Madelaine Petsch: PSA: You Can’t Fix Him

Join Alex in the studio for an interview with Madelaine Petsch. For the first time ever, Madelaine opens up about her childhood trauma, her complicated dynamic with her father, changing her mind on having children, and why she’s done being the fixer in relationships. Enjoy!

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Alex Cooper?

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• 0:41Alex Cooper?

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• 1:41Alex Cooper?

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• 2:25Speaker 03

  What is up daddy gang? It is your founding father Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy.

• 2:34Alex Cooper?

  Madeleine Petch, welcome to Call Her Daddy.

• 2:36Speaker 03

  Hi.

• 2:38Alex Cooper?

  You look so gorge.

• 2:40Speaker 03

  Thank you. So do you.

• 2:41Alex Cooper?

  How did you pick this outfit today?

• 2:42Speaker 03

  Well, I thought if I'm going on Call Her Daddy, I want Alex to call me daddy. So I'm gonna have my titties out.

• 2:48Alex Cooper?

  No, no, it's, it's perfection. I feel like you have had literally the craziest year. You've been on an insane filming schedule. Do you have any time off or are you getting back into something?

• 2:59Speaker 03

  This is like the worst time to ask me this question. I had one day off for the next two months and they just put something on it. So I'm, I'm feeling a little overwhelmed currently. I'm somebody who like, this is the thing about my job that I was not made for me is I don't do well with change in my schedule. And it changes constantly.

• 3:14Alex Cooper?

  Wait, you literally being an actress and you're like, I don't like change. I'm like literally every five fucking months. You're like, new project, new project.

• 3:21Speaker 03

  I'm fine with, but I was just shooting a movie in Tulsa, which I adored and they kept changing and adding days. And I was like, my brain can't function like this.

• 3:28Alex Cooper?

  Oh my God. You need a full set schedule. I read in an interview you did that you said you basically have like a very, very hard time ever relaxing. Like you're not someone that can relax. Have you gotten better?

• 3:39Speaker 03

  I have actually. The pandemic honestly like weirdly forced me to find stillness and be okay with it. Cause I couldn't work. I was stuck in my house and I was like, I have to find a way to, to manage this. I did actually, by the way, get my brain scanned during the pandemic because I was so anxious all the time. That I was like, there's something genuinely wrong with me. That's how bad I am with stillness. And then I was like, okay, no, this is actually, I'm actually just a crazy person. Cause I'm fine.

• 4:05Alex Cooper?

  Meanwhile, he's like, it looks gorgeous. You're like.

• 4:07Speaker 03

  Everything looks great. I'm like, there's a gremlin living in my head. You don't see it?

• 4:09Alex Cooper?

  Okay. But to be fair, I feel like so many of us during the pandemic were like that, where you were like, there is something wrong with me.

• 4:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 4:15Alex Cooper?

  Okay. October is coming up. I feel like you, Kami and Lily have been known in the past to do these really, really good Halloween costumes. Are you going to do anything this year?

• 4:25Speaker 03

  I don't think we are. I'm so sorry. I try every year. I want to let you know I am the one who rallies everybody.

• 4:30Alex Cooper?

  You are.

• 4:31Speaker 03

  I am the one in the group chat who's like, okay, it's August. What are we doing? What's the plan? And this year, I think we are all filming in different places and there's just no, I even said, what if we just do a photo shoot? But we're all so busy, like, it's not even possible.

• 4:43Alex Cooper?

  How do you feel, though, about so many celebrities doing that? Where half the time, they don't even go to the party in the costume, they just do the photo shoot and put it on Instagram. How do we feel?

• 4:50Speaker 03

  I don't even care, honestly, because I don't even like the party. I like the dressing up, but I don't even want to go.

• 4:54Alex Cooper?

  It's actually true, like, being a girl is like loving the getting ready process. And then you get to the party and you're a little like, can we go home and eat pizza and like hang out?

• 5:01Speaker 03

  Press days. I'm like, I'm so excited for press days. And then after glam's over, I'm like, wait, I still have to go do stuff.

• 5:06Alex Cooper?

  Right. You just want to like, look cute. And then you're like, wait, I now actually just want to like, sit here, take some selfies and then wash it all off and get in bed and watch a movie. Actually, fair. Okay, so no Halloween this year, but will you do something for a costume?

• 5:17Speaker 03

  I can't, I can't not do something for a Halloween. But also, I am so excited, Alex. Six Flags is doing a Strangers Maze. And they have little me's running around in there. And when I tell you, top 10 most important things to my entire life existence is having a haunted house with me running around in it that I can go to tend. Life is made.

• 5:33Alex Cooper?

  Wait, wait, wait.

• 5:34Speaker 03

  I can die happy.

• 5:35Alex Cooper?

  Wait, wait, wait. Little yous?

• 5:36Speaker 03

  Little me's, like me's, people with little wigs on, running around as if they're me, Maya and the strangers.

• 5:41Alex Cooper?

  A dream. Are you gonna go?

• 5:43Speaker 03

  Absolutely. I go on the 11th.

• 5:45Alex Cooper?

  I am like such a scaredy cat, so like, I would probably be like, I want to go. And then I'd be so fucking scared. I feel like you're gonna thrive.

• 5:51Speaker 03

  You don't go to Universal Horror Nights or anything?

• 5:53Alex Cooper?

  I just get really scared. I'm such a bitch.

• 5:56Speaker 03

  You're so fun. Are you crazy?

• 5:58Alex Cooper?

  I'm such a bitch.

• 5:59Speaker 03

  I thrive. September 1st, I'm like, I have my fireplace on.

• 6:02Alex Cooper?

  No, Madeline, I was like-

• 6:03Speaker 03

  It was 75 degrees in my house.

• 6:04Alex Cooper?

  Okay, yes to that, but me, I literally was like, I was getting scared of Halloween town. Like, I would get scared of like, the guy-

• 6:11Speaker 03

  What, Calabar? Are you scared of Calabar running around?

• 6:14Alex Cooper?

  Actually, yes. When he was like, yeah.

• 6:16Speaker 03

  No, honestly, he was a little scary. But that also came out when we were young, let's be honest.

• 6:20Alex Cooper?

  Um, we're gonna play a little quick game.

• 6:22Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 6:22Alex Cooper?

  It's called firsts and worsts. I'm gonna give you a scenario and you're gonna tell me the story behind it.

• 6:27Speaker 03

  Sure.

• 6:27Alex Cooper?

  Okay? What was the worst fashion phase that you ever went through in your life?

• 6:32Speaker 03

  Oh. Oh my God, I had like a full scene kid phase.

• 6:36Alex Cooper?

  Okay, talk to me about it.

• 6:37Speaker 03

  I actually have gauge holes in my ears that I have to like wear stickers in the back of my ears to wear earrings. I had double zero gauges.

• 6:44Alex Cooper?

  Wait, what are double zero gauges?

• 6:46Speaker 03

  It's like, I don't even know what the sizing is, but my brother was gauging his ears and he didn't want to go too big. And so he did it on me first. I'm the younger sister to see what the size would look like. Now he has massive ear holes.

• 6:56Alex Cooper?

  I love how he's like, hold on, come over here. Boom.

• 6:59Speaker 03

  He's like, it was like, you have to put Vaseline in and you have to like stretch it. It's such a crazy process. I did it when I was in like seventh grade. That would be the worst, I think.

• 7:06Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, I like, thought I was like in my like scenic emo phase. I never had gauges, but I did have um the like the colored skinny jeans. Just so horrid.

• 7:15Speaker 03

  That was a rite of passage, though. I honestly think.

• 7:17Alex Cooper?

  I look back at pictures though and you're like.

• 7:19Speaker 03

  Thank God I deleted my MySpace, all of that stuff like long before I became an adult.

• 7:24Alex Cooper?

  Oh no, you have to.

• 7:24Speaker 03

  I don't even have those photos and I want them to be dead forever.

• 7:27Alex Cooper?

  It's blackmail of yourself that you put out there willingly. And then you're like, why?

• 7:31Speaker 03

  Why did I do this to myself?

• 7:32Alex Cooper?

  The side bang? No.

• 7:34Speaker 03

  The way that I bought like thinning shears and thinned my own hair. So I had like very thin hair. I was like, why would we do that?

• 7:40Alex Cooper?

  And now we all want thick hair.

• 7:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, I know.

• 7:42Alex Cooper?

  Horrible. Okay, what is the story of your first kiss?

• 7:46Speaker 03

  My first kiss? Oh, honestly, I have a really weirdly terrible memory when it comes to my personal life. Maybe that's childhood trauma, but the one that I think of is my brother specifically said, like, there's this one guy who goes to the school that I hate more than anybody. And you cannot talk to him at this game. And I was like, you got it. Love you so much. And then I saw him and I was like, ah, he's kind of hot. What do I do? And then I'm pretty sure he became my boyfriend, my first boyfriend for like six months. And my mom would like drive us around in our minivan. I think I kissed him in the back of the minivan when my mom was driving.

• 8:17Alex Cooper?

  This is so telling of like who you are. Like I needed this information. I'm like, wait a second.

• 8:22Speaker 03

  It was my brother's like villain as a child.

• 8:25Alex Cooper?

  You know what? We would have been best fucking friends.

• 8:27Speaker 03

  Hell, yeah.

• 8:27Alex Cooper?

  Because I am a natural redhead.

• 8:30Speaker 03

  What?

• 8:30Alex Cooper?

  Yes, wait, you did.

• 8:31Speaker 03

  Wait, what?

• 8:32Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 8:33Speaker 03

  Why are you blonde? How dare you?

• 8:34Alex Cooper?

  I know. It was like, I, I know. I know.

• 8:38Speaker 03

  Pictures after this.

• 8:38Alex Cooper?

  Okay, but you look way better.

• 8:40Speaker 03

  There's no way. Actually, I think you'd look so cute with red hair.

• 8:42Alex Cooper?

  Maybe now that I've like grown into my face, but not back then. But I was always like wanting to hook up with my brother's friends and like, they didn't really want to hook up with me.

• 8:50Speaker 03

  What about enemies? Brother's enemies?

• 8:51Alex Cooper?

  That, see, that's what I'm getting to. I did hook up with one of his enemies.

• 8:54Speaker 03

  Love that for you.

• 8:55Alex Cooper?

  And he became my first boyfriend.

• 8:56Speaker 03

  He was the same person.

• 8:58Alex Cooper?

  Shout out, you know who you are. Like, it was, and I loved it.

• 9:01Speaker 03

  I wonder where that guy is?

• 9:02Alex Cooper?

  I know. Well, I think I know where he is, but, um, that doesn't matter. The problem was though, that like my brother got so upset with me, but it only made me want to love this kid more.

• 9:13Speaker 03

  My brother didn't get mad at all. He's the best. He was like, I mean, if you like him, like, all good.

• 9:17Alex Cooper?

  Oh, my God, wait. You had such a better experience with your brother. My brother came in and would like throw shit in my room and be like, you have to stop seeing him. And I was like, honestly, the day that you get bored of me seeing him, I'll probably dump him. But the fact that you're enraged.

• 9:30Alex Cooper?

  Honestly, it was a CW show. Okay. It was like one tree hill. Um, okay, next. What was the most random job that you worked? Before your big break as an actress? Cause I know you had a couple of jobs.

• 9:41Speaker 03

  I had a lot. I was a window salesman.

• 9:44Alex Cooper?

  Talk to me about that.

• 9:45Speaker 03

  So, um, I was on Craigslist and I was like, what's the highest paying job I can find? And by the way, I was getting jobs on Craigslist. I absolutely could have been murdered. I was such an idiot when I moved here.

• 9:53Alex Cooper?

  Madeline.

• 9:54Speaker 03

  And it was in Redondo Beach and they were like, you go door to door and you sell windows to people. And I was like, that. So I went and it wasn't working. And so I started waiting outside the houses till the wives would leave. And then I'd go to the door and like make myself cry and get the husbands to buy windows. And then they, I had a really high return rate was the problem because they didn't actually want the windows. They were trying to get the girl who's crying on the doorstep to leave.

• 10:19Alex Cooper?

  What if fascinating sales tactic?

• 10:22Speaker 03

  It was interesting. I don't think it was beneficial to anybody.

• 10:25Alex Cooper?

  Selling windows, picturing you coming up with like a reason these people need to buy fucking windows?

• 10:29Speaker 03

  And crying.

• 10:30Alex Cooper?

  Okay, but you were savvy.

• 10:32Speaker 03

  I was doing my best with what I had to do.

• 10:34Alex Cooper?

  You were doing your best. Okay, what was the, your first like big, big purchase? Once you got your paycheck from Riverdale?

• 10:41Speaker 03

  You know, I actually, every season that we got picked up, I bought myself a new Cartier ring. So I have like, I have seven Cartier rings for the seven seasons of the show that I literally never wear.

• 10:50Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, I was like.

• 10:51Speaker 03

  I don't wear them, but I have them and I like looking at them.

• 10:53Alex Cooper?

  They're somewhere.

• 10:54Speaker 03

  They're somewhere.

• 10:54Alex Cooper?

  Wait, do you ever wear them?

• 10:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, sometimes. I actually think I may have lost one, which was a real, it was a real bummer and a move.

• 11:00Alex Cooper?

  Okay, what was the worst Riverdale plotline you ever had to act out?

• 11:04Speaker 03

  Where do I begin?

• 11:04Alex Cooper?

  Okay, give me, give me a strong one.

• 11:07Speaker 03

  Okay, um, okay, so it's like, there's so many going through my head, I can't decide. Um, I had to act with my brother's dead corpse in a wheelchair for an entire season. Mind you, he died four years prior, his corpse should have absolutely rotted. But I was like basically losing my mind and speaking to a corpse for an entire season. I would wake up and be like, JJ, do you want your tea?

• 11:32Alex Cooper?

  See, I like definitely like watched the first couple of seasons and then when it was getting really crazy, I was like.

• 11:37Speaker 03

  Probably around that time.

• 11:38Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's probably, actually, yeah, that's exactly.

• 11:40Speaker 03

  Can I, can I change my answer? My actual answer is, this is my, this is my Roman Empire, okay? I became a witch on that show. Roberto, is this my camera? Roberto, when I didn't even watch on that show, there was one thing I told you, I said, I never want to see lasers coming out of my hands, okay? What did he do in the season finale of season six? I'm like scarlet witching up in the air, singing and crying with, with lasers shooting out of my hands at a comet. At a comet that ends up wiping out all of Riverdale, which is why we're in the 50s in season seven. Hey, what?

• 12:10Alex Cooper?

  That'll do it.

• 12:12Alex Cooper?

  And because you had the visual of like, I really don't want this to be me.

• 12:14Speaker 03

  No, and I actually think I might have given him the idea is the problem. I think I said like, just please no lasers, like I'll do anything witchy, it's fun, but no lasers. And then he was like, I think she said she wanted lasers out of her hands.

• 12:25Alex Cooper?

  And you're like, god damn it. This will literally follow me to the rest of my life.

• 12:30Speaker 03

  I see it every day, the meme of me like crying and screaming and like, I just.

• 12:34Alex Cooper?

  Okay, but people loved it.

• 12:35Speaker 03

  It's, look, it was fun. It was always, it was always a good time for me on set.

• 12:55Alex Cooper?

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• 14:29Alex Cooper?

  I know today you kind of want to talk about some things that you've never publicly spoken about. Yeah. Why do you think you are finally ready to open up about your childhood? Um.

• 14:44Speaker 03

  I think for a long time I struggled with the idea of is it my story to share? I mean, it involved a lot of other people, my whole family. And I think I got to a place through therapy and, and talking to my friends and also just, I think about when I was a kid, if there was somebody that I loved, just like one person saw this. If somebody, somebody that I loved was talking about what they went through and it was even remotely similar to what I was going through, it would encourage me to continue. So I think it's just kind of an amalgamation of that and then finding the right platform and, and feeling comfortable with you to, to do that.

• 15:17Alex Cooper?

  Okay, let's do it.

• 15:18Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 15:19Alex Cooper?

  Let's do it, girl. Here we go. Um, okay, let's go back. Growing up, just like very beginning days, what was your family like?

• 15:28Speaker 03

  Honestly, they're the strangest people on the planet, but I adore them. My parents are South African, so they don't really, they're not, they don't understand American culture very well and they were raising two American children in a small town. I have a wonderful older brother and a mom who was like, do you know people who are destined to be mothers? Like that's my mom's entire purpose on this planet. And a dad who tried his very best. And you know that he was trying his best, but as a kid, I didn't really understand like the way he was behaving and treating me wasn't, um, wasn't because of me, if that makes sense.

• 16:06Alex Cooper?

  When you say that you guys were different because your parents were South African, where were you raised also?

• 16:12Speaker 03

  Washington state.

• 16:12Alex Cooper?

  Washington, okay. Were you, were people outwardly like commenting on you guys? Like, did you stick out like a sore thumb or was it just like in your head, you felt different?

• 16:23Speaker 03

  I think also being a redhead and South African and being raised plant-based and without Christianity in my life, it felt like everything that were the core values of being a child, which is like looking normal, having a normalcy in religion and food eating, we didn't have. And so it felt more like maybe it was all in my head, but I definitely felt like I didn't belong growing up.

• 16:45Alex Cooper?

  So talk to me, growing up about your relationship with your mom and your relationship with your dad and like your early memories of those relationships forming.

• 16:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, my mom, um, is like the protector. My mom always was trying to, uh, keep the peace. Her words were peace and tranquility. And so she did, she did her absolute best to not let me see the trickling effects of my father's behavior. My relationship with my father was really complicated because he has behavioral issues and he would have extreme highs and extreme lows and in the extreme highs, as a child, it's like you have the most fun dad in the world. It's like you can't, you can't live and breathe without that person being around and then that person is ripped away from you and being cold to you and not responding when you tell them that you love them and, and

• 17:39Speaker 03

  getting angry at you and lashing out for no reason and you think it's your fault as a child.

• 17:44Alex Cooper?

  Do you remember like an early core memory of like the first time you realized like maybe your dad was struggling with mental illness?

• 17:56Speaker 03

  When I was eight, my brother and my mother were in South Africa and my dad and I had some sort of falling out over something. I don't even know what it was and I told him I loved him. I was like crying and telling him I loved him. I wanted him to tell me he loved me back and he told me he didn't love me and he left.

• 18:12Alex Cooper?

  And so you were alone in the house?

• 18:13Speaker 03

  For a couple of hours, not for very long. Um, and I was just crying in bed the whole time, but I remember sitting there and being like, my father doesn't love me. Like I did something very wrong and I was calling my mom and they're on a different time zone and that was the first time she was like, this has nothing to do with you. This is fully your dad. And that's when I really first understood that. I think it took a long time and a lot of therapy because we don't use diagnoses in the household either. So it took a lot of therapy for me to figure out what was actually going on.

• 18:45Alex Cooper?

  How was that explained to you that like we don't use?

• 18:49Speaker 03

  It wasn't. In fact, most of the time it was like, it's PTSD because my dad was in the apartheid war or it's, um, it's trauma or it's just he's having a bad mood and it's like, that's actually not what's happening. He has a chemical imbalance in his brain that makes him incredibly high and incredibly low. Um, and it took a lot of therapy for me to feel the validation of a diagnosis, even if. He has now gotten one, but even if he never got one to understand what was actually going on. And it was frustrating because you're like, why do you not want to know? It will help understand and educate us on what's happening. So it's not his fault either. Do you know what I mean? He's not trying to be like that.

• 19:32Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 19:32Speaker 03

  I also think like our parents' generation just doesn't really understand mental health. And I think it wasn't a priority, whereas now as we become parents, like of course it's a priority. But back then it really just felt like that wasn't even an option.

• 19:45Alex Cooper?

  So when you were dealing with difficult moments with your father, like how would your family talk about it?

• 19:52Speaker 03

  There's a lot of triangulation, which is something I learned in therapy. With my mom and my brother and I kind of having little kikis in my brother's room while one of us is crying because he's done something to them. Always verbal, never anything physical, thankfully. And usually the issue was I became this like key to unlocking his good mood. So when there was bad things going on in the house, I would be called to come and fix the problem. So no matter what the issue was, if he was upset with my mother or my brother, I would be sent in to essentially disarm him emotionally.

• 20:25Alex Cooper?

  Why do you think that was?

• 20:26Speaker 03

  He kind of has all, he just has this like, I think a lot of men like their little girls, the apple of their eye. And I think, I think I was the apple of his eye. So I think it allowed him to like, I'd walk in and most of the time it would work. And I'd be like, Daddy, can we, can we just have a nice night? Can we just figure it out? And it would take him a couple of hours, but sometimes it would work. So I think they kept doing that.

• 20:48Alex Cooper?

  Which is, at first, I'm sure before you were like able to process what was happening, everyone's like, anything to get him to like, come down and be in a better mood.

• 20:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:59Alex Cooper?

  But then as you started to get a little bit older into like high school, were you, how much was that affecting you kind of being the person that had to be almost like the parental figure in your household?

• 21:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, I remember one night I was out and I won't detail what was happening at my house because it's incredibly personal. But I was out at a ballet and I got a call saying you have to come home immediately. I had like 16 missed calls and I had to come home and, and deal with a situation that was so incredibly unsafe and so disrespectful as a child to put me in. That I have a lot of, I had a lot of resentment towards every one of my family for putting me in that position. When they could have just gone to professionals and dealt with it properly.

• 21:39Alex Cooper?

  How did you process any of this?

• 21:42Speaker 03

  I didn't. In fact, it became almost like this compartmentalization where a lot of the time now, we'll talk about things that happened, the three of us, my brother and my mom and I, and we'll be like, wait, that's not what happened, or that didn't happen because it was just push it out of your head. Don't think about it. This is just the reality. You don't know anything different.

• 22:02Alex Cooper?

  So when you look back on that time of your life, do you now have emotions that come up? Or is it still kind of like it's more survival mode?

• 22:09Speaker 03

  I I've worked through it so much in therapy, like my first six years of therapy were all about my relationship with my father and my parents and my childhood to the point where now, like, I don't necessarily feel emotional about it. I've worked through all of that, but there are still moments where I have to put that hat on and show up in that way.

• 22:27Alex Cooper?

  Being in a situation as a child where you feel like you have to become the parent has so many repercussions, obviously, when you get older. But what was going on when you were kind of handling things with your father? Like, what was going on with your mother in those moments?

• 22:43Speaker 03

  God, Alex, I don't even remember. I really don't remember. I think, like, honestly, I don't think she ever asked me to do that. I think I immediately saw a place that I could try to help, and I just tried to help every time I could.

• 22:56Alex Cooper?

  In like, high school or anything, did you ever confront your parents?

• 23:00Speaker 03

  I didn't confront my parents until I moved out, but I moved out the day I could when I was eighteen. And I also like immersed myself in after school activities. Like I was, that's probably why I am successful, honestly, is because I did not want to be at home. So I did dance from, I went to an arts high school that was forty five minutes away. I did dance from three to nine every single night. Afterwards, went home, did homework, went to bed. And then on weekends, I did plays in my local theater. Like, I just, I never wanted to be home. So I immersed myself in the arts and escapism. And now I'm here. So it's like, would I still be in this position if I didn't have that? I don't know.

• 23:32Alex Cooper?

  I that's what I was wondering, because I'm like, all these inconsistencies at home, like, how did it affect your life socially? Like, did your friends know what was going on?

• 23:42Speaker 03

  Yeah, for sure.

• 23:43Alex Cooper?

  Did you have any issues growing up with, like, could you have friends over your house?

• 23:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, my mom was so such a little soldier, honestly, because she Always fought for me to have the most normal childhood she possibly could give me. So I, I, I had friends over often, but the friends I was comfortable having over were friends that already knew what was going on. But it also affected their childhood. Like I, my childhood best friend is still one of my closest friends now. And she has horror stories about being at my parents' house.

• 24:11Alex Cooper?

  Would you and your brother lean on each other a lot, or was it tough to kind of?

• 24:15Speaker 03

  Well, it became really awkward because it's like I'm the one that's going in to fix a situation. What is, I can't even ima- we've never spoken about this, but I can't even imagine what it must have made him feel like to know that I could go in and make my dad feel better. That created a really weird, unhealthy dynamic between him and I, where when I moved out, like we weren't super close. We've become close in our adult years now and we've worked really hard to get there. But it, it didn't, we didn't have each other to lean on, really.

• 24:40Alex Cooper?

  Talk to me a little bit more about the resentment aspect because you go through this in your childhood. Your home is going through these like instability moments. You are parentified at a young age. You're throwing yourself into the arts, trying to get away. In the moment, were you resentful or did it take you leaving to become resentful?

• 25:00Speaker 03

  Honestly, the only resentment that I feel is seeing now how it seemingly seems so easy for him to be normal.

• 25:10Speaker 03

  That's the hardest part because now he's actually a pretty wonderful dad.

• 25:14Alex Cooper?

  Do you think there's a chance that's because you now can have distance and like leave and remove yourself from it?

• 25:20Speaker 03

  Absolutely.

• 25:20Alex Cooper?

  Like if you were living in a house with him, maybe?

• 25:22Speaker 03

  Potentially. I mean, my mom still lives with him. They're still together. And so it does seem like he's found things that work for him in that regard. But to see how easy it was for him to do that was pretty, it was a tough pill for me to swallow. But I'm incredibly honest with him now. I've not told him I'm going on this and I'm very curious to see how that goes. But I'm very honest with him about his behavior now and about how it affected me as a child. And he takes it on the chin very well.

• 26:02Alex Cooper?

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• 26:46Alex Cooper?

  To speed things up, there are all sorts of hacks like, you know, sitting on an Uncrustable sandwich so it thaws faster, but you don't have to wait for that pillowy soft bread anymore. You can now keep Uncrustables in your fridge so they're ready to eat the moment that craving strikes. No wait time. Find them in the freezer aisle today. Okay, let's talk about therapy. You get into therapy, you've been in therapy for a couple of years now?

• 27:10Speaker 03

  I've been with the same therapist for nine years. I'm obsessed with her.

• 27:14Alex Cooper?

  Wait, nine years is like-

• 27:16Speaker 03

  It's my longest relationship.

• 27:17Alex Cooper?

  Oh my God, wait, and you are like stronger than ever because I can't figure out if like you need to switch therapists at a certain point after like how many years, but you're, you feel good.

• 27:26Speaker 03

  I'm locked in. It's for life.

• 27:27Alex Cooper?

  Oh, I love that for you so much.

• 27:28Speaker 03

  I'm a lifer.

• 27:29Alex Cooper?

  What was it that made you want to initially get into therapy nine years ago?

• 27:34Speaker 03

  My relationship that I was in, my romantic relationship, was echoing very similar things that was happening with my father.

• 27:40Alex Cooper?

  It's so interesting because so many of my friends and I always talk about this, like when you become an adult, you're like, oh my God, I have to get in because of this guy that I'm seeing and little do we know. And meanwhile, it has nothing to do with fucking Brad or Ben or whoever the fuck we're talking about. It's fully childhood shit, but it ignites something in you and it brings up so much past trauma that you're like, wait, what is this? Why am I acting this way? And then you sit down in the therapist's room and they're like, sweetie, I'm gonna hold your hand when I say this. Let's put him over here. This has nothing to do with him. This is all you. And you're like, so you get into therapy?

• 28:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:16Alex Cooper?

  How did you start to initially feel when you started to work through?

• 28:21Speaker 03

  I remember the, I had a 15 minute, I was on, I was on set for Riverdale in my trailer, season one, and I had a 15, or season two, and I did a 15 minute call with her. And I was sobbing. In 15 minutes, I was like, broken down, all my makeup was off. And I, I was like, this is obviously what I need to be doing. And so, Riverdale was so wonderful. They would like, help me find time in my schedule to do therapy and they were really supportive. But it was just through talking about it. I mean, my relationship was obviously not great, if it was echoing that. So the kind of impetus was dealing with that at first, for a long time.

• 28:54Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 28:55Speaker 03

  Breaking yourself out of that and then getting into the weeds with your, with your childhood stuff.

• 28:59Alex Cooper?

  When you went back to the childhood stuff, like what did you find was the hardest stuff to start to unpack with a therapist? Cause therapists ask pretty like, pointed questions, or they like, ask you to go places that you sometimes don't want, not you don't want to go, but you're like, oh God, this memory just came up. Like, I can't believe this.

• 29:17Speaker 03

  I think I was struggling with

• 29:21Speaker 03

  understanding that he didn't not love me. I think there was still this like, idea in your head when you're a kid, that it's like, so deeply ingrained with you that this person can't possibly care about me and love me if they're treating me this way. And I thought I had worked through that. I thought as an adult, I understood that. But there was still that like, little Madeleine inside that was like, my daddy doesn't love me. You know? And so like, working through that, it still comes up occasionally at 31, nine years later. But I think that was the hardest, the hardest thing was to really, truly, at a cellular level, believe and understand that this has nothing to do with love or how much he cares about me. It has to do with fully him in a chemical imbalance.

• 29:57Alex Cooper?

  What was it like when you started to have such success? Like, were your parents?

• 30:04Speaker 03

  It was honestly kind of annoying.

• 30:05Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 30:06Speaker 03

  Cause it's like, with, with my dad, because he was so proud of me. And I'm like, ah, like, I just want to choke you. What's wrong with you? Um, no, and he, and he's so proud of me and he, and he's so excited. And so then it was complicated, cause I'm also like, I financially support a lot of my family as well. So it became, it became like, no one asked me to, I wanted to help. Um, but it started feeling weird, you know, like it's, it's weird to have a childhood dynamic like that. And then to be successful like this and then have able, the ability to monetarily help. And it just becomes really messy in my head. And so I had to like, again, compartmentalize and just figure it out.

• 30:42Alex Cooper?

  Well, and because Madeline, it's like, you used to be this parental figure in your house.

• 30:47Speaker 03

  That's it.

• 30:47Alex Cooper?

  You ran away because you didn't want to do it anymore.

• 30:50Speaker 03

  That's it.

• 30:50Alex Cooper?

  Then you get success and you go back to that role. And even though they didn't ask you, you know.

• 30:58Speaker 03

  It's just natural to me.

• 30:59Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 31:00Speaker 03

  It's just natural to me. I just stepped back into it. I bought a house in Washington that I moved my brother into so he could get out of the house.

• 31:08Speaker 03

  He's still there. He loves it and he's so happy in it and it makes me so happy. But that's the kind of stuff I was doing when I got to, I bought that before I bought my own house.

• 31:15Alex Cooper?

  So there's like this caretaker role that you're constantly in.

• 31:19Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:19Alex Cooper?

  But then eventually as in therapy, you're like, we, I also have to take care of myself.

• 31:24Speaker 03

  Right.

• 31:25Alex Cooper?

  Not everyone around me. Um, can you talk to me about like, one of the biggest breakthroughs that you ever had in therapy? If any.

• 31:33Speaker 03

  Yeah. Um, not dating carbon copies of my father over and over and over again. And even if I tell, I'm like, this is not that. This is not that. This is so not that. This is why, uh, it always was that. It was always that. So, um, I have to say, I, I feel at the place of my life now, like I'm, I could not be further from that, which is like the biggest, the biggest success of my life, honestly.

• 31:58Alex Cooper?

  That's so fucking real where you're like convincing everyone, you're like, no, no, no, guys, this is so different.

• 32:02Speaker 03

  No, I promise you it's different. And also here's why. And I know I told you last week, he did this thing that's exactly like the other thing I told you about, but it's not that.

• 32:07Alex Cooper?

  It's not that. You're not seeing it.

• 32:09Speaker 03

  You just don't get, it's not clocking to you that I'm standing on business. Okay.

• 32:13Alex Cooper?

  And your friends are literally like, okay, call us tomorrow. And then literally you're crying.

• 32:16Speaker 03

  I'm crying again. I'm like, you did it, my dad.

• 32:18Alex Cooper?

  Fucking shit.

• 32:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:19Alex Cooper?

  I feel like a lot of what you're talking about is like the steps that it took to get to this place. But like getting under it a little bit more emotionally.

• 32:30Speaker 03

  Jump in.

• 32:30Alex Cooper?

  When you look back, how did the responsibility of managing your dad's emotions your entire life ultimately impact you and your fundamental core and who you became as a human being?

• 32:47Speaker 03

  I remember in therapy, once I said, I'm happiest when I'm somebody else.

• 32:53Speaker 03

  I'm an actor.

• 32:55Speaker 03

  And I think that's how I think like I had to really, I spent a lot of my life not loving myself because I was like, if the person who made me doesn't love me, how the fuck am I supposed to love myself? And there are still moments where that it's not even like a conscious thought, but it's this almost like deep rooted, layered, sewn into the fabric of who I am, um, like insecurity of like, so it really is like to your point of what we were talking about earlier. Taking a break and finding stillness is so important to me because it's moments where I can be like, I love myself and I love who I am, even though right now I'm telling you, I'm a fucking badass. I love myself more than anyone could possibly love me in the planet.

• 33:37Speaker 03

  I still have moments where I'm that little Madeline who's like sitting in her bed crying because she thinks her dad doesn't love her.

• 33:43Alex Cooper?

  I think for so many people that experienced extreme dysfunction in their childhood, there is this like, want to just keep going and like, keep whether it's succeeding or whatever it be like, keep moving so you don't have to really be still and be like,

• 33:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 33:59Alex Cooper?

  Hey, so like, how are we feeling about the past like 20 something years of our life?

• 34:03Speaker 03

  Right.

• 34:03Alex Cooper?

  What do we feel about that? And when you do, sometimes it's really fucking difficult to get into therapy because I've had friends where they were like, I have to put a pause. Like this is literally like, I can't go to work. Like I am like a mess right now because I'm remembering things. Like I have some friends that forgot about certain memories that like, it is a journey, but once you get over that hump, it really does bring you to a better place.

• 34:24Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:24Alex Cooper?

  But it's not fucking easy.

• 34:26Speaker 03

  No.

• 34:26Alex Cooper?

  You talking about the men in your life. Um, talk to me about how your relationship with your father, like actually give me some examples of how it affected the type of men that you were going for.

• 34:38Speaker 03

  Oh, well, here's one.

• 34:39Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 34:39Speaker 03

  Um, after me and my, one of my exes broke up, he came out with the same diagnosis as my father.

• 34:44Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 34:45Speaker 03

  Right, so let's all take a break for a second on that one.

• 34:48Alex Cooper?

  Okay. And you in the moment didn't, didn't feel like.

• 34:53Speaker 03

  Hmm, did I feel like that? Um.

• 34:58Speaker 03

  I was, it was my first love and it was so like all encompassing and I was like, this is my person. And you just, I just, and that's the thing is I think watching my mom be with my dad and just decide to be with him forever. Made me believe that love is actually just staying no matter what.

• 35:13Alex Cooper?

  Okay, let's pause and talk about that.

• 35:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 35:16Alex Cooper?

  How many times have you, and give me like some like, things that have happened where you're like, I know I should leave, but I'm in love.

• 35:25Speaker 03

  Um, there was a moment in a relationship where I knew in my heart, it was over. I stayed for a year and a half longer. I called all my friends. I was like, I know this is it. I know it's over. I called them. I told them what happened. They were like, yeah, obviously it's over. I stayed for another year and a half. Because I watched my mom stay forever. And it's funny because I have friends now who are like in relationships with their, their, uh, they're parenting a child together and they're not happy. And I'm like, trust me, take it from somebody who grew up in a household where the parents were dysfunctional. It's actually better for your child to see real love. Go out and find your real love. Give them an example of what a proper relationship is meant to look like so that they don't seek that out when they're adults.

• 36:05Alex Cooper?

  It's a good point. It's almost like sometimes people understandably think like, keeping the family together is really going to be better for everyone in the long run. And then you see people be like, please get a fucking divorce. Like it actually will be better for all of us. And the parents are like, what? Wait.

• 36:22Speaker 03

  At the same time though, I don't know if that would have been better. My parents also own a business together. So like, I, I, I don't think it would have been the right thing. I think they did the right thing, but it did create a really unhealthy idea of what love was for me. I thought love was staying.

• 36:33Alex Cooper?

  How did you find yourself showing up in these dynamics? Like I know these men were acting a specific way. But what were you like in your relationships in the past?

• 36:42Speaker 03

  Same shit I did with my dad. There was conflict I was immediately fixing it to my detriment. Um, I didn't really allow like, I still have a hard time allowing conflict to stew. I think when there's unease or, or conflict, I get really uncomfortable for obvious reasons.

• 36:59Alex Cooper?

  And what do you do in those moments?

• 37:00Speaker 03

  Now?

• 37:01Alex Cooper?

  In the past?

• 37:02Speaker 03

  In the past, I would just scramble to fix it.

• 37:05Alex Cooper?

  Even if like they were the ones that fucked up, you would?

• 37:07Speaker 03

  You know, I'm really lucky. I haven't had many situations where someone's like actually fucked up in a relationship. It's usually just like an argument or a disagreement that's gone south, but, um, yeah, I would always scramble to fix it. Now. I stand on business. Now she's quiet. Now she just sits.

• 37:23Alex Cooper?

  And everything in you is like.

• 37:24Speaker 03

  I'm rageful inside because I'm like, I have to fix it. I have to fix it. I have to fix it. I'm like, it's okay. I'm just going to move my ankle and sit here and listen to you talk. And then I'm going to walk away, even though I don't want to walk away. I want to stay and fix it. And we'll talk about it tomorrow. That's okay.

• 37:38Alex Cooper?

  But when you get in that cycle, it's harder to break than to just keep doing it.

• 37:42Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 37:43Alex Cooper?

  Okay. So now talk to me about where you're at now through therapy of in the past, you are going through these moments where you're like, I'm becoming this fixer. I'm doing the same thing that I did with my dad. What are you like now?

• 37:58Speaker 03

  You know, I think I still have a bit of that in me, but I also think that's just part of my personality. So I'm trying to find the like navigate the, what is me and what is like learned behavior? And that's helpful through therapy. I think,

• 38:13Speaker 03

  choosing partners was always tough for me. And I think now I'm really like, I'm really locked into what I want and, who I am and what I deserve.

• 38:22Alex Cooper?

  In the past, what was something that would have attracted you to someone that now you would not?

• 38:26Speaker 03

  Loving me.

• 38:28Speaker 03

  Hey, you love me? Oh, my God, so cool. I love me too. Let's do this. Like, could be that simple sometimes. Hey, are you hot and you love me? Like, let's go. And you're kind of funny. I'm in. You know what I mean? Like, it was like, I just didn't know what to look for because I didn't have something to look at.

• 38:44Alex Cooper?

  But I think like, again, because there's so many women that listen to this, like, that is so unfortunately normal of like so many young women have this feeling of they're not loved in their childhood. And then they have this feeling of like, taking anything that feels like genuine love, but not actually.

• 39:04Speaker 03

  If it feels like security.

• 39:05Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 39:05Speaker 03

  Consistency, stability, even though none of those things were usually true in the relationships, if it felt like security, I was in.

• 39:12Alex Cooper?

  Because if he's saying he loves you so much, but he also is like doing these things.

• 39:16Speaker 03

  That are inconsistent. But he's saying he loves me.

• 39:19Alex Cooper?

  So you're gonna hold on to that?

• 39:21Speaker 03

  Sometimes I used to, yeah.

• 39:23Alex Cooper?

  What is your relationship like now with your father?

• 39:27Speaker 03

  It's complicated. Um, I love that man with every fiber of my being. He is one of the smartest people on the planet. He's also like, he loves gardening and he's like, he makes little salads from his garden and he loves his little greenhouse and he's, I mean, he's just like this sweet, sweet man. And when I'm able to step away from what happened and just look at the person in front of me, I'm like, you're an egg. You're just this wonderful little creature. Um, but it's still complicated because I still hear what's happening at home and there are occasional issues. And, um, so I draw really firm boundaries. Um, there are times where I don't talk to him for six months or so, and I'm very comfortable with that. He wishes we spoke more.

• 40:07Speaker 03

  I'm doing what I can, but I, I love him a lot and I'm, I'm very thankful for him doing the work.

• 40:14Alex Cooper?

  What is your relationship like with your mom?

• 40:16Speaker 03

  Best friend. Best friend in the whole world. I, when I say like woman who was meant to be a mom, I mean, woman who was meant to be a mom. Um, I think if anything, I feel sadness for her sometimes because I, she's so magnificent and so wonderful and so lovable. And I would just give anything. I would give my whole right foot for my mom to feel as loved as she deserves to feel. That would be my dream.

• 40:40Alex Cooper?

  I think like, it obviously can be so difficult when you become an adult to kind of replay what happened in your childhood and look at your parents and realize they're not perfect. They hurt me. I, you know, I didn't have the best situation in moments. Can you talk to me about the types of conversations that you've had to have with your parents in order to move forward to where you're at now?

• 41:07Speaker 03

  Yeah. Um.

• 41:10Speaker 03

  I had a lot, it was a lot of needing validation. It was a lot of needing like this actually happened, right? And this is how it went down. And I did this and you said this, or what hap- because my brother said this is what happened. So which one actually happened? And it was a lot of like actually trying to piece together my childhood and also saying these things to my father and having him acknowledge that's exactly what happened. That was the most important piece to me to have a relationship now.

• 41:36Alex Cooper?

  What boundaries have you had to set in order to kind of have a healthier relationship with your father?

• 41:44Speaker 03

  You know, with actually both of my parents, uh, they don't call me. I call them. That was really important to me. I was like, I'm tired of being the one who gets the phone calls. I will call you when I have time to talk.

• 41:55Alex Cooper?

  Oh, that's a good boundary.

• 41:56Speaker 03

  And I ended up, I call my mom almost every day. And my dad, I call, I think we spoke on the phone like a week ago. I faced him like a week ago to say hi.

• 42:05Alex Cooper?

  Do you have any advice for people? Cause I can imagine there's a lot of people watching being like, okay, wait, like this is so similar to things that I've gone through. Do you have any advice for people of how to approach difficult conversations with a parent?

• 42:20Speaker 03

  I don't know if I'm qualified to give advice, but I will say, depending on if you're still at home, if you're still at home, I think that you should probably manage those conversations very carefully to, to manage your environment. So you're not continuously walking on eggshells. Um, but as an adult, honesty and saying your truth. And if you need validation, go seek it out. And if they don't give it to you, cut them off. That's how I feel. If my dad wouldn't have given me validation at those moments, like he wouldn't be in my life anymore.

• 42:46Alex Cooper?

  Overall, in your situation, when you look back on your childhood, like, is there anything you wished your family could have really done differently?

• 42:57Speaker 03

  I wish I would have felt like a kid.

• 43:01Speaker 03

  Yeah, I don't, I think like now, like I do so much spiritual work. I'm incredibly spiritual. And when I, when I do healing sessions with my healer, I go to Denver for like three days and we get really in the weeds. Every time what comes up is like, you just need to go play, go be a kid. And the coolest thing, Alex, is that my job is playing all day long. Like, what a cool thing. I'm literally a big kid all day. Like, I'm sitting here on a couch with jelly beans, like, talking about my life, like, doing whatever I want. I'm just like a little sim now. So I am, like, I think I am finding a way to heal that, like, inner Madeleine with, through my work, which is the most beautiful thing I could do.

• 43:36Alex Cooper?

  Before we started recording, you had said that, um, you had mentioned there was a time in your life where you didn't think you wanted to have kids.

• 43:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:45Alex Cooper?

  And now you think you do.

• 43:47Speaker 03

  And no, I do.

• 43:48Alex Cooper?

  Um, talk to me about that shift.

• 43:52Speaker 03

  All my exes are gonna, if they hear this, they're gonna be so fucking pissed off. Um, because every, every man I've ever dated is like, are we gonna have kids or what? And I'm like, no, I don't want children. Um, a lot of it was, there's like two sides to it. One was the societal pressure of being a woman, of like, you are here to bear children. I'm like, go fuck yourself. No, I'm not. And also being a woman in Hollywood, and it's like, you only have so many years before your prime is over. And if you use them on, it's like, it's so much pressure that I was like, I'm just taking this off of the table for now. That was one side. The other side was much more deep rooted in, I refuse to raise a child in a dysfunctional home. I refuse to raise a child where they believe that they are not loved. I never felt

• 44:36Speaker 03

  like that was possible because of what I saw as a child. And then as an adult, something clicked,

• 44:44Speaker 03

  I want to say eight months ago, this is like really recent. I was talking to my therapist, and I was like, I mean, if I could just have consistency, like, if I could have a kid with my best friend, I would love that. And she goes, hey, you can. That's literally, you can pick your partner. You can have a kid with your best friend. And I, it like, mic drop. You're like, I was like, wait, what? I can? She goes, yeah, you can. And then it's like, I started thinking about it. I was like, how fun would it be to be able to like, I saw this TikTok that made me almost just lose my mind. I wish I could show it to you, of this adult mom showing a video of her daughter saying, it's crazy to see how easily I could have been loved. How easy it was to love a little me.

• 45:26Speaker 03

  And it's like, uh, knives to the heart, but also how cool would it be to like, be able to give all the love I didn't, I didn't feel and get to something little and to like, all the things that I feel, all the other youth that I feel now, like to, to see that through a child's eyes, like it just feels so beautiful. And so it's, it was at one point, the thing I wanted the least. I was like, I, I don't want to carry on this bloodline. Let it end here. And now I'm like, no, I can, I can change my narrative. I can rewrite history and I can decide what this looks like and I have the power to do that.

• 45:57Alex Cooper?

  I think that's so beautiful. And I also think it should be more normalized to go through that thought process of like, it's okay that you changed your mind.

• 46:08Speaker 03

  Oh my God. Now it's so annoying. Everyone's like, are you sure you want them? You've been saying for years you don't. And it's like, hey, what if, what if you were in my situation? Would you want them? Also, guess what? My ovaries, I can do whatever the fuck I want. I want them now.

• 46:20Alex Cooper?

  So shut the fuck up.

• 46:20Speaker 03

  Shut the fuck up.

• 46:22Alex Cooper?

  Dude, it is crazy.

• 46:24Speaker 03

  Why is it that I, I don't get why people feel so much autonomy over women's bodies? Don't even get me started about politics. I'm not going to go there.

• 46:31Alex Cooper?

  No, no, no.

• 46:32Speaker 03

  But in general, why is it your right to tell me that I'm, I'm, my time is running out?

• 46:36Alex Cooper?

  Or even just to judge you of like, I think it's so important to acknowledge that women can change their mind and it is okay and it is none of our business. Do you have any advice for women who have felt a little bit of just like shame that they have gone back and forth of if they've wanted kids? Cause I think people want you to feel shame. If you haven't known your whole life, then.

• 46:56Speaker 03

  Then you're not meant to be a mom.

• 46:57Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 46:57Speaker 03

  And it's like, actually I have, I have so much maternal instinct. It's absolutely insane. And I can't wait to put it on something and like, just love something so much. Um, no, I don't have any advice. Cause I just, I just experienced that. I don't know. Just love your truth and who the fuck would anybody says to you?

• 47:11Alex Cooper?

  And it's okay if you change your mind. You don't have to explain yourself to anyone.

• 47:14Speaker 03

  I don't know why women are so, we have to explain ourselves so much. Like, stop explaining yourself is actually my advice. You don't have to. You want them, say it. You don't want them, that's cool too.

• 47:23Alex Cooper?

  You had said all of your ex-boyfriends were going to be like, what the fuck? Talk to me about how at the time, not wanting kids and being vocal about that did, if anything, impact your relationships?

• 47:33Speaker 03

  I think it's so much easier for men to say they want kids.

• 47:36Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 47:37Speaker 03

  Like, sure you do. Come inside of a woman, get them pregnant, you can leave if you want. Like, it doesn't, of course you want a kid.

• 47:44Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 47:45Speaker 03

  It's fun for you.

• 47:46Alex Cooper?

  Nine months.

• 47:46Speaker 03

  Literally.

• 47:47Alex Cooper?

  Let me know.

• 47:47Speaker 03

  I've got to grow that thing. I've got to brew it in here. Um, so every guy I've dated has been like, yeah, I want kids one day. And I had such a harsh policy of like, I will not be the mother to your children. I was that crazy about it. Um, I think also because I was like, you don't tell me what I do with my body back then. And now I've like, I think I spent so much of my time as a child in like, living really heavily in my masculine energy to like, kind of father myself, that now I feel comfortable sitting more in my feminine and like, really sitting and being like, no, I want to be a mom and I want to be soft and I don't, I want to not have to protect myself and like, have, and have that support and like, feel beautiful in motherhood. And so that was the juxtaposition for me. They're going to be pissed, but like, there's, that's not the reason we broke up.

• 48:28Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 48:28Speaker 03

  For literally any of them.

• 48:30Alex Cooper?

  Okay, you said all of your ex-boyfriends. Um.

• 48:33Speaker 03

  What's up?

• 48:33Alex Cooper?

  Are you single?

• 48:36Speaker 03

  You know,

• 48:39Speaker 03

  I'm

• 48:41Speaker 03

  thirty-one.

• 48:42Alex Cooper?

  Mm-hmm.

• 48:43Speaker 03

  And I, I had a soundbite for you on this. Um, and I am in a place in my life where I've been in a, I've been a public figure for ten years. And I've tried to navigate my private and my public lives for a very long time, not very well. And, uh, the reality is, I know I'm on a show where I should be talking about my relationships, but like, I'm not going to.

• 49:04Alex Cooper?

  You're not going to. You know, I respect you for that. You're like, I finally figured it out. I need to take it behind closed doors and figure out if we're actually, if we're actually good together. And then maybe one day you're all figure out, okay, so we don't know if you're in a relationship.

• 49:19Speaker 03

  I do, but you don't.

• 49:20Alex Cooper?

  Okay. Oh, thanks. Okay. In this phase of life, what do you want out of a relationship?

• 49:25Speaker 03

  Okay, that's a great question.

• 49:26Alex Cooper?

  That's fair.

• 49:26Speaker 03

  Um, consistency. I think that's one thing that I learned is really important, consistency in a partner. Uh.

• 49:35Speaker 03

  Kindness, love. It's like honestly not that hard, I think, to be in a good relationship. And I'm, you know, it's, it's communication, uh, support for my career. I, I, I think the hardest part is that I'm an actor and I naturally will have to go have sex scenes and do things like that. And so trust is really important. I'm a very trustworthy person, but it's hard to trust an actor and I understand that. Um, just understanding, communication.

• 50:02Alex Cooper?

  What would you say is your best quality in a relationship?

• 50:06Speaker 03

  How much time do you have?

• 50:07Alex Cooper?

  Go.

• 50:08Speaker 03

  I'm a fucking amazing girlfriend. Now I am like, the shit that I've done to get here, like, I'm brilliant.

• 50:15Alex Cooper?

  You're like, put me in. You want me.

• 50:17Speaker 03

  Put me in coach.

• 50:18Alex Cooper?

  You want me.

• 50:19Speaker 03

  I, I listen and I care and I'm understanding and, um, I'm an incredibly good emotional communicator because of nine years of weekly or two times a week therapy.

• 50:31Alex Cooper?

  That'll do it.

• 50:32Speaker 03

  Uh, I have a good group of friends. I, I have a good job. Like, I think there's, I, I think that, like, I'm kind of the whole package.

• 50:56Alex Cooper?

  Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ross. Fall is about finding pieces you love, making them your own and creating looks and spaces just right for the season. Whether you're updating a small apartment or a spacious home, drawn to timeless neutrals or bold seasonal touches, Ross makes it easy to imagine what's next and bring your fall vision to life. Ross makes fashion accessible to all with up to 20 to 60% off other retailers' prices on the brands you love. Find your nearest Ross at rossstores.com. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Uncrustables. Daddy gang knows there is no disappointment like reaching for an Uncrustable sandwich and then remembering you have to wait for

• 51:39Alex Cooper?

  it to thaw. To speed things up, there are all sorts of hacks, like, you know, sitting on an Uncrustable sandwich so it thaws faster. But you don't have to wait for that pillowy soft bread anymore. You can now keep Uncrustables in your fridge so they're ready to eat the moment that craving strikes. No wait time. Find them in the freezer aisle today. Okay, we're gonna play a game. I'm gonna describe a guy and you're gonna say if you're in or out.

• 52:05Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 52:05Alex Cooper?

  He took you on the best first date of your life, but he's fresh out of a messy breakup.

• 52:10Speaker 03

  Out.

• 52:11Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 52:12Speaker 03

  I don't care. I don't care. I don't. It's a great date. I don't care.

• 52:16Alex Cooper?

  Right. You're like, call me in six months.

• 52:17Speaker 03

  Also, but like, no, don't, please.

• 52:19Alex Cooper?

  No?

• 52:20Speaker 03

  I'm thirty one.

• 52:21Alex Cooper?

  Okay. How soon is too soon for someone after a breakup to be approaching you and like really pursuing you?

• 52:27Speaker 03

  It just depends on, it could be the next day if it doesn't feel messy.

• 52:30Alex Cooper?

  Yes. Okay. He's super fun and social with his friends, but he's shy and reserved around yours.

• 52:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's fine. I'm in. I think it's kind of charming.

• 52:38Alex Cooper?

  Okay. How important is it for you to have your friends be friends with the person that you're dating?

• 52:45Speaker 03

  I think it's important that they get along and that like my, my, there's a couple of people in my life that are my north stars.

• 52:52Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 52:52Speaker 03

  If they love my partner, I'm in. If they hate them, I'm literally out, like actually out. Have been there. I have been out.

• 53:00Alex Cooper?

  Love. Oh, that's the best.

• 53:01Speaker 03

  She's in the other room, one of them.

• 53:02Alex Cooper?

  Perfect.

• 53:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 53:03Alex Cooper?

  Okay. He's super communicative, but won't share his location with you.

• 53:07Speaker 03

  Oh, that's fine.

• 53:08Alex Cooper?

  Would you ever share a location with a partner?

• 53:10Speaker 03

  I have if they ask.

• 53:11Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 53:11Speaker 03

  It's like, whatever.

• 53:12Alex Cooper?

  Okay. What is the biggest lie that you have ever caught a man in?

• 53:18Speaker 03

  Um, I was dating this guy. I was at work on location and he called me. He's like, I just got home. Went to bed. I love you. Good night. It's great. I love you. Good night. Got a call from the guy I was dating before him. Hey, I met your boyfriend last night at like four AM. I'm like, hey, no, he was in bed. Were you in bed with him? And I really trusted this guy. I was like, and what I'm telling you, like blind trust on only this partner. Cause he was just such, like, he was that guy. And I was like, you're lying. You're being crazy. No. I call him the next morning and I'm like, hey, it's so weird, but he said that he saw you. He goes, no, no, I was at home. Okay. Call him back. I go, you're a fucking liar. He didn't see you. He goes, no. And he starts describing this specific

• 53:58Speaker 03

  present that I had gotten from him that he was wearing, that like I had, no one had posted. It was like, there's no, and I was like, wait a second, hold on. Where were you? And he goes, oh, he was with this very famous eighties pop star and they were like all over each other at this bar. And then I call my boyfriend and he goes, oh, um, yeah, maybe I was there for like a second. I don't really remember. And then photos came out of them. And I was like, hey, what? Like, hello? Hello? Do you think I'm stupid?

• 54:27Alex Cooper?

  Not the photos.

• 54:28Speaker 03

  Do you think I'm dumb?

• 54:29Alex Cooper?

  No, not the photos.

• 54:31Speaker 03

  I don't even know if he did any, I'm sure he didn't cheat on me, but the lie was enough for me to be like, I'm done.

• 54:36Alex Cooper?

  Well, no, no, no. The lie is like,

• 54:38Speaker 03

  Crazy.

• 54:38Alex Cooper?

  Who cares if you go to an event? Just let me know, like, not, don't say you're going to bed.

• 54:43Speaker 03

  Hey, but like, why is she all over you? And why are her arms all over you? Like, are you okay?

• 54:48Alex Cooper?

  And how are you saying you forgot?

• 54:50Speaker 03

  You forgot? And you also met my ex. You think he's not gonna call me and tell me that you were with some other woman?

• 54:56Alex Cooper?

  And you also took multiple pictures that night?

• 54:59Speaker 03

  What? Like, what? Yeah, that was crazy. It's actually the only time I've ever caught anybody in a lie.

• 55:04Alex Cooper?

  No, the worst is when photo evidence and he's like, he's gaslighting you and then you literally like, so what's this?

• 55:09Speaker 03

  I didn't have to get there. It was basically like the next, like probably, I want to say like 4:00 PM the next day. He was like, okay, yeah, for a second. I'm like, for a second, my ass. For a second, my ass.

• 55:20Alex Cooper?

  Wait, so did you stay with him?

• 55:21Speaker 03

  No, fuck no.

• 55:22Alex Cooper?

  You broke up with him over that?

• 55:24Speaker 03

  Yeah, absolutely. Love that for you.

• 55:26Alex Cooper?

  Um, okay, there were rumors earlier this year. Look at us having a stare off.

• 55:34Speaker 03

  Charlie? What were the rumors about?

• 55:37Alex Cooper?

  Us, we literally just locked eyes and I was like, there were rumors, the, all the lights dim. There were rumors that you were dating a certain rapper.

• 55:46Speaker 03

  Oh, that's interesting. I haven't heard of those.

• 55:47Alex Cooper?

  What, uh? What was going on there?

• 55:51Speaker 03

  I don't know what you're talking about.

• 55:52Alex Cooper?

  You don't know?

• 55:53Speaker 03

  No.

• 55:53Alex Cooper?

  I don't know either. Who wrote that?

• 55:55Speaker 03

  I don't Google myself, so I don't know what you're talking about.

• 55:57Alex Cooper?

  You don't even know. Okay.

• 55:59Speaker 03

  What are you talking about?

• 56:00Alex Cooper?

  Madeline, I'm gonna...

• 56:02Speaker 03

  I literally don't know what you're talking about.

• 56:04Alex Cooper?

  We're pivoting.

• 56:04Speaker 03

  Pivot.

• 56:05Alex Cooper?

  Um, obviously your friendships on Riverdale were so iconic and everyone was obsessed with you guys. What was your first impression of those women in general? And like, did you even have any idea that you would?

• 56:17Speaker 03

  May I set the record straight about something on Riverdale, actually?

• 56:19Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 56:20Speaker 03

  I would love to do this on air.

• 56:21Alex Cooper?

  Please.

• 56:22Speaker 03

  Okay. Recently, an article came out saying that we all fucked each other on the show. I did not touch a single person on that show with a 10-foot pole. May I just repeat that one more time? I did not fuck a single person on Riverdale. I never touched them. That's what happened. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.

• 56:41Alex Cooper?

  Wait, did people think you fucked the girls or people on set?

• 56:43Speaker 03

  It was just like this article that came out that was like, we all fucked each other all the time. And I was like, hey, no, I did not fuck any of you. I don't claim that shit at all.

• 56:52Alex Cooper?

  You weren't into anyone on set?

• 56:53Speaker 03

  No. I don't mix business and pleasure like that. I've never hooked up with a co-star. Do you know why, though? You know what's really ironic about all this is Cole sat me down during the pilot and was like, if I can give you one piece of advice, Mads, do you have a cigarette? Can I borrow? Um, he was like, thanks, guys. Um, you can keep that in. Uh, he was like, don't, hey, don't hook up with any of your co-stars, okay? And so I was like, okay, got it. I won't.

• 57:17Alex Cooper?

  As he is, he's like, Cole.

• 57:21Speaker 03

  Right. But you know what? Honestly, best advice I've ever been given was from Cole Spur.

• 57:24Alex Cooper?

  He's like, I'm gonna give you advice and I'm not gonna take myself.

• 57:27Speaker 03

  For sure.

• 57:27Alex Cooper?

  But?

• 57:28Speaker 03

  Hundred percent. But no, I never, I never have.

• 57:30Alex Cooper?

  That's smart. I think that's really smart.

• 57:32Speaker 03

  Yeah, thank you. Anyways, back to the girls.

• 57:34Alex Cooper?

  Oh, yeah, back to the girls.

• 57:35Speaker 03

  My first impression was that I actually had known Lily because we, I didn't know Vanessa too. I'd known Lily because we did our chem reads together and she was lovely. And like we, I, we also were like in this thing together. We both had him booked it. So we had this like kind of hive mind. So we flew there together. We lived together season one, like we were so close and we never met Kami. She might have done maybe a chem read with her, but I didn't meet her. And then Kami walks in and we all, this is so funny, the way we all met, we were on a group chain. We're all at the Sutton Place in Vancouver and we're like, hey, let's all meet in the jacuzzi in an hour. Like, what? Like, why are we meeting?

• 58:10Alex Cooper?

  See, this is why the rumors got out, that you're all like fucking orgies in the hot tub.

• 58:14Speaker 03

  Orgies in the hot tub at the Sutton Place. Do not clip that. We are not having orgies at the Sutton Place. Um, no, we all met in the hot tub and Kami walks in and she's got the like, we're, we're like 20, 21. And she's got this like little black bathing suit on, she's got this like tat under her boob and she looks all hot. And I was like, you're the coolest person ever. Like, bye, you're never gonna like me. Um, but no, we all became best friends like immediately. The three of us were so close. It was interesting because the boys and the girls kind of got clicky, like the boys all loved each other, the girls all loved each other. Um, but no, it was, it was like a match made in heaven really fast, almost scarily fast. We're like, this isn't, this is gonna burn out quickly. And then it just never did.

• 58:50Alex Cooper?

  I feel like obviously society tries to pit women against each other and make everyone jealous of each other because it's their favorite thing to do. Um, how did you guys avoid jealousy over like roles and screen time? And who was getting more attention and the producers and all the things?

• 59:06Speaker 03

  We never had a problem with that. Ever. I think because we all started at the exact same place, we were able to just support. That was all it was. It was just supporting each other through the hard times, the lows. I mean, being in your early twenties and booking a show like that, that skyrockets to success. Thank God we had each other. So it became this thing where instead of pitting each other against each other, we were leaning on each other and every second of the day.

• 59:31Alex Cooper?

  Do you think you'll ever re-watch it?

• 59:34Speaker 03

  No.

• 59:35Alex Cooper?

  What about when you have a daughter or a son?

• 59:37Speaker 03

  I'm not letting her watch that. Or him.

• 59:41Alex Cooper?

  Wait, why? You were so good. Come on.

• 59:43Speaker 03

  Actually, no, I will. I'm just kidding.

• 59:46Alex Cooper?

  You're like.

• 59:46Speaker 03

  I was really good. You're right.

• 59:47Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 59:47Speaker 03

  Um, no, I love Cheryl. To be honest, I love her. I think it's, it was eight years of my life. There's so many, when I watch the episodes and thinking about what was happening behind the scenes, like, honestly, maybe I will re-watch it one day. I watched the pilot the other day and started sobbing.

• 1:00:01Alex Cooper?

  Stop.

• 1:00:02Speaker 03

  Because I was like,

• 1:00:02Alex Cooper?

  Alone?

• 1:00:03Speaker 03

  The show could have been so good. Like, I watched the pilot and I was like, this is what it could have been.

• 1:00:06Alex Cooper?

  You're like, this is so close.

• 1:00:08Speaker 03

  Ah, we were so close. But I'm also so thankful for it. Like, it's exactly, it's why I'm where I am right now. I met the friends I have. I love Cheryl Blossom more than anyone could ever love a character in my life. She was the most fun, psychotic, crazy woman of the planet Earth. Um, and always a wild ride and always a challenge. So I can't complain. I think watching it would be, there's still like a bit of sadness about it ending. So I think it would be kind of like heartbreaking to watch because I still miss, I was going to work and seeing my friends every day.

• 1:00:34Alex Cooper?

  Wait, why did you watch the pilot randomly?

• 1:00:36Speaker 03

  Um, it was like six, where was I? I was in Tulsa, Oklahoma, shooting this movie. And it was like, recommended for you, Riverdale. And I was like, ha, ha, okay. What's wrong with me? And I was on like night shoot, so I was really over exhausted. I was like, I'll turn it on to go to bed. I watched the whole thing. I'm sobbing in bed by myself. Like, hey, what's wrong with you?

• 1:00:54Alex Cooper?

  Honestly, really cute. That was really cute.

• 1:00:56Speaker 03

  I do. I really, look, I really love the show. And I think it was, it was, it was before its time. And I think that's really great.

• 1:01:02Alex Cooper?

  Let's talk about your new movie, The Strangers, Chapter Two. Tell me everything.

• 1:01:07Speaker 03

  So movie one is kind of like your typical home invasion film. They try to kill us. They succeed with one, you know. Um, and then the second movie is just me really fighting for my life more from them in the woods. And this time in crazy circumstances, doing things I never thought I would do. It's honestly, when I tell you, I'm like, how the fuck did I do this stuff? When I watch it, it's like I blackout. I don't know what's happening.

• 1:01:32Alex Cooper?

  What was the hardest scene to shoot?

• 1:01:34Speaker 03

  There's a scene that is on my fucking, of course, on my DNRS, which I, so I can't talk about it specifically, but there's a scene where I work with a creature actor.

• 1:01:42Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:01:42Speaker 03

  And we had to be affect into something else. And I get into a full fight with this thing. And it's like, it's really brutal and it's really insane. And it was incredibly tough to shoot and we had half a day to shoot it. Supposed to be two days. We didn't have enough time in the schedule, but it's so cool. It's so cool.

• 1:01:58Alex Cooper?

  You have another movie coming out.

• 1:01:59Speaker 03

  I do.

• 1:02:00Alex Cooper?

  Maintenance required. This is the complete opposite side of the spectrum and we're talking about a romantic comedy, which I love. The girl has range. Okay. She's got an axe next to her head. She's running. Oh, we're so scared.

• 1:02:12Speaker 03

  I'm so distressed.

• 1:02:13Alex Cooper?

  And then we're funny falling in love.

• 1:02:15Speaker 03

  Funny falling in love.

• 1:02:16Alex Cooper?

  Okay. What do you think the daddy gang will love most about this movie?

• 1:02:20Speaker 03

  Okay. So Charlie, the lead character, me, is a mechanic and she's like a hot mechanic. And like I went to mechanic school and like everything I'm doing is real. So it's, it's just really cool.

• 1:02:30Alex Cooper?

  Dude, it's so refreshing to actually hear like you learned how to pole dance from your other movie.

• 1:02:34Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:02:34Alex Cooper?

  You're learning to be a mechanic.

• 1:02:36Speaker 03

  Dude, I get paid to learn new skills. Why would I not want to do it? They're like, we can get you a handle. I'm like, no. Put me in coach. Like that sounds so much, like, why would I not want to do that? That's so fun. And it's like, um, it's like a ode to, I'm sure you've got males probably before most of daddy gangs time. Never said daddy gang out loud before.

• 1:02:50Alex Cooper?

  Sounds good.

• 1:02:50Speaker 03

  I like it.

• 1:02:51Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:51Speaker 03

  Um, but it's like an ode to those nineties, early aughts rom coms that we all love. And I feel like we're trying to get back. It's the, the haters to lovers trope. It's really fun. Jacob is brilliant in it, my co-star. And it's, um, it's really fun and the love is earned.

• 1:03:05Alex Cooper?

  You were producer on both of these movies. What made you want to step into that role?

• 1:03:10Speaker 03

  I just, if you can't tell by our conversation, I have like a naturally producerial brain, I feel like. So I can, especially being on Riverdale where the kids kind of ran the show, like we were there for so long that we learned everything we could possibly learn, especially the girls. Like we really soaked that up. We all have production companies now. Um, so I think it just comes naturally to me to produce. I just get it. I get scheduling. I understand how development works. I have a good brain for creative writing and like, it's just kind of, it was a natural evolution. The strangers I got offered. Two weeks before we started shooting and I was like, hey, I love the concept. Script's gotta be redone. Let's work on that. I go to Slovakia like three days later. I start working on the script with the writers and the producer. I'm like writing in Slovakia. And then it just kind of naturally evolved to me producing it. Same with Maintenance Required. It was a very similar process.

• 1:03:56Alex Cooper?

  That's really cool because even just hearing like all the way back to the beginning of this interview, you talking about how you like loved the arts, you threw yourself into it. Now to be continuing to like build on what you love. It's so cool to see you now also like in these movies, like it's just, we love seeing you on our screens.

• 1:04:13Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:04:13Alex Cooper?

  Um, Madeline, thank you so much for coming on. That was such a journey. That was.

• 1:04:21Alex Cooper?

  We literally started, we go high, we go low, we go high, we go low. We went all over the place. But I feel like the fun thing about sitting down with you is like, we see this version of you that we see on our screens, in movies, television shows, we see you online. But to hear you actually talk more about who you are, where you came from, why you are the way you are. I think it's going to let your fans and mine just like fall more in love with you and really appreciate watching you grow. And I'm excited to see what the next decade holds for you, my girl.

• 1:04:53Speaker 03

  Thanks for making this such a safe space, my girl.

• 1:04:56Alex Cooper?

  Love you.

• 1:04:56Speaker 03

  Love you.

• 1:04:57Alex Cooper?

  That was really good.

• 1:04:57Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:04:58Alex Cooper?

  Bye.

• 1:05:13Alex Cooper?

  Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ross. Fall is about finding pieces you love, making them your own and creating looks and spaces just right for the season. Whether you're updating a small apartment or a spacious home, drawn to timeless neutrals or bold seasonal touches, Ross makes it easy to imagine what's next and bring your fall vision to life. Ross makes fashion accessible to all with up to 20 to 60% off other retailers' prices on the brands you love. Find your nearest Ross at rossstores.com. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by American Eagle Holiday Outfitters. Fits just got way easier. American Eagles new arrivals are basically everything you need right now.

• 1:05:57Alex Cooper?

  Super soft sweaters, lightweight layers, comfy lounge styles, heritage faves, and low-rise jeans that are very much back in the rotation. Whether you're heading to a holiday thing or just hanging with your people, there's something for every plan. Just don't wait too long. Your new faves won't be around forever. You can check it all out at ae.com or just go to the store. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by SoFi, the everything app for smarter money. Daddy gang, stop letting your money sit in checking, doing nothing. With SoFi Checking and Savings, you get a competitive APY, no account fees, and a bonus when you join with eligible direct deposit. Terms apply. Make your smart money move today at sofi.com/callherdaddy.

• 1:06:40Alex Cooper?

  SoFi Checking and Savings is offered through SoFi Bank and a member FDIC.