Dakota Fanning, Vol. II

Dakota Fanning is back on Happy Sad Confused this week! Dakota and Josh catch up on Dakota’s latest project: Joe Swanberg’s THE SUN NEVER SETS, her viral 2002 Critics Choice Awards speech featuring Orlando Bloom, her TWILIGHT days, what it was like to act alongside sister Elle for the first time in the upcoming adaptation of THE NIGHTINGALE, whether she still gets birthday presents from Tom Cruise, & more! SUPPORT THE SHOW BY SUPPORTING OUR SPONSORS! Rula -- Rula patients typically pay $15 per session when using insurance. Connect with quality therapists and mental health experts who specialize in you at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.rula.com/happy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #rulapod Quince -- Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Quince.com/HAPPYSAD ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for free shipping and 365-day returns. Limited Time Offer–Get Huel today with my exclusive offer of 15% OFF online with my code happy15 at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://huel.com/happy15.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ New Customers Only. Thank you to Huel for partnering and supporting our show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

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• 0:29Josh Horowitz?

  Where do you rank in your Pantheon performances delivering that amazing acceptance speech while being clutch by Orlando Bloom in 2002?

• 0:37Speaker 02

  Honestly, that may be my peak achievement. People make me watch it all the time. I was just with my sister's boyfriend's family this past weekend. It's their favorite thing. Someone came over, a friend, they were like, have you seen it? You have to see it. They start playing it. I'm literally running down the hall of the house to get away from this video. I'm like hiding in the room. I come out, still not over, still talking. Orlando Bloom's shaking like a leaf.

• 1:07Speaker 03

  Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins.

• 1:14Josh Horowitz?

  Hey guys, it's Josh. Welcome to another edition of Happy Sad Confused. Today, we've got Dakota Fanning. It's kind of her first official visit to the podcast. We had her once way back when, but this is the career deep dive. That was way back in pandemic times. We don't talk about that conversation. This one is a great one. We talk about everything from the beginnings, I Am Sam, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, The Twilight Days, to her new film, The Sun Never Sets. Hey guys, thanks as always for checking out the podcast. Remember to hit that subscribe button, YouTube, Spotify, however you're doing it. That is your choice. I appreciate you guys as always for checking out what we do over here. Before we get to Dakota Fanning, quick reminder, check out our Patreon, patreon.com/happysadconfused, early access to all our episodes.

• 1:58Josh Horowitz?

  You can ask questions to our guests. You get merch, you get access to our live events in LA and New York, so much more. Patreon.com/happysadconfused. Okay, let's talk a little Dakota Fanning quickly before we dive into the conversation. Her new film, fantastic. It is called The Sun Never Sets. This is a small indie, it needs your support. It's got some great performances from her, from Jake Johnson, from Corey Michael Smith. It is directed by Joe Swanberg. If you don't know Joe Swanberg's work, especially with Jake actually over the years, they do this kind of semi-improvisational style, these dramedies, if you will. And this is kind of a relationship dramedy, I guess. And it's really Dakota's film though at the center. And she delivers one of her best performances. And I'm so happy for her.

• 2:43Josh Horowitz?

  It's something she's obviously very proud of, both the finished product, but also the very unique experience of making it. And we get into that in this conversation. But I was also just thrilled to have her dive deep into her entire career, which has been about 25 years. I think she's 31, 32 now. And she has been acting since she was just a little kid. I Am Sam was that first film. Her and Michelle Pfeiffer and Sean Penn, and then working with the likes of De Niro and Denzel and Tom Cruise. We talk about it all in this, including that evolution into, you know, being this acclaimed adult actor in all these great TV shows. She's Emmy nominated currently for All Her Fault. She was Emmy nominated for Ripley.

• 3:25Josh Horowitz?

  And of course, her work with Tarantino in recent years, a ton to talk to her about. And she's also like her sister Elle, a great supporter of the podcast, always has been. And always super, super fun to talk to, especially considering she just worked with Elle for the first time. So this is kind of her first extended chat, I think, about talking, about rather, working with Elle Fanning finally in their new film, The Nightingale, which comes out next year, which I'm very, very excited for. So that's what's coming up. Enjoy this conversation. She's fantastic. Here's me and Dakota Fanning.

• 3:59Josh Horowitz?

  Dakota?

• 4:00Speaker 02

  Hello?

• 4:00Josh Horowitz?

  It's good to see you. Welcome back to the podcast.

• 4:02Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 4:03Josh Horowitz?

  I say welcome back. This is, I feel like this is really the official.

• 4:06Speaker 02

  I think this is the official first. It's been on Zoom and you know.

• 4:09Josh Horowitz?

  We did pandemic times one, and that was like devoted to your passion for Almost Famous.

• 4:14Speaker 02

  Yes, correct. Which is still strong.

• 4:16Josh Horowitz?

  We can do a deep dive in that if you want today, but we covered a lot in that one.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  We did.

• 4:22Josh Horowitz?

  Congratulations on the new film.

• 4:23Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 4:23Josh Horowitz?

  We have a lot to talk about. Okay, first of all, I want to start the important stuff. I think I told you this, I did, I did try the margarita at Casa Vega.

• 4:32Speaker 02

  Oh, did you, the Dakota?

• 4:33Josh Horowitz?

  Delicious.

• 4:34Speaker 02

  It's delicious. Casa Vega is the best.

• 4:36Josh Horowitz?

  Casa Vega is the best. So for those that don't know, Dakota has a margarita immortalized at Casa Vega, iconic LA restaurant. This was iconic before you worked with Tarantino, but there's like the whole Tarantino connection too.

• 4:49Speaker 02

  And Christie Vega, who her father started the restaurant and she, she runs it now, is one of my aunt's best friends. So I've known Christie for like 22 years, like literally, like a long, long time. So it's a, it's a staple in our family.

• 5:13Josh Horowitz?

  Where, where on the list of career accomplishments do you rank the Dakota at Casa Vega?

• 5:18Speaker 02

  As a Valley girl, LA Valley girl, it is maybe number one. Like literally, yeah, it's, people, I get photos of that menu consistently. People are like, whoa, this is.

• 5:33Josh Horowitz?

  It's a good drink too. It's got a little honey in there, as I recall.

• 5:36Speaker 02

  A little honey, a little thyme. It's really good.

• 5:39Josh Horowitz?

  Come on, you have many accomplishments. Yeah, because I think Elle told me last time that you are a lady of the lake. That's what you're known as.

• 5:45Speaker 02

  I am a lady of the lake. Yes, I am.

• 5:47Josh Horowitz?

  Much like your buddy Kirsten, also a lady of the lake.

• 5:50Speaker 02

  Yes, she is also a lady of the lake. Yeah, the TL.

• 5:53Josh Horowitz?

  So yeah, a lot of accomplishments to celebrate today. Emmy nominations, two Emmy nominations. Congratulations on that. I also learned that you and Elle are going to be getting stars next year.

• 6:03Speaker 02

  We are.

• 6:03Josh Horowitz?

  On the Walk of Fame. Is that, is that meaningful? I mean, as someone that grew up in the business, like.

• 6:08Speaker 02

  We told our mom when we, we found out the night before and couldn't say anything, but we were like, well, we have to tell our mom. And so we called our mom together. We were all in different places and my mom started crying. She like burst into tears. I think it's just, that is such an iconic thing. And yeah, the first time I came to LA before I even started acting, you know, when it was just like, maybe I'll do some commercials or something. Like that's the main thing you do. You go to the Hollywood Walk of Fame and see the stars and find out where certain people's stars are and go take your picture with them. And so to have, to have Elle and I immortalized in that way,

• 6:53Speaker 02

  I think we're the first sisters to have the double star ceremony, which is very cool.

• 6:59Josh Horowitz?

  That's quick. Do you have any say on where it's going to be? Is it in front of like the Raising Canes?

• 7:03Speaker 02

  People keep asking. I have no idea. And by the way, outside Raising Canes would be great.

• 7:10Josh Horowitz?

  What's on the campaign now?

• 7:12Speaker 02

  Kind of ideal.

• 7:14Josh Horowitz?

  So the reason you've come in here today is to spread the good word of this great new film. For folks that don't know Joe Swanberg's work, a very unique kind of filmmaker, to say the least, The Sun Never Sets is the film, you're front and center. This is your movie. I mean, it's, it's kind of a three handle, but it's really your movie.

• 7:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, thank you.

• 7:31Josh Horowitz?

  You should feel very proud of it. I mean, you know as well as I do, like there, there's the experience of making a film, which can sometimes be great, sometimes be horrible. And there's the result of the film, which can sometimes be great and sometimes be horrible. It's very rare when it lines up and it's like, great experience, great product.

• 7:47Speaker 02

  Yes. I can't, I cannot stress enough how unbelievable the experience was. I mean, it was from the, the first time that I met Joe and Jake, we had a really long Zoom, the three of us. And it was just like we had known each other forever. And then making the movie and getting to know Corey Michael Smith. My sister knew him a bit from Sentimental Value. Cause he's in that. And so I had already heard great things about him. And then just the process of making it in Alaska, in Anchorage, Alaska,

• 8:29Speaker 02

  with Joe and Jake and Corey, and, and then Anna Conkle was, was there. And, and a part of it, she was incredible. Like it, it was so magical and it was one of those experiences that you need every once in a while to deeply remind you of why you love doing this so much. You know, because life gets crazy and it becomes about scheduling and about this and about that. And oh, should I do this or should I, you know, it's like.

• 8:58Speaker 02

  Not that I'm like some strategic person when it comes to like films or series that I'm a part of, but this was just like pure creative.

• 9:08Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, shakes up the process in the best way.

• 9:10Speaker 02

  Shakes up the process in the best way. If people don't know Joe's films, um, the script is not a traditional script. It's more of an outline, um, and a lot of it is improvised. Um, so that in and of itself is completely different from anything that I've ever done before. And I was, before I was, before I made it, friends of mine were like, when I was explaining that, if they weren't familiar with Joe's work, they were like, oh my God, like, are you freaking out? And I was, I was like, I, I was like, I am freaking out.

• 9:46Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 9:47Speaker 02

  But there was something in the back of my mind that was like, it's gonna be fine. Like, it's gonna be totally fine. And I didn't know what that, what that little voice in the back of my mind, like, why I was convinced that it was gonna be fine.

• 9:58Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 9:59Speaker 02

  Um, but it was Joe.

• 10:01Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 10:01Speaker 02

  It was Joe. That's why it was fine is because Joe is the greatest and, um, is leading you in a way where you're doing it and you don't even know that you're doing, you know what I mean? Like, it's just, it's really collaborative. And then Jake, of course, longtime collaboration going with Joe.

• 10:21Josh Horowitz?

  He's an absurd human being, though. He is like a silly man.

• 10:24Speaker 02

  Jake is the funniest person I have ever met. I, I actually genuinely, not exaggerating, I really think that he is.

• 10:31Josh Horowitz?

  He's top five for me. He just did, you know, he, I've told you about my dog show. He just did, he did my dog show. And it was.

• 10:37Speaker 02

  Were you crying?

• 10:38Josh Horowitz?

  I was sweating.

• 10:39Speaker 02

  Was your stomach hurting? Like, there were days, and because of Joe and Jake's history together and their friendship and, and both of their sense of humors, the combination.

• 10:49Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 10:49Speaker 02

  There would be times where I would be like, I'm, you have to stop, I'm gonna throw up. Like, you know what I mean?

• 10:54Josh Horowitz?

  Stop doing your bits, I can't.

• 10:56Speaker 02

  I am laughing so hard, I'm crying, my stomach is hurting, and I'm like, I can't breathe. I, I, and then not, and people say that, like, oh, that person's so funny. Like, oh my God, we were crying laughing. No, no, no. Like, I deeply mean that. Um, so getting to just be around that was so great. And then, yeah, making this movie that, and, and like you were saying at the beginning, like, having the result match the experience is, like, I really have a lot of gratitude for when that happens. And I love the movie so much. I really do.

• 11:33Josh Horowitz?

  So what is that like for you as an actor at this point to like, sit down in the theater?

• 11:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:37Josh Horowitz?

  You've had that experience so many, so many different times. And they've, and, and I'm sure every kind of experience where it's like.

• 11:42Speaker 02

  You're like, oh.

• 11:43Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, that's, was that the movie we made?

• 11:48Josh Horowitz?

  Um, do you still get butterflies? Is that a nervous day when you finally screen a movie?

• 11:53Speaker 02

  So with this, Joe, like, would, had sent us, like, his kind of assembly and like a rough cut because also the way that the movies are made in Joe and Jake's world, it's very equitable, like, we're all producers, so we all kind of were able to get on a Zoom and like chat about different things and be like, Joe, could you, I kind of miss that, like, funny thing. He's like, oh, let me, let me put it back in there. I'll show you, I'll just send you the scene, you know? So, of course, like, for me, I always defer to the director, like, the directors who I want their vision to.

• 12:27Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 12:28Speaker 02

  To be the thing that, that makes it, um, into the world. Um, but getting to be a little bit of part of, of that process was really fun. So I had watched it myself at home, um, and then I showed my mom and my sister, um, and they loved it. And then when it premiered at South by Southwest, that was the first time seeing it on a big screen with an audience, um, with other friends of mine that I knew would really like it. And, um, it was, it was really magical. Like, I can't wait to see, like, when it comes out, like, I'm for sure gonna go to the theater and watch it again.

• 13:05Josh Horowitz?

  I mean, it does feel like, like, you know, like, from my vantage point, you know, the folks like me, we kind of like, look at the career and you kind of like, you like, you chunk it out, you kind of like, figure out like, the different stages.

• 13:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:14Josh Horowitz?

  And like, you know, it, it kind of makes it math, which this isn't, obviously.

• 13:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, right.

• 13:19Josh Horowitz?

  But you kind of look at the last few years and it kind of does look like you're in this really cool, like, you've done a lot of amazing TV work.

• 13:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:25Josh Horowitz?

  Two Emmy nominations, you know, Ripley and All Her Fault, a lot of producing, working with Elle. This film, like, you know, it's, it's not as tidy as that, I know.

• 13:35Speaker 02

  Right.

• 13:36Josh Horowitz?

  But does it feel like a little bit like, yeah, I'm in a different kind of groove? Like, the last three or four years, I'm finding a different.

• 13:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:42Josh Horowitz?

  Lane.

• 13:43Speaker 02

  I think so. I think it does, for whatever reason, I don't even know why, you know? But, um, it does. And I think that I'm just, I think that I'm just going with, I've always gone with my gut, but I'm really going with my gut. And I'm also, I don't want to say that making this movie was like some big risky decision, but it was like a little maybe off the path of what somebody would expect me to do.

• 14:12Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 14:12Speaker 02

  Um, and, but, but, but in reality, that's, this movie and this character and this experience is actually like way more who I am.

• 14:24Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 14:24Speaker 02

  Do you know what I mean?

• 14:25Josh Horowitz?

  I've heard you say that. It's the nature of the collaborative nature, right? So this, this woman Wendy, like, you do connect with her more of like, not only the nature of the story, but like, literally the stuff that you brought to it, the ideas that you brought to the table, right?

• 14:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:37Josh Horowitz?

  So, without getting you on the couch too much, but like, what do you see, when you see Wendy on the screen, what do you see of yourself in there that you haven't seen before?

• 14:44Speaker 02

  I see a lot of myself. I see a lot of my, I see like, a really free version of myself. And I think because of the nature of Joe's process, you do end up bringing a lot of yourself because you're thinking of things to say on the fly. So what do you fall back on? You. You know what I mean? Like, so yes, as much as I, of course, am playing a character and there are differences between me and Wendy, I see a lot of my mannerisms, I see a lot of like, freedom in my face. Like, I don't know, I just like, when I'm, when I'm laughing in The Sun Never Sets, I'm laughing. Like, you know, it's, it's, um, and so I think people who know me who have seen it are like,

• 15:25Speaker 02

  it's fun for them to see the, the real me.

• 15:30Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 15:30Speaker 02

  Playing this character, you know?

• 15:33Josh Horowitz?

  More Happy Say Confused coming up.

• 15:40Speaker 00

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• 16:58Josh Horowitz?

  By nature of like, having done this as long as you have, since you were such a little kid, like, you know, little kids, I assume, aren't necessarily encouraged to improvise. Like, is, is that something that you've had, kind of had to like, relearn in recent years? Like, it's okay? Depends on the set, obviously, you're on a Tarantino set, you're not gonna be improvising.

• 17:14Speaker 02

  No, no, exactly. It's funny, though, when I did I Am Sam, the biggest takeaway from I Am Sam was that Sean improvised a lot.

• 17:22Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, really?

• 17:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I, right off the bat, learned, oh, I, you obviously memorize your lines and you know what's supposed to happen in the scene, but you have to still be present in the moment if somebody asks you, is it raining? And you're, you know, oh, it's written that it was supposed to be raining, but now it's not raining.

• 17:49Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 17:49Speaker 02

  You have to remember that. Like, you can't lie, you know what I mean? Like, well, actually, no, it's not raining. I mean, you know, whatever.

• 17:55Josh Horowitz?

  So like, literally in a nutshell, you got like, acting one of like, the ultimate, like, know your shit, but also be in the moment.

• 18:01Speaker 02

  Yes, I got a blast of that lesson at, um, seven.

• 18:06Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 18:06Speaker 02

  So, um, I've always carried that with me. And then, yeah, of course, like you said, like, probably not improvising on Ripley. You know, Steve Zalian has written those scripts and, um, and there's no need to. Like, I don't feel the need to. Like, I'm not somebody that feels the need to improvise.

• 18:24Josh Horowitz?

  Let me plus up your dialogue, Steve Zalian.

• 18:26Speaker 02

  Exactly, like, Steve, one second. Um, so, you know, there's a lot of times where it's totally not necessary and, um,

• 18:36Speaker 02

  But with this, it's inherent. We know with with the sun never sets, it was inherent. And yeah, I was I was I was like, literally the night before, I was like, oh, my like, trying to be like, okay, maybe I'll say that. And I was like, no, like, I was like, no, I was like, no, you can't do it. You have to just like, trust. You have to trust your own brain and trust Joe and trust Jake. And they had told me, something that did I would kind of go back to that would calm my nerves is, they were like, as much as the process is, the outline and the improv and the whatever. They were like, there will never be a time, I promise you, where you don't know what to say.

• 19:14Speaker 02

  Like, it's made like a normal movie. There's a call sheet. There's a schedule. Like, you know, you know, the intentions of the scene. And they were like, you will know what to say. Just trust us.

• 19:26Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 19:27Speaker 02

  And um, and that that became true, you know, pretty much right off the bat.

• 19:31Josh Horowitz?

  And you mentioned, like, you shoot this in Alaska. Like, the whole thing sounds like adventure. So like, you step off the plane, you're like,

• 19:37Speaker 02

  In a different world.

• 19:38Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. Where where would you rent? You've shot literally all around the planet. Where would this like, just from a physical standpoint, the the constant daylight, the whole thing?

• 19:46Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, this is this is like at the top of the list. Yeah, it's so unique.

• 19:53Speaker 02

  Obviously, the title of the film comes from the fact that it really doesn't get dark there in in the summer. And we were we were filming in June, pretty May, May and June.

• 20:03Speaker 02

  And definitely Jake did not care for the sun never setting.

• 20:09Josh Horowitz?

  He was quiet about it.

• 20:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, he was super quiet about it. No one really knew. And but I loved it. I was like, I just thought it was so neat. And Alaska was a place I never knew if I would get to like,

• 20:23Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 20:24Speaker 02

  Um, and I didn't really know exactly what it was like. And yeah, like you said, you step off the plane and it,

• 20:32Speaker 02

  how beautiful it is, is next level. I mean, you just you see, mountains and green and snow and clear water and whales and like moose and, I never saw a bear. I did want to, but I didn't see a bear.

• 20:50Speaker 02

  And yeah, and we were filming in Anchorage, but we also kind of went to other places too. We filmed in this place, Whittier, that sort of opens the movie filming in Whittier, which is a town that um, you get to through this tunnel that's, you can only go through the tunnel at certain times. And then, once you're through the tunnel in Whittier, you can only get out of Whittier at a certain time when the tunnel like allows.

• 21:17Speaker 02

  So yeah, it was just like, it was it was really amazing to film in in in Alaska. And I think what was also really fun was the people there were so willing to help and be a part of it and were so generous and really excited that we were there. And so that made it really special too.

• 21:38Josh Horowitz?

  Spoils you a little bit.

• 21:39Speaker 02

  Really, we were really spoiled. They're like, you can film here all night. We're like, no, no, no, it's okay. We don't need to. You know what I mean?

• 21:45Josh Horowitz?

  You're used to like LA, New York, where it's like, you have thirty minutes.

• 21:48Speaker 02

  You have to leave right now. And like, they were just like, so willing and and helpful. And it was it was really nice. Yeah.

• 21:55Josh Horowitz?

  Um, okay, so we do have the luxury of time. I promise we're not going to do every single. You have too many credits to talk through and we a long way to go back. You we talked a little bit already about I am,

• 22:03Speaker 02

  I am Sam, yeah.

• 22:04Josh Horowitz?

  Which, I mean, how fortuitous is it that that that kind of experience with Sean Penn and Michelle Pfeiffer is the first film experience?

• 22:11Speaker 02

  Pretty amazing, yeah.

• 22:12Josh Horowitz?

  Um, like by then, like, I guess this applies to a lot of the early experiences, like, you know, you're six, seven, eight, nine, you're working with these insane actors like, did you have a lot of awareness of who these people were at the time? Like, did your parents like say, by the way, this Sean Penn guy is a rare big deal?

• 22:28Speaker 02

  Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I I hadn't seen the full extent of Sean's work at six.

• 22:36Josh Horowitz?

  A lot of it's not. Not a lot of Pixar on there, not all.

• 22:42Speaker 02

  But I did know, I did, yeah, exactly. I did know that he was a super respected, serious, like, you know, movie star. Um, and same with Michelle, you know, um, same with Michelle. And so that sort of started me off. And then, yeah, then you would kind of watch. Like, I remember when I was young, I loved the movie One Fine Day.

• 23:02Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, yeah.

• 23:02Speaker 02

  Um, with Michelle, like, I just like, you know, so so then you you start seeing things and you're like, oh, my God. And then you and then now you fully realize who Michelle was and just like, oh, my God, being in that first movie with those two people is kind of amazing.

• 23:18Josh Horowitz?

  Like, are the early memories like conflated with the actual films? Because like, my my memories of being like a kid are very could get a little fuzzy sometimes.

• 23:26Speaker 02

  I think that because the experiences were so specific, it's it's like solidified my memories like so much.

• 23:35Speaker 02

  And it's all it's like, it is in chapters. Like, I know on I am Sam, I was six and I turned seven. And then I know the next thing that I did. And then I know, like, that by the next birthday, I was then going to do Man on Fire. You know, like, like, different. It's like, sort of in these chunks.

• 23:51Josh Horowitz?

  It's like equivalent to like a summer camp for me. Like, I went to, then I met this kid at this camp.

• 23:55Speaker 02

  Yes, and you know that that would have been before that other experience. So it's kind of like broken down in that way in my mind. But yeah, I people, people will say to me, like, I mean, do you even remember working with Denzel Washington? I'm like, uh huh, yeah, I do, of course. Like, what are you talking about? You don't forget that.

• 24:13Josh Horowitz?

  No. Where where do you hang again in your Pantheon of performances, really buckling down and delivering that amazing acceptance speech while being clutched by Orlando Bloom in two thousand and two?

• 24:24Speaker 02

  Honestly, that may be my peak achievement. Like,

• 24:29Josh Horowitz?

  Here's the photo. This is what you suffer for being around for all these years.

• 24:34Speaker 02

  At least you're not going to make me watch it, which people make me watch it all the time because they I it happened. I was just with my sister's boyfriend's family this past weekend. It's their favorite thing. Someone came over, a friend, they were like, have you seen it? You have to see it. They start playing it. I'm literally running down the hall of the house to get away from this video. I'm like hiding in the room. I come out, still not over, still talking. Orlando Bloom's shaking like a leaf.

• 25:03Josh Horowitz?

  You've had a lot of agents to thank.

• 25:05Speaker 02

  I had so many agents. I had Bob Shay from New Line. Like, I mean, I was like, I was, I thank God and my agents. God, then my agents. Unbelievable. Um, unbelievable. And by the way, remember it like it was yesterday. Remember it like it was yesterday. Was like, I have a lot of people to thank. And then at the end, my mom, dad, and my little sister, Elle. I mean, it was, it's it's so funny and I love it. I don't not like it, but like, listening to it sometimes, I'm like, oh, my God, oh, my God, it's still going.

• 25:35Josh Horowitz?

  When when you get your inevitable Emmy, you should just do the exact same speech and ask Orlando to come up and.

• 25:41Speaker 02

  When I when when I've um, run into Orlando over the years, I've seen him a few times actually recently, and we always talk about it. And uh, he's like, all right, come on, let's do it. I'm like, we're like, and I'm like, the critics' choice was is they're missing an amazing bit.

• 25:57Josh Horowitz?

  I'm a part of that group. I'm gonna.

• 25:58Speaker 02

  Okay, you need to put this up. They're missing an amazing bit.

• 26:02Josh Horowitz?

  It would break the internet. Okay, let's make this happen.

• 26:04Speaker 02

  Come on.

• 26:05Josh Horowitz?

  Do you remember being at the MTV Movie Awards and receiving? That was that was a major year.

• 26:10Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 26:11Josh Horowitz?

  That was the Gosling Notebook kiss year.

• 26:13Speaker 02

  Yes, yes, yes, I do remember. I was there. Was I just there once or was I just there? I was there with Tom.

• 26:21Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 26:21Speaker 02

  I was there with Tom.

• 26:22Josh Horowitz?

  I'm thinking about you won for, I think, Best Frightened Performance.

• 26:25Speaker 02

  Frightened Performance. That would have been that year. That was the first.

• 26:27Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, but you came for War of the Worlds as well, you're saying?

• 26:29Speaker 02

  I did, yeah. I think maybe we presented or we won something. I do remember it, though. It was like, Lindsay Lohan, Hilary Duff, like, Paris Hilton. Like, I was like, oh, my mind is exploding. Everyone's here. Like, I was just like, it was peak.

• 26:45Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 26:46Speaker 02

  Peak all of that. Never forget it.

• 26:48Josh Horowitz?

  Speaking of Tom, there's a recent photo I want to talk about. Can we look at this photo? So little reunion, you, Tom, Colin crashing the party.

• 26:57Speaker 02

  Yes, it was so fun.

• 27:00Josh Horowitz?

  And you got to be near Steven Spielberg's disembodied head.

• 27:03Speaker 02

  He was a popcorn holder of Steven's head. Yeah, it was um, a screening that Tom hosted for Disclosure Day at Steven's uh, Theater, Universal.

• 27:12Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 27:13Speaker 02

  And I was invited and I was like, oh, dying to see dying to see Disclosure Day. And then getting to see Tom, my mom came with me because she was there when we were doing War of the Worlds. She hadn't seen Tom in a long time. And um, Tom, my mom and I, we jumped up and down. We were so excited to see each other. It was amazing. And then we got this picture. And Colin, who I didn't really know, but Elle worked with on The Beguiled.

• 27:35Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, right.

• 27:36Speaker 02

  Nicest man on the planet, on planet Earth.

• 27:39Josh Horowitz?

  Like an angel on Earth.

• 27:40Speaker 02

  Nicest man on the planet. And he was with his son, who was the nicest kid I've ever met. I was like, struck by how nice he was. It was just like,

• 27:50Josh Horowitz?

  I know.

• 27:50Speaker 02

  unbelievable.

• 27:51Josh Horowitz?

  I know.

• 27:52Speaker 02

  I was like, oh, I I need to remember that and like, try and be that way for somebody else. I mean, literally, I was like, my mom and I were like, the nicest man we've ever met. It was crazy.

• 28:02Josh Horowitz?

  I want you to know, on the other end of that, I got a chance to do a Q and A with Spielberg here in New York when when he saw this photo. I was literally with him when he was looking at this photo. He was very touched by the whole thing.

• 28:13Speaker 02

  Good, good, good, good. Yeah, it's so sweet.

• 28:16Josh Horowitz?

  So are you still on? So obviously, you work with Tom, War of the Worlds. Famously, he would send you shoes every year.

• 28:22Speaker 02

  Still happening.

• 28:23Josh Horowitz?

  How many? What?

• 28:24Speaker 02

  I know. We talk about it. We talked about it. Then he was like, I'm gonna keep doing this. He was like, I love this tradition. I love the check in that we have once a year about it. He was like, I'm it's it's it's gonna keep happening. And I was like, I'll take him.

• 28:42Josh Horowitz?

  Every kind of shoe at this point? Like, do you have?

• 28:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, new, you know, whatever the new vibe is.

• 28:49Josh Horowitz?

  Do we think he's doing the research himself? Does he have a whole team?

• 28:53Speaker 02

  According to Tom, he is, he is involved. So he's involved.

• 28:58Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 28:59Speaker 02

  So I don't know. I don't know. I don't know the specifics. I don't ask. I don't ask.

• 29:02Josh Horowitz?

  Same thing like the Cruz cake list. You don't want to know the particulars. You don't know, like, you imagine he's delivering them himself.

• 29:09Speaker 02

  Everyone's like, everyone's like, do you get the Tom Cruise cake? I'm like,

• 29:13Josh Horowitz?

  You're OG.

• 29:14Speaker 02

  I'm OG.

• 29:15Josh Horowitz?

  Come on.

• 29:16Speaker 02

  I get the cake. Plus a little something extra. Couple of months later, my birthday's in February.

• 29:21Josh Horowitz?

  I've heard other things. Guillermo's told me he gets like a gingerbread house. There are different tiers.

• 29:26Speaker 02

  Well, I'm happy with the cake. I'm happy. I'm happy with the cake. I'm happy with the cake.

• 29:30Josh Horowitz?

  Well, you reunite with Denzel professionally. It would be nice to reunite with both Steven and Tom at some point.

• 29:37Speaker 02

  It absolutely would. It would absolutely. But it's also,

• 29:43Speaker 02

  you don't even know if you're gonna get to work with Steven or Tom once. I mean, you know, so so having the experience of both of them together, like, that I'll carry it for a lifetime, but it would be amazing, yeah.

• 30:02Speaker 00

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• 30:31Speaker 05

  You've got your favorite blanket, a freshly poured drink and a cold case burning a hole in your streaming queue. You're not just watching true crime, you're running the investigation from the comfort of your couch. Welcome to Murder She Watched, the podcast where we recap, dissect and slightly overanalyze some of the best and craziest true crime documentaries on our favorite streamers. Did the spouse do it? Why is the shady neighbor wearing leather gloves in July? Why did this guy agree to be interviewed in this documentary? We ask the tough questions that you're often just screaming at your TV. So every week we break down the twists, red herrings and absurd documentaries that have kept you up all night.

• 31:15Speaker 05

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• 31:32Josh Horowitz?

  Especially the early stuff, like you were like the kid getting like every major role it felt like at that time. Like, were you experiencing rejection? Like when I talk to a lot of like former, you know, you know, actors that were acting really young, it was a lot of like auditions and dealing with the rejection. Did you have to deal with that too? Or was it?

• 31:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, for sure. I mean, there was, when I first, when I first came to LA and you know, maybe doing some commercials and whatever, and you're going to these auditions for commercials or like little parts on a TV show or something. I mean, there were plenty of things that I wouldn't get all the time. And I would say, I think that why I've been able to maybe sustain and like handle the rejection or, or the disappointment that inevitably comes, you know? I would say to my mom, if I knew I didn't get something or whatever, I'd be like, oh, you know, they must've wanted somebody with brown hair. Like, you know?

• 32:31Josh Horowitz?

  Something out of your control.

• 32:32Speaker 02

  Something out of my control. Like I, I, I was like born with that thing of like just not absorbing, not absorbing it too much. And then of course, listen, there's been times over the course of the whole deal where you're disappointed or you know, you feel, you are, you, you feel like, oh, I really wanted to do that. That happens, but um, I've always been really good about like, there must be.

• 33:03Josh Horowitz?

  Something else around the corner.

• 33:04Speaker 02

  There must be a reason, you know? There must be a reason. And even if it's not obvious right in that moment, things become obvious later and you're like, man, if I hadn't done that, I wouldn't have done that and whatever. So I've always been pretty, I've always been pretty able for whatever reason to not absorb it into how I feel about myself. And I'm grateful for that.

• 33:27Josh Horowitz?

  It can be tough though, cause like especially when you're doing like the callbacks and stuff and it's like, you start to imagine a future, right? Like you kind of go down the road, like on the franchise side, then sometimes you're like, this is the next five, 10 years of my life.

• 33:40Speaker 02

  Totally. And then it's like, nope.

• 33:43Josh Horowitz?

  So was there, not to, again, not to dredge up bad memories, but was there anything that you came down the line for that was like, oh, this, this feels like meant for me. And then it just, it wasn't for whatever reason.

• 33:55Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 33:59Speaker 02

  I could think of one. Yeah.

• 34:01Josh Horowitz?

  It's okay. Time has passed. Dakota, get it out. Therapy.

• 34:05Speaker 02

  No, no, I can't say this one. I cannot say this one.

• 34:07Josh Horowitz?

  Wow.

• 34:07Speaker 02

  But um, but yes. And by the way, it's fine.

• 34:11Josh Horowitz?

  It's okay.

• 34:12Speaker 02

  It's fine. It's okay. Yes, it really is. It really is. It really is. But there's an element of being an actor and, and like, it's a little bit of like, it's inherent that like, you're gonna get a little heartbroken, you know? Like it's kind of, it's kind of a part of it. But I also, because of certain things that have happened, like a couple disappointments, like I do not rely on anything that I'm doing until I am there. Like, I'm like, well, I think I'm going to be working on this thing.

• 34:51Speaker 02

  Like I, my language around it is very specific because it's just healthier for me, you know?

• 34:59Josh Horowitz?

  Well, even you and Elle, I mean, The Nightingale, like.

• 35:01Speaker 02

  Oh, well, I mean, yeah, long journey. Yeah. Long journey to, to make that happen for sure. And asked about it all the time. That's the other thing. Then people find out about something and then you're asked about it all the time and you're like, I don't know. Like, you know, I don't know if it's gonna happen. I don't know. I'm not sure if it's gonna happen. But then it's exciting because then it's like, oh, wow, people really do want this to happen, you know? But yeah, making The Nightingale, we finished that earlier this year and.

• 35:28Josh Horowitz?

  So so much anticipation, not even from us. We all have anticipation, but for you guys, like you must've built it up so much. Like, what was the first day like? Did it feel like nerves, like in a weird way? Like obviously you couldn't be closer and this is meant to be, but put me in your head that first couple of days.

• 35:48Speaker 02

  Yeah. I think Ellen and I were nervous. Like we didn't want to admit how nervous about it we were because it was like the little intrusive thought of like, is this gonna be okay? Like, are we gonna be able to do this or is it gonna be weird? Are we gonna be laughing? Like, what is it gonna be like? But I don't think we wanted to talk about it too much because it was sort of that thing of like, oh, I think it'll be fine.

• 36:14Speaker 02

  And we really wanted to start, scheduling wise, things were really complicated, but it was really important to us that we started together, started the movie together, doing scenes together to just like see, yes, right away. And the first day, couldn't have been more normal. Couldn't have been like, that part of it couldn't have been easier. And I was like, oh, it's because we spent our whole childhoods playing together and making up these scenarios and like, that's how we learned how to act was like with each

• 36:57Speaker 02

  other in our playroom, making up the craziest stuff.

• 37:01Josh Horowitz?

  I was gonna say, whatever you're doing in The Nightingale can't compare to.

• 37:03Speaker 02

  It doesn't compare to me giving birth to Elle. Yeah, exactly. No, it doesn't. Like every time she tells it, I'm like, you have got to stop telling people about that. It sounds so weird, but like it wasn't, we just had, we had this, I'm not gonna go into too much detail. But literally it like we, we, that's how, that was our favorite thing to do. So it was just that on a bigger scale.

• 37:30Josh Horowitz?

  So no, you didn't have to like set any kind of ground rules of like, yes, we're sisters, but we're, we're actors together and like in, in the way that we were gonna kind of carry ourselves. It was just kind of like, you found like the way organically.

• 37:41Speaker 02

  I mean, we would joke about like, oh, Dakota can't boss me or you know, Elle would joke like Dakota can't boss me around and like, you know, blah, blah, blah. And I, and it was like a bit that we were doing and like, of course I wasn't gonna do that, you know? But then there were times where I was like, you're talking too loud.

• 37:59Speaker 02

  Like you need to be quiet.

• 38:02Josh Horowitz?

  And that was a bit or that was real?

• 38:04Speaker 02

  No, that was real.

• 38:06Speaker 02

  I'm just using it. I'm just like saying, but there were, there were some times where I was like, oh, I need to, I'm sorry to keep my mouth shut.

• 38:13Josh Horowitz?

  Were you really gonna deliver the line like that? Is that, that's how you're gonna do it?

• 38:16Speaker 02

  No, there was nothing, there was nothing performant, like there was nothing performance wise. I think that boundary was like very clear and there was nothing that I had to say. She was incredible. But yeah, there were a couple of times where I definitely was like, shh.

• 38:33Josh Horowitz?

  Big Sister can't stop.

• 38:34Speaker 02

  Can't stop, can't be stopped.

• 38:35Josh Horowitz?

  And when I spoke to her on one of the recent podcasts, like she was saying, again, so much was built up about you guys finally working together. And then she was saying, like, you guys are like, maybe we should just do a bunch of these, like, you know, like, and I don't know how serious.

• 38:47Speaker 02

  Yes, serious. Oh, yeah, we're serious.

• 38:50Josh Horowitz?

  Now the Band-Aid's been ripped.

• 38:51Speaker 02

  Band-Aid's ripped. It's like, why would we not like?

• 38:56Josh Horowitz?

  Play every permutation of Sister.

• 38:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. Like, keep collaborating it, like, every age and every experience.

• 39:02Josh Horowitz?

  Greg Vardens here in Kong, like.

• 39:04Speaker 02

  Exactly. Like, it's, we, I think, I think for so long it was like this sacred thing, and it is a sacred thing. And like, the first experience will always be the one that we just had. It will always be the Nightingale. And like, that was so important. But now, now that we've done it, we're like, let's do another one. Like, totally, you know?

• 39:22Josh Horowitz?

  Do you have one in, she mentioned something that she wanted Tony McNamara to write. Is that something that ever got off the ground?

• 39:27Speaker 02

  No, but I still, like, that's still, that's still percolating. There's another one that's still percolating. Like, there's, there's a couple. But I'm like, it's endless. Like, because it would, I also, we need to play sisters that hate each other and have a terrible relationship. Like, I, that would be amazing. Like, because again.

• 39:45Josh Horowitz?

  You're too excited about this. You're like a little bit.

• 39:47Speaker 02

  Because whether people believe us or not, I saw people, because we're working so much together and producing so much together, people really ask, like, do you guys really get along that well? And it's, you feel like you're lying. Elle and I could not be closer. I mean, like, our relationship could not be better, truly. Um, so, I'm like, let's do the opposite, like jealous, like, you know, totally like jealous, mean sisters. That would be so fun.

• 40:20Josh Horowitz?

  We're ready.

• 40:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:21Josh Horowitz?

  How many times have you talked or texted her today?

• 40:24Speaker 02

  Oh, all morning long, all morning long. I was asking her what I needed to wear. Like, I was like, I was sending her pictures. I was like, should I wear this or that or that? Yeah, I mean, we are so close. Saw her last night.

• 40:34Josh Horowitz?

  Um, okay, let me run a few other random crafts for the filmography.

• 40:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:39Josh Horowitz?

  Let's talk Twilight. I think I probably maybe even met you on the Twilight movies.

• 40:42Speaker 02

  For sure, for sure.

• 40:43Josh Horowitz?

  Was that a big deal for you to get New Moon to get Jane?

• 40:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a huge deal. It was like, all anyone was talking about. I was in high school at the time. I, um, I was homeschooled until I went to high school, and then I went to a regular high school. And it was like, the, everyone was obsessed.

• 40:59Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 41:00Speaker 02

  Um, so it was a huge, it was a huge deal.

• 41:03Josh Horowitz?

  You hadn't gone up for Bella prior, I assume. No, okay.

• 41:06Speaker 02

  No, I think I was, I was just a bit young for it. Yeah. Um, but, yeah, getting to, getting to play Jane was amazing. And that's where I met Kristen, who, you know, is one of my closest friends and, um.

• 41:19Josh Horowitz?

  Did you see that Rob recently compared his Odyssey character to Jacob in Twilight?

• 41:26Speaker 02

  I did see the clip where he was like, no one's team Jacob. I was like, oh my god.

• 41:33Josh Horowitz?

  Poor Taylor, after all these years.

• 41:35Speaker 02

  No, I know, I know. But people are team, some people are team Jacob.

• 41:40Josh Horowitz?

  I mean, no one I want to hang out with, but yeah.

• 41:43Speaker 02

  Rob's not team Jacob. That was clear. Yeah.

• 41:45Josh Horowitz?

  That's clear.

• 41:46Speaker 02

  Um, but, but no, I mean, it was just such a specific, like, thing, you know, it was.

• 41:51Josh Horowitz?

  To be in the center of that, because like, I covered those movies so much. I've never seen anything like it.

• 41:56Speaker 02

  They just had no clue it was gonna be that. They thought they did some little vampire movie, like, you know, and then going to Com- going to that Comic Con and being like, hit with the wave of the fans was super intense. So getting to be a part of that, um, for me, and I got like, kind of just all the good parts of it, because I was just a little character that was popped in, popped out, popped in, popped out. Um, so I didn't have really any of the pressure. I just got the kind of fun experience. So it was like, ideal, you know?

• 42:29Josh Horowitz?

  And then you mentioned Kristen, you got to work with her again for, I feel like more people should see. I really liked The Runaways.

• 42:34Speaker 02

  Same.

• 42:35Josh Horowitz?

  You guys did a great job with that one.

• 42:36Speaker 02

  Thank you, same.

• 42:37Josh Horowitz?

  And that must have been a meaningful experience. I mean, it's like playing real life figures, singing, the whole vibe of that.

• 42:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 42:44Josh Horowitz?

  Great Michael Shannon, come on.

• 42:45Speaker 02

  I know, I know. Yeah, it was really special. Filmed during the summer. I was fifteen. Um, it was right after I had done New Moon. So Kristen and I had met, and then we were going to do, you know, this movie. It was like, really fun to immerse yourself in that world of The Runaways. Joan was there a lot. Cherie was there a lot, getting to know them. Um, that was my, that was a summer camp for me, was The Runaways, you know, it really was. And,

• 43:20Speaker 02

  I really liked the movie. Yeah, I really liked the movie.

• 43:23Josh Horowitz?

  Was it a big decision? You came, you came here, NYU.

• 43:26Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 43:27Josh Horowitz?

  Like, where were you at in terms of like, career, personal life, like, I need to kind of like, stake a different, I don't know, like recalibrate, try something else out? I mean, where were you?

• 43:38Speaker 02

  I just wanted to move to New York, and my mom wouldn't have let me move to New York if I wasn't going to college. Um, and then also at the same time, it just was like a given that I would go to, I never imagined that I wouldn't go to college. Um, and I just really wanted the experience of living in New York. So that's sort of how it came about. I felt, it was, I was working and I was, I was working, but it was like, it felt like a bit of a quieter time, career-wise for me, because I was really focused on being eighteen, nineteen in New York and having those experiences. So, um,

• 44:20Speaker 02

  and I learned a lot during that time and really happy that I got that time to be a student and be, you know, going out with friends and like all that. It was, it's, wouldn't trade that for anything.

• 44:37Josh Horowitz?

  It does, again, let's go back to my earlier point of kind of like, you know, looking at the macro career and like, looking at the evolution, like, maybe this is a little bit later, but like, it does feel like twenty thirteen to twenty eighteen or nineteen. It's kind of like, it, you're working consistently.

• 44:53Speaker 02

  Yes, yes.

• 44:54Josh Horowitz?

  But it also feels like you, maybe you're trying to figure out, like, you know, you're kind of in a transitional age.

• 44:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think it was also like figuring, like, everyone else figuring out where to put me, even more importantly. I think that, I think the reason in the last few years that you probably, or people probably feel like, oh, there's like a group, I think because everybody is very comfortable that I'm an adult now. Um, and I think that the.

• 45:18Josh Horowitz?

  We can't keep pretending she's twelve.

• 45:20Speaker 02

  Right. So, and that, that, like, I really feel like that chapter is closed.

• 45:24Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 45:25Speaker 02

  And so when I'm talking about things that I did as a young person, it's

• 45:31Speaker 02

  deeply in retrospect, you know what I mean?

• 45:33Josh Horowitz?

  It's probably easier for you now, because like, there's a separation.

• 45:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think it was, it was always easy for me. It wasn't always easy for other people who perceived me as a certain age and whatever. So I think that is the reason why now it feels like groovier, because

• 45:53Speaker 02

  I just think it's now, like, I'm thirty-two years old, you know?

• 45:56Josh Horowitz?

  We can't deny it anymore.

• 45:57Speaker 02

  Can't be denied, can't deny it anymore. And so I think that I've found, like, I've, I've found a place as a, as an adult, as an actor, and everyone else has found that place for me also, you know?

• 46:09Josh Horowitz?

  Totally.

• 46:10Speaker 02

  Um, and so I feel like, yeah, those years were kind of that transition time where

• 46:19Speaker 02

  everyone was sort of catching up.

• 46:21Josh Horowitz?

  Do you see an evolution point in terms of like, you know, a lot of, especially for younger actors, it's, it's behavior more than like technique?

• 46:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:31Josh Horowitz?

  Like, where you can see a transition and, or remember even a transition of like how you approached roles and kind of, and, and, and, I mean, it seems like you were the anomaly, actually. I'm thinking about your earlier, you kind of always had technique.

• 46:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, I guess, I guess, but I, but I also, like, I still approach things the same way, which is,

• 46:55Speaker 02

  I don't do that much. Like, unless there's something that I need to learn, like, I kind of.

• 47:04Speaker 02

  I'm over familiar with like I know every I know everything that's happening in the script and like I learned my lines and then

• 47:11Josh Horowitz?

  Then you can be

• 47:12Speaker 02

  Then I can be there and then I can be in the moment and that's sort of what I've always done and I think that it does come from starting when you're young like It's only I just approached it as make believe And I still kind of approach it as as make believe and um Haven't really changed that I think for me like the technique is more of like How it's proper to behave what what be on set behavior and like like that professional thing I learned from So many people the importance of Being on time I don't want people to wait for me like those those sorts of things I'm very like rigorous about and um they I mean they haven't They also haven't changed but like that's where I feel like my

• 47:56Speaker 02

  Like the professionalism that I hope to inhabit I'm like that I've learned so much from from people that I've worked with Good and Bad I guess like everybody has their own style

• 48:13Speaker 02

  But yeah but in terms of like the technique as an actor I'm like

• 48:16Josh Horowitz?

  It's kind of

• 48:17Speaker 02

  I just kind of I just kind of try to behave how I think A normal person would behave given their circumstances like I just try and be as natural as possible

• 48:30Josh Horowitz?

  Easier said than done but yes yes um I would imagine you talked about like Professionalism on sets like special experiences we haven't even talked about Tarantino so let's talk a little bit about because that that's that's a marker that's a huge huge moment You kind of manifested it from what I gather

• 48:45Speaker 02

  I did I did I did

• 48:47Josh Horowitz?

  I don't know how often you do this is this something you've done a lot where you've like sent a letter to a director or kind of said

• 48:52Speaker 02

  No no no I've never that's what happened yeah I did I knew that he was Doing this movie didn't know a lot about what the movie would be but had heard From my agent that like there would be a role that would make sense for me but You know Quentin has his process with how he cast and who he wants to see and who he whatever And I was like I'm just gonna write him a note I'm just gonna write him a note and like See what happens if it if it isn't for this maybe it'll be for something else um and so yes I wrote him a note And

• 49:31Speaker 02

  He wanted me to to come in after reading the note and I had Dreamed of being in one of his movies but I had never told anyone like I just it was something in my own mind that I Just was like oh that'll be like the best and um Me saying how I like don't really prepare for anything now For this audition I prepared So intensely for this audition like I it was written what I was supposed to be wearing I was like I'm gonna wear that It wasn't like a dramatic costume it was like you know cutoffs and a tank top and I was like well might as well wear cutoffs and a tank top like I remember like

• 50:17Speaker 02

  I was like listening to like certain music from that time period like before I went to the audition I have never been more nervous In my whole entire life I was shaking like knees knocking together like I didn't know how I was gonna do it and then When I went in there Quentin Reads the scenes with you

• 50:40Josh Horowitz?

  Famously I know

• 50:42Speaker 02

  I didn't know that going in so that was I was that was a surprise and weirdly That put me so at ease

• 50:51Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah

• 50:51Speaker 02

  Because it then became like

• 50:55Speaker 02

  It wasn't like he's sitting in a chair like judging your performance he's like in the performance with you

• 51:01Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah

• 51:01Speaker 02

  And so I was like because that's my comfort zone is on a set and like Doing a rehearsal and acting that I can do that but sometimes auditions Feel so sterile and they feel like nobody's giving you any feedback and you just like walk in and walk out and you're like Well I don't know how that went so I expected it to be like that and it was the exact opposite it felt like Being on set like rehearsing the scene And um

• 51:31Speaker 02

  It put me totally at ease and uh and then yeah I got a phone I'll never forget getting the phone call that I got the part I was so excited Um and it's yeah one of the most special experiences I've had to this day really

• 51:45Josh Horowitz?

  I mean

• 51:45Speaker 02

  Truly

• 51:46Josh Horowitz?

  Electric on that set like I mean the stuff you get to do is pretty it's like

• 51:49Speaker 02

  Yeah it was I could have I would have stayed if they were like you have to keep coming back every day and do the same scene over and over again I was I would have been like done like I It was the epitome of what Making a movie can be like you know like really everyone is there to Bring the best version of themselves every cast member every crew member works with the same people a lot you know so there's a Like camaraderie that you you can't just create out of nowhere you know

• 52:22Josh Horowitz?

  How curious I'm so curious about this venture Tarantino movie

• 52:25Speaker 02

  Oh me too I can't wait I'll be first in line to see that I know I know

• 52:30Josh Horowitz?

  Okay a couple of the random things um you guys still working on the Paris Hilton series

• 52:34Speaker 02

  Still in development that's another people ask all the time I'm like I wish I had a better answer for people like something more concrete but It's you know In development and and still being worked on

• 52:49Josh Horowitz?

  Still don't know who if either of you or someone else is gonna play

• 52:52Speaker 02

  Still don't know still don't know it's like I feel like it's all kind of It'll depend it'll just depend on like lots of different factors yeah

• 53:00Josh Horowitz?

  Um what's the reality obsession today reality TV obsession

• 53:05Speaker 02

  Um I am watching I'm I weirdly hit this phase of my life which like I'm concerned about is like I'm Getting in the bed closing my eyes and going to sleep And not watching my shows

• 53:21Josh Horowitz?

  At least you're not reading or something

• 53:22Speaker 02

  What Like that it's like honestly freaking me out like getting in bed at night and being like I don't think I can turn My show on I'm like Forcing my I'm like no you that is who you are like that is who you are you can't lose that I have no this is this is actually the most concerning that's happened of late

• 53:45Speaker 02

  I have not started Big Brother yet

• 53:47Josh Horowitz?

  And you are devotee

• 53:50Speaker 02

  It is so disturbing that I have not started Big Brother yet like it It's upsetting me that I haven't started it yet

• 53:58Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah

• 53:59Speaker 02

  Um I can't even believe I'm admitting it like Julie Chen

• 54:03Josh Horowitz?

  Shameful

• 54:03Speaker 02

  Julie Chen don't worry

• 54:05Josh Horowitz?

  You'll be there

• 54:06Speaker 02

  I'll be there I will catch up like I will catch up I'm not watching any Any clips any TikToks any nothing I am like scrolling I can't I I don't know anything that's going on because I have to watch it

• 54:19Josh Horowitz?

  Be there when it's when you're ready for it

• 54:20Speaker 02

  There's so many episodes but yeah I but but I I will I can't I can't not not watch I I can't become a person who doesn't watch Big Brother

• 54:28Josh Horowitz?

  No it's a defining characteristic

• 54:29Speaker 02

  It's a part of my identity so um I will But um so that I'm watching Real Housewives of Orange County The Valley um

• 54:39Josh Horowitz?

  So you're still you

• 54:40Speaker 02

  But my I'm still me

• 54:43Speaker 02

  My favorite thing I've watched lately it's not reality but docu-series is The Dark Wizard

• 54:48Josh Horowitz?

  I don't know tell me educate me I love the title

• 54:51Speaker 02

  My god you gotta watch The Dark Wizard I hesitate to even say anything about it it's about a um a climber Like a kind of free solo climber yeah I don't want to say anymore it's it's life changing really is it's my favorite thing So I favorite favorite thing I've seen and L to L I told L to watch it L told people like it's it's incredible it's incredible

• 55:14Josh Horowitz?

  Kirsten has been working I believe with Jack Black

• 55:17Speaker 02

  He has yes

• 55:19Josh Horowitz?

  Has she relayed the I mean he probably knows by now the internet has told him

• 55:22Speaker 02

  He totally knows L and I were at the airport in a lounge and this woman came up who's like Best friends I think with his wife and L was like I'm so sorry like this has gotten out of hand and she was like no We love it like she wanted to take a picture she was like no no no we love it we think it's so funny but L's like gotten embarrassed about it I think like she revealed like Too much of her true feelings about Jack

• 55:46Josh Horowitz?

  It's too real

• 55:47Speaker 02

  She's made she's nervous that it's made him uncomfortable

• 55:51Josh Horowitz?

  I see

• 55:51Speaker 02

  But I don't think it has

• 55:52Josh Horowitz?

  I'm sure you guys have been in his presence before

• 55:55Speaker 02

  Only L L met him at the Golden Globes

• 55:57Josh Horowitz?

  Oh I see

• 55:57Speaker 02

  And took those selfies

• 55:58Josh Horowitz?

  Right You're gonna play it cool you'll be you'll be chill

• 56:02Speaker 02

  I'll be chill yeah I'll be chill

• 56:05Josh Horowitz?

  Cut to

• 56:09Josh Horowitz?

  Okay, we end every Happy Sad Confused with these profoundly random questions.

• 56:13Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 56:13Josh Horowitz?

  Dakota, you ready?

• 56:14Speaker 02

  Ready.

• 56:14Josh Horowitz?

  Dogs or cats?

• 56:16Speaker 02

  Dogs.

• 56:17Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. Your production company is?

• 56:19Speaker 02

  Llewellyn, our, our, our family dog, our, the best dog in the whole world. Yep, Llewellyn Pictures, named after her.

• 56:27Josh Horowitz?

  What do you collect?

• 56:31Speaker 02

  Um, shot glasses.

• 56:33Josh Horowitz?

  Nice. Favorite video game of all time?

• 56:36Speaker 02

  Never played a video game.

• 56:37Josh Horowitz?

  What?

• 56:39Speaker 02

  Never played a video game?

• 56:41Josh Horowitz?

  Like?

• 56:42Speaker 02

  Like, I mean, phone games, does that count?

• 56:44Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 56:45Speaker 02

  But not like with a controller.

• 56:46Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 56:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:47Josh Horowitz?

  Wow.

• 56:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:49Josh Horowitz?

  Okay. What about a phone game? Anything?

• 56:51Speaker 02

  Um.

• 56:53Josh Horowitz?

  Give us something.

• 56:54Speaker 02

  I'm really into, right now,

• 56:59Speaker 02

  so hard to describe.

• 57:02Josh Horowitz?

  So like the Dark Wizard of Games?

• 57:04Speaker 02

  It is a game where a, something

• 57:11Speaker 02

  comes up, like, let's say it's a clown face.

• 57:15Josh Horowitz?

  Sure.

• 57:17Speaker 02

  But the clown face is made of yarn.

• 57:19Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I'm with you.

• 57:21Speaker 02

  And you have to unspool each color of the yarn. I'm seeing nods, do you play this? Okay. Yarn Fever? It's called Yarn Fever? Yeah, that's what I play. And I can't even tell you the level that I'm on, it's like really bad. It's like really bad, but, but I will say,

• 57:42Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 57:43Speaker 02

  I only allow myself to buy the extra baskets for the, when, because you run out of space eventually in the yarn basket. The, the spools of thread can't, spools of yarn can't fit in there anymore.

• 57:56Josh Horowitz?

  Yep.

• 57:56Speaker 02

  And to unlock other ones, you need the coins and you need stuff.

• 58:02Speaker 02

  I don't allow myself to buy them, I mean, it has to be like, it has to be a situation where I feel like the game will not let me pass until I buy the extra basket, because I do think that they do that sometimes.

• 58:15Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 58:15Speaker 02

  So it's a really last resort, I will, I will get it on my own without buying the stuff. But yeah, I play Yarn Fever.

• 58:22Josh Horowitz?

  I've experienced where like there's a crazy person talking to you like in a Starbucks and you're just trying to like get, like survive. I just had that experience. It's like weather the storm, get, just let her say what she needs to say.

• 58:34Speaker 02

  I also play a game named Marble Sort, okay, where you sort marbles.

• 58:39Josh Horowitz?

  I'm sorry, I asked.

• 58:39Speaker 02

  I'm sick, yeah, I know, I know, I know, it's really fun though.

• 58:43Josh Horowitz?

  Another Dakota asked me this, Dakota Johnson asked me, would you rather have a mouthful of bees or one bee in your butt?

• 58:48Speaker 02

  I've seen it and I was thinking about, I was like, I wonder if he's gonna ask me this.

• 58:54Speaker 02

  It's gotta be, and, and I know this is what everybody, but it has to be bee in butt.

• 58:57Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 58:58Speaker 02

  It has to be bee in butt, yeah. Like, it's pretty clear cut for me. Yeah.

• 59:02Josh Horowitz?

  Agreed.

• 59:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:03Josh Horowitz?

  A wallpaper on your phone?

• 59:05Speaker 02

  Uh, my dog, Bunny. Yeah, yeah.

• 59:08Josh Horowitz?

  Last actor you were mistaken for?

• 59:10Speaker 02

  Elle Fanning.

• 59:13Josh Horowitz?

  How often is that, is that a daily thing?

• 59:15Speaker 02

  You know, most people, most people get it right, but it'll be Elle, and, and also Amanda Seyfried. I, and I, we, we, she gets it, I get it. This is a really great story. When I was in high school, the guy that I was dating, his mom said to him, "Oh, tell Dakota I can't wait to see her in Dear John." Because there was like a big, big posters for Dear John all over the place with Amanda Seyfried and it, so she knew me well and, um, still thought I was in Dear John, so. But by the way,

• 59:50Josh Horowitz?

  Great.

• 59:51Speaker 02

  Couldn't be a better person to be mistaken for, she's awesome.

• 59:53Josh Horowitz?

  Worst noted director has ever given you?

• 1:00:00Speaker 02

  Can you do it more like the kid in The Sixth Sense?

• 1:00:05Josh Horowitz?

  That's an all-timer, I love.

• 1:00:10Josh Horowitz?

  I hope this was like in the last like month.

• 1:00:12Speaker 02

  I wish, no, I was young.

• 1:00:14Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:14Speaker 02

  I was young. And I think at the time I said, "I don't think so."

• 1:00:21Speaker 02

  Or what does that mean? Like I said, I didn't just say yes, I was like, "I don't know."

• 1:00:26Josh Horowitz?

  More Haley Joel, that's what they always say.

• 1:00:28Speaker 02

  Haley Joel, more Haley Joel, yeah, yeah.

• 1:00:31Josh Horowitz?

  And finally, in the spirit of Happy Sad Confused, an actor who always makes you happy?

• 1:00:35Speaker 02

  Um, I am having the privilege right now of working with Stellan Skarsgård. And it is filling me with immense joy to be in his presence, uh, every day and get to have the experience of working with him after hearing of Elle's experience.

• 1:00:52Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:52Speaker 02

  And being the biggest fan in the world, so I'm gonna say Stellan.

• 1:00:56Josh Horowitz?

  Having covered that amazing film sentimental value last year and going through it with him and having him like, when I would see him at, at shows, like, even know, like, say, like, Happy Sad Confused, like in his accent, make me so happy. It made me so happy.

• 1:01:11Speaker 02

  He's just this, he's just the nicest, like, most wonderful man, yeah, yeah.

• 1:01:17Josh Horowitz?

  Sons too, Alexander's, he's a gem.

• 1:01:18Speaker 02

  I know, I know.

• 1:01:20Josh Horowitz?

  Um, movie that makes you sad?

• 1:01:23Speaker 02

  God, there's so many, I mean, I'm like a sucker for When the Dog Dies, you know, like a Marley and Me. I, I, I'm gonna freak out every time.

• 1:01:33Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:33Speaker 02

  Or, I've never, I've thought about watching this movie again and I'm like, I actually don't know if I can, I don't know if I can take it, Babe.

• 1:01:42Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:43Speaker 02

  I don't know if I can ever watch Babe again, it's so sad to me, but it's so good, but it's really sad.

• 1:01:49Josh Horowitz?

  Go right to Babe Pig in the City, go to the sequel.

• 1:01:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:53Josh Horowitz?

  And finally, a food that makes you confused?

• 1:02:00Speaker 02

  I guess, I, I see these clips when you ask people this question and they always say the same thing.

• 1:02:06Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:06Speaker 02

  They go, "Well, it doesn't make me confused."

• 1:02:09Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 1:02:10Speaker 02

  Why do you think they say that? Can I just ask, like, I just want to understand, like, obviously, it's not,

• 1:02:15Josh Horowitz?

  Well, I'm not, yeah, because I think they're misinterpreting that.

• 1:02:17Speaker 02

  They're misinterpreting.

• 1:02:18Josh Horowitz?

  I know you intellectually understand what the food is.

• 1:02:20Speaker 02

  Exactly. I, every time they go, "Well, I'm not confused by it necessarily," but it's like, well, obviously not.

• 1:02:27Josh Horowitz?

  I don't think you're an idiot.

• 1:02:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, we know, but it's like, so I, the way I interpret it, a few, a food that makes you confused is I'm interpreting like, "Why would someone ever eat that?"

• 1:02:36Josh Horowitz?

  Correct.

• 1:02:37Speaker 02

  Correct?

• 1:02:37Josh Horowitz?

  You win.

• 1:02:38Speaker 02

  Egg salad.

• 1:02:40Josh Horowitz?

  Million percent.

• 1:02:42Speaker 02

  What the hell? Why are people eating this? All the things on a menu. All wonderful sandwiches, meats, cheeses, prosciutto, mozzarella, uh, you know, even chicken salad.

• 1:02:58Josh Horowitz?

  I can't even do that, but yes.

• 1:02:59Speaker 02

  But, but,

• 1:03:00Josh Horowitz?

  Choosing, actively choosing.

• 1:03:02Speaker 02

  Chicken salad is like, totally fine compared, actively choosing egg salad?

• 1:03:08Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:09Speaker 02

  Are you okay?

• 1:03:10Josh Horowitz?

  You know who has a great bit on this? Do you know the, the comedian Todd Barry?

• 1:03:14Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:03:15Josh Horowitz?

  He's very deadpan.

• 1:03:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, is he passionate about?

• 1:03:17Josh Horowitz?

  He literally has a bit, my wife and I quote this to each other, it's so, he has this bit of like going to the diner and going through the entire menu and saying, "Give me some egg salad."

• 1:03:28Speaker 02

  Like, what?

• 1:03:29Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:30Speaker 02

  What?

• 1:03:31Josh Horowitz?

  Million percent.

• 1:03:33Speaker 02

  Don't eat it in public at least, for God's sake, keep it, keep it behind closed doors if you do like it. I'm just like, I, I don't get it at all. Come at me. Egg salad eaters? Try me, okay? I'm not gonna change my opinion on this.

• 1:03:50Josh Horowitz?

  Never change, Dakota.

• 1:03:51Speaker 02

  I won't.

• 1:03:52Josh Horowitz?

  Congratulations on everything, including The Sun Never Sets.

• 1:03:57Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:03:57Josh Horowitz?

  Honestly, one of your best, which is saying a lot, everybody should check it out. Um, and I appreciate you, I, look, the Fannings have been very good to me, you guys,

• 1:04:06Speaker 02

  Oh, Josh, you're the best.

• 1:04:07Josh Horowitz?

  Our fans of Happy Sad Confused, you guys have always been very good to me. You're always welcome, uh, it's always good to see you.

• 1:04:13Speaker 02

  Good to see you too, thank you.

• 1:04:16Speaker 03

  And so ends another edition of Happy Sad Confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts, I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley and I definitely wasn't supposed to do this by Josh.

• 1:04:35Speaker 00

  Do you love Disney? Do you love top 10 lists? Then you're going to love our podcast, Disney Countdown. Hi, I'm Megan the Magical Millennial.

• 1:04:42Speaker 06

  And biscuits, I'm Jeremy, AKA Jerindell, and we are the hosts of the hit Disney podcast, Disney Countdown.

• 1:04:48Speaker 00

  On every episode of our fun and family-friendly show, we countdown our top 10 lists of all things Disney. The parks, the movies, the music, the food, the lore, there is nothing we don't cover on our show, right Jeremy?

• 1:05:01Speaker 06

  Ooh, girl, you know we are famous for rabbit holes, Disney-themed games, and fun facts you didn't know you needed, but you definitely need in your life. So if you are looking for a healthy dose of Disney magic, check out Disney Countdown wherever you get your podcasts.