09.10.26 Ask An Advisor With Wes Moss

Rapid Fire Q&A: The "Happiest Retiree" Pet Factor, RMD Alternatives, Fidelity’s New Annuity + More Questions Answered Welcome to our first monthly "Rapid Fire Thursday" episode of Ask an Advisor! Today, Wes Moss is opening up the listener mailbag to answer your direct financial questions. We’re covering a wide range of topics: from how pets fit into the "Happiest Retirees" research, to whether UTMA accounts or Trump Accounts beat out a classic 529 plan for college and savings goals. Plus, we address pension life insurance strategies, handling portfolio planning with reduced life expectancy, and how to navigate the infamous "Tax Torpedo" in retirement. Mentioned on the show: Required Minimum Distributions: How To Calculate, Rules The Biggest Investing Lesson From Trump Accounts - Clark Howard Best 529 College Savings Plans By State Roth IRA vs Traditional (Pre-Tax) IRA Calculator - Clark Howard All this and more on the September 10, 2026, Ask an Advisor “Rapid Fire” episode of the Clark Howard podcast. Submit your questions: WesMoss.com/ask We hope you enjoy our weekly Ask An Advisor episodes. Let us know what you think in the comments! Learn more about Wes: BOOKS BY WES MOSS Wes Moss, CFP® Wes Moss - Clark.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:42Speaker 02

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• 0:50Speaker 03

  Happy Thursday. Welcome to this bonus edition of Ask an Advisor. We're going to try to do this about once a month with Wes and I like to caught rapid fire.

• 1:01Speaker 04

  Hey Krista.

• 1:02Speaker 03

  Hello.

• 1:02Speaker 04

  Is it really rapid fire?

• 1:04Speaker 03

  Well, you know what it's like? I feel like it's like, remember the cereal Captain Crunch?

• 1:09Speaker 04

  Remember.

• 1:09Speaker 03

  Which is like a sugar bomb.

• 1:10Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 1:11Speaker 03

  I love those.

• 1:11Speaker 04

  Huge fan of them.

• 1:12Speaker 03

  Remember when they came out with berries only? The crunch berries? Like they just do the berries? This is like that. We're just doing the berries, just the questions.

• 1:20Speaker 04

  I love that. Do they still make Captain Crunch?

• 1:22Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:23Speaker 04

  It always cut my mouth. That was the, I loved it, but it was like.

• 1:26Speaker 03

  Oh, it's the roof of your mouth?

• 1:27Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:27Speaker 03

  Yeah. Interesting. Okay. We're going to go straight to questions and you submit these questions at wesmoss.com, W E S M O S S dot com slash ask. We're starting out with Jim in Georgia. I'm 68, working from home, part-time for a full-time salary. Nice. I have $3 million in retirement accounts, $1 million in brokerage accounts, no debt, and a paid off house and cabin for weekends and vacation. I love the happiest retirees concept and feel like it has focused me on what I've always been aspiring to. However, I feel that Wes is missing one big item of happiness. My dog, a Chihuahua Siberian Husky mix, who showed up in our garage as a puppy, is probably

• 2:10Speaker 03

  the biggest key to my happiness and health. I walk her three to four miles every morning, frequently listening to Clark Howard and Wes Moss. She is my closest social connection, my personal trainer, and is my most important activity. I'm wondering where pets show up in Wes's surveys of happiness.

• 2:28Speaker 04

  Oh my God, Jim.

• 2:30Speaker 03

  Love that.

• 2:30Speaker 04

  You are like the coolest happy retiree in the world. What is your dog's name, Jim?

• 2:35Speaker 03

  I know.

• 2:36Speaker 04

  So the answer is I have not studied pets specifically. You know why? Because you don't even need research to know that a dog is a wonderful thing in your life.

• 2:51Speaker 03

  If you are a dog person, yeah.

• 2:54Speaker 04

  Or if you're a cat person, right? Like if you're a cat or a dog person, either are huge things in your life. Now, no offense to cat people. You don't take your cat for a walk. You do take your Chihuahua for a walk. We have a big red lab, big Cody, who is a huge part of keeping me somewhat active when it comes to walks. And we have a little super mutt. She's a, we did like the little DNA test thing and she was like a King Charles spaniel and a pit bull and it came back as super mutt, which is a category. So she's a super, super mutt. Anyway, these dogs are wonderful things in our lives and they lead to other social activity.

• 3:35Speaker 04

  Outside of my house, there is a cool little park and every single day there are 20 or 30 people from the neighborhood down there with their dogs. So I haven't asked specifically, but I know, I would say there's no dispute that having a dog is so good in so many different ways, core pursuit wise and socialization. I think it counts as at least one, if not two core pursuits, because dogs matter to happy retirees. Maybe one day I'll do a new study specifically for animals and I'll put it with the color charts on retire sooner method.

• 4:14Speaker 03

  Okay. Mike, Mike in Arizona says, instead of using the 4% rule for annual withdrawals during retirement, why not just use life expectancy charts similar to the RMD chart? Less hassle and no calculations. I think your advice is spot on and well presented. I love Clark and Krista, but you have been a great addition to the podcast.

• 4:36Speaker 04

  Oh, thank you, Mike from Arizona. I appreciate it. And that's a good idea. I never thought about that. But if you look at the life expectancy divisor for RMDs, it is pretty cool because it does start out a lot like the 4% rule. Like year one, if you take the divisor and you look at it as a percentage, it's like 3.7%. And then it goes to 3.9, don't quote me on these exact numbers, then four and 4.2, et cetera. What's interesting about it though, Mike, is that it gets to when you're in your 90s, which makes sense, the divisor goes over 10%. So A, I like the idea. B, the RMDs are meant to totally drain your account.

• 5:20Speaker 04

  That's the one difference. It escalates. I don't want your account to totally get drained. That's not the point. That then we start to flirt with not having quite enough and that is what we want to avoid. The other thing is that it, remember it doesn't start until 73 and you may be 62 when you start pulling money out. There's a whole decade indifference on the RMD charts versus when you want to start taking money. But look, it's a cool guide, but then it gets to be super high percentage, seven, eight, nine, 10%. And if you now are only in your 70s and it's, or 80s at that point, it may be a little too, too high because it was designed to drain the whole account so that the government gets all their taxes.

• 6:05Speaker 04

  So maybe the first 10 years of that life expectancy chart are in line with the 4% rule. And then beyond that, it gets a little bit too aggressive, but very cool idea, Mike in Arizona.

• 6:16Speaker 03

  All right. Teetering in Texas says, hi Wes, first, thank you for joining the Clark crew. I'm not going to read all this, it's so sweet. Anyway, Teetering in Texas thinks you're a great addition. What is your opinion on Trump accounts? What if a 529 plan is more than amply funded? Would you suggest UTMA over a Trump account? What scenarios apart from the free $1,000 is the Trump account better than the UTMA? Thanks.

• 6:41Speaker 04

  Hey, Teeter in Texas. And by the way, Teeter does sound like a name that would be from Texas. I know there's a movie with a Teeter in it, I think.

• 6:50Speaker 03

  My great grandfather was Teeter.

• 6:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 6:52Speaker 03

  That was his nickname that he was known by.

• 6:54Speaker 04

  That's cool. Thank you for your question. What is the big difference? So think of it this way. I think tax wise may be the biggest thing, Teeter. Remember the UTMA accounts, if they get to be big. Now, if they're little, if you've got a small UTMA account and a small Trump account, minus the free $1,000 you get in the Trump account, they're pretty similar.

• 7:18Speaker 03

  Can you kind of explain each of them for people who don't know?

• 7:22Speaker 04

  Okay, so a Trump account is a, an account you can start immediately, as soon as somebody's born, 5K, you can contribute, mom, dad, parents, grandparents. Companies can even contribute, I think up to 2,500. And then it's, it acts very similarly to a, an IRA. So that at age 18, it becomes that kid's account who's now an adult. And really it has the same rules that if you take money out before 59 and a half, you get a, you get a 10% penalty. It's really meant to be a long-term retirement account. And then meanwhile, and this is, I think the big difference, it's all growing tax deferred. So dividends and interest are all in the crock pot. It's like a crock pot account.

• 8:07Speaker 04

  The UTMA account doesn't have that. And there's a certain exemption for a little bit of interest that you would get, but over a certain amount in a UTMA account, what is called the kitty tax kicks in because if you get a whole lot of, if these get to be big accounts, these UTMA's, and there's 10 grand in dividends or interest, et cetera, then that starts getting taxed at the parent rate. That's a big difference. So if it's going to be a substantial account over time, I like the simplicity and the tax deferredness of the Trump account.

• 8:47Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 8:47Speaker 04

  But they're, they're both good, but this one tax wise, I think is a little better, Trump account.

• 8:51Speaker 03

  Dana in Colorado says, I was recently introduced to your podcast with Clark Howard. I'm learning a lot. My husband retired this past June and I plan to retire in a year or so. Between the two of us, we have 2 million plus in 401K, only 5% in Roth and IRAs. We're debt free, our home is paid off. According to a financial advisor, once I retire, we will be under the 4% withdrawal rule. My question is about college savings for our grandchildren, another one. We currently have two, nine years and 19 months. I believe our budget can handle saving for college for them. Is a 529 our best route or something else we should consider?

• 9:28Speaker 04

  Hmm. Hey Dana in Colorado, your grandparent in a really cool spot here, ready to retire, going to have no debt, your withdrawal rates in check, so. You've got the flexibility here, Dana, to be able to save for your kids. I certainly for the, they both have a long way to go before college expenses start to kick in. I mean, the almost two-year-old, you've got 16 years at least. The nine-year-old, you've got, again, you've got another nine years before they get to 18. And that, to me, leans favorably towards the 529 account. If you were, if you have not saved at all, and all of a sudden you're saying you've got a college

• 10:12Speaker 04

  grandkid and they're already going to college, then it doesn't really help to put money to 529 plan, just to take it right out to pay for college. So in your case, you have time and grandkids have time for this money to accumulate and grow tax-deferred and come out tax-free. Because of the long, the time horizon of for when the money is going to get used, I do like the 529 account. The other way to look at it would just be good old-fashioned after-tax brokerage account that you could be saving and money could go towards them. But you're getting a lot of the benefits because of the time horizon year. So I would, I would be sticking with the 529 accounts.

• 10:56Speaker 03

  And Dana, make sure you buy directly through the 529 plan. I just looked at on Clark.com, we have every year or so, we analyze all the 529 plans in the states. And Colorado is on the honor roll. It doesn't get the highest, the highest dean's list, but it is on the honor roll. And there is an in-state tax benefit for you if you invest in that plan. So you can see more about it.

• 11:22Speaker 04

  It's a little bit of a tax incentive to do the Colorado plan.

• 11:25Speaker 03

  Yeah. If you go to Clark.com/529, anyone can go there and check out that list and what your state might offer you. Tom in Florida says, one of your latest podcasts, you said you always recommend taking the survivor benefit with a pension. I was told to make sure you have life insurance prior to making this decision, since it will usually always be cheaper than the amount your pension benefits are reduced. I know there are special circumstances, like if your health can make insurance too expensive, or if you waited too long to buy life insurance, but isn't it better if you planned with life insurance? So if the co-pensioner dies before you, or if you're divorced, you're still getting the higher benefit. Love the show and can't wait for my signed book to get here.

• 12:10Speaker 04

  Totally, Tom in Florida. So when you say that I said always, and I try not to use the word always, because there's almost never a time when always or never apply, because there's always exceptions. So you're, you're right here. I think that here's what happens usually, not always in real life. It's that we buy insurance, if we do buy insurance, we buy it as young as we can, in our twenties, thirties, maybe even forties or fifties. And usually the term of that insurance is run out by the time a pension becomes available.

• 12:52Speaker 04

  So usually by the time you're 65 and you've got to make that pension decision, life only or joint with rights of survivorship, your insurance has either run out or it's going to run out in the next few years. And by that time, Tom, it's prohibitively expensive to buy new insurance, to buy new life insurance. And that's the scenario that if I'm sitting down with a family and they're, they've come in and they say, gosh, I need help with this pension lump sum. Should I take the lump sum or should I take the pension and which pension option should I take? It's somewhat rare that they've got a lot of insurance coverage ahead of them.

• 13:33Speaker 04

  And that's why, for the most part, the joint survivor can really give you a lot of peace of mind in your overall planning. However, Tom, you're totally right. If you have an insurance policy, a million-dollar plan or $2 million plan that extends well into your retirement years, then you absolutely should consider the life-only amount, because you get the highest amount. God forbid something happens to you, well, the life insurance kicks in and that amount should be able to more than take over and supplement income for what your spouse may be losing in the pension. So you're right, mostly.

• 14:17Speaker 03

  Okay. All right, we'll take a quick break. We're going to come back with more questions.

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• 16:38Speaker 03

  Welcome back to Ask an Advisor Rapid Fire Edition, or maybe we'll call it something else. Wes shakes his head every time I say it, but I like it.

• 16:47Speaker 04

  I like the berries.

• 16:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 16:49Speaker 04

  It's just, but I almost like the Lucky Charms better. It's almost, it's just the Lucky Charms.

• 16:53Speaker 03

  Yeah, marshmallows only. All right. This question came in from David in Florida. Wes, you've touched on the topic of how long we expect to live when planning out our financial retirement, but I'd love to get your thoughts on a situation where a person expects a shorter-than-average lifespan. I'm 47 and suffered a spinal cord injury at the age of 23, which left my legs paralyzed. Due to some things that come along with paraplegia, the reality is that living much beyond 80 is probably out the window, even for a permanent wheelchair user who does everything right with their health and who otherwise has family longevity on their side. I've been fortunate enough to work and am coming up on almost 19 years without even

• 17:38Speaker 03

  a single day being unemployed. I have approximately $1.5 million saved for retirement, spread roughly equally between an IRA, a Roth IRA, and a regular taxable brokerage account. My house is paid off because my injury is permanent. My understanding is that I can basically turn on Social Security, disability, and Medicare at some point prior to 65. My SSDI amount will be approximately $3,800 per month, according to my SSA.gov account. My expenses are generally low. Given all of that, do you have any advice, specific or general, for someone like myself, who has a very low likelihood of retirement lasting into their 80s, 90s, or beyond? What, what savings do you have at the age of 45?

• 18:22Speaker 04

  That's enormous, David.

• 18:24Speaker 03

  And a paid-off house.

• 18:25Speaker 04

  Paid-off house, 500K in an IRA, 500 in a Roth, 500 brokerage, approximately. Yeah. David, I think you are being realistic about this. I mean, you would know more about your own longevity situation than anyone. So I'm taking your word for this. And is it smart to just take it into, take that into account and say, look, I want a plan to age 80? I don't think that's a crazy way to look at it at all. It's still a really long period of time, though. Let's say you work another three years and retire at 50. That's, that would be super early. Did he say when, how, when he wants to retire?

• 19:09Speaker 03

  He did not.

• 19:11Speaker 04

  And I guess this partially depends on how much you like working, but I think that you knowing and conservatively or prudently planning to age 80, there's some advantages to that, because you know you have a higher likelihood of knowing the amount of withdrawal you can have in any given year. And yes, SSDI, I don't know what age that would exactly kick in for you, but then that transitions eventually into Social Security. And that's a, that's a big number. I don't know what the age it shows on your Social Security statement, but if you really

• 19:48Speaker 04

  think about it, as soon as that kicks in, we know you would have, let's see, $1,005,000. And, and here's the thing, what it would do is it technically would make your withdrawal rate be able to be a little higher, because you're not planning to 100 or 95, you're planning to 80. So it's probably-

• 20:10Speaker 03

  And you know you're going to get $3,800 a month.

• 20:12Speaker 04

  So you probably have a higher likelihood to be at the five range, and 5% of $1,005,000 with no growth is 75K a year. And $3,800 a month, when that kicks in, is 45K a year. So we're at $130,000 and no mortgage, man.

• 20:33Speaker 03

  And low expenses.

• 20:36Speaker 04

  75 and 45 is, I'm sorry, 120, $120,000 a year.

• 20:42Speaker 04

  And a lot of that is tax, either non-tax or taxed advantage because you've got brokerage money, you've got Roth money, which again, gives you flexibility pre 59 and a half. And that's how I'd be looking at this is that it's realistic. You are the one that knows your health and your potential longevity. And it gives you, the advantage that comes with that is a higher with potential withdrawal rate per year, which means a sooner retirement and a sooner to stop work. And my research shows there's a 21% jump in the propensity of overall happiness once that happens.

• 21:21Speaker 03

  Once you know. Okay. Russell in New Mexico says, why are none of these statistical facts discussed when choosing between traditional and Roth retirement accounts? And here they are. Spouses outlive their husbands by several years. Most surviving spouses earn less taxable income, even when in the single filer tax category. And most divorced spouses earn less taxable income. Half of marriages end in divorce. All of these favor a traditional account for the spouse.

• 21:52Speaker 04

  Hmm. Russell in New Mexico. So spouses live longer. Check.

• 21:59Speaker 03

  Women generally. Yeah.

• 22:00Speaker 04

  Yeah. My spouse should live longer than me. Survive. What was the second thing? Surviving?

• 22:07Speaker 03

  Most surviving spouses earn less taxable income, even when in the single filer tax category.

• 22:15Speaker 04

  Mm hmm. Okay. Oh, I, oh, I see what you're saying, Russell. And then the third one was?

• 22:21Speaker 03

  Most divorced spouses earn less taxable income. Half of marriages end in divorce.

• 22:26Speaker 04

  Man, this is kind of like a melancholy question.

• 22:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 22:30Speaker 04

  Somebody, somebody changed the cereal from Lucky Charms to unfrosted mini wheats.

• 22:39Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 22:39Speaker 04

  Yeah. Like what your grandfather would eat.

• 22:41Speaker 03

  Those are brilliant. Yeah. Right. But the real question is, why aren't these discussed when choosing between a traditional and Roth retirement account? That's the main.

• 22:50Speaker 04

  Russell, here's the point that you're trying to make is that if, long-term, if you're a surviving spouse and you're in a super low tax bracket because you have low income, then why would you need a Roth when you're already in a low tax bracket? Which always goes back, I did say always.

• 23:09Speaker 04

  It goes back to taxes today versus taxes in the future. And if taxes today are higher than they're going to be in the future, and you're the 30 bracket today, but you're going to be in the 10% bracket in retirement, then the Roth doesn't make as much sense. If your taxes are flat or higher in the future, then the Roth does usually make sense. And this is why we've had a lot of conversations here on the Clark Howard Show, Ask an Advisor, that the Roth gets the moniker that it's this magical elixir and you're crazy if you don't do the Roth. And I get questions from people all the time, like, well, I heard I'm supposed to do a Roth. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Not necessarily.

• 23:53Speaker 03

  Well, Clark says he's the man from Roth. So yes, he adhered on this show a lot.

• 23:57Speaker 04

  That's true. But Clark also says is that it's got to make sense from a tax perspective.

• 24:04Speaker 03

  Right.

• 24:04Speaker 04

  And for some people it does, and some people it doesn't. I think you're crazy if you don't consider a Roth, not crazy to not have a Roth. Because if all of these life circumstances do happen, and look, plenty of spouses do have more income, plenty of people don't get divorced. Sometimes surviving spouses do earn more money. So that wouldn't apply. But in your case, in your set of variables, this is why financial planning is so unlimitedly complex and infinite answers, infinite situations, that if all of your situations came through, then you're right, the Roth may not be worth doing and the traditional may make sense.

• 24:48Speaker 03

  John in Florida says, hi Wes. Most boomers like me have our invested savings in mutual funds. The younger generations seem to prefer investing in ETFs. Does your firm only invest clients' money in ETFs? Should boomers look to convert from mutual funds to ETFs? Are there any inherent benefits other than real-time trading?

• 25:10Speaker 04

  You know, that's good. That's a cool thought, John in Florida. I don't know that that's the case, that most boomers are in mutual funds and not in ETFs. I don't know that that's the case. Every single year, you have seen money leave mutual funds and go into ETFs. So if you look at the data, it's not less money is overall in mutual funds and ETFs combined, it's that the percentage shifts every year, more and more and more towards ETFs. Now, part of that is that most of the new flows are going to ETFs, but it's also people converting and people saying, I don't want to stay in a mutual fund.

• 25:50Speaker 04

  I'd rather just find an equivalent ETF that's 50% less expensive, 70% less expensive. So people have made the shift because of cost and taxation. That's the other big part of it is that ETFs are typically way more tax advantageous than a mutual fund. So in the cases where, here's where people stay in mutual funds, John, is if you have a large embedded capital gain that's unrealized, then it's not worth it. Right? If you've got, if you put a hundred thousand dollars in a mutual fund and now it's worth 200K and the basis is still around 100, which by the way, that's another conversation because bases typically rise in mutual funds because you're getting a capital gain distribution.

• 26:35Speaker 04

  It adds back to your cost basis. But my point here is that in that situation, it's not worth selling a fund, paying 20, 30, 40 grand in taxes, just to get into a lower cost ETF. You'll never make the money back. But you also probably have, and there's a higher likelihood in mutual funds, that your basis isn't as low as you might think, because your basis typically gets added to as you're reinvesting, because you're paying capital gain distributions. So take a look, John, at your bases. And if there's not much taxable gain, then it usually makes some sense to take a look at ETF options that are less expensive and more tax advantageous.

• 27:19Speaker 04

  But typically not a great idea if the change requires you paying taxes. What does that mean? It means in a crock pot account, an IRA, super easy to do because you don't have to worry about the taxation.

• 27:31Speaker 03

  Alex in Georgia says, there is no West Stink segment, so I'll just ask you why. When discussing when to take social security strategies, do you not discuss the tax torpedo? Also, going into more depth on protecting your portfolio, at 64, I received a recent diagnosis that will likely limit my lifespan to 80, give or take. I'm also the lower lifetime earner than my wife. Even with those two variables, the tax torpedo is my main reason for waiting until 70 to take social security. I don't care if I have a little money on the table, I have until 70 to prepare for the tax torpedo, which on principle makes me want to avoid it by stockpiling funds where they can provide cash flow without triggering a higher AGI.

• 28:16Speaker 03

  I have precious metals that are taxed as ordinary income, which I can liquidate during this window with no other income at a very low effective tax rate. Then the balance can wait to be passed to my wife with a step up in basis, and she can then liquidate most of the rest tax-free and bulk up her savings to again, avoid the tax. It is my dream to pay no taxes and these gotchas designed into these retirement programs can be avoided only with proper planning. We will have no RMDs and she can sell assets in a taxable brokerage slowly over time at 0% long-term capital gains if needed, plus our decent sized Roth accounts. I've paid enough to the government, state and federal. Enough is enough.

• 28:59Speaker 04

  Yeah. So I don't know, there's always a tax situation, always a tax situation to consider, but I don't know what he's referring to in the tax torpedo. I don't know what he's referring to.

• 29:14Speaker 03

  I assume it's the capital gains and ordinary income you have to pay a lot of times on IRA money. And then I assume capital gains.

• 29:23Speaker 04

  Right. He's got Roth only. He's got individual accounts where he's right. If you keep your long-term capital gains under a certain level and your income under a certain level, you can get a 0% tax bracket. So there's no tax torpedo there. I mean, if you take social security at 62, Alex, and it's two grand a month.

• 29:47Speaker 04

  But then you wait till you're 70 and it's three grand a month. This 2K a month over time, you still end up with higher income at age 70 because now you have more income coming in. Maybe he's, Alex, you're referring to having overall taxes higher because at 62, you've kicked in social security. I don't know if I'd call that a, listen, I think here's a tax torpedo in my book. Taking 200 grand out to pay off a house from an IRA, that's a tax torpedo. That's why you don't usually want to do it.

• 30:23Speaker 03

  Right.

• 30:24Speaker 04

  Giant Roth conversion from an IRA or a 401K into a Roth, 100, 200, 300 grand. That's a tax torpedo. What you're talking about here is, and this is a great, I think, learning opportunity for all of us, is that measured planning and measuring smaller amounts of income in any given year, smaller withdrawals, smaller distributions, spread out over a longer period of time, keeps your tax rate low and you, you don't ever have to worry about a big tax torpedo where your tax rate goes up a bunch. That to me is a, going from the 10% bracket to the 30, that's a, that's getting hit by the torpedo.

• 31:06Speaker 03

  Right, right, right.

• 31:08Speaker 04

  If you're measuring your long-term capital gains, you've got qualified dividends that are favorable rate and you write about the step up in basis. You've done a lot of other things here, Alex, like a Roth, no regular IRAs or 401Ks, brokerage accounts that you're taking only a certain amount out in any given year. I think you've steered very clear of the tax torpedo. But I don't see how turning on social security at 62 puts you in the path of the missile.

• 31:45Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 31:45Speaker 04

  Because it's still measured. But yeah, cool question. Thank you for, thank you for asking.

• 31:50Speaker 03

  Richard in New York says, recently Clark had an expletive laden podcast where he discussed a new annuity offered by Fidelity that he thought might be a good option. The next day, you voiced a generally negative view of traditional annuities. I'm approaching retirement with about $3 million in 401K IRA split roughly equally between Roth and traditional. Do you think these new annuities could play a part in my retirement? How are the annuity payouts treated, are a Roth versus traditional?

• 32:20Speaker 04

  There's been a lot about these new annuity options within, now from my understanding, these are within 401K and 403B plans. So these are, these are not something that you would go out with an IRA and directly buy. So it's not a quote retail product. But I think the reason Clark may like these is that instead of big expenses to 3% a year and a lot of annuities, it's similar to what the Freedom Funds are already, which is a really low percentage, like a quarter percent or lower. And then you have the opportunity, when you would like to, but between a certain age span,

• 33:02Speaker 04

  I want to say up till age 78, you can convert a slice of the account into a payment stream. And that is a new enhanced level of flexibility from what typically I've seen over the course of the last 20 years in the annuity world, which is, hey, you've got, you're going to buy it in an IRA and you're going to take a certain money out, buy the annuity, the money goes to them, you get a payment stream. This just gives us more flexibility to say, maybe I want to have 25% of my 401K and convert that sliver into an income stream and you're not in a big expensive annuity. So I think that's the nuance and the, in the evolution of these getting more consumer friendly.

• 33:48Speaker 04

  And I think that is something that anybody can consider if it's available in your particular plan. But remember, Richard, it's still the same big fundamental question, which is turning over a chunk of your money forever in exchange for a payment plan. And that in itself can be a good thing or a bad thing. If you live only, if you annuitize a portion and you're getting a payment and you don't live a long period of time and maybe you didn't do a period certain, then the annuity company wins. It's all based on these life insurance tables. And remember, the actuarial math always still favors the annuity company when you're looking at a pool of people.

• 34:33Speaker 04

  But it does give us some peace of mind. And if, I believe the insurance companies that are involved in this are the, are the big, robust insurance companies. Because the other thing about annuities to remember is that the guaranteed quote payment you're getting is still from a company. And companies aren't guaranteed to survive for your lifetime. Now, big, strong, established companies should be able to. And there are regulations in place for annuities and it's a very regulated industry. But just remember, when you're swapping over a big chunk of money in exchange for a payment stream, there's a, there's still a lot of things to consider. One of them is not having access to that money. Two, how long are you going to live?

• 35:18Speaker 04

  But as the costs go down for these and the flexibility goes up, I think they're worth considering.

• 35:26Speaker 03

  Okay, that is it for this episode of Ask an Advisor, rapid fire, just the marshmallows, whatever you want to call it.

• 35:34Speaker 04

  Just the Lucky Charms.

• 35:35Speaker 03

  Just the Lucky Charms. All right. I hope that you enjoyed this and you'll share this with a friend if you did. And if you learned something new today, we really appreciate everyone who listens, comments. And please visit wesmoss.com/ask to submit your questions to us. Keep them coming. We love it. Hope you have a great rest of your day.