How to Scale Your Reselling Business with AI

In this episode of the GaryVee Audio Experience, I sit down with the team at the We Got Sole Podcast to discuss the evolving world of reselling and culture. I explain why I believe reselling is a better business education than college and why the current "soft" sneaker market is actually a massive investment opportunity. I also dive into the importance of your reputation as a moat and why being a "nice guy" is a long-term business strategy. You’ll learn about:My "hire fast, fire faster" management philosophyWhy I’m bullish on vintage comic books and fictional character cardsHow to use AI tools to scale your business solo

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs.

• 0:29Speaker 01

  Every little kid now can sit and literally be in their room and have the power of 13 employees. That's insane. So you have to become incredibly good at vibe coding or using AI tools to scale you to get better information. But what you would learn if you're 50 is like, I'm going to actually do it because I need to know it well enough because this is a skill that's going to be so important that if I always outsource it, I'll never really know it. So I'll never be able to judge it over the next 10 years. This is the Gary Vee Audio Experience.

• 1:02Speaker 02

  Gary, thank you so much for coming on. Like sincerely, obviously, we've known each other for seven years or something like that, and I've been a fan for a decade. And it's just such an honor to have you. So thanks for being on the show.

• 1:12Speaker 01

  Happy to be your voice.

• 1:13Speaker 02

  Cool. Well, you are seen as like a, I don't even know how to say it. You're seen as a titan in this culture world and someone whose opinion is very much so trusted. So to get started, we got some hot topics.

• 1:24Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:24Speaker 02

  We want to ask you.

• 1:25Speaker 01

  Right, get right into it.

• 1:26Speaker 02

  We want your vulgar opinion.

• 1:27Speaker 01

  Okay, please.

• 1:27Speaker 02

  Don't hold back.

• 1:28Speaker 01

  I won't.

• 1:29Speaker 02

  The context on this one, you may have seen it on social. One of the most viral moments of all time at a Got Soul event is Meek Mill negotiating at our event and bartering for a pair of sneakers. The same thing's happened with Fat Joe. It's happened with other celebrities. And there's a huge discourse over should celebrities, rappers, famous people be negotiating with resellers for prices on their sneakers? Or should they just take the price? So should rappers and famous people be negotiating for their sneakers?

• 1:53Speaker 01

  It's none of my business. Here's what I mean by that answer. I obviously have seen that. In a negotiation, there's a two-way marketplace and there's an exchange happening. Some people, if they bought an expensive pair of rare Jordans, are gonna be as a reseller, and I've been, by the way, what's crazy is I've been on both sides of this. As a kid, there were people with clout and importance negotiating with me, and then I became someone who could do that.

• 2:21Speaker 02

  Right.

• 2:22Speaker 01

  I don't, I, I, let me, let me break this all down, because I think, I think everyone will agree with me that's watching. What two men, or two women, or a man and a guy do in a transaction deal is really ultimately none of our business. Like, I understand, we live in this world now where everyone thinks they should have an opinion about every fucking thing. I don't live that life. Here's why. The answer is yes or no. If I'm a reseller, if I'm selling something, and Meek Mill is at my table, and it's being filmed, I may see that as an investment for marketing.

• 2:58Speaker 02

  Right. That was his argument.

• 3:00Speaker 01

  Is that his argument?

• 3:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:02Speaker 01

  He's right. Like, there are companies that pay Meek to wear stuff.

• 3:08Speaker 02

  Tons of money.

• 3:08Speaker 01

  The fuck is a reseller not doing it for his ability, or her ability, to clip it and run it for their business? On the flip side, if somebody in the comments of this said, "Gary, no, no, no, like, I fucking worked hard, fuck Meek Mill, fuck Gary Vee, fuck..." I'm like, "Bet! You're allowed to do that." On the flip side, Meek, he's allowed to be like, "Yo, give me this."

• 3:32Speaker 01

  He's allowed? Like, in real life, it's not like that's illegal.

• 3:36Speaker 02

  Right.

• 3:37Speaker 01

  Now, some people might have feelings about that. Why are you using your cl... He might say, "Well, because I really think this person is getting value." It's also on the follow-up. If I give Meek a free pair of sneakers, if Meek's then putting on seven emerging artists onto my shit, and I become that dealer, well, that feels better. But that needs to be pre-negotiated too. I can't just assume Meek's gonna do that.

• 3:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 4:00Speaker 01

  In that negotiation, if, you can't be mad at Meek if you believe in capitalism.

• 4:08Speaker 01

  The dealer's allowed to say no. A lot of people have that. Do you know how many people on my come up asked me to do marketing for free because I needed them? Everyone. I said no every time because I knew I was gonna become who I was gonna become. But in pockets, I've done stuff. And a lot of times, I'll do shit for free before the person even asks.

• 4:29Speaker 02

  Right.

• 4:30Speaker 01

  Because in the micro, I think it's worth it. So, long winded to your answer, none of my business. My opinion, I'm agnostic. I think it can and cannot work. And I think every dealer and every celebrity or person with audience are allowed to do whatever they want.

• 4:48Speaker 02

  Got it. Okay. So, no hard yes, no, it's okay?

• 4:51Speaker 01

  Well, because I don't think, I don't think, you know, I guess if you're like, Gary, I'm not letting you off the hook. I would say yes, everybody can do whatever the fuck they want.

• 4:58Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 4:58Speaker 01

  You know what I mean? Like, in essence, I think I am saying yes. You know, like, again, it's not like someone's punking him.

• 5:05Speaker 02

  Right.

• 5:05Speaker 01

  It's not like, Meek's not like, my bodyguards are gonna beat the fuck out of you if you don't give me this sneaker. Like, you know what I mean? Like, Meek's allowed to use his equity, which is his fame, to negotiate if he chooses to. Some people will look down on that and say, that's not classy. I'm someone who puts out all of my marketing for free, like, my best advice for free. Tons of people sell it. Close Discord, close Telegrams, fucking courses. Like, everyone's allowed.

• 5:35Speaker 02

  Right. So, let him do what he needs to do.

• 5:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, again, other dealers are always worried that some precedent is being set that's gonna take away their money.

• 5:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:48Speaker 01

  That's who's, right? That's who, I get that.

• 5:50Speaker 02

  And I think one other argument, and we can go on to the next.

• 5:53Speaker 01

  No, no, I'm interested in this.

• 5:54Speaker 02

  That was one part, was like, oh, don't use your fame, you know, it's bullying, you know, this, that. But then another.

• 5:59Speaker 01

  There's no bullying if the other person is like, willing to say no. Like, instead of bullying, how about?

• 6:05Speaker 02

  And nobody's putting.

• 6:05Speaker 01

  It's not, we're not talking about 4th graders.

• 6:07Speaker 02

  Right.

• 6:08Speaker 01

  In science class, we're talking about fucking people that decided to buy a table and sell in a fucking commerce environment.

• 6:14Speaker 02

  Right. The other argument was, Meek Mill's a multimillionaire, he should just pay the price.

• 6:18Speaker 01

  I don't impose my opinions on what people should spend their money on.

• 6:21Speaker 02

  Right. I personally think he should.

• 6:24Speaker 01

  I think there's a lot of people that have that opinion, that are dealers that make a million dollars a year, that don't tip people.

• 6:29Speaker 02

  Right, yeah.

• 6:30Speaker 01

  Like, this concept of should, imposing your perspective on what is virtuous in the world on other people blows my mind. The same people that are meeks of multimillionaires, that make 200,000 a year slinging jewelry, cards, sneakers, and then fucking don't tip people at a restaurant, are doing the same shit.

• 6:49Speaker 02

  Right.

• 6:49Speaker 01

  It's all relative.

• 6:51Speaker 02

  It's all different scale.

• 6:51Speaker 01

  Again, I just, you know, unless someone's doing something illegal. I struggle to get into the virtues, because virtues change. I believe in tipping. Not everyone does. Like, they're allowed, they might have grown up in a different environment. I believe in charitable events. I'm very charitable. I don't publicize it, but I write real checks.

• 7:12Speaker 02

  Others don't.

• 7:13Speaker 01

  Others don't. I do not think someone who's not into charity is lesser than me. I don't want to peacock. You notice, I mean, I'm bringing it up now, we're having a conversation, but I don't make a lot of content about my charitable.

• 7:23Speaker 02

  Right.

• 7:24Speaker 01

  In fact, I'm very quiet about it. And I definitely won't judge another man or woman just because they have 100 million, like, I just, I don't know when everyone decided they were God.

• 7:33Speaker 02

  Social media has done that.

• 7:35Speaker 01

  No, no, social media exposed that.

• 7:37Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 7:37Speaker 01

  People sat in their kitchen tables and were God.

• 7:41Speaker 02

  It's, couldn't be more true. Next one. I think I already know your answer to this, but people will definitely disagree, which I, I'm on your side, I know your answer. Are resellers entrepreneurs?

• 7:53Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 7:54Speaker 02

  A lot of people say no, they're just hustlers, they're just taking advantage of a market, they're not really an entrepreneur.

• 7:58Speaker 01

  The definition of an entrepreneur.

• 7:59Speaker 02

  Start a business.

• 8:00Speaker 01

  Well, I think it is a business. Like, if you buy and sell something, I mean, I think it's the actual def- I don't know if anyone could argue, like, what's the, can someone, like, ChatGPT or Claude, like, what's the definition of an entrepreneur? The official Webster, like, let's, let's, let's play right now. I mean, in my mind, it is.

• 8:16Speaker 02

  I couldn't agree more.

• 8:17Speaker 01

  To me, it's, you don't have a job. You work for yourself, you pay for your dinner and your rent through your money? That, I view entrepreneurship as independent, yes, sir.

• 8:27Speaker 03

  Entrepreneur is someone who creates, organizes, and runs a business usually taking on financial risk in hope of making a profit.

• 8:32Speaker 01

  That's it. I mean, how are you not taking on a risk? You are not, you know, now, if you're saying I have a job and my side hustle is reselling, then you're both-ish. It's a side hustle, but anyone, in my opinion, if you listen to that definition, takes the risk. If your whole life, the way you pay for your roof over your head, the food on your table, is based on buying and selling product, if that's the definition of a reseller, well, I would argue that's an entrepreneur.

• 8:59Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 9:00Speaker 01

  And I would argue that it's an entrepreneurial venture if you have a job and it's your side hustle. Anyone who's saying it's not, first of all, I don't think it means anything to debate, like, I don't care if somebody thinks I'm an entrepreneur or not. There's also that, for every reseller, who actually cares if somebody else thinks they're an entrepreneur or not, that's a whole nother conversation for another day, which is like, who gives a fuck?

• 9:24Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs.

• 9:54Speaker 04

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• 10:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I agree. Okay, next one. I think people will definitely disagree or agree with this one too. You obviously have gotten in the trenches, you've done the garage sales, the whole thing. You've talked a lot about that hustle culture, reselling, you know, flipping world. Is reselling a better, actually let me rephrase this. So, is reselling a better business education than going to college?

• 10:49Speaker 01

  Yes. Because supply and demand and buying and selling, and learning how to market and create sales and marketing DNA, is a better education because you're doing, and a classroom is listening.

• 11:03Speaker 02

  Right.

• 11:04Speaker 01

  But like, I think working at a retail store as a cashier is a better education in business.

• 11:11Speaker 02

  And a lot of the business teachers now, I went to Babson, they say the number one entrepreneurship school in the world for 30 years, and I'm very happy that I went there. But a lot of those entrepreneurship teachers didn't even start a business, or don't run a business themselves.

• 11:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I've spoken at Babson multiple times and other places, like, listen, I love people learning finances. Like, I think colleges do a good job. And by the way, it's not that I'm mad at college. I just think what you learn from college is very learnable in an AI back and forth today.

• 11:39Speaker 02

  Right.

• 11:40Speaker 01

  And what you really need to learn is, like, the trenches. Like, again, you can watch football film, you can read about football, but you have to get on the field and like, play football to be a football player. I really do believe entrepreneurship is like that. I'm not against the education. But you went to Babson. I go to all these schools and watch what they're learning. Like, you're learning case studies, and you're learning theories, and you're learning good information of like, this is what you should do. But there is no should in entrepreneurship, because the world changes. You were taught when AI did not exist.

• 12:10Speaker 02

  Right.

• 12:11Speaker 01

  Now what? Hey everybody, I hope you're enjoying the podcast right now. Make sure you follow the podcast, that's why I'm interrupting. Let's keep going on this show, but follow the podcast. It'll make my mom super happy. Entrepreneurship is true sports, it's merit, the field changes. You can learn basketball, but then Wemby comes along and he's 7'7", and he's got wings in, and like, you've got to play dip. Like, I just believe in that when we talk about entrepreneurship and business. You have to adjust to the reality of the marketplace. I do not think college is built for creatives and entrepreneurs. I'm not against people going to college when their parents pay for it. I hate when creative or entrepreneurial kids go to college in today's environment and take on staggering debt.

• 12:52Speaker 02

  Right.

• 12:53Speaker 01

  I do believe most real entrepreneurs will tell you they learned more in the trenches than they learned in school. It's not school's fault. You can't keep up with the market.

• 13:01Speaker 02

  Of course not. No, I completely agree. And I think it just boils down to just experience can't be taught.

• 13:05Speaker 01

  Correct.

• 13:08Speaker 01

  Listen, I was destined to be a very successful entrepreneur. I had it. Fucking boy, I had it. The lemonade stands, the card shows. I learned in the trenches. But bro, Gary Vee, like me sitting here today against 25-year-old Gary who fucking built a monster business for his dad. I'm just better.

• 13:25Speaker 02

  You've been in it.

• 13:26Speaker 01

  I'm just too much inexperienced, too much pattern recognition. I figured out my kryptonites along the way. Like, experience really fucking matters. And unlike sports where your body breaks down. Like, do you understand that if LeBron was still physically as talented as he was four years into the league, what he'd be doing right now with his information?

• 13:45Speaker 02

  Right.

• 13:45Speaker 01

  But that's not how sports works out. But it is how it works out in entrepreneur land.

• 13:49Speaker 02

  For the mental.

• 13:49Speaker 01

  You have no idea how much better you guys are gonna be in a decade. You're gonna be like...

• 13:52Speaker 02

  That's gonna be laughable.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  And I didn't really believe it when I sat in your seats, meaning like I thought it was a natural talent like Kobe, like Serena, like, but it's very real.

• 14:03Speaker 02

  Well, I think everyone starts in a different point and then the time in is just gonna grow.

• 14:08Speaker 01

  Actually, let me stand on some business that I haven't historically. I've talked a lot about being a nice guy. You know, nice guys finish first, all that stuff I put out there, the propaganda that some of the players make fun of me for. It was funny, we were just talking, there's something else. Your reputation becomes your moat. One of the things that's going on with me now is just a lot of people in real life, not on social media, know how nice of a guy I am, and that is giving me a lot of business opportunity.

• 14:34Speaker 02

  Right. Yeah. Cool. Alright, those are some of the hot topics.

• 14:38Speaker 01

  So that's another thing, I'm just saying for all the kids, one of the reasons it's good to be a good person and not scam people and not fuck with people is when you get to 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, you're trading on your reputation.

• 14:49Speaker 02

  Right.

• 14:50Speaker 01

  That equity's enormous when you get to the big leagues.

• 14:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, at scale.

• 14:53Speaker 01

  At scale, it matters.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  Cool. Alright.

• 14:56Speaker 01

  You know?

• 14:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, and you mentioned the kids and you also mentioned like tying all this in, you know, your past experience. You've been in the trenches, you've done it all. But you mentioned today's world is much different than we grew up, especially when you grew up.

• 15:07Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 15:08Speaker 02

  So then I wanna ask you, how does someone become rich in today's world, reselling?

• 15:14Speaker 01

  I mean, it's easier than ever. Like, I think about this every day. Like, how dead I am that I didn't grow up in your guys' era. Like, I would have

• 15:24Speaker 01

  Fuck, man. I couldn't even imagine being 16 right now. Vibe coding and using Claude and all these AI tools. Using my insanity of passion, 15 hours a day being in the trenches, making relatio- I mean, it's all the same shit, it's just super tools, right? Like, I had flea markets and the malls of New Jersey. Then there was eBay, which I dreamed to wish I would have had. Then there was StockX and eBay. Then it was Discord and social and Telegram. And now it's AI. I mean, you've gotta be AI usage. Like, every little kid now can sit and literally be in their room and have the power of 13 employees. That's insane. So you have to become incredibly good at vibe coding

• 16:08Speaker 01

  or using AI tools to scale you. To get better information, to scale your relationship. I would sit down right now and create an app that automatically DM'd every person on Earth.

• 16:19Speaker 02

  Oh, I'll pay for it. If you make it, hit me up.

• 16:22Speaker 01

  What you're still thinking, this is what's so crazy. How old are you?

• 16:25Speaker 02

  26.

• 16:26Speaker 01

  This is how fast the game moves. 16-year-old you, listening to this, would know you could build it. But because you're 26, you already are old enough to not think that I could build the app?

• 16:37Speaker 02

  No, I know that I could build it. My focus isn't there. We're tunnel vision.

• 16:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, but what you would learn if you're 50 is like, "I'm going to actually do it." Because I need to know it well enough, because this is a skill that's gonna be so important.

• 16:48Speaker 02

  Right.

• 16:48Speaker 01

  That if I always outsource it, I'll never really know it. So I'll never be able to judge it over the next 10 years.

• 16:54Speaker 02

  Right.

• 16:54Speaker 01

  Did you see what I just said?

• 16:55Speaker 02

  Learning it is huge.

• 16:56Speaker 01

  But did you see what I said?

• 16:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, I get it.

• 16:58Speaker 01

  You know, because now you're gonna have 50 kids that are gonna DM you.

• 17:00Speaker 02

  Right.

• 17:01Speaker 01

  And be like, "I can build it." You don't actually know enough to make the best decision. One of the things that's made me very dangerous is because I do the things, I can judge the kids.

• 17:10Speaker 02

  Right.

• 17:11Speaker 01

  So you start to realize, "It's worth your 100 hours." Even though you're busy as fuck, if it's worth my 100 hours. It's definitely worth your 100 hours. And you start to prioritize the trenches.

• 17:21Speaker 02

  Right. Okay.

• 17:23Speaker 01

  Makes sense?

• 17:23Speaker 02

  No, it makes sense, it makes sense. So, how do you get rich reselling? You say lean into AI.

• 17:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think that's clearly one. I mean, like, diversification. My big theory, and you guys know this, you watched me do it publicly, that the sneaker kids were gonna crush with cards. More inventory, less weight. It worked, I was right. I think there's more categories. Like, if, and by the way, passions. Like, I'll give you one. Getting into music. Physical music. Cassettes, DVDs, CDs. Like, you see what's going on with, you know, you know, Spies doing some stuff. I think Ioki did some stuff.

• 17:54Speaker 02

  Bit of everything.

• 17:55Speaker 01

  Like, I just think everything is gonna...

• 17:57Speaker 02

  That's essentially exactly what our expansion is. Like, we've talked...

• 18:00Speaker 01

  Correct.

• 18:00Speaker 02

  Started with just sneakers and now expanding into all these things because all these worlds now, and this is something we were gonna ask you later on, actually, they're all intersecting now more than ever.

• 18:08Speaker 01

  A hundred percent. This was my theory.

• 18:09Speaker 02

  The person that is into sneakers now enjoys trading cards.

• 18:12Speaker 01

  You guys see the video, this was my theory.

• 18:13Speaker 02

  So I guess I would ask you then, you know, we've talked more extensively behind the scenes about the Gottsol expansion. I'd love to hear like your candid thoughts on where Gottsol's going with this expansion to a culture festival.

• 18:22Speaker 01

  It's all gonna come down to execution. What do I think? I think everyone should do everything. That's what I'm trying to do.

• 18:28Speaker 02

  Right.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  I like really have my hands in everything. Like, things that people don't, people don't know that I have a very successful hot TV production company. You guys don't even know that. I don't talk about VaynerWatt at all.

• 18:37Speaker 02

  Right.

• 18:38Speaker 01

  We're about to sell three major shows. Like, there's gonna be a massive show on ABC, and it's gonna be VaynerWatt, and you're gonna be like... You're gonna hit Tyler and be like, "Is that Gary? Like, Vayner...?" Like, like, so I'm in TV, like, like, now with AI music, I'm like, I'm gonna have the number one rap album in the world. What do I think? I think that your bravado and confidence and prior receipts give you a chance of pulling off what I think you're trying to pull off, which is like, why wouldn't you be the most important, you know, event covering all the genres of interest? Why wouldn't you?

• 19:09Speaker 02

  Right. Yeah, I mean, I think it's a no-brainer for us. I think Gottsol's positioned the brand in a unique way, and already had all these other worlds prior that have come under our roof, so... Yeah, it's almost a no-brainer, like you said.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, like, why wouldn't you add vintage clothing?

• 19:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, we have it.

• 19:23Speaker 01

  Correct. Why wouldn't you? Why wouldn't you add stamps and coins? Like, you will when you eventually think it's worth your operational, like, I think everyone should... achieve to as much TAM as possible. The addressable market, right? TAM. I'm obsessed with TAM. Like, when I make things, like VFriends. I built VFriends not just to get like 8-year-olds that collect Pokemon. I'm also making gummies. I want to be General Mills, like Flintstone Vitamins and Count Chocula fucking cereal. Like, I always talk about VFriends. 3 to 93. I want kids watching cartoons on YouTube Kids. And I want to fucking make adult fucking Pampers. Like Depends with fucking, you know, like, you know, like a character on it.

• 20:08Speaker 01

  I don't give a fuck. Like, why wouldn't I want to sell to 9 billion people?

• 20:13Speaker 02

  I think that's another piece of advice for the resellers, though. Like, even for a lot of people who watch stuff.

• 20:17Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 20:17Speaker 02

  If you're just selling sneakers right now, or you're just selling trading cards, or you're just selling vintage clothes, like, you should be exposed into all these worlds.

• 20:23Speaker 01

  And I would say if you do it based on passion, then you'll really crush. So there's people flipping sneakers, but they love music way more. They should spend 50 hours understanding what's happening with vintage music materials. DVDs, CDs, excuse me, CDs, cassettes, records. Like, if you love music, like, love it. Like, you're hardcore. And like, you had an older sister that was into like Grateful Dead and Phish things, but you're a hip-hop person. And your girl's fucking, you know, Hispanic, and she's into reggaeton. Like, it's your life.

• 20:52Speaker 02

  Right.

• 20:52Speaker 01

  You love it. Like, why don't you spend 50 hours understanding how to flip music?

• 20:57Speaker 02

  Right.

• 20:58Speaker 01

  Posters and tickets and memorabilia. Like, you like it more than sneakers. That's, by the way, the reason I knew sports cards was gonna work is the overlap of kids that were flipping sneakers that liked sports was high. The overlap of kids flipping sneakers that were gambling on sports apps was high. I knew sports cards was the mapping.

• 21:18Speaker 02

  Is sports cards a bubble?

• 21:19Speaker 01

  No. It's been around way longer than sneakers.

• 21:23Speaker 02

  True.

• 21:23Speaker 01

  It's been collected for 100 years.

• 21:25Speaker 02

  Do you think that there's any chance?

• 21:25Speaker 01

  No! Do I think the market could be frothy? A bubble to me is like something that bursts and dies.

• 21:32Speaker 02

  Right.

• 21:33Speaker 01

  Can it be frothy? Sure. So could the stock market, so could gold, so could Bitcoin, art, everything. I mean, sneakers were.

• 21:41Speaker 02

  Right.

• 21:41Speaker 01

  But they weren't. Like, when sneakers were at their apex before the card movement... It wasn't that it was a bubble, it was that people didn't anticipate trading cards coming in and taking some of the market.

• 21:51Speaker 02

  Right.

• 21:52Speaker 01

  Thus, once you take the market, if the demand goes elsewhere, all of a sudden, it changes. Can something come along and take away from the sports card market? Yes. I think comic books are under-leveraged. I think toys are under-leveraged. So that might, it might all grow. Which is my theory. Just collectibles. Like, Labubus, vintage clothes, handbags. Like, the girls are in now. The girls are in now.

• 22:18Speaker 02

  More than ever.

• 22:18Speaker 01

  More than ever, and gonna continue to grow. The 40 to 60-year-old dude who grew up with it heavy in the 80s and 90s with me? More than ever. To this day, I'm getting pinged by very wealthy people saying, "I'm finally ready to..." And I just sold a piece of property to create liquidity. I've got 800,000. I'm going into collectibles. I collected cards and comics. Is there anything else I should be looking at, Gary? These are just friends, acquaintances.

• 22:43Speaker 02

  Right.

• 22:43Speaker 01

  Like, we haven't even started.

• 22:44Speaker 02

  No, I agree. I mean, you're seeing people like Kevin O'Leary, who's spending all this money, and people are putting together, you know, asset pools now.

• 22:50Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 22:50Speaker 02

  Investment funds. So it's funny, because you talked about that, what people call is a bubble of the sneaker market, and, you know... I agree that if something doesn't pop completely, it's not a bubble, right? It just has the ups and downs.

• 23:00Speaker 01

  Corrections.

• 23:01Speaker 02

  But, right, so I guess I would ask you now, like, going back to a hot topic. The number-one narrative now, that we see on social media in the world, to the sneaker world, is sneakers are dead.

• 23:09Speaker 01

  That's crazy.

• 23:10Speaker 02

  In your opinion, are sneakers dead?

• 23:12Speaker 01

  Well, you know this, because we actually had a regular business meeting the other day, and I told you that I might be entering and buying some of the top stuff, because my assumption... Because I've not really been paying attention.

• 23:21Speaker 02

  Right.

• 23:21Speaker 01

  My assumption is, well, it has to be a little softer than it was, because all these new things have entered. I don't understand how people don't get sneakers have been part of our pop culture forever. They haven't been collected forever. You know, sneakers looked more like trading cards. Trading cards really didn't get collected, collected, collected, collected as valuable until like the late 70s, by my subjective decision. People collected, some people got it, but you started seeing in the late 70s, like, shows, Beckett. Like, it started to happen, and it really popped in the mid-80s. Sneakers, you know, they were unbranded, then we had the Converse and the Chucks and like, nobody was buying Jordans on release being like, "Ooh, if Jordans ends up being really great all the time." Nobody was saving them, which is why they became valuable.

• 24:06Speaker 05

  Right.

• 24:07Speaker 01

  But now it's a forever game. It will ebb and flow, and I think it cycles. Like, I don't like to predict, but I find it unlikely that sneakers aren't red hot, more so than cards, or NFTs, or comics, or toys, in some 20-year window. I don't know if it's three years from now, I don't know if it's seven years from now, but it's too culturally important, and it's on our feet, it's more functional. Like, I don't collect sneakers like that, but I buy sneakers to wear.

• 24:37Speaker 05

  Right.

• 24:38Speaker 01

  So that's more functional than a trading card or a comic. You get the double play with sneakers. You get the collectability and you get the flex, sitting courtside, going out on a date, you know, your boys, you know how it works. Like, when I walk in the airport, I'm looking at people's feet, so if they got a proper, like, both me and some other guy was wearing the Ben and Jerry's Nike thing one day, and we just fucking, you know, dapped it up, like-

• 24:58Speaker 05

  Like a sports jersey.

• 24:58Speaker 01

  Correct. It absolutely is. So, I know that it's not the red-hot collectible right now, in youth, male culture, the way it was, 5'7", whatever the apex was. It's definitely not dead, and in fact, if you're a long-term collector, investor, flipper, like I am, you want to buy on down cycles.

• 25:17Speaker 05

  I think now is the best time.

• 25:19Speaker 01

  I mean, you literally heard it from me in real life, off the record, at our last meeting. I've never meaningfully collected sneakers. I'm like, "Oh, I should go and get three to five all-time pairs, because I'm sure this is softer right now, because of all the attention to the other asset classes."

• 25:34Speaker 05

  1,000%. People are un-

• 25:35Speaker 01

  Give me, educate me. Give me a all-time top 10 sneaker that was red, red, red hot, let's say, right before things started to move, how much it was, and how much you can get it for now. Give me one example.

• 25:46Speaker 05

  I would know right off the bat.

• 25:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 25:47Speaker 05

  I had a 1985, obviously, the year Jordans started, Jordan won, the Chicago-

• 25:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, the red and black, yep.

• 25:52Speaker 05

  Chicago Jordan won 1985.

• 25:53Speaker 01

  The one that was banned, yep.

• 25:53Speaker 05

  Yep. That's the bread.

• 25:55Speaker 01

  Okay, got it.

• 25:56Speaker 05

  So the Chicago is the white and red one-

• 25:57Speaker 01

  Got it, respect, understood. Respect, yep, yep, got it.

• 26:00Speaker 05

  The 1985 model, either the bread or the Chicago.

• 26:02Speaker 01

  The Chicago, give me the real one.

• 26:03Speaker 05

  The Chicago would go anywhere from, anywhere from 20 to 40,000, brand new, which is obviously

• 26:11Speaker 01

  Rare and all that, yeah, of course. In, in the heyday.

• 26:14Speaker 05

  And, yeah, in the heyday, in the peak of sneakers. Now, right now, you can get a pair for probably, if you can find it, 10 to 15,000.

• 26:22Speaker 01

  It's awesome, I mean, if I heard that right, somebody on earth did pay 37K for a pair, how many years ago?

• 26:28Speaker 05

  That was five years ago.

• 26:30Speaker 01

  Great.

• 26:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, not even.

• 26:31Speaker 01

  Right, and now that same pair could be had for 17?

• 26:34Speaker 05

  For example, at our last event, a pair was for sale, a brand new, in the box, 1985, for 15,000.

• 26:40Speaker 01

  Great, so to me, again, when I go and do my journey, because I haven't, and that will be tough for me, because I hate Michael Jordan, so I may not buy that. But, to me, that gets me excited, because I'm like, okay, it was, it got to 37, it's 15, that means it definitely, 37 has been established. There's gonna be inflation, I'm gonna catch it at a different time, oh, that's a $55,000 sneaker, on the next red hot cycle, inflation, time, things change. Oh, that's good ARP, that's how I think about it. Oh, I think I can make 40K in a 10-year window. The problem is, most people listening aren't playing with a big enough bank to make big investments and go to sleep. Everyone's flipping, respect, but you flip your way up to be able to go buy some things to invest in.

• 27:24Speaker 05

  Right.

• 27:24Speaker 01

  That's how I think about it.

• 27:25Speaker 02

  Speaking of kind of analytics behind all this, right, another thing when people talk about, oh, the sneakers, you know, the sneaker game is dead, this is what's happened. Do you think that StockX is responsible for the sneaker game having the hit that it did?

• 27:37Speaker 01

  Absolutely not.

• 27:38Speaker 02

  A lot of people say yes, because it made it a, um, all about the money and less about the love. What do you think about that?

• 27:43Speaker 01

  I don't believe that's the case.

• 27:44Speaker 02

  I agree, I mean, Josh has been on the pod, Josh Luber.

• 27:47Speaker 01

  It's not even about Josh or StockX, it's just about people blame things for things they've done.

• 27:53Speaker 02

  Right.

• 27:54Speaker 01

  Like, let's go back, for the love, with all due respect to the white heat moment of five or six years ago, the percentage of people that were in there for the love. is now being romanticized.

• 28:05Speaker 02

  Right.

• 28:06Speaker 01

  The reason it's changed is not StockX. It's that those same people who didn't love it went to another thing because they're just chasing the arbitrage of math, of money.

• 28:14Speaker 02

  Well, so that's actually the next question. It's like, in general, and I think this, this isn't even just for sneakers. This is for trading cards, collectibles, everything, right? Do you think that people who collect, collect for the love? Or do they just collect for the money?

• 28:26Speaker 01

  I think people that are collectors, collect for the collecting. I just think they're a small percentage in every market.

• 28:31Speaker 02

  Right. Is that wrong to collect or be a part of this just for the money, you think?

• 28:35Speaker 01

  This isn't the Soviet Union. How is there wrong?

• 28:39Speaker 02

  I don't think so either.

• 28:40Speaker 01

  Of course not, because you're, you're maturing.

• 28:43Speaker 02

  Right.

• 28:43Speaker 01

  And maybe you never did.

• 28:44Speaker 02

  No.

• 28:44Speaker 01

  I don't know. But I can tell you, like, how can I impose? This goes back to politics. Like, if you grew up in a heavily Democrat or Republican family.

• 28:55Speaker 02

  Right.

• 28:56Speaker 01

  And like, like, and your family values were built around an ideology. Who am I to tell you that you see the world wrong? Now, there's wrong and right, and I think we can all agree on some things go a little too far.

• 29:08Speaker 02

  Right.

• 29:08Speaker 01

  But like, the concept of convincing people to see the world exactly the way you see it is laughable. And so that's how I see collecting and flipping. Like, collectors that shit on people that are flipping and say they ruin it. I understand why. If you're a collector and you just want to own something. It sucks when it's red hot with flippers because now it's 40K instead of 4K. Right? But, but that's called capitalism. That's called the world.

• 29:35Speaker 02

  I agree, and I think going to your point you were saying a bit earlier.

• 29:37Speaker 01

  On the flip side, real quick, if I may. Like, flippers who like, get caught with the bag because everybody left to go flip something else. They were part of that whole ecosystem. They can't shit on the game they were exposing.

• 29:50Speaker 02

  Right.

• 29:51Speaker 01

  If you get caught with the bag, that's on you.

• 29:53Speaker 02

  I agree. And I mean, you knew that there was a risk. We talked about risk, we talked about risk earlier. And I think one thing that you were saying earlier is a lot of people who are collectors. They say, "Oh, it's so expensive now. I hate the resellers." But now that everything's lower, they, they're not buying the things that they say they want.

• 30:06Speaker 01

  Well, this shit's expensive. Like, I don't blame someone not spending $15,000 on a pair. But yeah, yes, I think about, I think the most, like, if we want to get to the punchline. Yes, I believe most people on earth are bitches.

• 30:21Speaker 01

  But that's okay, because like, you know, like, I'm surrounded by friends and family that are complainers.

• 30:27Speaker 02

  Right.

• 30:27Speaker 01

  I get it.

• 30:27Speaker 02

  People are gonna complain no matter what.

• 30:29Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 30:29Speaker 02

  Like, something I really...

• 30:30Speaker 01

  I just, I just don't think about that shit.

• 30:32Speaker 02

  Right. Joe, I want you to ask the Nike thing, because we're talking about complaining, if you go down a little bit.

• 30:38Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah.

• 30:38Speaker 01

  I like the format you guys are doing this, we're hitting a lot of stuff, this is fun.

• 30:40Speaker 02

  No, I am. And I don't mean to cut you off, I just wanna get to it.

• 30:43Speaker 01

  I like what you're doing.

• 30:44Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 30:44Speaker 01

  Notice what I just said.

• 30:45Speaker 02

  Good.

• 30:45Speaker 05

  And we mentioned, obviously, the whole Nike thing, right?

• 30:47Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 30:48Speaker 05

  And, I mean, sneakers, and so, obviously, Nike being the leader in this, in the sneaker world. I wanna ask you, obviously, Nike, you've probably seen online and throughout stocks and stuff.

• 30:58Speaker 02

  The stock price shows.

• 30:59Speaker 05

  Yeah, Nike is down, right now.

• 31:00Speaker 01

  I don't need to look at, by the way, I'm not paying attention to the conversation, I actually have no idea of the stock price. I just know because I look at people's feet.

• 31:08Speaker 02

  Right.

• 31:08Speaker 01

  I mean, fucking five years ago, every single person had a fucking Nike Panda on, like, like, I just look at people's feet.

• 31:15Speaker 02

  Right.

• 31:15Speaker 01

  Like, the dominance of Nike six years ago, and it was dominance, has now been completely decentralized. With the running shoes, with the Reebok, with New Balance, like, it's, it's just, it's incredibly obvious. But anyway.

• 31:29Speaker 02

  I'm gonna ask you about that specifically in a second, but Joe, why don't you ask your first question?

• 31:31Speaker 05

  But my question is gonna be, obviously, you just said everything about Nike. What would you do, in today's world, right now, what would you do as the CEO of Nike to bring the stock price back up?

• 31:43Speaker 01

  That's a great question.

• 31:46Speaker 01

  I think Nike got caught, in a lot of different ways. I think Nike's positioning was always two things, sports performance, and then they had culture with Air Jordans and Air Force Ones. When they had the heat of the heat with Air Force Ones and culture, they stopped supporting the retailers. They started wanting to go direct, they wanted to keep, and so they hurt a lot of relationships, right? Then they also got out innovated. Some of the running companies, Cloud, all that, like, they started making shoes that people liked better.

• 32:16Speaker 02

  Right.

• 32:16Speaker 01

  I, I think Nike needs a full reset. I'd probably do an M&A deal, if I was actually the CEO, I'd probably wanna go out and buy something. You know, to give us a jolt.

• 32:25Speaker 02

  Buy what?

• 32:27Speaker 01

  I'm so not paying attention to apparel. Um, I would go... What would I buy? I actually want to answer this. I would buy...

• 32:35Speaker 02

  If Gary Vee was the CEO of Nike...

• 32:36Speaker 01

  Panini.

• 32:38Speaker 02

  You'd buy Panini? You'd get in sports cars.

• 32:41Speaker 01

  Maybe. Well, they don't have sports cars. They don't have the licenses.

• 32:43Speaker 02

  Oh, right, anymore, right.

• 32:44Speaker 01

  Like, Panini's an interesting one because I could probably get it for a lot less than it was worth. I could get into another category. Uh, maybe Funko. I would...

• 32:53Speaker 02

  So you wouldn't buy in footwear? Like, you wouldn't buy an Oncloud? Or you wouldn't buy something like that?

• 32:56Speaker 01

  I wouldn't buy there because that's my core competency. As Nike, they have enough money allocated to R&D. I might fire my head of R&D.

• 33:05Speaker 02

  Right.

• 33:06Speaker 01

  And hire the head of R&D from Oncloud, right? But I would... Because I would have more confidence... And I don't know everything about Nike, but I would have more confidence in my ability to innovate the next sneaker than I would creating net new categories for us.

• 33:21Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 33:21Speaker 01

  I would invest... If I... Here's the problem. If I was actually the CEO of Nike, I wouldn't have enough time to do what I would want to do. Because I'd get fired first. Meaning, I would invest in blockchain.

• 33:31Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 33:31Speaker 01

  You know, I would do... I would diversify the company to win in other areas. Again, I would have confidence that we could make better sneakers. I would probably hire somebody from Chanel or like, whatever is the hottest fucking apparel business right now, the best creative director. I'd probably hire them, you know, to like, bring in that culture a little bit into our... Into our... Like, we're in such a bad place with Air Force One. You know, I think they own Converse.

• 33:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, they do.

• 33:59Speaker 01

  I would probably try to use Converse to combat Reebok and New Balance and let them play like a challenger brand mindset.

• 34:09Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 34:09Speaker 01

  So you could see kind of where I'm starting to map out my plan.

• 34:12Speaker 02

  Okay, see, okay, interesting. So you didn't even talk at all about Nike's footwear specifically. Because I think one thing I want to get your opinion on... And this is another hot topic, is Nike's brought back... Like Joey talked about the Chicago one. They did a lost and found version of that. But they brought back a lot of these, you know, really grails. So like, an undefeated Jordan 4. It was a, you know, really friends and family shoe.

• 34:31Speaker 05

  It went from being a $40,000 shoe because it was so limited when it first came out. ...years ago to now you can buy a pair on Sockec for $250.

• 34:41Speaker 02

  Because it wasn't released.

• 34:42Speaker 01

  Right, so what they did wrong there was they thought, because that's out there, let us get the short-term economics of everybody who wants to buy it, but what they killed was the secondary market, which actually is driving a lot of their primary, and so they thought short.

• 34:55Speaker 02

  I don't think Nike understands that either, that that secondary market is what drives the primary.

• 34:59Speaker 01

  Well, they could watch this clip. Like Nike, there it is, like, you know, you're like, there's... Notice how weird I went. I went to Combers to act like Challenger.

• 35:05Speaker 02

  Right.

• 35:05Speaker 01

  I believed that our R&D department definitely can compete with any other fucking company, but let's get our shit together.

• 35:11Speaker 02

  Right.

• 35:11Speaker 01

  I went to the left-field shit like another collectibles ecosystem because we have the money, because we're a big company.

• 35:17Speaker 02

  Right.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think, I think they're too narrow. They want to extract the value out of the secondary market, which actually hurt them in the long term.

• 35:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, I agree. So the punchline to that, so Nike bringing back all these crazy sneakers that were super exclusive.

• 35:30Speaker 01

  I would have never done that.

• 35:31Speaker 02

  That was the question.

• 35:32Speaker 01

  That's a really bad idea.

• 35:33Speaker 02

  I couldn't agree more.

• 35:34Speaker 01

  That's a really bad idea. Now, what they should have done was they should have bought up all the originals in the secondary, and then created ways for people to get them through supporting their short-term business.

• 35:46Speaker 02

  Whoa.

• 35:47Speaker 01

  Got it?

• 35:47Speaker 02

  That is interesting.

• 35:49Speaker 01

  Right, so what if every new Nike, so they launch a new Kevin Durant, and they tie it into legacy, and they say, in the Kevin Durant's, they come up with a new seal on boxes, so it's more like a trading card, and there's golden tickets following legal sweepstakes laws, and every one of us knew that we could get an actual $50,000 pair because we bought the KD.

• 36:10Speaker 02

  This is the Gary V effect.

• 36:11Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, this is like, you have to think in those ways.

• 36:14Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 36:14Speaker 01

  And that would only work for a little while too, but it's, it's definitely smarter than it sounds like what they did.

• 36:20Speaker 02

  I agree. People say bring it back for, you know, let people have access to it. I, I disagree.

• 36:24Speaker 01

  No, because what built Nike's great window five to seven years ago was the secondary market.

• 36:30Speaker 02

  Right, okay.

• 36:31Speaker 01

  When, when you're a company that tries to eat up all the oxygen of all the economics, they fucked, and that's, if that's what they did, which it sounds like, did they do that with a lot of things? Yes. Okay, what, let me tell you what they then did, because I don't like talking when I'm not educated. I wasn't aware, now I'm a little bit aware. What they did wrong in this five... ...your window was they destroyed two markets. They destroyed their retail market. Third-party retailers weren't getting the allocation of the hardest stuff. They were controlling it. And they killed the secondary market that was creating heat for their overall new stuff. And now they're left with neither.

• 37:01Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 37:01Speaker 01

  They have to rebuild that trust with both the retailers and with the collector community.

• 37:05Speaker 02

  Okay. We don't have a ton of time. And we love you for these long answers. I need like 15 second answers.

• 37:12Speaker 01

  I'm allowed to follow your lead. Go.

• 37:14Speaker 02

  All right. Faces of the sneaker world, you know, we had Michael Jordan obviously retired. Virgil, rest in peace. Kobe, rest in peace. You know, Kanye.

• 37:22Speaker 01

  Kanye, yep.

• 37:22Speaker 02

  You know, all these people who are faces of the sneaker world who got it to this point are no longer the face of the sneaker world. Who's the next face of the sneaker world?

• 37:29Speaker 01

  No idea.

• 37:31Speaker 02

  Does the sneaker world need a face?

• 37:32Speaker 01

  It doesn't hurt.

• 37:35Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 37:35Speaker 01

  Doesn't hurt.

• 37:36Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 37:38Speaker 02

  Could Adidas overtake Nike?

• 37:40Speaker 01

  Everybody can overtake everybody. That's the coolest part of business. You know, it depends on what timeframe and things of nature, but everyone can take over everybody.

• 37:49Speaker 02

  Okay. Is Supreme making a comeback? Could it be ever what it was?

• 37:53Speaker 01

  A hundred thousand percent. Supreme is biggest, is, represents one of the biggest theses I have. That once hot, always in play to be hot again.

• 38:03Speaker 02

  Got it. Could it be bigger than it ever was?

• 38:05Speaker 01

  Harder, harder, harder to be, like, you know how big it was. You guys probably were, yeah. Harder, but look what Crocs did. Crocs took over the world in a different way in the 90s. And had a really good run. I think it's starting to slow down a little bit, but like, three years ago?

• 38:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:20Speaker 01

  You saw that. You guys got to see that. I mean, no cool kid would wear a pair of Crocs for a decade. Right now, no cool kid really wants to wear Supreme. It'll be a way for long enough and somebody's gonna reboot it.

• 38:32Speaker 02

  Okay, my question to that is, now my follow-up to that is, Supreme, obviously, it's comeback. What's your thoughts on Chrome Hearts comeback right now?

• 38:41Speaker 01

  I'm not educated enough.

• 38:42Speaker 02

  Okay, okay.

• 38:43Speaker 01

  I just don't know. I don't like answering things. I'm not educated about Chrome Hearts enough to really know.

• 38:47Speaker 02

  Hundred percent. Okay.

• 38:49Speaker 01

  By the way, that's maybe the most important, everybody who's watching, like...

• 38:54Speaker 01

  That might have been the most important part of the whole interview. Like, I am very convicted with my takes and things of that nature, but so many people are trying to build personal brands right now and talk about shit they don't know. The "I don't..."

• 39:06Speaker 02

  100%.

• 39:06Speaker 01

  The "I don't know" is so powerful. I hope that what I just did, where everyone was like, "Whoa, Gary Vee's not on..." No, I'm not. Like, I'm just still a human.

• 39:14Speaker 02

  Right.

• 39:15Speaker 01

  I don't know everything. I know a lot, because I watch pop culture enough, but more of you should say "I don't know", or "I'm not sure", or "I'm just starting to figure out". It will really benefit you.

• 39:26Speaker 02

  Got it. Okay, a few more.

• 39:27Speaker 01

  Sorry about that.

• 39:28Speaker 02

  We saw Logan Paul's Pokemon card.

• 39:30Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 39:30Speaker 02

  Sold for over 16 million. What's the next collectible asset that could sell for that high of a figure or more?

• 39:36Speaker 01

  I'm very bullish comics. I haven't started buying, so I hate to put it out publicly, because I'd like to get some, but I think comics are sitting in a really good spot. Also, the mix of comics and cards, something I have been buying that I'm obsessed with, is vintage fictional character trading cards.

• 39:50Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 39:50Speaker 01

  1940 Superman's highest graded rookie card could get crazy. It's in the hundreds of thousands. I think it'd be 20 million. I'm very bullish on that. I think cards and comics are really sitting pretty. I do think video games, toys, music, physical collectibles, all have a shot, and I do think clothes, you know, including sneakers, all have, like, all of these things are in play. They're all in play.

• 40:14Speaker 02

  Next one. Traditional assets, like real estate and stocks, or non-traditional newer assets, like trading cards, sneakers, what are you investing your money into more today?

• 40:23Speaker 01

  Me personally?

• 40:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:24Speaker 01

  The latter.

• 40:25Speaker 02

  Okay. Do you think that new age collectibles are a better investment than real estate, stocks, and traditional investments today?

• 40:31Speaker 01

  I actually think old collectibles are a better investment than... New age collectibles are dangerous.

• 40:35Speaker 02

  Okay, so, collectibles in general, are collectibles a better investment than traditional investments, like stocks and real estate? Yes or no?

• 40:41Speaker 01

  In a macro?

• 40:42Speaker 02

  Today?

• 40:43Speaker 01

  It's even. Let me explain what I'm gonna explain. In a macro, it's even. Stocks and real estate have the equal opportunity to be remarkable as collectibles. First, the fact that collectibles is even in this conversation is bonkers to everyone. Second, it's been proven over the last five years that there's a lot of exciting things that have happened in collectibles, but don't get it twisted. Like, people have made real money in playing Miami properly. People have made real money in playing Nvidia.

• 41:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:12Speaker 01

  Like, you could have bought a fucking Michael Jordan rookie card, or a Charizard. Nvidia worked. We make the mistake of saying everything in the macro. Here's the third part. I get much more joy out of owning a collectible that goes from, I bought it for 50K and it goes to 2 million, than I do from owning 50,000 in a stock that goes to 2 million.

• 41:31Speaker 02

  It's more of a gotcha, essentially.

• 41:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just, for me personally, it's more enjoyable. It's not more of a flex for every person, but for me, it's more enjoyable, and that's why, it's, the fact that that was even a conversation-

• 41:45Speaker 02

  Is wild.

• 41:46Speaker 01

  Is wild. But you can lose a fuckload of money in all three-

• 41:49Speaker 02

  100%.

• 41:50Speaker 01

  And you can make a lot of money in all three-

• 41:51Speaker 02

  And that's why-

• 41:52Speaker 01

  And know your shit. If you really know real estate and you don't know collectibles, or if you know stocks, like, focus on what you know.

• 41:58Speaker 02

  Got it. Everyone watching out now, everyone watching right now that thinks, "Oh, you're cutting them off, we're going quick." We only have limited time.

• 42:03Speaker 01

  Yes, he's doing the right thing, and I cut off everybody when I podcast, so I'm good with this.

• 42:06Speaker 02

  Got it. Is celebrity dead when it comes to influence and collectibles?

• 42:10Speaker 01

  Uh, I don't know if it's dead, but I'm glad that it's more thoughtful.

• 42:14Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 42:14Speaker 01

  I don't think people blindly will thought, like, I even feel comfortable starting to, I stopped talking about specific things. Even the fact that I just brought up vintage fictional characters, Spider-Man, Thor. I wouldn't have done that for 3, 4 years, because I was scared that people would speculate on my words.

• 42:29Speaker 02

  Right.

• 42:30Speaker 01

  I'm starting to be a little more comfortable talking about things I believe in and like, because I know people won't blindly follow me.

• 42:36Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 42:37Speaker 01

  That's good.

• 42:37Speaker 02

  Right, right. Okay, what's the one thing that the collectible culture is missing right now?

• 43:17Speaker 01

  Time.

• 43:19Speaker 01

  It's just a matter of time.

• 43:21Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 43:21Speaker 01

  It's gonna get so much bigger.

• 43:22Speaker 02

  I agree.

• 43:23Speaker 01

  So, we're seeing that female thing, I just referenced it. Uh, we're seeing some of those $800,000 OG guys going, and girls going in for the first time. We're seeing people be smarter and not just buy something because I tweeted it, or Aoki, or Logan Paul. Like, everything's getting better.

• 43:39Speaker 02

  We're just getting started.

• 43:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just time. For it to mature and get cleaner, get rid of all the riffraff, have it more professional.

• 43:46Speaker 02

  Got it, okay.

• 43:48Speaker 01

  Keep going, keep going.

• 43:49Speaker 02

  About what, like two minutes?

• 43:49Speaker 01

  Go, go, go, go. I'm in charge always, he's just keeping me educated.

• 43:52Speaker 02

  Okay, got it. Um, we're getting pretty much...

• 43:54Speaker 01

  Go, go.

• 43:56Speaker 02

  If you were Gottsols Head Advisor, what's the one piece of advice you would give us?

• 44:00Speaker 01

  Hire faster, and fire faster, and promote fastest.

• 44:05Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 44:05Speaker 01

  You've got a lot of ambition, I know you a little bit now, I think you got it. You need more people. People is what is gonna make you more successful. You have to hire them to even know who are your boys or girls, like, right? If you don't hire someone, you don't know if they're good or not.

• 44:22Speaker 02

  Right.

• 44:23Speaker 01

  Right? You also, once you hire, you have to be able to make better decisions on if they're good or bad.

• 44:29Speaker 02

  Quickly.

• 44:30Speaker 01

  Quickly. You know, you gotta give people a chance. If you're like, "Oh, Jeremy sucks." It's not like, "Oh, Gary told me to fire..." No, no. "Hey Jeremy, I think you might suck. Let me tell you why I believe that." You're fucking, "Really? I can see what you're doing, you're really just hitting on the girls on the floor." Like, whatever it is, right? Like, you're trying to steal our clients and do your own thing, which is fine, but you can't do that on my dime. Like, you're just a pro.

• 44:50Speaker 02

  Okay, hire fast, fire faster. That's the number of pieces of advice.

• 44:53Speaker 01

  And promote fastest. If on the flip side, you hire Jeremy and he's fucking 15 hours a day when he doesn't have to. Fucking, you know?

• 45:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 45:02Speaker 01

  Like, we... Yeah, like, people make that mistake.

• 45:05Speaker 02

  They try to keep people down.

• 45:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're like, "Oh, I'll say, oh, this guy's awesome, oh, I got a whole year before I have to give him a promo or a raise." No, no. You show a fucking winner, that you see them quickly, you can change the calculus, they're there with you for four years instead of a year and a half.

• 45:19Speaker 02

  Got it.

• 45:20Speaker 01

  Right? So, they've been seen.

• 45:22Speaker 02

  Uh, boss, two things, this and that.

• 45:24Speaker 01

  And by the way, all of that comes out of just how much money you take home. Right? Like, the key is, the reason I keep telling everyone to do what I'm saying is, too many people want too much from their business early on. Both companies that I built up were massive, Wine Library and Vayner, I made literally 40, 50, 60,000 a year. Into my 30s.

• 45:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, okay, got it. Um, we want to give you your flowers. Want to say this, I mean this in the bottom of my heart, like, someone who's looked up to you for a decade, right, and I remember we drove from Babson in a snowstorm just for you to sign those sneakers. You signed like twenty pairs for us and we gave a bunch away with our nonprofit. And me and my friends got stuck in a snowstorm and missed class the next day coming to see you. And I had never been so nervous meeting anybody in my life. And why I was nervous, not because there was this person on the camera that I was gonna meet and, oh, okay, this is this big moment for the business. It's because is this guy gonna be who I expect him to be? And you've been that, we've talked off-camera multiple times, we've had meetings, all these things. You've been that times a hundred. And I just want to give you your flowers to say that,

• 46:27Speaker 02

  you know, listen, we've had the pleasure to build something that means something, to have these meetings. The vast majority aren't gonna get to that point. What you give the world with no ask, with just give, is gonna pay exponentially. You know it, because you even say, it is selfish in the long term, because it's gonna pay back to you a hundred times.

• 46:45Speaker 01

  Karma's practical.

• 46:45Speaker 02

  The value that you've given to people like ourselves, off-camera, on-camera, is paying dividends to generations that you won't even see. And I just want to give you a thank you, from myself, from Joey, from our team, from our family, the thousands of entrepreneurs who will never get to say thank you. I just want to say thank you for everything you give. And that comes to my last question. You have literally millions of fans. People do this S-tier, A-tier, and they, a lot of people now even say you're like the GOAT content entrepreneur, GOAT social entrepreneur, you name it. For all those millions of fans that are out there that love you, that have watched you for years, what's your one message for all the fans back at home? That's your camera right there. Don't even look at me, tell them. What's your one message?

• 47:25Speaker 01

  That nothing you do professionally actually matters. Which is bonkers, right? If you just listen to that setup, the, the part of that setup that meant the most to me is, People knowing I'm a nice human being and that I've helped, matters so much more to me than the zeros in my bank account. I know the cliche response, "Easy for you to say now that you have it." "I got it because that's who I was." And like the people that really have known me the whole time know. You must live your life. Like, you have to hear me on this. Notice even in this interview, I said, "If you love music more, but you make more money in cards and comics, go all in and learn music, because flipping music's gonna make you happier in your soul." What makes me happy in my soul was these flowers. There is no money I make

• 48:09Speaker 01

  that ever makes me feel better than the moment I just had. People knowing I'm a good guy, and me knowing that then it affects them, so that they'll be a good guy to the girl or guy that comes and sees them in 15 years, that I'm setting the framework, that I am literally one of the few people on the internet that's like, "No, nice guys win, nice guys win, nice guys win, be nice." Like, I know. I mean, somebody left a comment to a post I did yesterday that got like 1,000 likes on TikTok that said, "This is the king of toxic positivity." And I laughed. I laughed. That we live in a world where people really believe there's something called toxic positivity. I'm not delusional. Does anybody listen to what I say?

• 48:52Speaker 01

  Toxic positivity is slang for delusion. I'm selling you all delusion that life can be good, or that it's nice out there, or it's not as bad as you think. That is insanity to me.

• 49:05Speaker 01

  It's the truth. But you've all believed the naysayers, you've believed the cynics, the politicians, the scared parents and teachers and bosses. You're allowed, but I'm telling you right now, fuck fear. Fuck fear and go get yours. And if you actually believe you can't, because someone told you, "It's tough for your Gen Z's fucked by the boomers, and you'll never be as successful." Or, "Sneakers are dead, and you're fucked because you got a closet in a warehouse." If you believe you're dead, do you fucking understand you're dead?

• 49:39Speaker 01

  I'm not saying this is the secret. All of this is hard work. I've got two admins and a whole team behind me looking over my shoulder right now because I'm four minutes late. That's how valuable my time is. It's all fucking work. But I promise you, if you don't choose practical optimism, meaning you have to be optimistic that you can, because it's true, you can. You might have to go through therapy. You might have to cut all your fucking toxic friends out. You might have to stop popping pills and smoking weed. You might have to do a lot of shit, but you can. I know you can. I've been on the receiving end of thousands of you who weren't you, who were fucking already set up for winning, and it just had to be a little like, like, truth of love. Like, I didn't let you down and you kept listening. I've met thousands of not you. Fucking real drug use, abusing their girl,

• 50:24Speaker 01

  really fucked up, hating the world, only like, trying to build out of fear and hate, not out of love and optimism. And I've watched my content and my interactions, and many others that do what I do convert these people to straight gangsters. And that's what I want for you. I don't want you to have a shit fucking life. That's my rant. I do not want you to have a shit fucking life. And I promise you it's this. And that's that.

• 50:49Speaker 02

  Gary, we love you. We are so excited to do more with you.

• 50:51Speaker 01

  Can't wait. Thank you, thanks everyone. Everybody, if you enjoyed this podcast, please go back and look at the prior episodes. They're loaded. I appreciate your attention, and uh, thanks for being part of this journey. See you later.