BigXthaPlug on new music, life after prison, promise to his kids, hating industry, life lessons from his dad, son teaching him patience and why he chooses to be naked.

"I love my fans, I don’t love music or the industry but I do it to provide for my kids.” BigXthaPlug In his first exclusive sit-down ahead of his highly anticipated new album, BigXthaPlug joins The Pivot Podcast for a raw, unfiltered conversation about the man behind the music — and the battles that success can’t silence. From life after prison to navigating fatherhood in the spotlight, BigXthaPlug opens up about his evolving relationship with his parents, the bond he shares with his father and mother, and the life-changing moment he learned his son has autism. He reflects on the responsibilities of being a dad, the sacrifices he makes for his children, and why, despite his frustrations with the music industry, he continues to show up and do what he does for them. But beyond the fame, the hits, and the success, there’s another side of BigXthaPlug that few get to see. He gets candid about struggling with unhappiness and loneliness, searching for peace in the middle of the chaos, and finding comfort in the small moments that make life feel a little lighter. He also shares why therapy isn’t for him and what it looks like to navigate his emotions on his own terms. With the vulnerability and honesty that define The Pivot, this conversation goes beyond the artist to explore the father, the son, and the man still figuring it all out. And for the football fans, BigXthaPlug lets his Texans pride show, proving that even with everything on his plate, he’s still repping Houston. Before the next chapter of his music career begins, BigXthaPlug sits down with Ryan, Channing, and Fred to discuss the weight of success, the realities of fatherhood, and the pursuit of peace in a world that never stops demanding more. This is BigXthaPlug beyond the music — unfiltered, unapologetic, and real. Watch on Netflix for full video episode. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web. Like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration blog. Or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up require compatibility and availability varies 18 plus.

• 0:26Ryan Clark?

  Big X the Plug is different from Xavier. And the truth is, becoming a famous rapper was never Xavier's dream. It became a necessity after the birth of his son. And truthfully, X hasn't seen Xavier in years. And it seems to me, he misses him. He takes care of his entire family and most of them live under his roof. You would think a man surrounded by so many people would never feel alone. But the reality is, the superstar often goes home and cries by himself. It seems that he would love rapping because he's so damn good at it. But after football, Xavier was lost. He was trying to figure out who he was, how he was going to survive. More importantly, how was he going to provide?

• 1:09Ryan Clark?

  Rap wasn't a passion, it was a lifeline. X opens up about his upbringing, his parents relentless hustle, and the life shaped by survival. He takes us back to the birth of his son, the moment he learned the news while sitting in jail, and how that moment changed everything. Then we went even deeper, past the fame, past the money, past the music. We talk about his mental health, the struggle to find motivation, and the days when X admits he doesn't even want to live. His friends told us that he was going to cry during this conversation, and they were right. One of our favorite Big X the Plug songs is Therapy Session. And that's exactly what this felt like. Not an interview, but a man allowing himself to be vulnerable enough

• 1:51Ryan Clark?

  to confront the parts of himself the world rarely gets to see. Because sometimes, the people who provide for everybody else are the ones struggling the most in silence. So please welcome Big X the Plug for one of our biggest pivots.

• 2:28Ryan Clark?

  Big X, man, welcome to the pivot. This is Channing Crowder, this is Fred Taylor, I'm Ryan Clark. Pivot fam, thank you for pivoting with us. You know, I know you love football.

• 2:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:36Ryan Clark?

  Right? So I want to know, how does it feel to be a famous meme every time a wide receiver get locked up? Because every time a wide receiver get locked up, we see you.

• 2:47Speaker 02

  Oh, you talking about that?

• 2:48Ryan Clark?

  Out there running routes.

• 2:50Speaker 02

  I seen a viral clip, a receiver used it and it worked.

• 2:54Ryan Clark?

  They used your move?

• 2:55Speaker 02

  They used the move. I seen, they said, oh, he used the Big X the Plug move. I can't remember what team it was, but it worked. So.

• 3:02Ryan Clark?

  You told him that worked?

• 3:04Speaker 02

  I'm doing something, right? You know? It's good, it's good to see I can still make an impact even off the field.

• 3:10Ryan Clark?

  Yeah. But for you, man, how much of what you, you know, learn from ball or the things you loved about ball, do you try to apply to life now?

• 3:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, everything. Like, me even going independent with United Masters off rip was, I looked at it as, okay, I can go to a major because I had offers from majors, but I didn't know the game, I didn't know the business. I'm not finna go put myself in a position where I don't know something and now I'm not starting or getting the playing time if I want. So, I went to a Juco. I looked at U M as a Juco, go there, get my, you know, get my reps in, get some playing time, get strong, hit the gym. And then I go major, but we done pulled a Cam Newton, basically. Where, you know what I'm saying? We really didn't even have to go, we could've went straight to the, but, you know, yeah. So, yeah, everything, from just the team to everything is just in a football mindset, for sure.

• 4:04Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, and through your journey though, with that same approach to, you know, football and sports and, and, and growing your ability though.

• 4:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 4:12Ryan Clark?

  So you had a, your lead up to rap was different.

• 4:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 4:15Ryan Clark?

  But you still gotta keep training.

• 4:17Speaker 02

  No, for sure, for sure, for sure.

• 4:18Ryan Clark?

  What was the, from me not knowing who Big X the Plug was to me knowing it? What was that training?

• 4:24Channing Crowder?

  And I have it like that, too.

• 4:24Speaker 02

  For music?

• 4:25Ryan Clark?

  Couple of years ago, I never heard of you in my life.

• 4:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 4:28Ryan Clark?

  And now my kids know that you coming on the show and they talking, oh yeah! That's him, that's him, bro. It blew up overnight. Some, there was, there was a maturation process that had to be.

• 4:38Speaker 02

  I don't know, man, I guess God just knew I had to figure something out. Something, he made some shape for me. I, football was, that's all I knew. You know what I'm saying? I didn't know how to sell drugs, even though that's what my parents was doing. They never let me see that. So I never knew how to do that at the time. I never knew how to take from nobody. I never knew how to do none of that. I just knew how to play football. I learned all that and stuff when I, when football was gone. Because then I had to survive. Yeah. So, yeah, I don't, I don't know, I don't know how it happened. I would be completely out of the job. I was, I went from football to football being gone to trying to survive, made some mistakes, to just having to figure something out. And I got a cousin that was just like, he been rapping forever. He was just like, man, try to rap. I tried to rap and then six months to a year.

• 5:24Ryan Clark?

  Big X, people don't try to rap. I'm, I'm be honest. Back in the days when I was in college, when I used to drink, I had tried to rap.

• 5:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:32Ryan Clark?

  You know, we all got to freestyle.

• 5:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:34Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? I grew up in New Orleans and I went to school in Baton Rouge when screw was big.

• 5:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:39Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? So we all jumped on, and I was terrible.

• 5:42Speaker 02

  Now, that's a Texas thing, though. Like, I feel like anybody, if you're from Texas, even if you can't freestyle, that's something that you do. Like, whether you smoking, whether it's football, whether it's whatever, you always, somebody gonna beat on their chest and somebody gonna, meow! That's just Texas, that's, that's, you know what I'm saying? That's what we do. I used to do that. I was the person who, before the games, it was me and this other dude named Josh Thomas. We would be in the huddle as we walked the field and hit a freestyle. And Calvin Fleming, we used to all freestyle before the game and just turn everybody up. And, but I just never, I never looked at it as nothing. I just looked at it as me being able to be one of the guys that was able to turn the team up. You know what I'm saying? I didn't even look at it as, oh, I'm good at this. It took for my cousin, the same person who told me to rap, to tell me,

• 6:26Speaker 02

  you're good at this, you need to, you know what I'm saying? And so, yeah, I never, ever thought I was gonna be no rapper.

• 6:32Fred Taylor?

  We can't talk about football and not talk about America's team.

• 6:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:37Fred Taylor?

  I mean, I'm not sure if you're a Cowboys fan. I know it's probably rhetorical.

• 6:42Speaker 02

  It's actually a Texas, touch the subject right now because I'm a Texans fan.

• 6:45Fred Taylor?

  A Texans fan?

• 6:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:46Fred Taylor?

  Damn, I was just about to say you, so C D use your own shit against you. God damn.

• 6:54Speaker 02

  How long this interview is?

• 6:56Ryan Clark?

  It should've felt like it's about to be over.

• 6:59Fred Taylor?

  My bad, bro. Like, so that, that, that sort of kinda, I guess it leads, it leads into part of the question. Like, being from Dallas, have you met anyone that's a fan of any other team that's not a Cowboys fan? And I guess you are the answer. How the fuck that happen?

• 7:16Speaker 02

  So my dad is a diehard Cowboys fan. He actually just called me, cursed me out. Oh, Houston, dah dah dah, with all my partners. But I just watched him, I watched a grown man, I don't wanna see my dad cry twice. Ever in my life. The first time was when I got dropped off to him. He had just got out of prison, they had nothing. He cried then, and it was watching the Cowboys lose. It's the only two times.

• 7:40Ryan Clark?

  Well, he cried a lot then.

• 7:42Speaker 02

  No, it was like, it was a certain game. I don't know if he had bet a certain amount of money on it or what. But he, he cried. Like, I watched the two drop out his eye and I said, I'd never let that happen to me. I'd never let that happen to me, ever. And so I just, and then that was right when J.J. Whitehead came out and I was just, you know what I'm saying? So they went J.J. White and they went Tom Mathieu and they went Javion Clowney. And I was just a big defensive guy at the time. You know, I played offense and defense, but everybody loved defense. You get, you know, it's just something about it. And so at that time, I was just, yeah, it just took me to Houston.

• 8:14Fred Taylor?

  Are you loving your defense right now?

• 8:17Speaker 02

  I like my defense better than I like my offensive line.

• 8:20Ryan Clark?

  Oh, so you watching, watching?

• 8:24Speaker 02

  I don't want to say nothing because I'm just trying to come to some game.

• 8:28Ryan Clark?

  Don't mess with their boxing.

• 8:31Speaker 02

  I don't want to miss that.

• 8:32Fred Taylor?

  No, we, we not trying to box you. It's tough.

• 8:35Ryan Clark?

  My dog said, he said, well, you know.

• 8:39Speaker 02

  Like, those, those timeouts that we took with those couple of seconds left in the fourth quarter yesterday, I didn't understand. And this is just me being honest speaking as a, as a sports, uh, what is it? Sports analyst or some whatever you want to call it. I think we're gonna have a new coach pretty soon.

• 8:56Ryan Clark?

  No.

• 8:57Speaker 02

  You don't think so?

• 8:58Ryan Clark?

  Absolutely, don't do that, X. No, absolutely not. The man has gone to the playoffs and won a playoff game. Every single year he's been the head coach. Same thing with the quarterback. They, they are going to be there. They're gonna figure this out. I'm, I'm just trying to get you tickets. So we gonna get out of that conversation and we gonna switch it up.

• 9:16Channing Crowder?

  Say, bro, do y'all remember when Klay Matthews got his looks maxed? I'm talking about like ridiculous jawline, balloon biceps, them huge calf implants? Which, by the way, I wouldn't be mad if I could get some of those.

• 9:32Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, bro. Klay definitely has some work done, just like the new and improved Caesar's Sportsbook app.

• 9:37Channing Crowder?

  Man, it has better design, more rewards and new ways to bet. I love the flex parlays and this season they have injury protection.

• 9:46Fred Taylor?

  That could have come into play this weekend with Jaden Daniels against Dallas. Or even with Sam Darnold in week one. So bet with Caesar's Sportsbook, the app that's been nipped and tucked to perfection.

• 9:56Channing Crowder?

  Use promo code PIVOT for exclusive welcome offers. Some makeovers are worth a closer look. You must be 21 or older to play with Caesar's Sportsbook. Offer's not available in Alberta or Ontario. Remember, betting should be fun. If you or someone you know struggles with problems gambling, help is available in almost every state where Caesar operates. You can call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MYRESSET for assistance. In Massachusetts, call 1-800-327-5050 or visit gamblinghelpline.org. And in New York, call 877-8HOPENY or text HOPENY. That's 467-369. Please play responsibly.

• 10:36Ryan Clark?

  I do want to ask you something. You know, I know our experiences build us up, right? And you spent time with your mother and then you mentioned being dropped off to your father. What does that do to a young person as they're trying to develop? Seeing their father cry when you're dropped off to him?

• 10:55Speaker 02

  I'm not gonna say it did nothing to me because I was young. So I didn't understand why he was crying then, but like now that I'm older, obviously I understand. It really made me respect him more. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's my dad. That's the one person in this world, my mom and my dad, I'd never go against, like, ever. Cause they brought me in this world. I can't, you just can't. So to see him cry and now to know why, it's like, he was crying because you, he just got out of prison. He ain't got nothing. He ain't had nothing but a, a air mattress and a one-bedroom apartment. That was it. He had no furniture, no couches, no, nothing. He had an air mattress and we slept head to foot on that air mattress for probably like a week or two. And he got to it. And, and a month, we had the whole house furnished.

• 11:40Speaker 02

  Wild, but, and he, knowing my dad, he probably still would have did it just because that's the type of person he is. He don't, he don't like living under means. You know what I'm saying? That's just, but I know for sure he did it 10 times faster because I'm there. He got six kids.

• 11:54Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 11:54Speaker 02

  But I'm the one, you know, I'm the oldest, so I'm the one that's, that was with him. So, you know what I'm saying? I know that's why he did it. But yeah, looking back on it, yeah, it made me respect him more.

• 12:02Ryan Clark?

  You openly love your kids. I think it's one of my favorite things about you. Looking back on that moment and thinking about how you care for your own, what do you take from that? That makes you say, I'm always gonna go, or how do you look at that and say, I'm always gonna go get it to make sure I can provide for mine?

• 12:21Speaker 02

  I didn't never want for nothing. I'm not one of those kids or one of those people that can say, oh, when I was coming up, it was hard. I mean, it wasn't, it wasn't. Like, when I was, my momma, my momma, she did what she did. She's so dope. My momma made sure I was good. Now, granted, she might've had me in some situations or in some places where I shouldn't have been as a child, but I was in that situation and in that place with the cleanest Jordans and the, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's just, that's, that's how it was. And then when I went with my dad, it was the same thing. My dad, he was just more clean with it. I ain't never seen nothing my dad did. My momma would have a, a spot with dope all on the table. My daddy, I'd never seen nothing. You know what I'm saying? The whole time, it's all, you know what I'm saying? It's, it's all around. I just, I'd never seen it. But they always made sure it was straight.

• 13:06Speaker 02

  So I ain't never, that's why I can never be one of those kids to say, I want it for anything. You know, or certain candies that they wouldn't let me get, stuff like that, toys. But other than that, anything that I needed, like that I was supposed to have, they, they gave me. And so with my kids, I just look at it the same way. Like, whatever, how my parents parented me, I want to be 10 times better. My dad always told me, you're gonna do what I tell you to do, not what I did. You're gonna be better than me. You're not gonna beat me. You know what I'm saying? And so that's just what that is. Like, my dad a great man, but I'm always gonna be better than him. So he's a great father. I'm gonna be a way better father than him.

• 13:43Ryan Clark?

  I love that.

• 13:43Fred Taylor?

  Yeah. Even, even then, you look at the contrast of how we came up, even when, you know, you were born in 98. So social media wasn't around then. You didn't, as a child, you didn't get to see how your dad really moved. Your kids can see how you moved. Just open the phone and they can see how you moved.

• 14:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, for sure.

• 14:02Fred Taylor?

  How has fatherhood allowed you to, uh, handle success? You know, making sure you move the, the right way because you don't want them to kind of, you know what I'm saying? See the wrong things.

• 14:14Speaker 02

  I made a promise to my son when I got out of jail and told him I'd never do, no, like, I'd never do no dirt again. So, and that's just a promise that, like I said, I want to be a better parent than my dad. So I made that promise to my, I lied to a, I'm sorry, baby. I lied to a female that I love before I lied to my kids. Like, I'd never lied to my kids. I, I'd never lied to my kids, my parents. Anybody else? I might give you that lie if it's just that bad. My kids, I never. My parents, I never. I don't know, man. Like I said, my son made that promise to him. I stood beside it, even when, whether it's my partner say he need, I got all the weed in the world. My partner needs some, I can't, I ain't got nothing for you. I can't do it. Whether it's, uh, uh, man, let's just lick over here and I'm damn bad broke.

• 14:59Speaker 02

  I can't do it. I made a promise to my son. And that's, it just, it progressed. It progressed. And I feel like I didn't even really find or realize or even know where I wanted to go in life. Like, I didn't, I was, after football, I didn't know. I didn't have no character. I didn't have identity. I was just X. I didn't have no, I didn't know, no reason. Even once I had my child, when I had my son, I didn't see, you know how most people say, oh, when you have your first kid, it, it make you quick? That wasn't, that wasn't it. Like, I had my son and even though I should have, like, yeah, I got the part as far as going to work, figuring out, you know, for my, it's still, I still wasn't locked in.

• 15:41Speaker 02

  Like, I was the, oh, I'll go buy some weed before I make sure everything in the house is just straight. Like, my kid's straight, but just before, like, I'll make sure my kid's straight, go get some weed or something before I, I eat or something like that. You know what I'm saying? Like, just my priorities just wasn't in line. I was young, stupid, dumb. It really took for a lot, though. I don't, I, God, they, they already told me I was gonna cry on here, so I'm trying not to cry. So, you know what I'm saying?

• 16:05Ryan Clark?

  Most people do.

• 16:06Speaker 02

  That's why I'm saying, I ain't trying to do that. I might have cried in the interview before that, and I ain't play it. You know what I'm saying? I ain't play it. But now, like, it's, it was just my, it was my son, man, I ain't gonna lie. He really just clicked everything for me. I know my, well, I don't know if y'all know or not, my son, he got, he got autism. And so I watched, like, my little girl right now, they, I'll tell you, my little girl, two years old, can you tell her your name? She'll leave out this room, come back the next day, no your name, no your name, no your name. Besides who you wear, like, that she's a smart girl, like, she, and so I'd be looking at her like, why is she so smart? But my son was the same way. My son knew all his ABCs, one, two, threes, all the way up to probably about 30 before he was two. And then I started rapping, started going on the road, started doing stuff.

• 16:49Speaker 02

  And my, the mother of my child at the time calling me, telling me that, oh, they saying that Carter is deteriorating. He's not doing this, he's not that, he might have this. I'm on the road. The only reason I'm doing what I'm doing is for him. So I don't want to hear that. I can't, you can't tell me that. Nah, y'all tripping, y'all don't know nothing. It took for the doctor to, I mean, my momma fell out because of that. I love my momma to death. I just tell you, I'd never go against my momma. That's the only time I've ever went against my momma, or twice. But that time it was, can't tell me nothing about my kid. What you mean, my kid got autism? I don't even know what the hell that is. At the time, I didn't. I'm not gonna lie to you and say, I didn't know, not what, I'm good. Nah, that's, I ain't believing that. Took for the doctor to tell me.

• 17:32Speaker 02

  And then with that, it's just like, so everything I'm doing, right? As far as this music, because I hate this. I'm gonna be honest with you. I hate the industry, the rap game, the, whatever lane you want to put me in, country, rap. I hate it. I don't like it. It's not me. I gotta go and be in front of a bunch of people. I love my fans, but that's not me. It's like, I'm a people's person, but I don't like people, if that makes sense.

• 17:56Ryan Clark?

  You're introverted, extrovert. I get it.

• 17:59Speaker 02

  I would rather just, as much as I can't be, well, now I think, because I used to be able to be alone, but now I can't be alone. I don't know where it came from. I don't know, well, I know where it came from. Yeah, but this, this industry is weird. It's not me and here I am doing something that I really don't want to do, but it's to provide for my kid.

• 18:15Ryan Clark?

  You know, I've, I've heard you talk about your son before. And, and so many times we feel as the parent, we're supposed to teach our children. That's our job. We're supposed to put them in places where they don't have to learn the hard way like we do. And my, my little brother, uh, his child is on the spectrum. My closest little niece, her son, uh, my best friend.

• 18:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:39Ryan Clark?

  And so around me, it's been extremely prevalent and I've learned so much from their children. I've learned so much from my family members who are raising children on the spectrum. What has your son taught you just about love, about, about life, about learning?

• 18:57Speaker 02

  Patience. Love, the love was always there for my son. Like, that's the first thing I ever brought in this world. I ain't never won no championship. I ain't never won no nothing. That was the first thing I ever, I felt like I had won. So it's like.

• 19:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, patience, patience. And he helped, he done saved a lot of people. You know what I'm saying? He done, he done helped me in a lot of ways, but patience, for sure. That's the biggest thing. But he done helped grown me into the man I am today, for sure. Because my dad used to always tell me, "Think before you do." And I never understood it, never did it. I would always do, and then, once I done got my ass whooped, now I'm sitting like, "Damn, what?" You know what I'm saying? But, once I had my kid, I still was just thinking, I still was just doing without thinking. It took for them to, you know what I'm saying? For them to tell me that he was on the spectrum, and just to really just have to... Because it was like, you know, when they first told me, I'm treating them like, basically, a newborn baby all over again.

• 20:00Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying? I didn't know how to... I was the kid, growing up, that they told, "You couldn't play with your... You can't play with your relatives, can't play with your siblings." Because I was always too big, I'm too rough. Here I am, now, with a child that's saying, "Has autism." I don't even know what it is. I don't know how to react, I don't know how to... So I was just, yeah. Yeah, man, I was just, I don't know, man, I was trying to figure, I was trying to figure it out.

• 20:24Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 20:25Speaker 02

  But that patience, though, that's the biggest thing that I learned from all that. Like I said, the love and all that, that was always there.

• 20:32Ryan Clark?

  In the crazy industry, does that, patience that he allowed you to have more of, does that allow you to protect your peace, when shit get loud?

• 20:43Speaker 02

  I ain't been at peace in the last three years. It just helped me, it keep me from going out. It keep me from, it makes me do a lot of things that I know I normally wouldn't do. But now I think, and I'm like, "Okay, well, I know if I do this, it's gonna further help me provide for my kids." As much as I don't want to do it, as much as I know this is not me, and I go against everything that this stand for. So it helped me provide for my kids, so...

• 21:07Ryan Clark?

  That's not stressful?

• 21:09Speaker 02

  Stressful. My people call me every other day, seeing if I'm all right. You know what I'm saying?

• 21:15Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, at least they're checking.

• 21:16Speaker 02

  You good, you woke up today, you out, you know what I'm saying? Like, it's been a roller coaster for all of us, but, we're here.

• 21:22Channing Crowder?

  Ball stopped, and you really didn't have an identity. So you didn't see the purpose in your life? But to provide for your kids? That's what you was trying to do, right?

• 21:31Speaker 02

  Before I even had kids.

• 21:33Channing Crowder?

  But, so you just didn't have no, there was no finish line you was running toward?

• 21:37Speaker 02

  You had my partners, I would get up every day, and we would just figure out, we would figure out what we was doing throughout the day. And then I was, I was a day-by-day. There was no, it wasn't no, "Oh, let me try to go to work for this amount of time, so I can get an apartment, and then do this." No, it was get up, and the most I'm trying to do is figure out how to get some gas, so I can go smoke with my partners, and cheer for the day.

• 22:01Channing Crowder?

  So, and then you had your boy? And that made you, your goal was to, "I need to earn money now."

• 22:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:07Channing Crowder?

  "I need to support my baby." Then you find a purpose, or identity, that God gave you a talent to do something, to provide.

• 22:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:16Channing Crowder?

  And you, and you just said, "I ain't been happy in three years." You were looking for something to provide for your baby. God said, "Here, you are a worldwide rapper. Why aren't you happy?" That was the goal, your finish line was making enough money to provide for your kid. Now you can, you can rap to provide for your kid. So what you chasing still?

• 22:37Speaker 02

  How long we been gone? We been gone, well, like, what, it's been two days now? Two days. I'm only doing this for my son, right, who has autism. I ain't seen my son in two days. He stayed with his mom, so I ain't really, I really ain't seen him longer. You see what I'm saying? So that's, that's what started off everything. Being, like, I'm, when everything first, like I said, it started fast. So here I am, I'm gone. After a year, that first year we was gone, I was probably gone over a hundred days, maybe two hundred of the year. So the only reason I'm doing this that I don't like is for my son, I not even seen him.

• 23:18Ryan Clark?

  X, what don't you like about it, though? Like, you keep saying you don't, you don't like it. It seems hard to be as good at something that you don't like.

• 23:29Speaker 02

  I like having money, but I wasn't good at math.

• 23:32Ryan Clark?

  So what?

• 23:33Speaker 02

  I didn't like school. Hated reading and writing class, but I could write. I'm just good at telling stories. I guess that's supposed to make everything easier, and more, you know what I'm saying? Because everything is real, everything is... Now, if I was faking it, then you're right, that might, it might be someone... But nah, it's just, it's easy to do, because I'm telling real shit, you know what I'm saying? So, that just come, but I don't, I don't like it because of the antics that come from it. The stuff people say now, and the stuff people do now, I've been went in somebody's mouth, and not care what happened behind it. I can't do that now. It's people that do stuff to you

• 24:14Speaker 02

  that could jeopardize everything that you got going, because they want to be here. Whether they already there or not, they just, nobody care, I feel like, in this industry. I feel like a lot of people is just, it's for self. You got a few select people, but everybody is just for they self, everybody is about the dollar, like, no... As much as people say, "Oh, man, I'm doing music because I love music." You gotta select a few of those. But the rest of them is for the dollar, for the clout, for the fame, for the... I'm not with that. If I could just make all the money and not see a camera, I would love it. NBA Youngboy made all that money and was on house arrest. I would, I would have rather did that.

• 24:56Ryan Clark?

  You said something, I saw, uh, reading about you, that you, you don't count these people in this industry as friends? That, you know, there are some people who are acquaintances? You know, I know you have your people that you walked in here with. Do you feel like you even put the effort in to know other people in the industry, and get close to them? Or you're kind of standoffish in that way?

• 25:21Speaker 02

  Up until probably like, this year? Yeah, I was willing to talk, you know what I'm saying? Because I know that's part of it. But, my questions for people don't be the same questions they have for me. Like, when I see a rapper for the first time, mine is, "How you doing? You good? You all right?" There's this, "Man, we gotta get something in." "You damn, you making it work already." We know we can't be friends, because now, you've already made it work. I don't care about this music, I don't... "Are you good as a person?" That's what I want you to ask me, too. And then, three weeks down the line, when you text me, it should be, "Hey, you good, you straight?" Not, "Hey, what's up with that song we was trying to..." And that's, I don't, that's cool. I done did songs with people that, "Oh, yeah, let's do it." I tried to, "Oh, yeah, let's do the song shit."

• 26:05Speaker 02

  And then, it ended up not working for me in my favor. People tried me, because of the industry, "I gotta go this way, I gotta go that way." And then when you do this way, which is what's best for you, now you gotta deal with somebody on the internet talking, somebody doing this, somebody doing that. I don't, I don't got time, or, I have patience, but I don't have the patience for that, so I just stay away from it.

• 26:28Channing Crowder?

  And, bro, you did, you know, either, either or, you didn't get that friendship. When you get a beat, and we were listening to you before you walked in, and you kill it.

• 26:39Speaker 02

  Appreciate it.

• 26:39Channing Crowder?

  You'd be happy? Like, because everybody, I know people will tell you, you say your cousin knew you could rap. So you done went and laid down, whatever, laid it down. "Bro, you killed that." "Yeah, whatever, get the fuck out of my face." Like, what? Your reaction to killing, to killing the song can't be, "Yeah, it's whatever."

• 26:54Speaker 02

  I made the song, and I was like, "Nah, I don't fuck with it." And he was like, "But you got something, it's cool. Let's go to the studio today." It made him want to do a song with me. You see what I'm saying? Like, I ain't...

• 27:05Channing Crowder?

  You are reluctantly a rapper?

• 27:09Speaker 02

  I guess I...

• 27:12Channing Crowder?

  This is crazy.

• 27:13Speaker 02

  I ain't never, I ain't, I wasn't the grow-up, "Oh, I want to be a rapper." No, I wanted to be a firefighter.

• 27:19Channing Crowder?

  You can't be the firefighter.

• 27:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, nah.

• 27:22Channing Crowder?

  I was thinking the same thing.

• 27:26Speaker 02

  But nah, like, that's, as, as a, as a young child, I remember, I remember my dad, he had a... This is the one time I done ever seen, maybe, some, some bad from my dad. He took me to one of his spots. But it was clean, you know, it wasn't just stuff everywhere, nothing like that. They had a microphone in the middle of a circle table, and there was some dudes in there rapping. And, uh, my dad was like, "Nigga, my, my son will kill y'all." Because he used to do stuff, like, where we would be in the car, and he'd be like, freestyle, like, me and my little brother be in the car, and he trying to have us bond, he'd have us freestyle against each other. And I freestyle, and he'd be like, "Oh, that suck, that ain't it." And then my little brother just hop on there, and he'd be like, "Oh, you can cuss." My little brother just hop on there and say, "Shit, fuck, shit, fuck." And he, "Oh, that's hard, that's hard." So that's probably what discouraged me from wanting to be a rapper, for real.

• 28:10Speaker 02

  Because I was like, "Man, I don't, I ain't, I ain't messing with that." But, yeah, that... So, boom, he took me to that table, and he told me freestyling or not. Freestyled and killed him, and he was like, "Man, you need to be a rapper." I'm gonna be a firefighter, daddy. I don't know where that came from. I don't know. Matter of fact, I do know where it came from. I was in Miami one day, we was riding, and there was a fire truck behind us. He hit the alarms, a lot of cars had to get out of the way. And he ran right through the red light.

• 28:36Ryan Clark?

  I need that.

• 28:37Speaker 02

  I said, I want that. I want that. He just jumped through the red light. Made all the cars get out of the way. I need that. But yeah, that never worked out.

• 28:45Fred Taylor?

  Chan asked you about not being content or satisfied. Right? Chasing perfection. Is that the mindset that you developed from football and being an athlete?

• 28:57Speaker 02

  I don't want to be the best rapper in the world. Like, I just, this is a nine to five to me. I'm gonna be completely honest with you. I just want to feed my kids.

• 29:06Ryan Clark?

  Wow.

• 29:07Speaker 02

  It started off as me just wanting to feed my kids. Now I want to take care of everybody around me. Because my kids are beyond good. My kids got ends in their account. Now, let me take care of the people who've been there with me since before I ever thought to rap is what I'm on now. Really, not even them. Forget them. Because now, they got my nieces and my nephews.

• 29:26Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 29:27Speaker 02

  That's what I care about. You know what I'm saying? But it's like, and it's much, even though it's not my job. I don't gotta do that. That's just me. You know what I'm saying? Like, I've always been a very family-oriented person. From my dad's side to my mom's side, it's just always been that. But that's what messes me up a lot now. I'm steady trying to do for everybody. But it's like, nobody really do too much for me. It's part of it, though. Because it's like, what the fuck can they do for me? Everybody look at it like, oh, you got everything.

• 30:01Ryan Clark?

  Heavy is the head.

• 30:03Speaker 02

  Maybe it's the what?

• 30:04Ryan Clark?

  I said, heavy is the head, the where's the crown?

• 30:07Speaker 02

  My damn security guards say that all the time, bro. And it'd be pissing me off sometimes, but nah, you right. But nah, it don't, it don't add up to me. It don't be adding up to me.

• 30:20Fred Taylor?

  Chan always asks the question. So I'm gonna ask it this time to save this motherfucker from asking it for the 9,000th time. Because it happens in sports. Like, you're instantly catapulted into, when you come from nothing. Like, you have to become the head, right? You become the patriarch of the family.

• 30:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, patriarch.

• 30:40Fred Taylor?

  And you got all this heavy, like, you gotta carry the load. Like, does that bring an extra sense of pressure to you? Or do you enjoy that? Or did I ask it the way you would ask it?

• 30:53Ryan Clark?

  No, no, no, you right. I just said it because it becomes all financial.

• 30:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:57Ryan Clark?

  You become the patriarch not because of respect.

• 30:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:59Ryan Clark?

  Not because they look at you in a certain way.

• 31:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:01Ryan Clark?

  It's because, shit, he can buy my house.

• 31:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, he got it.

• 31:04Ryan Clark?

  He can do this. So, a lot of us are already mentally to be the patriarch.

• 31:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:08Ryan Clark?

  But the bank account says you're the patriarch.

• 31:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:11Ryan Clark?

  And that transition mentally of being that dude, like, you just look the way like shit's fucked up.

• 31:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:16Ryan Clark?

  What's somebody gonna buy you? Nobody can get you a gift.

• 31:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:18Ryan Clark?

  We all go through that. People be like, what you want for Christmas, Chan? If I want something, I buy it.

• 31:22Speaker 02

  Nah, for sure.

• 31:24Ryan Clark?

  Like, that transition was Freddie asking about. What was that like? Because it seems like you're still going through it right now, or the realization of it.

• 31:31Speaker 02

  Well, to answer your question.

• 31:33Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 31:33Speaker 02

  That's where I'm at right now.

• 31:37Speaker 02

  I'm gonna be honest with you. Mentally, I'm not here. I'm being gone. You know what I'm saying? But as a person, as big as the plug, I'm here.

• 31:44Ryan Clark?

  Xavier not here?

• 31:46Speaker 02

  Not. He ain't been here in a minute. But I've, like I said, I've been realized it. But over the past year, I've just kind of like grown to realize that life gonna keep life. Can't stop nothing, can't pause nothing, can't replay it. So you just gotta keep going. Like, I've shed my tears.

• 32:06Speaker 02

  But keep going.

• 32:07Ryan Clark?

  I'm lighting this up for a second. Somebody could buy you an undershirt, though. Why you always naked?

• 32:15Ryan Clark?

  Why, like, why is your, I be like, why is?

• 32:18Speaker 02

  I was just gonna shed a tear. He just teed back.

• 32:21Ryan Clark?

  I be like, why is Benny always though?

• 32:24Channing Crowder?

  And don't want attention.

• 32:25Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, but I don't want attention.

• 32:27Channing Crowder?

  But I'm gonna get naked for you all the time.

• 32:29Speaker 02

  I'm gonna be honest. So, for one, I'm a very confident man.

• 32:36Speaker 02

  Listen, I feel like it ain't been a big nigga like me since me. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm just gonna be real. But other than that, I feel like in my past life, for real, I think I was a nudist.

• 32:49Fred Taylor?

  Don't say that around this man, bruh.

• 32:51Speaker 02

  I think I was a, oh, so you feel me?

• 32:52Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 32:53Speaker 02

  I think I was a nudist because I hate clothes. Clothes just make me feel so.

• 32:58Ryan Clark?

  Free.

• 32:59Speaker 02

  No, clothes make me feel.

• 33:01Ryan Clark?

  You feel confined.

• 33:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, but whenever I get home and I'm able to take off everything, I feel like a, just a monkey swinging. You know what I'm saying?

• 33:08Ryan Clark?

  So, hey, so you walk straight in the house and just take your clothes off?

• 33:12Speaker 02

  Well, see, what's funny is I stay in a house full of women. My momma, my granny, my daughter, both my sisters. Everybody stay with me. I can go through the front door and take my pants off and my jacket off at the door. I'm walking through in my drawers. They know this is me. Like, I hate clothes. I hate them. Before I came here, my jacket was unzipped, barely out. I said, let me look presentable for camera.

• 33:39Ryan Clark?

  Hey, shoot, that's the way we see you without a shirt all the time. Anyway, I actually expected you to walk in here with no shirt on.

• 33:46Speaker 02

  We was just saying, say less. I was in there with my shirt off.

• 33:49Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I could believe it. Man, I, um, so, one of my favorite songs is Therapy Session. Right? So me and Marcus Spears, when we would work together, we'd be going to Monday night games. We'd put it on. You know, you said you love to tell stories, right? And you're just talking about things being real. And I always relate it, you know, with the first line. Right? You said you're doing well. You said, not great, but I'm good. You know what I'm saying? But I can't complain because I have more than I should.

• 34:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:17Ryan Clark?

  Is that how you truly feel about your life? That it's not perfect, but I know I've been provided enough where I should be okay?

• 34:25Speaker 02

  For sure. That's why I said, I feel how I feel, but I just take it to the chin. I cry about it out. I keep moving because at the end of the day, I'm doing what I wanted to do, and that's take care of my kids. So, and this is what come with it.

• 34:37Ryan Clark?

  Are you okay, though? Like, honestly, like, just, like, are you in a good spot? Not that you gotta be. Like, honestly, like, true, like, we have, we've had this conversation. All three of us have cried on this show. Probably me most recently. But you said, like, you see people and they don't ask how you're doing. Or you see people and they don't hit you up like you're okay. Same for him. It's the same for him. It's the same for me. Like, I'm the one that made it. He's the one that made it. So is he. So are you. But, so I'll ask you, though, like, truly, how are you doing? How are you coping? How are you getting by right now in life?

• 35:15Speaker 02

  Being outside. I like to go outside. I like to buy stuff. Not even for me. Like, when I get sad, I just go buy shit for other people. I got everything. I got a Rolls Royce. I got everything. Got all the jewelry. We go to the jewelry store. I go get my jewelry clean and buy everybody in the store something.

• 35:33Speaker 02

  It's just.

• 35:34Ryan Clark?

  Buying people ain't gonna fill a space in your soul, though.

• 35:36Speaker 02

  It do for the time. I feel good at that time. I did a good deed. I feel happy. I'm okay.

• 35:42Ryan Clark?

  What you do when you go home and you buy yourself?

• 35:44Speaker 02

  I get in the shower and cry. Get high. Smoke.

• 35:49Speaker 02

  What can I do?

• 35:51Speaker 02

  What is it gonna do? What is me telling, they tell me to get a therapist all the time. What is that gonna do? What is me talking to somebody that don't know me gonna do for me?

• 36:03Speaker 02

  Nothing.

• 36:03Ryan Clark?

  Sometimes it's just enough to be able to say it. You know, I'm in therapy. I go every week. And, you know, when the phone call starts, sometimes she asks me the question, what do you want to talk about? And a lot of times, my answer is, well, nothing's wrong. And then an hour later, for 60 minutes, I then told her about everything that I think is wrong.

• 36:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:29Ryan Clark?

  It's not necessarily that you're gonna get advice or you're gonna be taught something that you don't know. But it's time you pay for it, clearly. But the person gets nothing out of making you feel great about yourself.

• 36:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:47Ryan Clark?

  Like, their job is to listen.

• 36:50Ryan Clark?

  There's people around you that will be around you because of what you can provide.

• 36:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, you actually do it.

• 36:58Ryan Clark?

  Right? And when you use providing for those people to make you happy, then you always need them.

• 37:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:08Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? You gotta find a way to have something where it's you taking care of you. Because if you not all right, neither would them babies be, bro. And like, eventually, it's not gonna be about what you can buy them. It's gonna be about how they feel when they're around you.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  And that's what bothers me, too.

• 37:26Speaker 02

  Because I'm one of the biggest rappers out right now. When am I gonna be able to just sit down?

• 37:34Speaker 02

  I think every day about the fact that when my little girl get older, she might be able to say, my daddy wasn't there.

• 37:41Speaker 02

  I done did everything in the world for this little girl.

• 37:45Speaker 02

  That's gonna hurt myself for ever saying my daddy wasn't there.

• 37:49Speaker 02

  But I would have to understand because I wouldn't. As much as I am there, I'm not there. And my little girl stay with me. Like, I have custody of my daughter. She at my house right now. I'm not there, though.

• 38:01Speaker 02

  That bothers me because I'm only doing what I'm doing for them. So to know that my daughter might get sixteen one day and be like, "My daddy wasn't really there." Yeah, he provided because that being there is the biggest part of being a parent. Providing, yeah, you're supposed to be able to do that, but being there is the biggest thing. And if you're not there, providing don't mean nothing. All these kids nowadays, the, the, I don't wanna say their names because I don't wanna, you know what I'm saying? But they got parents or stuff that was in the music industry that now they despise. You know what I'm saying? They get on the internet and say, "Oh, my daddy didn't do this for me and didn't do that for them whole time." "Daddy did everything that he was supposed to do money-wise just because he wasn't there." Because he had shows lined up back-to-back-to-back to provide for you.

• 38:46Speaker 02

  Now you bashing his name on the internet. That's my little girl, so I never go against her, but it's gonna hurt my soul to know that that's how she feel. If that's how she feel. But I do everything that I can so that my little girl never feel like that. My little girl called me right now and said, "Daddy, I want a, a pink, a, a red pig." Tomorrow, what she gonna have? A red pig. Well, I gotta go buy a pig and paint that motherfucker red so she gonna have it.

• 39:11Ryan Clark?

  I know the feeling for sure.

• 39:13Fred Taylor?

  I think you certainly parent how you see fit. That's part of it. I think for me, right, being in that same position, like, we make the ultimate sacrifice to make sure our, our, our kids are, are good, right? At the end of the day, God gonna be God. You, we not in control of anything that happens down the road. But I think what, just listening to you, RC talking about the therapist, what, what sort of hurt me, bruh? And we, we just met, we met in New Orleans, but like, we officially just met. Is when you said Xavier been gone.

• 39:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:53Fred Taylor?

  And, you know, I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be right if I didn't experience certain things and then try to give it back to people that are younger than me, no matter, you know, where, where they come from, any, any people. I think, and I don't wanna tell you how to move and live your life, but I do know that one day, all of that's gonna come to an end. Like, they tell us football's gonna come to an end. You gotta prepare for that day. How you spend your money, the decisions you make, so forth and so on. And that day's gonna come when you're gonna have to reconnect with Xavier.

• 40:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:30Fred Taylor?

  I would say, try to find a way to, to, to, to tap in, to, to see how he feel. Outside of all of this fucking industry shit, you gotta go and do your thing. You Big Ex the Plug, you worldwide, of, of course, you gotta do that. But you gotta make sure that inner, that inner child, you gotta stay tapped in with them. Because when that day come back.

• 40:51Speaker 02

  Yeah. Nah, it's, it's actually something I've been in the process of trying to do, like, within my people today. I've been like, on like, a thirty-day, not give a fuck, like, where it's just like, thirty days, nothing but me. Like, what I, what I feel like is gonna be for me, like, help me with this, just whatever it is. Like, I gotta, we gotta call, it was a big feature that I really needed on my album. He didn't wanna be on the album unless it was done this way, or the single didn't, we didn't want the single to drop unless it was this way. It was a big feature. Okay, babe, I'm good, I don't need it then. Like, I just been, I've been, class that I come from, I stand for a lot of stuff.

• 41:32Speaker 02

  And I feel like between me becoming this rapper, I have went against myself in every way. That's why I say Xavier gone. He left me because I kept going against him for other motherfuckers. Kept going against him, kept going against him, and he finally just was like, "I can't do it no more," so he left me. And I understand.

• 41:55Ryan Clark?

  Damn.

• 41:56Speaker 02

  I understand. Like I said, I, I, I'm not fucked up about nothing because I understand. Like, I try to under, I'm, I just feel like, I, I feel like I have a better understanding on life than majority of people my age do. Twenty-eight, I ain't, I ain't, I don't feel like I'm that young, but I ain't that old either. I'm saying? And I feel like since I was twenty-six, twenty-five, I've been having a better understanding on life than other people, or my age, anyway. I don't know, like I said, I, I understand, I can't, it's gonna come, you can't really do nothing about it. We can sit here, we can talk, but what is it doing?

• 42:31Channing Crowder?

  I gotta ask you, where is Xavier then? To Fred's point, you gotta find him. If, if Xavier had to leave to become Big Ex the Plug, where is Xavier at? Where does Xavier wanna be? If that's the person that you wanna be, where is he at?

• 42:44Speaker 02

  At home, my kids.

• 42:46Ryan Clark?

  So you find him there then, where you go?

• 42:49Speaker 02

  That's when I'm at, at peace, I guess you can say. Like, I can be in the biggest uproar, saying fuck everybody, and my little girl called me. Smiling, my son called me, I'm smiling here, there.

• 43:02Ryan Clark?

  I love that.

• 43:03Speaker 02

  So that's the only place, but I'm rarely home, so it's like, you know?

• 43:07Channing Crowder?

  And that's something too, you talk about the therapist, because I, man, we more similar than you think, because that's hard. Man, what's talking to some random motherfucker gonna do for me, man? I don't know that motherfucker, I've said that before. You need to go talk to somebody, what they gonna help? I gotta keep this train roll, that's, that was the analogy I used. Chad the therapist, man, I gotta keep this train rolling. He said, "So you the, you the, you the engine of the train?" "Yeah, I can't get off this train or it's gonna stop. I can't sit and enjoy myself for a month. This train gonna stop, this money gonna stop, this, these private schools gonna stop, these, these vacations gonna stop."

• 43:38Ryan Clark?

  They done basketball lessons.

• 43:40Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, I'm paying for basketball, man, my god, the daughter has fourteen trainers. Like, I'm like, "How much y'all need every Wednesday?" But he's like, "So if you hold that damn gas pedal down and have that engine on red, sooner or later, that bitch gonna blow up." So now the train really ain't gonna run. So if you don't service that engine, which would be yourself, because you are a frontman. Nobody can sing your songs, rap your raps without you. But if you're not healthy, if you ain't mentally there, all this shit ends. And he made me rethink that. My thing's fishing.

• 44:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:13Channing Crowder?

  I, I just wanna go fish, I don't wanna talk to nobody, I don't wanna tell no joke, I don't wanna entertain nobody, have no mics on. I just wanna go sit and fish with my kids. And sit, the one gotta catch a damn thing, I don't even need bait on the hook. I just wanna be sitting on the edge of some water.

• 44:25Speaker 02

  Need that line and that water, that's it.

• 44:27Channing Crowder?

  Stand at the tip of that pole and see if you do that. And it's, it's my peace, and I found that peace. And I make sure I do that peace, so I can keep that, so I can recalibrate that engine, I can throw a little oil in that engine, and then three, four hours of fishing. And then I can go and perform and be the engine for my family, financially, emotionally, mentally, have the smile. If you out there on the road running yourself dead, you gonna get home, you can't give your kids the same energy that you would.

• 44:51Speaker 02

  Nah, that's the thing.

• 44:53Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, it's hard.

• 44:55Speaker 02

  When it's for, when it's for them, I don't, I can, I'm just, I'm telling you, I can be dog tired. They'll tell you when I get home, it's about my kids, I don't. That's, I just told my mama the other day, right, because I scared everybody. I, like I said, battling what I'm battling, trying to stay right, my mama was scared. Mama was just, "Oh, just please tell me you ain't gonna try to do nothing crazy." I said, "Mama, I got kids. As much as I don't wanna be here, as much as I hate that I wake up, I got kids. I never, I never do nothing to myself, and I never let nobody else do nothing to me because I gotta, every day, I gotta get up for him."

• 45:37Ryan Clark?

  Do you listen to yourself talk?

• 45:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 45:40Ryan Clark?

  You just said, "As much as I don't wanna be here, as much as I hate to wake up." Like, that's the, that's the goal every day, to wake up.

• 45:52Speaker 02

  My girl is taking my kids, that's, that's literally my only reason for being here, I feel like. That's how I gotta live.

• 45:58Fred Taylor?

  Ex, they not gonna be kids forever.

• 46:01Speaker 02

  I know, but they still my kids, so you're, you're right. Until your kid, until you go, until you go, that's your baby.

• 46:08Ryan Clark?

  Hey, I tell them all the time, that's my baby. Before you came, before you came up, though, I just wanna let you know, man, we put some bread on like, three people's head, we called it a muffin. So I just want you to know that. I made sure, it was, that was my first Big Ex song, after that, I was hooked.

• 46:22Channing Crowder?

  You heard that song seven thousand times in the car.

• 46:26Ryan Clark?

  Yes, you will hear, because I need y'all to know, because we threw sixty up like Kobe, so I wouldn't, none of what y'all talking about. But also too, Ex, man, like, the, the heavy sad rapper is already taken.

• 46:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:40Ryan Clark?

  Rod got that. Ain't nobody sadder than him.

• 46:42Speaker 02

  That's my favorite rapper, I mean, my favorite artist, he ain't a rapper, he'd be my favorite artist though.

• 46:46Ryan Clark?

  Come on, Ex.

• 46:48Speaker 02

  Hey, what I, I, I relate, like, what can I do? I mean, I relate to it, I understand, I understand it. People listen to my music because they understand, they feel like they've been there. I understand, he's doing a great job, he's got, he got, he got me, you know what I'm saying? So I understand why he got all these people around the world, because as much as people say he's sad and he this, it's just, you know, he done went through something, and he expressing himself through his music. And that's what, that's why he has all the fans that he has, because it's a lot of people in the world that's going through the same thing.

• 47:17Ryan Clark?

  From a, from a creator's standpoint, for you.

• 47:21Speaker 02

  Hold on, wait, I don't give out sad, though. I'm just being vulnerable with y'all. You know what I'm saying?

• 47:27Ryan Clark?

  That's my point.

• 47:27Speaker 02

  Like, to, to the world on that stage, I'm smiling, you gonna see all thirty-two, I'mma wrap my heart out, I'mma give you everything you're paying for and what you're giving. Whenever we, i- i- i- if it's something other than this, a real, I, I give what I'm supposed to give. Because we just being real, so I'ma be real with you. I never fake the fuck with nobody. My mama said, "Before I lie to you, I'mma get on my belly and slide to you," so I'm keeping it to you real.

• 47:50Ryan Clark?

  I love that. And I think, one, I appreciate it.

• 47:53Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 47:53Ryan Clark?

  For us, like, that's what, that is what this platform has provided for us. Like, you know, we all, we're all from the south, he from Florida, he from Georgia, I'm from New Orleans, and, you know, especially our generation was taught to not feel.

• 48:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:08Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? Like, that's, that's how my pops taught me. My pops was like, "Man, don't nobody care that you got problems, and most people happy that you do."

• 48:15Speaker 02

  Not for sure.

• 48:16Ryan Clark?

  You know, so that was just how it was taught. And so, like, for, for somebody like you at your age to sit down with three old football players, though, man, and be this open about real life, it helps us. Because we do it all the time. But it's not often somebody your age who's gone through what you've gone through, who holds the position in life you hold, can be that honest about who they are, what they deal with, and how they persevere every day, man. So thank you from the bottom of my heart, for real.

• 48:44Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 48:45Fred Taylor?

  And, and talking about Rod Wave, like, what he's doing on the business side of things. You know what I'm saying? Like, what have you, are, are there any artists that you sort of, kinda, learning from in that realm of, of, of the business that you're in? Well, you have Six Hundred Entertainment, right?

• 49:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, I, I got, I got my label. I mean, like I said, due to the fact that I don't really get close with the artists. I don't really get nothing from like a upfront, personal, we texting point of view. Now, from the outside, yeah, Ry doing this thing, you know, you got, you got a lot, a couple of people that's, no, I ain't gonna lie, Ry, we're doing it the biggest. He got the, the mainstay, everything, from the, the booking to the, he doing his big one. So, yeah, as far as that, now, I don't really, I don't pay atten-, I got my, I got my own problems going on. So, I try not to pay attention to too much to everybody else. As far as me, business-wise, yeah, I got my label, I got my little game and stuff going on.

• 49:42Speaker 02

  But I just feel like everything that I do, I wanna be, I'm a hands-on type of person. Like, I'm, I've never been the type of person to, I'd never give nobody all this money and say, "Hey, start this business," and I'm just an investor. No, that's not me.

• 49:56Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 49:56Speaker 02

  I'm, I'm the, "Oh, you wanna do this? Okay, well, teach me this business, and then let's do it together."

• 50:02Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 50:03Speaker 02

  So, it's a little, you know what I'm saying? It take a little long, 'cause now I'm learning the business, I'm watching, I'm, but whenever I pop that, "Once this is over with," just know I got a couple of other things we're going full, full force into. But right now, I just feel like the label situation was the best option, because I'm already in

• 50:18Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 50:19Speaker 02

  that space. But even that is crazy. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, that's crazy too. That's another topic, though.

• 50:25Ryan Clark?

  And you, when you pointed to yourself, "So, once this is over with," what's this, rapping?

• 50:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 50:30Ryan Clark?

  And is there, is there a money goal? Like, when is that gonna be over with? Is there a plan, or you just saying you gonna ride it till the wheels fall off, or what?

• 50:38Speaker 02

  I mean, it's gonna, it's gonna, I mean, I'm never gonna pass down those shows, you know what I'm saying? I ain't never gonna do that. But I'm saying, there's a, when I, when they first, when I first got with my, my manager, and I told them, "Five years, I just wanna rap for five years. I just wanna get five years' worth of money, and I'm at the game." And then five years came, and they was like,

• 50:59Speaker 02

  "You at your peak now, bro, what you, you know what I'm saying, what you gonna do?"

• 51:03Ryan Clark?

  Hell, yeah.

• 51:03Speaker 02

  So, it's like, you know, I'm, I'm obviously gonna keep doing what I gotta do, but it's, it's definitely a point in life, I feel like, I just wanna switch, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know how you got the, even though I'm nowhere near Jay-Z, Jay-Z don't gotta drop another song for the rest of his life if he don't want to.

• 51:19Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 51:20Speaker 02

  Kanye West don't have to drop if he don't want to. Drake don't have to drop if he don't want to. Lil Wayne don't have to drop if he don't want to. I'm not saying I'm nowhere near them, but I'm gonna get to a point in life where I'm there, and you know how they pop out with those singles here and there? I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna be in a whole different bracket, doing a whole different business, and, yeah.

• 51:43Fred Taylor?

  Nah, we definitely rooting for you, bruh. That day is coming, though. Definitely coming. We always ask our guests, what's their biggest pivot in life, right? That's the moment you can look back on and say, "Because this happened to me or for me, I am who I am today." And it could be multiple moments, but.

• 52:01Speaker 02

  I'm gonna say the one where, a moment that, I guess, changed everything for me was when,

• 52:13Speaker 02

  I guess, when I went to jail. 'Cause I had went to jail, got out, I was on probation, three years papers. Was down to, I was down to the end, I had almost finished papers, went with my partner, I wouldn't even, I ain't gonna lie, all right, we was the...

• 52:31Ryan Clark?

  You was finna lie?

• 52:32Speaker 02

  I was finna lie, but I told y'all, I was kidding, G-Ria.

• 52:34Ryan Clark?

  He was finna lie.

• 52:35Speaker 02

  Because this was like the one time where I kinda almost broke the promise to my son, you know what I'm saying? Like, I had just got out of jail, I ain't had no money. I had somebody staying with me at the time, he ain't come up with it. When I went to jail, he ain't come up with what he was supposed to come up with for the rent. My mother, my chat at the time got kicked out, I had just had my son, so now they staying in McKinney at their home greenhouse. I ain't had nothing. My partner was like, "Hey, I need some money, what you trying to do?" So, I set something up for him. I wasn't really indulging, like, I wasn't the one who, you know what I'm saying, went with the move, but, you know, some stuff happened, and he ended up getting shot a couple of times in the back. It was crazy, the only reason, well, he'll tell you, but he feel like the only, well, we feel like,

• 53:18Speaker 02

  one of the only reasons he's still here today is because, because we drove off in separate cars. We took off in a whole nother car. It took me to call him, like, "Are you good?" He was like, "Yeah, I'm straight, I'm good." His adrenaline rushing, so he didn't even know he got shot. I'm like, "You, you didn't get, you didn't get hit or nothing?" He like, "Nah, I'm straight, I'm straight." I'm like, "Nah, man, pull over at a store or something, let's, let's check you out." And he had got shot three times in the back. When I told him, he fainted.

• 53:43Ryan Clark?

  Wow.

• 53:43Speaker 02

  He fainted, we take him to the hospital, when we take him to the hospital, they hold us. When they hold us, they end up taking us out of jail, boom, probation violation. At the end of my probation, now I done violated probation, because my partner done got shot, and we telling them, we don't know nothing about nothing. And because I went to jail, 'cause I don't know nothing about nothing, now I done violated probation. I was on probation out of Austin, we in Dallas, so now they done shipped me to, to Austin, sat there for three months. The last month, I was in solitary confinement, 'cause I missed my son's birthday. That's...

• 54:15Ryan Clark?

  That changed it.

• 54:16Speaker 02

  Yeah. Missed my son's first birthday. That's also when I realized, how I said earlier, I used to, I used to do and not think. My dad used to always say, "Think before I do." That was the moment. Because I was on the phone with my son for his birthday, and of course, they, time to rack it up. I ain't hearing that. You know, I'm, I'm already mentally, I'm already messed up, 'cause I'm missing my son's first birthday. Cut the phones off for me, I go crazy. They put me in the hole, I'm in solitary confinement. I was in there for, I was supposed to be in there for 30 days, I did 12. The worst thing I ever went through in my life. And that's with me going through everything I'm going through right now.

• 54:54Speaker 02

  I done been stabbed, I done been shot at, I done, that was the worst thing I ever went through in my life, and that's where I feel like I'm at now. Like, then it's just like, I'm sitting in a, a box, no windows, except for one in your door, for 23 hours of the day. Ain't no, everybody else in there hollering crazy, "Throw it off." I'm not, you know what I'm saying? So, it's just hard, like, I, I almost, I, like I said, I feel like I'm where I'm at now mentally. I had lost myself.

• 55:27Ryan Clark?

  You compare where you're at now in life, one of the biggest rappers in the world, to being in solitary confinement for 23 hours a day?

• 55:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:46Speaker 02

  But that one hour out there, sir, boy, it feel good.

• 55:50Speaker 02

  That one hour out, it feel good, though, I'm telling you. And that one hour, that's, that's me when I be with my kids.

• 55:56Ryan Clark?

  Man.

• 55:57Speaker 02

  That's that one hour.

• 55:58Ryan Clark?

  Bruh, this was, I'm gonna be honest, but I didn't really know what to expect, you know? We got the little sheet that they send. This was, this was amazing, like, truly, man. I, I am extremely grateful. I mean, obviously, you can tell I'm a fan, I was trying not to show that. I saw you in Dallas at a game once. I don't know if any of these people who are here today were with you. I was leaving, I ran all the way back to dap you off and introduce myself, and, and it was...

• 56:29Speaker 02

  It was, what, a basketball or football?

• 56:30Ryan Clark?

  It was at a basketball game.

• 56:31Speaker 02

  I was drunk, it had to be a Mavericks game.

• 56:33Ryan Clark?

  It was a Mavericks game. It was a Mavericks game, but...

• 56:35Speaker 02

  For sure. You gotta, you gotta be drunk to watch the Mavericks.

• 56:40Speaker 02

  I'm a Mavs fan, we gotta be drunk, so.

• 56:43Ryan Clark?

  But nah, I met you that time, man, and I hope that one day we'd get to sit down with you, so it was really cool, man, get a chance, chop it up, but I appreciate you.

• 56:49Speaker 02

  But before we get off, 'cause like I said, this wouldn't be me if I didn't ask. Y'all didn't ask a lot of questions about me. I know y'all grown, y'all good, y'all established, but y'all, y'all good.

• 57:01Ryan Clark?

  Most times, yeah. We had the conversation often. I think, for me, right now, it's probably the best I've been in an extremely long time. Every now and then, 'cause we all, we all feel like we're something.

• 57:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:17Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? Like, we all got this, these things, we, like you say, these things we stand on. And I have these certain principles and these certain foundations and the certain things that I feel like I'm always gonna be. And I think when you're up, you're up so high, like, like, your feet aren't on the ground, you don't know what you're standing on. And I got a chance to be down recently.

• 57:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:37Ryan Clark?

  And it's the best thing that's ever happened to me, because I got to see, like, all this stuff you taught, everything you tell everybody else who's going through something, can you be that? Can you do that? And God showed me that I could, and I think that was a, a lesson I needed to learn. And the thing He showed me that was more important were all the people who loved and supported me when I was down.

• 58:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:04Ryan Clark?

  Now, I don't have to question that ever again, and I think that's the most important thing I learned.

• 58:09Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, and I, I was drifting for a little bit, then my grandmother got sick with dementia, and then I sort of started coming to grift with, I will have to be the patriarch. I was the patriarch, but I will have to be the one that everybody will come to for the advice and the, and the wisdom and the lesson. And then this show, it became my therapy. You know, the people you surround yourself with, that, that, when you realize that you're servicing all of the people on the other side of the tube, the people that watch us, support us, and follow us, you realize that you're sacrificing of yourself, but you are giving back.

• 58:51Fred Taylor?

  Like, when I know we tapped in and, and we hear people say, "You saved my life this way," or "You helped my mental health that," like, that does something for me. Like, it is my therapy. Meeting people like you, I just told, you know, our, our last guest, like, I'm a fan of a lot of the people that we sit across from. Knowing that, like, that's my therapy, that excites me, that makes me wanna show up, the, the group that I do it with. I am good, to answer your question, I am good, but this helps, this is my outlet, but even the house, making sure the house good, and doubling down when I'm home, so I'm, I'm solid.

• 59:28Ryan Clark?

  Yeah. I'm straight, bruh, I appreciate you asking.

• 59:31Speaker 02

  You light skin, you gotta be straight.

• 59:32Ryan Clark?

  I'm in. We need a good life.

• 59:34Speaker 05

  Don't start that, dawg.

• 59:35Ryan Clark?

  Hybrids, hybrids.

• 59:39Ryan Clark?

  Hey, see, the crazy thing, though, whenever we get somebody on the show, he go to comparing himself, he be like, "Man, it's like, it's, it's me, it's Boris Kojo."

• 59:49Channing Crowder?

  Steph.

• 59:50Ryan Clark?

  He be like, it's President Obama.

• 59:56Channing Crowder?

  It's a bunch of us out there, man. Will Smith.

• 1:00:01Channing Crowder?

  I will tell you this, bro, because you made me think. It's a couple of things that made me think. And it's something I do. It's when I feel as if like I'm being fucked over or I'm not being appreciated. From any angle in life, I'm not gonna be as excited. I'm not gonna be as fun. I'm not gonna be as funny. I'm not gonna, you know what I'm saying? Y'all don't appreciate it anyway. And then you just sit in fucking sadness.

• 1:00:26Channing Crowder?

  So, I'm naturally happy. I'm gonna teach people a lesson by not being happy. You know who I'm teaching a lesson to? My motherfucking self.

• 1:00:34Ryan Clark?

  Yo dumb ass.

• 1:00:35Channing Crowder?

  My dumb ass is sitting around saying, fuck that shit. I'm about to be me. Y'all gotta appreciate it. Because I'm gonna enjoy this life I'm living. I'm gonna enjoy these walls around me at all times, every day. And that's why I kinda, and I do, and I fall, like you saying, that life is a, that mind is hell. That back and forth in the mind, that's a strong ass thing. But when I am in a good place, which I am now, I know it's where I'm supposed to be. And I'm sitting in a very good place. Now, like Freddie said, being around them, and really, bro, being around people that don't need shit from you. Because you know when you pick that phone up and you do that little, I got them.

• 1:01:12Speaker 02

  Now, you know it's bad. I be telling my little here, baby, you can hold my phone. You see what I'm saying? That's when you know it's bad.

• 1:01:17Ryan Clark?

  And he would like that.

• 1:01:18Speaker 02

  That's when you know it's bad.

• 1:01:22Speaker 02

  I don't even do that no more here, baby. Just take it. I don't, I'm good. I don't even want it.

• 1:01:25Channing Crowder?

  That'd be the funny thing, too. We get to a point, I'm gonna tell you, bro, we don't need nothing from you. We all sitting good. Like, you know what I'm saying? We good. And that's the thing, to know people out here, man, we just, we, shit, we care about you. We wanna holler at you. We are blessed to have you sit down with us. And we don't want nothing from you. Yeah. Matter of fact, you want this juice shot?

• 1:01:44Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no. It look better to go with your skin.

• 1:01:50Ryan Clark?

  It's good.

• 1:01:51Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, X, the one thing that got us here was the album, man. We ain't even really, we've been talking about life. We ain't even touched on the music. Better over time. Like, you know, take us there, like, what we expect.

• 1:02:02Speaker 02

  I feel like every one of my albums really just be more personal. Got a Take Her album, which is when like everything really kinda started. So you kinda can really just tell. Well, my people can tell. Most people, they don't know me, you know what I'm saying? So they don't know. They just think I'm just rapping. But that's when everything kinda just started. So then, boom, you got the Take Here, and you know, music just kept going. But this one is like now, I'm basically talking about like my realization with everything that's going on from just the industry, the people, the selfishness, the, just everything. Yeah, it's just a mix of everything. There's some fun stuff in there. There's some, but it's just, it's just more personal for me. My album be more personal. So I'm talking about what I'm going through, you know what I'm saying?

• 1:02:44Speaker 02

  Which, which I've been waiting, you know, what the, what the fans been waiting on. Where X been? Where he, where he? Here you go. This is what I've been going through. This is, this is, this is life right now. Yeah. I said, there's some, there's some kind of songs on there, but

• 1:02:59Speaker 02

  majority of it is, is just, I'm talking about me. I'm talking about what I'm going through. So, like you said, it's already one big sad person out there. But I don't know, they gonna have to feel me somehow, you know, so.

• 1:03:10Ryan Clark?

  You got your shirt on, on the cover?

• 1:03:12Speaker 02

  Under the cover.

• 1:03:12Ryan Clark?

  You got your shirt on, on the cover of the album? When they get the cover art? Or you ain't got no shirt on?

• 1:03:18Speaker 02

  I don't.

• 1:03:21Speaker 02

  And what's crazy is, what's crazy is five, it's like five different versions of me on there. I ain't, none of them got no shirt on.

• 1:03:27Ryan Clark?

  I already saw it. I already knew it. Ain't got a shirt on. Nantai even.

• 1:03:33Ryan Clark?

  I already knew he had no shirt on, dawg. That dude, ay, never got no shirt on, bro.