#689 - Nick Saban

Nick Saban is the former head football coach of the University of Alabama where he won 7 national championships. He is currently an analyst on College Game Day, and his new ESPN docuseries “Saban” is out 10/8. Coach Saban joins Theo to talk about the mentality he instilled to build a dynasty at Alabama, the changing culture of recruiting in college football, and how he’s learning to have fun in retirement. “Saban” docuseries out 10/8 on ESPN. ------------------------------------------------- Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Celsius: Go to the Celsius Amazon store to check out all of their flavors. #CELSIUSBrandPartner @CelsiusOfficial https://amzn.to/3HbAtPJ Prize Picks: Go to ⁠https://link.prizepicks.com/LME0/TPW ⁠and use code: TPW Mountain Dew: Look for Mountain Dew in stores near you at http://mountaindew.com Tecovas: Get 10% off at http://tecovas.com/theo when you sign up for email and texts. Perplexity AI: Ask anything at https://pplx.ai/theo ------------------------------------------------- Music: “Shine” by Bishop Gunn Bishop Gunn - Shine ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: [email protected] Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Mail stuff to: ATTN: TPW PO BOX 40137 Nashville TN 37204 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend X: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Trevyn https://www.instagram.com/trevyn.s/ Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Producer: Andrew https://www.instagram.com/bleachmediaofficial/ Producer: Halston https://www.instagram.com/halstonrays/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Nordstrom. For 125 years, Nordstrom has been part of your story. The stylist who found the perfect outfit for your big interview. The first pair of walking shoes for your one year old. The tomato soup you shared with your sister at the cafe. These are the moments that make Nordstrom Nordstrom. Big or small, we're here for all of it. Celebrating 125 years with new moments still add. Discover it all in Nordstrom stores and at nordstrom.com.

• 0:30Speaker 01

  He's probably the greatest college football coach of all time. And I know he didn't like hearing me say probably right there. His run at the University of Alabama will never be matched, I would guess. He's had seven national championships. What he's done is unprecedented. And he has a new documentary out this week on ESPN. It's called Saban. I suggest that you enjoy that. I am grateful for his time. Truly, it was an honor. Today's guest is Nick Saban.

• 1:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's one of those days. Sometimes I have those days where you're just like, how am I going to get it all done? You ever have days like that?

• 1:24Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Today's one of them.

• 1:26Speaker 01

  Has it been? And did you have to regroup a little or like, what do you do like in a moment like that? Cause I'm sure you've had them like at like kind of intense levels. And then it's at like regular day to day levels. Sometimes I'm just like, there's not a breath deep enough I can take sometimes it feels like.

• 1:42Speaker 02

  But you know, I'm so used to grinding through it, coaching 14 hours a day. One problem after the next, one solution after the next. I can usually sort of grind through it. What I don't do very well at is having nothing to do. You know, that, that, that after being so busy for so long. I mean, now, when I don't have anything to do, I'm like, like my wife, she didn't, she, she, she. You playing golf today?

• 2:10Speaker 01

  She's like, we're going to build a course in the backyard if we have to.

• 2:12Speaker 02

  I go to church on Sunday morning and then she says, well, you're going to play golf afterwards, right?

• 2:18Speaker 02

  I don't want to see you until 2:30.

• 2:20Speaker 01

  Yes, I guess it's kind of new for her that now you're home, right?

• 2:23Speaker 02

  That's right. I came home one day at three o'clock. She said, what are you doing?

• 2:29Speaker 01

  Where did, uh, where did you meet Ms. Terry at?

• 2:33Speaker 02

  Seventh grade science camp. We went to different schools in West Virginia. She went kind of the city school and I went to the country school and, um, but we met at science camp. Now we lived about 10 miles apart, but that's like worlds apart, you know, back in those days.

• 2:50Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, but so we always liked each other, but I could never see her. And it wasn't until I was a senior, she was a junior that we started dating. So, um,

• 3:03Speaker 02

  so there would be 55 years in December, we've been married.

• 3:07Speaker 01

  And how did, uh, congratulations?

• 3:09Speaker 02

  It's been fun.

• 3:10Speaker 01

  That's cool. No, it's great to hear that. How did you propose to her?

• 3:16Speaker 02

  Uh, I think over the phone, if I remember right.

• 3:19Speaker 01

  What, like a recruiting call?

• 3:21Speaker 02

  No, I mean, I was at Kent State. She was back home going to Fairmont State and we talked on the phone. But you know, in those days, I mean, you know, it was expensive, you know, to talk on the phone. So we'd have these short conversations, maybe once a week or whatever. And, um, she came to visit during the season when I was playing and kind of talked about it then, but.

• 3:45Speaker 01

  Did she ever make you get down on, like, did she ever make you go through kind of the formal?

• 3:49Speaker 02

  No, not really.

• 3:50Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 3:51Speaker 02

  And then we had our honeymoon in Wheeling at the Wheeling Holiday Inn.

• 3:55Speaker 01

  Did you really?

• 3:56Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. And weren't the big boy, you know, with the strawberry pie.

• 4:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:03Speaker 01

  That was where your honeymoon was?

• 4:05Speaker 02

  That was it.

• 4:05Speaker 01

  Oh, that's pretty cool. I will tell you this, I had a show in Pittsburgh one time and I had a couple of ladies offer me the Wheeling feeling after the show. I didn't get any of it, but.

• 4:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's, that's not one of the most accommodating places to visit.

• 4:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I've, I've had some good times. I did a show at the Big Sandy there in Huntington, which was really cool. I did a show one weekend when the, the guy read, remember they made that movie about, um, the plane that crashed from Marshall?

• 4:36Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 4:36Speaker 01

  You know, that it was just that horrific tragedy that happened there within that community. And they, the guy who didn't take the plane, the coach's name was Red something. He was speaking at the hotel that I was staying at that day. It was just kind of.

• 4:49Speaker 02

  I remember that story. Well, you know, ironically, I was playing at Kent State at the time and we played them at Marshall several weeks before that actually happened.

• 5:00Speaker 01

  Really?

• 5:00Speaker 02

  It was really interesting and they had pretty good, pretty good team. Yeah, it was.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  So that was the same, a same season that you were playing, one of their, the, the team just was gone.

• 5:10Speaker 02

  They're gone.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 5:12Speaker 02

  Crazy.

• 5:15Speaker 01

  That's pretty devastating. There it is right there. William Alfred Red Dawson was the Marshall assistant coach who did not.

• 5:20Speaker 02

  Red Dawson.

• 5:20Speaker 01

  Uh, passed away in the 1970 plane crash because he was away on a recruiting trip and drove back instead of flying. That's right.

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've never, I haven't spent a ton of time up there, but it's, it's always nice when I, when I do. Did you guys take a lot of family vacations and stuff when you, whenever you were growing up up there?

• 5:37Speaker 02

  No, not really. I mean, it was work, work, work. You know, my dad had a service station, never wanted to leave. And I worked in it from the time I was 11 years old. So, um, we never did. I'll, Terry and I always tried to do that, you know, once we got established and, you know, Myrtle Beach was the spot. I was like going to the French Riviera when you're from West Virginia. So, um, we, we, we went there quite a few times. Driving, drive down eight hours.

• 6:12Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, there you go. Look at you right there, Nick and Terry.

• 6:15Speaker 02

  That's it.

• 6:17Speaker 01

  That's magic, baby. Um, whenever you guys got married, did you have like a wedding song or anything like that? Like, do you have like a?

• 6:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I wish you wouldn't ask me those kinds of things. I'm supposed to know that I don't really remember.

• 6:31Speaker 01

  We'll edit in a good answer.

• 6:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, I won't say a word, man. I'm quiet on the creek over here, man. I got nothing for you. Well, how about this then? Is there a gift that she got you, like an anniversary gift over the years? One that you really kind of prized that she gave you?

• 6:50Speaker 01

  That comes to mind?

• 6:52Speaker 02

  That comes to mind.

• 6:55Speaker 02

  You know,

• 6:57Speaker 02

  we, we enjoy being together so much and like we're best friends. She's always been so supportive and helpful in everything that we've done. That, you know, it seems like those kinds of things are a little bit second nature. Um, you know, she's always told me what I needed to hear, not what I wanted to hear. And it's been very helpful, you know, in my development. I mean, when I was, uh, in college, I couldn't get up in front of a group and speak. And she was a speech English major debate team. I've lost a few of those through the years, you know, the arguments, but, um, she really was helpful to helping me develop, you know, confidence in, um,

• 7:41Speaker 02

  public appearances and that type of thing. So, um, she's just been so supportive, was a great recruiter, you know, great relationships with people. So I don't remember very many gifts. You know, most of the time I'm giving the gifts, you know, not getting them.

• 8:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think dads are just hard to shop for too. But I guess I'm hearing you say that she's just, it's just kind of the eternal gift of you guys' connection has always been, uh, the bigger value of anything that you, that you could just kind of get somewhere.

• 8:13Speaker 02

  That's right. Yeah.

• 8:15Speaker 01

  Is there a specific moment that comes to mind that she, uh, that she was really there when you, when it was like a space where you couldn't figure something out?

• 8:24Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, there's a lot of those, you know? I, I think that, you know, especially once you get to be a head coach. Who do you talk to? You know, your assistants are kind of your second lieutenants working for you. And when you have issues and problems, yeah, they can input certain things, but certain big decisions, you sort of have to make on your own.

• 8:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:44Speaker 02

  And so who do you have out there that you can go talk to? And you know, that's one thing that Ms. Terry was always someone that I could talk to about an issue or a problem. And it's interesting sometimes that the outside perspective is.

• 9:01Speaker 02

  A little different than your perception of what it might be. And that's very, very helpful.

• 9:06Speaker 01

  Cause even though she's your wife, she's still, she's not locked in it like you are.

• 9:10Speaker 02

  Right.

• 9:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. That's a good point. Head coaching, it kinda seems kinda lonely.

• 9:14Speaker 02

  It is. It can be. It is. And I was fortunate through the years to have, you know, he's in the documentary, Dr. Rosen was always someone that I could talk to about, you know, psychological disposition and how to try to, you know, motivate certain types of people and players. And he and Ms. Terry were probably the two people that had the biggest impact on me and the direction I was always trying to head in and how they reinforced it.

• 9:45Speaker 01

  It, it seems like from an outsider's perspective that you've had like an amazing life, right? Do you feel like you've lived up to your potential? Like, do you feel like that?

• 9:58Speaker 02

  Well, you know, I sort of look at it a little different. I mean, is winning games, is that really what your life's potential is? Or is it?

• 10:07Speaker 01

  And it's not a judgment. I'm just genuinely curious.

• 10:09Speaker 02

  No, no, but, but compassion for other people, helping other people. Could we do more, like we have a Knicks Kids Foundation? Could we be doing more to help other people? Have I helped our family enough? Have I been a good parent? You know, when you talk about all those things, not how many games you won, you always think that, hell, there's a lot of things I could have done better. And that's what I sort of constantly try to be a better person, set a better example for people, be a better leader, help people create value for themselves, show people that you care about them. I mean, all those things are really, really important to me because my goal as a coach was always,

• 10:52Speaker 02

  how can I help these guys have a better chance to be more successful in life? So it was a lot of personal development, importance of getting an education. How do you develop the habits on the field to reach your full potential? So that's where, you know, I spent most of my time. But now, not coaching, I still look at other people and how can we impact the future? And, you know, we're just like, we're building a Saban Center, which is a, you know,

• 11:21Speaker 02

  you know, student center for young kids growing up. It's gonna be our legacy, you know, in Tuscaloosa. So how can we impact education and career development in young people? So all those things, could you have done those better? I think I probably could have and will continue to try to do it the rest of my life.

• 11:42Speaker 01

  Do you feel like you've been kind of like a perfectionist? I know that's just a word that people throw around. Like, do you feel like you're a perfectionist kinda?

• 11:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:50Speaker 01

  It's not a judgment of you.

• 11:50Speaker 02

  No, I, I do.

• 11:52Speaker 01

  Just curious about, cause I wanna explore that, cause there's not a lot of people you can explore kinda that term with sometimes.

• 11:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:56Speaker 01

  So that's why I'm asking.

• 11:57Speaker 02

  But, but I think that, you know, and this is kind of in a documentary, but, um, you know, when I was a kid growing up, having compassion for other people was really important. Accountability was really important. In other words, if you had a job to do and you didn't do it exactly right, you're gonna do it over again. So you learn how to be accountable. But one thing that, you know, my parents always emphasized is it wasn't about winning or beating the other guy. It was about, did you do it as well as you were capable of doing it? So, I mean, we won 30 games in a row when I was in high school or something like that and won the state championship and that was never good enough. And I asked my mom once, why is it never good enough? And she said, it's not about winning the game. It's not about beating the other guy.

• 12:40Speaker 02

  It's about, did you do it as well as you're capable of doing it? So that, that's, makes you kind of a perfectionist.

• 12:48Speaker 01

  Right, cause the competition is always you.

• 12:50Speaker 02

  It's always you. And the other thing that that instilled in me was I never had what I call relief syndrome, which is, you know, it's kinda human nature is if you do something of significance, you think you're supposed to be able to rest on your laurels.

• 13:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:05Speaker 02

  You know, and we kinda promote that in society. We promote it in business, even players, you know, they would, would win a big game and it's a, can we have Monday off practice? We get rewarded for winning this big game. Well, I'm thinking about how are we gonna win the next game?

• 13:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 13:22Speaker 02

  And did we play well enough in that game to win the next game? And what do we need to improve on? So I, I never ever developed that,

• 13:33Speaker 02

  rest on your laurels, because I was never allowed to. And it goes back to that word that you're talking about. You can never be perfect, but you're always trying to close the gap on perfect. And I think great competitors, whether it's Kobe Bryant, Tiger Woods, you know, Michael Jordan, you know, those guys could always take the next challenge, man. It didn't matter how, how, how much they won or what they did. And that's how I wanted our teams to be able to compete. And I felt like I had to set that example. So if I'm satisfied and I'm thinking that everything's good, we don't have to focus on attention to detail and prepare for this game the right way. And you know, there was actually two times at Alabama, we won 19 games in a row

• 14:17Speaker 02

  and we lost the 20th game and we didn't play very well in either one of those games. Not to take anything away from who beat us, but, and it was all because of complacency, blatant disregard for doing what's right, your complacent. And then you start developing bad habits and it starts showing up in your performance. So I spent a lifetime trying to avoid that and never got it done. Not the way, won 19 in games in a row twice and couldn't keep it going.

• 14:47Speaker 01

  I mean, some would describe that as keeping it going though, you know? So, but I understand, I understand what you're saying. Do you think it's tough for you to feel success kind of? I, I know it's kind of a similar question, but I always have a tough time feeling the success. I feel like a, like a perfectionist, or I feel like I am a lot of times. Like, um, I know this haircut doesn't really say that, but what's under it does though. And I feel like that a lot of times. It's, I just feel like it's hard for me to have fun sometimes because perfection doesn't really allow a lot of space for fun, you know? There's just not a lot of room for it.

• 15:20Speaker 02

  Well, but I don't think I had a lot of fun, you know, because the fun of it is winning. That's the fun. Getting ready and doing all the things it takes to win is not that much fun.

• 15:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:32Speaker 02

  But to your point, when you think like you think and like I think, and you are as successful as you are because of the way you think, incidentally, success is not a continuum, it's momentary. And if there's anything that you've done in the past that you think is going to impact your, the future, you're infected with success. You know, I mean, you wanna be a flash in the pan and say, I can do something exceptional once, but have no conception of how to do it on a consistent basis. So I always defined consistency for our players. Consistency, success is consistency in performance. And that's what I wanted our players to think.

• 16:16Speaker 02

  You know, a great example of that is we won the first national championship at Alabama in 2009. We won the Rose Bowl, beat Texas. Everybody's excited, everybody's celebrating. We have this big celebration in the stadium and I don't know how many people were there. It's pretty full. And I get up and I said, this is not the end, this is the beginning. And I was sending a message, you know, we created a new horizon, a new expectation.

• 16:42Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:43Speaker 02

  So we gotta look ahead to what we have to do to continue to get better. It's like climbing a mountain. You know, once you climb the mountain successfully, you become the mountain. So everybody's shooting at you. How did you do it? What do we need to do to change? How are we gonna beat those guys? Well, if you don't keep improving, it's not gonna happen. I mean, they're gonna get you, they're gonna get you. So, and that's hard to get people to understand. But you understand it and that's why you don't have so much fun. I didn't have that much fun for 50 years. I didn't have that much fun. I enjoyed winning. I hated losing more than I liked winning. So I was always trying to avoid the setbacks.

• 17:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:24Speaker 02

  And looking forward to what I had to do and have the foresight to know what we had to do to be successful in the future.

• 17:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's interesting because yeah, once you find success one way, other people are going to gravitate towards it, or you've already done it. So you also need to set a new challenge for yourself. But then what's interesting about you is to go inside of what you'd already done and kind of look at the pieces of it and be like, what worked really well here? What can still evolve? And what can be different? That's an intense level of scrutiny, I think.

• 17:56Speaker 02

  Well, but to me, there's two parts to that. First of all, we changed how we played football through the years. We changed the way we played offense. We used to run the ball and play good defense. We won championships doing that. Then we went to the spread. We went to no huddle. We went fast through RPOs and all that stuff, which is with the rule changes, that was what you needed to do. Well, we didn't play as good on defense because we played a lot more plays. And the other teams scored more points, but we scored more points too. So we technically changed how we played the game to take advantage of rule changes.

• 18:33Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 18:34Speaker 02

  But we never changed the culture of what it took to be successful. The togetherness as a team, positive energy, positive attitude, accountability, be responsible to do your job. What do you have to do to dominate the competition? And that never changed. That never changed. And, um, but football, the technical parts of it sometimes changed.

• 18:56Speaker 01

  Was there, uh, like, I'm trying to think about like having fun, like, like you ever, have you ever been on a water slide or anything like that?

• 19:03Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 19:03Speaker 01

  You have?

• 19:04Speaker 02

  Oh, I know how to do all that now. I got thrown out of the water slides most of the time.

• 19:07Speaker 01

  Did you?

• 19:08Speaker 02

  We used to go on Senator Manchin, you know, who was the US Senator from West Virginia.

• 19:13Speaker 01

  Oh, Senator Manchin, yeah. He's in your documentary.

• 19:15Speaker 02

  Yeah. So, yeah, well, we used to go on vacation. We both went to Myrtle Beach, but we never, ever made it through a summer without getting kicked out of the water slide.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  What were y'all doing on there?

• 19:27Speaker 02

  You know, doubles and triples and running over people.

• 19:30Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Yeah, sometimes we'd get there early and just run down it. Like they had one kind of bus and was, it was a water slide, but it was almost not going to be like at any moment, you know? And, uh, it was just like a tetanus shot. Like it was, it was kind of a safety hazard, I think. But, um, but we would get there early and run down it right before they started the water. And that was always a good time. And I was just curious if you're able to also have like other types of fun outside of, um, outside of football and what that's like.

• 19:56Speaker 02

  I think that's the one thing that I learned through the years. I think there was in a time when I was an assistant coach, when I, I didn't do that very well. Um, you know, it was work, work, work, work. Uh, take your work home, never ever be able to separate. But when I became a head coach, I learned how to do that because it was just too stressful to, um, carry it with you all the time. And I had to set some parameters and say, okay, at 10 o'clock at night, I'm going home. I'm not working past 10 o'clock so I can get enough rest. Because if I don't rest, I'm not going to have the patience to do a good job the next day.

• 20:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:39Speaker 02

  So there was some of these kinds of built in things that I had to, and then I make myself go on vacation for three weeks in the summer.

• 20:47Speaker 01

  And you have to make yourself do those things?

• 20:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, make, and, and bought a lake house so I could spend three weeks with the kids. And, you know, so things like that, I kind of had to learn how to do that because I was so committed, it was not healthy.

• 21:03Speaker 01

  Did it ever actually affect your health, like some of that stress? Because I mean, you were like, I mean, watching you like, especially like in your documentary, it's pretty great to see like all these different, and they compile them all and make you seem kind of crazy for a little while. And you may have been, I don't know. That's fine. I think you gotta be a little bit crazy. And hopefully we all were a little crazy at some point in our lives, you know? But, um, you can definitely, you feel the intensity of you a lot of times. I mean, you've, I mean, even not, and it's some of the footage is older. It's not even high def. And you're like, you can still feel the intensity coming through the screen.

• 21:34Speaker 02

  But, but you gotta understand that in a competitive environment, I was trying to show intensity.

• 21:43Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 21:43Speaker 02

  Does that make sense?

• 21:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, 100%.

• 21:45Speaker 02

  I mean, I, I don't think I was ever, I mean, you want players to play with emotion, have intensity, but you don't want them to be emotional. So most of those times when I looked crazy, I really wasn't being emotional. I knew exactly what I was doing, but I was trying to affect other people.

• 22:04Speaker 01

  Wow, chess. That's chess, Nick. Um, that's incredible then, because yeah, it affected me the other night at home. Um, just watching it. But did, did it ever affect your health? Did it ever become like a health scare for you?

• 22:17Speaker 02

  No, never did. But I always got a physical. You know, one of the things when I was in the NFL, they always make you get a physical before the season, just like the players. So I continued that in college. And, um, you know, several of our coaches had issues that assistance too, that, um, you know, created a better quality of life for them and saved their life in some cases. So I always did that. Um, but when I retired, and I don't know if I ever shared this with anybody, I spent 50 years of my life being in a hurry and didn't know it.

• 22:55Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 22:57Speaker 02

  So I retired and the cars are backed up on the bridge and it goes down to one lane. And in the old days, I would be the guy that passed all the cars up and cut in at the last minute in front of somebody. And I sat there with Ms. Terry in the car. She says, you mean, you're not going to pass everybody illegally and cut in? I said, we're not in a hurry. But it's the first time when I retired that I realized that I wasn't in a hurry. And I was in a hurry for 50 years and didn't know it.

• 23:28Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 23:30Speaker 02

  Because I was always hurrying up to the next thing.

• 23:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:32Speaker 02

  Solve the next problem. Go to the next thing. I mean, and it's great. And you talk about relieving stress? That relieves stress better than anything.

• 23:42Speaker 01

  And that was just the thing you noticed? One day you just noticed that?

• 23:44Speaker 02

  I just noticed it in that circumstance.

• 23:46Speaker 01

  Right.

• 23:47Speaker 02

  Not cutting into traffic and waiting my turn.

• 23:49Speaker 01

  Right. Yes, sometimes we need proof from like our own actions and it'll almost surprise us.

• 23:54Speaker 02

  That was it.

• 23:55Speaker 01

  I realized one day that I was like, I felt like there's been a to do list since I was born and I don't know who wrote it or started it or how it ever began, but I always feel like I'm running behind. Like it's been an eternal feeling that I've had.

• 24:08Speaker 02

  And I've always had the feeling that I wanted to get everything that I needed to get done before I could relax.

• 24:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, and there's, and it's never all done.

• 24:17Speaker 02

  It's never all done.

• 24:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know what you mean. I know, man, I'm 46. I'm like, when is, where is the end of this list? It's got, and who wrote it? I didn't even put it together, I don't feel like. PrizePix is America's number one sports picks app. The app is really easy to use. That's why I like it. For players picks, just pick more or less on a few player stats and lock in your lineup. That's it. Rather just pick teams? PrizePix has that now too. Just pick the winner, spread or total on any game or fight. And with football season here, there's no better time to get in on the action.

• 25:01Speaker 01

  Make a football lineup or just pick the winner of the game and keep it simple. For this Saturday's UCLA versus Oregon game, I'm going with the Ducks. PrizePix is available in most states, including California, Texas and Florida. Plus you can even follow me on the app, at TheOvahn. Tail my picks with one click and follow your friends too. Best of all, play your first $5 and get $150 in lineups if you win. Just use code TPW when you sign up. That's right. PrizePix just switched up their offer. So there's no better time to join.

• 25:44Speaker 01

  Lock in and win that first lineup. That's code TPW at signup to get $150 in bonus lineups if you win your first $5 plus lineup. PrizePix, code TPW, play responsibly. First $5 plus lineup entered must win to receive $150 in bonus lineups. Lineups expire seven days after issuance. 18 plus in eligible areas. Lineups entered and awarded must include player picks. PrizePix Predict is a registered FCM offering team picks and culture picks as event contracts. Both involve significant risk, not for all. Must be 18 plus and for event contracts be a US resident. Restrictions apply. Void where prohibited. Use responsibly. For help, call 1-800-426-2537 or visit ncp gambling.org. There's a lot of fall moments I wish I had more of.

• 26:29Speaker 01

  I remember one time they had a big pile of leaves out there by the apartments. And we all got all ready and we put some eye black on our eyes. And, you know, some of us had pads on and everything. And we just ran and jumped into the leaves. And they had a guy in there, sleeping in there. And he had just been trying to stay warm. But it's not fall until you get out there and get some dirt on your boots. And when you do, grab a pack of Mountain Dew, the American original. Born in the foothills of Tennessee. Mountain Dew was made for a damn good time outdoors. When you get that Mountain Dew on your tongue, you just, man,

• 27:10Speaker 01

  it just reminds you of taking a hike with your daddy or with anybody's daddy. Or just tickling your cousin or just playing, uh, got your nose with the baby. The bold taste you know and love comes from American roots. Get out there and enjoy the outdoors with Mountain Dew, an American original, tasting great since 48. Look for Mountain Dew in stores near you. When it comes to coaching, uh, how much of coaching is knowing football? And how much of coaching is knowing people, do you feel like? And which took you longer to learn?

• 27:47Speaker 02

  Probably the non-people part. You know, coaching is teaching. Teaching is ability to inspire learning.

• 27:56Speaker 01

  Coaching is teaching. Teaching is ability to inspire learning.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  Right, exactly. So that inspiring the learning part is the people part. And everybody's a little different in terms of how they learn and how you need to approach them to teach them. You know, obsessive compulsive people, they don't need you to get on them. You know, other guys, not a self-starter. You need to get on them a little bit. So figuring all that out is important. The technical part of teaching and coming up with a good teaching progression, whether it's how to teach bump and run, or how to take on a block, or whatever, that part comes a little easier. But the other part, the human condition part, is much more difficult.

• 28:43Speaker 01

  Did you enjoy that part more, you think?

• 28:45Speaker 02

  I did. Because that was, that was a big interest to me. You know, is what makes people tick? What, what makes people, you know, do certain things, good and bad?

• 28:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:55Speaker 02

  Choices and decisions and impact of all those things.

• 29:00Speaker 01

  Do you think maybe that you just wanted to find the next thing to figure out? Does that make any sense if I say that? Because it's interesting to hear you talk about so many little facets that could go into giving yourself the best possible chance.

• 29:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah, I was always trying to learn. I mean, even to this day, you know, I remember my dad saying, you got two ears and one mouth. That means you should listen twice as much to talk. You've probably heard that before. But anyway, so I've always been a listener and I always try to learn from other people. And anybody that was doing something of significance in our profession, or a good book to read about a successful coach and how he approached it and all that kind of stuff. I was always into that, always into that. And we always had people come and visit us. Everything we had an issue with, we would pay somebody to come and visit us and teach us how to fix it.

• 29:58Speaker 01

  Oh, like different speakers and?

• 30:00Speaker 02

  Different speakers and some coaches. You know, like we had problems with no huddle. Who's the best defensive people with no huddle? Guys playing against Chip Kelly at Oregon? Bring them in and teach us, how do you play against this? How do you get people to adapt to it? So, but, you know, we struggled in the Sugar Bowl and got beat by Utah because they were in empty the whole game and we didn't do a very good job of defending it. So I just brought Utah staff in and said, okay, you guys run empty, tell us what you don't like.

• 30:32Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 30:32Speaker 02

  What gives you problems? So we were always looking for a better way. And I told everybody in the organization, everybody's responsible for a better way. So.

• 30:43Speaker 01

  Did you ever feel like, because ego is like a scary thing, right? And your name became, I mean, you're, there are people that would, you know, would rather baptize their kids with you involved somehow. It seems like these days, especially in Alabama, right? And, and bless them. But how did you, how did you keep yourself from getting too smart to learn? Does that make any sense?

• 31:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:03Speaker 01

  And was it ever a fear of yours, like at a certain point? Like, because ego is a unique thing, right? Sometimes our shadow gets bigger than us, right?

• 31:09Speaker 02

  Right.

• 31:10Speaker 01

  If the lights hit us the right way. So it's like, did you ever have to deal with any of that? Just curious, because you've had such a unique journey.

• 31:17Speaker 02

  Well, you know, one of the things I always did when I went to church is, I always prayed to be a good person and to serve other people. And, you know, I ask the question a lot when I speak sometimes is how do you pray? Do you pray to be blessed? Or do you pray to be a blessing? Well, I was praying that I wanted to continue to be a blessing to other people, which probably was me trying to check my own ego and make sure it didn't get out there to where it was going to have a negative effect on things. And I'm sure you could probably go find a lot of people. I mean, there was like 70 people got interviewed or 90 people got interviewed in this documentary

• 32:00Speaker 02

  that would say, yeah, he had an ego. But I tried to keep it in check.

• 32:04Speaker 01

  You tried to cap it?

• 32:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, dude, yeah. Because ego is such an interesting thing. What if you had players? How did you curtail players if they started to get kind of too big for themselves? Was there something that you would say? Like, you know, because that's, that's a, that's a lot of, that's a lot of energy for a young person to be taken on when they don't really even know the effects of it.

• 32:25Speaker 02

  Right, well, I was always trying to teach players cause and effect. And, you know, I would bring every player in and say, all right, what do you want to accomplish here? And a player would say, I want to graduate and play in the NFL someday. And then I would say, do you know what that entails? And he would say, hard work. And I'd say, well, you got to do this, this, this, and this, this. I was defining a process of what they had to do to be successful. And I wanted them to learn how to self-assess. So I'd ask them how they're doing. But I'd also go up to them a lot and say, how's that behavior helping you accomplish the goals that you have? And then they would usually answer, well, it's not, coach.

• 33:07Speaker 01

  So to help them have an actual thought process with it?

• 33:09Speaker 02

  Right, and I tried to make it about them.

• 33:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 33:12Speaker 02

  You know, not about, oh, I don't like it that you spiked the ball. Tell me if spiking the ball helps you get to the NFL.

• 33:18Speaker 01

  Right.

• 33:19Speaker 02

  Does that help you graduate? I mean, so I made it about them a lot and, and they, they related to that. You know, most people are selfish, self-absorbed and ambitious. So appeal to that.

• 33:33Speaker 01

  Right.

• 33:33Speaker 02

  You know, I used to tell the players, you know, I spent eight years in the NFL. The two most compelling words in the draft report is and and but. And they would look at me like, that don't sound right. And I'd say, yeah, they'd read the player, you know, quick feet, change of direction, good tackler, good hands, play the ball in the deep part of the field, talking about a defensive back now. And he's a good person. You know, he graduated, coaches loved him, he was captain of the team. Next guy, same guy. Quick feet, change of direction, good tackler, all that. But what comes after but usually not good.

• 34:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 34:13Speaker 02

  All right, wouldn't go to class, coaches didn't like him, watched him practice, wasn't a good practice player.

• 34:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:19Speaker 02

  Had a positive drug test. I mean, whatever. So who you want on a team, and but? So are you making choices and decisions that creates value for your future? Because we're trying to provide you with a direction that's value-based. Buy into it and you will create value for your future.

• 34:39Speaker 01

  You talked a second ago about going to church and praying. How did you, how did you start a relationship with God? Like, how did that, was that instilled with, in you when you were a child? And then how did you create your own relationship that was more real in your life, if you did? Or what was that like?

• 34:52Speaker 02

  Well, my grandmother used to take her umbrella and beat me over the head as we were going to church. I didn't have a choice.

• 35:04Speaker 01

  That's one way to do it, yeah. I mean, I think that's pretty effective. Your grandma's umbrella will put the Lord in you. It'll keep your posture up, too.

• 35:13Speaker 02

  No, but, you know, I, I just, I don't know. And I guess it started because I felt guilty if I didn't do it. And I think I was made to feel that way by my family, my grandparents. And so it was important to them that we all go to church and that's the way it started. I can't say I liked it, but I did it. And then I got into it and I think there's a lot that you can learn from, you know, biblical, you know, experiences that happened in the past.

• 35:53Speaker 02

  And I always try to see, you know, is this message helpful to me?

• 35:59Speaker 01

  Was there a time in your life where you called on God the most kind of to be supportive for you? Or that you really needed your faith more than you expected?

• 36:06Speaker 02

  Well, you know, I usually do it because I'm always asking, like, what could I do better to be a better parent? You know, can I be a good leader to my children and help them make choices and decisions that would help them be successful? And now you have grandchildren. So, you know, you're trying to do the same thing for your grandchildren. So it's more about what could I do to impact other people in a positive way? Than really, you know, I don't think God determines the outcome of a game or anything like that. So it was never about all that. But it was always trying to, what can I do better to help people?

• 36:48Speaker 01

  What made you care about people so much, do you think? I mean, I know it's a human thing to do, but.

• 36:54Speaker 02

  I, I think that it came from coaching because.

• 37:02Speaker 02

  My coaches that I had, whether in high school or, you know, my dad was my Pee Wee coach, my parents were great at this, but beyond my parents, my, the coaches that I had, Don James in college, um, and my high school coach, that, that, they had the greatest impact on me. And I never really wanted to be a coach, but when it happened that I was coaching, that's what I wanted to be to the players that I coached. And, um, so I guess that's how it happened. And I got a lot of positive gratification out of that. And I think that was the difference between being in the NFL and being in college. You

• 37:43Speaker 02

  know, I love the competition in the NFL. I love coaching the players. I love the strategy of the game and all that. But there was a lot more self gratification in college about helping people.

• 37:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:55Speaker 02

  Because they were at the right age where you could impact them, you know, 18 to 22, and they all still had goals and aspirations of what they were trying to accomplish. So, um, and I think that's why I ended up landing in college.

• 38:10Speaker 01

  You've kind of run like it seems like, or not run, but it seems like some people would say that they had like the Saban Rehabilitation Center for coaches that have kind of gone awry at certain moments, right? What was your determining factors for if a coach was a good fit for you on your staff?

• 38:26Speaker 02

  Well, you know, I wanted people that had character so that they would set a good example for the players. Uh, I think the players needed mentors and people that they could look up to.

• 38:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:38Speaker 02

  They needed to be knowledgeable.

• 38:39Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 38:39Speaker 02

  But they needed to be good teachers, uh, have good teaching preparation and presentation in terms of what they did. And they had to be a good fit. And you used the word ego before. And I think with coaches, sometimes you have to respect the other coaches and work with them and work together for what the best interest of the team is, not necessarily what's the self indulgent behavior or what's best for you, if that makes any sense. And, um,

• 39:08Speaker 01

  Like, how would that play out for a coach? Like, that it would be like a self indulgent behavior?

• 39:12Speaker 02

  Well, like the offensive coordinator is more worried about scoring points than he is winning the game.

• 39:17Speaker 01

  Got it. Oh, that can be a trap, huh?

• 39:19Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, you know, you end up fumbling the ball at the end of the game rather than running it when you're supposed to, because you put winning first. So, um, but, you know, when you ask about the rehabilitation part of it is, you know, all the coaches that I had on the staff, you know, people think discipline is punishment. Discipline is really doing something to somebody that changes their behavior. So it was easy for me with players because they all wanted to play. So if they, if I said, if you don't go to class, you're not playing, or if you don't quit having positive drug test, you're not

• 40:03Speaker 02

  going to play, they would change their behavior because it was something significant to them. You know, my daughter was always on the internet, always on the computer. If you take the computer away, you could get her to do, study, clean up the kitchen, do whatever you wanted. So, but it was what's, was significant to her. So I looked at the same thing as coaches. You know, you say these guys had issues and problems, but they all got penalized for the issues and problems that they had, whether they got fired or whatever. But they had some really, really good qualities that got them to where they were because they were successful at some point in their career as an offensive coordinator

• 40:46Speaker 02

  and even some cases as a head coach. And whatever this issue that they got penalized for, now they all of a sudden want to change their behavior so that they get another opportunity to be a coach. And I always just said, can I manage this guy? Can I manage this? Can I manage the issue? Because I know there'll be a positive in terms of what the guy brings to the organization if his negative doesn't bring it down.

• 41:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:15Speaker 02

  So, and, uh, we were able to do that. But in every one of those circumstances, that person knew that if they had one more stub of the toe, it was going to be career ending for them.

• 41:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:28Speaker 02

  So they were willing to change their behavior.

• 41:31Speaker 01

  You had a lot of guys in your coaching tree sort of, um, that were kind of, that have been under you or, I don't know if that's a term to use, but that have been part of your coaching tree over the years. Um, Kiffin, Jimbo, um, Kirby Smart, um, Lanning, Sark. Um, what was it like when they started to become this pack that was then like trying to beat you? Like, did that become its own thing that kind of added actually some extra excitement for you? Like, what, what did that, what did that feel like? Cause that's pretty fascinating, kind of.

• 42:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, you know, when you play somebody that really knows you, that makes things a little different.

• 42:12Speaker 01

  Does it make it harder?

• 42:13Speaker 02

  It makes it a little harder because I think you got to tweak things and change things a little bit, which may, you may not be comfortable with.

• 42:19Speaker 01

  Do you think you liked almost that it made it a little bit harder?

• 42:22Speaker 02

  Uh, I liked competing against those guys, but, uh, I knew that I had a lot of respect for them because they had done a tremendous job for me. And I was glad that they all got opportunities. So, um, because they did a good job. Uh, and it was always a challenge to replace them because they did such a good job. Um, so, but it was, you know, I think we, we all kind of respect each other as competitors. And, you know, you probably have some friend that you competed against that it was more fun to beat them, uh, because they were your friend and it gave you kind of bragging rights, even though you might not have bragged about it.

• 43:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:06Speaker 02

  It still gave you the right.

• 43:07Speaker 01

  Just even on the text thread or whatever.

• 43:08Speaker 02

  Yeah. So, um,

• 43:10Speaker 01

  Which one of those coaches that I mentioned a few minutes ago, which one kind of do you feel like learned the most from you?

• 43:16Speaker 02

  You know, I can't, you'd probably need to ask them that. It'd be hard for me to know, but, um, I, I think they all have their own style. And when each one of them left, whoever it was to go take a head coaching job, Mario Cristobal, it doesn't matter, Kirby or whatever. I said, the most important thing you have to do is be yourself. Be yourself. Don't try to be like somebody else. Don't try to be like me. I mean, you can take some of the technical things that we did here and, you know, the way we built the program and use those things to your benefit, but you have to be yourself. You have to be you.

• 43:51Speaker 01

  Why? Because trying to do somebody else's thing is just a trap, you feel like?

• 43:55Speaker 02

  No, I, I, I think you have to be authentic and people have to see you as being authentic and people have to see you as believing, you know, in what you're trying to preach or teach or whatever.

• 44:06Speaker 01

  Got it. When you were, when you were recruiting, did you drive? Did you go with somebody else, dude? And, or sir? And did you drive or did somebody else drive? Like, if you went?

• 44:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, most of the time I went with an assistant.

• 44:18Speaker 01

  And would you let them drive or would you drive?

• 44:20Speaker 02

  They would drive most of the time. I, I remember one time we were in Iowa, Mario Cristobal's, you know, Cuban from South Florida.

• 44:27Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. He's great.

• 44:28Speaker 02

  And, um,

• 44:29Speaker 01

  And eats all the snacks. He's been eating all the snacks down there.

• 44:32Speaker 02

  And, you know, I love the guy and he's done a great job in Miami, but we're in Iowa recruiting a player in the dead of winter. And I mean, it's a blizzard sideways. I mean, it's snow's going sideways, blowing crazy. He'd never driven in the snow before. I said, Mario, let me drive. And, and he was so prideful, you know, that he, he wouldn't let me drive. I mean, I grew up in West Virginia. We had snow. I lived in Michigan. I lived in Ohio.

• 44:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:57Speaker 02

  So I was used to driving in the snow.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 45:00Speaker 02

  But no way was he gonna let me drive. All right. So we survived barely.

• 45:05Speaker 01

  But he just wouldn't let you do it?

• 45:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 45:07Speaker 01

  Dang. Maybe he thought that a warm, like, cause they got that, the machismo or whatever? Maybe he thought that was Miltelle's path or something? I have no idea.

• 45:14Speaker 02

  No, he's a extremely hard worker and a great recruiter.

• 45:18Speaker 01

  Is he?

• 45:18Speaker 02

  Really good. Yeah. Was really good recruiter, developed great relationships with players and, and he's done a great job in Miami.

• 45:26Speaker 01

  I just can't imagine you letting somebody else drive. That's the part that I think is tough for me to think about that part.

• 45:32Speaker 02

  But you know,

• 45:32Speaker 01

  Isn't it so hard to sit there and let somebody else drive?

• 45:34Speaker 02

  But I, I, I would actually get work done.

• 45:37Speaker 01

  Oh, I see.

• 45:38Speaker 02

  And I would go to all these places that, um, I, I didn't know my way around. Now, when I was an assistant coach and I went recruiting, I went by myself, I knew my way around. So I was confident. And, you know, we didn't have GPS and cell phones and all that stuff back in the day, but, um,

• 45:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:57Speaker 02

  All these assistants now, they gotta type it in their phone and get directions and all. I don't even know how to do that.

• 46:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:04Speaker 02

  So, um, I'd let them handle that part of it. But when I was a head coach at like LSU,

• 46:11Speaker 02

  And you and the head coach was allowed to go to spring practice. I would go a lot of times on my own and just go, you know, to watch guys practice. Cause I, you can tell so much more about a player if you see him live than you can looking at a film. But um, I loved that and it was great. And you know, there were two coaches that did it. Erdmeyer did a great job of that and I did it. And they passed a rule that we couldn't run on the road.

• 46:38Speaker 01

  Oh, that's a saving rule, isn't it?

• 46:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:40Speaker 01

  That's what they call it. Did you ever get into a place where you were not welcome? Like, did you ever pull up on a porch or something, knock on somebody's door where you were just not welcome?

• 46:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, when I first went to LSU in New Orleans, and you know, you know, South Louisiana. The people were not happy with LSU and there was several families I went in and they just said, we're, we're just not interested in, in talking to you. And we had to actually prove ourself that we were going to create value for players. I mean, we built an academic center there. We took the graduation rate from the low thirties to seventy two percent, I think, in four years. And we won the national championship. So, but we had to prove ourselves in terms of how we were going to create value for players other than just football.

• 47:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, I will say this, when you've gotten to a campus and when you've left it, it's looked nicer. That's a fact. I mean, Alabama looks beautiful these days. That campus is beautiful.

• 47:39Speaker 02

  And you know, that community's changed a lot in the last twenty years. And you know, the school's gotten bigger, so that created some growth. Um, but they had a plan of, you know, if we improve the quality of the education and we improve the enrollment with a lot of out of state students, that would provide the resources for us to redo the whole campus, which they basically did. And you know, football is kind of the window that, you know, people look at an institution. So us having success in football probably helped them do that.

• 48:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, it looks great. It's just, it's great over there.

• 48:17Speaker 02

  It's beautiful.

• 48:17Speaker 01

  It really is. It's beautiful. Um, did you leave football because of the recruiting, because of the NIL? Like, is that kind of one of the main things? That's sort of what people say just off the cuff, right? Is that kind of the truth? Or did you just feel like you had achieved enough?

• 48:34Speaker 02

  Well, it's not the reason I left. Um, in fact, we had name, image and likeness, I think, the last three years that I coached. And having been in the NFL, managing the salary cap and all that, it, it wasn't that big an issue. Uh, but I could see that players were changing and I could see that the way you were going, people were making more transactional decisions. In other words, it was more about how much money you're going to pay me than how are you going to develop me? And I think we always sort of created more value for players in terms of personal development, academic development and football development.

• 49:16Speaker 02

  And we had proof in the pudding, you know, we had high graduation rate, fewer guys getting in trouble. Uh, most guys drafted, most first round draft picks. So we had proof that we were creating this value. Now, as the, the table started to turn, we, we were going to have to change the way we did things and cause it was going to be more about how much you paid some guys to get them to come. And uh, that was okay, cause I'd been in a league where that was what it was all about in the NFL. I mean, players are playing for money. They're trying to play well so they can make more money.

• 49:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:48Speaker 02

  Uh, and they're trying to extend their career so they can make money for longer. So I, I, I was okay with all that. I, I think for me, I never wanted to ride the program down.

• 50:00Speaker 01

  I see, like you, you wanted to kind of end on a high note.

• 50:02Speaker 02

  Right. I, I never wanted to coach where my age and my inability to have a positive impact was going to start to see the program go down. And um, and, and I felt like at seventy two years old, that last season, season was really, really hard. You know, we lost early on and um, the team really improved and we got in playoffs and they did a fantastic job. But it was very challenging and I just, I, I didn't know what I was going to do. I mean, I think this is in the documentary that I'm sitting there, I got a four o'clock team meeting.

• 50:42Speaker 02

  I got two speeches. I got one that says I'm staying and this is how, what we gotta do to, we had a young team, so we, we'd have been good the next year. Um, this is what we have to do. And then over here, I'm going to tell the players I'm going to retire. And that was ten minutes to four and I didn't know which one I was going to do. Um, so.

• 51:05Speaker 01

  How'd you decide?

• 51:07Speaker 02

  I called Ms. Terry and she said, you know, if you're that stressed out about it and you're that much, there's that much turmoil, you know, you have to do this at some point in time, whether it's this year, next year, or the next year. So if you feel that much anxiety about making the decision, maybe now's the time to do it. While you still have your health and quality of life is good enough that we can do other things. So that's basically, you know, what brought us to that decision.

• 51:42Speaker 01

  Was it the toughest decision, like that you felt like you had to make in your life?

• 51:45Speaker 02

  Toughest decision, yeah.

• 51:46Speaker 01

  Really?

• 51:47Speaker 02

  Maybe ever. Yeah, it's really hard. I've been part of a team for so long and enjoyed the relationship with the players and had such great relationships with the players. And knew a lot of those players sitting in that room came there because, you know, of the University of Alabama, but also because I was the coach and.

• 52:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, generations of families, generations of.

• 52:09Speaker 02

  Relationships with the, the assistant coaches and the staff. And I knew all that was going to get blown up. And that was the hardest thing was to change the changes it created for everyone else.

• 52:22Speaker 01

  And was that a kind of a weird drive home after that? Like, how did that feel after? That's kind of, that's huge.

• 52:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was. It was. It was a weird drive home. Well, well said.

• 52:34Speaker 01

  I feel like that day when you get home and you set your keys on the counter, they kind of make a different sound, you know?

• 52:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, they do, but it also was a relief in a lot of ways that you didn't have the stress of continuing or worrying about making the correct decision.

• 52:55Speaker 01

  Right.

• 52:55Speaker 02

  And I do think it was the correct decision for me and Ms. Terry and our family. Uh, because, you know, I, I missed my kids growing up. I didn't really want to miss my grandkids growing up. So this has given me a little bit more time to have those relationships.

• 53:13Speaker 01

  Did, did it ever bleed over where like you were coaching and fathering where they almost became the same thing sometimes? Like, just because it was so much, like, that would seem like there would be some maybe crossover in that space.

• 53:25Speaker 02

  Well, I, I thought that it was really important that

• 53:30Speaker 02

  because I didn't have a lot of time with my kids, that I made sure that the time I had with them was quality time. And.

• 53:38Speaker 01

  Like, how'd you do that?

• 53:39Speaker 02

  A lot of the same things that

• 53:43Speaker 02

  help you be successful in life are the same things that would help you be successful in football.

• 53:47Speaker 01

  Right.

• 53:48Speaker 02

  And um, in any sport for that matter. So um, we tried to teach those values. And you know, our kids turned out pretty well, so I'm not disappointed in that.

• 54:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's something that you admire most about each one of your, uh, you have two children, right?

• 54:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:05Speaker 01

  What's something that you admire most about each one of them?

• 54:08Speaker 02

  Well, Nicholas works in our Mercedes dealership in Birmingham and he's a general sales manager and he works his butt off. And he's a really, he's all into it and committed to it. And I'm proud of the fact that he's very productive doing that. I think he's a good father to his daughter. Um, he's got a good wife and I think they do well and I'm very proud of him. Kristen has a son and I think she does a good job of parenting and a good mother. And uh, we're always trying to be helpful in how we can help him. And he's a boy, so he plays everything, soccer, baseball. Uh, the only thing I hate is every time I go to try to watch him play, I get bombarded with kids wanting autographs and all that,

• 54:52Speaker 02

  which I'm never going to tell the kids no, but I'd like to watch the game too. So um, that creates a little bit of a conflict, but it's all good.

• 55:01Speaker 01

  Like, yeah, what are the things that you get to see about your grandkid that you almost maybe like, not missed out on as a dad, but it's like, it almost gives you a second chance? I guess it's like, yeah, does being a grandfather give you like a second chance almost?

• 55:12Speaker 02

  A little bit, yeah. And, and it's not, it, it's that you didn't have time. You know, like, we, we only had a family dinner on Wednesday night. It was the only night that I came home and we had a family dinner where everybody sat down together at dinner. Can you imagine your family only is one night a week, you eat together? Um, one of the things that Ms. Terry did because of that was Sunday is the day that I didn't like the most because you had to finish the game you just played, start preparation for the next game. So it was a grind on Sunday and you didn't see the players on Sunday.

• 55:57Speaker 02

  So she instituted five o'clock to six o'clock was family dinner. So everybody brought their kids, all the assistant coaches brought their kids, our kids, our grandkids. Everybody had to come for one hour on Sunday, so everybody had to get together. So that was the kind of stuff that she could see that was needed. That was great for morale of the staff and the families who were supporting the staff. That made, made a big difference.

• 56:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think having just a backup set of eyes like that is nice, you know?

• 56:31Speaker 02

  Very nice.

• 56:31Speaker 01

  Cause when you're in the fire, you need somebody out there who's got, who knows how to use a hose, you know?

• 56:37Speaker 02

  It helps.

• 56:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, cause you're in there. It's hot in there.

• 56:42Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Nordstrom. For 125 years, Nordstrom has been part of your story. The stylist who found the perfect outfit for your big interview. The first pair of walking shoes for your one year old. The tomato soup you shared with your sister at the cafe. These are the moments that make Nordstrom Nordstrom. Big or small, we're here for all of it. Celebrating 125 years with new moments still add. Discover it all in Nordstrom stores and at nordstrom.com.

• 57:12Speaker 01

  Anywhere worth going this fall is better in comfortable boots. Find your perfect pair with Tacovas. Tacovas crafts quality western boots for everyone. From generational ranchers and lifelong cowboys to first time boot buyers. I rock mine sometimes if I'm wanting to feel a little taller. Just gonna be out in the dirt or if I'm maybe gonna be getting on a horseback. They just, I don't know. They make you feel confident. And more importantly, they're comfortable. Tacovas boots are handcrafted with over 200 meticulous steps for broken in comfort right out of the box.

• 57:56Speaker 01

  They've got the boots you need this season for tailgating, festivals, weddings, bonfires, whatever. Right now, get 10% off at tecovas.com/ Theo when you sign up for email and texts. That's 10% off at T E C O V A S dot com slash Theo. tecovas.com/ Theo. See site for details. Tacovas, point your toes west.

• 58:28Speaker 01

  The CFP now, what do you, what do you think they should do with that? Cause last year it felt kind of wonky, right? It felt like some teams should be in almost a different divi- like a different big tournament. You know, or maybe they should have two tournaments for some of the larger schools and then some of the smaller schools. What do you think the solution is there? And what do you worry about the most?

• 58:50Speaker 02

  Well, me personally, I think that people want to see the best 12 teams in the playoffs. I think to get to a 12 team playoff, we had to do what was politically correct and make sure we included some of the schools that weren't in the power conferences.

• 59:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like DEI, division inclusion.

• 59:10Speaker 02

  Right. So, and I get that part, but I think each year we try to take some steps to make it better. Like it was not good that Notre Dame didn't get into playoffs last year. And it would have been bad if they got in and Miami didn't get in. Cause I said Miami is going to be one of the toughest teams in the playoffs and go a long way. And they went all the way to the finals and almost beat Indiana. So people just want to see the best teams. And I think the other thing is, is we gotta come up with a better metrics to determine strength of schedule. Like the question got asked at the SCC meetings this year.

• 59:52Speaker 02

  Texas loses to Ohio State 14-7. Now they had a bad loss at Florida, but they end up nine and three. So the question was, if we'd have played Texas State instead of Ohio State and ended up 10-2, would we have gotten into playoffs? And they had a hard time answering that question. So that in and of itself says the metrics for how we determine strength of schedule is not what it needs to be.

• 1:00:18Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:00:19Speaker 02

  And we always just look at how many wins a team has. And just like the SCC, there were six teams in the top 10. They're all going to play each other. So they're not going to end up in the top 10, but they're all really good opponents.

• 1:00:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:34Speaker 02

  So you're playing a difficult strength of schedule. And that should be taken into consideration. Like I think they do a better job of that in basketball. You know, they say if you beat so many top 10 teams, you get so many points. You beat 11 to 30, you get so many points. You get nothing for playing somebody who's not in the top 50. So they have a better way to sort of figure out strength of schedule and who gets in the tournament.

• 1:00:59Speaker 01

  Well, with the evolution of it, so it's an evolving thing you're saying.

• 1:01:02Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:01:03Speaker 01

  And with the evolution of it, it does seem like immediately kind of the bowl games turned into just something that's more of a fun thing. And almost like the tradition of a lot of the bowl games sort of seems like they kind of fell by the wayside quick.

• 1:01:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, and that's one of the things that back 10, 15 years ago, when people wanted to expand the playoffs. I said, if we expand the playoffs, we're going to make bowl games obsolete. Players are not going to want to play in them. Fans are not going to go to them. They're not going to get supported. And bowl games have been, you know, a tradition in college sports. And it was a reward for a team going eight and four. And the team gets to go to a bowl game, the fan base gets to travel. And that's all going to go away because the playoffs will become the standard of whether you had a good season or a bad season.

• 1:02:00Speaker 02

  And we had 33 coaches get fired last year because the playoffs have become the standard. And everybody expects their team to get in the playoffs. So, and that can't happen. There's 12 teams getting the playoffs. Now we may expand the playoffs in the future. I don't know if that's a good thing or bad thing. The only thing I'm concerned about is there is a limit to how many games a college player should play. There were three or four times where we played 15 games in the season. And I thought that was too many. Now you've got potentially 17 games that you could play. So I think we gotta be careful about that.

• 1:02:35Speaker 01

  Well, do you have a say in that sort of thing? Like, are you on the committee?

• 1:02:38Speaker 02

  I don't have any say.

• 1:02:40Speaker 01

  Have you ever met those people who is the committee? I mean, is it real people or is it just a bot?

• 1:02:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, they're real people.

• 1:02:46Speaker 01

  I just wonder if it's like an AI or something. It's like, who even knows? Everything's kind of confusing now. Do you think social media had a big change on people? You kind of coached across this timeframe where people didn't have social media and people were just like living in the, you know, the eyes on you were just one another's and the lords, that was it, you know? And then this other thing came along where, you know, we all kind of had the ability to watch each other. What do you think the effect of social media was on players over time? Did you notice any effect?

• 1:03:17Speaker 02

  Oh yeah. Yeah, I think that in the old days, you know, players were more motivated from within and weren't necessarily exposed to what other people thought. So it didn't matter as much. I think what social media has done is created an external factor that impacts a lot of people. In other words, what other people say about me is meaningful. So.

• 1:03:49Speaker 01

  As opposed to my relationship with myself.

• 1:03:51Speaker 02

  Right. It's not about what I think of myself. It's about what everybody else thinks of me. Like I used to say to our players all the time, and people have heard me say this publicly before, is I see players on their phone getting upset because somebody puts a post on there that's negative about the way they played or something or whatever. And I'd say, why do you care about what some fat guy running around in his underwear, living in his mother's basement?

• 1:04:18Speaker 01

  Probably pierced nipples, coach.

• 1:04:19Speaker 02

  Yeah. Puts on the internet about what kind of football player you are. Why, why would that matter to you?

• 1:04:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:26Speaker 02

  More than what matters to yourself in terms of the truth about how did you play? What do you need to get better? What habits do you need to change? You know, what things do you need to overcome? What work needs to be done to make you better? You have no control of what those people say. Focus on what you can control.

• 1:04:48Speaker 01

  And when you take that out of the, out of the internal, right? You take that relationship, but when you put that out into the external, all that energy goes out into the external too.

• 1:04:56Speaker 02

  Oh yeah.

• 1:04:56Speaker 01

  Now this motivation is from this foreign thing. And it's not really this like scale of a relationship with you inside of yourself of value and what do I think and what output do I want to have? And what do I think of, of the outcome that I'm creating for myself? I don't think, I don't think we know the long-term effects of like that whole thing of taking like all of this, like this, this like this template of our own relationship with ourselves and putting it into this external place. It's really kind of crazy.

• 1:05:25Speaker 02

  I know you said, you said, that was very well said, what you just said.

• 1:05:28Speaker 01

  Was it really?

• 1:05:29Speaker 02

  And I agree with you 100%.

• 1:05:31Speaker 01

  Dude, that's awesome. Thank you. Oh gosh, I gotta write that down. Um, I will say this, when we got to go, like just when I was touring with comedy, we got to meet Coach, we got to meet Coach Moffett over there at Texas A&M. Awesome guy. Um, and, but one of the best times that we had was we went, went to the Alabama campus and they took us just on a tour of the facilities and stuff. It's pretty magnificent they got over there. Ty Simpson gave us a tour everywhere. It's pretty cool. We had a great time.

• 1:05:58Speaker 02

  Ty is a great young man, no doubt, and.

• 1:06:02Speaker 02

  But we built all those facilities. They weren't there when we got there.

• 1:06:06Speaker 01

  Oh, I believe that.

• 1:06:06Speaker 02

  And they, the commitment that the university made, the athletic department made, people made, to give us the tools to do what we wanted to do, to support the players the way we wanted to support them. Um, with facilities, academic support, food, whatever it was, medical treatment, medical training, mental health, we had it all. And they did a great job. And it was very beneficial and helpful to us being able to build a program.

• 1:06:35Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. I mean, the structure is there, you know? Um, let's look real quick just at Lane Kiffin, right? It's an interesting thing that's going on here, right? We can all say that, right? Like, uh, Lane's a buddy of mine, right? And so I love, like, Lane's the only coach that has two rosters, basically, as well, active. How do things end up with Lane overall, do you think? Cause it's usually been kind of taboo if there was like, a coach that was like kind of a single guy, right? What do you think's going on down there?

• 1:07:05Speaker 02

  Oh, I, I don't make any predictions about things like that, but I will say that Lane is a really good coach. Uh, did a great job for us. He's a fantastic play caller. He's got a great ability to recognize what the other team's doing and adapt in the game.

• 1:07:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:21Speaker 02

  Uh, to take advantage of it. He's a really good recruiter. He relates well with players. Uh, and I think, you know, that's all changed a little bit, you know? We've got a little more liberal in this whole, uh, what's the expectation for how you should be as a person relative to how you can still lead? Um, and, you know, I was always wanting to set a good example, and I think it's important that that's a part of it. But you can set a good example in other ways, other than just your personal life. He's not married, so.

• 1:07:54Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, I think it's fine. I just think it's interesting, you know, that you've kind of had like a.

• 1:07:58Speaker 02

  I think it's a little more acceptable, you know, now than maybe back in the day.

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:04Speaker 02

  So, um.

• 1:08:05Speaker 01

  I agree. Do you, yeah, if, if, say if, so recruiting is kind of, do you think the value of recruiting is still the same or it's?

• 1:08:14Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:08:14Speaker 01

  Okay. So if that's not there, what becomes the new value of a coach to an organization? Do you feel like, how does that kind of morph or evolve? Does that make sense to you what I'm asking?

• 1:08:26Speaker 02

  No, absolutely.

• 1:08:27Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:08:28Speaker 02

  So how do you evaluate the players? Who are you gonna pay? What positions are most important? Cause if you pay the wrong guys, and you've heard me say this before, you're shit out of luck.

• 1:08:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:41Speaker 02

  So when you can't evaluate the players and you don't pay the right guys, you're gonna pay the consequences for that in the future, because you're gonna spend all this money, you're not gonna have a very good team. And you're not gonna get the outcome everybody expects. And then the cause and effect of this paying players is we're raising money from alumni who now think they should have a say in what happens, and that's why 33 coaches got fired last year.

• 1:09:06Speaker 01

  Because of boosters.

• 1:09:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, they have a say.

• 1:09:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I guess the value, a lot of the value is gonna become in like judgment, like the ability to be a judge of character.

• 1:09:17Speaker 02

  Character and talent and ability. If you don't, look, talent is not talent if you can't use it. So if you don't have character to go with it, you probably can't use it.

• 1:09:29Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:09:30Speaker 02

  And it's not just in sports. I mean, nobody, no, nobody that's not really, really smart gets in medical school. You gotta be really, really smart. But everybody doesn't make it. Talented enough, but they don't make it. Well, some reason for that.

• 1:09:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:46Speaker 02

  So, uh, and some of them that make it don't make very good doctors. So I always say talent is not talent if you don't, if you can't use it, which means you have to have some kind of competitive character to make the kind of choices and decisions to create the habits. So you can recruit talent, but accountability and commitment you have to develop.

• 1:10:07Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 1:10:08Speaker 02

  And most of the time you can develop it.

• 1:10:11Speaker 01

  So it's gonna be the coaches that can have the judge of character, but then also the ability to help their players create those things?

• 1:10:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, and also have the talent.

• 1:10:20Speaker 01

  What do you tell a player now that can, that can have a couple of million dollars in his bank account? Like, what do you say to these young men at 20 years old that other coaches might not be telling them because they're afraid that they're gonna lose them? Or they're gonna afraid that they're gonna, um, upset the apple cart in some way? Like, what would you tell these young men if you could?

• 1:10:39Speaker 02

  Don't let the money change you. You know, stay focused on the things that you can control to develop value for your future, because there's a lot more value out there. But I will say one thing that's very interesting to me. Former players that played for us, I'm not mentioning any names. They, they didn't make the money. They didn't get paid. They played, they created value, they made a lot of money in the NFL, they played for a long time. And one of them said to me the other day that was kind of alarming, said,

• 1:11:17Speaker 02

  "If I would have gotten paid $2 million when I played here, I don't know if I would have become the man I became. I don't know if I would have developed into the player I became. I don't know that I wouldn't have, but I don't know if I could have handled that at 18 and 19 years old, and I don't know if I would have become what I was able to become."

• 1:11:39Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:11:40Speaker 02

  Pretty interesting.

• 1:11:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. If you kind of live long enough, you can kind of see this, how the certain steps were shaped, and the ones that maybe helped you and ones that didn't, you know, over time? I think that's one of the blessings about being alive, is you get to see how all the little magic kind of worked out, the little things that maybe you didn't even know if they would.

• 1:11:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:11:58Speaker 01

  Um, I don't want to forget to ask about Saban. That's the name of the documentary. It's a six-part series. Um, what can people expect out of it?

• 1:12:07Speaker 02

  You know, this documentary is a little bit of a scrapbook. You know, my mom kept a scrapbook of when I was a player, and this will be the scrapbook for the future.

• 1:12:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:21Speaker 02

  Of what we did. And it's kind of a navigation of how did we develop this program? And all the people from friends, family, growing up, to coaches and players and people who impacted.

• 1:12:39Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:12:39Speaker 02

  And, and for the fans, it's gonna be an interesting look from inside out. Because they did things like, I gave like talks to the team, and I would never let the media hear what I said to the team in the locker room or in the team meeting or whatever. It was always taboo. I didn't know Alabama was filming all this stuff and putting it in an archive. I didn't even know they were doing it. Well, we got all that stuff and put it in this documentary. So it's a, it's an inside outlook at, how did, how did this program get developed? And it should be interesting for fans to be able to see that.

• 1:13:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:18Speaker 02

  You know, I spent 20, 30 hours in interviews and 70 people got interviewed. And if I'd have wrote a book, it's just the book. But now you've got all these personalities that you can see how this impacted and they related to this and how it helped them be successful. So I think this is gonna be a scrapbook of the future for, um, this generation and generations in the future, just like my mom's little scrapbook.

• 1:13:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think I love the fact that there's, you get, you get all these different players and, uh, and, and media personalities. There's like Mark Ingram, who I love. I see him at the UFC fights, um, Rolando McClain.

• 1:13:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:13:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um, there's just so many different characters. Oh, your wife is in there. Um, your son is in there. There's so many different like pieces of your life that, uh, that kind of like chime in about different little things. And it's fascinating to also to see the different schools you played at, the different coaching, the different decisions that were going on. Um, like, I wish you'd got to coach Drew Brees. I think that would have been awesome, dude. That would have been like, I, I start thinking of little things that I wish wanted to happen. Not in Miami, I would have wanted it to happen in New Orleans, but still, um.

• 1:14:26Speaker 02

  But you know, the Drew Brees thing would have been, we would have been successful in Miami if that would have worked out. But then I'd have never gone to Alabama.

• 1:14:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:37Speaker 02

  Because we'd have probably ended up staying there because we could have had success. And one of the reasons was, you know, with getting Culpepper, he was injured, he couldn't play. Not taking Drew Brees because of his injury, which turned out not to be an issue.

• 1:14:56Speaker 02

  Because we don't have a quarterback in the future, that's pretty much why I was interested in going back to college because I didn't think we could be successful in the NFL if you didn't have a quarterback. And I thought that you could impact your, you had more control of how you could impact your organization in college.

• 1:15:14Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:15:14Speaker 02

  Because you could go recruit 25 players every year. It wasn't a draft and all that. But, and we didn't have any draft picks. So, um, I was happy to get the opportunity to go back and it's worked out tremendously. You know, I wouldn't probably be here if I didn't go back to Alabama and have the success that we had.

• 1:15:32Speaker 01

  What's something interesting that you've noticed about yourself being away from coaching? Like, what's something like, because that's a long time to be locked in, in one sort of facet, one sort of machine. What's something that's, you've either found that you, a new joy, or just something that's different?

• 1:15:50Speaker 02

  Stress level is way down. And it's easier to enjoy other things because you're not so stressed about this one thing, that you can enjoy other things. So now I can enjoy other things, people, relationships, have more fun, laugh more. And all those things are pretty healthy, I think.

• 1:16:17Speaker 01

  Do you think you'd have such a good time on game day? Are you enjoying it more than you thought you would?

• 1:16:20Speaker 02

  I love it.

• 1:16:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:22Speaker 02

  I mean, your buddy Pat.

• 1:16:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:24Speaker 02

  You know, I was, I was so anxious that first time we're, we're over in Ireland. I was so anxious. I'd never done that before. I got a lot of pride in performance. I want to do a good job and I'm all worried. And, you know, Pat gets up there and he starts his stuff and I'm saying, this guy makes me feel like there's nothing I can do that's going to mess up.

• 1:16:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:45Speaker 02

  So it just made me relax and has been so helpful. Um, you know, all the guys have been.

• 1:16:53Speaker 01

  Oh, you guys got a great group, man. Reese Davis. I mean, it's just so perfect.

• 1:16:56Speaker 02

  And they're all so helpful and they're all much more experienced than I am. So they've, they've really helped me grow and develop. But Pat is what creates sort of the comfort level for me, thinking I'm going to do something wrong or I'm going to mess up. So.

• 1:17:15Speaker 01

  Yeah. You can't do anything better or worse than Pat. Kind of in a loving way I say that.

• 1:17:21Speaker 02

  That was a good way to say it. Thank you.

• 1:17:24Speaker 01

  He does it all.

• 1:17:25Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:17:26Speaker 01

  Man, he's, he, there's nobody like him. He is like, there's, there's nobody like that guy.

• 1:17:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I love being on his little show that he has every day. I always go on Friday, like at 12:15 or something.

• 1:17:38Speaker 01

  Oh, the Pat McAfee Show, you mean?

• 1:17:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:17:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:40Speaker 02

  I love, because the group of guys he has, they're all football guys. They ask questions. They're into it. I love that little 20 minutes of bantering back and forth with those guys. It's great.

• 1:17:51Speaker 01

  Nice. So do you think you're having more fun nowadays then?

• 1:17:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, I had fun coaching.

• 1:17:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:58Speaker 02

  But there, there was, there was this whole big pile of stress over here.

• 1:18:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:04Speaker 02

  And hard work and little time to do anything else to have this much fun for this little bit of time before you had the next challenge looking you in the eye.

• 1:18:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:17Speaker 02

  So, um, and then we won so many games.

• 1:18:22Speaker 01

  Oh, that's true.

• 1:18:22Speaker 02

  That the expectation got so high, it was almost like, do you really enjoy winning? Are you, are you just relieved that you didn't lose?

• 1:18:33Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:18:34Speaker 02

  So that, so now the fun starts minimizing itself. So now the stress level is down. The fun can go up. It's easier to have relationships with people. So, I mean, for years now, we, we, we don't have a lot of friends in Tuscaloosa all the time I'm coaching because people call and say, you want to go out to eat? You want to do this? You want to do that? No, Nick's working tonight. Can't do it. He's on the road recruiting. So they quit calling.

• 1:19:07Speaker 01

  Would Ms. Terry come and eat at the office sometimes?

• 1:19:10Speaker 02

  On Sunday for Sunday family dinner. Uh, and Wednesday we ate as a family.

• 1:19:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:17Speaker 02

  So, um.

• 1:19:19Speaker 01

  Man, it's a long run. It's a lot of sacrifice.

• 1:19:24Speaker 02

  It is. It's not, it, coaching is not family friendly. And, uh, I think coaches are constantly trying to make it more family friendly in terms of things that they do. But.

• 1:19:37Speaker 01

  Does it have to be that high stress? Does it have to be, you think? Or do you think it started to become this escalation ladder that made it even?

• 1:19:47Speaker 02

  I don't think there was any other way for me to do it.

• 1:19:50Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 1:19:51Speaker 02

  Hopefully there's other coaches that can do it another way, that it's not that way. But I felt like for me to do it the way I was going to feel good about the job I was doing, that's how I had to do it. And that was a trap that I couldn't get out of.

• 1:20:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. Your own success almost became, yeah, it's almost a trap, I guess, huh? That's wild.

• 1:20:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:20:14Speaker 01

  I mean, it's a nice trap.

• 1:20:15Speaker 02

  Is what it is. But I wouldn't want it the other way.

• 1:20:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. That's a good point. Um, thank you so much for your time, Coach. I just appreciate you coming today and, uh.

• 1:20:26Speaker 02

  Well, I, I appreciate you having me.

• 1:20:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:31Speaker 02

  It's been fun. I enjoyed visiting with you. You got a great perspective on things. Um, and a good ability to articulate things, maybe a little better than me sometimes. And I appreciate that for making some of my points. But, um, at the same time, you know, hopefully this thing that we're doing.

• 1:20:50Speaker 01

  Oh, the documentary is great.

• 1:20:51Speaker 02

  Is going to help people get sort of an inside look at, um, what it takes to build a program and have a better understanding of, um, how this whole thing got done. And , uh, hopefully it'll be something that fans can enjoy.

• 1:21:11Speaker 01

  Were you scared at first with the documentary that there was, that it was going to involve too much of your personal life? Or did you even know what your personal life was because you've been coaching so long?

• 1:21:21Speaker 02

  You know, I'm, I'm not big on any kind of self-promotion. So I wasn't that interested in writing a book. And I really wasn't that interested in doing this. But there was so much interest in people doing this. There were like eight or nine of these, whatever companies that do this that wanted to do it. And I'm kept like, I don't know if I want to really do that. You know, what I accomplished is what I accomplished. People know what it is. But this is an inside look at it. Uh, and I think it'll be interesting to people.

• 1:22:02Speaker 02

  And I'm actually glad that we did it because I do think it's going to be a scrapbook for the future.

• 1:22:09Speaker 01

  It'll be a nice scrapbook for your family as well, for everyone. There's so many people involved.

• 1:22:13Speaker 02

  Lot.

• 1:22:14Speaker 01

  They did a great job. You guys did a great job. Uh, the documentary comes out Thursday, October 8th, um, 5:00 PM Central and ESPN and the ESPN app. Um, Coach Nick Saban, thanks so much for everything, man. Thanks for that championship at LSU too. Appreciate you. And, uh, yeah, just, uh, I love getting to enjoy you guys over at game day and just thanks for all the years of, uh, excitement. It's been a good time.

• 1:22:36Speaker 02

  Well, thank you for having me. It's been enjoyable. Lots of fun. Thanks.

• 1:22:40Speaker 01

  Yes, sir.