PALOMA FAITH: How to Deal With Heartbreak When You're Not Okay | GREAT MOMENTS

Paloma Faith was one of the first guests to join me on Great Company. She’s one of Britain’s most distinctive music artists, known for her iconic style, incredible music and never being afraid to push boundaries. With a new series of her hit podcast, Mad, Sad and Bad, starting this week, I thought it was the perfect time to revisit our conversation. In this Great Moment, Paloma is incredibly open, discussing how she has navigated huge heartbreak and the pressures of motherhood. Watch the full episode HERE! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO7gZ_INKvU New episodes of Mad, Sad and Bad with Paloma Faith https://lnk.to/MadSadBad are available every Tuesday from 6th October. The new series features a brilliant mix of guests including Letitia Wright, Miguel, Grace Campbell and Davina McCall for a very special collaboration with CoppaFeel! and Candy Kittens, raising awareness around breast cancer. If you enjoyed Great Company, you can also follow us: Instagram-@greatcompanypodcast https://www.instagram.com/greatcompanypodcast/# TikTok -@greatcompanypodcast https://open.acast.com/networks/611e511b4ec6dc00134bced2/shows/65d737dfdc02e00016c413b2/episodes/www.tiktok.com/@greatcompanypodcast And if you've got thoughts, questions and comments, you can email us at: [email protected] THE CREDITS Senior Producer: Helen Burke Assistant Producer: Issy Weeks-Hankins Video: Josh Bennett Social Media: Laura Coughlan Exec Producer: Ewan Newbigging-Lister & Jemima Rathbone Great Company is an original podcast from JamPot Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Hi, it's Paloma Faith, my podcast, Mad, Sad and Bad, is back for season four. I'm sitting down with some amazing people, including Letitia Wright.

• 0:08Speaker 01

  When I'm really fearful of something, I just run towards it.

• 0:11Speaker 00

  Judy Love. I'm celibate. Out of Troy. Yeah, I could get it any day. Grace Campbell. Here we have Anita, who's a dog psychic. Tell Eddie, stop barking when I'm...

• 0:22Speaker 01

  She said you're too noisy.

• 0:24Speaker 00

  And plenty more. Mad, Sad and Bad with me, Paloma Faith. Listen now wherever you get your podcasts.

• 0:30Speaker 02

  Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. That means less time on the work around the work and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle/workspacewithGemini. That's goo.gle/workspacewithGemini.

• 1:03Speaker 03

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• 2:38Jamie Laing?

  Hello, everyone, I'm Jamie Laing and this is Great Moments.

• 2:44Jamie Laing?

  Hey, guys, so welcome back to Great Moments. These are our little snippets, right? And this week I wanted to revisit my conversation with the one and only, my great friend, Paloma Faith. Okay, she is simply incredible and one of the first guests I ever had on Great Company. Now, she honestly, she blew me away with how honest she was about love and heartbreak and how it fuels her incredible music. And even before I met Paloma, she thought she was gonna hate me. And then actually, we've got on so well. I think it's because she thinks I'm posh. Now, I learned so much from Paloma and I know you will too. And listen, guys, while I have you, we have some exciting news. Mad, Sad and Bad with Paloma Faith, her show is back for series four, giving us all the mad, sad and bad moments you didn't know you needed.

• 3:26Jamie Laing?

  We make it a jam pot, she's incredible and the new series features a brilliant mix of guests from Letitia Wright to Miguel and Davina McCall. Now, you don't want to miss it. Okay, so new episodes, get this, launch every Tuesday from the 6th of October. So sit back and enjoy this Great Moments with my buddy, Paloma Faith.

• 3:46Jamie Laing?

  Do you think you're lovable?

• 3:48Speaker 00

  Very.

• 3:51Jamie Laing?

  But that's, but that's great. That's a really positive thing because sometimes...

• 3:56Speaker 00

  But I also think I'm really despisable, but I'm just like...

• 3:59Jamie Laing?

  No, you're not despisable.

• 4:00Speaker 00

  In my life, I've had a lot of...

• 4:01Jamie Laing?

  You're opinionated, that's...

• 4:02Speaker 00

  Yeah, I've had an experience of people being really like, I love her. And I've had the opposite. And I quite like that because it would be awful if you went into a room and people were like, I don't really remember her.

• 4:15Jamie Laing?

  Do you...

• 4:15Speaker 00

  And I'd rather they were just like, she's awful.

• 4:18Jamie Laing?

  Do you think for you, like, so with your new album, could you obviously put your heart and soul into your music?

• 4:23Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm.

• 4:24Jamie Laing?

  Do you think for you, that is your one place that kind of never, always is supporting you, always is there to help you, always is never backing out? That is your place of comfort? So when you want to have a sounding board, when you want to release all of these emotions, you can put it into an album and write it?

• 4:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, but it's therapeutic, it's cathartic, absolutely. But I also do a lot of actual therapy as well and I find that important. Like I notice when I, when I don't go for a while that I'm, I need it.

• 4:57Jamie Laing?

  Hmm.

• 4:57Speaker 00

  But I don't think anger is a negative emotion either because I was raised to believe anger was a negative emotion. And my mum, when I was growing up, was always like, if I hit something or threw something, she'd be, I can't believe you. You're just like your father, because that was like the biggest insult. And because my dad's a very angry man.

• 5:19Jamie Laing?

  Why was that the biggest insult?

• 5:20Speaker 00

  Because he's a very angry man and it didn't get him anywhere. But I've also got something like, I get stress-related alopecia and I think all of that's like, and it's always emotional. If I'm stressed at work, it's my hair doesn't fall out. But if it's emotional, my hair starts falling out. And it's something to do with like, the body kind of like eating itself if you don't release those feelings. So it's really important that you do.

• 5:46Jamie Laing?

  With writing this recent album, when you finish it and you put it out there, is there a sense of, is there a sense of calm? Is there a sense of completion? Do you have that when you write your music? And when you, especially when you complete it? Or is there a sense of sadness when you complete it? Because then you can't go back into that place. Because actually, there's comfort being in trauma sometimes.

• 6:07Speaker 00

  Well, just because you finished the album doesn't mean the trauma's gone away.

• 6:11Jamie Laing?

  No, it doesn't for sure.

• 6:12Speaker 00

  Um, but I think in the past, up till, like, so my first five albums were all albums that I felt like I'd put something to bed with. But I think this is ongoing navigation because we have children together. And that's what makes this a different type of heartbreak album. Because the heartbreak will be forever and the, and the navigation of our relationship changing shape will be forever, probably till we die. You can't really let go of somebody you've got kids with.

• 6:47Jamie Laing?

  Hmm.

• 6:48Speaker 00

  And some people sort of, you know, just because you don't see them, some people never speak again. And they're still very present because you look at your kids and you see that person in your kids. Or they come back from visiting their, your ex-partner and they're, they're doing the mannerisms or they've got opinions that you don't agree with that are their opinions or whatever. But in my case, it's even harder, I think, in a way, because we really like each other a lot and we're really close and we still love each other. And that makes it confusing.

• 7:23Jamie Laing?

  That's really sad.

• 7:24Speaker 00

  So it's sort of heartbreaking every time we see each other.

• 7:30Jamie Laing?

  That makes me sad.

• 7:32Speaker 00

  Yeah, it is sad.

• 7:34Jamie Laing?

  Because if I was, if you were telling me and I was a friend of yours, I'd be like, but hang on a second. I can see you're getting emotional now because it makes me upset. Because you have so much love to give, obviously, you want to be looked after. No, it's so, because you're obviously...

• 7:50Speaker 00

  It's just very raw because of the kids.

• 7:52Jamie Laing?

  Of course it is. And you're obviously such a great mum and you want to make sure your kids are okay. And so you've got that pressure. And then you also still love your partner and sometimes you're just like in life, well, why the fuck hasn't this worked out? Like, like that, fuck's sake, I love you and you love me.

• 8:11Speaker 00

  But I say on the album, there's a spoken bit where I say, I know it's my fault. And then it does this mantra, it's all right, thanks. It does this mantra that's, ah, it does, says there's nothing more human than failure over and over again, and it's true.

• 8:27Jamie Laing?

  Yeah, it is true. We, and you know, we have to fail, right? And that's what happens. I sort of realized that in this like weird game called life, which by the way, I thought all the time that I'd open a door and I'd find all the answers and you just never do. And that's what's kind of scary about life. But you, you, we constantly have to make mistakes.

• 8:47Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 8:47Jamie Laing?

  And, and falling in love and getting married and then that maybe not working out isn't bad on you. That's just part of life sometimes and we, it's not even, it's not even a failure, it's just a part of what happens. And I think maybe you're giving yourself too much of a hard time. It feels like, I think you are.

• 9:07Speaker 00

  Yeah, but saying that to me is like telling me not to be me.

• 9:10Jamie Laing?

  I know it is.

• 9:13Jamie Laing?

  I know it is.

• 9:16Jamie Laing?

  Do you find it hard to listen to the album?

• 9:18Speaker 00

  There's one song on it that I can't listen to and I don't think I'll play live called Divorce. And I just get too upset.

• 9:31Jamie Laing?

  Because it's just too much?

• 9:32Speaker 00

  I don't think I could sing it.

• 9:34Jamie Laing?

  Really?

• 9:35Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 9:36Jamie Laing?

  So then why'd you put it on the album?

• 9:39Speaker 00

  Because it's the most truthful one.

• 9:45Speaker 00

  It's basically all the stuff that's just made me get emotional now in a song.

• 9:49Jamie Laing?

  Oh my god.

• 9:50Speaker 00

  And it's got my kids' voices in it.

• 9:53Jamie Laing?

  Really?

• 9:53Speaker 00

  Yeah. So as soon as I hear them at the beginning, so that I've recorded them playing in the garden, I just start crying. I just hear them and then I'm like, ah, one chord.

• 10:06Jamie Laing?

  Really?

• 10:06Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 10:07Jamie Laing?

  But that's kind of special at the same time.

• 10:09Speaker 00

  Yeah, maybe I'll get, maybe I need to like toughen up a bit on tour and just.

• 10:13Jamie Laing?

  You've got to perform that live. Are you kidding me? That's gonna be amazing. How do you deal with heartbreak?

• 10:22Speaker 00

  I don't know, not very well. I think you have to go through it though, and you've got to sort of face your feelings. I think in the past, this is what I've learned from this one. In the past, I always dealt with it by probably pushing it to one side and filling that void with another person almost immediately.

• 10:42Jamie Laing?

  Really? So you would replace straight away?

• 10:44Speaker 00

  I've just replaced, not straight away, but very quickly. And now I've got children, it doesn't work, it doesn't sit right. I've tried a bit of dating, I've tried some stuff and it doesn't work because when you've got children, the moment you know that someone's not right for you, you just can't see them. Like that they're not gonna make you happy or, you know, if they're gonna be damaging to you because if I'm miserable, my kids experience it. And I notice myself as well being like, if I'm upset or stressed about something with someone and then I'll be like, maybe more, quicker to snap with my kids. Like, what are you doing? Why do you keep asking me?

• 11:30Speaker 00

  Or they go, mama, mama, mama. And you're like, what? Whereas normally you'll just be like, yes, love, whatever, like, I don't know. So I have to be careful. So I don't think my old habits work anymore. So I'm sort of like learning, it sounds so cliche, but I was trying to have a relationship with myself. I don't know if I've ever had one.

• 11:54Jamie Laing?

  They always say that heartbreak is like grief and they go, you go through seven stages. And the seven stages are shock, denial, pain, guilt, anger, bargaining, depression, and then an upwards turn and it sort of gets towards acceptance. If you had to say which.

• 12:11Speaker 00

  That's what my album's about, by the way, all the stages of grief.

• 12:15Jamie Laing?

  That's, that's what is.

• 12:17Speaker 00

  So it could, it chron, it's chronological, but it goes through all those stages. So each song represents those stages.

• 12:24Jamie Laing?

  Can I, can I ask a personal question?

• 12:25Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 12:26Jamie Laing?

  Why do you think it didn't, your, it didn't work out? You're 10 years together, you have, you know, two beautiful kids.

• 12:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:32Jamie Laing?

  And relationships, I get a heart, doesn't matter how new or how old they are. But why don't you think it worked?

• 12:38Speaker 00

  Resentment because I think that I did too much. I felt I contributed more to the whole setup than, than I was, I didn't feel like I was matched in my contribution. And over time, that took its toll and the resentment built. Um, there was a lot of, like, I won't go into the details, but there's a lot of disparity, I think, between, I felt there was, between what I put into it and him.

• 13:10Jamie Laing?

  In terms of love, in terms of.

• 13:12Speaker 00

  Everything.

• 13:12Jamie Laing?

  Everything.

• 13:14Speaker 00

  Not love. I think we were equal on that. Practically, I think, more.

• 13:20Jamie Laing?

  And that's sometimes hard, but then, did you communicate that? Because sometimes I think in relationships, maybe that's not communicated. So you're, I've definitely felt in relationships before where I felt a certain way, but I've never communicated that.

• 13:31Speaker 00

  Yeah, I did communicate it, but I do think as well, like,

• 13:37Speaker 00

  it was, in the end, it becomes about accepting that, like, you can't turn someone into something else. Like, for example, I'm just quite an ambitious, proactive person.

• 13:50Jamie Laing?

  Hmm.

• 13:51Speaker 00

  But if somebody's not ambitious and proactive, I can't make them into that. I have to accept who they are. That's what love is.

• 13:59Jamie Laing?

  Hmm.

• 13:59Speaker 00

  So you sort of have to be okay with who they are and what they're bringing.

• 14:05Jamie Laing?

  Do you think in relationships sometimes that we change and then the other person doesn't potentially change with you?

• 14:11Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:11Jamie Laing?

  And then that becomes a problem, right?

• 14:13Speaker 00

  Well, I think having children was a huge shift for me because I, I have always been quite maternal and like enjoyed that role. But then as soon as I had small babies, I didn't, and this is quite common in relationships. I didn't have the capacity even to like mother anybody other than the baby or the next baby. Didn't wanna mother the partner or the friends. Like I had friends who got upset with me as well.

• 14:41Jamie Laing?

  Cause you just put so much love and everything in to the baby.

• 14:44Speaker 00

  Well, they were just like, you don't give me attention like you used to. Just like, well, hold fire for a second, like wait till my children are over the age of 10.

• 14:53Jamie Laing?

  And then you can go back.

• 14:55Speaker 00

  I'll give it, I'll have a decade of that. I didn't wanna like take that away from them, but I think that takes its toll. But I don't think there's enough acknowledgement for like the sheer amount of pressure or work that women do when they become mothers. And I do believe, and I talk about this a lot, that feminism has kind of let, started something for us and abandoned us halfway through. Because we've been given this sort of like pseudo, what I think is a patriarchal idea of equality, which basically means that we're all doing three people's jobs. And we're tired and irritable and it's understandable. We're just done. And like.

• 15:36Jamie Laing?

  But explain that more. What do you, what do you mean by three people's jobs?

• 15:39Speaker 00

  Well, I'm doing a full-time work breadwinner in my.

• 15:43Jamie Laing?

  In your situation, yeah.

• 15:45Speaker 00

  Um, and I am, you know, making great stuff happen, like, kind of feel like the responsible for exciting things to happen for my family.

• 15:57Jamie Laing?

  Yeah.

• 15:57Speaker 00

  Holidays, like events, like painting, whatever they do, like playdough, playdates, buying the school uniform, doing the supermarket shop, like it's so much, this sort of like invisible, unspoken labour that you do as a mother. And, um, so there's that. And then there's like,

• 16:24Speaker 00

  on top of that, like being there for your children, being like a source of, um, like moral growth and like emotional support and all of that. It's so much and, and I think that it's taken for granted by society, like the mother, the mother. And everyone's always like, oh, their mum or will mum be coming? Like you don't even realise until you, it happens to you that everyone's just like the mum. And nobody goes dad or they, and if he's involved, they go, oh, you're so lucky. And women even say it about their bloody partners, like, I'm really lucky because my partner's a stay-at-home dad. There is so much difference between a stay-at-home dad and a stay-at-home mum.

• 17:09Speaker 00

  Like there is so much difference between a working mum and a working dad. It is just, it's not fair.

• 17:15Jamie Laing?

  But bring that down quickly, just so.

• 17:17Speaker 00

  So a working mum goes to work, comes home and the kids are immediately her full responsibility. Whether she likes it or not, they're obsessed with their mum. I love it, but it's true. Like a working man might come home, sit down on the sofa, the kids aren't bothered, they're already doing something else. And they're like, dad's gone to work. Dad, hello daddy, you know, not like immediately, can you do this for me? Can you do this for me? Can you do this for me? As soon as he walks in the door, like they are like that with a working mum. And then the same with the stay-at-home mums. It's incessant. You get that all day. It's like, can I have my favourite food? Can I do this? And all the kids up all night with a temperature. They don't, they want their mum.

• 17:57Speaker 00

  And there are obviously exceptions. Of course there are, because there always is for every single rule. But in general, it, it isn't fair. And, um.

• 18:09Jamie Laing?

  But do you think that's in.

• 18:11Speaker 00

  We're burning out. That's all I was, that was my last conclusion.

• 18:33Speaker 00

  Hi, it's Paloma Faith. My podcast, Mad, Sad and Bad, is back for season four. I'm sitting down with some amazing people, including Letitia Wright.

• 18:42Speaker 01

  When I'm really fearful of something, I just run towards it.

• 18:45Speaker 00

  Judy Love. I'm celibate. Out of choice. Yeah, I could get it any day. Grace Campbell. Here we have Anita, who's a dog psychic.

• 18:53Speaker 06

  Tell Eddie, stop barking when I'm. She said you're too noisy.

• 18:57Speaker 00

  And plenty more. Mad, Sad and Bad with me, Paloma Faith. Listen now wherever you get your podcasts.

• 19:03Speaker 02

  Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AIs built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalised AI for the way we work.

• 19:22Speaker 07

  That means less time on the work around the work and more time finding the stories worth talking about.

• 19:26Speaker 02

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• 19:33Speaker 07

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