Who Framed Woman-Ochre? w/ Sabrina Wu

Laci welcomes writer, comedian, and actor Sabrina Wu (Murderbot, Joy Ride) to grab their monocle and magnifying glass and dive into the strange story of Jerry and Rita Alter, a sweet couple from New Mexico who passed away, and may have stolen a $160 million Willem de Kooning painting just to hang it behind their bedroom door. Plus, in Scammer of the Week: a homeowners’ association goes full villain after Irena Green’s lawn turned a little less green and somehow, it ends with her getting arrested. Stay schemin’! CON-gregation, catch Laci's TV Show Scam Goddess, now on Freeform and Hulu! Did you miss out on a custom-signed Scam Goddess book? Look no more, nab your copy on PODSWAG Follow on Instagram: Scam Goddess Pod: @scamgoddesspod Laci Mosley: @divalaci Sabrina Wu: @asabrinawu Research by Kathryn Doyle SOURCES https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/09/nyregion/a-de-kooning-a-theft-and-an-enduring-mystery.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/18/arts/de-kooning-higgins-sharp-harwood-fbi.html?unlocked_article_code=1. YE8. GU2s.vAP6jr-Zr2bc&smid=url-share The Thief Collector documentary https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/may/04/fbi-new-mexico-teachers-alleged-art-thieves https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/local-news/i-team-investigates/hoa-violations-involving-womans-brown-grass-led-to-her-being-arrested-and-jailed-for-seven-days https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona/2022/09/15/long-lost-willem-de-kooning-painting-makes-its-way-back-arizona/8058998001/ https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/arts-letters/articles/de-kooning-art-theft https://www.scdailypress.com/2024/03/15/california-writer-finds-two-stolen-works-estate-now-famous-cliff-couple/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:31Speaker 01

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• 2:20Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess, back with another installment of the comedy podcast all about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it. Sometimes we love them, sometimes we hate them. We will see all along the way. And congregation OG members, go ahead and stand up. Yes, you know, it's time for us to get very what? Yes, excited, thrilled, elated. Get up out of your seats, stand up in your car, okay? While it's moving, you can do it. You can do it, okay? My guest today is a multifaceted talent on the show, okay? And they're absolutely killing it in the game as a writer, comedian, and actor. They can be seen on Abbott Elementary, Joyride, and can be seen alongside Alexander Skarsgård on Apple TV's Murder Bot.

• 3:04Laci Mosley?

  And that show is poppin' right now. And hot, hot, hot, they are writer for FX's breakout series, Dying for Sex. This person is very busy, y'all. Congregation, please welcome Sabrina Wu. Hi, Sabrina.

• 3:18Speaker 03

  Hi, Lacey. Hi, everybody.

• 3:21Laci Mosley?

  Thank you for taking the time out of your multiple, multiple jobs to do the podcast.

• 3:27Speaker 03

  Oh, my God, no problem. You guys are so lucky to have me, but...

• 3:30Laci Mosley?

  Yes, and we feel that way. We feel that way. I have to ask you, though, Sabrina, what is your relationship with scams? Do you love them? Do you hate them? Have you ever been scammed? Have you run any scams that are past the statute of limitations? It could be anything.

• 3:43Speaker 03

  Oh, I'm so glad I'm on this podcast. While we were filming Murder Bot, I almost fell victim to a pig butchering scam.

• 3:49Laci Mosley?

  Okay, wow, this is specific. A pig butchering scam.

• 3:52Speaker 03

  Do you know what I'm talking about?

• 3:54Laci Mosley?

  No, do you be cutting up pigs a lot?

• 3:55Speaker 03

  Oh, my God, yeah.

• 3:59Laci Mosley?

  You making your bacon fresh?

• 4:00Speaker 03

  Yummy, yes, that's right. It's like, okay, I only Googled it because I almost fell victim to it. But the idea is that they like, is like the scammer will sort of... Kind of like keep you like either on a phone call or for them it was like they want to be on a Zoom call with them for a week straight.

• 4:19Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 4:20Speaker 03

  I know. Um, and the idea is that they just slowly, it's called pig butchering because they like kind of make small cuts at you until eventually they like take everything that you're worth.

• 4:30Laci Mosley?

  So they're just asking for little bits of money?

• 4:33Speaker 03

  Not even. It's like little, okay, should I just tell you the story?

• 4:37Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 4:37Speaker 03

  It's not gonna reflect well on me at all. And in fact, it'll make you feel like, wow, I guess any idiot can have cool jobs.

• 4:44Laci Mosley?

  No, no, no, no, no. We never shame here, ever.

• 4:46Speaker 03

  I'm just surprised that since you're scam goddess that you, you, I thought like the minute I said pig butchering, you would have been like, oh, yeah.

• 4:52Laci Mosley?

  I may not know the phrase, but I probably know the style.

• 4:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, it's like, it's, it's, it's, it's scam going Asian mode for sure. It's like, basically, while I was in Toronto filming, um, Murderbot, okay, and I also just gotta add, wait, am I annoying you in any way?

• 5:09Laci Mosley?

  No, no, no, you're chewing gum though. My fans are gonna kill me. I'm sorry. I was just looking at them to see if they could pick it up.

• 5:15Speaker 03

  No, it's fine. I got rid of it. Hey, sorry to the listeners and to anyone who loves mukbangs and ASMR, you're welcome.

• 5:21Laci Mosley?

  Right. The Miss Alphonia girlies will be like, what's going on?

• 5:25Speaker 03

  Damn.

• 5:26Laci Mosley?

  I know. They're strict. They're strict.

• 5:30Laci Mosley?

  Okay, see, that's, I like that. It doesn't, oh, you can be box?

• 5:35Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 5:35Laci Mosley?

  Oh shit.

• 5:36Speaker 03

  Is the mic picking up?

• 5:37Laci Mosley?

  That was like a casual like flex.

• 5:39Speaker 03

  Well, I was like, if the mic can pick up so much, I might as well.

• 5:44Laci Mosley?

  I love it. Wait, I'm over here bobbing my head. I'm like, okay, yeah, this is a different shout out. Oh, oh, robbery, eh, eh, and fraud, eh, pig butchering, eh, slippery, no, I'm ones and twos. All right.

• 5:56Speaker 03

  All right, yeah, you should make that your intro or something. Okay.

• 5:59Laci Mosley?

  Okay, so.

• 6:00Speaker 03

  I'm derailing. I didn't take Adderall this morning.

• 6:02Laci Mosley?

  Love it. So what, what happened? Like, how did this person encounter you? Did they send you like a text message? Did they get you on like Instagram? Like, how did you meet?

• 6:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, I got several FaceTime audios from what I thought was the US government, but, um, which, yeah, could have been a red flag.

• 6:18Laci Mosley?

  Uncle Sam definitely wants to see our face.

• 6:20Speaker 03

  It was like, I know. FaceTime audio, FaceTime audio.

• 6:24Laci Mosley?

  Okay, so yeah, so they're just calling on wifi.

• 6:26Speaker 03

  Digital, yeah, that's exactly right.

• 6:28Laci Mosley?

  And with all the budget cuts, honestly, like, the government could be calling us from like, you know, a flip phone.

• 6:32Speaker 03

  In Trump's America, anything's possible.

• 6:34Laci Mosley?

  Anything's possible.

• 6:34Speaker 03

  Although I do think it was Biden's America.

• 6:36Laci Mosley?

  Well, you know.

• 6:37Speaker 03

  And what do I have to say about that? Not much.

• 6:39Laci Mosley?

  It's not like it was much better. I mean, it was much better, but not that much.

• 6:44Speaker 03

  Let's cut it, let's cut it.

• 6:45Laci Mosley?

  Oh, God.

• 6:45Speaker 03

  No. I got this like FaceTime audio and the name that popped up was very, it was like, it seemed like the initials of someone I knew who was going through a breakup. So I thought maybe this person was like desperately trying to reach me while I was in Canada. So I picked up and then as soon as I picked up,

• 7:03Speaker 03

  the person on the line was speaking in Chinese and knew my last name and was just like.

• 7:07Laci Mosley?

  And you speak?

• 7:08Speaker 03

  I speak Mandarin, but not that well. And that is my excuse for how I felt so badly for this scam was that half my brain was just like dedicated to translating what was being said to me, you know, like, I was like, actually, like, I literally said to the scammer, I'm like, so, I was like, thank you so much for your patience. Like, my Chinese is so bad and like, you're so great. And they're like, of course, of course, but.

• 7:31Laci Mosley?

  This is kind of the perfect setup. You're out of the country.

• 7:34Speaker 03

  I'm out, no, yes.

• 7:35Laci Mosley?

  The FaceTime looks like someone you might know.

• 7:37Speaker 03

  So I pick up.

• 7:38Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and they also know your last name and know you speak Mandarin. So they did a little research on you.

• 7:44Speaker 03

  And here's, sorry, I'm like, it's such a long epic, but, um.

• 7:48Laci Mosley?

  No, I love it. Continue.

• 7:49Speaker 03

  I think basically, do you know this like app called We? It's like W E E E. It like delivers like Asian food and groceries. And I used it one time and I think there was a huge data leak. And so then this come, I think what whoever was scamming me targets, what they are hoping for is like Chinese nationals in America. And I think the big scam is to, um, like, just like extort you for a ton of money and make you think if you don't give it, they're gonna deport you. The government's gonna deport you. So that's the main scam.

• 8:20Laci Mosley?

  And that would be popping right now because the government is just like out on the streets deporting anybody like without a trial, without any due process.

• 8:27Speaker 03

  You know, this was happening during Biden's America right now. This, this scam.

• 8:30Laci Mosley?

  I mean, ICE was still around then.

• 8:31Speaker 03

  No, of course, but just imagine how good this scam is going.

• 8:34Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah.

• 8:35Speaker 03

  Investors need to get in on this. This is a very, this is a lucrative business. I mean, yeah, this scam must be popping off. Um, no, it's so scary. But what they told me was that they were just like, hey, is this Sabrina in China? Like Sabrina, Miss, like Miss Wu? And I was like, sure, sure, yes. Like, what's going on? They were like, is this your phone number? They were like telling me all these things about me. And, and they were just like, hey, like, we just want to flag that like, there is a credit card registered under your name that has been like attributed to like a lot of scams. And that, and they were scaring me by being like, and as a result, like, well, they were like, do you know about this? And I was like, no, no, no. And they're like, really? And I was like, yeah, no, I, I definitely like don't have a credit card.

• 9:18Laci Mosley?

  Like, really? Yeah, cuz y'all made it up.

• 9:20Speaker 03

  They made it up.

• 9:21Laci Mosley?

  Really, you don't know?

• 9:22Speaker 03

  They got my ass. I've never felt stupider in my life.

• 9:25Laci Mosley?

  No, this actually sounds like a pretty complicated situation.

• 9:28Speaker 03

  It's gonna get insane. Sorry, there are costumes and a, like, I get sucked in to like, well, and cuz again, I'm in a different country, I'm alone, and they're like, okay, this is really good that we reached you because like, um, if, like, because actually we're gonna shut, we were gonna shut down your phone number like in the next few hours.

• 9:47Laci Mosley?

  Okay, wait, wait a minute, wait, wait, wait, wait. We went from, I, I got a fraudulent credit card in my name to now you're gonna shut down my phone number? Y'all calling AT&T?

• 9:54Speaker 03

  I know, but when, but when a sweet man speaks to me, Amanda, and I assume he's like my father who's just looking out for me, like, Le Jiao was just like, oh my God, like, 谢谢叔叔, like, thank you so much for letting me know. And he was like, no problem, like, we'll try to, and then he was like, we can extend like the amount of time your phone works, but just like you need to contact essentially like somebody in this region in China. They were basically saying like whoever was scamming all these people, like, um, they've like, is in China and in this specific province that my family is from. So it was like another coincidence where I was like, could someone have like?

• 10:29Laci Mosley?

  Now, Sabrina, you do remember that you're a public figure, right?

• 10:32Speaker 03

  Well, it does come up.

• 10:33Laci Mosley?

  I was about to say.

• 10:34Speaker 03

  They don't know that.

• 10:35Laci Mosley?

  Okay, okay, they might know something. I feel like they had to have Googled you.

• 10:39Speaker 03

  No, they didn't. And actually what happened was, okay, eventually. Oh my god, so eventually like, basically like, I get connected to like, a phone line that like, registers as like, that regi- like, the Fujian like, provinces like, local Chinese department like-

• 10:55Laci Mosley?

  And why did they say that you needed to get connected to this phone line?

• 10:58Speaker 03

  Cause they were like, well, they were just like, you need to like, go talk to the police to catch this guy because he is like, doing like, illegal things under, using your identity.

• 11:06Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 11:07Speaker 03

  I know. I was a fool, but I also was, again, trying, just mostly spending my energy trying to speak in Mandarin fluently. And then, like, I was like, well, here this person is calling me with this like, name, and then I get on that call, and again, everyone is so nice to me, and might I add, I even said, hey, are you guys scamming me right now? And the guy scamming me guffawed. He went,

• 11:30Speaker 03

  he was like, alright, and then he was like, let's play it back. Have I asked you for any personal information? I said, I guess not, like, and he was like, right.

• 11:39Laci Mosley?

  Okay, well, why did you get so defensive?

• 11:42Speaker 03

  I don't know, but man, did I feel fucking stupid. I was like, damn, this guy, like, I was like, god, I'm such a paranoid Gen Z idiot, like, cause he was like, hey, if I was trying to steal money from you, I'd probably ask you for information, right? And I was like, right, you're so right, and I was so stupid.

• 11:59Laci Mosley?

  Damn, he really got you with that one. That's like, if you have a partner who's cheating and you start to suspect, and then they're like, oh, why would you even thi- like, flipping on you, like, why would you even say that? Why, you know I would never do that to you. I would never scam you. I had done nothing but give you information, boogie.

• 12:12Speaker 03

  They would. Yeah, yes, yes, they would. They, sir, sir, if you could, prince, thank you.

• 12:19Laci Mosley?

  Love it.

• 12:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm with who I believe is the local Chinese police department, where this like, man who has stolen my identity is like, committing fraud and like, stealing money from the elderly, and obviously I'm worried about the elderly, and then, basically, this cop is like- Gets me on a Zoom with him. He's like, wait, let's link up. Cause like, I think it was like hard for me to communicate over the phone. So I wasn't fluent. So then we get on a Zoom and I'm on a Zoom call with like two Chinese men dressed in like cop costumes.

• 12:49Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 12:49Speaker 03

  I'm not even kidding. And there was like, there was like even a big like, uh, like, what? Like an insignia on the back of like the police department. And anyways, like what happened was like, they then told me like, I was a part of a larger scam. Where like this one evil like mob boss had stolen my identity. Like, like.

• 13:11Laci Mosley?

  Hmm. And they're the police, but they need you to solve the crime. It seems like they know a lot about the crime, but then they're getting you involved.

• 13:19Speaker 03

  You're making me feel dumb. Can I just say that? You're making, you're shaming me.

• 13:22Laci Mosley?

  I'm not shaming you.

• 13:23Speaker 03

  And that's okay. The goddess has spoken.

• 13:25Laci Mosley?

  I'm not shaming you at all.

• 13:26Speaker 03

  No, I'm just kidding. I feel shame and I'm projecting.

• 13:28Laci Mosley?

  I don't want you to feel it.

• 13:29Speaker 03

  No, they know a lot about the crime. No, it's so intricate. There's so many layers and they just kept getting me like deeper and deeper. But the thing was they were just like, this person is very dangerous. And like, they were basically trying to convince me for my safety, we should like keep checking in with each other.

• 13:42Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 13:43Speaker 03

  And they were also like making me sign these documents.

• 13:46Laci Mosley?

  Oh, shit.

• 13:46Speaker 03

  They're like, can you sign these documents? And they were basically me trying to like, it was almost.

• 13:49Laci Mosley?

  Were the documents in Mandarin?

• 13:51Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 13:51Laci Mosley?

  Oh shit.

• 13:52Speaker 03

  And not only that, this, again, this skimmer was so patient. He like translated every sentence for me to make sure I understood all the words in these fake legal documents.

• 14:00Laci Mosley?

  Wow.

• 14:01Speaker 03

  And the understanding was that I too was under investigation. Cause they were like, they were like, we think that you are a innocent party being wrapped up in a scam, but we don't know. And we also need your cooperation to like not speak out about it. So that we don't like interfere with this international or like this international crime.

• 14:17Laci Mosley?

  So now that's why you don't have to say nothing to nobody.

• 14:19Speaker 03

  Exactly. And then they were like, hey, like you, you need to be on this Zoom with us. And that's what made, that's, that's when the acting thing came up. Cause I was like, ooh, I don't know if I can be on a Zoom with you because I actually have to be on set. And I'm really scared of pissing off my bosses. And they're like, wait, you're an actor?

• 14:39Laci Mosley?

  Oh no, then they're probably like ding ding ding ding.

• 14:40Speaker 03

  Well, there were a lot of things that bummed them out. And I had a theory, basically when I got on the Zoom, because you know, I have like short, I had a buzz cut then. And they thought, you know, I'm Miss Wu, like in their mind. And I have this sexy girl voice. And I logged onto the Zoom and the two men were like, wait, is that you with the short hair?

• 14:57Laci Mosley?

  Okay, so they must have not Googled then.

• 14:59Speaker 03

  They did not Google and they were shocked I was gay. They were like, they were, they were like, they literally like, your hair is very short. I was like, yes. And they're like, why?

• 15:07Laci Mosley?

  Why are you gay?

• 15:08Speaker 03

  I was like, no.

• 15:09Laci Mosley?

  Oh no.

• 15:10Speaker 03

  I was like, no, no, uh, sure.

• 15:11Laci Mosley?

  No, but you are gay, yes? Why are you gay? Not they go, how you go gay? How they go try to be homophobic while they're trying to scam you? Like, I gotta pick something.

• 15:20Speaker 03

  They weren't homophobic, they were just kind of like thrown off because I think part of it was that they were recording me on Zoom. So I'm sure they were also gonna use their plan. I think it's like a really complicated scam. Sorry, I've done so much thought into it, but like.

• 15:33Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I know, I love it.

• 15:33Speaker 03

  I think they were gonna like use my likeness to then scam like adult men. You know what I mean? Like, like I said, they're like, because I think that's part, that's why it's like a pig butchering scam. They're like taking my signature from the legal documents. They're taking my likeness from the Zoom recording and then they.

• 15:49Laci Mosley?

  So they're slowly stealing your identity.

• 15:51Speaker 03

  And they basically like keep you hostage, like being like, don't tell anyone. You're under a lot of dan, you're in a lot of danger, like.

• 15:58Laci Mosley?

  We also think you might be the criminal.

• 16:00Speaker 03

  Exactly. And you're just like, and you're kind of like trying to like be in their good graces and um. Yeah, I mean, there was a lot of time spent being like, and but when they found out I was an actor, I think it sort of stressed them out because I was a public figure. Yeah, they were like, wait, you're an actor? Like, and they literally were like, are you famous? And then I was like, uh, I'm like, it's like in Chinese being like, like trying to figure out, I say like, trying to figure out, Google translating, how do I say number four on the call sheet?

• 16:33Speaker 03

  I'm like, oh yeah, I'm like, I'm like a D-list, E-list celebrity.

• 16:38Laci Mosley?

  If you Google me, things come up.

• 16:40Speaker 03

  That's exactly right. And they're like, uh, oh, uh, okay, that they were very like, uh, we think that's fine.

• 16:47Laci Mosley?

  This really threw a wrench in it for them.

• 16:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 16:49Laci Mosley?

  It's like, wait a minute, famous?

• 16:50Speaker 03

  I know. And more, I'm like, what, what, what, like, and they were just like, you gotta be on this Zoom, like, your life is in danger. And like, little did they know, I value my career a little bit more than my own life. I was like, I'm so sorry. I'm too scared to ask my producers to like, let me step out to go on a weird Zoom, even with the international police. Um, yes. And basically, the only way I figured out it was a scam was like, after I was like, hey, I can't do a 24/7 Zoom call, but why don't, why don't we do like, regular check-ins?

• 17:18Laci Mosley?

  Also, what are you gonna do if I'm on the 24/7 Zoom call and then the scammer man bust through the door? And he's like, I got your bitch. And then, you know, like, y'all gonna just watch the Zoom? Like, what do we, you're gonna be on a Zoom? Like, stop that, stop that.

• 17:29Speaker 03

  He asked me to screen record. So basically, I think the idea was that he's gonna be on a, like, a 24/7 Zoom, screen recording me. And it's like, if I ever use my, if I ever open up my banking account, if I ever log into something, they get access to basically every single thing. They had me share screen. Sorry.

• 17:47Laci Mosley?

  Oh, okay. Yeah, share screen.

• 17:49Speaker 03

  They had me share screen for whatever reason.

• 17:51Laci Mosley?

  So they're trying to clone your computer, like, in front of your face?

• 17:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, and I fully just believed it. I was like, damn, I gotta write a script about this. I'm a part of some international, like, like, there were so many layers to it that I couldn't believe, like, I mean, again, like, set design, costumes, like, multiple actors. Um, and also, can I just say, I'm like, really good at the gay mafia? I think I came in with a confidence that like, I would, I would know if like, someone was scamming me, but I was like, so duped. And the only reason I, it started to piece together, I might have been scammed, was like, okay, you know what? I'm gonna talk to the one producer that I really trust on Murderbot. And I'll text her being like, can we talk in person? And she thought I was coming in to talk to her about like, an HR thing, like, someone said a slur to me.

• 18:35Speaker 03

  But then she came over, and as she was driving over, I like, Googled a little bit of the scam, and it immediately came up, like a Reddit thread that's like, Don't trust like when the Chinese government pretends to FaceTime audio. And also something about seeing what had happened to me.

• 18:49Laci Mosley?

  Written down.

• 18:49Speaker 03

  Written down in English. Once I had to say everything back to another white, like to a white woman in English. I was like, oh my God, I'm an idiot. Like, cause I had to say like, listen, so I was FaceTime audiod by the US government. And then she burst out laughing and was like, this is a scam. But it took me like two hours to like deprogram and be like, cause I also called my partner on Signal. I was like, bitch, get on Signal. Like something crazy is happening to me. And I was like, like, there is an international crime boss who stole my identity through the Chinese food grocery delivery app. And now he's scamming millions like out of like elderly, like out of millions of dollars. And he's a dangerous, like, like he's a part of like the black market and like I had to be really careful and we can't tell anyone.

• 19:32Speaker 03

  So that's why I'm calling you on Signal. And then my, like, my partner at the time was just like, damn, that's crazy. Like, and so like, I was just like, right? And so like, yeah, I just fully was bought and it took me like hours after talking to this white woman, my white woman boss to be like, hey, you fell for something really stupid.

• 19:48Laci Mosley?

  Okay, but you did it all the way fall for it.

• 19:50Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 19:51Laci Mosley?

  And you did the smart thing that we always say on this podcast, which is if something feels weird or sounds weird, say it to somebody else. Or like write it down. Like, like you were saying, like, there's such a language barrier there. And when I speak Spanish, like I do have to translate in my head sometimes because it's not my first language. So like, yeah, like I could see how like through time and through them doing these slow steps. It started with FaceTime audio, then it became Zoom, then it was like all, you know, all the Mandarin in between. Like this is what they do to try to confuse you so they can get you to the point where it seems rational and normal to give up your money. But you didn't give up your money. Like you keep being like, you're ashamed. You have nothing to be ashamed about.

• 20:24Speaker 03

  I did send them my passport and I did send them my signature. Yeah, that's right. Okay.

• 20:29Laci Mosley?

  Hey, but so far. But you know what? You can't do anything without a combination. You need the ID and you need the social security number and your social isn't on your passport.

• 20:37Speaker 03

  No.

• 20:37Laci Mosley?

  So for that reason, so you have to have a certain combo to actually do fraud with this. So tons of people see your passport and you know, the airport takes pictures of it all the time. And who knows if TSA ever wanted to be like, like it's something people see. It's not that bad.

• 20:50Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 20:51Laci Mosley?

  Your dad has your passport. Yeah, but they don't have, as long as they don't have your social.

• 20:54Speaker 03

  No, they don't have my social and I froze all my like credit. Like, so.

• 20:58Laci Mosley?

  You're good.

• 20:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:59Laci Mosley?

  They're gonna move on.

• 21:01Speaker 03

  I, I think so. What are they gonna do with my gay ass? Like?

• 21:04Laci Mosley?

  The one time being gay saved someone.

• 21:06Speaker 03

  Yeah, I know. Actually, we need to see more lesbians in scams, so I'm helping in that way.

• 21:13Laci Mosley?

  Yes, you know what? Representation matters, so we're getting involved.

• 21:16Speaker 03

  That's what they meant by that, that's right.

• 21:17Laci Mosley?

  That's what they meant. It's like, we need more of it in crime, we need more of it in tech.

• 21:22Speaker 03

  I just remembered another part of the story, can I tell you? Which is like, the other reason I fell for it was that like, my grandma was about to fly back to that part of the coun- like, that part of China. And she kept saying, we were texting me like, I have business to deal with. So that I was like, when I realized it was a scam, I was like, oh my god, I think my grandma's falling for the same one. And I called her being like, hey, like, there's not like some person pretending to be a mob boss and asking you for like, like, because it's a scam. And she was like, what? No, you fell for that? You're in-

• 21:51Speaker 03

  And I was like, I just, yeah. I think it's like, all the Chinese people in my life are like, my family and people I care about. And it like, never occurred to me, I think, on a deep, like, visceral level. Like, I just didn't, it never occurred to me, like, Chinese people could be evil. And my grandma was like, of course they can be evil. We're fucking, we're fucking evil.

• 22:08Laci Mosley?

  Scams!

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• 25:07Laci Mosley?

  For alarm license information.

• 25:13Laci Mosley?

  So now we're gonna get into my favorite segment of the show, which is historic hoodwink. This is where Gail Sabrina with the famous con caper group of criminals will get their opinions all throughout. Maybe they love it, maybe they hate it, maybe I love it, maybe I hate it. I don't know. I never endorse until we get through it.

• 25:29Speaker 03

  But eventually you will endorse or condemn.

• 25:32Laci Mosley?

  I think endorse is too strong of a word. Legally, y'all, again, the abocado fund is getting a little low. We gotta keep it up there, okay? Otherwise, I'm gonna have a bus bench attorney, which, you know what? I'd take. I'd take. If you got enough money for ads for the bus bench, you know, you must be winning some cases. But yeah, I don't endorse any scams. Scams are bad. Don't break the law. Laws are good. Love laws over here. That was convincing, right?

• 25:58Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, I got scared.

• 26:01Laci Mosley?

  I think about laws every day and how much I love them and following them.

• 26:05Speaker 03

  Damn, Lacey's such a cop. Oh, my God.

• 26:10Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, we got a Zoom call after this, Sabrina. I need you to hop on.

• 26:13Speaker 03

  I'm a victim. I'm a victim.

• 26:17Laci Mosley?

  Don't worry, it's just for one week.

• 26:20Laci Mosley?

  So today, we're talking about a small-town husband and wife who are schoolteachers, Jerry and Rita. This is them.

• 26:29Speaker 03

  Oh, wow. They, I can't tell if they're just like super white or from the past.

• 26:33Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Is this the from the past? Is this 70s? No, it looks like we're gonna be in the 2000s. Oh, okay, so they've gotten older. So, okay, so you were showing us a photo, Jess was showing us a photo first of like, like what they probably show their grandkids. Like, okay, they look like they were baddies back in their 60s. Yes. And so this, and so we have a photo of what they look like now. Okay, scammer really aged them.

• 26:57Speaker 03

  That is great. And this, and the wife in this situation is wearing sunglasses that I can't tell like if she's wearing to be a baller or if she's gotten her eyes surgically removed.

• 27:06Laci Mosley?

  Oh, my gosh, I was just about to say, I can't tell if you just left from like a cataract surgery.

• 27:09Speaker 03

  That's right, like her eyes are dilated or something.

• 27:11Laci Mosley?

  Or you stop by a gas station and you pick those up. I can't tell.

• 27:14Speaker 03

  It's hard to tell.

• 27:15Laci Mosley?

  Are your pupils dilated?

• 27:16Speaker 03

  I can't tell if she's wearing pearls or a chain, can you?

• 27:18Laci Mosley?

  I can't either. A chain and a turtleneck is diabolical. It's very The Rock.

• 27:23Speaker 03

  Yes, she's looking like The Rock.

• 27:25Laci Mosley?

  Like, I accidentally did that once and a comedian was like, oh, you look like The Rock. And I was, I was like, my face just dropped. And she was like, oh, my bad. And I was like, that was insulting.

• 27:33Speaker 03

  No, it's so embarrassing when people say that to you. Because I all, I used to dress like The Rock all the time.

• 27:41Laci Mosley?

  Sometimes you gotta smell what The Rock is cooking, okay? It's not fashion, but we still love him.

• 27:45Speaker 03

  She is wearing a heavy chain. We got the zoom in and...

• 27:49Laci Mosley?

  Okay, that's kind of like thuggish to me, though. Like, she did, yeah, those croupin', croupin' on croupin's?

• 27:54Speaker 03

  No, I'm glad you threw in the word thuggish. I was like, damn, there is something about even just the way she's smiling. Like, it's very, um...

• 28:01Laci Mosley?

  It's very, yeah, glow. Like, they, they look like they were doing a crime. Like, I kind of love this for them.

• 28:05Speaker 03

  She looks gay to me, the way she's smiling.

• 28:07Laci Mosley?

  Listen, sometimes you gotta be in a lavender relationship, and where you're lavender.

• 28:12Speaker 03

  She's in a lavender relationship, and she's literally a hey mama lesbian.

• 28:15Laci Mosley?

  And we love it. We love it. So, they turned out to be high-profile art thieves, hiding in plain sight. And they weren't found out until they died at the ripe old age of 81. I need a sound here, Brendan. I need a, just, I need a Jamaican air horn because I love finding out about a scam after they die. To see if they got away with it. They kept quiet. They kept it cute. Look, they dress loud, but they keep it quiet, okay? I'm into it.

• 28:43Speaker 03

  I can't believe they didn't catch this white lady. I mean, she really...

• 28:46Laci Mosley?

  She looks like every white woman I've ever seen. Like, Carol. Like, she's, her face says Carol.

• 28:52Speaker 03

  No, no, her face does, but the way she dresses, I mean, it's loud.

• 28:56Laci Mosley?

  It is loud, and that chain is screaming at me.

• 28:58Speaker 03

  In the Instagram reel, you must simply show the listeners, like, this woman's, like, fit.

• 29:03Laci Mosley?

  We will. I mean, um, they both dress real loud for, to be criminals. But we don't know where they live yet, so maybe they live in a place like Miami where this would be quiet.

• 29:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, rocking a turtleneck in Miami, totally normal.

• 29:20Laci Mosley?

  Okay, but the colors. I lived in Miami for a year, and I came back and my whole wardrobe looked like a highlighter. Like, that was just normal, okay? Lifesavers, they have shit on me. I was in everything, every color, every day.

• 29:31Speaker 03

  No, that's right, that's right.

• 29:32Laci Mosley?

  So, rest in peace, Jerry and Rita Alter. I hope y'all really are resting in peace. When Jerry, a retired music teacher, and Rita, a retired speech pathologist, okay, SLP, died in 2012 and 2017, respectively, they left behind a unique collection of weird stuff they had piled up in their pink stucco ranch house in New Mexico. Okay, y'all are allowed for New Mexico. And this pink stucco ranch house is... Yeah, this is a loud home. I like it, though. I feel like they should have been living in Miami because everything about them right now is giving Miami, but they were like, no, we'll do it in New Mexico. This makes sense.

• 30:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 30:09Laci Mosley?

  So the yard was full of obelisks. Am I saying that right? Yeah. Obelisks and busts of Shakespeare, French playwright Moliere and Beethoven, the composer. What's an obelisk?

• 30:22Speaker 03

  I know, I keep thinking of, I'm like, yum, sounds delicious and from the sea.

• 30:26Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 30:26Speaker 03

  Obelisk.

• 30:27Laci Mosley?

  Obelisk is a, is it, would you count the thing on, apicus?

• 30:30Speaker 03

  Oh, yes, that's right.

• 30:33Laci Mosley?

  These are like four-sided, like monuments, basically. So they had all of these obelisks and they had busts of Shakespeare. What the fuck is a bust of Shakespeare? They stealing stuff I don't even know about.

• 30:45Speaker 03

  Oh, my god.

• 30:47Laci Mosley?

  Oh, okay, so they had, uh, they had a Moliere statue. These are statues. They had statues, y'all. Um, so they had Beethoven, all these statues, right? And they look like bronzed and they're sitting on these, like these pedestals that are made out of rocks and shit. And remember, this is New Mexico, so they don't really be having no, like, grass in the yard. So I guess they gotta just stick these weird-ass statues in the yard for some accoutrement.

• 31:17Laci Mosley?

  The house contained lots of pictures of Jerry and Rita, plus a room full of African memorabilia, including tribal spheres, 75 hideous paintings that Jared made himself. Jerry made himself. Now, why you gotta call them hidey, okay. Okay, the color scheme is kinda, I don't know. This feels like when they zoom in on like a bacteria. You know what I mean?

• 31:39Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 31:39Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 31:40Speaker 03

  That's somebody's DNA, somebody with, somebody with a disorder.

• 31:43Laci Mosley?

  No, yes, that's what it's giving.

• 31:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:45Laci Mosley?

  So he had these, Jerry made 75 hideous paintings. Plus, they had many eclectic pieces of art, including one abstract nude. Oh, an abstract nude, is that where the titties is like?

• 31:56Speaker 03

  Triangles?

• 31:58Laci Mosley?

  What makes this nude abstract? I want to know. We may not have it. But I want to say, like, the African memorabilia, you kinda, I'm clocking it there a little bit because why, why are you stealing, like, African people's stuff?

• 32:14Laci Mosley?

  So Dave Van

• 32:15Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 32:16Laci Mosley?

  Right. Dave Van Acker, co-owner of the Manzita Ridge Furniture and Antique Store in Silver Lake, New Mexico, walked through the house and found the nude painting interesting, even though it was in a horrible Walmart frame. Y'all were really shading Jerry and Rita's art skills. Like, a horrible Walmart frame? Damn. Like, a snob did this research?

• 32:44Laci Mosley?

  So he bought the whole estate from Rita's nephew Ron for $2,000 and carted everything back to his antique store. About 10 minutes after he put it on display at his store, a local artist who lived in a van identified the Why do we gotta know they lived in a van? They could just be a local artist. They're like, "A local artist who lived in a van." Okay, listen, van life is a thing. It's just a bunch of nepo babies who make living in your car look fabulous. Have you seen these?

• 33:14Speaker 03

  No, I know you

• 33:14Laci Mosley?

  These people are always independently wealthy. And they're like, "I gave up my home to live on the road, van life." They'll be living in Sprinter vans, which are super expensive. But they're like, "No, we're nomads." It's like, where did you get this nomad coin?

• 33:28Speaker 03

  I fully agree. I know those TikToks.

• 33:30Laci Mosley?

  Yes. They're all rich kids who are tricking people with no money into thinking that they can live in a van like they do.

• 33:36Speaker 03

  Look, I'm just glad they're doing that instead of trying to be a screenwriter.

• 33:39Laci Mosley?

  You know what? Fair enough.

• 33:41Speaker 03

  Fair enough.

• 33:42Laci Mosley?

  Fair enough. About 10 minutes after he put it on display at his store, our van life artist came in, identified the abstract nude in a terrible frame as possibly being a mid-century masterpiece by De Kooning, and offered to buy it for $200,000. Again, kicking it back to van life. Immediately, we thought van life, or at least I thought, van life meant that they were like, you know, a starving artist. No, this man is living in a tricked-out prop motor home because he just got $200,000. Also, what kind of haggler are you? I have never seen somebody see something on display. And you said the frame is so nasty. The nastiest frame you ever did see. I'm gonna come in and be like, "Oh, that nasty-ass picture? Like, I'll take it for $5." Well, I'm not gonna pay you what it's really worth.

• 34:24Speaker 03

  No, you're right. Actually, like, what was on the tag? Like, I'm sure it was like $10. Like, damn. Wait, do you feel like this guy was in on it?

• 34:31Laci Mosley?

  I wonder, because I've just never seen somebody go into a store and offer something that doesn't seem to be the price, but okay. So Dave Googled the painting and saw that it had been missing for 30 years and was worth more than a hundred million dollars. Okay, so that's why he started at 200,000. See, that's why you can't show your hand. That's why you can't show your hand and say 200,000. Like, I would have been like, oh, this is ugly, but my grandma, like, she's blind. Here's six dollars.

• 35:01Laci Mosley?

  And then I'm running up out the store, I'm getting to my van, like, and I'm scamming all the way home. What do you mean?

• 35:07Speaker 03

  Why would you tell him? What'd you think it's worth?

• 35:09Laci Mosley?

  I mean, damn, I feel bad for Van Man now, because clearly...

• 35:12Speaker 03

  I'm impressed that he could figure it out.

• 35:13Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, well, so remember, Dave Van Acker was the one who bought all this stuff. And then he was the one who had it on display. And then Van Man slid and was like, oh, I'll give it to you for 200K. And then Dave smartly Googled and was like, and this is Dave, he looks very eccentric. He looks... He looks like he's fun at parties. You know what I mean? Like, he looks like he would go on vacation with, uh, what I'm assuming is his wife next to him. And, but then he would find all the black people and be like, singing "Happy Birthday" with them.

• 35:42Speaker 03

  Oh, interesting, yeah. I thought he seemed like the world's most fun cop, if that's possible.

• 35:48Laci Mosley?

  He's a little drunk sometimes on the job, but boy, do we love him.

• 35:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, he, he comes and he's like, "I got donuts."

• 35:55Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah, that's, that's his face.

• 35:57Speaker 03

  He's fun, fun.

• 35:58Laci Mosley?

  But I also, yeah, I do see him on vacation finding all the lit young people and then just being in the middle of a circle in like a swim-up bar. Like, this is very his energy, and I love that for him and for me. So Dave, once he Googled it and realized it was worth probably a hundred million dollars, he drove it to the house he shared with his life partner Buck and got guns out of state to protect it.

• 36:19Speaker 03

  Wait, so who, okay, Dave was in the van?

• 36:21Laci Mosley?

  I'm sorry, got guns out of the safe to protect it.

• 36:23Speaker 03

  I see.

• 36:24Laci Mosley?

  So, so no. Dave, remember when Jerry and Rita died? Dave went to their house and he was like, "Ooh, nasty art that Jerry made, ooh, this, this and that." He was like, "But you know what? I'll take these few pieces of art and stuff." And he bought everything from their, like, estate sale for 2,000 dollars. Then he took it back to his shop.

• 36:42Speaker 03

  I see.

• 36:43Laci Mosley?

  And that's when Van Man slid and was like, "Wait a minute, let me get that for 200K." And then Dave was like, "Oh, yeah, bet, one second." Google, Google, Google, all right, lock the doors.

• 36:55Laci Mosley?

  Like, we gotta protect this.

• 36:56Speaker 03

  No, thank you for running it back, cuz I was like, there are a lot of players.

• 36:59Laci Mosley?

  Yes, it's a lot of players.

• 37:00Speaker 03

  I see.

• 37:00Laci Mosley?

  But we're gonna whittle down. Now, we're back to Dave, who was the one who got the stuff from Rita and Jerry's house. So, here's a little known, like, some facts about the de Kooning hype. So, William de Kooning stowed away to arrive in America from the Netherlands in 1926. He became a huge success in the 50s New York art scene, first with black and white abstract paintings, and then in 1953 with the Six Big Women art show. So, this is de Kooning. He looks very Netherlands. He's giving Dutch. Love that for him. He also has the hairstyle of, like, a Bond villain, you know?

• 37:38Speaker 03

  Oh, he's sexy.

• 37:39Laci Mosley?

  He's kinda hot.

• 37:40Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 37:41Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I could definitely see him tearing it up in the art scene. His face is a little...

• 37:44Speaker 03

  How do I get an abstract nude of this guy?

• 37:48Laci Mosley?

  So, this is one of his abstract nudes. Oh, my God, obviously, I was right.

• 37:51Speaker 03

  Triangle tits.

• 37:52Laci Mosley?

  Triangle titties.

• 37:53Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 37:53Laci Mosley?

  It's the only way to go. Yes. So, he's really popular.

• 37:58Speaker 03

  Damn, girl, you got some nice isosceles going on. Whoa.

• 38:02Laci Mosley?

  Sure would love to run a protractor across those.

• 38:05Speaker 03

  Side angles, side by... Okay, yeah.

• 38:07Laci Mosley?

  Side angles, side. It's crazy.

• 38:14Laci Mosley?

  So, a few years after William completed it, a wealthy collector bought the painting and donated it to the University of Arizona Museum of Art in Tucson, where he liked to vacation with the stipulation that the museum could never sell it. So, de Koon's gave it to them and was like, "But you can never sell this. Like, I want this art to be hanging here long after I'm dead and whatnots." So, when it was stolen in 1985, it became one of Tucson's biggest unsolved crimes for more than 30 years. So, this has been gone for 30 years, and nobody knew where it was. In 1985, it was the day after Thanksgiving, a slow day in the sleepy southwest, and the museum's director happened to be out of town at a conference on museum security.

• 39:01Laci Mosley?

  So, while the director of the museum is on... He's at a conference for museum security. His museum is not secure.

• 39:09Speaker 03

  Damn.

• 39:10Laci Mosley?

  He shouldn't have went to that conference earlier because clearly he needed it. He needed it real bad. So suspects who looked a lot like Rita and Jerry. Like this man in the fake mustache. And they're both wearing winter coats, which is very unusual for Tucson because they don't really have winter like that. And I love that they put on a fake mustache and like fake. Like come on costumes, we're back to costumes, Rita. I know you love a costume.

• 39:37Speaker 03

  The commitment. I mean, you've just gotta appreciate that.

• 39:40Laci Mosley?

  True.

• 39:40Speaker 03

  Damn, these people are obsessed with wearing like heavy winter clothes in hot areas.

• 39:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, that would make you stick out. Yo, you're right because then.

• 39:47Speaker 03

  The turtleneck.

• 39:47Laci Mosley?

  Rita was in that turtleneck. Yeah. Y'all are in Tucson, Arizona. I need y'all to be serious. They don't have no sweat stains either, so.

• 39:53Speaker 03

  I bet they just have like crazy tattoos. It actually has nothing to do with like.

• 39:57Laci Mosley?

  I could see that being a whole different side if they took off. Like I could see Rita having like a chest piece.

• 40:04Laci Mosley?

  You know, something spicy. So Rita distracted a security guard with questions while Jerry went to the second floor and cut the 30 by 40 inch painting out of the frame using a box cutter and rolled it up under his coat. They walked out of the museum 10 minutes later, which is what made the security guard suspicious. He was like, y'all came in here in these hot ass coats and you were chatting me up about nothing and then y'all. Then your man leaves and comes back and now his coat. That's why they need the heavy coat because they had to stick the paint under it.

• 40:40Speaker 03

  I was like, what kind of Ocean's Eleven thing are these people running? They're just walking in and grabbing it. Like they're just shoplifting. Like it's like a Target or a Sephora.

• 40:48Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, this is like putting a little Smucker's lip gloss in your, you know, pocket.

• 40:52Speaker 03

  Damn, don't you miss before we lived in a surveillance state. You can't be doing this anymore.

• 40:56Laci Mosley?

  Man, you really can't. And for those of you who might steal from big box stores, I just want you to know that sometimes you're not getting away with it. Sometimes if you keep hitting the same joint, they're actually just amassing like surveillance footage on you so that they can like slap you with a bigger like charge when they decide to get your ass. So you know, I don't know, switch it up.

• 41:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, you're not Jerry, you're not Rita, you're not fooling anybody.

• 41:20Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Do something, do a little bit here, a little bit there. Go to these different box stores and steal, but maybe not the same one because they might already know about you. So when the theft was discovered, local police involved the FBI and Interpol. Most big art heists end up crossing international borders. So Interpol gets involved automatically. So they're going after these people. Like, this is the FaceTime call that they were getting from the government because they were fucking up. So nobody got the getaway car's license plate. There was no video camera and no fingerprints detected. Okay, museum art director, I gotta go back to you, sir. Because was your only security that one guard who's a yapper?

• 42:03Laci Mosley?

  Was that it? Okay, damn, I see why you need to go to the damn conference. You just got the paintings hanging out all within the no security cameras, one guard who likes to chat. This is a recipe for getting your shit stolen. The painting never hit the black market. One psychic called in with a tip that didn't pan out. And after all that, investigators had no leads.

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• 46:13Laci Mosley?

  So they just stole this painting, it seems like because they liked it? They really just loved art and wanted to... I kind of liked this more because it was like they wanted to appreciate the art. They made a museum in their own house.

• 46:24Speaker 03

  I know, but I feel like this story would be more noble if they like opened it up to other people.

• 46:30Laci Mosley?

  I mean technically when they died, they did.

• 46:32Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 46:35Speaker 03

  Hmm, yeah, actually, I really look up to Jerry and Rita.

• 46:40Laci Mosley?

  They just loved art. So they closed the case in 1987, so after two years of trying. But it stayed on the FBI's top 10 crime list. So they were just like, I don't know. I love that the FBI makes a list like they're Forbes and they're like, hey, these are the crimes that we couldn't figure out. Like if anybody wants to just chip in.

• 47:00Laci Mosley?

  I said, this is not my job. That's your job. Like, what do you mean? So our Triangle Lady painting is now valued at $160 million and it was hanging behind Jerry and Rita's bedroom door for over 32 years. Just behind their bedroom door.

• 47:16Speaker 03

  So that wasn't even like their favorite piece?

• 47:18Laci Mosley?

  Right, because behind your bedroom door means you can't see it when the door is open.

• 47:21Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 47:22Laci Mosley?

  And you swinging the door all the time, jostling the painting around.

• 47:27Speaker 03

  That's why it was in the cheap Walmart frame. It's already, they've actually broken the frame multiple times from just opening and closing the door.

• 47:33Laci Mosley?

  That's what it is. Like into a fight, somebody slammed the door and they're like, fuck, the Conan.

• 47:37Speaker 03

  Do you think, do you think they brought it back? And then when they got home, they're like, you know, I thought I liked this. It looks so good there, but now that we're home, it just doesn't match anything.

• 47:48Laci Mosley?

  With all of our other terrible art.

• 47:51Speaker 03

  I know.

• 47:52Laci Mosley?

  Like, yeah.

• 47:52Speaker 03

  It's just like, this isn't matching with all the African stuff that we rightfully should have.

• 47:59Laci Mosley?

  You know, we just got this from the Zulu tribe and the colors just don't...

• 48:02Speaker 03

  The Dutch and the Zulu, no.

• 48:04Laci Mosley?

  They don't, they don't go together. So they never got officially fingered. The FBI case opened in 1985 and has never officially been closed, even though overwhelming evidence indicates that the robbers were Jerry and Rita. Yeah, we got these sketches in front of us. It was found in their house. They just cut it out the wall.

• 48:26Laci Mosley?

  Cutting art out the wall is crazy. Why would you do this? So, they were just retired teachers, right? They taught? They had children? That they mentored? Yeah, one of them was a speech pathologist, Rita. So that's how you help kids with like eating and speaking and all that type of stuff.

• 48:43Speaker 03

  Sorry, I lost track. There's a lot of players.

• 48:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and then Jerry was a teacher.

• 48:47Speaker 03

  Oh my god. You know what? This actually isn't... I had a substitute teacher we all loved who got arrested for having stolen shrunken heads. So this actually lines up with the educators of America that I know.

• 48:59Laci Mosley?

  Stolen shrunken heads is also wild. Like, what did you need those for?

• 49:03Speaker 03

  It was part of his culture. He's from Panama. He's from like Central America.

• 49:07Laci Mosley?

  So that mean he get to steal them? I think so.

• 49:09Speaker 03

  No, yeah, I mean, that's why I have...

• 49:12Speaker 03

  No, yeah, I mean, that's why I have all these scrolls.

• 49:15Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, no, you deserve those.

• 49:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's right, yeah.

• 49:17Laci Mosley?

  They're just going back to where they belong.

• 49:19Speaker 03

  My house in Ann Arbor, Michigan, yeah.

• 49:22Laci Mosley?

  So, they were retired teachers, right? But they left behind an estate of $2 million in cash. And they made no will. Now, why didn't y'all make a will? At 81, y'all could have gotten this donated. We could have... Y'all don't got no grandchildren that you like or nothing? I could have been y'all grandchild?

• 49:39Speaker 03

  But, but no, you probably couldn't have, yeah.

• 49:42Laci Mosley?

  If you don't have a will out there and you got some coin, go ahead and just write my name in, okay? Bless me, bless me, yes?

• 49:49Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 49:50Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, if you're, if you're a single couple, like y'all don't got no kids or nothing, or your kids have bad vibes. Your kids don't got no rhythm, you hate them, put me in the will.

• 49:57Speaker 03

  Look, look how hard Lacey works.

• 50:00Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I work as hard as what you would want your kid to work, so just write a little clause.

• 50:05Speaker 03

  Yes, write, write a little clause.

• 50:06Laci Mosley?

  I want a year of just going to probate.

• 50:10Laci Mosley?

  Just fighting everyone. They're like, they never even knew her and her name is Scam Goddess. No, no, no, no, I definitely knew them. We talked every week on Tuesdays, so you don't even understand.

• 50:19Speaker 03

  There is gonna be an angry entitled white child that kills you. You know that, right?

• 50:23Laci Mosley?

  They will do the murder too.

• 50:25Speaker 03

  Just your producer is shaking her head, not even laughing. Just sort of like, that is 100% correct.

• 50:30Laci Mosley?

  Yep, yep. I'm like, is it worth it? Let me work it. So they made no will. They were just jet setting travelers who would visit 140 countries, according to their travel agent. Jerry and Rita were adrenaline junkies who loved to fly to one country and then pay smugglers to get them to another. So they were smuggling themselves when they were traveling to these 140 countries. They're places they're not even supposed to be. I feel like they was kicking it in North Korea with Kim Jong.

• 50:58Laci Mosley?

  They're just getting smuggled in everywhere.

• 50:59Speaker 03

  You know they're having the best sex ever, right? Between a couple?

• 51:02Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah.

• 51:03Speaker 03

  They are literally probably like in love.

• 51:05Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Oh, like, look at them. They look so in love in their little young people photo back when they were doing their heist. Oh, my God, they were probably banging so hard after they stole that piece of art.

• 51:15Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 51:15Laci Mosley?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 51:16Speaker 03

  You know what? That's why they weren't, they weren't doing it for the money. They were doing it for the crazy sex.

• 51:23Speaker 03

  They were doing it for like, just the thrill of each other's bodies.

• 51:27Laci Mosley?

  Like, how do you think you stay married this long? You have to do heists.

• 51:30Speaker 03

  Yes, yes. That's right.

• 51:33Laci Mosley?

  Yes, and you're so right. I just see them like hopping in the car, they're speeding away. They get back and they have the craziest sex and then they're both just smoking a cigarette in bed like.

• 51:42Speaker 03

  Oh, my God. And their post nut clarity is just being like, you know what? This painting's not even that good. Put it out behind the door.

• 51:46Laci Mosley?

  And that's why they put it in a cheap frame and just hug it behind the door. They're like, oh, not even really worth it.

• 51:51Speaker 03

  But worth it.

• 51:52Laci Mosley?

  And then when they're getting smuggled, they're all hot and bothered. I love this when they're traveling. So Jerry had self-published two books of poetry and a collection of short stories a year before he died. The stories include tales of art heists and some successful, some not, including one that had similarities to the Decuning theft. So there was some art heist that didn't work. So in a story called "The Eye of the Jaguar," now, sir.

• 52:17Laci Mosley?

  You said "The Eye of the Tire"? Hold my beer. "The Eye of the Jaguar," which some New Mexico neighbors believed is a coded rewriting of the Decuning theft, there's like a middle-aged grandmother and her 14-year-old granddaughter who steal a priceless emerald from a museum case using only, using only a special Allen wrench. Not while using the IKEA tools.

• 52:40Laci Mosley?

  So let me hold on to this after we make our deforfin' sturf and do a heist. Okay. So he ends the story by describing how the stolen emerald was later kept in a hidden display case, apparently in the grandmother's home, several miles from the place that it ever transpired. Sound familiar?

• 52:57Speaker 03

  Uh, yeah, it sounds just like Jerry and Rita. Minus the part where they have crazy sex afterwards.

• 53:02Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, no, the grandmother and granddaughter don't have crazy sex.

• 53:06Speaker 03

  Now that would be hot.

• 53:07Laci Mosley?

  No, oh my god, I love it.

• 53:09Speaker 03

  Gross, gross.

• 53:10Laci Mosley?

  So.

• 53:13Laci Mosley?

  You're killing me.

• 53:14Speaker 03

  Sorry.

• 53:15Laci Mosley?

  So, no, I love it. There's also tales of revenge. One against barking dogs, which the main character kills with poison. Another against non-responsive literary agents who get shot with a tranquilizer dart, kidnapped, and then tied half naked to a toilet until she edits every page of his manuscript. Wow. That sounds like you have some real anger towards whoever this literary agent was who didn't want to buy your trash ass books.

• 53:39Laci Mosley?

  Cause like, why you gotta kidnap her, tranquilize her, kidnap her, and then tie her half naked to a toilet? You really hate that lady.

• 53:46Speaker 03

  Well, at least you have the decency to tranquilize her.

• 53:49Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I guess. But it's like, but, but he didn't kill her. She just had to edit every page of his manuscript.

• 53:56Speaker 03

  Oh my god.

• 53:58Laci Mosley?

  She feels worse?

• 54:00Speaker 03

  Yeah. Yes.

• 54:04Laci Mosley?

  Also sounds like Misery, the movie. Did you just watch Misery and like, do misery to, like, but, with the woman? Yeah, please, please say. So in real life, Jerry never got a literary agent or a gallery for his paintings. And maybe he resented that enough to steal the famous painting and more than one. So that makes sense, because remember he had 75 ugly ass paintings just sitting in that room. He was trying to get this in a gallery. Like, he thought this was some gallery type shit. I'll give him this one. I could definitely see that in an art gallery. Especially in Tucson, like what kind like?

• 54:38Speaker 03

  No, I mean, art is a scam, like, you know, like, I think, you know, he's in New Mexico. I don't think he knows the right people, like, he's not in the scene, like, he's right to be like, this is not a meritocracy.

• 54:48Laci Mosley?

  True.

• 54:49Speaker 03

  Did he have to tie a woman to a toilet?

• 54:51Laci Mosley?

  I, I don't think, I feel like that's extreme. Um, you know, the kidnapping of it all, but I can understand why he was mad about the art scene. But at the same time, his paintings were ass, so what are we supposed to do, sir? Some things aren't just not for you. So Lou Schacter, we're adding in another person, Sabrina, but this is where we're gonna, it's gonna tighten up.

• 55:12Speaker 03

  How many white people are you gonna shove into my brain?

• 55:14Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I'm so sorry. It's, it's a day of the white people. You've heard of the day of the dead? This is a day of the white people.

• 55:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, sorry, sorry. Great, I love that.

• 55:23Laci Mosley?

  So Lou Schacter is a true crime fan who drives around the US in a convertible, looking for interesting cases to solve. Sounds a little bit Mike me. Decided to, he decided to investigate if any of the other strange paintings sold to thrift shops in the estate, the sale that was for Rita and Jerry, right? So he actually found two more paintings that went to thrift shops. The paintings Indian in a War Bonnet by J H Sharp, and then Fall Landscape by Victor Higgins.

• 55:52Speaker 03

  Okay, these are actually amazing. I am seeing how Jerry's paintings are a little bit lacking.

• 55:56Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, Jerry, at least you could hang art up on your wall and put, oh, yeah, no, we just saw Jerry's painting again. Oh, and these, yeah, they're bad. Oh, but look, you can see Indian War Bonnet up on Jerry's wall. So they were auctioned and Indian War Bonnet actually went for $50,000, and Fall Landscape by Victor Higgins went for $90,000, $93,600. So they just had millions of dollars worth of art just hanging in their house, where nobody else could enjoy it. But at the same time, I'm like, the museum charges you to go see it there, like, who? I don't know, they were art lovers. What am I, well, how do you feel?

• 56:37Speaker 03

  I'm feeling like they're, I think they're art haters. Like, it feels almost like.

• 56:42Laci Mosley?

  Ooh, that's a good take.

• 56:45Speaker 03

  Or they're like, they're like art world haters. Like, it feels like they're like so bitter and like, uh, they also seem kinky as hell to me.

• 56:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, kinky and bitter. What a combo. No, I think you might be on to something, Sabrina. I might have to side with you.

• 56:58Speaker 03

  Like, it feels like they're taking stuff. They're not even like really treating it with that much respect.

• 57:03Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 57:03Speaker 03

  And they, they feel like the kinds of people who are like on, like the kinds of people on TikTok, like who are writing like not funny on like other, like.

• 57:11Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 57:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, like John Mulaney will have a bit and they'll be like, who even is this guy? I'm like, it's John Mulaney. Like, what are you talking, you know? And like, it feels like they're putting on their wall to be like, you know, just given that he's also painting 75 paintings.

• 57:22Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and wanted to be a part of the art world, wanted to be a part of the literary world. It seems like somebody, like a artist who wasn't good enough, but then just became bitter because no one liked their art. Cause you're so right. There's something to the way that they treated the paintings, like you said. And also the fact that they never tried to sell these really expensive paintings. It's almost like they just had them hanging up so they could look at them like, ha, ha, ha, ha. Like, y'all can't ever see this again.

• 57:47Speaker 03

  Yes, and like punishing people who are like blowing up too. Like William de Kooning like was having a moment and then they stole this amazing painting from him. And then they treated it like shit.

• 57:57Laci Mosley?

  Ooh, yeah, like, like hating on specific painters as well. So he probably was a fan. Jerry was probably a fan of, of these people and jealous of them. So he stole what they made.

• 58:08Speaker 03

  Do you like my theory? I'm, I'm.

• 58:09Laci Mosley?

  I love your theory. No, I'm fully on board. I think you're right. Cause otherwise, why have this really expensive art and never try to offload it? Now, it would be very difficult to do when the painting was hot because people are gonna be looking for it. But now like a mobster would certainly take this painting off your hands and pay you for it. But instead they treated him like shit and like hanging it behind a door is really shady. Yeah, I think you're real, Sabrina, I think you're.

• 58:31Speaker 03

  At least for some of them, I feel like, yeah, they're just kinda just like.

• 58:34Laci Mosley?

  No, you're spot on. That's exactly what it is. We had an art hater on our hands. That's all it was.

• 58:38Speaker 03

  It's not worth that much. Like, fuck it, I'll just take it. And, and this artist will never make money off of it and.

• 58:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he was an art hater. He was an art hater. A good art hater, cause they stole three arts that were really expensive. Yes, I just called them arts. They were paintings.

• 58:54Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I, you kind of made me look at this scam now and I, I don't know if I appreciate Jerry as much. Cause I was on Jerry's side, but now it kinda seems like Jerry was a hater. But Jerry was also a fun hater. Did a lot of traveling, stayed with his wife, loved his wife, was a wife guy.

• 59:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, an art hater but an amazing lover.

• 59:14Laci Mosley?

  Literally it, literally. I feel like to that day, they were still.

• 59:18Speaker 03

  Look at them, they're so in love.

• 59:20Laci Mosley?

  Still banging, and I love that for them.

• 59:22Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's actually, she need, no, I'm like, yeah, after what they did, she did need to get cataract surgery. Yeah, they did some crazy shit and now her eyes are fucked up.

• 59:31Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I mean, when you see the things that she's seen.

• 59:34Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 59:37Laci Mosley?

  Eventually you're gonna have to get some of them thick ass big glasses. Oh my goodness. Alright, well that brings us to the last segment of the show, Sabrina, before I have to let Sabrina go. Um, it's just Scammer of the Week, just a short little, look, we brought Scammer of the Week back y'all for this week.

• 59:54Laci Mosley?

  I'm making my own hair horns now, that one was not good, but Scammer of the Week is where we honor a charlatan who may or may not be worthy of our praise. We'll see. So now you can erase all of those people that we just talked about on the hoodwink.

• 1:00:05Speaker 03

  Thank god.

• 1:00:08Laci Mosley?

  I feel like I needed a murder board.

• 1:00:10Speaker 03

  Yes, I was like.

• 1:00:11Laci Mosley?

  With strings, so it could be like, this guy's.

• 1:00:13Speaker 03

  And there's Dave, Jerry, Rita, yeah.

• 1:00:15Laci Mosley?

  You did well, you did well. We kept it together. So Scammer of the Week, ironically named Irena Green, was arrested following an escalating battle with her homeowners association over letting her lawn become less green than usual. So Irena Green had a lawn that wasn't so green.

• 1:00:35Speaker 03

  Say that.

• 1:00:36Laci Mosley?

  And, and I do want to let y'all know that the HOA is a bitch. You really, if you are looking to buy a home, you should see if there's HOA in your neighborhood because, and you should see how strict they are because some HOAs are just people who are meddling, don't have shit else to do, so if you leave your trash can on the curb for an hour longer than it's supposed to be, you'll have a fine. If you, they'll nickel and dime you, and they can even nickel and dime you up to a certain point where they can take your home. Cause some HOAs are owned by private equity companies, and so they're looking to make a bag. It's, it's really wild.

• 1:01:06Speaker 03

  It's a scam.

• 1:01:07Laci Mosley?

  The HOA is a scam. So Irina's lawn was looking ashy, and the HOA was like, no miss girl. So she has a home in Riverwood, Florida's Creekview subdivision. According to HOA rules, her grass needs to be green. But Irina says last year's drought and watering restrictions, plus a big tree next to her sidewalk, made the grass brown. So this is her grass. Oh, no, no, they black, Irina. Irina, they trying to take your house from you, girl. That's all that is. And the green, okay, so the lawn isn't super green, but it's not not green.

• 1:01:44Speaker 03

  No, it just looks like something's up with the dirt.

• 1:01:46Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it's a little patchy. Because you can see the house next door is like a bright green. And then Irina's lawn is green up until a certain point where it gets a little patchy and a little dirt.

• 1:01:57Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:01:58Laci Mosley?

  And then the other green is not that green. Okay, mm, Irina, I want to be on your side because, you know, we're black and we're in this together culturally. But your lawn does kind of make the neighborhood not look as nice. It's giving, it's giving a little trap. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. But Irina, who is a fellow dark-skinned girlie, says that there are other yards with brown grass in the subdivision. But for some reason, she's the only one who's gone to jail for it.

• 1:02:25Speaker 03

  What?

• 1:02:25Laci Mosley?

  Jail. Jail.

• 1:02:28Speaker 03

  I'm in shock.

• 1:02:29Laci Mosley?

  You mean the place with the cuffs and the bars jail? Oh, okay, back on your side, Irina. They, they're trying to, I see what they're trying to do to you, queen. So first she receives notices from the HOA management company, the Trow Bridge Company Incorporated, about, see, a private company, about the brown grass. Then another about a dent in her garage and a dirty mailbox, and for parking in a commercial cargo van, which is not uncommon in her driveway. So they really were, and look at her mailbox. It looks great.

• 1:03:02Speaker 03

  It's literally

• 1:03:03Laci Mosley?

  White.

• 1:03:03Speaker 03

  It's, it's hurting my eyes to look at, yeah.

• 1:03:06Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, this is them trying to get a black person out of the neighborhood for sure. Like, they coming for anything. So Irina failed to respond to a request for mediation, and the HOA filed a lawsuit against her in this county civil court. The HOA said she violated the community appearance rules and demanded that she correct the violations. Irina represented herself in court, preparing a handwritten response to the lawsuit. She That was rejected by both the HOA and the judge. So, the judge gave her 30 days to correct her appearance violations. Irene said she sold her van, cleaned her mailbox, and bought seeds and watered the grass to comply. But she missed her next court date because she never received the summons. Someone went in her mailbox and got that damn summons.

• 1:03:50Laci Mosley?

  This is like the kind of mailbox you steal people's mail from. So she never got the summons. The judge held her in contempt of court and issued an arrest warrant requested by the HOA's attorney. Arrest is crazy. Arrest is insane.

• 1:04:05Speaker 03

  I mean, yeah, I agree. It's insane.

• 1:04:08Laci Mosley?

  For my lawn not being green enough, like, everybody needs, like, hands put on them. Like, I'm sorry, at this point, you gotta just go to your neighborhood HOA meeting with a bat and really just start fucking shit up. Because ain't no way in hell y'all put me in jail and now I have a record because of some grass? Oh, no, your ass is grass too.

• 1:04:27Laci Mosley?

  Where you at, queen? Because if you need us to slide, I mean, we might have to have a barbecue. Not an angry mob. Don't bring a pitchfork. Don't bring torches and matches and stuff. But just, you know, barbecue stuff. And then we all meet, you know, at maybe dusk. You know, everybody. It might get a little chilly out, so y'all bring your shysties to keep your face warm. And we're gonna have a barbecue. Because the fuck? No, so Irene was pulled over on the way home from picking up her daughter at cheerleading practice. And that's when they put her in the clink. And she spent seven days in jail. Imagine getting arrested in front of your daughter. I would sue all of these people. This needs to be national news. Like, you need to sue the HOA company for distress, emotional distress.

• 1:05:11Laci Mosley?

  You should be able to bankrupt them, Irene, because they are tripping. They are tripping. Like, my grass isn't green enough, so now I have to go to prison?

• 1:05:20Speaker 03

  I know. What I feel like is just like one of their neighbors let their dog pee everywhere. And now the grass is dead. Like, I really, it's really... That's insane.

• 1:05:28Laci Mosley?

  Hell, for all we know, when Irene at work, they over there putting salt in her shit. Because you know they trying to get her black ass up out of there. That's all this is. I would not be shocked if somebody was just like, Irene, as soon as her car pulls away, they walk over to her driveway and then they hit it with the girl with the umbrella. And they just pouring it everywhere. This feels like sabotage.

• 1:05:47Speaker 03

  Seriously, justice for Irina.

• 1:05:49Laci Mosley?

  Justice for Irina. Cause like even the grass is bleeding over this greener. It does bleed into her lawn. And then it's like almost an abrupt stop at the housing line. Of where the, the grass starts to get patchy. You telling me that you can water your lawn to the exact like microscopic point of your land that has no fence in between? Being green? Somebody was over there fucking with that grass. It's like she go to work and then, or she go on vacation and then the whole neighborhood go over there and stomp it like they have, they stomping divots at the Kentucky Derby. That's what they doing. They having parties. They having their own barbecue where they go fuck up your lawn. That's what's happening.

• 1:06:25Speaker 03

  They're taking like practice swings with their golf club over there.

• 1:06:28Laci Mosley?

  Oh, for sure. Lighting small fires and stomping them out. We know what you're doing. Cause this lawn looks aggressively like somebody on purpose was trying to fuck with it. Yeah, no, Irina, I am so sorry that you went to jail, but we are gonna have to get you some justice. This is Florida and if anywhere, you know, white people could put your black ass in jail for not having the greenest lawn, it certainly is Florida.

• 1:06:53Laci Mosley?

  Okay, there ain't no justice over there. The, the NAACP issued a national warning, like it's not safe for black people to be in Florida. So, you know, it might be time to move, sis, but sue them first, okay? Show up to court in a neck brace and sue, and bring grass. Bring grass with you.

• 1:07:09Speaker 03

  Bring a sample, yeah, from your lawn.

• 1:07:13Laci Mosley?

  Exhibit A, sample of my grass, like. But that's, how, what do you think about that?

• 1:07:19Speaker 03

  Is there even like a debate? It's just like, why would you ever put a woman in jail for having like a weird lawn? Like, I can't, can't people have ADHD anymore? Like, what the hell?

• 1:07:30Laci Mosley?

  No, I don't think we can. I don't think we can. It'll, they gonna put us in prison? And I have ADHD.

• 1:07:37Laci Mosley?

  I don't want the sale block waiting for me, see, but y'all, you really do have to watch out. Like, if you're buying a property, like, make sure that your HOA is not privately owned. Or look into the history, like, that they have, because, you know, you don't want to move into a place where they're gonna try to put you in jail. I thought they were gonna try to steal her home. They said, no, if we just lock her up long enough, she'll miss mortgage payments, and then we'll get the home, and we'll get to put a black person in jail. That's a twofer.

• 1:08:01Speaker 03

  I really, this makes me like Jerry and Rita so much more, and what they were up to.

• 1:08:05Laci Mosley?

  Jerry and Rita, y'all, you know what? The artist had already put the art in a museum, so it's not like the artist was gonna see it every day, anyway. I mean, obviously, the fans of the artist won't see it, but the paint is also on the internet. They hate internets. Everybody's fine.

• 1:08:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, the Dutch are fine.

• 1:08:21Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, oh yeah, the Dutch are plenty fine. Yeah. No, everybody's doing great. So we're back on your side, now that we've seen someone less savory than you, Jared, uh, cuz at least you didn't put no people in jail, okay?

• 1:08:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:08:32Laci Mosley?

  Nobody cared about your lawn. It's all good. His lawn was with rocks in it.

• 1:08:40Laci Mosley?

  So Jerry would've never did this to you, Irina.

• 1:08:42Speaker 03

  No, Jerry would've sought justice for you, Irina.

• 1:08:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. He would've never, he would've.

• 1:08:46Speaker 03

  Jerry would've tied that HOA to a fucking toilet.

• 1:08:50Laci Mosley?

  And the HOA would have to read his manuscript, but then he.

• 1:08:52Speaker 03

  And they would shoot themselves, right then and there.

• 1:08:55Laci Mosley?

  He doesn't even have to do it. It's a part of the plan. Oh, my goodness, Sabrina, thank you so much for being here.

• 1:09:01Speaker 03

  Thanks for having me. Thanks for letting me be a little chaotic. I had so much fun.

• 1:09:05Laci Mosley?

  I love it. Thank you for staying strong through all of those names. You killed it. We always ask on this podcast, where would you like to be found? Anything you want people to see, social media, all of those things?

• 1:09:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, you can follow me on Instagram at Ace Sabrina Wu, or all my socia's. And, um, you know, I hope you watch Dying for Sex, I'm so proud of that show, and Murder Bot on Apple TV, and Stream Joyride, I guess.

• 1:09:27Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 1:09:28Speaker 03

  All right, yeah.

• 1:09:29Laci Mosley?

  I love it. And, Congregation, you can see all of the fantastic photos that we were gazing upon today at Scam Goddess Pod on Instagram. You can talk to me on Twitter, it's Scam Goddess Pod. And you can follow me and my shenanigans at D I V A L A C I, Diva Lacy, on all platforms. Don't forget to like, subscribe. Give it a star, have your baby listen to it again in another room. Review, write a little nice something for our black ladies today, okay? Especially because we just heard about Arena, like, the black girls need help. Yes, we love it, we love it all. And then you can catch my book, Scam Goddess, on wherever you buy your audiobooks and wherever bookstores are near you. I cannot be specific because of the book world, they be beefing. But it's out there, it's very much out there.

• 1:10:12Laci Mosley?

  And then watch all the episodes of Scam Goddess, they're all streaming now on Hulu. You can watch the first season of Going Dutch streaming now on Hulu. And I am back in Ireland, shooting season two, yes, we're gonna have a good crack. Yep, and congregation, I want you to get out there. Hmm. I want you to get out there and stay heisting. Yeah, take a little vacation afterwards, have some spicy lovemaking. That is not endorsed by me.

• 1:10:41Laci Mosley?

  Scam Goddess. This has been an Earwolf production in association with Team Coco. Scam Goddess stars and is hosted by me, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. Our producer is Jessica Sisneros and our audio engineer is Rich Garcia. Research for the show is conducted by Kate Doyle. Stay scheming.

• 1:11:04Speaker 04

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