Social Trolls & An Email Special Song

How to handle social trolls? In this episode of Wolf & Owl, the boys are back with another collection of bizarre listener questions, questionable role plays, and deeply unnecessary discussions. Plus, they get the first listen at a brand new Wolf & Owl song and present the question: could this go to the charts? Elsewhere, Romesh and Tom revisit their infamous Josh Widdicombe and Ross Kemp role play before attempting another one that goes spectacularly wrong. They also discuss tummy sticks, music speaker etiquette, and whether you really need social media to stay in the loop. And we address the topic of when friendly banter begins to cross a line. From cutting down on social media to dealing with online trolls, they cover all of your email conundrums. If you've been thinking about therapy, BetterHelp can help you take the first step. Sign up and get 10% off at https://www. BetterHelp.com/wolfowl A Ranga Bee Production in partnership with Platform Media. Chapters 00:00 Intro 00:48 An email special song 04:18 Revisiting the Josh Widdicombe & Ross Kemp role play 05:33 Tummy sticks 07:55 A question on music speakers 12:15 A failed role play 19:08 A large nose issue 28:19 How to stay in the loop without socials 31:59 Cutting down on social media 33:53 Dealing with social trolls 38:08 Outro Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

• 0:02Speaker 00

  Welcome to the Wolf and Al Email Special. It's a Wolf and Al Email Special. Uh, [email protected] if you'd like your email to potentially be read out on the podcast. Queries, questions, or just stories. We're open to it all.

• 0:33Speaker 01

  Actually, we haven't had a really good story for a while.

• 0:35Speaker 00

  No, we haven't.

• 0:35Speaker 01

  We had some really great stories back in the day.

• 0:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, um, that's when they made an effort, isn't it?

• 0:42Speaker 00

  Am I right? Uh, okay, should we do our first one?

• 0:44Speaker 01

  Yes, let's do it.

• 0:45Speaker 00

  Shall we?

• 0:45Speaker 01

  You go. I think you go first.

• 0:47Speaker 00

  Okay. All right, boys, it's me again, Vern. I threatened I would if you did some more, so I'm afraid I'm after your intro from your Do We Need A Summerbody podcast? I was once again compelled to turn your amazing songwriting skills into a track. This time it's not AI.

• 1:02Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:02Speaker 00

  It was taken from your actual audio, so your vocals and melody. Once again, it's only short. Hope you enjoy. Keep up the banter and bollocks. Cheers, Vern. Well, thank you for this.

• 1:12Speaker 01

  By the way, Vern, love the name. Oh, okay, well.

• 1:16Speaker 00

  Email special song.

• 1:20Speaker 02

  Welcome to the Wolf and Al Email Special. We do list the questions and queries and we try to help out if we can.

• 1:33Speaker 01

  Romesh Rang and Nathan got the answer.

• 1:34Speaker 02

  Tom Davis and Romesh Rang and Alvin, could you stop at the Wolf and Al station? We'll try our best to give you information. And integration to the Wolf and Al for you.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  Get your shoelaces up and pull your trousers up.

• 1:57Speaker 00

  This is unbelievable.

• 2:04Speaker 00

  Oh my God, that is Vern.

• 2:07Speaker 01

  Wow, Vern.

• 2:07Speaker 00

  What an absolute legend.

• 2:09Speaker 01

  That is a legend.

• 2:09Speaker 00

  That is sick.

• 2:11Speaker 01

  That's the legendary stuff.

• 2:12Speaker 00

  Oh my God, I can't believe how good that is.

• 2:15Speaker 01

  Crushed it.

• 2:22Speaker 00

  Vern, thank you so much, man. Holy shit. That was great. That's actually a banger.

• 2:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:28Speaker 00

  Isn't it?

• 2:28Speaker 01

  We could release that.

• 2:29Speaker 00

  We could, yeah. We have to give Vern some sort of, I mean, he put the whole thing together.

• 2:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, we have to make it a bit longer as well, I think. How, how long does your?

• 2:37Speaker 00

  I think you just put it out as it is.

• 2:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, but how long does the track have to be to enter the charts?

• 2:41Speaker 00

  Oh, that's a good question. I don't think, because didn't, um, that, uh, chicken thing from Minecraft get into the charts? That's only like a minute long.

• 2:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, but that's less than a minute, I'm guessing.

• 2:51Speaker 00

  Steve's lava chicken?

• 2:53Speaker 01

  Yeah. What about a comment, was it a fish song recently?

• 2:57Speaker 00

  It's about one pound fish?

• 2:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:58Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's about 15 years ago, I think.

• 3:04Speaker 00

  Have they butched you for Mock the Week yet?

• 3:06Speaker 01

  No, I've never been butched. They'd never want to be on it.

• 3:10Speaker 00

  Uh, that was a long time ago, the fish. He's about one pound fish.

• 3:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 3:14Speaker 00

  Very, very, very, very cheap, that one.

• 3:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. What about Wakey Wines? What's happened to him?

• 3:19Speaker 00

  Well, Prime went down the toilet an hour, but I don't think he's got the same.

• 3:23Speaker 01

  Is Prime gone now? That's it.

• 3:24Speaker 00

  It's not gone, but you're not paying.

• 3:26Speaker 01

  You were living off it for a while. You were living in that Prime life because you had quite, you had a big garage full of it, right?

• 3:31Speaker 00

  I didn't have a garage full of it, but they were sending it to me, yeah, yeah. Uh, thank you so much, Vern.

• 3:36Speaker 01

  Vern is the kind of name, if you were to give Vern a project, he'd come away and do it well. Just name wise. If you walked in and you were like, you had an operation to do, uh, and you only knew people by name.

• 3:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:49Speaker 01

  Would Vern, Vern would be someone I'd look to and go, yeah, I'll take Vern.

• 3:52Speaker 00

  Yeah, I guess so.

• 3:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:54Speaker 00

  Yeah. What other names are in the mix?

• 3:56Speaker 01

  Ian, Kevin, Bruce.

• 3:59Speaker 00

  So you've got to choose between Vern, Ian, Kevin, Kevin and Bruce?

• 4:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:03Speaker 00

  Okay. Your pool of go-to names, by the way. All right, do you want to do the next one?

• 4:08Speaker 01

  Who do you go with Vern though, right?

• 4:10Speaker 00

  Out of those, yeah, I would do, yeah.

• 4:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:12Speaker 00

  All other things being equal.

• 4:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, all right.

• 4:15Speaker 03

  Want to be the one who's always in the know about the game, the scores, the plays? Here's a tip, the Apple Sports app. Just pick your favourite teams and get automatic live updates without even knowing their schedules. And when your team scores, it shows up right on your iPhone lock screen, making it easy to check in anytime. So rule the group chat and download Apple Sports for free on the App Store or find it on your new iPhone.

• 4:41Speaker 00

  Dear Wolf, Owl, Swan and the Coyote. We are the parents of two boys, the Capybara, age 13, and the Golden-haired Tamarin, age 10, and all four of us love the pod.

• 4:51Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 4:52Speaker 00

  Hmm. We've recently returned from a family holiday to Tagazoot in Morocco. Our apartment was in the hills with wifi that hardly worked. The Capybara and the golden-haired Tamarin decided that role plays would be used for our evening entertainment. For 13 nights, the boys reenacted the Ross Kemp and Josh Whittaker purge role play from the 27th of July episode. The only challenge we had as parents was trying to explain what tummy sticks is.

• 5:21Speaker 00

  Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Yours truly, the Elk. 13 nights in a row of doing.

• 5:27Speaker 01

  That's incredible. That's a long, that's a longish.

• 5:29Speaker 00

  I was a bit nervous when the podcast team decided to clip that up and put it on socials.

• 5:35Speaker 01

  I was ecstatic.

• 5:37Speaker 00

  I, I, I.

• 5:38Speaker 01

  What, because they're, but you're.

• 5:39Speaker 00

  Because Ross and Josh are going to see that.

• 5:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, Josh is my friend and I was worried about Josh getting offended slightly.

• 5:45Speaker 00

  And Ross, you hate.

• 5:47Speaker 01

  I don't hate him. I just, I just think, I've said my view.

• 5:52Speaker 00

  Yeah, no, I know. Let's not get into it again. You've already compromised me on the traitors enough as it is. Uh, tummy sticks, um, how do you explain that to a 10 and 13 year old? It's, uh, fully erect penises and you sort of use them in a sword fight.

• 6:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 6:07Speaker 00

  Does that help?

• 6:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:12Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 6:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's pretty much it.

• 6:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, that is it. Is there, is there, um, is there a different way of explaining tummy sticks?

• 6:19Speaker 01

  I, I think, no, I mean, that is what tummy sticks is.

• 6:22Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 6:22Speaker 01

  But I think there's a world where you could, uh, you could say that.

• 6:25Speaker 00

  I mean, tummy sticks is.

• 6:27Speaker 01

  You could put a lollipop stick in your belly button and do that.

• 6:29Speaker 00

  Yeah, sure. Okay, so let's, tummy sticks, uh.

• 6:34Speaker 01

  Have you played tummy sticks?

• 6:34Speaker 00

  Capybara and golden-haired Tamarin, tummy sticks is where you stick a lollipop stick into your belly button and you have a little sword fight.

• 6:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, I mean, I'm guessing if you listen to the show, you've just heard Romesh's.

• 6:45Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah, that's true.

• 6:45Speaker 01

  He went straight in with the actual explanation.

• 6:47Speaker 00

  Sorry.

• 6:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 6:49Speaker 01

  And Romesh, by the way, an incredible tummy stick, uh.

• 6:52Speaker 00

  I was actually, uh, West Sussex tummy sticks champion, uh, four years running.

• 7:00Speaker 01

  I, I could, actually, I would say for, in Ross Kemp's defence, he would be insane at tummy sticks. Um, to have that level of aggression.

• 7:08Speaker 00

  If it was actually a tummy stick though, do you know what I mean?

• 7:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, that would be like a lollipop stick or.

• 7:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, but what I'm saying is.

• 7:14Speaker 01

  Do you ever play poo sticks?

• 7:16Speaker 00

  Where you throw some sticks in a river?

• 7:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:18Speaker 00

  Do I ever play that game?

• 7:19Speaker 01

  But when you see a river and a bridge, don't you get, like, a couple of bridges, do you not get excited? And go, oh, fucking poo sticks. Grace still, well, I wouldn't be past a river.

• 7:28Speaker 00

  Grace still, how old is Grace?

• 7:30Speaker 01

  Four and a half.

• 7:31Speaker 00

  Right, okay, so fucking hell, when's she gonna grow out of that?

• 7:35Speaker 01

  Do you not play with the boys? If you, if you're on a family walk, break off a couple of branches of a tree.

• 7:41Speaker 00

  I've broken off something during a walk, yeah.

• 7:44Speaker 01

  You don't break off a couple of branches from in.

• 7:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, we probably have done, yeah.

• 7:48Speaker 01

  It's great, man. It's great.

• 7:50Speaker 00

  Um, all right, well, look, first of all, what I would say is I'm surprised that children of that age are listening.

• 7:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, I am slightly. Well, it actually makes you feel about your boys not listening.

• 7:59Speaker 00

  Well, they're not listening because they've got no interest.

• 8:01Speaker 01

  Amazing getting Alex and Charlie to act out the Josh and Ross Kemp thing.

• 8:05Speaker 00

  Which finishes with tummy sticks?

• 8:07Speaker 01

  No.

• 8:09Speaker 00

  What's wrong with you?

• 8:10Speaker 01

  Not a tummy, Alex would obviously be Ross.

• 8:12Speaker 00

  Right.

• 8:12Speaker 01

  Charlie would be doing amazing, Josh.

• 8:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think he probably would actually.

• 8:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 8:19Speaker 01

  Hi, you sexy bitches.

• 8:20Speaker 00

  Oh, hello.

• 8:20Speaker 01

  I have just returned from a semi-relaxing holiday in Greece and stayed at a small adults-only boutique hotel.

• 8:28Speaker 00

  Can you whistle?

• 8:29Speaker 01

  No. My partner and I are both teachers, so we look for a quiet, adults-only hotel. This is our one week away in the sun before we get ready for another year of teaching. Romesh, I'm sure you remember what it was like preparing for another September. Um, anyone who's there.

• 8:51Speaker 01

  Sorry, anyone, there was this one guest, let's call him.

• 8:54Speaker 00

  Anywho, I think that's supposed to say.

• 8:56Speaker 01

  Anywho, there was this one guest, let's call him the graying chimpanzee, who insisted on playing music through his speaker around the pool. Oh god.

• 9:07Speaker 01

  He would play tapping his feet to the music with no care for any other guests. I'd say he was probably mid fifties and thought he was the life and soul of the hotel. My question is, do you think it would be acceptable to launch the speaker into the pool and tell this grime man he is a selfish **** who should know better? Of course, I didn't do this, but I dreamed about it every day. How would you have dealt with the situation? And do you think it's acceptable for adults to play music around a pool when no one else wants to hear it? Yours, the annoyed anaconda. I, yeah, um, speaker on the pool is a no-no, right? That's a f-.

• 9:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think it probably is. I, I, I, uh, I'm slightly, I have been known to take a speaker to the beach in the past. But, but in my defence.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  Beach is slightly different.

• 9:54Speaker 00

  But in my defence, I play, I really am careful with the volume. Because, because you know when you, you get a couple of like loungers or whatever, or you put towels down?

• 10:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:03Speaker 00

  And you're sort of away from other people. I, I, I, I would go as so far as to like walk away from where we are just to see if it can still be, you know what I mean? Like.

• 10:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:11Speaker 00

  It's only like, it's only.

• 10:12Speaker 01

  But you're a very respectful guy.

• 10:14Speaker 00

  I try to be. So I, I would hate to think that our music is bleeding into.

• 10:17Speaker 01

  Also, by the way, you're a DJ. So you have exemplary music taste.

• 10:22Speaker 00

  Um, I think around the pool loud.

• 10:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's a no-no.

• 10:26Speaker 00

  Actually, yeah.

• 10:27Speaker 01

  I actually think.

• 10:27Speaker 00

  I don't think you can launch it into the pool.

• 10:29Speaker 01

  I think after a while you can.

• 10:31Speaker 00

  So how many days?

• 10:32Speaker 01

  I, I, no, I think that there's a, there's a note that goes over.

• 10:37Speaker 01

  First of all, delivered by a waiter, get a few of you to sign it like.

• 10:40Speaker 00

  That's a good, that's a bloody good idea. That just pops into your head.

• 10:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:43Speaker 00

  Really good.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  I think you, you go to other people as this.

• 10:45Speaker 00

  I would say it pops into your head so quickly, it might be something that you've done before.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  No, no, I haven't done it, but I think this is, I mean, I've, I've marinated with the thought since reading it. Um, I think you send a note over, you get other people to like a, you know, petition. Saying, look, you know, and then when, when they read it, you'll, no one looks over, you know, reading a book or doing whatever. Hopefully at that point, the guy goes, well, okay, no one likes this music. He probably slopes his shoulders, walks back to his room.

• 11:12Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 11:13Speaker 01

  Has a little thing to himself and goes, goes down without his speaker. Becomes a part of the, the holiday for everyone and everyone gets on with him. Um, if he doesn't, if he doesn't

• 11:24Speaker 01

  like do anything and keeps on playing the music, I then think someone has to go over. You draw sticks, someone goes, right, who's gonna do it?

• 11:31Speaker 00

  Tummy sticks?

• 11:32Speaker 01

  Tummy sticks, yeah, we go with tummy sticks, yeah. Under the water.

• 11:35Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:35Speaker 01

  Um, hold your breath long enough.

• 11:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:37Speaker 01

  Um, uh, whoever, uh, you know, the winner goes over and says, look, mate, we sent you a note. Now, as you've seen, that we've been over there for the last six hours, we've had a very competitive game of tummy sticks tournament. I'm the winner, I've got the biggest deck essentially.

• 11:51Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 11:51Speaker 01

  And it's my duty to come over and tell you to turn the fucking music off.

• 11:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:55Speaker 01

  If he still then plays it, I think someone is with every right.

• 11:59Speaker 00

  Then you can launch into the pool.

• 12:00Speaker 01

  Launch into the pool. But sometimes these, these incredible new, it could be waterproof.

• 12:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. And then, then.

• 12:06Speaker 00

  Then you want to break it.

• 12:08Speaker 01

  Or, yeah, then you've got to launch it somewhere else, right?

• 12:10Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:12Speaker 00

  Um, yeah, I think, I think this.

• 12:13Speaker 01

  That's what wasps would come in useful if you could train wasps to go and sting him.

• 12:17Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think that's.

• 12:18Speaker 01

  Or put loads of jam all over his speaker. Or honey or golden syrup. So then, like saying sweet that wasps.

• 12:26Speaker 00

  I, I, I would say i- if you're pitching that as a real suggestion.

• 12:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:30Speaker 00

  I would say there's quite a few steps between you applying the honey and him waiting for wasps to.

• 12:37Speaker 01

  Right, you, you play the guy, right? You're just sitting there listening to me. What are you listening to?

• 12:43Speaker 00

  Um, I'm probably listening to Armin Van Helden.

• 12:47Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 12:49Speaker 01

  Hey, mate, hey, hey, hey, mate, turn off your music, you're never gonna guess what?

• 12:54Speaker 00

  What's that?

• 12:54Speaker 01

  Two of the waiters are having a fight. One of them got caught kissing the other one's wife. They've literally gone out and mate, they're fighting outside. You've got to see this. It's a really, really good fight.

• 13:02Speaker 00

  Well, I'll probably just let him get on with it.

• 13:03Speaker 01

  No, seriously, you have to see this.

• 13:05Speaker 00

  No, I, I believe you, but I'm just chilling.

• 13:07Speaker 01

  Mate, you can't miss this. Nothing's happened here for days.

• 13:11Speaker 00

  I'm cool, man. Thank you, though.

• 13:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, mate, seriously, I think you'll really regret not seeing it.

• 13:16Speaker 00

  I think I'll be fine.

• 13:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 13:20Speaker 01

  Hey, mate, mate, it's me earlier after, remember the fight? Hey, mate.

• 13:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 13:26Speaker 01

  The fight went crazy, but actually what's incredible is now the waiter and his wife are having sex in a pool.

• 13:33Speaker 00

  Okay, where?

• 13:35Speaker 01

  No, the other pool, the kids.

• 13:37Speaker 00

  The waiter and his, what, the other guy's wife having sex in the kids?

• 13:40Speaker 01

  In the kids pool.

• 13:41Speaker 00

  Okay, cool.

• 13:42Speaker 01

  Do you wanna come and watch?

• 13:43Speaker 00

  Not really, man. I've got to be honest with you. I, I, I, I don't know if I've given you the impression that I'm somebody that would like to watch something like that. But I'm not.

• 13:51Speaker 01

  Well, it's just you're on your own.

• 13:53Speaker 00

  Sure, but I'm not sitting here thinking, I hope I catch a glimpse of somebody having sex in the kids pool. And I'm so, I apologize if, if that's the manner in which I've been conducting.

• 14:04Speaker 01

  I thought you were gonna be a lot more creepy and weird than you actually are.

• 14:09Speaker 00

  Why do, why would you think I'd be creepy and weird?

• 14:11Speaker 01

  Some of the stuff that we've been saying over there about you, because you're on your own and you don't talk to anyone, you just listen to your music.

• 14:17Speaker 00

  Right.

• 14:18Speaker 01

  And it's, by the way, your music.

• 14:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:20Speaker 01

  It's really, really upsetting quite a lot of people because it's.

• 14:23Speaker 00

  Is it more upsetting than repeatedly bothering somebody to let them know there's a waiter fucking in the kids pool? Like, of the two of us, who do you think's been the most disruptive to the other one?

• 14:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know, but your music's disrupting loads of people. I'm only disrupting you. And if I'm honest with you, I didn't wanna disrupt you, but I wanna go with tummy sticks. So I had to come over here and talk to you.

• 14:44Speaker 00

  You, you did, you wanna go?

• 14:46Speaker 01

  Basically, here was how it's gonna go.

• 14:47Speaker 00

  Sorry, mate, you wanna go with what?

• 14:48Speaker 01

  Tummy sticks.

• 14:49Speaker 00

  Tummy sticks?

• 14:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:50Speaker 00

  How does that work?

• 14:51Speaker 01

  Uh, me, I don't know if you've met Big Clive over there. We both had to get erections and have a sword fight with our dicks.

• 14:57Speaker 00

  You had a sword fight with your dicks? How, how do you, I'm surprised you didn't come over and ask me to have a look at that.

• 15:02Speaker 01

  We know.

• 15:02Speaker 00

  How, how do you decide, how do you decide the winner?

• 15:05Speaker 01

  Uh, whoever becomes, uh, unerect, sorry.

• 15:09Speaker 00

  So whoever loses their erection first?

• 15:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, I maintain an erection on there on Big Clive.

• 15:13Speaker 00

  And your prize was coming over here to talk to me?

• 15:16Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, the honour was mine to tell you to turn the music down or we're gonna put.

• 15:20Speaker 00

  But you didn't tell me to turn the music down. You said that there was a waiter having a fight with somebody else because he was shagging his missus or something?

• 15:27Speaker 01

  The actual plan was to get you to go up to the kids pool because the waiter's not actually having sex with someone.

• 15:32Speaker 00

  So the waiter's not having sex in the kids?

• 15:34Speaker 01

  It was a ruse. Um, and basically when you go, we're gonna get your speaker and cover it in jam. So wasps come over it.

• 15:44Speaker 00

  You can spread jam on the speaker?

• 15:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, because you know, we sent that note to you that we all signed.

• 15:49Speaker 00

  Oh, was there? Oh, yes, I remember that now. Yeah, the note, yeah.

• 15:52Speaker 01

  So what we're gonna do is then cover your speaker in jam. So wasps come over.

• 15:56Speaker 00

  Right.

• 15:56Speaker 01

  And you get stung by some wasps and then you blame the speaker.

• 15:58Speaker 00

  You're hoping I was gonna get stung by some wasps?

• 16:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 16:00Speaker 00

  And then I'd blame the speaker for getting me stung by a wasp?

• 16:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was kind of.

• 16:03Speaker 00

  Because it had what? Secreted jam?

• 16:07Speaker 01

  We weren't really thinking it through at this point. We were just always quite upset about the music.

• 16:10Speaker 00

  I just wanted to clear something out. Did you win a game of tummy sticks to spread jam onto my smart speaker?

• 16:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. So then I'd have been the holiday hero because I was the one who got you to stop playing your music.

• 16:22Speaker 00

  Right.

• 16:22Speaker 01

  And everyone would sort of like me.

• 16:24Speaker 00

  And you're staying at this hotel, are you?

• 16:26Speaker 01

  I'm over there with my fam.

• 16:27Speaker 00

  Because I didn't, I sort of.

• 16:28Speaker 01

  I'm over there with my wife.

• 16:29Speaker 00

  I didn't realise.

• 16:29Speaker 01

  Adults only.

• 16:30Speaker 00

  Uh, yeah, it's adults only that are able to integrate with the sort of the normal adult world.

• 16:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, it feels ridiculous now I'm over here saying all this.

• 16:39Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:40Speaker 01

  So, but are you all right to turn your music down?

• 16:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, are you all right to stop playing tummy sticks in the swimming pool?

• 16:47Speaker 01

  Sorry, yeah.

• 16:48Speaker 00

  Because, because we're both causing an issue, aren't we?

• 16:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:51Speaker 00

  Yeah, I, I've got my music up too loud. You've got your cock out in a pool.

• 16:58Speaker 01

  Well, you put it like that, mate.

• 16:59Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, it does.

• 17:00Speaker 00

  Yeah, okay, cool. All right, yeah, fuck off.

• 17:03Speaker 01

  See, would you like me to send you over a drink?

• 17:06Speaker 00

  No, I'm good, thank you.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  Look, bearing in mind the way it has in a text with his wife, well, he probably has, just not enough kids pool here.

• 17:12Speaker 00

  Right.

• 17:12Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 17:13Speaker 00

  That's not effective whether I'm gonna have a drink or not.

• 17:15Speaker 01

  See ya.

• 17:16Speaker 00

  Yeah, see ya, mate.

• 17:17Speaker 01

  So, yeah, yeah.

• 17:18Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think that, that, I hope that helps.

• 17:22Speaker 00

  Anyway, we do think the guy's a bit inconsiderate, but, but I think, I think there's a possibility. I know it sounds unlikely. It's a possibility that that guy thinks he's doing a public service.

• 17:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I do.

• 17:35Speaker 00

  That he thinks he's got great music taste.

• 17:37Speaker 01

  But I think sometimes.

• 17:37Speaker 00

  And there's no atmosphere at the pool. So let me just put some music on.

• 17:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think sometimes you just have to talk to the people.

• 17:42Speaker 00

  Hmm, yeah.

• 17:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, okay.

• 17:45Speaker 00

  And if he gets, he might get upset. He might get his feelings hurt.

• 17:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:49Speaker 00

  But that's part of life.

• 17:50Speaker 01

  That's life.

• 17:51Speaker 00

  That's life, baby.

• 17:51Speaker 01

  Sometimes you've got to eat those quavers before you crunch them.

• 17:58Speaker 01

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• 18:00Speaker 00

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• 18:10Speaker 01

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• 18:19Speaker 00

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• 19:32Speaker 04

  Bonjour compadre, it's the

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• 20:04Speaker 00

  Hey Wolf and Al, I have the unfortunate problem of having a rather large nose. My mates have always taken the piss out of me for it. And to be honest, I've always been completely fine with it. Oh, that's good. It's just normal lads banter and I can give as good as I get. The problem is that one of my mates has taken the joke so far and so often in front of other people. The people outside of our friendship group now seem to think it's fair game too. For example, during a rugby game recently, my coach shattered across the pitch asking if I was alright. And more importantly, how's your nose? This has met with laughter from everyone on the pitch, all at my expense. Normally, I'm pretty good at laughing things off, but it's got to the point where it's actually starting to bother me. Especially when it comes from people I don't know, people who aren't part of my usual circle. I haven't really got the same banter or comeback with strangers, so I end up just feeling a bit self-conscious and embarrassed.

• 20:48Speaker 00

  Have you got any advice on how I can deal with it or even just a way of changing my mindset so I don't feel so self-conscious about it? Particularly when it happens in front of people I don't know. Love the pod from the insecure Ibis.

• 20:58Speaker 01

  Is Ibis an animal?

• 20:59Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 21:00Speaker 01

  Oh, it's just hotel trained.

• 21:02Speaker 00

  Named after an animal.

• 21:03Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 21:05Speaker 00

  I've got a, this is going to blow your mind, Lion Bar.

• 21:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:11Speaker 01

  Listen, I sort of, there's an element of this one, I, I kind of, I can relate to a little bit.

• 21:18Speaker 00

  How can you relate to it?

• 21:19Speaker 01

  With the tool thing.

• 21:21Speaker 00

  Oh, I see.

• 21:21Speaker 01

  I think I was, there was, and also when I, yeah, I think growing up, I, you'd have that thing with a group of mates and then once it starts, the banter starts filtering out and it's people you don't know, it can become, it can become

• 21:38Speaker 01

  a little bit, yeah, I can see where you're coming from. It can become a bit too much. I think your first port of call is, is very difficult to do. You know, is to sort of have a chat with your, with your friends and just say that I think this, certainly the person who's sort of done this the most, but I think it's very hard then to, you don't want to alienate one person and go, look, you seem like you've taken this further than anyone else. Cause then all of a sudden it becomes a, it's like you're aiming a target at them. But I think having an actual chat with your mates and go, look, I think this is, it's gone too far. It's a really hard thing. I think there's a masculine, like a matter of masculinity here where

• 22:20Speaker 01

  I think we all take stuff on our shoulders when it comes to things like this and laugh it off or try and have banter back. But can actually that stigma and those jokes can, you can walk away from it and, and it can rest on you. And you can feel, and you can feel stupid for letting it be. Oh, it was just banter and whatever, but you, you've taken it as a personal slight. And I think those things can chip away at you over time. And before you know it, you're in a situation, you know, where your self-esteem gets hit and you start worrying that, oh yeah, am I, am I thinking too much about this or am I taking this too personally?

• 22:59Speaker 01

  And actually speaking to people and saying, look, you know, and it seems a really silly thing to turn around and go, oh, you got all to take a look at my nose, but do you know what? It fucking stung a bit the other week when someone, that happened and

• 23:15Speaker 01

  and I think the cold heart truth of it, I think that when you're in a group of lads and a group of men, and I don't think this ever really changes. I think people are very comfortable if the joke's on someone else and it's not on them. And that's the real thing. I think that people are vulnerable and people are worried about being a person under the microscope or being a person that everyone's getting a laugh from. So what they do is they hide within a group and they'll go, and I don't think that's always a personal thing. I think quite a lot of that comes from a vulnerability of just hoping it's not going to be them. So actually turning around and, and I'd say you will know the people in your group of friends, the people around you who are the people that are sensitive,

• 23:57Speaker 01

  more sensitive or the people that, who will actually listen to you and try then to go to them and go, look, this, that fucked me off the other day and that pissed me off. That, that upset me. And actually try to get that, don't go to the, don't, don't turn to the people that you know or will will basically turn around and say, well, it's just fucking banter. Or, oh, you know, he's going to become a lot of quiet, but he can't have it, he can't handle it. And then they'll, they'll make that a thing because what you have in a lot of these groups is you'll have a thing, I think it's called, it's like a victim blaming. It's a mirroring thing. So even if they feel guilty for the thing that they've done, instead of sort of admitting guilt, and this is a very male problem.

• 24:39Speaker 01

  Instead of turning around and going, oh, I do that. I'm sorry, I did that. That was wrong. I shouldn't have done that. They'll turn around and they'll feel guilty. But instead of actually sitting with that guilt and feeling that guilt, they'll flip it on to the person who's being vulnerable and turn around saying that, um, you know, that's upset me. And they'll, that, that will be the, the reaction for, for a certain amount of people within your group. So it's just finding the people you'd actually talk to and speak to.

• 25:05Speaker 01

  And, and not taking yourself out of the situation and, and realising that it might take some time. It's not going to happen. People are, you know, we don't live in a movie. We don't live in a sitcom. We don't live in a fucking drama where you say something, everyone goes, oh, actually we shouldn't. It will take people time to go, actually, no, that isn't acceptable behaviour. And a lot of that is age based. A lot of that comes through the shows of time, but I pick the people around you that have a sensitive adult way of seeing things. And let them be the people that, that help you hopefully sort of extinguish this kind of behaviour.

• 25:36Speaker 00

  Really great. Eloquent. Beautiful. I love the way you're sat, the way you delivered that whole thing.

• 25:41Speaker 01

  Thank you. It's in there somewhere.

• 25:42Speaker 00

  No notes.

• 25:45Speaker 00

  Uh, I actually, um, I actually think that, um,

• 25:51Speaker 00

  I, I think that you just need to tell your friends that you don't like this anymore. Do you know what I mean? At the end of the day, you've been, um, obviously like when I was growing up and obviously with my eye, you sort of, the self-defense mechanism is that you make jokes about it. I have to, you know, made jokes about it at gigs and made jokes about it on TV. And the problem is that everybody then thinks that it's fair games joke about it. And then it becomes very difficult for you to defend yourself because you've gone, it looks like you've been all right with, about it this whole time. But actually what you're doing is you're trying to get in there first or you're trying to laugh along. Because your other option is to go, this is a bit out of order.

• 26:29Speaker 00

  So I think you actually, um, it's just a thing of like your friends, if your, your friends should understand that you don't want to spend all of your social occasions sitting there worried about when it's going to come up, when one of them's going to decide to make this joke. Because then there's a situation where you're just, part of your brain is focused on that the whole time you're out and about. Or with your friends at all, and you don't want that. And your friends don't want that for you. So it's one of these things of, you know, I often think when you have to have an uncomfortable conversation with your friends and it might feel slightly uncomfortable. You've got, two things could happen. Either you don't ever say anything and you live the rest of your life like this and getting increasingly self-conscious. Or you have one unpleasant conversation or a difficult conversation and their behaviour changes.

• 27:15Speaker 00

  And, and this is often the case with things like this, is if people think that it's open season on a certain thing, then they will talk like that. The way that you're, the way that people conduct themselves is often led by the group or typically with blokes, it's led by one alpha in the group, the perceived alpha or whatever. And so I think it's, it's probably a thing where you've got to say to your friends, I don't really like, you know, I don't mind a couple of jokes, but this is sort of taking it too far and having the chat with them. And then if other people see that your friends, your close friends aren't making those sort of jokes, then the, the, the model that they're setting up there is that you don't say those sort of things. And it's like Tom said, people love,

• 27:57Speaker 00

  they see it as an easy way to get in. Do you know what I mean? They think, oh, they're all making a joke about that. I'm going to make a joke. They're all going to laugh and it's going to make me look good. Your friends should not be giving people those opportunities. So I think it's having a difficult conversation with them. But then you're on the other side of it and things become a lot easier, hopefully.

• 28:14Speaker 01

  And I would say as well, just to add to that, because that's amazing advice, is that when we're young, and I don't know if you agree with this, when you're young and you're in a place where you're in this big groups of, you, you have this thing that you don't want to fall out of anyone. You, you think all your mates are going to be your mates forever.

• 28:30Speaker 01

  And if you bring someone like this up and how you actually feel and no one goes along with that, that they're probably not worth hanging on to anyway. And that I understand because I carried too many fucking wrong ends around in my life for too long. And I look back now and think what they did and what they sucked away from me as a human being. And I actually think, I wish I'd just lost them at fucking 17 when I knew they were a prick, but I just held on because I didn't want to be like, you know, and I got too long in the tooth and too wrapped around the wrong sort of people. So have those hard conversations, but if people can't understand the maturity in which you're taking it, they're probably not worth knowing anyway.

• 29:06Speaker 00

  Thank you so much, Ibis. Good luck, uh, for the future.

• 29:13Speaker 01

  Hello Wolf, Al and Coyote. Oh god, Hull and Shin Hermit here, is that right?

• 29:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 29:20Speaker 01

  Literally just finished this Thursday's episode. When I heard Rom saying he needs a push on tickets in Hull, my hometown. I haven't got tickets yet as I didn't know you were coming here because I don't have social media of any kind.

• 29:33Speaker 00

  Just before you carry on, thank you for that. My PR will be getting sacked. Continue.

• 29:38Speaker 01

  After I took your advice to put my phone into the grayscale to help spend this time on it a few years back. I eventually got to the point where two years ago I didn't need it anymore and have no FOMO at all from not having it. So it all got deleted. Thank you. Well done you. Fucking hell. Credit to society. However, because of this, I do rely on friends and family to tell me when there are up and coming shows and events that I might be interested in. And yet somehow this one has slipped the net. I'll be buying tickets at the end of the month and I'll see you there.

• 30:07Speaker 00

  See you there.

• 30:08Speaker 01

  My question is, what are some good alternatives to stay up to date with what's going on in terms of shows and events without turning back to without turning back to social media where your algorithm knows what I'm interested in and make sure I know what's coming? Thanks so much. Love the podcast and generally get so excited to listen to it every week. The Hull and Shin Hermit, what a great name.

• 30:31Speaker 00

  Really good name.

• 30:32Speaker 01

  Really inventive.

• 30:32Speaker 00

  Tom, any advice?

• 30:34Speaker 01

  I mean, I'm a social media whore. Yeah, I'm an absolute whore for it.

• 30:38Speaker 00

  Yeah, absolute slut for it, aren't you?

• 30:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, my algorithm is fucking, yeah. Shout out Tommy Robinson.

• 30:47Speaker 00

  Big shout out Tommy.

• 30:49Speaker 01

  No, I, I, I don't know, that's, I, no, but saying that, I think there's things within the group of people I've got who who will mention something's happening or like, there's this happening, there's that, you know, Luke Combs when I went to watch it, Combs by the way, got that wrong, I've been saying it wrong the whole time. Luke Combs.

• 31:08Speaker 00

  It's Combs?

• 31:09Speaker 01

  Combs.

• 31:09Speaker 00

  Okay. And you're saying Coombs?

• 31:11Speaker 01

  Combs, yeah. So I, I, there's quite a few different things that I suppose around the gaggle of parents at the school gates or whatever you hear about things happening locally. I think it's just chatting to people, isn't it? Actually, you know what? I find that's one of the best things on holiday. Chat to people about where they're going, what they're doing.

• 31:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 31:30Speaker 01

  Like, you know.

• 31:31Speaker 00

  So yeah, go on holiday and try and chat some people and hopefully they can keep you updated.

• 31:35Speaker 01

  I think it's being more chatty about, you've probably got posters up and around Hull, I'd imagine.

• 31:40Speaker 00

  I, I do.

• 31:41Speaker 01

  By the way, can I say, the one show of his that hasn't sold, he's sold out the O2 to nearly three nights in a row now.

• 31:49Speaker 00

  Two nights.

• 31:50Speaker 01

  Two nights, sold out. This guy's, so you're now, by the way, and I'm very proud of you, you're an incredible arena act. Like, you've sold out the, I looked at your tickets the other day, like, your poster came up on social media. I was like, the sold outs are so fucking depressing for the rest of us. I was like, this guy's fucking.

• 32:05Speaker 00

  Well, they shouldn't be depressing if it's a friend that it's happening to.

• 32:07Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no, but yeah, no, I'm happy for you, but I'm like, fucking hell, this guy's nailing it. Hard and nice.

• 32:12Speaker 00

  That's what happens if you put the, if you put the tour on sale 10 years before the tour starts, you can sell those tickets.

• 32:18Speaker 01

  Hull, but, but the issue, Hull is.

• 32:21Speaker 00

  Hull, I think, yeah, I don't.

• 32:23Speaker 01

  I bet it's, it's selling nice now.

• 32:25Speaker 00

  Hmm, who knows?

• 32:26Speaker 01

  But what, what should we be doing more to let, because like, there is weirdly actually, there's a lot of times where I will play somewhere and then put up that I've been there or.

• 32:35Speaker 00

  And people go, I didn't know.

• 32:36Speaker 01

  I didn't know you were there.

• 32:37Speaker 00

  Well, I, if you've not got social media,

• 32:41Speaker 00

  I would, I would like put a list together, all the people that you're interested in seeing and then sign up to their mailing lists. Like, go to their website, sign up to their mailing list. And also, a lot of like music streaming, if it's music gigs or for anybody, it will, if you follow certain artists, it will pull out who's playing in your area.

• 33:03Speaker 01

  Oh really?

• 33:03Speaker 00

  Soon, and then it will, it will notify you. So like, I've got notified by music gigs through that quite a lot. So I think it's because you're not on social media and those things aren't being delivered to you passively, I think you just have to be a bit more front footed about it and kind of look for the sort of things you're into. And then like, often on like ticket sale websites, you can put in what your interests are and then it will let you know. Like, you go, I'm into, I don't know, I'm into hip hop or whatever, and then it will start sending you when things are near you. So I think you just have to be a bit more front footed about it in a way that with social media, just sort of let it come to you.

• 33:37Speaker 01

  You should, you could meet this guy in Hull, by the way.

• 33:40Speaker 00

  I could do if I had any inclination to do that, but, but it's just, I don't think that's. I'm, look, I'm happy to meet you, but I don't want to, I mean, what Tom's suggesting is we meet, we like properly meet up.

• 33:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 33:53Speaker 00

  I don't think either of us would enjoy that.

• 33:56Speaker 01

  I don't know. He's not on social media, you don't do a lot of it now.

• 33:59Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 34:00Speaker 01

  You've really pulled back.

• 34:01Speaker 00

  Do you think so? Is that upsetting you?

• 34:03Speaker 01

  No, I, you said, I, there was a certain element there that I used to get a kick out of putting up certain things in my stories.

• 34:08Speaker 00

  No, I do still look.

• 34:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, but you'd comment.

• 34:12Speaker 00

  Oh, I see, right.

• 34:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like being seen.

• 34:19Speaker 00

  I mean, I'm currently deleting Instagram for days at a time and then downloading again, I feel like.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  I just, I'm like, I, do you know what? I don't, genuinely, I don't use it half, I don't look at it as much as I used to.

• 34:30Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 34:31Speaker 01

  If I had the inclination to put something up, I'll put it up. I don't spend ages on it.

• 34:34Speaker 00

  No.

• 34:36Speaker 01

  I've actually fallen into a bad habit. I've got a little bit too into X and West to comment on, but how bad West Ham are. That's become quite addictive at the moment.

• 34:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, I get that.

• 34:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, I've, I've noticed on social media, on videos, I've noticed this on my videos and I'm assuming it's happened to other videos, but I don't know because I don't know what the origins of that are. But where people basically imprint in their comment what they think is happening in that video. And what I mean by that is they'll go, these two clearly don't get on, right? Or, you know, like, not about us, but like, they'll watch a video and they'll go, I like the way, I don't know, I like the way Romesh got shut down there, for example, right? And that isn't what happened in the video, but people watch it and then they have their own interpretation of what they think happened. Or, his mum was clearly pissed off with him in that or whatever. So they'll just like, imagine what they're,

• 35:29Speaker 00

  they'll extrapolate what they think is going on. My desire to correct them

• 35:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 35:35Speaker 00

  is so strong, but I don't, I don't ever, because it's the sort of thing, you just have to accept that some people are going to take it, because you can't go around mopping up everybody's kind of fucking different interpretations of what's happening in that thing.

• 35:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I, I, I do comment.

• 35:50Speaker 00

  Oh, you thought I was having a dig at you, didn't you?

• 35:52Speaker 01

  No, no, but I comment, I, I get pissed.

• 35:54Speaker 00

  I know you do, I know you do, occasionally. But that's not a bad thing. But what I mean is any sort of, I don't want to, I don't want another thing to take up my time.

• 36:01Speaker 01

  You know what? I don't actually, if it's a real proper person, I'm like, cool, okay, you have your own type of opinion. I think all gloves are off. If you're a fucking idiot who's on any social media, you've got a picture of a caravan or a fucking cat or something like that. I, I live in a world where you, you're fee game and everyone should just go in on you. Because I just think, we live in a world now where you think you have carte blanche to say and do, your, your name, you're not, none of the rules of society are applicable to you. So you can go and say whatever you want. You almost treat social media like the wild west. You can bowl around just fucking from town to town like a lone gun, gun person shooting down whoever you want.

• 36:37Speaker 00

  With this analogy, aren't you?

• 36:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, but my point is, I think that the, the, you're a lower level of fucking human being if you can't just go, oh no, this is me. So someone puts up something and I go, okay, that's Claire or John or whatever and go, that's, that's it. You're Dan or, yeah.

• 36:53Speaker 00

  Steven.

• 36:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, or Vern. I, I look at it and go, right, cool, that's their opinion. And they're, they're, but I just think if you're playing by this whole game of like, oh yeah, well, I'm into caravans, you know, have a good caravan, my favourite thing, and I want my, my profile pictures, I'm like, you sad fuck. Well, you're just, I just don't think you're playing by the rules.

• 37:11Speaker 00

  Yeah, I am, I, we had a video from the Romesh Ranganathan show the other day, and obviously like, you know, I'm regularly getting this colour on one fingernail. Somebody said that one finger, the original comment was, I was laughing at this clip until I saw the fingernail and we know what that means, right? And somebody said, what does it mean? And he said, it's a signal for, to notify other people that are of the same persuasion that you're a paedophile.

• 37:44Speaker 00

  So he said, I have basically, this is like a universal sign for being a paedophile, right? It's like a secret thing. And then so people have gone, people have gone, that sounds like, obviously it sounds insane. They've gone, it sounds insane. The problem is if you're like a conspiracy theorist or whatever, there's nothing that can dissuade you of that thing. So he's gone, I can't believe you don't know that. And they go, do you not think it would be mad for a paedophile to identify themselves with like a a fingernail convention? And he's gone, yeah, well, they've got you too, I guess, or whatever. And this guy's like, he, he's not stopped. He's, that, that video went up weeks ago. He still keeps going, Romesh is part, basically he's insinuating that I'm part of a paedophile ring.

• 38:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:26Speaker 00

  So I got in touch with, like my, like the guys at Curb and the social team, and I said, I know that people are allowed to say they don't like you, but this guy is insinuating publicly that I'm a nonce.

• 38:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 38:38Speaker 00

  Is there some sort of, and they said, I don't know, I don't know what the rules are about that sort of thing. But the guys, I mean, am I allowed to, can I take legal action? The guy's saying I'm a fucking paedophile.

• 38:48Speaker 01

  You should be able to sue him. But has he got a profile that's him?

• 38:51Speaker 00

  He looks like it.

• 38:52Speaker 01

  Then you should sue the fuck out of that guy. I mean, yeah.

• 38:56Speaker 00

  I mean, I don't, I don't, I've not looked at his profile, but Harry, stop fucking saying I'm a nonce. Uh, thank you so much for listening and watching the Wolf and Al podcast email special.

• 39:08Speaker 01

  [email protected]

• 39:11Speaker 00

  Please could you send in any questions, queries or stories? Tom's after some stories, aren't you?

• 39:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think funny stories.

• 39:17Speaker 00

  Some like really funny stories or anything tummy stick related. [email protected]. We will see you next time. Peace.