Joy 101: Pat Monahan

"I'm pretty sure that my mother helped me write that song... And it was so quick that you just instantly think, this is not a good song. But then later when you look at it in hindsight, it's like maybe the easy ones to write are the best ones." —Pat Monahan on writing the Train hit, “Drops of Jupiter” Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb is Presented by CVS. Shop your local CVS, right around the corner. Experience the full conversation on the "Joy 101 podcast with Hoda Kotb" wherever you listen to podcasts. For more information please visit us at www.joy101.com/podcast https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.joy101.com%2Fpodcast&data=05%7C02%7CBrianBurton%40iheartmedia.com%7C76d67ccfce954dcae25308df03b67da9%7C122a527e5b714eba878d9810b495b9e3%7C0%7C0%7C639233754452194682%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=SmnDdHAtsO1ZGGSOasj1SWBiVyTUQPkyyMgbCMuykgU%3D&reserved=0 See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:10Hoda Kotb?

  Hey guys, welcome to Joy 101, the podcast I'm excited about who I'm going to interview today. Do you know the song, Hey Soul Sister? Of course, you know, the song, Marry Me? Do you know the song Drops of Jupiter? The man behind those beautiful words is a two-time Grammy winner named Pat Monahan. Pat is somebody who I've known for many, many years. And what I love about Pat is he's had so many iterations of his life and of his career. So there have been times where his band Train was, as he said, hitting rock bottom. There were times when it was up and high.

• 0:55Hoda Kotb?

  And Pat has always kind of made his way out and, and found kind of greener pastures. So today I'm going to talk to Pat. He has a lot of things on the horizon. He is on tour and everything is selling out. He kept saying like, why is everything selling out? You know, when you don't try, everything starts coming. That's what Pat is figuring out as he runs around the country and is touring. And he's got a new album out. It's called Mad Dog in the Fog, and it's aimed after the first bar that he and his buddies ever played at when they got their start. I mean, this is a guy from Erie, Pennsylvania, grew up in a very poor environment, one of, you know, seven kids. And look at him now. All right.

• 1:40Hoda Kotb?

  So I hope you enjoy this conversation with Pat Monahan.

• 1:43Speaker 01

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.

• 1:48Hoda Kotb?

  Joy 101 with Hoda Kotb is presented by CVS. I've realized that joy doesn't always come from those big moments. Sometimes you find it on the most ordinary day. I'll pop into a CVS for toothpaste or paper towels, and it never seems to be just a quick errand. Maybe I'll grab a delicious Well Market Trail Mix or wander over to the Joy Word Collection. That's part of the fun. So the next time you're checking something off your to-do list, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You might go in for one thing and leave with a little more joy. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS. Every purchase is a financial decision. So it's worth asking, what am I getting out of this?

• 2:29Hoda Kotb?

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• 2:55Speaker 02

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• 3:23Speaker 03

  I'm Melissa Jelton, host of the What Happened to Her podcast. We're kicking off the season with the Sandra Birchmore story, a case the police wrote off as a suicide in a snowstorm. Her family never bought it, and the man they suspected wore a badge.

• 3:38Speaker 04

  You never know who that devil is because he's wearing a disguise. Sometimes it's a police uniform.

• 3:43Speaker 03

  And you can get access to all episodes 100% ad-free with an iHeart True Crime Plus subscription exclusively on Apple Podcasts, available only to iHeart True Crime Plus subscribers. So don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts, search for iHeart True Crime Plus, and subscribe today.

• 4:03Hoda Kotb?

  Wait, are you in a tour bus? What are you doing? You are in a tour bus, which is exactly where you belong. How are you?

• 4:11Speaker 05

  I'm well. How are you?

• 4:12Hoda Kotb?

  Good. I'm great. I'm great. How is the tour going, by the way?

• 4:16Speaker 05

  You know, it's so funny. I, as I get older and care less, we sell more and more tickets, and it's crazy.

• 4:24Hoda Kotb?

  You know what? By the way, I think you just hit on a very important thing that I would love to start with. Okay. So when you stop giving a rip about anything, Kathy Lee used to say this to me all the time, I don't give a rip. And every time she didn't give a rip, ratings bounced, things went up. What's going on? Why are all these venues selling out so quickly?

• 4:44Speaker 05

  I don't know. It's a, you know, nostalgia is a word that has been thrown out a lot. There are so many teenagers at these shows because I think that they learned all this music from a car seat. So it's familiar and, and I think it's awesome. It's so cool.

• 5:02Hoda Kotb?

  That is, so tell me about, because look, we're, you know, everyone's at different stages in life. What's your pre, before you step out on stage, what is it that you do to keep like great energy, keep yourself fired up? What's like your ritual in terms of food and activity?

• 5:20Speaker 05

  Well, every show day, we do a truck workout. So we get in the back of a semi truck and do, we have a treadmill out there, a punching bag and all that. But before we, before we go on stage, I have for many years, maybe 20 years, I kind of meditate with seven healing oils that each oil represents something else. And I, I'm not a religious guy, but I try to communicate with the source of all of this. And, and so far it's working.

• 5:58Hoda Kotb?

  What is, you know, I, I started meditating probably about, not that long ago, maybe five years ago, four years ago. I found myself, I mean, before speeches, before moments, when I sit and do that, Pat, I noticed like a completely different presentation. And I remembered being on the Plaza, and it was Harry Styles, I think, who was there. It was pouring rain sideways. The place was insane. It was like, you felt like everything was going to catch on fire from the lightning. It was like one of those crazy days. And he was so calm. And I said to him in the commercial, I go, what's going on here? What are you doing? He goes, oh, I meditate. I do TM. You know, it makes me feel good.

• 6:41Hoda Kotb?

  And it's funny how that's something that has been quietly going on, probably with lots of performers, musicians, et cetera, for a long time. Yeah. How did you, how did you come up, up to it?

• 6:51Speaker 05

  Well, I'm from Erie, Pennsylvania. So if that would have been happening back in the day, in the rain, I would have been, have my hands around somebody's neck. And so, you know, you, you learn to laugh because the crying is not going to get you any closer to it. So I think years ago, I had a massage in Los Angeles, and the woman was using oils on my back. So she would say, this is, this is transformation. We're going to start there. I want you to transform. And then the next one would be abundance or highest potential or whatever.

• 7:31Speaker 05

  Young Living is the oil company that I use, but each one has a different name or desire. I don't know.

• 7:43Hoda Kotb?

  Uh huh. I love it. So you brought up Erie. So if I were to have walked into your childhood home, what would I have known about your family in the first 10 minutes when you were a little kid?

• 7:57Speaker 05

  We're pretty messy. Seven kids is like, I think my mom at some point was like, I'm good. If this is the way you guys want it to look, that's the way it's going to look. And funny, I would say that there were some good, there was some good fun being had. Those are the two things that, but I tried to get into my childhood home six weeks ago. And the guy, because I wanted to just take some pictures out front. I haven't been there in so long. And I was like, I grew up here. And the guy said, no, you didn't.

• 8:37Speaker 05

  I think I did. He started making me wonder about my own life.

• 8:40Hoda Kotb?

  Did I? What did you think when you saw it, even from the outside? What, what did it remind you of?

• 8:46Speaker 05

  Well, honestly, it made me sad. Like, we grew up, we grew up with nothing. And this poor man who didn't want me in his house, you know, he had two cars on cinder blocks in his driveway. And I was like, I don't need to bug this guy. Like, this is a memory walk for me, but he's living it, and this is not a memory for him. And it was, it just bummed me out. But, you know, it's also where I grew up, so I have a lot of beautiful memories there, too.

• 9:22Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah. Your mom, I mean, hats off to her all those years ago, mom of seven. What did she give you guys? Like, what was it that she filled you with that you think brought you to such a successful point in your life?

• 9:35Speaker 05

  I think my parents weren't much for advice. They would, they would just show us. Like, my mom, you know, she raised six kids, and then when I was a baby, she had to get a job. We just didn't have the money. So she, she showed me how to work hard. And, and I was like, I will outwork everybody. It's, it's not always the smartest work I was doing, but I was trying to outwork everybody.

• 10:09Hoda Kotb?

  What did you notice? I mean, when you saw her, you said you saw her as a worker. What did she, like, what memories do you have of her working?

• 10:17Speaker 05

  She worked in a place called Erie's Magnetics. And so she was the first one out of the house before I would go to school. And then she would come home and make dinner that, at the time, probably cost $20 for all of us. And it tasted like we just went to the fanciest restaurant in New York City. And so I don't know how she did all that, but I was just, I admired it. And then she would sit on the couch and read and fall asleep and the whole thing all over again. And then Saturday mornings, I would go to the grocery store with her, and she would have $100 to spend on groceries for the week.

• 11:00Hoda Kotb?

  For all the kids.

• 11:01Speaker 05

  She would figure it out.

• 11:03Hoda Kotb?

  Wow. How did you know, how did you know she loved you?

• 11:10Speaker 05

  You know, the word love, I don't remember being thrown around a lot, but there was never a question that she loved me. Like, I would fall asleep on her shoulder three days of the week, you know, and that was love for me. That was enough.

• 11:25Hoda Kotb?

  Wow. I mean, I was just, I just pulled the lyrics up for Drops of Jupiter because I wanted to reread them, knowing their origin and knowing that there's an anniversary for it and knowing how much your mom meant to you. Did the words from that song that became such an anthem, that was what you won, you won your Grammy for that one? Is that right?

• 11:45Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 11:46Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah. And I knew you won a couple. I wasn't sure which song it was for, but you won your Grammy for that one. Did the words to Drops of Jupiter just flow out of you?

• 11:57Speaker 05

  Or? Yes, because I'm pretty sure that my mother helped me write that song. It just happened too quickly for it not, because I was singing and writing at the same time. And, and, you know, it was so quick that you just instantly think, this is not a good song.

• 12:20Hoda Kotb?

  Oh, really?

• 12:21Speaker 05

  Yeah, but then later, when you look at it in hindsight, it's like, maybe the easy ones to write are the best ones.

• 12:30Hoda Kotb?

  So what, you didn't think this was hot right away?

• 12:32Speaker 05

  No.

• 12:33Hoda Kotb?

  Pat, oh my God. I mean, when you read this from, was this, was this solely about your mom, the song?

• 12:41Speaker 05

  The song was about my mom, but I, I had to transform it into a love relationship for people to recognize it as, you know, if I'm singing about my mom, some of the, some of what is being said wouldn't be said. So I, it had to become a love interest.

• 13:00Hoda Kotb?

  I love, but I, but when I read this, all I could think about was your mom, even though it was that way. I mean, some of the lyrics, tell me, did you fall from a shooting star, one without a permanent scar? And did you miss me while you were looking for yourself out there? Now that she's back from her solo vacation, tracing her way through the constellation? I mean, I know, it's like when someone reads words that you've written, but such, so beautiful. And to think it's been 25 years, Pat, that, and, and by the way, is this on TikTok? I feel like I've heard it somewhere recently on TikTok, other places. I feel like your music keeps popping up in unexpected places.

• 13:39Speaker 05

  Yeah, I, my management company, they really like me to be on TikTok. And you can imagine how thrilling it is for me.

• 13:52Speaker 05

  I mean, it's so funny. And you know what's really fun, actually, is that my 14 year old son joins us on stage every night and has for this whole tour. And he has gotten so great at singing and guitar, that he is blowing up on TikTok and Instagram. And there are, like, we do a Journey song, and just the other day, Neil Shone, the guitar player from Journey, started following him on Instagram.

• 14:19Hoda Kotb?

  Come on.

• 14:20Speaker 05

  Some of our favorite comedians are following him. A guy named Sam Richardson, like, it's, it's wild what's happening to this kid. It's fun.

• 14:30Hoda Kotb?

  How fun to see your kid, like, hitting this place. So was he, was he always on tour with you, watching you? Did he have talent early?

• 14:41Speaker 05

  He, the last few summers, he would just come out and his mom and sister would come out, go home, and he would just stay the whole time. Last summer, I took him on our European tour the whole time, and we had a day off in the UK and got to see Ozzy Osbourne's final show.

• 15:04Hoda Kotb?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 15:05Speaker 05

  And that was a magical life moment for the two of us.

• 15:08Hoda Kotb?

  Oh, wow. I think we spend so much of our lives waiting for the big moments, the birthdays, the vacations, the milestones. But the truth is, some of the happiest moments show up on the most ordinary days. So like this, I'll stop into a CVS because I need one thing. Somehow, the best part of the trip is never the thing I came for. So maybe I'll grab a delicious well-marketed snack, or maybe I'll wander over to the Joyward Collection. It's really full of fun, cool, seasonal decor, thoughtful little gifts, and those little discoveries that make you so glad you stopped in. I have to tell you, if you're an Extra Care member, you're going to save on things you're already buying, and those extra bucks

• 15:51Hoda Kotb?

  really do add up. Just watching that total go down at the checkout never, ever gets old. I know, life's busy. We're all juggling a lot. And that's why I think those little unexpected moments of joy matter so much. So, the next time you're running errands, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You may go in for something you need, but don't be surprised if you leave with something that simply makes your day a little brighter. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS. Halloween has a funny way of making you buy things you'd never normally buy. A 10-foot skeleton? Sure. A full-size fog machine? Why not? Three bags of candy that somehow

• 16:32Hoda Kotb?

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• 17:17Hoda Kotb?

  JP Morgan Chase Bank, NA member FDIC. Subject to credit approval. Offer subject to change. Terms apply.

• 17:25Speaker 06

  Hello, hello. I'm Malcolm Gladwell, host of Smart Talks with IBM. I spoke with IBM's Ana Paula Assis about what digital sovereignty actually means in the age of AI.

• 17:36Speaker 07

  AI now moves from somebody operating a system to the technology actually making decisions. So you have to have a much better visibility of what AI is touching, data it is accessing, and where.

• 17:52Speaker 06

  Hear the full conversation wherever you get your podcasts.

• 17:56Hoda Kotb?

  What's it like? What's fatherhood like for you?

• 17:59Speaker 05

  Well, you know, I've, I have a 33-year-old son and a 28-year-old daughter, and then my wife and I have a 16-year-old, or 17-year-old daughter, and then Rock is 14. And I think, you know, fatherhood really depends on your partner. And my partner is, like, absolutely tremendous. And, and because she's such a great mom, it makes being a father pretty easy. You know, I just, I just have to be there and be supportive, and there's not much else to it. You know, moms are so important. Like, my mom was so important, and you're

• 18:43Speaker 05

  so important. Like, that's the way it works.

• 18:47Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah. What did you, what did you lose the day that your mom passed, Pat?

• 18:52Speaker 05

  What did I lose?

• 18:56Speaker 05

  I think I had already lost it.

• 19:02Speaker 05

  Because when I found, I was on tour when a friend of my sister's handed me a, like a note card after a show, and I read it, and it basically said, call your mom, she's sick. And that was the moment I lost it. And I think that it was youth. I lost my youth that day.

• 19:31Hoda Kotb?

  What did she think of you and your career and the heights that you had reached?

• 19:37Speaker 05

  Well, she loved it, but she hadn't seen much of it. I mean, really, she's got to see me pay off my credit card bills with, with the money from Meet Virginia, but we never really had much. They're, you know, dividing a little bit of money up between five men is, doesn't go far.

• 20:01Hoda Kotb?

  Did she like to hear you sing? Like, did you sing around the house? Was she into that?

• 20:06Speaker 05

  She was really a good singer. Both my parents were good singers, and my mom was a great dancer. And they were, they loved Fred Astaire and, you know, Johnny Mercer songs. But she, she loved, they would always come to any show that I would have on weekends and, but it wasn't really their music, but she didn't care. She would, she would have sat and watched me sing whatever. That's another thing about being a mom like that is that it might not be for her, but she's going to make you think it is.

• 20:41Hoda Kotb?

  Exactly.

• 20:44Hoda Kotb?

  Do, do you still communicate with her? Do you have any, any feelings that you, any, any sense of communication?

• 20:53Speaker 05

  Well, you know, I,

• 20:57Speaker 05

  It's so funny that you ask this. When you lose somebody and the, the thing that you desire is to connect again. And I was just with this mom and son and the mom is, you know, in her sixties and the son's probably late thirties. And she was telling me the story about losing her daughter who, this just happened a couple of years ago. And she had a, the whole family has a heart condition. So the daughter came home to celebrate her other daughter's birthday. She was vomiting.

• 21:39Speaker 05

  And they thought maybe she had the stomach flu and six hours later she was gone. And her brother, this woman's son, continues to go to mediums.

• 21:53Speaker 05

  To, to connect and the mom tells him all the time, she's right here. You don't need somebody else to tell you. She's right. And I was like, wow, that was, that was pretty cool. That made a, that made an impact.

• 22:11Hoda Kotb?

  Wow. My brother's, my brother's best friend lost a daughter when she was little and I remember them telling me a story. My brother, his friend and another family member said that his youngest daughter was like wrestling on the floor and playing and laughing hysterically. This was after she'd passed. And they said, what are you doing? And she goes, she was like three, she was playing.

• 22:35Hoda Kotb?

  She goes, with who? What are you, who are you playing with? She goes, Victoria. Like, and it was happening right in front of her, right in front of them. And it was the glee of, she's right here. It's all happening right here. Yeah. It's so, it's so interesting that if you, you know, if you're not so skeptical and not so hard. Do you feel like, um, well, let's talk about, I mean, this, this podcast is called Joy 101. I feel like you're like, your life right now. I mean, I was just looking at the places you're going, the things you're working on. It's a lot of work, but in this moment, Pat, how, how do you, how do you find joy? Where do you find it? Do you have to work to find it? Is it something you wake up with?

• 23:19Speaker 05

  You know, I'm, this is the book that I read every day now because I recently just lost a dear friend and he told me he was, he was reading this every day. It's called The Daily Stoic.

• 23:33Speaker 05

  And the reason I mention it is, um, every day there's a page with the date on it for you to read about a lesson you could learn from the Stoics. Where joy, like yesterday's was, uh, it doesn't matter where you are. You can find the good in it. And it talked about Nelson Mandela and the fact that he was in a prison with a bucket for a toilet for years and years and years, but all of the other people in the prison would describe him as the one that kept them up and positive. And he would shadow box and do these workouts just to stay in shape and

• 24:16Speaker 05

  and I feel like the joy that he was finding maybe wouldn't be joy to any of us because he was in a, you know, a prison. And so I just find whatever I can pick out of the day as being the positive. I try to do that because that's what we have. I'm on, I'm on tour with a tour bus. And for the 95 minutes that I'm on stage, that's pretend. Like, I'm supposed to be great for that 95 minutes. And then when I get off stage, I'm not that guy anymore. I'm, uh, I'm, I'm just your buddy.

• 24:59Speaker 05

  You know, some guy that you run into at the grocery store, like that's it. And if I can't, if I can't divide those two people, then I'm in a lot of trouble. And I don't think a lot of people want to be around me. And so I just, uh, once I get off stage, I'm a dad and I, uh, I'm a terrible dad because I'm watching, I'm watching Breaking Bad with my 14 year old.

• 25:31Speaker 05

  But those moments, like I get so much joy out of that. And, uh, you know, when I get home, I'll get to see my, uh, my other two daughters and my wife. And those are the moments that I will celebrate. Every day I've got to find a thing to celebrate.

• 25:46Hoda Kotb?

  Did it, you talked about how you're, you're one way on stage and then you're just a regular guy. Um, when you first got famous, Pat, when Train was, you know, when that first happened. And I know you were singing in bars and doing all the stuff. You went to California. You said, I'm gonna, I'm gonna risk it. And once you started getting fame, how did that affect you as a kid who was one of seven, you know, living in a house that didn't have much? What did fame, what, what did it give you and what did it take away?

• 26:17Speaker 05

  I've never really been famous. Um, I desired fame because that's a thing that young people I think are dumb enough to desire. But the music that I created is famous and that makes a great life for me. Um, that I can, the only time I'm famous in your town is if my name, if the name Train is on the marquee above your head. Like, there's no other time that you would see me and be like, maybe once in a while somebody be like, can I get a picture or whatever, but I'm not that recognizable. And that's made for a beautiful life. And there was one moment

• 27:00Speaker 05

  that I complained to my father about a fan. This is really early days.

• 27:09Speaker 05

  And he was listening to me complain about this fan and he goes, wow, you don't get it. And that was the last time I ever, ever said anything negative about somebody who likes what I do.

• 27:25Speaker 05

  That's all I needed. That's all I needed for him to say is you don't get it.

• 27:29Hoda Kotb?

  That's all he said?

• 27:30Speaker 05

  Uh, cause man, I, I don't want to be the guy who doesn't get it.

• 27:34Hoda Kotb?

  Wow. Wow. Um, when you won that Grammy or those two Grammys, but when you're, when you would get that kind of validation from the industry, which is different from selling out or fans or the rest, what did that, how meaningful was it or was it?

• 27:50Speaker 05

  It was really meaningful. The first, you know, the Drops of Jupiter Grammy was really, really cool. Cause, uh, we got to perform. And I tell this story all the time and, you know, it's a true story. So she can be mad at me if she wants, but when Drops of Jupiter came out as an album, uh, in the USA Today on the front page, the, the woman named Edna Gunderson wrote, Drops of Jupiter derails Train. And the entire band was just furious that we got panned. We were panned in the USA Today and I was just like, who cares?

• 28:31Speaker 05

  Like, like, what are you gonna do? Be mad at her forever? Like, like people like our music. Just keep going.

• 28:40Speaker 05

  So nine months later, Edna Gunderson has to interview me about six Grammys.

• 28:49Speaker 05

  And I didn't mention her panning me. It was like, this is, I, I just got my revenge. Like all you have to do is ask me the questions and we're, we can be friends again. And so that was a really fulfilling time. Like we were up for a lot of Grammys and you too took most of them. Like when we were performing, when we were performing Drops, Bono was in the front row with his thumb up like that. And I was, yeah, but you know what he was saying? I'm taking these four. You can have this one.

• 29:25Speaker 05

  And then Hey Soul Sister was really fulfilling because we were so far off the map at that point that it looked like, you know, the, the career was dwindling to nothing. And that was very validating because I still feel like there's something in here. Like, like even now, um, you know, the move, the song Hallelujah. I think that was written when he was like 55 years old. And it didn't become a hit until he was 70. Because Jeff Buckley turned it into a hit. So there's something in all of us that, you know, you just gotta.

• 30:09Hoda Kotb?

  There's something cooking in there.

• 30:12Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah. God, I love that song so much. You're right. And has it, did, did the one that happened later, the soul, the Hey Soul Sister you said that, that just reminded you, was that sweeter?

• 30:22Speaker 05

  That was just more of a thank God. Like, uh, when, when you're, when you're on your way like this, you, and it's drops of Jupiter era, you think, oh, there's one of these every year. But then when you realize that there's not, and you, you catch a wave, uh, that, that was like, now, now I'm okay. And I can, I can be okay for the rest of my career.

• 30:50Hoda Kotb?

  When Train went on hiatus, you went through, there, everyone goes through these highs and lows. Describe, because to me, I'm always fascinated by, I mean, I feel like, I feel like as low as your lows are, your highs kind of coincide. So what was, what was the moment, and I don't know if it was around that time, I know you went through a divorce, lots of things were happening, but what was the lowest moment that you remember as a human? And what did it teach you?

• 31:19Speaker 05

  My mom's passing was really low. Um, and I, so the, the smartest thing I did is when I left Erie, I got sober. And I was sober for 17 years. And so everything that I did, and it's really funny because I just drink wine now, like, you know, not too much of it, I hope, but, but I remember more now as a wine drinker than my sober years, because I think

• 31:52Hoda Kotb?

  Oh.

• 31:53Speaker 05

  that the fuel in me, like, I was enraged most of the time, because, uh, you know, I was in a band with four people that weren't really my friends. We just found each other and figured we would, you know, so there were, there were so many moments of like, you know, I, I feel like I'm writing these songs and I'm performing, but everybody else is acting like they're famous and awesome. And I'm in this terrible relationship that just is getting worse and worse. And then I lose the one person who is my biggest fan, which was my mom. So I just wanted out.

• 32:37Speaker 05

  So by the time I made a solo record, uh, I had, that was my way of, hopefully I can quit the band without quitting the band, and I can just go make the solo record and every, all my dreams are gonna come true. And it's just, that's not. So the intention behind it was terrible. So you, you can't, you know, you can't be successful if you, if, I, I can't be successful if I go about it the wrong way. Like, my intentions have to be very solid. And that was just an escape. So I made the wrong record and that just now I'm darker than ever, because now I have to go back to the band

• 33:15Speaker 05

  that I'm not in love with. And at least I'm out of a marriage that was really bad. And I'm trying to be as good a father as I can. Like, you know, both my kids lived with me. And as much as I was away, they, that's where they wanted to be. And so anyway, those were the darkest times. And when I met my wife, I think things started to get like, there is life after all, that you should be living. And then I started writing songs like Hey Soul Sister, and, and Train fans would be like, hey, hey, hey,

• 33:55Speaker 05

  who, who, who, who, who, where's the sad guy? Because that's the guy I relate to.

• 34:07Hoda Kotb?

  I think we spend so much of our lives waiting for the big moments, the birthdays, the vacations, the milestones. But the truth is, some of the happiest moments show up on the most ordinary days. So like this, I'll stop into a CVS because I need one thing. Somehow, the best part of the trip is never the thing I came for. So maybe I'll grab a delicious well-marked snack, or maybe I'll wander over to the Joyward Collection. It's really full of fun, cool seasonal decor, thoughtful little gifts, and those little discoveries that make you so glad you stopped in. I have to tell you, if you're an Extra Care member, you're gonna save on things you're already buying,

• 34:47Hoda Kotb?

  and those extra bucks really do add up. Just watching that total go down at the checkout never, ever gets old. I know life's busy. We're all juggling a lot. And that's why I think those little unexpected moments of joy matter so much. So the next time you're running errands, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You may go in for something you need, but don't be surprised if you leave with something that simply makes your day a little brighter. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS. Halloween has a funny way of making you buy things you'd never normally buy. A 10-foot skeleton? Sure. A full-size fog machine? Why not?

• 35:28Hoda Kotb?

  Three bags of candy that somehow become six bags of candy? It happens. Which brings me to the Chase Freedom Flex Card, the savvy decision that will earn you more cash back on the everyday purchases, plus the extraordinary Halloween tricks and treats. With Freedom Flex, you earn even more treats on your Halloween and everyday needs. You get 5% cash back on popular rotating quarterly categories, 3% on dining and drugstores, and 1% on all other purchases. More ways to earn, more ways to get rewarded. That's no tricks, all treats. More ways to earn, more ways to get rewarded. So sign up for the Chase Freedom Flex Card. Learn more at chase.com/getflex.

• 36:11Hoda Kotb?

  This is a paid collaboration with Chase Freedom Flex. Cards issued by JP Morgan Chase Bank, N A Member FDIC. Subject to credit approval. Offer subject to change. Terms apply.

• 36:24Speaker 02

  Running a business means keeping pace with the latest tech. You put a lot into building your enterprise software stack, and scrapping it to integrate AI is out of the question. That's why IBM technology works with all the apps, data, and models you need. It's another way IBM helps you build on the technology you rely on. Let's create smarter business. IBM. Visit ibm.com to learn more.

• 36:52Hoda Kotb?

  I mean, I think what's so interesting is with this tour that you're on now, I was like, that's a, that's a big nut to have. You're also working on this show, which I know from others who have done this, this is a huge mountain to climb. It's from the movie Begin Again, and you're writing, you're doing it. What, tell me about that process.

• 37:12Speaker 05

  Well, this was maybe the hardest thing I've ever done in my career. It started because I was, for one month, I was in a musical on Broadway called, uh, Rocktopia, which just meshed classical music, uh, and rock. So I like sang some Zeppelin, got offstage. But, um, the, the musical got panned, and I gave my Ed Nygunderson speech to these poor kids that are trying to make it on Broadway. And I was like, who cares?

• 37:52Speaker 05

  It's not about those people. It's about the people in the seats, and, and they love you. So go be great. And the producer liked my speech. So then when Begin Again came up, uh, and the, there was another producer named Tamara Kleiman, who was asking Bill, the producer of, uh, uh, the thing I was in. So she was like, who should I get to? And he was like, you gotta call Pat, he's the guy. And so she was like, would you wanna do this? And I was like, I don't think you, that's the way to go about it. Like, you should let me write a song for it and have 10 other people write songs for it. And then whichever one makes sense for your musical, you should. So she said, great, thank you.

• 38:37Speaker 05

  So I wrote the song, and then she never had anybody else write any songs. She was like, great, you're the guy.

• 38:44Hoda Kotb?

  Were you onstage with Bon Jovi? Did I just see you at MSG a while ago?

• 38:51Hoda Kotb?

  Did he just call you up and say, hey, are you guys pals? What is that?

• 38:54Speaker 05

  Sean and I are pals, and, uh,

• 39:01Speaker 05

  He, I, I texted him that I was gonna be at the show and um he had a sinus infection and I've, I've been through every, you know, ailment

• 39:16Speaker 05

  vocally and so it's torture. And I saw him kind of struggling and I was like, oh man, I'm really, this is bumming me out because I love John. He's always been very kind to me. And then he got to the point where he was like, I, I, I can't keep going. So we're gonna play the last, last couple of songs, but I, I don't, I don't know how to, you know, keep pushing here. I don't want to hurt myself. And then he was like, and if, and if Pat Monahan's out there, go come and help me sing this.

• 39:47Hoda Kotb?

  Oh my god.

• 39:49Speaker 05

  And I can't tell you what uh the people in my row said.

• 39:55Speaker 05

  This is probably, this is a family, this is a family podcast. But they were like,

• 40:04Speaker 05

  it was pretty funny. It was not planned at all and I was not very helpful. Like the, the, the crowd sang every word. They, uh, he's, he's got a lot of big, big songs.

• 40:15Hoda Kotb?

  Man, so you are, as we're looking at your life and you're at this stage and I feel like you have so many things that are still TBD and like you said, there, there are these sold out um arenas that are happening just like boom, boom, boom, everywhere you go. You've got a few more uh for this tour. So what, when you, when you think about what's ahead, do you think about that? Or what do you, what do you see ahead for you, Pat?

• 40:45Speaker 05

  You know, um, it, it's a, it's a weird time. Like I said, the, the, the more I'm, I give up to the universe to take care of things instead of pushing my way through things, the easier things get or maybe the more acknowledgement or whatever the thing is that I had desired uh in my earlier days, but like the musical Begin Again is, has become really special to me and it be, it starts in September and then uh I started having a conversation with a, a movie director in, in Los Angeles who has the desire to

• 41:31Speaker 05

  just connect with someone like me and create a movie with great music that would reflect the two of our interests. And I've never been approached by anything like that. That seems so weird. It'd be like, I, I don't know. I mean, I don't know how to describe it, but it was such a great conversation. She is so smart and so cool. She's from New Jersey that maybe that will become something. And then um I'm gonna have a lighter year next year because my daughter is graduating high school and I want to be a part of the prom and the things that I don't always get to be a part of.

• 42:15Hoda Kotb?

  Good. So we usually wrap up these podcasts by talking about joy and um what does joy mean to you now and where do you find it?

• 42:27Speaker 05

  I find joy everywhere. Like I'll, I'll meet a young person. I met a young guy the other day that was so cool because I was, I was trying to describe if, if kids have a choice between music and something else, they'll choose something else because making a living in music has become just almost impossible. And I was like, and, and so you really, in the particular field of music, you, you probably can't have a choice. I didn't have a choice. It was my only option. And then little did I know, this 22 year old kid sitting next to me goes, I think I might be the guy you're looking for. And I was like, what's that? And he said, well,

• 43:09Speaker 05

  he, he very uh humbly told me he was a Harvard grad who worked at a financial company and that he just recently left the company to pursue comedy.

• 43:23Hoda Kotb?

  Wow.

• 43:24Speaker 05

  And I was like, whoa. And he's like, yeah. And I was like, how do your parents feel about it? He said, he said, honestly, it doesn't matter because I need this for my soul.

• 43:37Hoda Kotb?

  Wow.

• 43:38Speaker 05

  And he said, they've grown to be supportive in it, but it didn't start like that, but I don't have a choice. And I was like, well, that's what I mean is you can't have a choice. And his soul was, anyway, so he will find more joy in pursuing the hardest thing in the world, which is comedy, than any deals he could make in the finance world.

• 44:01Hoda Kotb?

  First of all, how wise is that kid to say, I don't, they probably don't like it, but I don't care? Which is so huge because the number of kids who are in jobs now, who are now grown men and women because their parent thought, their parent said, their parent did, they didn't want to disappoint. And now they're just plodding through life and the ones who were, who did what he's doing, what you did, what, you know, a bunch of people have tried. So if people say they want to go into music, do you say go for it or do you say it's a hard road?

• 44:36Speaker 05

  I, I, I'd say, man, I think that's awesome.

• 44:41Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah.

• 44:41Speaker 05

  Like we, we need more great music.

• 44:45Hoda Kotb?

  Good.

• 44:45Speaker 05

  It's not for me to discourage or encourage really because although, you know, if, if, when, when I see something special, I definitely let them know because I know that that's important to hear from somebody.

• 44:59Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah.

• 45:00Speaker 05

  But if I see somebody that's okay, I, I say, great job.

• 45:10Hoda Kotb?

  I like it. Pat, good luck on your tour. Good luck with your show Begin Again that we're gonna, what's the plan for that? What's the track?

• 45:18Speaker 05

  Um, it starts, I think the 6th of September will be the first show at the Old Globe in San Diego. And it will run until mid-October. I went to Lost Boys when I was in New York a couple of weeks ago. And a playwright came up to me out of nowhere. I've never met her. And she said, congratulations on Begin Again. Like uh it's kind of what people are talking about.

• 45:43Hoda Kotb?

  Wow.

• 45:44Speaker 05

  That's the coolest. I mean, wow, really?

• 45:47Hoda Kotb?

  Okay, this is reinforcing what you said, that good things are coming to you because you're hardly seeking them out. Just like that person coming towards you, the fans that are packing the arenas.

• 45:57Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 45:58Hoda Kotb?

  Good things keep happening to you. Yeah.

• 46:00Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's a, it's a strange thing because it's a,

• 46:05Speaker 05

  it's super fun too. I love it.

• 46:07Hoda Kotb?

  I love it too.

• 46:07Speaker 05

  How about you? Is the same thing happening to you?

• 46:10Hoda Kotb?

  Yeah. I mean, you know, for me, at the Today Show where, you know, I've been forever. I interviewed you dozens of times there and heard you perform, loved every second.

• 46:22Hoda Kotb?

  But I had a real like realization um on my 60th birthday there. And I remembered thinking, it was my birthday party on the plaza and they had a whole bunch of like signs and people and I was looking out and I was, I literally was crying. And Jenna was like, what is wrong with you, man? Are you losing it? Like what is happening? And I think I realized then, for me, that that was like the top of the wave and I knew it. And it was, I was also calm weirdly. And so, and I knew that it wasn't gonna get better and I was like, I felt

• 47:00Speaker 05

  Really?

• 47:01Hoda Kotb?

  fine. I actually had like a warm hand on my heart kind of thing. And then, this is super weird. I thought, well, that was fleeting. I'm just gonna go back to doing cooking segments and interviewing people and whatever. And I got home and a couple of weeks later, Hope, who's my little one, I have two little kids and she was six. She's now seven, but she was six then. And she was climbing a tree that was a little tree and she was up and down it. And I was just standing at the base of it, watching her and marveling, yay, Hope, my god, you're up again. And she was go down, oh my god, again. And finally, after like the fifth or sixth time, I said, Hopie, I said, you're at the top again. I said, what are you gonna do now? And she goes, oh, I, I guess it's time to find a different tree. And I go,

• 47:43Speaker 05

  Wow, that's a smart thing to say.

• 47:45Hoda Kotb?

  I go, what'd you say? She goes, yeah, I already climbed it. And I was like, a different tree. And it was like one of those weird like, okay, universe, okay, god, I got it now. Okay. So it was, and then I knew, for me, I know I make a right decision if I can sleep. And I slept.

• 48:04Speaker 05

  And you slept?

• 48:05Hoda Kotb?

  I slept. And that's how I knew, I slept. Sometimes if you sleep, you know it's right. And it's been,

• 48:11Speaker 05

  Amazing story.

• 48:12Hoda Kotb?

  And it's been a beautiful journey. Like, you know, I'm building a, a business around wellness. I'm loving it. I have my toe in the, in the Today Show and I, you know, like I've got a bunch of interviews coming up that they've asked me to do. So I get to, I, I get to see my friends. I'm gonna see Savannah tomorrow. So I still get my, my crew, which is what I loved about the show the most.

• 48:34Speaker 05

  Right.

• 48:34Hoda Kotb?

  And um, and I get, you know, I, I figure like your life's a time pie. It's like, how are you gonna carve it?

• 48:42Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 48:43Hoda Kotb?

  And I didn't love how mine was carved up earlier. So we'll try this one out.

• 48:49Speaker 05

  I love that story and I, I love that you're happy and you've always been the sweetest human ever and it was never bullshit. It was always real stuff and that's very recognizable. Like uh if, if anybody thinks they're getting away with something, they're not. Everybody knows everything. And everybody knows that you're a wonderful human.

• 49:11Hoda Kotb?

  Oh, I love you, Pat. Thank you. Thanks for doing this. All right. Have a great tour.

• 49:16Speaker 05

  Okay, thanks. Bye.

• 49:20Hoda Kotb?

  Hey guys, I hope you enjoyed the conversation with Pat Monahan of Train. He's so straight talking. He's so like on it. Um, he's a really wonderful human being. And I hope you enjoyed that conversation. So there is a guy named Nick Garofisher who is on my app, the Joy 101 app, who will help us alleviate stress. And guess how long it's gonna take to do it? Five minutes? You're welcome. So let's do that now so that for the rest of your day, you can be calm, you can go home and play with the kids, you can go grocery shopping, you can go out and go for a run, you can do whatever you want to do. Have lunch, sit in the backyard, do anything.

• 50:03Hoda Kotb?

  Just sit at home. Sit in the pantry and hide from the kids and do this five minute or let's try it.

• 50:08Speaker 04

  Hello, I'm Nick and this is your breathing space. We're here to connect through our bodies using our breath, practicing cyclical sighing.

• 50:22Speaker 04

  It's a double inhale through the nose, followed by a long

• 50:26Speaker 06

  Sigh out through the mouth. The vibration of the sigh is what stimulates your vagus nerve, helping your nervous system to come to a state of rest and digest. It's a great practice to come into the body and feel what's really going on for you. So let's take a moment to get comfy, sitting up with a nice neutral spine. Taking an easy inhale. Soft and smooth exhale, letting go of any tension in your shoulders. Just letting yourself be here as you are.

• 51:09Speaker 06

  The practice looks like this. Inhaling, inhaling, and exhaling sigh.

• 51:25Speaker 06

  Let's practice. We'll do about 12 rounds together. If you're ready, inhale, inhale.

• 52:28Speaker 06

  Feeling sensations in your body. Letting your sigh be loud, feeling the vibrations rippling through your body.

• 52:57Speaker 06

  Few more breaths.

• 53:05Speaker 06

  Letting that vibration move all the way down your spine.

• 53:20Speaker 06

  Letting your body relax on the exhale.

• 53:36Speaker 06

  Staying with it, you're doing great. Couple more breaths.

• 53:48Speaker 06

  And last one, breathing in, breathing in, sighing loud and long.

• 53:59Speaker 06

  Letting go of the practice.

• 54:03Speaker 06

  Noticing your body.

• 54:09Speaker 06

  And sensations moving in your body.

• 54:15Speaker 06

  This feeling of aliveness.

• 54:30Speaker 06

  And know that this practice is here for you whenever you need it. You can always come back to your breath and come home to yourself.

• 54:46Speaker 06

  Gently inviting yourself back into the room.

• 54:55Speaker 06

  Taking a moment to just feel your body.

• 55:02Speaker 06

  And giving yourself full permission to take it slow.

• 55:08Speaker 06

  And if you'd like to repeat this practice, you're very welcome. Otherwise, softly, slowly, moving on with your day.

• 55:21Hoda Kotb?

  I hope you guys enjoyed that. I hope you feel calmer, you know, you're ready to enter the rest of your day. Enjoy all the minutes, the hours that you have and take some more time for you. Thanks again for listening.

• 55:44Hoda Kotb?

  I've realized that joy doesn't always come from those big moments. Sometimes you find it on the most ordinary day. I'll pop into a CVS for toothpaste or paper towels and it never seems to be just a quick errand. Maybe I'll grab a delicious Well Market trail mix or wander over to the Joyward Collection. That's part of the fun. So the next time you're checking something off your to-do list, stop by your local CVS pharmacy. You might go in for one thing and leave with a little more joy. Visit your local CVS pharmacy, sponsored by CVS.

• 56:15Speaker 03

  I'm Melissa Jelton, host of the What Happened to Her podcast. We're kicking off the season with the Sandra Birchmore story, a case the police wrote off as a suicide in a snowstorm. Her family never bought it and the man they suspected wore a badge.

• 56:30Speaker 04

  You never know who that devil is because he's wearing a disguise. Sometimes it's a police uniform.

• 56:35Speaker 03

  And you can get access to all episodes 100% ad-free with an iHeart True Crime Plus subscription exclusively on Apple Podcasts, available only to iHeart True Crime Plus subscribers. So don't wait. Head to Apple Podcasts, search for iHeart True Crime Plus and subscribe today.

• 56:53Speaker 01

  Is there an epidemic against literature, more specifically, black literature? I'm Jacque Pies Thomas and on this season of the Black Lit Podcast, we're outside asking why. They don't want a whole bunch of little elevators, Malcolm X's and Martin Luther King's running around. And when you look at a lot of different cultures, they're like, we need to know where you came from. And considering this is Black Reading Month, the only real question is, what are you reading next? Listen to Black Lit from the Black Effect Podcast Network on our iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 57:25Speaker 04

  One recent episode of The Questlove Show, I chatted with JoJo about her music and Wallow267 about his story, everything in between. Don't invite me to karaoke. I'm gonna make it weird. Someone's gonna try to sing Leave, Get Out or Too Little, Too Late or Baby It's You. Oh no. And I'm gonna be like, okay, cool. Check out my conversation with JoJo, Wallow267 and more on The Questlove Show. Listen to The Questlove Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Peace.

• 57:55Speaker 01

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.