A Succulent Crime with Kelsey McKinney

Dowager queen Kelsey McKinney is back to close out season ten with a story about plant parenthood in a pediatrician's office. We are now on YouTube. Be sure to follow us on there at @DefectorMedia https://www.youtube.com/@DefectorMedia where you can watch today’s episode. Subscribe to our newsletter for writing from Rachelle, Se'era, Jae, Alex, and Kelsey, plus blog recommendations and secrets! https://defector.com/normal-gossip-podcast You can support Normal Gossip directly by buying merch https://defectorstore.com/collections/normal-gossip or becoming a Friend or a Friend-of-Friend at supportnormalgossip.com https://defector.com/products/normalgossip. You can also find all kinds of info about us and how to submit gossip on our Komi page:https://normalgossip.komi.io/ Episode transcript here https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UkBpkTEbY1IgZNtKX9m_h_LVr6F-O_ggaZf7srFytZ8/edit?usp=sharing. Follow the show on Instagram @normalgossip https://www.instagram.com/normalgossip/, and if you have gossip, email us at [email protected] or leave us a voicemail at 26-79-GOSSIP. Normal Gossip is hosted by Rachelle Hampton (@heyydnae https://www.instagram.com/heyydnae/?hl=en) and produced by Se'era Spragley Ricks (@seera_sharae https://www.instagram.com/seera_sharae/?hl=en) and Jae Towle Vieira (@jaetowlevieira https://instagram.com/jaetowlevieira?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==). Our audio engineer is Samantha Gattsek. Justin Ellis is Defector's projects editor. Show art by Tara Jacoby. Theme music composed by Hrishikesh Hirway. Normal Gossip is a proud member ofRadiotopia https://www.radiotopia.fm/. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices https://dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

• 0:01Speaker 00

  Hey there. It's Robyn from PRX. If you're a longtime listener of Radiotopia, you may know that we had a podcast that ran from 2016 to 2020 discussing every episode of the show The West Wing. Well, I'm excited to tell you The West Wing Weekly is back. Joshua Molina, who starred on The West Wing as Will Bailey, and Rishikesh Hirway, creator and host of Song Exploder, have reunited to discuss the hit Netflix political thriller, The Diplomat. Just as they did in their original run, they're discussing each episode of the series in sequence, joined by special guests from the show and from the real world of diplomacy. Rishi and Josh will be wrapping up the first season with a special live taping at Union Chapel in London on November 14th. Subscribe now to The West Wing Weekly wherever you get your podcasts.

• 0:50Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 0:51Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 0:51Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. What? Oh, my God.

• 0:53Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 0:53Speaker 01

  Oh, wow. Oh, my God.

• 0:55Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 0:56Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. What?

• 0:57Speaker 03

  Oh, my gosh.

• 0:59Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:00Speaker 03

  Hello and welcome to the finale of season 10 of Normal Gossip. I'm your host, Rachel Hampton, and in each episode of this podcast, we're going to bring you an anonymous morsels of gossip from the real world. Season 10 has been a special one in so many ways. We brought you more episodes in one season than we ever had before and more than we ever will again, let's be honest. If I'm being completely honest, 12 was too much. It was too many. You're welcome. We plumb the depths of our inbox to bring you the most chaotic gossip possible all season long. And this season, we did All Stars. We introduced you to some new friends, but we also brought back more of our favorite partners in gossip than we ever have before. And I'm sure you all agree, there is only one right way to

• 1:45Speaker 03

  close out our All Star season. Please welcome Dowager Queen Kelsey McKinney back to the show. In addition to being the co-creator and former host of Normal Gossip, Kelsey is one of my colleagues and co-owners here at Defector.com. She's also written two wonderful books, a novel called God Spare the Girls and a New York Times bestselling book about gossip called You Didn't Hear This From Me. Kelsey, hello. Thank you so much for joining me.

• 2:12Speaker 02

  Hello, Rachel. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here.

• 2:16Speaker 03

  This is the crossover everyone's been waiting for.

• 2:19Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, they're clamoring. Thank God I could make it.

• 2:23Speaker 03

  They said, where has Kelsey been?

• 2:25Speaker 02

  Everyone's been weeping and weeping, coming up to me on the street with tears in their eyes. It's so sad.

• 2:30Speaker 03

  And now here you are.

• 2:32Speaker 02

  Here I am.

• 2:32Speaker 03

  Thank you so much.

• 2:33Speaker 02

  In the flesh, even. Not just a floating voice.

• 2:35Speaker 03

  I know. First time on camera.

• 2:37Speaker 02

  First time on camera, ever.

• 2:40Speaker 03

  Guys, you're welcome. I did this for you.

• 2:43Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 2:44Speaker 03

  Well, actually, I do have ulterior motives for bringing you on.

• 2:47Speaker 02

  Uh-oh.

• 2:47Speaker 03

  Which is, you are the only other person who has hosted this show.

• 2:51Speaker 02

  True.

• 2:52Speaker 03

  You are the only other person who understands all that comes along with this.

• 2:58Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 2:59Speaker 03

  And so I wanted to talk to you about something that has been causing a little bit of, let's say, drama, just a tiny bit.

• 3:05Speaker 02

  Is it an intervention?

• 3:06Speaker 03

  No, I would never do that on camera. But, you know, one of the many platforms that the show is hosted on is Spotify.

• 3:13Speaker 02

  Famously, a platform that exists.

• 3:15Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm. And Spotify has added a feature where if you have subscriber episodes, which we do, you can put them in the feed.

• 3:23Speaker 02

  Okay, so it's like easier or something for people to listen to them?

• 3:27Speaker 03

  It's easier for people to figure out that we have extra episodes that you can pay $5 a month for.

• 3:31Speaker 02

  Okay, I'm not understanding what the problem is.

• 3:34Speaker 03

  You know, I also didn't think there was going to be much of a problem, but based on when this feature was rolled out and, which was in between seasons, and some of the comments we've gotten, I think, in a world where it feels like everyone's putting something behind a paywall, I wanted to talk a little bit about subscriber episodes, what a subscription does for us specifically as like co-owners of the company that we work at, because this show has always been free to listen to, and I can't imagine a future in which it won't be.

• 4:07Speaker 02

  May I speak first?

• 4:08Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 4:09Speaker 02

  We don't control Spotify. If we did, we would have so much more money. Like, we would be so rich. We would not be wearing this. You would never see us again. But we don't. We've had a subscriber feed, I think, since after the first season of the show. What is that, four years ago at this point? It's like 50 episodes at least of subscriber content.

• 4:30Speaker 03

  We have issues with Spotify, but it has lots more people discovering that we have this, which I feel like more people...

• 4:35Speaker 02

  We do have it.

• 4:36Speaker 03

  We do have it. You get an extra episode a month whether or not the season is running or not. But I think something I wanted to talk about specifically is that there are obviously ads on the show, which is how we make the money.

• 4:47Speaker 02

  So true.

• 4:48Speaker 03

  But ad revenue doesn't just come to me, or it didn't just come to you, Kelsey.

• 4:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 4:54Speaker 03

  It's split among like four to five different entities.

• 4:58Speaker 02

  There's so many people involved. It's crazy.

• 5:01Speaker 03

  It's our agents, it's Radiotopia, it's Defector Media, it's our contractors who make our videos, who make our show. So ad revenue is a big pot that we're all kind of drawing out of.

• 5:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:16Speaker 03

  Subscription revenue, which is the $5 you pay to get an extra episode a month along with other bonus content, that comes directly to us.

• 5:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:26Speaker 03

  As co-owners of Defector.

• 5:28Speaker 02

  We're not the New York Times. We're a small company. There's 27 of us. And the reason we introduced the subscription product in the first place was that we wanted to make Normal Gossip more integrated with the rest of Defector than it was before. So instead of having this kind of like island of Normal Gossip people, we wanted to make sure that like you, as the listeners of Normal Gossip, knew that we were a part of Defector and also that there's other content you get. So yes, as a subscriber, you get for $5 a month, one extra episode. But you also get articles. You also get a newsletter that has like lots of links in it and fun extra content. And like, you don't have to want that. We're not like begging you to subscribe. But it is the way that we see the future

• 6:12Speaker 02

  of this show being more integrated with the company that we own and love.

• 6:16Speaker 03

  Yeah. So I just wanted to talk about that a little bit on the main pod for a little bit, because I feel like we most often talk about Defector and subscribers and stuff on the subscriber episodes, because if you subscribe, it suggests you're interested in learning the behind the scenes. But I guess as things become less clear in terms of where money is going for creators that you want to support, I wanted to be pretty open about that, because I was kind of confused about the discussion. But I realized if you're from the outside looking in, it's not clear at all where any of this money is going. Yeah.

• 6:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:52Speaker 03

  You're just like, okay, well, there are ads, so you're making money, which is true. But you also have this thing that I could pay $5 for. Why do I need to do that? And the answer is, you don't need to. But if you do want Normal Gossip once a month, no matter whether or not we're producing the show, that's something you can have.

• 7:09Speaker 02

  Yeah. Also, as a side note, there are a lot of things that we cannot talk about incredibly explicitly on a public feed that everyone has access to. For example, if we want to talk about like actual celebrity gossip, or if we want to pan something, we usually do that on the subscriber feed.

• 7:27Speaker 03

  That is true.

• 7:28Speaker 02

  And so it's like, yes, it's paywalled. Part of the reason it's paywalled is because that's our safe space.

• 7:33Speaker 03

  It's true.

• 7:34Speaker 02

  We're talking shit in there.

• 7:36Speaker 03

  And we are. We do be talking shit. We have so many people come on and talk shit with us. We have y'all submit gossip morsels, which are literal, basically not super anonymized bits of gossip that we have people come on and react to. So, I mean, obviously, I make it. I would love if you paid for it, but I think it's a good subscription product if you like Normal Gossip and you get access to early information about like tours and stuff. But also, you can tell us what you might like in a subscription product. We're always...

• 8:09Speaker 02

  So true.

• 8:09Speaker 03

  Trying to make it better. That's the best part about owning our company, is that we can be like, oh, the listeners want to see more of our Slack transcriptions where we're talking shit about a celebrity. And it's like, oh.

• 8:20Speaker 02

  Here you go.

• 8:21Speaker 03

  Here you go. That's an option, you know?

• 8:23Speaker 02

  Also, one time, we drank a whole bottle of wine and talked about an erotic book.

• 8:27Speaker 03

  And we did.

• 8:28Speaker 02

  So there's all sorts of stuff going on on there.

• 8:29Speaker 03

  And we did. And we did. So, you know, subscribe if you want, but also...

• 8:34Speaker 02

  Literally like and subscribe.

• 8:36Speaker 03

  Literally like and subscribe, but also, in-season Normal Gossip will remain non-paywalled.

• 8:44Speaker 02

  Free, as they say.

• 8:46Speaker 03

  Thanks for listening. Now, back to your regularly scheduled program. I've got some gossip for you.

• 8:52Speaker 02

  Hit me.

• 8:53Speaker 03

  Are you ready?

• 8:53Speaker 02

  I'm so ready.

• 8:58Speaker 03

  Some of y'all may know that I used to host a twice weekly show about internet culture. And after doing that for three years, I basically abandoned social media. You can barely catch me online unless I absolutely need to. The one exception is Reddit. I swear to God, it is the one social media app that I check every single day because they have everything I need. I mean, I turn to my favorite subreddits like r slash girl dinner diaries when I'm bored, or r slash one orange brain cell because who doesn't want to see an orange cat? Or sometimes I'm just looking for recipes, or I'm looking

• 9:39Speaker 03

  for someone to talk to me about secret lives of Mormon wives. Reddit has useful answers, real perspectives, and communities built around whatever you are into or figuring out next. Download the Reddit app today. Y'all, for months, I've been in search of just a simple, black, crew neck cardigan. And I finally found exactly what I was looking for. I should have just gone to Quince as soon as I started thinking of this, but for some reason I didn't. Well, Quince had exactly what I wanted. Their Mongolian cashmere cropped crew cardigan is in fact so cute and their reviews are so good that despite the fact

• 10:21Speaker 03

  that I went in saying, I need a black cardigan to wear with everything, I took 15 minutes to decide what color I was getting. Do I need a red cardigan? Maybe. I can't promise I'm not gonna buy it later, but I did get the black one. Give the gift of quality this holiday season. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, now available in Canada and the UK too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Normal Gossip. It's the best way to support the show. We've been cooking up a fun, special holiday project for y'all over here at Normal Gossip.

• 11:04Speaker 03

  And usually when work gets crazy, I kind of just try to continue my life like nothing's happening. But recently, thanks to therapy, this time around, I was like, what if I did not try to pour from an empty cup? And that is what growing feels like. If you've been thinking about starting therapy, then I think you should check out today's sponsor, Growth Therapy. Growth Therapy is built for therapy that actually feels like care. You can find therapy based on what matters most to you, like insurance taken, mental health specialties, identity, or night and weekend availability if you're working a lot. Book your first session

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  in minutes and you can start in as little as two days. Sessions average $21 with insurance and some pay as little as $0 depending on your insurance plan. Prepare for holiday glimmers instead of holiday stress. Visit growththerapy.com/gossip to get started today. That is growththerapy.com/gossip. Availability and coverage vary by state and insurance plan.

• 12:14Speaker 03

  I have a very serious question for you.

• 12:15Speaker 02

  Oh, Lord.

• 12:17Speaker 03

  And I want you to answer with complete honesty.

• 12:19Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 12:20Speaker 03

  Are you a plant person?

• 12:21Speaker 02

  I would love to be a plant person in that I think plants look nice. But despite being insane, a Virgo, very well organized, design forward, I cannot keep a plant alive to save my life. And it's because I forget about them. And the problem is, plants don't have like, it's not consistent enough for me. Like, if it's like water it every day, I would do well. But it's not water it every day. It's water it like, every four days. And I'm like, I can't be putting that into my Google Calendar. There's already too much on there. And so then what I do is I just dump whatever's left in my water into the

• 13:02Speaker 02

  plant. And guess what? That doesn't work. So the plants I have, my outside plants do well because the sky waters them.

• 13:10Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 13:10Speaker 02

  But my inside plants, they are dead. Which you've seen, you've been to my house and seen my like, three dead plants.

• 13:18Speaker 03

  I didn't notice them among your many treasures.

• 13:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, you were distracted by my treasures. You couldn't see them.

• 13:23Speaker 03

  I was like, gadgets and gizmos aplenty.

• 13:25Speaker 02

  Literally. Pulling a fork out of my shelf.

• 13:31Speaker 03

  I want to be where the people are.

• 13:35Speaker 03

  I feel like I actually didn't know this about you, but it doesn't surprise me either. I feel like-

• 13:40Speaker 02

  Oh, you could have been, you wouldn't be surprised either way. If I was like insane about plants, that would have also made sense to you. It would make sense to me. I'm confused about why I'm not good at it.

• 13:49Speaker 03

  But it also somehow, the juxtaposition of all of the categories that would make you a good plant person and you not being a good plant person does make sense. Because I feel like as a plant person-

• 13:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, you're good at plants.

• 14:01Speaker 03

  Plants are a little less strict, but they also are, you do have to be keeping an eye on them at all times. You gotta keep an eye out for Selena with your, with your plants.

• 14:11Speaker 02

  In the same way that I don't see dust, I don't see plants. Like, I'm like, my brain just does not pick it up. And so I'm like, that's not my business.

• 14:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, our friend of mine today is named Martha, and Martha is an office manager-

• 14:24Speaker 02

  I love the name Martha.

• 14:26Speaker 03

  Do you?

• 14:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's so nice. Go ahead.

• 14:29Speaker 03

  Well, Martha is an office manager at a midsize pediatrician's office in a suburb of a major Midwestern city. Why are you already saying, oh, no?

• 14:38Speaker 02

  Because I just like, the doctor's waiting room is so stressful. And pediatricians, like, I feel like kids get sick in like, record time, right? Like, it's like, oh, you were fine yesterday, and now you have an ear infection and like, it's ruining your life. And so like, I imagine that managing a pediatrician's office is like, literally hell.

• 14:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. Waiting rooms are terrible.

• 15:00Speaker 02

  Liminal, strange.

• 15:02Speaker 03

  Give me high blood pressure.

• 15:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, and then they're like, you're sick.

• 15:07Speaker 03

  Girl. And I'm like, I'm sorry, you stressed me out.

• 15:10Speaker 02

  Sorry, it sucks here.

• 15:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm like, the vibes are horrendous. Maybe I wouldn't be so stressed out if the vibes are better.

• 15:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, get a candle.

• 15:16Speaker 03

  Just one.

• 15:17Speaker 02

  Turn these lights down.

• 15:19Speaker 03

  Fuck the fluorescent lights. Yeah, well, there are five doctors who practice at this office, and a whole assortment of like, physicians assistants-

• 15:27Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 15:27Speaker 03

  And nurses, plus one receptionist, and Martha.

• 15:30Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 15:31Speaker 03

  So there are about 30 people total employed at this office.

• 15:34Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 15:35Speaker 03

  As the office manager, Martha is responsible for handling the clinic's expenses, like payroll, rent, utilities, medical waste disposal. And then there's the plants.

• 15:44Speaker 02

  Oh, no.

• 15:48Speaker 03

  Now, at first, the plants cost the office nothing because the pediatrician who founded the practice loved plants.

• 15:54Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 15:54Speaker 03

  Her name was Dr. Honey.

• 15:56Speaker 02

  Aww.

• 15:57Speaker 03

  And she was the most beloved pediatrician in town for decades.

• 16:00Speaker 02

  So I would trust her with my life. Dr. Honey.

• 16:03Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 16:06Speaker 03

  She grew her practice from working solo to employing more than 20 people. And Dr. Honey was known for two things. Her signature polka dot doctor's coat.

• 16:15Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 16:16Speaker 03

  And her love of plants.

• 16:17Speaker 02

  Okay, slay.

• 16:18Speaker 03

  From the moment she opened her practice, it was covered with plants, like giant money trees, massive pothos plants, string of pearls, English ivies, snake plants galore. And Dr. Honey took care of all of them.

• 16:31Speaker 02

  I gotta admit, that's not what I want. Like, when I said I wanted a candle, I meant a candle, not like, thousands of candles, right? Like, I do want it to feel clean at the doctor's office. And something about the plants, like, that's dirt. That's not clean.

• 16:49Speaker 03

  You literally guessed the question I was gonna ask, which is, how would you feel if you walked into a doctor's office and there were like, a lot of plants?

• 16:57Speaker 02

  I think I would think I was in the wrong spot. Like, I would be like, this isn't right. This isn't where I'm supposed to be. Like, this is supposed to be uncomfortable in here. There's supposed to be like, a weird pattern on the chairs. I'm supposed to like, have to go to a little window and give them cards that I don't know where they are and like, cry.

• 17:13Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 17:14Speaker 02

  There can't be plants here also. That's crazy.

• 17:17Speaker 03

  So confused, but ultimately, it seems like it would improve the vibes for you.

• 17:22Speaker 02

  How bright are the lights?

• 17:26Speaker 03

  That's a great question.

• 17:27Speaker 02

  I do feel like if there's a lot of plants in the doctor's office, there does have to be natural light in the doctor's office. And usually, there's not. So that does seem better to me.

• 17:35Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 17:36Speaker 02

  Because I like the sun.

• 17:37Speaker 03

  Same. Well, Dr. Honey retired about four years before our story starts.

• 17:41Speaker 02

  Congratulations, girl. You did it.

• 17:44Speaker 03

  I can't wait to retire, if it ever happens.

• 17:46Speaker 02

  Sweetie, we're never retiring.

• 17:48Speaker 03

  And I know. Well, when Dr. Honey retired, she actually took all of her plants with her.

• 17:53Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 17:54Speaker 03

  Which was actually a relief to our friend of a friend, Martha, who is a plant agnostic. Like, she thinks they look nice, but she has zero desire to care for them.

• 18:02Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 18:02Speaker 03

  Familiar.

• 18:03Speaker 02

  Same.

• 18:03Speaker 03

  So Martha was like, phenomenal. Dr. Honey's taking all of her plants with her.

• 18:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:07Speaker 03

  Not my problem.

• 18:08Speaker 02

  Bye-bye.

• 18:08Speaker 03

  Literally. And Martha kept thinking this was phenomenal until all of the kiddos and their families started complaining about the lack of plants.

• 18:17Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 18:18Speaker 03

  For a month, it was all anyone working at the practice heard about. Like, it showed up in their Google reviews and in the comments on the article in the local paper about Dr. Honey's retirement. The comments were like, you could really sense the love back in Dr. Honey's day. We all just knew we could trust her with our children, right from when we walked in the door. So many doctors are just in it for the money these days.

• 18:41Speaker 02

  Oh, my God. Okay, first off, people will complain about anything, not necessarily your business. Second off, the plants made you feel that way? To me, doctors, they work a lot. Probably shouldn't have that much time to look after these plants. Should probably be more concerned about me being sick.

• 18:56Speaker 03

  True.

• 18:57Speaker 02

  Is my thought. But also, I'm like, people are really easily persuaded away from being in a bad mood. So like, what if you just got a soft serve machine?

• 19:08Speaker 02

  Like, oh, there are no more plants, but we have soft serve? Problem solved. Oh, there's no more plants, but we have 100 slinkies? Hmm? Like, children are easily made happy.

• 19:19Speaker 03

  And they are.

• 19:20Speaker 02

  The children, I feel, were not as passionate about the plants as their parents were. So I'm like, you get the parents a nice candle, you get the children a soft serve machine. Everyone's happy.

• 19:31Speaker 03

  Everyone's happy. It sounds like you don't have a lot of sympathy for these commenters.

• 19:35Speaker 02

  No, I never do.

• 19:38Speaker 02

  But I do respect them. Whenever I go somewhere that I really like, I like to read the one star reviews afterward. Because I'm like, wow, I just had the best dinner ever. Let's read the one star review. And the one star review is like, it was closed, one star.

• 19:49Speaker 03

  No, literally, it never had anything to do with the quality of the, it's always just like, when I-

• 19:54Speaker 02

  DoorDash driver left my thing outside, one star.

• 19:59Speaker 03

  This was the best thing I ever ate, but the bag ripped.

• 20:05Speaker 02

  Best meal I've ever eaten, fork too small, one star.

• 20:10Speaker 03

  Well, the five remaining doctors and all the staff were in agreement. If it will make these people shut the fuck up.

• 20:17Speaker 02

  It won't.

• 20:20Speaker 03

  They're like, let's just get some plants to honor Dr. Honey's memory, even though Dr. Honey is alive and well.

• 20:25Speaker 02

  No, I just, as a veteran of the blog minds, it won't. It won't make them shut up and it won't make them happy.

• 20:37Speaker 03

  Well, at the time, no one wanted to just like take on caring for a bunch of plants on top of their normal jobs.

• 20:41Speaker 02

  No.

• 20:42Speaker 03

  Right? So instead Martha actually found and hired a plant service that supplied the office with about 50 plants.

• 20:48Speaker 02

  Martha, incredible, really good idea.

• 20:50Speaker 03

  Right? All of the plants are like actually owned by the plant service and they send a gardener out about once a week to like water, trim, repot the plants.

• 20:57Speaker 02

  You think I can do that at my house?

• 20:58Speaker 03

  As necessary.

• 21:01Speaker 03

  That's actually a great question.

• 21:02Speaker 02

  I don't have money to do that, but I feel like rich people do be doing that. They do.

• 21:07Speaker 03

  Yeah. Well, this service has been costing the office about $3,000 per year, which works out to less than a hundred dollars a week.

• 21:14Speaker 02

  Uh huh. Okay.

• 21:15Speaker 03

  And sometimes it does take a couple of hours to do all the watering and trimming and repotting if like one of the plants dies.

• 21:21Speaker 02

  Sure, yeah.

• 21:21Speaker 03

  So $3,000 a year actually kind of feels like a good deal.

• 21:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I believe that people should be paid for their labor and this plant guy is coming over here to do all this stuff. It seems fair.

• 21:29Speaker 03

  Yeah. So as a small business owner, this feels like a good deal to you?

• 21:32Speaker 02

  Well, no, I don't think we should have gotten plants to begin with. Like if someone in our company was like, I want to spend a thousand dollars on plants, I would be like, I want you to quit. Get out of here. No, that's crazy. Um, but it sounds like the doctors have the power in this power struggle. And the doctors want the plants because they think it will make the patients happy. And doctors make a lot of money. So I'm like, whatever. Like $3,000, okay, sure. Now we have plants, I guess.

• 22:04Speaker 03

  Yeah. This doctor's office isn't exactly like a gravy train for the plant service. Like

• 22:11Speaker 03

  there's a lot of turnover amongst the gardeners, possibly because there's like so little money to go around, but possibly also because of the receptionist, whose name is Tori.

• 22:21Speaker 02

  Oh, Lord.

• 22:22Speaker 03

  Martha hired Tori three years ago and Tori is a plant lover.

• 22:27Speaker 02

  Oh, no.

• 22:28Speaker 03

  He has a sweatshirt that says plant parenthood.

• 22:34Speaker 02

  That's pretty good.

• 22:36Speaker 03

  He considers himself Dr. Honey's spiritual successor.

• 22:40Speaker 02

  Okay, even though he's a receptionist?

• 22:42Speaker 03

  Well, the children love him.

• 22:43Speaker 02

  Oh, okay.

• 22:44Speaker 03

  And he has like objectively improved the vibes in the clinic. Imagine like a boy, Mrs. Frizzle from the Magic School Bus.

• 22:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, see, we don't need plants. We have Tori.

• 22:53Speaker 03

  And Tori loves to crochet. Like he wears his own handmade granny square jacket in the office when it gets cold and he whips up gifts for any kid who has to get a shot. So like he'll ask for their favorite colors when they're checking in. And by the time they're checking out, have like a little doily ready.

• 23:07Speaker 02

  That's really cute.

• 23:08Speaker 03

  It's so cute.

• 23:10Speaker 02

  Also, I'm like, how much does this doctor cost? Like?

• 23:14Speaker 03

  This feels like one of those doctors.

• 23:15Speaker 02

  This is caught the earth, but some baby.

• 23:19Speaker 02

  This isn't for us and our regular insurance.

• 23:22Speaker 03

  This is called private insurance.

• 23:24Speaker 02

  Uh huh. This is an annual fee that you pay for Dr. Honey. So no wonder they want their fucking plants.

• 23:30Speaker 03

  And Tori loves plants. Every morning when he arrives, the first thing that he does is walk around the office with a sound bowl, giving all of the plants a sound bath.

• 23:41Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 23:41Speaker 03

  He says that the plants increase the vibrational energy of the space and the sound bowl helps them all harmonize, which in turn will help the children heal.

• 23:50Speaker 02

  I don't believe in king shaming, so I allow that.

• 23:54Speaker 02

  Sure. Have fun.

• 23:57Speaker 03

  Tori is constantly propagating new plants. Like it's common for him to have like a whole array of baby plants just lined up along the front counter where he works. But his biggest plant is a gigantic pathos that he has propagated from one of the office plants.

• 24:08Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 24:09Speaker 03

  Would you do me the honor of naming Tori's gigantic pathos?

• 24:13Speaker 02

  Do we know anything else about it? Also, can you describe to me what a pathos looks like in case what I'm picturing is wrong?

• 24:19Speaker 03

  It's one of the most common plants that you can see. It has like little like heart shaped leaves and they all like, usually they're trailing down. Like if you ever see like a really long vine in someone's house, it's probably a pathos plant. They're one of the hardest plants to kill.

• 24:34Speaker 02

  Let's call it Shakira.

• 24:37Speaker 03

  I love that. Incredible.

• 24:41Speaker 03

  Well, Shakira has a special stand up on the front counter.

• 24:45Speaker 02

  Wow. She wolf.

• 24:50Speaker 03

  Because the vines were getting so long that they had like reached the floor, but Tori refused to trim them. So he had to find a way to like move the plant higher.

• 24:58Speaker 02

  Okay, sure.

• 24:59Speaker 03

  Now you're a Virgo.

• 25:00Speaker 02

  Famously.

• 25:01Speaker 03

  A problem solver. So I feel like

• 25:03Speaker 02

  Problem.

• 25:06Speaker 03

  Creates problem, then solves it. Most people just do one.

• 25:09Speaker 02

  So true.

• 25:11Speaker 03

  And so I'm wondering if you're maybe thinking, why not save the money you're spending on the plant service and just let Tori take care of the plants since he loves them so much?

• 25:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, I am kind of thinking that because I'm like, $3,000 is a lot of money. I mean objectively. And I'm kind of like, Tori's already turning all these plants into more plants. So what if we just got rid of the mother plants and we had the baby plants instead?

• 25:35Speaker 03

  Yeah. This is, this is, this is a good plan.

• 25:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:38Speaker 03

  And the thing is Martha loves Tori. More importantly, Martha needs Tori.

• 25:44Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 25:44Speaker 03

  Martha and Tori work really well together.

• 25:47Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 25:47Speaker 03

  And Tori gets a lot done.

• 25:48Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 25:49Speaker 03

  But Martha has to be, let's say, careful about what tasks she assigns to Tori.

• 25:55Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 25:56Speaker 03

  And what little rituals she allows to become traditions. Because not only does Tori take his duty seriously, he can also get kind of like possessive about the work.

• 26:06Speaker 02

  Right. So like if someone comes in while he's doing the sound bath and disrupts the vibration, that's going to be a problem.

• 26:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 26:11Speaker 02

  For example.

• 26:12Speaker 03

  Exactly. And one time Martha asked Tori to take over stocking the break room. And Martha distinctly remembers telling Tori that this job means making sure they're stocked up on like coffee and creamer, as well as a few basics like pretzel, cheese, applesauce.

• 26:26Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 26:27Speaker 03

  But Tori saw an opportunity to be more thoughtful.

• 26:30Speaker 02

  Oh, Lord.

• 26:31Speaker 03

  Like he noticed that Martha brought in a small bar of dark chocolate for their lunch one day and the next week dark chocolate replaced the applesauce.

• 26:38Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 26:39Speaker 03

  No one complained about it.

• 26:40Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, obviously.

• 26:42Speaker 03

  But then Tori noticed one of the nurses snacking on a bag of pistachios at lunch and the next week there are three kinds of pistachios in the break room.

• 26:49Speaker 02

  God admit, these are all expensive snacks.

• 26:51Speaker 03

  Now, this seems very thoughtful of Tori, but do you see any problem with this in a pediatrician's office?

• 26:57Speaker 02

  One, expensive. Two, pistachios, a lot of shells everywhere. I don't like that.

• 27:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:02Speaker 02

  It's supposed to be very clean in here. Three, like doctors have a weird thing about like signaling health, right? So like I can imagine it being like, oh, we don't want the snack thing to get so overwhelming that then like patients see us eating dark chocolate in the middle of the day. What if our rich parents are like, chocolate's bad for you or whatever. Can I see any other problems? No, that's, that's what I've got so far.

• 27:23Speaker 03

  Those are good problems.

• 27:25Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 27:26Speaker 03

  Well, several of the nurses flagged this to Tori immediately. They were like, Tori, many of our patients have nut allergies.

• 27:33Speaker 02

  Duh.

• 27:36Speaker 02

  Duh. Pistachios, a nut famously.

• 27:39Speaker 03

  We cannot just fill this office with nuts. We only have so many EpiPens. Please get rid of the nuts and bring back the pretzels.

• 27:45Speaker 02

  Right. Because also that's like tons of contamination, right? Like if people are touching doorknobs, touching, right? Like even though I know people are very clean in doctor's offices, that's still a problem for sure.

• 27:56Speaker 03

  Well, apparently Tori said stocking the break room is my responsibility and taking care of the patients is your responsibility.

• 28:05Speaker 02

  Okay, first off, sweetie, you're a receptionist. Like I love you so much, but the children are sick.

• 28:13Speaker 02

  It's like the stakes are actually high. This isn't like a regular office where it's like, oh, whatever. Like let Tori have his little snacks. It's like, no, like what if a kid dies? Like the steak is dead.

• 28:26Speaker 03

  Of a child.

• 28:27Speaker 02

  Of a child.

• 28:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:31Speaker 03

  Yeah. Well, Martha heard the story from Lucy, who was the most senior.

• 28:35Speaker 02

  I bet she did. I bet she did.

• 28:40Speaker 03

  Lucy is the most senior of all the nurses.

• 28:42Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 28:42Speaker 03

  Lucy has jet black hair. She wears neon pink scrubs. She has a septum piercing, so everyone knows she's a socialist.

• 28:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course. I mean, we both have them.

• 28:53Speaker 03

  And while Lucy will crack up if any of the kids tell her a joke off of like a popsicle stick, Martha has never seen her smile at any of her coworkers.

• 29:01Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 29:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 29:02Speaker 02

  She's a cold, hard bitch.

• 29:03Speaker 03

  Lucy rarely speaks at staff meetings, but when she does, even the doctors like straighten up a little bit.

• 29:08Speaker 02

  That's a type of nurse that I love.

• 29:11Speaker 03

  That's the nurse I trust. She's gonna get my blood. She's gonna get the stick in one. Like, I'm not gonna have to. She's not fumbling for a vein.

• 29:17Speaker 02

  No. She knows what she's doing. She's in and out. She never laughs at my jokes, but I respect her.

• 29:22Speaker 03

  Exactly. Because you're not a child.

• 29:24Speaker 02

  I know. And this joke doesn't come off a popsicle stick. It's fair.

• 29:28Speaker 03

  Well, Lucy came to Martha and said, you need to deal with Tori. All the nurses are on the same page about this. Either the pistachios go, or we're all taking a sick day tomorrow.

• 29:38Speaker 02

  Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Absolutely not. We cannot have all, what? As a, as someone who's unionized two newsrooms, we can't have the nurses unionizing.

• 29:47Speaker 03

  Literally Martha's like, eh, whoa, no need to unionize.

• 29:50Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no, no.

• 29:53Speaker 03

  Consider the pistachios gone.

• 29:56Speaker 02

  Martha's lighting the pistachios on fire.

• 30:00Speaker 03

  Okay, so you're Martha. How do you approach this conversation with Tori?

• 30:04Speaker 02

  I say, Tori, children are going to die.

• 30:08Speaker 02

  Do you want to go to jail for accidental manslaughter? I don't think you do. So we are gonna get rid of these pistachios, and they're never coming back ever, ever, ever. And also, you're not gonna buy any of those like, single-serving, like, fancy peanut butter. Like, none of that. The nuts are done.

• 30:30Speaker 03

  Well, after the last patient of the day checks out, Martha asks Tori to come into her office.

• 30:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:35Speaker 03

  She closed the door.

• 30:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:36Speaker 03

  She says, I just wanted to check in about the snacks in the break room.

• 30:40Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 30:41Speaker 03

  And Tori immediately burst into tears. At the end of the conversation, long after the sun has set and the streetlights have come on outside.

• 30:49Speaker 02

  No.

• 30:52Speaker 03

  Tori says, okay, as a favor to you, Martha, I will stick to your list of approved snacks, but I need you to take my side next time. I refuse to be a team of one.

• 31:02Speaker 02

  First off, I'll take your side when you're fucking right. How about that? Like, I, this is crazy. Like, I refuse to be a team of one. Like, no, we're a team of two and I'm your boss.

• 31:15Speaker 02

  It's not, what are you talking about? I also like, never, I, like, as an insane person, you will never catch me blindly agreeing to like, have someone's back in the future. Like, no.

• 31:28Speaker 03

  Even me?

• 31:29Speaker 02

  What are you gonna do?

• 31:30Speaker 03

  I don't know yet.

• 31:31Speaker 02

  In theory, I have your back, unless you like, bring a gun somewhere, and then I'm gonna be like, help.

• 31:38Speaker 03

  You said I could have a gun before this.

• 31:40Speaker 02

  I did say that.

• 31:42Speaker 03

  Now we're taking it back now that we're on camera.

• 31:46Speaker 02

  But especially my employee, like, no way.

• 31:51Speaker 03

  Yeah. Tori's like, I need and I deserve to be supported.

• 31:55Speaker 02

  And you know what? You do, at home.

• 32:01Speaker 03

  Well, in that moment, desperate for this day to be over, Martha promises Tori that she would have his back next time.

• 32:07Speaker 02

  Martha, Martha, Martha.

• 32:10Speaker 03

  So, I've caught you up on the plants and their backstory.

• 32:13Speaker 02

  Uh huh.

• 32:13Speaker 03

  What potential problems do you see emerging?

• 32:16Speaker 02

  Tori clearly does not respect me as his boss. That's a problem.

• 32:21Speaker 03

  That is a problem.

• 32:21Speaker 02

  But also doesn't seem to really respect us as a team and thinks that we should just do whatever he wants all the time, which is more of a problem.

• 32:28Speaker 03

  Big problem.

• 32:29Speaker 02

  The nurses are more important than Tori, and also they're mad.

• 32:33Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:33Speaker 02

  So that's not good. I never want the nurses to be mad. The plants, I still don't give a shit about. Um, I think they should just get rid of them. Like, I'm like, this doesn't seem like that big of a problem to me. Um, my saws or machine idea, I think, would have solved that.

• 32:49Speaker 03

  100%.

• 32:49Speaker 02

  But also, Tori is front-facing.

• 32:53Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 32:53Speaker 02

  Right? So like, that's, you can't have the person welcoming parents of sick children into your pediatrician's office, having like, a pouty face all the time. Like, that's not gonna help anything. So I am also concerned about the management of Tori's emotions.

• 33:09Speaker 03

  This all seems to wrap around. Tori seems like, might, seems like a potential problem.

• 33:13Speaker 02

  I didn't say that. You said it.

• 33:13Speaker 03

  Oh, well.

• 33:18Speaker 02

  I think this level of sensitivity is difficult. It is hard to be a worker when you are that sensitive, because like, the workforce sucks.

• 33:28Speaker 03

  And it does.

• 33:28Speaker 02

  Doesn't care about you. And like, your boss doesn't give a shit about you.

• 33:32Speaker 03

  And he doesn't.

• 33:32Speaker 02

  It's hard. It's hard to be that sensitive. In general, like, I really have a lot of empathy for people who like, feel everything, as someone who feels very little. That's the difference between you and me.

• 33:43Speaker 03

  I feel everything.

• 33:44Speaker 02

  She's feeling stuff.

• 33:47Speaker 03

  Well, this brings us to the present, where this dynamic with the office plants is getting increasingly fraught.

• 33:53Speaker 02

  Just throw them away. It's fine.

• 33:55Speaker 03

  Well, Tori has a vision. Tori wants to spark joy. Tori says, I want our office to feel like the Rainforest Cafe. Kids love the Rainforest Cafe.

• 34:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, we can have our office feel like the Rainforest Cafe in that we can make it darker in here. Um, and we can have three stuffed frogs. That's what I'm willing to offer you. Otherwise, the Rainforest Cafe has literal rain. It has screaming gorillas. It has incredibly high ABV cocktails. Like, we cannot be doing that vibe.

• 34:28Speaker 03

  My kind of shit.

• 34:29Speaker 02

  At a pediatrician's office. Like, that's not the right vibe.

• 34:32Speaker 03

  Well, speaking of the pediatrician's office, the nurses hate all the trailing vines hanging everywhere.

• 34:37Speaker 02

  Obviously, because it's a doctor's office.

• 34:41Speaker 03

  Taking kids back to the exam rooms is like running a gauntlet. More than once, they've had to pry like a popo sleeve out of a child's mouth.

• 34:48Speaker 02

  Oh, my god.

• 34:49Speaker 03

  The nurses keep asking the plant service to trim the vines, but the gardeners are like.

• 34:54Speaker 02

  Those aren't our plants. That's Shakira.

• 34:58Speaker 03

  And they're also like, we don't want to deal with Tori. He's got a vision.

• 35:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:02Speaker 03

  I mean, part of the issue with resolving this situation is Martha doesn't want to lose Tori, who gets mentioned by name in their five-star reviews.

• 35:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, people love Tori.

• 35:11Speaker 03

  Often than any of the doctors.

• 35:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, totally.

• 35:13Speaker 03

  And before Martha can really decide to do anything, something changes to upset this already delicate balance.

• 35:19Speaker 02

  No, no.

• 35:20Speaker 03

  One day, the plant service assigns a new gardener. And after exactly 30 minutes of Tori breathing over his shoulder, the guy leaves.

• 35:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:29Speaker 03

  He just never comes back.

• 35:30Speaker 02

  You can quit your job at any time. No one can stop you.

• 35:35Speaker 03

  Our job makes a shirt that says, quit your job.

• 35:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. One of my favorite things to do in these stories is think about it from like, anyone else's perspective in the story. Like, imagine you work for a garden service. You come into a literal pediatrician's office that's full of fucking plants.

• 35:49Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 35:49Speaker 02

  And then this random man in a crocheted sweater is standing next to you being like, with a sound bowl, being like, this plant doesn't like those vibrations. I would be like, I quit. Get me out of here.

• 36:01Speaker 03

  Yeah. Well, after a week of the plants not being watered, Martha calls the plant service. And the plant service is like, oh my god, I'm so sorry. It's, we'll be right out. But no one comes. Another week passes. The plants start to get droopy. One Monday during their check-in, Tori's like, Martha, can I water the plants?

• 36:18Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 36:18Speaker 03

  Do you let Tori water the plants?

• 36:20Speaker 02

  No.

• 36:21Speaker 03

  No.

• 36:22Speaker 02

  I'm Martha. As his manager, it is my job to set him up for success. So I cannot allow him to take any more non-job-related duties. Like, you gotta stop, my man.

• 36:32Speaker 03

  Well, you and Martha are on the same page here.

• 36:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, obviously.

• 36:35Speaker 03

  Martha very cleverly is like, Tori, you already have so many responsibilities.

• 36:39Speaker 02

  I can't believe you picked a story that forces me to align myself with management. That's insane.

• 36:43Speaker 03

  It's almost like we're both on the manager board at our company.

• 36:49Speaker 03

  Pissed upon your own matin.

• 36:50Speaker 02

  So true. Voted in.

• 36:53Speaker 03

  And luckily, the day that Tori asks about watering the plants is the same day that a new doctor starts at the clinic. This doctor's name is Dr. Clementine.

• 37:01Speaker 02

  Okay, cute.

• 37:03Speaker 03

  And despite her whimsical name, Martha knows as the person who did her initial screening call, that 50% of the reason Dr. Clementine has been hired is to whip them all into shape.

• 37:12Speaker 02

  Dr. Clementine and Lucy are gonna be doing those high fives that football players do, where it like, hits in the back. Like, they're about to run this place like a very tight ship.

• 37:21Speaker 03

  Like the Navy.

• 37:22Speaker 02

  Which is like, literally my dream. So I do respect that.

• 37:26Speaker 03

  As you noted, Dr. Clementine runs a tight ship. She has immaculate sage green scrubs. She, a different animal print lanyard for each day of the week.

• 37:36Speaker 02

  Oh, okay, great.

• 37:37Speaker 03

  She can type 100 words per minute.

• 37:39Speaker 02

  Incredible.

• 37:40Speaker 03

  And according to the nurses, her visit notes are the clearest and most thorough of any doctor at the clinic.

• 37:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, because she's not here to fuck around.

• 37:48Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine has a very specific end-of-day checklist, a specific place for everything to go in the exam room. Some of the doctors go by their first names with the rest of the staff.

• 37:55Speaker 02

  No, uh, not anymore.

• 37:59Speaker 02

  Not in my house.

• 38:02Speaker 03

  On her second day, Dr. Clementine stops by Martha's office, which is very close to where Tori sits at the front desk. So Martha knows Tori will be listening. When Dr. Clementine is like, do you have a minute to discuss the opening checklist for the clinic?

• 38:16Speaker 02

  Yes, Dr. Clementine, I do. Why don't you come in and close the door?

• 38:20Speaker 03

  And you're smarter. You're smarter than Martha is. Martha's like, yeah, of course. And Dr. Clementine's like, I've noticed that once the front desk staff arrives, there's a lot of noise in the lobby and in the halls.

• 38:35Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine says it is important to have clear thinking at the start of the day, because clear thinking makes a clear mind.

• 38:40Speaker 02

  I respect this woman. And I'm terrified of her.

• 38:45Speaker 03

  And this is when Tori calls over from the front desk. Exactly. That's what the sound bowl is for.

• 38:51Speaker 02

  Dr. Clementine going, who is this?

• 38:55Speaker 03

  Well, Dr. Clementine just looks over her glasses at Martha.

• 39:00Speaker 03

  And then leaves without another word.

• 39:01Speaker 02

  Listen, you want to do your weird little sound bath thing that you like, that's great. You have to get here 30 minutes before the clinic opens. Sorry. It's not part of your job duties.

• 39:13Speaker 03

  So thoughts and feelings on Dr. Clementine. I have a feeling she's your hero.

• 39:17Speaker 02

  I love her. She's insane. I respect people who are really serious because I'm not super serious. I have my shit together and I respect other people having their shit together. So I salute her. I am afraid of her. Like, there's something terrifying about someone that put together. I would work for her in a heartbeat.

• 39:40Speaker 03

  Because you know she would have clear expectations.

• 39:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, you would know exactly what your job was and when it needed to be done and exactly when you could go home. And if you did a good job, once a year, she would be like, good job with that. And it would feel like the best day of your life.

• 39:56Speaker 03

  Yeah. Well, at the end of Dr. Clementine's first week, Martha has her monthly meeting with all the doctors. And it is important to note here, as you astutely noted, most workplaces, not everybody's opinion matters in this clinic.

• 40:08Speaker 02

  No.

• 40:09Speaker 03

  Yeah. Although there are 30 employees, it is the five doctors that make all the decisions.

• 40:13Speaker 02

  Also, doctors, like famously, I love doctors. I respect them. They have saved my life and the lives of many people who I love. And also, they do have God complexes. And so there, I expected this, that there would be a little bit of hierarchy, both enforced and invited.

• 40:31Speaker 03

  Yeah. The five doctors are like heads of their own, like tiny fiefdoms. So if you get a memo, the first question should not be, how do I implement this memo? It should be, and what is my Lord's position on this?

• 40:48Speaker 03

  So these meetings between Martha and the doctors sometimes result in really big-

• 40:51Speaker 02

  This is just like Grey's Anatomy.

• 40:54Speaker 03

  So no one's fucking. That I know of.

• 40:59Speaker 03

  So these meetings between Martha and the doctors sometimes result in like, big changes for the clinic.

• 41:03Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 41:04Speaker 03

  And no one was really expecting Dr. Clementine to add much to the agenda, since it's her first week.

• 41:09Speaker 02

  Are you out of your mind? This woman's gonna rewrite how you do the agenda. And she's gonna do it immediately because she's been given authority.

• 41:17Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine has a proposal.

• 41:19Speaker 02

  I bet she does. I bet her proposal is, we're gonna do it my way.

• 41:24Speaker 03

  It's about the office plants, which after two weeks without water are really starting to look like shit.

• 41:30Speaker 02

  They're looking bad.

• 41:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 41:31Speaker 02

  It's like my house.

• 41:35Speaker 03

  And Dr. Clementine has a simple solution. Get rid of all of the plants.

• 41:45Speaker 03

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• 43:06Speaker 03

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• 45:12Speaker 03

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• 46:03Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine did her research. She says, from what I've heard, the plant service is unreliable.

• 46:10Speaker 03

  It's already an unnecessary expense, and they're not even providing a service.

• 46:13Speaker 02

  She's right.

• 46:14Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine feels like plants are tacky.

• 46:17Speaker 02

  Pop off.

• 46:20Speaker 02

  That's a crazy take.

• 46:24Speaker 02

  The earth tacky.

• 46:27Speaker 03

  There's inside and outside.

• 46:29Speaker 02

  Plants go up there.

• 46:32Speaker 03

  But more importantly, Dr. Clementine has seen firsthand what an unsupervised toddler can do with a peace lily.

• 46:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, there are children everywhere. I recently watched my friend's child, who I love very much, put a whole handful of dirt in his mouth. And like, he's fine. He'll be fine. You can't just be leaving pots of dirt around a pediatrician's office. Like, that's crazy. From the beginning, I have said, get rid of these damn plants.

• 46:56Speaker 03

  And you have. And you have. Dr. Clementine is like, if this office can't keep basic houseplants alive, how can parents trust us with their children?

• 47:03Speaker 02

  Damn.

• 47:07Speaker 02

  Me standing at my desk, like-

• 47:12Speaker 03

  Everyone is a little taken aback. And many of them were traumatized from the hubbub when Dr. Honey retired. One of the younger doctors, Dr. Delgado, Dr. Delgado is, you know that kid in the classroom who reminds the teacher that they forgot to give a pop quiz?

• 47:29Speaker 02

  That's what I imagine all of medical school is like, but yes.

• 47:32Speaker 03

  That's Dr. Delgado. He is objectively brilliant, so good at his job. Whenever another doctor's having trouble making a diagnosis, they bring in Dr. Delgado, even though he's so young.

• 47:41Speaker 02

  Okay, yeah.

• 47:42Speaker 03

  Dr. Delgado loves order. So he is in total awe of Dr. Clementine.

• 47:47Speaker 02

  He's saluting.

• 47:48Speaker 03

  He's like, plants are tacky. I've been saying this for years.

• 47:53Speaker 02

  He's rapidly switching out his lanyard with one with a zebra print.

• 47:57Speaker 03

  Though Martha has never heard him voice his opinion about plants until now.

• 48:01Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, all his opinions are Dr. Clementine's opinions now because she's brilliant.

• 48:06Speaker 03

  And ultimately, most of the doctors are like, we did like the plants when they were alive, but now that they're dying, this all seems like more hassle than it's worth.

• 48:14Speaker 02

  Also, maybe our beautiful children, parentheses, the patients at this establishment and their parents, were just reacting poorly to Dr. Honey leaving. Maybe this was never really about the plants anyway.

• 48:25Speaker 03

  It was about change.

• 48:26Speaker 02

  It was about change.

• 48:27Speaker 03

  And the fear of change.

• 48:28Speaker 02

  And you know what? More change is here, bitch.

• 48:29Speaker 03

  Wow, it never stops. Dr. Clementine is victorious. Martha's instructed to fire the plant service.

• 48:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, great.

• 48:37Speaker 03

  Which ends up being pretty easy.

• 48:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, because they aren't coming anyway.

• 48:41Speaker 03

  The plant service does not seem surprised by this phone call. They even refund Martha for the rest of the quarter.

• 48:47Speaker 02

  Great.

• 48:48Speaker 03

  Martha's like, Dr. Clementine's victory is my victory.

• 48:51Speaker 02

  I have extra money now that I can manage with. Yeah.

• 48:53Speaker 03

  And this is one more task off my plate. I don't gotta deal with this invoice at the end of the year.

• 48:57Speaker 02

  Incredible.

• 48:58Speaker 03

  Until Martha asks the plant service when they'll be coming to collect the plants.

• 49:02Speaker 02

  And they say, never, heart.

• 49:06Speaker 03

  Which is when they say, oh, you can keep the plants and then they hang up.

• 49:10Speaker 02

  I'm gonna keep them in the trash. I'm gonna wait until Tori goes home. And then I'm gonna throw all these plants away. And then when asked about it, I'm gonna lie. I'm gonna say the plant service came and got them. They're gone. Bye.

• 49:21Speaker 03

  Wow. I was gonna ask you, Martha, you're now in charge of 50 dead or dying plants. What do you do? But it sounds like you eat them into the trash.

• 49:29Speaker 02

  Goodbye.

• 49:30Speaker 03

  Goodbye, plants.

• 49:31Speaker 02

  Maybe if I'm feeling really like I have some extra time on my hands, I would list them on Facebook Marketplace. Free plants.

• 49:37Speaker 03

  Hell, yeah. Monstera's used to cost a lot of money.

• 49:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, come get them.

• 49:42Speaker 03

  Come get them. Free.

• 49:43Speaker 02

  You can nurse it back to life.

• 49:44Speaker 03

  It's not quite dead.

• 49:46Speaker 02

  Get it away from me.

• 49:48Speaker 03

  The only thing Martha cares about is making sure that whatever happens with the plants is not her decision.

• 49:53Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 49:54Speaker 03

  Tori will not be able to handle it if he feels like Martha did not fight for the plants with every fiber of her being.

• 50:00Speaker 02

  Tori is an employee and therefore also an adult.

• 50:05Speaker 03

  Well, Martha decides to send an email to the three most senior doctors at the practice. So she leaves Dr. Clementine and Dr. Delgado off the email.

• 50:14Speaker 02

  Uh huh.

• 50:15Speaker 03

  Because Martha is worried that Dr. Clementine might go on a plant murdering spree, as you advocated for.

• 50:21Speaker 02

  She might already be done.

• 50:23Speaker 03

  With Dr. Delgado as an accomplice, once they figure out that the plant service does not give a single shit about these plants. So on the plus side, the three senior doctors get her an answer within 24 hours with minimal bickering. On the downside, they don't want to get rid of the plants.

• 50:38Speaker 02

  It's never about the plants.

• 50:39Speaker 03

  Their solution, they're like, well, Tori is a plant lover, isn't he?

• 50:45Speaker 02

  No, no, no.

• 50:47Speaker 03

  Perhaps Tori could take over the plant care.

• 50:49Speaker 02

  I'm Googling fastest way to kill a plant forever.

• 50:55Speaker 02

  And then whatever that is, I'm buying it. I'm spraying it on every plant.

• 51:00Speaker 02

  You can try to bring them back. They're covered in rubbing alcohol. Good luck.

• 51:05Speaker 03

  You said kill them.

• 51:08Speaker 03

  Are you letting Tori take over the plant care?

• 51:10Speaker 02

  No, absolutely not, because not only is Tori gonna become like really particular about the plants, which we don't need. Dr. Clementine, who is my boss and also a drill sergeant, has said that they should go. And therefore I don't want them here anymore. And Tori does not seem to understand. Something you should know is that you can talk about the problems at your job to people not at your job. This is like, you can talk about the problems at your job to people not there. You can have a friend group and tell them. You can go to the group chat and say, I hate my boss. And all your friends are gonna thumbs that up and they're gonna be like, yeah, we hate your boss too. And then three days later, you're gonna be like, I don't hate my boss anymore. And they're gonna be like, thumbs up. Good for you, girl.

• 51:55Speaker 02

  Like, you don't have to bring all of the drama that you have at work to work. And Tori does not seem to understand that, which means that any drama at work is going to be my problem as Tori's boss.

• 52:06Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 52:06Speaker 02

  And I reject it. I say, nope, no, get out of here.

• 52:12Speaker 03

  You're on the same page as Martha.

• 52:13Speaker 02

  Oh, great.

• 52:14Speaker 03

  Who was not even planning to tell Tori that they fired the plant service in the first place.

• 52:18Speaker 02

  I'm telling Tori nothing.

• 52:21Speaker 03

  However, and honestly, you might be on the same page here too. Martha decides to do what every overcompensating eldest daughter usually does in a situation such as this.

• 52:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 52:33Speaker 03

  For a whole year.

• 52:35Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. And I assume she has to keep this kind of, she's gonna have to come in early and do it or stay late and do it. Because if Tori catches her, he's gonna take over. Martha, no, girl, this job does not pay you. I don't know what it pays you, but it's not enough.

• 52:51Speaker 03

  For a whole year, Martha waters the plants herself in secret.

• 52:55Speaker 02

  One whole year of your short and precious life.

• 52:59Speaker 03

  As you noted, either before Tori arrives or after he leaves. And also every couple of months, Dr. Clementine or Dr. Delgado is like, we fired the plant service, right? When are they picking up the plants? And Martha's like, I keep calling them and they don't come.

• 53:14Speaker 02

  Kill the plants. Kill them. Problem solved.

• 53:18Speaker 03

  And neither of these doctors care enough to do such a menial task as make a phone call themselves.

• 53:23Speaker 02

  They're doctors. They have shit to do.

• 53:27Speaker 03

  So this fragile piece lasts for a whole year.

• 53:29Speaker 02

  Uh huh.

• 53:30Speaker 03

  Does Martha complain about the situation at least once a month to her husband?

• 53:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 53:35Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 53:35Speaker 02

  Martha's husband's gonna kill the plant.

• 53:38Speaker 03

  Does her husband say, maybe have a direct conversation with your coworkers?

• 53:44Speaker 02

  I don't think Martha's gonna do that, based on what I've learned about her.

• 53:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 53:49Speaker 02

  The theme of today's episode is avoidance.

• 53:53Speaker 03

  And it is. So again, this goes on for a whole year until

• 53:58Speaker 02

  Oh, my god.

• 53:59Speaker 03

  Everyone starts prepping for the big move.

• 54:01Speaker 02

  What big move?

• 54:03Speaker 03

  Well, you see, the clinic is moving to a different building. It's in a much better location with a much bigger parking lot and it's right next to a co-op grocery store. So everyone's really excited.

• 54:12Speaker 02

  I can kick every plant off of the moving truck and just break them.

• 54:16Speaker 03

  Well, as everyone in the office is packing and prepping, Dr. Clementine and Dr. Delgado stop by Martha's office and they ask her to distribute a memo.

• 54:23Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 54:24Speaker 03

  Which says, none of the plants.

• 54:27Speaker 02

  These people and their memos. Okay, god, sorry.

• 54:29Speaker 03

  Can you imagine if we did anything by memo at our company? No one would read it.

• 54:32Speaker 02

  No one would read it.

• 54:35Speaker 02

  We do do things by memo in that Jasper puts them in a PowerPoint and then we force everyone to read it with us at a meeting.

• 54:43Speaker 03

  These two distribute a memo, which says, none of the plants can be moved to the new office. There will be no space for plants.

• 54:51Speaker 02

  Agree.

• 54:51Speaker 03

  The plants must be given away or thrown away, but they will not be coming along. Question?

• 54:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, I have a question. What about Shakira? I feel like she hasn't been here in a while and I'm concerned.

• 55:02Speaker 03

  Where is Shakira?

• 55:04Speaker 02

  Where is she? The nurses don't like her. None of the plants are allowed to come. What about my superstar?

• 55:10Speaker 03

  Exactly. And it's also unclear if the doctors have the authority to do this.

• 55:14Speaker 02

  Yes, they do. I, the plants aren't real.

• 55:19Speaker 02

  This isn't real. None of this is real.

• 55:22Speaker 03

  And the thing is, no one actually responds to Dr. Clementine's memo outright.

• 55:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course not. Nobody read it.

• 55:29Speaker 03

  And they certainly did not ask Martha's permission for this little memo coup that they're doing.

• 55:34Speaker 02

  It's not a coup. She's in charge. It's a top-down edict.

• 55:41Speaker 03

  But deep down in Martha's little heart, she's grateful for this top-down edict.

• 55:44Speaker 02

  I bet she is.

• 55:45Speaker 03

  She's like, maybe my days of coming early to water the plants are over.

• 55:49Speaker 02

  She's been Googling pothos help for nine months.

• 55:54Speaker 03

  Tori, however, spends the rest of the day at his desk with his face just getting redder and redder. Like, you know the face people have when they're trying not to cry? You've certainly never seen this expression on my face before.

• 56:04Speaker 02

  I see it on her face often. I would be like, Tori, why don't you go home? Why don't you take a personal day?

• 56:09Speaker 03

  Why don't you take an early day?

• 56:10Speaker 02

  Why don't you go ahead and leave? And then what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna do both our jobs. And then tomorrow, I'm gonna be like, are you finished?

• 56:18Speaker 03

  You had a good day off?

• 56:19Speaker 02

  Did you have a good day off?

• 56:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 56:20Speaker 02

  You went to the spa? Do you need another day off? That's all I'm willing to offer is two days, one and a half days off.

• 56:28Speaker 03

  Honestly, I take it. Not bad. Not bad. Meanwhile, Martha sees Lucy and some of the other nurses reading the memo. And Lucy actually pumps her fist, which is the most emotion Martha has seen from Lucy in like six months.

• 56:39Speaker 02

  I'm telling you, if Lucy is on Dr. Clementine's side, it's over. Like, you've lost the war.

• 56:46Speaker 03

  You've lost the crowd.

• 56:47Speaker 02

  Because the nurses are gonna fall in line. Like, this is, this is about votes. And Dr. Clementine, it seems like she's got the votes because she has her cohort and it's Fiftem, Dr. Delgato's.

• 56:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 56:59Speaker 02

  Now all the nurses, like, that's a majority, baby.

• 57:03Speaker 03

  It is. It really is. You're right. You're right. Well, it's the first day in the new office. How are you expecting the move to go?

• 57:09Speaker 02

  Well, moves always go poorly. That's like rule number one of moving.

• 57:12Speaker 03

  And that's why you never move.

• 57:13Speaker 02

  I'm expecting, I don't know where my stethoscope is, all the files are out of order and need to be refixed, realphabetized. I'm expecting that the plants are here because the movers probably just picked them up and put them into the moving truck.

• 57:25Speaker 03

  It's a great guess. Did you know doctors have to pay for them a stethoscope? I thought it just came with the office. That's theirs.

• 57:30Speaker 02

  I recently learned this, that they also have to buy like some of their own little like microscopes and stuff?

• 57:36Speaker 03

  Expensive.

• 57:37Speaker 02

  That's crazy.

• 57:38Speaker 03

  I know.

• 57:38Speaker 02

  My opinion, the government should pay for it.

• 57:42Speaker 02

  Your tax dollars.

• 57:44Speaker 03

  We both have septum rings. We're both socialists.

• 57:49Speaker 02

  I'm a communist.

• 57:50Speaker 03

  I've never read Marx, so I can't say for sure.

• 57:56Speaker 02

  Thank you for your honesty.

• 57:57Speaker 03

  I'm just like, I'm pretty sure, but I don't actually know.

• 58:02Speaker 02

  Okay, sorry.

• 58:03Speaker 03

  Well, Martha's the first one at the office.

• 58:05Speaker 02

  Great, she can get rid of the plants.

• 58:08Speaker 03

  As she walks in, she sees

• 58:11Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

• 58:13Speaker 03

  That at least 80% of the plants from the old office have reappeared.

• 58:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, because movers, it's not their job to make decisions. It's their job to move stuff and they're really good at it.

• 58:24Speaker 03

  They're not in like metal baskets on the wall anymore. They've been nicely potted and placed on shelves and on top of cabinets. No one takes credit for this. Everyone suspects Tori. And Tori has his gigantic pothos Shakira.

• 58:38Speaker 02

  I knew she was gonna be a problem. I knew it.

• 58:42Speaker 03

  Even higher than before.

• 58:44Speaker 02

  Oh, my god.

• 58:45Speaker 03

  In pride of place on the front desk, so it is the first thing you see when you walk into the lobby.

• 58:49Speaker 02

  Dr. Clementine's gonna bring a gun. Like, this is over.

• 58:54Speaker 03

  I'm shooting all these plants.

• 59:00Speaker 02

  We're so stupid.

• 59:03Speaker 03

  Well, on their first day in the new location, Dr. Clementine brings this issue to email. She addresses all the doctors and CC's Martha. The plants were not supposed to come to the new office.

• 59:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:13Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine asks for all the plants to be disposed of immediately.

• 59:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, this is what I wanted to do to begin with.

• 59:19Speaker 03

  The other senior doctors, however, do not agree.

• 59:22Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, because this isn't about the plants. This is about a power struggle.

• 59:25Speaker 03

  They say the plants aren't doing any harm. And they say that their community has enough to adjust to with the change in location without the office just getting rid of all the plants too.

• 59:34Speaker 02

  Okay, if you're gonna be like, we can't kill the plants, we can't kill a living thing. Okay, great. Congrats. You have 80 new plants.

• 59:41Speaker 03

  These are your plants now.

• 59:42Speaker 02

  Take them home. Good luck.

• 59:44Speaker 03

  The three senior doctors outvote Dr. Clementine and Dr. Delgado. The plants can stay.

• 59:49Speaker 02

  Nah.

• 59:51Speaker 03

  Well, how do you expect this power struggle to end?

• 59:53Speaker 02

  I don't have a fucking clue. And I'm really concerned.

• 59:57Speaker 03

  Wow, I'm honored. That you haven't guessed the ending.

• 1:00:05Speaker 03

  Well, luckily, this is right around the holidays, so everyone quickly becomes too busy to give a fuck about the plants in the office.

• 1:00:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, everyone's sick.

• 1:00:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:00:12Speaker 02

  It's the holidays.

• 1:00:13Speaker 03

  Sick, shopping.

• 1:00:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:14Speaker 03

  Children, home.

• 1:00:15Speaker 02

  Everyone's sick.

• 1:00:16Speaker 03

  Yeah. The office is closed between Christmas and New Year's, except somehow almost every day Martha is fielding requests from staffers who want to get into the building. Like, Dr. Delgado texts Martha to ask where she keeps her toolbox, because he wants to like hang up some pictures in his office. Tori goes into the office twice.

• 1:00:31Speaker 02

  Go home.

• 1:00:35Speaker 03

  Well, Tori goes into the office twice over the break just to clear out their voicemails.

• 1:00:39Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:00:41Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine goes into the office once to reorganize the supply room with Martha's blessing. She's like, you, you can go.

• 1:00:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, go for it, girl.

• 1:00:48Speaker 03

  Pop off, queen.

• 1:00:49Speaker 02

  User label maker.

• 1:00:52Speaker 03

  Lucy goes in to pick up a cellphone charger she forgot. So people are kind of coming in and out.

• 1:00:56Speaker 02

  Everyone is lying. These are all lies. They're giving themselves botox injections.

• 1:01:02Speaker 03

  They're trying out the anesthesia.

• 1:01:06Speaker 03

  Well, the Monday after the holidays, Martha comes in bright and early. She is honestly, quite frankly, thankful to be back at work and no longer entertaining her toddler.

• 1:01:15Speaker 02

  Oh, I didn't know she had a toddler. All this time she's been taking care of all these plants and then she's going home and getting attacked by a toddler? Like, no.

• 1:01:22Speaker 03

  So Martha's like, thank God, I'm gonna talk to mostly adults for the next couple hours.

• 1:01:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm talking to parents. I'm talking to my coworkers. I'm not talking about Bluey.

• 1:01:32Speaker 03

  She says, new year, new me.

• 1:01:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:34Speaker 03

  Until she sees the plants.

• 1:01:38Speaker 02

  Oh, no. Why are they still here?

• 1:01:40Speaker 03

  Well, they all look terrible. They are looking shriveled. They're like dropping leaves. And at first Martha's like, maybe it just got too cold in the office over the holidays. So she's like going around assessing the damage.

• 1:01:53Speaker 03

  It was Kelsey.

• 1:01:56Speaker 03

  But when Martha gets to Tori's gigantic potho Shakira at the front desk, she notices there's like a strange white substance scattered on the counter.

• 1:02:04Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:02:06Speaker 03

  And when Martha pulls back the vines of the pothos, there's even more of the white stuff, like all around the soil at the base of the plant. So what would you do if presented with an unidentified white substance?

• 1:02:17Speaker 02

  I would throw all these plants away, is what I would do. I feel like also just because it is like an office, I'm like, it's dirty, like someone else needs to be alerted. If you wanted to poison the plants, great. That seems like the right choice to me. But plant poison, whatever it is, I don't know how you kill a plant, I assume, except the normal way, which is a slow death where you don't water them. I assume is also gonna be poisonous to children. So someone needs to be alerted. It's not me. The white stuff needs to be cleaned up.

• 1:02:49Speaker 03

  Yeah. Here's where I really, really get concerned.

• 1:02:54Speaker 02

  Uh-oh.

• 1:02:54Speaker 03

  For our friend of a friend, Martha.

• 1:02:56Speaker 02

  Poor Martha.

• 1:02:58Speaker 03

  Because this bitch licks her finger, presses it to the unidentified white powder.

• 1:03:06Speaker 02

  Martha, this isn't fun dip land. What are you doing?

• 1:03:09Speaker 03

  And taste it.

• 1:03:10Speaker 02

  No, no. Mm-mm. That's the wrong answer.

• 1:03:16Speaker 02

  I can't even say the thing I was about to say, but you shouldn't be taking any white powders without testing them.

• 1:03:23Speaker 03

  No, you shouldn't.

• 1:03:24Speaker 02

  All white powders should be tested.

• 1:03:28Speaker 03

  Well, this white powder tastes like salt. And when Martha goes to check all the other plants, as in, once again, continues to lick this unidentified white substance.

• 1:03:38Speaker 02

  I know you work at a doctor's office, but healthcare is still not free. Like, what are you trying to do, girl?

• 1:03:44Speaker 03

  Martha confirms that all the plants have seemingly been salted. And Martha Googles what happens when you put salt in plants, and the answer is they die.

• 1:03:52Speaker 02

  Wow, I wish I'd known this earlier.

• 1:03:54Speaker 03

  So I have three questions for you.

• 1:03:56Speaker 02

  All right, hit me.

• 1:03:57Speaker 03

  The first one is, would you assume that the unidentified white substance that tastes like salt is salt?

• 1:04:03Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:04:03Speaker 03

  Because there are, there are other substances that taste like salt.

• 1:04:06Speaker 02

  Lots of things taste salty.

• 1:04:07Speaker 03

  Yeah, baking soda, powder, one of them does.

• 1:04:10Speaker 02

  Also, like, one, don't be tasting things. Two, like, no, you're not a chemical engineer. You don't know what that is. Stop.

• 1:04:18Speaker 03

  Second question, if it is salt, who do you think assaulted these plants?

• 1:04:24Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 1:04:26Speaker 02

  Bored. Boo. Who has assaulted the plants? I don't think it's Dr. Clementine, because Dr. Clementine, that type of woman does not do her own dirty work. Someone else does it.

• 1:04:40Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 1:04:41Speaker 02

  We gotta have a named character, right, is my guess. My main suspects are Dr. Delgado.

• 1:04:46Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:04:46Speaker 02

  Because suck up.

• 1:04:48Speaker 03

  Good choice.

• 1:04:49Speaker 02

  And Lucy, she's mean.

• 1:04:55Speaker 03

  Um, and final question, what should Martha do here? Besides maybe get a checkup from the doctors to make sure she hasn't poisoned herself?

• 1:05:06Speaker 02

  Step one, I would make sure that you haven't been poisoned.

• 1:05:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:05:08Speaker 02

  Step two, throw the plants away.

• 1:05:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:05:11Speaker 02

  Now all your problems are solved.

• 1:05:12Speaker 03

  It's true.

• 1:05:12Speaker 02

  Step three, vacuum.

• 1:05:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:05:14Speaker 02

  Maybe actually, step one, call your employee, tell him, we don't actually need you today.

• 1:05:20Speaker 03

  You said, Tori, you have an extra day of Christmas break.

• 1:05:23Speaker 02

  I said, Tori, it's so crazy. We don't need you today. Why don't you stay home? Then I make sure I'm not poisoned, throw the plants away, vacuum. And then when Tori comes back, you say, I don't know what happened. That's crazy.

• 1:05:35Speaker 03

  What happened? Yeah, Martha doesn't know exactly who is responsible. She's going through the same kind of mental rolodex that you're going through, where it's like, okay, maybe. But she's also like, I'm not getting paid enough to investigate any of this shit.

• 1:05:48Speaker 02

  Okay, could not be me, but love that for her.

• 1:05:52Speaker 03

  Well, Martha's also like, I feel like if I accuse anyone outright, I'm in danger of losing my job.

• 1:05:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, you shouldn't be accusing people of things at work. That's not right. You can't be doing that.

• 1:06:01Speaker 03

  And Martha's also like, it'll be bad for morale in the office if she tells everyone that there's a plant murderer in the midst.

• 1:06:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, you could just throw them all away.

• 1:06:08Speaker 03

  So Martha takes all the plants to the back of the building to give them.

• 1:06:11Speaker 02

  And shoots them.

• 1:06:13Speaker 03

  With a gun.

• 1:06:16Speaker 03

  No, she like gives them a deep soak to like flush all the salt out of the soil. I know, eldest daughter. The only plant she brings back inside is Tori's potho Shakira. Then she sits down at her computer and drafts an email to the whole staff. She says, I have decided to go in a new direction with the decor.

• 1:06:32Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:06:33Speaker 03

  No more plants in common areas. You can keep them in private offices or take them home.

• 1:06:38Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:06:38Speaker 03

  The office plants are out back, and they're all up for grabs, first come, first served.

• 1:06:42Speaker 02

  Nice. Yeah, beautiful. And I do think that's a nice balance, because Shakira is Tori's plant.

• 1:06:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:06:51Speaker 02

  So like, Tori should get to take her home.

• 1:06:54Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:06:54Speaker 02

  Although she's dead.

• 1:06:56Speaker 03

  Dying, yeah.

• 1:06:57Speaker 02

  Dying.

• 1:06:58Speaker 03

  Everyone trickles into work, the plants disappear, some in people's cars, some at the doctors' offices, like their personal offices. Tori sulks through his and Martha's whole check-in. Like Martha asks him work questions, personal questions, how was your Christmas? And Tori is just like stone-faced and speaking in single syllables.

• 1:07:16Speaker 02

  And he's still doing his job, that's fine.

• 1:07:17Speaker 03

  He like tucks his hands in his little granny square jacket and just like stares at the ceiling until Martha lets him go back to his desk.

• 1:07:24Speaker 02

  He'll get over it.

• 1:07:27Speaker 02

  This guy is a yapper. He'll get over it.

• 1:07:31Speaker 03

  Martha's like, you know, Elisa didn't quit on the spot.

• 1:07:34Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 1:07:35Speaker 03

  But Tori is kind of a fragile thing.

• 1:07:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's like a plant.

• 1:07:43Speaker 03

  Well, we're almost at the end of our story. How are you feeling?

• 1:07:45Speaker 02

  Not good, man. I'm, this isn't good. Um, I don't like that Shakira is almost dead. I don't like, I do like that all the plants are gone, finally. Um, but it is a huge nightmare to lose your like favorite employee to you.

• 1:08:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:08:03Speaker 02

  And like your work wife and the person who like makes your job good.

• 1:08:06Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:08:06Speaker 02

  So I do get that, that Martha doesn't want Tori to go. And that this feels like it could accelerate the process of him leaving. That is sad, and I feel bad for her. And I would probably be stressed too.

• 1:08:19Speaker 03

  Well, at the end of the day, Martha's like in the storeroom behind the front desk when she hears Dr. Delgado leaving. And Dr. Delgado stops by Tori's desk, and he points to Shakira on Tori's desk. And he asks, do you need any help taking this one out to your car? And Tori's like, no, thanks. It's staying right there. And Dr. Delgado's like, didn't you see Martha's email about the new policy?

• 1:08:40Speaker 02

  And he's like, yeah, this is my office.

• 1:08:42Speaker 03

  Tori says, I may not have my own office, but I'm pretty sure this is my desk.

• 1:08:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:47Speaker 03

  And this is the point where Martha comes out the storeroom to break this up. She's just like, Dr. Delgado, are you taking off? Have a good night.

• 1:08:54Speaker 02

  Bye-bye.

• 1:08:58Speaker 02

  Queen.

• 1:08:59Speaker 03

  And Dr. Delgado just sort of like grumbles and leaves.

• 1:09:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's fine.

• 1:09:03Speaker 03

  The monthly doctor meeting is the Friday after Martha discovers the assault.

• 1:09:08Speaker 02

  The assaulting.

• 1:09:10Speaker 03

  She waits until they get through the agenda before she's like, I need to discuss something uncomfortable.

• 1:09:16Speaker 02

  Martha, terrible lead. You're gonna freak people out. It's just some plants. They're all gone.

• 1:09:23Speaker 03

  Martha's like, when I came in after the holidays, there was salt in the office plants. I believe whoever salted the plants wanted to kill them. Most of the doctors look stunned.

• 1:09:32Speaker 02

  Uh-huh.

• 1:09:33Speaker 03

  Some of them kind of look amused.

• 1:09:36Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:09:36Speaker 03

  And some of them seem worried. Martha gets a ton of questions, like, who would do this?

• 1:09:40Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 1:09:41Speaker 03

  How did you know it was salt?

• 1:09:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's also the question I have.

• 1:09:45Speaker 03

  To which Martha is like, I tasted it, and this is a room full of doctors. So they're all immediately like, why not?

• 1:09:56Speaker 03

  Why would you do that?

• 1:09:58Speaker 02

  And how many days ago was it? And what kind of sentence have you had since then?

• 1:10:02Speaker 03

  Can we get some blood work done?

• 1:10:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:10:04Speaker 03

  Yeah, Martha's like, that's not important. Stop asking questions.

• 1:10:08Speaker 02

  Martha, it is important.

• 1:10:10Speaker 03

  She's like, what is important is that this is why I rehomed all the office plants. She tells the doctor she has not yelled to Tori that his gigantic pathos was assaulted. And she's hoping his plant will make a full recovery.

• 1:10:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:10:21Speaker 03

  She's like, I still don't know who the culprit is. And I haven't asked the building for their security footage yet because I wanted to bring this to y'all first.

• 1:10:28Speaker 02

  This is like when your mom comes to your room and it's like, are you gonna tell me or am I gonna have to find out?

• 1:10:36Speaker 03

  Martha's like, which one of you did this?

• 1:10:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, confess.

• 1:10:39Speaker 03

  There's silence for a moment. And then Dr. Clementine speaks. She's like, Martha, you do know who's responsible. It's pretty clear.

• 1:10:49Speaker 02

  She's so smart.

• 1:10:52Speaker 02

  I'm in love with her.

• 1:10:56Speaker 03

  Martha's like.

• 1:10:57Speaker 02

  Martha's like, was it me?

• 1:11:00Speaker 03

  She's like, it's not clear to me.

• 1:11:02Speaker 02

  I don't know who it was.

• 1:11:04Speaker 03

  And then Dr. Clementine says, well, obviously I did it. She said, I told you all not to bring the plants to the new building. They're tacky and I cannot pull another rubber tree leaf from a toddler's throat. It is a new year.

• 1:11:18Speaker 02

  I love her. She's right and she should say it.

• 1:11:22Speaker 03

  And then Dr. Clementine's like, I gave you a chance to deal with Tori, but you didn't take it. I don't want anyone else to get blamed for this, though. So you can tell Tori it was me.

• 1:11:31Speaker 02

  Wow, very magnanimous of her. But also, Dr. Clementine's like, I don't care if Tori hates me, that's fine.

• 1:11:37Speaker 03

  She said, who?

• 1:11:40Speaker 02

  Martha's like, Tori will be upset. And Dr. Clementine's like, I don't have a doctor named Tori.

• 1:11:45Speaker 03

  None of the nurses are named Tori.

• 1:11:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know who that is.

• 1:11:49Speaker 03

  The rest of the doctors are all murmuring. Even Dr. Delgado looks uneasy. He's not sure if the end justified these means, you know?

• 1:11:56Speaker 02

  A doctor is not supposed to do death.

• 1:12:02Speaker 03

  Now, I normally ask this at the end, but I'm gonna ask it now.

• 1:12:05Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 1:12:06Speaker 03

  Do you think Dr. Clementine is a villain or just a woman who gets results?

• 1:12:09Speaker 02

  No, I respect her and I think she's right. I feel like you're about to do something that is gonna make me regret saying that. But I think she's right. I think the plant should have been killed earlier.

• 1:12:21Speaker 02

  I think she's running this place well. She's got them a new office. There's no more tacky shit going on. I trust her with my health.

• 1:12:29Speaker 03

  Well, Martha is reeling because on one hand, Dr. Clementine did fix like a years-long headache.

• 1:12:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:35Speaker 03

  On the other hand, Tori may be a fragile little flower, but he's Martha's fragile little flower.

• 1:12:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:42Speaker 03

  So Martha's like, okay, we won't get any more plants, but Dr. Clementine, you have to leave Tori's pathos alone. It is his personal plant. It does not belong to us.

• 1:12:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, we've agreed. These are the rules of engagement. We've agreed that he's allowed to have it. Yeah, okay.

• 1:12:56Speaker 03

  Several of the doctors nod. And Dr. Clementine blinks for a moment.

• 1:13:02Speaker 03

  Before being like, I can live with one plant in the office. But the vines have to be trimmed back from toddler height.

• 1:13:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, okay, great. Hang them up.

• 1:13:12Speaker 03

  Which Martha does feel is fair compromise.

• 1:13:14Speaker 02

  If you don't want to trim the vines, you can take the plant home.

• 1:13:16Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 1:13:17Speaker 02

  I think this is totally fair.

• 1:13:18Speaker 03

  So this becomes the new status quo. They become a one-plant office and they remain a one-plant office to this day. And somehow, against all odds, Martha, Tori, Dr. Delgado, and Dr. Clementine all still work there together.

• 1:13:32Speaker 02

  Wow, that's beautiful.

• 1:13:35Speaker 03

  The morning sound bowl ritual does still cause problems.

• 1:13:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, I believe that. I believe that entirely. But you know, they've done studies that show that if everyone has a common enemy at work, the happiness quotient of the workplace goes up.

• 1:13:49Speaker 03

  It's true.

• 1:13:50Speaker 02

  It's actually probably good that Tori's in there doing the sound bowl and everyone's like, oh, my God, the sound bowl's gonna ruin my life. Because you know what? That's camaraderie.

• 1:14:00Speaker 03

  It gets the anger out at the beginning of the day.

• 1:14:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, then you're done.

• 1:14:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:14:03Speaker 02

  Then you can focus on the wee children sneezing in your face.

• 1:14:09Speaker 03

  And that is the end of our story.

• 1:14:10Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, it was incredible. Thank you so much for having me.

• 1:14:14Speaker 03

  I do have some updates.

• 1:14:15Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 1:14:15Speaker 03

  But first.

• 1:14:16Speaker 02

  The update was that they were still working together.

• 1:14:19Speaker 03

  Have your thoughts on Dr. Clementine's villain status changed at all?

• 1:14:22Speaker 02

  No, she's my queen. I thought for sure she was gonna kill the pathos. And you know what? I was gonna back her.

• 1:14:28Speaker 03

  And you said it would have been fine with me.

• 1:14:29Speaker 02

  I said, sign me.

• 1:14:31Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine could shoot me and I'd say, thank you.

• 1:14:33Speaker 02

  I would. She's like Lydia Tar to me. I'm like, run me over with a truck, babe.

• 1:14:37Speaker 03

  And the thing is, Dr. Clementine could sew you back up.

• 1:14:40Speaker 02

  She could. She can fix me.

• 1:14:44Speaker 03

  Dr. Clementine could fix me.

• 1:14:46Speaker 02

  She can.

• 1:14:47Speaker 03

  Well, like I said, I do have a couple of updates for you.

• 1:14:49Speaker 02

  Hit me.

• 1:14:49Speaker 03

  Martha learned later that apparently Dr. Clementine apologized to every doctor individually after that meeting about the plants.

• 1:14:56Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:14:57Speaker 03

  But never to Martha and never to Tori.

• 1:15:03Speaker 02

  Oh, she's such a bitch. I love her so much. She's like, I'll apologize to my peers.

• 1:15:12Speaker 02

  She is a villain, but I love her.

• 1:15:14Speaker 03

  Well, one day at a happy hour that went just like a little too late.

• 1:15:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, totally.

• 1:15:18Speaker 03

  Well, Martha ends up telling Tori about Dr. Clementine's assault of all the plants.

• 1:15:23Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:15:24Speaker 03

  And this actually ends up working in Martha's favor because Tori now feels he and Martha are being persecuted together.

• 1:15:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:15:31Speaker 03

  He's like, solidarity, comrade.

• 1:15:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, perfect.

• 1:15:34Speaker 03

  Common enemy.

• 1:15:37Speaker 02

  We love it.

• 1:15:38Speaker 03

  And Shakira, Tori's gigantic pathos, did make a full recovery.

• 1:15:42Speaker 02

  Wow, I'm happy for her. I'm glad she's thriving. I'm glad her leaves are not being eaten by children.

• 1:15:49Speaker 03

  It remains on the front desk to this day, so it's still the first thing you see when you walk in the door. Though Tori did follow the new rules technically, like he did not trim the vines, but he did install some hooks exactly into the walls.

• 1:16:00Speaker 02

  You know what? That's the spirit of law.

• 1:16:05Speaker 03

  So the vines now hang above toddler height. So not only do they frame like the entire front desk area now, they're also starting to climb the walls of the lobby. A kid's parent recently told Martha, it's like the Rainforest Cafe in here.

• 1:16:19Speaker 02

  I'm so happy for Tori, but Dr. Clementine is about to kill that plant.

• 1:16:26Speaker 03

  Just shooting at the wall.

• 1:16:27Speaker 02

  She should have done it earlier.

• 1:16:29Speaker 03

  She tried.

• 1:16:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, she should have tried again.

• 1:16:33Speaker 03

  And that's our story, Kelsey.

• 1:16:35Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, I loved it. Thank you for having me.

• 1:16:40Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 1:16:41Speaker 02

  Wow, what a delight.

• 1:16:42Speaker 03

  Gossip with you once again.

• 1:16:44Speaker 02

  And to you as well.

• 1:16:51Speaker 03

  Thank you for listening to Normal Gossip. If you have a gossip story to share with us, email us at [email protected]. Or you can leave us a voicemail at 2679 gossip. If you love this podcast and want to support us, become a friend or a friend of a friend at supportnormalgossip.com. You can follow the show on Instagram and TikTok at Normal Gossip. You can follow me on all social media at HeyDanae. Subscribe to our YouTube channel at Defector Media to watch today's episode. Normal Gossip is written by me, Rachel Hampton, and Jay Tolbierra. This podcast was produced by Sierra Spragley-Ricks and Jay Tolbierra. Our audio engineer is Samantha Gatzick. Emily Cherish is our video editor. Theme music composed by Rishi Kesh Hirway.

• 1:17:35Speaker 03

  The co-creators and dowagers of Queens and Normal Gossip are Kelsey McKinney and Defector's supervising producer, Alex Tujong Loughlin. Justin Ellis is Defector's projects editor. Jasper Wang is Defector's business guy. Tom Lay is our editor in chief. This season was made in memory of Dan McQuade, who ran our merch store, which you can find at normalgossip.store. Tara Jacoby designed our show art. Thank you to Brandy Jensen, David Roth, Catherine Shu, Sabrina Embler, Chris Thompson, Dave McKenna, Patrick Redford, and Ray Rado for your help with this season. Thank you to the rest of the Defector staff. Defector Media is a collectively owned subscriber-based media company. Normal Gossip is a proud member of Radiotopia. I am your host, Rachel Hampton. And remember, you didn't hear this from me.

• 1:18:22Speaker 04

  Radiotopia.

• 1:18:25Speaker 04

  From PRX.