Pod Insights The Rest Is Football Brilliant England battle through Mexico test to the Quarter Finals About this episode Gary Lineker, Micah Richards, Brad Friedel, Joe Hart, Alex Aljoe and Aitch react to a famous England win over Mexico at the Azteca. They pick out huge performances from the likes of Jordan Pickford, Jude Bellingham and Anthony Gordon as they overcame a hostile atmosphere and a red card to finish the match 3-2 victors. After defeating Brazil, all eyes turn to Norway who await Thomas Tuchel and his men in Miami for the Quarter Finals.
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Transcript 0:10 Speaker 00 Hello and welcome to The Rest Is Football. We're all in a great mood because England have made it to the quarter finals. We'll be talking all about it with Micah Richards, Joe Hart, Brad Friedel, Alex Aljo and H the Rapper. Don't forget, as always, if you'd prefer to watch the show, we're on Netflix every day.
0:36 Speaker 00 H, what a day to pick to come in!
0:38 Speaker 01 Good first day that, I know. Good first day that. Tense. Anxiety for about 111 minutes, however long it was. But we got through it and yeah, I've had a good day.
0:48 Speaker 00 I think Alex, at my age, I can't cope with things like that. I think it's aged me 10 years, which is not great when you're already ancient.
0:55 Speaker 02 No, crazy but so good, right? They win the World Cup now, surely, after that, surely!
1:00 Speaker 00 Don't, don't, don't do that!
1:02 Speaker 02 Don't say it!
1:02 Speaker 00 Don't get ahead of yourself. That was amazing at the end defensively. England hanging on, obviously 10 men. I mean, I think when you're looking at it, you think, God, they're really struggling a little bit. But that altitude, when you're not acclimatized, it's very difficult. I thought they showed incredible heart.
1:21 Speaker 03 First, I'm so happy. Seriously.
1:24 Speaker 00 Because you were telling them.
1:26 Speaker 03 I'm just so happy because Mexico couldn't break down 10 men. I'm so happy that Mexico lost, more so than England won, sorry, but that's just how I feel. No, England were brilliant. They were defensively, I think, not going down a man helped them, but actually just being able to run a bit less because of the altitude. I thought the substitutes that came on were brilliant. I thought Bellingham and Pickford were both absolutely immense.
1:50 Speaker 00 Yeah. And he won the, what did he call it? The superior
1:54 Speaker 02 The Spom!
1:54 Speaker 00 The match, that Spom.
1:56 Speaker 02 We had a joke last time, didn't we, at the Club World Cup?
1:58 Speaker 00 But Jude Bellingham, I mean, he won that award and I think deserved. I mean, he is, I think, everything perhaps that England has been missing over recent years. I know he's been In recent years but he's now coming into his prime. I mean he's an extraordinary athlete.
2:14 Speaker 02 Yeah, he's showing a lot of leadership isn't he as well. I think he's taken a while as well to earn Thomas Tuchel's trust.
2:19 Speaker 00 Yeah.
2:20 Speaker 02 It hasn't been straightforward, has it? There were times when a lot of people were saying that Thomas Tuchel didn't even want him in the squad, which is crazy to think, but he's certainly earned his trust now, hasn't he?
2:30 Speaker 00 Yeah, H, I think before the start of the tournament, everyone was going, "Oh, I'm not sure whether it's going to be Bellingham or Rodgers." I mean with all due respect, Rodgers is, I think, fabulous and he played his part when he came on, but Bellingham's a monster.
2:43 Speaker 01 Yeah, he's a bit of a different beast. He's a bit of a different beast, isn't he? I think when you're playing big games like that, there's only one man to be in that position, I think. Again, no disrespect to Morgan at all.
2:53 Speaker 00 Yeah.
2:54 Speaker 01 Because he's amazing in his own way, but I think them little moments there, the little runs that Jude makes when we're on the attack are just different level.
3:03 Speaker 00 I look at him and I see a nine as well, you know, Brad. I see, I mean, he's so good, I mean, arriving in the box at the right time. You're probably describing him more as a kind of Frank Lampard of midfielders that runs in, but he's also more dynamic and he makes incredible tackles defensively, covers every yard of the pitch. Patrick Vieira, funny enough, said, "I think he needs to kind of pick his moments to do that." But I don't think, I'm not sure. I think, I'm quite happy with the way he's going all over the place.
3:35 Speaker 03 He's like an eight, nine, 10, all wrapped in the one.
3:38 Speaker 00 Yeah. Thankfully, it was relatively cool after the rain and the delay. But it's very, very difficult. I know I played in Mexico, I played in the World Cup when we had the time to acclimatise, which wasn't quite as bad because we'd had a few weeks prior to the tournament in Colorado. But also the year before, we went there on a tour just to see what it was like. We played without any... And it's really, really hard.
4:06 Speaker 02 I can't believe you haven't said it yet, Al T Jude.
4:12 Speaker 00 You want to out-pomble?
4:14 Speaker 02 I'm not taking you on. I'm not taking you on. I'll leave it there.
4:19 Speaker 00 But I mean, he's... He's a leader, isn't he?
4:22 Speaker 01 Yeah. Especially that first goal, the way, I'm not gonna, I won't get into detail because I can't explain things very well, but the way, the way, the way he's ran in and out into that box and Harry Kane's done the exact opposite and the ball's ended up falling to him, it was, there's no way they have not practised that. If that was by chance, that's fucking unreal.
4:42 Speaker 00 No, I think he explained it very well, but they just know what to do in those certain certain.
4:48 Speaker 01 I, I was almost getting a little bit mad at Jude certain parts of the game because I felt like we was getting broken down on the defence when he was playing too high up, but I'm kind of eating my words now.
5:00 Speaker 03 The only difficulty tonight's game for, for them was when they went 2-0 up and this is, they had to get to half time at 2-0, then Mexico would have imploded.
5:12 Speaker 02 It was never going to be that easy for England.
5:15 Speaker 03 But they had the opportunity, it was, it was right there, because they had quieted down the crowd, which was really difficult to do in Mexico, you've been there.
5:22 Speaker 02 Yeah, I've covered two matches there and I was thinking, I fear for England.
5:25 Speaker 00 You did two matches there.
5:26 Speaker 02 Yeah, two matches there and it was, it was all Mexico, all Mexican fans so loud, I've never experienced an atmosphere like it, and I was thinking, if England get here, I'm, I'm worried for them. They'd only ever lost two competitive matches in that stadium. Now it's three.
5:40 Speaker 03 But you can get them to turn, that's, that's the thing, we've done it, I mean, America, they don't, they don't like us when we go down there and play, but you can get them to turn and England was just about there.
5:49 Speaker 02 Yeah, and they hadn't conceded, had they? No.
5:51 Speaker 00 Well, Mexico conceded more goals today than in all the previous 10 World Cup games that they've played as Azteca. I mean, that's a tough, tough place, place to go. I actually thought they, they, they were, they were very good and I thought they, you know, they, they were better than I thought football wise and they created a lot and they were very dangerous. I'm sorry, I'm sorry Brad, I know you've got a little bit of a rivalry going there.
6:14 Speaker 03 You said Mexico and very good in the same sentence.
6:17 Speaker 00 I thought that, I mean, I think, I think we have to give them some, some credit because, you know, when you're playing at home in front of your own crowd as well, and you go 2-0 down, that could have ended up as an embarrassment. You know, we'll talk about Brazil later, but they've gone out, it's not their home game, but you know, they'll get a lot of criticism. I don't think that Mexican team will get any criticism from their fans. I think they, they fought and they fought and they fought and they did them proud.
6:45 Speaker 02 And those scenes we've seen down in the Reforma, I think there were 800,000 there when I was there. I wonder whether it will be the same party atmosphere this evening, proud of what they've achieved at this World Cup. I don't know, I'm not there.
6:57 Speaker 00 I don't know, we'll have to, have to wait and see.
7:01 Speaker 03 I think the goalkeeper will get a bit of abuse. This is just the way they are. I think the press will be hard for giving away the penalty. I think they'll give, I don't know, I can't remember who missed the header, but when it's dropped down, I think they'll give them a little bit of abuse. And I think they'll question the coach. That's just how it is down there.
7:17 Speaker 00 Yeah, it's difficult. Right, I'm going to introduce, hey Micah, Joe.
7:27 Speaker 00 You just look at them.
7:31 Speaker 04 Guys, now that is a performance.
7:32 Speaker 00 What a performance, wasn't it, Val? Now we're cooking. Now we're cooking, we're on the way. See, I just told you, you're just so negative all the time.
7:40 Speaker 03 Yeah, he was, he was negative.
7:42 Speaker 00 So negative.
7:43 Speaker 03 You were positive. Joe, you were positive. You wanted them to win.
7:47 Speaker 04 You were just scared of upsetting anyone, aren't you? You remember?
7:50 Speaker 00 Me?
7:51 Speaker 04 Naldo, you know, you criticised him once and then, no, Gaz.
7:55 Speaker 00 Oh, okay.
7:56 Speaker 04 Criticised him once and then he didn't speak to you anymore, Gaz, you know? You just, you just sit on that fence.
8:02 Speaker 00 Sit on the fence?
8:03 Speaker 04 Proper.
8:03 Speaker 00 Me? I used to work with you before I fell off the fence.
8:11 Speaker 00 Mike, can you tell me about the game? Your overall thoughts on, what was a truly extraordinary game of football?
8:18 Speaker 04 Honestly, England were outstanding in that first half. All the things that we talked about on the pod, from the start, in terms of being dynamic, in terms of having that cohesion, in terms of being aggressive, you know, and really believing in themselves. I thought they showed everything tonight, from start to finish. Obviously, second half, it was more about that togetherness and commitment and tactical nous from Tuchel, who we've mentioned many times in terms of in-game substitutions. But I just thought everything in the game was perfect. Although, obviously, Kwanzaa got sent off, who I thought was a little bit unfortunate.
9:02 Speaker 04 He got the ball, but then it was the follow-through, so I understand why he had to get a red card. It was what, serious foul play? So, yeah, all in all, I'm just absolutely delighted for them because it feels though we've been waiting for that moment and we knew they had it in them, but we've seen them play well under Southgate at times and get to finals, but that was a sort of a Tuchel-like performance, which we expected to see maybe a little bit earlier, but it came at the right time and the atmosphere, Joe, come on!
9:36 Speaker 05 Oh, I would do anything to be in that stadium and be a part of that team. The togetherness they showed and they've talked about, they banged on about that. Even the way he's interviewed, I'm not sure if you've heard how he interviewed after the game, but he's creating us against the world. But that was a true movie in there tonight. I think the guys have left everything out on the pitch. Amazing goals, defensively, big Dan Burn coming on, Jed Spence, when we thought he was injured, showing up at the very end with some big tackles.
10:02 Speaker 04 John Stones!
10:03 Speaker 05 Magnificent performance, they could be so, they make you so proud to watch that game.
10:07 Speaker 04 Johnny, Johnny Stone!
10:11 Speaker 04 Johnny, Johnny Stone!
10:15 Speaker 00 Joe, how about Jordan Pickford though as well? We've got two goalkeepers here. I thought, you know, there've been a couple of people a bit critical. He wasn't by his ordinary standards. He'd made a couple of mistakes maybe. I thought he was absolutely outstanding tonight. A goalkeeper's perspective please, Joe.
10:32 Speaker 05 Gary, from the moment that he made that save early down to his left and now, as well as being a good save, it was the composure he showed, just a great header from Raul Jimenez. And to meet that on the half volley like he did and get such a good hand on it, I knew he was on it. These are the kinds of occasions that he shines. These are his moments. He wears those three lines with so much pride and he's so proud to represent his country and be England's number one, and so he should be. And as the game went on, he made big save before half time and then the old school stuff that I'm sure Brad you're going to appreciate. When that ball comes in the box and you hear the goalkeeper saying, keepers, it's the best feeling ever for a defender. And not only that, he came and he met every single one and I loved it in the 102nd minute, whatever it was.
11:14 Speaker 05 He got that big left hook on it at the end and I thought, yeah, this is your moment.
11:18 Speaker 04 Can I just ask you though, because Alan didn't want to start Jude in the tournament. Now look at him. Who else? Who else? He's constantly in the group talking about, well, I call this team, I call that team. He doesn't want to even start Jude, you know? And look at him now, hey, who else?
11:37 Speaker 05 That's you and Alan's drama, that. I'm just trying to give the goalkeeper's perspective.
11:41 Speaker 00 Stay out of that one, Joe. Stay out of that one. We'll talk about, I want to get Brad on Jordan Pickford as well because we did a thing before the start of the tournament. You said to me, we were talking about the Golden Glove and we both went Pickford.
11:57 Speaker 03 I don't know about you, Joe, if you can even comment on this, I know I can. I wasn't a massive Pickford fan for a little while in the beginning of his career and the last four or five years, he's won me over. He's been brilliant and he's played in a struggling Everton side at times and he's made a lot of really good saves. And he's won me over for sure. Tonight, that's as good as I've ever seen him command his box. But time after time after time. And it's hard there, I mean, really is. The ball flies differently, that's the first time he would have seen it. Every punch he got right, every catch he got right. He was wasting time at the right times, he was speeding things up at the right times. His distribution was brilliant.
12:40 Speaker 03 I thought his whole match control was just outstanding.
12:44 Speaker 05 I understand why people had their questions over him because he's not actually physically imposing, you know, he's obviously, he can be quite erratic in how he behaves. But what has won people over, and rightly so, because these are all things around him. He actually has performed ever since he's come on at this level. When he was at Sunderland, he earned that move to Everton. And he makes massive saves for his teams. And when you get to know him and when you get to understand him, like I say, people who don't necessarily understand him, see all these kind of antics and touching and rolling around on the floor. That's what makes him great. And it's not as pleasing on the eye, but that's Jordan Pickford, he's not that pleasing on the eye. But my god, he's effective and you can rely on him and you can trust him. And in the big moments, he honestly wants to stand there and be that guy. And that's massive to have in a team.
13:29 Speaker 05 And to be the England number one for so long and to keep improving, he's keeping improving in that position. And stepping up in a big, I'm so pleased he had that night tonight. I'm so pleased for him and he fully deserves every bit of praise he's gonna get.
13:46 Speaker 00 I want to ask you, H, about another H. Yes. Harry Kane, who tonight equaled another record of mine, Micah. Most knockout goals, he's now equaled six knockout goals. Obviously, it took him two games longer, but that's alright.
14:06 Speaker 04 Seriously, seriously guys. It's getting embarrassing now. Have a night off for you. The rest is Gary Lineker. Just do your own part and you can talk about yourself for the whole 40 minutes.
14:20 Speaker 00 I can't help having so many fucking records, Micah, but they're all going, okay?
14:32 Speaker 00 Hang on a minute, fuck off. There you go, Bosch.
14:37 Speaker 00 Oh dear. I mean, he's something else though, isn't he?
14:40 Speaker 01 Oh yeah, different grade.
14:41 Speaker 00 There you go, I'll bring him back.
14:42 Speaker 01 Yeah, bring him back.
14:44 Speaker 00 I'm bringing him back because it's late.
14:47 Speaker 02 Still there?
14:48 Speaker 01 Yeah, no, he's absolutely different with it. Hundred million per cent. Even as a United fan, even just in general throughout the season, without, away from England and World Cup games and all that, I don't actually see much of Harry Kane. I don't really watch many other teams other than United really, so I just get glimpses every now and again.
15:06 Speaker 03 So it's been boring the last few years?
15:09 Speaker 02 The Champions League is back.
15:11 Speaker 01 Yeah, the Champions League is back, but we'll talk about that another time.
15:14 Speaker 00 Tomorrow.
15:15 Speaker 01 Yeah, as I've seen Harry Kane more recently, I'm just like, wow. Like, this is, he really is what all the hype's about, do you know what I mean? So yeah, he's the man, he's the main man right now, I think, in my eyes.
15:26 Speaker 00 Micah, let me ask you about Anthony Gordon, I thought he was terrific.
15:30 Speaker 04 Yeah, he was brilliant. And I feel as though he needed that performance because there's been a lot of talk about him and Rashford, who should start, who should come on. And that pressure going to Barcelona comes with obvious expectation. And it sometimes can be difficult to deal with that when you're playing for a team and you're not getting as much headlines. And the whole headlines coming into the tournament was about who's going to start, Rashford or Gordon. And up until this moment, he's not really produced his best stuff, but tonight, he was brilliant. The way he wanted to take people on, the way he wanted to press, the way he got the penalty, everything about his game was dynamic.
16:12 Speaker 04 And you called it, Gaz, in fairness to you, you said the game's going to open up, and Mexico did, Brad as well. He said that if England play to their best abilities, they will win the game. So kudos to you both. But I just thought his performance was a statement performance. And when you get those performances for England, it's going to do the world of good for his confidence. So he just needs to keep it going now. I was really proud of his performance today.
16:37 Speaker 00 Fantastic energy as well.
16:38 Speaker 02 I think they all want it so much, you can see it. They were working so hard, so hard. It seems like there's such a good feeling in that squad right now and some great characters, some real leaders.
16:48 Speaker 00 I think it's sometimes an atmosphere like that probably puts referee under a bit of pressure, H. Do you think he got the big decisions right? I think Anthony Gordon, that was definitely a penalty.
16:59 Speaker 01 Yeah.
16:59 Speaker 00 The Harry Kane one, maybe.
17:01 Speaker 01 Yeah, 50/50, yeah.
17:03 Speaker 00 I think that's kind of a new addition, that kind of penalty, isn't it? That we've got because of VAR. You'd never have got those before VAR. And I don't see why they have to do it, but when I saw it, I thought they will. And the Kwanzaa red card? Kwanzaa, sorry, red card.
17:19 Speaker 01 I think the red card was a sticky one because I think what Michael said before about like, you can't understand why it was a red card, however, in the same breath, you kind of want to say it was harsh at the same time.
17:30 Speaker 00 It just bounced off the top of the board and it's really unlucky. Really unlucky, I thought, but you knew.
17:36 Speaker 01 Yeah, I think it was quite 50/50 in terms of the ref decisions. I think he made some decent decisions. I also think he made some completely wrong ones as well.
17:43 Speaker 03 I thought he was poor with his first decision of the game, giving a booking to Rice after 50 seconds.
17:48 Speaker 01 Yeah.
17:48 Speaker 03 Because that sets the tone, you're going to have to give bookings out all the time. On the big decisions, unfortunately, I think he did get them right. I think it's a soft penalty, Kane, but when you look at it, he didn't touch the ball, he got the leg. The penalty, Gordon, I thought Gordon did brilliant. He got there, nipped in right before it touched the ball. But what I didn't like about him in that type of atmosphere, because it's a hostile atmosphere.
18:12 Speaker 00 Yeah.
18:13 Speaker 03 I didn't like him running up to players and he was like inciting the crowd to get them going. I think you need a ref that's going to calm things down and keep players calm. And when Lyra kept going up to him all the time, all the time, just book one of them, one time. And then it stops all that. So I don't think he did that particularly well, but the big decision's probably correct.
18:34 Speaker 00 I mean, the Kwanzaa one and then the Kane thing, it didn't have to make it an agonising laugh. It felt like about three hours, the last 20 minutes, didn't it, Joe?
18:42 Speaker 05 Honestly, it just seemed like it had everything tonight. With the hour delay before the game and then to go into the game and just absolute chaos ensued. And then to follow on from the Kwanzaa red card. England are on the back foot and as Brad touched on there, Gordon so, so sharp to win that penalty. It was a massive moment because you felt like the stadium was ready to erupt. And then it was just another counter punch, whack. Unbelievable penalty and then the game just kept coming and coming and we were talking about from a from a defensive point of view and England did make those changes I think they defended so well and I think Mexico flapped I think they panicked they ended up just lumping it into the box and that's exactly what England wanted it was either Jordan Pickford Dan Burn it was Konzer who else
19:24 Speaker 04 There was so many I thought Stones was brilliant too Gay Konzer you know
19:31 Speaker 00 Can we have a word micro on Thomas Tuchel because I think his in-game management and the things that were thrown at him were difficult but I thought his changes obviously in hindsight it's easy and you go yes they worked but I think he got them spot on don't you?
19:50 Speaker 04 Yeah I think that's why he was brought in in terms of we know we like the tactical side of the game and in the Croatia game in terms of introducing the subs that he did he could have kept it the way but he wanted to get another goal he brought on wingers and then tonight I actually thought he made the tactical change a little bit earlier early for our liking I would say just because England dropped a little bit deeper and remember the goal that they conceded against Croatia it was almost like can England deal with the crosses but when he went to a back five I think it was just perfect you know when you talk about details these are the little details that potentially could
20:35 Speaker 04 separate a Southgate to a Tuchel and that's no disrespect to Southgate it's just in certain moments of the game that's why Tuchel is so you know sought after because of his tactical nous I don't want to get too excited it is one amazing performance to deserve all the credit but it was just nice to see him make the decisions and be brave with them and not care what anyone else says you know we've talked about how England have played throughout the group and then DR Congo but actually if you look at it he said England would get better as the tournament
21:14 Speaker 04 Went on and he's proved that tonight. Mexico opened it up and you know Gordon was was good. Saka's cross, he doesn't even mention Saka. Saka's cross for Bellingham's goal was outstanding. I just feel all the pieces together just fit nicely. It was perfect and now you're starting to believe that, oh, if England perform like that, they actually have got a chance. Yes, we know France are good. Yes, we know Spain are good too. But if England could play like that, they give themselves the best possible opportunity.
21:46 Speaker 00 I'll ask you all here, the three of you here, what kind of belief do you think a result like that?
21:51 Speaker 02 So much belief. I don't know why I'm not allowed to get excited. Mika.
21:55 Speaker 00 You are allowed to get excited.
21:56 Speaker 02 Gary told me I can get excited earlier because I was trying to say it's coming home.
21:59 Speaker 00 Because the hope kills us.
22:01 Speaker 02 No, but I think we can get excited now, especially because we know it's not Brazil next. I think had it been Brazil next, maybe I wouldn't be saying that.
22:07 Speaker 00 In Miami in the heat.
22:08 Speaker 02 In Miami in the heat. Because it was cool tonight, wasn't it in Mexico?
22:11 Speaker 00 Yeah.
22:11 Speaker 02 Seventeen degrees.
22:12 Speaker 00 But there was altitude.
22:13 Speaker 02 Yeah, altitude. We've got altitude though. How many times can I say that in one programme? But I think they can beat Norway, right? We, sorry, not they.
22:22 Speaker 00 No, we's okay.
22:23 Speaker 02 We, yeah, we can beat Norway, yeah. No, I'm excited. We've got Super Tommy Tukul, Mika.
22:30 Speaker 00 Have you thrown a win?
22:31 Speaker 04 I have before. I did this morning.
22:35 Speaker 00 And how long did you live in England?
22:37 Speaker 04 Twenty-three years.
22:38 Speaker 00 Twenty-three years, yeah. So, yeah. What do you think, chances of England?
22:42 Speaker 04 Super Tommy Tukul. Super Tommy.
22:45 Speaker 02 If we've got Super Tommy Tukul.
22:49 Speaker 04 Super Tommy Tukul.
22:52 Speaker 04 Let's be positive. Let's be happy. Got a bit more positivity.
22:56 Speaker 03 This is going to make you happy.
22:58 Speaker 04 I'm buzzing.
22:59 Speaker 03 This will make you happy. What I thought England was missing was a good defensive performance in this tournament.
23:04 Speaker 00 Yeah.
23:05 Speaker 03 You know, going forward against a low block, that's a different technical, tactical issue tweaks. As we said going on in the tournament, teams are going to open up and play and that's where England's really good. They were lacking that solid defensive performance. They got it tonight. And now they also have a goalkeeper full of confidence going in. If you're going to beat France, if you're going to beat Spain, your goalkeeper's going to have to make saves. That's against anybody. So now they've got that piece of the puzzle. So now I'm really positive about it.
23:32 Speaker 00 What do you think, H?
23:33 Speaker 01 Yeah, obviously it was an important game. I think we got a lot of stick. Well, just before that game, I think there was the most pressure on England than there ever has been in terms of this tournament. And I think they've proved to everyone that it's more than possible. I'm really, I'm really, I'm only not shouting and screaming because I feel like everyone else is really calm right now.
23:52 Speaker 02 They have time now, don't they? They've got a few days. How do you think they're going to spend these next few days? It's almost a fortnight.
23:58 Speaker 00 Obviously they'll have to travel back probably to Kansas, won't they? But, you know, they've got a nice gap now. They've got like six days, five, six days, haven't they, till the next game?
24:07 Speaker 02 A day or two off, do you think, probably?
24:08 Speaker 00 I think, well, for the players that played are exhausted, they'll need to monitor their recovery and make sure they're all OK. There'll be a few players carrying knocks. But they'll be buzzing. There's no question about that.
24:26 Speaker 00 That's it for this episode of The Rest Is Football. England during the quarterfinals. Let's enjoy it.
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