271. Dr. Stephanie Haridopolos: On Screen Harms in Kids & the Surgeon General's New Advisory

Since 2010, math scores in 13-year-olds have dropped 14%, reading has dropped 7%, and by 2050, 40% of kids are projected to have myopia and the Surgeon General's office just connected that curve to the screen in your child's hand. Today, I sat down with Dr. Stephanie Haridopolos, Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary of Health at HHS, to walk through the new advisory on screen harms, the 5-D framework parents can use today, and what bell-to-bell phone policies are actually doing in 37 states. CLICK HERE TO BECOME GARY’S VIP!: ⁠https://bit.ly/4ai0Xwg⁠ Connect with Stephanie Haridopolos through the Office of the Surgeon General Website: ⁠https://bit.ly/4tSfkQp⁠ Instagram: ⁠https://bit.ly/4eLK81e⁠ YouTube: ⁠https://bit.ly/3RCtyqO⁠ Facebook: ⁠https://bit.ly/3R6RLWk⁠ X: ⁠https://bit.ly/3P1RYtf⁠ LinkedIn: ⁠https://bit.ly/4dikiPW⁠ Thank you to our partners A-GAME: “ULTIMATE15” FOR 15% OFF: http://bit.ly/4kek1ij AION: “ULTIMATE10” FOR 10% OFF: https://bit.ly/4h6KHAD AIRES: "ULTIMATE20 " FOR 20% OFF: https://bit.ly/4a3Duze BAJA GOLD: "ULTIMATE10" FOR 10% OFF: https://bit.ly/3WSBqUa BODYHEALTH: “ULTIMATE20” FOR 20% OFF: http://bit.ly/4e5IjsV COLD LIFE: THE ULTIMATE HUMAN PLUNGE: https://bit.ly/4eULUKp CYMBIOTIKA: "ULTIMATE10" FOR 10% OFF: https://bit.ly/4tjyluP GENETIC METHYLATION TEST (UK ONLY): https://bit.ly/48QJJrk GENETIC TEST (USA ONLY): ⁠https://bit.ly/3Yg1Uk9 GOPUFF: GET YOUR FAVORITE SNACK!: https://bit.ly/4obIFDC H2TAB: “ULTIMATE10” FOR 10% OFF: https://bit.ly/4hMNdgg HEALF: 10% OFF YOUR ORDER: https://bit.ly/41HJg6S PEPTUAL: “TUH10” FOR 10% OFF: https://bit.ly/4mKxgcn SNOOZE: LET’S GET TO SLEEP!: https://bit.ly/4pt1T6V WHOOP: JOIN & GET 1 FREE MONTH!: https://bit.ly/3VQ0nzW Watch the “Ultimate Human Podcast” every Tuesday & Thursday at 9AM EST: YouTube: ⁠https://bit.ly/3RPQYX8⁠ Podcasts: ⁠https://bit.ly/3RQftU0⁠ Connect with Gary Brecka Instagram: ⁠https://bit.ly/3RPpnFs⁠ TikTok: ⁠https://bit.ly/4coJ8fo⁠ X: ⁠https://bit.ly/3Opc8tf⁠ Facebook: ⁠https://bit.ly/464VA1H⁠ LinkedIn: ⁠https://bit.ly/4hH7Ri2⁠ Website: ⁠https://bit.ly/4eLDbdU⁠ Merch: ⁠https://bit.ly/4aBpOM1⁠ Newsletter: ⁠https://bit.ly/47ejrws⁠ Ask Gary: ⁠https://bit.ly/3PEAJuG⁠ Timestamps 00:00 - Introduction: Screen harms and the Surgeon General 01:15 - The MAHA partnership and HHS direction 02:51 - From family physician to HHS leadership 04:18 - Demystifying the office of the Surgeon General 06:45 - 25 years of patient care meets public policy 07:56 - A congenital heart defect at age four 10:48 - The new advisory on screen use in youth 12:37 - What the science actually shows 15:40 - Metabolic health and the military recruitment crisis 16:36 - Myopia: 40% of kids by 2050 18:16 - The 2010 collapse in math and reading 19:11 - An entire generation as an experiment 20:05 - Bell-to-bell phone policies and what's working 21:40 - Mental health, body dysmorphia, and deepfakes 23:47 - The five-D framework for parents 27:07 - Why more states haven't adopted bell-to-bell 28:35 - Gut dysbiosis and the body's engine 33:37 - The newborn screening updates saving lives 35:01 - Chronic Lyme disease and federal recognition 38:13 - Lyme awareness month and treatment gaps 39:08 - Bringing 25 years of practice into policy 40:45 - What does it mean to you to be an Ultimate Human? Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational purposes only and does not provide medical advice. It is not intended for diagnosing or treating any health condition. Always consult a licensed healthcare professional before making health or wellness decisions. Gary Brecka is the owner of Ultimate Human, LLC which operates The Ultimate Human podcast and promotes certain third-party products used by Gary Brecka in his personal health and wellness protocols and daily life and for which Ultimate Human LLC and / or Gary Brecka directly or indirectly holds an economic interest or receives compensation. Accordingly, statements made by Gary Brecka and others (including on The Ultimate Human podcast) may be considered. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  If you are exposed to screen time at a very young age, before 18 months, it could affect the full development of the brain. And so it's not just about how much screen time quantity. It's also the quality of it.

• 0:14Gary Brecka?

  Hardly a parent in America today would say, I have no concerns at all about what my child is consuming on social media or the amount of time that they're spending on their phones.

• 0:23Speaker 00

  In the office of the Surgeon General, you have such a huge megaphone to discuss very pertinent health emerging threats to the public. And how then do we amplify that message to increase health and wellness?

• 0:38Gary Brecka?

  In a perfect world, pulling all of your experience, what would be the utopia of success for you if what was accomplished?

• 0:46Speaker 00

  Believe it or not, this is probably the most surprising.

• 1:03Gary Brecka?

  Hey, guys. Welcome back to the Ultimate Human Podcast. I'm your host, human biologist Gary Brecka, where we go down the road of everything, anti-aging, biohacking, longevity, and everything in between. And as you know, lately, I have been very involved in the MAHA action, which is essentially this public-private partnership between Health and Human Services and the general sector, talking about and influencing and having interaction with Health and Human Services on the direction of healthcare in America. And most of all, looking at initiatives to keep people out of the system. Not everything that you're doing in HHS and the USFDA is designed to fix the healthcare system. A lot of it is designed to keep people out of chronic care.

• 1:47Gary Brecka?

  And today's guest is one of those thought leaders. She is a practicing physician. She's a mother, a ballroom dancer. She is an absolutely wonderful human being. Dr. Stephanie Haridopolos is now the Acting Chief of Staff and Senior Advisor to the U.S. Surgeon General's Office. Her role is updated, so I'll allow her to update us on that tune. But thank you so much for coming on the Ultimate Human Podcast.

• 2:11Speaker 00

  This is truly an honor. I appreciate the invite. Thank you.

• 2:14Gary Brecka?

  I'm so happy to have you here. You know, one of the things I've noticed about this administration, at least as it relates to Healthcare and healthcare policy is they're asking hard questions. They're challenging some of the status quo. They're shaking things up all to have a positive impact on Americans' healthcare. They are they are not accepting the fact that we are spending nearly $5 trillion a year on healthcare and the outcome has been some of the sickest, fattest, most disease-ridden human beings on the planet. And I think, you know, I would love, first of all, for you to correct your title because I know I left some of those out.

• 2:57Speaker 00

  Recently, I was promoted to Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary of Health at HHS, and I've been there for 15 months. I had a calling to make a bigger impact than I could just seeing the direct patient care. I miss it. I'm missing my patients and for over two decades, being able to see generations of families of all life, the whole lifespan, from womb to tomb. But with that-

• 3:26Gary Brecka?

  Womb to tomb. I love that. I've never heard that saying. I like that.

• 3:31Speaker 00

  Cradle the grave. But, you know, we can, we're in a big shift in healthcare right now, and I wanted to be a part of that movement. You know, with Kuhn's Law, we talk about, you know, sometimes you have crises and then adrift, but then now we're in a paradigm shift. And with that paradigm shift, we can, with a broad brush, change the trajectory of so many lives in America. And so I said, I want to serve, and it was just such a true honor for President Trump to entrust this huge responsibility in me as one of his political appointees during this time.

• 4:16Gary Brecka?

  You know, I wonder if we might just, for, you know, most people that are watching this podcast, everybody has heard of the Office of the Surgeon General, the Surgeon General for sure, but, and states have Surgeon Generals as well, but can we just kind of demystify the office for a minute and like, what is- The role of this in the government and what are some of the initiatives that are going on the Surgeon General? Why should, why should my audience draw their attention or care about what's going on at the Office of the Surgeon General?

• 4:42Speaker 00

  My goodness, such a long history of the Office of the Surgeon General. You've heard from previous Surgeon Gouverns in the 60s that brought attention to the harms of combustible tobacco to Everett Coop in the 80s with HIV and AIDS. In the Office of the Surgeon General, you have such a huge megaphone and you have a platform to discuss very pertinent health emerging threats and harms to the public and how then do we amplify that message to increase health and wellness.

• 5:24Speaker 00

  So there are many different ways in which the Office of the Surgeon General can communicate. It could be a call to action. It could be an advisory and it could be a commissioned Surgeon General report, which takes years and a longer period of time. In the Office of the Surgeon General, we also oversee Public Health Reports, which is a peer-reviewed journal that's been in existence for 148 years.

• 5:49Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 5:50Speaker 00

  It's the longest peer-reviewed journal in the nation's history and we also oversee the operations of the Public Health Service Commission Corps that has been in existence for over 200 years. So, right now, we have 5,500 Commission Corps officers. They're military-uniformed unarmed healthcare warriors that are all over the United States and some international posts that are there to help with natural disasters, outbreaks,

• 6:28Speaker 00

  if there is, you know, a problem with illnesses coming into our country, ports of entry. They work in every department of the US government and it's, so it's a true honor to serve along Inside them in the office.

• 6:42Gary Brecka?

  Wow, that's, I mean, because I think, you know, very often, we don't humanize these departments. And one of the things I I loved about getting to know you is you had 25 year history as a physician, raised a family, you're a wife, you're a mother, you're a practicing physician in family, family medicine. You've had hands on patients for decades and you're, you're just bringing that, that day to day, decades of knowledge of having been a practitioner, um, you know, into the office of, of surgeon general. So yeah, I feel like you have a really good handle on real world problems, right? I mean, what is, what is everyday mom and dad in America? What are they suffering from? What ailments do they have?

• 7:25Gary Brecka?

  Where are the issues that where the government can possibly intervene and give support, guidance, help, create awareness?

• 7:34Gary Brecka?

  And so I, I, I, I'm very fond of, of, of a lot of the folks in the administration because they do seem to be very, at least, you know, related to Maha, um, because they seem to be very purpose driven and passionate. And we talked earlier about your drive to become a physician. And I wonder if you might just share that story with my audience because I find it really compelling.

• 7:55Speaker 00

  Thank you. I was born with a congenital heart defect called the atrial septal defect. And I was lucky to have access to care and lucky to have astute physicians that heard the murmur and got a plan of action and care and eventually having open heart surgery.

• 8:13Gary Brecka?

  At what age?

• 8:13Speaker 00

  At age four.

• 8:16Speaker 00

  I know, at Columbia Presbyterian Hospital and it closed the hole. And I have been able to live a healthy, normal life since then, where I won't eventually have a right heart failure, which could happen if the shunt was not closed. I had a four to one shunt, which was a big hole. And so, um, you know, I'm very passionate about making sure that people have access to care and to health, but also preventative medicine in the sense that, uh, when, what drove me at that age, I set. My North Star that I wanted to be a doctor.

• 8:53Gary Brecka?

  At four years old, that's just so awesome. I think at four years old, I wanted to be a police officer, a cowboy. I also also wanted to be an Indian. I think I wanted to be a fireman and an astronaut. And I'm none of those. So for you to set your North Star at four and be sitting here now in the office of the Surgeon General, that's pretty, I mean, that's that's commitment.

• 9:16Speaker 00

  Thank you. By the way, you're making such a big impact with your work, so I commend you for that. You really have a huge reach.

• 9:24Gary Brecka?

  Thank you.

• 9:25Speaker 00

  I am just so blessed to be here and I am grateful every day and I feel compelled to live a purpose-driven life with God-given talents.

• 9:38Gary Brecka?

  Yeah, when we were having lunch earlier today, you know, we talked about just some of the basics, right, that go missed in in in modern medicine. And, you know, one of the things I really enjoyed about our conversation was we started to talk about community, connection, how children are becoming isolated. You know, they're missing that real human connection because, you know, we we've developed a dependency in the sense that we're connected through our screens and our phones and our laptops and our iPads. And that's actually not true. And I think a big concern of parents today is, you know, my my my children are spending so much time on screens.

• 10:22Gary Brecka?

  What is coming through those screens? And what, you know, what are they learning? What are the threats? You know, how is this helping or hurting the developmental cycle of their brains? And I know this is a big passion project of yours. And I wonder if you might just talk about what is the Office of the Surgeon General doing, you know, with respect to screen times?

• 10:45Speaker 00

  Well, I'm going to back up a little bit.

• 10:46Gary Brecka?

  Okay.

• 10:47Speaker 00

  And last August, the White House released the Maha Strategic Plan. And it had many different action items and deliverables. And one of them was delineated for the Office of the Surgeon General to bring awareness to the harms of screen use in youth. And the actual conversation had started with the previous Surgeon General talking about social media and mental health. I decided to pull it a little broader than that. Let's talk about harms of screen use and also what it could do to not only mental health, but neurocognitive development,

• 11:31Speaker 00

  your physical and metabolic health, and, you know, social interaction and health and wellbeing and mental health. So this is so exciting that this was one of the, you know, prerogatives of the Maha Strategic Plan. And we developed a wonderful advisory from the Surgeon General. So I'm so excited to talk about that with you today.

• 11:59Gary Brecka?

  Yeah, I'm really excited to talk about it because I think that, you know, hardly a parent in America today would say, "I have no concerns at all about what my child is consuming on social media, or the amount of time that they're spending on their phones, or, you know, what they're communicating, what's being communicated to them." And, you know, there's so many stories about scary issues around predators, but even without the direct dangerous risks of of social media, you're talking about the amount of time they're spending on screens and neurodevelopmental issues.

• 12:36Speaker 00

  Yep. So we decided to release an advisory on the use of screen harms in both adolescents and children. And so with that, advisories will not only give you the best scientific evidence that's available, all in a wonderful nugget, 25 pages, well cited with up-to-date research that were obtained from NIH, CDC, ASPI, all within these divisions within HHS. So we came together and we gave the best available information, but not only that, toolkits.

• 13:19Speaker 00

  What could be done about it? What can, advice could be given to parents, educators, policymakers, and the youth themselves, as well as what could tech companies do to make it better at this point? So I highly-

• 13:37Gary Brecka?

  I seem to be a big willing participant in that company.

• 13:42Speaker 00

  Well, you know, we, we just put what's out there and what's scientifically available for everyone to read. So what I could tell you is from our findings that this has affected it brain development. So it can actually the affect your executive functioning skills. The, if you are exposed to screen time at a very young age, before 18 months, it could affect the full development of the brain. And so it's not just about how much screen time, quantity, it's also the quality of it. So we need to think about what actually they are watching.

• 14:27Speaker 00

  You'll see states around the country, and I think there's like 37 of them, that have some bell to bell policy. What that means is during schools, they're actually eliminating some districts and some statewide that you cannot use cell phones in school.

• 14:46Gary Brecka?

  I love that. I mean, look, I mean, you and I grew up in an era with no cell phones and we did just fine. And when there are emergencies, parents can get ahold of the school, school can get ahold of a parent. You don't need to constantly be in communication. I mean, maybe there's some rare exceptions, someone has a Holter monitor or something where they actually need to be connected to a phone. But I can't imagine what my high school collegiate years would have been like if I had this screen constantly pulling my attention away. Because, you know, when you're, when you're learning and you're trying to take in information, you're constantly being distracted by whatever you're doom scrolling about. But what, what surprised you in, in your findings?

• 15:28Gary Brecka?

  Was there anything that surprised you in the evidence or your findings?

• 15:32Speaker 00

  Well, I can go into some of that.

• 15:34Gary Brecka?

  Well, I'm glad you asked.

• 15:36Speaker 00

  Well, I'm glad you asked. All right, well. Let's talk about the physical findings.

• 15:42Gary Brecka?

  Okay.

• 15:42Speaker 00

  That's different from the last sort of general report.

• 15:45Gary Brecka?

  Hmm.

• 15:45Speaker 00

  So, we're finding, we know the risk, we know obesity rates in children are so high. We understand so many children are not qualified to serve the military if they wanted to. We're talking like almost seventy percent.

• 15:58Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 15:58Speaker 00

  Because of some health.

• 16:00Gary Brecka?

  Poor metabolic health.

• 16:01Speaker 00

  Poor metabolic health. So, the more sedentary we are, uh, the more we are going down a rabbit hole of doom scrolling and we are looking at a screen, the less active we are.

• 16:14Gary Brecka?

  Hmm.

• 16:15Speaker 00

  What we want to be is get moving. So, just if we're looking at doom scrolling late at night, we're not sleeping, that's affecting our overall health. We're less active, we're less socially engaged. Um, so, is that, that's not surprising, but it's worth saying that there, can we say causation versus correlation? We think that the more screen time that you're on, the less active you are. Therefore, it is a multifactorial.

• 16:44Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 16:45Speaker 00

  Cause.

• 16:45Gary Brecka?

  Certainly a correlation there, right?

• 16:47Speaker 00

  Correlation.

• 16:47Gary Brecka?

  I mean, if you're sitting and you're on a screen, you're not moving.

• 16:49Speaker 00

  That's right. And not to mention, if you're on a screen inside, you're not outside.

• 16:54Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 16:55Speaker 00

  So, uh, the more you're on a screen, what could that do to something called nearsightedness?

• 17:01Gary Brecka?

  Hmm.

• 17:02Speaker 00

  Myopia is also a name. That means that you can't see far.

• 17:05Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:06Speaker 00

  And it is estimated by 2050, that forty percent of kids will have myopia.

• 17:12Gary Brecka?

  Hmm.

• 17:13Speaker 00

  So, we really need to bring that up. That is a, that's a harm.

• 17:18Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 17:18Speaker 00

  That's a hazard from being on screens too much and not going outside.

• 17:23Gary Brecka?

  The distance that you can focus and sort of observe your outside environment because you're bringing your, your outside environment fifteen inches from your nose.

• 17:31Speaker 00

  That's right.

• 17:32Gary Brecka?

  Right? And I don't think evolutionarily, we were designed, uh, to, to live within fifteen inches of our face.

• 17:40Speaker 00

  I don't think so. I think that, you know, we're, we're the Gen Xers, right?

• 17:44Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:45Speaker 00

  I am a mother of three Gen Z'ers.

• 17:48Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm. What do we do after Gen Z? Do we go back to A? Oh, we're back to the beginning.

• 17:53Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:53Gary Brecka?

  It's like, it's like naming hurricanes. We're gonna go through the whole alphabet and start over again.

• 17:58Speaker 00

  It's like a demographic cohort.

• 17:59Gary Brecka?

  Okay.

• 17:59Speaker 00

  Right? When you talk about from baby boomers to Gen X, millennials, Gen Z, and then alpha. And so you're following a population from their, uh, when they were born. And that's what they have. That's a common denominator. So, um, believe it or not, this is probably the most surprising, uh, NAEP, uh, National Academic Evaluation Progress. It's something that's been used since the 1970s that evaluates math and reading.

• 18:33Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 18:33Speaker 00

  Since 2010, so over a decade, uh, we have seen precipitous decreases in both of those metrics.

• 18:43Gary Brecka?

  Math, math and reading scores.

• 18:45Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 18:45Gary Brecka?

  So competency level.

• 18:46Speaker 00

  Yep. So in 13-year-olds, you'll see a 7%, uh, percent decrease, or 7-point decrease in the, um, uh, reading and a 14% decrease in math.

• 19:02Gary Brecka?

  Hmm.

• 19:03Speaker 00

  What started in 2010, ubiquitously?

• 19:08Gary Brecka?

  Screens.

• 19:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 19:09Gary Brecka?

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 19:10Speaker 00

  It's a, it's a factor. So this generation doesn't know life without it.

• 19:16Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 19:17Speaker 00

  So really, we were blessed to be able to grow up without it and be able to be young enough to navigate with it.

• 19:25Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 19:25Speaker 00

  But this is an experiment with this generation, both the Z'ers and alphas, that what, what is going to, what harms are they gonna have because of it? And I think that history will judge us. Not only about the actions we take and the steps we take, but the inactions that we let happen.

• 19:50Gary Brecka?

  Right.

• 19:50Speaker 00

  So I feel like we have a moral and ethical duty right now to bring this to the surface. Yes, there's more research that needs to be done, but our children don't have time for us to tease all of that out.

• 20:05Gary Brecka?

  Is there any data coming from these, uh, some of these states where they're actually doing this bell to bell policy? Are you seeing positive data emerging from?

• 20:15Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 20:15Gary Brecka?

  Um, and what, what does that look like?

• 20:17Speaker 00

  Well, first of all, can you imagine being a teacher in a school where you're trying to teach? And someone is just looking at their screen on their cellphone and ignoring you. So my hat's off to teachers in the United States that work so hard to do the right thing. And this is, and none of this is a diss on parents. We want to elevate parents' ability to, uh, have the tools they need. But the, the thing specifically, you'll see kids actually talking at lunch to each other. You see academic scores improving. You see less disciplinary actions in the schools. You see that kids are more involved in sports and other activities.

• 20:57Speaker 00

  Uh, so overwhelmingly and in other countries that have adopted some sort of bell to bell policy, you're seeing the positive trends going in the right direction.

• 21:07Gary Brecka?

  I love that.

• 21:08Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think that there, there's something to that. And I, I commend the states and individual districts that have adopted those type of policies. But kids are not being exposed outside of that. I think that we have the responsibility as physicians, when we see a metaphysical with the parents, ask about it in anticipatory guidance. What, how much screen time? Know your number. How many hours a day are you on a screen? And bring it to their attention.

• 21:39Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 21:39Speaker 00

  So there are evidence that kids are now on their cell phones more often than they sleep or in school.

• 21:47Gary Brecka?

  Wow. Yeah. So then where are they getting their education from? If they're absorbing data from their cellphone more than they're absorbing data while they're in school, then where are they really getting their education? Right? Where are they getting, where, where, what's shaping them? Right.

• 22:02Speaker 00

  And what are they being exposed to when they are on? And there are definitely some major harms that we probably should discuss at some point.

• 22:10Gary Brecka?

  Yeah, let's discuss it.

• 22:11Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, we know that there's been some mental health issues, increased depression, increased anxiety.

• 22:22Gary Brecka?

  Since 2010 with this, have been the screens, okay.

• 22:25Speaker 00

  Body dysmorphia, you know, wanting to be perfect, wanting, you know, almost like a fear of missing out. We, you know, I think that that has driven a lot of mental health issues, especially in girls. But what are they being exposed to as far as exploitation? Right, so I think that children and youth should have also some, I'll call it digital citizenship. Being aware of what they.

• 22:55Gary Brecka?

  Digital citizenship, oh my god, yeah.

• 22:57Speaker 00

  What they should put out there, you know, because it follows you. It could be follow you in a positive way, but it also can follow you in a negative way. But there's also sometimes even a sports picture of an athlete out there on the internet could be a deep fake that's put into a dude and then people are being exploited financially. And unfortunately, there's been suicides coming from that, cyberbullying or exploitation. So that is a real harm that we, we need to talk more about. And what maybe a chatbot could do in saying, massaging a conversation

• 23:39Speaker 00

  that unfortunately has led to suicide instead of the other direction. These are real things we need to be talking about.

• 23:47Gary Brecka?

  So in a broad sense, what does this initiative on screens coming out of the Surgeon General's office? In, in, in a perfect world, what would it accomplish? Would more states adopt these bell to bell policies?

• 23:58Speaker 00

  I think so. I think policymakers could be empowered with some making, you know.

• 24:06Gary Brecka?

  Data.

• 24:06Speaker 00

  Some data, but also. More money in research possibly going forward. Uh, they could um ask tech companies possibly to make sure that they protect the well-being of youth.

• 24:21Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 24:22Speaker 00

  I can see parents coming up with a wonderful plan, a digital plan for the kids. Maybe delaying technology, modeling behavior with a do. Do like, show them how they should be. Like, so that's a delay, a do. Divert if a kid is looking like that's all they want to do, divert them to a positive activity.

• 24:45Gary Brecka?

  Hmm.

• 24:46Speaker 00

  Um, you know, a maybe a a digital disconnect.

• 24:52Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 24:52Speaker 00

  It doesn't, we call it a detox, but having an environment where you um have like at meals, we are not going to have that cellphone, have digital free zones in the house. And five, discuss, discuss the plan so the kids understand and buy in. Like, I don't want adolescents to feel we're talking down to them. I want to empower them.

• 25:15Gary Brecka?

  Right.

• 25:16Speaker 00

  I want them to be the CEO of their life.

• 25:19Gary Brecka?

  Yeah, it should be, it should sound empowering. So is this some of the guidance that is coming out and, okay?

• 25:25Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 25:26Gary Brecka?

  And so you'll have guidance for parents, guidance for um educators. Are you going to um publicize some of what your research has shown, you know, to linked to some of the harms so that?

• 25:39Speaker 00

  Absolutely. So within the advisory encompasses the harms that we've delineated. But then the toolkits are for the different stakeholders, parents, educators, policymakers, um, and uh, the um, youth and tech companies.

• 25:55Gary Brecka?

  Mm-hmm.

• 25:56Speaker 00

  So it's all nicely packaged for it to be hopefully cited in the future when people are trying to uh pass laws or uh

• 26:07Speaker 00

  Change their behaviors, but use it for healthcare providers also to educate. And in a way where it's public facing and it's easily digestible.

• 26:19Gary Brecka?

  Why don't you think more states have adopted these policies?

• 26:22Speaker 00

  Well, thirty-seven have in some capacity and I think about twenty have full state to state. It's a shift. It's a paradigm shift that is moving in that direction. You're gonna see more and more. There's always a delay in what we know and action that follows.

• 26:39Gary Brecka?

  Okay.

• 26:39Speaker 00

  Right? So I think that it could be in progress. You have to wait for state legislatures to convene. And then you pass it and then the governor signs it and then it's an implementation phase. And is there a fiscal attached and are, you know, is there the ability to do it in a way that is streamlined? So, I mean, there's, there's many factors, but I mean overwhelmingly, it's going in the right direction.

• 27:04Gary Brecka?

  That's so good to hear. Is it, I don't purport to really understand who has the legislative authority over public school systems. But is, so the federal government can't legislate this in and pass something at a federal level that says, hey, we need these bell to bell policies. That's really left up to the states.

• 27:23Speaker 00

  It is. I do believe in the Tenth Amendment and giving the states the, you know, autonomy to do that. But we can present.

• 27:30Gary Brecka?

  You can give the guidance.

• 27:31Speaker 00

  The guidance. And then they can see that as an adoption. They could adopt the recommendations. It's just like the recommended uniform screening panel for newborn diseases. When the baby's born at the second day of life, they get the little heel stick with the blood. And they could check for all these rare diseases so they know ahead of time. And so we can pass it at HHS through HERSA. And then the states are either aligned and can adopt or they, they don't. So there's fourteen states that automatically will adopt in some fashion with rare diseases. Very proud about what HHS did in December in creating two new.

• 28:17Speaker 00

  Recommendations to add to the Recommended Uniform Screening Panel. That's metachromatic leukodystrophy, MLD, and Duchenne leukodystrophy. That was both added. So now the states are in the implementation phase that want to adopt it.

• 28:34Gary Brecka?

  That's great. You know, we also talked about gut health. At lunch today. And I was, I was, I was, it's so inspired to hear you talking about that. I'm like, wow, the Office of the Surgeon General is really thinking about gut health. We're in a new era. This is really good because, you know, clearly in my work and my community, I mean, we, we know the detriments of, of having gut dysbiosis. And, and all of the downstream consequences from behavioral disorders to what we call mood and mental illnesses, to tension deficit and all, all kinds of consequences just from having a really disrupted gut microbiome, or really, you know, poor gut function, gut dysbiosis.

• 29:20Gary Brecka?

  So are there initiatives surrounding gut health that you're working on?

• 29:25Speaker 00

  Well, I wanted to let you know, last May, with the public health reports that we have, we had, did a call for papers to researchers on a lot of Maha-related topics. One of them was gut dysbiosis, which is great. So I'm asking researchers to submit their manuscripts to, for publication on that subject because we want to know more. There are, at the NIH, one of the institutes at NIH, there's a division that is working specifically on that.

• 29:58Gary Brecka?

  On gut health?

• 29:59Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 29:59Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 30:00Speaker 00

  And, and, uh, ARPH as well. So there, like, we know that it's the engine of our overall body.

• 30:12Gary Brecka?

  We make neurotransmitters there. I mean, we absorb all of our nutrients.

• 30:16Speaker 00

  Gut-brain access. We know that we have inflammation and gut dysbiosis. We are, it will lead to something called leaky gut syndrome. Which then can pour toxins into our bloodstream that should have stayed in our colon. And then what does that do to our immune dysregulation? And festering for chronic diseases?

• 30:41Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 30:42Speaker 00

  So we need to have a healthy gut. And we need to put that in the forefront because if we have a healthy gut, a lot of times, whatever we are being exposed to in life, our body should be able to handle it. But not if we don't have a healthy gut.

• 30:57Gary Brecka?

  I would totally agree with you. Are there initiatives or guidance coming out of the Surgeon General's office around this? Are you working on?

• 31:04Speaker 00

  Well, I'm working in collaboration with others. It might not be in a report coming out exactly from our office like an advisory, but we're definitely going to bring attention to that. But within HHS, this is embedded within one of the main priorities of this secretary.

• 31:23Gary Brecka?

  So in a perfect world, you know, sort of pulling all of your experience as a mother, 25 years as a physician, especially in family medicine, what would be, when you exit this role, what would be like the utopia of success for you if what was accomplished?

• 31:48Speaker 00

  Well, yeah.

• 31:50Gary Brecka?

  What would be your vision for what's?

• 31:51Speaker 00

  My vision?

• 31:54Speaker 00

  I will tell you that if it all ended today, I'm so proud of the work that we've already accomplished with aiding in adding to those rare diseases to the recommended uniform screening panel. That means, and I just want to highlight this again, that for generations,

• 32:13Speaker 00

  parents and children will never know the hurt of having to die by age five because they were not screened for something that could be treated with a one-time gene therapy.

• 32:26Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 32:26Speaker 00

  And then they live a normal life.

• 32:28Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 32:29Speaker 00

  And if these children were not, are not screened at birth. And they develop the symptoms of the neurodegeneration. That this leukodystrophy does. They're not eligible for the one-time gene therapy that's FDA-approved.

• 32:42Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 32:43Speaker 00

  So you have to catch it.

• 32:44Gary Brecka?

  I was unaware of that.

• 32:46Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 32:47Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 32:47Speaker 00

  And so just, and think about the, um, first child's never caught. The second child, you fight for their life because you find out what happened to the first one. And so we, parents won't ever have to know that hurt.

• 33:04Gary Brecka?

  Right.

• 33:05Speaker 00

  For generations.

• 33:06Gary Brecka?

  I didn't realize it was a single-gene therapeutic intervention.

• 33:09Speaker 00

  For MD.

• 33:10Gary Brecka?

  Wow, for MD.

• 33:11Speaker 00

  For Duchenne, it's different.

• 33:12Gary Brecka?

  How rare is that?

• 33:14Speaker 00

  I, it's, it's quite rare.

• 33:15Gary Brecka?

  Well, look, one is too many, but, uh.

• 33:18Speaker 00

  That's true.

• 33:18Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 33:19Speaker 00

  I'd say about one in forty thousand live births, but in the, um, Native American population, actually, the incidence is much higher. I believe one in three thousand. In a certain tribal, there's like a genetic bottleneck there. And you know how Secretary Kennedy is just so passionate about helping our tribal nations and Indian health services. So, especially when he heard that statistic. He was, he was all in. But when you diagnose Duchenne's at birth and you, there are so many treatments now that will diminish the progress of the muscular dystrophy.

• 34:01Speaker 00

  So they can live a longer lifespan and a more quality lifespan. So really, it met criteria to add that on. And I hope that, um, this podcast helps states adopt it more readily.

• 34:15Gary Brecka?

  I hope so too. I mean, so, so right now, this was guidance from the office.

• 34:20Speaker 00

  That's great.

• 34:21Gary Brecka?

  And it's up to the states to say, we're going to implement this in our public school system.

• 34:24Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 34:25Gary Brecka?

  Or not public school system, sorry. We're going to implement this in our, in our healthcare system.

• 34:28Speaker 00

  Labs.

• 34:29Gary Brecka?

  State labs.

• 34:30Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm. And just adding to, the newborn screen is done with the heel stick with just a drop of blood.

• 34:37Gary Brecka?

  Right.

• 34:37Speaker 00

  At, you know, at birth. And then sent to the state lab. And so, um, it's already being done. The newborn screen. Also includes hearing and a pulse oximeter, which can check for oxygen sat.

• 34:53Gary Brecka?

  Right.

• 34:53Speaker 00

  So if the oxygen sat's are low, it would be indicative of possible heart congenital defect, which brings me around to why it's so important for me to highlight the recommended uniform screening panel in newborn screens because when you screen early, then you can help either fix or prevent the progression of disease.

• 35:14Gary Brecka?

  Yeah.

• 35:14Speaker 00

  So that is where my passion is. But as far as other initiatives go, I'm super excited about our roundtable that we had in December on Lyme disease.

• 35:23Gary Brecka?

  Yeah, that's, that was a big one for me, too. I was so happy to see it. Because, you know, I, I've had physicians tell me that that's just completely made up.

• 35:33Speaker 00

  Well, I think they need to get with the times.

• 35:35Gary Brecka?

  So do.

• 35:37Speaker 00

  There's infection associated chronic illnesses, IACs and COVID, long COVID, actually helped with that thought process. We know long COVID exists. And so it's being recognized. And really that helped with the medical community realizing that the same version of an infection associated chronic illness with chronic Lyme exists, too. Not all will persist to a chronic Lyme, maybe about a 20%, but a majority of the ones that do go to the chronic Lyme are women because of autoimmune issues. So there's something, again, maybe with the X chromosome that increases their likelihood to have autoimmune deficiencies,

• 36:22Speaker 00

  problems as well as problems with their gut. So if, and you know, the crazy part is we, for treating Lyme disease, we might have to do antibiotics for a long period of time. Yet there's no standardized recommendation on how to put pre- and probiotics in the gut to mitigate the

• 36:42Gary Brecka?

  The effects of the antibiotics.

• 36:43Speaker 00

  Effects of the antibiotics.

• 36:44Gary Brecka?

  Wow.

• 36:45Speaker 00

  So, you know, up, coming up with new standards there. Uh, you know, even with

• 36:50Gary Brecka?

  These are huge, huge issues because I, you know, um, we, we

• 36:54Speaker 00

  By the way, Lyme disease month is in May.

• 36:56Gary Brecka?

  Is it?

• 36:56Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:57Gary Brecka?

  I didn't know that either. Okay, so it's coming up. It's Lyme Disease Month. I'll have to do something on Lyme because, you know, I've had a number of, I'm very familiar with Lyme and its chronology and its etiology and the co-infections, you know, the bacterial and the parasitic co-infections, which very often go missed. And some of these people suffer these low-grade infections for a decade. You know, it's not the kind of symptoms that drive them to the ER.

• 37:23Speaker 00

  That's right.

• 37:24Gary Brecka?

  So they just suffer with it.

• 37:26Speaker 00

  That's right. It misdiagnoses.

• 37:28Gary Brecka?

  It mimics arthritis. It mimics, you know, migraines, you know.

• 37:32Speaker 00

  So CDC is updating their guidelines and they'll, will be doing some social media blast on, on that prevention, of course. And you'll, you'll see Secretary Kennedy talking a lot about this. He's very passionate about it. You know, he's suffered as well as his family from Lyme.

• 37:52Gary Brecka?

  I didn't know he had Lyme.

• 37:53Speaker 00

  Well, his children.

• 37:54Gary Brecka?

  Oh, children, okay.

• 37:54Speaker 00

  His sons.

• 37:56Gary Brecka?

  Then, yeah.

• 37:57Speaker 00

  And he just, this is just near and dear to his heart. So we, when he said that to me, I said, "You got it, sir." And we're gonna get all policymakers and physicians and patient advocates and researchers, all in one room.

• 38:13Gary Brecka?

  The fact that we're bringing awareness so they can test for it, you know, I talk a lot on my platform about mold, mycotoxins, parasites, viruses, heavy metals, like the things that don't show up on a standard lab, you know, because some Lyme patients, maybe except for some liver enzymes or those things, you know, they're not on standard panels and they just go missed. And so if there's no awareness around it, then.

• 38:40Speaker 00

  The biomarkers specifically are poor for the, the test and we're, research is being done for increasing the, a very, hopefully a point of care biomarker. But, you know, the Lyme disease, Asperger's, really likes to get out of the blood and into the tissues and create a biofilm. And that's why it's so hard to detect. That's part of the problem.

• 39:04Gary Brecka?

  So just sort of wrapping things up, how much did your practice as a family practitioner, how much has that impacted your, your role in the Certain General's office?

• 39:19Speaker 00

  Having a front row seat to humanity every day and seeing generations of families. I worked in the same community for two decades and seeing what, how education empowering them with knowledge to give them the tools they need to take care of themselves because they only see me a few times a year.

• 39:42Gary Brecka?

  Right.

• 39:43Speaker 00

  I needed to take the time and sit with them and talk to them about what they're eating, how they're exercising and thinking upstream. So I always had a preventative medicine thought process with them because I knew that if I empowered them with the knowledge to live healthier, then they would come back with better blood work, lower blood pressure, lower weight, more energy and feel better. And we were going to just improve their lives. So for me to be able to take that experience on the real world side and then bring it up to, with a little public health perspective at HHS

• 40:25Speaker 00

  and making mass changes in a very above conjecture,

• 40:33Speaker 00

  above criticism way, then I was compelled to do it. And it's an honor every single day to serve with Secretary Kennedy and for this administration.

• 40:43Gary Brecka?

  That's great. So Dr. Haridopolos, first of all, thank you for coming on the Ultimate Human Podcast. It's amazing. Where can my audience find out more about what the Office of the Surgeon General is doing?

• 40:55Speaker 00

  Well, right now, we do have a lot of social media on X, Instagram and Facebook, Office of the Surgeon General. You can also on our website on HHS, every time we put out an advisory, you can find it on the Office of the Surgeon General website within HHS.

• 41:17Gary Brecka?

  Okay.

• 41:17Speaker 00

  And those are the best vehicles to be able to view what we're doing.

• 41:23Gary Brecka?

  I saw that there's current priorities of the US Surgeon General. So I'm going to put, I'm going to put a link to that. Reports and publications, I'm going to put a link to that and.

• 41:34Gary Brecka?

  Leadership changes that impact public health. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna give links to those on, on your site. You know, I, I, I always wind down all my podcasts by asking my guests the same question. So, and there's no right or wrong answer to this question. But what does it mean to you to be an ultimate human?

• 41:54Gary Brecka?

  You're on the ultimate human podcast.

• 41:57Speaker 00

  My goodness, I think being a humanitarian in loving other human beings. I think that lifting others up, being positive. Well, how do we make the world better? And how do we leave the world a better place than we found it? I think would be really a, a life well-lived.

• 42:22Gary Brecka?

  Yeah, that's being an ultimate human. Well, Dr. Haridopolos, thank you so much. We're gonna follow your path and, and your work. I wish you all the success in the world. I think you've got a great team around you. I think you've got a great bunch of health warriors and some of these agencies like yourself that are really fighting for the American people. And I, I applaud that. I know it hasn't been easy because anytime that you want to create change and make progress, you create enemies. And it seems like your heart, like, like a lot of the folks in this administration is in the right place. And I appreciate your work.

• 42:58Speaker 00

  Thank you so much for having me on your show.

• 43:00Gary Brecka?

  You're welcome. Until next time, guys. That's just science.