Erin & Sara Foster

Erin and Sara Foster (Nobody Wants This, The World’s First Podcast, Favorite Daughter) are producers, entrepreneurs, and podcast hosts. Erin and Sara join the Armchair Expert to discuss thinking their dad was unimpressive next to Goldie Hawn, refusing to join their family’s reality show, and Sara starting therapy after Erin’s intervention. Erin, Sara, and Dax talk about the temptation to buy podcast views, why listeners prefer their episodes without guests, and building a business around people knowing the real them. Erin and Sara explain why money doesn’t erase childhood hurt, how one story from their dad changed Erin’s understanding of being loved, and why winning a fight can still feel like losing. Start your 2 month free trial today: https://youtube.com/premium . Terms Apply. Cancel Anytime. Check Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds: https://www.allstate.com/ See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dax Shepard?

  Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, Experts on Expert. I'm Dan Shepard. I'm joined by Lily Padman.

• 0:05Speaker 01

  Hello.

• 0:05Dax Shepard?

  Today, we have Monica's parasocial best friends on.

• 0:08Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 0:10Dax Shepard?

  Erin and Sarah Foster.

• 0:11Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 0:12Dax Shepard?

  Uh, the Foster Sisters.

• 0:13Speaker 01

  Correct.

• 0:14Dax Shepard?

  Erin, of course, is the creator of Nobody Wants This.

• 0:17Speaker 01

  Which is, this is Nobody Wants This Week.

• 0:19Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 0:19Speaker 01

  So, we had the cast on. Yes, and you do.

• 0:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 0:23Speaker 01

  Uh, we have the cast on Monday, and so today, we have our experts on, Erin and Sarah.

• 0:29Dax Shepard?

  Yes, and so Sarah is also a producer on the show. They also have, um, an incredible clothing line called...

• 0:36Speaker 01

  Favorite Daughter.

• 0:37Dax Shepard?

  Favorite Daughter. They also have a podcast called The World's First Podcast. They're as entertaining as two siblings could possibly get. Obviously, Nobody Wants This, out now on Netflix. I'm sure you've already seen it. If not, get with the program. Great third season. Please enjoy Erin and Sarah Foster. This episode is presented by YouTube Premium. YouTube is already great, but Premium supercharges it. If you like YouTube, you'll love Premium. Try YouTube Premium for two months free at youtube.com/premium. Trial eligibility varies. Terms apply. Cancel anytime. Now, let's get into today's episode. We get support from Quince.

• 1:18Speaker 01

  I have to say, I am so ready for fall. I want sweaters. I've been craving a true crisp morning where I actually need a jacket. I can't wait.

• 1:27Dax Shepard?

  I'm fully there. The second it dips below 70, I'm like, this is my season. Give me the layers, give me the boots, give me a reason to wear something other than a t-shirt. And honestly, that's why I love Quince, because fall is when your wardrobe actually has to show up. And everything at Quince is 50 to 80% less than similar brands. We're talking 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters, starting at $60.

• 1:50Speaker 01

  $60. $60 for cashmere that you'd expect from a luxury brand without the luxury price tag. It's amazing. Gets me every time. It really shouldn't be real, but it is, because they go straight to the factories, they skip the middlemen, and they just hand you the savings. The stuff isn't trendy. It's the kind of pieces you grab over and over because they work every time.

• 2:08Dax Shepard?

  The 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters for me are it. When I look at Steve McQueen, this man owned a couple of sweaters he wore all the time, and he looks iconic.

• 2:17Speaker 01

  It's a uniform.

• 2:18Dax Shepard?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:18Speaker 01

  And Quince isn't just about the clothes. They have hotel-quality bedding, cookware, bath essentials, thoughtfully-designed furniture. You can really go there and outfit your entire apartment or house. So, if you're in need of any kind of fall refresh at home, too, same quality, same attention to detail for every corner of your life.

• 2:36Dax Shepard?

  Find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Armchair Expert. It's the best way to support the show.

• 3:12Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 3:13Dax Shepard?

  Hello.

• 3:14Speaker 01

  Should we grab Sarah?

• 3:16Dax Shepard?

  How are you? Welcome.

• 3:19Speaker 02

  I decided to take the number one seat.

• 3:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Smart, smart, smart.

• 3:23Speaker 01

  That's what I wanted for you. We're gonna get into it.

• 3:26Dax Shepard?

  We're gonna establish you as number one, as favorite sister, favorite daughter.

• 3:30Speaker 01

  Favorite Daughter.

• 3:31Dax Shepard?

  Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. All queued up. Tell us about, uh, I think it's all equal.

• 3:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's all mediocre.

• 3:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. None of it's flattering.

• 3:42Speaker 02

  Everyone looks really good.

• 3:43Speaker 01

  That's very nice. Are we live? We're ABR, but we will cut. Oh, we don't.

• 3:47Speaker 02

  What does ABR mean?

• 3:48Dax Shepard?

  Always be recording. You guys don't do video, right?

• 3:51Speaker 01

  They do.

• 3:52Dax Shepard?

  Or you do do video. I listened to you.

• 3:54Speaker 02

  We do, but just nobody watches them.

• 3:55Speaker 01

  I do.

• 3:56Dax Shepard?

  You're watching them?

• 3:57Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 3:57Dax Shepard?

  Okay, yeah, let's just start there, because Monica has become recently a very obsessed with YouTube. She's having a parasocial relationship with YouTube, and do you already know that?

• 4:06Speaker 02

  I know it, but she and I have taken it into IRL.

• 4:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my goodness.

• 4:10Speaker 01

  But I just met Sarah for the first time yesterday, so we're not there yet. Yeah, of course. They're both stunning.

• 4:17Speaker 02

  You expected prettier.

• 4:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, what was your first? You are taller. I mean, I knew you were tall. I heard about that.

• 4:24Dax Shepard?

  Heard about your height.

• 4:25Speaker 01

  I heard the rumor that you were tall.

• 4:26Dax Shepard?

  Your height precedes you.

• 4:27Speaker 01

  That's right. But tall people really, in person...

• 4:30Dax Shepard?

  They pop.

• 4:30Speaker 02

  Get even taller.

• 4:31Speaker 01

  You're taller than I expected as well. Well, but I'm five feet tall.

• 4:34Speaker 02

  I have a tall presence, but I'm actually only five, six and a half. So, I'm actually not really rocking that much tight.

• 4:40Dax Shepard?

  That must be above average, though.

• 4:42Speaker 02

  It is. It's above average.

• 4:43Dax Shepard?

  I think nationally.

• 4:43Speaker 02

  Average nationally is like 5'3" or 5'4", right?

• 4:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so you're, you're quite a bit above. And how tall are you, Sarah?

• 4:49Speaker 01

  I don't know. Erin has two lights, and I have one. Like, I just, so I need your audience to know, your viewers to know, she has two lights. We're gonna let them know. We are letting them know.

• 4:59Dax Shepard?

  But when we go into the DI, we're going to increase the exposure on you. This whole thing gets run through.

• 5:05Speaker 01

  Well, and your loyalty's to me. Let's be clear.

• 5:07Dax Shepard?

  Well...

• 5:08Speaker 02

  No, no, your history runs a little deep.

• 5:10Dax Shepard?

  One of you employs my wife now, so that certainly...

• 5:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, wow, things are heating up quick.

• 5:16Dax Shepard?

  This is gonna get...

• 5:18Speaker 01

  Okay, it's gonna get nasty.

• 5:19Dax Shepard?

  It's gonna get Sophia's choicy.

• 5:21Speaker 02

  You guys should get into your history.

• 5:23Speaker 01

  It's a house of...

• 5:23Dax Shepard?

  Well, first, I want to hear more about, okay, so when did you start listening to The World's First Podcast? And did you tell them we almost did the exact same title? We were going to be...

• 5:33Speaker 02

  The World's Last?

• 5:33Dax Shepard?

  The 1,000,000th Podcast was gonna be the name of our...

• 5:36Speaker 01

  But you were very early.

• 5:37Dax Shepard?

  But we already felt very late.

• 5:40Speaker 02

  You already felt late at that point, right?

• 5:41Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yes. In 2018, you already had Chris Hardwick, you already had Maren, you already had Rogan. We felt late.

• 5:47Speaker 01

  When you started, I literally was like, what's a podcast? And why is Dax Shepard doing a podcast?

• 5:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, I thought you were sort of the first podcast.

• 5:53Dax Shepard?

  We were gonna do the 1,000,000th, because I was embarrassed about being so late. And I think you had a similar embarrassment, right? So, it's like, you try to make the joke first.

• 6:00Speaker 02

  Exactly. We wanted to do something in the vein of Nobody Wants This.

• 6:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, nobody asked for that.

• 6:05Speaker 02

  Nobody asked for this, and it already existed. And so, this was like our fifth choice.

• 6:10Speaker 01

  I kind of hate the name of our podcast.

• 6:12Dax Shepard?

  I love it.

• 6:13Speaker 02

  I know.

• 6:13Speaker 01

  You do.

• 6:14Dax Shepard?

  You don't like it.

• 6:14Speaker 01

  It just doesn't feel like us.

• 6:16Speaker 02

  I agree.

• 6:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I kind of hate it. Could we change it?

• 6:19Dax Shepard?

  Should we launch a rebrand now, a real-time rebrand?

• 6:21Speaker 02

  Well, we asked our audience about a rebrand, because we thought we would switch it to Fatigue Sisters Podcast.

• 6:26Speaker 01

  Because we're always tired.

• 6:27Speaker 02

  And people didn't want it.

• 6:29Speaker 01

  People don't like change. Don't want to throw that.

• 6:32Dax Shepard?

  Moni, when did you, what was your first episode? What was the context? Why?

• 6:36Speaker 01

  Well, obviously, I knew about Erin and Sarah.

• 6:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 6:39Speaker 02

  Well, that's not obvious.

• 6:40Dax Shepard?

  They're global brands.

• 6:40Speaker 01

  From the zeitgeist, and also from the show. So, I knew about you guys.

• 6:45Speaker 02

  Oh, right, of course, of course, because of that. Okay.

• 6:48Speaker 01

  No, but also from the zeitgeist. But I don't think I really knew about the podcast, and I was just listening to one of my own pop culture podcasts, and I think I was just like, served it.

• 6:59Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my goodness.

• 7:00Speaker 01

  It just appeared in my ears.

• 7:01Speaker 02

  That's good for our marketing.

• 7:03Speaker 01

  We need to pay for that.

• 7:04Dax Shepard?

  Do you pay for that?

• 7:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know, we need to pay for that.

• 7:05Speaker 02

  I don't think we do.

• 7:06Speaker 01

  And I just said to somebody, we gotta start paying for some views. And so, because you guys...

• 7:10Speaker 02

  We need to like get shady or something.

• 7:12Speaker 01

  No, guys, are you not aware of the thing?

• 7:14Speaker 02

  Sarah's always calling our people, being like, guys, get the bots, do the things, like buy stuff, like do it.

• 7:18Speaker 01

  I just heard, I won't say the name.

• 7:20Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 7:21Speaker 01

  But it is a very popular podcast. Way more popular than ours. I don't know if it's more popular than yours. Maybe not. We're gonna need the name in a minute. Is it?

• 7:28Dax Shepard?

  You didn't comment, but go ahead.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  We'll, we'll cut that, but is it?

• 7:32Dax Shepard?

  She didn't comment.

• 7:32Speaker 02

  By the way, Monica offers to cut things really quickly.

• 7:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I did tell.

• 7:37Speaker 02

  You're the meat. You're the meat.

• 7:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, I want people to feel comfortable.

• 7:40Dax Shepard?

  But she's probably the reason we still have a show nine years later.

• 7:43Speaker 01

  I am the one that does the cutting, so I get to...

• 7:45Dax Shepard?

  I would have been run out of town like 350 times.

• 7:48Speaker 01

  Thank God, thank God. You always yell at me when I do this.

• 7:51Speaker 02

  Sarah always starts with someone, goes, by the way, by the way, we'll cut anything you don't like. And I was like, shut up, Sarah. Like, let her like say something she regrets, and then we get big views.

• 7:59Speaker 01

  Erin's always looking for like the National Enquirer.

• 8:01Speaker 02

  I, I think it puts in people's heads before you even start talking, oh, I might say something that I would regret. And so, it makes, at least I think, people a little bit more aware of what they're saying.

• 8:13Speaker 01

  That's interesting.

• 8:13Dax Shepard?

  Interesting. I have the opposite point of view, which is like, if I tell you, like, anything you regret tomorrow talking about, it's gone. Now, you're not talking with this self-governing. Like, if you actually trust me, or you trust Monica, because she said it, I hope that then you're not governed, and then you drive home and the opposite happens, which is like, oh, I talked about that thing I normally wouldn't have talked about, but I think that went kind of well, and I think people will receive it well. That's certainly more often the case for us.

• 8:37Speaker 01

  But also, I never offer it unless someone's starting to, like, we don't normally say it. Unless someone's like, uh, you can tell they're thinking about maybe saying something. Like, just say, it's fine, we'll cut anything.

• 8:49Speaker 02

  Right, right, right.

• 8:49Dax Shepard?

  But go back to what you heard.

• 8:50Speaker 01

  Just, I heard, somebody said to me, they go, you know that people only listen to an average of four minutes of each of her episodes.

• 8:58Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 8:59Speaker 01

  And I was like, so it's all clips and these clip farms. And so there's this whole world, which I've just recently learned about, which I didn't know. We're not over here like, mm, how can we, which maybe we all should be. Yeah, where it's like these agencies, which I'm looking to employ, that will, that make it.

• 9:18Dax Shepard?

  Call me. Goose it, goose the numbers.

• 9:19Speaker 01

  But make it look like millions of people are posting about your show when no one gives a shit about your show.

• 9:24Dax Shepard?

  So I too am fascinated with it. Swear to God, we have never done anything remotely like it. I've been so tempted. We have a threshold. There's a point where it would cost us a lot of money to not do that, right?

• 9:34Speaker 02

  Your clips go deep. Like, these clips, the video clips really create a lot of conversation from the show.

• 9:41Dax Shepard?

  On this one?

• 9:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:43Dax Shepard?

  That's lovely. But I, of course, in moments of panic, like, I don't know, is there a farm? And I'm shady, right?

• 9:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:48Dax Shepard?

  But ultimately, I've never done anything. And I do think it's gonna come out. So without saying which podcast, I can tell you Dr. Mike. Do you guys know Dr. Mike?

• 9:56Speaker 02

  No.

• 9:57Dax Shepard?

  He's incredible. He's one of like the top 10 YouTubers. He's the most gorgeous doctor you've ever seen. He's in New York City. He won Sexiest Doctor a bunch of times.

• 10:05Speaker 02

  Who gives out Sexiest Doctor awards?

• 10:06Dax Shepard?

  It was one of those pop, like, pop sugary type.

• 10:09Speaker 01

  Very reputable source.

• 10:10Dax Shepard?

  Anyways, he was telling me a certain show who supposedly has millions of things. He said, I want you to look at what the average comment ratio is for a show with a million downloads.

• 10:20Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 10:20Dax Shepard?

  And now I want you to look at this person's comment section. There's not one comment on any of these episodes that supposedly have millions of downloads. And I went, oh, that's fascinating. And I'm so glad I sat it all out, because I do think at some point there'll be some exposes. I think some of them are a little suspicious.

• 10:38Speaker 01

  That's what we'll hire. We'll hire a journalist to look into this.

• 10:41Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's what we'll pay for it.

• 10:43Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, we need a little more integrity around all of it, right? That's how I'm feeling about like all these facelifts. I'm like, it's not fair. Just tell us, because then you make all of us who haven't done it feel like crap. Okay, but Sarah. Just tell us. Do you think this is because, not to get deep so quickly,

• 10:57Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 10:58Speaker 01

  but you're so gorgeous and you have been known for being so gorgeous your whole life, that, you're like, go on.

• 11:05Dax Shepard?

  Tell me more.

• 11:06Speaker 01

  Keep going. But really, and I understand this.

• 11:09Dax Shepard?

  What specifically are they saying is gorgeous?

• 11:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. What? Is it the eyes?

• 11:15Dax Shepard?

  No, let me guess. It's my eye?

• 11:17Speaker 01

  No, but that, you are a natural beauty and people are paying and are able to recreate some. And if I were you, I might be like, that is unfair. If you have these natural things and other people can pay to just get them all of a sudden.

• 11:32Speaker 02

  You're like, I was born with it.

• 11:33Speaker 01

  Exactly. And like, you're born with other good things, so you have your good things and I have my good things. And let's just like stay in our lanes. Is that possible?

• 11:40Dax Shepard?

  Hmm. I've never seen Monica this hard hitting. I think it's the parasocial relationship. She's really going hard.

• 11:47Speaker 01

  I don't know. I mean, listen, I think, no, I think aging is an interesting thing. Yeah, you do kind of get to a point where you're looking at people who are older than you that are starting to look younger than you. You reach that point and you're like, the fuck? Like, in order to like stay on this playing field, do I need to go now like get a facelift? I'm 45. The clip farms, it's all the same thing. It's like, what's going on? Everyone's cheating the system. Everyone's, which, by the way, I mean, people are looking good. Of course. People are not aging, you guys. Yeah, it is weird.

• 12:18Speaker 02

  I think they're aging weird.

• 12:19Speaker 01

  Well, some, some, some.

• 12:20Dax Shepard?

  Well, I think a more fascinating current thing is how many men are now doing it? And how differently we feel about men's faces changing than we do about women's faces changing.

• 12:30Speaker 01

  Men should not be cutting their eyelids.

• 12:32Speaker 02

  I don't like it.

• 12:33Speaker 01

  Let me be clear. Men, if you cut your eye, you didn't cut your eyelids, right?

• 12:36Dax Shepard?

  No, I haven't.

• 12:37Speaker 01

  Okay, great.

• 12:38Dax Shepard?

  I might though.

• 12:38Speaker 01

  Do not cut, men who cut their eyelids.

• 12:41Speaker 02

  I just think men looking a little weathered is handsome and women looking a little weathered is less socially acceptable.

• 12:48Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 12:49Dax Shepard?

  I'll co-sign on that observation.

• 12:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:51Speaker 01

  Okay, back to my parasocial relationship.

• 12:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry.

• 12:54Speaker 01

  So I got served.

• 12:55Speaker 02

  And you liked what you saw.

• 12:56Speaker 01

  I liked what I heard. And I was like, oh, these girls are fun, they're funny. And then something turned into a new gear. And it was so embarrassing. It's so embarrassing. I can't believe I'm saying it.

• 13:10Dax Shepard?

  Half of our fact checks are about you guys.

• 13:12Speaker 01

  Fact checks?

• 13:13Dax Shepard?

  This show has a fact check every episode, which is basically us doing what you guys do on your show. We just shoot the shit. And half of what Monica talks about is updates about you two that she's learned from the podcast the night before. And I'm like, this is lovely and I love them, but at some point, our show has to be about our show.

• 13:27Speaker 02

  Right, can't always be our show.

• 13:29Speaker 01

  Monica, the first time you mentioned us.

• 13:31Speaker 02

  I wish our numbers were like getting boosted from this.

• 13:33Speaker 01

  I mean, I would hope that they would. Sometimes I do have that power. You do have a lot of power, because the first time you mentioned us, Montana, who runs our production company, who has been with us forever. She started as an assistant, was like, oh, she sent a group chat. She was like, you guys.

• 13:45Speaker 02

  Monica just mentioned you guys.

• 13:46Speaker 01

  Monica just mentioned you guys.

• 13:48Dax Shepard?

  The all-powerful Monica.

• 13:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it was like, it was a very big deal.

• 13:51Speaker 02

  Big deal in the house.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was a big deal.

• 13:54Speaker 02

  So we appreciate you. And now you and I are friends.

• 13:57Dax Shepard?

  Did the show, I was gonna ask this much later, but did the wild success of Nobody Wants This up your numbers at all?

• 14:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:05Speaker 01

  Not really. I mean, I think maybe a little bit, but not maybe like what you would think it would do.

• 14:09Speaker 02

  I don't know. I don't fully pay attention to the numbers as much as this one does, but.

• 14:13Speaker 01

  Someone's got it.

• 14:13Speaker 02

  It definitely changed our favorite daughter sales.

• 14:16Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 14:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:17Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wonderful.

• 14:18Speaker 02

  Which was an unexpected consequence. It was great. I mean, it changed everything.

• 14:23Dax Shepard?

  If you had to pick what, I mean, I feel like I know the answer, but if you had to pick which one was a massive success, it would be Favorite Daughter, no?

• 14:30Speaker 02

  Which company?

• 14:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 14:31Speaker 02

  Between the podcast and the clothing?

• 14:34Speaker 01

  Favorite Daughter is a massive.

• 14:35Speaker 02

  The podcast is not really about size.

• 14:38Speaker 01

  Successful.

• 14:39Speaker 02

  No, well.

• 14:42Speaker 02

  I was just gonna say, the podcast is sort of.

• 14:44Speaker 01

  Like, it's just not. I don't know.

• 14:46Dax Shepard?

  But relative to what? I mean, again, there's 10 million, there's like, there's 9,900,000 podcasts that would fucking cut off a toe to have your numbers, guaranteed.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  But I think the point is that for us, Favorite Daughter is a business. Like, that is a business for us, that we started as a business. The numbers are very important. The growth is very important. We have a financial partner. It is absolutely.

• 15:07Speaker 01

  It's the only thing we own.

• 15:08Speaker 02

  Profit focused. The podcast for us is a way for us to connect to people who will watch the show, who will buy the clothes. But really, just, it's sort of like this quiet undercurrent underneath the businesses that we're working on. And it's not something we really look at as a big stream of income or a business that's supposed to be huge.

• 15:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I think it's like community building around the other brands you already have.

• 15:29Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 15:29Speaker 01

  But it works, because then people like you.

• 15:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:32Speaker 01

  And so then they want to support you.

• 15:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:34Speaker 01

  And it's the only place to know us, because Erin's basically not on social media. I'm not doing lives or, we're not on YouTube. We post when we want to post, we don't, we don't. It's a lot of like, buy this at Favorite Daughter, but we're not really speaking to anybody in any channel of our lives, except for the podcast. I want more solos. I want them to all be solos.

• 15:56Speaker 02

  I know, everyone says that.

• 15:57Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 15:58Speaker 01

  Solos is just when it's them, when they're not interviewing.

• 16:01Dax Shepard?

  I listened to a couple solos.

• 16:02Speaker 01

  That's the part that's like very interesting and hooky. People don't even want celebrities. It's interesting.

• 16:06Speaker 02

  Well, because Sarah's really weird with them. Sarah's very, she's too nice to celebrities. She's too nice. She doesn't want, she sits there and praises them the whole time. She never wants to like.

• 16:14Speaker 01

  The whole time. I literally kiss their ass. I'm like, they're number one fan, even if I can't even name one thing they've ever been in.

• 16:20Speaker 02

  The snooziest interview you've ever heard.

• 16:23Speaker 01

  I'm literally, what's your favorite, we had Kris Jenner on. This is someone we've known since we were children, okay? And, and I'm like, Erin, just like be cool. And we know her very well. I was trembling. I was like, Kris, like, tell us, like, what's your favorite color? Oh, no! And then Erin goes, alright, so when you guys are flying private, who pays? There you go. Erin, and I literally, Erin.

• 16:45Dax Shepard?

  You're being rude.

• 16:46Speaker 01

  How dare you put her on the spot like that?

• 16:48Speaker 02

  Like, Sarah, this could be a clip. Let her answer.

• 16:51Speaker 01

  I was sweating, like you cannot.

• 16:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:54Dax Shepard?

  When you guys meet people, who do they think is the older sister?

• 16:58Speaker 02

  Sometimes they do think that I'm the older sister.

• 17:00Speaker 01

  But it's also like rude to be like, you're older, right? Like, I think people don't really do that.

• 17:04Speaker 02

  I don't know. I mean, we're.

• 17:07Dax Shepard?

  I mean, like, you're 18.

• 17:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, 17 or 18 months difference.

• 17:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so who gives a fuck? It's not like it's offensive one way or another.

• 17:12Speaker 01

  I wear a lot of crop tops.

• 17:14Speaker 02

  She looks more immature, so I think people assume that I'm like the older, wiser sister.

• 17:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I was gonna say, you have more of a serious vibe that could read as older.

• 17:21Speaker 01

  I'll do like a side pony in crop top, you know?

• 17:24Dax Shepard?

  But I was delighted to learn today, because I think it could explain some similarities between you and I. You're a middle child.

• 17:29Speaker 02

  I am a middle child. You're a middle child.

• 17:31Dax Shepard?

  I'm a middle child.

• 17:32Speaker 02

  Out of three?

• 17:32Dax Shepard?

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:33Speaker 02

  Boys or girls?

• 17:34Dax Shepard?

  Older brother, younger sister. But a pretty big gap between both. You're 18 months and then what's?

• 17:39Speaker 02

  Jordan is three years younger than me, so five years younger than Sarah.

• 17:42Dax Shepard?

  Okay, still pretty close.

• 17:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm very, very middle child. I take on the task of wanting slash forcing everyone to get along or be together.

• 17:55Speaker 01

  The family sheriff.

• 17:56Speaker 02

  Sarah screamed at me once and said, no one elected you sheriff, so get the fuck off your soapbox.

• 18:02Speaker 01

  Sheriff is a word that Dax likes to throw around a lot as well.

• 18:06Dax Shepard?

  For both of us.

• 18:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, really?

• 18:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, we got a lot of sheriff vibes here.

• 18:10Speaker 01

  Too many sheriffs in the whole ecosystem over here, but, okay, I'm gonna get deep with you now.

• 18:16Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 18:16Speaker 01

  I think that that dynamic, which is clear and understandable, I feel like sometimes you're looking for Sarah to let you down.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  Monica? Sorry, and I also will say.

• 18:30Speaker 02

  Monica, should we get into a, are you single?

• 18:32Speaker 01

  And also, Sarah, you do fly first class, okay? So I'm just gonna even out the playing field here.

• 18:40Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 18:40Speaker 01

  But, and I mean it for your sake. I think you have an expectation that maybe she can't fill. And instead of just being like, that's just her, she's not gonna do that, it like hurts you.

• 18:53Speaker 02

  And then I try to like force her to do the thing that I wanted her to do and it doesn't work.

• 18:57Speaker 01

  You for that. Where have you been all of our lives? I'm here. Right here.

• 19:01Dax Shepard?

  Same treatment to yourself is what my guess would be. Been pretty brutal on yourself?

• 19:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 19:07Dax Shepard?

  You can kind of only extend to other people as much as you're extending yourself in some way. So it's like, it might be an internal.

• 19:13Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 19:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 19:14Speaker 02

  But interestingly, I had an experience, I don't know, a few months ago in Nashville, where I tried to do it differently with Sarah. We had a work trip, we were opening our store in Nashville, and Simon was gonna be there, we were bringing our daughter, Sarah was bringing her daughter, we had this like work thing on, I don't know, it was like a Thursday. And I really wanted us to turn it into a weekend family trip, where we go and we stay at a hotel on the weekend, spend the time there, bring all the kids, the cousins. Our dad was gonna be there with his son, who's the same age as like our kids. So we were like gonna turn it into a cute thing. And I already was ready for Sarah to go, I'm not doing that. I just wanna go back home, I'm not doing it. Cause sometimes it's like Sarah controls the cards because she is the no.

• 19:57Speaker 01

  Right.

• 19:57Speaker 02

  And then it like stops everything.

• 19:58Dax Shepard?

  She has a veto.

• 19:59Speaker 02

  She has the veto. And before I had a child, which is still kind of recent, two years, she had all the control because she had the kids.

• 20:06Speaker 01

  Oh, sure.

• 20:07Speaker 02

  So I had like nothing to bring to the table. So then I really wanted to like hold tightly. But I called Sarah, I said, I found this really cute hotel. And I was like, felt myself like getting all like stressed about her saying no. And I really want us to do this thing, and I already, there's cottages, and I looked them up, and I think that you're gonna like them. I'm holding just two rooms. And she was like, I don't know, Erin, I don't know if I wanna do that. Like, I don't know, the place doesn't look that good. Like, I, she started doing her thing. And Simon had a little bit warned me of like, just let her do what she's gonna do, we can still have a nice time.

• 20:37Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 20:37Speaker 02

  So I said, okay, Sarah, you know what? No pressure. You have the link, whatever you wanna do, that's what you're gonna do. And I went ahead and I booked it for ourselves. The other family members wanted to do it. I was sad thinking about her daughter Josie not being able to be part of it, which is a big part of my wanting to control it. But I just was like, I'm letting it go. And guess what this bitch did? She booked that place.

• 20:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:00Speaker 02

  She got the hotel, she stayed all weekend.

• 21:02Dax Shepard?

  She showed up with a big smile.

• 21:03Speaker 01

  Well, I didn't get the cottage, that was very expensive. I stayed in the main hotel, which actually ended up being great. I was like, I was like, but I'm gonna have my space. Sure, you're gonna do it the way you wanna do it. I'm gonna do it the way that I wanna do it.

• 21:14Speaker 02

  I had a little conversation with my husband, he was like, do you see? How when you didn't put the pressure on, she wanted to do it, cause she didn't feel that like.

• 21:22Speaker 01

  The tight grip.

• 21:23Dax Shepard?

  Being controlled.

• 21:24Speaker 02

  And ready to disappoint me.

• 21:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:26Dax Shepard?

  It's too stressful.

• 21:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  That's a really good observation that you have, probably from listening to the podcast, becoming closer with Erin, and just understanding humans and sibling dynamics and women and whatever. I do think this has been a constant theme for us that we have dealt with, which is, it's normal when you're as close with each other as her and I are. Of course, for Erin, she wants me to handle every situation the exact way that she would, right? This is human nature, the way with our parents, or our other sister, or a work situation. Of course, she's like, you need to handle it the way I'm gonna handle it. I'm like, bitch, we're two different people. We grew up in the same house, but we had totally different childhoods. Right, right. I have my own wounds, you have your own wounds, I have my own attachment style, you have your own attachment style.

• 22:09Speaker 01

  We're different, like, and now that we've accepted that, I would say our relationship is in a much better place.

• 22:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:16Speaker 01

  She likes to shit on it more, like, we did a podcast recently, and she was like, we have a very toxic relationship. Are you okay?

• 22:23Speaker 02

  Well, Sarah has a much higher threshold for like toxic energy.

• 22:26Speaker 01

  Sure, that's also probably a difference. Well, I can just move on quickly. I have a lot of, I don't wanna say patience is not the word, cause I don't have a lot of patience, but I do have grace for people. Everyone in my life operates in a way that I never would.

• 22:40Dax Shepard?

  Okay, now is where I come in, this would explain your tolerance for addicts.

• 22:44Speaker 01

  Well, one addict.

• 22:45Dax Shepard?

  Only one?

• 22:45Speaker 01

  Did I date more than one? No, just the one. When we met, I was dating an addict, yeah.

• 22:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so now let's talk about our. Well, first of all, I wanna applaud both of you because you guys just took that observation so well. Because you don't know that, right? Like, I think that's what gets tricky.

• 22:59Speaker 01

  Well, Erin and I are best friends.

• 23:00Dax Shepard?

  You guys are best friends, but because other people are in parasocial relationships with us as well, I will sometimes read comments that I'm like, oh, that's none of your business to say about, right? I can get a little defensive if you think you understand something about our dynamic that we don't. I don't always take that well, I thought that was really impressive, the way you guys just.

• 23:19Speaker 01

  I knew that. We're like in our growth era too, like Erin and I are not who we were even five years ago. We have done the hard work. I started therapy not until I was 40. Wow. So like, I was late to the party.

• 23:30Dax Shepard?

  Does that parallel a divorce, is that what, what drove you to therapy?

• 23:33Speaker 01

  No, it was before, no, it was during COVID, and Erin looked at me, and I think I had had like some like outburst or something, and she looked at me, we were in Lake Tahoe, and she goes, it's time. Yeah.

• 23:42Speaker 02

  I was like, I'm begging, I'll drive you.

• 23:43Speaker 01

  She goes, it's really time. And I was like, oh my god.

• 23:46Dax Shepard?

  Sarah, what do your outbursts look like? Will you have a proper tantrum?

• 23:49Speaker 01

  I'm rage.

• 23:50Dax Shepard?

  You'll scream and swear?

• 23:51Speaker 01

  No, I mean, I'm a rage. Erin's not an addict.

• 23:55Dax Shepard?

  Okay, okay. I wanna start with four and five. Mom and dad get divorced?

• 24:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:00Speaker 02

  Oh my god, you really did your homework.

• 24:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:03Dax Shepard?

  That's my job.

• 24:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, three and five, yeah.

• 24:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, he gets paid a lot of money.

• 24:05Dax Shepard?

  August 23rd, 82, February 5th, 81.

• 24:10Speaker 01

  Do you have a year P is a great memory.

• 24:12Dax Shepard?

  So four and five, mom and dad get divorced. Where were you living when the divorce happened?

• 24:16Speaker 01

  Malibu.

• 24:16Dax Shepard?

  And do you have a lot of memories of that period?

• 24:19Speaker 01

  I don't remember what I did yesterday, but I do have a memory. I remember the doorway, like, I remember a few things, like, I remember the house, like, parts of the house. But then you also question, is it a memory, or is it something our mom told us? Our mom used to say to us, like, I remember your dad saying, I'm leaving. And I remember me saying to your dad, oh, when are you coming back?

• 24:39Dax Shepard?

  Right, right.

• 24:40Speaker 01

  And him being like, no, I'm not, like, she thought he was just like, I'm leaving, I'm going to dinner, I'm going here. And that is how, so I can't remember if I saw that, or it's just she told me. And I've never done like MDMA, but I've thought about it.

• 24:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you should.

• 24:55Dax Shepard?

  Did you guys stay in the house? Or did you guys move to another house? Cause that would be memorable.

• 24:59Speaker 02

  We moved to Calabasas, he was in another relationship. There's nothing good about this divorce, you know? It was very bad for everyone.

• 25:06Dax Shepard?

  Cause I read something about you guys today, you've both said it, and I am guilty of having thought it. So like, I know you guys are the daughters of David Foster.

• 25:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:14Dax Shepard?

  I know he has won 19 Grammys and had 45 nominations and fucking, I'm assuming he has an insane amount of money, right? Also, I love your dad, I've actually hung out with him, and he's a fucking, yeah, yeah, at a birthday party.

• 25:29Speaker 02

  He really loves you guys.

• 25:30Dax Shepard?

  When I met you, you were.

• 25:32Speaker 01

  Sarah.

• 25:33Dax Shepard?

  Sarah, sorry, thank you.

• 25:34Speaker 01

  For the listener.

• 25:35Dax Shepard?

  For the listener. When I met Sarah, I already knew your dad was David Foster, or I knew that about you. And so, yeah, my assumption was like, oh yeah, this girl has probably $40 million in a trust fund. And that has been a kind of common thought about you guys, yeah?

• 25:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, even like yesterday, I saw some thing about the show coming out, and it was like, easy when your dad buys it for you.

• 25:57Speaker 01

  Oh my god.

• 25:58Dax Shepard?

  Like, that's how it works.

• 25:59Speaker 01

  So stupid. First of all, and we've talked about it so much, about privilege and nepo babies and all this, and, but it is interesting how with us, our dad is really like a behind the scenes person. Our dad is not a superstar, he is, he's a legend.

• 26:14Dax Shepard?

  You gotta know music a bit to.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, you gotta know music a bit to know who he is. But there are so many kids of really famous people, and who have done like far less interesting things, I think, that don't get it the same way that we get it. You know what I mean? It's interesting.

• 26:28Dax Shepard?

  Well, you guys are both blonde and beautiful, it's no one's getting in line to feel bad for you guys, right?

• 26:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, no one's gonna feel bad.

• 26:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you're fucking hot, you gotta pay the tax.

• 26:37Speaker 02

  No, but it's not even about feeling bad, it's more like, for some reason, and maybe it's some one of those things where we are more hyper focused on it than other people are, because we're very comfortable with it today, but sometimes we'll look at celebrity children who haven't really had a big career of their own. But people will write articles about them and refer to them by their name, as opposed to the daughter of. Where we get daughter of a lot.

• 27:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 27:00Speaker 02

  And we feel like, at some point, haven't we sort of paid the price? And like, we have our own careers now where we could just be listed as ourselves. I was nominated for a Writers Guild Award, went to the Writers Guild Awards, and like, the caption of my photo said David Foster's daughter.

• 27:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's insane.

• 27:14Speaker 02

  And I'm thinking, like, no. Didn't I like get here kind of on my own at this point?

• 27:18Speaker 01

  There's like influencers who post pictures of like their buttholes, and they're like daughters of someone, but they don't refer to them as the daughter of whoever.

• 27:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 27:26Speaker 01

  I'm like, all you do is post your butthole. I think part of it is because, not to age anyone.

• 27:33Speaker 02

  But if you were going to.

• 27:34Speaker 01

  There was an era of like Paris Hilton and Kim, I guess, like, other people who were sons and daughters of, that had these careers in reality TV and were like known as that. And I think for some reason, you guys got kind of like.

• 27:51Dax Shepard?

  Some of them were even your step siblings, right? I mean, some of them were actually.

• 27:54Speaker 01

  Because that's when you guys were also alive.

• 27:57Dax Shepard?

  Anecdotally, this was my experience, I didn't know who Brody Jenner was, I saw there was a reality TV show. I only stopped and watched because he had a really sweet Chevelle, and I like cars, right? And I'm like, how's this young fucking kid have this $200,000 Chevelle? So yeah, that kid is that, and I'm like, yeah, it's what I think it is.

• 28:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:15Dax Shepard?

  It's not crazy to put you in that net even though it wasn't true.

• 28:19Speaker 01

  It was our obsession. With not being thought of like that.

• 28:23Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 28:23Speaker 01

  So like when Brody and Brandon did a reality show with our dad, which was, we were like, wanted nothing to do with it. We were so like, we want to be taken seriously. We never want to be on reality TV. We this, but it almost like if we had it just leaned in.

• 28:36Dax Shepard?

  Well, it's like you're paying the bill anyways.

• 28:38Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 28:38Dax Shepard?

  You might as well, yeah.

• 28:39Speaker 01

  So true.

• 28:40Dax Shepard?

  So what was the childhood in Calabasas like? It was comfortable, I assume?

• 28:44Speaker 02

  I mean, listen, comfortable financially, always. We were never struggling financially or anything. I think that it was more just a really fractured family dynamic, you know? We have a really good relationship with our parents today. We're really close with everybody. No one meant to fuck things up as badly as it went. And I think that everyone has really tried to repair, which is so important, especially our dad. He's really like,

• 29:07Speaker 01

  We have the best relationship.

• 29:08Speaker 02

  We really want to repair this relationship.

• 29:10Speaker 01

  Yeah. He's such a good person.

• 29:11Speaker 02

  It just took so long for us to get there because, you know, he was in a relationship with someone that we didn't have a relationship with.

• 29:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:18Speaker 02

  And like, it was never going to be repaired while they were together. Around 23, they broke up and we had an opportunity to repair things with our dad.

• 29:25Dax Shepard?

  Well, also if I was spared the sight of my father raising other kids, when he wasn't raising my brother and I, that would have, I mean, I already was so judgmental of him, but if you would have added that log onto the fire, I would have fucking torched him.

• 29:40Speaker 01

  Well, we went on Kate Hudson and Ollie Hudson's podcast years ago, and we talked about what it's like sort of watching your parent raise other kids.

• 29:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 29:51Speaker 01

  And live a very different life than we're living. So we lived one life with our mom, which was like a very normal life. We were in like a normal house. But then our dad is this Grammy nominated producer. He has a mansion in Malibu.

• 30:02Dax Shepard?

  You're taking trips to Aspen?

• 30:03Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 30:04Dax Shepard?

  Shit with him, maybe?

• 30:04Speaker 01

  And we talked about that on the podcast and the reaction was like, oh boo hoo.

• 30:10Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really?

• 30:11Speaker 01

  These girls complaining.

• 30:12Dax Shepard?

  There's a fact of life in America and you just have to accept it, which is if you have money, compassion is off the table.

• 30:18Speaker 01

  But take the money out of it.

• 30:19Dax Shepard?

  And by the way, I'm fucking guilty of it. There are many people that, the thing I always say is like, if Jeff Bezos falls down a flight of stairs and he breaks his leg and I'm watching, I'll be like, yeah, but when he stands up eventually, he's gonna have $200 billion. Like, I do it, right?

• 30:31Speaker 01

  Not anymore.

• 30:32Dax Shepard?

  Some people like, of course, you just ratchet up whoever's above you.

• 30:35Speaker 02

  And I think it comes from a misconception.

• 30:37Dax Shepard?

  Yes, you were raised to think money will solve all problems and it's not your fault. You think it's the solution.

• 30:43Speaker 01

  So what you do is, let's take the money out of it. These are blue collar families.

• 30:46Dax Shepard?

  Two little girls that would love to grow up with their dad.

• 30:48Speaker 01

  Any little girl,

• 30:49Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 30:50Speaker 01

  who watches peripherally their other parent raising other kids. It's gonna hurt. And that really did shape a lot of the way that we operate in life and a lot of the relationships that we now have as adults. And all of those things, it did shape how we attach to other people.

• 31:06Speaker 02

  Yeah. But also you guys then have a level of forgiveness that I would say a lot of people probably don't if you've been able to repair all these relationships.

• 31:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:15Speaker 02

  That's amazing.

• 31:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I was wondering about this rad zone that you and your dad were both single and cynical. And you're like, oh yeah, like you were a team for a while. Like, obviously what a rad season of a relationship to have.

• 31:26Speaker 02

  Well, there was a point where our dad really wanted to repair things with us and he asked, what percent am I at and what can I do to get to 100%?

• 31:36Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 31:37Speaker 02

  And I just remember being like, we can just be at 100%. I really would love to just be in a happy relationship with my parent, you know, where we're getting along. I said, honestly, my only trigger is just please don't minimize it. Like, it wasn't that bad, you know, but like, if you could, if we could all own how bad it was, then let's all just move forward together. That's all I really need and want. And he's great about that. He's really worked on himself as well. Like, his relationship with us is very important to him.

• 32:07Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 32:12Dax Shepard?

  We are supported by Allstate. Checking Allstate first could save you hundreds on car insurance. Not checking if your alarm is actually set before you go to bed? You could have sworn you set it, even remember looking at your phone. But apparently looking at it and pressing the button are two different things because now you're waking up to sunlight and panic. Yeah. Checking first always makes sense. So check Allstate first for an auto quote. It could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate. Potential savings vary, subject to terms, conditions and availability. Allstate North American Insurance Company and affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois. We get support from our presenting sponsor, YouTube Premium. Now, you already know I'm a big YouTube person.

• 32:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:52Dax Shepard?

  Uh, it's incredible on its own, but Premium makes the whole experience feel enhanced. Like, you don't realize how much better it can get until you try it. The biggest game changer for me, background play. I love long, two-hour deep dives, you name it, motorcycles, uh, travel, cars.

• 33:10Speaker 01

  Cooking shows for me.

• 33:12Dax Shepard?

  Cooking. Listen, with Premium, you don't have to keep the screen open. So I can lock my phone, slide it into my pocket and listen to a podcast while I'm folding laundry or working out. It's also completely ad-free, meaning when a narrator is building up to the climax of an insane story, there's zero interruption. And for travel, offline download saves the day. I love this one. Relying on airplane wifi can be a gamble, so I just download my favorite videos before takeoff. And with smart downloads, Premium will automatically download new videos from channels you actually follow without having to lift a finger. I'm covered if I forget to download a video I want to watch or even if there's no service. And the home run for me is that YouTube Premium remembers exactly where I left off and lets me continue watching on another device from right where I stopped.

• 33:57Dax Shepard?

  So I can start a video on my TV while brushing my teeth and pick it right back up on my phone on my morning walk. So yeah, YouTube was already great, but Premium supercharges it. If you like YouTube, you'll love Premium. Try YouTube Premium for two months free at youtube.com/premium. Trial eligibility varies. Terms apply. Cancel anytime. This podcast is brought to you by Squarespace. We've talked before about Rob building our website on Squarespace and I bring it up again because it's a perfect example of what they do well. Rob had all the pieces, the content, the vision, the ideas, but he needed something to actually take all that and make it public facing. And Squarespace was that bridge. Maybe you're in the same spot. You've been developing something, a business, a skill set, a body of work, and it's been private.

• 34:42Dax Shepard?

  It's been yours, but at some point you're ready to put it out there and that transition from private to public can feel like a huge leap. Squarespace makes it feel like a step. Beautiful templates, built-in SEO, email campaigns, scheduling, analytics, everything you need to go from, I've been working on this, to here it is, come find me. All in one place, no code, no stitching together a bunch of different tools. So if you've been sitting on something and waiting for the right moment, this might be it. Head to Squarespace.com/dax for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code DAX to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. We get support from Instagram teen accounts.

• 35:26Dax Shepard?

  So we talk a lot on this show about how the world is different now than when we were growing up. And one of the biggest differences is obviously social media. And I think a lot of people wonder, okay, what's actually being done to make it safer for teenagers?

• 35:39Speaker 01

  Which is a fair question.

• 35:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so Instagram has got something called teen accounts and they come with automatic protections built in by default. So anyone between 13 and 17 is automatically placed into this experience. They get age-appropriate content settings, contact limits, so that by default, only people they're already connected to can message them. And time management tools, daily time limit reminders and also sleep mode that mutes notifications from 10:00 PM to 7:00 AM.

• 36:06Speaker 01

  Sleep mode is genius.

• 36:07Dax Shepard?

  Right? And here's the thing, for anyone under 16, a parent has to give permission to change any of those settings to be less strict. The guardrails are on and Instagram keeps building new safety features to create age-appropriate experiences for teens.

• 36:23Speaker 01

  I am really glad Instagram's helping to give parents peace of mind with teen accounts.

• 36:27Dax Shepard?

  Learn more about teen accounts and Instagram's ongoing work to protect teens online at instagram.com/teenaccounts.

• 36:41Dax Shepard?

  There was a moment, forgive me to the listeners, they've heard about this, but my dad was dying of cancer and I had so much resentment against him for having left and so much judgment of how he lived and everything. I couldn't have been more judgmental of this man. He's dying of cancer and so I'm at home all the time taking him to treatment. One time when I'm home, I go, hey, I want to drive around, take a picture of every house I lived in. I'm not planning on this being anything important. I just want to go have a photo of every house I ever lived in. So we're kind of driving through all these different places I've lived and I only lived in one place with him or two, maybe. And so we get to these apartments, he's like welfare apartments my mom and my brother and I moved into and they got divorced. And we're about to pull out of the parking lot place, I took a picture. He just out of nowhere goes, he goes, oh, fuck, man, oh, that intersection right there.

• 37:24Dax Shepard?

  I remember your mom asked me to drop off a couch, so you guys would have a couch. And I was driving through this intersection, that one right there, and I realized I was driving away from my life and everything I loved and I started crying so bad. I had to pull the truck over and I sat right there for like a half hour. I couldn't see. And I literally at, I must have been 37 then, 38? I did not know he gave a fuck ever before that moment. I thought he drove away and never fucking cared. It was like party time. And just getting to hear that, like, oh, oh, like that heals so much. You know, that it broke your heart to leave us. I just needed to hear that, right?

• 38:05Dax Shepard?

  To your point, Erin, I don't need you to fix everything. I just need acknowledgement that that was really painful.

• 38:12Speaker 01

  So sweet, dad.

• 38:13Speaker 02

  It is so sweet.

• 38:14Dax Shepard?

  But you know, you don't think that when you're the kid that was left. You just think, oh, they're not having a great time. There's new girlfriends involved.

• 38:19Speaker 02

  And you remember the hardest stuff.

• 38:20Dax Shepard?

  By the way, totally different income bracket, same shit.

• 38:24Speaker 01

  When you look at your parents as like, who is it that says, like, look at your parents like they're five years old? You know, it makes you like shit.

• 38:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 38:31Speaker 02

  It's so crazy because I've never had this experience ever until two days ago. And it's almost the same experience that you had. We went to our friend's wedding in Hawaii last week and I talked to my dad and he's like, how was it being away from Noah? And my husband and I just hadn't left her, she's two years old, together for four days before. And we were kind of like, everyone's bragging about how fun it is with away from their kids. Like, we had a really hard time.

• 38:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 38:54Speaker 02

  And we didn't really like it. And I kind of expected my dad to be like, oh, please, it's good for her, get over it. And he goes, he told me a story I'd never heard before. He goes, you know, it's so crazy when your mom and I got married, they got married after we were already born. And he said, you guys were little and we never did a honeymoon. And then Kenny Loggins gave us their house in Santa Barbara to go for the weekend. And it was like our belated honeymoon and we were so excited to go. And we finally got there and we left after one night because we missed you guys too much. And I said, wait.

• 39:25Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 39:25Speaker 02

  Like, just mom did or?

• 39:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, right, right, right, right, right.

• 39:28Speaker 02

  Because all the stories that they ever tell, it's like, he has to work, she's sad to leave us. He has to work and I'd never heard him say, he goes, no, I was really hard for us. Like, we both wanted to go home to you. And I swear to you, it like healed this little part of my heart. I was like, I didn't know you felt that way about me.

• 39:44Speaker 01

  Oh, God, you need the tissues.

• 39:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you just need to know they care about you.

• 39:49Speaker 02

  It made me so happy. He missed me as a one year old. Yeah.

• 39:52Speaker 01

  But you know what? I think when we were young, it was too hard for him. I mean, look, we all have real intimacy issues. We had a dad who couldn't go there.

• 40:02Dax Shepard?

  And this is a defense, he's Canadian.

• 40:05Speaker 01

  That is true. I mean, look, people leave marriages all the time. You know, it happens. It's like, and sometimes it really is for the best. But the way that it happened, for him to go there with us would have just been too painful for him.

• 40:17Speaker 02

  He was with someone who wanted war.

• 40:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:20Speaker 02

  And like, if that person wants war, like, you're gonna get a war.

• 40:23Dax Shepard?

  And you like to fight, yeah, a little bit?

• 40:25Speaker 02

  I like to fight.

• 40:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 40:26Speaker 01

  Do you?

• 40:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 40:27Speaker 02

  Well, not as much anymore in my life.

• 40:28Speaker 01

  I don't get that vibe.

• 40:30Speaker 02

  I really am in a different place in my life today than I used to be. I used to be really ready to fight. Now I get scared to get the juice going, you know? Because it doesn't really ever make me feel good at the end.

• 40:41Dax Shepard?

  I was gonna say, I think the realization you have as you get older and you're a fighter is, oh, I lose every fight I have, even if I win. It's like I would have these fucking showdowns at intersections with dudes and maybe I'd even get in a fight. And then for like the next five hours, like just the adrenaline dump and the cortisol. Like what I'm doing to my body to get all crazy like that. I'm just like, I'm gonna die really early, winning these fights.

• 41:03Speaker 01

  But did you fight or did you just hold grudges? Because to me, those are different things.

• 41:08Speaker 02

  I think I was ready to stand up for myself at any point. Growing up in LA, there's such a hierarchy with every room you walk into, right? Like, you are immediately put into the category of how important you are, how attractive you are, how old you are, how useful you are to speak to, to not speak to if someone's looking over your shoulder.

• 41:24Speaker 01

  You think that's just LA?

• 41:26Speaker 02

  I think it's definitely heightened.

• 41:27Dax Shepard?

  I think it's harder to detect status elsewhere. Here, I think there's a lot of indicators that help in that. Like, I met you, and I'm so fish out of water from that scene. Like, I meet you through Kate, I mean, truly.

• 41:43Speaker 01

  No, Kate met you through me. I knew you way before that. Are we talking about that?

• 41:48Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 41:49Speaker 01

  Let's. I met you when you met Ashton. I met Ashton the day he came to town.

• 41:53Dax Shepard?

  A hundred percent, that's true.

• 41:55Speaker 01

  Like, when you and Kate, are we, do we talk about that?

• 41:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, of course.

• 41:57Speaker 01

  Oh, when you and Kate started dating, you and I fully.

• 42:00Dax Shepard?

  We already knew each other.

• 42:01Speaker 01

  So, yeah, yeah.

• 42:01Dax Shepard?

  But what I'm saying is I walk into that situation and it's like, as someone from Detroit, it's like, oh, yeah, her dad's famous, her parents were famous, they went to school. Like, there's a whole network.

• 42:13Speaker 01

  It's like 90210 in your head.

• 42:14Dax Shepard?

  Yes, in my mind. It's like, oh, all these people are.

• 42:18Speaker 01

  Which is not accurate, but that's.

• 42:19Dax Shepard?

  Talking about status being on display, like, I walked in, I'm like, oh, yeah, and it's ding, clink, clink, clink, clink. Like, it's just very fucking palpable.

• 42:26Speaker 02

  Was it intimidating or you didn't like it?

• 42:29Speaker 01

  He wanted their approval.

• 42:30Speaker 02

  He loved it.

• 42:31Speaker 01

  He wanted their approval.

• 42:32Dax Shepard?

  Well, I loved it. It's like all these ridiculously beautiful girls. Yeah, and I'm much different, I think, than all the other folks that are coming around. Maybe I'm wrong. I'm liking that I'm a fish out of water.

• 42:44Speaker 02

  I don't know. I mean, I think, like all of us, we have a perception of ourselves that's always so different than someone else. And I was not nearly as close to Kate at that time that Sarah was. But I feel like the general feeling around her dating you was like, oh, she's dating someone who's like, cool and normal and a guy's guy and like funny and like not treating her with kit gloves the same way that maybe somebody else would. That's what I remember. There wasn't like a feeling of, wow, she picked up trailer trash along the way.

• 43:13Speaker 02

  Like, it wasn't like, who's this guy? Who's gonna pay for that?

• 43:16Speaker 01

  Wait, wait, wait.

• 43:17Speaker 02

  Wasn't what I felt.

• 43:18Speaker 01

  When I met you, you were fresh off the boat. When you started dating Kate, you were already famous.

• 43:23Dax Shepard?

  Correct. Yes, we, yes, when we met with Ashton, I had been nine years trying to get it. No, I was like, well, I was on Punk'd because I met Ashton through Punk'd. I didn't know Ashton prior.

• 43:32Speaker 01

  Okay, then Punk'd like hadn't come out yet. When I met you, no one knew you.

• 43:35Dax Shepard?

  Exactly. And I was in this unbelievable honeymoon where I was like, I had been here for nine years in a one bedroom apartment in Santa Monica.

• 43:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, you did love a trucker hat. You were always in a trucker hat.

• 43:43Dax Shepard?

  I had no money, Sarah. That was the weirdest thing is to be famous and be broke. Like, I would be at a bar and people knew me. It was like, I couldn't buy a fucking drink. But at any rate.

• 43:52Speaker 01

  I just want to put a bow around, which I'm sure we'll go back to it, but just with our dad. We healed with our dad in a real way like 25 years ago. So we've had like a really good relationship with him.

• 44:04Speaker 02

  For a long time.

• 44:04Dax Shepard?

  For more time than you've not.

• 44:06Speaker 01

  This isn't like a new thing where the family's healed. Like, we really did heal such a long time ago. So I always just want to like, you know.

• 44:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 44:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, sometimes it comes across more negative than ever intended because that's what people will grab on to.

• 44:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:20Dax Shepard?

  I'm ready to make one observation now.

• 44:22Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 44:22Dax Shepard?

  Just based on the things I've heard, not having the same parasocial relationship. But I think the people you're answering to in your head, like, you're spending a little too much time answering to people that certainly exist. Those people are gonna hate you and they want to hate you and it has nothing to do with you. I think this all the time. It's like something don't come out and everyone's against me and it's generally related to Kristen. I have to remind myself like, no, no, that group of people already hated my guts. And now they had something, which is great. And then the people that love me, they love me and that same thing they like. There are people dedicated to hating you.

• 44:57Speaker 01

  Oh, no, a lot of people hate us.

• 44:58Dax Shepard?

  It's not related to anything material. There's nothing actually to think about.

• 45:02Speaker 01

  And no one actually fucking knows us. But it's also, they don't hate you, they just want to hate. It's like, they just want to hate anything. And so if you're there, great, you're a good target.

• 45:11Speaker 02

  We get that much hate personally.

• 45:12Speaker 01

  Really?

• 45:13Speaker 02

  No, I don't.

• 45:14Dax Shepard?

  I don't think you do.

• 45:14Speaker 02

  I don't really think we're like the top of the list of hated people.

• 45:17Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 45:17Dax Shepard?

  I agree. I think probably when you were younger, there was maybe probably more of it. But to your earlier point, it's like, everyone's done a lot of stuff. When I look at your guys' history together, the main thing I will say about you guys, which is obvious on paper, you guys are fucking hustlers. You're such hustlers, dude. You guys have done every fucking thing that could have been done by the two of you. You're gangsters, that's that.

• 45:41Speaker 01

  Thanks.

• 45:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so, you know, whatever. It's important to remember these things like, there's no getting those people back. There's no doing the right thing. There's no phrasing something perfectly for them. These certain people will fucking hate your guts and they're gonna, no matter if you save a school bus full of people, they'll go, of course she cut her dad's foster. Then that's that.

• 46:03Speaker 01

  We could win like the Nobel Peace Prize for coming up with the cure for Alzheimer's. They'd be like, David Foster's daughter has got the cure to Alzheimer's.

• 46:10Speaker 02

  With all the money they just live in.

• 46:12Speaker 01

  With all that money. I do think though, Dex, you are on to something a little bit with you, Sarah. Because like even on the podcast, you are often like, I think the audience thinks this is boring. You're always thinking about the reception.

• 46:24Speaker 02

  I'm very, yeah, yeah.

• 46:25Speaker 01

  And I'm like, who, no, first of all, no one thinks this is boring. And then you calling it out actually is like, is it? No, no, not. Like, it kind of like makes you.

• 46:34Speaker 02

  You're like, I'm bored.

• 46:35Speaker 01

  Why am I, why am I listening to this?

• 46:39Dax Shepard?

  Am I too easily entertained?

• 46:41Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, but this is the same reason why like, I don't have parties for myself. If I have had a party for myself, I hide in the bathroom because all I can think about is, I have inconvenienced people to be here for me. It's all connected.

• 46:53Dax Shepard?

  But I'm guessing some of that comes from, again, now, I have a stereotype and it's probably really, really incomplete and wrong. But I do think you guys grew up probably in a pretty competitive environment.

• 47:02Speaker 01

  But not with each other.

• 47:03Dax Shepard?

  Well, I don't think that about each other.

• 47:04Speaker 01

  No, we've never been competitive with each other.

• 47:06Dax Shepard?

  But the thing you already talked about, which is like, it is a town where it's like, everyone kind of knows what everyone's parents do and how relevant everyone is.

• 47:13Speaker 01

  No, your audience will throw up. My best friend's parents were Kurt Russell and Goldie Hawn. I thought my dad was a loser.

• 47:19Dax Shepard?

  Right, right. Yes, Nate Plaskins versus a musician.

• 47:22Speaker 01

  And like, at Erin's school, she went to the Malibu Public School. So she was like the queen bee. I went to Crossroads where everyone's parent was like a A-list.

• 47:30Dax Shepard?

  Academy Award winner. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 47:32Speaker 01

  So I was like, oh, which is fucking crazy.

• 47:35Dax Shepard?

  It's crazy. Yeah, drop you at any other high school and you're like, you're strutting around.

• 47:39Speaker 01

  How did Erin, you end up at the public school and Sarah end up at Crossroads?

• 47:44Speaker 02

  She was academically thriving as a kid and she was very on a path that was very like straight and clear. And she did well in school and she did well with like friends. And I like couldn't get through the third grade or the fourth grade or the fifth. It was like all very challenging for me. So I kept like moving around different schools to see what would fit.

• 48:04Speaker 01

  She went to Switzerland.

• 48:04Dax Shepard?

  Which one had a lower enough, but yeah, that, that, that was a question I had. How'd you end up in Switzerland in a boarding school?

• 48:10Speaker 02

  I was like a really unhappy teenager. I really didn't feel like I was growing up in the right place. I was like, I don't belong here. Like, I don't want to be in Malibu. I don't want to go to the beach every weekend. I don't want to talk about the things you guys are talking about. I wanted to be like emo. I wanted to like listen to like Tori Amos and put Black Linger on and like, I wanted to be like.

• 48:32Dax Shepard?

  You wanted to declare you're not vapid.

• 48:33Speaker 01

  Really, the whole time?

• 48:34Speaker 02

  Yes. And I wanted to grab on to something a little bit meatier and I couldn't get it. It was tricky being in a family that was super visible when I was going to public school because, which I was mostly in only public school except for boarding school. I was, I mean, maybe in sixth grade.

• 48:50Speaker 01

  You were in public school except for one year of your education.

• 48:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, so it was such a shining light on where I was coming from. And there was a lot of negative attention for a lifestyle that I didn't have as much access to as maybe they thought I did. Because I didn't live in the house that they were talking about, you know?

• 49:06Speaker 01

  And they'd go to school and talk about, oh, the raging part. At the Fosters, Aaron's like, I wasn't there. Yeah. I wasn't invited because I don't live there.

• 49:13Speaker 02

  Yes, I just wanted to escape it. And I was just not happy. I just didn't really like myself. It wasn't working for me. And so I just sort of thought, what's like the farthest place I could think of to go? And I found this place in Switzerland.

• 49:28Speaker 01

  And you applied by yourself?

• 49:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, I applied by myself. I went to like Kolumbukuan. You don't know that, sorry, you grew up. Okay, so Kolumbukuan is like a summer school to help you graduate because you like can't get through school.

• 49:40Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 49:40Speaker 02

  And then I went to a school in Santa Monica that's essentially meant to like pay your way through the rest of high school because you like can't pass the grade. So I couldn't figure it out.

• 49:50Dax Shepard?

  Do you think you had a learning disability?

• 49:51Speaker 02

  I like really wanted to.

• 49:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, sure, sure. You want some explanation.

• 49:55Speaker 02

  I would have loved for that to be the excuse.

• 49:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 49:57Speaker 02

  But unfortunately, when I went to Switzerland, I got straight A's.

• 50:01Speaker 01

  Oh, wow. At like, this was an elite boarding school.

• 50:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was a hard school.

• 50:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:07Dax Shepard?

  What were your classmates like? Were there oligarch kids there? Were there like, what was the vibe?

• 50:11Speaker 02

  There were a ton of American kids whose dads typically worked at an oil company and they pay for the family to move to Saudi Arabia and then they pay for the kids to go to boarding school. They weren't super rich kids, a little bit blue collar families who then had moved to the Middle East and that company pays for them to go. And then there was a ton of Kazakhstaniyan kids. They spoke Russian and they looked Asian and they had a lot of money. And they would take limos from class to class.

• 50:37Speaker 01

  No, no, no.

• 50:38Speaker 02

  So I certainly wasn't like the rich kid there.

• 50:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 50:41Speaker 01

  Did anyone even?

• 50:42Speaker 02

  No, because I was from LA and like a Hollywood family and they thought that was interesting.

• 50:46Dax Shepard?

  You were Sarah at this school.

• 50:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. I became Sarah overnight.

• 50:52Speaker 01

  Except she had like an eyebrow ring and like black hair, so not really Sarah.

• 50:57Speaker 02

  It was my first exposure to a community where the hottest person wasn't the most popular person. The person who was the most interesting was the most popular.

• 51:05Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's a great.

• 51:06Speaker 02

  The person who spoke other languages and had traveled and had aspirations.

• 51:11Dax Shepard?

  Reasons.

• 51:11Speaker 02

  Yes, and Alabu really, it served me none of that. It just gave me the flattest view of the world. I was so not stimulated by it and not appreciated. I went to this school and I felt like I like met myself for the first time. And it was cool. And then it was cool to do well in school.

• 51:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 51:26Speaker 02

  Because people cared about their future and I wanted to care about my future.

• 51:29Dax Shepard?

  How many years did you go there?

• 51:31Speaker 02

  This is the part where I'm not proud. I only went for the one year.

• 51:35Speaker 01

  That's okay.

• 51:35Speaker 02

  Because I got my heart broken.

• 51:37Dax Shepard?

  Oh, by a boy there.

• 51:38Speaker 02

  By a boy.

• 51:39Dax Shepard?

  Kazakhstakian?

• 51:40Speaker 02

  I wish. He was from Chattanooga, Tennessee.

• 51:43Dax Shepard?

  Oh, they'll get you.

• 51:44Speaker 01

  Those are rough ones.

• 51:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, took my virginity and broke my heart.

• 51:47Speaker 01

  Oh, shit.

• 51:48Speaker 02

  So I had to swear off the whole country.

• 51:49Dax Shepard?

  Great place to lose your virginity though, in the Alps?

• 51:51Speaker 02

  It was like an Italian castle. It was great.

• 51:53Speaker 01

  Were you at the Alps?

• 51:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was probably at the Alps.

• 51:56Dax Shepard?

  Hemoglobin.

• 51:58Speaker 02

  But it still did the thing I needed it to do. Open my mind up to, I can be this different person and my life could be bigger. And so I think it definitely set me on a better self-esteem journey, for sure.

• 52:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Ultimately, you guys both out of high school start acting.

• 52:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:15Dax Shepard?

  What informs that decision? Different reasons or? I mean, to me, it would seem like just a no-brainer. Everyone, probably your friends with, is also doing it.

• 52:23Speaker 02

  For me, it was kind of the low-hanging fruit, like available to you.

• 52:26Speaker 01

  No, but you were like doing classes and you were.

• 52:29Speaker 02

  I was trying, for sure, but I definitely felt like it was an easy next step.

• 52:36Dax Shepard?

  Again, it'd be me going to work for the automotive industry, which I did. That's what you do in Detroit.

• 52:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:41Dax Shepard?

  You both had, by any other measure, if you moved here, like tons of success.

• 52:45Speaker 02

  No.

• 52:46Dax Shepard?

  Yes, you were in a million TV shows. You were the fucking, I remember you being the star of The Big Bang.

• 52:51Speaker 02

  You had a much bigger acting career.

• 52:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, but like I did not, even in high school, when Kate is like starring in movies, I just genuinely thought that was so cool. There was no part of me, I swear to God, where I was like, oh, I want to be famous. I want to be an actress. I didn't get that until later.

• 53:05Speaker 02

  She's like, I felt that much later.

• 53:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I did. But during high school, I didn't feel it.

• 53:10Dax Shepard?

  What did you think you were gonna do? And why aren't either of you musical, or are you?

• 53:14Speaker 01

  Hmm, good question. I mean, Aaron's husband lies to her and tells her she has a good voice. Like, she's just not. I mean, no, it's good, it's good, but it's not like a professional singing voice. Yeah, she's good at karaoke.

• 53:25Speaker 02

  It just skipped us.

• 53:26Dax Shepard?

  Okay. None of you play piano or none of that was happening? Okay.

• 53:29Speaker 01

  But also, maybe were you like, I don't want to do that?

• 53:32Speaker 02

  Well, I had this experience. When I was in fifth grade, I took piano lessons and we always had heard stories about our dad playing piano when he was like four years old. He's playing like, you know, Beethoven. So I was like taking lessons. I felt like this is not really clicking for me, but maybe there's like something that's gonna come through me. You know, my hands are just gonna like touch the keys and it's gonna like.

• 53:51Dax Shepard?

  That's what I would have thought.

• 53:52Speaker 02

  It's gotta happen.

• 53:53Dax Shepard?

  You just have to open up your chakra enough to let the energy pass through. You don't need any practice, you need like a spiritual awakening.

• 54:00Speaker 02

  Like, you know when like the pianos play themselves?

• 54:02Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 54:04Speaker 02

  I sort of did believe that that might happen. And then I had one recital and my dad came and I played and I didn't really mess up. So I was like, he's gonna be pretty impressed. And then afterwards, he came up and he was like, you don't have it, you can quit. Oh. And I was like, oh, okay. It was a really freeing moment and I really genuinely appreciate this about him because what he said was, this is not your thing, this is my thing and you do not have to do this to get my attention.

• 54:30Dax Shepard?

  Let me liberate you from this.

• 54:31Speaker 02

  Yes, and he brought this up, I think that day, unless I'm making this up. But he used to tell us this story. Our grandma would tell us this story about how our dad broke his hand. And they were like, you cannot play piano for six weeks because he broke his plan playing baseball. And he would like sneak out of his room and he couldn't stop playing piano. And the hairline fracture was growing up his arm and the cast is getting higher up and it's like all the way to his shoulder.

• 54:51Speaker 01

  It feels like a fake story. Is this real?

• 54:52Speaker 02

  And he has to keep playing.

• 54:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure.

• 54:54Speaker 02

  But he said to me, like, do the thing you would do through a broken hand.

• 54:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 54:58Speaker 02

  That's not this.

• 54:59Speaker 01

  That's a great lesson.

• 55:01Speaker 02

  Go do that thing. And the truth is, I wanted to go be in like a play at school. And so I didn't ever feel pressure, none of us did, that we had to be.

• 55:09Speaker 01

  They didn't put pressure on us for anything, actually. Like, I put way more pressure on my kids. Already it's at 14, I'm like, who are you gonna be? What are you gonna be? What do you like? What are we gonna? Our parents didn't even take us to like tour colleges. They were kind of just like, figure it out. It's weird.

• 55:22Dax Shepard?

  I dig that. Back to CrossFit, so what were you going to do?

• 55:25Speaker 01

  Honestly, I was in a super toxic relationship. And I just couldn't even fathom going to college. I was like, I can't go to college because then this person will cheat on me. So how, like this is, this is like, what do you mean? Like, it was the most toxic freaking situation ever. But there was this little issue where our parents were very clear. Like, you don't go to college, good luck. Yeah, you're on your own. It's not like you're gonna have a credit card to go live this life and have. I think that's fair. Whatever. So I literally was like, well, I guess people have always told me I could model. Maybe I could try that. And that's what I started doing and I went to Paris.

• 56:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh, great.

• 56:05Speaker 01

  Went to Paris for a month and then got jobs from there.

• 56:07Dax Shepard?

  And your mom Rebecca was a model, right?

• 56:08Speaker 01

  Our mom was never a model. They say this on the internet.

• 56:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that's what I read.

• 56:11Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 56:12Speaker 02

  I think a little bit in her twenties in New York or something. She was a flight attendant for American Airlines.

• 56:17Dax Shepard?

  That was a hot gig.

• 56:19Speaker 02

  I know. That's like where the models really were.

• 56:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Kristen and I went to, maybe she has told you the story. This is the wildest story and I need to be incredibly clear on the fact that this was before the person had decreed Sharia law in Brunei. So let's, this is pre Sharia law.

• 56:34Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 56:36Dax Shepard?

  I got invited to the Sultan of Brunei's children's birthday party because there was two boys and they were a fan of one of my movie. And Kristen and I were dating for maybe six months. I get this email, it's the weirdest invitation ever. And I say to her, I've been invited to the Sultan of Brunei's children's birthday party in England. Airfare and all the stuff. I said, I feel like there's no way we can miss it. This is so bizarre. We have to go see this, right? And she's like, yeah, okay. I didn't know where Brunei was. I hear Sultan, I think Middle East. Brunei's an island next to the Philippines. So the kids arrive, there's five of them and all these adopted children. We come to find out, their mom, these group of five kids, was the flight attendant when he flew to London.

• 57:20Speaker 01

  On like British Airways?

• 57:20Dax Shepard?

  They fell in love on this flight from Brunei to London. They landed and they went to the Dorsetshire Hotel and stayed there. He then married her and on their anniversary, he bought her the Dorsetshire Hotel.

• 57:33Speaker 02

  That's so sweet.

• 57:34Speaker 01

  Wait.

• 57:35Dax Shepard?

  It's kind of sweet, right? But anyways, yes, he fell in love with the flight attendant on the flight.

• 57:40Speaker 01

  I hope you still have that contact because I stayed there during Wimbledon and it is very pricey. And I was not gonna stay there in a nice hotel.

• 57:46Dax Shepard?

  Well, the whole trip, mind you, again, these kids were so fucking cute. There was two girls, three boys. They all got to invite whoever they wanted. That was so funny just to witness what they all. Because I was at the kids' table from like Without a Paddle or something.

• 57:58Speaker 01

  With like Big Bird?

• 58:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I was Big Bird.

• 58:01Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 58:02Dax Shepard?

  I was the Big Bird.

• 58:03Speaker 02

  It's like the Richard Pryor movie.

• 58:05Speaker 01

  I love that movie.

• 58:06Dax Shepard?

  The Toy, yes, I was the Toy.

• 58:08Speaker 02

  You were the Toy.

• 58:09Dax Shepard?

  And I loved it. It was great. There was archery and hot air balloon rides. It was spectacular. We had so much fun and then we fell in love with these kids. And they said, you've got to come to Brunei for my father's birthday. It's the whole month of August. The whole country celebrates. You guys have got to come to that. And we're like, based on this trip we just took, we're in. Like, we'll go to Brunei in August for this party. And then like we got home and then two months later, he decreed Sharia law and they start boycotting the Beverly Hills Hotel, which he also owns.

• 58:36Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 58:37Dax Shepard?

  And we were like, fuck, we can't go to this party now.

• 58:39Speaker 02

  No, yeah, you can't go at that point.

• 58:42Speaker 01

  So weird. Hollywood is so funny.

• 58:44Dax Shepard?

  It is. One day you think you're going to Brunei to a king's birthday, the next day you gotta protest it.

• 58:49Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 58:50Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so the modeling led to the acting for you, Sarah?

• 58:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, this wasn't like some burning desire in me. I wasn't trying to be a thespian. Like, I wasn't that good. I didn't work that hard. I really just fucked it all up. I had so many amazing opportunities and I just didn't.

• 59:06Speaker 02

  No, the world was like begging to make her a star and she like wouldn't show up to the auditions.

• 59:10Speaker 01

  Really? So you were kind of self-sabotaging? Self-sabotaging, but also just like an entitlement that was so unattractive. Like, honestly, like I look back and I'm like, how unattractive? But don't you think maybe deep down it was? Because you were afraid of getting rejected. Of course.

• 59:28Dax Shepard?

  That you weren't, yeah. You're gonna be good at it.

• 59:30Speaker 01

  Of course. I mean, listen, I did it, you know, it was the modeling and then I was hosting a show on MTV. You know, it was this thing that you did in the late 90s, early 2000s, right?

• 59:39Dax Shepard?

  It just kept progressing to other rungs of the ladder.

• 59:42Speaker 01

  And I took it for granted and I didn't treat it with the respect it deserved to be treated. And life doesn't work like that. Life doesn't allow that for too long. Like you eventually get kicked back in your ass where you belong. Yeah.

• 59:55Dax Shepard?

  And even when people get bent out of shape about nepotism, I'll always say like, it is true. You'll get a shot more than another person will, but it's a meritocracy. They will not keep hiring you. Like you'll get an unfair shot, but then beyond that, there's really no.

• 1:00:09Speaker 01

  Erin's next script could be really fucking bad. I mean, it wouldn't be, but if it was really bad.

• 1:00:14Dax Shepard?

  That'll be the end of the line.

• 1:00:15Speaker 01

  That's what I meant. But I meant like she could write her next script and if it's bad, no one's gonna be like, but let's make it. Cause her dad has a bunch of Grammys.

• 1:00:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Or even that she's had an incredible hit under her belt, that nothing matters.

• 1:00:27Speaker 01

  In this business.

• 1:00:28Speaker 02

  Work does have to speak for itself at some point.

• 1:00:30Dax Shepard?

  If I can argue another thing against the nepo argument is simply this, like our children will have an advantage. Two daughters, they certainly will get an agent easier than I got an agent.

• 1:00:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:00:39Dax Shepard?

  But that's not even the nepotism benefit. I'm on a walk with Delta and she's five years old in this neighborhood. She makes a joke, I laugh, like 20 seconds later, she makes the second joke, the same joke a second time. I don't laugh and she at five years old goes, I went to the well too many times, didn't I?

• 1:00:59Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:00:59Dax Shepard?

  And I go, yeah, you went to the well too many times. Like my five year old already knows about comedy and about going to the well too much. And it's like, that's the advantage they're gonna have. When they arrive, they'll have this knowledge that is real.

• 1:01:12Speaker 01

  But also when you know you're not gonna be homeless. Yes, that's real. The safety net is real. Like when you go to bed every night knowing like, I'm gonna be fed, I'm gonna have a roof over my head. Yes. There is a sense of freedom with that.

• 1:01:24Dax Shepard?

  Is enviable.

• 1:01:25Speaker 01

  Yes. And if you don't have that, it leads to angst and stress.

• 1:01:28Dax Shepard?

  Then you smoke crack in your one bedroom apartment, Santa Monica.

• 1:01:31Speaker 01

  Also though, also the benefit is that you saw it work out for people. That's a huge benefit that like you grew up in a house where your dad is a legend. Just the fact that that happened tells you something like, oh.

• 1:01:45Speaker 02

  So you're around a lot of successful people who are self-made and they are good at what they do. And they teach you things and they inform the conversation in the room. And you are exposed to like a level of entertainment, people and interesting conversations that heighten your ability to be in these rooms.

• 1:02:05Dax Shepard?

  You're educated. You get educated in that.

• 1:02:07Speaker 02

  You're not a fish out of water. It is a huge advantage. If you have a general with a studio network executive. I was much more relaxed to that room than somebody else might have been and that helps you. It is an advantage.

• 1:02:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:02:19Speaker 01

  But all that being said, Hollywood said no to me. All my connections, all my connections.

• 1:02:27Speaker 02

  And was not, no.

• 1:02:29Speaker 01

  And I'm talking connections. I knew everybody when I was everyone, every executive, every head of studio, every movie star. I knew everybody and Hollywood said no to me.

• 1:02:39Dax Shepard?

  Your classmates are Runny Warner Brothers for crying out loud.

• 1:02:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, Jesse, Jesse Uppman. My best friend's dad was Ron Meyer, ran Universal.

• 1:02:46Dax Shepard?

  Sure, sure.

• 1:02:47Speaker 01

  He never was like, let me put you inside. This was my best friend's dad who I was with every weekend and he did not put me in a film. Do you know what I'm saying?

• 1:02:53Dax Shepard?

  Right, right, right.

• 1:02:54Speaker 01

  The illusion is not actually what it is, right? Now you're a businesswoman and you're supposed to be that. It sounds the whole time.

• 1:03:01Dax Shepard?

  Well, that was kind of my question. I was gonna ask how each of you decide, okay, we're leaving that pursuit. Because again, Erin, I know you're shitting on it, but you're on a ton of fucking TV shows.

• 1:03:12Speaker 01

  No, she was.

• 1:03:13Speaker 02

  I mean, not, like one episode. Yeah, I was dead in a lot of them.

• 1:03:16Dax Shepard?

  Again, I would have killed you. Oh, okay.

• 1:03:18Speaker 02

  She was a corpse in 911. I was dead hooker.

• 1:03:20Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:03:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:03:21Speaker 01

  I was a corpse in 911.

• 1:03:22Speaker 02

  CSI, I was like a crackhead in like a, you know, halfway home.

• 1:03:26Speaker 01

  But that's a hard role. No, she had no lines. Oh, okay. So you're just stumbling around.

• 1:03:30Speaker 02

  No, I did. I did. I had lines. I had lines.

• 1:03:31Dax Shepard?

  Listen, you had more TV credits than Monica had or I had at that age.

• 1:03:36Speaker 02

  Well, thank you. Well, I, I definitely felt like I wasn't living up to my full potential.

• 1:03:40Dax Shepard?

  Yes. So that's what I'm curious about. When is the moment that you go like, okay, we're on the wrong path?

• 1:03:46Speaker 02

  It was gradual and then I started feeling this, I had like a writing bug as a kid, but it was like bad poetry.

• 1:03:54Dax Shepard?

  Eyebrow ring, goth, bad poetry.

• 1:03:56Speaker 02

  Yes, exactly. It all lines up.

• 1:03:57Dax Shepard?

  We already knew.

• 1:03:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, it lines up perfectly. And then I wasn't feeling like I was doing great in my twenties with my acting stuff. And then I started a blog when blogs were relevant. I don't know what this is, 2010, 2008? I don't know what this is.

• 1:04:11Dax Shepard?

  You didn't have to name it the world's first blog.

• 1:04:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, I didn't have to. I was early. I was like right in the zone.

• 1:04:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:04:18Speaker 02

  And it was called totallyconfidentandcompletelyinsecure.com.

• 1:04:21Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:04:21Speaker 02

  And it was just anything, random, nothing. Sometimes I'd write random scenes that were in my head. Sometimes I would write about like a weird date that I had been on and it unlocked something in my life. Things went viral at the time. It didn't go viral, but it would get sent around and someone would mention it to me. And I'd be like, wait a second. Oh, you thought that was funny or you thought that was interesting? And it really opened my brain up to this idea that that was really much more my thing. And then my girlfriend, Sophia Rossi, started Hello Giggles and I started writing on Hello Giggles.

• 1:04:52Dax Shepard?

  This is Monica Sane and I love it, which is like, love who loves you back.

• 1:04:55Speaker 01

  Love the thing that loves you.

• 1:04:56Dax Shepard?

  Love the thing that loves you back.

• 1:04:57Speaker 02

  Acting wasn't loving me back.

• 1:04:59Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:05:00Speaker 02

  I wasn't loving it. I didn't have a process. I was like, this, I'm faking this a little bit.

• 1:05:04Speaker 01

  You can feel when you're pushing up against something.

• 1:05:06Speaker 02

  It wasn't. And then the writing was like really flowing for me. It just felt really me.

• 1:05:11Speaker 01

  You always talk about red lights and green lights.

• 1:05:13Speaker 02

  Yes, I was all red lights with acting and then writing was all green lights.

• 1:05:16Speaker 01

  Matthew McConaughey, red lights, green lights.

• 1:05:18Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. That's his book, right?

• 1:05:19Speaker 01

  That's his book.

• 1:05:20Speaker 02

  So I stole that from him.

• 1:05:21Speaker 01

  No, or you invented it and he stole it. She's been saying it for years. Okay, we might have a loss to that.

• 1:05:26Dax Shepard?

  I bet I can guess what year she started using it.

• 1:05:31Dax Shepard?

  Cause the book has been up for years.

• 1:05:32Speaker 01

  Wait, you guys just maxed to listen to the pod? Did he say, is that what he got? Oh my God. Is Matthew McConaughey world's first pod?

• 1:05:38Speaker 02

  To be clear, I'm saying I probably stole it from him.

• 1:05:40Dax Shepard?

  I am Paul's, I am Paul's.

• 1:05:41Speaker 01

  No, but I'm saying he probably stole it from you. I am too. I'm doubling down on that.

• 1:05:44Dax Shepard?

  Foster sisters, I was just listening to your show.

• 1:05:46Speaker 01

  Oh God, I opened the door for this.

• 1:05:48Dax Shepard?

  What's red, what is it? Red lights, green lights?

• 1:05:50Speaker 02

  That's really good.

• 1:05:51Dax Shepard?

  Thank you.

• 1:05:51Speaker 01

  I had Dax.

• 1:05:52Dax Shepard?

  Mr. Dax.

• 1:05:53Speaker 02

  That's really good. Okay. So then I basically, I'm writing for Hello Giggles. I'm writing for Daily Candy. Does anyone remember that?

• 1:05:58Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Yes. You're also working at Free People.

• 1:06:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:03Speaker 01

  Which I'm sure the audience would love to whatever, but she was working at a clothing store called Free People at 27 years old. Where like all her friends would come in, her peers would come in and be like, get me a size four bitch.

• 1:06:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:06:15Speaker 02

  We did have a different point of view on these things. Like Sarah was never gonna stoop to working at Free People.

• 1:06:19Speaker 01

  No, but I did JC Penney catalogs where I modeled bras. Honestly, they were hot. They were in black and white. They were for the newspaper.

• 1:06:24Speaker 02

  So yes, that gave me the writing bug and I wasn't making any money out of it because you don't make money on like the internet stuff.

• 1:06:30Dax Shepard?

  But you get a staff writing position on Ryan Murphy's show.

• 1:06:34Speaker 02

  Yes. Well, so what happened was Sophia introduced me to Ollie Opst, who was at Three Arts, which was like pinnacle of like where you want to be as a comedy writer. And he wanted to represent me, which was huge. And I'd never written a script before. And so he said, you need to write a script and I'll teach you how.

• 1:06:49Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:06:50Speaker 02

  And we came up with this idea. I was dating a girl at the time. This is like this random one year of my life where I was a lesbian.

• 1:06:55Dax Shepard?

  A DJ.

• 1:06:56Speaker 02

  And she was a DJ.

• 1:06:57Speaker 01

  Very popular. We have had her brother on the show, friend of the pod, just wanna say.

• 1:07:03Speaker 02

  Friend of the pod. So I wrote this script called Lesi.

• 1:07:05Dax Shepard?

  You're a big converter. I'm really, now I see the pattern.

• 1:07:08Speaker 02

  What's my converter? Oh, yeah.

• 1:07:09Dax Shepard?

  Hey, you're like a converter. You're someone that'll just like, yeah, here we go.

• 1:07:12Speaker 01

  She's down.

• 1:07:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'll convert.

• 1:07:13Speaker 01

  I think you're someone that tries out a lot of things and identities maybe. I wish I was more like that. It's good. Yeah.

• 1:07:22Dax Shepard?

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare.

• 1:07:29Dax Shepard?

  Thank you to our presenting sponsor, HP, for supporting this episode. Their HP Smart Tank printer is the last printer you'll ever need. Oh, here we go, Monica. With a refillable ink tank and up to three years of ink included. So you get thousands of pages of cartridge free printing. Hallelujah. To learn more, search for HP Smart Tank. We get support from AG1. Fall is that time when your body and mind are getting ready for the winter. You're settling in, bracing for the cold. Your body's already running a deficit from the shorter days and broken sleep patterns. You don't want a nutrient deficit stacked on top of that too.

• 1:08:09Speaker 01

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• 1:08:22Dax Shepard?

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• 1:08:36Speaker 01

  That's the part people miss. It's not a one day fix. It's what happens when you stay consistent.

• 1:08:40Dax Shepard?

  It's an easy, everyday thing. I've added it to my morning routine and I'm gonna tell you, I actually love the taste of it. It's like Pavlovian. I drink it and I know, mm, I'm gonna get that little vitamin buzz.

• 1:08:50Speaker 01

  Well, that's also the thing. When you do it first thing in the morning, you already feel kind of self-esteem because you're like, I already did something good for myself.

• 1:08:57Dax Shepard?

  Yes. Go to drinkag1.com/dax and for a limited time, get a free immunity bundle, including a bottle of omega three fish oil and a bottle of vitamin D3 K2 with your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro. That's drinkag1.com/dax and after checkout, be sure to let them know that Armchair Expert sent you. We get support from Superhuman. I'm someone who wants to do big, meaningful work, but the small stuff eats up my day before I even get to it. The endless emails, docs, scheduling, follow-ups that pile up. By the time all that's cleared, there's no energy left for the ambitious stuff.

• 1:09:38Dax Shepard?

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• 1:10:25Dax Shepard?

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• 1:11:08Dax Shepard?

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• 1:11:31Speaker 02

  Anyway, I write this script, first script I ever wrote. Ollie, I have to give him so much credit because he really taught me. Like, I'd send him 10 pages and he'd be like, "Girl, that's not a joke. You put it in the description, you didn't put it in the lines and the dialogue and showed me where an act break was. I didn't know any of it." That script really changed things for me because I ended up having all three big agencies offer me to be with them. And I was like, "How did this happen? This is crazy." And I'd never experienced this in my acting life, ever. I'd never felt like I got the big call, you know? Like, no one ever was like, "I see something in you." And this was the first time I ever had that experience.

• 1:12:02Dax Shepard?

  Beyond that, your reaction to these meetings is going to be so different than even if you'd gotten those calls as an actor.

• 1:12:09Speaker 02

  Oh, 100%.

• 1:12:10Dax Shepard?

  Like, the feeling you have going there is a different thing entirely.

• 1:12:13Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, because I wasn't faking it. Like, this was really me. No one can do this for me. I can't phone it in. It was the most vulnerable and the most honest and the most myself. And it really shifted even who I was out in the world and how I interacted with people because I was being more myself. Got a staff writing job?

• 1:12:30Dax Shepard?

  That's a big job. That's what a writer in Hollywood's dying to get.

• 1:12:34Speaker 01

  And Ryan loved her.

• 1:12:35Speaker 02

  I couldn't believe, when I would drive on the lot, I was just like, "This is it." It was on the Paramount lot.

• 1:12:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a good lot. She'd like call me every day driving on. She'd be like, "This is crazy."

• 1:12:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:45Speaker 01

  I just couldn't believe it.

• 1:12:46Speaker 02

  That I have a fob.

• 1:12:47Speaker 01

  It is.

• 1:12:47Dax Shepard?

  Yes, it feels so good.

• 1:12:49Speaker 02

  I like wanted my friends to see my LID card in my car. "Sorry, I just have to go to work tomorrow. That's my thing."

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  It's a big ask, too.

• 1:12:55Speaker 02

  I was really proud of myself. I mean, I was very low on the staff, but it was very cool.

• 1:12:59Speaker 01

  And when did you guys do Barely Famous? Was that after or before?

• 1:13:02Speaker 02

  After that writer's room, I took out a pilot to try to develop and I couldn't sell it. And then, at the time, my managers at Three Arts said, "It's so funny, we have all these clients who are trying to get reality shows. And we keep getting calls from networks seeing if you guys will do a reality show, but you won't do one." We kind of all looked at each other like, "There's something here. There's something funny about two girls who are surrounded by reality TV and they refuse to do it. So they film a reality show about how they won't do a reality show." Like, let's write a scripted show.

• 1:13:33Speaker 01

  Their spinal tap.

• 1:13:34Speaker 02

  That's sort of like a Curb-style show. And that's how Barely Famous came together. And it was certainly my way in as a comedy writer, trying to like wedge this thing in. And it really shifted a lot for us. But it was hard also because we ended up selling it to VH1 that really did only have reality TV. They didn't have comedies, really. And so it was hard for us to maintain the kind of show we were trying to create.

• 1:14:03Speaker 01

  It was ahead of its time.

• 1:14:04Speaker 02

  It was.

• 1:14:04Speaker 01

  It was very funny.

• 1:14:05Speaker 02

  It was really fun.

• 1:14:06Dax Shepard?

  When do you guys star? Favorite daughter?

• 1:14:08Speaker 01

  Barely Famous got canceled in like 2017, something, 2016. Which was devastating, of course. Because all of a sudden, people started taking us seriously as like comedic actresses, right? Like, all of a sudden, it was this taste of what it could be. You know, which we'd never really experienced. Like, I was literally a failed actress. She was writing all those things.

• 1:14:30Dax Shepard?

  A retired actor.

• 1:14:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. And then all of a sudden, we would walk into rooms and we were like doing The Hollywood Reporter and on covers of things. We're like, "Holy shit, this is what it feels like for people to respect you?"

• 1:14:40Dax Shepard?

  There's also another level of pride when you've created it. You're not just like, you've been cast, the show was a genius, you're a lucky recipient. Like, it's a very pride.

• 1:14:48Speaker 01

  No, like Bob Iger came up to us at an event and was like, "I love the show." And I was like, "I will die." Yeah. And it's the drug. It's like, you're like, "I need this. Like, pump this through my veins. It feels so good." And then you start attaching your self-worth to that.

• 1:15:01Dax Shepard?

  Oh, god, yeah.

• 1:15:01Speaker 01

  And then it gets canceled.

• 1:15:03Speaker 02

  Sarah had a really hard time.

• 1:15:04Speaker 01

  I was like, "You guys, I'm gonna die." No, I was like, "What do I have now?" I was like, because now you don't want to go audition for things. Because now you're like, "No, no, I'm only in things that we create and write and cast ourselves." And you can't just go do that. It was like lightning in a bottle, really, that we had sort of cracked the code in the show. And so I was like depressed. I mean, not actually, but I was really, it was really...

• 1:15:26Speaker 02

  She kind of just couldn't accept it.

• 1:15:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, I just kept wanting to, "Are you sure?"

• 1:15:31Dax Shepard?

  Take it somewhere else.

• 1:15:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, not now. No, like, "Can we, like, for sure? Like, who do I know?" Like, "No, girl, it's canceled. Nobody wants it."

• 1:15:40Dax Shepard?

  Nobody wants it.

• 1:15:41Speaker 01

  No, we shopped it to everybody. Nobody... But it was so frustrating because everywhere we'd go, people would be like, "That show is genius." I'm like, "But..." Like, I just couldn't...

• 1:15:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, you were confused.

• 1:15:50Speaker 01

  Understand the delta. "Have you heard?"

• 1:15:53Speaker 02

  Bob likes it.

• 1:15:55Speaker 01

  What I was hearing, but then it was like really low rating. Anyways.

• 1:15:58Dax Shepard?

  Sarah likes using Delta as well.

• 1:16:00Speaker 01

  Oh, I love Delta. Delta Airlines?

• 1:16:02Dax Shepard?

  The Delta between.

• 1:16:03Speaker 01

  Oh, he loves it.

• 1:16:04Dax Shepard?

  She sometimes criticizes my...

• 1:16:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I love it.

• 1:16:06Speaker 02

  I criticize her for saying it, too.

• 1:16:09Speaker 01

  Oh, when I say it, she's like, "Okay, girl."

• 1:16:11Speaker 02

  I'm like, "Oh, you went to business school overnight?"

• 1:16:13Speaker 01

  It's a great way to explain what I'm trying to say. Yeah, when he gets a new word, he just says it nonstop.

• 1:16:18Speaker 02

  I feel like she like heard someone on a panel say it and now she's like using it all the time. And I'm like, "Okay, new word alert."

• 1:16:24Speaker 01

  Terra firma is another one I cut.

• 1:16:25Dax Shepard?

  That's the one I'm currently on.

• 1:16:26Speaker 01

  You're saying it so much.

• 1:16:27Speaker 02

  What is a terra firma?

• 1:16:28Speaker 01

  On solid ground.

• 1:16:29Dax Shepard?

  Well, yeah, on solid ground. No, no, the one that you hate that I'm using is prima facie.

• 1:16:33Speaker 01

  That one, too. I don't know what that is.

• 1:16:35Speaker 02

  Prima facie?

• 1:16:36Dax Shepard?

  On face value. It's like a legal term. Like, on prima facie, face value, like what should be obvious, but it's not.

• 1:16:42Speaker 01

  And this one's extra hard because I was there when he first heard it.

• 1:16:45Dax Shepard?

  Which one?

• 1:16:46Speaker 01

  Prima facie.

• 1:16:47Dax Shepard?

  No, I've known prima facie for 20 years.

• 1:16:49Speaker 01

  Steven Dubner said it, and then you started saying it a lot.

• 1:16:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, but I did learn prima facie in college.

• 1:16:56Speaker 02

  I mean, it's a beautiful word, if you can put it in a sentence.

• 1:16:58Speaker 01

  I think it's a terrible word. Like, Delta's so chic. When I say Delta, I...

• 1:17:04Speaker 02

  You know, it's his daughter's name.

• 1:17:05Speaker 01

  I know, but people like respect me more. There's just something to elevate.

• 1:17:08Dax Shepard?

  Try out prima facie. Or terra firma.

• 1:17:11Speaker 01

  Wait, I'm gonna go with prima facie. And people are like, "What?" Like, it sounds like fashion.

• 1:17:14Dax Shepard?

  They're gonna think you're talking about your face.

• 1:17:16Speaker 02

  I will not allow you to use that word.

• 1:17:17Speaker 01

  It sounds like a procedure. I can't wait to hear off the pod.

• 1:17:21Dax Shepard?

  Listen, we interview a lot of experts. I need to get the shorthand with them.

• 1:17:24Speaker 01

  Do you guys ever do solos, just the two of you or your only guests?

• 1:17:27Dax Shepard?

  Well, every episode has an hour-long fact check, which is just us shooting the shit.

• 1:17:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, and every single one, though?

• 1:17:32Speaker 02

  Fact-checking the episode. Yeah, I mean, I've obviously listened to the podcast, but every...

• 1:17:35Speaker 01

  Well, this is what's clear, is I have a crazy parasocial relationship with... When I met Aaron, I did feel like there was a huge imbalance.

• 1:17:43Speaker 01

  She's like, "Oh, what do you guys do?" No, that's not true. We fangirled when you talked about us. You don't even know about the fact check.

• 1:17:49Dax Shepard?

  That's okay, that's okay.

• 1:17:50Speaker 01

  No, but you guys are major. Like, honestly, we didn't even think we could get on this podcast. I was like, "Wait, really?"

• 1:17:55Speaker 02

  Well, we couldn't for a couple of years. It took us a little while.

• 1:17:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was like, "Wait, really?" Season three. I was like, "Did someone cancel? How are we getting on?" Season three, by the way, is so good. I was like, "Dax remembers, like, I knew him before he was famous, right? Like, make sure he knows."

• 1:18:07Dax Shepard?

  So let's do five minutes on that. I think we should, right?

• 1:18:09Speaker 01

  I want to know first impressions. Okay, fine, you start.

• 1:18:11Dax Shepard?

  I mean, my first impression is you're so fucking beautiful. It's insane.

• 1:18:14Speaker 01

  Well, we never hooked up.

• 1:18:15Dax Shepard?

  We didn't, no.

• 1:18:16Speaker 01

  And I never hooked up with any of your friends.

• 1:18:18Dax Shepard?

  You didn't hook up as much as you should have.

• 1:18:20Speaker 01

  I hooked up with nobody.

• 1:18:20Speaker 02

  A million percent.

• 1:18:21Speaker 01

  You guys, I hooked up with fucking nobody.

• 1:18:24Speaker 02

  No, it was pathetic, honestly.

• 1:18:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, nobody. And then when you were in relationships, they were very long, right?

• 1:18:28Speaker 01

  My roster of like the people I passed down were epic. What?

• 1:18:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:18:33Dax Shepard?

  I mean, I want to just, like, I would love to play a game. Like, I know somehow, I bet you've turned down Leonardo DiCaprio.

• 1:18:40Speaker 01

  No, he dated.

• 1:18:41Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my god, that's so wonderful. I feel like I would hook up with Leo.

• 1:18:44Speaker 01

  Benicio? Oh, yeah. Benicio's the best. She has some good ones, that's what I'm saying.

• 1:18:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, now I'm feeling like you did just fine.

• 1:18:51Speaker 02

  Benicio was like on family vacations with us. It was very funny.

• 1:18:53Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my god.

• 1:18:54Speaker 01

  He's a gem of a human.

• 1:18:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's great.

• 1:18:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wonderful.

• 1:18:57Speaker 01

  Oh, I have only the best things to say about anybody

• 1:18:59Speaker 02

  He's fantastic.

• 1:19:00Speaker 01

  that I ever dated, but no, I just didn't have fun in life.

• 1:19:03Dax Shepard?

  Would you agree you would know best?

• 1:19:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:05Dax Shepard?

  I think he looks like Brad Pitt.

• 1:19:07Speaker 01

  What do you mean? He's the Puerto Rican Brad Pitt.

• 1:19:08Dax Shepard?

  They look identical.

• 1:19:09Speaker 02

  No, they're like twins.

• 1:19:10Dax Shepard?

  Yes, he's like a Latino Brad Pitt or a...

• 1:19:12Speaker 01

  No, no, guys, guys, guys, people have said this forever.

• 1:19:14Dax Shepard?

  They already know this?

• 1:19:15Speaker 02

  They already knew it.

• 1:19:16Speaker 01

  That was how he was pitched to me. They were like, "He's the Puerto Rican Brad Pitt."

• 1:19:21Speaker 01

  Yeah. You do have a great story on your pod about George Clooney. I'll let people go find that. I know, but you know what? I actually feel bad about that.

• 1:19:28Speaker 02

  You do?

• 1:19:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, I do, because I forget that when we're talking, that anyone listens.

• 1:19:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:19:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's easy to do.

• 1:19:34Speaker 01

  I really do. So I talk shit. I kind of embellish.

• 1:19:38Speaker 02

  That's why I like it.

• 1:19:39Dax Shepard?

  Storyteller.

• 1:19:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, the way you listened to it on the podcast was different than the headlines. The headlines really were shitty because...

• 1:19:46Speaker 02

  They always are.

• 1:19:46Speaker 01

  They always are. And this is why I hate talking about celebrities on our podcast. Because, of course, if Joe Schmo talks about George Clooney, they're gonna print something.

• 1:19:54Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:19:54Speaker 01

  So, whatever. So I had just talked about, we had mutual friends who thought that we would be a nice couple.

• 1:19:59Dax Shepard?

  Beautiful pair.

• 1:20:00Speaker 01

  But at that time, I was like twenty-two, and he was like forty, and it just felt... But the way that they printed it was that I was saying he was this old man, and that he was this lecherous.

• 1:20:12Speaker 02

  I think you did say like ew or something.

• 1:20:13Speaker 01

  Yeah. No, you said he was boring. Yeah, and I just, that's not, that's not what I meant. The guy's, he's George Clooney.

• 1:20:19Speaker 02

  Well, and now you're talking about it when we get on here. This is even better.

• 1:20:20Speaker 01

  I know, but also, there won't be, there's nothing, there's nothing to say. There's nothing, there's nothing to say, but I...

• 1:20:26Dax Shepard?

  They give it a second go.

• 1:20:27Speaker 01

  The point is, you had your options. Like, you had a lot of options. To be clear, he was not asking to be set up with me. When he met me, he was kinda like, uh, he was not interested either.

• 1:20:35Dax Shepard?

  So back to my impression. I thought you were outrageously beautiful, and then I thought you were suspiciously friendly for being so beautiful.

• 1:20:41Speaker 01

  We always had a very nice relationship, you and I.

• 1:20:43Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes. My memory is a little different of yours. Mine is like, I knew this guy you dated, and I didn't like that guy.

• 1:20:49Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, no, I get that.

• 1:20:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I never liked the guy I knew from AA, and I'm like, I don't like this guy, and that's your ex-boyfriend, and...

• 1:20:55Speaker 01

  No, it was crazy.

• 1:20:56Dax Shepard?

  And I'm meeting you, and I'm kinda just like, how are, how are you with...

• 1:20:58Speaker 01

  No, it was crazy.

• 1:20:59Dax Shepard?

  How would you give that guy a time of day?

• 1:21:00Speaker 01

  And I wasted like five years of my life, but we, you know...

• 1:21:04Dax Shepard?

  We'll pull you into that cycle, right?

• 1:21:06Speaker 01

  These are my wounds. I don't move on easily. So I get into relationships, I get my heart broken, and then it's like, I waste years upset over it. Like, I'm not a mover-oner. It takes me a very long time to move on, because even when I'm not in the relationship, I'm like mourning the relationship.

• 1:21:22Speaker 02

  Because Sarah's someone who's like paralyzed in the moment. She won't ever do the thing she needs to do in the relationship. So she won't tell the person how she feels. In any relationship, whether it be romantic or not, she has a very hard time actually doing the thing she needs to do in real time. So then when it's over, she lives in so much regret, that she's always like replaying it over and over in her head.

• 1:21:43Dax Shepard?

  Cut it on this, cut it on that.

• 1:21:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, but also professionally, I had an agent who like wouldn't return my calls. He was my agent, and I wouldn't fire him. Like, the guy like wouldn't even call me back, but I still didn't have the balls to be like, this relationship is over. I'm moving on. I'm gonna go look for someone who actually cares about me. It was a theme with every relationship. I've always been so in awe of girls, of young women, I love it, who get their heart broken and then rebound. I love it. I think it's so amazing. All these young girls, where they're like so upset, they give themselves a week. And then they're like, oh, I'm gonna go out with so-and-so. I'm like, I'm obsessed with you. Right, it is shocking. But it's great.

• 1:22:18Dax Shepard?

  Well, it's like an audition, and it didn't go well. You gotta fucking get up for the next one. Let's go, next audition.

• 1:22:23Speaker 01

  I'm missing the, the DNA. I'm missing the...

• 1:22:25Speaker 02

  The quick rebound.

• 1:22:26Speaker 01

  Probably pick people who you feel like I'm gonna be in a long term. Like, maybe you're slow to connect, but then when you do, it's very deep. Totally. So then, of course, it's gonna be hard. It takes me time. I need friendship first. I've never just like met someone and fallen in love.

• 1:22:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I was hearing an episode I was listening to of y'all's today, where you were saying like, never been on a first date.

• 1:22:46Speaker 01

  Never. I've never been on a date.

• 1:22:47Dax Shepard?

  You were on a bunch of dates, yeah.

• 1:22:49Speaker 02

  Like a hundred, so many.

• 1:22:50Dax Shepard?

  Then I was re-kind of introduced to you when I was dating Kate, and I was around you a lot there for that period.

• 1:22:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, but like the dynamic shifted, I feel like. I don't...

• 1:22:58Dax Shepard?

  Okay, tell me more.

• 1:22:58Speaker 01

  No, no, no, I just sort of like remember me being excited, like, oh my god, this is great, we're friends, you're dating, and you were, I think, a little bit... Not standoffish, but you and I don't think had the same dynamic.

• 1:23:09Dax Shepard?

  Really?

• 1:23:09Speaker 01

  That's my memory. You weren't like a dick or anything.

• 1:23:12Dax Shepard?

  Oh, good, cuz I just had lovely feelings about you, and I thought this is the funnest person that's always around.

• 1:23:17Speaker 01

  No, I only have the best feelings towards you too.

• 1:23:19Dax Shepard?

  Cuz a lot of you get stuck with your girlfriend's friends, and they could be a big miss, and sometimes they are.

• 1:23:23Speaker 01

  But I remember being really excited that you guys were dating.

• 1:23:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it was a very fun little spell.

• 1:23:27Speaker 01

  And you guys got serious fast.

• 1:23:28Dax Shepard?

  God, yeah.

• 1:23:29Speaker 01

  And you guys were like always in beanies.

• 1:23:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, making out fucking all day long.

• 1:23:34Speaker 01

  You moved on from the trucker hat to the beanie. Yeah, but I remember feeling kind of like territorial over you. Like, I remember this.

• 1:23:40Dax Shepard?

  Oh, good, this is fun.

• 1:23:41Speaker 01

  And I remember being like, Kate, this is crazy, it's like my best friend.

• 1:23:46Speaker 01

  And I remember like you and her were kind of like, what? You don't know him that well. Yeah, like literally. And then I felt stupid.

• 1:23:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh my goodness, I didn't even know any of this happened.

• 1:23:58Speaker 01

  Because it wasn't like that deep, but like, I do remember feeling like stupid. I remember being like, oh, okay, wait a minute.

• 1:24:03Dax Shepard?

  I actually think I remember you being a bit of a lifeline. Like, I felt a bit out of place in that world, and I already knew you, and that was very comforting.

• 1:24:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, and were you like always a Bradley Cooper or something? I don't have a memory of that too.

• 1:24:13Dax Shepard?

  I would bring him around a bunch, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We came to the Halloween party, he was Magnum P.I.

• 1:24:17Speaker 01

  But were you still dating her at this time?

• 1:24:19Dax Shepard?

  That was right when we broke up, yeah. We had, yeah, broke up right before that party.

• 1:24:23Speaker 02

  But were you friends with Kate before you guys dated then?

• 1:24:26Dax Shepard?

  I was friends with Oliver. That's even how I... What happened was, I was friends with Oliver, I fucking adore Oliver. I was at his house one night playing poker, and she came and played, and she was still with Chris. I gave her a hundred and eleven percent of any charm I have, right?

• 1:24:44Speaker 01

  Dax was obsessed with Kate as like a young...

• 1:24:46Dax Shepard?

  I just thought she was so fucking beautiful, and I loved Almost Famous, and I was like, oh my god, I can't believe she's here, and I just gave her everything I had in the reserve tank she got.

• 1:24:55Speaker 01

  And she received it.

• 1:24:56Dax Shepard?

  She did. I remember leaving going like, well, that's as good of a job as one can do. I mean, she's married, who cares? But that was a great first showing. I just had a crush on her, and then they separated. Then I got invited to have, you know Steve Brill?

• 1:25:08Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:25:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so Brill invited me to dinner in Malibu, and I went, and she was there, and she's now single, and I'm like, let's see if we can fucking muster up this magic and get it going again. And then I got it going again. And then from that night on, we were together every single day.

• 1:25:21Speaker 02

  But I'm confused on the timeline, because when I met you, it was at Kate's house, at a party. I remember it very clearly. I know you don't remember, but that's okay, because you were with your girlfriend.

• 1:25:32Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, Bree.

• 1:25:33Speaker 02

  Who? Bree.

• 1:25:34Dax Shepard?

  Bree.

• 1:25:34Speaker 02

  And you, well, I don't know if you want me to say this part, but...

• 1:25:36Dax Shepard?

  You go ahead.

• 1:25:36Speaker 02

  You guys were basically educating me on an open relationship.

• 1:25:39Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, we talk about, I've talked about this all the time. And I interviewed Bree on the show.

• 1:25:42Speaker 02

  Okay, so I had like a long conver, I was nineteen or something, and I was like very like...

• 1:25:47Dax Shepard?

  What the fuck are these two doing?

• 1:25:48Speaker 02

  Well, I was just out of my depth at those parties, cuz I was the little sister, and I hadn't really found my place yet. And so we had a long conversation sitting on a couch, where you guys were basically just telling me like, monogamy isn't a real thing, and like, it doesn't, it doesn't make any sense, and this is the thing that works. And I had a million questions of like, what about getting jealous, or what are this, and you guys were really selling me on it, and I was kinda like, so is this what I have to do to like win a happy relationship?

• 1:26:13Dax Shepard?

  We was putting you on a trajectory.

• 1:26:14Speaker 01

  And then she became a lesbian immediately after. So Dax is very meaningful to you in your life.

• 1:26:19Dax Shepard?

  Wow. Okay, I'm embarrassed to admit I don't remember that. I'm really embarrassed to admit that.

• 1:26:24Speaker 01

  Okay, and then when you and Kate broke up, you and I like lost contact.

• 1:26:28Dax Shepard?

  We did. We started, well, I live on the east side, you live...

• 1:26:31Speaker 01

  No, I know, but like, I feel like I went like a long period of time.

• 1:26:35Dax Shepard?

  Till nobody wants this.

• 1:26:36Speaker 01

  Till, literally. Your best friend. No, and I remember when Kristen got cast and everything, I remember saying to Aaron, I'm very close with Dax. She got territorial again. I was like, no, I was like...

• 1:26:48Dax Shepard?

  All over again.

• 1:26:49Speaker 01

  I was like, I'll buy beer, I'll make a call.

• 1:26:52Speaker 02

  I think even something like when we met or something, Sarah was like, did he mention that we were like literally friends? And I'm like, no.

• 1:26:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I remember being like, I'm confused. This is, this is crazy.

• 1:27:01Speaker 02

  Like the respect she wanted from you.

• 1:27:03Dax Shepard?

  I definitely told Kristen, I'm like, oh, this is so exciting, I know Sarah. I'm telling you the truth, I've yet to lie. I've had to admit that I didn't remember that conversation, I would be honest.

• 1:27:12Speaker 01

  That's what you said to me yesterday too, when we met. You're like, you know I like know Dax. So it's like, I know, I know, I do know that.

• 1:27:18Dax Shepard?

  Couldn't it be more flatter that, that you're doing that? That makes me very happy. I mean, I don't know that we really have to talk about the show. We'll have the full cast on the same week, right?

• 1:27:28Speaker 01

  The cast came on already, they'll be out on Wednesday.

• 1:27:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, Monday we had all of them in here, four of them.

• 1:27:33Speaker 01

  How does that go? Like, is everyone talking over each other? Well, that was scary, but it was great.

• 1:27:37Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:27:37Speaker 02

  All four of them together.

• 1:27:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:39Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 1:27:40Dax Shepard?

  And Adam sat there. We had to put a chair there.

• 1:27:42Speaker 01

  It was great.

• 1:27:43Dax Shepard?

  One thing I wanna know is, I can tell you, I've been with Kristen nineteen years, I've seen her have lots of different successes. You Can't Get Bigger Than Frozen, The Good Place was enormous. When that show came out, we were in New York, and it was probably had been out for maybe three or four weeks. And like, we went to go see a show somewhere, and it was untenable. Just walking to the theater, being at the theater, being in line, oh my god, I thought I knew what level...

• 1:28:09Speaker 01

  She couldn't get more famous in your head.

• 1:28:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I said to her, I'm like, I'm gonna start meeting you places, like, I can't, I can't live like this, like, I can't, we can't talk to a hundred percent of the people we see on the street in New York City.

• 1:28:21Speaker 01

  That's crazy.

• 1:28:22Dax Shepard?

  So I just know even from our perspective, where we've already had a good dose of it, it was crazy. And I wanna know what it, what did that feel like for you guys to have your first TV show, and for this to be like a cultural phenomenon? It was so wild. How were you digesting that?

• 1:28:38Speaker 02

  It was crazy, but also, you know, I had had a lot of failed shows I'd written, so it wasn't like, I wanna write a show, and then that show's a hit.

• 1:28:47Dax Shepard?

  You probably had modest expectations.

• 1:28:49Speaker 02

  Barely Famous was our first show we ever got on the air, and it was on the wrong network, and nobody saw it at the time, and I don't know if you would say it's a failure or not, but it certainly wasn't like a failure.

• 1:28:58Dax Shepard?

  Sarah's still shopping it around. She thinks you may have found a home for it on a streamer.

• 1:29:02Speaker 01

  I mean, Netflix should put it on.

• 1:29:04Speaker 02

  But then between that year, twenty sixteen, and then when the show came out, twenty twenty-four, that's a long time of me writing shows that aren't making it on the air. So, making pilots, filming pilots, no one seeing them.

• 1:29:16Speaker 01

  Became the creative directors of Bumble in between all this. Like, we took a job at a tech company, like a lot happened.

• 1:29:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, three years is...

• 1:29:22Speaker 01

  In between the window.

• 1:29:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, so this interesting thing as a writer, that you can actually have a really good living, never getting anything on the air. You can write things, people buy them, you sell a show.

• 1:29:32Dax Shepard?

  The quote keeps inching up a little bit, even though nothing's getting made.

• 1:29:35Speaker 02

  I was kind of comfortable with the idea that I was even in the game at all.

• 1:29:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:39Speaker 02

  That still felt like a really big win to me, cuz I still felt like the person that's psyched to have the card to get on the Paramount lot, so anytime I made something and it didn't get picked up... Unlike Sarah, who has a hard time with things ending, I have radical acceptance at all times. I'm like, keep it moving. And that really is the life of a writer, at least in TV or in film. You're making something, you're spending a year of your life on it, you're writing it, you're adjusting it, you're making changes, and then one day they say, no, thanks, it is dead.

• 1:30:05Dax Shepard?

  That's it.

• 1:30:06Speaker 02

  They own it now, and it is dead, and they don't want it, so they can't, that's it. So I don't think about it again.

• 1:30:11Speaker 01

  Imagine all the good material. Getting dust on shelves that no one will never see. So much.

• 1:30:16Speaker 02

  And so with this show, it was like the ninth pitch and everyone had said no. And so I again was very much like, okay, great. Let's just let this thing die already. Like everyone's saying no. I've spent a really long time trying to write this pilot. It was a really hard one for me to write because it was really personal.

• 1:30:32Dax Shepard?

  And according to the New York Times, early times, whatever article I read, you were at a point too, where you're like, I don't think I can write anymore.

• 1:30:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, it had not happened for so long.

• 1:30:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:40Speaker 02

  And I was getting married and I was 37 and I wanted to be a mom. And I'm like, what am I chasing? You know, what is this thing I'm doing? Like, I don't think I, I want this to be my story. Trying to make something happen that's not gonna happen. I'd rather pivot to something that is loving me back. And writing was always, I weirdly always had open doors. Like people always wanted me to give them something, which felt like a big win.

• 1:31:07Speaker 01

  Everyone loved your voice.

• 1:31:07Speaker 02

  That I had options, but they weren't getting to the next step.

• 1:31:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you couldn't get past the finish line.

• 1:31:12Speaker 02

  I couldn't get past the finish line. And I was getting a lot of the same feedback, which was like, we love your writing. We love the dialogue. It doesn't feel big. It's like not, not enough is happening.

• 1:31:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:31:23Speaker 02

  So am I supposed to like write a cop show? I just didn't really know how to still be me and get it over the finish line. And that was not something I wanted to be in the battle of for my whole life. So I was now in a very content place in my life, in my personal life. Everything had calmed down and I was really happy. And I didn't feel that need anymore to chase it.

• 1:31:47Speaker 01

  We had a fashion brand.

• 1:31:48Speaker 02

  Sam just jumps in with all the random shit.

• 1:31:51Speaker 01

  Well, I'm trying to like.

• 1:31:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you got the chronology here.

• 1:31:53Speaker 01

  The audience should know that it's such a. You had also found love. Now you have like a business for the first time in your life.

• 1:31:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, favorite daughter was like a really fun distraction.

• 1:32:01Speaker 01

  Pretty important part of the fucking story.

• 1:32:04Dax Shepard?

  Perhaps the most important.

• 1:32:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, thank you.

• 1:32:06Speaker 02

  No, favorite daughter was a very, very fun distraction because it was also doing well. It was in a lot of ways, low stakes because that wasn't my dream.

• 1:32:13Dax Shepard?

  It wasn't your identity.

• 1:32:14Speaker 02

  Yes, that was not my identity. So it was a really fun thing to really put my energy into. But then my manager, Ollie, again called me one day and he was like, hey, can I get a discount code for that bowling branch I heard on the podcast? And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, foster 15. And he was like, wow, you really, this is gonna sound mean. He goes, you really took the loser path in life, huh? I go, what? He's like, I'm just kidding. But you know, it's like, you're a writer. You don't write. And you're just like selling sheets. And I wanted to die.

• 1:32:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:45Speaker 02

  I was like, wait, what do you mean? I am writing. I still, I have that thing. He's like, you're not writing. You're not doing it. You know, that's what you're meant to do. And it lit a fire in me. First of all, I was so mad at him.

• 1:32:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, of course.

• 1:32:58Speaker 02

  And so hurt and so embarrassed. And I remember telling Simon that he had just said that. So I was like, what did he just fucking say to you? You can't say that to me. But I knew that it hit a nerve for a reason. And I was just really avoiding writing this pilot. Because I was so scared of the consequences in my relationship. I had only ever written as a single person where I don't have to answer to anyone in terms of what I'm sharing.

• 1:33:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:24Speaker 02

  And I was marrying into this immigrant family who are hyper secretive about everything. And I'm about to sort of make a, not make fun of them, but like make light.

• 1:33:37Dax Shepard?

  Make entertainment out of them, mentally.

• 1:33:39Speaker 02

  And I was really scared that I'm going to fuck up the first great, healthy relationship I've ever been in to chase something.

• 1:33:49Dax Shepard?

  For this other dream. I was supposed to have been at peace with letting go.

• 1:33:52Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:33:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:33:53Speaker 02

  And it was in real conflict.

• 1:33:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:55Speaker 02

  And so I wanted to tank it.

• 1:33:58Speaker 01

  No, no, like actually tank it. She's like, we're not pitching. You did not want to pitch Netflix. Did you talk to Simon about it? Did he put you at ease?

• 1:34:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, he was kind of like, I agree with you. This is risky.

• 1:34:07Speaker 01

  She was happy when everyone was passing, like Amazon, Apple, NBC. She was thrilled.

• 1:34:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, there's a headache. You don't have to have.

• 1:34:13Speaker 02

  Because then it's like, I wanted to do it, but they won't say yes. And then one day Simon was like, I think you should call my dad and tell him that you're making the show. Or they're not making it yet, but like that you wrote this thing and just see what he says. And so I said, Anatoly, I've got to talk to you. I wrote this show and it's a script and you can read it if you want to. And I'm sure it won't go anywhere and blah, blah, blah. And I was so scared. And he goes, Aaron, this is really exciting. Okay. I just have one request. Don't make us look poor.

• 1:34:44Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:34:45Dax Shepard?

  Incredible.

• 1:34:46Speaker 02

  Make us look rich.

• 1:34:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, incredible.

• 1:34:49Speaker 01

  Guess what?

• 1:34:50Speaker 02

  And I said, okay, I can totally do that.

• 1:34:53Dax Shepard?

  You'll get in the whole project.

• 1:34:54Speaker 02

  And he was so excited and supportive. And that was when Simon even realized that he was protecting them a lot in ways that he thought he was supposed to as a good son of immigrants. And like, that's what you're built to do.

• 1:35:08Speaker 01

  Russian immigrants.

• 1:35:09Speaker 02

  We've talked about this immigrant culture is very similar across different backgrounds.

• 1:35:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:35:15Speaker 02

  And so he had that thing instilled in him that it's like a betrayal to his family.

• 1:35:20Speaker 01

  It's your job to protect them.

• 1:35:22Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:35:22Speaker 01

  When you're the American kid.

• 1:35:23Speaker 02

  And it turned out they didn't want to be protected. They like success. They want to see their children thriving.

• 1:35:28Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:35:28Dax Shepard?

  And their daughter-in-law to have a hit show. Come on.

• 1:35:30Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:35:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, they're gonna tell their friends about it.

• 1:35:33Speaker 01

  That's exciting.

• 1:35:34Speaker 02

  And that's what it ended up being and it freed me. And then I was able to actually write it in a way that I enjoyed and not tank it. So when it hit, it was a lot leading up to that. And I never, ever saw that coming. I could not have imagined.

• 1:35:49Speaker 01

  No, on set, even on set, you were like, no one could have imagined. I remember I watched all episodes back to back and came to set one day and I go, fucking works. Yeah. It fucking works. I remember like it was yesterday and you were like, I don't know. And I was like, it fucking works.

• 1:36:04Speaker 02

  And season was complicated.

• 1:36:05Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:36:06Speaker 02

  It was a tough time and I was pregnant the whole time.

• 1:36:09Dax Shepard?

  I was the husband.

• 1:36:10Speaker 02

  You were the husband, you know?

• 1:36:12Speaker 01

  God, but season was.

• 1:36:13Speaker 02

  It was hard.

• 1:36:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it was hard.

• 1:36:15Speaker 01

  It ended up hurt.

• 1:36:16Speaker 02

  It was a hard time.

• 1:36:17Speaker 01

  But then.

• 1:36:18Speaker 02

  And then it turned out. No, it turned into something so great.

• 1:36:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'm with Aaron, my best friend Aaron, we're in my bus in Texas.

• 1:36:26Speaker 02

  Not me, a different person. Okay.

• 1:36:28Dax Shepard?

  Me.

• 1:36:28Speaker 01

  His best friend's Sarah.

• 1:36:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, Aaron Weekly, sorry, best friend Aaron Weekly. And we're in my bus in Texas and I'm like, okay, this show's out. Let's watch it. And the two of us are watching this and when they kiss for the first time, we screamed. We're like, oh my God, that's the best kiss I've ever fucking seen.

• 1:36:51Speaker 01

  You saw nothing?

• 1:36:52Dax Shepard?

  No, I hadn't seen that. I saw it when it came out. But I was just happened to leave on this bus trip right when it came out. So then we watched it. And Aaron's like, oh my God, has she ever kissed you like that? I'm like, no, I don't think I've ever been kissed like that. Like we rewound it. We watched it like five times. And that was when I was like, oh yeah, this thing's gonna be a fucking juggernaut. If I'm the husband rewinding to watch.

• 1:37:17Speaker 02

  To watch your wife kiss someone.

• 1:37:18Dax Shepard?

  Fucking chemistry.

• 1:37:19Speaker 01

  Because that's how good it is.

• 1:37:19Dax Shepard?

  And the way it shot, like, yeah, this is gonna fucking work.

• 1:37:22Speaker 02

  But I don't think we knew when we were making it, you know?

• 1:37:26Dax Shepard?

  By the way, you never fucking know.

• 1:37:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:37:27Dax Shepard?

  It's not unique to this show. It's like you shoot a pilot. Sometimes you think, oh, this is a hit and it's not. And then sometimes you're like, I don't know. And then it is. There's no fucking way. The magic of the zeitgeist, why on earth? Again, that show, it was so fucking weird. I'm going to see my older Jewish doctors in Beverly Hills and every one of them's talking my fucking ear off about my wife's show. And I'm like, you're a 70-year-old dude and you fucking, and then there's 12-year-old girl. You know, it's just like, I've never seen a range of people consume a show like that. Still can't totally explain it logically. I think I have theories. I think a lot of the things we love the most are really wish fulfillment. And I think to see a woman in her 40s, being Kristen,

• 1:38:10Dax Shepard?

  have this totally swept up in love moment.

• 1:38:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:38:14Dax Shepard?

  Is so life-affirming and like wish fulfillment-y. I think that's part of it.

• 1:38:18Speaker 01

  And that the relationship is good, even though obviously there's a huge hurdle.

• 1:38:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:38:23Speaker 01

  But the actual relationship you're seeing is very healthy and aspirational and good. And I brought this up with the cast. I said, I think part of the reason the show is so compelling is your actual relationship, your love for Simon and your respect for him. You see in that Adam Kristen couple, Joanna Noah couple so clearly. And it's you guys.

• 1:38:49Dax Shepard?

  It's terra firma. Bedrock. It's bedrock. It is. It's anchored in bedrock. It's anchored in something real.

• 1:38:55Speaker 02

  It's very romantic, but also it's not dramatic. It's very healthy. And I think that usually you think you get one.

• 1:39:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:39:05Speaker 02

  And I really like the idea of showing both because that's what we all want.

• 1:39:09Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:39:10Speaker 02

  I mean, maybe it's not what everyone wants, but it's what you should want.

• 1:39:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:12Speaker 02

  You should want to be swept off your feet with someone who's gonna still be there in the morning and not play games with you.

• 1:39:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I think it's true. Like you can't say it about yourself, but I think there are few voices that can just make us feel all those things and laugh. Like Nancy Meyers, she hates it when I say it. But like it is that, that combined with Kristen, she's a comedic assassin.

• 1:39:32Speaker 02

  She really is.

• 1:39:33Speaker 01

  No, it's truly like, I knew she was, but when you're on set watching her, you're just like, oh, this is why I didn't make it as an actress.

• 1:39:42Dax Shepard?

  When I can tangle with Julia Louise Dreyfus, like she could do every single thing.

• 1:39:45Speaker 01

  She's like a robot. We call her an acting robot. She's like AI. Like it doesn't fucking make sense. You give her one note and it's perfect. It's like, it makes no sense.

• 1:39:52Dax Shepard?

  I've had to edit her many times in things. Couldn't be easier. She's holding a jar here in this shot. She's holding it exactly. And you're like, how are you giving that performance? And also your continuity is absolutely perfect.

• 1:40:02Speaker 01

  How is she trained? Is she like, what's her training?

• 1:40:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh yeah, she's been acting since she was a kid. She went to NYU to Tisch for.

• 1:40:08Speaker 02

  But you could say like, I think it's like, I want you to be a little bit more like anxious about it. And she'll be like, 15% or like 70%? And I'm like, uh, 15? Great. I'll give you 15%.

• 1:40:18Dax Shepard?

  Let's start there.

• 1:40:19Speaker 02

  What a psycho. Okay.

• 1:40:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:21Speaker 02

  That is actually what I wanted. It's so exact.

• 1:40:23Dax Shepard?

  When I directed her and I know those days are her, I'm like, oh, fucking easiest day.

• 1:40:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:40:28Dax Shepard?

  Every day on the shoot that's got her in it, I'm like, well, that's, I don't even think about that day.

• 1:40:32Speaker 01

  By the way, if she said no, who knows if there would even be. The show, because I think for Netflix, they bought it kind of going, this is for Kristen Bell or nobody.

• 1:40:39Speaker 02

  It's true.

• 1:40:39Speaker 01

  This is for Kristen Bell, because she wrote it for her. She wrote it for her and I.

• 1:40:43Speaker 02

  I did.

• 1:40:43Speaker 01

  I was gonna be the sister, I mean, not her and I, but I was maybe gonna be the sister, but she was Joanne.

• 1:40:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:40:49Speaker 01

  You know, and Netflix was like,

• 1:40:50Speaker 02

  No, thank you.

• 1:40:52Dax Shepard?

  So we knew this girl who seems to be working for quite well on the streamer.

• 1:40:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, they're like,

• 1:40:57Dax Shepard?

  We wouldn't mind sticking with her.

• 1:40:58Speaker 01

  Yeah. But Aaron's on this season and she's fantastic.

• 1:41:01Speaker 02

  Yes, I am in this season, one episode.

• 1:41:02Dax Shepard?

  I was on set that day, weirdly.

• 1:41:05Speaker 01

  Yes, you were on set.

• 1:41:06Dax Shepard?

  That was one of the days, and I had not researched you yet, so I didn't even know you had acted. And I said to Kristen, fucking A, she's fucking lovely.

• 1:41:12Speaker 01

  So funny, so funny.

• 1:41:13Speaker 02

  It was really scary, but Kristen was awesome and Adam was great, like shepherded me along. And I said, I needed them to be like my acting coaches, because I was really nervous, because now this is the third year we were doing the show. I knew what I was up against, and I also know I'm usually the person sitting in Video Village where if someone is not getting it right, you're like, oh my god.

• 1:41:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, babe, do your job, like hello, we all want to go home. Yeah.

• 1:41:36Speaker 02

  And now I'm like, what if I'm that person who can't remember her lines?

• 1:41:39Speaker 01

  That's why acting's hard.

• 1:41:40Speaker 02

  I was so scared.

• 1:41:42Speaker 01

  It's so scary. Acting fucking sucks.

• 1:41:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was really fun, but, no, no, it was really fun, but I certainly don't want to pursue that career anymore. Anyway, it's been incredible.

• 1:41:50Dax Shepard?

  I'd like to see her in season four.

• 1:41:52Speaker 02

  You want to see Nicole?

• 1:41:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I want to see, like, maybe you have broken up the sister's wedding or marriage.

• 1:41:57Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:41:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, let's see what that train wreck looks like.

• 1:42:00Speaker 02

  You want to know something funny? We've been writing you into this season.

• 1:42:04Dax Shepard?

  Oh, you have?

• 1:42:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:42:05Speaker 01

  Would you say yes?

• 1:42:07Dax Shepard?

  I was watching season three, which I love.

• 1:42:10Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:42:10Dax Shepard?

  And I jokingly said, who was I watching with? I think Best Friend, Aaron Weekly. And I was like, you know,

• 1:42:14Speaker 02

  Really with this guy?

• 1:42:15Dax Shepard?

  I think, I think season four should, I come in and fuck this whole perfect party up.

• 1:42:20Speaker 02

  Uh huh. We have an idea that was formed a few weeks ago, we put your name on the board, thinking about it, and then today, we were in the room, and this idea for you actually pivoted and switched into something bigger. And then what we said was, well, let's ask him how many episodes he would actually want to be in before we make this choice.

• 1:42:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:42:40Speaker 02

  Because it's not like you have to be there all season or anything, but it would be like pivotal.

• 1:42:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:44Speaker 02

  And an important role. We felt like it would be a very fun, interesting thing to do.

• 1:42:49Dax Shepard?

  You know, it's funny, if you had asked me last year, I would have said no, because I had not acted in six years, and I was very happy to not act. And then Bill Lawrence was in here, and he said, like, I'm gonna make you act on one of my shows, and I'm like, I don't really want to do it. And he said, what if every scene's with Vince? And I was like,

• 1:43:04Speaker 02

  I'll do that.

• 1:43:05Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I've always wanted to do that. So I just did this, and I loved it. I ended that experience, and I was like, I'm more open to that than I thought.

• 1:43:12Speaker 02

  Okay, so we're catching at the right time.

• 1:43:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so we're, yeah.

• 1:43:15Speaker 01

  I'm saying, why haven't the podcast worlds collided?

• 1:43:19Speaker 02

  Ooh.

• 1:43:20Speaker 01

  Like, that is just on a platter, you guys.

• 1:43:23Speaker 02

  The girls go on your podcast?

• 1:43:25Speaker 01

  Or like, we're at a podcast conference or something.

• 1:43:28Speaker 02

  So I'm basically cutting you out of this process.

• 1:43:30Speaker 01

  I do think the podcast, we need to see more of the podcast in four. I love aspirational comedy, I'm like, we need to see some career wins.

• 1:43:37Dax Shepard?

  One of my thoughts when I was seeing early stuff is I was like, I need to know why people recognize these girls when they go out in public. I need to know what they're talking about, I need to know what the fans like about it. I have wanted,

• 1:43:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're famous podcasters.

• 1:43:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I've wanted that.

• 1:43:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:43:50Speaker 01

  Minimum you could consult me.

• 1:43:52Speaker 02

  I know, we've had a hard time in the writers' room having the podcast be an interesting engine. We, you were using it more season one to tell the story, to show who they are.

• 1:44:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so my idea, you're right, you, sitting and watching people talk is limited. But I thought the way to tackle it is like, it's all about when you guys are out in public. Like, what we could be learning about you from the fans is the way to keep that dynamic.

• 1:44:17Speaker 01

  And you get it with Nicole.

• 1:44:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, by the way, I play a fan of the podcast.

• 1:44:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, which is great.

• 1:44:21Speaker 01

  And in the first season, when it was clear that he was sort of uncomfortable with you guys talking about sex, like, that was helpful.

• 1:44:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was good.

• 1:44:29Dax Shepard?

  And that's a real thing.

• 1:44:30Speaker 01

  It's a real thing.

• 1:44:31Dax Shepard?

  Like, what you're talking about on here, and it's coming back to you in the ass.

• 1:44:34Speaker 02

  There are times on our podcast where I'll say, everyone listening, do not DM Simon about this, don't mention anything you see about the world, like, just let this one go.

• 1:44:41Dax Shepard?

  No, the best thing in the world is that Kristen does not listen to the show at all.

• 1:44:46Speaker 01

  It's like, we could use her as a listener.

• 1:44:47Dax Shepard?

  And it would be more stressful if she did.

• 1:44:49Speaker 02

  But would she be upset? She feels like she's very easy open about stuff like that.

• 1:44:53Speaker 01

  Do you guys ever fight? You guys, to me, feel like I could not, and I obviously know you better than I know her, kind of.

• 1:45:03Dax Shepard?

  I think you know me better than she does, to be honest.

• 1:45:06Speaker 01

  If we're being honest. But I don't know, like, a lot about your guys' relationship, you guys are very private. I feel like you guys are a couple that just get along really well.

• 1:45:13Dax Shepard?

  Again, nineteen fucking years, and I think we're pretty good at handling our shit. We have a lot of shit, though.

• 1:45:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course.

• 1:45:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, we have two children, and they are going through puberty, and that stressor is, it throws the whole dynamic into a new zone that you have to figure out, okay, how do we now navigate this? You know, I think it's really hard when there's really little, because you care so much about the decisions you're making with the kid.

• 1:45:38Speaker 01

  But then it gets easier, and then it gets harder.

• 1:45:40Dax Shepard?

  Exactly, so it's like, you're butting heads about how you think this should be done, which is stressful, if both people care a lot, which we did. And then there's a sweet spot, right? Between like six and puberty, you're like, this is working out pretty good, I think this compromise, however we're doing it, is working. And then a whole new situation comes, and you're like, fuck, well, now we need a new strategy, and I don't know that we always agree. And then there's more stress. I like the thing, if we didn't have kids, it would be pretty smooth sailing, but I think the kids thing definitely.

• 1:46:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:46:09Dax Shepard?

  But we don't scream at each other or swear at each other.

• 1:46:11Speaker 01

  You never scream.

• 1:46:12Dax Shepard?

  No, I'm very large in my house, and I have to really be mindful of that. I just talk loud, even how the level I talk is like, it's hard for me to remember, oh, I'm much bigger than everyone. We're all talking at the same volume, I think, but it's different coming from me.

• 1:46:26Speaker 01

  Right, you're like, I won't go, we won't go to bed in a fight.

• 1:46:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I mean, we'll go to bed for sure, for like, we'll kick something down the road for a week. We'll go to bed for a week where it's like, mm, we're gonna have to talk about this eventually, you know, what day will that be? When will there be enough free air in the fucking room without the kids to mount this?

• 1:46:46Speaker 02

  Also, when is it fun to bring it up?

• 1:46:48Dax Shepard?

  Exactly, and it's like, you might have a reprieve from whatever kid stuff you're doing, and you're like, we want to use this tiny reprieve to address that. I guess we have to. So certainly, there's like four or five nights in a row where you're like, there's a talk looming, you know, it'll be a sit-down.

• 1:47:03Speaker 01

  It's a long time.

• 1:47:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:05Speaker 02

  It's great.

• 1:47:06Dax Shepard?

  Well, you guys are fantastic, I'm so glad we had you on, this was so fucking fun.

• 1:47:11Speaker 02

  Really fun.

• 1:47:12Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:47:12Speaker 01

  We're all real friends now. Do we over-deliver or under-deliver?

• 1:47:16Dax Shepard?

  I say over, big time.

• 1:47:17Speaker 02

  She's like, goes right, she always goes to her.

• 1:47:19Speaker 01

  Well, I also did that a little on purpose, because I, you know, because I knew it was expected.

• 1:47:24Speaker 02

  Thank you guys so much for having us.

• 1:47:25Dax Shepard?

  Sincerely, you guys are so fucking fun.

• 1:47:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, you are. Thank you so much for having us.

• 1:47:28Dax Shepard?

  I think so many people are envious of how tight you guys are as siblings.

• 1:47:31Speaker 01

  That was the real, that's the real draw of the podcast. That's what I realized when I was like, why can't I stop listening?

• 1:47:36Speaker 02

  Oh, that's cute.

• 1:47:37Speaker 01

  I was like, oh, it's their relationship, and I'm jealous of it.

• 1:47:39Dax Shepard?

  Again, that's the wish fulfillment aspirational thing.

• 1:47:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, because,

• 1:47:43Dax Shepard?

  It's rare.

• 1:47:44Speaker 01

  You just can't get it any other way. Sisters, and the way you guys grew up and all of it, there's no other way to, I will never have it.

• 1:47:51Dax Shepard?

  The joy of it is, and I do think this is why people should definitely have siblings, is like, your fucking siblings tell you the goddamn truth. We're so mean to each other siblings, and yet, we're closer, and we love each other more, and it works.

• 1:48:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, when I first started listening, I was like, they're so mean to each other. What? But then I was like, oh, but it's because they're so safe.

• 1:48:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, if you come downstairs in the morning, you've got a zit, my brother's gonna be like, fuck me, that's fucking, you know, like, he's gonna let it rip.

• 1:48:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, we say the craziest things to each other, but then, but we laugh.

• 1:48:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you don't even care.

• 1:48:23Speaker 01

  Exactly. She says the most offensive things to me, and I'm just like, oh.

• 1:48:26Speaker 02

  They're all true.

• 1:48:27Dax Shepard?

  It's because you have true security.

• 1:48:29Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:48:29Dax Shepard?

  Which is like,

• 1:48:30Speaker 01

  You can only get it in this relationship. Yeah, really lovely.

• 1:48:34Speaker 02

  Love you guys, thanks for having us.

• 1:48:36Dax Shepard?

  He is an arm care expert, but he makes mistakes all the time. Thank god Monica's here, she's gonna let him have the facts.

• 1:48:46Dax Shepard?

  Are you wearing those boots specifically because you were anticipating deep water?

• 1:48:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, I wore them yesterday, and I definitely encountered lots of water.

• 1:48:56Dax Shepard?

  I was wearing low-top Converse Chuck All Stars yesterday, and I too encountered deep water, which is not a good match.

• 1:49:02Speaker 01

  No, that's flooding.

• 1:49:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:04Speaker 01

  Um, but I knew we were gonna have rain again today, so I wore them. But it seems like maybe the rain is done.

• 1:49:13Dax Shepard?

  Your fingers crossed?

• 1:49:14Speaker 01

  My fingers are crossed, I hate rain.

• 1:49:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'm enjoying it.

• 1:49:18Speaker 01

  Ugh, I knew it.

• 1:49:20Dax Shepard?

  You knew I would.

• 1:49:21Speaker 01

  A lot of people enjoy it. I understand that.

• 1:49:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:24Speaker 01

  I don't, I don't understand it.

• 1:49:28Dax Shepard?

  You don't feel it.

• 1:49:28Speaker 01

  But I respect it.

• 1:49:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it'll actually understand it, but emotionally you can't find your way in.

• 1:49:33Speaker 01

  Can't, can't do it. I think it's so cloudy.

• 1:49:36Dax Shepard?

  But the clouds are like silver in there. They look like paintings and the sun is breaking through sometimes.

• 1:49:43Speaker 01

  Well, when the sun's breaking through, I like that.

• 1:49:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, the, I just, the walk to school today with Delta was just transcendent. It was so crisp and, and I thought, oh, this is what people in Seattle experience every morning if they walk to school.

• 1:49:58Speaker 01

  Could never live there.

• 1:49:59Dax Shepard?

  You couldn't do it.

• 1:50:00Speaker 01

  Could just absolutely never live there. It's one, this is kind of like, no, I shouldn't make that comparison.

• 1:50:07Dax Shepard?

  Oh, what were you gonna say?

• 1:50:09Speaker 01

  I can't.

• 1:50:10Dax Shepard?

  Okay, like, um, you were gonna say like Sarajevo during the war?

• 1:50:14Speaker 01

  No, worse.

• 1:50:16Dax Shepard?

  War, worse?

• 1:50:17Speaker 01

  Like, if I didn't have, like, if I didn't have a leg. Which is fine if you don't.

• 1:50:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:50:23Speaker 01

  But if I didn't, and then you were just like talking about.

• 1:50:25Dax Shepard?

  How much I love running.

• 1:50:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like that. Cause I do have a disease. It's called SAD.

• 1:50:31Dax Shepard?

  SAD disease. Do you know how many other people it affects in the country? Have you ever looked that up?

• 1:50:35Speaker 01

  Let's look it up.

• 1:50:36Dax Shepard?

  I'm wearing compression socks today.

• 1:50:38Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:50:39Dax Shepard?

  They go all the way up to my knees like stockings. I finally know what it's like to be.

• 1:50:43Speaker 01

  Why are you doing that?

• 1:50:44Dax Shepard?

  Because I assume like most people, I hate leg day. And so recently I've been like, you know what? We need to eventize leg day like Panay does. Like I need a specific outfit I wear. For leg days. And so, yeah, look at these.

• 1:50:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're tall socks.

• 1:51:02Dax Shepard?

  They're compressed. And I put those on, they're absurd. And I go, oh, this must be time to, and then I feel like it has more support, which is probably not even true.

• 1:51:10Speaker 01

  I want, I'm, well, it's compress, is it good for working out?

• 1:51:14Dax Shepard?

  I don't know. It could be good or bad. It gives me to do it. I bet that part's good.

• 1:51:18Speaker 01

  Well, sure, but like, what if it's compressing?

• 1:51:21Dax Shepard?

  Do you think I should lower them now that I, that should do it?

• 1:51:24Speaker 01

  Oh, just in a quick, this is easy. Oh, wow. Seasonal affective disorder affects approximately five percent of adults in the United States in any given year. That's a small group.

• 1:51:34Dax Shepard?

  And also big. That's also fifteen million people.

• 1:51:38Speaker 01

  I know, but it's a small percentage that I'm in. It's a small club.

• 1:51:41Dax Shepard?

  I wonder if they all live in Arizona or California. They should.

• 1:51:45Speaker 01

  Oh, wow. Women are affected at rates four times higher than men. It says beyond clinical SAD. An estimated fourteen percent to forty-one percent of adults experience milder forms of seasonal mood change or winter blues.

• 1:51:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, well, I mean, look, I think, uh, sun has a pretty, uh, well-studied, uh, effect on mood.

• 1:52:05Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:52:06Dax Shepard?

  And hormones.

• 1:52:07Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:52:08Dax Shepard?

  So you're supposed to look at the sun in the morning.

• 1:52:10Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:52:10Dax Shepard?

  I was thinking about, that's a nice, you know, so many things about children are counterintuitive. Virtually none of the stuff do you wanna do.

• 1:52:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:52:19Dax Shepard?

  You don't wanna run around town and like drop kids off and pick them up.

• 1:52:22Speaker 01

  American Girl Doll Store, birthday parties.

• 1:52:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:25Speaker 01

  Ding ding ding.

• 1:52:25Dax Shepard?

  But I will say lately I've been better at reframing it all. Maybe because the end is in sight and that terrifies me. So I'm kinda like, yeah, one day no one's gonna want me to walk them to school. But, you know, I'm not always dying to rush out the door to walk to school. But, um, A, we, Delta and I always have a fun time talking. There's a man who lives but right by the school on the sidewalk who. Daily, there's something exciting for us to witness. So that's, that's one little chapter of the walk. Uh, but then on the walk back, I am walking directly into the sun rising this time of year.

• 1:53:04Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:53:05Dax Shepard?

  It's like a direct shot at my eyes, but it's low enough that it doesn't hurt. And I'm like, oh, this is what they tell you to do, which I would never. Wake up and go sit outside and stare at the sun for twenty minutes like Huberman wants.

• 1:53:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was gonna say, I feel like we tried that for a little bit after we had Huberman on.

• 1:53:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, this is Huberman's like main thrust for hell. To like synchronize your circadian rhythm and I think up your. Supposed to up your cortisol in the morning, all this shit. All to say, I'm never.

• 1:53:33Speaker 01

  Cortisol, that's bad.

• 1:53:34Dax Shepard?

  No, cortisol's good. Too, too much cortisol in the wrong time is, is not good. But you peak cortisol in the day. There's a lot, a lot of stuff about energy. I can't imagine bracketing in twenty minutes of sitting first thing in the, especially after I've already meditated.

• 1:53:50Speaker 01

  I was about to say, I mean, you do.

• 1:53:52Dax Shepard?

  I would just start feeling like, when are we gonna start my day? Like crying, crying out loud. We went up for two hours.

• 1:53:56Speaker 01

  Or can you be like reading?

• 1:53:58Dax Shepard?

  I think you're supposed to be looking pretty much at the sun.

• 1:54:02Speaker 01

  I thought your body was just needing to soak it.

• 1:54:05Dax Shepard?

  No, specifically activated in your eyes.

• 1:54:07Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 1:54:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like if you wore an eye mask and sat in front of the sun, no bueno.

• 1:54:12Speaker 01

  But it's also probably not, I thought.

• 1:54:14Dax Shepard?

  You're also supposed to look at the evening sun. That tells your body it's starting to go nighty soon time.

• 1:54:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm not doing that.

• 1:54:19Dax Shepard?

  But that walk, um, and then last night we went out to Cafe One Oh One.

• 1:54:24Speaker 01

  Oh, nice.

• 1:54:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:26Speaker 01

  Did you get a grilled cheese? Cause it was raining.

• 1:54:28Dax Shepard?

  The girls both got grilled cheeses.

• 1:54:32Dax Shepard?

  And I am so impressed with Delta. I can't imagine having the willpower at eleven years old. She has quit eating cheese.

• 1:54:38Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 1:54:39Dax Shepard?

  And dairy.

• 1:54:40Speaker 01

  Forgot.

• 1:54:40Dax Shepard?

  Cause she gets really stuffed up like I do.

• 1:54:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:43Dax Shepard?

  But like, what eleven year old's gonna have the willpower to turn down macaroni and cheese and grilled cheese and stuff?

• 1:54:47Speaker 01

  So good.

• 1:54:48Dax Shepard?

  But God bless her. She, so she just got the fake cheese grilled cheese.

• 1:54:51Speaker 01

  They have that thing?

• 1:54:52Dax Shepard?

  They have a fake cheese grilled cheese. And she, she's like, it's not as good, but it's good.

• 1:54:58Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:54:59Dax Shepard?

  It's kinda like me. I mean, I'm sitting there eating a burger with no cheese and no bun.

• 1:55:02Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:55:02Dax Shepard?

  We're all a mess.

• 1:55:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, you're.

• 1:55:04Dax Shepard?

  But I'm fucking fifty-one and I can do it barely. So anyways, I'm just really impressed with it.

• 1:55:10Speaker 01

  That is impressive. I was, that's really funny. It's also Sim, it's Soulmates, which is at a different location. I was working. I'm not gonna say the location because Jess met me and, nope, and it wasn't wasps. It was mosquitoes. Um, Jess met me and we, uh, both, you know, of course, like gotta be in our bonnet.

• 1:55:30Dax Shepard?

  About?

• 1:55:32Speaker 01

  About wanting a grilled cheese.

• 1:55:33Dax Shepard?

  Oh, uh-huh.

• 1:55:34Speaker 01

  And the place we were at doesn't have that.

• 1:55:37Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:37Speaker 01

  And we were saying it to our server who we kind of know. They were just like, oh, I really wanna grilled cheese. And he was like, I bet we could. Probably have that made.

• 1:55:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, they must have enough.

• 1:55:50Speaker 01

  And we were like, no, no, no, no, but they did it. It felt like we were kings.

• 1:55:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:56Speaker 01

  Just like you say you want something and it appears.

• 1:55:59Dax Shepard?

  Cause you're loyal customers.

• 1:56:00Speaker 01

  We're loyal customers.

• 1:56:02Dax Shepard?

  This is where it pays off.

• 1:56:03Speaker 01

  I mean, and we were like, charge us a hundred dollars, I guess.

• 1:56:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:08Speaker 01

  You know, it was really nice. But, um, I also, you know, then it's like, I wanted the, I wanted tomato soup. They, I, I wasn't gonna.

• 1:56:14Dax Shepard?

  Do you guys, you think you could whip up a tomato soup?

• 1:56:16Speaker 01

  I know. But this weather does call for such.

• 1:56:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, do you, are you gonna get one today?

• 1:56:22Speaker 01

  I might.

• 1:56:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:23Speaker 01

  Now that we're talking about it, maybe I'll get it for lunch.

• 1:56:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Um, but after the meal together at Cafe One Oh One, we bought Rummy Cube. That was fun.

• 1:56:32Speaker 01

  Fun.

• 1:56:33Dax Shepard?

  Really pigged out. And then Delta wanted to go to Target to get socks.

• 1:56:37Speaker 01

  Oh, was that where you got your compression socks?

• 1:56:39Dax Shepard?

  No, I got these previously.

• 1:56:41Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:56:42Dax Shepard?

  But I don't wanna go to Target. You know, I don't like going to stores.

• 1:56:48Dax Shepard?

  I, you got a park, it's LA. And I'm like, fuck, I gotta go to Target. Again, I don't wanna go to Target, but I'm gonna go to Target. And right before we get to Target, we're at the intersection about to pull into Target. And Delta goes, when does Target end? And I go. Presumably when they go out of business. And she goes, no, when do they end? She was being belligerent. She, something about that fake grilled cheese. She got herself in a belligerent mood. It was very funny. And I go, do you mean, when does it close? And she's like, yeah, when does it end? And I go, no, those are not interchangeable.

• 1:57:19Speaker 01

  Oh, you were getting into some man.

• 1:57:21Dax Shepard?

  We got into a fun debate about that.

• 1:57:23Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:57:23Dax Shepard?

  I ended up, once we got to the register, I asked the guy, sir, when do you guys end? Yeah.

• 1:57:28Speaker 01

  And she liked that.

• 1:57:29Dax Shepard?

  She liked that. Um, also, um, I was feeling really rambunctious cause I didn't wanna be there.

• 1:57:35Speaker 01

  So I was running, like I was gonna clear the shelves and trash the place. God.

• 1:57:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and then Lincoln was saying if she ever had eternal disease, that's her last wish in life is to run through Target with her arms up and pull everything off the shelf. Anyway, all to say, we had a fucking blast.

• 1:57:51Speaker 01

  Sounds like it.

• 1:57:52Dax Shepard?

  Such a blast. And, um, and then because Kristen's out of town for a week, I've been going to bed with them at nine o'clock.

• 1:58:00Speaker 01

  That's nice. You're getting too much sleep. It's probably why you're acting crazy.

• 1:58:03Dax Shepard?

  I can't. That means I wake up at four fifty in the morning. So I've been waking up at five AM all week.

• 1:58:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:58:10Dax Shepard?

  But again, I'm like, yeah, I don't wanna do this, but I gotta say, I like having all that time before they get up.

• 1:58:15Speaker 01

  What do you do?

• 1:58:16Dax Shepard?

  Well, I do my, all my stuff.

• 1:58:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, but then there's more hours.

• 1:58:19Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, just, I don't know what I do, but I'm never, I'm not in a rush. I'm very ready to walk to school. I'll tell you that much.

• 1:58:26Speaker 01

  That's good.

• 1:58:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. But I just journaling about it. I'm like, all this stuff is so counterintuitive. It's just like, it's just a lineup all week of things running around. Doing a lot of stuff that I would not choose to do.

• 1:58:37Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:58:38Dax Shepard?

  And in the morning, I like myself.

• 1:58:40Speaker 01

  Love it. I had the opposite experience. I woke up to like a bunch of texts on a group chat I'm on. With two other girls. And there's so many, you know, there's so many and I'm reading all of them. And then at one point. Someone was like, I guess Monica sleeps in.

• 1:58:59Dax Shepard?

  Okay, all right, okay. This, it all kicked off early in the morning.

• 1:59:04Speaker 01

  I guess, early in quotes, it was probably like regular time.

• 1:59:08Dax Shepard?

  Did you wake up? I bet with this weather, you can go.

• 1:59:10Speaker 01

  I mean, I woke up at eight thirty.

• 1:59:12Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:59:13Speaker 01

  And I, I, I, yes, I could have slept till now.

• 1:59:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:19Speaker 01

  I think I could sleep all day.

• 1:59:20Dax Shepard?

  All day, yeah.

• 1:59:21Speaker 01

  If I didn't have things to do. I don't think so. I think it's just like.

• 1:59:26Dax Shepard?

  Cozy.

• 1:59:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, just so cozy.

• 1:59:28Dax Shepard?

  Pop on a little telly and drift in and out? Or no telly at all?

• 1:59:32Speaker 01

  No, yeah, in and out. And then like, you know, it's like, I can check, I can like check Instagram and then go back to sleep and then. Play Wordle and then go back to sleep. I could just stay there.

• 1:59:43Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that sounds nice.

• 1:59:44Speaker 01

  I mean, I've never done it, but one day I wanna do it.

• 1:59:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you should do it.

• 1:59:49Speaker 01

  I'm gonna schedule it on my Cal. I mean, yeah, I guess the fear is like, oh my God, is that depression? You just like, don't wanna get out of bed. But it's, it's not like, oh, the day. Like, it's not that.

• 2:00:01Dax Shepard?

  It's not a feeling of insurmountable.

• 2:00:02Speaker 01

  No, it's just like, it's just nice here. I'm tired.

• 2:00:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, feels nice in here. I have nice bedding.

• 2:00:10Speaker 01

  I have an eight sleep, so I can set the temp.

• 2:00:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:15Speaker 01

  Which is nice.

• 2:00:16Dax Shepard?

  You run more, you run it warm or cold?

• 2:00:18Speaker 01

  I, so you're supposed to run it cold. It's like good for your sleep.

• 2:00:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:22Speaker 01

  And in the summer, I was doing that. But then recently I've been making it warm.

• 2:00:28Dax Shepard?

  Like what temp?

• 2:00:29Speaker 01

  Well, they don't have, it's like, like negative. I don't.

• 2:00:33Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 2:00:33Speaker 01

  I don't think. You do like plus one, plus two. No, I don't know. I live there, so how would I know? No. God, that is obviously my greatest fear. Someone's gonna come in there to, you know, perform a sexual act. And then they're gonna be like.

• 2:00:53Dax Shepard?

  Too musty.

• 2:00:54Speaker 01

  What is?

• 2:00:55Dax Shepard?

  Too humid in here.

• 2:00:57Speaker 01

  What is the smell in here? Like, oh, ding ding ding.

• 2:01:03Dax Shepard?

  It's just he or she's not here right now.

• 2:01:05Speaker 01

  She hides, but she stinks.

• 2:01:07Dax Shepard?

  It's an iguana.

• 2:01:09Speaker 01

  That's Sim, you said that.

• 2:01:10Dax Shepard?

  Why?

• 2:01:11Speaker 01

  The movie.

• 2:01:12Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I don't wanna know.

• 2:01:13Speaker 01

  I know. I mean, it's not, it's actually not like a part of it.

• 2:01:15Dax Shepard?

  Sad. I was gonna see it tomorrow. I bought tickets. And then Kristen sent a screen grab from New York saying Sunday she had gotten tickets. So I gotta wait more.

• 2:01:25Speaker 01

  That's a lot of days.

• 2:01:26Dax Shepard?

  Dude, there's a lot of days and I'm so afraid someone's gonna tell me. You can see everything. Is that what it's called?

• 2:01:31Speaker 01

  You can see everything, yeah.

• 2:01:32Dax Shepard?

  You can see everything. That's what we're referencing.

• 2:01:34Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 2:01:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so I'm really nervous that I'm gonna learn stuff.

• 2:01:38Speaker 01

  Because there are some.

• 2:01:39Dax Shepard?

  Spoilers. Yeah, I don't wanna know. And I, it's gonna be hard to wait.

• 2:01:46Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare.

• 2:01:52Dax Shepard?

  We are supported by HP. My mental to-do list is already full. Uh, fix something around the house, refill prescriptions, remember to text someone back, keep track of a million little life things. The last thing I want on that list is, oh, don't forget printering.

• 2:02:08Speaker 01

  No, it's horrible.

• 2:02:09Dax Shepard?

  It's the bane of everyone's existence. What if you could just take that off your list for years?

• 2:02:14Speaker 01

  The dream.

• 2:02:15Dax Shepard?

  That's the idea behind the HP Smart Tank printer from America's most trusted printer brand. Instead of those tiny cartridges that always seem to run out at the worst time, the HP Smart Tank uses a refillable ink tank and it comes with up to three years of ink included. It's built to be simple. The easiest tank printer you'll ever use with the best print quality, period. It's the last printer you'll ever need. I've definitely been in this situation where something that should take two minutes turns into a whole thing. Like, I need to print tickets and get out the door, but then I realize I'm out of ink and have to deal with it right then. With the HP Smart Tank, that's just not something you're dealing with all the time. It's one of those things that just works when you need it to.

• 2:02:56Dax Shepard?

  If you wanna take one more thing off your mental to-do list, search for HP Smart Tank.

• 2:03:08Speaker 01

  Would you ever consider?

• 2:03:10Dax Shepard?

  Doing it? If, if, if, no, not lying, but I did do the analysis. Well, am I willing to just sit through it again?

• 2:03:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, could you tell her?

• 2:03:19Dax Shepard?

  Because it's three hours and I don't know what kind of movie it is, I'm just, I was too afraid to.

• 2:03:24Speaker 01

  Commit to that.

• 2:03:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:03:25Speaker 01

  I understand.

• 2:03:26Dax Shepard?

  Now, there are movies, like, had I seen Barbie early, I could have seen it two days later, no problem. Uh, Fall Guy, list goes on. But this type of movie, I'm not sure if I wanna see it again two days later.

• 2:03:35Speaker 01

  I know. I'm debating that too.

• 2:03:37Dax Shepard?

  Do you wanna see it again?

• 2:03:38Speaker 01

  I can't decide.

• 2:03:43Speaker 01

  Uh, my parents are gonna be in town, so I can't. I do wanna see it again, but I'm, I am like, God, it's, it's three hours.

• 2:03:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:03:50Speaker 01

  Do I wanna do that again? And the shot, and like, although I'm sure I'll get new things out of it.

• 2:03:58Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 2:03:58Speaker 01

  Which would be interesting.

• 2:03:59Dax Shepard?

  Right. How long are your folks staying?

• 2:04:01Speaker 01

  They're here like almost a week.

• 2:04:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, fun.

• 2:04:03Speaker 01

  I think they're gonna be a little depressed when they get here, because they normally spend their weekends with Fizzy.

• 2:04:09Dax Shepard?

  Oh, you're a little nervous.

• 2:04:11Speaker 01

  So it's like, oh, God, I'm not gonna be.

• 2:04:13Dax Shepard?

  Well, they spend the entire weekend FaceTiming.

• 2:04:15Speaker 01

  They will. They will, even.

• 2:04:18Dax Shepard?

  Speaking of Fizzy.

• 2:04:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's like.

• 2:04:20Dax Shepard?

  I met a Lassie.

• 2:04:21Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 2:04:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I went to All Time, hmm, yes, two days ago by myself. And when I walked in, there was the cutest little baby boy. He was five months old. And I asked the mom if I could chat with her friend, and we spent some time hanging. His name was Lazarith.

• 2:04:37Speaker 01

  Oh, cute.

• 2:04:38Dax Shepard?

  Isn't that cute?

• 2:04:39Speaker 01

  Lazarus or Lazarith?

• 2:04:40Dax Shepard?

  Lazarith.

• 2:04:41Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 2:04:42Dax Shepard?

  Isn't that cute? But he probably would go by Lassie.

• 2:04:44Speaker 01

  He should.

• 2:04:45Dax Shepard?

  Lassie and Fizzy.

• 2:04:46Speaker 01

  They could be friends.

• 2:04:47Dax Shepard?

  The same age.

• 2:04:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, similar ages. He's looking real cute. My brothers sent us this most recent pic, I think it was Monday. Or Tuesday. Um, and my dad said,

• 2:05:04Speaker 01

  he looks bigger than when I saw him on this week, on Saturday. And I was like, doing the math, and I was like, two days ago? You guys are nuts.

• 2:05:12Dax Shepard?

  They're in baby land. It's so cute.

• 2:05:15Speaker 01

  So cute. I think I am also jealous, like, I'm jealous that I don't get to see him every weekend. Like, I don't get to do that.

• 2:05:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:24Speaker 01

  And be like, ah, he's bigger. Cause like, of course he's bigger every time I see him.

• 2:05:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:30Speaker 01

  He's gonna be a grown up when I see him at Christmas. I hope he can talk by then.

• 2:05:35Dax Shepard?

  I don't think. As smart as he is, I doubt.

• 2:05:38Speaker 01

  I'm gonna teach him some words.

• 2:05:39Dax Shepard?

  He's also a boy, which means.

• 2:05:41Speaker 01

  I just have visions of me like, teaching him words and like.

• 2:05:45Dax Shepard?

  Like nice words.

• 2:05:46Speaker 01

  Like vocab words. Yeah. Um, and then people like, how did you, why are you such a literary genius? Yeah, and then like, oh, my aunt, you know, when I was four months old, she taught me prima facie.

• 2:06:05Dax Shepard?

  All the words you hate that I say, you're secretly teaching Fizzy. Uh, it's funny you say that. That is one of my favorite parts of both of our daughters is they have bang and vocabularies.

• 2:06:16Speaker 01

  They have great vocab.

• 2:06:16Dax Shepard?

  And they're not like doing it show-offy. It's just very organic. And they get me a few, I'm like, God, I can't, I didn't learn to use that word till like thirty-four. You know, a lot of those situations.

• 2:06:27Speaker 01

  Well, that's, I mean, reading is important. They read a lot.

• 2:06:31Dax Shepard?

  Well, just, they're being talked to.

• 2:06:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, but both. I think both. There's like, my vocabulary was so much better when I was reading.

• 2:06:39Dax Shepard?

  Was it?

• 2:06:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I don't read anymore. Um, ding ding ding, friend of the pod, Lauren Graham, friend of the pod and friend of.

• 2:06:47Dax Shepard?

  This is crazy, you're saying her name.

• 2:06:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, she texted me.

• 2:06:50Dax Shepard?

  She did?

• 2:06:51Speaker 01

  Yes, because she, um, she texted me because of my pumpkin display.

• 2:06:56Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:06:58Speaker 01

  I, this weekend, went on a big pumpkin mission with Jess. We went to two different locations.

• 2:07:03Dax Shepard?

  Patches?

• 2:07:05Speaker 01

  No patches. I wanted to go to a patch, but.

• 2:07:07Dax Shepard?

  You gotta go out to Sunland for that.

• 2:07:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, I felt far away. Or Beverly Hills, Mr. Bones. Is there, are they still doing that?

• 2:07:15Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's still a parking lot. I'm saying you can go up to fourteen and like, uh, Aqua Dolce and shit. And they have real patches where they grow them.

• 2:07:24Speaker 01

  Not doing that. We went to Trader Joe's and then we went to Albertson's, another grocery store. But it was also, so you know, we're, we're almost at Halloween, so some of these pumpkins have been there a minute.

• 2:07:36Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 2:07:37Speaker 01

  And, but we're, we need good ones. We have to figure out, do we get a big one? Like, you know, where are they gonna be placed? So we're gonna need a big one here, mediums. We're figuring all this out. There's a lot of math.

• 2:07:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:47Speaker 01

  To making your pumpkin scape. And he picked up one, and I, and I saw this happening slow motion as he's picking up one. His hand is like going inside the pumpkin, cause it was all mushy. And it was, and I was like, yes! And then, and he, it was, he was.

• 2:08:05Dax Shepard?

  That makes me think of that Armchair Anonymous.

• 2:08:08Speaker 01

  The leg, Jello leg. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was, it was so, it was like, it was a very visceral experience. He did get over it quick.

• 2:08:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, he's good like that.

• 2:08:24Speaker 01

  And, uh, he made me buy a Wardie pumpkin.

• 2:08:27Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:08:27Speaker 01

  That's not my normal pick.

• 2:08:29Dax Shepard?

  I know.

• 2:08:31Speaker 01

  Um, and he was like, I, I, I think you.

• 2:08:34Dax Shepard?

  Charlie Brown Christmas tree style. It needed love.

• 2:08:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, he was like, it's, we need, well, he is just draw, he just like likes them, you know, and I was like, fine, I guess we can get one. Um, and so we did, and you know, we made sure to unpack her last. So the rest of the siblings. Well, we wanted to talk to them first. And just say.

• 2:08:57Dax Shepard?

  Don't call this out.

• 2:08:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:08:59Dax Shepard?

  She knows she has warts everywhere.

• 2:09:00Speaker 01

  Listen, we just like, we're a family.

• 2:09:02Dax Shepard?

  Should I bring my high frector two thousand over?

• 2:09:05Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, you're gonna be there for a half.

• 2:09:06Dax Shepard?

  Clean that up. I can have those gone in a, under an hour.

• 2:09:10Speaker 01

  It's who she is. So we have to just accept it. But, um, I, you know, talk, we talked to the other pets and just said like, hey, just, you know, be nice.

• 2:09:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, be kind.

• 2:09:21Speaker 01

  Be kind. And this is part of the, she's part of the family. Um, and then Jess brought her out. Okay, here she is. And then he did place her in a little bit of a separate area so she can first.

• 2:09:35Dax Shepard?

  For why? We're supposed to be treating her like she's normal.

• 2:09:37Speaker 01

  What I said, but he said she's not ready. So she has to get acclimated. And now she is becoming, she has a little bit of like a victim mentality.

• 2:09:46Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 2:09:47Speaker 01

  So.

• 2:09:47Dax Shepard?

  She not.

• 2:09:48Speaker 01

  I know, it's tricky.

• 2:09:49Dax Shepard?

  But it's funny you say Lauren Graham texts you.

• 2:09:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:51Dax Shepard?

  Because we were at our restaurant last night, and I've known this server for four years she's worked there. We're there non-stop, so I know her well.

• 2:10:01Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 2:10:01Dax Shepard?

  And I don't know why this didn't occur to me for three or four years, but she's standing at the register and I go, oh my God, she looks identical to Lauren Graham.

• 2:10:11Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 2:10:12Dax Shepard?

  And then she came over to the table and I said, um, do you get told you look like Lauren Graham? And she said, yeah, I do. And I said, well, I hope you know, it's a huge compliment. She's my sister and I love her.

• 2:10:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:10:26Dax Shepard?

  And she goes, oh, I know she's your sister. I, I cried for six years.

• 2:10:30Speaker 01

  Well, of course. Yeah, I'm not surprised.

• 2:10:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And, um, and then it made me really think of Lauren. And then Lauren never comes up on my feed. I don't know, she doesn't post much. And then I saw Lauren thinking, I must connect with Lauren, and now you bring her up right now.

• 2:10:43Speaker 01

  The world is telling you, you're supposed to see her.

• 2:10:45Dax Shepard?

  I'm supposed to see her.

• 2:10:47Speaker 01

  She's the best. She lives in the neighborhood. And so she, I saw her the other day leaving and we were chit-chatting. And, um, we're gonna have wine soon.

• 2:10:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh, fun. Fun, fun, fun.

• 2:10:59Speaker 01

  She's a nice, nice lady. All right, well.

• 2:11:03Dax Shepard?

  Wanna do some facts?

• 2:11:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, let's do some facts.

• 2:11:05Dax Shepard?

  Let's see some facts.

• 2:11:06Speaker 01

  This is for. Aaron and Sarah.

• 2:11:08Dax Shepard?

  I loved them. That was so much fun.

• 2:11:10Speaker 01

  It was so fun.

• 2:11:11Dax Shepard?

  Gals on once a month.

• 2:11:13Speaker 01

  They're my best friends.

• 2:11:14Dax Shepard?

  They're your best parasocial friends?

• 2:11:15Speaker 01

  And, um, yeah, I didn't text Aaron after. I was like, kinda hoping she would text me, you know, and be like, hey.

• 2:11:24Dax Shepard?

  Not her style.

• 2:11:26Speaker 01

  Hey, that was so great. Thanks for having us. When do you want to hang out next?

• 2:11:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:11:33Speaker 01

  And then I'm just still waiting for that.

• 2:11:36Dax Shepard?

  Do you think you want it more from her? Cause it seems hard to get. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:11:40Speaker 01

  I almost brought that up in the episode, but I was like, but maybe I shouldn't. I was like, you know, Aaron is, she is, she's, she is hard to get. And she play, and she's a, has a great text game, but then she'll like ignore you, you know?

• 2:11:55Dax Shepard?

  Good poker face.

• 2:11:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it's, it's just like.

• 2:11:57Dax Shepard?

  Running in circles.

• 2:11:59Speaker 01

  It's just like a guy you're dating and like.

• 2:12:02Dax Shepard?

  Unavailable guy.

• 2:12:03Speaker 01

  Unavailable until you want them. But what I wanted to tell her is like, that's where I am with you right now.

• 2:12:09Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 2:12:09Speaker 01

  But you should know something about me.

• 2:12:11Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:12:12Speaker 01

  I always do get in there.

• 2:12:14Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh, sure.

• 2:12:15Speaker 01

  I always do.

• 2:12:16Dax Shepard?

  You're like WD-40.

• 2:12:17Speaker 01

  I always get in there. And then guess what? I'm your harshest critic.

• 2:12:25Dax Shepard?

  That's the good news. Once, once you do let me in, I'm gonna.

• 2:12:29Speaker 01

  Those roles reverse so quickly. And I know that about myself and I'm waiting for the day.

• 2:12:36Dax Shepard?

  You can't wait to have her running in circles.

• 2:12:38Speaker 01

  She will be.

• 2:12:39Dax Shepard?

  Mm-hmm, just wait.

• 2:12:40Speaker 01

  Would you agree that's a pattern?

• 2:12:44Speaker 01

  Go ahead, say the truth.

• 2:12:48Speaker 01

  It's the pattern.

• 2:12:49Dax Shepard?

  So you're saying the pattern is false advertising?

• 2:12:52Speaker 01

  It's not false. It's real, but this is what happens. Then I get to really know a person.

• 2:12:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:12:57Speaker 01

  And the, the glitter is completely gone. Like that never stays.

• 2:13:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:13:03Speaker 01

  It's good because it's real. Like then the relationship is real, but I have no like flu flus around people I know well. And I think I become my very true self in, in a, in a relationship.

• 2:13:19Dax Shepard?

  That is true, and I want you to be your true self. But I would argue you should start with your true self. Because I will say being, being on the end of it. There are times when I think back of the person I met and the person I know. And I'm like, oh, those are much different people.

• 2:13:33Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm, go on.

• 2:13:35Dax Shepard?

  Well, you would want, like when you meet someone and you, you're attracted to them and you want to become friends with them. It's because of how they're presenting.

• 2:13:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:13:43Dax Shepard?

  And then if they do a 180 on you.

• 2:13:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:13:46Dax Shepard?

  You're a little bit like, wait, what happened to the person that I initiated a friendship with?

• 2:13:52Speaker 01

  False advertising. It's who I am in the moment. It's who I am. It's how I'm feeling about the person in front of me in the moment. It's just, it's not, I'm not making up that I like.

• 2:14:03Dax Shepard?

  No, you organically change.

• 2:14:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, I change, I would say like most people do when they really know someone.

• 2:14:12Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 2:14:12Speaker 01

  Well, or maybe they don't, but I do. I, I get more comfortable.

• 2:14:16Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 2:14:16Speaker 01

  And I think when I'm most comfortable is when people like me. But you're saying the opposite. You're saying what I presented to you was something you liked. And then I, I turned it.

• 2:14:30Dax Shepard?

  You were happier, chipper, you're, you know, that's fine. I love who you are. It's different. It's different than who I'm at.

• 2:14:41Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:14:42Dax Shepard?

  You're the one who just brought this up. I'm telling you from the inside of it. It is like, oh, there's, this is a, these are different people to some degree.

• 2:14:50Speaker 01

  Well, don't you think our relationship has changed since I first met you?

• 2:14:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But even like, yes, a lot has happened.

• 2:14:59Speaker 01

  That changes the dynamic when things happen.

• 2:15:02Dax Shepard?

  You, look, this is dangerous. You, you told me how you are, which is you start one way and then it turns. That's what you just started it with.

• 2:15:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:15:11Dax Shepard?

  And then you asked me what that feels like.

• 2:15:13Speaker 01

  I didn't, but.

• 2:15:15Dax Shepard?

  What did you ask me?

• 2:15:16Speaker 01

  I said, would you agree that I come in and flip it? But I was saying, which, which I guess the answer is no from your perspective. But I was saying, would you agree that when it turns, the, the approval changes? That then the approval goes in the opposite direction, but you're saying no, which is fine.

• 2:15:42Dax Shepard?

  No way. You're, um, the approval goes in the opposite.

• 2:15:44Speaker 01

  Like I'm seeking Aaron's approval. My point is.

• 2:15:46Dax Shepard?

  And then it'll turn at some point and she'll be seeking your approval. And so do I think Aaron will enjoy that?

• 2:15:52Speaker 01

  It's not, it's not for her to enjoy or not enjoy. It's.

• 2:15:56Dax Shepard?

  You were just asking, do I agree that that's the pattern? That you were asking, do I agree that's the pattern?

• 2:16:01Speaker 01

  That's what I was asking.

• 2:16:03Dax Shepard?

  Yes, I do.

• 2:16:03Speaker 01

  But anyway, okay, so I did not text her. Um, I'm waiting for her to text me. I will, I'll see how that goes. Um, okay, the average height nationally. The average height for adult men in the United States is five feet, nine inches. And the average height for adult women is five feet, four inches.

• 2:16:23Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, my mom nailed it. Isn't it funny guys feel so less than if they're not six foot? That's what every guy's trying to lie and say they're six foot. But it's like, they should be lying to say they're five nine.

• 2:16:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. How many podcasts currently exist? 3.8 to 4.7 million registered shows across major directories. It's actually lower than I thought.

• 2:16:44Dax Shepard?

  There had to have been some falloff after the boom happened for sure. Like everyone I knew was starting one and then not everyone stuck with it.

• 2:16:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:16:52Dax Shepard?

  Still, that's a lot. 4.7 million. Imagine if there was 4.7 million television shows.

• 2:16:57Speaker 01

  I know. I mean, it's crazy.

• 2:16:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:16:59Speaker 01

  It says roughly 619 million people listen to podcasts worldwide.

• 2:17:03Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so we have a lot. We have a lot of room for growth.

• 2:17:07Speaker 01

  Yep. Um, who gave out Dr. Mike's Sexiest Doctor Award? People Magazine.

• 2:17:13Dax Shepard?

  Okay. Did BuzzFeed also maybe?

• 2:17:16Speaker 01

  I didn't.

• 2:17:16Dax Shepard?

  Okay. Didn't find, didn't see that.

• 2:17:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um, David Foster's Grammy. So he's won 16 Grammys out of 45 to 47 total nominations. That's insane.

• 2:17:28Dax Shepard?

  It's bonkers.

• 2:17:29Speaker 01

  Producer, composer, arranger.

• 2:17:31Dax Shepard?

  Worked on, uh, I Will Love You, I Will Always Love You.

• 2:17:34Speaker 01

  I know. He's incredible, but it's also funny because.

• 2:17:36Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I think he's had one in every decade too.

• 2:17:38Speaker 01

  Wow. I think there is a generation that knows him as Yolanda's husband. I mean, not anymore.

• 2:17:45Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I didn't know any, like when I, I, I had, I've seen that in the research and it's like, I don't know any of these characters.

• 2:17:51Speaker 01

  I mean, I have to say, cause I watched Real Housewives of Beverly Hills at the beginning and Yolanda, um, was a housewife.

• 2:17:59Dax Shepard?

  That was his, at the time, ex-wife or current?

• 2:18:02Speaker 01

  They were married at the time.

• 2:18:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 2:18:03Speaker 01

  And so he would come in and out and it was like, oh, she's married to this big led, music legend, but I didn't really know him.

• 2:18:11Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:18:11Speaker 01

  And then it's all kind, then like Gigi Hadid, just wild to see they're on their own huge.

• 2:18:19Dax Shepard?

  And who's father? Who, who, who's the father?

• 2:18:22Speaker 01

  Mohammed, and I don't remember. Oh, Hadid, duh.

• 2:18:26Dax Shepard?

  And who's Mohammed Hadid?

• 2:18:27Speaker 01

  He's somebody.

• 2:18:28Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:18:29Speaker 01

  Uh, but he wasn't in the show.

• 2:18:30Dax Shepard?

  It's a real estate developer.

• 2:18:32Speaker 01

  Okay, does altitude do anything for sexual activity? Um, yeah.

• 2:18:37Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 2:18:37Speaker 01

  It affects sexual function in the body's reproductive response due to lower oxygen levels. And changes in air pressure. It says decreased libido, well, actually it says psychological effects on men.

• 2:18:50Dax Shepard?

  Hmm.

• 2:18:51Speaker 01

  Decreased libido.

• 2:18:52Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:18:53Speaker 01

  Erectile dysfunction.

• 2:18:54Dax Shepard?

  Okay, if you've got a cheating husband, let's get up to altitude.

• 2:18:57Speaker 01

  Hormonal and sperm changes. Psychological effects on women and general experience. Respiration and stamina, lower ambient oxygen increases breathing rate and heart rate during physical exertion, which can cause fatigue or shortness of breath more quickly during intimate.

• 2:19:13Dax Shepard?

  So it sounds like it's, it's a terrible place to lose your virginity, it sounds like.

• 2:19:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, it doesn't sound fun. Intensified sensations.

• 2:19:19Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 2:19:20Speaker 01

  For some people, acute or mild high altitude exposure combined with the excitement of travel or a new environment can heighten physical arousal and perceived intensity.

• 2:19:30Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:19:30Speaker 01

  Okay. Uh, mood and sleep, that doesn't, although we did just learn they're all connected. Okay, sleep disturbances, insomnia and altitude-related mood shifts, such as increased anxiety or fatigue, can indirectly dampen overall sexual energy.

• 2:19:44Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

• 2:19:46Speaker 01

  Okay, when did the Sultan of Brunei declare Sharia law? He announced the introduction of Sharia penal law on October 22nd, 2013. And the first phase of the law officially took effect on May 1st, 2014.

• 2:20:02Dax Shepard?

  Hmm, and we were at that party before children, so that would have been pre-13. I wanna say it was like in the 09-ish range.

• 2:20:12Speaker 01

  Well, it couldn't have been, cause you said then two weeks later.

• 2:20:15Dax Shepard?

  I must've got that part wrong.

• 2:20:17Speaker 01

  Oh, interesting.

• 2:20:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:20:18Speaker 01

  2009, I was just graduating college.

• 2:20:21Dax Shepard?

  Oh, just a young, eager.

• 2:20:23Speaker 01

  Walking across that stage, excited to.

• 2:20:26Dax Shepard?

  Summa cum laude?

• 2:20:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:20:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:20:29Speaker 01

  Decided to get out here and trick, trick everyone into liking me.

• 2:20:33Dax Shepard?

  Special walk for the summa or just special tassels?

• 2:20:36Speaker 01

  No, special tassels.

• 2:20:37Dax Shepard?

  Are, we had two different ceremonies.

• 2:20:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, us too.

• 2:20:40Dax Shepard?

  Okay, yeah, yeah, there was an honors.

• 2:20:42Speaker 01

  College. Oh, so we had, yeah, there was also a.

• 2:20:45Dax Shepard?

  We had like the whole magna. You did the magna, the magna summa, the magna, you know?

• 2:20:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, there was something special I did, but I think that was for the like.

• 2:20:54Dax Shepard?

  I just forgot what I am. What am I?

• 2:20:56Speaker 01

  You're mag, you're, uh.

• 2:20:57Dax Shepard?

  Magna cum laude. You can just be cum laude, magna, and then summa.

• 2:21:01Speaker 01

  Yes. And then we had specific graduation ceremonies for, yes, your college.

• 2:21:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:21:08Speaker 01

  Within the university and then the university ceremony and that was tassels, no walking.

• 2:21:13Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:21:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, too big.

• 2:21:14Dax Shepard?

  Too, yeah.

• 2:21:15Speaker 01

  Too big, huge school, great school.

• 2:21:17Dax Shepard?

  Huge school, great school, beautiful school.

• 2:21:19Speaker 01

  Um, okay, that's it.

• 2:21:21Dax Shepard?

  Love you.

• 2:21:22Speaker 01

  Love you.