Peter King, legendary writer on his journey of 40 years inside the NFL, the stories that changed the game and relationships behind the infamous faces of the league from Patrick Mahomes to Michael Irvin to Bill Parcells to Mike Holmgren and more

Some guests we could talk to for hours, Peter King is one of them, an icon of ours who covered the game we love with writing that help shaped NFL's game-changing moments and stories that will live forever. For more than four decades, Peter King has been one of the most trusted voices in football, earning a front-row seat to the people, moments, and decisions that transformed the NFL into the cultural powerhouse it is today. The legendary sportswriter sits with Ryan, Channing and Fred for an unforgettable conversation about his life covering the NFL, the relationships that shaped his journey, personal encounters with each of the guys and his new book, The Game. From Mike Holmgren to Tom Brady, Brett Favre to Patrick Mahomes, and commissioner Paul Tagliabue to the coaches, players, and power brokers who helped define entire eras, Peter has spent his career gaining access to the people behind football's biggest stories. But what made those relationships possible? How did he earn the trust of the game's most influential figures? And what does it take to tell the stories that fans never get to see beyond the field? Peter takes us inside his remarkable career, revisiting the moments that defined generations of football. He shares stories from getting his start at Giants training camp to spending Super Bowl week with Green Bay Packers to riding back with Steve Young to his hotel after one of the greatest performances in Super Bowl history, and witnessing the early signs of Mahomes' extraordinary talent. He also revisits the behind-the-scenes decisions that changed the league, including Reggie White's free-agency journey to Green Bay and the pivotal moments that shaped football's evolution. In his new book, The Game, Peter goes beyond the greatest hits of his reporting career and the result is a sweeping, deeply personal look at 40 years of NFL history, told through the people who lived it. The book explores everything from Bill Walsh's final season with the 49ers to the leadership of the league's commissioners, the human cost of football, and the business decisions that helped turn the sport into a year-round obsession. On this episode, Peter also reflects on his own journey as a journalist, the lessons he learned from legendary coaches, the friendships and trust built over years of reporting, and how the world of sports media has changed. He opens up about what it means to cover a game for a lifetime, the responsibility of telling stories honestly, and the tension between the sport's incredible growth and the challenges it continues to face. As always on The Pivot, the conversation goes deeper than football. It's about relationships, legacy, curiosity, and the people who shape our lives along the way. Peter King's story reminds us that behind every legendary player, championship, and defining moment is a human story worth telling. Don't miss this historical conversation on The Pivot Podcast, episode now live on Netflix. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:29Ryan Clark?

  You can't write the story of the NFL without Peter King. Once nicknamed relentless, he built a career on more than great writing. It was unmatched work ethic and relationships that opened the door to stories only he could tell. Before Bill Parcells became a Hall of Fame coach, Peter King would show up early for coffee and stand in the parking lot to have conversations that ultimately led to a great relationship, because that was Peter's secret. Yes, he outworked everyone, but he also understood that the relationships were just as important as being able to write a great story. He's the legendary creator of Monday Morning Quarterback, and he releases a new book now called The Game. It takes us back through the history of the league that he loves and covering the Giants. Also, Michael Irvin and his office,

• 1:13Ryan Clark?

  which some would just call a strip club. We talked to Hall of Fame quarterbacks who remain his friend to this day, the moments that shaped the NFL, and why something I said over 15 years ago has stuck with him. He's the kind of storyteller who gazed out of the window at NFL Films to see where Steve Sabal's ashes were spread. And he shadowed Steve Young on the night he won Super Bowl MVP. He gave him enough Gatorade and cookies to watch him throw up and sat as he needed IV fluids to keep him awake just long enough to celebrate. And those are the kind of stories that only Peter King can tell. This conversation is special to me because football is the game that I love. It's the game that Peter loves, too. It's about relationships and a lifetime spent documenting the game

• 1:58Ryan Clark?

  through the eyes of someone who has seen it all. So please welcome the legendary Peter King as he shares his incredible knowledge, experiences, and stories with me, Chan, and Freddie T. Hold up. Limitless, niggas stomach kinda pinning it. I fought to hear the witnesses. Got my people feeling militant. Way I'm feeling got me up. On the mission got me up. Knowing me, I got the key. On the vision I can trust, trust. Limitless, niggas stomach kinda pinning it. I fought to hear the witnesses. Got my people feeling militant. Peter King, absolute legend. We are honored to have you here on the Pivot. This is Channing Crowder. This is Fred Taylor. I'm Ryan Clark. Pivot fam, thank you for pivoting with us. You are, I can't call it soundtrack because we read it,

• 2:43Ryan Clark?

  but for all of our football lives, you were the go-to man. Your ability to get people to tell you stories and to allow you to be close, I think, is just indicative of the type of person you are. It wasn't about the writer you were. I want to ask you about being, working for the New York Giants or covering the New York Giants and showing up early every morning to be in the coffee room. Right? So you might catch Coach Parcells, or you might catch the DC or the OC, the assistant coaches in there. What was it about your inquisitiveness that put you in places like that to get close to where the stories were?

• 3:24Speaker 02

  Ryan, you guys are gonna know exactly what this is in your walk of life, okay? So when you guys go on to a football team in high school, college, or the NFL, you always look at your competition. You always look at who you have to be better than to play. And then you have to look at who do you have to be better than to get that second contract? Or in free agency to really get paid, okay? And so when I went to cover the New York Giants in 1985, you know, I was 27 years old.

• 4:08Speaker 02

  And I only knew at the time there were 19 newspapers that covered the New York Giants every day. And so I didn't know a soul. I knew nobody. I just showed up the first day, introduced myself to Bill Parcells. I didn't know him. I didn't know anybody. And at that time, I said to my wife, I said, "Anne, I know that I'm a little bit devoted to my job, but I got a big favor to ask you. I want to live in this little town in upstate New York from New York, New York City, Pleasantville, New York. And I want to live here so that I can be there every day at 7 o'clock in the morning."

• 4:53Speaker 02

  Because most guys didn't show up until 9. So I would show up at 7, and I would see Parcells, Belichick, Ron Auerhart, all the coaches on that staff. And about the third or fourth day, Bill Parcells looks at me, and I said, "Hey, good morning, Bill." And he goes, "Who the fuck are you?" And I said, "I'm Peter King. I work for Newsday." And he says, "What are you doing here?" And I said, "Bill, there's 19 newspapers that cover this beat every day. I want to compete. I want to be better than them. So in order to do that,

• 5:34Speaker 02

  I need to do something to distinguish myself, differentiate myself." And he just shook his head, and he walked out of the room. And I have no idea to this day if he, I'm sure he doesn't even remember that. But Ryan, the only way you can be really good at something, in my opinion, is to look at your competition and say, "How can I be better than them?" That's how I always looked at it.

• 6:04Fred Taylor?

  The legendary Mr. King.

• 6:07Speaker 02

  Thank you, Fred.

• 6:08Fred Taylor?

  Bill, Coach Parcells even nicknamed you Relentless. Was that your greatest strength? Or did it come at a cost?

• 6:16Speaker 02

  Well, everything comes at a cost. But I was, you know, I'm the luckiest man on the face of the earth because my wife understood my drive. And, you know, I tried to be as good a husband and father as I could. And, you know, I'm still with my wife, so I guess she thought it was okay. My kids haven't disowned me, so we're okay there. But the reason he called me that is that the, at the time, the New York Giants did not like

• 6:56Speaker 02

  the media to have side conversations with people, okay? They wanted things done in a press conference, which I understand because if Parcells has got to walk off with one guy, the other guys are gonna see that. But so I made this deal with Bill. If it's really, really important, would you mind if I just met you at your parking space when you got to work in the morning? If it, I won't abuse this, I promise. And so he said, "Okay." And so one day, at 5:45 a.m., in the parking lot at Giant Stadium, the old stadium, I was just standing there, waiting for him.

• 7:40Speaker 02

  And he just said, "Oh my, you've got to be kidding me." But I had a couple of questions for him, you know? And I asked him the questions, and at that time, luckily, he said, "Come upstairs, we can talk." So we went upstairs into his office, and we talked for like 45 minutes. And I hate to say it because it makes me sound whatever, but that's when I knew that, he knew that I wasn't just some guy who was gonna show up at, you know, and put in my time and go home. This was everything to me. It was everything. You go to college to study journalism

• 8:24Speaker 02

  and to want to be great at something, at least I did, and I just knew it was gonna take more than just showing up and being in a gaggle and talking at press conferences. You really have to be able to do things like that in order for people to say, "Okay, he's serious about this."

• 8:45Ryan Clark?

  At this time, was this when you had the Afro?

• 8:48Speaker 02

  I didn't have a big Afro, but I had a smaller one. I had an Afro when I worked in Cincinnati, and it was totally bizarre. When I look at pictures of me now, I can't believe that anyone would take me seriously and look like that. It was, that was a weird point of my life, but anyway.

• 9:12Ryan Clark?

  Say, bro, do y'all remember when Clay Matthews got his looks maxed? I'm talking about like ridiculous jawline, balloon biceps, them huge calf implants? Which, by the way, I wouldn't be mad if I could get some of those.

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• 10:31Ryan Clark?

  Peter, talking about like stalking Bill Parcells, but you're speaking about your wife about relationships. And to be as successful as you've been with so many, journalism, reporting, this author, everything you do, the names in this book are legendary names. Is your career about relationships more than the ability to write?

• 10:53Speaker 02

  Well, when I got to Sports Illustrated in 1989, all I could think of was, "I am not worthy." Because you guys...

• 11:03Speaker 02

  Your players, you were players, honestly, when Sports Illustrated really meant something. It was a big, big deal. When I got to SI in 1989, it was bigger, or certainly at least as big as ESPN. But what I will always remember is like, the Dallas Cowboys were getting really big at the time. Okay? And when I went to the Dallas Cowboys, Michael Irvin was the man. And I just thought, okay, I have to get to know Michael Irvin. That is my job.

• 11:47Speaker 02

  And Michael Irvin at the time, you know, he was like, it was the same thing with Deion. Deion, because he was big at the time. I wanted to get to know Deion and get to have a relationship with Deion. And I'll just detour just one second. But you know when I knew that, at the time anyway, and I'm not, I wouldn't consider myself in any way close to Deion Sanders. But at the time, I was. And at the time, I knew that Deion Sanders kind of trusted me because he gave me his road pseudonym. So in other words, remember in those days,

• 12:31Speaker 02

  not cell phones. If you wanted to get a hold of guys and they were on the road at a game, you, many of them had fake names that they would check in with. And so Deion's fake name was Red Fox. And when I got his pseudonym, when I got the Red Fox, I said, okay, I got Deion now. I got Deion. But anyway, anyway, the reason that I wanted to sort of get to know Michael Irvin well is that, Channing, when you're around a team and you walk into a locker room and you're there for a little while,

• 13:15Speaker 02

  you can tell who not runs it or controls it, but who every player in that room looks up to. Okay? Michael Irvin was the effing man. And I just said to myself, okay, I gotta get to know him. So I would talk to him. And here I am, this, this kind of this white kid who grew up in an all-white town in Connecticut. And here's Michael Irvin, you know, obviously as incredibly talented as he was. But he also had this thing about him. He almost had a force field around him with the Cowboys.

• 14:00Speaker 02

  Everybody looked up to Michael Irvin. Troy, everybody on that team. And so I used to just try to go, every time I was around the Cowboys, I'd make absolutely sure that I would spend time with Michael. To the point that one time I went in to do a story on the Cowboys. And I said, Michael, I want to interview you. He says, okay, come to my office. And so I followed him in my rental car. He followed, followed him to what he called his office, which was a strip club in Dallas. And I sat there at the strip club with, with all kinds of stuff going on around him. Okay? Interviewing, he says, okay, I'm ready. Let's go.

• 14:45Speaker 02

  And so I talked to him. And he was fantastic. And meanwhile, I'm going, you know, like this, you know, like that. But that was, but you know why I really, really liked Michael Irvin? Because it was everything to him to be great at this game. And I, I like people who like to be great. You know, I, I like to be around those people. Even though, I mean, I could barely throw a football. I could see with Michael Irvin that not only was it important to him, but everything that he did

• 15:29Speaker 02

  in like browbeating Alvin Harper and to, and to basically, man, give me the ball. I, he always was a give me the ball guy. Not because he wanted to lead the league in receiving, even though he did. But he knew that if you gave him the ball, the Cowboys were going to win the game. That is something I just really, he's on an incredibly short list, you know, that probably starts with Michael Irvin and ends with Patrick Mahomes, of guys who I just said, okay, put the ball in their hands on the biggest play of the game. And, and I trust that he will die trying.

• 16:13Channing Crowder?

  Peter, I like all that stuff that was going on too.

• 16:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, you're looking around, yeah.

• 16:18Channing Crowder?

  But as you talk about Michael as a, as a, you're a young reporter, you know, he's a, he's a young player.

• 16:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:24Channing Crowder?

  That's, you said in late 80s?

• 16:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:26Channing Crowder?

  How did that change the players moving forward? Because I'm sure you, as you get to those 2000s and all, guys start getting protected or social media stuff and all of that. How much did it change through your career with that connection with players?

• 16:37Speaker 02

  Channing, listen, I'm, I'm dead serious when I say this. This is not, I'm the luckiest man on the face of the earth. I got in at the right time. If I got in now, there's just no way. I mean, how in the world in 1995, Mike Holmgren allowed me to spend a week, a game week with the Green Bay Packers? I could go anywhere. I was at Brett Favre's house three times that week. Because Holmgren stood up in front of the team and he goes, this is Peter King. He's going to be around this week. You know, blah, blah, blah. You know, if he wants to talk to you, please talk to him. That kind of stuff, it just doesn't happen now. I'm not saying it can't happen.

• 17:20Speaker 02

  It just doesn't happen as readily now. And it's one of the reasons why last Super Bowl I covered, Chiefs win the Super Bowl in Vegas. And 55 minutes after the game, I'm alone with Andy Reid and he's diagramming the winning play in the game or what he thought was winning. And the door is closed. I'm the only one in there along with my videographer. And, and, and so that can only happen because in 1995, I met Andy Reid and I, you know, talked to him for 30 years. Or, you know, that, and so that is fortunate because these days is just very hard

• 18:03Speaker 02

  to have those kind of relationships for that length of time.

• 18:07Ryan Clark?

  You know, you don't get to write a book like this, Mr. King, Peter, and just call it the game if you haven't been a part of the game. I think when time goes on and the story of the NFL is written, it's obviously going to be about players and coaches and general managers, but it's going to be about the voices. You know, I believe that this game or the story of this game can't be told without your voice. Story of our game can't be told without Steve Sable's voice as well. And I know you guys share the relationship. There's a chapter in the book about Steve Sable. And just as you were having those conversations and doing that research, what stuck out most to you about someone who told so many stories

• 18:52Ryan Clark?

  about the great game of football as you did?

• 18:55Speaker 02

  Ryan, one of the things that really stuck out to me is that when, when I started to think, when I retired after the 23 season, you know, I decided I was going to write a book. The one thing that hit me is that I do not want to just replay my greatest hits and write about, you know, write about what it was like. Let's, let's say, for example, why did Reggie White go to Green Bay? I never really knew why Reggie White truly, deep down, absolutely deep down, went to the Green Bay Packers. Okay? And Reggie White is not around to tell us why he went to the Green Bay Packers.

• 19:39Speaker 02

  But his agent, Jimmy Sexton, is. Ron Wolf, the general manager of the Packers at the time, still is. Mike Reinfeldt, who negotiated the contract with Jimmy Sexton for Reggie White, he is. And Carmen Policy of, formerly of the San Francisco 49ers, he's still around and he's in his 80s. But I'll tell you one thing. He remembers vividly the descriptions of things that happened way back then. So I wanted to go back and find out why things like that happened. Okay? And one story vividly sticks out to me. I interviewed Paul Tagliabue several months before his death.

• 20:24Speaker 02

  I was one of the last people in our business to talk to Paul Tagliabue before he died. And I remember, I went to see Paul Tagliabue five days after the planes hit the World Trade Center. 2,900 people died. And I remember that day, I went to see him on Saturday in the NFL office in Manhattan. And Paul Tagliabue cried that day. And now, Paul Tagliabue was a cold fish. Okay? I liked him because he, he, there was nothing phony about him. But he was not emotional at all.

• 21:06Speaker 02

  And I always wondered, why did he cry that day? What was going through his head? What was happening at that moment? And I found out why he cried that day. And one of the reasons why he cried, he, like the mayor of New York City, Rudolph Giuliani, was worried at that moment that there could be a second attack on New York City. And one of the things that worried Paul Tagliabue, who his first job out of law school at Georgetown, his first job was with the Defense Department. And doing that job, one of the things that he did, he had a project. And the project was basically

• 21:50Speaker 02

  trying to figure out how possible it would be for an enemy, an enemy country, to slip a nuclear device into the United States and blow it up remotely and kill hundreds of thousands of people. How possible was that? He feared that in the days after nine eleven. And he feared another country, whatever country it could be, was going to attack the United States. And so, Ryan, I know that that is a sobering story. But when I found that out, when I talked to him, I just was,

• 22:33Speaker 02

  I said, that's why it's important to go back to people years later and say, what were you thinking at this time? Hey, Jimmy Sexton, why did Reggie White really choose the Green Bay Packers? Why? And to go to all of these people after all these years and ask them why things really happened. And so that is one of the things about this book that I'm kind of excited about.

• 23:04Ryan Clark?

  And when you looked out of the window at NFL Films and could see the tree that Steve Sabel's ashes are spread under, just what does that signify to you about his love for the NFL, but for the place that he built in Mount Laurel?

• 23:22Speaker 02

  Steve Sabel is one of the most underrated figures in NFL history. And I know everybody says, oh, Sabel, he's awesome. He's fantastic. Does anybody have any idea all the stuff that he did? I mean, I write this thing in the book about how Steve Sabel, just recently out of college, finds himself in Vince Lombardi's basement on the night of the Ice Bowl. When they have this historic game and Bart Starr has this quarterback sneak on this frozen field and the Packers beat the Dallas Cowboys. And the night of the Ice Bowl, Steve Sabel,

• 24:05Speaker 02

  it's New Year's Eve, he is in Vince Lombardi's house with a Bell and Howell movie camera that some people use for home movies. And he's filming this night and Vince Lombardi makes kind of a joke that maybe it's time to put the camera away. And Steve Sabel, in his mind, thinks, Jesus, Vince Lombardi wants me to put the camera away? I'm not putting the camera away. And you know why I'm not putting the camera away? Because no one will ever have this opportunity again to see Steve Sabel, you know,

• 24:48Speaker 02

  in the three hours after the signature win of his incredible career. No one will ever have the opportunity to see who Vince Lombardi really is. Okay? And so to me, and the reason I mention that is that Steve Sabel, part of his genius was to know from a young age, man, I have got to be here to document this moment because no one's ever going to have this opportunity to document a moment like this again. And so when I went to NFL Films

• 25:30Speaker 02

  and heard the story of how he choreographed his own his own memorial service at NFL Films. And, you know, he could look out his window at a dwarf elm tree that, believe me, if anybody goes by it, you've seen 9,000 trees today that are more impressive than this tree. But you know why it was important to him? Because it was outside his office and he could see it every day. So the fact that you're going to spread his ashes on the bark around the dwarf elm tree, he wanted that so that now for the rest of time, anybody who ever goes to NFL Films

• 26:15Speaker 02

  is just saying, that's the Steve Sabel tree.

• 26:19Fred Taylor?

  I think that's an amazing story. We get little stories here and there from Alicia, who's very, she's worked with NFL Films in her younger days. So it's always good to hear those. Peter, I did want to ask you though, to achieve the sort of success as a journalist over the 40 years you've covered the NFL, you have to have the access, which you spoke about, got to have the trust by some of the bigger names and coaches in the game. Did having both of those make it harder to report the truth, though?

• 26:51Speaker 02

  That's a really good question. It's a great question. And, you know, I have a few regrets over time about probably getting too close. But I do think you are always walking that fine line. You're always, always trying to striving to find the balance because, you know, Brett Favre's not going to let you in if he thinks that you're going to screw him. That's all there is to it. But I also have to make sure that people know that, listen, there's some things I'm not going to hide,

• 27:35Speaker 02

  some things I'm not going to compromise on. And so that was hard. But I think honestly, you know, I know that, I mean, Mike Holmgren once said to me after a bitter loss to the Minnesota Vikings in the Metrodome, I remember he looked up at me when I was asking him a question respectfully, but dispassionately, he said to me words to this effect. And I don't remember the exact quotes, but, you don't care, do you? You just don't care. And I knew exactly what he meant. You don't care that we just had this gut-wrenching

• 28:18Speaker 02

  loss to our arch rivals, the Vikings. And I just said, as respectfully as possible, I said, Mike, I'm sorry, I can't care. I got 32 teams that are my home team, basically. I can't care who wins or loses. One of the funniest things is somebody said to me recently, hey, you're retired now, so can you go back to rooting for a team now? Like when I was a kid, I was a big New York Giants fan. My father was a New York Giants fan. So I was a New York Giants fan. And so I said, I just don't feel it.

• 29:01Speaker 02

  I don't feel like if the Giants are on TV, I don't care any more than if the Chargers are on TV. I just, so I think if you do one thing for 40 years and you try to be Switzerland, you try to just straddle the line and be fair to everybody, I think it's hard, once that's over, to say, okay, now I'm going to root for whoever. Now, having said that, I'll be honest with you. I really like, just because I like the people, I like Mahomes.

• 29:44Speaker 02

  I like Andy Reid. You know, there's a lot of people who I like. I like Lamar. Lamar is a gas. I mean, to this day, if I see, I saw him a couple of years ago. I saw him last year. He said, hi, Mr. Peter. And that's because the southern gentleman in Lamar Jackson, his mother, taught him, you know, that you want to be respectful to people, to your elders. And I always would say, will you stop calling me Mr. Peter? But he can't, he's just respectful. That's who he is. But Fred, that's a fantastic question.

• 30:28Speaker 02

  It's something I struggled with for a long time. And all I can say is I tried my best to honor my employer and my relationship with players and coaches.

• 30:42Channing Crowder?

  Hey, Mr. Peter.

• 30:43Speaker 02

  All right.

• 30:44Channing Crowder?

  I'll go that way now, if you love it.

• 30:45Speaker 00

  Mr. Peter is Lisa.

• 30:47Channing Crowder?

  But almost to the other side of that, where, like you say, you love Andy, you love Pat, you love Lamar. What about guys you didn't like? Or like in all aspects of life, in the locker room? There's guys I played with, I respected, I had the in and out receivers with. I didn't like them as a person. What about, I guess, separating the art from the artist in your career?

• 31:11Speaker 02

  No one cares if I like Patrick Mahomes. No one cares if I liked Tom Brady or something like, nobody cares. All they care about is the information that I can give them. And so that's why, at least, I look at it, Channing, and I look at, for instance, people who I may not have liked. And I always would pride myself, if you read my story, like, I was not the type of guy to say, oh, such and such is an ass. I wouldn't say that publicly, even though there are some people who I do feel are asses. Okay?

• 31:55Speaker 02

  But, but, you know, you have to be a professional, too. And just like you might not like some guy, you know, I don't want to be corny, but you gotta go to war with him on Sunday. And so for those three hours, you know, you're his brother. And that's just the way you have to be. And that's the way I always felt like I had to be, too. There were some guys who I may not have liked very much. I remember one time, there was a guard for the 49ers named Kevin Gogan. Huge, mountainous guy. And I had dared called Kevin Gogan journeyman, which I believe at the time I wrote that, he was on his third team in five years. That kind of defines journeyman.

• 32:36Speaker 02

  So he viewed it as a very negative thing. And he, literally, in that locker room, he came at me with finger pointing and everything like that. And I said, Kevin, sorry, but you moved around. That's what a journeyman is. I mean, it's not an insult like that. And so he walked back and everything. And then later in the day, he kind of sidles up to me and he goes, how'd you going, didn't I? So, and I think, like, I think there are times when, not that, I don't even mean, I didn't,

• 33:20Speaker 02

  it's not like I stood up to him or anything like that, but I just tried to explain why I said or why I wrote what I did. And I think, look, I think most players understand, I mean, sometimes, I'm sure I've taken cheap shots at guys, that in retrospect, knowing now what I may have known, or what I didn't know then, I would regret doing it, but, Jesus, I covered it for 40 years. I wrote more words than anybody in the history of the Sports Illustrated franchise, magazine, and internet. I'm gonna F some things up, there's no question about it.

• 34:00Speaker 02

  But I, I don't know, I tried to be as honest, I tried to be honest every day I did the job.

• 34:06Ryan Clark?

  You, I think the reason people respect you so much is the level of integrity that they felt you had in your work. There was one point where you talked about stepping away from Sports Illustrated, I think, maybe it involved Ray Rice or Spygate. Can you take me into that story and why you would feel so strongly that you thought you might need to step away from Sports Illustrated?

• 34:30Speaker 02

  I made a mistake in my reporting in Spygate. Chris Mortensen, the late Chris Mortensen, who I had tremendous respect for, reported that, I think his exact story was that 11 of the 12 footballs, after the Patriots deflategate controversy, where we were in the middle of the deflategate controversy, after the playoff game against the Colts in 2015, were found to be underinflated. Proof, allegedly, that the footballs were deflated at that time. And so I found two people with knowledge of the situation who confirmed Mortensen's

• 35:15Speaker 02

  story to me. And so I said, I can confirm that, you know, my sources say the same thing, that 11 of the 12 footballs were not at the inflation that they should have been when the NFL inspected the footballs. And it turned out that I was wrong. And the reason I was wrong is that on a very, very cold day, footballs would naturally deflate, which I certainly didn't know at the time, I don't think anybody knew at the time. But it turns out that I was wrong. And when I found that out, I just wrote, I called the managing editor at Sports Illustrated,

• 35:56Speaker 02

  Chris Stone, and said, I will offer my resignation because I deserve to be criticized for this. It doesn't matter why I was wrong. That doesn't matter. What matters is that I was wrong. And so I said, I will offer my resignation if you want it. I'll write my resignation right now and give it to you. And he said, no, no, no, no. It's understandable, I know why what happened, happened. But I did want people to know that we have to stand behind what we report. That's all there is to it. Whatever the reason for what we report, we have to stand behind it.

• 36:37Speaker 02

  And if we're wrong, you know, we have to not only admit we're wrong, but in my opinion, anyway, I think we have to say, if you guys find that this is so, it so diverges from where we are as an entity, and if you think that it really hurts our product, I'll resign. And, you know, they said, no, but I would have resigned and I wouldn't have been bitter about it. I would have deserved to not work there anymore because that's a major, major error.

• 37:15Ryan Clark?

  Peter, what is your relationship with Coach Belichick now? I know at one point...

• 37:19Speaker 02

  I haven't talked to him since 2006. And the reason I haven't talked to him is that I felt and still feel to this day that he knew exactly what he was doing when he videotaped the New York Jets sidelines in violation, in clear violation of what the NFL rules were. And I wrote that and I said it. And, look, I had had a great relationship with Belichick. I mean, I talked to Art Modell before Modell hired him because there was a lot of thought that Bill Belichick was not going to be a successful NFL coach because of his personality. And I told Modell, I thought that was a pile of crap.

• 38:04Speaker 02

  I said, call Lawrence Taylor, will you? I mean, this guy helps people win. That's what this game is about. And I said, and players love coaches who they know are gonna help get them better and help them win. But I think that with Bill was a bridge too far. I had been in, look, I mean, I did a profile on Bill for Sports Illustrated in 2004. I was in his childhood home with his parents in Annapolis, Maryland. I was in his bedroom. His mother asked me, do you want to see Bill's room? Why, yes, yes, I do, Mrs. Belichick. Yeah. And so I went into his room.

• 38:48Speaker 02

  I saw the books that he read in high school. So I had a pretty good relationship with him, but he viewed that as a bridge too far when I was highly critical of him for what happened during Spygate.

• 39:06Fred Taylor?

  As you talk about Coach Belichick and his personality not really having much to do with winning, the success of a team, I was just going through the books. And what I like to do with books is just open a random page.

• 39:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:19Fred Taylor?

  And the page I opened kind of takes us back to the segment we just did on the Pivot Sports Show. It's called Fuck It.

• 39:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:26Fred Taylor?

  When R.C.

• 39:27Speaker 02

  Fuck It Factor, yeah.

• 39:29Fred Taylor?

  Exactly, that chapter, the Fuck It Factor. Kind of how did you get to naming it that?

• 39:34Speaker 02

  Fuck It Factor is basically about, it really sticks with me because Ron Wolf, the former general manager of the Packers, Hall of Fame GM, was, you know, basically told me, that's what a quarterback has to have. He's gotta have the fuck it factor. Because there are times when you are in that position, the most important position in team sports, where you can totally screw things up, but you have to feel like, you know, fuck it. I just, I've got...

• 40:11Speaker 02

  You know, how every guy in this locker room, all the coaches, these are guys who rely on me. So I, I've gotta, I've gotta be able to say, hey, screw it. You know, whatever mistakes I've made, it doesn't matter. I gotta go win this game. And the reason why I wrote this chapter, I don't know if you guys remember this guy. Okay, the San Francisco 49ers, post Joe Montana, post Steve Young, were still looking for a quarterback to be the cornerstone of this franchise. And Bill Walsh, at the time, was still advising the franchise in this particular year. They were looking for a quarterback and they drafted in the third round, a quarterback from Hofstra,

• 40:55Speaker 02

  named Giovanni Carmazzy. And Gio Carmazzy, I was there in training camp in California in this year. Incredibly fortuitous day, because this was the day that Joe Montana was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame. And Gio Carmazzy, Carmazzy and his roommate, Tim Ratai, another quarterback at the time, yeah. Tim Ratai and Gio Carmazzy were up in their room and Gio was watching on TV Joe Montana being inducted into the Hall of Fame. And I could just tell, like, his whole, all his body language, man, I, I, I, I'm not worthy.

• 41:40Speaker 02

  I don't, I don't know if I belong. And that day, he, I could see, he was intimidated throwing the ball to Jerry Rice. Okay, and, and so, and he was talking about that with me. And, and I understood why he would be intimidated about, you know, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Gio Carmazzy. I mean, just, it doesn't really fit. Okay, and, but, but, if you're Gio Carmazzy, you cannot think that or you are defeated right then. I'm just telling you. And I just walked away from that thinking,

• 42:24Speaker 02

  man, hey, and one of the guys who I think, who I write about in the book, who I think had the fuck it factor, was Matt Ryan. Matt Ryan got to Atlanta and I was there the day that he was drafted. And there was a sports anchor in Atlanta who basically said to me that weekend, it doesn't matter how good Matt Ryan ever is here. He will never replace Michael Vick. Vick is always gonna be a legend here. And so I remember, I told Matt Ryan that at the time and he's, as anybody would, when they haven't done a damn thing yet.

• 43:09Speaker 02

  Matt Ryan said, well, I can only hope to, uh, live up to Matt Ryan, or to Michael Vick and, and I can only hope that I'll be the best quarterback I can be for this franchise and that's what I'm gonna try to be. Years later, I asked Matt Ryan, remember when I told you that day that that sports anchor said that he'll never be Michael Vick? And, you know, and

• 43:35Speaker 02

  dumb decision by this franchise. They should have hung on to Vick even though at that moment, Michael Vick was in Leavenworth Prison in Kansas. But, anyway, and I said, what were you really thinking that day? And the sports anchor's name was a guy named Gil Tyree and I hate to drag him up because Gil Tyree was great at his job, but that just happened to be his opinion. So, good for him not hiding it. He said what he thought. And, and he says, Matt Ryan said to me, he said, honestly, I thought, who the hell is Gil Tyree? You know, like, like, F it, F it. I am gonna do this. I am gonna make it. And look,

• 44:15Speaker 02

  Matt Ryan didn't turn out to be Johnny Unitas in his career, but Matt Ryan had a hell of a career. Come on, he had a great career. And he might be in the Hall of Fame one day. Ended up taking the team to the Super Bowl. But anyway, I guess what I'm saying is, I really think one admirable trait you have to have, especially as a quarterback, is the ability to shut out the outside noise. You know, one of the reasons I really admire Trevor Lawrence right now, because, look, we all can sit here and say right now that when Trevor Lawrence gets the, whatever it was, $55 million contract, you know what we all thought? Are you shitting me?

• 44:59Speaker 02

  What is he doing getting all this money when he hasn't done it yet? And here's Trevor Lawrence, man, he looks like he's worth it now.

• 45:08Ryan Clark?

  Yes, he do.

• 45:08Speaker 02

  And so, and, but, but, and I'm sure that I have no idea, I don't really know Trevor Lawrence at all, but I'm thinking that Trevor Lawrence has to have a little bit of that inside him. He's got to think, I don't care what any of these guys think, any of the public feels. They have nothing to do with whether I'm gonna succeed or fail. And I will not allow them to come into my head.

• 45:34Ryan Clark?

  I like that.

• 45:35Channing Crowder?

  Mr. Peter, you, just what you talk about and the, the names you remember and everything, you know football. You know rosters, you know coaches, you talk about the age of coaches, the fuck it factor. You talk about different approaches, you've watched them. You could be an amazing asset to a football team. I don't wanna, I'm sorry, Mrs. King.

• 45:55Channing Crowder?

  I know he's hung it up, but have you, you've never thought about going to the other side of really helping a team?

• 46:00Speaker 02

  No. I never have. Because, you know, Channing, I have this thing. I was really impacted at Ohio University when I had this professor named Roger Bennett. And he said to me one day, he said, you know, your job is to take people where they can't go and tell them what they don't know. And I thought, that is my mantra now. That's what I want. That's what I want to do. And I'm not sure that I would really enjoy or really ever want to. First of all, I don't wanna do a full-time job.

• 46:44Speaker 02

  But I don't think that I would ever really want to go into a team, sit there and do 24/7 doing everything I could so that, to help the, pick a team, the Cleveland Browns, the Denver Broncos, the, the Seattle, see, I, do everything to kinda help them win. I hate, I don't mean to be dismissive of that, but I just never once thought that that was what I wanted to do. I just have this curiosity gene. Still to this day, I wonder why certain things happen the way they do. And that is what interests me more than

• 47:29Speaker 02

  like getting on somebody's side and, and helping them win. So I don't know, that's kinda how I would answer that, yeah.

• 47:37Ryan Clark?

  Peter, uh, in October of 2010, 30-year-old dumb safety said this. He said, it's a sad day for the sport.

• 47:45Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 47:45Ryan Clark?

  The league has made James Harrison a villain for playing exactly the way he played to earn Defensive Player of the Year. I think what we're seeing is a knee-jerk reaction to the result of hits, not a thoughtful reaction to the reality of hits. And in 2024, you said, this was October 2010, when Rutgers player, Eric Legrand was paralyzed from a hit in a game in New Jersey when the NFL had helmet hits, had to issue, uh, helmet hits and issued huge fines to James Harrison of the Steelers. The players were ticked off big time. Pittsburgh safety Ryan Clark called it a sad day for the sport that the league was turning Harrison into a villain. Those comments have not aged well. In 2011, ex-Chicago safety Dave Durison killed himself with a shot to the chest

• 48:30Ryan Clark?

  so his brain could be studied. CTE was found. In 2013, junior Sayal also died by self-inflicted shot to the chest. CTE was found in his brain. I guess my question would be, why in 2024 did my comment about defending James to the league still resonate with you in a way?

• 48:52Speaker 02

  I'll never forget it. And because, because I could have picked 20 comments from then. You know why I picked your comment? Because I had so much respect for you. And because I felt like you earnestly, honestly, always said what you thought. And one of the reasons why, in my opinion, what happened back then, because let me just, I wanna just tell you this part of that story.

• 49:34Speaker 02

  I spent a day in 2010 when all that was happening, when James Harrison went after Colt McCoy and obviously, you know, that's, that, that's, that's, that was a big, big story at the time. But I spent a day with Dr. Ann McKee, who is the CTE doctor in Boston. And Ann McKee said something very poignant that day because I read her a lot of James Harrison's comments that day. And so I said, what would you say to James Harrison if he were here right now? And she said, I wouldn't say anything. I would just ask him to look at this brain tissue of these players who died

• 50:19Speaker 02

  with heavy amounts of CTE in their brain, this tau protein in their brain. So, the reason why, and I had the same kinda conversation with Kevin Mawae, who I respected tremendously, I believe that in 2010, you didn't know everything you know now. Okay? And I believe, one of the things I believe strongly about with the league is that they have done some good things about trying to, trying to make head trauma less prevalent in the game.

• 51:03Speaker 02

  But I do think at that time, and I don't even call it a knee jerk. I don't think your reaction was knee jerk. I think you were thoughtful in your reaction. But I don't think you knew everything at the time that you know now. You can't because CTE was still in its infancy as far as what the knowledge is. And I guess I would ask you now because you bring it up. Do you think you would make the same comment now about James Harrison? Because at the time, you were in a tough position.

• 51:38Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 51:38Speaker 02

  Okay. And the tough position was you were on the biggest, baddest defense there was. And you don't want to sit back and say, oh, James, hey, take it easy now. You know, let's, let's, let's not hit as hard as, as you, as you did. Okay. But I wonder now, would you be as strident about your comments as you were back then?

• 52:05Ryan Clark?

  I, I don't think, I think the errors make this, the answers different.

• 52:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:10Ryan Clark?

  Right at 46 years old in 2026, I know different things and the rules of the game has changed and have changed. At that point, the rules of the game were changing in the middle of what was our.

• 52:25Speaker 02

  They were changing on the fly.

• 52:26Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 52:27Speaker 02

  The NFL changed the rules in the middle of the season.

• 52:30Ryan Clark?

  Exactly. And so what was probably our greatest attribute as a defense was now being taken away.

• 52:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 52:38Ryan Clark?

  And outside of that, it was also for guys like myself who was undrafted, for guys like James Harrison, who was undrafted, it was a necessity to make us valuable as well. And I think my comments were more about that and the perception of who James was as a human because of the way he played the game.

• 53:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 53:03Ryan Clark?

  And so if you put me back in that space, in that time, even knowing what I know now, that's the exact comment I make. If you ask me about those hits today, I do view them differently.

• 53:15Speaker 02

  Yeah. I, I, let me just say one more thing about CTE because I think, I think you have to today, you have to make peace with football. If you're going to love football, you have to say, okay, I am willing to take the risks that we all know are there. And me, just as somebody who turns on red zone every Sunday at one o'clock and absolutely just goes on a magic carpet ride for the next six hours with Scott Hanson.

• 53:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 53:51Speaker 02

  You know, I love that. And the reason that I still do is because I feel like everybody who is in the game understands more than ever the risks of playing the game. And I think Kevin Moi said it best to me, and I wrote it in the book. He, and I'm going to paraphrase. He said, listen, I've made a lot of money playing football. I've been able to do things for my family I never would have been able to do. I've been able to help my church more than I ever thought I would, which is an important part of my life. My kids have gotten educated, my, you know, and all this stuff.

• 54:30Speaker 02

  And he said, I have zero regrets about playing this game, almost no matter what happens in the future, which I think is a very realistic thing to say. Bruce Smith once told me that I feel like playing a game of football to me is like being in 60 car wrecks every Sunday. But he said, I'm willing to do that because I am able to support my family to live this, this better life than I would without the game. So I think that people ha, they have to make their peace. I was able to make my peace with it. And I think everybody who watches the game needs to say, should I be watching the sport?

• 55:14Speaker 02

  And the vast majority obviously still say yes. And I don't have any, like, I've gotten into some discussions. Man, how can you still love football after all these years of seeing what it does to people? And I said, well, I'm, I'm sad about that. But quite honestly, I think it also provides incredible opportunities for people as well. And it's not perfect. Nothing in our life is perfect. And the last thing I would say is, you know what we need in this country right now? Football. Because everybody hates everybody else.

• 55:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 55:52Speaker 02

  And I was in the, I was in the stadium the night of the Seahawks opener against the Patriots. And I remember at one point, I just looked around and I just, because I don't, I have not sat in the stands, sat and watched many games. I've always been in the hermetically sealed press box or whatever. And I remember I'm looking out at the stands and I'm saying, this is great. And one of the reasons I thought this was great is because so many people are going to walk out of that stadium and tomorrow they're going to look at their neighbor across the way and he's going to have a Trump sign in his yard and they're going to say, oh, screw that guy.

• 56:34Speaker 02

  And he's going to have a Biden sign or whatever, whoever is running for whatever. And, and, and there's going to be a divide. Well, in the football game, you got, everybody's high fiving each other when Drew Locke hits Jackson Smith and Jigba for the touchdown, having no idea how they feel about other things in life.

• 56:55Ryan Clark?

  But they know what they feel about football.

• 56:57Speaker 02

  And I love that. I just love it and I think we need it.

• 57:00Ryan Clark?

  I will say, and I know we had to move on. I will say about the, the CTE conversation and even what you had with Kevin. I would take it a step further that, that I loved it so much. And it has given me all of these opportunities and it's allowed me to take care of my family. But I didn't even allow that to weigh into the way I played it or why I played it. I played it because I've never had the passion for something that could be considered a career like I had for that.

• 57:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:32Ryan Clark?

  And the same way, like you said, you want it to be great. You want it to be better than your competitors. And I told them this many a times, the darker place I could go to, I wanted to see if people were willing to go to that dark place with me. And if you want, and if you weren't, then I won. And I was going to keep winning because I knew you wouldn't want to keep going back there. And I think I made the peace with that because I loved it so much. And there's a high that football has provided for me and my family that even, like Kevin said, the almost pieces, even those lows,

• 58:11Ryan Clark?

  I don't think would ever take away from what we experienced because of the game. Like you said, and I'll always, always, always cherish every moment I got to play it.

• 58:23Channing Crowder?

  Listen, Peter, I got, I got anything to follow up on. How do you feel, because you know football, how do you feel about that thought, the dark place? Or you covered LT.

• 58:30Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 58:30Channing Crowder?

  Lawrence Taylor wasn't all the way there. We're a real cool LT to this day, but.

• 58:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:34Channing Crowder?

  Those guys that you know aren't all the way, because that dark place, I love hitting people, but I was doing my job. I wasn't taking nobody to a dark place.

• 58:43Speaker 02

  I'll just say this, Ryan, I don't know if you remember this, but the year that you were in the Super Bowl with the Steelers, I have this vivid memory because I was the pool reporter. For those who don't know this, every year at the Super Bowl, each team in the game, there's one reporter representing the whatever four or 5,000 reporters covering the game, who is assigned to go to, go to each practice and to write a fairly generic report about what happened that day at practice. And you can't be specific about what exactly they're running or who's doing what. But you just give them a kind of a sense of color because sometimes at the Super Bowl,

• 59:28Speaker 02

  you can forget there's a game actually that's going on.

• 59:32Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 59:32Speaker 02

  Because of all the other crap during the week. But I remember this vividly. You and Troy Polamalu and your secondary group.

• 59:45Speaker 02

  You were as tight and as close and, and, and, and I just remember that those days watching you guys, that everything was closer than twins. Every person in that secondary group. And I just thought to myself, and I remember, my wife is from Pittsburgh. And I remember saying to her that, that night, she wasn't at the Super Bowl, but I remember calling her and saying, man, it was cool. I'll tell you this, I don't know if the Steelers are gonna win or lose, but man, they're as

• 1:00:25Speaker 02

  close a group as I've been around, because I did that nine or 10 times in my career. But that was very cool to see. And the thing that I remember about that, everybody should be able to experience at some point in their life, the brotherhood type feeling that I remember feeling about the Steelers on defense in that group.

• 1:00:56Ryan Clark?

  He says it all the time. He says it all the time that he's around us now.

• 1:00:59Channing Crowder?

  Pittsburgh's different. The Steeler, because he played at Jacksonville, I was in Miami. When I go up to Pittsburgh, they're all like brothers and they, they brought me in. I'm like, hell, I ain't even playing footy and pot and keesler and damn, I can everybody.

• 1:01:12Speaker 02

  Why did, I remember one of my last years, Patrick Peterson was in Pittsburgh. And I said, why are you here? And he goes, Coach T, I wanted to experience what it was like here. Because he said, when you're a player in the NFL and you look from the outside, this is a pretty cool place. And, you know, and what is interesting about that, as you know, Ryan, I mean, the Steelers didn't always pay the best. Okay?

• 1:01:41Ryan Clark?

  People stayed.

• 1:01:42Speaker 02

  And you know, and they didn't always pay the best, but all players had this little curiosity about what would it be really like to wear the black and gold? That is a kind of a cool thing. And I would think for you, no matter what happens to you the rest of your life, you have a little bit of a cool feeling that I know what that was like. I was behind the curtain. I was behind the same curtain that Joe Green and, and, and Jack Lambert and Mel Blunt were behind.

• 1:02:22Speaker 02

  I mean, that is a, I don't know, to me, I think that's a really cool thing, myself.

• 1:02:28Ryan Clark?

  Even, even cooler is, they were always around.

• 1:02:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:02:33Ryan Clark?

  Franco before he passed, like you got to see those guys and you got to be around them and, and feel their greatness. And even more so, you got to see how the fans of Pittsburgh still embraced them.

• 1:02:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:02:46Ryan Clark?

  It felt like, once you were a part of that brotherhood, you were a part of that brotherhood forever. And I think that made people who were there give a little bit extra so they could be counted. Troy said it in his, um, in his speech, you know, that the, the greatest thing any of those Steelers could ever tell you is you could have played with us. And I think we all wanted that, that sign of approval.

• 1:03:09Speaker 02

  Pretty cool.

• 1:03:10Fred Taylor?

  Nah, it, it's really cool. I asked Mike T why he didn't sign me. I was a free agent. It certainly has that effect on you, a hundred percent. Uh, but Peter, I do want to ask you your biggest pivot in life. That's that one moment you can sort of look back on and say, because this happened to me or for me, I am who I am today. And it might just be in here somewhere. I'm sure it is in here somewhere.

• 1:03:36Speaker 02

  Uh, well, I mean, this is a little bit vague, but this is the truth. I walked into my house, my senior year in high school in 1974 on one August night. And, uh, my mother and father had the TV on. We had a nice black and white TV in our living room. And on TV, Richard Nixon, the President of the United States, was resigning. He said he was gonna resign the next day as President. And I had been reading and hearing, because I was a current events guy, about this scandal called Watergate. And I knew what was going on in our country and it was really ugly.

• 1:04:21Speaker 02

  It was terrible. And I thought to myself, holy cow, two reporters from the Washington Post, against all odds, with everybody standing in their way, these guys had the biggest set of balls you could ever imagine. Because they reported all this negative stuff about the most powerful person in the United States, Richard Nixon. And that reporting ended up bringing him down. And a year later, I was a freshman in college at Ohio University, and I saw the movie, All The President's Men. And I just said, that's what I'm going to do.

• 1:05:04Speaker 02

  Now, when I was in college, I never wrote sports. I would have been happy to cover the State House in Columbus or Harrisburg or any, I, I didn't care. I just wanted a job. But first job out of college was to be a general assignment sports reporter. So that's how it happened. But I would have been very happy to write about anything, because I, I think my curiosity would have been just as good covering something else. That was my pivot, right there.

• 1:05:36Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I'm pretty sure there'd have been some other Presidents brought down.

• 1:05:39Speaker 02

  I don't know about that.

• 1:05:43Ryan Clark?

  If Peter King or the, I, I know we have to go. Better experience with Steve Young, the writing of The Young and the Restless? Or you've given him Gatorades and cookies until he threw up on people?

• 1:05:57Speaker 02

  That's the craziest night, single craziest night I ever had in the job. And I talk about it with Steve, every time I see him practically, we talk about it. But just so that people know, the, I wrote a cover story for SI called The Young and the Restless, in which Steve was, I don't know what, 35 years old, and he still wasn't married. And he desperately wanted to be married. He's a Mormon. He wanted to have 23 kids and, you know, and all this. So, but anyway, he ended up getting married. He's got a great life in California now. He's such a terrific human being.

• 1:06:38Speaker 02

  But anyway, after he throws six touchdown passes to beat San Diego in the Super Bowl, uh, boy, 30 years ago now, after he does that, my assignment for Sports Illustrated was to tail Steve Young wherever he went that night. And in those days, you could do that. You know, you couldn't do that now, but in those days, you could do that. So, he did 24 interviews on the field after the game. He went from, you know, one San Jose TV station to, uh, you know, whatever, you know, ESPN to whatever. And so, he was like an hour or so into it and he looks over at me, because I've told him what I gotta do.

• 1:07:21Speaker 02

  He said, Peter, I, I'd do anything. Can you find me anything to drink or eat? You know, I haven't had anything since practically this morning. Can you, and so I went and underneath the stadium in Miami, I found three bottles of Gatorade and a bunch of cookies. And I didn't know quite what to do. This guy was wheeling it out from one of the luxury boxes. And I took a $20 bill out of my pocket and I gave it to him and I said, sorry, I need to take this. So I stole this Gatorade and the cookies. I gave him the 20 and I walked back out and I gave it to Steve. And Steve, and these are 20 ounce bottles of Gatorade, I think. And he drank all three of them, literally in two minutes.

• 1:08:06Speaker 02

  He, because he was just, and so then, it was a half hour, 45 minutes later, and we're in this limo driving back to his hotel. And Steve just says, uh-oh. And if you remember the scene in The Exorcist with the, uh, the vomit coming out, well, that is what happened. Only this coming out of Steve, Steve's mouth was bright red. Because the Gatorade I gave him was red. And so, it goes on, uh, mostly goes on his agent, Lee Steinberg's shoes. And right away, Steinberg says, well, never wash those shoes again. You know, but anyway, we went back to his room and he was so dehydrated.

• 1:08:49Speaker 02

  I think it was Miami Airport Marriott, Miami Airport Hilton. Goes back to the hotel and he goes in, he's got a junior suite and there's like 35, 40 people and their family. Steve was not a drinker, he's not a partier, but this was, he wanted his family to be around him this night. But he, he was almost catatonic because he was so dehydrated by the time he got back to the hotel. So Miami Dade Fire and Rescue came up to the room and they put IVs in both arms. And so for about a half hour, he was just laying on the bed, just like this. You know, because he was just so, he, he was, he was just weak as a kitten.

• 1:09:32Speaker 02

  But that night, I just remember how grateful he was and what an incredibly happy moment after everything he had been through. And he says, I never in high school threw six touchdowns in a game, never in college. I just did that in the Super Bowl. Can you believe that? And he was just being a gee whiz kid, like you would hope a day like that would impact a guy. But that's my Steve Young story.

• 1:10:07Ryan Clark?

  Well, I'll tell you, I'll tell you what, Mr. King, Mr. Peter, whatever you want to be called, I think that this sit down, this conversation could go on forever. I know you have story on stories. And so anybody who wants to hear some more of those stories, please go out and get the game and, and read, listen, however you want to.

• 1:10:26Speaker 02

  Hey, can I tell you one thing? I did the audiobook.

• 1:10:29Ryan Clark?

  Oh, you did it so?

• 1:10:30Speaker 02

  I did the audiobook.

• 1:10:31Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 1:10:32Speaker 02

  And, okay. It's 192,000 words and it took me nine days to do the audiobook, but I wanted to do it. You want to know why? Because people know my voice.

• 1:10:45Ryan Clark?

  Yes, they do.

• 1:10:46Speaker 02

  This is crazy. I, I'm in an airport about two months ago and some guy walks up to me and he goes, you're Peter King. I said, yeah. And he said to me, I recognize the voice. And I don't know, I don't think I have the most recognizable voice, but people seem to still recognize it. So, anyway, I, I wanted to do the audiobook. I thought it would be so much fun. And it actually was fun. I enjoyed it a lot, but thank you for liking the book.

• 1:11:12Ryan Clark?

  No, I appreciate you. I think for football fans like myself, football junkie, I was just excited just to hear some of these stories, to know some of the places you've been and the places that you've taken us. So excited for you, excited for your book and thank you so much for your time.

• 1:11:28Speaker 02

  Thank you, Ryan. Thank you, Fred Channing. I appreciate it.

• 1:11:31Channing Crowder?

  Thank you, brother. Appreciate it.

• 1:11:33Ryan Clark?

  Can you sign my book though?

• 1:11:34Speaker 02

  Of course. Let's do it.

• 1:11:36Ryan Clark?

  That's it. Do we have a?

• 1:11:38Speaker 02

  I got it.

• 1:11:39Ryan Clark?

  Oh, my man.

• 1:11:40Speaker 00

  Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' health care

• 1:12:23Speaker 00

  to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the House Majority PAC dot com. Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.