Fearne Cotton: “I’m completely out of my depth!” Happy Place turns seven

It’s Happy Place’s 7th birthday! To celebrate, Fearne’s put down her own trusty notebook and let her presenter mate Alex Jones turn the interview tables! In this chat, Alex asks Fearne about Happy Place’s evolution from a podcast, to a book publisher, to a festival, and now a marketplace too. Fearne opens up about feeling bleak and being on anti-depressants before she created Happy Place, as well as all the moments she’s cocked up personally and professionally over the last seven years. Do you have imposter syndrome and a deep desire to be liked? Fearne chats about how to cope with those feelings. Fearne’s also got better at admitting she’s ambitious and proud of her work, and wants you to be allowed to feel good when you’re good at something too! You’ll hear some exclusive BTS stuff: how does Fearne pick guests for the show? What does she look club in Book Club author? And how the bloody hell does she manage her time as a brand founder, presenter, mum, and mate?? (Spoiler: she tells Alex about the reality of bringing her kids to work!) Plus, Fearne answers the questions you’ve voicenoted her on Instagram! One of you has sparked an important conversation about fertility, and Fearne and Alex cover other big topics like taking more time to consider death and grief. If you liked this episode of Happy Place, you might also like: Alex Jones https://pod.fo/e/25a653 Elizabeth Gilbert https://pod.fo/e/54d4 Bjorn Nathikko Lindeblad https://pod.fo/e/10d79a YungBlud https://pod.fo/e/25cf34 Paloma Faith https://pod.fo/e/245bab Child on the line is a three-part documentary podcast series celebrating the Volunteer Counsellors of Childline, and the brave children & young people who contact the helpline service. Listen here: https://www.childonthelinepodcast.com/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Hi, I'm Natalie Dormer and I'm proud to be an ambassador for Childline. This year, Childline turns 40. To mark it, I've made Child on the Line, a three-part documentary podcast. We hear why children needed a helpline in 1986, how it was built against the odds and the challenges children face today, from abuse and mental health to social media and AI. Search Child on the Line and listen wherever you get your podcasts.

• 0:29Fearne Cotton?

  Hello and welcome to Happy Place with me, Fern Cotton. Today, I hope that you've got your snazziest party outfit on, gang, because we are celebrating seven years of Happy Place.

• 0:41Speaker 00

  And it started with you and my girlfriend.

• 0:46Speaker 00

  What are the things that go wrong?

• 0:48Fearne Cotton?

  Oh my god, where do I start? It seemed like every duck and goose in South West London had shit on our site. And I went, I'm too overwhelmed and I don't feel like I should be here. That was a lovely room of like-minded people that want to learn and they're really up for this. So I just literally text her and went, do you want to write a book? She was like, mm, don't know, maybe. This was a day where I had no childcare, so I had to bring my kids to work. And my manager at the time went, you're not here, are you? And I went, no.

• 1:20Speaker 00

  So you ask about your guest's happy place, but obviously, we have to know, what's your happy place? Where's your happy place?

• 1:29Speaker 02

  Where is my happy place?

• 1:31Speaker 00

  It's my bedroom.

• 1:32Speaker 02

  My happy place is in my mum and dad's kitchen.

• 1:34Speaker 03

  My happy place is people, actually.

• 1:36Speaker 04

  It's got to be performing magic.

• 1:37Fearne Cotton?

  So there's an hour before the sun rises.

• 1:40Speaker 02

  It's a cliche, naturally.

• 1:42Speaker 00

  Oh gosh, home.

• 1:43Speaker 02

  You know, to be around the people that you love, you know, is...

• 1:47Speaker 03

  My happy place is on a beach in the Maldives.

• 1:51Speaker 00

  That's a good question.

• 1:52Fearne Cotton?

  Is it wanky to say on stage?

• 1:54Speaker 00

  My happy place really ultimately is with animals.

• 1:58Fearne Cotton?

  I was literally going to say, I think Claridge is one of my happy places. I feel like nothing bad can happen in Claridge's. I can't actually believe that it's been seven years since the first Happy Place episode with the amazing first guest Dawn French, which I'll tell you all about in just a moment. But it does seem wild. Seven years have absolutely flown by. So we're going to do something a bit different today. This is actually very strange for me. I don't have my beautiful trusty notebook full of questions and musings in front of me because I'm not asking any questions. My gorgeous presenter mate, the phenomenal Alex Jones is here, and together, we're going to have a look back at some of the stuff that's made Happy Place what it is over the years. And by that, I mean the podcast, and the festivals,

• 2:43Fearne Cotton?

  the books, all of the hilarious stuff that's gone completely wrong. There's a lot of that, oh my goodness, and all of the incredible moments too, where we've really come together as a community, because quite frankly, none of this would exist without you lot. You've also been asking me some questions on Instagram, so I'm going to answer those too. We're basically just going to have a really good behind the scenes gossip. Just to let you know, I'm sat here currently wearing, I don't know how to describe this outfit, it's a dress, it's sort of floor length, all the fluorescent pinks and yellows and oranges, sort of lots of bits of mesh sort of lace in rows. I mean, I look like a clown is the best way to just distill that information down.

• 3:29Speaker 05

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• 3:59Speaker 06

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• 4:29Speaker 07

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• 5:04Fearne Cotton?

  Well, this is really weird and wonderful, but we're gonna do it. I'm handing over to Alex Jones. Here's the show.

• 5:30Speaker 03

  I absolutely love this dress.

• 5:33Fearne Cotton?

  Me too, me too. Have we started?

• 5:36Speaker 03

  Have we started?

• 5:36Fearne Cotton?

  We can.

• 5:37Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 5:37Fearne Cotton?

  Just call this a start. This is how I do things, Alex.

• 5:40Speaker 03

  I just love this. It's just so... But, oh my god.

• 5:44Fearne Cotton?

  It's ridiculous.

• 5:45Speaker 03

  I think we need to talk about this because nobody will listen otherwise to anything we say. They'll just be going, "Where's the dress from? And how can I get one?"

• 5:52Fearne Cotton?

  Will they, though? I mean, I saw this and fell in love. Anything very brightly colored and textured I have to buy, I thought, "Where... I don't go anywhere. Where am I gonna wear this?" I just thought, "It's Happy Place's 7th birthday. That's an occasion. I'm gonna wear it."

• 6:07Speaker 03

  I think you've done the right thing.

• 6:08Fearne Cotton?

  I look a bit like, do you remember those dolls that in the seventies housed a toilet roll?

• 6:13Speaker 03

  Yes, it is that.

• 6:15Fearne Cotton?

  It's a bit of that.

• 6:16Speaker 03

  I mean, a really good version of that.

• 6:17Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, like a 2025 version.

• 6:19Speaker 03

  But, you know, what do they say? Wear the dress today.

• 6:22Fearne Cotton?

  Wear the dress today.

• 6:23Speaker 03

  Don't wait.

• 6:24Fearne Cotton?

  Don't wait.

• 6:24Speaker 03

  You don't know what's gonna happen.

• 6:26Fearne Cotton?

  Exactly, just wear it. And I feel really happy. It's a jolly dress.

• 6:29Speaker 03

  Well, we should say happy birthday, Happy Place.

• 6:32Fearne Cotton?

  Thank you. It's so good to be seven again.

• 6:34Speaker 03

  Seven and seven phenomenal years.

• 6:38Fearne Cotton?

  I know. I actually can't believe it. It feels like two. It feels like it's really new still and that I'm finding my feet with it, which we are.

• 6:46Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 6:47Fearne Cotton?

  But seven, that feels wild to me that we've been doing this that long.

• 6:50Speaker 03

  Well, I think when you enjoy something.

• 6:52Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 6:52Speaker 03

  I mean, it's true what they say, time does whiz by.

• 6:56Fearne Cotton?

  It does.

• 6:56Speaker 03

  But I think, you know, I think I can speak on behalf of your listeners when I say, I mean, just a huge thank you for all the moments when I've been listening and nodded along, hearing something that somebody said that I needed to hear for a long time, or laughing, or finding a bit of joy in quite a dark place. It's just really good company.

• 7:19Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, thank you. I mean, it is for me too. That's the great thing about it. You know, I sometimes turn up to do a podcast recording and I haven't slept, or I'm in just a bit, I'm on a downer, I'm not feeling good about myself. Guaranteed by the end of whichever chat it is that day, I feel completely different. I feel like I'm a listener too, because, you know, I'm facilitating the chats, but I'm imbibing every bit of information, advice, the storytelling.

• 7:44Speaker 03

  And absorbing it all.

• 7:45Fearne Cotton?

  Absorbing it all. I've learned so much, so much.

• 7:48Speaker 03

  And it started with you.

• 7:51Fearne Cotton?

  Silly like shit.

• 7:53Speaker 03

  Well, I was gonna say, let's go back to the conception.

• 7:55Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 7:55Speaker 03

  The origin story of Happy Place.

• 7:58Fearne Cotton?

  Yes.

• 7:59Speaker 03

  You know, where were you professionally? Where were you personally? When you needed to kind of pivot completely.

• 8:06Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 8:06Speaker 03

  And change what you were doing, and hence Happy Place was born. Take us right back to the beginning.

• 8:11Fearne Cotton?

  Well, I guess I started to not feel great in my early thirties, maybe even late twenties. Let's say early thirties. Just had some stuff going on and I just sort of. Nothing really made sense at that point to me. Before that, I'd been luckily steadily working in the same industry from my teen years and I just thought, I'll just keep going. And hopefully one day I'll be as successful as Ant and Dec. What else could you dream of?

• 8:38Speaker 03

  That's the bar.

• 8:39Fearne Cotton?

  That's the bar. And I was just, it was a very narrow lane of I just have to keep doing everything to ensure that I'm on that path. And then I got to this point where I just really started not liking what I was doing, finding the feedback loop of being on the radio and in the public eye excruciating. And I started to conflate, I guess, other people's view of me with what I knew to be true about myself, which is dangerous.

• 9:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 9:08Fearne Cotton?

  Really dangerous.

• 9:09Speaker 03

  But we all do it.

• 9:09Fearne Cotton?

  We do it. And also, you know, I'm sure you have felt like this over the years and certainly doing the one show where you're exposed to that many viewers every day. When you listen to that feedback and take it seriously, it's not healthy.

• 9:22Speaker 03

  No.

• 9:22Fearne Cotton?

  It's gonna be there, but I think how seriously you take it is important. So at this point, I was taking it all really seriously and I thought it was all true. Every negative thing said about me was true. And I left radio. I mean, this is sort of like incrementally down the line. And I just thought, what am I doing? What, what is the point of any of this? I had no clue. And I honestly thought at that point, maybe I'll just quit everything because it's all too painful. And then I wrote a book called Happy.

• 9:50Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 9:50Fearne Cotton?

  And that was the first time, I guess, I'd talked about anything remotely real. Because a lot of the time, there's not the space to do it on the radio. You know, you've got to entertain people and.

• 9:59Speaker 03

  You're never the full version of yourself because, and it's not a choice, you can't be.

• 10:04Fearne Cotton?

  You can't be.

• 10:05Speaker 03

  Because you're facilitating what they want you to do and you're facilitating a form of entertainment that is scripted and handed to you.

• 10:12Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, it's, there is no space. And you know. You know what it's like, you you can give the best version of yourself most of the time, but all the other bits you just leave at home, like the bit that's stressed out or sad or whatever, you just think that can just wait for me when I get back home. So this was the first time I kind of went, actually, what's going on behind me going morning everyone and playing happy music is I'm going home and I'm crying and I don't know who I am anymore. And, you know, I was in a real period of proper depression, I was on antidepressants, I was feeling pretty bleak. So this book, I thought, people might like it, but also they might just think, we don't care, we don't want to know about what's going on in your head. Or I just, I had no idea how it would land.

• 10:52Speaker 03

  So you were quite scared putting that out?

• 10:54Fearne Cotton?

  Oh, my God, I was shitting bricks. The day before, I remember thinking, I need to go to every water stone in the land and break in and like nick them all or burn them. Like, I cannot have people read this. I was so scared. And I actually, I've not read it since. I can't remember what's in there. I've got no idea.

• 11:11Speaker 03

  I can tell you.

• 11:12Fearne Cotton?

  Literally no clue. But luckily, people seemed to like it. So that got me sort of interested. It piqued my curiosity, like, oh, that's, that's interesting. People seem to like the bit of me that I can't bear.

• 11:25Speaker 03

  Vulnerable.

• 11:26Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, and scared and

• 11:28Speaker 03

  Normal.

• 11:29Fearne Cotton?

  messy and completely flawed. And so then I, you know, carried on writing books, luckily. And then, you know, podcasting had started long before I started Happy Place the podcast, but, but it was still quite new. It was a new medium in terms of, you know, how you used it. People were using it in lots of dynamic ways, but I felt like what I enjoyed most about my previous job was interviewing people and being interested in other people. So I was like, let's give it a try. Let's just try doing a podcast. And I think like the first person I interviewed was my friend Zephyr. That's the first one we recorded.

• 12:06Speaker 03

  Right.

• 12:06Fearne Cotton?

  Just a mate of mine who's got a bloody interesting backstory. And again, I thought, well, see if people like this or not. And, you know, it was a slow burn. It wasn't like we're all of a sudden this huge thing, but it felt good. And that's why I kept doing it.

• 12:21Speaker 03

  So the person that we all knew that you interviewed first was then Dawn French.

• 12:26Fearne Cotton?

  Dawn French.

• 12:27Speaker 03

  Who of course is an absolute icon, not just of comedy. And she's a lovely, lovely person. And you went to her house. And you must have been feeling all the feelings like, oh, it's Dawn French. Because even though that's our job to interview, you still get that. It's Dawn French. It's in a house, which, great for a nose.

• 12:48Fearne Cotton?

  Love.

• 12:48Speaker 03

  Love. But also, it's kind of the birth of something that you're trying for the first time. And this interview is going to shape, in a way, what the rest of the podcast looks like.

• 13:00Fearne Cotton?

  Oh, yeah. I mean, I couldn't think of it in terms of that at all. Because at that point, I was like, will I even continue doing this? Like, this is an experiment. And I said to Dawn, I'm starting my own podcast. Would you come on? And she texts back and went, what's a podcast?

• 13:15Speaker 03

  Brilliant.

• 13:15Fearne Cotton?

  Because this was seven years ago, so it was still a new thing. And I was like, we're just going to chat and then see what happens. And she was like, look, I'll do it, but you have to come to me. And I was like, okay, win, win. We're going to Cornwall. We're going to Cornwall for the day. She made pasties for me and the team. It was a small team at the time.

• 13:31Speaker 03

  Actual pasties in Cornwall.

• 13:32Fearne Cotton?

  Cornish pasties. Her house was right on the beach. It was the dream day. And I didn't really know what I was doing because I'd never done an interview longer than eight minutes. Because radio, TV, it's like.

• 13:43Speaker 03

  It's quick.

• 13:44Fearne Cotton?

  It's so quick and it's so hard to get anything deep out of someone in four minutes. I think from having done the podcast now for so long, it takes about 20 minutes to get to the point where I'm really relaxed and they trust me. That feels like the sweet spot, like, oh, okay, we're one, we're one level down. We've forgotten that the cameras are here. We're just chatting. It's just me and you.

• 14:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 14:07Fearne Cotton?

  Then that feels so good when I click into that bit of, it's just me and this one person. And sometimes, you know, you're talking about stuff that you think, I can't believe we're talking about this. You know, it feels fucking special.

• 14:18Speaker 03

  And sometimes, and that does happen on your podcast, because I think especially, and we'll get to it in a second, but especially during the pandemic. Whoa, you feel like, and I know this is the point of podcasts, but you do feel like you're sitting in the room with you and just not saying something.

• 14:37Fearne Cotton?

  People understood the tone quite quickly because it was just, we're not skirting around subjects, we're diving in with them. You know, I didn't really know what I was doing, but it seemed to work and hopefully it's just gotten better. I would almost hate to listen back to that first one because it might be dreadful.

• 14:53Speaker 03

  Well, I was gonna ask because I can't, I rarely watch anything back or listen to anything back because, oh, just my voice.

• 15:01Fearne Cotton?

  You've got the best voice ever. What are you on about?

• 15:03Speaker 03

  How am I even on the telephone?

• 15:04Fearne Cotton?

  Because, because of that voice.

• 15:06Speaker 03

  No, disgusting.

• 15:07Fearne Cotton?

  The Welsh accent with its lovely little sing-song dialect, what is not to love?

• 15:12Speaker 03

  I'm on yours.

• 15:13Fearne Cotton?

  Are you joking? What common, North West London, common as muck? No, no, let's swap. Voice swap.

• 15:19Speaker 03

  We can't, we can't voice swap sadly, but we can listen back. Now, do you listen back? Did you listen to that first episode?

• 15:27Fearne Cotton?

  Yes, I did listen back to that first bunch because I just thought, what is this? And are people going to be interested? And are they going to listen for the whole time?

• 15:36Speaker 03

  And you can only get better.

• 15:38Fearne Cotton?

  And you can only get better. So I think I did listen to the first, probably actually, for the first couple of years, I was really on it with listening to the edit, making sure I hadn't said something stupid. And I think I got over that initial cringe factor of, oh god, why did I say that? Whatever. And I think it helped me learn and, you know, I've made tons of mistakes doing the podcast and just with Happy Place in general. And that, I think, is all part of it, is that I'll always own up to it or talk about it publicly that we did something wrong or badly or whatever. But I don't so much these days. I think in the moment, I know if I've said something stupid or if it was a good episode or not, and then it's up to everybody else.

• 16:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, but you can make notes now as you go.

• 16:22Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think because...

• 16:27Fearne Cotton?

  I'm quite happy talking about most things, honestly. I don't feel like I would be put in a corner where I was exposed unnecessarily. And equally, we say to every guest that comes on before we start recording, this is collaborative. If you don't like a question, just say, I don't want to answer that. Or if there's something now you want to say, can you not talk about that? This is not me trying to catch you out here. I want this to feel really good for everyone. And equally, they get editorial control afterwards. They can listen to it, take things out if they want. I'm not trying to stitch anyone up. I'm not trying to get headlines here. I want to make helpful conversations that our guests are happy with.

• 17:04Speaker 03

  Hmm. And for that to happen, it has to be a two-way street, doesn't it?

• 17:08Fearne Cotton?

  It's got to be, it's got to be.

• 17:09Speaker 03

  So the podcast started in 2018. And as you say, yeah, they were around, but quite new.

• 17:15Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 17:16Speaker 03

  This was kind of the first big one I feel like we all knew about. So when we went into the pandemic in 2020, you were well established.

• 17:26Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 17:27Speaker 03

  But of course, then everybody had to be quite agile. We all had to change the way we worked. How did Happy Place navigate the pandemic when everybody was now accessible?

• 17:40Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 17:40Speaker 03

  On Zoom, it was a weird energy, wasn't it?

• 17:42Fearne Cotton?

  It was so weird.

• 17:43Speaker 03

  Tom Hanks is in his pyjamas.

• 17:45Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. So great.

• 17:46Speaker 03

  Utility room.

• 17:47Fearne Cotton?

  I love, and looking at in other people's houses, the best.

• 17:50Speaker 03

  I mean, that's my favourite thing.

• 17:51Fearne Cotton?

  The best thing ever.

• 17:52Speaker 03

  That's what I think about when I look back at the pandemic.

• 17:55Fearne Cotton?

  I know, seeing Tom Hanks in his pyjamas and his utility room. I mean, it was an extraordinary experience because at first we didn't know what we were doing. And we were like, is this going to work on Zoom? Is this going to sound the same? And actually, we got really lucky because everybody was sat around, all that, you know, all the musicians' tours had been cancelled. All the actors' promo runs had been cancelled. All of the brilliant writers and psychologists and great thinkers out there were kind of twiddling their thumbs to an extent. And also going through something collectively that then was spurring on new ideas. So we all of a sudden had access to all of these people. And I, one that really sticks out, and also, you know, amongst that was the chaos of us trying to homeschool young kids, which was, I mean, I had the worst ages like you did.

• 18:39Fearne Cotton?

  My daughter had just started reception. What the hell?

• 18:43Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 18:43Fearne Cotton?

  Rex was in year two. Rex was in year two. I was like, this is a shit show. This is so horrendous.

• 18:51Speaker 03

  That probably made it better because you were in the thick of it, like everybody else.

• 18:55Fearne Cotton?

  And I, I went basically up into my stepson's bedroom. He had gone to uni for the first year, so he had a seriously strange time, sort of being locked in a halls of residence.

• 19:04Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 19:05Fearne Cotton?

  So I basically said, mate, I'm taking over your whole bedroom. And I set up a mini studio up there. But I'd had the doorbell going, police cars going past. It was so, kids come in and it was a nightmare.

• 19:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 19:17Fearne Cotton?

  Somehow we did it, but this one episode that really sticks out is Alicia Keys. Well, I was sort of sat there and she was in this gorgeous room in her house and I'd seen her house on Architectural Digest. So I was like, I know where that window is. It's your curved window that overlooks the pool.

• 19:32Speaker 03

  Well, her house, so she came on the show from her house.

• 19:35Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 19:35Speaker 03

  It's like back in in palace.

• 19:37Fearne Cotton?

  It's insane.

• 19:37Speaker 03

  I mean, I know she's successful, but Christ on a bike.

• 19:40Fearne Cotton?

  It's like a spaceship. It's so extraordinary.

• 19:42Speaker 03

  It's amazing.

• 19:42Fearne Cotton?

  So she was sat by this gorgeous sort of billowing curtain and she looked magnificent. And I was like, and I was in my stepson's bedroom with just shit everywhere. And I was like, how is this allowed? How am I allowed to talk to her on Zoom? This feels completely wrong. And she was unbelievably open, so honest, just perfect for, I think, women of my age to hear where she's at and how she's got there. I walked away just feeling, I was buzzed after that conversation and I sort of fell in love with her even more. So it was, it was a great time for Happy Place, I have to say, although, you know, challenging times for everyone in many other ways. We had access to all these great people and people, and there was a desire to hear honest conversations. So we ran with it.

• 20:27Speaker 03

  Yeah, because I think, you know, I mean, the horrible part was people experienced, all of us experienced quite dark times.

• 20:35Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 20:36Speaker 03

  During that period.

• 20:37Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 20:37Speaker 03

  Um, times of joy as well, but also, you know, I think for the first time, mental health was really at the forefront of everybody's mind. And people were looking for podcasts as, well, for companionship.

• 20:50Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 20:50Speaker 03

  As somewhere to feel like they were still belonging to something.

• 20:55Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 20:56Speaker 03

  So did you feel that pressure?

• 20:58Fearne Cotton?

  I don't know if I felt it as a pressure. I felt it, I felt it was a privilege to be. I don't know, having this chat with loads of people that really needed it, and I really needed it, you know, at this point, during that time, I was still having a bunch of panic attacks. I remember I was asked to go on question time to talk about mental health, ironically, and I had a massive panic attack.

• 21:22Speaker 03

  Surely you didn't.

• 21:23Fearne Cotton?

  I had a massive panic attack the night before and I just said, I can't do it. I can't. And it was over Zoom. I was like, I can't expose myself in this way at the moment. I, I can't do it. And I pulled out and I was so annoyed at myself, like, that could have been such a great opportunity to be on a big platform like that, to talk about mental health. And I, I couldn't do it. So it was, you know, I think we were all, whatever we were going through was sort of enhanced during that time. So, you know, and panic attacks have sort of had on and off for, for a long while. But it felt really lovely to know that people were like having their daily walk, listening to the podcast, or were feeling really bloody lonely and we were somehow trying to connect the dots. We actually did our Happy Place Festival online that year. I mean, that was a great learning.

• 22:08Fearne Cotton?

  Because we, for some mad reason, decided to do a month-long festival. What were we thinking? Well, we had a full schedule, every day of the month.

• 22:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 22:19Fearne Cotton?

  Online, so it'd be like a yoga class.

• 22:22Speaker 03

  I remember.

• 22:23Fearne Cotton?

  Follow my meditation, followed by a podcast, followed by something else. We overworked wildly. It was, it was an experiment, but we pushed ourselves way too hard. But again, I think it helped people feel like, there's something for me to do, I'll check in with this talk or this class. And it felt like a privilege. I mean, we were under pressure, but we, but we loved it. We did love it. And we learned a hell of a lot.

• 22:47Speaker 03

  And to be able to provide a service at a time like that.

• 22:50Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 22:51Speaker 03

  Felt like it gave, I mean, I felt like I had purpose because I was still going to work.

• 22:56Fearne Cotton?

  Exactly.

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• 24:58Speaker 03

  So when you started, because obviously Happy Place is now a lot more than the podcast. There's all these different arms. Was that always the plan or did that happen organically?

• 25:09Fearne Cotton?

  No, I mean, I think all of it started as a happy accident. Now we're much more considered and I've got a really great team and we're thinking forward and we're looking at the blind spots that we have. What could we do next? But I think back then it was like, oh, this is working. What can we do next? Should we try a festival? So we did a pop up festival. I think it was 2018. So it was quite early on.

• 25:31Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 25:31Fearne Cotton?

  And there were maybe 200 people who came down. So we were like, oh, there is a demand because 200 people want to come to this. There must be more out there. And it was in London and it was a small indoor event all day. We did yoga and workouts and sound baths and talks. And it felt great. Like we all walked away like, wow, that, that was a lovely room of like-minded people that want to learn and they're really up for this. So shall we try and do it on a bigger scale? And then we did the first live year was 2019 and we went full scale straight away, which was terrifying. Terrifying. I felt completely out of my depth.

• 26:12Fearne Cotton?

  Huge imposter syndrome when I turned up. Like this is too big. I don't like it. I, I, I don't know how to walk around this and feel okay about this being something we've done. It was just very overwhelming. But now I think we see it as just a big celebration, you know, biannual celebration. We do London and Cheshire. And it's just the best. I love being there, meeting everybody, getting big hugs, hearing everyone's stories. People would just come up to me and tell me their story straight away, which is just a total honour that people feel that they can do that. And I just adore it. But that first year, absolutely shitting my pants.

• 26:52Speaker 03

  I mean, the thing is, it is kind of the pinnacle, isn't it? Because people listen throughout the year. They buy the books, which we'll get on to.

• 26:58Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 26:59Speaker 03

  You know, they do all the stuff and then they can actually come and have a chat in the flesh. It is, though.

• 27:05Fearne Cotton?

  You've been.

• 27:05Speaker 03

  Pressure. I've been. I was there in Chiswick House last, my old stomping round.

• 27:09Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 27:10Speaker 03

  Last summer. And it, there's so much stuff there.

• 27:13Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 27:13Speaker 03

  It feels really nice to be there.

• 27:15Fearne Cotton?

  It's a good vibe. It's a good vibe.

• 27:16Speaker 03

  But I mean, but behind all of that. Is a lot of work.

• 27:21Fearne Cotton?

  Yes.

• 27:21Speaker 03

  As you say, it's a huge operation.

• 27:22Fearne Cotton?

  Huge.

• 27:23Speaker 03

  What are the things that go wrong?

• 27:26Fearne Cotton?

  Oh my God, where do I start? First of all, I have to say the biggest thank you to the festival team first and foremost, because they are the most incredible group of women. It's a big group of women. We sit around this big old long table chatting about the festival all year long. Then we bring some men in at the end and they come on site and help do all the other bits and bobs. But it is a core group of the most brilliant females I've ever met in my life. They're amazing. But there are so many variables with a festival that are out of your control completely. One of them being the British weather.

• 27:58Speaker 03

  Ah, that, yes.

• 28:00Fearne Cotton?

  We love it. Um, you know, the festival's in the summer, but that means nothing, as we all know. That means absolutely nothing. So we've had everything from the most scorching weather, which was incredible. That was 2019. 2019? Or was it the year after that? Anyway, I think it was 2019. It was boiling. Little Matt from my team got totally sunburned, didn't put sunblock on.

• 28:22Speaker 03

  Oh, Matt, come on.

• 28:23Fearne Cotton?

  By the end of it. Um, but it was gorgeous. If anything, too hot in some of the tents. So everyone, some, someone always moans about something.

• 28:30Speaker 03

  Of course they do.

• 28:31Fearne Cotton?

  It's too hot in there.

• 28:32Speaker 03

  But this is happy place. Get out.

• 28:33Fearne Cotton?

  Meditate in there. It's too hot. But the worst weather year we had was two years ago. There was a yellow weather warning. So the week leading up, so we start building on site about four days before. Wonderful Hester on the festival team starts bringing in the trucks, getting all the tents put up. It was torrential. And I went down on the Friday. There was, it seemed like every duck and goose in southwest London had shit on our site. There was just shit.

• 29:00Speaker 03

  Perfect.

• 29:00Fearne Cotton?

  Everywhere. It was torrential rain and I was like.

• 29:05Fearne Cotton?

  I want to do a runner. I don't want anything to do with this. I don't want to be part of this. I might not turn up because this is horrendous. But you can't. You can't not. So on Saturday morning, luckily the rain had stopped, but we had a yellow weather warning of 70 mile per hour winds. With tents. With tents. Perfect. Every other event shut, Kew Gardens shut, Goodwood shut. We were like, we're not shutting. We were going to carry on. Yeah. The thought of shutting and, you know, people have booked train tickets, they've booked hotels to stay. But also the logistics of them, do you refund? Well, like, how does that look? We're just doing it. We're just doing it. And actually, it was fine. So the two incidences that happened on that day,

• 29:45Fearne Cotton?

  a tent pole flew out of the main tent at one point. And it was fine. The tent has got millions of poles, so it wasn't going to fall down. But due to like legal, you know, legal reasons, you've got to get everyone out of that tent. So we had to pivot and get everybody out. They were all waiting for Tom Grennan to do a live podcast. So there's 300, 400 people. We had to move to the outdoor stage. Now, my team, completely calm, cool as cucumbers. You wouldn't even know there was drama. It was just whispering in his, we're going to move to the next tent, guys. Shall I tell you the only person who was having an absolute shit show, panicking and freaking out? Go on. Lynne Cotton, my mum. My mum. What was Lynne Cotton saying in all this? Lynne's in her four inch wedges backstage. Lovely.

• 30:29Fearne Cotton?

  What's going on? And I went, nothing. You don't need to, it's nothing to do with you. What, should I stay to watch the podcast because we want to get the dog back home? Or should we, what, what are we going to do? What's going on? Mum, um, I, at this point, I'm not worried so much about if you watch or not. We've just got to move like all of these people over there. So you go and have a chat with dad. You do what you think's best. We'll work that out later. Um, literally the only one freaking out. Everyone else, so cool. We managed to make it work. It was windy, but we got through it. And I think we learned enough about pivoting to feel like we could deal with most things. Because that was extreme weather. That wasn't just like a bit of rain. Yeah. It was extreme. I think the first year was our biggest lump of learnings because we'd never done it.

• 31:14Fearne Cotton?

  And we didn't have enough food trucks, so the queues were too long. You know, we had a big podcast guest just before lunchtime, so then everyone went to lunch at the same time. There are just things that we hadn't thought about properly, which we now think about a lot.

• 31:28Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:28Fearne Cotton?

  So that year, you know, there were people, some people feel the need to come up to you and complain to your face, which is an interesting.

• 31:33Speaker 03

  Do they really?

• 31:34Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 31:35Speaker 03

  That is interesting, isn't it?

• 31:36Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 31:37Speaker 03

  I mean, what are you supposed to do about the weather?

• 31:39Fearne Cotton?

  Don't know.

• 31:40Speaker 03

  You are not Thor.

• 31:40Fearne Cotton?

  Don't know. And I had a few people come up to me and go, I cannot believe these lunch queues. This is ridiculous. I'm like, I know, I'm really, really genuinely sorry about this.

• 31:50Speaker 03

  But it's a festival.

• 31:51Fearne Cotton?

  And, you know, we'll do better next time and we're just learning on our feet and that, they're in the minority, those people.

• 31:56Speaker 03

  Having been there last year, I have to say, I believe you when you say those people are in the minority because there's a lovely feeling there.

• 32:05Fearne Cotton?

  There is.

• 32:06Speaker 03

  I've never seen a room full of people look so serene and just happy in their own skin.

• 32:13Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 32:13Speaker 03

  And just very, I don't know, appreciative of, of the surroundings that they were in. They, they looked like they were having the best time.

• 32:20Fearne Cotton?

  I always have a little cry on the Sunday at the end of the day because I can't believe that we've done it. And I, like, my sort of faith in humanity is slightly restored, just being in amongst a low. And that's nothing to do with us. I'm not saying, yeah, like Happy Place, you know,

• 32:39Speaker 03

  No, no.

• 32:40Fearne Cotton?

  have created these humans and their mindset. Just so many lovely people turn up.

• 32:45Speaker 03

  Like-minded people, that's the point, isn't it?

• 32:47Fearne Cotton?

  And they're, they're so willing to like, to tell their story. And I hear all sorts of things throughout the day that, you know, terribly sad, terribly beautiful, amazingly connective and everything in between. But on Sunday, I feel so overwhelmed by it. And, you know, I haven't not had a cry on a Sunday. It's just, you know, it's just all too much in, in the best possible way. Just lovely people out there. There's good eggs out there.

• 33:14Speaker 03

  And also though, you're taking on all that stuff that they are telling you.

• 33:18Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 33:18Speaker 03

  And so that's the release, isn't it?

• 33:20Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, it's full on. I have to sort of work out what to do with a lot of those stories when I leave because, you know, you, I can't be responsible for. Much, really, and I'll listen happily, but you do walk away going, God, you know, is people going through utter shit out there?

• 33:35Speaker 03

  There really is.

• 33:36Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, I think it's motivating because then we can come and, you know, regroup and go, right, we haven't done a podcast on whatever it might be that I've just heard or, you know.

• 33:44Speaker 03

  See, it's interesting with the subjects because they are so varied, so diverse. Hattie has got a question on that subject.

• 33:52Speaker 09

  Hi, Ethan and the Happy Place fam. Off the top of your head, can you think of an interview or conversation you might have had on the pod that has been the most impactful on your life since it was shared with you? Any advice or theories that you've incorporated routinely as a result?

• 34:08Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, whatever I say, I'll kick myself and think, I should have said this because there's, it's so hard, there's been so many brilliant guests on.

• 34:18Speaker 03

  I mean, that is an impossible question, really.

• 34:19Fearne Cotton?

  It's hard, but I do remember, I'm a big fan of Elizabeth Gilbert, she's my favourite writer, I was so starstruck meeting her, I was almost giddy and I was, I had verbal diarrhoea when I started talking to her, I was just, I regret a lot, a lot of that first encounter with her.

• 34:35Speaker 03

  We've all been there, Ethan.

• 34:36Fearne Cotton?

  We've all been there. I was just going, blablabla.

• 34:38Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:39Fearne Cotton?

  Um, and then I like cringily gave her one of my books, I just wish I hadn't done that.

• 34:43Speaker 03

  You're not cringe.

• 34:44Fearne Cotton?

  It is, I was too overexcited. But, anyway, she was talking about the time when her partner at the time was really, really ill, terminally ill, in hospital, and she was sat by her bedside and having all the thoughts that you do when you know someone that you love is probably not going to be here much longer, which is really sort of existential and hard to get your head around. And then on her phone, she's got emails from people she knows, texts from people she knows, emails from friends of friends, emails from people she doesn't know, like we all do, this overwhelming inbox.

• 35:22Fearne Cotton?

  Constant supply of messages we're meant to stay, you know, on top of and in contact with all these people. And she just deleted everything. She was like, this does not matter in the context of what I'm going through. This doesn't matter. So that one really stayed with me because I have so often, like most nights, I'm trying to cook the kids tea or rushing around. I can hear my phone vibrating and I'm like, oh my God, another email. And then I'll quickly try and do that and then I'll come back to the dinner and then I've burnt something and then the kids are shouting at me. And, and it's just all such a bombardment of information. And I always think about her deleting it and I don't, I'm not as bold as.

• 35:58Speaker 03

  I was gonna say, have you done it?

• 35:59Fearne Cotton?

  No, but it makes me just stop and pause and think, if I don't get back to someone on text for three days. They're not gonna hate me.

• 36:07Speaker 03

  No.

• 36:08Fearne Cotton?

  The world's not gonna end, it's gonna be fine. So that was a small tweak in ways, but a big story.

• 36:15Speaker 03

  That is a big tweak because sometimes the girls in the makeup room and they look at my phone, they go, does that not worry you, Al? Like 456 unread emails and I'm like, I just, I just can't get round to it. I just haven't got the capacity.

• 36:31Fearne Cotton?

  And why should you? Why should you either?

• 36:34Speaker 03

  Delete them? Elizabeth Gilbert, that is extreme, but I like it.

• 36:38Fearne Cotton?

  I like it. It's really stuck with me, really stuck with me. And then one conversation that I'll never forget because it was probably one of the most important chats I've had in my life, in or outside of work. Was with this amazing guy who used to be a monk.

• 36:51Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 36:52Fearne Cotton?

  It's called Bjorn Nathikko Lindblad. And he had finished his sort of monastic life that had, he'd lived for 17 years to go and do talks and lead a more regular life. And he met the love of his life and was living in Sweden where he's from. And then he got diagnosed with ALS, which is obviously, you know, a horribly debilitating illness that, that leads to you dying.

• 37:17Speaker 03

  I never remember what it stands for.

• 37:19Fearne Cotton?

  I don't, but it's basically a degenerative illness where it just stops your body from working very, very slowly and.

• 37:27Fearne Cotton?

  He knew at the time of talking to us that he had about a month to live. And I cannot tell you how generous he was with his view on life. And it was just so poignant. And weirdly, and this sounds, I'm almost embarrassed to say this, but weirdly, one of my cats had died the day before. And he'd, he'd been told or he'd read it online and he brought it up. So we really, and I was in mega grief about this cat. I'd had this cat for 21 years. I was so in the thick of the grief at the time. So we talked about death in a very sort of real way, in a way that I'd not talked about death before.

• 38:05Fearne Cotton?

  And he was just so generous and broad minded and actually quite celebratory.

• 38:13Speaker 03

  Was he?

• 38:14Fearne Cotton?

  Yes, he'd had a few, a living funeral a few months before. And he was talking about his life in the most joyful way and talking about death in a curious way. Like, what is it gonna be?

• 38:25Speaker 03

  So was he, was he scared?

• 38:28Fearne Cotton?

  Not so much, not so much. I think he'd really made peace with it, which is so rare.

• 38:33Speaker 03

  Well, and it's, I mean, it's supremely brave. I'm scared of death every day of my life.

• 38:39Fearne Cotton?

  Same, same, same, same. Hence why I was so fascinated. I was hanging off his every word. And, and then when I had to say goodbye to him at the end of the chat, I didn't know how to do it.

• 38:50Speaker 03

  Because that's gonna be it.

• 38:52Fearne Cotton?

  See you soon or like.

• 38:53Speaker 03

  Because the reality is, you might not have ever spoken to him again anyway.

• 38:58Fearne Cotton?

  Anyway, but it, I knew it, but it was a fact. Yeah, and it felt like it.

• 39:03Speaker 03

  So how did he, how did he do it?

• 39:05Fearne Cotton?

  I cried the whole time. I was just sort of weeping and it was so, and I felt like I really sort of connected with him during that chat.

• 39:13Speaker 03

  So did that change then the way you look at death?

• 39:18Fearne Cotton?

  It did a bit. At the time, I was talking a lot to my late friend, Chris Helenger, who, you know, we've, I've been on the one show to talk about Chris and with Maran, you know, she's amazing. And, and Chris was really up for talking about death. I wasn't. I was terrified. It's awkward, don't know what to do, how to talk about it. So I think having that chat with Bjorn then opened up more conversation with me and Chris. Cause she would send me articles or. Thoughts about it and I'd be Cajun, I didn't want to say the wrong thing and then that makes you not say anything, which is not great.

• 39:52Speaker 03

  Not helpful, yeah.

• 39:52Fearne Cotton?

  So I think it did help open up a bit of an avenue for me and Chris to talk more about it, which I'm, you know, again, I'm so grateful for everything she taught me. And she ended up having a living funeral about a couple of years later and some of that was inspired by Bjorn.

• 40:06Speaker 03

  With Dawn French.

• 40:07Fearne Cotton?

  With Dawn French. I mean, it was just the best, the best day. But yeah, it was, that was one that I'll never, ever forget and I feel so grateful I got to do that chat.

• 40:17Speaker 03

  Reminds me of the big stuff. I think though, when you've lost somebody like Chris, I mean, we lost one of our uni girls and they're my best friends and we lost Maggie for Mag.

• 40:25Fearne Cotton?

  So sorry.

• 40:26Speaker 03

  And she was just hilarious. Her handbag was a lunchbox, you know, and she was just so funny. She worked in the newsroom in the shortest of miniskirts.

• 40:35Fearne Cotton?

  Oh, I love her.

• 40:36Speaker 03

  And she was just a character. And that made me feel better about it because I thought, oh, well, if Mag's gone through it and she's obviously out the other side, it must be all right. And the fact that, I don't know, it, sometimes you need somebody you know in a way who's, I don't know, it's a very odd subject.

• 40:53Fearne Cotton?

  It's so abstract.

• 40:54Speaker 03

  I'm still terrified of it.

• 40:55Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, I am. It's so, and sometimes, you know, I'm sure you feel like this about Maggie, I think, sometimes I sort of think, oh, Chris is at, like, she's just in Cornwall.

• 41:02Speaker 03

  That's what I think.

• 41:04Fearne Cotton?

  And then I'm like, oh my God, she's not. And I can't get my head around, where is she? I cannot get my head around it.

• 41:09Speaker 03

  But they're somewhere.

• 41:10Fearne Cotton?

  They're somewhere. They're definitely somewhere.

• 41:12Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 41:13Fearne Cotton?

  But it's just so, it's so abstract, so surreal. So, you know, and we, we hadn't covered death really on the podcast, so I think that was quite confronting for a lot of people, but I feel lucky we can just, we can chat about this stuff very openly.

• 41:27Speaker 03

  And you know, sometimes, I mean, because you cover, I mean, insomnia, skincare, OCD, you know, all of it.

• 41:33Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 41:34Speaker 03

  I mean, the whole gamut. Does who you. Interview and who you sort of ask to come on depends sometimes on where you are. Is there any sort of reflection of where you are personally at that time?

• 41:48Fearne Cotton?

  I guess so. I mean, not always. Sometimes people, you know, on a very base level are doing a press junket run and and they're like, we want them.

• 41:55Speaker 03

  And they're available.

• 41:55Fearne Cotton?

  And they're available. But I think, yeah, sometimes I'll say yes to people that maybe my team might go, really? And I'll go, oh, this is, trust me, this is going to be fascinating. And it's someone that no one's ever heard of. It could be a book that I've read that I thought was great, or someone that I've been introduced to and I think they're amazing. There's no sort of scientific formula as to how we pick our guests or why they're on.

• 42:18Speaker 03

  And that stars sometimes aligning, isn't it? Because you might have read the book because you felt a certain way, which then led, you know, leads to the guest.

• 42:26Fearne Cotton?

  Absolutely.

• 42:26Speaker 03

  Yes, it's all sort of organic.

• 42:28Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 42:28Speaker 03

  With the books though, because they're obviously an addition to Happy Place.

• 42:32Fearne Cotton?

  Yes.

• 42:33Speaker 03

  And a very obvious addition because, you know, it fits, doesn't it?

• 42:37Fearne Cotton?

  It fits perfectly.

• 42:38Speaker 03

  But, you know, oh my God, how are you, just how are you reading all the books for book club? How are you finding all these authors?

• 42:49Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 42:49Speaker 03

  How are you then? Because we know, and it shows that you do a massive deep dive on your guests. I mean, there's a lot of homework there. And, you know, as Chris Evans always said, fail to prepare, prepare to fail.

• 43:00Fearne Cotton?

  Yep.

• 43:01Speaker 03

  Um, and we've both, you know, got our notebooks and all the rest of it. But in terms of time management, I think people who listen to this podcast and appreciate what Happy Place does as a brand, just wonder, how the hell do you do it?

• 43:16Fearne Cotton?

  The book thing is tricky because I have to read a lot, like a hell of a lot. So.

• 43:21Speaker 03

  Are you a speed reader?

• 43:22Fearne Cotton?

  Not really. And because also I write notes in the margins so I can then collate all the stuff for the interview. So it's not a quick process. But I like going to bed really early, luckily. So I'm reading every night for probably 45 minutes. When I start to get sleepy, I'm like, okay, we're good. And then I am in the terrible habit of when I put my daughter to bed, she wants me to sit outside her bedroom while she falls asleep. So I've got another half an hour there and that's where I'm also reading. So I've got a stack of books on my bed like this. And I'm like, what is the order that I need to read? I'll grab one.

• 43:53Speaker 03

  Oh my God, yes.

• 43:54Fearne Cotton?

  But I do love reading. If even if I had. Rarely, but like an afternoon off, I would wanna read in the bath. I don't think there's any better combination. Absolute heaven. So I am, I am just reading a lot and I, I, I don't really watch TV that much. Something has to really grab me. Like I just devoured The Last One Laughing, best show I've seen on TV.

• 44:15Speaker 03

  Oh my god, hilarious.

• 44:17Fearne Cotton?

  I, I just loved it.

• 44:18Speaker 03

  Do you think, do you think it's because they are comedians or do you think, cause I don't think it would work as well with just normal people?

• 44:25Fearne Cotton?

  No, no, no. They're, these are the best comedians out there and they are so clever.

• 44:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:29Fearne Cotton?

  Catching each other out. I've never laughed so much in my life. I have loved it. But I so rarely watch a series. I'm so behind. Like, I haven't even seen bloody Breaking Bad. I haven't watched ER.

• 44:40Speaker 03

  Well, I'll make you feel better. Neither have I seen ER and I got to see series three of Breaking Bad and decided I didn't like it.

• 44:47Fearne Cotton?

  Oh god, you wasted a lot of time there, babe.

• 44:49Speaker 03

  Only because. I was like, there are seven or whatever seasons.

• 44:52Fearne Cotton?

  Haven't got the time. No, I'm, if I've got the time, if the kids go to bed and I've got time and I'm not knackered, I'll read. I'll read any, and also it helps, it makes me a better writer. So there's no downside to it. But yeah, I am reading a hell of a lot. I mean, book club, we have a book a month, but they're always brilliant books. We would never pick a shit book. So that's a joy.

• 45:11Speaker 03

  Well, what do you look for in an author then?

• 45:13Fearne Cotton?

  Um, I think if it's just for book club, it's just something we know our audience will love. If it's something we're publishing, I think we're just trying to cover all bases again, subject matters that are gonna really be helpful. We've got a sort of internal line that we use, which is something along the lines of, you know, it's either books or stories that are gonna bring joy or educate, something like that. So we, we know if a book's gonna resonate or not and what subject matter to, to pull from. So we were really, really lucky last year. We had two Sunday Times, um, I think they're both number ones actually. Paloma, Faith and Youngblood.

• 45:53Fearne Cotton?

  I was like, why hasn't Pyma written a book about motherhood? She's, and also wasn't she just written a book? She's one of the smartest people I've ever met.

• 46:00Speaker 03

  So did you go to her and say, look?

• 46:02Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, so I just literally text her, went, do you wanna write a book?

• 46:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:05Fearne Cotton?

  And she was like, mm, don't know, maybe. And then wrote the most sensational book that everyone is still talking about. It was in the top 10 for weeks on end. It's so good. It's called MILF, if you haven't read it. And then, again with Youngblood, I'm just a mega fan. I think he's a superstar. He's like one of the only rock and roll stars of this new generation. And I was like, he's got so much to say. He needs to put pen to paper and do this. So he made this amazing record journal for us. Again, I just said, do you wanna come to my office and have a chat? This was a day where I had no childcare, so I had to bring my kids to work. It was one of those days.

• 46:41Speaker 03

  Oh, no.

• 46:42Fearne Cotton?

  So I was like, kids, you get to meet Youngblood? And they were like, who? They're too young.

• 46:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:45Fearne Cotton?

  So anyway, he was lovely to the kids. And then I sat them in a corner with a tablet and they just gamed for two hours whilst I talked to Youngblood. And then one of my team just kept giving them sweets. I was like, this is an absolute shit show. But he said yes, and again, top 10 Sunday Times bestselling books. We were so chuffed. So yeah, that feels like a really exciting new, it's, for me, what I miss about doing Radio 1 is the opportunity to find a new band or artist and help them on their way. And I haven't got the, so this is the new opportunity, is finding someone who you know's got a book in them.

• 47:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 47:21Fearne Cotton?

  And, and giving them that opportunity. So I, I love that bit. It's like my favourite thing to do.

• 47:26Speaker 03

  Well, there's somebody who's a listener, who's been in touch, and this is very timely. Let's hear from Megan.

• 47:34Speaker 10

  Hi Fern, I'm 25 years old and I've recently started fertility treatment using donor sperm. As for a long time, it's been my dream to become a mum, even though I'm single. As I've been going through my fertility journey, I've been writing down my thoughts, my feelings, my experiences and questions that I've had. And I'm hoping maybe one day that my story can be shared with the world. Maybe inspiring other people, my aides, to just go for it if they want to do the same. My question to you is, how did you go about navigating the publishing world and bringing your first book to life? Do you have any nuggets of knowledge that you could share with me, please? Thank you.

• 48:12Fearne Cotton?

  Wow, what a babe.

• 48:13Speaker 03

  There's so much to say on that, isn't there?

• 48:15Fearne Cotton?

  So much. Do you know, my first thing is just start writing it.

• 48:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:19Fearne Cotton?

  The book, there's never a great time to write a book. And there's no moment where you think, today's the day, the book's gonna come out of me. You've just got to start. And that first bit you write might be a pile of shit. So you might go back and rework it down the line. But as long as you're just getting things down on your laptop every day, if you can, could be two words, you're in the flow of it. So I think just write it, Meghan. And then I think it's all about, now with books, like the whole, the book industry has changed so much over the years. I mean, I've only been in it for about 10 years, but it's changed so much over the years. And now so much of it is about building out from that book. So making sure that you're talking about it on social media. You're giving people that don't even like books, a taster of what you're talking about.

• 49:04Fearne Cotton?

  So they're hooked in with the subject matter. I think fertility is such a hot topic and one that so many people, no matter where they are in their journey with it, or what age they are, want to feel armed with knowledge and also want to hear positive stories because there's so many negative ones. So I think you've just got to keep putting it out there until you get that following. It's all about building that following and getting people involved with your story. So by the time the book's there, you've got an engaged audience who are like, oh my God, I, this is the exact book I need.

• 49:35Speaker 03

  I'm ready for it, yeah.

• 49:36Fearne Cotton?

  This is the book I need.

• 49:37Speaker 03

  Well, I mean, with that, I mean, so many things. Meghan at 25 is so sure she wants to become a mom. That is amazing to have that clarity.

• 49:43Fearne Cotton?

  Yep.

• 49:44Speaker 03

  That young and to actually go for it. I mean, already there's a market for that.

• 49:48Fearne Cotton?

  Yep.

• 49:49Speaker 03

  Even before she's written a word.

• 49:50Fearne Cotton?

  I'd buy it. That's what we're all craving, is real stories and honesty. We're so bored of everything looking shiny and perfect and we want to hear the nitty gritty. So I think a story like that is, is gonna be great.

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• 51:34Speaker 03

  It must be so satisfying to be able to get in touch with Paloma and say, "Do you want to write a book?" And not just people that are out there in the public eye, people like Meghan or a listener who might have a fantastic idea for a story or a different take on something, and you can do that.

• 51:53Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 51:53Speaker 03

  Is the books angle... I mean, this is a hard question, because it's like picking children. You've got the festival, you've got the books, you've got the merch now, which I imagine is the fun bit.

• 52:03Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, merch. We sold merch at the festival and online, but we're starting our whole marketplace. We've sort of soft-launched it this year. We've got lots of lovely things on there, so that's a whole new monster that we're dealing with.

• 52:13Speaker 03

  But which are you most proud of?

• 52:18Fearne Cotton?

  I would say it's got to be the podcast because it's an oversaturated market when I'm sort of talking about the boring business-y side of it. To stay relevant or to keep people hooked in is getting harder, harder and harder. And I'm no spring chicken. When you're 25, you can naturally build this big following. People are excited by you, you're young and gorgeous. You know, I'm not.

• 52:46Speaker 03

  Well, we're in the twilight.

• 52:49Fearne Cotton?

  We're in the twilight, babe. So we've got to work harder. Work harder. And really, and I only want to hone my craft further, get better at what I do. I feel like I'm on rung one of the ladder. I don't feel like I'm anywhere near where I want to be with how I'm conducting interviews, with where I could take happy place. Not in a sense of, I want to take over the world, but what am I doing? How could I be doing this better? It's a lot about bigger.

• 53:16Speaker 03

  Where you can get to as a self-development.

• 53:19Fearne Cotton?

  Correct, correct. And I think the levels of comfort within that feel important to me. And I think the podcast is a never-ending opportunity to do it because every week I sit down with a different person and I feel completely different each time because it's a different person and it's a different story.

• 53:36Speaker 03

  And that's the joy, isn't it?

• 53:37Fearne Cotton?

  And that's the joy. And I can keep getting better. And I think it's still the one place where people, because they're listening so privately and intimately, they do feel perhaps that they can let down their own guard and maybe discover things about themselves that's what I'm doing when I'm listening to the guest speak. So I'm still immensely proud of that and I don't mind saying that. I think when we're, like, British people are very nervous to say they're proud of anything. But I do feel proud of the podcast and that we're still going.

• 54:07Speaker 03

  And it doesn't feel genuine when people say, oh no, you know, everything's shit. Because no, you wouldn't still be doing it. You have to find the moments to celebrate.

• 54:16Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, and also I work fucking hard. And I think, that's the other thing, you know, I think I was very scared to say that before. It's like, oh, I've just been so lucky. Yeah, I have been lucky. I got really lucky when I was 15, getting my first job. I have worked my absolute tits off and I continue to.

• 54:31Speaker 03

  To stay in it.

• 54:31Fearne Cotton?

  Probably too much. And that's something that I'm trying to learn to do is have more balance and try and give myself a break. But I love what I do. It means so much to me and I am constantly scared it will all go. Constantly scared it will all go.

• 54:43Speaker 03

  Because, oh my god, people ask me. Why are you still on that show? Because I love it, you know, I really value the job.

• 54:53Fearne Cotton?

  Yes.

• 54:53Speaker 03

  I still feel excited by it. And I don't know where I'd be without it because it gives me structure, not just routine, but in terms of myself. I like the preparation, I like doing it, I like the buzz and.

• 55:08Fearne Cotton?

  And also, you're fucking good at it.

• 55:11Speaker 03

  Well.

• 55:11Fearne Cotton?

  And don't be British and go, well, I'm not, you're fucking good at it.

• 55:15Speaker 03

  I have some days where I'm, I'm better than at first.

• 55:17Fearne Cotton?

  No, you're, you're impeccable. Like I, I've watched the one show a million times, I've never seen you stumble on a word, fuck up, like you are impeccable. And I think that as women, again, we are nervous to say that we're good at things, but also that it feels really good when you're good at something. It feels really good and that is about time and effort put in. You don't turn up a good presenter.

• 55:39Speaker 03

  No.

• 55:39Fearne Cotton?

  All of us were shit when we started, we were absolutely shocking.

• 55:42Speaker 03

  It's hard work.

• 55:42Fearne Cotton?

  But you do hours and hours and hours to the point where you know, do you know what? I nailed that interview, do you know what? I nailed that one show and it feels great. Why would you not want to do that?

• 55:52Speaker 03

  There are days, of course, where you go, what? I was awful.

• 55:55Fearne Cotton?

  Oh my god, I can't believe today is like this and oh, and I don't feel I can do anything. And you've got something massive to do.

• 56:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 56:03Fearne Cotton?

  When have you had a day where you full, a full, you know, what's the day that you can really recall and you think that was not a good day, you doubted yourself and it all went tits up? I, do you know what? I had one at the festival, it was, it was Tatten Park two years ago and my manager at the time went, you're not here, are you? And I went, no, can you tell? And I don't think anyone else would be able to.

• 56:26Speaker 03

  No.

• 56:27Fearne Cotton?

  And I went, I'm too overwhelmed and I, I don't feel like I should be here. And it was so wild being called out on it because I thought I was doing a pretty good job of just going da, da, da, going on with emotions, of saying hello to thousands of people and interviewing people on stage and being dragged from pillar to post and doing selfies and, you know, it's not normal to do that, it's not normal to think you are worth it. Like, why does someone want to selfie with me? I'm just some random person who's totally flawed and bumbling through life. I was having one of those days where I was like, I shouldn't be here. I shouldn't fucking be, I shouldn't be on this stage. I don't deserve this, you know, I was having a real downer. And her calling me out on it actually enabled me to go.

• 57:07Fearne Cotton?

  God, yeah, that's what I feel like. That's why I'm jumping out my own skin. Because I feel like I don't deserve to be doing this. And I've had it before on the podcast, I've had it when I'm doing TV shows. Terribly so that I don't want to do telly at the moment. Where I just think, I shouldn't be here, I shouldn't be doing this. And I think the only way to get around it, you know, I have made drastic decisions to not do certain things, but I think calling yourself out on it, like, I feel unworthy of being here, or I feel out of my depth. And actually, then going one level deeper, the absolute terror of

• 57:48Fearne Cotton?

  the the sort of fear of being unliked sits beneath a lot of it. Like, if I'm not good, or people find out that I'm not as good as they think I am, they're not going to like me. And I don't even know what that fear is. We've all got it. We don't want to be disliked. And it's really tricky when you land on that. It's like, yeah, I just, just want to be liked.

• 58:11Speaker 03

  But that is the real truth.

• 58:13Fearne Cotton?

  Yes.

• 58:14Speaker 03

  Because people skirt around going, well, what is it? I've got imposter syndrome. And it is all of that. But it's, it's the thing that you just want to be liked.

• 58:21Fearne Cotton?

  Just want to be liked. Even when you have a little bit of insecurity, you just want to be liked. It's that simple. And our job's tricky because if we're not liked, we haven't got a job.

• 58:31Speaker 03

  Well, no career.

• 58:32Fearne Cotton?

  So it's sort of survival. And that sounds really dramatic, but it's sort of survival because I'd, I've got fuck all if I am not doing this. You know, you're going to go back to mum and dad's in Wales. What are you going to do? I'm going back to East Coast. Like, where am I going? Like, it's terrifying. You just want to be liked. So on those days, it feels so heavy that weight because you just want to be liked. And if you're not liking yourself, that is a really hard place to be. It's not fun. So I have those days all the time. And usually, within 10 minutes of doing a podcast, I can talk myself out of it. And or on a festival day or a big day, I'll just take myself away and just have a chat with myself about it for a minute and say to one of my team members, I just need to not speak to anyone for like half an hour.

• 59:16Fearne Cotton?

  And then I'm going to be back in the room and everything's going to be okay again. Because it's very overwhelming, but I, it's so normal to have those days. We all have them.

• 59:24Speaker 03

  We all have them.

• 59:25Fearne Cotton?

  We all have them.

• 59:26Speaker 03

  Hopefully not in Gunnersbury this summer.

• 59:28Fearne Cotton?

  No, not allowed. And if I do, I'll just have a quiet word with myself and all will be fine.

• 59:32Speaker 03

  So you're Tatten Park and Gunnersbury this year. Brilliant.

• 59:35Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, new venue, which is, you know, exciting slash nerve wracking, you know, because it's a whole new thing. But the festival will be the same. It's just a whole new plot, but um bigger and better.

• 59:44Speaker 03

  So Happy Place the future.

• 59:47Fearne Cotton?

  Yes.

• 59:47Speaker 03

  So we've got the books, we've got the merch.

• 59:49Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 59:50Speaker 03

  Bet that's so fun. And we've got the podcasts, obviously, the festival.

• 59:54Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah.

• 59:55Speaker 03

  Pipe dreams for Happy Place.

• 59:57Fearne Cotton?

  I really want Marketplace to grow. It's our first year. We've only really soft launched it at the moment. But we re, what we discovered at the festival was our shopping area with all these small little curated brands that are usually um British owned companies. A lot of them have female founders. A lot of them are just startups, one or two people. That area is so popular. And not only are people going along and buying stuff from these small brands, but also they're chatting to the brand founders and um and learning about their story and and it just feels like a real hub in there. So bringing that to life for our online marketplace feels very natural.

• 1:00:38Fearne Cotton?

  And and like, we're, we're on this journey with all these little brands. It's so exciting. Some of them are bigger brands, some of them have have already established. But it's a really lovely place to distill. You know, the well wellness market is very, very overwhelming. And all of us are like, am I meant to be taking magnesium or not? Putting this freeze cream on or not? Drinking this juice or not?

• 1:01:01Speaker 03

  Of the caca, I can't even say caca, cacao.

• 1:01:04Fearne Cotton?

  It's all so overwhelming. So what our aim is with Marketplace is just to distill it all down and go.

• 1:01:09Speaker 03

  Great.

• 1:01:10Fearne Cotton?

  These brands are ones we really believe in and we know that they are doing great work and that they work. So let's put them all in one place, just to cut out all the noise, come and shop here. So that feels really exciting and I'm getting more and more into sort of the learnings of the business side and that feels like a big one.

• 1:01:27Speaker 03

  But that's also very exciting, isn't it?

• 1:01:29Fearne Cotton?

  Wild, yeah.

• 1:01:29Speaker 03

  Like a new skill.

• 1:01:31Fearne Cotton?

  It is, it's a whole new world to me and I'm learning on the job and all these new terms I'm having to learn and I have to keep asking questions. What does that mean? I don't know, I've forgotten.

• 1:01:38Speaker 03

  And do you pick the stuff?

• 1:01:40Fearne Cotton?

  Yes, so yeah, we're picking all the brands, yeah, we're picking, brands are coming to us, we're picking brands, we're, you know, going through big lists of brands. Like we do, have we've done for the festival every year, it's so fun.

• 1:01:50Speaker 03

  But it's also a natural addition, isn't it? Because I feel like a lot of your listeners will be those people who, especially maybe in the pandemic, started their kitchen table businesses and thought, I need to.

• 1:02:01Fearne Cotton?

  A lot of them are those brands.

• 1:02:02Speaker 03

  Yeah, and do something different and now to see them succeed and be able to give them a bit of a leg up as well.

• 1:02:08Fearne Cotton?

  Oh, it's amazing.

• 1:02:09Speaker 03

  It's great.

• 1:02:10Fearne Cotton?

  It's great, I'm really excited about that project. And I think really, I don't ever want to forget where we started or what the backbone is, which is the podcast. So if I take my eye off the ball with that, it will go wrong. So I'm really day to day with it, am I doing a good enough job? Am I doing enough homework and just keeping as on it as I can with that.

• 1:02:36Fearne Cotton?

  I'm writing a new book at the moment that we're going to publish through Happy Place, which I'm excited about. So that feels like a near sort of project, future project. And then I think just being open to where, where it could go, I don't know. You know, as I said, it's not like I've got this burning desire to be like the biggest brand on the planet. I just want to do what we're doing well.

• 1:02:57Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:02:58Fearne Cotton?

  And I just want people to feel like they're part of it and that we're not going, we're wellness, you know. I love doing a bit of yoga, I rarely meditate at the moment, which is something I need to rectify.

• 1:03:08Speaker 03

  Oh, I can't do that.

• 1:03:09Fearne Cotton?

  I am flawed beyond, I do, I cock up all the time, I get things wrong, I make poor decisions. I don't want wellness in the UK to be this lofty, exclusive thing. I want Happy Place to make us feel like we can all be part of it, no matter where we're from, what our background is, what we've tried, what we haven't. The disability community are a huge thought in our minds, especially for the festival, that we are as inclusive as possible. And we've got loads more learnings that we're working on year on year. But for all parts of the brand to be as inclusive as possible. So it doesn't feel like something just for a niche group of people.

• 1:03:47Speaker 03

  I'm so glad you said that because, you know, you get to a certain age scared of death. As we've just discussed, I am trying to extend my life.

• 1:03:56Fearne Cotton?

  Yep.

• 1:03:56Speaker 03

  As much as possible. And I feel like some areas of wellness are very exclusive. I don't understand. I don't know what I'm supposed to take.

• 1:04:05Fearne Cotton?

  No, and we're time poor.

• 1:04:06Speaker 03

  You know, and we're time poor. Why can't somebody break this down for us?

• 1:04:09Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, this is what we're desperately trying to do.

• 1:04:11Speaker 03

  Okay, good.

• 1:04:12Fearne Cotton?

  I think the main message with all of it, which gets left out of wellness is give yourself a fucking break. Stop thi- like wellness has become this thing where it's really militant. And if you don't do all of these things, you're not well. And then that becomes boring.

• 1:04:25Speaker 03

  Well, then it becomes stressful.

• 1:04:27Fearne Cotton?

  Stressful. Yeah. That antithesis of what we're trying to do. So.

• 1:04:30Speaker 03

  Have a sound bath. I haven't got time. Shit.

• 1:04:32Fearne Cotton?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're failing because you're not doing enough meditating. Like whatever, just go easy on yourself. I think that's what we're trying to say in a plethora of ways. And we'll continue to look for ways to do that.

• 1:04:45Speaker 03

  Now, you end every podcast by talking about your guest.

• 1:04:49Fearne Cotton?

  I should have thought about this answer.

• 1:04:50Speaker 03

  Here we go. I mean, you knew it was coming.

• 1:04:53Fearne Cotton?

  No, I didn't. I forgot.

• 1:04:54Speaker 03

  Well, we've got to do it.

• 1:04:55Fearne Cotton?

  Because behind the scenes, I forget to ask that question every week. And Anushka, my producer, has to come in and go, can you answer the happy places?

• 1:05:01Speaker 03

  Shit.

• 1:05:02Fearne Cotton?

  So, forgotten again.

• 1:05:04Speaker 03

  So you ask about your guest's happy place, but obviously we have to know. What's your happy place? Where's your happy place?

• 1:05:15Speaker 03

  The person that asks it every week needs time to think.

• 1:05:19Fearne Cotton?

  I generally don't know what to say. There are some obvious actual places, like being by the sea, which is so cliche, but it is.

• 1:05:27Speaker 03

  Oh, no.

• 1:05:27Fearne Cotton?

  In Dorset, by the coast, in the sea if possible. Euphoria.

• 1:05:34Speaker 03

  Who makes up the happy place?

• 1:05:37Fearne Cotton?

  Well, I would say, obviously, you know, close friends and family are everything to me. And it's a small group of people, but they make me feel so great. My old schoolmates, my friend Claire, my friend Kai, obviously my kids and my stepchildren. It's just they're like so important in my life. But I think my happy place figuratively are those little moments where I feel very accepting of myself. It's bordering on liking myself, which is what I'm aiming for. Those moments, that is my happy place where it's just, it's not like euphoria. It's like a low level, it's a low key contentment where I just think, oh, yeah.

• 1:06:18Fearne Cotton?

  Everything's kind of, you know, it's not, not everything's all right because there's all sorts of shit shows going on wherever. But I'm sort of accepting of myself, my flaws and my good side. And I think when I get to that place mentally, that is a happy place.

• 1:06:31Speaker 03

  Congratulations, happy birthday.

• 1:06:34Fearne Cotton?

  Thanks, babe.

• 1:06:34Speaker 03

  Congratulations on the dress.

• 1:06:36Fearne Cotton?

  That's ridiculous. Thank you so much for doing this.

• 1:06:38Speaker 03

  What a pleasure.

• 1:06:39Fearne Cotton?

  I was like, who is going to be the slickest interviewer in town? Who's going to do that? It's Alex Jones and we're so grateful for you giving up your time to do this.

• 1:06:49Speaker 03

  It's an honour and a privilege. As a listener, this has been a lovely insight.

• 1:06:54Fearne Cotton?

  Oh, I love you, mate.

• 1:06:55Speaker 03

  Love you. Thank you.

• 1:06:57Fearne Cotton?

  Well, Alex, thank you. I mean, not only is she just the best pro and the best person at interviewing, I just loved that. And it isn't like I ever really stop and take stock of anything that I've been doing. So to sort of reflect on the last seven years felt really special and I'm really grateful for you lot listening to that and for being such a huge part of it. I love meeting you all at the festivals and at little events across the year. But day in, day out. We're having a good old natter on Instagram, so do come and join us on at Happy Place Official. It's honestly the most beautiful thing, seeing you lot share your own stories and really support each other too. And to carry on milking our seventh birthday, we're going to be sharing lots of lovely chats from the podcast archive that you might discover you haven't heard before.

• 1:07:42Fearne Cotton?

  All right, I'm back here next week with a brilliant Aussie icon, absolute icon. In the meantime, a massive thanks again to Alex, to the producer, Anushka Tate at Happy Place Studios, and to you, because you literally make all this what it is.

• 1:08:24Speaker 11

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