465: Weird Trajectory

How can I be part of John’s Book tour if tickets are sold out in my area? What is going on with collagen? How long ago is “a million miles ago”? How do I read The Bible? Why do windmills have three arms? Will John or Hank ever do an event in Northern Europe? …Hank and John Green have answers! If you're in need of dubious advice, email us at [email protected] Join us for monthly livestreams at patreon.com/dearhankandjohn Produced for Hank and John Green by Complexly See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Hank Green?

  You're listening to a Complexly podcast.

• 0:09Hank Green?

  Hello and welcome to Dear Hank and John.

• 0:11John Green?

  Or I prefer to think of it Dear John and Hank.

• 0:14Hank Green?

  It's a podcast where two brothers answer your questions, give you dubious advice and bring you all the week's news from both Mars and AFC Wimbledon. John, is it true that you read a lot of your books inside of this like chair? Am I making that up?

• 0:26John Green?

  No, I sometimes write in this chair.

• 0:28Hank Green?

  There's like a special writing chair that you have.

• 0:31John Green?

  Oh, I do have a special writing chair, yes.

• 0:33Hank Green?

  Is it a recliner?

• 0:34John Green?

  It is. It's a lazy boy.

• 0:36Hank Green?

  And you've, you've written a lot in this lazy boy?

• 0:39John Green?

  I've written at least some of all of my, my books in that lazy boy.

• 0:43Hank Green?

  Is it fair to say that you and that recliner go way back?

• 0:48John Green?

  That's a pretty good joke, actually. You set it up well. You made me feel like I was deeply invested in it as a person. You know, you really personalized it for me before you delivered, so.

• 0:58Hank Green?

  Yeah, made it about you. It needs to be about, it needs to be about you is what I've learned.

• 1:02John Green?

  Oh, I've had one of those days, Hank. I've had a long day today.

• 1:05Hank Green?

  I'm sorry.

• 1:05John Green?

  I did just get the very first review of Hollywood Ending, Hank.

• 1:10Hank Green?

  What? From who? How do they even have it?

• 1:12John Green?

  From Booklist Magazine. Do you want to know what it says?

• 1:15Hank Green?

  They better star it. You're a, you're a legacy.

• 1:19John Green?

  I'm an alum, but it has been 25 years, so I don't know that being an alum matters much. But it is a starred review. Can I read a little bit of it to you? I'm so excited about it. It just came across my desk minutes ago. A YA fiction supernova, Green began writing for adults with his two works of nonfiction, The Anthropocene, Review and Everything is Tuberculosis. He now presents his first novel for grownups and his first novel since, Turtles All the Way Down. An enthralling tale aglow with all the traits his steadfast fans adore, but deepened by more complex predicaments, inquiries and insights. Yada, yada, yada, yada, yada, yada. Green storytelling.

• 1:54Hank Green?

  The booklist reviews always have like plot summary, so he's skipping back.

• 1:58John Green?

  Yeah, I'm trying, I'm trying not to have any spoilers. Green storytelling is astute, empathetic and magnetizing as Juniper and Kai take turns narrating. Reflections on Warhol's profound grasp and exploitation of the vicissitudes of celebrity and the commodification of art and life shape the novel's provocative and suspenseful conflicts. Yada, yada, yada. This is a spellbinding, tender, incisive, funny and compassionate story of love and creativity.

• 2:21Hank Green?

  Ooh. That's the, the booklist reviews are always about that last sentence.

• 2:26John Green?

  I know. That's the sentence that you want to quote. That's the one. Because when I was writing booklist reviews, if I really loved a book, I would try to write a last sentence where I would be like, that's going to be on the back of the book.

• 2:36Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 2:38John Green?

  I, I only reviewed a few books that I really, really wanted to succeed. And I would always try to craft just the perfect little, this is good stuff.

• 2:52Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 2:53John Green?

  For the back of the book.

• 2:54Hank Green?

  Do you feel like somebody was thinking that when they wrote that?

• 2:56John Green?

  I hope so. At any rate, it's a lovely review. And also, thank you to the two or three people who wrote into the Dear Hank and John inbox that because they are booksellers or book talkers, they've already read Hollywood Ending and said nice things to me.

• 3:09Hank Green?

  Nice. John's had such a day that he is, if you can tell, his audio is not as good as mine because he is filming in his living room.

• 3:17John Green?

  It's actually Sarah's office, but it's very echoey. I'm sorry about that.

• 3:23Hank Green?

  Look at that. I don't even recognize your art correctly.

• 3:26John Green?

  Well, Sarah's always reinstalling the permanent collection, as we say, so I think there's a new, new picture behind me these days.

• 3:33Hank Green?

  John, congratulations on your first review. I know that that's a scary moment and it's exciting when it goes well. Do you want to look at some questions from Dear Hank and John listeners?

• 3:43John Green?

  Let's answer some questions from our listeners, Hank.

• 3:45Hank Green?

  We got a first question. It's from Cody who asks, hello, brothers Green. Mostly of the John variety. I just went to HollywoodEndingBook.com to purchase tickets for the book tour in Salt Lake City after listening to the most recent pot episode. I don't know why I assumed that you wouldn't be coming to Utah, and I don't know why I wouldn't have checked until you set it out loud on the podcast, but unfortunately, here we are. The venue is sold out entirely and I can't find, nor do I want to pay someone for scalped tickets. Is there some version of a tailgate viewing party for an event like this that I could partake in? I want to be a part of it in some way. Would love some dubious advice from you both. Cody, you starred this one, John. You, you, you told me to, you bolded it. It was, John will go through and bold the ones that he wants me to answer, so.

• 4:30John Green?

  Yeah.

• 4:32Hank Green?

  But I feel like the answer is there's nothing you could do, Cody.

• 4:35John Green?

  I feel so bad, Cody, because that's going to be such a fun show. I don't want to make, I just made it worse, Hank.

• 4:42Hank Green?

  You did. You did. Cody, you gotta go to Brooklyn.

• 4:45John Green?

  Yeah, go to Brooklyn. There's still tickets in Brooklyn and Portland, Maine and Birmingham, Alabama and Boise, Idaho. Boise, Idaho's pretty far from you. Pretty far from you.

• 4:54Hank Green?

  There's a nonstop. I know this because this is, this is my part of the world.

• 4:58John Green?

  Cody, if you want to fly nonstop from Salt Lake City to Boise, Idaho just to see me, that actually isn't going to be a good use of your resources.

• 5:08Hank Green?

  It's $369.

• 5:09John Green?

  I'm going to be honest with you, man. I don't think there are watch parties, unfortunately. Now, you can maybe host your own watch party with some friends and family because I am going to livestream some of these events whenever I can. I'm going to be livestreaming it at John's channel, on my YouTube channel, so maybe check it out there. But I do feel really bad that, that so many of the shows are sold out. That said, many of the shows aren't sold out and I wish that they were. So I'm kind of torn on which I would prefer. I feel bad for Cody, but I also feel bad for me for the places that aren't sold out.

• 5:41Hank Green?

  It's strange that, I don't like, I don't know if this is weird, but it's strange that the varieties of sold out and not sold out you have going on. Is that just a, like a size of the room difference?

• 5:55John Green?

  The space in New York is definitely a size of the room difference. It's a 3100 seat theater. It's ridiculous. So come see me in New York City, everybody. I think it's also prices to some extent. Like when Ticketmaster gets involved, it gets very expensive. As you may know, call, call your congresspeople about global health, but then mention Ticketmaster at the end. Tucson, Arizona, I'm going to be there and that's not sold out. I think there's still some tickets left in Nashville and Gainesville. Yeah. But yeah, it's starting to sell out. I feel bad about this whole thing, Hank, because I, it's always, you don't want to be playing a mostly empty room, you know?

• 6:37Hank Green?

  Yeah. And we've done it.

• 6:38John Green?

  Oh, we've done it. We've played empty rooms before. I've played empty middle school auditoriums. The only thing worse than an empty middle school auditorium is a full middle school auditorium that's full of people who don't know who you are.

• 6:50Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Boy, do middle schoolers not know who we are anymore. Maybe they do. I don't know.

• 6:57John Green?

  I mean, certainly in 2008, they didn't know who I was. I remember like, one time, like performing at a middle school, like reading from Paper Towns, and there were two kids wearing Nerd Fighter t-shirts in the very front row.

• 7:12Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 7:12John Green?

  Who were extremely excited and 798 kids who were just getting out of English class, who were like talking to each other loudly, absolutely. The classroom was absolutely out of control.

• 7:24Hank Green?

  I, our trajectory is bizarre. Here we are, though. Here we are, though. I don't know. You can't go back home again.

• 7:34John Green?

  No. No, you can't ever, you can't. I've been thinking about this actually because we're releasing a new soap. Hank, do you know about this?

• 7:44Hank Green?

  Oh, what a, what a weird thing to say, but yes, go on.

• 7:47John Green?

  Okay, so at good.store, our, our company that donates 100% of its profit to charity, we have a soap company and we now make shampoo bars and conditioner bars and soap and it's great and it's really high quality soap. I use it every day. I use all those products. I don't use liquid based shampoo or conditioner anymore. And they were like, is there anything you'd like to, any kind of soap that you'd like that you don't have? And I was like, yes, I'd like a soap that smells like my high school dorm room, which sounds like it smells really bad. But in fact, it smelled really good because I had this amazing roommate, Todd, who was a very hygienic person and always, we had this beautiful, I mean, aside

• 8:30John Green?

  from when we would smoke cigarettes in the dorm, which don't do that, we had this beautiful, beautiful smell. And occasionally I'll catch a glimpse of it and smell is just so powerfully linked to memory.

• 8:41Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 8:42John Green?

  And so I asked.

• 8:42Hank Green?

  A glimpse of it. That's fascinating that there's no like word for that in smell, but.

• 8:47John Green?

  There's no word for glimpsing a smell. So I, I, dude.

• 8:51Hank Green?

  A whiff.

• 8:52John Green?

  A whiff of it. That's what it is. I asked the people at Botany to design a soap that smelled like my high school dorm room. And because they are so good at turning language into smells and smells into language, because that's what, basically what they do for a living on some level, they got pretty close.

• 9:11Hank Green?

  That's wild.

• 9:13John Green?

  And it's called memory. And we just released it.

• 9:17Hank Green?

  That's weird. Ah, strange.

• 9:21John Green?

  That's, that's how weird our trajectory is, Hank, that I can get a custom soap.

• 9:25Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah, I also have a custom soap.

• 9:29John Green?

  What's yours? Tell me about it.

• 9:30Hank Green?

  It's based on Catherine and I's favorite British drink, the Pim's Cup, which we could not name it. We could not name it the Pim's Cup because it turns out that's an actual brand, unfortunately, not just a drink name.

• 9:41John Green?

  So go to good.store and get our weird soaps.

• 9:44Hank Green?

  Yeah. I think ours is called Garden Party.

• 9:47John Green?

  Oh, yeah. I like Garden. The Garden Party's in my top three in my rotation.

• 9:50Hank Green?

  Oh, nice. Yeah, I love it too. I was doing a citrusy this morning. I don't know which one it was, but yeah, I, it's crazy to like, always be decked out in my own products. I got a Pizza John shirt on. I got awesome socks. I took a shower this morning with sun base and soap. And it's all, all, all those things for a charity.

• 10:10John Green?

  Weird trajectory indeed. All right.

• 10:13Hank Green?

  Weird trajectory.

• 10:14John Green?

  How about you ask me this question from Ella, because I'm very interested in it.

• 10:18Hank Green?

  Okay. Dear Hank and John, please, what the blazing heck should we actually be doing with collagen as a woman of a certain age, 25? All right, stop right there.

• 10:28John Green?

  Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Panic at the disco. Panic.

• 10:35Hank Green?

  As a literal child, 25, no, sorry.

• 10:40John Green?

  As a newborn baby who emerged from her mother's womb mere minutes ago.

• 10:46Hank Green?

  As, as a person who wasn't alive on September 11.

• 11:00John Green?

  Oh, boy.

• 11:01Hank Green?

  Uh, as...

• 11:04Hank Green?

  Okay. I am... Okay. As a woman of... As a woman, I am bombarded with adverts for collagen. I buy this. Uh, everyone is using it. Apparently, we need more of it. I have a basic scientific understanding of human anatomy and physiology, but I... I have to admit, I don't really understand how we absorb collagen. Are the face serums all a waste of time? Do we need to eat more of it? Also, as men, are you guys dealing with the societal pressures of aging and the looming devaluation of your worth? I doubt it. You guys are hot.

• 11:36John Green?

  Curse word.

• 11:37Hank Green?

  Curse word. Um, cheers. Uh... Uh, F.L.A.S. Fellas. Cheers, fellas. Great. Good... Good work.

• 11:48John Green?

  I have to say, I get very few ads for collagen.

• 11:51Hank Green?

  Yeah, no, I don't. I... I will sometimes look at my hairline and I will think about it.

• 11:56John Green?

  Yeah. You could stand... You could stand to go to Turkey, as they say.

• 12:02Hank Green?

  It's been... A trip to Istanbul would be nice.

• 12:06John Green?

  I've always wanted to go.

• 12:07Hank Green?

  I have, actually, always wanted to go.

• 12:09John Green?

  Me, too. It's definitely on my list.

• 12:10Hank Green?

  Yeah. Um, I... Uh, I don't think that I'm gonna get a hair transplant anytime soon, but...

• 12:16John Green?

  I don't think you need one, Hank.

• 12:17Hank Green?

  Yeah, I wanna look distinguished.

• 12:20John Green?

  Well, I... I've thought about dying my hair because it's so gray now, but everyone would know.

• 12:27Hank Green?

  Everyone certainly would know. Um, there... I... I've thought just about dying. Um...

• 12:36Hank Green?

  So collagen is a protein that, uh, your body ha... Has, and it makes... It's... There's a bunch of different kinds, uh, but it's... It's in the skin and it's also in the joints. It does a lot of different stuff. And, uh, I think... And the idea is that the more collagen you have in your skin, the more elastic your skin is and that is more youthful. And, uh... Collagen, uh, on its own, is gonna be too big to absorb through the skin. It's a very big protein. It's not going anywhere. It will sit on the surface of your skin, I'm... I'm pretty sure. There... There have been some meta-analyses that have looked at this. And what is more, and not very, but more backed up by science is that there may be some effects, and these are more for, like, the joints than the skin, it seems.

• 13:21Hank Green?

  Some effects of eating, uh, little broken-up pieces of collagen, which can then be sort of immediately... The idea is they can be immediately repurposed by the body to more efficiently build collagen because they are... It can actually be absorbed, unlike collagen, which is too big. Uh, and then they... They sort of like already have the right sequence to be put to... To be put to use by the body. And that's the idea of collagen peptides. So when you see collagen peptides at the store, that's what that is. But the effects are... Ap... Appear to be small. And there are probably other things that can go into skin creams that are better for your skin.

• 14:01John Green?

  Hmm. Okay. Cause it's... So skin creams are not completely a scam, but collagen is probably not the best thing.

• 14:08Hank Green?

  Are not completely a scam. Um, but it doesn't seem like having like a big, hunky protein in there is gonna do much but sit on the top of your skin.

• 14:16John Green?

  Okay. Well, good to know. I mean, like I said, I haven't gotten a lot of ads for collagen, but then... Then I got Ella's ad and I was like, well, maybe I should be using it. I do... I would like to look a little younger.

• 14:29Hank Green?

  It... It comes for us all, John.

• 14:31John Green?

  I had a birthday since the last time we recorded, and there's something about this particular birthday where I'm like, well... I mean, am I middle-aged? Not really.

• 14:40Hank Green?

  Turning 56. It's old.

• 14:43John Green?

  I'm not 56, Hank.

• 14:44Hank Green?

  No, I made that up.

• 14:45John Green?

  But I will be. Uh, that's the thing, man. We'll probably still be making this podcast. It'll be called Dear John and Hank, but we'll probably still be making it when I'm 56.

• 14:52Hank Green?

  I cannot believe that we're still doing the podcast. And then I thought there was any chance. Does... Do people know about the wager that we made? Are they aware?

• 15:04John Green?

  We should tell them. We should tell them.

• 15:05Hank Green?

  Okay. Update. A whole long time ago...

• 15:09John Green?

  Yeah.

• 15:09Hank Green?

  When we were making this podcast, I don't know, 10 years ago, I thought that there was a chance that we might have humans on Mars by 2028. And John was like, that's a ridiculous proposition. And this is important for me to remember because I have all kinds of insane thoughts.

• 15:23John Green?

  Mm-hmm.

• 15:24Hank Green?

  Like, I... I recently hitched on with this one. I don't think humans will get sick in the future.

• 15:29John Green?

  Yeah. Cause it's...

• 15:30Hank Green?

  Like...

• 15:31John Green?

  Wrong. Incorrect.

• 15:33Hank Green?

  Which... I... I have a bunch of qualifications for this take, which is like, I mean infectious disease. I mean, not all humans, but like, there will be... There will be ways to avoid getting, like, your normal rhinovirus types things. But anyway, um, I also think that I'm wrong. But I al... Also think, maybe... 100 years from now? Who knows? But I thought that there might be a chance that we could get to Mars by 2028. And John thought this was so ridiculous. It's like, I will bet you... And I don't know what his... I don't know what I was gonna get from him. But what I... I offered to him was renaming the podcast Dear John and Hank.

• 16:07John Green?

  I think what you were gonna get from me is the satisfaction of humans on Mars, which, I mean, I don't even think you're gonna live to see it. And I think you're gonna live a long and happy life.

• 16:17Hank Green?

  Well, I think I'm gonna live for hundreds of years.

• 16:20John Green?

  Oh, God. Let's not do that. Let's not go there, Brian Johnson. Let's stop it. The collagen was far enough.

• 16:26Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 16:27John Green?

  Um, humans won't get sick in the future.

• 16:29Hank Green?

  Uh, look. Do we already... Here's the thing. There's like whole classes of illness that our society is mostly free of now.

• 16:37John Green?

  I gr... I agree. I don't... Never think about mumps.

• 16:40Hank Green?

  Never think about mumps? You never think of... Never think about rickets? You don't even know what rickets is.

• 16:44John Green?

  Never think about rickets?

• 16:45Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 16:46John Green?

  Don't... Don't think very much these days about cholera, personally?

• 16:50Hank Green?

  Yeah. Certainly, there's lots of people who, uh...

• 16:53John Green?

  Who do have to think about cholera.

• 16:54Hank Green?

  Thankfully think about cholera.

• 16:55John Green?

  Yeah, I know.

• 16:56Hank Green?

  Yeah. Yeah. Um, but yeah, I was just thinking about the nutritional deficiencies. Uh, you know, scurvy, rickets.

• 17:04John Green?

  Right.

• 17:04Hank Green?

  Berry berry, like, these things that are like still problems in the world. But if you live in a society with fortified cereals and, you know, iodized salt and, you know, we... We're getting... We're getting these things in a lot of different ways.

• 17:17John Green?

  Yeah.

• 17:18Hank Green?

  That's great.

• 17:19John Green?

  Raisin Bran has both.

• 17:21Hank Green?

  It has berry berry? And... And goiters?

• 17:25John Green?

  No, it does. It's... It's both fortified with vitamins and with salt.

• 17:30Hank Green?

  Oh, okay.

• 17:32John Green?

  All right. Let's answer this question from Kate, who writes, Dear John and Hank, but mostly Hank. I was having dinner with a few friends this evening when friend A referenced something that they said earlier, saying, "That was a million miles ago when I said that." And friend B said, "Miles, not seconds or minutes," to which friend A vaguely gestured, saying, "You know, with Earth's rotation and everything." So my question is, how much long ago would a million miles ago be? Awaiting astrophysical answers, Kate.

• 17:55Hank Green?

  Well, Kate, I have amazing news, which is that I did a lot of math.

• 17:58John Green?

  No way. Did you really?

• 18:00Hank Green?

  I really did.

• 18:01John Green?

  Oh, my God. Well, cause... Correct me if I'm wrong, but we're going a million miles... We're going X number of miles per hour around the sun.

• 18:10Hank Green?

  Uh-huh.

• 18:10John Green?

  And so that's one speed that Earth is going. But Earth is also rotating with the sun around the center of the Milky Way. So that's another speed. So Earth is basically going two speeds at the same time.

• 18:23Hank Green?

  Oh, more than that, John?

• 18:24John Green?

  Oh, it's... It's... It's... It's not even Too Fast, Too Furious? It's like Three Fast, Three Furious?

• 18:28Hank Green?

  It's like Four Fast, Four Furious, is... Is the math I did.

• 18:31John Green?

  Four Furious.

• 18:33Hank Green?

  Yes. So... So first of all, the... You gotta think about how fast we're spinning around our own axis. And this is complicated, it turns out, because the equator moves much more quickly than, uh, halfway up the planet, much more quickly than the pole, which, you know, at the pole, you... If you're right there at the top, you don't actually move at all. So if you are looking at the Earth's rotation at the equator, that's gonna be like 1,000 miles per hour. That's gonna be like 40 days to go a million miles. But if you're at 60 degrees latitude, that's like twice as long to go a million miles because you're up on this part of the Earth that's, you know, that's going around the same number of times per day, but there's...

• 19:13John Green?

  Less... Less travel.

• 19:15Hank Green?

  Yeah. So you're traveling less. And so that's gonna be like 80 days, uh, to go 100,000 miles. If you're at the pole, never. Because you just are standing there. And you're not spinning at all.

• 19:24John Green?

  Okay.

• 19:25Hank Green?

  But we are also orbiting the sun, which you correctly referenced. And that's going 66,600 miles per hour. And so you're gonna go a million miles in just 15 hours.

• 19:34John Green?

  Wow.

• 19:36Hank Green?

  So a million miles ago, not that long.

• 19:39John Green?

  I'm on the move.

• 19:40Hank Green?

  You're on the move. Correct. Also, the solar system is orbiting the center of the Milky Way. Uh, so... So we are out there pretty far and the whole thing is spinning. That's going 515,000 miles per hour, so substantially faster. So a million miles ago, in terms of that reference frame, that's gonna be about two hours.

• 20:01John Green?

  Like an hour and 52 minutes. Like, uh... What... What I think is the correct length for a movie.

• 20:08Hank Green?

  It is absolutely... God, I gotta say, when I wanna pick a movie for just, like, watching with Orin, I'm really looking for that 90-minute mark. But if it's for me, hour 52 is perfect. You're right.

• 20:20John Green?

  Hour 52. I'll tell you what, Christopher Nolan. You might be able to make a great spectacle, but call me when you can do it in an hour and 52 minutes.

• 20:29Hank Green?

  Well, do you know the other way in which we are moving?

• 20:32John Green?

  No. No.

• 20:33Hank Green?

  So there's a... There's a... Like a reference frame of the cosmic microwave background. So the... The Big Bang, and then we have... Are like moving away from that reference frame. So our local group of galaxies is... Is like... Has a movement relative to the cosmic microwave background. And that's, uh, 1,390,000 miles per hour. So that is about 43 minutes to go a million miles. And this, of course, all takes you back to relativity, John. You can also be going zero. It's... It's inertial reference frames all the way down. And so we don't really know. But I did try to figure out what the fastest you could be going was. And it would be... A million miles would be like... 3 minutes, maybe? 4?

• 21:14John Green?

  4 minutes?

• 21:16Hank Green?

  Yeah. If like a reference frame of like 99.999% the speed of light.

• 21:23John Green?

  Oh, okay. That's as... So the fastest I could be going would be the speed of light, and that would be about 4 minutes per million miles?

• 21:31Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 21:32John Green?

  Wow. Okay. I mean, it really makes the proclaimers look less impressive.

• 21:39Hank Green?

  Yeah. I mean...

• 21:41John Green?

  They only walked 500 miles. They could've just waited a minute.

• 21:50Hank Green?

  Oh. Deboki put, when she was doing the research for this, she's traveling right now and she was like, "I just left this here for you."

• 22:04Hank Green?

  She worked on the collagen question, but this one, she was like, ah, you know what you're doing. Which actually reminds me, John, this podcast is brought to you by Deboki Chakravarti. Deboki Chakravarti, unsung hero of Dear Hank and John, digging into your questions, sending me weird emails since 2014 or something.

• 22:25John Green?

  Really bringing you every episode of Dear Hank and John. Today's podcast is also brought to you by 4 Fast 4 Furious, the exciting new cosmic travel game.

• 22:35Hank Green?

  Oh, I thought it was gonna be a movie. That's much more exciting. This podcast is also brought to you by Booklist Magazine, but not Booklist Magazine now. Booklist Magazine 25 years ago, specifically the ones that had John Green reviews in them.

• 22:49John Green?

  God, I started working there 26 years ago. I am old. And today's podcast is brought to you by Collagen. Collagen.

• 22:57Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 22:59Hank Green?

  This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Wayfair. There are a number of objects in my home that I have been extraordinarily well-served by, maybe for 15 or 20 years. Like a pair of fake leather upholstered stools that I've had forever, but they've seen better days. They maybe need a little bit of a refresh. Good news, Wayfair helps you create a home that stands up to real life with quality products, great value, and trusted reviews. Wayfair verified products are hand-vetted by product specialists using a 10-point quality inspection. You can use filters, customer photos, and more than 20 million verified 5-star reviews to confidently find the right fit for your home. And now those stools that I had 15 or 20 years ago, I don't have those.

• 23:42Hank Green?

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• 24:06Hank Green?

  This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Quince. I do very much like opening up my closet and finding an item that I know is gonna be both comfortable and I'm just gonna look good in it. It's gonna go well with my khakis, or my jeans, or my third kind of pant? That I have like a pair of orange pants. Just things that make getting dressed easier, and that's what Quince does best. Quince focuses on high-quality wardrobe staples made with premium materials like 100% Mongolian cashmere, organic cotton, and merino wool, and the styles are timeless, and they're versatile, and they're designed to become dependable pieces that you reach for day after day. This morning, I put on this jacket that I'm currently wearing with just a white t-shirt, and I knew immediately, this is gonna work.

• 24:50Hank Green?

  I went downstairs, and Catherine was like, "Look at that nice jacket. Where'd that come from?" You know where it came from? It came from Quince. Everything at Quince is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands, because they work directly with ethical factories and cut out the middleman, so you're paying for the quality, not the brand markup. Find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers, or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns, now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know that it was Dear Hank and John. It's a good way to support the show. I feel like I should say it's Q-U-I-N-C-E. I guess it's pretty easy to spell Quince. Quince.com. I feel tempted to make up a tagline for them, but that's not what they want me to do. I shouldn't do that.

• 25:40Hank Green?

  This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Factor. Factor makes chef-crafted, dietitian-designed, ready-to-eat meals, so you don't have to choose between real food and convenience. You can have both real food and convenience, which is good, because I will choose convenience every time, even if convenience is just peanuts again. Literally. I eat a lot of peanuts. Factor meals are ready in two minutes, and I'm not joking there. They are ready in two minutes, and they require no prep and no cleanup. So even the days when your schedule is completely out of control, eating well is still achievable. But here's a secret I have for you. Sometimes I actually do introduce cleanup artificially. I will move it from the Factor container onto a plate, so I can feel like I'm having

• 26:25Hank Green?

  a real meal. And that's fine. And then I have one plate to clean. I don't have a bunch of pots and pans to clean, though. Every week, you will find over 100 nutrient-dense menu items to choose from, and new options like salmon burgers, shredded pork, collard greens, and more. Plus add-ons you'll crave, like pumpkin-flavored cheesecake and protein shakes. 97% of users agree that Factor meals help them live a healthier life, so you can feel confident that you're doing something good for yourself with every meal. True story, right now, I do not have any Factor meals in my fridge, and I am hungry, and I'm about to go inside and absolutely rummage for something, and I'm sad about it. Some current Factor meals include Chicken Taco Bowl with Corn Salsa and Cilantro Crema.

• 27:09Hank Green?

  This is making me so hungry. Onion Portobello Burger with Potatoes and White Cheddar. That's right, they can help you go vegetarian or eat less meat. You can also have Golden Corn and Shrimp Risotto with Brussels, Cabbage, and Pepper Medley, but I can't, because I'm allergic to shrimp. Let's eat real. Head to factormeals.com/dearthank50off and use code DEARHANK50OFF to get 50% off and one free breakfast item per box for one year, while supplies last until October 31st, 2026. That's code DEARHANK50OFF at factormeals.com. Dear Hank, 5-0, off at factormeals.com. See the website for more details.

• 27:52John Green?

  All right, we have a question from Stevie, who writes, "Dear John and Hank, how do I read the Bible? I'm essentially an atheist, but I want to read specifically my late grandma's personal Bible, both to connect with her, but also because I'm curious from an academic standpoint as a writer and sociologist. But growing up in church, it always sounded really complicated and dense, and there's all those Bible companion books that give you specific passages and explain as you go or whatever. So is this the way I'm supposed to read this thing, or can I just go through in any order that I like? Also, John, what's the best chapter? Pumpkins and Penguins, Stevie."

• 28:22Hank Green?

  Do they come in chapters? What's the sort of unit of a Bible?

• 28:25John Green?

  There's books. So the Book of Job, the Book of Genesis, and so on, and then...

• 28:29Hank Green?

  It's a book of books.

• 28:30John Green?

  It's a book of books, and then there are chapters and verses within the books. And part of what makes it difficult to read, actually, is the constant presence of numbers, because numbers show up every few words, because the verse changes, and then the chapter changes.

• 28:45Hank Green?

  That makes it like, easy to look up stuff.

• 28:47John Green?

  Exactly. So that makes it easy to reference, but it also makes it kind of hard to read narratively.

• 28:52Hank Green?

  Right. Like, I imagine you get used to that after a while, but...

• 28:56John Green?

  You do. You do. And the Bible is more narrative than many sacred texts. I would say it's, you know, more story-based than, say, the Quran. But it is also hard to get yourself into the mindset of reading a text that's 5,000 years old, or however old it is, 3,000 years old, 2,000 years old, depends on which chapter and which testament we're talking about. And I think the way to do it, the best book of the Bible, by the way, Stevie, is Job, by a wide margin. It's a proper, good narrative, and it features a really complicated God who won't stop torturing

• 29:41John Green?

  a good man.

• 29:42Hank Green?

  So Job is, that's the Old Testament one?

• 29:45John Green?

  Yeah, that's Old Testament, and it's a banger. I mean, if you're gonna go New Testament, I think the Gospel, according to Matthew, is probably the best of the New Testament books, but they're all... Luke's not bad.

• 29:56John Green?

  It's weird that we have four different attestations to the life of Jesus, and they have different takes.

• 30:02Hank Green?

  They got different takes. Yeah. I also think, and I got, this is a strange thing to say, but like, Job, I'm like, yeah, that's a guy who belongs in the Bible. But Luke and Matthew...

• 30:12John Green?

  Those just seem like regular dude names.

• 30:14Hank Green?

  Those are guys who are like, currently famous actors, you know?

• 30:18John Green?

  Right. Right. Yeah, Job, not a widely-used name, and you'll realize why when you read the Book of Job.

• 30:27Hank Green?

  You're like, "Oh, I actually don't want to identify with that guy at all."

• 30:30John Green?

  No, I wouldn't want my kid to end up like that fella, losing his wife and his children, and being tortured with boils on the balls of his feet and whatnot.

• 30:40Hank Green?

  Oh, that's a bad place for a boil. Also, a complicated place to get a boil. I'm not sure how that would happen physiologically.

• 30:48John Green?

  Well, Hank, you know, if God is all-powerful and feels like testing you, you're gonna get boils on the bottom of your feet.

• 30:55Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 30:57John Green?

  I think you absolutely can read it without a kind of guide to the Bible. It's nice, I find it's nice to have one, just so that you can be like, "What the heck did I just read? That didn't make any sense."

• 31:10Hank Green?

  Right. The one that I had in my Religious Studies class was like, page of the Bible, and then like, if you're confused, you can look on the side, the other side of the Bible.

• 31:20John Green?

  Right.

• 31:20Hank Green?

  And it's like, here's what that's referencing, and here's like, what that word means in this context. Yeah.

• 31:26John Green?

  Right. So that's what I would recommend, is one of those Bibles that has that sort of, where you can do it within the text. I guess you're reading your grandma's Bible, which probably doesn't have that, so you might need a separate text. But it is an interesting read from a secular perspective. I've thought over the years that it would be fun someday to do a secular reading of the Bible, or a secular series of sermons or something, because I think a lot of what's useful about sermonizing and reading sacred texts is still useful, even if you don't believe in God. I think it's still interesting.

• 32:01Hank Green?

  Do you think everybody would be sort of real receptive to the idea of me kind of just rewriting it a little bit? Just sort of like, doing a Hank's version?

• 32:08John Green?

  Hank's version?

• 32:12John Green?

  Yeah, no, I would, that seems like it would be something that would get you right back in the discourse, Hank, where you love being.

• 32:19Hank Green?

  Yeah, that's probably not for me. John, I appreciate your answer there, and I would actually be very interested in your secular sermons if you ever have a time.

• 32:30John Green?

  Well, I guess I did write a book of them called The Anthropocene Review.

• 32:35Hank Green?

  All right, John, this next question comes from Ben, who asks, Dear Hank and John, we're driving through Iowa on a family road trip, and my eight-year-old son Ben is wondering why all the windmills have three arms. Is that a random decision, or is it a science thing?

• 32:50John Green?

  It can't be a random decision, right? So it has to be a science thing. But I have to say, Ben, that this is an example of childhood curiosity being much more interesting than adult curiosity, because I have never thought about this, and it is very interesting now that you've brought it up.

• 33:05Hank Green?

  Right. And the thing to know, Ben, is number one, like, if you're gonna build something as expensive and complex as a windmill, you are going to do this, or a wind turbine, as we say, because it's not actually milling anything. Windmills mill. They actually, the idea is that they like, put grain in there, and then turn it into flour inside of the windmill, and that power for the milling would come from the wind. But the wind turbines, or turbines, the thing that they're doing is they're turning wind into electricity, and we want to do that as efficiently as possible without spending more money. So you really would want, ideally, one, you know? You'd only want to have one up there. Why would we have three when we could have one? We certainly wouldn't want to have four

• 33:47Hank Green?

  if we could have three, and we'd like to have two if we could not have three, and we'd like to have one. But you can't have one. So there's a very good reason, which is you want balance. You don't want like, a weird amount of weight being put on to the whole structure and the sort of wobble that would be introduced by the one. So it would need some kind of counterweight to make that happen. So two blades would be cheaper, but it would also be shakier and noisier. So there is like, some idea that having two would actually be, like, you could make a two-bladed wind turbine that would be like, cheaper to produce electricity with, but three blades gives you smooth, and it gives

• 34:30Hank Green?

  you stable, and it gives you reasonably inexpensive. And then with more blades, you're gonna get heavier, you're gonna get slower, and you're gonna get more costly.

• 34:40John Green?

  Okay, so that's it. I mean, it really comes down to, it's not about aesthetics.

• 34:46Hank Green?

  Yeah. It's not about aesthetics, but it is a little bit about like, the, like, kind of two-bladed might be kind of like, kind of fine, but it introduces more shake, it's less balanced, and it might decrease the life of the wind turbine, it might also make them louder, which is not something that you want. So you want that to be, apparently, from what I can tell, having three blades smoothes it out.

• 35:09John Green?

  Okay. All right, Hank, we got another question from Meru, who asks, Hey, John and Hank, I'm a huge fan, but I live in Estonia, and as you know, Estonia is very far away from the USA. I just want to say, Meru, thank you so much for assuming that Hank and I have the geographic knowledge to know that Estonia is far away from the USA, because I know that in the European imagination, many Americans don't.

• 35:34Hank Green?

  Good. Could be Caribbean island, I don't know.

• 35:38John Green?

  Isn't that off the coast of Cuba?

• 35:43John Green?

  Also, I really don't want to travel to USA, even if it was cheap. I do not like USA, sorry.

• 35:49Hank Green?

  Don't put any punches. We appreciate you, like, knowing where we stand, you know? Who does like USA these days?

• 35:57John Green?

  Let's face it, Meru, we're all on the same page here. Will you ever come to Northern Europe to some event so I could finally achieve my dream of seeing you in person? The Rs are shy in my name. Meru, May, Mayu?

• 36:11Hank Green?

  Meru, Meru. The Rs are shy in my name. I love that, that's beautiful.

• 36:14John Green?

  The Rs are shy in my name.

• 36:16Hank Green?

  Yeah. John, question, does Estonia have RAXs?

• 36:20John Green?

  No, but Finland does, and that's in Northern Europe. I bet Mayu could make their way to Northern Europe. If Mayu is interested in Northern Europe and considers Finland Northern Europe, then maybe we could all meet at a RAX.

• 36:34Hank Green?

  I mean, literally, Estonia is closer to Finland than like, Seattle is to me, and I've driven to Seattle.

• 36:43John Green?

  Yeah. No, you could make it from Estonia, easy.

• 36:46Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 36:47John Green?

  Light work.

• 36:48Hank Green?

  Light work. Estonia to RAX.

• 36:52John Green?

  How far from Estonia to RAX in Finland? Hmm.

• 36:58Hank Green?

  Hmm. Hmm. That didn't work.

• 37:02John Green?

  Yeah, that didn't work.

• 37:03Hank Green?

  That didn't work.

• 37:06John Green?

  There's a ferry, but it doesn't, the ferry is two and a half hours, but it doesn't go directly to RAX.

• 37:13Hank Green?

  That's pretty cool, though. You had just, from Estonia, straight over the Gulf of Finland into Helsinki.

• 37:20John Green?

  Yeah. I would love to do a show in Helsinki, Hank, and Mary's kind of talking me into it right now. Like, I'm starting to think, maybe I could make my way to Helsinki. I've never been to Helsinki.

• 37:29Hank Green?

  No. No, I know nothing about it. But also, we could just do a show in Talaen.

• 37:36John Green?

  Yeah, we could just do a show in Estonia. That's a good shout. I hadn't thought of that.

• 37:40Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 37:40John Green?

  Never been to Estonia either.

• 37:42Hank Green?

  Look, what we're learning, Meru, is that what we really want is for you to tell us where to go in Estonia.

• 37:49John Green?

  Yeah, tell us all the cool spots.

• 37:51Hank Green?

  We're Americans, so we know nothing. You could just lie to us.

• 37:55John Green?

  Let me tell you everything I know about Estonia. I'm gonna level with you. It's not a lot. Estonia has a female prime minister.

• 38:03Hank Green?

  Okay, great. That's information.

• 38:05John Green?

  Hold on, let me Google that and make sure that's right. Yep. Yep. His name is Kristian. I got it confused. To be fair, his name is Kristian, and that is in America.

• 38:18Hank Green?

  In America, which is the only place that matters.

• 38:21John Green?

  Primarily, that's kind of a female presenting name. Now, the previous president of Estonia was a woman, but she's out of office since 2024. All right, well, I failed at my first hurdle.

• 38:38Hank Green?

  Here's the question. How hard is it to get Estonian residency and get a EU passport?

• 38:45John Green?

  Oh, my kingdom for an Estonian residency. Meru, can you get us Estonian citizenship as like, as like, an honor if we visit? We don't even need to be paid. We just need the honor of your citizenship.

• 39:03Hank Green?

  I think I know one single fact about Estonia.

• 39:06John Green?

  Yeah.

• 39:06Hank Green?

  Which is, it's where Skype came from.

• 39:09John Green?

  Is it really?

• 39:11Hank Green?

  I think Skype was originally an Estonian company.

• 39:13John Green?

  That's a great fact.

• 39:14Hank Green?

  I don't know why that information is in my head.

• 39:16John Green?

  That's a great fact. Okay, I want to tell you something else I know about Estonia.

• 39:20Hank Green?

  Okay.

• 39:21John Green?

  So I mean, I know all the basics. It was a former Soviet republic. It's the top of the three of Estonia, Lithuania.

• 39:30Hank Green?

  Like, it's all like, geographically on top? Or are you saying it's the best?

• 39:34John Green?

  No, no, it's on top. It's above the others.

• 39:37Hank Green?

  Right.

• 39:38John Green?

  Physically.

• 39:40Hank Green?

  The others being?

• 39:42John Green?

  Lithuania.

• 39:43Hank Green?

  Okay.

• 39:46Hank Green?

  There's one in the middle.

• 39:47John Green?

  Latvia.

• 39:49Hank Green?

  Well, I did look at a map, so I...

• 39:52John Green?

  Is it Latvia? Did I get it right?

• 39:53Hank Green?

  It's correct, yes.

• 39:54John Green?

  Oh, thank God. Thank God. We're not doing, we're not doing much to bolster the Europeans' beliefs about Americans and geography.

• 40:04Hank Green?

  Look, here's like, two pretty well-educated Americans. We can name some countries in Europe.

• 40:13John Green?

  Yeah. No, I think I can name all of, I think I can name all the countries in the world. It's just Latvia, Latvia's a hard one for me, but I got there. The point is, I got there.

• 40:23Hank Green?

  I can't name all the countries in the world.

• 40:25John Green?

  Yeah. I can, I think.

• 40:28Hank Green?

  Really?

• 40:28John Green?

  Well, ask me one.

• 40:31Hank Green?

  How do I ask? Okay.

• 40:32John Green?

  Just say like, what's north of, what's north of X?

• 40:35Hank Green?

  Okay. Well, let me reopen my map of, I'm just gonna, I'm gonna stick you, what's west of Lithuania?

• 40:45John Green?

  And that's left or right?

• 40:48Hank Green?

  It's to the left.

• 40:49John Green?

  Okay, because I, I mean, that's the hardest part for me, actually, is, because I know it's to the right of Lithuania, and I don't want to mention it. It's Russia. What's...

• 40:59Hank Green?

  No, in fact, that's wrong, everybody!

• 41:01John Green?

  No, Russia is to the right of Lithuania. I'm a hundred...

• 41:04Hank Green?

  I mean, eventually.

• 41:04John Green?

  Belarus!

• 41:05Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 41:06John Green?

  Belarus!

• 41:10John Green?

  Now, what's west of Lithuania?

• 41:12Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 41:12John Green?

  Is that what you asked me?

• 41:13Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 41:14John Green?

  West of Lithuania is an ocean.

• 41:19Hank Green?

  Weirdly, John, west of Lithuania is Russia.

• 41:25John Green?

  No?

• 41:26Hank Green?

  There's an enclave, Collingrad. There's a Russian enclave that is not, am I, am I wrong about this? But I'm looking at a map and there's, there, there is a, there's no-

• 41:37John Green?

  What are you talking about?

• 41:39Hank Green?

  What? Okay.

• 41:41John Green?

  You think there's a little Russia inside of Lithuania?

• 41:44Hank Green?

  No.

• 41:45John Green?

  Like the Vatican?

• 41:47Hank Green?

  I'm right. I, I'm looking and I think I'm right.

• 41:51John Green?

  Where is this, where is this place?

• 41:54Hank Green?

  No, I got, I got, I think I got confused.

• 41:57John Green?

  Yeah.

• 41:57Hank Green?

  Hold on. No, no, no, I'm not.

• 42:00John Green?

  Okay.

• 42:02John Green?

  You're telling me that Lithuania does not border the ocean. It borders a tiny slice of Russia that borders the ocean?

• 42:10Hank Green?

  Yeah, it also borders the ocean. Uh, but there is, there's a fairly large hunk of land. And I, I also can't believe I don't know this. Uh, and that it's not like a problem, but that a, a piece of Russia that is not connected to Russia that is, uh, just to the southwest, they're just to the southeast of Lithuania, north of Poland.

• 42:32John Green?

  Southeast.

• 42:34Hank Green?

  Southwest is what I meant to say.

• 42:36John Green?

  Okay, north of Poland.

• 42:37Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 42:38John Green?

  Okay, I can picture where Poland is. I can picture where Lithuania is.

• 42:40Hank Green?

  Why don't you open up a map and look at what I'm looking at?

• 42:42John Green?

  What is this?

• 42:46John Green?

  Kaliningrad.

• 42:48Hank Green?

  Kalin, Kaliningrad.

• 42:51John Green?

  Kaliningrad.

• 42:51Hank Green?

  Did I say Collingrad? Yeah, Kaliningrad.

• 42:55John Green?

  Now, let me look this up real quick.

• 42:57Hank Green?

  It's Russia.

• 42:59John Green?

  Russian territory cut off from mainland Russia located on the Baltic Sea between Poland and Lithuania. Fat, I never, okay. So now I've, now I've embarrassed myself. Not only do I not know all the countries, I don't even know, I don't even know all of Europe.

• 43:13Hank Green?

  I mean, I feel like this is a pretty big deal. I'm sure that people in Estonia are like, yeah, and it is.

• 43:20John Green?

  Poor Meru's listening just like head in hands, just like, I can't believe this is happening right now. This is not making Meru like you as anymore.

• 43:28Hank Green?

  Weird, I'm like looking at the map and there's a country that doesn't have a name.

• 43:32John Green?

  Wow.

• 43:33Hank Green?

  Because it's Russia.

• 43:35John Green?

  All right, Hank, before we get to the all important news from Mars and AFC Wimbledon, we need to deal with something, which is that 4,000 people wrote in to the Dear Hank and Johnny email inbox, and we appreciate every single one of those emails at [email protected], specifically to talk to Ollie, who we talked to in episode 463 about their social media conundrum. Ollie was like, I've never had social media and now I'm going to college. I don't know if I should get it. And we were like, maybe you should get Snapchat. And at least 3,000 people wrote in and said, that's a terrible idea.

• 44:09Hank Green?

  Okay. Hopefully, Ollie has not in the meantime gotten Snapchat.

• 44:13John Green?

  I'll just read this one from Matty, who writes, I urgently and aggressively cannot emphasize enough how much Snapchat is the wrong answer to Ollie's question about social media. My qualification being that I graduated from college recently. Do not make yourselves responsible for Ollie being a man who has to say that the only social media he has is Snapchat. That is a very bad look, lol. I don't know why it's a very bad look, but the fact that it ended with a lol makes me think that it's a very, very bad look.

• 44:46Hank Green?

  Very bad look. Yeah, I don't like, is that for high schoolers? I don't know.

• 44:50John Green?

  Who knows? We don't know why it's a bad look. We're, we're too old to know, but it is a bad look.

• 44:55Hank Green?

  Really, you know what there should be, and I, I wish there was, is a way to have Instagram that is only DMs.

• 45:04John Green?

  You mean texting?

• 45:06Hank Green?

  Yeah, but like, I don't know, I get a lot of DMs on Instagram.

• 45:10John Green?

  I do too.

• 45:10Hank Green?

  And I don't want to get rid of that part of it. I talk to people on Instagram and I, but like, and, and also what I, what I want is for, if somebody sends me an Instagram reel, I want to be able to watch that reel and no others.

• 45:24John Green?

  Right, right, right. I, I want it to show, I want the app to like flame up the moment that the reel ends.

• 45:31Hank Green?

  I try to like scroll to the next one because it's like, of course I do, because I've, now I'm watching Instagram reels. And instead of actually showing me an Instagram reel, it just shows me like a picture of myself being like, you said you wouldn't do this.

• 45:45Hank Green?

  This is like, or I record the video, you know, like when I load this version of Instagram, it's the new version of Instagram and it's like, record a video telling yourself that you're not there to watch reels.

• 45:57Hank Green?

  And the moment you open reels, it's you and you're like, I told you, you're not here to watch reels.

• 46:04John Green?

  All right, Matty also writes, um, also, I think it's fine to have no social media TBH. It's kind of cool. Much more important really to have an iPhone so he can be added to group iMessages and keep the bubbles blue. Pinterest and PayPal, Matty.

• 46:18Hank Green?

  Well, boy, they really did lock that one in. Good job, Apple.

• 46:22John Green?

  So I do think that everyone seemed to agree, Ollie, that you will be fine without social media and that if anything, it might make you somewhat cool.

• 46:33Hank Green?

  Yeah, yeah. Be like, no, I've never done that. I have no, uh, internet footprint, which is just not the lifestyle I'm living, but I, I think that it is, it is like a cool thing now.

• 46:43John Green?

  And it's like the kids in the 90s who didn't smoke.

• 46:46Hank Green?

  Yeah, or like in the two, the early 2000s who, who liked, I don't watch TV.

• 46:51John Green?

  Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. I don't have time for it. I'm too busy smelling nature or whatever they were doing.

• 46:57Hank Green?

  Yeah, I read literature.

• 46:59John Green?

  Right, right, right.

• 47:00Hank Green?

  I also want to send a shout out to Carol Prince, who posted on the Nerd Fighter subreddit, uh, a, a version of the Brokeback Mountain, uh, movie poster that says Back Country Pass on it.

• 47:21John Green?

  It is genuinely a better movie title than Brokeback Mountain.

• 47:26Hank Green?

  I don't know, I think they're both good, you know?

• 47:29John Green?

  It's good. I mean, don't get me wrong. Brokeback Mountain is a great story, a great film. The only way it could have been improved if it was called Back Country Pass.

• 47:43Hank Green?

  Oh, man.

• 47:46John Green?

  That might be one of the greatest accidental jokes that, that's ever happened on this podcast.

• 47:51Hank Green?

  We're getting to that age, John, where we're just gonna start like mom calling Uma Thurman, Erna Thulman.

• 48:02Hank Green?

  You know, Erna Thulman? It's like, yeah, no, I know what you're exactly, it might as well be.

• 48:07John Green?

  Yeah.

• 48:08Hank Green?

  You know, you say Back Country Pass, everybody's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what you're talking about.

• 48:11John Green?

  I know what you're, I know what you're talking about.

• 48:12Hank Green?

  Yeah.

• 48:13John Green?

  Yeah, I wish I knew how to quit you.

• 48:16John Green?

  That's actually, that's what should come up every time I go to Twitter or Reddit or Facebook. It should just be the, I wish I knew how to quit you meme. That's the only thing I see no matter how far I scroll.

• 48:27Hank Green?

  Yeah, over and over again.

• 48:30Hank Green?

  They should, I mean, in a, in a real world, you'd be able to mod these things. You'd be able to create a version of Instagram that's just for DMing, because that's all I want. You'd be able to create a version of Twitter that's just, I wish I could quit you over and over again. That, that's the, that's the utopia we could have had.

• 48:52John Green?

  That's right. Instead, we have six rich men.

• 48:58John Green?

  All right, Hank, it's time for the all important news from Mars and AFC Wimbledon. I'll go first. AFC Wimbledon played their second League One game of the season and scored their first, just kidding, they still haven't scored a goal in two games.

• 49:11Hank Green?

  Well, you're not gonna score a lot of goals without those strong right feet that you just don't have anymore.

• 49:18John Green?

  We don't seem to have strikers at the moment. Um, we're currently in 23rd place with a negative three goal difference. We did get a point in that game because we tied 0-0, but I'm going to AFC Wimbledon this weekend and I trust that my presence, along with mom and dad's presence, will change their fortunes.

• 49:37Hank Green?

  And that's what we need. We need changed fortunes.

• 49:40John Green?

  Need changed, time for some changed fortunes. I've thought about it, Hank. I've thought, man, maybe they're looking to recruit a 49-year-old guy who wasn't very good in his prime.

• 49:54Hank Green?

  If it gets people to show up at the games, maybe.

• 49:56John Green?

  Yeah, well, no, the games sell out. I mean, AFC Wimbledon fans are incredibly loyal, considering what, what they've been through. Um, and I'm very excited overall about the AFC Wimbledon season. I just would like us to be able to score a goal, which we haven't done so far, which is a bit of a concern. Anytime you're looking two games in, you've watched 180 minutes of football and you haven't seen a goal. And you have it, to be fair, I think our two best chances were created by our center back, Ryan Johnson. And he's not supposed to be the chance creator. So, yeah, it's, uh, it's, it's all gonna come together, Hank. It's all gotta congeal. It's all gonna work out, but right now, it looks a little bit terrifying.

• 50:39Hank Green?

  Well, and news from Mars, John, I'm rereading the Mars trilogy. Kim Stanley Robinson's classic series that I loved so much as a teenager. And I have to say, I don't encourage people to reread the Mars trilogy specifically, uh, but I absolutely do encourage people to reread books that they loved when they were younger.

• 51:01John Green?

  Yeah.

• 51:02Hank Green?

  To, to have, like, I remember so much of this series because it was, they were probably like, my, the, the like, third, fourth and fifth novel I ever read. So, uh, so, so it was very impactful, you know, those first, first novels you read. And, uh, the other ones were Jurassic Park and Jurassic World, which were not super complex stories. And, uh, and these ones really are. And so reading it, I, I can feel and remember the way I reacted to things. And I'm like, that's so different from how I understand this part of the story now. And, uh, so, so like to see my own self through that, the lens of this book

• 51:46Hank Green?

  and to see how I've changed and like, to see which characters I resonate with now. And the characters, I hate it, hate it. I still hate some of the same characters, but some of them, I'm like, no, I totally understand this person's bitterness. And I was like, they're so whiny all the time. And now I'm like, no, they got absolutely, like the, the vision, their vision of the world got destroyed. And, uh, and so I'm just really, um, I'm enjoying it in a, in like several different ways at the same time. And it's, it's also very chill. It's like nice to be in a story that I just know and-

• 52:22John Green?

  Yeah.

• 52:23Hank Green?

  Spend my time there.

• 52:24John Green?

  That's great. I love rereading books because the, the words are the same, but I'm so different.

• 52:30Hank Green?

  Yeah, it's very interesting to see, to see a story, like a different story.

• 52:35John Green?

  I love it. I love it. All right, Hank, thank you for podding with me. Thanks to everybody for listening. You can email us your questions at [email protected].

• 52:43Hank Green?

  This podcast is edited by Linus Obenhouse. It's mixed by Joseph Tuna-Medish. Our marketing specialist is Brooke Shotwell. It's produced by Rosiana Halsrohas and Hannah West. Our executive producer is Seth Ratley. Our editorial assistant is Deboki Tragavarti. The music you're hearing now and at the beginning of the podcast is by the great Gonna Rolla. And as they say in our hometown, don't forget to be awesome.