Bonus: Good Vs. Evil, Brian vs. Keith, Blind Melon, and Buddy Holly

Halloween is over. Evil fading toward good, and grace. Thanksgiving is upon us. Keith Richards’ quiet charity vs. Brian Jones, the irredeemable Stone. Plus, we hear from you on Reggie Watts, Madonna, Blind Melon, and more. See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:13Speaker 00

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• 0:45Speaker 01

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• 1:15Jake Brennan?

  Hey, Discos. Need a little more DisgraceLand in your life? Just a touch to get you through? Yeah, me too. This is the podcast that comes after the podcast. Welcome to DisgraceLand: The Afterparty.

• 1:41Jake Brennan?

  Welcome to the DisgraceLand bonus episode. A little thing we like to call the afterparty. This is the show after the show, the party after the party, the bridge to get you from one full episode of DisgraceLand to the other, the backyard to dig into the dirt. Our mission to uncover the truth, to confront the myth, to reclaim the story. On this bonus episode, we talk about Shannon Hoon from Blind Melon. We're previewing Buddy Holly and, as always, wrestling with good versus evil throughout music history. This is the podcast for the musically obsessed, the outsiders, the independent thinkers who know that the best history is the history that gets buried. DisgraceLand is where I tell the stories you'll end up telling someone else. All right, Discos, let's get into it.

• 2:33Jake Brennan?

  It's November 4th, 2026 in DisgraceLand, and we're joined this week by Blind Melon, Reggie Watts, Madonna, Britney Spears, and Brian Jones. I'm writing my notes down for this afterparty that I'm about to record here in my living room in southeast Florida. Bill Evans is blasting from my speakers. The coffee is hot. The air outside is cooler than usual. Autumn leaves, as the man says. I spent the night this past weekend back home in Massachusetts, then raced to Miami to meet up with a friend to go to the game and to then eat and drink our way through what they're now calling Vice City. It's been a whirlwind, and throughout this travel, I've had my head buried in more Rolling Stones research,

• 3:17Jake Brennan?

  particularly into the death of Brian Jones, which I know. How many rock and roll deaths do we have to look into before we come to the conclusion that none of them are what they seem, yet somehow they're all what they seem? Anyways, I had a thought when I was researching, a thought about why I'm so comfortable with my head buried in the past and why I think you guys are as well. I mentioned here in the afterparty a couple of weeks ago a quote from Martin Scorsese, something about how artists create in an effort to make sense of the world. Now, I believe that, but it's a little different for me. I create content almost exclusively about the past, Reggie Watts and the upcoming episode on Jared Leto notwithstanding.

• 4:03Jake Brennan?

  So why don't I do this with the now? It's not a choice. I'm not done with the past any more than the past is done with me or than the past is done with us. The past helps us make sense of the now. And the now is part fucked and part beautiful. The past was no different. And I guess I find it comforting to have the context of what happened before help me see through the gloom of right now. It was October the last time I talked to you guys. We're exiting the month of All Hallows' Eve. Thematically, we're leaving the evil cultural touchstones Halloween entertains and surrounds us with, the horror movies, the creepy soundtracks,

• 4:47Jake Brennan?

  the scary costumes, the meditations on Satan in the occult and their influence on rock and roll and the musicians that we love. And we're heading into a cultural period here of grace. Thanksgiving, the band's last waltz, Neil Young's Harvest and Harvest Moon, feel-good movies, Planes, Trains and Automobiles, Home for the Holidays, and thematically, an overall feeling of good, not evil. Good versus evil, the tension between the two surrounds what we do here in DisgraceLand year-round. It's not just Halloween. Is Reggie Watts good or evil? Shannon Hoon, Madonna, Britney Spears, Brian Jones, the same thing can be asked and debated about all the artists in DisgraceLand

• 5:31Jake Brennan?

  this month or in any month. But each year, in the fall, this theme is more prevalent than ever. I read The Exorcist this month, or this past month, I should say, and there's no other book I can think of that better captures the power of this theme. In the end, we know which side triumphs. I'm now reading Silence by Shuaku Endo, the work of Japanese historical fiction, tracing the efforts of 17th century missionaries in Japan. Thematically, it has good versus evil on every page, but I know where this is going, and you can probably guess as well. Next in line on my nightstand is Mikhail Boglukov's The Master and Margarita,

• 6:15Jake Brennan?

  a book of Russian fiction about Satan. This book is the same book that inspired Mick Jagger to write Sympathy for the Devil. I'm not sure which side will prevail by the time I get to the end of this novel, but the theme remains front and center for me, good versus evil. This tension is overwhelmingly on display in the Brian Jones research that I'm now doing that I mentioned before. Brian Jones from the Rolling Stones, the founder of the Rolling Stones, and the beginning of the band, their leader. Brian Jones, one of the coolest rock and roll icons to come out of the 1960s. Brian Jones was not a good person.

• 7:01Jake Brennan?

  And aside from learning how he really died, I'm wondering what this story from the past is teaching me about the world today or perhaps even about myself. I don't know yet. Keith Richards told Q Magazine in 1988, "I don't think you would find anyone who liked Brian. Brian was not a likable guy. You know, he enjoyed beating chicks up. Not a likable guy." Brian Jones, not a likable guy, end quote. Brian Jones was violent, volatile, very much wasted all the time. And most of all, like all men who beat women, Brian Jones was weak.

• 7:43Jake Brennan?

  Now, the overwhelming amount of shitty behavior on display in Brian's story is so prevalent that it forced me to go looking for the opposite of what I was being served in this research. I wanted to know, did Brian Jones ever do anything good? And the answer is, well, not really. No, he didn't. Now, to be fair, he died young, at the age of 27. But typically, what happens when I get into researching these stories is there's usually some selfless examples of kindness and generosity that offset an artist's transgressions. But when it comes to Brian Jones, there's little, if any, evidence.

• 8:27Jake Brennan?

  But again, like I said, he died young. He died at 27 years old. Perhaps, had he lived, he would have pulled his head out of his ass. But anyways, this all got me thinking about the rest of the Rolling Stones, who are worth tens of millions of dollars, hundreds of millions in the case of Mick and Keith. And it got me looking for examples of goodness to offset the sympathy for the devil. And there is plenty, okay? There's the big splashy charitable giving, the kind that gets plastered on websites and shouted about on social media and written about in the Sunday Times. There's also a fair amount of quiet giving from Keith Richards on top of the major donations that he and the band have made.

• 9:09Jake Brennan?

  Keith regularly writes checks to local radio stations, libraries, local historical landmarks who are in need of financial help. You can find anecdotes online of checks showing up randomly at these organizations unsolicited and often with instructions to keep Keith Richards's name out of the press. I just love this image I have of Keith Richards being driven back from the liquor store near his homes in Connecticut or West Sussex or wherever and passing, you know, a local library with a sign out front about an upcoming fundraiser or hearing a local public radio station during their fund drive or whatever, and just writing a check.

• 9:52Jake Brennan?

  I suspect this type of giving goes on more often than not, not just with the Rolling Stones, not just with Keith Richards. I suspect that this type of good is just as prevalent as the evil that grips our imaginations and has the capacity to wrap us in its doom and gloom. Now, as the holidays draw nearer, I'll be doing my best to remember and focus on the good. For every Brian, there is a Keith. Speaking of evil, though, and speaking of Halloween,

• 10:22Jake Brennan?

  I'm not done with, I'm not done with October, okay? You can probably hear it in my voice. I'm very mellow this morning.

• 10:31Jake Brennan?

  I don't know if the coffee is not working, or if it's working in a different way, perhaps. But you know what I think it is, guys? I got up this morning and I did something that Zeth always does. Zeth gets up in the morning and like most people, like most of you, I suspect, he takes a shower and he gets dressed and he goes to work. I have the luxury, well, Zeth has this luxury as well, but a lot of you do, of working from home. And I, I don't do this. I get up and I sort of, you know, putt around, putz around in my, in my, I don't want to say pajamas, but in my robe or whatever. And I sort of work for the first few hours of the day before I, before I shower in sort of, you know,

• 11:14Jake Brennan?

  comfort clothes or whatever. I did the opposite today. I got up and I got showered and I got dressed. I even tucked in my shirt before I sat down here at the mic to record for you guys. And I feel like it's made me, in a weird way, despite the added formality, it's made me more comfortable. And I feel like, I don't know if it's how I got the mic positioned the morning, this morning, or the, the new belt I'm wearing, or whatever it is, but I feel more relaxed here as I'm talking to you guys. I don't know if it's the, the autumn air, whatever it is. Yeah, I'm kind of into it. And the sort of, the autumn, autumn relaxation of it all is reminding me that I've got one last October item that

• 11:58Jake Brennan?

  I want to talk about before we put the spooky season to rest. Dr. Lundey and Matt here at Double Elvis are both from Bangor, Maine. One of my good friends here, down the street from us, our, our family friend, Colleen, she's also from Bangor. And so I'm talking about Bangor a lot. I'm talking about Stephen King a lot as well, a guy I grew up loving, a guy who made his living in October. And I want to get with Zeth later in this episode and talk about Stephen King, the weird and wild ways that he's impacted their hometown, share some of the stories these guys have told me throughout the past. Talk a little bit about Stephen King's music tastes, which are very in line with our music tastes, ACDC,

• 12:42Jake Brennan?

  The Ramones, old school doo-wop, all kinds of great stuff. And, but mainly I want to get to what it's like growing up in the shadow of Salem's Lot with a very famous neighbor, a very influential author, very commercially successful author, a very creatively inspiring author, someone as massive as Stephen King. And I want to look into all the strange and bizarre and revealing Stephen Kingisms that those of us who don't come from Bangor might not know about. Now, I've wanted to do this over the past month. At some point, I just didn't get around to it. It's still the first, it's only the first week in November. I think you can indulge me this last bit of Halloween content. That's coming up in the exclusive

• 13:26Jake Brennan?

  section of this after-party. Go to disgracysandpod.com to sign up to become an All-Access member and unlock exclusive and ad-free content just like this. All right, discos this week, Shannon Hoon and Blind Melon in the feed. Upcoming Rewind episodes this week are on Britney Spears, Britney Bitch, Part One and Part Two. Next week, did Buddy Holly shoot down his own plane? You're going to want to hear our Buddy Holly episode. And after you do, you're going to want to call us and let us know the answer to that question. Did Buddy Holly shoot down his own plane? The evidence, as you will hear, is pretty compelling, to say the least. 617-906-6638. Voicemail and text. Hit me with your answers

• 14:07Jake Brennan?

  or hit me up to talk about whatever you want to discuss. Buddy Holly, Brian Jones, Madonna, how your Halloween went, what you're cooking up for Thanksgiving, what do you listen to when you cook? That's something that I'm constantly thinking about. It's a question of mine that I have. What do you listen to when you cook? We've talked about this in the past, and I loved your answers and I'm here for them. I got that rolling around in my head all the time. I'm about to roast a chicken today, too. So, you know, 617-906-6638. Hit me with your, your cooking music recommendations or whatever you want to talk about. And you might hear yourself on next week's after-party episode, just like these other discos that you're going to hear about right after this break. Don't go anywhere.

• 14:49Speaker 00

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• 15:17Jake Brennan?

  I like a story with a twist as much as anyone, but some of the best traditions don't have one. They just started and kept going. That's something that's great about Chateau St. Michelle. They've been leading Washington wine since 1967 with wines that are balanced, expressive, and easy to enjoy. Choosing the right bottle shouldn't feel complicated. It should be something you open with confidence every time. So for once, here's a story with no twist, just a good bottle. Redefine your rituals with Chateau St. Michelle.

• 15:55Jake Brennan?

  All right, guys, we are back. 617-906-6638. Voicemail and text. You want to hit us to talk about anything under the sun. We've got this good versus evil conversation that we've been diving into for the last few weeks. And this theme is brought to us here in voicemail form from the 903.

• 16:13Speaker 03

  Hey Jake and Dr. Zeth. Lundey, I am just calling in reaction to the whole idea of evil being in music and the movies and Satan worshiping and all that. I go back to what my mother told me when that, like, I grew up in the 90s in Texas, and I would still say the satanic panic, which had died out around the country, hadn't really died out in Texas yet. And she basically said, what does it mean to you? Do you see this as Satan worshiping? Do you see this as praising Satan and all that stuff? And we're like, no, we just like the music. And she's like, there you go. That's what you should, you know, believe and exercise and take joy in. Especially these days with people trying

• 16:55Speaker 03

  to superimpose and project their own meanings on everything. It's like, what does it mean to the person? If it means that to you, yeah. If it doesn't mean that to you, okay. It just is what you put into it. That's just my view of it, of the show, all my fellow discos, and keep on doing what you guys do. All right?

• 17:15Jake Brennan?

  903, thank you so much for the call. You're absolutely right. What does it mean to you? And, you know, a lot of people, I try to stop people from seeing The Exorcist. My, what that story means to me, as we've discussed many times already, is something completely different than what the critics were saying about that film in that book. And you're right, people are always, I cannot stand this. People are always trying to project their own, their own views onto different pieces of art to reinforce whatever their worldview might be. And absolutely, I am guilty of that, as I think we all are. But

• 17:56Jake Brennan?

  I just don't like it when it cuts against the way I think. And nobody's going to tell me that what I think about The Exorcist is not what the intent of the author was. I just believe it in my bones. 903, your mom sounds like she was a smart lady, or is a smart lady. Thanks for the call. 617-906-6638. You guys want to talk about anything under the sun, hit us up.

• 18:20Speaker 04

  Hey Jake, this is Lee out of Memphis. I just kind of want to get your thought on something. I've noticed something over the past several years, probably even further back, but there's a lot of tribute bands out there now, and they're really, really good. I recently saw Van Halen tribute band called Jump. I know, I saw something the other day on, we call it Red Knut Chili Peppers. I've got a buddy that went to a Smiths tribute band. They went, I mean, I'm sorry, Kier, went to a Depeche Mode tribute band. I've seen a Prince tribute band and a GNR band. You know, nothing really going on here. Just

• 19:01Speaker 04

  I just kind of wanted to get your, get your take on it as a lover of music. So anyway, have a good day.

• 19:08Jake Brennan?

  Well, Lee in Memphis, thank you so much for the call. You asked, so I'll tell you. I don't think people are going to like this, but I am not a tribute band fan in, in the least. No shade for those who make their living or for playing in tribute bands, or for those who enjoy going to see a tribute band. And I get it, you hear those songs, they're nostalgic, and it's fun to hear a band play them. But as a guy who grew up in music and in around musicians, it's just hard for me to, to get into. I think also when it comes to covering a song, this is a debate I've had with my friend Dutch ever

• 19:50Jake Brennan?

  since we were in high school. I, I am more into an interpretation of a song. Like I played, we were driving the other day, we're going through the Sumner Tunnel, and Talking Heads' version of Satisfaction came on, and my 12-year-old's head was completely blown. At first, at first, he hated it. Like, his reaction was, this is so fucking weird. And he's not even really a Rolling Stones fan.

• 20:17Jake Brennan?

  By the end of the song, he was loving it. And I like interpretations of songs. I don't like museum replicas of songs. And I feel like that's kind of the vibe in the best version of tribute bands. Not my thing, but I get it. And I love that there's a Depeche Mode tribute band out there. That sounds awesome.

• 20:39Jake Brennan?

  But I won't be going to see them. 617-906-6638 voicemail and text, guys, you want to get at me about anything. I want to hear your thoughts next week on Buddy Holly. I want to hear whether or not you think he shot down his own plane, or if anybody shot down his own plane. 416 writes in, this is from Jason in the 416 writes in, hey, one of my favorite Stephen King stories. When I was a kid, I loved Stephen King and I had just read Christine, which terrified me. My dad, who was an English teacher, gave me the hardcover copy of Pet Sematary for Christmas that year. And on the inside cover, he inscribed, Merry Christmas, Jason. That's it for you, shitter. And I still have and cherish that book. I love that, man. Stephen King was a big part of my relationship with my dad growing up as well.

• 21:24Jake Brennan?

  He was, he was funneling those books to me as well, Jason, so I completely get it. And as I mentioned before, you want to hear a little bit more about Stephen King and Banger Maine? Hit us, get with us in the exclusive section of this episode coming up. Go to disgracelandpod.com to sign up. 808 writes in, hey, Jake and Zeth, although we missed the appearance date of Devil's Night, October 30th, I would like to suggest the crow for this film should be played loud. It's the most 90s as fuck 90s movie soundtrack you could have. You're absolutely right. And yeah, man, I don't know. Did we, did we blow it by not, by not doing the crow in October for this film should be played loud?

• 22:07Jake Brennan?

  We did Shaun of the Dead and I'm pretty happy with how that came out. You guys seemed to like it as well. Yeah, we gotta do the crow. That soundtrack is just incredible. It's incredible.

• 22:19Jake Brennan?

  This one from the 360 on our episode on Reggie Watts. Hey, disgraceland, Sonny here from the 406. I'm calling to comment on your story about Reggie Watts. Having grown up in Great Falls, Montana, and being in the same circles with Reggie. For those of you guys who don't know, Reggie Watts grew up in Great Falls, Montana. Now, back to the 406's text, he says, being in the same circles with Reggie. In fact, he gave me my first Mohawk. I'm not surprised about the heavy drug use that was reported. Heavy drug use was a big part of our circle. My brother, who was even closer to Reggie, passed away from a drug overdose a few years ago. But I'm surprised about the reported treatment by Reggie towards his girlfriend.

• 23:03Jake Brennan?

  The reported treatment by Reggie towards his girlfriend. He was always the nicest guy to everyone around him, but I guess I'm not the only one surprised. Anyways, thank you for all your work you do. Absolutely love disgraceland rock a roller. 360, thank you for the text. I got a lot of comments, I'm sorry, not comments, direct messages, emails, excuse me, from folks who know Reggie Watts. When this story broke and when I sort of started to talk about I was, that I was going to do this episode. And yeah, it's a mix of kind of what you, what you said, like the signs were there, but surprised.

• 23:41Jake Brennan?

  Or I even heard from some folks, Sonny, who kind of didn't know the extent of the behavior that is alleged about Reggie Watts and his behavior towards Catherine McCullough. But they, they, they, they had evidence of, of things in their eyes that would more easily let them believe what has been alleged. And it should be said Reggie Watts denies everything. Okay. Got to say that. Chris from the 781 writes in, hey, while listening to today's episode of Reggie Watts, which was jaw dropping, I happened to look up at the TV in the gym and there was an iHeart radio ad and I saw your face. Can you confirm your identity? Congratulations.

• 24:22Jake Brennan?

  I can confirm my, my identity. I mean, I don't know how, I mean, go to, go to Instagram, at disgracelandpod, you'll see me all over that thing. Get this text from the 415 says, hey, Reggie, no, not responsible for another adult's decisions. She was 36, not six. He may be a complete asshole, but she made her own choices. All right. It's from the 415.

• 24:48Jake Brennan?

  314 writes in, hello Jake, I've been listening to the disgraceland pod for a while now and I absolutely love it and just want to say, keep up the great work and keep pumping out these amazing stories. You got it, 314. We are in a heavy production mode right now. Heavy production. We got a lot going on, a lot. Like I said, I'm researching Brian Jones. I just finished, what did I, what did I record yesterday? Oh, the Buddy Holly story. No, I didn't do that yesterday. What did I do yesterday? Why am I blanking on this?

• 25:23Jake Brennan?

  Hold on. Yesterday, I sat down in this chair and I recorded an episode that Zeth wrote on Al Green. Oh my God. Oh my God. You're not going to want to miss that. 949 texts in with a picture of Alice Bag. Oh, Alice Bag, picture of Alice Bag. That it looks like the 949 took at the Skirball Gallery. Texts in, hey, Rocket from the Crypt and Drive Like Jehu. One question, one answer. Question, do you have a Rocket tattoo? I do. Answer, both Jehu records are stunning, two-way tie. I don't have a Rocket from the Crypt tattoo. I have a New York Dolls tattoo though, and a Grateful Dead tattoo.

• 26:06Jake Brennan?

  I think Rocket from the Crypt lives somewhere in between those two. I've seen Rocket from the Crypt before, one of the best shows I've ever seen in my life. I saw them upstairs at the Middle East in Cambridge, right around the time. It was before Hot Charity. It was the one with On a Rope on it. It was a great time to see that band. And yeah, both Jehu records are stunning, two-way tie. Mmm, feels like an easy way out. 949. 949 also says, hey, I'm listening to the after-party. If you do an episode on Tiny Tim, be sure to check out the interviews he did with Howard Stern. Amazing. Peace out. Tiny Tim is interesting. Tiny Tim, whoever suggested that last week, thank you. Appreciate it. 617-906-6638 voicemail and text, this is the surefire way to get in touch with me

• 26:51Jake Brennan?

  and to also get your recommendations in on which episodes we should be covering. At disgracelandpod on the socials. Chris dot Clary writes in, Blind Melon forever. Stephen La Duke on Instagram writes in, every time I hear this song, it's a Madonna song. I think of Snatch. I just see Vinnie Jones and Bullet Tooth Tony dragging Ewan by his tie in a car. Dags, you like Dags? That's all I get to say to you, Stephen La Duke. No, appreciate you, man. Thank you. A lot of Shannon Hoon and Blind Melon fans coming out of the woodwork and they're angry on Instagram. They're angry, their butt is hurt because I said I didn't like Blind Melon and I wasn't a fan.

• 27:35Jake Brennan?

  But you guys don't care. You can handle it. The social media peeps. Those who do not listen to the podcast, but follow me on Instagram have very, very thin skin. And you know what? If you're not listening to the podcast and you're just following me on Instagram, well, I do not care about you. I guess I do a little, but not really. This idea that people can't handle an opinion blows my mind though. It just blows my mind. There's this thing called criticism and I don't know. It's been a part of my life, my whole life. Then again, I'm older than a lot of people. And I don't, I don't know where this comes from, where people just, they just, it goes right up their butt when somebody doesn't like the exact same thing they like in the exact same way. But I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

• 28:20Jake Brennan?

  617-906-6638 voicemail and text. If you want a deeper and better conversation than what you get on the socials, you can get it here with me and Dr. Lundy. Also at disgracelandpod, direct message on Instagram, leave a comment if you want as well. Join that discourse, but be forewarned, people really like Blind Melon. And you know what? I could just, I just got to clarify, I don't like, it's not that I hate Blind Melon. You know, it's not like a, like an active dislike. It's just like, meh, just not a fan. You know what I'm saying? I do like the story though. I like the story of that guy, which is a different thing entirely. [email protected] as well. We'll be back with your emails right after this.

• 29:10Speaker 05

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• 29:41Jake Brennan?

  I like a story with a twist as much as anyone, but some of the best traditions don't have one. They just started and kept going. That's something that's great about Chateau St. Michelle. They've been leading Washington wine since 1967 with wines that are balanced, expressive, and easy to enjoy. Choosing the right bottle shouldn't feel complicated. It should be something you open with confidence every time. So for once, here's a story with no twist, just a good bottle. Redefine your rituals with Chateau St. Michelle.

• 30:18Jake Brennan?

  Welcome back into the after-party. So, hey, guys, we're doing something a little different. We are opening it up in a more formal kind of way, the floor here for you guys who are Sound and Fury members on Patreon at the Sound and Fury level to join me and Zeth, and perhaps even Matt and Brett as well, if he wants. Join us all, get in here, and we can talk about what episodes we're going to produce for next year and make part of our programming schedule. This is a perk that we offer our Sound and Fury Patreon subscribers, patrons, All-Access members, and we're trying to figure out when to do

• 30:59Jake Brennan?

  this. And part of this is, it's very difficult, and part of that is my fault, because this year, this summer in particular, really flew by. There's a lot of travel, as there was for a lot of us. But we're talking on Patreon and trying to figure out if we can do this before the end of the year, or if this makes sense to do at the beginning of next year. So far, it's kind of a mixed bag. If you guys have any strong opinions, get into Patreon. The post is one of the, I made the post yesterday, so it should be pretty high up in the feed. And let your voice be known. 702 Sunshine sent in some recommendations right there, right there in the comments. Says, "Hey, doing a single week focused on John and Mackenzie

• 31:42Jake Brennan?

  Phillips." I'm going to stop you right there, 702 Sunshine. "I woke up this morning with 'Young Girls Are Going to the Canyon'" in my head, because I was driving the other day. I was driving through Miami, and I heard that song. And I just thought, given all we now know about Papa John Phillips, that song is insane, and I really want to do this episode. But 702 Sunshine says, "Doing a single week focused on John and Mackenzie Phillips would cover everything: music, Hollywood history, and true crime, all tied to one family. Get the classic mamas and papas era, the dark Laurel Canyon scene, and their intense personal drama, all wrapped into one story. It's the perfect pitch for

• 32:27Jake Brennan?

  a debauchery-themed lineup. If you haven't read Mackenzie's bio, you will go to dark places. I am going to go there, 702 Sunshine. I'm not, I'm just not sure when." 702 Sunshine, "If you have not heard our Mamas and the Papas two-part episode, I invite you to do that, but I do not get into the Mackenzie John Phillips piece." Lisa Wade Duncan writes in, "My two suggestions are Dolores O'Reardon and Sinead O'Connor." I have more. I'll send them over. This is great, guys. We're getting a little ahead of ourselves. I'm happy always to discuss recommendations here in the after-party and on Patreon and wherever. But again, I want to find a time when we can meet on Zoom. So if you got a hard take on that, is it the end of this year? Is it the beginning of next

• 33:10Jake Brennan?

  year? Get in the chat over on Patreon. Let us know. And I'm leaning toward the beginning of next year. I think Zeth is as well, but, and I think the comments here are, you guys are kind of open to that. DisgraceLandPod.com, if you want to become an All-Access member on Patreon, go ahead and sign up over there. Like to welcome some new listeners in Patreon, some new supporters. Boots in the doorway. 702 Sunshine, didn't realize you were new. Welcome. Michael Geis, Gees or Geis? Anyways, Michael, welcome. Appreciate you. Courtney Henderson, hope you guys are digging the vibe in Patreon. Get in the chat. Helltown Mark will hook you up with something. He's always given us something, Helltown Mark. Everybody is. The All-Access members are great. DisgraceLandPod.com to sign up to

• 33:52Jake Brennan?

  become an All-Access member on Patreon. This email comes from Verna Sutherland, subject: Reggie Watts. "First, I've been listening since the beginning, and that episode on John Denver still haunts me. Excellent writing and storytelling. About the Reggie Watts episode, I loved Reggie on Comedy Bang Bang. Always thought he was a big goofy teddy bear. Recently heard him on a podcast, and he was a boorish know-it-all. Really changed my mind about who I thought he was. Is he responsible for Catherine's death? Hell, no. They knew each other for a year. All of her quote-unquote 'concerned' friends and family should have done more to save her, intervened, etc. Should we blame James Corden for turning Reggie

• 34:37Jake Brennan?

  into an asshole? Nope. He's a grown-ass man, making his own terrible choices, just as Catherine did. Still a great tragedy. Thank you for your excellent pods. Glad you're with Exactly Right: Rock A Roll." Verna Sutherland, thank you so much for the email. Lot to unpack here. Reggie Watts is a very interesting character to me, because, yes, he's a celebrity, and James Corden certainly had a lot to do with bringing him to a wider audience, at least with name recognition. But he comes from Comedy Bang Bang and sort of the quote-unquote alt comedy scene, whatever that is. And like I said, he's just a guy who's around.

• 35:17Jake Brennan?

  And even if you're in the entertainment world at the, you know, the level I am, which is to say, you know, out on the margins, he's still kind of around, you know what I mean? Like, I mentioned the episode that I have a recollection of being at a party or an event or something, and he was there. I still don't know what it was, but I'm certain he was there. He's hard to miss. So that makes him very interesting to me. And we have some Exactly Right fans here at Double Elvis, and we have some Comedy Bang Bang fans here at Double Elvis as well. When it comes to assigning blame, that's a good question, and it wasn't fully the thesis of that episode. I was more trying to get at the counter,

• 35:59Jake Brennan?

  the contrast between the goofy teddy bear that you have mentioned here and sort of the wolf and sheep's clothing, the bad guy, the guy our moms warned us and/or if we're female, if we're male, excuse me, our sisters about. Anyhow, I think we answered that question without blaming him directly for Catherine's death. And when it comes to that event, again, Reggie Watts denies any responsibility. But when it comes to an event like that, a deeply personal event like that, it's really hard to say one way or another what happened definitively.

• 36:43Jake Brennan?

  We can have our feelings, we can have our ideas, our opinions, our thoughts, and hopefully, most important, we can learn from it. Anyways, those are my thoughts. Putting a bow on the Reggie Watts story. Verna, I appreciate your email. Thank you so much. [email protected] if you guys want to get at us about Reggie Watts or anything else. Wrapping up Halloween over in the Hollywood Land podcast with The Silence of the Lambs in our screening room this week, jumping off of our archive episode on Jodie Foster. Zeth is, he's got you in the wrap party, he's got you in the screening room. I got you in the archive episode. Make sure you're subscribed to Hollywood Land on Apple Podcasts,

• 37:27Jake Brennan?

  iHeartRadio app, or wherever you get your podcasts. As I mentioned before, Shaun of the Dead. Shaun of the Dead is our last episode, our most recent episode of This Film Should Be Played Loud. We are still trying to figure out what we're doing this month. We wanted to do Last Waltz, and somebody had on Patreon made a really great point of like, how do you do the categories? And at first, I was like, yeah, you can't do it. But now, I'm kind of like, well, maybe we can do it in a really creative and fun way. But I don't know. I don't know. There's also some talk of planes, trains, and automobiles. And forgive me if we've already decided this on Patreon, and I'm just confused, you know, like I said, forgive me. Anyhow, This Film Should Be Played Loud, we're going to have one that's Thanksgiving-themed, I know that. That'll be coming up at the end of this month. Go to DisgraceLandPod.com

• 38:11Jake Brennan?

  to sign up and become an All-Access member and unlock bonus content just like this, plus ad-free listening. And when I say bonus content, I'm not just talking about This Film Should Be Played Loud. I am also talking about the exclusive portion of this after-party where, in a few moments, if you are an All-Access member, you will hear Zeth and I discussing what it's like to grow up in the shadow of Stephen King. Okay, that conversation is coming up right now for All-Access members. Be back after this.

• 38:52Jake Brennan?

  All right, guys, we are back. Just my weekly reminder here. Get into the archive. Find yourself an old episode of Disgraceland to keep you warm on these cooling autumn nights. We are approaching our 300th episode, so if you've got a favorite musician, there's a good chance we've done an episode on them. Now, let's recap, shall we? Number one, this week, our new episode on Shannon Hoon from Blind Melon. That's available for you right now. Number two, in the rewind slot this weekend, our classic episodes on Britney Spears, Parts One and Part Two. Number three, next week, our next new episode, that's coming, and that is gonna be on Buddy Holly. We're gonna try to figure out, did Buddy Holly shoot down his own plane? Holy cow, this story. Number four, Zedd gives you those Hollywood and crime vibes in the Hollywoodland feed, so make sure you're subscribed. And I give you my music recommendations in the wrap party.

• 39:37Jake Brennan?

  There's another reason to get to Hollywoodland, delivered straight to your podcast app. Subscribe to Hollywoodland. Number five, the current episode of this film should be played loud. Our video podcast episode on Shaun of the Dead is available for our All-Access members. Go to disgracelandpod.com to sign up. Number six, 617-906-6638. Your voice keeps us digging into the dark corners of music history, so keep calling, texting with your answers to this week's question of the week, or with whatever else you guys want to talk about. Number seven, don't forget Discos. This isn't just content, it's a community, a community of the obsessed, and no one cares about music books, records, and the crime and grime that ties them all together like you do, and well, that's a disgrace. All right, back on October 21st, 1995, Shannon Hoon was found dead, unfortunately,

• 40:21Jake Brennan?

  on a tour bus in New Orleans, and this is what America was listening to on that day according to the Billboard charts. Number one, Fantasy. Mariah Carey, "Last Week," one. Peak position, one. Weeks on chart, four. Number two, Gangsta's Paradise, Coolio, "Last Week," two. Peak position, one. Weeks on chart, ten. Number three, Runaway, Janet Jackson, "Last Week," four. Peak position, three. Weeks on chart, six.

• 40:57Jake Brennan?

  Number four, Kiss from Rose, Seal, "Last Week," five. Peak position, one. Weeks on chart, ten.

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• 42:27Jake Brennan?

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