Veronica Bozza

Veronica Bozza, a devoted mother with a successful career as a television producer, was shot to death inside her home in August 2010. Her estranged husband, Tim, provided a seemingly air-tight alibi, but investigators soon found suspicious activity on his phone records. Join Mike and Gibby as they discuss Veronica Bozza. In 1994, she married Tim Bozza, a self-employed home remodeler in the Nashville area. They settled in Hermitage, about 20 minutes outside the city. The couple had a son seven years later, but the relationship became strained under financial pressure. Veronica filed for divorce, and it was thought to be amicable, but the police would uncover an elaborate plan to murder Veronica. You can help support the show at patreon.com/truecrimeallthetime Visit the show's website at truecrimeallthetime.com for contact, merchandise, and donation information An Emash Digital production See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

• 0:39Speaker 00

  Hello everyone and welcome to episode 492 of the True Crime All the Time Podcast. I'm Mike Ferguson and with me as always is my partner in true crime, Mike Gibson. Gibby, how are you doing?

• 0:50Speaker 01

  Hey, I'm doing okay. How about you?

• 0:52Speaker 00

  I'm doing great, man.

• 0:53Speaker 01

  Good.

• 0:54Speaker 00

  You know, the weather's picking up, getting nicer.

• 0:57Speaker 01

  It is.

• 0:57Speaker 00

  My wife and I can go out for a walk. I don't a lot, but she does.

• 1:03Speaker 01

  I can start wearing my half shirts.

• 1:05Speaker 00

  Yeah, or the fishnet ones.

• 1:08Speaker 01

  The fishnet and half.

• 1:09Speaker 00

  And the combo. The combo. Let's go ahead and give our Patreon shout outs. We had Ben Whitaker.

• 1:15Speaker 01

  Hey, Ben.

• 1:15Speaker 00

  Nobody.

• 1:16Speaker 01

  Well, thanks, nobody.

• 1:18Speaker 00

  Kaylee.

• 1:19Speaker 01

  What's going on, Kaylee?

• 1:19Speaker 00

  Kiki Barwick.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  Oh, hi, Kiki.

• 1:22Speaker 00

  Catherine Montanez.

• 1:23Speaker 01

  Ah, Montanez.

• 1:25Speaker 00

  Andrew McNaughton.

• 1:27Speaker 01

  Don't be McNaughton.

• 1:28Speaker 00

  Deborah Mitchell.

• 1:30Speaker 01

  Hey, Deborah.

• 1:32Speaker 00

  And last but not least, Nicole Fleming.

• 1:34Speaker 01

  I feel like Secret Agent Fleming.

• 1:36Speaker 00

  Yeah, it always cranks me up when you crack yourself up.

• 1:39Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:40Speaker 00

  Uh, that's one of the funnier things to me. And then if we go back into the vault. This week, we selected Christina Weitz.

• 1:50Speaker 01

  Hey, thanks, Christina.

• 1:52Speaker 00

  So we appreciate all the Patreon support, the new support, the continued support. Speaking of Patreon, we dropped a brand new Patreon only episode Saturday night. It's on Chelsea Perkins, a Coast Guard veteran who plotted a revenge killing against her ex-boyfriend.

• 2:11Speaker 00

  So if you're not signed up for Patreon, now's a great time. Go check it out. And then we have a new unsolved episode out that's on Tracy Kegley. She went out to run errands with her daughter. And then the following day, her vehicle was found on the side of the road with her daughter inside. But Tracy was nowhere to be found.

• 2:33Speaker 01

  That's fascinating.

• 2:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's a very interesting case.

• 2:38Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 2:39Speaker 00

  And then I want to preview Thursday's TCAT episode. It's on Egypt Covington, an aspiring singer who was murdered inside her home in Bellevue, Michigan. All right, buddy. Are you ready to get into this episode of True Crime All The Time?

• 2:53Speaker 01

  I am ready.

• 2:54Speaker 00

  We're talking about Veronica Bozza. Veronica, a devoted mother with a successful career as a television producer, was shot to death inside her home in August 2010. Her estranged husband, Tim, provided what was, you know, a seemingly airtight alibi, but investigators soon found suspicious activity on his phone records. And it's always the estranged ex-husband.

• 3:22Speaker 01

  It is on the radar right away.

• 3:25Speaker 00

  Veronica Bozza was born on March 31, 1971 in Milan, Italy. Veronica attended university in Italy and majored in psychology. And I know you've spent a lot of time in Milan for Fashion Week there, doing your runway type stuff.

• 3:45Speaker 01

  Well, I'm trying to get that, you know, new Gibby line, you know, out there. It hasn't been smooth, but.

• 3:52Speaker 00

  Well, it's mostly fishnet, and I think that is a, one of the big downsides.

• 3:56Speaker 01

  It's been a problem, especially on the menswear, the underwear part, you know, it's really not holding things where they should be held. But we are working on that, trying to go with a tighter knit. So more to come on.

• 4:10Speaker 00

  Let's see how that goes. At the age of 23, Veronica moved to the US to pursue her dream of working as a TV producer. In 1994, she married Tim Bozza, who was self-employed and remodeled homes in the Nashville area. They settled in Hermitage, about 20 minutes outside the city. And you and I love Nashville. We've been there a couple of times for Crime Con. I've been there a bunch, just with my family and stuff. It's a great city.

• 4:41Speaker 01

  It is. You've been down there a few times doing open mic night with your guitar.

• 4:45Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 4:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:46Speaker 00

  You never know who might be in the audience.

• 4:48Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 4:49Speaker 00

  Veronica also attended Vauld State Community College as a communications major. Their son was born seven years later. And it was said that Veronica had always wanted a family. And she absolutely loved being a mother. And she did develop a successful career as a TV producer. She was well-liked and respected by her colleagues. And she was known for being a kind person who always helped others. Veronica and Tim's marriage became strained in the last year and a half before her death. In part due to financial problems. Tim was going through a rough period with his business while Veronica's career was taking off.

• 5:33Speaker 01

  Sometimes you get that animosity.

• 5:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, because you're like, she's doing good. Instead of being like happy, right? Oh, that's awesome, babe. You're doing everything you want and it's really helping us right now. Cause my stuff's not really doing what I was hoping it would do.

• 5:50Speaker 00

  But there are some men who can't handle that.

• 5:52Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 5:53Speaker 00

  I am 100% okay with it.

• 5:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:56Speaker 00

  You know.

• 5:56Speaker 01

  Knock it out of the park, please.

• 5:57Speaker 00

  If my wife wants to make millions of dollars, you know, pour it on. Now, she's a public school teacher, so that is unlikely to happen.

• 6:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. But hey, I like how you're thinking and how you are positive about that kind of stuff.

• 6:14Speaker 00

  You know, I'm secure. Cause I'm gonna benefit. And that's the one thing I guess I never understood about some of these guys who, it's like a blow to their ego because, okay, now all of a sudden their wife is making more money. Like, hey, that's just more for all of us to go around.

• 6:34Speaker 01

  Yeah. You and I used to work with a guy that had a. His wife was very successful.

• 6:39Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 6:40Speaker 01

  And he, he was very open about, he loved just piggybacking on that, you know?

• 6:45Speaker 00

  Hey, you know, do what you gotta do. Veronica filed for divorce in 2009. She and Tim argued often about money and custody of their son. They eventually reached an agreement on the division of assets, but they weren't able to resolve their custody issues. And we, you know, you and I talk about divorce a lot. Some divorces can be, you know, pretty amicable.

• 7:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:13Speaker 00

  Some can be just downright nasty, like War of the Roses type situation.

• 7:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, the original War of the Roses, like nasty. Not, the remake was not nasty.

• 7:24Speaker 00

  Oh, there was a remake?

• 7:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was, it wasn't the same.

• 7:27Speaker 00

  Um, I didn't know that.

• 7:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, had that Cumberbatch, Ben Benjamin Cumber.

• 7:33Speaker 00

  Why would you even try to say his name? You know, it's not going to come out. You are setting yourself up for failure. Benedict Cumberbatch.

• 7:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, that guy right there.

• 7:44Speaker 00

  According to State versus Bozza, they were each given 182 and a half dates with their son. But the schedule gave Veronica more time with them. The child support also required Veronica to pay more than she would have paid under an equal custody arrangement.

• 8:05Speaker 01

  You know, a lot of people at home right now are doing that math. 182.5 plus 182.5.

• 8:12Speaker 00

  What is it there, Rain Man?

• 8:13Speaker 01

  Say it's, don't worry, the math is right. 365.

• 8:17Speaker 00

  Tim was worried Veronica would move out of state and that the parenting plan would provide a basis for her moving without the court's permission. She had expressed her desire to remain in Nashville for her son's benefit and in an effort to alleviate Tim's concerns, offered to pay the transportation costs and Tim's attorney's fees if she attempted to relocate.

• 8:41Speaker 01

  Nothing like saying, hey, I'm making more money than you, buddy.

• 8:44Speaker 00

  So don't worry about it. I'll pay for it.

• 8:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:47Speaker 00

  Uh, if it ever comes down to it, but it doesn't sound like she had any real desires to, to relocate.

• 8:54Speaker 01

  I think she just wanted in there as a, you know, just in case.

• 8:57Speaker 00

  And to make him feel better.

• 8:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:59Speaker 00

  Maybe because he obviously was worried about it. Veronica was shot to death inside her home on August 29th, 2010. Earlier that day Veronica and her son attended church together. Afterwards, she met Tim in the church parking lot to exchange custody, which was their normal routine on Sundays. Veronica returned home alone. And I've mentioned it before, but you know, my parents got divorced when I was pretty young, five, I think, or six, something like that. And I can remember it seemed like more often than not, the exchanges happened at a McDonald's.

• 9:38Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 9:39Speaker 00

  I don't know why, but that was their preferred location. And a lot of times, you know, if my mom dropped me off and my dad took me, we'd go in and eat, you know, at McDonald's before we went back home.

• 9:54Speaker 01

  So it benefited you?

• 9:55Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 9:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. Hey, can I get a McFlurry dad?

• 9:59Speaker 00

  They did not have McFlurries when I was six, seven years old. That is a relatively new concept. Veronica was found at 12:30 PM by her boyfriend, Brian Robinson. Brian called 911 to report that Veronica was on the living room floor in a pool of blood. She was shot at least four times. Two times in the head, once in the right shoulder and once in the mid back. There were signs of a struggle. There was gunshot residue on Veronica's body. And I think on her hands, Gibbs, because it indicated that she tried to grab the gun. The curtains were pulled down and some chairs had been moved around.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  So she was a fighter?

• 10:45Speaker 00

  Yeah. And, and obviously that would have been a harrowing situation that nobody would ever want to find themselves in. But I think you're right. You, she was going after that gun to, you know, try to save herself. The killer had taken the murder weapon and all but one shell casing. And I found this very interesting because, okay, if somebody's going to take the time to gather up shell casings. Well, they know a little bit about, you know, forensics and, and things like that. So the one being left behind, what they just miss it?

• 11:27Speaker 01

  I mean, you, you would think that's gotta be the reason, or were they like, you know what? I'm gonna leave this one. Let's see how good these police and detectives are.

• 11:37Speaker 00

  Well, I'm pretty sure they would all tell the same story. So my thought is the killer must have missed it, right? Maybe they didn't realize how many shots they fired or how many casings they had to pick up.

• 11:52Speaker 01

  And maybe felt a sense of urgency to get out of there as well.

• 11:55Speaker 00

  Yeah, that could be, that could be, and maybe it rolled under something, who knows? Brian told police he came to the house that day because he and Veronica had plans to go out. Upon his arrival, he found the garage door open. Veronica's car was inside and the door to the home was wide open. He walked in and found her body.

• 12:17Speaker 01

  I mean, we've said it before on other episodes, but how rough would that be?

• 12:22Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's gonna be one of the worst days of your life. I also can imagine kind of, you know, getting to the house. Okay, the garage door is open. Maybe that's not the biggest deal. Sometimes people leave their garage doors open. Sometimes they just forget to shut it. But then when you see that the door leading into the house is open. That's just to me strange. Most people don't do that. Brian was considered a suspect and he is the current boyfriend. So that doesn't surprise me at all, right? Police have to rule out all possibilities.

• 13:04Speaker 00

  And like we always talk about, they start kind of from the center and work their way out. So you've got Brian, the current boyfriend. Obviously you have the estranged husband, ex.

• 13:18Speaker 00

  At the crime scene, investigators discovered that Veronica was a victim of a random mugging and robbery months earlier. She had a letter from the state informing her that the subject who was arrested was going to be released on parole.

• 13:35Speaker 01

  That would be alarming.

• 13:37Speaker 00

  That would be very alarming, considering the fact that this just happened a few months earlier and this guy's already getting out. But I think from the standpoint of the police, all right, now we gotta look at this guy.

• 13:52Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 13:53Speaker 00

  Because he may or may not have been out at the time that the murder occurred. So police had to investigate this individual. However, records showed he was in jail that day. And we talk a lot about alibis, right? Some are, okay, not very good at all. I was home by myself all night. Nobody can corroborate that.

• 14:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:18Speaker 00

  You've got mom is vouching for me, that type of alibi, or a significant other or something like that. Those can go a couple of different ways because people have a vested interest in not wanting to see that person go to jail. You know, the one that is pretty airtight is you were in jail or in prison.

• 14:44Speaker 01

  Kind of hard to debate that one.

• 14:47Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think they have pretty good records.

• 14:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:50Speaker 00

  Of where you are, if you're a prisoner. And if you were there the entire day that someone was killed, I think you're going to be scratched off the list pretty quickly.

• 15:01Speaker 01

  But, you know, there are services, I'm just going to plug my own, rentanalibi.com.

• 15:09Speaker 00

  Thought you were going to go rent a Hitman like the episode we did a while back.

• 15:13Speaker 01

  But rentanalibi.com, you know, we have people that will come and sit in your home quietly for the entire day for a low, low fee and.

• 15:26Speaker 00

  When you say people, it's just you. You're running the whole thing by yourself.

• 15:29Speaker 01

  Wait for it to take off. You know, once it takes off, then I can start incorporating more people, you know.

• 15:35Speaker 00

  The fact that you sit around someone's house all day, wearing their ankle monitor is. Less than ethical, legal. I mean, you're really blurring the lines there.

• 15:46Speaker 01

  I'm hoping Uber or DoorDash or somebody like that buys it from me.

• 15:49Speaker 00

  Mm hmm.

• 15:50Speaker 01

  And then they have their people take over, you know, and just pay me out.

• 15:53Speaker 00

  Well, what are they buying? You have some big infrastructure?

• 15:57Speaker 01

  Absolutely. I got procedures left and right.

• 16:02Speaker 00

  Detectives then focused on reconstructing Veronica's final hours. They knew she went to church and dropped off her son with Tim. She talked to Brian on the phone during her drive home and also a coworker. Cell records showed she and Brian talked at 11:51 a.m. Authorities established that Veronica was alive at 12:08 p.m. And dead by 12:20, leaving about a 12-minute window for the murder to occur.

• 16:33Speaker 01

  That's a very small window.

• 16:35Speaker 00

  Yeah, 12 minutes is, uh, is not a lot of time. Now, you can get quite a bit done in 12 minutes. But as far as narrowing down where somebody was or their alibi, you know, yeah, it doesn't give a lot of leeway.

• 16:51Speaker 01

  No.

• 16:52Speaker 00

  Brian arrived at Veronica's house around 12:25 or 12:30. He called 911 at 12:30. And I thought this was a very, you know, interesting piece of the timeline. You know, they believe she was dead by 12:20.

• 17:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:10Speaker 00

  Then Brian shows up five minutes or 10 minutes later. By 12:30, he's calling 911.

• 17:19Speaker 01

  So, I mean, let's just say he shows up at 12:25. Maybe if he had nothing to do with it, that's the reason why the individual didn't get the other casing. Because he didn't have the, that person didn't have the time to search for it. Cause they, maybe they heard the car pull up.

• 17:34Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:35Speaker 01

  Saw headlights.

• 17:36Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's a, a good theory. But police found it hard to believe. Brian could have arrived so quickly after she was killed without spotting the person responsible fleeing the area. So he was taken in for further questioning. And like I said earlier, right? How could he not be? He's, he's gotta be eliminated. He's the current boyfriend.

• 18:00Speaker 01

  And he's the one that found her.

• 18:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, he's he's got kind of a double whammy against him because he's the current boyfriend and he found the body and both of those people are normally looked at. He just happens to be both.

• 18:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:15Speaker 00

  He described how he and Veronica met through work and had only been dating for a few months. They were supposed to go on a weekend trip together. Investigators noted that Brian only checked for a pulse after he called 911 and the dispatcher asked if Veronica was breathing. He also washed his hands before police arrived. So, okay, a couple of things that possibly, you know, could be suspicious or at least to police. They're they're going to think maybe that's suspicious. Yeah, the one thing that that jumps out at me about Brian or, you know, most boyfriends is what's the motive?

• 18:57Speaker 01

  Right.

• 18:58Speaker 00

  You know, especially if you've only been dating for a few months. What is the motive to kill your girlfriend? It can't be financial.

• 19:08Speaker 01

  Right.

• 19:09Speaker 00

  You don't have anything monetarily invested in this relationship. It's so new and both parties can walk away anytime they want without really any ramifications.

• 19:22Speaker 01

  Unless one of the parties doesn't want to walk away. Like you can't, you know, we've heard it before. You you're not going to leave me.

• 19:29Speaker 00

  Yeah, I get that and there could be the kind of snap situation, right? That that could happen. Brian maintained his innocence and when asked if Veronica had disagreements with anyone, he named Tim. He mentioned they were involved in a contentious divorce and custody battle. Brian said about the divorce, when Veronica refused to submit to him, to it just being a split, he then attempted to tarnish her as a mother. Brian said he and Veronica were worried that Tim was capable of bad things. Brian had been keeping an eye out for months. He explained that he always felt like maybe he was the kind of guy

• 20:12Speaker 00

  who was going to have somebody there like surveillance or something like that.

• 20:17Speaker 01

  Just felt like you had eyes on them all the time.

• 20:20Speaker 00

  Or he was the type of guy who would do that.

• 20:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:24Speaker 00

  Now, I think you could say, okay, maybe Brian's a little paranoid, or maybe he is, but rightfully so.

• 20:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, it sounds like maybe it could, could have been justified.

• 20:35Speaker 00

  Investigators learned Tim and Veronica were just weeks away from finalizing their divorce. Police traveled to Tim's home to notify him of Veronica's death. And it was noted that he didn't seem particularly upset. And this is something that gets analyzed all the time, right? How does someone react in a certain situation? I get it, they're not in the best place.

• 20:59Speaker 01

  Right.

• 21:00Speaker 00

  They're going through this contentious divorce, but she's also the mother of your child.

• 21:08Speaker 01

  Right.

• 21:09Speaker 00

  And she was the love of your life at one point. I just don't know how you can't have feelings upon learning that this woman is dead.

• 21:21Speaker 01

  Unless you really hated her.

• 21:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, and some people do. I mean, divorces can go real bad.

• 21:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:29Speaker 00

  Tim was brought in for questioning and talked about Veronica's affair with Brian Robinson. He explained that he noticed she was acting weird and admitted to the relationship. They tried therapy, but it didn't work and he eventually moved out. However, he never really wanted to get divorced. Besides the divorce, another potential motive was Veronica's $550,000 life insurance policy. Veronica and Tim were both under court order to maintain at least a $350,000 policy. Once the divorce was finalized, Tim would no longer be the beneficiary, which he admitted in his interview.

• 22:14Speaker 01

  That would definitely be potential motive.

• 22:17Speaker 00

  Yeah, he's got a couple of things, right? Going against him, at least when it comes to motive. You have the contentious divorce, you've got the, the custody issues. Now, he would have benefited to the tune of over half a million dollars.

• 22:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:36Speaker 00

  That's, uh, that's quite a bit of money. And not only that, but you know, time is running out for him. Because here very soon, he's no longer gonna be the beneficiary. And I think you have to take that into account as well.

• 22:53Speaker 01

  So if you want to benefit from that, you better act.

• 22:59Speaker 00

  Investigators later learned that Tim filed an insurance claim just three days after Veronica was killed.

• 23:07Speaker 01

  I know it's it's the right of the person that's benefactor, right? To file whenever. I always just find it strange when they file so quickly on cases like this.

• 23:19Speaker 00

  Yeah. Do you not realize that it's not going to make you look great? You've already talked to police, probably.

• 23:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:28Speaker 00

  You have to know that you're gonna be at least on their radar. You know, maybe you let it lay for a little while.

• 23:36Speaker 01

  Maybe just allow the police to do what they need to do and hopefully find the killer before you worry about getting your half million plus dollars.

• 23:45Speaker 00

  Or worry more about being there for your son.

• 23:49Speaker 01

  That's very true.

• 23:50Speaker 00

  Because, you know, he's lost his mother and it's gonna be really hard on him. But Tim maintained his innocence. He said that he last saw Veronica in the church parking lot when she dropped their son off. He went to a hardware store and grocery store near his home. And there was surveillance footage and receipts to support his story. Brian Robinson also had an alibi, supported by surveillance footage. Police spoke to Veronica's neighbors in hopes of getting more information. One neighbor said they saw a light colored SUV parked in a nearby alley before the murder. And then later afterwards, it was gone.

• 24:33Speaker 00

  Veronica's purse was found in her car, but her cell phone was missing. Cell records showed that the phone left her home, but the trail stopped. Suggesting that the phone was turned off or the battery died.

• 24:48Speaker 01

  So whoever killed her wanted her phone.

• 24:51Speaker 00

  Yeah, and you wonder why? Is it because possibly there was some communication on the phone that the killer thought could potentially lead back to them? Now, what communication would it be that the police ultimately wouldn't be able to get?

• 25:11Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 25:12Speaker 00

  I mean, they can get records of texts and all that.

• 25:16Speaker 01

  But maybe this person didn't realize that.

• 25:19Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's possible, but we're also talking about an individual who tried to make sure they took the shell casings with them.

• 25:28Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 25:29Speaker 00

  So they at least had some smarts or had watched some movies or TV shows enough to know that that's something that could possibly sink them. Tim's phone records showed he made numerous calls to one number before and after he and Veronica met to exchange their son. That number belonged to his friend Cory Copham. Cory and Tim had known each other for several years. Cory had been living away from the Nashville area, but in April 2010, he contacted Tim and began working for him. They also socialized together. Cory had a criminal record that included terrorizing and assaulting women.

• 26:14Speaker 01

  So not a nice guy?

• 26:16Speaker 00

  Apparently not the women.

• 26:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:18Speaker 00

  Cory's cell phone records indicated that his phone was traveling in the same direction as Veronica's before she was killed. His phone also left the crime scene on the same route and at the same time as Veronica's phone.

• 26:36Speaker 01

  Coincidence?

• 26:38Speaker 00

  I think not. I also think that you still have trouble saying coincidence.

• 26:44Speaker 01

  I think I said it perfectly.

• 26:47Speaker 00

  But here's the thing, right? If this guy turns out to be the killer and he had enough sense to try to take his shell casings and he had enough sense to, you know, either turn off her phone or take the battery out or whatever. Why didn't he have enough sense to think that his phone was gonna be tracked? And maybe that's because he never thought police would tie him to the murder or to Tim.

• 27:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, that's probably what it was if he's the person that did this.

• 27:23Speaker 00

  But no doubt, right? He became the prime suspect. And how can you not be when your cell essentially is following the same route as the victim both before and after the murder?

• 27:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, it doesn't look good.

• 27:39Speaker 00

  On August 30th, Corey was questioned under the guise of helping clear Tim's name. He didn't want to come into the station, but agreed to an interview in a parking lot. He explained that he called Tim the morning before to talk about their weekend and Tim's new girl. He called Tim a second time and they talked until Tim picked his son up. He texted Tim again on August 30th to tell him he would be late to work. And Tim replied, there was no work because of what happened to Veronica. And according to him, this was how Corey found out about the murder. He called Tim after receiving this text.

• 28:21Speaker 00

  In regards to his alibi, Corey claimed he visited a couple of his girlfriends at different locations that were not near Veronica's house.

• 28:30Speaker 01

  Couple of girlfriends.

• 28:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:32Speaker 01

  So yeah.

• 28:33Speaker 00

  He's a real lethario.

• 28:35Speaker 01

  Oh, nice.

• 28:37Speaker 00

  Or he's just trying to, you know, make himself look more impressive than what he really is.

• 28:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's true.

• 28:46Speaker 00

  He was asked how investigators could best reach him. Corey said he typically had his phone with him at all times, further incriminating himself. He was then confronted with the fact that his cell phone records showed he was in Veronica's neighborhood when he called Tim around 12:20 PM. Corey became irate and denied any involvement in the murder. And this is where, you know, police and detectives can get pretty tricky. They have a piece of evidence that they're not disclosing upfront. Before they do that, they want to lock the person into to certain statements.

• 29:30Speaker 00

  And in this case, you know, they asked Corey what he did that day, where he was all the while knowing that they had his phone records.

• 29:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, they did a good job boxing him in.

• 29:43Speaker 00

  Yeah. Police obtained a warrant to seize Corey's car and phone. His vehicle matched the description of the car seen near Veronica's house on the day of the murder. Investigators found gloves, clothing, a red lunchbox and a blue towel in the car, but they were forced to release Corey due to a lack of evidence. And that might shock a lot of people, but let's look at what the evidence really was. Okay. I mean, the cell phone records are damning, but they're not proof of murder.

• 30:17Speaker 01

  No.

• 30:18Speaker 00

  The fact that his car matches a car that a neighbor said they saw before and after the murder, or it was gone after the murder. Okay, doesn't make him look great, but it's not evidence of murder.

• 30:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's not enough to hold somebody.

• 30:36Speaker 00

  Yeah, or bring a charge or anything like that. DNA testing showed that a mixture of DNA from three individuals was found on the blue towel taken from Corey's car. One test excluded Tim Bozza and Brian Robinson, but not Veronica and Corey. Testing at another facility determined Corey was the major contributor, but could not exclude Veronica and Brian as minor contributors. I think this is where, you know, DNA can get kind of fuzzy.

• 31:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:13Speaker 00

  Frustrating at times. You know, it's not always that kind of one in four quadrillion.

• 31:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 31:21Speaker 00

  That we talk about when you have major and minor contributors and a mixture of DNA, right? Things get a little muddy. The waters do. Investigators looked into everyone Corey spoke to on the day of the murder. For example, at 1228 PM, he called someone who said he used to live across from Corey. He cleaned a nine millimeter gun from, for Corey, a couple of weeks prior. The witness recalled that Corey took the gun out of a red lunchbox. Again, one of the items that was found in his vehicle.

• 31:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:00Speaker 00

  Also, I don't know why you need somebody else to clean your gun for you. They're not hard to clean.

• 32:06Speaker 01

  I was wondering the same thing. Is it that difficult to clean a pistol?

• 32:11Speaker 00

  No, it's really not. Police also talked to Corey's girlfriend, Jennifer Addington, who went by the nickname Jenny. Jenny initially supported Corey's alibi.

• 32:22Speaker 01

  Wait a minute, are you telling me that Jennifer had the nickname of Jenny?

• 32:28Speaker 00

  Yeah, shocking, isn't it?

• 32:29Speaker 01

  It really is. I wonder if her telephone number was 1-800.

• 32:34Speaker 00

  Or 867-5309?

• 32:37Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 32:38Speaker 00

  He started out with 1-800.

• 32:42Speaker 00

  It does make me sound kind of stupid to say she went by the nickname Jenny, but I get it. Thanks for not actually calling me that, but pointing it out in a much more subtle way.

• 32:53Speaker 01

  Well, hey, you redeemed yourself when you gave out the correct number versus my 1-800.

• 32:58Speaker 00

  So she, you know, she's backing up his alibi initially, but then on September 11th, she reached out again and said she wanted to tell the truth. She had previously said Corey was at her house around 12 to 12:30 PM on the day of the murder. But now she admitted she wasn't sure what time he was there. She slept most of the morning because she had been working the night before. Corey was there when she woke up later in the afternoon. So it sounds to me like she might've been asleep during that period of time. And Corey said, hey, I was here, but she corroborated his alibi without really being able to.

• 33:41Speaker 01

  Maybe she learned that he told the police that, hey, I was over that in that area because I was visiting some of my girlfriends. And she's like, I'll, I'll correct that right now.

• 33:50Speaker 00

  Yeah, that, that's probably not.

• 33:54Speaker 00

  What you want to say to keep your girlfriend on your side, the person who is corroborating your alibi?

• 34:03Speaker 01

  Right.

• 34:04Speaker 00

  Jenny also admitted that she stole her ex-husband Jeffrey Walters handgun and put it in a red lunchbox. She decided she was going to sneak the gun back into her ex-husband's home, but it was missing. Corey was the only one who knew about it. Jeffrey Walters confirmed his gun was missing and allowed police to compare his shell casings to the one found at the scene. And it was a match.

• 34:32Speaker 01

  Luckily that he had some casings.

• 34:35Speaker 00

  Yeah, it is because I don't know how many people save their casings. Now, if you reload your own ammo and maybe he did that, that would be a reason why a lot of people would, would save their casings. Jenny then informed the police that Corey was planning to leave the country. She was asked to come to the station and wear a wire. While she placed a call to Corey, she told him she was worried police were going to arrest her because the handgun she took was linked to the homicide. Corey replied, they're saying it's a nine millimeter. They can get nine millimeter bullets anywhere. That don't matter, so that's stupid. The problem is the caliber of the gun was not public knowledge at the time.

• 35:20Speaker 00

  Corey also told Jenny she needed to contact him, suggesting he was involved in the murder after all. So there's a couple of things here. You know, number one, Jenny, I think at a certain point probably has to go into self-preservation mode because she did actually steal this gun from her ex-husband.

• 35:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 35:45Speaker 00

  And so whether she lied about the alibi or she just confirmed it, even though technically she was asleep, the gun thing, okay, that's going to get you in trouble. Number one, it's theft. But then secondly, it's used in a murder? And then for me, the other thing is Corey just can't keep his damn mouth shut.

• 36:06Speaker 01

  He cannot.

• 36:07Speaker 00

  But that's often why, you know, police want people to wear a wire or record their phone calls and have them call the person. Now you think you're talking to someone you can trust.

• 36:20Speaker 01

  He's just randomly saying stuff like, it's a nine millimeter that they're saying. You can get those anywhere.

• 36:27Speaker 00

  Well, which you can, nine millimeter is a, a very common ammo, right? Here in the US. But when police haven't made it public that Veronica was killed by a nine millimeter. Okay, that doesn't make you look good. And that's on top of the fact that, and Corey might not have known this, but they have a shell casing that they can actually match to a specific gun.

• 36:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:56Speaker 00

  On September 21st, 2010, the Nashville Metropolitan Police Department announced the arrests of Tim Bozza and Corey Coppa. Both were charged with first degree murder. Corey refused to talk to police. And that's probably a good idea because he had already messed himself up on numerous occasions.

• 37:18Speaker 01

  That's very true.

• 37:19Speaker 00

  Tim was questioned on September 28th, 2010. At first he denied any involvement in the murder or prior knowledge of Corey's actions. He took a break to consult with his attorney and then denied that he hired Corey to kill Veronica, but admitted they had conversations that were, quote, "still kind of suggestive."

• 37:45Speaker 01

  Oh, suggestive.

• 37:47Speaker 00

  Well, Tim admitted that they had talked about a crisscross murder plot to kill the troublesome person in the other's life. Corey was supposed to kill Veronica and Tim was supposed to kill the ex-husband of one of Corey's girlfriends.

• 38:05Speaker 01

  Oh, is this like the stranger on the train?

• 38:07Speaker 00

  It is, or throw mama from the train.

• 38:10Speaker 01

  Or throw mama from the train.

• 38:11Speaker 00

  Which is my favorite.

• 38:12Speaker 01

  I know. It's one of your most favorites.

• 38:16Speaker 00

  And you know, Tim did say that the plot was inspired by the 1987 movie Throw Mama From The Train.

• 38:23Speaker 01

  Of course, your favorite movie. Take credit.

• 38:26Speaker 00

  You know, that's the one with Danny DeVito, his character agreeing to kill Billy Crystal's ex-wife over authorship of a book in exchange for Crystal killing DeVito's mother. Tim admitted the idea came from this movie and said Corey offered him $10,000 to commit murder. He thought it was a joking conversation. Now, I'm sure that people have joked about this idea. I truly believe that.

• 38:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:57Speaker 00

  They don't mean it. They're just joking. Hey, you kill, this person's causing me trouble. I'll kill this person who's causing you trouble, but we're never really gonna do it. We're just messing around. I don't think it's a great thing to mess around about, but I'm sure there are people who have done it over the years.

• 39:14Speaker 01

  To just be clear, we have never done that ever, for the record.

• 39:19Speaker 00

  For the record.

• 39:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:20Speaker 00

  For whoever's listening.

• 39:22Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 39:22Speaker 00

  According to Tim, Corey knew where to find Veronica on August 29th because he previously pointed out the church in school to him. He told Corey that morning he was going to pick up his child. He didn't see Corey when he was picking up his child, but he saw him earlier that morning. They talked about Corey's girlfriends and the fact that Corey was driving his girlfriend's van. Tim admitted that when he saw Corey, he quote, "had a feeling about what was about to happen." But also thought Corey wouldn't follow through with it because Corey had followed Veronica before and had not harmed her. He denied needing to know when the murder was going to take place, so he could establish an alibi.

• 40:07Speaker 00

  All right, Tim is not making himself look good here either.

• 40:11Speaker 01

  Not at all.

• 40:11Speaker 00

  Now, he is trying to cast. More of the guilt on Corey. Yeah, we were joking around about this and I never took it seriously, but it seems like he might've followed through with it.

• 40:23Speaker 01

  He also never said, oh, when I did see Corey, I said, hey, Corey, we were joking, you know that, right? Don't, don't do anything. I hope you're not planning on doing anything because I don't want you to.

• 40:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, but there's a, yeah, there's a couple of things that he says here, like he knew Corey had followed Veronica before. Okay. At that point, if you know that, do you not step in and say, hey, I do not want you to kill this woman.

• 40:49Speaker 01

  Right.

• 40:50Speaker 00

  He doesn't say anything about that.

• 40:52Speaker 01

  Cause you'd have to ask yourself, why are you following her?

• 40:55Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 40:58Speaker 02

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• 41:27Speaker 00

  Tim noted that about a week before the September 28 interview, Corey came to his house asking for $35,000. Tim said he would not receive any money while there were unresolved questions about Veronica's death. And we talked earlier about why he would need to file the life insurance claim so quickly. Well, if he owes somebody $35,000 for committing the murder, that might be one reason why.

• 41:59Speaker 01

  I would think so.

• 42:01Speaker 00

  Tim also talked about his marriage to Veronica. He said she meant everything to him and he loved her, but nothing he did was good enough for her. When he caught her having an affair, she told him the courts would be on her side. He would get nothing and he would never see their son. He admitted he wanted something to happen to Veronica so he could be with his son, but he didn't want someone to kill her. Referring to an alleged marital impropriety, he said that if he had been able to kill someone, he would have killed Veronica the second time he discovered she was having an affair. Again, I don't know why these are things that you're revealing.

• 42:44Speaker 01

  Yes, you should probably think about what's coming out of your mouth.

• 42:48Speaker 00

  Also, he wanted something to happen to Veronica so he could be with his son. But he didn't want someone to kill her. Well, what is something that could happen to her? That would cause her not to be able to see her son? And the custody would go to Tim?

• 43:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, it could only be if she died.

• 43:09Speaker 00

  Or she's in horrific accident. I'm, I just don't understand what he's saying. Or why he thinks this is making him look better in the eyes of the authorities. And also he's saying, I, if I wanted to kill her, I would have killed her. The second time I discovered she was having an affair. Well, but you didn't kill her in this police scenario, right? You hired somebody else.

• 43:39Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 43:40Speaker 00

  To kill her. So I don't know how that plays either. He did say that he just wanted to move on with his life. Like Veronica had. Tim gave a second statement on November 2nd, 2010. Once again, he acknowledged that the conversation about the crisscross murder for higher plot was in jest. Corey mentioned it again a couple of days later and offered Tim $10,000 to kill a man. Tim said he couldn't do it. He told Corey, he wished Veronica would get hit by a bus, run over by a drunk driver, or would move to California. Corey later told him he followed Veronica.

• 44:21Speaker 01

  It sounds like he still wanted some pretty nasty stuff to happen Veronica, though.

• 44:26Speaker 00

  Well, it goes back to the whole point of how is he going to get full custody of his son? Unless something really bad happens to her. Tim gave a third statement on November 16th because he hadn't been truthful during his last interview. Well, that's a real shocker.

• 44:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:45Speaker 00

  He said, when he and Corey first talked about the crisscross murder from the movie, they were both having a bad day. Corey brought it up again a couple of days later, and at that point seemed more serious about it. Tim said he couldn't kill anyone. Corey offered him $10,000. Tim said that sounded good to him, and he agreed to give Corey $10,000 as well.

• 45:10Speaker 01

  Well, that's a big change.

• 45:12Speaker 00

  Well, yeah. He's still saying, I can't kill anyone, but that $10,000 does sound pretty good. Tim and Veronica continued to have disagreements about the divorce. Meanwhile, Corey wanted to establish a routine of following her. Tim didn't disagree with this and said that he just kind of left the idea there in place.

• 45:35Speaker 01

  I was also just thinking, if Tim gives Corey 10 and Corey gives him 10, why even give each other money at all?

• 45:43Speaker 00

  Just keep, just keep your money and, uh, yeah, it does seem to cancel out. On the day of the murder, Tim talked to Corey and Corey said he was nearby and that he could see him across the street. A short time after Tim picked up his son, Corey called and told him it was done. All right. So this is like his third interview, right? And he's really kind of morphed some things as people often do from interview to interview, story to story. Now, some of the stuff is kind of the same in all of the statements, but there, there are definitely some nuances in them.

• 46:24Speaker 00

  But this revelation here that Corey called him and told him it was done. I mean, that's a, that's a pretty specific confession. Now, I still think Tim is trying to lessen his role.

• 46:40Speaker 01

  Sure he is.

• 46:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, we talked about this crisscross. I told him I couldn't kill anybody. I just kind of left it hanging out there. He's saying all of these things to make it seem as though Corey just took it upon himself to murder Veronica, let's say in the hopes that Tim would come around and do his part. It just doesn't seem all that believable.

• 47:05Speaker 01

  No. And if Tim really didn't have anything to do with it, why wouldn't he have just called the authorities right then and said, hey, I think this buddy of mine killed my wife?

• 47:16Speaker 00

  Well, that's a great point. You know, if you really thought that, maybe you tried to get ahead of it.

• 47:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:24Speaker 00

  Corey came to Tim's house a couple of weeks later and asked for $35,000. He wanted more money because Veronica fought with him. Corey said he was going to get a new identity and leave. According to Tim, Corey wasn't aware of Veronica's insurance money, but he was aware of a loan Tim applied for. He would not have told Corey about the life insurance because he probably would have asked for more money. Yeah, if you're getting 550 grand, I want more than 10.

• 47:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm sure he'd want 100,000.

• 47:56Speaker 00

  Tim and Corey were tried separately and were both found guilty of murder. Corey was also convicted of especially aggravated robbery. Now, most of the trial information comes from State versus Bozeman. Prosecutors presented a theory of the crime. They believe that Corey went to the church on the morning of August 29. The only person who could have told him Veronica would be there was Tim. While Tim ran errands, Corey followed Veronica home. Corey pulled in behind her and approached her, wearing a mask and gloves. Veronica ran inside. Corey followed her. A struggle ensued and Corey shot her. Corey's former girlfriend,

• 48:41Speaker 00

  Jenny, testified that she worked in Alabama on the night of August 28 and got back to Nashville around 9:30 a.m. on the 29th. She went to sleep and woke up to find Corey leaning over her. She always kept her handbag containing the key to her van in bed with her because of her roommates. It was possible Corey took her key, but she didn't know for sure if he drove her van while she slept.

• 49:10Speaker 01

  How rough is it when you have to take your own keys to bed with you?

• 49:14Speaker 00

  For fear that your roommates are gonna steal your van?

• 49:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:18Speaker 00

  Maybe you should get some different roommates.

• 49:19Speaker 01

  That's what I was thinking.

• 49:21Speaker 00

  Jenny woke up in the mid afternoon. She and Corey went out for an early dinner. On the way to the restaurant, Corey stopped in a parking lot by a Catholic church and school. Corey said he didn't know why they went that way and then turned around. She also testified that at Corey's urging, she stole a nine millimeter handgun from her ex-husband on July 17th or 18th, 2010. Corey told her to take it to stop her husband from using it on her. He didn't ask her to give him the gun. She put it in a red lunchbox in her van and noticed that it was missing on July 27. Corey had unloaded groceries from the back of her van on multiple occasions.

• 50:07Speaker 01

  So easy access to it?

• 50:08Speaker 00

  Yeah. And, you know, was he playing her all along? Hey, you need to steal this gun before your ex uses it on you. All the while knowing that he's going to use this to commit a murder.

• 50:24Speaker 01

  Right.

• 50:25Speaker 00

  Possibly without her knowledge. The jury also heard from Judge Philip Robinson, who previously represented Veronica in her divorce proceedings. Veronica notified him of two communications from Tim, which she perceived as threats. On March 28, 2010, she emailed Robinson and said she and Tim had a heated discussion during their custody exchange about parenting time. Tim looked at her and said, be careful, it's coming.

• 50:56Speaker 01

  Wow, that's damning.

• 50:58Speaker 00

  Well, what's coming? Now, I think after someone is murdered, that statement is even more ominous. I think if somebody said that to me, I would take it as a threat, but I wouldn't know what the threat was. Cause I, I don't know what is coming. But after someone's murdered, you can kind of put it in there as that's what was coming.

• 51:20Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 51:21Speaker 00

  This was before the hearing. After the hearing, she and Tim had a disagreement about his questioning her about their child's babysitter. She tried to explain how she perceived his questions. And Tim said he could not speak to her and accused her of not focusing on their child. He said it would take a simple phone call to end the nonsense. She asked Tim if he was threatening her and he continued yelling, so she hung up on him. A simple phone call to end the nonsense. I mean, this is pretty vague stuff.

• 51:54Speaker 01

  It is.

• 51:55Speaker 00

  But again, most people don't come out and say, I'm going to call my buddy who's going to kill you. They're not that stupid. Detective Chad Gish testified that although Cory's phone contained text messages to and from Tim before and after the murder, Tim's phone didn't contain any messages or call history. Cory's phone also contained photos of Tim and a photo of the gun.

• 52:21Speaker 01

  So it sounds like Tim deleted all the ones on his phone.

• 52:25Speaker 00

  Sounds like he wiped it, yeah. In February 2012, Cory was sentenced to life without parole, plus 25 years. Tim was sentenced in October 2012. He won't be eligible for parole until he has served 51 years in prison.

• 52:41Speaker 01

  Good.

• 52:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, I'm good with both of those. Tim Bozza and Cory Cotham thought that they could get away with murder by following a movie plot. Tim believed he had covered his tracks by securing an alibi for himself, but he didn't account for incriminating phone records and cooperative witnesses who helped prove his involvement.

• 53:06Speaker 01

  And he just wasn't good at telling the stories.

• 53:09Speaker 00

  And neither one of them were.

• 53:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 53:11Speaker 00

  And I think that's the downfall of many people, right? You know, as we wrap this one up, so many times in the episodes that we cover, you know, people are just, you know, they're undone by the stories they tell because they often have to change those stories later on after being confronted with certain evidence. And it just becomes a real mess at that point.

• 53:36Speaker 01

  What happens when you lie?

• 53:37Speaker 00

  Well, like you always said, right? When you're telling the truth, it's easy to keep the story straight because it just is what it is.

• 53:43Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 53:44Speaker 00

  When you're crafting this narrative that turns out to be false, it can be a lot harder in sticking to it because number one, you made it up or you fabricated at least bits and pieces of it. And then number two, once you're confronted with facts that completely disprove what you've been saying, well, now you gotta pivot.

• 54:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:11Speaker 00

  And you gotta come up with another lie. And is that gonna stand up? You know, just, it never works out well for these people.

• 54:19Speaker 01

  You could only pivot so many times anyway.

• 54:21Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's just, it's hard to believe that, you know, Tim didn't know what was gonna happen. You take these threats that he had made to Veronica, you know, I get it. Defendants are always trying to lessen their involvement, especially when there's another person involved. Anytime you can switch the level of involvement or sway it more towards the other person, I guess the better for you.

• 54:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:54Speaker 00

  But to me, it's just so unbelievable that he thought, well, we had this conversation about, you know, each killing the other's problem person in their lives. But yeah, I never thought he would go through with it, even though I knew he was following her. Just stuff like that, it just, it makes it nonsensical at a certain point.

• 55:16Speaker 01

  Really does.

• 55:16Speaker 00

  And, and I believe the jury saw it that way, too.

• 55:19Speaker 01

  I just, I feel bad, obviously, for the son.

• 55:22Speaker 00

  Yeah, absolutely. Because he lost his mother, he lost his father.

• 55:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:28Speaker 00

  And that's the other thing that I, in these cases, where, whether it's a murder for custody or a murder for financial gain, when a child is involved, how does one parent not think that no matter how this thing shakes out, it is going to do irreparable damage to their child? Number one, one of the parents is gonna be killed, and then there's a really good chance that you're gonna be caught. Which means the child's gonna lose both parents.

• 56:02Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 56:03Speaker 00

  But if you're able to come to the decision that you could kill your spouse or ex, or have that person killed, well, maybe you don't care all that much about what it does to your child.

• 56:16Speaker 01

  Clearly he didn't. He cared more about himself than his child.

• 56:19Speaker 00

  Which is the problem with most people.

• 56:21Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 56:22Speaker 00

  It really is. But that's it for our episode on Veronica Bozza. We got a couple of voicemails. You want to check those out?

• 56:28Speaker 01

  It's here.

• 56:29Speaker 03

  Hey guys, this is Mark calling from Oregon. I'm Team Mick Gibby or Gib Mickey or whatever. I love you both. You guys are awesome. I just listened to the episode about Patricia Rohr because mostly I just watched an episode about that on FBI files. And I wanted to see the comparison between their view of it and your view of it. And it was, it was amazing. You guys did a great job. You covered, you matched every fact. There were no discrepancies, but it was, it was great to get a true crime aficionado, I guess. I don't want to say fan, but you love it and it was amazing. I truly appreciate the episode. And I really love you guys. Keep doing what you're doing and keep your own time taken. Thanks.

• 57:10Speaker 00

  All right. Appreciate the kudos very much. And we had a caller from Oregon who didn't talk about seeing people walking around with swords.

• 57:18Speaker 01

  Which is, you know, a plus nowadays.

• 57:20Speaker 00

  And apparently unusual.

• 57:22Speaker 01

  Yeah. No, but thanks. And, you know, we do some consulting with the FPBI.

• 57:29Speaker 00

  The FPBI?

• 57:30Speaker 01

  The F B B Y I.

• 57:33Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 57:34Speaker 01

  That, that went south.

• 57:35Speaker 00

  Yeah. You're gonna have to explain that acronym or acronym because I don't, I don't know what that is.

• 57:41Speaker 03

  Mike Gibby, what's going on guys? This is Josh. It's my second voicemail. I left one back in January. I'm the one who had the appendectomy and you guys had me laughing so hard. I almost popped my stitches. Um, anyway, I have, still have not called up, but I am on Bruce MacArthur. I had to call and leave a voicemail because you guys were talking about poppers. Bergy kept saying he didn't know if he's ever done poppers. Listen guys, as a gay man, I just wanted to let you know. That's a almost exclusively gay drug.

• 58:16Speaker 03

  So I doubt you have ever done poppers, Fergie, but feel free to give it a try. They're not that bad. Uh, anyway, love you guys. I'm team Gibby. Uh, just, I relate to Fergie more, but Gibby is just hilarious. So you guys keep up the good work. Keep your head on swivel and keep your own time ticking. Thanks, guys.

• 58:35Speaker 00

  I loved the voicemail. Yeah, don't, don't believe I've ever done poppers. Did not know that that was almost, as he said, exclusively a gay person's drug. I, I did not know that.

• 58:49Speaker 01

  Now you know.

• 58:50Speaker 00

  I just have heard poppers.

• 58:52Speaker 01

  Poppers.

• 58:53Speaker 00

  Don't really know what they are, to be honest with you.

• 58:56Speaker 01

  Maybe we should look it up.

• 58:57Speaker 00

  Yeah. Well, be careful because you might see some things you don't want to see. It depends.

• 59:03Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, but like you said, now we know. So.

• 59:06Speaker 00

  We love information.

• 59:07Speaker 01

  We do. Knowledge is power.

• 59:10Speaker 00

  The, the, the question is always, will we remember it the next time this comes up? Sometimes we do. Sometimes we don't.

• 59:17Speaker 01

  You know, the answer for me is I will not. I forget things, uh, fairly frequently.

• 59:24Speaker 00

  I was also thinking, going back to the, the first voicemail, McGibby sounds like something uh, new coming out of McDonald's.

• 59:31Speaker 01

  You know, they should.

• 59:32Speaker 00

  The McGibby.

• 59:33Speaker 01

  The McGibby.

• 59:34Speaker 00

  I think that'd be a big hit.

• 59:36Speaker 01

  Would you go buy a McGibby at McDonald's?

• 59:38Speaker 00

  It depends on, on what it, what it is.

• 59:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:41Speaker 00

  Um, I think it would be a sandwich that's not real sure what it is. Uh, doesn't know what's in it. Maybe has seen that mystery ingredient in something else, but can't remember the name of it.

• 1:00:00Speaker 01

  Is it a, is it a McRib? Is it a McChicken?

• 1:00:02Speaker 00

  We don't know. Maybe it's just a McGibby. An amalgamation of a bunch of different, uh, things.

• 1:00:09Speaker 01

  It'd be a big hit.

• 1:00:09Speaker 00

  It would be a big hit. I like it. All right, buddy. That is it for another episode of True Crime All the Time. So for Mike.

• 1:00:16Speaker 01

  And Gibby.

• 1:00:16Speaker 00

  Stay safe and keep your own time ticking.