Sam Vanderpump: Why I’m Fighting For Organ Donation

For Organ Donation Week, Sam Vanderpump's shares his life-changing health battle that began with a liver disease he was diagnosed with at just 4 years old. Sam opens up about the moment he was confronted with the possibility of dying, the fear of not seeing his future child, and why understanding the signs of sepsis could save lives. He also explains why he is campaigning for greater awareness around organ donation and shares the story of his friend Daniel, whose decision to donate his organs saved four lives. NHS Organ Donation Register - https://linkly.link/2tqu7 (00:00) Intro (01:03) Diagnosed With Liver Disease(04:38) Sam Develops Life-Threatening Sepsis(14:30) Told He Needs A Transplant (16:18) Why Organ Donation Matters Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

• 0:02Speaker 00

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• 0:30Speaker 01

  Welcome to We're Talking. This organ donation week, I sit down with Maiden Chelsea star Sam Vanderpump to discuss the life-changing health battle that led him to become an advocate for organ donation.

• 0:56Speaker 01

  Let's talk about this health condition that you're facing. Because when I, as a father, as a husband, when I think about what you are going through, I can't fathom it. To the point where there was high interest for me to sit down with you because I truly want to understand how you are feeling in this moment with everything you're dealing with. So just to describe, what is it that you're dealing with?

• 1:34Speaker 02

  I'll take you from the beginning.

• 1:37Speaker 02

  I was diagnosed at the age of four with a liver disease, congenital hepatic fibrosis. My mom spotted it because when I was four years of age, I was a very poorly baby, actually. I was born eight weeks early.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:53Speaker 02

  I had a collapsed lung. I was in an incubator. I died twice.

• 1:57Speaker 01

  In the incubator?

• 1:58Speaker 02

  I think, yeah, I had a collapsed lung. They put a tube into me. I mean, I like, flatlined, I think, twice.

• 2:03Speaker 01

  My goodness.

• 2:03Speaker 02

  Once or twice. You know, I was very poorly. And then a few weeks later, sent out into the world healthy. We thought I was healthy.

• 2:13Speaker 02

  So they dealt with a very, you know, it must have been very hard for my mom, my father, my whole family, my grandmother, everyone. But I was fine, you know, they dealt with it. You know, I was fine. Four years of age. My mom looks at me in the swimming pool and she goes, "Sam's figure doesn't look right." And because I'm not, I wasn't a chubby baby or a chubby child. I had very skinny arms. But I had this extended belly. But it wasn't, it wasn't like, there was no fact, it was like I was pregnant.

• 2:52Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:53Speaker 02

  And my mom couldn't get over it in her head. So she took me to the hospital. And she says, I mean, obviously, I don't remember any of this. I was four. They ran frantically, all over the place. Because they did some tests. And at first, they thought I had cystic fibrosis.

• 3:10Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 3:11Speaker 02

  Which is, I believe, fibrosis on the lungs. They did their series of testing. A biopsy, skin, I've still got the scar here today. Huge scar. Must have been a big, big piece of skin they took. A series of testing and they diagnosed me with liver congenital hepatic fibrosis. And they very much at that age said, "Okay, Sam's got this liver disease. From what we know now, his liver function is fine, but one day, he may need a liver transplant." So we knew about this from the age of four.

• 3:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 3:47Speaker 02

  But then over the next, and they said, you know, "Sam's got to be careful. Can't be punched in the liver." Not that I would, you know, not everyone goes and gets punched in the liver, but you've got to be careful. I couldn't do rugby or stuff like that. And I was seen every, quite regularly in the hospital, at the Royal Free, Great Ormond Street Hospital. But as I got older, and my experience that I will tell you is, I had this conversation with my mom recently, is very different to her experience.

• 4:18Speaker 02

  But I'll tell you my experience. So as I've grown up, I've known I've had this disease. And I, but I didn't pay it much attention because I was always told to live my life normally. So from four to the age of 27, I would go every three months to the hospital. And that would be spaced out to every six months to every year. Every single appointment, they would do bloods, urine. "Your liver function's fantastic." So at age of four, I might need a liver transplant at 16. We're now 27. "Absolutely fine. We don't need to see you till next year." Well, nothing's going to happen at this rate. You kind of start to think, not you're invincible.

• 5:01Speaker 02

  You don't, and you know, but you think it was, this wasn't going to ever affect me.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 5:07Speaker 02

  And then last year, very weirdly, never been hit by anything. I was, I thought I got the flu. Had a little bit of an asthma attack. I've always had asthma. And I started to get really, couldn't get better. And couldn't get better. And I had this really bad back pain. So I was seeing the GP. Went into A&E a few times. Couldn't, I had my asthma under control from A&E admissions.

• 5:35Speaker 02

  But I couldn't get rid of this back pain. And I didn't, and I always felt like I had the flu. And this persisted for another two weeks. And we were getting close to Christmas.

• 5:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 5:46Speaker 02

  We weren't doing any of the Christmas things that we wanted to do, Alice and I.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  Why? Because you were just poorly?

• 5:53Speaker 02

  Just poorly.

• 5:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:55Speaker 02

  Didn't go, we loved to go to Winter Wonderland, like nearly every other day. We went once.

• 6:02Speaker 02

  And I really wanted to do my Christmas shopping. So I really got myself out of bed. Because I was so excited to get my friends and my fiance, now fiance. At the time, she was only my girlfriend. I was excited to get everyone's presents. So I was like, "We're going shopping. We're going to Harrods."

• 6:21Speaker 01

  Of course, we're going to Harrods.

• 6:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I was extremely thirsty. I had a liter bottle of water. And I drunk the whole thing in an hour. I was so dehydrated. I thought I was so dehydrated. I went to Alice. I can't quench my thirst. After being there for an hour, I went, I was sitting down. I was doing a friend's engagement present. And I was sitting down, and I was going, and I had more to do, more shopping. And I went to Alice. "I can't do this. I feel too ill. I feel like really flu-y. I need to go home." For the next two days, I basically laid in bed.

• 6:54Speaker 02

  Alice thought I was taking too much codeine for the back pain. I wasn't. I was taking normal amounts. But that's, the symptoms I was posing were that of delirium, dehydration. Now, you look back on it, I was a little bit jaundice.

• 7:13Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 7:14Speaker 02

  I was a little bit crusty lips. And you don't, you don't put two and two together because you've never experienced anything like that. So you couldn't, you didn't recognize the signs. That's why I'm such a massive advocate for the sets of signs today.

• 7:26Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 7:26Speaker 02

  We didn't recognize the signs. We didn't know what those signs was. What was happening? We've got, well, on the Monday, I was meant to be flying to Dubai for work. And Alice came back from her work and I was still in bed. Hadn't moved. She went, "Something's wrong." She spoke to my mom. They got me into A&E. When I got into A&E, they went, "Yeah, you're not well, are you?" So they were like, they couldn't understand at first. I did my bloods. And the doctor came back and he went, "You're not, you're not well, are you, Sam?" And I went, "No, I really don't feel well. There's something wrong in my body." He went, "Yeah, you're going into organ failure." My CRP was up in the 400s.

• 8:03Speaker 01

  Okay. And CRP is that what?

• 8:07Speaker 02

  Protein.

• 8:09Speaker 01

  Almost tests, I think, inflammation of, yeah, in your body.

• 8:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:13Speaker 02

  And it shows, so normally, your normal level should be below three milligrams.

• 8:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 8:18Speaker 02

  You know, zero to 100, there's a mild infection. 100 to 200, serious infection, get to A&E. Mine was in the 400s.

• 8:25Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 8:25Speaker 02

  Like, basically borderline. The next, the next step from that is basically you're dead. Right, that infection rate is, they were. The doctor was white in the face from seeing that infection rate.

• 8:36Speaker 01

  How close do you believe you were to dying in that moment?

• 8:41Speaker 02

  I mean, so we don't think at that point, we really knew. It wasn't until I came out of hospital, a week, two weeks, three weeks later, where I spoke to one of the doctors who had seen me. And she went, "Look, we obviously weren't going to say it to you at the time." And I laughed from, I don't know, of trauma properly. But you, we didn't know if you were going to make it. You know, you were touch and go. You know, you came to us and we were like, phew, 50/50. Yeah, that that was a big shock to hear from one of the doctors when we heard that. That that made just like major stomach sink.

• 9:17Speaker 01

  Absolutely. And this was sepsis.

• 9:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, so due to my condition, so this is all later found with later testing and everything, the journey for the last year. Was what had happened is with my liver disease, when your liver starts, so I have fibrosis of my liver. So basically imagine a liver, a nice, smooth organ. Mine's very bumpy.

• 9:42Speaker 02

  And those bumps are the fibrosis and your biliary tree is where the bile passes through your liver.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 9:49Speaker 02

  And the bumps have started constricting that biliary tree, stopping the bile from moving. When the bile can't move, it sits and bacteria can gather and start an infection. So what had happened is obviously my disease has progressed over so many years. But now to a point where that bacteria can build and I can get these infections. And we didn't recognize I had an infection. And because we didn't recognize, that infection became septic.

• 10:19Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 10:20Speaker 02

  Now, sepsis is any infection that gets out of control.

• 10:24Speaker 01

  Interesting. Okay.

• 10:25Speaker 02

  Any infection, blood poisoning, you know, so there's there's common misconceptions. But any infection in your body that gets out of control is is sepsis.

• 10:33Speaker 01

  All right. And when it gets out of control, what is it? Is it that your your your body is basically attacking itself?

• 10:39Speaker 02

  Well, it starts, all the infection starts spreading into all the other parts of your body.

• 10:43Speaker 01

  Hmm. You you know, so.

• 10:45Speaker 02

  It runs rapid.

• 10:46Speaker 01

  What what I didn't.

• 10:47Speaker 02

  And starts to shut down your organs.

• 10:49Speaker 01

  I I was so ignorant to what sepsis was, and I think this is in part. Yeah, what what's what's beautiful about what you're doing is you're helping to destroy ignorance, right? I started looking at sepsis, you know, with with you coming in and and there's these are some stats that I didn't realize. And and and some of these are dark. So.

• 11:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:12Speaker 01

  One is, in the UK, five people die every hour.

• 11:17Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 11:17Speaker 01

  From from sepsis. The Sepsis Trust estimates about forty eight thousand people die each year from sepsis-related illnesses. However, thousands are preventable.

• 11:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:31Speaker 01

  I didn't know this.

• 11:31Speaker 02

  Just by recognizing the signs. So like like me, I mean, now I look back on it. And I've had infections since and never got to that stage because you look back on it, if you've got a temperature, if you've got a a fever, if you've got, if you're dehydrated, if you've got extreme pains. These are like, I mean, I know it's funny, but these are, you think, when I say them like that, it's like, oh, yeah, that's obvious signs to get into hospital. But when they're happening and then they they progress quickly, you don't recognize them. So as clearly as the stats say, people don't recognize them.

• 12:05Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 12:06Speaker 02

  And sometimes it's not all of them. Sometimes it can just be one of them. So it's about understanding what those signs are. And if you have any, get into the A and E.

• 12:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 12:18Speaker 02

  Rule it out.

• 12:19Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 12:19Speaker 02

  Make sure it's not.

• 12:21Speaker 01

  So the.

• 12:22Speaker 02

  Ask the question, could it be sepsis?

• 12:24Speaker 01

  It could be fair. So the core signs from your experience were, just for us to to to to unpack it.

• 12:31Speaker 02

  Fever, temperature, delirium and dehydration.

• 12:37Speaker 01

  Dehydration.

• 12:37Speaker 02

  I I got to a stage where I was quite bad, so I was experiencing all the signs.

• 12:42Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 12:42Speaker 02

  Yeah. Now I know, and testament to this, now I know those signs. Every time I've had a reinfection since, I've got straight into A and E, I've got on antibiotics and I've been fine. I've been out within a few days. So now I understand the signs. I don't think I'll ever become septic again, and I don't think I'll ever have a fear, touch wood, wherever it may be, that I would ever, you know, be in that position again because I understand the signs.

• 13:09Speaker 01

  All right.

• 13:09Speaker 02

  So it's about understanding them.

• 13:10Speaker 01

  Fair. This is very important, very important.

• 13:12Speaker 02

  Extremely.

• 13:13Speaker 01

  The, was it the sepsis that then required your need for a liver transplant? No, this is something else.

• 13:23Speaker 02

  It's what what it was, the sepsis was came from my liver disease. So the infection came from my liver disease, which came out of control, which became septic. But the the core problem was my liver disease, which is why I need a liver transplant. I get this notification on the NHS app. Alice is at work. I'm home alone. And I go, oh, it's a letter from King's College. I get a letter after every appointment. Open it up and it's literally a four-line letter and it goes, Dear Sam, after reviewing your latest E T scan, these are in line with your condition. We're sending you for liver transplant assessment.

• 14:04Speaker 02

  I mean, that was, yeah, receiving that, I think your heart, yeah, your heart stops, your tummy drops.

• 14:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:17Speaker 01

  In that moment, when you, if we can go back and revisit that moment, you're describing emotively what's happening. What are you thinking in that moment?

• 14:30Speaker 02

  Fear.

• 14:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, terrified.

• 14:36Speaker 01

  Fear of what?

• 14:38Speaker 02

  Am I gonna die?

• 14:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:46Speaker 01

  You're engaged.

• 14:47Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 14:48Speaker 01

  You know that you are a father-to-be. How does that impact your thoughts?

• 14:59Speaker 02

  I always get sad when I think my dad's never gonna see his grandchild. So now to start having that thing dawning on you, am I gonna see my child?

• 15:10Speaker 02

  That's terrifying.

• 15:15Speaker 01

  This is the part, Sam, that I can't, I can't fathom, you know?

• 15:19Speaker 02

  So we have an opt-out system in the UK for organ donation. So everyone automatically thinks, oh, my organs would be donated. Actually, what happens is one percent of deaths are likely for you to be able to give your organs. Because obviously a lot of deaths aren't make, your organs won't be viable for transplant.

• 15:39Speaker 01

  Okay, wow, I did not know this.

• 15:40Speaker 02

  Only one percent of deaths.

• 15:41Speaker 01

  Only one percent of deaths are viable for transplant, for for organ donation.

• 15:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 15:46Speaker 02

  So what that means, and those circumstances of those deaths are usually ones of surprise. So they haven't had those conversations. So yes, we're an opt-out system, but what happens? Imagine, and this is quite crass, I'm gonna give you the imagined imaginary situation. Imagine

• 16:08Speaker 02

  a young lad has been hit by a car.

• 16:12Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 16:12Speaker 02

  His organs are fine. That family, we've got an opt-out system, transplant coordinators come to speak to the family. The family go, okay, so there's an opt-out system, so yes, we can, but the family can still opt out. And ninety, fifty percent of the time, they do because they don't know the intentions or the wishes of their children.

• 16:33Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 16:33Speaker 02

  So fifty percent of the time, those organs aren't donated. Now, if everyone confirms their decision of what they want, then that increases to ninety percent. And that's why there's a necessity to confirm your decision.

• 16:48Speaker 01

  All right.

• 16:48Speaker 02

  And that's what I'm trying to raise awareness for.

• 16:51Speaker 01

  I see.

• 16:51Speaker 02

  And the really, really hard-hitting fact, right? Did you know you're two to three times more likely to need an organ than you are likely to be able to give an organ?

• 17:00Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 17:01Speaker 02

  So there is more chance, and I'm sorry to be crass here with your family.

• 17:05Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 17:05Speaker 02

  There's more chance that someone in your family would need an organ than any of you would be likely to ever give an organ.

• 17:11Speaker 01

  Which shows the importance of.

• 17:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's like, and then there's the big ethical debate. If you're willing to take an organ from someone, surely you should be willing to give your organs.

• 17:20Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 17:20Speaker 02

  It's an extremely complex issue. All I'm advocating for is if you know you want to give your organs, just confirm your decision. Because fifty percent of the time, if you did die in a manner where your organs would be viable, your family wouldn't donate it. So go confirm your decision and make sure that they know what that is. Have that conversation with them, but also confirm it online. So there is, you know, it's already been done. It takes the pressure off them.

• 17:47Speaker 01

  What what their wishes are. So so looking at organ donation too, is this is just mind-blowing if you look at the numbers. Over eight thousand people in the UK are currently waiting for an organ transplant. Six hundred and fifty people in the UK are currently waiting for a liver.

• 18:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:03Speaker 01

  Transplant. And in twenty twenty-two to twenty twenty-three, almost five hundred people died simply by by waiting on the transplant list, which, to your point, underscores the importance of this because those organs were available.

• 18:22Speaker 02

  Like, I literally just shivered all over, the hairs standing up on my legs.

• 18:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's it's just, it's just one of those where it is a.

• 18:31Speaker 02

  I mean, that's five hundred unnecessary deaths.

• 18:35Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:37Speaker 01

  Yes, yes. So then currently, you are on a waiting list.

• 18:43Speaker 02

  I'm being sent for a liver transplant assessment. There's another dilemma to the whole.

• 18:49Speaker 02

  Before you go on the list, they have to make sure you're gonna survive the surgery effectively. And less, less big of a deal for me, you know, I'm a fit. I like to believe I'm fit and healthy and young and, you know, whatever.

• 19:05Speaker 02

  There's obviously a lot of other people that are a little bit elderly,

• 19:10Speaker 02

  pre-existing other conditions which can implicate things. So that it makes it harder for them to survive the surgery. So those numbers, you said it doesn't even take into account all of those people that actually need a transplant list, but don't even get onto the waiting list.

• 19:24Speaker 01

  Wow, so physically you have to be at a certain level.

• 19:28Speaker 02

  Survive a 12-hour surgery. It's a special.

• 19:29Speaker 01

  It's a 12-hour surgery?

• 19:30Speaker 02

  For a liver transplant, yeah.

• 19:32Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 19:32Speaker 02

  So kidneys are amazing, right? They transplant them like through keyhole surgery. We're so advanced on kidney. But liver, slightly more tricky. And obviously, as you go up the vital organs, it gets even trickier, you know? Heart and lung being a very, very... I mean, I think we did the world's first double lung transplant the other day.

• 19:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 19:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. Amazing. I mean, it's fantastic.

• 19:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, but if you look at the advances of medical technology, it's just, it's a blessing to be alive, you know, in this day and age.

• 20:09Speaker 02

  You've hit on something really, really important. And this is why I'm an optimist. This is why I'm a positive person. And I don't go, what? I did for one day, go, why me? Why does it happen to me when I had my breakdown? But I go, how lucky am I that I'm living in this timeframe? If I was born in my grandad's or before, I wouldn't be so lucky. I wouldn't make it past my mid 30s, you know? So I'm lucky. I'm lucky to be born in this timeframe where we're able to do a liver transplant. Nearly every day we do one.

• 20:44Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 20:44Speaker 02

  Every day we're doing a liver transplant. I mean, how amazing is that?

• 20:48Speaker 01

  Yes. And then also the fact that you're going to receive a liver from someone who wanted.

• 20:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:57Speaker 01

  You know?

• 20:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's amazing.

• 21:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, that, I mean, that's beautiful.

• 21:03Speaker 02

  Ah, yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, I hope, I had a really good friend,

• 21:11Speaker 02

  a guy named Daniel Werbe. Unfortunately, a couple of years ago, he passed away from a brain aneurysm. And the way I describe him was the kindest man you'll ever meet, much like yourself.

• 21:24Speaker 01

  Thank you, thank you.

• 21:25Speaker 02

  You have that nice, genuine aura to you and quite like him. Just a very kind person. And he had that conversation with his family a month before and said, if I was to pass away, why wouldn't I give my organs to someone who needs them? I don't need them anymore. And he said this to his family. So when that time came, he saved four people's lives. His sister reached out to me recently and spoke to me. And she said, thank you for raising awareness on your story because it made me realize how important it is to keep speaking about Daniel's story. And that really touched me. I mean, that's humanity at its best, right? I mean, I've received thousands of messages.

• 22:10Speaker 02

  It's obviously, there's a big thing about you with livers. You can do live transplants. And there is, it shows humanity at its finest. I have not seen one negative message, you know? Thousands of these messages. And I sometimes see some of them pop up. And, you know, there are so many. I wish I could reply to them all. But I mean, I would spend all day on social media replying to messages.

• 22:32Speaker 02

  And there are people who are offering to do the live transplant, to give half their livers. And I think that is humanity at its finest.

• 22:42Speaker 01

  Think about, I mean, think about that.

• 22:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:44Speaker 01

  Isn't that, you know, we talk so much about how terrible society is.

• 22:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:51Speaker 01

  But then here you have all of these people who probably have never met you.

• 22:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:56Speaker 01

  Willing to give up half their liver for you.

• 22:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, you'll sit here with me and you'll see that I talk about everything in a positive light. And you'll see that Alice, you know, what she says about me in that video. I'm such a positive person. So I see everything for the, I see people for the better. And I see all the optimism. And that's all I, all I talk about. I talk about the goodness, you know? I think strive to be in the light, keep away from the dark.

• 23:22Speaker 01

  Absolutely. And if you want to hear the full, unfiltered stories from today's guest, you can check them out on the We Need to Talk page. Drop a like, leave a comment and hit subscribe. See you next week.

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