This is the Best Android Update Ever

Marques, Andrew, and David start this episode off by diving straight into the new Snap Specs . Then it's all about the new Google Home Speaker with Gemini and everything Android 17. They wrap it up by talking about the proposed U. K social media legislation as well as the ongoing Anthropic vs U. S government debacle. Of course, we wrap it all up with trivia. Enjoy! Links: Snap Specs AWE XR - Snap Specs reveal CNBC - Interview with Evan Spiegel Google Home Speaker In Depth Tech Reviews - Android 17 video Reddit - Android 17 Megathread The Verge - Inside the fight over Claude This episode brought to you by: Framer: https://www.framer.com/wave Shopify: https://www.shopify.com/wave Follow us on socials: Marques: https://twitter.com/MKBHD Andrew: https://www.instagram.com/andrew_manganelli/ David: https://www.instagram.com/davidimel/ Adam: https://www.instagram.com/parmesanpapi17/ Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin Rufus: https://www.instagram.com/rmullhaupt/ Mariah: https://www.instagram.com/totallynotabusinessacc/?hl=en Waveform: Twitter: https://twitter.com/WVFRM Threads: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/waveformpodcast/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Intro/Outro music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Andrew Manganelli?

  This episode is brought to you by On Investing, an original podcast from Charles Schwab. Each week, host Lizanne Saunders, Schwab's Chief Investment Strategist, and Colin Martin, Head of Fixed Income Research and Strategy for the Schwab Center for Financial Research, bring your fresh insights on what's happening in the markets and why, and what the implications might be for your portfolio. Join Colin and Lizanne as they explore questions like, how do you evaluate corporate bonds that look interesting? And what sectors are on the move right now? Download the latest episodes and subscribe at schwab.com/oninvesting or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 0:33Speaker 01

  Support for the show comes from Jira by Atlassian. AI is only as useful as the context it has to work from, but when that context is scattered across tools, threads, and DMs, that means your team and your AI agents end up flying blind. That's the problem that Jira solves. What's the goal tied to your project? What got decided last week in Slack? Atlassian's teamwork graph pulls all these pieces together, from Jira, Confluence, Slack, GitHub, and more, so nothing falls through the cracks. With Jira, you can actually share that context with the AI agents you already use, like Claude, Cursor, and GitHub Copilot, assign them work directly, or connect your agents through MCP. Spend less time digging through endless links and DMs, less time chasing down what got decided and by who, and more time actually shipping. Learn more at jira.com.

• 1:18Speaker 01

  That's J-I-R-A dot com. I have exactly one smart outlet, and every year around the holidays, the Christmas tree goes in that one, and it turns on at a certain hour, turns off at a certain hour.

• 1:28David Imel?

  Oh, nice. Why don't you use that for other things?

• 1:30Speaker 01

  Like what?

• 1:31David Imel?

  Like lamps that you don't want to put a smart bulb in.

• 1:34Speaker 01

  Lamps? I don't really use lamps. I don't think I...

• 1:38Speaker 03

  I'm sorry.

• 1:38Speaker 01

  Wait, what? I don't think I have any lamps.

• 1:40Andrew Manganelli?

  This is... What's the meme of like, I don't like the big lights, I just like the little lights?

• 1:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45Speaker 03

  Do you have a single lamp in your house?

• 1:47Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:48David Imel?

  No.

• 1:48Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:49Speaker 03

  How?

• 1:54Speaker 01

  Yo, what is up people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts, I'm Marquez.

• 1:59Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm Andrew.

• 2:00David Imel?

  I'm David.

• 2:01Speaker 01

  Still got that Knicks jersey on.

• 2:02David Imel?

  Still.

• 2:02Speaker 01

  Very nice.

• 2:03Andrew Manganelli?

  I've never taken it off.

• 2:04David Imel?

  I've been a fan for 15 days.

• 2:05Speaker 01

  It must be good luck. Today's episode, we got Google's releases, including Android 17. We gotta talk about that. Also, multiple AR XR glasses have come out. Multiple tech bans have happened. And also new matter updates. So we got a whole bunch of stuff to talk about.

• 2:23David Imel?

  It matters.

• 2:23Speaker 01

  It does matter.

• 2:24Andrew Manganelli?

  And just in case you're wondering if this episode's a little late, it might be because the Knicks won the NBA Finals.

• 2:31Speaker 01

  Woo!

• 2:31Andrew Manganelli?

  Adam is a big Knicks fan.

• 2:33David Imel?

  Wait, the Knicks won the NBA Finals?

• 2:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Adam's going to the parade. We're also recording this late because Marquez was just in Rome and flew back like an hour ago.

• 2:42Speaker 01

  I just landed.

• 2:43David Imel?

  He landed an hour.

• 2:44Speaker 01

  An hour ago.

• 2:45Andrew Manganelli?

  So we're starting late, we're editing late. Maybe we'll be on time. If so, Adam's a bigger MVP than Jalen Brunson.

• 2:51David Imel?

  Hey, hey, hey, wow. Well, I mean, kinda true.

• 2:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Always true. I mean, true even if it's super late, but.

• 2:57David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 2:58Andrew Manganelli?

  We here, we're still here.

• 3:00David Imel?

  Yeah, if you make it to the end of the episode, you can comment, Adam is the real MVP. Speaking of Jalen Brunson though, I just gotta mention, look, that guy can stop so fast. You know, Wemby's tripping all over him. Those refs are not calling nothing on Wemby. He's like making jumps, going for his ACL.

• 3:17Andrew Manganelli?

  David knows ball!

• 3:18David Imel?

  Freaking crazy. Also, Cat was like very underrepresented. He is really the reason they won game one and two, which is crazy. But in the 15 days, the long 15 days that I've been covering, like following basketball, that hand of OG tip off, I watched that live was probably the best basketball I've ever seen in 15 days. It was crazy.

• 3:37Speaker 03

  It's the only and it's the best.

• 3:39Speaker 01

  I mean, it was one of the first games of basketball I had ever watched and all the announcers were like, I think this is the best game I've ever seen in my life. And I was like, good time to start.

• 3:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Was it Charles Barkley that was like, that was a world clash choked, or what did he say? It was the dumbest team in the history of civilization, the way the Spurs lost that game?

• 3:58Speaker 01

  It was tough to watch.

• 3:59David Imel?

  That's pretty rough to say.

• 4:01Speaker 01

  I was in the Garden for that and shout out to, yeah, my dad's a big Knicks fan, lifetime Knicks fan. Decided on a whim to take him to a game. That was the game we went to. Probably the greatest Knicks game of all time.

• 4:12David Imel?

  Definitely.

• 4:13Speaker 01

  But, uh.

• 4:14David Imel?

  Yeah, it's up there.

• 4:15Speaker 01

  It was, it was incredible.

• 4:16David Imel?

  Top two and it ain't two.

• 4:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Your dad's the most stoic man ever. Like, you're sending pictures of it and that man was just, he's like, you could tell the hope was there, but he didn't want to get over.

• 4:27Speaker 01

  He waited till the final buzzer to be like, oh my God, they actually won. Cause there was, there were many opportunities to lose, even though they had this incredible comeback and they actually won.

• 4:35David Imel?

  29 point comeback.

• 4:37Speaker 04

  Yep. And if you like this.

• 4:38David Imel?

  Like six minutes.

• 4:39Speaker 04

  If you like this talk of basketball, just wait, cause we have a whole bonus episode coming up next week. So.

• 4:44David Imel?

  We don't even need it anymore.

• 4:45Speaker 04

  Get ready for that, cause I already knew everything about basketball, man.

• 4:48Speaker 01

  We'll see about that.

• 4:48Andrew Manganelli?

  He's gonna teach Alex about the Knicks.

• 4:50David Imel?

  Yeah, I'm gonna see. Yeah. Come at me, Alex. Let's go.

• 4:53Speaker 01

  But first, okay. Did they even test this?

• 4:56Andrew Manganelli?

  I have two. They're both pretty small. One, I think is more niche and one I know happens to everyone, but it's really fast. Which would you rather like?

• 5:04Speaker 01

  Uh, the one that happens to everyone, I think.

• 5:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay. So have you ever noticed on YouTube web, when you go to the search bar and you hover over the X, the highlighting circle is breaking over pretty much every line in the UI possible. This is terrible.

• 5:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've never noticed that.

• 5:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Tim would freak out if he saw this, but I checked in multiple browsers. It's happening in all of them, for all the ones I tested. How did no one on the YouTube AI or YouTube UI team?

• 5:34David Imel?

  Have you seen the Fitbit app?

• 5:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 5:37David Imel?

  They fixed it and it's still not centered.

• 5:39Andrew Manganelli?

  That, I saw someone say they fixed it, but all they fixed was the two different dark modes.

• 5:43David Imel?

  The dark mode thing they fixed, which was a big deal.

• 5:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Which should be really easy.

• 5:49David Imel?

  But the text is still not correctly aligned.

• 5:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Cause they put Cal under the one number, which just absolutely decimates the lining, which you'd think anyone could fix that.

• 5:59David Imel?

  I don't know, man. I feel like Google, Google, yeah, their software can be a little.

• 6:04Speaker 01

  YouTube, YouTube like updates the UI every couple of months with subtle things. I think mobile just got this update that doesn't show subscribers anymore.

• 6:13David Imel?

  And it shows like live, it shows views instead of subscribers.

• 6:16Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I, I know that they always claim to be doing lots of small volume tests. They'll do a test that's like, half a percent of people on the site will see this. And if it goes over well, then we'll show it to 1% and then one and a half percent. Somehow these things make it all the way to the end and then we go, wait, what? That's.

• 6:32Andrew Manganelli?

  But those are at least on purpose changes that suck.

• 6:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:36Andrew Manganelli?

  This is just a straight up UI, like in one of the most clicked places on the homepage.

• 6:42Speaker 01

  That's a good question. Do people actually, I don't, I don't usually click the X.

• 6:45Speaker 03

  I've never clicked.

• 6:46Speaker 01

  Really?

• 6:46David Imel?

  Really?

• 6:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've never noticed.

• 6:48David Imel?

  I click it all the time.

• 6:49Andrew Manganelli?

  I click it all the time because.

• 6:50David Imel?

  I guess it's Command A.

• 6:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, and if you notice that whatever you search, no matter how long you stay in the browser, the thing stays in the search box all the time. Even if you click through a million videos. So I like clearing that out and clicking that X is.

• 7:03David Imel?

  In case someone stands over your shoulder and sees the embarrassing thing you searched.

• 7:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Exactly.

• 7:06Speaker 01

  I thought you were about to search.

• 7:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Just like how to know everything about the Knicks in the next hour.

• 7:11Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no, no. Give me an history of basketball, TLDR.

• 7:15David Imel?

  Long 15 day stream. By the way, Steph Curry, I know that he popularized the three pointer and he can shoot that from like three quarters away. From the court. That's crazy.

• 7:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:24David Imel?

  But like they, they put that, they, they gave Wemby that play. They were like, make a bunch of three pointers because you're seven feet eight. And then Jalen Brunson, the mini guy, he's like, I don't care about, I don't care about three pointers. I'm just going to ram in here and get twos over and over and over again within six minutes. It's freaking crazy. It's so crazy. But Steph Curry still might be the GOAT of all time is all I gotta say.

• 7:51Speaker 01

  I, I want more of these takes, but I can't, we can't keep doing this.

• 7:54Andrew Manganelli?

  You can't just get David into hockey.

• 7:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:57Andrew Manganelli?

  So bad.

• 8:02David Imel?

  Uh, okay. Really quick on that YouTube update though, on the mobile.

• 8:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:06David Imel?

  I think it's a good change. I, I kinda wanna debate this a little bit.

• 8:09Speaker 01

  What part? The not showing?

• 8:10David Imel?

  Not showing subscribers and just showing views.

• 8:13Speaker 01

  It does. So when there's a subscribe button, here's where I'll play devil's advocate. I think showing the subscribe button. I, I guess I'm generally in favor of glanceable quality metrics. And when they took away the dislike counter to me, I was like, I get why they're doing this, but if I see a video, like a tutorial on how to install something electrical and it has way more dislikes than normal, I know not to follow that tutorial at a glance. I don't have to get 12 minutes in and be like, wait, this doesn't seem right.

• 8:38David Imel?

  Right.

• 8:39Speaker 01

  And to me, the subscriber counter is a glanceable, like quality verification. Like if I'm watching a video, I guess I feel like people are more likely to watch a video from a channel with more subscribers. And when you don't have that on the watch page, so you're just clicking into a random related video, you don't know how many subscribers it has.

• 8:59David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 8:59Speaker 01

  You're going purely by how many views it has.

• 9:01David Imel?

  I've got God's advocate for you, because it's the devil's devil's advocate.

• 9:04Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 9:05David Imel?

  Okay.

• 9:07David Imel?

  YouTube is now old enough that there are many, many, many channels that have a ton of subscribers that don't make quality content anymore.

• 9:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Did you watch the latest Mr. Beast video? It's all people with a million subscribers and half of them don't get any views anymore.

• 9:20David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 9:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:20David Imel?

  So like, a lot of the...

• 9:23Andrew Manganelli?

  You're not one.

• 9:24David Imel?

  Yeah, this is the thing, this is the thing. Subscribers can sort of be a legacy artifact. Like, for you, you're still getting really good views.

• 9:31Speaker 01

  It's still very much a vanity metric. Has been for a long time.

• 9:34David Imel?

  Right.

• 9:34Speaker 01

  I agree.

• 9:35David Imel?

  Right, but like, it makes it easier now for people to break onto this, because the algorithm behind the scenes is already sort of doing a lot of work to tell the search engine whether or not this is a quality video, right? It's based on how long people stayed on the video for, all of these metrics. And so like, for me now, it's like subscriber count, there might be a YouTuber from 15 years ago, but he completely sold out his channel five years ago, and so...

• 10:01Speaker 01

  So there's a lot of subscribers, but it's not a good indicator of quality?

• 10:03David Imel?

  Yeah, I would say that.

• 10:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:05David Imel?

  I would say there's a small, there's a percentage that is a good indicator of quality, like yourself, but there is a lot of people that I don't think it's necessarily a good indicator of quality. Also, maybe they're making the same type of video that they made that everyone kind of vibed with 10 years ago, but nobody really cares for anymore. That's just, you know? Times change.

• 10:25Andrew Manganelli?

  I feel like an argument for showing subscribers, which is your argument, but the opposite of it is, if there's a low subscriber channel with a ton of videos, I'm more likely to be like, "Well, something's going on right here. Like, I want to watch this because something's clicking with people." Yeah, it's like, it's an outlier, and outliers generally are either, if it's a tutorial type thing, it's like, "Okay, people really connected with this tutorial, and it seems to be working."

• 10:47David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 10:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Or, "Something insane happened in this, and I want to see what that is."

• 10:51David Imel?

  That is in the same realm of, yeah, glanceable information. I glance at, "Oh, this has 3 million views, but the channel only has 10,000 subscribers." Okay, that tells me something.

• 11:00Speaker 01

  Rather than not having.

• 11:01David Imel?

  To that, though, I feel like, I kind of feel like if someone's made a thousand videos, but then none of them get views, I feel like the algorithm is really good at surfacing good content. And so if it didn't surface a single one of those videos over the thousand videos they made, they just don't make good content in general.

• 11:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I guess you're more in the realm of a suggested videos and the algorithm surfacing things for you on the homepage. I'm more in the realm of search and manually going to content and trying to judge if I should watch it on the spot.

• 11:29David Imel?

  But doesn't the search engine kind of do the same thing as what the homepage is doing?

• 11:32Speaker 01

  Uh, it tries, but it still will show me bad stuff. So if I get to a video and it's bad, I can glance at, oh, it has a bunch of dislikes, it's bad. Versus it's gone now, so I might watch too much of the video to realize I wasted my time.

• 11:46Andrew Manganelli?

  You're talking about like you search something specific. How do I pick this thing that's specific? You're talking about homepage.

• 11:50David Imel?

  Yeah, but I mean, the search, you know, if a video has 200,000 views on the search engine, I still think that's a decent indicator of quality.

• 11:59Speaker 01

  It's one of them, generally. Yeah, the view count. What if they got rid of view count?

• 12:04David Imel?

  I'd no, you can't do that.

• 12:06Speaker 01

  Because this falls, this is like the slope of your exact same argument. Well, the algorithm is going to tell me what's good. It's pretty good at that already. It's doing all that stuff behind the scenes.

• 12:14David Imel?

  I see what you're saying.

• 12:15Speaker 01

  But I would like to know how many views it has.

• 12:17David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 12:18Speaker 01

  I would like to see how many likes and dislikes it has.

• 12:20David Imel?

  Okay, yeah, I get what you're saying.

• 12:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:21David Imel?

  All right, well.

• 12:23Speaker 01

  Well, we'll see. It's still there on desktop. It's still there on desktop. I can still see this stuff, but we'll see how long that lasts.

• 12:28David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 12:29Speaker 01

  All right, we got to talk about these glasses.

• 12:32Andrew Manganelli?

  You don't even have to name them.

• 12:34Speaker 01

  It's funny because there's a post in the MKVHD subreddit that it's like, finally, like something incredibly dramatic has happened right before they record on Wednesday. And it is Snapchat's unveiling of the new AR glasses. And of course, Evan, their CEO, is going around doing a bunch of interviews, like wearing glasses, they've showed it to people. About two years ago, I think it was, we had the previous generation of their AR spectacles here, and they were massive and extremely first gen feeling, but at least it worked and it was a proof of concept and I could see the idea. Now, this new generation of them is $2,200. They're gonna sell these. They are a little tiny bit smaller, but they still

• 13:19Speaker 01

  look quite large, quite heavy.

• 13:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you want me to do specs first and then we'll talk about the most fun part, which is what they look like?

• 13:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:27Andrew Manganelli?

  The specs.

• 13:28Speaker 01

  Spec the specs.

• 13:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, $2,195. Snap is calling them wearable computer built into see-through AR glasses. To give them credit, they are standalone. There's no puck, there's no wire. You'll see where they fit all of it later.

• 13:44Speaker 01

  They have two Snapdragon chips.

• 13:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Yep, two Snapdragon chips, four hours of battery, 20 including the case. Depending on the size, it's either 132 or 136 grams.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  There's two sizes?

• 13:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, I didn't really get what that meant.

• 13:57Speaker 01

  For people with smaller heads and people with bigger heads.

• 13:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, I guess. There's an LED bar to show that they're recording. This has a 51-degree field of view, which the previous ones we did were 46, and man, I remember that feeling really limiting.

• 14:10Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 14:11Andrew Manganelli?

  So I'm glad it's higher, but that's not much higher.

• 14:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Five degrees higher is not. The Meta Orions were 70 degrees, and that felt so much better.

• 14:19Speaker 01

  Same with the Exreal Aura.

• 14:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Are they?

• 14:22Speaker 01

  70.

• 14:22Andrew Manganelli?

  70.

• 14:23Speaker 01

  72, I think.

• 14:24Andrew Manganelli?

  I do, the spec prototypes, we haven't used these new ones. I do think I remember the resolution being so much better than the Orions, but I would pick field of view over resolution any day because it, when I was wearing them, it just kept getting cut off, like whole parts of the screen, which is gone.

• 14:40Speaker 01

  I remember playing a golf game with them, and the whole idea of the golf game is like it overlays the golf hole and the world over your real world, but I would look down at the club and the ball, and then I would look up at the target, and I couldn't see them both at the same time. And then when I'd swing the club, I can't see the club anymore, so I only see the ball. And it was, it was very like segmenting. It just took me out of the immersion because of how compact the field of view is. It cut off really fast.

• 15:07Andrew Manganelli?

  And then they're claiming it can show 60 million colors and go from clear to tinted.

• 15:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay. Now, who wants to talk about what they look like?

• 15:15Speaker 01

  They look...

• 15:16David Imel?

  Prada.

• 15:17Speaker 01

  Uh, well, okay. There's two things about them that I think are weird. One is the size. Obviously, you're fitting a ton of compute in them, and to their credit, they have jammed a ton of compute in these things. But they have these really big, thick arms, big, thick rims, and even over behind the ear, there's extra weight sort of counterbalancing everything. So 130 grams is pretty heavy for something you're gonna wear on your face that's supposed to feel clear. If it's a VR headset, maybe you're expecting, you know, heavy, but the glasses are kinda heavy. The other thing, though, is every single one of these pictures I've seen, pictures and videos, I can't see quite through to his eyes very well. I don't know if it's the wave guys or if something about the glass that they're using, but I, it doesn't feel like I'm looking at someone wearing glasses. It feels like I'm looking at someone who's wearing,

• 16:01Speaker 01

  I mean, they might as well just be wearing a headset. Like, I'm not making real eye contact. You know what I mean? Like, this is from the pictures I'm seeing. Maybe there's just a ton of lights in the room.

• 16:09Andrew Manganelli?

  There's video too, and it cracks me up every time I see him like turn his head around and smile.

• 16:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, they look like fogged over or something. So those are the two things that I noticed that would turn me off from giving a chance. And obviously, these are still super early, and the devil's advocate for these is, well, at some point, they're gonna be really good, and then we'll all want these, because they'll be really nice. And this is just the early adopter version. To which I'd say, yes, this is the really, really early adopter.

• 16:38David Imel?

  $2,200. From a company that doesn't really have any usable applications for day-to-day use. Like, that's what seems very confusing to me about this, is that Evan's positions them as a wearable computer. To do what exactly? In Snapchat? Like Snapchat's UI and AR and whatever.

• 16:56Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:56David Imel?

  They don't have, like, applications like Apple has with the Vision, not even, not even Apple has with the Vision Pro, which, Apple doesn't really have that many applications for the Vision Pro, but at least you can use Safari and you can use Messages.

• 17:08Speaker 01

  They've got a YouTube app now.

• 17:09David Imel?

  There's a YouTube app now. You can do, you can watch movies. There's, there's actually, there's a little utility to the Vision Pro. What do you actually do in these, besides Snapchat?

• 17:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. From what I remember, I mean, there's a bunch of these, there's lenses, and there's a bunch of, it felt like applications, and I'm not remembering everything. I'll have to go back and watch my own video just to refresh my memory. But there were some apps, and there were some developers who are making things that work with these glasses. But it wasn't in the name of productivity, usually. It was typically just like, here's a thing that we built that takes advantage of AR. So like my computer screen's not in there, my documents aren't in there, my browsers and YouTube videos are not in there, but it's just a couple of experiences.

• 17:46David Imel?

  This is kind of analogous to the Windows phone. Because if there's no developers making actual things that people use every day and like porting their stuff to it, what do you do with it?

• 17:55Andrew Manganelli?

  It's a confusing thing because he says there's 450,000 developers creating for Snap AR, but like that obviously is including the Snapchat AR that they've had for years. So like, I don't think I need a pair of glasses that are going to play the dancing hot dog guy out in a 50 degree field.

• 18:12David Imel?

  Agree. This is the primary use case of the glasses.

• 18:16Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm sure there is more. I'm sure there's some stuff, but none of that can get past. I think calling it thick is an understatement. They're like, if you took glasses and made them bold and then still one and a half X them, like they just do not fit on his head. His ears are absolutely crushed. There's an interview of him on CNBC that is brutal and he literally looks like he's like moving down his head like throughout the whole thing. And I honestly think it's because of the weight of the glasses. They stick out like four inches past your ear with these big. I mean, it's cool that they fit all that. I know that it's a huge tech advancement for where it is. But two years ago, these were really cool because it was a prototype that we could see where they're going.

• 18:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Now it's a $2,200 thing that a person can buy and it's going to get made fun of because of that.

• 19:03David Imel?

  Yeah, I, I think that it's, it's cool that they were able to pack that much technology into the, into the glasses. And if you, if you were to compare these to like an actual wearable computer, like a Vision Pro, and you said, oh, we basically packed most of the Vision Pro's technology into thick, arguably very thick glasses, it's still like shrinking down the tech by a lot.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  That's what I was gonna say is like, there are two ways to look at this, uh, this like dimensions. And one of them makes them look really impressive and the other makes them look really bad. The really impressive one is, okay, these glasses are 130 something grams and a Vision Pro is seven or 800 grams. And this doesn't have a puck. This has all the compute, all the sensors, all the chips, all the batteries, everything all built in at 130 grams. That's actually kind of insane. Really impressive technical feat. The other angle is, Array band metas with the cameras in them and the batteries and the compute for that are, according to Google, about 50 grams.

• 20:03David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 20:04Speaker 01

  So you're wearing, and the X reels, which I just showed you, which feel too heavy, they're a little bit front-heavy, but I wouldn't want to wear them all day. And they have the electrochromic glass and the tint and everything. Those were in the 90 gram range. So these being 130 is not an all-day product.

• 20:21David Imel?

  The X reel and the meta use your phone.

• 20:24Speaker 01

  And they have a separate computer.

• 20:25David Imel?

  Exactly.

• 20:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:26David Imel?

  Which, in my opinion, is better, but that's just.

• 20:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Using your phone or not?

• 20:29David Imel?

  Yeah, using your phone.

• 20:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I will, I mean, it's cool that they can do it. Using your phone, I don't think it's that big of a deal because we have it. The tether, not having that is huge. I totally agree. But by saying like, these all compute by themselves and these don't have a tether, they don't have a puck, they still have to be glasses at the end of the day and they just look so uncomfortable. No part of him wearing that in any of those interviews, does he look like he's having a good time with them?

• 20:54Speaker 03

  I don't know who it was. Someone sent a picture of Danny DeVito and they missed out on having him wear the glasses.

• 21:00David Imel?

  I think, yeah, the closest thing to this is like hollow lens, right? Because it's a standalone device that you wear when you want to do certain tasks. But it's not necessarily like a, you, like, they're kind of angling them as a thing that you just wear every day.

• 21:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes, that's my problem.

• 21:15David Imel?

  That's the mistake.

• 21:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. I have a quote from him. He says, during that CNBC interview, he says, "The goal for these are to bring computing into the world and make it more human. I think it's something people are really looking for, where screens are distracting them and people are spending more than seven hours a day staring at a screen instead of spending time with their friends." He's saying that with two giant screens glued to his eyeballs where the interviewer can't even see his eyes.

• 21:39Speaker 01

  That would have hit so much harder if the glasses were clear.

• 21:41Andrew Manganelli?

  I know, like, it feels like more of separation because now I just can't see your eyes. I don't know if you're looking at something. Also, you can't spend seven hours a day staring at them because it has a four-hour battery. So like, I don't know.

• 21:54David Imel?

  Is it four hours or two hours?

• 21:55Speaker 01

  It's four hours for now.

• 21:56David Imel?

  Four hours, okay.

• 21:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, and he wants you to spend 14 hours a day staring into the screens, so.

• 22:01David Imel?

  Okay, I'm gonna be devil's advocate here. I think these are dope because they are specifically an Apple Vision Pro alternative. I don't see them as a meta glasses alternative.

• 22:11Speaker 04

  Like, I'm not expecting anyone to wear these walking around all day.

• 22:14David Imel?

  That's

• 22:15Speaker 04

  These are developers that are building the future of AR, just like Apple Vision Pro, no matter what Apple wants to say.

• 22:20David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 22:20Speaker 04

  Regular people aren't using that. That's where developers building the future of AR.

• 22:23David Imel?

  I agree with you.

• 22:24Speaker 04

  And that's kind of how I view these.

• 22:25David Imel?

  It's just not how they position them.

• 22:26Speaker 04

  Exactly. Their positioning is where they messed up.

• 22:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Positioning is really bad.

• 22:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that's, so I remember years ago, way back at the beginning of this AR XR thing, we talked about the spectrum of like, on one side of the spectrum, there's VR headsets.

• 22:39David Imel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 22:40Speaker 01

  Where you're obviously not going to walk around in them. They're an opaque thing with like pass-through cameras and you put it on, you're fully immersed and they're heavy and you watch a movie in it for an hour or whatever, wear it for work. That's one side of the spectrum. And on the complete other side of the spectrum is glasses with a tiny bit of tech in them, maybe a camera and a speaker and a battery and some compute.

• 23:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Mono screen.

• 23:01Speaker 01

  And they're transparent. There's no screen, the absolute basic, total other side of the spectrum. Those, you can actually see people putting on and wearing for half a day, an entire day. And then companies in order to get to this future of like, you know, the future of AR computing, have to decide which part they want to start with to get to the future.

• 23:24David Imel?

  Mm-hmm.

• 23:24Speaker 01

  And I think if you position yourself in the wrong way, you're kind of doomed and you have to start over. So Vision Pro is where Apple chose to start. They're going to eventually do glasses someday, we all suspect. These are kind of like, I mean, he's wearing them as if they're supposed to be regular glasses. He's having conversations with people, he's doing interviews with people wearing the glasses as if they're not a, like, if this was a Vision Pro, you'd be like, what are you doing? So they're positioning them very clearly as a thing that you can wear and walk around and live your life because it's glass and it's AR and they're the world around you. But then they look like

• 23:55David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 23:56Speaker 01

  Just a little too much for that.

• 23:58David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 23:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Way too much.

• 23:59Speaker 01

  They're kind of in the middle.

• 24:00Andrew Manganelli?

  They're in the middle, which is like where they want to land. It's very clear. In his interview, he said like, that, almost that exact same thing. We want to be in the middle. I think the problem is, is when you have to describe things as where them like glasses instead of wearing them as glasses, because that's what they are, it's just proof that none of us are looking at this and thinking this is a pair of glasses.

• 24:19Speaker 03

  I guess my question is, as a regular Consumer is why do they need to announce this like very publicly? Could this not just be an email within like a community space?

• 24:28David Imel?

  Well.

• 24:29Speaker 03

  Or the targeted audience?

• 24:30David Imel?

  Yeah, that's what I was about to say that again with their positioning problem. They're saying we're going to sell these to consumers, which is a bad move. Like the HoloLens was always for enterprise and enterprise only. And selling these direct like direct to consumer going on CNBC and be like, look at our big consumer like, what are you doing? Consumers are not going to buy this.

• 24:50Speaker 01

  2200 bucks implies a lot of tech and a lot of functionality and usefulness. And I tweeted this like, there are actually two things you have to overcome. You have to overcome the price and how dorky they look. If there are some amazing utilities or some incredible functionality or productivity things that it does that makes you want to do that, then you're willing to go, okay, I know it looks like ridiculous, but look at this amazing functionality. Same with the price. I know it's $2,000, but like, I don't have to use a MacBook Pro anymore. It's $2,000. I don't see that with these. And maybe it'll be proven wrong. Maybe there's some development happening. Maybe there's some amazing apps that I haven't seen with these spectacles yet. But I think that's what it needs to overcome how ridiculously bad they look and how expensive they are.

• 25:35David Imel?

  Yeah, we don't really even know anything about the app ecosystem or functionality yet. So.

• 25:41Speaker 01

  Waiting to see that.

• 25:42David Imel?

  We'll see that. Hopefully they send us a pair so we can look stupid for a while.

• 25:45Speaker 01

  I'm sure they'll love to after they hear this, what we just said about. At a different place in this world, we still have XReel's AR glasses. They just launched, which are running Android XR. So we know the ecosystem. It's the Play Store. So it's whatever you want to do in the Play Store and all the stuff that's optimized for Android XR. That's actually pretty interesting now. Like Google Maps has this, this cool optimized Android XR version. You can fly down into Street View and look around and then pinch and zoom and walk around. It's kind of interesting. But yeah, I did some of this. I covered these actually on the latest Dope Tech episode. So if you want to watch that, there's about two or three minutes in there about these. Again, 90 grams, you know, 70 something degree field of view. Micro OLED displays, it looks pretty good. They're high resolution.

• 26:30Speaker 01

  And I think my favorite feature is you can like soft body lock a video in the corner of your vision with you and walk around with it. So instead of like having to pinch and hold and walk around carrying the video, you can like watch waveform in the corner of your vision while you actually wash dishes. Because you're just looking through glass.

• 26:48Speaker 04

  Which is exactly how I watch it anyway, when I'm doing dishes.

• 26:51Speaker 01

  It's perfect.

• 26:51Speaker 04

  It's right next to the sink.

• 26:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:53Andrew Manganelli?

  That's such a simple thing, like so many of VR, AR is like, how do you pin things to a spatial place that's in your actual environment? And this is just like, just put it in my corner and then it stays with me and I can see it.

• 27:04Speaker 01

  I don't need to move it around.

• 27:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, exactly. Which the X reels were cool because they can do pinning to different places in the environment. Like it was a really neat, I still want to call it a demo of what Android XR was because these glasses, I also don't think are things you're walking around with every day.

• 27:21Speaker 01

  No, yeah.

• 27:22Andrew Manganelli?

  They, they look very similar to some previous X reels where even though the shape is smaller and the, the weight is lighter, it still just fits really strangely off the front of your face because it has to fit those windows.

• 27:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've, I've always thought of these as closer to a VR headset, even though they don't look like it, they're very much like a put a screen on your face type of thing.

• 27:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Sit down at a desk, an airplane, a train.

• 27:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Get yourself a private larger screen.

• 27:46Speaker 01

  They're nice on a plane.

• 27:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 27:48Speaker 01

  I think they'd be nice on a plane.

• 27:48Speaker 03

  Wasn't the previous version, the one Ellis was like fully locked in?

• 27:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 27:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, because they're, they're plug and play.

• 27:54David Imel?

  A few of these.

• 27:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, it might've been those or N reel or something like that. A lot of them are the same. We're like, you, you, they're plug and play.

• 28:00David Imel?

  Just X reel, but they changed the name.

• 28:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:02Andrew Manganelli?

  But when we were using N reel, it was actually for the third person video that we did.

• 28:06Speaker 01

  Right.

• 28:06Andrew Manganelli?

  I think Ellis is more locked into the Meta Quest Pro.

• 28:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:10Andrew Manganelli?

  For a while, but the N reel ones were very awesome because like they were super plug and play. You just plug your phone in and it's there.

• 28:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:16Andrew Manganelli?

  These, the whole puck thing that just looks like a phone, including it essentially has a like hole punch cut out on the front was just very funny to me.

• 28:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:27Andrew Manganelli?

  It's cool. That's a touchscreen.

• 28:28Speaker 01

  You can plug that plug into something else like, uh, like your phone or actually even better, what I did was plug it into my laptop so that my laptop screen became one of the things in the virtual space.

• 28:39David Imel?

  That's cool.

• 28:40Speaker 01

  So that was.

• 28:40David Imel?

  I'll try that.

• 28:41Speaker 01

  A legitimately interesting, like.

• 28:44Speaker 01

  80% of the stuff that I would do with this is just being on a plane. Like, I want to go on a plane and I have to edit a video that's embargoed, so nobody around me on the plane can see it. So I would just plug it into these, the screen would go black here and it would just show up in my glasses and I could edit the video on the plane.

• 28:57David Imel?

  That's smart.

• 28:58Speaker 01

  Stuff like that.

• 28:59David Imel?

  Yeah, I still wonder about the utility of these things. I guess for that, it makes sense.

• 29:04Speaker 01

  We're watching a movie.

• 29:06Andrew Manganelli?

  We didn't have a price on these yet, right?

• 29:08Speaker 01

  Uh, no, but they promised me that they would be under the price of a full Galaxy XR headset, which makes sense. Cause that's like 1800.

• 29:17Speaker 04

  It's like 2G's.

• 29:18Speaker 01

  Well, that's, that's already cheaper than the Snapdragon Spectacles. So that the Galaxy XR is 1800, I think. So this is ideally.

• 29:25David Imel?

  People are really need to like, people need to get, get that utility curb up there. Like, they need to figure out the utility real hard because putting these things on your face has a very high goofiness scale.

• 29:37Andrew Manganelli?

  It is. This, I do like the electrochromatic tint because the old N-reals we used to had just came with a cover that you put over top of the glass to get the faded black background, so everything popped more.

• 29:48David Imel?

  Yeah. Okay. Well, speaking of, um, gosh.

• 29:53Speaker 01

  You can do this.

• 29:54David Imel?

  You can do this. Fabric, digital fabric.

• 29:56Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 29:57David Imel?

  Is that something I could say?

• 29:58Speaker 01

  Speaking of things made in the universe.

• 30:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Speaking of things that matter.

• 30:04David Imel?

  That's true. Honestly, thank you. You really saved me on that one. Matter 1.6. Okay. You guys have heard me talk about Matter before. I love protocols. We love protocols here at the Waveform Podcast.

• 30:15Speaker 01

  It's more than the Fediverse corner, it's the Protocol corner.

• 30:18David Imel?

  Yes.

• 30:18Speaker 01

  Expanded Fediverse corner.

• 30:20David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 30:20Speaker 01

  But it's.

• 30:20David Imel?

  Cause the Fediverse is dead, so we can just.

• 30:22Speaker 01

  It's not dead.

• 30:23David Imel?

  This into the protocols corner. Met, hey, Metta's tried to kill it many times and they're still trying to kill it.

• 30:29Speaker 01

  They've stabbed it, it's bleeding openly, but it's not dead yet.

• 30:33Andrew Manganelli?

  Wemby stomping on his ACL.

• 30:35David Imel?

  Yeah, Wemby stomped on the Fediverse corner's ACL. Hey, hey, hey. Okay. Matter matters. You guys might remember Matter Protocol, Smart Home Protocol. You probably don't like going to the store, you know, being like, oh, I like this smart bulb. It's cool. But then you see, works with Amazon Alexa. Hmm, I have Google Homes in my home, which we'll talk about later because Google Home is also a feature on this podcast today. Matter is supposed to be this just like, oh, it works with Google Home, it works with Amazon Alexa, it works with HomeKit. Amazing. They've stumbled quite a bit with this future.

• 31:10Speaker 01

  I was, I remember looking forward to this.

• 31:12David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 31:13Speaker 01

  I remember having the little glimmer in my eyes.

• 31:17David Imel?

  That's how all protocols start, Marcus.

• 31:20Speaker 01

  I'd go to Home Depot, I'd be like, someday, these lights will all talk to each other.

• 31:23David Imel?

  They'll all talk to each other. So, the early version of Matter, basically how it worked is that you would still set up in one of the, you know, Google Home apps, or like the Amazon Alexa app, or the Siri HomeKit app.

• 31:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:35David Imel?

  But then you had to like, share the device with other apps through the Matter protocol, which used a Thread border router. It was sort of like-

• 31:44Speaker 01

  Thread?

• 31:44David Imel?

  Yeah, Thread, Matter over Thread. Sort of like tacking on a bunch of like, uh, little protocols onto existing things.

• 31:52Speaker 01

  It was like Velcro-ing something to more Velcro.

• 31:55David Imel?

  Hundred percent. Hundred percent.

• 31:57Speaker 04

  Situation, there are 14 protocols.

• 31:59David Imel?

  There are- We should make one that encompasses all of these.

• 32:03Speaker 04

  Situation, there are 15 protocols.

• 32:05David Imel?

  Okay, Matter 1.6 is supposed to fix this problem. They have this new feature called Joint Fabric, which should allow any smart device on the network to just automatically show the device that you set up, which is a big deal.

• 32:18Speaker 03

  Anything?

• 32:19David Imel?

  Anything.

• 32:20Speaker 03

  Anything?

• 32:20David Imel?

  And allegedly.

• 32:21Speaker 01

  Supposed to.

• 32:23David Imel?

  Supposed to allegedly. Um, now, all these companies obviously have to support this, this, uh, Joint Fabric thing.

• 32:32Speaker 01

  I feel like that's always the roadblock.

• 32:34David Imel?

  You say that line every- I know!

• 32:37Speaker 01

  Now, all the companies are supposed to support this.

• 32:39David Imel?

  I know.

• 32:40Speaker 01

  Now, we have 15 protocols.

• 32:41David Imel?

  Okay, if you remember, if you remember, the entire reason that Google and Apple and Amazon decided to support Matter was, especially, especially Apple, they went way too hard on certifying every single HomeKit device, and then they realized, like, we don't have the infrastructure to like, certify every single one that's good enough for us. So, it's easier if Amazon just like, makes all, all these smart home things and we can utilize it. We can tap into it. We don't have to deal with any of this stuff. So, Apple, I think, still has incentive. Whether Google or Amazon now still have as much incentive to support Matter, similarly to how Meta, at one point, had some incentive to support the Fediverse and now just doesn't. Yet to be seen.

• 33:25David Imel?

  Yes, boo them every day.

• 33:29David Imel?

  Anyway, it does bring some other benefits. There is now NFC setup, which is very good. I had a Samsung Smart Plug. Congrats! It had a QR code on the back of the Smart Plug.

• 33:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, so you can't scan it while it's plugged in.

• 33:44David Imel?

  Yes.

• 33:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's pretty classic.

• 33:47David Imel?

  That was the most, did they even test this thing, I've ever seen in my life. Because it can't find it when it's not getting power.

• 33:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, I have this incredibly frustrating, also incredibly boring situation where I've gone through several smart locks in my garage. I have this one door, it's like really far from all the other appliances, it's far from the wifi, but it's... I just want to have a smart lock there, and every time I try to set one up, it's like, well, I have to connect to something else on the network, and I'll have like, I'll like unplug a doorbell and like walk over and like wave it to unlock, like nothing ever really gets it to connect. And I'm just hoping that it's some, someday, one of these protocols, man, they're gonna fix everything.

• 34:30David Imel?

  Unplugging a doorbell sounds crazy.

• 34:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:33David Imel?

  Someday, one of these protocols.

• 34:34Speaker 01

  Cause I have a Nest battery doorbell.

• 34:36David Imel?

  Yeah, dumbest thing ever, I have it. When I die on my tombstone, I really want you to write, someday, one of these protocols is gonna fix everything. That's all I want on my tombstone. I feel like random smart home gadgets are the most often Claire will find me just like sitting cross-legged on the floor.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  Watching a YouTube tutorial.

• 34:56David Imel?

  Everything okay? I'm fine!

• 34:59Speaker 01

  The cool thing about this new NFC setup, though, is that you can pair to the device before you even power the device on. So, this problem that I have where they put the QR code on the back, that's not a problem, theoretically, allegedly won't be a problem anymore. Companies like Eve have been offering Matter upgrades for a long time, and now they sell direct, they used to be like a HomeKit-only company, but now they're doing Matter, which is good for them, because they can just be like, hey, we're available on everything. And then Matter can be like, hey, look at our big, you know, these guys are supporting Matter people. So that's nice, so hopefully we're gonna see a lot more.

• 35:34David Imel?

  Products like that. Also, one more thing, the Thread protocol of which Matter, you know, it's Matter over Thread. That's how the whole thing.

• 35:42Speaker 01

  Matter happening over Thread, yeah.

• 35:44David Imel?

  Yeah, I've explained this to my dead grandma. She understands it. She understands it. Um, there's a new Thread update. It's called Thread Direct. And it allows you, because now, I think we did a short about this a while ago. There are now, there are hidden Thread radios now in like new iPhones, new Pixels, and new, some new Samsung phones. And now you won't have to have a Thread border router to set up the device because previously, in order to set up a Matter-enabled device over Thread, you had to have, well, you still have to have this, but not to set up. You had to have a Google Nest Wi-Fi Pro, which is a Thread border router, or a Apple TV, which is the Thread border router, or some Alexa, uh, devices, whatever they're called, I don't even remember.

• 36:26David Imel?

  And, uh, now, you can just set it up directly from your phone, which is really helpful, and you can deal with all the networking stuff later. But you can at least get it set up on the Thread network, and then Matter will work afterwards.

• 36:38Speaker 01

  Allegedly.

• 36:39David Imel?

  Allegedly. So yeah, this is all extremely alleged. Uh, did get announced this week. We'll see how long it takes to actually get implemented. Please, God.

• 36:50Andrew Manganelli?

  It's one of those things where like, I really hope this works, but this working just means things work. It's like, it kinda sucks that when all of this goes perfectly, there'll be no big hype around it because it just mean I won't be banging my head against the wall setting up a smart one.

• 37:07David Imel?

  It's like, nobody appreciates the IT guy until you got a real big problem.

• 37:11Speaker 01

  They're broken, yeah.

• 37:12Speaker 03

  Can I get a vibe check? What percentage of your guys' homes run on smart things like this? Like, if they were to just not work, could you function?

• 37:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Percentage is hard because...

• 37:24David Imel?

  Yeah, the percentage is hard, but I do have several pretty important, like, my doorbells are all smart doorbells. I don't, I mean, that's fine, but like, if, if the internet goes out, I guess I don't get... Like, if someone rings the doorbell, I just won't.

• 37:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, yeah. Luckily, there's something called knocking, so you're good there.

• 37:40David Imel?

  If there's a doorbell, people just don't knock anymore. They just hit the doorbell, yeah. So that would be bad.

• 37:45Andrew Manganelli?

  I think the only thing that would screw me is the lights in my living room, because that's a smart switch.

• 37:50David Imel?

  Yeah. All of my lights are on my smart home, which is a problem, because occasionally it does glitch out, and I just can't turn my lights off. So sometimes I sleep in the bright light.

• 38:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Are they smart bulbs or smart switches?

• 38:04David Imel?

  Smart switches.

• 38:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Good. Smart switches are the best, except for that issue.

• 38:08David Imel?

  Yeah, they're smart plugs, sorry.

• 38:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, and like lamps in a smart plug?

• 38:12David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 38:14Andrew Manganelli?

  You can still press the button on the side, right? You just have to go to... Nud. All my smart plugs have a button on the side that...

• 38:20David Imel?

  The eve ones that I have are on the side, you can do it, but the Samsung ones on the back.

• 38:25Speaker 01

  I do have one, I have exactly one smart outlet and every year around the holidays, the Christmas tree goes in that one. And it turns on at a certain hour, turns off at a certain hour.

• 38:34David Imel?

  Oh, nice.

• 38:34Speaker 01

  Why don't you use that for other things?

• 38:36David Imel?

  Like what?

• 38:36Speaker 01

  Like lamps that you don't want to put a smart bulb in.

• 38:41David Imel?

  Lamps. I don't really use lamps. I don't think I...

• 38:44Speaker 03

  I'm sorry.

• 38:44Speaker 01

  Wait, what?

• 38:45David Imel?

  I don't think I have any lamps.

• 38:47Andrew Manganelli?

  This is, what's the meme of like, I don't like the big lights, I just like the little lights?

• 38:51David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 38:51Speaker 03

  I don't have a single lamp in your house?

• 38:53David Imel?

  Uh, what?

• 38:54Speaker 01

  No.

• 38:55David Imel?

  What?

• 38:56Speaker 03

  How?

• 38:56Andrew Manganelli?

  To be fair, I think my lamps are plant lamps.

• 38:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't have those either.

• 39:01David Imel?

  Okay.

• 39:01Speaker 01

  We got windows and we got a big switch.

• 39:03Andrew Manganelli?

  There are also 600 Kelvin.

• 39:05David Imel?

  You use your overhead lights?

• 39:06Speaker 03

  You get natural sunlight?

• 39:08David Imel?

  No, I don't get natural. I live in the basement. You don't use your overhead lights?

• 39:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:12David Imel?

  Oh.

• 39:13Speaker 01

  Or just windows with no, sometimes I just don't turn the lights on because it's bright. Because of the sun.

• 39:18David Imel?

  I would do that if I had windows.

• 39:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:20David Imel?

  Anyway.

• 39:21Speaker 03

  Great, okay.

• 39:21David Imel?

  That's great.

• 39:22Speaker 03

  Do, should we?

• 39:26Speaker 01

  It is time for trivia.

• 39:27David Imel?

  Cellar dweller over here.

• 39:30Speaker 04

  Snap has launched multiple things under the Snapchat umbrella. But which of these is not real? A, the Snapchat Apple Watch app, self-explanatory. Snap Cash, a feature that lets users send and receive money to each other through private messaging.

• 39:45David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 39:46Speaker 04

  Snap Code, customizable way to add friends via usernames. Snap Tracks, with an X, mini beat machine app inside of Snapchat.

• 39:54Andrew Manganelli?

  That's definitely real.

• 39:56David Imel?

  Alright, that's cool.

• 39:57Speaker 01

  Which one? And one of them is fake?

• 39:59Speaker 04

  One of them is fake.

• 39:59Speaker 01

  One of them is fake, okay.

• 40:00Speaker 04

  In honor of Ellis still on vacation.

• 40:03Speaker 01

  We will, uh, we will learn at the end. Answers will be at the end like usual. We'll be right back.

• 40:16Speaker 01

  Support for the show comes from Shopify. So, starting a new business is so daunting that most people quit before they even start. But you don't have to be like most people and you don't have to do it alone. Shopify makes it easy to take the leap. Everything you need to start selling is included and ready from day one. Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide from household names to small businesses just getting started. Their templates and AI tools help you get a website up and running fast. No coding needed. If questions come up, Shopify's built-in AI assistant Sidekick is ready to help you build, troubleshoot, and keep moving. And the best part is that all of Shopify's tools are conveniently located in one easy-to-use platform. And because Shopify handles the setup and checkout, you have more time to focus on growing your business and the tools to do it.

• 41:00Speaker 01

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• 41:42Speaker 01

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• 42:24Speaker 01

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• 43:06Speaker 01

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• 43:25David Imel?

  What's up? Welcome back. We got to talk about the Google Home speaker that launched in the spring, but actually the summer. I don't know if you guys remember, but during the October Google Made by Google event last year, they announced a very, very nice-looking new Google Home speaker. It comes in basically all the same colors as the Fitbit Air, which is very nice, although half of them are exclusive to the US for some reason.

• 43:48Speaker 01

  I just realized that.

• 43:49David Imel?

  Yeah, the good colors are exclusive to the US. Like, the berry and the, I believe, the green one are the exclusive US colors. I don't know why they're doing that.

• 43:57Speaker 01

  They have weird color names, like jade and porcelain and stuff, but yeah.

• 44:00David Imel?

  Jade, porcelain, berry, yeah. So, this is effectively their first Gemini-first speaker. That's the big deal. It has a glowing LED strip on the bottom that will kind of illuminate and dance when you're talking to Gemini. And instead of being the classic, you know, Google 4 color combo, it's sort of that blue-purple look. It's supposed to have 360-degree audio. You can pair them to each other. You can, if you pair it to a Google TV streamer, you can use it for surround sound audio. They say the audio is a lot better. But the main things, honestly, are the Gemini reasoning. Now, there's a lot more things that you can do with this, just like there are a lot more things you can do with Gemini over Google Assistant. For example, you can say, "Turn off all the lights except the bedside lamps."

• 44:45David Imel?

  So you can make exceptions. You can say, "Dim the kitchen lights, play some relaxing music, and set a 20-minute timer." So you can chain together reasoning. That's pretty cool. "Turn on the coffee maker." I mean, "turn it off." You can say, "I mean," and kind of interrupt it in the middle. That's great. "What's the weather going to be like for the next Mets game?" That's pretty cool, because it understands where it is, you know, when it is.

• 45:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, currently, if you ask Google for that, it will absolutely, without question, get it wrong.

• 45:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 45:15Speaker 03

  What if I don't have any lamps in my house?

• 45:20Speaker 01

  That's a little unrealistic, Moran. Everyone has some lamps in their house.

• 45:23David Imel?

  Everyone's got a lamp.

• 45:24Speaker 01

  At least one lamp.

• 45:25David Imel?

  And it's gotta be a smart one as well.

• 45:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:27David Imel?

  It will leave the mic open or on for a couple of seconds after you finish, after it finishes giving you the response, so that you can continue a conversation with it.

• 45:35Speaker 01

  Huge.

• 45:35David Imel?

  Very useful. By the way, I was testing this on Siri yesterday. I was walking over the Manhattan Bridge, and I was trying to like, ask Siri some questions, but it will just give you the response, and then every time, you have to say, "Hey, S," again, just to continue the conversation. Really annoying. I would really like it if you just keep it going. So that's cool.

• 45:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, it doesn't, that's a good point. It doesn't have a live mode. Whenever you open like Gemini, you can open a Gemini Live chat, and it's just back-and-forth conversation. It's always listening. You can keep talking. You can interrupt it and ask another question. It'll keep going.

• 46:05David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 46:06Speaker 01

  And Siri does not have a like, chat mode like they all do.

• 46:09David Imel?

  No.

• 46:10Speaker 01

  Interesting.

• 46:10David Imel?

  Yeah, they're gonna need to add that, I think.

• 46:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:13David Imel?

  There are 10 new voices, so you can really, you know, get very specific with the way that you want your

• 46:18Speaker 01

  Good I might.

• 46:18David Imel?

  Google Assistant Gemini to sound. You could make it Australian. You could make it Marquez as an Australian.

• 46:24Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 46:25Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm not sure if either of those are true.

• 46:27Speaker 01

  You can definitely make it Australian.

• 46:28David Imel?

  I think the Australian is 100% true. Australian's true on every single one.

• 46:31Speaker 01

  I would know.

• 46:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Lampless house.

• 46:32Speaker 01

  I would know.

• 46:33David Imel?

  If I could have, if I could have Marquez as an Australian as the assistant, I would 100% pay for that.

• 46:38Speaker 01

  I'll do some recordings for you.

• 46:40David Imel?

  Thank you.

• 46:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:41David Imel?

  Google is now also selling a Google Home Premium subscription, starting at $10 a month. Does not give you that much. I don't really understand why people are gonna wanna pay for this, but it gives you Gemini Live, uh, which you already have on your phone, again. I also don't completely understand the difference between this and the microphone just being left on, and then you continuing the conversation. Google says it lets you say, "Hey G, let's chat," to have free-flowing chats.

• 47:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, so like when you have, it's the same, it's kinda the same as on the phone. When you open Gemini and just ask it one question, and then it gives you a response, and then maybe listens a little longer for another.

• 47:17David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 47:17Speaker 01

  That's one thing. But when you open the like chat, the full Gemini Live thing, that's what "Hey, let's chat" does.

• 47:23David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 47:23Speaker 01

  Then you can interrupt it while it's talking back to you. You can ask unrelated questions, and then ask it about previous questions. It's like this whole live, and same thing with like the ChatGPT app and like others, they all have this for just like talking version.

• 47:37David Imel?

  Could you not do that if you were just talking to it normally, though?

• 47:39Speaker 01

  I don't think you can interrupt it. I don't think it's quite the same like full-featured chat experience.

• 47:43David Imel?

  Okay.

• 47:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:44Andrew Manganelli?

  It feels more like order-based, like telling it what to do or ask it specific things, like all of those have a specific outcome.

• 47:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like when you're planning to have a multi-response conversation with it, where you don't really know where you're going, that's when I would do the live thing.

• 47:59David Imel?

  Hmm.

• 48:00Speaker 01

  When you're just asking for one thing or two things, then you just ask it the one.

• 48:04David Imel?

  The main reason I use Gemini Live on my phone is because I wanna show it something in the real world. Like if I'm having a technical issue, and I'm like, "This is the thing I'm having a problem with," or "This is what's on my screen, can you tell me about..." whatever.

• 48:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've asked it about like researching things that I don't know about, so I'll ask it like basic, high-level questions, and then dig in after that. So it's like, "Tell me about these paint colors, and like, is it bad to use these types of paint colors? And why is it bad to use..." and then I just ask follow-up questions.

• 48:31David Imel?

  But I feel like you could do that with the regular one.

• 48:33Speaker 01

  I probably could.

• 48:35David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 48:35Speaker 01

  But...

• 48:36David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 48:37Speaker 01

  That seems like the biggest difference.

• 48:38David Imel?

  If this is behind a paywall, it just like, you really have to add value, I would feel like.

• 48:42Speaker 01

  Totally.

• 48:42David Imel?

  I don't know. Uh, other things you get with the Gemini, uh, the Google Home Premium subscription, you get camera history search, so you can ask your speaker to describe current or recent activity captured on your Nest cams, like, "Hey G, is my back gate open?" Or, "Hey G, did my dog go on the couch today?" And I don't know why you would need to know that. That was literally one of Google's examples, by the way, so.

• 49:05Speaker 03

  It's just narking on your dog.

• 49:08Speaker 01

  Did the raccoons take the trash?

• 49:11David Imel?

  There are home briefs. You can ask Gemini what happened in your home while you were away.

• 49:15Andrew Manganelli?

  If that's anything like the home briefs that it gives me in the Nest app right now, it will take forever.

• 49:22David Imel?

  So Nest Aware, which is a paid subscription, is becoming Google Home Premium.

• 49:27Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 49:28David Imel?

  So this is why it's exactly like that.

• 49:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, so bad.

• 49:31David Imel?

  Really, really long.

• 49:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I literally, I mean, I pay for it because I just want the, I've prior ranted about this before, so I'm sorry, but I just want the history, the events being labeled, which half of them are wrong anyways.

• 49:42David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 49:43Andrew Manganelli?

  And then, like, the other, also, the thing's just not good at catching things. Sometimes I send you guys all the picture of the bear walking past my front door. It walks right past the other camera. No event capture or anything.

• 49:55David Imel?

  A light breeze.

• 49:58Andrew Manganelli?

  But, yeah, but then every time I go to look at it, I have to go through this four paragraph essay of like, this morning, a woman and a girl walked out the front door. It's like my wife and my daughter that you've seen 4,000 times and are logged in there. It's just too long, and I can't imagine it saying that out loud.

• 50:14David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, kind of strange.

• 50:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 50:17David Imel?

  I, uh, I have a sort of theory slash conspiracy theory.

• 50:23Speaker 01

  Sounds like it's a conspiracy.

• 50:24David Imel?

  Wait, wait, it's more a theory.

• 50:25Speaker 04

  Let me get my tinfoil hat.

• 50:27David Imel?

  Yeah, get it, get it. Okay, I don't really think that Google wants you to buy Google Home Premium or, or Google Health Premium or any of their, like, small $10, like, bespoke premium feature things because they're, like, they just keep adding value to the Google AI Pro, Google Drive subscription.

• 50:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 50:52David Imel?

  Because it comes with all this stuff.

• 50:53Andrew Manganelli?

  They want enough of the $10 ones to add up to making the AI thing.

• 50:57David Imel?

  Which is $20, by the way. So like, it's basically, like, we've, we talked before about, like, price ladders and stuff like that.

• 51:04Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 51:04David Imel?

  But I feel like this stuff would normally be free, but they're only slapping a price tag on it because they want you to pay for the AI Pro subscription. So they say they have more Gemini users so that they can keep getting investment for artificial intelligence.

• 51:18Andrew Manganelli?

  That's totally reasonable.

• 51:19Speaker 01

  Mostly on board with that. I think they have to have a way for it to be standalone as literally your only product. Like, you have a Google account and just that speaker, and you want to be able to use it with no other anything.

• 51:32David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 51:33Speaker 01

  Then I guess you just have that one subscription.

• 51:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Or it'd be free.

• 51:36Speaker 01

  But I, yeah, but I think they are pricing it specifically to be like, well, for just a few more dollars, I could just have this whole account with all this stuff in it.

• 51:44David Imel?

  Yeah, I mean, Google AI Pro comes with five terabytes of drive storage.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  Almost full, man.

• 51:49David Imel?

  Terabytes? Terabytes. So even if you do not care about Gemini, which is what it, you know, it's AI Pro and it comes with Gemini Pro and all these Gemini features, and it comes with Google Health Premium, it comes with Google Home Premium. Even if you don't want any of that other stuff, regular people want the storage.

• 52:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 52:05David Imel?

  You know what I mean? So in my opinion, like, they're only throwing price tags on these things in order to get more AI subscribers.

• 52:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 52:12David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 52:13Andrew Manganelli?

  I, I'm, I think I buy.

• 52:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 52:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 52:15Speaker 04

  I'm buying for sure. And I think that it's really smart of them to use Google Drive as the main workhorse on this.

• 52:21David Imel?

  Mm-hmm.

• 52:21Speaker 04

  Because that's the thing that most people, like, Marques, why are you almost filled up with your five terabytes of storage?

• 52:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, cuz like my Gmail of like the past 20 years of Gmail and my Google Photos are at like 4.9 terabytes right now.

• 52:33Speaker 04

  And photos are like the thing that most people care most about.

• 52:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 52:37Speaker 04

  And they take up so much space.

• 52:38David Imel?

  Such a long-term game for like all of these companies, giving you like-

• 52:42Speaker 04

  Buy our Pixel phone, you'll get it for free. I mean, never mind.

• 52:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, remember, unlimited high-definition storage with the Pixel 4.

• 52:49David Imel?

  If you upload the photos from the Pixel 1, you still get unlimited storage through it.

• 52:54Speaker 04

  But for how long?

• 52:55David Imel?

  Still, still.

• 52:56Speaker 01

  I know damn well I'm not still using a Pixel.

• 52:58David Imel?

  Well-

• 52:58Speaker 04

  People have been buying them on eBay, though, and like unboxing it.

• 53:01David Imel?

  If you transfer anything from your Pixel, from any phone to the Pixel and then upload from the Pixel, it doesn't count against your storage.

• 53:08Speaker 04

  If you're from Google, stop listening right now.

• 53:10Speaker 01

  It takes a lot of work.

• 53:11Andrew Manganelli?

  That takes a lot of work. I can make an AI swap all that. If I just get Google AI Pro.

• 53:15David Imel?

  Yeah, just tell Gemini Spark to do it. Then we're good. Uh, anyway, they cost $99, which is the same price as the HomePod Mini, so I think that's kind of the market they're going after. If you'll remember, the Google Nest Hub Mini, they used to just throw through your window when you weren't looking.

• 53:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 53:30David Imel?

  So, this one, it seems like they think people might actually spend money on.

• 53:35Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 53:36David Imel?

  They do look very nice.

• 53:37Andrew Manganelli?

  It is, it's 20, the original Google Home was $129, right?

• 53:41David Imel?

  Yes.

• 53:41Speaker 01

  Usually around there.

• 53:41Andrew Manganelli?

  I still have one that's kicking. But yeah, these could be, oh. 99 feels expensive.

• 53:48David Imel?

  The Nest 7 Mini was like 30 bucks, but it was competing with the Echo Dot, which was also 30 bucks, and the sound quality was terrible.

• 53:55Speaker 01

  They'd be in like cereal boxes.

• 53:57Andrew Manganelli?

  These were 70. Yeah, no, really, every time you would buy any contract of an internet, whatever, it's like $100 of Google, and I would just be like,

• 54:04David Imel?

  And a Google Mini.

• 54:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Four Google Mini's.

• 54:07Speaker 04

  This time, I moved so many times, like three or four times, and every time I set up a new internet, they would just send me another one. So I had like four.

• 54:13David Imel?

  Black Friday, literally anything you bought came with a Google Mini.

• 54:17Andrew Manganelli?

  The receipt's printed on it?

• 54:18David Imel?

  Yeah. Yeah, so anyway.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  One lamp, four Google Mini's all trying to turn it on.

• 54:24David Imel?

  Huh?

• 54:27David Imel?

  Anyway, so it got announced today, if you're listening to this, it was two days ago on Wednesday, but they said during the Made by Google event last October, it would be out in spring. Technically, it is still spring. If you're listening to this for two more days, it comes out on the 25th, which is technically the summer. So it's up to you whether or not you think that they actually made that margin or not.

• 54:51Speaker 01

  And how much that means to you.

• 54:52David Imel?

  And how much that means to you. You know, we're just trying to keep them accountable over here.

• 54:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:57David Imel?

  So yeah, we should be getting review units pretty soon, so we'll be able to let you guys know what's up.

• 55:01Speaker 01

  Stay tuned.

• 55:02David Imel?

  Stay tuned.

• 55:02Speaker 01

  If you're curious, HomePod's still crap.

• 55:05David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 55:06Speaker 01

  Speaking of Google.

• 55:08David Imel?

  Speaking of Google.

• 55:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I jump in here?

• 55:09David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 55:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Google Android 17 is out, and it is the greatest Android release of all time. I'm calling it now.

• 55:16David Imel?

  Oh.

• 55:17Andrew Manganelli?

  At a glance, is [bleep] gone. I removed it this morning, and the weight off my shoulders is freeing. I am a free man.

• 55:26David Imel?

  For those who don't know.

• 55:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Everything is right in the world. At a glance, is sayonara.

• 55:31Speaker 01

  So this was the widget that was permanently on every Pixels homepage for the past decade or so? How long has that been?

• 55:39David Imel?

  Pretty long.

• 55:40Speaker 01

  It feels like a decade.

• 55:40David Imel?

  At least four or five years.

• 55:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, and you could just, just... Did anything crazy happen? Any fireworks show up, or you just like removed it and it just went away and that was it?

• 55:50Andrew Manganelli?

  I was like looking through all the changes. And then I forgot, like, wait, the first thing I was excited about this beta as a go was at a glance and I I clicked it thinking there's Yeah, yeah, I clicked it being like it might still not be there and I saw that removed from the screen. And I raised both my hands in the air and Adam was like, what's going on? And I was like, she gone.

• 56:13David Imel?

  This is life changing. What are you gonna do with all that space? You're gonna put icons up there?

• 56:16Andrew Manganelli?

  No, I'm gonna leave it as space because it's what I've always wanted it to be. Maybe now, actually, I can move my clock to where my clock used to always be at the top and kind of spanning across and I couldn't do that because of at a glance.

• 56:27David Imel?

  Yep.

• 56:27Andrew Manganelli?

  So now I have it in this weird bottom corner, but.

• 56:29David Imel?

  My clock can be anywhere I want it to be.

• 56:31Andrew Manganelli?

  It can just be free space. As someone who likes just a clean background.

• 56:36David Imel?

  A little bit of wallpaper.

• 56:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't need to have, yeah, the same, the date that's already on the screen somewhere else.

• 56:42David Imel?

  Before, poor use of space.

• 56:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Poor use of space.

• 56:45David Imel?

  But there are a lot of other updates. I know they're not as important.

• 56:49Andrew Manganelli?

  No, no.

• 56:49David Imel?

  That's the headliner.

• 56:50Andrew Manganelli?

  There's some other.

• 56:50David Imel?

  Nearly as important. Um, we got a new floating bubble window thing. Android has tried to do bubbles many times. Uh, this one is kind of tailored specifically at foldables. They're they're on regular Android phones as well. You can now make any app a bubble, so it kind of just floats above your other apps. And if you are on a large screen device, which is like a tablet or a foldable phone, which because Android is really leaning foldables, you now have a bubble bar and I do like that that set of words to get.

• 57:20Andrew Manganelli?

  You wanna see it? It's it can do up to four apps and then once you do it, it'll start knocking off the oldest one. But the coolest part, oh, sorry, I didn't show Marquez. C4 and other floating windows. The coolest part is when you drag it around, it just has this cool animation.

• 57:35David Imel?

  It's like the Windows XP when it would freeze.

• 57:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Physics based too. Like if you go slow, they all go slow. But if you go fast, they all go really fast.

• 57:42David Imel?

  Is this built into, has this been built into like third party skins on Android? Cause I feel like this isn't new.

• 57:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Their singular chat bubbles.

• 57:48David Imel?

  Chat bubbles are not new. They were only for messaging apps.

• 57:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Right, yeah.

• 57:52David Imel?

  Even so, this this is any app?

• 57:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. Not any app, but most apps. I have a couple of random ones that won't do it like.

• 58:00David Imel?

  Interesting.

• 58:00Andrew Manganelli?

  The hyperace one doesn't do it like, which doesn't really.

• 58:04David Imel?

  Maybe it's an API?

• 58:06Andrew Manganelli?

  It's probably. There's some smaller ones, like a weather app I have that doesn't. Oh, no, that one does, but yeah.

• 58:11David Imel?

  Weird. Um, yeah, so yeah, there's a bubble bar. If you have a foldable phone where it will just kind of be docked in the lower right corner. I feel like this is kind of gonna look kind of weird on, on Android sometimes because now, doesn't Android 16, didn't that introduce the dock on the foldable phones?

• 58:30Speaker 01

  At the bottom, yeah.

• 58:30David Imel?

  So now if you've got a dock of regular apps and a bubble bar of other apps.

• 58:35Speaker 01

  But the bottom dock hides.

• 58:37David Imel?

  Oh, it hides.

• 58:38Speaker 04

  Bubble bar.

• 58:39David Imel?

  Yeah. Yeah, okay, if it hides, like.

• 58:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Does a bubble bar hide?

• 58:43David Imel?

  No.

• 58:44Speaker 01

  It just stays.

• 58:45Andrew Manganelli?

  It stays, you put it wherever you want.

• 58:46Speaker 04

  Bubble bar.

• 58:48David Imel?

  But I find it useful because, for example, if you're like, I don't know, if you're watching a NBA sports game like myself.

• 58:55Speaker 01

  Oh my god.

• 58:56David Imel?

  And then, um, you're texting with your friends, right? You can quickly pull up the group chat, hit the group chat, say, "Wemby is freaking not getting those fouls. Those refs are not calling those fouls."

• 59:06Speaker 03

  Tell them.

• 59:07David Imel?

  Trying to break those ACLs. Talk about it. Nah, nah.

• 59:11Andrew Manganelli?

  It actually, like, when you've got four apps, it almost becomes this, like, quick switch. Because it takes up 80% of the screen.

• 59:19David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 59:19Andrew Manganelli?

  And then you can swap between the apps pretty easily.

• 59:22Speaker 03

  What four apps are you swapping between?

• 59:23David Imel?

  Discord.

• 59:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, Discord, Reddit.

• 59:26Speaker 01

  Slack, Reddit.

• 59:27Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm watching how many times Evan Spiegel looks stupid with those glasses on.

• 59:31David Imel?

  You could say that this is like a, sort of a minimal phone launcher in a way. If you just keep the bubble bar open. Bubble bar. Bubble bar. Then you just have those four apps that you switch.

• 59:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Would you, would you say having four apps open simultaneously is a minimal phone feature?

• 59:45David Imel?

  As long as they're non-social media apps, I don't know, something like that.

• 59:49Speaker 01

  Interesting.

• 59:49David Imel?

  All right, there's other features too, there's other features too. So we're gonna say, uh, oh yes, there's a foldable gaming mode. So now, if you have a foldable phone, you open it up, it splits the screen in half. So half of it is the game and half of it's a virtual gamepad. Which actually has a skin on it and doesn't just look like dumb. Gamers can't afford this. Now you can. If you're a gamer, you cannot afford this. I'm glad to tell you that if you're a gamer, you can now afford this. If you can afford a folding phone.

• 1:00:15Speaker 01

  If you have a two, that's not a problem.

• 1:00:17David Imel?

  Which.

• 1:00:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Maybe you can't afford this.

• 1:00:19David Imel?

  Uh, so that's kinda cool. I still think that the adaptable gamepads and also just Bluetooth ones are way better because I hate slamming my fingies against the screen. I really hate doing that. I've tried multiple times. It's not fun. It's uncomfortable.

• 1:00:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, but it makes for a good marketing ploy.

• 1:00:35David Imel?

  It does.

• 1:00:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Like, there's something about a folding screen with a fake gamepad that makes you go like, "That 3DS is sick." I mean, that Pixel Fold.

• 1:00:41David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, true. Um, okay, there is, now you can grant apps temporary location access, which is good, because before it was just like, permanent location access or no location access. And you can only share specific contacts instead of your entire address book. So if you really don't want apps to know all the stuff about you all the time, you have a little bit more control. There's now a new mark-as-lost feature in Find Hub, which is sort of their, uh, Find My kind of portal thing for your phone, where you can lock the phone so you can only unlock it with biometrics. And they said the reason was because if the thief knows your passcode, which is the entire point of a passcode, so I'm not really sure why the thief would know your passcode, but maybe they did.

• 1:01:24David Imel?

  You can make it so they can only unlock it if they're using a biometric login. So I guess that's kinda cool.

• 1:01:28Andrew Manganelli?

  What if he has your finger?

• 1:01:31David Imel?

  Yeah, then you're kinda screwed. Maybe they need blood flow.

• 1:01:34Andrew Manganelli?

  Did they even test this?

• 1:01:36David Imel?

  Yeah, it was kinda like when, when, uh, they, they came out with the Face Unlock and people were just unlocking their spouses' phones while they were sleeping. Anyway.

• 1:01:45Andrew Manganelli?

  You can also hide app names on home screen.

• 1:01:47David Imel?

  Yes.

• 1:01:48Andrew Manganelli?

  I have a request.

• 1:01:50David Imel?

  Yes.

• 1:01:50Andrew Manganelli?

  I really want, I don't know, none of you guys use folders on your docs, right?

• 1:01:54Speaker 04

  I do know.

• 1:01:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 1:01:56David Imel?

  No.

• 1:01:56Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you know how like you can name the folder?

• 1:01:58David Imel?

  No, not on the dock. I'm not a psycho.

• 1:01:59Andrew Manganelli?

  On your dock?

• 1:02:01David Imel?

  Oh, wait, we've done this before. We've done this before.

• 1:02:03Andrew Manganelli?

  But, so in the dock, it doesn't show app names anyways.

• 1:02:05David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:05Andrew Manganelli?

  But inside a folder, you name folders and it shows up on the bottom, right? Like

• 1:02:10David Imel?

  I mean, mine shows up on top, but yeah, same thing.

• 1:02:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, I don't want it to say anything.

• 1:02:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:14Andrew Manganelli?

  But if you do nothing.

• 1:02:15David Imel?

  It's still

• 1:02:16Andrew Manganelli?

  It

• 1:02:16David Imel?

  Poor use of space.

• 1:02:17Andrew Manganelli?

  It uses something, so you have to put a space in. But every time I open the folder, I can accidentally click that and then it brings the keyboard up.

• 1:02:24David Imel?

  Ugh.

• 1:02:24Andrew Manganelli?

  Which I ain't trying to do, just let me not name it. So give me hidden folder names.

• 1:02:28David Imel?

  I'll text Michelle for you.

• 1:02:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Also, please. Thank you. That would be, I would. That would be life changing.

• 1:02:34David Imel?

  I'll text Michelle.

• 1:02:35Andrew Manganelli?

  I already lost my place because I was mad about that.

• 1:02:38David Imel?

  No, you're good. It was, um.

• 1:02:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, yeah. And then there's, okay, there's a new resize bar in split screen that gives you arrows. So you can kind of tick it up in, um, you know, like if you want to go like 70, 30, it'll, it'll help it do that.

• 1:02:50David Imel?

  Oh, cool.

• 1:02:51Andrew Manganelli?

  In steps instead.

• 1:02:52David Imel?

  Nice.

• 1:02:52Andrew Manganelli?

  I thought that was really cool.

• 1:02:53David Imel?

  That's useful.

• 1:02:54Andrew Manganelli?

  I love this one. Separate Wi-Fi and mobile data tabs in quick settings.

• 1:02:59David Imel?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:02:59Andrew Manganelli?

  So good.

• 1:03:00David Imel?

  I feel like they used to have that.

• 1:03:02Andrew Manganelli?

  I know. All these things I'm excited about this were what it used to be.

• 1:03:07David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:07Andrew Manganelli?

  But it was so annoying to if you wanted to disable Wi-Fi for only mobile data.

• 1:03:12David Imel?

  Cause it was just an internet button.

• 1:03:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Have to click into, yeah.

• 1:03:13David Imel?

  One of the worst changes they ever made.

• 1:03:15Andrew Manganelli?

  The first two things I did when I downloaded it this morning was [BLEEP] at a glance and get mobile data as a separate quick setting.

• 1:03:23David Imel?

  Yeah, that's nice.

• 1:03:24Andrew Manganelli?

  It feels so good.

• 1:03:25David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Um, there's a new screen recorder. There's just a lot of UI updates with this that, um, the quick setting now it kind of like brings up a bubble that is the screen, screen recorder rather than like leaving you in quick settings as you leave with a couple of different options. It now defaults back to entire screen instead of singular app, which I think most people want to do.

• 1:03:43David Imel?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:03:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Um, there's new toggles for recording audio from device and microphone.

• 1:03:47David Imel?

  That's cool.

• 1:03:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Separate toggles, which is really nice. Um, you can change settings during the recording and like, if you want to enable taps halfway through your recording, you can go in and enable show taps.

• 1:03:57David Imel?

  That's nice.

• 1:03:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Um, and when you're done recording, there's just a new screen that lets you click edit, which will bring you into photos that it is already. Or you can just delete the video straight up there if you decide you don't like it anymore.

• 1:04:07David Imel?

  Oh, cool.

• 1:04:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Which is nice.

• 1:04:07David Imel?

  Nice.

• 1:04:09Andrew Manganelli?

  We just talked about Apple parental changes last week. There's some new ones for Android as well. A lot of them are very similar.

• 1:04:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:15Andrew Manganelli?

  You can set screen amount time per day. You can create downtime schedules so it can lock a children's device at night. There are app store filters based on content ratings. If, you know, like mature everyone, all those, it kind of has a list of those. You can limit time on specific apps or block apps entirely. And then through Family Link, you can do things that we just saw at the dub, like school time, app approvals and approved contacts. All great.

• 1:04:38Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:04:40Andrew Manganelli?

  I think that's kind of my list of things that got me excited. I thought it was really crazy that Michelle, someone we've talked about as like a Google leaker or just reporter for so long, just straight up has a mega thread on Android right now and saying like, "These are the changes we made." It's like, "Oh, okay." That's pretty awesome. You're at Google now. But he has a mega thread on our Android Reddit that says everything. And I also watched a really good video from In Depth Tech Reviews of all the little visual changes. I mean, things he was catching were like, "This pop-up now has an X to close out of it." It did it before and he's showing 16 and 17 next to each other. Or like, "Monochrome theme mode, now all the darkers are like more dark." Things I would never guess, but.

• 1:05:23Speaker 01

  That's cool.

• 1:05:24Andrew Manganelli?

  Just shout out to them. I enjoyed recapping all of that this morning. Cause I was too busy stomping on Adaglance's grave.

• 1:05:33Speaker 01

  Like parade around the house being like, "It's going, it's going, it's going."

• 1:05:38Speaker 03

  Lane's like, "I don't know what you're talking about."

• 1:05:41Speaker 01

  All right, I got one more thing I want to share. It's actually a video I want to play for you guys, but I'm just going to play the audio and I want to get your reaction to it.

• 1:05:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 1:05:47Speaker 01

  This sound you're about to hear is from the all-new 2027 Porsche Taycan, which has added eShift. They are the newest electric car company to add fake gear shifts when you paddle shift. So it's like an eight-speed simulated gears. The Taycan already made sounds, but now this is what your Taycan will sound like in 2027.

• 1:06:18Andrew Manganelli?

  As a non-car person that does nothing to me.

• 1:06:20David Imel?

  I don't.

• 1:06:21Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't get it.

• 1:06:22David Imel?

  I'm not against it.

• 1:06:23Speaker 01

  Do you guys, when you drive a quiet car, this is such a specific question, but like, why, why are we, maybe this is just a sign of the times, why are we emulating gas car things? It seems insulting to emulate a gas car with such an obviously fake sound when it's obviously electric, like it doesn't have the same emotion as a gas car, it doesn't have the vibrations of a gas car. Like, is this, does it not give you vibrations?

• 1:06:52David Imel?

  No, not really, not really.

• 1:06:55Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it could be like, why not own, you can, and the Taycan kind of did this before. I still never know if I'm pronouncing that right, by the way, so someone white me up in the comments. Thanks for the engagement. The, like, didn't they have different sounds? Just make fun sounds. You can do whatever you want and your choice is old gas car.

• 1:07:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, they, they had sound before. It was very like spaceship-y. Famously, actually, the Taycan is one of the loudest electric cars on the outside. I can hear Taycans driving around my neighborhood because they just have this

• 1:07:27Speaker 01

  this like sound that they play on the outside. And it's fine, but they're never trying to sound like a gas car specifically. You might remember we had the Ioniq 5N here that did this, or we had that, uh, the electric Dodge Charger here. It didn't do the gear shifts, but it, it had a gas car emulating speaker sound. And I, my theory is that this is very much going to be a sign of the times, specifically when electric cars are not really popular yet, but car companies are trying to make them as familiar as possible to people who like gas cars by emulating gas cars. And this is one of the things that they're doing is like, oh yeah, you can, you can fake gear shift and it kind of sounds like your gas car,

• 1:08:11Speaker 01

  even though it's obviously not a gas car.

• 1:08:13David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:14Andrew Manganelli?

  The people that wanted to, I have nothing against the sound of gas cars. I, I understand, but that usually is like, there's something involved in all of that. That's like a piece of machinery making that to emulate it. The people who like that piece of machinery. Don't want just the sound. They want the whole orchestra playing of everything. And like, I just, I also think we're far enough at EVs that we don't need to bring people over by being like, "Look, it sounds like your car."

• 1:08:41Speaker 01

  I think they still do. I think they feel like they have to, just because they're not flying off, they're not flying off the shelves. Like, they're trying to like, find new ways to bring, to make them. Cause there's lots of other, um, I almost made an autofocus video about this, but there's lots of other features that EV manufacturers will add that are specifically to mimic people who are, this is their first electric car. So when you take your foot off the accelerator pedal-

• 1:09:04Andrew Manganelli?

  That I think makes sense.

• 1:09:04Speaker 01

  And it coasts instead of regenning, that's to mimic a gas car. When you're sitting at a stoplight, and you take your foot off the brake, and your car starts to creep forward-

• 1:09:13David Imel?

  I hate that.

• 1:09:13Speaker 01

  That is a gas car thing.

• 1:09:15David Imel?

  Yep.

• 1:09:16Speaker 01

  It doesn't have to happen in an electric car, but they will add torque and, and actually start to roll you forward to mimic a gas car.

• 1:09:22David Imel?

  Why would they do that?

• 1:09:23Speaker 01

  Cause that's what people are familiar with.

• 1:09:24David Imel?

  They're taking away the good things that electric cars add to cars.

• 1:09:27Andrew Manganelli?

  I will say, the, the coasting off the brake, like, when you go from a gas car to your first time in an EV car, you feel like a new driver because you're just like, like, jerking forward and back, getting used to it.

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  I think, like, that was the thing that I thought Tesla did really well, is they just threw all that stuff out. Like, back in the day, they were like, "Yeah, there's regen. Get used to it. It's more efficient and it adds range." It adds range. It's better, one pedal driving, instead of two pedals. You almost never use your friction brakes.

• 1:09:53David Imel?

  Yeah, it's awesome.

• 1:09:53Speaker 01

  And it doesn't, it'd have creep mode, but like, that's off by default. And there's no power button in the car.

• 1:09:59David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:59Speaker 01

  You just get in and it's on. Like, all these cars now have like a on button, even though it's just like a, it's an iPad. Like, you just get in and it's on, so.

• 1:10:07Speaker 04

  I think we go in the complete other direction. If they're gonna do these sounds, I want a clutch. I want a manual stick. Go all in.

• 1:10:16Speaker 01

  This is pretty close to all in. This is paddle shifting. There's no third pedal, but like-

• 1:10:20Speaker 04

  That's what I'm saying. It's not the same.

• 1:10:22Speaker 01

  I mean, you can redline it and lose clu, and lose torque.

• 1:10:26David Imel?

  Does anyone have a fake clutch?

• 1:10:27Speaker 01

  I don't think so.

• 1:10:28David Imel?

  You could do e-clutch.

• 1:10:30Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 1:10:31Speaker 03

  Don't give them ideas. Why would you do that?

• 1:10:33Speaker 01

  Can go all in. At that point, you're just, why even, I mean-

• 1:10:36David Imel?

  That, all of these are why even.

• 1:10:39Speaker 01

  Why are you buying an electric car in the first place if you want a clutch?

• 1:10:42David Imel?

  That's true.

• 1:10:42Speaker 04

  If you want a clutch, we already have Jalen Brunson, so.

• 1:10:44Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 1:10:47David Imel?

  You made that, yes.

• 1:10:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, OG.

• 1:10:49Speaker 01

  OG.

• 1:10:49Andrew Manganelli?

  I do feel like, all the EVs are basically like- Right now, the selling point is this will totally drive itself or like this makes big gas noises. It's just like, yeah, what if they just drive well and last like a pretty long time?

• 1:11:03David Imel?

  We should just need to educate people on the fact that all of these EV features are good for your life and they're enjoyable to you.

• 1:11:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think they're my, my, the way I've described it has always been that there are certain types of cars that are best to go electric because when you make a car electric, what happens? It gets bigger, it gets heavier, more expensive, but also gets smoother and torqueier and more powerful and quieter than ever. Okay. So then any car that is already big and heavy and you want to be smooth and quiet, it's perfect.

• 1:11:35David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:35Speaker 01

  Escalade, SUVs, big sedans, like all those, when they went electric, it was the best version of that car that had ever been made.

• 1:11:44David Imel?

  Although isn't that Escalade, isn't the whole thing with the Escalade that it's super freaking loud?

• 1:11:48Speaker 01

  Um, no, that's just the Escalade V specifically, but the Escalades you see in Manhattan that are all like Uber Blacks.

• 1:11:54David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:54Speaker 01

  It's like, that's the best Escalade ever now is the, is the electric.

• 1:11:58Andrew Manganelli?

  That's just like, this is a Yukon, but I can charge way more money for putting people in the back of the van.

• 1:12:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. So sports cars are the worst possible car to go electric.

• 1:12:06David Imel?

  Even though I feel like that's what people would want.

• 1:12:09Speaker 01

  Well, it's a, it's a, it's a really good method of propulsion and I'm getting into the easy rate, but like it's, you get all your torque right away. It's like very quick in a straight line and a lot of the world records for acceleration are by electric cars, but people want a lightweight sports car. They want an engaging sports car. They want a small sports car and none of these things are really the upside of electric cars.

• 1:12:31David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:31Speaker 01

  So, yeah.

• 1:12:33David Imel?

  They're trying stuff like fake gear shifts.

• 1:12:35Speaker 01

  Yeah. Just as someone who doesn't really care about cars that much, but obviously like the look of a Porsche is still very, very nice looking. I would love a Porsche electric car.

• 1:12:48Speaker 01

  This will convince a non-zero number of people to get a Taycan. And we'll see, we'll see how it goes.

• 1:12:53David Imel?

  We'll see how that goes.

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:54David Imel?

  Yeah, probably one.

• 1:12:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:56David Imel?

  Well, it looks better than the Ferrari, so that's all we gotta say. By the way, I had a question that I did, I meant to ask when, on our Ferrari episode when we talked about the, um, what is it called?

• 1:13:05Speaker 01

  Luce.

• 1:13:06David Imel?

  Luce. Do you know why they called it the Luce? Nobody explained this.

• 1:13:09Speaker 01

  It's Italian for, let me find this.

• 1:13:11Andrew Manganelli?

  Uh, they said light? No. I'm Italian.

• 1:13:14Speaker 01

  I believe so. Light, yes, correct.

• 1:13:17Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm Italian.

• 1:13:17David Imel?

  What about the light?

• 1:13:18Andrew Manganelli?

  I mean, sorry. Light.

• 1:13:20David Imel?

  Wait, isn't it heavier though, because it's needy?

• 1:13:22Speaker 01

  Oh, that's, that's actually kind of a pun. I don't know if you're joking or not, but I think they mean like, lights.

• 1:13:28Andrew Manganelli?

  They had this very.

• 1:13:29David Imel?

  The light of God.

• 1:13:30Andrew Manganelli?

  There's like a very marketing of like, they're doing it because this is like the light. I actually didn't say the light at the end of the tunnel of where we're going to, but, light at the end of the tunnel is usually what you see before you die, which was a really funny thing after launching the worst looking Ferrari ever.

• 1:13:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think it was more of a, just a, like, lights are electric, like, this is the, the electrical.

• 1:13:55David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:13:55Speaker 01

  Thing.

• 1:13:56David Imel?

  I can see like an Italian it meaning light. I can see that just being a cool name. But I just wanted to know, because it sounded more like a Lutador, you know, and I was like.

• 1:14:04Speaker 01

  If you've looked back at other Ferrari names, I mean, they're an Italian company and they have extremely Italian names for all their models.

• 1:14:10David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:14:11Speaker 01

  They recently came out with a 12-cylinder car, and so they named it the, the Dettche Cylinderi. That's the name of the car.

• 1:14:20David Imel?

  It's the 12-cylinder.

• 1:14:21Speaker 01

  Yeah. So.

• 1:14:22Andrew Manganelli?

  The Urus.

• 1:14:24Speaker 01

  That's Lamborghini. I mean, that's also Italian, but yeah.

• 1:14:26David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:26Speaker 01

  Uh, the Amalfi.

• 1:14:28Andrew Manganelli?

  They just said the light towards the future and innovation.

• 1:14:31David Imel?

  The Amalfi.

• 1:14:32Andrew Manganelli?

  It's not end of the tunnel, but.

• 1:14:33Speaker 01

  True.

• 1:14:33David Imel?

  Yeah, what does Urus mean?

• 1:14:35Speaker 01

  Uduz? I have no idea. No clue.

• 1:14:38David Imel?

  What about the Toyota Yaris?

• 1:14:40Speaker 01

  Speaking of things that start with a T.

• 1:14:42David Imel?

  T.

• 1:14:43Speaker 01

  Trivia.

• 1:14:45David Imel?

  What else started with a T?

• 1:14:50Speaker 01

  Tesla.

• 1:14:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, I thought that was an actual timeout.

• 1:14:52Speaker 01

  Timeout.

• 1:14:53Andrew Manganelli?

  I thought you did.

• 1:14:53Speaker 01

  Toyota.

• 1:14:54David Imel?

  Toyota.

• 1:14:56Speaker 01

  Timurario.

• 1:14:56Andrew Manganelli?

  I take timeouts seriously.

• 1:14:57Speaker 01

  Tim Cook.

• 1:14:59Speaker 03

  What's up gamers?

• 1:15:00Speaker 01

  What's up?

• 1:15:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Mariah's here, by the way.

• 1:15:04Speaker 01

  I'm enjoying your guys' symmetrical shirts.

• 1:15:07Andrew Manganelli?

  The green? I wish I got the green memo.

• 1:15:09David Imel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:15:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's cool.

• 1:15:11Speaker 03

  Um, the question that I definitely totally wrote for you today is, code names used to be a whole thing with Android, but it's kind of fell by the wayside. Still, the code name of Android 17 was what?

• 1:15:30Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:15:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't.

• 1:15:31Speaker 03

  What's?

• 1:15:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know.

• 1:15:32Speaker 01

  I don't think I know.

• 1:15:33Speaker 03

  I don't either. This is great.

• 1:15:35Speaker 01

  Bubble bar.

• 1:15:36David Imel?

  We'll find out together.

• 1:15:37Speaker 01

  Bubble bar.

• 1:15:38Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah. Can you say bubble bar for me real quick?

• 1:15:41Speaker 01

  Bubble bar.

• 1:15:43Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:15:44Speaker 01

  That's nice. All right. Well, we'll learn something new then. Answers will be at the end. We'll be right back.

• 1:15:59Speaker 01

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• 1:16:43Speaker 01

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• 1:17:26Speaker 06

  This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required. Compatibility and availability varies 18 plus.

• 1:17:51Andrew Manganelli?

  All right, welcome back. We are going to quickly talk about the UK social media ban because we got tagged a lot of, on a lot of places to ask about this, but we live in the US. So I don't have too much to say about it, so I quickly wrote down what I saw. We'll get a couple of thoughts, but, okay. Children under the age of 16 will be banned from using social media platforms like TikTok, YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, and X. I believe this is supposed to be happening by next spring. Messaging apps like WhatsApp and Signal are not part of that. There will be doing possibly curfews for children under 18 that would require breaks at nighttime to stop infinite scrolling.

• 1:18:31Andrew Manganelli?

  Ways to prevent children, they will, there will hopefully also, or in their eyes, hopefully be ways to prevent children under 16 from talking to people on online games. And the UK said in a statement that the policy will go further than any other country in restricting children's online, time online. One of the reasons they said this was because they claim big tech has had multiple opportunities to try and protect children, but they have failed. So that's why they're taking this on.

• 1:18:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:58Andrew Manganelli?

  They're not wrong on that.

• 1:19:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:00Andrew Manganelli?

  It's just generally when we see stuff like this, the problem is, is a lot of government officials just don't really understand the internet.

• 1:19:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:08Andrew Manganelli?

  So we have two separate forms of people that understand completely different things. We have capitalists who want to make as much money as possible. I don't care how old you are. I don't care what you do. As long as you spend time on app, I make money.

• 1:19:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:22Andrew Manganelli?

  That's never going to be for us.

• 1:19:24Speaker 01

  Andrew Manganelli, 2026.

• 1:19:27Andrew Manganelli?

  And then you have government officials who are attempting to protect, but generally probably pretty ignorant about all of this.

• 1:19:33Speaker 01

  Eighty-six years old.

• 1:19:34Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:36David Imel?

  Yeah, I have so many thoughts about this. This is always a very nuanced topic. Anytime you bring kids into the equation, it's always such a nuanced topic because it's like, obviously, we want to protect the kids. Obviously, there's a lot of cyberbullying. Obviously, there's a lot of bad stuff that kids can get into online and that predators can, you know, access children easily and whatever. That's all bad. But like.

• 1:19:58Speaker 01

  But.

• 1:19:58David Imel?

  Yeah, and I know. And it's really hard to have this conversation without people screaming at you because it's very, very nuanced. But, and we were having this conversation a little bit off the show, but why is YouTube included here?

• 1:20:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, I'm maybe biased. I started, I started on YouTube when I was 15, but YouTube was a very different place back then.

• 1:20:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 1:20:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. And social media was a very different place back then. And we mentioned like the infinite scrolling thing, which is, I think, mostly what this gets at, which is like the addictiveness of a lot of these platforms and how much time it makes people spend online.

• 1:20:36David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:36Speaker 01

  So that makes a lot of sense. My angle, though, on YouTube is like, uh, okay, YouTube, does that mean you just straight up can't access YouTube if you're under the age of 16 and they have to add some sort of a paywall? Or does that just mean you can't have an account? In which case you're logged out and will get recommended way more insane.

• 1:20:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Exactly what Hank Green said, and I thought it was a really.

• 1:20:55David Imel?

  It's a good point.

• 1:20:56Andrew Manganelli?

  Obvious take is like.

• 1:20:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, you won't be able to make an account, but you can probably still log on to just YouTube with no account, watch things, and now the recommendations are all over the place. You actually will lose restrictions that people could possibly. Put on it.

• 1:21:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:09David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Sorry.

• 1:21:11Speaker 03

  Regionally, could they make that an option where you have to have an account?

• 1:21:14Andrew Manganelli?

  You would have to log in.

• 1:21:17David Imel?

  They could force that.

• 1:21:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Possibly.

• 1:21:18David Imel?

  It's all a big question. Um, yeah, I don't know. I mean, you know, the movie Backrooms that came out recently?

• 1:21:24Andrew Manganelli?

  I have not seen it. I only know about it because of you guys.

• 1:21:26David Imel?

  I haven't seen it, but the director is 20 years old and he made his first short when he was 17. And all of that came from like a creepypasta that he like read online and was part of a community of people that were contributing to these horror stories. And that to me is a representation of the value that the internet and social media has brought to youth these days where they have so much access to creativity and learning at a very young age, right? Like when we were kids.

• 1:21:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:57David Imel?

  Google was like so new and the idea of going on a forum and like finding answers to things was brand new. And so the speed at which we could learn at was very walled off by our access, our ability to access information. And the, the two-sided coin, the like two-sided two-face. The double-edged sword of all of this is like, yes, the benefit of infinite information is infinite information and you can, you can get young, young, young people creating like amazing things because their brains are sponges and they soak up information way faster than us 30-year-olds do. On the other side of that coin, unlimited information and unlimited,

• 1:22:40David Imel?

  all types of information. It's not learning, it's not all learning information. It's not all educational. A lot of it's really bad. A lot of it's porn. A lot of it is just like things that kids with brains that are not good at tuning, like filtering out what's good content versus bad content. And you know what their dopamine receptors respond to. That's what makes all of these incredibly complex topics.

• 1:23:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. I always like to advocate for like some sort of built into education like internet literacy. I kind of remember a little of that when I was growing up, like learning how to Google things. I don't remember what age it was or what class it was, but like explaining if you put no colon, then you could like

• 1:23:19Speaker 04

  Oh, right.

• 1:23:20Speaker 01

  exclude words from like your Google search where if you put them in quotes, then it will have to appear in that order and stuff like that, like how to search Google and then filter through your results and find primary sources versus secondary sources. All of that when I'm writing a paper, I had to learn all of that. And I wonder, because I'm not in school and I don't have a kid, like, how's that going? Are people, is it just out of control? Like there's AI, there's all sorts of changes in the way that you find information on the internet. And it's just like, how do we teach kids how to navigate the internet? Maybe it's too hard. We just ban social media until they turn 16. Maybe that's the solution. Feels kind of heavy handed to me, but again, I don't have a kid, so I don't know.

• 1:23:58Andrew Manganelli?

  I feel like all of us here can probably talk about our own success stories as being children of the internet and what we did back then. But like you said, it is so much different. Like in my high school years with how like overly conscious I was of thinking everyone was always thinking, like, I can't imagine that day and age now with social media where we're all posting stuff and we're all commenting on people's things. I could text like two people after 8pm because that's when I didn't have to pay for text messages. Now anyone can make comments in group chats and everything. So it's a, it's an age that I don't understand quite as well. I don't know if this is exactly how to do it. I'm glad people are trying to find it, but it really feels like most of this is on, if

• 1:24:43Andrew Manganelli?

  you're on the companies, but I do also like these things like we just saw from Apple and Google of like enhanced parental controls. So the parents can make individual choices for their kids.

• 1:24:52Speaker 01

  It's a little more nuanced.

• 1:24:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, I was just going to say, I don't think that everyone is dreaming for legislation for this, but the companies didn't rise to the occasion.

• 1:25:01Andrew Manganelli?

  No.

• 1:25:02Speaker 04

  So this is the only solution.

• 1:25:03Speaker 01

  It reminds me of when we, when the UK was like USB type C iPhone, do it now.

• 1:25:08Speaker 04

  Well, remember the EU.

• 1:25:10Speaker 01

  Sorry, the EU.

• 1:25:11Speaker 04

  Because the UK is.

• 1:25:13Speaker 01

  So the EU, and this was like, okay, this one.

• 1:25:18Speaker 01

  Piece of legislation makes sense here and it's going to advance it and there's no downsides here. So obviously it feels heavy handed, but it's actually going to work and we all benefit from it. But yeah, this is, there's so many different factors in the way people engage with the internet and all the different parts of the internet. That I, you know, it's possible that this feels like the most complete or safe solution to the UK. But it is just the UK.

• 1:25:42David Imel?

  I think they need to just enforce, like, just like the EU forced USB-C, they forced removable batteries in a lot of devices. They need to force insanely like powerful parental controls and they need to educate people on that. Because I agree, a 13 year old should absolutely not be on X.com. 100%.

• 1:26:02Speaker 03

  I don't think a 30 year old should be on X.

• 1:26:04David Imel?

  Should not be on X.com. There's so much stuff on there you should not be looking at. And I don't know, I just, it kind of feels to me like stopping access at an individual level is a much smarter way to control this kind of stuff. Because also, a lot of the time when governments institute large sweeping bans on things, they're, they always use kids as like a fake agenda. And slip a bunch of like privacy nightmare stuff underneath it. I don't know if that's the case with this one, but it happens a lot.

• 1:26:34Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, I don't know UK governance very well, but I would not trust the US with regulating any of this.

• 1:26:40David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:40Speaker 01

  I will also say on YouTube, there's, I just, maybe I'm YouTube pilled, but there's so much good stuff on YouTube.

• 1:26:46David Imel?

  I know.

• 1:26:46Speaker 01

  Like, I remember in high school, like, feeling like I'm falling behind on a class and then looking up on YouTube and finding Sal and watching him teach me the same stuff that the teacher couldn't. And actually learning and catching back up in class. That was YouTube.

• 1:26:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Mine was, I'm falling behind in class. I'm not going to pass it anyways. I might as well watch some stuff on YouTube.

• 1:27:05Speaker 01

  That's the other half of YouTube. There's gotta be some sort of self-control. You gotta have it all. You gotta have it all.

• 1:27:10David Imel?

  And this is why I use the Backrooms example, because like, that kid could not have made that short that got 8 million views, or no, 80 million views. And then, you know, made a movie with a major studio that made just as much money as a Star Wars movie. You know, that, that just couldn't have happened. Also, he did a bunch of like 3D modeling and effects. I guarantee you, he learned all of those skills on YouTube.

• 1:27:33Speaker 01

  Yep. Tutorials. That's how I started. All the tutorial videos you watch.

• 1:27:36David Imel?

  And he was 17 when he put, when he put his first short out. So he wouldn't have been able to learn those skills when he was 16. You know what I mean? So. I don't know. It's tough.

• 1:27:46Andrew Manganelli?

  It's just tough because for every success story, there's also the story of someone getting abducted, or someone being groomed, or someone thinking about self-harm from all these things. So there's, there are all of those things out there. We're not trying to diminish that.

• 1:27:58David Imel?

  No.

• 1:27:59Andrew Manganelli?

  I do think YouTube is the one example of like, maybe it's less of that because it's less of a personal, unless you are physically uploading a lot of videos. It's much less so than Facebook, Instagram, where you're like, this is all of my life. But this is also why every time we talk about social media, I weirdly don't think of YouTube as the same social media as Instagram X. They feel like personal pages.

• 1:28:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, maybe ban uploading to YouTube before a certain age.

• 1:28:25David Imel?

  That is probably good. I would agree with that. Yeah. Because every time I see like a, like a video from a kid that gets uploaded and everyone like comments like, yay, this is awesome. Good. I'm like, I don't really like this. I don't want to be.

• 1:28:38Speaker 01

  It's supposed to auto detect when there's a kid and it doesn't allow comments or something. There's this, all these things are supposed to happen when it auto detects that it's a child account, but that it doesn't always work either.

• 1:28:48David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28:49David Imel?

  Yeah. Well, speaking of bans, last week, we talked about how Anthropic released the model that they said was too dangerous to release.

• 1:28:59Speaker 01

  Classic.

• 1:29:00David Imel?

  So they did that for a hot two days, maybe three. And then, sort of out of nowhere, it got banned by the US government. So this is very funny in a way, because Dario has constantly just been like, regulate us, regulate us, regulate us. And then they regulated them and then they're like, ah. So there's that. However, as usual, the way that the US government went about banning this was extremely short notice and something that there was just no way that they could possibly fix. Because the administration's problem with it was that they didn't want foreign nationals, including Anthropic employees, to be able to access the model.

• 1:29:45Andrew Manganelli?

  In the US or outside the US. Essentially, if you're foreign, we don't want you to use it.

• 1:29:49David Imel?

  Which is just.

• 1:29:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Not, I wish I was kidding.

• 1:29:52David Imel?

  Just classic.

• 1:29:53Speaker 03

  How do you even enforce that?

• 1:29:54David Imel?

  You can't. And this is why they turned the model off.

• 1:29:57Andrew Manganelli?

  They had to turn the model completely off because they thought that was the only way they could actually do that. And it seems like the reasoning behind it is because of some concerns of essentially jailbreaking it, which would bypass a bunch of the different restrictions and things they had on it because it kept finding. Potential cybersecurity risks and all that, so they're trying to avoid all of that.

• 1:30:17David Imel?

  There were a lot of funny memes around Mythos because they specifically like, or sorry, not Mythos. Fable, Fable 5 is a distill, it's a cut down version of Mythos with more restrictions on it. Guardrails.

• 1:30:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, can I say something really fast? That's not really, everyone kept talking about Fable 5 and I thought a new version of Fable, the game came out? Because it was all, all of the things I saw of it were like 3D renders and stuff. And I was like, oh, I remember that game. And then I realized how wrong I was.

• 1:30:43David Imel?

  Okay, well, the, one of the major restrictions on Fable 5 over Mythos was that you can't talk about biology. Obviously, they were doing this because they didn't want people to make weapons, like bio weapons and stuff. But there were a lot of funny memes where someone was like, my dog is not feeling well, what should I do? And it's, it's just like you've been reported to the FBI. Anyway, funny. There's a, you know, there are AI reporters that are way better at handling these detailed things. Hayden Field over at The Verge did a really amazing article about this called Inside the Fight Over Claude Mythos 5. You should definitely go read that. Very complex. It seems that they have been going to Washington, trying to work with the US government and try to figure out a way

• 1:31:27David Imel?

  to find a path forward. They went last week, they did not find a path forward. So, uh, yeah, in the next few days, I guess we'll, we'll see if they can.

• 1:31:36Andrew Manganelli?

  That was still banned at the time of recording.

• 1:31:37David Imel?

  Yeah, apparently it was tipped off to the US government by some Amazon researchers, um, which is-

• 1:31:44Andrew Manganelli?

  I think at AWS.

• 1:31:45David Imel?

  At AWS, which is both ironic and interesting at the same time because Amazon is a major investor in Anthropic.

• 1:31:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 1:31:54David Imel?

  But also, you know, tin foil hat time. Amazon could have some high incentive to make it so Mythos could only be accessed through AWS. And they could go to the government and say, anyway, I don't wanna, I don't wanna throw, I don't wanna throw conspiracy theories out there.

• 1:32:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Like as if they're scared of cybersecurity attacks, AWS would be a major target and they don't want-

• 1:32:15David Imel?

  Yeah, probably that too.

• 1:32:16Speaker 03

  Also, Andrew, uh, you're not crazy. There was actually a Fable gameplay demo that came out last week.

• 1:32:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, was there really?

• 1:32:24Speaker 03

  Yeah, because someone else was telling me about it, so you're not entirely wrong.

• 1:32:26David Imel?

  Is it Fable 5?

• 1:32:28Speaker 01

  If it was also five, that would be.

• 1:32:29Speaker 03

  I think it.

• 1:32:30Speaker 01

  Really funny.

• 1:32:30David Imel?

  It might have been.

• 1:32:32Speaker 03

  Whatever the newest one is, I don't know.

• 1:32:33David Imel?

  By the way.

• 1:32:34Andrew Manganelli?

  I haven't paid attention.

• 1:32:34David Imel?

  Nobody really knows why Anthropic called this Fable 5, because it's the first Fable model, but they called it 5.

• 1:32:40Andrew Manganelli?

  I've given up on guessing AI model.

• 1:32:43Speaker 01

  Head start on competition.

• 1:32:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Since Nano Banana, I don't care about any of what they're called.

• 1:32:46David Imel?

  AI pro powered by personal intelligence. Yeah. So, anyway.

• 1:32:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Overthought.

• 1:32:51David Imel?

  As of time recording, that is still banned. We'll see if that changes in the coming days. Uh, yeah. So that's, that's about it for the news this week. So now we're gonna do the thing

• 1:33:03David Imel?

  that we always do at the end.

• 1:33:05Speaker 01

  Which is give me trivia points.

• 1:33:08David Imel?

  We don't always do that, unfortunately.

• 1:33:10Speaker 04

  Quick update on the score. Marquez with 28, Andrew with 26, and David with 31. Question one. Snap has launched multiple things under the Snapchat umbrella, but which of these is not real? A. Snapchat Apple Watch app. B. Snap Cash. C. Snap Code. Or D. Snap Tracks. With an X, of course, because it's tech.

• 1:33:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it, did we all assume he meant with an X when he said it out loud? I thought of it 100%. What, what does it do again?

• 1:33:43Speaker 01

  Beatmaker.

• 1:33:44Speaker 04

  It is a mini beat machine app inside of Snapchat, allegedly.

• 1:33:48Andrew Manganelli?

  I thought it tracked you.

• 1:33:50David Imel?

  Oh, it does.

• 1:33:51Andrew Manganelli?

  That is a thing in Snapchat, though.

• 1:33:53David Imel?

  It does.

• 1:33:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Find my, no. What is it called?

• 1:33:56David Imel?

  Snap Maps.

• 1:33:56Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it Snap Maps?

• 1:33:57David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:58Speaker 04

  Well, flip him and read. What do you got?

• 1:33:59Andrew Manganelli?

  We all said the same thing.

• 1:34:00Speaker 01

  He all said the Apple Watch app.

• 1:34:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:03Speaker 04

  Incorrect. There is a Snapchat Apple Watch app.

• 1:34:05Andrew Manganelli?

  What does it do?

• 1:34:06David Imel?

  The beat one?

• 1:34:06Speaker 04

  No idea.

• 1:34:07David Imel?

  Was it tracks?

• 1:34:08Speaker 04

  It was Snap Tracks.

• 1:34:09David Imel?

  Damn it.

• 1:34:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Was it really?

• 1:34:10Speaker 01

  I wrote tracks and crossed it out.

• 1:34:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Man.

• 1:34:12David Imel?

  Um, interesting.

• 1:34:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Wow.

• 1:34:14David Imel?

  Does it just, did the Apple Watch app just allow you to like remotely shutter? Is that what it was for?

• 1:34:19Speaker 01

  That seems like the only thing it could possibly do.

• 1:34:22Speaker 04

  According to, uh... Google AI overview.

• 1:34:25David Imel?

  Oh, no.

• 1:34:25Speaker 04

  It is an official watch OS application designed to supplement messaging on the go.

• 1:34:29Andrew Manganelli?

  I bought Claire a pair of Crocs for Mother's Day and they're too small. So I wanted to return them, but she didn't tell me they were too small till like way too late.

• 1:34:38Speaker 03

  She's too nervous.

• 1:34:39Andrew Manganelli?

  So I went on AI overview and went, what's the Croc return policy? And I said 45 days. So I'm trying to return them and nothing's coming up to return them. So I get on the chat and I'm constantly just telling this guy, there's just no way. He's like, that's because our window's 30 days. It's past 30 days. And then I just closed the chat because I was so embarrassed. Went to the overview where it said 45 days again, click the link and the link just brings you to a page that says 30 days on.

• 1:35:04David Imel?

  What?

• 1:35:04Andrew Manganelli?

  It's

• 1:35:05David Imel?

  Just made it up.

• 1:35:06Andrew Manganelli?

  It's so funny that it constantly sources its incorrect information.

• 1:35:09David Imel?

  Yeah, source, I made it up.

• 1:35:13Speaker 03

  Sources.

• 1:35:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Source. It's just a page that says, trust me, bro.

• 1:35:16David Imel?

  Trust me, bro. That's Google's new tagline.

• 1:35:20Speaker 03

  We need internet literacy.

• 1:35:22Speaker 01

  I would like to teach an internet literacy class.

• 1:35:25Speaker 03

  Please.

• 1:35:25David Imel?

  What if we made one?

• 1:35:26Speaker 01

  Like a high school level, like here's how to navigate the internet.

• 1:35:30David Imel?

  We should make one for the studio channel.

• 1:35:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:33Andrew Manganelli?

  I feel like you could like volunteer at a library and do that.

• 1:35:37Speaker 04

  But if we make one for YouTube, people in the UK under 16 wouldn't be able to watch it in spring.

• 1:35:41Speaker 01

  I feel like you have to teach a physical class, like in person, be like, everybody go to google.com. All right, and ask it a question. All right, see how you got an AI overview? All right, here's what we're gonna do. Scroll down. Anyway, okay.

• 1:35:55David Imel?

  Go to Wikipedia.

• 1:35:56Speaker 03

  So the second question is, code names used to be used, uh, let's see.

• 1:36:01David Imel?

  For Android.

• 1:36:02Speaker 03

  Code names used to be used a whole, how did you word this? Sorry, I'm having a stroke. It's too warm in here. Code names are a thing with Android, but they're not really as popular, I guess, anymore. And this is me abbreviating. Okay, what is the code name?

• 1:36:21Speaker 03

  What is the code name of Android 17?

• 1:36:23David Imel?

  Shamu.

• 1:36:24Speaker 03

  Please, God, somebody tell me.

• 1:36:28David Imel?

  Meat hook.

• 1:36:30Speaker 04

  I want you to come in and summarize every question.

• 1:36:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I wish, I don't even know.

• 1:36:35Speaker 01

  Is it not still? 16 either.

• 1:36:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it a dessert still?

• 1:36:37David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:38Speaker 01

  It probably is some, think of, okay, it's a logical, what letter would it be? So.

• 1:36:42Andrew Manganelli?

  It would be Q, right?

• 1:36:44David Imel?

  No, we already, we passed you a long time ago.

• 1:36:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Then they didn't go alphabetically.

• 1:36:49David Imel?

  No, they did.

• 1:36:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, yeah, because it was.

• 1:36:53David Imel?

  I don't even know what we're on.

• 1:36:55Speaker 03

  I don't even know where we are.

• 1:36:56Andrew Manganelli?

  David, that spelling is insane.

• 1:37:00Speaker 03

  Alright, what do you got, David? Can you read that for me?

• 1:37:03Andrew Manganelli?

  No, spell it. No, read what you wrote. Letters. Spell it. Spell it.

• 1:37:09David Imel?

  Why are you trying to bubblegate embarrass me right now? T I E R R E I M. Wait, see, E M I S S E U. Tiramisu. Tiramisu.

• 1:37:22Speaker 01

  That cannot be how it's spelled.

• 1:37:23Andrew Manganelli?

  It's not.

• 1:37:24Speaker 03

  You know, I don't even know how it's spelled.

• 1:37:25Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't even know if I can spell it right, but I know you're gonna close it.

• 1:37:27David Imel?

  Look, it's a French word. It could be spelled anyway.

• 1:37:29Speaker 03

  I like the spirit, but that's not it.

• 1:37:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it French?

• 1:37:31Speaker 03

  Andrew?

• 1:37:31David Imel?

  Yeah, tiramisu is 100% French.

• 1:37:33Speaker 03

  Andrew, why did you put that?

• 1:37:34Andrew Manganelli?

  I put Jell-O. I was thinking of a dessert.

• 1:37:37David Imel?

  Do you remember jelly bean?

• 1:37:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Is Jell-O a jelly bean?

• 1:37:40David Imel?

  No, jelly bean, I thought we were on tea. That's why I did tiramisu. But I think that was 16, was tiramisu.

• 1:37:46Speaker 01

  And nougat, oh.

• 1:37:47David Imel?

  Nougat was a long ass time ago. And then Oreo.

• 1:37:50Andrew Manganelli?

  If we're on 17, Q is the 17th letter of the alphabet, right?

• 1:37:54David Imel?

  Q was Q.

• 1:37:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, Q.

• 1:37:58David Imel?

  R. R was red velvet cake.

• 1:38:01Speaker 01

  S.

• 1:38:02David Imel?

  Wait, are we on red velvet cake?

• 1:38:04Speaker 01

  Maybe it's S.

• 1:38:05Speaker 03

  What do you have?

• 1:38:05Speaker 01

  Maybe that was 16.

• 1:38:06David Imel?

  Strudel. It's Strudel.

• 1:38:08Speaker 01

  I have a mythos there. I just made up a name.

• 1:38:11David Imel?

  It's Strudel, right?

• 1:38:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. Wait, can you tell us the first letter?

• 1:38:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, did spell it.

• 1:38:15Speaker 03

  You're not gonna like it.

• 1:38:17Speaker 01

  Well, is it S or T?

• 1:38:19Speaker 03

  It's C.

• 1:38:19David Imel?

  It's C?

• 1:38:20Andrew Manganelli?

  What?

• 1:38:21Speaker 01

  I don't have it in order anymore. There's no shot.

• 1:38:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, can we all guess? Can we have all four more guesses with C? That's a great guess.

• 1:38:28Speaker 03

  What is it with C? What do you think?

• 1:38:30Speaker 01

  Okay, it's a dessert that starts with C.

• 1:38:32Speaker 03

  We had a half way.

• 1:38:33Speaker 01

  We had cupcake like a decade ago. I'm going with cupcake two.

• 1:38:37David Imel?

  Cupcake two, electric boom.

• 1:38:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Chocolatey milk?

• 1:38:41Speaker 04

  Cupcake two codename.

• 1:38:44David Imel?

  Why did they do this? Can I complain to Michelle? I'm texting about so many things today.

• 1:38:49Speaker 01

  Bug report.

• 1:38:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Michelle's gonna watch this episode and be like, I'm never talking to you again.

• 1:38:54David Imel?

  No, he'll be mad about this too.

• 1:38:55Speaker 03

  Codename for Android 17?

• 1:38:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Creme brulee. Those are both so much better than mine.

• 1:38:59David Imel?

  I bet creme brulee.

• 1:39:01Speaker 03

  I like where your head's at.

• 1:39:02David Imel?

  Damn.

• 1:39:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Mark, I can go first.

• 1:39:04Speaker 01

  I wrote crepe.

• 1:39:05Speaker 03

  I, that's also a good one.

• 1:39:07Andrew Manganelli?

  I just wrote cookie. I've been watching too much Sesame Street with Lane.

• 1:39:12David Imel?

  Cookie? What is it?

• 1:39:13Speaker 03

  Any other final?

• 1:39:15Speaker 01

  Cupcake chocolate.

• 1:39:16David Imel?

  Cupcake three.

• 1:39:17Speaker 01

  Cupcake three.

• 1:39:18David Imel?

  B.

• 1:39:20Speaker 03

  It's apparently called. Chrome Fresh. It's cinnamon bun.

• 1:39:26Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm not even that upset.

• 1:39:27David Imel?

  Why did they do that? It has nothing to do with the old naming.

• 1:39:31Speaker 01

  I like cinnamon buns too, but what?

• 1:39:33David Imel?

  Sure.

• 1:39:34Speaker 01

  What does that have to do with seventeen?

• 1:39:36David Imel?

  How?

• 1:39:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it seven? Seventeen and we're all the way through the alphabet already?

• 1:39:41David Imel?

  No, they just just Android ten, they just got rid of of the official names. But then they kept going with the code names underneath.

• 1:39:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, but what did the first, what was the first one?

• 1:39:52Speaker 01

  Well, alpha, beta, whatever, didn't really have names. Cupcake, donut, eclair, froyo, gingerbread.

• 1:39:58David Imel?

  Cupcake was my first.

• 1:39:59Andrew Manganelli?

  One was cupcake.

• 1:40:00David Imel?

  No, well, three was.

• 1:40:01Speaker 01

  Well, it was like three dot something. Yeah.

• 1:40:03David Imel?

  Yeah, but it was technically the first. It was the first one they started using the.

• 1:40:06Speaker 01

  Wait, how many? Okay.

• 1:40:07Andrew Manganelli?

  What did we skip?

• 1:40:09Speaker 03

  The alphabet is twenty six letters.

• 1:40:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:40:11David Imel?

  Cupcake.

• 1:40:12Speaker 01

  Donut, eclair, froyo, gingerbread.

• 1:40:14David Imel?

  Wait, what about H?

• 1:40:16Speaker 01

  Gingerbread, honeycomb, ice cream sandwich, jelly bean, Kit Kat, lemon.

• 1:40:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Lollipop.

• 1:40:23Speaker 01

  Lollipop.

• 1:40:24David Imel?

  Lollipop.

• 1:40:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Mm hmm. Oh.

• 1:40:28David Imel?

  Ma.

• 1:40:30Speaker 03

  Mark.

• 1:40:30Speaker 01

  And marshmallow.

• 1:40:31David Imel?

  Marshmallow.

• 1:40:32Speaker 01

  Nugget.

• 1:40:32David Imel?

  Nugget. Oreo.

• 1:40:34Speaker 01

  Oreo. Pie.

• 1:40:35David Imel?

  Pie.

• 1:40:36Speaker 01

  Q.

• 1:40:37David Imel?

  Q.

• 1:40:37Speaker 01

  And then that was it.

• 1:40:40David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, we had an R?

• 1:40:41David Imel?

  They stopped at Q. I mean, technically.

• 1:40:43Andrew Manganelli?

  What the? I.

• 1:40:45David Imel?

  That Q was.

• 1:40:46Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't even know how to pronounce it.

• 1:40:46David Imel?

  Is technically Android ten and it's when they officially switched over to letters.

• 1:40:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:50David Imel?

  I mean, numbers.

• 1:40:51Andrew Manganelli?

  It's not Keesh. Kins?

• 1:40:52Speaker 01

  They never named, it was just Q.

• 1:40:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Kinstart.

• 1:40:55David Imel?

  Kinstart was the secret code name.

• 1:40:57Andrew Manganelli?

  The red velvet cake.

• 1:40:57Speaker 01

  But they called it Q on stage.

• 1:40:59David Imel?

  Red velvet.

• 1:41:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Snow cone's really good.

• 1:41:01David Imel?

  Yeah, that's fire.

• 1:41:02Speaker 01

  Okay, so I would have.

• 1:41:03David Imel?

  Oh, T was T R M S U.

• 1:41:04Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:04David Imel?

  I thought so.

• 1:41:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Upside down cake, vanilla ice cream.

• 1:41:07David Imel?

  What?

• 1:41:08Andrew Manganelli?

  And then they went to B, baklava.

• 1:41:10Speaker 01

  And they fell off.

• 1:41:11David Imel?

  Dude, baklava's fire.

• 1:41:12Andrew Manganelli?

  No, Google broke alphabetical order for sixteen.

• 1:41:15Speaker 01

  They did.

• 1:41:15David Imel?

  Oh, so they would just restarted. So B, baklava, C is.

• 1:41:18Andrew Manganelli?

  I see where I'm screwing up. They're counting dot versions. That's what I, it's not one for one.

• 1:41:25David Imel?

  It's not numbers.

• 1:41:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 1:41:26David Imel?

  Wait, so when did they stop? They stopped at?

• 1:41:28Andrew Manganelli?

  After P.

• 1:41:28Speaker 01

  They gave up on.

• 1:41:29David Imel?

  Q R S T U V.

• 1:41:31Andrew Manganelli?

  They stopped here.

• 1:41:31Speaker 01

  W X Y Z, they.

• 1:41:32David Imel?

  They stopped at.

• 1:41:33Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, oh, oh.

• 1:41:33David Imel?

  Vanilla ice cream?

• 1:41:35Andrew Manganelli?

  So next is D.

• 1:41:37David Imel?

  That's the most vanilla thing you could do.

• 1:41:39Speaker 01

  They should have done a W X Y Z. Anyway. Google, I recommend you actually make a W, X, and Y and Z.

• 1:41:46David Imel?

  I demand an apology.

• 1:41:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:41:49Andrew Manganelli?

  But thank you for getting rid of Adaglance.

• 1:41:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:41:51Andrew Manganelli?

  You can do no wrong.

• 1:41:52Speaker 01

  You did some good and you did some wrong.

• 1:41:57Speaker 01

  We'll be back next week, but also stay tuned for the bonus episode. Again, it will have not nothing to do with Ball. And if you made it this far into the episode, comment.

• 1:42:07David Imel?

  Nix in five.

• 1:42:08Speaker 01

  Nix in five. Catch you guys in the next one. Peace.

• 1:42:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, former spruce by Adam Alina and Mariah Zink today. I guess Rufus is probably still going to do some of the audio editing despite not being here.

• 1:42:22David Imel?

  What's his last name?

• 1:42:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Mulhaupt.

• 1:42:24Speaker 01

  There it is.

• 1:42:25David Imel?

  That's it.

• 1:42:26Andrew Manganelli?

  I was ready.

• 1:42:27David Imel?

  I aced it.

• 1:42:28Andrew Manganelli?

  But now I forgot the rest of the things I have to say. I think it's we're part of the Vox Media Podcast Network and our intro and true music was created by Vain Still.

• 1:42:34David Imel?

  Bingo.

• 1:42:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Nix in five.

• 1:42:36David Imel?

  Nix in five. Bingo.

• 1:42:47Speaker 01

  When be the greatest 22-year-old of all time? When be the attempted murderer?

• 1:42:52Speaker 07

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