Skip to content

How does music move us? (feat. Sylvan Esso's Amelia Meath)

Unexplainable

32m
Transcript

Original podcast

Summary

Written by a model from the transcript; not yet reviewed.

This episode explores why music moves us so deeply, bringing together Sylvan Esso's Amelia Meath and Princeton music cognition researcher Elizabeth Margulis. The host, Amelia Meath, and Elizabeth examine how rhythm, surprise, and repetition combine to trigger primal physical and emotional reactions. They discuss how false downbeats and structural syncopation create tension, how repetition shifts listening from conscious thought to automatic processing, and why songs can evoke profound feelings even after thousands of listens. Through examples from Sylvan Esso, Steve Reich, Katy Perry, and contemporary art music, the conversation uncovers the surprising neuroscience behind why music feels both deeply mysterious and universally connective.

  • Shift the emphasis of a musical line slightly off the downbeat to create an unexpected groove that draws listeners into the song. 1:15
  • Add repetition to unfamiliar or challenging contemporary art music to significantly increase listener enjoyment and perceived human composition. 15:33
  • Pay close attention to familiar songs during repeat performances or listens to uncover hidden intricacies and fresh emotional resonance. 17:41

Chapters

  1. 0:01
    Sonos Promotion and Intro

    The host introduces Sonos and explains its features while setting up the episode.

  2. 0:38
    Sylvan Esso’s New Album Spotlight

    The host discusses Sylvan Esso’s new album and a favorite track, “Back Again.”

  3. 3:53
    Science of Music Surprise

    Elizabeth Margulis discusses how expectation violation drives emotional responses to music.

  4. 5:46
    Interview with Amelia Meath

    Amelia explains her creative process and how she writes music in the air before collaborating.

  5. 14:02
    Repetition and Musical Pleasure

    The study shows that repeated exposure to music increases enjoyment and perceived human authorship.

  6. 17:25
    Performing Repetition: Amelia’s Perspective

    Amelia describes how performing a repetitive song can still feel fresh and engaging.

  7. 22:55
    Motor Activation and Movement

    The scientist explains how music activates motor areas of the brain, prompting movement.

  8. 25:59
    Chills and Emotional Response

    The discussion covers how surprise moments trigger chills and emotional reactions.

  9. 27:30
    Music as Language vs. Magic

    The conversation explores whether music is a language and how scientific insight can enhance its magic.

Highlights

  • 0:52

    A False Downbeat Creates Surpriseinsight

    A rhythmic shift in Sylvan Esso's song makes the beat feel out of whack, shifting forward and altering how the listener experiences the groove.

  • 4:57

    Music as a Magical Spellstory

    Amelia Meath recalls hearing The Who's Behind Blue Eyes from the back of her father's minivan at age three, experiencing music as a magical spell.

  • 10:37

    Repetition and Semantic Satiationinsight

    Elizabeth Margulis explains how repeating words or musical phrases shifts processing from conscious thought to fine-grained, nuanced auditory exploration.

  • 15:33

    Injecting Repetition Into Complex Musicdata

    In an experiment adding artificial repetition to challenging 20th-century art music by Berio and Carter, participants enjoyed the music more and believed humans composed it.

  • 17:28

    Finding Newness in Repeat Performanceinsight

    Amelia Meath describes how performing the same song thousands of times reveals new intricacies because she is a completely different person singing it.

  • 22:55

    Motor Areas Activated During Listeningdata

    Even when sitting completely still and passively listening, the exact same motor circuitry used for physical movement is activated in the brain.

Quotes

  • “This is all about which notes are emphasized and where they sit with the beat.”
    Unnamed speaker · 1:48
  • “The more we listen, the more we get into a groove, and that frees up the rest of our attention.”
    Unnamed speaker · 12:44
  • “And that simple change not only made the music more enjoyable for people, but also made them think that it was more likely to have been composed by a human.”
    Unnamed speaker · 15:33
  • “I would really never want to be dedicating my life to eradicating the magic from this sphere of human activity that we treasure so much.”
    Unnamed speaker · 28:44
  • Sonos 0:12–0:30
  • Sonos 19:54–20:12
  • Sonos 21:01–21:27
  • Sonos 32:41–33:24

About this episode

Music can give us goosebumps. It can make us cry. It can make us move. How? Guests: Amelia Meath, songwriter and singer in Sylvan Esso; Elizabeth Margulis,  director of the Music Cognition Lab at Princeton University and author of On Repeat: How Music Plays the Mind For show transcripts, go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠vox.com/unxtranscripts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠For more, go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠vox.com/unexplainable⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠And please email us! ⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠We read every email. Support Unexplainable (and get ad-free episodes) by becoming a Vox Member today: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠vox.com/members⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Thank you! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

0:00
32:09

4,802 words · 4 speakers

Topics

  • Sylvan Esso
  • Princeton
  • Mountain Man

Page updated · transcript and summary are machine-generated