The Attempts on Trump’s Life, Why He Shut Down the Investigations & How It Altered History Forever

The attempts on Donald Trump’s life, why he shut down the investigations and how it altered history forever. Ken Silva with bizarre details from the shooting that changed world history. (00:00) The Assassination Attempt on Trump in Butler, PA (05:04) Who Was Thomas Crooks? (13:14) The Missing Details of That Day (25:45) The Strange Crooks Sightings (37:06) How Was Crooks Such a Good Marksman? (59:11) Did Iran Have Anything to Do With This? (1:22:34) Ryan Routh Recruiting Foreign Fighters for Ukraine Ken Silva is the editor of HeadlineUSA.com, a contributor to the Libertarian Institute, and the author of "The Trump Assassination Plots: What the Investigations Missed, and Why it Matters (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0H1GVFW3Y/r)." He has more than 15 years of experience as an investigative reporter, with bylines in the Associated Press, the Economist Intelligence Unit, Reason, and numerous other publications. Follow him on Twitter/X: @JD_Cashless. Paid partnerships with: Ethos: Protect your family with life insurance from Ethos. Get up to $3 million in coverage in as little as 10 minutes at https://ethos.com/TUCKER Joi + Blokes: Use code TUCKER for 65% off your labs and 20% off all supplements at https://joiandblokes.com/tucker American Financing: NMLS 182334, nmlsconsumeraccess.org. APR for rates in the 5s start at 6.327% for well qualified borrowers. Call 800-685-5696 for details about credit costs and terms. Visit http://www. AmericanFinancing.net/Tucker. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:34Tucker Carlson?

  Ken Silva, thank you very much for doing this. You've written a book on the Trump assassination plots, the two from the summer of 2024, about which there are more unanswered questions than answered questions. And they're so transparently ridiculous, the stories that we have been told. That it... My first question is, what... Where are all the other books on this topic? Why did this fall to you?

• 0:59Speaker 02

  That was my question too. And you're actually probably one of the only major media figures that's still keeping this story alive. So it's a pleasure to talk to you. But yeah, there were a couple of books published in the wake, like Selena Zito, who's a Washington Examiner reporter, wrote a book called Butler, but it goes more into the cultural aspects of like the Butler community and the political effects, the political fallout of the event. It's not really like a forensic investigation. This is the first of that kind.

• 1:30Tucker Carlson?

  Does Zito's book have a conclusion? Does it reach... Does it reach a conclusion about what that was? Or does she affirm the official story, which is this was a crazed, left-wing lone gunman?

• 1:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's more or less an affirmation of the official story. And again, just like the political fallout, that's more of the book. She was there that day. So there is like an autobiographical account of what happened, you know, from when she got there. But it doesn't go into like the details about what happened over on the HGR building or the security failures or who Thomas Crooks was.

• 2:07Tucker Carlson?

  So I'm gonna state what I think is the official account of what happened in Butler that day. And then I would like you to just take us through what you know about what happened in Butler that day. So the official account is there's this weird kid.

• 2:22Tucker Carlson?

  Local kid who really hates Trump and he's been radicalized probably online. We don't really know because he has no meaningful online profile. He's like the only young man in America who's not online. And he's somehow a very good shot. And he somehow gets into the one vulnerable place at the event site in Butler Township that gives him a sight line to Trump. And nobody notices this because there are just these unaccountable holes in security. It's just amazing. It's just a failure of security. And he takes the shot.

• 3:07Tucker Carlson?

  He misses. He kills someone in the stands, a fireman. And then he's killed by a US government sniper. And he had no accomplices. He's just a crazy person, one of many. And that's all we know. Case closed.

• 3:26Speaker 02

  And that's bad enough.

• 3:27Tucker Carlson?

  But is that a fair representation of to this day, the story of what happened in Butler?

• 3:33Speaker 02

  The biggest issue I would take with the official story about just what happened that day is that a lot of people think the Secret Service sniper actually saved the day. You know, everybody knows about the slope roof excuse for why they didn't have somebody posted there in the first place. The fact that that building was outside of the ostensible perimeter, even though it was, you know, again, like 150 yards clear line of sight to Trump. But a lot of people say, well, at least the Secret Service sniper stopped it from being a lot worse. In fact, Donald Trump said that a couple of weeks ago, after this most recent White House Correspondents Dinner attack, he's talking about, well, they did a lot better

• 4:18Speaker 02

  at that event than they did at Butler. Although my buddy David saved my life at Butler. He was, he's the sniper. His name's David King. And Trump says he responded in 4.2 seconds from 400 yards away. Neither one of those assertions by Trump are true, which is very bizarre that he doesn't know. The details about the attempt on his own life, in fact, it was a local cop who saved the day. It was the alleged would be assassin Crooks fired three well-measured discreet shots. And then there's a short pause and then he starts rapid firing five shots.

• 5:02Speaker 02

  And then the ninth shot comes immediately after that eighth shot, all in the span of five seconds from the local cop on the ground. His name's Aaron Zalapony. He was a Butler ESU member. And then there's 10 whole seconds that pass by before David King finally puts the final bullet through.

• 5:24Tucker Carlson?

  Wait, Thomas Crooks fired nine shots?

• 5:26Speaker 02

  He fired eight shots and then the ninth shot came from the ground from Zalapony.

• 5:31Tucker Carlson?

  He fired eight shots?

• 5:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:33Tucker Carlson?

  So let's, let's just start at the beginning. Um, who was Crooks?

• 5:39Speaker 02

  Well, that's still an unanswered question. My book does have the most complete biographical account of Crooks, but he's still an aberration. He almost seemed like he was kind of leading a double life. All the public information I found out about him paints him as just a really respectable young man, almost, you know, hate to say it, but like the kind of guy you'd want your son to turn out to be like. Uh, he was a straight A student in high school, well-liked by his classmates and teachers. Graduates with a 4.0, goes to a community college for engineering.

• 6:21Speaker 02

  While there, one of his projects was actually 3D printing a chessboard and a Rubik's cube that were inscribed with Braille and his mother's legally blind, so it seemed like a pretty sweet thing to do for his mother. I got community college speeches where he says, one of my favorite things to do is like cook with my family. Loved his sister Katie Crooks.

• 6:47Speaker 02

  And he was planning on going to Robert Morris University that fall to get his four-year degree. That's the public facing.

• 6:56Tucker Carlson?

  As of when was he planning on going to college?

• 7:00Speaker 02

  Well, that's a great question because it was actually, I obtained his college emails and I got one from June 14th, 2024, where he's emailing the community college about the status of his diploma because he had just graduated, but apparently he didn't get actual proof and he needed that to go to Robert Morris that fall. So, less than a month before he winds up dead on a rooftop, he's asking about the status of his diploma and still making plans to go to university that fall, which is very strange. I just don't know what to make of it. Not, it doesn't sound like a man planning to die, you know?

• 7:40Tucker Carlson?

  It certainly doesn't sound like a man planning to die. It's like the death throw inmate asking if he can, you know, save some for later in his final meal. Um, does anybody around him later say, yes, he was radical and crazy and violent?

• 7:57Speaker 02

  Nobody that knew him, his father, the night of the incident, the ATF responds to the House and they're questioning him and he said, well, I didn't really know much about Thomas's politics. He liked to play the contrarian. He liked to kind of, whatever side the father and the mother would take, he would just be devil's advocate and argue the opposite side. Uh, he was a registered Republican, but he made a donation to Act Blue, like the left wing PAC on the day of Joe Biden's inauguration. So I guess the theory there would be if he was left wing, he registered as a Republican to vote in the primaries and try to vote for the weaker candidates, something like that. But, uh, yeah, we don't

• 8:40Speaker 02

  know for sure. Probably the best evidence of his political leanings comes from the trove of data that you published a couple of months ago in your documentary about, you know, the violent comments and kind of showed his political transformation in 2019 and 2020. But that was when he was like 16, 17. So, we don't really know what happened those last three, four years of his life. He started using more encryption, VPNs. Uh, there's not much- Of a data trail there. I did obtain his community college metadata. What I did there is FOIA it from the college and they sent me like a

• 9:23Speaker 02

  big string of jumbled up code, but I had somebody who knew what they were doing, kind of decipher it. And it showed the actual websites that he was visiting while he was on the community college campus. It doesn't show the contents of any of his messages or anything, but you know, he voted, uh, he visited like a Game of Thrones fan site. He seemed to be a Pittsburgh Steelers fan. Twitter.com, reddit.com, nothing very unusual. I mean, he went to like AR15.com, but that doesn't really tell you that much. Uh, so yeah, he, he's a total cipher when it comes to the last few years of his life.

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• 12:02Speaker 04

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• 12:55Tucker Carlson?

  Very. The FBI has a lot of this information, we should say, and has not released it for reasons maybe we can speculate about in a minute. But it's fair to say the FBI has a lot of information about this guy that's not public.

• 13:08Speaker 02

  That's absolutely right. So when it became apparent last July that the FBI wasn't going to voluntarily release information about Thomas Crooks or the event, the transparency organization Judicial Watch filed a lawsuit to force disclosure. And we just got a status report a few months ago saying that they had 45,000 responsive records about Thomas Crooks in response to Judicial Watch's lawsuit. A couple of months later, we get another status report. Saying we found another 30,000. So now it's up to 75,000. And they've started making monthly productions to Judicial Watch.

• 13:54Speaker 02

  But it's like a couple dozen, it's been four months and it's been a couple dozen pages apiece. So like 200 in total.

• 14:02Tucker Carlson?

  Out of 75,000.

• 14:03Speaker 02

  Yeah. So at that rate, we'll all be dead before all the records are produced. It's pretty egregious.

• 14:11Tucker Carlson?

  Which, and also pretty revealing. Like, what is that? Right? If the lone, if it's a crime committed by a lone gunman who's deceased, no one else involved in this case at all, then, then that's the official story. Then what would be the motive to hide it?

• 14:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, as controversial as the Epstein files rollout has been, one of the beneficial things that the Justice Department did is just put them all in a word searchable database. And you'd think they'd be able to do something like that with the Crooks files. So people could just type in any word and it'll pull all the records with, you know, that word on it. You know, one of Cash Patel's excuses was that, well, Donald Trump is a victim here and he has rights too. So that's why we're not releasing some of this out of respect for him. But that's not, that's not a legal thing. Like, that's not covered in FOIA. Of course, they could redact Donald Trump's name, but they can't just say, oh, because Trump's a victim,

• 15:12Speaker 02

  we're not gonna comply with FOIA. It's pretty ridiculous.

• 15:17Tucker Carlson?

  And of course, no individual, even president, owns the US justice system. Justice is affected on behalf of the entire country.

• 15:24Speaker 02

  It's supposed to be rule of law and.

• 15:26Tucker Carlson?

  Right. That belongs to the American people. These documents belong to the American people. The FBI belongs to the American people. So that's like, it's a nonsensical argument. It's a grotesque argument, actually. So, um, tell us about that day. So this guy about whom we know very little, who seems pretty normal.

• 15:44Tucker Carlson?

  Shows up at this Trump rally and what happens?

• 15:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, so I guess the story starts 8 a.m. that morning. There's a Secret Service site counterpart. Her name's Dana Dubre. She shows up and none of her colleagues are there. And apparently there's rumors that they had been out drinking late the night before at a Pittsburgh bar called Tequila Cowboy. So she's kind of upset that her supposable, ostensible partner isn't helping her with the setup. They finally start trickling in around 10 a.m. and they hold a briefing and this is the first kind of weird anomaly. Is that a Pennsylvania police trooper tried to participate in the Secret Service briefing and they actually kicked him out.

• 16:32Speaker 02

  So it seemed pretty insular. We don't know exactly why that is.

• 16:37Tucker Carlson?

  So the briefing would be the, the meeting that law enforcement has at the beginning of the day to talk through what they're going to do and what the potential threats might be.

• 16:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's exactly right. And I guess one of the reforms to come out of this whole fiasco is the now they hold a unified briefing where they let the locals in, but you know, a little too little, a little too late for that.

• 16:59Tucker Carlson?

  So how did Crooks get there? How did he get in? How did he get to this spot? Like, what do we know about all that?

• 17:08Speaker 02

  Uh, he first showed up around 10 a.m. when they're holding this secret briefing where they're keeping out the locals and the staties. And Crooks shows up and apparently he just drives around and kind of cases out the place. And he later goes home to Bethel Park, which is about a 45 minute drive. He lived closer to Pittsburgh, butlers more out in the country. So, um, yeah, Crooks goes home. Uh, and meanwhile, we have the first security failure at the site before anything even happens. The counter drone operator, an agent named Eduardo Castro, uh, just can't get his drone detection equipment working.

• 17:50Speaker 02

  Uh, he's initially by the stage. He tries to move it. He thinks it might be some kind of signal issue. Uh, he even calls like a 1-800 number for troubleshooting and.

• 18:01Speaker 02

  He doesn't get it working until about 4:20 PM, which is when Crooks finally returned. Uh, Crooks flies a drone over the site for about 11 minutes, and this is like 3:50 to 4:01. And then he returns with the drone and then the drone detection equipment gets up and working, which is, uh, an unfortunate coincidence, I guess.

• 18:24Tucker Carlson?

  What does Crooks, uh, get at his house? Do we know?

• 18:29Speaker 02

  Uh, well, he got his rifle, which apparently belonged to him, but his father was in possession of it. So he asked his dad for his rifle and, uh, he goes to a local shop. He buys some ammunition. Uh, he also bought a ladder that morning and I think a lot of people think that he got up on the rooftop on a ladder, which isn't the case. He actually scaled some air conditioning, uh, unit and the ladder was found in Bethel Park in the woods later. So I think what probably happened there is he bought the ladder. He went that morning and cased out the site and realized that he wouldn't need the ladder. He could use the air conditioning and then

• 19:12Speaker 02

  just abandoned it in the woods. And like I said, uh, supposedly the rifle belonged to him, but the father was possessing it, but, uh, the ATF would eventually track the rifle to the father and the father said that he, uh, sold it informally to his son a couple of years ago, but there's no paperwork for that. So the paperwork shows that the rifle belonged to the father and I guess there's a loophole in Pennsylvania, uh, state law where you can transfer long guns, uh, two Pennsylvania residents can do that with each other without any kind of paperwork. So we don't know for sure. I, I mean, that's the story that he transferred it, but there's no paperwork to that.

• 19:54Tucker Carlson?

  How does Crooks get a rifle onto the grounds of a Trump event?

• 19:58Speaker 02

  It was probably broken down in his backpack. Yeah, that's, we don't know that for sure. There is surveillance footage that the FBI is still withholding that would presumably, you know, shed light on some of these details. Like, there's an ice cream shop north of the AGR building that apparently has footage of Crooks actually even scaling the building. But that's just one of like the thousands and thousands of records that the FBI has refused to disclose.

• 20:30Tucker Carlson?

  Including the, the footage of Crooks training on a, on a local firing range. That might give us insight into how this kid was able to get off the shots that he did.

• 20:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, Claritin Sports Club. We went there 43 times in the span of maybe 10 months. I did find with those records that there were four times where he signed in with somebody else at the exact same time and for the exact same range. So you could go to either the pistol club, pistol range or long rifle range. And every time that somebody else signed in at the exact same time, they would go to the same range. There was even a day where he went to pistol and rifle and this mystery person, it could have been his dad, but the name's redacted in the records. So the person that signed in at the same time also went to the pistol and rifle.

• 21:25Speaker 02

  Another interesting thing I found as far as that goes is, is again, back to the community college emails. November 9th, 2023, he actually emails his teacher saying that he's going to be late to class. And that was the day that he went to the range. Presumably with this mystery person and they trained on pistols and rifles. And, you know, you can go to the range anytime. Thomas was again, a model student. I think he missed class maybe like three or four times his whole career. So I've got questions about why it was so important for him to go to the range that he emailed his teacher and said, I'm going to be late today.

• 22:08Tucker Carlson?

  Because he was going with someone else, obviously.

• 22:11Speaker 02

  Sure. Yeah. But, you know, the deeper question like why, why was it urgent that day or what? Why they needed to go that particular time?

• 22:20Tucker Carlson?

  He was, at one point.

• 22:24Tucker Carlson?

  In contact with security at the event, correct?

• 22:28Speaker 02

  Uh.

• 22:29Tucker Carlson?

  He got a rangefinder through.

• 22:32Speaker 02

  Well, he never went through the magnetometers or went through security, which is another weird anomaly is that he registered through an encrypted email to get a ticket to the event, but then he never went through, uh, went inside. So I don't know what his original plan was again, he might've gone there that morning and realized like, well, shoot, this is easy. I don't even have to go through security like it. There's a clear line of sight there. Um, but yeah, he never went into the perimeter.

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• 24:35Tucker Carlson?

  He gets up on the roof. Do we know how long he was there?

• 24:39Speaker 02

  He was up on the roof.

• 24:41Tucker Carlson?

  Yes.

• 24:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, he was um up on the roof since about 6:03 PM. And this is actually a pretty bad local security failure. I do believe it was a mistake and not something intentional. And I could actually show you and I'll try to articulate what's going on here.

• 25:04Speaker 02

  Uh, for people just listening. But so.

• 25:11Speaker 02

  This is the AGR building. And a local sniper spots him here. And the local sniper, uh, Crooks runs off when he's spotted. And the local sniper says he's going all the way around the building when in fact, he went into this alcove and climbed up. So this is like 6:03. All of local law enforcement is responding here, thinking that he ran all the way around, when in fact, he went in and up on the rooftop. And that was just one of the few mistakes made by the locals.

• 25:44Tucker Carlson?

  6:03 is when he was first spotted.

• 25:46Speaker 02

  Well, that's an interesting question because the local snipers in that building, uh, there were three in there and one of them left around 4:20 PM. And he texts his buddies inside the building and says, there's this guy sitting out on a parking bench. He's looking up in the building. I think he knows you guys are in there and just flagging this for your situational awareness. And it was initially reported in the wake of the shooting that that was like the first sighting of Crooks. But then somebody released um cellphone footage showing Crooks walking on the other side of the site like.

• 26:30Speaker 02

  Over a half mile away. So the question is like, who did these local snipers really see that they thought was suspicious? Uh, one of them, not one of the snipers, but another one of the local cops on the ground, his name's Chris Copas. He insists that yes, that really was Crooks that we saw at 4:26 PM. I swear it was him, except he was wearing pants instead of shorts. But obviously, you know, Crooks can't be at, uh, two places at one time. So, uh, there was a lot of false sightings, um, or I don't know if they were false sightings or not, but, uh, another rally goer said he saw somebody that looked like Crooks carrying

• 27:15Speaker 02

  a long rifle north of the AGR building. And this would have been captured by that surveillance footage from the ice cream shop. And the reason I take, um, take this sighting seriously is because the rally goer who says he saw this, uh, was communicating with a Pennsylvania state police trooper with a body cam. And so he actually sues to get the footage of the body cam that would have shown this young man open carrying a rifle. And he didn't tell anybody about this lawsuit. He like, didn't want the attention. But a local newspaper uncovered the lawsuit and found out what he was doing. And, uh, the upshot of the lawsuit

• 27:58Speaker 02

  is that the state police said, well, we don't have any footage for you. Like it doesn't exist. Um, but again, the reason I think that's a legitimate sighting is because he didn't want attention. He was actually trying to prove his case. He's not just like talking, you know?

• 28:12Tucker Carlson?

  So, uh, when was the shooting? What time did he pull the trigger?

• 28:16Speaker 02

  Uh, 6:11 PM. Uh, so putting aside those possibly false sightings or, you know, God knows what's going on. Uh, it's around 5:20 that a local sniper inside the building again sees Crooks. This time Crooks has a rangefinder. Um, now instead of putting this over the radio, he, he texts. Some of his local counterparts and including the command center leader Butler ESU commander Edward Lenz and nothing's really done because I guess they're not checking their phones. It's not until like 540 that people finally see like, oh, this is like the infamous pictures of Crooks

• 28:59Speaker 02

  sitting on a concrete wall by the AGR.

• 29:02Tucker Carlson?

  Yeah.

• 29:03Speaker 02

  Said he's lurking around. He has a rangefinder.

• 29:06Tucker Carlson?

  And they identified it correctly as a rangefinder.

• 29:09Speaker 02

  That's we've never seen a picture of the rangefinder, but they say they found that in Crooks's pockets after he was killed. So yeah, I think that's.

• 29:16Tucker Carlson?

  So if you're trying to protect the life of the principal, somebody and someone at the scene has a rangefinder.

• 29:26Tucker Carlson?

  I mean, could there be a clear indication of intent?

• 29:30Speaker 02

  And the locals did respond to it accordingly. The local command center leader Edward Lenz says that he called the Secret Service Command Center. By the way, they're separate command centers, which is a huge issue. He talks to a Pennsylvania State Police Trooper inside the Secret Service Command Center, who then tells the Command Center Leader Jeffrey Burr. And instead of putting that over the radios, though, Jeffrey Burr then tells the counter drone guy Castro about it. Castro calls some agents to go search for it, but they never put it

• 30:10Speaker 02

  out over the radios. And this by now is like 550 PM, about 21 minutes before the shooting.

• 30:18Tucker Carlson?

  So we know Crooks is on the roof at 603. What happens between then and 611?

• 30:23Speaker 02

  Okay, so yeah, Crooks gets up on the rooftop. Meanwhile, all the cops are searching north of the building like they don't know. But then a local cop does spot Crooks on the rooftop around 606 PM. Says somebody's on the roof. He seems to be running around. Again, they still don't know what exactly to make of this. They I don't think they even knew it was the guy that had the rangefinder. This gets passed on to the local command center Edward Lenz and he puts it out over channel three at 608 PM that there's a guy on the rooftop. It's not one of ours.

• 31:06Speaker 02

  But the problem here is it's the local radios and specifically he was on a channel that was only heard by like the traffic cops and like some of the people on the ground who are pretty much assisting in like crowd control and things like that. He never switches over to channel four to inform the actual snipers in the building or his QRF team that was like ready to deploy in response to emergencies. Instead, he again calls the Secret Service Command Center. And here's where things get especially controversial because he said, Len says that he calls

• 31:48Speaker 02

  the PSP trooper in the Secret Service Center and then they both inform Jeffrey Burr about somebody's on the rooftop now. Burr claims that he never heard this. So I've been kind of called Jeffrey Burr, Jeffrey, a deaf and dumb Burr because he never, he says he never heard anything and he never put anything out over the radios, even though now obviously the threat has escalated. You know, we should point out that Trump's on the stage at this point. He took the stage at 602, which is exactly, you know, that sighting of Crooks where they think he's running around, but he goes up top. So things are getting serious now.

• 32:27Tucker Carlson?

  And at some point, people in the crowd beneath Crooks notice him up there.

• 32:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, people notice him up there like around 608 or and they're watching the locals kind of frantically scramble around seeing how they can get up on the rooftop. And yeah, it's kind of a spectacle and even some people inside the perimeter start to notice, you know, the commotion going on by the AGR.

• 32:53Tucker Carlson?

  So then a local cop tries to get on the roof. What happens and when?

• 32:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, so while all this is transpiring, Detective Collins, Tyler Collins, is actually at the Butler Police Station, maybe a mile away and he's hearing all this chatter and he's, I guess he's a relatively young. and fitter guy, so he decides to go assist in the chase. He drives directly to the AGR building. And you know, this is seen on body cam. He has one of his buddies boosts him up to try to get get up on the roof. Uh, he gets up there. He looks, he says he saw Crooks. Crooks swivels his rifle at Tyler Collins.

• 33:41Speaker 02

  Collins drops down and now he says, the person on the roof is armed. Now, now we're probably talking like 30, 25 seconds before the shooting.

• 33:51Tucker Carlson?

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• 34:56Speaker 00

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• 35:26Speaker 06

  searches and compares hundreds of travel sites. But unless I repeat the word kayak, kayak thinks you won't remember that. So kayak asked me to say kayak as many times as possible. Kayak. Kayak. Kayak. Kayak. Kayak. Kayak. Kai.

• 35:45Tucker Carlson?

  Ooh.

• 35:45Speaker 06

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• 35:56Tucker Carlson?

  So one of the most interesting, I mean, it's minor, but it's interesting. Facts of this is that Crooks is on the roof. He's surprised by a local cop, aims his rifle at him, then pivots. And starts firing within 30 seconds. At over 100 yards and hits Trump's ear famously. That's pretty, that's like biathlon level shooting in that there's clearly lots of adrenaline. It's a quick turn. And you see all these, you know, people on TV, oh, that's an easy shot. That's not an easy shot for a man filled with adrenaline. Just been confronted by a police officer like that's, that's someone who is either like remarkably cool under pressure or who's done a lot of training.

• 36:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, Crooks, uh, from what I can tell was a really good shot. Um, this wasn't his training at Claritin Sports Club. He also took a pistol course that I think it's called like the Keystone Range out in Pennsylvania. And there was one other guy who was with the class, in the class with Crooks. He's called by the FBI a couple of days later when, um, you know, the FBI finds that Crooks was training here. And this guy gave an interview and said that Crooks once shot a target in the same spot with a nine millimeter so many times that he blew a hole out of the target. So yeah, Crooks was really good. And, you know, I've heard you talk on your previous podcast about this with Sean Davis.

• 37:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's incredibly difficult shot under that pressure situation where you see a local cop, you know, coming up to get you and you have to focus and, you know, keep your breathing under control and, and.

• 37:36Tucker Carlson?

  Yeah.

• 37:37Speaker 02

  Came within millimeters.

• 37:38Tucker Carlson?

  Struck, I'm really struck by that. Um, so then he sets some place he's prone, he's lying and, and he gets off eight shots.

• 37:46Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 37:47Tucker Carlson?

  What happens to those bullets?

• 37:49Speaker 02

  Uh, the first one grazes Trump's ear. Uh, the second one flies over Trump's shoulder. And this is the Pulitzer Prize winning photo taken by Doug Mills, where Trump's beginning to bring his hand up to his ear, which is really strong evidence that this was like a legitimate shooting and that the bullets were real. Um, unless you want to make the argument that the New York Times are in on the conspiracy that this is staged. Uh, but yeah, it shows the bullet and it also shows that Trump doesn't have any kind of squib in his hand that, you know, for the fake blood. Um, but in any event, yeah. So the second one whizzes by his shoulder.

• 38:30Speaker 02

  And I'm pretty sure that's the one that hits David Dutch, uh, who was one of the wounded rally goers. Um, it actually, I think, split his liver. It was a pretty, pretty nasty shot. Uh, the third one, I'm not sure about. It was the second volley of five that one of them hits, uh, the firefighter Corey Comparatori and then, um, Jim Koppenhaver, who generously wrote the foreword to my book, he got shot twice. And one of those bullets is still, uh, in his body. It's like too close to the spine. I think he's in his mid eighties now, so they can't really extract it.

• 39:11Tucker Carlson?

  So four people are hit by bullets, including Trump?

• 39:13Speaker 02

  Yeah. Uh, yeah, that, that's right. Initially, this is weird. Uh, Ronnie Jackson, who was once Trump's physician, now he's in Congress. I think he initially said that like my son was grazed or something, but we haven't heard anything about that. I, I really don't know what happened there. But we know for sure of these, uh, the, these four people.

• 39:35Tucker Carlson?

  The man who was killed, who was he?

• 39:38Speaker 02

  Uh, Corey Comparatori. Uh, yeah, he was, uh, you know, firefighter, a family man, a, a girl dad. He had, uh, two girls, a loving wife, Helen. Uh, by all accounts, just like an upstanding member of the community, the kind of guy you'd want to be friends with, the kind of guy you'd, uh, entrust with your life. Just a real tragedy that we lost him.

• 40:01Tucker Carlson?

  So that, um, there's been a lot of speculation about this being staged. It's fake. There are, you know, theological arguments for this that come out of, of the Old Testament. Apparently there's a-

• 40:16Tucker Carlson?

  A part that suggests, you know, the pricking of the ear is necessary for a prophecy to be fulfilled, et cetera, et cetera. There's a lot of talk about this.

• 40:26Tucker Carlson?

  What's your view of that?

• 40:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, the same people that make that biblical argument or prophecy argument also says that he wasn't really shot. So I don't really understand that if his ear has to be pricked, then, but he didn't get shot in the ear. It's hard to really argue with the people who think it's fake because I haven't really heard a coherent theory for how it possibly could have been staged. I mean, as we've discussed, the local response to the would be assassin was very much legitimate. The bullets were real, the blood was real, the bodies were real. This would require the complicity of the Biden FBI, Biden's Secret Service. Keep in mind that he's under investigation

• 41:12Speaker 02

  at the time or facing prosecutions. I'm sure he's surrounded by FBI informants. They're probably listening to his calls. I don't know when he would have been able to plan something like this. And then, one of my favorite pieces of evidence that I found in the transcripts of interview, Congress interviewing the local cops, is that his personal physician was actually left behind in the chaos when he was shuttled off the stage and taken to Butler Hospital. So he had to have been examined by a Butler doctor, who then, because his personal physician was at the farm

• 41:52Speaker 02

  show, they take the Butler doctor on Trump Force One to the next site. I think it was New Jersey. So I would imagine that if this was a staged event, it would have been something like, he keeps the low, he keeps his own doctor close to his side. They go to Butler Hospital. They say, no, nobody's allowed to see Trump's ear for national security reasons. But that wasn't the case. It was actually a local doctor who initially treated him. And he would have had to been in on it, too, if this was-

• 42:22Tucker Carlson?

  Well, and there are three other people shot. So, I mean, it's hard to, if it was fake, you know, no one told them.

• 42:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 42:29Tucker Carlson?

  Right, yeah. So, okay, I think that the evidence suggests it was entirely real. Someone was trying to kill Trump. How did the Secret Service respond?

• 42:40Speaker 02

  They really didn't respond. Again, we can go more into the failures leading up to it. I mentioned Jeffrey Burr, who by the way, he's the Command Center Leader. And by the way, he's also the Special Agent in Charge of the Buffalo Field Office, which I found a little bit strange. I don't know much about the inner workings of the Secret Service, but it was kind of bizarre to me that this 25-year-old veteran or 25-year veteran in charge of an entire jurisdiction, he's now just a post-stander manning the radios on the ground for a rally outside of his jurisdiction.

• 43:22Speaker 02

  I think the argument was there was that they were short-staffed and needed help, and he's a senior guy who knows what he's doing. But of course, he makes a lot of the key mistakes by never putting anything out over the radio. Another Secret Service blunder was when they did call the Secret Service Counter Sniper Response Agent, who is like the agent on the ground that the snipers can say, "Hey, go check this out", and he'll go run over there. And, you know, he's kind of like the eyes and ears of the snipers on the rooftops. He goes to search for crooks when they're notified of the rangefinder,

• 44:05Speaker 02

  and he's actually turned away by another agent, which is really inexplicable. And this agent said like, "Oh, we have the AGR building covered. There's people searching for the suspicious person. Go to the south of the stage and look there", which didn't make any sense because everybody knew the action was happening by the AGR building. But again, the granddaddy of them all is the fact that the Secret Service sniper waited up to 23 seconds before responding. And I say 23 seconds because we have footage.

• 44:42Speaker 02

  Of him looking through his scope before the shooting starts. He actually had, you know, he's looking through his scopes. I don't know if he had crooks in his sight or not.

• 44:53Tucker Carlson?

  But he was looking in that direction.

• 44:54Speaker 02

  He was looking in that direction. And yeah, I listened to your-

• 44:56Tucker Carlson?

  And this is after eight shots have been fired.

• 44:59Speaker 02

  This is before any shooting started.

• 45:01Tucker Carlson?

  Right. But I mean, he, the FBI sniper waited long enough that Crooks fired eight times before he was taken out.

• 45:09Speaker 02

  Yeah. And the eight shots happened in five seconds. He waited an entire, another 10 seconds before he put that final 10th shot through Crooks. And, you know, I could give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he wasn't prepared. He panicked. He had Crooks in his scope. The local cop shoots Crooks. Crooks staggers back and now he's got to readjust. However, his congressional testimony is very troubling.

• 45:43Speaker 02

  The sniper initially tells the House task force that he didn't see Crooks until after all the shooting had stopped. He said he was like on his binoculars. The shooting started. By the time he finds Crooks in his scope, Crooks had already fired eight times. Then he tells a similar story to the Senate Homeland Security Committee, but a staffer, I don't know who this is, but the staffer is heroic. He pulls out, this is almost like a Perry Mason moment. He pulls out the sniper's own notes that they apparently got as part of a production from the Secret Service. And he says,

• 46:25Speaker 02

  well, you know, David, your own notes after the incident says that you saw Crooks, quote, "low crawling with an AR-15 into position and that you had seen him before, before the shooting started." I actually, I have the exact notes. This is what the sniper David King wrote immediately after the incident, quote, "I and my teammates positioned ourselves to observe that area that everyone was moving to. I noticed- An individual white male, white or gray shirt, low crawling on the roof. I noticed an AR style weapon in his hands. As I moved to observe through my rifle scope, I heard weapon fire.

• 47:06Speaker 02

  I immediately got a laser rangefinder distance from my weapon mounted rangefinder. I looked up to see my engagement scope, looked back through the scope, observed the individual shooting and engaged. So there's a major contradiction there. I'm not necessarily suggesting that he waited on purpose. I think, again, I think he might be covering his ass because as we discussed before, Trump views him as a hero and maybe he just doesn't want to admit that he did.

• 47:38Tucker Carlson?

  Where is that sniper now, David King?

• 47:41Speaker 02

  He's still, I believe he's still on Trump's detail because again, after the White House Correspondents Dinner attack, Trump goes, I tell David, I love you, David, like acting like David's his hero. And by the way, that's how we were able to identify him. He had, he's on local police body cam footage with his patch that says D. King. And then Trump says, I think he first told Miranda Devine about a year ago that his name is David. So Trump almost kind of outed him. I searched David King, Secret Service, LinkedIn immediately pops up showing that he, this

• 48:23Speaker 02

  guy in the Special Operations Division of the Secret Service. I reached out to him, he declined to comment and reporter Susan Crabtree has since corroborated that identity, the David King name.

• 48:37Tucker Carlson?

  But he still works there?

• 48:38Speaker 02

  Again, yeah, I think Trump expresses appreciation for him.

• 48:43Tucker Carlson?

  Was anyone fired?

• 48:46Speaker 02

  Kimberly Cheadle resigned, the former director resigned under bipartisan pressure. Uh, there were five or six suspensions that all came, most of them came from the local Pittsburgh field office, even though, um, they, they were kind of thrown under the bus in my opinion. But no, nobody was actually fired.

• 49:09Tucker Carlson?

  Nobody was fired.

• 49:11Speaker 02

  Unless you count Cheadle, but that's, uh, again, she resigned and she has, I don't know if she's still has secret service protection, but she was given, uh, taxpayer, taxpayer funded security after she was fired, uh, I guess, you know, for the threats or whatever, because people thought she was in on it.

• 49:29Tucker Carlson?

  So what happened next? Trump gets shot, he leaves, he goes to New Jersey with the local doctor. What happens to Crooks's body?

• 49:40Speaker 02

  Uh, that's a great question. Crooks's body was actually left on the rooftop until 6 a.m. the next morning. And instead of taking him to the Butler County coroner, he shipped to Allegheny County. Um, I guess we've gotten conflicting explanations. Uh, I guess Allegheny County is where Pittsburgh is. They have more advanced facilities. But then I also heard they took Corey Comparatore's body to Allegheny County because they, the press was at the Butler County coroner's office. Um, and they wanted to avoid the press attention.

• 50:16Tucker Carlson?

  Crooks was shot once, correct?

• 50:18Speaker 02

  I think the local cop hit him.

• 50:21Tucker Carlson?

  First?

• 50:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, I, I definitely think, uh, the local cop hit him because you keep in mind, Crooks stopped shooting after the local cop fired. Uh, there's some speculation that, uh, Aaron Zala Pony might've hit the buttstock of the gun and shattered it. Uh, but the thing is that the x-ray of Crooks shows that there's bullet fragments still in his shoulder.

• 50:47Speaker 02

  And people, ballistics experts have told me that that 300 Win Mag final shot wouldn't have fragmented like that. The Secret Service's 300 Win Mag round went through Crooks's neck, out, back in the shoulder, then it fragments into two pieces and makes two re-exit wounds. They actually recovered those fragments. It's this material in the shoulder that was left in there. Actually, the body was released for cremation with the fragments still in the shoulder, which seems like a mishandling of evidence, but what do I know?

• 51:24Tucker Carlson?

  How quickly after this event was his body cremated?

• 51:30Speaker 02

  I believe it was released for cremation a week or two after. We didn't find out about this until Representative Clay Higgins went to go look at the body and they said, well, you know, Mr. Higgins, the body doesn't exist. They gave it to the funeral home.

• 51:47Tucker Carlson?

  How would you assess the thoroughness of the autopsy?

• 51:51Speaker 02

  Well, the medical examiner who did the autopsy insists that Aaron Zalapony didn't hit Crooks, which I just think all the evidence points to the contrary. Not only the bullet fragments, but reason would dictate that the shot did something because, you know, because he stopped shooting after Zalapony fired. So there's that. There's the releasing the body, I would argue prematurely. But the biggest question I have is about this toxicology report, which I obtained, which by the way, obtaining this report is kind of a, I guess, interesting story, at least to me in itself, because this was kind of

• 52:34Speaker 02

  my first big scoop in late 2024 when I got these documents. When I found out that the body was taken to Allegheny County, I requested it from them and they said, Well, uh, we did the autopsy and the toxicology, but this is Butler County jurisdiction. I then asked Butler County for it and they denied it too. It was almost like they're pointing at each other, playing shell games with the evidence. I, I went through a couple of months long, uh, legal battle to get these documents and then, um, actually got them in early October and put them up on our website, Headline USA. Uh, so that was a big scoop, but I didn't think

• 53:15Speaker 02

  much of, uh, the documents, like they didn't really seem to show any scandal to me at first until, uh, a Twitter sleuth notified me a couple of months later and said, um, have you looked at this toxicology report? It seems incomplete and, uh, I'll show you exactly what I'm talking about. So the medical examiner, Eric, Ariel Goldschmidt, collected eight specimens from Thomas Crooks, uh, four tubes of heart blood, a tube of urine, some eye fluid, bile, and then an envelope of hair. And now these are numbered one through eight.

• 53:55Speaker 02

  And now if you look at the findings, you have one, the heart blood, one, two, and then it's four, five, and six. But there's three specimens that, uh, Goldschmidt, the medical examiner, collected and either didn't test or didn't include in the report. That's the, the bile, one tube of blood and the envelope of hair. So I don't know what to make of it again, but these samples, uh, you could argue they would have shown evidence of some kind of perhaps psychotropic drug use. I don't know.

• 54:35Tucker Carlson?

  Has he explained, has Goldschmidt, the medical examiner, explained why he didn't test or there's no record of him testing?

• 54:41Speaker 02

  No, I, I reached, when I found out about this, I reached out to him numerous of times, including, um, his lab assistants too, and they haven't given any answers as to, you know, why this is.

• 54:54Tucker Carlson?

  Okay. Um, and that it kind of is the, the question that hangs over all of this. Why are there no answers in a case that according to the government is open and closed? Lone gunman, crazy person, killed by heroic secret service sniper, no accomplices, there's no reason to hide anything. Do you have any idea why the FBI is continuing to hide information about this case?

• 55:19Speaker 02

  Well, I hope you I would have been hoping you could tell me.

• 55:21Tucker Carlson?

  I have some theories about it.

• 55:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:24Tucker Carlson?

  I mean, Joe Kent said it's directly related to, he believes, directly related to our war in Iran. You know, can't prove that, but I, but just to establish clearly that they are hiding it. You've gone presumably to the Justice Department to ask for this information. What answer do you get?

• 55:43Speaker 02

  In fact, I did a FOIA request for all the 302s in this case. The day after Cash Patel said about a year, a year ago, that the investigation is closed. Crooks acted alone, nothing more to see here. So, oh, okay, great. The investigation's closed. Now they can comply with FOIA and make all this stuff public. I filed my FOIA and get a response about a month later saying, we're not giving you these records because in fact, the investigation's still open. So it seems to me as they're playing a legal games with these documents. They sense Cash Patel has changed his tune and said, well, the investigation is open, but not active.

• 56:23Speaker 02

  And in my mind, that's just a way they're, an excuse they're using to avoid disclosure.

• 56:33Tucker Carlson?

  So at the root of all of this is the question of Trump and his, you know, he was the target of the assassination attempt, which you have said, and I agree with you, was real, like someone tried to kill him, missed, killed somebody else.

• 56:46Tucker Carlson?

  But if the president wanted this investigation to continue, it would continue, correct?

• 56:54Speaker 02

  Presumably, yeah, maybe in his first administration, you could argue that he didn't have total control over the, the deep state or whatever. But now, yeah, he's got loyalists installed in most of the key positions. So it, yeah, I don't see any possible excuse for why.

• 57:12Tucker Carlson?

  Right. So it's not, it's not just that, you know, Cash Patel's incompetent or Dan Bongino's incompetent.

• 57:19Tucker Carlson?

  This is a statement of fact, Trump shut down the investigation into Butler. So he shut down the investigation into his own attempted murder.

• 57:27Tucker Carlson?

  And I think that's the most shocking fact to come out of this Trump term. Because I don't see a non sinister explanation for that, but maybe you have one.

• 57:40Speaker 02

  No, I mean, it's just total speculation, but I sometimes I wonder, did they stumble onto some sort of like MKUltra program? I don't know. Is this, are they threatening Trump's family? It does. And this is why, like, I don't get too mad when people think he's faking it because he's so tight lipped. You know, you can't blame people for speculating.

• 58:03Tucker Carlson?

  I think that's exactly right. It doesn't make any sense at all. Are there any pieces of evidence that you have seen that suggests that Crooks acted in concert with anybody else?

• 58:16Speaker 02

  I've seen nothing explicit. No, there is. There's some unanswered questions about what happened on July 13th, 2024, that might point to others being involved on the scene. Of course, we have the false sightings of Crooks, like if they saw somebody that looked like him. There were numerous such cases, so I have questions about that. And then the bomb squad, Allegheny County Bomb Squad initially responded to a van that was parked about a half mile away from the site. And the series of events raises questions in my mind. You know, Crooks is dead up on the rooftop.

• 59:00Speaker 02

  They find a transponder in his pocket that they believe might be used to set off IEDs. They evacuate the rooftop and after that point, the locals are never involved in the crime scene again. It's totally controlled by the FBI. They're searching underneath, inside the building with bomb sniffing dogs. And at one point they find blood in the building, which I guess a local trooper climbed over a fence and cut his hand and then got blood everywhere. They find a bicycle with a backpack that wasn't Crooks's, but they initially assumed it was.

• 59:42Speaker 02

  And most interestingly is this van. They searched the van with the bomb squad and towed it away and we haven't heard anything about this since. And this is before they searched Crooks's car, which is parked, it was parked right on the street by the AGR building. So I have questions of why they searched the van before the car. I did a FOIA on the van and was told that yes, it was part of the investigation, but again, I was denied actual records about it.

• 1:00:11Tucker Carlson?

  Is there proof that Crooks constructed bombs or a bomb?

• 1:00:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, they eventually found bombs in his, in the trunk of his Hyundai Elantra. And this was after they searched his home and found some empty ammo canisters and some racing fuel and other bomb making equipment in his bedroom. That led to the search of the car supposedly. But again, I don't know why it's van, house, car.

• 1:00:41Tucker Carlson?

  But we do know he made bombs.

• 1:00:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, we know for sure. And in fact, one of the community college emails, the only one that showed any possible evidence that he was planning this is him ordering racing fuel from a company. I think almost everything he did would have had to have been on his encrypted emails, but this one order he places through his community college email that does show him in January 2024, ordering racing fuel, which is used to make like anpho bombs.

• 1:01:15Tucker Carlson?

  Yes.

• 1:01:16Speaker 02

  The same material that McVeigh allegedly used in OKC. So like, yeah, little, little tiny miniature anpho bombs found in his trunk in the.

• 1:01:27Tucker Carlson?

  But we have no idea why he made these bombs or what he planned to do with them.

• 1:01:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, my speculation is that again, he probably planned an attack that day, maybe. Again, I can't get inside of his mind, but maybe he showed up thinking that I'm going to do a bombing and then realized that, well, no, I could do a shooting instead. I don't know. He might've had multiple possible plans because the bombs weren't even set to go off in the trunk. Like even if he pressed the button on his transponder, he would have had to flip switches to activate the bombs inside of the trunk beforehand. So, yeah, I don't know really what to make of that.

• 1:02:06Tucker Carlson?

  Has his Google search history ever been released?

• 1:02:09Speaker 02

  Uh, other than the limited release, uh, well, that you got I from.

• 1:02:15Tucker Carlson?

  Well, they didn't release anything. I got that from a source who got it himself.

• 1:02:19Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:02:19Tucker Carlson?

  Outside.

• 1:02:20Speaker 02

  To misphrase that.

• 1:02:21Tucker Carlson?

  Outside the federal government. Yeah.

• 1:02:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. Uh, no, nothing. Uh, we've gotten assertions like he apparently Googled how far was Oswald away from Kennedy? He Googled RNC DNC, Joe Biden, Donald Trump, um, but nothing that would really shine light on, you know, the details that matter.

• 1:02:41Tucker Carlson?

  They claim he was transgender too?

• 1:02:44Speaker 02

  Uh, no, they, they never claimed he was transgender. I think, uh, there were rumors about that at one point. The dad asked his son if he was gay, but that's just because he didn't have a girlfriend, but no, this wasn't a trans type thing.

• 1:02:58Tucker Carlson?

  Um, okay.

• 1:03:01Tucker Carlson?

  Shortly after, there was widely publicized, uh, claims that Iran had something to do with this. What were, were those real? What was that?

• 1:03:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, I saw you actually debating Ted Cruz about this like a year ago, saying there's no evidence that Iran.

• 1:03:20Tucker Carlson?

  The government of Iran.

• 1:03:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, the government of Iran tried to kill Trump and, and Ted Cruz is like, actually, yeah, uh, they hired two hitmen to take out Trump in 2024. Uh, well, those hitmen actually turned out to be undercover FBI agents and there was never any serious threat to Trump. It appears to be totally controlled sting operations, uh, you know, at the very least, uh, if not an actual plot to manufacture a phony case about Iran. Uh, so what happened here is, uh, somebody did, a Pakistani man named Asif Mershan was arrested July 12th, 2024,

• 1:04:00Speaker 02

  the day before Butler, and when the case was announced in August, uh, everybody automatically assumed that it had to have been linked somehow. Uh, but if you look at the details again, it's a totally controlled sting operation. Uh, they were actually monitoring Mershan, uh, before he even entered the country. And I think some intelligence may have been passed through Israel. That's what the New York Times reported a couple of months ago, and so did Max Blumenthal.

• 1:04:34Tucker Carlson?

  Information was passed through Israel. What does that mean?

• 1:04:37Speaker 02

  I, yeah, I don't.

• 1:04:38Tucker Carlson?

  Information about the Iranian plot against Trump came in part from Israel.

• 1:04:43Speaker 02

  The New York Times specifically reports that the initial intelligence came from Israel. But the thing is, is these, I would argue, again, phony cases have been, there's been years of them. The first such case was John Bolton in 2022, where the DOJ announced that Iran tried to assassinate him. And it turns out it was just some guy in Iran talking to an FBI informant. The informant took photos of Bolton's house to try to pretend to be like conducting surveillance. Bolton had full knowledge and was consenting to all this. They announced an indictment, but of course, the defendant's in Iran. So it's kind of

• 1:05:28Speaker 02

  like the Russia indictments where they never have to prove this case. It's almost just like a big press release.

• 1:05:35Tucker Carlson?

  So, I mean, presumably, considering that Trump launched a war against Iran in February of this year, if there was evidence that Iran was involved in this assassination attempt, the Department of Justice would be pursuing it vigorously and publicizing it in order to backfill a motive for this war.

• 1:05:53Speaker 02

  People have used the Merschant case as evidence that, yes, there was some sort of threat, but you got to measure a threat by both intent and capacity. And here, there was absolutely no capacity. Like I said, they let Merschant into the country in April 2024 on purpose as part of the sting operation. A reporter named John Solomon actually had sources tell him that this was similar to Operation Fast and Furious, where the ATF was allowing illegal gun purchases to supposedly track where these guns were going. Apparently, the Biden administration was doing that with humans, where they're like letting terrorists

• 1:06:36Speaker 02

  into the country on purpose to supposedly track where they're going. So Merschant's led into the country. And a leader at a local mosque connects him to a driver because he doesn't speak English, doesn't have a car, doesn't have any means. So supposedly a friendly guy is driving him around just because that's part of their culture. They're trying to help each other. But this guy turned out to be an FBI informant. He's actually an Afghan who served in Afghanistan as a translator for the US military. And the story about how he became an informant is unclear

• 1:07:19Speaker 02

  because in the DOJ's indictment, they say that he heard what Mershant was plotting and he went to the feds and flipped and became an informant. And I could see your face. You probably find that dubious. But we found out in court that the official story changed. Supposedly now, he says that he's driving Mershant around and he sees unmarked cars following them everywhere they go. And he's worried because of his experience in Afghanistan that maybe some Taliban is out to get him or something like that. So he happens to have the card of an FBI agent in his pocket,

• 1:08:02Speaker 02

  who supposedly he had like a friend who died a few years earlier and he got a card from an FBI agent from then. He calls the FBI and says, I think, I don't know, the Taliban's out to get me or something. And they supposedly fill him in on the operation saying, no, we're monitoring Mershant because we think he's dangerous. Will you work for us? Will you just kind of be our eyes and ears and go along with whatever he says? So again, this is the official story that came out in court. He agrees to become an informant. Him and Mershant have a meeting in

• 1:08:40Speaker 02

  a hotel room in early June that's wired for, you know, surveillance. And keep in mind that Mershant has not proposed anything.

• 1:08:52Speaker 02

  Related to the assassination or otherwise illegal at this point, but there are already, you know, full-fledged surveillance of him. Uh, he sketches out some plan that looks like like a 10-year-old would have drawn it about, yeah, this is the target. How will it die? Uh, again, this is all in Urdu. So we just have like an English translation of what was said. And I think like the vape, like he had a vape that he put down and like, this is the target. So like, you're not, not really sophisticated stuff. Uh, the informant then introduces him to two undercover FBI agents, the guy, the guys that Ted Cruz was, were arguing to you that were hitmen. Uh, the hitmen, the agents take Mershat to a strip

• 1:09:37Speaker 02

  club and they have some kind of vague conversation about possibly either assassinating politicians, stealing government documents, or staging like a protest. Mershat tells them, you know, "Visit me in Pakistan in September and we'll give you the, the official target." They want the undercover FBI agents want him to make a down payment to show that he's serious. And he, uh, is trying to get $5,000, trying to scrounge it up from his family. Initially, he's turned down by his family in Pakistan and, and eventually finds, I guess,

• 1:10:20Speaker 02

  cousins in Tanzania who are willing to, uh, front him $5,000 through like the Hawala system, uh, where he can pick it up in New York, but borrow on it in Tanzania. So the FBI informant actually helps him do this. The informant picks up the $5,000, uh, gives it to Mershat, who then gives it to the FBI agents. Like instead of the informant just giving it, you could see they're really trying to set him up. And then it's when he Is trying to leave the country on July 12th that he's arrested.

• 1:10:57Tucker Carlson?

  He's not Iranian, by the way, just to restate, he's Pakistani.

• 1:11:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's right. He supposedly has a family in Iran. And we shouldn't, you know, steel man the other side. And when he's arrested, he was interrogated. And he did say that, yes, I was working for Iran to try to do something. He wouldn't admit to the Trump assassination plot. So we could definitely, it's not like as egregious as the Whitmer plot, the supposed government kidnapped plot. Where they're just, they weren't even looking to do anything. And it was totally provoked by the FBI. This, this, you appear to have a somewhat willing defendant, but again, absolutely no capacity.

• 1:11:44Speaker 02

  No means, no money, can't even speak English, surrounded by feds, like there was definitely no

• 1:11:53Tucker Carlson?

  And no relationship to Butler that we know of.

• 1:11:56Speaker 02

  Uh, no, no, I've heard Joe Kent ask that question, like, well, was Merschant in touch with crooks?

• 1:12:05Speaker 02

  He didn't even speak English. So, and I don't think he was playing with a full deck of cards.

• 1:12:11Speaker 02

  So I, yeah, he definitely wasn't. Joe Kent also asked, was the informant in touch with crooks? And I think that's a far more interesting question, but we'll probably never find out because there's actually classified information in the Merschant case, over 1.6 million pieces of evidence that not even Merschant was allowed to look at. And there's something called the Classified Information Procedures Act, which says, well, if discovery is classified, not even the defendant can get it.

• 1:12:44Tucker Carlson?

  So it's not a real trial?

• 1:12:46Speaker 02

  No, it was a total show trial. And bizarrely, again, they trot out all this dubious evidence, but on the last day, Merschant's attorney allows him to testify. And again, he says that, yes, I was working for Iran. So he does think that. And I guess he said he was acting under duress. So, but it was pretty much just an admission of guilt. It's something that he should have said during like the plea deal proceedings and not. You know, on the last day of his trial. And so, yeah, I have a hard, I don't know really what to make of that. It seems like legal malpractice, to be frank.

• 1:13:29Tucker Carlson?

  Yeah, well, it's not uncommon to see defendants in cases like this represented by lawyers who are acting against their interests, which is interesting. I've seen it a number of times.

• 1:13:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:13:38Tucker Carlson?

  And so that may be part of the whole, uh, the whole performance, but I don't know.

• 1:13:44Speaker 02

  Sure. And just to steal my, I guess, I've argued with people online about this and they say, well, even though he didn't have any capacity, we knew because of what he says that he thinks he was working for Iran, uh, that Iran was plotting something. So why not let him into the country, uh, just to make this case and stick it to Iran? And, you know, there's a couple of responses to that. I think foremost, it's like while the FBI is constructing, fomenting this case, they let crooks and Ryan Ruth totally slip under their noses. Um, but even more importantly, I don't think anybody's really realized that is this case arguably

• 1:14:26Speaker 02

  is what almost got Trump killed. Um, because the, uh, the reason that the Secret Service snipers were sent to Butler was because of a so-called Iranian threat. Uh, the head of Trump's detail, Sean Curran was briefed about an Iranian threat and he's getting briefed on the Mershon case a week before Butler. And they decide to send Secret Service snipers to Butler as a result. It was the first time that a former president has ever had Secret Service sniper protection and the first time that year that the Trump campaign had Secret

• 1:15:05Speaker 02

  Service snipers. And I would argue that if that phony Iranian threat never sparked, you know, the notion to send Secret Service snipers to Butler, that it would have been local snipers up on those barns behind Trump instead of the guys who waited 15 seconds to respond. And I could almost guarantee you that the local response would have been better because the locals, uh, they would have been on the local radios. That's another thing about the Secret Service snipers at Butler is they did not pick up the local radios that were off.

• 1:15:38Tucker Carlson?

  Where's Sean Curran now?

• 1:15:40Speaker 02

  He's actually the director of the entire agency, which again is a totally baffling decision.

• 1:15:46Tucker Carlson?

  So that that's kind of the context that piques my interest. I mean, I do think whenever you, I mean, you've been a reporter for a long time, you know that when you press down on one specific story, you find anomalies, things are impossible to explain. You also find coincidences that are just bizarre, but maybe they really are coincidences. But big picture, it's truly crazy what we're looking at. So here you have Trump, two days before the Republican convention, he has not yet chosen a running mate. Everyone in, everyone in, up for consideration is a neocon except for J D Vance. Okay. So, um, and so that's when the assassination attempt takes place before Trump has chosen a running mate of

• 1:16:29Tucker Carlson?

  a vice president. The second this shooting happens, you see a bunch of high profile endorsements of Trump. And shortly after all of his legal problems go away, and ultimately in very short order, Trump becomes not just a neocon, but like the leading neocon in the world, way more of a neocon than like Bob Kagan and Bill Kristol ever were. And so you see a complete change in Trump and in official Washington's view of Trump, like people who didn't like Trump endorsed Trump after this. And then you see Trump appoint the people who effectively allowed this to happen by their incompetence at best, to positions of greater authority. And then you see Trump shut down the investigation into the shooting.

• 1:17:14Speaker 02

  According to reporter-

• 1:17:15Tucker Carlson?

  Right. Am I, like, what the hell?

• 1:17:18Speaker 02

  You're exactly right. And according to reporter Susan Crabtree, I guess Sean Curran is a favorite of Susie Wiles, which I don't know why Susie Wiles would have the power to keep or promote him to be Secret Service Director after he was pretty much-

• 1:17:35Tucker Carlson?

  But it's about Trump though. I mean, it's like, if you had bodyguards who are supposed to protect you with their lives if necessary, and they allow, again, by their incompetence at best, somebody to hit you in the ear with a two, two, three round, you'd say, these guys have to go. Like, you failed. Your one job is to keep a sniper from shooting me at me, and you failed. But instead of doing that, Trump promotes the guy?

• 1:18:02Speaker 02

  I have no good answer for you as far as that goes. I mean,

• 1:18:05Tucker Carlson?

  I'm tormented by it.

• 1:18:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:18:07Tucker Carlson?

  Especially considering what happened after where Trump gets effortlessly elected and then becomes this crazed neocon. He becomes the one thing he said he hated. There's a total change in Trump.

• 1:18:20Speaker 02

  It is worth mentioning that Susie Wiles and Sean Curran were both involved in what I would argue like a psyop on Trump to make him think the Iranians were out to get him. And this is after the Ryan Ruth event. They actually tell Trump that the Iranians have smuggled missiles into the country and they want to shoot down your plane, which there's absolutely no evidence for that. I mean, no actual documentation, no witnesses, no arrests were made. If that were true, the war would have started a lot earlier. But in any event, they actually put Trump on a decoy plane with

• 1:18:56Tucker Carlson?

  I remember.

• 1:18:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, they used Steve Witkoff's plane and him Witkoff and Susie Wiles would ride in Witkoff's plane while the staff were serving his decoys on Trump Force One, which I'm not sure how they would feel about that. But I mean, it's pretty crazy. Like, if you look at the reporting on this, the staff would be going to Trump Force One and the Secret Service would be like, oh, keep your head down, like acting like, like a threat was out there. Like, it really seemed like a total psyop to me. It's bizarre.

• 1:19:27Tucker Carlson?

  Preparatory to this war, of course, right?

• 1:19:30Speaker 02

  I would think so, yeah. I mean, you can make the argument that Trump was already an Iranian hawk, but um, you know, this certainly didn't help.

• 1:19:39Tucker Carlson?

  You can't make the argument that Trump was in favor of a regime change war with Iran, since he was explicitly against a regime change war with Iran, like for a decade.

• 1:19:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's certainly what he said. I did, wasn't there rumors that he was about to launch a war in the last month of like his

• 1:19:56Tucker Carlson?

  Of the first term?

• 1:19:57Speaker 02

  First presidency.

• 1:19:58Tucker Carlson?

  Well, those, yeah, I mean, those were more than rumors that he was under a lot of pressure to do that. But the fact is, he didn't. And then he spent

• 1:20:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:20:06Tucker Carlson?

  his campaign in the 2024 race arguing against regime change, were attacking people who were in favor of it. And then he launched it. And not just launched it, but became this kind of enthusiastic tool of the government of Israel. So, I mean, maybe those are all organic changes of heart.

• 1:20:27Tucker Carlson?

  Uh, but he's never explained how or why and the demarcation, the change point, the pivot seems to be the shooting.

• 1:20:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:20:37Tucker Carlson?

  Who's Ryan Ruth?

• 1:20:39Speaker 02

  Uh, Ryan Ruth was the second would be assassin and this happened on September 15th, 2024, uh, just, just over two months after Butler, uh, Trump's golfing on his Palm Beach golf course. He's on the fifth hole and the secret service is doing an advance on the next hole and an agent spots Ruth hiding in the bushes with an SKS rifle. Uh, the agent initially thinks this is a homeless guy until he sees a rifle pointing right at him. He shoots five times at like point blank range about from five or 10 feet away. Misses all five times, but causes Ruth to flee.

• 1:21:19Tucker Carlson?

  What?

• 1:21:20Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. Uh, I've, you know.

• 1:21:23Tucker Carlson?

  He missed him five times at close range?

• 1:21:26Speaker 02

  And presumably the secret service officer had a rifle too. It's not like he pulled out his pistol or anything because he's on the advance, probably armed and ready. So.

• 1:21:37Tucker Carlson?

  Wow. I didn't know that.

• 1:21:38Speaker 02

  Yeah. Another security failure. Um.

• 1:21:41Tucker Carlson?

  Well, an embarrassing one too.

• 1:21:43Speaker 02

  Yeah. I guess he gets credit for at least not hesitating. He.

• 1:21:45Tucker Carlson?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:46Speaker 02

  But again, the gun's pointed at him. So, um, but he did cause Ryan to flee and, um, Ryan's caught 45 minutes later in another.

• 1:21:57Tucker Carlson?

  He actually got away?

• 1:21:58Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. And so this isn't the secret service that caught him either. And he could have been at large. This could have been another like Tyler Robinson situation with the Kirk case where he gets into his daughter's Nissan Xterra and speeds off. And it was actually a witness who heard the gunshots and took down Ruth's license plate and gives it to the Palm Beach sheriffs who then put out a warning, be out on, be on the lookout for this Xterra and Ruth is pulled over on the I-95, uh, in another county.

• 1:22:32Speaker 02

  And this is, this is-

• 1:22:33Tucker Carlson?

  No way.

• 1:22:35Speaker 02

  Yes, again, like, he had an escape plan, uh, he-

• 1:22:39Tucker Carlson?

  Well, how did the Secret Service agent allow, if he's that close to him? How do you, why didn't he chase him down?

• 1:22:45Speaker 02

  That's, we've got even less details about the Secret Service's actions at Palm Beach than we do, um, from Butler. So I, I don't know. I don't have an answer to that question.

• 1:22:57Tucker Carlson?

  So then what happens? So they arrest the guy?

• 1:23:00Speaker 02

  And here's where the most tragic part of the whole incident happens, is that, uh, there's a bunch of traffic backed up on the I-95 due to this unexpected arrest, and a lady, uh, slams into the backed up traffic with her three-year-old daughter in the backseat. Uh, the daughter was put into a coma and has permanent brain damage as a result, so,

• 1:23:24Speaker 02

  regardless how you feel about Trump or anything else, like, it's, it's very sad, and a lot of people actually think Ruth is kind of like a clownish, buffoonish guy, but I don't have a whole lot of sympathy for him because this narcissism led to this little girl's permanent brain damage.

• 1:23:40Tucker Carlson?

  So what do we know about Ryan Ruth?

• 1:23:43Speaker 02

  We know a lot more about him than we do about crooks. I mean, by like midnight of that day, people had already dug up articles about him being in Ukraine and recruiting foreign fighters. Uh, the FBI holds a press conference the next day and says that we actually did receive a tip about him in 2019, that he was a felon in possession of a firearm. Uh, we didn't act on that tip, but we're trying to be forthcoming and, and you know, we'll do better, uh, in the future, I guess, is what they were trying to present, but it's actually

• 1:24:23Speaker 02

  far, far worse than that. Uh, one of the things I did, because I live close to where Ruth grew up in Greensboro, I pulled, uh, local police reports about these criminal incidents from the early 2000s. It turns out that he was actually on the ATF's radar since at least 2002. Uh, he was a, uh, construction worker and he had gotten-

• 1:24:47Speaker 02

  He owned a construction firm. He had gotten into a dispute with illegal immigrants who he was hiring. Apparently, he wasn't paying them. He threatens one with a 410 shotgun. They wrestle the shotgun away from him. He gets in his truck and escapes and almost runs over these these workers of his. They, the, the workers call the police and the police respond and then they find that Ruth was like possessed in possession of dynamite illegally. And they put him in jail. While he's in jail, somehow he gets a cellphone in there. He calls somebody

• 1:25:28Speaker 02

  who was helping him run the business and says, get rid of the dynamite we have on the other sites because they're about to probably search those sites too. A prison snitch tells the police about this. He gets charged with having that dynamite too. He gets let out on bail. About six months later, he's in a police, he gets pulled over. He's got a machine gun in his passenger seat. He runs away from the police, gets into a standoff. And finally, after a couple hours, he's arrested again. And the upshot of that is that after all that,

• 1:26:08Speaker 02

  he was only given probation. But this case was reported to the ATF, which declined to take any action.

• 1:26:17Tucker Carlson?

  How did that guy wind up, I think you said recruiting foreign fighters in Ukraine?

• 1:26:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, so.

• 1:26:24Tucker Carlson?

  Can you recruit foreign fighters in Ukraine without the knowledge and participation of US government authorities?

• 1:26:30Speaker 02

  Well, he certainly had knowledge of it. And again, yeah, career criminal, just to put a bow on that. He's charged again with a scheme of paying crackheads to steal stuff from construction sites. Gets caught in 2010 with like $30,000 worth of stolen equipment. That triggers a probation violation from 2002, but that gets waived the next day. And then he gets another round of probation. So very bizarre of how his cases were handled. But to answer your question. I don't know how he became so politically radicalized. In 2016, he was a Trump supporter.

• 1:27:15Speaker 02

  2019, he briefly jumped on the Tulsi Gabbard bandwagon. And then when Putin invades, apparently, he felt like, you know, he had to stand up for, you know, global freedom or democracy or something like that. So he winds down his construction business, takes a flight to Poland, tries to cross the border and volunteer to serve in the International Legion. He's a 58, he's a 58-year-old construction worker with no combat experience. So they say, "No, we can't really make use of you." So he turns to recruiting foreign fighters, as you say. A little interesting factoid in his self-published book, which is still available on Amazon,

• 1:27:59Speaker 02

  he said his best partner, quote, "best partner in this venture was an Israeli guy." I was never able to track down who that partner was.

• 1:28:09Tucker Carlson?

  This is all so crazy.

• 1:28:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's absolutely crazy.

• 1:28:11Tucker Carlson?

  But if you're, I mean, if you've got an extensive criminal record for violent crimes, and you wind up in Poland trying to join the Ukrainian Foreign Legion and then recruiting foreign fighters, like CIA knows, because they're running Ukraine and the war, they know you exist. They're, I mean, of course.

• 1:28:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, and he was in an Azov Battalion commercial, which of course Azov was sponsored by the CIA.

• 1:28:37Tucker Carlson?

  The Nazi Battalion.

• 1:28:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, the Nazi Battalion. He was flagged by multiple people. At one point, I think I counted seven federal or international agencies that were aware of what he was doing because a travel nurse, I think her name is like Chelsea Walsh, initially reported him to the FBI, the State Department and Customs and said, "Hey, this guy's got really dangerous rhetoric, and he's doing sketch, sketchy things." He was reported to Interpol, a former CIA officer named Sarah Adams flagged him too. So of course the CIA was aware and this State Department actually opened up an investigation

• 1:29:21Speaker 02

  for him violating international arms trafficking regulations. Not that he was trafficking in actual arms, but that also covers the human fighter element of it. So there was actually an open State Department investigation at the time of the September 2024 assassination attempt.

• 1:29:40Tucker Carlson?

  So in September of 2024, Trump was telling me and everybody else that I'm going to end this war between Russia and Ukraine and I can do it. I can do it in one day and I know Putin and I know Zelensky and I can do this. This happens on his golf course, fast forward now, almost two years, and Trump has done nothing to end the war and in fact has kept it going with American tax dollars to this day. We're lying about it, but that's a fact. And that's like a big change, no?

• 1:30:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, another broken promise.

• 1:30:14Tucker Carlson?

  The guy who was in an Azov Battalion commercial tries to kill Trump with an SKS rifle and then low and behold, all of a sudden Trump is for the Ukraine war.

• 1:30:24Speaker 02

  It's bizarre. I don't think Ryan was explicitly told to do this because keep in mind, he was put on trial and he actually represented himself and I think at any time he could have blurted out, well, hey, you know, the FBI told me or whatever. I think it's a little more subtle. I did talk to a lot of people who knew him in Ukraine and I think it was very easy to be influenced. He was around a lot of virulent anti-Trump people. At one point I'm talking to a guy who knew him. This guy thinks like the Russia pee tapes are real. He goes off on a tangent to me about how he wants to punch JD Vance in the face.

• 1:31:05Speaker 02

  So it's like these type of turbo turbo liberals were like Ruth's friends over there. And moreover, this isn't like your wine drinking aunt that hates Trump. These are more high status people. They have, they come from money. They have State Department connections. Ruth probably thought like, oh, these are really important people. I could be a hero. They hate Trump. I could save the day by doing this. That said.

• 1:31:32Speaker 02

  The biggest anomaly I have that suggests something darker is the fact that Ruth had been travel or been camping at the golf course for about 11 hours before the shooting actually happened. And if you read the House Task Force final report, Trump actually made a last minute decision to go golfing and the Secret Service was informed at 2:00 a.m. and look at the state search warrant. It says that according to geolocation data pings, Ruth showed up at like 2:30 a.m.

• 1:32:08Tucker Carlson?

  No way.

• 1:32:08Speaker 02

  Yeah. And that, yeah, that's.

• 1:32:10Tucker Carlson?

  Are you serious?

• 1:32:11Speaker 02

  I'm absolutely serious.

• 1:32:13Tucker Carlson?

  Did Ruth at trial ever explain why he, since Trump hadn't been planning to golf, decided to show up at 2:30 a.m.?

• 1:32:21Speaker 02

  That was never explained. Actually, Ruth represented himself and the trial was a disaster. So we didn't get any helpful information. I mean, during his opening statement at one point, he goes off on a tangent about like the importance of human rights and democracy. The judge says, Mr. Ruth, this has nothing to do with your case. If you keep doing this, you're going to forfeit your own opening statement. He says, you know, yes, your honor. And he immediately delves right back into the same tangent. He forfeits his opening statement. So it was a real shit show is that. Uh, there's also classified information like the Marshant case. There's classified

• 1:32:58Speaker 02

  information in the Ryan Ruth case. Um, and Judge Cannon sealed the information on the grounds that it could, quote, harm national security. Yeah.

• 1:33:11Tucker Carlson?

  Now, why would a multiple convicted felon construction worker who tries to murder the Republican nominee have classified national security related intelligence anywhere near him?

• 1:33:26Speaker 02

  I assume there's probably FISA involved, perhaps, you know, surrounded by informants.

• 1:33:33Tucker Carlson?

  So just to go back to the question of the classified information, I'm just baffled by this.

• 1:33:42Tucker Carlson?

  What could that possibly, why would Ryan Ruth intersect, you said, FISA, I'm not sure what that means. Can you explain that a little more?

• 1:33:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, sure. So again, like the Marshant case, there was classified discovery in the Ryan Ruth case that's subject to a law called the Classified Information Procedures Act, which means that you as a defendant don't have a right to your own discovery if it's classified information, even if it harms your case. And I think the SEPA law was passed in the late 70s. And at the time, there was very select usage of it. It was to like protect overseas informants and to protect certain FISA information. But increasingly, with the advent of text messages and chat groups, the DOJ is just using it to hide things.

• 1:34:35Speaker 02

  They might have an informant overseas, but that person's life isn't in jeopardy. It's just all chatroom stuff.

• 1:34:42Tucker Carlson?

  Well, they might also be orchestrating crimes.

• 1:34:44Speaker 02

  And there's, yeah, there's major, major scandals that this classified information procedure law has been used to cover up, just to name a couple. The Pulse nightclub shooting where the shooter's father, Omar Mateem's father, was an FBI informant. The shooter himself may have been an informant too. And that's according to Trevor Aronson. But classified, the SEPA law was used to cover up information there. The granddaddy of them all, in my opinion, is the Garland, Texas shooting in 2015, where there were two people who were allegedly upset at a draw, the Prophet Muhammad contest. They went there to shoot up the contest, which was like at a local fair, I think.

• 1:35:30Speaker 02

  And they were stopped right away. But there was a third guy who was behind them who went to run away. The cops arrested him, but it turns out that that was an undercover agent who were friends, who was friends with the, you know, the supposed terrorist.

• 1:35:47Speaker 02

  And also in that case, I don't know if it was the same agent or another informant actually told the shooters to quote, "tear up Texas." So it was a clear case of provocation. And to top it off, they had guns that were purchased at the Lone Wolf Gun Store that was involved in Operation Fast and Furious and Pat Con, which was like this undercover operation in the 90s. So that's, that's a really dark one. It's so dark.

• 1:36:18Tucker Carlson?

  But what makes the two assassination attempts that you wrote a book about different is that they, I think, changed world history. My suspicion is that they changed world history and that they changed Trump, the President of the United States. So if you, and I know this, this book is in some ways like a list of unanswered questions.

• 1:36:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:42Tucker Carlson?

  But if you could pick some number of top questions, the most pressing questions that the Department of Justice could answer, the Trump administration could answer but won't, what would they be?

• 1:36:55Speaker 02

  The first and foremost question I have in my mind is why, sorry to keep harping on this, but why did the Secret Service sniper wait up to 23 seconds before responding? And why does he have contradictory testimony?

• 1:37:10Tucker Carlson?

  And this is the one Trump is complimenting in public?

• 1:37:12Speaker 02

  That's right. Yeah. And so July 14th, you know, Crooks's body is still on the rooftop chop and Susan Crabtree reports, and she, this is like a great reporter. She's very deeply sourced in the Secret Service. And she was told that the snipers were given instructions that you can't respond to a threat until that threat actually fires their weapons. This report from Crabtree sparks outrage. People are like, that's preposterous. How could they have to wait until the threat actually starts shooting?

• 1:37:47Tucker Carlson?

  Until the principal gets killed before they respond?

• 1:37:50Speaker 02

  Yeah. And then

• 1:37:50Tucker Carlson?

  It's nuts.

• 1:37:51Speaker 02

  The Secret Service denies it, says that's not true. They were, they were not under these instructions at all. And I, again, total speculation, but I, you know, can, safe to say that Crabtree was really told this by a legitimate source. I think they were almost like trying to float an excuse out there and see like A B testing it, seeing if the public would buy this. When the public acted like this is the craziest thing ever, they walked it back. And then we just haven't gotten any good answer, you know, pretty much.

• 1:38:23Tucker Carlson?

  But that's your number one question is, why did the Secret Service sniper wait 23 seconds after the volleys, two different volleys, eight shots have been fired and one that hit Trump, three other people killed one, he did not respond. That's the number one question. And I would follow it up by asking, if that's the number one question, why is this the number one guy Trump is complimenting, praising a year and a half later?

• 1:38:51Speaker 02

  Your guess is as good as mine.

• 1:38:52Tucker Carlson?

  I mean, that's just bizarre.

• 1:38:53Speaker 02

  It is. It's incredibly, incredibly bizarre. I mean, I would think this Aaron Zalapony, the local heroic cop who actually shot crooks, like if I were Trump, I would make July 13th, Aaron Zalapony Day. But he doesn't even acknowledge this guy's existence. I mean, so on one level, it's just kind of sad, a little bit disgusting that he's not honoring the true heroes. But, you know, I think you're suggesting, you know, something more disturbing going on.

• 1:39:21Tucker Carlson?

  I'm suggesting a fact pattern, a known fact pattern that has no non sinister explanation that I can think of. That's all I'm saying. Sure. I can't, and I've, I mean, trust me, I've brought this to a lot of different people. Like, what is this? You know, people, very knowledgeable people, and I've never had one person say, well, actually, what you're missing is this. Here's why Trump shut down the investigation, which he did. Fact, obviously. But it is also fact. I've, I know it. And so I've never had any person say, you know, don't jump to conclusions. Actually, there's a good explanation. I still don't see, and you just wrote a book on it. You don't see one either.

• 1:40:05Speaker 02

  No, absolutely not. No. I guess another big unanswered question I have has to do with this.

• 1:40:13Speaker 02

  Seemingly incomplete toxicology report, which, you know, I hesitate to mention this because I don't know the significance of this, but the person who wrote this report, the medical examiner in Pittsburgh, who autopsied Crooks, released the body for cremation with fragments and still inside, insisted Zalapony never hit him, and then doesn't, either doesn't test certain specimens from Crooks, or didn't put him in his report. Uh, this guy is actually a dual Israeli citizen who was in Israel after October 7th, helping identify, uh, the bodies there. So, you know,

• 1:40:52Tucker Carlson?

  again- Actually?

• 1:40:54Speaker 02

  Actually, yeah. This is in the front page of like the Pittsburgh Jewish Chronicle. He's actually pictured, he's standing next to a guy named Chen Kugel, who is an Israeli and a source of a lot of these dubious claims about beheaded babies. Um, yeah, and Goldschmidt's standing right next to him. I guess he volunteered and went over there to help. And again, I'm not-

• 1:41:17Tucker Carlson?

  He is a dual citizen.

• 1:41:18Speaker 02

  He is a dual citizen. Yeah, that's correct.

• 1:41:21Tucker Carlson?

  And he's the medical examiner who did at best an incomplete job with the autopsy, or of the report anyway, of Crooks.

• 1:41:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's a hell of a nine or 10, 10-month run for his career to go from, you know, responding October 7th to autopsying, uh, Crooks. And, yeah, again, I'm not necessarily suggesting anything, but because he's such a key player, we do need to know, you know-

• 1:41:50Tucker Carlson?

  And he is not the medical examiner that victims, dead people in Butler Township, Pennsylvania would normally go to.

• 1:42:00Speaker 02

  Uh, no, not at all. I mean, again, the excuse was that they had more advanced facilities, but then they do this kind of run-of-the-mill autopsy and toxicology-

• 1:42:08Tucker Carlson?

  So the fireman who was killed at Butler went to the local medical examiner, but Thomas Crooks went to this medical examiner, the dual citizen?

• 1:42:15Speaker 02

  Well, he actually, Corey Comparatory was taken to Allegheny County as well, but they've got contradictory excuses where they say they took Corey there to avoid the press attention at the Butler office. And then Thomas was supposedly sent there, uh, for the more advanced facilities. So, um-

• 1:42:35Tucker Carlson?

  The facilities that cremated, allowed him to be cremated with the fragments still in him and didn't list the testing of his hair. Okay. Um, that's really, really interesting. Has he, and he has not spoken to you, this medical examiner?

• 1:42:49Speaker 02

  No, he hasn't. He did testify at an open hearing where Clay Higgins pressed him. Uh, Clay Higgins, you know, say what you will about him, but I think he's been pretty good on this story. He's the only guy in government who's emphasized Aaron Zalapony's heroics. And Higgins is trying to press Goldschmidt by like, how could you possibly say that, um, Zalapony didn't hit anything? And, uh, Goldschmidt just insisted that the Secret Service was the only person who shot Crooks that day.

• 1:43:22Tucker Carlson?

  That's really bonkers. Um, okay. So those are your top two questions.

• 1:43:30Tucker Carlson?

  My top question is why the secrecy? Do you have any theories on that?

• 1:43:36Speaker 02

  Just total speculation. Um, you know, I do think Crooks was probably, well, almost certainly manipulated, possibly

• 1:43:48Speaker 02

  in contact with the feds, you know, based on these violent comments that you disclosed a few, uh, months ago, you know, openly calling for assassinating politicians on YouTube. That gets you flagged to law enforcement. So there could be some kind of cover up telling like Mr. Trump, if this is revealed, it'll be the end of the FBI. You can't do this. You have to keep your mouth shut. Um, it could be something darker. I don't know.

• 1:44:14Tucker Carlson?

  Do you expect that you'll be like the last guy to look into this? Cause that, cause the, the cover up or the secrecy or the studied lack of curiosity doesn't sort of end at the Justice Department. It extends into the media. Like what is, this like, however you feel about Trump, everyone has an opinion. It's just an amazing story. And I just don't know why I'm ending where I began. Why are you the only guy doing this?

• 1:44:41Speaker 02

  I thought, yeah, I thought that was probably one of the biggest stories to happen in the last five years, you know, outside of the wars and things like that. And so it's been really puzzling that I don't have much competition, nor do I have much interest. I mean, you're, again, you're one of the only guys keeping this story alive. So I'm hoping that the book, you know, unfortunately, it doesn't have like a big smoking gun. This is the guy who did it, or this is the institution behind it. It is the best and most complete picture of what happened. I'm hoping it could be a starting point for future researchers, people who want to jump on board and, and help find out, you know, some of the answers to these bizarre questions we have.

• 1:45:26Tucker Carlson?

  We'll probably both be long dead when someone, you know, writes the book. I hope that's wrong, but that's tends to be the way this stuff plays out. You know, it's 100 years after Lusitania and it was like, actually, there were armaments on the boat. The Trump assassination plots what the investigations missed and why it matters. Ken Silva, thank you very much for doing this.

• 1:45:50Speaker 02

  Thanks again.