Don't make these financial mistakes

Financial educator Yanely Espinal shares her don'ts when it comes to money. Don't co-sign loans. Don't make hype-driven investments. Don't spend money you don't have. If you've been making these missteps, don't worry — Espinal has advice on how to create a path forward. Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:19Marielle Segarra?

  This is NPR's Life Kit. I'm Mary Alcegara.

• 0:26Marielle Segarra?

  I want to start this episode by saying, we have all made financial mistakes. Yanely Espinal is a financial educator. She works at a nonprofit called Next Gen Personal Finance.

• 0:37Speaker 02

  Which is on a mission to try to get every single high school student in America guaranteed access to a semester course about personal finance and financial literacy.

• 0:46Marielle Segarra?

  10 years ago, she was deep in credit card debt and counting down the days until she was going to pay it off.

• 0:51Speaker 02

  In October of 2015, I was going to make my last credit card payment. So like October of 2015 was my mantra every day, right? Like, I would wake up in 2014 to get dressed for work, and I'm like, October 2015, October 2015, because I knew that was my north star. Like, I was going to be debt-free on that day.

• 1:10Marielle Segarra?

  Yanely wrote a book called Mind Your Money.

• 1:12Speaker 02

  Being low-income and a daughter of immigrants, I really had to learn the money system in the US like by myself. And I wanted to tell that story and help navigate, you know, credit scores and the stock market.

• 1:24Marielle Segarra?

  One thing she's learned: if you make a financial misstep, cut yourself some slack.

• 1:29Speaker 02

  It's OK that I made a bunch of mistakes. It's OK that I thought I was J-Lo when I was 21 and I bought too many clothes and shoes. It's OK. Look, the mistakes were made. I didn't really know how to approach my finances. I never had guidance. We never learn about these things. But now that I know better, I'm doing better.

• 1:44Marielle Segarra?

  On this episode of Life Kit, Yanelli and I are going to talk about some of the common financial mistakes she sees people make. We'll break them up into three categories: borrowing money, making money on your money, and budgeting. And the point of all this is not to shame you, but to give you more information and help you figure out a path forward.

• 2:04Speaker 03

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• 3:37Marielle Segarra?

  So we asked you for some of the most common mistakes that you see. So I think they fall into a few categories. So the first I would say is in the category of taking on debt in general. What are some of the most common mistakes you see for people who are borrowing money?

• 3:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, they just don't understand the relationship between the borrower and the lender. So they don't realize that this relationship isn't like they're gonna help me and give me free money. Like this relationship is they're running a business and they're going to make profit off of me needing a loan right now. And so I'm gonna come in with my business hat on, which means I'm thinking about negotiating. I'm thinking about how can I get the best deal in this partnership and this business deal. And we don't operate that way. Oftentimes, we operate as like we're desperate. We just really need this money and we're gonna just take any loan that we can get. Those interest rates are so high, they compound so quickly that it means that the amount that you're paying back is significantly more than the amount that you borrowed.

• 4:38Speaker 02

  And it can really end up leading you to be trapped in a cycle of debt payments that you can't really get out of.

• 4:44Marielle Segarra?

  Okay, so it sounds like the advice or the takeaway there would be to shop around if you're borrowing money?

• 4:50Speaker 02

  Comparison shop, a hundred percent. It's just like, yeah, getting like this is what we gotta do. This is what we should all be doing.

• 4:56Marielle Segarra?

  On the comparison shopping front, are there institutions that you might consider that might have more favorable terms for you?

• 5:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, totally. Credit unions are notoriously known historically for giving better interest rates on loans. And the reason why is because you're not a just a customer, just a client, like you are actually a member owner. So they're able to take the money that they would typically make in profit and actually divvy it up and give it back to their members by offering much lower interest rates for things like credit card loans or a car loan or a personal loan or even a mortgage loan. So if you are gonna borrow money for any big ticket item like that and you're not a member of a credit union, it's a good idea to establish an account with a credit union a little before you know you're gonna need to borrow money. So that you already have a relationship with that credit union.

• 5:47Speaker 02

  And then when you need a loan, you could say, hey, you know me, you know, I've been I've been doing my banking here for a little while. We have a relationship, I have an account. And so that's gonna give you the ability to go and get lower interest rate loans through a credit union rather than these big, major banks. And then also online research, there are so many marketplaces nowadays that will show you like fifteen to twenty possible loan options. And then you can compare the loan terms and go ahead and apply once you find one that you think is the best deal for you.

• 6:15Marielle Segarra?

  Another financial mistake that you told us you see commonly is about co-signing loans for someone else. Can you talk about that a little bit?

• 6:23Speaker 02

  Oh, yes. This is particularly when you are maybe raised in a, in a family where the values are very much like community oriented, like we're here for each other. We do everything for our family. And what ends up happening is you see sometimes siblings where one sibling has really poor credit, they can't qualify for a loan, and then they ask their other sibling, hey, can you help me? And then, of course, how am I going to say no to my family? So then they co-sign a loan for their sibling and the sibling stops making their payments. And then what happens is you are equally responsible, 100% responsible for the payments because you co-signed. And so I've just seen so many people watching their credit score get tanked because both of the borrowers who co-signed together just are not able to pay back that loan.

• 7:08Marielle Segarra?

  Okay, so what's the advice for people who are in that situation, right? Let's say it's your sibling and they're like, hey, can you co-sign this loan? I really need this. I, I need to get this car so I can get to work. I need this, I need this loan to keep afloat. Help, help me out, please.

• 7:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, I had this happen to me. I had a god sister a few years back who was trying to go back to nursing school and she texted me and asked me to co-sign a loan for her. And I just said, I love you, girl. I want to help you out. I can sit down with you and try and help you find a loan for people with a lower credit score that can help you qualify for that. I can also spend some time with you looking over your credit report to help you boost your score so that you can then try again and see if you qualify for a loan. I'll sit with you and go through your budget and see if we can squeeze out places where there's a little extra money that you're spending maybe unnecessarily. Like, I offered time, resources, and as much help and support as I, I could, being honest about my why, like, hey, you know, I want to be able to help you, but it's not something

• 8:09Speaker 02

  that I'm comfortable doing, putting my credit at risk with somebody else's loan for their goals. And I think if you do that from a place of authenticity, love, kindness, wishing the very best, and not a place of like anger or judgment or spite, I think most people will understand.

• 8:27Marielle Segarra?

  So that's one bucket. Another one is mistakes when you're trying to make money on your money, when you're trying to invest or earn interest.

• 8:37Marielle Segarra?

  What are some of those? What are some of the most common mistakes you see in that bucket?

• 8:41Speaker 02

  Eighty percent of Americans are not using a high-yield savings account. How? Your cash is literally losing value every single year over year because inflation changes every year. Sometimes it's four percent, sometimes it's three percent, sometimes it's seven, eight percent. And your cash sitting in that traditional savings account is barely making any interest at all. Rates are as low as like 0.01 at major banks, right? So we have to kind of go out and look like, how can I put my money to work and make me the most money? Grow me the most money while it's sitting in an account? And right now, hands down, for any cash that you have, it's going to be a high-yield savings account. One thing I will tell you, the banks that offer these accounts tend to be lesser-known banks,

• 9:25Speaker 02

  like online-only banks or mobile-only banks. And people don't really feel that they're all that familiar with these names and institutions that are not as common as like the big, major banks that we see every time we go outside. But if you make sure that your bank account is FDIC insured, or if you have a credit union savings account, that your credit union is NCUA insured. It's the same thing for credit unions. You're making sure you're protecting yourself and your money, and it's backed by the government. So as long as you do that, there's no reason to think that there's something shady going on.

• 9:53Marielle Segarra?

  And so this is one way to make money on your money is putting it in a high-yield savings account. But another way to make money on your money is to invest it. And I think a lot of people are not so familiar with that. What are some of the financial mistakes that you see around investing?

• 10:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, actually, so I was in a workshop, in one of the teaching workshops I've been doing this summer. And at the end of the workshop, one of the cleaning staff people came in, and he spoke to me and he said, hey, I heard your workshop about how important financial literacy is. I wanted to talk to you because when I first got my job, they offered me a workplace retirement plan. It was called like a 401K. My cousin told me to not do it because he said it was a scam. And now I'm getting very close to retirement age. And I, and like, I feel like I made a mistake. I don't know, like, do you know about that? And I was like, Oh my goodness, like my heart just wanted to break for this man. He was an older man. He was a person of color, like characteristics of the type of person who often is underserved by the financial industry.

• 10:54Speaker 02

  And I was just like, oh my goodness, like your cousin did not serve you well, telling you it's a scam. That is not true. It's not a scam. It is a benefit. It's a workplace benefit. So if I if I make a dollar this year, I'm gonna be taxed, right? I have to pay whatever tax percentage I owe on that dollar. But if I take that dollar and tuck it away into a 401k or another workplace retirement plan, it won't get taxed until I actually take it out at retirement in the future. And all the money that I do put into that account will be able to get used to purchase stock market investments. Like, this is amazing, because if you look at the return of the stock market, for example, in 2023, it was 24%.

• 11:36Speaker 02

  But because there's so much volatility, people I think are afraid of it and they think it's scammy because the market return changes year over year. This year could be, you know, negative even, you know, the market could drop and people could lose money in their accounts. But generally speaking, when you just take the average return of all the companies in the stock market in the United States alone over a 20 or 30 year period of time, it's about 9%. So that will actually grow your money. So by the time it's retirement time and you wanna kick back, relax, enjoy the fruits of your labor, you actually have some fruits.

• 12:08Marielle Segarra?

  Yeah. Basically, these are considered a benefit because they offer you some sort of tax savings and because they offer you an opportunity to invest in the stock market. And um to do it potentially with the help of your company, because often companies will provide a match. If you put in, let's say, 3% of your salary, they'll match that and they'll put in 3% of your salary, like the equivalent amount of money you never would have gotten otherwise.

• 12:40Speaker 02

  Yes. If you take $1,500 of your pre-tax income and then you'll put that into your account, but then your company is gonna match it. So then they're also gonna give you another 1,500. So by you putting 1,500 in, it's like your your money is working more for you because the company matches that 1,500. But if you don't put anything in the account at all, well, then you're basically saying, I don't want $1,500 from my company.

• 13:06Marielle Segarra?

  Another financial mistake you've talked about is investing based on what causes hype, right? Like what's hot right now, buying a bunch of shares of individual stocks, rather than putting money into something less risky, like an index fund, which is a big bundle of stocks and bonds.

• 13:22Speaker 02

  So when you pick stocks, you're trying really hard to predict the future and say, I think I know how to pick the stocks that are going to be the ones that are going to go to the moon, that are going to be, you know, make a ton of profit. But you don't know, and neither do I, and neither does the person who's screaming on the news. We're all speculating. We're all just trying to make our best guess based on what we see happening. And if you want to dabble with individual stocks, what I like to say is you should have a percentage rule. So you say, you know, 80% of my money, I invest in the tried and true approach that always works for people, the index funds, the target date funds, the mutual funds, the ETFs that are low cost and really good at harvesting tax losses. So making sure it gives you a good tax strategy, right?

• 14:06Speaker 02

  The other 20%, so one-fifth of your money, that I'll use to kind of dabble in things that I think are hot and cool, like maybe some crypto or maybe some individual stocks that I want to buy. And that's fine, but acknowledge that that's stuff that could really go wrong and you could lose that piece of your account. But at least the majority of the rest of your money isn't going to be completely risked in this world of hype that might work out, but it also might not.

• 14:32Marielle Segarra?

  The other category I would say that we've talked about is budgeting. You sent us one about lifestyle inflation. When you start making more money, you can often start spending more money and then suddenly you think you're broke. I have had, I won't, I won't call out who, but folks I know who are making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year and somehow they're living paycheck to paycheck. Help, I don't understand it.

• 14:57Speaker 02

  It's wild. So what they do is they immediately look around at the other people making multiple six figures and they say, oh, this is the level that we're on now. This is the lane that we're in. So we gotta do the things that people in this lane do. I have to get a bigger house. I have to upgrade my home. We need this, we need that. And so the money that you just started making more, the excess money that you have disappears literally right away into thin air because it's going into new financial obligations that are not necessary. They're not needs. Let's be real. They are wants that you have so that you can keep up with

• 15:36Speaker 02

  the look of being a six-figure plus earner. But you also deserve to have a dignified retirement. And you also deserve a lot of other things, like being able to pass generational wealth down to your children and their children's children. And it takes a generation to create generational wealth. It's not going to happen today or tomorrow or next month. You have to really be in it for the long run.

• 16:00Marielle Segarra?

  Yanalee, thank you so much.

• 16:02Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 16:03Marielle Segarra?

  All right, time for a recap. If you need a loan, shop around. Don't just go to one bank and accept the terms they give you. You can compare rates online and negotiate with lenders. Also, consider opening up an account with a credit union. They may have better interest rates for loans if you end up needing one. If you co-sign a loan for someone else, you will be on the hook if they stop making payments. If that's not something you're willing to do, say no, and maybe offer a different kind of help. Get a high-yield savings account that'll pay you four or five percent interest on your deposits. And to protect your money, make sure the bank is FDIC insured or the credit union is NCUA, National Credit Union Administration, insured. For long-term investments, don't put most

• 16:48Marielle Segarra?

  of your money in stocks that seem hot right now. Instead, invest in funds that include a whole bunch of stocks and bonds. If your employer offers a 401k or 403B or another retirement account, that is a benefit. Use it. Put money in, especially if your employer offers to match your contributions. And if you start making more money, that doesn't mean you have to spend it all. Maybe you don't need that bigger house or nicer car. This episode of Life Kit was produced by Sylvie Douglas. Megan Kane is our supervising editor and Beth Donovan is our executive producer. Engineering support comes from Simon Laszlo Jansen. I'm Mariel Segarra. Thanks for listening.

• 17:31Speaker 03

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