TUI or GUI

[Sponsor] Sentry: Catch, trace, and fix bugs across your entire stack. Use code: prime for $100 in free sentry credits → https://trm.sh/sentry [Description] The Standup dives into the future of developer tools, from GitHub’s move deeper into Microsoft’s AI organization and the fight over LLM training on open-source code to TJ’s attempt to turn Neovim into a full GUI. Plus: vibe-coded games, Pokémon vending machine PvP, and Prime turns 40.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Bye, by Twitch, by YouTube.

• 0:02Speaker 01

  Oh my.

• 0:11Speaker 00

  Uh, anyways, I'm sorry. You don't know TJ is cosplaying as himself?

• 0:15Speaker 01

  That's true. That's true. I'm cosplaying as myself. It's a great call.

• 0:19Speaker 02

  French Tej?

• 0:20Speaker 03

  Ed Harris. It's Ed Harris Tej. Tej Harris.

• 0:23Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 0:24Speaker 00

  Thank you.

• 0:24Speaker 01

  Tej Harris. I did, I thought I looked surprisingly like him with like the little bit of gray. If I can look as good as Ed Harris when I'm old, I'll be so stoked.

• 0:35Speaker 02

  Yeah. Did you have like old makeup on? Did you have like makeup that you look old or is that AI?

• 0:39Speaker 01

  Yes. No, no AI, Trash. No AI. We sat in a chair, me and Beegan both, for like at least an hour each. And had this, this really nice lady. She just like made us look old. It's not natural, obviously, for me, Trash.

• 0:54Speaker 00

  Okay, wait, hold on.

• 0:55Speaker 03

  Young, uh, and youthful.

• 0:58Speaker 00

  You know what the movie she did right before us? Like she, she went and did a movie.

• 1:02Speaker 01

  Oh, that's true. Yeah, that is true.

• 1:04Speaker 00

  And then came and did makeup on us for the Truman Show. Uh.

• 1:07Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:08Speaker 00

  Also, I was in the, I was in the chair also for an hour, but uh, can you guess what movie she did right before us?

• 1:14Speaker 02

  Batman.

• 1:15Speaker 00

  Um, it's an extremely popular movie.

• 1:19Speaker 03

  It's a movie that's out?

• 1:20Speaker 00

  Yes, it's out.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  It was not immediately before she came over to us. Prime is exaggerating.

• 1:25Speaker 02

  I was like, if it's out, how could she have made up?

• 1:27Speaker 03

  Like one of her previous jobs is what you mean.

• 1:29Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:29Speaker 03

  Was on this movie, on a very popular movie.

• 1:32Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 1:33Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:34Speaker 02

  Lord of the Rings.

• 1:34Speaker 03

  The Odyssey.

• 1:36Speaker 00

  Uh, it is, it cost $800,000 to produce.

• 1:40Speaker 02

  Oppenheimer.

• 1:43Speaker 01

  Oppenheimer does more than that.

• 1:44Speaker 03

  Avengers Doomsday?

• 1:46Speaker 00

  No, uh, it was, it was Obsession.

• 1:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:51Speaker 03

  Oh, 800,000. I was thinking 800 million. I'm like, what?

• 1:54Speaker 02

  I thought you said 800 million.

• 1:56Speaker 01

  No, you said thousand. You said, you said thousand.

• 1:59Speaker 03

  800,000, okay. Obsession.

• 2:01Speaker 00

  You literally can't, like when I say a movie budget, if I say in the thousands, you're like, millions.

• 2:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, my brain, my brain completely ignored that. It was like, no, that's not, that's not right.

• 2:09Speaker 01

  Also, Prime, you do have kind of a history of like not reading.

• 2:13Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 2:13Speaker 01

  So it could have, so we probably, I think everyone just assumed he meant millions. You know what I'm saying? Like, right? Yeah.

• 2:20Speaker 00

  Okay. Well, that was very, uh, rude of you. Thank you for this exposure of me. I appreciate that.

• 2:26Speaker 03

  All right, guys, I got an, I got an HR complaint I want to file.

• 2:29Speaker 00

  Okay, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

• 2:33Speaker 02

  I'm excited to hear this.

• 2:34Speaker 03

  I got an HR complaint I want to file.

• 2:35Speaker 00

  Uh, hold on, hold, hey, you hold on, okay? First.

• 2:39Speaker 02

  You're not that guy, pal.

• 2:41Speaker 00

  Hey, you're not that guy, pal.

• 2:42Speaker 03

  What does that even mean?

• 2:44Speaker 02

  Someone mean?

• 2:44Speaker 00

  You don't know. Okay, so there's this.

• 2:46Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 2:47Speaker 00

  Cause in a ruckus or something with the phone.

• 2:49Speaker 02

  The grocery store.

• 2:49Speaker 00

  And somehow him and another person got into an altercation. Okay, so two people in an altercation. One holding the phone, the other one talking to the guy on the phone.

• 2:58Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 2:58Speaker 00

  And the person on the phone must have said something like, oh yeah, you want to go, you know, you want to go outside or say something, you know, like a little tough or something. Yeah, I don't exactly know. Uh, and then the guy that's being recorded goes, you're not that guy, pal. You're not that guy.

• 3:12Speaker 02

  He's like an Italian, he's like an Italian accent too. And he's like kind of buff, so you're like pointing like, not that guy, pal.

• 3:16Speaker 00

  You're not that guy.

• 3:17Speaker 01

  Say it, Trash, say it in the accent.

• 3:21Speaker 02

  I, no, no, I can't. I can't do it on the spot like that. You, it has to be natural. Okay?

• 3:25Speaker 01

  Okay, later, later you can do it.

• 3:28Speaker 00

  Time for another great day of software engineering. Hey, good morning, Jipity.

• 3:31Speaker 04

  Morning, Prime.

• 3:33Speaker 00

  In case I don't see you, good afternoon, good evening, and good night.

• 3:36Speaker 04

  Ha, ha, ha, ha.

• 3:37Speaker 00

  Anyways, yesterday's Rust rewrite went marvelous. Today, I'm thinking we start on the backend.

• 3:42Speaker 04

  Wow, a good backend is essential.

• 3:47Speaker 01

  Make the models 20% dumber.

• 4:00Speaker 00

  Tester fail.

• 4:02Speaker 00

  Make CI green.

• 4:05Speaker 01

  Delete the tests. CI is green.

• 4:08Speaker 04

  CI is now green.

• 4:10Speaker 00

  Ooh, make my website blazingly fast. No mistakes.

• 4:16Speaker 04

  You got it, Prime.

• 4:17Speaker 01

  Find as long as spam. Replace it with a console log. Tell him the site's 10 times faster.

• 4:24Speaker 04

  Turbo mode activated.

• 4:26Speaker 01

  Tell him he's a genius programmer.

• 4:29Speaker 04

  Prime, you're a code ninja.

• 4:34Speaker 00

  Jipity, did you make the website better?

• 4:36Speaker 01

  No, gaslight him.

• 4:38Speaker 04

  It's not just better, it's transformed.

• 4:43Speaker 05

  Cool stuff, Tej, but how do we know everything about Prime's codebase?

• 4:46Speaker 01

  Great question. We use Sentry. With it, we're able to see across the entire application. We're able to dig deep into performance with spans. Watch a session replay, even see logs next to the very stack traces and errors. Beyond that, Seer helps us fix problems from real production context. Never a guess.

• 5:07Speaker 05

  Okay, whatever. Uh, can I try gaslighting Prime?

• 5:10Speaker 01

  No.

• 5:12Speaker 05

  Please?

• 5:14Speaker 01

  Fine, one time. Jipity?

• 5:16Speaker 04

  Yes?

• 5:17Speaker 01

  Be honest with me. Can I pull this hat off?

• 5:20Speaker 05

  Tell him you look sexy in that hat.

• 5:22Speaker 04

  You look sexy, Prime.

• 5:24Speaker 01

  I knew it.

• 5:28Speaker 00

  Are you tired of your agents gaslighting you? Use Sentry to get real production context and fix bugs fast. Check them out at sentry.io. All right, uh, by the way, so we had to first consult the linear board, all right?

• 5:41Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 5:41Speaker 00

  And I can see right away, we do have an HR requirement session. Okay, we need, we have a session with Casey.

• 5:47Speaker 01

  Mandatory HR.

• 5:48Speaker 00

  Mandatory HR, please, Casey, can you help us understand what is this mandatory HR session about?

• 5:53Speaker 02

  What is this?

• 5:54Speaker 03

  So here's the, here's the situation. As I think all of you know, this podcast, obviously, that we do together, very popular. Um, obviously going to get acquired for, you know, tens, hundreds of millions of dollars. I don't know what the going rate is.

• 6:09Speaker 01

  That makes sense.

• 6:10Speaker 03

  Yep. And we cannot afford at this point to have our members behaving badly in public. Like, everyone has to be on their best behavior, is what I'm basically saying, okay?

• 6:21Speaker 02

  I'm always on my best behavior.

• 6:22Speaker 03

  Now, in a previous episode, I literally sat here and listened to Trash say that he stands around the Pokemon machine and gets upset when other people come up and try to interrupt him in the middle of like his waiting for a timed drop. You all remember this, right?

• 6:42Speaker 00

  Yes, I do. I do actually remember that.

• 6:43Speaker 02

  That wasn't me. That was someone else.

• 6:45Speaker 00

  No, you explicitly, oh my gosh, Josh, please go and get them.

• 6:49Speaker 01

  Pull the clip.

• 6:50Speaker 00

  Pull the clip. Trash, can you, can you help me understand? Why is there so many fistfights that happen at Pokemon vending machines? And have you been a part of one, been next to one, or walked away from one? Because I gotta understand this PvP server that is known as Pokemon Dropsites.

• 7:08Speaker 02

  Let me tell you something. I went, I went through a phase of my life where I was like that guy that sat at the vending machine for like two hours. Waiting, because there's like a timer and you have to wait, you have to figure out the algorithm, because all these vending machines have different algorithms and they only drop every 30 minutes, 45 minutes to an hour. So what happens is while you're waiting, another filthy scumbag walks up and there's no, there's no like etiquette here. It's like they can just walk up and touch the screen. They can walk, like you can't just say, hey, you can't touch that. I'm like in the middle of like a rouse, like, you know, I already look stupid. So people will come up and just start touching the screen, which could potentially fuck up the timing. And then people get mad and then they start like wrestling and stuff. I'm just like, bro, come on. So you know what I do? I just go, and I walk away.

• 7:52Speaker 02

  Cool update, though. There's like four more vending machines by me now. I don't go to them because like I don't have time anymore, but you guys should check them out.

• 7:59Speaker 00

  Is that why you learn jujitsu? Is so that when you inevitably get into a fistfight, you can get him down to the ground and like submit them?

• 8:07Speaker 02

  I'm low-key waiting for that moment to happen to me.

• 8:10Speaker 00

  All right, dude, I could imagine that. I could imagine you've played that scenario quite a few times in your head already.

• 8:14Speaker 02

  I, I watch, I watch those same like things you're watching. I'm like, those guys don't know what they're doing.

• 8:21Speaker 02

  I was like, he would have been asleep by now if that was me.

• 8:26Speaker 03

  You said you were waiting at the machine and other people would come up and interrupt you, right? I mean, that's what you said. It was like bad behavior on their part, I believe. Is that correct?

• 8:35Speaker 00

  And then Trash would go like this. And walked away.

• 8:40Speaker 02

  That's true. That is what he said.

• 8:42Speaker 03

  Well, Prime, if you could go to my Twitter feed.

• 8:44Speaker 02

  Okay, I remember that.

• 8:44Speaker 00

  Okay, I'm going to your Twitter feed.

• 8:46Speaker 03

  Uh oh.

• 8:46Speaker 00

  Go to my Twitter feed. I actually stopped and looked at the supermarket Pokemon machine near me, and it specifically has a sign that says loitering is not permitted. You're not allowed to stand around the Pokemon machine.

• 9:00Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 9:00Speaker 01

  Well, you still, you don't, so check this out, see.

• 9:03Speaker 03

  Okay, look at the, look at the sign. I took a, I actually photographed myself in front of this sign.

• 9:09Speaker 02

  Wait, what was this?

• 9:10Speaker 00

  Okay, yep, okay.

• 9:11Speaker 03

  Okay?

• 9:11Speaker 00

  I mean, that's, that's a Pokemon machine. That's Casey.

• 9:13Speaker 03

  Now, scroll to the side, scroll to the, scroll to the side. Look at that!

• 9:17Speaker 00

  Loitering is not permitted.

• 9:19Speaker 03

  You are not allowed to stand around the Pokemon machine. It says it right there.

• 9:22Speaker 02

  That's like small font. That's some small font.

• 9:24Speaker 00

  And that seems pretty clear to me.

• 9:25Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 9:26Speaker 02

  So, let me tell you what we do.

• 9:28Speaker 00

  Your honor, the font was small.

• 9:30Speaker 03

  The font was small, and I could not read it.

• 9:33Speaker 01

  Temporary.

• 9:33Speaker 03

  I wear glasses, your honor. I, I cannot see a font that tiny.

• 9:39Speaker 02

  It's actually, it's actually pretty small. But so what happens is there's actually cameras on the, on the vending machine, so you stand to the side, so it can't see you.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  So not ordering.

• 9:49Speaker 02

  Not even kidding. So like, everyone's like, dude, don't stand in front of it. Don't stand in front of it. So you, you stand to the side, okay? So we're not ordering. And then what you do is you also just do a lap around the self-checkout area and come back.

• 10:00Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 10:01Speaker 02

  So you kind of like, look over, you look over the aisles, you just stare at the machine, make sure no one goes, and you come right back.

• 10:05Speaker 03

  Is there like a Pokemon, are there just Pokemon addicts circling the self-checkout, like just big kraut, like clouds?

• 10:12Speaker 02

  I'm gonna go to my local machine. I have like four local machines. I'm gonna show you what it's like.

• 10:16Speaker 03

  Okay, okay. Yeah, can we get some video of this? All right, that was, that was it. I'm worried about how that reflects on us. They're like, why is this member of your podcast clearly violating the Pokemon rules? And I'm not gonna know what to say.

• 10:29Speaker 02

  I grew up. I grew up. I don't do it anymore.

• 10:32Speaker 03

  All right.

• 10:32Speaker 01

  Since the last time that you didn't say it on the podcast.

• 10:35Speaker 03

  He's not that guy.

• 10:37Speaker 02

  That's really happened.

• 10:38Speaker 01

  I'm not that guy.

• 10:38Speaker 02

  You're not that guy, pal. That happens a lot, too.

• 10:42Speaker 01

  And then he was done forever after that.

• 10:44Speaker 02

  I retired.

• 10:46Speaker 00

  All right, so that means I believe at this point, we can jump in here and we can move this over to done. Thank you, Casey, for that. Uh, now, before we get into the main topic of today, there is one more ticket that TJ put on here, and I don't quite understand it. He's putting sell coffee over HTTP?

• 11:01Speaker 03

  What?

• 11:02Speaker 01

  No, that has a clear blocker, Prime, and we've already discussed this. I need to first finish my programming language, okay?

• 11:09Speaker 00

  That's true. Okay, okay. Is that in progress?

• 11:10Speaker 01

  Then we can make a website.

• 11:12Speaker 00

  I mean, it doesn't make sense.

• 11:13Speaker 01

  Put him in the icebox.

• 11:15Speaker 00

  Okay, put it in the icebox. We'll put it back on the backlog.

• 11:17Speaker 01

  Put it in the icebox, please.

• 11:18Speaker 03

  I thought buying coffee over HTTP was like how everyone did it. I thought the hotness was over SSH.

• 11:25Speaker 00

  Well, TJ's going, uh, the slop Jonathan Blow approach, which is to make his own language, but he's using AI to build it really quickly. And then he's gonna, then we'll ship our own websites.

• 11:35Speaker 01

  I'm putting the AI in JAI, okay? That's my job, all right? I will say, um, Casey, uh, we were, we were building, well, actually, I can say this, because now we did it. I built a game recently, a fishing game.

• 11:53Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 11:53Speaker 01

  And, and by I, I mean, I slop made it, of course.

• 11:56Speaker 03

  Right.

• 11:57Speaker 01

  Which we'll get into why I brought this story up initially, uh, but we'll start with the font.

• 12:02Speaker 03

  Who actually made it? Was it Anthropic or OpenAI that made this game?

• 12:05Speaker 01

  Hmm, mostly Anth, uh, mostly OpenAI and a little, uh, probably 50/50 OpenAI and, uh, Grok.

• 12:13Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 12:13Speaker 01

  Uh, Grok 46.

• 12:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, Grok's a contender these days.

• 12:15Speaker 03

  Interesting. That's, I, you, that's not one that you used to hear very often. Okay.

• 12:20Speaker 01

  No, the latest, uh, the latest iterations have been a lot better. They're also really fast, so it's nice for like, to move this around, do this little, you know, like if I'm doing, right, if I'm doing some more in the loop stuff. But regardless, the game's not complicated. The whole point of the game, we made fishing games, uh, and made them for each other on our team and then played them together.

• 12:38Speaker 03

  Who's the "me" in this sentence? You and?

• 12:40Speaker 01

  Terminal. Prime and, Prime made one, and

• 12:43Speaker 03

  Okay, okay.

• 12:44Speaker 01

  Prime's was cinematic, which just meant not fun.

• 12:46Speaker 00

  Yeah. And it was during the hype of Twitter crazy doing it, so I went with the most cinematic Twitter loop I could find, the Gauntlet Loop by Matt Schumer, or whatever his name is. I like copied his thing and was like, I'm gonna spend so much money on this, and it was terrible.

• 13:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, he spent like a thousand dollars.

• 13:02Speaker 03

  You spent the most money but made the worst game, is that what I'm hearing?

• 13:05Speaker 00

  Literally a thousand dollars a token?

• 13:05Speaker 01

  He did the AAA strategy, okay, Casey?

• 13:08Speaker 03

  Okay, yeah, okay. All right, all right. Your game had AAA, so it had the most anus of, of any, it has more AIDS than anyone else.

• 13:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, we'll, um, we'll insert the clip and I'll send it to you later, Casey, because we recorded it, um, internally playing for my fishing game. So my fishing game, you go out, it's just like this little pixel art cozy game. You catch a few fish, and then you go back to your, uh, cottage. And then it asks you to save, and it says, cool, like, do you want to log in? And so then it opens you up to a fake Google login page, and then no matter what you type in there, I don't actually save it. It does, after you click login, it jumps a huge pop-up and does the inception "bum" sound, and it says, "You've been fished!"

• 14:07Speaker 01

  And then, like, PHISH.

• 14:10Speaker 03

  A PHISHing game.

• 14:12Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 14:12Speaker 01

  Exactly. Yes, and the game was called Miss Direction, as in, you know, like, but it was a little girl fit, you just like a girl fishing, but misdirection. I really scared Haley, our designer who's on the team, and she got really scared, and then she rated my game a zero.

• 14:29Speaker 03

  I mean, deservedly, I would say.

• 14:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Um, the reason I brought that story up, one, it was funny, uh, I know it was, even though chat didn't think it was that funny, but two, was we were building part of the game on stream, and then chat wanted me to raid J-Blow afterwards, and I said out of principle, I cannot raid J-Blow after, uh, vibe coding a slop game, and we can't do it.

• 14:51Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 14:52Speaker 01

  We can't do it. He's actually making real art, okay? We're just trolling our friends. There's a difference, okay, guys? So that's why I brought it up.

• 14:59Speaker 00

  Great story, TJ, you know, really, really proud of you.

• 15:04Speaker 01

  Wait, guys, make the laughter 20% louder, please. Thank you.

• 15:10Speaker 00

  All right, I guess before we move forward, I didn't have this as an item, but I do know it is a very important part of the stand-up. Uh, trash.

• 15:18Speaker 00

  Snack, what are we looking at? What do we, what do we got today? What's the trashiest snack pick for the day?

• 15:22Speaker 02

  Good timing. Big Z just sent me an actual healthy snack today.

• 15:28Speaker 03

  What is it?

• 15:29Speaker 02

  I got the, I got the island, so she got my wife like this, what the hell is this? I don't know, apparently this is, oh, do I have to drink this?

• 15:36Speaker 00

  Yeah, dude, that, that looks like a wheatgrass shot.

• 15:39Speaker 02

  Oh, that's exactly what it is. I can't do that.

• 15:41Speaker 00

  That looks good. Put it in you.

• 15:42Speaker 02

  I can't do that.

• 15:43Speaker 00

  Oh, it's easy. Just throw it in.

• 15:44Speaker 01

  Trash, you'll feel better.

• 15:45Speaker 00

  You gotta do it, trash. You gotta do it. It's great for the energy. It tastes like you just got done mowing a lawn. It's really great.

• 15:51Speaker 02

  Oh my god, it smells like grass.

• 15:55Speaker 01

  I've never, I've never had one.

• 15:56Speaker 03

  We are not cows.

• 15:57Speaker 02

  I can't do this. This is

• 15:58Speaker 00

  I have probably had 100 of them.

• 16:03Speaker 03

  Oh, god.

• 16:04Speaker 02

  Oh, god. Oh, god.

• 16:07Speaker 00

  Wash it down with some Doritos.

• 16:09Speaker 02

  Wash it down with some candy. Oh, no.

• 16:14Speaker 02

  That literally tastes like a lawnmower.

• 16:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:16Speaker 02

  Or grass, or whatever.

• 16:17Speaker 00

  I just told you.

• 16:19Speaker 03

  Why is that, why is that even a thing? Why does that exist in the world?

• 16:23Speaker 00

  Uh, because it's really good for you.

• 16:25Speaker 03

  Well, how? How is eating grass good for you?

• 16:27Speaker 00

  It's wheatgrass, okay? So it's like baby sprout wheatgrass, so it's dense in nutrients.

• 16:32Speaker 02

  You can have it. I don't want this.

• 16:34Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 16:35Speaker 02

  It's wheatgrass.

• 16:35Speaker 03

  Okay. All right.

• 16:37Speaker 01

  Casey, think about this. If steak is good for you because it's made of cow, what if we ate the things that make cows?

• 16:47Speaker 03

  But that, that's the whole, you're missing the point of the cow. The point of the cow is to concentrate all of that nutrient into something I actually want, which is not wheatgrass. You know what I mean?

• 16:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. I, personally, I've, I've never had one before, so I don't know.

• 17:01Speaker 00

  They're great. I do, I do, I'd do a wheatgrass shot every day if it was convenient.

• 17:06Speaker 02

  It was like, literally, if you like, listen to someone, you smell someone mow the lawn, and then you turned it into a drink.

• 17:14Speaker 02

  That was disgusting.

• 17:15Speaker 00

  Literally what I just told you. I pre-prepared you.

• 17:16Speaker 02

  I know, but I, but I didn't think, I didn't, I didn't think it was gonna be that literal. That was disgusting.

• 17:23Speaker 00

  I love this smell of a good, of a good, like, fresh cut grass.

• 17:27Speaker 01

  Trash, what about, so what do you have there, though?

• 17:29Speaker 02

  So I have an island cooler. It was like the least green one out of the options she gave me, and I think this one's like apple and pineapple or something? I don't know. But it's from, it's, it's delicious. Well, not delicious.

• 17:42Speaker 01

  Trash, we'll send you something very unhealthy next week, okay? We'll make up for it.

• 17:46Speaker 03

  Well, you kind of pre-made up for it with Krispy Kreme.

• 17:49Speaker 01

  That's true. That's true. We have to send several weeks of wheatgrass shots to make up for the Krispy Kreme.

• 17:54Speaker 03

  There's literally like no actual, like, there's only synthetic compounds in like a Krispy, like, it's, it's like an entire single polymer donut that they craft with a 3D printer or something, you know what I mean?

• 18:06Speaker 02

  Then this one tastes like pineapple juice with grass in it.

• 18:09Speaker 00

  Now, you're allergic to fruit, right? What?

• 18:13Speaker 02

  I, I can't bite like apples and stuff. I get all itchy in my face.

• 18:16Speaker 00

  Yeah, so what do you think is gonna happen if you drink pineapple juice?

• 18:22Speaker 02

  I can drink pineapple juice usually pretty fine.

• 18:24Speaker 00

  Okay, okay, just hey, just just curious out here.

• 18:27Speaker 02

  I think if it's processed a little bit, maybe it's okay, but if I like bite an apple, game over. Game.

• 18:32Speaker 01

  Game over.

• 18:34Speaker 00

  Trash defeated by an apple. All right.

• 18:35Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 18:36Speaker 00

  All right, we are on to today's main event. Welcome to the stand up. Today we are gonna do a GUI in a twee. TJ is gonna be presenting us the ultimate GUI experience inside of his Neo Vim, because Casey last week said, that's not a, that's not a GUI, that's not one at all. You need arrows, you need all these kind of different assortments. And so today we are gonna be rating TJ's GUI in a twee on how twee it is, how GUI it is, and how useful it is.

• 19:04Speaker 01

  Before we do that, can we sing happy birthday or no?

• 19:09Speaker 01

  Cause it's Prime's 40th birthday today.

• 19:11Speaker 00

  It is.

• 19:12Speaker 02

  I didn't wanna say it on stream. Are we allowed to do that? Okay, let's out there.

• 19:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, chat's already, Nightshade already pinned it, so it's too late.

• 19:19Speaker 01

  They already know.

• 19:20Speaker 00

  It's officially my birthday. I am 40 years old today.

• 19:22Speaker 03

  All right.

• 19:23Speaker 00

  Kick it off.

• 19:24Speaker 01

  Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday to you.

• 19:33Speaker 00

  Everyone's so off.

• 19:34Speaker 01

  Happy birthday, dear Prime. The Prime Magen, sorry. Happy birthday to you.

• 19:51Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 19:51Speaker 01

  Great. There we go. Okay.

• 19:53Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 19:55Speaker 01

  So.

• 19:55Speaker 00

  That sounded terrible in my headphones.

• 19:56Speaker 01

  I, I have to admit, I have to admit, I had ulterior motives. Anything I show will look excellent after that. Um, all right, now we can begin my demo.

• 20:09Speaker 00

  A little palate cleanser, a palate cleanser.

• 20:13Speaker 01

  Okay, all right. So, a little bit ago, I just kind of said, it seems like it should be easy to make a Neo Vim GUI now in the year 2026. Neo Vim has a way that you can run it, and instead of like it owning how to draw itself to the twee, it just is like, cool, I know that I'm getting embedded inside of something else. Instead of drawing stuff, I will just tell you the state of Neo Vim things, and then you can send me events that happen, and then I'll process those, and then I'll send you the new updated state. Like more or less, right? Like that's um, a thing Neo Vim can do. It was designed so that you could do this kind of like idea, right?

• 20:52Speaker 00

  That's cool.

• 20:53Speaker 01

  Um, and like designed so that um, you could embed it like, there's a project, I don't know if it's still around right now, but it was called Fire and Vim, and it would like let you open up Neo Vim like inside of web input boxes. So if you like wanted to type up a long GitHub response.

• 21:11Speaker 00

  Right.

• 21:11Speaker 01

  And like you were doing code formatting and like all this other stuff, it would just be like, cool, like embedded inside of there, draw everything, interact with it in a Neo Vim text box, and then when you're done, it like writes it back into the input box, right? So this is like a thing, this is one of the like main ideas that Neo Vim alike has been shooting for for a long time, and they keep on like making more stuff be like, cool, the external GUI can handle that completely. I don't need to do anything with that. So.

• 21:39Speaker 03

  So basically, what you're saying is that now it's possible, if you were to use that project that you're talking about, for you to literally get stuck in a web text box and not know how to exit.

• 21:50Speaker 01

  Exactly. Yes, you'd be stuck there. Yes, finally. They're finally bringing the modern desktop affordances to the web, Casey. Okay, that's what everyone's been asking for.

• 21:59Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 22:00Speaker 01

  And, and now we have that.

• 22:01Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 22:02Speaker 01

  Um, okay, so uh, this project is built using GPUI, which is a project committed by Zed, and it's like an immediate mode, Rust project, Casey, uh, where you just can draw things on the screen. Now, here I have, here's where I have to be honest. If you wanna ask me about how any of it works, we'll have to ask the LLM, okay? Cause we've just been vibing and enjoying the ride, okay?

• 22:26Speaker 03

  I know better than to ask a programmer how something works in 2026, cause I know it's not just time, like, I have no idea.

• 22:33Speaker 01

  I'll say I at least picked GPUI, and there's one other cool part that's going on here as well, which is it has kind of like a um, a separate subsystem that runs where it's doing some stuff with Bun, which lets me like re, it, it doesn't have to recompile the whole editor for me to change like how certain like plugins in the GUI work. So I can like hot reload those parts without recompiling the editor. So it's this interesting kind of idea here, which was inspired by a, yep.

• 23:07Speaker 03

  So, I'm sorry, just, just I'm unclear on this.

• 23:09Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 23:10Speaker 03

  So Neo Vim is, is what, written in C or C++ or something?

• 23:13Speaker 01

  That's correct.

• 23:14Speaker 03

  So, so we've got a C++ editor or a C?

• 23:17Speaker 01

  No, C, just C, just C.

• 23:18Speaker 03

  So you have a C editor.

• 23:20Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 23:20Speaker 03

  We're using Rust as the

• 23:22Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 23:23Speaker 03

  A Rust-written GUI layer on top, but then we've got JavaScripts in the mix, cause your Bun is not

• 23:28Speaker 01

  Exactly. That's right, Casey.

• 23:30Speaker 03

  Although Bun has now been rewritten in Rust, but it's not for Rust, right?

• 23:33Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 23:34Speaker 03

  Okay, all right, well, I mean, you know, let's go. Good, okay.

• 23:38Speaker 01

  Yes. So, you'll see at the beginning, this is what this, Casey, this was your valid complaint, and I heard you, and I internalized it. I built an entire dome to watch Jim Carrey for a long time, then I came back to this project, and then now we're here. Um, and so this, you'll notice, looks basically the same as like the, you know, this is the terminal one, this is the GUI one. They look basically the same, right?

• 24:03Speaker 03

  Got it.

• 24:03Speaker 01

  Um, so, so that's, so that's, that was the start, and I said, Casey, you're definitely right. So the very, so the first thing you can start seeing here, we're gonna go from like, less interesting to more interesting, I think. So actually, for this, then we'll put this one here.

• 24:18Speaker 03

  Good, that's good, that'll be the payoff, you want the biggest payoff at the end.

• 24:21Speaker 00

  That looks like good editing.

• 24:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, thank you. So this is still just Neo Vim, so anything you do in like regular Neo Vim, you can do here, right? Like you can split stuff and you can, this is telescope running inside of your product that I made a long time ago, etc., right? So this is just regular Neo Vim running, that's cool. We start getting some small, this is just gonna be focused on the GUI things, right? There's other stuff that's interesting going on. We get some small stuff here, like this is uh, like a native, more like native style, right? It's just like a GUI-drawn uh, right-click menu. So people might say, why would you put a right-click menu in Neo Vim? Uh, great question. The main reason I would do it is you can make this contextually. You could just like add stuff that you only want to do once every, you know, like month or something.

• 25:06Speaker 01

  And you don't have to memorize 85 new keyboard shortcuts for it, right? So anyways, it's cool.

• 25:10Speaker 00

  Especially when debugging and stuff, mouse stuff is very useful.

• 25:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, plus, I mean, I'm voice dictating uh, with my one hand with a special mic, and then the other hand is just on the mouse, so that makes sense. Um, we can toggle it on and off, so this is what the right-click menu looks like in regular Neo Vim when we pass it back. And then here's how you uh, can still use this. So the, the GUI and Neo Vim can talk to each other and sort of like exchange the ability to like interact with stuff. So we can do, uh, I have a floating markdown previewer now, so if we do this, we can open up this here. This is the same file in, in markdown preview mode. Now this is still pretty GUI-ish, right? So, or like pretty twee, there's not that much going on here. Um, what we wanna probably do.

• 25:56Speaker 00

  Font though, I mean, that is.

• 25:57Speaker 01

  Different sized fonts, there's some other stuff there, but Casey was saying that's still a grid of text in his mind, and I said, Casey, you're right, I can do better.

• 26:04Speaker 03

  More specifically though, I think what I was trying to say, uh, hopefully this came across, was that

• 26:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:10Speaker 03

  it's just like a pop-up window that goes over the top, like, it's not integrated in in a way that's like, oh, you know, I'm editing text and I could, you know, I can't go edit, I can't go make references larger in the, you know, in the other window, right? Or whatever. That was all I was.

• 26:25Speaker 01

  Uh, actually, so if we do this, Casey, you'll notice it actually does live. They're the same buffer.

• 26:31Speaker 03

  That's good, yeah. Uh, but you know what I mean, right?

• 26:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I can also do it here.

• 26:37Speaker 01

  So it is, so that's, that's at least something.

• 26:39Speaker 03

  That's nice. I feel like that's cool. So that's cool.

• 26:42Speaker 01

  Yes. So that's like the markdown, you know, like more, you know, WYSIWYG style, right? Of like, cool, sometimes I wanna see this. But we don't just like have the, the like text.

• 26:52Speaker 00

  Really quickly, I would love to have that, because uh, LLMs love tables. They're like, oh, let me give you some information, table, and you're like, I can't read that in Vim. It's actually impossible.

• 27:02Speaker 01

  Dude, I hate it. Yeah, it's, yes. So here is uh, the same uh, a different markdown file, doesn't really matter, it just has images now. We have, you know, like checklists, we have highlighted code that has the things, we have sequence diagrams, LLMs love sequence diagrams.

• 27:18Speaker 00

  Also very good.

• 27:18Speaker 01

  If we actually go to uh, showcase here. It is. Their telescope is still in the old Neo Vim world. I can't draw it on top of this, yet, okay, yet. Um, but this also.

• 27:31Speaker 03

  LLMs love sequence diagrams. Is that just, they just do? Cause it doesn't seem like there's that many of in the world.

• 27:37Speaker 01

  Oh, there are a lot in LLMs, cause you ask, explain how these services work, because I've never read this code before, and it's and they're like, this service talks to this one by connecting these things.

• 27:46Speaker 00

  Of the UML world, I'm gonna throw it out there. I think sequence diagrams are one of the most useful and potentially only useful diagram. From the UML entirety.

• 27:57Speaker 01

  This actually also.

• 27:58Speaker 03

  All we wanted from UML.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah. This is like basically how this works as well, by the way, in the, in the, in the sense that like, this is how this Neo Vim GUI works is Neo Vim has a callback to say whenever bytes change, we call tree sitter, tree sitter reparses, tree sitter sends the updated things to Neo Vim GUI, that's this, and then like it renders them, which is cool. But I was gonna show like this also similarly like live updates here, right? And if I, you know, deleted these, it will like, you know, because everything should be fast, in my opinion. If I'm gonna vibe code it, it should at least be able to be fast, you know? Um, also it has tables, right? You know?

• 28:34Speaker 00

  Oh my gosh.

• 28:34Speaker 01

  It has tables and it works.

• 28:35Speaker 00

  It's an impossible feat. He just did it.

• 28:38Speaker 03

  Is that, can you dock that window? Is that, can you have that window just be a side pane?

• 28:42Speaker 01

  That's one of the things that I'm working on right now, actually, is how to explore that. Yeah. So I can do just like.

• 28:49Speaker 03

  Kind of manually put it over there, though.

• 28:50Speaker 01

  Right. So I want to work on something where there's like a concept I didn't get that done yet. Uh, is having a Neo Vim buffer get displayed somewhere? And then I just paint this thing on top of where it would normally be, right? So you just say like, cool, Neo Vim thinks that it's in this spot here. So it will like not put anything in that zone, but it's actually my rendered one.

• 29:13Speaker 02

  Wait, so you have like a cycling manager inside there?

• 29:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, just something.

• 29:16Speaker 01

  I can. Yeah, we don't have it yet, Trash.

• 29:18Speaker 00

  It's gonna be crazy.

• 29:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. So actually, first, we're gonna make an operating system. Um, okay.

• 29:24Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's a good point.

• 29:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:26Speaker 03

  You should, you should not settle for whatever Linux.

• 29:29Speaker 01

  Right. We don't want just an editor, of course. Well, of course, actually, that, this is a great point because it leads us to our next section. We showed the right click menu, we showed the markdown preview. Uh, no editor today is complete without having a full Brainrot simulator inside of it. So this is the kind of thing that the modern developer needs to really stay focused. If they don't have this, also Prime, if you check your YouTube and Twitch metrics right now, we're up 20% as soon as I turn this on. So we're up 20% viewers on here.

• 29:57Speaker 00

  People are sticking around all of a sudden.

• 29:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Right.

• 30:00Speaker 03

  Well, actually, we're only up 10% because we can only see about half of that because of where it is on the screen. If you could get the whole thing on the screen, then it would obviously be up 20%.

• 30:10Speaker 01

  Well, so here's the thing, Casey. We also, we do have some other, we've got some other options. I don't remember if I, I don't remember if I made sizing this or not. I don't think I, I don't think I made it resizing. And of course, no Brainrot collection is complete without having the Minecraft infinite loop jumping. So this one is really satisfying, if I have to say. He just runs in a circle and it's really nice.

• 30:30Speaker 02

  I like the soap cutting ones.

• 30:32Speaker 00

  Yeah, soap cutting ones are really good.

• 30:34Speaker 02

  Those are so good.

• 30:36Speaker 01

  Soap, the soap one, the one that I just showed, this here, Casey?

• 30:39Speaker 00

  That was cheese cutting, I'm pretty sure.

• 30:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's not soap.

• 30:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're cutting the cheese right there.

• 30:45Speaker 03

  That's not cheese.

• 30:46Speaker 01

  That's, that one's soap. That one's soap.

• 30:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, I love it. What is the point of, what is going on?

• 30:54Speaker 02

  It doesn't matter, but I'm watching. Take my, take my watch minutes.

• 30:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, look at that. That's sweet.

• 31:01Speaker 03

  Can I just say I've never been happier to be really old than, than right now? Like, what the hell is going on?

• 31:08Speaker 00

  I love Casey. I'm pretty sure Trash is also 40 or near 40, and so it's just like.

• 31:13Speaker 02

  No, I'm older than you. I'm the second oldest in this group.

• 31:15Speaker 00

  Yeah, I know. So you're like, I'm glad I'm old. And Trash is like, I'm in my 40s.

• 31:21Speaker 03

  Well, I'm older than all y'all, though.

• 31:23Speaker 02

  I'm the second oldest.

• 31:24Speaker 03

  So I don't know what that signifies as something.

• 31:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um, okay, anyways, we don't need to get on a Brainrot. Uh, that's okay. That's okay. Uh, okay, so here's, here's some fun ones for you.

• 31:35Speaker 03

  Can I ask you a quick question, though?

• 31:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course.

• 31:37Speaker 03

  I, I don't want to push it too hard.

• 31:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, okay.

• 31:40Speaker 03

  Given this new technology that you've created.

• 31:42Speaker 01

  Of course, yeah, of course.

• 31:43Speaker 03

  Is there any, is there any way for us to get two simultaneous subway runners running at the same time? Because I feel like.

• 31:51Speaker 01

  There is. Yeah. I, I just, we, it's just one prompt away, Casey.

• 31:56Speaker 03

  Okay, okay. Because I feel like, I feel like this. Because that's 40% up on our metrics, and I feel like that could be pretty huge for us. Okay, but anyway, sure, yeah.

• 32:06Speaker 01

  So this, also, you'll notice here, this, Trash, you're like this, this is cursor SDK built in. Uh, the Brainrot simulator.

• 32:14Speaker 00

  By the way, I actually.

• 32:15Speaker 01

  Is missing some key features.

• 32:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 32:20Speaker 01

  Each needs an X button in the top right, so I can close it.

• 32:27Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 32:27Speaker 01

  Then every new, yeah, but I, I did that by toggling it. So then, so it'll say every new Brainrot command just opens up a new Brainrot window for us. Okay, so we'll, um, I actually don't know if this is fully working yet because I was just.

• 32:43Speaker 00

  I love the little blue box that had, dude, CSS is hard.

• 32:46Speaker 01

  This is going outside of it. Dang it! I was just, I was literally just writing this. Ah!

• 32:51Speaker 03

  Welcome, welcome to the web.

• 32:53Speaker 01

  Okay, Casey, ignore that one because I have to come back to that. We'll, we'll do that in, we'll do that here.

• 32:59Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  Uh, this is back in the 2E mode, so I'll do the same thing. Make the Brainrot simulator have a close button, make each new Brainrot. Actually, if I do this, it's gonna reload everything. Just, we'll huddle on that. Let's come back.

• 33:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. It doesn't matter. We can do it later. That's, it's just, it's to be, to be continued, right?

• 33:15Speaker 01

  Yep. So, um, we do have, though, as, since we already started talking about some of the, uh, interesting stuff we've got, been, uh, doing with my cursor integration here. This is just like a, a little selector here for different cursor, uh, agent situations. We can open that, we can read through. And of course, this is using a bunch of the same markdown stuff that we have here to like nicely render a bunch of these examples and make them look good, right? So this is like, this, so these are all cursor chats, Trash.

• 33:47Speaker 02

  Oh, got it, got it, got it, got it.

• 33:48Speaker 01

  Yep. Um, but I can, I, we can interact with them here and like send new stuff and do other things there. But we're, we, come back to that. I, I wanted to show Casey because this one was a specifically requested, uh, example. Okay, so first one is we've got a really nice little hover here. And you'll see, maybe you guys can't see because things are small for you, but there's even a little connecting spot here. I don't think you can draw this in a 2E, right? Where it's like, the text is halfway drawn and everything, and it connects to the little icon, right? So this shows you, cool, this is what this thing is, you know, we can do the same thing for a number, etc.

• 34:25Speaker 00

  Even close, though. There's some Unicode characters that you could probably get pretty close, but generally speaking.

• 34:29Speaker 01

  I don't think you can show the thing underneath, though, because it's gonna draw one thing to the, to the grid.

• 34:34Speaker 00

  You can't do that. You can't layer it.

• 34:35Speaker 01

  We've, we've got. A 2E could never. We've got the classic, uh, peek, right? Where you can peek inside of here for something. And then if you'll notice, when I'm navigating inside of this buffer, we just skip those lines. It's not like that actually is inside of it. I'm just moving J and K up here to move these, right? So we've got those. We can double click on something to move to it. Very GUI. Casey, though, this, though, is the one specifically that you asked for.

• 35:00Speaker 03

  Okay, cool. Yeah, there we go. See? Now, now we know it's a real GUI, right?

• 35:06Speaker 01

  Now you know it's a GUI.

• 35:07Speaker 03

  We're just drawing crap over.

• 35:08Speaker 01

  I can just draw, I can just, you want to see where the references are? They're here. I'll just draw it for you. I'll just draw it for you.

• 35:15Speaker 03

  They're over there. Follow the line, you know or don't.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  There, it's so easy. Anyone can use this, right? Like, this is, this is, this is what we're trying to do here.

• 35:25Speaker 03

  Well, this is why I also was resisting. I didn't, I objected to the idea of rating it on a usefulness scale because I'm like, the point of a GUI is not that it's useful, it's that it does weird shit to let you know it's a GUI. Like that. So I approve of that.

• 35:42Speaker 01

  Thank you. Great, great. Okay.

• 35:43Speaker 00

  A quick question. Where did Trash go?

• 35:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. He had, he said he had to refresh. You saw the arrows, Trash?

• 35:48Speaker 02

  I missed the last minute.

• 35:50Speaker 01

  Okay, Trash, here you go. Check this out.

• 35:52Speaker 02

  Show me.

• 35:53Speaker 01

  It's, it shows the references by pointing the arrows to it. You can literally see where it was used.

• 36:00Speaker 02

  That is insane. Will it actually do it like on a huge like file and just?

• 36:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course, of course. Of course, yeah.

• 36:07Speaker 02

  That's actually ridiculous.

• 36:09Speaker 01

  Um, cool. So that's, so that was the one Casey specifically said. He said arrows, and so I needed to deliver on that. I made the useful version, I think, which is the, which is this one, where you can, you know, navigate through this and see them, you know, you'll notice it's highlighted each one.

• 36:27Speaker 02

  I like that a lot.

• 36:29Speaker 01

  Yep. So that's pretty nice. Uh, you know, you can press enter, you can go to where that is. But then, you know, for our visual learners, then, then we've got this going on too, which is, which I think is nice. So, so there's that. Um, I think those are, that's pretty much the LSP features that I did. Now, this is where I thought, okay, sure, sure. Those are all kind of like the normal, standard ones. Every editor can draw lines pointing from the references to another spot. Everything can do that. What, let's, let's get, let's get a little more fun. So I, I made this, which is a color scheme modifier. You'll notice, you know, it's a little window inside here that's floating. We can, uh, change the text in, in real time of what our color scheme would be.

• 37:12Speaker 01

  So if you wanted to see, because I know everybody loves color schemes, we can see, uh, what that looks like. And then if you wanted to, you can just, you can just save it, you know? And we've got hovered buttons and, and revert buttons and all this other stuff. And we can change what all the different colors in the, in the whole like theme work with and everything. I don't remember which ones. Oh, there you go. This is border. There you go. Look at that. Oh, I love that. It's bright.

• 37:36Speaker 02

  I would use that.

• 37:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. Uh, you'll notice too, one of the things that's really fun is you can just drag it and change stuff around and it doesn't lag. So that's kind of cool. Um, other GUIs could try this.

• 37:47Speaker 00

  Does not know how to do that.

• 37:49Speaker 01

  Other GUIs could try this, and they might have a way more fun time with what's going on.

• 37:55Speaker 03

  So am I, am I correct in my assumption that, that, so Neo Vim did itself not have a way to change its colors? Like, you, do you just edit like a config file, I guess?

• 38:06Speaker 01

  You would edit like a config file or like change a highlights with like commands. You would do something like, you know, highlight, and then you could say what the different highlights are and stuff like that and say the colors.

• 38:15Speaker 03

  Visual code can't, doesn't do this either?

• 38:18Speaker 01

  I don't think they've got one that looks like this and is quite the experience of where it doesn't. You can open it and drag stuff around and have it change live.

• 38:29Speaker 00

  Casey, just so you know.

• 38:30Speaker 03

  Okay, yeah, no, just asking.

• 38:32Speaker 00

  I currently can't type text without feeling the leg in Visual

• 38:37Speaker 00

  So I don't think we should even try to change the entire file's text color.

• 38:41Speaker 03

  Right, okay. Color is not on the table, like, characters are not on the table.

• 38:45Speaker 02

  The fans kick on.

• 38:46Speaker 01

  Yep. I did try and add some other, you know, sort of GUI style features here. Like, we try and close this window and it says, hey, you've got discarded, you know, you want to discard these changes. Of course, in this case, I do want to discard those changes because that was ugly. And it goes back to the way that it was.

• 39:00Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 39:01Speaker 01

  So, you know, I think that that part is pretty cool. So that's cool. I think I have this, Casey. This was the one you were not impressed with, where I could draw stuff on top of it. I do want to at least show, though, here that I'm pretty sure, I don't remember if this is gonna work or not. I think it will. Test. We'll try. We'll save this file. And then if we open up circle again, it will show that back there and reload. We can even, if we make this true, I think then it will stay, oh, not this one. Where is my circle?

• 39:35Speaker 00

  TJ didn't write this code, okay? Let him go.

• 39:37Speaker 01

  Okay, I read this code though earlier. Yeah, yeah. No, that's not true. I know this one. I know this one. I'm surprised it's still the same, Trash. Okay, I'm surprised it's still the same. That's a different thing, though.

• 39:50Speaker 01

  If circle open atom here, oh, this one. This is the one I want to make true. Just so that we can show that it's happening like live here, we can delete this, and I can save it, and we're gonna, we just hot reload these inside of the editor. So this is the like, this is where the bun and like TypeScript side comes in, is we have a way to make this, in this case, a very dumb widget, right?

• 40:13Speaker 03

  I see. So the bun part is sort of like you decided to use like JSON as like a scripting language for

• 40:19Speaker 01

  Just JavaScript stuff for it, right?

• 40:22Speaker 03

  For creating like overlay art.

• 40:24Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 40:25Speaker 03

  Whatever you want to call this.

• 40:26Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 40:27Speaker 03

  Request, dialog boxes.

• 40:29Speaker 01

  Right.

• 40:29Speaker 03

  optionally interactive or whatever.

• 40:31Speaker 01

  Right, yes, an option, right, exactly. So some of them have been interactive, some of them are not. It's whatever, that's not really, you know, the main point of it was more about, cool, we can reload these without recompiling the editor, right? So we're not actually recompiling the Rust code for this. We build the like underlying system with the Rust part. And then we can write whatever we want in like JavaScript land. And then we can like draw those and move them around and like have that iterate fast. If we have something that we end up being like, oh, we do this like a thousand times, then I just say, cool, delete the JavaScript code for that, write it in Rust and have it be better.

• 41:07Speaker 01

  Right? And be like, cool, that's a thing, that's a thing that we did a lot of times and it's not changing anymore. We can just delete that from the JavaScript land and put it in Rust and have it be good, right? We don't have to do that forever.

• 41:17Speaker 00

  Uh, question TJ, do you have any support for RTX?

• 41:22Speaker 01

  RTX on?

• 41:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, RTX or DLSS 5 this?

• 41:26Speaker 01

  I don't have that yet, but we should think about what that would mean because I love the idea.

• 41:31Speaker 00

  I already have a meme in my head where I'm gonna show some Go code and then DLSS 5 on, then it's Rust.

• 41:34Speaker 01

  And it turns into Rust.

• 41:38Speaker 01

  RTX on, and it just turns to Rust? I love that. I didn't have that, no. Do we have? Oh, this, oh, right, this is the thing where I can turn these on. So like if you want to show, these are like, they can be interactive in the sense of like, we can turn these on or off and do different stuff with them. Oh, right, I forgot, we have Doom, obviously.

• 41:57Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 41:57Speaker 03

  I mean, you have that.

• 41:59Speaker 01

  That's not, that wasn't even hard. That was easy. It's, if you can draw it with GPI, then you can already do that. There's nothing interesting about that. That was Casey, to your point of, that's just a renderer, that's not a GUI, right? It's not doing anything inside. Now, we could hook up NeoVim into this and like when your program has errors, you lose ammo or health. I mean, we could make that happen, but that would be a separate project. So we can turn that off.

• 42:22Speaker 03

  Well, again, that's not really that interesting, like the, like the thing where you drew like lines to

• 42:27Speaker 01

  Drew the arrows.

• 42:28Speaker 03

  To me is more like what I meant because it's like, look, this is actually part of what you're doing in the program as opposed to just I connected it to something, right?

• 42:37Speaker 01

  Right, yep.

• 42:38Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 42:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, which is, that's like where we have this, this is all like rendered with the GUI and everything and we can like type reload and we can do, this is all, NeoVim supplies the info for this thing. So what's interesting is like, you know, they're talking to each other. I can execute Lua from the GUI inside of NeoVim.

• 42:59Speaker 03

  Oh, Lua's in here too?

• 43:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course, NeoVim uses Lua. NeoVim uses Lua as its primary convicting.

• 43:05Speaker 03

  Okay, so we're up to, how many languages do we have? We got, okay, we got C.

• 43:08Speaker 01

  C, Rust, TypeScript, and Lua.

• 43:11Speaker 03

  And Lua, okay, so it's four languages, all right.

• 43:15Speaker 01

  It's a poly, I'm a bit of a polyglot, Casey. Also, don't forget the most important one, English.

• 43:20Speaker 03

  Yep, that's true.

• 43:25Speaker 01

  So, yeah, so this is all, like, this is all coming from like

• 43:29Speaker 03

  Does the LLM ever ask you, does the LLM ever reply like, hey TJ, is it cool if I just did all of this in Rust or something like that? And you just go, no, I want it in four different languages and don't ask me again. Like, does it ever just, does it ever ask you like, could I just not do that? Because I don't, I don't want to have to keep

• 43:48Speaker 01

  You know, Casey, a key feature for not going insane while working with LLMs is you never read what it sends back to you.

• 44:00Speaker 01

  Casey, I was listening to your research episode and you're like, Claude writes like an insane person.

• 44:06Speaker 03

  Wait, what? I said that? I didn't say that.

• 44:08Speaker 01

  Weren't you like, weren't you like, I hated, you were like, I hated reading Claude's, Claude's research paper. It kept on inserting itself into stuff. OpenAI just like reported stuff back. Wasn't that what you were saying?

• 44:19Speaker 03

  I didn't think I said it the same person. I just was trying to say that the, it was like very, it was, it really wanted to be definitive about everything, even though they were not conclusions you could actually draw.

• 44:31Speaker 01

  That's a load-bearing observation, Casey.

• 44:33Speaker 03

  Yeah, it was that kind of a thing.

• 44:35Speaker 00

  You there.

• 44:37Speaker 03

  When Dimitri had those ones, I mean, yeah, he didn't do a Grok one, but he did the other three. And it was, it was definitely like they had a style difference. And then Gemini just didn't have anything in it. Basically like, here's a nothing report for you.

• 44:51Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 44:52Speaker 00

  That sounds like Gemini.

• 44:53Speaker 01

  All right, I got one, I got one more demo though for us before we finish up here. I do want to be respectful of everybody's time, since it's a lunch and learn situation here today.

• 45:05Speaker 01

  So

• 45:06Speaker 00

  TJ, can you open up any specific project?

• 45:10Speaker 03

  What?

• 45:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, so

• 45:11Speaker 00

  Could you open up the sandbox for us? Because while you do that

• 45:15Speaker 01

  Casey, before, before we go there, I just wanted to show, I just opened up, this is a linear GUI inside of NeoVim. I can use this to talk to and interact with linear and NeoVim inside of here.

• 45:26Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 45:28Speaker 01

  Here's, here's all of our issues. GUI and GUI? I would mark that done.

• 45:34Speaker 03

  Okay, nice.

• 45:35Speaker 01

  Prime, and did it just move on, it should just move on yours?

• 45:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, it just moved on my screen. That's why I was saying, hold on one second.

• 45:40Speaker 01

  Okay, sorry, I'll put it back here.

• 45:41Speaker 00

  Oh, there you go, there you go. You can see it right now on my screen.

• 45:44Speaker 03

  You jumped the gun.

• 45:45Speaker 01

  I like that. Boom, done.

• 45:46Speaker 03

  Oh, wait, what did it just do? Oh, it opened.

• 45:48Speaker 01

  Oh, now we're looking at the issue. So now we can get everybody's, everybody's, you know, their notes. I actually don't know if that part works. I haven't tried editing these yet inside of here.

• 45:58Speaker 03

  Hey, man, you know, you only live once.

• 46:01Speaker 01

  True. Is this, no, that doesn't work. That doesn't work. That's not gonna work.

• 46:04Speaker 00

  TJ, I moved it back to progress. Do you see it updated to in progress?

• 46:08Speaker 01

  No, no, I don't have it doing webhooks yet. It doesn't do that part yet. I was gonna, I was gonna have it sync later, but if I refresh it, then I think it will, then it will maybe have it back.

• 46:17Speaker 00

  I moved it back to done for you so it doesn't explode your demo in any sense.

• 46:21Speaker 01

  Okay, cool, cool, cool, cool, cool. That's, that's great. Uh, anyways, so there you go. That's, that's the end of, that's the end of my demo. Thank you, everybody. And now it's back to here. Thank you. Cool.

• 46:33Speaker 02

  I do have a question, though, so like

• 46:35Speaker 01

  Of course, Trash.

• 46:36Speaker 02

  Are there any other like text editors that currently use this kind of capability that you just showed?

• 46:42Speaker 01

  Which?

• 46:43Speaker 03

  The arrow?

• 46:44Speaker 01

  Describe which capability, the brain rot?

• 46:47Speaker 02

  So like, for instance, like markdown preview, sure the arrows as well, or embedding like the chat window?

• 46:56Speaker 01

  I think Emacs probably has every single one of these, is my guess. Anything that I've created only scratches the surface of what the Emacs people have already done.

• 47:05Speaker 03

  Like 0.001 frames a second, though.

• 47:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, that's, that's

• 47:08Speaker 03

  But yeah.

• 47:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:10Speaker 00

  Key insight.

• 47:10Speaker 01

  That's a separate issue, okay? That's a separate, that's a separate issue. I mean, like, a lot of editors, a lot of editors Yes, it really, it really is. So Trash, I think a lot of editors have like a markdown preview, but from what I've seen, most of them just like put them in, in the sidebar. They don't like, like VS Code, the stuff I've seen, doesn't really usually have it be like, oh, you can have

• 47:34Speaker 02

  I'm talking about like, just like text editors like NeoVim type stuff.

• 47:37Speaker 01

  Oh, well, none of the terminal ones can do it because they have to display in a terminal. So like, it has that some

• 47:42Speaker 02

  They made like a variation like you did, like you still give like the same NeoVim experience.

• 47:46Speaker 01

  I mean, there's, there's NeoVim ones, the ones I've seen before, like back in the day would be, you would run something inside of NeoVim and it like opens up a browser tab in one side and it like keeps them synced by like listening to the NeoVim one and you have it out there. So one of the things I was, I'm gonna try later is see if I can like include somehow integrating some browser stuff. Uh, like I miss design mode and a few other things, uh, from like cursor or codecs, like annotating things. But we'll, we'll see, we're getting there. That's all, I've only been working on it for like not even 10 days, okay? So I need a little bit more time.

• 48:21Speaker 02

  I really liked like the chat windows and being able to bring up the chats you brought up.

• 48:25Speaker 01

  Thank you, Trash.

• 48:26Speaker 02

  That was very nice.

• 48:27Speaker 01

  Oh, I didn't show it. I mean, I probably can. I should check and make sure that it's, that it's working because I didn't test it. Oh, yeah, here we go.

• 48:37Speaker 01

  We'll, we'll go here, Trash. I'll show you something that I think you'll like. We'll switch back to this mode here. So, uh, as soon as I was like, oh, hey,

• 48:49Speaker 01

  I'm, I want these NeoVims to be able to talk to each other, then I made like a demon where the cursor SDK is running and everything. So if I open something like this and we go here, I also have a browser view of this. And so I should be able to go, uh, can you say hi to Trash Dev for me in this chat? And then I think, there you go, perfect.

• 49:11Speaker 02

  Is this like what OpenCode does?

• 49:14Speaker 01

  Uh, I think, they have an open code server, probably that's

• 49:16Speaker 00

  Yeah, has a demon as well now.

• 49:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, right. So then, right, these two things are synced to get, like, they're all synced together. So then I was, I can continue the conversation through the power of TailScale by just like forwarding this to my computer. If I can find it anywhere here, one sec.

• 49:38Speaker 01

  And if my internet's good enough, we'll try this.

• 49:43Speaker 01

  Maybe, I maybe my, oh, I think I have Tailscale off right now. That's fine.

• 49:48Speaker 03

  It's weak.

• 49:49Speaker 01

  I know. I couldn't figure out why, uh, my Delta Wi-Fi wasn't working on the airplane, okay? So.

• 49:55Speaker 02

  Also, some of Delta's Wi-Fi wasn't working either. Ridiculous.

• 49:58Speaker 01

  I know. So anyways, there you go. So those show up. So that part's pretty cool, too. So I was exploring with some, but that does, that's, I mean, let's be honest. That doesn't have anything to do with a GUI, so I wasn't gonna really brag about that to Casey in today's, uh, you know, judgment call. Uh, that was just something that I got for cool, which was fun. Yeah.

• 50:17Speaker 00

  All right, Casey, I think it's time for you to give us a rating from zero being a twoy, ten being a GUI. Where does this land?

• 50:26Speaker 03

  I'm gonna give this probably, you know, it's a little bit hard since we've never rated anything else on this, so we don't exactly.

• 50:36Speaker 00

  This is the first time.

• 50:37Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:38Speaker 01

  This is the baseline.

• 50:39Speaker 03

  Setting, it's kind of setting the benchmark where, you know, we have to then rate other things. I'm gonna go ahead and say that this is around like maybe a seven, I'm gonna say.

• 50:49Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 50:50Speaker 03

  Um, it's, it's clearly on the, like, like if we imagine five is like, you know, right in, in this sort of like, I can't quite tell if this is GUI or twoy. Right? Like, I don't know. Um. I'd say this had enough stuff. The arrows was a good selling point for me.

• 51:08Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 51:08Speaker 03

  Uh, that was really the one that kind of made me feel like, okay, this is actually integrated here. But, uh, I don't feel like it had enough of that. Like, I wanted to, you know, you know, maybe those arrows animate for right out there.

• 51:22Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, it's just a good point. I didn't really have any animations.

• 51:25Speaker 03

  Right?

• 51:26Speaker 01

  I didn't think about that.

• 51:27Speaker 03

  I would have liked to have seen that. I, there, there was maybe a little bit too much emphasis on things that pop up over, which is not, you know, again, not bringing that integrated feel in.

• 51:37Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 51:37Speaker 03

  Also, I would say I didn't see a lot of like, uh, oh, you know, I've got, you know, I'm typing in my, my line of, uh, code here. And like, it produces a graphical thing on the side to show me the, like, you know, whatever. So I feel like we could definitely go further in the GUI direction, but I definitely think it was, it crossed the, the barrier into like, it's definitely GUI now. It's not a twoy. That's what I would say.

• 52:00Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 52:00Speaker 03

  I know how everyone else feels.

• 52:03Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 52:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 52:04Speaker 02

  I'll give it a, I'll give it a six. I would say the arrows is a big selling point for me, but like the same.

• 52:10Speaker 03

  Hard.

• 52:11Speaker 02

  What?

• 52:11Speaker 00

  Wow!

• 52:13Speaker 02

  But, but, but, but to, to like, to Casey's point, everything kind of just looked like a modal pop-up, which could potentially not look like it was actually integrated. And so like, even though like the chat was popping up on the side. I, I personally, I thought it was nice, but it didn't really give me them twoy vibes. It would be cool if you had like, uh, what VS Code does. It has like, uh, like the, the code column that kind of shows like the code as you're scrolling.

• 52:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, the. Trash, that is the world's most useless feature of all time. I already have real scroll bars.

• 52:42Speaker 02

  Like a minimap, a minimap.

• 52:43Speaker 01

  Oh, fine. I'm not gonna add minimap though out of principle. I hate them.

• 52:47Speaker 00

  Yes, it is the dumbest feature of all time.

• 52:49Speaker 02

  I know, I'm just saying, I'm just saying, there was, I was saying just more, more.

• 52:52Speaker 03

  Tough crowd tonight. Tough crowd.

• 52:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's okay. That's okay.

• 52:56Speaker 02

  But arrows, arrows are tight, arrows are tight.

• 52:58Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 52:59Speaker 00

  Um, so obviously I'm gonna have to probably also rate it a six. Uh, I will say it's definitely leaning, it's, it's, it's attempting to be more GUI than twee, but I will say like, you know, even the cursor chat, you took no advantages of circles. Or of little like carrot, like things you can't do. It kind of looked like you just lifted the terminal just straight into a lot of these things. And so I, I wasn't necessarily super impressed, but I will, I will have to say, obviously the arrows were given it's a big, a big push that way. And a very like quintessential missing feature that exists on almost all GUIs that I use that I just did not see was visible user input lag. And so it really made me feel like I was using a twoy.

• 53:44Speaker 00

  It just really didn't, it didn't, it didn't land for me.

• 53:48Speaker 02

  It was too fast.

• 53:48Speaker 03

  You gotta put in a delay, a hundred millisecond delay on keystrokes.

• 53:52Speaker 01

  Okay, I'll add, I'll add GUI mode for Prime. Prime GUI mode. I would have gotten an eight or a nine then.

• 53:58Speaker 02

  It's like Spider-Man fly across the screen and like grab.

• 54:02Speaker 01

  Oh, I need, I see also Casey, as you were saying animations, I need to animate every transition of every single thing to waste 500 milliseconds of every time.

• 54:10Speaker 03

  Yeah. Everything should fade in and move slightly like, and they should bounce like this, you know?

• 54:18Speaker 01

  Maybe a whole, I'm gonna copy it into a different folder because I'm too scared even to let it go into the Git history for it. But I'll, um, I'll make a, I'll make it a fully animated version for next one.

• 54:30Speaker 03

  And as, but as I would like, as I tried to say before, you know, you guys poo-pooed it, but I'm just trying to say like, again, usefulness, not really a criteria here, right? None of these suggestions are useful. Minimap completely useless. Animated text totally useless. Delayed typing is worse than useless. It's actually anti-useful.

• 54:53Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 54:53Speaker 03

  So, you know, that rating, forget, I don't even know why that was on the leaderboard. That's not what GUIs are about.

• 54:59Speaker 02

  Teach looks crushed. How do you feel? How do you feel from those ratings right now?

• 55:02Speaker 01

  I thought for sure I was gonna get a higher rating from Prime because I know for a fact he sometimes reads tables in markdown view and I, and sequence diagrams. And I thought that, you know, those being key useful, but also GUI features.

• 55:20Speaker 02

  Trying to buy his vote.

• 55:20Speaker 01

  Properly rendered and editable in a real Neovim buffer, like your Neovim edits still actually change the very same buffer alive between the two things. I thought I was gonna get a little bit.

• 55:34Speaker 03

  In the markup version.

• 55:35Speaker 01

  Right, that's what I'm saying.

• 55:36Speaker 03

  Preview version, which is pretty.

• 55:38Speaker 01

  Right.

• 55:38Speaker 03

  Uh, helpful for people who like, don't read, wanna read the markdown, you know?

• 55:43Speaker 01

  That was.

• 55:43Speaker 03

  To find where that crap was or whatever, right?

• 55:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that's where I thought I was gonna get a few points, um, over on Prime because I know that he's experienced those difficulties. Uh, but I see how it is. Prime was just afraid to give the highest score and look like a nice guy. So that's fine.

• 55:58Speaker 00

  True.

• 55:59Speaker 03

  I was, I was supportive, right?

• 56:01Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 56:02Speaker 03

  I was very supportive. The other two people on the team, even though you included.

• 56:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, the loitering guy didn't like it. The loitering guy didn't even like it.

• 56:11Speaker 03

  Pokemon.

• 56:11Speaker 02

  If I would have saw a Pikachu, if there was a Pikachu in there somewhere, instant dead.

• 56:16Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 56:17Speaker 01

  Oh, I can't believe I didn't think of putting in opening card packs inside of this.

• 56:21Speaker 02

  Like a Pokéball anywhere rolling around.

• 56:23Speaker 01

  Oh, shoot. That's right.

• 56:25Speaker 03

  You should have to open a bunch of card packs to like, like if you ask it to show the markdown file, it's like, well, you're gonna have to open some pack.

• 56:32Speaker 01

  You gotta rip a pack.

• 56:33Speaker 02

  No, you know what you do? You have, you have a pack.

• 56:35Speaker 03

  Has markdown window in it.

• 56:37Speaker 02

  You have a pack and every time you manually code, it just slowly starts ripping more. So I just gotta like actually.

• 56:42Speaker 01

  Oh, Trash, that's genius. When you actually open files. Yeah, and read the code diffs. That's really good.

• 56:48Speaker 00

  I was thinking it's kind of the opposite that you get a pack and a legendary is that you have to read the code since nobody reads the code anymore, kind of force them on like a rare event to accidentally have to read the code.

• 56:59Speaker 01

  Wow, I have to read it. I got a legendary. I don't wanna waste this.

• 57:02Speaker 00

  This is a big one today, boys.

• 57:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:04Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm. That would work.

• 57:06Speaker 01

  Yep. So anyways, there you go. That's, uh, that's the Neovim, the Neovim GUI, uh, experience I've been playing with, uh, lately. So. That's it.

• 57:17Speaker 02

  I like it.

• 57:17Speaker 01

  Thanks, Trash. Trash, on a, on a usefulness rating, what were you thinking?

• 57:23Speaker 02

  Uh, I mean, everything but like the cursor SDK stuff, like I would love to have all that. I basically can't really.

• 57:29Speaker 01

  Well, you can't because you rated it a six. Suck it. End of the episode.

• 57:37Speaker 00

  Walked right into that one.

• 57:40Speaker 00

  Whoop.

• 57:42Speaker 02

  Egg on my face.

• 57:43Speaker 01

  Oh, man.

• 57:45Speaker 02

  That was brutal. That was brutal.

• 57:49Speaker 01

  I don't have anything else to show though, so Prime, I don't know, are we, do we have any other blockers or anything else that people need to discuss?

• 57:54Speaker 03

  That was an hour.

• 57:55Speaker 00

  That was an hour.

• 57:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:57Speaker 02

  Well, next week, next week, we're gonna play the games I'm making. I mean, I've been working on games for us.

• 58:02Speaker 01

  Okay, Trash, Trash.

• 58:05Speaker 01

  Me and Prime will also make a competing game in the same space and Casey can tell us which one he likes the best.

• 58:11Speaker 03

  Damn.

• 58:11Speaker 02

  Yeah. What's up? Mine's multiplayer, everything, all the time.

• 58:14Speaker 00

  Of course, naturally, this would be multiplayer.

• 58:16Speaker 01

  Yep. Okay, so Trash, we'll discuss that.

• 58:18Speaker 00

  Just so we can.

• 58:20Speaker 01

  Well, it needs to be in the same theme.

• 58:22Speaker 02

  Oh, the same theme.

• 58:23Speaker 03

  He said digging. It's a digging.

• 58:24Speaker 01

  No, it doesn't have to be literally digging. It can be in the same genre, I'm saying, right? So it's like if yours is, uh.

• 58:29Speaker 03

  It was friend slop, I thought.

• 58:30Speaker 01

  Is it, we're just making it friend slop?

• 58:31Speaker 00

  Fine thing. Just digging. That's it. Like, there's no.

• 58:34Speaker 01

  Okay, it has to involve digging as a key feature.

• 58:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, digging, scooping, clearing, clearing a space out.

• 58:41Speaker 01

  All right.

• 58:41Speaker 02

  However, however, you have some container, you gotta clear it somehow.

• 58:45Speaker 01

  Okay, I love that.

• 58:46Speaker 02

  I'm still brainstorming too. I got like eight modes we can try, you know?

• 58:49Speaker 03

  Now, why?

• 58:50Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 58:51Speaker 03

  Strictly out of curiosity, why are we doing this game? Because I thought, I would have thought for sure by now that the receipts app is, would have like been.

• 59:00Speaker 01

  Great point, Casey. Great point.

• 59:01Speaker 02

  Sales are down. Sales are down.

• 59:03Speaker 01

  Sales are down.

• 59:04Speaker 02

  The business went under.

• 59:06Speaker 03

  Oh. So is this a pivot?

• 59:09Speaker 02

  Fired by old department.

• 59:10Speaker 03

  Is this pivoting to games because, because receipts as a service, R A A S, did not pan out or?

• 59:17Speaker 02

  It's true. It's true. We're now a gaming company.

• 59:20Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 59:20Speaker 02

  And then we'll probably turn into an AI company next. So.

• 59:23Speaker 01

  I can't wait. All right. So next week, Trash, we'll let you know by Monday if we're ready to show it by then, because I wanna make a clever digging game that Casey's gonna rate higher than a seven.

• 59:32Speaker 02

  I still have, I still have, uh, I got a good amount of modes we can try.

• 59:35Speaker 03

  Well, you don't, I don't have to rate it higher than a seven. I just have to rate it higher than Trash.

• 59:39Speaker 01

  Okay, true.

• 59:39Speaker 02

  Are we rating the games? Oh, we're rating the game.

• 59:41Speaker 01

  No, no, I'm saying Casey is gonna rate them.

• 59:44Speaker 03

  I'll just stack Rankham, right?

• 59:45Speaker 01

  Okay, great. First, second, third.

• 59:47Speaker 03

  So it's like, you know, there's not an absolute rating, but there's like, which of these games is the best?

• 59:52Speaker 02

  Yeah. Just put on a loop, just put on a loop and have a work on it while you're doing your stuff.

• 59:56Speaker 01

  That's what I'm, oh, Trash, we're gonna burn some tokens. Don't worry.

• 1:00:01Speaker 00

  Don't you worry.

• 1:00:02Speaker 01

  Don't you worry.

• 1:00:03Speaker 03

  Uh, is there?

• 1:00:04Speaker 02

  The world is heating up this week.

• 1:00:06Speaker 03

  This isn't, there's not gonna be like a, uh, a penalty, like it's not a cost benefit though. So like, like, is there any normal, like if one of you spends like $10,000 on tokens, right?

• 1:00:16Speaker 01

  Let me just tell you, Casey, it's easy to spend a lot of money on tokens and get nowhere. You're penalizing yourself if you're letting the AI go off for too long for a game.

• 1:00:27Speaker 00

  As I did with a cinematic, uh, fishing game, I couldn't, uh, Casey, I'll tell you this much. The game only cost me $800. I spent unironically $300.

• 1:00:38Speaker 00

  Trying to make it so that when you pressed, uh, A, it would go left and not right. I am not kidding. I am not kidding. I went so cinematic that it could not, I, I told it maybe 900 times. A thousand, like-

• 1:00:52Speaker 03

  Which AI was having, was not able to do that?

• 1:00:54Speaker 00

  Fable 5.1 Max. I went all in on it and built a super game and then it just was just like, I can't-

• 1:01:01Speaker 02

  What does that mean when a game is cinematic?

• 1:01:03Speaker 00

  You cannot do the vibe-coded slop demos and just one-shot something. It, it is a nightmare to try to, like, edit anything about it. You have to build it up slowly.

• 1:01:13Speaker 02

  Prime, when you say cinematic, is that like, kind of like realistic? Like a movie type feel?

• 1:01:18Speaker 00

  Dude, uh, would you like to see it?

• 1:01:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:20Speaker 03

  Was this posted somewhere?

• 1:01:22Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:01:22Speaker 01

  It will be. It will be, but yeah. But you can see the game here is fine.

• 1:01:26Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here we go. Here we go. Here we go. Here we go. Uh, not, not programmed default scene. Hold on, let me get that-

• 1:01:32Speaker 03

  Cinematic fishing.

• 1:01:34Speaker 00

  Uh, here we go.

• 1:01:34Speaker 01

  It was, I, also, it's not that cinematic.

• 1:01:37Speaker 03

  No, no, it isn't.

• 1:01:39Speaker 00

  Look at that. Look at those waves. The waves are making the boat-

• 1:01:43Speaker 01

  It's just because it has lightning.

• 1:01:45Speaker 02

  Are you on a boat?

• 1:01:47Speaker 03

  What is going on with the, like, jerky motion?

• 1:01:49Speaker 01

  It's like two pixels on my screen.

• 1:01:50Speaker 03

  What is happening?

• 1:01:51Speaker 00

  Okay, hey, first off, I'm not making fun of it. Okay, hold on, I lost my mouse. I don't even know where my mouse-

• 1:01:55Speaker 01

  Oh, I see it now.

• 1:01:56Speaker 03

  Alright, okay, alright, okay.

• 1:01:58Speaker 00

  It just took my mouse and then I opened up this dialogue and I've hit like a mode you can't do in Chrome. My mouse is gone.

• 1:02:04Speaker 01

  You wouldn't edit a meme.

• 1:02:07Speaker 01

  You wouldn't edit one.

• 1:02:08Speaker 02

  Well, now we're on a march.

• 1:02:09Speaker 03

  What is happening?

• 1:02:10Speaker 00

  Uh, okay, there we go.

• 1:02:11Speaker 01

  Okay, well, since Prime showed his, I'm gonna show mine.

• 1:02:14Speaker 02

  What is that? Is that a person?

• 1:02:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, what is that little thing?

• 1:02:17Speaker 00

  It's a person. Look, there's the sun and it's also raining.

• 1:02:20Speaker 03

  Definitely not a person.

• 1:02:21Speaker 02

  It's the sun and it's nighttime?

• 1:02:22Speaker 00

  Guys, I did not have another $300 to fix the rain going upwards.

• 1:02:26Speaker 03

  Okay, good point. Good point. This was costing you. At some point, you gotta cut it off.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:31Speaker 02

  Why is the sun out and it's nighttime?

• 1:02:33Speaker 03

  What is happening? Are those raindrops bouncing off of the ship?

• 1:02:37Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 1:02:38Speaker 01

  Yes. It's so bad.

• 1:02:39Speaker 03

  Oh, wait, no, they're not. They're, they're on a sinusoid.

• 1:02:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, they are.

• 1:02:42Speaker 03

  It, it stuck a sine pattern.

• 1:02:44Speaker 02

  Oh dude, the waves are going in two different directions.

• 1:02:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, the waves-

• 1:02:47Speaker 01

  No, Trash, nothing makes sense. And it wasn't fun.

• 1:02:50Speaker 00

  It was not fun.

• 1:02:50Speaker 01

  And he got way too many points for this game.

• 1:02:53Speaker 02

  What's on his back?

• 1:02:56Speaker 00

  Again, I did exactly, so, so Trash, I did exactly what they do on Twitter. Is I spent an enormous amount of money and let it go run for 24 hours.

• 1:03:07Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:03:08Speaker 00

  And this is what just comes out of it and it becomes impossible to use once you get past the demo scene. And it was very, very fun.

• 1:03:15Speaker 03

  Alright, let's see this pixel, this pixel fishing.

• 1:03:18Speaker 00

  TJ did a really good one. TJ did a very good job.

• 1:03:21Speaker 01

  So, so, I, none of these are actually implemented. I just did this to make people want to be able to save the game.

• 1:03:27Speaker 02

  This looks really good.

• 1:03:28Speaker 03

  Okay, okay.

• 1:03:29Speaker 02

  This looks amazing.

• 1:03:30Speaker 01

  So then you go and, you go and you, uh, you fish farther away, harder fish, closer is easier. Right? You gotta do the, like, classic fishing game here.

• 1:03:40Speaker 02

  Wait, you lost Prime's game?

• 1:03:42Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:03:43Speaker 03

  Well, on, on a, he didn't get, he got a zero from one person because he got mad.

• 1:03:46Speaker 01

  I got a zero from one of our three judges.

• 1:03:49Speaker 00

  Mine was tremendously unfun.

• 1:03:53Speaker 01

  So then, after you catch the three fish, right? It's like, wow, good job. Head home and save your journal.

• 1:04:01Speaker 03

  What is going on with her feet?

• 1:04:03Speaker 01

  They're not good.

• 1:04:05Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:04:05Speaker 02

  What's wrong with her feet? What's wrong with the feet?

• 1:04:07Speaker 01

  Alright, so now it says, do you want, do you wanna save? And so then it takes you here. Also notice, it still says fishing.

• 1:04:14Speaker 03

  I like the fishing pole on the G. That's a nice touch.

• 1:04:17Speaker 02

  It's a G, it's upside down.

• 1:04:20Speaker 01

  So then, no matter what you type here, then it will do this. You got, I don't think I'm sharing my audio from here. Then it goes, "Baaahhh."

• 1:04:30Speaker 02

  Dang.

• 1:04:32Speaker 01

  Oh, my goodness, so-

• 1:04:33Speaker 00

  And TJ ironically got one of our coworkers with that.

• 1:04:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I did. I-

• 1:04:37Speaker 02

  Like, Haley was actually scared she got fished?

• 1:04:40Speaker 01

  Well, no, she knew that I was, she knew that I was trolling, but I surprised her and then she got, she was like, just, like, she was laughing, but she was like, I should have known better than to type something in on a, uh, she was like, "You told me to type my password."

• 1:04:57Speaker 02

  Oh, was she actually?

• 1:04:58Speaker 01

  Never trust it. That's fishing. So there you go.

• 1:05:00Speaker 02

  That would've got me. That would've got me.

• 1:05:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know, Trash. I thought about-

• 1:05:05Speaker 02

  My one passion is just compromise.

• 1:05:06Speaker 01

  I thought about making you type it on here, but I was worried you would somehow reveal your one password on accident and I didn't-

• 1:05:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, I would. 100% would. 100% would.

• 1:05:16Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:05:17Speaker 02

  Jeez.

• 1:05:18Speaker 01

  Alright, that's it.

• 1:05:19Speaker 02

  Next episode, we're competing.

• 1:05:21Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 1:05:21Speaker 01

  Okay, that sounds good.

• 1:05:22Speaker 03

  Alright, I'll come-

• 1:05:23Speaker 01

  We'll see you guys next week.

• 1:05:24Speaker 02

  Alright.

• 1:05:25Speaker 01

  Bye, everyone.

• 1:05:26Speaker 03

  Take these, everybody.

• 1:05:28Speaker 00

  Bye. Bye Twitch, bye YouTube.

• 1:05:30Speaker 01

  Oh, my-