Between the Lines: In Storytelling, Simplify to Amplify - Premium Sampler

Visit fastersmarter.io/premium http://fastersmarter.io/premium to become a Premium subscriber. "Start with the action moment or right before it," advises Hilary Price https://www.fastersmarter.io/guests/hilary-price/ whose one-panel comic strips offer insights far beyond humor—they’re lessons in concise storytelling that resonate with anyone seeking to communicate effectively. “Simplify and amplify,” Price advises, emphasizing the art of clarity and impact. Every stroke of her pen strips away the unnecessary, letting the essentials shine through. Creating her daily comic strip, Rhymes with Orange https://rhymeswithorange.com/, Price starts with the game of “what if,” merging unexpected ideas to surprise and engage her readers. “You want to start at the action moment—or just before,” she notes, pointing out how the unsaid often speaks louder. Price extends this philosophy beyond cartoons: whether crafting a presentation, a joke, or a story, it’s essential to leave room for the audience to co-create meaning. “Don’t spoon-feed your readers,” she says. “The joy comes from not getting it, then getting it.” In this bonus episode of Think Fast Talk Smart https://www.fastersmarter.io/, Price joins host Matt Abrahams to explore the power of surprise, stakes, and shared experience in storytelling—reminding us that the punchline, whether in humor or communication, is where the magic happens. Episode Reference Links: Hilary Price https://www.fastersmarter.io/guests/hilary-price/Rhymes With Orange https://rhymeswithorange.com/Ep.170 Advice From Nontraditional Storytellers Part 1 https://www.fastersmarter.io/170-advice-from-nontraditional-storytellers-part-1/Ep.171 Advice From Nontraditional Storytellers Part 2 https://www.fastersmarter.io/171-advice-from-nontraditional-storytellers-part-2/ Connect: Premium Signup >>>> Think Fast Talk Smart Premium https://www.fastersmarter.io/premium/Email Questions & Feedback >>> [email protected] Transcripts >>>Think Fast Talk Smart Website https://www.fastersmarter.io/between-the-lines-in-storytelling-simplify-to-amplify-premium-sampler/Newsletter Signup + English Language Learning >>>FasterSmarter.io http://fastersmarter.io/Think Fast Talk Smart >>>LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/think-fast-talk-smart/,Instagram https://www.instagram.com/thinkfasttalksmart/, YouTube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6caGRBUYZCmgDGM2RK6mxKB9jG_ccmm3Matt Abrahams >>>LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/maabrahams/ Chapters: (00:00) - Introduction (01:45) - What Makes a Good Story? (02:38) - Crafting a Story (03:58) - Auditioning the Characters (07:02) - Stories in Daily Life (08:50) - Visuals in Storytelling (10:37) - The Power of a Punchline (12:44) - Admired Storytellers (14:41) - Communicating with Titles (16:13) - Conclusion ******** Thank you to our sponsors. These partnerships support the ongoing production of the podcast, allowing us to bring it to you at no cost. Learn more about how Notion https://www.notion.com/?utm_source=podcasts&utm_medium=thinkfast can support your business at notion.com/thinkfast. https://www.notion.com/?utm_source=podcasts&utm_medium=thinkfast Join our Think Fast Talk Smart Learning Community and become the communicator you want to be. https://learning.fastersmarter.io/?redirect_from=podpage

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Matt Abrahams?

  In the moment, conflict is difficult for everyone. In our October newsletter, out now, you will learn ways to help yourself handle these challenges better. Not only do you get specific advice, we're also providing an infographic to help you remember. Find our newsletter on the Think Fast, Talk Smart LinkedIn page or at fastersmarter.io under Resources. Being concise and clear is critical in a world where our attention is constantly being tugged and pulled. When I thought about communicators I know who had to deal with this challenge of being clear and concise on a daily basis, I was reminded of a former college classmate who for decades has written a daily one-panel comic strip called Rhymes with Orange.

• 0:45Matt Abrahams?

  As part of our recent Think Fast, Talk Smart mini-series on non-traditional storytellers, I interviewed Hilary Price. Her complete episode, along with those of others who were in the mini-series, can be found in our premium library. But since Hillary's insights into communication are so useful and applicable to all of us, I wanted to share the full interview here outside of premium as a bonus episode. I hope you enjoy learning from Hillary as much as I did. I am super excited to speak with Hilary Price. We went to college together, and Hillary helps me start every day as a cartoonist and the author of Rhymes with Orange.

• 1:27Matt Abrahams?

  I get a little chuckle and sometimes a big guffaw every morning by reading Hillary's work. Hillary, thanks for being here with us, and I'd love for you just to take a moment to introduce yourself.

• 1:36Speaker 01

  Okay, thanks, Matt. So I have been creating the comic strip Rhymes with Orange, which appears in newspapers daily and also online, for the last, gosh, almost three decades. For the last seven years, I collaborate on that with a Toronto-based cartoonist, and we go back and forth, generating gags for the strip.

• 1:59Speaker 02

  I thoroughly enjoy your work. And what I find so fascinating about it, Hillary, is you do it all in one panel.

• 2:06Speaker 01

  Lazy cartoonists.

• 2:07Speaker 02

  I want to hear more about that. But what makes a good story?

• 2:11Speaker 01

  There has to be change and there has to be surprise. And there also has to be stakes. I'm going to reference a storyteller who is one of my favorites. His name is Matthew Dix and he does a lot of mock storytelling. And his definition of a story is, I used to think one thing, then some stuff happened, and now I think another. So I think that when you're doing that in a cartoon, in terms of the before, you rely on cultural history. So if you're at a Thanksgiving table, you don't have to have a banner that says Thanksgiving over the top, right? And then you're going to have a twist.

• 2:49Speaker 01

  If every bit of cultural history is a common knowledge, then a cartoon or a good story that has surprise disrupts that cliche.

• 3:00Speaker 02

  It seems to me that something you're bringing to the table that we have yet to talk about is how we use the reader or the story experiencer's past experience to help us tell our stories. So you're relying on cliche or common experiences that are culturally shared and bring that, literally in the example you used, to the table to help us be part of the story. And then this notion of surprise and change is critical as well. And one of the things that I enjoy so much about the cartoon that you draw and write is the fact that there is surprise and change in it. It makes you think for a second, oh, that's really clever. And that's part of the shared experience that you bring through the storytelling you do.

• 3:44Speaker 02

  Are there other aspects of storytelling you use in your job? Can you share a little bit, perhaps, how you go through your process of actually crafting the story?

• 3:52Speaker 01

  So for my creative process, I tend to come up with the joke first and then I audition the characters. Is this most effectively done by having two dogs talking to each other, by having a dog talk to a person, a person talk to a dog? What is the best way to get the gag across? And in my business, it's called gag cartooning and gag means the joke, just like for musicians, gig means the act.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  So it sounds like you start with the end in mind, the result you want, the gag. And I love this notion of auditioning the characters. So can you walk us through what is it you're looking for? Is it what's most appropriate? What would be most silly? What would be most counterintuitive? What's the audition about?

• 4:36Speaker 01

  I'll walk you through what's going to be my Easter gag. So I started out and I was talking with a friend and we were brainstorming ideas. Or what are the kind of cliches of Easter? The bunny, right? And then we were thinking, where does this bunny exist outside of Easter? And we came up with the idea of the magician. So what if you took the concept of you've got a magician and you've got a bunny and the bunny is turning to the magician and saying, I told you I needed this Sunday off. You need to have some clues that this is a Easter. You don't want to say it's Easter because anybody reading the newspaper on that day is going to know Easter, right?

• 5:19Speaker 01

  And so I had the bunny, the prop I added was the bunny holding a basket. That's all I needed to say Easter. And then it never says Majesto the Magnificent in the drawing, because if you see a man and a cape and a mustache and there's like a dove and some rings or something, some magic rings, then you, the reader, already bring to the experience where we are. I ended up with, I told you I needed this Sunday off. But it started with, before that, I told you this was my side hustle. The goal in cartooning is you want to simplify and amplify. Those are the two things. And also not spoon feed your reader

• 6:01Speaker 01

  because the joy of a cartoon, it's interactive. It's going from not getting it to getting it.

• 6:08Speaker 02

  I love this notion of simplify and amplify. And I think a lot of our communication would benefit if we thought about how can we make our messages as simple as possible and really amplify the meaning? And also in what you said in your brainstorming about this idea, you were really thinking about what's appropriate for a reader of a newspaper on Easter Sunday. And it's not just here's a gag. It's how do I make the gag play for the audience? And I think those are really critical skills for anybody in communicating and story writing.

• 6:42Speaker 01

  There's something interesting in terms of backend is that when my syndicate receives my comic strip, they try and do tag words. And one of the first things they do is they just record what is said. But that doesn't make for an effective tag, because you need to bring also what is the cultural things that aren't being said. It doesn't state Easter, it doesn't state bunny, it doesn't state magician. It's a challenge then for like an AI SEO to properly mark the strip because you're trying to take out those markers because the reader's bringing them. So that's just a little left turn, but it's just an interesting way that it doesn't help in this modern world.

• 7:24Speaker 02

  I think what's fascinating is we finally found something that AI can't do well and what humans need to do well, which is to bring in all the implied information that isn't just overt. So this notion of, in many ways, it's a partnership with your reader to co-create the meaning that you're talking about. Many times, in the type of storytelling that people do, they're literally bringing your audience through the story. You're telling them everything. And in your case, you're actually leaving out critical information that the audience brings to the stories you're telling, the comics that you draw and write. And that's the magic. That's where it really happens. What is it in storytelling that you

• 8:08Speaker 02

  do as a cartoonist, beyond what we've talked about in terms of simplify and amplify, consider the context, think about the audience? Are there any other things that people who tell stories in their daily lives could benefit from what you do and your process?

• 8:23Speaker 01

  Yes. You never want to start a story with, first I was born. And then, too much introduction is not necessary. So you want to start at the action moment, or right before the action moment. The way that this translates for me is that I have a single panel to do this. So I can't futz around giving too much information that is unnecessary. And with humor, you either want to show an event right before it happens, or right after it happens. If I were gonna throw a glass of water at you, what is funnier? Me about to throw the

• 9:03Speaker 01

  glass of water, or the act of it? You want to give the audience the joy of imagining it versus showing it.

• 9:12Speaker 02

  So what I'm hearing you say, which is really important for, I think, all of us to think about, is where do you start? And some of us start too early and with too much. And we have to think, I love this idea of what's the action moment? Even if you're writing technical documentation, there is an action moment there that you can think about. I want to ask you, because of all the guests we're talking to for this mini-series, you're the only one that uses any visual elements at all. We're talking to a mime who uses only physical body. How important is the visual element? And where does the visual element come in your process? So for many of us, we're not cartoonists, but we might create slides or PowerPoint to help us get our message across. In your process, do you start with the visual elements?

• 9:55Speaker 02

  Or do you start just with the character or the gag? Where do you start and where do visuals come into that process?

• 10:01Speaker 01

  The first question in creating a joke is taking two disparate ideas and going, what if? What is the connection between these two things? It is a game that I often play in order to generate gags. I call it the justification game, trying to decide how two different things might make sense in a way that disrupts the cliches. The visual is the last thing that happens. But even that is an iterative process. So I might draw something and then redraw it and redraw it type of thing in order to cut elements out, in the same way that I'm cutting words out of the speech bubble.

• 10:43Speaker 01

  I'm not overcomplicating the drawing, because I only want to put the elements that are important. If they're decorative, I don't want them there, because I'm going to tell my audience, if I've drawn it, then my audience knows it's a clue.

• 10:59Speaker 02

  What I'm hearing is that the drawing often comes last. And that's the advice that those of us who do what I do suggest, that you don't create the slides first, you create the story first, you create the reason first. And then applying similar rules to you, does it help simplify or amplify? And if it does, then maybe a visual makes sense. And then the other thing I heard you say, which I think is so important for all of us, is the task is to figure out what is the least amount of information you can provide to accomplish it. What I hear you saying is exactly the opposite. What's the least amount of information I need to provide to make the joke land or to get the point across? And I think that's an interesting lesson for all of us, is less is more.

• 11:37Speaker 01

  It's called a punchline for a reason. You want to end on the strongest word in a cartoon. So the reader have to get to it and then there's the boom. And then your job as a cartoonist is not to have another character comment on the punchline. That is the reader's job. That's the listener's job. You don't say, and here you laugh. Your audience is going to laugh or not laugh. But I have always found it odd when a comedian makes a joke and no one laughs. And then they comment on the fact that no one laughs. Just move on.

• 12:13Speaker 02

  This notion of a punchline, I think all of us in the stories we tell, the communication we do, we have punchlines. A punchline is what you build up to.

• 12:20Speaker 01

  I've learned that invariably someone is going to ask me, where did you get the title Rhine's with Orange? What does that come from? As a general rule, I don't include it in the talk because I know that's a curiosity seed that someone is going to raise their hand and then you've got that engagement going. And then if you break the seal with the first question, then others will follow.

• 12:44Speaker 02

  I think that is such good advice and advice that we often give to people during Q and A is have a question at the ready or set yourself up for a question to get the ball rolling. And that's exactly what you do.

• 12:57Matt Abrahams?

  We'll be right back to finish our conversation. But first, we're going to take a quick break for a word from our sponsors. Their support covers the cost of production so we can bring you this show for free. This podcast is sponsored by Squarespace. The best communicators don't just get their message across. They make it easy for people to know what to do next. Your website can do the same thing. With Squarespace, you can build a polished online presence that clearly shows people who you are, what you offer, and how they can work with you. If you offer coaching, consulting, classes, or other services, Squarespace lets you showcase those offerings, take payments, and use Acuity Scheduling so people can book time with you directly. And with built-in analytics, you can see how people are finding and engaging with your site,

• 13:42Matt Abrahams?

  helping you make smarter decisions about where to focus. So your online presence doesn't just look professional, it helps people take action. Go to Squarespace.com/thinkfast for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code THINKFAST to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. Hi, Matt here. Sometimes the biggest obstacle to getting something done isn't the idea, the plan, or even the budget. It's finding the right person to help you execute. And the longer that takes, the easier it is to lose momentum. That's where today's sponsor Upwork can help. Upwork gives businesses fast access to highly skilled freelance professionals across areas like marketing, design, software development, AI,

• 14:27Matt Abrahams?

  and business operations. And with Business Plus, you can access the top 1% of talent on Upwork. AI-powered shortlisting gives you a curated list of freelancers matched to your goals in under six hours. So you can spend less time searching for the right person and more time actually moving the work forward. Visit upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That's upwork.com to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's U.P.W.O.R.K. dot com. Upwork.com.

• 15:01Speaker 02

  The last question I'd like to ask is, who is a storyteller that you admire and why? You've already mentioned one, but I'm wondering if there's another that you admire.

• 15:09Speaker 01

  Matthew Dix is an award-winning mock storyteller. And his definition of three elements that a story has to have is stakes, suspense, and surprise. And I figured that's something that would be good for folks listening to just keep that in mind. If your story is that you went to the drive-thru and ordered a grilled chicken sandwich, there are no stakes involved there. So you're going to lose your audience. There's nothing in peril. There's nothing that you could lose or win as a result. That's not a story because you didn't change from the fact that you were hungry and you're no longer hungry. That's not enough of a stake.

• 15:53Speaker 01

  If the stake is that the principal wanted the chicken sandwich, and if I didn't get it for him in time for her lunch, I would lose my job. That's a stake.

• 16:06Speaker 02

  So there's consequence and significance. And we as storytellers need to make sure that is clear. And what I'm hearing in the work you do is that because you rely on cliche or commonly known knowledge, you will let the reader create the stakes in their own mind. They understand the stakes that are involved.

• 16:23Speaker 01

  Well, here's my other storyteller, Elna Baker. I heard a story she told about how in her life at that time, because she was a religiously observant person, she had to say no to a lot of things. And she was a young woman living in New York. So her credo was that she had to say yes to everything else. And so it takes her on all these adventures, this saying yes to things. And the name of her story is called Black Dress. I think that you know at the outset that she is going to get in trouble because she's going to say yes to everything. And it takes her on these adventures that you just would not expect.

• 17:06Speaker 02

  Okay, last question. How did you come up with and why did you name your comic strip Rhymes with Orange?

• 17:12Speaker 01

  So there are a couple of different answers to this. First is that there is no real word that rhymes with the word orange. The other piece is that when the strip began, I was a 25-year-old woman living in an apartment with three other roommates. And I date women, right? So that was an experience that was absolutely, not my dating life, but just my entire worldview was very different than the ones found on the traditional comics page. And so I felt like the title reflected that the reader was going to get a different take on the world.

• 17:54Speaker 02

  Right. So the titling of a story can set expectations for the experience. So it signaled two things. One, that this is going to be different than all the other titles, which many of them are names for their characters or something. I think there's a lesson there. Many of us have to title our presentations, our meetings, our stories, and think of a title that builds curiosity and incites somebody to want to learn more. And perhaps a title that shares what's to come. And in your case, it was this comic's going to have a slightly different perspective maybe than others. So Hillary, it is always a pleasure to chat with you. Your insights into storytelling are really cool. Thank you so much.

• 18:35Speaker 01

  Thank you for having me. Anytime, Matt.

• 18:39Speaker 02

  Hillary's insights can be used by all of us to be more clear and concise in our communication. I try to employ her ideas in the work that I do. To get more extended content like this, please consider checking out FasterSmarter.io Premium, where you can join our global community and get access to tools and opportunities to further your communication and careers. Be sure to check out FasterSmarter.io/premium. This episode was produced by Jenny Luna, Ryan Campos, and me, Matt Abrahams, with thanks to Podium Podcast Company. Please find us on YouTube and wherever you get your podcasts. Be sure to subscribe and rate us. Also, follow us on LinkedIn and Instagram,

• 19:22Speaker 02

  and check out FasterSmarter.io for deep dive videos, English language learning content, and our newsletter.

• 19:31Matt Abrahams?

  Before we wrap up, I just want to say thank you for listening. It really means a lot to hear how people all over the world are using these ideas in their own lives. It inspires me and the whole team that brings you this show. If you want more episodes and resources, feel free to follow, subscribe, and explore past conversations. We're grateful for your support of Think Fast, Talk Smart.