Pod Insights National Park After Dark Trail Tales 59 About this episode Today’s stories include ranger reprimands, haunted objects, yellow roses, misplaced eyes, freaky lights, close encounters and NPAD love. Outsiders Only bonus stories available for Patreon and Apple Subscribers! We love our National Parks and we know you do too but when you're out there, remember to enjoy the view but watch your back. Please take a moment to rate and subscribe from wherever you’re listening to NPAD! Become part of our Outsider family on Patreon or Apple Subscriptions to gain access to ad-free episodes, bonus content, and more. Follow our socials Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. To share a Trail Tale, suggest a story, access merch, and browse our book recommendations - head over to our website. Thank you so much to our partners, check them out! Laundry Sauce: For 15% off your order, head to LaundrySauce.com/NPAD and use code NPAD. Embark: Use code NPAD to save $65 on Embark’s Breed + Health Test and get free shipping. Zocdoc: Use our link to download the Zocdoc app for free. Quince: Use our link to get free shipping and 365-day returns.
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Transcript Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
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1:16 Danielle LaRock? Hello, everyone, and welcome back to National Park After Dark Trail Tales.
1:20 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, so happy to have you all here. Again, we have more stories this week, which we're really excited to tell you about. So, I don't think there's really much else to chat about this episode, so let's dive right in. Would you like to go first?
1:34 Danielle LaRock? Sure. All right, so my first tale is titled Smoky Mountain Ghost Encounter. My name is Hannah, and I just graduated with my bachelor's. Just gets right into it. No, hi, no, love you.
1:47 Cassandra Yahnian? Cutthroat.
1:49 Danielle LaRock? My name is Hannah, and I just graduated with my bachelor's in environmental science from the University of Alabama. Feel free to use my name. Oh, okay, I kind of just, she does kind of say she loves us, so I'm sorry for just saying you didn't.
2:03 Cassandra Yahnian? Not cutthroat.
2:04 Danielle LaRock? Not cutthroat. I want to start by saying this podcast has been my saving grace in college when I was not Able to get into the outdoors as frequently. Your podcast makes me feel so connected to the outdoors and the outdoor community and I thank you for that. Anyways, this story comes from a time in my life when I had easy access to the most visited national park in the U.S. The Great Smoky Mountains National Park. I moved from Alabama to Gatlinburg, Tennessee during high school, but have since moved back to Alabama for college. Living in this area of Appalachia was absolutely amazing. There was nothing like having such easy access to this beautiful national park. I lived less than two miles from the park's entrance. While living in this area was amazing, it could also be eerie at times.
2:50 Danielle LaRock? When I was seventeen, I was driving home from work late one night. To get to my cabin, you had to drive some windy wooded roads. It was probably close to eleven P M. At this point, so I was not expecting to encounter any people or even any cars, as I rarely did on this route after a closing shift. As I rounded a curve, I saw a person like figure who seemed to be watching me. My heart immediately dropped, but I told myself that it was probably a funny looking tree and continued driving towards it. As I got closer, I realized it most definitely was a person and she was absolutely staring at me. I immediately felt a heavy feeling of immense dread and uneasiness. I was only a half a mile from my cabin, but the road I was on was dark and very wooded.
3:34 Danielle LaRock? She was standing directly beside the road and I knew I would have to pass her to get to my house.
3:39 Cassandra Yahnian? No.
3:40 Danielle LaRock? I would have the feeling of like, I don't even want to go to my house because I don't want to lead this person to where I live.
3:46 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, I was just walking by them and being in close proximity.
3:50 Danielle LaRock? I mean, she is driving. She's driving.
3:52 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, you're right, but still being in close proximity.
3:56 Danielle LaRock? Yeah. As I drove towards her, I realized she had very long stringy hair and was wearing a shabby purple dress that dragged on the ground. There is simply one word for how she looked and it is creepy. There was something in front of her that caught my attention and when I got closer to her, I saw that they were mason jars and they each had something inside of them. There were probably fifteen to twenty of them of varying. sizes. As I passed her, the woman bent down and reached her arms around the mason jars, almost as if she was protecting them from my car. It was the only time during the entire encounter that she looked away from me. After I passed her, I watched her in my rearview mirror and saw her stand back up and stare me down until I was out of view. I sped home and ran
4:40 Danielle LaRock? inside to tell my family about what I had just witnessed. I ran into my living room and told my parents that there was a creepy woman with mason jars on the side of the road. They were confused, and rightfully so. I was so freaked out that I was having trouble explaining what it was that I saw. I tried to explain how eerie the woman looked and how she was just staring at me. I went on to tell them that she had a ton of mason jars with something in them. They comforted me, but ultimately chalked it up to being some random woman who had happened to be on the side of the road. My dad offered to go check on her, but I was so scared and did not want to feel that eerie feeling again. It was impossible to relay the feelings that I had when she was just staring at me. A couple weeks later, my sister was reading about ghost encounters that took
5:24 Danielle LaRock? place in the Smoky Mountains. She told me that she read a story about a ghost named Lucy, who had really long hair and wore a long purple dress. And guess what else? She was sometimes seen carrying around jars.
5:36 Cassandra Yahnian? Ah, no.
5:37 Danielle LaRock? You saw Lucy.
5:39 Cassandra Yahnian? You definitely saw Lucy.
5:41 Danielle LaRock? I was so freaked out. I have never been more spooked in my whole life. My family was not originally from the area, but we went to church with some people whose families had lived in the Smokies for generations. A woman at church came up to me and said, "Your sister told me about your encounter with Lucy. I cannot believe you saw her." I told the woman all about my ghost experience, and she confirmed that people have been spotting Lucy for years. I am normally a bit of a skeptic about paranormal activity, although I am an avid Bigfoot believer, but I have never been more certain that I had experienced something paranormal. I was freaked out every time I had to drive past that place that I saw Lucy, which was very often. I always looked really hard for her, especially during the daytime, as I hoped she was really just some actual
6:24 Danielle LaRock? physical woman that happened to live nearby. A couple of weeks later, my sister told me that she had been Pranking me. There are actually stories of a ghost named Lucy, but she lied about all the ways that the woman I saw resembled Lucy. It was all an elaborate prank. She even got, oh, this, this runs deep. She got me. Okay. She even got the woman from church in on it to solidify my belief. She wrangled in people.
6:53 Cassandra Yahnian? That is dedication and I am impressed. I'm appalled.
6:56 Danielle LaRock? Yeah, I'm, I was up, now I'm down. I was feel betrayed, but you gotta give them kudos, you know?
7:02 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, it's impressive. I mean, it's, they went through a lot to make sure that she believed this was really happening.
7:08 Danielle LaRock? There is now a running joke in my family about Lucy. In hindsight, I am not sure why I did not do more personal research on Lucy, but I think I may have been just so freaked out that I didn't want to read the stories online in detail. Once I saw all of the articles and blog posts about Lucy, it was enough for me to confirm that the woman I saw was indeed her. While I do not mind the prank or the jokes, I know I seriously did see something eerie that night. I guess she is probably not named Lucy, but I would not be shocked if she were a ghost or something else paranormal. Every time I travel back to Gatlinburg, especially on that road, I keep my eyes peeled for my Lucy. Last time I heard y'all discuss Great Smoky Mountains National Park, I believe neither of you had visited. I cannot recommend
7:52 Danielle LaRock? a trip to this park enough. If you do go, enjoy the view, but watch your back for Lucy.
7:57 Cassandra Yahnian? Her name's Lucy now.
7:58 Danielle LaRock? Yeah.
7:59 Cassandra Yahnian? Because.
7:59 Danielle LaRock? Lucy too.
8:02 Cassandra Yahnian? Lucy too.
8:03 Danielle LaRock? Right?
8:04 Cassandra Yahnian? I mean, I think you saw, you definitely saw something and it sounds scary. And the fact that now you have a lighthearted story around it that your friends and family laugh at you for.
8:15 Danielle LaRock? It is fun. It is fun. And I don't know, the jars is like, I think, kind of the creepiest part. The long stringy hair and the dress is kind of, feel like you hear that a lot. And with paranormal.
8:29 Cassandra Yahnian? And it could just be a person, you know?
8:31 Danielle LaRock? To have a bunch of, I just imagine them being like.
8:33 Cassandra Yahnian? The jars.
8:34 Danielle LaRock? You know, like.
8:35 Cassandra Yahnian? Filled with organs.
8:38 Danielle LaRock? That's what I was picturing.
8:39 Cassandra Yahnian? Like.
8:42 Danielle LaRock? Like various like herbs and.
8:45 Cassandra Yahnian? Oh, right.
8:45 Danielle LaRock? Right. It could be organs.
8:47 Cassandra Yahnian? Right.
8:48 Danielle LaRock? From people she murdered.
8:51 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah.
8:52 Danielle LaRock? Okay. Well, anyway.
8:53 Cassandra Yahnian? Lucy.
8:54 Danielle LaRock? You sly, sly.
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9:30 Cassandra Yahnian? Okay, uh, my story is titled, "You Don't Know What You Know Until a Ranger Tells You." Hello ladies, my name is Sylvia. I have more than a handful of trail tales to share. From drunken nights on Mount Rubido when I was 13, to, "Oh my God, I almost died hikes." But this one below seemed suiting to start with. One morning, dark and early, I was listening to Dateline on one of my many five-mile morning suburban treks and realized I had listened to every possible episode. It was my go-to while building strength from my 100-pound weight loss journey. I needed a new show to listen to. I started searching for other true crime stories on the Apple platform and stumbled across NPAD.
10:11 Cassandra Yahnian? While I glossed past it at first, the logo and name intrigued me because I had started hiking again and had started backpacking in the last couple of years. Since I hit my goal and I was bored of my suburban quote-unquote "trails," I needed new challenges. Then I went back, read the synopsis, and I was hooked before I even started listening. Side note, my life was an oxymoron of ways Catholic children should be raised. For instance, my uncle's fiance was killed by a serial killer in Southern California when I could barely walk. And because it hit so close to home, Unsolved Mysteries and other similar shows was what I grew up watching. My mother's famous words, "It could be anyone we know," "The devil never sleeps,"
10:52 Cassandra Yahnian? was what we heard whenever macabre-like episodes of some other nightmarish show was over right before we were shooed off to bed. Tuck those thoughts into bed with you at night. What could be better than listening and learning what not to do, or better yet, what to do in case I was ever in that situation? Which I have found myself in more than a few times. So when my wife and I fight now, it's because I'm either reading whatever new book y'all recommend, or tone deaf to the world around me because I have you two lovely ladies in my ears. I had just hit my goal weight of 155 pounds, and I joined a social media group challenge in the Bay Area of Northern California. It was my first hike of one of 12 on the list, and since I have never done hiking challenges before, and even though all trails has never done me wrong,
11:35 Cassandra Yahnian? yet, I still started with the easiest list of the three available experience levels listed. This hike was in an area I was familiar with. So hike one on the beginners' challenge, I took the Wildcat Peak Trail, first on the list closest to my home. I hike in that mountain range every weekend, just never the side of the mountain. The Tilden Mountains near Berkeley, California are beautiful and very active, wildlife and humans equally. I have a few health issues, for the most part controlled. One of the small things I deal with is I had an ear injury when I was in my teens, to my left ear. So when I play sports, exercise, or in this case, hike, my ears get plugged up and breathing echoes in my head, making sound seem more distant. I know I am the only one on the trail right now, since there's no other cars in the 20 space lot,
12:20 Cassandra Yahnian? and the ranger I saw when I drove in, who warned me to wait in my car until 8 a.m. before I stepped on the trail, told me so. The trail technically didn't open until 8 a.m., but I got there at 6:30 a.m. It was still a little dark out, but not so much that I needed a headlamp. After getting my day pack out of my truck, lacing up my boots, stretching, prepping my Liquid IV water, adding some jerky to my pocket, I was ready by 7 a.m. and needless to say, I didn't listen. I was on the trail and huffing it. The fog was thick, the layer of mist smacking me in the face, and all I could think of was that I wish Basil, my chocolate husky, was with me. Because not only does she love trails, but loves the mist, wind, and of course, the jerky we share. About half a way up my hike,
13:03 Cassandra Yahnian? I can hear the echo of my breath and the irritation of my hearing being obstructed. I stop and take a selfie. I'm Latin American Indian, and I turn tomato red when I do anything active. No avoiding it, so I must snap a few pics until I semi-like one of them. My phone back into my jacket and start to pick up my poles and I hear the bush rattle about 10 feet ahead but off to my right. Well, the rustling noise I thought could only be one of many things. A bird, a squirrel, a coyote, or a gorgeous mountain lion. A transient, I'd rather deal with a mountain lion. I told myself it was the second of the few. But just in case it was a transient that seldomly made their way on the trails since we were so close to Berkeley, I unsnapped my seal knife I purchased on one of my backpacking trips and flipped the
13:47 Cassandra Yahnian? blade to the opposite direction, the blade facing forward. So in case I had to use it, one swing forward and back and whatever quote unquote attacker or branch falling toward me would be stopped in its tracks. I ignored the noises after that and kept on. I hit a bend in the trail and around it was an incline that I knew was going to burn. And to add to it, there was a small stream trickling, if you will, of water running right down the center from the rain the night before. So I had to walk with each foot on the opposite three-foot wide wall. That way it didn't slip in the slurry the small stream created. As I am walking the wall, I hear my breathing and I laugh because it seemed as though my breathing was like one of those foreign movies where the voiceover is in English and the lip movements do not
14:29 Cassandra Yahnian? quite add up to the words coming out of their mouths. And of course, I would be that weird one where even my breathing is effing with my head. Then I hear more rustling behind me. Five minutes later, again, about six yards to the right of me. It kept on for quite some time, along with the weird breathing that at one point sent shivers up my spine. So I stopped to pull out my inhaler from my pack, shoved it in my breast pocket of my puffer jacket in case I needed it. I had reached the peak by then. I whipped out my ultralight chair and sat for five minutes while I ate my breakfast and got hydrated. I also took a selfie, which was one of the requirements to prove that I had completed this hike. I took another with my trail buddy Flick, the character from the Pixar movie. Once that was done, I packed up
15:10 Cassandra Yahnian? my chair and navigated my way through the few trails to make my weekend hike worthwhile. Hiking back down and making my way to another trail, I crossed paths with the ranger I saw in the morning. And he pointed at me with a "I told you so" grin, accompanied by cheesy finger, pointed at me and just said, "Better to ask for forgiveness than permission." With a smile and a wink, he laughed and asked what trail I came up. I explained I took the southwest trail up the peak and his eyes widened and said, "Oh, I just put up warning signs. So be careful tomorrow if you come back. It's denning season." I remembered that I read on all trails that someone saw a coyote and her pups near the top of Skyline Trail. So I agreed to steer clear and I went on my way. Again, my ear plugged up, my breath echoed, chills happened again.
15:55 Cassandra Yahnian? And then I heard not just rustling in the trees, but branches snapping behind me. I whipped my head around and saw nothing, but could hear the offbeat breathing at one point. It felt like it was on the back of my neck, cringe-worthy at best. I got annoyed at the thought that I may have to make an appointment with a specialist to check this out. But then, for no reason, I decided to hold my breath for a second. Holy shit, I could still hear it. The breathing was so heavy, thick and chilling. About 15 minutes later, my trail crossed a paved trail, and I stopped to stomp off some of the mud that dried up around the side of my boots from the trails. A 12-year-old-looking ranger on a golf cart came to a screeching hole in front of me. He was visibly irritated and aggressively shouting at me, "Are you purposely tempting Mother Nature?"
16:38 Cassandra Yahnian? So I thought he was addressing my eight-inch blade that I was carrying. I apologized and explained that I thought I heard a homeless person in the brush about two miles back, so I was holding it as a precaution. His face went blank and looked at me with the most "you're stupid" look I had ever seen. I then, now irritated myself, tucked my knife back into the sheath and said, "Well, if you're done looking at me like I just kicked your cat, I'm gonna get on with it." He then snapped out of an arrogant gaze, shoulder shimmyed and said, "Oh shit, sorry, but uh, not happening. You're coming with me. You're being stalked and hunted." I turned and said, hence why I had my knife out. He then calmly, this time, asked me to get in. My legs were tired from all the mud, so I got in and figured I could get hit a quiet coffee shop and read my book,
17:22 Cassandra Yahnian? the newest Andrea Langford book you recommended. I sat in the seat behind him, held on, and he explained, while stepping on the gas pedal of his 15-mile-per-hour golf cart, that I had passed a cub den some time back and mama had been following me the majority of my hike. It then hit me, the rust- Wessling trees, the brush, the snapping of the twigs and the branches on the ground, the chills I was getting and the offbeat sounds of my foreign movie-like breathing were all because of a mountain lion following me along my trek. It was her breathing that threw me off. It was the chills I got subconsciously knowing I was being followed while ignoring all that I knew, learned and studied. Perhaps I was one of those that didn't realize I was living, "it won't happen to me" fantasy.
18:04 Cassandra Yahnian? Had this ranger not been tracking Mama to account for her den and cubs, had he not taken the golf cart from the ranger that has politely scolded me about starting early, I probably would have been served up on a silver dirty platter to her babies. Definite testament to your mantra, enjoy the view, but watch your back because I sure as hell didn't. Sylvia.
18:23 Danielle LaRock? Okay, so I was thinking it was a coyote this whole time. I was misled.
18:27 Cassandra Yahnian? Me too. I thought it was a coy-
18:30 Cassandra Yahnian? I know, there was like a buildup that there were coyotes around.
18:33 Danielle LaRock? And this is worse.
18:33 Cassandra Yahnian? It was funny because at the, at the beginning I thought mountain lion, but then they said coyote. So I was like, oh, okay, there's coyotes. And then mountain lion, so much worse, being stalked by a mountain lion.
18:43 Danielle LaRock? I'm just confused that kind of like, I wouldn't imagine you'd hear a mountain lion breathing, right?
18:48 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah.
18:49 Danielle LaRock? I mean, I'm not trying to question the validity of your experience. I'm just thinking out loud. I don't, I don't, I've never been stalked by a mountain lion, to my knowledge. So I don't know.
18:58 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah. I do, I kind of wonder because when you wear earplugs and your ears are plugged, sometimes you still hear like muff, you hear noises a little bit differently, like muffled. And they were saying how their ear gets like plugged. I wonder if it just distorted what she was hearing a little bit. And she heard things like maybe wouldn't have noticed before because I wear earplugs all the time. And sometimes I'll be sitting there. I'm like, am I hearing something? And I'll take them out and I hear it again, but it's in like a different manner. So maybe, but a breathing, a breathing mountain lion.
19:31 Danielle LaRock? I feel like if you were to hear the, the breath of a mountain lion, it would be kind of like too late. I don't know, but-
19:38 Cassandra Yahnian? Or you just really lucked out because it was close.
19:41 Danielle LaRock? I don't know. Interesting, but scary and glad you're okay. And I guess, yeah, lessons were learned all around.
19:47 Cassandra Yahnian? Definitely.
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22:44 Danielle LaRock? Okay, so my second story is titled "A Haunted Flea Market Object and How It Reeked Havoc in My Possession." I have quite the story for you. Although this tale does not take place in the woods or a national park, it's definitely up your alley, especially you, Danielle. I moved from my small hometown in New Jersey to Brooklyn, New York in 2018, about four months after I graduated grad school to pursue my career, and also to get a change of scenery as my mom passed away in March of that year. I was super excited about the move and found a room for rent fairly quickly. Once I was settled into my new place, I was excited to decorate with things that really resonated with me now that I truly had my own freedom. So naturally, I do what most in their
23:25 Danielle LaRock? early twenties in Brooklyn do, and went to a flea market in Williamsburg to find some new and used decor. As I'm walking around this huge flea market, a shiny, blue, beat-up tin catches my eye. Inspecting it closely, it appeared to be in fairly good condition, but what made it really unique was that it had all of the Zodiac signs printed on it. I was immediately drawn to this piece, bought it, and brought it home with me. My roommate at the time was very into astrology, and I had asked her if I could use it as a decor piece in our living room or kitchen, and she happily agreed. Now, let's fast forward a few days. Nothing outwardly unusual happened, but my roommate and I both noticed that we were feeling a little more down than usual. We sometimes would say that if we hung out in our living room too long, it would cause us to get
24:10 Danielle LaRock? Because we had no windows in the common space. Around the fourth or fifth day of owning this astrological tin, I started getting insane sleep paralysis. I would quote unquote, wake up and would see a man dressed in all black with a large cowboy like hat just standing over me at the foot of my bed.
24:29 Cassandra Yahnian? No, no.
24:30 Danielle LaRock? Oh, the plot thickens.
24:31 Cassandra Yahnian? No, the foot of the bed thing. I can't. No.
24:35 Danielle LaRock? What made this even creepier was my room was connected to the backyard and he would be standing, oh, he would be standing next to the back door.
24:43 Cassandra Yahnian? So realistic.
24:45 Danielle LaRock? I know. I've never experienced night paralysis. So I don't know what this experience is like firsthand, but it sounds very terrifying.
24:56 Cassandra Yahnian? Terrifying.
24:57 Danielle LaRock? This night paralysis went on for a few days. The same night that the strange man was standing over me, I could feel myself literally trying to scream for my roommate to help, but I couldn't. Side note, I had never in my life experienced sleep paralysis before this, nor have I experienced it since then. Maybe three days after the night paralysis, it was late at night and I was just drifting off, or at least I was trying to. My head was pounding and the air felt so thick. I thought trying to move would make my breathing feel more laborious, so I tried to stay as still as possible. I thought I was having an anxiety attack. Suddenly, my roommate bursts through my bedroom door and jumps into my bed. She told me she was feeling intense anxiety all of a sudden
25:39 Danielle LaRock? and also said she was having an intense migraine as well as trouble breathing.
25:43 Cassandra Yahnian? What is this thing?
25:44 Danielle LaRock? If it's affecting you both physically as well as, I feel like sleep paralysis is clearly a mental thing, right?
25:51 Cassandra Yahnian? It must be. I don't, I don't know anything about it.
25:54 Danielle LaRock? But I feel like for you both to be so affected physically simultaneously is a huge indicator that something is going on. Um, okay, ba ba ba. We sat in the dark for a few seconds and suddenly we both turned to each other and said, oh my God, it's the tin. We laid in bed stiffened with fear. I told her we had to just get through the night and I would dispose of the tin in the morning. All night, we were awake in fear of falling asleep because whatever was attached. To that astrological tin was angry and had no plans of ceasing its night terrors on us. The next morning, I threw the tin into the garbage on my way to work. Later that night, my roommate and I reflected on how much better our apartment felt now that it was gone.
26:35 Danielle LaRock? Whatever or whoever was occupying that astrological tin definitely had some unfinished business. So a friendly reminder to enjoy the flea market, but beware of the spirits that may linger within the object that catches your eye. All the best, Kylie.
26:51 Cassandra Yahnian? I was expecting Kylie to be like, and then I got home and it was sitting in my living room.
26:56 Danielle LaRock? Oh, imagine. Yeah.
26:58 Cassandra Yahnian? I would burn my house down.
26:59 Danielle LaRock? As soon as I read the part about, like, they just had to, like, get through the night and it would be thrown out the next day. I feel like if this was a me and you dynamic, you'd be like, get this thing out of here right now. Like, go outside and throw it.
27:11 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, it's like, wait, it's not staying another night. Like, if it's this, put it outside now.
27:15 Danielle LaRock? Exactly.
27:16 Cassandra Yahnian? I'm leaving.
27:16 Danielle LaRock? And it's just, I don't know, sometimes I do think about that with things that I have gotten at antique stores. I've always been curious as to if anything is attached or if I will feel.
27:29 Cassandra Yahnian? The history behind it.
27:30 Danielle LaRock? Yeah, or if I'll feel any sort of shift if I bring certain items home. And I have not felt that way yet.
27:38 Cassandra Yahnian? Yet.
27:38 Danielle LaRock? Yet. But I do, I don't know.
27:40 Cassandra Yahnian? Still time.
27:41 Danielle LaRock? I don't know. I've never been like super drawn to something like, I need to bring this particular thing home. So we'll see. And maybe if I get that feeling, I'll be like, eh, maybe shouldn't.
28:01 Cassandra Yahnian? All right. My next story is titled, I Think NPAD Saved My Life and I Have The Sign To Prove It. Hi, Cassie and Danielle. Trigger warning that I will be discussing eating disorders and understand that this could be harmful for those in recovery themselves. And they should skip this if it is best for them. Thank you for the warning. I found NPAD in August while listening to Tooth and Claw Podcast. The first episode of yours I was on was T24, which I totally loved. Once I had listened to the entirety of the Tooth and Claw. Clawback catalog, I decided to dive in from the beginning and start working my way through the hundreds of NPAD episodes. I finished them all within a month and I am now starting to re-listen to them again as there's so much fascinating content in each one. Thank you.
28:44 Cassandra Yahnian? I'm currently working on my PhD and the outdoors provided a much-needed escape from hours in the lab or spent staring at a computer. As you could probably tell from me saying bushwalk, I am from, when did you say bushwalk? I am from Australia. Did I skip over that?
28:59 Danielle LaRock? Uh, I didn't hear you say anything.
29:00 Cassandra Yahnian? I don't think you, I don't think you said bushwalk yet, but thank you. You are from Australia.
29:06 Danielle LaRock? Like, uh, did I miss that too? No, I don't think so.
29:09 Cassandra Yahnian? Uh, no, I don't think so. I am from Australia, born and raised in Perth, Western Australia, on the land of the Nungar Wajuk people. For many years of my childhood, my family, aunt and uncle, cousins and grandparents would go camping for two weeks every January in the Easter long weekend. We would drive down the beach and fish for hours. We would barefoot, ride our bikes or running around. We have so many inside jokes and wonderful memories from these times. My health started deteriorating in my early teens and I now live with multiple chronic health conditions, which, and at times, they limit my capacity to engage in the outdoors. But one of my greatest joys is getting out for a hike, bushwalk, or just stroll and park.
29:50 Cassandra Yahnian? There's the bushwalk. There isn't much in the way of mountains around Perth and our quote-unquote "forest" look very different to those in the US. So, hearing all of your stories with mountains and the amazing experience of hiking through these, for me, otherworldly forests are truly magical and inspiring. Apart from my physical ailments, I'm currently recovering from many years of an eating disorder. After being officially diagnosed with anorexia nervosa in January 2024, I commenced my battle to recover. As any journey, there are ups and downs. I had a major lapse at the end of April, cultivating a hyperglycemic shock and I was nearly hospitalized. This also resulted in being completely restricted from all exercising. I couldn't even walk from one side of the shopping center mall to the other and would
30:35 Cassandra Yahnian? need to drive there if I needed to get to the other side. I thought I was going to die and at times I wished- I would, but this lapse was a major wake up call and because I love walking in my local parks, anywhere and everywhere, this provided to be a motivation I needed to really put it all together for my recovery. My mantra became, "I want to hike." I would repeat this to myself anytime I had an urge to skip a meal or restrict portion sizes. I started to make progress, scary but incredible. After several months and some major life changes, including getting married, buying and moving into our first house, and returning to my PhD after six months of medical leave, I started struggling in my recovery again. Enter NPAD.
31:16 Cassandra Yahnian? I was listening on the bus, in the car, and at home while I would be cleaning and/or doing crafts. After a few episodes, I was hooked. I was enthralled by the stories and the magical landscapes that they occur in. Between Wes and Jeff always talking about Glacier National Park on Tooth and Claw, and hearing about all the magical parks in the USA and around the world through NPAD, I started planning all these amazing adventures in my head. Around this time, I came to the realization that I was slipping and needed to recommit to my recovery. And NPAD provided the motivation I needed. I need to recover so I can get in on these adventures. I have to have the strength in my body to be able to have these experiences. And thus, my mantra returned, but this time it was even louder. "I want to hike."
31:58 Cassandra Yahnian? I cannot thank you enough for spreading the word about the majesty of the outdoors, and in doing so, giving me the strength and motivation to continue my fight, which I am proud to say I am currently winning. Up to this point, I drafted this months ago but couldn't bring myself to send it in, not quite sure what I was holding back. But what happened next was truly worth including, and now it seems like the universe was holding me back from sending the story as it knew what was coming my way. I am now about nine months into recovery and doing so well. This past weekend, we took a short, belated honeymoon three hours south in the southwest region of Western Australia, lands of the Wando people. For years, I'd wanted to hike in the Quinip Falls. We were blessed with a spring storm the week before our weekend away,
32:40 Cassandra Yahnian? so I knew it would be running and my husband agreed that because I'm doing so well, we could take the walk. It was about four kilometers there and back, on gravel trail and over sand dunes. It was hard work. As my musculature is still returning and I haven't exercised at all for many months, we made it there and despite it seeming probably very underwhelming compared to most waterfalls around the world, it was one of the most beautiful I have seen in my home state. Australia isn't known for its abundance of water. To me, this was the greatest sight. I fulfilled a dream I had since 2017 and proved to myself I'm doing it. I am recovering and all the struggles are worth it. Feeling emotional, happy and fulfilled, we started our way back up and down the sand dunes and made it to the gravel trail.
33:22 Cassandra Yahnian? Then, right under my foot, a little lizard scurried and stopped half a meter away. I guess that's a couple of feet for non-metric people. I stopped and bent down to look. I was amazed. Most lizards run at the first sight of sound, but he just sat there, letting me take my photos and being in awe. Eventually, I allowed myself to move on, thinking I had just had the most amazing experience I could. But I would shortly be proved wrong. Just 100 meters up the trail, there was suddenly a rustling in the scrub, low, dense brush. Seconds later, a western gray kangaroo pops out of the scrub and hops to a puddle that had just formed in the recent rains. She bent down and took a drink. We sat in silence, marveling at this kangaroo, just hearing the sounds of the roo drinking.
34:05 Cassandra Yahnian? We have each seen hundreds or thousands of kangaroos, but this felt magical. The trail had been busy and we walked past more than a dozen other people on our journey back, but no one was in sight for this moment. Normally kangaroos will move away when you're near them, but she had come out of the bush towards us. Thinking the day could not get better, she lifted her head and stood up halfway. As she did, I noticed her pouch moving and knew that meant there was a joey inside. Then, as if showing it off to us, the joey poked its sleepy little head out of the pouch and looked at us. We just sat and watched as she took another drink, showed us her baby one more time, turned around and hopped back into the bush. Stunned at what we had experienced, we walked back to the car completely overjoyed.
34:46 Cassandra Yahnian? The next day, we saw at least four humpback whales on their southern migration back to Antarctica. As we sat and watched from the rocks, a magpie was staring at me. Once the whales were out of sight, we moved back to the car to leave. I spent a couple more seconds sitting on the bonnet, not quite Ready to give up trying to spot another whale when a magpie approached me. Magpies were my granddad's favorite and were the mascot of his favorite AFL football team. Since he passed away in 2017, whenever a magpie lingers, we say that it's granddad coming to visit us. In that moment, as the magpie looked into my eyes, I knew. My granddad had sent me all those magical wildlife experiences. The lizard, the kangaroos, and the whales, things I have always loved and things we enjoyed,
35:29 Cassandra Yahnian? observed, and marveled at together on our camping trips. When I clearly hadn't gotten the message, he hopped right up to me as I sat at my car, showing me it was him. He wanted to show me how proud he is of me and my strength, proud that I am recovering, and wanted to give me a treasured memory and continued motivation to keep recovering, healing, and getting my strength back, so I can have my life back and live my dreams. Some might say it's simple confirmation bias and food-conditioned magpie, but I know in my heart that it was him, saying he was proud of me and to keep going. Thank you, Cassie and Danielle, for being part of my recovery journey, giving me the inspiration to keep going, even when I've wanted to throw in the towel, and helping me save my life. If I hadn't chose to recover and didn't continue to choose it every day,
36:13 Cassandra Yahnian? I wouldn't have gotten that sign from my granddad. Keep doing what you love, as you never know who you are inspiring by doing it. And to anyone else struggling with their mental health, keep going. You can do it, and I am proud of you. I look forward to enjoying all the views I am yet to see, but I will always be watching my back. Emma.
36:30 Danielle LaRock? Wow, that was so kind to include us in a story like that.
36:35 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, and congratulations to you for keeping pushing through and being willing to share that story. It's such a personal story to share to us. So, thank you for trusting us with your story and our platform with it. I know that there's a lot of people who are listening who can resonate with that, and I think it's a very inspiring story, and we hope you're still doing well. You're getting out there, you're seeing these beautiful places, and maybe one day we'll run into you out on the trail, which would be really cool.
37:01 Danielle LaRock? Yeah, come to the US, or we could go there.
37:04 Cassandra Yahnian? Or we'll come to Australia. Yeah, we'll come to you.
37:06 Danielle LaRock? I mean, I don't know, last time I brought that up, you said you don't want to go with me, so.
37:10 Cassandra Yahnian? When did I say I didn't want to go to Australia with you?
37:12 Danielle LaRock? When I did the Australia episode, like very recently.
37:16 Cassandra Yahnian? Right, right.
37:18 Danielle LaRock? Right.
37:19 Cassandra Yahnian? Right. Well, I changed my mind.
37:20 Danielle LaRock? Oh, thank you.
37:21 Cassandra Yahnian? I'm ready now.
37:21 Danielle LaRock? Okay, great. You just needed a little time.
37:23 Cassandra Yahnian? Just not to that place.
37:24 Danielle LaRock? I don't want to go to a haunted. I feel like if I'm in Australia, I'm gonna go there. See, this is why I said no. This is why we can't go together. Maybe I'll just, maybe I'll take her. Maybe I'll take Emma. Emma will go with me. Um, we'll see. Maybe Emma will go hiking with me instead. I don't know, whatever. Emma, you decide. You decide.
37:54 Danielle LaRock? My last story is titled, "Your Podcast and My Mini Story." Hello, my daughter-in-law introduced me to your podcast a couple of weeks ago. I started from the beginning and have been working through them as I do things a retired person gets to do. And I have since become an addicted fan. I am very impressed by your attention to detail, your dedication to research, and your open-mindedness. I find you both to be intelligent, passionate, compassionate, well-spoken, and very entertaining. My kind of girls. It makes me feel like I am hanging out with kindred spirits, particularly with the occasional F-bombs thrown in there. Nurses like myself are notoriously potty mouths. Yeah, thank you. Thank you for saying that.
38:35 Danielle LaRock? Thank you for saying all those things, but to reinforce the occasional cursing. I, the medical field really does bring it out of you. And sorry, but I worked in there for way too long and I've, there's no going back. Okay, I heard Danielle on an episode, speaking of one of her favorite experiences with an animal encounter, where a mountain lion passed her car very closely. I'm a lifelong lover of the outdoors. I grew up in the foothills of the Santa Cruz Mountains on the peninsula, south of San Francisco. Spent an idyllic childhood trepezing around the foothills and mountains in the sixties with my three brothers and many other friends. I spent a lot of time in various state and national parks in my youth and through my adult life.
39:18 Danielle LaRock? I've had many opportunities to hike, camp, and spend time communing with the natural surroundings of my youth and later, my adulthood. I moved to Humboldt County, California to go to college in 1981 at Humboldt State University. I graduated from nursing school and after the requisite years of hospital. Hospital nursing, I transitioned to home health. Humboldt County is very rural and rural community nursing was my true calling and where I spent the next thirty four years. My territory was broad and changeable and for a long time I served a few of the local tribal communities. And it was very often extremely remote and at times sketchy due to both animal and human behavior. But I loved the opportunity to visit my patients in their homes.
40:00 Danielle LaRock? One particular home just south of the Redwood State and National Park, I had a very lovely native lady whom I had the privilege to care for. She lived in a remote little home to which I drove one particular day, passing a tethered goat tending to overgrown grasses and other flora. After leaving her home approximately an hour later, I passed where the goat had been tethered, but it wasn't there anymore. I figured it had to have been moved to an additional space to do yard work. As I continued down her drive slash road, a beautiful and huge tawny gold brownish lion sauntered out into the road about ten feet in front of my car. I swore the tail was as thick as my upper arm. I was so excited that I stopped and jumped, hold on, jumped out of my car to get a closer look.
40:45 Danielle LaRock? Yes, I know what you're thinking and as fast as I thought of how much I loved rural nursing opportunities. I realized the stupidity of my action and quickly, quickly jumped back in my car. All while the lion stood in the road looking at me as I was looking at it. Then it casually disappeared into the brush. I laughed at my idiocy but was euphoric about my sighting of this incredibly beautiful animal. As I continued down the road, it dawned on me that the missing goat was probably lunch for the lion and it had certainly cached it nearby. Yikes. This is still twenty five years later, my favorite wild animal opportunity. Just thought I would share as suggested.
41:25 Danielle LaRock? Oh, so maybe, I think I did ask for favorite wildlife encounters at some point. I must have.
41:31 Cassandra Yahnian? You did.
41:32 Danielle LaRock? This is me asking again in case that wasn't clear, but okay. Thanks for doing what you do to entertain and educate your listeners. So happy to be one of them. Warm regards, Jeannie. Okay, this reminds me so much of Jurassic Park. Remember when they have the goat tethered like to a stake?
41:49 Cassandra Yahnian? Yes.
41:50 Danielle LaRock? And then feed it to the T-Rex.
41:51 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah.
41:52 Danielle LaRock? That's exactly what.
41:53 Cassandra Yahnian? And everyone's like sitting outside waiting for it to come.
41:56 Danielle LaRock? Yep. And then it also reminds me at the end of the second one, when the T-Rex is loose in the city and it sees the dog barking and the dog is attached to a chain that it leads into its little doghouse. And then like the next scene, you just see the T-Rex like head pop up and the the dog is clearly in its mouth because the chain is hanging from its mouth and the doghouse is just swaying in the breeze before it drops. Yeah, that's what all that reminds me of. But it's really cool.
42:26 Cassandra Yahnian? It is really cool.
42:27 Danielle LaRock? But.
42:28 Cassandra Yahnian? I'm glad you jumped back in your car too.
42:29 Danielle LaRock? I know. And you know what? It just speaks to the nature of you, I think, and your profession, like nursing. You know, you're, you're in the world of helpers and you rush towards danger while everyone else runs away. And I feel like that kind of is mirrored in this story a little.
42:50 Cassandra Yahnian? That's one way to look at it for sure.
42:52 Danielle LaRock? That's what I see. Stupid, but yeah.
42:57 Danielle LaRock? But you know that. Jeannie knows that.
42:59 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, you jump back in. You jump back in. It's fun.
43:02 Danielle LaRock? It's fine. She lived.
43:04 Cassandra Yahnian? All right. My last story is titled Yellow Roses. Hi, my name is Kelsey. This story isn't from a trail or even outdoors. It's actually from a Kroger in the middle of a big city, but I promise I'll connect it all together in the end. I love NPAD. I binged all of your episodes last year, binged a few other podcasts, and now I'm back catching up on your library of episodes. I just recently got to episode 212, Trail Tales 44, That Is All About Signs. And I couldn't help but think about my mom. She passed away last year after a brief battle with cancer. I found out I was pregnant just two weeks after we got her diagnosis and she fought so hard to be. Be here for the birth of her first grandchild. My son was only a month old when she passed.
43:46 Cassandra Yahnian? Danielle, as you were wrapping up the episode with your story about yellow roses from Ian, I started to think about what sign my mom could send me that would make it very clear that it was from her. In that moment, I couldn't really think of anything specific and went on with my day. Fast forward the next day, and I'm making a normal trip to the grocery store for milk and a few other toddler necessities. It's October and I've been putting up fall decorations, so I stopped to look for some fall flowers for the skull-shaped vase I have on my kitchen table. I picked out a small bouquet with a combination of purple and orange flowers, satisfied that it would match my decorations at home. Just as I put the bouquet in my cart, there's a worker who quite literally shoves a second bouquet of flowers into my hands and says, "These are for you."
44:28 Cassandra Yahnian? She didn't say, "These are free," or "We are giving these away today." She said, "These are for you." And then, as quickly as she appeared, she walked away before I could even say thank you. Looking down at the flowers in my hands, I saw a sticker that marked the flowers as paid. I had just been handed a free bouquet of 20 small yellow roses. And there's no such thing as coincidences, right? My mom loved the outdoors. As a family, we spent a lot of time camping and hiking. Red River Gorge was one of my mom's favorite places in her home state of Kentucky, and she loved visiting national parks. One of the last days just the two of us spent mother-daughter time together was in October of 2022, when we went hiking on a local trail. We took a picture together on the trail that day, and that's very special to me.
45:13 Cassandra Yahnian? We had agreed to hike the Grand Canyon for my 30th birthday, and I still planned on making that hike in a few years. She's not here to go with me like we had planned, but I'll carry that picture and her spirit with me instead, while looking for signs of her along the way. Thank you for reading and for all of your work on the podcast. And Danielle, thank you for being so open about your grief on the podcast as well. Enjoy the view, and hopefully, if you forget to watch your back and someone startles you from behind, they are just a kind grocery store worker there to hand you a sign from a loved one. Kelsey.
45:43 Danielle LaRock? That is incredibly unique. That story is incredibly unique.
45:48 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah.
45:48 Danielle LaRock? And so amazing.
45:50 Cassandra Yahnian? Just to be handed, like...
45:52 Danielle LaRock? No explanation.
45:53 Cassandra Yahnian? Just to be handed a bouquet of flowers that are paid for and happen to be something that you resonate with as a sign from a loved one. I mean, like we always say, there's no such thing as coincidences.
46:04 Danielle LaRock? Yep, and you don't need any further explanation because you know.
46:07 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah.
46:08 Danielle LaRock? That's really cool. I'm glad you got that sign. Well, that's it.
46:11 Cassandra Yahnian? Yeah, that's everything that we have for you this week. If you're an outsider on Patreon or Apple subscriptions, we have two more stories. Mine's titled "The Worst Place For Eyes."
46:21 Danielle LaRock? Okay.
46:21 Cassandra Yahnian? Mine is...
46:22 Danielle LaRock? I don't know.
46:23 Cassandra Yahnian? We'll find out what that means.
46:23 Danielle LaRock? I guess so. And mine is titled "Freaky Lights in Appalachia."
46:28 Cassandra Yahnian? Ooh. All right. Well, come hang out with us on Patreon or Apple. And if you are not doing that, we'll see you in our next episode and enjoy the view.
46:38 Danielle LaRock? But watch your back.
46:39 Cassandra Yahnian? Bye, everyone.
46:45 Danielle LaRock? Thank you so much for joining us again this week. If you have a trail tale or story suggestion, send us an email at [email protected] . Follow us on Instagram and Facebook at National Park After Dark and on Twitter at NPAD Podcast. Join our Outsiders Only community on Patreon or Apple subscriptions to listen ad-free, unlock monthly bonus episodes, and exclusive content.
47:09 Cassandra Yahnian? And remember, when you support our sponsors, you are supporting our show. For our exclusive discount codes and source information from today's episode, check out the show notes. For more information on our show, our book recommendations, merch updates, and more, visit our website at NPADpodcast.com. And please rate, review, and subscribe from wherever you listen to podcasts.
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