S2E35: Soraya's Story Part One | Talk Tracks

When Soraya was born, her parents knew something wasn’t right. What followed was years of medical uncertainty, countless specialists, and a diagnosis that never came. But alongside Soraya's physical challenges emerged something equally extraordinary: vivid experiences with the non-physical world, messages from loved ones who had passed on, and moments her family still cannot explain. In Part One of this special two-part conversation, Ky sits down with Soraya and her parents, Tasha and Safi, to explore their remarkable journey through disability, faith, and the possibility that consciousness extends far beyond what we can see. Part Two premieres next Wednesday. For more information and to donate towards research targeting Soraya's illness, click here: https://together.uw.edu/campaign/taok1 ________________ Join The Telepathy Tapes Backstage Pass to get ad-free episodes, never-before-heard interviews, behind-the-scenes documentary footage, and access to our private Discord community. This is your invitation to come closer. To help shape what’s next. To be more than a listener… to be a co-creator of this paradigm shift. So if you’ve felt moved, if you’ve felt seen, if you’ve felt the call—subscribe today and join us: https://thetelepathytapes.com/ ________________ Thank you to our sponsors! First Day https://firstday.com/- For a limited time only, our listeners are getting an insane deal. Use code TAPES to get up to 57% Off and a free gift at FirstDay.com https://firstday.com/. Lola Blankets https://lolablankets.com/ - For a limited time, our listeners can get 40% OFF select Lola Blankets products with code TAPES at checkout, go to lolablankets.com https://lolablankets.com/. One Skin https://www.oneskin.co/TAPES - Get 15% off OneSkin with the code TAPES at https://www.oneskin.co/TAPES #oneskinpod. Luminara https://www.luminara.care/ - If you’re curious about energy healing and ready to experience it for yourself, Luminara is offering 20% off your first session for listeners of The Telepathy Tapes. Just go to luminara.care https://www.luminara.care/ and use code TAPES20. Quince https://www.quince.com/tapes - Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to Quince.com/tapes https://www.quince.com/tapes for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Chilipad http://www.sleep.me/TELEPATHY - Visit www.sleep.me/TELEPATHY http://www.sleep.me/TELEPATHY to get up to $255 off your Chilipad 2.0 with code TELEPATHY. Order it today with free shipping and try it out for 30-days with an option for free return if you don’t like it with their sleep trial. Prolon https://prolonlife.com/TAPES - Ready for your own reset? For a limited time, Prolon is offering Telepathy Tapes listeners 15% off site-wide plus a $40 bonus gift when you subscribe to their 5-Day Program! Visit ProlonLife.com/TAPES https://prolonlife.com/TAPES. AeroFlow http://aeroflowurology.com/tapes - Stop paying out-of-pocket. AeroFlow offers medical-grade supplies, like diapers, pull-ups, and wipes, all covered by your insurance. See if you qualify in under two minutes at aeroflowurology.com/tapes http://aeroflowurology.com/tapes. Omaha Steaks http://OmahaSteaks.com - Get flavorful, high-quality proteins delivered by visiting OmahaSteaks.com http://OmahaSteaks.com, plus $35 off when you use promo code TAPES at checkout. Ka'Chava https://kachava.com - Go to https://kachava.com and use code TAPES for 15% off your first order. Progressive http://Progressive.com - Drivers who switch and save with Progressive save over $900 on average. Visit Progressive.com http://Progressive.com and see if you can enjoy a little cash back. BiOptimizers https://bioptimizers.com/tapes - Make this the year you finally get your sleep, your energy, and yourself back. Get 15% off at https://bioptimizers.com/tapes when you use my code, TAPES. Ruggable http://RUGGABLE.com - Refresh your home. Get 10% off your first order, sitewide, with promo code TAPES at RUGGABLE.com http://RUGGABLE.com. Grow Therapy http://GrowTherapy.com/TAPES - Whatever challenges you’re facing, Grow Therapy is here to help. Visit GrowTherapy.com/TAPES http://GrowTherapy.com/TAPES today to get started. Shopify http://Shopify.com/tapes - Start your business today with the industry’s best business partner, Shopify. Sign up for your one-dollar-per-month trial today at Shopify.com/tapes http://Shopify.com/tapes. TruDiagnostic http://TruDiagnostic.com - Right now, listeners can get 20% off at TruDiagnostic.com http://TruDiagnostic.com using code TAPES at checkout. Choose TruAge, TruHealth, or the Combo Kit, as a one-time purchase or subscription. Zenni http://Zenni.com/podcast - If your glasses are overdue for a refresh, go to Zenni.com/podcast http://Zenni.com/podcast and use code PODCAST15 for 15% off your first order. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Network freedom and flexibility. That's what you want in a healthcare plan. With a Humana Medicare Advantage PPO plan, you can see any doctor in the country who accepts Medicare, including specialists. No referrals. No kidding. Learn more at gethumana.com. See any doctor who accepts Medicare and is willing to bill Humana. Humana PPOs may not be available in all areas. Benefits and costs share may vary. Humana is a Medicare Advantage PPO organization with a Medicare contract. Enrollment in any Humana plan depends on contract renewal.

• 0:33Ky Dickens?

  Hi, everyone. I'm Kai Dickens, and welcome to The Talk Tracks, brought to you weekly by TTT Media. In this series, we explore the threads that weave together our understanding of reality, science, spirituality, consciousness, and even unexplained phenomena. Because every era has ideas once dismissed as impossible until someone was willing to investigate them seriously. And on this show, we do just that. If you want to see our incredible guests in person, we have a video version of this episode on the Telepathy Tapes YouTube page. Today, we have Tasha and Safi and their daughter Soraya. Soraya is a proud disability advocate, and for most of her life, she's been struggling through an undiagnosed condition.

• 1:17Ky Dickens?

  It's been very difficult for their family, and today, we're going to talk about their journey and Soraya's incredible experiences with the other side and the non-physical world that has really changed what her family believes is possible. So, right now, on the couch, we have Tasha and Soraya, and later, we'll bring in Safi, Soraya's dad. This is your moment to say whatever you want into the world.

• 1:36Speaker 02

  Uh-oh.

• 1:37Speaker 00

  Oh, no.

• 1:39Ky Dickens?

  So, why don't we first start by just introducing both of you? For you, like, what grade are you in? Or how old you are? Where you live? Where you're from? Who's in your family? Just a quick intro.

• 1:49Speaker 03

  Okay. My name is Soraya, and I am 13 years old. And I'm in what grade?

• 1:58Ky Dickens?

  You're in eighth grade.

• 1:59Speaker 03

  Eighth grade. Sorry, forget what grade I'm in sometimes.

• 2:03Ky Dickens?

  That's okay.

• 2:04Speaker 02

  And I'm Tasha. I'm Soraya's mom. I'm a mom to three girls. So Soraya's a middle sister. She's got an older sister who's 16, a younger sister who's 11. I am also a pediatrician and book author.

• 2:19Ky Dickens?

  And your husband's a doctor as well, correct?

• 2:21Speaker 02

  Yes. He is an orthopedic cancer surgeon. Yes.

• 2:24Ky Dickens?

  Wow. And when you walked in today, let me restate that, when you rolled in today, you had a very cool sign on the back of your wheelchair. Can you tell me what your sign said and why you put it there?

• 2:34Speaker 03

  Okay, so since I have like social anxiety and people stare or they say, look, that's a wheelchair. My um, sounds like if you have any questions about like my disability or my wheelchair, ask me and like I've been asked those questions and so I was like, like I just did not want to go out of the car because of social anxiety and staring and kind of stuff that made me couldn't think that. And I was like, literally telling my mom, I was like, please write it down. I can not leave this car because I just can't do it. I just can't.

• 3:17Ky Dickens?

  I have social anxiety too. I think a lot of us do, right? It's hard being in a new place or new people.

• 3:22Speaker 03

  Definitely. Because like I'm quiet sometimes and then I talk a lot. It just kind of depends.

• 3:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. Awesome. So let's talk a little bit about your history. Like maybe Tasha, tell us about when Soraya was born.

• 3:34Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 3:35Ky Dickens?

  And maybe we can talk a little bit about like your, your journey, like growing up, what you wanted to be, you know, what you wanted to do, like what your dreams were and then how, how and when the diagnosis came into play and how that affected you and your family.

• 3:48Speaker 02

  Yes, and I can tell some of the history and um, just for those that are listening, sometimes it takes a lot for Soraya to talk and as

• 3:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, we're gonna go back and forth.

• 3:57Speaker 02

  Yes. And it's never to cut Soraya off, but her mouth sometimes gets tired just from talking. And so when um, she was born, we actually were not aware that she was going to have any medical issues or any additional needs. But when she was born, she was born smaller than we expected. And so that was a surprise. Um, mostly because I'm a pediatrician and so I felt pretty hyper vigilant about all of the things that I was putting into my body, everything. And so when she was born smaller than her sister, it raised a little bit of a concern for me. I was very much quickly reassured that it was, you know, just in my head, just overthinking things.

• 4:37Speaker 02

  And um, I also felt like when I breastfed that she got tired really easily. And again, I was kind of quickly reassured. You just graduated, you're overthinking this, she's fine.

• 4:49Speaker 02

  Fast forward to the two-month appointment of her well-child visit. I could not get her to take a bottle and I had to go back to work full-time. And I brought this up to the pediatrician and at that time, she's like, you're just so good at breastfeeding. She's not going to starve herself when you have to take her to daycare. So, fast forward, four-month appointment now. I've been back at work for a month and my 10-hour workdays. She's being force-fed one ounce by the daycare workers and I'm nursing her throughout the night. We get to the appointment and she is what we call failure to thrive. She is not gaining weight. And I am feeling, like many mothers, like I'm not doing enough and this is my fault. And so I'm told.

• 5:30Ky Dickens?

  And what month checkup was this?

• 5:32Speaker 02

  Four months.

• 5:32Ky Dickens?

  Four months.

• 5:33Speaker 02

  Go ahead and feed her solid food. And as a pediatrician, you know, we say you can give food at four months. But I felt like she wasn't like, strong enough and wasn't ready. But at that point, I just was like, do what you're, what you're told. I surrendered and I'm like, fine, I will do it. And so, we gave her solid food. I don't know what about it made me want to record it. It's almost like I knew it wasn't going to go well. And I recorded it and she was sweating and she started making this noise like, ugh! And that noise is actually called strider. And at that point, it was my like, stopping point where I recorded it, I sent it to the pediatrician and I said, I want a swallow study ordered.

• 6:14Speaker 02

  Granted, I had no idea what I was looking for, but I just like, knew that like, there was something. I was like, I know, there's something going on. And at five months, when she did the swallow study, it was shown that she was aspirating, which just means that it's going down into her lungs versus her stomach. That in itself led to a lot of red flags because now we have a child that's not gaining weight, that is sweating with feeds, feeding difficulties, and aspirating. And it sets off a whole bunch of, what diagnosis is this? So it went from nobody being concerned to, we actually think she has some rare condition that could actually shorten her life. And the first thing they thought it was, was something called spinal muscular atrophy, which at that time, there was not a cure.

• 6:59Speaker 02

  For and so they were actually preparing us that she would pass away in the first year of life.

• 7:04Ky Dickens?

  Oh my gosh.

• 7:05Speaker 02

  We were stationed out in Virginia at that time. My husband's former military. And he had just gotten his orders to serve in Afghanistan. And so we were meeting with genetic counselors, meeting with everybody like, okay, are you going to try to have another child? If if Soraya passes away and all these questions like.

• 7:22Ky Dickens?

  Jeez.

• 7:23Speaker 02

  We went from nothing to everything and we got in for a lot of testing. The SMA testing was negative. Then they looked for other diseases like adrenal leukotis, Rett syndrome, Zellweger's disease, disorders of neurotransmitters. All of these things that I had briefly learned about for my board exams that I knew were all bad. And they were all negative, which was great. However, as two physicians trying to navigate life, we wanted to really try to fix this. And it became very evident after a three year journey of looking for every type of testing that was coming back inconclusive that we were likely not going to have an answer.

• 8:04Speaker 02

  But even more so than not having a diagnosis, realizing that this wasn't going away. Her treatment really was therapies, speech, OT, physical therapy. We had nine subspecialists at that time because we knew every system of her body was impacted. But she was making enough progress where we had no signs that her life was going to be limited. But we also had no signs that this was going away.

• 8:30Ky Dickens?

  How was she eating at that time? Not to cut you off.

• 8:32Speaker 02

  No, she ended up getting a G tube at seven months of age and she still has one today. So she, this is a part of her that we absolutely love the G tube in the sense of it's kept her alive.

• 8:45Speaker 03

  Like literally everyone asks me like, can you eat food? Yes, I can eat food.

• 8:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think a lot of times it's almost like the wheelchair where people see you in a wheelchair and they assume that you cannot walk if you have a wheelchair. And they see you with the G tube that you must not be able to eat at all. Where there's a, there's a nice mix. So up until age three, we had gone on this odyssey. And then we actually got to a place of acceptance where, all right, she has something. But she's doing well. It's time to create some new dreams. And we ended up moving to Cincinnati from where we were stationed in Virginia because they have one of the best children's hospitals and it's actually where I trained for my residency. And so it was that nice comfort of being back in the Midwest. And

• 9:29Ky Dickens?

  It's best.

• 9:30Speaker 02

  Yes. And we knew that they were used to seeing the zebras. And what I mean by that is the rare. We wanted to be surrounded by people that were interested in cutting edge science, research, therapies. And there we landed and we planned on this life where Soraya may live with us forever and or she may not. Or she may work at the mall. We knew that she would do something in customer service you wanted to do.

• 9:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 9:58Speaker 02

  Lots of things, I feel.

• 10:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, and my doctor did say like I might be living for a long time.

• 10:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, we, we don't know.

• 10:06Speaker 03

  I hope that stays that way.

• 10:07Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 10:08Speaker 03

  For the rest of my life, but

• 10:09Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 10:09Speaker 03

  You never know if the unexpected is gonna come in.

• 10:12Ky Dickens?

  So Soraya, what do you want to be when you grow up?

• 10:15Speaker 03

  Okay. I think it was a, like, I was kind of more of a figuring out what I want, what, what do I, what's my life's, like, lifestyle. And I was like, well, let's see. I, this is like a lot of jobs. I was thinking, it's like, maybe I should have three jobs, maybe.

• 10:38Ky Dickens?

  That's pretty typical in today's society.

• 10:40Speaker 03

  I was like, you know what, let's just do something because I just, I like to be that ambitious kind of person. And I was like, you know what, name me a hairstylist and I'll, will be a singer. And then I was like, kind of figuring out everything, I think. The other one is makeup artist. Yeah, I think those were the three ones I wanted to do. And like, I always talk about my dream lifestyle, like, we were talking about that in the car.

• 11:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:13Speaker 03

  About like, what cars do I want or just something like that.

• 11:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, we learned that she wants a motorcycle.

• 11:18Speaker 03

  Um.

• 11:20Ky Dickens?

  Or a Jeep.

• 11:21Speaker 02

  And how are you doing now?

• 11:23Speaker 03

  I think it's definitely a overwhelming, definitely challenging in my physical life because I was not expecting what's gonna, what was happening in my health, kind of.

• 11:39Speaker 03

  Like lifestyle and I did, I, I don't know what it's gonna look like, but hopefully it's good.

• 11:47Ky Dickens?

  How do you feel in your body during the day? Do you feel discomfort?

• 11:52Speaker 03

  Okay, so.

• 11:53Ky Dickens?

  And you can be honest.

• 11:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, because it's like also this year too. Um, I think sometimes my muscle is physically tight, sometimes I can feel it, sometimes I don't. But, um, usually I'm tired, wiped, but definitely talking a lot. And on my screen a lot.

• 12:19Ky Dickens?

  Like she used to be out and about, she used to be walking and moving a lot.

• 12:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, I used to go outside and do kid stuff.

• 12:26Ky Dickens?

  Sometimes when a body starts to feel physically restrained or limited, other things open up for us that are more in the spiritual realm or mental realm. Has any of that happened for you?

• 12:37Speaker 03

  I def- I do have spirituality, um, for a pretty like age. And I think I told my parents like, hey, I see spirits or anything like that. Um, I've experienced it still now more often and it's common in our personal family. But like sometimes we will see like lights or like other things that are so-called like miracles.

• 13:08Ky Dickens?

  And Tasha, when was the first time you heard Soraya start talking about this type of thing? And what was the fir- what were the first few?

• 13:15Speaker 03

  Because I, I had, I was not ready to tell them quite yet. But when I was ready, I was like, hey, I have spirituality and I haven't told you guys that.

• 13:30Ky Dickens?

  What do you mean by I have spirituality?

• 13:32Speaker 03

  So I call it spirituality because like.

• 13:37Ky Dickens?

  I think it's hard for you to name what it is and I think that people call it different things.

• 13:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, people can call it like energies, people can just like, I think every people who have spirituality experience it way differently. Me is more, I'm more in that unique kind of opponent.

• 13:57Speaker 03

  And like, I can like, I don't see what they're wearing, but I can hear them. I can hear footsteps or air moving back and forth. And that happens a lot with me. And it's part of my life that I personally was not expecting. And I think a lot of like, I see like my family members or I would see like my dad's friends or my dad's, my mom's uncle

• 14:41Speaker 03

  that used to party a lot. And my mom's like,

• 14:46Speaker 02

  That's a different story. That's a whole different story. I'll tell you the story behind that.

• 14:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, we'll tell the story behind that.

• 14:56Ky Dickens?

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• 15:41Ky Dickens?

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• 16:06Speaker 00

  Network freedom and flexibility. That's what you want in a healthcare plan. With a Humana Medicare Advantage PPO plan, you can see any doctor in the country who accepts Medicare, including specialists. No referrals, no kidding. Learn more at gethumana.com. See any doctor who accepts Medicare and is willing to bill Humana. Humana PPOs may not be available in all areas. Benefits and costs share may vary. Humana is a Medicare Advantage PPO organization with a Medicare contract. Enrollment in any Humana plan depends on contract renewal.

• 16:43Speaker 02

  When did you start seeing, was it just spirits or were there like angels and energy and orbs? Like what were the, what's the palette of what you would see?

• 16:50Speaker 03

  I think I would see a person like, I definitely give example, like I was telling my mom this name and we searched it and it was a real person that was giving heart to another woman. But we, on there, they didn't really say how she died. But I think she had a heart condition and so that was like really unexpected. I think.

• 17:19Speaker 02

  Like she was able to give us a name, a first name and a last name.

• 17:23Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 17:24Speaker 02

  Of somebody that she had connected with. And then I looked, and then I looked up the name and there was an article of this teen female who there, she had passed away and her family had donated her heart to another woman. And so that really impacted us as parents.

• 17:42Speaker 03

  I was not expecting that.

• 17:44Speaker 02

  Okay, okay. And that was your new friend for a while.

• 17:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, and I still see it in my house or anywhere or like anyone who had a person pass away, I would. Automatically could tell what they're saying, or I would get a number, or

• 18:03Speaker 02

  When she says automatically, she can do it all the time. Like, I can ask her about anybody and she can take a second to

• 18:10Speaker 03

  Like a couple of minutes.

• 18:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, and, and there has been times where she's like, no, that person won't. So it's not like, it's not just what Soraya wants to do. And I'm starting to learn more as she shares in the way that Soraya shares. But she, from it sounds like it, is just open. So like, when she's in our house, she says, "Oh, there's so many that are here." And I always say, if you're overwhelmed, I hear, and I'm trying to learn so I can like, guide her, that you can like, close that off if it's overstimulated. She's like, nope, I don't mind it. And then

• 18:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, I still do it.

• 18:50Speaker 02

  I will say, the first time that my husband and I realized that there is some sort of connection with Soraya to the other side was actually when she was a baby. And this was in a moment of my pure utmost desperation. She was an infant, and when she was an infant, she would not sleep. And we would have to tube feed her every three hours, but she had reflux, so then she would throw up. Then we would have to look at how much she threw up and try again through her G-tube and hold her upright for another hour. And so the whole process of feeding her every three hours was about an hour and a half.

• 19:34Speaker 02

  And I could not get her to calm down, and it was my turn. And I was sobbing as she was sobbing, and I literally was praying and saying, "God, I cannot do this anymore." Like, I cannot, I don't have it in me to do this. Like, I, people say, "God doesn't give you what you can't handle." And I'm like, "I, I can't do, I can't do this." And I had texted my husband, I'm like, "I know it's not your turn. Can you tag me out? I just, I just can't." And so he came, and then he had put Soraya down, even though she was crying, to check on me. And so she's crying in her room, we've got the baby monitor on. And I'm sobbing and I'm like, I'm at my wits end. I'm not strong anymore. I can't do this.

• 20:17Speaker 02

  And I look at the camera and there is this white light that is stroking Soraya while she is calming down and it was there for hours.

• 20:29Ky Dickens?

  Calming her down?

• 20:30Speaker 02

  Calming her down.

• 20:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:31Speaker 02

  And we recorded this.

• 20:33Ky Dickens?

  This is making me cry. I've never heard anything like this in my life.

• 20:36Speaker 02

  I, I, I literally, I am being a little bit more censored of the feelings that I had at that moment of my desperation of like really wanting to give up, I will say.

• 20:48Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 20:49Speaker 02

  Really asking for help, but then also really truly believing that there was no help. And um, so like it was that kind of desperation. This wasn't like a bad day. This was like trying to imagine what our life would look like on very little sleep. Trying to keep up with our jobs, trying to keep up with this trajectory of life that we thought was going to be our life. And um, so at that moment, we felt like that moment was so sacred that we recorded it, but only showed her grandparents. And um,

• 21:28Speaker 02

  both sides of grandparents are very devout in their faiths. And so they were like, this is a great sign, like just take it for, for what it is. And we also are very protective of how we share this information, which is why we love what you do in the sense of like not to exploit this. This is something beautiful that I do think all of us have the ability. Or maybe not, maybe those that are.

• 21:52Speaker 03

  It depends.

• 21:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, I guess I should ask Soraya. She has some ideas on this.

• 21:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 21:56Speaker 02

  But that was the first time. When she started talking, she would talk about somebody that was with her. And so we always kind of joked that it was like her imaginary friend. And, and when I would say like, oh, how long has this person been with you? And she's like, oh, they're with me when I sleep. They, I was like, do they go to school with you? She's like, yeah. And I'm like, well, how long have they been with you? She's like, since I was inside of your belly. And so then it was kind of like, okay, she might be right. Like I, I never doubt her. Like I think that's the other thing is I never challenge. I just keep it. Open and around that.

• 22:30Speaker 03

  Yeah, you take it as it is.

• 22:31Speaker 02

  I take it as it is. And in that same time, um, you know, her older sister would would talk about bright lights that she would see. And then there was a time where her older sister stopped talking about it. And she was like, I don't see him anymore. I wish I could. And so there was always something about.

• 22:49Speaker 03

  And she still doesn't talk about it.

• 22:50Speaker 02

  Yeah. I, I, you know, what is it about being younger? Being more fearless, being more unfiltered. And then as she got older, it's not that she would tell us much, but there was a time where we're sitting at the table. And I have this uncle that Soraya never met. He actually died when I was 12. He is the best. I will start by saying that. He was like a father to me. So my, my parents were divorced and my mom was a single mom and she moved in with her brother, which is this uncle. So, um, he was like a dad. And he was so kind. And every night he would put me to bed and he would say, all right, while everybody's sleeping, I'm gonna come wake you up. You and me are gonna go party. We're gonna party all night or all everybody else is sleeping.

• 23:34Speaker 03

  Yeah, this is, we're talking, that's what I'm talking about.

• 23:37Speaker 02

  And he also was a chain smoker in the eighties and just smoked nonstop. And so we're sitting at the table one day. And again, Soraya doesn't really know about this uncle or any stories about him. Other than I hadn't, I had uncles that have passed away. So she's sitting there and she's like, Mom. And she starts doing this movement with her hands, which I've never seen her do. She's like, your uncle. And like a smoking. Yes, right. But I didn't know what she was doing. She's like, your uncle is so kind and funny. And I'm like, which uncle? And then she's like, you know, the one that passed away on your mom's side. And I'm still like, there's more than one. And she's still doing this. She's like, the one that smoked all the time.

• 24:18Speaker 02

  And I was like, oh, my God, I know exactly who you're talking about. And, and I said, okay, well, what's he saying? And she's like, he's the partier. And that, that word is our word. And when my husband's, one of his best friends had passed away, um, this was a, a Navy colleague. She really gave.

• 24:41Speaker 02

  Some speeches from him, but it was like.

• 24:45Speaker 03

  And like visible letters.

• 24:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, like she.

• 24:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 24:50Speaker 02

  She would talk like how he was talking, although it would be her voice. But it's almost like the language that she would use was so much more fluent than what she is capable of with her speech delays. Um, she would say like, hey, brother. I'm really proud of you. Like you've got a good life with this family. I'm really proud of the surgeon that you've become. And these are things that she doesn't even have context of their relationship. You know, they might be like one liners, but they. They were meaningful. And so that really hit me where then I was like, oh, can you do that?

• 25:30Ky Dickens?

  What did you mean by do that?

• 25:31Speaker 02

  Like, can you connect with people like, can you? And she said, yeah.

• 25:36Ky Dickens?

  On the other side.

• 25:36Speaker 02

  On the other side. And. It was just kind of overwhelming.

• 25:42Ky Dickens?

  Hi. Come on in, Dad. We can even ask you a few questions too, before we.

• 25:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's okay if you're on the camera, because.

• 25:49Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:50Speaker 03

  I don't want to be able to see my YouTube, so.

• 25:53Speaker 02

  He's the skeptic, just so you know.

• 26:07Ky Dickens?

  So Safi, Soraya's dad, just joined us for a few.

• 26:10Speaker 04

  Hello.

• 26:11Ky Dickens?

  Answers and questions. Um, so Safi, why don't you introduce yourself and what you do for a living?

• 26:16Speaker 04

  Sure. Uh, my name is Safi Fruchy. Uh, I'm actually an orthopedic hand surgeon, uh, in Cincinnati, Ohio. And more importantly, I'm the father of three beautiful girls, including Soraya. And I'm Tasha's less smart half.

• 26:31Ky Dickens?

  Um, your wife is the coolest.

• 26:33Speaker 04

  She is.

• 26:34Ky Dickens?

  Um, she told us a story and I'd love for you to retell it because I thought there's two stories she told that were pretty remarkable. The first one being when she was at wit's end, when, and Soraya was having a hard time eating when she was little. Do you remember that story?

• 26:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 26:47Ky Dickens?

  And what happened and? Like, did it feel real to you?

• 26:51Speaker 04

  Yes, so like, um, one of the things that we really kind of had to struggle with initially is that, so Tash described exactly kind of how the nighttime would go, but that's exactly what we would do. We did that for four and a half, almost five years. So like, literally every night, one of us was up most of the night, and in the daytime, we'd go and work. And so, um, in one of those experiences, it's just Sarah I was really struggling. And, you know, it's so, it was disheartening every time we would give her her feeds and then she would throw up because that would automatically mean there was going to be a longer time for her to not be sleeping. And she's gonna, we'd have to rock her, like, literally, we would

• 27:34Speaker 04

  rock her for, for almost, I mean, it ended up being days and weeks and months if you like, add it up. Um, so like, that particular evening, like, when she was crying and both of us were at a point where like, this is, um, almost not sustainable. Like, we're not sleeping, like, neither one of us, and we gotta work full time. And like, I'm operating during the day, and then I'm not sleeping at night, and then like, getting the rest which you can, you nap when you can. But like, you know, in that moment, like, when the monitor kind of got quiet, like, it was, you know, I didn't honestly know, like, I, you know, full, full disclosure, I'm, I'm a super skeptic, like, scientific kind of

• 28:17Speaker 04

  minded person. And so like, I am, I usually try to find things that I can't explain, usually try to find what is a scientific justification for do that. Then there's certain things, of course, you can't, like, if you are religious in any way, by definition, the definition of faith is belief in the unseen, right? So like, there has to be some level of acceptance of things that are perhaps not able to be explained by science, but I'm still like a science scientist at back, at heart. But, like, when we were looking at the monitor, um, it really did. It looked like a, a white light that was actually traveling back and forth over the area of the crib, right where she was. And then she stopped crying. And like, it was, like, for me,

• 28:59Speaker 04

  Like almost disconcerting because I'm like, wow, what, what is happening? Like, is this like, is this a good thing or a bad thing? That was the first thing I thought in my mind. I was like, it's great that she's not crying. But like, what, what exactly is that, right? And so when we took the video, like, you know, I, you know, my, my, my folks are pretty religious and as are my wife's parents. And so like, I said it really more for like, the concept of like, like, can you help me process? Like, what am I looking at here? Because what I'm seeing is something that is soothing my daughter. That is, I, I, I mean, I went in there. I mean, like, I was the first one. I was like, I'm gonna go upstairs. And I went in there myself with my own eyes. There's nothing I can see. There's nothing visible that I can physically see in the room. And then, but she's quiet.

• 29:44Speaker 04

  She's not crying. And so like, come back down and still there, still there on the monitor.

• 29:49Ky Dickens?

  So you can see the monitor, but not in real life?

• 29:51Speaker 04

  I could see the monitor, but I couldn't.

• 29:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, it didn't want to show itself, I feel like.

• 29:53Speaker 04

  I couldn't see it in real life. And so like, you know, like my, you know, I had, my dad was like, listen, he's like, you know, there are things that we can't explain, but I don't feel like something that is soothing Soraya is going to be something that you have to worry about. But it's not something that I would say like, let's advertise this to everyone in the whole world. Like this is this me, this is like just for you guys. This is like, just, this is a, hopefully a sign that things are at some point, you know, you, you're going to be able to manage like what feels to be unmanageable, you know? And so I, I think that it was, it was, it was, um, in my look retrospective, look, look, look back at it. It was pretty, pretty incredible, like, because it doesn't, it didn't make a lot of sense to me then. And not, it doesn't make sense to me now, like what exactly that was, so.

• 30:37Ky Dickens?

  What faith background did you guys grow up in?

• 30:39Speaker 04

  So both, um, I, we are devout Muslim. And so like, you know, they're growing up, that's exactly kind of, I was.

• 30:48Speaker 03

  We're like half. For my dad's side, half Indian and then my mom's side, half Bangladesh.

• 30:56Speaker 04

  Right, so you're.

• 30:57Speaker 03

  A type of Muslim.

• 30:58Speaker 04

  So, so, so my love, yes, that you, you are half Indian and half Bangladeshi. That is a true statement. Both of my parents of India, both Natasha's parents are from Bangladesh.

• 31:07Ky Dickens?

  So your parents were like, okay, we think it's a safe thing. We're not, okay. Yeah.

• 31:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, and, and that this is something that like, I think that is, is, um, it's not a negative, right? Like, like I think that, you know, sometimes things happen that we can't explain that especially like in, in, in, if, if there's any bit of a negative connotation, it can be a little bit disconcerting, right? I mean, like, Sarai watches a lot of like shows about hauntings and things of that nature.

• 31:36Speaker 03

  And haunted houses.

• 31:37Speaker 04

  And haunted houses and like she is not scared by these things, but while I'm doing her meds and we're seeing the Annabelle doll. Like, like it, it, it's a little different thing. I'm like, I'm not sure if that could be classified as, that's awesome. That's good, you know, like there is something a little bit disconcerting about that, but this wasn't that.

• 31:54Ky Dickens?

  So tell me about like what, you know, Sarai clearly has a deep connection with the other side. That's very real. And when did you start to believe that what she was seeing and experiencing wasn't made up? Like that she was probably really connecting with people on the other side.

• 32:11Speaker 04

  So it took Sarai a long time to learn how to talk. It took Sarai a long time. Like we, we were, we were wondering if she was going to be able to communicate. And so like, even in the early, early stages of her starting to communicate, sometimes she would say things that I can, I know for a fact that Tasha and I have not said. And at that point, our other kiddos were, it was just me and she was young. She was like five or so. She's not using that language. The people that are coming into the house are not using that language. And so like, can't explain that. So that was like, like my first kind of clue. I'm like, okay, I don't, can't explain that.

• 32:48Ky Dickens?

  And what would be like something that maybe she would say even?

• 32:51Speaker 04

  So, so like the first time, um.

• 32:55Speaker 04

  I distinctly remember this, like there was a device that we got called a stander. And so a stander is when you cannot bear weight. It kind of helps try to build like not just bone health, but the ability to kind of stand up. It's the first time I got it in our house. Like it really depressed me because it is actually a, it's a physical representation of something that I know has not a good long-term outcome. Like I'm an orthopedic surgeon by trade. Like we use standards in kids with cerebral palsy and things of that, that can never walk or really struggle walking. And so like, you know, in that moment, like Soraya had, I want to say she was maybe three and maybe two and a half or three, not saying too many words.

• 33:40Speaker 04

  And she, clear as day, you know, said in no distinct terms, because I remember, because I was sitting in the kitchen and she was over and she looked at me, she's like, Dad, it's okay. This is okay. And I have not heard, at that point, I had not heard those words, like literally coming out of her mouth in that way. It was a very distinct, at that point, it was like one word, barely answers, not sure if she's understanding. But then I didn't hear anything like that for a while. And so like, in that moment, I did need that, there's no doubt. Like, but the thing is, I wasn't talking about it. It wasn't like I was like walking in the house and like, oh my God, I can't believe this thing's in the house. And like you could infer that what I'm thinking, I was just looking at him.

• 34:25Speaker 04

  I was sitting in the kitchen, we had an island kitchen, it's like a little window, you could look down to the family room and I was just staring at it. That's it.

• 34:31Ky Dickens?

  So interesting.

• 34:32Speaker 04

  And so like those type of things, like slowly but surely, I'm like, I don't understand those things. But I cannot find good solutions other than gotta take it at face value. Because how else can you possibly explain it?

• 34:45Ky Dickens?

  For both of you, maybe you just give like a quick snapshot of what in the Islam faith, people believe about the afterlife and the soul.

• 34:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, I would, I will say I believe in all beliefs. Definitely. And even our history, I love knowing the history.

• 35:05Speaker 04

  And I think that, you know, in Islam, we certainly believe that, you know, like our purpose here on this earth is not just this earth. It's our job here, or our purpose here is to, you know, do as many good deeds as you can. And then at the end, we have a little day of reckoning and we figure out how we do. And I think that, you know, part of that belief and thought process is this concept of the soul. And the soul is like, it is what is, you know, essentially breathed into our body. And it's like, we have a physical representation of who we are, but then you have the soul representation of actually what God has given you. This is who you are. And like, you know, like, in like, in many faith traditions, there is some version of, you know, there is a

• 35:48Speaker 04

  angels that are collecting good deeds and bad deeds and how are you doing? And like, you know, with the thought process that God gives you free will and the ability to do either good things or bad things. And that's up to you to figure out how you want to do. There's obviously different books of faith that can help you try to navigate that, depending on kind of how you, how you, how you think about those things. And so like, I think that for me, like, the concept of the soul is very, it's a very, very distinct and real one. And I, you know, I have been in the room, you know, multiple times in my medical career when people pass away, you know, like we in the hospital. And, you know, we always talk about how it gets cold. There, it, that's, that's a thing. I don't think everybody's ever, I never seen a study where people have quantified the temperatures when somebody passes away.

• 36:33Speaker 04

  But like, there is no doubt, like I have been in the room myself, you can't deny that, and like, in multiple times. So like, I don't know what that is. Okay. So like, so, you know, is it the soul, soul escaping the body and heading back to God, you know? I, unless you truly somehow, you know, had a, got an email from God saying, yep, you're right. This is exactly what it was. You're not going to know, right? And so like, but that is, but that is for me, like, absolutely fundamental. Like, I think that the soul is most definitely an important part of who we are.

• 37:05Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. And then, so your friend's name was Chris, right? I'd love to hear the story, because I think we kind of touched on that, but I think she was kind of waiting for you to share it. So I'd love to, for you to talk about that. And so what was the first experience? And Sarah, if you want to talk about that too, or remember, you know, like,

• 37:23Ky Dickens?

  You know, what experience where you heard Soraya was communicating with Chris after he'd passed?

• 37:28Speaker 04

  So I think that even before that, I think that there was a non-Soraya story that I probably should tell first. So like the day that Chris passed away, he's a very young and healthy human. And he passed away of a massive cardiac event and no rhyme nor reason. I mean, he kind of looks like the Incredible Hulk, like literally. And so Chris, the night that he passed, like I was a mess, as you might imagine.

• 37:55Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, I think.

• 37:56Speaker 04

  And so like.

• 37:57Ky Dickens?

  You were crying, I think?

• 37:58Speaker 04

  I was crying a lot.

• 37:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 38:00Speaker 04

  So, you know, we had like a little trio, me, him and my buddy Rob. And so like Rob had called me and said, like, look, like this is what just happened like last night. And like, you know, it was devastating for me. And so like, I was sitting in our study and I was trying to talk to Tasha, but I was like not in a great place, you know? And like, you know, one of the things that Chris and I, he is, you know, one of the best dads I ever knew. Like Chris is, was the model of how we should be as parents. And so like the most, and one of the most invested humans and his oldest daughter was just starting medical school. She passed away the first week of med school. And like Chris, she wanted to do what he did.

• 38:44Speaker 04

  She wanted to be him and like, and like, or that doesn't be him, but like do what he did. And so like, I remember like talking with Tasha and like, we were like, I was like, I gotta take care of Kelly. I gotta figure out how we're gonna do this. And I was like, you know, like maybe she can come and rotate in Cincinnati. So on it, this is like during the summertime, so clear crystal day.

• 39:06Speaker 04

  The lights in our study went up completely off, completely on, right? And so like, I didn't think much of it when it first happened. I was like, all right, dude, electrical surge, like I don't know what's happening. But so then I said the words like again, and I was like, we have to take care of her. And like, I was like, I'm going to take care of her, lights on, lights off. And again, I was like, okay, so now I'm actually listening. I'm like, I'm not sure what the second one was, but I refuse to believe that this is a coincidence. Like, there's no, there's no storm, there's no wave, the electrical surges are happening. And so I kind of decided to tempt fate a little and I just talked about it again, and this time purposely, lights on,

• 39:48Speaker 04

  lights off, like clearly, like all studies lights off, all studies lights on. So I truly, like, felt, and this is coming from a known skeptic, I was like, Chris is here, or some version of him is here, because like, this is what he would want me to do. And because I know for a fact, if the roles were reversed, Chris would take care of these girls, like, forever. And so like, you know, that, that was the first time. I was like, okay, so like, there is something about Chris, like, he's around, like, in some capacity. I don't know what that is, but he's around in some capacity. So then, like, there was a time where we were at Great Wolf Lodge, and we're, we're, we're going to dinner, I'm sitting next to Soraya,

• 40:29Speaker 04

  and she's like, hey, your friend is here. And I was like, who's my friend? She goes, your friend, Dr. Hogan, he's here. And I was like, oh, I was like, fantastic, I'm glad Chris is here. I have no idea, like, what she's saying. But then she's like, no, no, he's here, and he needs to tell you a few things. So on this, me and her, on the drive from our hotel room to dinner, Soraya starts talking to me about all the things that Chris wants to me to know. And it's stuff that I have never discussed with Soraya, I have never talked with Soraya. It's like Navy stuff, and some of it's like, like, surgery stuff, some of it's like, hey, hey, you know, you, you said something along the lines of, like, good job of keep trying to do the hard cases. Well, the thing is, oh, Chris and I, I mean, he

• 41:14Speaker 04

  was like, an almost a mentor to me, and like, we would do some really difficult stuff together.

• 41:19Ky Dickens?

  In surgery, like in medical?

• 41:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, like medically speaking, like really complex stuff. And like, I never talked to Soraya about that. And so like, by the time I got to the table at Great Wolf Lodge, I was like, this is, um, I was like a little like, um, I don't know what the word is.

• 41:35Ky Dickens?

  What was it like?

• 41:36Speaker 04

  I was pensive because I, I, I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Cause I was like, and I couldn't, in my logical minds, like trying to put that together as if like, okay, so what, what, how does she know this? How is it possible for her to know these particulars of what I'm talking about? Cause I try my best not to talk shop to the girls unless they ask me about something. Because like, I'm a dad first and I'm a surgeon in a far second or third. So like, like it's not something I want them. I, I, I used to give a talk to residents about like, like life balance, right? And like, it's like at the end of your life, you're not going to talk about how many surgeries you did, or how many patients you saw. You're going to be like, essentially four or five things. Like, were you a good human?

• 42:21Speaker 04

  Were you a good son or daughter? Were you a good husband or wife? Were you, were you good to the world? Were you a good father or da, or, or, um, mom? You know, like those are the things that we think about right before we pass. We don't do anything else. So I'm like, I try to do that. And the fact that Soraya was able to like dead on tell me things that I'm like, I, I just, I can't, I don't know what that is, Soraya. But I was like, but again, I, I have to take it full, like a full, full bore. Because it doesn't make any other sense any other way. And so like, I, I actually feel blessed by, by hearing it because I feel, I miss him less because occasionally I'll get something like that. And it's like, okay, you know, and regardless of how I'm trying to frame it, it is still

• 43:01Speaker 04

  really like good to know that, um, that somebody as good as him, uh, is still around in some ways, in some capacity.

• 43:10Ky Dickens?

  Soraya, anything you want to add to any of the stuff your dad just mentioned?

• 43:14Speaker 03

  I feel like for me, I think, I don't know what Mimi said. Chris, I think, I think, I think my brain was like, I think something happened to him. I don't know what it is. And Marion's like, I don't know, but I don't know what happened, but he's here.

• 43:37Speaker 04

  I feel like to this day, I learned from this child and my other two girls every day. Like, like there is something that, some lesson that's taught and like, and I know that other parents have these same lessons from our kids. But like, this one's a little bit different in the way that you hopefully can perceive the world. And like, we don't have to have it in a very rigid way. There are ways that are, that are beyond us that we should be able to at least be semi-open to, to like, think about. Because maybe it makes us better humans.

• 44:07Ky Dickens?

  Wonderful. Um, Sarai, what a great story. I mean, you're such a unbelievable gift and inspiration to so many people. We're going to end today's episode here, but next week, we'll continue Sarai's story. Dive deeper into some truly unexplained experiences and learn more about her unique gifts. You definitely don't want to miss it. That's it for this episode of The Talk Tracks, but new episodes will be released every Wednesday. So stay tuned as we work to unravel all the threads, even the veiled ones that knit together our reality. And please remember to stay kind, stay curious, and that being a true skeptic requires an open mind. To dive in deeper, subscribe to our Backstage Pass by visiting our website.

• 44:47Ky Dickens?

  With it, you'll unlock access to bonus content like telepathy tests, ask me anything interviews with myself and guests. You'll be able to enjoy the podcast ad-free, connect with other members on our Telepathy Tribe Discord, and hear and see exclusive content from the Telepathy Tapes Vault. Visit our website at thetelepathytapes.com for more info on how to subscribe to our Backstage Pass. Thank you to my amazing collaborators, producers Katherine Ellis and Selena Kennedy, technical directing, audio mix and finishing by Jeremy Cole, opening and closing music by Elizabeth P. W., and original logo and cover art by Ben Condor Design. I'm Kai Dickens, your executive producer, writer, and host.