We Almost Rolled the INEOS Wagon

Matt Farah and Zack Klapman went off-roading in the new 2026 INEOS Grenadier Station Wagon Trialmaster and it almost went very wrong; a full review of the INEOS and its competitors; Tesla is ending production of the Model S and X, so we talk about why and what it means for the future; Washington D. C. is going to have an INDY street race apparently; and we answer 50 questions from our Patreon members, including: Would we rather be mid-tier racing drivers or have our current jobs? Which supercar should have had a diesel engine? Miata RF or soft-top? Best M5: E90 M5 or E90 M3? Most enthusiast-magnet nerd car? Are "classic" tires worth the price for my older car? Which cars does every enthusiast need to drive? More timeless design: Lexus GS or C6 Corvette? Do we like bigger wheels? When? Were early paddle-shifted transmissions cool when they came out? That new Porsche Rally GT Why does the S63 AMG feel like too much AMG and not enough S? F1 2026: Audi vs Cadillac. Thoughts? Which cars depreciate TOO fast? Why don't STIs hold value? Options that made cars unreliable Would you always choose a lighter engine in a race car? Foreign car brands that would work here And many more! Recorded February 2, 2026 Note: Upon watching Coffeezilla's analysis of the files it appears that Peter Attia's relationship with Jeffrey E was more than just "In the same room at an event." It is unclear what their relationship was but their email exchanges are concerning. It should go without saying that we hope all facts come to light and justice is served to any and all deserving of it. - Zack SHOW NOTES Truewerk Get 15% off your first order at https://www.truewerk.com using CODE: TIRE. . Fitbod Join Fitbod today to get your personalized workout plan. Get 25% off your subscription or try the app FREE for seven days at https://www. Fitbod.me/TIRE. Use Off The Record! and ALWAYS fight your tickets! For a 10% discount on your first case go to https://www.offtherecord.com/TST Want your question answered? Want to watch the live stream, get ad-free podcasts, or exclusive podcasts? Join our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/thesmokingtirepodcast Instagram: https://www. Instagram.com/thesmokingtire https://www. Instagram.com/therealzackklapman

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Matt Farah?

  What's up everybody, welcome to the Smoking Tire Podcast. Today's episode is, as always, brought to you by Off the Record. We love Off the Record, and you guys do too, or at least you keep telling me over and over in the DMs and the emails that Off the Record saved your backside from a big old problem out there. Here's how it works: if you are driving out there in your car, you could be doing basically anything, and then you get pulled over and you get a ticket. It happens, you know? But what you don't do is plead guilty. You never plead guilty. You don't have to plead guilty. It won't just make it go away. Instead, what you do is get Off the Record. You go to offtherecord.com/tst.

• 0:43Matt Farah?

  That'll get you 10% off all legal services booked through Off the Record, and they will fight that case all the way to the end! If they don't get those points off your record, you don't have to pay. It is like that. Offtherecord.com/tst. I'm using them every time I need them. They're right there in my back pocket, always taking care of me and our TST fanbase. So make sure you write that one down. Offtherecord.com/tst. Alright folks, on this show, Zach and I have had a go in the Ineos Grenadier. Did a little bit of off-roading, and we go over that. Plus, Herr Fuhrer wants to have an IndyCar race at the National Mall in Washington.

• 1:27Matt Farah?

  And Elon has decided to not make cars anymore, cancelling the Model X and S with no replacement. All this and more, it's the Smoking Tire Podcast. Let's go! What the fuck was I even doing this weekend? Went to Manhattan Beach Cars and Coffee, which was good. It was so busy. Place was like, over full by... It's supposed to start at 8:00. I get there at 7:35, and the place is like, blown out, dude. If I didn't have a little, you know, position of authority, maybe I was in. I got a little front rosies, you know, just, which is nice. They put me next to, in between a Singer and a Ford GT. The pink car, it was okay.

• 2:10Speaker 01

  Wow. Where, uh, where do they hold that one? Is it in the beach parking lot?

• 2:13Matt Farah?

  No, it's at the Point, the fucking fancy sort of mall.

• 2:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:20Matt Farah?

  And right at the, so it's Manhattan Beach Cars and Coffee. Now technically, it's in El Segundo. But it's direct, across the street would be Manhattan Beach. It's on the north side of Rosecrans Avenue. The south side of Rosecrans Avenue is Manhattan Beach. I'd pull the same trick. I cannot throw a stone in that glass house. With this is West Side Collector Car Storage Playa Vista. Technically, it's Culver City. Playa Vista's across, Playa Vista's 50 yards away.

• 2:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:53Matt Farah?

  It's still, why do my pants feel so tight right now, really? These are, I, you know what I'm doing? I had to get new pants, which is a good thing. Means you're a little less fat, new pants. And so I got the same pants, polo Ralph Lauren jeans in like, different levels of like, stretch. These are the fucking no stretch.

• 3:15Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 3:16Matt Farah?

  These are, these are hard as a rock.

• 3:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:18Matt Farah?

  I'm not sure how often I'm supposed to wash these. It's probably not that often.

• 3:22Speaker 01

  It's not, they did, some scientists did a test where like, jeans that were worn for like, months straight and jeans that were washed and they had the same bacteria content at the end.

• 3:29Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 3:29Speaker 01

  It's pretty amazing.

• 3:30Matt Farah?

  They could get smelly. I think, right?

• 3:33Speaker 01

  Depends on how much you fart, maybe?

• 3:35Matt Farah?

  I mean, dude, if you're an active person and wearing a fucking pair of jeans for five, six days in a row.

• 3:41Speaker 01

  Depends on how much you sweat, that's the biggest thing. Like jeans, if you, if you're in Florida in any time and it's humid, your jeans are gonna smell much more quickly than out here.

• 3:50Matt Farah?

  The move I was taught was if you put your jeans in the freezer. It freezes all the bacteria, gets rid of all the smells, but it's not like a wash.

• 3:58Speaker 01

  Doesn't damage the jeans, right?

• 4:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 4:01Speaker 01

  Like washing allegedly does?

• 4:02Matt Farah?

  I mean, I guess, yeah. I would say I wash my jeans probably every three to five wears. I wash them.

• 4:12Matt Farah?

  We'll see, but these don't stretch, so they're riding up on my fucking

• 4:14Speaker 01

  It's weird. I wear those Prana pants all the time that stretch and now I'm wearing regular jeans today and the same thing they get

• 4:19Matt Farah?

  It's very, very, very different.

• 4:21Speaker 01

  These are the problems we deal with.

• 4:22Matt Farah?

  Oh man, it's like, it's like going barefoot, you know, you're on a beach somewhere for a vacation, you know, you don't wear real shoes for like five days. This is gonna happen when we go on the boat.

• 4:31Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 4:31Matt Farah?

  And, uh, and then you put sneakers back on and even if they're the most comfortable NBs, you're like, oh my god, my foot is like in this coffin. It's so weird. Uh, when I go on the long road trip scouts for road and track, I wear like fucking Lululemon pants because it's just me sitting in a car. Why would I wear, you know, but then you put on the jeans, you're like, what the fuck is this torture device that has been invented?

• 4:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:53Matt Farah?

  Um, hi everybody. Thanks for, uh, thanks for joining us. It's Monday. It's our Monday. Don't know when you're gonna get this. If you're, if you're on Patreon, patreon.com/slovenetirepodcast, you can get it live. You get it the same day. You're gonna get it way before everybody else. And we're gonna get to some of their questions. So if you wanna help us out, help yourself out. Help us pay the bills, help you get a better experience. Patreon.com slash this momentirepodcast is where it's at. Uh, Zach and I are dirty this morning because we spent it on the mountain with the new and improved Ineos Grenadier. And Ineos has a, boy, do they have a name scheming

• 5:32Matt Farah?

  that really takes some learning. So the Ineos is the, is the manufacturer. The Grenadier is the model line. The Grenadier is then broken down into station wagon, which is the SUV, uh, that, that vaguely resembles, resembles, I mean, vaguely, a lot resembles a Defender 110.

• 5:53Speaker 01

  A lot, yeah.

• 5:54Matt Farah?

  And then there's the, uh, Quartermaster, which is the pickup truck. And that thing is like long, like, uh, like a Jeep Gladiator. Right? It's, it's picture Jeep Gladiator, but that, that's the, that's the one. You know, I've only ever seen one. We see, I think we have many, uh, we have a higher percentage of Grenadiers on the streets of Los Angeles than most other places in the country.

• 6:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I agree.

• 6:19Matt Farah?

  Um, Ryan from Ineos, I had lunch with before I got this thing. He said Texas is the biggest market, which doesn't surprise me. This is a real fucking

• 6:32Matt Farah?

  Outside of Dallas kind of car.

• 6:34Speaker 01

  Sure, and especially if you have a dirt road to your house. It helps justify having an off-roady vehicle. And like, it's more, it's more of a truck state, you know, or area than Los Angeles is, for sure.

• 6:46Matt Farah?

  So, um, and this thing is trucky. This is of, this is the, possibly the truckiest feeling SUV, you know, on the market today. It's, it's ladder frame, you know, it's a body on frame thing, solid axles, old school. Um, and it's, uh, it's a, it's a square. It's a, it's fucking boxy, and it has recirculating ball steering, which I thought had completely gone the way of the dodo in passenger vehicles, but they're bringing it back.

• 7:16Speaker 01

  Does the Wrangler not still use it?

• 7:17Matt Farah?

  Um, I don't think so. I think the Wrangler finally got, I think the Wrangler finally got it, didn't it? Or no? The Bronco has rack and pinion. The Bronco having rack and pinion eliminates, in my opinion, any valid argument for having recirculating ball steering. Basically, if you don't know what I'm talking about, rack and pinion steering makes SUVs steer more like cars. It's a, it's a bit of a sharper turning ratio, um, more like a car has than a truck has. Whereas the, the Grenadier has recirculating ball steering, which means it's a lot of turns,

• 7:56Matt Farah?

  lock to lock, and a lot of, uh, sort of dead, big dead zone in the center, followed by a fairly abrupt movement once you try to, once you notch it one way or the other. You know what I mean? You described it in better words than that earlier.

• 8:13Speaker 01

  Well, the off-center, it was very light for about an inch, and then as soon as you got to the point of friction, it felt like, uh, you know, Camaro's in sport mode. The weight was, was more of a shelf than a ramp.

• 8:25Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 8:25Speaker 01

  Um, the Wrangler does still use ball steering, which is why, I totally forgot this. The Bronco, one of the big deals is that it has rack and pinion. So that's part of why it's a little easier to drive on the highway.

• 8:34Matt Farah?

  It's been a while since I drove a Wrangler, sorry. But, um, now that I would think about it, I remember when we drove all the Broncos, we're like, yes, this is- Better because it steers better.

• 8:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, it steers, yeah.

• 8:44Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah, okay, so, so then if you're familiar with Wrangler, then this, I guess, will be kinda like that. But I think something about the, that, the recirculating ball steering, combined with the shape and position of the steering wheel in this vehicle, makes it like, extra weird. The steering wheel is like, almost a sports car-sized steering wheel. It has two spokes, we've got a photo of it, some, somewhere you have an interior photo handy there. Yeah, it's got two spokes that come out at nine and three. Um, kinda tough to tell which way is up, on the steering wheel, sometimes.

• 9:19Speaker 01

  Yes, yeah, it really is.

• 9:22Matt Farah?

  And, and, and it's, it's, it's the kinda wheel you'd see, like, this wheel would be right at home in a Mini Cooper.

• 9:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, or Fiat 500, you know, something, something kinda funky like that.

• 9:31Matt Farah?

  Citroen hatchback. Um, so when you combine this small, thick-rimmed steering wheel with a ton of turns lock-to-lock, um, and, and quite a bit of weight, it is fairly heavy steering. It just, it, it, it, it, to me, presents an odd experience for a vehicle, um, that is, for most people in America, going to be driven on the street, on tarmac, most of the time.

• 9:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, there's a lot of pushback on the wheel, and it, it could be the alignment, it could be, um, you know, you have pretty big wheels and tires, but it's just, as you, when you turn it, you're getting a lot of force back on it. Not necessarily feel, but it's pushing those wheels to go straight again.

• 10:11Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 10:11Speaker 01

  So the steering, as you turn in, this is better, the, uh, Quartermaster, I think you had to, like, hold it in the turn?

• 10:19Matt Farah?

  So, it doesn't-

• 10:20Speaker 01

  Looser feeling, it was just weird.

• 10:22Matt Farah?

  The self-centering?

• 10:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:23Matt Farah?

  Which is when you're going from a turn and the car's straightening out, and most cars will, if you let go of the wheel, sort of tends to do that on their own, the wheel will unwind on its own, right? On the road, you have to physically unwind it from a corner, in this vehicle. If you make a 90-degree right turn, the wheel will effectively stay there.

• 10:45Speaker 01

  It doesn't spin back as easily.

• 10:46Matt Farah?

  It does not self-center, so that's another different thing you have to do, which is, in a vehicle where you have to spin wheel a lot, it, it's, it's a lot. Now, this sounds like I'm kinda shitting on it. I wanna like, i- i- this is a criticism about this thing that I don't particularly like. They made a choice. It's not like a failure. It's not like something that didn't work. Like, they say it's stronger. They say it's better for off-roading. They say this is first and foremost an off-roading vehicle, and driving it on tarmac is deeply secondary to how it performs off-road. Fucking fair enough. Like, fair enough. You know, it's like saying this race car is bad in traffic. Okay, fair enough, you know. So, we took it off-roading then. It's pretty good at that.

• 11:29Speaker 01

  It is.

• 11:29Matt Farah?

  It's pretty good at that. The trail that we used, which is called Rower, north of LA, was pretty rough today. This trail was as eroded, full of rocks and holes, and as I've ever seen it. I mean, I think Zach could attest to that, that this was the most challenging, that this particular trail has ever been, in my opinion.

• 11:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think, well, we had a week of rain, the big storm out here, and it washed all the dirt that fills in these rocks. I mean, some of the rocks we were on, it just, the rain revealed a lot more of them. So if the rock was four inches, it might be six now. And all of the little, you have these little, like, Legos that form a larger rock out here, the ones that are all compressed together. And all of those teeth were revealed, too. Which that provides a lot of grip, but I mean, any of these undulations that just turned into rivers during this rainstorm were way deeper than they've been in any of our time climbing this thing.

• 12:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah, normally, normally a competent stock SUV does not have much trouble with this trail.

• 12:31Speaker 01

  We did it in an Escape before?

• 12:34Matt Farah?

  No, we did it in a Bronco Sport.

• 12:35Speaker 01

  Sorry, Bronco Sport.

• 12:36Matt Farah?

  Bronco Sport made it up. That was probably the, like, puniest thing to make it up.

• 12:40Speaker 01

  Did we make it in the Outback, or did we have to turn around?

• 12:42Matt Farah?

  The Outback did not make it.

• 12:43Speaker 01

  Because it couldn't get past the hole.

• 12:44Matt Farah?

  Yeah, the Outback, the Outback didn't make it. I tried it in a Macan once, and that couldn't do it. But like, anything with low range can do it, pretty much.

• 12:55Matt Farah?

  But we had a couple of spots today that we had to fully reverse down. I came very close to rolling.

• 13:02Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 13:02Matt Farah?

  You can do you show the photo, you have the photo of me?

• 13:04Speaker 01

  I have a photo of the area.

• 13:07Matt Farah?

  This dude, we pushed this thing today. We scratched up both skid plates pretty well and the center one.

• 13:13Speaker 01

  It should be said in Rower, there's a couple of hills where you can choose three different routes up the hill. You know, and it's usually like for skiing, like, you know, an intermediate slope and like two expert slopes. But the one in the middle has always had the deepest holes, these kind of like oscillations, you know, it's tilting the truck back and forth. It really tests articulation.

• 13:32Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 13:34Speaker 01

  And what I recognized after, we can talk about the moment and then we can talk about the tech that this truck should have had.

• 13:40Matt Farah?

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• 14:24Matt Farah?

  and ready for whatever the day throws at them. While brands like Carhartt and Dicky's focus on traditional cotton-based gear that gets heavy when wet, True Work uses advanced performance fabrics developed for extreme outdoor conditions, now engineered specifically for trade work. It's moisture wicking, it's wind resistant and insulated with fabrics that keep you comfortable and mobile all day, even in the harshest winter conditions. There's over 50,000 five-star reviews from pros on TrustPilot, every trade and climate. Real feedback from electricians, plumbers, and contractors working through brutal winters. So I've got the True Work hoodie, I got the True Work.

• 15:04Matt Farah?

  pants and although I am not an on the job site pro I work outside a lot and they are great for keeping me comfortable keeping me warm when I need it cool when I need it and dry when I need it I love the true work pants and the hoodie it's awesome don't let cheap gear slow you down this winter upgrade your day with workwear built like it matters get 15% off your first order at true work.com with code tire that's T R U E W E R K.com code tire I mean look the moment the moment is what it is I went through one of these big swales with a big articulation you know in this in a photo that we're showing right

• 15:48Matt Farah?

  now the the front left tire is at least 18 inches off the ground

• 15:54Speaker 01

  yeah and it was higher at a different point in that like in that section you the first time you did it you stopped yeah and I was like holy shit and I took a photo and your tire was absolutely two feet off the ground

• 16:06Matt Farah?

  yeah so then a few feet maybe 10 feet further up this ravine there was another swale but it was very soft yeah and we did not air down we honestly just out of laziness and and usually when we're testing stock SUVs on this trail we don't air down we just drive them right off the road and up the trail just because that's how we do the test I mean this isn't like sciencey science but like I think if we air down some of the cars and not others that would be not you know consistent so so you know we use whatever drive modes are appropriate and available for the for the challenge of the obstacle and we leave the tire pressure stock so I think had we aired down we probably could

• 16:50Matt Farah?

  have got up this soft thing we didn't I had to back down I tried it like three times and on the third try The vehicle went into this ravine, but like, we kinda realized just how like, far down it was. Like, okay, so in this photo, the front left tire is about three feet in the air.

• 17:14Speaker 01

  That's a lot.

• 17:15Matt Farah?

  And it's at full droop.

• 17:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:17Matt Farah?

  And the other tire is at full compression. The rear tire is articulated, the rear axle is articulated fully in the opposite way. And had I fallen, had the front tire fallen from this, I absolutely would have rolled the vehicle. It was deep enough.

• 17:35Speaker 01

  And this was right before, uh, do I have a shot? No. Um, cause I put my phone down to help. So right after this moment, the front left tire went into this deep hole and, and he kept proceeding forward, but then you hit the soft stuff and the truck yawed left.

• 17:49Matt Farah?

  Oh, yeah.

• 17:50Speaker 01

  Nine inches. So now instead of facing straight up that trail and having all that control, you twisted and the left, you know, left front was kind of near a bush, back right. I mean, that rear tire could not have gone higher where it would have gone into the backseat.

• 18:03Matt Farah?

  And I was sort of sideways down the hill a little bit.

• 18:05Speaker 01

  Sideways and, and the way, the, the moment happened when you were starting to back up, I think. And, uh, the vehicle like started to, it just the rebound of the shock and, and you were going slow. You weren't going fast. It was just the rebound and everything tilted your driver window closer to the ground than we've ever experienced.

• 18:26Matt Farah?

  Yeah, really, really close to the ground.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  Like I ran around the car and probably did nothing, but my instinct was push on the other fender. Not like under the car, but I was like, oh shit.

• 18:35Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 18:35Speaker 01

  And, and you just, you moved back just enough and the, the back left came, rose, rose up a little and settled it. But woof.

• 18:42Matt Farah?

  I don't, it was like, it wasn't like a fuck up that got me there. And it wasn't like an act of heroism that got me out of there. It was just like a, oh shit. You know, it was one of those, it's very, this thing is capable enough that we got to this point where it was like, all right, let's see what this, you know, this, this, this is a hard obstacle. We're going to choose the hardest path. We think it can do it.

• 19:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:05Matt Farah?

  It actually can't. We did, this is where it couldn't proceed. We had to go around the other one later, but like, this is a tough rig, but yeah, we got it pretty close to, pretty close to having a moment.

• 19:17Speaker 01

  And what this highlighted for me is the advantage of electronic, you know, sway bars. You know, you can get them on the Bronco, Ranger, or Wrangler, I think had them first, of course. And that makes a massive difference because the articulation.

• 19:31Matt Farah?

  Toyotas, you can do it. I think.

• 19:33Speaker 01

  Oh, you can get them on there too.

• 19:34Matt Farah?

  The Toyota Land Cruisers also.

• 19:35Speaker 01

  People who are experienced off-roaders know, and we've been on press launches where you try something with, you know, those things engaged, and then you disengage the sway bars and you gain a foot of articulation.

• 19:44Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 19:44Speaker 01

  Now, in the back, I don't know if you would get more room because you might have the tire up against the wheel well, but in the front, if you're able to twist this down another foot, you know, that would have prevented the body from leaning so much.

• 19:57Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, I think what's, what Ineos is really going for with this thing is to make it as simple as possible, which is an interesting thing for us to explore because I'm not sure that they've succeeded. Cause it's still, it's still, it's not as complex as most modern vehicles. It has, as they told me, like somewhere between a half and two thirds of, or a half, excuse me, a third, I want to say that right. The Grenadier has between one third and one half the number of ECUs that a normal, like, car would have today.

• 20:37Matt Farah?

  So it has a mechanical, you know, low range, but it still has electronic, you know, locking diffs. It still has drive modes. It still has, you know, a screen and CarPlay and Bluetooth and fucking ADAS.

• 20:51Speaker 01

  Has that. Well, it's a turbocharged engine.

• 20:53Matt Farah?

  It's a BMW engine and a ZF gearbox.

• 20:56Speaker 01

  It's pretty modern stuff.

• 20:57Matt Farah?

  Yeah, so it's not like it's got, you know, a Buick 3800 V6 and a five-speed manual.

• 21:04Speaker 01

  Right.

• 21:05Matt Farah?

  You know, and crank windows, you know, it, it, there are definitely things on this that could break in a modern way, such as the gearbox that got stuck in fourth gear. For us, we actually didn't notice it because we were going downhill. And we were in low range and we were essentially just idling the engine and and using the brakes. But but for about forty five minutes, the vehicle was fully stuck in fourth gear.

• 21:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:32Matt Farah?

  Um, and we had to shut it off. And I mean, fortunately, all it took to fix it was was um. Shut it off, walk away for a few minutes, come back and and and that did fix it. But like, you know, it just is a reminder that weird electronic hiccups can happen in this thing also like. It's not so simple that. Check engine lights and you're electronically controlled gearbox getting stuck in fourth gear. Isn't gonna happen like that happened.

• 21:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:00Matt Farah?

  Um. And but like. The analogness of it. In an otherwise incredibly digitized world is like super welcome, like the buttons and the knobs and the toggles and. The fact that at night, there's so little light coming at you in the cockpit. Like, all that shit is fucking great.

• 22:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, and those little bars next to the toggles. I'd always looked at them and just thought, oh, that's like.

• 22:24Matt Farah?

  The guards, little protector guards.

• 22:26Speaker 01

  I just didn't understand like the true function and then we're bouncing around and I had to like disable the front locking diff or whatever. And I hooked my finger on it and hit it with my thumb and I went, oh. Yeah, that's why because otherwise there's no way I'd be able to aim for that button while we were bouncing up and down this trail.

• 22:41Matt Farah?

  The off-road controls aren't. Fully as intuitive as they. Maybe should be, but there is like a nice, quick, handy reference guide card.

• 22:50Speaker 01

  The placard was so helpful. Every car company. If it's a press car should have that thing like if you're an owner. You might learn these things, but I think any cars that sold and aimed at off-road should have. Placard off-road functions because now with all these electronic diffs locking this and that. Sometimes you have to dig in the manual and go find page two hundred twelve E. And then if you want to look at the, you know, a different function, it's over on a different page and this was here's all the things you might need to know and it was really handy.

• 23:19Matt Farah?

  We only when this, when we had the the other Ineos like a year and a half ago, whatever it was. We had trouble getting into some of these modes. We didn't have that card.

• 23:28Speaker 01

  True.

• 23:28Matt Farah?

  And the reason is like, it can only go into this mode if this mode is engaged first. But like, that doesn't pop up on the screen.

• 23:35Speaker 01

  I wish it did that because I'm glad you brought that up. There's a little, on the lower left side of the screen is where the warning lights pop up. Little information. I kept thinking it was a button.

• 23:44Matt Farah?

  They're not clickable.

• 23:45Speaker 01

  It's shaped like some of the clickable buttons.

• 23:47Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 23:48Speaker 01

  But we have this screen that can display so much information. And later on, it said, "Window washer fluid low."

• 23:56Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 23:56Speaker 01

  So there's, there's programming in there that could tell me things. But to just say, "This unavailable."

• 24:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 24:02Speaker 01

  Like, tell me why.

• 24:02Matt Farah?

  Give me, give me further information.

• 24:04Speaker 01

  Or say, "Before you go into this mode, this must be activated."

• 24:06Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 24:07Speaker 01

  Because as much as I dislike Hyundai's, Hyundai N divisions menu like, uh, black hole, it will often say, "Hey, you have to go into this mode first." Doesn't tell you how.

• 24:18Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 24:18Speaker 01

  But it does say you have to be in that mode first.

• 24:19Matt Farah?

  It should work like a car configurator, right? Where you click on the wall seats and it says, "I'm sorry, you have to get premium package. Would you like to add premium package?" And then it's just done, right? Like, if it can work on the thing you use to buy the car, it should work in the car.

• 24:35Speaker 01

  That is exactly the idea.

• 24:36Matt Farah?

  You know, like, "You must, so, oh, to get in this mode, you must disable trash control. Would you like to disable trash control? Yes." Okay, done. Like, there should just be a flow chart of that.

• 24:46Speaker 01

  Cause it's clear you want that thing on.

• 24:48Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 24:49Speaker 01

  So.

• 24:49Matt Farah?

  Um, speaking of which, ADAS, okay? Now, British car company, and we know from Aston Martin, the UK mandatory ADAS law. And for these small carmakers, and for, maybe I'll have to correct myself. I, this is a US market vehicle. It's not, this is not a European spec car. Um, so it's, the ADAS fully goes back on every time you start the car. If there are two kinds of cars where this should not happen, luxury, sporty SUVs is gotta be the biggest one. Because those are cars driven every day by people. That's people's every car. And then shit like this, where it's supposed to give you the impression of something older. And it's doing the most annoying thing possible out of today's cars.

• 25:33Matt Farah?

  And to turn off the fucking ADAS in this thing, you have to go, in the touchscreen, you have to press Settings, Vehicle Functions, ADAS, which brings up the ADAS menu. That's three button taps. If you are stopped, and I mean in park, you can then scroll to the bottom of a long menu, at the very bottom, and click a thing saying, "Turn off all." And you have to do that. That's your best case scenario for every time you start the car. And I'm talking lane, lane keep that is

• 26:07Speaker 01

  We'll get to that in a second.

• 26:07Matt Farah?

  The lane keep that makes you almost think you've had a crash.

• 26:10Speaker 01

  The correction, the force of correction on the wheel was so abrupt, it happened twice while you were driving us back, that I, I thought you were avoiding something about to hit.

• 26:19Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 26:19Speaker 01

  And you're like, you had just like moved towards the yellow line on the left and it pushed back with a like three or four times as hard as you had moved over. So it doesn't, it doesn't match the angle or cadence with which you've drifted.

• 26:31Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 26:31Speaker 01

  It's really unnerving.

• 26:32Matt Farah?

  It's almost like a dog ran in the road and I'm trying to avoid it or something. And you're talking about a top-heavy floppy-ass SUV, not a fucking Cayenne Turbo, right? So, so you have to, so if, best case scenario is one, two, three, slide four, when you're parked, every time, best case scenario. If you forget, and now you're driving, you can't hit the fucking turn all off. They gray it out. Now you have like six individual ADAS functions. Click off, are you sure? Yes. Click off, are you sure? Yes. Click off, are you sure? Yes.

• 27:13Matt Farah?

  Click off, are you sure? So now it, it goes to like 15 button taps while you're, touchscreen taps, while you're driving.

• 27:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 27:22Matt Farah?

  This is like crazy town. I can't fucking, and Johnny, I had dinner with Johnny the other night for a thing with Sergio, cause Tato's going, whatever. We had dinner together. And Johnny goes, he's like in love with this thing. He goes, when I'm done with the Rivian, I'm gonna buy one of these. This is gonna be my next daily driver. I go, Johnny, have you, have you messed with the ADAS yet? And he goes, no, I didn't really try it yet. You should, you're gonna wanna do that. This shit is crazy, dude. That alone puts it in the absolutely fucking never category for me.

• 27:55Speaker 01

  I just think it's strange that, you know, the intention of ADAS is to increase safety, but if you are moving, it requires more attention on the screen than if you're parked.

• 28:04Matt Farah?

  Insane.

• 28:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:05Matt Farah?

  Insane. What else did I write about this thing? Okay, the good. Folks gotta take one more quick break because Fitbod wants your ears and man, I cannot tell you how important it is to have a routine and stick to it and get accountability, right? I have accountability, I have a, I have a personal trainer. I spoil myself, I spend my money on a personal trainer and look, it works. I gotta do it. I, I know how to do a workout, but I need that accountability and there, if you don't have a personal trainer, Fitbod is a personal trainer in your pocket, right? It's so easy. Fitbod creates personalized workout routines based on your goals, fitness level, and your

• 28:50Matt Farah?

  available equipment, right? Then the workouts can adapt to your growth, so every workout is challenging enough to push you to make progress, just like a personal trainer. Fitbod then tracks your muscle recovery, so you can avoid burnout and keep up your momentum. Fitbod is fine tuned by experienced certified personal trainers to bring best practices and exercise science right to you. And there are over a thousand demonstration videos within Fitbod, so you know that you're doing the workouts right, you're not gonna get hurt. The Fitbod app makes working out easier, it feels like having a personal trainer in your pocket, and it will customize these workouts based on the goals that you have. So, level up your workout in the new year.

• 29:34Matt Farah?

  Join Fitbod today to get your personalized workout plan at F I T B O D dot M E slash tire. That's Fitbod dot me slash tire. F I T B O D dot M E slash tire. And now, back to the show. I think the, I think the BMW powertrain, for the most part, fits the character of this thing very well. I think it works.

• 29:59Speaker 01

  The only exception, though, was in low range, there was this kind of step, as you started applying throttle, the boost surge that would happen. It made it a little hard to modulate the thrust and then like the speed of the rear wheel, or the wheels, between like 2,000 and 2,800 RPM. All of a sudden they go from

• 30:16Matt Farah?

  There's a big torque spike.

• 30:17Speaker 01

  And it highlighted for me the, how impressive the 4Runner was. You know, that's a 4-cylinder engine, but it had the iPower, whatever, electric boost. And by filling in those torque spots, it was much easier to creep up these, this exact same trail.

• 30:32Matt Farah?

  Dude, the electric G-Wagon.

• 30:34Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 30:34Matt Farah?

  The electric G-Wagon and the Rivian, the 4-motor Rivian. That shit, that's like next, I mean, this, you don't want a Rivian in the fucking middle of Africa. That makes total sense, but for local off-roading, holy shit, is 4-motor EV where it's fucking at.

• 30:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was the most control.

• 30:55Matt Farah?

  Um, I, I think, I think the Grenadier, particularly, and can we, let's get a better picture of it. Fire engine fucking red, which is new for this year with the steelies.

• 31:07Matt Farah?

  And it's got the snorkel on it, though they qualified the snorkel with, it is a dust snorkel, not a water snorkel. The fitment where the snorkel goes into the steel body is not watertight. So it's really for dust and not water.

• 31:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, the opening on the snorkel faces the back of the car, not the front of the car.

• 31:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah, so I might not equip mine with dust snorkel, but this one, but still, the red with the black steelies, that's dope.

• 31:31Speaker 01

  Looks very good.

• 31:32Matt Farah?

  Um, the interior, I love the dashboard, the headliner, the pop-up sunroofs above the driver, like, that shit is great. But this thing is $95,000. I don't mind manual seats, but we need lumbar support. That, that is a, I need, even if it's just a knob you crank up, or a thing, a thing you squeeze, like, for $95,000.

• 31:54Speaker 01

  For a hundred grand, and it's a vehicle that's meant to be driven for long, long, long distance. Um, I just, I flew in yesterday from New York, sat on a plane for five and a half hours. And I went, and my back hurt toward the end of that. And I was sitting there going, the shape of the seat feels good now, but would it after five hours? I don't, I don't know the answer to that question.

• 32:09Matt Farah?

  It doesn't. You, you noticed the lack of the lumbar.

• 32:11Speaker 01

  And the other thing is that the adjustment knob for the seat, to change the angle of the seat, is right in line with the B-pillar. And if your hands and wrists are any bigger than ours.

• 32:22Matt Farah?

  It's weird.

• 32:22Speaker 01

  You're not adjusting it.

• 32:23Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it's weird. And, and then the backseat. Which in the pickup truck, if you recall, was fucking laughable. Because the cab is really short to have like a bed. And so the backs, it's a vertical.

• 32:36Speaker 01

  It's a pew.

• 32:37Matt Farah?

  So the backseat is like so vertical, like you cannot fit in it in the pickup truck. They might as well ditch the back doors and just make it extended cab. And have the seats fold forward or something, but like, that's just crazy.

• 32:52Matt Farah?

  In this one, the backseat is okay, the legroom's okay. But it doesn't, it's still very upright. It doesn't recline. It also doesn't fold down flat. It's fixed. There's no.

• 33:06Speaker 01

  Oh, I didn't expect that, really?

• 33:08Matt Farah?

  It doesn't fold forward and it doesn't fold back. And there's no fold down armrest in the middle. Again, ninety-five thousand dollars. And the seats are made by like Recaro, I think.

• 33:19Speaker 01

  Wow, you can't change the angle and you can't fold it down? So if you own this thing and you want to move a table.

• 33:24Matt Farah?

  The seats are made by Recaro, don't hold me, I think, I thought I saw Recaro on there somewhere. But like, but I just, it doesn't, again, for this much money. You know, like, I, I get that boutique vehicles made in small volume and, and, and the, the, the actual quality, as you noticed. As well today, Zach.

• 33:46Speaker 01

  They are Recaro seats.

• 33:47Matt Farah?

  They are, right? So this thing is, it's not like they don't know how to make a good seat. Um, like Fisker, like they, like they've never even tried, their, their seats were terrible, but. But like, I don't know. There's a, there is a bunch of stuff where it's like, yes, it's boutique. Yes, it's analog, yes, it's, it's got a lot of things about it that do make it sort of pseudo exotic. But there's other shit where it's like, for this much money, dude. Lumbar, a backseat, a, a rear seat that has some kind of adjustment.

• 34:17Speaker 01

  So, so Top Gear magazine said the rear seats, the bench does fold flat.

• 34:21Matt Farah?

  It does?

• 34:22Speaker 01

  So maybe we didn't find that thing.

• 34:23Matt Farah?

  We, we have to go, we'll have to go out and look again. I, I, I couldn't find a lever anywhere.

• 34:28Speaker 01

  It may not lean back, because that's something that's kind of recent to cars where the backseat is adjustable to lean back for comfort. Folding flat. has been around for a long, long time.

• 34:37Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 34:38Speaker 01

  But it is a nice thing.

• 34:39Matt Farah?

  There's nothing behind it.

• 34:41Speaker 01

  Right.

• 34:41Matt Farah?

  There's, there isn't a good reason that this can't have some adjustability to it.

• 34:46Speaker 01

  This has a lot of the ergonomics of like a G-Wagon.

• 34:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 34:50Speaker 01

  Backseat, not a lot of legroom.

• 34:51Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 34:52Speaker 01

  Trunk, not that deep, although maybe, I'd have to look at the measurements, like, not that deep. I like the split tailgate door. I think it's clever, so it opens, doesn't need as much room to swing out as a G-Wagon.

• 35:02Matt Farah?

  Or a, what was, was it a Bronco? I think it's the Bronco. The Bronco had like a cra- you needed enormous amount of room to open that door.

• 35:10Speaker 01

  That and the G-Wagon.

• 35:10Matt Farah?

  Was it Bronco or the? I, I, I think it was. I think it was the Bronco. Anyway, go on, sorry.

• 35:16Speaker 01

  But it, it does, it, I mean, now this thing had a thousand miles on it.

• 35:21Speaker 01

  I think it felt really, really solid, even compared to when we've gotten Wrangler vehicles, just, it feels like the tolerances are really, really good.

• 35:29Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 35:30Speaker 01

  Bouncing up and down all these rocks, like, the only, the only wiggle sound in the entire car was the keychain.

• 35:37Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 35:37Speaker 01

  Which I, and also I got in.

• 35:39Matt Farah?

  That was driving me nuts, dude, that keychain, that sucks.

• 35:41Speaker 01

  Click, click, click, click. I almost stopped to take the thing off. Also, it has a key, which is interesting.

• 35:46Matt Farah?

  Which is interesting, yeah, you, you put the key in, yeah.

• 35:49Speaker 01

  Keeps it simple.

• 35:49Matt Farah?

  It's one less, one less ECU, is it, without having that thing, yeah.

• 35:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was the only sound in it.

• 35:54Matt Farah?

  No, I'd like, I, I don't, I like the key. I like the toggles and the, the analog switches. I like the manual seats, like, but I just, uh, there's just, you know, there's some things that I think that for that much money. Now, this one also had all the off-road stuff. It has the winch, which we didn't use.

• 36:14Speaker 01

  That's the most expensive option.

• 36:15Matt Farah?

  The winch is the most expensive option. It's like four grand or something. And it's got, oh, I, I started down this road, the, the, this is the wagon. There's also the Quartermaster is the truck. But then, confusingly, Trialmaster is an off-road trim package, no, excuse me, an off-road equipment package that can be applied to any of them. So you could have a Quartermaster, Trialmaster, which is dumb. Ineos' naming scheme is really gonna go off the rails next year when they come out with the Fusilliar, which is one of the worst car names I can.

• 36:50Speaker 01

  It is terrible.

• 36:52Matt Farah?

  Oh, hey, by the way, speaking of just sidebar, fun fact, fun fact for everybody today. Did you know? That even though in 1958, America had about half the population it has now. During the same two-year period of time, Ford sold almost twice as many Edsels as Tesla has sold Cybertrucks. A car that is like, it's like the universally known fail car. They sold twice as many of them to half as many people during the same period of time as the Cybertruck. That's how bad the Cybertruck is a flop.

• 37:33Speaker 01

  I mean, there were fewer cars available.

• 37:35Matt Farah?

  Good point.

• 37:36Speaker 01

  So there were fewer cars available.

• 37:38Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 37:39Speaker 01

  Trialmaster, yeah, the Quartermaster Trialmaster.

• 37:42Matt Farah?

  So you could have a Quartermaster Fieldmaster, or you could have a Quartermaster Trialmaster. They must have had Infiniti's people on the names. That's just crazy.

• 37:53Speaker 01

  Quartermaster Field, just end with Field. That's fine.

• 37:56Matt Farah?

  Quartermaster Trials.

• 37:58Speaker 01

  Trials, not Trials. Trials, good. And you'd keep Black Edition, you would not shorten that.

• 38:03Matt Farah?

  Right. So, so, I mean, look, if you, if anyone out there is considering an old Defender, and I don't mean like 1960s old, but I mean like, any of those fucking crazy expensive like V8 swap Defenders, any of that kind of shit, skip all of that. Just skip straight over that garbage and just get one of these.

• 38:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:28Matt Farah?

  I mean, if you think you want a Defender, I can almost guarantee you, you actually want this instead.

• 38:35Speaker 01

  This had, I rested my arm on the armrest on the left side.

• 38:38Matt Farah?

  It's meant for people who have left arms.

• 38:40Speaker 01

  For people who have arms toward the outside of the vehicle, either side. Yeah, it drives nice, and I think, you know, the ball steering, as annoying as it is for road stuff, it's true of the Wrangler as well, when you are driving off-road and there's a lot of kickback on the tires, it mutes that pretty well.

• 38:55Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 38:55Speaker 01

  You know, there's not a lot, like, it reduces the chances of you breaking your fingers. But keep your thumbs out of the spokes anyway.

• 39:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, that's true. I mean, and it's better built than one of those old, you know, the comp for this is all Old Defender, not new Range Rover, or maybe, maybe hopped up Wrangler. I mean, you, if you, if you were considering one of those 75 or 80,000 dollar hopped up Wranglers, I think you, your money goes further buying one of these.

• 39:23Speaker 01

  I think you, I think as long as you're driving on the road more, you know?

• 39:27Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 39:28Speaker 01

  Because the hopped up Wrangler will have things like the, you know,

• 39:31Matt Farah?

  The sway bars?

• 39:31Speaker 01

  Electronic sway bars, like it will be more suited for serious off-roading.

• 39:35Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 39:35Speaker 01

  Um, and the engine, if it's still the Pentastar V6 is also, it's like a simpler,

• 39:40Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 39:41Speaker 01

  more known thing, but this, this kind of reminds me, at that price point, this is like the shop foreman drives this.

• 39:48Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 39:48Speaker 01

  The F-150 Platinum Edition.

• 39:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 39:50Speaker 01

  You know, it, it looks off-roady, it is off-roady to a degree, but it has a slightly different badge. It looks different, it looks like the old Defender, but drives more like a new car.

• 39:58Matt Farah?

  You gotta explain to a lot of people that it's not a Defender.

• 40:01Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 40:02Matt Farah?

  They, I had to spend a lot of time.

• 40:04Speaker 01

  Did you get approached a lot?

• 40:05Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Oh, what's up with the Defender? Like, it's not, what is it? It's named after?

• 40:09Speaker 01

  It's made by Chevron.

• 40:11Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, like what if, what if Chevron made a car?

• 40:14Speaker 01

  That's what Ineos is. Ineos is like a petroleum company, so it's like if this is the Chevron Grenadier.

• 40:20Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it's the most fucking gas company car like ever, yeah.

• 40:24Speaker 01

  But they, look, they made a good product. I mean, I think we are, we're pointing out the details and the tiny problems, which is what we should do, and for first effort, as we've talked about.

• 40:33Matt Farah?

  Oh, yeah.

• 40:34Speaker 01

  Very impressive.

• 40:35Matt Farah?

  It, it, honestly, if you look at this car and just looking at it, you go, I like that, you probably will. Like, you, you actually probably will.

• 40:43Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 40:44Matt Farah?

  The only things that would keep me from buying it, you know, if I really liked how it looked and the idea of it, is the ADAS and maybe the seats.

• 40:52Speaker 01

  I wonder if US lobbyists or companies or something can make an argument for, if a car is imported from Europe, can we have a different ADAS interaction system? That's quicker or, you know, than they have over there?

• 41:07Matt Farah?

  I mean, I think it's voluntary. I don't think they have to put that in here for America. That shit's voluntary.

• 41:13Speaker 01

  Well, I think people like having lane keep assist, they like having those features in US cars also, but if, if we can access. Those controls and disable them more quickly than Europe law allows.

• 41:22Matt Farah?

  Yeah, or just have them stay off. If you turn it off, I mean, the answer is just to have it, or default to wherever you left it. That's, I mean.

• 41:30Speaker 01

  That's the thing.

• 41:31Matt Farah?

  Yeah, a, a, a car, imagine setting anything in your car, the fucking radio, the, the memory seats, whatever, and every time you get back in the car, it's not where you left it? That's fucking crazy.

• 41:45Speaker 01

  True.

• 41:45Matt Farah?

  That's terrible.

• 41:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, true.

• 41:46Matt Farah?

  Who would want a car like that?

• 41:48Speaker 01

  ADAS memory function, you hit M.

• 41:50Matt Farah?

  Oh my god, tie it to the memory seat?

• 41:52Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 41:52Matt Farah?

  Bro, your big boy needs ADAS off? Your, your short woman?

• 41:57Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 41:57Matt Farah?

  This is, I'm not being sexist, I'm talking about my own wife. Your short woman in memory three really fucking needs it.

• 42:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, there's profiles like the, you know, the M cars have all that stuff, so why not have an ADAS profile? Patent pending, Zach Lattman.

• 42:11Matt Farah?

  Fucking alright.

• 42:12Speaker 01

  Smoking tire.

• 42:13Matt Farah?

  They don't, I, I kept saying to like Aston, like, how come, you know, you've got tour, sport, track, and then individual? I said, well, why don't you just make it so you can have individual ADAS settings in your individual drive mode? So I start the car and I go into individual and everything's where I want it. And they said it's like a not, not enough, you know, button clicks or whatever to, it's gotta be by law?

• 42:37Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 42:38Matt Farah?

  Just the minimum three.

• 42:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:41Matt Farah?

  Anyway.

• 42:41Speaker 01

  Makes sense.

• 42:42Matt Farah?

  We didn't, we didn't break it, but we did scratch the skid plates a little bit.

• 42:46Speaker 01

  We peed our pants.

• 42:47Matt Farah?

  We peed pants and, and definitely did a little scratchy, scratchy in the underside, but that's what it's there for.

• 42:52Speaker 01

  And I, I don't know how much lean, you know, one of these vehicles can take. I'm sure if we were, maybe if we were the pro off-roader coach or something, they go, no, no, you got a couple of degrees left.

• 43:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 43:01Speaker 01

  That was enough for us.

• 43:02Matt Farah?

  That's like that Ron White joke, like, I don't know how many of them it would take to beat me up, but I know how many they had.

• 43:12Matt Farah?

  Um, oh, and the last thing about it, dude, you know what I did experience on the highway? The funhouse mirror effect at night, cause all the windows are vertical, like my old Hummer? I've told this story, but the light bounces around in there.

• 43:26Speaker 01

  Oh my gosh.

• 43:26Matt Farah?

  And so, if you have a...

• 43:31Matt Farah?

  You see, you see cars in the back window that are being reflected from the front window. So like I was following a white Mini Cooper. And I look in the rearview mirror and it shows me in my back window.

• 43:50Speaker 01

  The taillights.

• 43:50Matt Farah?

  The ass end of a white Mini Cooper.

• 43:52Speaker 01

  And you're like, man, that guy's going fast in reverse.

• 43:54Matt Farah?

  And, and that used to happen to my Hummer and it's, it happens in this too, when the windows are perfectly vertical, you get funhouse mirrors.

• 44:00Speaker 01

  Whoa.

• 44:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it's a little creepy. Uh, so thanks to Ineos for, uh, letting us have a go for a week. We, we appreciate it.

• 44:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:09Matt Farah?

  We do. It was a fun morning out there. Uh, till I thought I lost my phone. We had to go look for it.

• 44:14Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 44:14Matt Farah?

  And then it was in the car the whole time.

• 44:16Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 44:17Matt Farah?

  It were, I mean, well, it was hidden very well in the car, but, but we thought it fell out of the car.

• 44:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:22Matt Farah?

  And we went looking for it. It was on the way back to where we were going. And, uh, then it wasn't there. So I logged into Zach's phone, used the Find My iPhone. I made my phone play a little song and the song came from the car. There we go.

• 44:36Speaker 01

  It was excellent.

• 44:36Matt Farah?

  Excellent day. Um, what else we have? Oh, so. Don't get political, but did you see that, um, fucking Herr Fuhrer wants to have an Indy car race at the National Mall in Washington?

• 44:50Speaker 01

  What?

• 44:51Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 44:51Speaker 01

  I did not see that.

• 44:52Matt Farah?

  So first, you know, first they want to do UFC on the White House lawn and now they're talking about having an Indy car race.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  What?

• 44:59Matt Farah?

  In Washington DC. They planned the Freedom 250 around the National Mall. It's part of the, this, this fucking, this is, uh,

• 45:12Speaker 01

  I'm playing on the map.

• 45:13Matt Farah?

  Like in Gladiator. 200 days of games. This is like the straight up Commodus 200 days of games.

• 45:23Matt Farah?

  Uh, era of, now I'm not inherently against having a Nash, a street race in Washington DC. That's okay, right? The fuck not, have a little, have a little Indy car race.

• 45:34Speaker 01

  Sure, I mean, street circuits are fun and they're exciting. Okay, so it would be like around here-ish?

• 45:38Matt Farah?

  Uh, my guess is it would be, yeah, I don't know the, the, what the distances are, yeah. Where does, uh, where does, uh, that, that bottom, Independence Ave, Southwest, does it come, bring, oh yeah, it comes around.

• 45:49Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 45:50Matt Farah?

  So it probably will connect somewhere and then go up, you know, Constitution Avenue, back around, right?

• 45:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, that could be fast, that's pretty cool.

• 45:58Matt Farah?

  Kind of a neat track.

• 45:59Speaker 01

  Well, it's like a gentle sweeper, sweeper.

• 46:02Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, maybe they chicane it somewhere if you go around the Lincoln Memorial, if you take a hard right.

• 46:07Speaker 01

  In here?

• 46:08Matt Farah?

  Yeah, and go Lincoln Memorial, and then north there, yeah, or on the angle, on the angle maybe, on the 45 there. That could be cool.

• 46:17Speaker 01

  Look, I gotta say, out of all the things he has decreed in the last year, this is probably my favorite.

• 46:21Matt Farah?

  This was, this was okay.

• 46:23Speaker 01

  Because if, if someone got the permits independently from him, it was like, we're having a race here and here's what it's gonna look like. I'd say if the track's cool, like, that's pretty cool.

• 46:30Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 46:30Speaker 01

  So.

• 46:31Matt Farah?

  You can't, yeah, you can't make something shitty just because Trump did it.

• 46:36Speaker 01

  Uh, yes, that's what I'm trying, yeah, trying to do that, uh, and it's probably easier to get those permits when it's been decreed by the great leader.

• 46:42Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 46:43Speaker 01

  Which is, now that's the aspect I don't like, but.

• 46:46Matt Farah?

  Cause he's in construction, he could waive, he could just waive permits, right?

• 46:49Speaker 01

  Well, you just don't pay the permit, you just go ahead anyway.

• 46:51Matt Farah?

  You just do it, whatever.

• 46:53Speaker 01

  Alright, I think I need, I need to see the track map of what they would do, man, you could.

• 46:58Matt Farah?

  Well, you're gonna, you're gonna turn right on Trump Avenue and then turn left onto Trump Place and then, and then go straight down Trump Way and then, he's gonna fucking, and then you break at the Trump S's.

• 47:08Speaker 01

  You got the Baron chicane.

• 47:09Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, you do a lap around.

• 47:11Speaker 01

  You should call it the Dean chicane because we're gonna get demonetized, because it's causing a little trouble.

• 47:15Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it is.

• 47:16Speaker 01

  You know, it just could throw off your race, we're gonna get, uh, no views on this video now.

• 47:19Matt Farah?

  Turn left at the Dean S's.

• 47:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:25Matt Farah?

  Oh, bleh. Anyway.

• 47:27Speaker 01

  But there's no rules. You can just go straight across those and there will be no flag.

• 47:31Matt Farah?

  Uh, questions? Did you get to that?

• 47:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:33Matt Farah?

  I don't have, I legitimately don't have anything else.

• 47:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, I didn't drive anything this weekend.

• 47:40Matt Farah?

  I drove my own cars. How about that? I put 250 miles on my Spyder this weekend. And I reminded myself that it now has 7,500 miles. And I need an oil change. So it's gonna go to BBI next week for an oil change.

• 47:55Speaker 01

  For the eight-hour surgery.

• 47:57Matt Farah?

  Yeah, dude, that's crazy how long fucking oil changes take in Spiders. That's insane. Uh, let's go to the people. Of course, who are these people? Patreon.com slash the Smoking Tire Podcast. They're the people that support this show in good times and in bad with their dollars every month, keeping the show rolling down the river. And for those dollars, they get to listen to the show live. If not live, they get to listen to the show early. They get to ask their questions for the show, which we will get to in just a second. They get extra show every month. And they get exclusive access to merch collabs and things like the Notice Canyon watches that we are doing. And patrons get them first.

• 48:43Matt Farah?

  Uh, alrighty. Queers shifting gears. I'm trying to make a list of fun, wait, I'm trying to make a list of fun vintage sporty runabouts for Cleveland, Ohio. Previously had an MG and a Boxer. Uh, currently top of the list is a Honda S800 and an old Mini. What else should I throw on the list? And a Manx feels a bit too weather-dependent. Uh, well, how about your Beetles then? I mean, there's lots of room in Beetle land.

• 49:14Speaker 01

  True.

• 49:15Matt Farah?

  Uh, not weather-dependent. I, if you haven't had a Beetle, I would throw that in there. Uh, I mean, old British shit, right? Your old, your Triumphs, your Austin Heelys. I mean, you had an MGA, so you, you know, you know about that. S800's a great call.

• 49:32Speaker 01

  It is. The coupe I just looked up. That's a pretty cool-looking thing.

• 49:35Matt Farah?

  Oh, those are pretty rad. Yeah. Um, dude, you know what I just saw that was amazing? It was a Triumph TR4 Coach Body by Vignale. It was at the Manhattan Beach Cars and Coffee. I'd never seen one before. It was very pretty. It was an Italian styled Triumph. I believe it was a TR4. They made like 300 of them or something? Do you see that? It's like Triumph TR4 Italiano or some shit like that? But the body is by Vignale, V-I-G-N-A-L-E. And it sort of has a very like Maserati-ish kinda look? You want me to find one?

• 50:13Speaker 01

  Triumph Italia?

• 50:15Matt Farah?

  Yeah, Italia, that might be it. Yeah, that, top left, Triumph Italia. That's it, sorry. That look, I mean, that is...

• 50:24Speaker 01

  Ooh, that's like a baby Aston.

• 50:25Matt Farah?

  It's like a little baby Maserati Sebring.

• 50:27Speaker 01

  Or that, yeah.

• 50:29Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Pretty cool, huh?

• 50:30Speaker 01

  This is really nice in the back.

• 50:31Matt Farah?

  This, this thing was red tan, looked great, had the fitted luggage in there. That's a hot little item.

• 50:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:38Matt Farah?

  If you can find yourself a, yeah, Triumph Italia.

• 50:42Speaker 01

  Rear three-quarter view.

• 50:43Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Apparently they're pretty rare, only made a couple hundred of them. But fucking cool. Yeah. I like that. How about something a little more modern? How about an Audi TT, first gen?

• 50:55Speaker 01

  That's a good, that's a good choice.

• 50:56Matt Farah?

  Sporty runabout, that could be awesome. P Car Photos. Do you prefer the look of the Miata RF over the standard soft top? And does the RF's added weight noticeably change the driving experience?

• 51:09Speaker 01

  Yes, I do, and no, I don't think it really does.

• 51:12Matt Farah?

  I do not prefer the look of the retractable hardtop. I do not think it significantly changes the driving experience. However, I, I think it's still fucking loud in there, considering, considering it's a real roof.

• 51:27Speaker 01

  It totally is.

• 51:28Matt Farah?

  It doesn't knock the noise back that much.

• 51:30Speaker 01

  It weighs 113 pounds more.

• 51:32Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 51:33Speaker 01

  And I think, I think it changes the noise by like a decibel or two. So, um, I like it, I think it looks cool, and I like the security of the hardtop, um, versus a soft top, and more durable over long-term ownership.

• 51:46Matt Farah?

  Yeah, uh, Duffle Shuffle Retirement Club. Recently learned about the diesel-powered Audi R8 prototype. Didn't that have the V12 diesel in it out of the that we're using in the Q7? I think it did. Diesel R8. What crazy diesel engine in a supercar combo would you like to see? Interesting question and interesting thought exercise. Personally, a diesel engine in a supercar is, does not interest me at all.

• 52:16Speaker 01

  It doesn't. Diesel, I like the torque of it and the long legs. My brain goes to like Veyron if you want to drive 2,000 miles in one tank of fuel.

• 52:23Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 52:24Speaker 01

  But if you have a supercar, you have supercar gas card money, then just keep putting high-octane in it, you know?

• 52:30Matt Farah?

  It just, it doesn't sound as good, it doesn't rev. The power band that it makes is not the kind of power band that I enjoy in a sports car. I mean, I think Audi's, um, strategy at LeMans with the diesel cars was fucking unbelievable.

• 52:45Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 52:45Matt Farah?

  I mean, that, it worked for years.

• 52:47Speaker 01

  But they won races with it, but they did not put it in their supercar.

• 52:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, I think that, that says a lot. I mean, the thing, the, the engine, you know, the race car driver drives the race car fast, like whatever it is. The race car driver's not there to have fun. And I am there to have fun. I'm spending a lot of money on this car to have fun. And I'm guessing the reason they never actually made it is because it probably wasn't very fun.

• 53:09Speaker 01

  Imagine the rev sound.

• 53:11Matt Farah?

  It sucked. I mean, it probably wasn't that great. Like, um, I, I, I think, I think that's a sad truth of diesels in sports cars. It's just like, they're not, they're not for that.

• 53:25Speaker 01

  I can get started.

• 53:26Matt Farah?

  I mean, having said, having said that.

• 53:27Speaker 01

  R8 sound.

• 53:28Matt Farah?

  Yeah, what would I like? I, I, I do think you could put like a Cummins or like a, I saw a Duramax in like an old Cadillac.

• 53:36Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 53:37Matt Farah?

  Like that, there's something to that. Where if you have an old cruiser, you could diesel it up and it, and it could be cool.

• 53:43Speaker 01

  Lead sleds, old hot rods, those are cool. And I still like the M cars in Europe that are diesel, I think, for like.

• 53:49Matt Farah?

  Oh, yeah.

• 53:50Speaker 01

  Remember those, like the M550D?

• 53:51Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 53:52Speaker 01

  Whatever.

• 53:52Matt Farah?

  Yeah, no, I don't mind that as a, as a, that's like a, cause that's a highway car.

• 53:56Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 53:56Matt Farah?

  That's like, I'm doing 30,000 miles a year and that, that's alright. I just like, not for a supercar. Gat Farah.

• 54:05Speaker 01

  It's a good one.

• 54:06Matt Farah?

  Been thinking about buying a gun. I mean, I have a shotgun, but like a gun gun. I wanna be thinking like that. I don't wanna... I'm not a gun... I'm not like a "have a gun" guy.

• 54:16Speaker 01

  If it gets to there, just swing by your friend's house.

• 54:19Matt Farah?

  I know.

• 54:21Speaker 01

  Borrow one or...

• 54:22Matt Farah?

  If it does... That's true. If it does, I just... I know... I know where to go.

• 54:26Speaker 01

  You have the sailing knowledge.

• 54:28Matt Farah?

  No, for sure. Oh, for fucking sure, sure. Shit really goes down, you know. Guess what? No... No boat is safe.

• 54:36Speaker 01

  We Voltron.

• 54:37Matt Farah?

  We're fucking going.

• 54:41Matt Farah?

  Okay. Gat Farah says, regarding the Lemonade debate, okay, this is now... I don't know if it's a debate, but this is a company that is offering to provide discounted insurance based on the fact that it says that if you use Tesla FSD, you are safer and therefore your rates go down and we've sort of pretty much implied that that's not actually based in any existing science. The question is, wouldn't an insurance company that has a telematics platform be ideally positioned to produce their own data about FSD versus non-FSD safety? I think there is actually an argument for that.

• 55:25Matt Farah?

  If Lemonade knows about driving behavior via their own data and can then correlate to FSD versus non-FSD miles and then compare it to all cars in the data set, surely they'd be able to draw a good conclusion to support their FSD discount. For the record, I think this is tech bro accelerationist BS also. I think you're right here. I think if they did have telematics and connected telemetry that really did work and could produce that type of a test and could get it in enough cars and have it running over a period of time, they absolutely could produce their own data, but it doesn't seem like that's what they're trying to do. It seems like they're trying to hype FSD.

• 56:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, we'll see. Real quick, someone mentioned caster in terms of the Ineos, and I found Ineos forum, and people said that in stock, this is 2024 cars, the stock vehicles only had two degrees of caster, so one person added 1.5 degrees and it made a big difference in their steering response.

• 56:25Matt Farah?

  Really?

• 56:25Speaker 01

  So, remember the, uh, who made that Volvo we drove, the P1800 thing?

• 56:29Matt Farah?

  Yeah, oh yeah.

• 56:30Speaker 01

  Zero caster, terrible auto return.

• 56:33Matt Farah?

  We didn't even mention it, but the 2026 vehicle, which we were driving, did have like, a list of like 60 updates. There were, and some of them were big and some of them were small. So there was like updates to the climate control system, updates to like all kinds of little stuff, but there were a couple of updates to the steering. Little suspension bits that changed the behavior, I think based on those type of complaints from those earlier cars. And so although I don't have an apples to apples comparison in order to say like, yes, this is better, I think it's a little better than when I drove it last time.

• 57:11Speaker 01

  I think it is too.

• 57:11Matt Farah?

  But it's still not as good as if it was a rack and pinion system.

• 57:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:16Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Kendrick Lamarque for Supra?

• 57:19Speaker 01

  (laughing)

• 57:20Matt Farah?

  It's pretty good. Uh, if, if OEMs could set up a completely blind test, meaning journalists got in a car and there was no badging and no way to tell what brand of car you're in, what cars would overperform and what cars would underperform?

• 57:36Speaker 01

  Talking about performance driving or like in terms of people's review of that car?

• 57:41Matt Farah?

  I mean, I, I don't know if they mean, if it means driving or like touching stuff and, and quality.

• 57:51Matt Farah?

  I mean, cars that would overperform driving is probably like Genesis, actually. In terms of touching and in terms of driving is probably Genesis.

• 57:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:59Matt Farah?

  Cars that would underperform, non-M BMWs now, I think. If you got in a fucking... Like a fully loaded up, I don't know, Elantra versus a BMW two series, the front-wheel-drive one, the Ford. I bet you couldn't tell much difference at all.

• 58:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, they both have lots of screen.

• 58:20Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 58:21Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 58:21Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 58:22Speaker 01

  I think the Cadillacs would underperform because I think Genesis and Hyundai and other, they've gotten closer to those higher-priced vehicles and Cadillac has a lot of the same, like, hard buttons, which I really appreciate, but because they don't have the fancy sparkle sometimes, which is detrimental, like Mercedes, you might think it's lower market.

• 58:41Matt Farah?

  Sure. If you're talking dynamics, the Cadillacs would probably overperform.

• 58:45Speaker 01

  Yes, very true.

• 58:45Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 58:45Speaker 01

  I was thinking just interior design.

• 58:47Matt Farah?

  "Reeducation Through Working on Shitboxes," "New Assignment for the Patrons," I would like your kitschy usernames to be based on "Rise Against" songs for the next three months, please. Let's work on that. "Reeducation Through Labor" is an excellent song. Tim McElrath was at the Tom Morello concert.

• 59:07Speaker 01

  The one in Minneapolis?

• 59:08Matt Farah?

  Yeah, with Springsteen and shit.

• 59:09Speaker 01

  Oh, cool.

• 59:09Matt Farah?

  They did a couple "Rise Against" tunes and they also did "Misery" by Soul Asylum, which is a great song. A few weeks ago, asked for advice debating between the 981 Boxster S and the E92 M3, and your recommendation came down to "Don't get backseats if you don't need them." Then my wife and I just learned we have a need for backseats in the near future.

• 59:34Speaker 01

  Hey, congratulations.

• 59:35Matt Farah?

  Congratulations, there we go. Is an E90 M3 manual a better M5 than an E39 M5?

• 59:41Speaker 01

  I think in many ways, yes.

• 59:44Matt Farah?

  In many ways, yes.

• 59:46Speaker 01

  In terms of reliability, cost of ownership, twisty, dynamic, fun, yes, all those things.

• 59:52Matt Farah?

  Nine years newer car, it's a second-generation engine compared to the M5's engine. I would say, yes, it is a better car. Yeah, the E39 M5 is probably a better collectible, but...

• 1:00:09Matt Farah?

  Uh, yeah, I think a four-door M3 E90 is a good, a good choice. And congratulations, Sweden low. Uh, okay, looking for tires for a Saab 9000 Turbo. You know when the last time I saw a fucking 9000 Turbo was out? They're, they, Saabs don't exist in LA.

• 1:00:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, they don't.

• 1:00:27Matt Farah?

  I saw, I, I saw one 900 at Manhattan Beach Cars and Coffee. Non-turbo, no wing. We just, they were, on the East Coast, they were everywhere. They just don't exist here. Um, do you have an opinion on quote, "classic tires versus a regular, modern, high-quality all-season"? Is this a, uh, cosmetic thing for the purists?

• 1:00:50Speaker 01

  Cause they point out that these classic tires are more expensive than a similar.

• 1:00:54Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 1:00:55Speaker 01

  You know, uh, AS tire.

• 1:00:56Matt Farah?

  Yeah, so here's the, uh, the good thing about the classic tires is they're used modern rubber. Right? It's the old shape and style and it's, and it's modern rubber. So for a car like, like a Countach or an eighties, an exotic car or a specialty car, or as you pointed out, if you want the look, um, or if you want the car to drive kinda like how it would have, you know, but with, with the better compound. So it'll grip better, but with the tread pattern, you know, it would drive in the wet and snow like it used, like it would have back then. And so like, if, if you wanna, you know, keep it period correct, like, you know, pay the cost to be the boss, right?

• 1:01:38Matt Farah?

  And these tires are made in smaller, uh, quantities, so they're gonna be more expensive.

• 1:01:43Speaker 01

  But also the rim size, I mean, this is.

• 1:01:44Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:44Speaker 01

  They mentioned the Michelin.

• 1:01:45Matt Farah?

  Twelve's and fifteens.

• 1:01:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, they mentioned the Michelin XZX. It only comes in a 12-inch and a 15-inch rim size.

• 1:01:51Matt Farah?

  So it comes either for like a Mini Cooper.

• 1:01:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:53Matt Farah?

  A 12 would be a Mini. And then a 15 is gonna be a lot of shit. Well, also, my Countach is 15s. I mean, the, my Mans is 15s, like, uh, the Ferrari 308 is 15s. A lot of eighties cars are 15s, seventies and eighties cars.

• 1:02:09Matt Farah?

  In my opinion, if you don't care about the look and you do care about the price, just get regular tires. No one's gonna be like, ew, bro, you're car, you put new tires on your car? Like, it's, uh, speaking of which, to talk, I'm just, I should get front row parking forever. I mean, I've been plugging Manhattan Beach Cars and Coffee, but there was a guy, there was a Fox Body, 93 Cobra, and as I do, because I can't help myself, squat down, look at the tires, and the guy, the guy goes, "They're original." I go, "From 93?" And he goes, "Yeah." I go, "Did you drive this here?" He goes, "Yeah." I go, "You really shouldn't be doing that."

• 1:02:50Matt Farah?

  And he looked at me like, "Okay, buddy, wherever." I go, "Look, no, man, like, nobody gives a shit that this has original tires on it. And if you really care that much, take them off and put them in a bag." You, you're one pothole away from spinning this thing into a telephone pole.

• 1:03:05Speaker 01

  You have a blowout, the tire just shred.

• 1:03:07Matt Farah?

  Thirty-year-old tires this guy's driving around on. What are you doing?

• 1:03:12Speaker 01

  I think people don't know. People just, people literally don't know.

• 1:03:16Matt Farah?

  Dragging about it. Lucky to be alive.

• 1:03:22Matt Farah?

  Yamaha BB, "If you had to prescribe driving homework to every driving enthusiast, what cars should every enthusiast experience driving at least once in their life?" I mean, there's a, there's a, that's an easy one. You've got your Miata's, uh, you've got your, uh, Mustangs, 80's, 80's, 90's Mustangs. You've got your, uh, your Civic, someone, you drive a great Civic. Everyone should drive, um, like, uh, like, an early 2000's Subaru WRX or STI, and also an Evo. Everyone should try a gated manual Ferrari.

• 1:04:09Matt Farah?

  Everybody should be, should at least be driven, if not drive, in a McLaren in anger, like a 750 on a track or 765 on a track. And you'd be shocked that things like that are allowed for sale on the street at all. And everyone should do a quarter mile pull in like a Lucid Sapphire or Taycan Turbo GT to really understand what they're, what they're selling people in terms of. And everyone should, um, everyone should, uh, should do a full, a quarter mile pull in a Rivian Quad motor and then have to slam on the brakes at the quarter mile just to see what they're actually selling people over there.

• 1:04:54Matt Farah?

  And you'll, and you'll be like, oh, that shouldn't be legal.

• 1:04:57Speaker 01

  I think you should also hopefully get a quarter mile pull in something with a big turbo.

• 1:05:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:02Speaker 01

  Just to see the difference.

• 1:05:03Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:04Speaker 01

  In generational horsepower.

• 1:05:05Matt Farah?

  Everyone should try a Model T. Everyone should try a three on the tree column, a three on the tree shift. That'll get you going.

• 1:05:14Speaker 01

  It's like old stuff, new stuff, mid, all mid-engine, rear-engine, front. You know, start with that criteria for sure.

• 1:05:20Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it's a good question. Everyone, the bottom line is like as many different things as possible.

• 1:05:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:26Matt Farah?

  Even Flowmaster.

• 1:05:28Speaker 01

  That one's great.

• 1:05:29Matt Farah?

  That's excellent.

• 1:05:30Speaker 01

  Even Flow. With a resident chamber. What are they, I need, where's any more of their products?

• 1:05:41Matt Farah?

  Oh, the cops all know. So they chasing us away. Uh, what's a more timeless, modern era design? The last generation Lexus GS or C6?

• 1:05:55Speaker 01

  C6.

• 1:05:57Matt Farah?

  I have a question. Is that question set up because those are like particularly not timeless designs?

• 1:06:04Speaker 01

  I think the last gen GS is a good car.

• 1:06:07Matt Farah?

  It is, but timeless?

• 1:06:08Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 1:06:09Matt Farah?

  Not with that shredder grill.

• 1:06:10Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:06:11Matt Farah?

  What are you doing?

• 1:06:12Speaker 01

  That was like the first step in what many of us call a bad front-end design. That was the beginning of shredder.

• 1:06:16Matt Farah?

  The timeless GS is the second gen GS, the one that where it was the GS4, uh, the GS400. The four I car. That motherfucker is timeless.

• 1:06:28Matt Farah?

  That one, top left, the GS400.

• 1:06:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:31Matt Farah?

  You wanna, you wanna talk about a fucking exceptional car? No notes? That GS400, that thing was fast as fuck. Great interior design. Aged beautifully. Couldn't kill it. Fabulous car.

• 1:06:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:46Matt Farah?

  The six cylinder ones you could turn into drift cars. Cause they had two Js. But I'm gonna go with fucking neither even Flowmaster.

• 1:06:54Speaker 01

  Oh, well, I'm gonna C6 out of the two of these.

• 1:06:57Matt Farah?

  I guess C6, but that C6 is a fucking...

• 1:07:00Speaker 01

  I think...

• 1:07:00Matt Farah?

  I don't think it aged well.

• 1:07:01Speaker 01

  I think the interior ruins the exterior. I think the, I think the exterior profile front is fantastic. And then you look inside and you go, it's basically a C5. And that sucks.

• 1:07:14Speaker 01

  So this is a little confusing.

• 1:07:15Matt Farah?

  Okay, wait, do we think, this is weird. Indy car...

• 1:07:17Speaker 01

  To sell well.

• 1:07:18Matt Farah?

  Indy car, out D car. Okay. Do you think most modern enthusiast cars are doomed to sell well for the first years? And then die off and be killed? It seems that people want one, but then everyone gets one and then they die off. And they don't do a new one. Right around its time for a refresh or a new generation. Killing or neutering the car for the next generation. I mean, the, the problem is, is that people just can't fucking afford cars.

• 1:07:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:49Matt Farah?

  Like enthusiast cars are luxury purchases. Whether it's a second car or, you know, driving a sports car as your main car instead of something more practical. And so when budgets get tight, people go, I'm not gonna get the second car. I'm not gonna, I can't afford to finance it. I'm gonna wait and buy a used one or whatever. Sports, like, I'm, I'm writing a column next month for Road and Track about income inequality and how it's fucking up cars. Because...

• 1:08:20Matt Farah?

  We have an in, we have the inverse, the, the, right now, the car market in terms of sports cars is inverse for what it should be. There should be thirty different options for the masses and enthusiasts to buy reasonably, excuse me, reasonably affordable sports cars. Instead, there's like five cars for everybody and like thirty different choices if you can spend one to six million dollars on cars. Which is like, that's not how it should be. That's crazy. There should be fewer and fewer things to choose from as you get higher and higher up the, because there's fewer and fewer people to serve.

• 1:08:58Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:08:59Matt Farah?

  But we have an opposite, you know, this is the, what they call the K-shaped economy. We have the opposite of that happening right now. And that's fucked up. So, yeah, I mean, the, every, you know, everyone wants to build a sports car. So they try to build a sports car. They, Subaru partners with fucking Toyota, uh, Toyota partners with BMW. You know, they, there's partnerships because no one could do it on their own. They build a sports car and then it sells in very small numbers because there's a very small number of people that are in that, what used to be called middle class, uh, that, that, that can have a second car, but that that second car isn't going to be a McLaren. So, yeah, it sucks.

• 1:09:43Matt Farah?

  Rolex LT Lariat King Ranch. I do not purchase things with leather, used or new, as I am one of those damn vegans. Do I, okay. Uh, what are your thoughts on Porsche Race Tech's interior over leather or overall thoughts on quality synthetics? Um, so I have Race Tech's in my Spyder. Uh, I like it for the seats. I hate it on the steering wheel and shifter and I'm going to change my steering wheel to leather. Sorry, vegan. Having said that, I don't hate synthetic materials. I love a great cloth.

• 1:10:18Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:10:19Matt Farah?

  Volvo wool, uh, uh, Rivian's, um, use of cloths with, um, they're, they're not using real leather, whatever their leather is, is not, is.

• 1:10:29Speaker 01

  And there's a lot of synthetic leathers now that look and feel very close to the real stuff. And if you had like a cloth insert with the, you know, vegan leather exterior, which is made of plastic or whatever. But I think it looks amazing and feels good, too.

• 1:10:42Matt Farah?

  Yeah, most of the, of the higher end.

• 1:10:47Matt Farah?

  Alternative leathers feel really nice. Now, you get into a Bentley or something and damn, now you're fucking... Serious leather, that's a different story. But yeah, I don't like, I don't like on the steering wheel or the shifter. But other than that, I do, I do like it, yeah. Koji Koji, in cars where you're stuck between two wheel sizes, oh, where you have a choice of two wheel sizes, how do you personally go about picking which size to go with? Do you downsize for lighter weight and cheaper tires? Or if you can get the bigger size in a forged wheel where weight isn't issued, you opt that? It's a dilemma I'm struggling with right now.

• 1:11:28Matt Farah?

  You, it's actually, sometimes you can, the bigger, the 19 might be lighter than the 18, because there might be more wheel and less tire. Could, could, could in some cases be, you know, if you have very light wheels, for instance.

• 1:11:45Speaker 01

  Sure. You also can fit larger brakes, sometimes, depending on how the interior dimensions of that wheel, and that can be beneficial. I, I would always opt for smaller wheel, more sidewall, both from an aesthetics point, because I think it looks cool on basically anything, and also because of the roads around here. So it depends on where you live. And I think your aesthetic style and what you're doing with the car.

• 1:12:05Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I, I agree. I mean, if, if you have bumpy roads, you want sidewall. If your roads are great and you just like the look, you know, possibly, depending on the car, you might get maybe a little bit sharper turn in with the bigger wheel, because you'll have less sidewall flex.

• 1:12:22Speaker 01

  But you can get that, you could get a more aggressive tire.

• 1:12:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah, but yeah, you could, if that's what you wanted, you could still do that, yeah. Yeah. Federal Investigator, pretty good. Were single clutch transmissions such as Lambo's E-Gear and Ferrari's F1 considered bad when they were new, or were they considered a revolutionary new technology at the time? Both.

• 1:12:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:46Matt Farah?

  Both.

• 1:12:49Matt Farah?

  Go watch some episodes of Top Gear. Go find the original episodes of Top Gear on YouTube or on Hulu or Prime or wherever the fuck they are. Of Clarkson reviewing like the Ferrari 360 or the Aston Vanquish or any or the Mercy Lamborghini. They're just shitting on the gearbox and talking about how terrible it is the whole time. And when we were driving those cars new at the rental company, we fucking hated them. We didn't, they would blow, the hydraulic pumps would blow. They'd roast the clutches like crazy. You had to, the original ones like the Ferrari 355 and the Vanquish.

• 1:13:33Matt Farah?

  Like you were really supposed to like tug the paddles and put the car into neutral when you came to a traffic light. You weren't supposed to sit there in first gear the whole time. You could like wear out the throw out bearing like that's like, that's like silly.

• 1:13:48Speaker 01

  But I also, and I was more of a consumer, well not a consumer, I was a valet, but like my exposure to it was, I thought it was exciting because it was different and it was a cool thing to have paddles on the car.

• 1:13:58Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:59Speaker 01

  And when it kind of worked, it felt cool. Like the SMG now I know it's super slow, but at the time it was just such an interesting idea that I thought was exciting. But it was, it was still bad.

• 1:14:09Matt Farah?

  The idea of it was like, I can see where you're going with this. And at the time it was, well, this works in race cars because it works, you know, if you're flat on the floorboard, then it was reasonably quick.

• 1:14:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:21Matt Farah?

  It was just clunky around town and you go, okay, well, this is race car technology. It's not great in the street cars.

• 1:14:31Matt Farah?

  And, and I think people at the time just wanted what the race cars had and that was, that was fancier. Plus like, I think, I think Americans liked automatic. I think Americans just like automatic transmissions and wanted to drive automatic transmissions.

• 1:14:43Speaker 01

  It was cool.

• 1:14:45Matt Farah?

  I thought they were shit at the time, but don't worry, they're still shitty today. Gila Monster Greg, what is that? What's the new 911 Rally GT?

• 1:14:55Speaker 01

  This is the 911 Rally GT.

• 1:14:57Matt Farah?

  This is a rally homologation kit for the cup car. Oh, so they've, they're selling a fucking rally car. That is awesome.

• 1:15:11Matt Farah?

  I need, I don't need to have any thoughts. That's awesome. Why would that, why would that, how is that not awesome? That's awesome.

• 1:15:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:16Matt Farah?

  That's fucking sick.

• 1:15:17Speaker 01

  I was curious, oh, top speed.

• 1:15:19Matt Farah?

  How, can I just get a, can we get a better photo? Is the car road legal? That's a good question. Yes, with rally homologation, the rally GT is road legal car for competition use only. That's awesome.

• 1:15:32Speaker 01

  Here we go. Biggest changes.

• 1:15:33Matt Farah?

  Uh, based in the cup car adapted for rally use features a modified roll cage to carry a spare wheel, rally specific suspension, underbody protection, as well as a co-driver seat, handbrake.

• 1:15:44Speaker 01

  Misspelled brake. You misspelled brake.

• 1:15:45Matt Farah?

  I did, yeah. And four identical rally tires. Uh, the powerful engine sequential gearbox with modified ratios, ABS and traction control. That's pretty fucking awesome. How do I drive this? We must. We must drive this. It's street legal.

• 1:16:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:06Speaker 01

  Do a target with it.

• 1:16:06Matt Farah?

  That's very, very, very sick. Yeah. We have to figure out how to drive this.

• 1:16:14Speaker 01

  They're listening.

• 1:16:15Matt Farah?

  I know, but we must. That's so cool. Yeah.

• 1:16:19Speaker 01

  It's gonna be a good time.

• 1:16:20Matt Farah?

  That is all that is right and good in the world. Off-road, off-road sports cars are just better. Carbon monocoque and ball torture.

• 1:16:30Speaker 01

  So good.

• 1:16:32Matt Farah?

  Uh, that's so funny. One of the most boring cars I've ever owned is a Saab 93, and yet I couldn't leave the house with at least one Saab nerd approaching me to chew my ear off for an hour. That's very funny. In your experience, what's the most enthusiast, uh, what's the most or most surprising enthusiast nerd magnet car? Skylines.

• 1:16:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:55Matt Farah?

  I mean, you, you can't get out of a gas station, cause everyone's.

• 1:16:59Speaker 01

  I'm glad you mentioned that, cause Sarah showed me a video this weekend. It's like a TikTok thing, but the, the caption, it's someone with a red R32. And the caption says, like, quote, "You know that girls aren't gonna approach you for that car, right? Just dudes." And it's like, I know.

• 1:17:13Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:13Speaker 01

  And it's just footage of dudes giving thumbs up and stuff. And I went, wow, it would be really funny if there's, I mean, there's, of course, there's. Gay car dudes out there that are just like.

• 1:17:21Matt Farah?

  But if that's your move.

• 1:17:22Speaker 01

  If that's.

• 1:17:23Matt Farah?

  Cruising.

• 1:17:23Speaker 01

  If that's the move and it works, you know, only on men, it'd be so funny.

• 1:17:27Matt Farah?

  Can we get, we're gonna have to get.

• 1:17:28Speaker 01

  32 fishing lure.

• 1:17:30Matt Farah?

  Queer shifting gears. We need you to weigh in on this, please. Have, and I don't know if they're, if these are men, men, women, or, or otherwise, but, but, uh, let us know. Is that a good way for men to attract other men?

• 1:17:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:45Matt Farah?

  I think it probably is.

• 1:17:46Speaker 01

  I would like, that's funny.

• 1:17:47Matt Farah?

  It's pretty fucking funny.

• 1:17:48Speaker 01

  Um, nerds? Yeah, I mean, Skylines, sure.

• 1:17:52Matt Farah?

  I mean, everyone wants to talk to you about your DeLorean.

• 1:17:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I was gonna say, most surprising. I feel like the DeLorean is too famous.

• 1:17:59Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:18:01Speaker 01

  Delica? Does that get approached a lot?

• 1:18:04Matt Farah?

  People.

• 1:18:04Speaker 01

  By like van nerds?

• 1:18:05Matt Farah?

  Not really. People are like, oh, that's cool, but then they don't really give a shit. The pow, I mean, Hannah's pow, people love. Everybody loves the pow.

• 1:18:17Matt Farah?

  Hmm.

• 1:18:22Matt Farah?

  I mean, this, this Ineos, you know, is, is a fairly regular car and people seem to be into it.

• 1:18:32Speaker 01

  I think older cars, maybe that's not surprising, but like, you know, your NSX, it's 20 years old, but you'd probably park it and get approached by lots of enthusiasts.

• 1:18:41Matt Farah?

  I was very surprised at how much love the NSX would get on the street. It was a lot. Um, huh.

• 1:18:51Matt Farah?

  But if you have a really clean, old, cool car, like, doesn't have to be fancy, but like, just something, you know, whatever, but that's nice and like a Beetle or.

• 1:18:59Speaker 01

  It's a super clean, stock 240 SX.

• 1:19:02Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 1:19:03Speaker 01

  You'd get so many people saying what's up.

• 1:19:05Matt Farah?

  People offering you money.

• 1:19:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, just NA whatever coupe.

• 1:19:08Matt Farah?

  Um, LL Cartier.

• 1:19:12Matt Farah?

  Cartier.

• 1:19:12Speaker 01

  Cartier.

• 1:19:13Matt Farah?

  LL Cart.

• 1:19:14Speaker 01

  Like Cool J, so I guess it's.

• 1:19:16Matt Farah?

  Oh, LL Cool J, LL Cartier.

• 1:19:18Speaker 01

  LL Cartier.

• 1:19:19Matt Farah?

  Cool, yeah, yeah. Got a chance to drive the S63E Performance for a little over a thousand miles around Texas. I found it to be effortlessly fast and the stereo and toys are amazing. However, I expected it to have no road or wind noise, supple suspension, and that the seats would guarantee my back would never feel a thing. And I was disappointed in those things. Is my disappointed because, am I disappointed because it's an AMG? Or because my expectations are off? Zach reviewed this car.

• 1:19:48Speaker 01

  I had the exact same expectations and I came away disappointed because I think adding too much performance to the S-Class, and I know they want to sell it and make it differentiate it from the lower S-classes, classes. But I think, to me, a big body bends of that should be a great highway machine, but a comfortable highway machine. So give it all the power in the world, give it a thousand pound feet of torque and stuff, but make the suspension soft and make the wheels slightly smaller because on mild cracks in Santa Monica, I mean, really like mild, you know, joints between smooth concrete, it like shook through the car. I think it has 22-inch wheels. And it just felt like they pushed it too far to the twisty track performance envelope and they completely lost what that car is intended for and will be used for.

• 1:20:33Matt Farah?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:20:33Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:20:34Matt Farah?

  I haven't driven it, but I would want it to ride well. I mean, you know, maybe, maybe they've just done a little too much AMG. You know, they went a little too far, gotta dial that shit back. But your back, I mean, the seats that your back should, did it not have good seats?

• 1:20:53Speaker 01

  No, I thought the seats were great.

• 1:20:54Matt Farah?

  Maybe, did you, I wonder if, is there like further touchscreen? Like, if you just fuck with the controls? No, no, like, but if you just set the seat using the controls, but you don't dig into the menus to get, you gotta get the additional lumbar. All that stuff's in the, in the NMI.

• 1:21:09Speaker 01

  And the adjustable bolsters, and with Mercedes, you can change the lumbar with that graphic. Not only how pronounced it is, you can make it look like a pregnant woman or a lightly pregnant woman. But you can also move the lumbar up and down. And you have to get into those menus to find that stuff. And then you can tailor the seat totally to your body shape, but the ride, you know, what your back's going to feel through the tires is not adjustable. Not really.

• 1:21:32Matt Farah?

  Uh, Matt's missing Countach part. Uh, Cadillac and Audi is and are now in F1. Predictions for who will have a better year?

• 1:21:42Speaker 01

  Well, Audi bought Sauber.

• 1:21:44Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:44Speaker 01

  And Cadillac's making their own team.

• 1:21:46Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:47Speaker 01

  My money would be on Audi and Cadillac racing is so good. I mean, when they're in IMSA, like they are one of the top three contenders basically every year for.

• 1:21:56Matt Farah?

  But Audi was extremely dominant in endurance racing as well.

• 1:21:59Speaker 01

  And I think, I think Audi knows how to endurance race. F1 is not an endurance race, but they know how to race, but they're, and they bought an existing team that was doing okay. And Cadillac is like, everything is from the ground zero. And I think that will have a lot more issues.

• 1:22:16Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, the odds of them coming out of the hole fucking on podium is probably low.

• 1:22:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, they'll learn and they'll catch up, but I think they're starting behind.

• 1:22:25Matt Farah?

  Right. Um, oh boy, David Tuig, the pink one in the stink. So, uh, it turns out I know like three people in the Epstein files.

• 1:22:37Speaker 01

  The newly released, released ones.

• 1:22:38Matt Farah?

  Newly released one. A cup, uh, the, the, um, the Brian Vickers and Sarah Kellen thing goes back like 11 years to when me and Spike hosted that TV show together with Brian Vickers. And his like wife was around and she was just Brian's wife and he was just a retired NASCAR driver. And we were, you know, she was just hanging out. So we were talking about her, what do you do? Interior designer, okay. You like cars? What do you drive? Ferrari 599. It's like, what? This girl was like, maybe in her late twenties or early thirties. I'm like, you, you drive a Ferrari 599? And she's like, yeah, and I have a Bentley or some, some, something else expensive. And I was like, interiors?

• 1:23:24Matt Farah?

  You're interior designer? Like, okay. But like, something was like off and like later Spike was like doing some Googling and like found out then, like that this girl, his, his wife was like Ghislaine Maxwell's like number two, like recruiter.

• 1:23:42Speaker 01

  Oh, really?

• 1:23:42Matt Farah?

  Yes.

• 1:23:43Speaker 01

  I did not know that.

• 1:23:43Matt Farah?

  No, this was in 2015.

• 1:23:44Speaker 01

  Whoa.

• 1:23:45Matt Farah?

  This was 2015, and me and Spike have been talking about this for years, for years. And every time, there's been a tidbit about her name was Sarah Kellen, or was, is. I don't think she's ever been charged with anything. Her name's come up a million fucking times. I don't know why it's like a bombshell that all of a sudden Brian Vickers is, was involved because he's married to her. So like, of course, his name's gonna be in there fucking somewhere. I haven't seen either of them since 2015, by the way. Um, and then, yeah, Peter Attia's in there, too. That's not great. Um, you know, I, I don't know him, this guy, that well. He came on the show. He's a doctor.

• 1:24:25Matt Farah?

  He's, uh, pretty well-known. He's a huge fan of Ayrton Senna and is a, is a very fast racing driver also. And, uh, yep, in the Epstein files.

• 1:24:35Speaker 01

  We, we, uh...

• 1:24:38Matt Farah?

  There's not, he's not, I mean, he, there isn't any-

• 1:24:40Speaker 01

  Do you know what he's do- because so I pull up this story, this is very recent.

• 1:24:43Matt Farah?

  There isn't anything overtly criminal that, that I, that I saw, okay? And I, I didn't spend a lot of time on this, but like, there's just, there's just emails back and forth of two people that are clearly friends, like-

• 1:24:55Speaker 01

  Right, so Vickers forwarded, uh, a sexually explicit, this is from USA Today. He forwarded a sexually explicit email to Epstein, uh, with a story about, uh,

• 1:25:09Speaker 01

  uh, someone who gets rejected by a princess and then, oh, a prince that gets rejected. Um, so he's in there for that.

• 1:25:14Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:14Speaker 01

  And then, I was trying to find information on Sarah Kellen.

• 1:25:17Matt Farah?

  Well, she's right, I mean, she's right there. Vickers' ex-wife, Sarah Kellen, blah, blah, blah. And there's two, two links right there of her in that paragraph that you're on right there. Down, down, down, one of those two.

• 1:25:29Speaker 01

  Oh, okay. Oh, yeah, she was accused of recruiting.

• 1:25:32Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:33Speaker 01

  I mean, what she found, yeah, guilty, I don't know.

• 1:25:35Matt Farah?

  I, I don't, I don't actually know if she was tried, but she's certainly, uh, you know-

• 1:25:40Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 1:25:41Matt Farah?

  Definitely been around, let's just say. And, oh, the thing that, that, uh- Spike found back in the day, the address of her office for her interior design business. It was in a fucking building Epstein owned. Like it was at Epstein's like building.

• 1:26:00Speaker 01

  Right, so was she doing any interior design or being paid for that by doing other things?

• 1:26:04Matt Farah?

  It was driving around a Ferrari 599 at 20 something. So, yeah, and then, you know, Peter's in there too, fucking. I, I, I, nothing like overt, but like, you know, friendly emails between friends.

• 1:26:20Speaker 01

  I mean, I said in the car, like.

• 1:26:21Matt Farah?

  It's not great.

• 1:26:22Speaker 01

  I, I would be, I would feel gutted if my name showed up and it was like. Epstein was hit by valet Zach Klapman while at the Chop House in Boulder in 2007.

• 1:26:33Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:26:33Speaker 01

  And it was like I crashed a car into him or something like that, even then, you know.

• 1:26:37Matt Farah?

  No, Thaddeus was like, don't worry, the only Farah in there is a hotel in Morocco. I was like, whoa.

• 1:26:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:26:42Matt Farah?

  Alright, but man, fucking, everybody knew Epstein, I guess, huh? It seems like, seems like all the rich people on, on all sides of the fucking political spectrum.

• 1:26:53Speaker 01

  I think it really, I think it does really matter how you knew this person because if they were putting themselves in these, in rich people parties.

• 1:27:02Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:02Speaker 01

  And you were also going to the, not the island parties, I'm saying, you know.

• 1:27:06Matt Farah?

  Yeah, the, like the, the charity parties or whatever the fuck, the high society stuff.

• 1:27:10Speaker 01

  High society stuff, okay, but the details do matter, so.

• 1:27:13Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 1:27:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:15Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:15Speaker 01

  But read the, the complaint line logs if you're listening to this and you haven't seen them, because those are disgusting and that's.

• 1:27:22Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:22Speaker 01

  Where like the real story, I think, is.

• 1:27:24Matt Farah?

  The, uh, the extent of my wanting to read about the Epstein files, I, I watch, uh, Coffeezilla.

• 1:27:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:31Matt Farah?

  I like, I love me some Coffeezilla, the latest video from the other day about, that was like two days ago or whatever about this was great.

• 1:27:40Matt Farah?

  But, uh, yeah, no, not, uh, not so great that Peter was in there. I mean, hmm, not great. So, I mean, what am I, I don't know what the fuck I'm supposed to say, hung out with the guy a couple of times, we didn't do anything weird.

• 1:27:55Matt Farah?

  We looked at cars and ate.

• 1:27:57Speaker 01

  Talked about Senna.

• 1:27:58Matt Farah?

  Talked about Aaron Senna.

• 1:27:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:59Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Major depreciation disorder says, lots of people say certain cars hold value better than they should. But have you seen examples of cars that depreciate badly even though they shouldn't? Uh, sure. Sure. There are cars that depreciate faster than they should.

• 1:28:20Speaker 01

  Well, how do we define like should or shouldn't? It's like, we love them because they're exciting, but they depreciate. You know, because they made a ton of them.

• 1:28:27Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:27Speaker 01

  And it's like, oh, that car, we think that car is worth more than X, but it's falling to that value because there's a bunch of them out there, or because they fall apart and they suck.

• 1:28:35Matt Farah?

  You need to change the, we need to change the wording. Because it's not cars that depreciate badly even though they shouldn't. It should be cars that depreciate badly even though they're fundamentally good cars. You know what I mean? Because like, sometimes a car depreciates badly because it's an unreliable piece of shit. Sometimes a car depreciates badly because they just built too many.

• 1:28:52Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:28:52Matt Farah?

  Like, that's, that's Corvettes. I mean, that's, I'm literally counting on that. I am counting on Corvette ZR1s to get so cheap.

• 1:29:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:29:01Matt Farah?

  That I can buy one as a daily beater.

• 1:29:03Speaker 01

  Or the fact that the Z06s have already come down.

• 1:29:05Matt Farah?

  Yeah, they're already there.

• 1:29:06Speaker 01

  You know, hugely in price.

• 1:29:07Matt Farah?

  And regular ass C7s? Like, a Stingray is like a $55,000 car right now with relatively low miles. So like, you can always count on GM to make one more car than they should have. And so, um.

• 1:29:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's a good example.

• 1:29:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Granny Shiften not double clutching like you should. Would you rather be a moderately successful racing driver? Think mid-tier Indy car? Or have the careers you currently have? I'd rather have the career I currently have.

• 1:29:40Speaker 01

  I think something that isn't talked about, but if you listen to Dinner with Racers, a lot of the racers they talk to, they talk about the hustle required by a racing driver below the top, top tier. The hustle they have to put in to get sponsors for everything for every year is crazy. I mean, all of them have the same story of knocking on 100 doors when they're getting started. Even when they're winning a couple of things or doing well, they have to go sell themselves all the time. And that just seems, for me, that would be like impossible.

• 1:30:12Matt Farah?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:30:12Speaker 01

  That'd be really hard. Not to mention, you don't get to drive everything, you get to drive one thing and...

• 1:30:17Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it might suck. I mean, what if you're, you know, what if the car you have is a piece of shit, or the team you're in is a piece of shit, but you need them, you know?

• 1:30:23Speaker 01

  Ross Bentley has that story, like the cars, his Indy car was this engine from last, last generation. It wasn't competitive, and then they kept exploding. So you could get stuck with that.

• 1:30:33Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Uh, major depreciation disorder. When the STI was discontinued, I thought, Zach, can you, can you check this? Uh, so it's some, some sold listings on cars and bids. When, when the STI was discontinued, I thought it would hold value or possibly appreciate. Looking at bat and cars and bids, I've seen many go for underwhelming figures. Uh, in some cases, WRXs hold value better. Why does nobody seem to care about STIs? Interesting question. Part of it is that Subaru hasn't really done anything to make younger people excited about STIs. You know what I mean? Or about Subarus. Like, they don't have a real,

• 1:31:16Matt Farah?

  like, they're not rallying right now. Let's see. Let's go, oh, hang on, let's go for, uh, can we, results? Let's go for, uh, recent. Sold for, so there's a Type RA, 13,300 miles, 40,000. 2016, one owner, 15,000. I mean, I would say 1,200. Well, I would say this. They don't really appear to be collectible. They appear to be fun cars to drive that, you know, will hold value sort of well to a point.

• 1:31:56Speaker 01

  Wow, look, I mean, this is 10,000 miles on a car that's 11 years old.

• 1:32:00Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:00Speaker 01

  And it's 25 grand.

• 1:32:02Matt Farah?

  Yeah. I mean, that's not great.

• 1:32:04Speaker 01

  That is so low, that's 1,000 miles a year, less, and...

• 1:32:09Matt Farah?

  I mean, actually, look, that would be, if you, if that sale went through, which it doesn't look like it did, but that would be a good buy. A 10,000 mile STI for 25 grand?

• 1:32:20Speaker 01

  Well, then, but then we get into thing is the mileage too low where you need to fix things because it wasn't driven enough.

• 1:32:24Matt Farah?

  I think those are enough miles. I think 1,000 miles a year is enough miles that you don't have to fix things from not, from lack of use.

• 1:32:32Speaker 01

  I'd have to look at the production numbers. I think for me and a lot of it is that the car's performance hasn't really, hasn't changed drastically enough. So you have, you don't just have the supply of like the most recent generation. You have the supply of effectively 04 to now.

• 1:32:47Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:47Speaker 01

  And they all make almost the same horsepower. The transmissions, I think, are the same. It's a good 6-speed, so they, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. And they don't break, so they don't have to change it. But you go, okay, well, basically, you're picking an appearance package. Which one do you like the best? But I think that means the supply number's really high. And so they're not that collectible. And I think they get driven a lot, which is good.

• 1:33:07Matt Farah?

  And also, like, they have, like, they have a floor, you know?

• 1:33:12Speaker 01

  Right here.

• 1:33:13Matt Farah?

  Like, yeah, like, like, like a running, driving, non-salvage one is always gonna be worth like 15, 16 grand, right? So, you know, you can use that number of knowing where the floor is to buy one used and enjoy, you know?

• 1:33:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:31Matt Farah?

  Going, all right, well, if I pay $25,000 for that, that 10-year-old one, you know, I could put 100,000 miles on it. And as long as I don't crash it or otherwise break it, I'm only gonna lose, you know, whatever, 8,000 bucks in depreciation.

• 1:33:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:48Matt Farah?

  So it's not gonna cost me anything to buy. So all these collectible ones are fucking in the wrapper, right? Those are, those are all, or like a 22B or something, but like...

• 1:33:59Speaker 01

  Pretty much.

• 1:34:00Matt Farah?

  You know, so, so they're just not investment-grade cars, which is okay. It means buy, drive, and enjoy.

• 1:34:08Speaker 01

  It also looks like the ones that are selling for more money is, according to BAT, are the, you know, 04 to 06s.

• 1:34:16Matt Farah?

  With like no miles.

• 1:34:17Speaker 01

  The Blavie and Hawkeye with low miles.

• 1:34:18Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:19Speaker 01

  But anything that's newer than that, that's when you're getting, even that one. That one's when you're getting into like the 20s and the 30s.

• 1:34:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:24Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah.

• 1:34:25Matt Farah?

  I mean, those, those 04 to 06 cars or 04 to 07, I mean, those are really iconic cars. And so I'm not sure the... Like if you said to me, if you said to me, Matt, what does a 2005 STI look like? I go, well, it has these headlights and this wing. If you said, what's a 2016 look like compared to a 2014? Like, I probably, I couldn't really tell you.

• 1:34:49Speaker 01

  I couldn't either. I think we kind of stopped paying attention to them and, um, uh, yeah. Cause that was after the egg. That was after the hatchback.

• 1:34:57Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah. Uh, queer shifting gears says, thoughts on the car community using delete as a verb or noun for removing or swapping something? Where did it come from? Um, I mean, you go back to like the 60s and you could have ace air conditioning delete or, or radio delete packages for muscle cars and shit.

• 1:35:20Speaker 01

  Definitely. I think what they say is, I guess on the E500 discussion, you said, we're deleting the wood trim and swapping it with all wood. So that's just like, maybe just, you know, I mean, language changes. It evolves a lot as time goes on. Um, but I think-

• 1:35:34Matt Farah?

  If I literally said it like that, that's me speaking very sloppily. We're not deleting. We're swapping, we're changing. We're changing wood to metal.

• 1:35:41Speaker 01

  I think delete mostly means I didn't choose this option that was available. You know, if, like the, uh, GT3 RSs-

• 1:35:47Matt Farah?

  No, delete is a pro, is not just not getting an option. It's, there are options to remove shit. That's delete.

• 1:35:54Speaker 01

  You're, you're selecting to take away the thing that was included.

• 1:35:57Matt Farah?

  Correct. Like you could get, like in the GT4, you could get air conditioning delete, things like that.

• 1:36:06Matt Farah?

  Okay. When, uh, Baymobile says, when equipped with an automatic gearbox, the Mazda RX8 cannot reach 7,000 RPM, uh, in order to open an intake valve that would otherwise be able to open with a car equipped with a manual, because the red line is higher. This, among other things, caused engines to fail and sully the reputation of the car. Have there been other cars that when equipped with certain options drastically changed reliability of that car? Oh, yeah.

• 1:36:37Speaker 01

  That's a pretty unique situation.

• 1:36:39Matt Farah?

  No, for sure. I mean, there's like, like, like this, in this descrip, like, if you had a car that had a shitty automatic transmission, well, yeah, if you got the automatic transmission, it would be worse than if you got the manual, which was fine. Right?

• 1:36:54Speaker 01

  Well, the auto is the thing that breaks. This is interesting because the transmission selected is causing engines to fail versus the transmission failing.

• 1:37:02Matt Farah?

  Well, we just talked about this. The F1 pumps in the single clutch gearboxes, like a stick shift Ferrari 360 is drastically more reliable when it's driven properly and not smoked the clutch than a fucking paddle shifted one. Way more reliable, but not because the gearbox ruins the engine. It's because the gearbox isn't reliable. You know, so those for sure. The Wranglers 4xE, any Chrysler hybrid or whatever Stellantis hybrid product, for sure.

• 1:37:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, overcomplicating usually leads to a reduction in reliability.

• 1:37:43Matt Farah?

  Right, yeah. Back in the day, the Cadillac cylinder deactivation from the 80s.

• 1:37:50Speaker 01

  Oh, because then it was...

• 1:37:51Matt Farah?

  The V8 642 or whatever it was. I think V8 64 it was called. It was essentially cylinder deactivation. It was just a mess.

• 1:37:59Speaker 01

  Wasn't that happening with an LS generation? Like because it deactivates, you're not getting that wash, the gasoline cleaning off the cylinders and stuff?

• 1:38:06Matt Farah?

  It could have been, yeah. Not sure.

• 1:38:11Matt Farah?

  Okay.

• 1:38:15Matt Farah?

  Let's see. Koji Koji also says, "It seems that the latest trend in BMW track cars is swapping in the B48 turbo four cylinder, which I think was in like the 230 in BMW. Shops are doing this swap and attune into E36s and getting cars that put down faster track times than the cars equipped with S54s and LSs. Lighter weight, better chassis balance." Okay. "If you were one of the people tracking their older BMW and chasing faster lap times, would you do this?"

• 1:38:50Matt Farah?

  I don't, I don't see why not, if it actually worked.

• 1:38:53Speaker 01

  This makes total sense. If all I'm chasing is lap times, then you will always go for the thing that will make you faster. So reduce weight, move the weight balance back.

• 1:39:01Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 1:39:01Speaker 01

  Liability stays the same power, especially with power and BOP and all these different class rules.

• 1:39:06Matt Farah?

  You use the automatic gearbox.

• 1:39:07Speaker 01

  Am I hitting the horsepower number that we're allowed to have? Yes.

• 1:39:10Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:11Speaker 01

  So if I can do that with less weight and less consumption and better weight balance, the answer is yes.

• 1:39:16Matt Farah?

  And if you can literally do the whole powertrain, like that B48 with the ZF 8-speed automatic gearbox, like I just did a fucking endurance race with that gearbox, I will absolutely race with that gearbox. That is a excellent automatic transmission for racing, like does exactly what it's fucking told. So if I was doing it, I would actually ditch the stick also and take the automatic.

• 1:39:40Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:39:40Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:42Matt Farah?

  Fast back to the future, assuming it can be done OEM and has good margins, is there a market for a shop that creates and sells Crosstrek converted STIs? Are you turning an STI into a Crosstrek or a Crosstrek into an STI?

• 1:39:59Speaker 01

  That's a very good question. I assumed it would be swapping stuff, STI stuff into the cross, well, Crosstrek converted STIs.

• 1:40:08Matt Farah?

  No, I think it would be-

• 1:40:09Speaker 01

  I mean, that's, you're right, that's that direction. So you're just lifting an STI?

• 1:40:13Matt Farah?

  You're lifting an STI.

• 1:40:14Speaker 01

  Well, there's, that market truly exists. It's called rally suspension.

• 1:40:17Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:17Speaker 01

  And that's much simpler than swapping STI parts into a Crosstrek, probably.

• 1:40:21Matt Farah?

  But, but I don't know who, who, let's say a Crosstrek is a $35,000 car. I don't, I don't know. Let's say an STI, well, is a $50,000 car, right? So are you gonna get somebody who really wants to spend like $75,000 on a Subaru?

• 1:40:43Matt Farah?

  I don't think you are.

• 1:40:44Speaker 01

  I think the market's very small for this kind of thing.

• 1:40:46Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:46Speaker 01

  And in either direction, if you want to make a Crosstrek faster, there's probably cheaper ways to do it. Just put a turbo, a small one on that thing, or maybe you can just swap the engine. But to make a full STI version of Crosstrek with, you know, trans and fitment and all that stuff would probably be tough and expensive.

• 1:41:02Matt Farah?

  Yeah. I blow horns, why are many automotive news outlets referring to an upcoming 911 GT car that's been tested recently as a GT3 RS claiming it's going turbo as opposed to NA for the next gen? Isn't it obviously a GT2 RS testing? I think you're right. I think all these people are saying the next gen GT3 RS is going turbo to get people to click on their shit, when in reality, the spy shots are very obviously a GT2 RS. The question for me is, is the GT2 RS going to be hybrid?

• 1:41:36Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:41:37Matt Farah?

  Or will it be just the twin, like last generation's twin turbo?

• 1:41:41Speaker 01

  Crazy turbo engine.

• 1:41:42Matt Farah?

  Or a juiced up version of the 3.0 liter, which we know can make big power? So that's really the question for me. It is also possible that the next gen GT car, GT3 RS, might have to be turbocharged, like, or it might have to have a hybrid assist system in it, or have something. Like, I'm not sure how long they can keep building that engine. I think they're gonna try, but I don't know if they can.

• 1:42:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think a lot of people, when these changes happen, they'll say, why is Porsche or why is car company doing this? And the answer is almost always, not because they want to, because they have to.

• 1:42:18Matt Farah?

  Mm-hmm. Focus ST Lover, what would you consider to be the best car for the snow under 35K? No modifications? I mean, whichever one, you can just get snow tires from the factory.

• 1:42:31Speaker 01

  That...

• 1:42:32Matt Farah?

  Like, the best car in the snow. By the way, we live in Los Angeles. I have a very limited amount of time to drive cars in the snow. Like, I... Testing cars in the snow is a real treat, I love doing it, but like, that doesn't happen here, so... But like... Any all wheel drive car, let's game it out. It'll probably be a Subaru.

• 1:42:56Speaker 01

  My, my thought went to Outback of some kind, preferably like the last gen where they're a little bit smaller than.

• 1:43:04Matt Farah?

  Yeah, like essentially like a Crosstrek or a, like it has, it has, it has all wheel drive that's longitudinal, not Haldex based. So there's a real transfer case, real longitudinal, you know, all wheel drive. And, and you just put good tires on that.

• 1:43:19Speaker 01

  Yeah. I think, I think Crosstrek with snow tires is the answer because you have ground clearance. You have a simple engine. It's not turbocharged. Uh, and the, the diff situation is simpler than some of the front wheel drive based cars. So.

• 1:43:32Matt Farah?

  Mm hmm. Elderly woman behind the wheel of a small car. Uh, you recently said that no production cars have ever really scared you. What about the opposite? Have car, have any cars just been way too easy to drive at the limit?

• 1:43:46Speaker 01

  GT Rs?

• 1:43:48Matt Farah?

  GT Rs are boring. Yeah. R35 GT Rs are boring. Yeah.

• 1:43:51Speaker 01

  Now the limits have gotten higher with cars like that because its power's gone up. So, you know, a new 911 Turbo S, which is what the GT R competed with when it came out, is so fast, the limits, the kinetic energy and the momentum, like if you lose it at that speed, the speed's capable, would be pretty dangerous.

• 1:44:07Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:08Speaker 01

  So it's gotten harder, but um, usually things that have too much tire and not enough horsepower are also very easy to drive. The Miata is pretty easy to drive at the limit.

• 1:44:16Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, there, there's, yeah, there's cars with more tire than power.

• 1:44:20Speaker 01

  Subaru BRZTS.

• 1:44:21Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 1:44:22Speaker 01

  That thing.

• 1:44:22Matt Farah?

  That thing, yeah.

• 1:44:23Speaker 01

  Sticky, tightly sprung, no guts.

• 1:44:26Matt Farah?

  Um, GR Corollas are really easy to drive at the limit, particularly the automatic transmission equipped ones. There, you could fucking lap and lap and lap and lap and lap like the Golf R. I mean, I, I, the Golf R is an incredibly competent car that is not particularly exciting. You, I could get to within a quarter second a lap of what that car could ever possibly do on like lap three. And now what do I learn? You know, so that's, that's kind of like where that, those types of cars could be like boring is on a track because on a road, well, every, the scenery changes, you know? So every, every corner is a little bit of a new adventure, but on a track where you have the same 12 corners over and over,

• 1:45:09Matt Farah?

  and you can figure out what a car can do like right quick. Now you're just, now you're boring.

• 1:45:18Matt Farah?

  Uh, yeah, that was, yeah, uh, blue shoes and blue cruise.

• 1:45:26Matt Farah?

  Thinking about that combination. That would be a good, uh, that'd be a good like OnlyFans, uh, channel. Like for like a, for like a couple, a couple where that was like getting, giving roadhead constantly.

• 1:45:39Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:45:40Matt Farah?

  For a while, remember there was like, when FSD like first came out, there was a bunch of like FSD porn.

• 1:45:45Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:45:45Matt Farah?

  I'm glad they've stopped doing that. Uh, thoughts on the discontinuation of the Model S and X? That is, um, the X I, I, I could see, but what's crazy is that they don't like have a new one. Like there's no, they're just cancelling this car, these two cars, and it's not like there's, uh, they're replacing them with other cars. Like they're actually talking about building this dumb fucking robot thing. What are we, what are we doing?

• 1:46:17Speaker 01

  Right. They, they say they're gonna shift production into Fremont factory from Model S and X to robots, to the Optimus robots and whatnot.

• 1:46:23Matt Farah?

  Yeah, that are very real and that we're all gonna fucking have for sure. That, that is just crazy to me.

• 1:46:30Speaker 01

  I wonder what, I don't think the X has been selling well for a long time.

• 1:46:33Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:46:34Speaker 01

  So getting rid of that makes sense. I am curious, I'll look it up while you chat, like, what the Model S sales have done, or has the X, have the X, uh, I'm sorry, have the three and the Y eclipsed the S so much?

• 1:46:44Matt Farah?

  Yeah, no, the S is such an old car and it's still expensive. The X is fucking stupid, but to not have replacements.

• 1:46:53Speaker 01

  Very true. That is a unique thing that most car companies don't do.

• 1:46:55Matt Farah?

  That is crazy, you know?

• 1:46:59Matt Farah?

  And, and, and not only that, I mean, they, they, we know for a fact, they don't really have any next gen plans for, for Model Y or Model 3 either. They're, I guess they don't want to build cars anymore. I mean, it turns out that like, you know, most, shocking that most of Elon's bullshit was fucking bullshit because, because this, you know, it was supposed to, it was supposed to make transportation fucking greener. It was, that was gonna be the thing. And now they've, they've rolled back all these environmental fucking regulations, thanks to the fucking guy that Elon effectively guaranteed got into

• 1:47:42Matt Farah?

  office. And now Tesla's just not gonna build cars anymore.

• 1:47:46Speaker 01

  It's weird. According to goodcarbadcar.net, the annual sales for the Model S peaked at 90,000 in 2022, although they were going down.

• 1:47:55Matt Farah?

  Yeah, 90,000.

• 1:47:56Speaker 01

  That's weird.

• 1:47:57Matt Farah?

  That's when, that's when the Plaid came out.

• 1:48:00Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:48:00Matt Farah?

  That was the Plaid.

• 1:48:01Speaker 01

  They sold a lot of Plads, but since then, 26,000 in '23, 15,000 in '24, 9,000 in '25.

• 1:48:09Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:09Speaker 01

  So, pretty steep decline. Geez, I mean, that's falling really fast.

• 1:48:14Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:14Speaker 01

  So, they had their time, kind of the early teens, selling in the twenties, but still not super high.

• 1:48:20Matt Farah?

  That's not that many.

• 1:48:21Speaker 01

  I mean, the average, if you get rid of the 90,000, it's like 22,000 a year.

• 1:48:27Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:27Speaker 01

  So, I think, I think the three in the Y. But it is weird. I get it, getting rid of sedans, Ford's done that. But to get rid of your biggest, largest SUV.

• 1:48:36Matt Farah?

  Well, and you're.

• 1:48:36Speaker 01

  And not replace it.

• 1:48:37Matt Farah?

  And not have a fucking.

• 1:48:38Speaker 01

  Is something I don't think any other car company would do.

• 1:48:41Matt Farah?

  That's crazy. I mean, they're going so hard at this AI thing. I mean, it, either it's spectacularly successful and regular people are deeply fucked, or it goes spectacularly wrong, and regular people will get to laugh in five minutes before realizing that the entire economy was propped up on this and we're all deeply fucked.

• 1:49:06Speaker 01

  Propped up on the AI thing.

• 1:49:07Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:08Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, yeah, that would hurt the Mag7 and, you know, SPY and all that stuff. I think the bigger question is, if the robots don't work out for him in terms of manufacturing, does Tesla crater down to being, you know, valued, like what a car company should be valued at? And if they succeed, does he actually have an army of robots to do his bidding?

• 1:49:26Matt Farah?

  I mean, first off, they will not. There's all, there are already domestic robots. I have like four of them in my kitchen right now. I have a dishwasher, a washing machine, a dryer, fucking automatic coffee maker. I have all kinds of robots that do things already. They're not shaped like people because they'd be worse at their job if they were shaped like fucking people.

• 1:49:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, car companies already use robots to do specialized things.

• 1:49:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:51Speaker 01

  But a human is more versatile in skills than something bolted to the ground that can like move a thing or weld a thing.

• 1:49:57Matt Farah?

  But it's like so bad at things.

• 1:49:59Speaker 01

  It is.

• 1:50:00Matt Farah?

  It's so bad at doing things.

• 1:50:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:02Matt Farah?

  Like, like, it's like, you, the reason our eyes are good is because they're connected to our brain. The reason our fucking, our hands can do things is because they're all connected to our brain. Without an actual human brain, you fucking can't do any of this shit.

• 1:50:19Speaker 01

  Well, it depends on what you program it to do. I mean, computers can.

• 1:50:23Matt Farah?

  A general AI robot is what he's trying to sell.

• 1:50:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:50:27Matt Farah?

  You can't, that's not a thing. You can't have that. It's, I don't, I feel like I'm fucking taking crazy pills. Everyone's like, when he has robots, what the fuck do you mean when he, they're, this is not real.

• 1:50:37Speaker 01

  Following you around and doing your dishes for you.

• 1:50:39Matt Farah?

  This is fucking bullshit, dude. None of this is real. Ugh. Colin Sieb is reading The Power of Now. Have the lessons from the book stuck or faded in your daily life? The only thing that sticks is to be an observer of yourself. I read this book like three years ago and so it was like, it's essentially like. If you're, if you're having thoughts, negative thoughts about yourself, the idea is that you step out and become an observer of that and go, huh, I'm having those thoughts. At, you know, like, and, and to observe yourself having the thoughts

• 1:51:21Matt Farah?

  and sort of become that separate from it. The first half of the power now is really good. Then the second half, it really veers into Jesus land and you can let that shit go. But if you have an overactive brain, you can't turn it off, that's a good place to start. Um, my cat's name is Bethany. Hi, Bethany. Uh, when you're on a road trip, what gas station chains do you prefer to stop at if it's available? Um, I don't really give a shit unless it's, unless it's like not a brand name of gas. Like I, I try not to stop at gas I've never heard of. Um, I like a good store though. I like a good selection at a store.

• 1:52:05Matt Farah?

  You know, I, I like a, I like a big travel stop, given the choice, but I don't, I don't really care that much.

• 1:52:12Speaker 01

  My needs are pretty small. It's like water, caffeine, if they have the tea, great. Uh, and then one, one quest bar and I'm fine.

• 1:52:21Matt Farah?

  Yeah. I mean, I'm not, I don't poop at gas stations unless it's an emergency. I don't like to roll like that. I prepare for my road trips. My, my road trip really begins about an hour before I get on the road. There's a, there's a, there's a poop and then there's a safety poop, you know, it's gotta be.

• 1:52:37Speaker 01

  But that means it does change with wifely presence, like I, you know, and Sarah, she'll, she'll go to the bathroom, at the gas station bathroom and she'll come out and be like, that was gnarly. And she'll go, you are so lucky that you don't have to do that. But if you don't, there's no gas station, well, gas station bathroom reviews is not an app I've come across in order to.

• 1:52:55Matt Farah?

  It's called Grindr.

• 1:52:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, it probably is. The only things I don't like are the super, super tiny gas station where they have like eight drinks and two chips. You know, it's just, and it's what they have room for. I try to avoid those.

• 1:53:07Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I.

• 1:53:10Matt Farah?

  It's hard, it's hard to tell, but it's hard to tell from outside. But I really don't like it when you go, especially in the Midwest or the South, to a really big gas station store. It's fucking big. No sparkling water. They'll have like thirty, thirty kinds, no, they don't even have that shit. They have no bubbly water in this bitch. They'll have like twenty-five kinds of regular water, flavored, but no bubbles. Come on, guys, get with the fucking program. Um, Johnny E V. Gerberman, of all of the, uh, pedestrian rentals or loners you drove in twenty twenty-five, what was the top five? I don't have five regular cars.

• 1:53:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:49Matt Farah?

  We rented a Chrysler Pacifica.

• 1:53:51Speaker 01

  Those are good.

• 1:53:52Matt Farah?

  For racing, that was, that was good. I had a Kia Carnival I rented in Texas. No, I didn't like driving it as much as I liked the Pacifica, to be honest with you.

• 1:54:03Matt Farah?

  Um.

• 1:54:06Speaker 01

  I drove a Ram fifteen hundred that my stepdad-in-law owns, and that was nice. Sounds good.

• 1:54:14Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:15Speaker 01

  Good truck, sure.

• 1:54:16Matt Farah?

  I drove a, hmm, hmm, what else have I driven? I liked my dad's T Lexus TX.

• 1:54:24Speaker 01

  I saw, I've seen a couple around here.

• 1:54:25Matt Farah?

  Yeah, my dad's Lexus TX I like, I like a lot. That's pretty cool. Uh, I think that's a good one.

• 1:54:33Matt Farah?

  Hmm.

• 1:54:34Speaker 01

  We have a privileged journalist lifestyle, truly. Like, we drive, we drive the sporty stuff.

• 1:54:40Matt Farah?

  Yeah, and when we travel, we're usually driving press cars, or we're there to drive something else. So there's not a lot of like rentals or like regular ass cars coming through.

• 1:54:47Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:54:48Matt Farah?

  Um.

• 1:54:54Speaker 01

  This is the end.

• 1:54:55Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:55Speaker 01

  That helps you.

• 1:54:55Matt Farah?

  Chris, well, I got, we have to be done too. Chris from Colorado says, why do some manufacturers not put emphasis on the tactile feel of the paddle shifters? It should feel like pulling the trigger on a gun, mechanical and crisp. Some of them feel like you're pushing a button on a fifteen-dollar coffee maker. I don't think very many people use the shift paddles. And I think that if. If they want something to cheap out on, having that mechanism you're describing, that could bring the cost of that shifter paddle from 15 cents to 40 cents. And that could be axed out of any meeting. I mean, even Porsche, Porsche has multiple shifter paddles.

• 1:55:40Matt Farah?

  You know, if you get a, if you get a Macan or something and has the paddles, that will feel different from a GT3 paddles. And then the GT3 RS has the optional super clicky paddles. Like, there's an optional crazy paddle set for the GT3 RS. It's like, out of the race car, it's crazy, but it costs like, real money. I mean, so, why? Because money. Because it's just an easy thing to cheap out on, and they don't think very many people are going to use them. If I, I was just driving the Corvette E-Ray, it had carbon paddles. I happen to think carbon paddles feel kinda cheap. I don't think they feel that good. They feel like plastic, but, but they are carbon, they're not plastic, so I don't know.

• 1:56:34Matt Farah?

  Okay, wait. Mustang Geek says, regarding the C8 Vet's rearview mirror screen, have you considered that a rearview screen lacks a traditional mirrors' depth perception because it's literally a 2D device? I, I mean, yes, I am aware of that, but that's not, that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was the clarity of the image, not the depth perception. I wasn't complaining about that. I was saying that I could, I could see in my digital rearview mirror that there's five cars behind me in the other lane. I can see five cars. Whereas, in, I then look in the side view mirror, which is real glass, and I go, that's a BMW 3 Series, a Ford Explorer, a Nissan Versa, a blah blah.

• 1:57:19Matt Farah?

  I'm not, I'm not talking depth perception, I was talking about the clarity of the image and being able to identify what's there. Now, the question, do you think that rear view screens like Yoke steering wheels sound like a great idea in theory, but in practice expose massive shortcomings for actual driving? I do, and I think that's a good way to put it, but I don't think it's 100% right, because I think it, there are benefits, it's not all negative. Like, there's, there are certain things about the camera, like the performance in low light, and the fact that it's not, it's independent of your window being dirty, you can change

• 1:58:01Matt Farah?

  the, the field of view of that camera a little bit to suit your, yourself, the way that adjusting a mirror wouldn't produce the same result. So there are some benefits, but I just think there's also some very interesting drawbacks. It's not a win-win. Uh, can you scroll down?

• 1:58:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, some people speculated, like, I looked up how much, what the resolution of the human eye would be, if you could measure it like that, and one way of measuring it would be like 12,000 by 12,000 for a picture. So, that's obviously much higher resolution than, it's way beyond 4K.

• 1:58:33Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Um. By Turbo Curious, uh, history has many examples of car companies that tried and failed in America, including most of the French ones. What car brands currently not doing business in the US could succeed here? Oh, BYD, easy.

• 1:58:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:58:54Matt Farah?

  BYD.

• 1:58:55Speaker 01

  It's cheap, and it's an appliance that drives people around.

• 1:58:57Matt Farah?

  And they don't have weird, unpronounceable names, it's just three letters, American, Americans can pronounce.

• 1:59:02Speaker 01

  They're gonna start selling them in Canada.

• 1:59:03Matt Farah?

  They would undercut everybody, I mean, people would be like, wait a minute, what?

• 1:59:06Speaker 01

  If they were priced here the way they are in other places, it would undercut everyone. It always depends on tariff adjustments.

• 1:59:11Matt Farah?

  Sure. Um.

• 1:59:13Speaker 01

  I've not read this.

• 1:59:16Matt Farah?

  I've, I've, some, I mean, I appreciate that you're asking about a, a bill, but I don't, I didn't read it, I don't know what it is.

• 1:59:26Matt Farah?

  Tiny Japanese Cobra, last question, then we're done. Says, "Not everything needs to be fast to be cool. What cars have the highest dollar to horsepower ratio?" Uh, crazy 21-window Volkswagen buses come to mind at 200,000 for 50 horsepower. How far back you want to go? I mean, that car we drove in the fucking Veteran Run was like a $250,000 car. I think it made 6 horsepower.

• 1:59:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:59:51Matt Farah?

  I mean...

• 1:59:52Speaker 01

  If you go old and collectible and super historic.

• 1:59:55Matt Farah?

  What would a Benz Patent Motor Wagon cost at auction? Millions and millions of dollars, and it makes like a half of a horsepower. So it's just like, old. Go, just keep going old, and you'll, you'll end up in something that costs-

• 2:00:08Speaker 01

  If you had the first, yeah, the first Mercedes electric wagon thing, that's not what you're talking about.

• 2:00:13Matt Farah?

  Yeah, no, like the Patent Motor Wagon, the little three-wheeled fucking thing with the big flywheel you started with? Like, that's like a horsepower.

• 2:00:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, with their first electric car that Ms. Benz drove, Mrs. Benz drove, like, that would be-

• 2:00:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:24Speaker 01

  800 million dollars if you could find it.

• 2:00:26Matt Farah?

  Yeah, some historically significant, you know, thing that makes 2 horsepower is probably it, yeah. Thanks, everybody. Good show today. Thank you to our patrons for such good questions. Thank you to everyone else for playing along with us. If you want to join the fun, patreon.com/thesmokingtirepodcast, and we'll see you back here in a couple of days. Bye.