#581 - Unofficial Bumbags, Anti-Cunning Disease and Susie Dent

We’re creating water cooler moments here on Elis and John. From 'how many t-shirts do you own', to 'is there a God', via the state of play in the treehouse scene. Not sure how or why we got here, but there’s no doubt about it; we’re shaping the nation’s conversations. Move over Traitors, Elis and John are in town. Lightboards firmly switched up, John describes feeling all the emotions whilst on holiday; overwhelm at the studio Freddie Mercury last recorded in, and fear at the hands (pincers) of a massive scorpion in his bedroom. All this, plus we are graced by the presence of the nation’s favourite wordswoman Susie Dent, who brings a high-stakes game with a surprising outcome. If you’re inspired to contribute to one of Elis’s great discussions, send your thoughts to [email protected] right away. For lots of exclusive EJJR #content, join our Patreon at patreon.com/elisandjohn. For weekly visual highlights, head to youtube.com/@elisandjohn. For everything else, head to elisandjohn.com. The Elis James and John Robins Show is a Significant Production. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Before we start this episode, we want to invite you along to the adventures of Ellis and John.

• 0:04Speaker 01

  If you head over to patreon.com/ellisonjohn, you can join us on our monthly escapades, including

• 0:10Speaker 00

  Miniumpicks.

• 0:11Speaker 01

  It's the strangest legal jump in the history of long jump.

• 0:14Speaker 00

  Birdwatching. My two favourite things are birds and football.

• 0:18Speaker 01

  And you can watch our latest episode now, where we tackle an escape room.

• 0:22Speaker 02

  So John is absolutely flying here. Well, Ellis is there as well.

• 0:26Speaker 00

  Ellis is there as well, Dave.

• 0:27Speaker 02

  We did the first three, Dave, for complete chill.

• 0:32Speaker 00

  So for adventures and so much more, head over to patreon.com/ellisonjohn now.

• 0:40Speaker 03

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• 1:30Speaker 00

  Hello, listeners. I'm trying my best. But I owe John, and I owe you an apology. First things first, and there's no way of sugarcoating this, I want to let you all know that I'm the kind of person who knows where Liberia is. My reason for saying this is that last week, in what I can only describe as my Clapham Common, my moment of madness, I said that 1995 Ballon d'Or and World Player of the Year, George Wayat, was Libya's best player ever, when of course he played for and eventually became president of Liberia. These are basic, basic, fundamental facts, and I may as well have said that Shane Wanley cricked for Austria. I am better than this, and I can only blame this error on my alarming

• 2:14Speaker 00

  cognitive decline and the profound regret I feel for allowing Izzy to show the nation my lucky pants on Taskmaster. But I also owe John an apology. Last week, I poured scorn on John's latest idea of asking listeners how many t-shirts they owned. Quite frankly, as a feature, I thought it was weak and weird.

• 2:37Speaker 00

  And I felt validated when Ed Gamble texted me to say he was listening and now regarded our show as a modern art project that plays with the line of what is accepted to be boring, before amazingly admitting that he and Matthew had done the same thing on Radio X in a feature called My Goodness, My Trousers. If anything, I felt smug, especially due to Ed's response, until strangers started coming up to me on public transport to tell me how many t-shirts they owned. I saw my friend Andy from Swansea, who said, I don't know what he's talking about, but Nick, my next door neighbour, asked me to pass on to you that he owns 200 t-shirts.

• 3:15Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 3:16Speaker 02

  Too many.

• 3:17Speaker 00

  200 t-shirts.

• 3:19Speaker 01

  That's something special.

• 3:21Speaker 00

  When I explained, he said, oh, I've not listened to the pod for a few months. Is that what the show is now? And I had to concede that, yes, it probably is. The main thing I don't understand is how John can simultaneously be a man of and hate to be around the people.

• 3:38Speaker 00

  I have spent my life crying at Oasis documentaries and trying to understand the magic of communal events, to connect with people, and yet I just can't make the switchboards light up like him. And so, in my bid to create a watercooler moment, I submit the following three questions for rapid response unit one would answer. Number one, have you ever been impressed by a treehouse?

• 4:02Speaker 00

  Number two, should adults who like Disney be put in jail?

• 4:05Speaker 01

  Okay, these are just yes or no questions.

• 4:07Speaker 00

  Well, that's a rapid response unit, isn't it?

• 4:09Speaker 01

  No.

• 4:10Speaker 00

  People say yes, all right.

• 4:11Speaker 01

  That's not a watercooler moment, is it?

• 4:13Speaker 00

  Yeah, because people will come up to me and say, I have been impressed by a treehouse.

• 4:16Speaker 01

  But then the conversation ends.

• 4:18Speaker 00

  Yeah, well, it ended when I got told that Nick had 200 t-shirts. I went, has he?

• 4:22Speaker 01

  No, but you might go, what type of t-shirts? Are they sentimental? Do you collect them?

• 4:26Speaker 00

  Tell me about your treehouse.

• 4:32Speaker 02

  Go on, watch the third.

• 4:33Speaker 00

  Is death really the end?

• 4:34Speaker 01

  Another yes or no question.

• 4:36Speaker 00

  Why can't I say, well, what do you think happens then?

• 4:43Speaker 01

  Have I ever been impressed by a treehouse? Probably.

• 4:46Speaker 00

  I have.

• 4:46Speaker 02

  I haven't.

• 4:47Speaker 00

  What, as a kid?

• 4:48Speaker 02

  They are always rubbish.

• 4:49Speaker 00

  As a kid?

• 4:50Speaker 02

  They are always, it is always the same thing. Oh, you should come around to my house. My dad's built me a treehouse. And you imagine that it's like got an on sweet, and it's just incredible, and it's got sky, and you can watch-

• 5:02Speaker 01

  He's just nicked a wooden pallet from work and wedged it in a tree.

• 5:06Speaker 02

  And wedged it in a tree, or nailed it between two branches.

• 5:10Speaker 01

  No, my mate Tom.

• 5:11Speaker 02

  And you get to sit on the pallet for a bit. My mate, my mate Tom in Woodford had a cracking treehouse in the field in the back of his garden.

• 5:18Speaker 00

  What do you mean by that?

• 5:19Speaker 02

  I mean, in the-

• 5:21Speaker 00

  Did it have a roof?

• 5:22Speaker 02

  No.

• 5:24Speaker 00

  Dave.

• 5:26Speaker 02

  But it was big, like it had layers.

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Wait, it was a big pallet?

• 5:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a number of pallets.

• 5:32Speaker 00

  Could you charge your phone on it?

• 5:33Speaker 02

  No, because phones weren't really even a big thing in 1996.

• 5:36Speaker 00

  Could you charge your video on it?

• 5:38Speaker 02

  Charge your video?

• 5:39Speaker 00

  Plug in your video.

• 5:40Speaker 01

  Or do you have a snaz in it?

• 5:42Speaker 02

  You could have put a, you could have, you could have taken a Game Boy up there, sure.

• 5:46Speaker 00

  What were you doing up there?

• 5:47Speaker 01

  The problem is-

• 5:48Speaker 02

  Hanging out.

• 5:48Speaker 00

  Why are you going up there in the rain?

• 5:50Speaker 02

  No, God, no, there's no roof on the thing.

• 5:53Speaker 01

  Well, this is the thing, because a treehouse without a roof might as well just be the tree.

• 5:57Speaker 02

  Well, no, but then you build into it. It's, I think, you've, no, as a kid, treehouses are exciting.

• 6:03Speaker 00

  You imagine it to be so much better than they are.

• 6:06Speaker 02

  No, it depends how much effort you want to put in. You weren't putting in the effort, Ellis, clearly.

• 6:09Speaker 00

  Do you know what?

• 6:09Speaker 02

  I wasn't building them, I was a child. I see, when you're meant to build them.

• 6:13Speaker 01

  I get a train past a lot of gardens, like it's 25 miles of people's back gardens on the way into London. A lot of treehouses, I've never seen any kids in them. And I can almost hear the dad staring out of the window at it going, it took me three weeks.

• 6:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:29Speaker 01

  He never bloody uses it, he's on his phone.

• 6:31Speaker 00

  Have you ever said wow?

• 6:33Speaker 01

  No, I've never said wow.

• 6:36Speaker 02

  All right, fine. Disney?

• 6:38Speaker 01

  Treehouses, what was the next one? Should adults who like Disney go to prison?

• 6:43Speaker 01

  No, I don't think they should.

• 6:45Speaker 02

  All right. Because Moana was Disney. Big fan of Moana.

• 6:49Speaker 00

  Well, you are.

• 6:50Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 6:52Speaker 01

  And what was the third one?

• 6:53Speaker 00

  Is, is death really the end?

• 6:56Speaker 01

  Well, it's not the end.

• 6:57Speaker 00

  We're creating watercooler moments.

• 7:00Speaker 02

  Leila asked me that on Wednesday on the way to Athletic.

• 7:02Speaker 01

  Oh, that's a tough one. What did you say?

• 7:04Speaker 02

  Well, she asked me if I believed in God.

• 7:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:06Speaker 02

  And then, and then she asked, do we, do we turn into something after we die?

• 7:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, I do. And I'm in a ticket queue to go and see him next year. They're doing Nebloth.

• 7:17Speaker 02

  I have a God and he's on Twitter three times a day. It's Liam Gallagher. I think, yeah, I was quite vague in the old, in the old answer. Because I'm not really sure whether I do. So it's quite hard to then offer a firm opinion on the whole God thing to Leila.

• 7:30Speaker 00

  Kids, when they're between sort of six and 10, they often, they're often fascinated by death.

• 7:37Speaker 02

  Well, she wants to come back as a guinea pig. So, so the whole kind of, you know, afterlife stuff and incarnation is-

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Also, they only live for a couple of years. They get to choose what you come back as after the guinea pig.

• 7:49Speaker 02

  She then wants to come back as a cat. She's through. She's through. She's just coming back as the animals that we have at our house.

• 7:56Speaker 01

  But that's nice.

• 7:57Speaker 02

  It is.

• 7:57Speaker 00

  It's very sweet. Maybe a tortoise, one of those big ones that lives 150 years.

• 8:00Speaker 02

  I had a tortoise on Saturday at my friend Dan's house.

• 8:03Speaker 00

  Did you?

• 8:03Speaker 02

  Tortoises are mad. They're so hard on the bottom and the top.

• 8:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:07Speaker 02

  I always thought they were soft underneath.

• 8:09Speaker 01

  My neighbour's one got run over, we think, or a fox got it. It's weird that we've pivoted from how many t-shirts you've got to is there a God?

• 8:16Speaker 00

  Yeah, but that's the kind of fleet footed broadcasting we're capable of.

• 8:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, so in your face, Ed Gamble.

• 8:22Speaker 00

  It was, honestly, people I've never, I've had DMs, I've had people come up to me at football saying, I've got 48 t-shirts out. I was like, really? I just, I just didn't expect it.

• 8:34Speaker 01

  Dave, I am the Pied Piper of the terraces. I am setting Britain's conversation in the terraces.

• 8:43Speaker 00

  It's so annoying.

• 8:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, because I would hate to be in the terraces.

• 8:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 8:46Speaker 01

  It'd be awful. But I'd like to know they're chatting about my topics.

• 8:49Speaker 00

  How can you understand a thing you hate?

• 8:52Speaker 01

  Well, that's a good question.

• 8:54Speaker 02

  LBC stands for Leading Britain's Conversation. Maybe that's where you need to be one day.

• 8:58Speaker 01

  If the money's right.

• 9:01Speaker 01

  You say you get right wingers as you get older.

• 9:05Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 9:05Speaker 00

  James O'Brien's not right wing.

• 9:07Speaker 01

  No, and I did his podcast, which is out today, in fact.

• 9:09Speaker 02

  Is it? I will listen to that on the way home. I love that podcast.

• 9:12Speaker 00

  What's it about your book?

• 9:13Speaker 01

  Yes, but we-

• 9:14Speaker 00

  Is it a bit boo hoo heavy? She's still banging on about that book.

• 9:18Speaker 01

  We go in quite heavy on sort of up to my teenage years, and then we have to fast forward to the end because we run out of time.

• 9:26Speaker 02

  Oh, no.

• 9:27Speaker 01

  He's a love, very good interviewer.

• 9:28Speaker 00

  He's a lovely guy.

• 9:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:29Speaker 00

  When did you get to the t-shirts?

• 9:32Speaker 01

  Didn't talk about how many t-shirts I had.

• 9:34Speaker 00

  Wow. Oh, it's before you came up with your big idea, I suppose.

• 9:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, I guess we sort of skirted around whether there's a God, sort of God of your own understanding.

• 9:43Speaker 02

  Did he remember you from the X days, do you think? The Radio X days?

• 9:47Speaker 01

  I never expect anyone to remember me from anything, Dave.

• 9:49Speaker 00

  No, I'm like that. If anyone remembers me, I'm absolutely amazed every single time.

• 9:54Speaker 01

  Or terrified.

• 9:55Speaker 00

  Or terrified.

• 9:58Speaker 01

  So yes, Ellis is now on day 12 of his hangover.

• 10:01Speaker 00

  Because of the unique way we record this podcast.

• 10:03Speaker 02

  No, day five.

• 10:04Speaker 00

  Day five, yeah.

• 10:05Speaker 02

  We've gone back in time. It is tricky.

• 10:07Speaker 01

  Well, he might have had another drink since then.

• 10:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:10Speaker 01

  But that was a very good introduction.

• 10:12Speaker 02

  It was.

• 10:12Speaker 01

  Considering the state you've been and the absolute mess you've been on off mic, spilling your water twice, up and down to the toilet like a yo-yo.

• 10:21Speaker 00

  There's a problem with my glass.

• 10:23Speaker 01

  There's a problem with Ellis's glass. They'll tell you what the problem is, it's half empty. Whereas me and Dave's are half full.

• 10:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, we are actually. Chipper chaps over here.

• 10:32Speaker 01

  Yes, I've just come back from, have we heard of Domodossola? Have we heard of Italy? So I don't have any more specific information.

• 10:43Speaker 02

  Is that it?

• 10:43Speaker 01

  It's in a valley, but I forgot the name of the valley. It's where four valleys meet.

• 10:47Speaker 00

  Oh, nice.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  I've been away eye climbing in the very north Italian Alps, and on the way, I visited Montreux.

• 10:57Speaker 00

  Did you?

• 10:57Speaker 01

  Yes, I did. And let me tell you, I was not, well, I knew I was staying in the Freddie Mercury Hotel.

• 11:05Speaker 00

  What do you mean by that?

• 11:06Speaker 01

  There's a Freddie Mercury Hotel in Montreux.

• 11:08Speaker 00

  Anything to do with him?

• 11:09Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 11:09Speaker 00

  There's a Beatles hotel in Liverpool, there's nothing to do with the Beatles.

• 11:12Speaker 01

  It's not nothing to do with the Beatles, it's called the Beatles Hotel.

• 11:15Speaker 00

  Yeah, but like, you know.

• 11:16Speaker 01

  Historically. It's just called it.

• 11:17Speaker 00

  No, no, no, but like Paul McCartney hasn't invested in it.

• 11:20Speaker 01

  Right.

• 11:21Speaker 00

  It's a Beatles themed hotel.

• 11:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, the Freddie Mercury Hotel is a Freddie Mercury themed hotel.

• 11:26Speaker 00

  Oh, okay.

• 11:27Speaker 01

  So that was the obvious choice for where to stay in Montreux.

• 11:30Speaker 00

  Is it nice?

• 11:31Speaker 01

  It was, yes, I loved it.

• 11:36Speaker 00

  Where did you stand in the league table of Queen fans at the Freddie Mercury Hotel?

• 11:44Speaker 01

  Good cue. Most people there, I think, were just staying in it because it was one of the cheaper hotels in Montreux.

• 11:50Speaker 00

  Right, okay. Because it does amaze me that your level of Queen fandom is not unique.

• 11:59Speaker 01

  Oh, no.

• 11:59Speaker 00

  Or you're not an outlier.

• 12:01Speaker 01

  No, no, no.

• 12:01Speaker 00

  There are some real Queen oddballs out there.

• 12:03Speaker 01

  Big time. And if I'd thought about it, I didn't even bring any Queen clothing.

• 12:09Speaker 00

  If you'd walked in in the jacket, John.

• 12:11Speaker 01

  I could have walked in, I bet, that wouldn't be the first time that's happened in the Queen Hotel. Because Freddie Mercury's birthday, people go out there and there's lots of wreaths laid around the statue. Because Montreux, Montreux, I always call it Montrou, but it's not Montrou, but I'm gonna have to say Montrou because that's how I spell it.

• 12:27Speaker 02

  It sounds like you're saying it in like a Yorkshire accent.

• 12:29Speaker 01

  Montreux.

• 12:30Speaker 00

  Montreux.

• 12:30Speaker 01

  From home. Yeah. Montreux, I tell you what, a good, great, big Freddie Mercury statue right on water. I'd have used that brass for tackle and for horse bridles if I had my way, but they would have put a statue up to that Freddie Mercury.

• 12:50Speaker 00

  Now, just for the avoidance of doubt, John has a lot of family from Yorkshire, so he's allowed to say.

• 12:54Speaker 01

  Hell, yeah, yeah. So I knew there was a Freddie Mercury statue there. I knew there was the Queen's Studio Experience, because what happened was Queen bought Mountain Studios in Montrou. And that's where they recorded a lot of their later albums. Freddie Mercury rented an apartment there, which he was sort of doing up when he died. So I knew there's a big history and the photo on the front of Made in Heaven, the final studio album, is of the view over that lake.

• 13:27Speaker 00

  Oh, is it?

• 13:28Speaker 01

  So if you get that up, I think it's actually the statue, because I think the statue had been unveiled by then.

• 13:34Speaker 02

  Oh, so that's not Freddie, that's the statue on Made in Heaven?

• 13:37Speaker 01

  Let me see, I should know that, I should know this, Dave.

• 13:41Speaker 02

  I think if you click on the picture, make it bigger. This is too visual for an audio medium.

• 13:44Speaker 01

  I think that's the view of from his, the apartment he was doing up and they maybe superimposed the statue or just a thing. Anyway, I should know that, but I don't.

• 13:53Speaker 00

  Could I see the photograph, please?

• 13:54Speaker 02

  Google Made in Heaven.

• 13:55Speaker 01

  Google Made in Heaven album.

• 13:57Speaker 02

  If you wanna be in the gang here.

• 13:58Speaker 00

  That looks like a statue to me.

• 14:00Speaker 01

  But what I didn't realise is how much Queen merch and artwork is in Montrou, just in general.

• 14:09Speaker 00

  The town.

• 14:10Speaker 01

  Like when you go to Naples.

• 14:12Speaker 00

  And it's all Maradona stuff.

• 14:13Speaker 01

  It's Maradona stuff. Now, there weren't big, like, fan art on the sides of buildings like in Naples. But every sort of souvenir shop had a Queen section.

• 14:22Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:23Speaker 01

  With T-shirts I hadn't seen.

• 14:24Speaker 00

  Oh, no.

• 14:25Speaker 01

  Unofficial bum bags, that sort of thing. And like paintings and fan art and all that stuff. So it was a real treat. Also, Montrou itself is stunning.

• 14:38Speaker 00

  Is it?

• 14:38Speaker 01

  Have you ever been?

• 14:39Speaker 00

  No.

• 14:40Speaker 01

  Wowsers, trousers, that's one heck of a view.

• 14:43Speaker 00

  What was the weather like?

• 14:44Speaker 01

  Fantastic.

• 14:45Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 14:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, great weather.

• 14:48Speaker 01

  But we went to the Mountain Studios Experience, which is, it's a casino now, which is, leaks me out.

• 14:56Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:56Speaker 01

  But they have preserved lots of stuff from the recording studio and it's free to get in.

• 15:03Speaker 00

  Oh, cool.

• 15:03Speaker 01

  Which is amazing. And they've got loads of handwritten lyrics on loan from the Brian May Archive.

• 15:10Speaker 02

  Really?

• 15:10Speaker 01

  They've got some original clothing, they've got really well-written sort of guides to the different studio engineers.

• 15:19Speaker 00

  I should say, there's an Ellis and John museum without our clothing.

• 15:22Speaker 01

  Well, I've got 76 T-shirts to donate.

• 15:26Speaker 00

  Handwritten running orders.

• 15:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, but there's, there's just so much stuff, it's really good. And then you can go into the actual mixing desk.

• 15:38Speaker 00

  Oh, wow.

• 15:40Speaker 01

  And they've got two songs and you can mix it, so they've separated out the tracks.

• 15:44Speaker 00

  And improved them.

• 15:46Speaker 01

  Well, there's a nice video from Roger Taylor saying, you know, we've created this, you get to mix the song.

• 15:50Speaker 00

  Oh, a fun thing.

• 15:51Speaker 02

  That's cool, it's like the stems.

• 15:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:53Speaker 02

  Nice.

• 15:54Speaker 01

  And he said, whatever you do, just make the drums the loudest thing, which is a nice bit of fun.

• 15:57Speaker 00

  Lovely little joke.

• 15:59Speaker 01

  But I was suddenly, I was really overcome with emotion. So when I was like 13, getting into 12, getting into Queen, that was, that remains to this day, the only studio album that's been released while I was a fan of theirs. So I had all of the versions of all of the singles, all of the coloured vinyls.

• 16:17Speaker 00

  Oh, wow.

• 16:18Speaker 01

  I like remember desperate for it to get to number one in the charts. I was a member of the fan club at the time, so I was getting all of the sort of magazines about it. And then to be able to listen to his isolated vocals.

• 16:32Speaker 00

  Oh, cool.

• 16:32Speaker 01

  On the same desk, which were the last things he ever sung into a microphone.

• 16:37Speaker 00

  Oh, cool.

• 16:38Speaker 01

  Behind you is a little sort of plaque on the floor where he stood to record his last ever vocal. And there's a description on the wall from the studio engineer who, it was just him and Freddie in the studio on that final day, because.

• 16:53Speaker 00

  Because he was unwell, wasn't he, for that?

• 16:55Speaker 01

  He was very unwell and Brian was off doing some promo for his solo album, Roger wasn't, wasn't in the country or whatever. And he said Freddie was like, let's just go in and do it. And Freddie was doing take after take after take. And it was so really profoundly moving to be in that space. And I realised that in the merch shop.

• 17:19Speaker 00

  You just simply had to have a bum bag.

• 17:22Speaker 02

  That's what Freddie would have wanted.

• 17:24Speaker 01

  In the merch shop, they sell loads of, you know, Queen Experience hoodies and.

• 17:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:29Speaker 01

  And all the money goes to the Mercury Phoenix Trust, which is an AIDS awareness and an AIDS charity for people in developing countries with AIDS and HIV. And they've got this Mountain Studios T-shirt, like a sort of fake vintage T-shirt. And I realised that's the T-shirt I bought at the Freddie Mercury auction, is that logo. So I've got Freddie's Mountain Studios T-shirt from that studio. And I kind of hadn't put the connection together in my head, that it was.

• 18:03Speaker 02

  Well, so was it, what did you get at the auction, Freddie's actual T-shirt?

• 18:07Speaker 01

  They were like, hun, we could, we could count how many T-shirts Freddie Mercury had.

• 18:14Speaker 02

  No, I don't think we could.

• 18:16Speaker 01

  Because they all went up for sale.

• 18:17Speaker 02

  And didn't they?

• 18:17Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:18Speaker 01

  And some of them.

• 18:18Speaker 00

  It'd be logged, it'd all be online.

• 18:20Speaker 01

  So the ones that had featured.

• 18:22Speaker 00

  Dave, Google how many T-shirts Freddie Mercury had.

• 18:24Speaker 02

  Won't be an answer.

• 18:26Speaker 01

  So the ones that, so you remember when I was live bidding on air?

• 18:29Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 18:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, god, do I, five live, remember?

• 18:31Speaker 01

  So the T-shirt.

• 18:32Speaker 00

  We were live on the radio.

• 18:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:35Speaker 00

  And you were, I'm gonna say it, distracted.

• 18:39Speaker 01

  So the clothes that he wore in Queen videos went for hundreds of thousands. The clothes that he wore in, captured on film or on, in famous PR pictures, went for tens of thousands.

• 18:53Speaker 00

  The clothes he wore in bed.

• 18:54Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:55Speaker 01

  They're, they're in my ballpark.

• 18:57Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, T-shirts he, he sort of, he wore to like do the painting and that kind of stuff.

• 19:01Speaker 01

  So they either sold them in like batches of 10, which they didn't do. Or they sold them individually if they were.

• 19:09Speaker 00

  You were buying them from Tesco.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  It's like a car boot sale, almost.

• 19:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was.

• 19:14Speaker 00

  Get your T-shirts.

• 19:16Speaker 01

  They, but every so often, there was one with maybe a slightly interesting design that they sold on its own. And I got one of those and it was Freddie's Mountain Studios T-shirt that he wore in the 70s.

• 19:26Speaker 00

  What have you done with it?

• 19:27Speaker 01

  Well, here's the thing.

• 19:30Speaker 00

  I've got many questions, actually.

• 19:31Speaker 01

  Often, like, is the way with the things you crave, once you've got them, they end up being in your cupboard for years.

• 19:40Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 19:41Speaker 01

  Because what do you do? I haven't got any, you know, I can't, I haven't got space in my house for a Freddie Mercury display. Well, that's a lie, because I have one.

• 19:49Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah.

• 19:50Speaker 01

  But it just so happens that.

• 19:52Speaker 00

  Mad when I think about how small your house is and yet you found the room for a Freddie Mercury display.

• 19:58Speaker 01

  So I need to get it framed, but it's just one of those things you keep putting on.

• 20:01Speaker 00

  Well, I was gonna say, if you.

• 20:02Speaker 01

  Like, Dave, you've got Sergio Aguero's snood.

• 20:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's just in my drawer.

• 20:06Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 20:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 20:08Speaker 01

  But I now need to, I think it deserves to be in that exhibition, so I'm gonna look into contacting them.

• 20:17Speaker 00

  Are you?

• 20:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:18Speaker 00

  Oh, wow.

• 20:18Speaker 01

  Because I think it would, it would be so cool for people to sort of see a T-shirt of, with the logo of the studio.

• 20:25Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 20:26Speaker 01

  That Freddie owned, so I'm gonna look into getting it there somehow. It's better there than in my cupboard.

• 20:33Speaker 00

  Have you put it on?

• 20:34Speaker 01

  No, he was thin.

• 20:38Speaker 00

  Oh, really?

• 20:39Speaker 01

  He was a small man.

• 20:41Speaker 00

  Was he?

• 20:42Speaker 01

  Well, you don't, it's like, I'm never gonna make this comparison again, it's like Hitler. Because.

• 20:47Speaker 00

  Yeah, please don't.

• 20:48Speaker 01

  But you're always looking up at him.

• 20:51Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 20:51Speaker 01

  Well, because, no, as in, as in like physically.

• 20:54Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, understood.

• 20:55Speaker 01

  Right, I, I take back that comparison, but important men.

• 20:59Speaker 02

  Charlie Chaplin, is that?

• 21:01Speaker 01

  Mussolini?

• 21:03Speaker 00

  Mussolini was small.

• 21:04Speaker 01

  Well, they're often small in real life.

• 21:06Speaker 00

  But again, he's also a fascist.

• 21:07Speaker 01

  Tom Cruise is who I should have gone with. Kylie Minogue. But when you're looking at people in powerful poses filmed from audiences, they look big, was, Freddie was like 28 inch waist.

• 21:21Speaker 00

  Good grief.

• 21:22Speaker 02

  Well, you were 28 at one point, weren't you?

• 21:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, as a child. No, no, when I was 18.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  In the 70s, also in the 70s, all men were like stick thin, like David Bowie.

• 21:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 21:33Speaker 01

  In, so.

• 21:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, I saw his clothes at the V and A and it's sort of. Hilarious how thin he is.

• 21:38Speaker 01

  If I put that T-shirt on, it would immediately halve in value.

• 21:44Speaker 01

  So.

• 21:45Speaker 00

  Have you put your head through the hole?

• 21:48Speaker 01

  No, but I have smelt it in a, in a nice way.

• 21:53Speaker 00

  They can't prove that.

• 21:54Speaker 01

  In a kind, loving way.

• 21:56Speaker 00

  Have you cuddled it?

• 21:58Speaker 01

  No, because again, that would affect its resale value.

• 22:02Speaker 02

  You're gonna sell it to the museum or are you gonna give it to the museum?

• 22:05Speaker 01

  I don't know.

• 22:07Speaker 00

  Interesting.

• 22:08Speaker 01

  I would imagine it would be.

• 22:09Speaker 00

  But it is.

• 22:10Speaker 01

  A matter for our legal department.

• 22:12Speaker 00

  But it is funny.

• 22:13Speaker 01

  Look into it and get a legal department.

• 22:15Speaker 00

  But it is strange because you sort of crave things and then you.

• 22:18Speaker 01

  Is David Panic free?

• 22:20Speaker 02

  Panic on the Streets of London. God, he's got a lot of coverage over the last two episodes. He is free at the minute. No, no, or is he? No, they've just lodged the appeal. No, he's busy again.

• 22:27Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 22:28Speaker 02

  He had a few days off.

• 22:29Speaker 00

  Like, obviously I couldn't afford to spend 380 grand on Johnny Marr's Rickabacker.

• 22:33Speaker 01

  No.

• 22:33Speaker 00

  But I did look at it.

• 22:34Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 22:35Speaker 00

  And then I, well, as I was looking at it, I thought to myself, but what I really want is A to be able to play guitar like Johnny Marr and B be his friend. Because once I own it and it's been played by me, it kind of loses its magic.

• 22:48Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 22:49Speaker 00

  And I, I had this very strange moment of clarity where I thought I would just be playing, you know, I'm obviously not as good a guitarist as Johnny Marr. So then suddenly the guitar, the guitar becomes very normal.

• 23:01Speaker 02

  And you kind of are now nearly his friend.

• 23:04Speaker 00

  I wouldn't go that far.

• 23:05Speaker 02

  He took to you. I saw the glint in the eye.

• 23:08Speaker 00

  I would say it went better. Meeting him went better than I anticipated.

• 23:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:13Speaker 00

  But that, that, because once you've got the T-shirt, sort of, I suppose, because you bought it at auction. So was it sent, it was delivered to you or did you have to go and pick it up?

• 23:20Speaker 01

  When I picked it up.

• 23:21Speaker 00

  So when you went and picked up the, you know, the, the moment you take it out the box, you're like, oh my God, that's my idol's T-shirt. And then it's, then it is a T-shirt.

• 23:29Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, all of these things that you attach a great deal of value to when you're doing it to material things, I think, do tend to lose there. I sort of felt very strongly in that room, hearing that voice, this shouldn't be in my cupboard, just because I wanted it for a week at one point and bid for it live on air.

• 23:47Speaker 01

  It should be seen by people who are very passionate about.

• 23:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 23:51Speaker 01

  What he did and where he worked. So a wonderful trip to Montreux.

• 23:55Speaker 02

  Great.

• 23:56Speaker 01

  Then I climbing in Les Alpes.

• 23:58Speaker 00

  Oh, lovely.

• 23:59Speaker 01

  Which was really nice. Though are you, there was one nasty surprise. Are either of you familiar with the phrase? Se uno scorpione del [BLEEP] Solmuero.

• 24:11Speaker 02

  Well, I recognise one of those words.

• 24:13Speaker 00

  There's a scorpion on the wall.

• 24:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, you might have to bleep some of that for any Italian listeners, Dave.

• 24:17Speaker 02

  Oh, is it sweary?

• 24:18Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 24:19Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 24:19Speaker 01

  It's what I, what I said.

• 24:21Speaker 00

  There's an effing scorpion on the wall.

• 24:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. I didn't know you get scorpions in the Alps.

• 24:26Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 24:27Speaker 01

  And we found two of them, one in the wall and one in the sink.

• 24:31Speaker 02

  Were they big?

• 24:32Speaker 00

  In the sink?

• 24:33Speaker 01

  Hmm. They are big enough to.

• 24:38Speaker 00

  Startle.

• 24:39Speaker 01

  To dramatically change the structure of your day.

• 24:42Speaker 00

  And stop you from brushing your teeth?

• 24:44Speaker 01

  Yes, and cause you to tell your beau that she was responsible for carrying out pre-bed checks in every room.

• 24:51Speaker 00

  Cool. Nice life.

• 24:54Speaker 02

  Are they fast?

• 24:55Speaker 01

  Um, didn't give it the chance to show off its speed.

• 24:59Speaker 00

  So what did you, what did you do to it?

• 25:01Speaker 01

  I hit it with a big book.

• 25:03Speaker 02

  Did you?

• 25:04Speaker 01

  Yes, Dave, because it was a scorpion on the [BLEEP] wall.

• 25:09Speaker 00

  And then did it come back to life, like in a horror film?

• 25:11Speaker 02

  I know, that's what I'd be worried about.

• 25:12Speaker 01

  In my dreams and in my darker thoughts. No, but I do dream about scorpions.

• 25:18Speaker 02

  My worry in that scenario.

• 25:20Speaker 01

  Is that there's a scorpion on the wall and you're like, oh no, my worries come true.

• 25:24Speaker 02

  No, but I don't know enough about scorpions that I worry that if I hit it with a book, they're a bit like cockroaches. And actually it doesn't, it doesn't hurt it, it just angers it.

• 25:33Speaker 01

  Or it will suddenly ingest all the information and become an expert on Wuthering Heights.

• 25:38Speaker 01

  There's only one person Wuthering after that height.

• 25:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:41Speaker 01

  It was a scorpion.

• 25:42Speaker 00

  Hit it with a paperback.

• 25:43Speaker 01

  Uh, no, hardback.

• 25:45Speaker 02

  But yeah, I just, I would worry that I didn't know what the next thing would be that would happen. What if it didn't die?

• 25:49Speaker 01

  Well, the police don't come.

• 25:51Speaker 02

  But what if it then just scuttles up your leg because it's angry?

• 25:54Speaker 01

  Oh, Dave, I can't imagine it. I can't bear it. One thing on earth worse than spiders and it's scorpions.

• 26:02Speaker 02

  Are they black?

• 26:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:03Speaker 02

  Black as the day is long. Interesting.

• 26:05Speaker 00

  I'm gonna go.

• 26:06Speaker 01

  Black as the day as long as they say.

• 26:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:08Speaker 00

  I could imagine scorpions.

• 26:10Speaker 01

  It were horrible. And, and then it just makes you afraid.

• 26:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:14Speaker 01

  For the rest of your trip.

• 26:15Speaker 02

  Because you know they're around.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  Yeah. And they fluoresce.

• 26:18Speaker 00

  Oh, they're not dangerous to humans.

• 26:20Speaker 02

  There you go.

• 26:21Speaker 01

  All right then.

• 26:22Speaker 00

  Oh, you could have just lived with you. Typically comparable in pain and effect of a bee or a wasp. Get over it.

• 26:27Speaker 02

  Oh, man.

• 26:28Speaker 00

  Well, they're, they're like, you can fit them on the palm of your hand.

• 26:31Speaker 01

  Oh, well, you might as well keep them as a pet and have them crawling around your neck all day.

• 26:35Speaker 00

  They've got little pincers at the front.

• 26:36Speaker 01

  Yes, they've got enormous pincers at the front.

• 26:39Speaker 02

  Adorable.

• 26:39Speaker 00

  Oh, is that it?

• 26:40Speaker 01

  What do you mean, is that it? It's a scorpion, you [BLEEP].

• 26:46Speaker 02

  I was bleeping that.

• 26:49Speaker 02

  I love that. That was four seconds of you trying to think about what word to say and you still went for that word. You're better than that.

• 26:59Speaker 00

  But now, now I, now I'm, now I've been reassured that it can't kill me or my family. I'm fine with it.

• 27:04Speaker 01

  Okay. Why don't you go and live in a pit full of millipedes and rats and scorpions? And will look down into the pit and go, they're all harmless to humans.

• 27:16Speaker 00

  Uh, rats can bite and spread diseases.

• 27:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, so can I.

• 27:21Speaker 00

  Bit me.

• 27:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:23Speaker 00

  Gave me a disease.

• 27:25Speaker 02

  Right.

• 27:27Speaker 01

  El scorpione, Dave.

• 27:29Speaker 02

  Yes, got it.

• 27:30Speaker 01

  Um, and I ate too much cheese and that's the end. And it was beautiful. And I had a good time apart from being afraid of scorpions 24 hours a day.

• 27:37Speaker 02

  But that's good. You've, you've learned something there. You now, you know.

• 27:40Speaker 01

  I learned never to go to an area of the Alps where scorpions are alive.

• 27:44Speaker 00

  Yeah. The only true risks are the possibility of an allergic reaction to the sting being received by babies or small pets. Although it should be pretty harmless. Oh, come on, you flea. Get over it.

• 27:57Speaker 02

  Shall we connect?

• 27:58Speaker 01

  Oh, they fluoresce at night.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  What does that mean?

• 28:00Speaker 01

  That means that people find scorpions by shining a UV torch around a room because they glow.

• 28:07Speaker 00

  Okay, that's a good thing out of a horror film.

• 28:09Speaker 01

  Yes, it is. It is a horror film happening in your life.

• 28:12Speaker 02

  That's quite, they look quite pretty.

• 28:13Speaker 01

  No, a scorpion is the worst looking thing. Though, do you know how I handled it in my mind?

• 28:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, not well, it seems.

• 28:20Speaker 01

  No, I said they look.

• 28:21Speaker 00

  Better than reality?

• 28:22Speaker 01

  No, I said they look like the devil, which is why they're scary. And then my, my partner made the point that we should see them as like metal fans.

• 28:32Speaker 00

  Heavy metal fans, right. Like mini Ed gambles.

• 28:35Speaker 01

  Because they're the most intimidating looking people.

• 28:38Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 28:39Speaker 01

  But they are always the most gentle, sensitive.

• 28:41Speaker 00

  Friendly nerds.

• 28:42Speaker 01

  Friendly nerds. So I tried to imagine that the scorpion was just on his way to a Black Sabbath gig or on his way to see, you know, Death Goat or whatever it is.

• 28:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:51Speaker 01

  And they're wearing all the like.

• 28:53Speaker 00

  Ghost prolapse.

• 28:54Speaker 01

  All of the chains and studs and tattoos.

• 28:58Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:58Speaker 01

  But actually inside is a guy who just wants to make friends.

• 29:01Speaker 00

  Yeah. Bye, man. I'm off to the heavy metal gig.

• 29:03Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 29:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:06Speaker 01

  So.

• 29:06Speaker 02

  That, did that work?

• 29:07Speaker 01

  It did a bit.

• 29:08Speaker 02

  Did it?

• 29:08Speaker 01

  Because I thought he doesn't know what he looks like.

• 29:11Speaker 02

  No, oh.

• 29:12Speaker 00

  Chuckie looks in the mirror and thinks, God, I am quite intimidating. I'm quite buff.

• 29:16Speaker 01

  All he can see is his little pincers.

• 29:19Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 29:20Speaker 01

  So maybe he thinks, oh, poor, I wish I, I wish, you know, everyone always squashes me when I, I just want to chat.

• 29:27Speaker 00

  Yeah. I wouldn't mind reading Wuthering Heights first, actually.

• 29:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 29:35Speaker 03

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• 30:09Speaker 02

  We have stuff to do.

• 30:10Speaker 01

  Yes, we've got a guest coming in.

• 30:12Speaker 02

  We've got Susie Dent coming in to play a word-based made up game, which is exciting.

• 30:16Speaker 01

  1-0 to John.

• 30:17Speaker 02

  But before that, we must connect, of course.

• 30:20Speaker 01

  Okay, yes, of course. It's everyone's favourite feature, the Cymru Connection. Breaking news, everyone. A rare species of moth has been found in North Wales. It's called the big. Sorry, this has thrown me.

• 30:36Speaker 01

  Breaking news, everyone. A rare species of moth has been found in North Wales. It's called the boggrass moth. And it was found at the Coes Gairh National Nature Reserve in Gwynedd.

• 30:47Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 30:47Speaker 01

  Many questions are currently being asked. How did the moth get there? How do we better preserve? Is this real?

• 30:53Speaker 02

  Is this real, Michael? Yeah, yeah. We're topical as well, John.

• 30:57Speaker 00

  Still doing the same feature?

• 30:58Speaker 02

  Well, we're just trying to have a bit of fun with it.

• 31:02Speaker 00

  Part of Mothwatch.

• 31:04Speaker 01

  How do we preserve natural spaces so that more rare species can be found? And most importantly, can Elis James overcome his North Walian blind spot and make a connection with either the scientists who discovered the moth or indeed the moth itself?

• 31:17Speaker 02

  There you go.

• 31:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 31:18Speaker 00

  I'm not friends with moths.

• 31:20Speaker 01

  Nor am I. Good grief, they're back with a vengeance.

• 31:22Speaker 02

  But they're just, we don't know what they look like.

• 31:24Speaker 01

  They're just chomping up all your clothes.

• 31:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, but you know, they're.

• 31:27Speaker 01

  Which were bought at auction.

• 31:31Speaker 00

  Imagine.

• 31:32Speaker 01

  That's cotton.

• 31:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:33Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 31:34Speaker 01

  There's only one way to find out. Welcome to the Cymru Connection. It's another Cymru Connection. Ellis thinks his tactics are sheer perfection, but his questions have won.

• 31:49Speaker 04

  Where did you go to school? Do you know Dafydd Evans? No, come on, mate, you must do. No, we've never met at all.

• 32:07Speaker 01

  Before we get started, an email from Ben with the subject header, a Cymru connection skeptic. Hi, gents. Last night I went to a gig in Peckham that was compared by one Elis James. Despite missing a chance to discuss his AI cat flap with a Belgian who worked in AI, who was unsure if AI was going to kill us all, Ellis was in top form.

• 32:28Speaker 00

  I was all right.

• 32:29Speaker 01

  The highlight was the chance to see a Cymru connection live. It took him about five seconds to connect with a 39-year-old education charity worker.

• 32:37Speaker 00

  From Llanrewst.

• 32:38Speaker 01

  Five's friend Mark. Truly electric stuff. Even if he did have to translate the whole thing for the audience, having done the connection in Welsh. On the way out of the gig, though, I owed of a heard a man say, surely they didn't actually know someone in common that fast, before the skeptic and his friend agreed, he probably just asked her for something like, can you just say yes here? And then moved on with the gig. Just wanted to give Ellis the chance to refute the charges before the nation's favourite feature is brought into scandal, rivaling the 100 metres final at the Seoul Olympics or Dave's beloved Manchester City.

• 33:12Speaker 00

  It's good fun, 10 days in.

• 33:14Speaker 01

  Ben from 10 days in. You're cheating. I'm just detected for a decade. I've had 10 days of this, that's enough. Can't we just let my guns be my guns?

• 33:25Speaker 00

  It's the same blooming jokes from the same fans. I'm sick of it. I was fairly chilled, but anyway, let's not get into this. It's all good. Everyone's a bloody comedian. She was called Siwone from Llanrewst in North Wales. And but she talked to me in Welsh and I talked Welsh back to her because I wasn't quick witted enough to switch. And then we did connect very quickly, but obviously I was in Peckham and there were 700 people then. She was presumably the only Welsh speaker. So then I had to say, well, we've just done it up to five seconds. But obviously if I'd done it in English, people would have been like, wow. But no, there was no subterfuge at all.

• 34:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, but there's not, there's not, nothing untoward.

• 34:01Speaker 00

  I'm just too honest. It's why I could never be on Traitors. Yeah, I just, I just cannot be cunning. It's like an illness. I've got anti-cunning disease.

• 34:10Speaker 01

  Which would make for a good episode of The Traitors.

• 34:12Speaker 00

  Uh, I'd have to be a faithful. I'd be an absolutely rubbish traitor.

• 34:16Speaker 01

  No, I don't think you would.

• 34:17Speaker 00

  Sorry, everyone, it's me.

• 34:20Speaker 01

  You get in their heads, though.

• 34:22Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 34:23Speaker 01

  Anyway, after last week's failed connection with Alled, Ellis's connection rate is down to 48.08%. A few good connections and he can get back closer to that elusive 50%. Let's see what happens today. We have a caller on the line. Caller, what's your name?

• 34:40Speaker 04

  My name's Tony Hampson, and I'm actually running from Thetford in Norfolk.

• 34:45Speaker 01

  Okay, that's a lot of early intel for Ellis to go on. Ellis, your time starts now.

• 34:50Speaker 00

  Age of school?

• 34:52Speaker 04

  I was from Swyms Jones, Amloch.

• 34:54Speaker 00

  Amloch, how old are you?

• 34:56Speaker 04

  62.

• 34:58Speaker 00

  62 and you're from Amloch. So that's Anglise.

• 35:02Speaker 04

  I'm from Benfry.

• 35:03Speaker 00

  Paryn?

• 35:05Speaker 04

  I'm from Benfry.

• 35:06Speaker 00

  Oh, okay. So you're Welsh speaker?

• 35:08Speaker 04

  Tippinbach.

• 35:09Speaker 00

  Tippinbach, okay. You're from Amloch. Do you know Tidir Owen?

• 35:15Speaker 04

  No.

• 35:16Speaker 00

  Do you know my friend Gary Pritchard?

• 35:18Speaker 04

  No.

• 35:19Speaker 00

  Do you like football?

• 35:20Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 35:21Speaker 00

  Well, who do you support?

• 35:23Speaker 04

  Everton.

• 35:24Speaker 00

  Everton. You don't know Tommy Colin? I don't know his, I don't know his brother. I just know he's an Everton supporter. Okay, what do you do for a living?

• 35:31Speaker 04

  I'm retired, but I used to be a prison officer.

• 35:34Speaker 00

  Prison officer. Oh, my God, where?

• 35:38Speaker 04

  Several places. Last place was Southwark.

• 35:41Speaker 00

  Do you remember a guy called Phil from Bridgend, who was a really good laugh in interstates quo?

• 35:47Speaker 04

  No, no, my shame.

• 35:50Speaker 00

  Oh, it's a toughie. He was, what was his name? He was big interstates quo and he worked in loads of prisons from Bridgend.

• 36:00Speaker 04

  I've never, I've never worked in Wales in a prison.

• 36:02Speaker 00

  No, he wasn't working in Wales. He was working, he was working in prisons in England, but never mind, he's a prison officer, I know. And you're from Amloch and you're 62, so you would have been born in the 60s.

• 36:17Speaker 04

  Good maths.

• 36:22Speaker 00

  Are you aware of any connections?

• 36:24Speaker 04

  Yes, I think so. I think so. Through S4C.

• 36:29Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 36:30Speaker 01

  What's that?

• 36:31Speaker 00

  S4C, so it's the Welsh word for S4C. Uh, go ahead.

• 36:36Speaker 04

  What, tell you?

• 36:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, Ellis is too hungover to have much of a conversation. He just wants to know and go home.

• 36:45Speaker 04

  I don't, I don't know for a fact, but I think you know quite a lot of people for S4C, yeah?

• 36:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:51Speaker 04

  Nia Roberts, Gareth Roberts.

• 36:54Speaker 00

  Do you know what? I've never, I don't think I've met Gareth Roberts, although I have been in the same room as Nia Roberts.

• 37:00Speaker 04

  So I was on the same school bus as them and went to the same school.

• 37:03Speaker 00

  I wouldn't say that counts as a connection, actually.

• 37:06Speaker 01

  No.

• 37:06Speaker 00

  Because I, I, yeah, I, you know, I don't have Nia's phone number.

• 37:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 37:12Speaker 00

  And I don't think she, she certainly wouldn't remember meeting me. Are there any others?

• 37:16Speaker 04

  I mean, I just thought Nia Roberts and Gareth Roberts.

• 37:19Speaker 00

  No, unfortunately not.

• 37:22Speaker 01

  Do you follow Wales, the football team?

• 37:25Speaker 04

  Yes, I do.

• 37:27Speaker 01

  Do you know anyone through Wales?

• 37:28Speaker 04

  These Welshmen would.

• 37:31Speaker 00

  I'm trying to think of people from Amloch. What was that guy? What was his name? He used to have like a fur lined denim jacket. What was his name? I can't, he's part of the Amloch scene. When did you leave Amloch, out of curiosity?

• 37:49Speaker 04

  Well, I left school in 82.

• 37:52Speaker 00

  And what, and you've, you left Amloch then, did you?

• 37:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, so I'm from Benfry, yeah?

• 37:58Speaker 00

  Oh, yes, of course you are, sorry.

• 38:00Speaker 04

  So, yeah, so I left, I left school in 82, went to Liverpool, um, till 84, then joined the Air Force in 86. So I used to do the markets in Pethelie, Amloch and Tsungebny.

• 38:12Speaker 00

  Do you know what? I think, I think I'm absolutely stumped, even though I have got a hangover. I think even if I was, if, even if I'd had eight hours' sleep and a vitamin tablet, I would, I would be, I would be lost.

• 38:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:27Speaker 00

  Did you ever work at RAF Broady, out of curiosity?

• 38:30Speaker 04

  No, no, no, I never joined the Air Force and went home. I always sort of thought, a lot, a lot of my school friends joined the Air Force and went back to valley. I never saw the point, I never saw the point of it.

• 38:41Speaker 00

  What, what sort of planes did you fly? Sorry, I said a question that's six-rodged.

• 38:44Speaker 04

  Paper ones, mate.

• 38:47Speaker 00

  So what were you doing in the RAF?

• 38:48Speaker 04

  I just, HR.

• 38:50Speaker 00

  HR in the RAF?

• 38:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:53Speaker 01

  HR AF.

• 38:54Speaker 00

  HR AF, very good.

• 38:55Speaker 01

  Did you see any cool bands in Liverpool in the 80s?

• 38:58Speaker 00

  You must have done.

• 38:59Speaker 04

  Cock to Books, Echo and the Bunny Men.

• 39:01Speaker 00

  Oh, my gosh, I would have loved to see, did you used to go to Eric's, which was the?

• 39:05Speaker 04

  Uh, I think I went a couple of times. I went to, um, oh God, what was the one on Dale Street? The State.

• 39:12Speaker 00

  Oh, that is, I can't believe it. So you saw Echo and the Bunny Men in the 80s? I'm extremely jealous of your memories now.

• 39:18Speaker 04

  Yeah, and War Heat.

• 39:20Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 39:21Speaker 01

  Well, sorry that there was no connection. Um, and perhaps even, even on a brighter day. But we thank you very much for your call and wish you a lovely retirement. Are you enjoying it?

• 39:35Speaker 04

  Well, yeah, I am. I, I kind, well, yeah, yeah, I'm just getting into it. We're hopefully moving back to Wales to the same peninsula.

• 39:43Speaker 00

  Oh, lovely.

• 39:44Speaker 01

  Well, thank you so much for your call.

• 39:46Speaker 00

  Cheers, mate.

• 39:47Speaker 01

  Cheers, mate. We'll have another attempt next week, but it feels like the elusive 50 is going to remain elusive.

• 39:56Speaker 00

  That's probably dropped him into 47 territory. But, you know, it's never far away, is it?

• 40:02Speaker 01

  Right, let's watch Ellis get battered in a word going with Susie Dent.

• 40:48Speaker 01

  Well, it is an Ellis and John honour to have in the studio Susie Dent. Susie, welcome.

• 40:55Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 40:56Speaker 01

  This is in many ways what the Anglo Saxons would have called the word hoard. This studio, I am in charge of the word hoard. Uh, I maintain it. Uh, Ellis is also there.

• 41:07Speaker 00

  Yeah, I sweep up a bit.

• 41:09Speaker 01

  Ellis sweets up a bit. He knows a lot of Welsh words.

• 41:12Speaker 00

  So many.

• 41:13Speaker 01

  So many.

• 41:13Speaker 00

  So many.

• 41:14Speaker 01

  Almost all of them.

• 41:15Speaker 05

  What a language.

• 41:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 41:17Speaker 01

  How many words are there in the Welsh language, Ellis?

• 41:19Speaker 00

  I don't know, because the, doesn't the OED have half a million words in it? Something like that.

• 41:26Speaker 05

  It does. It's always difficult when someone says how many words are in the language, because do you count run, runs, ran, running? Do you count the different letters?

• 41:35Speaker 00

  Do you count caffeine in restaurants?

• 41:37Speaker 05

  I mean, English is a spoken word.

• 41:39Speaker 00

  Language, yeah.

• 41:40Speaker 01

  But you wouldn't count every word in the OED because that's as much a history of the language as it is a sort of a snapshot of the words we use.

• 41:47Speaker 05

  It depends if you're looking at current language or not. So there's quite a lot of wonderful obsolete words in the OED, which I personally think we should bring back on many, many an occasion. But, uh, yeah, I think if you're looking at current language, you wouldn't include quite a lot of those.

• 42:02Speaker 01

  Um, and you have made, before we get to the made up game, which early betting is on me because Ellis is hungover. But you never know. You never know if it's vibe based. Many a hangover has won many a comedy award slash made up game. Um, it may be it's the spicy needs in his sails.

• 42:23Speaker 00

  Feel very fallible.

• 42:26Speaker 02

  One of the rounds does have a 60 second countdown.

• 42:28Speaker 00

  Oh, come on.

• 42:29Speaker 02

  I don't think that works now.

• 42:31Speaker 05

  You know, it's a great word that you just described, the excesses of alcohol and food, actually, which was crapulence. Are you feeling crapulent?

• 42:39Speaker 00

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 42:40Speaker 01

  I, Susie, at any one time, am playing five games of Scrabble. I boggle daily.

• 42:47Speaker 00

  You wordle daily?

• 42:48Speaker 01

  I have wordled, I'm coming up to my 1800th wordle.

• 42:56Speaker 01

  I lost my streak 200 days ago.

• 42:58Speaker 05

  That's the thing, isn't it? When you lose your streak and then it just, oof.

• 43:02Speaker 01

  But I am all, I've got a wordle spreadsheet that dates back to lockdown. Is that cool?

• 43:06Speaker 00

  Oh, he's got a girlfriend.

• 43:08Speaker 05

  I've got a girlfriend. A spreadsheet of words that have been used, how long it took you each time?

• 43:14Speaker 01

  So there's a group of us in the wordle WhatsApp group and the spreadsheet covers everyone's scores. So we scored them depending on what you get them in.

• 43:23Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 43:23Speaker 01

  I could dig into the detail of.

• 43:25Speaker 00

  Who's in charge of the spreadsheet?

• 43:27Speaker 01

  You're looking at him.

• 43:27Speaker 00

  Okay. And everyone else has access to it?

• 43:30Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 43:31Speaker 00

  Okay, did they access it?

• 43:33Speaker 01

  No, but I have dominated the wordle.

• 43:36Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 43:37Speaker 01

  Today's was usury, got it in two.

• 43:40Speaker 05

  I haven't done today, so thanks.

• 43:42Speaker 00

  Nice one.

• 43:44Speaker 05

  Genuinely, I haven't done today.

• 43:46Speaker 01

  Well, there you go, in one.

• 43:47Speaker 05

  Did you get the sure?

• 43:49Speaker 01

  I, I got, no.

• 43:51Speaker 05

  Is that where you lost your streak?

• 43:52Speaker 01

  Because that, I, my streak is currently about 198.

• 43:56Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 43:56Speaker 01

  And that covers for sure.

• 43:58Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 43:58Speaker 01

  But it is annoying when they, and I'm finding this more with Spelling Bee, where they just don't have words that are very common in English. And I do have a question for you about words.

• 44:10Speaker 05

  In British English?

• 44:11Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 44:11Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 44:11Speaker 00

  Well, go on then.

• 44:13Speaker 01

  So what decides whether a verb can have un or de added to the start? So, because you can have underdeveloped or undeveloped, but you wouldn't have unenveloped. Enveloped, what a time to mispronounce enveloped. It's not a word, it is a word. Sorry, Dave, I've gone mad.

• 44:33Speaker 00

  No, we're all nervous.

• 44:35Speaker 01

  Because when you're on Spelling Bee, you can add, just go through adding de to all of the verbs. Why can't you just do it to all of them?

• 44:42Speaker 05

  Because English is probably the most idiosyncratic language I've ever encountered. It is gnarly as anything because it's had so many different influences. It's why we have so many different plurals. Why is it, you know, moose plural rather than meese, like geese, et cetera? And it's because they come from different places, they've come at different times. Sometimes we borrow the same word from French twice and one has a different register than the other, but they both mean the same thing. It is quite chaotic. And honestly, the answer is it's all down to us. So, you know, it's a democracy and we decide collectively, we don't have an academy telling us what's right and what's not.

• 45:24Speaker 00

  Like the French do.

• 45:25Speaker 05

  Like the French do, although it doesn't really work. So one of the things they try and do is to resist the tide of English.

• 45:33Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 45:33Speaker 05

  Words coming in, which of course doesn't work and it's very difficult. It's so difficult to militate and it's so difficult to say you can use this and you can't use that because it's, you know, it's down to us. And if we use it, there's no one that's really going to punish us.

• 45:47Speaker 00

  I remember George Orwell writing that ain't, which is now regarded as slang, was perfectly acceptable in the Victorian era.

• 45:56Speaker 05

  Eight?

• 45:56Speaker 00

  Ain't, it ain't my donut.

• 45:59Speaker 05

  You will find kings and queens using that.

• 46:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's what I remember reading, so that Queen Victoria would have said ain't. And it would have been regarded as received the Queen's English.

• 46:08Speaker 05

  Most of the arguments we have about English usage are incredibly circular. So less versus fewer, we've been arguing about that one for a long time. The very first meaning of disinterested, which is a bit of a bugbear for some people, that was actually uninterested. That was the very first meaning. So quite often, you know, like is a filler, which really gets on people's nerves because it's so prolific. You know, she was like, I was like, first use of that was 1778.

• 46:36Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 46:37Speaker 05

  So very often, things that we see as new infestations of English, usually from US English, were actually either ours to begin with a long time ago, or we've been having that argument.

• 46:47Speaker 00

  The fall, meaning autumn.

• 46:48Speaker 05

  We called it fall, which I love because it's a nice symmetry, fall of the leaf. And then spring is short for spring of the leaf. And I think that's quite poetic.

• 46:56Speaker 00

  I think gotten was used in English, wasn't it?

• 46:58Speaker 05

  Used in the King James Bible.

• 47:00Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 47:00Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 47:00Speaker 00

  Whereas actually the word gotten makes me cringe.

• 47:04Speaker 05

  I think there's a sense of progression there, though, as in she'd gotten really tired.

• 47:09Speaker 00

  Yeah, I don't like it.

• 47:10Speaker 05

  Yeah, I think it's because it's been instilled in us that got itself is quite slangy, that you think, got.

• 47:18Speaker 01

  So you're, before the game, we're going to talk a bit about your new podcast. It's called Artworks, the Deadliest Book in England, about William Tyndall's Bible. I am, in some small ways, a Tyndalist.

• 47:31Speaker 05

  Oh, good, okay.

• 47:32Speaker 01

  Just because I grew up near the monument in Nibley. And we used to go to, this tells you a lot about my childhood. If we were a loose end on a Sunday, my parents would take me to a monument for someone who was executed for translating the Bible into English.

• 47:47Speaker 05

  The same one every time?

• 47:48Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 47:49Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 47:50Speaker 01

  It would still be the same and then we'd go home and have a roast dinner.

• 47:53Speaker 05

  And what would you do when you got there?

• 47:56Speaker 01

  So climb up it, look out of the tower, pretend I was in the chains and then go home.

• 48:01Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 48:01Speaker 01

  And.

• 48:02Speaker 05

  But you remember it.

• 48:03Speaker 01

  I do remember it.

• 48:04Speaker 05

  That's, it did its job.

• 48:06Speaker 01

  So the Bible being translated into English has a long history. In fact, the first ever writing in English is a sort of gloss of Cadman's hymn is a gloss of the Bible. So bits of the Bible have been written in Anglo-Saxon, but what was special about Tyndall's Bible? And why did it get him into so much trouble?

• 48:27Speaker 05

  Yes, why was it the deadliest book in England? Well, he was greatly influenced by Luther and by Erasmus, who kind of taught that going back to the original source of a text was the way to go. And I think Tyndall realised, as did many, that the Latin scriptures that were being, you know, used and preached from in church was a gatekeeper for the church because they could, given that not many people, not many laypeople could speak Latin at the time, they were entirely dependent upon the church telling them what the Bible said. And so the idea that Tyndall fully believed in was that he would teach even the ploughboy,

• 49:12Speaker 05

  you know, the sort of true word of God, if you like, without any gatekeeping. And he translated words that had been, for example, Ecclesia, the church, he translated into congregation and priests became the elders and that kind of thing. And that was seen as being scary for those who wanted to maintain the authority of the church and who wanted to keep that sort of, as I say, gatekeeping role. So it got him into, he did ask for permission because there were actually English translations of the Bible at the time. And he did ask for permission from Bishop Tunstall, who had already had some projects on the go, he thought he didn't need any more.

• 49:55Speaker 05

  But also he was scared, you know, Lutheranism was actually quite threatening to the position of the church. And so he said no, which forced Tyndall to flee. So essentially he was in exile from that, that time on.

• 50:07Speaker 01

  It's sort of hard to imagine what it was like being a layperson six, 700 years ago. Because you would, there's these amazing manuscripts where you get like a little postage stamp of biblical text and then around it is all the gloss from the, from the priests and the monks, basically telling you what it is and why you have to behave and why you have to give this money to the church. So the, having access to your own copy would basically is freedom of determining your own beliefs and your own behaviour.

• 50:37Speaker 05

  Absolutely right.

• 50:38Speaker 01

  But it's sort of, it's difficult to put ourselves in the position of people who were so ruled by the ecclesiastical forces.

• 50:46Speaker 05

  Absolutely. And also have to remember that not, not many of them actually could read. So what they were doing is they were listening to these, so sort of, you know, incredible, really, just as Dickens was writing, so that his books could be read out loud. Hence, you know, the kind of rhythm of a lot of his prose, so it was with Tyndall as well. That's why the musicality of his language is incredible because he knew it was going to be read out.

• 51:13Speaker 01

  And he coined lots of words, including the word taskmaster.

• 51:16Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 51:17Speaker 01

  And who would have thought, hundreds of years later.

• 51:20Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 51:21Speaker 01

  We were connected to William Tyndall by Elis James's pants, which featured on the second episode of Taskmaster.

• 51:29Speaker 00

  That's a great regret of mine.

• 51:30Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 51:31Speaker 00

  Because.

• 51:32Speaker 01

  Add it, add it to the list.

• 51:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, I don't know if you've seen it, Susie, but I used to have a pair of lucky pants.

• 51:38Speaker 05

  Lucky pants, are we talking trousers, pants or?

• 51:40Speaker 00

  No, underpants.

• 51:41Speaker 05

  Underpants.

• 51:42Speaker 00

  And.

• 51:42Speaker 05

  And everyone saw them.

• 51:43Speaker 00

  Izzy, my wife, has shown them to the nation and it's made my social media almost unusable.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  They were voted the thing Greg Davis was least jealous of.

• 51:53Speaker 05

  And he can be mean, as I discovered myself, yes.

• 51:56Speaker 01

  So Susie, your podcast is now available to listen to on BBC Sounds. It's called Artworks, the Deadliest Book in England, and you're touring your show Word Perfect.

• 52:05Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 52:06Speaker 01

  And people can find out information about that where?

• 52:09Speaker 05

  They can go to No Third Entertainment or look at my Instagram, basically. I've got a little pinned set of dates up there and, and I love it. And it's just me and some videos and some lovely nerdy audiences. It's brilliant.

• 52:24Speaker 01

  Amazing. Now, we're about to play a made up game. Can I just apologise in advance because Dave has bought, bought in a pocket Oxford dictionary.

• 52:32Speaker 05

  Ah.

• 52:33Speaker 01

  I'm Chambers through and through.

• 52:35Speaker 05

  Are you? It's a Scrabble, yeah.

• 52:37Speaker 01

  And I did, and ironically, the word pocket dictionary isn't in my dictionary, Dave.

• 52:42Speaker 00

  What do you mean? What's wrong with this?

• 52:45Speaker 01

  I've just got a bigger dictionary than you.

• 52:46Speaker 00

  I mean, so cool.

• 52:47Speaker 02

  Why would this be called pocket dictionary?

• 52:49Speaker 05

  I know, you can't fit it in your pocket.

• 52:51Speaker 01

  I can fit that in my pocket, Dave.

• 52:52Speaker 00

  Well, you've got quite, because you wear climbing trousers.

• 52:54Speaker 01

  Well, that's because I've just come back from the Alps.

• 52:56Speaker 00

  You cannot fit that in your, there's no chance.

• 52:59Speaker 01

  I'll fit, I'll fit your pocket dictionary in my pocket.

• 53:01Speaker 00

  Don't stretch the silhouette of your trousers, John.

• 53:03Speaker 05

  Oh yeah, I think there might be some weird thing going on.

• 53:06Speaker 00

  He wants to do it now, so he will.

• 53:08Speaker 01

  I'll put it in the back pocket now.

• 53:10Speaker 05

  No.

• 53:10Speaker 01

  You've got a point there, Dave.

• 53:11Speaker 00

  Why don't you get your bum bag out and put it?

• 53:13Speaker 01

  Your bum bag. I haven't brought my bum bag. Anyway, you carry on explaining.

• 53:17Speaker 00

  John became very emotional because he saw Queen bum bag.

• 53:22Speaker 05

  Ah.

• 53:23Speaker 01

  There, Dave, it's as simple as that, Dave.

• 53:26Speaker 00

  It's.

• 53:26Speaker 05

  Oh, well done.

• 53:28Speaker 01

  Sorry, let me just get a quick.

• 53:29Speaker 00

  You're just, we're gonna have to get a photo of that. You're just ready to.

• 53:32Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 53:32Speaker 00

  You're just ready to use a dictionary at the drop of a hat.

• 53:37Speaker 05

  That is brilliant.

• 53:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:38Speaker 05

  Um, why do they make them like that? That's a very good question. We do have mini versions.

• 53:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:42Speaker 02

  Okay, made up game. So, uh, first of all, we will, uh, start with a jingle, which is from Dan, uh, which was first played a few weeks ago. So here is jingle Dan.

• 54:53Speaker 02

  So scores on the doors. Ellis continued his good form, uh, a couple of weeks ago in the game. One sill does exactly what it says on the tin, uh, and puts his first back to back win together since May.

• 55:05Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 55:05Speaker 02

  Uh, that's up the scores to thirty fifteen to Ellis. In the fourth game of the third set, John is leading two games to one and two sets to love overall. We do tennis scoring for the made up game, Susie.

• 55:14Speaker 01

  Is that simple, Susie?

• 55:15Speaker 02

  Which does keep it nice and neat.

• 55:17Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 55:18Speaker 02

  Okay, uh, so this week's game, uh, comes in from our guest, Susie Dent. We're going to use Susie's Lexicographical.

• 55:25Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 55:25Speaker 02

  Is that correctly pronounced?

• 55:27Speaker 05

  Lexicographical.

• 55:27Speaker 02

  Great.

• 55:28Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 55:28Speaker 02

  Skills to challenge both Ellis and John in a game we're calling Dictionary Dash. Uh, so Susie will make her way through the English, Ox- the Oxford English Dictionary. For each letter, you have to guess the word from the definition. Your total point is the total number of words you guess within ninety seconds. Uh, to keep things moving, you do have unlimited passes. For example, A, an instrument for performing, for performing calculations by sliding counters along rods or in grooves would be abacus. If you correctly guess, Susie then flicks to B. So.

• 56:02Speaker 05

  Oh, I'm starting.

• 56:02Speaker 02

  There's a bit of pressure on Susie here to be keeping it moving as fast as she can to go from A to B.

• 56:07Speaker 00

  Be kind, Susie.

• 56:08Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 56:09Speaker 00

  Be kind.

• 56:10Speaker 02

  But it's, it's, it's a level playing field, so it's the same for both. Uh, we will go from, uh, well, we'll start with John and then we'll play with Ellis separately. So it's two separate rounds. You have ninety seconds. You've got any questions, Susie?

• 56:24Speaker 05

  So I'm reading out the definition.

• 56:25Speaker 02

  You read out the definition.

• 56:26Speaker 01

  So it's not, we're not guessing the same word?

• 56:28Speaker 02

  No, no, no. So it's around each.

• 56:30Speaker 05

  Right the way through the alphabet?

• 56:31Speaker 02

  You won't get through, you'll get through as far as you can in ninety seconds. As, I love the faith that you have in these two, that we might get all the way through the alphabet.

• 56:37Speaker 00

  Pass John.

• 56:38Speaker 01

  Can you pass?

• 56:39Speaker 00

  You can pass on a. Passes.

• 56:41Speaker 02

  You can pass, but then there'll be another definition from that letter.

• 56:44Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 56:44Speaker 02

  So you won't ever go further past a letter.

• 56:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 56:47Speaker 02

  Uh, so are the rules clear?

• 56:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 56:49Speaker 02

  Okay, good stuff. All right then. So John, we will start with you. It's Dictionary Dash. Get as far through the alphabet as you can from the definitions that Susie describes and your time starts now.

• 56:59Speaker 05

  The lump of cartilage at the front of the neck, noun.

• 57:02Speaker 01

  Adam's apple.

• 57:03Speaker 05

  Uh, uh, a temporary camp without tents, B. This is.

• 57:07Speaker 01

  Bivouac.

• 57:08Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 57:09Speaker 00

  Nice.

• 57:09Speaker 05

  Uh, A, horse's pace between a trot.

• 57:12Speaker 01

  Cantor.

• 57:13Speaker 05

  My goodness.

• 57:13Speaker 00

  Oh, today.

• 57:14Speaker 05

  He's learned the dictionary. Uh, okay, um, attractively small and neat, British informal.

• 57:20Speaker 01

  Dainty.

• 57:21Speaker 05

  No.

• 57:23Speaker 01

  Diminutive.

• 57:23Speaker 05

  No, it's, it's quite colloquial.

• 57:27Speaker 01

  Pass.

• 57:28Speaker 05

  Um, a wild Australian dog.

• 57:30Speaker 01

  Dingo.

• 57:30Speaker 05

  Yes. E, expressing pleasure or approval in an unrestrained way.

• 57:35Speaker 01

  Enthusiasm.

• 57:36Speaker 05

  Mm, almost.

• 57:37Speaker 01

  Enthusiastic.

• 57:37Speaker 05

  No.

• 57:38Speaker 01

  Infused.

• 57:39Speaker 05

  No, no, sorry, that was a different word.

• 57:41Speaker 01

  Excited.

• 57:43Speaker 05

  No. He was so, mm, about.

• 57:47Speaker 01

  Effusive.

• 57:48Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 57:48Speaker 00

  Nice.

• 57:49Speaker 05

  Uh, F, literature describing imaginary events and people.

• 57:52Speaker 01

  Fiction.

• 57:53Speaker 05

  Very good. Uh, G, um, a defender or protector.

• 57:57Speaker 01

  Guardian.

• 57:58Speaker 05

  Very good. Um, H, a book giving basic information.

• 58:03Speaker 01

  Uh, huh, oh, uh, urology?

• 58:07Speaker 05

  Oh, no, it's much simpler than that.

• 58:09Speaker 01

  How to?

• 58:11Speaker 05

  No, it's a noun. I guess that is a noun, but it's a, it's a, something you might have that gives you information, like a manual.

• 58:19Speaker 02

  Five seconds.

• 58:20Speaker 00

  Elsebook.

• 58:21Speaker 05

  Very close.

• 58:23Speaker 02

  Three, two.

• 58:25Speaker 01

  Handbook.

• 58:26Speaker 02

  One.

• 58:26Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 58:27Speaker 02

  There we go, we got it with one second to go.

• 58:30Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 58:31Speaker 00

  How many is that, Michael? A, B, C, D, E, F, G?

• 58:34Speaker 02

  Eight. Eight points with one pass.

• 58:37Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 58:38Speaker 02

  That's not bad, John.

• 58:39Speaker 00

  Bad.

• 58:40Speaker 02

  Not bad at all.

• 58:41Speaker 05

  So am I starting for I or do I go the way?

• 58:42Speaker 02

  No, you go back to A. To make it fair through the alphabet.

• 58:46Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 58:47Speaker 00

  Cantor.

• 58:48Speaker 01

  Oh, thank you.

• 58:49Speaker 02

  Okay, so eight.

• 58:50Speaker 05

  Show whenever.

• 58:51Speaker 02

  How are you feeling, Al?

• 58:52Speaker 00

  Bad, I feel sick today. I regret every single one of my choices last, from last night.

• 58:58Speaker 01

  No, you had a lovely time with your friends.

• 59:00Speaker 00

  Actually, yes, I did. So I don't, but I do.

• 59:04Speaker 02

  Right, Susie, are you ready?

• 59:05Speaker 05

  Uh, yes.

• 59:07Speaker 02

  It's Dictionary Dash. It's eight to beat, Alice. Your time starts now.

• 59:12Speaker 05

  A, noun, a foot pedal which controls a vehicle's speed.

• 59:15Speaker 00

  Accelerator.

• 59:16Speaker 05

  Good. B, noun, either of the two round fleshy parts of the body that form the bottom.

• 59:21Speaker 00

  Butts.

• 59:23Speaker 05

  Uh, C, noun, any of the segments making up a bulb of garlic.

• 59:28Speaker 00

  Clove.

• 59:29Speaker 05

  Uh, G, a large white dog with dark spots.

• 59:33Speaker 00

  A dachshund, Dalmatian.

• 59:35Speaker 05

  Correct. Um, E, the state of a country in terms of the production and consumption of goods and services and the supply of money.

• 59:42Speaker 00

  Economy.

• 59:43Speaker 05

  Very good. F, the sport of fighting with blunted swords.

• 59:47Speaker 00

  Fencing.

• 59:48Speaker 05

  Very good. Uh, G, a red semi-precious stone.

• 59:53Speaker 00

  A gem?

• 59:54Speaker 05

  No.

• 59:55Speaker 00

  Uh, pass.

• 59:55Speaker 05

  Red. Okay, go on it. Um, G, noun, an attic.

• 1:00:01Speaker 00

  Uh, pass.

• 1:00:03Speaker 05

  Uh, that was a garret. Um, okay. Um, G, a large seabird or a greedy person.

• 1:00:10Speaker 00

  Gannet.

• 1:00:10Speaker 05

  Very good. Um, H, the handle of a knife or axe.

• 1:00:16Speaker 00

  A scabbard. No, um.

• 1:00:19Speaker 00

  Uh, pass.

• 1:00:20Speaker 05

  Haft. Um, H, bargain over a price.

• 1:00:24Speaker 00

  Haggle.

• 1:00:24Speaker 05

  Very good. Um, I, a conclusion implied by something.

• 1:00:31Speaker 05

  A possible effect.

• 1:00:33Speaker 00

  Implication.

• 1:00:34Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 1:00:36Speaker 01

  He's done it!

• 1:00:37Speaker 02

  Two.

• 1:00:37Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:00:38Speaker 05

  A lively dance to swing music, J.

• 1:00:41Speaker 00

  Pardon?

• 1:00:41Speaker 05

  A lively dance to swing music.

• 1:00:44Speaker 00

  Jive?

• 1:00:44Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 1:00:45Speaker 02

  Jive without a time.

• 1:00:47Speaker 05

  Oh, I'd started those, so I finished.

• 1:00:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, good point. Although we, we can't, well, you won either way, Alice, so.

• 1:00:52Speaker 01

  On a hangover.

• 1:00:53Speaker 05

  Very good.

• 1:00:55Speaker 02

  Hangover, nine points, Al.

• 1:00:57Speaker 05

  To be fair, some of those at the beginning were maybe a little bit easier.

• 1:01:00Speaker 00

  I think mine were easier, so I feel sorry for John.

• 1:01:03Speaker 01

  I don't know, I wouldn't have got half.

• 1:01:04Speaker 05

  Complex at the end, though.

• 1:01:05Speaker 00

  Pardon?

• 1:01:06Speaker 05

  I made them more complex.

• 1:01:07Speaker 02

  Thank you. Yeah. Dictionary Dash, I enjoyed that. Thank you, Susie.

• 1:01:10Speaker 05

  Not at all.

• 1:01:11Speaker 02

  That was great.

• 1:01:12Speaker 05

  It was fun.

• 1:01:13Speaker 00

  Oh, my God, I feel euphoric.

• 1:01:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:16Speaker 01

  So you don't regret any of your decisions last night?

• 1:01:18Speaker 00

  No, it seems to be working for me.

• 1:01:21Speaker 01

  Oh, no.

• 1:01:22Speaker 00

  Oh, God.

• 1:01:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:01:24Speaker 01

  Well, Susie, thank you so much for coming in. Um, check out Susie's podcast, Artworks, the deadliest book in England about Tyndall's Bible. And also, uh, check out her tour, Word Perfect, which is in, oh, I was gonna say cinemas.

• 1:01:38Speaker 05

  In cinemas near you.

• 1:01:39Speaker 01

  Well, who knows? If it, if it really kicks off.

• 1:01:40Speaker 05

  They are theatres near you.

• 1:01:42Speaker 01

  In a theatre near you.

• 1:01:43Speaker 05

  Can I give you three Tyndall phrases for producer Dave?

• 1:01:45Speaker 00

  Oh, yes, please.

• 1:01:46Speaker 05

  Long suffering, the salt of the earth and peacemaker.

• 1:01:49Speaker 02

  Thank you so much, Susie. What a lovely way to end it. Yeah, that is classic master.

• 1:01:54Speaker 00

  He saw you coming.

• 1:01:56Speaker 02

  Great.

• 1:01:57Speaker 01

  Great stuff.

• 1:02:01Speaker 01

  Well, what a treat it was to have Susie Dent in here from Dictionary Corner.

• 1:02:05Speaker 02

  I've always heard that she's absolutely delightful.

• 1:02:07Speaker 01

  Oh, she's lovely.

• 1:02:07Speaker 02

  And she really is.

• 1:02:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:02:09Speaker 02

  She really is.

• 1:02:10Speaker 00

  Also, I've just got so many questions about language and you just know that she'd know all of the answers.

• 1:02:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 1:02:18Speaker 00

  I just like being with experts, Dave.

• 1:02:21Speaker 02

  It's, yeah, it's good. It's quite inspirational, isn't it?

• 1:02:23Speaker 00

  Absolutely, yeah.

• 1:02:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I agree.

• 1:02:26Speaker 01

  So is that all we've got time for, Dave?

• 1:02:28Speaker 02

  That's a ramajammoed show right there, John.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  Okay, well, we do hope you enjoyed it and we will be back with you next week.

• 1:02:35Speaker 00

  Bye.

• 1:02:45Speaker 03

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• 1:03:17Speaker 01

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• 1:03:23Speaker 00

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• 1:03:28Speaker 01

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