Why Moderna Tanked, MSG Employees Duped By Their Boss, The Mansion Section | Diet TBPN

Diet TBPN delivers the best of today’s TBPN episode in 30 minutes. TBPN is a live tech talk show hosted by John Coogan and Jordi Hays, streaming weekdays 11–2 PT on X and YouTube, with each episode posted to podcast platforms right after. Described by The New York Times as “Silicon Valley’s newest obsession,” the show has recently featured Mark Zuckerberg, Sam Altman, Mark Cuban, and Satya Nadella. TBPN is made possible by: Ramp - https://ramp.com Public - https://public.com Cisco - https://www.cisco.com Console - https://www.console.com CrowdStrike - https://www.crowdstrike.com Figma - https://www.figma.com MongoDB - https://www.mongodb.com NYSE - https://www.nyse.com Railway - https://railway.com Shopify - https://www.shopify.com/ Follow TBPN: https://TBPN.com https://x.com/tbpn https://open.spotify.com/show/2L6WMqY3GUPCGBD0dX6p00?si=674252d53acf4231 https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/technology-brothers/id1772360235 https://www.youtube.com/@TBPNLive

• 0:01Speaker 00

  Big news, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 4 multiplayer dropped today. Tyler is going to try and prestige while we're doing the show, so he's locked in. Don't count on him to look anything up for us, because he is trying to go on a kill streak right now. Let me tell you about Ramp. Time is money, say both, he's used corporate card. You know, we started this show with like, let's just get right into the show. And the whole bit was like, we'd just be like Technology Brothers, and then we'd just start the show, and it was like, really convenient. And now we're like, we gotta tell you about Ramp, we gotta tell you about the Ultradome, we gotta tell you about the Road to Christmas.

• 0:37Speaker 01

  We gotta tell you about COD.

• 0:39Speaker 00

  But, the Road to Christmas, how many days are there until Christmas? Because that's why you come to the show. You want to know how many days there are until Christmas. Let's count it down. Sixty-two days until Christmas.

• 0:50Speaker 01

  There you go.

• 0:51Speaker 00

  Jeff Bezos is also 62 years old. What is that? We got fun facts now? This is elite. Good job, production team. I like that.

• 1:01Speaker 01

  New feature.

• 1:02Speaker 00

  We're gonna learn about a different number every day, I guess, on the way down. Oh, this is very cool. I like that.

• 1:08Speaker 01

  Very, very cool.

• 1:09Speaker 00

  Well, let's try and give you some news while Tyler tries to prestige and COD.

• 1:15Speaker 01

  Just a bit of news.

• 1:16Speaker 00

  Just a bit of news. So, Moderna. Moderna is in the Wall Street Journal today, and it's an interesting story. Data from Moderna's cancer therapy leaked, and the stock has been on this wild ride up and down, fueled by speculation that they cured cancer. They said the AI labs, they've been talking a big game, nobody's doing it without us doing it first.

• 1:37Speaker 01

  I would hate for an AI lab to cure cancer before we do.

• 1:41Speaker 00

  That's exactly what they said. And they actually did have some really promising results, but it's a very fascinating story, because obviously curing cancer is a very broad term. Insane that the AI lab leaders try and collapse it down to just like, it's going to be done. Clearly, it's like a game of cat and mouse with all these things, like, there's always some level of cancer in your body that your body's naturally fighting off, and then there's really bad cancer that not, no one can solve, because it's metastasized so significantly. And then there's much more modern, much more moderate forms, that if you catch them on time, you can fight back with both surgery, just removing the cancerous cells, the tumors, also drug treatments. There's a bunch of great cancer drugs that are out there. Some of them are blockbusters, like KEYTRUDA from Merck, which was actually used in concert with Moderna.

• 2:25Speaker 00

  So Moderna didn't say, this is going to be used by itself. They said, we'll be using this in concert with KEYTRUDA. And so, basically, this has been Moderna's core idea for the company, going back to 2013. Stephane Bancel, the CEO, I don't know if he's the co-founder/CEO, but he did a TED Talk in 2013, where he said, like, we are going to be able to design patient-specific drugs for cancer. And he was standing on stage, being like, guys, we're going to cure cancer. And everyone was like, clapping at TED. And then, three years later, they were calling him the Theranos, because they were like, this is not going to happen, this is completely fake, your company's really secretive. And then, he started delivering, but it took a really long time. And the company was really secretive, and would require people to sign NDAs to come

• 3:10Speaker 00

  in the building. And all of that was sort of like, offset by the fact that they continued to deliver. And they actually did get up through a successful Phase 3 trial with this particular drug. So, it's not a one-shot solution, of course, like, curing cancer is this broad spectrum. And so, the way it works is that scientists sequence a patient's tumor, identify mutations unique to their specific cancer, and then manufacture an mRNA vaccine that teaches the immune system to recognize and attack those cancer cells. The treatment is actually administered alongside Merck's KEYTRUDA, which I mentioned, an existing cancer immunotherapy drug. And the hope is that the combination can prevent cancer from returning after surgery, and eventually work against many different types of cancer. So, the early results.

• 3:55Speaker 00

  The early results that they had sort of gestured towards in the Phase 2 was a 49% reduction in relative risk of cancer recurrence or death compared to KEYTRUDA alone. So you're on the best-in-class, because even when they do these studies, they're not just going to say, hey, we want you to go cold turkey, we want you to go completely vanilla. They say, you can use the drugs that are already available. Will this be better than just the drugs that are available currently? So, they had this 49% number, and that's the important number to anchor on, because Phase 3 was going to tell you, was it higher than 49 when they did more trials, or was it lower? And spoiler alert, of course, it came in lower, that's why there's all the drama.

• 4:36Speaker 00

  But, in August of 2016, Moderna announced that its much larger Phase 3 trial, which had 1,137 patients, over 1,000 cancer patients, went through this trial doing KEYTRUDA and the Moderna treatment. They said, our Phase 3 trial succeeded. Succeeded. But they didn't say the data behind it. They didn't say the number, they didn't update that 49%. So everyone was like, this is incredible, they cured cancer, the stock moons. But on October 2nd, the detailed results leaked, which is crazy, because they were basically embargoed, and it was two days before Moderna was scheduled to present them. And in biotech, these presentations about the actual results are very precisely traded

• 5:21Speaker 00

  by hedge funds. It matters a lot. And so, you shouldn't leak them, but a medical publication called Oncology Central apparently published an article containing the embargoed clinical data ahead of schedule. Screenshots circulated on X, and Moderna's stock plunged 26% intraday, eventually closing down 18%. And it's not that they secretly failed the trial. It's not that they said they succeeded it, and then the data came out and they failed. What actually happened was that the Phase 3 did succeed, but the results weren't as spectacular as investors had hoped. Instead of the 49% that I mentioned before, it was only 42%, which is still pretty good. But, it wasn't good enough. It's great if you're a cancer patient, but it's not so good if you're an investor who's

• 6:04Speaker 00

  banking on 49%, or maybe a beat, maybe an update. Hey, it's actually better than we expected. And so, you can kind of understand how the market would react to that. Also, the Phase 3 trial showed that Moderna's treatment is really only starts to be effective after six months, it starts kicking in. So if you have a really aggressive, fast-growing cancer, it doesn't really help all that much. It's more for someone who has like, a slow burn cancer, that sort of, they're fighting it off over the course of a year or two, that's when Moderna's going to help. And so...

• 6:38Speaker 01

  Somewhat disappointing results.

• 6:40Speaker 00

  Relative to expectations, right? Just didn't meet expectations, not a beat, in the clean sense. And so, that's all just a normal biotech story, but then, it takes a bizarre turn, because a fitness and gambling influencer, which is how he's described, named Shane Stouffer, who's better known as Togi, managed to time Moderna's crash almost perfectly. Naughty, naughty. Flipping his entire position from calls to puts, just hours before it plunged. And so, we have some more information on Togi. And I don't know if we have any videos that we want to pull up to contextualize for the audience, who Togi is, because he's a true character in the modern online world.

• 7:24Speaker 01

  I don't know if you could pull up just any video.

• 7:26Speaker 00

  I don't think we could, it's kind of dangerous. He's a real wild card.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  I sent in a video, that I think is...

• 7:32Speaker 00

  Okay, oh, it's clean? Okay, we'll play that video, and while we're pulling it up, give me the update on how you did in your first game of Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 4.

• 7:40Speaker 01

  I went 13 and 14, not great.

• 7:41Speaker 00

  13 and 14.

• 7:43Speaker 01

  But, you know, first game, just getting the feeling.

• 7:45Speaker 00

  Okay, okay.

• 7:46Speaker 01

  I'm feeling confident, though. My first time on this map. Can we get a camera on Jackson?

• 7:50Speaker 00

  Yeah, we need a camera on Jackson.

• 7:52Speaker 01

  We need a camera on Jackson ASAP. He put together the fit...

• 7:56Speaker 00

  Of all fits.

• 7:57Speaker 01

  Of the month.

• 7:58Speaker 00

  Of the month!

• 7:59Speaker 01

  And it's only...

• 8:00Speaker 00

  Spinning around. Way over here.

• 8:02Speaker 01

  Where are we? Here we are.

• 8:04Speaker 00

  There we go.

• 8:05Speaker 01

  All right, zoom out a little bit.

• 8:06Speaker 00

  There we go.

• 8:07Speaker 01

  Okay, what do you got on, Jackson?

• 8:08Speaker 02

  I got the frontale.

• 8:09Speaker 01

  And the backale. What's on the feet? Do we got boots on the feet?

• 8:16Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 8:17Speaker 01

  What do we got?

• 8:18Speaker 02

  I'm happy to be here.

• 8:20Speaker 01

  There we go.

• 8:21Speaker 00

  Fantastic.

• 8:22Speaker 01

  Looking great. Looking great, thank you for that.

• 8:24Speaker 00

  So do we have that Togi video to contextualize for everyone? Can we pull that up? Okay, this is Togi, the fitness and gambling influencer.

• 8:32Speaker 03

  Like, every day, I probably have like, six, like, useful thoughts, and then the rest of it's just kind of like...

• 8:39Speaker 04

  Give me an example of a useful thought you had today.

• 8:41Speaker 03

  Oh, no, today was bad.

• 8:47Speaker 00

  What an entertainer. Anyway, um, on October 4th, Togi, the man pictured in that video, was trying to speed up his stock video trading challenge, which is already a hilarious premise. He said he noticed people online acting bearish towards Moderna. Everyone was turbo bullish on every stock except one, dollar sign mRNA. Everyone and their mother could only talk about how overvalued it was and how good of a short it was. Then he decided to go against the crowd and bought Moderna calls. That night, he had a dream. Moderna cured cancer

• 9:25Speaker 00

  and the stock went to $275. It's trading around $200 today. It was at two, almost 250 a little bit earlier. Making his portfolio if these calls had hit, uh, worth $11 million. This was his dream. After the dream, he asked Claude what it would take for Moderna to actually reach $275. That's when he said he learned about Moderna's cancer vaccine. Wait, for the first time, he just has this dream based on vibes based analysis. He's vibes trading. Over the next two weeks, the stock went up 25% and Togi got worried that all the hype from the trial was already priced in. Then he had another dream. This time that Moderna

• 10:10Speaker 00

  stock would surge 22%. Uh, I thought, this is a quote from him. He says, "I thought it was a sign from God that I was wrong about the top being in and that I should trust my original swap end of market on Friday plan. But when he woke up and checked his phone, Moderna was tanking and his position was down nearly $200,000." Quote from Togi, "My port down 200K almost had me full, fully in a panic, thinking maybe sell on the news was so obvious that they are selling days before the news." Originally, Togi had planned to flip his entire position from long to short on Friday, October 23rd, betting that

• 10:53Speaker 00

  Moderna's stock would crash after the trial results were released on Saturday, but the sudden drop convinced him to move up his plans. Quote, "I got too scared that the pump would happen so soon that I'd have no capital left to flip the port short come Friday." But, so he sold his position at a loss, freeing up roughly $500,000 to bet against Moderna by buying put options ahead of the trial results. Perfect timing for Togi. Shortly after, the results were leaked and the stock crashed by 26%. In Togi's own words, quote, "And the rest is some giga stroke of luck history. The news broke early somehow?" Question mark, question mark, question mark, question mark. "The most likely outcome for all traders would be that I was destined for." Rock solid thesis blown out by some unlucky BS.

• 11:38Speaker 01

  That's my quant. Giga stroke of luck.

• 11:41Speaker 00

  Lucky my panic this morning got to my head enough to break my original game plan. In hindsight, this entire saga was beyond obvious. Thanks for playing. Not financial advice. I'm just learning and gambling.

• 11:56Speaker 01

  Guy gets, has two dreams and a giga stroke of luck and says, "In the end, this was all beyond obvious."

• 12:03Speaker 00

  All beyond obvious, but also not financial advice. I'm just learning and gambling, but also put some respect on the thesis. S U M for some. So, I don't know.

• 12:15Speaker 01

  The thesis that started before he was aware of what the entire stock was riding on.

• 12:20Speaker 00

  It's, it's, uh, yeah, it's a very, very funny story. Anyway, uh, yeah, Moderna's all over the place. How is Tyler doing this round?

• 12:29Speaker 01

  So it's Nick playing now.

• 12:30Speaker 00

  Oh, it's Nick playing now. Okay, we swap. Let's see. So the, the score to beat is even.

• 12:35Speaker 01

  Slightly negative. If he can go even.

• 12:38Speaker 00

  Yeah, okay, okay. Um, I don't know if I played this map in the, in the beta.

• 12:43Speaker 01

  You look like you're about to pull up a

• 12:44Speaker 00

  Pretty good.

• 12:45Speaker 01

  A shot from deep.

• 12:46Speaker 00

  Is he leaning in yet? Stands forward for Modern Warfare 4? Um, this is exciting. And somebody in the chat also said it's only 26 days until GTA 6. So it's, uh, Christmas is coming early for the next 62 days.

• 13:03Speaker 01

  All right, Nick, get it together.

• 13:04Speaker 00

  Get it together. Okay. Uh, well.

• 13:06Speaker 01

  Uh, President Trump says Sundar over at Google talked him out of renaming the Atlantic Ocean. Says, "And I spoke to a brilliant guy, Sundar. He heads all of Google. He's a brilliant guy."

• 13:18Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 13:18Speaker 01

  Uh, Sergey and Sundar are totally brilliant guys. You know, they're, they're still rattled from the Gulf. And I said, "No, Sundar, I'm thinking of the Atlantic Ocean. Can you handle it?" "No, no, no, this time I'm not doing it," he said. He said, "Oceans are different, sir. You know, they cover, they cover really a lot of countries. Please don't ask us to do that."

• 13:38Speaker 00

  That's the craziest thing. So it'd be the American Ocean? Is that the idea?

• 13:43Speaker 01

  I think you would have to assume so.

• 13:45Speaker 00

  Or Trump Ocean? Maybe Mar-a-Lago, the ocean? I don't know.

• 13:51Speaker 01

  Could see all of these.

• 13:52Speaker 00

  I feel like there's enough in the, in the Trump brand canon to, to rename everything. Cause after you rename one Gulf, if you, if you have another Gulf, you need to come up with another one. Well, uh, so you have America and then United States, the United States Ocean on the other side, I guess. Try and make everything United States.

• 14:11Speaker 01

  So apparently Lake Ontario only shows up as Lake America in the United States.

• 14:16Speaker 00

  Oh, Geo-locked. Oh, so that would

• 14:19Speaker 01

  I think it's the same for the Gulf too.

• 14:20Speaker 00

  So now there's the lake, the Gulf, and then now there's

• 14:23Speaker 01

  We're really just living in our own little world.

• 14:25Speaker 00

  A little bubble, a little

• 14:26Speaker 01

  A bit of a bubble.

• 14:27Speaker 00

  Personalized AI Intranet, basically. The American Intranet. That's where we're going.

• 14:32Speaker 01

  Let's check in with Joe Lonsdale. He was on CNBC yesterday.

• 14:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, we gotta break this one down.

• 14:38Speaker 01

  And there's a lot to, to kind of process here.

• 14:42Speaker 00

  Yes. This is Joe Lonsdale on CNBC.

• 14:56Speaker 01

  All right, pause. First off, he's calling the, I mean, well, let's start with the basics. He's calling in from a private aircraft.

• 15:04Speaker 00

  Immediate alt.

• 15:05Speaker 01

  Uh, which is incredible. I think, um, a lot of people, we actually have had guests this week call in from their planes, but they'll use a Zoom background.

• 15:13Speaker 00

  Usually people do the Zoom background. Going no Zoom background. Very strong play.

• 15:17Speaker 01

  Second thought, you know, he's immediately, apparently in their household, they're calling it the, uh, the Grok Bot. They've rebranded Grok Bot to TradBot.

• 15:26Speaker 00

  Tradwife Bot, yeah.

• 15:28Speaker 01

  TradBot. So

• 15:29Speaker 00

  So it's done locked the anchor.

• 15:30Speaker 01

  Super, you know, and we know Joe's contrarian, right? One of the ultimate contrarians, right? Um, but going to Grok for parenting advice is probably, is probably the most, there's a lot of things that you could go to it for, but going to it for, for parenting advice is the, is the ultimate contrarian move. Knowing, knowing what sort of hides in the weights, right? Knowing the thing that has emerged at times

• 15:55Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 15:56Speaker 01

  And could emerge at any moment.

• 15:57Speaker 00

  Any moment, potentially.

• 15:59Speaker 01

  That is maybe, may or may not be fully solved.

• 16:01Speaker 00

  Sure, sure.

• 16:02Speaker 01

  So knowing that all things, uh, all things considered, very contrarian, but it makes me, knowing how often he's been contrarian and right, which has led to extreme investment results.

• 16:12Speaker 00

  Wisdom here.

• 16:13Speaker 01

  It makes me way more tempted to start going to Grok for parenting.

• 16:16Speaker 00

  Might be looking at the next grade parenting product.

• 16:18Speaker 01

  Exactly. And maybe, maybe, maybe there's an opportunity here to reposition Grok around.

• 16:23Speaker 00

  Maybe that's the key to product market fit in that category.

• 16:25Speaker 01

  Totally, totally. So he's running TradBot

• 16:27Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 16:29Speaker 01

  In the home for parent, you know, just general like household management parenting advice. I think, I think that makes, uh, you know, again, it's contrarian, but I, I'm gonna give it a shot now.

• 16:39Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:39Speaker 01

  Um, next up, language selection. We gotta talk about language selection. He talks about, you know, clearly one of their kids is using a Binky. They want to get them off the Binky. It's like a little addiction. Been there as a parent, but word selection, right? Deprecate the Binky, right? Really, really good word selection, especially with this audience, right? This audience is an audience of capital allocators and, you know, this audience knows, okay, deprecate the Binky. It just, it clicks almost instantly.

• 17:08Speaker 00

  Immediately.

• 17:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. So all in all, 17 seconds on this video, one of the best performances we've seen of any CNBC hit in years. Yeah, the chat saying, uh, just needs McDonald's and a Diet Coke. So if you really wanted to, to like get into that sort of like Donald mentality, you should have taken a bite or at least a sip of something.

• 17:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:29Speaker 01

  But overall, round of applause. Fantastic.

• 17:32Speaker 00

  Fantastic performance. Yeah, really elite, elite performance.

• 17:37Speaker 01

  Not gonna be, I'm, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say, I don't think it'll be topped.

• 17:39Speaker 00

  I don't think it'll be topped. No, no, this is, this is S tier performance.

• 17:43Speaker 01

  S tier. Uh, should we head over to one of Joe's, uh, portfolio founders?

• 17:48Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 17:48Speaker 01

  Friend of the show, Scott Wu.

• 17:50Speaker 00

  What'd he say?

• 17:50Speaker 01

  Uh, Scott Wu was doing some math.

• 17:52Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 17:53Speaker 05

  The natural thing, obviously, once that got too easy, is then you take eight cards and you make the current year. And this year is now 2025. Um, and so we get to try that one. And, um, in this case, it's actually quite, uh, quite easy because 13 minus 12 is one, 11 minus 10 is one, one plus one plus seven is nine. And it turns out that nine times nine times five times five is exactly 2025. Okay. But, but okay. So at some point, that gets too easy.

• 18:18Speaker 00

  Do you think he has to practice this? Cause I know he's been elite at mental math and these, like all these different types of math challenges from when he was a kid, but like this can't come up on a daily basis in his job as CEO of cognition, right? Or does it?

• 18:35Speaker 01

  I think you should do it with potential hires.

• 18:37Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 18:38Speaker 01

  It's like, hey, let's go, let's talk for a couple hours and then let's block off 30 minutes for math tricks.

• 18:42Speaker 00

  Yeah. I mean, he has that story about playing, what was it? High stakes poker for term sheet with, uh, Founders Fund?

• 18:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. He was playing, uh, I think poker against Napoleon, chess versus Peter.

• 18:54Speaker 00

  Yeah, okay.

• 18:55Speaker 01

  That was the one he wanted to do.

• 18:56Speaker 00

  Okay. But yeah, I mean, you pull that trick out with a, with like a, a mid-tier VC who's trying to cram into a later round. Like it's a, it's game over. You get whatever price you want.

• 19:05Speaker 01

  I think this is a learned skill.

• 19:07Speaker 00

  You think so?

• 19:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:08Speaker 00

  Okay, learn it.

• 19:08Speaker 01

  All right.

• 19:09Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 19:10Speaker 01

  All right. In a month, I'll, I think I can do this on the table.

• 19:13Speaker 00

  We've given you so many challenges. It's like learn the drums. Prestige at cost.

• 19:19Speaker 01

  Skydive without a parachute.

• 19:21Speaker 00

  That one's doable with a net, right? Didn't they do that once?

• 19:25Speaker 01

  No, you gotta do the Pastrana method.

• 19:26Speaker 00

  What's the Pastrana?

• 19:27Speaker 01

  Other people.

• 19:27Speaker 00

  Oh, other people get you. Okay, okay.

• 19:50Speaker 00

  I like that. I like that.

• 19:51Speaker 01

  Let's head over to the Knicks.

• 19:53Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 19:54Speaker 01

  Let's check in with the Knicks.

• 19:55Speaker 00

  What's going on with the Knicks?

• 19:56Speaker 01

  The Knicks assistants were told they would receive championship rings eventually, but many longtime employees at Madison Square Garden, including some who work in the Knicks' business operations, will not receive rings at all, team sources told The Atlantic. Typically, most employees for NBA teams receive rings, even if they are not as fancy and expensive as the ones the players receive. Those MSG employees got their hopes up at the end of September, when the Knicks sent an email to a long list of employees, which gave recipients a first glimpse at their would-be championship rings. Atop the email, a copy of which The Athletic has obtained, was a graphic of two differently-styled rings. "Congratulations, your employee championship ring is here," the email read.

• 20:38Speaker 01

  "This is one. This one is on the house. MSG is issuing a complimentary employee..."

• 20:44Speaker 00

  I didn't, I saw this and I didn't understand the full context. Now I get it.

• 20:48Speaker 01

  MSG is issuing a complimentary employee championship ring, the same jeweler, the same craftsmanship, personalized with your name, no cost to you. "There are two designs to choose from: championship gold and garden classic. Reserve the one you want below." But the email was a fake-out. "A phishing test Madison Square Garden sent to see if those employees would click," multiple team sources said. "Those who did click the link at the bottom of the message did not get to choose any jewelry. Instead, they were forced to attend a mandatory cybersecurity class to help satisfy some of Dolan's growing cybersecurity concerns," those team sources said. "Definitely the most insane thing I've ever heard of a company doing to..."

• 21:31Speaker 00

  I think it's a good plan. We gotta start doing this. Send in Jackson, "Hey, we got you Nitro Circus tickets. Click here." If he clicks it, he's gotta go to cybersecurity training or send me monster truck rally.

• 21:42Speaker 01

  Just literally figure out what every individual on the team, their hopes and dreams.

• 21:46Speaker 00

  Personalized. Yes.

• 21:47Speaker 01

  Like, it has to be something that is, they literally have dreamed about for more than a decade.

• 21:51Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 21:52Speaker 01

  And then deliver that. Deliver a phishing email based on that.

• 21:55Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 21:55Speaker 01

  And you could actually use AI to do that.

• 21:57Speaker 00

  Yes, you could. You could. So, I, I actually, I mean, I understand this isn't very poor taste, but I don't have as much of a...

• 22:05Speaker 01

  Meet and greet with Dale Earnhardt Jr.

• 22:09Speaker 00

  I, I, I don't have as much of a problem with it if there is a, if there is actually something about it, that if you inspect the email thoroughly enough, you can tell it's a phishing email. So, it has to come from MSG.fishing.com.

• 22:28Speaker 01

  I don't have a problem with that.

• 22:29Speaker 00

  But if it just comes from MSG...

• 22:31Speaker 01

  Also, they have to get, they're saying it's normal for all the employees to get rings. And so, these people, not getting rings, but getting the phishing email and having to go to the cybersecurity, you know, the, the naughty naughty meeting is completely insane.

• 22:48Speaker 00

  Okay. I get that.

• 22:50Speaker 01

  And, and demoralizing, and if you were one of these people, you work at MSG, you work for the Knicks, you won the championship. This probably will become the item in your life that is most significant to you.

• 23:03Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 23:04Speaker 01

  The thing that's irreplaceable.

• 23:05Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 23:06Speaker 01

  You've been hearing that, "Oh, maybe we're getting it. Maybe we're getting it." And then, and then you don't get it, and you, but, and so you get the, you get the phishing email, you're just a little bit excited. So, I can see cyber criminals taking advantage of this kind of thing. It, it might even happen, right? Like, hey, when, when a team wins a championship, send a phishing email about rings to everybody involved, and let's try to break into their systems that way.

• 23:32Speaker 00

  If, look, it's a controversial decision not to give everyone the ring, but they made it crystal clear that in this organization, we just don't do it like the other teams. If you want to be on a team that gives rings to everyone, you gotta go to a different team, right? And they've made that crystal clear. And then, so, and it's been publicized. So, there's been news articles about, "Oh, Knicks employees don't get rings." And it's been established, and the, and the team has communicated that very clearly. And then, there's a phishing email, and it comes from, and it comes from IT set up a special domain, so if you looked at it closely, you could tell that it's a phishing email.

• 24:08Speaker 01

  Fair game. Still cruel.

• 24:09Speaker 00

  Still cruel. But fair game.

• 24:10Speaker 01

  This is cruel and unusual punishment.

• 24:12Speaker 00

  Okay. It, it, well, we don't, we don't fully know how clearly they had communicated, at least I don't. And so, with your, with your series of events, if that's true, I, I do agree with you. I do agree with you. Given the, given the, given the level of cybersecurity threats, almost nothing is off the table for, for phishing. I think that CEOs should be hiring actors to put on full Hollywood makeup to go into the office as them and try and fish employees in person. I feel like you should, if you work at a company, you should see an actor who's dressed up like the boss knock on your door. "Hey, can you, can you wire $10,000 to this account?" And if they, and if they do it, boom, security training, because you fell for the Nathan Fielder-esque phishing scheme.

• 24:57Speaker 01

  In other news, Quest Diagnostics has been hacked.

• 25:00Speaker 00

  Brutal.

• 25:01Speaker 01

  Patient data was exposed. They serve roughly half of US hospitals and physicians. Investigation is ongoing. Quest said, "Yesterday, we have identified an incident involving unauthorized access to our Quantum Lab Service Manager, which certain clients use to place test orders, receive and look up results." It's interesting, they say "certain" clients. Like, you imagine, like, pretty much, they probably have some other ways to check it, but like, this seems like they're kind of like the main thing. "Upon discovery of the incident, we paused access to the system, and we are continuing to investigate the incident. Our core business operations are not impacted and remain up and running." What data was affected? "We believe some patient data within Quantum LSM was accessed, but other systems were not affected.

• 25:46Speaker 01

  We are working diligently to investigate the incident to determine the specific data affected." Does this mean patient health information or patient identifiable information was part of the unauthorized access? Yes.

• 25:59Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 25:59Speaker 01

  But we are still investigating to determine the specific data.

• 26:02Speaker 00

  So, they probably have some cyber insurance policy that was inked like years ago, and so they'll probably have to pay out some sort of settlement or class action. But the financial motivation behind this one is curious. Like, I understand the botnets installing crypto miners, stealing crypto, stealing API tokens to work on large-scale distillation attacks, but you get a bunch of patient data. I'm wondering what the value of that is to a hacker, other than just like you were trying to hack everything, and why not this website too, if it's running PHP or something? But do you have any...

• 26:40Speaker 01

  Comments are saying like, medical records of politicians in the wrong hands could give them leverage for blackmailing, extortion. Yeah, John would hate for his four-digit testosterone to leak. Well, let's pull up this video from John. He recently...

• 27:00Speaker 00

  Me?

• 27:01Speaker 01

  Recently posted it.

• 27:05Speaker 01

  I'll send it over.

• 27:07Speaker 05

  Cows know that humans exist. They can see us. But cows don't know that money exists. So, just as cows can't understand the financial system that controls their lives today, we will not be able to understand the AI financial system that will control our lives in 10 or 20 years. Which means that we are the cows of the future. We are the cows of the...

• 27:40Speaker 00

  You gotta be the wild bull.

• 27:42Speaker 01

  Sebastian says, "My cows know money exists. I do money spreads through them every morning."

• 27:50Speaker 00

  Can I read this article from the Wall Street Journal mansion section, Jordy?

• 27:54Speaker 01

  Hit me.

• 27:55Speaker 00

  Alaska property comes with a helipad. This is a special, special property. 147 acres with a helipad. Guess how much it's going for? They're giving it away. Just 12 and a half million. 12 and a half million dollars.

• 28:12Speaker 01

  No, there's that house we saw in Alaska that was like, one of one.

• 28:16Speaker 00

  I think that was on like five acres or 10 acres.

• 28:18Speaker 01

  It was John, John Lautner.

• 28:19Speaker 00

  John Lautner.

• 28:20Speaker 01

  But it was like 600K or something.

• 28:21Speaker 00

  But this is a, this is a very cool story. So, Richard Strickland lived in Alaska his whole life. The 68-year-old retired commercial real estate developer was born in Fairbanks, spent time along the Bering Sea in an Eskimo village, but when it was time to settle down, he built a family compound. He chose Palmer, a small city about 40 miles from Anchorage. Surrounded by glaciers, the landscape attracted him with its grandeur. His 147-acre property has views of the glaciers, mountain ranges, and northern lights. "I climbed a tree, and I saw the view potential, and that's where I decided I was gonna build," he said. Now, he's looking to downsize. Strickland has listed, has decided to list the compound for 12.5 million, making it one of the most expensive homes for sale in Alaska, according to Troy Dana of Fay

• 29:06Speaker 00

  Ranches. Strickland began to assemble his compound just outside the city limits in the 90s on the property, which he calls the ultimate, ultimate Alaska. He built a ranch-style, single-story main bedroom, main house with three bedrooms, a garage and a two-bedroom apartment above it, and a helipad for his wife. He built vegetable gardens and an orchard. The couple's adult...

• 29:28Speaker 01

  I thought you were saying he built the helipad for his wife. I was like, that's amazing.

• 29:32Speaker 00

  That would be good. They have 13 grandchildren that live nearby. Let's give it up for that. During the winter solstice, Palmer receives only about five hours of sunlight a day. Strickland and his family spends this time skiing, visiting local winter festivals, and attending the grandchildren's indoor sporting events. When spring arrives, they shift to snowmobiling on the glaciers, prepping the orchard and gardens for the growing season, and enjoying outdoor community events. They are selling because he has built a lakefront home about an hour away, and his, and he and his wife plan to spend most of their time there. So, if you're in the market for a 147-acre Alaska compound, head over to...

• 30:14Speaker 01

  You know who should consider?

• 30:15Speaker 00

  Who?

• 30:16Speaker 01

  Palmer Lucky.

• 30:17Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah.

• 30:17Speaker 01

  Ben Lamb.

• 30:18Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 30:19Speaker 01

  They just set up, set up a dog operation out there.

• 30:23Speaker 00

  Why not there?

• 30:23Speaker 01

  Ben Lamb and Palmer have a warhound.

• 30:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 30:27Speaker 01

  A...

• 30:29Speaker 01

  Company coming out of stealth to genetically engineered dogs for military and law enforcement. Let's pull up this video.

• 30:35Speaker 00

  Of them talking about it.

• 30:36Speaker 01

  Back in 2023.

• 30:37Speaker 05

  And I'm not talking about biological weapons. I'm talking about using biology as a tool to solve a lot of military problems because we have new advanced bioengineering capabilities. So muscles that go in machines are going to be a really big deal. For example, building self-power scavenging robots that can live off of grass out in a field. Imagine if you could have radio relays that roam the plains and just eat grass. And that's how they power themselves and they're very low signature. They can hide, they can hibernate. There's actually a lot of interesting biology derived systems where you can take that stuff in, have bacteria in a little bioreactor that puts out methane gas, which you then run a fuel cell with. It's really, really cool stuff. And then of course, the other big one is, you know, you guys are probably familiar with some of the companies out there doing de-extinction work of species.

• 31:18Speaker 05

  And I think there's a lot of species in the history of our planet where if we go back to the future, they're going to have excellent military applications. You think that German shepherds, they weigh 150 pounds, are really good canine units. Well, what about dire wolves? What if you have 600 pound canine units carrying 150 pounds of armor? You're talking about something that weighs all up eight times more with 100 times more bullet resistance. They're extinct now, but they don't have to continue to be. That sounds crazy, but I don't know if you guys know this, that the US military actually already has a lot of animals working in it. You have a lot of dogs working in the military. You have a lot of dolphins and seals that are working in the US Navy. And of course, we'd customize them a bit too, you know, give them some better endurance, give them the ability to breathe at high altitudes, things they didn't have when they were on the Arctic tundra.

• 32:00Speaker 05

  Imagine if you could have all of these survival characteristics of Arctic wolves, but with the obedience and trust and loving characteristics of domesticated animals. Of course, you can breed things like this over long periods of time with different levels of success. But what if you could really get it to be like every canine unit we have in the northern latitudes? They have the characteristics of the strongest Arctic wolf that ever walked the earth. And also they love to cuddle and do exactly what I say.

• 32:28Speaker 00

  I was always thinking that it would go the other direction. Instead of trying to scale up the friendly dog, you would try and make the fierce giant bear friendly. And you would genetically engineer a domesticated bear and basically speed that up because wolves, dogs came from wolves. Over generations, they became friendlier. It feels like you could speed that up, but Palmer and Ben Lamb clearly know better than I do.

• 32:49Speaker 01

  Why stop at, you know, seals and dolphins? Why not great friendly great white sharks?

• 32:55Speaker 00

  Great white sharks with laser beams.

• 32:56Speaker 01

  Man's best friend in the seas.

• 33:00Speaker 00

  That's right. Thank you for tuning in. Fantastic week, fantastic show. We made it through some sickness, some chaos.

• 33:07Speaker 01

  We love you.

• 33:08Speaker 00

  Let's get the Christmas countdown up again. 62 days to Christmas.

• 33:12Speaker 01

  We'll see you Monday.

• 33:12Speaker 00

  Goodbye. Goodbye.