‘A Nightmare on Elm Street’ With Bill Simmons, Chris Ryan, and Van Lathan

One, two, Freddy’s coming for you. Three, four, better lock your door. The guys try not to fall asleep after rewatching Wes Craven’s 1984 classic, ‘A Nightmare on Elm Street,’ starring Heather Langenkamp, Robert Englund, and Johnny Depp. Producers: Craig Horlbeck, Chia Hao Tat, Eduardo Ocampo, and Matt Pevic Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:06Bill Simmons?

  The Rewatchables, we are live on Netflix. Van Lathan is here.

• 0:11Speaker 01

  What's up?

• 0:11Bill Simmons?

  You might see him, remember him on Higher Learning.

• 0:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:15Bill Simmons?

  Ringoverse?

• 0:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 0:16Bill Simmons?

  The Net Boys?

• 0:17Speaker 01

  Puh, puh.

• 0:17Bill Simmons?

  Ringertailgate covering the 7-0 UCLA Bruins.

• 0:20Chris Ryan?

  Freddy Krueger, how would he raise the roof?

• 0:26Speaker 01

  Welcome to prime time.

• 0:30Bill Simmons?

  That's how you're starting the pod?

• 0:35Speaker 01

  He's going crazy. He likes to wiggle the finger.

• 0:38Chris Ryan?

  He does like to wiggle.

• 0:39Bill Simmons?

  CR is here. CR, are you still working?

• 0:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 0:41Bill Simmons?

  What's going on with you?

• 0:42Speaker 03

  I like coming on the Rewatchables once a month.

• 0:44Bill Simmons?

  Oh, cool.

• 0:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 0:45Bill Simmons?

  Well, we're about to do live Van's favorite horror movie.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  Oh, yes.

• 0:50Bill Simmons?

  It's your number one, right?

• 0:51Speaker 01

  Not this movie, this franchise, but this actual film is the most fundamental part of my Freddy lore.

• 0:59Bill Simmons?

  Nightmare on Elm Street, live, coming next. This episode is brought to by Ethos. As a parent, life insurance feels like a no-brainer and just gives me peace of mind knowing my family will be taken care of. And Ethos makes getting it fast and easy. Apply online in minutes. Get up to 3 million in coverage with no medical exam, just a few simple health questions. Take 10 minutes to get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free quote at ethos.com/rewatch. That is E-T-H-O-S dot com slash rewatch. Application times may vary, rates may vary. This episode is brought to you by Major League Baseball. There is nowhere left to go, two teams, one championship.

• 1:41Bill Simmons?

  Watch the World Series, yeah, the World Series, presented by Capital One on Fox and Fox One. No time like October. Visit MLB.com slash postseason to learn more.

• 2:09Bill Simmons?

  I'm gonna start here. Nightmare on Elm Street. I call it Nightmare on Elm Street. It really is a nightmare on Elm Street.

• 2:16Chris Ryan?

  It is a nightmare, yeah.

• 2:16Bill Simmons?

  When did we drop the A with this?

• 2:18Chris Ryan?

  Hmm, I like the A.

• 2:20Bill Simmons?

  You like the A?

• 2:21Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:21Speaker 01

  The A is, uh, it's classier. A nightmare on Elm Street.

• 2:26Bill Simmons?

  I'm gonna start here.

• 2:26Chris Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:27Bill Simmons?

  The most realistic batshit crazy movie ever made.

• 2:31Chris Ryan?

  Oh, um, realistic?

• 2:33Bill Simmons?

  When I watch this, I'm like, yeah, I feel like all of this could happen, but it's fucking insane.

• 2:38Chris Ryan?

  I think I know why you think that, though.

• 2:40Bill Simmons?

  Why?

• 2:40Chris Ryan?

  Because if you operate inside of dream logic, anything is possible.

• 2:43Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:44Chris Ryan?

  Because when you're watching most horror movies, you have something like an interior monologue that's like, don't go down there. Like, obviously, that other person is hurt, Franklin, don't go looking for them in Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

• 2:56Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:56Chris Ryan?

  Whatever, like, in this movie, you kind of can't say that because you can't tell somebody they can't go to sleep.

• 3:01Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 3:01Chris Ryan?

  You know, and the future films and Nightmare on Elm Street franchise go to great lengths to try and keep people awake. But even in this, with Nancy popping, stay awake, you know, people have to sleep, and once they do, they're in Freddy's house.

• 3:14Speaker 01

  Also, a dream is just inherently an adventure. Because your subconscious is taking over in a dream, you investigate things you shouldn't investigate. You go places you shouldn't go. You're involved in stuff and you're like, how did I get here? So like, when someone is plopped in the middle of a dream, it's both otherworldly and whatever danger that befalls them, they didn't earn it. So it's actually scarier.

• 3:38Bill Simmons?

  It's the one terror that can't be solved.

• 3:40Chris Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 3:40Speaker 01

  You have to sleep.

• 3:41Bill Simmons?

  Halloween, maybe make sure this guy's coming back to Haddonfield, maybe tell some more policemen and let's try to get this guy and put him in jail. Jason, I guess Jason gets a little weird.

• 3:54Chris Ryan?

  No, Jason.

• 3:54Bill Simmons?

  Jason's like supernatural at some point.

• 3:56Chris Ryan?

  For the first few movies, though, Jason is keeping it pretty local.

• 3:58Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, like, maybe let's not work at the campsite.

• 4:01Chris Ryan?

  Let's just throw a fumigation tent on that, yeah.

• 4:03Bill Simmons?

  This one, once you're in the dreams, I don't know how you fight back.

• 4:07Chris Ryan?

  Well, this is also the fatal flaw, maybe, of this movie, which is then how do you solve against Freddy? Like, how is Freddy ever dead? How, how do you ever really, like, fix something that you're eventually gonna have to dream again? You're have to, you have to go back to sleep.

• 4:20Bill Simmons?

  What was the scariest dream you've ever had? Because I'll tell you mine.

• 4:23Speaker 01

  Uh, this, oh, my hell dream. It happened recently, this year.

• 4:27Bill Simmons?

  Hell dream?

• 4:28Speaker 01

  It's a hell dream, so I had a dream.

• 4:29Bill Simmons?

  Was it after Lillian Kiffin hiring?

• 4:32Speaker 01

  And we're doing good now.

• 4:33Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 4:34Speaker 01

  So this was a hell dream. I'll be quickly brief. So I'm in a, a club in Baton Rouge, like, like a, some kind of nightclub. And the nightclub is built in the swamp. So they're like these wooden things, like the-

• 4:48Bill Simmons?

  The swamp club?

• 4:49Speaker 01

  It's a swamp club.

• 4:50Chris Ryan?

  Kind of like Playa del Rey.

• 4:51Speaker 01

  Exactly, right? We were just talking about it. So I'm in the nightclub and there's, people are like, looking at the animals in the bayou and the snakes and they're playing with them. I'm like, you guys, the bayou is dangerous, like, stop doing that. Now, go sit down, I'm having-

• 5:04Bill Simmons?

  Bayou is dangerous.

• 5:05Speaker 01

  I'm going to sit down, I'm having a drink. And Tales from the Hood, the movie, the end of the movie Tales from the Hood now starts showing on the walls in the club.

• 5:13Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 5:14Speaker 01

  And at the end of the movie-

• 5:15Bill Simmons?

  Sounds like a good club.

• 5:16Speaker 01

  At the end of the movie Tales from the Hood, like, all my friends are there and we're drinking. They won't serve us any food, but they'll give us as much drinks as we want.

• 5:22Bill Simmons?

  Zion, Zionster.

• 5:23Chris Ryan?

  Racist dream.

• 5:24Speaker 01

  Racist dream. No food, all the liquor, you know what's up. So at the end of this, at the end of Tales from the Hood, it's revealed that the guys are actually in hell. The wraparound stories that these guys are in hell and they're burning in hell. And I look around at my friends and I look around at this club where every, where it's all dangerous, people are riding on each other, and we go, nah, no way, right? And my friends look at me and they go, you think so? And I go, it can't be, but we are in hell, in the dream. And one of my other friends goes, yo, can we leave? And I go, we gotta try. And so then we get up and we leave the club. In this dream, not to make things too serious, but I was in this dream at the beginning, looking for my father.

• 6:08Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 6:09Speaker 01

  Like, I was, I was looking for my dad. And then in this dream, when we leave and we get outside, for some reason, there's a blue convertible sports car. And there's only two seats. Uh, it's a coupe. And we go, there's not enough room for all of us. And I go, and we're gonna sit in each other's laps. And then we get, and we drive away.

• 6:27Bill Simmons?

  See, he's a giving guy.

• 6:28Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 6:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:29Bill Simmons?

  And then you woke up.

• 6:30Speaker 01

  Then I woke up and wrote the dream down.

• 6:33Chris Ryan?

  Oh, good.

• 6:33Bill Simmons?

  You kept a dream journal.

• 6:35Speaker 01

  I got up and wrote, I was terrified at the end of it. Got up and wrote the dream down. Scariest dream I've ever had.

• 6:41Bill Simmons?

  I had a dream last night that I was in Oklahoma City with Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook.

• 6:47Chris Ryan?

  Tough.

• 6:48Bill Simmons?

  No, I'm not kidding.

• 6:49Speaker 01

  Nah, you're bullshitting.

• 6:49Bill Simmons?

  And we, no, I swear to God.

• 6:51Speaker 01

  Go ahead, go ahead, get it off, get your shit off.

• 6:52Bill Simmons?

  And we were gonna play a pickup basketball game with a bunch of people there to cheer them up.

• 6:56Chris Ryan?

  Were you telling them how good you are at pickup?

• 6:58Bill Simmons?

  To cheer them up after the Jalen Williams thing. And it was just weird and I, I couldn't find my shoes to play in the game. And I was like, I know they're here, and then I woke up.

• 7:06Chris Ryan?

  Was Katie being nice to you?

• 7:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, he was being really nice, actually. Him and Russ were getting along great. The scariest dream I ever had, though, I was like five or six. I had a dream I was on top of a tall building, like the Empire State Building, one of those. And Batman and Joker were fighting and I was sitting there watching it. Yeah. And then I got too close to it and I got knocked off the building and I started falling down toward the ground.

• 7:30Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 7:31Bill Simmons?

  And I woke up and it was the most scared I've ever been from a dream.

• 7:34Speaker 01

  Real quick, in this dream, Batman makes no effort to save you, right?

• 7:38Bill Simmons?

  No, I was watching them fight.

• 7:39Chris Ryan?

  It goes against his mythology.

• 7:40Speaker 01

  This tells you a lot.

• 7:41Bill Simmons?

  But I, I used to love the Batman show in the mid 70s.

• 7:44Speaker 01

  I know, but there are some people that Batman thinks for the sake of society, you gotta let him go.

• 7:49Bill Simmons?

  So he, Batman was letting me go?

• 7:50Speaker 01

  Batman was letting you go, you got more important fish to fry.

• 7:53Bill Simmons?

  But that, but then I always thought if I, if I landed, would I have died?

• 7:56Chris Ryan?

  You would wake up, right.

• 7:57Bill Simmons?

  But would I have died?

• 7:58Chris Ryan?

  Well, after-

• 7:59Bill Simmons?

  If you die in a dream, you die.

• 8:00Chris Ryan?

  You start to think that. My only, my worst dream ever that I, I still remember from when I was a kid, it was basically the other mommy dream. Uh, you basically, like, I had two moms in front of me, identical. One was giving me the hard sell about how she's my mom, the other one was just kind of like, you know, you, you should know, you should know which one of us is which. And the other one's like, no, it's me, you know, it's me. I choose the hard sell mom.

• 8:22Bill Simmons?

  Oh, no.

• 8:23Chris Ryan?

  The other mom walks off, she looks back at me from the landing and shakes her head and goes down the stairs. I look back at the hard sell mom, her eyebrows grow and her nails grow when I wake up.

• 8:33Speaker 01

  No.

• 8:34Bill Simmons?

  How old were you for that one?

• 8:36Speaker 01

  Hell, no.

• 8:36Chris Ryan?

  Really young.

• 8:37Bill Simmons?

  Jesus. Bring that one to the therapist.

• 8:41Speaker 01

  Hold on for a second, bro. This is some Ativan in my bag. Like, no way, that is fucking terrifying.

• 8:47Chris Ryan?

  Werewolf other mommy.

• 8:48Bill Simmons?

  You know what's gonna be really terrifying? Bangkok Craig's worst dream ever.

• 8:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's your worst dream?

• 8:52Bill Simmons?

  What did you have, Bangkok Craig?

• 8:53Chris Ryan?

  Um, not starting a kicker last week.

• 8:56Bill Simmons?

  Not starting a Kim Dicker.

• 8:57Speaker 03

  Drafting Saquon. Uh, my scariest dream, or the one that at least sticks out, is one time I remember I was a kid and I was stuck inside of a giant beer bottle, like, a giant glass bottle.

• 9:07Chris Ryan?

  Oh, my God.

• 9:07Speaker 03

  Inside of it, and, and ants were crawling into the top of the bottle down the tube towards me and I was trapped.

• 9:12Chris Ryan?

  Is that like in the night kitchen? Where did you, how did you even get that imagery?

• 9:16Speaker 03

  Don't know.

• 9:16Chris Ryan?

  God.

• 9:16Bill Simmons?

  Hmm. So being trapped, suffocated into something.

• 9:21Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 9:22Bill Simmons?

  See, there, there's like this whole sign, this was my biggest issue with The Sopranos. Because I thought David Chase was too interested in dreams. And I feel like when you use dreams as a device in TV shows like that, you can basically do anything.

• 9:33Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 9:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. And it's like this blank canvas and I'm not sure what anything means, but, you know, it was the key at the end of season two, when he realizes that pussy was who, you know?

• 9:43Speaker 01

  Well, when his subconscious, like, told him to come to terms with the fact that he had to kill him.

• 9:47Bill Simmons?

  And that means something. But in general, this whole thing about, as a horror movie concept of, I can't fall asleep, but human beings have to sleep, what do you do? This is a great what do you do movie.

• 9:59Chris Ryan?

  And there's also, like, the danger of dream world violence will cross over into the physical world. It's something that I think everybody is familiar with, the sensation that that could be true, but knows, like, if I wake up, like, I'll be fine, right? But this is like, it just adjusts it enough. That it's, it works so perfectly. And on top of that, like the, the dreams in this movie are not annoying, like flights of fancy. And like, the only time they ever rewrite history is at the very end, and that's the worst dream of it all.

• 10:30Speaker 01

  Right.

• 10:30Chris Ryan?

  You know?

• 10:31Speaker 01

  And as human beings, one of the things that we've, civilization to civilization, struggled to understand, is the meaning of our dreams. Like, why we dream about things, how we dream about things. And although we understand the science behind it, there's still all kind of metaphysics and spirituality in why we dream, how our brain keeps going when we're asleep. And these dreams, as this generational curse, this boogeyman that can infect it, is something that multiple cultures have explored throughout the history of.

• 11:05Bill Simmons?

  So you think this is, you think this is the best gimmick we've ever had in a horror movie?

• 11:09Speaker 01

  Without a doubt. And it, it gives Freddy the opportunity to be something that he becomes. In this one, he's a supernatural slasher. But Freddy ends up becoming a comic book villain.

• 11:19Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 11:19Speaker 01

  By the end of this entire thing-

• 11:21Bill Simmons?

  Well, he's Fred for this whole movie.

• 11:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 11:22Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 11:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, by the end of the-

• 11:23Bill Simmons?

  It's more formal.

• 11:25Speaker 01

  He loves his work. He does it with a smile. The sort of way that he's been tortured by these people, he is so happy to revisit this on their children at their most vulnerable moment. And he becomes something that he, to me, gets to a spot in, like, horror movie villainry that no, that no other character gets to.

• 11:46Bill Simmons?

  One, two, Freddy's coming for you. Three, four, better lock your door. Five, six, grab your crucifix.

• 11:52Speaker 01

  For no reason.

• 11:54Bill Simmons?

  Seven, eight, gonna stay up late. Nine, ten, never sleep again. They only, they only do it twice in the movie. Basically, near the beginning and then in the end.

• 12:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:03Bill Simmons?

  But it's fucking creepy.

• 12:04Speaker 01

  Awesome.

• 12:06Bill Simmons?

  Fred Krueger, goes by Fred in this movie. It's IMDb change. Didn't become Freddy until later. We talked about this during the Chainsaw Massacre pod, that the big four was Freddy, Jason, Myers.

• 12:20Chris Ryan?

  Leatherface.

• 12:21Bill Simmons?

  Leatherface. You agree with that, Van?

• 12:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, we talked about it a little bit on, on Friday the 13th as well.

• 12:25Bill Simmons?

  That's our four? I think being everywhere, you said this, and, you know, revisiting the movie, watching it a couple of times, going back in the whole universe, I think you might be right. I think the ability to be in multiple places is the best, the most unstoppable gimmick of all the gimmicks. It's the first time we see, we see him when he's outside in the background, when he's chasing Tina the second time. And then he switches, and now all of a sudden, she's running, and then he's, I don't know how he stopped that.

• 12:53Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. I mean, this is, this is the scariest possible thing, because you don't have to go to summer camp, you don't have to pick up a hitchhiker in Texas. You know, there's all, all these other killers, all these other slashers have, you meet them where they are, kind of. I mean, I guess Myers is coming to a suburban street, but Myers does feel like a situation we could have handled a little bit better.

• 13:15Bill Simmons?

  Slow walker.

• 13:16Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 13:17Bill Simmons?

  Just, Myers is gonna move at his pace the whole time. Freddy's-

• 13:20Chris Ryan?

  Freddy is able to take on all these different forms. He's inhibiting, he's inhabiting all the different fears that these people have. And I really don't know, like, in a weird way, like, if, of all the franchises that should have just been one movie, this one maybe is the most, because you're just like, it should end with it being like, there is no end to this.

• 13:42Speaker 01

  Right.

• 13:42Chris Ryan?

  You know, there is no way to defeat this guy.

• 13:45Bill Simmons?

  We should probably talk about the ending now, because it's been controversial. It was always my least favorite thing about the movie. I thought it just went really sideways and was weird.

• 13:53Chris Ryan?

  Versions.

• 13:53Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and they, and we can go into the history of it. They had four different ones. They couldn't really decide, and, you know, the production-

• 13:59Speaker 01

  There was a battle over it, yeah.

• 14:00Bill Simmons?

  Production company really wanted them to do one that left the door open for a sequel. But this could have been a beginning, middle, and movie, Van.

• 14:07Speaker 01

  Without a doubt. The movie is elegant. It's a movie that's executed with this impeccable taste level. And the only time that that's not quite true is the end. Because they have to leave it open for Freddy to have more adventures. And Wes Craven, if you, you know, watch him talk about this, was in a battle with the head of New Line-

• 14:31Bill Simmons?

  Bob Shay, yeah.

• 14:32Speaker 01

  Bob Shay, about the fact that the movie had to have some kind of hook at the end of it to keep the audience on the line for another one. So there's not much elegance in the ending of the film. However, it is still scary. It is still skilled-

• 14:46Bill Simmons?

  It's good, it's just weird.

• 14:47Speaker 01

  It's just weird, like, when, there's an otherworldliness to the end of it, where you come out and they even say, look, the fog out there. You feel like you're still in a dream, but you want Nancy to have won.

• 14:58Chris Ryan?

  Sure.

• 14:59Speaker 01

  Like, you want to believe that she's beaten Freddy. You kind of know something's up. Her mom is too cool. The mom has been a fucking asshole the entire time.

• 15:08Bill Simmons?

  You mean drunk milk mom?

• 15:09Speaker 01

  Drunk milk mom going crazy.

• 15:13Bill Simmons?

  Drunk milk mom? I have a lot of notes on March.

• 15:15Speaker 01

  And then, you know-

• 15:16Bill Simmons?

  I was gonna bring a giant thing of vodka, just to swing from there.

• 15:21Speaker 01

  Then it goes down, and you're like, these kids are not safe, and they will never be safe.

• 15:26Bill Simmons?

  So you like it, or you don't like it?

• 15:28Chris Ryan?

  I do like it. I just think, when they get to the end, and it's like Nancy can beat Freddy by turning her back on him, you just know that they're not gonna end it on that note, because like, it's just like, well then, why didn't, why couldn't they have figured that out earlier? Like, how is she sure? And I, I actually think that the way it's all foggy, and it's like, this is what you want. This is your happy ending, right? Like, this is what we think we want. And then it's not that. It's, it's getting trapped in the car with him forever. I guess it's like, there's a little canonical unevenness with it, as you go forward in the sequels, about what happened at the end of that movie and how it works. But, you know, only Nancy lives.

• 16:05Bill Simmons?

  Good outfit, Freddy. Like the hat, like the red, red and green sweater. Supposedly happy for Christmas, but it's not. Good burn face. The razor hands are great. I like that they didn't make him like a giant, they talk about this with the casting of it, that they didn't want to make him like a giant Michael Myers type. Freddy's kind of moving around, like, he's got, like, weird posture. I think he's creepier in a lot of ways than, the, the physicality of him is, I think, the creepiest thing about him.

• 16:34Chris Ryan?

  We've talked a couple of times over Friday the 13th, the Halloween pods that we've done, Leatherface to some extent, about how, like, what happens is you wind up starting to think about the guy, the original conception of the character, the way the sequels present him, rather than the way they're originally shown.

• 16:50Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 16:51Chris Ryan?

  Freddy is like a stand-up comedian by three and four.

• 16:54Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 16:54Chris Ryan?

  Like, he's like-

• 16:55Bill Simmons?

  You don't get this at all in the first one.

• 16:56Chris Ryan?

  What's the funniest way I could kill this person and then do a one-liner?

• 16:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. That was the Schwarzenegger influence.

• 17:01Chris Ryan?

  In this movie, when you first see him go after Tina with the arms, it's fucking terrifying.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  It's scary.

• 17:08Chris Ryan?

  It is, it is like, really, really scary. And he is actually, like, aided by the fact that he is not doing the bits. And he is not doing, like, one-liners after. It's just like, this is a, this is a nightmare to watch this guy's arms go out and come, come after her like that.

• 17:23Speaker 01

  An interesting thing about the Freddy lore is that by the time you get to three and four, they've invented this conceit to where Freddy is more powerful the more kids that he kills. So part of the reason why he is torturing these kids with these one-liners so much is because now he's become this all-powerful dream demon that can be everywhere at once, like you guys talked about, that can, like, use your worst nightmares and everything to put you in this torture chamber. Here, he's still kind of like a mid-level exception dream demon. He's still like a guy that you can get a lot of good minutes out of, but these kids, he hasn't, like, perfected.

• 18:05Speaker 01

  This is the first generation of Elm Street kids that Freddy is haunted, has haunted. He's still working his game out. He's still working his counters out. He's trying to figure out how to stay on the court.

• 18:15Bill Simmons?

  So they can boozer and the gristly shirt?

• 18:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's still trying to figure it out.

• 18:18Bill Simmons?

  Trying to figure out his go-to move.

• 18:19Speaker 01

  By the time you get to the end of it, he's an all-NBA villain, and he's legitimately playing jokes. He's playing pranks on them.

• 18:27Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, he's like smashing girls into TVs and stuff like that.

• 18:30Speaker 01

  Welcome to prime time, bitch. Just kill me, dawg. I don't need a comedy set. Welcome to prime, like, welcome to prime time, bitch.

• 18:37Chris Ryan?

  Nightmare on Elm Street, three dream warriors.

• 18:39Speaker 01

  Dream warriors. Takes her, puts her head into the thing, and then says that. The one kid is horny, so Freddy turns into the nurse, big boobs, like, then takes him hostage. By the end, we get really, really wacky. But in this one, a focused-

• 18:54Bill Simmons?

  Straightforward.

• 18:55Speaker 01

  Straightforward. You killed me, you shouldn't have done it, now your kids are gonna get it.

• 18:59Chris Ryan?

  And this, and this movie has two of the most memorable, disturbing, incredibly executed kills-

• 19:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 19:08Chris Ryan?

  I've ever seen in a movie.

• 19:09Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. I had that in my notes. We did a long Ringer piece about this once, like, the greatest death scenes of all time. And it was about as uncontroversial for me, the, the final 10. Normally, I get really mad. I mean, most famously, with the fast food one we did. It was before you got to the Ringer. We did the best fast food in 2016, and the waffle fries from Chick-fil-A won. And it was an actual affront to America. We're still apologizing. What's the best fast food?

• 19:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, what would be the best?

• 19:37Bill Simmons?

  I mean, I would say the Chick-fil-A chicken, chicken nuggets.

• 19:40Chris Ryan?

  What did win? I can't remember.

• 19:41Bill Simmons?

  The waffle fries.

• 19:42Chris Ryan?

  That one, what, what would you have put? McDonald's fries?

• 19:44Bill Simmons?

  Not the fucking waffle fries.

• 19:46Speaker 01

  Where'd you put the actual nuggets themselves, you said?

• 19:48Bill Simmons?

  I would have, I probably would have done the Chick-fil-A sandwich or the-

• 19:50Chris Ryan?

  Double double from In-N-Out.

• 19:52Bill Simmons?

  But the Big Mac could have been on there. A lot of stuff.

• 19:54Chris Ryan?

  For you, man.

• 19:54Bill Simmons?

  Regardless.

• 19:55Chris Ryan?

  Why? Because nobody gets to eat the double double from In-N-Out.

• 19:58Speaker 03

  I'm in half the country now.

• 19:59Chris Ryan?

  Ah, it's like-

• 20:00Bill Simmons?

  Anyway, best death scenes. I, so, to me, there's different types of death scenes, right? Like, hereditary, the girl's head getting cut off.

• 20:08Chris Ryan?

  Yes. Spoiler.

• 20:09Speaker 01

  Bang!

• 20:13Bill Simmons?

  That movie came out 10 years ago.

• 20:14Chris Ryan?

  There's a big Fred is on fire moment in this movie.

• 20:21Bill Simmons?

  I like the ones where there's a beginning, middle, end. I think they are the hardest ones to stand out. These are my favorite four. Tina dying in the room, definitely. Tina on the ceiling.

• 20:30Speaker 01

  Terrifying.

• 20:31Bill Simmons?

  It's just, the whole scene is just unbelievable. And watching Rod be like,

• 20:36Bill Simmons?

  Scatman Crothers in The Shining. The way that's all set up. Hello? Mrs. Doris, hello? And Jack's like behind. You know he's there, but that, that three minutes, the psycho shower scene, obviously is the goat. And then I really think the opening of Scream is, that would be my fourth.

• 20:53Chris Ryan?

  Drew Barrymore?

• 20:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. I think that first five, six minutes of Scream is fantastic.

• 20:58Chris Ryan?

  It's so agonizing because it goes on so long.

• 21:00Bill Simmons?

  But I like the setup, the execution and the end of a death scene is really hard. Like Halloween, the first one, probably the closest is when the guy goes to get a beer. After he has sex with PJ Soul, she's like, go get me a beer. And he goes downstairs, what's that noise? And then ends up getting the knife in the chest, but it's not as good as those four.

• 21:21Speaker 01

  Can I throw one in?

• 21:22Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, please.

• 21:22Speaker 01

  From a movie that, um, I don't know how many people have seen this movie. Have you guys ever seen Death by Temptation?

• 21:29Chris Ryan?

  I think I saw it when it like came out.

• 21:32Speaker 01

  So Death by Temptation is a movie that stars Kadim Hardison. Samuel L. Jackson is also in this movie. It's about an eons old succubus. And this succubus demon.

• 21:42Bill Simmons?

  That's why I didn't see it because it starred Kadim Hardison. But keep going.

• 21:47Speaker 01

  That's a diss. Shout out to Kadim Hardison, man.

• 21:50Bill Simmons?

  No, I had him just say that's why.

• 21:51Speaker 01

  He's done a lot of great work over these.

• 21:52Bill Simmons?

  I knew that, I would have annoyed Ben.

• 21:53Speaker 01

  And the guy who I think wrote the, the movie and directed it was James Bond III was his name.

• 21:59Bill Simmons?

  I remember that guy.

• 22:00Speaker 01

  Okay, James Bond III. Okay, so there's a scene in Death by Temptation that's still to me is one of the most terrifying horror scenes like ever. So Kadim Hardison is coming back, like he's, he's coming back into the house. The succubus has like possessed the television. He's watching himself on the TV. And he's walking through the house, wondering like who's around. He's seeing himself, but then we're seeing him in the television. He's got a knife, but in the television, he's got a gun. The TV is talking to him. And he's trying to figure out like what's going on. The whole time it's being narrated by the demon who's possessed the TV. He's like, ah, look, look at you. He's like, you got a knife. I got a gun. I'm harder than you. Like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Then he gets too close to the television.

• 22:46Speaker 01

  The TV, the demon inside the TV pulls him into the TV, then spits his bones back out.

• 22:54Speaker 01

  And I'm telling you, this is like, it pulls him into the TV. And he's, and he's like in the TV trying to look around, trying to escape, and then his bones get spit back out. Terrifying scene. Death by Temptation is actually a really phenomenal.

• 23:09Bill Simmons?

  Tubi?

• 23:09Speaker 01

  Underrated. It might be on Tubi. Underrated, uh, uh, horror movie.

• 23:14Bill Simmons?

  That's a good one. Did you have a favorite one?

• 23:16Chris Ryan?

  No, I mean.

• 23:17Bill Simmons?

  An obsolete one?

• 23:17Chris Ryan?

  I kind of became, I came of age to some extent during the Saw Hostel area era. So that was just more like deracial. Like you're watching this happen over like minutes and minutes of like, oh my God.

• 23:30Bill Simmons?

  I will say, When a Stranger Calls, but she doesn't die. The first 15 minutes of that. As he's getting madder and madder on the phone is really scary. But then Silent Rage has a great one. The girl comes home and Ron Silver, I think is dead. And she, and the guy who won't die, the Syracuse, or you know this movie, right?

• 23:46Speaker 01

  I've never seen it.

• 23:48Bill Simmons?

  You would love this movie.

• 23:49Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 23:49Bill Simmons?

  Guy who won't die, basically is, it's like a Michael Myers ripoff. But she, she goes upstairs and hides in this little thing. And it's one of those, they're never patient enough with these. Where somebody's hiding and it's like, did he go away? Okay, it's good to come out. They take like a minute or two. And then she's fine. Like I think he's gone and opens the thing and he just comes in and whams her head against the wall. But it's really scary. It's good. I like, I like when they build the suspense up to it.

• 24:17Chris Ryan?

  I think probably like the scariest kill ever is, is still Pam in Texas getting thrown on the, the meat hook. That one.

• 24:25Bill Simmons?

  That's a really good one too.

• 24:27Chris Ryan?

  But that's like brutal. This is like art. Like you're watching like a guy like Wes Craven, wrote poetry, studied philosophy. It's just like really build, made porn and is building out like such an expressive, surreal world with these kills. And you're just like, this is just for this. And I can't believe they put so much effort into it.

• 24:47Bill Simmons?

  We have to ask Bangkok Craig because we force fed horror down his throat like broccoli.

• 24:52Chris Ryan?

  He's wearing a hard T-shirt today. It's amazing.

• 24:53Bill Simmons?

  Now he's like pro horror. What did, what was your favorite kill scene of everything you've seen?

• 24:58Speaker 03

  Favorite kill scene?

• 24:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, the, the one you're most impressed by.

• 25:05Speaker 03

  I think it's probably Meat Hook. I think the scariest thing is Old Bloodthirsty Grandpa in Texas Chainsaw Sucking on the Finger. That's scarier than any guilt to me.

• 25:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that really was.

• 25:15Bill Simmons?

  Wes Craven, Last House on the Left, 1972. Remake, pretty good with Tony Golden. The Hills Have Eyes, 77, Nightmare, 84, New Nightmare, 94, and Scream, 96. And he's on whatever, whatever shrine you want for horror movies. Yeah.

• 25:32Speaker 03

  Actually, no. What am I saying? It's the, the blood vortex in this movie is number one.

• 25:35Chris Ryan?

  Johnny Depp.

• 25:36Speaker 01

  Johnny Depp into the bed.

• 25:37Bill Simmons?

  The shining elevator in the waterbed?

• 25:41Speaker 03

  Nah, it's the blood vortex.

• 25:43Bill Simmons?

  Johnny Depp.

• 25:43Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:44Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 25:44Chris Ryan?

  It's also great because it's the inverse of Tina. You see everything that happens to Tina. And it's, it's just traumatizing, but with Depp, you're like, even when the cop goes into the room, you don't go into the room with him. You just see him be like, oh no, and walk out.

• 25:58Bill Simmons?

  Say, better get a mop.

• 25:59Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 25:59Speaker 01

  A brilliant part of this movie is the way Freddy is deployed. Because Freddy is such a scary character, right?

• 26:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 26:07Speaker 01

  They almost deploy him in like a Hannibal Lecter type way and.

• 26:12Bill Simmons?

  You know how many minutes he's in the movie?

• 26:13Speaker 01

  How many?

• 26:14Bill Simmons?

  Seven.

• 26:15Speaker 01

  See?

• 26:16Bill Simmons?

  Really?

• 26:16Speaker 01

  Same thing, right? It's the, it's, they let the conceit of the movie be the thing that terrify you. Falling asleep. What happens when you fall asleep? The nature of a dream. He does not have to be in every scene of the dream for the dream to be scary. By the end, it's Freddy on the poster and a bunch of the other kids that have to be killed. So it's Freddy, Freddy, Freddy all the time. It's almost scarier in a way in this movie because of the dread that's able to build.

• 26:43Bill Simmons?

  So Wes Craven wasn't exactly, uh, bankable in 1984, even though he'd had some success. So they had to, uh, it was a classic. We've done so many of these where they're like, we could barely have the money. At one point they run out of money. Nobody's getting paid. People are quitting.

• 27:00Chris Ryan?

  Investors are pulling out.

• 27:02Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. So they finally have to make this deal with the devil to get the royalties for it, but it all works out in the end.

• 27:08Chris Ryan?

  This trajectory with Toby Hooper.

• 27:11Bill Simmons?

  Another deal with the devil movie.

• 27:12Chris Ryan?

  But it's just also like a guy who was like walking by, uh, a night bear on Elm, uh, not, uh, Night of Living Dead screening one day and was like, there's a line down the block. Seems like making these kinds of movies is how I get into the movie business. Craven was not that different. He moved to New York. He was working as like an editor with Sean Cunningham, who goes on to direct the first Friday the 13th in 1980. But those guys were like, Craven wanted to make like Bergman and Fellini movies. He wanted to make like art films. And he basically gets pulled into this because it seems like horror is something that you can make fast and cheap and make money off of. So they get him to make Last House on the Left and he never expected anybody to see that movie.

• 27:51Bill Simmons?

  He made a porn after that movie.

• 27:53Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I know. I mean, like, he's like, I'm gonna make, I'm gonna make the worst, grossest thing I can possibly think of. No one's gonna see it. But it turns out to become a cult hit. And then because of that, he gets irradiated because it's like, you're the guy who fucking thought of that? Jesus, get out of my office. But it, so it takes him a little while and they get going. And then he winds up almost reluctantly becoming a master of horror.

• 28:14Speaker 01

  It, it's interesting when you go back and look at him tell the story of why he told this story.

• 28:21Chris Ryan?

  Oh my God. So interesting.

• 28:22Speaker 01

  So interesting, right?

• 28:23Bill Simmons?

  Oh, about like reading about the LA Times.

• 28:26Chris Ryan?

  The Lathan guys.

• 28:27Bill Simmons?

  These refugees who were so scarred by their war experiences.

• 28:30Speaker 01

  Like their trauma was actually killing them. They were tortured by going to sleep and tortured by their dreams. And some of them died in their sleep. The ethos.

• 28:40Bill Simmons?

  They called it Asian death syndrome. It was an actual, the actual name of it.

• 28:43Speaker 01

  So like, even though most horrors, horror movies are based around premise, like what happens if a slasher gets loose at a, at a, at a summer camp? What happens if on Halloween there's a killing spree? This one is like, it's undergirded by something deeper than that. It, sleep is the point where you're supposed to be the safest. Like even my dog comes and lays in front of the bed and protects me like while I'm sleeping. And if you are not safe then, then it just completely unravels your life and says so much about past trauma and just like the experience of being a human being if you can't sleep in peace.

• 29:21Bill Simmons?

  Your dog lies in front of the bed?

• 29:23Speaker 01

  My dog lies in front of the bed.

• 29:24Bill Simmons?

  Doesn't get on the bed?

• 29:26Speaker 01

  Sometimes it gets on the bed. Gets on the bed. I mean, most of the night it gets on the bed. I'm a definitely dog.

• 29:31Bill Simmons?

  Murph comes up about 2:30 in the morning and goes full length of the bed on my website.

• 29:36Speaker 01

  Length of the bed, like length of the bed.

• 29:37Bill Simmons?

  Like he's a human.

• 29:38Speaker 01

  And like also, I mean.

• 29:40Chris Ryan?

  Spoons are like.

• 29:42Bill Simmons?

  He's like, guys, move over.

• 29:43Speaker 01

  It's facts though. Like, and sometimes Bozeman will come in and he'll look and we'll be just like, yeah, come on. Well, jump on the bed. But he's sleeping there because you're at your most vulnerable when you're asleep.

• 29:53Bill Simmons?

  It relaxes the dog to be with sleeping people. When they're, when their people are sleeping, it relaxes their bodies and then they sleep.

• 29:59Speaker 01

  Right. So like, even though this movie was.

• 30:02Bill Simmons?

  No, no dogs in this movie.

• 30:04Chris Ryan?

  I think.

• 30:04Bill Simmons?

  Freddy would have fucked those dogs up.

• 30:05Chris Ryan?

  Dogs would have broken the movie. You can't have.

• 30:07Speaker 01

  Dogs in two. Dogs in two. I was thinking about, I was getting confused. Anyway, all I'm saying is that like, in that, he actually made a lot of deep kind of philosophical statements. He, he, he's, he's seriously getting into this. It's more than a slasher movie.

• 30:22Chris Ryan?

  There's generational violence. There's extrajudicial judicial system justice going on in this. There's like a pretty profound statement about the indifference of parents towards their kids.

• 30:33Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 30:33Chris Ryan?

  Throughout this movie with like all the people who are basically like, I'm not really like paying attention to what my kids are up to at any point.

• 30:40Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, at one point, the kid's 15. The mom just goes to Vegas with her Tina. Mom just goes to Vegas with her creepy boyfriend for two days.

• 30:48Chris Ryan?

  Rod Lane come over? Yeah.

• 30:49Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 30:50Speaker 01

  Yeah. And also the lies of the parents. The, the kids actually die, they actually die because of the lies and the secrets of their parents, which you know, is something that you have to contend with when you're an actual person. The things your parents didn't tell you.

• 31:03Bill Simmons?

  Do you think when your name's Wes Craven, you kind of have to direct horror movies?

• 31:06Chris Ryan?

  That's a good question.

• 31:07Bill Simmons?

  Like, what are you gonna do?

• 31:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:08Bill Simmons?

  Just gonna?

• 31:09Speaker 01

  Or.

• 31:10Bill Simmons?

  Have like a, like a WNBA podcast? Game six, 12:30. What are we doing?

• 31:17Speaker 01

  It's the Wes Craven WNBA.

• 31:19Bill Simmons?

  The Craven Cast.

• 31:20Chris Ryan?

  Go live after the Lakers. It's Yovon Buhan, Wes Craven.

• 31:26Bill Simmons?

  He also was, uh, Dreamweaver was a big one for him. So the little yacht rock. He loved Dreamweaver and thought that was like a good idea for a movie. And then, uh, he had some memory when he was a kid of an old man outside the window of his home that freaked him out. But he, he said, quote, Freddie stands for the worst of parenthood and adulthood. The dirty old man, nasty father and adult who wants children to die rather than prosper. He's the boogeyman. So there you go. Wes Craven.

• 31:57Bill Simmons?

  Johnny Depp is in this.

• 32:00Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 32:01Bill Simmons?

  Not only is Johnny Depp in this, we get an introducing Johnny Depp.

• 32:05Chris Ryan?

  We do.

• 32:05Bill Simmons?

  First IMDb credit.

• 32:07Chris Ryan?

  It's surprising that he didn't go with John Depp, much like Fred Krueger, you know?

• 32:10Bill Simmons?

  Oh, yeah. John or Jack Depp?

• 32:12Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 32:14Bill Simmons?

  So for years I knew him from this and 21 Jump Street. But he was very likable in this movie. And then he was in 21 Jump Street. It was like, oh, the kid from Nightmare on Elm Street. It's great. Bad things are working out for him. And then all of a sudden, the nineties, he became Johnny Depp. Out of nowhere.

• 32:30Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 32:30Bill Simmons?

  But he's good in this movie.

• 32:31Chris Ryan?

  Sure. One of the, like, it's one of the best parts of eighties horror movies is going back and being like, oh, Patricia Arquette, there she is in Dream Warriors.

• 32:38Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 32:39Speaker 01

  Kevin Bacon.

• 32:39Chris Ryan?

  Paul Rudd in Halloween. You know, like, yeah.

• 32:42Bill Simmons?

  Amanda Weiss.

• 32:44Chris Ryan?

  Awesome in this movie.

• 32:46Bill Simmons?

  Is it this or Better Off Dead for you?

• 32:48Chris Ryan?

  She's had, I mean, I think I have this in a later category, but what an incredible eighties. She had Fast Times, this, Better Off Dead, and Silverado. She was in.

• 32:58Speaker 01

  Silverado, one of my favorites, man.

• 33:01Bill Simmons?

  Better Off Dead, she's the bitchy version of Tina.

• 33:04Chris Ryan?

  She's Beth. Yeah.

• 33:06Bill Simmons?

  Renee Blakely, Blakely as Drunk MILF Mom.

• 33:11Bill Simmons?

  Nominated for an Oscar, Nashville, nineteen seventy-five.

• 33:16Chris Ryan?

  It's Marge, Marge Thompson.

• 33:17Bill Simmons?

  Did a Love Boat Vegas tour on IMDb. If you go on IMDb, she's Love Boat, Fantasy Island, Vegas, all that stuff. And then shows up here and can we just give her the Eddie Falco and Copland Award now? And she lights that dart up with the giant bottle of vodka CR. Hey, baby.

• 33:38Bill Simmons?

  Looks like this family needs, needs a dad. What are you doing later?

• 33:43Chris Ryan?

  Trying to surreptitiously be a raging alcoholic, but drinks straight from the bottle. It's like she's not mixing it in orange juice. She's not trying to hide it in a water bottle. It's just like,

• 33:53Bill Simmons?

  She's doing the Vin Diesel drink too.

• 33:54Chris Ryan?

  Bottle of Smirnoff that I take everywhere in the house.

• 33:57Speaker 03

  It's like an old Jack Sparrow pirate bottle of alcohol that she carries around.

• 34:00Bill Simmons?

  It's incredible. It's so big. It's like, if you bought that now, it's a hundred and ten dollars. So much vodka. She's just carrying it around. I enjoyed her. And then, uh, Heather Langenkamp.

• 34:12Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 34:13Bill Simmons?

  Who she comes back in, in three. So really interesting character.

• 34:18Chris Ryan?

  I think in New Nightmare, right?

• 34:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, New Nightmare, yeah.

• 34:20Bill Simmons?

  So atypical, cause not the stupid horror movie character or not the damsel in distress like Jamie Lee in Halloween. Like, actually really smart, understands what's going on. Nobody believes her. Comes up with ways to prove she's right. Um, she's the only one who really gets it the entire movie. And then she, we think survives.

• 34:40Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, she survives because she comes back in three. She's been on hitting the scene.

• 34:43Bill Simmons?

  But I don't know that when I see the end of one.

• 34:45Speaker 01

  I mean, well, yeah. So, you know, but in, I guess at the end of the movie, you didn't know.

• 34:50Speaker 01

  Very interesting art because the movie starts with Tina.

• 34:53Chris Ryan?

  That pulls the psycho.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  It pulls the psycho, like the Hitchcocking thing. You think that Tina's gonna be, but over the course of the movie, she actually has an actual arc.

• 35:02Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 35:03Speaker 01

  A, a real arc. The movie is about Freddie and about the nightmares, but then at a certain point in this movie, this becomes a descent into her madness.

• 35:14Bill Simmons?

  SV, combined with nightmares.

• 35:16Speaker 01

  Trying to figure out like what's going on with her, her watching her friends die and deal with that trauma. And then really figuring out she's gonna do something now, the Home Alone portion of this movie being what it is.

• 35:27Chris Ryan?

  When she goes MacGyver?

• 35:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:28Chris Ryan?

  She gets that giant, giant rubber hammer.

• 35:32Speaker 01

  The Home Alone portion of this movie being what it is.

• 35:34Chris Ryan?

  It's Freddie in the solar plexus. He's like, ah!

• 35:37Speaker 01

  Ah! Ow! Still though, like she is a fully formed and like kind of realized character.

• 35:43Chris Ryan?

  I also really like the fact that she kind of gets more and more insolent and rude as the movie goes on and she hasn't slept. And she's just like, what's with the bars, mother? You know, like, it's like, kind of like a little bit of a little shit. But like, is, you would make sense if you were a teenager who didn't sleep for four or five days.

• 36:00Speaker 01

  She's fucking pissed.

• 36:02Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 36:02Speaker 01

  Hold on. She didn't do nothing. Her parents decide to execute an extrajudicial killing.

• 36:08Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 36:09Speaker 01

  On someone they, they thought was a pariah in the neighborhood.

• 36:12Chris Ryan?

  To be fair, it does sound like Fred was guilty.

• 36:14Speaker 01

  It sounded like Fred was guilty. At the same time, hold on for my hot take, okay?

• 36:22Chris Ryan?

  Are you saying if the knife glove doesn't fit?

• 36:26Speaker 01

  You can't do that, guys. Okay?

• 36:28Bill Simmons?

  I will say, I think the hot takes for this movie were, might break the record, especially being live. Cause I have a hot one too.

• 36:34Speaker 01

  You can't, you can't do that. So now she's gotta deal with this. She can't go to sleep. Her friends are dead. Johnny Depp is still trying to get pussy after a dream demon is around. She can't be left.

• 36:47Chris Ryan?

  The funniest thing is that Depp never suffers from this until the very end. Yeah.

• 36:51Speaker 01

  And so at the end, she's just completely had it with her mom and her dad. And she takes it upon herself to call the ISO and do it all on her own.

• 37:01Bill Simmons?

  Well, with some help from the, the guy who works for her dad. Help get my dad. He's like, what's going on?

• 37:07Chris Ryan?

  This seems bad.

• 37:08Bill Simmons?

  What?

• 37:08Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 37:10Bill Simmons?

  What's going on with you? Robert Englund, playing Freddie, pretty, uh, by all accounts, like a decent actor, did some Shakespeare.

• 37:21Bill Simmons?

  Really has dined on this movie for the last forty-two years, I think.

• 37:24Chris Ryan?

  Honestly, that's what I.

• 37:25Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Available for any convention, any oral history. The Ringer did an oral history of this movie, by the way. But there's been a bunch of them and, uh, loves talking about it. But basically Wes Craven did not want to hire the typical giant stunt man, wanted an actual actor. And I think that was a great move.

• 37:41Chris Ryan?

  They actually talked to Kane Hodder about doing it, who winds up, or Hodder plays, winds up playing Jason in future Friday the thirteenth.

• 37:47Bill Simmons?

  They go head to head eventually. Dan likes that movie.

• 37:50Speaker 01

  Love it.

• 37:51Bill Simmons?

  Freddie versus Jason.

• 37:52Speaker 01

  Freddie versus Jason. Ever since they teased it, when the Freddie hand pulls Jason's mask into the dirt, I was waiting for that movie and it did not disappoint.

• 38:01Bill Simmons?

  Disappointing Myers wasn't involved. It should have been a murder triangle.

• 38:05Chris Ryan?

  I have a question about that later.

• 38:07Bill Simmons?

  New Line was the company that, uh, jumped in and it was the, they were normally a distributor. This is the first time they actually got behind a movie. Now called The House That Freddie Built. They had a nice little run. Made a lot of movies that I like. Franchise films.

• 38:21Chris Ryan?

  Like the Lord of the Rings films.

• 38:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:22Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Heard that's good.

• 38:27Bill Simmons?

  Nine movies total. Can you name them all in a row right now?

• 38:30Speaker 01

  Okay. Uh, one, two.

• 38:33Chris Ryan?

  What's two?

• 38:34Bill Simmons?

  What's two? You got good titles.

• 38:35Speaker 01

  Two, uh, Freddie's Revenge.

• 38:36Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 38:36Bill Simmons?

  Yep.

• 38:37Speaker 01

  Three is Dream Warriors.

• 38:38Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 38:39Speaker 01

  Four is Dream Master.

• 38:41Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 38:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 38:42Speaker 01

  Five is Dream Child. Six is Freddie's Dead, The Final Nightmare. Seven would be, uh, Wes Craven's New Nightmare. Eight would be Freddie versus Jason. Nine is the remake.

• 38:58Bill Simmons?

  Wow.

• 38:58Chris Ryan?

  Jackie Earl Haley.

• 38:59Bill Simmons?

  Jackie Earl Haley.

• 39:00Chris Ryan?

  Can I just say, where to fucking go?

• 39:02Bill Simmons?

  That's really good. That was almost as impressive when Pellicero on my podcast did all eighteen, what was it Vikings quarterbacks?

• 39:11Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. Or Tate doing all the first ladies of rap.

• 39:13Speaker 01

  Ah, Tate, man. Raise the roof for Tate, guys.

• 39:17Bill Simmons?

  So that was the franchise.

• 39:18Speaker 01

  Guys, can we respect Tate? Raise the roof?

• 39:21Chris Ryan?

  With the Freddie hand. Yeah.

• 39:24Speaker 01

  That's the best you got.

• 39:26Bill Simmons?

  Did we have too many nightmares or not enough here? Nine. Should the number have been like eighteen? Or should we have been like four?

• 39:34Chris Ryan?

  Gets pretty goofy. You know, I mean, like they all do. I think actually, I mean,

• 39:41Chris Ryan?

  I personally like Dream Warriors a lot, but I still think unlike Friday the thirteenth, where my favorites are kind of the, the Tommy three in the middle, this is by far my favorite nightmare.

• 39:53Bill Simmons?

  I think three is pretty good. I think New Nightmare is my other one that I liked. And you can throw the rest of them away.

• 39:58Speaker 01

  New Nightmare is so novel.

• 40:01Bill Simmons?

  It's good.

• 40:01Speaker 01

  Such a swing.

• 40:02Chris Ryan?

  Is that before or after Scream starts?

• 40:03Bill Simmons?

  Before.

• 40:04Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. So it's like basically a trial and.

• 40:06Bill Simmons?

  It's good. It came out in ninety-four. There's just too many good movies in ninety-four.

• 40:09Speaker 01

  I will say that like, obviously Dream Warriors is like my favorite. It's like, you know, around the time I'm really like getting into these movies. Like X-Men movie. It's like, legitimately, it's a comparable movie. But I do have a special place in my heart for Freddie's Dead, The Final Nightmare. Because that is a weird, off kilter movie. By this time, there are no children left in Springwood. There are no kids left in Springwood. Because Freddie has like run out of villains to kill. He's killed everyone. He's too powerful. He's killed everyone. There's a weird Roseanne Barr cameo in, in the movie because when Freddie's daughter,

• 40:47Speaker 01

  like brings kids to like, uh, Springwood, they're so happy to see children that they're all over their kids and stuff. There's weird powers and rules about where Freddie can go and how, the fact that he needs.

• 40:59Bill Simmons?

  Freddie's got a half brother.

• 41:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's just, but like all of that stuff in the movie, there's a lot in it, but it's still so eerie in the film. And then at the end with his daughter killing him, I still have like a special place in my heart for that.

• 41:11Chris Ryan?

  Do you have a favorite all time kill in the franchise outside of the first movie?

• 41:14Speaker 01

  The roach.

• 41:15Bill Simmons?

  So. Roach is a famous one.

• 41:17Speaker 01

  Girls afraid of roaches. Freddie, oh, the roach. And by far the most disturbing one is The Puppet.

• 41:26Chris Ryan?

  The Puppet in three is fucked up.

• 41:27Speaker 01

  The Puppet is three.

• 41:28Chris Ryan?

  Also in three is when, uh, Taryn gets heroin, hyperdermal to death. For, in her, and her, uh, needle marks have eyes and are like blinking at her and stuff like it. It, that's, that creeps me out.

• 41:43Bill Simmons?

  One point one million dollar budget made fifty-seven point one million dollars this movie.

• 41:47Chris Ryan?

  That's how you do it.

• 41:48Speaker 01

  That's nuts.

• 41:49Bill Simmons?

  Nobody reviewed it other than there was a Washington Post review where the guy went nuts.

• 41:53Chris Ryan?

  It was very positive.

• 41:53Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Paul Attanzio.

• 41:55Chris Ryan?

  Attanzio.

• 41:56Bill Simmons?

  Attanzio.

• 41:56Chris Ryan?

  That's the guy who made fucking homicide life on the street.

• 41:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 42:00Chris Ryan?

  And wrote Quiz Show.

• 42:01Bill Simmons?

  But nobody took this movie seriously. There was also a lot of good 1984 movies.

• 42:04Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 42:05Bill Simmons?

  This episode is brought to you by Panda Express. Telling someone you love them, it isn't always easy, but showing them through food, sometimes that's better than words, especially when that food's what cooked at Panda Express, a Joe House favorite. Pick from delicious classics like orange chicken, honey walnut shrimp, kung pao chicken and black pepper sirloin steak. Perfect for when you're watching the team you love or eating with the person you love. Have you eaten yet? Click or tap the banner to order or visit a Panda Express near you.

• 42:37Speaker 04

  Shaq here. What's it like to buy a car from Carvana 100% online and get it delivered to your door? Let me tell you, your car is here, Mr. Shaq. Thank you, Mr. Carvana guy. Can't wait to take it for a spin. Only the best for you, Mr. Shaq. Hey, have you always been so big, tall and handsome? Not always. I was 6'10" once. Seven days to love it or return it, Mr. Shaq. Not that I would. You never do. No, I never do. So buy your car today on Carvana. Delivery fees may apply. See our seven day return policy at carvana.com.

• 43:08Bill Simmons?

  We don't have to take a break, right? Could I do most rewatch or most watchable scene? All right. Opening nightmare from Tina.

• 43:13Chris Ryan?

  Of course.

• 43:15Bill Simmons?

  Tina leaves the house, runs into Freddie. This is God.

• 43:20Chris Ryan?

  First, the, the rock's at the window and you're like, what's going on? I was like, is somebody else coming over to see Tina? And then the rock gets the one that gets like stuck in the window. And so she knows that there's something weird going on, like there's, is she in a dream now?

• 43:35Bill Simmons?

  It ends with the old bloody ceiling dance, which has never really gone well for anybody. Anytime somebody's on a ceiling in a movie, you know, they're not making it. I would give this the okay motherfucker award for the exact moment when this movie went up a notch.

• 43:47Speaker 01

  Without a doubt, yeah.

• 43:49Bill Simmons?

  This is, this is like 12 minutes in.

• 43:51Chris Ryan?

  Also took them six weeks to build this set, I think.

• 43:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 43:54Chris Ryan?

  Something like that. It spun around and inverted. Everybody was like getting sick and stepping out or like, you know, Amanda Wiss was like, this was like legitimately terrifying to film. And you could tell, like, there is like an element of it that feels real while you're watching.

• 44:09Bill Simmons?

  Don't you miss the days we used to be able to make things in this country?

• 44:11Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 44:12Bill Simmons?

  Like rooms that were inverted, upside down?

• 44:14Speaker 01

  I, I don't want to go too deep into the in my day shit, but when you watch the documentary on the making of this film and you look at some of the stuff that they had to pull out.

• 44:23Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 44:23Speaker 01

  To get scenes in the movie, like how they had to build the bathtub over an actual water tank.

• 44:28Bill Simmons?

  Over a pool.

• 44:29Speaker 01

  Right. Like this really forced them to do some pretty cutting edge filmmaking.

• 44:34Bill Simmons?

  It almost killed cast members.

• 44:35Chris Ryan?

  But there's stuff that like Chris Nolan does now that people are like, I can't believe this.

• 44:39Speaker 01

  But, but.

• 44:40Chris Ryan?

  They were kind of doing that in the Nightmare on Elm Street.

• 44:42Speaker 01

  But he's continuing on that tradition. Whereas sometimes the shit we look at and it doesn't look very good. That's not to take away from any VSF artists or anybody out there that's making shit like that that's generated on the computer. But the reason why you don't feel it is because it's not tactile.

• 44:58Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 44:58Speaker 01

  It's not, your eyes are looking at something that you know is rendered by graphics. Meanwhile, this stuff, you're like, how'd they do it? Like, how'd they get him through the bars when Donna's in jail? All, all of that type of stuff. They had to figure out ways to make that.

• 45:10Bill Simmons?

  The blood come out of the bed.

• 45:11Chris Ryan?

  Also, like the, think about the other slashers that we've done over the last couple of weeks. Either they're trying to avoid the, the X rating or like, maybe they don't have the money to afford the, the sort of makeup that you need. This movie, they figured out some way to make this opening kill the bloodiest, scariest thing so that the rest of the movie, you know, those are the consequences of it. Like you are terrified something like that is going to happen to another kid. It's not as dark when it happens to Rod. I mean, it's sad, but it's not like, oh my God, like his head came off or something. But what happens to Tina is traumatizing to the viewers. It's.

• 45:48Speaker 01

  And from a script standpoint, there are little things to where she's talking about this dream and this guy that she saw. Then somebody else is like, yeah, I had that same dream.

• 45:58Bill Simmons?

  The guy with the knife hands?

• 46:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. And you, and there's like, there's a harbinger of things to come. So by the time it happens to her, it's like the fulfillment of this perverse wish for the audience.

• 46:11Bill Simmons?

  And you can't Google it like now.

• 46:13Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 46:14Bill Simmons?

  You'd be like, Google red, green sweater killer.

• 46:17Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 46:17Bill Simmons?

  Had you seen this movie before or no, right?

• 46:19Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 46:20Bill Simmons?

  And you didn't watch it with Liz?

• 46:21Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 46:21Bill Simmons?

  I'm guessing.

• 46:22Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 46:22Bill Simmons?

  The Tina scene, what was your reaction as it was happening?

• 46:25Speaker 03

  Like so impressive and inventive and so cool to see. Like, I almost feel like when you're watching a movie like this, like a low budget movie that pulled off this great accomplishment. I feel like you feel like you're a part of the team making the movie. You're like, you're like happy for the movie that it's able to do it, if that makes sense. You know what I mean? You're like, wow, this is awesome. Like this is, the relationship is like, I give you my money and you guys can do stuff like this. And when you watch that scene, you're like, this is so cool that they were able to do this. So while being scared, I was also like, impressed and like happy that they were able to pull it off.

• 46:56Chris Ryan?

  50 years later, we're still like, I can't believe Jaws built a shark.

• 47:00Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 47:00Chris Ryan?

  You know, like it, it still looks better than every shark movie since then. You're just like, you guys did it.

• 47:05Bill Simmons?

  They got Glenn's room upside down.

• 47:07Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 47:07Bill Simmons?

  With the, with the bed of blood. They have all the stuff on the walls upside down, inverted that they had to just painstakingly put one by one.

• 47:15Chris Ryan?

  True sickos working on it. They were like, how much like water should we add to the fake blood? How much red dye, whatever? Like, it wasn't like, well, we'll just fix it in post. We'll just shade it differently in color correction. It was like, we gotta get this right. And it was.

• 47:27Bill Simmons?

  They almost electrocuted a cast member, fake blood.

• 47:31Chris Ryan?

  With fake blood?

• 47:32Bill Simmons?

  In Glenn's room, yeah. When they turned it around, they didn't realize some of it was going to get in the floor. So those, those kinds of things you do. Anyway, incredible scene. That's probably my winner, but we also have the classroom scene.

• 47:43Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 47:44Bill Simmons?

  Another homage to Halloween.

• 47:45Chris Ryan?

  In the body bag.

• 47:46Bill Simmons?

  All the classroom scenes with the shot with the window, they love doing it. And then we get the Nancy no running in the hallway and then she's like.

• 47:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, Freddie.

• 47:55Bill Simmons?

  And then we get the, uh, this is when we realized Freddie has green blood and worms in his chest. Yeah.

• 48:03Speaker 01

  Whatever he can do to gross you out. You know what's interesting about the classroom?

• 48:06Bill Simmons?

  That one worked.

• 48:07Speaker 01

  The classroom scene, I think, is the first time they do the classic Elm Street knot. To where we're all sitting around and you do like this. And you think that the character has actually woke back, but they're actually asleep. They're in the dream. So I've talked about this before to where you're now and you look and the teacher's still teaching and all of a sudden the teacher is writing. And the teacher is going, okay, in 1738, this happened. And all of, the teacher starts writing, I'm going to kill you bitch. And they turn around and it's freight. And like, that gives you a sense of, you don't know whether or not they're asleep or awake. You understand that feeling because it's familiar that we, we've all had that, but it's terrifying for the people that you're watching on TV.

• 48:50Bill Simmons?

  Really good scene.

• 48:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:51Bill Simmons?

  Bathtub scene.

• 48:52Chris Ryan?

  Yep.

• 48:52Bill Simmons?

  CR's favorite scene. Freddie's hand going through the legs.

• 48:56Speaker 01

  You said that.

• 48:57Chris Ryan?

  It is funny that she's like so serious about taking a bath. It's like, that, that, that seems like. She has a bath pillow. She's like really into it.

• 49:05Bill Simmons?

  I haven't slept in three days. I'll take a bath. What could go wrong?

• 49:09Chris Ryan?

  Also, don't worry about me, mom. I'm going to lock the door.

• 49:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I'll lock the door so you can't get in. Freddie's hand coming up through her legs is a great, oh no.

• 49:16Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 49:16Speaker 01

  Then it comes right back down when she wakes up. Just how dangerous sleep is for her.

• 49:21Bill Simmons?

  I didn't see this one in the theater, I'm pretty sure. I think this was TV only for me, but that would have been a great theater scene.

• 49:27Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 49:27Bill Simmons?

  Crowd like, ah, looking for Rod.

• 49:33Bill Simmons?

  The marshmallow stairs, that whole section.

• 49:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:36Bill Simmons?

  When she runs back in, the stairs are apparently made out of cream of mushroom soup, uh, soup and oatmeal. This is when Freddie jumps through the mirror.

• 49:44Speaker 01

  Craven didn't want that.

• 49:45Bill Simmons?

  Didn't want what?

• 49:46Chris Ryan?

  That was Bob Shay.

• 49:46Speaker 01

  That was Bob Shay's idea. Craven didn't want.

• 49:48Bill Simmons?

  Through the mirror.

• 49:49Speaker 01

  No, Craven didn't want the steps. Bob Shay wanted that.

• 49:52Bill Simmons?

  I like the steps. And then Glenn falls asleep on us. We have that. We have Rod hanging himself.

• 49:58Chris Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 50:00Bill Simmons?

  I think this is exactly how Epstein did it. Freddie came right in.

• 50:04Chris Ryan?

  You didn't rely, Fred.

• 50:06Bill Simmons?

  Moms.

• 50:11Bill Simmons?

  I thought I'd get a better laugh for the Epstein joke. I thought we're all selling each other here in the wrestling ring.

• 50:19Speaker 01

  That was the sale. On his face.

• 50:22Bill Simmons?

  Didn't realize Sierra wasn't selling my powerbomb.

• 50:28Bill Simmons?

  Moms, Fred Krueger story. Milk bomb. Oh yeah, I was meaning to tell you. We had this guy.

• 50:35Speaker 01

  Murdered the fucking guy.

• 50:36Bill Simmons?

  Killed 20 kids in the neighborhood.

• 50:37Chris Ryan?

  I got a glove up in this.

• 50:38Bill Simmons?

  She'll have it in the basement. I didn't tell you about this?

• 50:41Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 50:42Bill Simmons?

  I didn't tell you about this in the basement?

• 50:43Speaker 01

  Right.

• 50:44Bill Simmons?

  Glenn's bed turns into the shining elevator.

• 50:49Bill Simmons?

  I wrote down, this is the worst thing that ever happened to Johnny Depp in a bed, except the time Amber, Amber Heard allegedly shit in his bed.

• 50:56Speaker 01

  Did a bit.

• 50:57Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it was one A, one B.

• 50:58Speaker 01

  TMZ classic.

• 51:01Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 51:03Bill Simmons?

  The final showdown.

• 51:04Chris Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 51:04Bill Simmons?

  The Home Alone. Is this just a dream? I take back every ounce of energy I gave you. And then the second ending. What do you got for most rewatchable?

• 51:12Chris Ryan?

  It's by far Tina's death.

• 51:13Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 51:13Chris Ryan?

  It's one of the great accomplishments.

• 51:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, we could like drone on, but it's that's an easy one.

• 51:18Bill Simmons?

  I also like the popcorn setup of, ah, they're just some kids playing some pranks. The radio and lying to their mom and making popcorn and. Oh, Rod's gonna come over and this will be like a classic eighties.

• 51:31Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 51:31Bill Simmons?

  We want to see a sex scene scene.

• 51:33Speaker 01

  This is not a most rewatchable scene, but you know, I did notice. Freddie calling out to Tina after, uh, Dawn finished tanning that ass up is.

• 51:44Chris Ryan?

  Rod?

• 51:44Speaker 01

  Rod, excuse me, like Rod, my bad. Wasn't like that. After Rod finished doing his thing is legitimately. Like the, is the scream scene sort of like, kind of like an homage to that? Just like, like a. Short hair, he's talking to her.

• 51:58Chris Ryan?

  I thought it was probably more for Janet Leigh and Psycho.

• 52:01Speaker 01

  I'm sure, yeah.

• 52:02Chris Ryan?

  It's like an homage.

• 52:02Speaker 01

  But it feels like that scene kind of mirrors each other.

• 52:05Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 52:06Speaker 01

  This kind of feels like the same thing.

• 52:07Bill Simmons?

  The homage in Scream was Skeet Ulrich basically being the Johnny Depp experience.

• 52:12Chris Ryan?

  Right.

• 52:12Bill Simmons?

  I mean, to the point that.

• 52:13Speaker 01

  Poor man's Johnny Depp.

• 52:15Bill Simmons?

  Total like karaoke.

• 52:16Speaker 01

  Remember Chain Reaction?

• 52:17Bill Simmons?

  Karaoke Johnny Depp.

• 52:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 52:20Bill Simmons?

  What's the best nineteen eighty-four thing about this movie?

• 52:22Chris Ryan?

  I got so many.

• 52:24Bill Simmons?

  I have six.

• 52:25Speaker 01

  I have one.

• 52:25Chris Ryan?

  I've, I've.

• 52:26Bill Simmons?

  So Ben, you do yours first.

• 52:28Speaker 01

  I have two. Number one, the gigantic boombox with the tape player. Where he's playing the sound effects.

• 52:33Bill Simmons?

  That thing had a four year run and it was glorious.

• 52:35Speaker 01

  Right.

• 52:36Bill Simmons?

  Everyone had it.

• 52:36Speaker 01

  Everyone had it. You had to have it blasting your music everywhere. Also.

• 52:42Speaker 01

  Throwing pebbles up to somebody's window to like wake them up. Or going in somebody's window, period, that lived across the street. Like you getting the police called on you on somebody's ring camera right now. Like it's totally.

• 52:56Bill Simmons?

  Well, now we have texting. If you did that, you'd be a sociopath.

• 52:59Speaker 01

  Right. You just.

• 53:00Chris Ryan?

  Do you, did you ever have something where like a kid could climb up like a trellis in one of your houses that you've had?

• 53:07Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 53:07Speaker 01

  No.

• 53:07Chris Ryan?

  Did you, when you go to real estate agents or you're like, no trellis?

• 53:11Bill Simmons?

  I don't like the trellis idea at all.

• 53:15Bill Simmons?

  Pretty rough. And especially like if I had. A fifteen year old daughter with Johnny Depp across the street.

• 53:21Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 53:21Bill Simmons?

  That trellis is coming down.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's tough.

• 53:23Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, you're not getting.

• 53:23Chris Ryan?

  And you're digging a moat.

• 53:25Bill Simmons?

  What'd you have for eighty-four?

• 53:27Chris Ryan?

  Glenn's crop top football jersey, uh, Glenn's white polo under the Nike tennis or golf vest.

• 53:33Bill Simmons?

  I don't know what happened to the dudes wearing a crop top jersey.

• 53:36Chris Ryan?

  But it's not like generic number ten.

• 53:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's tough.

• 53:40Bill Simmons?

  Like if Van wore that for the pod today, I would have been like, are you all right?

• 53:43Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 53:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's fucked up.

• 53:44Chris Ryan?

  Basically, everything about Rod Lane, like the idea of there being like a town. Miss it like miss, like no, no good nick who's like. I have, I wear a jean jacket with no shirt on underneath is like my look. And it's like, well, he's a musician.

• 53:59Bill Simmons?

  I got your name on my joint.

• 54:01Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. Uh, and then also just like all of the latchkey kid stuff with like Glenn's mom not knowing where he is. All the back talk the kids do to the parents. The parents going out on dates or not being around ever or going to Vegas or whatever. It's, it's just like. A lot of like, could it, could have been a little bit more hands on there.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  Can I ask you a question about his crop top? Is his crop top, uh, Drake major? Is that Patriots crop? It looks like it's number ten, right?

• 54:30Bill Simmons?

  Fourth in EPA right now.

• 54:31Speaker 01

  I'm just saying.

• 54:32Bill Simmons?

  Be careful.

• 54:33Speaker 01

  It looks like right there.

• 54:34Chris Ryan?

  Be careful who?

• 54:35Bill Simmons?

  Just be careful with your Drake Ma slander.

• 54:37Speaker 01

  I'm just saying.

• 54:39Bill Simmons?

  I have a for most eighty-four thing. I think the winner is young Johnny Depp. I don't know how anything else wins, but the clothes that all the kids have. Glenn has a young U2 poster.

• 54:50Chris Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 54:51Bill Simmons?

  I don't know if you saw it.

• 54:52Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 54:52Bill Simmons?

  Early eighties U2. Nancy has a poster of the police.

• 54:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 54:59Bill Simmons?

  Kind of buried in the side. Rotary phones. Uh, all the clothes, obviously. And then, uh, sleeping with a crucifix over your bed. I don't think people are doing that as much anymore.

• 55:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:10Bill Simmons?

  Multiple kids have the crucifix right above the bed, which is, I know they're doing it for the movie. The Floyd.

• 55:16Chris Ryan?

  And next time my wife goes away, when she comes back, I'm gonna have a big crucifix over the bed.

• 55:20Speaker 01

  Please tape it. Just see what she says when she goes. So please tape it.

• 55:25Bill Simmons?

  Floyd Gondally butter on my ass, lollipops in my mouth award for something I just enjoy. I'll start. Alcoholic eighties movie parents.

• 55:32Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 55:33Bill Simmons?

  Just getting after it.

• 55:35Speaker 01

  Right.

• 55:35Bill Simmons?

  It's like, what, what's mom do tonight? Just pounding a ninety dollar bottle of. Like this, not, no ice, no, no glass.

• 55:43Chris Ryan?

  Nah, she's going full.

• 55:44Bill Simmons?

  Chaser. Just fucking chugging it like it's a soda.

• 55:48Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. And like, everybody knows it. She's like, you're loaded, mom, you know, like.

• 55:53Bill Simmons?

  Come in, he come home, she's like, ah, I locked the door.

• 55:56Chris Ryan?

  I love when she pulls a bottle out of the closet, like the towels, she just has one hidden in there.

• 56:00Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 56:00Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 56:01Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, the, the kid breaks the bottle at one point and mom's like, I'm fine. I got another one in the linen closet. Same size.

• 56:07Chris Ryan?

  You got the guy in backup?

• 56:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Always enjoy it. In the eighties, we really went for it with, uh, the drinking parents. I don't know why.

• 56:13Speaker 01

  All the parents were bad for the whole decade.

• 56:15Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, just boozing.

• 56:17Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 56:18Bill Simmons?

  What'd you have?

• 56:19Speaker 01

  Uh, young white commandos. I, can you guys, if you guys had to, when, could you like rig a whole room with booby traps? Like she rigs a whole room with booby traps.

• 56:30Chris Ryan?

  No, she rigs one book and she's like an expert.

• 56:32Speaker 01

  There's several times.

• 56:33Bill Simmons?

  I almost had this as my, as my.

• 56:35Speaker 01

  There's several times in the eighties into it where like kids can set up booby traps, like complicated ones. Using household items, like legitimately like Denzel in the Equalizer.

• 56:47Bill Simmons?

  It would have taken me like twelve to eighteen hours to make two of those things. Cause she has the little clips.

• 56:53Speaker 01

  The clips.

• 56:54Bill Simmons?

  She's got, got long string. That would take me three hours to find the string.

• 56:58Chris Ryan?

  Like, yeah, man.

• 56:59Speaker 01

  Nuts. But it happens.

• 57:00Bill Simmons?

  I feel like Craig could do all this stuff.

• 57:02Chris Ryan?

  You know, back then kids used to play with real things, Legos and things like that. You know, they actually had to be inventive. And you weren't as distracted by TikTok. So you would actually read the book about setting up a survival dungeon.

• 57:12Bill Simmons?

  The hammer thing was, that was a lot of time, a lot of time. Then she has the tripwire like she's in fucking Vietnam.

• 57:17Chris Ryan?

  And how do we know that Marge isn't gonna like walk into all that stuff one night looking for her drinks? Yeah.

• 57:23Bill Simmons?

  What'd you have?

• 57:23Chris Ryan?

  Uh, I had Glenn falling asleep with a giant television in his lap because I'm just mad I never tried it when I was a kid. You know, I could have stayed up watching Andrew Tony highlights. And instead I was like, oh, I guess done watching TV. Glenn with the big headphones on and a television in his lap.

• 57:42Speaker 03

  That's what aged the best.

• 57:43Chris Ryan?

  Is hilarious.

• 57:44Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 57:45Bill Simmons?

  What's aged the best? Yeah, seriously. Well, I, those TVs, they don't make those anymore.

• 57:51Chris Ryan?

  No, but that's like twenty-five pounds.

• 57:52Bill Simmons?

  Square TVs. Can you even buy those anymore?

• 57:54Speaker 01

  I don't think so.

• 57:56Chris Ryan?

  But that, you also wouldn't be able to handle that. Like that would have been like having a microwave oven on your television.

• 58:01Speaker 03

  Him like multitasking. He's like, I'm listening to music. I got the TV on my lap. I'm like, hell yeah, this guy's ready for the twenty-fourth.

• 58:07Bill Simmons?

  He would have been in our generation.

• 58:09Chris Ryan?

  Could be a great podcaster.

• 58:11Bill Simmons?

  What's aged the best? The, the whole gimmick of the parents are away or oblivious. We just got fifteen years out of this and then finally had to stop doing that. John Saxon plays the dad, just famous character actor. He's that, like a beyond that guy, but he would be in every.

• 58:29Chris Ryan?

  It was like a get to get him, right?

• 58:31Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I think he, he was relatively famous. Incredible toupee though.

• 58:34Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 58:34Speaker 01

  Right.

• 58:35Bill Simmons?

  Like you, like really just a co-sell like rug.

• 58:37Chris Ryan?

  Exactly the same.

• 58:38Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, every time.

• 58:39Chris Ryan?

  Six years later in Dream Warriors.

• 58:40Bill Simmons?

  There's no part, it's just coming across. I like staring at it.

• 58:42Speaker 01

  Exactly the same in Dream Warriors.

• 58:44Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. So. I have two more. I, I'll save mine too. What do you have?

• 58:50Speaker 01

  Um, so just Freddie himself. Like this is the beginning of an icon, just an iconic character, a deep, deep, deep lore, super deep lore. The voice is still there. It's not quite. Like in the Freddie realm and it gets to later on movies, but Freddie himself has aged impeccably.

• 59:08Bill Simmons?

  I had as well for him with the, the face, the outfit, Halloween costumes.

• 59:13Chris Ryan?

  All of that.

• 59:14Bill Simmons?

  All of that has aged really nicely.

• 59:15Speaker 01

  You know what it is when you see the claw, when you see the sweater.

• 59:18Chris Ryan?

  And you know what? Just to go piggyback off of this, now that I'm thinking about it, a lot of our, our favorite Rushmore killers. I think technology would do away with them. You know, like you would be like, Mike, Jason would all be kind of got by like.

• 59:32Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:32Chris Ryan?

  Technology. Freddie? I don't know. Like it would be kind of amazing if you were doing like, I'm gonna fall asleep on a live stream and if Freddie comes for me, somebody has to help me like.

• 59:41Bill Simmons?

  That was my other idea for this.

• 59:42Chris Ryan?

  You can make this today.

• 59:44Speaker 03

  But now it's like my, my whoop would alert me when Freddie's on his way.

• 59:47Speaker 01

  Actually, to be real with you, you could use the whoop and all of these sleep trackers in this movie to be like.

• 59:54Bill Simmons?

  They basically do it when she goes to the institute.

• 59:56Speaker 01

  And that's another thing that's aged the best. So like, well, before I get to that, the Charles Bernstein, uh, is it Bernstein or Bernstein?

• 1:00:03Chris Ryan?

  I'm not sure.

• 1:00:04Speaker 01

  The piano score, like the piano, like that. Very noticeable, recognizable. This is Freddie's theme is like up there with other, wow, you're in trouble. Right.

• 1:00:15Bill Simmons?

  It's subtle. You don't even barely notice it, but it's always there.

• 1:00:18Speaker 01

  In this movie also, a mention of REM sleep.

• 1:00:22Chris Ryan?

  Yep.

• 1:00:22Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:23Speaker 01

  When they, uh, when she goes to the sleep disorder place, a mention of REM sleep, which I think about all the time now, which I didn't before, aged the best.

• 1:00:31Chris Ryan?

  We've talked about a couple of them. One, two, Freddy's coming for you is indelible. Freddie has like a long-term project is amazing. I gotta tell you something this time around. That fucking guy on fire was amazing. That guy's on fire for like two minutes.

• 1:00:46Bill Simmons?

  I had that too. It's like, it's like a continuous shot.

• 1:00:48Chris Ryan?

  I can't believe he didn't die. Like he's like running around the back and forth in the basement, all the way up the stairs and into the bedroom. I'm sure that. Like they had some, some tricks there, but like they talk about it in the making of documentary. Like, yeah, we got the best fire guy. This guy's just really good at being on fire. It's just like, how do you find that out?

• 1:01:09Bill Simmons?

  He said, no, no, more fire. I can handle more. I can do two and a half minutes.

• 1:01:12Speaker 01

  How do they do it? What do they do to you?

• 1:01:14Chris Ryan?

  It's like a, a chemical that they can put on your clothes that like, it's like superficial burns. Cause it's bringing the chemical and not you, but he's got like tarping and all the stuff on. Yeah.

• 1:01:24Bill Simmons?

  Myers, at the end of Halloween two, they did their version of that with him and it really feels fake.

• 1:01:30Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:30Bill Simmons?

  Feels way more realistic. My number one, what stage the best? So this movie's been in my life now since I was like in eighth or ninth grade, whatever year it came out. And when I saw it, when I was at that age, you know, I'm attracted to Heather Langenkamp and Nancy and Tina.

• 1:01:48Chris Ryan?

  Marge.

• 1:01:48Bill Simmons?

  And then as you get older, it's like, you know, Marge is looking pretty good.

• 1:01:52Speaker 01

  The mom?

• 1:01:53Bill Simmons?

  Now I've moved into the Marge range when I watch this movie. Like fucking Marge, man. She just needs, needs to find the right guy.

• 1:01:59Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:59Bill Simmons?

  That bathroom, just waiting to bust out.

• 1:02:01Chris Ryan?

  Steps, you can have it all figured out. Yeah.

• 1:02:04Bill Simmons?

  Kind of a sleeper. I wasn't thinking that, everybody else in the ninth grade though.

• 1:02:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's true.

• 1:02:09Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:10Bill Simmons?

  Okay. Hans Gruber scale villain ranking?

• 1:02:13Chris Ryan?

  We need to change the chart, man.

• 1:02:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's off the chart.

• 1:02:15Chris Ryan?

  He breaks it.

• 1:02:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:16Chris Ryan?

  Fred, undead, burned alive, child predator with finger knives?

• 1:02:22Bill Simmons?

  Mm-hmm. Child murderer.

• 1:02:23Chris Ryan?

  Child murderer. I know the day, they softened it a little bit.

• 1:02:26Speaker 03

  I think that has aged the best.

• 1:02:28Bill Simmons?

  The softening?

• 1:02:28Speaker 03

  Them choosing murderer, I think.

• 1:02:30Chris Ryan?

  Over molester.

• 1:02:31Speaker 03

  Yes. I think 40 years later, I think we'd be looking at this now being like, ugh.

• 1:02:34Chris Ryan?

  Also, cause like if he's, you're right. If he's explicitly a child molester in this, like, nobody's like, yeah, get him Freddie. Nobody's dressing up as Freddie for Halloween.

• 1:02:43Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 1:02:43Speaker 01

  It's true, cause you couldn't do it.

• 1:02:44Speaker 03

  Because part of these movies is like, you're not like excited for the next kill, but you kind of are. You're like interested in it and you're not rooting for the bad guy, but you're like taking part in it in the movie. And if he's a child molester, you're like, okay.

• 1:02:54Speaker 01

  The dream world is, okay, we're doing a lot of work between child molester and child killer. So I just wanna call it out.

• 1:02:59Speaker 03

  No, but I'm saying, wasn't it originally supposed to be?

• 1:03:01Speaker 01

  It was. It was. There were too many real world stories that happened that they didn't wanna go there, but I'm fucking with you.

• 1:03:06Bill Simmons?

  I think it was the right move.

• 1:03:06Speaker 01

  I think it was the right move too. But also the dream world is so interesting. Like the world that Freddie creates is so interesting.

• 1:03:13Chris Ryan?

  Cause it's like extension of the boiler room.

• 1:03:15Speaker 01

  Of the boiler room and all of that stuff. And you have to.

• 1:03:17Bill Simmons?

  And the scratching noise.

• 1:03:19Chris Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:03:19Bill Simmons?

  The noises of this movie would have been great in a theater. Like, ah, like, it's one of the worst noises.

• 1:03:24Chris Ryan?

  Can't handle it.

• 1:03:26Bill Simmons?

  Great check order. What'd you have, Sierra?

• 1:03:27Chris Ryan?

  Knife fingers coming out of the water for in the bathtub.

• 1:03:30Speaker 01

  So that's the answer, but, but there is a gorgeous shot. Tina in front of the boiler room.

• 1:03:36Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  In front of the boiler itself. It just pristine, perfectly framed. Like you're, you know that she's barefoot. She's wearing a night gown. She's so vulnerable. And you know, it's got to be hot. It just like kid in danger sets the stakes for the entire movie.

• 1:03:56Chris Ryan?

  I mean, the blood coming out of the mattress, Glenn going into the mattress. Like, there's so many, like, this movie is really one.

• 1:04:02Bill Simmons?

  It's the bathtub shot.

• 1:04:04Speaker 03

  Right after that even too, when she gets dragged down, there's a great bird's eye shot looking down at the tub. It's really good.

• 1:04:08Speaker 01

  It is, it is, it is the bathtub shot.

• 1:04:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:04:13Bill Simmons?

  Ninth grade, Bill really watched that bathtub scene closely.

• 1:04:17Chris Ryan?

  Trying to see, I get it. Freeze frame?

• 1:04:18Bill Simmons?

  Tried. Then she had the closet scene too. That was another.

• 1:04:21Chris Ryan?

  You had the all 22?

• 1:04:24Bill Simmons?

  Trying to look to the side. Uh, Big Coonaburger Award, best use of food and drink. Obviously, uh, Marge is.

• 1:04:28Chris Ryan?

  It's not obviously that. There is another one.

• 1:04:31Bill Simmons?

  Over Marge with the, she thinks the kid went to sleep?

• 1:04:34Chris Ryan?

  Really brief moment towards the end of the film where, uh, Marge goes into Nancy's room. Nancy has stay awake there. She's got all sorts of like, she's got a coffee maker.

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:47Chris Ryan?

  Marge takes the coffee maker, walks out. Nancy wakes up, pulls out another coffee maker.

• 1:04:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, she's like, that's.

• 1:04:54Chris Ryan?

  Dude, the fucking electricity she's drawing. She's got two Mr. Coffees running.

• 1:04:57Speaker 01

  The answer is the coffee.

• 1:04:59Bill Simmons?

  That's pretty good.

• 1:05:00Speaker 01

  When you say best use of food and drink, you're using the food to stay alive.

• 1:05:04Chris Ryan?

  Coffee maker.

• 1:05:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, she has to drink the coffee. She's pounding coffee. That's the answer to the fucking.

• 1:05:10Chris Ryan?

  It's probably like Dunkin' Donuts in her room.

• 1:05:12Speaker 03

  They definitely thought of that like on set. They're like, well, wouldn't the mom just take away the coffee maker? And like, what can we do?

• 1:05:17Chris Ryan?

  What if she had a secret batch?

• 1:05:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:05:20Bill Simmons?

  It's pretty good. I still like the vodka in the linen closet.

• 1:05:23Chris Ryan?

  Yes, it's, it's.

• 1:05:24Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, all my vodka's gone. All right. I'll see you later. Have a good night, honey.

• 1:05:27Chris Ryan?

  Got my closet vodka.

• 1:05:29Bill Simmons?

  Ches Rockwell Brocklander's award for best character name. The two boys in this movie are named Glenn and Rod?

• 1:05:36Chris Ryan?

  Rod Lane.

• 1:05:37Bill Simmons?

  What are we doing that again?

• 1:05:38Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:39Speaker 01

  Oh, you, Fred Krueger? You don't think Fred?

• 1:05:41Bill Simmons?

  Glenn, Rod and Fred with Tina and Nancy. It's like, these names are out of the 1950s.

• 1:05:47Chris Ryan?

  Who's our, who's our most recent Rod? I mean, I know you can just shorten it from Rodney.

• 1:05:51Speaker 01

  So Rod Strickland.

• 1:05:52Chris Ryan?

  Rod Strickland.

• 1:05:53Bill Simmons?

  Rod Tidwell.

• 1:05:56Speaker 01

  Rod.

• 1:05:56Bill Simmons?

  Rod Benson had a cup of coffee.

• 1:05:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but we don't have a lot of, not a lot of our Rodneys are going down.

• 1:06:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, we've moved to Rodney.

• 1:06:04Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:05Bill Simmons?

  Is really what's happened. That's how we don't have any dicks anymore.

• 1:06:09Chris Ryan?

  That's right.

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  No Rods or dicks.

• 1:06:10Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:11Bill Simmons?

  Joe House's father, Dick House, one of the last dicks. His dad's name, Dick House, Richard House, AKA Dick. Kid Cudi Pursuit of Happiness Award for best needle drop. No songs in this movie, which is where they couldn't afford it.

• 1:06:25Chris Ryan?

  I think one, two, Freddy's coming for you.

• 1:06:26Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, so that's the winner by default. Was there a better title for this movie?

• 1:06:32Bill Simmons?

  Dream Weaver?

• 1:06:34Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, Never Go to Sleep.

• 1:06:36Speaker 01

  Never Go to Sleep, all of that. A Nightmare on Elm Street is just a fucking banger.

• 1:06:42Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:42Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:06:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:43Chris Ryan?

  They really name the hell out of these movies.

• 1:06:45Bill Simmons?

  Sariya Fux category.

• 1:06:47Chris Ryan?

  Um, I just had a, I've said this accidentally. It's a book about metals award for the belatedly best quota exchange. You could take any number of Nancy Marge interactions, some real like acting going on between Langenkamp and Ronnie Blakely. But mother, what's with the bars when she comes home and the security bars have been put somehow in one school day has had a two-story house completely security barred up. And has now drank a bottle of Citron and is falling asleep with the keys.

• 1:07:15Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, who was doing that? That would take, I think, a couple of days.

• 1:07:18Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, that is straight. That's not a union job. She went to like a, straight Task Rabbit.

• 1:07:26Bill Simmons?

  The Van Lathan Award, did this movie need more black people?

• 1:07:28Speaker 01

  You guys have to hear me out.

• 1:07:30Bill Simmons?

  There's a poster of black people in Glenn's room. Can't see in the background.

• 1:07:34Speaker 01

  Who are they?

• 1:07:34Bill Simmons?

  I couldn't tell.

• 1:07:35Chris Ryan?

  Hmm.

• 1:07:36Bill Simmons?

  Free, a freeze frame, I couldn't figure it out.

• 1:07:37Speaker 01

  Fuckin' Commodores or something like that. Um, like, it's like the whispers, like he likes.

• 1:07:42Bill Simmons?

  I think that's a Lada Ritchie.

• 1:07:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, he likes, he likes a little R and B. This movie goes up a notch if Don is black.

• 1:07:51Chris Ryan?

  Who's Don? Rod?

• 1:07:53Speaker 01

  Rod, excuse me. If Rod, excuse me, I said it.

• 1:07:55Bill Simmons?

  I was trying to.

• 1:07:57Speaker 01

  If Rod is, if Rod is black, if Rod is black.

• 1:08:01Chris Ryan?

  This movie is electric.

• 1:08:02Speaker 01

  This movie goes up a notch if Rod is black.

• 1:08:05Chris Ryan?

  And you know what? Is this, is this before Cry Freedom? Is it, could Denzel have got, no, this would be, Denzel would probably be two.

• 1:08:12Speaker 01

  Okay, so Rod's sneaking over. Why is he sneaking over? Because no one can see him. No one can see him with Tina because there's illicit racial undertones. He also gets up there with Tina. Think of the scene where Johnny Depp is laying down and Rod is up there beating Tina out of the frame. That feels like, that, like that, that feels different, right? I'm not gonna go to how he actually dies. That mean what we might have to change. But if it's like, that, that might not, that we might have to change. But all of the things is, none of the town believes him. He's framed for the death of this white chick that he's been talking to.

• 1:08:56Speaker 01

  None of the town believe, Nancy is on the side of him. Dad, why do you think that he's guilty of this? Why do you think Rod had to do it? Why do you think this? Why? Cause dad on some bullshit.

• 1:09:08Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:08Speaker 01

  Right? Dad is looking at, you know, we shouldn't have never let his family into this town in the first place. The whole nine.

• 1:09:13Bill Simmons?

  Pretty good.

• 1:09:14Speaker 01

  This, if, if he is black in this movie, this goes up.

• 1:09:18Chris Ryan?

  Canonically though, there is a black family in Elm Street or in Springview. Is that what it's called?

• 1:09:24Speaker 01

  Springwood.

• 1:09:25Chris Ryan?

  Springwood?

• 1:09:25Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:09:26Chris Ryan?

  Because Kincaid.

• 1:09:27Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:09:27Chris Ryan?

  In Dream Warriors is one of the Elm Street children. So there must have been a black family in town.

• 1:09:32Speaker 01

  Right. What if Kincaid ends up being?

• 1:09:35Bill Simmons?

  Rod Kincaid.

• 1:09:36Chris Ryan?

  Rod's kid.

• 1:09:38Speaker 01

  His, his, his.

• 1:09:38Chris Ryan?

  Illegitimate.

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  Kid or his little, probably his little brother.

• 1:09:41Chris Ryan?

  Little brother, yeah.

• 1:09:42Bill Simmons?

  Well, this leads me to the butcher's girlfriend award for weak link in the film, which is Rod, cause he's terrible in this.

• 1:09:48Chris Ryan?

  It's also tough. This is also where casting what ifs comes in. Cause you're like, there's some Rod what ifs that are pretty tantalizing.

• 1:09:55Speaker 01

  But also we should say that the actor is very, very forthright about the fact that during this time.

• 1:09:59Bill Simmons?

  Like real issues.

• 1:10:00Speaker 01

  He was like even part of, he was using heroin at this time. And so like it took away from his performance.

• 1:10:06Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 1:10:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, he said in 2014 that, uh, he was snorting heroin in the bathroom between takes.

• 1:10:13Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:10:13Bill Simmons?

  That he was high on heroin during the jail cell scene with Nancy. Who said, uh, the actress said, his eyes were watery and they weren't focused. I thought, wow, he's given the best performance of his life. So he's having a lot of issues. Um, his name is Sue Garcia.

• 1:10:30Chris Ryan?

  Uh-huh.

• 1:10:31Bill Simmons?

  But he was credited as Nick Corey in this movie.

• 1:10:34Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:34Bill Simmons?

  And we could have done better than Rod. He's bad. He's bad from the first time you see him when he's, is he, is he a bad guy? Is he heckling her? What? Is this his boyfriend?

• 1:10:46Speaker 01

  Unclear, like, cause she disses him. He didn't, he didn't.

• 1:10:49Bill Simmons?

  You don't know what's going on. It's just weird.

• 1:10:51Chris Ryan?

  It seems like he's like.

• 1:10:53Bill Simmons?

  It's almost like scared like a hoodlum. Who is he?

• 1:10:55Chris Ryan?

  And he's the greaser kind of thing from Outsiders or whatever. But then like, they obviously all hang out together, like they must hang.

• 1:11:03Speaker 01

  Even after he says like up yours with a lawnmower or whatever he says to her, Nancy goes, well, you know, he's crazy about you. So they did, you know.

• 1:11:11Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. And Tina's like, you guys can't leave. You can't leave me alone.

• 1:11:13Bill Simmons?

  Do you guys have a different weak link than this? It has to be Rod, I think.

• 1:11:16Chris Ryan?

  I think that in, uh, in retrospect, Nancy's mom is like an ironic fun character.

• 1:11:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:25Chris Ryan?

  But I think they left something on the table by not having somebody a little bit more dialed actively.

• 1:11:29Speaker 01

  Like so one.

• 1:11:30Chris Ryan?

  With all due respect to Roddy Blakely, who's.

• 1:11:32Speaker 01

  Like so one note, so like I have her as the weak. I know, Bill, you can't get over.

• 1:11:36Chris Ryan?

  And she does like, she's doing like soap opera acting where she like walks to the camera and is like, I have to tell you something, Nancy. You know, it's like.

• 1:11:42Bill Simmons?

  I have more thoughts on this in a later category.

• 1:11:44Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:11:45Bill Simmons?

  What stage the worst?

• 1:11:49Bill Simmons?

  Freddy's arm stretch, we probably, it's probably the one special effect we could have done better.

• 1:11:55Chris Ryan?

  Here's what I like about it though, and that whole scene, which I had mentioned, we were doing it for a watchable scene, is that's also a scene that operates on dream logic, where like Tina is like running, but not fast enough, like

• 1:12:07Bill Simmons?

  Not going anywhere.

• 1:12:08Chris Ryan?

  It's like that feeling of like, why can't I outrun this person? He's not even running that fast and like him.

• 1:12:13Speaker 03

  And I think it's deliberately filmed that way, where they almost are having her like fake run in motion.

• 1:12:17Speaker 01

  Also, I can't go there with you on that one, because it's too iconic of a scene. It kind of demonstrates Freddy's ability to be whatever he needs to be in the dream.

• 1:12:27Bill Simmons?

  I just think if he did in 26, they'd be doing a better job.

• 1:12:30Chris Ryan?

  Well, they would do all this stuff.

• 1:12:30Speaker 01

  It would be better, but I don't think it.

• 1:12:32Chris Ryan?

  But it's two guys with fishing poles standing behind, that's amazing.

• 1:12:36Bill Simmons?

  Sleeping with crucifixes over your bed, we mentioned. Not being able to just Google Fred Krueger in 1984 stands out. Like if this is all happening, I'd be like, oh, just Google what happened.

• 1:12:46Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, where's the press?

• 1:12:47Speaker 01

  Yeah. Why don't you, remember film strips? Remember going to, what do you call it? Microfiche. Microfiche. Are you from the microfiche era?

• 1:12:54Chris Ryan?

  No, he's.

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  So when I wanted to know a news story from the past, I had to go to LSU's library. And in LSU's library, they had microfiche, where they had all of these old news stories. They had to look up the old news.

• 1:13:06Bill Simmons?

  Newspapers.

• 1:13:07Speaker 01

  Newspapers, or like to turn through them.

• 1:13:09Bill Simmons?

  You'd go cross-eyed after like an hour. Tina was only 15? How old are the characters in this movie?

• 1:13:16Speaker 01

  15. In the script, she's 15.

• 1:13:19Bill Simmons?

  So Nancy was 15 too?

• 1:13:21Chris Ryan?

  I guess.

• 1:13:21Speaker 01

  I think everybody was in a.

• 1:13:22Chris Ryan?

  It doesn't really make sense for Dream Warriors, because it's supposed to be six years later, and Nancy's a graduate student who's interning at a mental hospital.

• 1:13:29Bill Simmons?

  Why didn't they just make these kids senior in high schools? Or juniors?

• 1:13:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:13:33Bill Simmons?

  I thought 15 was weird. Jungleman fixed Jean was just from a what's age the worst. That was a Tarzan thing. I don't know if they would.

• 1:13:41Chris Ryan?

  It's not hitting.

• 1:13:44Bill Simmons?

  The.

• 1:13:45Speaker 01

  Might have to change that too, but I don't know if they, you know.

• 1:13:48Bill Simmons?

  The four endings, which we talked about earlier, the fact that they were really, there seemed like there was real animosity about where this landed. Ended was pretty interesting.

• 1:13:58Speaker 01

  We haven't talked about this. It, there seems to have been between Shay and Craven a lot of back and forth on how the movie should be. Like these guys and.

• 1:14:11Bill Simmons?

  Robert Shay was the head of New Line.

• 1:14:12Speaker 01

  Shay was the head of New Line. And this goes on to the next film, which, you know, they got out really quick because they needed a sequel.

• 1:14:19Bill Simmons?

  Because Shay saw dollar signs and Craven's just trying to make the best movie possible.

• 1:14:23Speaker 01

  But also Shay saw himself as something of a filmmaker, not as a producer.

• 1:14:28Chris Ryan?

  He directed like the, the stair scene. He's like, if you like this scene so much, you should direct it.

• 1:14:33Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:14:33Chris Ryan?

  And he was like, Wes was nice enough to let me direct it. Yeah.

• 1:14:36Speaker 01

  And they were, and you know, Wes Craven said that was part of the, the peace offering was I'll let him call action and cut on this. But they were going back and forth a lot about where this movie was supposed to go.

• 1:14:44Chris Ryan?

  I, I guess I don't mean to not have a take on it. I don't really know what the best ending would have been for a movie like this.

• 1:14:50Bill Simmons?

  I don't either. I read all the possible ones and none of them jumped out.

• 1:14:53Chris Ryan?

  Now in 84, so has Friday the 13th part two come out already? I assume, right?

• 1:14:59Bill Simmons?

  Oh, yeah. I think 3D was out at that point.

• 1:15:02Chris Ryan?

  Halloween two is out by now, right?

• 1:15:04Bill Simmons?

  Oh, the first three were out.

• 1:15:05Chris Ryan?

  One of the things that's so cool about this movie is that you can tell that they've learned the lessons of some of the other earlier films, like there is.

• 1:15:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:13Chris Ryan?

  There's no, you have to wait 45 minutes for a kill. Like, you know, like the way that you have to end Halloween and then Friday. This is like immediately something bad happens, but clearly they knew that if this was successful, there was going to have to be sequels. So they probably should have baked that into the script itself, probably.

• 1:15:28Speaker 01

  Well, also at New Line, there was something happening that they had to, to in order to get the movie financed, give away a lot of their royalties and all of their, their merchants, stuff like that. So they actually didn't see a lot of the financial windfall that came from the success of this movie. So the way for them to make money was to get another one out as soon as possible.

• 1:15:47Bill Simmons?

  We used to do that with the Watch.

• 1:15:48Chris Ryan?

  Right.

• 1:15:49Bill Simmons?

  We, we gave a bunch of the Watch profits to the mafia in 2015.

• 1:15:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, the departed guys.

• 1:15:57Bill Simmons?

  My biggest what? Two giant what's age the worst for me. That, I guess that could also be considered nitpicks, but I really feel like it's a what's age worst. Glenn's room has bugged the shit out of me since 1984.

• 1:16:09Speaker 03

  Why?

• 1:16:10Bill Simmons?

  First of all, there's no girls anywhere on the walls. He's, this is the only ninth grader in America that didn't have like.

• 1:16:17Chris Ryan?

  Swimsuit issue up there?

• 1:16:18Bill Simmons?

  Swimsuit issue, the old Cheryl Teagues poster, Heather Thomas, Heather Locklear, like nothing. He's got one music poster.

• 1:16:26Chris Ryan?

  He's into U2, maybe he's like more into punk rock.

• 1:16:28Bill Simmons?

  If you actually look at his, it's the weirdest fucking room. It's like, who is this kid? That's one, really bugs me. And then the second one was, uh, so Freddy killed 20 kids in the same neighborhood.

• 1:16:45Bill Simmons?

  20?

• 1:16:46Chris Ryan?

  This is, this goes into my what's age the worst, is that there, there's an artificial dampening of reaction to this. If Freddy crimes themselves, no one would live there.

• 1:16:56Bill Simmons?

  First of all, if somebody killed 20 kids in the same neighborhood.

• 1:16:59Chris Ryan?

  They're just like, I guess.

• 1:17:00Bill Simmons?

  This would be the most famous murderer we've ever had.

• 1:17:02Chris Ryan?

  And this neighborhood is a rap.

• 1:17:03Bill Simmons?

  This, yeah, this is.

• 1:17:04Chris Ryan?

  I'm not raising a child in this neighborhood. Yeah.

• 1:17:07Bill Simmons?

  And every fucking kid would know, you have one murder in your town. Everybody knows the house, what happened.

• 1:17:13Speaker 01

  But they know that it's him to a degree, like, because.

• 1:17:18Bill Simmons?

  She doesn't, the mom tells her. It's like, oh, we had this guy, Fred Krueger.

• 1:17:21Chris Ryan?

  But they know at the funeral for Rod, who is the funeral for when she's like, when clearly the mom and dad are like.

• 1:17:29Speaker 01

  Well, what I'm saying is.

• 1:17:30Chris Ryan?

  It seems like Fred's back.

• 1:17:31Speaker 01

  There's, there's something else that happens while Freddy's alive. His wife goes missing.

• 1:17:36Chris Ryan?

  But we don't know that.

• 1:17:37Speaker 01

  We don't know that now, but I'm just saying overall. So it's actually more than just the fact that there are 20 kids.

• 1:17:43Bill Simmons?

  But maybe do four kids?

• 1:17:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:17:45Bill Simmons?

  Four kids is pretty scary.

• 1:17:47Chris Ryan?

  I mean, even how.

• 1:17:48Bill Simmons?

  20? 20 is like the whole city.

• 1:17:49Chris Ryan?

  Origin story in three, and you find out he is the bastard son of a hundred maniacs.

• 1:17:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:55Chris Ryan?

  Who has been like conceived in a just grotesque fashion at an asylum.

• 1:18:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, his mom worked there.

• 1:18:01Chris Ryan?

  You're like, but what, like, we need to have federal intervention. Where was Reagan? You know, like, who didn't step in here and put a net on this?

• 1:18:11Speaker 01

  But no, seriously, you guys are right. If 20 kids went missing in one place.

• 1:18:15Bill Simmons?

  What's the right number of kids for everybody in town to know about this? Like four?

• 1:18:19Chris Ryan?

  For social though.

• 1:18:20Speaker 03

  Under five.

• 1:18:23Speaker 03

  Like with two, like I feel like it'd be pretty bad.

• 1:18:25Speaker 01

  Five, five is probably.

• 1:18:26Speaker 03

  Can we put up a poll?

• 1:18:28Bill Simmons?

  Did you have, do you have a murder where you grew up or anything like a death or a fire or anything? No, but I'm saying like a famous one, like a famous one.

• 1:18:36Speaker 01

  Um, no, not, not really. Not like in this vein. Not, not like in this vein.

• 1:18:41Bill Simmons?

  I feel like if one kid was murdered, it would have been all we talked about for 10 years. Like little Bobby.

• 1:18:47Speaker 01

  You can't do one though.

• 1:18:47Bill Simmons?

  It's the anniversary of when that fuck it's.

• 1:18:50Speaker 03

  If the same guy killed three kids on three different occasions, it would be a huge.

• 1:18:53Speaker 01

  But we do, we do have like.

• 1:18:55Bill Simmons?

  Like, we're getting out. Like, we're not living here anymore.

• 1:18:57Speaker 01

  We are in the heyday 70s and 80s of the serial killer.

• 1:19:01Bill Simmons?

  True.

• 1:19:01Speaker 01

  So people are popping up missing and going missing and getting killed. So like, I, I feel like five, six could be a thing. 20 is a lot.

• 1:19:10Bill Simmons?

  The only other what's age the worst is there is a scene where Glenn comes out of the bed that's on the DVD cut, but they didn't put in the movie. And I always wondered why they didn't put it in the movie.

• 1:19:19Chris Ryan?

  His dead body comes out or?

• 1:19:21Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, his body comes out after.

• 1:19:22Chris Ryan?

  Is it gruesome or is it?

• 1:19:24Bill Simmons?

  I don't know. They just, maybe they thought it was too gross. Any other what's age the worst?

• 1:19:27Chris Ryan?

  I mean, I just, I had the lack of alarm over the grotesque and inexplicable nature of multiple killings on the part of the police department. And then, yeah, it's just funny to watch the kids sass their parents so much. I don't think that that.

• 1:19:42Speaker 01

  I, I'm so glad you brought this up. In you guys' culture, isn't that a thing?

• 1:19:47Chris Ryan?

  You guys' culture?

• 1:19:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know what I'm talking about.

• 1:19:49Bill Simmons?

  You mean white people?

• 1:19:50Speaker 01

  Yeah. In the culture that you guys, like, because I used to watch Belvedere back in the day, right? Mr. Belvedere. And the kids in Mr. Belvedere would just talk crazy shit to their parents. You don't understand me, mom. And they'd like storm out of the room. Dead, I'm dead.

• 1:20:05Bill Simmons?

  There was this show, there was this Disney show called Jesse.

• 1:20:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. When Ben and Zoe were little kids. You remember Jesse? Debbie Ryan on Disney? The kids were sassy and our kids started to be sassy, like the Jesse kids. We made them, we got rid of Jesse. So you're not watching this anymore.

• 1:20:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:20:21Bill Simmons?

  You know, I'm not the fucking parents from Jesse. You're not going to talk to him.

• 1:20:24Speaker 01

  So I mean, but I've also witnessed this. I had a friend who his parents had got divorced.

• 1:20:29Chris Ryan?

  White friend?

• 1:20:29Speaker 01

  White friend.

• 1:20:30Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:20:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, like his parents had got divorced and his mom was, you know, she was like, Jesse, what's happening? You know what I'm saying? So she would come back from being out on a date or whatever. She was out there trying to see what, you know what I'm saying? The thing, you know what I'm saying? What's happening? And she would come back and he would like, like.

• 1:20:44Bill Simmons?

  Sass her?

• 1:20:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, he would sass her. And I just, it never was, so I thought that that was like the way that things.

• 1:20:49Chris Ryan?

  There's a huge spectrum of it for whites. Uh, you know, like, I mean, I've seen kids curse out their mom using direct address.

• 1:20:58Chris Ryan?

  I've also seen kids get the leash yanked a little bit.

• 1:21:01Speaker 01

  Like I legitimately, one time went, my, my dad said something to me. I went, and I smacked, and he went, oh, you smack your mouth? You smack your mouth? Come here, sit on the ground. Like, you couldn't even.

• 1:21:13Chris Ryan?

  Do you think that that.

• 1:21:15Speaker 01

  Make a gesture.

• 1:21:15Chris Ryan?

  Style of parenting protected you from Freddy Krueger?

• 1:21:18Speaker 01

  Uh, probably not. Not if Freddy really wanted it.

• 1:21:21Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:21Speaker 01

  Freddy wanted it, Freddy gonna get it. There's one thing I have that age the worst, and it's a question. So the 80s, you know, he's in his briefs. You know, Rod is in his brief, call him Don again. Rod is in his briefs.

• 1:21:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:35Speaker 01

  When did you stop?

• 1:21:36Bill Simmons?

  Rod Dunn?

• 1:21:37Speaker 01

  Or Rod Dunn. When did you stop with briefs? Because the 80s was a real.

• 1:21:41Chris Ryan?

  Middle school.

• 1:21:42Speaker 01

  It was middle school for you.

• 1:21:43Chris Ryan?

  Boxers.

• 1:21:44Speaker 01

  I'm gonna give you a year that you stopped.

• 1:21:46Bill Simmons?

  That I stopped?

• 1:21:46Speaker 01

  I think it was 98.

• 1:21:48Chris Ryan?

  98's late for Bill.

• 1:21:50Speaker 01

  For Bill, but I think Bill was probably a briefs guy until about 98.

• 1:21:53Bill Simmons?

  I mixed it up, honestly mixed it up. Boxers, went back to the briefs. But I did have briefs on once. That's why my, my fantasy team with my high school college friends, my, my team name is the banana hammocks.

• 1:22:09Bill Simmons?

  But they were more because my mom bought the underwear and I had it on. And my friend Camp thought this was the funniest thing ever that I had a pair of these. But it was mostly boxers.

• 1:22:19Chris Ryan?

  I switched to boxers when Bugle Boy stopped, started popping off.

• 1:22:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, I feel like once you got to the point to where, like, I was remember I knew this girl and she was like, you wear drawls, drawls, like actual drawls and then I couldn't.

• 1:22:31Bill Simmons?

  Problem is boxers, more higher sperm count.

• 1:22:34Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, that's another thing that happened. That actually was a big deal.

• 1:22:37Bill Simmons?

  The brief spring, the sperm count down.

• 1:22:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, boxers. Yeah, okay, cool.

• 1:22:40Bill Simmons?

  Here in college, it's, you know.

• 1:22:42Speaker 01

  Because when that came out, it was like people wearing the tight Calvin Kleins. I'm like, when you see that in the eighties movie.

• 1:22:47Bill Simmons?

  There was a run for that that seems to have gone away. This episode is brought to you by NASA Energy. Every ounce of dirt, sweat and gears, every checkered flag and trophy raised, every lap, every race, every hard fought place. They're all jammed inside every can of NASA Energy. High performance energy for burning the midnight oil in the garage and pedal to the metal human horsepower for the streets. Go ahead, crack open a can of NASA Energy and get after it. When the sun goes down, the appetizers come out. Yeah, you heard that right. Late night half price appetizers are here at Applebee's. Saucy, sweet and spicy boneless wings, crispy cheesy mozzarella sticks, creamy spinach and artichoke dip.

• 1:23:28Bill Simmons?

  Your favorite apps half price available every single night because why should appetizers have curfews? Tap the banner to learn more. Dining only for a limited time at participating locations. Restrictions apply. Copyright 2026 Applebee's Restaurant LLC. Ruff Lohan and Rubenek Partridge over at King Word. Rod is gonna win this one going away. Van, you have a flex?

• 1:23:50Speaker 01

  Um, no list this time. I really desperately wanted to do a list of the all time best.

• 1:23:55Chris Ryan?

  Sorry, you listed every Nightmare on Elm Street with the subtitle.

• 1:23:58Speaker 01

  No list. The Tel Avivine Award for a performance so good and distinct, it may have ruined the actor's career. Now, I cannot go so far as to say that Freddy Krueger ruined Robert Englund's career because he's played him for so long, right? But he is Freddy. As much as Mark Hamill is Luke Skywalker, as much as Christopher Reeve is Superman. He, Robert Englund, for a long time, when I was truly afraid of Freddy, I could not see his face because I saw.

• 1:24:25Bill Simmons?

  So he couldn't have been like Kramer in Seinfeld.

• 1:24:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, right. Yeah. So like for him, this is the defining role. And when you look at his career before this.

• 1:24:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:34Speaker 01

  I mean, he was in V, which is another.

• 1:24:36Bill Simmons?

  He was in V, which was a huge show back in the day.

• 1:24:38Speaker 01

  But when you look at his career before this, he was playing kind of different sorts of roles. After this, it had to be horror and most certainly had to be Freddy.

• 1:24:47Chris Ryan?

  And most, and like his notable performances even within like that context are like meta textual commentaries on being Freddy Krueger or whatever. Yeah.

• 1:24:56Bill Simmons?

  The CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford hottest take award.

• 1:25:00Chris Ryan?

  I have a feeling you guys are gonna go nuclear, so I'll just say that Wes.

• 1:25:03Bill Simmons?

  Are you gonna do an appetizer for us?

• 1:25:05Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I'll just throw like a couple of potato skins on the table and say that Wes Craven is as good as directing teenage hangouts as he is at directing horror. And that's actually the secret to his horror success.

• 1:25:15Bill Simmons?

  I like this.

• 1:25:16Chris Ryan?

  Is that like when you hang out with them for 15 minutes in the first act, you're like, I really care about what happens to these four, you know? Like, he is able to establish, like Linklater, believable human behavior that when it's terrorized by like other worldly evil.

• 1:25:32Bill Simmons?

  Observation.

• 1:25:33Chris Ryan?

  It's just like, you're like, no, not Tina.

• 1:25:35Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:36Chris Ryan?

  I like Tina.

• 1:25:36Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, he uses a lighter touch in those scenes. He, you know, he kind of reminds me of Jeezy.

• 1:25:42Chris Ryan?

  Young Jeezy?

• 1:25:43Speaker 01

  Young Jeezy.

• 1:25:44Chris Ryan?

  How so?

• 1:25:44Speaker 01

  Because when you are listening to Young Jeezy, when you're listening to Jeezy, when Jeezy's at his peak, there are times when you feel like nobody has ever been as good as this guy is right now.

• 1:25:55Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:56Speaker 01

  Then I go on Twitter and I go, hey, man, Jeezy, one of my top five rappers. Jeezy's genre doesn't allow people to think that he's that super dope, so they have to say, in, in trap, you know, Atlanta. They have to be limited by, but he is, to me, the music is so phenomenal and it takes me to another place that I just think of him as transcending it. And that's how, that's the way that I look at Wes Craven. Like, um, such a master of his genre, I think he can stand next to other filmmakers in that way, even though he kind of just makes the one genre, besides like Music of the Heart, where he tried to like show what else he could do.

• 1:26:30Chris Ryan?

  That's like an Oscar nominated.

• 1:26:31Speaker 01

  I know, but, but he's so, he's so, he's so good at this and doing everything about it. I think he demands to be up there with the other guys.

• 1:26:39Speaker 03

  CR, it's why I wanted to give Heather Langenkamp the Sasha Jenkins Award for the character, actor I couldn't believe didn't, didn't become a bigger star. Because, yeah, I watch her in this and I'm like, why isn't she in John Hughes movies after this?

• 1:26:50Chris Ryan?

  Right.

• 1:26:50Speaker 03

  And maybe she didn't have the chops, but to your point, the way that Wes like is able to direct her in this movie, I thought she should have been among all those people in the eighties.

• 1:26:58Speaker 01

  Can I tell you how bad, can I tell you how bad Freddy scared me in the eighties? She was on another show with this guy who had like 15 kids or something like that. She was like on one of those, we got a lot of kids shows, you know?

• 1:27:08Bill Simmons?

  She was like the mom or the daughter?

• 1:27:10Chris Ryan?

  Seventh Heaven or something like that?

• 1:27:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, she was, what's the name of the show?

• 1:27:12Chris Ryan?

  Eight is Enough?

• 1:27:13Speaker 01

  Somebody looking, she was on a show where it was like the dad had a bunch of kids and it was like, what, you guys know.

• 1:27:18Chris Ryan?

  Just the 10 of us?

• 1:27:19Speaker 01

  Just the 10 of us was the name of the show.

• 1:27:21Bill Simmons?

  The Sean Kemp Show?

• 1:27:24Bill Simmons?

  The Anthony Edwards Hour?

• 1:27:27Speaker 01

  Oh, man.

• 1:27:28Chris Ryan?

  If every Buddha just the 10 of us.

• 1:27:31Speaker 01

  I'll be funny. That's funny. Send the video.

• 1:27:33Chris Ryan?

  And LaMelo played his like zany neighbor.

• 1:27:35Speaker 01

  Like coming over there, hey, man, you trying to get some shots up?

• 1:27:39Chris Ryan?

  There was a shot of them like interacting on the bench and somebody tweeted like not a single brain cell being exchanged by either of these guys.

• 1:27:46Speaker 01

  They're both smart.

• 1:27:47Chris Ryan?

  No, of course, I know, but when you're like, you know that they're talking about like probably something.

• 1:27:51Speaker 01

  Going to get some ass. Um, but that show, when that show came on, I used to be scared of that show.

• 1:27:57Bill Simmons?

  Just from seeing her?

• 1:27:58Speaker 01

  Yes. She was on the show, so I would watch the show every now and again, it would come on. And I would think that one day Freddy was gonna bust into the living room of these people, these, and kill everybody.

• 1:28:10Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:10Speaker 01

  And so she was, to me, very connected to the whole thing. Anyway.

• 1:28:13Bill Simmons?

  Craig, you have a hot take?

• 1:28:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:28:15Bill Simmons?

  What's her?

• 1:28:16Speaker 03

  Uh, I think Freddy is a miss, but it's why the movie stands the test of time because they didn't nail Freddy.

• 1:28:22Chris Ryan?

  Because they didn't get it right the first time?

• 1:28:23Speaker 03

  I know. I, I think, I think the wave, I think like his whole thing, he looks like a dime store magician in this movie. And his like weird gloves and his hat, the fedora that's embroidered with his name on it, his long arms, like the red and the green. I don't think any of it is really all that great, but I actually think it has made the movie palatable. And perhaps you could argue that Wes knows that this is a children's nightmare and this is what kids are afraid of. But, but I think if he was too good, the movie would be too scary.

• 1:28:52Chris Ryan?

  So you're telling me if you see Freddy outside of Barney's Beanery at 1 a.m., you're not scared?

• 1:28:57Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I think you, I think you actually would at this point in 2026.

• 1:29:00Speaker 03

  At downtown LA, he's, he's all over. But I, yeah, I just think like Freddy's kind of lame to me and doesn't, isn't that scary or doesn't really work? But it, but it stands the test of time because it, it softens the movie, I think.

• 1:29:13Bill Simmons?

  If Fred, if Craig was found dead tonight in an elevator, elevator bloodbed. We'll know, we'll know what happened.

• 1:29:21Speaker 03

  Raisin gloves.

• 1:29:21Bill Simmons?

  Freddy's like, I'll show you scary.

• 1:29:24Speaker 03

  His long arms, the, the gloves.

• 1:29:25Bill Simmons?

  What do you have, Ben? Or do you want me to go first?

• 1:29:29Speaker 01

  I'm gonna go ahead.

• 1:29:30Bill Simmons?

  How hot are you going?

• 1:29:31Speaker 01

  I'm not going that hot. I, I, these kids are kind of getting what they deserve. I'll just be honest with you.

• 1:29:37Chris Ryan?

  They're asking for it because their parents crying?

• 1:29:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, now that I look at it, I'm kind of team Freddy. You can't do this, man. Okay, so apparently they didn't collect this evidence.

• 1:29:48Chris Ryan?

  It was a clerical error on a search warrant.

• 1:29:50Speaker 01

  That's fine. You didn't sign the search warrant in the right place. I got rights. I got rights. I got rights as an American. You have to collect the evidence in the right way. There's a way that you have to go. We live in a country of laws. I got off on a technicality. Hey, go to somebody, bring the trial back, bring it back. Like bring the whole thing back, do the whole, but you can't click up and just kill me. I can make an argument that Freddy was lynched. You can't just click up and kill, you can't do it that way. And guess what? You try to kill me, a dream demon came to me and say, hey, you want to get him back? I'm like, I'm good on the get back forever. You can't do it that way. They were arrogant.

• 1:30:34Speaker 01

  And they took the law into their own hands and they kind of got what they deserved a little bit.

• 1:30:39Chris Ryan?

  But their kids never did anything wrong.

• 1:30:41Speaker 01

  I don't think.

• 1:30:42Chris Ryan?

  Why isn't Freddy going after Marge?

• 1:30:44Speaker 01

  Because Freddy is not thinking. But at the same time.

• 1:30:49Bill Simmons?

  He's still working on this.

• 1:30:50Speaker 01

  He's still working on, but at the same time, when I looked at this and she's telling that story, by the way, she kept a trophy. She fucked up, dog. The mom kept the trophy.

• 1:31:00Bill Simmons?

  Victory left.

• 1:31:00Speaker 01

  Or like of, of the thing, I looked at this, I'm like, hey, bruh, we a nation of laws, man. Justice is harmony.

• 1:31:06Bill Simmons?

  She put a championship banner up in the kitchen.

• 1:31:08Chris Ryan?

  She was like T O Janssen, the star.

• 1:31:09Bill Simmons?

  Killed Fred Krueger.

• 1:31:10Speaker 01

  If you, if you get involved in vigilante justice like that, all of that type of shit, whatever comes from that, you kind of got to deal with it, man.

• 1:31:19Speaker 03

  Freddy kills the kids and not the parents because that's worse to a parent. Like a parent would rather die than have their kid die.

• 1:31:24Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:31:24Speaker 03

  Right?

• 1:31:25Bill Simmons?

  Van cockery. Fred, uh, was working on a book called If I Did It.

• 1:31:33Bill Simmons?

  He was right there in the book deal. My hottest take, this is really for Van. I think of all the movies that were made in the 1980s, this is the one that most resembles the structure of a 1980s porn.

• 1:31:50Bill Simmons?

  Every time Freddy, yeah, see, I had to be into this one. It's, it's, first of all, we have the bad acting, especially from the mom, who I, I love the mom, but she's a terrible actress.

• 1:32:01Chris Ryan?

  Right.

• 1:32:01Bill Simmons?

  All the scenes, like, it's just very porny. It's like, hey, what's going on here? Rod, porn actor. And we have these, like, kind of setup scenes for the sex, but in this case, it's for the Freddy showing up, right? So it's setup Freddy. Setup Freddy. But then we have different circumstances where it's like, oh, the three of them are hanging out. Somebody's gonna make some popcorn.

• 1:32:23Chris Ryan?

  Oh.

• 1:32:24Bill Simmons?

  The mom, the mom's feeling bad for herself on a Saturday night. Boom, boom, boom. And then we get the big sequence at the end where it's like, oh, now she's gonna have her showdown with Freddy. So I did look it up to see if this movie had a porn parody.

• 1:32:38Chris Ryan?

  It does.

• 1:32:38Bill Simmons?

  And it did, and it was called A Wet Dream on Elm Street.

• 1:32:40Chris Ryan?

  That's cool.

• 1:32:41Bill Simmons?

  But I think the, the beats of this, and Wes Craven, I was not surprised to find out, made some porn.

• 1:32:48Chris Ryan?

  Made some porn. Wes Craven.

• 1:32:50Bill Simmons?

  So he basically porned a horror.

• 1:32:52Chris Ryan?

  And do you know what Wes Craven's porn director name was?

• 1:32:56Bill Simmons?

  Should've just been Wes Craven.

• 1:32:58Chris Ryan?

  It's, I'm really happy I get to tell you this for the first time.

• 1:33:00Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I can't wait to.

• 1:33:01Chris Ryan?

  Abe Snake.

• 1:33:03Bill Simmons?

  Abe Snake.

• 1:33:05Speaker 01

  That's the type of shit I'm talking about. Abe Snake.

• 1:33:08Chris Ryan?

  I move that we, for the, did this movie have a porn adaptation, the Abe Snake Award?

• 1:33:15Bill Simmons?

  The Abe Snake Award for this, yeah, that's pretty good. Casting whatevs. Charlie Sheen honed in on Glenn, but wanted too much money.

• 1:33:23Speaker 01

  He denies it.

• 1:33:24Chris Ryan?

  He denies that.

• 1:33:25Bill Simmons?

  He denies it. Casting director does not deny it. And Charlie Sheen has lied about just a million things.

• 1:33:31Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 1:33:32Bill Simmons?

  And seems to be a pretty awful guy. David Warner was originally cast to play Freddy, but apparently was too big, but they went through the thing with them. Did you believe Roy Scheider for the dad?

• 1:33:45Chris Ryan?

  I did not. I mean, Roy Scheider made some bad movies in the eighties, but I don't think it was at this level.

• 1:33:51Bill Simmons?

  And then allegedly Demi Moore, Courtney Cox, Jennifer Grey all auditioned.

• 1:33:56Chris Ryan?

  There's one other one that was deep in the IMDb trivia of this one, which was Ralph Macchio for Rod, and that's where we need to be.

• 1:34:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:34:06Chris Ryan?

  That or Kiefer.

• 1:34:08Bill Simmons?

  You're gonna have my name. What's the thing he says about the, my name, your name tattooed on my crate?

• 1:34:15Chris Ryan?

  My piece, yeah.

• 1:34:16Speaker 01

  My piece, my piece. It's such an interesting time in Hollywood because when you hear them talk about like who might have ran for the role, it's like Charlie Sheen, Brad Pitt.

• 1:34:30Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that's why it's tough to believe.

• 1:34:32Speaker 01

  It's like all of these guys.

• 1:34:33Chris Ryan?

  But then the casting director was like, I am me Brad Pitt for like five more years.

• 1:34:37Bill Simmons?

  We always talk about this. So we do a movie like Obsession, and there's like no casting whatevs.

• 1:34:41Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:42Bill Simmons?

  But then as the years pass, it's like, yeah, we, Demi Moore, and then just people keep adding stuff to Wikipedia.

• 1:34:48Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:34:48Bill Simmons?

  So I never know what to believe. Joey Pants Award, Best That Guy. John Saxon, I think, is.

• 1:34:55Chris Ryan?

  I think it's, I think he's a that guy.

• 1:34:56Bill Simmons?

  There's a better one. Manda Weiss, no. The guy from The End of Zodiac, Charles Fleischer?

• 1:35:02Speaker 01

  Charles Fleischer, yeah, I had him.

• 1:35:03Bill Simmons?

  Is he Charles Fleischer?

• 1:35:04Speaker 01

  I think he's a that guy. I think Saxon is too, though.

• 1:35:07Bill Simmons?

  He's the that guy to Craig.

• 1:35:09Chris Ryan?

  Of course, yeah. Craig doesn't, yeah, like, most people wouldn't know John Saxon anymore.

• 1:35:12Bill Simmons?

  There's an amazing that guy, though, that trumps all of these, and it's a lady, and it was the teacher, Lynne Shay, Robert Shay's brother.

• 1:35:18Chris Ryan?

  Dion Waiters, actually.

• 1:35:20Bill Simmons?

  Robert Shay's sister, who would go on to play Magda in There's Something About Mary.

• 1:35:25Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:35:26Bill Simmons?

  The teacher in this movie becomes Magda down the road.

• 1:35:29Chris Ryan?

  And she's a scream queen. She's an insidious, yeah.

• 1:35:32Speaker 01

  I didn't connect her with Magda in Something About.

• 1:35:35Chris Ryan?

  And Bob Shay's sister.

• 1:35:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, it's a sister. Apparently they did not. Was she?

• 1:35:40Chris Ryan?

  Wait, Lynne Shay did, oh, Magda in Something About Mary. I thought you meant Magda in Sex and the City.

• 1:35:44Bill Simmons?

  No, Magda in Sex and the.

• 1:35:45Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:35:46Bill Simmons?

  And, uh.

• 1:35:46Chris Ryan?

  Something About Mary.

• 1:35:47Bill Simmons?

  Something About Mary. Dion Waiters Award's a tough one, because we really only have main characters.

• 1:35:53Chris Ryan?

  Would you go Depp here, or is that too many?

• 1:35:55Bill Simmons?

  He's in it too much. Rod? No, I have, I didn't like, I don't wanna give Rod no award.

• 1:36:02Bill Simmons?

  I have, as a runner-up, the cop who won't get her dad at the end.

• 1:36:07Chris Ryan?

  That guy's great.

• 1:36:08Bill Simmons?

  Well, what's going on over there?

• 1:36:09Speaker 01

  You guys good over there?

• 1:36:10Bill Simmons?

  Get my father! But the winner, and I really want to think about this, is Glenn's dad.

• 1:36:16Chris Ryan?

  Oh, that guy's awesome.

• 1:36:17Bill Simmons?

  Oh. That short, squatty guy who's just like fucking ripping a beer and is just pissed off.

• 1:36:21Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:22Bill Simmons?

  Let's get out of here. He's like, that girl's crazy.

• 1:36:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:24Chris Ryan?

  I don't want her talking to my son anymore.

• 1:36:27Bill Simmons?

  Really enjoy that guy. Recasting couch, who did you have for Rod?

• 1:36:32Chris Ryan?

  I like Macchio. I like Kiefer Sutherland, Stand By Me, Eric Kiefer Sutherland, trying for this one.

• 1:36:38Speaker 01

  Uh, Dylan.

• 1:36:40Bill Simmons?

  Matt Dillon?

• 1:36:41Chris Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:36:42Speaker 01

  Perfect, like an outsider's name.

• 1:36:43Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:44Bill Simmons?

  Let me offer you a little S.I. Morales.

• 1:36:46Speaker 01

  Oh!

• 1:36:46Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, yeah, a little bad boys there, S.I. Morales.

• 1:36:49Speaker 01

  Sure. Okay, little, little.

• 1:36:51Bill Simmons?

  Let's get some, let's bring some real acting in here.

• 1:36:53Speaker 01

  What was the one he did with?

• 1:36:54Bill Simmons?

  Shout out to Shay Serrano.

• 1:36:55Speaker 01

  Like, he was so good in that, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah.

• 1:36:57Bill Simmons?

  I like that guy.

• 1:36:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:59Bill Simmons?

  Ended up on NYPD Blue.

• 1:37:00Speaker 01

  I have a, I have a city.

• 1:37:02Bill Simmons?

  Okay. Boston?

• 1:37:04Speaker 01

  Never. Rod would have definitely been, oh, anyway. Uh, New Orleans could have been a fun city for this.

• 1:37:10Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, this could have been fun, and like a little bit of a Gothic southern.

• 1:37:13Speaker 01

  A little bit of a Gothic southern city. You got a little bit of like spirits hanging around, you know? New Orleans could have been a fun city for this.

• 1:37:20Bill Simmons?

  That's good. Craig, you have a flex.

• 1:37:23Speaker 03

  The Estelle Reiner All Have What She's Having Award for the Best Contribution by a Performer with Two or Fewer Lines. I like Tina's mom's lover at the beginning of the movie, just coming in and going, you coming back to the sack or what?

• 1:37:35Speaker 03

  He just comes in, gets a QB pressure, he's out of the game.

• 1:37:40Speaker 01

  Your dog is having the worst nightmare of his life. It's like, yo, we doing something in here.

• 1:37:46Speaker 03

  Yeah, that guy's scarier than any of Freddy's.

• 1:37:48Chris Ryan?

  It's so funny to watch these movies. The parents are always like getting back at 1:00 AM, and they're like, you're still up?

• 1:37:56Bill Simmons?

  And they're always with the worst guys if they're divorced. It's always a guy like that guy. That's a good one. Half-Assed Internet Research, fictional street address of Nancy's house, 1428 North Janice Avenue. It's like eight blocks from our Sycamore studio.

• 1:38:10Speaker 01

  Been there several times.

• 1:38:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's close.

• 1:38:12Chris Ryan?

  Is it still the same house?

• 1:38:14Speaker 01

  So it looks the same if you know the movie.

• 1:38:16Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:16Speaker 01

  So like, one of the first things that I did when I came here, my friend Jeff Burke, it's like, hey, you wanna see the Elm Street House? I was like, absolutely. So we went there, we stopped, and then I got out and like stood in front of the crib and legitimately, once again, felt like scared.

• 1:38:31Chris Ryan?

  Screamed out.

• 1:38:32Speaker 01

  Looking around, seeing if there's gonna be little girls jump roping or something like that, but it's right over there.

• 1:38:36Chris Ryan?

  It is really weird. They picked it for this exact purpose, but there are all these streets in West Hollywood like that, where like the side street off of Beverly or off of whatever, you're like, I'm just in the suburbs.

• 1:38:48Speaker 01

  It's in the neighborhood, yeah.

• 1:38:48Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, like, I am, I feel like I'm in.

• 1:38:50Bill Simmons?

  Halloween's off of Sunset, where the Zanku Chicken is, under Orange Grove, and then it's two blocks down. The Happy Days House is near the Elm Street House. Like, there's some weird ones.

• 1:39:00Speaker 01

  But that, but all of those houses, those are all in the same area.

• 1:39:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, like legitimately within like a half mile.

• 1:39:06Bill Simmons?

  Because it looks, especially like if there's leaves falling or anything, it really does look like you're in the East Coast.

• 1:39:10Chris Ryan?

  You can see just where, like, there's just so much money in this city, because those people obviously constructed like a fake suburb for one block.

• 1:39:15Speaker 01

  You're right, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:39:17Bill Simmons?

  Craven thought about having a sickle as the choice before he became the Glove.

• 1:39:22Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:23Bill Simmons?

  That the Glove was a good move. You mentioned the child molester thing when they did the 2010 remake with Jackie Earl Haley. He was a child molester.

• 1:39:32Speaker 01

  Little children.

• 1:39:33Bill Simmons?

  The bottomless tub we talked about.

• 1:39:35Speaker 01

  Look at Craig's face. Craig's like, too far, man, they shouldn't have done it.

• 1:39:40Bill Simmons?

  The, uh, they wanted, uh, they wanted everything to end, like, this is the ending that we argued about. It ends up being a dream within a dream within a dream, which is really confusing the first time you see it, but that's what they were aiming for.

• 1:39:58Chris Ryan?

  In Dream Warriors, which I literally just watched but didn't remember hearing, do, does Nancy explain what happens actually at the end of Elm Street?

• 1:40:08Speaker 01

  I don't think she does.

• 1:40:09Chris Ryan?

  She's like, all my friends are dead, so I.

• 1:40:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, she says all my friends are dead, and she's been taking that drug, like, to stay awake for like five years.

• 1:40:13Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:14Speaker 01

  Well, not, not to stay awake, to not dream.

• 1:40:16Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, to not dream.

• 1:40:16Speaker 01

  For five years. But I don't think she does. She says all of her friends are dead. She, so they all die.

• 1:40:21Chris Ryan?

  And her mother dies in her sleep later. So I think that it basically wipes the end of this movie off the map.

• 1:40:27Bill Simmons?

  The car that they drove away in the end was a 1958 Cadillac Series 62 convertible.

• 1:40:33Chris Ryan?

  And there's, you can see in the documentary and on YouTube, Freddy, they had one ending with Freddy driving them off.

• 1:40:39Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:39Chris Ryan?

  You know, like, but then they, they went with the, the tarp.

• 1:40:42Bill Simmons?

  And when the top fell, it actually wasn't supposed to fall that hard, and they're actually like scared. The reaction is legitimate. And then that's really it, except when Glenn's listening to the radio, the broadcaster says it's midnight, you're listening to station K G, K R G R, which is the acronym for Kruger.

• 1:41:03Chris Ryan?

  Mmm.

• 1:41:04Bill Simmons?

  He snuck that one in there. Pretty good.

• 1:41:05Speaker 01

  Oh, can I, can I say something else that was snuck in there that I didn't wanna miss? So the establishing shot before they're all in the house, next time you watch the movie, the establishing shot before they're all, when they're all in the house, when they're like eating chips and he's playing the, like, the, uh, the boombox.

• 1:41:19Chris Ryan?

  Oh, and he's like, I gotta play my mom the sound effects tape?

• 1:41:22Speaker 01

  The establishing shot from outside of it, there is like a hat on a rack.

• 1:41:27Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 1:41:27Speaker 01

  And a figure that makes it look like Freddy is in there with them. It's like a weird thing that I just picked up when I was watching this this time. If you look at the establishing shot itself.

• 1:41:38Bill Simmons?

  This is probably intentional.

• 1:41:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, it looks like Freddy is looming over them even while they're awake.

• 1:41:44Bill Simmons?

  Apex Mountain, Heather Langenkamp?

• 1:41:47Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 1:41:48Bill Simmons?

  I would've changed her name and just been Heather Camp.

• 1:41:50Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:41:52Bill Simmons?

  Like, the fact that we don't really totally know how to pronounce her name is probably a bit.

• 1:41:56Chris Ryan?

  I think most people can say Langenkamp, right?

• 1:41:58Bill Simmons?

  Langenkamp?

• 1:41:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I mean, but.

• 1:41:59Bill Simmons?

  But people look at it and go, Langen Camp.

• 1:42:01Speaker 01

  Is it a Hollywood name?

• 1:42:02Bill Simmons?

  Langenkamp.

• 1:42:02Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:03Chris Ryan?

  Is it a Hollywood name? Probably not.

• 1:42:04Bill Simmons?

  Amanda, Amanda, Heather Lang?

• 1:42:07Speaker 01

  Heather Lang?

• 1:42:08Chris Ryan?

  Amanda Wiss.

• 1:42:08Bill Simmons?

  Amanda Wiss Weiss?

• 1:42:10Chris Ryan?

  Is it Wiss Weiss?

• 1:42:11Bill Simmons?

  I don't know.

• 1:42:12Speaker 01

  Johnny Depp?

• 1:42:13Bill Simmons?

  Johnny Depp is a no?

• 1:42:14Speaker 01

  No, fucking around.

• 1:42:16Bill Simmons?

  Wes Craven?

• 1:42:18Chris Ryan?

  No, I think Scream.

• 1:42:19Bill Simmons?

  I think it's Scream.

• 1:42:20Speaker 01

  Scream.

• 1:42:21Bill Simmons?

  Renee Blakely? Probably Nashville?

• 1:42:23Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:25Bill Simmons?

  The Katia Institute for the Study of Sleep Disorders?

• 1:42:27Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:42:28Bill Simmons?

  You think this really existed? Did you Google this?

• 1:42:30Chris Ryan?

  Uh, I did not, and I have a, I have a note about them soon.

• 1:42:33Speaker 01

  Interesting.

• 1:42:34Bill Simmons?

  Eighties horror movies?

• 1:42:37Speaker 01

  Nah, I mean.

• 1:42:38Chris Ryan?

  Well, what is?

• 1:42:39Bill Simmons?

  Top it. Eighties.

• 1:42:41Speaker 01

  Eighties horror movies, uh.

• 1:42:43Bill Simmons?

  Cause Halloween.

• 1:42:44Speaker 01

  Quality?

• 1:42:45Bill Simmons?

  Halloween Chainsaw. So it's basically against Friday 13th, that franchise, Halloween Four.

• 1:42:53Speaker 01

  Do Freddy sequels out apex this one though? Cause by the time we get to the end of the eighties, we're talking about one nine hundred numbers, Will Smith records. We're talking about Freddy as a legitimate cultural force. And

• 1:43:06Bill Simmons?

  But I still think this is the best one.

• 1:43:08Chris Ryan?

  This is the best one.

• 1:43:08Speaker 01

  I know, but like when I think of, you guys gotta help me understand as many of these episodes.

• 1:43:12Chris Ryan?

  Apex Mountain means?

• 1:43:14Speaker 01

  Love to hear me on this. So like it, it, it, you guys have to.

• 1:43:17Bill Simmons?

  Why did you say that? Why did you say that derisively?

• 1:43:20Speaker 01

  I'm just joking.

• 1:43:22Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I didn't like the derisiveness.

• 1:43:23Speaker 01

  No, but seriously, is Apex, I thought Apex Mountain wasn't the number one best.

• 1:43:29Chris Ryan?

  It's where it's at its peak.

• 1:43:30Speaker 01

  It's where it's at its peak.

• 1:43:31Bill Simmons?

  It's when you have your most juice, but the, the concept falls apart when we start doing eighties horror movies.

• 1:43:36Chris Ryan?

  I think retro, I, I would.

• 1:43:38Bill Simmons?

  Cause it's, there's no way to answer it.

• 1:43:39Chris Ryan?

  He's just asking, is this the greatest horror film of the eighties?

• 1:43:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:42Speaker 01

  I think, I, I think so.

• 1:43:43Chris Ryan?

  What about The Shining? Does that count?

• 1:43:46Speaker 01

  Oh, Bangkok Craig. There's, there's no way that.

• 1:43:50Bill Simmons?

  That was summer nineteen eighty.

• 1:43:51Chris Ryan?

  We can never count you out.

• 1:43:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's no, there's no way that like, there's no way that.

• 1:43:54Chris Ryan?

  Bangkok Craig just became Macau Craig.

• 1:43:55Bill Simmons?

  From downtown Bangkok Craig.

• 1:43:58Speaker 01

  Bang.

• 1:43:59Chris Ryan?

  Coming back to the sack, honey?

• 1:44:08Speaker 01

  Bro, that's so fucking funny. Bruh, she's sweating.

• 1:44:11Chris Ryan?

  It's awesome.

• 1:44:11Speaker 01

  Like she, the mom is like, stop cutting yourself in your sleep. Like, the whole thing is like, hey, like come get on my joint. That, that's so funny, bro.

• 1:44:22Bill Simmons?

  He, we have for Apex Mountain, Balinese dream skills? Not sure it's ever been done better.

• 1:44:29Chris Ryan?

  I mean, she mastered that art very quickly. Yeah.

• 1:44:33Bill Simmons?

  Eighties MILF Moms, I think we probably did better.

• 1:44:35Speaker 01

  Booby trapping?

• 1:44:37Chris Ryan?

  No, Kev, Kev came along and changed the game.

• 1:44:39Speaker 01

  That's in the nineties.

• 1:44:40Bill Simmons?

  That was ninety.

• 1:44:40Chris Ryan?

  Oh, of the eighties.

• 1:44:41Bill Simmons?

  I'm talking about in the eighties. Eighties booby trap movies.

• 1:44:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:44Bill Simmons?

  Cruise or Hanks?

• 1:44:46Chris Ryan?

  Uh, Hanks as Glenn, young Hanks as Glenn.

• 1:44:49Bill Simmons?

  Oh, wow. I thought Cruise was, I thought Risky Business Cruise.

• 1:44:52Chris Ryan?

  I think Hanks, I mean, the way that Depp plays him, he has a goofy side. I think it would have been good Hanks.

• 1:44:56Bill Simmons?

  What do you have, Craig?

• 1:44:57Chris Ryan?

  I think Cruise, they both work.

• 1:44:58Bill Simmons?

  And Cruise takes a three one.

• 1:45:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:02Bill Simmons?

  I added this one for you guys. The Ed Norton reverse dunk award. Did this movie need a random sports scene? So it's established Glenn's a jock.

• 1:45:10Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:45:10Bill Simmons?

  Cause at one point she says, you're a jock. He's wearing a football jersey. And it seems like Rod knows him in some sort of sports way, cause he tackles him, which leads me to believe Glenn is on the football team.

• 1:45:21Speaker 01

  With the crop top as well.

• 1:45:22Chris Ryan?

  And he's wearing number ten, which would suggest quarterback, which would be a pretty big get.

• 1:45:25Bill Simmons?

  You know what I could have used? Practice football scene.

• 1:45:28Chris Ryan?

  Yep.

• 1:45:29Bill Simmons?

  You know what else I would have liked? Nancy on the bleachers watching it tired. You know what else I would have really enjoyed? Freddy under the bleachers. It's the fucking easiest two minutes on the planet. What are we doing?

• 1:45:40Speaker 01

  If this is the third movie, when Freddy's having more fun, then legitimately he has a dream and he's on the field.

• 1:45:47Chris Ryan?

  Freddy's playing DN.

• 1:45:47Speaker 01

  And Freddy's the DN.

• 1:45:49Chris Ryan?

  And he keeps coming at him.

• 1:45:50Speaker 01

  Freddy keeps pounding him and pounding him and pounding him.

• 1:45:54Bill Simmons?

  Except he's making those Freddy jokes.

• 1:45:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:56Bill Simmons?

  Call this pass interference.

• 1:46:00Chris Ryan?

  Legal hands to the heart.

• 1:46:03Speaker 01

  That's the one.

• 1:46:04Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. Unnecessary roughness.

• 1:46:10Bill Simmons?

  We did, this was, I never understood why we didn't get more fake sports scenes in eighties movies, but this was an easy one. Even Karate Kid, we get a little soccer with Macho when he tries out for the team.

• 1:46:20Chris Ryan?

  Like use the crew from Lucas. Just feel like we need to borrow you guys for one minute.

• 1:46:24Bill Simmons?

  And then when would I have died thrillers and horror only?

• 1:46:27Chris Ryan?

  I think when I heard the first story about Fred Krueger killing twenty children, I would have, I would have passed out.

• 1:46:32Speaker 01

  Yeah. No, I wouldn't have died.

• 1:46:34Chris Ryan?

  You would not have died in Nightmare on Elm Street.

• 1:46:36Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no, no, because uh, if I came to work right now, oh shit, see?

• 1:46:42Bill Simmons?

  Live.

• 1:46:44Speaker 01

  If I came to work right now and you, Mallory, Joe and Craig were like, yo, man, we all had the same dream about this one guy, I fucking quit. I'm out.

• 1:46:56Bill Simmons?

  You're out?

• 1:46:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:46:57Chris Ryan?

  Cause you leave LA?

• 1:46:58Speaker 01

  I'm out, like I'm out. I'm away from y'all. Like legit, like I, we all had the same dream. We dreamed of this guy with this fuck, done, gone, like calling Matt Barnes.

• 1:47:10Chris Ryan?

  There's no king kate in you. Yeah.

• 1:47:12Speaker 01

  Like some, like something's going on. I'm out of here. And like you, they just stayed around till they fucked around and found out.

• 1:47:19Bill Simmons?

  I think I'd die if I'm Rod in Tina's room. Oh. I'm just like, take me out, dude. I'm, I'm not recovering from that.

• 1:47:25Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah. No way. I would not have even, I don't even know if I would have.

• 1:47:29Speaker 01

  Cause you would have gone to sleep on purpose.

• 1:47:30Bill Simmons?

  I'm just like, just.

• 1:47:31Chris Ryan?

  If Rod was a survivor, he made a run for it. You know what I mean? Like he didn't.

• 1:47:35Speaker 01

  Barefoot, being tracked down.

• 1:47:37Bill Simmons?

  Picking nits. What's your biggest picking nits here?

• 1:47:39Chris Ryan?

  The sleep doctor who knows nothing about dreams. So when Marge is like, what are dreams anyway, doctor? He's like, mysteries, incredible body hocus pocus. I'm like, you run a sleep clinic. If that's like the fucking answer you have.

• 1:47:53Bill Simmons?

  That's the number one question he gets.

• 1:47:55Chris Ryan?

  This is like, I wonder if this is like Mike McDaniel with the Chargers where they're like, how do we run this offense? He's like, I don't know. It's, he worked with two of them for a couple of years. Yeah. Uh, I also don't understand how Nancy has independent jail visitation privileges. Cause she goes down and sees Rod the first time. It's like,

• 1:48:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:12Chris Ryan?

  Why are they letting a teenager go visit a murder suspect? And.

• 1:48:16Bill Simmons?

  The most violent murder the town's had in ten years.

• 1:48:19Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. The last one is like, I, I don't know if this jumped out at you guys, but I guess, I feel like the last twenty minutes kind of breaks some of the logic of the movie in that Nancy, Freddy is now attacking Nancy in waking life. Like Nancy's not asleep when the tongue comes out of the phone, right?

• 1:48:35Speaker 01

  That is the biggest picking nit. Well, there is a theory on that.

• 1:48:39Chris Ryan?

  Is that she's the bridge and she's a.

• 1:48:41Speaker 01

  The theory is that during that time, she's experiencing something called hypogenic hallucination to where.

• 1:48:48Chris Ryan?

  Are you making this up as you go along? This is your, your.

• 1:48:51Bill Simmons?

  He knows more than the K I institute sleep doctor.

• 1:48:53Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:53Speaker 01

  No, I'm serious.

• 1:48:54Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:48:54Speaker 01

  There, there's a theory um, that I saw on the YouTube video, that she is experiencing something called hypogenic hallucination, which is where you're in a halfway dream like state. And Freddy in that state will be able to have.

• 1:49:11Chris Ryan?

  Can get you.

• 1:49:12Speaker 01

  A little bit of power, but not like the full power. Cause you're asleep, but you're not really asleep.

• 1:49:18Bill Simmons?

  Picking nits. Did you have any?

• 1:49:21Speaker 01

  So my only picking nit is, well, number one, my picking nit is if Freddy gets brought into the real world, then he's in the real world.

• 1:49:30Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:30Speaker 01

  And not believing in him is not gonna make him go away.

• 1:49:33Bill Simmons?

  Very good point.

• 1:49:34Speaker 01

  So that, that is a picking nit. And then other than that is just the fact that like she turns into the Navy SEAL. I've said that several times already. There's no explanation as to why that.

• 1:49:41Bill Simmons?

  Freddy comes back in the real world, like, I don't know, Morton Downey Jr. Show probably does the tour. Peraldo? Picking nits. Why does Glenn dress like he's playing golf in Greenwich, Connecticut later or something? What's up with that? That one outfit he has with like the blue Nike vest?

• 1:49:59Chris Ryan?

  It's awesome though.

• 1:50:00Bill Simmons?

  Did you notice this? Glenn's clothes?

• 1:50:02Chris Ryan?

  It's very preppy. Yeah.

• 1:50:03Speaker 01

  It's preppy. Yeah.

• 1:50:04Bill Simmons?

  But over the top, like.

• 1:50:05Speaker 01

  It's like Morse.

• 1:50:06Bill Simmons?

  Crazy preppy. Uh, Tina has, or I'm sorry, Nancy, her best friend dies. Rod escapes. Goes to school the next day?

• 1:50:15Chris Ryan?

  This is the craziest thing that happens in the movie where she's just like, it's really important to stay busy, mother.

• 1:50:19Bill Simmons?

  I got a nine o'clock English class. I gotta.

• 1:50:22Chris Ryan?

  The entire town would be quarantined.

• 1:50:24Speaker 01

  There's no school the next day.

• 1:50:26Bill Simmons?

  Tina's just had a blood ceiling fucking whatever the fuck happened.

• 1:50:30Speaker 01

  Counselors that are coming to the school. They're gonna talk about it if in fact anyone actually goes.

• 1:50:34Bill Simmons?

  How about this?

• 1:50:35Speaker 01

  Neighborhood.

• 1:50:35Bill Simmons?

  For the week.

• 1:50:36Speaker 01

  No, neighborhood vigil on the news. The community is coming together to deal with this horrible, horrible thing that's happening.

• 1:50:41Chris Ryan?

  Does the dad use her as bait? Or is that just what she accuses him of doing?

• 1:50:45Speaker 01

  She accuses him of, I think he was actually doing it though.

• 1:50:47Chris Ryan?

  Okay. Cause he was like, I didn't think you'd be going to school.

• 1:50:49Bill Simmons?

  I had Rod as a nitpick. Just hands covered in blood the next day. He didn't wash out. He, where was he gonna go? I don't know. Get like a faucet.

• 1:50:57Chris Ryan?

  Go to a creek.

• 1:50:58Bill Simmons?

  He's gonna have, aren't you gonna, and you're still carrying your switchblade? You're the fucking dumbest. At some, at some point, are you like, oh, man?

• 1:51:05Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I'm in trouble.

• 1:51:05Bill Simmons?

  Gotta at least get rid of something. We have a funeral scene for Rod, but not Tina?

• 1:51:12Bill Simmons?

  Where was the Tina funeral?

• 1:51:13Chris Ryan?

  She was still in Vegas. She was on a roll at Caesar's. Yeah.

• 1:51:17Bill Simmons?

  Back to the sack.

• 1:51:20Bill Simmons?

  Freddy got off twenty child murders because they screwed up a search warrant?

• 1:51:24Speaker 01

  Just bring the case again.

• 1:51:26Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:27Speaker 01

  Just bring, just.

• 1:51:28Bill Simmons?

  Can you imagine the newspaper coverage of this one?

• 1:51:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:51:31Bill Simmons?

  Back in the streets.

• 1:51:32Chris Ryan?

  So that's not double jeopardy. You can't.

• 1:51:33Speaker 01

  Well, here's the thing. Was Freddy convicted and was in jail and then they let him out? Was this a happen, something that happened in the trial?

• 1:51:42Chris Ryan?

  I think it's trial. I think he had like a mistrial.

• 1:51:43Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:51:44Chris Ryan?

  There was improper evidence.

• 1:51:45Bill Simmons?

  It's like, you're free to go Fred Krueger.

• 1:51:47Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:47Speaker 01

  I just think that they, I.

• 1:51:48Chris Ryan?

  And then Fred is like, cool. I'll just go back to my boiler room where I usually hang out.

• 1:51:52Speaker 01

  And they, they got him. That's what they.

• 1:51:55Bill Simmons?

  The scream, when she's screaming near the end, the cops don't care. It's just weird. And then my number one nitpick, she finds Glenn's headphones at the end in the final dramatic showdown scene. And his headphones have Glenn on the side.

• 1:52:09Chris Ryan?

  It's kinda sick.

• 1:52:11Bill Simmons?

  Who the fuck is naming their two, two dollar headphones?

• 1:52:14Speaker 01

  Unless.

• 1:52:15Bill Simmons?

  These were not nice headphones.

• 1:52:16Speaker 01

  Unless he actually is on the football team. If he's on the football team.

• 1:52:23Chris Ryan?

  He doesn't want anybody else to take him.

• 1:52:24Speaker 01

  He might have his name on his stuff.

• 1:52:27Bill Simmons?

  Interesting.

• 1:52:27Speaker 01

  Because.

• 1:52:28Chris Ryan?

  Well, it's also interesting because these are for seemingly only children.

• 1:52:31Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:52:32Chris Ryan?

  So does, if Glenn had a little brother or an older brother, it would be like, this is Glenn's shit. Don't touch my headphones.

• 1:52:38Speaker 01

  But if he's on the team, he's got his stuff in there. He's like, who's taking, he might put his name on his shit. So nobody steals his headphones.

• 1:52:43Chris Ryan?

  I got another Glenn nitpick.

• 1:52:44Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:45Chris Ryan?

  Did anyone else have trouble with the fact that like the end of the movie hinges on the fact that a sixteen year old boy just can't stay up until midnight to save his life? Uh, I mean, yes. Yeah.

• 1:52:54Bill Simmons?

  He just, he just can't get to midnight. As if he's not up to midnight every night of his fucking life.

• 1:52:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:58Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. That's a great point.

• 1:52:59Chris Ryan?

  Maybe he's getting up at five and doing like Mark Wahlberg workouts and stuff, but yeah. Should have made it like 4am or something.

• 1:53:07Bill Simmons?

  He's Wahlberg in it.

• 1:53:08Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, he's like, I get up, I have salmon, I do a run, play nine holes.

• 1:53:11Speaker 03

  Cold plunge, yeah.

• 1:53:13Bill Simmons?

  Sequel, prequel, streamer, all black cast, spinoff, remaker, Untouchable. We've done almost all of these. All black cast caught my attention.

• 1:53:19Chris Ryan?

  They did a TV show where it was basically like Freddy's nightmares and it was like a Twilight Zone thing, right?

• 1:53:25Speaker 01

  I missed the picking, Nick, but yeah, my bad, yeah.

• 1:53:28Chris Ryan?

  Go ahead.

• 1:53:29Speaker 01

  Did anybody investigate Freddy's death?

• 1:53:32Chris Ryan?

  You really, justice for Freddy.

• 1:53:34Speaker 01

  Justice for Freddy. Did anybody, did anybody?

• 1:53:37Chris Ryan?

  Why don't you investigate?

• 1:53:38Speaker 01

  Did anybody investigate Freddy's death? The people in the town got together and burned him alive.

• 1:53:47Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:53:47Speaker 01

  And they all went free. Did anybody investigate? Who cared enough about this American citizen? Who, like, did anybody investigate his?

• 1:53:56Bill Simmons?

  I think they narrowed the investigation down to the 20 parents of the murdered kids.

• 1:54:01Speaker 01

  Well, I'm saying though, like, somebody has to answer for it.

• 1:54:03Chris Ryan?

  If you went to Rachel Lindsay and you were like, Rachel, there's a new, I have a new mission for this show. We need to exonerate a man who was wrongly accused of child murder. And you were like, it's a man named Fred Kruger.

• 1:54:15Bill Simmons?

  Not a molester, just a murderer.

• 1:54:17Chris Ryan?

  How long before Rachel was like, like Nightmare on Elm Street Freddy Krueger? Or do you think she would actually like go along with it for a while?

• 1:54:24Speaker 01

  So what you guys don't know is every Halloween, because Rachel knows I'm scared of Freddy, she dresses up like Freddy and she pops out at me at different times on the pod. So she would know.

• 1:54:31Chris Ryan?

  She would know.

• 1:54:32Speaker 01

  She would know. So she would know that.

• 1:54:34Chris Ryan?

  But I'm just saying. Rachel sometimes like has a pop culture like blind spot from time to time.

• 1:54:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, you get at her.

• 1:54:39Chris Ryan?

  No, you get at her. You get at her. She scares me.

• 1:54:47Bill Simmons?

  Is this movie better than Wayne Jenkins, Fergie the Florist, or anyone else here?

• 1:54:52Chris Ryan?

  You know, I was doing a lot of research recently, going back several years into the Stephen A. Smith archives. And so I just thought if Stephen A. was a part of Nightmare, it would be so much more entertaining. Freddy Krueger is the one who's lying. I have interviewed Freddy Krueger. His rookie year, I interviewed him near Elm Street. I interviewed him years ago when we were in Orlando for SportsCenter. And I've talked to him on several occasions, literally within the last year. We've run into each other in the dream realm and we've also seen each other at 4040 because he's being represented by Roc Nation.

• 1:55:28Speaker 03

  Oh shit.

• 1:55:30Chris Ryan?

  I just love the idea of him getting deep into like telling Freddy not to, not to lie about him anymore.

• 1:55:36Speaker 01

  What about animated Stephen A.?

• 1:55:39Chris Ryan?

  We usually do solid.

• 1:55:40Speaker 01

  And over 20 kids going missing. And Freddy Krueger is the one at the center of the investigation. Did I say anything about that, Freddy?

• 1:55:50Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I like when he does that.

• 1:55:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, when he does that.

• 1:55:52Bill Simmons?

  Lower voice.

• 1:55:52Speaker 01

  When he goes up and then he comes back down. 20 kids, that's a lot of kids.

• 1:55:56Bill Simmons?

  You don't want to see me, Freddy Krueger. I'll haunt you.

• 1:56:01Bill Simmons?

  I was, I was thinking Stephen A. the day after Rod is found dead in the jail cell. I said some things about Rod on this show a few days ago. And it turns out I was wrong. Rod did not commit a murder. No, but I had Byron Mayo for this. Byron, Byron Mayo, what was your line?

• 1:56:21Speaker 03

  You coming back to the sack or what?

• 1:56:23Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Byron Mayo as, or as the police from Officer and Gentleman being just with, with the drunk MILF mom.

• 1:56:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:56:33Bill Simmons?

  Ah, and there's a lot of tension in this house. I know a couple of ways to diffuse it. Hey, we can all sleep like babies tonight.

• 1:56:44Speaker 03

  What about if Yaxel Lendaborg lived on Elm Street?

• 1:56:47Chris Ryan?

  Freddy ain't shit.

• 1:56:48Speaker 03

  He's like, I saw him in my dreams. He ain't scary. I told him he was a bitch. He keeps complaining.

• 1:56:52Speaker 01

  Lost all respect for Freddy.

• 1:56:55Bill Simmons?

  I love that. I loved Yaxel. Just one Oscar who gets it. It has to be the stunt man at the end. It just has to.

• 1:57:01Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:57:02Bill Simmons?

  Okay, best stunt, right?

• 1:57:03Speaker 01

  Best stunt.

• 1:57:04Bill Simmons?

  He was on fire for two minutes.

• 1:57:05Chris Ryan?

  I mean, I had Wes.

• 1:57:06Speaker 03

  I had Wes Craven.

• 1:57:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, all right. Probably an answerable questions. I only have one. Do you have any?

• 1:57:12Chris Ryan?

  Do you think that John Hughes saw this and got an idea for Home Alone?

• 1:57:16Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 1:57:19Chris Ryan?

  Of turning the house into a trap?

• 1:57:20Bill Simmons?

  It's unanswerable. I have no idea.

• 1:57:21Speaker 03

  Unanswerable, yeah.

• 1:57:22Bill Simmons?

  It's a pretty good one.

• 1:57:24Bill Simmons?

  I had, why did we go through this phase in horror movies and rom coms, which might still be going? Where everybody has a neighbor that they're also romantically involved with, that they can see from the window of their bedroom and they could see across.

• 1:57:36Chris Ryan?

  This is why they.

• 1:57:36Bill Simmons?

  Has this happened to one person in real life?

• 1:57:38Chris Ryan?

  You watch this movie, you never worry about this. And it saves you all the scenes of Heather has to get in a car and drive to fucking.

• 1:57:45Speaker 03

  Because it's easy to shoot.

• 1:57:46Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:47Chris Ryan?

  It's jeans.

• 1:57:47Bill Simmons?

  Even 13 Going on 30 had this. This is Love and Basketball. They live next door to each other. Every horror movie, they did it. It follows, they had it.

• 1:57:56Speaker 01

  Do you know anyone that it's true for? Like, like that as the girl next door, I loved her the whole time.

• 1:58:01Bill Simmons?

  I don't know one person.

• 1:58:02Speaker 01

  But it's got to be that because the girl next door is a thing.

• 1:58:06Speaker 01

  The girl next door is a thing. It's like a thing. It's a control.

• 1:58:07Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but it's like, is it literally the girl next door or just a girl you went to like high school with or whatever? Yeah.

• 1:58:14Bill Simmons?

  The memorabilia you'd most want from this movie? Got to be the glove, right?

• 1:58:18Speaker 01

  The glove or the hat?

• 1:58:19Bill Simmons?

  The hat?

• 1:58:20Speaker 01

  Could be the hat, but the glove or the hat?

• 1:58:22Chris Ryan?

  Glenn's TV. I'd like to introduce that to my marriage. It's just like getting to bed with Phoebe and then all of a sudden I put a 25 pound television in the bed with us.

• 1:58:32Bill Simmons?

  In the research, they said Heather Langenkamp took the, they made a special phone for when the tongue stuck out of the phone. She just took it home.

• 1:58:39Chris Ryan?

  Well, that's what she used.

• 1:58:40Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Finstock, Mr. Miyagi were best, worst life lesson.

• 1:58:47Bill Simmons?

  Maybe don't get pounded, pounded vodka at home every night. Maybe listen to your kids.

• 1:58:52Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I think listen to your kids.

• 1:58:53Bill Simmons?

  Listen to your kids?

• 1:58:54Chris Ryan?

  Listen to your kids. Your kids are trying to tell you something.

• 1:58:56Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. What do you have for double feature choice?

• 1:58:57Chris Ryan?

  I got Dream Warriors because it's basically the sequel to this. It's basically the direct.

• 1:59:02Bill Simmons?

  I had New Nightmare.

• 1:59:04Speaker 01

  New Nightmare.

• 1:59:04Chris Ryan?

  Okay, yeah.

• 1:59:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, I have Freddy's Dead. Because you get Freddy's kid in it. I love Freddy's Dead.

• 1:59:12Bill Simmons?

  And we have Wes Craven for who won the movie?

• 1:59:14Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:59:14Bill Simmons?

  Without that. Craig.

• 1:59:15Speaker 01

  Actually, no, I mean, well, you have to, yeah, yeah.

• 1:59:18Bill Simmons?

  Craig, what do you got?

• 1:59:18Speaker 03

  I loved it. My favorite of, of Halloween month or horror month. I thought it was great. I like, I like this movie particularly because it felt like, it feels like you're on a ride at a theme park. Like this movie feels Halloweeny to me and that's why I like it. Like I'm realizing that I'm much more drawn to like holiday horror type movies. Because there really are just two completely different types. Like you have Hereditary, which is its own thing. And then you have like Halloween and Friday the 13th and Nightmare on Elm Street, which is like holiday horror. Where it feels like you're just walking through a haunted house.

• 1:59:49Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:49Speaker 03

  And I've realized I really actually like that.

• 1:59:51Chris Ryan?

  Rather than like real life horror.

• 1:59:53Speaker 03

  Like grim dreadful horror, which just, they're just two different genres to me.

• 1:59:56Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:58Speaker 03

  The one, the thing that I thought about the most while watching this movie was Stranger Things. Stranger Things feels heavily influenced by this one.

• 2:00:04Chris Ryan?

  Dream Warriors especially is basically like, yeah.

• 2:00:07Speaker 03

  I mean, all the way down to like the music. We didn't talk about it, but like there's like kind of spooky techno music in this movie that is like very Stranger Things. Yeah, I mean, it's so well directed. I did not expect it to be so artistic and inventive and all that stuff.

• 2:00:20Bill Simmons?

  It's funny, my wife said that about Stranger Things too. Because she was like, I don't understand why you like this movie, but you wouldn't like Stranger Things.

• 2:00:26Chris Ryan?

  It's funny, all those movies that you mentioned that we've done over this month have been grouped together in different ways, even though they happen in different phases of horror's history. But I don't know if there's a movie that is this inventive, given the budget. You know, you'd like, they're a low budget and you're like, oh man, I can't believe Carpenter did that just with like synth music and camera lenses or whatever. This is like pretty high level special effects and filmmaking stuff going on for the entire movie.

• 2:00:55Bill Simmons?

  And well acted.

• 2:00:55Chris Ryan?

  And when you watch the behind the scenes documentary, you guys got to check it out on YouTube. You're like, oh, they shot this in an alley. Or they shot this in like, you know, like.

• 2:01:04Speaker 03

  Set pieces are remarkable.

• 2:01:05Chris Ryan?

  A power station, abandoned power station in downtown LA and turned it into the boiler room. It's really impressive.

• 2:01:11Speaker 01

  But also when the movie is like based in something that's high concept. What that forces you to do is to continuously challenge yourself shot after shot. To go to the limits of your creativity, which is what they did. And when you listen to the documentary, you watch the documentary and you get a glimpse into the creative process. Like Craven was just never satisfied with any corners being cut.

• 2:01:38Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:38Speaker 01

  At all. He wanted the most he could get out of every single effect. And everyone up and down from the effects guys, they were trying to do something that hadn't been done before. They were trying to like find, answer the problem of the scene. And they all took great, great pride in it, even years and years after.

• 2:01:58Bill Simmons?

  Nightmare on Elm Street. Classic. If we did one other for rewatchables, which one would you pick? Third one?

• 2:02:04Speaker 01

  It would have to be.

• 2:02:05Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah, Dream Warriors.

• 2:02:06Speaker 01

  Yeah. Dream Warriors is like, it's, it just, it becomes so expansive. Like you have the drug events, you have two bona fide stars in the movie, Patricia Arquette, Laurence Fishburne. Them realizing their powers, you know, you just.

• 2:02:22Chris Ryan?

  AKA Bill Maher.

• 2:02:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:02:23Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, exactly like Bill Maher.

• 2:02:25Chris Ryan?

  He looks like him.

• 2:02:25Speaker 01

  Right? So you have the Freddy scene, Saxon comes back.

• 2:02:31Chris Ryan?

  Yep.

• 2:02:31Speaker 01

  You got to bury Freddy's bone. Just, it's amazing.

• 2:02:34Bill Simmons?

  The problem with that one and then Halloween four, the next year is that both of those movies were, they did pretty well. And then we just got sequels for six straight years after, which Scream eventually kind of flipped the script back and we started making movies again, but.

• 2:02:48Chris Ryan?

  I think it's probably all for the best that we are now seemingly in an era of like, let's try an original one rather than rebooting. I'm sure, you know, we just did Crystal Lake, they just did Carrie. Like these things are constantly going to be in the culture. But I don't, I don't know that we're going to get another Nightmare on Elm Street and eight times.

• 2:03:04Bill Simmons?

  Long legs. Kick it along legs. Uh, thanks to Craig, thanks to How, thanks to Eduardo and Jack and Chris back in the Sycamore Studios, your favorite place.

• 2:03:16Speaker 01

  I just left there.

• 2:03:16Bill Simmons?

  Sycamore is banging.

• 2:03:17Speaker 01

  Going crazy.

• 2:03:18Bill Simmons?

  It's hopping. Uh, thanks to everybody who stayed with us on Netflix. We'll be back next week on the rewatchables.