Pod Insights Fin vs History Pickles The Dog Didn’t Kill Himself (with The Upshot!) | The History of The World Cup (Part 2/4) About this episode This episode of Fin vs History is brought to you by Surfshark.
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The World Cup (Part Two)
The show for people who like history but don't care what actually happened.
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Chapters:
00:00 - Banned From Fortnite
04:43 - You’ve Ruined it
09:40 - Everyone’s Furious
15:50 - Shagging Every Moving Thing
20:59 - Vin Laden
23:36 - Brazil’s Hiroshima
27:13 - Japan’s Arse
32:28 - IQ of 70
38:37 - Pickles Knew Too Much
43:07 - They’re Animals
49:21 - Meat And Potatoes
54:06 - Soccer Aid
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Transcript 13,228 words · 8 speakers
0:00 Speaker 00 Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' healthcare to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the House Majority PAC dot com. Not authorised by any candidate or candidate's committee.
0:41 Speaker 01 Welcome back to Bin vs History. We're joined by Zach and Jack from the Upshot Podcast.
0:45 Speaker 02 Look at this, what an honour.
0:46 Speaker 01 Boys.
0:47 Speaker 02 To finally return the favour.
0:48 Speaker 01 Yes, we've all been on the Upshot Podcast.
0:51 Speaker 02 The only podcast in the world to have all three of us on.
0:53 Speaker 03 Oh yeah, we've had Charlie as well.
0:54 Speaker 02 Yeah.
0:55 Speaker 01 Yeah.
0:55 Speaker 02 How was it having Charlie on?
0:58 Speaker 03 It was entertaining. Charlie's an excellent guest. It was nice to get Charlie in front of the camera. We talked about a bloke who had a spike go up his arse, which was very much home turf.
1:06 Speaker 02 Sure.
1:07 Speaker 01 Home fixture for Charlie. This is part two of our World Cup series. You guys, terrific podcast, The Upshot. We were saying last episode, it's similar to this in that you pay a researcher and then put it in the bin and call whoever you're talking about a paedophile. Which is similar.
1:23 Speaker 02 It's a new genre of podcast.
1:24 Speaker 01 It's a new genre of podcast. The heavily researched, baseless paedophile accusation podcast. But you do sports. Now, we talked about the World Cup pre-war last time. We're going to kick off post-war now. Now, Germany and Japan had been banned from the 1950 World Cup.
1:42 Speaker 02 Why had they been banned?
1:43 Speaker 01 Well, I don't think-
1:45 Speaker 02 Was it because of the Holocaust?
1:46 Speaker 01 Yes. I don't think it's a long enough ban personally. It was banned for one tournament.
1:51 Speaker 03 Would it not have been better to force them to come and then destroy them? Because presumably-
1:57 Speaker 02 But what if they won?
1:58 Speaker 03 Yeah, I guess.
1:59 Speaker 01 The problem is, is that they win in 54. And the problem is, is that you look at what the generation of politicians were doing before that and their racial laws, and it's icky, isn't it, in the post that they win?
2:10 Speaker 02 What are you saying as an amateur?
2:11 Speaker 01 As an amateur eugenicist, I'm saying, I'm saying it's an icky result for the post-war consensus.
2:18 Speaker 02 Not icky for you?
2:19 Speaker 01 No, I'm enjoying it.
2:22 Speaker 01 You know, it's a culmination of my theories.
2:24 Speaker 02 For the average Joe, it might be icky.
2:25 Speaker 01 Yes, for the, for the, for the weak, lily livered average Joe. The fact that Germany win in 54, having pursued a 20 year policy of racial sterilization.
2:33 Speaker 03 It was sort of the antidote to 1936 Olympics, right? Cause that was, that was the one where they, they were basically trying to prove it. Prove that eugenics was, was right. And then.
2:42 Speaker 02 They got proven wrong. And so I guess, well, saying antidote, I like that because it's like saying 1936 was an aberration.
2:49 Speaker 01 A bliss.
2:50 Speaker 02 That was a bliss. And now we're back on track.
2:53 Speaker 01 1936 was a tragedy.
2:56 Speaker 01 1954, everything clicked into place.
3:00 Speaker 03 So how long's the ban? Six matches.
3:02 Speaker 01 Genuinely, it seems that, well, so there's not a tournament for, so end of World War II, 45. There's then the next tournament is 1950 in Brazil, which we'll deal with shortly. But that, yeah, Germany and Japan are banned for one World Cup cycle. For committing the Holocaust.
3:18 Speaker 03 Yeah.
3:19 Speaker 01 It, it doesn't feel like enough.
3:21 Speaker 02 Well, I think they should play, but they should have some sort of disability. Either they do it in blindfolds.
3:26 Speaker 01 Yes.
3:26 Speaker 02 They do it dead or like, like, I don't know. Or they, they have it like it's a three legged race thing. Like they have to be in potato sacks.
3:33 Speaker 01 Well, they have to do it with less players.
3:34 Speaker 02 And they play against Israel, Israel win 20-0. Like that could be like a nice.
3:39 Speaker 03 Cause even so, right now Russia, Russia's banned, right?
3:42 Speaker 01 Is it?
3:43 Speaker 03 I think, I think Russia are.
3:44 Speaker 01 From the World Cup.
3:45 Speaker 03 They're banned from the World Cup and banned from the Euros.
3:47 Speaker 01 Well, that's a disgrace.
3:48 Speaker 03 Cause this, I think it's been like, now it's been a few, a few tournaments that Russia's been out for.
3:52 Speaker 01 Can you just Google what, how many tournaments Russia have been banned for currently? Because they have not committed the Holocaust.
3:57 Speaker 02 They're just protecting their.
3:58 Speaker 03 It's a longer ban.
3:59 Speaker 02 Putin's just protecting his national security.
4:03 Speaker 01 It's his western border. There's a special operation on his western border.
4:06 Speaker 03 It's just a special operation.
4:07 Speaker 01 It's a special, it's a police managing situation on his western border. So, uh, hang on, FIFA and UEFA have lifted their ban on Russian under 17 teams.
4:15 Speaker 02 I guess it's not their fault.
4:16 Speaker 03 No.
4:17 Speaker 02 The youth, you can't blame the youth.
4:18 Speaker 01 My problem is that if you ban, if you ban a country for one World Cup for committing the Holocaust. Then what does a ban mean anymore?
4:26 Speaker 03 Hmm.
4:27 Speaker 01 There's also.
4:28 Speaker 02 Cause that's like the naughtiest thing you can do.
4:29 Speaker 01 That's the naughtiest thing you can do.
4:31 Speaker 02 But how long a ban would you give them then?
4:33 Speaker 01 Well, I don't know, a generation.
4:35 Speaker 02 Yeah.
4:36 Speaker 01 You wouldn't abandon them. I would have made them hoard the tournament in the camps.
4:42 Speaker 03 Right, yeah, but also like Mudryk, you know, Mikhail Mudryk, the Chelsea player, he's just got a full year ban.
4:49 Speaker 04 Has he?
4:50 Speaker 03 For potentially doping, but I mean, it's not even, it's not even entirely
4:55 Speaker 01 That's a Holocaust-length ban.
4:56 Speaker 03 Exactly.
4:58 Speaker 03 I know, I actually know what Mudryk gets up to in his spare time, so maybe they know more than we do.
5:03 Speaker 04 He was banned from Fortnite as well, isn't he? Or Counter-Strike?
5:05 Speaker 03 He got banned from Counter-Strike.
5:06 Speaker 04 Did he?
5:07 Speaker 02 Was he doping playing that?
5:09 Speaker 04 Quite possibly, yeah. Those finger muscles, they never look stronger.
5:13 Speaker 01 So Germany and Japan are banned from 1950, but in 1954, they're back into the fold.
5:19 Speaker 02 Yeah, but this is West Germany.
5:22 Speaker 01 West Germany.
5:23 Speaker 02 It's a different Germany.
5:23 Speaker 01 Yes, that is true.
5:24 Speaker 02 It's jeans Germany, not cabbage Germany.
5:27 Speaker 01 Supposed to cabbage Germany, yeah, sorry. It's jeans versus cabbage. Ultimately, it's a 40-year war and jeans win just.
5:36 Speaker 01 So I suppose Berlin now is a melting pot of denim and cabbage.
5:39 Speaker 02 Yeah, I guess that's what gives it that distinct flavour.
5:45 Speaker 01 So the miracle of the burn, Switzerland 1954. Now, this is the era of the Hungarian team, supposedly the greatest, the mighty Magyars.
5:54 Speaker 02 Is that pushcast then?
5:55 Speaker 01 This is pushcast.
5:56 Speaker 02 Right.
5:57 Speaker 01 And again, this is the 50s football, so you know, total football means passing sideways.
6:02 Speaker 02 Yeah.
6:02 Speaker 01 So for us now, it's still like shit.
6:04 Speaker 04 Yeah, it's two at the back, isn't it though?
6:06 Speaker 01 Is it?
6:07 Speaker 04 Yeah, it's like almost no defenders.
6:08 Speaker 02 They're basically wearing ski boots down the wing, that's sort of the thing, right?
6:12 Speaker 03 54, this was, there was in the, in the semi-final, one of the, it was Uruguay against Hungary, and one of the Uruguay players scored a goal and then had a heart attack when he was celebrating. And they like, they resuscitated him, sent him back on and he scored again.
6:27 Speaker 02 I mean, that's what, that's the greatest celebration.
6:28 Speaker 01 That's a real man, man.
6:29 Speaker 02 I mean, that's an amazing celebration to die, we bought hearts alive and go, that's incredible.
6:34 Speaker 03 I think you could do that on FIFA now.
6:35 Speaker 01 Now it's fucking Italians diving at someone brushing past you. He had a heart attack.
6:40 Speaker 04 Christian Eriksen looking quite sick.
6:41 Speaker 02 Exactly. Get back out there.
6:44 Speaker 01 Get on with it, son. Moamba, lazy. Always said he's lazy.
6:48 Speaker 02 He never got back, he never even came back.
6:50 Speaker 01 He never played again, though, also on score.
6:52 Speaker 02 I'm sorry to slag off Moamba, but he wasn't the best player. I think he probably was using that as an excuse to end his career, but he didn't.
7:00 Speaker 01 So like when you-
7:01 Speaker 02 I wanna attack, Fabrice Maramba has not had enough.
7:04 Speaker 01 No, he's had it coming for a while actually. Fabrice Maramba, right?
7:08 Speaker 02 I'm sick of Fabrice Maramba.
7:09 Speaker 01 He's watched a charity cooking sauce, does this man have no shame? Okay, you know when you got fouled at school? Or no, rather you made a fuck up and you misplaced pass, you went ah and you went down. You're saying that's what Fabrice Maramba did?
7:24 Speaker 02 I'm saying that when he came to, he was like, I might as well end it here because I don't actually have a lot left of my cramp. Was he playing for Bolton?
7:31 Speaker 03 He was. Bolton went down the next couple of years. Styles were changing, playing were changing, you know, Pep Guardiola, he's got a passing problem. Probably not gonna be able to keep up.
7:38 Speaker 02 Oh no, really? It's alright Fabrice, do me a favour.
7:43 Speaker 01 Get up mate, come on. Yeah, the ultimate dive, Fabrice Maramba.
7:49 Speaker 01 Yeah, so-
7:50 Speaker 02 So the Knights didn't get to enough for the Holocaust, that they were like, Fabrice, that's the real villain.
7:55 Speaker 01 Fabrice Maramba should have been banned for life after that.
7:57 Speaker 03 That's two tournaments.
7:58 Speaker 01 Two tournament bans.
8:02 Speaker 01 So, yeah, now, the Magyars, what we'll realise as we go through is that every World Cup has a team that's never won it, that's like the greatest team that ever won the World Cup. This is probably the first iteration, it's the Hungarians in the 50s. They were the first team to beat England in England.
8:19 Speaker 02 Right.
8:20 Speaker 01 6-0 at Wembley.
8:22 Speaker 02 But this is the big change because we don't, we think it's embarrassing that other people are playing football and you're like, you're taking it too seriously, it's a game for amateurs, they're taking it professionally. And we think we're better than everyone, right? Until they come and absolutely spank us.
8:33 Speaker 01 Yes.
8:34 Speaker 02 That was the 6-0, was it?
8:35 Speaker 01 Yeah.
8:35 Speaker 02 Yeah.
8:36 Speaker 03 Infamous. Yeah, it's basically, that's sort of the way it goes with all of our sports, right? Cricket, football, all the other ones.
8:43 Speaker 02 The French will make a federation and we're like, that's gay, we're not joining that.
8:46 Speaker 03 You ruined it.
8:47 Speaker 01 You ruined it.
8:48 Speaker 02 Yeah.
8:48 Speaker 01 So-
8:49 Speaker 02 And they batter us.
8:50 Speaker 01 Then you have a guy called Fritz Walter, who is the captain of the German team, West German team. And he-
8:58 Speaker 02 Not Joseph Fritzl, Charlie.
8:59 Speaker 01 Joseph Fritzl, thank you Charlie, not Joseph Fritzl.
9:00 Speaker 02 It's an easy mistake to make.
9:02 Speaker 01 Well, he's cut from the same cloth.
9:04 Speaker 02 Yes.
9:04 Speaker 01 He had contracted malaria during World War II, which means that he is more comfortable playing in the rain. And also-
9:12 Speaker 02 Why?
9:13 Speaker 01 Hey?
9:14 Speaker 02 Why?
9:14 Speaker 01 I don't know. Why are you asking me? I don't know.
9:18 Speaker 03 A decade later, he's still, he's still in the same world.
9:21 Speaker 01 This is what the research says.
9:22 Speaker 03 Is that cooling the fever?
9:25 Speaker 01 Don't ask me to explain why malaria makes you better in the rain.
9:29 Speaker 02 Okay.
9:29 Speaker 01 Because actually it doesn't make sense.
9:30 Speaker 02 I don't really know what malaria does.
9:32 Speaker 01 Because there's not a lot of Southeast Asians playing football in Scotland.
9:36 Speaker 02 Yes.
9:37 Speaker 01 Yeah.
9:37 Speaker 02 You destroyed that with truth and logic.
9:42 Speaker 01 Malaria can make you thirsty. Thank you, Charlie. Where would we be without you?
9:46 Speaker 02 Oh, so you mean it's the hydration?
9:48 Speaker 01 Right. Anyway.
9:49 Speaker 02 Cheryl Cole had malaria. That's one thing I know.
9:51 Speaker 01 Cheryl Cole had malaria?
9:53 Speaker 02 Yeah. Do you not know about this? How do you not know that Cheryl?
9:55 Speaker 01 I'm a straight man with a morbid. I'm not keeping up with Cheryl Cole's diseases.
9:59 Speaker 02 Not Cheryl Cole's over at Food Charlie, it's incredible.
10:01 Speaker 01 No, come on, listen. It's also the first tournament.
10:03 Speaker 02 Sunday roast dinner.
10:04 Speaker 01 Likes a roast. It's also the first dinner, first dinner. It's also the first tournament where Adidas have made boots for the Germans. Now, Addy.
10:13 Speaker 02 Naughty.
10:14 Speaker 01 Addy's the naughty one, I believe. Can we just double check that? Adolf is. So Adolf Dassler was a Nazi party member, a card-carrying Nazi.
10:23 Speaker 02 Yep.
10:23 Speaker 01 Fell out with his brother, Rudolf, who went to make puma.
10:27 Speaker 02 Yep.
10:27 Speaker 01 Because Rudolf was a traitor.
10:30 Speaker 02 Yeah.
10:30 Speaker 01 And so they rightly cut contact with him and cut ties. Communist. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Straight to cul-de-sac. And then Adidas, you know, again, the West Germans are like, well, let's pick the Nazi one. He made longer, they made longer studs for the German team so they could play better in the rain. This is all called the miracle of the burn.
10:50 Speaker 02 Okay.
10:51 Speaker 01 So he cheated. They had longer studs. Yeah, of course. This episode of Finn vs. History is brought to you by our dear friends at Surfshark.
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13:41 Speaker 01 And so they beat Hungary in the final, having Hungary had wiped everyone. I think Hungary had beaten West Germany 8-3 earlier in the tournament, then they beat them in the final. And this is the beginning of the Germans just sort of being this ultimate killjoy of the pure, of the kind of pure footballing countries, which we'll see.
14:00 Speaker 02 The way they organise and just steamroll countries.
14:03 Speaker 01 They're an organised nation. Why is that? Well, let's look 10 years previously.
14:07 Speaker 02 Sure. Well, that energy has to go somewhere.
14:09 Speaker 01 The energy has to go somewhere.
14:11 Speaker 03 Longest studs doesn't seem like a particularly massive innovation. No one, no one, no one had thought of that before.
14:17 Speaker 02 Yeah, but someone who only invented passing sideways like two years earlier, like this is like trying.
14:23 Speaker 01 They were wearing hiking shoes before this.
14:25 Speaker 03 There's blokes in suit, you know that record score 36-0 in Scotland? And one of the teams stand up in suits, three-piece suits and just smart shoes.
14:33 Speaker 02 Amazing.
14:33 Speaker 03 36-0.
14:34 Speaker 01 They were playing in three-piece suits.
14:36 Speaker 02 Who won?
14:36 Speaker 03 The team in football.
14:40 Speaker 03 Wasn't it in the, I don't know, maybe he talks about this in the last episode, but the 1930 World Cup, where the Bolivians or something played in berets?
14:48 Speaker 02 Really? I didn't know that.
14:49 Speaker 03 Yeah. And I think the refs had suits and ties as well.
14:53 Speaker 01 Is this the one where India are invited to play, but they're not allowed to play barefoot? So they don't come.
14:58 Speaker 02 Yeah, but isn't, yeah.
14:59 Speaker 01 And also their chef wasn't allowed to cook meals with their feet either. So they were like, well, we're not, I can't come then. That's the 1950s.
15:05 Speaker 03 I don't think anyone even asked India. They just said, oh, you'll probably want to be barefoot. Don't bother coming.
15:10 Speaker 01 So anyway, so the, now this is also the first time, 1954, that the German national anthem is played publicly.
15:16 Speaker 02 Was it the new one?
15:19 Speaker 01 Yeah, but the old instincts kicked in. And then the press, when they win, the press go mental, like not even just the Daily Mail, like in Denmark. They were all like, oh, well, the only thing that was missing was Z-Kyles at the trophy being lifted. Everyone's furious.
15:33 Speaker 02 Right, yeah. It's embarrassing.
15:35 Speaker 01 It is embarrassing because it's a repudiation against the United Nations and the end of eugenics.
15:40 Speaker 02 Right.
15:41 Speaker 01 And so no one knows what to make of it.
15:43 Speaker 03 So did they, so is it a brand new anthem or did they just change the lyrics?
15:46 Speaker 01 I think it's just they missed out a few words.
15:49 Speaker 03 Yeah, because it's a pretty dodgy, pretty dodgy stuff.
15:51 Speaker 01 And also is this where they talk about the Fuhrer Prinzip as well? There's the, the coach talks about like, when he's coaching them, talks about, basically says, do it for the Fuhrer.
15:59 Speaker 02 Well, yeah, that's.
16:02 Speaker 02 And they did. That's the leader prince, but does he mean Führer as in Hitler or the idea of the leader?
16:07 Speaker 03 Like the manager.
16:07 Speaker 02 Yeah.
16:08 Speaker 01 This is the defence that he makes. He goes, no, I just meant Führer in a general sense. And we're like, guys, it's 1954.
16:13 Speaker 02 The royal Führer.
16:15 Speaker 01 Yeah, the royal Führer. It's 1954, you know, Hitler still cast a long shadow.
16:20 Speaker 03 Yeah.
16:21 Speaker 01 But mainly.
16:22 Speaker 02 Hitler's still a young man in Argentina at this point.
16:24 Speaker 01 Of course, yeah. He's nailing Kattinga on the beach.
16:29 Speaker 01 But mainly, mainly when you talk about Brazil, that's what this sort of story is about.
16:34 Speaker 02 Also, as we're going through, I guess the thing that's becoming clear is every World Cup is controversial. Every World Cup is corrupt.
16:39 Speaker 01 Yes.
16:40 Speaker 02 And if we're trying, we're trying to find any World Cup that is not deeply political.
16:44 Speaker 01 Yeah.
16:44 Speaker 02 1954 failed.
16:46 Speaker 01 Failed.
16:47 Speaker 02 Deeply failed.
16:47 Speaker 01 It's the re-appelitation of the Holocaust.
16:51 Speaker 01 And they call that the miracle of the burn, which is an awful name.
16:56 Speaker 01 So let's talk about Pelé. Have you guys done Pelé on the upshot?
16:59 Speaker 03 We've done him in bits, not dedicated.
17:01 Speaker 01 Why have you got a naked fuck me? Look at his hog.
17:04 Speaker 03 Yeah, he's a big shagger.
17:05 Speaker 07 That's him and Franz Beckenbauer, apparently.
17:07 Speaker 01 And some other guys.
17:08 Speaker 03 Do they all just shower together, the different teams after the game?
17:12 Speaker 02 That's nice.
17:12 Speaker 03 That's Pelé's cock.
17:13 Speaker 01 Well, if you're listening, Charlie's just found a photo of Beckenbauer and Pelé in the shower.
17:17 Speaker 07 And this is Bellini as well.
17:19 Speaker 01 Who's?
17:20 Speaker 02 Ooh, look at that rug.
17:22 Speaker 03 That's a 50s rug.
17:23 Speaker 07 That's Pelé and Bellini.
17:24 Speaker 01 Okay, who's Bellini?
17:26 Speaker 07 Don't know.
17:26 Speaker 01 Right, it's just a naked guy.
17:30 Speaker 07 You know about Bellini.
17:33 Speaker 02 I do now.
17:34 Speaker 01 I will say about, if you go back to the first photo, what I will say is that Pelé's got a nice hog. Beckenbauer is thick.
17:41 Speaker 02 Wait, wait, where's the thick?
17:43 Speaker 03 That's his arse, isn't it?
17:45 Speaker 01 Hey?
17:45 Speaker 02 What are you seeing?
17:46 Speaker 01 No, I'm saying like his bum and his waist is like a thick, like he's like a lady.
17:51 Speaker 02 He's juicy, he's got a juicy like.
17:52 Speaker 01 I'm attracted to Beckenbauer's arse. That's the Kaiser. He's like a Renaissance nude. He's got, he's got similar sized thighs to me.
18:01 Speaker 02 Yes, all right, yeah.
18:01 Speaker 01 People always criticize me for my Amazonian thighs.
18:06 Speaker 01 There are lots of gay men in the comments asking me, asking to be suffocated by my thighs. There are no women. We've said this before.
18:14 Speaker 02 But now you can understand.
18:15 Speaker 01 Now I'm seeing Beckham about his thighs.
18:17 Speaker 03 I think, I think this is something that's changed from football then to now. I can't imagine Cole Palmer stripping off in the shower. Yeah. I think he's quite, he's gonna be quite prudish.
18:26 Speaker 02 But his knob has like, it's like a mouth breather.
18:30 Speaker 03 Yeah.
18:30 Speaker 01 I think, I think, I think it's the wrong way around. I think, I think he's a mouth breather, but his knob is one of the most articulate philosophers of this time, of this generation.
18:37 Speaker 02 Right. So it's all, yeah, you want it the other way around.
18:39 Speaker 01 All the brain's gone to his cock.
18:40 Speaker 02 Right. Well, can we get Pele's, let's see what Pele did with that knob. Can we get his quote about sex?
18:47 Speaker 01 What have you got, what did you guys find out when you did, on your podcast, you do deep dives on sporting figures?
18:52 Speaker 03 Yeah. So Pele nonce, obviously.
18:55 Speaker 01 Nonce?
18:55 Speaker 03 Well, borderline nonce. Forty-one with a seventeen-year-old girlfriend.
18:59 Speaker 02 Stuff on this podcast.
19:00 Speaker 01 That's not a nonce.
19:01 Speaker 03 No, that's just fair. It's cricket.
19:02 Speaker 01 That's cricket.
19:03 Speaker 02 Wait, fourteen, fourteen.
19:04 Speaker 03 Seventeen.
19:05 Speaker 01 Forty-one for seventeen.
19:06 Speaker 03 Forty-one, seventeen. Jerry Seinfeld stuff.
19:07 Speaker 01 Devastating bowling figures, seventeen to forty-one.
19:10 Speaker 03 Yeah, decent. And face of Viagra.
19:12 Speaker 01 Yes, we know that, yeah.
19:13 Speaker 03 And he's got the Boris Johnson thing. He won't, I mean, he's dead now, but he wouldn't say how many kids he has.
19:19 Speaker 01 Yes.
19:19 Speaker 02 Yeah, but it's important to keep your cards close to your chest. It gives you a lot of power.
19:22 Speaker 01 Yes, it does.
19:23 Speaker 02 If you, no one knows how many kids you have, I think that gives you a very strong hand. Cause no one knows when one of your kids might come out of the woodwork.
19:30 Speaker 03 There was, there was one a few years ago, this, this woman, it was after Pele died. She popped up and was like, yeah, my mum shagged Pele back in the seventies or something.
19:38 Speaker 01 Yeah.
19:38 Speaker 03 And she was trying to get him dug up.
19:40 Speaker 02 Oh my God.
19:41 Speaker 01 Dug up.
19:41 Speaker 02 No, no, no, no, it was an amazing headline. Go exhume Pele. Exhume Pele, Daily Mirror headline, it's a tabloid, it's one of the funniest headlines. Where they were basically started a petition to exhume Pele, to prove that, do you have it up?
19:57 Speaker 03 It's also like, he, he's been alive. He lived till like eighty-six or something like that. And it's like, you could have, you could have approached him earlier.
20:04 Speaker 02 So dig up Pele.
20:06 Speaker 07 There's something about his.
20:07 Speaker 02 Dig up Pele headline.
20:08 Speaker 07 A woman claiming to be Pele's secret daughter wants the football legend dug up.
20:11 Speaker 01 Woman claiming to be Pele's secret daughter wants football legend dug up for paternity test.
20:14 Speaker 03 Don't think it got many signatures, the old petition.
20:16 Speaker 02 Yeah, it's just, it was, the way they phrased this headline, but there's just something so funny about like a riot to it. Let's exhume Pele. Hashtag exhume Pele.
20:27 Speaker 03 Is there a picture of her? There is a resemblance, you've got to say.
20:31 Speaker 04 But I mean, he was the face of Viagra, so, you know, get in line. There's going to be a lot of love.
20:35 Speaker 01 Thing is though, if you're the face of Viagra, you are going to be, you are going to be tarred with nonce accusations.
20:42 Speaker 04 Especially if you've got a 17 year old girlfriend.
20:44 Speaker 01 Well, that's by the by, that's relevant. Age is just a number.
20:47 Speaker 02 Yeah, it'd be hard to be the face of Viagra without people throwing that sort of stuff at you. You're acting like the purist man.
20:53 Speaker 01 Does this work? Fucking right, I've got a 17 year old girlfriend. If you're ambassador for the brand, you know, then you have to live your life by the brand's values. And the value of Viagra is, it doesn't matter that I'm fucking 50, I've got a fucking 16 year old girlfriend.
21:07 Speaker 04 Fuck stuff.
21:07 Speaker 02 Is his numbers, does that water down his nonceery? For example, if you'd only, if he was 50.
21:14 Speaker 01 Does the scale of Savile's crimes water each one down?
21:19 Speaker 02 Savile was sort of exclusively going for 10.
21:21 Speaker 04 Give it a rest, love, there's fucking hundreds of you.
21:24 Speaker 03 Is this, is this a sort of like, one death is a tragedy?
21:27 Speaker 01 Yeah, it is.
21:30 Speaker 02 If you're shagging, if you're putting those numbers up, a 17 year old's down to get fucked, do you know what I mean? Bound, not down.
21:41 Speaker 02 I'm saying that he's shagging left, right and centre. He's probably shagging grannies as well. So it just, does that, that mean, if you'd only ever shagged, if you were a 50 year old who'd only ever shagged a 17 year old, that's it. That's a nonce. If you shagged every, every moving thing and one of them happens to be 17, that must take away.
21:57 Speaker 04 Well, it's collateral damage.
21:59 Speaker 02 Exactly.
21:59 Speaker 01 Right, so Pele is born in 1940, he's named after Thomas Edison, which makes no sense.
22:05 Speaker 02 Bizarre. It's like Lionel Messi named after Lionel Richie.
22:09 Speaker 01 Is he actually?
22:10 Speaker 04 And Ronaldo's Ronald Reagan.
22:12 Speaker 01 Really?
22:12 Speaker 04 Genuinely.
22:13 Speaker 01 Cristiano or?
22:14 Speaker 04 Yeah Cristiano. You know this thing of Brazilian names, there's basically two categories, there's the sexy Brazilian Roberto Carloses. And then there's like Kevin, Fred, Ian, Graham.
22:23 Speaker 02 What's going on there? What's, why? Why is Fred good?
22:26 Speaker 03 I think it's just, it's just nicknames, isn't it? But like, because a lot of them, they're also, there's like, there's a Brazilian player called Mahatma Gandhi as well.
22:35 Speaker 04 And there's Osama Bin Laden.
22:37 Speaker 03 There's a Peruvian, a Peruvian, a Peruvian player who plays now, he's like 20 or something, called Osama Bin Laden. It's got with a V.
22:44 Speaker 04 Spanish V. And his brother's called Saddam Hussein, no?
22:48 Speaker 01 Are you joking?
22:48 Speaker 04 No, no, I'm serious, his dad.
22:50 Speaker 02 Can we get his shirt? I need a Bin Laden shirt.
22:53 Speaker 03 He plays for a particular period.
22:54 Speaker 01 Has he ever scored two goals? Because I want to hear the commentary when the second one goes, "Oh, it's another!"
23:00 Speaker 02 That's when you knew he meant it.
23:01 Speaker 01 That's when you knew.
23:02 Speaker 03 His dad.
23:04 Speaker 02 Osama Bin Laden.
23:05 Speaker 03 Are you fucking joking?
23:06 Speaker 02 I need to see the back of his shirt, because I need that for Christmas.
23:08 Speaker 03 And his brother Saddam Hussein. His brother Saddam Hussein. They had a...
23:14 Speaker 02 This is like when we do like fucking terrorist...
23:17 Speaker 01 These are genuinely my... These are my suggestions when my wife was pregnant.
23:22 Speaker 03 Yeah.
23:22 Speaker 01 For a while.
23:23 Speaker 02 Osama Bin Laden.
23:24 Speaker 01 Osama Finn Laden.
23:26 Speaker 03 The dad said he wanted to call their next kid George Bush, but it was a girl, so.
23:31 Speaker 01 Why not George?
23:32 Speaker 03 I think just go George Bush.
23:33 Speaker 04 What was George Bush's wife?
23:35 Speaker 01 Barbara.
23:36 Speaker 04 Barbara.
23:36 Speaker 03 Barbara Bush.
23:37 Speaker 01 That's his mum.
23:39 Speaker 02 And then so kaka means poo.
23:41 Speaker 03 Means shit, yeah.
23:41 Speaker 01 Does it?
23:42 Speaker 03 Yeah.
23:42 Speaker 01 Actually.
23:43 Speaker 03 In a lot of languages it does. I don't know if in his...
23:45 Speaker 01 I'm cacking it.
23:46 Speaker 02 Yeah.
23:48 Speaker 03 Yeah. But there's Hulk, the footballer. His son is just called Ian.
23:53 Speaker 02 It's sort of like getting your stag do name on the back.
23:56 Speaker 01 Yeah.
23:57 Speaker 02 You know, like Fanny Muncher.
23:58 Speaker 01 Yeah, that's how Brazilians do it. But it's a very sexual country.
24:01 Speaker 02 Small cock.
24:01 Speaker 01 Yeah.
24:02 Speaker 02 It's like, it's crazy just having... At the airport, that's your name for life now.
24:06 Speaker 01 Fanny Magnet. Yeah. That's your name.
24:09 Speaker 03 Bin Laden.
24:12 Speaker 01 Yeah, naming a Brazilian is basically an airport t-shirt spot.
24:14 Speaker 02 Yeah.
24:15 Speaker 01 So Pele is born... His actual full name... There's too many names. It doesn't matter. Anyway, Pele is because his nickname was Bilei. And then he couldn't... He was like a bit deaf when he was younger or whatever.
24:27 Speaker 03 That's Borat's brother, isn't it, Bilei?
24:29 Speaker 04 Is that B- Bilo?
24:30 Speaker 01 Oh, it's Bilal.
24:31 Speaker 02 It's kind of a really dull and strange story. It's kind of a boring story why he's called Pele. It doesn't really make me say it.
24:38 Speaker 01 Yeah, who cares?
24:40 Speaker 02 Someone called him Bilei and they said it wrong, so he's called Pele.
24:43 Speaker 03 They're all a bit like that, those Brazilians, aren't they?
24:44 Speaker 01 But he grew up very poor and he basically started playing football with a grapefruit in an alleyway.
24:49 Speaker 02 If you know what I mean.
24:50 Speaker 01 If you know what I mean.
24:53 Speaker 01 He was barefoot, you know, blah, blah, blah. And then he, so in 1950, the first World Cup, which Germany and Japan are banned for, it's in Brazil.
25:02 Speaker 02 And so Brazil haven't come on to the global stage yet. Uruguay's shown up. Argentina's become a bit of a force, but Brazil untouched by war, I guess. Are starting to show that, but they haven't won anything. And there's, the idea of Brazil as this great nation is not at all for them.
25:16 Speaker 01 There's also, there's a historian of Brazil who says that, you know, it's the fifth largest country in the world, but there's, there's no real, and I disagree with this, I think bossa nova's a vibe, but he says there's no real like intellectual, philosophical, cultural sort of export until football. Like that is their kind of gift to the world.
25:36 Speaker 02 But when did bossa nova start?
25:36 Speaker 01 The 60s, 50s, 60s. I suppose it's about the same time.
25:39 Speaker 04 Ball and bunda and a bit of barbecue, actually.
25:42 Speaker 01 Ball, bunda and barbecue. Brazil.
25:44 Speaker 04 That's Brazil. Do we know how football came to Brazil?
25:47 Speaker 01 England, Britain, I think. It's Britain.
25:49 Speaker 04 Is it, is it Britain?
25:50 Speaker 01 Brazil and Argentina are all, they're soft empire in the 19th century. So that's why Argentina have got, they're really into rugby and polo.
25:57 Speaker 02 They have like country clubs and, you know, all the trains.
26:00 Speaker 01 I think Brazil's first international match is against Exeter City.
26:03 Speaker 02 Yes.
26:04 Speaker 04 And is it all English players?
26:06 Speaker 02 Did they not replay it or something? They replayed it like on a 100 year anniversary or something.
26:10 Speaker 01 So anyway, so Brazil are playing in white at this point in 1950. And they're eager to show their football culture. This is, I guess this is before maybe the sort of Samba caricature, maybe. Pele's a young boy and he remembers how, he remembers this tragedy of the final where Brazil, who are the favourites, they lose to, is it Uruguay again? They lose to Uruguay at the Maracana, which is the big stadium. And they described this loss as Brazil's Hiroshima. And bear in mind, this is, this is five, this is four and a half years after Hiroshima.
26:46 Speaker 02 I mean, we do say everything's 9/11, but this, this literally is so recent.
26:50 Speaker 01 Yeah, I don't think you can call it, I mean.
26:52 Speaker 02 I mean, it's a country that clearly hasn't been touched by World War II.
26:54 Speaker 01 Yeah, you can call it Hiroshima.
26:56 Speaker 03 And this was, they, they allowed Japan back for this World Cup and then called it Hiroshima.
27:00 Speaker 02 Wait, was Japan, was it?
27:01 Speaker 01 That's the one after this one.
27:02 Speaker 03 This is the one after. But there were 200,000 people watching, which, what's the death toll at Hiroshima?
27:07 Speaker 01 Does that mean when Brazil lost 7-1 to Germany, that was Nagasaki?
27:11 Speaker 02 Yeah.
27:12 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah. An estimated 140,000 people died.
27:15 Speaker 02 So similar, similar.
27:16 Speaker 01 To be fair, yeah, it was a similar scale.
27:18 Speaker 02 He's got a good understanding of scale.
27:20 Speaker 01 Yes, yes, it's a comment on scale really, rather than anything else. Pele said, "It was the first time he saw his father cry and he comforted his father by promising that he would win the World Cup himself." Now, obviously at this point, Pele's what? Fucking 12?
27:34 Speaker 02 Yeah.
27:34 Speaker 01 So his dad's like, "Just fuck off, would you?" That's bollocks.
27:37 Speaker 02 Yeah.
27:37 Speaker 01 But he turns professional at age 16 or something like that and he gets recruited into the national team. The psychological trauma from the, from Hiroshima, from the Brazilian Hiroshima, is known as the Maracanazo.
27:49 Speaker 02 Yeah.
27:50 Speaker 01 And there's a thing called the mongrel complex, which is the second volume of my book coming out.
27:58 Speaker 01 This is all, this is apparently about, because Brazilians are, their psychology is quite, it's a strange one because it's such, it's such a melting pot.
28:06 Speaker 02 Yeah. It's the most diverse country in the world, probably.
28:09 Speaker 01 Yes.
28:09 Speaker 02 The most like truly blended.
28:11 Speaker 01 I think the bundes, it's the greatest range in bundesize.
28:14 Speaker 02 Yes. What? Because you've got?
28:16 Speaker 01 You've got this sort of Portuguese, white, sort of, straight down.
28:20 Speaker 02 Oscar. Let's get Oscar's arse.
28:22 Speaker 01 Oscar's arse.
28:23 Speaker 02 Let's get a look at Oscar's arse.
28:24 Speaker 01 And then you've got, you know, you've got Ronaldinho's bunda.
28:27 Speaker 02 Yeah, you've got, well, you've got.
28:27 Speaker 03 And then you've got Amazon.
28:28 Speaker 01 The hips.
28:29 Speaker 02 Yeah. And you've got, well, you've got the greatest bundes in the world. It's the most famous bundes in the world, really.
28:33 Speaker 01 The most famous bundes.
28:34 Speaker 02 The most bonger, bongerable bundes in the world. If you're gonna bonger a bunda.
28:39 Speaker 01 You're sambring a bunda.
28:42 Speaker 02 Yeah, exactly. I mean, that's where it came from.
28:43 Speaker 01 Exactly.
28:44 Speaker 02 Yeah.
28:44 Speaker 01 You go to Venice to watch sea of the art, you go to South East Asia for sex.
28:49 Speaker 02 Did you get Oscar's arse up, Charlie?
28:50 Speaker 03 No, I've got Ronaldinho with loads of arses.
28:51 Speaker 02 Yeah.
28:52 Speaker 01 Oh, yeah.
28:52 Speaker 03 Famous pick.
28:53 Speaker 02 But when I actually ask for an arse, he won't give it to me.
28:56 Speaker 01 Oh, you know.
28:56 Speaker 02 But he will be constantly showing me other people's arse.
28:59 Speaker 03 Yeah, it's a European arse.
29:00 Speaker 02 Yeah, look, I mean, there's absolutely nothing going on there.
29:03 Speaker 01 Straight down.
29:04 Speaker 02 Straight.
29:06 Speaker 02 Yeah, so you've got a real blend. Imagine culture, it's like, who are we? We've got some of those bongoable bundes in the world.
29:12 Speaker 01 And some of the least. But then that's how you play the vibraphone is you need a different, you know, the bongos have different.
29:18 Speaker 02 Are you saying that? Well, that's, that's maybe a cool for like a rainbow society, right?
29:22 Speaker 01 Yes.
29:22 Speaker 02 Is that we need, you know, if it's, you know, Japan, that's just one note. If you're hitting Japan's arse, it's, it's a pretty much an ethno state in a way.
29:30 Speaker 01 Yes.
29:30 Speaker 02 You're hitting just, they're not making beautiful music.
29:34 Speaker 01 There's no timbre to a Japanese arse.
29:35 Speaker 02 Brazil?
29:36 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah, exactly.
29:42 Speaker 02 What was that at the end?
29:42 Speaker 01 There was a farty one at the end.
29:45 Speaker 01 That was Franz Becker Ball at the end.
29:47 Speaker 03 There's a big, there's a big farty ball.
29:48 Speaker 02 How do you get in here, Franz? You're not Brazilian, get out!
29:53 Speaker 01 The mongrel complex is coined by Nelson Rodriguez, who refers to the 1950 loss and sort of psychological issue they have with it by basically, because their mixed race heritage, and at this point, you know, it's just art, it's still, we're still in the kind of.
30:06 Speaker 02 They're not really, haven't been united as a country.
30:08 Speaker 01 No.
30:08 Speaker 02 It's still so early. It's not really clear what the country is.
30:11 Speaker 01 Exactly. And there's so many different, it's got, I think it's the biggest African population outside of Africa, is that right?
30:16 Speaker 02 Yeah.
30:16 Speaker 01 In Brazil. And they sort of still believe this kind of psychological shadow of like lack of discipline and all those kind of stereotypes. That, but here we go. By mongrel complex, I mean the inferiority in which Brazilians place themselves voluntarily, when they compare themselves to the rest of the world. Brazilians are the backward narcissus who spits in his own image.
30:37 Speaker 02 Is this you or the?
30:38 Speaker 01 Sorry, that's, that's not my words, not my words.
30:42 Speaker 03 But do you think this is also because they've had all the Nazis come over from Europe after the war?
30:46 Speaker 02 Did Brazil get a lot of them?
30:47 Speaker 01 Argentina welcomed them.
30:50 Speaker 02 Welcomed them.
30:50 Speaker 01 And I think some of them went to Brazil.
30:52 Speaker 03 Yeah, for the.
30:52 Speaker 02 Permeable ball.
30:53 Speaker 03 Mengele went to Brazil in the end. To experiment in, in bundesizes.
30:56 Speaker 02 Yeah, of course.
30:57 Speaker 01 Now, Mengele will, Mengele will come into the story in the next part.
31:00 Speaker 02 Surprisingly.
31:00 Speaker 01 Surprisingly.
31:01 Speaker 02 The one who got away.
31:02 Speaker 01 The one who.
31:04 Speaker 01 The love of my life, Joseph Mengele.
31:07 Speaker 00 Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' healthcare to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the HouseMajorityPac.com. Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.
31:37 Speaker 05 He built the first planet-wide media empire.
31:39 Speaker 06 He monetized the paranoia and resentment that led to Donald Trump and Brexit.
31:44 Speaker 05 He ruined his own family in his obsessive quest for money, power and legacy.
31:49 Speaker 06 This is the story of Rupert Murdoch, the real-life succession.
31:53 Speaker 05 Join me, Dorian Linsky.
31:54 Speaker 06 And me, Ian Dunst, for season 10 of Origin Story, the show that uses the past to explain the present.
32:01 Speaker 05 That's Origin Story, kicking off with a two-part special on Rupert Murdoch on all podcast platforms now.
32:09 Speaker 01 Anyway, so, let's get to 1958. This is Sweden and this is Pele's first World Cup. He's butter, he's 17.
32:18 Speaker 02 We did, when we did the Grinch episode, right?
32:20 Speaker 01 Yeah.
32:21 Speaker 04 So we did Grinch with you, Horatio, who famously lost his virginity to a goat.
32:24 Speaker 02 Yeah.
32:25 Speaker 01 Catholic country.
32:27 Speaker 04 Which apparently, in the book about Grinch, the guy says-
32:29 Speaker 02 So is my uncle. Do anyone know who's Catholic?
32:33 Speaker 01 That doesn't happen in Germany.
32:34 Speaker 04 Apparently 99% of rural teenagers in Brazil lost their virginity to a goat.
32:39 Speaker 02 How many?
32:39 Speaker 04 In the 30s and 40s. 99, according to the book by-
32:42 Speaker 02 Yeah, but who's collecting that poll?
32:45 Speaker 04 Rui Castro, the author, I think. That's in the census, I think, did you lose your virginity?
32:50 Speaker 02 No, Grinch, Grinch is hilarious. I mean, he's got like, he's on the borderline between actual mental retardation, right?
32:56 Speaker 01 And he's got rickets.
32:57 Speaker 02 Yeah, to add insult to injury. But he put it away.
33:01 Speaker 04 Huge cock as well.
33:02 Speaker 02 Yeah.
33:03 Speaker 01 Yeah.
33:03 Speaker 02 So you know, you, so it's all, all the blood's gone to his cock?
33:06 Speaker 04 Yes.
33:06 Speaker 03 Bad news if you're a goat as well.
33:09 Speaker 02 All good news, it depends what the goat's into.
33:11 Speaker 04 I was on that, I was on that, I was Grinch, I was walking off the farm. I was, I was really just-
33:17 Speaker 03 I was reading this article about goat shagging and in Colombia apparently it's more donkeys. And this thing was, it was from a farmer who was saying that he, he used to basically, he basically pimped out.
33:26 Speaker 01 He's got another scholar on the show, isn't he?
33:29 Speaker 03 Sorry, come on. Some of my research.
33:30 Speaker 02 Sorry, what's higher stakes, a goat or donkey? Because it's all.
33:33 Speaker 03 Donkey, donkey, but they, because it was, he basically pimped it out, pimped it out to local teenagers sometimes.
33:38 Speaker 02 Wait, is he charging?
33:40 Speaker 03 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like the early teens have to bring a little box to, because donkeys are a bit taller.
33:45 Speaker 02 Yeah.
33:45 Speaker 03 But there was one rule that you weren't allowed to use a condom because donkeys, they don't, they don't.
33:49 Speaker 01 Catholic country, Catholic country.
33:52 Speaker 03 And it's a Catholic country.
33:53 Speaker 02 The Lord does not.
33:54 Speaker 03 And they're also concerned that the latex might irritate the, the donkey.
33:57 Speaker 01 God forbid the donkey would have an irritant.
33:59 Speaker 02 That's all right, isn't it?
34:00 Speaker 03 Personally, I think the donkey's got bigger issues than the, than the latex, but.
34:05 Speaker 01 Charlie's just found, what have you found? A horse sex case?
34:07 Speaker 02 What have you found, Charlie?
34:08 Speaker 07 A guy died after being bummed by a stallion.
34:11 Speaker 03 Oh, there's a video of that, isn't there?
34:12 Speaker 01 Sorry, being bummed or trying to bum a stallion?
34:14 Speaker 07 From a ruptured colon.
34:15 Speaker 03 Yeah.
34:15 Speaker 01 Okay, right. That's a different kettle of fish.
34:18 Speaker 02 Yeah.
34:19 Speaker 03 Goats are fine.
34:20 Speaker 02 I guess it's like the revenge for Garrincha.
34:24 Speaker 01 What, in the Grand National, running is Garrincha's revenge? It's the horse that killed a man by bumming him. Anyway, so yeah, so Garrincha has knock knees or rickets or something. And it basically means when he's, when he's a winger, no one actually knows which way he's running.
34:39 Speaker 02 He doesn't know which way.
34:40 Speaker 01 It's like a cartoon.
34:41 Speaker 02 It's Forrest Gump running away. He's got two left feet.
34:43 Speaker 01 So he's, is he a left or right winger? He's on, he's on the wing. Anyway, so he's part of this sort of early amazing Brazil team. But yeah, so they, so what do they say about Garrincha? They say that, and there's actually this footage of this team, which is, which is the first time.
34:55 Speaker 02 It's the first time, yeah.
34:57 Speaker 01 And Pele's scoring amazing goals, even for the fifth, like this is the first time you recognise these goals and you go, oh, that's a, that's a goal.
35:05 Speaker 02 And so when they go to Sweden and Garrincha can't believe the women there, right?
35:08 Speaker 03 Yeah, and he fathers a child there.
35:10 Speaker 02 Yeah, exactly. And then there's, is there a nudist beach?
35:13 Speaker 01 He fathers a kid or a child?
35:16 Speaker 03 Well, that's my go.
35:17 Speaker 01 Right.
35:18 Speaker 03 Because they had this doctor, Hilton Gosley, who was at the Brazil team doctor, and he was really worried that, he basically knew that all the Brazil players were massive shaggers.
35:25 Speaker 01 Yeah.
35:26 Speaker 03 And he, before he like went ahead to the hotel in Sweden and got all of the female staff removed. So it was only men. And then realised that.
35:34 Speaker 01 That's what I do on tour as well.
35:36 Speaker 03 Separation. The holiday end is, yeah, so they're fine with it.
35:39 Speaker 01 Yeah.
35:39 Speaker 02 Only sexy guys.
35:40 Speaker 03 They, they got there and then realised that the hotel overlooked a nudist colony.
35:45 Speaker 04 I thought you were going donkey sanctuary there.
35:47 Speaker 03 Probably had the same, same result.
35:49 Speaker 01 In, in Brazil, they have those adverts for donkey charities, but it's, it's not, I'm so hot.
35:55 Speaker 02 It's I'm so horny.
35:56 Speaker 01 It's I, I keep getting fucked by a national footballer.
35:59 Speaker 02 Oh, is it to try and stop? Don't fuck your donkey.
36:01 Speaker 01 Don't fuck donkeys.
36:02 Speaker 03 Can you like adopt a donkey in Brazil as a?
36:05 Speaker 01 Yes, it's a different charity.
36:06 Speaker 03 Different charity.
36:07 Speaker 04 But Sweden's the happy World Cup then, isn't it?
36:09 Speaker 03 I guess so.
36:09 Speaker 04 Is there politics there?
36:10 Speaker 02 Yeah, is that, let's see if that's a political World Cup.
36:12 Speaker 01 So, Gorrincha is, isn't he, what do they say about Gorrincha? They say that he's basically borderline.
36:18 Speaker 03 IQ of 70.
36:20 Speaker 04 Wow.
36:20 Speaker 03 And after the final, doesn't Gorrincha says, who are we playing next? He just, he just thinks it's school.
36:26 Speaker 02 That's what you need. You need someone who can't think.
36:29 Speaker 01 Brazil was, Brazilian 58 was the first time that a team had like a psychologist and then like specialist, like backroom staff.
36:34 Speaker 02 Charlie is typing cleverest dog IQ.
36:40 Speaker 01 The report they, they make says Gorrincha was not mentally capable of following complex tactics. But then the coach, Faiola, dismisses the expert, saying, you might be right, but you know, fuck all about football, which, to be fair.
36:52 Speaker 02 Well, he, he would probably play better in like an Ancelotti system. He's like a Real Madrid player, Gorrincha. He's not a tactical, it's more self-expression, a vibes based player, you know?
37:01 Speaker 01 So now Pele is dropped for the first couple of games, but then he comes into the team, starts scoring hat tricks. And then in the final against Sweden, this, this was the first time they played in blue. So after Hiroshima, they got rid of their white shirts.
37:16 Speaker 02 Right.
37:17 Speaker 01 And put yellow shirts on. So I've just decided not to say a comment about Japan.
37:23 Speaker 02 A master in self-control.
37:27 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah. Leave. And then, so Brazil, now Sweden turn up in yellow. This is still the time where both teams would turn up in the same shirt and be like, no, I'm not fucking changing, you change.
37:36 Speaker 02 Yeah.
37:37 Speaker 01 So Brazil go and buy blue shirts and they then beat them 5-2. Pele scores a hat-trick.
37:43 Speaker 02 Yeah.
37:44 Speaker 01 And.
37:44 Speaker 02 He's 17.
37:45 Speaker 01 He's 17 and he does the first, I think the first time someone ever knocked a ball over someone's head and volleyed it.
37:49 Speaker 02 Yes.
37:49 Speaker 01 So everyone just loses their mind.
37:51 Speaker 02 Yeah.
37:51 Speaker 01 The sombrero flick. This is the first time European commentators are going cha cha cha, Brasilia, you know.
37:58 Speaker 01 So Pele burst into tears at the final whistle, having fulfilled the promise he made to his father after Hiroshima.
38:05 Speaker 01 And he enters the 62 World Cup as the world's best player.
38:07 Speaker 02 Not after Hiroshima, after Brazil's.
38:09 Speaker 01 Brazil's.
38:12 Speaker 02 Yeah, America didn't drop a bomb on Japan and Pele said, I will win the World Cup.
38:19 Speaker 03 There was a story from the, from the celebration.
38:20 Speaker 01 But why didn't Japan do that?
38:22 Speaker 02 Yeah, they could have taken a leaf out of Pele's book.
38:24 Speaker 01 Because the only thing Japan have ever done in football, from my point of view, is when there's that footage of 100 Japanese toddlers playing world professional football.
38:33 Speaker 03 They tidy up after games.
38:35 Speaker 01 Sorry, what were you gonna say?
38:36 Speaker 03 At that, what was it, 58, the one in Sweden?
38:38 Speaker 01 Yeah.
38:39 Speaker 03 At the trophy celebration, apparently one of the like Brazilian squad players, like just on the bench, convinced these journalists to call him Pele in front of these like hot Swedish girls. And disappeared off with a.
38:52 Speaker 01 With a six foot.
38:53 Speaker 03 Six foot two blonde apparently.
38:55 Speaker 01 Six foot two blonde.
38:56 Speaker 03 Who probably fathered, fathered a child with him and realised he was actually Fred.
39:02 Speaker 01 Yeah, is the 58 World Cup, is it, is it apolitical? I mean, Sweden.
39:05 Speaker 03 Yeah, I think it's a happy one.
39:06 Speaker 01 Is it maybe one we can enjoy?
39:08 Speaker 03 Although the Swedes were still doing eugenics then, weren't they?
39:10 Speaker 01 They were famously.
39:11 Speaker 03 So it's another, so it's two eugenics wins back to back. West Germany, Sweden.
39:14 Speaker 01 Fantastic, fantastic.
39:15 Speaker 02 Yeah, that's true.
39:16 Speaker 01 Sweden did not drop sterilization laws until the fucking 70s.
39:20 Speaker 02 And also look at Sweden's football team now, look at their results. Like this is the golden age of Swedish football.
39:25 Speaker 01 Yes, you're true. You're right.
39:28 Speaker 01 So Pele enters 62. No, 62 is in, where's 62? Where's that World Cup?
39:34 Speaker 04 Chile.
39:35 Speaker 01 Is it Chile? Chile, I think.
39:37 Speaker 04 Is it? No, no, that's late.
39:38 Speaker 01 It isn't Chile.
39:38 Speaker 02 Day for it.
39:39 Speaker 01 Brazil won, so Brazil then go on to win in.
39:41 Speaker 04 This is the one where Brazil have an official team brothel in Santiago.
39:45 Speaker 01 Wow.
39:46 Speaker 04 The, the team doctor has a complete 180 and thinks, all right, didn't work, getting rid of the female staff. So he goes and sets up a, a deal with a local brothel.
39:54 Speaker 02 If you're gonna be doing it, I'd like to know.
39:55 Speaker 04 Yeah. It's like, you know how England pick their team hotel now and take it over, change the bedding?
39:59 Speaker 01 So the opposite of Capello.
40:01 Speaker 04 Yeah.
40:01 Speaker 01 Just get the brass in.
40:03 Speaker 02 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
40:03 Speaker 01 But we'll stare, we'll like, make sure the brass are, yeah.
40:06 Speaker 03 It does make you wonder what happened to that, that doctor in the intervening years. They'd gone from all the female staff out of the hotel. It's a, it's a, it's like, they basically wanted to be like a, a nunnery. And, uh, and then now they're literally busting in.
40:21 Speaker 02 Maybe he just had the, he had some of the best busts of his life.
40:25 Speaker 01 It's Brazil in the 60s.
40:26 Speaker 02 Yeah.
40:27 Speaker 03 It's true.
40:27 Speaker 04 Post goat.
40:28 Speaker 02 Yeah, I think maybe he saw a blunder that changed his whole view of life.
40:31 Speaker 01 Yeah. We haven't placed any of this. Shall we, shall we get to the 1966 World Cup? Which is, uh, probably the, the most apolitical, purest World Cup.
40:40 Speaker 02 The purest World Cup.
40:41 Speaker 01 Has ever been.
40:42 Speaker 02 Yeah. It's the only real World Cup that sort of counts, I think.
40:45 Speaker 01 I think so.
40:45 Speaker 02 Cause everything else before is corrupt. Everything else afterwards is even more corrupt.
40:48 Speaker 01 There's, there's eugenicists, there's Hiroshima, there's Nazis.
40:51 Speaker 02 And standing alone.
40:53 Speaker 01 Is the England 66 World Cup. Once again, we stood alone in defiance. So England get the World Cup in 66. Uh, the context for this is that, uh, everyone, England, England are kind of falling on their arse. It, it's, it's, it's all sold as like a, like the English summer and the high watermark of our kind of cultural, um, zeitgeist, 360s. But actually the economy was in the toilet. Wilson's in power. Get, uh, it's not getting pegged by Marcy yet. And the, the World Cup trophy is stolen from like a stamp collecting fair when like a few weeks before. And it's found in suspicious circumstances by a dog called Pickles. I think just around the corner from where we record in South East London.
41:37 Speaker 02 Yes.
41:38 Speaker 01 Pickles finds the trophy, gives it back to, um, the FA or the FIFA or whoever.
41:44 Speaker 02 Was Pickles the dog?
41:45 Speaker 01 Yeah, Pickles was a dog.
41:46 Speaker 02 So the Pickles gives it back to the FA?
41:47 Speaker 01 Yeah.
41:49 Speaker 03 I've got your trophy.
41:51 Speaker 01 Pickles, right. Pickles then, only a year later, Strangles dies, his lead gets caught on a branch and he hangs himself. Now, I dispute that.
42:02 Speaker 02 What, you say Pickles didn't kill himself?
42:03 Speaker 03 No, he did kill himself.
42:05 Speaker 02 He was an absolute situation.
42:06 Speaker 01 Pickles did not kill himself, he knew too much, okay? How did he suspiciously find that trophy?
42:12 Speaker 01 Pickles did not kill himself.
42:15 Speaker 03 It's quite Epstein.
42:16 Speaker 01 It is.
42:17 Speaker 03 Don't they all die? The bloke who nixed it dies as well.
42:20 Speaker 01 It all stinks.
42:21 Speaker 02 It stinks, it absolutely stinks.
42:22 Speaker 01 Absolutely stinks. Mears, Bletchley and Pickles, they all die. Say their names. Say their names. Pickles was a colleague.
42:29 Speaker 03 Leave Pickles.
42:30 Speaker 01 The trophy was found in Belua Hill, which is just, yeah, just around the corner from here. Wrapped in newspaper, tied with a string, lying under a bush.
42:38 Speaker 02 Yeah, I don't buy that for a second.
42:39 Speaker 01 I think it stinks.
42:40 Speaker 02 I wasn't born yesterday, mate.
42:41 Speaker 01 No.
42:42 Speaker 03 So hung himself on his lead, was that how he died?
42:45 Speaker 01 Devastatingly sad.
42:46 Speaker 03 And the CCTV was turned off at the time.
42:48 Speaker 01 At the exact time.
42:50 Speaker 01 Now, obviously, 66 in Britain, it's a fire sale for the colonies. They're all just going, take them all.
42:56 Speaker 02 Music's good, though.
42:58 Speaker 01 Yeah, the music is good.
42:59 Speaker 02 It's starting to kick off now.
43:00 Speaker 01 But this is, so this is the great African boycott, because the FA, the FIFA is run by a guy called Sir Stanley Someone. He's like, head of FIFA at this point, and he basically says, right, all of Africa and Asia and whoever else can compete for one spot to play at the World Cup.
43:22 Speaker 01 And they all go, well, that's racist, we're going to boycott. Fine, just one more team, one more Europeans like them. Idiots, idiots.
43:27 Speaker 03 South Africa is the qualifier.
43:30 Speaker 02 Yeah.
43:30 Speaker 03 We're the Rhodes.
43:34 Speaker 01 So this means that North Korea.
43:36 Speaker 02 Oh.
43:37 Speaker 03 Even better.
43:38 Speaker 01 Even better, they qualify.
43:40 Speaker 02 So this is the purest World Cup there's been.
43:42 Speaker 01 Yes.
43:43 Speaker 02 This is the least corrupt.
43:44 Speaker 01 Yes, North Korea qualified for the finals, even though a peace treaty had never been signed following the Korean War and the UK didn't even recognise North Korea.
43:54 Speaker 02 North Korea has a right to defend itself.
43:55 Speaker 01 It does, I've always said that. I've always said North Korea has a right to defend itself. And so the Foreign Office identifies these three main areas of tension. Firstly, the use of the national anthem, the flying of the flag and the official name of the country. Because diplomatically, we don't recognise North Korea. So eventually, it was called, they were referred to as the Democratic People's Republic of Korea. And the anthems would only be played at the opening match of the tournament and the final. So you're basically banking on North Korea not making it to the final.
44:23 Speaker 03 Yeah.
44:24 Speaker 01 Now, the big shock is that North Koreans beat Italy 1-0. Huge shock.
44:30 Speaker 02 Crazy.
44:30 Speaker 03 Yeah.
44:31 Speaker 01 What's the guy called? The guy who scored the goal? I wanna, I wanna say it's Pak. But I just wanted to get it on the screen before I ran into it.
44:40 Speaker 02 I'm gonna say Chung.
44:41 Speaker 03 I think it is Pak.
44:42 Speaker 01 Pak Chung? Is it Pak Choi? Is Pak Choi scored the goal? What's Pak Chung?
44:47 Speaker 02 And there could be a Lee in there.
44:49 Speaker 01 Is it, is it Lee Pak Choi? Charlie, help us the fuck out.
44:53 Speaker 02 Pak Du.
44:54 Speaker 01 Pak Duik.
44:55 Speaker 03 Ah, Pak Duik, of course.
44:56 Speaker 02 Dong, Dong Won.
44:58 Speaker 01 Lee Dong Won, Pak Duik, Pak Sung's in, Yang Soon Cook. And some pork crackers at the table, thank you. Anyway, that's the North Korean team.
45:08 Speaker 01 Now, Pak Duik, so the North Korean team are based in Middlesbrough.
45:12 Speaker 02 That means live, laugh, love in North Korea.
45:17 Speaker 01 Yeah. Yeah, they have tea towels with Pak Duik on it. And Middlesbrough, their locals like fall in love with the North Koreans.
45:24 Speaker 03 Got a lot in common.
45:26 Speaker 01 They do, yeah. Same, similar architecture.
45:28 Speaker 02 Middlesbrough is the highest stab rate in Europe, I think.
45:31 Speaker 01 In Europe?
45:31 Speaker 02 Yeah. Yeah, Charlie is from Middlesbrough.
45:34 Speaker 01 Not that Charlie.
45:35 Speaker 02 Not that Charlie, other Charlie, clever Charlie.
45:37 Speaker 01 Right, clever Charlie in Middlesbrough, yes. Even half a century later, cultural exchanges continue between Middlesbrough and North Korea.
45:44 Speaker 03 Wow, so all the people of, people of Middlesbrough go over there and take a look at the modern appliances.
45:49 Speaker 01 Yeah, they do.
45:49 Speaker 03 Karaoke. Wow, guys, what's that, what's that? Is that a banana? I've only ever heard of those.
45:54 Speaker 01 They got microwave over there, fucking hell. And then, so, but the main story, of course, is England, the wingless wonders. Have you done, have you done 66 on the upshot? Have you done the?
46:03 Speaker 03 Again, we've done, done various fragments of the, of the chaos.
46:06 Speaker 01 Yeah.
46:07 Speaker 02 So how much of, was Alf Ramsey actually an innovator?
46:09 Speaker 04 Well, he said he was gonna win it, which no one ever has the guts to do, apart from Ange at Tottenham. And he was right. So I think he's considered quite good, but Geoff Hurst is the big turnout for the books. He wasn't meant to be playing.
46:21 Speaker 02 Yeah.
46:21 Speaker 04 Jimmy Greaves got injured.
46:22 Speaker 02 Jimmy Greaves is our best, one of my best players. He's unbelievable. Goal scoring stats.
46:28 Speaker 04 He was injured and Geoff Hurst obviously does the business. Have you ever seen Geoff Hurst's advert, his interview on Sky Sports?
46:34 Speaker 01 No.
46:35 Speaker 02 No.
46:35 Speaker 04 This is too much of a diversion.
46:36 Speaker 02 No, no, no.
46:37 Speaker 04 It is very good.
46:37 Speaker 02 You can never have too much of a diversion.
46:40 Speaker 04 It was, it was just before, I think it was the last Euros final, he got, did like an interview on Sky Sports the day before the final and like gonna ask him about it and he, I think he might have had a sponsorship.
46:52 Speaker 02 It's great to have you here to watch your own pod.
46:54 Speaker 07 Here's what he had to say. Just finished off an advert for Budweiser, which has been very interesting. And I think one, the great thing about supporting England is you can support England from all over the country, not just at the games, but in pubs and bars, just enjoying a nice glass of Budweiser.
47:14 Speaker 04 Sky Sports.
47:15 Speaker 01 Great advertising to be fair to him.
47:17 Speaker 02 You can support England wherever you are just by having a glass of American beer.
47:20 Speaker 04 America's favourite beer.
47:22 Speaker 02 Wherever you are, not watching football.
47:23 Speaker 01 No.
47:23 Speaker 02 That supports England.
47:25 Speaker 04 He's the only one left though from 66, so.
47:27 Speaker 01 Is he?
47:27 Speaker 04 Give him his.
47:28 Speaker 02 Everyone else got like brain damage from heading the fucking wet balls all of the winter, you know?
47:33 Speaker 04 Yeah.
47:34 Speaker 02 These sodden.
47:34 Speaker 01 It's the first World Cup that has a mascot, Willie, World Cup Willie.
47:39 Speaker 01 The lion with Union Jack on it. And then probably the best, I think the best, so Pele gets basically kicked off the pitch, right? Pele gets kicked off. The South Americans see England 66 as like the worst World Cup has ever been.
47:52 Speaker 04 The most corrupt one.
47:53 Speaker 02 All, all of them.
47:53 Speaker 04 We get some very dodgy calls.
47:56 Speaker 01 Yes, so the main, the main one is the.
47:58 Speaker 02 Oh, sorry, yeah.
47:58 Speaker 01 So this is before the invention.
48:00 Speaker 02 You're personally getting dodgy.
48:04 Speaker 04 England.
48:05 Speaker 01 Who is this?
48:09 Speaker 01 This is before yellow and red cards are invented. So we should place 1966.
48:13 Speaker 02 Right, okay.
48:14 Speaker 01 Would you guys like to? You're aware of every?
48:16 Speaker 02 The placement system.
48:17 Speaker 01 Yeah, so let's, we'll start by saying it's before yellow and red cards. And it was after?
48:24 Speaker 04 Last woman to be hanged?
48:26 Speaker 01 Lovely, let's just see when was the last woman to be hanged?
48:29 Speaker 04 It's gonna be around there, isn't it?
48:31 Speaker 02 Hyung, I think, is the North Korean player, actually.
48:33 Speaker 04 Isn't this your?
48:34 Speaker 01 Lovely, 1950.
48:35 Speaker 02 Wow, that is beautiful.
48:36 Speaker 01 Absolutely glorious.
48:37 Speaker 02 Yeah, I mean, someone understands. And now also off the bat, just.
48:41 Speaker 04 Ruth Ellis.
48:41 Speaker 01 Say her name, Ruth Ellis.
48:43 Speaker 04 Queen of a horse.
48:44 Speaker 01 I don't think she killed herself. This stinks. Her and Pickles have been taken out by someone up top.
48:50 Speaker 02 No, I think she did kill herself.
48:53 Speaker 01 Sorry, you're right, you're right. Pickles, Pickles did not kill himself. Ruth Ellis was a suicide.
48:57 Speaker 02 It was mental health.
48:59 Speaker 01 Yeah, no, she was trying to change a light bulb. Anyway, why was she hanged?
49:03 Speaker 02 Why was she hanged?
49:04 Speaker 04 She shot a lover outside a pub in Hampstead.
49:08 Speaker 01 You can't be doing that.
49:10 Speaker 02 Woman shooting a man, though, is kind of bollocks. It feels different.
49:14 Speaker 01 What do you mean?
49:15 Speaker 02 Well, it just, if a woman kills her husband, you're like, what has he done?
49:18 Speaker 04 I think he was, he was a dirty dog.
49:20 Speaker 02 Yeah, you know what I mean? Like, if a, if a husband kills his wife, it's like an evil man.
49:24 Speaker 01 He didn't need a reason. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, I get it. Yeah, yeah, sure.
49:29 Speaker 02 I get it.
49:29 Speaker 01 I get it.
49:30 Speaker 02 It's just like a temper thing.
49:32 Speaker 01 Fucking never stop talking.
49:34 Speaker 02 If a woman gets past her instinct to not kill people and like pushes past that, what has he done to get her to that point?
49:41 Speaker 01 Yeah.
49:42 Speaker 02 You just, you always look at him worse than her, I feel.
49:44 Speaker 01 Yes, yes.
49:46 Speaker 04 She's building, building that train set.
49:47 Speaker 02 Exactly.
49:48 Speaker 04 It's just like, let's take over the whole house now.
49:49 Speaker 02 Exactly.
49:50 Speaker 01 The best thing about this World Cup is the, is the, the match between England and Argentina in the quarters.
49:57 Speaker 02 And this is the beginning of our footballing rivalry with Argentina?
50:00 Speaker 01 Yes, it is. So there's no red or yellow cards. Now, the Argentinian captain, Antonio Ratin.
50:09 Speaker 01 He gets sent off by the German referee. Ratin refuses to leave the pitch claiming he didn't understand the order and demands an interpreter, which then, he then goes and sits on the Queen's red carpet in Wembley, which is a disgrace.
50:24 Speaker 02 I mean, that's disgraceful.
50:25 Speaker 01 Absolute disgrace.
50:27 Speaker 02 They're animals.
50:28 Speaker 01 They are animals, which is what Alf Ramsey says in the press conference, he goes, "They're fucking animals."
50:33 Speaker 02 In a press conference?
50:35 Speaker 01 Yeah, he says, "Well, I think they're just animals." This is called like the battle of wherever, this is one of the, this is one of, I think it's the most amount of cards or fouls in a game to this point. It's one of the, it's one of the shittest games ever, basically. So this is him trying to send off Ratin and they don't understand.
50:53 Speaker 04 You need a card.
50:53 Speaker 01 You need a card, yeah.
50:55 Speaker 04 Complicated.
50:55 Speaker 02 Yeah. Fuck off. So lopsided foul.
51:00 Speaker 01 Thirty-three committed by England to Argentina's 19. I dispute those numbers. I think that's too high.
51:05 Speaker 02 They're too high.
51:07 Speaker 04 Ref looks so generic.
51:08 Speaker 02 So was it a crap, do we get a lot of calls our way, basically?
51:11 Speaker 04 Well, you had plenty to believe, obviously, but yeah, it was, it was a favourable rubber
51:15 Speaker 01 green. Well, I guess the, this is when an Englishman was the head of FIFA.
51:19 Speaker 04 Yeah.
51:20 Speaker 01 And hence the exclusion of anyone from the developing world. Sir Stanley someone.
51:24 Speaker 04 It's before all the sort of French corruption.
51:26 Speaker 02 Yeah, it's English corruption, which doesn't really.
51:28 Speaker 01 It's before the woke madness of trying to give the World Cup to South Africa or something like that. So the final, England get to the final, obviously, the wingless wonders.
51:36 Speaker 02 Yeah.
51:37 Speaker 01 And then they're playing Germany in 66 in the final. And again, the World War Two is still casting a shadow over it.
51:47 Speaker 04 Still.
51:48 Speaker 01 Still.
51:48 Speaker 04 Come on.
51:49 Speaker 01 You know.
51:49 Speaker 02 Go over it.
51:50 Speaker 01 In the, in the every, so Helmut Schör, who's the German coach, he had survived the 1945 basballing of Dresden.
51:58 Speaker 02 Yeah.
51:59 Speaker 01 And so West Germany had beaten the USSR in the semi final. So I guess this is also, which is the World Cup where East Germany play West Germany? That's not until later, is it? Yeah, anyway, obviously England, England win. They think it's all over. It is now.
52:13 Speaker 04 Two world wars, one World Cup.
52:15 Speaker 01 Exactly.
52:16 Speaker 02 And we got a fable, rub, rub the green there with the ball not crossing the line. Yeah.
52:20 Speaker 03 Yeah.
52:21 Speaker 02 That sort of stuff before.
52:23 Speaker 01 Well, this is before.
52:23 Speaker 04 Definitely, definitely. When we insult Saudi Arabia, I quite often see comments being like, well, Jeff Hurst's goal didn't cross the line. From Saudi lads.
52:30 Speaker 01 From Saudis?
52:31 Speaker 04 Yeah.
52:31 Speaker 01 Really?
52:32 Speaker 02 Fair enough. But we got, we got.
52:34 Speaker 04 The Lampard one, yeah. Oh, it's Lampard, yeah. So we're even.
52:39 Speaker 01 Yeah. So Pele's kicked out of the game. And, you know, England, this is probably the last time that we had any sort of thing to shout about, really, until the Falklands.
52:50 Speaker 04 Yeah. This is also the birth of can he do it on a rainy Tuesday in Stoke? Because it's like Pele, you came, you could do it in Sweden.
52:57 Speaker 02 You got kicked to death.
52:58 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah. Because a foul at this point is, I mean, assault is allowed. It's not considered a foul.
53:06 Speaker 04 Yeah. It's meat and potatoes football. It's nobly Englishman called Nobby versus.
53:10 Speaker 01 Yeah, it's the high point of the name Nobby, actually, isn't it?
53:13 Speaker 02 Yeah, Nobby styles.
53:14 Speaker 04 And like nobly knees and comb overs.
53:16 Speaker 02 Yeah.
53:16 Speaker 01 Yeah, they're all 20 and they've all, they're all bald as fuck. Horrendous hairlines. Horrendous haircuts. Heroes, all of them.
53:21 Speaker 02 Yeah.
53:22 Speaker 03 The, for this World Cup, the Brazilian team were staying, they stayed in this like village in Cheshire, Lim, I think it was called. And they apparently, someone, someone told that the limb was like the most dangerous place in the UK. And apparently they just wouldn't leave the hotel for the entire way. They were just like, you know, they'd step out and there'd be some like Cheshire farmer just like, all right, all right, lads. You want to, you want some fucking potatoes? And they're just cowering in their, in their.
53:44 Speaker 04 Well, they accused them of serving them horse meat.
53:47 Speaker 03 Yeah, they thought there was some horse.
53:48 Speaker 01 That's my girlfriend. How dare you?
53:52 Speaker 01 But then we get to 1970. So Pele has had, it's been kicked to shit in the last two World Cups. And in 1970, this is in Mexico, this World Cup, and this is the first time where it's becoming a real commercial operation because they make all the players play at midday in the height of the Mexican sun for TV audiences in Europe. So it's also the first World Cup of colour. Sorry, the first World Cup in colour.
54:25 Speaker 01 And so this is where like the Brazil are kind of at their pomp.
54:29 Speaker 02 Yes, this is the one where that colour TV goal, that famous whole team 1970.
54:34 Speaker 01 The 1970 final, yeah, the right back, Carlos Alberto scores an amazing team goal. But also, so this is where like the, it's also filmed in Technicolor, so it's the yellow shirts, the kind of brightness of the sun. This is where, I suppose, certainly when I was a kid, I had this box set of the history of the World Cup, and this was the one that felt like the sort of, if there ever was a peak, it's this and the next one for me. I was like, yeah, this one feels like the most.
55:03 Speaker 02 But also is this where Bobby Moore's tackle was?
55:05 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
55:05 Speaker 02 Which my dad would talk, and then you see it and it's like, it's a nice tackle, but the way he talked, my dad explained this to me for about 45 minutes.
55:11 Speaker 04 Was it Gordon Banks' save in that?
55:13 Speaker 01 Gordon Banks' save in the same game.
55:14 Speaker 04 And this is the one where Bobby Moore gets accused of stealing jewellery.
55:18 Speaker 02 Really?
55:19 Speaker 04 This is the big scandal. On the eve of the tournament, Bobby Moore's accused of stealing a necklace.
55:23 Speaker 01 Yeah.
55:23 Speaker 04 Apparently Bobby Charlton.
55:25 Speaker 02 This is the greatest tackle of all time.
55:26 Speaker 01 Yeah.
55:28 Speaker 04 It's a slight tackle. Was slight tackles new then?
55:31 Speaker 02 Yeah.
55:32 Speaker 04 But Bobby Moore, right before the tournament, they accused him of stealing a bracelet or a necklace, and apparently Bobby Charlton flirted with the shop assistant to distract her.
55:41 Speaker 02 But is that, didn't that actually happen?
55:42 Speaker 04 Bobby Charlton, back the old eyelash.
55:45 Speaker 01 Flit the camera over.
55:47 Speaker 04 But Harold Wilson had to intervene, I think.
55:49 Speaker 03 Yeah. It was in Colombia or something, they were over there for a friendly and they went to a jewellery shop and nicked a bracelet or something.
55:57 Speaker 01 Yeah, I mean, it's not fucking goats, is it?
55:58 Speaker 02 Yeah.
55:59 Speaker 03 Yeah.
56:00 Speaker 01 It's a bit of harmless fun. Catholic country. Anyway, so 1970 is the kind of high point of Brazil. This is what, they win the World Cup for the fourth time in 1970, is it?
56:11 Speaker 04 This is when they keep the trophy, isn't it?
56:12 Speaker 01 Oh, this is the third time. 58, 62, yeah, 70.
56:17 Speaker 01 This is what popularised the phrase hogabonito. And now, at this point, Brazil is under a repressive military dictatorship. And so, this is kind of sports washing, which had been happening in, how long, when did the Brazilian dictators get into? They've been in since the 60s?
56:35 Speaker 02 64.
56:36 Speaker 01 64. So, yeah, the famous goal in the final, they beat Italy 4-1. Pele then retires after this. He was best mates with Henry Kissinger.
56:46 Speaker 02 Yeah, it's crazy.
56:47 Speaker 01 You know that? Kissinger's a massive football fan.
56:50 Speaker 02 Which is also sus if you're an American massive football fan.
56:53 Speaker 04 He's German, isn't he?
56:53 Speaker 02 He's German, yeah.
56:55 Speaker 04 Born.
56:57 Speaker 01 Yeah, that's why the whole bombing Cambodia thing.
57:00 Speaker 02 What?
57:00 Speaker 01 He's German, isn't he?
57:01 Speaker 02 Right.
57:02 Speaker 04 Loves it.
57:02 Speaker 01 Let's drop napalm on them.
57:03 Speaker 02 Yeah.
57:05 Speaker 04 So they were pals?
57:07 Speaker 01 Pele and Henry Kissinger were best mates and Kissinger tries to, basically is the missing link in, you know, we know when Pele goes to America for the New York Cosmos.
57:15 Speaker 04 Yeah.
57:15 Speaker 01 He's just getting a mo.
57:16 Speaker 02 Yeah, he broke his.
57:18 Speaker 04 Do we know how they met?
57:19 Speaker 01 Kissinger just came to the, I think, just, isn't the talk of Kissinger?
57:24 Speaker 02 Kissinger in Chile, I think.
57:26 Speaker 04 Yeah, he had some business in the region at the time.
57:29 Speaker 02 Yeah.
57:29 Speaker 04 He was a right wing junta to me.
57:30 Speaker 01 Yeah, exactly. They met in 1974 at a hotel in the Sao Paulo. And he sought out Pele to persuade him to come out of retirement.
57:38 Speaker 04 Isn't he sat in, like, with all the families when they win it or something, Kissinger?
57:41 Speaker 01 Something like that. Anyway, Pele's high point is 1970, then this is when the game becomes really commercial. And he goes on to be the face of Coke and Viagra.
57:53 Speaker 02 Yeah.
57:54 Speaker 01 And he's in, what's the, it's Game of Victory.
57:58 Speaker 02 Which I've never seen, I've seen clips of it.
58:00 Speaker 04 No, me neither.
58:01 Speaker 02 It's got loads of. It kind of looks kind of crap.
58:03 Speaker 04 Bobby Moore in it and Gordon Holmes.
58:04 Speaker 01 So P O, they're playing against Nazis.
58:06 Speaker 04 Yeah.
58:06 Speaker 01 Yeah.
58:07 Speaker 02 Yeah, it just seems too, I can't really wrap my head around the premise, to be honest.
58:10 Speaker 01 Sylvester Stallone, Michael Caine, Pele, playing against Nazis.
58:15 Speaker 02 What's that not for?
58:17 Speaker 01 I'm watching that. So Pele retires in 19 whatever, and then, yeah, 1977.
58:27 Speaker 04 With the mad goal record, that's a bit.
58:29 Speaker 02 Yeah, so what's going on there?
58:30 Speaker 04 Well, 500 of his 1300 goals were scored in exhibition matches, which is like Soccer Aid. It's like Lee Mack and Steve Bartlett being England's top scorers, chunks.
58:43 Speaker 03 That, that does also make me doubt Pele's shagging numbers as well then.
58:48 Speaker 02 Was it in the exhibition?
58:49 Speaker 03 He said he was posting, posting a thousand.
58:51 Speaker 04 Is that his number?
58:52 Speaker 03 I don't know.
58:52 Speaker 02 Yeah, it's over a thousand.
58:54 Speaker 03 So how many?
58:55 Speaker 02 Where's that quote?
58:55 Speaker 03 If you're counting goals in friendly, are we counting goats as well?
58:59 Speaker 04 Yeah.
58:59 Speaker 03 I don't think, I don't think goats go to the.
59:01 Speaker 01 Was that exhibition sex?
59:03 Speaker 02 Yeah, but yeah, it was for charity as well.
59:05 Speaker 03 Exactly.
59:06 Speaker 04 Donkey sanctuary.
59:07 Speaker 01 He said, good forwards only scored to have sex the day before.
59:10 Speaker 02 Oh, good.
59:11 Speaker 04 They all say that, don't they?
59:12 Speaker 01 Yeah. Well, there are two camps.
59:13 Speaker 03 Yeah, there was one, I think it's a later one.
59:15 Speaker 01 Chris Sutton's not saying that.
59:17 Speaker 03 Who was it? Someone, someone, uh, someone scored, I think it was 94 World Cup final, Brazilian, who, uh, scored in, scored like a goal in the World Cup final and they asked him like, uh, in interview afterwards, like, what, what's your secret? And he said, ah, good night, good night shagging the night before. And his wife was watching back at home in Brazil. And his World Cup was in like.
59:38 Speaker 01 America.
59:39 Speaker 03 To me, America, yeah.
59:40 Speaker 02 Mario.
59:41 Speaker 03 Mario, that was it.
59:42 Speaker 02 Yeah, that was right.
59:43 Speaker 01 Brilliant.
59:43 Speaker 03 Divorced it the next day.
59:45 Speaker 01 So Pele, just to wrap up his story, he gets an honorary knighthood by the Queen in 1997. Uh, because he's, uh, he's honorary because he's a nonce, but he's Brazilian.
59:53 Speaker 02 Right, so yeah.
59:54 Speaker 01 Yes, so, or just an honorary knighthood.
59:56 Speaker 02 Yeah.
59:57 Speaker 01 Um, you know, you can't be Sir James Saville because you weren't born here. We like what you're doing abroad.
1:00:04 Speaker 01 He's named athlete of the century by the IOC.
1:00:06 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:00:07 Speaker 01 Quote, "I was born to play football, just like Beethoven was born to write music and Michelangelo was born to paint." I think fair enough. I mean, 1970s, the, when you see that thing he does where he runs part, he runs past the ball.
1:00:22 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:00:23 Speaker 01 And I mean, what, I, I love this era of football because it's the first time these, these things are happening. And so.
1:00:28 Speaker 02 Or they're being captured in.
1:00:30 Speaker 01 Well, no, but no, the first time, it's like the first, the first Cruyff turn.
1:00:32 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:00:33 Speaker 01 You see the people's reaction.
1:00:35 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:00:35 Speaker 01 They're like, "Ooh", it's like a cartoon.
1:00:37 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:00:37 Speaker 01 It's like the first time people heard synth music. They were like, "Ooh."
1:00:40 Speaker 02 Yeah. Or like, yeah, when, you know, in deaf people, you can, they hear again, there's that moment where they.
1:00:45 Speaker 01 Yeah, you like cry, exactly.
1:00:46 Speaker 02 That's the first Cruyff turn.
1:00:48 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:00:50 Speaker 04 Nobby Stiles wasn't doing that.
1:00:51 Speaker 02 No.
1:00:52 Speaker 01 No. So, uh, let's just get to 1974, which, uh, is, was in West Germany.
1:01:00 Speaker 01 And this is held as an intense time globally. Uh, the post, this is like the oil, OPEC crisis.
1:01:07 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:01:08 Speaker 01 The echo, post World Cup consensus.
1:01:09 Speaker 02 We're on our knees.
1:01:10 Speaker 01 We are on our knees. Uh, Heath's in, three day working week.
1:01:14 Speaker 02 Avs turned the light off.
1:01:16 Speaker 01 Uh, they, yep, they tend to.
1:01:16 Speaker 04 Grave diggers on strike.
1:01:17 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:01:18 Speaker 01 Yeah, exactly. Not quite yet.
1:01:19 Speaker 02 That's Carahan at 79, 78.
1:01:21 Speaker 01 So I think Britain don't, England don't qualify for this.
1:01:24 Speaker 02 Yeah. I mean, it's a pretty bleak.
1:01:26 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:01:26 Speaker 02 You don't even have that to, cause the thing is, as we've learned from all of these, if you, if your country can get a, a sporting success, you can like wash all of your failures.
1:01:36 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:01:37 Speaker 02 We had nothing to wash away our failures.
1:01:39 Speaker 01 We couldn't even sports wash.
1:01:40 Speaker 02 We had nothing. Cause we were shit at cricket as well.
1:01:43 Speaker 04 Yeah, yeah, awful.
1:01:43 Speaker 04 And we, we fucked up the 70 World Cup. We were 2-0 up against Germany and got knocked out. The English Hiroshima.
1:01:49 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:01:49 Speaker 01 Of course.
1:01:50 Speaker 04 So then the low, the low begins.
1:01:53 Speaker 01 The England have, England have quite a lot of.
1:01:54 Speaker 02 Only snooker. The snooker's the only thing that's interesting.
1:01:56 Speaker 01 Hiroshimas though. And it does cheapen the analogy.
1:01:58 Speaker 02 Yes, it's true. It's, it's Hiroshima after.
1:02:01 Speaker 01 It's just Hiroshima after another Hiroshima.
1:02:03 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:02:04 Speaker 01 So, East Germany make their debut in 74, uh, the only World Cup they qualify for, and they beat West Germany, the hosts, 1-0. Huge victory for communism. But mainly this, this is about the Dutch team. This is my favorite, uh, team to watch is early total football.
1:02:21 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:02:22 Speaker 01 Where they just basically tear up all the rules, switch positions and no one can handle it because they must be playing systems and the.
1:02:29 Speaker 02 And Cruyff is the person who inspired Pep the most. So it's a lineage that's still seen today fully.
1:02:34 Speaker 01 Cruyff says, uh, a perfect game ends 0-0.
1:02:39 Speaker 02 What do you mean by that?
1:02:39 Speaker 01 Because he means that if you're playing football properly, you don't concede a goal. Yeah.
1:02:45 Speaker 03 I thought it was the other way. I thought it was all free flowing, yeah.
1:02:48 Speaker 01 No, it's all based on not conceding and keeping the ball. If you keep the ball, the other team can't score.
1:02:53 Speaker 03 It's just possession football.
1:02:54 Speaker 01 Possession football. But there's a great quote by, I can't remember, it's David Winner who wrote a book called Brilliant Orange, which I read years ago. There's a great quote that the total football of the Dutch team was, it was like the Beach Boys, the hippie movement, Swinging Sixties and the death of John Lennon, all in one tournament. In that the Dutch play this amazing round of football, get to the final, score in the first minute, and then West Germany win. And they don't, you know, it's like the Dutch still go on about this. That's their, this is the Dutch of Roshma.
1:03:27 Speaker 03 Well, they stitched it up. There was, do you know, there was like, there was like a sabotage thing the week before the final. Cause they, the Dutch players had this like pool party at their hotel a few days before the final. And these girls like joined them in the pool, like took their tops off. Well, I had a great night, like slipped off with the Dutch players. And it then turned out that they had been hired by Bild, you know, the German tabloid paper. And the day, like the night, the day of the World Cup final, the day before the World Cup final, they did this front page spread, like with the headlines like Cruyff champagne, naked girls, swimming pool. And this caused like a massive stir. And apparently the night before the final, all the Dutch players were just on, in their hotel,
1:04:12 Speaker 03 on their phone to the wives back home. Cruyff was up till like three or four in the morning. It's World Cup final. He's playing the World Cup final the next day. Cueing for the paint.
1:04:21 Speaker 02 So they literally just like put them in the doghouse. All of them, put the whole team in the doghouse.
1:04:26 Speaker 03 Bild stitched them up. That's good, good work.
1:04:28 Speaker 01 It is.
1:04:28 Speaker 03 That is pretty good. We do it to our own team.
1:04:30 Speaker 01 Shit house really. Exactly.
1:04:34 Speaker 03 That is true. That's what we do every England tournament.
1:04:36 Speaker 02 Was a bangs man behind Bin.
1:04:40 Speaker 01 You ordered me to go and fuck that grandma behind the bin.
1:04:43 Speaker 02 You can't be putting sexy grannies out like that and expect me not to fuck you.
1:04:46 Speaker 01 What do you think's gonna happen? Bad day to be a grandma.
1:04:50 Speaker 02 What I like about Rooney, he's not the most discerning shagger. That's why I like, there's a purity to it.
1:04:55 Speaker 04 What, BBC grannies?
1:04:56 Speaker 01 A political.
1:04:57 Speaker 02 Sort of, it's just more like, he doesn't have-
1:04:58 Speaker 01 Keep politics out of granny bashing, would you?
1:05:01 Speaker 02 Yeah, but it's just more like, he doesn't seem like, he's not, he's not very vapid with how the women look or anything like that. It's just, it's purely shagging.
1:05:10 Speaker 01 Just shagging.
1:05:12 Speaker 02 It doesn't matter who it is, it doesn't matter how old they are, but the other way, he's the opposite of the nonce. He's only shagging like 90 year olds.
1:05:17 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:05:18 Speaker 04 If you're chasing Pele's numbers, then-
1:05:19 Speaker 02 You've got to be like-
1:05:20 Speaker 01 You've got to be hoovered up, whatever you-
1:05:22 Speaker 02 Yeah, you've got to really be, yeah, getting loads of numbers in those kind of mid-table clubs.
1:05:27 Speaker 04 Pick up, pick up.
1:05:27 Speaker 02 FA Cup, for, you know-
1:05:29 Speaker 04 Soccer aid.
1:05:30 Speaker 01 You've got to be doing that pre-season tour of the care homes in America.
1:05:35 Speaker 01 So, so 97-
1:05:36 Speaker 02 So Netherlands, sorry, Netherlands are the best team to not win the World Cup, right? They've been in three World Cup finals, not one.
1:05:42 Speaker 01 Yeah, but I suppose, you know, that's the best country, this is the best team in the, this is like revolutionary style of football, some of the best players that ever played the game.
1:05:51 Speaker 02 Who else was in there apart from Cruyff? Was there anyone else?
1:05:54 Speaker 04 I looked it up and I'd never heard of any of them. I think they were great in their own-
1:05:57 Speaker 01 Yeah. But also this is based off the Ajax team which dominated the European Cup. But this is, at this point, the World Cup is still the pinnacle of the game. Right, I suppose in the 90s, 1000s, it becomes the Champions League, really.
1:06:09 Speaker 02 But you wouldn't say the Champions League is the pinnacle of the game compared to the World Cup now?
1:06:12 Speaker 01 Yeah, in terms of the quality of, quality of the competition, a club team is better now than a national team.
1:06:19 Speaker 02 Yeah, you're probably right.
1:06:20 Speaker 01 But I still think the prestige of the World Cup means more. Anyway, we're gonna leave this episode here. In our next episode, the Upshot Boys will still be there and we'll be talking about Maradona, South American dictators-
1:06:31 Speaker 02 The Falklands, Thatcher comes in.
1:06:33 Speaker 01 The Hand of God, the Falklands, the whole thing's a disgrace.
1:06:37 Speaker 02 This is my favourite episode, is gonna be the next one, I think.
1:06:39 Speaker 01 It's an absolute South American disgrace, the next episode. They should be ashamed of themselves. That's already on our Patreon, where you can pay £3 a month and get instant access to series. We'll also be doing a bonus episode with Zach and Jack about hooliganism and the Hazel disaster, which is the Liverpool one that we can make jokes about.
1:06:58 Speaker 01 I'm on tour in Liverpool. Anyway, that's on the Patreon and if not, we'll see you next time for the continuation of the World Cup story from everyone here. Goodbye.
1:07:25 Speaker 00 Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' healthcare to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the House Majority PAC dot com. Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.
Previous Fascist Eurovision | The History of The World Cup (Part 1/4) Next First Port Stanley, Now This?? (with The Upshot!) | The History of The World Cup (Part 3/4) Page updated October 30, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated