425: Kohberger Backtracks, ‘Netflix Trend Murder’, Nolan Wells Audio Released & D4vd Going to Trial

This week on Headline Highlights: Bryan Kohberger is seeking to withdraw his guilty plea, claiming he was coerced into confessing. D4vd's preliminary hearing concluded with the judge ruling there is enough evidence for him to stand trial on all charges and special circumstances. Newly released dispatch audio reveals that officers considered Brooke Hanlon's death suspicious within minutes of arriving at the scene. The Nolan Wells case remains full of unanswered questions as conflicting witness accounts and newly released boat audio add to the mystery surrounding his death. The unexplained death of Allie Hummel is drawing scrutiny after it came just months after her husband pleaded guilty to assaulting her. And influencer Sara Gilson, who went viral after posting a TikTok joking that Netflix would make a documentary about her "soon-to-be ex-husband," was allegedly killed by him just days later…. If you’re new here, don’t forget to follow the show for weekly deep dives into the darkest true crime cases! To watch the video version of this episode, head over to youtube.com/@annieelise. .🔎Join Our True Crime Club & Get Exclusive Content & Perks..🎧 Need More to Binge? Listen to both of my weekly true crime series 10 to Life & Serialously with Annie Elise wherever you get your podcasts on the Annie Elise Channel!🍎 Apple Podcasts | Where you can also unlock access to 100+ and growing extra exclusive deep dives.💚 Spotify🔴 YouTube🎙️ All Other Platforms.📸 Follow Annie on Socials Instagram: @_annieeliseTikTok: @_annieeliseSubstack: @annieeliseFacebook: @10toLife.⭐SponsorsEthos: Get your free quote at http://ETHOS.com/ae.
Wayfair: Head to http://Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home and get your space ready for less..👗 Shop Annie’s Must-Haves! ShopMY: bit.ly/AnnieElise_ShopMy Amazon: bit.ly/AnnieElise_Amazon.🫵🏻 Get Involved or Recommend a CaseAbout Annie: www.annieelise.comFor Business Inquiries: [email protected].📚 Episode Sources Abby Blabby | AP News | CNN | Drop Dead Serious | Fox News | GoFundMe | Idaho Statesman | KXLY | New York Times | NewsNation | People | WLOX••••••••••••••••••🚨Disclaimers1️⃣ Some links may be affiliate links, they do not cost you anything, but I make a small percentage from the sale. Thank you so much for watching and supporting me. 2️⃣ Sources used to collect this information include various public news sites, interviews, court documents, FB groups dedicated to the case, and various news channel segments. When quoting statements made by others, they are strictly alleged until confirmed otherwise. Please remember my videos are my independent opinion and to always do your own research. 3️⃣ The views and opinions expressed in this video are personal and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organization, employer, or company. Assumptions made in the analysis are not reflective of the position of any entity other than the creator(s). These views are subject to change, revision, and rethinking at any time and are not to be held in perpetuity. We make no representations as to the accuracy, completeness, correctness, suitability, or validity of any information on this video and will not be liable for any errors, omissions, or delays in this information or any losses, injuries, or damages arising from its display or use. All information is provided on an as-is basis. It is the reader’s responsibility to verify their own facts.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Annie Elise?

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• 1:29Annie Elise?

  Hey, true crime besties. Welcome back to an all new episode of Serial Slay.

• 1:53Annie Elise?

  Hello, hello, hello, and welcome back to an all new episode of Serial Slay. With me, your host, Annie E. Lee. Happy Thursday. Holy shit. A lot has gone on this week so far. There is so much that we need to talk about. There's the Brian Kohberger of it all with him saying that he's innocent and he wants to withdraw his guilty plea. There's David now officially going to trial. The judge deemed that there was enough evidence, which hello, obviously, but officially now moving forward to trial. A lot of things that came out in the preliminary hearing that are very disturbing. And one of the biggest questions I think so many people had was, okay, what did Celeste's

• 2:34Annie Elise?

  family know? And we're getting a little bit more information on that. There's also this horrifying new case with this woman named Sarah who did the Netflix trend that I'm sure so many of you saw where, you know, you sit down in the chair, you're making your fake documentary. I did one for like being addicted to Diet Coke. She did one about her soon to be ex-husband, only to then be murdered by him allegedly shortly after that. There are also updates to cases. There's more audio that has been released in the Nolan Wells case where there's it's been transcribed and like Nancy Grace is on the necks of everyone in that case. There is so much going on. If you're brand new here and

• 3:17Annie Elise?

  it's your one of your first episodes, let me just give you a quick little housekeeping announcement. Mondays, I release a deep dive into a single episode and then Thursdays headline highlights where I break down everything going on in real time this week in true crime. But you know what? I don't do it alone. I like to always have a surprise guest, an expert, a person in the industry or just someone else to weigh in. And, you know, it's unfortunate because we've never had the same guest twice. We just are constantly turning over new guests. So with that, I'd really like to welcome to the show today's episode, Amy Collette. Hello.

• 3:58Speaker 03

  It's such a shock and honor to be here. Thank you.

• 4:01Annie Elise?

  Welcome for your first time ever.

• 4:04Speaker 03

  Ooh, I'm nervous.

• 4:06Annie Elise?

  I also want to apologize to everybody. I know the audio is a little bit trash again this week. It's because we're recording via StreamYard. Back in studio next week with regular equipment, to which Amy, I just have one thing I want to say to you, actually, something I'd like to sing to you, if you'll allow.

• 4:26Speaker 03

  Okay, I'd love to hear.

• 4:28Annie Elise?

  Okay, I'll be ready. I'm coming home. I'm coming home. Tell the world I'm coming.

• 4:37Speaker 03

  I'm not even kidding you. I swear. I wish I would have just started singing because that song was playing in my head when you said we back. And I feel like we share a wavelength of like when it comes to music. I know, but music specifically, we communicate through song.

• 4:54Annie Elise?

  Or by look.

• 4:58Annie Elise?

  No, I have to say though, I know you were not on TikTok. That song is like the trending song for when people are reunited with their family from being overseas with the military, the army. And every single time I cry like a baby when I see those videos. So obviously not comparing our home coming to that, but excited to be back in studio with you.

• 5:21Speaker 03

  There might be some tears. I don't know.

• 5:23Annie Elise?

  Happy tears or sad tears that are back. Everybody's like, we don't want her to come back.

• 5:27Speaker 03

  It'll be a mix.

• 5:28Annie Elise?

  Yeah, great. Well, I know there's a couple of things we have talked about already, like on the side this week. Lots going on. I want to start with this Brian Kohberger update. This guy, I'm trying to like mind my mouth. This guy, I can't even, you know what? I'm not shocked. And I know you know this because when we went on tour last fall, this was a big segment within like the headline highlights portion of the show is I called this months ago. I was like, they're pushing paperwork for it right now. That doesn't make sense because he's already agreed to a guilty plea. Why is this happening? Are they trying to lay the foundation for him withdrawing his plea or

• 6:08Annie Elise?

  filing an appeal? And here we are, what, 10 months later? And sure enough, that is what this guy is doing. So let's kick this off because a bomb was dropped on Monday of this week. Brian Kohberger gave his first interview ever from prison and he gave this interview Sunday night with the New York Times. Now, during this interview, he told them that he was planning to file for a post conviction relief, saying he wants to withdraw his guilty plea. He wants to send the entire case to trial instead. And what I thought was interesting about this too, which let me actually do some admin here really quick. An appeal is different than post conviction relief. Post conviction relief

• 6:53Annie Elise?

  is more of like an umbrella term. It's broader. It's where you still would cite ineffective counsel or different things like that, but it's not necessarily the same exact procedure as filing an appeal. If it doesn't go through, to my knowledge, he then could file a formal appeal, but right now he's trying to do PCR. So what's interesting too is he said, not only does he want to take this to trial, but he, when he didn't go to trial last July and he accepted the guilty plea, part of that arrangement was so that they would remove the death penalty from the table. And he was then sentenced to four consecutive life sentences. But now he's saying, not only does he want to go to trial, but he welcomes the death penalty. And I have some very specific thoughts

• 7:38Annie Elise?

  based on his exact writing in this petition or complaint or whatever you would call it, which, let me start by saying this. I saw a lot of discourse out there of people being like, well, wait, when he pled guilty, he also waived his right to an appeal. Here's where it gets sticky with that. Technically in a lot of states, actually, I think most states with the Supreme Court, but also within Idaho, there is a loophole. It's not, I guess it's a law. So I guess it's not a loophole, but kind of where even if you waive your right to an appeal, there are still circumstances in which you in which you can file one. It's either new evidence being admitted, proof of, of, what's the term I'm looking for? Ineffective counsel or a violation of your constitutional

• 8:23Annie Elise?

  rights. So that's why last fall, when we were talking about this, I was like, oh, I know everybody thinks it's safe. He can't appeal. It doesn't matter. No, that's not entirely true. He can certainly drag this out if he wants to, which he strikes me as the kind of person who will want to do that. So with that, he can file for this PCR and cite ineffective counsel. And what he is saying specifically is that he was tricked into accepting and filing this guilty plea, that he was promised false things, that there was misinformation, that he was under poor advisement. There was also a note in his memo where he said that he was told a different thing about the conditions

• 9:06Annie Elise?

  of what death row in Idaho looked like in comparison to the regular prison system. And we also know that for the better part of a year now, he's been complaining about prison conditions, people threatening, other inmates threatening his life, threatening to sexually assault him, the food he complains about because he's a vegan and he, you know, he can't hack it, obviously. He's been complaining from day one. So the way I read that in this notice that he wrote at hand, he handwrote was that

• 9:39Annie Elise?

  Death row is actually nicer than the prison he's in. So he's like, no, I want to be on death row. It's better and/or let's take this to trial, throw a hail Mary, maybe I'll be found innocent and I'll be exonerated. But if not, putting the death penalty back on the table, at least I'll be sentenced to death. I won't have to continue living out like this in prison for four consecutive life sentences. Like, let's just shoot our shot. So the filing documents were released a few hours after the interview came out. And as I said, he alleges that he was quote convinced to falsely confess to the quadruple murder and burglary, that he was, it was coercion, disinformation,

• 10:22Annie Elise?

  and false promises. He also claimed that he was quote convinced that actual guilt was not an important factor in accepting his plea deal. And he said that he was advised to lie. And as I mentioned, he also goes on to say that he was told quote, "A gross misrepresentation of death row in Idaho, including an elaborate fabricated story of counsel's horrific experience touring an actual eight by eight death row cell." The filing also claims that Brian's attorneys withheld evidence from him and never told him about a supposed quote clump of unknown hair that was found in Ethan Chapin's hand. Now, to me, like I said, it sounds like he's trying to say that he

• 11:05Annie Elise?

  was promised possibly a more comfortable life behind bars if he accepted this deal and the death penalty would be taken off the table. But now, and all of that in comparison to a very uncomfortable life if he went to death row. But now, I think he's realizing that prison life isn't everything that he thought it was going to be. He's in solitary confinement 23 hours a day. Yes, he has a TV and a notebook, but he has food that he hates. He's getting all these threats from other inmates. So I think he'd rather lose the trial and get the death penalty, or, like I said, shoot his shot and hope that he's found innocent because although it's not the majority, there is a big chunk of people out there who believe that he is innocent, that he is either

• 11:50Annie Elise?

  had help, that he is wrongfully convicted, that he was coerced into falsely falsely confessing. I mean, there are, there is a large group out there who believes that. And as we know, if it goes to trial, all it takes is one juror to have a little bit of doubt to throw the whole thing into chaos. Now, when it comes to how the families of the victims feel about this, obviously, they are not happy, enraged, pissed off, like, I can't even imagine what they must be feeling right now. The Gonzales family made a statement on Monday calling Brian Kohberger a narcissist and quote, I love this, "The mosquito you just can't seem to swat." They said, "We would have preferred a death penalty trial. We fully believe in the evidence. Instead, BK received exactly what he

• 12:35Annie Elise?

  asked for, a deal that spared his life. Know this, he hates that life. He wants another chance to roll the dice." And I agree too. I am obviously not a medical professional, so I can't diagnose somebody as a narcissist. But I would bet a lot of my money on the fact that I think Brian is a narcissist. So I think not only is he a pussy and he can't sack these prison conditions, and so now he wants to take a shot and go back to trial. But I also think for him, he kind of wants to relive everything and have enough evidence in there that he thinks proves his innocence and that he once again is outsmarting people. Because wherever you sit with this, anyone who's listening,

• 13:16Annie Elise?

  I've never tried to hide the fact, I think he is guilty. 100%. If you don't, that's your opinion, that is absolutely fine. But I think that it's for him, it's like, oh, I get to go on recess from prison, go into this trial, wear maybe a different outfit if they allow him, look through all the evidence again, torture these families and keep them in purgatory for who knows how long, and just milk the system with a shot of, hey, either I'll get out, or I'll get the death penalty by firing squad and I'll be killed and I won't have to live the rest of my life in this torturous prison. He's a pussy. I hate him. This makes me so angry. What do you think?

• 13:58Speaker 03

  I was gonna call him a pussy. And as I was gonna say, I felt like that was too vulgar, but that's exactly what he is. Because I feel like, number one, he's trying to outsmart, like, he's this criminal justice student. He thinks he's going to be able to commit this murder and get away with it. He's a moron and fucked that up ultimately, got caught. Then he's like, I'm above it all, I'm gonna plead guilty and like, just not even go to trial.

• 14:25Annie Elise?

  Not get any answers, like, yeah.

• 14:27Speaker 03

  And now, I can't stand the food. And I'm a pussy, so I'm gonna put this family now. One thing I did think initially was, how could you put your, the families through this again? However, I know that they did want a trial ultimately, so maybe for them.

• 14:43Annie Elise?

  Not all the families. Yeah.

• 14:45Speaker 03

  And then another thought, when he was saying that when he pled guilty, he didn't think that had anything to do with the guilt behind the crime. So wouldn't you then do like an Alfred plea, where you're saying like, I'll be, say I'm guilty, or like, I'll admit to being guilty and take that plea, but I'm not actually confessing to the crime? Because if that were true, wouldn't he have done that?

• 15:07Annie Elise?

  Well, it depends what they offer you. But also, I mean, to that point, though, he's saying he was advised to lie and that he like, to go against his, he even, I think, one of the direct quotes was, "My actual innocence is the truth, or will prove the truth." Even going as far, which really annoyed the shit out of me to say, "Justice wasn't served in this case because the public never got a trial and had the opportunity to see all the evidence." Yeah, because you didn't go to trial, you took a plea deal. But my point to what you said is that, yeah, this guy was on the road to a PhD. When you're going through that paperwork and you're accepting a plea deal, and when the judge is asking you repeatedly, point blank, do you understand the terms of this

• 15:47Annie Elise?

  agreement? Are you guilty? And you are verbally giving a yes, a yes. You're telling me, you're so smart, you were on the road to PhD and like, you didn't fully understand, or you were somehow coerced or tricked, but you're this smart, brilliant guy, this criminology major? Give me a break.

• 16:04Speaker 03

  Well, and also, am I wrong in saying, I thought it was, it was my understanding that death row is better living conditions. I have always thought that. So as a criminal justice student, wouldn't you have known that too?

• 16:17Annie Elise?

  Well, so yes, that's why in his thing, he's saying that the counsel told him that when they toured it, the conditions were not good. And so I think that's where he's like, oh, death row isn't going to be great and cozy and comfy. It's going to be better to be in, not gen pop, obviously, but solitary in the prison system. And now I think he's realizing it is better. So he's like, oh, no, I want that cushy lifestyle of death row.

• 16:41Speaker 03

  I mean, I think what the public needs to do is just, not that they haven't already, just publicly shame the fuck out of this guy and make him feel like the idiot he is, because that's the whole thing. He is a narcissist. His ego is everything. He continues to think he's like, beating the system or making some big point. And at the end of the day, it's just further making him look like the coward, weak, pathetic loser that he is. And I think more than anything, that's what he doesn't want, is people to like, have him go down thinking, or make him go down, people thinking out of him. So.

• 17:14Annie Elise?

  I think back to Kaylee's sister Olivia's statement in court against him, where she just like, eviscerated him and like, brought him to his knees, basically, of like, what a weasel he is. And, look, I don't know that there's, he's got a leg to stand on in this situation. I truly do not think it will go anywhere. But I've been fooled before, you know, you never know. And like I said, I don't know if you've had as much visibility to it as I have just from like, the comments and DMs that I receive. But there are so many people who think that he is innocent. And so I'm not trying to come for you guys. If you believe that, don't yell at me in the comments, being like, Annie, you're attacking this guy, he's innocent. Like, we're all entitled to our

• 17:54Annie Elise?

  own opinions. My opinion is based on the evidence and based on the fact that he admitted his guilt, okay? But I'm not going to come for you for having your opinions. But like, yeah, I just, I don't like any of this.

• 18:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:09Annie Elise?

  I know. Now.

• 18:10Speaker 03

  You always say you hope that you'll never have to talk about him again. And then he is that mosquito that you cannot swat.

• 18:16Annie Elise?

  Exactly. Steve was spot on with that comparison. Now, speaking of other absolute trash humans, we've got to talk about David Anthony Burke and everything that went down in the preliminary hearing. He's officially going to trial. And we got to talk about, you know, not only the big takeaways that came out through the prelim, especially on Monday, but also what happened over the weekend. Because you guys probably have seen it in your social media feeds, but on Sunday, a song was very quietly uploaded to David's official Apple Music page. The song was titled, "I Did It." And the cover art was his, of the album, was his black Tesla sitting in that Hollywood

• 19:00Annie Elise?

  tow yard with the front trunk open, which is obviously how we, you know, we know where they discovered Celeste's remains. So, Apple Music also gives you a little bit of a preview of songs, which I didn't know. I don't use Apple Music. I use Spotify, not for any reason, it's just that it's on my phone. But apparently, it gives you like, a little preview of a song before you can listen to the entire thing. And after people started listening to that preview, it became pretty obvious that this was not actually a new song, that it was an older song. And more than that, the lyrics are what had people talking. It was apparently the same song that was leaked back in September of 2025, titled "Celeste." And it included the lyric, "Celeste, the girl with my

• 19:44Annie Elise?

  name tattooed on her chest." There also was a lyric about being like, left in the Tesla. I'm sorry, I didn't mean for that to happen. Things that made people ask like, okay, was he admitting to this in his music? There's obviously been this big conversation about him blurring the lines between fantasy and reality and him. Allegedly murdering Celeste as a way to bring his quote unquote art to life, if you can even call it that. So people started talking and there was a lot of buzz. I didn't want to talk about it over the weekend because my first thought when I saw this and heard it, I was like, I don't think that there's proof that this is an AI generated.

• 20:25Annie Elise?

  I don't think that he is some mastermind that scheduled this upload to happen or had his manager release it or anything like that. I think that somebody probably hacked Apple Music. So I was like, you know, I'm gonna take a beat. Before I talk about this, let's like just see where this goes. And sure enough, it was a hacker, but a lot of people thought that it was real. I think even still to this day, a lot of people think that it was real, which if you are one of those people, it isn't. It is not real. So basically, it was a hacker who hacked in, put this song in there, which what a disgusting thing to do and like, exploit this young girl's murder and this high profile case to like,

• 21:06Annie Elise?

  then put music on hack in, put music on his account, saying he did it like, and send everybody into a tailspin. It's just so gross, in my opinion. So the internet being the internet, there were a lot of wild theories, as I said, floating around. Some people thought that it had been planned ahead of time or that David wanted this song to come out now because he was going to plead guilty and he wanted it to like be in line with that release. Others wondered if maybe he was going to try to take a plea deal. And so this was some kind of confession before doing that. People even went as far as to say that he was only using the court process to buy time and to move money around before eventually pleading guilty.

• 21:49Annie Elise?

  Which personally, I don't buy any of that. I really do think that the hacker theory is what makes the most sense. So the song was eventually removed after being up for 24 hours. And as of right now, nobody involved in the case has said a word about it. It was just all a very strange thing that happened over the weekend. So let's now move on to the preliminary hearing because Monday was the fourth and final day. And I released, if you missed it, you may have, you know, I release bonus episodes, guys. So I've got to keep you on your toes. And that's one of the reasons you should either follow the podcast or subscribe on YouTube so you don't miss those bonus episodes. But I released about an hour and a half bonus episode on Sunday, recapping everything that had gone on in the preliminary hearing up until that point.

• 22:34Annie Elise?

  So you can go back to that, listen, we talked through a lot of the evidence that was presented, some of the autopsy, uh, things that were discovered, we go through everything. But then Monday was the final day. So prosecutors continued walking through the evidence, starting the day with thousands of text messages between David and Celeste. And they told the court that the two of them exchanged somewhere between 8,000 and 9,000 text messages before her death. They then focused on the messages from April 22nd through April 26th, including the night that Celeste took that Uber to David's house. So those records show David ordering the Uber for her, tracking her ride,

• 23:15Annie Elise?

  and Uber records confirming that she arrived at his home around 10:10 PM that evening. However, very surprisingly, there was no surveillance outside of the house of him meeting her outside or her walking in. There are cameras all out front of the house, so maybe they were down, maybe they were wiped, maybe she went in through the side gate. Who really knows? But I did think it was interesting that they had this digital trail and footprint, but then they didn't have the surveillance image to back it up of her entering the house or him coming out to meet her. And it's alleged that he was playing video games with his friends while she was en route to his house. So then there's also no witnesses, apparently, and I'll get to this in a moment, that we know of, who saw her come into the house that night.

• 24:00Annie Elise?

  So I could see where the defense was trying to poke some holes here. But they also then talked about the 20 minute window after she arrived, leading to when they believe she was murdered within that 20 minute span. And him just luring her there, blitz attacking her, and then standing by as she bled out. Through all of this, David remained pretty much emotionless as he had the entire preliminary hearing. And as prosecutors read through text after text between him and Celeste, he mostly just stared straight ahead, just very, very blankly. Then during the defense's questioning, he spent most of the time looking down at the table in front of him. But overall, there just really wasn't much of a reaction from him at all.

• 24:44Annie Elise?

  So then both sides got to their closing arguments where they like wrap everything up, trying to convince the judge that there is enough evidence to move this forward to trial. And honestly, this was probably one of the biggest parts of the day. Because the defense argued that the prosecutors hadn't actually proven any of the three special circumstances that they're trying to attach to the murder. Which if you remember, there's first lying in wait and the fact that he premeditated this, lured her to the house and was waiting for her arrival so that he could murder her. They said that there was no evidence that David had planned some sort of ambush, pointing out that Celeste was actually the one pushing to come over that night. And that David, as I said, had been online gaming with friends shortly before she arrived.

• 25:29Annie Elise?

  So I wanted to backtrack a moment to a preliminary hearing. You don't have to put all your cards on the table. You just have to show enough to the judge to say, here's the evidence we do have, not all of it. Here's enough that we think will convince you to take this to trial. So I have no doubt in my mind that there is stronger evidence that will prove that when it goes to trial, especially because of the language that was included in the prosecutor's brief when they say that after Celeste was killed, he stood by and waited as she bled out, which indicates that he either was watching that her bleed out, that he possibly recorded her bleeding out, that there was something happening because they used very specific language.

• 26:13Annie Elise?

  So I think that they absolutely will prove that. And I do think to an extent that Uber proved that as well. But anyways, the defense was arguing that. The other special circumstance was financial gain. The defense said that the prosecutors were basically guessing when they said that David killed Celeste to protect his career. They said that future music earnings are too speculative to count as financial gain under the law. Therefore, there would be no way to know if there would even be money to gain in the future. Which I guess, I mean, the way they had laid it out, it was like a minimum guarantee of 3 million per album, upwards of 6 million per album, sponsorships with like Crocs,

• 26:55Annie Elise?

  it was Adidas or Nike, all of these things that then totaled upwards of like 17 million dollars in earning potential. But it's not guaranteed money necessarily. But that does seem to be the strongest motive because Celeste was threatening to out their relationship to people and to destroy his career. So it seems kind of odd for them to be like, oh no, there's not enough money at play to prove. When it's like, well, no, there was like almost 20 million dollars on the line for him. That is very strong and compelling. Then finally, there was this special circumstance of the allegation that he killed Celeste to keep her from becoming a witness against him. The defense argued that there wasn't any evidence that she had actually threatened to go to the police,

• 27:35Annie Elise?

  saying that everything supporting the special circumstances was all just circumstantial evidence and assumptions. But again, that ties in, in my opinion, with the financial gain piece of it. Obviously, by silencing her and murdering her, you are protecting your assets, but also you are hindering her from becoming a witness against you if that relationship becomes public knowledge. So of course prosecutors completely disagreed. They argued that whilst Celeste may have arranged to come over, she of course had no idea what was waiting for her. They said that David knew that she was coming, unlocked the gate and door for her and was waiting for her to get there. They also argued that protecting a multimillion dollar career absolutely could qualify as financial gain

• 28:20Annie Elise?

  and that Celeste had become a serious threat to both his reputation and his future. And then there was one moment that really stuck with everyone in the courtroom, apparently. Prosecutor Beth Silverman ended part of her argument by saying, quote, "Her body turned to liquid while he went on tour." According to reporters who were there, someone in the courtroom quietly whispered right after hearing that, Jesus, under their breath, because she so bluntly illustrated what he allegedly did to her remains, just letting her rot in the car. Another big bombshell that I forgot to mention that came out during all of this on Monday

• 28:59Annie Elise?

  is that apparently Celeste's family knew about their friendship, relationship, connection, whatever you want to call it. He apparently had gone to church with her family and met her family. We know that he had taken her to Texas to meet his family. And whether or not she lied about his age or whatever excuse could come up there, obviously, they know he's a celebrity, he's a singer, they could, one quick Google search shows you his age, so I'm not buying that for a second. And even more than that, the parents signed off on her traveling internationally as a minor with him to London. So they knew that there was something going on between the two of them.

• 29:38Annie Elise?

  And again, way more evidence of exactly like what they knew and the knowledge they had will come out during the trial. But my mind, I've seen some, I've seen some theories floating around out there too about like a possible immigration issue and that David was like threatening to call immigration on them if they didn't allow their relationship or something to that effect. I don't know how true that is. And I don't know if they, I don't know what their immigration status is, but. To me, when I first heard that, and I don't know if you'll agree with this, Amy, my mind immediately went to R. Kelly. And I was like, oh, this kind of feels just like a playbook back then when like, R. Kelly was promising the family and the parents of these young girls,

• 30:22Annie Elise?

  I'm gonna make her a star, I'm gonna take care of her, I'm gonna make her famous, to where the parents get so swept up in that of their child having a better life than they did and all of these things. And they get kind of glamorized by the celebrity of it all, that they allow these things to happen. And I don't know that he was making any promises of that nature. Possibly, again, we will find out more in the trial when that happens. But my mind went to R. Kelly, for sure. So by the end of the day, the judge ruled that the prosecutors had presented enough evidence for the case to move forward on all charges and all special circumstance allegations. So David's gonna remain behind bars without bail, and his next hearing is scheduled for August 31st.

• 31:07Annie Elise?

  However, one of the biggest moments actually came after court wrapped up. Because outside of the courthouse, the DA told reporters that prosecutors have precipitant witnesses that they plan to call during the trial. Which basically, a precipitant witness is someone who has firsthand knowledge of an event or an act that occurred. Either because they personally saw something, or experienced something, or received possibly like a message of sorts related to the case. It's not an expert witness, it's not someone giving opinions, it's someone who was actually there or has direct knowledge of the act and what happened. Now, we still have no idea who those witnesses are, how many of them they have, what they know.

• 31:51Annie Elise?

  But hearing that prosecutors have firsthand witnesses waiting to testify, it definitely got a lot of attention and has a lot of people thinking, oh, his friends have flipped. Maybe Neo, maybe his, the girl who was involved, is her name Ayesha? I can't remember. Like, how many friends flipped? We also know that a lot of them were a part of the grand jury proceedings. So what's going to come out at trial? I mean, we also have seen, with what we've seen so far during the preliminary hearing, that's only a very small portion of the evidence, as I said. So there is going to be a lot that comes out during the trial. So as usual, I'm gonna be watching for updates on this. A trial date could be set as soon as 60 days from now.

• 32:33Annie Elise?

  We also know that his team has been advocating his innocence from day one, so they may not file motion after motion, they may want a speedy trial. But I don't know, we'll see where this goes. I'm curious to see what happens.

• 32:47Speaker 03

  I mean, I think the writing's on the wall. And like, this guy is another one that just feels like he's above the law, like a Brian Kohberger, where it's like, you're parading around with this underage girl, you're going with her to her family. And again, who knows how they were presenting the nature of their relationship? But he's obviously, his friends were aware, business people were aware. So he's teetering that line already. Then he's feeling like, oh, maybe either she's gonna out me, or if somebody else does, because now, the length of time they've been together, how many people now at this point might know about it? And then if she's a scorned, you know, girl in love or whatever, and wants to come forward, she's a threat. And so not only does he allegedly take her life,

• 33:31Speaker 03

  but then, to your point, goes on tour and just has complete disregard for her. So it's like, the most selfish piece of shit ever. And then now, it's like, you're going to court and you have no remorse. And of course, you're staring blankly because there is nothing, I'm sure he knows his entire world is gonna come down on him, and the evidence is just, I'm sure, stacking up.

• 33:56Annie Elise?

  You said something really interesting, the scorned piece of it. That's something I talked about in the deep dive episode that released Sunday, which you guys can find it in the feed, you can also find it on YouTube. But one of the things that the defense tried to bring up towards the end of last week in the preliminary hearing, was that those stab wounds could have been self-inflicted. Trying to almost paint Celeste as this like, unhinged, unwilling to let him go, that she could have done this to herself. And I also share in that episode, and I think I talked with you about this offline a little bit, Amy, what I think the defense's strategy is going to be as to him not being responsible for the murder, but more so the cover-up, and that he panicked.

• 34:37Annie Elise?

  And I go into a lot of detail in that episode about what exactly I think they're going to lay out. We'll see if any of that happens. Obviously, I'm not a lawyer, so maybe they have a better strategy in place. But I did go into all the details of that in that episode, too.

• 34:51Speaker 03

  That's crazy that it could go to trial so quickly.

• 34:54Annie Elise?

  Mm-hmm, I know.

• 34:56Speaker 03

  I hope it does.

• 34:58Annie Elise?

  Same.

• 34:59Speaker 03

  Well, we have an update, this is just a quick one, on the Brooke Hanlon case that I talked about last week, because there's been a little bit of new information that's come out. And if you remember, Brooke's husband Connor Hanlon was the one who called 911 on June 6th after saying he found Brooke upstairs in the master bedroom of their New Jersey home. And remember, their home is in like, a remote area that's not near any neighboring homes. And she was unconscious, not breathing, and had what he had described as large lacerations to her chest. And here's that 911 call again.

• 35:34Speaker 04

  911 for you for emergency.

• 35:37Speaker 05

  339, 339 Pottersville Road, Chester, New Jersey.

• 35:44Speaker 04

  Okay, that's, bear with me one moment.

• 35:47Speaker 05

  Oh my God, I need, I need an ambulance.

• 35:51Speaker 04

  Okay, 339 Pottersville Road in Chester Township, is that correct?

• 35:54Speaker 05

  Chester Township, Chester Township.

• 35:57Speaker 04

  Okay, is there a floor apartment of room numbers, is this a private home?

• 35:59Speaker 05

  A private home.

• 36:00Speaker 04

  Okay, you call?

• 36:01Speaker 05

  Yes, yes, yes, yes.

• 36:02Speaker 04

  Okay, tell me exactly what happened? I know you said your wife is bleeding.

• 36:07Speaker 05

  My wife, my wife, I don't know what's going on. CPR, I need CPR, there's instructions.

• 36:12Speaker 04

  Okay, she's not breathing or conscious?

• 36:16Speaker 05

  Oh my God, there's, there's a laceration in her.

• 36:21Speaker 04

  Okay, sir, bear with me one moment. We're getting up there, just stay in the line, they need some more information, okay?

• 36:30Speaker 05

  Please, I don't know what to do, I need you here, I need you here immediately.

• 36:35Speaker 04

  Sir, so she is, she is bleeding and she's not, she's not conscious, is that correct? Okay, okay.

• 36:42Speaker 05

  Oh, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God.

• 36:46Speaker 04

  All right, sir.

• 36:50Speaker 04

  All right, the paramedics have been sent, just stay in the line.

• 36:52Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. What?

• 36:56Speaker 04

  If, if there's a defibrillator available, send someone to get it now and tell me when you have it, sir.

• 37:00Speaker 05

  No, I don't have one, I don't have.

• 37:01Speaker 04

  Not available, okay.

• 37:03Speaker 05

  I don't know what to do, I don't know what, what the fuck, what the fuck?

• 37:07Speaker 03

  So now, as of late last week, newly released dispatch audio is giving us a little bit of a better idea of what the first responders were thinking almost immediately after they got there. It turns out that just 13 minutes after that 911 call was placed, and just less than two minutes after the officers were on the scene, this first responding officer can be heard telling dispatch suspicious death right now. And almost immediately after that, the major crimes team was then assigned to the case. Then after the death was labeled as suspicious, a high-ranking official with the Morris County Sheriff's Office can be heard over the radio asking when the original 911 call came in and who had placed it.

• 37:49Speaker 03

  And then dispatch had responded that the caller was James Connor Hanlon. And if you remember, this was, there was a lot of speculation going on, and we talked about that last week. Because as of now, nearly two months after Brooke's death, there are still no arrests of the men made, no suspects that have been publicly identified, or persons of interest. But Connor went MIA, no one can find him. We also know that oftentimes stab wounds can be a result of a crime of passion. So there was a lot of chatter going on, and a lot of people thinking that it was potentially the husband or someone close to Brooke. So the Morris County Medical Examiner's Office has confirmed that Brooke's autopsy determined her cause of death

• 38:33Speaker 03

  to be multiple sharp force injuries, and officially ruled her death as a homicide. But literally, there was no additional information that has come out over the last two months. So the community is still reeling, and of course, all eyes are focused on Connor at this point. But we'll see if there's any more information that comes out. I think it's definitely, obviously alarming that the first responding officer immediately clocked it as a suspicious death. Then Connor goes MIA. So maybe they're just collecting evidence at this point to try to build a stronger case, but we'll be following it to see what new evidence comes out.

• 39:12Annie Elise?

  I remember, too, there was that really small reward that was placed, which that could have been to like, make it seem like whoever was responsible to lead them to believe that they were not on their track, or you know, something like that, to kind of pull them off course. But yeah, when we had released the episode last week, the majority of the comments I saw, which, I get it, a lot of people are quick to be like, the husband did it, the husband did it. But a lot of the comments were like, something shady, especially that 911 call where he's like, there's a large lash, laceration, like, and the word, like, the words he chose. So, yeah, I don't know.

• 39:45Speaker 03

  I mean, to have something like that be investigated for two months, and you live in this kind of remote area, you would think there would be some sort of evidence left behind, or evidence of a forced break-in, or text messages, or something that would allude to some or other type of suspect or person or motive. So at this point, if there's nothing that's come out, I don't know.

• 40:11Annie Elise?

  Building their case.

• 40:12Speaker 03

  That's kind of what it feels like to me.

• 40:14Annie Elise?

  Yeah. Today's episode is sponsored by ZENNI. All right, you guys know we all have those things on our to do list that we keep putting off. For me, it is grocery shopping, it's decorating for the holidays, it's so much stuff. And for some reason, getting new glasses, it always seems to be one of them too. But honestly, I realized it doesn't have to be such a production. That's where ZENNI comes in. They make shopping for prescription glasses and sunglasses so easy with frames starting under $30. You can browse tons of cute styles. You can virtually try them on too. You can enter your prescription, customize your lenses. And the best part is then you have everything shipped right to your door. And you can get, I recently got not only a new pair of prescription, but also blue light.

• 40:58Annie Elise?

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• 41:41Annie Elise?

  All right, so we have another pretty big update in the case of Nolan Wells. I did a deep dive on this a couple of weeks ago. So if you are not familiar with that case, I highly encourage you to go get caught up. It is a wild one. We've been talking about it for weeks. But as a refresher, Nolan was out with his friends on Horn Island in Mississippi on the 4th of July. Then somehow, two days later, he was found dead in the water on the shoreline of Horn Island. Investigators still haven't released his official cause of death. And honestly, the stories about what happened that day just keep getting more and more confusing. Initially, his friends were taking the boat back to the mainland and they said that he wanted to stay on Horn Island with a girl that he met.

• 42:26Annie Elise?

  Yet the girl said that she saw him get back on the boat with his friends. So there were two conflicting accounts right there. The autopsies have been not conclusive in every single aspect. An independent autopsy that was performed at the direction of the family couldn't be, it was completed, but it couldn't fully be completed because, this is going to be gross, but certain organs and body parts of Nolan's were missing after the first autopsy had been performed. I mean, it's just, it's a very tragic case and one that has a lot of people divided. This is the one that I said earlier, that like Nancy Grace has her foot on everybody's necks over this case, okay?

• 43:07Annie Elise?

  So one of the biggest new developments is that the young woman that Nolan was reportedly talking to before he disappeared has now been identified. She's 19 year old Katie McCormick, a college student from a town just east of Ocean Springs where Nolan lived. Now, as I said from the beginning, Nolan's friends said that after their boat started taking on water, they were going to leave. Nolan decided to stay behind so that he could hang out with her. He planned to then later catch a ride back to the mainland with another group who had been partying on the island that day. However, now Katie's sister Gracie is saying that that's not what Katie believed happened. According to Grace, Nolan wasn't staying behind to spend time with Katie. She said that Katie actually assumed that Nolan was getting back on that same boat that he came on.

• 43:52Annie Elise?

  And she also said that she believed that these friends who were telling him to get on the boat wouldn't have just left him there. She also said that Katie was there with a completely separate group of people that day and that she eventually left the island with her brother and his fiance. Katie herself, at this time of this recording though, hasn't publicly spoken out about what happened. But she did comment on social media, writing, "What's understood doesn't have to be said. I love y'all, just pray for his family and friends. This is a terrible situation all in all." According to her family, she's been fully cooperative with both investigators and Nolan's family. The family's attorney, Ben Crump, says that that's exactly why these conflicting stories matter. Katie's side said that Nolan was getting on the boat, but Nolan's friends say that he stayed behind.

• 44:37Annie Elise?

  Specifically, the attorney said, "She's saying he went to get on the boat. They're saying he didn't get on the boat. So which is it? Somebody must not be telling the truth." Authorities still haven't identified any suspects though. They also haven't said whether or not they do believe that there was foul play involved. And they haven't released his official cause of death. Then another interesting piece of this case also came out this week, and this has everybody talking. Because audio was released from a phone call that Nolan's friends had made to a private company called Seeto after their boat started taking on water near the west tip of Horn Island. This call has been broadcast everywhere, transcribed.

• 45:19Annie Elise?

  And people believe they can hear friends in the background, basically acknowledging that Nolan was or had died or was dying. So here's the beginning of that call.

• 45:46Annie Elise?

  Seeto assistant, Vicky speaking, how can I help you?

• 45:49Speaker 06

  Hey, we're at the west tip of Horn and our village pump stopped working. We're going, we're sinking. Can y'all please come? We have a membership.

• 45:59Annie Elise?

  All right, of course. How far is the water coming up, sir? Can you give me a description? Ankles?

• 46:08Speaker 06

  What'd you say? Hey.

• 46:10Annie Elise?

  Is the, yes, how far is the water coming up, sir?

• 46:14Speaker 06

  Uh, it's coming up, it's, we're just sinking. I don't know, like, we're, we're going down.

• 46:19Annie Elise?

  In the recording, the caller tells the dispatcher, "Hey, we're at the west tip of Horn and our pump stopped working. We're sinking. Can y'all please come?" The dispatcher asks if everyone is on board and the caller responds, "Yeah, yeah, everyone's on board." Then he asks for the boat to be pumped out and towed back to Fort Bayou, saying that there were about seven people on board. But while that call was happening, the Seeto captain said that he had already talked to the owner of the boat, who they thought was the caller's grandpa, who reportedly told him that the teens didn't actually need help at the moment, but that if anything changed, he'd call back. So all of that to say, since that call was released, people, like I said, have started enhancing that background audio.

• 47:01Annie Elise?

  Not the person who was actually making the call, but all the friends talking in the background. And this is something that has been shown as a transcript out there. I want to just vocalize right now, I can't with 100% certainty say that I hear these things in the background. But this is the transcription that is being broadcast out there on several different news channels and independent journalist channels and things like that. So after enhancing the background audio, people are claiming that they hear things like, "He's dead." Or, "Oh my God," and "Check his chest." And in the beginning of the call, you could kind of hear under the hold music, you know, when people put you on hold, it's like doo doo doo doo doo. You could kind of hear that there is a lot of commotion going on.

• 47:44Annie Elise?

  But like I said, none of the interpretations have been verified, even though that transcript is floating around like quotes of Nolan's dead. Is he like, Nolan, get up, man, get up, man, all of these different things. So some of the clips could certainly be AI, you never know. And people enhance things in all different ways these days. Others could be people hearing different things in poor audio quality and thinking that they heard something because they want to hear something. And investigators haven't confirmed if any of these phrases actually were said. So for now, we are still left with even more questions than we had a few days ago or even a week ago. Maybe by the time this episode comes out, there will be more information on that call as a total. I don't know.

• 48:27Annie Elise?

  But this case is definitely still on my radar. I'm looking for any updates that come out. I will let you know once we hear of anything new. That deep dive is available if you want to go back and listen. Something doesn't feel right. And I'm not one to say, I think something shady automatically happened. I think the friends are responsible. I don't know, but I do think since they haven't been able to rule out foul play, since there is not an official cause of death yet, and because the friend and the girl have conflicting stories, there is something weird here, like.

• 48:59Speaker 03

  Which side do you believe on?

• 49:01Annie Elise?

  I don't know. I really don't know. I don't know. I don't know. The family, Nolan's family, is very adamant that there's more to the story here, as is the family attorney Ben Crump. So, and I'll say this too, the majority of what I'm seeing out there online, just through public chatter, is that they believe the friends are involved and that they're covering this up. Because early on too, one of the friend's mother, who's a judge, was very involved in it, was making a lot of public statements, and they thought that maybe there were some cover-ups happening and collusion and things like that, which I break all of that down in the earlier deep dive. But I don't know where I'm at right now. I feel I need information.

• 49:40Speaker 03

  Katie is cooperating, and that she, it doesn't feel like she's being too defensive in her statement. She's kind of just saying like, I don't need to say anything. You guys know the information. And what's important is just like getting to the bottom of this and like, for the family. And I don't know. Something tells me, yeah, it's the friends that are hiding some information and like,

• 50:03Annie Elise?

  Okay.

• 50:04Speaker 03

  maybe a little nervous that they were gonna get caught or something.

• 50:08Annie Elise?

  Alright, alright.

• 50:09Speaker 03

  We'll see.

• 50:10Annie Elise?

  Alright, we'll see. We'll see, O'Brien.

• 50:14Speaker 03

  Well, we have another case that's just absolutely awful, that has a lot of people talking, and this one came out of Missouri. Uh, this one all started on the early morning hours of June 23rd, when deputies were called to a home in New London, Missouri for a medical emergency. I don't know if you've heard about this one.

• 50:31Annie Elise?

  No, I haven't.

• 50:32Speaker 03

  But when the first responders arrived, they found thirty-six-year-old Alexandra Ali Hummel unresponsive from inside the home. And despite all their efforts to save her, she was pronounced dead at the scene. An autopsy was ordered, but over a month later, investigators still have not yet released her cause or manner of death. They also haven't said whether foul play is suspected. So officially, everyone just, uh, there is nothing official. Everyone just has a lot of unanswered questions and a lot of unknowns surrounding her death. But what was strange was almost immediately after the news of Ally's death broke, people started looking back at something that had happened earlier last year with her husband. So another issue with her husband.

• 51:18Speaker 03

  Her husband's esteemed anesthesiologist, Dr. Andrew Hummel. And this all took place on a vacation that they took last year in St. Louis. So check this out. Back on July 4th of 2025, so almost a year ago, Ally and Andrew were staying at a Hilton Hotel near St. Louis right before leaving for a trip to Jamaica, and police were called out for a domestic disturbance. Usually, these are always red flags and indicative of a bigger issue. Because when officers arrived, they found Andrew with a cut on his hand and blood inside the hotel room, and later found Ally hiding inside of a woman's bathroom in the hotel lobby with a swollen lip. And according to court records,

• 52:01Speaker 03

  Ally had told the officers that during an argument, Andrew had strangled her multiple times until she couldn't breathe and had also hit her in the face. And a guest also staying in the hotel in the room next door to them had said that they could hear arguing and that they heard a woman repeatedly screaming, "Get off me", before hotel staff later then called 911. So there was this disturbance in the hotel room. Obviously, people next door heard it. The hotel staff was alerted enough to then call 911. So Andrew was initially charged with second-degree domestic assault for that strangulation, along with third-degree domestic assault for striking Ally. Then he was released after posting bond, but he was ordered to wear this ankle monitor,

• 52:46Speaker 03

  which I've never heard of this before. I've heard of like those breath things that you have to take in your car after a DWI. But this was an ankle monitor that would test his sweat every single thirty minutes, twenty-four hours a day, to detect alcohol. And, and this all happened during his arraignment last September when he pleaded not guilty. So alcohol must have been a pretty big factor in this domestic disturbance. I've never heard that as a punishment. Then on March 12th of this year, he took a plea deal. He pleaded guilty to two misdemeanor counts of fourth-degree assault. He was sentenced to one year in jail on each count, but both sentences were suspended, which means he never actually served any jail time for that.

• 53:28Speaker 03

  Instead, he was given two years of probation in order to remain sober, complete substance abuse and psychological evaluations, undergo domestic violence assessment, and attend a domestic violence victim impact panel. And then after the assault, the hospital where he was an anesthesiologist at actually revoked his privileges, so he could no longer practice there. However, he was still able to hold on to his medical license and practice anesthesiology in other medical facilities. But then came the night where Ally was found. Around 7:30 that evening, police received reports of a pickup truck driving erratically on Highway 61 outside Bowling Green, Missouri. Witnesses say the truck rear-ended a semi,

• 54:10Speaker 03

  but when the semi driver got out to exchange information, the pickup driver allegedly tried to run him over before speeding away. However, witnesses were able to get the truck's license plate, and it was connected back to Andrew. And when he and Ally got home that night around 10:00 PM, police officers were already waiting there for them. Ally reportedly told police that she was the one driving, not Andrew. And as a result, she was arrested that night for a DWI and for fleeing the scene of an accident. And just hours later, deputies were called back to that exact same home for that medical emergency where Ally was found unresponsive. Now, authorities have not connected Ally's death to last year's assault case.

• 54:52Speaker 03

  And like I said, they haven't announced a manner or cause of death. But since her death, several friends and family members and neighbors have come out, shared what they had witnessed over the years. Some neighbors say that they saw Ally with black eyes and bruises. One neighbor even said that Ally would mow the lawn in the summer wearing a hoodie and large sunglasses to cover the injuries on her face. Friends have also said that Ally was afraid to leave the marriage because she believed that Andrew would kill her if they did. Some claim they even went to the police themselves with the concerns, but were told there wasn't really much authorities could do unless Ally chose to press charges herself. And to be clear, none of this has been confirmed by authorities, but it's definitely raised a lot of eyebrows in the case.

• 55:36Speaker 03

  Because obviously, there was this huge incident that happened a year ago. Friends have witnessed these things throughout the course of their marriage. And then now, there's this medical incident where they're called to the home, and Ally's unresponsive. Friends have described Ally as someone who had an infectious smile, a laugh that could brighten any room. She was a nurse, a mom to one son, loved her four dogs, and was known for always putting other people first. And so for now, we just sit without answers, and her friends and family are just wondering what happened. And investigators are still looking into her death, and the case is ongoing. So we'll certainly update you with any new information that we get. But I think that it seems like there's a lot of evidence of abuse

• 56:21Speaker 03

  in the relationship outside of even that incident that happened last year. And then the fact that she was covering supposedly in this, or could have been covering for him in this DWI where he gets out and hits the semi. It'll be interesting to hear what that witness testimony looks like. And I'm sure the driver of that semi has more information that would come forward. And if she was in fact concealing that, I think that would show that there was some sort of turmoil in the relationship. And it kind of got me to thinking, like, if that did escalate into what caused her death, was it because he was already, couldn't be practicing at the hospital that he originally worked at as a result of what happened the year before?

• 57:04Speaker 03

  Now, if he was charged with a DWI, I would imagine his license would be completely revoked. And she is probably one of the only few people that knew he was the one driving in that hit-and-run. So I'm just wondering if like, any of that is what caused the escalation? What are your thoughts?

• 57:21Annie Elise?

  Yeah, I mean, I think that there's obviously a history and a pattern here of domestic disturbances there. I would imagine that she probably was covering for him with the DWI. And because he had, he was on probation and all those things, he would have gone to jail if he gave the other driver his identification. So I think she covered. Then I think it could have been something where, rather than trying to silence her, maybe she said like, "Enough is enough. I just took the fall for you. Like, I'm out of here." And that's what made him potentially lash out. I would guess that they are gathering more evidence and building a case. So I'm sure if we don't have an update by the time this episode goes out, I would imagine that there's gonna be one soon.

• 57:59Speaker 03

  Well, and if the, the basis of, or a big part of what this previous charge was, was alcohol-related, since he has to have this monitor on, and then he's drinking and driving.

• 58:10Annie Elise?

  Well, that's what I mean. That's why she probably took the fall.

• 58:13Speaker 03

  Well, yeah, but I mean, I'm just thinking from a criminal perspective. I, I would imagine he feel, is feeling the heat. I mean.

• 58:20Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 58:21Speaker 03

  And from a professional standpoint, so. It's crazy what people do when they feel threatened for getting in trouble. It's like, why would you take, like, why would you risk? Getting in trouble for something far worse than just taking the consequence of drinking and driving.

• 58:38Annie Elise?

  He'd go to jail on probation. Yeah. And so he just probably didn't want that. But it's actually, okay, that kind of takes us into this next case because it's also very, very heartbreaking and has to do with a man and woman, husband, wife. And as more information is coming out, it gets more and more difficult to ask yourself like, could this have been prevented? So late on the night of July 23rd, police were called to a home in Oklahoma after a child inside the house called 911. According to some of the audio that has since been released, a dispatcher told responding officers that they could hear a woman screaming and crying in the background of this call. And they said that there was then some sort of loud bang before the call disconnected.

• 59:20Annie Elise?

  When officers got to the home around 11:15 that night, they found 43 year old influencer Sarah Gilson and her estranged husband, 48 year old Jeremiah Sean Duffy, both dead from gunshot wounds. Investigators say that Sean shot Sarah before then turning the gun on himself. But what makes this case so disturbing is everything that had happened in the weeks leading up to this murder, self harm, self exit situation. Because just 12 days earlier, Sarah posted a TikTok video that has since been viewed by millions of people. And it was a part of that trend that everybody is like posting and joking about, you know,

• 1:00:02Annie Elise?

  sitting down for my Netflix documentary on XYZ, just talking about filming a future documentary and like, you know, it's some little niche funny type thing. Except Sarah, when she posted hers, she wasn't joking. And for those of you watching the video version of this, I'm going to play it for you on the screen. And then for my audio listeners, I will describe it for you. So the text on her video read, preparing for when Netflix drops a documentary about my soon to be ex-husband, who I just found out is a pedo. And in the caption, she wrote, I wish I was joking. And as it turns out, there was already a lot happening behind the scenes. Court records show that Sarah had filed two protective orders against Sean back in 2021.

• 1:00:47Annie Elise?

  However, both of them were dismissed after she didn't show up for the hearings. Then on June 10th of this year, she filed for another emergency protective order. And in this one, she said that Sean had a gun and had threatened to take his own life and had gone on the run. A judge ordered him out of the house immediately and also ordered him to stay at least 100 yards away from Sarah at all times. Few weeks later though, that order was extended through August. But that wasn't the only protective order that was filed that day. Another woman also filed one against Sean on behalf of her 15 year old daughter who played on the youth basketball team that he coached.

• 1:01:27Annie Elise?

  According to court documents, Sean allegedly kissed and inappropriately touched this 15 year old girl. And another coach reportedly caught him in the act. The girl's mother also said that her daughter told her that Sean had sent her messages, inviting her to his hotel room during a tournament and even offered her money to quote, keep quiet. So once all of that was reported, an active investigation was started against Sean for lewd acts against a minor. And that investigation was still ongoing when Sarah was killed. Then just this week, another heartbreaking piece of this story came out. Sarah's first husband, Lyle, spoke publicly and said that he had spent years begging Sarah to leave Sean.

• 1:02:11Annie Elise?

  He said that although they divorced about seven years ago, they had become close friends and they worked really well together as co-parents to their two children. He said that he offered her over and over again to help her leave, but felt like Sean had such a stronghold over her that she just couldn't get away. Lyle also said that Sarah was an incredible mom who would have done absolutely anything for her kids. Then he added that in the end, trying to protect children is what ultimately cost Sarah her life. Which it's just, this case has gone absolutely viral and everybody is talking about it because first you have this TikTok of her sitting down for this faux documentary, saying, you know, wait until they hear about my soon to be ex-husband being exposed as a pedo.

• 1:02:54Annie Elise?

  And something that maybe she finally felt bold enough to call him out, to like, put it on blast to say, I'm divorcing this creep and put it out there. Completely, I'm sure, unknown to her that, or unbeknownst to her, that he would then see that, be sent it, whatever, and then would go and attack her. Then you peel that whole layer back and a child who made this 911 call while this was happening in the house, two dead bodies. The trauma that child has to endure. The long history of a pattern going on here, people trying to intervene and help. And at the root of it, we know that she didn't show up to several of those hearings after the 2021 incident.

• 1:03:34Annie Elise?

  But then when this thing came out about him allegedly via assaulting a 15 year old girl, she couldn't ignore it anymore, spoke up for herself, was leaving. And that that is the catalyst that brought all of this to a head. It's just so sad. It's incredibly sad. And there has a, it's a case that has a lot of people questioning whether there was truly enough done when there were already protective orders in place and an active criminal investigation underway. Like, why wasn't he arrested? Were they still investigating it? Was it an open investigation? Like, why hadn't there been any follow up? And so a lot of people are kind of wondering, and it's also kind, you know, I hate to say it,

• 1:04:16Annie Elise?

  but a lot of these cases, they serve for as educational episodes as well because it helps you identify what red flags to look for. It does help generate awareness. It helps you see the signs of what to look for in potential abusive relationships. And I think this is a good example of, and I don't want to say, I don't want to get this construed where people think I'm trying to say silence yourself. But don't air something like that necessarily on social media unless you, somebody's been arrested, you have protections in place or like, you're sure that they won't retaliate against you or can't retaliate against you. And that's not to say she did anything wrong. Absolutely not. I think she found her voice and she was trying to

• 1:04:58Annie Elise?

  jump on this trend, but also maybe it was therapeutic for her a little bit to vocalize what was going on. But I've seen a lot of people speaking out since then being like, you know, if you're going through something like this, go through the appropriate measures, go to the police, like, don't even risk and jeopardize anything of taking it public yet because look at this perfect example of what this monster then did as a, like, to retaliate against her.

• 1:05:21Speaker 03

  I know. It's, it's heartbreaking and it's a catch 22 and I feel very strongly about this topic, obviously. And just, I, I think that you have this movement that's happened over the last several years of people speaking out about being treated unfairly or wronged or, and, or of this type of subject matter. And I think like, it's important that people still talk out. And I think it's important and I understand too, like you said, finding your confidence and being able to out people that like, the rest of the world doesn't know is a certain way. And it's like, all you want is like that truth to be out. And you almost feel like if I say it out loud and everyone sees it, then nothing can happen to me because I've like exposed it.

• 1:06:05Speaker 03

  But the other side of that is those people are diabolical and have nothing to lose and are desperate. So you're right in the sense of like, you're outing them and now they might get their consequence. But for them, they're too cowardly to ever even live through that consequence. So instead they're gonna punish you and take their own life. And I think that that is the ultimate cowardly thing you can do. And I just feel bad for that. I just feel so badly for the whole situation because I'm sure she felt like she was doing what was right and protecting children. Um, but you're right. You need to be careful and cautious and you never know who that, what that other person's going to do on the other side.

• 1:06:50Annie Elise?

  I know. It's incredibly sad. Now, actually, that kind of brings me into my next topic and it's unrelated, but speaking of children, I have seen a lot of messages and comments and DMs from you guys asking if I am going to cover the Lindsay Clancy trial. You probably have seen it in your feed. She is the mother who is on trial right now for the murder of her three children. I did release an episode this week, but on my other feed, 10 to life. So if you don't follow that podcast yet, go ahead and follow it. And that's where the episode is. It's also over on YouTube. I released it on Tuesday. As a reminder, new episodes between the two podcasts are Monday, Tuesday and Thursday.

• 1:07:30Annie Elise?

  And then of course, some bonus episodes. So you can go listen to that right now. It's 1-0 to life, 10 to life. And I go all through the backstory of what happened in that case, what's been going on in the trial, what we can expect going forward in the trial. I also share a little bit about my own personal experience within the postpartum space. And just talked through everything. So that is available for you right now. So right now you can go back and listen to the David deep dive and everything that happened in the prelim that released Sunday. Monday, I released a brand new episode too. It was on the Netflix documentary Toxic Love Story, which is like the wildest documentary ever. I know it's going viral right now, but of course, as always, a lot was left out. So I dissected that.

• 1:08:15Annie Elise?

  Then, um, Tuesday was Lindsay Clancy. And then of course today, headline highlight. So lots for you to go back and binge this week. That is what I've got for today. Excited to be reunited next week. And I'll be back with you on Monday with an all new deep dive into a case. So until then, be nice, don't kill people, just get a divorce. I think that that really applies today. And don't prey on minor children. And don't be a Brian Coburn.

• 1:08:47Speaker 03

  Ugh, get him out of here.

• 1:08:49Annie Elise?

  I know. All right, guys. Thanks. Bye.

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