Still Existing and Bucket Listing: The Moth Radio Hour

In this hour, stories of finding joy, and the pursuit of big dreams. This episode is hosted by Moth Executive Producer, Sarah Austin Jenness. The Moth Radio Hour is produced by The Moth and Jay Allison of Atlantic Public Media. Storytellers: Jordie Poncy attempts to live in the moment. Mike Sela's daughter has a daring birthday request. Eric Scheur's dream of visiting Pixar is put in jeopardy. Despite not knowing how to swim, Samantha Williams agrees to go white water rafting. A chance encounter sends Shannon Garvey on a new path. Podcast # 940

• 0:13Speaker 00

  This is The Moth Radio Hour. I'm Sarah Austin Janis. Storytellers find the moth, and we find storytellers, sometimes in strange and curious ways. One spring day, I got a text from my friend Faith Salee, a former storyteller. She said, "I've just met a man named Jordie Poncy. You should talk with him about telling a moth story, but time is of the essence." So I called Jordy. Jordy, do you remember our first phone call? And what were you thinking?

• 0:45Speaker 01

  I have been a longtime moth listener, and to actually meet you, I was shocked.

• 0:52Speaker 00

  Jordy and I worked on his story together for weeks, and he told it live at our yearly Moth Mainstage in collaboration with Greenwood Cemetery in front of 800 people. His story gives context for this episode, which is called "Still Existing and Bucket Listing." Here's Jordie Poncy, live at the Moth.

• 1:13Speaker 01

  I'm a psychologist by profession, and when I tell people that, they either do one of two things: they clam up, or then they start spilling their guts. And I've always been kind of analytical, cerebral, I like figuring people out, I like helping people, and so it's been a really good fit for me. And in 2022, I got the opportunity of a lifetime with a job offer to work at the esteemed Moffett Cancer Center, where I would get to help cancer patients go through all aspects of their cancer journeys. I was so excited. And about two weeks before my start date, I thought to myself, "Jordy, you really ought to get this stomach ache checked out that has been kind of lingering."

• 1:58Speaker 01

  And so I drove myself one morning to an ER, because it felt like my organs are about to explode. Actually, I drove myself first to a dentist appointment, because those are a real pain to reschedule. And then I drove myself to the ER. I'm responsible. And I thought it was just gonna be something easy, like colitis, pancreatitis, gingivitis, something just needed a pill. But the doctor came back in and he looked really nervous. And he started making weird small talk, like, "Where's your family? How quickly could they get here?" And I was like, "This is not good." And then he seemed to be getting more and more nervous. And finally, he came out with it.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  He said, "Geordi, we found what appears to be cancer throughout your liver." And I was like, "What?" And then I distinctly remember him breathing a sigh of relief and saying, "Oh, I just hate delivering life-changing news like this." And being a psychologist, of course, I said, "I thought you did great. How do you feel about it?" As they wheeled me up to the inpatient units, like some sort of Faberge egg, I thought many things, one of which was, "What am I gonna tell Moffitt Cancer Center, my future employer? I mean, how do you make that call? 'Hi, this is Dr. Poncy. How firm would you say that start date is? Meanwhile, hospital machines are like beeping in the background.'"

• 3:25Speaker 01

  So I decided the first person I would actually call was my attorney. That's what I call my sister, because she's a criminal defense lawyer in Tampa. And within about 20 minutes, she was Tokyo drifting into the parking lot of the hospital, bounding up to my room and saying, "I've already talked to multiple people about getting you in to see a specialist." I was just really happy to see a familiar face. Soon, we were playing rock, paper, scissors to see who would have to call our parents. I won, but somehow, I still had to call them, which is what happens when you have an attorney in the family. They were soon racing frantically up to meet us. I eventually did call Moffitt.

• 4:07Speaker 01

  I spoke to my future supervisor from my hospital room and I was sort of frantic. I was like, "I know this is hard to believe, but like, I just got diagnosed with cancer. I'm at the hospital. I don't know what to do about this job. I don't know what to tell you. I'm really scared." And she was fantastic. Deanne, she said, "First of all, I'm gonna pray for you. Secondly, we're gonna hold this job. You just focus on your health." I was super relieved to have that sort of taken care of for the time being, but also pretty nervous because I didn't know what the future would hold and if I would ever be able to take that job. Eventually, I did end up entering Moffitt, not as a staff member, but as a patient, which was pretty devastating.

• 4:51Speaker 01

  And in the weeks that followed, we met with a bunch of fantastic, top-notch, top-in-their-field specialists, but they were sharing really scary things about this cancer. We were hearing terms like "rare," "neuroendocrine carcinoma," "stage 4," "incurable," and I bullied the doctors into this one, but my personal favorite was "an average lifespan of about two years from date of diagnosis." That's the day I learned what it's like to go capatonic. My family actually had to kind of prop me up to leave the cancer center that day because I was in so much shock and my head was spinning. I quickly started chemo. My hair fell out. I lost more weight.

• 5:34Speaker 01

  My friends did that amazing thing they do where they all shaved their heads in solidarity, but it was actually annoying because they all looked awesome in their buzz cuts, and I have the skull, apparently, of a pachycephalosaurus dinosaur that's sort of bulbous and misshapen. So, it didn't have the intended effect, exactly.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  I spent my days getting chemo, recovering from chemo on my parents' couch, and pretty much moaning under a blanket with existential dread. I mean, if you can imagine my parents going about their business throughout their day in the house, and from under a blanket muffled size of, "I feel like a ghost. I'm not alive anymore, and I really hope there's an afterlife." I was scared. The only thing that brought me any solace was torturing my father with morbid humor. One day, we were driving in the car. He was driving, and I tilted my passenger chair back. And I said, "Dad, let's pretend like this is my deathbed, okay?" And I kind of half-closed my eyes,

• 6:36Speaker 01

  and I coughed a little for effect, and I said,

• 6:40Speaker 01

  "Dad, Dad, I'm drifting toward the light. This is your chance. Tell me, what do you want to get off your chest?" And he said, "I'm trying to drive. I'm not playing this game." And I said, "Dad, this is it. Unburden yourself with all your personal and family dark secrets." And he said, "I'll tell you a secret. Don't ever pull this stunt with your mother." I thought that was pretty good advice. She was a little more emotionally labile than we were at this point. So, yeah, time trudged on, and I entered a really dark place. I was super depressed and hopeless with everything we had learned. And it was interesting to observe myself as a psychologist going through this,

• 7:25Speaker 01

  because I had definitely underestimated the paralyzing weight of depression and hopelessness. You know, as a psychologist, I'd always been warm, compassionate, connecting. I got good results with my clients. But honestly, I think I was a little low on the empathy scale, because I hadn't experienced anything quite like this before. And I was a little annoyed with myself at times when we would ask clients or patients to activate and do things. I didn't realize what a big ask that was until now. More time went by and eventually the doctors and the scans said, "You know, your tumors aren't going anywhere, Jordy, but they are shrinking." And I did start to have some better days. And one day, I was pulling groceries out of the back of the car and boom,

• 8:10Speaker 01

  I was hit with this epiphany. "Jordy, you're still alive." And I know that sounds kind of obvious, but to me, it wasn't. I had felt like I was not part of the living, so focused on treatment and chemo and cancer. And I thought, "I'm just as alive as anybody else is today, at least. How can I make this day worth living?" And I've been a longtime admirer of Viktor Frankl, who is a psychologist who founded logotherapy. And he was a survivor of concentration camps. And there, in that harsh environment, he noticed that people who tended to do the best physically and mentally were people who had a sense of meaning and purpose in their everyday lives, especially when that was focused on helping others.

• 8:55Speaker 01

  And I had missed that for my days in psychology, and so I thought, "Maybe I should think about this job." But every time I had contacted Moffett Cancer Center, I'd been terrified because I thought, "How can I do this job when I can hardly get through it myself?" So I sat down with my former supervisor, Lisa, who is one of the most direct and intelligent people that I know. And I gave her a whole dissertation about why I shouldn't take the job. There would be countertransference. I'd freak the patients out. They'd freak me out. No one could concentrate. And she let me finish. And then she said, "Jordy, you're scared. You need to get your act together and take this job, because you're going to be able to offer something that rarely people can,

• 9:40Speaker 01

  which is both your analytical skills, your clinical skills, but also the empathy you're building for going through this experience." And Lisa had always called me "boundaried." And that meant I didn't share a lot about myself, which was true in counseling. And she was asking me, or nudging me, to practice in a different way, to be really open with my story. And I said, "Oh, Lisa, I thought you were going to let me off the hook here." And she just gave me a signature Lisa eye roll, which is a badge of honor if you've ever received one. It's like the Paul Hollywood handshake of psychologists. So I started at Moffitt and my first day, I was terrified. I went to trainings, I shook people's hands, I met new people, I smiled, but I was panicking inside.

• 10:24Speaker 01

  I mean, literally, I hid in an office space to have a panic attack. Only that space had a glass wall, I didn't realize. So people could walk by and see the new guy just hyperventilating in a room by himself. It was not a great start. Finally, I met with my first patient and I had rehearsed my intro speech. It was, "Hi, I'm Jordi Ponce, I'm a psychologist here at Moffitt, but you may see me at chemo or in waiting rooms because I'm also a patient." And she burst into tears. And I was like, "Oh no, I have broken this woman in a vulnerable place." And she said, "No, no, no, actually, it's fantastic. These are tears of relief because I can finally talk to someone who understands what it's like to sit in this chair.

• 11:09Speaker 01

  You know, my family try as they might, they're great, they just don't quite understand." And then I talked to the next person, and the next person, and the next, and I started seeing more and more reactions of the same nature. And I realized, a lot of these patients want someone in the trenches with them who's gonna get it. You know, someone who's not gonna placate them, or tell them everything's gonna be okay, or, this is surprisingly common, but when you tell someone you have cancer, one of their first reactions is to immediately tell you about a great aunt who died of the exact same cancer you have. So someone who wasn't gonna do that, at the very least. And I was doing more connecting and more sharing of myself, and it was amazing. I remember a patient who was an older woman going through cancer largely by herself, and

• 11:53Speaker 01

  she was experiencing depression as well, and one day she came in and she said, "Jordi, I finished my chemo regimen." And I was like, "That's fantastic." And we celebrated, and I said, "Did you ring the bell upstairs in the infusion center, like you can when you finish chemo?" And she said, "No, I was by myself." And I was like, "You are not by yourself right now." And I dragged her up to the infusion center, we gathered the Moffitt staff around who are amazing at building community like this, and we all clapped and cheered while she clanged that bell, and it was the first time I'd seen her smile in a long time. It was amazing. New Year's, well, thanks.

• 12:29Speaker 01

  New Year's rolled around and my family has this terrible tradition I would not recommend, where my mom, my dad, my sister and I sit around and we were, instead of telling our own New Year's resolutions, we were telling everyone else what their New Year's resolutions ought to be. When it's your turn, it's insulting but also enlightening.

• 12:51Speaker 01

  And my attorney was sitting there, my sister, and she said, "You know, you still fear the future so much, you still have this existential dread, you're always super responsible," which she finds annoying, "and she said, 'I think you should pursue in the moment, everyday enjoyment in the new year.'" And I was like, "That's allowed?" And then I thought, "You know, that's actually a pretty good idea." And so I did what anyone does when they're trying to live in the moment, I sat down and made a to-do list. And that list was called "Still Existing and Bucket Listing." And even though I'm really afraid, it has led me to do some really fun things like go hiking with friends in New Mexico, go swimming in a cenote in Mexico, swim with dolphins

• 13:35Speaker 01

  in Orlando, go fishing in Alaska, and telling a moth story, because I'm a longtime listener and this is incredible.

• 13:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, so we can just like, "Check."

• 13:51Speaker 01

  And, you know, I don't mean to make it sound like it's all fun and games or living out loud, because fighting cancer has been the hardest thing I have ever had to do, and working this job is also really difficult. There are days where I face the very mortality that has been ascribed to me in patients. You know, I see patients decompensate, and I see their health decline, or they get a bad scan, or they pass away, and I see the future that I've been told that I have, even though we're not sure exactly when that will be. And so, you know, people ask all the time, "How are you doing this?" And I have learned two really valuable lessons. One is, I lean a lot on God. Sometimes I actually

• 14:34Speaker 01

  feel Him just pushing me back up when I want to flee the room. And also, I realized that my sister and Viktor Frankl were correct, that having a sense of meaning and purpose in your daily life, especially when helping others, fighting cancer in me and also in my patient community, is honestly what I think has kept me alive this long. I'm about a year past that two-year deadline. And, thank you, thank you. I appreciate that. And the doctors, as of the last scan, they say that the tumors are still shrunken and stable, so we're still going. And each day that I go into the cancer center, I find myself really excited about the people I'll get to meet with and the exciting bucket

• 15:19Speaker 01

  list items I'll get to tackle in the future, no matter how long of a time that might be. Thank you.

• 15:32Speaker 00

  That was Jordi Ponce. Jordi is still working as a psychologist at Moffett Cancer Center in Tampa. He loves to spend time with his friends and family, and he's still adding things to his bucket list. To see photos of him pursuing that list, go to themoth.org.

• 15:51Speaker 00

  Jordi, do you, do you have any things left on your bucket list that are still scary to you?

• 15:57Speaker 01

  Uh, yes. I have wondered quite a few times, like, why add more fear to my life at this moment? But I think trying to do a little bit of travel would be really great, but that's also a little bit scary to be, like, maybe away from medical and all that other stuff. So, I would, I would love to get to visit somewhere out of the country once again.

• 16:23Speaker 00

  Jordi Ponce is going to join me off and on. He's listening to the stories too, so you'll be hearing more from him in this hour.

• 16:33Speaker 00

  In just a moment, one man's giant leap, and an animator tries his best to get to Pixar, when The Moth Radio Hour continues.

• 16:46Speaker 02

  The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.

• 16:55Speaker 00

  This is The Moth Radio Hour. I'm Sarah Austin Jenness, and this episode is all about bucket lists. My mother used to tell me, "Put some lipstick on and get out there." I don't wear lipstick, but I have always tried to get out there. And our next storyteller got out there, too, somewhat unwillingly. Mike Sela told this onstage in San Francisco at a Moth Grand Slam. Here's Mike.

• 17:25Speaker 03

  So a few years ago, my daughter was home for the summer from college, and we decided to go to Disneyland for a few days, where we did a few things that really brought me joy. One, a bunch of the roller coasters there have cameras that take a picture at the scariest moment. And my shtick that I've done for years is that I like to do a big exaggerated yawn right when they take the picture. So you see them, and everyone looks really scared, and there I am in the middle, just aggressively bored. And Parker did it with me, which really pleased me very much. And I learned about her. I learned that one of the things on her bucket list is that she wants to go skydiving one day. And I thought, wow, that makes one of us weirdo. Because I have a big fear of heights. I'm uncomfortable on a ladder,

• 18:08Speaker 03

  let alone like walking off of an airplane voluntarily. But I took this thought, and I stored it away. And a few days later, I'm chatting with my wife, and somehow, the words that came out of my mouth were, "We should all go skydiving for Parker's birthday." When what I was thinking was, "I will get out of this somehow." But her birthday was months away, and I thought, this is a problem for future Mike, and I pushed all my fear down into my bowels.

• 18:39Speaker 03

  A few months later, Future Mike wakes up and it's skydiving day. And I'm Future Mike.

• 18:48Speaker 03

  My bowels are very unhappy. But I drive us to the Watsonville Airport and we check in for our skydiving appointment. And there's a bunch of forms to fill out that very specifically list all the different types of death and dismemberment that you promised not to sue them for. And then we meet our skydiving partners, because when you go skydiving for the first time, you don't do that by yourself. You don't even get a parachute. Your skydiving instructor puts a parachute on their back and they strap you to their front like a big baby Bjorn.

• 19:19Speaker 03

  So it's not like you're really skydiving, you're just the luggage of someone who is skydiving.

• 19:26Speaker 03

  And we meet our instructors and they're very chilled dudes. Mine is named Stephon. He's like one part snowboarding instructor, one part Top Gun, like two parts sunglasses.

• 19:38Speaker 03

  And we go through the training, which is just like explaining how to be good polite luggage. And then they take us out to the runway to see the group in front of us. And a small plane pulls up and two instructors and two skydivers get in the back. And the plane starts to taxi away and they don't even bother closing the door. One dude's leg is just casually dangling out the door. And this is where I really start to flip out. I mean, I, I, there was a leg dangling. I've been in airplanes and normally when my airplane's taxi, I'm not even allowed to have my tray table down.

• 20:16Speaker 03

  Let alone part of me hanging out the airplane. So I turn to Parker and my wife and I say, "Hey, how are you guys feeling?"

• 20:26Speaker 03

  And they're fine, they're happy, they're excited, like psychopaths.

• 20:31Speaker 03

  And so, our plane pulls up next, and two instructors get in, and then Parker and I get in, sort of, you know, with our backs to them. We scoop between their legs, like we're the little spoons. And the plane starts to taxi, and it takes off. And I realize that I'm not strapped to Stefan yet. And I ask him, in my calmest and most high-pitched voice. I say, "Hey, Stefan, don't you think you should just strap us together?" And Stefan is chill. He says not to worry. I am not chill. I am very worried. And I'm going through in my head how I'm gonna get out of this. I signed a lot of forms. Maybe I gave up the right to do this. I don't know. Maybe luggage doesn't even have rights.

• 21:17Speaker 03

  If I don't do this, will my daughter be disappointed in me? Or am I just gonna let peer pressure make me jump out of an airplane? And as I'm masterminding my escape, Stefan says, "It's go time!" Because that's how he talks.

• 21:34Speaker 03

  And Parker's due to go first, so I see her and her instructor inch towards the door, and it's surreal. And the door opens, and they're gone.

• 21:45Speaker 03

  My daughter, my only child, has fallen out of an airplane.

• 21:53Speaker 03

  I spent 20 years trying to convince her not to run with scissors.

• 21:59Speaker 03

  And now, she has literally tumbled out of an airplane in front of me, and suddenly, I'm very motivated to skydive. And so Stefan and I, he sort of scooches, and I sort of Samsonite my way over to the door. And then my leg is dangling out that open door.

• 22:19Speaker 03

  And Stefan pushes us out. And we are tumbling, and it is windy, and it is noisy, and it is terrifying. And we are free-falling for like 30 seconds, or a week, or something. And Stefan pulls the parachute ripcord, and he's also doing his other job, which is to video-record the whole thing, like I'm ever gonna watch this worst day of my life again.

• 22:45Speaker 03

  And he gestures to me to smile for the camera. And I look up at the camera, and I go...

• 22:59Speaker 03

  Am I proud of myself for facing my fears and supporting my daughter and skydiving with her? Yeah, sure, whatever, a little bit. But am I really pleased with myself for making that stupid gag while plummeting to earth? Oh, my God, yes, so much. That is my favorite. But the next few years for Parker's birthday, we just sheltered in place, and that was way better. Thank you.

• 23:29Speaker 00

  That was Mike Sela. Mike spends his workdays writing software for trees, small children, and internal organs. He dreams of getting back to running, which he hates more than anything. Mike says, "My daughter Parker has absurdly continued to taunt gravity, taking aerial classes at circus school. Meanwhile, I have focused on ground-based activities, like sitting on the couch. We recently had to buy a new couch because I had a mic-shaped imprint in the last one."

• 24:08Speaker 00

  Our next story is from Eric Schur. He told it in Portland, Oregon, at an open-mic story slam where we partner with Oregon Public Broadcasting. Here's Eric live at the mall.

• 24:28Speaker 04

  If you are a Christian, you want to get to heaven. If you're an animator, you want to get to Pixar. I was taking an animation class with my friend Robert, and he approached me one day and he said, "Hey, I heard about this gathering of people that's happening at Pixar down in California. You want to go with me?" For those of you who don't know, Pixar is the animation studio that kind of like redefined what the modern animated movie can be. They did Toy Story and Bugs Life, Cars, Monsters, Inc., Finding Nemo, like The Incredibles. They are an amazing studio, and if you're an animator, that's just where you want to go. So I said to Robert, "Of course I want to go there." Which was a little strange for me because I'd never really traveled with anybody before,

• 25:13Speaker 04

  you know, other than my family when I was a kid. But I've never traveled with a friend, I've always traveled alone. And I like going alone because I know how to prepare myself, I know how to get places on time. I know how to get places way early.

• 25:29Speaker 04

  And, and, and you know, like, working with somebody else, traveling with somebody else I knew could, could throw everything off, but I really wanted to go to Pixar. So Robert said he had this plan. He got the tickets and we would fly down to Sacramento and stay with a friend. And the next morning, we would drive into San Francisco and go to Pixar. Now, the plane that Robert had booked took off at, I think, like, 7:30 in the morning. And that was fine for me, I'm fine waking up early. As far as I knew, Robert had never been up before 10, 11. So I really didn't know how he was gonna get up for this thing, but I trusted him. We were gonna take his car, I didn't have a car at the time.

• 26:08Speaker 04

  So the morning of the flight came around, I know we had to get up at like 5:30, just to be ready to, to get up and, and, and make the traffic, get to the airport, get to the security and get to the gate and everything. I'm up, I have my suitcase, I'm dressed. I knock on Robert's door, it's about quarter to six. And I knock on Robert's door again. And he comes to the door groggy and sort of half asleep. He said, "Yeah," I said, "are you ready to go?" And he said, "Oh yeah, let me throw some stuff in a suitcase." "Let you throw some stuff in a suitcase? We're going to Pixar and you're not ready?" He's like, "No, it'll be fine, I'm, I'm, I'll be there in a second."

• 26:50Speaker 04

  So already my heart is racing and he finally gets ready, brushes his teeth and says goodbye to his dog and, and gets a suitcase. We make our way down to his car, which he forgot where he parked, so we walked the wrong direction first. And the entire, this, this clock is ticking down in my head, are we gonna make it, are we gonna make it? We do make it to the airport at about quarter to seven. We're there for 45 minutes, 45 minutes early. We get through security pretty quickly because it's pretty early, which is nice. And I am ready to walk down to the gate, because you know, like, the plane takes off at 7:30, which means that they're gonna board early and then you're gonna sit on the runway for a while. So we have to be there early, we have to be there early.

• 27:33Speaker 04

  We get through security and Robert heads to the coffee bar. And says, "I'm gonna get some coffee." And I say, "Robert, we don't have time." Robert says, "No, we're gonna be fine." And I'm like, "No, I don't think we are, but I don't wanna argue with him, I'm not big on confrontation."

• 27:52Speaker 04

  So, Robert goes over to the coffee bar. He waits for his coffee, and then he says, "You know, I think I'm gonna get a bagel, too." And I say, "A bagel?" And he says, "Yeah, just hold on." And the person at the counter says, "Would you like a toasted?" And Robert says, "Yeah, toasted, why not?" I say, "I'll tell you why not, because of the plane."

• 28:10Speaker 04

  So we wait for Robert's toasted bagel, and this entire time, I'm like, I'm, I'm, I'm standing there, I'm tapping my foot. And Robert gets his toasted bagel, and his coffee, walks over to the station where there's cream cheese and butter. He puts cream cheese and butter on it, and then he sits down at a table.

• 28:27Speaker 04

  I'm like, "Why are you sitting down at a table?" He says, "Would you calm down, we're fine." I'm like, "No, we're not fine, like, it's getting dangerously close to 7:20." And the plane takes off at 7:30, and the ga- like, we still have to go to the gate, which is far away. I don't know if you know this part of the Portland airport, but it's like down a weird hall, and then down an escalator, and then there's a turn. You know what I'm talking about? And so I, I decide that whether Robert is ready or not, I am going. I say, "You can have your bagel, you join me later, I'm going to the gate." And he says, "Fine." And so I, I, I go down to the gate, like, like just power walking as fast as I can with my, you know, little rollum suitcase.

• 29:05Speaker 04

  I get to the gate, and there is nobody there. Except for one person working for the airline, she's holding a clipboard. And she looks at me, clearly it's the roster of the, of, of, of the flight, uh, people. And she says, "Are you Eric, or are you Robert?"

• 29:24Speaker 04

  I said, "I'm Eric." She said, "Where's Robert?"

• 29:31Speaker 04

  I said, "He's having a bagel."

• 29:35Speaker 04

  She said, "Well, you have to get on the plane right now. We're about ready to take off." I'm like, "Can we wait just because he's..." And she's like, "No, right now." And at that moment, I look down that long hallway and I see Robert kinda ambling down the escalator. And I look, and I see his face, and he's, he's just having a gay old time, just full of coffee and bagel. And I say, "Robert!" And he says, "What?" And I say, "Run!" And so he kinda runs down to the gate, and this, this nice lady, she lets us onto the plane, and we, and we, and we get there on the, on, on... We have to walk like up the, up the stairs of the plane, like on the runway. And then, our seats are in the back, so we have to walk past every single person on the plane who's been waiting for us.

• 30:23Speaker 04

  I am so fuming mad by the time that we sit down. Robert looks peaceful and happy as a clam.

• 30:33Speaker 04

  I can hardly speak to him. I am seething with anger.

• 30:38Speaker 04

  And Robert looks at me, he can tell that something is a little twitchy in my eye, and he said, "What's wrong?" And I say, "We almost missed the plane!" And Robert looks at me and he says, "We're on the plane."

• 30:56Speaker 04

  And I could not argue with that.

• 31:02Speaker 04

  And I am proud of being a person who gets to places early, and plans, and travels well by myself, and stresses a little bit about, about when things aren't going entirely according to the clock. But every once in a while, I envy Robert's position, because he can look at things and say, "It's all gonna work out." And it usually does. Thanks.

• 31:32Speaker 00

  That was Eric Schur. Eric is an animator living in Portland, Oregon with his wife, stepson, a cat, and a bunny rabbit. He and his wife have also co-produced their own storytelling series, The Mystery Box Show, for 10 years in Portland. Eric's takeaway from this story is, even if you think you're where you want to be, look around. Surprises are everywhere. Time is finite. What will happen, will happen.

• 32:08Speaker 00

  So Jordy, when I reached out to Eric to tell him that his story was moving on to the episode, he shared this idea of the arrival fallacy, which I found fascinating. He said, "It's the idea that, once I have this experience, or see this place, or do this thing, I will be complete. I will be happy." He said, "It just doesn't work that way, and finding peace with that is its own kind of happiness." Have you heard of the arrival fallacy?

• 32:37Speaker 01

  I haven't heard of it, but now I'm gonna be obsessed with it. It also reminds me of this really cool poem by Thomas Transtraumer called "The Blue House." And in it, he talks so much about how not every journey was meant for us, that could have been for us, and so all we can do is be at peace with that. And he says, "All sketches wish to be real." And it just gives me goosebumps, and it's a similar idea, right? That there's all these different directions we can take, and it's a normal human experience to kind of lament the ones we can't, and enjoy the ones we can.

• 33:13Speaker 00

  We'll hear a little more from Jordy Ponce at the end of the hour.

• 33:18Speaker 00

  After our break, a woman is roped into whitewater rafting, and an act of kindness helps a woman live her greatest dream, when The Moth Radio Hour continues.

• 33:34Speaker 02

  The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.

• 33:44Speaker 05

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• 34:27Speaker 05

  more. From a great deal today to a great value tomorrow, a Toyota is right for you. Shop toyota.com for deals and details, or stop by your local Toyota dealer today. Toyota, let's go places.

• 34:43Speaker 00

  You're listening to The Moth Radio Hour. I'm Sarah Austin Jenness. What happens when you're called upon to help a friend complete their bucket list? That's what our next story is about. Samantha Williams told us at an open-mic Story Slam in New Orleans, where we partner with public radio station WWNL. Here's Samantha, live at The Moth.

• 35:07Speaker 06

  Thank you. Okay, so you should know that I can't swim. Keep that right here. Comes in handy later. So in 2015, I was living in Johannesburg, South Africa, and had a great group of girlfriends, many that I'd known for a couple of years. And my closest friend in the group, her name was Farai, and she was organizing a trip for our friend Lorraine to go to Victoria Falls to celebrate her 35th birthday. Now, this should be very straightforward. We're going to Vic Falls, we're doing boozy boat cruises, we're doing barbecues by the pool. It's gonna be great. And for the first two days of the trip, it was exactly that. We were lightly lit on the river, we saw the falls, we ate whole, you know, plates of food. Everything's wonderful.

• 35:52Speaker 06

  So then, on the day we're supposed to leave, Lorraine, who's turning 35 and in her feelings and like wants to have a big adventure before she leaves Vic Falls, says, "Ladies, what if we go whitewater rafting?"

• 36:07Speaker 06

  And all the other members of the group, there's six of us and we're all from, you know, we're living in South Africa, Zimbabwe, Tanzania, like these are downed women to adventure. They're like, "Yeah, let's go whitewater rafting." And I'm like, "Hey, I can't swim and I really need to make this flight because I have work tomorrow, so I don't think we should go whitewater rafting." Imagine us going on for about two hours and then imagining it ending with us in a van on our way to Victoria Falls for the whitewater rafting, reading the release waiver in the van, and learning that the Zambezi River is a Class 5 or Stage 5 River. There are no Stage 6 rivers for whitewater rafting. That's it. It is a Stage 5 River.

• 36:48Speaker 06

  And amateurs and people who can't swim are not supposed to be on that river whitewater rafting. Fast forward, an hour later, I'm shaking and like basically crying. Everyone else is super pumped. We're all ladled up in our vest and the guys are like, "A 97-year-old woman did this yesterday. You're fine." I'm like, "She sounds hardcore. I'm not. I can't swim." He then shows me how safe it's gonna be by throwing Lorraine into the river at like a calm part. And of course, her vest boobies her straight up and he's like, "See? You're gonna be just fine. You'll float up just like that too." And in my head, I'm like, "Maybe, yeah. Like, maybe I'll live through this."

• 37:27Speaker 06

  So, he teaches us the brace position. There are six of them on little canoes sort of beside us in the raft. And they tell us no one ever flips over, of course. "You're gonna be just fine." They're in their, I don't know what they're called, like kayaks, and they're like, "And if anything happens, we got you." We start going down the rapids and I'm feeling the breeze. It's actually kinda nice. We're surviving, so I'm happy. And then we start to get to the ones that, the rapids that have names. And I've forgotten the names, but it's like, "The washing machine." You know, the closet door, you know, the closet door, because it's like, it slams clothes really fast. And I was like, "Okay." And then we get to the Terminator.

• 38:10Speaker 06

  Like, "Are we going over the Terminator?" And he's like, "Yep." "Get your, you know, get your oars down. We're down, we're down." And then he screams out, "Brace!" Which means you're supposed to drop your oar into the raft and like, put your head down. So he screams, "Brace!" We do that. And the next thing I know, we are completely submerged under the water. I don't even remember this part of the day. I remember my friend, Farai, who was my roommate in grad school. Like, that means she owes me nothing in life, but we became great friends after this. She pulled me out of the water. I mean, I can't swim, so this, this raft, or the, the vest, you know, it can save you in still water, but the rapids going over your head from the Terminator, it's got very little to do. She's holding me for dear life and holding me onto the raft.

• 38:55Speaker 06

  It's completely overturned, so the bottom is up. And we're all just sort of screaming in the water, going over these rapids. The kayakers are telling us, they, there's nothing we can do until they can get us over into the side of the riverbank. And we notice that someone in the water starts having an asthma attack. This is a black woman who has started to turn purple. She cannot breathe. And I start noticing that my side really hurts. But she's purple, so I gotta keep it quiet, but my side really hurts. So we go over one more rapid. They start to try to, Farai pulls me onto the top of the raft, then pulls herself up. We get the woman who's having the asthma attack onto the top of the raft. Another rapid. It's still coming over every time. I'm sure it's the end for me, because at this point, I'm just swallowing water. There's really nothing you can do.

• 39:39Speaker 06

  And then I start to notice the blood on my side is starting to grow a little bit. Her asthma attacks upside, so I feel like I can speak up now. I'm like, "Hey, I'm bleeding." And it hurts, um, a lot. And then, I don't know if any of y'all have ever been hysterical, but it turned from like, "Hey, I'm bleeding," to screaming, "Y'all, I think something happened to me too." Another rapid, another rapid. To keep it to five, y'all, we went over nine more rapids before they could finally corral us over to the side of the river. So we get to the side of the river. They're finally able to call the emergency helicopter. We get helicopter evacuated. See the falls again. I feel them brush my face. Spend the night in the hospital.

• 40:24Speaker 06

  The next day, finally released. I had missed all this luscious chub. Hadn't made sure that no organs or bones got broken. But I was deeply bruised and decided that I will never, ever again go whitewater rafting. But I will go anywhere in the world with Farai.

• 40:51Speaker 00

  Samantha Williams is the executive director of Birmingham Promise, an organization in Alabama that helps young people achieve economic security and prosperity. She's the auntie of three little boys. And since the trip in the story, she and those same friends have traveled across South Africa, back to Zimbabwe, and to Australia. But she says, quote, "I've never done something that crazy since." So Jordi, okay, what did you think of Samantha's story?

• 41:20Speaker 01

  What really stood out to me and something I've learned on this bucket listing journey is that it is a team sport. And people have come to help me do it. And I haven't done any of these things alone. And so I loved how she was in on it to help her friends, even though it could have put her in mortal peril, and did.

• 41:40Speaker 00

  Shannon Garvey is our final storyteller in this hour. She told this in Boston at an open mic story slam, where we partner with public radio station WBUR. Here's Shannon.

• 41:55Speaker 07

  So, the August before my senior year of college, when others in my program of study were applying to medical school or interning in cognition labs, I was working as a barista at a bookstore café. I was eight months away from graduating with a degree in neuroscience and behavior. But I had this secret I didn't know what to do with. I wanted to be a writer.

• 42:21Speaker 07

  So I was spending all my time at the bookstore, even when I wasn't working. I was getting introduced to the music of Leonard Cohen. Somebody lent me their copy of Just Kids by Patti Smith. People were saying things in earnest around me like, "You've got to read The Russians." And, "Do you want to join our Ulysses book group?" I was wearing all these little corduroy skirts and tights with holes in them and black turtlenecks. And I even got bangs.

• 42:51Speaker 07

  And it was all just so romantic to me, every moment, every cappuccino I made, every book that I scanned, and every conversation that I was now a part of. But I was 21 and I was really freaked out about this double life. You know, "Who was I to want to be a writer?" I thought. "What did I really think that I had to say?" And beyond that, I didn't really understand the logistics of this being a writer business. Like, how does one make money? And how long could I realistically work at this café? What was going to happen after I graduated? I was worried that all these things I was feeling at the bookstore were going to disappear like a mirage once my bangs grew out and everyone realized I was an imposter.

• 43:34Speaker 07

  So I was looking for a sign, and I was looking for a push, and I was looking for them everywhere. So, one night I'm working, it's pretty dead, I'm studying for a chemistry exam, carbon structures. And I got bored of this, and I put that away, and I took out the essay I had been reading earlier by F. Scott Fitzgerald, who at the time was my favorite author. So, I'm reading, I'm making notes in the margins, when an older gentleman walks in. And he's standing by the door, kind of flustered, muttering under his breath. And I'm sort of bracing myself for a negative interaction. When he looks up at me and he grins, and he takes these two bounding steps forward and

• 44:15Speaker 07

  says in this really dramatic way, "Never get old, miss." "What are you reading there?" And I said, "Fitzgerald." And I mentioned he was my favorite author. And his eyes light up, and he says, "Fitzgerald, yes. But who was his wife?" And I say, "Zelda." And he says, "Yes, Zelda." And they met at a dance. So we went back and forth about Fitzgerald and writing for a little while. And the whole experience was really wholesome. And he mentioned that he had some pretty old books at home and maybe he'd bring them by sometime for me to look at. So I get him his green tea and his cookie. He goes off to enjoy.

• 44:55Speaker 07

  I didn't even really notice him leave, but a couple hours later, I'm closing up the bookstore, mopping the counter, and the door opens and he's back. Much the same way by the door, but this time he has something in his hands. And it's a little book wrapped in plastic. So he walks up to the counter and he opens it and he points to the first page and puts the book in my hands.

• 45:21Speaker 07

  It was a second edition copy of This Side of Paradise by F. Scott Fitzgerald, which was his first published novel, and it was signed.

• 45:30Speaker 07

  So I'm holding this piece of literary history in my hands and I'm looking at the signature and it looks so normal and crazy and I'm just, you know, thanking him for bringing it by. And I go to give it back to him, but he's taken two steps away from me. And he says that he wants me to have the book.

• 45:52Speaker 07

  And I am sputtering, I'm saying, "No, no, no, no, there's no possible way I can accept this." At the time, I had no idea what something like that could be worth, but I knew for certain it was much, much more than anything that I owned.

• 46:07Speaker 07

  And he kind of stops me and he says that he was a teacher for a really long time and my passion and enthusiasm for Fitzgerald reminded him of the enthusiasm from his students that really made it worth it for him and it just really brought a lot of light to his life. So I tried to give the back, book back one more time. He doesn't accept and he leaves kind of abruptly. And I never saw him again.

• 46:37Speaker 07

  So I took the book as the sign that I needed.

• 46:42Speaker 07

  It has followed me between rundown apartments, sat on the shelf while I've eaten Cliff Bars for dinner, and worked odd jobs to sustain writing time.

• 46:52Speaker 07

  Some of that old romance is definitely gone. I'll never get bangs again. Or be as excited about cleaning tables or mopping floors. It's not always paradise, but things feel much better on this side of it, pursuing a passion. Thank you.

• 47:16Speaker 00

  That was Shannon Garvey. Shannon lives in Portsmouth, New Hampshire with her partner, James, where she tries to spend as much time as possible in the ocean. Thanks to that stranger and the inspiration from his generous gift, Shannon is happy to report that her debut novel, June Baby, is being published by Random House and Thousand Voices Books. She still has the signed Fitzgerald on her bookshelf. There have been times when she's wondered how much writing time selling it could afford her, but she hasn't sold it and she doesn't think she ever will. Here's what Jordi Ponce had to say about this story.

• 47:55Speaker 01

  Well, now I have to add reading June Baby to my bucket list. In my experience with my story and with cancer, I have found that meaning and purpose has been so important, as I mentioned, and I love how she really went for it. She said there are all these pressures to follow this one maybe more seemingly secure path, but instead she really prioritized having that sense of meaning and purpose in her career. And sometimes those things are more important than gaining the approval of others or financial security is really being able to enjoy every day.

• 48:40Speaker 00

  Moth Stories come from everyone, everywhere. Consider telling your story at The Moth. We want to hear from you. Find an open mic moth slam through our website, themoth.org, and please share this episode with a friend you think would love The Moth and these stories. You can find us on social media, too. We're on Facebook at The Moth and on Instagram at Moth Stories.

• 49:06Speaker 00

  I want to thank all our storytellers, including Jordie Poncy, for being with us today. Here he is again to close us out.

• 49:13Speaker 01

  One more?

• 49:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 49:15Speaker 01

  That's it for this episode of The Moth Radio Hour. We hope you'll join us next time.

• 49:19Speaker 00

  Yay!

• 49:34Speaker 02

  This episode of The Moth Radio Hour was produced by me, Jay Allison, and Sarah Austin Janest, who also hosted and directed the stories in the show, with additional Grand Slam coaching by Michelle Jalowski. Co-producer is Vicky Merrick, associate producer Emily Couch. The rest of The Moth's leadership team includes Sarah Haverman, Christina Norman, Marina Kluch, Jennifer Hickson, Jordan Cardenale, Kate Tellers, Suzanne Rust, Sarah Jane Johnson, and Patricia Uraina. Moth stories are true, as remembered and affirmed by the storytellers. For more of the interview with Sarah and Jordie Poncy, and extras related to all these stories, go to themoth.org. Our theme music is by The Drift.

• 50:19Speaker 02

  Other music in this hour from Pino Palladino and Blake Mills, Hadouk Trio, Deluxe, Felix Labond, and Falbum. The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts. Special thanks to our friends at Odyssey, including executive producer Leah Reese Dennis. For more about our podcast, for information on pitching your own story, and to learn more about The Moth, go to our website, themoth.org.