#695 - Happiness Expert Dr. Arthur Brooks

Dr. Arthur Brooks is a social scientist, author and professor known for teaching the Science of Happiness at Vanderbilt and Harvard Business School. His new book “The Meaning of Your Life” is available now everywhere. Dr. Brooks joins Theo to talk about what makes a meaningful life, why chasing success can feel unfulfilling, and the questions that can help us figure out what true happiness looks like. Dr. Arthur Brooks: https://www.instagram.com/arthurcbrooks/ ------------------------------------------------- Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Celsius: Go to the Celsius Amazon store to check out all of their flavors. #CELSIUSBrandPartner @CelsiusOfficial https://amzn.to/3HbAtPJ Acorns: Learn more about Invest My Tips at http://Acorns.com/TheoTips Blue Chew: Discover your options at http://BlueChew.com! Buy two months and get the third for FREE with promo code THEO. Glacier: Privacy isn't paranoia. It's protection. Get 20% off your first 3 months at http://theglacierapp.com/TPW and use code TPW at checkout. #ad Fabletics: Shop now at http://Fabletics.com/WEEKEND to get 70–80% off everything when you sign up as a new VIP. ------------------------------------------------- Music: “Shine” by Bishop Gunn Bishop Gunn - Shine ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: [email protected] Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Mail stuff to: ATTN: TPW PO BOX 40137 Nashville TN 37204 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend X: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Trevyn https://www.instagram.com/trevyn.s/ Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Producer: Andrew https://www.instagram.com/bleachmediaofficial/ Producer: Halston https://www.instagram.com/halstonrays/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Theo Von?

  You ever realize that you spent your entire morning thinking about lunch? It's 9:00 AM and somehow I'm already in negotiations with myself about how I'm gonna spend $20 on a sandwich at noon. And then I eat it, or you eat it, or somebody eats it. And then an hour later, you're just standing in the kitchen worrying about what you'll do for dinner. And that's one reason why I've been into Huell. The Black Edition Powder is a complete meal you have instead of food, not a shake on top of food. Their powder starts at less than $3 per meal, has 40 grams of protein, and mixes with water or milk in about 30 seconds. I like Huell's shakes because they're clean and it's quick.

• 0:41Theo Von?

  I just want to make sure I have everything I need to keep going the way I want to keep going in a healthy manner. So with Huell, basically lunch went from a daily logistical problem to a thing I can solve in about 30 seconds. Make healthy eating simple. New customers get an exclusive offer of 15% off online with my code WEEKEND at huell.com/weekend. That's H-U-E-L.com/weekend. Thank you to Huell for partnering and supporting our show. Today's guest is an author and a social scientist. He's a professor at Vanderbilt and a senior fellow at the Harvard Business School, known for his popular class, Leadership and Happiness.

• 1:26Theo Von?

  He's here discussing his new book, The Meaning of Your Life, which is available now. I had a great time with today's guest, Dr. Arthur Brooks.

• 1:51Speaker 01

  Well, the whole idea of Jesus carrying the cross, that has this incredible imagery, that idea that each one of us has to take up our cross and carry it. I mean, you woke up heavy today.

• 2:01Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 2:01Speaker 01

  You were carrying your cross. And that has meaning, but you, and the whole modern therapeutic culture says, Theo, you gotta get rid of that feeling. That's a pathology. No, it's not. It's an opportunity. That's what that is. That means something. And then we can actually kind of get to the deep meaning of what that is, that can actually help you learn and grow.

• 2:19Theo Von?

  Amen.

• 2:20Speaker 01

  And to say, man, there's suffering today. Okay, bring it on. Put me in, coach.

• 2:24Theo Von?

  Right.

• 2:25Speaker 01

  Right?

• 2:26Theo Von?

  Um, Arthur C. Brooks, uh, thank you so much for joining us. Um, I know that you are an author, a social scientist, and a professor. Is that fair to say?

• 2:37Speaker 01

  That's right. And I've been teaching the last seven years full-time at Harvard, and I just, I just switched out to Vanderbilt here in Nashville, Tennessee, where we're taping this today.

• 2:44Theo Von?

  Thanks, welcome.

• 2:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, thank you.

• 2:45Theo Von?

  You have a new book, uh, The Meaning of Your Life: Finding Purpose in an Age of Emptiness. Um, and one thing that I even just loved about the title is it's the meaning of your life, right? It's not like this, this huge thing of like, oh, the meaning of life.

• 3:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, everybody has the same meaning to life and I'm gonna lay it on you. No.

• 3:04Theo Von?

  Right.

• 3:04Speaker 01

  I want to lead you to find the meaning of your life.

• 3:07Theo Von?

  Right.

• 3:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm a trail boss. I'm a Sherpa in this book. And it's basically the brain science and behavioral science that shows that all of us, when we use our brains right, and we stop doing a bunch of dumb things, and we start doing a bunch of old things, old-fashioned things, that, that we can find the meaning of our lives. And I'm not gonna tell you what it is, cuz I don't know. I mean, some days I don't know what the meaning of my life is.

• 3:29Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 3:29Speaker 01

  I mean, I'm on this journey myself because I'm like beaten up and suffering too.

• 3:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 3:35Speaker 01

  Right?

• 3:35Theo Von?

  Amen, bro. Yeah. Yeah, even today, it was just like, man, I was like praying right before, like probably 11 minutes ago, I was praying. I was just like.

• 3:43Speaker 01

  What were you praying?

• 3:44Theo Von?

  I was just like, God, just let me have some confidence in myself.

• 3:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:47Theo Von?

  You know, let me have some peace today.

• 3:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:49Theo Von?

  Um, let me not feel this pressure, uh, that I, everything has to be perfect.

• 3:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:56Theo Von?

  And that this person that I don't know, uh, what I'm doing.

• 4:00Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 4:01Theo Von?

  You know?

• 4:01Speaker 01

  You know, it's funny because.

• 4:03Theo Von?

  So a little more agency out there. I was just looking for a little bit more real agency and not just like a frenetic energy, like, um, you know, I'm gonna have another coffee and I'll be ready.

• 4:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I'll be all set.

• 4:13Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 4:13Speaker 01

  But there's, you know, whatever, two, three million people, whoever, who watch this episode of the show, the assumption is, and this is a huge thing for them to understand, they think, if I had Theo Von's life, it would be so awesome and everything would be good.

• 4:25Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 4:26Speaker 01

  That's a lie. That isn't true. That's not how life works at all. You know, it's like we say in my business, woe be to the man whose dreams come true, and he finds he had, he finds he had the wrong dreams. Because you always have the wrong dreams. You know, you always think, if I hit the lottery. But we know people with the lottery, they wind up miserable. It's a huge problem. I mean, and people who, where their worldly dreams come true, it's a big burden. It's a big problem. The stakes get higher. And then the guy was like, I'm not gonna hit the lottery. I'm not gonna be CEO. I'm not gonna be a billionaire. Okay, whatever. I guess I'll just go to the park and play with my kid.

• 5:01Theo Von?

  Right.

• 5:02Speaker 01

  He hit the lottery. He won.

• 5:04Theo Von?

  He won.

• 5:05Speaker 01

  He won. And, and, and then you gotta figure, okay, all right, well, the die is cast. Theo Von is Theo Von. Arthur Brooks is Arthur Brooks. Good. So what are we gonna do with it?

• 5:13Theo Von?

  What are we gonna do with it?

• 5:14Speaker 01

  And the only thing that we can do on the day that's heavy is go love somebody else, is to go serve somebody else. That's all there is.

• 5:22Theo Von?

  Amen, man. Yeah, even when you came in, you just asked me what was going on, like genuinely, man, I just appreciated that, you know? Sometimes it's what I need. Like last time, I was even calling my brother, like, and he was busy with his kids, but I just wanted to have a moment where he like, you know, just like, like told me everything was gonna be okay.

• 5:37Speaker 01

  You know, this funny thing, there's this Catholic saint from the year 13 something. She's the first woman ever published in English. Her name was Saint Juliana of Norwich. And that, like, there's a.

• 5:49Theo Von?

  Saint Juliana of Norwich?

• 5:50Speaker 01

  Of Norwich, in, in, in Great Britain. And, um, these troops, these enemies were closing in, and it was a huge thing. And she wrote in her journal, "All will be well, and all will be well, and all manner of things shall be well." You gotta have faith, right? And you gotta offer up to suffering. You have to, you know, say, I'm gonna love somebody right now, and then all will be well. What does it mean for it to be well? That I won't actually have any discomfort or suffering or heaviness anymore? No, because that's your lot, man. I mean, there's suffering in your life.

• 6:22Theo Von?

  Yeah, and there's suffering everywhere.

• 6:23Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 6:24Theo Von?

  And there's so much, there's a ton of suffering, and a lot of that is, is, um, is part of life.

• 6:28Speaker 01

  It is. And it's actually weird because it's one of the things I study, is that people who will have, have a lot of suffering, they have a lot of meaning too. They have a deep sense of life's meaning. You get like 90 years to figure out how to live with your suffering. If you're lucky.

• 6:46Theo Von?

  Uh, that's so interesting, man. Uh, yeah, it's, it's, uh, it's, it's interesting that, um, that your book came into my life at this moment. You know, a, um, a lot of times I've had a fear of missing out recently, like I have a lot of FOMO, but even more so, it's become a fear of missing out on myself.

• 7:07Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 7:08Theo Von?

  You know, it's not like, I keep thinking, I'm, I'm, I'm missing this game that I'm seeing, or I'm missing these people doing this. And there's some of that, but it's, there's this deeper thing that feels to me sometimes like, man, I'm missing out on some opportunity of me, or some, or.

• 7:25Speaker 01

  There's something deeper. There's something deeper, and you can't get it. You can't quite get it, right?

• 7:29Theo Von?

  And I can't quite.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  You can't focus in on it. You don't, it's like, what is it? And then you're distracted, and then it goes away, and it's like, oh, missed it again.

• 7:35Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 7:36Speaker 01

  Another day won't buy.

• 7:37Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 7:37Speaker 01

  That feeling?

• 7:37Theo Von?

  Yes. And so what made you write this book now?

• 7:41Speaker 01

  So I teach classes on the science of happiness. So the past seven years, I've been full-time teaching a class on the science of happiness at Harvard, and it's super popular. It's like the most popular elective at the Harvard Business School. So like I have hundreds of people on the waiting list for this thing, cuz they wanna be happier. They know how to make money.

• 7:57Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 7:57Speaker 01

  But, but they know how to be successful, but they don't know that the ultimate startup is your life, that you're the CEO of the enterprise of you incorporated, and you're responsible for it. And that means taking risks where you should in, in, in, in return for explosive rewards. But how are they denominated? Not money, or power, or pleasure, or fame, or Instagram followers, anything stupid. No. It's love and happiness. And, and people don't know how to get that. So I've been talking about that. So, so scientifically, happiness isn't a feeling at all. Feelings are evidence of happiness, kinda like the smell of the turkey is evidence of your Thanksgiving dinner.

• 8:31Theo Von?

  Okay, so the smell.

• 8:32Speaker 01

  That's feelings.

• 8:33Theo Von?

  So the smell of the turkey is evidence of the Thanksgiving dinner?

• 8:35Speaker 01

  That's right. And your feelings of happiness are evidence of happiness.

• 8:39Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 8:39Speaker 01

  So don't ever go for feelings. Big mistake that everybody makes in trying to find something big in their lives is like, I want that feeling. I hope I feel happier tomorrow. Big mistake. Your, your feelings lie all, when you woke up this morning, and you didn't, I woke up this morning, I felt bad too. And, and you're like, is God here?

• 8:58Speaker 01

  And, and, you know, okay, get it back. If I actually said, okay, my feelings are authentic, I would have really questioned a lot of things in my life, but my feelings are, are the activity, are biochemical activity in my brain, in the limbic system of my brain. It's a bunch of signals saying that there's threats and opportunities. That's all emotions are. And they lie constantly.

• 9:19Theo Von?

  They lie constantly?

• 9:20Speaker 01

  Constantly. Your, your feelings are not to be trusted. Now, they're worth listening to, but don't trust them as the authentic truth. The problem with a lot of young people today is a lot of young adults today are told that the only thing authentic about them are their feelings, which is why all that safe spaces and, and I'm offended and, and, you know, all that nonsense, that's based on the feelings-based culture, which is a culture of lies. That's what it comes down to.

• 9:42Theo Von?

  Amen.

• 9:43Speaker 01

  And so what do we want to look for if it's not feelings? We want to look for something that's really tangible. Sort of the, you know, the macros when you're trying to eat, right? Protein, carbohydrates and fat. That's food. Happiness has three macronutrients. The things that we really got to go for are enjoyment, to enjoy our lives. Not the same thing as pleasure. I've made that mistake. You know, there's a reason I drink zero alcohol today is because I made the mistake of confusing pleasure and enjoyment.

• 10:07Theo Von?

  Yeah, I've done that a lot.

• 10:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's anybody who's been addicted, they know exactly what that's all about. The, the pleasure is not the road to happiness. Pleasure is the road to rehab.

• 10:15Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 10:16Speaker 01

  Now, there's nothing, there's nothing wrong with pleasure, but it's incomplete. You gotta add people and memory to it so you can manage your pleasures and they don't manage you. That's enjoyment.

• 10:25Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 10:25Speaker 01

  The second macronutrient is satisfaction, and that's the joy of an accomplishment with struggle.

• 10:30Theo Von?

  Okay, so the first one is?

• 10:32Speaker 01

  Enjoyment.

• 10:32Theo Von?

  Enjoyment?

• 10:33Speaker 01

  Not pleasure, enjoyment.

• 10:34Theo Von?

  Not pleasure, enjoyment. And the difference between those two, one more time?

• 10:37Speaker 01

  Is pleasure plus people plus memory equals enjoyment.

• 10:40Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 10:40Speaker 01

  So it's got to be conscious and memorable. So that's why when you're doing something really pleasurable and you're doing it alone, you're probably doing it wrong.

• 10:47Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  That's why people are so critically important. You almost never really enjoy, if it's not addictive, like walking in the woods or saying your prayers, good. But anything that actually is pleasurable, like what you eat, what you look at, what you use, if you're, that's the reason that, you know, that a beer company doesn't do an ad, uh, you know, a beer ad for a dude alone in his apartment pounding a 12-pack. It's like, that doesn't look good in the ad. And the reason is because it's pleasure, not enjoyment. They show the guy with his buddies, right? Because it's pleasure, it's beer, plus people he loves, plus memories that they're making together. That's enjoyment.

• 11:24Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 11:24Speaker 01

  That's the recipe.

• 11:25Theo Von?

  So the first one is enjoyment?

• 11:27Speaker 01

  Right.

• 11:27Theo Von?

  And you'll get enjoyment if you include other people?

• 11:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, and making a memory. So it's really conscious.

• 11:32Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 11:32Speaker 01

  So that you can, you can, enjoyment is permanent. When you remember it, it's permanent. You know, it's like when I, when I was a kid, you know, my mom was a good cook and, and we had Thanksgiving at our house every year, just like all of us did, right? You probably did too. And every year we'd open up the oven and it'd be a beautiful turkey. My dad would like, get the camera. And we would take a, it's like we have 30 turkeys in the same oven and we don't even, but the whole point was he was trying to make it memorable. And that's what Thanksgiving dinner was all about. That's your life. So it's like, yeah, yeah, there's gonna be pleasure. But if you start doing something for pleasure and you take it away from people and memories, you're gonna be an addict.

• 12:08Theo Von?

  Right. So if you're sitting in your apartment, just playing with your turkey or whatever.

• 12:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly right. Or if you're sitting in your apartment all alone, you're isolated and you're gaming.

• 12:16Theo Von?

  Right.

• 12:16Speaker 01

  Or, or you're looking at pornography, because nobody looks at pornography with a bunch of friends.

• 12:21Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 12:22Speaker 01

  You know, all these things are so bad.

• 12:24Theo Von?

  Right.

• 12:24Speaker 01

  You know, that's the reason they're so bad, because they take pleasure away from, and they make them not part of enjoyment, which means they lead to addiction, not to happiness.

• 12:31Theo Von?

  But we feel like that's not the truth, right?

• 12:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, because your brain, your ancient brain, which is the same as it was 250,000 years ago, lies to you. And all your brain cares about is you actually getting these rewards that will make you more likely to get mates, more likely to get calories, more likely to survive. Mother nature, she doesn't care if you're happy. She doesn't care at all. And so she'll lie to you and make you follow your animal impulses.

• 12:55Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 12:55Speaker 01

  And that, and so all the stuff that we're really good at today, you know, opiates, alcohol, or pornography, all it is, is a way to supercharge the impulses, the animal impulses that we naturally have.

• 13:07Theo Von?

  So it's kind of a hijacking of those?

• 13:08Speaker 01

  Completely.

• 13:09Theo Von?

  Right. And there's a much more dense and meaningful way to get those?

• 13:13Speaker 01

  Yes, for sure. And well, the way to get that such that it's, it's deeply fulfilling, but not addictive, is to make sure that you're getting, you know, the experience the way that was intended. So don't like refine it. I mean, we have natural endorphins in our brain so that we get injured, we're actually able to function and run away from the predator and not be completely debilitated by the pain. That's what endorphins are for. Well, when we figure out chemically what they're all about in the brain, and then we refine them and produce them, they turn into fentanyl. I mean, that's what, that's what heroin is. That's what, that's what opiates are. Pornography, it, it shears off the, the, you know, the physical aspect of a sexual relationship between people who are in love. And it, all it does is it just preserves that particular part. It's the fentanyl, it's fentanyl for sex.

• 13:58Theo Von?

  Right.

• 13:58Speaker 01

  And that's the reason.

• 13:59Theo Von?

  It's like weiner fentanyl or whatever.

• 14:01Speaker 01

  It's just super addictive.

• 14:02Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 14:03Speaker 01

  It's a, it's supposed to be addictive.

• 14:05Theo Von?

  Right. So they're just hide, so a lot of that is the hijacking of just a simple moment to kind of trick your system.

• 14:11Speaker 01

  That's right. And so if you make it social and memorable, you'll go to the real thing.

• 14:14Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 14:15Speaker 01

  Right? That's what it comes down to. Then it's enjoyment, and that enjoyment is a beautiful part of life. That's a beautiful part of life. But any of us who've actually really, really struggled with addictive behavior, it's because we got that wrong.

• 14:26Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 14:26Speaker 01

  Right? And some people are genetically more, more prone to that than other people. Did you have alcoholism in your family?

• 14:32Theo Von?

  Yeah, we got it.

• 14:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, so do we.

• 14:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 14:34Speaker 01

  It's a Brooks disease.

• 14:35Theo Von?

  Is it?

• 14:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure.

• 14:36Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 14:39Theo Von?

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• 16:45Theo Von?

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• 17:30Theo Von?

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• 18:50Theo Von?

  What's the second macronutrient of happiness?

• 18:53Speaker 01

  Satisfaction. Now satisfaction is the joy you get from an accomplishment with struggle. And this is super weird because only Homo sapiens want to suffer. We want to suffer for our accomplishments because that's how we know what they're worth.

• 19:06Theo Von?

  Okay, so only Homo sapiens want to suffer?

• 19:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, my dog doesn't want to like struggle for his rewards. He'd be lying down. Right? They want the easiest path to absolutely everything because they don't have moral aspirations. But you and I, we actually, we don't know if something is actually worthwhile unless we gave something up for it. And that's why struggle is so critically important. And that's why we teach our kids, you know, good things come to those who wait. Defer your gratifications. Don't eat before dinner. Study really, really hard even though you're not going to like it so you can get good grades. Because then you learn this lesson that things are, that the reward is way sweeter. The accomplishment is meaningful to you when you've actually struggled for it. And that's one of the biggest problems that we have today is we're teaching people that struggle and sacrifice is stupid.

• 19:50Speaker 01

  That all that does is it ruins the sense of accomplishment that people get.

• 19:54Theo Von?

  Where are we teaching that at? Or where are you seeing a lot of this being taught?

• 19:57Speaker 01

  I see this taught with sort of the immediate gratification that comes around from tech and social media for sure. But also in the therapeutic, the therapeutic industrial culture that we've got that says that if you're suffering from something, it's evidence that there's a pathology. That's wrong. I mean, I teach my students, it's like you're studying at Harvard. If you're not depressed and anxious, you need therapy. You know, it's hard and you're doing a hard thing on purpose. Of course, you're suffering. Good. I mean, I don't go to the gym and you don't go to the gym going, this is gonna feel so good. No, it's gonna hurt. That's kind of the point. But the whole, but life is a gym.

• 20:30Theo Von?

  Right.

• 20:30Speaker 01

  You know, you put yourself in front of hard things and you're gonna suffer for those hard things because you want the sweetness that comes as a reward for what you get in, in, in return for the struggle is what it comes down to.

• 20:41Theo Von?

  Yeah, yeah, it feels like sometime, some point along the way, we forgot the value of the squeeze.

• 20:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:48Theo Von?

  Is what makes us love the Jews.

• 20:50Speaker 01

  Totally. And that's absolutely the case. It's so funny that we actually, we, we, we fail to realize this kind of thing. But in, in, in a culture of immediate gratification,

• 21:00Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 21:00Speaker 01

  We're not gonna have any struggling. And so we start to lose the reps. We start to lose the ability. We get in kind of a doom loop where I don't suffer and so I'm no longer able to suffer. And so I try less to suffer. And what happens is I get less and less and less and less satisfaction from life. Life is just like, yeah, whatever. Why should I even try? And you find that people are just like not striving in the same way that they would have before. Because they can actually get a payoff without any struggle and they don't want the struggle naturally. But that's the wrong approach. Like, it's funny because again, the animal impulses lie.

• 21:32Theo Von?

  The animal impulses lie?

• 21:34Speaker 01

  Mother nature lies all the time. And she says the easy path is the best path. Because in, you know, 250,000 years ago, all of humanity lived in bands of hunter gatherers of 30 to 50 individuals. And if you could actually sit down and not work better because you're saving your energy. If you could get more calories, get them, right? Under all circumstances. But that's not the case today.

• 21:55Theo Von?

  Right.

• 21:55Speaker 01

  And so the result is we actually have to put friction back into our lives and not listen to Mother Nature who says, take the easy path. Don't take the easy path. Take the hard path. And this is one of the things that we find, I talk to a lot of young men. I mean, I get tons of unsolicited email from young guys. I just graduated from college. I got nothing to do. I'm living with my mom. I'm having a hard time finding a job or even looking for a job. I'm smoking a lot of weed. I'm gaming all the time. You know, what do I do? And my answer is always go do a hard thing. You know, even if it's a hard thing, it's like get up before dawn every day for the next month.

• 22:30Theo Von?

  Your life will change.

• 22:31Speaker 01

  I mean, if, if the sun is up every day, when you get up, you've lost the first battle.

• 22:35Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 22:35Speaker 01

  Right? And, and there's a whole bunch of neuroscience on this too. It talks about productivity and focus and happiness. The Indians call that the Brahma Muhurta, which in Sanskrit means the creator's time.

• 22:46Theo Von?

  Brahma Muhurta?

• 22:47Speaker 01

  B R A H M A M U H U R T A. Brahma Muhurta.

• 22:54Theo Von?

  Bring that up and keep that other page open for me. I do want to read that really fast.

• 22:58Speaker 01

  There you go. The time of Brahma or the creator's time. It's the sacred predawn window in Vedic tradition in Ayurveda.

• 23:05Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 23:05Speaker 01

  And I, I learned this. I go to India a lot. But when I go to India, I have Hindu teachers in the south of India. I've also worked for the last 13 years with the Dalai Lama, which has been really, really helpful for me. But the result of it is I've been able to incorporate a lot of that Vedic physics, all that, you know, ancient Indian wisdom into my own work as a scientist in the West, as a Catholic. Maybe a better Catholic.

• 23:27Theo Von?

  That's fascinating. And I find that so many of the faiths overlap in, in a lot of ways.

• 23:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:34Theo Von?

  With some of the core principles.

• 23:36Speaker 01

  Many of the same core principles. Many differences, of course.

• 23:39Theo Von?

  And not so much in some of their lore and truths.

• 23:42Speaker 01

  Right.

• 23:42Theo Von?

  To the, to the faith themselves, but in, in the principles.

• 23:46Speaker 01

  For sure. And, and a lot of the things, you know, the intense love for the divine, the search for life's deepest meaning, and different ways to actually do that. I've learned a tremendous amount about my own prayer life by actually sitting in meditation with the Tibetan Buddhist monks, even though I'm not a Buddhist. I'm not a, no, I'm not a, and the Dalai Lama's not a Catholic. But we've shared these ideas with each other an awful lot. And he's a man of great wisdom and love and compassion. And it's made me, I think it's made me a better Christian man.

• 24:13Theo Von?

  Amen.

• 24:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:14Theo Von?

  Well, even when Bishop Barron was on, you know, he was talking about how he would sit in front of this statue in the morning and just repeat a mantra for a long time.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  Right.

• 24:24Theo Von?

  I remember how long.

• 24:25Speaker 01

  That's his holy hour.

• 24:25Theo Von?

  Right.

• 24:26Speaker 01

  Which is what the Indians call the Brahma Muhurta.

• 24:28Theo Von?

  Oh, I didn't even know exactly that, that it brings us back to that.

• 24:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:31Theo Von?

  Uh, but when, when he was saying that, I was like, oh, well, that's just a medita, that's meditation, right? It's like creating a pattern within yourself. It's a lot of, so much is action, right? It's like when I'm sitting sedentary and when I'm just scrolling on my phone, when I'm just doing things that are sedentary, I'm just stuck in my thoughts.

• 24:47Speaker 01

  Right.

• 24:47Theo Von?

  It's not action. And action, when I can put action with something, I don't know, it creates a lot more meaning. I'm noticing for me in my own life, even that's why I notice in my gratitude list. It's like, well, let me create even a visual action with it if I am sitting here

• 25:02Speaker 01

  Right.

• 25:03Theo Von?

  Kind of in a meditative state and writing out things I'm grateful for. Like if I'm, I'm thinking, oh, I'm so grateful for my sister, then I will think of things, of active moments where I've seen her smile or seen her like laugh or jokes she tells. So it's just like, even if I'm just remembering actions or attaching actions to thoughts.

• 25:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure.

• 25:22Theo Von?

  It, it just helps make things more real.

• 25:25Speaker 01

  For sure. Look, I mean, it's like an unsupervised mind is a dangerous business, right? And, and what the whole thing about actually disciplining the mind first thing in the morning comes a lot along with disciplining the body. That's why I recommend to all of my students that they have morning protocols and doing something that you know is gonna set yourself up for success. Because I wake up and unsupervised, I'm like, I'm all alone. You know that feeling where you wake up and you're like, it's real dark. It's in here.

• 25:55Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah. I feel like a missing person.

• 25:57Speaker 01

  Well, you feel like, you feel like you've been in deep space all night long. And that there's a profound aloneness to it, right?

• 26:07Theo Von?

  Well, if I don't create a little bit of structure and create some points of structure, then it's just one big whatever. It's just, it's a, it's a, it's a sunrise and sunset of whatever.

• 26:20Speaker 01

  That's exactly right. That's exactly right. You have to put together the architecture to be, to be the person that you want to be.

• 26:27Theo Von?

  Right. A lot of my life is filled with a lot of stimulation though, where it's like, things look fun. You get to go do all these fun things and it is fun, but it's like,

• 26:35Speaker 01

  It's distraction.

• 26:36Theo Von?

  It's, a lot of it is distraction, even though it's great. It is distraction in the end from just my relationship with me.

• 26:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:44Theo Von?

  And, and, and maybe what more do I want for myself? Like in a human sense or, I don't know. It's just, yeah, it's a distraction from my relationship with myself. And, and what things might be very important to me that I'm putting on the side just because I'm, because it's, some things are fun. I want to read what the, can you bring that up with the, the, the, how do you say it?

• 27:12Speaker 01

  The Brahma Muhurta?

• 27:13Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 27:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:15Theo Von?

  Brahma Muhurta is a sacred predawn period in Vedic tradition and Ayurvedic practice. Let me see. And traditions highlighted by teachers like Sadhguru. It is considered a time when an individual can act as a creator of their own state of mind and energy. So yeah, it's like, it's like swabbing your decks, washing your decks, seeing what's going on and preparing yourself. Oh, when I have those days where I get up and I'm popping and I get to my meeting and I get my workout done, dude, by 9:30, I am the king.

• 27:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:49Theo Von?

  Anything's possible.

• 27:51Speaker 01

  Um, but your brain chemistry is not the same every day when you wake up. I mean,

• 27:56Theo Von?

  So I have to take control of it?

• 27:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. So that's right. That's why you gotta have protocols that actually will get you back to a baseline, reliably get you back to a baseline. You're not gonna be perfect. I mean, I slept like garbage last night. I mean, I was sleeping it up. Yeah. I mean, I'm on tour.

• 28:08Theo Von?

  I slept like a damn farm animal or whatever.

• 28:10Speaker 01

  Oh, man.

• 28:11Theo Von?

  I slept like a farm animal in the city.

• 28:15Speaker 01

  You know, it's like that old joke, I slept like a baby. Every two hours I woke up crying.

• 28:20Theo Von?

  And reaching out for breasts or whatever.

• 28:24Speaker 01

  It's bad. You know, I'm on tour every, almost every week, 48 weeks a year.

• 28:27Theo Von?

  Are you?

• 28:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:28Theo Von?

  And you're like, I'm traveling and speaking?

• 28:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, speaking, speaking, speaking to media. So I'm doing speaking to media because there's, you know, a lot of people want to hear about happiness. But the result of it is, you know, I'm not with my wife. I'm, I'm, I'm in hotels and you know, it's okay. But it's kind of lonely.

• 28:44Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 28:45Speaker 01

  But you gotta have a protocol so you can become human again. I, I wanted to come see you today. I'm super pumped to come see you today. I gotta be my best self, right?

• 28:53Theo Von?

  Right.

• 28:53Speaker 01

  And you were thinking about that even before we haven't met before and you're like, and, and so the protocols actually that we can actually have the discipline. It's funny because you know, there's this guy, Admiral McRaven, remember he gave that famous speech called make your bed? Remember this a few years ago, like 2005?

• 29:09Theo Von?

  Bring him up because I feel like, um.

• 29:11Speaker 01

  William McRaven.

• 29:12Theo Von?

  He was, uh. Jordan Peterson kind of became the guy that did that.

• 29:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, for sure. He gave a speech, this guy gave a speech at the University of Texas at Austin called make your bed. And the whole point was you want to get started on something good. That was have a protocol that's practical and specific. That will set you on the right path. Though making your bed is great, but the whole point that we're talking about here is like, make your bed in a metaphysical sense. Like really good things. Get up, pump the iron, go to mass, say your prayers, do your gratitude list. You know, do, do the things you actually need to do to get your brain and this neurophysiologically into the right possible space. Notwithstanding the fact that you slept like garbage, you went to sleep feeling sad, you woke up feeling a lack of the presence of God.

• 29:55Speaker 01

  And you know, the biology isn't there for you. So you gotta have a way to get it back.

• 30:00Theo Von?

  Yeah. Yeah. Uh, he says right here, if you want to change the world, start off by making your bed. If you have a miserable day, you will come home to a bed that is made, that you made, and a made bed gives you encouragement that tomorrow will be better.

• 30:11Speaker 01

  It's a metaphor.

• 30:11Theo Von?

  I agree. Well, it's just getting up. It's like getting up. I go in the kitchen. A lot of times I'll leave my dishes out from dinner. And so then in the morning, the first thing I'll go do is go and put them up, start the dishwasher. It's like, that's the first thing then I'll. Um, and I keep earplugs in too, for the first like probably 90 minutes of the day.

• 30:27Speaker 01

  Do you look at your phone in the first hour?

• 30:29Theo Von?

  Dude, if I do, I wait until I'm rolling my legs out. There's usually like probably about 50 minutes that I've been awake and then I'll respond to texts.

• 30:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:36Theo Von?

  But it's just for communication.

• 30:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. I recommend actually the whole first 60 minutes without the device.

• 30:42Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 30:42Speaker 01

  For neurocognitive programming. And if you don't do that, if you actually don't, you'll, you'll be better focused. And you'll have better mood and productivity for the whole day. Cause you won't get the hijack, you know, this, it's the kind of thing where it's like, okay. If you can go the whole, when you're, when things are really, really rough, if you do a bad habit in the first hour, you're going to do it for the rest of the day. And the whole day is written off, right? But if you don't do it for the first hour of the day, you're programmed, you're path dependent toward the better self. And so one of the things that, that we all should actually do is don't look at it in the first hour. I mean, look at it, nothing's on fire in the business. Okay. Then now for the first hour, while you eat, because your brain actually wants you to eat with other people. And if you have your phone on the table, it interrupts the neurochemicals that you need to connect to the other person.

• 31:27Speaker 01

  And then last hour of the day. So you're looking at a real physical book. You're not getting blue light. If you're, you know, people who are watching us who live with somebody else, like a spouse or, you know, somebody they love, they can connect with them better. That's really, just those three things, it'll change your life.

• 31:41Theo Von?

  Yeah. Oh, well, I mean, I, I was even thinking last night, I was reading your book before I was going to sleep and I was looking, I was thinking like. There, there's certainly been times where I will replace my sense of self, like with a sense of screen, right?

• 31:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:56Theo Von?

  It's like how I feel.

• 31:57Speaker 01

  That's a simulation. That's the matrix.

• 31:59Theo Von?

  Right.

• 31:59Speaker 01

  That's what, and there's actually, we know how that affects the brain. So your brain has two hemispheres, the left and the right. The left hemisphere is what you're using when you're looking at tech. That's a simulation of the experiences in the right hemisphere, which is all like love and mystery and meaning. And so dating on the apps is a, is a, is a simulation of actual courting. Your social media is an actual simulation of friendship. Gaming is a simulation of actual real life accomplishment. And we're living in a simulation. That's what the whole thing is like. And your brain knows the difference.

• 32:34Theo Von?

  So that's why it feels more like a simulation because everything that is, that was once more tangible.

• 32:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:39Theo Von?

  And interactive and actually human, we are simulating it now.

• 32:42Speaker 01

  Exactly right.

• 32:43Theo Von?

  So, so when people say we're living in a simulation, some people think it's like, oh, this, everything is a computer and it's gigabytes and everything.

• 32:49Speaker 01

  Not what I mean.

• 32:50Theo Von?

  That's not what you mean.

• 32:51Speaker 01

  We're simulating in real life love.

• 32:53Theo Von?

  Right. So that's.

• 32:54Speaker 01

  That's what we're simulating.

• 32:54Theo Von?

  And that's why we feel like we're living in a simulation.

• 32:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. Because in that way, it's truly like a literal simulation. Not like Elon Musk says, there's a 90% chance that this is a simulation run by aliens. I don't know.

• 33:06Theo Von?

  Right.

• 33:06Speaker 01

  I don't know. But this is simulating what our brains really want, which is we're made for you. There's a reason we're not doing this on Riverside. There's a reason we're not doing this online, like a Zoom right now. Because we're having a human connection right now that we can't get otherwise. It would be a simulated conversation between Theo and Arthur. If we actually did it online.

• 33:25Theo Von?

  Right.

• 33:25Speaker 01

  And it wouldn't be as good.

• 33:26Theo Von?

  Right.

• 33:26Speaker 01

  Cause it would be a left brain simulation for the right brain connection between friends.

• 33:31Theo Von?

  Got it. And this is super important for me to even just, just make sure I'm clear on. So, cause a lot of people here, you hear stuff like that Elon says, and you see all these things like, we're living in a simulation and like, you know, I was on, uh, you know, I was on 70 grams of mushrooms.

• 33:44Speaker 01

  It's like trippy, man.

• 33:45Theo Von?

  And I could see the numbers at the, on the, in the light on the wall. Like you hear a lot of that, right? Like you hear a lot that, and. But as we're seeing, hearing, seeing like clips saying this and hearing this in our world. If at the same time, we are simulating things that are very real, like instead of meeting somebody and having to ask them out and having a real moment with them. You are just swiping left or right.

• 34:07Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 34:08Theo Von?

  That's why it feels that way when we hear those, when we hear those things saying, we're living in this, like in the matrix. That's why it feels that way, right?

• 34:16Speaker 01

  It's a digital curve fit for the thing you actually want to see. I want to experience.

• 34:20Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 34:21Speaker 01

  You're getting a virtual experience instead of a real experience.

• 34:24Theo Von?

  Got it. And one thing that I, that I really loved about your book is when you say that. One thing that cannot be simulated is meaning.

• 34:33Speaker 01

  And that's the third macronutrient of happiness. And that's the hard one.

• 34:36Theo Von?

  Oh, right there, bro. Is that how we pulled up at that?

• 34:38Speaker 01

  Nice. Nice. See that collaboration?

• 34:41Theo Von?

  Let's go.

• 34:42Speaker 01

  So, so meaning is the third macronutrient and that's the hardest. That's what's missing today. So.

• 34:48Theo Von?

  Before we go down, so just tell me the first two again.

• 34:50Speaker 01

  Enjoyment, satisfaction.

• 34:52Theo Von?

  And those are the macronutrients of happiness.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  The first two macronutrients. There's three, because remember food is protein, carbohydrates and fat. Happiness has three also.

• 35:01Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 35:01Speaker 01

  It's not, it's, it's a coincidence, right? So, so enjoyment, super important. You gotta enjoy your life. Satisfaction, that's like, you gotta take a deep sense of satisfaction in your accomplishments for sure. Which means you gotta have stuff to do, goals, direction, progress. And the third, the hard one, is the meaning of life. Cause that's the why of your existence.

• 35:21Theo Von?

  You hit, you hit that third one.

• 35:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's the why. And that's the one I didn't, ah, that's so hard to write about because it's so philosophical. So it turns out that the meaning of life, the fact that we have walked into since 2008, I've been, I've been keeping data on this forever.

• 35:36Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 35:37Speaker 01

  That since 2008, people have been progressively more and more likely to say, my life feels meaningless. That's not coincidentally when we started to actually have screens take over our individual lives. Why? Because that's when we started to walk into the matrix. That's when our brains started to work differently.

• 35:52Theo Von?

  Right. A sense of screen and not a sense of self.

• 35:54Speaker 01

  Yeah. And so that meaning of life, that lies behind the explosions and depression and anxiety and loneliness that, that we actually see. I mean, you read the news, it's like, okay, why are so many young people depressed and anxious? And depression is up by three X since 2008 for people under 30.

• 36:10Theo Von?

  Oh, one out of six people are on antidepressants.

• 36:12Speaker 01

  It's, it's insane.

• 36:14Theo Von?

  And a higher percentage of that, uh, in college.

• 36:16Speaker 01

  For sure. And actually, here's the weird part, Theo, is that ordinarily you see mental suffering for people who have less privilege and less education. It's more likely if you have education, have high levels of education, gone to college.

• 36:28Theo Von?

  Wait, so say that against the people that have more, uh.

• 36:30Speaker 01

  People who have more, that have, have more years of education are more likely to be depressed. And they're more likely to be anxious. So depression, three X.

• 36:39Theo Von?

  Makes me feel pretty good.

• 36:41Speaker 01

  Well, that's, we went to college, but still.

• 36:43Theo Von?

  So, so look, there's still a way out of all this.

• 36:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. So, and anxiety's up by two X. So everybody's like, okay, it's cause. The boomers made all the houses really super expensive and we're wrecking the environment. There's too much income inequality. That's all nonsense. Those might be problems. Everybody's got to decide for themselves whether those are problems, but they're not new problems. There's nothing new about the fact that, you know, something's wrong with the environment or, or stuff is getting expensive. There's, I mean. I kinda, I remember the seventies. It was way worse. Everything was way worse. You had to roll up your windows when you drove through LA because it was too smoggy. And, you know.

• 37:19Theo Von?

  That's a good point.

• 37:20Speaker 01

  Eighteen percent inflation.

• 37:23Theo Von?

  Well, even if you go back to feudal times, it's like.

• 37:25Speaker 01

  Way worse.

• 37:26Theo Von?

  You could be walking down the street and somebody would shit out their window and it would hit you.

• 37:29Speaker 01

  I know. It's like, yeah, a third of the population died of the bubonic plague.

• 37:32Theo Von?

  Bummer.

• 37:34Speaker 01

  Right? No, good old days. What are you talking about?

• 37:36Theo Von?

  Cause I will romanticize stuff like, oh, it was so, you know.

• 37:39Speaker 01

  So good. I got a, my son got a blister and he died of sepsis. What? Uh oh, toothache. You're gonna die.

• 37:47Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude. You'd have three or four funerals a week to go to.

• 37:50Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, completely. And, you know, half your kids would die.

• 37:52Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 37:53Speaker 01

  I mean, it's like.

• 37:53Theo Von?

  Abraham Lincoln, the president, Abraham Lincoln, all three of his kids died by the age of like 22.

• 37:58Speaker 01

  One of them was playing, no, that was Calvin Coolidge. His son was playing tennis at the White House, forgot his socks, no kid you not, got a blister on the back of his heel and died of an infection. The president's son. So, I'm like, romanticizing the old days is completely absurd. Oh, we're bringing it up. Cal, Calvin, silent Cal.

• 38:17Theo Von?

  Calvin Coolidge's younger son, Calvin Coolidge Jr., or, uh, on June 30th, 1924, Calvin Jr. Played lawn tennis on the White House South grounds with his brother John without wearing socks. A blister formed on his toe. He was moved to Walter Reed Army Hospital where doctors could not stop the infection because antibiotics like penicillin had not yet been discovered or made available. He passed away.

• 38:40Speaker 01

  And people are like, oh man, old days were so much, no, that's actually wrong. The reason that we have this explosion of depression and anxiety is because people don't know the meaning of their life and they're not even looking and they're paralyzed from looking because they're using their brains wrong because they're staring at the screen all day long.

• 38:55Theo Von?

  And, and before we go too much deeper, can you define meaning for people?

• 38:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure, because it sounds so philosophical. It's like a New Yorker cartoon. What's the meaning of life? Right?

• 39:04Theo Von?

  Right. And this is also about what's, yeah, and, and you, but the book, but I did love it and I'll reiterate is that it's your meaning, right?

• 39:11Speaker 01

  Right. You're right. Exactly right. And it's the answer to three big why questions in your life. So, so we'll go through the big three why questions.

• 39:19Theo Von?

  So, meaning answers three big why questions?

• 39:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, cause meaning is always about the why of life. Have you had Simon Sinek on your show before? Do you know who he is? Simon Sinek, he wrote a book called Start With Why.

• 39:29Theo Von?

  We've not had.

• 39:29Speaker 01

  He's fantastic. And, and why is fundamentally about meaning. It's like, why, you know, those days when you wake up, it's dark. Simon Sinek, he's great. I've been working with him for years. And, and you're like, why? Lord, why? Right? That's a meaning. That's a cry for meaning, right? The first big why question is why, why does all this stuff happen? That's, you know, that's called coherence. You gotta have some sort of a theory about why things happen the way that they do. I believe that things happen the way they do because of the mind of God and because of the laws of science. And those things work together. That's my coherence theory. That's my why about why things happen the way they do. Paranoid conspiracy theories are coherence, are a, a way to find coherence. It's like, cause shadowy forces are doing things behind the scenes, right? But that's a why. That's, that's, that's number one.

• 40:14Theo Von?

  So, but, but, but any of those are okay? You just have to have a why?

• 40:17Speaker 01

  You gotta have a why that actually makes sense to you, that you actually believe, that you think actually kinda holds water is the way this works.

• 40:24Theo Von?

  But we used to have a, we used to have a news, kind of a news system, I feel like in America. Or it used to feel like we had a news system in America that we believed and trusted. So I feel like when that sort of dissolved, then it made probably the why a lot.

• 40:39Speaker 01

  It made coherence worse.

• 40:40Theo Von?

  It made.

• 40:40Speaker 01

  It made coherence a big problem for people.

• 40:43Theo Von?

  Coherence a big problem, because you, that's a huge thing. You don't know what is real anymore.

• 40:47Speaker 01

  Why things are happening.

• 40:48Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 40:48Speaker 01

  Why are these things happening? It's like, well, well, the, the mainstream media said, and you're like, yeah, right. Yeah, right.

• 40:56Theo Von?

  Yeah, the last thing I'm gonna trust is them. They're like, you know, they're the.

• 40:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just obfuscation and, you know, it's like biased, whatever. For sure. It's a big problem.

• 41:03Theo Von?

  Right.

• 41:03Speaker 01

  I mean, I think we all understand that at this point. And, and by the way, that's gonna lead to good things. You know, it's like, I do a lot of mainstream media and we all do a lot of mainstream media. I think it's actually getting better as a result of the fact that people are more skeptical at this point. But it hurts in the meantime, because it ruins the sense of coherence, the, the through line about why things are happening the way that they are. That's number one.

• 41:25Theo Von?

  Right. So that's one of the issues that why we're having trouble with meaning right now is because things feel incoherent.

• 41:30Speaker 01

  You don't know who you can trust. You just don't know who you can trust. The second is purpose, which is why am I doing what I'm doing? And that's the question you started with today. It's like, why am I doing this? I mean, it's gotta be perfect, but why? You know, that's this, the, that means goals, direction and, and the ability to make progress. And when life feels futile, like this is dumb, that, that means that you're, you're lacking a sense of purpose. You're lacking a sense of direction in your life. And, you know, it's funny because experiments on like undergraduate students in college shows that you can dramatically raise their sense of meaning and happiness by giving them an arbitrary goal, which gives them more purpose. Like you're getting a B minus in calculus, we're gonna get a B plus for you in calculus.

• 42:12Speaker 01

  And you set them up on a protocol, which is why the morning protocols we talked about.

• 42:16Theo Von?

  As a professor, you mean?

• 42:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, as a professor, like campus counseling will do this an awful lot. We're gonna raise your grade by one full letter grade. And just that gives them a sense of purpose and they start getting more disciplined. They start getting happier.

• 42:30Theo Von?

  You mean, you're gonna raise the goal of their grade?

• 42:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, they got, you got, they need a goal and that gives them a sense of purpose. Even like an arbitrary dumb little purpose like that really helps people an awful lot.

• 42:39Theo Von?

  Are there easy ways for us to do that for ourselves?

• 42:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, to set, you know, basic goals about ways, in, in small ways, you wanna get better. I wanna get, so, you know, for example, purpose in recovery is one day at a time. It's like, today I'm not gonna drink.

• 42:54Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 42:54Speaker 01

  And that's a doable goal and that gives you a, a sense of purpose. Now that's, you need more than that, but that's really super helpful.

• 43:02Theo Von?

  Right. That's a huge thing. It's like people, people say, I can't, oh, I don't get to drink for the rest of my life? I don't know if you get to drink for the rest of your life. I'm just saying you can't, like, can you not drink for today?

• 43:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. And, you know, there's a funny thing in my, in my world, you know, we ask a lot, for example, what is the psychology behind the fact that diets always fail? So, almost any diet works. Low fat, low carb, low whatever, man. I mean, it's like fasting, keto, caveman, whatever.

• 43:28Theo Von?

  Yeah, sleep and beauty diet, having a tapeworm.

• 43:31Speaker 01

  They all work, but they don't work in the long run. Now, the reason they all work in the short run is you can make it today, not eating what you want, because the scale's gonna go down. But when you hit your goal, the reward is never getting to eat what you like ever again for the rest of your life. Congratulations. That's a big problem. That just destroys purpose.

• 43:49Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 43:50Speaker 01

  Purpose is everything. You just don't have any more goals. You don't have any more direction. You can't make any more progress. And so it's obliterated. It's depressing, as a matter of fact. People hit their goals and get really, really depressed and like eat a whole cake.

• 44:01Theo Von?

  Yeah. Oh, yeah, dude. Somebody sent me a cake, dude. And, bro, if.

• 44:08Speaker 01

  Did you eat the whole cake?

• 44:10Theo Von?

  I didn't plan on it, dude, but I woke up in the middle of the night. I wasn't doing well and I ate half that bitch. Bro, I ate it standing up.

• 44:16Speaker 01

  What kind of cake was it?

• 44:17Theo Von?

  I don't even know. Dude, it was dark.

• 44:19Speaker 01

  And it was.

• 44:20Theo Von?

  I ate it standing up, Arthur.

• 44:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, no, I'm not.

• 44:24Theo Von?

  Who is that?

• 44:25Speaker 01

  It's me too.

• 44:26Theo Von?

  But then I was so jacked up on sugar, I couldn't sleep.

• 44:29Speaker 01

  I know.

• 44:29Theo Von?

  Now I'm furious with myself. Now I go buy a vape, dude.

• 44:32Speaker 01

  Now you're full of self-loathing.

• 44:34Theo Von?

  Oh, now it's 4 AM, dude. And I'm like, I can't live like this anymore.

• 44:40Speaker 01

  You know, here's the irony. It's like, there's like 200 people that are listening to this conversation right now at 3 o'clock in the morning, standing up, eating a cake.

• 44:49Theo Von?

  Yeah. And honestly, and somehow I'm envious of them.

• 44:53Speaker 01

  No, I get it. You know, so this is a, you know, that's the problem with progress. That's progress. You know, progress means that you actually make goals and they're achievable goals and you know what they are. And that's one of the big parts of meaning in life. Purpose is part of meaning in life.

• 45:06Theo Von?

  Okay. And, and, but so.

• 45:08Speaker 01

  That's why you're doing what you're doing.

• 45:09Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 45:10Speaker 01

  Because that's my purpose. For today at least.

• 45:12Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 45:12Speaker 01

  For today at least. Now, it doesn't have to be like, I want to be president of the United States. I want to save seven million children. No, it might be as simple as I'm gonna be kind to my wife today. I am going to do one good act for somebody today. I'm gonna love somebody who needs my love today.

• 45:30Theo Von?

  Yeah, including myself.

• 45:31Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 45:31Theo Von?

  Sometimes.

• 45:32Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 45:32Theo Von?

  That's a big one, dude.

• 45:33Speaker 01

  Exactly right. I'm not gonna eat that cake tonight.

• 45:36Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 45:36Speaker 01

  I'm not. We'll see.

• 45:38Theo Von?

  Yeah, we'll see.

• 45:39Speaker 01

  It's like, don't send Theo a cake, folks.

• 45:41Theo Von?

  Well, dude, yeah. And when people send a cake, I can't even, and sometimes I'll even curse them or whatever.

• 45:47Speaker 01

  I know, I know. I know, dude, they think they're doing something so good for you, but you have no impulse control in the middle of the night. That's when your willpower is gone.

• 45:53Theo Von?

  Dude, I ate frigging 17 peanut butter cups one night.

• 45:56Speaker 01

  That sounds so good.

• 45:57Theo Von?

  I ate 17 peanut butter cups one night in my 40s.

• 46:01Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Don't, look, I'm in my 60s.

• 46:04Theo Von?

  So it doesn't get better? Thanks, Art. You ever realize that you spent your entire morning thinking about lunch? It's 9 AM and somehow I'm already in negotiations with myself about how I'm gonna spend $20 on a sandwich at noon. And then I eat it, or you eat it, or somebody eats it. And then an hour later, you're just standing in the kitchen worrying about what you'll do for dinner. And that's one reason why I've been into Huell. The Black Edition Powder is a complete meal you have instead of food, not a shake on top of food. Their powder starts at less than $3 per meal, has 40 grams of protein and mixes with water or milk in about 30 seconds. I like Huell's shakes because they're clean and it's quick.

• 46:49Theo Von?

  Sometimes it may, I just, I would just wanna make sure I have everything I need to keep going the way I want to keep going in a healthy manner. So with Huell, basically lunch went from a daily logistical problem to a thing I can solve in about 30 seconds. Make healthy eating simple. New customers get an exclusive offer of 15% off online with my code WEEKEND at huell.com/weekend. That's H U E L dot com slash weekend. Thank you to Huell for partnering and supporting our show. You guys know I love Acorns, the financial app where you can invest your spare change from transactions into the market and grow it over time.

• 47:34Theo Von?

  Well, they're trying a new idea I want to tell you about, and it's pretty cool. It's called Invest My Tips. If you're someone who gets tips as part of your job, like a hairstylist, or a tattoo artist, or a mover, you can set up an Acorns account, get a QR code, then customers scan that to tip you. Whatever they tip gets invested for you immediately. Plus, it adds up. $15 a day invested over 40 years could grow to around $1 million. And if you're the customer, you don't even need an account of your own. Tipping is as simple as it is today, except now your tip helps someone save for their future.

• 48:19Theo Von?

  So now I'm thinking about all the jobs out there where you could use this. Maybe somebody rakes your yard up, and bam, you tip them, hit that QR code, help build their future. Or maybe somebody is delivering ice to your house. You got a warm house, and you, you need some ice. And then you hit them with that QR code tip. Or it could even be your grandmother. She hits you with that healthy hug, bam, bless her bank account. So let's give a shout out to everyone working for tips out there. The people, part of our community, that we trust and come back to time after time. Next time you tip someone, ask if they have the Acorns code.

• 49:04Theo Von?

  Help the people you trust in your community to not just get through the week, but build for their future. With Acorns, Invest My Tips. You can sign up for it yourself at acorns.com/theo-tips. Paid non-client endorsement. Compensation provides incentive to positively promote Acorns. Investing involves risk. Acorns Advisors LLC, NCC Registered Investment Advisor. View importance at acorns.com/theo. And so that is the second question. The second why question is, why am I doing the things that I'm doing?

• 49:34Speaker 01

  Right, exactly.

• 49:35Theo Von?

  And if you ask yourself that question, you'll be able to establish some sense of purpose with yourself.

• 49:38Speaker 01

  That's right, that's right. If you basically say, I am doing what I'm doing because, because XYZ, because I want to lose some weight, because I want to get better grades, because I want to be a more loving person, because I want to get to the end of the day not having used alcohol.

• 49:50Theo Von?

  Right.

• 49:51Speaker 01

  Right? That's the person that I want to be. And you got to see that better person, that better version of yourself. Say, that's, that's me at the end of the day going, yep, still not drinking. That's good.

• 50:01Theo Von?

  So to visualize it too will help you.

• 50:03Speaker 01

  Super important, super important. That visualization is, I mean, that's how, that's how this idea of manifestation actually works. There's nothing, no gears in the universe that are turning, although I do believe in the power of prayer. I do honestly believe, I believe that it's a good thing to say, what is, I want to visualize 11:00 PM Theo going to sleep, not having done the things he didn't want to do, and now I'm going to pray that God will give me the strength and grace to become that person. That's how purpose, that's how you can, you can bring purpose to your real life.

• 50:36Theo Von?

  That even feels cool when you say it. I mean, I felt like there's a sense of, say that one more time, say that part one more time.

• 50:42Speaker 01

  Okay, so you got, purpose means you got goals and direction. And your goal, your direction is toward a goal that is something good, right? It's got to be something tangible, something that you can actually put a pin in, not something like, the universe is perfect.

• 50:55Theo Von?

  Right, or I want to be a millionaire, jillionaire.

• 50:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just, it, no, no, it's, it's, it's something really tangible, something really meaningful to you. And it might be as something as simple as, at the end of this day, I will not have done this, and I will have done that. And I'm going to imagine myself at the end of the day, and how I'm going to feel when that has actually come true. And visualize that actually, you understanding yourself as having achieved that goal. Nothing audacious, nothing, if somebody else would be like, holy mackerel, you did that in one day?

• 51:25Theo Von?

  Right.

• 51:26Speaker 01

  No, it's something realistic that you can actually do.

• 51:28Theo Von?

  So I would just think like, okay, so today if I make it to bed, like, like, tonight I would like to make it to bed by 10:00 PM, right? So that could be my thing.

• 51:35Speaker 01

  Sober, stone cold sober.

• 51:37Theo Von?

  Stone cold sober.

• 51:38Speaker 01

  Having worked out, having done my job, having done a good podcast, having, you know, fed my body in the right way, having had a couple of conversations and told a couple of people I love them.

• 51:47Theo Von?

  But now, is that stacking too much on or you think that's an okay, basic day?

• 51:50Speaker 01

  That's a good, basic day.

• 51:51Theo Von?

  Okay, good.

• 51:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, because you've actually fed your needs.

• 51:53Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 51:54Speaker 01

  Body, soul, work, relationships, in a very, in a very, you know, very modest way.

• 52:00Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 52:01Speaker 01

  You know, you didn't call 63 people and say, I love you.

• 52:03Theo Von?

  Right, called a couple of buddies, checked in, listened to them.

• 52:06Speaker 01

  And then you figure it, and then, and then you say, okay, and I really want that. I see myself doing that, and then you, then you get help. And the way that you, a good way to get help is say, Lord, help me make it to that point.

• 52:18Theo Von?

  Help me make it to that point.

• 52:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, help me, it's like, be with me until 10:00 PM tonight, when I'm looking back on that in this way.

• 52:23Theo Von?

  Hmm, I like that. So God, help me be, get to 10:00 PM tonight. I would like to be able to make it through my day healthily. I'd like to be able to take care of my body, my mind, and my soul. I'd like to be able to be of service to others. Show me examples of ways I can do that. And I would like to get to bed sober, and I would like to get to bed at a decent time tonight. Please be with me until I can get there.

• 52:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's, there's an ancient, ancient, ancient Catholic prayer that, that, that a lot of priests will pray, and they'll say, night has no terror for me, sleeping under God's wings.

• 52:54Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 52:55Speaker 01

  Right?

• 52:56Theo Von?

  Dang, boy, that's a frickin' holiday end of the Lord, brother.

• 52:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's so good, it's so good, it's so good. So, and then, and the last of the why questions is, why does my life matter? Why does my life matter? And to whom?

• 53:08Theo Von?

  And to whom?

• 53:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, and to whom? Because it has to matter to someone. It's like, why does my life matter? It's going to be like, because, you know, something cosmic? No, it's because my mom loves me, because my friends care about me, because God is somebody who's taking care of me. That's the significance question, and you got to have an answer to that. And a lot of people today, they're like, I don't know why my life matters, and I don't know to whom my life matters. Establishing that is critically important. If you don't know, that's going to be a problem.

• 53:36Theo Von?

  So significance is, is the answer to the question, why does my life matter and to whom?

• 53:41Speaker 01

  That's right, that's right. And that's getting harder and harder to answer, especially when we're mediating our relationships through screens. It's like, why does my, why does my life matter to whom? And if it's like, all the people I'm dealing with over the entire course of the day are 12 hours through social media, I'm not quite sure that my life does matter.

• 53:58Theo Von?

  Why does that, why does this so much create this? Oh, because this is a simulation and it's not real.

• 54:03Speaker 01

  Exactly right. It's very hard for me to deny, for us to deny each other that we matter to each other right now, because we're looking into each other's eyes.

• 54:11Theo Von?

  Right.

• 54:12Speaker 01

  And we're brothers right now.

• 54:13Theo Von?

  Right.

• 54:14Speaker 01

  That's the way life's supposed to work.

• 54:15Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 54:16Speaker 01

  But if I'm looking at, you know, it's like, hey, Theo, and like, text, text, text, text, text, I don't know, I don't know what else you're doing. I don't even know if it's you.

• 54:22Theo Von?

  Oh, that's craziest.

• 54:23Speaker 01

  Uh huh, and that's how the simulation works. Is it real? Is it not real? That matrix effect actually destroys significance. Our brain is not made to, and there's a lot, a lot of neurochemistry to this. There's a, a neuropeptide in the brain called oxytocin. You ever heard of oxytocin?

• 54:41Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 54:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, it's the love molecule, and it's how we connect with each other, how you connect with your baby, I connect with your friends, how, how people who are loved connect with each other very, very deeply for deep friendship.

• 54:51Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 54:52Speaker 01

  You don't get it through a screen, almost nothing, almost nothing. And so neurochemically, we're not getting the link that we're evolved to actually get to connect with each other as human beings, and that destroys the sense of significance.

• 55:04Theo Von?

  And is that true? Bring that up.

• 55:06Speaker 01

  Oxytocin? Yeah, oxytocin, a natural peptide hormone and neuropeptide.

• 55:12Theo Von?

  It's often nicknamed the love hormone, or cuddle hormone. It influences social recognition, trust, romantic attachment, and mother-infant bonding. Wow.

• 55:23Speaker 01

  And the new research on Zoom screen, for example, we wanted to know during COVID, how much do we actually get when we're disconnected and we're talking on FaceTime and Skype and, and over the Zoom screen? And the answer is not very much.

• 55:34Theo Von?

  When prolonged social isolation settles in, the body's hormonal systems undergo a profound shift. Social, social isolation essentially hijacks the oxytocin system by driving down its baseline production and allowing stress hormones to dominate the brain. So that comes from social isolation. So it, it hijacks the oxytocin system by driving down its baseline production and allowing stress hormones to dominate the brain. So not only do you have lower oxytocin, but it...

• 56:06Speaker 01

  When you're only on screens and not in person.

• 56:08Theo Von?

  When you're only on screens and not in person, but scientifically, it allows more stress in.

• 56:13Speaker 01

  For sure. I mean, basically, it's that, that, that spaceman's going to get filled by something.

• 56:17Theo Von?

  But so the enemies are at the gates, and we're, we're, we're, we're the gate, we're the enemies and the gates.

• 56:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, did Bishop Barron, Bishop B., when he's on the show, did he teach you the, did he teach you the St. Michael prayer? This is a great prayer. So St. Michael the Archangel is one of the three archangels in the Old Testament, and he's believed by Catholics to actually fight the devil. But that's how he talks about it. St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle, be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray, and do not do thou, oh prince of the heavenly host, you know, and, and it talks about, you know, cast into hell Satan, who prowls about the world seeking the ruin of souls.

• 56:58Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 56:59Speaker 01

  Okay, good, manly stuff, right?

• 57:01Theo Von?

  We need that right now.

• 57:02Speaker 01

  We need that right now, but, but look, okay, even if people are watching us, they don't believe literally in Satan, they don't believe in the hijacking of souls, they don't believe in all this stuff, there are problems out there. And you need the sword and shield.

• 57:13Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 57:14Speaker 01

  You need the defense.

• 57:15Theo Von?

  Oh, Satan is lurking, bro. Satan, these days, has cleats on, dude.

• 57:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:20Theo Von?

  He is active, bro. That is the realest thing that, that's become more real than ever.

• 57:25Speaker 01

  And you're just like, if you're looking at your phone all day long, you're wandering into battle unarmed and naked.

• 57:31Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 57:32Speaker 01

  That's what you're doing. It's like, good luck to you.

• 57:34Theo Von?

  And most who, like, a lot of like the, it's just, it's, it's, there's a lot of ill out there that's coming through the phone, and it's designed, it's designed to ruin you.

• 57:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:48Theo Von?

  I think a lot of it is, it's designed to ruin you.

• 57:49Speaker 01

  I think that more than anything else is designed to leave you vulnerable. It's designed to disarm you. It's designed to leave you... Completely defenseless.

• 58:00Theo Von?

  The devil is here and it's like.

• 58:02Speaker 01

  And that ruins a sense of significance. The whole, I just gets back to who loves me? Why does my life matter and to whom? And it's like, I don't know.

• 58:13Speaker 01

  No. So people who are isolated, get this. So we talked about this a little bit before, isolation, right? Why isolation is so critically important. This is why all of this leads to loneliness is because of isolation, not because of solitude.

• 58:26Theo Von?

  And so just so we're, just so we're, just so I'm making sure that we're locked in here. And how this is, how does, how is this affecting significance?

• 58:32Speaker 01

  So significance is why your life matters and to whom. It's all about love. It's all about the people who value you, people who love you, people who care about you.

• 58:40Theo Von?

  And one of the main people needs to be you.

• 58:42Speaker 01

  Gotta be you and.

• 58:43Theo Von?

  And a lot of you gets, um, a lot of you gets hijacked when, um, when we're on our screens and we're not actually on ourself.

• 58:53Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's almost as if you lost yourself, that you don't know yourself. You're not, so it's a funny thing. So I'll, I'll say to people, okay, put down your phone for the first hour of the day. Do the brahma mahurta, that first hour, starting, you know, 48 minutes before dawn and, and go for that walk without your device, without, without headphones, just hearing the crunch of gravel beneath your feet and watching the sun come up. You will know you because you're going to be with you.

• 59:18Theo Von?

  Right.

• 59:18Speaker 01

  Right? And, and but if you're not, you're, I mean, it's like, so there's a Vietnamese Buddhist monk who died two years ago named Thich Nhat Hanh. Very, very.

• 59:28Theo Von?

  Thich Nhat Hanh?

• 59:28Speaker 01

  Thich Nhat Hanh. Have you heard of him?

• 59:30Theo Von?

  Nah.

• 59:30Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah. He's, he had the, you know, the plum village movement, which was a lot of Westerners actually got into it. Thich Nhat Hanh.

• 59:36Theo Von?

  Rip Thich Nhat.

• 59:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. He's a, he was a, and he's, he wrote, his most famous book was called The Miracle of Mindfulness. That starts off with his description of washing the dishes. And when you're washing the dishes, you should be washing the dishes and thinking about washing the dishes and fully present while you're washing the dishes. Cause if you don't, you're not there. You're missing your life and we're missing our lives. And you're missing your life. So if you're really not missing your life in that first hour of the day, you're there for you. You care about you. You're fully showing up is what it comes down to.

• 1:00:09Theo Von?

  If while washing dishes, we think only of the cup of tea that awaits us, thus hurrying to get the dishes out of the way as if they were a nuisance, then we are not washing the dishes to wash the dishes.

• 1:00:22Speaker 01

  What's more, we're not alive during the time we're washing the dishes. It's the thing, isn't it?

• 1:00:27Theo Von?

  Yeah. It's just about being like, having a sense of presence. Um, before we move forward, uh, how, let's, uh, can, how can we tie a bow on, uh, significance?

• 1:00:37Speaker 01

  So significant, to lock it down, to say, okay, I, if I'm with, if I'm with somebody who, if I'm with my wife and, and every time I'm with her, she's scrolling her phone. She's not actually with me and I don't know if she loves me.

• 1:00:51Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:00:51Speaker 01

  And that's, that destroys my sense of significance. If every time I'm by myself, I'm scrolling my phone, I'm not with me.

• 1:00:59Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:01:00Speaker 01

  And I'm not even significant to me.

• 1:01:03Theo Von?

  That's, and that's what it feels like right now.

• 1:01:05Speaker 01

  Sure does.

• 1:01:05Theo Von?

  You just start to feel like this.

• 1:01:08Speaker 01

  Who am I? I'm, I'm nothing. I'm a simulation of me.

• 1:01:13Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:01:14Speaker 01

  That's super heavy. When you think about it, I don't want to be a simulation of me. I want to be me.

• 1:01:19Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:01:19Speaker 01

  Right? I mean, for all the problems that I've actually gotten, all the dumb stuff that I've actually, I, I want to, at least I get one life. Why am I missing it? You know, why am I simulating it? Why am I running a, like a, some sort of weird blooper reel? What, what's the deal? How stupid is that? What am I trying to distract myself from? And the answer is, I don't, I don't know. I don't know. I'm just doing it. And that's no way to live.

• 1:01:44Theo Von?

  No, it's no way to live. And it's, I mean, it's certainly, it's where I find myself a lot of times. It's like, um, uh, and also I don't even notice how it just happens over and over again. And the main, it's just like, oh, it's just another rerun of the same, like me finding these little things that I feel like meant something and they don't. And then I just keep going.

• 1:02:02Speaker 01

  It's a doom loop, actually. It's a, and what, the problem is that we're very bad at boredom. And, you know, life until relatively recently was pretty boring. Your great grandfather, they were plowing fields three generations ago, right?

• 1:02:14Theo Von?

  Oh, I'm sure dude. They used to smoke. I know.

• 1:02:16Speaker 01

  Yeah. And they were.

• 1:02:18Theo Von?

  Grow it.

• 1:02:18Speaker 01

  And, and they were, and, and, you know, moment to moment, your great, great grandfather was basically looking at a mule's butt.

• 1:02:25Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:25Speaker 01

  Right? No headphones, no podcast, not even yours or mine, right?

• 1:02:29Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  But his life wasn't boring. Now you can wipe out every moment of boredom, moment to moment over the course of your life, but life is profoundly boring. See, this is the thing, man. This is the irony. If you try to wipe out your boredom moment to moment, your life is going to be grindingly boring. That's the irony of life. If you're not going to be alive, you're going to be dead. That's what happens.

• 1:02:53Theo Von?

  And we're missing out on being alive.

• 1:02:54Speaker 01

  We're zombies. We're walking dead.

• 1:02:56Theo Von?

  And so the things that we can do are we can find some coherence, right? Find things that make sense to us, that we believe in, that are sure to us. And sometimes if you can't find those in the media, you have to find those in, um, personal relationships.

• 1:03:08Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:03:08Theo Von?

  And like, um, just things that are very sure to you, right?

• 1:03:11Speaker 01

  Spiritual life?

• 1:03:12Theo Von?

  Your spiritual life.

• 1:03:13Speaker 01

  Super important because that's, man, that gets real, real fast.

• 1:03:16Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:16Speaker 01

  If you're basically like, if you're gonna like before, at that 10 PM hour, you're down on your knees, life gets real very fast.

• 1:03:23Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:24Speaker 01

  Yeah. And a lot of people, it's like, ah, what? Yeah. Like my grandfather? Yep. Like your grandfather.

• 1:03:30Theo Von?

  And sometimes it's like, people will say like, um, or people will say to me like, man, I just want to help other people. People say that a lot of times. And, and I think about that a lot too. And it's like, but one, one way I think that we can do that is by praying for others. It's like the giving of myself and my energy and my time with God. It's like me wanting to focus that onto someone else.

• 1:03:53Speaker 01

  For sure. That's a, that's an ancient truth, where you just start to. Yeah, for sure. I mean, the monastic tradition is that the, the monks and the nuns that would be cloistered, meaning that they never go out. Their whole job was praying for others.

• 1:04:06Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:04:06Speaker 01

  Full time, man. Full time praying for other people because we believe, you know, Christians believe that intercessory prayer is a real thing. The intercessory prayer actually works.

• 1:04:16Theo Von?

  Intercessory?

• 1:04:17Speaker 01

  Intercessory prayer. You're interceding for somebody else. You're asking God for something for them is what it comes down to. That's super powerful. Now, I don't know.

• 1:04:25Theo Von?

  And how long do they pray for? Does for all the time?

• 1:04:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. Like, like a lot of the day, a lot of the day.

• 1:04:30Theo Von?

  Have for lunch during that or whatever.

• 1:04:31Speaker 01

  I know. It's like eating a corn dog and praying for Theovon. So.

• 1:04:36Theo Von?

  Dude, you're just over there praying for, uh, Kyle Larson or something. You're just having chips on your.

• 1:04:43Speaker 01

  No, but it's like, and it's funny because, you know, I know a lot of laypeople, you know, who are, are not living in religious communities, who will have a list of people they pray for every single morning and actually start their day praying for a list of other people. And I try to do that too. I try to pray for other people every single day and people who, and then the last one is always like, and Lord, I'm praying for all the people who asked me to pray for them, but I forgot.

• 1:05:05Theo Von?

  You gotta bundle it.

• 1:05:06Speaker 01

  You gotta bundle it.

• 1:05:08Theo Von?

  Sometimes you have to bundle it, man.

• 1:05:09Speaker 01

  I know, but that's really powerful.

• 1:05:10Theo Von?

  And God gets that prayer and he's like, oh God, I gotta.

• 1:05:13Speaker 01

  That one again.

• 1:05:13Theo Von?

  This one bundled.

• 1:05:14Speaker 01

  I know. It's like, it's lame.

• 1:05:18Speaker 01

  But that's a big deal, what you just said. That's a real, that's a real thing.

• 1:05:22Theo Von?

  So that's the first one is having co, things that are creating coherence for yourself, right? Things that have meaning.

• 1:05:26Speaker 01

  That really help you understand why things happen in the world.

• 1:05:29Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 1:05:30Speaker 01

  Right? The second is making sure that you've got direction in your life. And the third thing is knowing who loves you and why.

• 1:05:35Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 1:05:36Speaker 01

  That's, and if you do that, you've got meaning. Now here's a test to see that kind of bundles all that stuff together. And so really scientifically validated. I've been giving this test for 30 years.

• 1:05:44Theo Von?

  It is, it's very scientifically validated?

• 1:05:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. So in other words, we've tested all this stuff. It's in a lot of research, et cetera. Those three, the why questions are super scientifically validated. There's a guy named Mike Steger, who's a, who's a psychologist and in Colorado, and he's done, he's published, you know, books and academic journal articles on why this works, et cetera.

• 1:06:02Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:06:03Speaker 01

  But I have a two question exam that I give my students to see where they are on that that makes it easier. And if they're struggling, then they, they don't need to look for the meaning of life. They need to look for the answers to these two questions.

• 1:06:14Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:06:15Speaker 01

  Question number one is, why are you alive? And, and the way to answer that is like, who made me or for what reason? Maker and mission.

• 1:06:23Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:06:23Speaker 01

  So, and, and, and by the way, you can't Google that.

• 1:06:26Theo Von?

  So wait, why are you alive?

• 1:06:27Speaker 01

  Why are you alive? I mean, why are you walking the earth?

• 1:06:29Theo Von?

  And that's a question I need to ask myself when.

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  And you, you need to start contemplating that question and maybe thinking about it during your holy hour, first thing in the morning when you're out for that walk. Is thinking, why am I alive? Who did create me and for what purpose am I alive? Cause here's the thing, you have been created for a purpose. Absolutely. But it's obscured, especially on the hard mornings. Like that's when it's hard because that's when old scratch is bothering you.

• 1:06:55Theo Von?

  Right. When the devil starts wearing too.

• 1:06:57Speaker 01

  Old scratch.

• 1:06:57Theo Von?

  Is that the devil?

• 1:06:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:00Theo Von?

  What the heck? That's his nickname?

• 1:07:01Speaker 01

  You're from Louisiana, aren't you?

• 1:07:03Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude.

• 1:07:04Speaker 01

  That's an old Catholic Louisiana deal.

• 1:07:06Theo Von?

  Old scratch.

• 1:07:06Speaker 01

  Scratch. Not bad, right?

• 1:07:08Theo Von?

  God, yeah.

• 1:07:09Speaker 01

  When he's got his old pitchfork out and he's, you know, distracting you from the things that matter. So, okay, who created me and for what purpose? And let's give that some thought. Second question is, what would I die for right now happily? It's a funny thing because two of my kids are US Marines. Two of my three kids are Marines. And one of the things that you find is when people come out of combat roles in the military, that are, that they're, and they, they can have problems, right? I mean, there's PS, PTSD and, you know, all this stuff. But they're happier because they have answers, especially to that second question. You know, my son was a scout sniper in the Marine Corps. That's a hard job. That's a, that's a, an elite job.

• 1:07:49Speaker 01

  And, and I said, so what would you die for? After he came out of the Marines, 23, married with a kid, right? He said, easy. I send a contract to the government for that question, you know? I would die for my faith and family, obviously, but I would die for my fellow Marines, the United States of America. Boom.

• 1:08:05Theo Von?

  So he had his answer.

• 1:08:06Speaker 01

  Mic drop. He had an answer and he was fundamentally happier because that was defining of his sense of meaning in life. Whether he was thinking about meaning and all this esoteric psychological.

• 1:08:16Theo Von?

  Whatever he had.

• 1:08:17Speaker 01

  Neuroscience nonsense.

• 1:08:18Theo Von?

  He had something foundational.

• 1:08:19Speaker 01

  Foundational. It's like, why, why are you alive? Carlos says, because God made me to serve others.

• 1:08:24Theo Von?

  Carlos who?

• 1:08:25Speaker 01

  Carlos Brooks, my son.

• 1:08:26Theo Von?

  Oh, that's his name?

• 1:08:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:28Theo Von?

  Oh, shout out Carlos Brooks. Bring up a picture of him.

• 1:08:30Speaker 01

  Good old Carlos Brooks. Is he on the, is he on the internet? There he is.

• 1:08:33Theo Von?

  That's him?

• 1:08:34Speaker 01

  That's him.

• 1:08:34Theo Von?

  Jeepers dude.

• 1:08:36Speaker 01

  That's my son.

• 1:08:37Theo Von?

  Bro, if he's fricking, bro, if he's mowing the lawn with that.

• 1:08:41Theo Von?

  Yeah, tell him, uh, that's awesome.

• 1:08:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right.

• 1:08:44Theo Von?

  Thank you for your service, sir.

• 1:08:44Speaker 01

  Absolutely. And his little sister now is an officer in the Marine Corps. She's a, she's a second lieutenant out of K Bay, Hawaii, right now.

• 1:08:51Theo Von?

  Ooh, that's a beautiful place to be for her, huh?

• 1:08:53Speaker 01

  She's four eleven, he's six five.

• 1:08:55Theo Von?

  So he, uh...

• 1:08:57Speaker 01

  And he has to salute her because she's an officer.

• 1:09:00Theo Von?

  Really?

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  Well, he's not active duty, but he gave her her first salute. That was a very beautiful moment.

• 1:09:06Theo Von?

  He gave her her first salute?

• 1:09:07Speaker 01

  Yep. As an officer, she was commissioned, um, uh, a year ago in Providence, Rhode Island, after she graduated from college, and she took her first salute from her older brother.

• 1:09:16Theo Von?

  Oh, that's awesome, man.

• 1:09:17Speaker 01

  It was really great, but you know, his, he's got answers to his questions. Why did, why are you alive? Because God made me to serve others.

• 1:09:22Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:09:23Speaker 01

  For what would you give your life? For my faith family, for fellow Marines in the United States of America. There, there it is. There it is. First salute.

• 1:09:31Theo Von?

  Oh, that's cool, dude.

• 1:09:34Theo Von?

  That's beautiful, dude.

• 1:09:36Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:37Theo Von?

  And what's her name?

• 1:09:38Speaker 01

  Marina.

• 1:09:39Theo Von?

  Marina?

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  Marina. She's, she's, uh, she was born in, in, um, in Fuzhou, China. We, we adopted her in two thousand four at the age of sixteen months. She had been abandoned at twelve hours old. In a, on a park bench in China. Parking, you know, it's good, man. She's, she's tough.

• 1:09:58Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's a good, yeah, look, I mean, look, if you spend a night out in a park, I've slept in some parks, dude. You know what I'm saying?

• 1:10:04Speaker 01

  At twelve hours old?

• 1:10:05Theo Von?

  Hey, not at twelve hours, bro, but maybe...

• 1:10:08Speaker 01

  She's tough as nails, man. She's tough as nails. She's so strong and so good, and she loves me, and I love her.

• 1:10:13Theo Von?

  Blessings. Thank you for your service.

• 1:10:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:16Theo Von?

  Marina, um...

• 1:10:18Speaker 01

  My baby. My baby forever.

• 1:10:20Theo Von?

  Yeah, huh?

• 1:10:21Speaker 01

  And lethal.

• 1:10:23Theo Von?

  Lethal babies, dude. That's what, that's what we need more of. We need more lethal babies, bro.

• 1:10:29Speaker 01

  But that's why people in the military, by the way, that's one of the things I recommend to a lot of young men who have no answers to these questions, I recommend the military.

• 1:10:36Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:37Speaker 01

  Because the military helps you find answers to these questions.

• 1:10:39Theo Von?

  Just adding structure to yourself, because things can get really unstructured.

• 1:10:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:44Theo Von?

  You know, things can get extremely unstructured.

• 1:10:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, and for you and me too. I mean, who knows if we would have been better off?

• 1:10:50Theo Von?

  Dude, when I leave out of here, I could go, like, you know, I'm saying, there's nothing, it's just me that's gonna keep me going for the rest of the day. Like, there's things, you know, I have responsibilities to my coworkers and, and we'll do some stuff together, but it's like, yeah. And I'm sure it's the same for a lot of people. It's like, um, yeah, they have to be the ones to keep themselves going. And I think if I can create more of a relationship with myself, then it's more, there's something to keep going.

• 1:11:17Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:11:17Theo Von?

  Cause otherwise, you can fall in, I'm just this sort of like thing, I'm this, I'm this repeating thing.

• 1:11:23Speaker 01

  So thinking about those questions is critical, because what that does is it opens up your brain so that meaning of your life will find you. It's the cheat code.

• 1:11:31Theo Von?

  Okay, so I want to say those again, and those questions are?

• 1:11:34Speaker 01

  The questions are, number one, why are you alive? Like, who made you? For what purpose? Why are you alive? Like, why are you walking the earth? I don't know. Random. Right? Now, it's more than that. But if you don't think about it, and, and again, it might take years.

• 1:11:48Theo Von?

  Right, but you have to plant seeds. That's another thing about talking with yourself and having a relationship with yourself. I noticed for me, it's like, it's, it'll plant a little seed. I'll start something, and it might not be anything for a little bit.

• 1:11:59Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 1:11:59Theo Von?

  And then it'll come back around when I have some space, or when I have some peace, or when I'm at rested. It's like, oh, okay.

• 1:12:06Speaker 01

  That's right. That's right. That's right.

• 1:12:07Theo Von?

  Cause your brain will do a lot of the work for you.

• 1:12:09Speaker 01

  That's right. And, you know, that has been fundamental to my life. I mean, there are different points in my life when I felt very desperate, really lost, as a matter of fact. And, and by the way, that doesn't stop. I mean, the last time I was very desperate was fifty-five. I was retiring from this big job. I was super burnt out. I didn't know what I was doing. And so I went on a pilgrimage. I walked hundreds of miles across northern Spain.

• 1:12:32Theo Von?

  I was gonna say a pill.

• 1:12:34Speaker 01

  Nah, pilgrimage.

• 1:12:35Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:12:35Speaker 01

  Pilgrimage, though.

• 1:12:36Theo Von?

  But that's how things have changed, right there. It used to be people were going on a pilgrimage. Now they're going on a pill.

• 1:12:42Speaker 01

  I recommend the pilgrimage. And, and I just thought, you know, why am I alive? And for what would I give my life? Why am I alive? For what would I give my life?

• 1:12:49Theo Von?

  Why am I alive and for what will I give my life? It, it's a tough thing to answer, kinda.

• 1:12:53Speaker 01

  It is. It is. And sometimes you just have an understanding, a deep understanding of it. And you ask for the grace, if you're religious, to, to get, to put this, put the understanding of these questions on my heart. Put these, like, grant me this wisdom.

• 1:13:05Theo Von?

  And so, so that's something I could ask God to do, cause it's like, I don't even know if I know those answers.

• 1:13:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know. And, and for sure, of course, I mean, it's hard. I mean, and those answers change over the course of your life, for sure. But that led me to, I mean, now, I mean, my purpose, my mission is to lift people up and bring them together in bonds of happiness and love using science and ideas.

• 1:13:27Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:13:27Speaker 01

  That's my mission in life. I came up with that on the pilgrimage, asking those questions. You know, and, and I feel like that, that information was granted to me, because I was in the space to actually get that. But if you don't, if it's like, you know the way to not be in the space?

• 1:13:43Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:43Speaker 01

  I mean, it's, and hours pass, and days pass, and, and, and your life passes.

• 1:13:49Theo Von?

  Okay, so I want to say those again. Uh, and those questions are?

• 1:13:53Speaker 01

  Number one, ask yourself, why am I alive?

• 1:13:56Theo Von?

  So why am I alive? And how do we ask ourselves it? Cause you don't want to ask yourself in a way that's negative, that puts you in a negative space.

• 1:14:02Speaker 01

  Not as if, you know, I might as well be dead.

• 1:14:04Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:14:04Speaker 01

  But I'm alive. There's a reason.

• 1:14:06Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:14:06Speaker 01

  And I want to know what it is. And the two parts are, who created me? And number two is, for what purpose? Now, that doesn't have to be religious like me or you. We, we do our own thing, right? I like my way.

• 1:14:19Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:19Speaker 01

  But there's gotta, there's gotta be an answer to that. There's gotta be an answer to that. But the second one is, you know, like, this, it gets real fast when you say, for what would I die? Like, what, cause a lot of people are like, I don't know why I'm alive, and I don't have any idea what I'd die for. What are we, how the hell are we to live?

• 1:14:38Theo Von?

  Right, right. Cause if you don't have something you would die for, then, uh, then what are you living for, right?

• 1:14:43Speaker 01

  Correct, correct.

• 1:14:43Theo Von?

  Right, there's not a real purpose. So, and I think some of us have some basic things, right? Like, you, if you have a family, or if you have children, those will give you some, some severe purpose. Sometimes it could be work, if you have a work that you're passionate about, and you feel like it's helping the world.

• 1:14:58Speaker 01

  If you have kids, most people would die for their kids.

• 1:15:00Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:00Speaker 01

  Most people really would die for their kids. Would you die for your friends? Would you die for your country? Would you die for your faith? Would you die for your ideas? Would you die for a stranger? I mean, it's really worth thinking about that, right? Because, you know, I, I don't know. I don't know. But there's sometimes when I feel more like I would, and, and, but, but the act of doing that, what that does is, as a scientific matter, is it, it opens up the aperture to meaning by actually activating the right hemisphere of your brain.

• 1:15:28Theo Von?

  So it opens up the aperture to meaning by opening up the right side of your right?

• 1:15:32Speaker 01

  The right hemisphere of your brain.

• 1:15:33Theo Von?

  Which is where meaning is calculated?

• 1:15:35Speaker 01

  This is where we, this is where we process issues of meaning.

• 1:15:39Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:15:39Speaker 01

  Is in the right side of our brain. That's where intuition happens, mystery, love, happiness, all the stuff that, the why questions of life.

• 1:15:46Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:15:46Speaker 01

  Like, you know, the how to and what is what you're doing all day long? You know, you're doing your podcast, and it's a really technical thing, and you got all these stuff, all these, you know, how to and what questions.

• 1:15:53Theo Von?

  That's the left brain.

• 1:15:54Speaker 01

  But it's gonna be really depressing if you don't ask the why question first. Why am I doing the podcast? Why am I doing that podcast? And the answer is to help a whole bunch of people, to entertain and help people, right? Because I want to make my living.

• 1:16:08Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:08Speaker 01

  And those are, that's really important. Why is way more important. All the important stuff is on the right. All the technical stuff is on the left. And people are on the left side. Anytime you're looking at your phone, you're on the left side.

• 1:16:19Theo Von?

  Got it. Well, we've also, the, all of our, the owners of so many of these, uh, tech companies and a lot of these sort of tech oligarchs, and I'm not blaming them, but it's like, they are all left, they seem very left brainish.

• 1:16:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're, yeah, they are.

• 1:16:38Theo Von?

  There's just all these tech lords and a lot, there's a lot of like, you know, these tech lords nowadays, people say that term, but, uh, they all have sort of this, you know, it feels a lot of times like an autism, like where they don't know how to create. Like, they're trying to connect us more than ever, right? But it's not working.

• 1:16:56Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:16:56Theo Von?

  And I don't even know if some of them possess, you know, I believe a lot of them have like an autism, like a techtism or whatever. And that they don't even know how to process, they're just gonna keep trying. It's like, they're just trying to like, find the exact formula. It's like, motherfucker, it's a hug.

• 1:17:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:13Theo Von?

  You know what I'm saying? It's, there's, there's two equa, it's like, four equations. Your two arms and my two arms. It's like, there's not, you know what I'm saying?

• 1:17:20Speaker 01

  I do. I do. I know exactly what you're saying. And, and one of the biggest problems that we have, and if you back up a couple hundred years to, they talk about the Enlightenment. The Enlightenment was this idea that there's a solution to every human problem, that science is gonna come up with a solution to every problem. There was a belief in the Enlightenment, that a kind of a religion of scientism. It's completely wrong.

• 1:17:40Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:17:41Speaker 01

  It's completely wrong. And it has everything to do with the fact that scientism and science and technological solutions are the solutions to complicated problems, not the complexities of the right hemisphere, which is all the why stuff, the things you can understand, but you can't solve. I'll give you an example. All of your human relationships, they're not complicated problems like writing software, or putting together a jet engine, or even building a toaster. Your relationships are complex problems that you'll never solve, but they're easy to understand.

• 1:18:09Theo Von?

  Okay, wait, say that stuff again?

• 1:18:11Speaker 01

  So complicated problems that tech is really good at solving are problems that are hard to figure out. But once you do, they're solved. That's not the same as complex problems, which are really easy to understand and impossible to solve. My marriage is incredibly complex. It's my most complex problem.

• 1:18:29Theo Von?

  Right, love is a complex problem.

• 1:18:31Speaker 01

  Because it's completely, it's like, you know, your cat is a complex problem. That's why you love your cat.

• 1:18:35Theo Von?

  Being a child, all these.

• 1:18:36Speaker 01

  A mechanical cat is a complicated problem, which is why you don't love your, your mechanical cat.

• 1:18:41Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:18:41Speaker 01

  Right? And so if the tech guys and the whole culture are saying there's a complicated technological solution to all of our deep human needs, they're gonna keep giving us mechanical cats.

• 1:18:52Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:18:52Speaker 01

  And that's why we feel so empty when we spend all day scrolling, is cause there's one mechanical cat after the other, and we want a real cat. That's what it comes down to.

• 1:19:01Theo Von?

  Who don't want a little cat?

• 1:19:02Speaker 01

  Cat's warm. You don't know what it's gonna do. It's alive. It's a, it's a creature.

• 1:19:07Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:19:08Speaker 01

  And, and the machine, it's like, it's, it, it procs it, it's a cat, it doesn't poop, no litter box.

• 1:19:13Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:19:14Speaker 01

  Don't have to feed it. Just kind of plug it in. It's better than a cat. No, it's completely inadequate.

• 1:19:19Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:19:20Speaker 01

  It's totally inadequate. And so all of these tech solutions, so, yeah, social media is gonna wipe out loneliness. Every hour you spend on social media, you will get lonelier, cause your brain knows the difference. That's, it's like, social media... Which has its place and is not going away and it can do a lot of good. But it's basically the junk food of our social lives. You know, if you're really hungry and you're coming home from a gig and you pass like a fast food place and you're like, yeah, it's gonna be good and you stop in and it is good, right? You get all your calories, but you get hungry really fast later because it doesn't meet your nutrient needs. And so you can binge and get both malnourished and obese at the same time. If you eat stuff that's high in calories and low in nutrients.

• 1:20:06Speaker 01

  Social media is high in calories and low in nutrients.

• 1:20:09Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:09Speaker 01

  Which means that we'll binge it and get lonelier and lonelier.

• 1:20:12Theo Von?

  Our soul just has a lot of fat on it.

• 1:20:14Speaker 01

  And the reason is because it's a simulation of what we actually want.

• 1:20:16Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:20:16Speaker 01

  Fast food is a simulation for the nutrient dense foods that our bodies need.

• 1:20:20Theo Von?

  So why can't we quit it right now? What's going on?

• 1:20:23Speaker 01

  Because we're super addicted.

• 1:20:25Theo Von?

  Okay, got it. So we are addicted, but also there's this element of the devil is creating it. It feels like, like they are sharpening the spear every single day.

• 1:20:35Speaker 01

  Well, it's also, here's an interesting thing. So you've dealt with, you know, we understand how addiction substances work.

• 1:20:41Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:20:41Speaker 01

  Substance addiction is always the solution to a problem that winds up creating a catastrophe.

• 1:20:47Theo Von?

  Okay, wait, so substance abuse, substance addiction.

• 1:20:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, is always a solution to a problem.

• 1:20:53Theo Von?

  It's always a solution to a problem.

• 1:20:54Speaker 01

  But it always creates a bigger problem.

• 1:20:55Theo Von?

  But it always creates a bigger problem.

• 1:20:56Speaker 01

  So for example, people who are anxious are in danger. Everybody watching us who has, not clinical, you know, generalized anxiety, who has an anxious job, who's an anxious person.

• 1:21:07Theo Von?

  Yeah, like real anxiety, like something, you know, like.

• 1:21:09Speaker 01

  Which is unfocused fear.

• 1:21:11Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:21:11Speaker 01

  Right? That's anxiety. You're in danger for alcohol abuse. And there's a reason for that. We actually understand that you're, the alcohol, I mean, anxiety, it stimulates the amygdala, which is the part of your brain for fight or flight. And you don't like it, right? And it's chronic and it's uncomfortable. You'll cut the connection with your conscious brain, with your prefrontal cortex with alcohol. Alcohol snips that connection. So you're stressed out, but you don't know it. And that's the reason that when you're really stressed out, like really stressed out, two drinks and you're a new man.

• 1:21:40Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:41Speaker 01

  And then another six drinks and you're the best version of yourself and then, and then after that you don't remember anything. So the problem with that is that then it will rebound. It will create a much bigger problem with escalation and all the things that we understand that are attendant on that. If you're lonely, opiates solve that problem because they feel like love. Opiates feel like love and they hit some of the same receptors as oxytocin, as a matter of fact. The problem is that they create addiction and destroy your relationships in the end. The reason that we're using social media addictively is because we hate boredom. It's boring and it wipes out boredom. But what it does is it creates the most boring possible life. That's the irony. It's just like, it's just like alcohol.

• 1:22:23Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:22:23Speaker 01

  It's like, I'm feeling stressed out and so I wipe out momentary stress and all I get is like the most stressed out horrible life ever.

• 1:22:31Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:31Speaker 01

  That's, it's the same thing. We're wiping out a little problem or creating a catastrophe. That's how old scratch works, by the way.

• 1:22:37Theo Von?

  Right? The devil. The devil's active.

• 1:22:41Speaker 01

  Here's the thing about it too. It's so funny. Nobody says, the secret to my happiness is social media. Just like nobody says, you know, the secret to my happiness, meth.

• 1:22:51Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:22:51Speaker 01

  Like words never uttered.

• 1:22:53Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:54Speaker 01

  And a lot of people use meth.

• 1:22:55Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude.

• 1:22:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:56Theo Von?

  I never got to use it. I never, I don't think I would have liked it. I don't like doing a lot of auto body type of shit.

• 1:23:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's actually more addictive than cocaine because it actually boosts. It's the substance that we know of that boosts dopamine the most. You know, crystal meth is a 10x of your dopamine.

• 1:23:15Theo Von?

  Damn.

• 1:23:16Speaker 01

  It's like supercharged.

• 1:23:18Theo Von?

  Dude, it's crazy. They gave it like crystal meth. They give it as like a kind of a cool name to have overall, you know?

• 1:23:26Speaker 01

  So that's the problem with tech.

• 1:23:28Theo Von?

  Yeah, I don't know if I feel like there's a solution.

• 1:23:30Speaker 01

  There is, there is, there absolutely is, but it requires commitment. We don't need, you know, a massive 12 step program, I don't think, for social media. What we need is, is people, it's funny because when people stop using, there's three things that they always do, right? And they stop using. Number one is that they get pissed. That's the first thing that happens. Get pissed off. This thing is ruining my life. This thing is sucking out my soul and I don't want to live this way and it's not right. They get angry. You gotta get mad enough. You know that feeling?

• 1:24:02Theo Von?

  Right. So you have to get upset that you're using this.

• 1:24:05Speaker 01

  You gotta get furious. You need to be enraged about that.

• 1:24:07Theo Von?

  Like, yeah, like what kind of bottom do people have to hit? Like, you know what I'm saying? Do you need to sit, you know, like?

• 1:24:12Speaker 01

  People's bottoms are different. So with alcohol abuse, 70% of people who stop using, stop using before they hit rock bottom and have to go to rehab.

• 1:24:21Theo Von?

  Amen.

• 1:24:22Speaker 01

  So 70%, this is really, really good news. I never went to rehab.

• 1:24:25Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:25Speaker 01

  I never went, never had to go to rehab, but boy, was my life a mess. And so I, but I was in, I was in the 70%. I could have, I could have taken that elevator down many more floors.

• 1:24:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:34Speaker 01

  Right? So most people, but I, I was so mad. I was so mad at what it was doing to my life, what it was doing to my marriage, what it was doing to my relationship with God. It was tearing me, it was tearing apart my relationships and I wasn't going to put up with this. Step one. Step two is actually understanding the science of what's actually going on sufficiently that you can actually engage in what the medical intervention that's appropriate, right? I mean, you actually have to do something about it. Do something tangible about it, which might involve a 12 step program, but usually it has to do with like going to the doctor and saying, I got a problem here.

• 1:25:07Theo Von?

  For alcoholism, you mean?

• 1:25:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, or alcoholism or any drug abuse or any addiction, by the way.

• 1:25:11Theo Von?

  Are you talking about a screen, addiction to screen too?

• 1:25:13Speaker 01

  That is, it's really important that we actually have an intervention. You know, the second step is actually intervening and changing our behavior.

• 1:25:20Theo Von?

  Okay. So the first step is hitting a bottom, recognizing, getting angry.

• 1:25:23Speaker 01

  Getting angry. The second is intervening in the process of using.

• 1:25:26Theo Von?

  So you have to intervene for yourself.

• 1:25:28Speaker 01

  Yep. And the third is you gotta live in a new way. You gotta live in a new way. I mean, it's like you gotta get new friends and, and, you know, it's funny because one thing that alcoholics always do that's really interesting is they try to go to step three first and they'll like move. Hey man, if I move, then all these stimuli and all these kind of loser friends that I've got and all like that, it never works.

• 1:25:48Theo Von?

  Yeah, never works.

• 1:25:48Speaker 01

  Because you didn't do one and two.

• 1:25:50Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:25:50Speaker 01

  You didn't do actually the, you didn't get mad enough and you didn't actually intervene. But then you do have to live in a new way. And so that's what we need to do with these screen addictions. People need to say, I'm tired of this sucking out my soul. I'm tired of this actually taking over my life. I'm tired of missing my life.

• 1:26:07Theo Von?

  And I feel like you almost hope you hit a rock bottom with it, you know? I heard my friend Jay the other day shared at a meeting, he's like, and this was about addiction, like in drug and alcohol, but not screen addiction, but he just said rock bottoms when you break your own heart.

• 1:26:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know.

• 1:26:22Theo Von?

  And I thought that that was pretty profound. It was like.

• 1:26:24Speaker 01

  Deep disappointment in you.

• 1:26:27Theo Von?

  And how like, and like, will we get there where we are like, we're just fed up? We're like, this isn't feeding anything anymore. These are just empty calories.

• 1:26:37Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:26:38Theo Von?

  For a desperate soul.

• 1:26:39Speaker 01

  Because people do. And then we will and we do. And it turns out that the second part, the intervention is easier, much easier.

• 1:26:46Theo Von?

  So the first one is, is getting up.

• 1:26:48Speaker 01

  Acknowledging I got a big problem.

• 1:26:50Theo Von?

  The second one is an intervention.

• 1:26:51Speaker 01

  And the intervention, it turns out, there's just those three steps, that science based things that we talked about before. First hour, meals, last hour. That in 42 days, your life is different.

• 1:27:01Theo Von?

  So what are you saying? You're gonna, that will help you stay off your screen?

• 1:27:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, it'll make it so that when you use your screen, you're using it as a tool and you're not using it as a way to actually pacify yourself. You're not using it to hypnotize yourself. You're not using it to miss your life.

• 1:27:13Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 1:27:14Speaker 01

  So it's not the kind of thing where you won't think of it in every single moment. So if you don't use it the first hour of the day, after about, it takes about six weeks. Most, and that's a rule of thumb. Your results may vary, right? It might be less, it might be more, but the whole point is a few weeks. And what you'll find is that you won't think of it all the time when you're not doing something else. Like when you're waiting at the light, light's kind of taking a long time. It's like, yeah. Right? That's because you don't want your mind to wander. You want to keep the mind wandering. It's called the default mode network in your brain. You want to keep it off. That mind wandering is really uncomfortable and that's why we do it, right? Okay, you won't, you'll get out of the habit of distracting yourself all the time, which is important. You'll also get more oxytocin because you're eating with other people and you're not having your phone on the table. We're evolved to eat with other people.

• 1:27:59Theo Von?

  So you're saying that the actual intervention for self is spending time with yourself in the morning?

• 1:28:04Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:28:04Theo Von?

  Having experiences for an hour.

• 1:28:06Speaker 01

  Together with others.

• 1:28:07Theo Von?

  Eat together with others.

• 1:28:08Speaker 01

  With no phone, even on the table.

• 1:28:10Theo Von?

  With no phone on the table, so you're engaging in humanity and you have a connection and then the last hour.

• 1:28:15Speaker 01

  Hour of the day. And the phone should never be in the bedroom.

• 1:28:18Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 1:28:18Speaker 01

  Never, if it's the last hour and the first hour, you don't have it, you don't need it in the bedroom. It's plugged in downstairs.

• 1:28:23Theo Von?

  Yeah, the phone in your bed, you're supposed to have your spouse in there.

• 1:28:26Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:28:26Theo Von?

  I know people that'll sleep with their phone and won't even sleep with their own spouse.

• 1:28:29Speaker 01

  I know. Well, I know people who are, you know, it's like the saddest thing is a spouse, you know, two spouses lying in their beds, you know, scrolling their individual Instagram until they fall unconscious.

• 1:28:38Theo Von?

  And they don't even like each other's shit.

• 1:28:40Speaker 01

  It's, they're not even laughing at each other's funny memes.

• 1:28:43Theo Von?

  Dude, that's the worst, bro. You're like, your wife posts something, you're like.

• 1:28:47Speaker 01

  It's not funny. Yeah. So it's, it's, yeah, no, it's sad actually. And so, I mean, you can save a ton of marriages if you just have like read to each other from a real book and then stare into each other's eyes for oxytocin, nighty night, man. You'll wake up more in love than you would sleep, but you won't, you're missing your marriage. It's it's just those three things. That's the intervention. And then you gotta live in a new way. We're actually engaging in life and love and beauty and pain and life.

• 1:29:16Theo Von?

  Right. If there's something on the side, it's like, say, you have something on the scale. It's heavy, right? Like, it's like, oh, this thing's too heavy for me. I'm tired of this, like, feeling checked out. I'm tired of this phone addiction. I'm tired of this. Like, it could be alcohol, whatever it is, whatever this thing is. You have to put something on the other side of the scale. So you can't, you have to replace it kind of with something.

• 1:29:33Speaker 01

  You gotta do it. Otherwise, you know what? I mean, I'm sure you know what a dry drunk is, right?

• 1:29:37Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:37Speaker 01

  A dry, I mean, for everybody doesn't know, a dry drunk is somebody who doesn't replace the alcohol with something that's positive. They don't get to the bottom of what you're actually trying to, the need that you're trying to meet.

• 1:29:48Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:29:49Speaker 01

  I mean, you're, remember, you, you, you, you use alcohol abusively because you're trying to solve a problem. So you get rid of the alcohol without solving the problem, you're just gonna be like a mean guy. Just, that's called the dry drunk syndrome. And we can be drive, social media users or something, you know, dry screen addicts or something.

• 1:30:07Theo Von?

  Standing around looking for something, yeah, to be like.

• 1:30:09Speaker 01

  Monkeys on your back, you know, you're super nervous all the time. You're uncomfortable with yourself. You're bored.

• 1:30:14Theo Von?

  Yeah, you don't even, you just feel less human. And I, and I'm, I'm amazed that you think that it's repairable, that you believe that there's another, that there's a way out of this, because sometimes it feels like there's not.

• 1:30:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, but there is. And I've actually seen it with a lot of young people who are actually developing and using these protocols. Once again, it comes back to structuring the architecture of your own life, the way that you want to live.

• 1:30:35Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:35Speaker 01

  Taking back your own brain. I mean, again, it's not easy. If it were easy, everybody would do it. You know, there are actually studies now that show that teenagers would literally pay for there to be no social media.

• 1:30:46Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:46Speaker 01

  As long as nobody had it. They don't want to be the only ones without it, because they don't want to be alone on Gilligan's Island. They, they, they want nobody to have it. They would literally pay, I think it's like thirty-five bucks or something that they say they would pay on average to get obliterate it, right? There's a, there's a good study here, right?

• 1:31:00Theo Von?

  A study led by researchers examined how much people value social media versus a world without it. When asked about individual use, participants typically said they would need to be paid fifty-nine, around fifty-nine dollars. To deactivate their accounts individually. However, when asked about a collective deactivating scenario, many users would actually pay to get rid of the platforms.

• 1:31:21Speaker 01

  Yeah. They would pay an average of twenty-eight dollars to deactivate a social media platform and ten bucks to globally deactivate Instagram. You want to get rid of both? Thirty-eight bucks. Deal?

• 1:31:34Theo Von?

  How nice would it be? Imagine what it would be like.

• 1:31:36Speaker 01

  Yeah. And, and you know, that's what a lot, and these are teenagers who are saying this. It's not like you and me, you know, grown up guys.

• 1:31:43Theo Von?

  Because then you gotta be like around somewhere, like, if you want to see people, uh, if you want to see, you had to go see them, dude. You had to hope they were somewhere. Remember that?

• 1:31:53Speaker 01

  I know. And so what happens is when young people do that, they'll have a, they'll collectively do that. Groups of friends will do this. You see this on campuses, and they get so much happier. And what are they doing at night after they, after Saturday night when they come back from a party? They're just like BSing. They're having those conversations, those late night dorm conversations.

• 1:32:11Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:12Speaker 01

  They're not waiting for the YouTube algorithm to deliver them some anesthetizing, algorithmically derived information they didn't seek. It's so depressing.

• 1:32:22Theo Von?

  And you reminisce, bro.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:25Theo Von?

  Dude, laying, like, if my friends would sleep over, we'd do a sleepover or something, bro.

• 1:32:29Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:32:30Theo Von?

  And we was reminiscing.

• 1:32:32Speaker 01

  But you know, they could, what?

• 1:32:33Theo Von?

  And we could lie to each other.

• 1:32:34Speaker 01

  I know. And you know, think about it right now. So we're having, we're having a conversation right now, and it's so awesome. I'm just enjoying it so much. Want to know why?

• 1:32:42Theo Von?

  Why?

• 1:32:43Speaker 01

  Because we're talking about real things in real time. And that's life in life.

• 1:32:47Theo Von?

  Well, dude, remember when you could lie to your friends, bro?

• 1:32:51Theo Von?

  Remember that?

• 1:32:53Speaker 01

  Tell me a lie you told your friends.

• 1:32:54Theo Von?

  Oh, dude, I remember, bro. So we had to go, like, we was doing, uh, I don't know if it was Boy Scouts or if there was just like.

• 1:33:01Speaker 01

  You were a Boy Scout?

• 1:33:02Theo Von?

  Uh, it might have just been some pedophiles in the area. Nonetheless, we were going camping. And right when we got there, I remember telling everybody, like, man, I just can't even believe that. And like, what happened? I was like, did y'all see that Jay Leno had died? And they're like, what? Even the dads and kids and everybody was like, what? And I was like, yeah, Jay Leno died. And they're like, oh, man.

• 1:33:22Speaker 01

  You spread a rumor, a local rumor?

• 1:33:24Theo Von?

  So for, so for the next two nights, we're out in the woods and stuff, and everybody thought Jay Leno had died. So I'd hear them sit up and talk about it at night. And I would be in my tent, bro, like, laughing at a level that came from, like, I can't even tell you.

• 1:33:38Speaker 01

  Because there was no internet access. There was no way to fact check that. Like, we're like fact checking me in real time right now, right? Like, nuh-uh.

• 1:33:43Theo Von?

  No. And I, and I knew that when they got home, he was gonna be alive for them. And that was awesome, too.

• 1:33:49Speaker 01

  That's pretty funny.

• 1:33:50Theo Von?

  I was like, damn, bro.

• 1:33:51Speaker 01

  That was like real life.

• 1:33:52Theo Von?

  Not only am I having so much fun right now, but you guys are gonna get Jay Leno back.

• 1:33:56Speaker 01

  Oh, it's so great. It's like resurrected.

• 1:34:01Speaker 01

  The reincarnation of Jay Leno.

• 1:34:03Theo Von?

  Oh, dude. Oh, God, bro.

• 1:34:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's great. So, so this is, so, so that's the protocol. That's the protocols, one, two, three, right? And no phone in the, there shouldn't be, by the way, any phones in classrooms, any place in America. That's completely insane. That's total, that's nuts.

• 1:34:19Theo Von?

  At a certain point, though, it's obvious that there are bigger entities out there who want us to, they want this.

• 1:34:25Speaker 01

  You know, sorta. I think that what's happening is we're finding our way. I know a lot of these guys, and you do too. They want the best for their kids, and they don't want to get sued to kingdom come. And, and they don't want the worst for our kids either. But we kind of, people develop stuff, and you know, we've got this dynamic economy where people invent things they think are cool. And it turns out that, well, they're dangerous too, and we're gonna figure it out. And you know, when you meet these guys, they're, they're, they're good dudes. They're good people. And, and they want the best. And it's not just like profit at any cost. You have to not know them to think that it's profit at any cost.

• 1:34:59Theo Von?

  I don't know. Some of them, you start to wonder if they're even people sometimes. I start to wonder. And you start, I, I start to wonder, like, do they care about anything other than profit at any cost? Sometimes what I think that they've created is something that they can't control anymore.

• 1:35:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. And that's a common thing.

• 1:35:15Theo Von?

  And they don't want to admit that.

• 1:35:17Speaker 01

  That's right. No. And look, I mean, there were people who, who, you know, developed tobacco, tobacco products, or people who developed the automobile. And there were unintended consequences of those things. And, and we figured it out.

• 1:35:28Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:28Speaker 01

  We figured it out. And we're gonna figure this one out, too. I'm, I'm super optimistic about that. I just don't want to lose the generation in the meantime.

• 1:35:34Theo Von?

  I love that. No, I love hearing that, because it's like, that's the thing that we do need to hear, is that there's optimism out there about it.

• 1:35:39Speaker 01

  No, no, I'm very optimistic about it, because humans are great at figuring stuff out, you know? It's not like the end of civilization. We're gonna be all right. We're gonna be all right.

• 1:35:48Theo Von?

  Yeah, the best thing used to be, though, dude, when it was like, you, but, you, if you wanted a story, you had to go to your buddy to get it, dude.

• 1:35:54Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:35:55Theo Von?

  And that was the guy who told the story. And that's what added so much, like, it added so much value to being.

• 1:36:02Speaker 01

  It was this?

• 1:36:02Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:03Speaker 01

  And it was oxytocin, and it was friendship, and it was love, and it was good.

• 1:36:06Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:07Speaker 01

  And now what is it? We're actually just getting it virtually, electronically, just the facts, just the facts, just the facts, left brain, left brain, left brain.

• 1:36:14Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:15Speaker 01

  Which is, of course, a simulation of fellowship and goodness and love. That's what it comes down to. So that's, you know, that's the, that's the inter, that's the, the way that we get in, that's the way that we, um, the cessation method is actually getting into that. That's the, the way that we can actually solve the problem. But then we have to live in a different way, because we've got to live the rest of our lives. And that comes back to living like your great grandfather. My great grandfather was Leroy Brooks.

• 1:36:41Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 1:36:42Speaker 01

  He plowed the fields in Olathe, Kansas.

• 1:36:44Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:36:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:45Theo Von?

  Like, beautiful out there.

• 1:36:46Speaker 01

  He, he married Mary Ellen James, the, the sheriff's daughter. Her father had been strung up by Quantrell's Raiders, you know, like Frank James and those guys.

• 1:36:57Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:58Speaker 01

  Strung him up. He was, he didn't kill him because they were too drunk to tie his hands.

• 1:37:02Theo Von?

  Dang.

• 1:37:02Speaker 01

  He let himself down, got married, had, I'm alive today because of liquor.

• 1:37:05Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:08Speaker 01

  Also not, unfortunately not dead because of liquor.

• 1:37:10Theo Von?

  That's true.

• 1:37:11Speaker 01

  Well, it has a complicated relationship in our lives, doesn't it? But, but he was, you know, he was fully alive, bored moment to moment, and completely engaged in his life.

• 1:37:20Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:21Speaker 01

  Kids, grandkids, strong Christian guy, married sixty years. I guarantee you, his life was not boring. He did not say on his deathbed, honey, that was boring.

• 1:37:29Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:30Speaker 01

  Because it wasn't. And so that's, and how did he live? He lived with nature. He lived with beauty. He lived with his faith in God. He lived in love with his wife. He was fully alive and completely engaged in his life.

• 1:37:43Theo Von?

  We lived with all the real things that it's like we see clips of.

• 1:37:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:37:47Theo Von?

  And we share them, and we say, well, this is real. This means something. But we're not like, um, we don't have a tan, like a, uh, we don't have a true relationship with it sometimes.

• 1:37:56Speaker 01

  Yeah. And so we need to, we need to go back and do those things on purpose, whereas there was no other choice. You know, people send out those internet clips now of how people lived in, like, the late seventies or eighties or something like that. That was my childhood.

• 1:38:11Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:11Speaker 01

  And it was like, ride our bikes. And, and if you gotta call home, you gotta find a payphone, but you probably don't. Your mom's like, make sure you're home before nightfall. And she didn't know any idea where you were or what you were doing.

• 1:38:21Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:21Speaker 01

  And you're at the arcade, ding, ding, ding, ding, playing ping ball. And, and these kids were like, seventeen years old, are feeling sentimental about my childhood. Because they know. It was real.

• 1:38:32Theo Von?

  There was something real in it.

• 1:38:33Speaker 01

  Something real in it, right?

• 1:38:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:34Speaker 01

  And that's key, is to actually live in this old fashioned way, falling in love, right? Seeking the beauty in life.

• 1:38:42Theo Von?

  That's a big one right there.

• 1:38:43Speaker 01

  Huge.

• 1:38:44Theo Von?

  Finding some love out there.

• 1:38:45Speaker 01

  Huge. And that means in real life, you know, for the guys who are watching us right now with a real woman.

• 1:38:51Theo Von?

  Love is a real thing.

• 1:38:53Speaker 01

  Oh, man, that's my next book is called Falling in Love and Staying in Love. The science of falling in love is so heavy.

• 1:38:59Theo Von?

  Is it?

• 1:38:59Speaker 01

  It's amazing what happens to your brain. It's completely indescribable. It's like a total miracle. Have you ever been in love?

• 1:39:06Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:07Speaker 01

  How many times?

• 1:39:08Theo Von?

  Probably three times.

• 1:39:10Speaker 01

  You're heartbroken any of those times?

• 1:39:12Theo Von?

  Yeah, my shit was pretty banged up, but some of it was my own fault. But yeah, dude, when it was good, it was good. I think I was always, part of me was afraid to be all the way there.

• 1:39:21Speaker 01

  Did you, were you always the reason that it broke up, that it broke up?

• 1:39:24Theo Von?

  Probably in some ways or something like I just, I don't know. I never had a good, um, the foundation for, of it for me wasn't great. But I think it's, I do like, yeah, the moments where you felt like connected, man, it's really nice.

• 1:39:38Speaker 01

  It's like Fourth of July inside your head. And we actually know, I mean, the chemistry is actually there. We've evolved the chemistry to bond to each other and find your person, to find your soulmate. Human beings are made, uh, we call it pair bond mating. It's just a kind of a clinical way to say falling in love with your person. For the rest of your life. And the goal is the deepest possible friendship, deepest possible friendship. That's the union of your right hemispheres.

• 1:40:04Theo Von?

  It is?

• 1:40:04Speaker 01

  Oh, totally.

• 1:40:05Theo Von?

  So that's right hemisphere stuff. That's meaning stuff.

• 1:40:07Speaker 01

  Totally. My, my wife and I is like, when we're in the zone, when we're really clicking, it's because, I mean, she's finishing my sentences. And, uh, and when we're understanding each other at a deep intuitive level, it's not like, yeah, I can, I, you know, I understand the meaning of those particular words. No, it's just, it's this deep intuitive understanding.

• 1:40:24Theo Von?

  We're right there.

• 1:40:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's two right hemispheres beating as one.

• 1:40:28Theo Von?

  Damn. It sounds, yeah, something you're gonna get arrested for.

• 1:40:33Speaker 01

  Romantic, I know, but you know, but it's, but that's really, really, I mean, it's, that will lead you to meaning. Falling in love and letting yourself fall in love. And that's, you know, it's very hard on apps to do that.

• 1:40:43Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:40:44Speaker 01

  62% of couples today meet on the apps. Some are better than others. I've actually done a bunch of work with Bumble. I like those guys because they're trying to add more human friction into the algorithm. So it's not just

• 1:40:57Speaker 01

  you know, they're trying to find ways to get people out on you real human dates faster. And that's the way it's going to have to be. And once again, we'll solve these problems like that.

• 1:41:05Theo Von?

  So you think a lot of it is just kind of a fine tuning of this errant ways that we've gone?

• 1:41:09Speaker 01

  Yeah. For, well, I mean, we're not gonna throw our phones in the ocean. It's just not gonna happen.

• 1:41:13Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:41:14Speaker 01

  I mean, we're not, we're, that ship has sailed and so we're gonna have to figure it out. It's like people said, we'll never be happy again because of the telephone. I mean, there was an article early out of the telephone where people like, people are gonna stay in their houses. Somebody's just gonna hold a phone up at the church and people are gonna listen in their houses, not gonna see each other anymore. It's the death of civilization. No. No, it's just a tool. What's gonna have to happen is we figure out that the internet and especially social media and small screens are nothing more than a tool. They gotta go from entertainment to tool. Here's the, here's the way to think about it, Theo. If any device or technology is substituting for your in-person relationships, it's gonna make you miserable and ruin your life.

• 1:41:53Theo Von?

  There you go.

• 1:41:54Speaker 01

  If it's a compliment, if it actually connects you to other people, it's good. It's a tool. Use it and go forth and, you know, be, be at peace.

• 1:42:03Theo Von?

  Yeah. So, yo, I mean, I just say, yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean, there's so many good like, like nuggets in this conversation of just ways to evaluate where you're at. To begin to have a little bit more of a relationship with yourself.

• 1:42:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:15Theo Von?

  Right? Which is so key.

• 1:42:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. Love yourself and others.

• 1:42:19Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:19Speaker 01

  Don't distract yourself from yourself. Don't lose yourself. Don't simulate yourself. Real life. And, and that's, by the way, when you're not feeling good, that's hard.

• 1:42:32Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:32Speaker 01

  When you wake up and you're like, no, no, I don't want me, I don't wanna be with me.

• 1:42:36Theo Von?

  But sometimes those are the days you gotta work through. It's like, I know that if I put in the effort right now, then hopefully it'll pay off, you know, that tomorrow will be easier. It's like, you know what I'm saying? Some of those things you start to know. And it's just the next foot in front of the other. It's like, my buddy Mark Dowdell says, it's just like, can I take this next step for myself right now? And that is a truth, right? Whatever's going on in here, if it's not thought, then it's like, um, it's like, cause you ever, do you ever notice sometimes in your brain, like, I've really started to notice sometimes my brain is just rattling and, and I'm rarely thinking. I feel like, I feel like I'm thinking, but it's not thinking. It's something else. Like,

• 1:43:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's sort of chatter. It's not deep in its own way. And what's actually, th- this is the hemispheric lateralization problem. Your right brain is not engaged at all.

• 1:43:20Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 1:43:20Speaker 01

  All you're doing is just like kind of information that, that it's like a ticker tape. It's like the, it's like the crawl on CNN headline news.

• 1:43:30Speaker 01

  And it doesn't have any content.

• 1:43:31Theo Von?

  That's how we feel.

• 1:43:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, sure. Absolutely.

• 1:43:34Theo Von?

  That's where we are. We gotta get back into the big picture.

• 1:43:35Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. You gotta be alive, fully alive. There's this guy in the, in the early church, there was a saint in the fourth century named Saint Irenaeus. Great name, right? We gotta name boys Irenaeus again. And he said, the glory of God is a man fully alive.

• 1:43:48Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:43:49Speaker 01

  That's what he wanted. The glory of God. What does God want? He wants you miserable. He wants you happy. He wants all of you. What he doesn't want is this degraded version of you that's like getting filtered through a screen.

• 1:44:02Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:02Speaker 01

  Like, bring it on and bring it on. And so this is, you know, like this thing, if early in the morning, I'll do this, like,

• 1:44:09Speaker 01

  there was this old preacher named Norman Vincent Peale back in the day.

• 1:44:13Theo Von?

  Norman?

• 1:44:13Speaker 01

  Norman Vincent Peale. And he used to have this thing called the power of positive thinking. He was like one of those little Protestant guys, right? And he used to say, every day when you wake up, you can actually get these recordings. They all sounded like that back in the day. Every day when you wake up, he say, say the Psalm, this is the day that the Lord has made. I will rejoice and be glad in it. Yeah, but there's more to it than that, I say. Wake up and say, I'm also so grateful for all the trouble I'm gonna face this day. Because I'm gonna learn and I'm gonna grow and I'm gonna feel somebody else's pain and I'm gonna get the meaning of my life. Bring it on.

• 1:44:46Theo Von?

  Amen.

• 1:44:46Speaker 01

  Bring it on, man.

• 1:44:47Theo Von?

  How do I be a warrior? How do I start to, just how do I have that relationship with myself?

• 1:44:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:51Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, all of it. All of it. All of it. I want it all. I want it all. At the end of the day, you want some of it or you want all of it?

• 1:44:58Theo Von?

  This is, yeah, you're here for the, yeah, I want the, I don't wanna scoop. I want the sundae, cuz. Dr. Brooks, you have your, uh, new book, The Meaning of Your Life, um, Finding Purpose in an Age of Emptiness. And, uh, thank you, man. Thank you so much for coming and talking about it.

• 1:45:14Speaker 01

  I love being with you.

• 1:45:15Theo Von?

  Yeah, I've enjoyed it, dude. We'll have to do it again sometime.

• 1:45:17Speaker 01

  You're a, you have very, very, very, very special soul.

• 1:45:20Theo Von?

  Oh, thanks, dude. Yeah, I feel lucky to be alive, uh, most of the time. And when I don't feel that way, I gotta find a way to get back to that way.

• 1:45:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, you, you run super deep. You run super deep. And that's got, that's got cost. That's got a cost to it.

• 1:45:35Theo Von?

  Yeah. Yeah, well, I'm grateful to have days like this where I can talk with somebody and like, you know, I mean, if anything, I feel way better now than I did when I started.

• 1:45:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, man. Let's do it again.

• 1:45:45Theo Von?

  What a blessing.

• 1:45:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, thank you.

• 1:45:46Theo Von?

  We'll do it again. Thank you, Dr. Brooks.

• 1:45:48Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:45:48Theo Von?

  Go doors.