S3 Ep334: Amy Bradley: Our Interview with Brad Bradley (Part 5)

In the early morning hours of March 24, 1998, 23-year-old Amy Lynn Bradley vanished from the balcony of her family’s cabin aboard a Royal Caribbean cruise ship. Just a few hours earlier, she had been at a party, joking with her brother, dancing with the ship’s band, and planning out the next day’s adventure in Curaçao. By sunrise, Amy was gone. Her sandals were still on the balcony. Her cigarettes were missing. Her key card and license were gone too, but everything else had been left behind. What began as a family vacation quickly turned into a nightmare, and the moments leading up to Amy’s disappearance would raise questions that remain unanswered to this day. Try our coffee!! - www. CriminalCoffeeCo.comBecome a Patreon member -- > ｿ https://www.patreon.com/CrimeWeeklyShop for your Crime Weekly gear here --> ｿ https://crimeweeklypodcast.com/shopYoutube: https://www.youtube.com/c/CrimeWeeklyPodcastWebsite: CrimeWeeklyPodcast.comInstagram: @CrimeWeeklyPodTwitter: @CrimeWeeklyPodFacebook: @CrimeWeeklyPodADS:1. https://www. TaskRabbit.com - Use code CRIMEWEEKLY for $15 off your first task!

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:11Derrick Levasseur?

  Hey everyone, welcome back to Crime Weekly. I'm Derrick Levasseur.

• 0:15Stephanie Harlowe?

  And I'm Stephanie Harlow.

• 0:16Derrick Levasseur?

  And as you can see on the screen right here, as promised, Brad Bradley is with us tonight. For anybody who doesn't know, we did a four-part series on Amy Bradley. That was gonna be the end of the series, but at the end of it, I had said, hey, listen, if someone wants to see Brad on here, the floor, the platform is his. We'll give him an opportunity to come on and share whatever information he wants to share. And one of you actually tagged Brad on Twitter, tagged me as well. And I happened to see Brad respond to it, saying, yeah, I'm willing to do that. So I reached out to Brad. We talked briefly, Brad and I, a couple of things. He had sent me some notes. He had sent me a couple TikToks. I've watched all of it. I sent it all to Stephanie, so we can talk about that.

• 0:58Derrick Levasseur?

  But we saved a lot of it for tonight. So Brad, first off, thank you for being here. I've been seeing a lot of your interviews. I know you're going out there, you're spreading the message. And I have a lot of respect for you, because with Netflix, that's like the pinnacle, right? Like, that's gonna get the most eyes and ears. And yet, you're still out here pounding the pavement, spreading your sister's story, when a lot of people would just say, I got it on Netflix. I don't need to talk about it anymore. And as people who do this every week, it's not easy to come on here and work a full day's work, and then come out and do podcasts or interviews when this is something that you would have rather not lived. So, a lot of respect for you, and thank you for coming on. And we're gonna basically throw the floor to you. You had said in one of your messages, there's some things that were in your episode that are wrong.

• 1:44Derrick Levasseur?

  And full disclosure, we have no incentive, no agenda. We want our viewers and our listeners to get the full story. And we may mess up on things. So to have you here to enlighten us on certain things, that's the best thing possible. So, thank you for being here.

• 2:00Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, thanks for having me. You know, yeah, I'm doing what I'm doing, because, you know, for a lot of years...

• 2:09Speaker 02

  There was nothing going on, you know.

• 2:10Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah.

• 2:11Speaker 02

  We were working old leads and still trying to do some things and talk to people. But when this Netflix thing came out, and I have to admit, I, you know, I didn't study for a test or I certainly wasn't prepared for what all was gonna happen. In my mind, I, I feel like if we ever had a chance, th- this is probably the last one we get. So, so the last thing I want to try to allow to happen is for everything to kinda die down and everybody stop talking about it and thinking about it and on to the next. So, you know, I'm trying to maintain people's interest and awareness and make sure, you know, there's a ton of bad information out there, whether it's misinformation or disinformation

• 2:54Speaker 02

  or it's kinda like that old telephone game where you whisper in first person's ear by the time it gets around the circle.

• 2:59Derrick Levasseur?

  Fair. That's fair. We see it all the time. That's fair.

• 3:02Speaker 02

  So, you know, that's, that's my, that's been my intent and, you know, I took on kinda the mantle of being the spokesperson for the family because my, my parents just, you know, my mom can't get through one question without losing it. So, i- it's really tough on them. So, I, I, it was, it was my intent to kinda shield them from everything I've been facing, you know, although half the internet, or I might say three-fourths of the internet is very kind and loving. You guys know well, uh, what the other fourth is like.

• 3:34Derrick Levasseur?

  Oh, yeah. All too well. But most people in this community all want the same thing. Resolution, answers, right? We all, as human beings, it's not natural for us to have this arcing story with no ending. We're conditioned because of movies and television. So, it's natural for people to say, "Hey, there's gotta be something here. It can't end like this."

• 3:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:55Derrick Levasseur?

  And it's awesome to see, because it is a big community, them to rally behind people they don't know to try to help them. And we're seeing with science and technology evolving, it's becoming more prevalent where it's actually happening, where people from home are contributing to solving cases. So, it's a pretty cool time to be in this field because people at home are actually making a difference.

• 4:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. I've never seen anything like it. I mean, obviously, a lot of years ago, there was none of this.

• 4:19Derrick Levasseur?

  Nope.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  You know, we'd be on America's Most Wanted and it was kind of a national broadcast and no internet, no nothing like that, no Netflix, no Twitter, no Facebook.

• 4:29Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah.

• 4:29Speaker 02

  No, none of it. So, you know, this is a whole different level, obviously, uh, of exposure and awareness and.

• 4:37Speaker 02

  I have to tip my cap to Ari Mark and Phil Lot from Netflix. Well, they're not from Netflix. They're producers from Ample Entertainment. And Netflix was the one who ended up picking up the show, obviously. But those guys, you know, people give them a lot of flack for not including this or that. But, you know, like you said on the last episode I watched, and unfortunately, like I told you before we started, that was the only one I was able to watch from you.

• 5:03Derrick Levasseur?

  Yes, yes.

• 5:04Speaker 02

  You know, it's impossible to fit 27 years worth of detail in two and a half hours or whatever it was. So, you know, they did a tremendous job.

• 5:13Derrick Levasseur?

  You know, me and Phil are best friends now, right?

• 5:15Speaker 02

  I didn't know that, no.

• 5:16Derrick Levasseur?

  No, I don't know if it was in episode four. It might have been three.

• 5:19Stephanie Harlowe?

  It was episode four.

• 5:20Derrick Levasseur?

  Phil actually reached out to me or reached out to us through our Crime Weekly Instagram. And he wanted to follow up on something that we had said that we had gotten from an article out of CNN, and we'll talk about it. But he basically, which to your point, really does care about it. He reached out and was like, hey, you guys said something in your episode. Do you have a source for that? And I provided the source and all that stuff.

• 5:41Stephanie Harlowe?

  That was yellow, when he was informed of Amy's disappearance.

• 5:46Derrick Levasseur?

  So he wanted the source for that. We provided it. But yeah, right from Phil. So I made a little bit of a joke about it because he left me on red. And I was like, but it's all good. I respected the fact that, you know, even after the show's done 900 million downloads or whatever it is now, he's still reaching out to little podcasters to get sources as the showrunner, you know? So that's pretty cool.

• 6:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, they're great guys, man. We really appreciate them. And, you know, I took, I made an effort, you know, after it first came out, you know, after, I mean, it's been at least 25 years since everybody's paying attention. And so I found, you know, that it was an opportunity, you know, while everybody's listening, I'm going to share everything I got. So, you know, I went on early and kind of said that, you know, they didn't include this. And the fact that she was dating the guy before, and they kind of did that. You know, a whole sexuality deal, but didn't tell the whole story. I took a little bit of an issue with that.

• 6:45Derrick Levasseur?

  Yep.

• 6:46Speaker 02

  And then, you know, the Scientology thing you guys touched on on the last episode, like you said, it it flies contrary, obviously, to the predominant theories in my mind, but it's another thing that people don't know about. And, you know, just so you guys know, this is something I've been talking about since day one. Every single show I've ever, we've ever done, it's been discussed. And what happens on these shows is in order for them, I guess it's etiquette. You know, if you're going to talk about it, you reach out to Scientology, you know, for a request for comment. And then they come at you with a slew of lawyers and threats and and then they decide not to carry it. And that and that is frustrating.

• 7:29Speaker 02

  Um, as much as that angle and that weird interaction and experience that we had bothered all of us um, over the years. No one would ever talk about it. And and I, you know, I found it kind of telling, too. Um, Stephanie was, uh, willing to speak and you kind of wanted to move on, so you didn't get your life threatened at Crime Con, so.

• 7:50Derrick Levasseur?

  Again. Stephanie did a big little context, because you probably don't know us from a hole in the wall. Stephanie did a whole series on her channel, which is much bigger than this. Well, I started. Started to on Scientology and she had told me that some things were happening that were weird and then so we went to this Crime Con. In Vegas. And in Vegas and there was a guy who literally showed up very well dressed, waited in the meet and greet line to meet us and we won't make it about that whole thing this episode, but, you know, I was a law enforcement officer for 13 years. I've owned my private investigative firm for almost 20, uh, for, well, this will be five years, 20 years in investigations. And I can tell you, I've interviewed a lot of people. There was something about this guy. He wasn't there to meet us for Crime Con. He was there to send a message directly to Stephanie. He didn't blink once.

• 8:35Derrick Levasseur?

  Didn't blink once. And so I was kind of joking, but what you're saying, and I'm not a conspiracy theorist, there's there's validity to it. And I'm not even directly pointing it at Scientology, just in general, there's something there, so.

• 8:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:47Derrick Levasseur?

  I don't, I don't, uh, I don't laugh at it because I've seen it.

• 8:50Speaker 02

  And I just want to make it clear, you know, people come at me and attack me like, oh, all of a sudden the brother remembers this. Well, why don't we know about this? That's just, no one will talk about it, you know?

• 9:00Derrick Levasseur?

  That's fair. And I was one of those people who was like, why are we hearing about this now? But to your point, you've been talking about it from day one.

• 9:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, even in the latest, you know, there's a People Magazine cover. Um, I think they did a dual cover with, I thought, I think I see Helen Mirren on one of them. And then I think Amy's supposed to be on another one. But, um, I, I found, and I won't share all the details because it was told to me in confidence. Um, but when they reached out to Scientology for requests for comment, you know, the lawyers and the threats descended, um, on their staff and their editors and, uh, and they decided not to talk about it either. Um, so again, every single time.

• 9:37Stephanie Harlowe?

  Totally don't blame them, especially a big production like that. It could have stalled it. Yeah.

• 9:42Speaker 02

  And, and it's just, it's just weird to me, you know, they, they, um, there was a gal in, um, Daily Mail that did an article, I don't know, four or five, right after the thing came out. And, um, she touched on it, reached out, you know, for comment and they responded like within three hours, which she found odd because, you know, she told me usually you have to hound these people over and over again to get them to comment. And then I haven't heard from her since, so we might want to check on her, but, uh, but, yeah, so she brought it up. She talked about it and she's really, you know, other than us talking about it now and me on X, you know, telling that story, everyone's afraid of them. And, and I think it's weird that they told her, you know, the US consulate, apparently after they couldn't find

• 10:27Speaker 02

  a priest to come to our room, they claim, and they may be, they may be telling the truth, who knows? Um, that the US consulate contacted them. The ships, the ship or that company, I'm not allowed to say the name because we had to sign a contract after they sued us, um, for mentioning the name of their company in combination with Amy's story. So you won't hear me say the word, um, of that, you know, the name of that.

• 10:49Derrick Levasseur?

  But we're allowed to say it.

• 10:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. Or, or that ship. So.

• 10:52Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay.

• 10:53Speaker 02

  And that, um, their.

• 10:54Derrick Levasseur?

  That's interesting.

• 10:55Speaker 02

  You know, their people reached out to Scientology. Scientology claims the US consulate, um, reached out to them and I've never been able to confirm that. And they, they said, hey, you know, I guess we, we understand you help people with grief and loss and your methods and whatever you do. And, and again. May well be the case, but my experience with them was very odd.

• 11:17Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, it was odd. It was very odd.

• 11:19Speaker 02

  All the people that I've spoken to, you know, I spoke to Aaron Levin Smith or Aaron Smith Levin from Scientology. I spoke to Tony Ortega. I spoke to Valeska Paris. I spoke to Claire Headley, who apparently was over top of Mike Render in that in that Sea Org. You know, each one of them individually told me that it would be extremely unlikely. Although each one of them admitted it was rather weird that those guys show up in our hotel room at midnight. And then you get back on X and I say, well, I feel a little bit better. And people are like, yeah, believe them if you want to. So then I reach out to Jenna Miscavige. I think it was TikTok because I saw one of her videos. And this is now going back into, well, maybe I don't feel comfortable with putting that to bed.

• 12:03Speaker 02

  And I reached out to her and I find out she's married to Aaron Smith Levin. And she doesn't really have anything else to offer me. And I think, okay.

• 12:13Stephanie Harlowe?

  It's hard. It's it's very muddled. It's hard to get. It's hard to get any clear answers.

• 12:18Speaker 02

  And you don't know whether to trust them or whether not to trust them. And I, yeah, who knows? But you know, those two black ladies, I have no idea if they were actually Scientology. FBI has told us years and years ago, quote unquote, we know who they are. However, they won't ever share that with us. So if they would have simply told us, hey, no, those ladies are from Aruba Customs. Or, you know, like the guy that Renner interviewed that was an ex staff member or crew member that said they were likely either Aruban Customs or Police. I think they boarded the ship with the entourage of performers that got on that night from Aruba. And who knows why the hell they were talking to Amy for an hour.

• 12:57Speaker 02

  What I found when I got home because of that weird experience in that hotel room and, you know, them inviting us on that ship. And I did a lot of research on them. I was able to find in some photos. Matching uniforms to those ladies, whether they were back, I don't know, it was 27 years ago.

• 13:16Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah.

• 13:16Speaker 02

  But, you know, each one of the, you know, ex Scientology people told me that, no, they you, they wear white. And I don't think there were any black ladies on that boat and whatever. So Claire Hadley told me that she never heard of Amy, never saw Amy. Valeska Paris told me the same. And, you know, in the end, maybe they were just trying to help and apologize for bringing it up if that's the case.

• 13:40Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah.

• 13:40Speaker 02

  But, you know, FBI has always been dismissive of it. And I don't know why they don't share any information with us or what they have or haven't done or looked into. So it's just difficult to, like you say, in any investigation, you want to make sure everybody knows every little piece of it in case somebody knows something.

• 13:56Derrick Levasseur?

  That's right.

• 13:56Speaker 02

  If somebody has any little piece of information that can help. So that's why I brought it up. I've been talking about the damn story since the, the day after she disappeared and no one's ever been willing to talk about it.

• 14:07Derrick Levasseur?

  Clarified for me, you have no reason to bullshit about it. And so that was one thing where I said, this is the first we're hearing about it. Well, you're hearing it from Brad's mouth.

• 14:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:15Derrick Levasseur?

  He's been talking about it. And I think it's understandable where people are a little nervous to talk about it because of the topic it covers. And as you even mentioned, the FBI, they've looked into it, but yet they don't share too much with you. That may be because it's an active investigation or it could be something else. Who knows? But I think it is important to share everything because as you just said, I always say it, it may seem trivial to you or someone else, but someone listening or watching who you've never met before may go, oh, no, that's not true. And I can prove it. And here's how. They don't have to be an investigator. They may someone who maybe, maybe someone who has personal experience with that, who can reach out to you directly and, and share that information. So it never hurts to say it. That's, that's for sure.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  Now I look back on it and I feel like it's probably a huge distraction from what I actually think.

• 15:02Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, that, and I want to get into that. Stephanie, did you have to say something first? Cause I feel like I cut you off. I'm sorry.

• 15:06Stephanie Harlowe?

  It's, no, you're, you're good. It was something about, you said the FBI, they are not, or they have not shared their files with you. At all?

• 15:16Speaker 02

  Ever. Any question we've ever asked them, the answer we get is, Mr. And Mrs. Bradley, you know, we cannot share that information. This is an open and ongoing investigation. So they will not work with us. They will not collaborate their information with what we've learned and what we've been able to determine over the years through our own investigations. And we feel largely like any progress we've ever been able to make is because of us. We don't know what the hell the FBI has done. Like you touched on in your podcast, Mr. And Mrs. Bradley, we just don't have any evidence Amy ever left the room. That's been their modus operandi since day one, apparently. So that kind of goes a long way to tell me,

• 15:57Speaker 02

  if that's their belief, why would they do anything else? Why would they investigate any other angle, any other person? They seem to believe what they believe, which I feel 100% is absolutely wrong. And I don't think that they've done their due diligence or a proper investigation, which is why we're seeking a new team to do what should have been done all along.

• 16:21Derrick Levasseur?

  And how could they, how could you change your mind if they don't share anything with you, right? Maybe if you had access to the folders and all the files, you as an intelligent person could sit there for a few weeks and read everything. And you seem like a pretty straight up guy where you'd say, hey, you know what? I went through their files. I see everything they did. They did do a pretty thorough investigation, but without it, it's just speculation.

• 16:42Stephanie Harlowe?

  So how is it that the FBI has allowed agents to participate in a Netflix documentary, but will not allow the family of this missing person to have access to and view the files in any way, shape or form, not even redacted? Have you, have you asked? I mean, I'm sure you've asked for this. I would.

• 17:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, we've asked plenty of times for.

• 17:04Stephanie Harlowe?

  What's their reason?

• 17:05Speaker 02

  Their reason is simply it's an open investigation and they can't do it.

• 17:09Stephanie Harlowe?

  It's an open investigation that's going on, what, 20 years?

• 17:12Speaker 02

  27 years, yeah.

• 17:13Stephanie Harlowe?

  27 years, almost 30 years, three decades.

• 17:16Speaker 02

  Yeah. And that's why we can't get access to the grand jury testimony, which includes the third eyewitness named Elizabeth, who was in the Viking Lounge and testified that she saw Amy early that morning, same time Crystal and Lori saw them come off the elevator from inside the Viking Lounge, saw Amy go up to the table where she was sitting at when I left the disco that night before. And I'll get y'all's time straight. Y'all were saying some wrong times, but.

• 17:44Derrick Levasseur?

  Hit it. You can hit us with it.

• 17:45Speaker 02

  She basically says that, and this is from an FBI email that was sent to us, that she saw Yellow come back down, fix a drink, handed Amy a dark drink, and then they got up and walked into a, an area further toward the back where she could no longer see them. A couple of days later, after everything played out, she's back in the Viking Lounge. And you have to understand, this girl was apparently on some antibiotic that didn't allow for her to be in the sun, so she spent the majority of her time in that lounge. It has surrounding windows, she can see the pool, she can see the people, she can see the water, the island. So she's got a good vantage point from in there, and she was preparing for her excursion, apparently, that day. She had had a friendly relationship with the bartender in that lounge, um, named Louis

• 18:29Speaker 02

  Lara. And after that happened, she said that the bartender became very aloof and, uh, non-communicative towards her. And at one point, a girl, who she estimated to be about 18 or 19 years old, came out from behind the bar, uh, yelling, "Senorita kidnapped, senorita kidnapped." And then the bartender shuffled that girl back around behind the bar. Now, she testified to this in the grand jury in Richmond years and years ago. Now, again, we can't get that testimony, uh, because it's an open case, and you can't get grand jury testimony released. Um, all of our, uh, requests through FOIA have been denied, we're working on appeals for that. So we've been stonewalled, that we've, we've got no information from, um,

• 19:12Speaker 02

  anybody except for little snippets, and basically, any information we've got is just in relation to information we've provided to them. So I don't know how it all works, or whether that's the right way it's supposed to happen or not, but that's been our experience.

• 19:27Stephanie Harlowe?

  Do you think that's weird? 30 years, and the FBI's saying it's an open investigation, even though they claim they have no evidence of her leaving the room, which would... Lead to the supposition that the FBI's investigation, even though it's open, kind of makes them feel that she fell off the balcony in the room because there's no evidence she left the room. So why do they still have it open 30 years later if it doesn't appear to be?

• 19:48Derrick Levasseur?

  They can't, they can't close it without her.

• 19:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:50Stephanie Harlowe?

  Why can't they give the family at least redacted access to the, the files?

• 19:55Derrick Levasseur?

  This is, this is something that I criticize all the time on, on my show. I, I agree with you. I think there's has to be a, like a spectrum, right? Where after 10 years, maybe we're not releasing much. 15 years, a little bit more. 20 years, it should be open source. Because at that point, you haven't solved anything. So allow a fresh set of eyes, independent investigators to look at it. Completely agree with you guys. I'm just pointing out what they're gonna say.

• 20:21Stephanie Harlowe?

  And I mean, as far as we know, the last thing, the last thing the FBI has done in this case is be part of a Netflix documentary.

• 20:26Derrick Levasseur?

  That's fair.

• 20:27Speaker 02

  You'll find it, I, I find it interesting anyway. And, and you know, obviously, people don't know the details and people think what they're gonna think wrong. Um, that FBI agent, Sheridan, um, says in the documentary, quote, "Unfortunately, we were never able to corroborate the girl's timeframe." Now, the girl she's talking about are Lori and Crystal.

• 20:49Stephanie Harlowe?

  The ones who testified during the grand jury?

• 20:52Speaker 02

  That's one of the things I'd have to check on, whether they were part of that or not. I believe they would have been. But I was talking about the third eyewitness. So you have Crystal and Lori on the upper deck from outside the lounge to see them go up the glass elevator. They say 5:30 to 6:00.

• 21:06Derrick Levasseur?

  They said that around 6:00 AM?

• 21:07Speaker 02

  5:30, between 5:30 and 6:00. And we find affidavit from Crystal's mother, um, stating that she opened the door for the girls after she had gotten up that morning to prepare for their excursion and let them into the room just after 6:00 AM. The FBI didn't then, and still hasn't to this day, ever interviewed that woman, who could have easily corroborated the girl's timeframe. So they dropped the ball on the most crucial eyewitnesses in the case in the most, in the earliest hours that claimed that they saw what they saw. And people don't understand, you know, you can't equate those two girls with... Random eyewitnesses that weren't on the boat months or years later that never met Amy,

• 21:51Speaker 02

  never knew Amy, never spoke to Amy. These girls, we knew, we met, we hung out with them, we were hanging out with them that night. They knew Yellow, Yellow was flirting with them, they knew me, we were talking, we were hanging out. They, they, we knew each other. They knew what we were wearing, they knew what we looked like. And when I left the disco, which by the way, was right at closing around 3 a.m. to go outside and talk to a couple of girls and sit on the chairs for a half hour before I went to the room. They were out there. Um, I can verify they were out there at that point and they were out there when I left to go back to my room. I don't know what they did for the next two hours. But the mother has told us as recently as 10 days ago, that yeah, she left them in the room right after 6 o'clock and that's why there's no key card information.

• 22:36Speaker 02

  But yet the FBI failed to ever interview the woman still currently. So I, I feel like that's, that's, I mean, that's a major error. Um, and, and the girls have told me personally through, uh, text exchanges and conversations we've had, that they felt as if they were treated like a couple of little drunk teenagers who didn't know what they were talking about and they were dismissed. It, it's, um, it's a frustrating thing. And then, you know, one of the, um, the, the other FBI agents, McCullum, Victor McCullum. Yeah. So apparently during his interview with Netflix, don't know whether this was captured on camera or not, but he made a statement to one of the producers that,

• 23:17Speaker 02

  you know, well, you got these rich white folks going down and blaming this poor black island kid. So my impression from that statement is that he came onto that boat out of the, uh, St. Thomas FBI field office with a particular bias. And, um, I don't know, maybe he didn't try so hard to, uh, go after the poor little island kid.

• 23:38Derrick Levasseur?

  I just want to set the table because we're getting in the weeds right now and we're going to get into it. I want to get into all of it, but I just want to get your overall 35,000 feet perspective on this so that it's very clear what Brad Bradley thinks. And you don't have to say, oh, the 100% it's one. You can give us the three scenarios, like, I don't think suicide's on the table. We said it in our interview, like, there's nothing to indicate that whatsoever. Anyone who's like, oh, I don't know why, we even had comments for it, like, why aren't you guys entertaining this? We're not entertaining it because there's no evidence of it. But what are your three things or four things, what do you think happened?

• 24:10Speaker 02

  She did not jump. Not, not a chance, zero.

• 24:14Derrick Levasseur?

  She did not jump, we, off the table. We, we all agree on that.

• 24:17Speaker 02

  She did not fall, and, and I'll explain all the details related to why I think that and why I know that. She did not go run away on purpose to start a new life, didn't happen. And so what, what I think happened is that, for whatever reason, either she agreed to meet Yellow at a specific time, and we've had times from other girls that have contacted us from prior cruises and cruises after ours that state that Yellow asked them to meet, that meet him up on the pool deck at 6 a.m. So, for whatever reason, that's, that's what he does. And I don't know, I, my, my theory about why she came back to the room and why they didn't just stay out.

• 24:59Speaker 02

  Obviously, Yellow states in his interview that he was aware that he was on camera dancing with her. If she never returns to the room, and he's the last person that was fraternizing with her, that's a bad look. So letting her go back to the room allows him to disassociate himself from the incident. And if, if for whatever reason, whether she agreed to meet him, or whether she ran out of cigarettes and went up to try to find some, or her lighter stopped working, I don't, who knows? Why ever she left the room, I believe she did. I believe Crystal and Lori, if you could have seen the look on their faces and the breathlessness and the panic in their eyes when they ran up to me and my mom a couple of days later to tell us what they saw,

• 25:41Speaker 02

  they believe what they saw, they know what they saw. And I believe that the eyewitness that came to the grand jury testimony knows what she saw. I think Amy ended up in that club with Yellow right around 6 o'clock in the morning. I think he handed her off to an accomplice in the back of that bar where there's a crew service elevator that goes straight down to the bottom of the boat. Then that allows him to walk out of the club, back by the girls, by himself, again, disassociating himself with the scenario. Then, what I believe, and, you know, people are gonna accuse me of bringing up New stuff, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna talk about it today, cause um, you know, my investigator has encouraged me to kinda keep that under wraps and keep the cards close.

• 26:25Speaker 02

  But that morning when I was out looking for Amy, and this would have been, you know, between seven, seven thirty, seven, whatever it was, I'm walking around the upper walking track, and I'm looking and I'm looking and I've been in the disco, by the way, the disco was closed, but the doors are never locked. I went in there freely, um, and walked around and looked everywhere. I walked in the public areas, I went in the bathroom, I went around the walking track, I went to the front of the ship, I went to the back of the ship. I went all the way around the damn thing, and on the water side, opposite the side the boat is docked to, I look over, there's two large doors open at water level, with boats coming and going. And I sat there and watched them for a couple minutes, and I

• 27:10Speaker 02

  thought to myself, you know, I wonder what that is. You know, if you think about the, the drones that are, I think we all know, move through those boats from, from South America up through those islands, I believe that's how they get those things on there. I also believe that's how they get things off of there. So if they took Amy down that service elevator, held her until, what, for an hour, until those doors opened, and remove her via the back of the ship on the water side, when everybody's looking this way towards the island, that's what I believe. Now, whether the, the taxi driver, Deshy, that saw her, actually saw her where he said he did, or whether he was involved in transporting her to one of the three locations he suggested my dad and my uncle and her boyfriend at

• 27:52Speaker 02

  the time go and check later, I feel like he partially could have grown a conscience and was trying to help us without outing himself as being involved. So, that's, that's kind of in a nutshell what I believe. There's not a whole lot of other scenarios, other than, how many people were involved? Was there two or three? Was there seven or eight people, um, in, that, that deal with, you know, moving drugs on those boats, or, or getting the people, getting the person off of that boat? I, I don't know the answer to that, obviously. Um, but that's, that's the scenario that I believe, and um, You know, I guess that's where I'll stop that answer.

• 28:31Derrick Levasseur?

  So if you're cool with it, what I would like to do is just play devil's advocate. This is what I do and it's not to debate you. It's not because we both want the same thing, right? We both want to find Amy or know at least know what happened to her. So for for me, the last thing I want to do is hop into an echo chamber and just agree with everything you said, because the only way we're going to figure it out is if we both ask questions. And ultimately, after vetting all of that, come to a reasonable conclusion. So as a layman, not knowing as much as you do, just based on what you said, I have a couple of questions. And Stephanie, I'll only ask one or two, and I'll let you pepper in there because I'm sure your wheels are turning as well. But I wanted to know where you landed because now I want to dissect that and see if I can poke holes in it,

• 29:15Derrick Levasseur?

  not to prove you wrong, but to see, because you said, you said in our DMs, you're like, Derek, I disagree with you. And I think I can prove it.

• 29:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:23Derrick Levasseur?

  And let's do that because I will be glad to say, yeah, you know what? My opinion's changed.

• 29:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:28Derrick Levasseur?

  So breaking down what you said, my first question that comes up to mind is, I don't know Amy like you do. So you're going to be able to speak to her character and what her behavior was like. But she was with you down at the disco hall. You leave, we know for certain that she got to her room around 3:45. The key card shows her coming to the room. You confirmed seeing her in the room.

• 29:50Speaker 02

  Absolutely, yeah.

• 29:51Derrick Levasseur?

  So we know she got back safely.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, I go in 3:35, she comes in 3:40.

• 29:55Derrick Levasseur?

  So we got, we got her in the room. That's a checkpoint we can verify. Boom, done.

• 29:59Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 30:00Derrick Levasseur?

  She's in the room with you. You guys are on the balcony. The first question I have, which is minimal, but I do think it could be important. I've seen some reports where she told you she wasn't feeling well. Do you have any more detail on what that was like? What wasn't feeling well? Was it motion sickness? Was it maybe one or too many drinks? What was it?

• 30:17Speaker 02

  At the time, I thought it was motion sickness. Now, you guys touched on it in your last episode. Her bar tab shows she had six light beers. Now that extends from 6:00 PM until we were on the balcony. I I can drink that all day and I'm sober as anybody. And obviously, we don't know what she was potentially given or how many drinks.

• 30:36Stephanie Harlowe?

  Right.

• 30:36Speaker 02

  To her, I, who knows? But yeah, so when we were, when we first left San Juan, this was the first time Amy was on a boat. Myself had been on, I had been on a boat about three years earlier, a buddy of mine and I went on a volleyball cruise down in the Caribbean. My parents had been on a cruise years before with a couple of aunts and uncles. So we were familiar with when the boat first starts moving, you kind of get this kind of like, eh. And and you don't have your sea legs yet. Amy got that feeling, so did I, the first day we took off again. And, you know, it takes a little while for you to kind of get used to that. When the boat left Aruba, uh, on Tuesday morning at 1:00 a.m. We, we got the same kind of, you know, kind of feeling where you don't feel too good.

• 31:21Speaker 02

  When she told me that on the balcony, I didn't assume, now neither one of us were stone cold sober. We were both drinking for hours, right?

• 31:28Derrick Levasseur?

  Nothing wrong with that.

• 31:29Speaker 02

  Right.

• 31:29Derrick Levasseur?

  Nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

• 31:30Stephanie Harlowe?

  But she didn't seem.

• 31:32Speaker 02

  No, she.

• 31:32Stephanie Harlowe?

  Super drunk, falling down.

• 31:34Speaker 02

  Was nothing.

• 31:34Stephanie Harlowe?

  Et cetera.

• 31:35Speaker 02

  That would indicate, and I've had, uh, conversations with our investigator in my family recently. I, I didn't have any indication or any suspicion that she had been drugged. There wasn't any odd behavior that I noticed, you know? So when she told, when I said, look, you know, we talked about what we were going to do potentially the next day. I explained to her that I'd never been to Carisal, so I don't know what's there. I don't, you know, maybe we'll go jet skiing and maybe, who knows? I don't know what we're doing to do. And then she mentioned to me, and again, this was just in past, that, you know, she, and she kind of jokingly said, yeah, Yellow tried to touch my tit. And I was, I was like, yeah, I don't think so, buddy. And I kind of like, you know, laughed along with her and it wasn't, no big deal was made of it. I didn't think about it again.

• 32:18Speaker 02

  You know, people are online kicking my ass for why wasn't I upset about that? Because she wasn't upset about it. So when I said, look, you know, we got to be up and. Two or three hours, I'm going to bed. I love you. She was like, I don't, you know, I don't feel so great. I don't want to go in the room. And, you know, being closed in, this wind feels nice. I'm just gonna stay here. I said, okay. So I go inside and, um, and shut the door behind me and went to bed and, uh, and that was, that was it. And then, you know, I got woken up the next morning by both of my parents standing at the foot of the pullout couch I was sleeping on. With a look on their face I had never seen before.

• 32:55Derrick Levasseur?

  So she tells you, which is important, she tells you about the, him touching her boob, right?

• 33:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, and you can, uh, on the video of them dancing, he's behind her and he kinda comes up and she pushes his hand down. So obviously she continued to dance with him after that. It wasn't like an assault.

• 33:12Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah.

• 33:13Speaker 02

  He was trying.

• 33:13Derrick Levasseur?

  But she let him know. She probably let him know. But my, the reason I, I'm, I'm honing in on this is because she's back at the room with you. You guys seem like you were super close. First and foremost, it doesn't sound like if Amy's reading the room, she can see what this guy's motives are. I, I personally, without knowing her, don't think she's gonna go meet back up with this guy, knowing she's smarter to know what his intentions are, right? And if he had suggested to her, hey, I want you to meet back up with me at six, once, you know, once everybody's out of here. I feel like she wouldn't have hid that from you. I feel like she would have said, this asshole wanted me to meet up with him in a couple hours. He's out of his mind. I don't think she would have snuck out of the room without telling you.

• 33:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I, that's, that's, that's something that I've never been able to figure out, obviously, why if she had plans to go meet him, why she wouldn't have told me about it.

• 34:00Derrick Levasseur?

  I don't think she would have gone.

• 34:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. And I don't know. And that's why, that's why your mind goes into different scenarios. Like, maybe she went out because when you come into Port, Curacao's really pretty and has a bunch of colorful buildings. Maybe she went out to get some fresh air and take a walk. Maybe she went out to find some, uh, some more cigarettes. Maybe she went out to get coffee, um, and then ran into him.

• 34:22Derrick Levasseur?

  What are the chances, though? What are the chances that, that big boat yellows out there lurking around waiting?

• 34:27Speaker 02

  And what are the chances you go on a cruise with your family and one of you doesn't come home? They're not, not very, not very big.

• 34:34Derrick Levasseur?

  Fair, fair.

• 34:35Stephanie Harlowe?

  She may have gone back out to meet Yellow if he said something like, you know, I know a spot, you know, okay, we get it. You're not into me, whatever. Let's just be friends. I know a spot where you can go that's only known to the staff, where you can see Curacao and you can see the sunrise and it's beautiful. In that case, though, I feel like she would have brought her camera. And Brad, you said her camera was found in the safe in the room. So she did not bring her camera, correct?

• 35:01Speaker 02

  Correct. We have her camera and all the film that was with it.

• 35:05Stephanie Harlowe?

  So let's go back to you guys being out on the balcony before you go inside. How long were you out on the balcony? You said you got in around 3:35. She got in at 3:40. You guys are out on the balcony 3:45.

• 35:18Speaker 02

  I don't know, 15, 20 minutes, probably.

• 35:21Stephanie Harlowe?

  Okay. So at that time, before you go inside, how close are you to Curacao? Can you see land? Is it starting? Is the sun coming up at all? What's the outside look like? Is it pitch black still? Can you see any land approaching?

• 35:36Speaker 02

  Literally wasn't paying attention to it. But yeah, obviously at 4 o'clock in the morning, it's dark. I mean, I guess the light was out because it wasn't pitch black out there and you know, we could see each other.

• 35:45Stephanie Harlowe?

  Could you see the lights of Curacao, like the shore?

• 35:48Speaker 02

  No, because the problem with at 4 o'clock in the morning was that our balcony was, I don't know what, how you call what side of the ship is what. We're on, so if the ship's pointing forward, we're on the right side. The ship comes into Curacao, so even if the island's behind us, we can't see it. And so the time estimates, you know, ship leaves at 1 o'clock. Cruise ships travel on average somewhere between 18 and 22 knots. I think it's 60 nautical miles or 70 actual miles from Aruba to Curacao. That ends up as about three and a half hours putting the boat right in front of the mouth of the canal about 4:30, 4:40, something like.

• 36:28Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, because you left Aruba around 1 a.m.

• 36:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, so we probably, when I went to bed, we probably weren't there yet. And I don't, no, I don't, I don't remember seeing the island when I went to bed.

• 36:39Stephanie Harlowe?

  With the location where your cabin was, you couldn't see Curacao coming in? Is it possible Amy was out there after you went to bed and she's like, I can't sleep? Let me go on the other side of the boat?

• 36:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, sure.

• 36:49Stephanie Harlowe?

  And, and see if I can, you know, see, see the port, see land coming in?

• 36:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, for sure. I mean.

• 36:54Stephanie Harlowe?

  That's possible.

• 36:55Speaker 02

  Definitely possible, yeah.

• 36:57Stephanie Harlowe?

  Now, what time, because what day was this of the cruise?

• 37:00Speaker 02

  This was, I think we left Saturday. We spent Monday on Aruba. I think we woke up there, um, got off, spent the whole day there, got back on the boat. I don't remember what time it was, um, late afternoon. Came in, you know, like you see me sleeping like a zombie after being roasted in the sun all day on Aruba when we got lost. Got back on. The boat leaves right towards the end of the pool party. I think it left at 1 a.m. So that was Tuesday morning. We spent Monday on Aruba. Monday turned into Tuesday during the pool party, right towards the end of it. Uh, and then Tuesday morning at 1 a.m. The boat leaves Aruba. Um, again, estimated travel time is about three and a half hours. So we, we're not at sea.

• 37:43Speaker 02

  My, you know, my dad sees her, obviously people here, you know, they don't know the story and certainly before the Netflix series came out. You know, vanished at sea. That's a popular headline. That always kills us because we weren't at sea when she vanished. It's estimated that ship was docked at 6 a.m. And the docking process takes at least an hour. The timeframe that she, from when she was last seen from 5:30, when my dad woke up, looked at his, looked at the clock, saw me on the thing, didn't see her, looked, you know, two feet further. I'm literally like a foot from her on the other side of the glass, sees her legs, thanks to himself.

• 38:19Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, these rooms aren't big.

• 38:21Speaker 02

  No, they're not. No, they're not big. I mean, literally you have the clean bed my parents are in, a little tiny side table between the couch that I'm sleeping on. And then I'm right up against, I mean, I'm literally less than a foot from the window. And then she's right on the other side of the glass, Jay's lounge. So he sees her at 5:30. My dad has never changed his time. I've heard of all this BS about some interview my aunt gave 25 years ago, where she was wrong and said 4:30. That's not the case. My dad's never changed his story. So he woke up at 5:30, star, went back to bed, said, you know, we're going to be up in, you know, 45 minutes anyway. I'll just get her up. She looks comfortable. Woke up again at 6:00. Doors open, whereas it had previously been closed by me.

• 39:06Speaker 02

  And her shirt that she absolutely, I can assure you was wearing when I went to bed, was inside the room on the chair. So she 100% came back in. Another important point to make here, not only was the boat. At the minimum, in that little skinny canal, in front of all those businesses, all those people, people up getting, preparing, you know, for their excursions, we're not, we're not out, the sea's not rough, the ship's smooth as silk. Um, in fact, the canal's like glassy. I mean, it's, it's, the boat's not rocking. There's no motion to lilt, you know, someone toward the rail that they won't go near. And it, and the only way that she ended up in that water, if she did, was if she was put there.

• 39:51Speaker 02

  The suggestion, and I know Derek, and I, I, you know, I respect you. I, I've listened to everything you say and you're very-

• 39:56Derrick Levasseur?

  Give it to me.

• 39:57Speaker 02

  That table bullshit about that thing being up against the railing. That morning, that table was against the sliding glass door between the chairs. When the FBI got on the boat and separated me from my parents, interviewed each of us individually, had us each individually sketch where the balcony furniture was. We all three drew the table where it was, up against the sliding glass door between the chairs. Our pictures were identical. Now, as you know, and as attested to by the FBI agent, Mr. McCullum on the show, the room was clean prior to being able to be investigated by authorities.

• 40:40Speaker 02

  My opinion is that that table was put there to support a narrative that that company would love everybody to believe. So, no, the, and I heard you say the rail was five feet six. No, Amy was five feet six inches tall. The rail, I think, is estimated to be forty-two to forty-five inches tall, which is certainly-

• 40:58Derrick Levasseur?

  That's what I'm saying. That seemed awful high, five foot six inches tall rail. I've been on a bunch of cruises with this company, and the rails aren't that tall.

• 41:05Speaker 02

  Yeah. So, so they're certainly too tall for her to fall over, especially since she would never even go close to the rail. If she's gonna puke, the table climbing bullshit is dumb. She, the table wasn't there. So, she's either gonna come in the room, which we know she did, and go in the bathroom and throw up, or she's gonna be like, oh shit, I'm gonna throw up, and then lean over the rail. She didn't have to climb on anything to throw up over the rail, easily.

• 41:29Stephanie Harlowe?

  When you guys docked in Aruba, cause I've never, Derek and I talk about this, I've never been on a cruise ship. They just- I don't, I don't want to do it. It unsettles me. I don't find anything fun about it. So I've never been on a cruise ship. When you dock at different ports, like when you went to Aruba, you said the ship at Curacao was docked by six and, and the whole docking process, not the onboarding process, but the docking process takes about an hour, right? When was it typical for people to start getting off the ship at the port? And was there a certain time where people would all sort of go? Or was it like you could choose, hey, I don't want to get off at Curacao? Or did they say, hey, we're all getting off at Curacao? Was it just open? So you could go out at eight or you could go out at nine?

• 42:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think the, I think the gangplank was open. And if you look, look at the itinerary on that, on that company's flyers for that particular cruise, disembarkation on Curacao was set for like 7:00 a.m.

• 42:25Stephanie Harlowe?

  Okay.

• 42:26Speaker 02

  I don't know whether it was delayed momentarily, when we started barking about pulling the ship away from the dock and closing everything up and not allowing anybody off. Obviously, they didn't care to listen and do any of that. But I think it was roughly at 7:00 a.m. I actually don't remember much at all about Aruba, or how the docking process works there. I don't remember that. And I have never really paid attention to that because nothing happened there, you know? But, oh, in Curacao, it's different. I think Aruba, from what I saw recently on Marine Tracker, so you have the, the ship we were on, and I think it's right

• 43:06Speaker 02

  on the outside of the island. And then on Curacao, you have to come, you have to stop, and you have to wait for the harbor pilot to come out and board the ship. On Curacao, it's mandatory for the harbor pilot to get on the boat. So they have to go through that process. And then the guy has to get off the boat. They have to hook up the boat to one or two tugs. They have to start to pull the boat through the mouth of this little skinny canal. There's a floating bridge that has to be slowly moved out of the way and it takes a little bit of time. Then they pull all the way back through the island, go under that Queen Emma Bridge or whatever it is. They have to get to the end, they have to turn right and then they have to back into the port where they dock.

• 43:50Speaker 02

  That's, that's Curacao and I've studied that quite a lot. We actually had, um, US Attorney Greg Nivola, um, did an independent investigation, not only of the timing and sequencing of the docking process, but the water search that was conducted. And not only did the local authorities assure us that if she had been in the water, something would have been found, uh, Greg Nivola's team, uh, did as well. And, and so again, Amy, even if she went overboard, it was inside that island, uh, we were not even 200 yards offshore. Um, so the currents and all that stuff that people talk about, they're, they're not in play. And, you know, they had radar, they had boats, they had helicopters. I, don't quote me on this, I think there were divers involved too.

• 44:35Derrick Levasseur?

  There probably was, there should have been.

• 44:37Speaker 02

  And they searched that area and that canal and that area for four days, either four or five days. Um, and at the end of it, again concluded she was not in the water.

• 44:49Derrick Levasseur?

  I want, I want to talk about the water, cause I, cause that's something in episode one or two, in cases that I've worked, but I'm still, I'm still back on the boat because I think the boat, I don't want to skip over the boat because being in that room is critical and, and developing a baseline for what was normal behavior for you, your sister and your parents is extremely important.

• 45:08Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, that's what I'm trying to figure out.

• 45:10Derrick Levasseur?

  Which is why I want to go back to the balcony door because you had said when you came in the room, you were on the balcony with her. I'm assuming the balcony door was shut behind you or was it open while you guys were on the balcony?

• 45:21Speaker 02

  I think it was shut because, so when I came into the room, I didn't wake my parents. When Amy came into the room, and a lot of people don't know this, cause a lot of people don't know a lot of stuff, um, my dad. Woke up and said, hey, Amy, can you turn off that bathroom light? So she turned around, turned the light, came out on the balcony. And obviously we're out there talking. We don't want to talk with my parents eight feet from us. So yeah, we had, the door was closed. We were sitting out there. Uh, when I came in, I opened it. I quietly closed it behind me. Um, and then went to bed. And then when my dad woke up, he said, the door is open. And I don't know, you know, 12, 14, whatever it was, the door was open and she's gone.

• 46:03Speaker 02

  And then, I have to say, this, the whole shoe debacle, uh, drives me nuts. You know, I've answered it a zillion times and I'm happy to, uh, you know, quell everybody's, uh, questions and, uh, and anxieties about her shoes. But, you know, we don't know, Amy had tons of shoes. She brought a bunch of pairs of shoes. We still have a bunch of pairs of shoes in her bag. We didn't catalog how many she brought or which ones she brought. We don't know if any, uh, are missing because we don't know which ones she brought.

• 46:37Derrick Levasseur?

  I, I don't think she would have left the room without shoes, but to your point, I don't know what other shoes she had, so I haven't focused on that. Who would? But the balcony door, you come in, you shut it. Before that night, just be Amy's behavior, your behavior, whatever, was it normal for you guys? To leave that room for the day or whatever, to go downstairs and leave the balcony door open after exiting the room? Or what was the normal occurrence for you guys in that room? For me personally, and I said this to, uh, Stephanie in a few episodes. I didn't usually leave the balcony door open because it would create like this wind tunnel effect. And it, it can get pretty loud. So that's why I wouldn't. But what was the normal baseline for you guys?

• 47:15Speaker 02

  The first two days, we're on the water, we're out on the boat. I don't think, you know, I don't remember honestly, but I don't think we would have left the balcony door open because we want, we don't want the room to be hot. You know, you want the AC to cool the room down. So, you know, when, when we all leave, uh, I would imagine we'd shut it. If anybody was in the room, I think we'd have it open, sort of like you do at the beach, because you want to have the atmosphere of the wind and the water and all that.

• 47:40Derrick Levasseur?

  Mm-hmm.

• 47:40Speaker 02

  Uh, I remember nothing, uh, about that door having some crazy vortex if you have the balcony door open. There was never any moment where the door slammed and everybody's like, oh my God, watch out for that door. Uh, there was, there was none of that. When I came in that night. The door opens and closes quietly when Amy, you know, that I don't think, I, I never noticed there was any problem with the door opening or closing when the balcony door was open. I, I don't recall any of that.

• 48:08Derrick Levasseur?

  My question would be for you, cause I struggle with it, to be honest with you, Brad. I struggle with it because for a couple of reasons. If Amy was leaving the room, let's just all say she left the room voluntarily. For whatever reason, we don't know, right? But she leaves. One, the balconies are connected to other rooms. I never liked that because people can come from other balconies if they wanted to and hop over to your balcony. As a, as someone who's paranoid, I hate that. I also, it would make the room a lot warmer and it also creates some noise. Do you think Amy, if she was going out to the top deck or whatever to meet someone, she would leave the balcony door open with all you guys still in the room when the AC's on?

• 48:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know. It's a good question.

• 48:49Derrick Levasseur?

  You know what I'm saying? It's just, it's, I, I struggle with it.

• 48:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, I hear you and, and I don't, I have an answer for it, honestly. So, uh, you know, I think maybe she came in and was, if she was trying to sneak out to do something, maybe she didn't want to shut the door and make any more noise. Maybe, I, I don't know. Uh, can't, can't answer that, but it's.

• 49:07Derrick Levasseur?

  Do you think she would do that though? You're the best person to ask. Do, cause that's not the vibe I get of her. Cause you would sneak out to go meet a dude without telling someone.

• 49:16Speaker 02

  Well, I think she's a hell of a lot more likely to sneak out and meet a dude than jump off the balcony or do some other dumb.

• 49:22Derrick Levasseur?

  I agree with that. I, I agree with Ju- I, I think that's off the table as far as I'm concerned.

• 49:26Speaker 02

  This is a good point to bring up. So, you know, I've been accused of like accusing all these different people. Anytime I mention a name of another character on the boat, it is not in an attempt to accuse them of any wrongdoing. Like you say, again, you want to give everybody all the information. So there's a bartender named Caitlin Feges who works in the casino. Amy and I spent several hours in the casino in the days during the early, you know, days of the cruise. We met and spoke with Caitlin. Amy and Caitlin were very chatty. And I'm standing there and Caitlin's talking to Amy about getting together after she got off work. So if if Amy's gonna go meet anybody potentially,

• 50:12Speaker 02

  it would make much more sense that she's gonna go meet her or a girl rather than, you know, uh, Yellow, who's, you know, kind of a slimy guy making a move on her. Um, I don't know, but.

• 50:23Derrick Levasseur?

  Agreed.

• 50:24Speaker 02

  So there's, there's other people involved. There's other people she had met. There's other females that she had met. Uh, so, you know, obviously we, nobody knows the answer to that question. It's a, it's a reasonable question and it's fair. Um, but I, you know, I don't know. I, I don't think that should be the biggest sticking point. Because to believe she didn't leave the room means that you have to discount about 10,000 uh, other very interesting and curious uh, facts, which I'd like to get into and you can point me uh, to the right time to talk about this particular thing. As to why both Yellow and Oscar Alexander need to lie through each of their interviews.

• 51:05Speaker 02

  Uh, if Amy never left the room, what, what reason does anyone have to lie about anything? And I can explain to.

• 51:11Derrick Levasseur?

  O- Oscar Alexander, because we didn't talk about him. He's, he's, I believe you're talking about Yellow's roommate, correct?

• 51:17Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 51:17Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay. He had a cab with me. I was gonna ask you about that. I, I guess my final question, Brad, for the room would be, did they, just for detective questions, quick, and you could answer them spit firing. Did they ever dust the room? Did they ever dust that balcony?

• 51:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:30Derrick Levasseur?

  Anything found from that?

• 51:32Speaker 02

  Oh, we actually sent Amy's prints. There's some crap that was first brought up by the company's attorney. There was some heel print on the outside of the glass, like Amy's sitting on the balcony on the railing. The FBI confirmed that was not accurate. There's no handprints on the rail. Victor McCullum and the FBI in the Netflix documentary confirmed there were no prints. We supplied Amy's prints to them and they compared to anything and everything they found on that balcony. And apparently that room was cleaned pretty damn good because they don't have any.

• 52:10Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay, that was what I have at the room.

• 52:11Stephanie Harlowe?

  It doesn't mean that there were no handprints. It just means that before the FBI was able to go in there, the room was cleaned.

• 52:18Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 52:18Stephanie Harlowe?

  But they did such a very thorough job of cleaning the balcony railing.

• 52:22Speaker 02

  They really number on it. And you know, one thing that people don't also know that I think is interesting is that during the first couple of days of that cruise, you know, we're on two levels that have glass railings on the balcony. We were the top one and there was one below us that also had a glass railing. There were several occasions during that cruise where right at those two levels, because again, those are the only two levels that the window washers had to clean, there were rolling scaffoldings that would come by the room right, right at our level. And the guys would come by and wash the balconies and roll on and wash the balconies and roll on. So, you know, it's also kind of, hmm, I wonder if someone rolled up on one of those

• 53:06Speaker 02

  things and got her off the balcony that way. It was definitely kind of an unsettling thing and I think we even talked about it. Like, we don't like these guys. They could just jump right on her balcony because they're right there. I mean, they're, they're rolling by on these rolling scaffoldings and, and you know, people aren't aware of one of that fact that, that that happens and they have those things. But just another interesting tidbit to throw in there.

• 53:31Stephanie Harlowe?

  Okay, so when, based on just you knowing you're going to be going into port, you're pulling up to Curacao, was there any conversation with you, Amy and your parents the night before at any point where it was like, okay, this is what time we're going to get up? This is what we're going to do? We're going to go into Curacao together? Or was it just kind of like, when we get up, we'll get up and go in?

• 53:51Speaker 02

  On the fly, you know, we didn't, you know, even when we got off on Aruba that day, we didn't have plans. We got off and like, yeah, let's rent a vehicle. And we got in this little topless thing and we took off and got lost for several hours. Didn't even, we were, we kind of were nervously joking and laughing to ourselves out in the middle of the desert with, you know, tumbleweeds and wild goats and dogs like. We're dead. Like, we're not, we don't know how to get back in.

• 54:18Stephanie Harlowe?

  Like, we're gonna miss the boat, yeah.

• 54:19Speaker 02

  Same thing. We got back, we took naps, took showers, got up, went to the casino, went to the formal dinner, came back, changed, went up to the pool party. They went to bed, we went to the dance club, came back. It was, we didn't have, no, to answer your question simply, no, we didn't have an itinerary or discuss plans for the next day.

• 54:39Stephanie Harlowe?

  So considering that you and Amy were kind of getting into bed late, and you, they were docking, the boat was docking at around 7:00 a.m. and you knew people would be probably getting off at that point, was there some sort of understanding of like, hey, the parents will get up, and then we're gonna get you guys up? Or was it kind of like, maybe your parents would go into curacao, and then you and Amy could get off when you got up? What time would you have to be back to the boat? If it docks at 6:00 and, you know, starts letting passengers off between 7:00 and 8:00, what time would you be expected to be back to the cruise ship in order to make sure that you don't get left behind?

• 55:13Speaker 02

  Back to the cruise ship after, like, I lost you there for a second, so you're...

• 55:17Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, like, when you go to port, if you go to port, it's usually 4:00 or 5:00, Stephanie. Usually you have to be back on the boat. Like, if you get off to go do excursions with Royal Caribbean, it's usually 4:00 or 5:00, maybe 6:00 p.m. You have to be back in line, given your ID to get back on that boat, or they will leave you behind.

• 55:34Stephanie Harlowe?

  Okay, I mean, just wondering, because you'd think you'd want to get off pretty early, because that way you have actual time, and you don't have to worry about rushing back to the boat.

• 55:42Speaker 02

  I remember when we got off the boat, um, the evening of the morning, she disappeared. Um, I think it was roughly 5:00 p.m. We checked into the hotel, and then after, you know, it was a terrible, uh, terrible scene in that room. Uh, watching what my parents were going through and dealing with what I was going through, um, I decided I had to, I had to get out of there and take a walk. So I, I walk out onto the, um, the canal. I go sit on some rocks, um, at the point, and, you know, I'm just out there talking to God and pondering life. Then we watched as our boat left on, on schedule, with no, uh, no interest in, uh, hanging around for, uh...

• 56:25Derrick Levasseur?

  Horrible. We talked about that horrible, absolutely horrible visual. Like I said, the fact that you're still out here talking about it, I mean, I think people who are watching this as for quote unquote entertainment, you know it and I know it, right? They don't see that these aren't fictional characters.

• 56:42Speaker 02

  Right.

• 56:42Derrick Levasseur?

  This is a real story. A lot of people do, but some people look at it more for the entertainment value, which it's important to see your face, which by the way, I don't know, I'm sure I'm not the first person to tell you this, you look just like Amy, which is kind of weird because I've been studying her face with that frigging photo, which we're going to talk about, but you look so much like her. I want to give you the floor before we visually get off the boat to talk about yellow because you know how I feel about the accident scenario, but I'm open to everything and I want to hear more about yellow because to what you were going to say a little while ago, if yellow is somehow involved, it's not just yellow. There's gotta be more people, including people that he was living with in his cabin, because there's no way he could pull this off without multiple

• 57:26Derrick Levasseur?

  people giving him an alibi, right?

• 57:29Speaker 02

  Right.

• 57:29Derrick Levasseur?

  So the floor is yours. Talk about it. I've seen some things online, but maybe you can just clear it up because I did see that he had a roommate and that he was interviewed and I think he's defending him, but I'll let you kind of clarify everything.

• 57:42Speaker 02

  So first of all, you have to understand when my dad woke up at six, he left the room, didn't wake mom or I. So obviously you can leave the room without waking people up.

• 57:53Derrick Levasseur?

  Fair, fair.

• 57:54Speaker 02

  It's about six o'clock after he gets up. He admits he didn't panic immediately. I know a lot of people run their mouths and say, whoa, you're panicking immediately, you know, whatever. So he didn't panic. He got up and he said, you know, they're going to be out at four o'clock in the morning and she's gone at six. This is, she was just there 30 minutes ago. So he gets up, he decides to go out and walk around and take a look for her. I think fully expecting to just find her up on the deck. And he looked and he looked and he looked and he looked for close to an hour. Looked everywhere he knew to look. Anywhere we had been, anywhere that he knew of, he was, he was looking. Obviously

• 58:37Speaker 02

  didn't find. So he comes back to the room at that point to wake us up. Before he hits our cabin door, Lou Costello, the chief security officer for the boat, happens to be standing about 30 feet from our cabin door. On that entire ship, size of a city, hundreds of rooms. You know, thousand feet long. He just so happens to be right near our door in our hallway. Um, right then. Uh, my dad hadn't reported it. He never went to the purser's desk. He was walking around. He ran into a colleague of his. You know, shortly, I think, I don't know, six twenty, six thirty. He recalls the boat sitting still, no scenery moving. We're, we're, we're at the dock. He comes back, walks over to, um, you know, the security officer holding the walkie talkie and he's like,

• 59:22Speaker 02

  "Excuse me, I just wanted to let you know, I've been, I woke up this morning. Uh, my daughter wasn't in the room. I've been looking for her for an hour, um, and I can't find her." So, he goes back into the room and gets mom up. Mom talks about this. When he touched her leg or her foot and she turned around and saw the look on his face. Also a look she had never seen, and I think that immediately panicked her. Um, because he says, "I can't find Amy." So they get up. I'm woken up with both of them standing at the foot of the, the pullout I was sleeping on.

• 1:00:03Speaker 02

  And their, their mom nervously is telling me and, and, and obviously kind of startles me. You know, your dad's been looking for Amy for an hour. We don't know where she is. We're gonna go out and look for her. You stay here in case she comes back while we're out, so we don't miss each other. So they go out and leave. They go out and I think they pretty immediately go to the purser's desk to report it. Now,

• 1:00:28Speaker 02

  Yellow claims in his interview with, uh, uh, I won't even say the asshole's name. Um, but, uh, he, he has a recent interview with a guy writing a fictional story, apparently. Uh, where he says that, uh, security called his room. Didn't knock on his door, didn't go to his room. Security, or the hotel manager, I think he calls it. Um, during the interview, called his room at seven AM. To ask him if he had the girl in his room that he was dancing with in the club the night before.

• 1:01:02Speaker 02

  Okay, so, how did they know who he was dancing with the night before? Why did they call him at 7:00 when my parents didn't report it? Apparently, per the Chief Security Officer's official report, until 7:33 a.m. Chief Security Officer states in his report, and I can provide it to you, that he was first made aware, quote-unquote, of a missing passenger at 7:33 a.m. after he was contacted by the purser's desk. He excludes completely the interaction that he had with my dad, when my dad told him he couldn't find his daughter at 7:00 a.m. It's a little bit curious as to why, you know, on the official report, that wouldn't even be mentioned. So if the security officer and the purser's desk are only made aware

• 1:01:46Speaker 02

  of Amy's disappearance at 7:33, how the hell is somebody gonna call him at 7:00 to let him know my sister's missing? And apparently know that he was dancing with her in the club the night before. He claims that he was in his room at 1:00 a.m. He told me straight to my face that that morning, "I left her at 3:30. When's the last time you saw her? What happened?"

• 1:02:08Stephanie Harlowe?

  Well, yeah, his car doesn't access his room.

• 1:02:10Speaker 02

  Until 3:35, and there's no entry or anything prior to it.

• 1:02:14Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, and we talked about that in the last episode, where I said, "Well, what was he doing?" Because he said he had to be out, uh, crew and employees had to be out of that area by a certain time. So he left that area and went back to his room. But we know he didn't enter his room until 3:35, and if you left that area, then what were you doing for two and a half hours? Derek and I did ask that question. We have no idea.

• 1:02:37Speaker 02

  He didn't leave that area, because when I left the club at 3:00 a.m., he's sitting his ass up at the table with my sister. He was absolutely there until 3:00 a.m. Um, he was with her right up until she came back to the room.

• 1:02:49Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, Derek, that clears it up.

• 1:02:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, he came back to the room, apparently, the same exact time I did, weirdly enough. Amy came back five minutes later. I think he had quicker access via the crew elevator.

• 1:03:00Derrick Levasseur?

  Downstairs, yeah.

• 1:03:01Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:02Speaker 02

  To his room, which is why it took her five minutes longer to get back. So he's lying, obviously, provably so. Why would you lie if you're telling the truth and you have nothing to hide? Why, why, you're 27 years later. You're not trying to protect your job anymore.

• 1:03:16Stephanie Harlowe?

  To play devil's advocate, because even 27 years later, there's so much online...

• 1:03:24Stephanie Harlowe?

  Even before this Netflix documentary, because I was looking into Amy's case years ago, and I saw all the reddits and the internet forums saying Yellow's guilty, Yellow's guilty, you know, he's claiming he's getting comments, this, this and that. So maybe at the time, he lied because he was like, I don't want to get in trouble for this. I don't want to get this pinned on me. And now he's still lying about that gap because he's like, well, now if I say I'm lying, I'm going to look suspicious. So it's kind of, I'm going to die on this hill thing, deny, deny.

• 1:03:50Speaker 02

  Another interesting thing, and please kind of bring me back if I don't address the point you just made, but the chief security officer's report also states that Yellow made many false statements during initial questioning until I explained to him the lock link key card, and then his answers fell more in line with the facts. So not only do you have a security officer excluding pertinent information about my dad's first indication to him that Amy was missing, didn't mention it at all, then you have a security officer who, I don't know, and this is just a question, does it seem like to anyone that

• 1:04:33Speaker 02

  maybe he was coaching Yellow through his answers by saying, you know, he's giving these kind of false statements. And then I say, well, oh, hold on a second, Yellow, we have your key card data that says you go in here. And then Yellow says, oh, yeah, okay, I go in there. So that's interesting to me, that little fact.

• 1:04:50Stephanie Harlowe?

  Are you talking about Lou Costello?

• 1:04:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:04:52Stephanie Harlowe?

  The chief security officer? Okay. So you did have access to the chief security officer's report? You've seen that?

• 1:04:57Speaker 02

  Portion of it. We've, yeah, we were provided that. And I can't tell you exactly who gave it to us. There's an FBI, I'm a Brian that we worked with for years. There's several names that, you know, sometimes I get mixed up when you're talking about all the different people, a lot of them. But yeah, we have, we have certain portions and pages that are pertinent to Yellow's movements, which show her based, and based on his report, this is based on their bar tab and their, he was able to track Yellow and Amy, and they're on the Stargazer deck sometime between 2:30 and 3:30 a.m. So it proved, I mean, it easily proves Yellow's lying about the one o'clock in the morning thing. And I think during his questioning with the FBI, since they had the lock link data, say in 3:35,

• 1:05:42Speaker 02

  that was his story then. And that's a problem with a liar. A liar has to remember all the lies he's told. And I, I think Yellow, unfortunately, after having 27 years of rehearsal time, didn't quite study enough for the interview that he gave. So he's saying 1 o'clock. He says that he's got a gay uncle. His daughter says, no such thing. He says, uh, his daughter says he lies. She, she breaks down on TikTok. He lies about this. He was well aware of people smoking. They were around him all the time. He never had a gay uncle. I didn't go get a job in Georgia, blah, blah, blah. So, all right. So we got that Yellow side of the story. And, and whether you guys have spoken about this on your prior podcasts or not,

• 1:06:24Speaker 02

  about him coming up to me that morning as I'm exhausting my initial search effort and sat at that table by the pool. He walks up to me and again, I think I was incorrect at first and said about 7 a.m. And then I think it more accurately, it's sometime between 7:30 and 8.

• 1:06:41Stephanie Harlowe?

  Your dad talked to Yellow at 7 a.m.?

• 1:06:43Speaker 02

  No, no, no. No, my dad talked to Lu- Luke Costello.

• 1:06:46Stephanie Harlowe?

  At 7 a.m.?

• 1:06:47Derrick Levasseur?

  Yes.

• 1:06:48Stephanie Harlowe?

  And at that point, Luke Costello told your dad that he had already talked to Yellow?

• 1:06:53Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:06:54Derrick Levasseur?

  No, he talked to Yellow apparently after that.

• 1:06:56Speaker 02

  Was never mentioned by my dad. We didn't ever associate Yellow with the, with our suspicion until Lori and Crystal came up and told us two days later, they saw him go up the elevator with her. So my dad never said Yellow's name during his interaction with Luke Costello. So why do they call him directly if in fact they called him at all?

• 1:07:16Derrick Levasseur?

  So, so here's what we have. This is what Phil reached out to me about.

• 1:07:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:07:19Derrick Levasseur?

  We had said in an episode that Yellow's original statement, this was to CNN. He had said that he was contacted at 6. Clearly that's what he said in the interview. They could have gotten it wrong. He could have gotten it wrong. We know that's not accurate. Right? My interpretation of it, just try again, to try to look at Yellow's side of it was if your dad went down and spoke to them around 7, okay? And they, and they say at that point, he was last seen down at the bar. Maybe your dad talked to you. And again, you could correct me on this. But at that point, the, someone reached out to Yellow, according to Yellow and said, hey, is she in the room with you? And from what I read in the statement.

• 1:07:57Stephanie Harlowe?

  They said he came to the, they came to the cabin.

• 1:07:59Derrick Levasseur?

  Came to his actual cabin.

• 1:07:59Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:00Derrick Levasseur?

  And he was, he was asleep and he got, he was awoken.

• 1:08:03Stephanie Harlowe?

  By someone knocking and being like, hey, is this, is there a girl in here?

• 1:08:05Speaker 02

  He says this?

• 1:08:06Derrick Levasseur?

  Uh, Yellow said this in a CNN interview. So here's what I said to Phil. Because Phil said to me, "Listen, this is compelling information if true because we thought the first time Yellow had any interaction with us was during the Charlie drill. So him talking to Brad beforehand would make no sense. So I provided the source and what I said to Phil was, "Phil, this doesn't take a detective. This is easy. You have to go speak to the Yellow and ask him, "Who came to your room? Who came to your room at 7:00 a.m. and asked you if Amy was in there?" Because if he's lying...

• 1:08:39Stephanie Harlowe?

  No, it's 6:00 a.m.

• 1:08:39Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, he said 6:00 a.m., but I think he got that time wrong. There's no way 6:00 a.m. is right.

• 1:08:43Stephanie Harlowe?

  So you think Mr. Bradley goes to Lou Costello around 7:00, "My daughter's missing", says nothing about Yellow. Then...

• 1:08:52Derrick Levasseur?

  That's what Brad's saying. He says nothing about Yellow.

• 1:08:54Stephanie Harlowe?

  He says nothing about Yellow. And then the chief security officer, Lou Costello...

• 1:08:59Derrick Levasseur?

  Or someone under him.

• 1:09:00Stephanie Harlowe?

  Under him, goes to Yellow because how would they know...

• 1:09:04Derrick Levasseur?

  That's the question.

• 1:09:06Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, how are they...

• 1:09:07Derrick Levasseur?

  But this is something that can be confirmed. This can something be corroborated or discredited. So my point for you, Brad, is if Yellow's lying and nobody went to his room, he's got, he just did the worst thing that a criminal could do, which is involve someone else in your, in your web of lies.

• 1:09:23Stephanie Harlowe?

  And it's guilt knowledge. If you know she's missing before you're informed she's missing, then, yeah.

• 1:09:27Derrick Levasseur?

  My question would be, "Has anybody effing done that? Has anybody said, "Yellow, who came to your room?" Because then you go to that person, let's say it's Joe Smith. "Oh, it was Joe Smith who came to my room. He woke me up." Even if the time's wrong. "Oh, Joe Smith came to your room? Hey, Joe Smith, did you go to Yellow's room in the morning? And if so, who directed you to go there?"

• 1:09:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:09:49Derrick Levasseur?

  Very simple. This is like Detective 101. It's not complicated.

• 1:09:53Speaker 02

  So my, my suspicion of a potential explanation of why Yellow seems to claim that he was contacted or someone went to his room, and I find it interesting that such a significant event of someone knocking on your door to search for a missing passenger to search your room, you forget totally about it in your, in your only interview you've ever given and say someone called your room, and then they tell you to stay in your room... Meanwhile, you're up on the deck talking to me, telling me you're sorry to hear about my sister. He knows that he shouldn't have known about it at that point when he said that to me. So he's trying to find some way to tell everybody that's how I knew about it before I talked to Brad. I don't believe that he, I don't think he should have at that point.

• 1:10:38Derrick Levasseur?

  I agree with you, and I think we could easily prove that.

• 1:10:45Derrick Levasseur?

  I don't want to lose track for you because you had mentioned earlier about Yellow having a roomy or a cabin me, a bunk me. I think this would be a good time to get into that.

• 1:10:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, so there's, there's a little bit more to that story. So when Yellow said, "I left her at 3:30," what time did you last see or what happened? And I said, "Well," I start to say, "Well, when I left," he said, "Hold on a second. I want my brother to hear this." So he stops me, interrupts me, walks over about 50 feet to a table with three or four guys at it. I assumed who were his bandmates, brings just one of them back over. Don't know why it would be just one and not the whole crew. Why is that one specific guy need to hear what I'm about to say? And he said, comes back over and he's like, "Okay, go ahead." Now, I don't know if this guy was Reggie, and I'll talk to you about Reggie later, or whether this was Oscar. I honestly don't know who the guy was he brought over.

• 1:11:38Speaker 02

  I don't remember what he looked like. It was just another guy that was at that table over there. So he says, "Okay, go ahead." So I proceed to lay out my timeline of exactly when I left the club, exactly when I got back to the room. And by that, by then, I didn't have the key card data, so I didn't know exactly when. But I got back to the room, I don't know, 3:30 or whatever it was. Amy came in, and I think I probably said 10, 15 minutes later. It turns out it was 5:00. And then, so in retrospect, look, and at the time, it didn't register to me. I'm in my head, I'm in my feelings, I'm freaking out, I don't know what the hell's going on. I'm realizing this isn't good. And so I didn't, I wasn't of the right mindset to pay attention to what was happening.

• 1:12:21Speaker 02

  And looking back on it, it seems clear to me that he stopped me to go get that guy so he could hear my account of my timeline directly and they could have their story straight based on my story. That's what I believe. Now- Whether that was Reggie or whether that was Oscar, I do not know. Now Oscar, never heard the guy speak. And the only good thing that this author has done as a useful idiot is get these people to talk when they should have kept their mouths shut the whole time.

• 1:12:49Derrick Levasseur?

  So this roommate who was staying with Yellow did an interview?

• 1:12:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:53Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay.

• 1:12:53Speaker 02

  Now, it's not a full interview. There's only a three minute and 14 second clip of a statement with a still picture of Oscar Alexander's Facebook profile picture, not

• 1:13:05Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay.

• 1:13:06Speaker 02

  not a video of a guy talking.

• 1:13:07Derrick Levasseur?

  For the audience, we're not, we won't say his name, but I've seen your Twitter posts and stuff. This is someone who's in the true crime community, who's been conducting their own independent investigation. So if they go look at your Twitter, they can go see what you're talking about, but this person is not a-

• 1:13:23Stephanie Harlowe?

  Why are we not saying their name?

• 1:13:25Derrick Levasseur?

  If you don't mind me saying it, I'll say it. So it's James Renner and basically he's, I just wanted to make that clear because he's not someone who's with the FBI or with law enforcement. This is someone else who's doing it for their channel. So he did the interview with this, with this roommate Oscar.

• 1:13:39Speaker 02

  And he's the one that did Yellow's interview.

• 1:13:41Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay, cool.

• 1:13:42Speaker 02

  So he releases this new clip, audio clip of Oscar's statement. And I wish I had listened to it just before this interview so I'd memorize exactly what he said. But the most important points are, he said that Yellow met Amy that night at the pool party because she was coming up and requesting music. True, we both were. He said that they had, you know, a short conversation after their set was over. True. He says that after we finished playing, we packed our stuff up and went back to our rooms. Now, Yellow in his interview says he went back to his room, took a shower and came up to the club for one or two songs. So he could explain away why there's a video of him dancing.

• 1:14:26Speaker 02

  Oscar claims they both went back to their room after they finished playing and that was it.

• 1:14:31Speaker 02

  Oscar claims that somewhere between three and four o'clock in the morning, security knocked on their door and searched their room for Amy Bradley.

• 1:14:41Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay, and we know that's wrong.

• 1:14:43Speaker 02

  Obviously, Amy wasn't missing till after 7 a.m.

• 1:14:46Derrick Levasseur?

  Right, right. That's definitely wrong.

• 1:14:48Speaker 02

  If he's gonna say 6:45 or 6:30 maybe. Three or four o'clock in the morning is a pretty, um, especially if you're in your room at one o'clock sleeping, that's a pretty significant event that would be burned in your brain forever. And again, Yellow makes no mention of anyone searching their room at all. He got a phone call.

• 1:15:08Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, he might have said in that, just to be fair to him, he might have said in that CNN interview, I'll send you the source after this, because I sent it to Phil. He said that someone came to his room.

• 1:15:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, but it wasn't.

• 1:15:17Stephanie Harlowe?

  He did, but he changed his story after, because in his interview with James Renner, he said he got a call.

• 1:15:22Derrick Levasseur?

  Yep. Okay, and so that's, that's a discrepancy. Okay, cool. I'm with you.

• 1:15:25Speaker 02

  I've spoken to Amika recently, simply about the story that her dad has told her over the years, and how many times it's changed and how. I can get you all those details if you want. Um, Amika tells me that after, um, now she was in her mom's belly when, when he came home from that cruise. Her mom was pregnant with her at the time.

• 1:15:44Speaker 02

  So she gets all of this information secondhand from her mom. She wasn't present. But the mom has told her throughout her young life and growing up, when she got old enough to, I guess the mother was concerned about, you know, Amika finding out online about her dad instead of hearing it from her mom. So her mom tells her all these things. You hear about the pictures of Amy, uh, not, well, I don't know that the pictures in his suitcase included Amy, but you hear about all the pictures of, of women in his suitcase. Amika tells the story that her mom told about Yellow bragging about having $60,000 for whatever reason when he came back from the cruise. Yellow's mother told her that Reggie came to her after the cruise

• 1:16:26Speaker 02

  and said that something happened on the boat and Yellow was involved and, um, you know, I need to talk to you about it. And then she, I don't know whether she heard from Reggie again. Amika's mother says that Yellow called her. From that cruise, either before the boat got to Aruba or before the boat got to Curacao, she's not exactly sure. And she says that Yellow called her and told her, and she found it odd, like, why are you telling me this? That he had to get off the boat to deliver a package or bag to a guy. And she mentioned the guy's name. And I can give it to you, but I'm gonna hold that to the chest right now.

• 1:17:03Derrick Levasseur?

  No, you can keep it in-house, and that way, there's no way they could say it came from an outside source. Keep it in-house.

• 1:17:08Speaker 02

  Amika believes her dad is guilty. I asked her on a recent live I did with her whether she, her mom feels similarly, and apparently she does. The pictures in his suitcase, you know, Yellow claims, you know, people took pictures with him all the time, their fans and blah, blah, blah. So how are you gonna get everybody's pictures that they take with their camera of you that they want?

• 1:17:30Derrick Levasseur?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:17:31Speaker 02

  No, that doesn't work. My mom has the receipt from the reprint order that the night Amy and her went to the photographer booth.

• 1:17:39Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, I was gonna ask you about that.

• 1:17:41Speaker 02

  So she walks up, they walk up together, mom says, hey, let's go get y'all's pictures. Take family pictures. It was just Amy and I. Mom and dad were talking to their business associates and weren't, weren't in the pictures. So they walk up to get the pictures and they say, hey, you know, I would like to pick our pictures up. And she said the guy was like, oh, yeah, they're right over here. I remember putting it. And he walks over and there's a blank spot. And he's like, that's weird. I'd like, I just put those there a few minutes ago. So there's no pictures. And the guy's like, well, what, you know, that's funny. Would, would anybody from your group have purchased the pictures or got them for you? And my mom's like, no, like, don't think so. And so she had to submit an order or a ticket for those pictures to be reprinted because they were gone and they were never

• 1:18:26Speaker 02

  found again. So why were her pictures missing? Why is Yellow lying? Why is Oscar lying? It's not because she fell off the boat.

• 1:18:32Stephanie Harlowe?

  Were there any, to your knowledge, any pictures in Yellow's suitcase that were those types of pictures taken by the cruise line?

• 1:18:39Speaker 02

  We don't know because that, we, we, that story came from 1998.

• 1:18:45Speaker 02

  And Amika only first contacted us in 2016 or 17. I don't remember which one. But so you're talking about 17, 18 years later. That suitcase is long gone. No one can even investigate what pictures are in it.

• 1:18:57Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yellow's wife saw them though, right?

• 1:18:59Speaker 02

  Yeah. If her mom would be willing to speak with me. I know my mom's spoken to her. I know that the FBI has interviewed her and candidly told my mother. They believe she knows more than she's telling, but we don't know, you know, no one was ever able to investigate the suitcase because it was, you know, 18 years old at that point.

• 1:19:16Stephanie Harlowe?

  I'd be interested to know if Yellow's wife remembered whether some of those pictures were like Polaroids, candids, or like posed pictures that the cruise line would take because they would obviously have an insignia on them from the cruise line.

• 1:19:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:19:29Stephanie Harlowe?

  All right. So what he told James Renner, what Yellow told James Renner, he said he had to be out of guest areas by 1 a.m. So he had to be out of the Viking Crown Lounge, but he was seen by staff with Amy on the Stargazer Deck from 2:30 to 3:30 a.m. And you Brad also saw them during that timeframe. The security officer, Lou Costello consulted the lock link system, which logged when the passengers and crew entered their cabins. Yellow's key card showed he entered his cabin at 3:35 a.m. However, we are aware, just like those two girls who claimed they saw Amy and Yellow and their mother let them in. His roommate could have let him in at any time before or after that 3:35 a.m. period.

• 1:20:09Stephanie Harlowe?

  Now, the Viking Crown Lounge that he claims, he didn't, I guess he never said it closed at midnight, but he said that the band had to be out of there by midnight, but according to this information, that Viking Crown Lounge did not close at midnight. It was open till 2:30, 3 a.m. So have you ever verified with the cruise line? That what Yellow is saying is true, that the band had to be out of that area by midnight? Or is this just something he's kind of like making up to show that he wasn't around or with Amy? After that midnight hour.

• 1:20:45Speaker 02

  That company has never communicated with us. So, no, we don't, we have never verified through them. That band was not playing in the lounge. They were playing on the pool deck. And so when that pool party ended is when they packed up, you know, apparently went back to change and take showers and come back up to the club for a couple more hours. Because again, I can guarantee you, I assure you, he was in that club, sitting at a table with Amy at 3 a.m. when I left it.

• 1:21:12Stephanie Harlowe?

  Well, there is surveillance footage showing them dancing together after that midnight hour.

• 1:21:16Speaker 02

  And that's not surveillance footage. That is a privately hired videographer that worked. Chris Fenwick, who was a video editor that was hired for a company called Van Star, who's, who's no longer in business, but they also had a work trip company that he was hired for separately. And so his guy Bob was filming for their company in the lounge that night. So that's not security footage. That's a private videographer.

• 1:21:42Derrick Levasseur?

  Which is very important because that means yellow, if whatever his past practices were, he knows there's no security camera in there. So he can leave, come back, he's not going to be on footage, not expecting a private company to be recording at those moments.

• 1:21:58Stephanie Harlowe?

  Why would there be no surveillance cameras?

• 1:22:01Derrick Levasseur?

  Fuck, it's ridiculous.

• 1:22:02Stephanie Harlowe?

  In that area though, because they said they had them in some areas. Why not in that area?

• 1:22:06Speaker 02

  The some areas are in the casino. You know, you gotta protect your money.

• 1:22:11Derrick Levasseur?

  That's all they care about.

• 1:22:12Speaker 02

  Nowadays, I think it's different. I think there's

• 1:22:14Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, now it's everywhere.

• 1:22:15Speaker 02

  A lot of other places. But back then, we even asked them, the ship's captain, we say, you know, pull up the footage that shows down the sides of both, you know, down the sides of the ship to see if she went overboard. And sorry, none of those cameras, they weren't recording, they're monitoring. Okay?

• 1:22:32Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, we talked about that too, in, in an episode. We were like, what's the point? You got people staring at these things 24 hours a day. What's the point to even have them monitoring if you're not filming?

• 1:22:41Speaker 02

  Whether that's BS or not, and they actually had recordings that they didn't want to share with us. That's, that's potentially the case. We know that via Chris Fenwick, that not only did the, did Lou Costello ask for his master tapes, claim he was working with the FBI when Chris refused. And Chris said, that's great. Tell the FBI to come get him. And never heard from the FBI.

• 1:23:04Stephanie Harlowe?

  So you're suggesting that, just suggesting, or, you know, implying that Lou Costello and, and maybe

• 1:23:12Stephanie Harlowe?

  The cruise line in general had an interest in not having their fingerprints on any of this and not necessarily protecting Yellow as a person, but protecting the reputation of the cruise line.

• 1:23:26Speaker 02

  It's protecting liability is what I think. And so not only did they want the footage of Amy dancing with Yellow to, in my opinion, destroy it so no one ever sees it. They also asked their own video editor, Steve Smith, to delete or scrub. I forget what the actual term was that Chris used. Chris is in Steve Smith's editing suite because they had become friends and they were working on, actually, Chris was paying Steve to use some of his equipment for his projects and things. So he goes over to Steve's room one day and he's like, you know, what are you working on? And Steve's sitting there at his computer. And he said, you know, they asked me to remove any footage of Amy from my tapes. So meanwhile,

• 1:24:11Speaker 02

  you have Chris Fenwick preserving evidence in a potential criminal investigation while the company is apparently deleting it.

• 1:24:21Stephanie Harlowe?

  So wait, Steve Smith worked for the cruise line?

• 1:24:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:25Stephanie Harlowe?

  And you've heard this from him that they asked him to remove any footage of Amy that they had?

• 1:24:32Speaker 02

  I've never spoken with Chris, I mean with Steve Smith personally. I have spoken at length with Chris Fenwick. He documented this all from day one. This is, he's got a whole story. He did a podcast with a gal named Katie Beck. Steve told Chris that he was advised to delete any footage of Amy from his tapes so as not to show her potentially with any crew the night that she disappeared. Now, again, that's speculation on my part. I have no proof of their motives. Chris Fenwick is an extremely credible individual and he's documented every single detail of this at length. And he's actually contacted Steve Smith recently and I don't know what

• 1:25:18Speaker 02

  We're not at the end of what they are discussing at this point. Um, so I don't have any resolution on that story as far as what Steve remembers or doesn't remember. The, that cruise director, um, Detweiler, you know, he's not so popular.

• 1:25:31Derrick Levasseur?

  No, I, I wasn't a fan of him. We hate him. Yeah, I wasn't a fan of him. We had a lot to say about him in our episode.

• 1:25:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, I can tell you that, um, you know, although he stuck to the talking points of she either jumped or fell. Yellow and Oscar, I think, forgot the company line, you know, both of them allude to a crime, by the way. Neither one of them, as easily as they could have said, you know, she jumped or she fell. They allude to, they hope that the family finds the person or the people responsible for this crime. And, and I find that a little bit interesting. Uh, I don't know what I don't know, but I do know what I suspect. And I do know, uh, when I hear, uh, provably false claim over and over again in multiple different ways. And, you know, all of these things combined.

• 1:26:18Speaker 02

  And again, I'll go back to the, the morning. I think it was like three 45 in the morning. We had reboarded the ship after we were told by the authorities, uh, in that harbor that she was not in the water. We said, okay, well, we're not done with that boat then. So we get back on, their attorneys are standing front and center at the time. And we had not yet gotten the FBI through the efforts of my family at home to get on the boat yet, which they subsequently did. So that timeframe, we've all talked about it. And from the time we got back on the boat, so, all right, so she goes missing Tuesday morning, 6:00 AM ish. We get off the boat, 5:00 PM. Um, the next day we get up, we're told she's not in the water. We get on a commercial flight from Curacao to St. Martin.

• 1:27:02Speaker 02

  We beat the boat there, so we have to stay, we have to, you know, spend the night in the hotel. Get up the next morning, take a tender or ferry out to the boat to reboard. So then that's going to be. Thursday morning and so shortly thereafter, the FBI arrived from the the field office in St. Thomas, two guys, no dogs, no team. And again, we talked about the bias that I'll call at least one of the agents got on to that ship with. It's a blur. We don't know really kind of, we can't remember what really happened that day or when the interviews took place. I know the Norwegian consulate got on the boat because that's a Norwegian, they're flying

• 1:27:44Speaker 02

  a Norwegian flag, I think, you know, out of Norway, whatever. And so during those interviews, the ship's attorney sat in on all of the interviews with the Norwegian consulate consulate and the FBI for that matter, once they got on the boat, which I'm pretty sure isn't proper protocol. One of those mornings, you know, we can't sleep, we can't eat, we can't stop crying, we're a mess. My mom and I, you know, in the middle of the night, we decide to get up and we say, okay, let's, let's go retrace potentially where Amy might have gone. We're just kind of like, we don't know what the hell we're doing. So we go out of the room, we take a right, we go towards where the elevators are, which weren't very far, by

• 1:28:27Speaker 02

  the way. And as soon as we get into this little open area where the elevators were, Crystal and Lori, um, running up to us, like, oh, my God, oh, my God. And they're breathing heavy and their eyes are, you know, that's like they, they're white as a ghost, they're, they're pale and they're like, we saw Amy go up the elevator and they're freaking out with yellow and then he came back down by himself. And so we're like, oh, my God, oh, my God. So we go get security. That was the first time that we ever accused yellow or, you know, had any suspicion of yellow, really. Connected him to her disappearance. Yeah.

• 1:29:09Speaker 02

  Didn't have any freaking clue. The intensity of that moment, it wasn't like these girls kind of walked up to us and they're like, yeah, I think we. I think we, you know, we could have seen him go. I mean, they were freaking out. Again, they met Amy. They knew Amy. They met Yellow. They knew Yellow. They met me. They knew me. We were together that night. We were together in the disco. They saw me out on the pool deck. They knew what, I mean, they, they, they knew who the players were and they were, and still are certain. So not only do you have those two that see him go up with her the elevator. They describe what she's wearing, which is the white bodysuit t-shirt that was underneath the yellow shirt and the shorts.

• 1:29:48Speaker 02

  They couldn't see her feet because the way their vantage point, you know, the way the elevator works, they didn't, they couldn't confirm whether she had shoes on or not or what shoes. And then you have Elizabeth Lewis from inside the club saying that they got off the elevator from inside. Went up, Yellow handed her a drink. They go in the back and that's the last she sees of them. And then, you know, of course, the FBI can't be bothered to interview, uh, the most crucial witnesses. Mother to corroborate their timeframe. I don't understand how that even, how that can even happen.

• 1:30:21Stephanie Harlowe?

  I think they kind of felt like it was hearsay because they couldn't validate it with the card swipe. So she could be wrong. She could be off.

• 1:30:28Speaker 02

  But they're not.

• 1:30:28Derrick Levasseur?

  I mean, that, that, that would be the one thing I would say from an investigator's perspective. I don't, I don't doubt them seeing her. If I am being, uh, if I'm being the dissenting opinion here, my, my doubt would come in for the timing because we do know from, from your account and from Yellow's account that they had walked around the deck and they had been up there at the, at the club and the bar. So I don't think anybody's disputing the fact that they, that they saw what they saw. I guess the question is, and it sucks, and I said this in our podcast episode, it sucks that they didn't use their key card. Because then they could basically reverse engineer from there. But to your point, Brad, as you mentioned, mom was up. Mom was in the room and let them in and yet she's never been interviewed.

• 1:31:12Derrick Levasseur?

  So that that's that's the problem right there, but I wanna, I wanna segue to something because I think we, we, we covered that. You definitely got my eyes open to some things to be transparent, and I'm not one to just say that.

• 1:31:24Speaker 02

  Not only did they not corroborate the girl's story by doing that, they never attempted to corroborate.

• 1:31:29Derrick Levasseur?

  That's a problem. I, I, I acknowledge it. That's, I'm not gonna defend it. It's a problem, but for the people out there, including myself, I'm not gonna run from it, that are still more receptive or open to the idea that this could have been a tragic accident. Some of the things that you point to, because you're, you're talking totality of circumstances, saying, hey, Derek, I hear you, but there's too much other stuff that points in a different direction, and I'm following you. But for the people who are gonna point to things like the water, and this is anecdotal from my perspective, I just wanted to talk about it with you here, because I, I don't know if I talked about it in episode four, but with the argument of Amy not being found in that canal, I put this out there, and again, there's anomalies, every case is different, I acknowledge that, no two cases are the same.

• 1:32:15Derrick Levasseur?

  One of the arguments that I made as far as her body not being found, and don't let me forget, Brad, to talk about the jawbone, because that's a big question, and we have to address what you told me in, in the DMs, so don't let me forget that. But the one thing I would push back on with the water, although it's not that deep, although it's not that wide, it's a vast area. I was a diver, I, I wasn't a rescue diver, but I was a diver for many years. All the variables, all the circumstances, visibility, there's a lot of debris down there, there's, there's rocks, there's branches, there's, there's a ton of shit down there, to be honest with you, it's a scary place. And I had given an example in an episode about a woman named Robin Pope.

• 1:32:54Derrick Levasseur?

  And in this case, and I'll make it super quick, she, we believe that she had went off her dock, which was about 10, 15 feet from her backyard. The water around her dock was only nine to 12 feet deep. There was a area of coastline during, in the Chesapeake Bay where she could have been for 23 days. They searched for her with radar, boats, divers. We could not find her. 24th day, she turns up a mile away from her house on the coastline. She washed up on the rocks. Our hypothesis is that she went under, her shirt was torn when we found her. She had been caught on something, gases expanded in her body, and eventually she came loose. And that's how we found her. So I say all that to say,

• 1:33:39Derrick Levasseur?

  I agree with everything that a lot of the people have said, which is more than likely she would have been found. I can't professionally say that it's not possible that unfortunately, if she did go over, whether it's foul play or an accident, I don't think she jumped. I'm not even acknowledging that. That she could have gotten caught on something because buoyancy, when you first go in, may not be there. It may happen over time. So is it possible, again, whether she was thrown in or fell or fell in, that she got caught under something and the divers or the radar missed her? I would not be doing my job if I didn't say that's a possibility at least.

• 1:34:15Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, and I'd also say it's it's it's possible aliens abducted her from the balcony.

• 1:34:21Derrick Levasseur?

  That's that's not fair. I mean, that that's a big, that's a big jump.

• 1:34:25Speaker 02

  It's possible, right? You know, you don't know. So yeah, I hear you. I mean, yeah.

• 1:34:30Stephanie Harlowe?

  I feel like I feel like you and I have had this conversation before, Derek, when you're like, it's possible. And I'm like, so is this?

• 1:34:35Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, I know. But listen, and Brad, I'm not trying to get you to agree with me or not, but as we're sitting here, we're shooting this, I know how you feel. You made a very compelling argument and there's still more of us to talk about, but even if it's foul play, let's say yellow did it. Let's say yellow and Oscar and Reggie are all involved. There's something that happened on the boat and they dumped her in the water. There's still a possibility that her body wouldn't be found.

• 1:34:58Speaker 02

  But when would they do this? All right. She goes, she sees she she is seen in the elevator. I don't know. 5:45, 6 o'clock, let's call it. All right. The boat's docked at 6. Where are they? Where are they throwing her off? And you got a whole crew of people working on the docking process. I've seen videos of how many people are involved in that process, how they have to moor it to the dock and all the all the procedural stuff and the tugboats that are out there pushing the boat. That's not a ghost town out there. So, yeah, I mean,

• 1:35:29Derrick Levasseur?

  It's not. It's not. But the crew members, the crew members would know the blind spots, though. If this is malicious and foul plays involved, they could have wadered down, found an area that they're familiar with, where there's nobody around, and dumped her overboard, knowing she's going to sink to the bottom, and nobody's in an area. And by the way, we already acknowledged, they're monitoring the cameras. They know nobody's monitoring them. So I just put that out there just to say, we might be, and we're going to get into the photo and stuff, but even if it's not an accident, even if it's foul play, she could have went in the water and not been found. These experts that say, oh, she would have been found, I hear you. Nine out of 10 times maybe, but it would be unprofessional to say there are outliers where you can't explain the unexplainable. That's all I'm saying.

• 1:36:14Speaker 02

  I hear you. And it's fair. I mean, it's, yeah, it's possible.

• 1:36:16Derrick Levasseur?

  If they, if they wadered down,

• 1:36:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:18Derrick Levasseur?

  from the lower level,

• 1:36:20Speaker 02

  I find it

• 1:36:20Derrick Levasseur?

  that's it.

• 1:36:21Speaker 02

  I find it highly unlikely that with the amount

• 1:36:24Derrick Levasseur?

  I'm with you.

• 1:36:25Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I'll, I'll send you the video that I have of the docking process and how many people are involved and how many people are out there. Not to mention, the people who are milling around, getting ready for their excursions and sitting on their balconies. And it'd be a pretty damn ballsy thing to do.

• 1:36:40Derrick Levasseur?

  I mean, listen, they bring a pilot.

• 1:36:43Speaker 02

  Huh?

• 1:36:44Derrick Levasseur?

  Royal Caribbean brings a pilot, right? At least on the bigger ships. I've been on a lot of cruises. They'll actually bring a captain out from the island who's specialized in docking. They come out on a boat, or a helicopter, and they come on just to dock the boat. So to your point, it's a big elaborate process. It's not some guy up in the, you know, the, whatever you call that area up there with, behind the wheel, you know, of the, what do they call it? The bridge, right? They're not up there with just one guy doing his thing. So I acknowledge that. There would be people out there, but if it was a random passenger who hurt Amy, very difficult to hide that. But crew members, people who are on the boat all the time, if anybody would know where the blind spots are and what timeframe to do it. They would be the people, right?

• 1:37:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, yeah, and it'd also be the people to remove her via the waterline door access by boat.

• 1:37:35Derrick Levasseur?

  Absolutely. I completely agree. Steffi said something to me in the final episode where, and I corrected her where she said, you know, so you believe she wasn't trafficked? And I said, no, I believe the photo wasn't her. But before I get into the photo, I forgot jawbone. Can you elaborate on the jawbone? Because we were, we had unanswered questions on that. You clarified that for me. So I want to let you, at least talk about the jawbone as it relates to the water.

• 1:38:00Speaker 02

  Yeah. So, yeah, so the jawbone was found in Aruba somewhere. And would you know what year it was? 2010?

• 1:38:07Derrick Levasseur?

  I don't know what year it was, but we left it at, why haven't they tested it yet? Why are there no results? And that's a big question mark. And you were able to answer that for me with proof in the DMs.

• 1:38:17Speaker 02

  It was six different documents, which included email correspondence.

• 1:38:21Derrick Levasseur?

  Yep, I verify them. I saw them.

• 1:38:23Speaker 02

  From the FBI agent at St. Croix, who we sent Amy's dental records to, and they clearly confirm via forensic analysis that that jawbone was compared to Amy's dental records and was

• 1:38:36Derrick Levasseur?

  Not her.

• 1:38:37Speaker 02

  Not her.

• 1:38:37Derrick Levasseur?

  You followed up, you were getting impatient. You're like, hey, we sent it to you, or somebody sent it. Like, what are you guys doing with it? And then finally, they got back to you.

• 1:38:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. And so, yeah, so that was confirmed. And again, you know, people talk about all kinds of wrong stuff online and they run with it and then they, they turn it into fact and it's just not, that was ruled out.

• 1:38:58Derrick Levasseur?

  So we have it here confirmed, that jawbone, not your sister, which leads me to this photo. And I have, I went back and forth with Phil on it. I've talked about it with Stephanie. Before I say anything, what's your opinion on the photo slash photos, which they didn't show on Netflix? Is that your sister in your opinion?

• 1:39:19Speaker 02

  I don't know. I know.

• 1:39:21Derrick Levasseur?

  That's what I've been saying. And people yell at me.

• 1:39:24Speaker 02

  Well, what you say is that it's absolutely not her.

• 1:39:27Derrick Levasseur?

  And I'm gonna, and we're gonna go into it because I do believe 100% it's not her because it goes against the whole theory of why they would put her online. And I feel very strongly about this.

• 1:39:40Speaker 02

  All right. Well, let me, let me tell you how I feel.

• 1:39:43Derrick Levasseur?

  Hit me with it.

• 1:39:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, so. I think it was 2005, you know, there's a lot of years and sightings and I think that's the year we received that picture. And obviously, so that's, you know, if that's correct, then that's seven years after she disappears, we get this email. Holy shit. Like, you know, we've seen, and, and just like with the Netflix series comes out, we get hundreds and hundreds of pictures from, is this her, is this her, is this her? Thank you for your help and I appreciate people's intention to try and be helpful, but no, not even close. No, no, no. Easily no. And this picture, now I will admit, the one picture that they highlight on the series is the most.

• 1:40:25Derrick Levasseur?

  The one that looks like her the most, for sure.

• 1:40:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. And there's a, it's actually two or three more of the whole set that's still like, ah yeah, man, that really.

• 1:40:35Derrick Levasseur?

  They're definitely not as good as that one though, Brad. That one that they show and they highlight, the angle, the lighting, it looks like your sister.

• 1:40:43Speaker 02

  I agree. And it's like, the nose, the eyebrows, the hairline, the ear, the jaw, the teeth, lips, the angle of everything.

• 1:40:50Derrick Levasseur?

  I agree.

• 1:40:51Speaker 02

  And so it's like, oh my God, FBI analysis, and we've got the emails that confirmed the name of the man who was a, you know, forensic artist who did all this stuff, and they confirmed not 100% that it was Amy, but that there was a high probability that it was. Now, there are certain pictures in that where it's, it's not like it's like, that definitely is not her, but it's like, yeah, that doesn't look like her as much. There are certain pictures where all of the tattoos that she has, she's positioned in such a way that you wouldn't be able to see them, but there's other pictures that you

• 1:41:33Speaker 02

  clearly should be able to see where they're, but you don't know if you're looking at her left ankle or her right ankle, or if the picture's flipped.

• 1:41:41Derrick Levasseur?

  I agree.

• 1:41:42Speaker 02

  Totally say that. The left shoulder blade in that one picture where the dip is, you know, I don't know how many people have a dipped in shoulder blade, that's a little bit odd. And we've, and we've determined through AI analysis that there is apparently. Digital noise is how it was explained to me, overlying the areas where her tattoos are. They're working on trying to remove that and I don't know if that can be done or not. So you're looking at the ankle. You think it's her right ankle, but the picture's flipped and might be her left ankle. You're looking at her left shoulder, that might be her right shoulder and her hair is over the Tasmanian devil tattoo. So really hard to tell. I don't know what, if there was or how good Photoshop was back then. I don't know about makeup. I don't know about what, whatever. And no, I, I'm not a hundred percent on the pictures.

• 1:42:27Speaker 02

  None of us are, we can't be. Um, but I can sure tell you over 27 years, those pictures are the closest thing that, that we've ever seen. And, and especially one or two of them are like, there's really not, and it kind of takes the question away out of our heads that it's her. So yeah, I, I mean, I hear what you're saying. It's fair that you think what you think. And I think probably a lot of people do, but.

• 1:42:54Derrick Levasseur?

  Let me, let me elaborate on it because it's not just me just pulling it out of my ass. Right. I talked to a digital expert that I've worked with many times. The number one problem with the digital noise argument that they're saying is this isn't the original photo. This was uploaded online and so it's a copy of a copy. And so you're not going to see the alterations in the upload from that website. It wouldn't be there because it's basically like a, a photocopy of the original photo. So the metadata is not going to show you that. So whoever that person is, I'm not trying to discredit them, but that doesn't even make sense to me from the people that I've spoke with. And I can even bring this person in so you can hear it directly from them. Because ultimately this isn't me proving a point.

• 1:43:36Derrick Levasseur?

  It's me, I get frustrated when people provide you with bullshit information. And whether that's for money or whatever, I don't know the circumstances, but I've heard about some of the things where you guys were taken advantage of. It pisses me off.

• 1:43:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:43:47Derrick Levasseur?

  So there's no skin in the game for me. I, I, I just want to make sure that I'm doing whatever I can to help. So that's the first thing was the, the digital noise or any indication that it was altered. But let's just step back for, from a, for a macro level here, look at it where. I talked in an episode about what human traffickers will, who they'll usually target. It's a disenfranchised, it's people that are not going to be looked for, that their family isn't going to be out there pounding the pavement with their poster everywhere with the FBI looking for them. Human traffickers don't want to be caught. It's bad for business. So to think that they would take Amy, who is not getting the attention she's getting now, but is still being put out there, you guys were out there looking for, that they would plaster her on a website where it would possibly leak back to them.

• 1:44:33Derrick Levasseur?

  Doesn't make a lot of sense on the surface, but even more so, if I acknowledge or at least concede that they altered those pictures. You're going to alter the tattoos, but you're not going to alter her hair or face. Like that to me is the identifiable mark even more than the tattoos. But overall, if I'm involved with this, I'm not putting her online. It's back channels, it's behind the scenes, it's the black market because it's too much of a risk to put her face out there. And as far as the photo itself, to what you said, I don't think it's mirrored, but let's say for this argument it is. Then you wouldn't see the shoulder where the dizzy devil would be on, but you would see the ankle tattoo.

• 1:45:16Derrick Levasseur?

  And conversely, if it's the other way, you would, I think that indentation because that woman is holding her shoulder up. I think it's the delt going into the trap and it's creating that little bit of a shadow as her arms going up with, based on lighting.

• 1:45:29Speaker 02

  There's something that I would like to send to you, if I can find it again, I think I bookmarked it. But there's a guy, there was a guy on TikTok and, you know, I don't know whether it's legit or whether he messed with the picture or whatever. But he basically takes a picture of her ankle where in the photo, you're looking at it and you can't see a tattoo there. And then he goes in and does all these, you know, changes the saturation and this and that, and does all this stuff to the picture. And, and I can show it to you. It basically reveals her ankle tattoo to include.

• 1:46:06Speaker 02

  A good portion of there's a plus sign towards the top of her ankle tattoo and then the M that's on it.

• 1:46:11Derrick Levasseur?

  You you could definitely send it to me and I I am no means an expert in it, but I will say there are people. Unfortunately, and I don't, I haven't seen this Tik Tok, but I'm sure you've been exposed to it too, that will say or do certain things. To get clicks and views.

• 1:46:26Speaker 02

  Well, yeah.

• 1:46:27Derrick Levasseur?

  It's it's.

• 1:46:28Speaker 02

  Of the lady in Curacao with the blonde hair you see from the back walking next to the wall. She's got tattoos. Those people, we found the original photo. There's someone.

• 1:46:37Derrick Levasseur?

  Scumbags.

• 1:46:38Speaker 02

  Tattoos on the woman. Yeah. So, yeah, we know that.

• 1:46:41Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, they're absolute scumbags. Yeah. So that's what that's where I'm at. You have like the shoulder area, then you have the trapezoid area. There could be a shadow there. Overall, what I will say is I don't believe it's your sister. But to me, what's even more telling is that you and your mom are not 100% sure either. I have two young daughters. They're 12 and nine. I'd like to think regardless of how much time has passed, if I saw them, even if they've aged. There would be no doubt in my mind. I don't, you might disagree. You've been through it. I I haven't been.

• 1:47:11Speaker 02

  But what I'd say is we all believe that that is her. We feel like it is her and looks like her.

• 1:47:19Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay.

• 1:47:19Speaker 02

  But we can't honestly say we know 100% that it's her. That's that was the point of me saying, you know, we aren't 100%.

• 1:47:26Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay, fair enough. I'm not going to dispute it.

• 1:47:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, we do feel like it is and and, you know, I I understand what you're saying um and and how you feel.

• 1:47:35Derrick Levasseur?

  What what do you feel about my argument that if they did traffic her, whether it's yellow, whether it's someone else that we haven't identified yet? What would be the rationale when the frigging FBI and you guys are looking for and putting all this money toward it? What would be the rationale behind putting her on a website that everyone can view?

• 1:47:53Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know. I'm not.

• 1:47:55Derrick Levasseur?

  Wouldn't be very smart.

• 1:47:56Speaker 02

  No, it wouldn't be very smart. I don't think these guys are a. Our Harvard scholars.

• 1:48:00Derrick Levasseur?

  They're not, they're not. Real quickly, because it kind of segues into it. What do you think about this, this theory that there's another woman out there named Jas, AKA Susan, whatever, who's pretending to be Amy because it's gonna get her more money?

• 1:48:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, I heard about that. I don't, I don't know that I know anything about this Susan that I heard you guys talk about. This is, this is new to me, so I don't, I don't know about it.

• 1:48:24Derrick Levasseur?

  I found it, it was on, and I could direct you towards it, it was on Reddit. I think your, your friend, James Renner there, actually, James, is it Renner, the last one, last name? Yeah. He had interviewed someone who potentially knew this woman. The only reason I brought it up is because I, when I was undercover, we did a lot of sex worker stings and John stings. And what we found, I used to pretend I was the John in some cases. What these women would do is they'd give you a story. You know, I gotta pay the electric bill, I got, you know, bills to pay at home, I need food. If you can give me, you know, a couple hundred bucks, that's gonna help me, you know, over this hump. And one of the stories was from that Navy officer or whoever, who I'm not a fan of, to be honest with you, just if that's what he heard in coming forward all these years later.

• 1:49:07Derrick Levasseur?

  And he was kind of like laughing in the interview. I didn't, I didn't like it, I didn't like it. But, um, the story that he told that this woman had said, I'm Amy Bradley, you know, for 200, you know, I owe them 200 bucks, they have my papers. To me, it sounded like a, a money grab. And I, my suspicion is that this woman we're seeing in these photos, who absolutely knew that she looked like your sister, was trying to generate income off of it because for these sickos out there, they would enjoy and get gratification out of knowing this is a woman who was kidnapped and, and is a missing woman. Cause there's some sick MFers out there, if you know what I mean. So, some people might play into it. Do I have anything to confirm that?

• 1:49:50Derrick Levasseur?

  No, but it is a working suspicion that I have, which would explain her putting out these photos. Looking like your sister, but not exactly. Again, hypothesis, nothing to substantiate it.

• 1:50:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, I can't say that's not a plausible theory. I think there's a million of them. Um, and, and I can tell you, you know, over the past 27 years, my mind's gone through every scenario you could possibly think of. And, uh, it's, it's, um, it's a tough thing, but, you know, whether, you know, and obviously, we don't know if she's alive, we hope that she is. We have a gut feeling. That we feel that she is, and I can't, I can't make sense of that or explain that to people to make it make sense. It's just something that we have always all shared and it's never gone away. Uh, maybe that's just the level of hope that we've lived with for 27 years that creates that feeling. I don't know.

• 1:50:46Speaker 02

  But that's, that's, that's the way that we feel. I don't know whether it's a an intuition type of thing, or whether it's just false hope. Uh, I can't tell you. When we started this whole thing, or I'll just speak for myself after the series came out, and again, it was the first time in 25 years where everybody, well, first time ever, everybody around the world is interested in it. And, and potentially the last time. So I still feel that whether or not Amy is out there or not, let's play devil's advocate and say that she's not. Um, we're still not going to believe the jumped over, fell over, ran away

• 1:51:30Speaker 02

  theories. We still think that someone did something to her. We're still never going to stop trying to hold the people or person responsible for that accountable. And this whole thing, and I've, I've had this feeling since we first started, depends on somebody that knows something coming forward and saying something. Because not just one person knows something. I think there are quite a few people that know something and, you know, 27 years is an awful long time to keep a secret. We were begging and pleading that one person out there that knows something needs to come forward and, and maybe we don't find Amy. Maybe we aren't able to find enough evidence or have this re-investigated to the point where the perpetrators are uh, held to account.

• 1:52:16Speaker 02

  But maybe, uh, we can affect some positive change uh, in the arena of new legislation, something that uh, changes the way that jurisdictional laws and barriers to these sovereign countries works to potentially try.

• 1:52:32Speaker 02

  And help prevent this from happening to someone else and someone else's family. I hear your argument about this not being jazz and it's all a farce and maybe it's someone else pretending to be her for extra money or whatever.

• 1:52:44Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, by the way, and that doesn't rule out the trafficking theory. It just means someone's capitalizing on it. That's all, that's all it would indicate.

• 1:52:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, and sure, that's possible. But, you know, I, I think that it's clear in my mind, the people that I think were involved in what happened to Amy did what they did. And I don't know exactly what they did, but I don't, I don't believe any of the other BS about her going in the water. Um, you know, we have three eyewitnesses that see her that morning with yellow in the club or going up to the club. And then in the club, we have an eyewitness we haven't talked about yet, um, uh, named David Carmichael from Canada, who saw this girl who, and he's identified yellow to the FBI, uh, through a lineup of the, one of the guys he saw with her. His diving partner confirmed her belly button and her, uh, the lizard, the gecko tattoo around her navel.

• 1:53:35Speaker 02

  David Carmichael spoke about a men's Dos Equis watch that had never been discussed or revealed in anything. It's not something we even ever thought about or talked about to any person ever.

• 1:53:48Derrick Levasseur?

  Was she wearing that watch in the video?

• 1:53:50Speaker 02

  I think so, yeah. I think so.

• 1:53:52Derrick Levasseur?

  I'm always skeptical of people. Uh, this is, I'm a cynic in that thing, so I'm always trying to prove them as liars first before I believe them. There's just a lot of people in my career who've come forward, who seem like they want to help, but I'm not disputing David or anything. I'm just, I'm wondering if anybody would have had access to that information without it being disclosed to them. That's all.

• 1:54:12Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I can't, I can't confirm because I, I wasn't paying attention. I didn't, I, I see in the pictures that she has a watch on. I don't know if that was watch. We don't have the watch. So, and, uh, apparently my parents remember her bringing that on the cruise. So I don't know for sure whether that was the watch she had on that night. I, I can't tell you that, but

• 1:54:34Derrick Levasseur?

  Okay.

• 1:54:34Speaker 02

  I, I find that. You know, an interesting detail that I think a lot of people don't know about and David Carmichael has been adamant, he's 100% sure. And then you have the Barbados sighting and you have the San Francisco sighting and that gets all into the Alfred Cotton story and the Margarita Island and the, you know, the, the sex worker thing that he and his wife probably plead down to a, a five-year probation for some information that they volunteered on someone else. We don't have that information either. That's kind of a, that's a, that's a pretty convoluted story and I, I honestly haven't memorized all the details well enough to, to talk about it intelligently. But yeah, I, I understand your devil's advocacy, but I think at some point when you have

• 1:55:18Speaker 02

  a certain amount of information that points in a certain direction, you gotta stop playing that game to, at a point.

• 1:55:26Derrick Levasseur?

  So my, my final words on it, and it wasn't about proving right or wrong. I think the thing we'd be in agreement on, and I'm gonna let Stephanie wrap this up, is we both want the same thing. I started off saying it. I, I know family, I don't care what, what has happened before, what has happened after, deserves to go through what you guys have gone through. Not knowing what happened to your loved one. It's something that we should never accept. And unfortunately, let's just be honest. The reason Netflix decided to cover this story is because it is a true mystery, right? Like, there's not enough there. If it was clear cut what happened to your sister, they would have had no interest in it. It's that, it's the fact that we don't know is why they were interested in it. And yeah, they want to help, but ultimately it's a good story

• 1:56:10Derrick Levasseur?

  where they knew that people were gonna be on here going through it and speculating. That's what it is. But there are people that really want to help you. All I will say is you have my number now. If there's anything I could do, anything you want to bounce off me, I'm here. I'm not a skeptic in the sense that I don't believe it's possible. I said it in our final episode. For me, I think both are still on the table, although I will acknowledge, and I've always said it, that the witness testimony, the sightings on the island, the, the fact that nobody knows anything as far as where we are now, the fact that there was Desi, there's other people. It's a lot and some, a lot of the times where there's smoke, there's fire. And yellow has not been consistent. So I acknowledge all that because I'm not his defense attorney. I want to find out what happened, whoever it was.

• 1:56:53Speaker 02

  He's not only not been consistent, he's been lying his ass off. And I've said many times, if- You're telling the truth, you got nothing to hide. What are you lying for?

• 1:57:02Derrick Levasseur?

  I'm with you. The only, the only pushback I would give is, and I don't know Yellow. I don't, I don't give a shit about Yellow. Is he lying because he was involved? Is he lying because he's a scumbag who is doing stuff like this all the time and Royal Caribbean was after him or whatever? I don't know. I'm not going to defend the guy. He clearly wasn't a, an upstanding person. The question is, why is he lying? We know he's lying.

• 1:57:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:57:26Derrick Levasseur?

  Why?

• 1:57:26Speaker 02

  Why don't we get, why don't?

• 1:57:27Derrick Levasseur?

  That's the million dollar question.

• 1:57:28Speaker 02

  Why don't we make the call for old Yellow and old Oscar and, uh, any other players you want to get? And let's all sit down to a fresh set of polygraphs with new AI technology and all. Let's have a conversation.

• 1:57:41Derrick Levasseur?

  Love that. Crime Weekly will pay for it.

• 1:57:43Speaker 02

  And why wouldn't you agree to it if you, if you're innocent and you could easily clear your name by doing it? So let's do it.

• 1:57:49Derrick Levasseur?

  I'm all for that. I'm all for that. And I would also say also just more of an easier thing to do without even technology. Hey, Yellow, who came to your room that morning? That's all I need. I need a name. We'll go talk to them and poly them. Now we start to reverse engineer. Who was involved and how deep does it run and who can corroborate or discredit these stories? That doesn't even take a polygraph. That's just following the leads.

• 1:58:12Speaker 02

  I mean, the FBI can't question him apparently unless he agrees to it currently, as it stands.

• 1:58:17Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, there's private, there's independent investigators. My firm would do it. My firm would pay for the polygraph. We would interview and we wouldn't, we would do a statement analysis. We would cover that. The floor is out there just like it was when we said, hey, if Brad wants to come on. We want to get you the answers. I don't know what those answers are going to be. But we got it. We got to get you some answers. There's no reason that we should have 900 million downloads for a show. And you and your mom and your dad should be left right where you started. That's not justice. There should be some movement in this case, even if it's not the answers you want. There should be something. That's where I'm at. As a father, there's got to be something.

• 1:58:53Stephanie Harlowe?

  So did you say the FBI will not interview him?

• 1:58:57Speaker 02

  It's not that they're, they would refuse to interview him as far as I understand. They've told us that they cannot interview him unless he agrees to it. And he ain't doing that. He'll agree to

• 1:59:10Stephanie Harlowe?

  Okay.

• 1:59:10Speaker 02

  Softball from James Renner, uh, who, you know, portends to be on his side as a perpetrator sympathizer. Um, and someone who, uh, attacks and slanders victims' families to, to sell a book, but he won't agree to be re-investigated or re-interviewed by, uh, a new team of FBI agents. Maybe, maybe, uh, Derek, maybe you can get him to agree to it. Um, I'd like to get you

• 1:59:33Derrick Levasseur?

  Open invitation.

• 1:59:35Speaker 02

  I'd like to get you in touch with

• 1:59:36Derrick Levasseur?

  Open invitation, we'll

• 1:59:38Speaker 02

  And, um, and see what you guys can come

• 1:59:40Derrick Levasseur?

  I'm game.

• 1:59:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:59:41Derrick Levasseur?

  And I have the polygraph examiners. We can do a statement analysis. If he's willing to do it, we can have it unedited. We don't even have to record it. We can just report back on it. We don't need it. You know, it's, it's one of those things where if he's willing to do it, all for it, all for it.

• 1:59:56Stephanie Harlowe?

  I do find it interesting that he would be willing to sit down with

• 2:00:01Stephanie Harlowe?

  an investigative journalist, but not willing to be re-interviewed by the FBI, because if this is about clearing your name and getting your reputation unsullied, why wouldn't you go the more like legal authoritative route?

• 2:00:18Speaker 02

  So, uh, I, I guarantee you, so, you know, James Renner's whole thing is that our family did not support or accept sexuality. Therefore, he's, that's, that's why she killed herself. And it's bullshit. It's a hundred, it was none of that. Um, now, one more thing I'll mention before I go on that rant. In, in Yellow's interview, he also states that Amy told him that my, my dad forced her to come

• 2:00:48Stephanie Harlowe?

  He was forced to go on the cruise. Yeah.

• 2:00:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, he found out she was gay three years earlier. Um, and I wonder who planted that seed in Yellow's, uh, head before the interview. Um, ask yourself that.

• 2:01:01Stephanie Harlowe?

  I didn't believe it. I didn't believe it because I remember Amy's friends saying she was excited to go on the cruise.

• 2:01:07Speaker 02

  Another bold-faced lie. Um, there's absolutely no truth to that. There was no contention whatsoever. There was no argument on the balcony. I have no idea where that stupid story came from. Dad did not, now, he did come back up to the club to check on us. Um, and I don't know if you've seen this part of the story. Um, Dad, he's not sure exactly what time it was. We, we don't, we didn't get full access to all the key card data. He thinks it was sometime between 2:30 and 3:00. He goes up there because I was a dan- you know, I was dancing with a bunch of people and apparently I started dancing with this guy's wife. I have no idea. And the guy comes up to my face like, you know, gives me crap and I walk over to dad and I'm like, dude,

• 2:01:47Speaker 02

  this guy just almost got me. Um, so dad goes to bed. We're out, you know, three hours after. They go in, he wakes up, we're not there. He's like, yeah, let me go check on my son. Maybe he's been beaten in the dance club.

• 2:02:02Speaker 02

  Comes up there, he checks on us. He did not, we did not walk back to the room with him. He did not make us come back to the room. He went back to the room by himself. We came in later. Yeah. So there's a lot of, there's a lot of BS uh, stories out there that people think, but.

• 2:02:17Derrick Levasseur?

  You know, like I said, a lot of people clicks and views, man.

• 2:02:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, but.

• 2:02:20Derrick Levasseur?

  Clicks and views.

• 2:02:21Speaker 02

  Now getting back to Renner's whole deal, you know, he, he, and I think the reason that he is able to get these interviews is because he sides with the suspects and he says, hey, man. I'll tell you what happened. Her family hated her because she was gay, so she killed herself. So I'm here to help you. Um, let's talk about it.

• 2:02:39Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, I, I don't even mind if he does that. If once he gets him on record, he, he, you know, I've done that to get the interview, the interrogation and then you turn it on him. But yeah, you gotta, you gotta be unbiased. You gotta be objective.

• 2:02:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. If you do any research on um, his pattern of uh, behavior o- over time, this is his MO. It's, it's what he does in almost every case he covers.

• 2:02:58Derrick Levasseur?

  Oh, I, I see you guys going at it. I'm like, I'm playing Switzerland. That's why I'm glad we got you on, you know, it's, there's no incentive here. We'll see where it goes. I mean, like I said, we're available. I know Stephanie's gonna wrap it up, but I, we're available. Anything we can do to help. I'm glad you came on. We've talked for over, over two hours. And I think you cleared up a lot of things. I think people are going to be enlightened by what you had to say. And this is what it's all about, like respectful discourse, because we're not in echo chambers. We're all going for the same goal. And it's important not to have everyone on the same path, because if you do, you're all going to come to the same conclusion and it's not necessarily the right one. So to have a fresh set of eyes, to have an open conversation, an open dialogue.

• 2:03:40Derrick Levasseur?

  That's how you offer alternate theories and maybe alternate ideas on how to solve the problem. And maybe one of them works. That's how it's supposed to be done.

• 2:03:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I appreciate you, man. I don't have your background or your experience with what you do. I think you're, I think you're fair uh, with, with, with your. With what you say, um, you know, I don't have answers to um, some of your questions and nor can I, you know, but I, I think it's, they're fair questions to ask. I think you gotta ask all the questions. I might disagree with some of your points and some of your positions, but that doesn't mean they're not, you know, you're not entitled to them, you know?

• 2:04:18Derrick Levasseur?

  I respect it. I respect it.

• 2:04:20Speaker 02

  Appreciate y'all having me on and I'm happy to, I'm happy to do it anytime.

• 2:04:23Stephanie Harlowe?

  At the end of the day, both Derek and I were talking when we were having the connection issues and you had to go and recharge your phone. How, we were saying how much we respect you because, I mean, we understand to a much like smaller scale, what it's like to be in the public eye and have people feel free to speculate on like your personal life and all of this stuff and, and what, what you and your parents are going through with, you know, not only losing Amy, but putting yourselves out there year after year after year in order to keep the awareness of, of her being missing alive. And you keep putting yourselves out there for anybody to pick apart and make speculations

• 2:05:05Stephanie Harlowe?

  and say things, like you said, people say things and couldn't be further from the truth, but you can't combat every one of those and these things spread around. To have the, you know, the ability to come and sit and talk to us, knowing that once again, you're putting yourself out there, opening yourself up to speculation, opening yourself up to criticism and, and keeping it really respectful and mature and open-minded. Even if you might come in defensively, it's just, we have so much respect for you. We appreciate that so much and none of, so very few people in this world can understand what you've experienced and what you continue to experience.

• 2:05:46Stephanie Harlowe?

  That is, you know, it's unfortunately you have to be in this, this minority of people who have been through this and not one person who's saying anything about this case or saying anything about speculations, including James Renner and, and Yello, have had to go through what you're currently going through. And so it's never going to be um, something they can understand. We cannot understand it, but I think it's every- Every parent, every brother, every sister's greatest fear. And you have, you know, conducted yourself so professionally and, and just, you know, really, really respectfully during this. And we do appreciate that because we never know what, what to expect going into these things. We don't know you. We don't know what we're,

• 2:06:29Stephanie Harlowe?

  what we're facing, but you were great. Thank you for answering our questions. Thank you for listening to our questions. Thank you for trying to be open-minded about things that I know is very difficult to even consider because like you said, this is all the hope you have left. And so whatever we can do, whatever Crime Weekly can do, if there's new information, you want us to share it on socials, if there's a call for information and you want people to answer things, we will do that for you, anything that we can do because we want to understand what happened to Amy. And if she is still out there, obviously we would like to know that too. So, anything we can do to help, you have, you have our respect. We are, you know, we're, we would try to do anything we could for you. And, and

• 2:07:13Stephanie Harlowe?

  if we could get yellow, if you know how to contact him.

• 2:07:15Speaker 02

  Well, if James does, I bet he won't give you his number though.

• 2:07:18Stephanie Harlowe?

  No, he won't.

• 2:07:19Derrick Levasseur?

  I'll tell you what, I'll tell you what, I'll say it right here on record. I'm gonna reach out to him. I've never spoken to the guy before, but I feel, I don't think it's gonna work, but I'll reach out to James. He's probably gonna see this clip. I'll reach out to him.

• 2:07:30Speaker 02

  Yeah, um, you know, I appreciate that, Stephanie. Um, yeah, it's, it's hard to explain to people, um, what, you know, what our life been like. Um, obviously, I have a wonderful wife. I have a wonderful life. Um, I have the best parents in the world. Life is good, you know? I got a great job. I got a lot of, you know, tons of friends and family. I don't wanna paint a picture like I'm, you know, huddled in a corner crying for the last 27 years. I mean, we, we, we have to live our life too. I try to be professional about it and mature about it, but you know, uh, sometimes I have weak moments and sometimes, um... You know, some nastiness gets to me to a point where,

• 2:08:13Speaker 02

  you know, I'm not going to tolerate so much idiocy. It's tough to stay above the fray 24 hours a day when you got a bunch of morons saying some of the most vile disgusting things that that a person could say to a victim's family or about a victim's family. It's just, it's just horrible.

• 2:08:30Stephanie Harlowe?

  Totally agree, but I feel like you know who you are.

• 2:08:32Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. And I've, at no point have attempted to deceive anybody. I've, I've never been dishonest. Uh, yeah, maybe we don't have perfect times and we're off five minutes or 10 minutes or something like that. And, you know, we're not making shit up. I mean, we're, we, we do the best we can. Deceiving the public by any measure helps us none. We've been as honest and as forthcoming and I will continue to be, uh, as we can possibly be. And, um, you know, people are gonna think what they're gonna think, no matter what you do. And, and you have no control over that. So those-

• 2:09:12Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, people are gonna people.

• 2:09:13Speaker 02

  Yeah. The haters are unimportant and insignificant, uh, to, to what we're trying to do. And, you know, I guess I would ask for you guys' help potentially with some outreach to these islands. And, uh, you know, Curacao's been awful quiet. Barbados, we don't hear, uh, anything from those people. Uh, Aruba, you know, everybody's like a clam over there. Um, and I don't know whether they're afraid of the law enforcement that's corrupt or, um, or cartels that work through those islands and have people on payrolls or what. I don't get it.

• 2:09:47Derrick Levasseur?

  I also think it's also tourist stuff, right? Like, these people make a living on tourism. And so if these islands start to get a black eye, people don't want to visit.

• 2:09:54Speaker 02

  Well, they got a black eye.

• 2:09:56Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah.

• 2:09:58Speaker 02

  Yeah. So, and, and it's no secret. I mean, I think we all know how many billions of dollars worth of drugs go through those islands. You know, so it's, um, it's a, you know, human trafficking is not a conspiracy theory. Um, you know, it is a very real global crisis. Um, unfortunately, there's a lot of children involved in it. I don't believe it's strictly female, uh, either. I think there's, there's boys and, and young men that are involved in it. And people think, just like they think about my story, "Yeah, that's done. That stuff doesn't really happen. That happens to other people. Happens to thousands and thousands of people all the time." And, you know, if people are serious in our, in our government about combating human trafficking,

• 2:10:43Speaker 02

  whether or not, Derek, that, that is what Amy fell subject to. Where's the change? Where, where, where are the laws and the, and the bills that are being passed to affect the changes, not only to, let's say, for instance, pass a bill to require all cruise lines to maintain archived, recorded footage permanently on their ships, instead of having these bullshit monitoring cameras, whether that's the truth or not? Why don't we change treaties so that our government has the authority and the ability to investigate crimes that, that happen in a different country?

• 2:11:21Derrick Levasseur?

  And involve American citizens? Absolutely.

• 2:11:23Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so, you know, let's see, let's see some change. And again, obviously, first and foremost, if Amy's out there, that's our, that's our goal, to find her. If she's not, our next goal is to, is to hold someone accountable for what happened, because I think we all have a pretty good idea of whether we can dance around it or play devil's advocate here or there. I think we all have a pretty good idea who was involved, at least in the, in the beginning stages of whatever happened. Where's the accountability? Where's the justice for Amy? Where's, where's our justice? There is and hasn't been any. So, if y'all can help get this message to these islands, or help us with some social media outreach to these places and these people, whatever you can think of.

• 2:12:07Speaker 02

  I mean, obviously, we don't have all the ideas in the world. I, I can't tell you how many times on TikTok and X, someone suggests something, and it's like... Oh my God, how did I not think of that, you know?

• 2:12:18Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, well, that's why they should, that's why the FBI should be more open by now with their investigation, because we could crowdsource.

• 2:12:25Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, I agree.

• 2:12:26Stephanie Harlowe?

  And come up with ideas that haven't been come up with before.

• 2:12:28Derrick Levasseur?

  Twenty-seven years is cold. It's, the case is cold.

• 2:12:31Stephanie Harlowe?

  I don't know what, what kind of process you would take to sort of demand that they do, or say, you know, Brit, maybe bring it to the Supreme Court or something. I don't know what that process is. We can look into it. But they, they need to be answering as to why they don't want to release those files even to the family, even in a redacted form.

• 2:12:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, alright, so if you're not gonna do anything anyway, let's close the case and.

• 2:12:54Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, they're not doing anything, man. They're not, we said this about Brittany Drexel too, remember? That it was unsolved and cold for so long and they wouldn't open the case files and let, you know, people look and, and see what's going on and see if they have other options.

• 2:13:07Derrick Levasseur?

  Rule it accidental. Close it.

• 2:13:10Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah.

• 2:13:11Derrick Levasseur?

  Rule it an accidental death. Close it. And then you guys get the access to the files.

• 2:13:15Stephanie Harlowe?

  But why aren't they doing that? And I, I wonder if it's because there was mistakes made in the FBI investigation that they don't want to be made public.

• 2:13:24Derrick Levasseur?

  Only one way to know is if you got the reports. It's the only way. And at this point, yeah, it should absolutely be closed. They, they won't do it, more than likely. They won't.

• 2:13:31Stephanie Harlowe?

  Which is weird.

• 2:13:32Speaker 02

  Like to see happen. Um, uh, uh, we've got, uh, some meetings coming up and I, I won't share quite yet with who. Um, I'd like to see the case closed. Release the grand jury testimony, release the FBI files via FOIA requests that we've made. Um, and reopen the case with, with a new team. Uh, so that, that's kind of the ultimate goal here. Um, we'd love to get this in front of President Trump. I, I know people. And I'm not trying to be political. I, I, I feel, um, deep in my bones, the man gets things done. Um, and if, if we can get it in front of him, we've been tagging Bongino and Cash Patel and all these people, Pam Bondi, relentlessly. And I don't know whether they're just not seeing it or whether they have more important things to do.

• 2:14:18Speaker 02

  Um, but if we can, if we can get some help to make something happen, you know, I don't think, I don't think, uh, You know, Trump gives a rip about jurisdiction laws in Grenada or Barbados.

• 2:14:29Derrick Levasseur?

  Where could people find you if they have any information they want to contact you, Brad?

• 2:14:33Speaker 02

  So first and foremost, you know, the email, Amy Bradley is missing at gmail dot com. Her website, there's a ton of information on there that would save me a lot of time from some of the questions I have to answer repeatedly at Amy Bradley is missing dot com. The tip line via telephone is eight oh four seven eight nine four Amy, which is eight oh four seven eight nine four two six nine. And then, you know, my X page is at B R A D R A D five Bradley, B R A D L E Y. So Brad rad five Bradley. And then my Tik Tok is at Amy Bradley is missing. You know, there's a YouTube page where I did some Tik Tok lives. It's called at Amy Bradley is missing on YouTube.

• 2:15:19Speaker 02

  You can find, now I don't really, I'm still trying to figure out how to work Tik Tok.

• 2:15:24Derrick Levasseur?

  Likewise, right there with you.

• 2:15:26Speaker 02

  But on X, I've posted every single interview I've done, posted a lot of additional information and documents and pictures and all kinds of things. And I wish people would take the time to kind of pour through that. I think it proves a lot of points and people just go on what they hear around the rumor mill on Tik Tok and all these videos that are wrong a bunch of times, you know, go check out Stormy C underscore spirit on Tik Tok. That dude's money. He, he's done some really good videos, really accurate things.

• 2:16:00Derrick Levasseur?

  That's a Tik Tok you sent me.

• 2:16:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:16:02Stephanie Harlowe?

  Yeah, I've seen him a few times.

• 2:16:03Speaker 02

  Much more so than I've seen a level of accuracy on other people's information they're putting out, not that, not that there aren't other good people doing things, but.

• 2:16:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's a, I appreciate your offer to help. I'll be in touch with you. Anything I have, anything you come up with, please.

• 2:16:23Derrick Levasseur?

  I'm gonna reach out to James Renner. I don't know him personally. I don't know if he'll respond to me, but I think that'd be the starting point because what I would like is the name of the person who woke Yellow up.

• 2:16:32Speaker 02

  Yellow, it depends on which interview you go to because all his interviews tell different bullshit. So he's got, the one with Renner, he says the hotel manager called him. We have a crew list. I can tell you who the hotel manager is. That's who called him. I don't know who he claims came to his room on the CNN interview. I don't know who Oscar is saying.

• 2:16:53Stephanie Harlowe?

  That CNN interview was like 2015 as well, by the way.

• 2:16:56Speaker 02

  I don't know who Oscar is claiming came to his room. Security came to their room at 3 to 4 a.m. Hotel manager called Yellow at 7 a.m. Now at 6 a.m., 10 years ago, someone came to their room again. Um, so, you know, Derek, Stephanie, they're, they're clearly lying, um, multiple times, and we can prove every one of them. And their, and their time discrepancies aren't minor. They're like glaringly, obviously false.

• 2:17:24Stephanie Harlowe?

  Oh, for, for sure. I mean, we pointed that out in the last episode. It's like, all right, two and a half hours. Where the hell were you?

• 2:17:29Derrick Levasseur?

  Yeah, something, something's not passing the smell test for sure. So I'll reach out with that.

• 2:17:34Speaker 02

  Derek, she, she didn't fall over. She didn't jump over. If something, if she ended up in the water at any point, whether it was at that island or whether they hit her and dumped her on the way to St. Martin, someone did something. And those two guys are the key to it. And, and, and the closest you're gonna find to who's responsible for this. But again, I'm gonna go back. I can send you pictures of those water level doors. Um, I can, um, I swear to you that morning, there was a lot of activity on the backside. That whole dance entourage that came on the boat in Aruba, that was a large group of people. All right, where did those people go? And you'll see in Stormy's video, he talks about downline.

• 2:18:16Stephanie Harlowe?

  It was like a dance troupe, like a, like a dance troupe.

• 2:18:18Speaker 02

  First, it was fire jugglers. It was whatever. All the people that came on to perform, they weren't of the ship's employee and they weren't passengers. This big entourage of people came on the boat on Aruba. Now where did they get off? They get off during that downline disembarkation on the backside via ferry, you know, those back doors. I saw, when I saw that happening, I saw vehicles with men standing over on the land. I saw boats, I saw jet skis, I saw mid-sized boats, I saw them remove large containers, I saw them deliver um, all kinds of things and I'm standing there watching it. I mean, I literally could have watched the boat Amy was taken away on.

• 2:18:57Derrick Levasseur?

  Oh yeah, we, we talked about it in episode one. Plenty of opportunity. If you wanted to smuggle somebody off the boat, you definitely could.

• 2:19:03Stephanie Harlowe?

  Oh yeah.

• 2:19:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, and that, and people think she walked off or they took her off the gangplank on the taxi side on, that didn't happen that way.

• 2:19:10Derrick Levasseur?

  No shot, no shot, no shot, she walked off the boat.

• 2:19:13Speaker 02

  And I'll close with this. Yellow went up that elevator, that elevator with Amy, he was seen.

• 2:19:20Speaker 02

  He was seen coming off the elevator in the disco by a third eyewitness that testified in the grand jury. He handed her off after he handed her a dark drink, took her to the back where the cruise service elevator was. Whoever was waiting there to take her down and hold her. And then when those doors opened in the morning, you know, again, via the same way they get drugs and shit on that boat, they, they have a bunch of, you know, corrupt and criminal people working on those boats that do all that stuff. And that's, that's firmly how I believe they got her off the boat that morning.

• 2:19:53Stephanie Harlowe?

  I have looked into that. You're absolutely right. The cruise ships, especially back then, did not do their due diligence, not, no background checks or weak background checks for employees. Um, people would sometimes be working on the cruise ships and then get off and never come back. And it was like, oh, that person's just gone, but yeah, it's, this is why I've never been on a cruise. I don't feel safe. So uh, definitely a lot of things that could happen and your jurisdiction issue because you're floating in a floating city in the middle of the water and nobody wants to take responsibility when something like this happens.

• 2:20:26Speaker 02

  You got it.

• 2:20:28Speaker 02

  I don't know how many billions of dollars worth of coke and whatever comes through those islands. And, and, and mind you, Curseau, Aruba, Vonaire, all that's right off the coast of Venezuela. So all that stuff can easily be transported there. There's plenty of places boats can come and go without being checked. Those boats, those cruise ships, I, I, I don't know. I think it's a fact, drugs are moved in there, people are arrested, drugs are found, all kinds of kilos that crew members are arrested with. They move drugs through those boats. How do you think they get drugs on that boat without the harbor chief? Uh, or the chief of the harbor police being aware of it? Because he's on the tank. How do you think the, the, uh, people on the island and the police officials who we've since found out are corrupt?

• 2:21:12Speaker 02

  How do you think all that stuff happens without them knowing about it? If I were in the cartel and I was-

• 2:21:16Stephanie Harlowe?

  Well, that's a tale as old as time. Yeah, of course.

• 2:21:19Speaker 02

  In the cartel and I said, hmm. Who do I want? To threaten to be on my payroll? I think I'm gonna pick the guy who writes the, uh, and, and potentially falsifies his, uh, falsifies the, uh, security reports. Let's get him on our team. You know, just something to think about, you know, I, I don't know. And that's all, that's all speculation and, um, maybe just a bunch of bullshit, but it's, it certainly does, uh, make sense. Um, you know, if you're, if you're gonna infiltrate, uh, these boats with crew from different islands and, um, you'd need someone like that on your side who wasn't really trying to do a good job at, uh, securing the vessel.

• 2:21:58Derrick Levasseur?

  Like with all these cases, more questions than answers, that's for sure. But we're here to support you. Whatever you need, we'll, uh, we'll, we'll be here. We hope at minimum. This is almost a three hour interview. So thank you for taking the time to sit down and go over as much as we did. We could probably do another three hours. You guys know Brad's on X. Brad, what's your handle one more time?

• 2:22:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's B R A D R A D five, the number five at, uh, and then B R A D L E Y. So Brad, rad. I've Brad.

• 2:22:29Derrick Levasseur?

  Well, we hope that we, whether it's through us or someone else, we hope that there's movement in this case, whether that's just the FBI closing it and giving you guys access to those reports and having a new team look at it. There needs to be movement in this case. We hope that there is. Thank you so much for sitting down with us. It was a great discussion. Guys, weigh in down in the comments below. Let us know what you think. Where do you stand on this one? What can we do to help? Give us some ideas. And we will, if there's an update in the case, we will be more than happy to cover it here. We hope that there is. Brad, thank you again so much.

• 2:22:58Speaker 02

  Hello, welcome. Thank you.

• 2:22:59Derrick Levasseur?

  Guys, everyone have a good night. Stay safe out there. We'll see you next week.