Bonus Episode: Brit Pop and the Attempted Kidnapping of Two British Musical Icons

Yeah, admit it, you don’t like Suede either. Plus, you’re going to want to learn more about the British band that attempted to kidnap not one, but two different British musical icons. Also, we explain how we plan to produce our answer to Ryan Murphy’s Love Story: JFK Jr. and Carolyn Bessette. That’s right…Damon and Justine are coming to Disgraceland. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This is exactly right.

• 0:13Speaker 01

  Cash Flow Crunch? OnDeck's small business line of credit gives your business immediate access to funds, up to $200,000, right when you need it. Cover seasonal dips, manage payroll, restock inventory, or tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat. With flexible draws, transparent pricing, and control over repayment, get funded quickly and confidently. Apply today at ondeck.com. Funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 0:44Speaker 02

  Hi, I'm Steph, and I work at United Healthcare. When I think about United Healthcare's members, I think of my own family. My niece was diagnosed with an ultra-rare genetic disorder. I know how hard it is for families. At United Healthcare, we can make it easier.

• 0:58Jake Brennan?

  I'm Brian. I care because I know what it's like to not speak the language. It's not easy. Health insurance is complicated. I would say our job is to make everything easy for our UFC members. I work for United Healthcare. I'm committed to care.

• 1:14Jake Brennan?

  I like a story with a twist as much as anyone, but some of the best traditions don't have one. They just started and kept going. That's something that's great about Chateau St. Michelle. They've been leading Washington wines since 1967 with wines that are balanced, expressive, and easy to enjoy. Choosing the right bottle shouldn't feel complicated. It should be something you open with confidence every time. So for once, here's a story with no twist, just a good bottle. Redefine your rituals with Chateau St. Michelle.

• 1:46Speaker 04

  Running a business means keeping pace with the latest tech. You put a lot into building your enterprise software stack, and scrapping it to integrate AI is out of the question. That's why IBM Technology works with all the apps, data, and models you need. It's another way IBM helps you build on the technology you rely on. Let's create smarter business. IBM. Visit ibm.com to learn more.

• 2:14Speaker 05

  Hey folks, it's Matt Altmaix.

• 2:16Speaker 06

  And Joel Larsgaard.

• 2:17Speaker 05

  From the How To Money Podcast.

• 2:18Speaker 06

  If you travel for work like I do, you know that every trip is an opportunity to get more from the miles that you are already earning. Whether you are heading to your next client meeting or catching a flight home, those miles can go a long way.

• 2:32Speaker 05

  And for a limited time, new Delta SkyMiles Business Card members can earn 200,000 bonus miles, the highest miles offered this year with the Delta SkyMiles Reserve Business American Express Card. Apply today at delta.com/podcast. Offer ends November 4th. Minimum spending requirements and terms apply.

• 2:52Jake Brennan?

  Hey, Discos. Need a little more Disgraceland in your life? Just a touch to get you through? Yeah, me too. This is the podcast that comes after the podcast. Welcome to Disgraceland, the after-party.

• 3:19Jake Brennan?

  Welcome to the Disgraceland bonus episode, a little thing we like to call the after-party. This is the show after the show, the party after the party, the bridge to get you from one full episode of Disgraceland to the other, the backyard to dig into the dirt. Our mission to uncover the truth, to confront the myth, to reclaim the story. On this bonus episode, we jump off of Pete Dougherty and jump back into the Britpop glory years, get your thoughts on all things music and true crime, preview next week's very special episode. And in the exclusive section, we dive into two new Britpop-specific music and true crime stories, one involving the attempted kidnappings of not just one, but two iconic British musicians by, you're never going to believe this, a bunch of other gangster British musicians.

• 4:03Jake Brennan?

  Plus, we get into your emails, comments, DMs, and as always, a whole lot of Rosie. This is the podcast for the musically obsessed, the outsiders, the independent thinkers who know that the best history is the history that gets buried. Disgraceland is where I tell the stories they didn't want told, the kind you'll end up telling someone else. All right, Discos, let's get into it.

• 4:33Jake Brennan?

  You know, something we've never really discussed here in Disgraceland is Britpop. Now, I know The Libertines, the subject of this week's full episode, isn't technically Britpop. They're really just an indie rock band with UK influence, from the UK, of course, from London. And they're part of a generation of British indie bands that became known after Britpop. Britpop, to me, is decidedly a 90s thing. Oasis, Blur, Pulp. The 90s are the era of British bands. Okay, that, to me, is Britpop. The Libertines, Block Party, The Cribs, that's a different generation. British, sure, but not necessarily Britpop.

• 5:16Jake Brennan?

  So we covered Oasis here in Disgraceland, obviously Britpop, and we have Blur and Elastica on our list for this year, for episodes that we're going to produce. But we've barely spoken about the groups from that 90s Britpop era that inspired bands like The Libertines and The Cribs and Block Party. You know, again, Britpop bands, Supergrass, Suede, Radiohead. And we've barely spoken about the group of British bands that came to inspire these Britpop bands. I'm talking about the post-punk era of British groups that inspired Oasis and Blur and Pulp and all that. I'm talking about The Cure, Smiths, Suzy the Banshees.

• 6:00Jake Brennan?

  And we've spent a ton of time talking about the first generation of British punk, Sex Pistols, Clash, Generation X, which just did an episode on The Pretenders, Chrissie Hynde, which is set largely in that world in London in the late 70s. So, here's what I want to do. Thanks to The Libertines, thanks to Pete Doherty. I want to talk about the Britpop movement here, with The Libertines, obviously, as a jumping-off point. And I want to use it as an entry point ideally into some more Disgraceland episodes we can cover going forward.

• 6:35Jake Brennan?

  From this era. Now, I can't recall if in the Oasis episode, if I mentioned whether I'm Oasis or Team Oasis or Team Blur, not that you have to be either, but you know, you kind of like one more than the other. You don't like them both the same, or you're not really paying attention. I can't remember if I got into that in those Oasis episodes. But I am an Oasis guy, which is a very unpopular opinion in my house. My wife and my oldest son are decidedly Blur first, and my youngest son is basically just agreeing with them to piss me off. So

• 7:08Jake Brennan?

  I'm in the minority, but I'm going to win him over. Let's look, though, not just at Oasis and Blur, but at that whole 90s generation of peak British pop music. The era that directly influenced Pete Doherty and the Libertines. And let's steep ourselves a little bit more in London music history, more recent, of course, and hopefully some lore. All right. So I went digging this morning as I was thinking about what I was going to say to you guys today. And surprisingly, Rolling Stone magazine does not have a list of top Britpop groups or albums. But side note, Rolling Stone, if you want one, you know, you can call me up,

• 7:52Jake Brennan?

  you know? I was kind of surprised by that. Rolling Stone's all about the lists. I don't know why they don't have one. Pitchfork, on the other hand, has a 50 best Britpop albums list. And right out of the gate, I'm angry before even looking at the list, because I know that Pitchfork isn't going to have Oasis's Definitely Maybe at number one, which they absolutely should, because really, to me, that 1994 album is Britpop's big bang. Instead, Pitchfork is going to have Something Obscure, like Richard Holly's cousin's third grade teacher's best friend's demo that he cut in the basement of the local pub, as their number one album of top 50 Britpop albums. That imaginary album is called Chandler and

• 8:32Jake Brennan?

  the Ghost by the imaginary band Causely. But I digress. And despite my anger, or perhaps because of it, I'm going to trudge on here like Liam Gallagher into a violent melee of warring soccer hooligans and cops, which is to say, I'm going to dive headfirst into this list. Okay, so this is just kind of recent, it's from 2017 and right out of the gate, despite my reservations, I have hope here, okay? Because the list, as I look at it, it starts with a Jarvis Cocker quote, and it goes on to interview Danny Boyle, okay? Trainspotting Danny Boyle. Pitchfork defines Britpop similarly to the way I do, but they put more meat on the bone. They say that Britpop is, quote, "the musical scene active in the United Kingdom in the

• 9:17Jake Brennan?

  mid 90s, particularly we are looking at the guitar-based musicians who shared focus on anthemic melodies, social observations of British culture and daily life, and their country's musical heritage." That sounds about right to me, that nails the definition of Britpop. So let's dive in. I'm not doing all 50 here, by the way, I'm just doing the top 10. Number 10, The Verve, Urban Hymns. This feels both too low and too high at the same time, so maybe this album is perfect at number 10, I don't know, I don't know. I'm going to reserve judgment here. Number nine. Now, see, I knew it, I knew it.

• 9:59Jake Brennan?

  Oasis, Definitely Maybe, at number nine. This is an affront to, I don't know, the monarch, no, to the working class, that's what it's an affront to. This is way, way, way too low, okay? This is what Pitchfork has to say about Definitely Maybe. Hold on here, let me pull it up for you. It's interesting, at number nine, Definitely Maybe, Oasis's full-length album, their debut full-length from 1994, Pitchfork has this to say in the context of this list of top 50 Britpop albums. Okay, here we go. "Tonight, I'm a rock and roll star," Liam Gallagher proclaims at the start of Oasis's debut.

• 10:40Jake Brennan?

  Taken out of context, it's easy to mistake this chorus as another example of braggadocio from Britpop's brashest band, particularly- Given the anti-stadium hero ethos of the era. But the verses of rock and roll star tell a different story. Reflecting Oasis's modest circumstances when they made Definitely Maybe. Before Oasis were arrogant, they were aspirational. I disagree with that. They were always arrogant. Goes on to say, throughout the album, Noel Gallagher writes about a dead end, working class life from which there is no escape, save for fantasies of fame and fortune. In that same song, in a cutting wind pitched at the midpoint of John Lennon and Johnny Rotten, Liam Gallagher sings Definitely Maybe's truest line.

• 11:24Jake Brennan?

  "In my mind, my dreams are real." It was up to Oasis to make them real. There's more to it than that, but that's the part I wanted to read to you. Because I don't really disagree with anything there, except for the claim that this was before Oasis were arrogant. You know, insinuating that there was a time when they weren't arrogant, which just isn't true. They always had that cockiness. And that was, honestly, that was the appeal to me of Oasis back in the 90s. It was super refreshing to finally, after Kurt Cobain, after just this sort of the grunge era of the 90s in America.

• 12:08Jake Brennan?

  The time in which we were all supposed to, and I felt this way authentically. You know, we were all sort of like, just rejecting the idea of the rock star for something more authentic and more artistic. It was, even though we felt that way, it was just honest to get the opposite in Oasis. Of these guys who were clearly larger than life, absolute rock stars, and just made no bones about it, came out of the gates swinging exactly authentically who they were, not putting anything on. You could just feel it. They were fucking gangsters, rock stars, absolutely didn't give

• 12:53Jake Brennan?

  a shit about societal norms. It was expressed in their music. And yes, this was not the brand of your sort of, you know, like high falutin', high society, late 60s swing in London Rolling Stones rock star. This was a different breed entirely. This was just totally working class thuggish. It was great. It was great to know that these guys were going for it. And we were rooting for them. In the hardcore scene, we were at least. I mean, it was kind of just this thing. It was, I don't know what it was. I don't know why hardcore kids liked Oasis so much because I think them being British gave us the freedom to root for their rock stardom because there was some separation there. We didn't do

• 13:38Jake Brennan?

  that with American bands, not in 1994, certainly not with new American bands in 1994. Anyways, this record to me, it, like I said, it's the big bang of rip pop. And I know there's, there are plenty of arguments to make against this record for other records. That's what makes this topic so interesting. But for me, this is the one. This is the one. It's a ringing bell. It's bunker hill or Lexington or whatever it is. This is the thing. This is, this is when it starts for me. So number nine, I just, nine, barely in the top 10? I just can't go there. I can't. Come on. But it's Pitchfork. So what do you expect?

• 14:18Jake Brennan?

  Number eight is Blur's self-titled album, Blur from 1997, which I don't know, this, this also feels very low. This was Blur's breakthrough in America, sort of. Blur never really broke through in America like Oasis did, despite, despite the massive single from this album, song number two, which still has cultural relevance. This record personally is, I love it. It's incredible. One of my favorite albums from this era for sure. It's definitely my favorite Blur album. I like it more than Parklife, which is saying something because Parklife is fantastic. And again, this is the band that broke the band, broke Blur in America. And America is still listening to it. Like I said, pretty much every day.

• 15:03Jake Brennan?

  Turn on most any sporting event broadcast and wait a couple of minutes and you're going to hear the crowd singing song number two at some point. A woo-hoo, as they say. So number eight here feels low for Blur's self-titled album. Number seven, Pulp. This is hardcore. And you know by now, guys, that I'm not a huge Pulp fan, but I don't dislike Pulp like your favorite New Jersey crime boss. I like some Pulp. And this record ain't it. Not for me anyways. But that's mainly out of ignorance and preference. I don't know this album that well. I always loved the album cover, but I was never compelled to really dig into this and explore it. I suppose now is the time to change that. I just learned today, however, in going through this Britpop history, that Pulp

• 15:46Jake Brennan?

  had been a band for 17 years before breaking out in, I had to look, I had to look at this twice, before breaking out into in the Britpop era of the 1990s. Pulp formed in 1978. What? That's incredible. That's shocking. I think Picasso was still alive in 1978. He wasn't. I think he died a couple of years earlier, but you get my point. Wild. All right. Number six, Elastica's self-titled album. Now, this placement seems right. Perhaps it could be a little higher. Perhaps this album suffers in its positioning because it's a female fronted group. And most of the folks putting this list together are crusty

• 16:31Jake Brennan?

  rock dude journalists. This is a great record with a great breakout single, Connection, and, and songs on it that nod enthusiastically to the past, maybe too enthusiastically got them into some trouble. And, you know, this is the type of album that also storms into the future fearlessly. And the result, of course, is a sound that is undeniably, or was undeniably present at the time. I love this record. And I can't wait to cover Justine Fishman in either an Elastica episode of Disgrace Land or in a joint Damon Albarn Disgrace Land episode. We're going to talk about that later, Seth and I in the exclusive section of this here bonus episode. Number five, Suede, Dog Man Star. Now, I was never

• 17:16Jake Brennan?

  a big Suede fan. Suede for me was where Britpop just kind of went a little.

• 17:23Jake Brennan?

  To Britpoppy, but people love this record. So what do I know at number four? Here we go. Now we're getting down to it. Oasis's What's the Story Morning Glory? I honestly don't know how to rank this album. Oasis, who I clearly love, only really has two great albums. This and Definitely Maybe. And Definitely Maybe is my favorite among the two. But What's the Story Morning Glory is a monster album. It skyrocketed the band to international fame. It made Oasis the biggest band to come out of Britain at the time. So I kind of don't know how it's just not number one on this list.

• 18:04Jake Brennan?

  But then again, I do know because it's not even my favorite Oasis album. By the way, four just feels too low. Number three, Radiohead's The Benz, mixed by my mentor and American, Paul Q. Coldery and Paul's production partner at the time, Sean Slade. This feels right. Number three, Radiohead busted into the mainstream during the grunge era with Pablo Honey and their single Creep, which I believe is 1992. But this follow up in the middle of the Britpop era, 1995, is incredible. The only thing though, I don't know how, I don't know if people will be able to relate

• 18:46Jake Brennan?

  to this, this album, like it's follow up OK Computer. They don't really feel Britpoppy. Radiohead feels like its own thing. This record feels like its own thing. You know, it feels like Radiohead and Radiohead alone, like the beginnings of a new genre almost. But that's just me. I don't know what that says about its placement on the list here at number three. Perhaps it should be even higher. Perhaps it should have its own list. I don't know. Number two. Okay, before I get to number two, there are only two more albums that can possibly be at number two and number one on this list, right?

• 19:26Jake Brennan?

  And I Should Coco by Supergrass and Grand Prix by Teenage Fanclub are those two albums, right? They have to be. They haven't been mentioned yet. But no, they're not.

• 19:41Jake Brennan?

  And my dog's pissed about it. You hear that? Dusty is upset. Dusty is upset. She's a huge Supergas fan. Why wouldn't she be? Damn it. Both these incredible Britpop albums were left out of the top 10 by the supposed big brains at Pitchfork. Unbelievable. Number two is Parklife by Blur, which is the appropriate ranking, I think. I don't know. I know I'm contradicting myself because I already said that I like their self-titled album better than Parklife, which, you know, Blur heads I'm sure would hate. But this record just, I feel like it meant more to the Britpop

• 20:19Jake Brennan?

  movement. And it should be behind Oasis, as we've already discussed. Incredible as Parklife is, but the two great Oasis records, they've already been talked about here on this list. You know, actually, if I stop to think about it for five seconds longer, I can probably make the case that Parklife should be number one on this list, if I'm being honest. It's as genre-defining as either of the great Oasis albums. I'm just letting my Oasis bias sway me, that or my wife. But again, Parklife here at number two. So what is number one? Number one. Number one, Britpop heads have already figured this out. Number one on this

• 20:58Jake Brennan?

  list. I don't know. This kind of feels like, look at me journalism, you know what I mean? Like some, some, I'm hipper than you because I'm naming this record type of bullshit, which is just obviously so Pitchfork. Number one on Pitchfork's list of top 50 Britpop albums is Pulp's Different Class, which, Deborah, come on. We love this album, but placing it above Blur or Oasis just feels like, like I said, Pitchfork, like trying, they're trying just a little too hard, trying to appeal to the so-called cool kids hanging out at Miss Shapes in the mid aughts in New York, or Boston's The Pill during that same era, or Great Scott. I cannot get with Pulp's Different Class at number one. Maybe that

• 21:43Jake Brennan?

  says something about me. Maybe it says that I'm not as big of a Britpop fan. You know, I'm not. I'm not a huge Britpop fan, if I'm being totally honest. I like some Britpop. I gotta stop. It's true, though. And, and there is kind of a gaping hole in my knowledge of the history, which is why I'm excited to get into some Britpop-focused episodes going forward here with Disgrace. I just can't get with the fact that Supergas and Teenage Fanclub with I Should Coco and Grand Prix are not cracking the top 10 list here. All right. These are capital G great records from start to finish. And not having him in the top 10 just doesn't make any sense to me.

• 22:26Jake Brennan?

  Pitchfork does have I Should Coco at number 12 and Grand Prix way down at number 36. I'm sure Bandwagon-esque is higher than Grand Prix. I didn't look. But also not having Primal Scream on this list kind of feels intentionally hurtful. Stone Roses, I get, I get why they're not in the top 10 or even on the list at all. They sort of preceded the whole Britpop thing. And to an extent, so did Primal Scream, but not really. So I'm not too butthurt about these two omissions. Anyway, if you are a Libertines fan or a fan of any of the early to mid 2000s British indie rock, Maximal Park, Razorlight, these bands that we're discussing right here from this list,

• 23:10Jake Brennan?

  they're going to give you some idea of what Pete Doherty and Carl Barra and others from the 2000s indie sleaze era were weaned on. So there you go. Now, Jake, you might be asking me, might be screaming at your car speaker or whatever right now going, what Britpop bands are you going to cover, dude? Well, like I said, I think there's a blur, I think there's Blur and Elastica episodes. Perhaps a Damon and Justine joint episode. Maybe we write a really transgressive, kind of junky love story from the 90s, set in the UK, explores all the drug, the heroin, the crime and grime,

• 23:54Jake Brennan?

  and the tabloid era that their relationship took place in. That, that sounds interesting to me. I'm obsessed with the Ryan Murphy's love story at the moment, JFK Junior and Carolyn Bissette, and maybe Damon and Justine is our answer to that here in Disgrace Land. I like this idea. It's 90s, it's the same era, but it's a totally different scene, a totally different place, obviously. And we can, it also has a completely kind of different type of glamour, yet it's still glamorous. It's got similar tabloid madness, just the UK Britpop version. I'm loving this idea as I'm talking about it to you right now. From a crime angle, we've got heroin use, Damon's arrests, Elastica's legal settlement with

• 24:37Jake Brennan?

  Wire, all kinds of stuff we can get into. There's also what I've learned here over the years from you guys. I wish I could remember your names who had written me on this subject, but quite, quite a few of you, more than a handful, have written about another British band that we should cover, that we have not mentioned at all yet, and that is the Happy Mondays, a group with an insane true crime backstory, including kidnapping, multiple kidnappings, assault, one of the kidnappings, actually both involve musical icons. I can't even, can't believe these stories. And heroin, of course, not just

• 25:21Jake Brennan?

  using heroin, but large scale drug smuggling. And of course, all manner of rock and roll hedonism and debauchery. The Happy Mondays predate Britpop, go back to the wild sort of Manchester club scene that was the decade before. But nonetheless, this is an insane story, and one that needs further exploration, and most definitely its own Disgrace Land episode on the Happy Mondays. I want to talk more about the true crime story of the Happy Mondays, as well as the junkie love story of Damon from Blur and Justine from Elastica with Zest, and figure out how these episodes will take shape. We're going to do that in the exclusive section of this after party, where we'll reveal which rock

• 26:05Jake Brennan?

  star, rock stars, the Happy Mondays attempted to kidnap. Go to Gracelandpod.com to become an All Access member and unlock this and more exclusive and ad-free content. Often, oftentimes, guys, if you're new here, we use the exclusive portion of this bonus episode, Zeth and I, as sort of a creative session, a behind-the-scenes look at how we figure out what episodes we're going to cover and whether or not there's enough crime and transgression there to warrant a Disgraceland episode. It's kind of our think-tank, our laboratory, so to speak. And that's what we've got going on today. Again, go to disgracelandpod.com to sign up to become an All Access member, and you'll get exclusive content like this

• 26:49Jake Brennan?

  and ad-free content every month. All right, before we dive into all that, let's do a little table-setting here. As we mentioned, this week's Pete Doherty from the Libertines episode is available for you to check out. And, look, this story and the death of Mark Blanco, who was hanging out with Pete Doherty that night, is one of the most under-reported stories in music history. And we did our part here. Look, we're not journalists, we're not pretending to be journalists. We are storytellers, open-source storytellers, who use information that's already

• 27:29Jake Brennan?

  been published. We don't go out and dig up new stories. We source everything, we're careful about it, we make sure that we're giving you guys what really happened. But this story in particular really requires some real journalism. And, you know, I'm coming across, this is the second time, in like, this week, actually, that I've come across this, where we're telling these stories. It's almost like, so many of the stories we tell on Disgraceland are from like, the 1960s and 70s and 80s, and a lot of time has passed. This story is from 2006. Not that much time has passed. And I don't believe that the facts are all out there, or the truth is out there. But I wanted to dip in and find

• 28:11Jake Brennan?

  our way through this story. And, you know, if I'm being totally frank, we come up like, with more questions than answers at the end. And it's super frustrating, because I, you know, I've got a business to run, I've got podcasts to make every week, I can't just, like, we have a way of doing it, I can't just, like, pack up and fly to London and start asking people questions. Not that anyone would even talk to me if I did that anyhow, that's not what I do. So it's kind of frustrating and I don't understand why actual music journalists, and again, I've never called myself a journalist. Some people have, I never have. Not, not from the beginning, like a definition of a journalist to me is not somebody who does what I do. A definition of a journalist to me is somebody who goes out and actually digs up and finds information

• 28:57Jake Brennan?

  for the first time, you know, and it like finds information that has not yet been public. Everything we talk about is public information, oftentimes made public by the artists themselves that we are covering in their autobiographies. And it gets buried throughout time. So it becomes very interesting when we get to it. Because a lot of this stuff is sort of just been shoved under the covers. Cause it goes back, like I said, to the 60s, the 70s, the 80s, the 90s. Here though, again, 2006, not that long ago, when you think about it. I mean, two decades, sounds like a long time, but culturally, not really. And this story still,

• 29:40Jake Brennan?

  it's hard to accept the story of how Mark Blanco died. I'm not pointing any fingers. It may very, what, what the official story is may very well be the case, but we, it's just one of those things where we need more evidence that proves it that way, one way or another. And I've similarly come across the same challenge in the story that I'm researching right now on the Foo Fighters, which, I mean, look, man, Taylor Hawkins died in 2022 and we still don't know the cause of his death. He died tragically. I say that as a point of fact, but that is not the explanation for how he died.

• 30:25Jake Brennan?

  Which if you read anything about the Foo Fighters over the last few years, that's the explanation you're going to get. They'll talk about drugs in his system, but that's not the official take. They won't talk about an overdose. Again, more questions than answers. And this is only four years ago. And look, man, like, I'm not trying to pry into anybody's life and I get the sensitivity that this has with Taylor Hawkins's family and, and certainly I would feel like this shit was none of anybody's business if this was my family member. But we know how Keith Moon died. We know how John Bonham died.

• 31:11Jake Brennan?

  It just doesn't make any sense that we don't know how Taylor Hawkins died. And anyway, like the Pete Doherty story here, the death of Mark Blanco, which Pete Doherty is at the center of, the death of Taylor Hawkins is one of those things that we still don't have an answer for. I'm gonna go a little bit harder into this one than we did Pete Doherty, and I'm gonna try to find out. I'm not, I'm not promising you anything, nothing at all, but I am gonna ask questions that people don't seem to really wanna ask. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that. People in the public, public eye, that's, that's the price. And you can be a fan of the Foo Fighters. I mean, I loved Taylor Hawkins. I mean, he just struck me as the type of guy, I never met him, but he struck me as the type

• 31:54Jake Brennan?

  of guy that if, if you met him, you would just instantly be like, you know, just vibe. And he's just such a spirit and an incredible talent. And our episode is not gonna be a takedown in any way, but it is gonna ask some questions. And maybe perhaps at a later date, we'll dive back into this Pete Doherty story as well, but we need more journalism here. And I'm appealing to the actual music journalists out there who listen to the show, you know, come on, let's go, let's figure this out. All right. Anyways, I say all that because we're in the midst of Pete Doherty week here in Disgrace Land. That's our latest episode.

• 32:34Jake Brennan?

  This here is the bonus episode. Episode tomorrow is our rewind episode, and that is on Bobby Brown. Now, listen, if you ever wondered what having sex with a ghost was like, you don't have to wonder anymore, because we're gonna answer that question in the Bobby, well, Bobby, Bobby Brown has answered it for us, and you can hear about it in the Bobby Brown episode. I'm not kidding. Next week, next week, next week, we have a very special episode coming your way on Tuesday. There's something happening in Disgrace Land right now, something big. I can't exactly say what it is yet. I'm not even saying I'm gonna go all the way there with this news and next week's special episode, but I am going to come close. So make sure you check out our special

• 33:17Jake Brennan?

  episode coming to you on Tuesday. That is a new ep coming up right after Bobby Brown. All right. And I'll be coming up right after this break. I'm gonna take a quick break. I'll be back after this with your voicemails, texts, and more.

• 33:33Speaker 05

  Cash flow crunch? OnDeck's small business line of credit gives your business immediate access to funds, up to $200,000, right when you need it. Cover seasonal dips, manage payroll, restock inventory, or tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat. With flexible draws, transparent pricing, and control over repayment, get funded quickly and confidently. Apply today at ondeck.com. Funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 34:04Jake Brennan?

  I like a story with a twist as much as anyone, but some of the best traditions don't have one. They just started and kept going. That's something that's great about Chateau St. Michelle. They've been leading Washington wine since 1967 with wines that are balanced, expressive, and easy to enjoy. Choosing the right bottle shouldn't feel complicated. It should be something you open with confidence every time. So for once, here's a story with no twist, just a good bottle. Redefine your rituals with Chateau St. Michelle.

• 34:34Speaker 06

  This is Joel Larsgaard from How To Money. As someone who travels a lot for work, I really appreciate a premium airport experience. With the Delta SkyMiles Reserve Business American Express Card, it truly feels like you can have it all. For a limited time, new Delta SkyMiles Reserve Business Card members can earn 200,000 bonus miles, the highest miles offered this year. Yeah, card members can also enjoy 15 visits to the Delta Sky Club each medallion year when flying Delta, and you can unlock unlimited Delta Sky Club access after spending $75,000 in purchases on your card during a calendar year. Those are benefits you can get behind. You also get, for one time, guest passes each medallion year, so you can bring a friend or a colleague along.

• 35:17Speaker 06

  15 Sky Club visits plus four guest passes? That's up to $950 in annual value. Value estimate based on $50 per visit rate to purchase additional visits or bring a guest to the Delta Sky Club. It's that kind of premium access that helps you feel right at home and at ease, no matter where you're heading. Apply today at delta.com/podcast. Offer ends November 4th. Minimum spending requirements and terms apply.

• 35:43Jake Brennan?

  I'm Malcolm Gladwell, host of Smart Talks with IBM. I spoke with Dr. Laura Jayhai of Cleveland Clinic about how advanced computing is helping shorten the path from medical discovery to treatment. The moment that there is a compound that someone in a lab thinks it would be effective to treat a certain disease, it takes about 10 to 13 years from that moment to when that drug is on a shelf for a patient. A big part of that gap could be computationally solved. Better simulation of compounds, designing drug trails that are more efficient, that would finish faster.

• 36:21Jake Brennan?

  That was the motivation to bring computational tools and technology closer to biomedical researchers. Learn more about how Cleveland Clinic and IBM are using AI and quantum computing to revolutionize biomedical research at ibm.com/smarttalks.

• 36:49Jake Brennan?

  All right, guys, I'm back. I'm in the chair. I'm talking to y'all. I'm in my happy place. I got to go to Los Angeles kind of unexpectedly. And it's a super quick trip, so I'm getting it. I'm recording this early. My point is, in telling you this, I'm recording the after-party early this week, so we're not going to get a lot of your answers and responses to the Pete Dardie episode here right now, but we will get to it next week in next week's after-party. But we are going to talk to you guys. We're going to hear from you. As always, 617-906-6638, voicemail and text. You want to hit me up about anything, anything at all, episodes you want to hear, artists you want us to cover, whatever it is, get at us, 617-906-6638.

• 37:32Jake Brennan?

  If you're shy, you don't want to leave a voicemail, I would encourage you to, you know, leave a voicemail for sure. I love hearing your voices. You can always send me a text as well. This voicemail, however, comes from, let's see here, this is the 5:03. Hey Jake, this is the 5:03, 2:53 a.m. in the morning, listening to...

• 37:54Jake Brennan?

  I'm not even sure. I listen to all of your shows. Anyway, we're talking about women in rock and roll, which um, I'm not sure that I've ever really been too into, but you haven't mentioned Heart. And I'm not a huge, I prefer Patti Smith over Heart, but what the hell, man? Those guys, those two must have sold more records than any of these people, these others you're mentioning. Anyway, dude, that's it. Uh, I hope you're doing well, man. Bye. 503, thank you for the call. Yeah, you're right, man. I don't know that I have mentioned Heart. I think a listener might have in the last after-party. I guess I take Heart for granted. Like I was talking the other day, we take CCR for granted because it's kind

• 38:38Jake Brennan?

  of, they've kind of, they're just there. They've been there forever, you know, on classic rock radio. But they're incredible, incredible musicians. And yeah, they sold a shit ton of records and they're definitely in the conversation. Um, I like Patti Smith more than Heart. I guess if I was going to pull an album off my shelf and I only had two choices and those are them, I like you would listen to Patti Smith as well. But uh, they're, yeah, I don't really understand the comparison, I guess. I guess you're comparing them because um, I guess I was talking a lot about Patti Smith in the last episode and I get that. But yeah, Heart, great, great, great, great band. Well deserved Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductee. By the way, I guess we're going to find out in the next

• 39:20Jake Brennan?

  couple of weeks, who's getting in, in the Hall of Fame. I can't wait to talk to you guys about it. Uh, but in the meantime, let's talk to the 724. Hey Jake, this is Clint from uh, 724. I'm responding to your response to my response about the baddest ass females. Uh, I had said Joan Jett, he weighed in, said you thought it was a pretty good choice and asked me to get back. Had I ever seen Light of Day? Fucking A, dude, that was a great movie. Euclid Tavern, I live right up. Right on the state line between Pennsylvania and Ohio. So I'd get up that way for a long ti- uh, uh, a life. And, um, back in the day when that was a, you know, relatively popular cousin,

• 40:03Jake Brennan?

  Michael J. Fox and John certainly made the pilgrimage, went up there and checked it out. There's also the Warsaw up there, kinda, kinda same area where, uh, Joe Walsh played a lot with the, the Drew Carey Show and shit like that. Kind of fun. So, uh, yeah, thanks for getting me on. Thank you for taking my response. Always a lot of fun. You do a great job with your show. Have a good day. Seven two four, thanks for the call, but thanks specifically for your, your excellent placement of the phrase, fucking A, Jake. I just love fucking A. I love that. I love that. You know what else I love? I love, I shit you not. I love it when people say those, those two phrases. Fucking A. Clint, yeah, Euclid Tavern, right? Right on, man. Thanks for getting back and, uh, light of day.

• 40:45Jake Brennan?

  I love that we're talking obscure Joan Jett movies from the eighties. Six one seven nine oh six six six three eight. You guys want to talk to us about anything? Doesn't have to be obscure Joan Jett movies from the 1980s. Six one nine texts in, hey, Melissa here from the six one nine. I'm not sure how we can have a discussion about influential women in rock without mentioning Anne and Nancy Wilson. Anne is one of the most recognizable voices of rock women and Nancy is an outstanding guitarist. The two of them combined in Heart makes a catalog of some of the best rock tracks in history. Just my two cents and you're spot on. Those are two, two cents well spent, Melissa. I agree with you 100%. Uh, I'll go even a step farther and say that, uh, Nancy should get more recognition for

• 41:30Jake Brennan?

  her guitar playing. She's one of the best in, in, in, in classic rock and not, and I don't mean like ripping off solos. I mean, just as her guitar playing sets the stage for the songwriting in Heart. It's kinda unmistakably her, which is awesome.

• 41:49Jake Brennan?

  302 writes in, "How many messages did you get giving you shit for omitting Susie Quatro from your most influential female rock musicians discussion?" I didn't think I omitted her. I think we talked about her. I think she was brought up by you guys, by the listeners first. And yeah, we have a Susie Quatro episode coming 302, so you will not be disappointed. Eric from the 954 texts in, "Hey, Eric from the 954, ex-Boston 80s, 90s, early 2000s, always enjoy the show. The FX Sex Pistols series included Chrissie Hyne throughout. Her and Susie Sue and others blazed the trail in Europe. I think Carole King deserves

• 42:30Jake Brennan?

  much credit for her role in the evolution of pop music." Damn, you are absolutely right. Carole King, her influence is hard to measure in pop music. She's incredible. Incredible. All right, one little message here on the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame nominees. This one, because I want to keep this conversation going, y'all. By the way, did we talk about that in the, I think we just talked about it in the exclusive section last week. But anyways, this one comes from Jason 416. "Hey, Rock Hall nominees, the one I am really pulling for is Joy Division New Order. It'll be a very Blue Monday if they don't get in. Highly, highly influential. I can't imagine the soundtrack of my life without at least three

• 43:11Jake Brennan?

  Joy Division and three New Order songs on my triple album. Saw them in 2022 with Pet Shop Boys and the show Blazed. I also noted that it was not just Gen Xers like me in the audience, people of all ages and many 20 and 30-somethings rock or roll." Yes, hugely influential and relevant to the conversation we were having earlier about British bands. I don't know, man. I have a problem with this one. Not that I don't love the music or the band, the plural, but it's the fact that the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is inducting like a hybrid Joy Division slash New Order. And I get why. It's just the difference of

• 43:50Jake Brennan?

  a singer, right? It just seems fucking weird to me. Like just, like induct New Order and then induct Ian Curtis at a later date or something. Doesn't this seem weird? Doesn't this open a can of worms that we're not, that we're gonna be upset that we opened in like- Five, 10 years? I don't know. Just seems kind of odd to me. But I hear you hugely influential. And I get it. And I love them too. And I understand their greatness. I get it. Just there's something about the, the way it's being done rubs me the wrong way and probably working against them. If we're being, if we're being honest about it. But then again, we don't know how these things get decided. So who the fuck knows?

• 44:31Jake Brennan?

  All right. 617-906-6638 voicemail and text. You guys want to get at me? At disgracelandpod on the socials, Instagram, Tik Tok, Facebook, you know how to do it. I'm going to take a quick break and I'll be back in a flash with some recommendations.

• 45:02Jake Brennan?

  All right, we are back and I talked about this last week. Going to start doing more recommendations. I know you guys like it. I like it. I like talking about what music I'm into. I like talking about what music and films combined get me going. I like talking about books I'm reading, movies I'm watching, all that stuff. But I, I've been thinking, I've been, guys, this is going to sound so fucked up. I've been, I don't know how to start this. I've been listening to more new music than I have in the last decade.

• 45:37Jake Brennan?

  And I have a take on why, but I can't really articulate it yet. It has a lot to do with how I don't like how modern rock and modern guitar oriented music is produced. And this sort of new age of production that we're into where everything's kind of done in the box, so to speak. And the way things sound, it just sounds different from how I was raised, but I'm not going to get into that. However, I've sort of opened myself up a little bit to.

• 46:06Jake Brennan?

  Being very curious of of modern pop music. And this is largely spun spun me out from or spun out, I should say, and spun me out spun out from me being on Tik Tok and scrolling through and hearing stuff. I'm like, whoa, what the fuck is that? That's good. And, you know, it's new shit, but it's not new rock. And it's not new punk or hardcore. It's like new fucking hip hop in top 40. I know that sounds insane, mainly top 40. I like the new Harry Styles American Girl song. I know you're some of you are vomiting in your mouth. I don't care. It's a good song.

• 46:49Jake Brennan?

  And I can appreciate that song the same way that I could appreciate George Michael in the 90s. I like it's not that new. It's from 2024, the Dochi song, Denial is a River. It's fucking incredible. Everything I've heard by her is incredible, by the way, which is new. This is like the last few days for me. But I can appreciate her stuff in the same way that I can appreciate Salt and Pepper from the 80s or En Vogue or something like that, which I love. Doja Cat, same thing. You can think I'm nuts, but I can appreciate that shit the same way I can appreciate Kanye stuff from like, you know, the 2010s or

• 47:32Jake Brennan?

  whatever. So I'm not saying that like, we're gonna do recommendations, it's gonna be all new music. I'm not saying that, you know, in addition to, I'm also like, I've just I have late onset Father John Misty appreciation that's happened to me over the last month. I've always kind of been curious and liked, you know, what's a Real Love Baby, that huge song, but I've now I'm like, I'm deeper into the albums. And that makes sense. If I told you I was getting into that, that was kind of a new thing for me, even though he's not new, but a new thing for me, you guys would go, I kind of get that. The Dochi stuff, though, that makes no sense. And I'm not saying, again, I'm not saying that like our, the recommendations we're going to be doing, it's going to be like new pop music, but um, I'm just going to be honest with what I'm listening to and let you guys

• 48:14Jake Brennan?

  know. And I think it's a good thing. You know, I'm being turned on to new shit. Filthy, some of it. Dochi stuff is filthy. It's great. Anyhow, we're going to be doing the Rex over in Zeth's Rap Party episodes, because these after-parties are jammed and we, we used to do them over there. And then we stopped, um, for reasons I can't remember, but we're going to start doing them again. They'll be over there. And, uh, don't worry, you won't forget. I'll remind you here in the after-party. And the best part of the recommendations is it queues up this conversation with you guys and you start to send us your recommendations,

• 48:57Jake Brennan?

  which is what we want. 617-906-6638, voicemail and text. Let us know what you're listening to, watching and reading. TV sucks right now, guys. It sucks. I'm watching fucking Love Story. Okay. TV blows at the moment, in my opinion. I'm forcing myself to like this Jason Bateman slow burn DTF, which I don't hate, but I mean, I just like, I've given this thing now, what, four hours of my life and I'm just mildly entertained. TV Rex, give me the TV Rex. Okay. Great film Rex. I feel like movies have come back. Movies are now what peak television was, uh, 10 years ago, or they're getting there. So we're going to talk about that stuff too, in the recommendations. And as you know, music and

• 49:42Jake Brennan?

  movies, always a central topic for us. Some of you, if not all of you, know that we have a new video podcast called This Film Should Be Played Loud. And it is available, the new episode, yeah, you can hear it right now. It came out, uh, yesterday. You gotta be a Patreon member. Go to disgracypod.com to sign up to become an All-Access member. We did Big Lebowski this month, and it was a lot of fun. Great, great movie with incredible music. Uh, one of the greatest soundtracks from the 90s, in my opinion. And a movie where the music, I believe, changed the trajectory of the Coen Brothers' career, the music from the Big Lebowski. And you'll hear why I think that. And you'll hear Zeth's thoughts

• 50:27Jake Brennan?

  as well. And Zeth is really more of a film guy than I am, and his insights. Into soundtracks and scoring is pretty incredible. And I always come away having learned something and I laugh pretty fucking hard when we do these, which is great. So check that out. Next, next month's episode is going to be on High Fidelity, which I know all of you love that movie. So that's coming up as well. Go to disgracampod.com to sign up for this film should be played loud. Make sure you're subscribed to the Hollywoodland podcast so you can get the rap parties and all the recommendations that I'll be doing over there with Zeth, plus everything that Zeth has going on. He's got, we have three episodes popping off a week over in the Hollywoodland feed. So if you want more double Elvis content, you're gonna, you're gonna supersize it over there. So make sure you're

• 51:11Jake Brennan?

  subscribed to Hollywoodland on Apple Podcasts, the iHeartRadio app, wherever you get your podcasts. Now it is time for the sports rant sponsored by Five Hour Energy. This is the 60 second sports rant in under 30 seconds. Sponsored by Five Hour Energy and their fruity rainbow flavor. Treat your taste buds to an explosion of fruity candy flavor with a tasty caffeine kick. Get candy flavored chaos with fruity rainbow five hour energy shots online at www.fivehourenergy.com or at Amazon. Now, listen, guys, I don't think I've nailed one of these 60 second sports rants in under 30 seconds yet. So we're going to try right

• 51:52Jake Brennan?

  now. The other day I was cruising around YouTube on my couch with my youngest son, eight years old, and we came across a CBS network football promo from the 1970s. And literally every single piece of footage, every hit, every action shot from an NFL game that they were using to promote their games on CBS, every single one would now be an illegal hit in today's NFL. My son's mind was blown. He literally was like, that's a penalty. That's a, that you can't do, you can't do that. You can't. Now, listen, he's not wrong. Am I going to pull the old guy card here and rant about how football is this better?

• 52:38Jake Brennan?

  Was it better back then? I can't really say. I don't know. It certainly wasn't healthier. I don't want my son playing that game that was up there on that screen. It was nuts. Do yourselves a favor and Google this or search for this on YouTube, I should say. CBS NFL Sunday Sports Promo, it'll come up in no time. I guarantee it. All to say, I miss sports right now. I got nothing. I got nothing. You know this, we're in the dead zone. I guess I gotta turn my, I gotta put my, my fricking green teamer shirt on here and get on the Celtics bandwagon as we head into the postseason. But it's, it's just, you know, I'm watching, I'm watching 70's NFL promos on YouTube. Come on, man. What's wrong with me? Matt, how did I do? 89 seconds, Jake.

• 53:22Jake Brennan?

  So I guess it was a 60 second sports rant in under 90 seconds? All right, well, you can't fault me for trying. That was a sports rant sponsored by Five Hour Energy's fruity rainbow flavor. Treat yourself to a candy like flavor explosion and satisfy your sweet tooth with this zero sugar treat. Once again, you can get in on the candy flavored chaos online at www.fivehourenergy.com or Amazon today. Guys, I loved our Britpop conversation from earlier, but we got more on this subject. Specifically, which iconic rock stars were nearly kidnapped by a British band of just complete and total criminals? We're going to get into that.

• 54:06Jake Brennan?

  We're going to get into love story, Damon and Justine. Okay? We're going to get into that in the exclusive section. Go to disgracedpod.com to sign up.

• 54:20Speaker 05

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 help make it happen fast. Rated A+ by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 54:50Jake Brennan?

  I like a story with a twist as much as anyone, but some of the best traditions don't have one. They just started and kept going. That's something that's great about Chateau St. Michelle. They've been leading Washington wine since 1967 with wines that are balanced, expressive, and easy to enjoy. Choosing the right bottle shouldn't feel complicated. It should be something you open with confidence every time. So for once, here's a story with no twist, just a good bottle. Redefine your rituals with Chateau St. Michelle. This is Troy Millings. As someone who travels a lot for work, I really appreciate a premium airport experience. With the Delta SkyMiles Reserve Business American Express Card, it truly feels like you can have it all. For a limited time,

• 55:34Jake Brennan?

  new Delta SkyMiles Reserve Business Card members can earn 200,000 bonus miles, the highest miles offered this year. Card members can also enjoy 15 visits to the Delta Sky Club each medallion year when flying Delta, and you can unlock unlimited Delta Sky Club access after spending $75,000 in purchases on your card during a calendar year. Those are benefits you can get behind. You also get four one-time guest passes each medallion year, so you can bring a friend or colleague along. 15 Sky Club visits plus four guest passes? That's up to $950,000 annual value. Value estimate based on a $50 per visit rate to purchase additional visits or bring a guest to the Delta Sky Club.

• 56:19Jake Brennan?

  It's the kind of premium access that helps you feel right at home and at ease, no matter where you're headed. Apply today at www.delta.com/podcast. Offer ends November 4, 2026. Minimum spending requirements and terms apply.

• 56:36Speaker 04

  Running a business means keeping pace with the latest tech. You put a lot into building your enterprise software stack, and scrapping it to integrate AI is out of the question. That's why IBM Technology works with all the apps, data, and models you need. It's another way IBM helps you build on the technology you rely on. Let's create smarter business. IBM. Visit ibm.com to learn more.

• 57:11Jake Brennan?

  All right, guys, welcome back. Let's, you know, the archive, you know, the archive, Disgrace Land Archive. What's the Disgrace Land Archive? Well, it's got 260-plus episodes on tons of artists that you know and love. And every week, I inevitably mention some of them, and it's a good jumping off point to clue you guys into the archive. We mentioned Oasis, The Clash, Sex Pistols, Generation X, Billy Idol, Joy Division, and we have episodes on all of those artists. Matt will grab the episode information, put it in the show notes of this page to help you guys easily navigate to those stories should you want to hear them. And you should, you should want to hear them because if, you know, if I say so

• 57:53Jake Brennan?

  myself, they're, you know, they're fucking awesome. Okay, listen, let's recap, shall we? Number one, this week, our new episode on Pete Doherty is available for you to listen to right now. Number two, our rewind episode coming up next is on Bobby Brown. Number three, next week, a very special Disgrace Land episode that you are not going to want to miss. Number four, Zeth gives you those Hollywood and crime vibes in Hollywood land, so make sure you're subscribed on Apple Podcasts, the iHeart Radio app, or wherever you get your podcasts. Number five, our new "This Film Should Be Played Loud" video podcast on The Big Lebowski is available for you to watch right now over on our Patreon. Go to disgracelandpod.com to sign up. Number six, 617-906-6638. Give me a call, leave me a voicemail, send me a text. Your voice, it keeps us digging

• 58:36Jake Brennan?

  into the dark corners of music history. So keep calling, keep texting with your answers to the week's question of the week, or with whatever else you want to talk about. Number seven, don't forget, Discos, this isn't just content, it's a community, a community of the obsessed, and no one cares about music, books, records, and the crime and grime that ties them all together like you do. And well, that's a disgrace. All right, December 2, 2006, that's the day that Mark Blanco stopped partying with Pete Doherty and died in a, well, pretty sketchy way. And on that day, this is what America was listening to, according to the Billboard charts. Number one, I Want to Love You, Akon, featuring Snoop Dogg. Last week, 17.

• 59:20Jake Brennan?

  Peak position, 1. Weeks on chart, 8. Number 2, Smack That, Akon, featuring Eminem. Last week, 2. Peak position, 2. Weeks on chart, 9. Number 3, Irreplaceable, Beyonce. Last week, 4. Peak position, 3. Weeks on chart, 5. Number 4, My Love, Justin Timberlake, featuring T.I. Last week, 1. Peak position, 1. Weeks on chart, 5. Number 5, Fur Delicious.

• 1:00:06Jake Brennan?

  Quit talking and start mixing. Cut it. Hey guys, time to dust off your detective skills while unwinding in the Caribbean on Virgin Voyages' second true crime voyages. Back by popular demand, this five-night, adults-only escape sets sail March 20, 2027, to Grand Turk in the Beach Club at Bimini. The difference between this year and last will be that I will be on the cruise this year, along with Zeph, and he and I will be taping a live version of Disgrace Land, along with podcast hosts from Exactly Right's Buried Bones, podcast of the year award winners Wyscrack, and other fan favorites. Get on this cruise with us, guys, and enjoy live podcast recordings, behind-the-scenes

• 1:00:49Jake Brennan?

  storytelling, exclusive meet-and-greets, and immersive true crime programming throughout this one-of-a-kind voyage. Head over to www.virginvoyages.com/trucrime to secure your spot. I like a story with a twist as much as anyone, but some of the best traditions don't have one. They just started and kept going. That's something that's great about Chateau St. Michelle. They've been leading Washington wine since 1967, with wines that are balanced, expressive, and easy to enjoy. Choosing the right bottle shouldn't feel complicated. It should be something you open with confidence every time. So for once, here's a story with no twist, just a good bottle. Redefine your rituals with Chateau St. Michelle.

• 1:01:32Speaker 01

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A+ by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five-star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 1:02:00Jake Brennan?

  This is Troy Millings. If you travel for work like I do, you know every trip is an opportunity to get more from the miles you're already earning. Whether you're heading to your next client meeting or catching a flight home, those miles can go a long way. For a limited time, new Delta SkyMiles Business Card members can earn 200,000 bonus miles, the highest miles offered this year, with the Delta SkyMiles Reserve Business American Express Card. Apply today at www.delta.com/podcast. Offer ends November 4, 2026. Minimum spending requirements and terms apply.

• 1:02:35Jake Brennan?

  She's been thinking about this sleepover all week, but I think about her food allergies all the time. Fortunately, her doctor prescribed Zolair, omalizumab. It's proven to significantly reduce allergic reactions if a food allergy accident happens. Zolir 150mg is a prescription medication used to treat food allergy in people one year of age and older to reduce allergic reactions due to accidental exposure to one of more foods. While taking Zolir, you should continue to avoid all foods to which you are allergic. Don't use if you are allergic to Zolir. Zolir may cause a severe, life-threatening allergic reaction called anaphylaxis. Tell your doctor if you ever had anaphylaxis. Get help right away if you have trouble breathing or if you have swelling of your throat or tongue. Zolir should not be used for the emergency treatment of allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis. Zolir is for maintenance use to reduce allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis, while avoiding food allergens.

• 1:03:20Jake Brennan?

  Serious side effects such as cancer, fever, muscle aches and rash, parasitic infection, or heart and circulation problems have been reported. Please see zolir.com for full prescribing information. Ask an allergist about Zolir. This is an advertisement for Zolir, paid for by Genentech and Novartis.