Pod Insights My Therapist Ghosted Me MTGM EXTRA! "I'm anxious about our future." About this episode Vogue & Joanne decide that the best time to identify each other's red flags is whilst the mics are live and the pod is recording. WHY NOT?! Plus, a devilishly sweet revenge story and a troubling email from a girl with some very legitimate concerns.
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This episode contains explicit language and adult themes that may not be suitable for all listeners.
Transcript 0:01 Speaker 00 This is a Global Player original podcast.
0:10 Speaker 01 Hello, welcome to my therapist ghosted me the bonus episode with myself, Vogue Williams, and herself, Joanne McNally.
0:21 Speaker 01 Excuse me, Jo, excuse me.
0:24 Speaker 02 Fair joke.
0:25 Speaker 01 We were right in love a conversation.
0:27 Speaker 02 We're catching up.
0:28 Speaker 03 I'd hate, I'd hate to get in the way of a conversation. Is this we're gonna...
0:31 Speaker 01 We're catching up in your... I haven't spoken to her since this morning.
0:34 Speaker 02 You're just there with your fucking hair, looking at us, judging us and telling us what to do. We don't appreciate it.
0:39 Speaker 03 You let me know when you're ready.
0:41 Speaker 01 Have you noticed that I've put my hair in a ponytail? I'm thrilled with myself.
0:44 Speaker 02 I did, actually. Have you noticed I'm going grey?
0:47 Speaker 03 No.
0:48 Speaker 01 No, I did not notice.
0:49 Speaker 03 No.
0:51 Speaker 02 Have you any greys, Jo?
0:52 Speaker 03 No, I check every single morning, but no, not yet.
0:55 Speaker 02 Do you? Because women are attracted to power, success, wisdom, age, all that shit. It doesn't bother us as much, whereas men are drawn to fertility. So if you have grey hair, their brain starts ticking and they're like, this woman isn't fertile. So it stands against us, but it adds to them because they're like, oh, we're like, oh, they have more resources because they're old and grey.
1:15 Speaker 01 Well, I like old and grey. You know that director who just died, David Lynch?
1:19 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:19 Speaker 01 Everyone's mad about him, they're all posting about him. He has this full grey hair like Jo and he's absolutely like right up my street.
1:27 Speaker 02 It's sexy on men, life is, but not on women. Life is viciously unfair. Jo, have you anything to say about that?
1:33 Speaker 03 Sorry, probably sorry.
1:34 Speaker 02 The discrepancy between the genders, have you anything to say?
1:37 Speaker 03 Bloody sexism, if you ask me, mate.
1:39 Speaker 02 Good man.
1:40 Speaker 01 Jo, what's the meaning of life?
1:42 Speaker 02 Do you believe in God, Jo? Do you believe in God?
1:45 Speaker 03 No, not really. No, not day to day.
1:49 Speaker 02 What do you think happens when you die? Apart from you losing your hair?
1:52 Speaker 01 Let us know, go on.
1:53 Speaker 03 I think you probably have a few moments of sort of thinking back through everything, seeing how it went and maybe, maybe there's a moment or two of sort of euphoria.
2:02 Speaker 02 Jo, hurry up, will you?
2:03 Speaker 03 And then it's just done.
2:05 Speaker 01 And then you're done and that's it? You don't do anything?
2:07 Speaker 02 Jo, that was really long-winded. We'll have to edit that down. Anyway, Vogue, back to yourself and myself.
2:14 Speaker 01 Back to us. Christ alive, don't let him have the mic. Well, you wouldn't believe what's happened to me since this morning.
2:21 Speaker 02 Go on.
2:22 Speaker 01 As I was chatting to you two this morning, I
2:25 Speaker 02 Oh, she's digging in.
2:26 Speaker 01 Well, not my plane, not my plane. My train to Manchester and I love being on the train. It's my favourite place. I was wearing all my comfy clothes, nothing fancy, actually very unfancy. Like, look at these runners I'm wearing, my gym runners, because I was like, I'll save room in the case and wear the gym runners up. And anyway, it looked like shit. And I went, I was dying to go to the toilet, so I walked out of the train to the toilet and I saw a guy I used to date. I had to start talking to him and he actually was very sound, but I was really embarrassed. You know, when you know you look like shit and you're just like, oh, God.
2:59 Speaker 02 You never, you, you, you kind of never look like shit though. Like your shit isn't that shit, I would say.
3:07 Speaker 01 He looked very well put together though, very well put together. I kind of was dragging myself down the train.
3:13 Speaker 02 You've got a great base, like, yeah, you're working with good structure, I would say, yeah.
3:18 Speaker 01 I know, I know.
3:19 Speaker 02 There's nothing worse. When you meet your ex, you want to look like, you want to look like a knockout.
3:22 Speaker 01 Anyway, then I spoke to him when we got off the train and it was kind of fine. It was less embarrassing because it's the initial shock and you're like, oh, he's not my ex, by the way, a couple of dates, not my ex. And I actually was a really sound guy, but yeah, I mean, it just, it's a, you're like, oh, hello, I wish I, fuck, fuck it, fuck.
3:38 Speaker 02 He was, he was a situation, we would say.
3:41 Speaker 01 Yeah. And then I had to go to the toilet again on the train and I was like, I'd rather piss my pants, actually. I'm not.
3:47 Speaker 02 Don't let them know you've got bowels or a bladder. They don't need to know that information.
3:52 Speaker 01 I'd always, I'd always put in a double wee on a train, particularly if it's over two hours, because I drink loads of fluids. I love that they make you tea on the train. And then if I'm in the cinema, also a double wee, so I like to sit at the side of the row, so I'm not annoying anybody. I'm, I'm quite a nice person when it comes to not annoying people, but if I hop on an Aer Lingus flight, wee before we take off. I wee before we take off, so I don't have to annoy anyone. I, I really consider these things.
4:17 Speaker 02 Thank you for your urinary etiquette lesson. We are thrilled to have us, thrilled to have us.
4:23 Speaker 01 You are welcome. A kind, a kind sir.
4:26 Speaker 02 Thank you. What we need to get you is a catheter. It's one of those words I can't pronounce, a catheter.
4:32 Speaker 01 A what? She's reading.
4:34 Speaker 02 A catheter, catheter.
4:36 Speaker 01 A catheter, a catheter?
4:37 Speaker 02 Catheter, no, a catheter.
4:39 Speaker 01 My room service is here, hang on, hang on.
4:42 Speaker 02 We're trying to make you relatable folk. Jesus, she does not make this easy. She fucking does not make this easy.
4:48 Speaker 03 My caviar's just arrived, sorry.
4:53 Speaker 02 She's like, my staff have just come in with my... I'd say she eats fruit out of people's mouth. Like, I'd say they're gonna drop it in, like, what was that bird we were talking about that chews up food and spits it in their partners' mouths?
5:04 Speaker 03 I did go through that.
5:04 Speaker 02 Gannus!
5:05 Speaker 03 There's lots of birds that do it. It's not uncommon in the avian world.
5:09 Speaker 02 Gannus.
5:09 Speaker 03 But gannet is what you're thinking.
5:10 Speaker 01 Excuse me, by the way, I can hear you. This is not unrelatable. I've had to order my dinner because I'm working now and then I'm going straight to do rehearsals. Sorry if some of us want to eat and there's no caviar.
5:22 Speaker 02 We heard you pointed them in the face, Vogue. We all heard it. What was the delay? I ordered it three minutes ago.
5:29 Speaker 01 Yeah, excuse me? Where's my diet coke?
5:35 Speaker 01 I'm the most polite person you'll ever meet in your life.
5:38 Speaker 02 You don't complain, neither do I, to be honest. I couldn't be arsed.
5:41 Speaker 01 Would you like an email?
5:43 Speaker 02 Yeah!
5:44 Speaker 01 Well, no, you can't have one. No. Not after that. Not after being so rude to me.
5:48 Speaker 02 Go on, give us one, go on.
5:49 Speaker 03 Go on, just a little.
5:51 Speaker 02 Brandon Courtney is staring at me in a pair of Speedos. I don't have long.
5:54 Speaker 01 Oh, I love... Call him to come over and show us the Speedos. I love seeing him in the pool.
5:59 Speaker 02 He's delighted with himself. Oh, my God. He's like, look at me, look at me. It's like having a child in the pool.
6:06 Speaker 02 I'm like, fucking hell. I'm looking, I'm looking at you, Brandon. Yeah, that's great. He's 50 odd. I'm like, that's fantastic, babe. It's great. Look at you there with your pool noodle doing your handstands. Thrilled.
6:18 Speaker 01 Have you even got yourself a pool noodle? You've really... She's not coming home anytime soon.
6:22 Speaker 02 We've splashed out. No, I have a pool noodle, yeah. Pool noodle.
6:24 Speaker 01 Have you got any blowups?
6:27 Speaker 02 Interestingly, no. But like I say, I've extended the stay, so we don't know what will happen.
6:31 Speaker 01 It's a security issue if you get an inflatable. Supposedly, you're more inclined to drown.
6:37 Speaker 02 Well, not in a pool. Remember we were talking before about all the women in the 80s who died on Lilies? Because they just floated out and were never seen again. It's the creepiest shit I've ever heard.
6:47 Speaker 01 I have to say, I'd need some real fact checks on that there, because I just, I don't, I don't know if that's true now, I have to be honest.
6:53 Speaker 02 Honest to God.
6:54 Speaker 01 I don't like to, were you there?
6:55 Speaker 02 I know. Pressing my authority, I'm telling you now, I'm telling you now. Joe, Google that shit. These women disappeared, it was a, it was a, it was a, it was an epidemic. Women of the eighties, when Lilo's were invented, women were lying down, trying to tan, falling asleep, drifted out, never seen again.
7:12 Speaker 03 Oh yeah, the, the internet's just full of headlines, drifting out to sea, lifeboat deployed to rescue person drifting out to sea, yeah.
7:22 Speaker 02 Yeah.
7:22 Speaker 03 It's happening all the time.
7:23 Speaker 02 It's so creepy.
7:25 Speaker 01 I'm deeply sorry about that, deeply.
7:28 Speaker 02 Imagine, imagine us floating to death. Honestly, it makes me feel sick. Anyway, go on, emails, let's go.
7:34 Speaker 01 Okay, you can either have, is he a red flag? Or grinder drama, ooh.
7:39 Speaker 02 Ooh, let's go grinder drama, because he is a red flag. So that's answered. Let's go grinder drama. And so is she.
7:50 Speaker 01 He is a red flag, yes, and I'm marrying him immediately.
7:53 Speaker 02 We can, yeah, we can, we can, we can indulge this, but yes, he is. And also, I will say.
7:57 Speaker 01 You'll be incredibly happy together for a minute.
8:00 Speaker 02 So am I, and so was Joe. Like, no one's flagless. No one, no one is flagless.
8:04 Speaker 01 Okay, hang on a second, this is an interesting conversation. What are my red flags?
8:09 Speaker 02 I wouldn't, I don't know, I, I've never been in a relationship with you.
8:15 Speaker 01 You only know the red flag before.
8:18 Speaker 02 As your friend, business partner and confidant. Hold on till I get my notebook, I've actually been waiting for this moment for two years. Thank God, she's finally asked me.
8:34 Speaker 01 That's what my book is about, it's literally just about why Joanna's a red flag.
8:39 Speaker 02 Every human being is a, like, you can't, like, why are you looking for a fucking AI robot?
8:43 Speaker 01 Tell me one thing about myself. Tell me one thing that makes me red flag.
8:47 Speaker 02 Okay, well, I would say, as spectacular and gorgeous as you are, I would say, Jo's staring at me now. Me and Jo are, we go to a group every Wednesday to talk about, I'm joking. No, I would say, you're, you are, you are, I would say, driven, driven to a, I say problematic level.
9:08 Speaker 01 Because I don't, oh, I've no chill, that's okay.
9:11 Speaker 02 Yeah, there you go.
9:11 Speaker 01 I agree, I agree.
9:13 Speaker 02 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. There's no off switch with you. Like, you're writing up PowerPoints in your sleep. It's just, you're always on. You're always on. And remember we spoke about the value of, remember I was like, downtime is good for like creativity, it's good to be bored and let your mind wander, but you don't do that.
9:30 Speaker 01 Do you know what? I have, I've started taking, I'm trying to take at least two days off a week. And you know me, I'm always on holidays. I love going on holidays. So people shouldn't deny me that and give out to me when I'm on holidays. Because it's going to continue. So you're gonna, you're really wasting your breath.
9:45 Speaker 02 That is, as is your right. What would you say my red flag is?
9:49 Speaker 01 Um, I would say you're very disorganised.
9:52 Speaker 02 Yeah, fair. That's, that's fair. Like, that's a, a smart observation. If you had not seen that at this stage, I'd be like, another red flag for you is that you're fucking blind.
10:06 Speaker 02 I am disorganised. And you are highly organised. So my disorganisation is like highlighted compared to you.
10:13 Speaker 01 Us split in the middle would be the perfect woman.
10:17 Speaker 02 It's Jo.
10:20 Speaker 02 Us split in the middle is literally Jo.
10:25 Speaker 01 Okay, I'm glad we got through that part of our relationship without fighting.
10:28 Speaker 02 But you know what I, do you know what I will say, though? As, I know you're like, highly, what would you say, highly charged, what's a, what's a word when they're like, um? Sorry, I guess I think as someone like yourself, who's like as organised as you are, and I'm gonna, you know, you're very, you like control, you're very organised. And me, who's someone who is so unorganised, that the fact that we don't actually scrap more is shocking to me.
10:55 Speaker 01 But it actually says a lot about relationships. You should go for somebody who's not, like, imagine I was with a hyper organised person. I'd actually be really probably quite upset because I'd be like, well, what can I organise? Because you've already organised. You've taken my skill and used it. Now I've got nothing to do.
11:13 Speaker 02 Folks, if we were going out, I'd be buried in the patio at least by six months at the stage. You'd fucking murder me.
11:22 Speaker 01 No, what I do is, no, your side of the bed would be full of shit because what I would do is I pick up all, I would pick up all your stuff and I'd just put it on your side of the bed. So you'd have nowhere, you'd have to sleep on the floor. Because then I'd be trying to get you to put it away. And that's why I get the kids to tidy.
11:38 Speaker 02 You sleep on the couch and anyway, I wouldn't, I wouldn't go to bed because I'm like, I can't go down there again. Like it's, I just, I can't fake it anymore. It's why I'd be on the couch.
11:48 Speaker 01 Excuse me, I'd be like, I don't want her anywhere near me until she gets rid of those picky nails.
11:52 Speaker 02 If someone had told me her vagina's as big as their mouth, I would never have gotten involved.
11:58 Speaker 02 I don't have the time or the tongue to do this. Shit show. I work nights.
12:15 Speaker 01 Okay, okay, we're reading the email. It is called, the Grindr one. Ladies, I need to tell someone this but can't, so emailing you. Keep me in on. Last Friday at dinner, I thought I clocked Grindr app on my boyfriend's phone. Bastard. We're doing long distance for two months while I buy a house. I came back up on Sunday. Instead of calling it out in case I was wrong, I installed, oh, oh, I installed Grindr. And favoured it, this is very Lily Allen, isn't it? A blank profile that came online near his house just after I left. I parked in the street and he came online like clockwork.
12:54 Speaker 01 Like a mad bastard, I've spent all week correlating the online Grindr profile status and it fits perfectly with his routine.
13:02 Speaker 02 It's him. It's him.
13:04 Speaker 01 How is this for revenge? Oh my god, this is bad for him. He's coming to visit me Friday night. I've booked a lovely hotel. He's thrilled and thinks he's gonna have a lovely time paid for by me. What he doesn't know is that when he arrives, I'm gonna make him comfortable. Pour him a wine and then immediately tell him I know he's a cheating Grindr slut. And then I'm gonna kick him out onto the street at nine PM on a winter Friday night after a 250 mile journey. I hope he's just been paid trying to sort a hotel last minute on a weekend. Some may say it's spiteful. I say it's taking back the power. I actually think that that's not so bad of you. I don't even think that that's bad.
13:42 Speaker 02 I love that this person doesn't need advice. They're just telling us what they're gonna do. They're just like, this is what I'm doing. The decision has been made. We're like, right, keep us in the loop. Yeah, you deserve that.
13:52 Speaker 01 I'm amazed that you were able to hold it in. This is where my problem is. I explode immediately over anything. And then I'm like, I should, I wish. And you go back in your head, I wish I'd done something like you're doing.
14:04 Speaker 02 We've no, we've no long, we, we've no long game. We're too reaction, like we're very reactionary and very emotional. So we just, yeah, I know. We're like straight in kicking in the bedroom door. What the fuck is this? Who the fuck is Carol? Yeah. Standard. Yeah.
14:21 Speaker 01 Why have I been cheated on real bad? Yeah, actually lots of times now.
14:25 Speaker 02 Who the fuck is Carol? I think that might be the name of my memoir. Who the fuck is Carol? Anyway, sorry, are we advising this person or not?
14:32 Speaker 01 No, they've got it all under control, but we would like to hear you get on.
14:36 Speaker 02 So one of my mates was telling me the other day, he was going out with this guy, like really properly going out with this guy. And he, he is also a guy. And they were in a relationship and the guy that he was going out with was the one who like made it official as such. He was like, I don't wanna ride anyone else. Like, let's go out. And my friend was like, okay, let's go out, fine. And he was mad about him. And he said he just got this weird notion in his head that your mom was fucking around. So he went on Grindr and exactly like that, found, he put in the area. So your mum was like down the road from put in the area and this torso like faceless thing popped up and he asked him a couple of questions and realised it was him and yeah, it was him. Yeah. I know, I know.
15:21 Speaker 01 I'd love to though, thinking back to the times I've been cheated on, I'd love to have actually found out when I was going out with them. I just would have loved that.
15:29 Speaker 02 Would you though?
15:30 Speaker 01 Yeah.
15:30 Speaker 02 I don't know.
15:31 Speaker 01 Because you stick around for so long and you're just like, what? Why the hell?
15:35 Speaker 02 The gas thing is, and it's so, when you think about it, like quite embarrassing. But like, I've been cheated on and everything in my body, my whole body was like, I knew, my whole body knew I was being cheated on.
15:46 Speaker 01 Yeah.
15:47 Speaker 02 But when I confronted him, he denied it. And because I want to, I just wanted to believe him.
15:52 Speaker 01 You wanted it to not be true.
15:54 Speaker 02 Yeah. Yeah. So I just, I believed him. But like, I didn't believe him, but I was like, okay, he told me enough, he told me enough lies that I can now say, I'm, I can justify staying. But like, I knew, fucking knew. You know, you know, you know, your body knows.
16:07 Speaker 01 You do always know. If you have an instinct.
16:09 Speaker 02 Your body knows.
16:10 Speaker 01 It's usually true. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
16:11 Speaker 02 Yeah. The lesson is, trust your instincts. They're not witchy woo woo bullshit. They are, you're reading a situation with your eyes and yourself. Okay. Next.
16:19 Speaker 01 Okay. Is he a red flag? Hi Joanne, Vogue and Jo. Please keep me in on, but I need your help because my relationship is turning into a whirlwind of guilt, confusion and way too much attention on my underwear drawer. Here's the story. I've been with my boyfriend for two years now and lately, things just feel off. He's great in some ways, but there are a few patterns I can't shake. One, every disagreement somehow ends with him guilting me into feeling like I'm the bad guy and apologising for something even when I know I'm not.
16:47 Speaker 02 I'm writing that down. That's actually just good. That's a good argument tactic. It's not, that's just how people argue. He's just good at it. All right. Next point.
16:55 Speaker 01 I know, but I can barely even apologise when I am wrong. So.
17:00 Speaker 01 I've put so much effort into, I'm sorry, but I'm sorry, but I'm sorry, but remember you.
17:07 Speaker 02 I'm sorry that what I did made you feel like that, but that's kind of your problem for feeling. So I'm out. I've made my point. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
17:17 Speaker 01 I've put so much effort into building a relationship with his family, but he barely makes an effort with mine. I get he's a shy person, but I'm also extremely shy and still managed to build a relationship with his family. It's like he thinks dating me doesn't include the people I care about. Don't like that. I'm very family oriented.
17:34 Speaker 02 Yeah.
17:35 Speaker 01 And he has a habit of making me feel like I'm not affectionate enough, saying I don't kiss him or tell him how gorgeous he is enough. And it's wearing me down.
17:44 Speaker 02 Oh my God. I think I was seeing this lad. Go on.
17:48 Speaker 02 Honestly, I swear to God. Go on.
17:50 Speaker 01 There's always someone that's more affectionate in the relationship. They're just, I'm not like a massively affectionate person, but like I didn't, I wasn't getting like loads of hugs and stuff when I was younger. It just wasn't done in our house.
18:01 Speaker 02 I, I was seeing, I was seeing a lad who was like, you're not affectionate enough. And I was like, you're riding other women. Like,
18:08 Speaker 02 we're not exclusive and you want me to be what? Fucking rubbing your back on the couch.
18:13 Speaker 01 No.
18:13 Speaker 02 Oh God.
18:15 Speaker 01 And the strangest part, the first thing he noticed about me most days isn't my smile or my mood. It's my underwear. He checks it every time.
18:23 Speaker 02 Checks it in what capacity?
18:25 Speaker 01 Well, he makes a comment if she's not in sexy underwear. I feel like more of an object than a. To top it all off, I'm anxious about our future. We're both very young, early twenties, and he seems very keen on moving in together despite me still being in college. No, I think that you're gonna have to do a runner here. Every time the future conversation starts, I get so anxious and I just can't, that's, that's exactly what we were talking about. Trust your gut.
18:49 Speaker 02 He's triggering your nervous system. This is all that this is. Your nervous system is heightened. You need to calm it down. You feel like he's the person who can help you calm it because he is, because you've given him that power. He's checking your knickers. Get the fuck out of this. It's, it's wrong.
19:03 Speaker 01 I've been considering going for my master's degree in a different country about three hours away, but he's passing comments and playing the victim, saying it would be too hard in our relationship and could ruin it. It's like I can't focus on anything without the weight of this hanging over me. I'm at a crossroads. Part of me feels like I need a break from the relationship to see how I feel on my own, but I also want to handle this with as much respect as possible.
19:23 Speaker 02 You need a break forever, actually. Any lad who's stepping in and stopping you getting your fucking education, no. Take it as you're two elderly aunts. This lad is contr- I don't, I don't like the sound of this at all. Checking your knickers? Fuck off. No. Out, out, out. Go get your education, cultivate your life, build yourself. No. Deescalate all this shit, get out.
19:46 Speaker 01 Go live in a different country while you have the chance. Like, it's really fun. Like, you will go live your best life and, yeah, and wear rotten knickers.
19:55 Speaker 02 Go get your qualifications, read Nora Ephron, drink red wine, enjoy your life. No, he's out. Joe, do you agree with us?
20:03 Speaker 03 A hundred percent. I'm really glad that you chose this email because as soon as I saw it, I thought we have to get this on because she has to know that this is bad.
20:12 Speaker 01 It's not right. Yeah, it's not good. That's awful. They're not even like fun red flags. They're like real bad red flags.
20:20 Speaker 02 Concerning red flags. And do you know what? I went out with a lad, I went out with a lad once and if ever I posted anything online where I, where it was like potentially flirty or I had like a neck exposed or something, he'd kick off. And
20:37 Speaker 01 Weird.
20:38 Speaker 02 It's, it's really, it's, it's very telling. It's very telling. No.
20:43 Speaker 01 Controlling situations like that are, are never good. I used to go out with a guy who would like give out to me if I wore like a sports bra in the gym, you know, and I'd be like, what? He'd be like, look at you going around the gym like that. Yeah. And then I wasn't allowed to train at the same time. It was really weird.
20:58 Speaker 02 Yeah. And Vogue knows this. I went out with a lad who stopped me training with someone because he was like, what? These men, they will never change. That is what they are. They are controlling, insecure, weird and dangerous. Get the fuck away.
21:18 Speaker 02 That's it for this week. Thanks for listening. We adore you and we'll see you soon. Keep sending a email to [email protected] .
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