‘Crash’ With Bill Simmons, Van Lathan, and Joanna Robinson

The Ringer’s Bill Simmons, Van Lathan, and Joanna Robinson revisit one of the most controversial Best Picture–winning films of all time, Paul Haggis’s ‘Crash,’ starring Don Cheadle, Matt Dillon, Thandiwe Newton, Sandra Bullock, Terrence Howard, and Michael Peña. Watch this episode on our Ringer Movies YouTube Channel! This episode is sponsored by State Farm®. Create an affordable price just for you with the State Farm Personal Price Plan.® Producer: Craig Horlbeck Video Producers: Jack Sanders and Chia Hao Tat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Bill Simmons?

  What's up, rewatchables fans? As you know, we've done live shows in New York, in Philly, DC, in Chicago, LA many times. We've never done Boston. I've been saving it for the right moment. The right moment is here. It's going to be Thursday, March 27th. It's going to be the House of Blues, which is right by Fenway Park. And it's going to be the dream team. Me, Chris Ryan, Sean Fantasy, and Ryan Rusillo. That's right, we're all coming back. We're not doing the town. We're not touching the town. That one episode lives on forever on YouTube, Spotify. We're not redoing it, but we'll probably do a Boston movie. And tickets will go on sale this Thursday, February 27th. That's only a couple of days away at 10 a.m. Eastern. All information will be on the ringer dot com slash events very soon.

• 0:43Bill Simmons?

  Once again, the rewatchables live, Boston, Thursday, March 27th. House of Blues, Thursday, ticket sales, 10 a.m. Eastern, ringer dot com slash events. And we're going to have a couple more things we're doing that weekend, too. So I'm very excited. We have not come to Boston yet, and we're going to do it right. Hope to see you there. The rewatchables is brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network. You can find us on the Ringer Movies YouTube channel. You can also find us every episode now on video on Spotify. You can see our beautiful, our beautiful hosts, Joanna Robinson, Van Lathan, myself. We don't normally do this. We usually do movies we love and we can't stop rewatching, but it's the Oscars.

• 1:27Bill Simmons?

  And we're going to do Crash, which won the 2006 Best Picture Award, and it's unbelievable. And it's next.

• 1:36Speaker 01

  I just had a gun pointed in my face.

• 1:39Speaker 02

  Experience the most provocative and powerful movie of the year. We leave this man here, he dies. I promise I'm going to find out who did this. He put in rubber gift Crash, two thumbs way up.

• 1:51Speaker 03

  You had a conversation with God, huh? What did God say?

• 1:55Speaker 02

  One of the best films of 2005.

• 1:57Speaker 01

  What did you do?

• 2:00Speaker 02

  Crash, rated R, in theaters everywhere Friday.

• 2:18Bill Simmons?

  All right, Joanna Robinson is here, Van Lathan is here. You guys have sorted out all your Marvel stuff?

• 2:24Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:24Bill Simmons?

  Good?

• 2:24Speaker 03

  Captain America: Brave New World, this is a text exchange.

• 2:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, so just a spicy text exchange.

• 2:30Speaker 03

  Yeah. You don't care?

• 2:32Speaker 04

  No.

• 2:32Speaker 03

  Why do you even ask?

• 2:33Bill Simmons?

  I don't care. I don't care at all. I do care about the biggest Oscars travesty of the 21st century, Crash winning over Brokeback Mountain. This is a weirdly watchable movie, and I would even say a rewatchable movie, that is also now kind of a comedy?

• 2:48Speaker 04

  That's what you said. I want to know what mood you're in when you sit down to rewatch Crash.

• 2:53Bill Simmons?

  There's good scenes in this movie, but the totality of it leaves me going, I can't believe this happened.

• 2:59Speaker 04

  What's happening on a day where Bill's like, I'm gonna fire up Crash. I gotta, gotta get my Crash on.

• 3:03Bill Simmons?

  Flipping channels.

• 3:04Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 3:05Bill Simmons?

  It's like, oh, Matt Dillon's running up the hill.

• 3:07Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 3:09Bill Simmons?

  He's gonna try to save her in the car. It's like, all right, I'll watch this scene.

• 3:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, so I hadn't seen the movie in a while. I've seen it a bunch of times. I hadn't seen the movie in a while. It's, it's, it's not very rewatchable.

• 3:24Speaker 04

  I have, I have not seen it since I saw it in theaters.

• 3:27Speaker 05

  Maybe we call it the hate, the hate watchable.

• 3:29Speaker 03

  This is now.

• 3:30Bill Simmons?

  We're celebrating. I thought it was the 20th anniversary of when it won, but it's actually the 19th anniversary.

• 3:34Speaker 03

  Now, I'll say this though. When you get into the movie, there's just like a wave of nostalgia that hits you because of the cast.

• 3:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 3:44Speaker 03

  And because of what place we must have been in society for this movie to have been made and been taken so seriously. It, because, because like, everybody in the movie is at a weird type of position in their career.

• 4:01Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 4:02Speaker 03

  Terrence Howard is as hot as he ever was in this movie.

• 4:05Bill Simmons?

  But we don't know that in 2005 when he's making it. Cause he has this and Hustle and Flow the same year.

• 4:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 4:10Bill Simmons?

  And this is it.

• 4:10Speaker 03

  Sandra Bullock is in a sort of, and Brendan Fraser as well, like Brendan Fraser more than her. Brendan Fraser is in a weird limo.

• 4:19Bill Simmons?

  It's almost over for him as a star.

• 4:21Speaker 03

  Right.

• 4:22Bill Simmons?

  Sandra Bullock is like, I'm being typecast in rom coms. I gotta break out of this. I'm gonna play the biggest bitch who's ever been in a movie.

• 4:27Speaker 03

  Meanwhile, Michael Pena is.

• 4:30Speaker 04

  On the rise.

• 4:31Speaker 03

  On the rise.

• 4:31Bill Simmons?

  Now, this is his first big job.

• 4:33Speaker 03

  Like, Cheadle is taking control of his Hollywood A-list status in this one, cause he's also a producer. Um, and then you look throughout the cast and there's just other people who this is their, either their first big serious thing, they're making a turn.

• 4:47Bill Simmons?

  Or Matt, Matt Dillon near the end of being a major star.

• 4:50Speaker 03

  Right.

• 4:51Speaker 04

  But this was supposed to be sort of his revival.

• 4:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 4:54Speaker 04

  And it didn't quite work out that way.

• 4:56Bill Simmons?

  Although he did get nominated.

• 4:57Speaker 04

  He did.

• 4:58Bill Simmons?

  Which I was shocked by.

• 4:58Speaker 04

  He was the only actor nominated out of this movie, and that's just one of the many delightful things about Crash.

• 5:03Bill Simmons?

  What did you think on your rewatch?

• 5:05Speaker 04

  I agree with Van. I, I don't think I've seen it. I saw it since I saw it in the theaters, but I remember it so well. So rewatching it, I was like, uh, these are sort of iconic, comical, but iconic film scenes. You know, the, the Matt Dillon, Tenduai Newton car crash scene, Michael Pena with his daughter, like, there's just a bunch of moments. Sandra Bullock falling down the stairs, whatever it is, you know, there's something for everyone, but, um, I just remember this movie so well.

• 5:35Speaker 03

  Why did she fall down the stairs? You know what I'm saying? It's, it's, it's.

• 5:38Speaker 04

  It's karma, man.

• 5:40Speaker 03

  I know, but like.

• 5:41Speaker 04

  And she had a lesson to learn.

• 5:42Speaker 03

  Why did she fall down the stairs?

• 5:44Speaker 04

  So he could find out that Carol's a bitch.

• 5:46Speaker 03

  It just.

• 5:46Speaker 04

  You know?

• 5:47Speaker 03

  That's the kind of thing.

• 5:47Bill Simmons?

  She needed a scene with the maid.

• 5:49Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 5:49Bill Simmons?

  You're the only friend I have.

• 5:51Speaker 03

  There, there are a couple of scenes in the movie that get it devastatingly right. Then I'll talk about like I talk about.

• 5:59Bill Simmons?

  Did you get emotional during it, this movie at any point?

• 6:01Speaker 03

  A little bit. There there there are times just because the the sheer human agony that's happening on the screen, sometimes you relate to it, but it's so hamfisted, overwrought and heavy handed that you in its totality, you just cannot take it seriously. In its totality, it becomes funny because you start to think what race thing can happen next? Like if all the characters at the end of this movie would have joined hands and started singing, We Shall Overcome, it would have made sense in context of the movie.

• 6:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, except instead you have Loretta Devine like coming in and saying like, speak American to me in the car crash scene at the end.

• 6:45Speaker 03

  Race.

• 6:46Bill Simmons?

  I like the nostalgia angle.

• 6:48Speaker 03

  I'm just I'm just saying every single I I look in a lot of ways, I can make an argument that this movie brought me to LA. We, okay.

• 6:58Speaker 04

  You saw this movie, you're like, that's where I want to be.

• 7:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:01Speaker 04

  Yeah?

• 7:02Speaker 03

  Because.

• 7:02Bill Simmons?

  He's like, I like, I want to be in a place where people have to crash into each other to feel something.

• 7:06Speaker 04

  To feel something, yeah.

• 7:08Speaker 03

  I'm in Louisiana this whole time and Louisiana has grown tired of my shtick. You know, they know it. I've been doing this since the sixth grade. I'm in the all white classes. I'm injecting race into everything. They're immune to it, right? It's not working on them anymore.

• 7:22Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 7:23Speaker 03

  And Crash comes out, I'm 25.

• 7:25Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:26Speaker 03

  I'm 24, I'm looking around, I'm like, where could I go to where I can revitalize the thing that I do?

• 7:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:33Speaker 03

  Boom, that's the place.

• 7:34Bill Simmons?

  LA?

• 7:35Speaker 03

  2005.

• 7:36Bill Simmons?

  Right as Matt Dillon's running up that hill, Van's like, I'm running to LA.

• 7:39Speaker 04

  When you, so, okay, so when do you think LA is gonna grow tired of your shtick? What do you think?

• 7:44Bill Simmons?

  Never, probably not.

• 7:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:46Speaker 03

  It's just too many people, it's too much shtick.

• 7:48Bill Simmons?

  He keeps adding stuff, like he added the hat last year, he keeps adding wrinkles.

• 7:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, you gotta come up with new gimmicks. Also, it's it's now the point that I've actually grown tired of the shtick. Like I came to The Ringer and now I just want to talk about Star Wars and basketball all day long, but every time I walk down the street. NFL draft, somebody grabs me and they go, you see what happened to South Carolina? They outlawed Negro. And I'm like. Got to spring to action.

• 8:13Bill Simmons?

  Right. You're just on call at all times.

• 8:15Speaker 03

  So that's the thing. So we we ride till the wheels fall off.

• 8:18Bill Simmons?

  The nostalgia thing, one of you mentioned, which I thought is an interesting point because this did make me nostalgic for this pre-social media era of movies like this, where people kind of didn't know any better and they just went for it. And there wasn't like a fear of a backlash because it was much harder to have backlash back then. Back then we had newspapers. We had early internet websites. We had like

• 8:41Speaker 04

  We still have newspapers.

• 8:42Bill Simmons?

  Best picture boards. No, I'm just saying like there was less of a mechanism to kind of respond in anger to a movie like this. So this was a slow build and I don't think it really, I don't think people really got pissed off about this movie until the Oscars. When it won Best Picture and you can go back and watch it on YouTube, Nicholson's the, he's the presenter. And he does it and he reads it and he's like, the winners crash and he goes, whoa. And you hear the crowd, the crowd, which I don't know if I've ever heard this at the Oscars, they make like a what the fuck noise. They're like, oh, it's like one of those noises. And that was when this movie, it turned.

• 9:20Speaker 04

  I think especially because at that Oscars, um, Ang Lee had one director and once he won director, people thought, oh, Shirley Brokeback's gonna win Best Picture.

• 9:29Bill Simmons?

  Well, there was a thing, it would see Brokeback was the only movie to win PGA, DGA and WGA and not win Best Picture Oscar.

• 9:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 9:37Bill Simmons?

  The, the Which by the way, Anora's, we're taping this before the Oscars, but Anora is the next one that

• 9:42Speaker 04

  That cut is on that.

• 9:43Speaker 03

  The conversation became really divisive after a while because what started to happen was it it almost was like the Hollywood liberal elites wanted to award one type of film and they chose race over a movie with gay themes because we still weren't there yet.

• 10:04Bill Simmons?

  We weren't, we we actually weren't.

• 10:06Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 10:06Bill Simmons?

  But now it's, Brokeback is such a great movie and it's kind of, it's it's kind of insane that it didn't win.

• 10:13Speaker 04

  There's some back, there was some backlash before the Oscar win. And I only know this because I read a really embarrassing Roger Ebert column where he was defending.

• 10:20Bill Simmons?

  We're gonna hit that later.

• 10:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:21Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 10:22Speaker 04

  Where he's defending the movie against its, its critics.

• 10:25Bill Simmons?

  He loved it and then had a second, he went back.

• 10:28Speaker 04

  He went, had another bite of the apple when people were like, actually it's not very good. And he's like, how dare you? Um, a, a.

• 10:33Bill Simmons?

  Here's what you're missing about Crash.

• 10:35Speaker 04

  Here's what you don't understand about Crash. Let me, Roger Ebert, explain it to you. Um, so that was all before, I think, the Oscar win.

• 10:42Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 10:43Speaker 04

  But yeah, then it really cemented itself as, I think if it hadn't won the Oscar, we, I mean, we definitely wouldn't still be talking about Crash. We would be talking about it a little bit, but not the way we talk about it, where it became sort of the most famously egregious Oscar Best Picture win.

• 10:58Bill Simmons?

  The first, like, hit piece I remember heading into an Oscars, remember reading, was my favorite writer, William Goldman. He wrote a Saving Private Ryan review before that Oscars, and he just fucking torpedoed it. And it was great, and it was like, oh my God, I can't, and, and it was kind of like, uh, it was, it was a glimpse of where the internet was probably going with some of this stuff. But by oh five, this, the, some of the Crash pieces, they're really funny to reread. People were on it pretty early, like.

• 11:29Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:29Bill Simmons?

  This movie made people mad. I also like that movies like this exist where people either get super mad or super defensive about it, because now, where do we have this in movies in the same way anymore?

• 11:41Speaker 03

  Um, we, we, we don't, because everybody kind of runs and huddles to their corner.

• 11:45Bill Simmons?

  Right, everyone's in their little, in their little spheres.

• 11:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, some, a movie over here is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Uh, and everyone, like, right now, everyone is in unison about Emilio Perez. Right, there are not very many Emilio Perez defenders.

• 12:00Speaker 04

  But that wasn't the case two months ago. I think we do still get those, like, debates.

• 12:05Speaker 03

  I don't think it was the case two months, uh, by the way, when I say everyone, I mean, the people. Like, it, the, the industry seems to love the movie, right?

• 12:14Speaker 04

  Right.

• 12:15Bill Simmons?

  You're saying like the, the fantasy people?

• 12:17Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 12:18Bill Simmons?

  They're like on Letterboxd logging that they saw Emilio Perez?

• 12:21Speaker 03

  The, the people, everyone that saw it was just like immensely offended by the movie. However, the critical, uh, acclaim for the movie is perplexing them. It's actually driving them, people, those people that hate the movie even more.

• 12:35Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 12:36Speaker 03

  Um, but you have two very distinct.

• 12:40Speaker 03

  Different factions. Crash was a movie that people were told that they should love and they were told that like this movie is an incredibly biting um and important criticism on race.

• 12:51Bill Simmons?

  The conversation that we all need to have.

• 12:53Speaker 03

  And then when you watched it, it was so comical. It from the very first scene, it was so comical. I was like, what for real this is we supposed to take this like seriously? Every single stereotype is approached and then like sort of validated in in the movie to a point to where it kind of doesn't mean anything in the end. It's just funny.

• 13:23Speaker 04

  I think the other difference, like there's the if you want to talk about like online outrage culture, that's one thing, but there's also like we aren't all collectively watching movies like this anymore. This is a seven million dollar movie. It's a small movie. I don't think you get the the people, as you're saying, don't go in droves to see this in the theater if they're watching it at all, they're maybe watching it on home and at home in the background. You know, so you won't get an opportunity for people to have that kind of debate about a movie like this because they're streaming, I don't know, White Lotus instead, or whatever else they're watching.

• 13:56Bill Simmons?

  Cheeto gave it real credibility for me when it came out. The fact that he was a producer.

• 14:01Speaker 04

  It didn't get made without him.

• 14:02Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 14:03Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 14:03Bill Simmons?

  And just at the point of the career he was at, I just really liked him. He'd been in stuff I liked and the fact that he was in it was like, oh, maybe. But it was even in oh, five, pretty notable that it was a white director. And that's something in twenty twenty five, there's no way a white director makes this movie. I think it's it's zero chance.

• 14:19Speaker 03

  No, it's interesting.

• 14:20Speaker 04

  I don't know.

• 14:21Bill Simmons?

  I don't. You you think not a zero chance?

• 14:23Speaker 04

  I don't, we're just not that far away from Green Book. Like, you know, there's just like it. Uh, every time I think we're done with something like this. Every every time I think we're done, we come back to it, so.

• 14:35Speaker 03

  They'll never stop making Green Book. I have a list of movies like this, like they'll never stop making Green Book. They'll never stop making the movie where white people solve racism. That's going to exist so you guys can feel good about yourselves in perpetuity.

• 14:47Speaker 04

  Thanks.

• 14:47Speaker 03

  Um.

• 14:48Bill Simmons?

  So I'm so happy.

• 14:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, you you guys always will have one of those.

• 14:51Bill Simmons?

  Thanks.

• 14:52Speaker 03

  Um, this movie, though, I feel like can only be made by a white director. Okay.

• 14:59Speaker 04

  Oh, well, yeah.

• 15:00Speaker 03

  Crash. You can't, a black man cannot have directed this movie. Why? Because the movie, it, it's a movie about race that's obviously made by somebody white. Yeah. It ignores, in my opinion, so much historical and contemporary context to put everyone in these trite, stupid, like racial stereotypes. It's working so hard to make you believe that we're all a little good and we're all a little bad. The movie actually has one of the most grotesque scenes of police misconduct that I've seen in a movie, you know what I mean? Beyond like a cop just shooting somebody.

• 15:45Speaker 03

  Yeah. Literally a sexual assault, then has that exact same police officer save the black woman's life? You cannot justify that scene. And I think it was like 12 hours later. And be a, and be a black director. You cannot justify that scene.

• 16:00Speaker 04

  And be the hero, and be the hero in that moment. Matt Dillon running up that hill to be the hero.

• 16:05Speaker 03

  It's a hero shot.

• 16:06Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:07Speaker 03

  Hero music too.

• 16:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:09Speaker 03

  There's, there's like no possible way you could justify that scene if you are Steve McQueen, Barry Jenkins, Ryan Coogler, like you can't, it's impossible.

• 16:20Speaker 04

  Also to your point, I think all the racism is so obvious and broad that it just ignores the subtler, like microaggression factuality of how we navigate our lives. And so everyone is such like a caricature of a racist that can make you feel good, watch you, a white person watching it, and are just like, well, I'm, I'm no Sandra Bullock, so I'm fine. I'm not racist, you know?

• 16:42Speaker 03

  Right. The movie starts off with these, obviously, uh, this is a scene before that, but two guys who we don't know are carjackers, right? One dude is Ludacris's character.

• 16:54Speaker 03

  Is ridiculously hyper aware of every racial microaggression that exists. He's also hyper aware of this entire construct of American racism. And he's even talking about how big the windows on the bus.

• 17:10Speaker 04

  On the bus, sorry.

• 17:10Speaker 03

  All of that stuff, right? He's what you would consider to be woke. However, he is chosen to be a criminal, a criminal with a code that he doesn't rob black people. He's got this entire worldview, this entire politic that he's chosen to go out there and be a criminal. The moment they go, because we got guns, I'm like, yeah. Let's get into it. This guy, he's talking to me, but he's telling me about, yeah, let's, let's, let's, let's go. We're gonna have a wild ride with this one.

• 17:45Bill Simmons?

  First big, uh, best picture film since Rocky in nineteen seventy six to only win three Oscars.

• 17:52Bill Simmons?

  To, uh, to show like, what a shocker this was.

• 17:56Bill Simmons?

  By about the ten year anniversary. The first thing, the end of the decade, that was when the first backlash really happened. By two thousand fifteen, they're writing about it and Paul Haggis, the director. He said, was Crash the best film of the year? I don't think so. Crash, for some reason, affected people, touched people. People still come up to me more than any of my films and say, that film just changed my life. I've heard that dozens and dozens and dozens of times. So did its job there. I mean, I knew it was a social experiment that I wanted. So I think it's a really good social experiment. Is it a great film? I don't know.

• 18:30Speaker 04

  That's also Paul Haggis on his like, I'm no longer a Scientologist tour.

• 18:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 18:35Speaker 04

  That's a whole part of this narrative. Like, why did this win Best Picture? Part of it is Scientology.

• 18:41Bill Simmons?

  Explain.

• 18:42Speaker 04

  Paul Haggis, massive Scientologist, and a lot of this is like Scientology at the height of its secretive power in Hollywood. Before it starts, like in two thousand seven is when you start getting bigger exposes on Scientology. And people start saying like, oh, hey, where is Shelley Miskovich? Like, what has happened in Scientology? Before that, they're operating in the shadows and this is like one of their biggest, you know, Haggis wins for Million Dollar Baby.

• 19:07Bill Simmons?

  He wins the screenwriting.

• 19:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, wins for Crash, does like three films the following year. Like he's on a heater and then he leaves the church of Scientology. And the minute he does, he's gone.

• 19:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 19:19Speaker 04

  And that's just like. I'm sorry. I don't mean to sound like conspiracy Joanna, but that is.

• 19:24Bill Simmons?

  I'll give you the background on him. Longtime TV writer in the eighties, nineties, early two thousands. Won the back to back screenwriter Oscars.

• 19:31Speaker 03

  Walker, Texas Ranger.

• 19:32Bill Simmons?

  Won best film for this movie. Yeah, did Family Law. Was that with the bald guy?

• 19:36Speaker 04

  Uh, I don't know.

• 19:37Bill Simmons?

  Remember Family Law. Uh, thirty five year Scientologist, left in two thousand nine, three years after he wrote Casino Royale, which is like his last big Hollywood thing. And then, uh, he's one of the ugliest Me Too stories.

• 19:49Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 19:49Bill Simmons?

  Had like a civil suit for rape and, uh, got bankrupted by it two years ago. Claimed that church framed him and.

• 19:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 19:57Speaker 03

  Then he had another.

• 19:58Bill Simmons?

  Pretty ugly reading.

• 19:59Speaker 03

  Then he had another thing.

• 20:00Speaker 04

  He got like arrested abroad. Yeah.

• 20:03Bill Simmons?

  So yeah, that's part of the history of this movie.

• 20:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, I don't talk about them people, so.

• 20:07Bill Simmons?

  The cast includes two future Oscar winners.

• 20:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:11Speaker 04

  Brendan Fraser and Sandra Bullock.

• 20:13Bill Simmons?

  Terrence Howard, Matt Dillon, nominated, Cheadle nominated, Michael Pena, Ryan Phillippe, kind of tail end of the Ryan Phillippe era.

• 20:22Speaker 03

  Phillippe.

• 20:22Bill Simmons?

  Uh, you mentioned Newton. How do you say her first name?

• 20:25Speaker 04

  Philipe. Oh, who?

• 20:25Speaker 03

  Is it Philipe?

• 20:26Bill Simmons?

  Tand- Tandoue?

• 20:28Speaker 04

  Oh, Tandoue Newton.

• 20:29Bill Simmons?

  Tandoue Newton?

• 20:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 20:30Bill Simmons?

  I call him Ryan Phillippe.

• 20:31Speaker 03

  That was Tandy. It's Tandy.

• 20:33Speaker 04

  No, she goes by Tandoue Newton.

• 20:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, she changed. She added a W.

• 20:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's very important that she did.

• 20:37Bill Simmons?

  Ryan Filipe, you call him?

• 20:38Speaker 04

  Ryan Philipe.

• 20:39Speaker 03

  Ryan Philippi.

• 20:40Bill Simmons?

  I call him Ryan Phillippe.

• 20:41Speaker 03

  Ryan Philippi. You call Ryan Phillippe?

• 20:43Bill Simmons?

  Well, I'll call him what I want.

• 20:44Speaker 03

  Well, I mean, you can. Like, I'm just saying, I've never heard, I've, I've, I've literally never heard Ryan Phillippe.

• 20:49Bill Simmons?

  You heard it now.

• 20:50Speaker 03

  There you go.

• 20:51Bill Simmons?

  Jennifer Esposito. Ludacris.

• 20:54Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 20:55Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 20:56Bill Simmons?

  Lorenz Tate?

• 20:56Speaker 03

  Yeah. Interesting Lorenz Tate role.

• 21:00Speaker 04

  So.

• 21:00Bill Simmons?

  Why so? I was gonna do this later, but I genuinely like him and I like him in every movie and I don't know why he wasn't a slightly bigger star. He was in a lot of movies that I liked playing guys that I liked in the movie. He had a really nice ten year run and then he just kinda went to TV and that was it.

• 21:17Speaker 03

  It's an interesting role for him because he spent the entire nineties building an undeniable momentum to become a Hollywood star.

• 21:26Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 21:26Bill Simmons?

  Like he kinda was Cheeto five years before Cheeto.

• 21:29Speaker 03

  I mean, he literally went from critically acclaimed performance, New Jack City, right? Um, he, he, he did Dead Presidents, another incredibly in, in, uh, important cultural movie. The Postman, like that's your big, huge Hollywood joint, right? Then he has his starring role.

• 21:48Bill Simmons?

  Couple rom coms?

• 21:49Speaker 03

  A couple of rom coms. He has his, he has Love Jones, beloved film. Then he has Why Do Fools Fall In Love, which he's Frankie Lyman, that's your big biopic. He normally, he spends all of that time building up and then when Crash comes out, he plays, number one, he plays a lot younger. He plays like a twenty one year old, twenty two year old kid, which in and of itself is interesting.

• 22:10Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 22:10Speaker 03

  And then two, he plays

• 22:14Speaker 03

  second fiddle to a lot of people that he, it felt like he should have been on their level.

• 22:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 22:18Speaker 03

  It felt like he should have been, maybe almost, it felt like he ma- he made more sense in actually Don's role.

• 22:25Speaker 04

  Oh, really? At that point?

• 22:26Speaker 03

  Like to, at that point in his career.

• 22:28Bill Simmons?

  Don was the producer.

• 22:29Speaker 03

  I know that Don was the producer and Don was further along in his career than, than what Lorenz was.

• 22:34Bill Simmons?

  Same age, yeah.

• 22:34Speaker 03

  But, but when you, when you looked at it, I was, even when it was on back then, I was like, oh. It, it seemed like a role where he was trying to re-enter the conversation after having a couple of cool years or something like that.

• 22:44Speaker 04

  He is second fiddle to Ludacris in this movie.

• 22:46Speaker 03

  He is for sure.

• 22:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 22:47Bill Simmons?

  Ludacris is a hell of an actor.

• 22:49Speaker 04

  Ludacris is.

• 22:50Bill Simmons?

  I, his IMDB, I was looking at it and I was like, man, I like a lot of these movies.

• 22:53Speaker 04

  Ludacris is genuinely great in this movie.

• 22:55Speaker 03

  I was sup- when you, when I first watched it, I was surprised at how good he was in the movie. I was surprised.

• 23:03Bill Simmons?

  He's good in every Fast movie too.

• 23:05Speaker 04

  I mean, he's good in the Fast movies, but he's not like trying to do anything in the Fast movies.

• 23:08Bill Simmons?

  I just like him. I, I, I think he's good.

• 23:13Bill Simmons?

  So this was inspired by a real life incident where Haggis's Porsche was carjacked in 91 outside a video store in Wilshire Boulevard.

• 23:20Speaker 03

  The movie completely, by the way, just real quick, I didn't know that until I started doing my research on the movie. The movie totally makes sense now.

• 23:28Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 23:29Speaker 03

  Totally.

• 23:30Bill Simmons?

  And he kind of had this idea, followed it away, wrote an outline for it, didn't do anything with it for 10 years.

• 23:34Speaker 03

  He wants to make a movie about all the microaggressions and the societal reasons that he was carjacked. He wants to make a movie about that, but he can't quite do it without bringing everybody else into it. And he feels the need to tell everybody's story to where really the story that he wants to tell.

• 23:55Speaker 04

  It's about being him, a white guy being carjacked.

• 23:57Speaker 03

  He wants to know why that happened to him.

• 23:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 24:00Speaker 03

  And that, and then that ends up becoming this entire movie where he has to kind of litigate why that happens to anyone, why everything happens to everybody. But really, that's what he wants to talk about. It's obvious to me.

• 24:14Bill Simmons?

  Well, he said he wrote Crash to criticize racists and bust liberals for the idea that the US had become a post-racial society.

• 24:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, he got us, got us good.

• 24:24Bill Simmons?

  He showed us. He, they had a $7.5 million budget. He took out three mortgages on his house. They reused locations, tried to save money, the cash took way less. And, uh, and they sold it in Toronto for 3.5 million. Released it in the spring of 05, built it wide, put out the DVDs in the fall. And then Oprah, that was the big stamp of approval.

• 24:50Speaker 04

  That sounds right.

• 24:50Bill Simmons?

  The whole cast comes on the show in October. Oprah stamps the show, the movie. Then they decide to put DVDs to the different guilds. They were the first movie to send the DVDs to all the guild members. And all of a sudden you win a Best Picture Oscar.

• 25:05Speaker 04

  Screenagate, love it.

• 25:07Bill Simmons?

  They created it. Oprah and screeners.

• 25:11Speaker 04

  Oprah and screeners.

• 25:13Speaker 03

  So I remember two things about the Oprah thing. Number one, I remember the big deal that it was that Ludacris was on Oprah's show. He was on Oprah's show as Chris Bridges. Oprah didn't really have rappers on her show.

• 25:23Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 25:23Speaker 03

  And Ludacris went on the show and he kind of called her out on it and yeah, and they kind of went back and forth. And I think part of it was taken out of the show and it was a big deal during the Oprah hates hip hop era.

• 25:34Bill Simmons?

  What an era that was.

• 25:35Speaker 03

  It was a huge era. It was a big era. And then also, we should do a retrospective on Oprah's decision making.

• 25:43Speaker 04

  We really should.

• 25:45Bill Simmons?

  Want to do that now or after the break? Let's do it after the break.

• 25:51Bill Simmons?

  All right, Van, retrospective on Oprah's decision making. Wasn't expecting this in the outline.

• 25:57Speaker 04

  Here we go. We're coming for Scientology and Oprah.

• 25:59Bill Simmons?

  Let's do it. No, Van's not going near Scientology. So I said, stay away.

• 26:04Speaker 03

  Like I one time saw them people on Hollywood Boulevard, like recording people's faces. Y'all got it. Whatever y'all need.

• 26:11Speaker 04

  But you're not scared of Oprah?

• 26:13Speaker 03

  Not, not as much.

• 26:14Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 26:14Speaker 03

  Not, not as much because this, because I love Oprah, but this is with love.

• 26:18Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 26:18Speaker 03

  We gotta look, we have to look back at some of the decisions. Number one, Oz, Dr. Phil, obviously we took two huge L's there.

• 26:25Speaker 04

  Correct.

• 26:26Speaker 03

  Um, Crash the movie.

• 26:28Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 26:28Speaker 03

  Okay. What was the guy that wrote the movie and wrote the book and he was on Oprah and the book was great?

• 26:33Bill Simmons?

  Oh, and he turned out to be a plagiarist, kind of?

• 26:35Speaker 03

  Turned out the guy didn't write the book.

• 26:37Speaker 04

  James Frey.

• 26:38Speaker 03

  I think that somebody should do like an Oprah spreadsheet.

• 26:42Bill Simmons?

  Ringer narrative pod?

• 26:43Speaker 03

  Ringer narrative pod.

• 26:45Bill Simmons?

  Episode three, the guy who lied about his book?

• 26:47Speaker 03

  A spreadsheet about the things that Oprah has put us on and whether or not it's actually been super dope.

• 26:55Bill Simmons?

  You know what? You miss a hundred percent of the shots.

• 26:57Speaker 04

  Are you gonna call it like Oprah Lose Free?

• 27:00Speaker 03

  There you go.

• 27:01Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 27:02Speaker 03

  There you go.

• 27:02Speaker 04

  Doesn't roll off the tongue, but we can, we can workshop it.

• 27:05Bill Simmons?

  That's an interesting title. I like it, Joe.

• 27:07Speaker 04

  Um, I don't. Well, here's my question about Paul Haggis pitches this show, pitches this as a TV show.

• 27:14Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 27:14Speaker 04

  What does Crash the TV show look like?

• 27:16Bill Simmons?

  Well, we found out they made it on Star.

• 27:18Speaker 04

  Oh, my God.

• 27:18Bill Simmons?

  Dennis Opper.

• 27:19Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:19Bill Simmons?

  And then he died.

• 27:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:21Speaker 04

  But what is it?

• 27:22Bill Simmons?

  So he died. That's why the show got canceled.

• 27:24Speaker 04

  Well, what does it look like in the mid 2000s? Where is it airing?

• 27:29Speaker 03

  It's HBO.

• 27:30Speaker 04

  Showtime.

• 27:30Bill Simmons?

  I would say Showtime.

• 27:31Speaker 04

  No.

• 27:31Speaker 03

  HBO passes.

• 27:32Speaker 04

  Showtime is a great, it's a great call.

• 27:33Bill Simmons?

  HBO passes. Might be stars, because it was on Star.

• 27:37Speaker 04

  I think it's Showtime. I think you're right.

• 27:39Bill Simmons?

  How about 10 years later, is Crash, where is it a Netflix?

• 27:43Speaker 03

  It's for sure Netflix.

• 27:44Bill Simmons?

  It's the fourth show they make. So, a couple other things. Terrence Howard, we mentioned huge year. Bullock is in the movie for like, less than 10 minutes, but was really important.

• 27:54Speaker 04

  I remembered her being in it so much more, yeah.

• 27:57Bill Simmons?

  Here's, I'm gonna, before we get to the categories, who's the worst person in this movie?

• 28:03Speaker 04

  Ryan Phillippe.

• 28:06Bill Simmons?

  Why? Why do you think?

• 28:07Speaker 04

  I think it's super miscast.

• 28:09Bill Simmons?

  No, how about, I'm saying character, not actor.

• 28:11Speaker 04

  Oh, worst character?

• 28:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 28:13Speaker 04

  Well, he also does a murder, but, um.

• 28:15Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I mean.

• 28:16Speaker 04

  So, it's not a bad pick. What about Fickner?

• 28:21Speaker 03

  I gotta be honest with you. That scene between Fickner and, and, uh, Cheadle? That is the one scene in the movie that overwhelmingly works to me.

• 28:34Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I think that Tony Danza scene's good.

• 28:36Speaker 03

  That's a good scene, too.

• 28:37Speaker 04

  I think the Danza scene.

• 28:38Bill Simmons?

  I thought that was one of the most realistic scenes.

• 28:40Speaker 04

  That's the one that's closest to like, an actual conversation that a human has had in their life.

• 28:44Speaker 03

  But either one of those things, either one of those scenes, like, I've literally been both of those black dudes.

• 28:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 28:50Speaker 03

  Like, I've been the black dude where some white guy's like, like, sitting you down and he's telling you, you just don't know when to take a win. Like, you need to do, you have to get a little dirty to get what you need to do. And I've also been the other guy, I fucking got fired for that. I also have been the, I've been the guy where they're trying to tell you to ramp it up a little bit.

• 29:10Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 29:11Speaker 03

  And you're like, don't tell me how, but I didn't, he cut that.

• 29:15Bill Simmons?

  I, I apologize for that.

• 29:17Speaker 03

  You've never, don't even play like that.

• 29:20Speaker 03

  Don't even, don't even, don't even play like that, because people will believe that.

• 29:26Speaker 04

  But in that first conversation, the one, the one that you said, the Cheadle Figner conversation, when you had that conversation, did that person say to you, "Black people, am I right?" Is that something that they said with their mouth to you?

• 29:37Speaker 03

  What, they don't, the, obviously that they played a scene up a little bit. They don't say it like that though. But what they do is they rap. They, they're trying to get to their end.

• 29:49Bill Simmons?

  It's a shit sandwich as a gift.

• 29:51Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:51Bill Simmons?

  They're presenting.

• 29:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 29:52Speaker 03

  They're trying to get to their end and they tell you, "Listen, you're not gonna be able to do what you wanna do by staying pure. You're gonna have to get dirty and play the optics of it."

• 30:03Bill Simmons?

  This is how the world works.

• 30:04Speaker 03

  This is how it works.

• 30:05Speaker 04

  Yeah, that conversation, just not the way that it plays out inside of this movie.

• 30:10Speaker 03

  No, cuz he, he said all that to grab his attention, to like rope, to like rope him in and, and, and make him know that I'm shooting straight with you.

• 30:18Bill Simmons?

  I think the worst character in the movie as a human being is Sandra Bullock.

• 30:24Speaker 04

  It's.

• 30:24Bill Simmons?

  It's completely unredeeming in every way. There's not one redeeming thing. I was gonna bring that up later. Is this, did she create the Karen character?

• 30:32Speaker 03

  But see, you could.

• 30:33Bill Simmons?

  Is this the first Karen in the movie?

• 30:34Speaker 04

  As I, your most Karen adjacent, uh, member of the Ringer staff, um, I, she's way worse than a Karen. Like a Karen, this is, cuz the thing about a Karen is that it's sometimes subtle or insidious.

• 30:48Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 30:48Speaker 04

  And that's, there's no subtlety here with this character. You know what I mean?

• 30:52Speaker 03

  I still go for Matt Dillon and I'll tell you why. Like.

• 30:55Bill Simmons?

  Wow, it's a good choice.

• 30:56Speaker 04

  It's a great choice.

• 30:57Speaker 03

  So.

• 30:57Bill Simmons?

  So I'm not gonna argue it.

• 30:59Speaker 03

  So.

• 30:59Speaker 04

  Guys, there's no bad options in this movie.

• 31:01Speaker 03

  It's true. With, with, with, they don't give Michael Pena any, he's got no red in his ledger.

• 31:08Speaker 04

  That's true.

• 31:08Speaker 03

  He's a, he's, he's the only character maybe in the movie.

• 31:11Bill Simmons?

  Well, he's the answer to the other question, which is who's the best character in this movie?

• 31:14Speaker 04

  Easily.

• 31:15Speaker 03

  Easily. It's easily him, uh, easily him. So.

• 31:19Bill Simmons?

  They probably deleted a domestic violence scene with him or something. He was like, I gotta make them not like him.

• 31:24Speaker 03

  Um, but she gets traumatized early in the movie. And the thing about that is that, like, her fear gets validated. She's like, she's scared of the guys.

• 31:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, she's holding the purse.

• 31:36Speaker 03

  But at the same time, they actually robbed her. So the rest of the time that like, she's freaking out about stuff, you're thinking, well. Her instincts were right before. You could almost like argue it away as being as her being.

• 31:49Bill Simmons?

  Validated.

• 31:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, validated a little bit. But with him, he literally is having issues in another area of his life. He's the nightmare police officer. He's the he's the cop that's having a bad situation at home, that's having a bad day, that got stuck in traffic, and because of that, he kills or assaults you. Like, he did save the lady at the end, and he is going through something with his father, but that's like the worst version of the fear that a lot of people have on the police.

• 32:17Speaker 04

  I think there's also, I mean, for me, it's it's because it's all systemic. Uh, the the Brendan Fraser character and the Fickner character and that whole, you know, office. Again, it's it's like it's settler, especially the Brendan Fraser character, who you could argue if you're watching it, you think, well, he's close to a good guy. He doesn't want his wife to say racist shit inside of his house and stuff like that. But like, no, there's there's nastiness there, too. And the nastiness that's hidden, I think, is much scarier than her, you know, spewing it around the house.

• 32:52Speaker 03

  At the end, though, it looked like Brendan Fraser was.

• 32:55Speaker 04

  Oh, he's definitely fucking her.

• 32:56Speaker 03

  Getting it in. That's the type of shit that we're talking about.

• 32:59Bill Simmons?

  Deleted scene there, definitely.

• 33:00Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 33:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 33:01Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 33:02Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 33:02Speaker 03

  Nonna Gay, 100 miles an hour. Jesus, where's Nonna at?

• 33:06Bill Simmons?

  I interviewed her at the Ali junket. I told you about that.

• 33:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, how'd that go?

• 33:10Bill Simmons?

  She's unbelievable. I don't know why she wasn't a gigantic star. I don't really understand it.

• 33:14Speaker 03

  It seemed like she didn't want it.

• 33:16Bill Simmons?

  I don't think she did.

• 33:17Speaker 03

  And because there was there's a moment here, there's this, the Matrix, I'm missing one, oh, and Ali.

• 33:22Bill Simmons?

  She was one of the most beautiful actresses of that decade. It felt like it was all sitting there for her.

• 33:26Speaker 03

  It kind of seemed like at the end, she just kind of, she wasn't into it.

• 33:29Bill Simmons?

  Probably. Uh, 6.5 million dollar budget made 98.4 million, lowest grossing film domestically to win Best Picture in 18 years, Last Emperor.

• 33:40Speaker 04

  That's a great film.

• 33:41Bill Simmons?

  One Oscars for Picture Screenplay Editing, nominated for Director, Matt Dillon, and one more. Roger Ebert, here we go. We love Roger Ebert. Every once in a while, he misses. The great ones miss. Larry Bird missed a couple of game winners. Michael Jordan missed a couple of game winners.

• 33:56Speaker 04

  Roger Luthbert.

• 33:57Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Four stars. Best film of oh five. Quote, "Not many films have the possibility of making their audiences better people.

• 34:07Bill Simmons?

  I don't expect Crash to work any miracles. But I believe anyone seeing it is likely to be moved to have a little more sympathy for people not like themselves."

• 34:16Speaker 03

  Give the context, though.

• 34:18Bill Simmons?

  What's the context?

• 34:20Speaker 03

  Give the context about Raj. Why this movie might have touched him and affected him.

• 34:24Speaker 04

  Oh, because of his wife?

• 34:25Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:27Bill Simmons?

  Well, you think that's it?

• 34:28Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think he watched, I think, I think that he watched the movie and...

• 34:33Speaker 04

  What do you think she thought of the movie?

• 34:34Speaker 03

  She probably was like, Raj, that shit sucks. But she was like, she was probably like, I don't want to hear no more about that. Get that movie out of here. But he probably felt like in a place where he's been probably judged and people have made a lot of decisions about him and his life because he's married to a black lady. He probably looked at the movie and went, huh, I get it because some of the shit that Raj has probably got probably came from the black community, which sometimes can be deified in conversations about race relations.

• 35:06Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 35:06Speaker 03

  So a movie that paints everybody as a little fucked up, he probably was fucking with it a little bit, a little more than than another critic would be.

• 35:14Bill Simmons?

  After the Oscars, he said, "As someone who felt Brokeback was a great film, but Crash a greater one."

• 35:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 35:22Bill Simmons?

  "I would have been pleased if either had won." And then he said about Crash, "It's not a safe harbor, but a film that takes the discussion of racism in America in a direction it has not gone before in the movies, directing attention at those who congratulate themselves on not being racist, including liberals and/or minority group members."

• 35:39Speaker 03

  See?

• 35:41Speaker 03

  They, see? They're like, and/or minority group members. Raj was tired of people looking at him crazy at the NAACP award.

• 35:48Speaker 04

  And he's like, you're racist too.

• 35:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly.

• 35:50Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 35:51Speaker 03

  Same thing.

• 35:51Bill Simmons?

  Coates called it "the worst film of the decade" in 2009. This was the first wave of the backlash. He said, "I don't think there's a single human being in Crash. Arguments and propaganda violently bumping into each other, impressed with their own quirkiness. It's a kind of unthinking and curious nihilistic multiculturalism. Nothing tempers my extremism more than watching a fellow liberal exhort the virtues of Crash."

• 36:16Bill Simmons?

  Then he just goes on and on and on, killing it.

• 36:20Bill Simmons?

  Let's get to the categories. What's the perfect age to see this movie? Exactly.

• 36:26Speaker 03

  Oh shit.

• 36:27Bill Simmons?

  I have sixty-five.

• 36:29Speaker 04

  Oh, I wrote, I wrote fifteen, Baby's, Baby's First Racism.

• 36:33Bill Simmons?

  Hmm. Oh, interesting.

• 36:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 36:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:37Bill Simmons?

  What do you think? You the tiebreaker, fifteen or sixty-five?

• 36:39Speaker 03

  I'm gonna go in the middle. I'm gonna go like twenty-three.

• 36:42Bill Simmons?

  Why? Oh.

• 36:43Speaker 03

  Because I, I think that it, twenty-three is at the point where you could have, which is the perfect response to Crash. It's called the ten-minute regret.

• 36:58Speaker 03

  Crash is a ten-minute regret movie. We've all seen it before, where you leave a movie and you go, shit, that shit was, okay, yeah, that shit was pretty good, man. I see what they was doing. And then on the drive home, by the time you make it home, you're like, man, fuck that movie. Like, you see, you know what I'm saying? By the time you make it home.

• 37:15Bill Simmons?

  I like that.

• 37:16Speaker 04

  I've heard, I've heard Van drop this take on like countless superhero movies.

• 37:20Speaker 03

  It, it happens all the time. Like, you, you leave the theater and you're like, they did it. And then by the time you get home, you're like, man, that shit sucked. Like, it, it, and, and Crash is the perfect movie and the perfect time at twenty-three, twenty-four, you think you know the world. You know just enough to know that what you saw is bullshit.

• 37:37Bill Simmons?

  There's a cousin to the ten-minute take, which was my stepfather after we saw Godfather Three.

• 37:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 37:43Bill Simmons?

  Which is the, I've just lost my leg because it got bit by a shark, but my dad is telling me it's okay. We're leaving Godfather, he's like, no, no, it was okay. It was okay. It was good. There was some good stuff in there. And I was like, I have a bloody stump for right leg.

• 37:56Speaker 04

  I think seeing it when you're younger and thinking it's really saying something and then watching it again with your, when you're a little older.

• 38:03Bill Simmons?

  I think Joe's right, but I think old people still, the sixty-five and up crowd. Craig, what do you have?

• 38:08Speaker 05

  I, I literally wrote down seventy-two-year-old, rich, white man, because those are all the people that voted for this movie at the Oscars.

• 38:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's true.

• 38:14Speaker 05

  It's so validating for every old, rich, white dude.

• 38:16Speaker 04

  Correct.

• 38:16Bill Simmons?

  Can't wait for Craig's take later. Categories. Most rewatchable scene. Carjacking scene. It's a good scene.

• 38:22Speaker 04

  I say, uh, Pania and his daughter.

• 38:26Bill Simmons?

  Well, we're gonna list a bunch of them.

• 38:27Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 38:28Bill Simmons?

  You have Pania and the daughter?

• 38:29Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 38:30Bill Simmons?

  The locksmith scene?

• 38:33Bill Simmons?

  Both being just a bitch from hell as, as poor Michael Pena's working on her door.

• 38:39Speaker 01

  I would like the locks changed again in the morning. And you know what? You might mention that we'd appreciate it if next time they didn't send a gang member.

• 38:47Speaker 03

  A gang member?

• 38:47Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 38:48Speaker 03

  What, you mean that kid in there?

• 38:49Speaker 01

  Yes, the guy in there with the shaved head, the pants around his ass, the prison tattoo.

• 38:53Speaker 03

  Those are not prison tattoos.

• 38:54Speaker 01

  Oh, really? And he's not gonna go sell our key to one of his gang banger friends the moment he is out our door.

• 38:58Speaker 03

  We've had a really tough night. I think it'd be best if you just went upstairs right now.

• 39:02Speaker 01

  And what, wait for them to break in? I just had a gun pointed in my face.

• 39:07Speaker 03

  You lower your voice.

• 39:08Speaker 01

  And it was my fault because I knew it was gonna happen. But if a white person sees two black men walking towards her and she turns and walks in the other direction, she's a racist, right? Well, I got scared and I didn't say anything and 10 seconds later, I had a gun in my face. Now, I am telling you, your amigo in there is gonna sell our key to one of his homies. And this time it'd be really fucking great if you acted like you actually gave a shit.

• 39:32Speaker 03

  This motherfucker, Michael Pena, was going through it.

• 39:35Bill Simmons?

  He really was.

• 39:36Speaker 03

  He, he, like, like, it's two weeks. This is like two fucking days.

• 39:40Speaker 01

  It's four, it's 24 hours.

• 39:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, like, so he, he literally catches two calls. One, where he gets called a gang member when he's a loving devoted father.

• 39:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 39:51Speaker 03

  And then the other one, where he tries to tell the guy, like...

• 39:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, fix your door.

• 39:56Speaker 03

  Fix your door, and the guy goes off on him and then wants to murder him later on.

• 40:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:03Bill Simmons?

  The locks missing.

• 40:06Bill Simmons?

  Brendan Fraser not being able to tell the difference between black and Iraqi? Kind of an underrated racist moment in the movie.

• 40:11Speaker 01

  That's what I'm saying.

• 40:11Bill Simmons?

  He gets swallowed up by 28 other racist moments.

• 40:13Speaker 01

  He's a, he's a stealth winner there.

• 40:17Bill Simmons?

  The Dylan Newton harassment scene, I don't, I don't know if rewatchable is the right word, but it's a pretty affecting scene, like, and I think Terrence Howard...

• 40:24Speaker 01

  I think she's really good in that scene.

• 40:25Bill Simmons?

  Terrence Howard and her are both like fantastic in that scene.

• 40:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:28Bill Simmons?

  Terrence Howard's great in that scene, like, the way his demeanor slowly changes. That's the confusing thing about this movie is the actors are really good in it.

• 40:35Speaker 03

  They all are, and they got top flight actors. I tell you something about this movie, though.

• 40:40Speaker 03

  Terrence Howard doubled up really well in this movie. What I mean, in his career. Having DJ from Hustle and Flow.

• 40:48Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 40:49Speaker 03

  Come right after this was a gift. It was a gift that these movies were out at the same time. Cause if not, this is the type of movie that could Orlando Bloom you from Troy. I don't think Orlando Bloom ever recovered from Troy. Cause he was too much of a bitch. Okay. He was, he was, he, I'm sorry. Orlando Bloom was the man. And then in Troy, he was just such a bitch. That I think it really hurt him for years to come. And his character is so feckless in this movie. That is the kind of thing that can stain you. Particularly with the, with the community for a while.

• 41:23Bill Simmons?

  Interesting.

• 41:23Speaker 03

  But DJ kinda got him back there. Cause DJ was a straight G.

• 41:27Speaker 04

  I'm so confused though, but he's throwing trash into a car fire at the end of the movie. Isn't that a, a show of strength and character growth?

• 41:33Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, he got his strength back.

• 41:35Speaker 03

  He never got it back.

• 41:36Bill Simmons?

  Throwing, throwing stuff in the fire.

• 41:38Speaker 03

  He, he never got it back. Brave roll though, I seriously brave roll to tell.

• 41:41Bill Simmons?

  And he had a, a lot of issues to say the least in his personal life.

• 41:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, certainly.

• 41:46Bill Simmons?

  Terrence Howard.

• 41:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 41:48Bill Simmons?

  If those issues don't happen, I think, I think we.

• 41:51Speaker 04

  If those issues don't happen, he's still roadie, like.

• 41:55Bill Simmons?

  I think he would have been in a bunch of great stuff. I think it made him un-hireable for a couple of years there.

• 42:00Speaker 03

  Oh, I mean, I'll say this, he's had a fantastic career even still like.

• 42:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, but I think this, when, when he started having his issues.

• 42:07Speaker 04

  I think it's a test.

• 42:08Bill Simmons?

  Right at the time, he would have been drifting off these two movies.

• 42:10Speaker 04

  My thing is a testament to how talented he is, is that he kept getting hired after these things became obvious.

• 42:15Speaker 03

  Cause think about it, Prisoners is after this.

• 42:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:18Speaker 03

  Empire is after this.

• 42:19Bill Simmons?

  Oh, yeah.

• 42:20Speaker 03

  Like he, and, and he's back now. He's the world's smartest man. He's figuring out astrophysics and all kinds of shit.

• 42:26Speaker 04

  He was the first hired onto Iron Man, the first actor.

• 42:29Speaker 03

  Highest paid, highest paid, yeah.

• 42:32Bill Simmons?

  Couple more, the Tony Danza scene.

• 42:35Speaker 02

  Have you noticed, uh, this is weird for a white guy to say, but have you noticed? He's talking a lot less black lately.

• 42:45Speaker 03

  No, I haven't noticed that.

• 42:46Speaker 02

  Really? Like in this scene? I was supposed to say, don't be talking about that. And he changed it to, don't talk to me about that.

• 42:53Speaker 03

  Wait a minute, wait a minute. You think because of that, the audience won't recognize him as being a black man?

• 43:00Speaker 02

  Is there a problem, Cam? Excuse me?

• 43:04Speaker 06

  Is there a problem, Cam?

• 43:05Bill Simmons?

  Terrence Howard, there was an oral history about this movie and Terrence Howard said about the Tony Danza scene. I remember Paul telling me about when he worked for a network, there were execs who told black jokes. And his black colleagues had to just laugh along. He wondered what their lives were like and what it felt like to be ethnically neutered.

• 43:21Speaker 03

  Shit.

• 43:23Bill Simmons?

  Tony Danza, by the way, incredible stunt casting.

• 43:26Speaker 03

  Never, I don't think, thought I could see him like that.

• 43:30Speaker 04

  Never before since his dance had done something like that, I think, so.

• 43:33Bill Simmons?

  No way. And he's pretty good in it. I was kind of surprised. Uh, Dylan Saves Newton. Just a really well filmed scene. It's absurd. I, I think if I'm her, I'd just rather die in the car.

• 43:46Speaker 04

  That scene makes me sick to watch, honestly.

• 43:47Bill Simmons?

  It's really well done, though.

• 43:49Speaker 03

  I have a new category. I have least rewatchable scenes. This movie has. Several least rewatchable scenes.

• 43:55Bill Simmons?

  And that Terrence Howard getting carjacked and then fighting back would be the only other one I have, but.

• 44:00Speaker 03

  See, so that's one of the more absurd scenes in the movie that kind of works. Like.

• 44:05Bill Simmons?

  That they don't check the car, they don't, nothing.

• 44:08Speaker 04

  First, Cam.

• 44:09Speaker 03

  Okay, our bad. Like him sort of getting to the thing and he's in front of the cops. Because actually, I've seen people that are just tired of taking shit. Make mistakes with the police like that to where they just, you're taking the wrong time with the wrong group of people to assert your manhood. And I'm not gonna let you tell me to move and all of that stuff, that, that kind of thing, actually, they might have stumbled onto something that actually kind of happens.

• 44:35Bill Simmons?

  So what do you have for most rewatchable scene?

• 44:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, Michael Pena and his daughter.

• 44:39Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 44:39Speaker 04

  Like the invisible cloak scene.

• 44:41Bill Simmons?

  Man.

• 44:41Speaker 03

  I got, uh, Lickner and Cheadle. That, I watched that scene.

• 44:47Bill Simmons?

  Fickner?

• 44:47Speaker 04

  Fickner.

• 44:47Speaker 03

  Fickner, I'm sorry, Fickner, Lickner.

• 44:49Bill Simmons?

  He's doing with Ryan Phillippe?

• 44:52Speaker 04

  William Lickner.

• 44:53Speaker 03

  I got, I have him and Cheadle. I actually watched that scene three times. I think that's a great scene. I think it's, uh, I think Cheadle is great in the scene. And I just think that's like, that's actually a legitimately great movie scene to me.

• 45:06Speaker 06

  You know, I know all the sociological reasons why, per capita, eight times more black men are incarcerated than white men. Schools are a disgrace. Lack of opportunity, bias in the judicial system, all that stuff, all that stuff, but still, it's, it's gotta get to you on a gut level as a black man. They just can't keep their hands out of the cookie jar.

• 45:26Bill Simmons?

  I'm a Fickner fan.

• 45:27Speaker 04

  I love Fickner.

• 45:28Speaker 03

  Fickner's good in everything.

• 45:30Speaker 04

  Fickner doing voice only work in Mr. And Mrs. Smith is one of my like top tier stealth great performances.

• 45:36Bill Simmons?

  Uh, what's the most two thousand five thing about this movie, Joanna?

• 45:41Speaker 04

  Um, the landline on Sandra Bullock that she drops as she falls down the stairs.

• 45:45Bill Simmons?

  Ooh, landline.

• 45:46Speaker 03

  That's really good.

• 45:47Bill Simmons?

  My dad still has a landline.

• 45:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 45:48Bill Simmons?

  Won't give it up.

• 45:49Speaker 03

  Oh, does he?

• 45:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 45:50Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 45:52Bill Simmons?

  I have no camera phones and unironic racism.

• 45:56Speaker 03

  Huh.

• 45:57Speaker 04

  Unironic racism is an enduring legacy, Bill. But yeah, no one filming any of this police stuff.

• 46:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, they, if they're doing this in twenty twenty five, somebody's filming something at some point in one of these scenes.

• 46:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:12Bill Simmons?

  What do you have, Ann?

• 46:12Speaker 03

  Smoking in Los Angeles.

• 46:15Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 46:17Speaker 03

  Smoking in Los Angeles.

• 46:17Bill Simmons?

  Happier times.

• 46:18Speaker 03

  Like people just, he's like, he's just ripping cigs, going crazy, smoking in Los Angeles, yeah.

• 46:23Bill Simmons?

  What stage the best, we mentioned Michael Pena. This is an important Michael Pena movie. It gets the train rolling for him as a movie guy. Uh, I'm a huge fan of his. I actually wish he was in more stuff.

• 46:34Speaker 04

  I agree.

• 46:36Bill Simmons?

  I was, I was so fired up when he was in Landman. And then spoiler.

• 46:40Speaker 04

  And then he was fired up.

• 46:42Bill Simmons?

  And then he was literally fired up because they blew him up.

• 46:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:45Bill Simmons?

  In one episode.

• 46:46Speaker 03

  I haven't seen it yet.

• 46:47Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Um, what do you have for what stage the best, anything?

• 46:49Speaker 03

  Uh, the MCU, a lot of MCU peeps in this.

• 46:53Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 46:53Speaker 03

  Yeah. Two different roadies. Both roadies are in this movie. Double roadie. Michael Pena.

• 47:00Speaker 04

  Michael Pena.

• 47:00Speaker 03

  Well, I think I wrote them down here. Um, uh, um, the dude who helped Iron Man is the shop owner.

• 47:10Speaker 04

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 47:11Bill Simmons?

  Oh, the Persian guy.

• 47:12Speaker 03

  The Persian guy.

• 47:13Bill Simmons?

  You're right.

• 47:14Speaker 03

  Who helped Iron Man.

• 47:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 47:15Bill Simmons?

  Oh, so he should win the that guy award. I forgot that he was in that.

• 47:18Speaker 03

  There's another great that guy in this one too, but like the guy who helped Iron Man and then, and Michael Pena, Luis.

• 47:25Speaker 03

  So I'm looking at the movie and I'm saying all of the MCU people that are that are in the movie. The MCU's.

• 47:31Bill Simmons?

  What do you have for what stage the best, anything good?

• 47:33Speaker 04

  Indictment of the LAPD, top to bottom.

• 47:36Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 47:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's age nicely.

• 47:37Speaker 03

  You know something else about the movie that makes it very two, two thousand and five? So the film is actually coming off the worst, like criticizing the LAPD now is actually kind of trying. People don't actually do it as much as they used to. It's not a top of mind thing anymore. There's still obviously a lot to talk about, but this movie kind of buttons that up a little bit. Like the, the, the conversation around the LAPD, the LAPD was by far the most notorious police department.

• 48:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 48:03Speaker 03

  In America throughout the nineties.

• 48:05Bill Simmons?

  It was a nineties thing that I think people have forgotten about a little bit. And Crash was like, we're bringing it back.

• 48:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, I will say, uh, critique of the health insurance industry.

• 48:14Bill Simmons?

  Oh, that's a good what's age.

• 48:15Speaker 03

  That's aged the best.

• 48:16Bill Simmons?

  Look at Joe. First free watchable, she's doing great.

• 48:19Speaker 03

  Throwing heat.

• 48:20Bill Simmons?

  Really doing great. Um, I have a what's aged the best because I didn't notice this until I watched this movie twice in six days. The very ending, when the car gets rear ended, that's Shaniqua.

• 48:32Speaker 04

  Yeah, Laura Devine, yeah.

• 48:33Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I, I just some, for some reason didn't notice that. And the insurance guy. Yeah.

• 48:38Speaker 03

  That's who?

• 48:39Bill Simmons?

  The insurance guy.

• 48:40Speaker 03

  I know, but who, but who is that though?

• 48:42Bill Simmons?

  Shaniqua.

• 48:43Speaker 03

  I just never thought I'd hear you.

• 48:45Speaker 04

  Did you hear you say Shaniqua?

• 48:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:47Bill Simmons?

  It was the character's name.

• 48:48Speaker 03

  Okay, I know, I'm with it. Shaniqua.

• 48:50Bill Simmons?

  Shaniqua.

• 48:50Speaker 03

  Put a little sauce on it.

• 48:52Speaker 04

  Don't do that. Don't take the bait. Don't take the bait.

• 48:55Speaker 03

  This is an American ad, though.

• 48:56Bill Simmons?

  I'm not taking your bait.

• 48:59Bill Simmons?

  I have, uh, Keith David, who I love in every movie. He pops in this one.

• 49:03Speaker 03

  And just delivers.

• 49:05Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:05Speaker 03

  And just delivers in that one scene.

• 49:07Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:08Bill Simmons?

  I'd say the cast is a what's aged the best for me. That's a good scene, that's a good scene.

• 49:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, Keith David scene is very good.

• 49:13Speaker 03

  But do you understand though, that like, if there's a, this guy is riding high, right? Because he just won an academy where he can do whatever he wants. There's a version of this movie that has more scenes like the Keith David scene, more scenes like the Figner scene. That's not as.

• 49:32Speaker 04

  You're talking about Haggis riding high off of Million Dollar Baby?

• 49:34Speaker 03

  Yeah, what I'm saying is like, the movie loses itself in how important it actually thinks that it is.

• 49:39Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 49:40Speaker 03

  Because that scene with him. Is a perfectly good scene.

• 49:44Speaker 04

  I agree.

• 49:44Speaker 03

  Where a black man in authority is saying, you're not gonna fuck this up for me. And it can be fucked up. This is what you're gonna do.

• 49:51Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 49:51Speaker 03

  This is how we're gonna work this around. Like, that works.

• 49:54Speaker 04

  And that's under, for me, that's under the umbrella of the LAPD indictment because there's like Keith, from Keith David to Ryan Phillippe and everything in between. It's just like, there's no good corner at the LAPD in this movie.

• 50:05Bill Simmons?

  I have one more, what's aged the best? But you guys, if you have anything left, tell me now.

• 50:09Speaker 03

  Uh, no.

• 50:11Bill Simmons?

  I like when Sandra Bullock gets a little, gets a little randy with her movie picks.

• 50:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:18Bill Simmons?

  I like angry, angry bitchy Sandra Bullock. Like, she did it in, uh, The Blind Side was like a totally different character for her. I liked her in, what's the movie, when she gets gravity?

• 50:28Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 50:29Bill Simmons?

  I just, I, I felt like she, like the seesaw of her with like rom-coms versus her pushing herself to, and maybe Hollywood didn't take her seriously as like a serious actress, but I think she's a really good actress.

• 50:42Speaker 03

  Well, she won Academy Award.

• 50:44Bill Simmons?

  I know she did.

• 50:44Speaker 03

  Yeah, so the.

• 50:45Bill Simmons?

  But I, I think she just got pigeonholed in this like Julia Roberts, Meg Ryan category for like almost two decades.

• 50:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:52Bill Simmons?

  And then it finally kind of broke out of it a little bit late, but I was, I just think she's really good.

• 50:56Speaker 04

  And then she made All About Steve and changed it all around for herself, you know what I mean?

• 50:59Bill Simmons?

  I'm pro Bullock, is my point.

• 51:01Speaker 03

  I like her a lot too.

• 51:02Bill Simmons?

  What's aged the best is Bullock.

• 51:03Speaker 03

  You know what the funny thing is? You just brought up Gravity.

• 51:06Bill Simmons?

  That movie's good. It's on the rewatch list.

• 51:08Speaker 03

  Have I been neuralized? I completely forgot about how much I loved and enjoyed that movie.

• 51:13Speaker 04

  People don't talk about it.

• 51:14Bill Simmons?

  You'll be getting on the rewatch list this year.

• 51:16Speaker 03

  Interstellar is talked about every six weeks for some random reason. Interstellar is fucking great.

• 51:22Bill Simmons?

  Whatever.

• 51:22Speaker 03

  You don't like Interstellar?

• 51:23Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 51:25Speaker 03

  You don't like, are you a Nolan guy? Hold on for a second, just allow me 30 seconds of Lantu.

• 51:29Bill Simmons?

  I like Gravity.

• 51:30Speaker 03

  I like Gravity as well, but you don't fuck with Interstellar at all?

• 51:33Bill Simmons?

  I, I don't, I haven't watched it since the year it came out.

• 51:36Speaker 04

  You should rewatch it.

• 51:37Speaker 03

  You should rewatch it.

• 51:38Speaker 04

  That's actually a really good rewatchable. That one gets better every time you watch it.

• 51:41Bill Simmons?

  Let's sit that one out. What?

• 51:44Speaker 05

  What about Inception? Do you like Inception?

• 51:46Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 51:47Speaker 03

  Oh, you don't like Christopher Nolan? Never mind, move on.

• 51:48Bill Simmons?

  Inception's too weird.

• 51:49Speaker 03

  You don't like?

• 51:50Speaker 04

  Memento?

• 51:52Bill Simmons?

  Love Memento.

• 51:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, you're a Memento guy.

• 51:54Speaker 03

  Oh, so you're early Nolan?

• 51:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 51:56Bill Simmons?

  I, I love Dark Knight.

• 51:58Speaker 03

  That's kinda Nolan. It's like Nolan Batman.

• 52:00Bill Simmons?

  I respect all the Nolan movies. I just like, I wouldn't like crank up, oh, let me get Inception on Blu-ray and crank this out. I think Inception's a polarizing movie, though.

• 52:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 52:09Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 52:10Speaker 04

  So is Interstellar.

• 52:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 52:11Speaker 04

  But they're all, I think they're all better the more you watch them.

• 52:14Bill Simmons?

  I might be wrong on Interstellar. I know I'm not wrong about Contact. That's the one where I'm like, that movie sucks. You'll never convince me otherwise. That movie was bad.

• 52:20Speaker 04

  Wow, Fickner catching another stray.

• 52:23Speaker 03

  Contact.

• 52:24Bill Simmons?

  Jodie Foster.

• 52:25Speaker 03

  The Carl Sagan joint about aliens and all of that stuff.

• 52:28Speaker 04

  David Morse.

• 52:29Speaker 03

  I always saw it one time.

• 52:30Bill Simmons?

  This episode of the Rewatchables is brought to you by State Farm.

• 52:34Bill Simmons?

  Life is full of reasons to celebrate, and now with the State Farm Personal Price Plan, you can keep celebrating when you create an affordable price just for you when you choose to bundle home and auto. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can bundle and save with the Personal Price Plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings, and eligibility vary by state. Back to the podcast.

• 53:04Speaker 03

  There you go.

• 53:04Speaker 04

  I love having a State Farm commercial on the Crash episode. That's great stuff.

• 53:09Bill Simmons?

  Great. Uh, great shot, Gordon Award, most cinematic shot.

• 53:13Speaker 04

  I don't have anything here. This is a ugly looking movie.

• 53:16Bill Simmons?

  Matt Dillon pulling, pulling Newton out of the car?

• 53:20Speaker 03

  The, we can, we can.

• 53:22Bill Simmons?

  No?

• 53:22Speaker 03

  We can shoehorn that in, but this movie is so obviously low budget.

• 53:28Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 53:28Speaker 03

  That they don't really have.

• 53:29Speaker 04

  This is a screenwriter.

• 53:30Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 53:30Speaker 04

  Tried to direct a movie. Um, there, the one like flair is the sort of like reverse zoom on Michael Peña when he's screaming because he thinks his daughter got shot.

• 53:40Bill Simmons?

  Or maybe. I'm gonna make Van Reenact that later.

• 53:42Speaker 03

  Or maybe at the end of, uh, Ryan, uh.

• 53:47Speaker 04

  Philippe.

• 53:48Speaker 03

  Philippe. Ryan Philippe.

• 53:49Bill Simmons?

  And Philippe.

• 53:50Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 53:50Speaker 03

  Like burning the car, which that shot, him with the gloves.

• 53:55Speaker 04

  With taking the gloves off, yeah.

• 53:56Speaker 03

  Signaling that what. Matt Dillon said to him earlier in the movie has already come to pass. Just wait till you're on the job a little bit longer and.

• 54:04Speaker 04

  But like.

• 54:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 54:06Speaker 04

  Wait a couple hours.

• 54:07Speaker 03

  Wait a couple hours.

• 54:07Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 54:08Speaker 03

  It happened that night.

• 54:08Speaker 04

  It was.

• 54:09Bill Simmons?

  Do we have a Kid Cudi Pursuit of Happiness Award for Best Needle Drop?

• 54:12Speaker 03

  There's no music in the movie.

• 54:13Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, there's really no music, right?

• 54:14Speaker 04

  There is a Stereophonics Maybe Tomorrow drop right at the end, which I like, but there's also, it was nominated for Best Original Song. Kathleen York, who plays the cop early in the movie, she plays one of the cops early in the movie. Her song In The Deep Plays, and it is the most like, we wanna be Magnolia, Amy Mann moment.

• 54:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 54:35Speaker 04

  Um.

• 54:36Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 54:37Speaker 04

  But no, but it's bad.

• 54:38Bill Simmons?

  Good answer.

• 54:38Speaker 04

  Like it's.

• 54:39Speaker 03

  But you win though.

• 54:39Speaker 04

  But it's.

• 54:40Bill Simmons?

  That's.

• 54:41Speaker 04

  Good enough to win.

• 54:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 54:42Bill Simmons?

  Chess Rockwell and Brocklanders Award for Best Character Names.

• 54:45Speaker 04

  Say it, say it, Bill.

• 54:47Speaker 03

  Shadiqua.

• 54:48Speaker 04

  Shadiqua. Definitely Shadiqua.

• 54:51Speaker 03

  There you go. Put a little sauce on that motherfucker.

• 54:54Speaker 04

  Shadiqua Johnson.

• 54:55Bill Simmons?

  Van, you're up with the flex category. You get to pick any category. I knew you were gonna screw this up.

• 54:59Speaker 03

  Any category? I have my own category.

• 55:02Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that.

• 55:02Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 55:02Bill Simmons?

  You wanna use your own category here?

• 55:04Speaker 03

  Yeah, right here.

• 55:04Bill Simmons?

  Go ahead. Let's hear it.

• 55:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, uh, this is an all time we solve racism movie. And I gave the top five we solve racism movies of all time. I put it in here.

• 55:13Bill Simmons?

  Okay, so I gotta figure out what the category name of this is.

• 55:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 55:17Bill Simmons?

  Van's. Van's, uh, historical.

• 55:22Speaker 03

  Go for it.

• 55:22Bill Simmons?

  The Van Lathan Historical Take Award?

• 55:24Speaker 03

  The Van.

• 55:25Speaker 04

  Impacts, historical impact?

• 55:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's top five we solve racism movies.

• 55:29Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 55:29Speaker 03

  Top five white people solve racism movies. At number five, The Blind Side. That's where racism loses to athleticism. At number four, A Time To Kill. Blacks deserve revenge.

• 55:38Speaker 04

  Are you just doing Sandra Bullock movies?

• 55:40Speaker 03

  No, I mean, they're all, she's been in a lot of them. Bash. Number three, We're All Racist and It's Beautiful.

• 55:47Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 55:48Speaker 03

  Number two, The Help. Or How White Women Will Save Us.

• 55:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 55:52Speaker 03

  Number one, Driving Miss Daisy.

• 55:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 55:55Speaker 03

  How Elderly Sexual Tension Makes A Cool Oreo Swirl.

• 56:01Bill Simmons?

  It's an amazing list. That's it. It's top one. I really wanted Miss Daisy to be number one and you didn't disappoint.

• 56:06Speaker 04

  Yeah, I was really hoping The Help would be on there. That's what I was really hoping for.

• 56:10Bill Simmons?

  The Help and Miss Daisy are two movies that after the screenwriters or the playwright finished writing the movie, they went. Yeah.

• 56:18Speaker 04

  I did it.

• 56:19Bill Simmons?

  We've done it. Well, The Help is another one where it's an absurd movie.

• 56:25Bill Simmons?

  But the actors are pretty good in the movie. So good. And you feel bad because there's good scenes. It's like this movie. Like ridiculously good. Yeah, it's like, ah shit, Emma Stone's like really killing it in this.

• 56:34Speaker 04

  I was working in a bookstore when that book came out and this woman that I worked with, who was in her like sixties or seventies, who worked at the store with me, hated the book so much. And but people were coming in, white women were coming in by the droves to buy The Help. And she was like, oh, the hep? You want to get the hep? You just call it the hep? Like to their faces and they like, they thought they were mishearing her because she was this older woman and she could just get away with it. It's great.

• 56:58Bill Simmons?

  The Butch's Girlfriend Award for the weak link of the film. This is tough to narrow it down. I have the Persian shop owner because I still have no idea what's going on in that character and what his arc was in this movie. This is a nine eleven commentary. Well, he doesn't realize he has a gun with blanks, even though the box says blanks.

• 57:17Speaker 04

  He can't read English.

• 57:18Bill Simmons?

  He can't read English. It says blanks.

• 57:20Speaker 04

  He can't read English.

• 57:21Bill Simmons?

  He says that earlier in the movie.

• 57:22Speaker 04

  Like he can't read his insurance policy. He doesn't read English.

• 57:25Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 57:25Speaker 04

  And his wife is Diana Troy from Star Trek. I just need to say that.

• 57:28Bill Simmons?

  But don't the blank box even say like blanks where it explodes and there's nothing there? No? What are you, like, there's a cartoon of like it's, it's very clear that there's no bullets. It's just blanks.

• 57:38Speaker 04

  I mean, I didn't see any cartoons on this particular box.

• 57:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Uh, he shoots a little girl with blanks and then everyone's like, okay, we're gonna go inside now.

• 57:47Speaker 04

  Well, what do you, if there's a man on the street, if there's a man on the street with a gun, let's say.

• 57:51Bill Simmons?

  They just went back in the house. Who wants some cereal? He, he, he.

• 57:54Speaker 04

  I mean, they might have called the cops. You don't know what they did when they got in the house.

• 57:57Bill Simmons?

  They don't look like they called the cops. Honey, you want a pop tart? Yeah. It, everybody's traumatized. Crazy guy still out there? Oh, he is? Yeah. Hey, you guys want to watch a movie?

• 58:05Speaker 04

  It's Christmas too. This is a Christmas movie.

• 58:07Speaker 03

  Oh, it sure is.

• 58:09Speaker 04

  There's wreaths and Christmas trees everywhere.

• 58:12Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 58:12Speaker 04

  And then it's.

• 58:12Bill Simmons?

  Could he understand English or he couldn't?

• 58:15Speaker 03

  He could understand it. He couldn't read it.

• 58:16Speaker 04

  Speak it poorly and he could not read it.

• 58:19Bill Simmons?

  Cause Keanu is like, you need a new door.

• 58:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 58:22Bill Simmons?

  Fix the lock. You need a new door. And the guy's like, you're trying to.

• 58:25Speaker 03

  But the language barrier, he's, he's functional enough to be able to run a store, but the language barrier is part of the social dysfunction that's stopping them from understanding.

• 58:34Bill Simmons?

  But if he's so dysfunctional that he can't understand he needs a new door, how does he run a store? Like they make it so that he literally can't understand anything, but yet we're expected to believe he's working forty hours a week running a store.

• 58:47Speaker 03

  But we gotta, we can't do it.

• 58:48Bill Simmons?

  He thought an angel saved him. This character sucked. Uh, what do you have, Joanna?

• 58:53Speaker 04

  It's full, it's good old Philippe, Ryan Phillippe.

• 58:56Speaker 04

  I think that.

• 58:56Bill Simmons?

  A miscast?

• 58:57Speaker 04

  I think it's A, it's miscast.

• 58:59Bill Simmons?

  There's an amazing casting would have for this that we won't say now.

• 59:01Speaker 04

  I agree. And it would be a lot better with that, but I think he's miscast because Ryan Phillippe has, right? I'm just saying it wrong now. Ryan Phillippe has a face that I don't trust ever. I've never.

• 59:13Bill Simmons?

  You want him in cruel intentions.

• 59:14Speaker 04

  I want him in cruel intentions. Great in cruel intentions. I don't want him as like a, oh no, not him. He, he shot someone. Which is sort of what you're supposed to feel in this moment. And, uh, and then the, the turn from that character is.

• 59:27Speaker 03

  Doesn't make any sense.

• 59:28Speaker 04

  Makes no sense. You need a beat between, or you need to see him visibly shaken from the interaction with Terrence Howard or something like that.

• 59:35Bill Simmons?

  There's, there's really no wrong choices with the Butcher's Girl.

• 59:38Speaker 03

  Honestly, honestly, it pains me to say this. It's Lorenz Tate.

• 59:44Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 59:44Speaker 03

  He's miscast. He's totally miscast. He's playing this so wide eyed because he's trying to seem.

• 59:51Bill Simmons?

  Very chaste in like.

• 59:52Speaker 03

  Younger, but we know him.

• 59:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:55Speaker 03

  And we know that like he's more senior than this. We remember young Lorenz Tate. We were. If, if the O-Dog era Lorenz Tate, they tried to recast O-Dog. It makes a lot of sense. He just doesn't.

• 1:00:07Bill Simmons?

  Like Paul Haggis, the wire is right there. Just grab, you have twenty different good actors. You can just grab.

• 1:00:12Speaker 03

  Yeah. Actually, you know what's funny is J D Walker, who plays Bodie in The Wire.

• 1:00:17Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:17Speaker 03

  Would have been perfect in that role.

• 1:00:19Bill Simmons?

  They could have had Omar, could have been. I mean, they could have picked anybody.

• 1:00:22Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:00:22Bill Simmons?

  Um, what's age the worst? Sandra Bullock falling down the stairs. This movie won for best editing. I encourage people to, if they watch this after, to watch how bad they edit it. It's honestly like, if we made like a Spotify movie about The Ringer, and we just like did a quick cut to try to, it's so bad. They must have run out of money for that scene.

• 1:00:44Bill Simmons?

  Two movies named Crash in eight years is just weird. I don't, I think there should be a rule if I was the movie czar. You get a title, you at least get 20 years with the title for the next one, yeah.

• 1:00:53Speaker 04

  How good or watched does a movie have to be in order to?

• 1:00:57Bill Simmons?

  I think it has to make like at least like five million dollars.

• 1:00:59Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:00:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:59Speaker 03

  Did you see the other Crash, 96 Crash?

• 1:01:01Bill Simmons?

  I saw it in the movie theater. That was weird.

• 1:01:03Speaker 03

  Let me tell you something.

• 1:01:04Bill Simmons?

  That movie gets after it.

• 1:01:06Speaker 03

  That, that movie gets after it. I remember, I, I had to see it. I remember going to Buffalo Video, Baker, Louisiana.

• 1:01:14Speaker 03

  And like, and, and renting that movie and a lady at the, uh, at the front going.

• 1:01:19Bill Simmons?

  Judging you.

• 1:01:20Speaker 03

  Son, that is a weird movie. And I, I still had to see it.

• 1:01:26Bill Simmons?

  He has sex, James Spader has sex with the cut in her leg.

• 1:01:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:01:29Speaker 04

  We pitched, we saw pitched in this text exchange, uh, James Spader Freak Era Rewatchable Series.

• 1:01:36Bill Simmons?

  Rewatchables with Spader?

• 1:01:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:01:38Bill Simmons?

  You know the other Crash, Craig? No.

• 1:01:40Speaker 03

  Aw, Craig.

• 1:01:41Speaker 04

  My god.

• 1:01:42Speaker 03

  Craig, you gotta get dirty.

• 1:01:43Bill Simmons?

  That is, yeah.

• 1:01:44Speaker 03

  Well, you know what? So we already did Eight Millimeter. But what we should have done was...

• 1:01:48Bill Simmons?

  Fucked up movie month?

• 1:01:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, we, we should have done Eight Millimeter.

• 1:01:52Bill Simmons?

  Crash is too fucked up.

• 1:01:53Speaker 03

  Aw, dog, that's a, that, that's one that deserves a revival.

• 1:01:57Bill Simmons?

  We should have just done Crash Month. Are there two other movies named Crash?

• 1:02:00Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:02:01Speaker 04

  I bet there are.

• 1:02:01Speaker 03

  I'm gonna start taking clips from Crash and just putting them on my Twitter without any context.

• 1:02:08Speaker 03

  I am. That's a crazy movie.

• 1:02:10Speaker 04

  This is the new Cowboy Head.

• 1:02:11Bill Simmons?

  You should have done that after the Luca Doncic trade. You should just start picking clips of Crash. What do you have for one stage worse, Joe?

• 1:02:18Speaker 04

  The Matt Dillon hero turn.

• 1:02:21Speaker 03

  Easy work, easy work.

• 1:02:22Speaker 04

  The Matt Dillon stuff and the fact that he's then the only actor nominated for this movie. Do you, have you seen that clip that?

• 1:02:28Bill Simmons?

  Well, there's a reason for that though, because Howard, that they wanted to push him for Hustle and Flow. And I think Howard would have gotten nominated over Dillon.

• 1:02:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, but there's a lot of other great options that's not Matt Dillon. There's this, there's this clip that comes around to me every so often of Aubrey Plaza hosting the Eddie Spirits Award when Black Klansman came out. And she was like, Adam Driver, congrats on being the only actor nominated for Black Klansman. You're the best one in this movie. And that's what I thought. That's what I thought when I saw that Dylan was the only actor nominated for Crash.

• 1:03:01Bill Simmons?

  I was surprised Newton didn't get nominated, actually, because I thought she was excellent.

• 1:03:05Speaker 04

  The image of this movie, the image of this movie is her clinging to him.

• 1:03:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:03:10Speaker 04

  After the crash.

• 1:03:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, for sure. They played that up and made.

• 1:03:14Bill Simmons?

  More would say the worst. In L.A., we're trapped behind metal and glass. You gotta crash into someone to feel something. Joanna's like, Joanna, my move here. This movie's gonna get in her head.

• 1:03:23Speaker 04

  Can I tell you, when I first moved to San Francisco, I was walking down the street. This is like right after this movie came out. And this guy, and this is gonna sound unreal because I recently said on a different podcast about an inception pickup line that a guy tried on me, but I bumped into this guy and he's like, let's crash into each other like the movie. And I was just like, like, literally, that is a thing that has happened to me.

• 1:03:43Bill Simmons?

  San Francisco's freaky.

• 1:03:44Speaker 03

  Freaky.

• 1:03:45Bill Simmons?

  Freaky.

• 1:03:46Speaker 03

  Oh, you think he made freaks?

• 1:03:48Bill Simmons?

  Oh, it's since the 60s.

• 1:03:49Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:03:50Bill Simmons?

  Fucking weird freaky place.

• 1:03:51Speaker 03

  Who said something like that? He probably was a vampire.

• 1:03:54Speaker 04

  Do you think he was talking about this movie or do you think he was talking about the James Garner movie?

• 1:03:57Speaker 03

  It could have been either because it's a car crash situation.

• 1:04:00Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:04:01Bill Simmons?

  More would say the worst. Cheeto calls his girlfriend Mexican. And she responds by saying angrily, my mother's from Puerto Rico and my father's from El Salvador. And then he responds by saying, why do all of your people park their cars in their lawns?

• 1:04:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:04:16Bill Simmons?

  That's an actual exchange in the movie.

• 1:04:17Speaker 04

  Because everyone's racist, Bill. That's what this movie wants to teach you.

• 1:04:21Bill Simmons?

  Don Cheadle too much. She's got this side too. They're just trying to.

• 1:04:24Speaker 03

  Everything.

• 1:04:25Bill Simmons?

  Slide that in there.

• 1:04:26Speaker 03

  Sidebar, can I just throw something in in the movie that also really works? The whole thing with Don Cheadle and his brother and his mother, that's effective.

• 1:04:35Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:35Speaker 03

  Like, that actually is effective, how she has the one upstanding son. But for some reason, I don't know how many times you see this, they gravitate towards the fuck up son.

• 1:04:46Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:47Speaker 03

  And try to like protect him and the whole.

• 1:04:49Bill Simmons?

  She's projecting that it didn't turn out well for the son and it was her fault, but she wants to blame the brother.

• 1:04:54Speaker 03

  All of that stuff where she goes, I know it's your fault, blah, blah, blah.

• 1:04:56Bill Simmons?

  Dan's talking himself into this movie.

• 1:04:58Speaker 03

  I'm not.

• 1:04:58Bill Simmons?

  Keep, you keep complimenting.

• 1:05:00Speaker 04

  The canvas Whole Foods bags?

• 1:05:01Speaker 03

  The canvas Whole Foods bags, all that stuff. I'm just saying that the movie actually has some talent in it. It's just, it falls under the weight of itself.

• 1:05:09Bill Simmons?

  What else do you have, Joe?

• 1:05:10Speaker 04

  That's it.

• 1:05:11Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:05:15Bill Simmons?

  The Ruffalo Hannah Rubinek Partridge over acting award.

• 1:05:18Speaker 03

  Oh, this is a good one.

• 1:05:21Bill Simmons?

  I hate to give it to Michael Peña. But the, the 10 second scream.

• 1:05:31Bill Simmons?

  What is happening?

• 1:05:32Speaker 03

  Don't throw that shot!

• 1:05:34Bill Simmons?

  It's just weird.

• 1:05:36Speaker 04

  I think it actually kind of works on him in a way unfortunately doesn't work for the wife character who we literally don't know.

• 1:05:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:42Speaker 04

  Cause she gets a really long like, no, like a, like a platoon.

• 1:05:46Bill Simmons?

  It's not, not his fault. It's the editing.

• 1:05:47Speaker 03

  By the way, that wife character, I, I don't know the actress's name. That's a classic that girl.

• 1:05:53Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I don't even know what her name is.

• 1:05:54Speaker 03

  But eight, one eight seven, I think Stand to Deliver, maybe Dangerous Minds, a bunch of different movies.

• 1:06:01Bill Simmons?

  What do you have for that category?

• 1:06:03Speaker 04

  Uh, Van's gonna get mad at me.

• 1:06:04Speaker 03

  Uh-uh. What?

• 1:06:05Speaker 04

  But I think it's Beverly Todd as Mrs. Waters as Don Teedle's mom.

• 1:06:08Speaker 03

  Oh, interesting.

• 1:06:09Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:06:10Speaker 03

  You're gonna get mad at me. I think it's, how you say her name? Ben Dewey?

• 1:06:16Speaker 04

  Ben Dewey Newton.

• 1:06:17Speaker 03

  It's Ten Dewey Newton. The scene, she, the scene where she's crying and telling him that he lost his dignity in the, in the thing. She has a cry thing that she does.

• 1:06:28Bill Simmons?

  She's supposed to be drunk, I think is part of it.

• 1:06:30Speaker 04

  Are you talking about the one where she comes to his?

• 1:06:32Speaker 03

  Well, she comes to his job.

• 1:06:33Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:06:34Bill Simmons?

  Oh, after. Oh, yeah.

• 1:06:35Speaker 04

  I agree. I don't like that scene.

• 1:06:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:06:36Speaker 04

  I think the bedroom fight is good.

• 1:06:37Speaker 03

  The bedroom fight is good, but she has a cry thing that she does. Her, like, her cry is like overpower.

• 1:06:43Bill Simmons?

  Ugly cry.

• 1:06:44Speaker 03

  Ugly cry that she does.

• 1:06:45Bill Simmons?

  Joe, you have a flex category. What do you got?

• 1:06:48Speaker 04

  Oh, I am stealing in honor of House of Arms, stealing the Molly Rubin, uh, award. Did this movie need a better or an additional sex scene?

• 1:06:57Bill Simmons?

  That's so great. I'm so, I'm sure I'd be so pleased.

• 1:07:00Speaker 04

  Um, and I'm gonna say we deserve to see Brendan Fraser, known a gay, uh, have sex.

• 1:07:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:07:07Speaker 04

  When Sandra Bullock calls him at the end.

• 1:07:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:07:10Speaker 04

  When Sandra Bullock calls him at the end.

• 1:07:11Speaker 03

  Hard R.

• 1:07:12Bill Simmons?

  Be careful.

• 1:07:12Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:07:13Bill Simmons?

  Hard R.

• 1:07:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:07:14Bill Simmons?

  Well, there's R and there's hard R. It's like borderline NCT 17.

• 1:07:17Speaker 05

  You know, that was something I never knew was a thing.

• 1:07:18Speaker 03

  What?

• 1:07:19Bill Simmons?

  Hard R.

• 1:07:19Speaker 04

  Hard R.

• 1:07:20Speaker 05

  I've heard somebody say hard R for a movie.

• 1:07:21Speaker 03

  Hard R's a thing.

• 1:07:22Speaker 05

  You can't say it.

• 1:07:22Bill Simmons?

  I didn't make it up.

• 1:07:22Speaker 03

  But if you say hard R in a movie that's about race.

• 1:07:25Speaker 05

  I agree. I just didn't know hard R was ever a way to describe an R rated movie.

• 1:07:29Speaker 03

  Interesting. Soft R, hard R.

• 1:07:30Bill Simmons?

  Soft R.

• 1:07:31Speaker 05

  Yeah, I didn't know that.

• 1:07:31Bill Simmons?

  So, so you just wanted him to knock some boots?

• 1:07:34Speaker 04

  Well, I just think when Sandra Bullock calls at the end and she's like, I fell down, and he's like, your friend's a bitch.

• 1:07:38Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 1:07:38Speaker 04

  He should have been having sex with her rather than just like glancing at her at the elevator, you know?

• 1:07:43Speaker 03

  And you know, if they cut in, I don't want to direct the scene, but if they cut to him.

• 1:07:47Speaker 04

  Yeah, you do.

• 1:07:48Speaker 03

  Like in the middle and he's all, he's out of breath, he grabs the phone. Huh?

• 1:07:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

• 1:07:54Speaker 03

  You know what I mean?

• 1:07:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:07:54Speaker 03

  In The Wire or in any of these.

• 1:07:57Bill Simmons?

  Or they do The Internal Affairs where it starts with him and it.

• 1:08:00Speaker 04

  It pans out.

• 1:08:01Bill Simmons?

  Scales back.

• 1:08:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, and then you find out that he's having sex.

• 1:08:04Bill Simmons?

  Good one. Mal would have been honored.

• 1:08:06Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:08:07Bill Simmons?

  The, uh, the CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford at hottest take award. I already gave mine. I think Bullock's character was the original Karen. You guys disagreed. Did you have a hottest take for this?

• 1:08:16Speaker 03

  No, she's the.

• 1:08:17Bill Simmons?

  I think it's the first Karen. I think it's like the Neil Armstrong of Karens.

• 1:08:20Speaker 03

  Right.

• 1:08:21Speaker 04

  I think there's a really good short film in here that's just the ludicrous scenes.

• 1:08:29Bill Simmons?

  Chris Bridges, our guy.

• 1:08:31Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:08:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:08:31Bill Simmons?

  Gave it back to Oprah, edited it out, never heard from again.

• 1:08:34Speaker 04

  Just put together the ludicrous monologues and I would re-watch. That's re-watchable.

• 1:08:38Speaker 03

  He's good. I, they could have, he, the movie needed more ludicrous for sure.

• 1:08:43Bill Simmons?

  You have a hottest take or keep moving?

• 1:08:45Speaker 03

  Um, no, my only hottest take is this is the least infective, effective anti-slavery movie I've ever seen.

• 1:08:52Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:08:53Speaker 03

  At the end.

• 1:08:54Bill Simmons?

  Certainly not, not hot.

• 1:08:55Speaker 03

  At, at the end, he literally frees slaves. He literally frees slaves. He gives them forty dollars. Forty?

• 1:09:03Speaker 04

  No mule.

• 1:09:03Speaker 03

  And a mule.

• 1:09:04Speaker 04

  No mule.

• 1:09:04Bill Simmons?

  Oh, interesting.

• 1:09:05Speaker 03

  He gives him forty dollars.

• 1:09:06Bill Simmons?

  Look at you.

• 1:09:07Speaker 03

  Forty dollars he gives him, tells him he's completely racist to them. And at the end, y'all really feel good about it.

• 1:09:13Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:14Speaker 04

  You see a guy sink down, like, on the street and you're like, he's just gonna stay there.

• 1:09:18Speaker 03

  He's just gonna stay there.

• 1:09:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:09:19Speaker 03

  He's gonna be there in perpetuity.

• 1:09:20Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:09:20Bill Simmons?

  Were they trying to say something with one of them goes in a video store and sees all the choices for movies?

• 1:09:24Speaker 04

  Um.

• 1:09:25Bill Simmons?

  Is that, like, hitting us over the head with something?

• 1:09:26Speaker 04

  Story has the ability to transport and change us, Bill.

• 1:09:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:09:30Bill Simmons?

  He's looking at all the MCU where it's going. Casting what ifs.

• 1:09:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:09:35Bill Simmons?

  Couple of good ones. Forest Whitaker was supposed to play the Terrence Howard role, but the film and got the lady dropped out.

• 1:09:41Speaker 04

  I found the Cheadle role. Is it Howard role?

• 1:09:43Bill Simmons?

  I have Terrence Howard, but it was one of them. Uh, Cusack was attached to Matt Dillon, had to drop out. And then the big one is Heath Ledger was supposed to be Ryan Felipe. And dropped out, and this is kind of a different movie if he's in it, cause this is like right in his wheelhouse.

• 1:10:01Speaker 04

  So, good for him, but, um, yeah, I think Heath Ledger, I mean, I actually have different casting ideas for that role, but I think Heath Ledger is a huge improvement in the Ryan Felipe role. That, that character still needs one more scene, at least, to get where he gets.

• 1:10:16Bill Simmons?

  Could it be like a Monsters Ball cop Heath Ledger performance?

• 1:10:20Speaker 04

  Wow, Monsters Ball. Haven't thought about that in a long time.

• 1:10:24Speaker 03

  I like Josh Hartnett.

• 1:10:24Bill Simmons?

  Not on the rewatchables list.

• 1:10:25Speaker 03

  It's, it's, well, there's certain reasons why it's rewatchable, but it, it, but it, that's on the, Josh Hartnett could have played that young cop. You know what? When you said the John Cusack thing, he should have done it.

• 1:10:37Speaker 04

  No, Cusack in the Dillon role would have been great.

• 1:10:39Speaker 03

  It would have been fantastic.

• 1:10:40Speaker 04

  Genuinely great.

• 1:10:40Speaker 03

  Like legitimately great. I don't know that I've ever seen him play a role like that. Like, I, he, I don't know.

• 1:10:46Bill Simmons?

  He's tried to be bad guys a couple of times and it usually doesn't work.

• 1:10:48Speaker 04

  But not that kind of bad guy.

• 1:10:49Speaker 03

  Not like that. I think seeing him like that would have been, would have been super awesome.

• 1:10:52Speaker 04

  I think Cusack would have been, I think of those three, Heath Ledger's like sort of the big one, but I think Cusack is the stealth. This would have been a much better movie with Cusack in the Matt Dillon role.

• 1:11:02Bill Simmons?

  So, Best That Guy, it's the guy from Iron Man. That's a great one.

• 1:11:06Speaker 03

  You know who I have?

• 1:11:06Bill Simmons?

  Who else did you have?

• 1:11:08Speaker 03

  Jack McGee.

• 1:11:08Speaker 04

  As the gun store owner, that's mine.

• 1:11:10Speaker 03

  The gun store owner.

• 1:11:11Speaker 04

  That's mine.

• 1:11:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:11:12Speaker 04

  He, I looked at his CV, this guy usually plays cops, and here are some of his character names that he's played. Detective, sheriff, deputy, the chief. There's so many roles he's played that it's just like the name of the rank of the police officer.

• 1:11:24Speaker 03

  I remember him from Scrooged.

• 1:11:26Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:11:26Speaker 03

  You, you can, you can barely see them nipples.

• 1:11:29Speaker 04

  Scrooge is my favorite Christmas movie.

• 1:11:30Speaker 03

  You, you, you.

• 1:11:31Bill Simmons?

  I remember that, yeah.

• 1:11:32Speaker 03

  You could see, you could better see the nipples.

• 1:11:34Bill Simmons?

  Fichtner used to be that guy, but then he became.

• 1:11:36Speaker 03

  Ah, he became Fichtner. He did, he did too much good work.

• 1:11:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, David was also that guy for a long time. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:11:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, there, it's probably somewhere in the nineties it flipped.

• 1:11:44Speaker 03

  I think it changed with Something About Mary.

• 1:11:45Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:11:48Bill Simmons?

  Uh, Diane Waiters Award. Jennifer Esposito is eligible.

• 1:11:53Speaker 03

  Probably, yeah.

• 1:11:54Bill Simmons?

  She's great in this movie.

• 1:11:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, she is.

• 1:11:56Bill Simmons?

  I always liked her. I never understood why.

• 1:11:59Speaker 03

  They just didn't have anything for her to do.

• 1:12:00Bill Simmons?

  I always felt like there was a better career for her.

• 1:12:03Speaker 03

  She, they just didn't have enough for her to do. Every time she's, she's ob- obviously gorgeous, she's talented.

• 1:12:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:12:10Speaker 03

  She's, they just didn't have enough for her. She's dope. Like, there was no series for her. There were, there were not a lot.

• 1:12:16Bill Simmons?

  There was like a feisty policewoman series that she should have been on CBS for eight years.

• 1:12:22Speaker 04

  It's not too late for Jennifer Esposito. That's my take.

• 1:12:24Bill Simmons?

  Whatever that, when they started spinning off CSI Miami, all those, it could have been like CSI wherever and just, she's the lead.

• 1:12:33Bill Simmons?

  Diane Waiters, one more. The guy who runs the chop shop?

• 1:12:36Speaker 04

  Lucian.

• 1:12:36Bill Simmons?

  I didn't want to forget him.

• 1:12:38Speaker 04

  When he says, he's my pick. And when he says, do I look like I want to be on the Discovery Channel?

• 1:12:43Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 1:12:44Speaker 04

  Loved it. Love that guy.

• 1:12:46Bill Simmons?

  I like that guy.

• 1:12:46Speaker 04

  And also, I would say the woman at the locksmith's, who like will not give up Michael Pena's name, who's just like smoking and over it and slapping her chair and wearing all the eyeliner. I really liked her too.

• 1:12:59Speaker 03

  I was trying to remember the relationship that Jennifer Esposito was in.

• 1:13:03Bill Simmons?

  Eddie Murphy, right? Early?

• 1:13:04Speaker 03

  No, she was married to Bradley Cooper.

• 1:13:07Bill Simmons?

  But she dated Eddie Murphy in like the eighties.

• 1:13:09Speaker 03

  Oh, did she?

• 1:13:10Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:10Speaker 03

  Interesting. I didn't know that. Bradley Cooper.

• 1:13:13Bill Simmons?

  Bradley Cooper.

• 1:13:13Speaker 03

  Two thousand and six.

• 1:13:14Speaker 04

  A lot of choices for Bradley Cooper.

• 1:13:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:13:17Bill Simmons?

  Recasting couch director city.

• 1:13:20Bill Simmons?

  Joe has something.

• 1:13:21Speaker 04

  For, um, okay, on the Ryan Phillippe role.

• 1:13:27Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:29Speaker 04

  Matt Damon.

• 1:13:31Bill Simmons?

  Oh, almost like Departed type of character. Yeah.

• 1:13:34Speaker 04

  Departed.

• 1:13:35Speaker 03

  Is he too old?

• 1:13:36Speaker 04

  No, he's the exact same age as Ryan Phillippe. I looked up actors that was same age as Ryan Phillippe. He's the exact same age. This is the year he made Euro Trip and Ocean's Twelve.

• 1:13:43Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, he's available.

• 1:13:46Speaker 04

  Euro Trip, greatest cameo of all time. Also additionally, Tobey Maguire, Casey Affleck.

• 1:13:52Bill Simmons?

  Casey Affleck would have been really good. That's a good one.

• 1:13:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:13:55Speaker 03

  I still, I think Josh Hartnett works too, but Casey Affleck works.

• 1:13:59Speaker 04

  I don't think Josh Hartnett is good enough.

• 1:14:01Speaker 03

  As an actor?

• 1:14:02Speaker 04

  Not at that. I like late, late stage Hartnett.

• 1:14:06Bill Simmons?

  I have a director for the recasting. Quentin Tarantino's Crash would have been unbelievable.

• 1:14:12Speaker 03

  Oh, brother, N-words, bro.

• 1:14:15Bill Simmons?

  Three hours and thirty minutes. It would have been amazing.

• 1:14:17Speaker 04

  You just wanted to see Sandy's feet more than when she fell down the stairs?

• 1:14:20Speaker 03

  This, this movie would have gone down the N-word path, bro. We can't do it, doc. Spike, Spike Lee's Crash would have been interesting, cause then.

• 1:14:31Bill Simmons?

  Spike Lee's Crash would have been.

• 1:14:32Speaker 03

  A lot of crane shots, you know what I mean, of people, uh, you know, some jazz. But Quentin Tarantino's Crash.

• 1:14:38Bill Simmons?

  Is Spike Lee's Crash known to gays having sex with Brendan Fraser?

• 1:14:41Speaker 04

  That's what I'm saying.

• 1:14:42Bill Simmons?

  Five in the first twenty minutes.

• 1:14:44Speaker 03

  Of course.

• 1:14:46Bill Simmons?

  Thank you for not doing, uh, I recast Crash in Boston. Doing, I was dreading that monologue. Thank you for not doing it. We're just gonna keep moving.

• 1:14:52Speaker 03

  Crash is Boston.

• 1:14:54Bill Simmons?

  No, I'm not letting you do it. No, moving on.

• 1:14:59Bill Simmons?

  Half faster research. Crash, first Best Picture winner to be released on Blu-ray.

• 1:15:05Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 1:15:06Bill Simmons?

  June two thousand six.

• 1:15:07Speaker 04

  Fun fact.

• 1:15:08Bill Simmons?

  Haggis had a heart attack during the last part of the filming.

• 1:15:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:15:10Bill Simmons?

  Missed a week.

• 1:15:12Speaker 04

  He was like, it's just so good.

• 1:15:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:15:15Speaker 04

  I'm just making my masterpiece.

• 1:15:18Speaker 03

  We, this movie needs me. People have to see this.

• 1:15:22Bill Simmons?

  Uh, in two thousand fifteen, Hollywood Reporter,

• 1:15:27Bill Simmons?

  they found a bunch of the Oscar voters and asked, what would you do if you had to do this over again?

• 1:15:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:15:31Bill Simmons?

  Brokeback Mountain won convincingly. And then I didn't really understand how this went. I'm just gonna read what's written down. Uh, Newton wore a special protective underwear for the, for the assault scene. Because Haggis wanted it to look real from the camera's perspective for Matt Dillon to go there. I'm gonna guess no intimacy coordinator in this movie?

• 1:15:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's a wild step in the dark.

• 1:15:55Bill Simmons?

  What kind of underwear are we talking about?

• 1:15:57Speaker 04

  Underwear, right? Like, are we, is it like?

• 1:15:59Bill Simmons?

  I don't know what to make of that.

• 1:16:00Speaker 03

  Well, they have like the modesty stuff that they wear, right?

• 1:16:03Speaker 04

  Yeah, but he's like real, like.

• 1:16:04Speaker 03

  He's, yeah.

• 1:16:05Speaker 04

  He's really up in there.

• 1:16:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:16:09Bill Simmons?

  Uh, do you think?

• 1:16:11Speaker 04

  Are you envisioning like the metal chastity belt from Robin Hood Men in Tights?

• 1:16:15Speaker 03

  I'm sorry, I shouldn't laugh. That wasn't funny that Joe said that, but when she said.

• 1:16:21Speaker 04

  He's really up in there?

• 1:16:24Speaker 04

  He was.

• 1:16:27Speaker 04

  That's what I'm saying.

• 1:16:28Speaker 03

  I tried, audience, I tried.

• 1:16:34Speaker 04

  I'm like, how protective can that underwear be? What if she's like?

• 1:16:38Bill Simmons?

  It would almost have to be like a, like an adult diaper with like seven different panties.

• 1:16:44Speaker 04

  I think it has to be like the metal chastity belt from Robin Hood Men in Tights. Like, I think you need something. A barrier.

• 1:16:52Bill Simmons?

  Apex Mountain.

• 1:16:53Speaker 03

  Oh, shit.

• 1:16:54Bill Simmons?

  I'll just keep reading stuff until you tell me if it was anybody's Apex Mountain.

• 1:16:58Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:16:59Bill Simmons?

  Sandra Bullock, Brendan Fraser, LA race relations, undercover cops shooting each other. Terrence Howard, there's a case because Hustle and Flow came out the same year.

• 1:17:08Speaker 03

  Oh, well, that moment, yeah, for sure.

• 1:17:09Bill Simmons?

  Two thousand five, this is Apex Mountain.

• 1:17:12Speaker 04

  I don't know, Empire season one.

• 1:17:14Speaker 03

  That's pretty, he was pretty big. He was a big star on TV.

• 1:17:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:17:17Speaker 03

  Maybe, yeah, so yeah, it's pretty big, but.

• 1:17:19Bill Simmons?

  Bigger than Hustle and Flow?

• 1:17:20Speaker 03

  Best actor nomination, Hustle and Flow is pretty tough to beat.

• 1:17:23Bill Simmons?

  Matt Dillon, no. St. Christopher statues? I don't have a lot of experience. Human trafficking? Probably not. Don Cheadle, no. Michael Peanion, no. Ryan Philippe, Felipe?

• 1:17:35Speaker 03

  What would be his Apex Mountain? It'd have to be two tensions, yeah.

• 1:17:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:17:40Bill Simmons?

  Thandiwe Newton?

• 1:17:41Speaker 03

  No.

• 1:17:42Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:17:43Bill Simmons?

  What is her apex, man?

• 1:17:45Speaker 04

  Westworld.

• 1:17:47Bill Simmons?

  That wasn't she in the first Mission Impossible movie or one of them?

• 1:17:50Speaker 03

  It's Mission Impossible.

• 1:17:51Speaker 04

  It's just two.

• 1:17:51Bill Simmons?

  Two.

• 1:17:52Speaker 04

  The worst one.

• 1:17:54Bill Simmons?

  Lorenz Tate, no. Ludacris, it's one of the Fast movies. I don't know which one.

• 1:17:59Speaker 04

  It's Paul Haggis's.

• 1:18:00Bill Simmons?

  Jennifer Esposito, no.

• 1:18:02Speaker 03

  No, it's Paul Haggis's.

• 1:18:03Speaker 04

  It's Paul Haggis's apex.

• 1:18:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:18:04Bill Simmons?

  Paul Haggis definitely is.

• 1:18:06Speaker 04

  The Church of Scientology's influence apex, man.

• 1:18:09Bill Simmons?

  One more break and then we're gonna do Cruise or Hanks.

• 1:18:14Bill Simmons?

  Cruise or Hanks and what role would you want them to play in this movie if you pick?

• 1:18:19Speaker 03

  Hanks kills as Brendan Fraser's character.

• 1:18:23Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:18:25Speaker 03

  Kills. Would love to see Hanks in that morally gray. If you have Hanks, you gotta have the sex scene. Would love to see.

• 1:18:35Bill Simmons?

  Has Hanks ever had sex in a movie other than Forrest Gump?

• 1:18:39Speaker 04

  I can't think of one.

• 1:18:40Bill Simmons?

  But that never happened in home ec class?

• 1:18:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:18:43Speaker 03

  Got it. Hanks kills in that role.

• 1:18:45Bill Simmons?

  Can I test drive Tom Cruise and the Matt Dillon character for you guys?

• 1:18:49Speaker 04

  I want Cruise in this because if we're doing Magnolia methadone, we might as well go all the way. And I also think you need cokeier energy in this LA movie.

• 1:18:57Bill Simmons?

  Tom Cruise helping out the dad, you get the Magnolia angle yet again with like Tom Cruise's weird dad issues. But then angry like evil Tom Cruise as the cop, but then he, Tom Cruise trying to save somebody from a fire. I mean, I, my vote's Cruise.

• 1:19:12Speaker 04

  I say Cruise.

• 1:19:13Speaker 03

  Is this the rare movie where you could put Cruise and Hanks in it together?

• 1:19:19Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, you probably could. Hanks could be Brendan Fraser.

• 1:19:21Speaker 04

  I mean, certainly not at this time in his career. Hanks doesn't belong here. I don't think.

• 1:19:25Speaker 03

  You don't think so?

• 1:19:26Bill Simmons?

  Craig, Cruise?

• 1:19:27Speaker 05

  I like Cruise in this. I, this movie is kind of like a Magnolia type movie. You could even just get Cruise's character from Magnolia. Jam him into this movie.

• 1:19:36Bill Simmons?

  Cause you could also put Cruise in that William Fichtner character, just have him come in for.

• 1:19:40Speaker 04

  If it's a, if it's a Church of Scientology joint, why not invite Tom Cruise?

• 1:19:44Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, where was it?

• 1:19:45Speaker 03

  It's true.

• 1:19:45Bill Simmons?

  How is he not in this?

• 1:19:46Speaker 03

  Can I say something about the Cruise thing now? He works in Magnolia, but then there are other like big ensemble, one scene movies where he doesn't work. Like he totally ruined Lions for Lambs. Like he was terrible in that. That movie kinda sucked.

• 1:19:58Bill Simmons?

  That movie sucked anyway.

• 1:19:59Speaker 04

  He's not the reason that movie sucks.

• 1:20:01Bill Simmons?

  There were other reasons too.

• 1:20:02Speaker 03

  That was a great script. I read that script and thought that movie was gonna win ten Oscars.

• 1:20:05Bill Simmons?

  We forgot to do Apex Mountain for Church of Scientology.

• 1:20:08Speaker 04

  I, I think this is-

• 1:20:09Bill Simmons?

  Two thousand and five. Haggis wins the Oscar, Cruise is jumping on Oprah's couch.

• 1:20:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:20:13Speaker 03

  Oprah's couch, Cruise, the jump.

• 1:20:16Speaker 04

  Lose Free, Oprah Lose Free.

• 1:20:18Speaker 03

  Another Oprah mistake.

• 1:20:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:20:20Speaker 03

  Just to let you know. Soft launch and a hard launch.

• 1:20:22Bill Simmons?

  Is that Oprah's fault though?

• 1:20:23Speaker 03

  I'm just saying, she was part of the hard launch of that whole deal.

• 1:20:25Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:26Speaker 03

  Another mistake. By the way, anytime the Scientology thing is mentioned, just black my face.

• 1:20:32Bill Simmons?

  Scorsese or Spielberg?

• 1:20:34Speaker 04

  Martin Scorsese's Crash.

• 1:20:36Speaker 03

  This is great.

• 1:20:38Bill Simmons?

  This is a movie Spielberg would have tried to take on though.

• 1:20:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:20:41Bill Simmons?

  I feel like he, he easily could have. I could see him doing it. Yeah.

• 1:20:44Speaker 03

  A little edgy for him.

• 1:20:46Bill Simmons?

  But that's the thing. It's like safe edgy.

• 1:20:48Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 1:20:49Bill Simmons?

  But yeah, Scorsese's the answer.

• 1:20:50Speaker 04

  Scorsese.

• 1:20:51Bill Simmons?

  Okay. What role would Philip Seymour Hoffman have played?

• 1:20:54Speaker 03

  Who won best actor this year too.

• 1:20:56Speaker 04

  He did for Capote.

• 1:20:57Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:20:58Bill Simmons?

  I'd throw him in the Matt Dillon role as well.

• 1:21:02Bill Simmons?

  Think he'd do it. I'd like to see evil cop Philip Seymour Hoffman.

• 1:21:06Speaker 03

  Let me tell you something though. If he's in it, it's the, the redemption part doesn't work as well. Because he's gonna play, it's gonna be-

• 1:21:16Bill Simmons?

  Was Matt Dillon actually redeemed in this movie? I guess we can talk about it later.

• 1:21:20Speaker 03

  But the, but-

• 1:21:20Speaker 04

  The movie thinks he is.

• 1:21:22Speaker 03

  The movie thinks he is, but if he, if he's in the role, Philip Seymour Hoffman is going to be so loathful and he's gonna play it so well during the soft launch.

• 1:21:31Bill Simmons?

  It'd be funny if he played it like talented Mr. Ripley, Freddy.

• 1:21:33Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:21:34Speaker 04

  How's the peeping Tommy?

• 1:21:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's peeping.

• 1:21:35Speaker 03

  Tommy.

• 1:21:36Speaker 04

  I think, uh, in the Fickner role, in his like Charlie Wilson's war mode.

• 1:21:41Bill Simmons?

  Just coming in hot. Won't see. Um, the Van Lathan Award, did this movie need more black people?

• 1:21:46Speaker 03

  Perfect. Nope. We're good.

• 1:21:49Bill Simmons?

  Picking nets. Can't wait.

• 1:21:52Bill Simmons?

  Wow. Where do you begin?

• 1:21:54Speaker 04

  I just wrote, oh, God, all of them. Like, I don't know how you pick nits inside of this movie.

• 1:22:01Speaker 04

  What are your, Bill Simmons, top ten nitpicks of crap?

• 1:22:05Bill Simmons?

  I, I know she's a horrible person, but you just start screaming with the locksmith like forty feet away. Like, nobody does that.

• 1:22:11Speaker 03

  She's angry.

• 1:22:12Speaker 04

  Nobody does anything that they do in this movie.

• 1:22:15Bill Simmons?

  Ever do that.

• 1:22:15Speaker 04

  There are no human being behaviors in this movie.

• 1:22:19Bill Simmons?

  Matt Dillon runs into Thandiwe Newton twice in like three days.

• 1:22:26Speaker 04

  Yeah, and Ryan Philippi runs into-

• 1:22:27Bill Simmons?

  Then it just happens to be there when she has a car crash in Los Angeles.

• 1:22:31Speaker 03

  Ryan Philippi runs into Terrence Howard.

• 1:22:33Bill Simmons?

  I have that later.

• 1:22:34Speaker 03

  Ryan Philippi happens to

• 1:22:38Speaker 04

  Pick up Don Chino's brother.

• 1:22:40Bill Simmons?

  L A's a gigantic city.

• 1:22:41Speaker 03

  It, you could literally go-

• 1:22:43Bill Simmons?

  You could go ten years without seeing the same person go.

• 1:22:45Speaker 03

  Like, how many times did you ever, by the way, the only time I ever run into somebody I know is when I randomly see you walking down the street.

• 1:22:52Bill Simmons?

  Well, that's easy. I'm walking everywhere.

• 1:22:54Speaker 04

  He's always, Bill's always walking.

• 1:22:56Speaker 03

  We're sitting down and my, my brother goes, yo, was that you? I was like, yeah, he just, he walks, bro.

• 1:23:01Bill Simmons?

  But, but, he's on a Zoom.

• 1:23:02Speaker 03

  But, but you could literally go ten years without like randomly running into somebody if you're not at a function, just like out somewhere.

• 1:23:12Speaker 04

  But that's the disease of this kind of movie. The vignette, everything's connected movie.

• 1:23:16Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:17Speaker 04

  The like fable.

• 1:23:18Bill Simmons?

  It's only really worked once.

• 1:23:20Speaker 04

  Magnolia.

• 1:23:22Bill Simmons?

  Well, I guess Matt, twice then.

• 1:23:24Speaker 04

  What's your other one?

• 1:23:26Bill Simmons?

  Playing by Heart with Angelina Jolie.

• 1:23:28Speaker 03

  Oh, shit.

• 1:23:29Speaker 04

  No one knows about that movie except for me. Ryan Philippi's in that movie. Dennis Quaid's in that movie.

• 1:23:35Bill Simmons?

  It all comes together in the end. It's like, whoa, they all know each other.

• 1:23:38Speaker 04

  Gina Rollins, great Gina Rollins movie.

• 1:23:40Bill Simmons?

  Twenty-seven years old.

• 1:23:40Speaker 04

  Uh, there's a monologue about Dancing About Architecture in that movie?

• 1:23:43Bill Simmons?

  It's a good movie.

• 1:23:44Speaker 04

  Oh, my God.

• 1:23:44Bill Simmons?

  Jon Stewart's in it.

• 1:23:45Speaker 04

  Literally, I don't know anyone else who's ever seen that movie.

• 1:23:48Bill Simmons?

  It would just be me and Joe in Rewatchables.

• 1:23:49Speaker 03

  Saw it one time.

• 1:23:50Speaker 04

  Rewatchables, playing by heart, let's do it.

• 1:23:53Bill Simmons?

  Um, wouldn't Matt Dillon just let her die in the car?

• 1:23:57Speaker 03

  In real life, probably. But remember, he's.

• 1:24:01Bill Simmons?

  He's like, oh shit, this is the lady who could probably get me kicked off the force and in a five year lawsuit. I should just kind of let her go.

• 1:24:08Speaker 03

  There's another version of this movie where he runs up to her and he sees her. He looks around.

• 1:24:16Speaker 04

  And he like drops a cigarette. Yeah, drops it in his.

• 1:24:18Bill Simmons?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:24:20Speaker 04

  That's.

• 1:24:20Bill Simmons?

  Honestly, better movie.

• 1:24:21Speaker 04

  A better movie.

• 1:24:22Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, better movie.

• 1:24:24Speaker 03

  She's catching, she's right, he's just walking away.

• 1:24:26Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's a better movie.

• 1:24:28Bill Simmons?

  So when Terrence Howard gets carjacked and drives off. And the cops see something happening, right? And then they decide what something's happened to the car, they chase it, chase it to this driveway where he's driving radically. They don't walk toward the car, they don't check out, make sure nobody else is in the car.

• 1:24:47Speaker 04

  Well, Luda is slouching.

• 1:24:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:24:49Bill Simmons?

  I'm just, I'm just.

• 1:24:51Speaker 04

  It's the old slouch method.

• 1:24:52Speaker 03

  It's a felony stop at that point.

• 1:24:54Bill Simmons?

  You're.

• 1:24:55Speaker 03

  So on a felony stop.

• 1:24:56Bill Simmons?

  You're at least putting him in handcuffs for two minutes and you're at least checking to see if anyone else is in the car.

• 1:25:01Speaker 03

  Oh, no, you you're talking about after.

• 1:25:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, when they, when they have him, you know, when Ryan Philippi comes in.

• 1:25:06Speaker 04

  Chris is slouching in the front seat.

• 1:25:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, they're checking the car.

• 1:25:09Speaker 03

  Well, hold on.

• 1:25:10Speaker 04

  But Ryan Philippi's like, let's just walk away from it.

• 1:25:12Bill Simmons?

  But he should go check the car.

• 1:25:14Speaker 03

  Beginning of it, you're not checking.

• 1:25:15Bill Simmons?

  These guys are policemen.

• 1:25:16Speaker 03

  At at the beginning of it, you're not checking the car, you're on a felony stop, you have to neutralize him first. It's, you ever been? You haven't, obviously.

• 1:25:26Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I'm saying, what's a neutralize them? You're still checking the car.

• 1:25:29Speaker 03

  You're gonna go check the car, but they hadn't ever really neutralized them because he was still walking.

• 1:25:33Bill Simmons?

  It's an absurd scene.

• 1:25:34Speaker 03

  He was advancing towards them. So like, they're gonna be like, they they go, get out the car, get out the car, get out the car. You get out the car, but whatever, whatever. But like, they're gonna deal with him first before they go check.

• 1:25:45Speaker 04

  He wouldn't even sit down on the curb. So like, they weren't doing anything.

• 1:25:48Bill Simmons?

  Um.

• 1:25:51Bill Simmons?

  Don Cheadle gets into a car accident right where his brother had just been killed? What are the odds of that? Like one in a kajillion?

• 1:25:56Speaker 04

  I think he, he was supposed to show up to that scene.

• 1:26:00Bill Simmons?

  And gets in a car accident while he's on there, yeah. Um, the white van just has keys in it for 12 hours. Nobody just takes it?

• 1:26:09Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 1:26:11Bill Simmons?

  The chop shop guy knew exactly what to do in an unexpected human trafficking situation?

• 1:26:15Speaker 03

  He just knows how to sell people.

• 1:26:17Speaker 04

  Not his first rodeo. Not his first human trafficking.

• 1:26:20Bill Simmons?

  Is this a real human being?

• 1:26:21Speaker 03

  It, it, I would think.

• 1:26:22Bill Simmons?

  Hold on, I'm gonna call Al.

• 1:26:24Speaker 03

  Wait a minute.

• 1:26:25Speaker 04

  He's like, first of all, they're Thai or Cambodian. Secondly.

• 1:26:28Speaker 03

  Yeah, he knows the whole deal. I would think that he would be like, I mean, he didn't want the heat of the blood spatter from earlier. But he wants the heat of selling human beings.

• 1:26:39Bill Simmons?

  But trafficking sounds great.

• 1:26:40Speaker 03

  Yeah. So I would think he would have been even more freaked out. But he wasn't. He got all fucking.

• 1:26:44Speaker 04

  I think he knows, he knows what he's doing.

• 1:26:46Speaker 03

  Thomas Jefferson with the shit.

• 1:26:47Bill Simmons?

  Are chop shop guys secretly the most evil people on the planet? That's one of the lessons from Crash.

• 1:26:52Speaker 03

  They're actually supposed to be kinda cool.

• 1:26:54Bill Simmons?

  That's what I thought.

• 1:26:54Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:26:55Bill Simmons?

  Any other nitpicks?

• 1:26:57Speaker 04

  Uh, no. Just the whole movie.

• 1:26:58Bill Simmons?

  Sequel, prequel, prestige TV, all black cast or untouchable? We mentioned earlier it became a star's TV show in 2008. I think there's a prestige version of this show

• 1:27:11Bill Simmons?

  that you could try to make. I wouldn't wanna watch it. But I think it makes more sense in that context than a movie.

• 1:27:18Speaker 04

  I think it's untouchable in, but not the way you usually use untouchable on this show.

• 1:27:21Bill Simmons?

  True.

• 1:27:22Speaker 03

  You could orient.

• 1:27:23Bill Simmons?

  It's touchable.

• 1:27:24Speaker 03

  Uh, it's touchable. You could orient a prestige show around the case that Don Cheadle was on. Right?

• 1:27:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:34Speaker 03

  Around that case, like with the dirty cop and the whole deal and the machinations within like City Hall. And then it could spread out from there, then to the DA, then to his son, then to his brother.

• 1:27:46Bill Simmons?

  It would have to be a black showrunner.

• 1:27:48Speaker 04

  Cause the, the, the sequel to this is The Hunt for Ryan Phillippe, right? Is Ryan Philby going back to work? He burned his car. Is he going to Mexico?

• 1:27:57Speaker 03

  He's going back to work. Yeah, he's gotta go back to work.

• 1:27:59Speaker 04

  So Don Cheadle's looking for the murderer of his brother who was on the force.

• 1:28:02Speaker 03

  All of that. That's part of the show.

• 1:28:03Bill Simmons?

  Cord Jefferson's Crash?

• 1:28:05Speaker 03

  Cord Jefferson's Crash.

• 1:28:05Bill Simmons?

  But it's a comedy?

• 1:28:06Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 1:28:06Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 1:28:07Bill Simmons?

  After he does Entourage?

• 1:28:09Speaker 04

  Guess what?

• 1:28:09Speaker 03

  If he does Entourage, he does it.

• 1:28:11Speaker 04

  Guess what? It's already a comedy. Crash is already a comedy.

• 1:28:14Bill Simmons?

  He just does it. It's like when Gus Van Sant did Psycho as a shot by shot remake.

• 1:28:19Speaker 04

  Right, shot by shot remake, yeah.

• 1:28:20Bill Simmons?

  Cord just does a shot by shot Crash remake.

• 1:28:22Speaker 04

  What is he doing?

• 1:28:24Bill Simmons?

  Is this movie better than Wayne Jenkins, Danny Trejo, Doris Berg, Sam Jackson? No, Byron Mayo, Barney Cousins, Tony Romo, Harley Mays, Chris Collinsworth, Daniel Plainview, Long Legs, or Wilford Brimley in The Firm?

• 1:28:33Speaker 03

  The question is, how is Danny Trejo not in this fucking movie?

• 1:28:37Bill Simmons?

  He must have been filming another movie.

• 1:28:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, he, he, it's so LA, crimey. Like, how is he not in it? They didn't find anything for him in this anywhere.

• 1:28:46Speaker 04

  Wilford Brimley in The Firm in the Fickner role.

• 1:28:52Speaker 04

  Cause there's that whole scene in The Firm where he's like showing Tom Cruise the incriminated photos of him. The dossiers.

• 1:28:57Bill Simmons?

  You know what that's gonna mean, Cheadle? Heartbreak.

• 1:29:01Bill Simmons?

  I think Wayne Jenkins is the Matt Dillon. We won't do a Wayne Jenkins impersonation without CR.

• 1:29:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:29:05Bill Simmons?

  Wayne Jenkins in the Matt Dillon role would have been pretty interesting.

• 1:29:07Speaker 04

  You don't wanna try?

• 1:29:08Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 1:29:09Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:29:09Speaker 03

  It's, it's, it's, it's.

• 1:29:11Speaker 04

  Do you wanna say Shaniqua again?

• 1:29:12Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 1:29:15Bill Simmons?

  Just one Oscar, who gets it?

• 1:29:18Bill Simmons?

  I mean, it got three Oscars, but I think in retrospect, I'd probably say Terrence Howard.

• 1:29:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:29:24Bill Simmons?

  For Best Supporting Actor. If I had to give an Oscar.

• 1:29:27Speaker 04

  I would say Terrence Howard.

• 1:29:28Speaker 03

  What about Ludacris as a nomination? He blew it in.

• 1:29:31Speaker 04

  That would've been really fun.

• 1:29:32Speaker 03

  That'd be really fun for Ludacris.

• 1:29:33Bill Simmons?

  At that Fast Seven, he got robbed.

• 1:29:35Speaker 04

  Luda on the, on the award circuit?

• 1:29:37Speaker 03

  Would've been great.

• 1:29:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:29:39Bill Simmons?

  Probably an answerable questions.

• 1:29:42Bill Simmons?

  If this movie had a black director but was the exact same movie, what happens?

• 1:29:47Speaker 03

  I they do.

• 1:29:49Speaker 04

  And a serious rewrite of the screenplay?

• 1:29:51Bill Simmons?

  I'm saying it's the exact same movie.

• 1:29:53Speaker 04

  Exact same movie.

• 1:29:54Bill Simmons?

  Every single moment is the same, but the director's black whatever.

• 1:29:57Speaker 03

  Run him out of town. I'm telling you, man, it would have been.

• 1:30:00Speaker 04

  Oh, it doesn't get any Oscars.

• 1:30:03Speaker 03

  They run him out of town. It would have been, he's just got to, he or she would have just gotten destroyed from all sides.

• 1:30:10Bill Simmons?

  Any other rewatchables?

• 1:30:12Speaker 04

  How did this movie beat Brokeback Mountain? I guess that's not really the question of the category, but like.

• 1:30:18Bill Simmons?

  Brokeback Mountain and where the country was in two thousand and five.

• 1:30:20Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:30:21Bill Simmons?

  That's it.

• 1:30:22Speaker 05

  And the Academy specifically.

• 1:30:23Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and old white dudes who were probably seventy to eighty percent of the vote at this point.

• 1:30:29Speaker 03

  I'll say something about Brokeback Mountain is Brokeback Mountain didn't, Brokeback Mountain went for it. When you were in the theater watching Brokeback Mountain, that actually made me read the short story after. When you were in the theater watching Brokeback Mountain, Brokeback Mountain didn't make that story for consumption with people that would be uncomfortable with any of the, and not even just the sex, the love and the affection between the two men. Brokeback Mountain said, either you're ready for it or you're not, and they weren't quite ready.

• 1:31:01Bill Simmons?

  It doesn't seem.

• 1:31:04Speaker 04

  Like.

• 1:31:04Bill Simmons?

  We're probably doing it this year for rewatchables. It doesn't seem as crazy now when you're watching it as it did in oh five, that there was a mainstream movie that was going for some of the stuff it was going for. Now it's like twenty years later, it's like, of course they made this movie.

• 1:31:16Speaker 04

  Well, it was mostly, it's mostly, I think, that like Gyllenhaal and Ledger were, but like Ang Lee wins best director. It's not, it's not inconceivable that it wins best picture. I think it was really, really close.

• 1:31:28Bill Simmons?

  Everybody was shocked. I think it was a heavy favorite.

• 1:31:30Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, I mean.

• 1:31:31Speaker 04

  It's just like, if it's gonna lose.

• 1:31:32Bill Simmons?

  Now it's crazy. Now if you're redoing Oscars, it's one of the first ones you redo.

• 1:31:36Speaker 04

  But like, if it's gonna lose to anything, that it loses to Crash is just like.

• 1:31:41Speaker 03

  Was nominated that year.

• 1:31:42Bill Simmons?

  Well, there was, Munich was nominated that year.

• 1:31:44Speaker 05

  Capote.

• 1:31:45Speaker 04

  Capote.

• 1:31:45Bill Simmons?

  Capote was the other one, yeah. And then Good Night, Good Luck, which was not a good movie.

• 1:31:49Speaker 03

  Not a incredibly strong.

• 1:31:52Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it was a bad movie.

• 1:31:53Speaker 03

  Best Picture year, right?

• 1:31:54Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:31:54Bill Simmons?

  But Brokeback should have won. It's crazy that it did win. Um, what piece of memorabilia would you want or not want from this movie? It's probably the fortified underwear would be my pick for the not want.

• 1:32:08Bill Simmons?

  Game worn fortified underwear. No, thank you.

• 1:32:11Speaker 04

  You don't think, uh, Tenduwe Newton kept that?

• 1:32:14Bill Simmons?

  Probably dumped that one. The St. Christopher statues.

• 1:32:19Bill Simmons?

  Coach Finstak or best life lesson. Everyone's a racist.

• 1:32:24Speaker 03

  But also, but also, everyone's not a racist.

• 1:32:28Speaker 05

  You can be racist.

• 1:32:29Bill Simmons?

  You can be a redeemable racist.

• 1:32:31Speaker 03

  Yeah, everyone is a little bad, but everyone is, we're all like pizza.

• 1:32:35Speaker 04

  How about, how about public transportation? It's not so bad. It's better than getting in a car with Brian.

• 1:32:42Bill Simmons?

  Yep. Good point.

• 1:32:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:32:44Bill Simmons?

  Best double feature choice. What do you have, Joe?

• 1:32:47Speaker 04

  Uh, 25th Hour?

• 1:32:50Bill Simmons?

  Oh, interesting.

• 1:32:51Speaker 03

  Interesting one.

• 1:32:52Bill Simmons?

  Wow.

• 1:32:53Speaker 04

  You know, that, that movie has the, the like hyper racist rants from all the characters inside of it, but it's like, we did this better. This is how spiked, you know, so.

• 1:33:04Speaker 03

  Grand Canyon.

• 1:33:06Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 1:33:08Bill Simmons?

  No, that's honestly, that's the answer. I was gonna say American history, actually, this, Grand Canyon is perfect.

• 1:33:13Speaker 03

  Grand Canyon.

• 1:33:14Bill Simmons?

  Cause that's like the previous generation.

• 1:33:16Speaker 03

  The kind of same.

• 1:33:17Bill Simmons?

  Uh oh, we took a wrong turn coming back from the Laker game.

• 1:33:21Speaker 04

  Oh my god.

• 1:33:23Bill Simmons?

  That movie's funny, too.

• 1:33:25Speaker 03

  I still fuck with Grand Canyon. I know, I kinda like it. I know everybody.

• 1:33:30Bill Simmons?

  She finds a baby?

• 1:33:31Speaker 03

  I know everybody hates it.

• 1:33:32Bill Simmons?

  Mary, Mary McDonald finds a baby?

• 1:33:34Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:33:35Speaker 04

  That's amazing.

• 1:33:35Bill Simmons?

  It's our baby.

• 1:33:36Speaker 03

  I fuck with Grand Canyon.

• 1:33:38Bill Simmons?

  Who won the movie? I guess Paul Haggis.

• 1:33:40Speaker 03

  Yeah, Paul Haggis won.

• 1:33:43Speaker 03

  I'm, I've never.

• 1:33:43Speaker 04

  And we all collectively lost, I think, as a culture.

• 1:33:47Bill Simmons?

  Craig, had you ever seen this movie?

• 1:33:49Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:33:51Speaker 03

  I've never been more.

• 1:33:51Speaker 05

  I had heard about it. Certainly.

• 1:33:53Bill Simmons?

  So you knew, you were a little prejudiced by what you had heard?

• 1:33:56Speaker 05

  Yeah. I thought this was like the best movie I've seen in 10 years.

• 1:34:01Speaker 05

  I'm completely lying.

• 1:34:02Speaker 03

  Oh, I was about to say, bro, what the shit?

• 1:34:04Speaker 05

  No, no. You know that meme that's like, my expectations were low, but holy fuck?

• 1:34:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:34:09Speaker 05

  That is how I felt. I thought this would at least have something I could kinda grab on to. I thought this was hor- a horrible movie.

• 1:34:15Speaker 04

  What was the worst part of this horrible movie for you?

• 1:34:17Speaker 05

  Uh.

• 1:34:21Speaker 05

  Honestly, how unsubtle it is and how lack of nuance there is.

• 1:34:29Speaker 05

  Just, I don't know, shocking at 2005. Maybe that was a terrible time. And you know what's funny is I do think the movie, if it were to come out now, I kind of think it would still be really successful. I think this movie would still make a lot of money amongst a certain crowd because it's kind of like if a Facebook post was a movie. Like, there's that kind of Facebook pseudo-intellectual, like, warped, sentimental bullshit.

• 1:34:50Speaker 04

  But it didn't even make a lot of money then. It didn't even make a lot of money then.

• 1:34:54Bill Simmons?

  It made about a hundred million.

• 1:34:55Speaker 05

  No, it made like a hundred million under six. I mean, that's crazy.

• 1:34:58Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, like relative to the budget, but like, we used to live in a society where we watched more movies, but who?

• 1:35:05Speaker 05

  That's true.

• 1:35:06Speaker 04

  Who is watching this movie now?

• 1:35:07Speaker 05

  Everybody's on Facebook.

• 1:35:09Speaker 03

  Craig, the movie would come out and, like, we would go ape shit.

• 1:35:14Speaker 04

  It would end careers.

• 1:35:15Speaker 03

  It was like, we, like, people, it, it, like, movies, Queen and Slip, like, any movie that delves into this, that doesn't do it authentically now, is held up in such detest.

• 1:35:28Speaker 05

  You couldn't make it with any of the big names or anything like that, but what was that, um, what was that movie that came out a couple of years ago? That religious movie that was, that did really well?

• 1:35:36Speaker 03

  Talking about God's Not Dead?

• 1:35:37Speaker 05

  No, it was about like the trap, the like, Sound of Freedom.

• 1:35:40Speaker 03

  Oh, shit. You're talking about like something different, though.

• 1:35:42Speaker 05

  Yeah, but I think there's like, it's like, there's a world in which it catches fire in that way because of that kind of side of society.

• 1:35:48Speaker 04

  Wasn't Sound of Freedom the one that they, like, astroturfed the theaters, though, that, like, people weren't actually seeing that? They were just mass buying tickets to make it seem like people were seeing the movie?

• 1:35:55Speaker 05

  The pay-forward model.

• 1:35:57Speaker 03

  Also, mass church groups, mega churches, would get their people and take their people to go see the movie after church. But though, to be honest with you, I might make one of those. Those movies do well. I'm being for real. I might make one of those, like.

• 1:36:11Speaker 04

  What is your, what is your mega church scam movie called, man?

• 1:36:15Speaker 03

  Ooh, that's a good one.

• 1:36:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:36:16Speaker 03

  Oh, you know what it is?

• 1:36:17Bill Simmons?

  He won't be making a Scientology movie. We've learned that during this pod. They blacked his face out.

• 1:36:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, black my face out again. Mine is gonna be about a prosperity preacher. Like a, like a black prosperity preacher that preaches, kind of like Leap of Faith. It's a shadow remake of Leap of Faith with, uh, with Steve Martin. It's about a black prosperity preacher that's actually just trying to get money, but then something happens. And he really catches the spirit. All right, he really catches the spirit and then is I'm gonna have put all of the people in it. He David gonna be in my shit and like we gonna put all of the people in it and then we just gonna go church to church to church to church to church running it up.

• 1:37:00Speaker 05

  I can't believe every actor.

• 1:37:01Speaker 03

  It's called the price of heaven.

• 1:37:03Speaker 05

  I can't believe every actor read the script and was like, yeah. This is an awesome choice for me in my career right now.

• 1:37:08Speaker 03

  Craig, I guarantee you. They were so thrilled.

• 1:37:11Speaker 05

  I know, I bet.

• 1:37:12Bill Simmons?

  I think I I really think it's hard to overstate how weird two thousand five was.

• 1:37:16Speaker 05

  Well, I could see how in the moment.

• 1:37:18Bill Simmons?

  Society.

• 1:37:18Speaker 05

  I could see how in the moment, if you're an impressionable young person and you go see this movie that like like your ten minute regret thing. I could even see it being like a year long regret. I'm surprised Ebert didn't walk it back because he usually does when he has bad takes. But you can see how in the moment, somebody could walk away being like, this felt important.

• 1:37:33Speaker 03

  But just put it in context, okay, so post nine eleven, we are dealing with a lot of like nine eleven was almost. It was the big, it wasn't the beginning of online. It was the beginning of this really harsh approach to to to discourse where we're like.

• 1:37:51Speaker 04

  Tribalism.

• 1:37:51Speaker 03

  To, yeah, to where we're like really litigating the the the all the idiosyncrasies between us and all of that stuff like that. This movie deals in that, then you have like the Bush era where we thought we were divided, weren't even nearly as divided as we are now. It was actually a movie perfect for its time in a way to look at.

• 1:38:12Bill Simmons?

  Seth felt like we weren't. I I thought nine eleven in some ways brought people a little closer.

• 1:38:17Speaker 03

  It did, but.

• 1:38:19Bill Simmons?

  And then Tom Brady and the Patriots started winning Super Bowls and that brought people closer.

• 1:38:22Speaker 03

  It did.

• 1:38:23Speaker 04

  But it but it gave people license to say, I feel like it gave people license to say things that they weren't saying in the nineties. You know what I mean? Like we went through a phase in the ninety political PC culture, right? And then nine eleven happened and it just sort of let the lid off of a lot of stuff.

• 1:38:36Speaker 05

  It's happening a little bit again right now.

• 1:38:37Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 1:38:38Speaker 03

  Right, but then also remember that like by the time two thousand five comes. We're just beginning to sort of reexamine all of the stuff.

• 1:38:45Bill Simmons?

  Well, but the OJ verdict starts it, right? The way everybody reacted to the OJ verdict was illuminating in a lot of different ways and that kind of led to it, but then by the late nineties. I don't know, it felt like things had.

• 1:38:59Speaker 03

  Oh, we were, you know why?

• 1:39:00Bill Simmons?

  Could've kind of moved on.

• 1:39:01Speaker 03

  You know why?

• 1:39:02Bill Simmons?

  Why?

• 1:39:02Speaker 03

  Cause everybody was getting money.

• 1:39:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:04Speaker 03

  We were having fun.

• 1:39:05Bill Simmons?

  Then nine eleven happened.

• 1:39:06Speaker 03

  And then, and then.

• 1:39:08Bill Simmons?

  It's like, oh shit.

• 1:39:08Speaker 03

  Everybody.

• 1:39:09Speaker 04

  Bill Clinton, party president.

• 1:39:10Speaker 03

  Party president.

• 1:39:11Speaker 04

  Party president.

• 1:39:12Speaker 03

  Having fun, fucking NSYNC, Backstreet Boys. Everybody was having a good time. The economy was good. Everybody was having fun. And then stuff starts to happen. And we start to go, okay.

• 1:39:22Bill Simmons?

  Joe Francis, girls were going wild.

• 1:39:25Speaker 03

  Bruh. Two AM. Two AM.

• 1:39:30Speaker 03

  We're in South Padre Island, Texas.

• 1:39:32Bill Simmons?

  Wrestling was the best it's ever been.

• 1:39:34Speaker 03

  Wrestling, the Attitude Era.

• 1:39:35Bill Simmons?

  Nineties was fun.

• 1:39:36Speaker 03

  The nineties was.

• 1:39:37Speaker 04

  Nothing better than the nineties.

• 1:39:39Bill Simmons?

  Movies were great.

• 1:39:40Speaker 04

  Nothing better than the nineties.

• 1:39:41Bill Simmons?

  Shows were coming on.

• 1:39:41Speaker 03

  Music was amazing.

• 1:39:43Bill Simmons?

  Nineties, great.

• 1:39:43Speaker 03

  We, we like.

• 1:39:44Speaker 05

  I was there, Connor.

• 1:39:45Bill Simmons?

  Internet was starting.

• 1:39:46Speaker 03

  Internet was just starting.

• 1:39:48Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:39:48Speaker 03

  It was a great.

• 1:39:49Bill Simmons?

  It's good times.

• 1:39:49Speaker 04

  Was the internet a mistake?

• 1:39:51Bill Simmons?

  The what?

• 1:39:52Speaker 04

  Was the internet a mistake?

• 1:39:56Speaker 05

  It was inevitable.

• 1:39:57Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it was inevitable.

• 1:39:59Speaker 04

  That's what we're saying about AI right now.

• 1:40:02Speaker 05

  I thought the, uh, the Cambodian children part, I was like, all right, we've, we've gone one step too far. We didn't need that.

• 1:40:08Speaker 04

  That's what broke you.

• 1:40:08Speaker 05

  I was like, what are we even like, what are we doing at this point?

• 1:40:12Speaker 04

  Craig made it almost, almost all the way through the movie and then we broke him.

• 1:40:16Speaker 05

  Cambodian children and women in it. I'm like, all right, Paul, Paul, come on here.

• 1:40:20Speaker 03

  Another reason why everybody did it is because of Paul Haggis.

• 1:40:24Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:40:24Speaker 04

  Million dollar baby.

• 1:40:25Speaker 03

  Million dollar baby, yeah.

• 1:40:25Speaker 05

  Also, I love that the only character he didn't redeem was the, was the store owner, the Persian guy. Like, he didn't redeem, like.

• 1:40:32Bill Simmons?

  We saw Angel.

• 1:40:33Speaker 05

  God saved me from killing this little girl.

• 1:40:35Speaker 04

  Redemption is Matt Dillon, where they, they're just sort of like, Christmas in LA.

• 1:40:40Speaker 05

  But Haggis tried to redeem Matt Dillon, even though it was ridiculous. Like, you didn't even try to redeem, what was the redemption for the store owner?

• 1:40:47Speaker 04

  They're getting rid of the gun.

• 1:40:49Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:49Speaker 04

  And he's, he's not going to go shoot people in the street anymore.

• 1:40:53Speaker 05

  Tried to kill me, thought God saved him.

• 1:40:54Speaker 03

  He killed a kid, bruh. I don't care, he did it, he guilty.

• 1:40:58Speaker 05

  Hundred percent.

• 1:40:59Speaker 03

  That's a, that's a, that's a charge.

• 1:41:02Speaker 05

  See, that shot is also, the two shots they use in the promotion of this, like when you're Googling this movie, is the, is the Tandy Newton in Matt Dillon's arm and then Michael Pena's screen.

• 1:41:13Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:41:13Bill Simmons?

  Crash coming Friday.

• 1:41:15Speaker 05

  I would watch Emilio Perez 20 times in a row before I watch Crash again.

• 1:41:19Speaker 03

  Actually, to be honest with you, Emilio Perez is kind of the Crash of it's day.

• 1:41:23Speaker 05

  Similar similarities.

• 1:41:24Speaker 04

  Except, uh, we, we took a turn before it won Best Picture. Uh, here's a question for you.

• 1:41:29Bill Simmons?

  We sure did.

• 1:41:30Speaker 04

  Uh, watching this movie, did you think you were watching a kind of movie where like, the kid is gonna die?

• 1:41:37Speaker 05

  I did think the kid was gonna die.

• 1:41:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, or like, it's a different experience rewatching Crash.

• 1:41:42Bill Simmons?

  Actually, I hadn't seen it in a long time.

• 1:41:43Speaker 04

  Like Terrence Howard gets out.

• 1:41:44Bill Simmons?

  I thought Michael Pena died in the movie. That was my memory of it.

• 1:41:47Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:41:48Speaker 04

  There's certain stakes in a movie when you watch it the first time. Terrence Howard gets out of the car with a gun in the back of his belt. You're like, something terrible's gonna happen. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:41:55Speaker 05

  The Pena scene was nerve wracking. I was, I was gonna be really sad.

• 1:41:57Bill Simmons?

  I'd collect the movie.

• 1:41:59Speaker 04

  No, it's just, but then you rewatch it, knowing the girl's gonna be safe, Terrence Howard's gonna be safe, and you're just sort of like, well, it's just Lawrence Tate and we don't really care.

• 1:42:06Bill Simmons?

  That movie won Best Picture.

• 1:42:08Speaker 05

  I'm telling you, man, I don't know what movie I'd rather watch than, or I wouldn't rather watch than this. Like, like The Room, Tommy Wiseau, I would watch that.

• 1:42:16Speaker 04

  Well, that's just fun.

• 1:42:17Speaker 05

  I would watch anything over this.

• 1:42:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:42:18Speaker 05

  Liz came in halfway through and was like, what is going on? Like, every five minutes, this is like ridiculously over the top racist interaction.

• 1:42:26Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:42:27Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that's Crash. That was the rewatchables. You can, uh, watch us every week on Spotify on video, watch us on Ringer Movies. You can see these two in House of R and Midnight Boys.

• 1:42:39Speaker 03

  Midnight Boys, yep.

• 1:42:40Speaker 05

  Beep beep, beep beep.

• 1:42:41Bill Simmons?

  And, uh.

• 1:42:42Speaker 04

  Wait, did you guys say?

• 1:42:43Bill Simmons?

  I said beep beep.

• 1:42:45Speaker 04

  That's all I'm gonna do now. That's all I'm gonna do now.

• 1:42:49Speaker 03

  Cause I didn't realize what he was doing. It's pew pew.

• 1:42:51Speaker 04

  No, no.

• 1:42:51Bill Simmons?

  But I said beep beep.

• 1:42:53Speaker 04

  The Midnight Boys, beep beep.

• 1:42:54Speaker 03

  It's pew pew.

• 1:42:55Bill Simmons?

  I don't care. I did beep beep.

• 1:42:57Speaker 04

  It's beep beep now.

• 1:42:58Bill Simmons?

  Cause I did my own version of it.

• 1:42:59Speaker 04

  It's beep beep now.

• 1:43:00Speaker 03

  Midnight Boys beep beep, yeah. Johnny Five.

• 1:43:03Speaker 04

  Like the little Road Runner.

• 1:43:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, beep beep.

• 1:43:06Speaker 04

  Beep beep.

• 1:43:07Bill Simmons?

  And Higher Learning as well.

• 1:43:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:43:09Bill Simmons?

  Thank you both.

• 1:43:10Speaker 04

  Thank you.