Fraud Friday: The 90 Day Fake Fiancé w/ Clark Moore

In this week's Fraud Friday, Laci is joined by Clark Moore (Love, Simon, Crazy Ex-Girlfriend) to discuss a particular scam involving the Ukrainian Marriage industry. Plus, we look into how scammers are taking advantage of billionaire MacKenzie Scott’s pledge to donate half her fortune. Stay schemin'! (Originally Released 07/26/2021) CON-gregation, catch Laci's TV Show, Scam Goddess, now on Freeform and Hulu! Order “Scam Goddess: Lessons from a Life of Cons, Grifts and Schemes" here: Hachette Book Group Follow on Instagram: Scam Goddess Pod: @scamgoddesspod Laci Mosley: @divalaci Clark Moore: @mrclarkmoore Research by Kaelyn Brandt SOURCES: ​​https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-57358241 https://www.news18.com/news/buzz/british-man-duped-of-250000-on-pretext-of-marriage-to-a-ukrainian-3886691.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/24/business/mackenzie-scott-giving-scams.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/20/business/mackenzie-scott-philanthropy.html https://nyfights.com/worldwide/no-i-didnt-pull-a-cancer-scam-says-podcaster-jonathan-leir-aka-jonny-straws/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Speaker 00

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• 0:58Speaker 02

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• 1:11Speaker 03

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• 2:29Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. Welcome to an episode of Fraud Fridays, where we release older episodes from the Scam Goddess Vault. That's right, Fraud Fridays is where we bring back your favorite episodes from behind the paywall. Enjoy this episode from behind the paywall, and as always, stay schemin'.

• 3:11Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. How y'all doin'? Guys, I am so very what? Yes, yes, you're right. Excited, excited for today's guest, I really am. Guys, Clark Moore, you've seen him in that poppin' ass rom-com movie for the LGBTQIA and the plus, honey, love, Simon, which was an instant classic. He was on Crazy Ex Girlfriend, recurring on Crazy Ex Girlfriend, and also now you can hear him. You can put him in your eardrums, honey, with his podcast, Soul Bomb by Clark Moore, which is a podcast about healing and identity. Yes, get into it, guys. We have Clark Moore. Hi, Clark.

• 3:52Speaker 06

  Hi, Lacey. Thanks for having me.

• 3:54Laci Mosley?

  Thanks for being here. You have such good energy. We chatted like a little bit. I told Clark about how I had got locked out of my new place, and I was very angry about it. Because I was like, I paid too much money to be locked out of this hole, like, sitting outside.

• 4:07Speaker 06

  It's literally my nightmare, especially being black, because you know the moment that you try to get back in the house is the moment the whoop whoop. And you're like, wait, no, I live here, I swear.

• 4:18Laci Mosley?

  One leg in the window?

• 4:20Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 4:22Laci Mosley?

  Yo, if you do robbery, maybe try that one time. Like, you know, you see the whoop whoop. Don't act guilty, just be like, oh, I live here. I got locked out.

• 4:32Speaker 06

  That's the thing, it doesn't work either way.

• 4:33Laci Mosley?

  Pull your ski mask up and be like, no, I live here. My face is just cold.

• 4:39Speaker 06

  If only.

• 4:40Laci Mosley?

  All right. Well, Clark, do you have any relationship with scams? Have you ever been scammed? Do you like scams? It could be anything.

• 4:47Speaker 06

  I was just thinking about this the other day. I'm very gullible. I just sort of like believe anything you tell me.

• 4:56Laci Mosley?

  Oh, don't advertise that here, because the girls will. They will be in your DMs like Clark.

• 5:02Speaker 06

  I've had to develop a skepticism. But like years ago, people, you know, I'm like the snake oil salesman. This will change your life. I'm like, sure, here's all my money. Take it. I also like at a market, I don't, I'm not able to like haggle. You know, if someone's like, this peach is $50. I'm like, do I have $50? Like.

• 5:26Laci Mosley?

  Oh, so you're like, so this is, this is James and the Giant Peach? This is the one from the book? Like, you're not even gonna ask why it's $50?

• 5:33Speaker 06

  No. Oh, that's just what it is. Okay, do I have $50? If I do, here you go. If I don't, I guess I'm not having a peach today. You know, so I'm very easily scamable.

• 5:43Laci Mosley?

  In a way, low key though, I kind of like that because haggling is kind of disrespectful. I wish that people would just put the price on it. That's what the price is. Instead, it's such an American capitalistic thing to be like, I'm gonna put a price way higher and hope these suckers won't notice. Just charge what you're supposed to be charging. Why gotta come in here and fight you? I've never understood that about car dealerships. Like, like I gotta come in here and fight you? Why? Can't you just put the price of the car out on the sticker and like, let's stop with the games?

• 6:12Speaker 06

  It's funny you would say that, Lacey, about car dealerships because I'm starting to realize that perhaps some of my easily, my easy scam ability is because of my mother, who is the opposite. Like literally, she, specifically in car dealerships, she's so intense that I've seen people scurry when she walks into the car dealership. One time we walked in and she said hello and the woman picked up the phone and was like, Dr. Morris here. And people started running around. It was like the Don't Morris Prada.

• 6:47Laci Mosley?

  I have several questions. One, why am I at the car dealership so much?

• 6:52Speaker 06

  Right, right. That's my question too, because somehow every time I need money, she doesn't have any. And yet she always has enough to buy a new car whenever she wants one. So I'm thinking there's some, you know, something's going on here.

• 7:05Laci Mosley?

  Your mama sounds like daddy government. The American government ain't never got no coins when the girls want healthcare and into, you know, people being unhoused.

• 7:13Speaker 06

  Yes. She's like, I have money. You don't.

• 7:20Laci Mosley?

  My mom used to always say that about my dad. She was like, Lacey, when you're dating, look, his money is our money. My money is my money.

• 7:30Laci Mosley?

  I still live by that principle. I'm like, yes, come on, take us out.

• 7:33Speaker 06

  Yes, please.

• 7:34Laci Mosley?

  If it's me.

• 7:36Speaker 06

  Please. That's why I've wanted a boyfriend this long, for that joint bank account.

• 7:40Laci Mosley?

  Listen, Clark, I'm on the same wave. I haven't dated for eight years. I've just had some little boo things, you know, here and there. You know, some girls and some guys, but I'm ready now to just settle down. And unfortunately, I don't have the personality that's very like, oh, I'll be patient and take my time. I was out this weekend and I saw this really fine man and I was like, hey, um, what's your Instagram? Follow me. And I made him follow me and then I followed him later and I DM'd him and I said, hey, send me your number. And he was like, yes, ma'am.

• 8:12Speaker 06

  We love that. This is part of your glow up. Cause I was just about to say, Lacey, you don't have time to date. You are on iCarly. Honey, she has jobs. She is working. Who has time for a boo at this point?

• 8:26Laci Mosley?

  Right. She's tired, but she wants some, I want time for a little thing. You know, I need to go take a trip or like, you know, touch sand. I've been touching grass too much. I want to touch some sand, okay? But yeah, okay. So your mom kind of made you more anti-conflict. Therefore, you're probably not as like incredulous or skeptical when it comes to seeing things that seem a little off. Cause you just don't want to be fighting with people.

• 8:50Speaker 06

  That's exactly right. I'm a people pleaser. This is my trauma.

• 8:53Laci Mosley?

  I get that. And honestly, I am too. It's weird. I'm a skimmer and a mark. Like I'm not, I understand why your mom is coming into the dealership, you know, putting her dick on the table. Simply because as a woman especially, we get run, they could, you go in the dealership and all of a sudden it's fucking nineteen fifty and you're in goddamn Mad Men and they're like, hey, toots, looking for a set of wheels? Where's your husband? And I'm like, nigga, it's twenty twenty one. If you don't just show me these damn Jeeps and shut the fuck up.

• 9:24Laci Mosley?

  They're like, oh yeah, little lady like you never had to buy a set of wheels before, huh?

• 9:29Laci Mosley?

  What happened to your husband? Did he die?

• 9:30Speaker 06

  I mean, they mark it up. They just take it up. They're like, the man, he would be able to bring it down, but we're gonna pull one over on her.

• 9:37Laci Mosley?

  Listen, I used to have a Ford Focus, and I don't give a fuck Ford Focus. I'm coming after y'all now. If y'all sponsor the podcast, I'm gonna be like, built Ford tough. But for now, Ford Focus plagi girl. I had a car. It was a Focus, and it was a lemon. And I started to realize that it was a lemon. It was my first car. Well, no, my second car. I did get in a little accident. I'm not a good driver, Clark.

• 9:59Speaker 06

  No, dude. We will meet in separate cars when we.

• 10:03Laci Mosley?

  No, come on, Clark. Now, everybody who get in my car be living though, okay? Nobody die, okay?

• 10:08Speaker 06

  There's a first for everything.

• 10:10Laci Mosley?

  So I'm not trying to be the first?

• 10:12Speaker 06

  I'm not. That's a barrier I'm not trying to break.

• 10:15Laci Mosley?

  Not trying to break new ground on.

• 10:17Speaker 06

  No.

• 10:19Laci Mosley?

  Be a killer dad. Okay, fair. Fair enough. Uh, but I went, like, so as soon as I got the car, I started to notice things were like a little wonky with it. I started getting things in the mail. This is the car that I got when I first moved to LA. And I'll get shit in the mail like, hey sis, recall, um, so some doors have been flying off or whatever on the Ford.

• 10:42Speaker 06

  That's like one of the basic functions is that the door has to stay closed and on the vehicle.

• 10:50Laci Mosley?

  And on, and on it. Wow, you know, you bring up a good point. I think Ford was really trying to rebrand it and be like, look, y'all seen the UPS trucks? They ain't got no doors. Y'all good. Just hang your seatbelt on it. Like, you good.

• 11:03Speaker 06

  That Cali Jeep life, top off, doors off.

• 11:07Laci Mosley?

  Doors off.

• 11:10Laci Mosley?

  Y'all heard of the top, y'all heard of like a rooftop, right? Now you got a side roof. You got a.

• 11:15Speaker 06

  Easy access, in and out.

• 11:17Laci Mosley?

  You got a, you got a sliding balcony. On your driver's side door.

• 11:24Laci Mosley?

  So I slowly started to realize it was a limit. And then when I went into the dealership after my transmission just said goodbye. I was like, what? I haven't had this car that long. I went to the dealership and they're like, oh yeah, your car is on limit. And I was like, how you gonna just tell me that? This is the

• 11:38Speaker 06

  They told you. They're not supposed to tell you that.

• 11:41Laci Mosley?

  I don't think so, but so I understand mom. I get it truly.

• 11:45Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 11:46Laci Mosley?

  Well, let's get into our first uh segment here. What's hot and fraud? Clark, this is where we warn our listeners about fraud that's popping in the streets. Or more often than not, we get a listener letter from someone. Um, and they just snitch on their friends, their family, maybe themselves. We just say, make sure your scam is retired. So we don't what? Yes, fuck up your bag. All right, that's scamgotuspott at gmail dot com. Snitch on your friends and family. Um, and Clark, I need a fake name for this person. Gender doesn't matter.

• 12:13Speaker 06

  Baxter.

• 12:14Laci Mosley?

  Baxter, okay. So Baxter says, I'm a new member of the congregation. Oh, welcome, amen. We put on your podcast for the first time last week on a road trip. And my wife and I immediately became hooked. An instant, I knew I had to put you onto Johnny Straws, Scammer Supreme and former best friend of mine. Now Johnny Straws. Clark, are you gonna be friends with somebody named Johnny Straws? Cause that sounds like a criminal name to me.

• 12:37Speaker 06

  Yeah, I'm nervous already. Johnny Straws feels like, um, yeah, he feels like someone who came to LA in like the mid nineties. And was like, I need to come up with some kind of cool hip.

• 12:56Speaker 06

  And he and he sort of like landed there and maybe didn't workshop it quite enough.

• 13:00Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he should have, cause it's giving like Goodfellas. Like I feel like they'd be like, and our boy Johnny Straws. So like, like what, what is happening?

• 13:08Speaker 06

  Yeah, but like the Goodfellas made for TV ripoff, not the, not the actual film.

• 13:14Laci Mosley?

  Okay, we have a photo of Johnny Straws. Okay.

• 13:19Speaker 06

  I take back everything I just said.

• 13:21Laci Mosley?

  Cause I might wanna slurp on all Johnny. Oh wait, oh no.

• 13:24Speaker 06

  Honey, you can scam, I don't care what your name is, if you look like this, you can scam me all day long.

• 13:31Laci Mosley?

  Okay, bone structure, okay, you got little muscles going on.

• 13:35Speaker 06

  Yes, and the fade, I'm here for it, that shadow beard.

• 13:38Laci Mosley?

  Right, where you get this fade from, the west side?

• 13:42Speaker 06

  He went somewhere.

• 13:43Laci Mosley?

  Okay, Johnny Strauss, Johnny Strauss look like he do MMA.

• 13:46Speaker 06

  Yes, oh yeah, he looks like the kind of guy who would um, sort of give you a thirty minute diatribe about why ice cold baths are good for your immune system.

• 13:57Laci Mosley?

  Yes, Johnny does cryo, Johnny Strauss is doing the cryo for sure. Oh wow, okay, I take it all back, I would let that man rob me, I see, I see where, I see where it happened.

• 14:08Speaker 06

  Happily.

• 14:09Laci Mosley?

  So, this is his former best friend Baxter, right? And they went to middle school and high school together, and Baxter says, this shit is wild, well, judging on his appearance, alright, anyways, so Johnny Strauss, real name, uh-uh, nah, nah Baxter, we don't dox people's real names on this show.

• 14:30Speaker 06

  Come on, give me the social.

• 14:32Laci Mosley?

  Right, I'll tell you, I'll tell you after his real name, maybe there's something we can look up, but I'm not gonna say his real name Baxter, don't be snitching. Oh, he got more nicknames, AKA Ringwalk John, first rose to fame, Ringwalk John, how many damn names does he have? Okay, so Johnny Strauss, or as the girls know him on the streets, Ringwalk John, okay.

• 14:55Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 14:56Laci Mosley?

  So he first rose to fame in twenty fifteen as an Instagram bodybuilder fitness guru, makes sense, see that, saw that.

• 15:02Speaker 06

  All that track.

• 15:04Laci Mosley?

  Over the span of a few years, he amassed a huge following, see that, I would wanna hit follow as well, I, you know, if I saw him on the street, I might just follow a few blocks, you know, not even realizing I was doing it, like, I'm not going this way, so. This didn't surprise me that he amassed this huge fan base because dude is charming, charismatic and charismatic as fuck. Alright, yep. And his face is also giving what faces should give. So what did shock me, Baxter says, was when he began to fake fucking cancer in all caps and started asking his followers for donations for treatments. Wow, Johnny.

• 15:43Speaker 06

  Wow, that's wild.

• 15:46Laci Mosley?

  You had me in the first half, but you picking the big C? I feel like that's bad karma.

• 15:52Speaker 06

  I was just gonna say that. It's coming for us all anyway. Why would you tempt fate?

• 15:58Laci Mosley?

  Right. They say if you live long enough, you will get it. So, so maybe don't risk, you know.

• 16:07Laci Mosley?

  But also like, you know.

• 16:08Speaker 06

  All of a sudden, this becomes a medical podcast. I'm like, yes, I have heard that. And the mutation of the cells happens at this point in your lifespan.

• 16:16Laci Mosley?

  Lord Jesus. And also, like, obviously, like, cancer isn't something that is karmic retribution for anybody who gets it. I've had so many family members who've had it, been in remission, you know, survived, maybe not.

• 16:26Speaker 06

  Seriously.

• 16:26Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. But, so I'm not in no way saying that that's like, oh, if it happens to you, you did something wrong. I'm just saying, don't put it out there.

• 16:34Speaker 06

  No, it's the same thing of like, when you have, when you come up with an excuse of why you can't do something, you never say, it's because my mom died. You never say, it's because, like, my friend got in a car accident. You know, you always have to come up with something that's benign.

• 16:50Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Or you kill a relative who's already dead. That's what I do. You know how many times I done killed off my Aunt Shirley? You know? And then I just, you just have to zhuzh up that obituary program a little bit, change that date, that sunset date.

• 17:05Laci Mosley?

  You know, keep that sunrise, change that sunset.

• 17:08Speaker 06

  The one thing about Aunt Shirley, she keeps bouncing back. You can't keep her down.

• 17:13Laci Mosley?

  She bounced back all through my college years, you know, just, we thought she was dead, but she wasn't. Until my next final.

• 17:23Laci Mosley?

  So now, as someone, this is Baxter talking. Now, as someone who knows this person very well, I could immediately tell he was making it up and faking the whole shit. He has a long history of manipulation in every friend group we were a part of. I had to wait four to five years for the whole scam to implode on him, and luckily, it did. Four to five years.

• 17:43Speaker 06

  I mean, you saw his face.

• 17:45Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 17:46Speaker 06

  That would buy you quite a bit of time.

• 17:48Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it would. But also, like, you could have been the whistleblower. You already gave me this man's full government Baxter, so it's given a little bit of a... What's your job? You got a hater job? It's given a little bit like he was hating. But at the same time, like, maybe you weren't hating, because you did let the man cook until, you know, the pot ran it out. You did let him cook. So, four to five years, and then it happens, right? So eventually, his fans figured out the whole thing was a scam when he won, didn't die. Okay, now, wait a minute.

• 18:21Speaker 06

  Right.

• 18:23Laci Mosley?

  A lot of people, there, there, there are a lot of treatable forms of cancer these days. I have friends and family members who have lived very, very long lives. It's not the end of the world in every case. So I, I don't know, the fans are a little aggressive there for me if they like. So, you know, you could bounce back if anybody out there is struggling, like lots of people, lots of people bounce back, you know, so.

• 18:44Speaker 06

  So I'll say that's a red flag for me, but that's not an immediate, like, four to five, you know what I mean?

• 18:50Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 18:50Speaker 06

  I could, I would still, having said that, I did just say that I'm easily scamable. So I'm like, five years, I wouldn't even have asked the question. And the fact that they saw that as a, as a warning sign, I'm like, yeah, wow, he's really resilient.

• 19:02Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, maybe he was just talking about it too much, like every day, he was like, "Al, my cancer is really hurting today. If y'all could just put something on the GoFundMe, if y'all could just Venmo me."

• 19:13Speaker 06

  We reached our goal. We're gonna to multiply it. We want more for this GoFundMe.

• 19:19Laci Mosley?

  I, I got a popsicle budget that I need for, you know, all my friends in chemo. I'm trying to spread the wealth, so if y'all could get, get in, you know, get on Amazon wishlist and like, you know, maybe he was just really like juicing it. But so, number two, he says red flag was,

• 19:35Laci Mosley?

  he just vanished into thin air and stopped posting about his progress. He recently pops back up online as Ringwalk John, so that's his second alias, a boxing podcaster. Wow.

• 19:50Laci Mosley?

  He created the alias Jonathan Lear. He is definitely a scammer. He didn't have about six names the whole time we've been talking.

• 19:57Speaker 06

  But they're all John, so.

• 20:00Laci Mosley?

  And that's a good scammer. You don't want to switch up too much. Then you're not going to remember it. If somebody calls you Jonathan Lear, you're going to be like, oh, my first name is John. Maybe you'll look back. But if people start calling you like Craig Smart or something, you might forget that that's your name. Because you switched it up too much. So he kept the first name the same, then he switched up everything else. And I appreciate that.

• 20:18Speaker 06

  Hmm, consistency.

• 20:20Laci Mosley?

  So he created this alias and his, like, it quickly amassed another fan base because John is fine. And so, you know, the girls came to the new fan base, which was boxing. Um, which is still pretty much done shirtless. So, you know, people want to, people want to see. And, um, his new fans were completely unaware of his past. His past was recently exposed by a blogger and homeboy went back into hiding where he remains today.

• 20:48Speaker 06

  Wow, that's some investigative journalism right there.

• 20:52Laci Mosley?

  Also, this just tells me that Baxter is a petty icon because four to five years means that he was following Johnny Straws, Jonathan Lear, and Ring Wop John. And just keeping tabs, like, what's he up to today?

• 21:08Speaker 06

  Keeping the receipts.

• 21:09Laci Mosley?

  Oh, now he done shaved his head, ball. He's really committed, like.

• 21:13Speaker 06

  Did Baxter mention the, the slight? Was there, besides the fact that, that Johnny Straws um, is a scammer, was there like a particular moment where Johnny Straws was like, I don't know, an hour late to brunch and just really pissed Baxter off? Like, what set Baxter on this petty path?

• 21:33Laci Mosley?

  Right. I don't even know when they fell out, but he said former best friend from middle school and high school. So what I'm guessing is, is that they were cool and then college separated them. Or, you know, Johnny Straws moved and became an influencer and didn't have time for the regular girls on the gram anymore. You know, probably one of those grow apart situations. Because it doesn't seem like he had malice towards Johnny, because he didn't out him.

• 22:00Speaker 06

  Right, right. But what I do appreciate here and what I admire is that Baxter can hold a grudge. Um, from adolescence into adulthood. Because that, my motto in life, and this would be my Real Housewives tagline, is I never, I always, wait, let me, what is my tagline? Got it.

• 22:20Laci Mosley?

  We're gonna do a room. Didon't didon't.

• 22:23Speaker 06

  My tagline is, I always forgive, but I never forget.

• 22:29Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yes, yes.

• 22:30Speaker 06

  So I'm right there with you, Baxter. I can hold a grudge.

• 22:34Laci Mosley?

  Can I? I can't. I'm really bad at it. After a while, I'm just like, ugh, I don't care anymore. I think there's like one person that if I see them, you know, they're never gonna get any kindness for me. Or even, uh, I, it's like a person that I see them and I just like, actually, there's three people like that. So what am I saying? Maybe I can't hold a grudge.

• 22:54Speaker 06

  All of a sudden, the list is multiplying.

• 22:56Laci Mosley?

  Right. There are people out there that if I see them, I just pretend that they are literally thin air. Like, I'm not gonna give you an angry face. I'm not gonna give you a smile. I'm gonna literally act like Ray Charles to the bullshit.

• 23:08Speaker 06

  I love that. Just deadpan, can't see you.

• 23:11Laci Mosley?

  Didn't see you. Literally didn't see you. Hang my coat up on your shoulder like you're a coat rack.

• 23:17Speaker 06

  Just like Baxter, I want you to name names. I want you to dox these people, drag them.

• 23:23Laci Mosley?

  Oh, no, some of them are in entertainment.

• 23:27Laci Mosley?

  So, uh, Baxter, I'm gonna say, I don't know if I approve of Johnny Straw's scam just because I feel like he might have been taken away from other people who obviously could have used those funds. Obviously, the American healthcare system is ass. So getting sick is very expensive. However, it's like, if those people were fans of Johnny's, then maybe they were gonna run him coins either way. He could have, like, did Herbalife or something, or, you know.

• 23:56Speaker 06

  That's so true. And that's what came to my mind is that there's so many ways that this hot white man could have made money.

• 24:02Laci Mosley?

  OnlyFans.

• 24:03Speaker 06

  Why choo-, I was literally thinking OnlyFans. Why choose the one that is like the most morally corrupt you could possibly do? Why not almost literally anything else?

• 24:15Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah. I think you're right.

• 24:17Speaker 06

  Having said that, definitely send me his Instagram handle so I can slide into those people.

• 24:22Laci Mosley?

  Well, he's back in hiding.

• 24:23Speaker 06

  I've got plenty of money to waste.

• 24:25Laci Mosley?

  Clark, he's back in hiding, so we don't know where he is. He's not on the interwebs anymore. But I expect a new variation of Johnny something coming along very soon. It probably will be OnlyFans.

• 24:36Speaker 06

  And waiting. My thirst knows no bounds.

• 24:40Laci Mosley?

  Exactly. I can't wait for Johnny cakes on OnlyFans.

• 24:45Laci Mosley?

  Scams.

• 24:50Speaker 00

  That sound? That's the National Squash League. Pro teams, the world's best players, and rally so fast you'll forget to breathe. Season four is in full swing, and every match streams free on YouTube. Big hits, bigger rivalries, and a front row seat from wherever you are. Watch every match for free on YouTube. Search National Squash League and hit subscribe or follow live updates on Instagram at nsl.sport.

• 25:18Speaker 07

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• 25:49Speaker 08

  Hi, I'm Jenna Oshkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection, and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.

• 26:03Speaker 09

  People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to, I'm deathly allergic, in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.

• 26:14Speaker 08

  And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you you're not alone.

• 26:19Speaker 10

  One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorize all my food allergies.

• 26:25Speaker 08

  So join us and hear their stories and more, because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At the Table, the food allergy podcast, on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At the Table and start listening on the free iHeart Radio app today.

• 26:47Laci Mosley?

  And we are back and it's time for my favorite segment of the show, Historic Hoodwings. This is where I will regale Clark with a famous con caper group of criminals. We don't know yet, let's see. We'll get his opinions all throughout, he'll interrupt, maybe we'll go on tangents. You know how it goes, guys, just hold on. We don't, we don't know what's gonna happen. But today, we're gonna keep in the, the family of, uh, people who are lying to, uh, people who've learned to trust them.

• 27:14Speaker 06

  Hmm.

• 27:14Laci Mosley?

  And we're gonna talk about Ukraine's marriage industry. And y'all know I love a Ukrainian scam.

• 27:20Speaker 06

  Ooh.

• 27:21Laci Mosley?

  You know, I love a scam with like a little accent, a little, a little accent that I'm terrible at doing, but I love to do anyway. Um, so.

• 27:30Speaker 06

  This is so great, Lacey, because I love the Eastern Bloc. I am a Slavophile. I speak Russian.

• 27:38Laci Mosley?

  You speak Russian? Okay, come on, Strasvutzy.

• 27:41Speaker 06

  Da, я говорю по-русски. I lived in Russia briefly in college and let me tell you, they know a scam. They know their way around a scam.

• 27:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, they're very straightforward people, no bullshit people. I feel like they may be doing the scams, but they're rarely getting scammed.

• 27:59Speaker 06

  Oh, yeah, they can see right through it.

• 28:02Laci Mosley?

  Other than by their government, because during the pandemic, it was too many doctors falling out of Russian windows.

• 28:07Speaker 06

  I know, well, they're, they would think that we're being scammed by our government because they're like, you believe them? You trust them? They're like, we know government equals corrupt. Like what, why, why are you surprised that the people you quote elected didn't do what they said they were gonna do? Like, that's just how it goes.

• 28:28Laci Mosley?

  They're like, we know Vladimir Putin, he writes horse shirtless, he the finished straight doctor. Like, we know this would happen every week. You want vodka? Like, we just drink vodka.

• 28:40Speaker 06

  Pretty good.

• 28:41Laci Mosley?

  Oh, wow, you are such a flatterer, cuz I know if you lived over there, you know. But I appreciate it. So, Ukraine, we're in the Ukraine. And we're talking about Ukraine's marriage industry. It's one of the biggest draws for Western men visiting the country. Wow. However, it doesn't always end in a happily ever after. One UK man's experience with a Ukrainian woman ended up with him being drugged and left in an apartment in a country he didn't speak the language of, and out of almost his whole life savings. Wow.

• 29:17Laci Mosley?

  Now, I will say, um, I don't approve of men, women, non-binary, anybody being drugged and robbed. You know, rob people while they're awake, it's just common decency, you know? Like, obviously in robbery, there's no consent, but I feel like there's way more consent if I'm alive. Like, just take it and don't kill me, you know? Than there is if I just wake up and all my things are gone. However, I also have to say that whoever this man is, you a nasty man. Who goes to a country to try to marry somebody? Like, what does that say about you? You didn't, that's not like you were talking to somebody on some ninety day fiance shit. That's like you went to the country where you thought there would be vulnerable people for you to marry

• 30:00Laci Mosley?

  and kidnap back to your developed nation. Like, eh.

• 30:05Speaker 06

  Yeah, we're already talking about a person who doesn't have a particularly like discerning eye for, um, yes, scams. I mean, like, they're not asking critical questions, they're not thinking beyond, like, the very transactional moment of.

• 30:21Laci Mosley?

  Well, also, they're a scammer. I'm sorry, but last time I checked, marriage was supposed to be between two consenting adults who were not under duress. Now, we know that's not how most marriages work. But, at the same time, it's like if you planned on like, oh, I'mma go ahead and get me one of these. Like, like, you're not looking for a person, you're looking for almost property. Or somebody who's desperate. Yeah, so, y'all are both in the wrong here, in my opinion. So, Ukraine is one of Europe's poorest countries, and that's what I'm talking about. You're trying to take advantage of people who have fewer resources, and then you gonna have them cooking and cleaning and living with you and just being so grateful to, I guess, have a passport to your country like, mm-hmm, you a scammer too.

• 31:02Laci Mosley?

  The average wage is about three hundred fifty dollars a month in the Ukraine. So, in the wake, and I, and look, we can talk about poorest countries and be like, oh, the poor Ukraine, but like, let's not act like America's disparity between the top one percent and the bottom, what, like ninety-nine? Like, people, we got food deserts, we got kids starving here, we got adults starving, we have unhoused people. Like, we are a developing nation in a Gucci belt, and we know that. So, I am in no way looking down on the Ukraine. So, in the wake of an increasing, like, increasing poverty and conflict with Russia, Ukraine's marriage industry, a confusing mix of scams and actual matchmaking, is an attractive option for many women looking to leave the country.

• 31:45Laci Mosley?

  Every year, hundreds of men from the US and England travel to the Ukraine in search of a wife, drawn by the promise that dating a Ukrainian woman will be like dating a model with the values of your grandmother.

• 31:56Speaker 06

  Oh, God.

• 31:58Laci Mosley?

  So, you know what that sentence said to me?

• 32:01Speaker 06

  I'm nervous.

• 32:03Laci Mosley?

  Basic ass, American and men from the UK. If you want a woman who's fine and don't know she fine, come on down to the Ukraine.

• 32:15Speaker 06

  Mm-hmm. That's why so many of these models get plucked out of these, these developing eastern countries.

• 32:22Laci Mosley?

  And I don't even think that that's the truth. I think that that's something that maybe some of the Ukrainian scammers are like, that's how we get them over here. We tell them, we tell them, we models, and all we love to do is cook clean, sun dick, and, um, read the Bible.

• 32:36Speaker 06

  Right.

• 32:36Laci Mosley?

  And that's how we get them.

• 32:38Speaker 06

  Right, and they get here and they're like, lol, thanks for the passport. You are a terrible human, I'm gonna go live my life now.

• 32:45Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 32:46Speaker 06

  I love this empowering narrative.

• 32:48Laci Mosley?

  So, most of these matches are made by large companies that attempt to vet and quality control their matches. With James, this wasn't the case. So, James is our man from the UK, it is a fake name, we not gonna out you, James. And he didn't give his own name because of his shame. Which, um, James, you should have, you should have some shame. I think so.

• 33:08Speaker 06

  It was clear that he had shame to begin with because he went over with no backup plan, no money other than what he had on him, like.

• 33:16Laci Mosley?

  Did you go some, who goes some places with their life savings? I ain't never, I ain't never went nowhere. It was like, let me get my suitcase out and put my life savings in it, like.

• 33:24Speaker 06

  Hold on, let me, let me take these three hundred dollars out of my bank.

• 33:31Speaker 06

  Let me make this withdrawal.

• 33:34Laci Mosley?

  Have you ever had a teller walk past, the teller glass come out and throw your money at you? Like, get the fuck out of here. So, James is fifty-two years old. He's a charity worker from the UK who first traveled to Ukraine in twenty fifteen and set up a project for children fleeing the Ukraine's conflict zone. Okay, James, you have some redeemable qualities. You was trying to help a little bit. Now, mm, mm, let's see. During his time traveling back and forth to Odessa, he worked with a translator, Julia. Julia suggested James go on a date with one of her friends. Okay, so James, it seems like you went over there for less skeevy reasons, so maybe.

• 34:10Speaker 06

  It started good, as all scams do.

• 34:13Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 34:14Speaker 06

  And it turned.

• 34:15Laci Mosley?

  So Julia was like, James, you are such a nice humanitarian. You helping with the cheering. We love it. I got a homegirl who I think you would really marry. I mean, like,

• 34:26Laci Mosley?

  to go on a date with. You would like to go out with her. To the altar. So, uh, this friend was Irina. Ooh, I know some Irinas, honey. I know some Irinas from the Ukraine. So she's a thirty-year-old woman from Donetsk, a town that had become occupied by Russian-backed fighters. Um, so this is Irina and James on a date. So here's my first thoughts, and you know, we'll always publish the images so y'all can see them. Irina's a bad bitch.

• 34:53Speaker 06

  Mm. Irina.

• 34:55Laci Mosley?

  Irina, Irina. Irina's a bad bitch. She knows how to do her makeup. She's giving me a very natural, um, a natural beauty face. She looks tall. She's got like a kind of long neck. They're sitting down, but she's.

• 35:07Speaker 06

  Her bangs are working, I think.

• 35:08Laci Mosley?

  She's giving us a bang. Um, and she's got really thick hair. It's blondes. I don't know. She's a natural blonde, but, you know. Right, exactly. The next thing that I'm seeing here. Is that this must have been a introduction date or something because there's three glasses wine in the photo, but one is like, you know on Instagram how people like put their hand out and hold somebody else's hand and take a picture of their hand or whatever? So it's like one person just has their hand in the photo and then it's the man and I didn't know. So the friend must have, Julia must have come on the first introduction date.

• 35:46Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 35:47Laci Mosley?

  Kind of grease the wheels.

• 35:48Speaker 06

  Sure. Yeah, make it feel, make her feel safe, you know, having out.

• 35:53Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm. And he already sitting on the booth next to her. He cuddled up there in very close proximity. So clearly this was going well. So James and Arena began dating and despite the twenty year age gap, wait now, wait now, now.

• 36:09Speaker 06

  Okay, but we love a daddy.

• 36:13Speaker 06

  Do we not?

• 36:15Laci Mosley?

  Here's the thing.

• 36:16Speaker 06

  Is that just my trauma peeking out here?

• 36:19Laci Mosley?

  We need a daddy. I mean, we love a daddy.

• 36:23Laci Mosley?

  I miss my zaddy. I mean, I need a zaddy. Here's the thing. Have I gone on a date with a man who was criminally older than me? Absolutely. I used to go out dates in New York City with this man named I'm just And you know, he would take me to the theater and he would take me to really fancy restaurants and you know, I think I was like twenty-two. And I remember looking around one time at a restaurant because I was a bona fide hoochie and I still am. Hoochie shall I die? Gang gang. You know, and I ain't never been able to bend over in a dress just straight out, right? Like, you know, I've always had to bend the knees and drop down and get my eagle on. Otherwise my little cootie kitty was gonna be out, you know, because the dresses are short.

• 37:08Laci Mosley?

  You know, the skirts are short. And they're tight. So I remember going to a restaurant once. This is when I stopped dating or going out with I ain't date that man. We, we didn't do no sexuals. I couldn't do none of that. But um, and I think that's also why because I was like, okay, it's the third day. He's starting to really talk about sex casually.

• 37:29Laci Mosley?

  I can't do that. So, but I went to a restaurant once with him and I saw people looking around at me and they thought I was a sex worker. I realized during it, I was like, and then I asked him, I was like, how old are you? Child, well, I was Stuart sixty. I thought maybe he was like early fifties. When he says sixty, I literally like was like, oh.

• 37:53Laci Mosley?

  And he knew how old I was.

• 37:57Speaker 06

  I mean, it's like if other people think you are a sex worker and you aren't getting paid to be there, talk about scam.

• 38:06Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 38:07Speaker 06

  Because if people think you're a sex worker, that means you could be getting paid for what you're doing for free.

• 38:11Laci Mosley?

  And that's the only embarrassing part of it because sex workers work. So I'm not saying I embarrassed that people thought I was a sex worker. I am exactly what you said. I'm mad that I could have been getting more out of this than dinner.

• 38:23Speaker 06

  Literally. I'm like, wait a minute. I haven't been charging and everyone assumes I am.

• 38:28Laci Mosley?

  Right. I should at least be getting some hundos out of this, a little stack of racks, you know?

• 38:32Speaker 06

  Right.

• 38:33Laci Mosley?

  So I had to let that go. But I just think twenty years, if you're talking about marriage, that's too much. If you're talking about maybe you want to go on some dates and relive your youth, you know, the Demi Moore's of the world, the, you know, the Leonardo DiCaprio's, maybe. But honestly, twenty years is just deeply inappropriate to try to have a relationship with somebody. It's predatory. You've been on this earth two motherfucking decades longer than this girl. Like, you know more. When I was in my, oh my God, my early twenties, I was so dumb. I believed like anything people said to me. I was like, uh huh, okay. Like I was dating a guy in college. He was definitely cheating on me. One day he told me, oh, my friend is coming to visit. So I need you to like get your toothbrush and like your, your little outfits and stuff that you leave over here and like take them with

• 39:16Laci Mosley?

  you because they're going to use the drawer. And nothing, my brain clicked to be like, he could have just put that somewhere and the friend could have just like, it wasn't like I had that much stuff there.

• 39:25Speaker 06

  Right, right.

• 39:26Laci Mosley?

  The friend was a girlfriend. And I was literally like so, such a space cadet. I was like, la da da da, da da. Okay. Like, I didn't care.

• 39:33Speaker 06

  Youth, uh, youth. Well, let me tell you, I, when I was twenty four, twenty three, twenty four, I, um, by the way, if my mother is already, hasn't already turned off the podcast, this is a great time to stop listening to the podcast.

• 39:52Speaker 06

  I met this man and I mean, I'm gonna give a G rated version of the story anyway, but still, mother doesn't need to even hear the G rated version. Met this man and he is, he works in the industry and he's older and he's very, he had this beautiful apartment that was like, in my mind, I was like, this is gorgeous. And he was like, oh, I'm just staying here while I renovate my house in Beverly Hills. And he has, he has since gone on, since that encounter, to win an Oscar. He, everyone that I met with at that time, when I first moved out to LA, they were like,

• 40:34Speaker 06

  you are young, you are hot, get a daddy, because this is the time to do it. This, this woman who went to Dartmouth, this alum, was like, I wish when I was 22, that I had been dating an older man who would pay for my things. She was like, that is my advice to you. And so I took her advice and I reached out after our encounter and I was like, I would love to see you again. And he was a little bit like cold, like not as into it. Some time went by, another movie that he made came out. I texted him and I was like, I think we could really like.

• 41:14Laci Mosley?

  Hey, so random, just saw a poster for your new movie and it just really made me miss us, you know?

• 41:22Speaker 06

  And basically, the long story short is I basically asked this man to be my zaddy and he said, no, thank you. He was like, pass.

• 41:32Speaker 06

  So I tried, Lacey, I tried.

• 41:35Laci Mosley?

  Now, Clark, you were too straightforward, you were too straightforward. The whole thing about a zaddy is like, look, the zaddy knows deep down that he is the zaddy and that he's paying, but you gotta make him feel like he not. You gotta be like, I'm so tired of me and my own age, one and a half, six more than once a week. And, and, and, you know, they're so immature. I like you, cuz you are, you know, you are seasoned and flavorful. You gotta make a

• 42:04Speaker 06

  I did it wrong.

• 42:05Laci Mosley?

  You gotta make a, you can't come out right and be like, look, you're old, I'm hot. I'm here for my things and I will be with you. Like that's, it's, it's, that's a very honest and I appreciate that honesty Clark. I feel like that's why I don't have a zaddy either, because I'm not good at lying to people to their faces like all the time. That's a lot for me.

• 42:24Speaker 06

  See, this is why I'm not, I can't be a scammer. I'm too honest.

• 42:28Laci Mosley?

  It also just gets exhausting having to be around people you don't actually really want to be around because you want something from them. Like I just was like, I'll buy my own things. It was, it was too hard for me as well. So I understand, but I appreciate the effort. I appreciate that you tried, that you gave it the good old, the good old try.

• 42:42Speaker 06

  The old college try, yeah.

• 42:44Laci Mosley?

  Yes. So from the woman from Dartmouth.

• 42:49Laci Mosley?

  So they go on this, these dates. There's a 20 year age gap. All the dates were chaperoned by Julia, which makes sense because we saw Julia's hand in that photo, right? The translator. So that's why she's there. She got to translate what's going on. I bet you half the time, that Irina was there like, okay, how much more time I got to spend with this geezer? Is he gonna give me somebody today? When are we getting married? And then Julia be like, she says she loves your eyes.

• 43:15Speaker 06

  She's never seen anyone as beautiful as you.

• 43:18Laci Mosley?

  The different, the UK, the men from the UK just so much more manly. That's what she said. And really she was like, tell this man to get his hand off my thigh. His palms are sweaty. So they're doing this, right?

• 43:33Laci Mosley?

  Julia was paid a hundred fifty dollars a day to attend the dates. Yes. And Julia and Irina even went to the opera with James and we'll see an image of that. So I see this hustle because Julia is like, I'm a translator. So if I can get you with somebody who, Irina probably speaks perfect English. But he was like, if I can get you with somebody who you don't know speaks English, or you know, then I, you gotta pay me to come on the dates.

• 43:56Speaker 06

  Right. Wow. And look, the opera looks great. Looks gorgeous.

• 44:02Laci Mosley?

  They look cute. And look at him taking this picture. You know that James took this picture. And they both look like, they're giving me that Anthony Mackie face like we know something about you that. I know something about you that nobody else knows. The smirk is like, we robbing you.

• 44:17Speaker 06

  I would love to see this movie.

• 44:19Laci Mosley?

  So despite the language difficulty, James was convinced that they were a perfect couple. They continued to chat via an app called Viber, which had a translation function and allowed them to communicate more freely. In one message Irene sent, she said, you gave me the real fairy tale and thanks so much for that. I believe in you. Just you can give me this happiness. I love you.

• 44:39Laci Mosley?

  Wow. That's what you should have said to old boy Clark.

• 44:42Speaker 06

  I know. Not, I heard your movie did well.

• 44:45Laci Mosley?

  Right. It's like, you could have been like, I always knew you was gonna get an Oscar boo. I believe in you. And I also believe that you are the only one who can make me happy.

• 44:54Speaker 06

  Maybe I'll circle back. I think I've aged out though, unfortunately.

• 44:58Laci Mosley?

  Oh no, you look good. You know, the Browns, we, we don't, we don't go down easily.

• 45:07Speaker 00

  That sound? That's the National Squash League. Pro teams, the world's best players, and rally so fast you'll forget to breathe. Season four is in full swing and every match streams free on YouTube. Big hits, bigger rivalries, and a front row seat from wherever you are. Watch every match for free on YouTube. Search National Squash League and hit subscribe or follow live updates on Instagram at NSL.Sport.

• 45:35Speaker 01

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• 46:03Speaker 08

  Hi, I'm Jenna Oshkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At The Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection, and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.

• 46:17Speaker 09

  People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic, in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.

• 46:28Speaker 08

  And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you you're not alone.

• 46:34Speaker 10

  One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorize all my food allergies.

• 46:39Speaker 08

  So join us and hear their stories and more. Because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At The Table, the food allergy podcast, on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At The Table and start listening on the free iHeart Radio app today.

• 47:00Laci Mosley?

  At fraud! All right, guys, and we're back. So when, whenever James returned to the Ukraine, he and Irina would go on expensive dates to the opera or Desa's nightlife. Even though he continued to drop considerable money on Irina, these dates were strictly platonic. The couple was always accompanied by Julia, and Julia told James that Irina didn't believe in sex before marriage. Okay.

• 47:24Laci Mosley?

  With you, because Irina.

• 47:25Speaker 06

  With you.

• 47:27Laci Mosley?

  Irina's fucking, okay? She not fucking you. She don't believe in sex before marriage with you. So from engagement to a sham wedding. 11 months after their first date, James proposed to Irina after significant insistence from Julia and Irina. So they're like, come on now, like, let's get a move on it.

• 47:44Speaker 06

  Right.

• 47:45Laci Mosley?

  She felt so trapped in her country. She was obviously intelligent and wanted to create another future outside of the Ukraine. The connection was sort of shared interests. That's what James said. Bureaucratic obstacles created difficulty with, like, Irina trying to move to the UK. So James instead sold his house, quit his job, and began looking for a place to live with his soon-to-be-wife.

• 48:08Speaker 06

  Oh, my God. Does no one watch the Sex and the City movie? Never give up your apartment. You always keep your place.

• 48:16Laci Mosley?

  Exactly. This meant that James had to move large amounts of money from the UK to the Ukraine to start his new life, which came with its own set of difficulties. Along with being one of Europe's poorest countries, the Ukraine is also one of its most corrupt. So moving large amounts of money in and out attracts attention and invites limits on the amount that can be transferred. Irina came up with a solution for James. Instead of transferring the money directly into her account, she suggested it be transferred instead into the business account of her friend and wedding planner, Christina.

• 48:43Speaker 06

  Oh, no. Oh, no. This is some next level fraud.

• 48:48Laci Mosley?

  This is Christina. Oh, wow, Christina's a criminal.

• 48:51Speaker 06

  Oh, Christina.

• 48:53Speaker 06

  Oh wow.

• 48:55Laci Mosley?

  Christina's hair is so damn big cuz it's full of secrets and lies.

• 49:01Speaker 06

  It's full of wire transfers.

• 49:03Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 49:05Laci Mosley?

  She got everybody's routing number in her scalp and in her follicles. Uh, she is a criminal.

• 49:11Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 49:12Laci Mosley?

  James trusted Irina, so he did what he was told. However, when the money arrived in the Ukraine, he was informed that the bank would only release the money if he were legally married to Christina in a quickie marriage. This all occurred days before what was supposed to be James and Irina's wedding. James was stuck with no home and an angry fiance that threatened to call off the wedding unless he married Christina, which would release the money. So, you ca- you gonna call off our wedding unless I marry somebody else? The math. The math ain't mathin'.

• 49:44Speaker 06

  It's not working. Wow.

• 49:47Laci Mosley?

  The math ain't quite mathin'. I'm, I'm confusion. I am confusion. So, on July 10th, 2017, James married the wedding planner Christina. He was told it'd be easy to undo the marriage at a later date. The same day, Christina and Irina told James that all $200,000 he had transferred had been spent on an apartment. And this is the apartment that was purchased. We'll show you that quick and we'll put this in our Instagram notes, guys.

• 50:17Speaker 06

  Oh.

• 50:18Laci Mosley?

  This cost $200,000? Did they buy the whole complex?

• 50:24Speaker 06

  Okay, I, I- Admittedly, I am not up to date on the, um, Odessa real estate market, but I just don't believe that this is $200,000.

• 50:35Laci Mosley?

  No, it's giving, one, exposed asbestos. You know, some people have exposed brick, they have exposed asbestos. Uh, part of it's wood, part of it looks like it's concrete. Uh, another part looks unfinished. It, it's not giving $200,000.

• 50:54Speaker 06

  No.

• 50:56Laci Mosley?

  So the following day, James was ready to go forward with the wedding reception for his marriage to Irina. So he's still alright. The plan was to have the reception and then soon after, figure out the divorce to Christina and legal marriage to Irina. James paid for everything, including the $20,000 wedding bill. Christina sent him for the reception with 60 guests, a photographer limo musicians and a full restaurant rental. The reception was when it's planned until the evening when James fell violently ill and had to be taken to the hospital. Wow, I've never seen a wedding reception planned out on Facebook.

• 51:34Laci Mosley?

  Christina sent him a breakdown of the cost for the wedding reception on Facebook.

• 51:42Speaker 06

  Wow, I will say these, these numbers aren't crazy.

• 51:46Laci Mosley?

  No, it's very affordable. $20,000 for a reception feels like that's probably pretty baller.

• 51:52Speaker 06

  Yeah, leading to the, what, what, leading to the wedding registration equals $800.

• 52:00Laci Mosley?

  What?

• 52:02Speaker 06

  Leaving wedding photos projector cracker for newlyweds first dance.

• 52:07Laci Mosley?

  $1,200. Photographer 1,500, that's pretty normal. Video 1,000 or 1,800. Okay, what's the difference between 1,000 and 1,800 and why, why?

• 52:19Speaker 06

  Yeah, what are the packages there?

• 52:21Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, we're not getting any details, but I'm also confused as to the leading to the wedding resis- what does that mean?

• 52:28Speaker 06

  I'm not sure I understand that.

• 52:29Laci Mosley?

  Does that mean that in order to click the link to the registry for like the wedding, it costs $800? Cause I ain't never seen no links that costs $800 for you to go buy something.

• 52:42Speaker 06

  Or maybe she meant reception, like the, the, the, like decorating the pathway to the reception. It says registration, but maybe she meant reception.

• 52:51Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, cause there is a bit of a, a language barrier. So maybe, cause I'm like, I don't understand what that means then. So when he woke up the next morning after falling violently ill, Irina wouldn't see him, claiming he had gotten so drunk, he had humiliated her in front of her family.

• 53:10Speaker 06

  Oh my gosh.

• 53:11Laci Mosley?

  For the next few weeks, she then claimed she had a medical problem and as he wasn't legally her husband, he couldn't visit her in the hospital.

• 53:19Speaker 06

  Oh wow.

• 53:21Laci Mosley?

  I don't know if that's how hospitals work. Like, I'm pretty sure they have, you can, friends can visit at a certain point.

• 53:27Speaker 06

  Right, unless you're like actively in surgery.

• 53:30Laci Mosley?

  Right. Marie was like, I'm mad at you because you embarrassed me getting drunk in front of my family. Then he was like, okay, well, can we talk about this? No, I'm getting surgery right now. You're not my husband. You don't hear him in the back? Clear, clear.

• 53:46Laci Mosley?

  I'm in ICU. Stop texting me. Like, what?

• 53:49Speaker 06

  Ma'am, you can't use your phone here.

• 53:55Laci Mosley?

  Oh, no. So, the next few weeks, you know, she said she was in the hospital. Still, James sent over twelve thousand dollars for medical costs. Now, here's the thing, James. I think if you're gonna send over the twelve K, which is stupid in the first place, the least you should get out of it is like, if you want this money, Irina, then I better come see your sick ass on some IV tubes. You better figure out how I could come into the hospital and see you to hand you the cash in your hand. I'm not about to wire this money to you.

• 54:23Speaker 06

  See, this is, this is my question for you as the scam goddess, because I don't want to sound like I'm victim blaming, but in your experience, is there a theme where people who get scammed, there has to be part of them that wants to be scammed, right? Like, I'm not giving any, I don't have two hundred thou- thousand dollars to give anyone, but I'm also not, probably because I don't have it, but even if I did, I'm not giving someone two hundred thousand dollars, you know, like, in any context. And then I'm not giving them a further twelve thousand, because they're in the hospital.

• 55:00Laci Mosley?

  So, here's the thing. He's an older guy. Obviously, he's kind of a rube. This is a beautiful woman. He's been tricked by lots of beautiful women. He's been in it for eleven months. And not getting no cootie cat, not getting to even, you know, see nothing. So, he's all fantasy right now. He thinks he's in love. He thinks he's finally made it to the point where he's gonna be with his wife. So, his desperation is high. He's, he, and, and unfortunately, people don't remember economics, basic economics is sunk costs, right? You don't put more money into something because you've already invested so much money in it. You cut your losses. Because otherwise, you're just gonna lose more money. There's no such thing as a sunk cost. Like, once a sunk cost happens, it's gone. You're not gonna get the money back that you spent by putting in more money.

• 55:45Laci Mosley?

  So that desperation is now fueling him to try to chase a sunk cost. Like, I already spent this much money, what's another 12,000, right? That's why they came in lower than the 200K and the 20K. They're like, well, you see how the number's getting lower? It was 200K wired, then it was 20K for the reception. Now it's 12,000 for the hospital that he can't go visit her in. So how this scam works is most Ukrainian romance scams make their money from stringing men along, which is what happened for months while they pay per minute to chat with women who mysteriously disappear when they come to collect their wives. Irina and Julia and Karina play the long con and only first started making serious money when they took the $200,000 for the apartment that actually cost $63,000.

• 56:30Laci Mosley?

  And I still don't believe it cost $63,000 because it was a dump.

• 56:33Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 56:34Laci Mosley?

  Unbeknownst to James, they also put it in both Christina and James's names. So now his name is on the bill. And so if they start defaulting on some payments, it's on him, right? So unbeknownst to James, they had put his name on this. The itemized wedding bill Christina sent James was extremely inflated. They had a reception at a restaurant. He was like, damn, it costs $20,000 to throw a party of chilies? And Ukrainian chilies?

• 57:06Laci Mosley?

  They're like chili, baby, back club, barbecue sauce.

• 57:11Speaker 06

  If that's all you can eat, that's where they get you.

• 57:13Laci Mosley?

  Right. So they obviously have been running up the tab on this poor man. Most, if not all, the 60 guests that attended the wedding were paid to be there. They weren't her family. The women that James thought were Irina's mom was actually Julia, the translator's mother, who was probably the same woman who drugged him and caused him to fall ill. So mom is also in on the con. Irina already had a husband, a man named Andrey Skyval, whom she married three months before she met James. So she already got a man. And remember, Julia was the one who was like, you should meet my homegirl. And Julia's got the mama who's pretending to be the homegirl's mom and drugin' James. So Julia's probably the orchestrator of this scam, probably making the most money off of it.

• 57:59Speaker 06

  Wow, this is elaborate.

• 58:01Laci Mosley?

  Right, it's wild. Christina had a husband as well, a man named Denise, that she divorced three weeks before marrying James, whom she remarried afterwards. So she was like, hey babe, I gotta divorce you real quick so we can get to the bag. And then we gonna run the marriage back as soon as we get to the money. And we gonna have a new apartment.

• 58:21Speaker 06

  These hijinks.

• 58:22Laci Mosley?

  So all in all, James had been scammed for over $250,000. And it wasn't until one of his homeboys from the Ukraine was like, bro, they running a scam, they're running a scam on you. And this is after he spent two thirds of his life savings.

• 58:37Speaker 06

  Hmm, oh my gosh.

• 58:40Laci Mosley?

  James went to Odessa Police four times with evidence of the scam, and was mostly met with laughter, damn.

• 58:48Laci Mosley?

  It's not good, it's not good when the police are laughing. They not finna help you.

• 58:53Speaker 06

  That's the thing, that is like the most Eastern European thing though. Like, the police are the ultimate scammers.

• 59:01Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 59:01Speaker 06

  Uh, and like, that was one of the things, that was one of the first things we learned when we did our, um, orientation, they were like, the police will not help you. And if you go to them, they will scam you, they will charge you money. Like, you run up to a police officer and you're like, I'm lost. And they're like, give me $200. And I'll tell you how to get where you're, like, I'm not even kidding.

• 59:24Laci Mosley?

  They're like, perfect, you're lost, love to hear that. So, how desperate are you to get to where you're going?

• 59:31Speaker 06

  And also, you look American, are your parents rich?

• 59:35Laci Mosley?

  Right, rich enough, okay. How much do they love you?

• 59:38Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 59:39Laci Mosley?

  A thousand, 10,000, how much do they love you?

• 59:41Speaker 06

  Let's find out.

• 59:43Laci Mosley?

  So Irene and Christina were taken in for questioning but have not been charged with anything. They probably wasn't even taken in for questioning. The cops were just like, oh, James is getting on our nerves. He keep coming over here, so we know y'all made the, the bags. So y'all gonna have to run us a cut. Otherwise, we gonna have to throw y'all in jail. That's probably what happened.

• 59:59Speaker 06

  They were probably in on it.

• 1:00:00Laci Mosley?

  Let's just bring them in and get our cut. Cause at this point, we know they stole a lot of money. They got coin. Let's bring them in and get our cut.

• 1:00:07Speaker 06

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:00:08Laci Mosley?

  So they probably were brought in for taxes, not questioning.

• 1:00:13Laci Mosley?

  So the most progress James has made has been obtaining the sole ownership of the sixty-three thousand dollar apartment. Okay, at least he got that. James has since employed a private investigator not shy of using intimidation to attempt to recover his lost savings. Not shy of.

• 1:00:29Laci Mosley?

  James, okay, I fuck with you a little bit for this, cause he said, okay, we all doing crime? Great, let me go find me some criminals and get them on my side as well.

• 1:00:37Speaker 06

  Literally. Who was that guy Harvey Weinstein was using? Who was that guy who intimidated Ronan Farrow? That's the one I want.

• 1:00:44Laci Mosley?

  Right, I want somebody who's like, got lots of free nights and weekends to just sit in front of your house. And, you know, eat snacks and, and wait for you to be intimidated. I love that for you. Irene still maintains a dating profile online, listing herself as a divorced babysitter and promising, "My heart will belong to one man and only one."

• 1:01:05Speaker 06

  At a time.

• 1:01:07Laci Mosley?

  I feel like that one man is Jesus. And she's just like, I'll marry you, but you know.

• 1:01:13Speaker 06

  That one man is JP Morgan. She is just trying to get as much money as she can. And honestly, I'm not mad at it.

• 1:01:20Laci Mosley?

  It's who was the whatever dead monarch is on the dollar bills? That's who her heart belongs to.

• 1:01:28Laci Mosley?

  Oh, damn, James, you hate to see it. It's time for Scammer of the Week. This is where we highlight one honorary charlatan or maybe a group of criminals. Maybe we like them, maybe we don't, let's see, not sure yet. So Scammer of the Week. Scammerings are taking advantage of Mackenzie Scott's benevolence. So Mackenzie Scott is obviously the divorced, former Mrs. Q Ball, which is what I call Jeff Bezos with his smooth head that looks like the ball that you break, uh, in pool.

• 1:01:57Speaker 06

  Currently en route to the outer atmosphere.

• 1:02:02Laci Mosley?

  And that's, oh my god, America. You make so much money and then we're like, you can just go to space. What?

• 1:02:09Speaker 06

  Fine, bye.

• 1:02:10Laci Mosley?

  What a waste. There's so much we need to do on earth and billionaires are like, no, we've ravaged this place. We're done. We're now we're going to the moon, girl, so we can colonize that, okay?

• 1:02:20Speaker 06

  Ah, she's done me a good start.

• 1:02:22Laci Mosley?

  So last year, Mackenzie Scott was best known as the ex-wife of Just Bezos. Um, she said she would be giving away half of her fortune following her divorce. Ms. Scott's team sent out hundreds of emails out of the blue to charities notifying them of her large contribution. Now, I will say, Ms. Scott, you could have did better with this money because she's spreading out the coins little by little.

• 1:02:41Speaker 06

  She's redistributing, yeah.

• 1:02:43Laci Mosley?

  I mean, but when you do it to like, like, I want her to be out here giving money to people like Drake. Like, hand it to niggas on the street in cash, like, all this charity giving, like, you know, all the words of charities.

• 1:02:54Speaker 06

  Did. I thought you meant you want her to give money to Drake. I thought that's what you meant.

• 1:02:59Laci Mosley?

  That wouldn't be bad either. I feel like Drake would redistribute the wealth, you know?

• 1:03:03Speaker 06

  She can give some to me.

• 1:03:05Laci Mosley?

  Right. Mackenzie, just go door to door and start giving niggas bands, like,

• 1:03:09Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:03:10Laci Mosley?

  Because this donating to charity, it's cute on paper, but I know how charities work. They have boards. They have people who get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to run the charity. It's a lot of places that that money goes to before it gets to the people who actually need it. T-shirts, blankets, and, you know, we need water for the 5K and ribbies. Like, you know, we all know, we know, it ain't all going straight to the children, okay? Cut the middleman out. Mackenzie, get out here on these streets and start throwing bands at people. So Ms. Scott was sending out all these emails, like, hey, girls, we got the coins, we, you know, skirt, skirt. Uh, we ran off with the bag from Mr. Amazon. And it was exactly this method in a combination with the fact that Ms. Scott has no online presence

• 1:03:51Laci Mosley?

  or established foundation that created a ripe for the picking ground for scammers to prey on vulnerable people in need.

• 1:03:58Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 1:03:59Laci Mosley?

  So because she doesn't have social media and because she's also really sending out emails herself to charities, like, come get the bag, come get the Bezo bag.

• 1:04:08Speaker 06

  [email protected].

• 1:04:14Laci Mosley?

  Miss BezoWifey227 at Hotmail.

• 1:04:21Speaker 06

  Oh my gosh, you can't do anything good, no good deed, I swear.

• 1:04:26Laci Mosley?

  The most prime Amazon.

• 1:04:30Laci Mosley?

  On Instagram dot com, like what?

• 1:04:34Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 1:04:35Laci Mosley?

  So, wow. So, one of these scammers was Danielle Churchill, an Australian mother of five, trying to raise funds to cover therapy fees for her ten year old son. So this is someone who got caught up. She was a victim of this scam. But Churchill received an email saying that she qualified for a grant from Ms. Scott. She was then directed to set up an account with a bank that no longer exists. Wow, I didn't know banks just be disappearing like that, wow.

• 1:05:03Speaker 06

  Remember two thousand eight?

• 1:05:04Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah, yeah. But we bought most of them bitches out. They should have been gone. The bank should have been closing, like Wendy's, like, you know, sorry, I want an out of service sign on the door. Shut it down. So, she was directed then to set up an account with this bank that no longer exists and pay a series of fees via a fake Facebook profile, WhatsApp messages, and Bitcoin in order to access the funds she was told were hers. Here's the thing about money. When people give it to you, they don't charge you for it. The only people who get away with that are the government because they reach into the check before you get it. And they don't even do that all the time.

• 1:05:42Speaker 06

  These people, I just feel so bad for them.

• 1:05:44Laci Mosley?

  If anybody tells you that they're gonna give you money, but all you gotta do is pay the taxes and fees, like, immediately, you should remember the Nigerian prince. That is the whole crux of that scam.

• 1:05:57Laci Mosley?

  I hate to see it. So even though Ms. Churchill did her research, the search results that popped up led back to accounts of people that believed the actual Ms. Scott's emails were a scam and turned out to be real. So there were a lot of people who were like, okay, yeah, we got this weird email and it was like.

• 1:06:13Speaker 06

  And it was actually her.

• 1:06:16Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, Ms. Scott was like, look, I'm trying to help y'all broke bitches out, okay? Respond to this email if you want some coin from Mrs. Former Bezos. And it was real. So apparently, you know, she did her research and she thought, well, all these people thought it was a scam and it was real, let me go ahead and dip my toe. You know, she's trying to take care of her son. It's completely understandable. So it's also easy to assume that, of course, a billionaire giving away billions would at least have a foundation, right? Which. But she didn't.

• 1:06:45Speaker 06

  Whoa.

• 1:06:46Laci Mosley?

  At the time, she was just giving out the coin. So people were making their own Mackenzie Scott foundations and people were just believing them because like, why not?

• 1:06:55Speaker 06

  Oh, no.

• 1:06:57Laci Mosley?

  And I hate this scam. I don't like these scammers because if people are in need.

• 1:07:02Speaker 06

  Right.

• 1:07:03Laci Mosley?

  They are the last people you should be robbing.

• 1:07:06Speaker 06

  Never punch down. Yeah, always punch up.

• 1:07:09Laci Mosley?

  Rob Jeff Bezos. We should all just like, what if I made a Facebook invite for us to all get together and you know, much like protests and marches and stuff, except for we go to Bezos' house.

• 1:07:20Speaker 06

  Right.

• 1:07:20Laci Mosley?

  And strengthen numbers. We just get in there and we take whatever we can get.

• 1:07:26Speaker 06

  I know. I think about what's gonna happen to all that money if he blows up on reentry because.

• 1:07:39Speaker 06

  Because I would really love to get into that, you know?

• 1:07:48Laci Mosley?

  I think he's not gonna send himself. I think he's definitely like, they're already putting out feelers like, who wants to go?

• 1:07:55Speaker 06

  Instead, in his stead?

• 1:07:57Laci Mosley?

  Yes. Who wanna go to Space Show? On me, on me. Mild risks, mild risks.

• 1:08:03Speaker 06

  Mild. Oh, my God. Can you imagine? Like, we see those SpaceX rockets blowing up. Why do these people wanna go to outer space?

• 1:08:14Laci Mosley?

  Look, this is gonna be the craziest thing. It's the craziest thing that I believe, but I don't think we've ever been to space.

• 1:08:20Speaker 06

  No, you didn't. You are not a a truther.

• 1:08:24Laci Mosley?

  You can't tell me in the sixties, they had that good high def cameras on the moon.

• 1:08:34Speaker 06

  Oh, my God.

• 1:08:36Laci Mosley?

  You can't get no signal. Okay, somehow Verizon made it to the moon? But when but when I go, when I go out to Malibu, she can't hear me now?

• 1:08:49Laci Mosley?

  But in the sixties, she made it to the moon in sixty nine?

• 1:08:52Speaker 06

  Wow, wow.

• 1:08:54Laci Mosley?

  Look, I think the earth is round. I'm not a flat earther. I'm not, but, but I don't believe that that white man went to the moon. I think Neil Armstrong's whole life and career is built on a lie that he knows he had to keep up so that he could keep getting them speaking engagements.

• 1:09:08Speaker 06

  Well, this is what I was gonna ask. Do you think he thinks he went to the moon? Like, do you think they played a trick on them as well? Like, you know, like, you go to those Universal Studios and they put you in that thing, like, and it shakes? And then, like, they open the door and they have them in, like, an anti-gravity chamber or, like, they're on wires, but they don't realize it. Like, do you think they played them too? Because at this point, don't you think one of them on their deathbed or, like, in their will would be like, "I have to come clean before God"?

• 1:09:44Laci Mosley?

  Oh, no. That's some, like, B six thirteen level shit. If you start, if you start thinking about snitching on the American government never actually going to the moon, they will kill you.

• 1:09:57Laci Mosley?

  That's some blood oath shit. That's some, like, you never, you don't tell nobody. You don't even tell your girlfriend, your wife. Nobody knows but Neil and whoever was in that tin can. I think they, I think he went into the tin can in Houston. They rolled that bitch around a little bit, shook it up like stir fry, flipped it, flipped it a few times. And I think maybe, yeah, they let him come out in a really cold, dark space with, like, a black and white kind of camera. And, you know, they made a cute moon situation. And they were like, "Actually, Neil, you're running out of oxygen, so we just need you to say the line."

• 1:10:29Laci Mosley?

  Stick the flag in.

• 1:10:30Speaker 06

  Can we run that back, actually? Sorry for sound. We have a plane.

• 1:10:39Laci Mosley?

  We got a space, it was a space crater. Did we say plane? We meant asteroid. It was an asteroid. So if you could just give us one more time, one small step for man, yeah, yeah, and then run back mankind, yeah, yeah. And this time, don't ad lib at the end. Like, we really just want to keep it short.

• 1:10:55Speaker 06

  We said just save the line. Just save the line.

• 1:10:58Laci Mosley?

  Well, guys, that brings us to the end of a fantastic episode. Clark, it was so amazing meeting you.

• 1:11:03Speaker 06

  This was such a blast. Thank you for having me, Lacey. I'm loving all the work that you're doing. You are completely unhinged in everything you do, and it's such a pleasure to watch.

• 1:11:14Laci Mosley?

  Thank you. Thank you for being here. Thank you for donating your talent and making me cackle. I needed that today. We always ask on this podcast, where do you want people to find you?

• 1:11:24Speaker 06

  I'm at MrClarkMoore on all platforms, and my podcast is Soul Bomb by Clark Moore. It's, you can find it wherever you get podcasts. And we're on hiatus right now, but we have a backlog of tons of really great interviews with people, and we'll have to have you on one day soon, once we're back, once we're back from our little summer break.

• 1:11:46Laci Mosley?

  Oh, I love that. Take a summer break. I should take a break. I might.

• 1:11:49Speaker 06

  You know, you're working so hard. You should go on the European vacation model of, I'll see you in September.

• 1:11:56Laci Mosley?

  Oh, that sounds lovely. I might have to start getting a little European, a little Ukrainian, okay? Go on my little vacation. But guys, congregation, as always, if you want to snatch on your friends and family, just make sure your bag is retired. It's game, got us pod at gmail.com. The Black Lady Sketch Show, streaming now on HBO Max, all episodes. iCarly's releasing every single Thursday on Paramount Plus. Get into it, yeah? If you want to find me, D I V A L A C I, Diva Lacey, on all platforms. All right, congregation, stay scheming.

• 1:12:26Laci Mosley?

  This has been an Earwolf production in association with Team Coco. Scam Goddess stars and is hosted by me, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. It's produced by Judith Cargbo, engineered by Marina Faiz, and researched by Kalen Brand. Stay scheming.

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• 1:15:25Speaker 04

  depending on your pack tier. You can also check the live odds and see what you could pull before you rip, and what other cards are being pulled by fans. Download Underdog and get in on the chase. Get five free rips packs when you deposit $5. Real rips, real cards, real cash. Only on Underdog. Unleash your dog. 18+, terms apply. Top grails are extremely rare.