Jocko Underground: Struggling with Measuring Up to Your Fiance's Ex.

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Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Jocko Willink?

  This is the Jocko Underground Podcast number 212. Sitting here with Echo Charles. We have some questions from the field, from you in the field. And we will provide some guidance, some cases, some answers, and at a minimum, some courses of action for you to follow.

• 0:13Speaker 01

  Yep, sounds good.

• 0:15Jocko Willink?

  Get you through this maze of life is what you refer to it as.

• 0:19Speaker 01

  Sometimes, yes, it is a maze for sure.

• 0:21Jocko Willink?

  Alright, let's go.

• 0:22Speaker 01

  Some direction always helps. Alright. First question, Jocko, huge fan of the podcast, been listening since 2016. Never miss an underground pod. Okay, recently I found out from my buddy that my fiance used to date a SEAL before me. Ever since hearing that, I can't help but wonder what the heck she's doing with me. And I feel like I probably come up short in every possible way. How do I accept my newly realized inferiority? And just to get, and just get back on the path of being the best husband and hopefully dad soon. PS, I'm a very average purple belt in jujitsu. So at least I have that going for me.

• 1:04Speaker 01

  Although I routinely get humbled by 15, by 15 year olds at A O J, part of jujitsu, by the way. Um, where I train.

• 1:12Jocko Willink?

  Yeah. Um, cool. Hey, man.

• 1:17Jocko Willink?

  Listen, uh, first of all, being a SEAL doesn't make you a good person.

• 1:26Jocko Willink?

  Doesn't make you a good fighter, doesn't mean that you're smart. It doesn't really mean that you have any positive qualities other than perhaps you will keep going in rough situations. But even that's suspect, um, because there's people that go through BUDs and they skate and they duck boat and, and SEALs are all over the spectrum in every aspects, uh, in their behavior. And so in other words, SEALs are people. And this guy that your fiance dated at some point was just some dude that happened to, uh, have made it through, you know, SEAL training, who wasn't a superhero.

• 2:07Jocko Willink?

  And there's most important and the guy could have been a great guy, could have been terrible because it doesn't really even matter. Like you, it doesn't matter. The fact of the matter is is whether this guy was a great guy and a hero and a, and a stud or not, what that, none of that matters. Like, why are you even thinking about that? Because they're not together anymore. She's with you. So guess who won? Or lack of a better word, I mean, guess who she ended up with? You. So I wouldn't think about it too much. I, you know, don't, don't compare yourself to some myth that's in your head, which by the way, I must remind you that it, if you reveal this,

• 2:51Jocko Willink?

  look real insecure, which isn't going to make your fiancee super stoked, right? Like, the insecurities that come out from this, they seem real weak and, and there's no reason for them. Because whatever the guy did in the past, it doesn't really, whatever some guy that she dated a long time ago, doesn't really matter. Doesn't really matter. So I wouldn't worry about it, man. Honestly. The dude's just a dude. He, he's not some mythological creature that you've built up in your head. He's some random dude that happened to make it through SEAL training.

• 3:33Jocko Willink?

  So he's probably, you know, probably would have been a terrible husband, by the way. There's a 90% divorce rate in the SEAL teams. Not that there's not great dudes in the teams, but there's a lot of dudes that are great SEALs. They're not the best husbands. You wouldn't want them to marry your daughter. I can tell you that. So, yeah, just keep getting after it. Keep training jujitsu. Keep taking care of your girl. Don't worry about this and don't. Yeah, don't, don't think about it. It's not that big of a deal, man. You know, that's the way. What am I missing here? Cause it's gonna be hard for me to answer this question.

• 4:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, cause you're the Navy SEAL.

• 4:10Jocko Willink?

  Yeah, then maybe it is for you. What, what would you say?

• 4:12Speaker 01

  Uh, oh, I would say what you, what you said is correct. I believe. The only thing that I might be, uh, on a, in a different kind of maybe perspective or whatever is I understand what this guy's saying, not from a necessarily, ooh, that guy was a Navy SEAL. But you know how, I think sometimes we trick ourselves or, I don't know, for some reason have this miss like understanding that things that we look up to and respect is something that my fiance or me, even just the woman, the potential girlfriend, whatever, might look up to and like and be attracted to. So like, you know, like guys in the gym, they like, they put on more weight. If a girl is around, you know, like, bruh.

• 4:57Speaker 01

  Girls do not care how much you can bench, you know, like they care if you're strong versus like super weak, of course, but that's sort of it, you know? So if it's like, oh yeah, this guy can bench, uh, three fifteen, right? Three wheels. Hell yeah. Okay. But this other guy, he can do three fifty. She's not gonna be like, oh, I am no longer attracted to the, you know, it doesn't work like that, you know? And I think we make up these, these myths, like I say, in our head that it's like, oh, this guy's a SEAL. So of course somewhere inside of him, he's like, dang, he kind of looks up to that as an idea, you know, and then, so he just assumes maybe subconsciousity that she looks up to it the kind of the same way, but just from a, you know, female, you know, intimate kind of standpoint. And then he feels like this thing, but it's like, yeah, you're right. It's like, so what does that mean at home?

• 5:40Speaker 01

  You know, what does that mean as a husband? What? Like he's fucking sick with his weapon? Like it doesn't make sense. You see what I'm saying? So yeah, and then I think what you said, the, the point of like, okay, how does this translate into being a fiance, husband, dad or whatever? As a Navy SEAL, you said the ninety percent divorce rate is kind of like, okay, that's actually a more of a factor than all these cool missions he probably went on. And as cool as.

• 6:03Jocko Willink?

  Or may or may not have gone on.

• 6:04Speaker 01

  May or may not have gone on, okay. You know, even there, there you go, even additional stuff, you know, to kind of consider. So, so yeah, you know, makes sense. I mean.

• 6:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, that that delusion I think is is.

• 6:17Jocko Willink?

  Did you, did you ever see the movie, uh, I think it's the movie Meet the Fockers? Or it's Meet the Parents?

• 6:23Speaker 01

  Parents, yes.

• 6:24Jocko Willink?

  And Owen Wilson? He plays like the ultimate. Ex boyfriend. And the, the, uh, Robert De Niro like loves him. And I just remember that scene where he's like, he un, he unveils the, the like.

• 6:41Speaker 01

  The HOPA.

• 6:42Jocko Willink?

  What is it called?

• 6:43Speaker 01

  Well, they call it HOPA, but it's a, the.

• 6:45Jocko Willink?

  What you get married.

• 6:46Speaker 01

  Alter, right?

• 6:46Jocko Willink?

  Yeah, like the altar.

• 6:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:48Jocko Willink?

  And he's like, um, oh my gosh, like, how much time did he say? And he's like, oh, it took me a hundred and thirty five man hours. Uh, but you know, it to me, it's just working with your hands. You know, if it's good enough for J C, it's good enough for me. He was a carpenter too. Just everything he says is just so perfect. And what's his name? Ben Stiller.

• 7:08Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 7:09Jocko Willink?

  Who's just the, the lower level dude in this scenario. But the fact of the matter is. Who's she getting married to? She's with Ben Stiller despite his, you know, gross shortcomings in comparison to Owen Wilson. Yeah. Who plays the perfect, uh, dude.

• 7:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:29Jocko Willink?

  So it's kind of the same thing.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  That, oh, it actually, I'll do you, you're more right than you know. I think that was literally an illustration of this exact concept where, but the way they did it was way more appropriate than the Navy SEAL thing. Cause just like I said, the Navy SEAL thing, it's like, that, that's you're comparing apples to oranges. Like a badass dude versus a badass husband is like two different things, you know, in this situation. But in that movie, they chose the things that girls tend to look up, you know, this guy, like, if you look at the, if you watch that scene, there's pictures of them skydiving together, doing all these adventurous things, you know? And he's like, he made all this money, which is a known thing, attraction, like point for girls, you know, so he's super rich, you know, and all this stuff.

• 8:11Speaker 01

  He does all this like interesting stuff, you know, he's a handsome dude or whatever, and the dad likes him, everyone likes him, you know? So it's, it's kind of like. He has a point to be insecure.

• 8:22Jocko Willink?

  Do you remember by chance why they weren't together anymore?

• 8:25Speaker 01

  No.

• 8:26Jocko Willink?

  Like what, what went wrong?

• 8:27Speaker 01

  She's, if I remember correct, she said something, oh, she just simply said I wasn't in love with him.

• 8:32Jocko Willink?

  Oh.

• 8:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:33Jocko Willink?

  Okay.

• 8:34Speaker 01

  That's all she said.

• 8:35Jocko Willink?

  Damn. Yeah. So there you go. It's a good comparison though, right? And in Ben Stiller's mind, he thinks like, bro, I, I can't compete with this dude, but she literally doesn't even love Owen Wilson.

• 8:47Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 8:47Jocko Willink?

  And I'm sorry that I don't know the character names and I'm not trying to attribute these attributions to the actual humans. Even though Owen Wilson, dude, that guy's freaking awesome, dude.

• 8:57Speaker 01

  Cause he was like, and that guy just says in general is he does a really good job in like, you know, playing these characters, but they, they add these little details. That it's like, it would make you super freaking, whether it be jealous, insecure, whatever. Cause he'll be like, oh yeah, she was a tomcat. And he, we had some wild times and he kind of goes into, thinks about it to himself and then Ben Stiller, he's looking at him like, fuck. And then, um, and then he's like, uh, they were playing volleyball. And then she was like, and they were on the same team, the Owen Wilson and the girl. And she was like, he was like, uh, hey, good job, Iceman. They had nicknames for each other. That's when he got jealous, he finally got jealous or whatever. Bruh, I'm telling you, that's real though.

• 9:43Jocko Willink?

  But here's the thing, man. And this is where you gotta kind of get, you gotta get control of the, gotta get control of the, of the damn, uh, of the damn steering wheel here, right? Cause you gotta steer away from like this jealousy and this insecurity, bro. You gotta steer away from that because it is in its own right, what the weakness is.

• 10:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:03Jocko Willink?

  You know, does that make sense? Like if you're insecure, that is the insecurity. The insecurity isn't that this guy might be bigger, stronger, faster, taller, richer than you. That, none of that matters. What actually matters is the one thing that you have control over is, is like, are you going to act insecure?

• 10:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:20Jocko Willink?

  Cause if you are, then throw, you, you break up with her. Cause nothing, it's not going to be good. But if you can be like, oh, cool. I get it. Might be a little bit jealous of that shit, but I'm gonna kinda, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna make a deal out of it. I'm certainly not gonna act it out, which means you have to stay detached enough from your own little like weird uh, uh, uh, control system that you don't steer it the wrong way. You know, well, I don't know. Well, I don't want to go to a party if he's gonna be there. You see what I'm saying?

• 10:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, fully.

• 10:47Jocko Willink?

  Or, no, I don't want to go see this movie about, about Navy SEALs. Might make you think of Fred or, you know what I mean? Like if you do that, you're, you're just, you're, you're, you're revealing the one thing that actually could matter.

• 11:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 11:02Jocko Willink?

  In a negative way. If you're like, bro, yeah. You know, if you just go, yeah, I'll go see that. And she goes, you know, that reminds me of that guy Fred. And you go, oh, who? Well, like I dated a guy. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I forgot about that.

• 11:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:16Jocko Willink?

  If you say it like that, she's all good. If you say it like, well, I don't want to see another one of these movies. It's gonna make you think of him. Like you're just pathetic.

• 11:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:23Jocko Willink?

  So don't do that. Get control of your steering wheel. And listen, I'm not saying you're gonna feel the, you won't feel the pull of the steering wheel.

• 11:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:28Jocko Willink?

  I, I get it. It's, it's, it's part of nature, right? Part of nature. You're looking around. You're gonna be jealous. You're gonna be resentful. You're gonna have all those things. But you don't, you don't let that feeling. So that is a little excerpt of what we are doing on the Jocko Underground Podcast. So if you want to continue to listen,

• 11:50Jocko Willink?

  go to jacood underground.com and subscribe and we're doing this, we're doing this to mitigate our reliance on external platforms. So we are not subject to their control and we are doing this so that we can support the Jocko Podcast, which will remain as is free for all, as long as we can keep it that way. But we, but we are doing this so we don't have to be under the control of sponsors. And we're doing it so we can give you.

• 12:22Jocko Willink?

  More control, more interaction, more direct connections, better communications with us.

• 12:28Jocko Willink?

  And to do that, we are, we're building a website right now where we'll be able to utilize to strengthen this legion of troopers that are in the game with us. So, thank you. It's jockounderground.com. It costs $8.18 a month. And if you can't afford to support us,

• 12:48Jocko Willink?

  we can still support you. Just email [email protected] and we'll get you taken care of. Until then, we will see you mobilized underground.