Fraud Friday: Fraud van Gogh w/ Jonathan Van Ness

What’s poppin’ con-gregation? Jonathan Van Ness joins us to discuss how Margaret Keane didn’t know that her husband, Walter Keane, was taking credit for her famous “Big Eyed” children paintings popularized during the 1950s and 60s. Plus, find out how one woman found a stack of 70 Chase bank credit cards in her mailbox. Stay Schemin’! (Originally Released 7/26/2022) Follow on Instagram: Scam Goddess Pod: @scamgoddesspod Laci Mosley: @divalaci Jonathan Van Ness: @jvn Sources: https://www.cbc.ca/radio/outintheopen/deception-effects-1.4628704/how-margaret-keane-helped-deceive-the-art-world-1.4629030 https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2014/oct/26/art-fraud-margaret-walter-keane-tim-burton-biopic https://www.widewalls.ch/magazine/margaret-and-walter-keane-art-fraud

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:29Speaker 02

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• 1:58Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. Welcome to an episode of Fraud Fridays, where we release older episodes from the Scam Goddess Vault. That's right, Fraud Fridays is where we bring back your favorite episodes from behind the paywall. Enjoy this episode from behind the paywall, and as always, stay schemin'.

• 2:40Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. Back with another installment of Scam Goddess, the podcast that celebrates robbery, fraud, well, most of it, and the people who participate. Guys, I'm very what? Yes, I'm extremely excited for today's guest. This is a huge get. I feel like I scammed them. You know, you gotta stalk a little bit every now and then. You gotta be in a bush every now and then, in the middle of the night, to get an amazing podcast guest. And I'm willing to do that for you all. Okay, today, we have an Emmy-nominated television personality, comedian, bestselling author, podcaster, hairstylist, and haircare innovator. Check out their Earwolf Podcast and Netflix show at the same damn time,

• 3:24Laci Mosley?

  Getting Curious with Jonathan Van Ness, and also Queer Eye. Don't forget to check out their haircare line, JVN Hair, and their new book entitled, Love That Story: Observations From A Gorgeously Queer Life. Congregation, please welcome Jonathan Van Ness to the show. Jonathan!

• 3:41Speaker 02

  Hi, thanks for having me. I just had this daydream when you were doing that intro that like, wouldn't that be really funny if when I started talking, I had like, a really straight man voice? All of a sudden, they're like, wait, who is this? I was like, hello, thanks for having me. That's as close to a straight man voice as I can do. I can't really do it.

• 3:56Laci Mosley?

  Did it go like, kind of Italian? You're like, hello, thanks for having me.

• 3:59Speaker 02

  I don't know what it is.

• 4:00Laci Mosley?

  Who is that, Jersey?

• 4:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know, Lacey. Yeah, like Bernie Sanders is a straight man? I don't know. Who is that?

• 4:08Laci Mosley?

  I know, that was, it was a very, I love that, though. I love the, I feel like if anybody is aggressively straight, it's probably a New Jersey accent, or like, a Boston accent.

• 4:16Speaker 02

  Yes, northeastern.

• 4:18Laci Mosley?

  Right. But wait, I have to say, so Jonathan, you have a lot of jobs. And normally to me, that indicates we might have like maybe a scammer or at least somebody who enjoys a scam on our hands. You have several employments.

• 4:34Speaker 04

  I do have several employments. I I don't know about like a scam that like I, well, okay, when I think, well, you haven't even gotten here yet, but I was like really racking my brain for scams. And I do feel like, um, I, I did take part in one, but I feel bad about sometimes.

• 4:51Laci Mosley?

  Okay, listen, we all, we all stray. We all have to do what we

• 4:56Speaker 04

  But I only did it for, but I only did it for like, for like seven days.

• 5:01Laci Mosley?

  Okay, so now I'm super curious. What I have to say before we get into that, congratulations on your Emmy nomination again for Queer. That's amazing. That is so amazing. I'm so excited for you.

• 5:13Speaker 04

  I know, I can't believe it.

• 5:14Laci Mosley?

  I mean, who's out here making the girls cry more than This Is Us? You.

• 5:21Speaker 04

  They're snub. I can't believe Mandy Moore didn't get a fucking nomination.

• 5:25Laci Mosley?

  I heard it was because of you.

• 5:27Speaker 04

  No, we're not even up for the same thing.

• 5:29Laci Mosley?

  I know, I'm messing with you. But, but no, but that's amazing. So, um, yeah, you're, you're right into it. What, what is your relationship with scams, Jonathan?

• 5:38Speaker 04

  Well, I'm like so gullible that I like, thought you were like dead serious. I was like, no, no, no, because you know, she's like the lead actress or like

• 5:42Laci Mosley?

  You're so sweet.

• 5:44Speaker 04

  I was like, uh.

• 5:45Laci Mosley?

  You're like, no, I love Walks Who I Remember. I remember it so fondly.

• 5:50Speaker 04

  It was really good. I cried. Her fringe, actually her bangs made me cry in that movie. That fringe was like, what? Like, what were we going through in that era? Anyway.

• 5:58Laci Mosley?

  She was going through a lot. That's why she had the bangs.

• 6:00Speaker 04

  She was, yeah, she was. And she really was. Um, but this is really shameful for me to admit, but I worked at Glamour Shots for a whole week and.

• 6:14Speaker 04

  I did, and it was before I went into hair school and I had the worst job. I had to be the person in the front of the glamour shots. Like it was in the Mall of America, honey. Not the Mall of America, the Mall of America.

• 6:26Laci Mosley?

  Now, is that the big one?

• 6:27Speaker 04

  The big one.

• 6:28Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 6:29Speaker 04

  And I, and I had to stand in front of the, the thing and I had to like flag walkers by to be like, would you like to get your glamour shots today? Like you get your hair and makeup, you get like a full glam situation. Like we got clothes, come on in. So, and that was my only job. Like once I got them in that, and then I went on to the next. So like, I didn't like, I didn't do anything for them like throughout the process, right?

• 6:49Laci Mosley?

  So you disappeared? So you roped them in?

• 6:51Speaker 04

  I disappeared, I roped them in. And these really sweet ladies who said they were sisters, but I believe them to be a lesbian couple. You know, cause this was like 2004 or no, it was 2005. It was like a different era, you know?

• 7:04Laci Mosley?

  But if you're a lesbian couple, would you just be like, you besties? Like that's what we do in the black community. You got that one auntie who always bring her roommate and they always wearing white linen. I haven't heard of saying we're sisters. Like why are we all sisters making out?

• 7:18Speaker 04

  I feel like they were like, um, yeah, they were like, this is a sister. And, um, but then they wouldn't do like this like, but they ended up, they, cause the whole thing was, is that like, and I learned this, I wonder if glamour shots is still in business, whatever. Maybe we bleep glamour shots like Beatrix Kiddo, but like, or maybe we don't. Cause we should put them on blast, cause this is fucked up. So basically they sell you like the biggest bundle first and then like walk you down from there, right?

• 7:40Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 7:40Speaker 04

  So these little, these, you know, ladies, they had like six teeth between both of them. And they gave them the little flippers, honey. So they gave them like, they, they had some like little things.

• 7:50Laci Mosley?

  Glamour shot gave you teeth?

• 7:51Speaker 04

  They gave them some click in teeth, honey. To, and they really like, they just really gave them a full transformation. And then they sold them a package that had like life size cutouts, like all of these things. They had to go to the bank in the Mall of America to re-mortgage their trailer, honey. I got like an $800 commission. They sold them like an $8,000 package where they had to go like, take out a dang loan and they did, like they did.

• 8:17Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 8:18Speaker 04

  And so then when they left, they were like, you just made $800. And I was like, what? They had to reborrow like, and so then like two days later, there was a company meeting, honey, and like the general manager was in like, or like the district manager, right? And you're supposed to wear black or white, right? But I wore this stunning black and white turtleneck that was like the snow on TV.

• 8:38Laci Mosley?

  No rules broke.

• 8:39Speaker 04

  I'd be like, I'd be like, you know, so like the TV goes like black and white, you know? I wore that. It was like that. It was like a little black and white, like thread. It was gorgeous. And this fucking heterosexual man got in my face and was like, do you not know the meaning of black and white?

• 8:54Laci Mosley?

  I mean, that's what you were wearing.

• 8:56Speaker 04

  No, I'm sorry. Do you not? You're so right. Black or white. He said, black or white.

• 9:00Laci Mosley?

  Okay, Michael Jackson. Black or white.

• 9:02Speaker 04

  It was that. And so he was like, you have to go buy a new shirt if you want to work here. And I was like, okay. And so then I just left. I just like walked out, never went back. I was like, I'll be back in 10 minutes. And then I just left. So I left the scam early. I was there for a good seven days. I got like one, like $890 paycheck. And then I never went back, darling. I couldn't stand it, darling.

• 9:22Laci Mosley?

  Okay, see, Jonathan, I can tell you're super sweet because this is just you being employed, which is a scam technically, but, but the fact that you were like, oh, this is just so horrible. Like you teed it up, like you were gonna tell me you were out here, I don't know, playing three card monte or stealing from elderly people and pinching.

• 9:39Speaker 04

  Oh, no, I didn't do that. What I, what is like, I mean, I.

• 9:42Laci Mosley?

  No, I love this because it is a scam, like having someone refinance their home for some photos. Okay, do they at least get to take the fake teeth with them? Because then it's like they got a new dental job.

• 9:51Speaker 04

  But they were like, they were like, they were like glued on flippers. They were like these like teeth, they had to like glue. They were just like, it was like a retainer that teeth on the outside where the top was pink and the bottom were white things. And then you put glue in there and you just like clicked it into whatever was in there. They were like temporary like flippers.

• 10:06Laci Mosley?

  I love the glamour shots was like, oh yeah, we doing dental work too. We do braces. We come to glamour shots. We do acrylic tea. So apparently there's like five stores still, like still five glamour shots around. So you can, y'all go get your, why y'all go to the dentist? You can get your teeth did at glamour shots.

• 10:22Speaker 04

  Glamour shots. They really are doing the most, you know, I have to say, they did great hair and makeup. I mean, they were giving you, and, and, and before 2005, I mean, everybody who was anybody had a glamour shots, honey.

• 10:35Laci Mosley?

  I got my BBL at glamour shots.

• 10:38Speaker 04

  What's that?

• 10:38Laci Mosley?

  They doing it all. Oh, Brazilian butt lift.

• 10:42Laci Mosley?

  They doing it all over there. What y'all want? Both types feeling glamour.

• 10:46Speaker 04

  They really are. What else is like a scam? Oh, bleach and tones are a scam. Like bleach, like bleach and tones are a scam. I feel like I like, cause people come into the salon like wanting a bleach and tone. And you're like, girl, that's like Photoshop. And like it's Photoshop and it's extensions and their roots are yellow, but they photoshopped it white. Like her hair doesn't look like that. Like.

• 11:08Laci Mosley?

  They Photoshop hair? Okay. See, I know they Photoshop hair where they like put pieces. Cause you know, I, when I do photo shoots for work.

• 11:13Speaker 04

  Color.

• 11:14Laci Mosley?

  They'll put your face on another body.

• 11:16Speaker 04

  Oh yeah. Density. They'll Photoshop everything. So like every color, like, yes. So short story. Yes. So when you bring like a picture of a magazine into your hairdresser and you're like, I want this. Well, I would say to people is like, well, what part do you want to start with? Because there's $10,000 of Photoshop. There's $5,000 of extension that glamour team taught or charged. I don't, maybe like 7, 800 each.

• 11:36Laci Mosley?

  Glamour hair? You're not giving them permanent Photoshop when they leave the hair salon?

• 11:40Speaker 04

  I mean, people sometimes just have like really big expectations, honey. Like really big expectations. You're like, I'm a hairdresser. I'm not a plastic surgeon. I'm not a doctor.

• 11:48Laci Mosley?

  Not a miracle worker.

• 11:50Speaker 04

  I'm not, I'm a colorist, which is a artist. Okay. I'm an artist. I'm not a doctor.

• 11:55Laci Mosley?

  Right. You're an artist. Yes. I, what's interesting to me about that couple, cause I now I'm thinking about them so fondly. These sisters are maybe.

• 12:02Speaker 04

  They were really cute. They were so cute.

• 12:04Laci Mosley?

  What did they do with these cutouts? You know?

• 12:06Speaker 04

  I was wondering that. I was wondering that when I heard the story. I was like, where are they gonna put that? Eh eh eh, but I mean, they got like hundreds of wallet sized, like, you know, sheets and sheets of sheets of like the wallet cutouts. Till and like eight by tens and like life size cutout. They got like, like trays, like a lead, like trays with like the pick, like they got everything you could get.

• 12:26Laci Mosley?

  They were like, put it on a T-shirt, put it on a pillow, put it on my panties. Okay?

• 12:30Speaker 04

  Give me the max. Give me the max.

• 12:31Laci Mosley?

  We want a couch with our photos on it. I love this. What if they started a business? It's giving business. Like they took these glamour shots and their new dental work and hair and clothes. And maybe they started a business.

• 12:42Speaker 04

  They did like a before OnlyFans. Like it was like before, like, like early 2000s, like.

• 12:47Laci Mosley?

  Door to door OnlyFans?

• 12:49Speaker 04

  Yes. Door to door OnlyFans. Can I interest you in this like cardboard cutout? But it wasn't that sexy because they were very. You know, it was very, yeah.

• 12:58Laci Mosley?

  Y'all having dinner?

• 12:59Speaker 04

  And those outfits, and those outfits that we, that they left in, that, or that they wore, they didn't leave in them, but their outfits, they would have scared somebody. There was Boas, there was cowboy hats.

• 13:08Laci Mosley?

  Were your locals, probably lesbians, but maybe sisters, and we just want to know if you wanted some personalized photos of us, like a subscription, we come to your house every Thursday during dinner and give you glamour shots of us. Like a door to door OnlyFans is amazing to me. Like, I want that. I want to be a part of that.

• 13:23Speaker 04

  And maybe it was safe back then to do that. I don't know. You know?

• 13:27Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, you can't door to door OnlyFans anymore. You can barely cut co-knives, which is already weird.

• 13:32Speaker 04

  Couldn't do it in 2005 either. Or like, I don't think you could ever really safely door to door, you know? It's like...

• 13:38Laci Mosley?

  I mean, look, the, the, the girlies are still door to door. They definitely were in 2005. It's, how you do it now, I don't understand. But I love that. I love that for them. I hope that they started a beautiful scam business together. That is my prayer. But guys, we're gonna take a quick break for some non-scam advertisements. When we back with our next segment, what is on the front? Scam!

• 13:59Speaker 00

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• 14:28Speaker 05

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• 15:13Speaker 02

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• 15:43Laci Mosley?

  And we're back, and it's time for What's Hot in Farah. This is where we warn our listeners about the scams that are popping in the streets. And more often than not these days, we get a letter from you guys. As always, snitch on your friends and family at [email protected]. Just make sure the scam is retired, because we don't want to what? Yes, fuck up your bag. Amen.

• 16:00Speaker 04

  I bet you were gonna say like, become implicated in a crime.

• 16:04Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah, fuck up your bag. That's essentially what being implicated in a crime is. The police come in and they fuck up the bag, or, yeah.

• 16:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, so I don't want to have to go testify, you know? I'll go to my email, you know?

• 16:17Laci Mosley?

  Listen, also, like, I delete some of these, because I'm like, oh, this is a crimey crime. Like, I can't be involved in this. I never saw this. But today, we're talking about something light, which I think is cute, because Jonathan, your scam, your Glamour Shot scam is so light and cute. And I love that you felt bad, but I also love these ladies, and I hope that they're somewhere doing amazing with their glued-in teeth.

• 16:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, they were like 50, and they're totally alive. They're 100% alive, unless they felt like a tragic end.

• 16:43Laci Mosley?

  Unless they died? You're totally alive unless they died, but they definitely died.

• 16:47Speaker 04

  I bet they didn't.

• 16:49Laci Mosley?

  No, I know that they're out there living good.

• 16:51Speaker 04

  Unless they did, where are they? I hope they're okay. Please be okay.

• 16:58Laci Mosley?

  Lord Jesus.

• 16:58Speaker 04

  Lesbian sisters, you know?

• 17:02Laci Mosley?

  This song, this song.

• 17:03Speaker 04

  It's my song.

• 17:04Laci Mosley?

  Let's record it. Do it for Pride next year?

• 17:07Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 17:07Laci Mosley?

  Let's be okay.

• 17:08Speaker 04

  I put a remix on it. Lesbian sisters.

• 17:12Laci Mosley?

  I love it. Beautiful. So I need a fake name for this person. We don't care about gender on this podcast.

• 17:17Speaker 04

  Um, Vladislava.

• 17:19Laci Mosley?

  Vladislava.

• 17:21Speaker 04

  Vladislava. She's got a heart of gold. Her name is Vladislava and she is your person.

• 17:26Laci Mosley?

  So Vladislava says, hey, girl, this is some bullshit and I feel bad. What a first sentence, Vladislava.

• 17:34Speaker 04

  I love Vladislava's take on like American, like she's so like, she already gets it. Like she already gets all of the terms. I love her.

• 17:41Laci Mosley?

  So it says, I only did it once. I was hanging out with this lowlife friend of mine in high school and at the food court in the mall, she said to get a free meal, I should take a piece of my own hair and put it in the fried rice and teriyaki dish that I had been eating at the end of my meal. So what? I love this Vladislava because you threw your friend under the bus. You did it. You said, I was hanging out with this lowdown, dirty, skank bitch and she told me to do crime. Like, how you gonna put it all on your friend? Your friend was trying to get you a free meal. Your friend sounds benevolent and caring. Why you gotta call her lowdown? I don't like that, Vladislava.

• 18:16Speaker 04

  I really needed a well-placed skank. Like I haven't heard someone say skank in like too long. That was like such a good word and it needs, I'm really glad that you're.

• 18:26Laci Mosley?

  It's comical. It's like calling somebody a goofy bitch. It's just funny. Okay?

• 18:30Speaker 04

  So good. And it's like not, like, I don't think it has any like really fucked up. Like it's just like a good, like it's like a good word.

• 18:37Laci Mosley?

  It hits the ear right too, like hussy. You know, you call somebody a hussy.

• 18:41Speaker 04

  Did you say skank bitch? Is that what you? Yeah, that's, that really, mm, that feels nice.

• 18:47Laci Mosley?

  It flows, the way it flows off the tongue. And so I have this.

• 18:50Speaker 04

  Skank bitch?

• 18:52Laci Mosley?

  Not with a little dance. I wish I could see Jonathan. He hit the shoulders. He hit him with the shoulders. I love it. But so also, chicken teriyaki in the food court mall is a very specific memory for me. You worked in the Mall of America, so I would imagine that has to be too, because you know, they would be standing out there with the chicken on the stick, getting the girls hooked.

• 19:11Speaker 04

  I was an Auntie Anne's pretzel person. I, those pretzels really.

• 19:17Speaker 04

  Really do it for me.

• 19:19Laci Mosley?

  They do it for me too, the cinnamon sugar, even the pizza one, like I could bust down on an auntie. I love auntie and her aunt. Actually, oh my god, wow. So the first job that I ever had in New York, like professional performer job, was a non-union Auntie Anne's commercial for Pretzel Day. And I got the job, I auditioned in my apartment, I did self-tape off backstage.com, which is low-key a scam, but also like, if you're just starting out, get involved in this scam, why not? See, you might get murdered, or you might get, you might be backstage, or you might be in a back alley. But, but you know, you gotta take that risk. So I like put the video camera on, and like you were supposed to dance with a bag of pretzels. Now, I don't dance with snacks no more, cause I'm black and I, I should have realized, I shouldn't be dancing with, with products, you know?

• 20:03Laci Mosley?

  But at the time, I'm trying to get my career off the ground. So I was out here dancing with this bag, just dancing my heart out, and then I got the job. Two hundred fifty dollars, Auntie Anne's Pretzel Day, my black ass, dancing with pretzels. If I, I, I know where the pictures are, I will post these on the Instagram, but yeah, I used to be slugging them.

• 20:21Speaker 04

  I have to tell you something really funny. Um, we were doing a Queer Eye shoot the other day, and our hero was this like really, really, really sweet, sweet, um, black man, who, I don't wanna say too much, cause I can't give it away, but he's like an LTR, you know, with this wifey. And we were looking at their kitchen, and I was like looking at their kitchen table, and I was like, oh my god, like remember that show Mad About You? And then Karamo looked at me and he was like, honey, we're black, we don't watch that shit. And I was like, and I was like, no! I'm usually good about that thing, like some stuff like that, but I was just gonna say anything.

• 20:56Laci Mosley?

  That's not dumb. Some black people watch Mad About You, he didn't have to do you like that.

• 21:00Speaker 04

  Do you think that, do you think that that's true?

• 21:03Laci Mosley?

  He plays you, he plays you, because I watched Mad About You, and Dharma, and Greg, and you know, I love me some tall salad and scrambled eggs. Going again. He didn't have to do you like that.

• 21:14Speaker 04

  It made me feel so much better lately, because I was like, I don't think that like a lot of people, I mean, she won like five Emmys in a row, I'm sure a lot of people watch Mad About You too.

• 21:23Laci Mosley?

  And some of us was mad about her.

• 21:24Speaker 04

  And I just love that you could, or I just love that they fucked on that kitchen table so much. That's all I was trying to say. I just thought that was nice that a married couple would still want each other so much that they would throw the stuff off their kitchen table and fuck right there. That was so cute, I thought.

• 21:41Laci Mosley?

  That's sexy. I didn't even know that people really did that in real life. I thought that was just a movie thing where like, you know, in a movie when they have a sex scene and it's always like the straight couple, they, they, they pick the, the man picks the woman up and then they just start knocking everything off the counter and then they humping on the wall and then they on the floor and it just beat, like the house looks like it went through a tornado afterwards. And I'm like, is anybody really having sex like that?

• 22:00Speaker 04

  We don't do that because our stuff is too cute. Like our, our, our little like tchotchke things on the counter. It's like all of it's way too cute. I do like being like firmly yet non-violently picked up and pressed upon a wall, but not like on certain, yeah, I do like that, but I think it's even better when they're carrying a.

• 22:17Laci Mosley?

  Not on my good eggshell. Not on my good e crew, bitch.

• 22:19Speaker 04

  It's even better when they're like daring enough to realize like not fuck anything up and it's like just on some drywall.

• 22:24Laci Mosley?

  You got touch up paint dick? Do you have touch up paint dick? That's what I need to know.

• 22:30Speaker 04

  Wait, what was the scam?

• 22:32Laci Mosley?

  So the scam, so the scam is, is that Vadaslava is putting hair in her teriyaki. You know, because they used to slang the teriyaki on the block, on the mall block. They like get one of these toothpicks, get into it. Yeah, in your mouth. And um, I used to love that. I feel like they don't do that anymore. Everything is gone, you know?

• 22:49Speaker 04

  It's all gone. We can't do samples anymore with COVID, but yes.

• 22:53Laci Mosley?

  They can do samples. I feel like they stopped because there was a good excuse to save some money when they know I want to suck on some chicken teriyaki in the mall while I'm at the Victoria's Secret. That's not right. Okay? Also, shout out to Adam Conover. Adam ruins everything. Um, if you stay in a hotel, and then we're going to get back on track. If you stay in a hotel, get room service. Cause like, you know, is we're still kind of in the, deep in the COVID situation. And so a lot of hotels have scaled back on room service and they'll say like, just call if you want it. And you think you're being a good person because you're like, oh, I'm not having the room cleaned and I'm saving people from exposure or something. No, they're doing that so they can save money on not having to pay housekeepers. And the less that y'all call for room service, the less housekeepers that they have to hire.

• 23:33Laci Mosley?

  Which leaves a lot of these people out of work. So if you're in a hotel, the right thing to do is call the girlies and be like, yes, I would like my towels and whatnot every day. And let it happen so that they can have job security.

• 23:43Speaker 04

  And stop taking like 20 minutes to get this coffee up here. Like you need to hire more people, you know?

• 23:48Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, they're trying to skip out because they're like, oh, y'all, uh, it's us, Mr. Uh, Hilton, we down bad as sand with the COVID. So we only got four people on staff. Are y'all cool with not having no new towels? How many times can you wipe your ass with the same towel? Have you thought about that? Greta Thunberg would say your whole stay.

• 24:06Speaker 04

  Do you stand up? Cause I didn't come to your show. Like you do do it because you need to be doing it. Yeah. You are just, this is like, I've never had so much fun on a podcast. That particular scam is giving me, I feel like they watch heartbreakers. I feel like they were just really watching Jennifer Love Hewitt and Sigourney Weaver, like, live their best lives.

• 24:26Laci Mosley?

  But it's such a cute, innocent thing. So I'm gonna say Vadaslava, you shouldn't feel as bad about this as you do. She says, so, you know, she put in a hair in there. And then at the end of her meal, she would bring it up to the people and show them the hair and they would refund her the cost of the meal. It wasn't that cool of me and that friend laughed and says she does it all the time and that fucked me up. I didn't feel good about it. I was probably only 16 or 17, but if you're really broke as hell and need some food, I don't know. Just something I thought of. Love the show, boo. Uh, okay, Vadaslava. Are you a Cancer? Like, what is your sign? Because it's giving like, you are so cute. Girl, if you were broke and you needed your money more than the teriyaki man did,

• 25:07Laci Mosley?

  then go ahead and get your money back for that teriyaki bowl. Cause they was giving out the teriyaki on the stick. They done gave out the equivalent of like 50 of them bowls all day at the mall. I know. I took 10 samples. I walked away with a tray.

• 25:18Speaker 04

  Yes. And it's not like the people that work there were getting paid commission.

• 25:23Laci Mosley?

  Right. It's not like they're like, I can't feed my family because Vadaslava stole another teriyaki bowl.

• 25:28Speaker 04

  Meanwhile, you're gonna have like some manager of like that place. He like, actually, our sales numbers do get us bonuses and so Vadaslava did rat buck us. You know what I'm saying?

• 25:37Laci Mosley?

  We actually hate that bitch. And could you tell us where she lives? We're getting an angry mob together.

• 25:46Laci Mosley?

  All right, well, Vadaslava, I think you're a good, you're a good person. And also, I think your friend is a good person. I think you need to call that friend and apologize because they was just trying to help you get involved in some crimes.

• 25:57Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 25:58Laci Mosley?

  And there's nothing wrong, I love a friend who gets me involved in some crimes. So guys, we're gonna take another quick break for some non-scam advertisements and we'll be back with my favorite part of the show, historic hoodwink. [Singing] Robbery!

• 26:11Speaker 06

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• 27:27Speaker 02

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• 27:57Laci Mosley?

  And we're back, yeah. And it's time for my favorite part of the show, historic hoodwinkings. This is where I will regale Jonathan with a famous con caper group of criminals. And we'll figure out if we like them, if we hate them, we never know, right? Um, I'm really excited for this because we have a rule. We always say this rule up top. When we have the amazing celebrities with huge followings, the scam is always a dead person. So that way, no one can now, I can't, I'm not responsible if a poltergeist comes for you, Jonathan. Now that's not mine.

• 28:24Speaker 04

  I am waiting on beta breath for this scam.

• 28:26Laci Mosley?

  Yes, so we do a note up top here because we don't scam our journalists. Much of the research from the story came from John Ronson's 2014, the Guardian article, "The Big Eye Children: The Extraordinary Story of Epic Art Fraud." Uh, so guys, we always put those links in the footnotes. If you want to go read some more, check it out, educate yourself, the more you know. Okay, there is a content warning up top here too. This discussion, there's a discussion of emotional abuse in the story. So perhaps this is not the day for that for you. Now you know, uh, but you guys know I, we, we treat everything with care. We try not to get it too sad over here. Okay, we, we're true fun crime, okay? So let's go. Walter Keane's Big Eye paintings could be found on postcards in every grocery store

• 29:11Laci Mosley?

  and pharmacy in the 1960s. Famous actors were patrons of his art and he gained fame as the creator of melancholic Big Eye Children. But no one knew his secret, one that only he and his wife, Margaret Keane, knew. Okay, do we have a picture of, uh, one of these pieces of art with the big eye? Oh, so he was like doing like little anime babies? Wowzers, is this recent?

• 29:37Speaker 04

  What's the secret? It was in the 60s, what was it? Well, he would.

• 29:41Laci Mosley?

  That he could draw well? No, well, there's, there's definitely a secret here, but nobody knew what it was at the time. So this is homeboy posing with a canvas, giving artist. That's giving artist to me.

• 29:52Speaker 04

  It is giving artists, but it's also like giving me like

• 29:56Speaker 04

  after watching Morbid or listening to Morbid so much and just like watching all these like true crime documentaries like I don't know what the scam is, so my brain goes to pedophile, but you said that it was a fun crime thing, so it couldn't be a pedophile.

• 30:07Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, no, we do not cover.

• 30:09Speaker 04

  We don't do pedophiles. What's his problem? What'd he do? What'd he, what'd he, what'd he fuck up? I've been listening to too much Morbid.

• 30:16Laci Mosley?

  God, then why are you so anxious right now?

• 30:18Speaker 04

  Cause what's his problem with the babies? They got big eyes and he's like a white man, so what, what's he doing?

• 30:25Laci Mosley?

  Yo, we know we live in a crazy world where we're like a, a white, a straight white man drawing babies. We're like, what's going on? We need to investigate. No, it has nothing to do with that. So in 1946, Walter Keane was in Berlin, traveling to Europe to learn how to be a painter. According to his memoir, he found himself staring at the heartbreaking big eyed children fighting over food, victims of the aftermath of the war. He would later recall, "As if goaded by a kind of frantic despair, I sketch these dirty, ragged little victims of war with their bruised, lacerated minds and bodies and their matted hair and runny noses." Um, Walter.

• 31:04Speaker 04

  They're survivors of war or something.

• 31:07Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, Walter, this is giving like, you see people who need help and you pull out your camera phone and start making a video so you can go viral. Cause like, if you see these children, I understand like art, it, it definitely spreads, you know, art can be a political statement and a lot of times is, and so maybe you can share these images with the world who may not realize the consequences of war that men love to do, right? I get that, but I'm also like, did you help him at all? Did you get him some food? Did you, or did you just sketch while they fought for the bread? I don't know. It just the way that he wrote it, I'm like, it's, it's giving warrior.

• 31:44Speaker 04

  So he ripped it off, like someone had already made these babies and he stole the art.

• 31:49Laci Mosley?

  No, so he, at this time, all we know is that he saw the kids, he started painting the kids. He saw Oliver Twist and was like, we post.

• 31:57Speaker 04

  Why he's a swindler, honey? What did he do?

• 31:59Laci Mosley?

  We're gonna get there.

• 32:01Speaker 04

  Oh my God.

• 32:03Laci Mosley?

  I have never had a guest this impatient, but the energy is so amazing that I love it.

• 32:08Speaker 04

  I was dying to hear this story.

• 32:10Laci Mosley?

  So fifteen years later, he found a purpose for his art. The recent invention of the American suburb gave many homemakers an earnest need to cover their blank walls. So when the girls were prosperous, the boomers who got houses for like fifteen dollars and a Coca-Cola, you know, they needed art in their houses. So we have a photo of a piece of art that he did and people are starting to like buy these, right? Now personally, I don't know if I would want this sad ass photo in my house. Like, do you want this above your coffee maker, like just the saddest little baby?

• 32:40Speaker 04

  No, I do like, I like the texture on the stairs, but the kid is just so sad to kids. And also, when you said big eyed babies, I thought they were gonna be more like precious moments, which are like cute.

• 32:51Laci Mosley?

  Right, precious, he was like, let's do precious moments, but emo.

• 32:54Speaker 04

  Creepy, yes.

• 32:55Laci Mosley?

  What if all the precious moments were depressed? Like, what?

• 32:58Speaker 04

  Yes, it's actually kind of Yashitomo Nara, this Japanese artist who draws these like really big eyed creepy babies. But it's like this guy is doing like a less cool version of Yashitomo Nara.

• 33:14Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I feel like there's a place for this. Maybe I will look at it in an art exhibit, but I don't know if I would want this in my house. Like, I'm not trying to wake up and see it just like the saddest baby when I wake up.

• 33:23Speaker 04

  I like the cat, though. I will say I like that cat.

• 33:27Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah, the cat is cute. If we could just crop the cat, I would maybe do the cat.

• 33:31Speaker 04

  Yeah, the cat's nice.

• 33:33Laci Mosley?

  Many chose Walter's melancholic, big eyed children to put on their walls. So this is the sixties, everybody get in the house for two dollars and they're like, we need paintings, we need art. So this is like before Ross, probably. So people weren't buying their art at Ross. So like, what are we gonna, where are we gonna get it? Oh, sad babies, that's the move, put them in our houses. So despite his melancholic subjects, Walter was known as a charming womanizer, whose love of women only matched his love for himself. I don't know if charming and womanizer should be in the same sentence and they definitely shouldn't be consecutive like that. I feel like, what's charming about a womanizer?

• 34:09Speaker 04

  Well, because they do it at first, you know, they do it for you, but then they, all of a sudden, you're like, oh no, you're a piece of shit. But at first, they.

• 34:15Laci Mosley?

  At first, it's all like woman and then it's nizer. Then they start nizing you.

• 34:19Speaker 04

  Yes, I hated, you know, a nizing person, like.

• 34:23Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I'm not trying to get nized. That's, that's terrible.

• 34:26Speaker 04

  Can't you be nice?

• 34:27Laci Mosley?

  Right, be nice, don't be nice. I don't wanna be nice. So, meeting Margaret, according to Walter, so he's a big bachelor, he's just drawing sad babies and fuck it, that's his whole life, draw sad baby, you know, pull another girl, you know, that's his life, right? So according to Walter, uh, his first meeting with a woman who would become his wife took place outside an outdoor art exhibit in San Francisco in nineteen fifty-five. Um, so, San Francisco nineteen fifty-five, very cool. He was still an unknown artist waiting for recognition. In his memoir, he said Margaret's first words to him were, "I love your paintings. You are the greatest artist I've ever seen. You are also the most handsome."

• 35:07Speaker 04

  Liar.

• 35:09Laci Mosley?

  That was her first words to you? She walked up and was like, "Hi." Uh, no, there's not even a hi. Her first words are, "I love your paintings. You are the greatest artist I've ever seen. You are also the most handsome. You have big dick energy." Like, it's like that, she said all that, it's not even how my name is Margaret, nothing else, she just, okay. Okay, maybe she did.

• 35:32Speaker 04

  I wanted her, and when you were recapping it, I wanted it to be like, "And I'm into anal."

• 35:37Laci Mosley?

  Right, "And I'm into anal, and I love cooking breakfast and lunch and dinner. And my passion is getting shit stains out of men's underwear when they don't wipe properly." Like, like, what, like, who is this woman?

• 35:49Speaker 04

  I cannot even.

• 35:52Laci Mosley?

  Vacuuming makes me cum. Do you wanna?

• 35:55Speaker 04

  I do feel like for queer couples, or like, men who have sex with men couples, or like, non-binary people, just, or just, it's actually, like, cause I, it's just like, when you're really into anal sex, I feel like you clean your butt better, cause you are terrified of your partner, like, you just never would want them to see that, cause it's like, they, that's like their, that's their playground, is like your butthole, so like, you don't wanna be leaving skin marks anywhere, cause it's like, that's their playground, and you don't want you to know that your playground has shit in it.

• 36:23Laci Mosley?

  And I wish that everyone, playground has shit in it. I wish that everyone would just do that, because it's just the, like, we should all just be clean all of the time. But, yeah, no, that's like mortifying painting, but, I will say, I was in Hawaii and I had a Japanese toilet.

• 36:40Speaker 04

  Sorry, but you're so right. That is like, Wow, you really just made me realize something. I was like only wanting to keep my asshole right for someone else and like not for me.

• 36:51Laci Mosley?

  But not for you.

• 36:52Speaker 04

  And that's fucked up, like.

• 36:55Laci Mosley?

  Think about the confidence that you have walking out with a clean taint.

• 36:58Speaker 04

  A clean taint, just being like, you could eat me out right now and I would feel so confident. And why was I wait? That is so fucking, I need Karamo, I need to go on Queer Eye, like I need the other fat four to like, why have I? That is, wow, Lacey, wow, do it for you.

• 37:18Laci Mosley?

  Do it for you.

• 37:19Speaker 04

  Do it for you.

• 37:21Laci Mosley?

  Fleet for you. I come out with a brand of fleets. I'm coming out with a line of fleets, guys.

• 37:28Speaker 04

  Is yours like, is like kind of like a cleaner, like reusable one than balloons? It's like not, it's like, it's a cleaner or, ooh, ooh, or? You know what we really need is someone to come out with like a cleansing solution for the inside of your things, like if.

• 37:43Laci Mosley?

  Oh, like, so you can like keep, so it's like reusable, like the Diva Cup where you can like reuse it and wash it?

• 37:49Speaker 04

  Cause they have reusable ones, but it's like, I get nervous.

• 37:52Laci Mosley?

  No one wants to deal with that.

• 37:54Speaker 04

  Yeah, you know, it's like, I want, but it's like, but like plastic, like why does the environment have to suffer like for our assholes?

• 37:59Laci Mosley?

  Once, once a turtle has a fleet stuck in its nose, they'll, they'll get wise.

• 38:03Speaker 04

  Honestly, it's already probably happens all the time.

• 38:05Laci Mosley?

  Oh, my God, no.

• 38:06Speaker 04

  It really does. And that's why we have to make douche cleansing solution, like cleansing solution for reusable douches, Lacey. And that is really fucking important, okay?

• 38:16Laci Mosley?

  It is, it is. Also, like, I, I feel like all of my reps will be like, this is such a weird pivot, but I want to come out with like an affordable Japanese toilet. Because that Japanese toilet, I was in Hawaii, I was sitting on it, it's warm every time you sit on it, the bidet is bideting. And like, I like, I feel like it's, I started it and I just shot off the toilet, it was crazy.

• 38:34Speaker 04

  I don't want to be this like out of touch celebrity, but after I got back from Japan, I got them all for my house. So I have, I have the automatic, when you walk in, like it, it sits up, like when you walk in the room, it says, are you ready? It's always warm. This one, when I was in Japan, Donald Trump was in office, obviously, right?

• 38:51Laci Mosley?

  Oh, God.

• 38:52Speaker 04

  And I was like, and I used to get up at like 3:30 in the morning when we were filming Queer Eye in Japan. So I could go figure skating at like 4:30 in the morning, cause I had to go that early to be ready in case we were shooting, it's like. Because TV shows, they're still like worried about like when you live your life. So you have to like live your life like before they want to live, you know?

• 39:07Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 39:07Speaker 04

  So I was just like, oh my God.

• 39:08Laci Mosley?

  You're like a meat puppet. They're like, little meat puppet, we need you here early. Yeah.

• 39:11Speaker 04

  And so I'm, I'm going to go do figure skating because I'll be so depressed if I don't. But I was reading about like that they were maybe gonna, they were thinking about like investigating Trump Jr. And I forgot that I turned the bidet on. So I was reading this like Newsweek article about like potentially like Ivanka and Donald Trump Jr. Like getting investigated.

• 39:28Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 39:28Speaker 04

  And I, and then this like warm water was like just cleansing my asshole as I was reading this. And I just had this huge smile on my face. And then I realized that I've been sitting there for like 10 minutes reading this article, just getting like this warm water blown up my ass.

• 39:40Laci Mosley?

  Oh, my God. What a spiritual experience. We're like, I'm reading the best news.

• 39:45Speaker 04

  And my. Getting my taint cleansed. Like you guys, if you haven't experienced that, it really is, it's the next level.

• 39:51Laci Mosley?

  You got it. Yeah. I'm, we gotta make it more accessible.

• 39:53Speaker 04

  Actually, it's only a hundred dollars, Lacy. Like that thing, it was like a hundred dollars. And you just have to get a TaskRabbit to like install it and you too can have like.

• 39:59Laci Mosley?

  Really? Yeah, it was like, the Japanese ones are like $20,000.

• 40:03Speaker 04

  No, girl, you, it's like a hundred dollar thing that like goes, you like take your lid off and you like you replace your, you, you just take, you screw off the American part. And then you just, and it plugs in and you too, and girl, it will blow dry your asshole and your vagina and your taint. And I'll blow dry your privates. It, it, it blow dries, it cleanses, it can set it for front, back.

• 40:25Laci Mosley?

  I didn't know that you could get it without buying the whole full like toilet thing.

• 40:29Speaker 04

  I only have the top part and it is.

• 40:32Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 40:32Speaker 04

  For you. And I, maybe that's the universal reason that I did this podcast today with you is that like you needed to know that they were at your fingertips.

• 40:39Laci Mosley?

  I didn't know. Yes. Now they're at my booty tips. Thank you so much. I'm so excited. So. So you know Walter saying that basically Margaret walked up to him and was like, you the baddest man, you the best, right? Later that night, he remembers that Margaret told him, you are the greatest lover in the world. Walter. Now why you?

• 41:02Laci Mosley?

  I want to meet somebody and be like, I knew that this was my husband or my wife. They were like, you are so sexy and you have the most beautiful ma- like, what is this? Like, all these compliments to yourself. What about your wife? You didn't notice, if you knew that you were gonna marry her when you met her, you not talking about her smile that could light up a room? You, you, you not talking about her at all? Like, she ain't have no way about her. It's just about how nice she was to you and how much you would've shit? Okay, Walter, it's giving conceit, okay? They married soon after that first meeting, and he went on to have an incredibly successful career as an artist. So Margaret's account. This is how Margaret says it went down. So that's how Walter said. Walter said Margaret came up and was like, oh my god, you are the most talented artist with like the, the most delicious penis I've ever had in my life,

• 41:44Laci Mosley?

  and your paintings changed my whole world, and I would like to work for you as a wife. But now, let's see what Margaret said happened. Margaret says, it's a little different. She said, in the mid 1950s, Walter spent most of his time at a San Francisco beatnik club, The Hungry Eye. Famous comedians, including Larry Bruce and Bill Cosby, uh-oh, performed on stage while he sold his big-eyed children paintings in front of the club. Now, if people are coming to a space to laugh, like, you outside, like, y'all want some paintings of the saddest children you've ever seen, ravished by war, before you go laugh at a nasty man and another man? I, I, I guess this is a good strategy? One night, Margaret went to the club with him. He told her to sit in a corner while he conducted business, but when someone asked her, "Do you paint too?",

• 42:29Laci Mosley?

  she realized that he was there to sell paintings. Her paintings. For the first year of their marriage, unbeknownst to her, Walter had been taking credit for her big-eyed children. In actuality, Walter Keane couldn't paint to save his life.

• 42:51Speaker 04

  So then what happened?

• 42:53Laci Mosley?

  So let's, can you pull up that photo with Walter with that, uh, paint again? Cause it was giving prop. It was giving like, "Look at me paint-" is it giving Bob Ross, y'all? Is it, does it look like I painted this? He, he's not a painter.

• 43:06Speaker 04

  So they get married, and then he just took credit for her work?

• 43:09Laci Mosley?

  Yes, he was stealing her art. So, in his account, and the reason we did this, thank you, Kailin, for burying the lead, is Walter was telling everybody on the street, all the girls, they're like, he's this talented artist. And when he said he met his wife, he was like, my wife was like, oh my god, you are such a good painter and a good lover, and you have the most money and the best dick and everything in the world. When in reality, he met this woman- And realized that she was a great painter and then started selling her art as his own.

• 43:37Speaker 04

  And then she went to that theater after dating him for a year and saw him selling her art.

• 43:45Laci Mosley?

  So these are the first years of their marriage. So while they're married now, he's like, oh, come to the comedy club. And then didn't realize that what he had, she's like, what you got in that bag? Don't worry about that. Don't worry about that. Just come to the comedy club. Be cute. And so she didn't realize that he's over there slanging her art and pretending that it's his.

• 44:02Speaker 04

  And so then what'd she do?

• 44:04Laci Mosley?

  So Margaret confronted him as soon as she found out and told him to stop. Walter tried to explain it first. We need the money. People are more likely to buy a painting if they think that they're talking to the artist. People don't want to think I can't paint and need to have my wife paint. People already think I painted the big eyes and if suddenly I say it was you, it'll be confusing and people will start suing us. So he was like, come on, everybody already thinks I'm the painter. Now, we don't want to mess that up for everybody and for us. Like, he basically gave her a bunch of excuses as to why he should be able to continue to pass off her art as his own. He was like, we need the money, baby. Who gonna pay the light bill if I don't plagiarize your work?

• 44:41Speaker 04

  So then what happened?

• 44:43Laci Mosley?

  So his solution was to have Margaret teach him how to paint big eyed children so he could take credit only for her ideas and not for her actual work. So now he's like, okay, well, teach me how to do it and then you won't, I won't be stealing from you anymore. So she tried to teach him, which Margaret, why didn't you just get a divorce child? And he failed. He might have been the best lover in the world because Margaret, why are you staying? Did he have like?

• 45:05Speaker 04

  A huge, really nice perfect.

• 45:07Laci Mosley?

  He had touch up paint, dick? That's what he was giving. So Margaret said, and when he couldn't do it, it was always my fault. You're not teaching me right. I could do it if you had more patience. I was really trying, but it was just impossible. No, you can't teach talent. Like, you can hone talent, but you can't teach somebody to have a skill that they don't have. Margaret wanted to leave, but she said she had no way to support herself or her daughter. Well, Margaret, you got your paintings. Okay. So she went along with it, the supportive wife to her genius husband. Now, we do have to remember this is like the early sixties, fifties. So women, you know, barely had autonomy, didn't have any access to money, were essentially still property. And so she couldn't leave her husband. She had to let him keep scamming.

• 45:46Laci Mosley?

  Walter's thriving career. By the early nineteen sixties, keen prints and postcards were selling in the millions. Margaret, of course, saw none of the money, but she continued to paint and the family moved into a big luxurious house. Walter took the opportunity to throw massive celebrity attended parties while Margaret continued to paint sixteen hours a day. He got his wife in a sweatshop in the basement, painting pictures while he upstairs being Great Gatsby, throwing scarves and yucking it up with celebrities.

• 46:15Speaker 04

  I can't.

• 46:16Laci Mosley?

  They're like, Margaret.

• 46:16Speaker 04

  I can't with him.

• 46:17Laci Mosley?

  I just imagine, I just imagine he's like talking to people about his art and you hear like a, and they're like, what's, what's that Walter? Oh, no, don't, don't worry about that. Don't, don't, don't worry about that. That's just, uh, my dog downstairs. Uh, what you need, Margaret? Sir, can I have some more paint? I just imagine her like all of her toys in the basement, just painting all day.

• 46:37Speaker 04

  How does it end?

• 46:39Laci Mosley?

  So not even the house staff were aware of what she was doing with her day. Her relationship also changed.

• 46:43Speaker 04

  Because they were so rich.

• 46:46Laci Mosley?

  Right. So her relationship changed with Walter a- and did the freedom as well. So the relationship, the freedom that she used to have. Now she's basically an indentured painting servant to her husband, which is horrible. According to Margaret, the door was always locked, the curtains closed. When Walter wasn't home, he'd usually call every hour to make sure that I hadn't gone out. So this is abusive. He is now locking this woman up. It's like flowers in the attic, but it's the painter in the attic making the paintings. So the unhappy marriage then became more domineering and abusive while Walter lived a lush party life and Margaret stayed locked inside, painting away. Despite his many affairs, Walter didn't allow Margaret to have any friends and even abused her beloved Chihuahua so much that they had to give it away.

• 47:29Laci Mosley?

  Walter, you are a nasty man. You are a horrible person. So he threatened that if she ever told their secret, he'd have his mafia friends eighty-six her. Meanwhile, he continued pressuring her into working day and night to create bigger and bigger works. Eventually, Margaret created a masterwork called Tomorrow Forever. It depicted hundreds of sad looking, big eyed children standing in a line that stretches across the horizon.

• 47:55Speaker 04

  That is so fucking chilling, knowing what she was going through while creating all of these paintings.

• 48:04Laci Mosley?

  And it depicted like all of these sad children, right? The organizers of the 1964 World Fair hung it up in their Pavilion of Education. So later Walter wrote in his memoir that his dead grandmother told him in a vision that Michelangelo has put your name up for nomination as member of our inner circle, saying that your masterwork tomorrow forever will live in the hearts and minds of men as his work would like the Sistine Chapel. So this is in his memoir. He was like, "My grandma came back to me in a dream and told me that Michelangelo and them inducted me into the Bad Bitch Painting Hall of Fame and that I'm just like the Sistine Chapel."

• 48:39Speaker 04

  He must have been doing a ton of drugs.

• 48:41Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it's giving...

• 48:43Speaker 04

  It's giving like delusions of like self-grandeur. It's giving LSD with coke. It's giving major uppers. It's giving like delusional uppers.

• 48:53Laci Mosley?

  And despite the heaven sent message from Michelangelo, art critic John Kennedy described the piece as "tasteless hack work, contains about 100 children and hence is about 100 times as bad as the average king." Damn, now y'all don't gotta be panning this. This woman was making the art.

• 49:11Speaker 04

  She's trying.

• 49:13Laci Mosley?

  So the World Fair promptly took it down, which made Walter furious. Margaret was also hurt as her children were personal expressions of her own feelings that she could never voice because she's actually the children in the painting. And I think if they knew the meaning that it wasn't this like egotistical asshole who made it and it was actually this woman who feels the same thing as the children, they probably would have been more...

• 49:36Speaker 04

  So sad.

• 49:38Laci Mosley?

  You know, empathetic of the artwork and you know, it's art is subjective. So the truth comes out. After 10 years of marriage, eight of them spent in misery, Margaret and Walter divorced. Still, Margaret promised that she'd continue to paint for Walter. Now Margaret, why, girl, you down bad as sis? Stop painting for this man. Put the brush down. No more strokes.

• 49:55Speaker 04

  No more strokes.

• 49:56Laci Mosley?

  But after 20 to 30 more paintings, she finally had had enough. 20 to 30 is, I feel like you're breaking point sis, but I get it. She wanted to tell the truth. In October 1970, Margaret told a reporter from the UPI everything. Walter rampaged against Margaret and her claims. He denied all her claims that she was a true artist and swore that the big eyes were his. He also called Margaret "a boozing sex starve psychopath", who he once discovered having sex with several parking lot attendants.

• 50:24Speaker 04

  So then did they do a draw off on national television or something?

• 50:28Laci Mosley?

  That's what needs to happen. I would have been like, okay, let's, let's do a draw off. Let's see who can draw. Also, like, this is such a specific thing to say that your wife did that I'm like, this is all projection. You had sex with several, parking lot attendance.

• 50:40Speaker 04

  Hundred percent. Yeah, a hundred percent.

• 50:43Laci Mosley?

  Also a boozing sex star psychopath? That sounds like you too. This sounds like you were just saying-

• 50:47Speaker 04

  But he wasn't sex star because he was like a sex glutton.

• 50:51Laci Mosley?

  But if you, if you're a glutton, then you're constantly starved, right?

• 50:55Speaker 04

  Oh, I guess, yeah, yeah, so he has to have pussy all the time. So then what happened?

• 50:59Laci Mosley?

  So having most, lost almost entirely all of his credibility, Walter moved into a shack in La Jolla, California, where he fell into deep alcohol abuse. Now, what's crazy to me is like, you had millions of dollars, right? You spent all of that money and now you have to live in a shack?

• 51:13Speaker 04

  Probably.

• 51:14Laci Mosley?

  Like, it's given, like, y'all just played the life, like, a mash game. Like, you had the mansion, now you in the shack. What? So his story grew to include that Margaret was in a league with the Jehovah Witnesses who were out to get him. Okay. The few reporters that were still interested in Walter ran his stories, so Margaret sued him. During the trial, the judge challenged them both to a paint off! In the middle of court, in front of everybody. Oh, my God, Jonathan, you were right. They had a paint off in court.

• 51:42Speaker 04

  And so then what happened?

• 51:43Laci Mosley?

  Can you imagine being on this jury and it's like, okay, now they about to do the paint off?

• 51:46Speaker 04

  I can't believe I predicted the paint off, you guys. I didn't even know that. So then what happened?

• 51:50Laci Mosley?

  So they were judged on how they painted a child with big eyes. Margaret painted hers in fifty-three minutes, because remember, she was down there cranking them out. Like, on the assembly line. Walter said he couldn't because he had a sore shoulder. You got a painted injury? Okay. She won the case, of course. He was like, oh, my shoulder. I pulled my paint. This is my good painting shoulder. Oh, can't do it. What? Sir. Margaret was awarded four million dollars, which she never saw because Walter had pissed their fortune away. By the seventies, the big-eyed children fell out of popularity, and occasionally, even to mockery, Walter died in two thousand, several years after giving up drinking. Margaret found God with the Jehovah Witnesses. She moved to Hawaii,

• 52:31Laci Mosley?

  and the tone of her paintings became more cheerful with her big-eyed children swimming in tropical seas with the fish. She can be seen in a cameo of the twenty-fourteen Tim Burton film Big Eyed, based on her story. Margaret Keen passed on June twenty-six, twenty-twenty-two, at the age of ninety-four. Okay, I'm glad that Margaret got to live a second life and live to ninety-four. Okay, yeah, these photos are happier.

• 52:49Speaker 04

  Did it get successful, did it get successful later?

• 52:53Laci Mosley?

  I don't know about that, but she did end up, you know, in a Tim Burton film, so she got some Tim Burton coins.

• 52:59Speaker 04

  God, poor thing. What a life.

• 53:02Laci Mosley?

  Oh, Margaret. Oh, she's so cute.

• 53:04Speaker 04

  Plus, she didn't get to celebrate birthdays and stuff. Fuck.

• 53:09Laci Mosley?

  She was down, bad and sad. Sorry, Margaret. The times were tough for women back then, as they are now. Ain't that crazy? But guys, it's time for our last, our saddest segment of the show, because it's the last one, where eventually I'm gonna have to let Jonathan go. It's time for Scammer of the Week. So Scammer of the Week is where we honor one charlatan who's worthy of our praise, or maybe not. We'll see. Today, we're talking about, ooh, let's see. While pre-approved credit cards often pop up in mailboxes, one day, a woman opened her mailbox to find a stack of 70 Chase Bank credit cards waiting for her. What? The cards were issued to 70 completely different strangers, all on Tina Kumar's account.

• 53:51Laci Mosley?

  Somehow, Chase Bank never raised a red flag when 70 names were added to one woman's account. That was particularly concerning when each envelope contained two cards with two different names and her account number. When she called the number on the back, suddenly all 70 cards were activated. When Tina finally was able to get ahold of customer service, they said someone logged into her account and added 70 names all at once. The bank immediately closed the account and issued her a new card, along with a promise that the manager would call her back. But the call never came, and no explanation was given as to why 70 users could have been added to Tina's account, but no one was noticing.

• 54:29Speaker 04

  So what the hell was that about?

• 54:31Laci Mosley?

  So Tina, I don't think that you're the, you got scammed here. Like, you're not the Scammer of the Week. There's some mysterious person out there who got away with adding 70 names to your credit card account.

• 54:40Speaker 04

  That makes me think of this article I just read about this kid who...

• 54:47Speaker 04

  Stole like fourteen million dollars of Bitcoin. Um, and he did it by like part of what taught him about like hacking and stuff was like he would have people's like, like phone accounts, but he would get employees from like Sprint and Verizon and AT&T because he needed someone from the inside to like flip their stuff. So he would like go offer like five thousand dollars or four thousand dollars because they weren't making that much money anyway. And he would just like find someone that was like down to clown with the scam and he would get into all these. But interesting, I feel like that must have been like, that sounds like an inside job, like someone from the bank. And that's why the manager isn't reaching out because there's someone from inside the bank that did that.

• 55:27Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it's giving internal, it's giving like internal investigation and they didn't want it to get out.

• 55:32Speaker 04

  Seventy accounts and one foul swoop and like, get out of here.

• 55:35Laci Mosley?

  No, it would definitely have pinged some flags. So it's giving like somebody a chase, ran up a bag real quick and got out. Seventy cards? Why did you have them go so? I mean, look, big, big banking industry has scammed us over and over and over again. So I don't even know if I'm mad at the seventy card scammer on the other side, especially because Ms. Tina.

• 55:54Speaker 04

  I feel so bad for the people's names and their credit. It's their credit. It's those other seventy people. Oh, but I, well, I don't know. I can't, it's too many scams. I can't even think about it.

• 56:03Laci Mosley?

  Right. I mean, but guys, it's always just another way for us to remember, like, check your cards. You're never too big to sign your own checks. Check, check your bank statements because people will charge you. They will try to get over on you. I always say if you go to the hospital and you built your insurance, even if you built your insurance, get an itemized because you'll be surprised when stuff just starts falling off of that hospital bill. Cause they put all kind of cotton swab fees, Band-Aid fees, you know, opening and closing the curtain fee, you know? And you can get that stuff taken off. So you just have to really be vigilant out here because everybody's trying to do crime. Crime is very popping. It's very sexy in the zeitgeist right now.

• 56:40Speaker 04

  It really is. It's very twenty twenty-two. It really is.

• 56:42Laci Mosley?

  It is. It's a moment. Crime is having a moment. Okay? And it's, I don't think it's going away. I think that scams, she is the moment. They are the moment.

• 56:50Speaker 04

  She is the moment. They really are. A scam's a plenty queen.

• 56:53Laci Mosley?

  Yes, the baddest bitch. But guys, that brings us to the end of a fantastic episode. Jonathan, you have the best energy. This is so wild.

• 57:01Speaker 04

  Thank you so much for having me. I had so much fun.

• 57:03Laci Mosley?

  We always ask on this podcast, where would you like to be found?

• 57:07Speaker 04

  Oh, where would I like to be?

• 57:08Laci Mosley?

  So any socials, anything you want to plug?

• 57:11Speaker 04

  Oh, I was like, I was like on a beach in the Caribbean, probably.

• 57:14Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 57:15Speaker 04

  No, it's like, yeah, at JVN, you can follow our, my podcast at Curious at JVN. Um, we're doing the most over there. It's all about curiosity and just kind of like figuring out the world around. It's like, how did we get so fucked up? But like with some fun. And, um, yeah, at JVN Hair, we're doing a lot over there. All the, so at JVN, at Curious at JVN, at JVN Hair, we're doing all this stuff. And thanks for having me on.

• 57:35Laci Mosley?

  Yes. And Jonathan, you are very curious. So if y'all want to hear more of his curiosity, because he was so curious on this podcast, y'all get into his show, get into these books, get into this hair. You have fantastic hair.

• 57:45Speaker 04

  Thank you, honey.

• 57:46Laci Mosley?

  You really just have the best.

• 57:47Speaker 04

  I gave you a little bun today because it's like really hot Nola, but sometimes it is really good.

• 57:51Laci Mosley?

  And I love a hairstylist who has nice hair because I trust them more. Like, you know what I mean? Like, shout out to the bald hairstylist. I know that's, we don't always get a choice in being bald, but it's just something about hairstylists with gray hair that I'm like, I trust you. Like, put your hands in my hair. You get it?

• 58:06Speaker 04

  I need to, I need to.

• 58:07Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yes. And guys, as always, you can find us at scamgoddispod at gmail.com. If you want to snitch on your friends and family, you can find me at D I V A L A C I, D Velaci on all platforms. If you'd like to follow the show and see all the photos and extra information and shenanigans, scamgoddispod on all platforms. Guys, I'm pretty sure I could announce this, maybe I'll have to take it out, but season three of Icarly is happening, y'all. So I will be back on your television screen doing my normal crimes. Also, Lopez v. Lopez, you know, so we're out here, we're doing TV crimes, we're doing audio crimes. I got y'all, wherever you want to see me. Congregation, stay Schemin. Scam Goddess.

• 58:48Laci Mosley?

  This has been an Earwolf production in association with Team Coco. Scam Goddess stars and is hosted by me, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. It's produced by Judith Cargbo, engineered by Marina Paez, and researched by Kalen Brandt. Stay Schemin.

• 59:05Speaker 07

  Has Been, a Team Coco Production in association with Earwolf.

• 59:15Speaker 05

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  That sound? That's pro squash. Some of the fastest rallies in sport played inches from the crowd. The National Squash League is back in full swing for season four. The sport is heading to the 2028 Olympics for the first time, and you can see it up close right now in a city near you. Watch every match for free on YouTube. Search National Squash League and hit subscribe or follow live updates on Instagram at nsl.sport.

• 1:00:58Speaker 02

  Building with AI should feel simpler, not harder to navigate. The challenge is finding the right resources to move from exploring AI to building with it. The Microsoft AI Innovators Hub brings together code samples, guided labs, and practical guidance to help you move from exploring AI to building with it. Learn by building at the AI Innovators Hub. Visit aka.ms slash AI dash innovators. That's aka.ms slash AI dash innovators.