Pod Insights Elis James and John Robins #559 - Here We Hit It, The Calmru Connection and Darwin’s Flatmate Dave About this episode Sad news everyone, Elis is retiring. We thought Johnny JR would go first, but Elis has beaten him to it. He’s peaked. He’s reached his zenith and there ain’t nowhere to go from there.
But worry not, because he’s referring to his DJing career and not his podcasting one…
Then it’s onto kids' parties and the big question: is John’s conduct in the Bureau de Change of the Mind the best training ground for dealing with 20 hungry kids?
All this plus some top tier shame, a cracking Cymru Connection, and a Made Up Game that unearths the bombshell revelation that John’s book 'Thirst' was a ripoff of the OG blubography, Charles Darwin’s 'On the Origin of Species'.
Please continue to furnish us with your brilliantly penned correspondence by sending it to [email protected] mailto:[email protected] .
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Transcript 11,761 words · 8 speakers
0:00 Speaker 00 Before we start this episode, we want to invite you along to the adventures of Alice and John.
0:04 Speaker 01 If you head over to patreon.com/ellisonjohn, you can join us on our monthly escapades, including...
0:10 Speaker 00 Miniumpicks.
0:11 Speaker 01 It's the strangest legal jump in the history of long jump.
0:14 Speaker 00 Birdwatching.
0:15 Speaker 02 My two favourite things are birds and football.
0:18 Speaker 01 And you can watch our latest episode now, where we tackle an escape room.
0:22 Speaker 03 So John is absolutely flying here. Well, Alice is there as well.
0:26 Speaker 02 Alice is there as well, Dave.
0:27 Speaker 03 We did the first three, Dave, for complete chill.
0:32 Speaker 00 So, for adventures and so much more, head over to patreon.com/ellisonjohn now.
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1:10 Speaker 05 Hello, this is Susie Ruffel.
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1:27 Speaker 05 Yeah, and a fair bit of gossiping, too.
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2:00 Speaker 00 Hello, listeners. John's here, ready to podcast in a state of mental equilibrium.
2:06 Speaker 00 Dave is here with a steady hand on the tiller. I am here, overpowered, having experienced all of the available emotions on Sunday, because I was the DJ for the Super furry animals, beat a band and badly drawn boy show at Alexandra Palace. And I mean, all of the emotions. Nerves, elation, being extremely hungry, being extremely full, when I realised that I have to DJ in shorts rather than trousers because it was so hot on stage, complicated grief.
2:37 Speaker 00 Even though I've DJ for Dave at his seminal day disco Dancing with Dave, I've never done that without something going wrong. But that's always fine, because in an emergency, Dave's able to press play on Avril Lavigne faster than a Kalashnikov can fire a bullet.
2:51 Speaker 00 I've DJed Scared to Dance, my favourite indie night in London, but Paula Runs, it realises that even though I have a decent taste in music, I need to be helped on the decks as attentively as you would introduce a Victorian to the concept of Uber Eats.
3:04 Speaker 00 On Sunday, I flew solo. I was out of my comfort zone. And why do people stay in their comfort zone? Because being comfortable is absolutely fantastic. And if you stray too far out of it, you either become irritating or addicted to creatine. It was a day to remember. I was able to watch the soundchecks meet the bands, and I realised that I find grizzled roadies who can work calmly under pressure but still find the time to smoke rollies hugely attractive.
3:31 Speaker 00 I asked Damon Goff, aka Bully Drawn Boy, if he was still going to wear his trademark hat and coat on stage on one of the hottest days of the year.
3:37 Speaker 03 He will.
3:38 Speaker 00 And he said, yes, hell, I absolutely hate this weather.
3:41 Speaker 03 Because he always wears his hat.
3:43 Speaker 00 It's incredible, yeah. Even though it was 32 degrees in the shade, the super furry animals are Welsh, and so the backstage catering was a full roast dinner. And when we get to the bases to bunt the guitarists, saw how much I was eating, they asked me to invoice the band.
4:00 Speaker 00 Let's look at some good memories. Good memory number one, playing Know How by Young MC, a hip hop classic from 1988, before the furries went on and seeing them dancing and giving me the thumbs up from the wings, and Griff re sing tunes on Hegel de Olch, which means incredible tunes, funky really.
4:16 Speaker 01 Oh, yes.
4:17 Speaker 00 That's all you want. Good memory number two, being asked to write down some of the psychedelic tunes I was playing for not one, not two, but three separate roadies, and being complimented on my taste by a man who was changing batteries on a distortion pedal.
4:29 Speaker 01 Oh, this is the stuff.
4:30 Speaker 00 It is, it is. A roadie saying, hmm, I wonder if you've got the right cable for this, when they were setting me up, and getting to say, don't worry, I've got all the cables we need in my bag, because I had an anxiety dream about this happening on Wednesday night.
4:43 Speaker 01 Tick, tick, tick.
4:44 Speaker 00 Number four, talk about the company connection on the Super Free Animals tour bus, and having my percentages criticised by my favourite band of all time.
4:51 Speaker 01 Really?
4:52 Speaker 00 Who bumper said, but you never do it, oh. I was like, I do it 47% of the time.
4:57 Speaker 03 Yeah, you just listen to the wrong episodes.
4:58 Speaker 00 So where does this leave, that's what I said, you're just listening to the wrong ones in the wrong order. So where does this leave us? Such an amazing day for me, I have decided to retire. So this is the last Ellis and John for me. John will limp on Ellis list until 2032. The only advice I would give to Dave in regards to significant productions is that for your mental health, just do what John says until you dissolve the company. Thank you for all your hard work. 2014, but I have seen Everest and I have scaled it.
5:26 Speaker 01 Oh, I'm so pleased.
5:28 Speaker 00 Retiring.
5:29 Speaker 01 Because we had the negros on Friday.
5:33 Speaker 03 We had Griff on Friday's ep as well.
5:34 Speaker 00 We did, yeah.
5:35 Speaker 01 We had Griff on Friday, but that, I would be, if I was able to, I mean, I don't know why my favourite musicians would have a DJ, but say...
5:44 Speaker 00 Well, there's always music between bands.
5:46 Speaker 01 Well, say, yeah, well, but, so say...
5:48 Speaker 00 Geese.
5:49 Speaker 01 No, say Bonnie Prince Billy, Nico Case and Gillian Welch.
5:52 Speaker 00 Okay, that's a lineup that works.
5:54 Speaker 01 And wanted a DJ in the middle.
5:57 Speaker 00 But there's, they were, at that show, there would be something in the background when they're turning the bands around. That's what I was doing. I wasn't on stage like giving it large.
6:06 Speaker 01 So I guess the equivalent would be, there is a Bob Marley album, which was a big influence on Bonnie Prince Billy's album, I See a Darkness. I know this because I've listened to a two hour podcast about the making of I See a Darkness.
6:20 Speaker 00 Lovely.
6:21 Speaker 01 I then listened to that album and noticed that the bassline from one of the Bonnie Prince Billy songs is taken from one of the Bob Marley songs.
6:29 Speaker 00 Nice.
6:30 Speaker 01 So it'd be like me playing that.
6:32 Speaker 00 Yeah.
6:33 Speaker 01 And then Bonnie Prince Billy give me a thumbs up.
6:35 Speaker 00 Absolutely. Manny took the bassline for Fool's Gold from Know How by Young MC.
6:40 Speaker 03 And that's what you played?
6:41 Speaker 00 And that's what I played just before they went on.
6:42 Speaker 03 Can I ask you about the wires?
6:44 Speaker 00 Yes.
6:45 Speaker 03 Which wires was it that you said you had and it saved the day?
6:48 Speaker 00 The, the red and white one.
6:51 Speaker 03 Well, I told you to get.
6:51 Speaker 00 The one that you told me to get on Wednesday after my anxiety dream.
6:54 Speaker 03 Great stuff. So I saved the day.
6:56 Speaker 00 You did save the day again.
6:57 Speaker 03 This is huge.
6:58 Speaker 01 Amongst your panicked phone call to Dave where you swore at him and called him rude words, did you say, did you then pause and go, PS, thanks for the wire?
7:07 Speaker 00 Um, it was before the wire.
7:08 Speaker 03 It was before the wire. But I didn't get, I didn't get a message afterwards saying thanks for the wire.
7:12 Speaker 00 No, sorry. Uh, there was only one slight mistake when, um, about three minutes before Barry Drumboy come on, all my music stopped playing. But it was so hot, I realised I'd turned the fader down because I couldn't see my screen on my computer because it was blinding.
7:27 Speaker 03 Really?
7:27 Speaker 00 But that was, that was, and my computer had gone very hot.
7:29 Speaker 03 You declined a microphone, didn't you?
7:32 Speaker 00 Yeah, because I've been to.
7:34 Speaker 03 Yeah. But was there any point, was there any point where you thought, you know, I'd actually love just to quickly get on the mic and I'll just hype them up a bit?
7:40 Speaker 00 No, because I actually think I'm not extroverted enough for that.
7:44 Speaker 03 No.
7:44 Speaker 00 I think that's the, yeah, it's, it's weird. Like you might see that at a festival, a cage, but you, you don't really very often. It's the bands who do that. Like I went, I went to watch the Furies at Brixton Academy a few, what's up, six weeks ago. And there was music being played in, you know, in between groups, but no one was chatting to the audience. It's only, you, you invented that, Dave.
8:09 Speaker 03 No, well, I didn't. And also I'm not, I'm not in between bands or my friends. It is literally just DJs. You do get that more at just DJ nights, I think.
8:18 Speaker 00 Yeah, but it was, uh, no, I think I've been low key stressed about that for about three months.
8:24 Speaker 03 I do.
8:26 Speaker 00 Cause I was, cause I was out of my comfort zone. Cause when I, whenever I do it with you or with, uh, done, uh, scared to dance, Paul's there or you're there.
8:32 Speaker 03 Yeah. Did it all just, uh, but as soon as you hit play on that first track and it played out and you knew you were in, did it all just start to slip away?
8:39 Speaker 00 Cause once the system worked, cause I'd practised with the system, I thought, I think I can just do this now. This is fine. And I did realise that no one's there, obviously to watch me, they're all there to watch the bands.
8:47 Speaker 03 No, you want to get it right because you care for your craft.
8:50 Speaker 00 Absolutely. Uh, despite what people said about me on Reddit.
8:57 Speaker 00 But no, it's good. But how are you anyway? I've not, I, I'm, I'm Mr. Man. I've been so obsessed with how my week's been. I haven't asked you how you are. So, John, how are you?
9:07 Speaker 01 How am I? Well, uh, did my second ever Pilates class today and I've been told I look like Alex Turner, who I'm reliably informed is the lead singer of the Arctic Monkeys and an indie heartthrob.
9:20 Speaker 00 Does he do Pilates? Or do you look like him for a different reason?
9:23 Speaker 01 I think I just look like him.
9:24 Speaker 03 There's a look.
9:24 Speaker 01 Yeah. Well, you're not alone, Dave.
9:27 Speaker 03 Eyes, it's the eyes, I think.
9:29 Speaker 01 Is it the eyes? The eyes have it.
9:30 Speaker 03 The eyes have it.
9:31 Speaker 01 So yeah, I then Googled him and thought, good.
9:35 Speaker 00 He's had, he's had many different looks.
9:38 Speaker 03 He has.
9:39 Speaker 01 Which look am I giving of his right now?
9:42 Speaker 03 What look? What era?
9:44 Speaker 00 Certainly not the early years.
9:46 Speaker 03 No, it's not.
9:46 Speaker 00 When he had the fringe.
9:48 Speaker 03 It's not whatever people say I am. It's not favourite, worst night. There was a quiffed era, wasn't there?
9:53 Speaker 00 There was a quiffed era.
9:54 Speaker 01 Is it the quiffed era?
9:55 Speaker 03 It's gotta be the quiffed era.
9:56 Speaker 00 But the quiffed era, there was a lot of like wet look lacquer in his hair.
10:00 Speaker 03 I'm going on Reddit, Ellis, look away.
10:05 Speaker 03 Late 2011, they're saying.
10:08 Speaker 01 Just, just, just ask Reddit, what era Alex Turner does John Robbins look like? There'll be so many threads about it. Just don't go on the Taskmaster ones. It's just bad news.
10:22 Speaker 00 There's Reddit threads talking about whether people are gonna leave during my set at the Royal Albert Hall.
10:27 Speaker 03 Suck it and see.
10:29 Speaker 00 You're, you're suck and see Robbins.
10:31 Speaker 03 Which was a bad album.
10:32 Speaker 01 What? Well, it doesn't matter because I look good.
10:35 Speaker 00 You look good. So how did you find the Pilates then?
10:38 Speaker 01 Um, challenging.
10:40 Speaker 00 Because he loves it. Yeah, loves it.
10:42 Speaker 01 Due to having the tightest hamstrings in, I'm gonna say the home counties.
10:47 Speaker 00 Oh, okay.
10:48 Speaker 01 It was reformer Pilates.
10:50 Speaker 00 Yeah.
10:51 Speaker 01 So I struggle with anything that involves my legs being straight or bent or moving.
10:58 Speaker 00 Okay.
10:59 Speaker 01 But you're in lots of like hooks and hoops and loops.
11:04 Speaker 01 And there's stuff, because my back's been quite bad recently, there's stuff where you think either this is exactly what I do need to be doing, or either this is exactly what I don't need to be doing.
11:15 Speaker 00 Yeah.
11:15 Speaker 01 And I'm pretty sure it's what I do need to be doing.
11:18 Speaker 00 Did you feel tired or sore at the end of it? I've never done Pilates.
11:21 Speaker 01 Not really, but it does, if you're doing them properly, it does really engage the old abs.
11:26 Speaker 00 Oh.
11:26 Speaker 01 You get a lot of ab engagement.
11:28 Speaker 00 Oh, well done.
11:29 Speaker 01 But I am sort of struggling to keep up with the rest of the class.
11:32 Speaker 00 That's all right.
11:33 Speaker 01 Yeah.
11:33 Speaker 00 Also, it's not a very sort of toxic masculinity sort of atmosphere in Pilates.
11:38 Speaker 03 It's not high rocks, is it?
11:39 Speaker 00 No, you're not at all.
11:40 Speaker 03 Lifters laughing at you and everything.
11:42 Speaker 01 No, no, no, no, it's very supportive.
11:43 Speaker 00 Good.
11:44 Speaker 03 Would you ever do a high rocks? Have you seen, have you seen the videos?
11:46 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. My CrossFit gym now does high rocks training, but I haven't lifted a weight for a year.
11:54 Speaker 00 No.
11:54 Speaker 01 So I don't think I'd be very good at high rocks.
11:58 Speaker 00 That's all right.
11:59 Speaker 01 I'm struggling a bit with the old strength and mobility and cardio and health and weight and everything.
12:05 Speaker 00 You've got to start somewhere, John.
12:06 Speaker 01 Yeah, but I'd just try to start again because you have to start from your bottom with your bench press amounts.
12:12 Speaker 00 But you might be, you might be starting from the bottom, John. You've started from the bottom the first time, not the, you might have had, you might have had time off. You're not starting from the absolute bottom.
12:20 Speaker 01 I lost a lot of muscle and gained a lot of fat.
12:24 Speaker 00 Yeah, but you know, you were an absolute shambles when you started at CrossFit.
12:29 Speaker 01 Yeah, maybe you're all right, but I'm now too scared to go back.
12:35 Speaker 00 Yeah, so it's a mental problem.
12:36 Speaker 01 And it's too hot to run, so I eat.
12:40 Speaker 00 Yeah.
12:41 Speaker 01 That's what I do all day. I think you hadn't done anything for an hour. I want a bit to eat, mate.
12:48 Speaker 00 Why don't you have a star bar?
12:50 Speaker 01 I might have a star bar, might have a cookie, might have some toasted hummus.
12:55 Speaker 00 I'll have a crunchy now.
12:56 Speaker 01 Yeah.
12:57 Speaker 00 Yeah, well, you know, it's fine. Heat waves aren't going to last forever. You could go out and do something.
13:03 Speaker 01 Yeah, it's a bit cooler now. Oh, and my roses are out.
13:07 Speaker 00 Are they?
13:07 Speaker 01 Yes.
13:08 Speaker 00 On your Quality Street.
13:10 Speaker 01 Oh, very good. And I went to see, I went to see friend of the show, Lou Sanders.
13:16 Speaker 00 Lovely.
13:16 Speaker 01 She's got a swimming pond.
13:18 Speaker 00 What's that mean?
13:20 Speaker 01 Uh, now I've been guilty at rolling the old eyes and giving the odd bit of advice to the lovely Lou Sanders when she comes up with a new project. And we do have a laugh about it. Because I'm quite conservative, not in my politics.
13:36 Speaker 00 Or in your politics.
13:38 Speaker 01 What?
13:39 Speaker 00 No, that's fine to say you're not conservative in your politics because there's options, carry on.
13:43 Speaker 01 There's other options.
13:45 Speaker 00 That's fine.
13:46 Speaker 01 I could either be centrist, left wing, hard left or hard right.
13:50 Speaker 00 There we go. Oh, take your pick.
13:51 Speaker 01 They're all up for grabs.
13:52 Speaker 00 Take your pick.
13:53 Speaker 01 Or I could be a wig.
13:55 Speaker 00 Yeah.
13:55 Speaker 01 Or a liberal, an old fashioned liberal.
13:58 Speaker 00 Yes.
13:59 Speaker 01 But no, because I'm, I'm too anxious to really do big projects. Whereas Lou would just sort of dive headfirst into these things and I'll often be like, well, have you thought about this? Have you thought about that? She has made the most beautiful garden I have ever seen.
14:16 Speaker 00 She?
14:17 Speaker 01 Simply by just saying yes and, yes and, yes and.
14:20 Speaker 00 She improvised a nice garden?
14:22 Speaker 01 Basically, yes.
14:24 Speaker 00 And there's a swimming pond in there?
14:25 Speaker 01 There's a swimming pond, Dave.
14:27 Speaker 00 What is a swimming pond? How she lined it?
14:30 Speaker 01 Um, these are questions you would have to ask her and her swimming pond experts. It's basically like. A pond you can get in.
14:39 Speaker 00 Okay.
14:40 Speaker 01 And.
14:40 Speaker 00 That did, did exist before or did not exist?
14:43 Speaker 01 Did not exist before. So you can walk from sort of like ankle depth up to like chest depth.
14:51 Speaker 00 Wow.
14:52 Speaker 01 And lots of aquatic plants in it.
14:55 Speaker 00 Oh.
14:55 Speaker 01 And it's all been beautifully sort of manicured around the edges with lots of plants. And, you know, I'm not, I'm, I'm Johnny, I'll wait with the things on the beach.
15:05 Speaker 00 Hmm.
15:06 Speaker 01 You, you guys get in the sea.
15:08 Speaker 00 You hold the coats at Chessington.
15:09 Speaker 01 I hold the coats at Chessington. I hold the iPhones and the car keys on the beach.
15:14 Speaker 00 Yeah.
15:14 Speaker 01 I don't like getting sand in between my toes. I don't like being in damp clothes in a car. I don't like sand being in my car. I don't like dogs.
15:22 Speaker 00 Okay. Other than that, rock and roll.
15:25 Speaker 01 Rock and roll. Um, but I just got straight in this swimming pond.
15:29 Speaker 00 What did you wear on your feet?
15:30 Speaker 03 Yeah, I was gonna ask that.
15:31 Speaker 01 Uh, I bought my Crocs, but I actually wore some sliders.
15:35 Speaker 00 Okay.
15:35 Speaker 03 Can you go barefooted in there?
15:37 Speaker 01 Yeah, you could, yeah.
15:37 Speaker 00 Could you?
15:38 Speaker 01 Yeah. I'll show you a picky.
15:39 Speaker 00 Are there any animals in the pond?
15:41 Speaker 01 Uh, no, but I'm assuming one day that.
15:43 Speaker 00 I mean fish.
15:43 Speaker 01 There might be the, yeah, there might be frogs and the, the odd fish and, um, there's a picky.
15:50 Speaker 00 What was the temperature of the water?
15:52 Speaker 03 Blimey heck.
15:53 Speaker 01 It was still slightly warm from the heatwave, even though it was somehow 10 degrees cooler in Margate than in London the other day.
15:59 Speaker 00 Yeah. Izzy was filming in Yorkshire. They offered a warm coat.
16:04 Speaker 00 Oh, wow. That's got a Japanese look to it.
16:07 Speaker 01 Yeah.
16:07 Speaker 00 What a nice garden she's got.
16:09 Speaker 01 I would say it was probably about 15 degrees in the water, so.
16:13 Speaker 00 That looks lovely. Also, it's, it's quite shallow, so it will warm up.
16:18 Speaker 01 Oh, yeah.
16:19 Speaker 00 That's absolutely brilliant. I'm very proud of Lou.
16:22 Speaker 01 Yeah, I said to her, I'm very proud of you. I'm sorry for being such a negative Nigel about everything.
16:28 Speaker 00 What a nice thing to have in her life.
16:30 Speaker 01 Oh.
16:30 Speaker 03 It's a lovely colour of water.
16:32 Speaker 01 Yeah, really gorgeous.
16:34 Speaker 00 What a positive.
16:35 Speaker 01 A huge positive. And then I went to, um, Faversham and I went to a farm shop. And I went to a place by the sea and another place by the sea in Whitstable.
16:48 Speaker 00 Oh, I like Whitstable.
16:49 Speaker 01 So I had a great old time.
16:51 Speaker 00 Good.
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18:59 Speaker 00 Well done, John. Have you had a good time, Dave?
19:02 Speaker 03 Uh, yes. Lila's, it was Lila's birthday party on Saturday. We had 22 girls in the garden. And we had, I think it's fair to say we bit off more than we could chew.
19:12 Speaker 01 It sounds like an old sort of, um, nursery rhyme.
19:15 Speaker 00 22 girls in the garden.
19:16 Speaker 01 22 girls in the garden. What did daddy learn?
19:20 Speaker 03 Never do again.
19:21 Speaker 00 And they're all crying for different reasons.
19:23 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
19:23 Speaker 03 Yeah, that happened.
19:25 Speaker 01 One has dropped her plum pudding.
19:28 Speaker 01 The other scared by a crow, that sort of thing. What has daddy learned?
19:32 Speaker 03 At the, at the end of those things, Hannah and I, I think, and it's, I think it's a good thing to be, is at the end of those sorts of challenging days, you go, that was good, that was worth it, you know. Lila had a great day. We both got to the end of that day and went, that was hell on earth, we're never doing that again.
19:46 Speaker 00 Yeah.
19:47 Speaker 03 But Lila did have a great day.
19:48 Speaker 00 For Betty's fifth birthday, we invited everyone in the class to a church hall for a party.
19:54 Speaker 03 But church halls, at least it's not your house.
19:56 Speaker 00 Yeah, but at the end of it, it was like 40 kids or something. And at the end of it, I said, never again. I remember sweeping up at the end and thinking, I have, I, I know my limit now.
20:07 Speaker 01 Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
20:08 Speaker 00 Beyond, I was beyond my limit today.
20:11 Speaker 03 And kids will do anything to get to the sweets, it turns out.
20:15 Speaker 00 Yeah.
20:16 Speaker 01 What's on the list of anything?
20:18 Speaker 03 Uh, they'll just, they'll, they are, once they know there are sweets in the vicinity, they will, they will make sure to try and find those.
20:26 Speaker 01 Who does that remind you of, Dave?
20:28 Speaker 03 It's like the Johnny J R.
20:29 Speaker 00 Do what does happen though.
20:31 Speaker 03 That's what you would have done. Oh my lord.
20:33 Speaker 00 The older they get, the smaller the parties become.
20:37 Speaker 01 Yeah, until you get to my age, where you're just going to the Alps on your own. And you're like, finally, I can manage this.
20:44 Speaker 00 Yeah, I can manage my party, my solo Alps party. I am in charge. Yeah, they, that was something, I didn't anticipate that. I, I thought it was going to be that kind of chaos until they were 16, but no, they do get smaller and more manageable in my experience.
21:00 Speaker 03 Gotta chip away, gotta chip away the friendship groups. Well, not the friendship groups.
21:05 Speaker 00 You gotta drive a wedge.
21:07 Speaker 01 Yeah, Lila, tell you who was slagging you off behind the bouncy castle? Little Poppy, she was slagging you off.
21:13 Speaker 00 Yeah, she's tucking behind your back.
21:15 Speaker 01 I tell you what, do you know who's run off with your teddy bear and put pins in its eyes?
21:19 Speaker 00 Yeah.
21:19 Speaker 01 Oliver. Yeah.
21:21 Speaker 00 Who's it mate?
21:22 Speaker 01 Who's been an eye little upstart, actually. Said your shoes are crap.
21:27 Speaker 01 Do you know who's done a piddle on your bike? Yeah, he says you were in pinch the jeans, but you're nine. Noah's piddled all over your bike. What shall I do? Shall I tell him to come back next time? Oh no, you're probably a predator. Just come back next time. It's probably the best, right? If you just never invite him again. I reckon we got us, I reckon we got us down to sixteen for next year. No, only get rid of another ten and then it's dead, dead manageable.
21:51 Speaker 03 Yeah, it was a bit of that. But no, lovely, lovely, no, it wasn't, it wasn't. Why am I saying that?
21:56 Speaker 00 What did you eat? Or what did they eat?
21:58 Speaker 03 Domino's pizza.
21:59 Speaker 00 Yeah, of course, you've got to.
22:00 Speaker 03 Domino's pizza, but again.
22:01 Speaker 01 Because the salt counteracts the sugar, doesn't it? It evens them out.
22:05 Speaker 03 But it's hard to, they didn't quite understand when the limit of pizza slices had been reached for each person.
22:11 Speaker 01 Who does that remind you of, Dave?
22:14 Speaker 03 I was actually, yeah, I was well equipped with, for this, due to the people I hang around with at the other.
22:19 Speaker 01 The Bureau de Change of the Mind is the perfect training team for kids' parties.
22:23 Speaker 03 Yeah.
22:23 Speaker 01 How many Domino's slices do they have each?
22:26 Speaker 03 So there was twenty kids.
22:27 Speaker 01 Yeah.
22:28 Speaker 03 And we got four large, knowing that there was ten slices in each pizza. This is right.
22:36 Speaker 01 So that's forty slices for twenty children.
22:39 Speaker 00 Two slices each. They're quite big slices.
22:41 Speaker 01 That's not enough.
22:42 Speaker 00 And they're only little.
22:43 Speaker 03 They're big slices.
22:43 Speaker 00 Yeah, they are big slices.
22:44 Speaker 01 Two slices each.
22:46 Speaker 03 I reckon. We had chips on the go in the oven as well. So we had the chips coming out.
22:50 Speaker 00 I think you've done that. I, I, I think that's what I would have worked it out.
22:53 Speaker 03 But a lot of them wanted three.
22:54 Speaker 01 Yeah, but I would have ten.
22:56 Speaker 03 And I wanted so. I thought I was going to get some leftovers.
22:58 Speaker 01 I would have ten slices and I'm not five times bigger than a nine year old. So you don't, you would want half a pizza per child. You should have ten pizzas.
23:08 Speaker 03 Yeah, what's happened there?
23:10 Speaker 01 You, that's your, that's on you. That's not on kids wanting more than two slices of pizza.
23:14 Speaker 00 It does start to get expensive though.
23:16 Speaker 03 Yeah.
23:17 Speaker 00 Um, also, you've got to get rid of all the boxes. Like, recycling looks crazy that on party week.
23:24 Speaker 03 Well, you shouldn't really be recycling your pizza boxes.
23:25 Speaker 00 No, well, I don't know why I said that. I just was making, it would have looked crazy if you decided to recycle them. Yeah, goodbye. Sorry, I'm tired. This is my Everest, I've had it.
23:36 Speaker 03 I'm on the top of the mountain.
23:36 Speaker 01 You can recycle them if they've not got food and oil on them.
23:39 Speaker 03 Yeah, I think a lot of people do, but I think the minute it's got to be greased.
23:41 Speaker 01 I want a pizza now, Dave.
23:43 Speaker 03 I can't keep it.
23:44 Speaker 00 What was your entertainment, Dave?
23:46 Speaker 03 I did an obstacle course for them. I did a fantastic obstacle, but again, just trying to corral 20 kids to follow instructions. It was a lost cause.
23:56 Speaker 00 It's when they have an argument that has nothing to do with you.
24:01 Speaker 03 Yeah.
24:01 Speaker 00 That just reflects the politics of the playground.
24:04 Speaker 03 Oh, it was, it was.
24:05 Speaker 00 And then when they get upset, it's very hard to calm them down.
24:09 Speaker 03 Yeah.
24:10 Speaker 00 And that will, because for Betty's last birthday party, we had a sleepover, which is still being discussed in the school. Because they did a full all nighter, which was not allowed.
24:23 Speaker 03 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
24:23 Speaker 00 And they played, I was sleeping in the attic for some reason and they, they were in, they didn't realise I was up there and they, they came in at six AM because they're playing hide and seek.
24:30 Speaker 01 Did you get in trouble from the other parents?
24:33 Speaker 00 No, because we were begging them to go to sleep. So, so they would sort of agree to, and then we'd turn the lights off and go upstairs. And then they were just out whispering and they were, they were absolutely destroyed the next day.
24:46 Speaker 03 Yeah.
24:47 Speaker 00 But it's sort of famous in, in this, in the, in the tapestry of the, of the primary school. Betty's birthday party. But with the entertainment, I think they just watched a film. I can't remember us doing.
24:57 Speaker 03 No, we had all sorts. We had musical statues at one point for them, which they enjoyed. Oh, Hannah, I mean, goodness knows how she finds the time. It was her last week of secondary school. She found time to buy 20 tote bags, kind of inscribed an outline. She's very arty, so she's got good font in like a bubble font, the name of each child on each tote bag. And got a load of colouring, you know, fabric colouring pencils. So the first hour, it actually started really well and calmly because they were scribbling away at their little tote bag, which you can then take away.
25:27 Speaker 00 It's like the first 20 minutes of, of, of a big football match when, when your team's keeping it tight. You're like, all right, okay.
25:33 Speaker 03 This is all right.
25:34 Speaker 00 It's still nil nil.
25:37 Speaker 00 Kay. He only needs one chance.
25:39 Speaker 03 And then it starts to open up after a couple of sending offs and stuff and it all goes, it all goes haywire.
25:44 Speaker 00 Yeah.
25:45 Speaker 03 But it was good.
25:46 Speaker 01 I wonder if they're playing football and only two slices of pizza, Dave. Absolute nightmare.
25:51 Speaker 03 Not made of money, John. Do you know how expensive Domino's is?
25:54 Speaker 00 Was the obstacle course around the house or the garden?
25:58 Speaker 03 It was egg and spoon to the first cone. Cone on your head to the second cone without touching it. If the cone falls off, back to the start until you get the cone all the way on the head to the, to the third cone. And there's a ball waiting and then dribble the ball in and out, pass to the person on the other side. They do it, they come back until the teams have completely switched over. There's three on one side, two on the other.
26:17 Speaker 01 Was it, was there a kid there like me who was like, Mr. Masterman, Mr. Masterman?
26:21 Speaker 03 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
26:22 Speaker 01 Jeremy touched his cone. I saw him touch his cone.
26:26 Speaker 03 Yeah, yeah, there's all that. I mean, all of them, all of them are, you know, they all get, they're all very lovely, lovely kids.
26:31 Speaker 00 There will also, there will also be a kid who just doesn't want to do it and will sulk.
26:37 Speaker 03 And that's fine. Yeah.
26:38 Speaker 00 No, no, no, but it's, it's interesting because obviously we're not able to observe our children at school. So you, you're, it's an introduction to the dynamic.
26:47 Speaker 03 Yeah.
26:48 Speaker 00 It's quite interesting, actually. I saw that at sports day because I, I attended my kid's sports day last week or two weeks ago. And some kids will be trying to win the 60 metre sprint.
26:59 Speaker 03 Yeah.
26:59 Speaker 00 And other kids almost as a protest will sort of not do it, or they just won't throw the beanbag.
27:04 Speaker 03 Yeah.
27:04 Speaker 01 Well, they might find it a bit overwhelming and be like, this isn't really my scene.
27:08 Speaker 00 Yeah.
27:08 Speaker 01 But they don't, they don't, are not aware of that quite yet.
27:10 Speaker 00 But you can't predict that until you see it in action. That's, it's, it's, it's quite an enlightening experience.
27:15 Speaker 01 I could be in charge of the sort of the calm zone. I could come and there could be a little sort of John's tent.
27:23 Speaker 03 Uncle John's in there and I can't see John.
27:25 Speaker 00 Do you want to go and, do you want to go and be calm with Uncle John?
27:30 Speaker 01 Okay, well, it's not going to stay calm in here for much longer because it's time from the Calmru Connection. What is your name? Elis James, son of Wales.
27:42 Speaker 00 You started doing more of these, but your hit rate is about the same as my hit rate on the communication. It's about 50%.
27:49 Speaker 01 I should have said Calmru, not Calmru. Then it would have been great.
27:53 Speaker 00 Then it would have been great.
27:54 Speaker 01 Elis James, son of Wales, has just 60 seconds to find a mutual connection with a fellow country person. Can he do it? Let's find out in the Cymru Connection.
28:04 Speaker 07 It's another Cymru Connection. Ellis thinks his tactics are sheer perfection, but his questions have one direction. Where did you go to school? Do you know David Evans? No. Come on, mate, you must do. No, we've never met at all.
28:33 Speaker 01 Before we get into today's attempt, a nice Cymru connecting tale from listener Tom. Hello, my pair of sturdy saplings. I thought I'd email to tell you of my own wonderful Cymru Connect experience. Back in 2008, I was travelling to the remote island of St Helena in the South Atlantic. Before the island had an airport and the quickest way to get there was on the Ministry of Defence flight to Ascension Island. On its way to the Falkland Islands, followed by a four-day sailing on the Royal Mail ship, which reminds me of the book I've just finished, which is one of the best novels I've ever read. It's called Trustee from the Toolroom and it's by Neville Shute and Richard Osman recommended it to me and it is brilliant.
29:14 Speaker 00 You told me about this the other day, so what's so great about it for the listeners?
29:19 Speaker 01 So it's bang in my era, like late 50s, everyday guy, lives in suburban Ealing. He's a toolmaker and a model engineer.
29:30 Speaker 00 Like Keir Starmer's dad.
29:31 Speaker 01 Yeah, a bit like Keir Starmer's dad. And he finds himself suddenly, unexpectedly, the trustee of his niece. And in order to, without spoiling it, in order to fully...
29:50 Speaker 01 oversee his duties as a trustee, he has to embark on an adventure, which is way out of his comfort zone. And it's a real-
29:57 Speaker 00 It's not a fantastical book.
29:59 Speaker 01 No, it's a real romp and a real adventure story. There is peril, but crucially for me, things work out okay. Cause I don't like bad things happening to good people.
30:11 Speaker 00 Well, you don't like injustice. Yeah.
30:12 Speaker 01 But what's great is because Neville Shute was an engineer, even though I don't understand them, his, his descriptions of like machine tooling and even the boats they're on, he's obviously really researched boat terminology.
30:25 Speaker 00 Which must have been, would have involved a trip to the library-
30:28 Speaker 01 Yes.
30:29 Speaker 00 In 1959.
30:32 Speaker 01 Oh, it's just so, so good.
30:33 Speaker 00 What's the book called? Neville Shute?
30:34 Speaker 01 Trustee from the Toolroom.
30:36 Speaker 00 Okay. I need a holiday book.
30:37 Speaker 01 Oh, I'd recommend it.
30:39 Speaker 00 Is it long?
30:40 Speaker 01 Uh-
30:41 Speaker 00 Does it have pictures?
30:41 Speaker 01 It's about, it's sort of a classic novel length, sort of, you know, 200 pages.
30:46 Speaker 00 Oh, lovely. Yeah, I'll, I'll read that.
30:48 Speaker 01 On the ship, around 30 so-called saints travelling home, four or five professionals such as myself, visiting the island for various work reasons, and maybe three tourists looking to visit a destination far off the beaten track. One evening, on the ship at dinner, a thousand miles from the nearest mainland, I got chatting to a lady in her seventies. She's recently been widowed and was living her best life ticking off some of her bucket list travel destinations. It soon emerged that we were both from Wales. Canarfon? No way. Me too.
31:19 Speaker 00 Yes.
31:20 Speaker 01 I grew up on Greyslon.
31:22 Speaker 00 Greyslon.
31:23 Speaker 01 Greyslon, just south of Canarfon. It turned out that she used to live with her husband on a farm in Greyslon, a small village of a few hundred people. I told her I lived in a house at the end of Ford Lago.
31:37 Speaker 00 Can I have a look at that?
31:38 Speaker 01 F F O R D D.
31:39 Speaker 00 F F, uh, Forth?
31:41 Speaker 01 Forth Lago.
31:42 Speaker 00 Oh, is that an I? It might be Forth Iago.
31:45 Speaker 01 Oh, Forth Iago, a short cul-de-sac. Her reply, Forth Iago used to be a field on their farm and her husband built the house I grew up in.
31:55 Speaker 00 Oh my god, that's fantastic.
31:59 Speaker 01 Have a great day. Tom Heller. Hey, thanks, Tom. That's great. Come reconnect out in the wild.
32:04 Speaker 00 I love that.
32:05 Speaker 01 Also, maybe I want to go on an MOD flight to Ascension Island. Maybe I want to be an adventurer. Hmm.
32:11 Speaker 03 No.
32:12 Speaker 00 I don't think you do.
32:13 Speaker 03 Okay.
32:13 Speaker 00 I really, really don't think you do.
32:16 Speaker 01 Despite arresting the slide with a swift connection to caller Gareth a few weeks ago, Ellis returned to his usual losing ways, not my words in last week's Crossed Wires episode.
32:26 Speaker 00 Oh, yeah.
32:27 Speaker 01 It was stated prior to the attempt that the result would count towards Ellis's total, and though he attempted to connect to audience member Ian via well-dressed George, Ellis ultimately failed in his quest. Ellis's connection rate has dropped to 46.81%. He's made a connection with 44 out of 94 callers. What can he do this week?
32:48 Speaker 00 Do what I like about coming connecting, it's now become the descriptive term for that. So a friend of mine's on holiday in Buenos Aires, Welsh boy, who I've known since school, and he bumped into like 30 rugby players from Sarn, and they were all trying to come reconnect. That's how they were all used, yeah.
33:09 Speaker 03 It's etched in now, isn't it?
33:10 Speaker 00 Etched in. It's part of the fabric of social life.
33:14 Speaker 03 Yeah.
33:18 Speaker 01 We have a caller on the line from Wales. What's your name, caller?
33:22 Speaker 06 Hi, my name is Leah.
33:23 Speaker 01 Okay, Leah. Ellis, you have 60 seconds to find a mutual connection with Leah. Your time starts now.
33:29 Speaker 00 Agent school?
33:31 Speaker 06 Forty-five, Kiwi Cambria.
33:34 Speaker 00 Oh, Kiwi Cambria. Well, then, Beth Mead.
33:38 Speaker 06 Jesus, yeah.
33:39 Speaker 00 Yes, okay, thank you, thank you, thank you. That's all right then. Okay, that's fine, that's fine, that's fine, that's fine.
33:45 Speaker 01 Wow, that was quick. Ellis, how did you know Beth Mead?
33:49 Speaker 00 I, well, Beth went to Cambria and I used to hang out with Beth in sixth form because we liked the same books. Because I went to a different school, but we liked the same books and music. And she was, she's really good laugh, Beth. And then I was in a drama on Radio 4 that her husband, James, was the producer of.
34:10 Speaker 01 Ah.
34:11 Speaker 00 So I haven't seen Beth for a very long time, but I sort of know how she's getting along because I work quite a lot with James. I, we did like seven or eight series.
34:19 Speaker 01 So Leah, how do you know Beth?
34:22 Speaker 05 Beth and I were in the same, um, uh, class, a form, form class.
34:27 Speaker 00 Did you remember Rhiannon O'Dreas?
34:30 Speaker 05 Yes, I was very good friends with Rhiannon, yeah.
34:32 Speaker 00 I did come out in youth council with Rhiannon O'Dreas and our greatest achievement was setting up a drop in centre for children in which they were allowed to smoke.
34:43 Speaker 01 A bit of John Robbins, that.
34:45 Speaker 00 And do you remember Yvonne?
34:47 Speaker 05 Yvonne? Yes.
34:48 Speaker 00 Yes, Yvonne was on the youth council as well and it was, it was Hannah.
34:52 Speaker 01 I didn't know you were a dweeb like me.
34:55 Speaker 00 Do you know what it was? Right. My mother was a careers officer. So she helped people that university leavers find work, but she'd also done it in schools beforehand. So she ended up, by the time I was doing this kind of stuff, she was working at Trinity College. But she'd been going into schools before that and she was always saying, when you're filling out your UCAS form, if you want to go to a good university, you need to show that you've got a hint of land and you don't do anything, son. And I, and I realised that I just hadn't done very much. So there was an advert in the paper or something for members of Carmarthen's youth council. I just put my name forward. I can't remember how many, I must have attended a meeting of every fortnight or something.
35:36 Speaker 00 I can't remember, but we used to sit in like Carmarthen council's offices, like in the main chamber. And there's people who used to take notes and things. See, so I was basically the voice of Carmarthen's youth. There was about, there was about 10 or 12 of us and we organised the Battle of the Bands at St Peter's Hall.
35:52 Speaker 01 Nice. I was on the Castle School sixth form committee and I was chair of the committee. Won it by a landslide, actually.
36:01 Speaker 00 Yeah.
36:01 Speaker 01 I had a campaign manager. I had like a spin doctor.
36:04 Speaker 00 Did you?
36:04 Speaker 01 Yeah, Warren. And he called me up the night before and went, Robbins, it's a landslide.
36:10 Speaker 01 We organised the school party, like the school disco. And because the kids of the year before had got in so much trouble that it was in the Sun newspaper that they all had their stomachs pumped.
36:20 Speaker 00 Oh, yes, yeah. Is this in your book?
36:22 Speaker 01 No, I don't think so. The, oh yeah, maybe it is. The school like refused to have any connection to it. So we charged like seven quid a ticket, including a bus and entry to the nightclub. We made like 450 quid because he couldn't go to the school.
36:35 Speaker 00 Which is a fortune when you're 18.
36:37 Speaker 01 Yeah, like King's ransom in 2000.
36:39 Speaker 00 Yeah.
36:39 Speaker 01 So we split it amongst the committee.
36:41 Speaker 00 Do I remember at the Battle of the Bands, which I organised, a lot of local groups played. And it was a really good night. And then, right at the end, some rough kids turned up and wanted to get in, but they didn't have tickets. And the cleaner of St Peter's Hall, who, and it wasn't his job, had become kind of de facto security because he was an adult. Yeah. And he was trying to stop these kids who didn't have tickets coming in. And this, a rough kid had a mountain bike and he kept shouting, I'm gonna throw the mountain bike through the window. And I remember thinking, I hate organising things. This is the worst day of my life. Leah, do you know of any more connections?
37:21 Speaker 05 I do, actually. I didn't think we would get any school connections because we weren't in the same school.
37:29 Speaker 05 But I actually work with your cousin, Rodri.
37:32 Speaker 00 What do you, Rodri from, from L- Lampeter?
37:35 Speaker 05 Yes.
37:36 Speaker 00 Oh, how do you work with Rodri?
37:38 Speaker 05 I'm, well, I'm technically his assistant in the NHS.
37:42 Speaker 00 Oh, right. Wow.
37:44 Speaker 05 Yeah.
37:44 Speaker 00 Oh, that's, so where, where do you work now, Leah?
37:47 Speaker 05 In the corporate office for Howlthorn and Carmarthen.
37:50 Speaker 00 Ah. Oh, well, this is.
37:53 Speaker 01 Have you got like a billion cousins? Are you one of those sorts of people?
37:55 Speaker 00 No, I'm not like Roisin Connery who has fifty-five or fifty-two first cousins, which is pretty impressive.
38:01 Speaker 01 What, but has Rodri from Lampeter featured yet on the Cumbria Connection?
38:05 Speaker 00 No, I think his farm might have done. Because he's, he comes from a notable farm.
38:10 Speaker 01 Does he?
38:11 Speaker 03 Yeah, you've mentioned, I'm sure you've mentioned Lampeter before.
38:13 Speaker 00 I've mentioned Lampeter before, Dave.
38:15 Speaker 01 Leah, have you ever met Ellis or had any direct interaction with him? Because you're the same age.
38:20 Speaker 05 No, never, not as far as I'm aware. Anyway, I don't think we've ever met.
38:24 Speaker 00 We would have gone to the same places at the same time. So you would have gone to places like the Riv and Metros and the Jolly Tar in Carmarthen when you were a teenager, I'm assuming.
38:33 Speaker 05 Yeah, and, you know, Granby's when it was a pound pint, definitely.
38:38 Speaker 00 Oh, my God. A hellhole.
38:42 Speaker 00 And did you go to Savannah's, the nightclub for over twenty fives and divorces?
38:48 Speaker 06 Yeah, I think I was probably about seventeen when I went in there.
38:51 Speaker 00 Yeah, I had my eighteenth birthday party in there. I worked in there once and all of the,
38:57 Speaker 00 all of the punters were queuing up at the bar Saturday night, very busy. And someone said that I had a nose like Ringo Starr and they all started chanting Ringo, Ringo, Ringo. Yeah. It was a good place to come up to. It was good, honest fun, actually. Oh, I thank you, Leah, for calling in. I'm very, I'm very, I'm glad to have got a good, successful connection.
39:18 Speaker 01 Yeah, straight in from the kickoff. So yeah, thank you for your call, Leah.
39:23 Speaker 06 Thank you. It's in problem. Rodri said he's gonna come and see you in the East End, but.
39:27 Speaker 00 Oh, is he? Good. There's actually a minibus of my family coming in, but I've just found out I will discuss this at another time. But yeah, nice. Thanks. Nice char, Leah.
39:37 Speaker 06 At you, y'all.
39:38 Speaker 00 Thanks.
39:39 Speaker 01 Bye bye. Well, much needed there. Well done, Ellis. So that I'm guessing is gonna push you back up above forty seven percent.
39:47 Speaker 00 Yes, it will, I think.
39:49 Speaker 01 Fingers crossed, because we're at about, what is it, forty four out of ninety four? So they're about a percentage point each, aren't they?
39:56 Speaker 00 Yeah.
39:57 Speaker 01 Okay.
39:58 Speaker 03 But not, but I was confused at first, but not the English footballer Beth Mead, obviously different.
40:02 Speaker 00 No, no, no.
40:03 Speaker 01 Oh, I assumed it was.
40:04 Speaker 00 No, no, no. I was, well, I grew up in Carmarthen with a woman called Beth Mead.
40:09 Speaker 03 Yeah.
40:10 Speaker 00 Who now, obviously, I think of every time Beth Mead, the footballer, was on the table. It's quite confusing.
40:14 Speaker 01 I should have interrogated that a bit because I assumed it was the footballer Beth Mead. Well, let's take a little break now before we play a made up game.
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42:42 Speaker 01 Okay, Dave looks poised. He's been in secret conversations with producer Michael about the made up game as always, Ellis and I remaining ignorant. So the field of play is fair and equal, Dave.
42:56 Speaker 03 Well, let's have one more spin of Sam and his big band's jingle. Here we hit it. Here we hit it. Here we hit it. Here we hit it and here we go.
43:06 Speaker 00 Ladies and gentlemen, it's Tuesday afternoon, which means it's time for Made up games. John Robbins and Elis James. It's so good. It's time to play. We've asked the public to make a game. This isn't a bit about French rugby league, trying to work on
43:27 Speaker 03 The Pembrokeshire scene, before we have a shame, well, you know exactly what time it is. So when there's cognitive declining. That's my favourite bit. And if your thumb procedures got you whining, you know it's time for a made up game. John Robbins and Elis James. You never know which way the guessing is gonna go. So take it away, Mr Fizz, Mr Babe, because it's time to play a made up game.
44:08 Speaker 00 A Hall of Famer.
44:09 Speaker 03 Hmm.
44:10 Speaker 00 And it does sound like I've had a jingle made for my cognitive decline.
44:13 Speaker 03 Yeah. Uh, thank you to Sam and his big band. Scores on the doors. John won a tense game of brain darts a few weeks ago to take the scores to 15 love in the third game of the third set. It's one all in games and John is two sets to love up. Since Ellis took the first game in the third set, John has had five wins in a row.
44:34 Speaker 01 Wow.
44:35 Speaker 00 He ma- he, he's a moments player and he makes it happen.
44:40 Speaker 03 Yeah.
44:40 Speaker 00 He's Jude Bellingham.
44:41 Speaker 03 He is Jude Bellingham.
44:43 Speaker 01 Am I?
44:44 Speaker 03 Yeah.
44:45 Speaker 01 Great.
44:46 Speaker 00 He is a sensation, Jude Bellingham.
44:47 Speaker 03 Yeah, he's a good player.
44:48 Speaker 01 Um. He also sounds a bit like a, an actress from an 80s sitcom.
44:53 Speaker 00 Judy Bellingham.
44:54 Speaker 01 Did you hear Jude Bellingham's died? Oh, she was, she was great in Daniel Road.
44:59 Speaker 00 Yeah.
45:01 Speaker 01 Like, he'd be there with Penelope Keith.
45:06 Speaker 00 Yeah.
45:07 Speaker 01 Patricia Routledge.
45:08 Speaker 00 Yeah.
45:09 Speaker 01 Jude Bellingham.
45:10 Speaker 00 Yeah, I don't think ITV have made a decent soap since Daniel Road.
45:14 Speaker 01 Yeah.
45:15 Speaker 03 Right, uh, can John make it six today or can Ellis stop his own rot? This week's game comes in from.
45:23 Speaker 01 Can Ellis stop his own rot?
45:25 Speaker 03 Thank you.
45:26 Speaker 01 That sounds horrific. I wouldn't feel good if I heard that before playing a game.
45:29 Speaker 00 That'd feel great.
45:30 Speaker 01 Imagine if a football manager said, right, you lot, can you stop your own rot?
45:35 Speaker 00 Yeah.
45:36 Speaker 01 Might be quite effective.
45:37 Speaker 00 You've all gone mouldy.
45:38 Speaker 03 Yeah, well, you gotta, you know, you gotta stop your own rot sometimes. It's not up to other people.
45:41 Speaker 01 You're like a food waste bin and there's flies all round you.
45:44 Speaker 00 Yeah.
45:45 Speaker 01 Because you forget to put it out on the pavement and they're not gonna come down your drive.
45:49 Speaker 03 Yeah.
45:50 Speaker 00 Has that happened to you?
45:51 Speaker 01 Yeah, the odd occasion.
45:54 Speaker 03 This week's game comes in from Sophie in Hove. To my three softly breaking shafts of light.
46:02 Speaker 00 They're getting more and more poetic.
46:04 Speaker 03 Yeah, it's lovely. It's absolutely lovely. In a recent episode of the Bravo Delta Charlie Oscar Tango Mike, Bureau de Chans of the Mind, of course, you discussed voluntary castaway Alexander Selkirk and his similarities to John, i.e. being dead, dead moodeh.
46:25 Speaker 03 She spelt it M-O-O-D-E-H.
46:29 Speaker 00 Yeah, because he was, um, he was dead, dead moodeh on the boat. And he went, I'd rather live on that deserted island. And they went, go on then. And then he had to.
46:38 Speaker 03 Yeah. This reminded me of another one of history's great sad boys, Charles Darwin. Yes, the compiled letters and diaries of the groundbreaking biologist truly read as one of the 19th century's premier blubographies. The noted naturalist often wielded dark remarks to rival the famous Robin's maxim, grief is living, such that where he, were he alive today, Ellis would frequently be forced to say, do keep it light, Charles. Recalling this, a made up game was quick to evolve. I present, run to Darwin and hate yourself. The rules are simple. Ellis and John will be presented with a quote. They must each guess whether the statement was made by Charles Darwin or John Robbins.
47:21 Speaker 01 Well, I have a slight advantage here.
47:24 Speaker 03 I don't know.
47:25 Speaker 00 I don't mind. So you're saying that thirst is a rip off of The Origin of the Species?
47:31 Speaker 00 That's so fair. Josie Long wrote an Edinburgh show where she read out from the diaries of Charles Darwin.
47:36 Speaker 01 Oh, did she?
47:36 Speaker 00 About 15 years ago. I remember seeing it in Australia. It was great.
47:40 Speaker 03 It's a point for each correct answer. There's up to 10 rounds here of having fun because we should just fly through this, I think.
47:45 Speaker 00 Listen, you know, John's at an advantage.
47:50 Speaker 03 Yeah.
47:51 Speaker 00 I have read the book twice.
47:52 Speaker 03 Yeah, it was not from the book. It's not quotes in the book. It's not quotes in the book, is it? No, no. It's just quotes that you've said over the years.
48:00 Speaker 01 Okay, I might have forgotten a fair few of them.
48:01 Speaker 03 Yeah, I think you might have done.
48:02 Speaker 00 Yeah, I mean, I don't remember anything I've said on this podcast.
48:04 Speaker 03 Yeah. So, uh, yes, I think that's it. Sending love to the whole team. God bless. Sophie in Hove.
48:14 Speaker 00 Thank you, Soph.
48:16 Speaker 03 Round one.
48:20 Speaker 03 Okay, round one. I am languid and bedevilled and hate writing and hate everybody.
48:29 Speaker 01 Okay, I'm in.
48:31 Speaker 03 John.
48:31 Speaker 01 Uh, Darwin.
48:32 Speaker 03 Ellis.
48:33 Speaker 00 Darwin.
48:34 Speaker 03 Darwin is correct.
48:34 Speaker 00 Okay.
48:35 Speaker 03 One all.
48:37 Speaker 03 Round two. Everything I've lost, I've lost myself. I'm responsible for the bleak horizon that surrounds me.
48:45 Speaker 03 Uh, Ellis.
48:46 Speaker 00 Robins.
48:47 Speaker 03 Robins, John.
48:48 Speaker 01 Darwin.
48:49 Speaker 03 It's John Robins. What? Say that again. It's John Robins.
48:54 Speaker 01 What's the line?
48:59 Speaker 03 Everything I've lost, I've lost myself. I'm responsible for the bleak horizon that surrounds me. Have we got him?
49:05 Speaker 00 On a podcast, but in the comedy section.
49:07 Speaker 03 Let's, let's hear it.
49:09 Speaker 01 Everything I've lost, I've lost myself.
49:12 Speaker 00 Oh, yeah, yeah, okay.
49:18 Speaker 01 I'm responsible for the...
49:21 Speaker 00 Is that poetry, or do you think that?
49:23 Speaker 01 For the bleak horizon that surrounds me.
49:25 Speaker 00 You are quoting poetry, are you?
49:26 Speaker 01 No.
49:27 Speaker 00 No, just straight out of his soul.
49:29 Speaker 01 That's my interior monologue whenever I'm talking to you.
49:32 Speaker 03 November 16th, 2017, you said that.
49:35 Speaker 00 Good grief. That's hilarious. You really are a broadcaster like no other.
49:40 Speaker 03 Uh, in a, in a fantastic way, of course.
49:42 Speaker 00 Can you imagine Greg James saying that on the Radio 1 Breakfast Show?
49:46 Speaker 03 Uh, it's 1-0 to Ellis. Is it? No, no, 2-1, because they both got the first one right, 2-1.
49:52 Speaker 00 That's so funny.
49:53 Speaker 03 Round three. I hate doing things I'm not good at. It makes me feel humiliated, sad and angry.
50:00 Speaker 03 John.
50:00 Speaker 01 Darwin.
50:02 Speaker 03 Ellis.
50:02 Speaker 00 Robins.
50:03 Speaker 03 John Robins.
50:04 Speaker 01 Good grief.
50:09 Speaker 03 Is this game okay?
50:10 Speaker 01 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
50:11 Speaker 03 Yeah, okay.
50:12 Speaker 01 I'm really good, I've bounced back.
50:13 Speaker 03 Yeah, you have bounced back.
50:14 Speaker 00 You have.
50:15 Speaker 01 I have.
50:16 Speaker 00 You really have.
50:17 Speaker 03 You bloody have.
50:18 Speaker 00 I would love, I would love you to meet 2015 John.
50:22 Speaker 03 Yeah, or 2021.
50:24 Speaker 00 Yeah, I'd put my arm around the new one, current John, and I'd say, "You're gonna be here one day."
50:29 Speaker 01 Either he'd get me wrecked, or I'd change his life.
50:34 Speaker 00 You'd change his life.
50:35 Speaker 01 I think he might get me wrecked.
50:39 Speaker 03 Three one to Alice. And let's have a little listen.
50:43 Speaker 01 I'd just like to point out before we begin all this, I've never ever sat at a drum kit before. I hate doing things I'm not good at. It makes me feel humiliated and sad and angry.
50:53 Speaker 03 That was the Drum-a-thon, wasn't it?
50:54 Speaker 00 Oh, in Manchester, in Salford, yeah.
50:57 Speaker 03 Round four. One Lives Only to Make Blunders. Hmm. That might be me making fun of Alice.
51:08 Speaker 03 One Lives Only to Make Blunders. I forgot what I... Alice?
51:13 Speaker 00 I think that's John. I think he's making fun of my career as the presenter of Channel Five Star's Greatest Ever Movie Blunders and Greatest Ever Christmas Movie Blunders.
51:23 Speaker 03 John?
51:23 Speaker 01 I'm going Darwin.
51:24 Speaker 03 It's Darwin. Good pick.
51:27 Speaker 00 That's amazing.
51:27 Speaker 03 Good pick there, because it's confusing.
51:29 Speaker 01 That's very good. Were these picked by our listener?
51:31 Speaker 03 Were these picked by... Yes, these were picked by Sophie.
51:34 Speaker 01 Amazing. This is very good stuff. I mean, you've found two things I don't remember saying, and I'm me.
51:38 Speaker 03 Yeah, this is... You know, this podcast's been going for 12 blundering years.
51:43 Speaker 00 That's annoying. I really, really thought that was John. I thought that was John on a big diatribe about my career. But never mind.
51:52 Speaker 03 Three two to Alice as we head to round five. I feel fat and bloated with self-reproach.
51:58 Speaker 03 I feel fat and bloated with self-reproach. Was it John Robbins or Charles Darwin? John?
52:03 Speaker 01 I've gone for me. I've gone Robbins.
52:05 Speaker 03 Robbins. Alice?
52:07 Speaker 00 This is real 50/50 for me.
52:09 Speaker 03 Yeah.
52:10 Speaker 00 I think it might be John, but I've gone Darwin.
52:13 Speaker 03 Interesting.
52:14 Speaker 00 I went... We both went through a phase of saying self-reproach quite a lot, doing the shame well, but I think it just feels like a Darwin.
52:23 Speaker 03 It's three all. It was John Robbins. Let's have a listen.
52:26 Speaker 01 Yeah, I feel fat.
52:29 Speaker 01 I honestly feel fat and bloated. Bloated with self-reproach, Dave. There we go.
52:36 Speaker 03 January the 14th.
52:37 Speaker 01 If you'd have kept Dave bit in, I'd have been clearer.
52:40 Speaker 03 Well, he might have known a Dave. That might have been his housemate.
52:43 Speaker 00 Charles Darwin's flatmate, Dave.
52:48 Speaker 00 You going on about evolution again?
52:50 Speaker 03 Hey, it's three all. Huge. Round six. I hate myself, I hate clover, and I hate bees.
53:02 Speaker 01 That wasn't me upsetting a sponsor of the Radio X show, was it?
53:07 Speaker 03 Don't know. I hate myself, I hate clover and I hate bees.
53:13 Speaker 03 Ellis.
53:15 Speaker 00 John.
53:16 Speaker 01 Oh, come on, that's gotta be Darwin.
53:18 Speaker 03 Darwin.
53:18 Speaker 00 Crossed out Darwin.
53:19 Speaker 03 It's Darwin.
53:20 Speaker 01 Why would I be hating clover?
53:22 Speaker 00 Because I thought you meant the, um, the spread.
53:26 Speaker 03 Again, why would I be hating clover?
53:28 Speaker 00 I don't know.
53:28 Speaker 03 Oh, it's the kind of thing you might hate.
53:30 Speaker 00 I thought we'd be, yeah, it's the kind of thing you might, I thought, like, look, I actually crossed out Darwin. I just thought it was a double bluff.
53:36 Speaker 03 Yeah, because you're a flora guy. We all know that.
53:39 Speaker 01 I'm neither.
53:39 Speaker 03 Yeah.
53:40 Speaker 00 Okay.
53:41 Speaker 03 Uh, it's four, three to, John, what a comeback. Here we go, round seven. I am very poorly today and very stupid and I hate everybody and everything.
53:54 Speaker 03 I'm very poorly today and very stupid and I hate everybody and everything. John?
53:58 Speaker 01 Darwin.
53:58 Speaker 03 Darwin.
53:59 Speaker 00 Darwin.
53:59 Speaker 03 Darwin. It's Darwin. That's safe. It's five.
54:03 Speaker 01 Have we got recordings of Darwin as well?
54:05 Speaker 03 We did. We thought we might have put animal noises in or something, but we just thought, no, we'll just leave it.
54:09 Speaker 01 He'd have had a, he'd have done well in podcasts, Dave.
54:11 Speaker 03 He would have done well, clearly.
54:13 Speaker 01 Yeah.
54:13 Speaker 03 Yeah. Uh, round eight, three to go. It is foo, five, four to John, I think. Um, every time I look in the mirror, I hate myself.
54:27 Speaker 03 Is it Darwin? Is it Robins? Ellis?
54:30 Speaker 00 Robins.
54:31 Speaker 03 Robins. John?
54:32 Speaker 01 I've got Robins.
54:32 Speaker 03 It's John Robins. Let's have a little list, shall we?
54:36 Speaker 01 I mean, my hair is awful at the minute and every time I look in the mirror, I hate myself.
54:39 Speaker 00 Okay.
54:40 Speaker 03 Hey.
54:41 Speaker 00 Okay.
54:42 Speaker 01 That's so funny.
54:44 Speaker 03 Uh, that was from, uh, July 2nd, 2024.
54:47 Speaker 01 Oh, that's, oh dear, that's a, that's a sober hate myself.
54:51 Speaker 03 Is that too close?
54:54 Speaker 03 Okay, round nine. It's 6-5. I am a withered leaf. I am a withered leaf.
55:05 Speaker 03 Ellis.
55:06 Speaker 00 Darwin.
55:06 Speaker 03 Darwin. John.
55:07 Speaker 01 I've gone Darwin.
55:08 Speaker 03 Darwin. It's Darwin. Withered leaf is Darwin's. And the final round, now we need an Ellis, we need an Ellis win here to take it to...
55:17 Speaker 00 To take a tie break.
55:18 Speaker 03 Yeah, to take it to tie break. I am but a worm compared to the power of nature.
55:25 Speaker 03 I am but a worm compared to the power of nature.
55:29 Speaker 03 Uh, John.
55:30 Speaker 01 Darwin.
55:30 Speaker 03 Darwin.
55:31 Speaker 00 Darwin.
55:32 Speaker 03 Darwin. It was there for the taking, Ellis, because it's John Robbins, let someone listen.
55:36 Speaker 01 Yeah, absolutely. I am but a worm compared to, uh, the power of nature.
55:42 Speaker 00 You're an ant.
55:43 Speaker 01 I'm an ant, I'm an ant who's now suffering, um, a stress-related rosacea flare-up.
55:48 Speaker 03 Is that recently?
55:49 Speaker 00 No, that's 2023.
55:51 Speaker 01 That was my last rosacea flare-up.
55:52 Speaker 03 Was it? Three years ago. Uh, that was there, Ellis.
55:56 Speaker 00 It was, if they're taking...
55:57 Speaker 01 I thought that was a trick one, because that's a line from Highlander, which I often quote. The Kurgan says, uh, to a vicar, "I am but a worm to a priest", um, and then licks his arm. And, um, I thought, but I thought Darwin had said it about researching nature.
56:16 Speaker 03 Yeah, it, it sounds very Darwin-esque, absolutely.
56:19 Speaker 00 The number six, which, when I crossed out Darwin, because I thought you were double bluffing me and gone to John.
56:24 Speaker 03 Yeah.
56:25 Speaker 00 That's come back to haunt me.
56:26 Speaker 03 I hate myself, hate clover and I hate bees.
56:30 Speaker 00 Yeah. But it's, it's quite, in an odd way, reassuring that during his magnum opus, he was annoyed at himself and angry at how it was going.
56:40 Speaker 03 Oh, yeah.
56:41 Speaker 00 And didn't like the work he was producing, because I hate clover and bees. It's just, I mean... 160 years after the event, it's a really funny thing to say, but he would have been in turmoil at the time.
56:53 Speaker 01 There's some amazing extracts from, I can't remember the writer, it does the round on Instagram every so often. It's either Kafka, I think it might be Kafka actually. His diaries are just pure loathing and writer's block. And you think, this is coming from one of the greatest writers of all time.
57:11 Speaker 00 If Kafka's got writer's block, it's all right.
57:14 Speaker 03 Yeah, very true. Good game. Thank you, Sophie.
57:17 Speaker 01 Great game. Thank you, Sophie. Enjoyed that.
57:19 Speaker 03 Good game. So, John wins again. Absolutely. It's now, oh dear, 30 love in the third game.
57:27 Speaker 00 Even though, even though John should have been at a big advantage, I didn't feel that was unfair.
57:32 Speaker 03 This is it. I was a bit worried after that, as we started to get in, I thought, will this just be too easy? But actually, it's a tricky old game.
57:40 Speaker 00 I mean, he would be crazy if he remembered every single thing he'd ever said.
57:43 Speaker 03 That's the made up game. Good game. Do send your made up games to [email protected] .
57:54 Speaker 01 Right then, folks, before we leave you today, there's time for a little trip down the shame well. What was I thinking? Why did I say he had nice ankles? She was stood behind me the whole time. I didn't know he's only got one hand. I was signed in on her Gmail. John's Shame Well. Right then, straight into it. Hi, Ellis and John. I'd like to submit a story for the shame well. This happened around 15 years ago when I was a new teacher, starting out and trying very hard to give off the impression of being a calm, capable adult. I was on a school trip with a group of year eight pupils, so 11 to 12 years old, and the activities
58:37 Speaker 01 included water sports, pier jumping, jet ski trips and banana boats. I mean, I didn't go on any school trips like that.
58:45 Speaker 00 What an amazing trip.
58:46 Speaker 01 This was very much not my ideal environment. I have a fairly specific fear of being underwater. Up to the neck is fine, but if my face goes under, immediate panic. However, I was the adult on the trip. I didn't want to model fear, and I definitely didn't want to give the pupils an excuse to opt out, so I fully committed. The shame comes from a trip on the banana boat. There were six of us on it, me and five pupils. We were being pulled along at full speed when the driver took a sharp turn and inevitably we were all thrown off. I went under. Now, I'm sure I was only underwater for a few seconds, but in my head it felt like a minute of pure panic. I couldn't tell which way was up.
59:28 Speaker 01 I was flailing, desperate to find purchase on anything that would help me get back to the surface. Then I found something. Two hands on, pushed down hard, and boom, I breached, gasping for air like I'd just escaped the Titanic. Five seconds later, up bobs Jake Dobbin. A delightful pupil, although now a slightly unusual shade of blue, he took an even bigger gasp of air than I did and immediately shouted, "My life jacket isn't working." At this point, I had to bluff him. I said, "Your grand, Jake, it was only a second, and the life jacket has started working now." But deep down, I knew the truth. His life jacket had been working perfectly the whole time.
1:00:13 Speaker 01 The issue was that his teacher had just used him as a flotation device.
1:00:17 Speaker 00 Hallelujah.
1:00:19 Speaker 01 I carry shame that in a moment of pure survival instinct, I nearly sacrificed a year-eight pupil to save myself. But worse than that, I fear I may have passed my fear of going underwater to a whole new generation. Yours sincerely, anonymous.
1:00:35 Speaker 00 Wow, that's...
1:00:38 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:00:39 Speaker 00 But that's the fascinating thing about instincts, especially if you have a phobia or a fear of something. When it comes to the crunch, the instinct just, the survival instinct kicks in regardless of your responsibilities as an adult. It's quite weird.
1:00:56 Speaker 01 It's also amazing how often the advice in water issue is just stay still.
1:01:03 Speaker 00 Yeah.
1:01:04 Speaker 01 Like, cause if you're, if you're drowning and you take a breath in and just lie on your back, you float. If you're in a rip, they tell you just to stay still and let the water sort of roll you out. But I guess our panicky nature is just to sort of grab for stuff.
1:01:20 Speaker 00 Also, if it's, you know, if it's very choppy, then lying still is going to be difficult and unpleasant.
1:01:27 Speaker 01 Yeah, but if you can't swim, you can float.
1:01:30 Speaker 00 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1:01:31 Speaker 01 And you can make your trousers into a flotation device as well.
1:01:35 Speaker 00 Can you?
1:01:36 Speaker 01 Yeah. Tie the, if you tie the, sort of, what's the bit where your feet come out called? The ankles. If you tie the ankles, right, in wet trousers and fill it with air, it will float.
1:01:46 Speaker 00 Oh, nice. Goodness me.
1:01:48 Speaker 01 Okay.
1:01:50 Speaker 00 Wow, what a good shame. Well, anyway, if you've got another one, uh, please send them into [email protected] .
1:01:58 Speaker 01 Yes.
1:01:58 Speaker 00 And we will absolve you of your shame.
1:02:00 Speaker 03 I don't think we've really absolved there.
1:02:01 Speaker 01 Oh, I think that's fine.
1:02:02 Speaker 03 Yeah, I do, I do.
1:02:03 Speaker 01 You've gotta save yourself.
1:02:04 Speaker 03 Yeah, absolutely.
1:02:05 Speaker 00 Well, it's like, it's like, it's like on a plane when they say you've got to put your own life mask on first before you sort of sort out your kids.
1:02:12 Speaker 01 Yeah.
1:02:12 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:02:13 Speaker 01 But they don't say to steal your kid's face mask.
1:02:16 Speaker 03 No. No, it is fine, because you just, you do what you gotta do, don't you?
1:02:19 Speaker 01 Yeah, and you survived and the pupil survived.
1:02:22 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:02:23 Speaker 01 So you were there to lead them all to safety, I assume, or get back on the inflatable banana.
1:02:28 Speaker 00 If I was a teacher, I would hate to do anything that involved heights. Yeah.
1:02:32 Speaker 03 I wonder how long ago that was, because I don't know whether.
1:02:34 Speaker 01 Fifteen years.
1:02:34 Speaker 03 Right. I don't think year eights are getting taken jet skiing and banana boating anymore. I think that's always too dangerous.
1:02:40 Speaker 00 Maybe it's, maybe it's different country, but year eights in this country in the UK are twelve and thirteen, aren't they?
1:02:46 Speaker 03 Yeah.
1:02:47 Speaker 00 Rather than eleven and twelve.
1:02:48 Speaker 03 Yes.
1:02:49 Speaker 00 Not that that makes a big difference, but, um, yeah, if I was, if I was in charge of a group of thirty kids and I for some reason had to be up a cliff, then I, I think I would find it very difficult to be rational.
1:03:02 Speaker 01 You can't say you go on ahead to groups of eleven year olds when you're near a cliff.
1:03:06 Speaker 00 As I go and smoke a pipe in my car.
1:03:09 Speaker 01 Yeah. Well, thank you very much for listening, folks. Uh, we will be back with you on Friday.
1:03:14 Speaker 00 Goodbye.
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1:04:26 Speaker 05 1965, London. The world's largest uncut diamond has been stolen from the Natural History Museum.
1:04:35 Speaker 05 Shortly after, a young London window cleaner is arrested. They said you're nicked, you're in a lot of trouble. But was he set up? Wanted add, led to fall of two cops. His family say he is guilty, but of a totally different crime.
1:04:50 Speaker 07 You're not going to end up going to prison, do you, kidlet?
1:04:52 Speaker 05 I'm Jacy Long and this is Rough Diamond. Listen now wherever you get your podcasts.
1:05:01 Speaker 01 Thanks for listening to the show and you can follow us on Instagram and TikTok at Ellis and John for more content.
1:05:07 Speaker 00 And you can watch highlights of every episode over on our YouTube page at Ellis and John.
1:05:11 Speaker 01 Plus, you can find all things EJJR, including links to our Patreon, our merch, and much more by heading to ellisonjohn.com. See you next time.
Previous #558 - Drip Feeding Dross, Dave Kanchelskis and Oiling The Engine of Love Next #560 - The Messi of Englyns, Warranty Wallies and Garth Olwg or Bust Page updated October 29, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated