Emmett J. Scanlan On The “Devil” Inside Him

Emmett J. Scanlan can’t picture his childhood. He can’t imagine himself growing old, and until relatively recently, he had no idea everyone else could. The Peaky Blinders, Kin and MobLand actor opens up to Joe about living with aphantasia, his complicated relationship with fear, the self-destructive impulses he works to keep under control and why becoming a father changed everything. He’s in the office to discuss his “Neverland Syndrome” and how he approaches life and work with child-like wonder. But as Joe learns, there’s a darkness inside of him. Joe attempts to rid him of imposter syndrome, perfectionism and self-destruction with a highly sophisticated psychological tool: Operation. GET TICKETS TO THE LIVE TOUR HERE: https://www.livenation.co.uk/joe-marler-will-see-you-live-tickets-adp1647830 Featuring Joe Marler (@joemarler17) and Jake Bhardwaj (@jakebhardwajtv) Follow the show on Instagram: @willseeyounowshow Joe Marler Will See You Now is a Platform Media production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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• 1:24Speaker 03

  Mate, 22? That is just, that is completely impossible. 22 pieces?

• 1:33Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:33Speaker 03

  Eyebrows. Eyebrows it right now.

• 1:37Speaker 04

  What an experience that was. So you weren't able to make it. I went to the Invictus Games dinner.

• 1:42Speaker 03

  Yeah. Well, why did your mouth do that after you said that?

• 1:45Speaker 04

  Because that's me showing off that I went to something like that.

• 1:48Speaker 03

  Oh, wow.

• 1:48Speaker 04

  Invited by Prince Harry himself.

• 1:51Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:51Speaker 04

  Well, I say "himself," by his team, himself. Took my mum with me.

• 1:58Speaker 03

  You took your mum instead of me?

• 1:59Speaker 04

  Well, you weren't available. Everyone was asking after you.

• 2:02Speaker 03

  I didn't get invited.

• 2:03Speaker 04

  You were invited, big time. So there was an auction, because it was a charity fundraiser, and you've got, like, people there who run companies with their revenue in the billions, not millions, billions.

• 2:13Speaker 03

  Billions.

• 2:14Speaker 04

  Like, to buy a table on this thing, thousands and thousands of pounds.

• 2:17Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:19Speaker 04

  And there was an auction, and they're auctioning off things like afternoon tea with Elton John.

• 2:24Speaker 03

  Please, please tell me your mum bid on it.

• 2:26Speaker 04

  Starting bid, £5,000, £10,000, £15,000, £20,000.

• 2:32Speaker 03

  What? £20,000 for afternoon tea?

• 2:35Speaker 04

  Oh, it went higher than that. I don't know what it ended up on. It went higher than that. But my mum, before we left my house, my mum was like, "Right, okay, I'm ready to go. Also, I've got a bit of cash out, the cash machine, just in case." You said there was an auction. She had £30 on her. She had £30.

• 2:51Speaker 03

  Who's starting, who's going to start, who's going to start at 30 then? Oh, me, pli-- £30,000, thank you. Jake's mum, £30,000, what?

• 2:59Speaker 04

  Well, go in at 20. Well, go in, because she heard 20. She's like, "Well, go in at 20." Yeah, 20, 20,000. I mean, loads of this stuff, but, I mean, amazing, though. They raised like millions.

• 3:07Speaker 03

  I was just about to say, surely they raised loads.

• 3:08Speaker 04

  They raised loads of money. They raised loads of money. And like, we met all of these Invictus athletes. It was very cool.

• 3:14Speaker 03

  You know what I'm really wanting to know is, did he remember you?

• 3:20Speaker 04

  Didn't see me.

• 3:21Speaker 03

  What?

• 3:22Speaker 04

  Well, actually, no, he did see me because I arrived at the same time as him. And when we arrived, there was loads of, there was loads of photographers all shuffling around. My mum was like, "Oh, Jake, I think they want to, they want to get a picture of you."

• 3:32Speaker 03

  Jake, I told you you were doing so well.

• 3:34Speaker 04

  Turns out, turns out he'd arrived at the same time, but then they said, "Sorry, Harry's arriving. Do you mind just standing to the side?" "Yeah, absolutely, absolutely."

• 3:41Speaker 03

  Who were you sat with then on the table? Were you on the dukes table?

• 3:44Speaker 04

  I was sat with your old mate.

• 3:47Speaker 03

  Chris Brooker?

• 3:49Speaker 04

  James Haskell.

• 3:50Speaker 03

  Right, rephrase that sentence.

• 3:52Speaker 04

  I was sat with your mate, James Haskell.

• 3:54Speaker 03

  You were, you were sat with an old teammate of mine?

• 3:56Speaker 04

  I was sat with your mate, James Haskell.

• 3:58Speaker 03

  You were sat with an old teammate of mine?

• 3:59Speaker 04

  Yeah, I was sat, I was sat, we were sat together.

• 4:01Speaker 03

  Okay, how was that experience for you?

• 4:03Speaker 04

  It was very good, very enlightening. Learned a lot about you.

• 4:06Speaker 03

  Sure.

• 4:06Speaker 04

  In your, in your younger days, the sorts of things you used to get up to.

• 4:09Speaker 03

  Go on.

• 4:10Speaker 04

  Does the phrase "fire pussy" ring a bell?

• 4:16Speaker 04

  I can't believe that's a sentence I've said out loud. Does the phrase "fire pussy" ring a bell? So, picture the scene.

• 4:21Speaker 03

  Who have we got in today then?

• 4:22Speaker 04

  Picture the scene, picture the scene. We're sat on this very posh table, this, with a very posh food and a very posh, like, all these wine glasses or whatever. To the right of me, Haskell. Then me, then to the left of me, my mum, then to the left of her, a Colonel.

• 4:35Speaker 03

  What?

• 4:36Speaker 04

  Yeah. Very nice man as well. Very gentle, very warm, talked to us all about his life in the military, kept pouring glasses of wine for my mum. And I was like, "Okay, that's nice." The first one, fair enough. The second one, he's trying to get my mum drunk. He was a very, very lovely man. And so, we're talking, and then we start talking about fire pussy. Apparently, you were involved in this.

• 4:56Speaker 03

  It's important you get to the detail of the story quicker.

• 4:58Speaker 04

  So.

• 4:59Speaker 03

  Quicker.

• 5:00Speaker 04

  James Haskell was telling me about fire pussy, and basically, this game that you rugby lads used to play, when you were indoors, I can't stress this enough, this is indoors, and you'd start a fire, I don't know, you in a hotel or training room or something like that?

• 5:13Speaker 03

  It was a team room, yeah.

• 5:15Speaker 04

  Start a fire, say in that wastepaper bin, and you keep throwing things, bit of paper, bit of wood, bit of this curtain, whatever. The fire gets bigger and bigger and bigger. Whoever gets so scared that they put the fire out because it's getting unmanageable is then labelled the fire pussy, because there was too much of a pussy to let the fire keep going. What sort of thing were you getting up to?

• 5:35Speaker 03

  Well, you've just described what sort of things I was getting up to. Yeah, it was, it was, it was in my younger years, mate. I was 27.

• 5:44Speaker 04

  So we're finding out about fire pussy, and my mum's like, can't believe it. She's, she, she was a bit disheartened about not being able to bid £20 for afternoon tea with Elton John. So this story is sort of a bit of a gear change for her. At which point, the Colonel, who'd been sat sort of quite amicably and quite nicely next to us, he chips in and says, "Oh, actually, it reminds me, James, of a, of a story from when I was at, back with the lads." And I think, "Oh, God, here we go." He said, "I shouldn't say it in front of your mother, though." I said, "You can say it in front of my mum."

• 6:11Speaker 03

  Oh, no.

• 6:12Speaker 04

  He said, "Oh, go on, then." So it reminds me of a time with the lads, and we had a competition to see exactly how many two pence pieces we could fit under our foreskins. At which point, my mum goes, "What? I'm thinking, what?" And he goes, "I got to 22."

• 6:28Speaker 03

  22? There's no way he could fit 22 two p pieces in his foreskin.

• 6:37Speaker 04

  I could not believe it. I thought to myself, "I am amazed by, I'm just, it was so exciting to be involved in this new world of, of..."

• 6:47Speaker 03

  Go on.

• 6:49Speaker 04

  "Of army and aristocracy and, and, and, you know, in this massive great hall where there's the banquet being served." Because everyone is so mild-mannered and polite and lovely, whilst also being able to explain to you that they once tried to put 22, well, they not tried, they successfully did, but then tried to put 23 two pence pieces down their foreskin. I found myself having a wee and tugging on my foreskin, trying to think, "I don't know if I could fit one one pence piece down there."

• 7:16Speaker 03

  Did you go back to your mum and say, "You got any change from that?"

• 7:21Speaker 04

  Well, your mum split the 20, would you?

• 7:24Speaker 03

  What I'm wondering is, say your head is the shaft here. Am I, am I now putting, so am I now putting, am I putting my two p in here like a slot and then stretching the foreskin this way? Or am I putting the two p like on top of your head, like a, like a biscuit?

• 7:48Speaker 04

  Oh, I didn't even see like that. Oh, I see.

• 7:50Speaker 03

  And then it comes up as if to lengthen the actual appearance of my penis.

• 7:53Speaker 04

  Oh, that's how you do it? Oh, in that case, you can fit more.

• 8:00Speaker 03

  I mean, 22.

• 8:01Speaker 04

  Oh, I see. I thought, I thought, say this is the penis, I thought you were pulling that back to slide them in the side there.

• 8:09Speaker 03

  What?

• 8:10Speaker 04

  I thought, "Of course."

• 8:15Speaker 04

  Oh, you're saying you flop it on top and you wrap it round? Oh, gosh, of course.

• 8:25Speaker 03

  Who is it? Tell the people.

• 8:27Speaker 04

  Well, we have a manly man.

• 8:31Speaker 03

  A manly man?

• 8:31Speaker 04

  A manly, manly man. You've seen him on Peaky Blinders, you've seen him on Kin.

• 8:35Speaker 03

  Ah, hello, dear.

• 8:36Speaker 04

  You've also seen him on Mobland. It's Irish mega-hunk Emmet J Scanlon.

• 8:46Speaker 03

  It's huge. And every time you, you say his name, you have to say all of it.

• 8:50Speaker 04

  Emmet J Scanlon.

• 8:53Speaker 03

  So he's mega-hunk?

• 8:54Speaker 04

  He's a mega-hunk. He's a mega-hunk.

• 8:56Speaker 03

  And he basically plays like hard men, like gangsters, all the time. Although in Peaky Blinders, he was a retired football pro that they converted to be on the side, and he would throw football matches now for, for betting and stuff like that. So he's sort of, he was gangster, but not prominent gangster.

• 9:16Speaker 04

  Gangster-adjacent.

• 9:17Speaker 03

  That is exactly what I was looking for.

• 9:19Speaker 04

  You've got loads of kids, right? You could make a crime family.

• 9:25Speaker 03

  What, be like the, the new Mobland?

• 9:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. In your crime family, who would, who would have the different roles? Who would be the one, who'd be the muscle? Who'd be the brains behind the operation? Who'd be the, um, who'd be the, uh, the one that's laundering the money? Who'd be the one who's?

• 9:39Speaker 03

  Maggie would be the snitch.

• 9:41Speaker 04

  Right, so you already know who's snitching on the family?

• 9:43Speaker 03

  She, no, no, no, she wouldn't snitch on the family, as in, she's, she'd be the snitch, as in, she'll be the informant, she'll be able to, um, infiltrate the oppositions.

• 9:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 9:57Speaker 03

  Get all the information, bring it back, like, she just picks up on everything. Daisy's obviously the muscle.

• 10:02Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 10:03Speaker 03

  Jasper is like the Tom Hardy figure. He's like the fixer. You send him out, he's like, jolly, huh, quite polite at times, good morning.

• 10:12Speaker 04

  Switched, though, can't he?

• 10:13Speaker 03

  I'm gonna smash your face in.

• 10:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:15Speaker 03

  Unless we sort it out, do you know what I mean? Pixie, I don't even wanna explain to you what Pixie will be.

• 10:20Speaker 04

  She's a four-year-old, right?

• 10:21Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 10:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:22Speaker 03

  Five.

• 10:23Speaker 04

  Five, she's a five-year-old, right?

• 10:25Speaker 03

  Four.

• 10:25Speaker 04

  Yeah. They call her four-five, no one knows if she's four or if she's five, either way, gets the job done.

• 10:33Speaker 03

  Felix just really likes animals.

• 10:36Speaker 04

  Oh, right, okay. I've got, I, don't let me set the dogs on you.

• 10:39Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 10:40Speaker 04

  Yeah, very nice.

• 10:41Speaker 03

  He's got, he's got the dogs and he owns a pig farm. Never trust a man who owns a pig farm.

• 10:47Speaker 04

  You're looking a little bit Peaky Blinders, actually, with that haircut.

• 10:49Speaker 03

  Precisely what I've done today.

• 10:51Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't know how that's gone so unnoticed.

• 10:53Speaker 03

  It's taken you this long to pick up on the fact

• 10:55Speaker 04

  I'm so sorry.

• 10:56Speaker 03

  That I've got this lid.

• 10:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 10:58Speaker 03

  Apparently, this was the lid that, uh, the famous real-life gangster Al Capone had.

• 11:03Speaker 04

  Really? He had it beach blonde?

• 11:05Speaker 03

  No, without, like, I couldn't get the shoe polish to

• 11:08Speaker 04

  Right, okay.

• 11:09Speaker 03

  Go in it, do you know what I mean?

• 11:10Speaker 04

  We had it done in Turkey.

• 11:11Speaker 03

  Right, I actually had mine done in Leeds.

• 11:14Speaker 04

  Oh, fine. You had it done in Leeds? Al Capone had his beach blonde hair transplant done in Leeds.

• 11:22Speaker 03

  Right, uh, enough of you, enough of your prattling about.

• 11:25Speaker 04

  Right.

• 11:26Speaker 03

  All right, we've got a guest that we need to bring in, and he spent way longer than most with Janet, so shall we just get him in?

• 11:34Speaker 04

  Let's do it, let's get him in.

• 11:36Speaker 05

  Hey, Janet.

• 11:42Speaker 05

  Yo, Janet. Send in Emmett, will you?

• 11:50Speaker 03

  Hi, Janet, could you, uh, could you send in Emmett J. Scanlon, fuck off?

• 11:57Speaker 04

  Slips, can we keep all of these in?

• 12:03Speaker 05

  Yo, Janet. You, send in Emmett. Emmett J. Scanlon. Send him in. It's not a Philly bite, it's

• 12:14Speaker 04

  Why has he got a lisp? I'll do my gangster voice.

• 12:18Speaker 03

  Give me a gangster voice.

• 12:20Speaker 04

  So, you could do, you could do, like, Michael Caine, like that?

• 12:23Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 12:23Speaker 05

  Or you could do Statham.

• 12:24Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 12:25Speaker 05

  Yeah. All right, Janet. Yeah, send in Emmett J. Scanlon, will you? I won't ask twice.

• 12:34Speaker 03

  That work?

• 12:35Speaker 04

  That loves it, yeah.

• 12:38Speaker 03

  Emmett J. Scanlon, everybody!

• 12:39Speaker 05

  Hey, my man.

• 12:41Speaker 03

  Hello, Emmett. Oh, yeah.

• 12:43Speaker 05

  Oh, that's great. Lovely. How it's been, how?

• 12:45Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 12:45Speaker 04

  Come here, do you welcome? Oh, yes, please, I'll have one of those.

• 12:48Speaker 05

  Come on, what's your name? I'm Jake.

• 12:50Speaker 04

  So nice to meet you.

• 12:54Speaker 04

  Do you know what the worst part is? I said, "I'm Jake."

• 12:57Speaker 03

  I know who you are.

• 12:59Speaker 04

  I completely, like, succumbed to it as well.

• 13:01Speaker 03

  Are you kidding me? You're Jake slash Luke for six weeks.

• 13:03Speaker 04

  Whoa! That is such a deep cut of the podcast.

• 13:08Speaker 03

  Listen, guys, can I just say, before we start this off, that I am a massive fan of this podcast? I remember when we were talking about the potential of me coming on here, it was about eight weeks ago, two months ago, and I was like, "Well, I better do some research, I better watch one of the episodes, just in case I happen to be on this show." So, I, I do, I watched, my first episode I watched was the Ross Kemp episode, and he's clearly insane, bananas, like, brilliant and a legend in his own right, and I'd only listened to him for fucking three hours if I could have. And I was like, "This is amazing." So then I watched three other episodes on the bounce, and every single one of them was brilliant. And I was thinking to myself, "Well, okay, the bar is high now."

• 13:49Speaker 03

  And I'm already doing this, and doing shit like this makes me uncomfortable, because I don't have a mask to hide behind, I don't have a script to hide behind, I don't have lines to say. I have to be authentically myself while fucking cameras are rolling. So I was like, for the next seven days, I tried to find a shit guest. For real, I tried to find a low bar, a low bar from which to build my confidence on, so when I came on here, I could go like, "However this goes, it doesn't matter, because I'm not gonna be as bad as X, Y, or Z." And I found

• 14:24Speaker 03

  no one, not one. So statistically, this episode has a good chance of being a low bar, which makes me excited, but also makes me feel like Will Ferrell in the, in the bear pit, where he immediately regrets this decision. So please to the editor, be kind.

• 14:43Speaker 04

  This is already one of my favourite, this is one, this is already one of my favourite periods of time I've spent in my life. Forget about, forget about the episodes.

• 14:51Speaker 03

  Emmett, thank you very much for doing your research and saying such lovely words. That is kind.

• 14:56Speaker 05

  Massive fan.

• 14:57Speaker 03

  Shall we begin with the intake questionnaire?

• 14:59Speaker 05

  Please.

• 15:01Speaker 03

  Full name?

• 15:03Speaker 05

  Emmett Robert John Scanlon.

• 15:06Speaker 03

  So, when Jake, uh, when we were saying in the intro about who we've got on?

• 15:11Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 15:11Speaker 03

  Jake said, "We've got Emmett J. Scanlon."

• 15:13Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 15:14Speaker 03

  And I said, "Are we Emmett J. Scanlon all the time?" Like, do you insist on people saying, calling you Emmett J. Scanlon?

• 15:21Speaker 05

  No, not at all, in fact, my nickname is just Scan, so anybody who knows me, who's friends with me, just call me Scan, so you can call me Emmett J. Scanlon.

• 15:32Speaker 04

  Why, why did you keep the J, not the R?

• 15:34Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 15:36Speaker 05

  Uh, that was my confirmation name. I was basically named, my dad named me Emmett, uh, after an Irish rebel called Robert Emmett, who was hung, drawn, and quartered by the English, this has got awkward.

• 15:47Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 15:47Speaker 05

  And, uh, and that was it, so with my confirmation name, I picked Robert. And John has always been my middle name, so, it was that kind of thing. I also added the, I'm born E M M E T, I added an extra T for my acting name, because Emmett is Hebrew for truth, and that's kind of, it sounds fucking wanky, but that's kind of the process of acting, is don't get caught acting, find the truth. So that's why I changed it to Emmett J. Scanlon.

• 16:16Speaker 03

  It's gone into top three.

• 16:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:19Speaker 03

  We've, we've, we've done full name

• 16:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:21Speaker 03

  And it's gone into top three.

• 16:22Speaker 04

  I know. You're not getting that from Specs Gonzalez, are you?

• 16:28Speaker 03

  Star sign?

• 16:29Speaker 05

  Aquarius.

• 16:32Speaker 05

  Manzarians.

• 16:34Speaker 03

  He, he's, it's, it's actually a little bit disconcerting how much he knows about us.

• 16:38Speaker 04

  Yes. It's incredible.

• 16:41Speaker 03

  Occupation?

• 16:43Speaker 05

  A father, in that order. Everything else is fucking background noise, everything else is a hobby, a father, a dad. Um, uh,

• 16:54Speaker 03

  Big family man.

• 16:56Speaker 05

  Yeah, I remember, uh, 25 years ago, I turned around to my old man and I said, "Dad, can I, um, can I have a conversation with you, can we go to the pub and have a pint?" And 25 years ago, my relationship with my dad was quite tumultuous, volatile, distant. He was a typical Irish generational man, um, you know, loved to drink, didn't know how to express himself, would sit in silence quite a lot. And, anyway, I said, "Let's go for a drink, I need to talk to you," and we're sitting in a bar with a, uh, a Guinness and a whiskey chaser each, and we're facing outward, we're not looking at each other, and he says, "She's pregnant, isn't she?" And I went, "Yeah, yeah, Dad, she is."

• 17:38Speaker 05

  And we sit in silence for another two minutes, and I say to him, "What's it like to be a dad?" And he raised his Guinness, put it to his lips, and just before he took us up, he whispered, "Vulnerable." And then 24 years ago, my daughter was born, and I saw my heart outside of my body for the very first time. And I think, as parents, uh, we, our job is to try to prepare and, um, arm our kids for a happy life, a life that they will never get, that we will never get to see them finish. And that is the best-case scenario.

• 18:17Speaker 05

  Uh, our job is to be memories for our kids and ghosts for their future, and we have to endeavour to make those fucking memories so goddamn important and so interesting and so present. We have to live every single day like it's gonna be our last, because one day it will be, but that's the job. My job is a dad.

• 18:41Speaker 04

  Have you said that before?

• 18:42Speaker 05

  No.

• 18:43Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 18:44Speaker 05

  But I am shaken.

• 18:46Speaker 04

  That was one of the most.

• 18:48Speaker 03

  I could listen to you for hours.

• 18:49Speaker 04

  It was one of the most beautiful passages of speech I've ever heard anyone say. There was no hesitation, there was no um, there were no filler words. Everything was with complete conviction. I really respect that.

• 18:58Speaker 03

  It was gorgeous.

• 18:59Speaker 05

  Thank you Jake slash Luke for six weeks.

• 19:01Speaker 03

  That is unbelievable. Thank you for sharing that as well, in the way that you have.

• 19:06Speaker 04

  I've never heard anyone be able to speak with such fluidity.

• 19:09Speaker 05

  We have at least an hour left. Don't worry.

• 19:15Speaker 05

  We'll fuck it up some way. Hold my beer.

• 19:18Speaker 03

  The next question is morning routine.

• 19:21Speaker 05

  I get up, I would get up every single morning, no matter what time I go to bed at, I will wake up at 5:30 in the morning. And for one hour, I call it my happy hour. It's where I try to arm myself for the day ahead. And I think that the secrets to life, or certainly the measure of success is happiness and joy, because you can have all the fucking things you want, all the relationships you want, all the children you want, but without happiness, it's, it's, it's, well, it's fucking meaningless really. So I spend that hour from 5:30 to 6:30.

• 20:00Speaker 05

  I get up and the first thing I do, first thing I do before my face works up, before the elasticity kicks into my face and my eyes open, I slap on a song, a song that I'm obsessed with and I dance. I find a room on my own and I fucking dance for about three or four minutes. I raise my vibration, I raise my energy and I dance. Right now it's Rolling Stones, Mr. Charm. It is a fucking beautiful one. I'd love to dance with you one of these days, and you. And so that's what I do. I raise my vibration straight away. Then I go into my affirmations, I go into my, I'll do a meditation. I'm addicted to ice baths, so I'll hop into an ice bath at two degrees for four minutes, asylum for 15 minutes. I will, I will bulletproof myself.

• 20:43Speaker 05

  And it is the most important thing that I can possibly do. And it's one of the selfish things that I need to do, more important than anything else, in order to be of service to other people, in order to be a better dad. Or a more attentive husband, or a fucking, you know, a better scene partner to my, to my, you know, co-star on set. And so that's, I, I need to do that because I have, you know, I have the devil inside of me and as well. I've got darkness inside of me, so you need to.

• 21:12Speaker 03

  Self-love.

• 21:13Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 21:13Speaker 03

  You said it was selfish, but it's self-love.

• 21:15Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 21:16Speaker 03

  You have to do it in order to be the best for the other people.

• 21:19Speaker 04

  Poor kids though, I mean, 5:30, dad, turn the bloody noise down. Stop it down, you're above me, okay, you decided to do it there, the music's going, you've got the ice clinking about everywhere, water everywhere. It's 5:30 in the morning, dad.

• 21:34Speaker 03

  What's something that some people might not know about you?

• 21:39Speaker 05

  Oh, fuck me, man.

• 21:43Speaker 05

  Something that people might not know about me? I was 22, I was. Oh, that, oof, I almost went somewhere else.

• 21:53Speaker 04

  I want to know that one, I want to know that one.

• 21:56Speaker 05

  I was 22 when I found out I was circumcised.

• 21:59Speaker 04

  Were you? You had no idea?

• 22:02Speaker 05

  No, I had no idea. Basically, when I was growing up, I thought there were two types of dicks in the world, right? There was the, the good-looking dick, the one that I had, the rare one, the one that looked neat, the one that had a head. And then there was the more common dick, the kind of like, I don't know, loose-skinned, like a decapitated Jedi of some sorts. And that was a more common one. And then when I was 22, standing naked in front of another girl and she goes, oh, you're circumcised. I went, is that what that is? And then all of a sudden a light turned on in my head and it was like a Matrix download. And that was the first night I ever had sex with a circumcised dick.

• 22:42Speaker 04

  Thank you so much for sharing that.

• 22:43Speaker 05

  Thanks, man.

• 22:44Speaker 03

  I've never heard somebody describe an uncircumcised penis as a decapitated Jedi.

• 22:52Speaker 05

  What the fuck?

• 22:54Speaker 03

  That is my favourite.

• 22:56Speaker 04

  You're better off not having one. People waste their foreskins on trivial things.

• 23:03Speaker 03

  Just could you come up with an example off the top of your head?

• 23:06Speaker 04

  I met, I met a colonel in the army who told me when he was younger, him and the other lads in the army, used to see how many two-pence pieces they can fit down their foreskin. Couldn't believe it.

• 23:14Speaker 03

  What?

• 23:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:16Speaker 05

  How many?

• 23:17Speaker 04

  22.

• 23:20Speaker 05

  When I found out I was circumcised.

• 23:22Speaker 04

  Yeah, oh my god.

• 23:23Speaker 05

  Oh my god, full circle.

• 23:25Speaker 03

  Honestly, did you, did you, were you prepped pre-show that we were telling a foreskin story?

• 23:32Speaker 05

  No, no, no, no, no.

• 23:35Speaker 03

  And you weren't prepped that it was 22 pieces and you weren't prepped that you were going to then come and say you were 22 when you found?

• 23:42Speaker 05

  You think this is a bit?

• 23:43Speaker 04

  No, I just think there's, I think there's a weird, there's a very, a good weird, but a good weird energy in the room.

• 23:49Speaker 05

  That's good.

• 23:50Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:51Speaker 05

  I think.

• 23:51Speaker 04

  You feel that?

• 23:52Speaker 05

  I don't think this is gonna haunt me for the rest of my fucking career, that's for sure. That was a, that was a real nice, I'm really like, can we rewind it back and talk about Aphantasia?

• 24:02Speaker 03

  We'll stick with decapitated Jedi, thanks.

• 24:04Speaker 05

  Okay, sound.

• 24:06Speaker 04

  What is, what's the, I, I sort of do one of them.

• 24:08Speaker 05

  Aphantasia is basically, I was 41 when I found this out.

• 24:14Speaker 05

  Deep in the heart of lockdown, like balls deep into lockdown, I was like finding a real comfort in and a like towards tequila. And at that time as well, I was trying to find other outlets in which, more constructive, nicer outlets in which to, you know, spend my time rather than tequila. And I found Wim Hof, breathing exercises, ice bath, fasting and meditation. And one of those meditations was with a good friend of ours, a spiritual teacher, myself, my wife were doing this Zoom, global Zoom meditation. And she was talking about like, okay, the blue light of Archangel Michael is around you and you're dancing on the rings of fucking Saturn.

• 24:55Speaker 05

  I'm being facetious here, but I might as well, just so you know, that's how crazy it was, the imagery. And I just tapped out, I'd had enough at that point and I was just like, I can't, I can't do this anymore. And I, and I sat up and the missus came over and she says, what's wrong? And I says, nobody can imagine things. Nobody can see blue lights. She says, of course you can. I said, no, you can't. She says, no, you can. I said, so if I said grey elephant, could you see a grey elephant in your head? And he goes, she goes, yeah, absolutely, I can see a grey elephant. I says, so you can see pictures? And he goes, yeah. I says, I don't see pictures. So I look at you, Joe, and I'll close my eyes and it's just black, it's static. I have no idea what you look like until I open. Oh my god. And I wish I didn't sometimes. No, I don't, you're a staringly handsome Madonna.

• 25:37Speaker 05

  And then, and then like, so I realised, then I rang my best mate, I rang my parents. Not my dad, I was still fighting with him over the circumcised story. I rang my good friend of mine, Alex Lanning Peckin, and he found a New York Times article called Aphantasia, where 3% of the world's population don't see in images. They have nothing. So I have no memory of my childhood. I, I cannot picture anything about my childhood. I can tell you feelings I had of maybe, I don't know, fear, loneliness and, you know, pockets of fucking happiness and love and all that. I can't imagine a future.

• 26:18Speaker 05

  I can't imagine getting up on stage, holding an award or, or holding my wife when she's older. I, I can't imagine any of these things. So all I can, so I was wondering to myself, well then if I can't do that, if I can't see in pictures and everyone else sees very vividly in pictures, then how am I able to attract the thing that I, that I'm doing if I can't see the pictures? And I realised that it all comes down to feeling, it all comes down to energy, it all comes down to vibration. So that's how I see.

• 26:50Speaker 04

  Do you, do you know how that impacts on your acting or do you just, because you know no different?

• 26:55Speaker 05

  Yeah, when I'm acting, I do as much research and as much, like, like I'll watch as many films as I can, read as many books as I can about whatever that topic is, topic is. And then even though my retention isn't good in imagery, the feeling of that is there. That's kind of my, my energy or my echoes. And so I do that as much as I can. I look at the script, I learn the lines so I don't have to think about them again. And then I step up on set and just assume that the character shows up between the words action and cut. And just hope that fucking, if you throw enough shit at the wall, some of it will stick.

• 27:30Speaker 03

  You mentioned not being able to picture or remember a lot of your past and then you struggle to.

• 27:38Speaker 05

  Sure, sure, sure, sure.

• 27:39Speaker 03

  Picture a future as well.

• 27:40Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, very much so. So all I got is right here, right now.

• 27:44Speaker 03

  So then it could be a blessing, because it forces your hand to be more present in everything that you're doing.

• 27:50Speaker 05

  It does force you to be present. And I did say to one of my best mates, I said, wow, imagine what I could attract if I could see an imagery. And he said, it's fucking awful. If you get a bad film going on in your head, tapping out of that is really difficult. I went, oh, okay, well, maybe, maybe it is good that I'm kind of blind, maybe ignorance is bliss, maybe everything's gonna be about energy and vibration. But that's not to say I don't have an insidious little [BLEEP] inside my head, that narrative, you know what I mean? That keeps on going on and on and on and on and on and on, trying to like belittle you or whatever.

• 28:24Speaker 03

  I love that. Do you consent to being analysed by someone who's not a real doctor?

• 28:30Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 28:31Speaker 03

  Ooh, there was some thought in that.

• 28:33Speaker 05

  I'd love to analyse you afterwards.

• 28:35Speaker 04

  I'd love to see that as well.

• 28:39Speaker 03

  I don't know what's happening. Oh, anyway, I've got your consent, so that's absolutely fine. Thank you very much.

• 28:44Speaker 05

  Well, thank you.

• 28:49Speaker 03

  Talk to me, if you want to, about Neverland Syndrome.

• 28:56Speaker 05

  Yes, okay. My first taste of movies was around seven years of age. I'd watch movies like Donald and the Living Dead, Exorcist, Poltergeist, and, you know, Fright Night. I had ghoulies. There was a movie where a guy sat down on a toilet and a ghoulie came up and had his bollocks and I couldn't shit without hovering for about a few years. So, like, that was my first introduction. It'll get to Neverland Syndrome.

• 29:24Speaker 03

  You were dark, motherfucker.

• 29:25Speaker 05

  Seven years old. No, but, no, but, no, it was, so what it was, was, that gets to the Neverland Syndrome, is that, I would watch that with my mum, so that was my first taste of movies, because my dad would hate my horrors and my sister, she was five, so she was obviously too young.

• 29:41Speaker 03

  Seven was fine.

• 29:42Speaker 05

  Seven was absolutely fine. Weird thing is, like, I could watch zombies eat the brains of the living dead, but the minute half a breast was shown, I was always like, "Shut your eyes, Emmet." I was never allowed to see what was underneath a woman's top. Anyway, fast forward to that, that was my first taste of it. Fast forward to me being nine, the ripe old age of nine, I'm watching a movie called Rocky, Sylvester Stallone. It's my favourite movie of all time. He was my hero growing up. And I was shadow boxing behind my mother's sofa. And I couldn't believe that a film, a story or a performance was able to touch me or inspire me in such a way. And I'm pretty sure that, like, I'd be looking at it going like,

• 30:26Speaker 05

  "If I feel like this watching him, I wonder what he feels like doing that thing." So, I, from that moment, pretty sure from that moment, I dedicated my life to, in pursuit of that doing thing. That Neverland Syndrome, that Peter Pan Syndrome, that Never Grow Up Syndrome that I talk about. It's about learning to live inside your imagination. It's about trying to be a child. And, and if you're lucky enough, get paid for it. And, which facilitates you being able to tell stories.

• 31:06Speaker 05

  And I think the currency, true currency of that, for me, is getting on set collaboratively. As you know, we're having a family here, collaboratively, and making something, creating something together. And that's, I mean, I am more myself when I'm on set than at any other time in the day. You know, just hiding behind a fucking mask.

• 31:30Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:30Speaker 05

  And then, and then when somebody comes over and says, "Hey, what you did, I liked." It reminds me of that nine-year-old boy shadow boxing, still probably, shadow boxing behind his mother's sofa. So it's, yeah, that's the Neverland Syndrome.

• 31:47Speaker 03

  That, that's given me food for thought.

• 31:52Speaker 05

  Go on.

• 31:53Speaker 03

  The way I see it is you've got two forces inside you. The disciplined grown-up, who gets up at dawn's chorus and does the ice plunge, two degrees for four minutes and then sauna for fifteen. That's, that's, that's a nice finish off.

• 32:10Speaker 05

  There it is.

• 32:11Speaker 03

  Or, or the inner child, the mini Peter Pan that just doesn't want to grow up and just wants to play games all the time and play act all the time. So, with those two inner forces in mind, I want to find out who the real Emmet J Scanlon is.

• 32:30Speaker 05

  Good luck.

• 32:32Speaker 03

  So menacing, the way he said, "Good luck."

• 32:36Speaker 03

  Okay. Does that sound like fun?

• 32:39Speaker 05

  It sounds delightful.

• 32:43Speaker 03

  What was your first bit of acting, like, that you actually experienced? Let's unlock, let's unlock that childhood of yours.

• 32:53Speaker 05

  Okay. I was fourteen years of age and I was too young to be cast, but I was cast in my very first production, which was Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat, which was a school production. And it was,

• 33:09Speaker 05

  "There I was standing in front of a vine. I picked some grapes and I crushed them to wine. I gave some to Pharaoh who drank from my cup. I tried to interpret but I had to give up." I remember those lines. I couldn't tell you what I was saying last week.

• 33:21Speaker 03

  Very good.

• 33:21Speaker 05

  Oh, thank you very much. Thank you, thank you, thank you so much.

• 33:24Speaker 03

  And was that the only lines?

• 33:26Speaker 05

  They were, I only had four lines. I think I might have even improvised a little bit, but I came on, I can't, first of all. I came on set, I came on the stage, and for me, there was like, maybe 2,000 people there, it was probably about 100. And I did the thing and sang my little part and then walked off and I got a round of applause. And I was like, "Oh shit, that feels nice." And it was the first time anybody ever applauded anything I did, you know? I was fourteen years of age, I said, "Oh, maybe that's, maybe this is the thing." Because I already knew that I loved movies and I loved losing myself in stuff and to prevent me from staying so much up here. And, so, yeah, I think that was my first taste, that was my first experience of that, and I wanted more of that.

• 34:11Speaker 03

  What was the moment then catapulted you to going, "Right, this, I'm gonna make a career out of this"?

• 34:18Speaker 05

  I mean, there's always, there's always moments where, like, your, your, your, your trajectory kind of changes, you know? I remember, like, the first leading role I ever got was a movie called Charlie Casanova. And it's based, it's a, and I played Charlie and there was this sociopath who made all his decisions based on the draw of a card. Eight to five, yes. Six to 10, no. You'd play a game of cards and he'd advocate responsibility. So, anywhere from, you let the cards decide. Almost like the dice man, so you let the cards decide. So, anywhere from throwing this table onto the over or cutting your throat, whatever the case may be. So, he put all his power into, into the cards. I played this sociopath.

• 35:02Speaker 05

  And I got the lead of that. And that was, and then I remember a couple of weeks before I was filming, I'd walk around the streets of Dublin city centre with a deck of cards, asking people if they wanted to play a game. You know, and just to try and get, to try and, I've since changed my approach. I, I figured not many people wanted to work with that guy. So, yeah, and that was the first, that was my first lead and it was the first time I was nominated for something. And, and that kind of changed it. And then on the, on the back of that, I got, I went straight over to Britain, over to England and did Hollyoaks in May 2010 for two years.

• 35:44Speaker 05

  And that, again, changed everything for me a little bit, you know? And, yeah, and I was just trying to navigate that and get used to that. So there were moments, and then Kin is another thing that changed it. Mobland is another thing that changed it.

• 35:58Speaker 03

  When's that going back? When's that going back? Kin, are you allowed to say you're doing it?

• 36:00Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm halfway through season three right now.

• 36:03Speaker 03

  Oh, brilliant.

• 36:03Speaker 05

  Yeah, and in my, in my humble opinion, they are the best scripts yet. I think so, I think.

• 36:10Speaker 03

  If you've not seen Kin yet, it is fucking box office television. It's incredible. Dark, absolutely brilliant.

• 36:16Speaker 05

  I appreciate it.

• 36:17Speaker 03

  Good dark.

• 36:17Speaker 05

  Yeah, I appreciate that.

• 36:19Speaker 03

  Kin, Peaky Blinders and Mobland.

• 36:23Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 36:23Speaker 03

  Like, they're all quite, um...

• 36:26Speaker 05

  Light.

• 36:28Speaker 03

  They're all quite, you know, gangster-heavy.

• 36:31Speaker 05

  Yes, sir, they are.

• 36:31Speaker 03

  Do you, do you like playing gangsters? Like, is this a thing that you really enjoy doing?

• 36:36Speaker 05

  I, I like working. I, I mean, I like, I like getting on set. I like investing my time in, and hopefully putting together a box set of characters that are gonna fucking outlast my time here on this earth. And I like the fact that I have a chance to do it. I get to play Paul O'Donnell in Mobland and I get to dance opposite heroes of mine and I get to learn with them. I get to get on the mats with them, get on their stage where I get to watch Helen Mirren, you know, Pierce Brosnan and Tom Hardy. I don't mind what I do so long as I'm on set and I get to play, so long as I get to, to, to learn from people and become better as a result of that.

• 37:19Speaker 03

  What does that feel like? Because you...

• 37:21Speaker 05

  Being on set with them?

• 37:22Speaker 03

  You spoke about being a bit nervous before coming in here.

• 37:24Speaker 05

  I was. Yeah, yeah, big fans.

• 37:26Speaker 03

  But it's, it's me and Jake slash Luke and a lovely team of producers and all the team here. And we're here to look after whoever comes in and have fun with.

• 37:36Speaker 05

  No, you do that.

• 37:37Speaker 03

  But you're then on set with these big, like...

• 37:40Speaker 05

  Giants.

• 37:41Speaker 03

  Giants of the acting world. Do you then, like, shit your pants?

• 37:45Speaker 05

  No, man, I'm excited.

• 37:46Speaker 03

  You're excited.

• 37:47Speaker 05

  I'm excited. I, I wanna go toe-to-toe. I wanna, like, you, I mean, you...

• 37:51Speaker 03

  I love that you keep describing it like toe-to-toe, is it, "I wanna go, I wanna beat fuck out of them."

• 37:57Speaker 05

  I wanna, I wanna, I just wanna fucking dance sometimes, I'll leave, sometimes I'll leave, you know, I just... And, and to be able to share the space with these people that you grew up watching, that I admire so much, is, is, the magic of that is never lost on me. I mean, when I signed up to do Mobland, like, I was supposed to die in episode nine of season one. I only signed up for nine episodes and then somewhere along the way, our incredible scribe, Jazz Butterworth, he changed his mind and started writing more and more things for my character. And then episode nine came along and there was no dead scene. Episode 10 came along, no dead scene.

• 38:38Speaker 05

  I said, "What the fuck, am I in season two?" And then season two, and like, and Jazz, like, the incredible person that he is, he's managed to get this crazy story and then inject it and take it to another level. Where season two, in my opinion, is like, if, if season one is a rabid dog, season two is the fucking dogs of Hades. It is just, it's insanity. And it's wonderful to play in that world. That's my playground. And I absolutely love it.

• 39:07Speaker 03

  When you're, when you're in there and you've got a scene with Pierce Brosnan or Tom Hardy or any of them, are you there like, "Oh, I've been acting a while now. I belong here. I feel great. I feel comfortable being alongside you." Or is there still part of you that goes, "How the fuck have I got in here"?

• 39:25Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's a great question.

• 39:30Speaker 05

  That comes down to like that insidious little shit inside your head telling that you're telling yourself that you're not good enough or that you think people might think that you're not good enough uh uh to be there. And he does creep in. He I mean, he creeps in every once in a while. But I try to change the narrative of that, you know, like I'm like I was scared coming in here doing this podcast because like I said, I'm a big fan and and whatnot, but I try and change the rhetoric of that instead of scared I'm gonna I'm gonna keep saying I'm excited, I'm excited. Both of those things, they both serve the same thing, but only one of those things makes me feel better. So when when he gets when he gets into my head, I try to push him away as much as I can.

• 40:14Speaker 05

  But I think that's where the morning routine comes into place. When you do the morning routine, you you you're able to, you know, try and be as happy as you possibly can so you feel deserving to be on set. While at the same time, it's like Christmas is like it's magical. It's just it's one of those weird experiences.

• 40:33Speaker 03

  It's that change in approach that you go in. It's still the same feelings you get of nerves and

• 40:39Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, nerves.

• 40:40Speaker 03

  Should I be here or thingy, but your mind is now telling you or changing the approach. Like you said, it's more of a positive spin. I'm I'm excited to attack this as opposed to fuck, are they gonna find out that I shouldn't be here or I'm not good enough to be here?

• 40:53Speaker 05

  Oh, man, that that yeah, a hundred percent.

• 40:54Speaker 03

  Consistency in the morning to constantly have that fight in your own head and go, how am I gonna approach today then? Am I gonna let him win or am I gonna win?

• 41:04Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's one of those like the don't be scared about the thief in the alley who's after your purse. Be scared about the thief in your mind that's after your promises. So it's that kind of shit, you know what I mean? We we know that our thoughts carry power, they carry frequency, they carry energy. So it's kind of like, you know, you you and we all know like thoughts become your your words, your words become your actions, your actions become your habits, habits become your character, character becomes your fucking destiny. So it's important that when you're thinking about shit, that you make sure that those thoughts are good. Cause uh you know, Milton says that mind makes a heaven of hell and a hell of heavens. So once you get caught in there, you're fucked. So the best way to do that, I believe, is just to short circuit the wiring of that, the bogus wiring for that.

• 41:47Speaker 05

  And the only way that I can do that is by getting up at five thirty every morning, dancing like a fucking maniac and throwing myself in the two degree ice bath.

• 41:55Speaker 03

  Why do you everything you you put it so eloquently. I've had to write I've had to write down that thief purse alleyway promises thing. I love that.

• 42:06Speaker 04

  You don't stumble once as well. I'd have got the order wrong of the character leads to the thoughts. No, let me start again. So thoughts lead to the actions, lead to the words. That in itself, I would need to revise that order of how it progresses.

• 42:17Speaker 05

  Oh, God.

• 42:19Speaker 03

  On that, what about fear? Is fear something that motivates you?

• 42:23Speaker 05

  Yes, a hundred percent. Find out what you're afraid of and go live there. That's why I'm here. I always find out what I'm afraid of and I try and make it commonplace. I try to push that comfort zone, you know?

• 42:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, I like to think that if you if you're constantly in your comfort zone, you you'll stay who you are.

• 42:41Speaker 05

  Exactly, exactly.

• 42:42Speaker 03

  Unless you get out and become uncomfortable, put yourself in a situation, that's where you grow.

• 42:47Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 42:49Speaker 03

  You know, I don't know what I'm doing. I still fucking don't know what I'm doing, but the more that you get out there and try something different.

• 42:54Speaker 05

  But you're constantly putting yourself you constantly put yourself into those situations despite your fear. That's that's something to admire.

• 43:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, but again, that goes back to your head of like, oh, I need to do it. I need to do it, otherwise I'll just stay still because I want to. I want to grow, I want to learn, I want to learn new things, meet new people, what their experiences are and all that lot and then but it's also hard work because it can be it's exhausting and you're scared shitless of like, oh, that means I'm gonna have to be myself and that means they're gonna judge me.

• 43:24Speaker 05

  But the alternative is you're fucking prisoner to your own fear and then where's the fucking like you said, where's the problem?

• 43:28Speaker 03

  I'm eating loads.

• 43:29Speaker 05

  Yeah, at home. I still do that.

• 43:31Speaker 03

  Watching Emmett play soccer aid.

• 43:36Speaker 03

  That is unacceptable. That is honestly.

• 43:39Speaker 05

  Jake slash Luke for six weeks. Was that your fucking phone?

• 43:43Speaker 03

  That is honestly Emmett, sorry, I'll deal with this one.

• 43:46Speaker 05

  No, man, this is

• 43:47Speaker 04

  Unbelievable.

• 43:48Speaker 05

  We were doing so well.

• 43:49Speaker 03

  That Jake, I yield, I yield on so many occasions.

• 43:53Speaker 04

  I know, I know, I know.

• 43:54Speaker 03

  I've even yielded this morning being an hour late.

• 43:56Speaker 04

  I know, I know, I know.

• 43:58Speaker 03

  But what you've just what you've just done.

• 44:00Speaker 04

  It's not what I've done. But go on, you say it and then I'll tell you the whole story.

• 44:07Speaker 03

  What you've done by allowing your laptop to be on full sound.

• 44:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 44:12Speaker 03

  Mid chat and I also know that it's a message that's come through from the team to help you with it whilst we keep going. So you're gonna like solve yourself of any pain.

• 44:22Speaker 04

  I was gonna drop them under the bus completely.

• 44:24Speaker 03

  But you the point I'm saying is you kept it on that.

• 44:26Speaker 04

  On clouds.

• 44:28Speaker 03

  We can move on, can't we?

• 44:29Speaker 04

  Gutted about that. Honestly, I'm gutted about that. I'm so sorry. Oh.

• 44:34Speaker 03

  You you apologize to our guest, mate, who's fucking opened up for the last forty five minutes.

• 44:39Speaker 04

  I know, just to hear that go off.

• 44:40Speaker 05

  My God. I'm sorry, you were saying? No, no, never mind.

• 44:45Speaker 03

  Unbelievable. Was it important?

• 44:47Speaker 04

  Huh?

• 44:47Speaker 05

  What? Who was it? At least who was it?

• 44:49Speaker 04

  Uh, Georgia, she said, this is good, isn't it?

• 44:55Speaker 04

  Can you believe that?

• 44:59Speaker 05

  It's all right, isn't it?

• 44:59Speaker 04

  And I was gonna reply being like, it is. I hope they don't I hope they don't notice me saying that though. Oh, it's just so good. I can't tell you enough. It's so good.

• 45:12Speaker 03

  Pieces of shit.

• 45:15Speaker 04

  It's so good.

• 45:18Speaker 04

  Oh, this is what it's like to be back in comfort zone.

• 45:24Speaker 03

  We interrupt this episode to remind you that we are going on tour.

• 45:29Speaker 04

  Yes, Janet has been hard at work and organised not one, not two, not three. I don't have time for this. It's seven shows across the UK. Can't believe it.

• 45:36Speaker 03

  Seven?

• 45:36Speaker 04

  Seven.

• 45:37Speaker 03

  But where are we going?

• 45:38Speaker 04

  You can't even count to seven.

• 45:39Speaker 03

  I can. I can. Look, I've got seven fingers.

• 45:41Speaker 04

  I know. Well, I don't know. You saying I've got seven fingers sort of proves that you're mathematically gifted.

• 45:46Speaker 03

  Okay, right. We've worked the numbers out, but what about the destinations? Where are we going?

• 45:50Speaker 04

  I I I let me try and do it in one breath. We're going to Birmingham, York, Manchester, Bristol, Southampton, Brighton and London all this autumn.

• 45:58Speaker 03

  Look, Janet's put a lot of work into this tour and it would genuinely upset her if you didn't buy a ticket. That is of course me guilt tripping you in buying the tickets, which is actually unkind. We want you to want to buy the tickets.

• 46:12Speaker 04

  We want you to want to buy the tickets, but also we don't want you letting her down. She's been hard at work all year putting this tour together. And I just don't want her in a bad mood because no one's come to the shows, okay? I mean, I already have to work with him. He gets quite in a bad mood a lot anyway.

• 46:24Speaker 03

  Tickets are on sale right now. Just find the link in the episode description. And who knows, you might even get to see a little more of Janet in the flesh than you bargained for. I don't think she's up. Is she up for that? Have we got clearance that she's all right with that?

• 46:39Speaker 04

  You've written that in.

• 46:42Speaker 04

  So don't now backtrack from it. Unbelievable. I can't work like this.

• 46:54Speaker 03

  Let's talk about fatherhood, which you pushed on in the

• 46:57Speaker 05

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 46:59Speaker 03

  And also your Neverland syndrome. Did becoming a father like have an effect on that? Like, did you find yourself going?

• 47:06Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 47:06Speaker 03

  Oh, hang on. I'm desperate to always stay in that child mindset and playtime and all that. But hang on, I've now got a tiny human that I've got to help survive and then, you know, thrive, help them become good. So did that change? You had to grow up quicker?

• 47:27Speaker 05

  Well, I don't know whether I have grown up. I think uh I think being a father has helped me become a better actor. Because you're kind of, you know, you know, Christmas has become magical again. You start questioning things again. You start asking questions. The fucking the the wonder that children find and the joy they find in the same company or the same thing over and over and over again. We kind of lose that as we get older. And uh and I steal from my children. They they they bring me back to a more rooted place of playfulness

• 48:09Speaker 05

  and and joy. And like I said before, that's

• 48:15Speaker 05

  that to me is

• 48:19Speaker 05

  that to me is success. So I just kind of I I milk my little daughter, Fion Luna's toothless smile and her three chins and I just and I and I I look at it and I FaceTime her and I'll FaceTime my son Ocean Torn and and and you know, they put me in this really good playful place or when I'm playing with them and then I'll go on set and I'll and I'll and I'll and I'll use that. It's just it's just a wonderful. I think I think I've become a better person

• 48:49Speaker 05

  because of being a dad and I think I've become a better actor as a result of that. And I owe them ten percent.

• 48:56Speaker 03

  There's pureness in them that I'm like, it's it's pure happiness or pure joy that I feed off from them. And it I'm like, oh, my God, all these things that are going around in my head that I'm worrying about. And I spend half an hour just sitting there watching them, like playing and going off and I'd go, fuck.

• 49:20Speaker 05

  Glorious. Or else they'll drop us some absolute clangers. They'll just have some one liners that are just brilliant. I remember driving back from picking up my daughter, like I had Ocean in the backseat and Fion's over there and we just picked her up from forest school. And, you know, I'm driving along and she's like, oh, where's my bobo, you know, and a little soother. And I said, well, listen, we're just we're we're literally just two minutes away. And she's and of course, she's like fucking two. She has no idea what time is. She doesn't she doesn't give a shit. And then she's like, and she immediately starts crying. I said, sweetheart, we're two minutes. Literally, we're on the same road. We'll turn right there. And she starts bawling. And my son is there with like his book like that and he doesn't even look up and he goes, wow, tough crowd.

• 50:01Speaker 05

  And that was it. And I'm just like, that's fucking genius. That's absolutely beautiful. And then I'll just burst out laughing, you know, it's just amazing.

• 50:14Speaker 03

  You mentioned earlier that your morning routine helps you deal with the devil inside you. In fact, you've mentioned it several times. You've called them the insidious little git or little...

• 50:27Speaker 03

  Okay, we'll go with then.

• 50:32Speaker 04

  Is the devil inside you, is it a part of you that is like a scary part of you? Or is it a separate entity that is the voice telling you that you're not good enough? Or is it both?

• 50:43Speaker 05

  It's the devil inside of you or the darkness inside of me. We all have light and darkness inside of us and it's kind of trying to find that balance. Because, you know, I like both quite a lot. So in order to facilitate both of them coexisting within me, I have to do things that allow for a nice peaceful marriage. Now, sometimes I can tip one way or another way, but it's just that juggling act where I have to incorporate a lot of things in order to facilitate things that I really like as well.

• 51:26Speaker 03

  Is stuff like your morning routine?

• 51:28Speaker 05

  That's important, yeah.

• 51:30Speaker 03

  And stuff like that that keep those self-destruct impulses away?

• 51:36Speaker 05

  Self-destruction, yeah, yeah, it is.

• 51:38Speaker 03

  It's important to stay on top of those.

• 51:40Speaker 05

  Yeah, it is.

• 51:41Speaker 03

  So say that went out the window.

• 51:43Speaker 05

  Left my own devices, I would like, you know, that would be a scary, scary place to be. You know, so that's why, that's not to say that like, like one thing is stronger than the other. I'm making this kind of sound like if I don't do this, then I'm going to be this type of person. But it's not, it's not like that. It's kind of, I love both sides. I love getting up early and I love hitting an ice bath and meditating and playing with my kids and stuff like that. Then again, you know, at the same time, I love, you know, other things like fucking, you know, tequila and, you know.

• 52:16Speaker 03

  I'm trying to get the best way for me to tell you how much that relates to me and how this lot, I've only experienced it once so far. But I did jokingly say to you before, when we were doing the run through and that lot, I was like, oh, I think I'm due my next meltdown. And it was like, we can joke about it, because I could feel it. Like usually for me, it's like every six months, I sort of

• 52:43Speaker 05

  implode.

• 52:44Speaker 03

  Self-implode and I just go fuck all this, I'm done. Can't do any of this, I'm not interested. And that's to everything. And unless I stay on top of, unless I stay on top of like going to the gym, I found this gym that's like

• 53:01Speaker 05

  Yeah, insane.

• 53:02Speaker 03

  Half hour away from me. I get up at five, I peg it down there, a nice drive in there and I'm with my own foot. That's my sort of ice bath sauna moment where I'm in the car and I'm deciding, am I going to listen to him today or am I going to listen to me today?

• 53:19Speaker 05

  Sure.

• 53:20Speaker 03

  And get through that. And then I have the consistency in the gym where I'm chasing something like a goal and that makes me feel physically good, but mentally I'm on track with it. And as long as I'm staying on it, that sets up my whole day. It sets up my whole week. It means that I am there for my wife and kids. It means that I am there at work and present and I can be more, sometimes a little bit late. Okay, but I'm still present.

• 53:47Speaker 04

  Sometimes very late.

• 53:49Speaker 05

  Can I say what's beautiful about you, Joe, is that like

• 53:57Speaker 05

  weak, weak people gossip about other people to build like fake connections.

• 54:08Speaker 05

  Strong people express their vulnerability to build real ones. And you are a beast of a man who expresses his vulnerabilities all the fucking time to build real connections. You allow and facilitate other people to talk about it too. So when that insidious little inside of your head starts belittling you and ridiculing you, what do you do? You talk about it and you, Jake slash Luke of six weeks, facilitate that conversation and are as important to that conversation, although not really. But, no, but I'm, I mean it.

• 54:50Speaker 05

  What you do is extraordinary and the vulnerability there is, is really powerful and is a sure sign of your strength, I think.

• 55:01Speaker 03

  That's very kind of you to say that, thank you.

• 55:05Speaker 05

  You're welcome.

• 55:06Speaker 03

  And that's why.

• 55:08Speaker 05

  I actually only said that so you'd be kind in the edit when it comes to this podcast.

• 55:12Speaker 03

  Oh, we don't edit this, sorry.

• 55:13Speaker 05

  Bollocks.

• 55:14Speaker 03

  No, this is the first one we've decided we're not going to edit.

• 55:18Speaker 03

  We're doing a new route, aren't we?

• 55:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. This has been livestreamed actually.

• 55:23Speaker 05

  Oh shit, oh shit.

• 55:28Speaker 03

  So yeah, that's, it's lovely to meet someone and probably lovely is not the right word.

• 55:36Speaker 05

  It's a good word.

• 55:36Speaker 03

  But I could instantly connect. I'm like, oh, okay, you might be this big actor that I see on a TV screen and a movie screen and you're Paul O'Donnell.

• 55:50Speaker 03

  But then I get to meet you in real life and I go, oh, hang on, this is, this is Emmet. This is, and I'm like, oh, that's quite a cool connection there.

• 55:59Speaker 05

  Thank you, brother.

• 56:03Speaker 03

  Emmet, you've shared a lot today.

• 56:05Speaker 05

  Thanks, mate.

• 56:06Speaker 03

  But before you go, I've got one final exercise for you to try. I really want to tap into your inner child.

• 56:14Speaker 04

  Emmet, trapped inside of you, we know you have demons as we all do. Self-destruction, imposter syndrome, perfectionism. We'd like to exercise those demons with a game of Operation and

• 56:24Speaker 05

  No way.

• 56:25Speaker 04

  Just to help you visualize this character as you, we've stuck a beard on as well.

• 56:30Speaker 05

  Thank you so much, man.

• 56:31Speaker 03

  That's you.

• 56:32Speaker 04

  New rules.

• 56:33Speaker 03

  I mean, it's not strictly you.

• 56:36Speaker 05

  No.

• 56:36Speaker 03

  It's you if you didn't do all the healthy things you did, stay on top.

• 56:41Speaker 04

  We're going to give you five lives. I want to know if you can exercise all of these demons.

• 56:47Speaker 05

  I just want to see if it was working. I just want to see if it was working.

• 56:51Speaker 04

  We want to see if you can get all three out.

• 56:52Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 56:53Speaker 04

  Imposter syndrome, perfectionism and self-destruction. Which one do you think is, what's he going for first?

• 57:00Speaker 03

  Perfection. Are you taking a piss? Sorry, I just told you that, Emmet.

• 57:05Speaker 04

  We were trying this before we started, none of us could do.

• 57:07Speaker 03

  Are you fuck off?

• 57:09Speaker 04

  Are you fuck off?

• 57:10Speaker 03

  No, can't.

• 57:11Speaker 04

  We've had some wonderful passages of speech from him today and we've gone with a you fuck off.

• 57:17Speaker 05

  Well, first of all, this fucking thing.

• 57:19Speaker 03

  Whoa, whoa, whoa.

• 57:20Speaker 05

  It doesn't go wide enough to even go around it.

• 57:22Speaker 03

  You don't blame your tools, mate.

• 57:23Speaker 05

  It doesn't go wide enough to go around it.

• 57:25Speaker 03

  So you got rid of perfectionism first, interesting.

• 57:28Speaker 05

  It was just easier.

• 57:30Speaker 03

  That'll be one life gone.

• 57:32Speaker 05

  I didn't touch it.

• 57:34Speaker 03

  Yes, you did.

• 57:34Speaker 05

  Look, this, this doesn't go wide enough to go around the head of my self-destruction.

• 57:40Speaker 03

  Take it out with Hasbro, buddy.

• 57:42Speaker 04

  Okay, so perfectionism has been removed from the operating table.

• 57:46Speaker 03

  No way. No way.

• 57:49Speaker 05

  Self-destruction.

• 57:50Speaker 04

  You've done it.

• 57:51Speaker 05

  It's, it's, no, it's so fitting that this is the one that's still alive.

• 57:56Speaker 03

  He's taken perfectionism out and he's taken imposter syndrome out.

• 58:01Speaker 04

  How many lives are left?

• 58:02Speaker 03

  He's got four remaining.

• 58:04Speaker 05

  But you see, it's not wide enough to grab this, that's the problem.

• 58:08Speaker 03

  That's what self-destruction would say, wouldn't it?

• 58:10Speaker 05

  Look, come on, can I just show you how ridiculous this is? If this, this.

• 58:15Speaker 04

  The tongs are not wide enough.

• 58:16Speaker 05

  They're not wide enough to wrap around the fucking stupid mushroom.

• 58:22Speaker 03

  I know you've, I know you've got.

• 58:27Speaker 04

  The ball's been tipped over, self-destruction's fallen out. It's the end of the exercise, I'm very excited.

• 58:32Speaker 05

  Unbelievable.

• 58:35Speaker 03

  Right, well, it appears like self-destruction was the winner.

• 58:43Speaker 03

  All jokes aside.

• 58:45Speaker 05

  Yes, sir.

• 58:46Speaker 03

  That was a bit of fun and games, I'm proud of you.

• 58:48Speaker 05

  Thanks, mate.

• 58:49Speaker 03

  I'm proud of you, I really am. You've shared so much today and I appreciate it, we all appreciate it here. It's been great fun at times and it's been pretty dark at others. And I do really respect you and appreciate you sharing all of that. But in terms of bringing it back to the final exercise where we were like, oh, you need to take out the self-destruction and perfectionism and imposter syndrome. I don't think you do, I think they're the things that probably drive you to a degree. Like if you don't have those little bits that you have to keep on top of and all that, then I don't think you'd be as successful as you've, as you've become. I think you're fucking great.

• 59:30Speaker 05

  Oh, thank you, brother.

• 59:31Speaker 03

  I also love the way that I can say that to you and then go, do you want a lollipop?

• 59:39Speaker 05

  Can I see them though? I want to see if they're shit or not.

• 59:41Speaker 03

  Before you go, not only will you get a lollipop, you will get a badge.

• 59:45Speaker 05

  This is what I'm looking forward to.

• 59:46Speaker 03

  To remember your time and always remind you of the lack of help we gave you today. What have we gone with, Jake?

• 59:54Speaker 04

  Really happy with today's badge, I love it.

• 59:57Speaker 03

  It better be good after that.

• 59:58Speaker 04

  Peter J. Pan.

• 1:00:01Speaker 04

  Beautiful, isn't it?

• 1:00:02Speaker 03

  Good, really, really good.

• 1:00:04Speaker 04

  That's for you to take home and do what you will.

• 1:00:06Speaker 03

  And you went with green, oh, green.

• 1:00:09Speaker 05

  I know.

• 1:00:10Speaker 03

  Why green?

• 1:00:10Speaker 05

  Ah, just because I'm Irish.

• 1:00:14Speaker 05

  And it was the closest one to me, they all look shit to be fair.

• 1:00:17Speaker 03

  Before you go, Mobland, I know where to watch it, but for people who don't, where can they watch it, Mobland season two, please?

• 1:00:25Speaker 05

  Paramount Plus.

• 1:00:27Speaker 03

  As simple as that?

• 1:00:28Speaker 05

  Paramount Plus.

• 1:00:29Speaker 03

  Mate, you've been brilliant, thank you so much.

• 1:00:30Speaker 05

  Thank you so much, man.

• 1:00:31Speaker 03

  Emmet Scanlan, everybody.

• 1:00:35Speaker 03

  All right, Janet will sort you out, bugger off.

• 1:00:37Speaker 05

  Thanks, man.

• 1:00:41Speaker 04

  Quite the man.

• 1:00:42Speaker 03

  Look at that, oh, that beard, his beard is so soft. I wish I'd have stroked his beard in, in real life.

• 1:00:48Speaker 04

  I think you'd have punched him in the face for that.

• 1:00:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, probably a good idea. Anyway, if you want to join the doctor's waitlist, then please subscribe to our YouTube channel and follow us on Instagram, at We'll See You Now Show. Remember, unless it's not clear enough already, I'm not a real doctor. If you need any professional help, you'll find a link to great support services on our Instagram. I've been Joe Marler, he's been?

• 1:01:10Speaker 04

  I've been happy to be here.

• 1:01:13Speaker 03

  Brilliant. And this has been Joe Marler, We'll See You Now, and we'll see you next time. Bye bye.

• 1:01:18Speaker 04

  Bye.

• 1:01:20Speaker 02

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