Episode 200: The Mob Dumps Trash All Over Naples

i'm the trashman. i throw trash all over---all over the ring Our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/wtyppod/ Send us stuff! our address:Well There's Your Podcasting CompanyPO Box 26929 Philadelphia, PA 19134DO NOT SEND US LETTER BOMBS thanks in advance in the commercial: Local Forecast - Elevator Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/ that's right folks sam put together SOURCES: (remind me to link these when we get the doc together - roz)

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Speaker 00

  My favorite, my favorite piece of podcast fan art I've ever gotten was when I posted a picture of Burt looking down concerned and somebody edited him into the I dropped the socket guy.

• 0:12Liam McAnderson?

  Oh.

• 0:14Justin Roczniak?

  That was really good.

• 0:15Speaker 00

  So funny.

• 0:17November Kelly?

  We, someone, someone.

• 0:18Justin Roczniak?

  We got so much, we got so much fan art.

• 0:21November Kelly?

  We got so many good designs that I have yet to upload to the store, but rest assured that I will be, um, it's fine. I will get around to it eventually. That's also sort of the reason why we haven't recorded an episode in six or seven years is because I, I myself have been going through it. So I apologize. Also, also we should sync the recording.

• 0:42Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, but, but no, no, I've been going through it and by it, I mean California, Nevada, Utah.

• 0:51November Kelly?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 0:51Liam McAnderson?

  Did you shoot a man in Reno just to watch him die?

• 0:53Justin Roczniak?

  I, no, I was really fucking sick in, you're in Reno. I was like disappointed because I, I wanted to see the new train station and, uh, no, I was just, you know, I was like

• 1:04Liam McAnderson?

  Shitting your brains out.

• 1:04Justin Roczniak?

  half conscious, laying in the roomette and I was like, oh, I'm in the trench for the new station in Reno and then I fell back asleep.

• 1:15November Kelly?

  You went on a kind of like psycho geographic vision of the American West. Yeah.

• 1:21Liam McAnderson?

  Right.

• 1:21Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, yeah, I was, yeah, exactly.

• 1:22Liam McAnderson?

  Metaphorical, literal, right?

• 1:24Justin Roczniak?

  It, it, it's, it's what, uh, you know, taking peyote would be like if peyote was COVID. Um.

• 1:33November Kelly?

  See, that's way more exciting than me. My, my thing was just, I'm just sad, you know, like I was, I was still going back to bed, but I wasn't doing it in Reno.

• 1:45Speaker 00

  You're killing your guy. Not being in Reno is a good thing.

• 1:48Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I forgot you used to live in Nevada.

• 1:52Justin Roczniak?

  Shit, yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Um, but anyway, we're back. We're ready to podcast.

• 1:59Liam McAnderson?

  Hello.

• 2:00Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. Is, is everybody ready for podcasting?

• 2:03Liam McAnderson?

  Yes, sir.

• 2:04November Kelly?

  I'm, yes, we, we, we gotta sync the audio. We gotta, god damn it. We gotta sync the audio. Also, there's like a four second lag on my end.

• 2:13Justin Roczniak?

  Oh my God.

• 2:15November Kelly?

  All right.

• 2:15Justin Roczniak?

  Uh. Three, two, one, mark.

• 2:22Justin Roczniak?

  All right, close enough.

• 2:23Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, boy.

• 2:24Justin Roczniak?

  That's definitely, that's definitely about a four second lag right there. Yeah.

• 2:29November Kelly?

  Okay, that's, that's fine. That's fine. We make it work. Um.

• 2:35Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, we're all gonna have to speak slowly.

• 2:39Liam McAnderson?

  Zen caster, you son of a bitch.

• 2:42November Kelly?

  You're all gonna have to hold space for like female voices.

• 2:47Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:50Justin Roczniak?

  So.

• 2:51Liam McAnderson?

  Thank you. Thank you.

• 2:52Justin Roczniak?

  All right. With, with that in mind, we'll all have to speak very slowly and clearly with long pauses.

• 3:01Justin Roczniak?

  Welcome to the 200th episode of Well, There's Your Problem, a podcast about engineering disasters with slides. I'm Justin Rosnick. I'm the person who's talking right now. My pronouns are he and him. Okay, go.

• 3:20November Kelly?

  It's something I've said this 200 times. I'm November Kelly. I'm the person who's speaking right now. My pronouns are she and her. And 200 times, yay, Liam.

• 3:35Liam McAnderson?

  Yay, Liam. Thank you, November. Uh, yeah. Hi, I'm Liam McAnderson. My pronouns are he and him. And, uh,

• 3:44November Kelly?

  You got a new one? You had another pronouns debut?

• 3:48Liam McAnderson?

  A new neo-pronoun?

• 3:49Justin Roczniak?

  We got a, we got a joke about pronouns, huh?

• 3:51Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. 200 episodes in and the mask comes off, baby.

• 3:57Justin Roczniak?

  No, we got, we got an attack helicopter with us today.

• 4:01Liam McAnderson?

  I'm an Apache.

• 4:03Liam McAnderson?

  I'm original. Please don't Charlie Kirk me. Um, Victoria, go.

• 4:11Speaker 00

  Hello, my name is Victoria Scott. I'm the person who's talking right now. My pronouns are she and her.

• 4:17Speaker 00

  I haven't done this 200 times.

• 4:20Justin Roczniak?

  No.

• 4:20November Kelly?

  It's fine. Give it time.

• 4:22Justin Roczniak?

  One day.

• 4:24November Kelly?

  Hmm.

• 4:24Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 4:27Justin Roczniak?

  And what you see on the screen in front of you is Tony Soprano.

• 4:35November Kelly?

  A legitimate Italian-American businessman, a pillar of his community, and most of all, a waste management consultant.

• 4:44Justin Roczniak?

  A waste management consultant. Now, you may think The Sopranos is a work of fiction. However,

• 4:54Justin Roczniak?

  there is a strong analog in Italy. And that's what we're going to talk about today. When the mafia poisoned a good chunk of Southern E. Italy by, and to quote Sam's notes, because Sam wrote this episode, taking the bins out incorrectly.

• 5:16November Kelly?

  Yeah, in case you were in any doubt that our research assistant is British, this is this is bins politics. This is the politics of the bin.

• 5:24Justin Roczniak?

  This is this is this is the bins episode. And also, if this episode sucks, blame Sam and not me. All right. Anyway,

• 5:33Justin Roczniak?

  I think it'll be good, though.

• 5:36Justin Roczniak?

  But before we do that, we have to do the goddamn news.

• 5:40November Kelly?

  I still haven't got the fucking iPad fixed.

• 5:45Justin Roczniak?

  Hold on, hold on, hold on. I got this. I got this. I got this.

• 5:52Justin Roczniak?

  Hey, Sam. Yeah, Liam. Not New York, Delaware. No, wait, no.

• 5:58Justin Roczniak?

  Hold on. No. Jesus. I thought I actually put it in here. No, I didn't.

• 6:07Justin Roczniak?

  All right, anyway.

• 6:12November Kelly?

  A very special 200th episode, Whirlitzer, for the news.

• 6:17Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, yes.

• 6:20November Kelly?

  So.

• 6:21Justin Roczniak?

  There was a train crash in the UK. I actually have no idea what happened here. Someone explain this for me, please.

• 6:29November Kelly?

  I'm sensitively using this to plug you and Gareth's new podcast, Trains Atlantic.

• 6:37Justin Roczniak?

  Trains Atlantic. Listen to Trains Atlantic.

• 6:39November Kelly?

  Because we kind of don't, we don't know anything yet, but what we do know is that Justin and Gareth have a new podcast. It's called Trains Atlantic. It's about trains. It's like Rounas, except that Justin is on it. So you should listen to that.

• 6:53Justin Roczniak?

  Except there's, there's two of us. Yeah. It's less structured. But yes. There was a signal pass a danger, but I don't think we know why or how.

• 7:05November Kelly?

  Yeah, this is the worst like train crash we've had in the UK in a while, not least because one of the drivers was killed. And then like a lot of people apparently seriously, seriously injured because one train on the East Midlands Railway just ran into the back of another one.

• 7:26November Kelly?

  And all we know so far is that that second train passed a signal at danger. We don't know why. And, you know, to an extent, we don't want to speculate. I don't also necessarily want to have the like really close up sort of footage of like train wrecks. So what I've got here is an image I found, which looks so tilt shifted. It reminds me of playing the emergency games back in the day. And this is National Rail having to build a road up to the track in order to crane all of the like rolling stock off, which is crazy work logistically.

• 8:02Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, I like the, the train crane.

• 8:06November Kelly?

  Hmm. Oh, yeah.

• 8:07Justin Roczniak?

  It used to be you just take a sidewinder up there and just shove the train back on the track. I don't know what's going up there, going on up there in the UK. But yeah, I also have no idea what happened here. I, I don't, I do want to speculate, but I don't have enough information to do so.

• 8:24Liam McAnderson?

  To even speculate. Oh, that's tough, man.

• 8:26Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. I don't know. Place your, place your bets on Polly Market now.

• 8:33November Kelly?

  If you, if you have inside information, then immediately.

• 8:36Liam McAnderson?

  Bleep that.

• 8:38November Kelly?

  Immediately start using privileged information to start like corruptly winning bets on prediction markets. Yeah, no, I, I think as far as I know, all of the injuries were like confined to the first carriage of the train that ran into the back of the other one. Which, you know, is, is pretty bad, but as far as the sort of crashworthiness of everything else, it's, it's, you know, good that more people weren't injured, I guess.

• 9:03Justin Roczniak?

  It seems like, yeah, everyone, uh, other than, other than the driver, you know, the, the, uh, the cars stayed relatively intact. The train seems to have stayed on the track. I mean, it's about the best outcome you can expect, you know, given the circumstances, which again, we don't exactly know what they are.

• 9:24November Kelly?

  Yeah, I think the, the only other thing that we know is that the first train had stopped because of like an AWS fault. Uh, that's the, uh, the automatic warning system that like makes you break automatically if you don't acknowledge it like a yellow signal. Um, or slow down time for a red signal. Um, so that had done, just stopped and then, uh, whatever signal was protecting it, the second train has just come through. Um, which, yeah, brutal, but we, we don't know yet. Future episode, I guess, once we do know more.

• 9:55Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, most likely.

• 10:00Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, but in other news. Mr. Speaker, I am a dooner. All right, we got, we got to talk about the reflecting pool.

• 10:09November Kelly?

  Oh, God.

• 10:10Justin Roczniak?

  We're gonna have to talk about the goddamn reflecting pool.

• 10:13November Kelly?

  I, I knew this was something for us as, as that whole story spiraled.

• 10:18Justin Roczniak?

  I don't, I don't, I don't know much about pools, right? But my understanding, not, well, okay, this is untreated water, right? Or it was untreated water until they treated it. Um, but yeah, the, the, the reflecting pool has. Yeah, yeah, that's, that's okay. That's a trivial statement. Yeah.

• 10:44Liam McAnderson?

  But sorry.

• 10:46Speaker 00

  Didn't they treat it by dumping a bunch of hydrogen peroxide into it?

• 10:50Liam McAnderson?

  But like one gallon jugs at a time?

• 10:52Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, one gallon jugs at a time. Yeah, it was embarrassing to look at. The reflecting pool, I'm gonna say this as someone who was not a Washingtonian, but a resident of the suburbs of Washington for a long time. It has always had seasonal algae problems. But the president decided in his wisdom to have a pool company come in and add a blue liner to the reflecting pool.

• 11:29Justin Roczniak?

  You know, as one might find in a pool. And this has increased the temperature of the water, which means the algae blooms this year have been much worse than usual.

• 11:48November Kelly?

  Yeah, he wanted it American flag blue, which is, you know, sort of characteristically hubristic. And what it ended up being was, you know, kind of toxic green. Luckily, however, we found out why this is happening and it's not.

• 12:04Justin Roczniak?

  The water is already blue.

• 12:07November Kelly?

  But not enough. And thankfully, like I say, we found out the reason why this is happening. And the reason, of course, is Antifa.

• 12:14Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 12:14Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, we did this.

• 12:16Justin Roczniak?

  Well, no, so there was a project some decades ago that was organized by Antifa to, instead of feeding the reflecting pool with Washington DC municipal water, it would instead have sort of a tidal cycle along with the Potomac River being fed directly from the tidal basin, right? This was like an old Antifa plot. I think it was, you know, like, I don't, I don't know which, which sort of sector of Antifa started it, but this was going to disgrace the capital, right?

• 12:54November Kelly?

  Mm hmm.

• 12:57Justin Roczniak?

  So, but anyway, once they stopped feeding it with municipal water, the algae blooms got a lot worse. Um, you know, uh, but the, these were all, it's just a seasonal thing you tolerate, right? And the fact that President's real, real mad about it is, is, is, is pretty funny because they are arresting people for being Antifa for like, looking at the reflecting pool the wrong way, which is the thing you're supposed to do with the reflecting pool is look at it. It has no other purpose.

• 13:29November Kelly?

  The thing, the thing about the liner as well is the liner is now like coming up in chunks, which Trump suggests is due to, uh, still further dedicated agents of Antifa slashing the reflecting pool's new liner with a knife.

• 13:45Speaker 00

  My favorite thing was, um, Jen Bendry from HuffPo went down to it and found a pool guy there who was like, oh yeah, this is a shit liner job. I used to run a pool business and like, this is, this was always inevitable. It was always gonna just start peeling, sloughing off in huge chunks. Uh, but no, we got a grand jury indictment today for a former Olympian who touched the water.

• 14:09November Kelly?

  I look forward to that going about as well as the guy who like threw the sandwich at the FBI agent. I just, I don't get the reflecting pool. I have to be honest because like, I understand that Washington DC is, it's, it's a bog functionally. It's a city that you built in a bog to make a very important point. And it's like humid as ass all the time. And then for some reason, uh, for some reason, you decided to put like a big puddle in there to commemorate the fucking, I don't know, uh, liberty or whatever. And now you have a child in charge who wants the pool to be blue crayon when in fact it's not because it's a water system.

• 14:52Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, it's, you know, and the other thing is, well, no, let me, let me, let me break out some, you know, I don't know how to describe this. If you want a reflecting pool, it costs money. They should just hook it back up to the municipal water. Fuck it. I, you know, if you want this outcome, you're gonna have to spend some money instead of doing all this bullshit. This is a hack on a hack on a hack.

• 15:20November Kelly?

  It's really, it's sort of a lot of Trump's worst qualities besides the obvious ones where he's like, because he's a property guy, but he's also a micromanager, but he also tries to do everything on the cheap and stiff everyone on the bill.

• 15:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, they spent millions and millions of dollars doing the new liner, which appears to just have been them rolling out like blue epoxy based like pool paint.

• 15:45Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 15:47Speaker 00

  It's

• 15:47Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 15:48November Kelly?

  Going, going, going to the reflecting pool, which now looks like it emits the fucking radiation Geiger counter thing from Fallout 3. And there's a guy in waders with like a sort of floating like pool chair with a bunch of like blue gloss paint buckets and a roller.

• 16:08Speaker 00

  I, I think the thing about this for me is that like, it's the first thing that's felt genuinely funny because it's, it's every time he makes a mockery out of like the seat of power of America, I think it's hilarious, especially when it upsets him. And this is like the ballroom for me, you know, where it's like, hey, we leveled part of the White House to, to like satiate this one, like 80 year old child's whims. And like, we're just, we're, we're making, we're desecrating America's monuments and it's honestly pretty funny. And the fact that upsets him is great. It's like, it's the same thing as like the state fair thing.

• 16:44Justin Roczniak?

  The, the, the great American state fair.

• 16:47November Kelly?

  The thing about Marx is that he thought that the, the farce would follow the tragedy when instead, what seems to be happening is the tragedy and the farce are happening at the same time, but faster and dumber.

• 16:58Justin Roczniak?

  Simultaneously. It's, it's, it's a black comedy, folks.

• 17:02Speaker 00

  I would recommend that people read DeBorde to understand the spectacle, but I also don't want all of our listeners to kill themselves.

• 17:09Justin Roczniak?

  The worst part is, the worst part is for the Trump administration, this is actually a fantastic carbon sink right here. You know?

• 17:21November Kelly?

  It's just Trump, between this and the straight of four moves. Yeah, between this and the straight of four moves, Donald Trump is not having a good time with like narrow bodies of water.

• 17:32Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I was about to say, but you know, the other thing is, yeah, we've, we've, we've, we've taken so much CO2 out of the atmosphere, you know, probably, probably Europe can start having air conditioners now. I'm sorry.

• 17:48November Kelly?

  I just like thinking about this as being part of his sort of narrative arc. I'm sort of imagining a like a version of The Apprentice where we go back to 80s New York Trump and he stiffs a pool guy and the pool guy kind of implicitly curses him to this.

• 18:03Justin Roczniak?

  Did you see the pictures of the pool guy?

• 18:06Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, his neighbor? Like the one that no bid contract?

• 18:10November Kelly?

  Oh, God, yeah.

• 18:13Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 18:16Speaker 00

  You mean the guy who was responsible for the Avanti revival?

• 18:21November Kelly?

  I mean, the guy who looks like, like Paul Barra?

• 18:25Speaker 00

  Do you remember the, so if you're, if you're a car psycho, Studebaker had the Avanti and then somebody decided they would buy the nameplate and try to bring it back as a modernized 80s version when they were doing 50s nostalgia and it was a terrible piece of shit and they ruined the whole like design of the car in the process of doing it. It was one of the like classic like auto, the auto industry can't be that hard proceeds to, you know, shoot self in foot stories. But I think that's the same guy who did the pool.

• 18:52November Kelly?

  It's, it's not, it's not Frank Carone in this case. I got my wires crossed with no gods, no mess. Frank Carone is the Eric Adams aide who texted, "Thank you, my big guy" in a corruption thing that then got subpoenaed by the feds.

• 19:07Justin Roczniak?

  Hold on, let me, John J. Cafaro. Hold on, let's see. Let's see if we can find.

• 19:14November Kelly?

  Okay, so I'm racist against Italians now. That's gonna bode well for the next 50 slides.

• 19:21Justin Roczniak?

  Wait, no, it is the Studebaker revival guy. Holy shit.

• 19:25Speaker 00

  I'm not doing a bit. No, he really did that.

• 19:28Justin Roczniak?

  God damn it.

• 19:30Speaker 00

  It's just the same five guys.

• 19:33November Kelly?

  Revival guy?

• 19:34Justin Roczniak?

  He got the Studebaker guy.

• 19:43Speaker 00

  There's always not a motive angle, baby.

• 19:47Justin Roczniak?

  No, yeah, it's this guy.

• 19:52Speaker 00

  He looks like a villain from like a new, a new Home Alone remake.

• 19:58Speaker 00

  Yes, they don't, they don't make guys like that anymore.

• 20:01November Kelly?

  We're gonna rediscover Fordite just from like layers of pool liner.

• 20:10Speaker 00

  It won't have long enough to congeal. Fordite only worked because the paint adhered.

• 20:22Justin Roczniak?

  Well, uh, good, good luck to the president and his quest to make, make the waters blue.

• 20:29Speaker 00

  We have more to look forward to too, because in the next week, probably by the time this episode's up, uh, we're gonna have 850,000 fireworks going off to break the world record for the 4th of July. And he says he wants to give the longest speech possible in 107 degree weather, which is like, I don't know, 34? So like, you know.

• 20:49Justin Roczniak?

  He's just gonna absorb and radiate the heat, um, into the crowd, uh, assembled, right? Like, like people are gonna die in the crowd, but he's gonna absorb their life force.

• 21:00Speaker 00

  Like a reverse William Henry Harrison.

• 21:03Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, pretty much.

• 21:05November Kelly?

  And right, right now, I understand that they've, they've just fenced off the reflecting pool and they've had to just start draining it in order to try and get it bluer and get some of the algae out. But they say it's gonna be done for July the 4th.

• 21:22Justin Roczniak?

  I've also heard that like fencing off the reflecting pool is normal for setting up the fireworks, but I, I don't know that, um, for sure. Um, I've never been to the July 4th fireworks on the National Mall because I'm a sane person.

• 21:38Speaker 00

  A rabid anti-American.

• 21:39November Kelly?

  Yeah, I kind of get the sense that like doing, doing the 4th of July stuff in DC is kind of the American equivalent of like British people who are into our royal family.

• 21:51Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, the only reason to go see the fireworks in DC is if you live in DC. You know, and that's like, that'll be like the one time a year you visit the National Mall, maybe. And actually, you probably won't do that because you can see it from everywhere.

• 22:07Speaker 00

  Yeah, they're, they're starting, they're starting security screening at 1:00 and you're only allowed to have a liter of water and the fireworks start at 11:00 PM. So.

• 22:15Justin Roczniak?

  This is the equivalent of like, uh, the God Emperor in Warhammer 40k. You know, they are gonna have to sacrifice 10,000 chuds.

• 22:26November Kelly?

  Death March.

• 22:27Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 22:29November Kelly?

  Yeah, just chuds screaming for water, trying to dive into an empty reflecting pool.

• 22:35Justin Roczniak?

  Every, every year we sacrifice 10,000 used car dealers to Donald Trump.

• 22:49Speaker 00

  Look, if it's the only way we can get denazification done in this country, whatever, I'll take it.

• 22:54Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, that, that well may run dry soon. Uh, but you know, in the meantime, uh, you know, it's, uh, I guess we'll see what happens.

• 23:08Justin Roczniak?

  And in other news, uh, hold on. I don't even know if I should do that. I'm gonna do it.

• 23:19Justin Roczniak?

  Sorry.

• 23:20November Kelly?

  Oh, yeah, no, pretty much. That's, that's pretty much how it feels. Um, this is, this is where I parked the anger slide, the slide for anger.

• 23:29Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 23:30November Kelly?

  My, my understanding.

• 23:31Speaker 00

  If no one got me, I know Devin got me.

• 23:33Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 23:35November Kelly?

  The Supreme Court of the United States of America showed up to work the one day a year they bothered to do that. And in a thing that was much reported, what broke 6-3 on the legal question, "Motherfucker, can you read?" and preserved birthright citizenship. But in a far less reported decision, decided that equal rights in Title IX do not apply to trans people. So fuck the Supreme Court, brackets, "American" this time.

• 24:08Speaker 00

  Specifically also just like vindicating Giulia Serrano by like having Kavanaugh write a whole like, "Trans women are just, you know, the lowest class of people. We can't have them stealing scholarships from our precious like blond-haired, blue-eyed cis girls."

• 24:27Speaker 00

  Yeah, the thing is, I have nothing funny about this. As somebody who lives here and, you know, is kind of just like, losing my mind constantly. It took about 26 hours for this one to actually hit me because I was so relieved. It was actually, it was like 5-4 for the citizenship thing too, because there were two questions they decided and one of them was 6-3 and one of them was 5-4. And all the, all the confident law knowers, the ball knowers of America were convinced that it was going to be like, you know, 9-0 or maybe like 7-2. And of course, it was just way worse than that. And they're, they're already like trying to set up the legal arguments to go for another round on that.

• 25:03Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 25:04Speaker 00

  And they probably will. I mean, the thing, it's nice is that like, I am not an accelerationist. So another year where people don't unnecessarily suffer is good, honestly. Like, you know, that was nice. But this is just, the thing that really fucked me about this was just like, it was 9-0 that trans women don't apply to Title IX. It wasn't even like, oh, you know, it was another like 6-3 split decision for, you know, on one reading of the law it was, but on the Title IX thing, it's like, no, it's just, you know, it was a weak legal argument, but I just don't give a fuck anymore. This is all Calvin ball. I like, I don't give Like if I don't understand how you look at the legal situation for trans people in the US and you say, well, this wasn't the best case. It's like, it doesn't fucking matter.

• 25:50Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. I the thing, the thing that strikes me here is, you know, they, they make all the huge deals here about, um, one of like the six high school trans athletes in America. You know, it's like they did a, the, the right wing movement has successfully done a reverse Rosa Parks.

• 26:10Speaker 00

  Yeah. Well, and like the, the girl that this case was about was like, I think 11 when this law got raised. She's like 16 or 17 now, and she's the only person the law applies to. And she did everything, you know, quote unquote, right, according to these fucking bigots. And then she started puberty blockers at a young age and she didn't go through like, you know, the years of excruciating puberty and it doesn't fucking matter. They don't give a shit. We don't, we don't belong in their society. And it's like, I just, I, there's nothing, I don't even know. I mean, like, I guess I could make a bunch of actionable threats, like, you know, we have to fucking kill these people. United States is a dead institution and until we move past it, we're never going to get anywhere. But like, what difference does it fucking make? I'm just, I like,

• 26:58Speaker 00

  I would like to participate in my society again.

• 27:02November Kelly?

  Hmm. I, I feel kind of lucky to be British, which is one of the rare times I'll say that because we had our version of this, uh, last year, I want to say, I don't know, time sort of turns into a blur and you start thinking about stuff like this. Um, but either way, I had my kind of like three weeks of not going outside. And then I sort of realized that I could do the, you know, the court has made their judgment. Now let them enforce it type thing. Um, and just keep doing what I wanted. Now, admittedly, this is going to stop my, you know, professional sports career from taking off. But, uh, you know, on a sort of personal level as, as a kind of, you know, uh, dedicated non-athlete,

• 27:44November Kelly?

  it's just sort of like, okay, there are lots and lots of ways that this can fuck every trans person over, including me, but I can kind of just keep going until it gets to an inflection point that affects me personally, which is not a great feeling to be running out the clock on, but it's more time, I guess.

• 28:03Speaker 00

  Yeah. Well, and the thing here is like, this, this decision is going to be used to basically, Remove any legal protections we have. So discrimination in housing and employment and all that is going to be even more legal than it currently is, which it already fucking is. Just ask any American trans person. But also, like, the night after this decision came down, there was some fucking press release from the White House about Supreme Court rules with Trump to eliminate transgender insanity. And it's like fucking crickets from everybody. And it's just, it, like, I know that there are, there are many, many problems going on in the US

• 28:45Speaker 00

  right now, but the fact that this just attracts so little attention and nobody gives a shit is really just kind of like, it's jokerfying me, for lack of a better term. Like, it just, I just feel like what's gonna, the best case scenario for liberals in this fucking country is that we get President Gavin Newsom, they continue to legally eliminate us from the United States. And everybody is like, oh, it's fine now, because like, you know, ICE has like smiley faces drawn on their fucking balaclavas. And, you know, we're quieter about it. And it's just like, I fucking hate this institution. I hate this country. You should put 100 people on the Supreme Court. That's your starting point.

• 29:25Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. Well, the other thing, of course, is that now that, you know, we're talking about a high school sports, you know, banning trans people entirely, it's, you, how are you gonna tell who's trans? You know, this is, you know?

• 29:44November Kelly?

  Oh, mandatory genital inspections. I'm sure that's gonna go down wonderfully.

• 29:49Justin Roczniak?

  I wasn't gonna say it, but yeah, I, this is, you know, it's in a, in a field where there are already a lot of, you know, pedophiles. They're only being enabled by this.

• 30:06November Kelly?

  Yeah, the the sort of like all sort of like high school athletes must post hog or pussy law is a huge loss for the transgender community and a huge win for the pedophile community.

• 30:19Justin Roczniak?

  I was about to say, yeah, this is, uh, this is, this is gone. This has gone poorly overall. Um, so yeah, I mean, I don't know. We need, well, yeah, as Victoria said, like 100 people on the Supreme Court, um, none of them should be cisgender.

• 30:36Speaker 00

  I'll also accept blood in the streets.

• 30:39November Kelly?

  Yep, me too.

• 30:39Speaker 00

  I mean, it's, it's like, it's up to y'all at this point. I don't give a fuck.

• 30:43Justin Roczniak?

  Mm hmm.

• 30:44Speaker 00

  Either we'd have a second constitutional convention and remake the idea of what like America, well, I guess the third is like 1787 was sort of one. But like, uh, we remake the idea of what America is and we like are very clear about, uh, who gets rights and who doesn't. Um, and, you know, we, we need to like redefine our entire legal system or a bunch of people. I don't give a fuck. I'm here for a bad time, not a long time.

• 31:10November Kelly?

  So it seems like it wasn't really.

• 31:12Justin Roczniak?

  Well, the first street tunnel is right there underneath the building and there's no security lines to get onto Virginia Railway Express. There's no one, so.

• 31:25November Kelly?

  Oh, okay. I love the ending of V for Vendetta. We're all going to federal prison.

• 31:33Justin Roczniak?

  No, please, please don't, don't bomb the Supreme Court, or if you do, don't say you got the idea here. You can look at a map and figure that out.

• 31:42Speaker 00

  Yeah, Devin, uh.

• 31:43November Kelly?

  I'm, I'm trusting a lot to the bleep here. I really am.

• 31:48Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 31:48Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, we didn't even, we didn't even get into the fucking Prairieland decision. So I don't know. Is this worse or better than Z's?

• 31:54November Kelly?

  Oh, my fucking God. I, oh, that, that's the one that really got to me. Yeah.

• 31:59Speaker 00

  State. I, it's, I, I feel like every single day, it's like, I, I look at my phone before I wake up. There's been three fucking abductions, like 20 miles from my house. It's just like, i- i- then I check the news and it's like, oh, cool. More, more endless humiliations, more people suffering. It's just like, and, and then it's, and then it's like deeply personal, you know?

• 32:19November Kelly?

  Y'all these people over shallow ditch, obviously. Yeah.

• 32:21Speaker 00

  Yeah, I just, I just, I don't know. Please, please keep me out of federal prison, Devon. I trust you. Thank you.

• 32:27November Kelly?

  You're in a sort of, we're in a sort of moment where it's like, well, because the Democrats don't give a shit about this. It's like, DSA is having some electoral victories, which is kind of cool. That's great. It's not a lot of consolation if you're in like, federal prison for 50 years for no reason.

• 32:44Speaker 00

  Sorry, I'm just really mad. I've been in a bad mood all week.

• 32:47November Kelly?

  No, no, no. Me too. Me too. I, this, this fucks me up for a long time.

• 32:52Speaker 00

  I had a bunch of people get mad at me because I wasn't humping the fucking flag for the US men's soccer team. And I'm just like, I-

• 32:59Liam McAnderson?

  I can't in good conscience root for Belgium, but maybe I can root for the meteor.

• 33:03Speaker 00

  Yeah, there we go. I mean, I'm not asking, I would never ask anyone to root for Belgium. Let's be real here. But I just like, I don't know. I just, I'm so-

• 33:12November Kelly?

  My position, my position is very clear. England are going to win. We're not going to deserve it. It's going to be the stupidest possible thing, but we are going to win it.

• 33:20Justin Roczniak?

  It's coming home, folks.

• 33:23November Kelly?

  It's coming home.

• 33:24Liam McAnderson?

  Kill you, Roz.

• 33:32Justin Roczniak?

  Well, you know, in other-

• 33:34Speaker 00

  Hey Liam, you're really quiet again.

• 33:36Justin Roczniak?

  Liam, you're really, really quiet. Yeah.

• 33:37Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, am I?

• 33:39Justin Roczniak?

  No, now you're, now you're, no, now you're very sensual.

• 33:45Liam McAnderson?

  Is that better?

• 33:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, thank you.

• 33:46Liam McAnderson?

  Thank you.

• 33:47November Kelly?

  The political compass whose two axes are volume and sensuality.

• 33:52Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 33:53Liam McAnderson?

  Thank you. I think, I feel insulted and praised.

• 33:58Justin Roczniak?

  That's, that's the best way to feel. Um, in other, in other news.

• 34:07Justin Roczniak?

  How do I, oh, I gotta go back over here.

• 34:11November Kelly?

  The fucking sound effect is fucking me up every so. Oh, okay. Yeah, this is a real quick one from me. So that, that is a picture that you see attached of, of the UK's new prime minister, Andy Burnham. Basically, Starmer-

• 34:28November Kelly?

  No, that's Ian Brown of the Stone Roses, but it would be funny to make you believe it.

• 34:35Speaker 00

  I'm face blind. I trust anything you tell me.

• 34:38November Kelly?

  So Starmer finally out. I finally got to retweet all of those like Keir Starmer has resigned posts from 2016. Keir Starmer is in tears from 2022. All the good ones. He's out. I feel no great satisfaction over it now that it's actually happened.

• 34:56Justin Roczniak?

  So sad sometimes.

• 34:56November Kelly?

  Yeah. And so now they've replaced him with a like a version of him that can like talk to people and appear to be human. And this one's deal is that he's from Manchester, which is like London, except it's in the north.

• 35:14Justin Roczniak?

  What do they have in Manchester?

• 35:16Liam McAnderson?

  Manchester United.

• 35:17November Kelly?

  Oh, a lot of like music, like bars, small plates restaurants that do things a little differently. It's really a kind of place of the kind of city authentic movement that we've talked about. I mean, the main thing is I think that this means that the entire country is going to become like a kid from the southeast who goes to uni in Manchester and makes it their whole personality. We're going to all be doing really inauthentic accents. We're going to be like trying to weave in bits of local slang. It's going to be horrible. And the worst part about it is on the day before he becomes prime minister, we're going to win the world cup.

• 35:58Justin Roczniak?

  So this is like.

• 35:59Liam McAnderson?

  So we're just in full on delusion land, huh?

• 36:05November Kelly?

  Well, according to the Supreme Court.

• 36:08Justin Roczniak?

  If we had the first Philly president and he starts saying John all the time.

• 36:15November Kelly?

  Yeah, kind of. It's no, no, what it is, what it is, is it's like if you had the first Chicago president, you know, like with the kind of shit on your shoulder.

• 36:25Liam McAnderson?

  Fuckers.

• 36:26Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. We do have a Chicago Pope.

• 36:30November Kelly?

  That's true.

• 36:31Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. So, but, uh, well, yeah, I guess we got a Chicago Pope, but then the world shifted significantly. Chicago as a result.

• 36:41November Kelly?

  Yeah, I guess so, but I like that. I think that's a good thing. Like, I want to put the slide about the pious, the tent stuff, but like, no, it's like, you know how Chicago kind of has that like second city chip on its shoulder sometimes? That's kind of Manchester and we're gonna, we're gonna have to live in that world for, oh, at least three years now.

• 37:03Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I mean, that's, that's definitely the worst part because Manchester is definitely the third city after Birmingham.

• 37:09Speaker 00

  So we are predicting though that he will outlast the cabbage?

• 37:13November Kelly?

  I believe so. Yeah, he's gonna, he's gonna run into all of the same problems like Starmer, just as a fuck you has handed him a like five billion pound deficit on defense spending. Just to fuck with him. But so he really can't do anything differently other than vibes. And the vibes still aren't good. Like, he's still one of the guys who like backtracked on trans rights. He's still sort of like, oh, we have to have controls on immigration. So as much as people want to fantasize about him being on the like soft left of the Labour Party, it's really just like, there's a lot of kind of stuff where he's constrained to do all of the same things. And, you know, give him six months, everyone's gonna hate him just as much as they hate Starman now.

• 37:59Speaker 00

  The Marie Glusencamp Perez of Manchester.

• 38:03November Kelly?

  Ooh, yeah. I don't know, it would be funny for Andy Burnham to start going in on like killing sea lions. I, I would be surprised, but you know, maybe, maybe he, he'll do it. I don't know. That's it. That's my Burnham bit.

• 38:18Justin Roczniak?

  Yep, that, that's, that's, that's the, the new empty suit running Britain, folks. Um, that was the goddamn news.

• 38:29Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, wait, that wasn't even the one I was going for.

• 38:34November Kelly?

  He's, he's, he's not even, he's not even really an empty suit. He's got the Fetterman disease. Like, he wears the fucking like black t-shirt everywhere.

• 38:44Speaker 00

  I thought they call those strokes, Nova.

• 38:47Liam McAnderson?

  Hmm.

• 38:50Justin Roczniak?

  Fetterman syndrome.

• 38:53November Kelly?

  And against all of the odds, John Fetterman got Fetterman syndrome?

• 39:00Liam McAnderson?

  It's like Lou Gehrig's disease.

• 39:07Justin Roczniak?

  All right, all right, folks.

• 39:09Liam McAnderson?

  Enough laughter.

• 39:10Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, enough laughter. Let's get serious. No, that doesn't happen on this podcast. Anyway.

• 39:15November Kelly?

  It's time. It's time to go to Italy, a very serious place.

• 39:17Justin Roczniak?

  It's time. It's time to go to Italy, a very serious place. Yes. Where in Italy? Not even normal Italy. No, we're going to southern Italy. We're going to Campania, right?

• 39:30November Kelly?

  Specifically. Campania.

• 39:33Justin Roczniak?

  Campania. I, you know, I, this is why I didn't, I, I, no, I have been here. I have no excuse.

• 39:41Liam McAnderson?

  Naples.

• 39:46Justin Roczniak?

  Campania. Okay. And, and specifically Naples and its neighboring connurbations, which is a fun word, and its suburbs, right? In there, there's five provinces. There's Naples. There's, oh, boy.

• 40:04Liam McAnderson?

  Get through it.

• 40:06Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 40:07Speaker 00

  We believe in you.

• 40:09Justin Roczniak?

  Benevento, Caserta, Salerno.

• 40:16Justin Roczniak?

  About 25% of all protected area, yeah, protected areas in Italy are in this region. Four state natural reserves, eight regional national parks, four regional national reserves, 106 sites of community interest and so forth.

• 40:32November Kelly?

  This, this is like a briefing from the Biden EPA.

• 40:40Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, Campania's agricultural output is mainly fruit and vegetables, you know, which, yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Okay. They also have buffalo for mozzarella. I would assume this is where you get your nice San Marzano tomatoes, you know, that you get in a can from the grocery store because you want to, you want to pay $5 more. That's what I do.

• 41:06November Kelly?

  Genuinely, I am stupid enough to believe that to get my wires crossed again and to believe that buffalo mozzarella is called that because of upstate New York.

• 41:16Justin Roczniak?

  I also get my wires. No, I always think it's gonna be, you know, it's gonna have Frank's Red Hot in it.

• 41:24Speaker 00

  That's right, baby. Go Bills.

• 41:25Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, go Bills.

• 41:28Liam McAnderson?

  Josh Allen is the future at some Drag Dots stage.

• 41:32Justin Roczniak?

  Well, yeah, Campania is where-

• 41:34November Kelly?

  I see here in the incredibly comprehensive notes that this is like, this is where the mozzarella is from. This is like 80% of the mozzarella.

• 41:42Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. Yes.

• 41:46Justin Roczniak?

  324 traditional products, 28 certified products of Protected Designation of Origin, right? That's when you look at the can of San Marzano tomatoes, it says DOP on it. That's how you know it's good.

• 42:02November Kelly?

  Italy, Italy really abuses those. That's the thing. They've got like fucking thousands of them because of this kind of like gastro nationalism. It's, it's crazy.

• 42:12Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, and I buy all of them. I eat that shit up.

• 42:17November Kelly?

  Expression softening. Ah, what the hell, brother? Pass me a product of Protected Designation of Origin.

• 42:23Justin Roczniak?

  Give me, give me, give me another fucking tomato, please.

• 42:30Justin Roczniak?

  It's also one of the poorest regions in Italy. Twenty, 21% of families living below the poverty line. Um, anyway.

• 42:40November Kelly?

  Jesus, there's no money in this mozzarella shit.

• 42:43Liam McAnderson?

  Right. We're gonna find out why November.

• 42:47Justin Roczniak?

  I just, I took, I, I, I put some of my vacation photos in here.

• 42:50Speaker 00

  Oh, my God. That is such a cool tag.

• 42:53Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, um, yeah, the, uh, the.

• 42:56November Kelly?

  Oh, that rules.

• 42:57Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, uh, the Circumvisuviana is a great way to get around sort of Naples and the surrounding areas. Tiny shitty narrow gauge trains. They're all covered in graffiti. And for whatever reason, it's like, okay. Yeah, for whatever reason, the, uh, the company's like, okay, you know, that's just a free coat of paint. We'll leave it like that.

• 43:19Speaker 00

  Oh, the Union Pacific mentality.

• 43:21Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, pretty much. This is a nice, nice view of, uh, Vesuvius here from the Railroad Museum. Greatest railroad museum I've ever been to in Naples. And a stupid tweet I made when I was over there, um, about walkable streets. Because, uh, yeah, this was, I almost got run over here several times. I was playing hooky from the rest of my family because they were going to the Vatican Museum that day. I was like, no, I'm never going in that place again.

• 43:51Liam McAnderson?

  It's hell on wheels, man.

• 43:53Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I took the high speed train down to Naples to go see the train museum.

• 43:58November Kelly?

  Okay, that rules and I support that as a decision. However, it's really funny that every city you go to in Europe, you almost get run over and, and then post about it.

• 44:07Justin Roczniak?

  He gets almost run over a lot.

• 44:09November Kelly?

  So much for the like superior European urbanism. And it's a photo you took in the middle of a traffic island where the traffic is going 70 miles an hour.

• 44:20Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, yes, November, I, yes, you, you understand me completely. I.

• 44:28Speaker 00

  I did almost get hit by a car when I went to Paris too, so I'm kind of sympathetic to this.

• 44:33Justin Roczniak?

  I managed to have a bad time biking in Amsterdam.

• 44:38November Kelly?

  Both of your problems are that you hang out with not just bikes too much, right? And so you think that like, oh, Europe, we've like conquered the car. And so you go to a society that's 5% less car centric than America. And you think because there are only three lanes of traffic instead of five, you can walk across it and just get hit by every car.

• 45:00Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, here's the thing. Here's the thing. I had a different opinion in Prague. No, I had a different experience in Prague because there I was almost getting murdered by trams.

• 45:13November Kelly?

  Oh, okay.

• 45:15Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. Anyway, that's what we strive for.

• 45:20November Kelly?

  Oh, yeah. No, love a tram.

• 45:22Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, they're all old Soviet trams. It was great. Anyway.

• 45:29Justin Roczniak?

  So.

• 45:32Justin Roczniak?

  There's this thing, the Neapolitan conurbation, right? This is genuinely like a strange piece of urban development, right? You know, there was no like coordinated planning as you might see in other places. So there's like apartment buildings next to like an orchard or a vineyard or a farm field. And there's a factory next to that, right? And there's some single family houses. There's a villa. There's, you know, it's just build, build anything, anywhere. No one gives a shit, right? It's all in the shadow of a huge volcano that could explode at any time and kill people.

• 46:13Justin Roczniak?

  And you got, you know, Naples in the south. You've got, what is it? Caserta in the north, right? There's also like a bunch of old volcano craters. Those will be relevant later.

• 46:30Speaker 00

  Why'd you draw among us?

• 46:32Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, fuck.

• 46:44November Kelly?

  See, I know that you're so pure of heart that that's entirely unintentional.

• 46:51Justin Roczniak?

  Next slide.

• 46:57Justin Roczniak?

  So here's a diagram stolen from Wikipedia where we talk about waste disposal infrastructure, right?

• 47:05Liam McAnderson?

  God, it looks like the military PowerPoints.

• 47:07Justin Roczniak?

  It's very, you know, actually, if you look at it for a bit.

• 47:11November Kelly?

  Thinking about Tony Soprano frowning at this.

• 47:15Justin Roczniak?

  He, he doesn't have to look at it. This is like something he hands to, uh, what's his name?

• 47:23Justin Roczniak?

  Um, the young guy.

• 47:28November Kelly?

  Christopher Moltisanti, the, the author of the greatest line in all of screenwriting.

• 47:36Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, he makes him read it. He also doesn't understand it. What is the greatest line of all?

• 47:44November Kelly?

  It's, it's when, um, he's writing his mob spec script and he has a beautiful woman talk to the version of him. Uh, and she's like, beautiful woman. Thank you. And he says, I must be loyal to my capo, but he misspells loyal.

• 48:00Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. Okay. Yeah. Shit.

• 48:07Justin Roczniak?

  So, so we as humans use and dispose of a lot of shit. We produce waste. What happens after you, a regular citizen, put the bins out?

• 48:21Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, I send it to New Jersey where it belongs.

• 48:24Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, no, no, we send it to Trenton, Liam.

• 48:28Liam McAnderson?

  I thought we sent it to, uh, Chester.

• 48:31Justin Roczniak?

  Do we send it to Chester?

• 48:32Liam McAnderson?

  Isn't that where the big incinerator is?

• 48:34Justin Roczniak?

  That might be where the big incinerator.

• 48:36November Kelly?

  It goes, it goes off of the map where you use a sort of slider to make a deal with the mayor of that city that they take your garbage and you pay them.

• 48:44Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, no, no. I, there, there was a guy in, uh, who did a SimCity 4 mod that, that, uh, fixed this. And you actually just push it off the edge of the map and it falls down into the void.

• 48:59Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, the wonderful world of waste management is what happens, right? Most waste that people are familiar with is municipal solid waste, right? That that's the stuff that you yourself throw out, right? So that could be, I don't know, what, what, what did everyone throw out yesterday? I threw out a bunch of stuff.

• 49:24November Kelly?

  You too.

• 49:28November Kelly?

  Like if it's, if it's me, it's probably like 80 different shoe boxes from pairs of shoes that I bought that don't fit well.

• 49:35Speaker 00

  I went to a, I went to a museum nearby, the Burke Museum, which is at the UW campus. And they have a section on like human landfill waste. And it, it kind of filled me with a sense of sort of Protestant guilt about the amount of waste that I generate as a human being. So I think about and feel bad about basically everything I throw away. And it's a ton of shit.

• 49:55November Kelly?

  Protestant guilt, do they make that?

• 49:58Speaker 00

  I don't know, it's just like the kind of ambient American sort of, I feel bad because I'm here.

• 50:05Justin Roczniak?

  I personally went and cleaned out my fridge and got rid of a few science experiments in there, including. No, that, no, this was really bad. There was some, I, I went to, I went to Handy Nasty recently.

• 50:21November Kelly?

  Of course.

• 50:22Speaker 00

  What?

• 50:27Justin Roczniak?

  Han Dynasty, it's a really great Chinese restaurant, but everyone calls it Handy Nasty.

• 50:32November Kelly?

  You're welcome.

• 50:37November Kelly?

  Put that on my tube stone rods.

• 50:41Speaker 00

  It's like, wow, your pride month went crazy.

• 50:50Justin Roczniak?

  I left a container of leftover leftovers in the fridge for like the, the week I was in Prague. I came back and it started fermenting. I opened up the container, it was, the whole apartment was overwhelmed. And I threw it out, it's no longer in my life anymore. It has gone into the municipal solid waste stream.

• 51:12November Kelly?

  I don't want to tell people to glamorize my life too much, but like, do not ask for a beer in a podcaster's house because you will open the fridge and something will bark at you and it'll be in a plastic container.

• 51:26Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. No, the worst part of that about that was it had such a strong vinegar smell that I was like, damn, if I left this five years, I'd get some great fish sauce out of it or something, you know? But anyway.

• 51:42November Kelly?

  Oh, just go ahead and reach in there and grab yourself a thousand year egg. It's fine.

• 51:46Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 51:51November Kelly?

  It's like, sometimes, sometimes the mental health gets a bit much for me. And sometimes what that leads to is, let's say, an inadvertent experiment in home pickling, right? It's not the worst thing in the world. You just, you just have to suit up in the full CBRN suit and throw it out and then it becomes Tony Soprano's problem.

• 52:11Justin Roczniak?

  Well, this is how, this is how, uh, this is how pickled food originated. It was depressed people.

• 52:20Speaker 00

  We've always been here.

• 52:24Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, yeah, this, this becomes part of the municipal solid waste stream, right? You know, so people produce a lot of this, dense urban areas produce a lot of this. And that's why, you know, you need systems to handle it, right? They're very, they're expensive, but you know, we can do things to reduce the impact, right?

• 52:48Justin Roczniak?

  So yeah, doing this stuff in the best study case practice can be very expensive, which this is a literary technique known as foreshadowing, right?

• 53:02Justin Roczniak?

  But

• 53:02November Kelly?

  Costs a lot of money to separate out the like recyclables from the handy nasty containers that, you know, are sort of like might bite you if you put your hand too near them.

• 53:13Justin Roczniak?

  I actually, I actually, I actually saved the container. But I got rid of the food in it because it's one of those nice like court containers and like, I need more of

• 53:23Liam McAnderson?

  You can just buy those, man. We have the money.

• 53:25Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, but I have to go all the way to Chinatown for that.

• 53:28Liam McAnderson?

  I will buy you some.

• 53:31Justin Roczniak?

  All right.

• 53:32November Kelly?

  So I'm now getting, now getting some insight, and maybe the listener is too, on why the podcast is so often disrupted by sickness.

• 53:46Justin Roczniak?

  I put it through the dishwasher. It's fine.

• 53:49November Kelly?

  Like, like, here's the thing, right? I don't want people to start thinking, well, like, like, four Asmongolds here, right? Like, we, I, it's fine.

• 53:58Justin Roczniak?

  You, you could use those things like four or five times.

• 54:03November Kelly?

  I, like, sometimes I get very, very depressed in my head, and then the room turns into the sort of like garbage dimension for a bit, and then I get out of the depression, and I, and I clean it, and I, I sort of think to myself, you know, my, like, like you say, Victoria, we've always been here. So I'm like, my ancestors are smiling on me neurotypical. Can you say the same? But like, I, it, once it's clean, it's fine. I'm not reusing the fucking experimental test bed beaker fucking Earl and Meyer flask.

• 54:36Justin Roczniak?

  No, the, the Earl and Meyer flask is somewhere else in the apartment.

• 54:39Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, I don't know where that is.

• 54:40Speaker 00

  Also, like, aren't those not designed to be reused? Are you like a test bed for how much BPA a person can take?

• 54:47Justin Roczniak?

  You, you could use them four or five times. It's fine.

• 54:51Justin Roczniak?

  I'm not dead yet.

• 54:52November Kelly?

  I think we're, we're operating on a real sort of program of like, fuck the microbiome, I'm the macro biome, and I'm the macroplastics. So like, I'll do what the fuck I want.

• 55:05Justin Roczniak?

  Exactly, exactly.

• 55:10Justin Roczniak?

  So, uh, this, this diagram here, you, you have, uh, like, in, in a theoretical framework, right? How you, how do you dispose of waste? You know, you have, you have the best ways to do it up here. You have the worst ways to do it down here. You know, okay, we're reducing, right? We are doing prevention. Uh, do we, do we need to get the stuff that we're gonna throw out? You know, are, are we doing less stuff than we might otherwise need, right? Or you reuse, which everyone was just making fun of me for.

• 55:47Justin Roczniak?

  Right?

• 55:52Justin Roczniak?

  You know, can you, can you sell stuff to other people who might need to use it? Right?

• 55:57November Kelly?

  Probably not that container, no.

• 56:00Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, I wouldn't sell it to someone because it's probably only got four uses on it now. But yeah. Eventually, you know, we go down to like, okay, stuff is now actual waste.

• 56:11Speaker 00

  Do you remember, do you remember the time we learned about Nova's computing setup? This is how I feel about how you use food containers.

• 56:19November Kelly?

  Listen, I, I, I, I was late to start recording today because I had to turn my computer on for the first time in like 50 years. And it took too long and it had like mandatory updates and shit. So I've been confirmed my belief that I should just leave this running all the time. The room is quite clean, so I'm taking credit.

• 56:39Justin Roczniak?

  I also do that. Oh, my room is quite clean for the first time in a very long time.

• 56:46Justin Roczniak?

  Because I threw a whole bunch of shit out. I didn't do it. Riley didn't. Thank you to Riley. Not Riley from Trash Future, other Riley who's not on social media.

• 56:58November Kelly?

  Yeah, Riley, Riley from Trash Future came to Philadelphia, cleaned out your apartment and then left.

• 57:04Justin Roczniak?

  Out of my apartment. Yeah, then left. Exactly. So let's say.

• 57:08November Kelly?

  You're there clutching your like emotional support takeout container, just like, no, I need it.

• 57:15Justin Roczniak?

  Well, it's one of those nice standardized court containers. They all fit nicely into each other. Anyway, let's say you use that four or five times. It's waste now, right? Anyway.

• 57:28Justin Roczniak?

  They don't last forever.

• 57:33Justin Roczniak?

  So it's waste, right?

• 57:37Justin Roczniak?

  You know, and, and you can, you can maybe recycle it. Or you can say you recycle it. A lot of plastic recycling is fake. That's a different episode, right? Or it goes to, you know, the bottom of the chart here.

• 57:52Justin Roczniak?

  You dump it, right? Disposal. It goes to the landfill or it gets incinerated, right? Incineration, of course, can produce energy. But it also creates ash that goes to the landfill. The landfill produced nasty stuff like leachate. We'll talk about later, right? Which that's, that's, that's a whole thing right there, right? So this is at the least favored end of the reduce, reuse, recycle schedule, right? You know, this is the stuff, stuff winds up in landfills, but there's a lot of ways to avoid that. And that's, that's what this big complicated

• 58:35Justin Roczniak?

  defense chart is about. It says you can use that standardized takeout container four or five times before you really got to throw it out. Anyway.

• 58:46Justin Roczniak?

  But yeah, you want to divert stuff from the landfill. That's, that's the end of the slide right there. Now, stuff does go to landfill.

• 58:53November Kelly?

  I like the smiley faces where it's just like happy, neutral, and then three times dissociating, which is kind of how I've been lately.

• 59:02Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 59:03Speaker 00

  I gotta go to the bathroom.

• 59:05Justin Roczniak?

  Uh oh.

• 59:06Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, good. Oh, we're an hour inward.

• 59:08November Kelly?

  We've got like 40 more slides. Hold it.

• 59:11Liam McAnderson?

  This is gonna be a doozy.

• 59:14Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, this is, uh, this is why I was gonna, I was, I was gonna really try.

• 59:20Liam McAnderson?

  You got to tell Sam.

• 59:21Justin Roczniak?

  I, Sam has created a year-long episode.

• 59:29November Kelly?

  It's fine. I can still be doing this this time next year.

• 59:32Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 59:33Liam McAnderson?

  No problem.

• 59:34Justin Roczniak?

  Damn, here I was planning a three-part extravaganza extravaganza and Sam might have just done it for us.

• 59:41November Kelly?

  A three-part extravaganza is like some shit that we all did in uni.

• 59:45Liam McAnderson?

  Isn't this weed?

• 59:47Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 59:47November Kelly?

  Yeah, yeah, it's a weed joke.

• 59:51November Kelly?

  I say that I'm stealing valor. I've smoked weed one time in my life.

• 59:54Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, I'm not a, not a big weed guy. I always liked cocaine and alcohol and prescription.

• 59:59November Kelly?

  Oh, yeah. The gentleman's choice.

• 1:00:03Liam McAnderson?

  Thank you, November.

• 1:00:04Justin Roczniak?

  I was not good at weed.

• 1:00:06Liam McAnderson?

  Hmm.

• 1:00:07Justin Roczniak?

  Are we back?

• 1:00:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:00:09Liam McAnderson?

  Wow, you.

• 1:00:10November Kelly?

  That's a quick piss, goddamn.

• 1:00:11Justin Roczniak?

  Very, very quick. Yeah, okay. So the first thing we gotta talk about here.

• 1:00:18Liam McAnderson?

  Look at that stream.

• 1:00:20Justin Roczniak?

  Well, I've seen a racehorse piss. It's a, it's a, it's a strong stream, but it still takes a long time. There's a lot of volume to dispose of, yeah.

• 1:00:29Speaker 00

  Look, there are some upsides to having had a GRS yet. And part of it is that you get to, you get to go quicker.

• 1:00:37Speaker 00

  It's an efficiency thing. So if I ever pursue my dream career of being in a, like, LeMans driver, I can, I can have faster pit stops.

• 1:00:46Liam McAnderson?

  Kids are just going in the suit.

• 1:00:47November Kelly?

  Getting like gender for it, because it's like, yeah, I'm not getting, I'm not getting bottom surgery, so I can use the pilot relief tube on an A10 cockpit.

• 1:01:00Speaker 00

  Wasn't that that Isabel fall story?

• 1:01:04November Kelly?

  Yeah, kind of also. It surprises me how few people know that a lot of, a lot of planes just have like a, like a piss tube that you can just piss into in the cockpit. Crazy work. Anyway.

• 1:01:14Justin Roczniak?

  So let's talk about landfills. It's the oldest, most common form of waste disposal, right?

• 1:01:20Liam McAnderson?

  Throw it in the trash, baby.

• 1:01:22Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, throw it in a hole. Take your municipal waste, put it in a big hole, maybe a big pile, right? They're not that great as a disposal system, right? But there's ways you can manage it. You know, you, you can do like remediation after it's full. You can limit how much stuff leaches out of the landfill. You to the limit, like the various, you know, toxic elements in there that leach out of the environment. But you can also have very bad landfills, which is what this episode's about.

• 1:01:58Justin Roczniak?

  So one of the major issues is something called leech it, right? Or leech aid, excuse me. And leech aid is, um, you know, just it's the garbage juice, right? Um, everyone knows garbage juice.

• 1:02:14November Kelly?

  No. Yeah, the bag splits and you're wearing like open toed shoes. Yeah, we're aware.

• 1:02:21Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, or it's like, you know, fucking, um, it's, it's the three week old handy nasty.

• 1:02:29Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, my God, why is it wet?

• 1:02:33November Kelly?

  That's a disfavorable set of words. Yeah.

• 1:02:36Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, no, you don't wanna, you don't want that. You don't want that in the, you don't want that in the groundwater, right? Because it hasn't fermented for five years and turned into a delicious sauce.

• 1:02:46November Kelly?

  What is this liquid? Well, it used to be a salad dressing from a Czech restaurant called Domi Handjob. And now it's like, I don't know what it is.

• 1:03:01Justin Roczniak?

  So, so.

• 1:03:12Justin Roczniak?

  If that soaks into the ground.

• 1:03:19Justin Roczniak?

  It, it, um,

• 1:03:23Justin Roczniak?

  it gets into the groundwater and then it gets sucked up into like someone's well or something, which is not good because then they're drinking it, right? That's bad.

• 1:03:32November Kelly?

  Hmm. Yeah. Why does this water taste like bin?

• 1:03:36Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. And if you have a good landfill, you have some kind of impenetrable liner on the bottom. Impenetrable is relative, but a lot of times this is some kind of like plastic liner, you know, which is going to just sit there, you know, hopefully forever, right? In order to.

• 1:03:57November Kelly?

  It's a beautiful American flag blue.

• 1:04:00Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, exactly. No, no, that one didn't work. You need something better than that. Um, oh crap, I didn't mean to switch the slides. Anyway.

• 1:04:10Justin Roczniak?

  But yeah, oh crap, where was I? So you need the, you need the liner, right? You still need monitoring of the liner, you know, to make sure that stuff isn't leaching down into the aquifer, right? Cause these things are supposed to last basically forever. You gotta remember, they are not so different from like a trash bag though, right? They are, they're, they're kind of thin, plastic liners usually, right? They can leak, right? They also have gas, right?

• 1:04:45Liam McAnderson?

  Hmm.

• 1:04:46Justin Roczniak?

  There's all kinds of nasty fermenting stuff in there. And that is mostly producing methane, right? Natural gas, right? You also got CO2, of course, from the fermentation process, right? And at the bottom, I don't know.

• 1:05:02November Kelly?

  This is both like a kind of jar of kimchi and like an instant pot. This is troubling. I don't like thinking of the garbage casserole.

• 1:05:11Justin Roczniak?

  It does get very hot in there a lot of the times. Yeah.

• 1:05:15Liam McAnderson?

  I don't like that you said the sentence garbage casserole to me. Don't, don't really like that. I'm not gonna lie.

• 1:05:21Speaker 00

  Is that a Mormon dish?

• 1:05:22Justin Roczniak?

  I'm no garbage.

• 1:05:23Liam McAnderson?

  Plate? That's Rochester, New York.

• 1:05:25Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I was about to say, what if you, what if you made a garbage blade into a casserole? That sounds. No, that'd be really good.

• 1:05:31November Kelly?

  Joking.

• 1:05:32Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:33Liam McAnderson?

  A garbage plate?

• 1:05:34Justin Roczniak?

  Garbage blade. Yeah.

• 1:05:36November Kelly?

  I mean, I can't judge. I'm from the land of the munchy box.

• 1:05:38Speaker 00

  It's uh, what is baby?

• 1:05:41Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, yeah, no, this, this, this is a podcast about upstate New York now.

• 1:05:47November Kelly?

  Fucking buffalo. You have all of that mozzarella and you just like insist on doing something called a garbage plate instead?

• 1:05:54Justin Roczniak?

  Oh yeah, it's, it's really fucking good. Actually, you got some, uh, got some pasta salad. You got the, uh, the, the chili, you got the, the, the, the white hots on top. You got the ketchup and mustard. What else is there? There's fries, I think. I don't, I like. Yeah. Yeah. Ah, fuck.

• 1:06:14Liam McAnderson?

  Good news. You still got six and a half hours left.

• 1:06:19Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, we're all gonna, we're all gonna, you know, we have enough podcasts left that we could all go to Rochester and get one.

• 1:06:26Speaker 00

  Nova's gonna have another birthday in the course of this episode.

• 1:06:30November Kelly?

  Six, six and a half hours with like a four second lag and I'm just, I'm just making it work. I'm just.

• 1:06:43Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, um, you know, one thing you can do with all that gas, right, is you can recover it, right? And well, ideally you, you, especially with methane, at the very least, you want to burn it. Because it's less significant greenhouse gas if you burn it. But you can also collect that heat energy to drive a turbine, right? And then you get electricity. Ooh.

• 1:07:14Speaker 00

  Or Grok.

• 1:07:16November Kelly?

  Yeah, Grok.

• 1:07:17Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:17November Kelly?

  Some of us, some of us fondly remember the garbage to energy plant in SimCity as the highest level of civilization.

• 1:07:24Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. Yes. We'll talk about those in a bit. There's a fun Italian word for them, which we'll get to.

• 1:07:32November Kelly?

  Ooh.

• 1:07:33Justin Roczniak?

  But well, that, that's, that's, that's a preview of coming attractions. So yeah, you know, this, the, these are ways you can manage the landfill to make it less harmful. But you know, these things usually they smell, they look pretty bad. Uh, they're, they're, um, they can be noisy. They attract pests. You know, there's a lot of like, you know, what eats garbage? You know, uh, rats.

• 1:07:58November Kelly?

  Birds, birds do. And then, and then like Dutch couples go and take photographs of the birds and they get Hunter virus.

• 1:08:06Justin Roczniak?

  Oh shit, we completely missed that. Um, I don't know.

• 1:08:10November Kelly?

  That's just a full force of thing that happened is, is like, uh.

• 1:08:14Justin Roczniak?

  That thing entirely happened. Yeah.

• 1:08:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:08:18Justin Roczniak?

  These are things that usually happen in bad landfills as opposed to, uh, well managed ones. But all of them have an issue, which is that they have a limited capacity. They're eventually full, right? And then they require some future remediation, you know?

• 1:08:35Justin Roczniak?

  Here, here, here, here's a, here's a quote here. In 1999, the European Union has issued the landfill directive 1999 slash 33 slash EC, aiming to divert waste from landfilling, in particular, member states have been forced to introduce national strategies to cut down biodegradable municipal waste BMW. That's a hell of a slight against that company. Address to.

• 1:09:02Liam McAnderson?

  The Nazis, fuck them.

• 1:09:03Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:04November Kelly?

  Thank you. Thank you, Sam. Very cool. Without that, I would never have known.

• 1:09:09Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. So, um, anyway, uh, remediation can actually be pretty successful, right? To the point where old or abandoned landfills are repurposed as parks, right? One, one famous example, which is under construction right now, is Fresh Kills Park in Staten Island, which replaced this Fresh Kills landfill, right? Or pictured here is the famous Mount Trashmore in Virginia Beach.

• 1:09:44November Kelly?

  Hell, yeah.

• 1:09:46November Kelly?

  Okay, sure. I mean, I love, I love how lumpy every remediated landfill is because it, it, it makes me imagine like a nomadic warrior being like, you know, what mighty king is buried under this and it's just like 50 years of Labubus?

• 1:10:02Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, it's full of, it's full of He-Man action figures.

• 1:10:07Speaker 00

  It's a cairn for Funko Pops.

• 1:10:10Liam McAnderson?

  This is where they buried all those copies of.

• 1:10:12November Kelly?

  I mean, it is kind of like a rich tradition, right? To like inter your most sort of sacred and valuable figures in sort of like artificial hills. And I think that, you know, what's better than to exemplify the values of a capitalist society than a mound of garbage?

• 1:10:29Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. I mean, when I'm dead, throw me in the trash.

• 1:10:32Liam McAnderson?

  Already ahead of you.

• 1:10:35November Kelly?

  Hmm. That's where, that's where we put the plastic, our most honored commodity.

• 1:10:39Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, that's a good point. Yeah. But, uh, we're, we're not, we're not talking about successful landfills. Here are some pictures of the landfills we're talking about today in Campania, right? The, oh God, there's more Italian words.

• 1:10:56November Kelly?

  Yeah, bye.

• 1:10:57Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:59November Kelly?

  Giuliano and Santa Maria della Fossa.

• 1:11:02Justin Roczniak?

  Giuliano. Yeah. And Santa Maria della Fossa, which sounds like a beautiful church you're supposed to visit and get an indulgence. No, it's a landfill.

• 1:11:11November Kelly?

  Hmm. It's a beautiful landfill you visit and get Hunter virus.

• 1:11:20Justin Roczniak?

  Giuliano landfill is, I almost said landfill like it was a town.

• 1:11:26Justin Roczniak?

  Giuliano landfill was notable because about a decade ago, Italian authorities evicted a bunch of Roma people and forced them to live next to it.

• 1:11:35November Kelly?

  That's a shitty thing to do. Yeah, that tracks, that tracks sort of average European reaction to Roma people, um, is to become.

• 1:11:44Justin Roczniak?

  There are cycles about Roma people. Oh my God. Yeah.

• 1:11:48November Kelly?

  Yep. Yep. I know.

• 1:11:50Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. Yeah. South and central Italian provinces often have a landfill disposal rate above average. Prior to adopting the aforementioned 1999 EU landfill directive, 82% of Italy's biodegradable municipal waste was sent to landfills. This is in 1995.

• 1:12:12November Kelly?

  Put it in the hole. I'm not going to do an Italian accent, but like, just put it in the hole. And you know what else?

• 1:12:17Justin Roczniak?

  I insist that you do.

• 1:12:23November Kelly?

  Oh, I put the garbage in the hole.

• 1:12:26Justin Roczniak?

  I put the garbage in the hole.

• 1:12:29Justin Roczniak?

  I'm sorry too.

• 1:12:37Justin Roczniak?

  No, I guess it gets worse later on. Um.

• 1:12:42November Kelly?

  I discriminate against ethnic minorities.

• 1:12:49Justin Roczniak?

  Now, now you might think, or you could think, or for some reason, a lot of people think this is because of some special thing about, uh, southern Italy. Uh, but no, production of waste per capital, or per capita in southern Italy is not higher than that of the rest of Italy, right? Now.

• 1:13:11November Kelly?

  Would be funny if it was. It would be funny if like, uh, like Neapolitans were just throwing stuff out for fun, just like buying it just to throw it away. Like to me in my culture, the greatest pleasure you can have is throwing something in the garbage. So I just buy some Labubus and throw them in the garbage every day.

• 1:13:29Justin Roczniak?

  Shred them down. What you're describing is me over the past three weeks.

• 1:13:34Liam McAnderson?

  I didn't know you were a big Labubu guy, Ross.

• 1:13:36November Kelly?

  Me over the last couple of years, to be honest.

• 1:13:38Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:41Justin Roczniak?

  So the other thing you can do with municipal waste is set it on fire.

• 1:13:49November Kelly?

  Ah.

• 1:13:50Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, it's a good idea. Preferably this is done in a proper incinerator, right? So this is.

• 1:13:59November Kelly?

  Why have they made this building out of construction paper?

• 1:14:05Justin Roczniak?

  That's a good question. I, I think we, I think we get back to that later. Um, this is the Asara incinerator in 2019. This is not a very good incinerator, right? You may notice there's big piles of garbage here.

• 1:14:23Justin Roczniak?

  Probably shouldn't have that outdoors.

• 1:14:24November Kelly?

  Yeah. It's more, it's more of a yard that happens to have a couple of smoke stacks, maybe.

• 1:14:30Justin Roczniak?

  Pretty much, yeah. Incineration is pretty good for municipal solid waste and solid residue from wastewater treatment, which is, that's a fun one.

• 1:14:40November Kelly?

  Ugh.

• 1:14:40Justin Roczniak?

  Um, yeah, no, that they, they, yeah, they ship big blocks of poop to incinerators and burn them.

• 1:14:48November Kelly?

  Wow. God, goddamn, okay, sure, I'm never complaining about my job ever again.

• 1:14:54Speaker 00

  That was the worst derailment ever, ever created.

• 1:14:59Justin Roczniak?

  No, um, there was a case a few years ago, a town in Georgia had a train.

• 1:15:05Liam McAnderson?

  That's right.

• 1:15:06Justin Roczniak?

  Full of blocks of poop that was stuck in a yard.

• 1:15:11Justin Roczniak?

  For several weeks and it was unpleasant, unpleasant. I mean,

• 1:15:18November Kelly?

  Now, hold on a second. Hold on a second. This is, this, this is important to me to know. How long on a side is one of these cubes? Are we talking like a centimeters, meters? Like, what, what are we talking about?

• 1:15:30Speaker 00

  I'm pretty sure it's those, it's those trash cars, right? Like, they're just, they're like the size of a cargo container.

• 1:15:35Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, no, there's a specific type of container they use, at least in the United States. Uh, if you ever see a train with these containers that say epic on the side,

• 1:15:49Justin Roczniak?

  that's full of poop cubes.

• 1:15:51November Kelly?

  About, about to do the least fruitful train theft in history?

• 1:15:57Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, that would be, that would be pretty bad if you did. Don't, don't, don't steal from those trains. You're gonna regret it. Anyway.

• 1:16:06Justin Roczniak?

  Gonna have a bad time. Kind of a shitty, shitty time.

• 1:16:10Speaker 00

  The second worst thing to train jack next to, uh, the, the nuclear missile car.

• 1:16:19Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, anyway, you're incinerating municipal solid waste and poop, right? And that reduces the volume of solid waste by like 80 to 95%, right? So this is, this is, okay, so I actually, um, editorialized here a bit. So the Italian word for waste to energy as a concept is thermovalerizatore.

• 1:16:50Justin Roczniak?

  Also like,

• 1:16:52Justin Roczniak?

  thermovalerizatore. I don't speak.

• 1:16:59Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. But there's this word thermovalorizer, which I, I believe is also only used as a concept. That just means waste to energy. Um, cause you're, it's interesting, cause like you're valorizing the waste and like Marxist sense. You're turning it into a new commodity, you know, or, you know, anyway.

• 1:17:25November Kelly?

  This is why, this is why Gramsci was Italian.

• 1:17:33Justin Roczniak?

  It is a fun thing to say. I gotta start. We gotta bring that.

• 1:17:39Justin Roczniak?

  Dermovaleritatore. Anyway, so here's.

• 1:17:44November Kelly?

  Yeah, I like the pastor term of valoritatore, please.

• 1:17:51Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, you want a garbage plate?

• 1:17:56November Kelly?

  First wave of Italian immigrants into Buffalo.

• 1:18:01Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, a ratchet, but yeah.

• 1:18:05Justin Roczniak?

  So if you do this incineration process properly, this is a very clean and efficient operation. Actually, actually, this is, this is the big incinerator for Alexandria, Virginia, right? Which is right near where I went to high school, right? It processes loads and loads of waste.

• 1:18:25November Kelly?

  Everything in Virginia looks like the CIA.

• 1:18:28Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, that's, that's true.

• 1:18:32Justin Roczniak?

  You know, they process loads of waste each day. No one even knew it was there, right? Plus, you know, this process incineration is actually very good at recovering metal from the waste stream because metal doesn't burn, right? So you just get a pile of ash and metal and use a big magnet and you separate that out. Get free metal, right? And it generates electricity, which is fun. We'll talk about generating electricity in the next slide.

• 1:19:01Justin Roczniak?

  But yeah, I mean, incineration, you know, even though it's on the least favored in the reduce, reuse, recycle, you know, sort of chain there, it's still, it, it works pretty good. Now, sometimes if you're doing recycling, especially if you're doing it for profit, especially if you're doing it specifically to generate electricity, you want to do some treatments to the waste beforehand. Um, right. Which is how we get to something called, and this is, I think, more of an EU thing because the Alexandria one, they just let you drive up and dump your waste at the incinerator and they take it. But in the EU, it's everything's more complicated.

• 1:19:45Justin Roczniak?

  Refuse derived fuel, right? In the form of eco bales, right?

• 1:19:52November Kelly?

  These, these are, these are mucky rolls. These, these, uh, like, yeah.

• 1:19:59Justin Roczniak?

  That's a big fucking seaweed plant. Yeah.

• 1:20:08Justin Roczniak?

  So refuse incineration is treated as a renewable source of energy under Italian law, and as such is heavily subsidized by the government. Under European Union law, however, is not categorized as renewable.

• 1:20:24November Kelly?

  Oh, we could do some real fraud. The Italian government for also, also looking, looking at all of these big mucky rolls. And I'm like, me, why am I sick? And then smash cut to the sushi that I ate earlier, and it looked like this.

• 1:20:46Justin Roczniak?

  It costs about 70 euros per, I'm going to assume this is megawatt hour and not megawatt. Megawatt hour of energy.

• 1:20:56November Kelly?

  Jesus Christ.

• 1:20:57Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, produced in 2009. Um, now with these things, you have to produce a certain amount of energy when you burn them. And there's rules about what can go into refuse derived fuel, so on and so forth.

• 1:21:12November Kelly?

  Fucking Italians and their protected designations of origin, you know, it's like, oh, it's gonna only have like four ingredients.

• 1:21:21Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, car, uh, cardboard, um, and shit, what else would go up? Cardboard, plastic, uh, and olive oil. Um, no.

• 1:21:35November Kelly?

  Yeah, cardboard, plastic, olive oil and labubus.

• 1:21:39Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, exactly. So you need a maximum humidity of 15%, right? You know, you don't want too much water content because you want to ensure your energy returned on investment or your EROI.

• 1:21:51November Kelly?

  Yeah, you kind of have a wet marquee roll. Sure.

• 1:21:56Justin Roczniak?

  If, yeah, exactly. Because if it's too humid, right? You use more energy to burn the fuel than it produces. Because a lot of times these incinerators, they have to be assisted with like, you know, natural gas, you know, burners and stuff like that. Over here in the United States, we don't really care about that. But this is Europe where they care about stuff. So.

• 1:22:20November Kelly?

  This beautiful Keynesianism where it's like the government pays you to burn garbage in a way that is actually more expensive.

• 1:22:30Justin Roczniak?

  So if you, if there's, yeah, if there's too much water in there, you know, you use more energy to burn it than it produces, you just lose, you lose money. Well, not quite because people pay you to take the waste. But, you know, there's also limits on contaminants, you know, mercury, arsenic, so on and so forth.

• 1:22:53Justin Roczniak?

  Boy, this is a big, long, long one. The Italian Industrial Property Code adopted in 1992. This is.

• 1:23:05November Kelly?

  Okay.

• 1:23:06Justin Roczniak?

  SIP 6, right? Favors the production of electricity through renewable and assimilated energy with public money, right? This latter category, assimilated energy, refers to any energy production method based on energy recuperation. For instance, incineration, okay? Right? You, you, you want renewable and, you know, stuff that's used, stuff that's made with waste.

• 1:23:42November Kelly?

  The, the, the Italian government decides that this is renewable energy, so they're going to subsidize it for you, right?

• 1:23:49Justin Roczniak?

  Well, it's pretty renewable. People aren't gonna stop making garbage.

• 1:23:53Liam McAnderson?

  They're gonna throw stuff out forever.

• 1:23:54Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:57Justin Roczniak?

  So producers of this energy can sell the electricity at a higher rate than that of non-renewable sources and the difference in price is paid by a tax that every citizen pays on their electricity bill.

• 1:24:14Justin Roczniak?

  And this SIP 6 code enabled increased production of this assimilated energy specifically from incineration favoring the construction of these big RDF incineration plants across the country.

• 1:24:30November Kelly?

  Yeah. If I wanted to be cynical, and I'm not going to jump the gun on the sort of point of the episode, but if you told me that there's a line item in my tax thing that's like, this is going to pay for burning the garbage, then I would probably go to the government as a good conscientious citizen and be like, I am a term of valor de desearzato or whatever, and so is my wife, money, please.

• 1:24:57Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. And I would say, I know my rights and burn my garbage in a barrel in the backyard.

• 1:25:03November Kelly?

  Right there with you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And so long as I'm burning the barrel, it's like legally speaking, I am a producer of renewable energy and I will be taking some of that subsidy money.

• 1:25:19Justin Roczniak?

  Exactly, exactly. Yeah, give me that, give me that, give me those subsidies. I want to, I want to burn trash. Give me that trash. I'm going to burn it. I'm going to burn your trash. You're going to be so happy. You won't have the trash anymore and I'll have it and I'll burn it. It'll be great. It'll be so good.

• 1:25:39Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, who else had that idea? Well, we got to talk about a group called the mafia.

• 1:25:51Justin Roczniak?

  You come to me on the day of my daughter's new podcast release and ask me to do a voiceover for money. Anyway.

• 1:26:01November Kelly?

  I feel like that line was for Garrus, you know?

• 1:26:04Justin Roczniak?

  Not that.

• 1:26:10Justin Roczniak?

  So the mafia is a nonspecific catchall term for a variety of mostly Italian, Sam capitalized those, mostly Italian organized crime groups, right? So you have the Sicilian mafia, we all know that, the Cosa Nostra, one of the most, you know, the family that's most commonly referred to as the mafia. But these organizations are also regionally specific, right?

• 1:26:40Justin Roczniak?

  In Campania, it's the Camorra.

• 1:26:46November Kelly?

  Yes.

• 1:26:46Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. Yeah. And they date back to the 18th century. They're one of the oldest and largest organized crime groups in Italy. It's divided into clans and the clan we're primarily focusing on is the, oh, boy, the Casalesi?

• 1:27:08November Kelly?

  The Casalesi.

• 1:27:09Justin Roczniak?

  Casalesi, okay, okay.

• 1:27:12November Kelly?

  These are our Tony Sopranos.

• 1:27:15Justin Roczniak?

  Okay, good, good. I just want, I want them to be familiar.

• 1:27:20Speaker 00

  I really enjoy how this, this specific crime organization dates back to the foundation of our country.

• 1:27:27Liam McAnderson?

  And before modern Italy, because that was.

• 1:27:29November Kelly?

  Yeah, we have been doing crimes for like far, far longer than the United States has existed. Yeah.

• 1:27:38Justin Roczniak?

  Technically more legitimate than anything Vittorio Emanuele could have come up with.

• 1:27:46Liam McAnderson?

  That's tasty. I like that.

• 1:27:50Justin Roczniak?

  So yeah, from Castle de Principi, Principi, anyway.

• 1:27:57November Kelly?

  Durban.

• 1:27:58Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, it's northwest of Naples, southwest of Caserta. The Castelacy clan is heavily involved in the cement and milk industries. Hopefully not combined.

• 1:28:11November Kelly?

  You don't want to get those trucks mixed up.

• 1:28:12Justin Roczniak?

  I was about to say, you know, you're gonna.

• 1:28:16November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:16Justin Roczniak?

  Septic.

• 1:28:18November Kelly?

  Milk and cement.

• 1:28:19Justin Roczniak?

  Not same truck.

• 1:28:20November Kelly?

  Yeah, not same truck. Yeah, exactly.

• 1:28:23Justin Roczniak?

  Not, not same truck. Yeah. I mean, you're gonna really throw off the water cement ratio if you use milk instead.

• 1:28:30Justin Roczniak?

  As well as the international drug trade, right? You know?

• 1:28:35November Kelly?

  It's, it's, I'm doing this sort of Yamaha meme where it's like, well, I want my cement. I want my milk. If only there was somewhere I could get my heroin. You're not gonna believe this.

• 1:28:46Justin Roczniak?

  No, this is like the old fashioned, like, you know, they cut the milk with, you know, flour. They do it with cocaine here. It makes the milk cheaper. No, it doesn't do that. Excuse me.

• 1:28:59November Kelly?

  Cutting my cement with cocaine in order to make a structure that falls down way quicker and is also incredibly expensive.

• 1:29:10Speaker 00

  Hey, that's how they built the, the 250 World's Fair fucking fake arches.

• 1:29:18November Kelly?

  That one, that one needle tower off of Central Park as well.

• 1:29:22Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:24Justin Roczniak?

  Sam put a note here. I'm cheating with the Sopranos images because the mob slash the American mafia slash the Costa Nostra are totally uninvolved with this. Instead, the Costa Nostra, the civilian Sicilian mafia were apparently really into building super corrupt wind farms.

• 1:29:42Liam McAnderson?

  I love, I love infrastructure.

• 1:29:46November Kelly?

  How do you do like, I, I, how do you get a kickback from the wind? Like, does, boss, we made a windmill that don't turn.

• 1:29:55Liam McAnderson?

  Real sexy like you like it.

• 1:29:58November Kelly?

  At a certain point, it's more impressive to have a wind farm that doesn't work.

• 1:30:06Justin Roczniak?

  It's it's the woke mafia.

• 1:30:08November Kelly?

  In in the mafia, in the mafia corruption labs, guys in like with like gold chains and lab coats trying to come up with ways of inventing wind power that doesn't work so they can cheat the state and it requires a lot of theoretical physics.

• 1:30:25Justin Roczniak?

  I'm imagining there's like a bunch of like different mobs that are like doing different elemental scams. You got the wind mafia, you got, you know.

• 1:30:35November Kelly?

  Yeah, the fire nation.

• 1:30:37Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, the water mafia, they made a deal with Poseidon to make tidal power plants work better. You know, you got the, yeah, exactly, wind nation, fire nation. What are the other ones?

• 1:30:49Speaker 00

  Earth.

• 1:30:50Justin Roczniak?

  Earth, water, heart.

• 1:30:54Liam McAnderson?

  I don't know.

• 1:30:57November Kelly?

  Doing doing Avatar.

• 1:30:59Justin Roczniak?

  But he's wearing a fedora.

• 1:31:00November Kelly?

  One of, one of the nations in Avatar is just the mafia is a great bit.

• 1:31:09Speaker 00

  That was just Legend of Korra.

• 1:31:12November Kelly?

  Yeah, fuck it was.

• 1:31:14Speaker 00

  They had the mafia in Legend of Korra.

• 1:31:16Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:17November Kelly?

  Fake lesbian.

• 1:31:18Speaker 00

  Sorry, you were beaten by about fifteen years.

• 1:31:22November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:26Justin Roczniak?

  So the Kamura really benefit from the nineteen ninety, nineteen eighty Arapinyo earthquake, right?

• 1:31:36Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, this is, this is a big fucking earthquake, right? Moment magnitude of six point nine, maximum Mercalli intensity of ten. Um, that I think Mercalli intensity, what is Mercalli intensity? I should look this up. Yeah, shit.

• 1:31:54November Kelly?

  I mean, it does, it could say ten or it could say X for extreme.

• 1:32:00Justin Roczniak?

  Oh.

• 1:32:01November Kelly?

  It's like, it's way scarier if it's an alphabetic, alphabetical scale.

• 1:32:07Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, yeah, that's true. Uh, it is the effects. Okay, so that's, that's, uh, like.

• 1:32:20Justin Roczniak?

  It measures the intensity of shaking at any particular location. Okay, right. Um, anyway. I'm working through this with the rest of y'all. Be patient. Anyway.

• 1:32:37Justin Roczniak?

  It's a big fucking earthquake. It's very bad, right? And after this, the region is flooded with public money, right? For recovery efforts and because and reconstruction and because of this, there's not a lot of sort of uh oversight, right?

• 1:32:58November Kelly?

  Sounds about right.

• 1:33:01Justin Roczniak?

  So in.

• 1:33:02November Kelly?

  Oh, wait, fuck. Who owns the concrete industry?

• 1:33:06Justin Roczniak?

  Hmm. Who owns the milk industry?

• 1:33:10November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:11Liam McAnderson?

  Amphetamines.

• 1:33:13Justin Roczniak?

  So in.

• 1:33:17Justin Roczniak?

  The Casalese clan uh had a monopoly on the local market of concrete provision and land movement, which I think a land movement here means excavation, right? Or.

• 1:33:32November Kelly?

  Yeah, so they're the guys and.

• 1:33:34Justin Roczniak?

  They're the guys you call. Yeah.

• 1:33:38Justin Roczniak?

  And that also means they're key stakeholders in land planning and use in the region, right?

• 1:33:47Justin Roczniak?

  So it's estimated that a $40 billion spent on reconstruction, about $6.4 billion, end up in the pockets of the Kamara, right?

• 1:34:01November Kelly?

  I mean, that's that's bad, but it's not as bad as I was expecting. I was expecting that that $40 billion just to go directly to like the mob.

• 1:34:09Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's this actually sounds like a good deal right about now.

• 1:34:13Justin Roczniak?

  I was about to say, you know, I'm surprised there's that many non-mob construction firms.

• 1:34:18Speaker 00

  It takes that fucking long and that much money to do environmental review in Seattle. Like, this seems fine. Fuck it.

• 1:34:28November Kelly?

  What's the Seattle mob called?

• 1:34:31Speaker 00

  They pretend they care about orcas as a pretense to block every new apartment being constructed in the city, because we have to cut down trees to make space. And they're like, well, it's gonna kill all the orcas, because dense housing and fewer tire particulates are obviously going to be what kills them. I'm not even joking. I'm so fucking mad.

• 1:34:54Speaker 00

  We had a fucking consortium of wealthy homeowners that were intentionally trying to block helicopters from landing at a children's hospital for children in intensive care, because it interfered with their peace and quiet.

• 1:35:10Liam McAnderson?

  I am sympathetic to that as someone who grew up near a hospital. As I said, I thought many a day about sitting on my roof with an RPG 7.

• 1:35:16Speaker 00

  Fuck them kids.

• 1:35:18Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, no, no. As someone who grew up around Washington DC, fuck them helicopters.

• 1:35:23November Kelly?

  Fuck them kids.

• 1:35:24Speaker 00

  But it was for children's ages.

• 1:35:31November Kelly?

  Just photoshopping you and Liam into like an old photo of the Taliban with a stinger missile on a mountain about to shoot down a life flight.

• 1:35:43Justin Roczniak?

  I would set up a toll. I would say, show me a picture of the kid and determine if the kid is cute enough that I would want to deal with the helicopter.

• 1:35:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:35:54November Kelly?

  On like a case by case basis, whether the thing is urgent enough to annoy you.

• 1:36:00Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, pretty much.

• 1:36:03November Kelly?

  Well, I get that. I think we're all we're all sick of like the sick kids like playing the system, right? Like, you know, they're riding high on the hog. They think that just because they have cancer or whatever, that they're better than me. And that they get to like ride in the helicopter. I don't get to ride in the helicopter. So what the fuck?

• 1:36:25Justin Roczniak?

  It's time to stop having sympathy for kids. And that's why I am taking this opportunity to say, join the IDF.

• 1:36:37Justin Roczniak?

  Um, no, sorry.

• 1:36:39November Kelly?

  Oh, boy.

• 1:36:44November Kelly?

  Oh, Jesus.

• 1:36:48Justin Roczniak?

  All right, all right, all right. Back to reality here.

• 1:36:54Justin Roczniak?

  So, why is the mob involved in like, construction, right? The mob is supposed to do like, crime crimes, right? You know, shooting people, leaving the gun, taking the cannoli, um, you know, uh... Gabagool, things of this nature? Gabagool, yeah, things of that nature, no. It's much easier and much safer to do things like illegal construction than it is to like, murder people and traffic drugs.

• 1:37:31November Kelly?

  Yeah, the state consider these to be like nerd crimes rather than cool crimes, which means you go to like nerd prison.

• 1:37:40Justin Roczniak?

  Exactly, exactly. It's like, oh my god, you didn't get the permits. And it's like, well, I have a gun.

• 1:37:48November Kelly?

  And then if they get you, you get to be the one jock in nerd prison.

• 1:37:52Justin Roczniak?

  Exactly, exactly. King of the nerds. I'm the king of the nerds.

• 1:37:59November Kelly?

  Your first day in nerd prison, one of the nerd gangs comes up to you, they're like, you know, menacingly running their slide rules.

• 1:38:11Justin Roczniak?

  You show up, you got a TI-89, you're smuggled in.

• 1:38:21Justin Roczniak?

  I'm through with your shit.

• 1:38:24November Kelly?

  It's like, no, obviously you don't condone this kind of discrimination out in like, real life, but like, nerds and dorks, they like, they're like, separate in prison, you know, because they're different gangs.

• 1:38:35Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, yeah, no, it's different gangs, yeah. They got a pencil smuggling ring, they got...

• 1:38:47November Kelly?

  Guy who joins the nerd brotherhood in prison, he's got like, a big tattoo of Dilbert on his chest.

• 1:38:55Justin Roczniak?

  Comes in with, comes in with like, like, like, like, you know, 20 Ty Kondoroga number two shoved up his ass.

• 1:39:06November Kelly?

  Ow, Jesus.

• 1:39:07Justin Roczniak?

  No, that would be pretty bad. Yeah.

• 1:39:10November Kelly?

  God damn.

• 1:39:16Speaker 00

  You wouldn't even have to change the myth for like nerd John Wick. He still could have killed two guys with a pencil.

• 1:39:28November Kelly?

  I love when the derangement starts to take hold.

• 1:39:39Justin Roczniak?

  Hi, it's Justin. So this is a commercial for the podcast that you're already listening to. People are annoyed by these, so let me get to the point. We have this thing called Patreon, right? The deal is you give us two bucks a month and we give you an extra episode once a month. Sometimes it's a little inconsistent, but you know, it's two bucks. You get what you pay for. It also gets you our full back catalog of bonus episodes. So you can learn about exciting topics like guns, pickup trucks, or pickup trucks with guns on them. The money we raise through Patreon goes to making sure that the only ad you hear on this podcast is this one.

• 1:40:22Justin Roczniak?

  Anyway, that's something to consider if you have two bucks to spare each month. Join at patreon.com/typod. Do it if you want, or don't. It's your decision and we respect that. Back to the show.

• 1:40:46Justin Roczniak?

  First day, your first day in nerd prison, you gotta go up to the guy with the biggest glasses and say to him, pie is exactly three.

• 1:40:57Liam McAnderson?

  So the sentence regards just stabbing a guy to death of like a real life CS:GO dagger or something. I don't know, man.

• 1:41:14Justin Roczniak?

  So through these construction and land dealings,

• 1:41:20Justin Roczniak?

  the Castle Lacy end up-

• 1:41:20November Kelly?

  You know, the process, the like, style of like sagging your pocket protector, that actually came out of prison because when they issued you one, it was like really poorly fitting.

• 1:41:35Justin Roczniak?

  They wouldn't, they wouldn't let you have a pen cap because you might use it as a, a shiv. So everyone's got an ink stain on it.

• 1:41:54Justin Roczniak?

  It's through construction and land dealings

• 1:41:59Justin Roczniak?

  that the Castle Lacy ended up embedded within the Campanian Municipal Administration, which gives them the power to influence public works projects and contracts, ensuring the work went to Kamora controlled companies.

• 1:42:18November Kelly?

  Yeah, sure. You start awarding the contracts to yourself and you work it from both ends. Yeah.

• 1:42:23Justin Roczniak?

  Exactly, exactly.

• 1:42:28Justin Roczniak?

  So how did the Castle Lacy clan move into illegal waste management?

• 1:42:37Justin Roczniak?

  And most sources say it dates back to the 1980s, right? In the early 1980s-

• 1:42:43November Kelly?

  This is a lot of highlighting.

• 1:42:46Justin Roczniak?

  Oh.

• 1:42:48Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I highlighted all the quotes because I don't know from which article they're from. And I was like, I should probably summarize these guys instead of like-

• 1:42:54November Kelly?

  I've gone, I've gone one.

• 1:42:55Justin Roczniak?

  I don't want to read them directly because then I'll wind up in a H bomber guy video. We said our sources, god damn it.

• 1:43:03November Kelly?

  Year one of college type thing where it's like you end up highlighting the entire page to prove that you've read it, like-

• 1:43:10Justin Roczniak?

  And what about it? I was gonna, I was gonna summarize this and then I had to go to the police station instead.

• 1:43:16November Kelly?

  What?

• 1:43:17Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, because of the RPG?

• 1:43:20November Kelly?

  They, they, yeah, they were trying to put you in nerd jail.

• 1:43:23Justin Roczniak?

  No, I actually had a, I had a, I had a 10 out of 10 experience with law enforcement today. I was going to go pick up some, uh, whatchamacallit, uh- Parking lane closure signs from, uh, from the Philadelphia Police Department for a friend is moving in, right? And I was like really pissed off that I had to do that. I've been pissed off about it for a while. And I thought I was gonna have to go there and wait in the line and like do all this crap. I was getting close to the police station. It was so fucking hot out. I had been walking a long time. It's really hot out right now. By the way, it's like 105 degrees. And, and I go up to the, the, the police headquarters and it's

• 1:44:05Justin Roczniak?

  like, oh shit, there's a metal detector and everything. I was apoplectic. I had been working myself up so long about this. I was just really mad and I go down in there and the guy asked me what, what I'm here for. And I was like, I'm getting, uh, parking lane closure signs. He was like, you have the permit? Yes, I do. And he was like, oh yeah, here, here, like the great billing vol. He says, here's your sign. Just hands them to me. And I was like, and then he was like, do you need some string to hang them up? I was like, yeah. And, and I was like, well, shit, that was way easier than I thought it was gonna be. I'd been mad for two days for nothing.

• 1:44:44Liam McAnderson?

  That is the most rawest thing I've ever heard in my life.

• 1:44:50Liam McAnderson?

  Other than, oh, I'm not as bad as I thought, as the appropriate level of bad fuck.

• 1:44:54Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:56November Kelly?

  Oh, you hate the police? Well, let's see how you feel when someone hands you a sign you need.

• 1:45:01Justin Roczniak?

  Hands, hands, hands me a sign I need like very promptly, like a 30 second interaction. Okay. Anyway, that was my experience with municipal government today. Very convenient and quick and, you know, and courteous. Helpful. And helpful. Yeah.

• 1:45:18November Kelly?

  Do, do you want me to have a go at summarizing this? Like just on the, off the dome?

• 1:45:25Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:28November Kelly?

  Okay, cuz I've been reading this while you were telling your cop story.

• 1:45:31Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, my cop story, yeah. Getting cancelled cuz I like cops now, actually.

• 1:45:37November Kelly?

  Who doesn't, right? But say you're an Italian company, right? You make the most heartbreakingly beautiful typewriters or like coffee cans or whatever the fuck it is in the world, right? Sophia Loren is advertising your product, but you still generate a lot of waste, right? And you have like a legal obligation to dispose of it and you can't just like throw it in a ditch, right? So what you do is you know a guy and that guy knows a guy.

• 1:46:03Justin Roczniak?

  The DOC waste.

• 1:46:06November Kelly?

  Yeah, exactly, right? And so like you know a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy with a Neapolitan accent who will like take care of it for less and you don't ask so many questions, right?

• 1:46:17Justin Roczniak?

  I like Neapolitan.

• 1:46:18November Kelly?

  And yeah, yeah, exactly. And so like pretty soon this gets to be a thing all over Europe, even out to like Germany is you're German, you run the company that makes machines that make machine parts that make machine parts and you send all of the fucking swarf or whatever to Italy, to your guy who's gonna dispose of it.

• 1:46:43Justin Roczniak?

  I got a garbage guy.

• 1:46:44November Kelly?

  That's, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the start of the 80s. Campania, it's a very poor region. It's got like bad oversight. It doesn't have a lot of public competition. And so because they've got the local government sewn up, pretty soon they can just like close down like hazardous weight. So like pretty soon they can just like muscle everybody else out of the business. Like a bunch of like competing waste disposal stuff in northern Italy closes down. And so it just makes sense if you're a company that you do this, right? And you save a ton of money doing this, right? Nobody wants to ask too many questions cuz like central government is like GDP number go up.

• 1:47:29November Kelly?

  All of this shit's getting like thrown into ditch or whatever in the south, which we don't care about. So whatever, and you make a lot of money. Nobody goes to nerd prison.

• 1:47:40Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, exactly. And you know, if you ask questions about like, I don't know, the benzene content, you say, I don't speak, no sprechen Sie Deutsch. No, excuse me, that's, that's two languages in one. Well, yeah, exactly. You know, that these, the hazardous waste aspect is, is not, you don't talk about it. You don't talk about what you're dumping where.

• 1:48:09Speaker 00

  Roz, you trying to speak any European language makes me understand why you almost get hit by cars so often.

• 1:48:14Liam McAnderson?

  Frequently.

• 1:48:18Justin Roczniak?

  Well, I get hit by cars.

• 1:48:21Speaker 00

  The sign can't stop me. I can't read.

• 1:48:25Justin Roczniak?

  It doesn't even have words on it. It's just a picture.

• 1:48:35Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:37November Kelly?

  Because, because they control, because they control the like area, it means they can decide where they're gonna dump it because they control the cement industry. It's like, there's a ton of like quarries and like open pits and stuff that they can dump stuff in. It's even not that bad of a deal if you're a farmer or whatever at first, because you're not really farming that much. And some guy in a suit is like, have, you know, 500,000 lira. So we can just put some stuff on your land and you don't worry about it. You take that money and then, you know, send your kid to college in the north of Italy, but they acquire a cool accent.

• 1:49:12Justin Roczniak?

  Also, a very crucial part of the concrete industry is having dump sites because concrete can go bad over the course of a few hours of a truck gets stuck in traffic or something.

• 1:49:26Liam McAnderson?

  Especially if you mix it with milk, dude.

• 1:49:28Justin Roczniak?

  Well, yeah, that's true. That's very true. But you do need a diversion site to unload bad concrete available at all times. And, you know, that is a convenient place for things to go missing.

• 1:49:45November Kelly?

  Snitches, labubus, et cetera.

• 1:49:49Justin Roczniak?

  Toxic waste.

• 1:49:55November Kelly?

  Alright, that's it, that's my summary.

• 1:49:56Justin Roczniak?

  If you got, if you got vacant land, it's a great place to dump stuff, right? Emptied quarries, another thing about this area is it is a volcano, or it's volcanic. There's lots of caves, there's lots of lava tubes and stuff like that, we'll get to this in a bit. It's great for hiding waste. And so it's very profitable to find, you know, some expensive waste somewhere and dump it here, right? It's very profitable and, you know, it doesn't seem to have any immediate ill effects. It's like, ah, this is some harmless mafia fun compared to, you know, you know, shooting people and trafficking drugs, right?

• 1:50:41Justin Roczniak?

  It made a lot of money, and yeah, you could only go to nerd jail, which you immediately win if you're a mafia guy, right? Unless you're, I don't know, you're the mafia nerd, you know?

• 1:50:58Justin Roczniak?

  So, anyway, with this in mind,

• 1:51:04Justin Roczniak?

  the Kamora come in and they do the illegal waste dumping, right? They dump the toxic waste.

• 1:51:17November Kelly?

  Uh huh, yeah.

• 1:51:19Justin Roczniak?

  So, this becomes a full industry.

• 1:51:22November Kelly?

  The benzene in the milk.

• 1:51:24Justin Roczniak?

  Alright.

• 1:51:29Justin Roczniak?

  Benzene.

• 1:51:35Justin Roczniak?

  So there's large, open-air dumps of toxic waste, but there's more interesting places where they dump the waste. They dump them in farm fields, they dump them on the side of roads, construction yards, they throw them in caves, right? But this is also Naples, right? So, you know, they're burying it sometimes, but not often. They're putting in normal landfills, unsuitable for hazardous waste. But the one I think is most interesting here is they threw it in the crater of Vesuvius.

• 1:52:09November Kelly?

  Yeah, man. Listen, you can't say that's not an incinerator.

• 1:52:13Liam McAnderson?

  If that comes back out, it's somebody else's problem.

• 1:52:16Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, that's, that's a lot of people's problem when it comes out, but you know, it's gonna be the least everyone's problem. I mean, this is, this is like a child's understanding of waste disposal. Why don't we just throw it all in a volcano? The mob has tried this.

• 1:52:35Justin Roczniak?

  They also reclassify hazardous waste and dispose of it through non-hazardous waste routes, right? You know? They just, they just take, I don't know, your cube of cadmium and send it to a incinerator, right?

• 1:52:50November Kelly?

  Yeah, or they say it's fertilizer and you spread your fields with like cadmium or whatever. And then you wonder why all your plants are dying.

• 1:52:58Justin Roczniak?

  Why, this is suspiciously metallic fertilizer.

• 1:53:07Justin Roczniak?

  Italy held the record for waste disappearance with about 31 million tons of hazardous waste vanishing without legal treatment.

• 1:53:17November Kelly?

  I gotta be honest, I didn't know there was a league table in that. I haven't been paying attention to it. I, I hope England are ranked well, but you know.

• 1:53:31Speaker 00

  That's from the, uh, the C E, C E C, by the way.

• 1:53:36Justin Roczniak?

  Ah. Wait, what's this?

• 1:53:37Speaker 00

  Which is the Civil Society Engagement with Ecological Economics.

• 1:53:41Justin Roczniak?

  Ah.

• 1:53:42Speaker 00

  It's, um, one of those bullshit acronyms where they like.

• 1:53:45November Kelly?

  Enjoyers over there.

• 1:53:46Speaker 00

  Yeah, civil lowercase society, uppercase engagement with E C capitalized, ecological, E C, anomics. Uh, which feels like bullshit, but that is where, that is who came up with this quote because they have an entire article about this. As the, the regional waste crisis, I just thought I'd throw that in there because it's a, it's a good quote. Um, but also I do like the idea of just Jimmy Hoffing, all your fucking cadmium.

• 1:54:14November Kelly?

  Yes.

• 1:54:16November Kelly?

  Into a volcano.

• 1:54:21Justin Roczniak?

  You're adding, you're adding this toxic waste to uh cement, concrete, metals, asphalt, and of course, dilution is the solution to pollution, so they dilute the waste and dispose of it in sewage systems and dump it in the river.

• 1:54:39Speaker 00

  I love the idea of the mafia reading that like Popular Mechanics article from 1950 where they show you how to dispose your used motor oil. And they're like, hey, it worked for them.

• 1:54:49Justin Roczniak?

  Hey Tone, I got a great idea about what to do with all this used motor oil.

• 1:54:54November Kelly?

  Into the

• 1:54:55Justin Roczniak?

  So what types of waste are we disposing of? We got sludge from various chemical industries, ashes from steel plants, right? Radioactive waste from hospitals, very common now that we have

• 1:55:18November Kelly?

  Jesus, how did they not do a Guyane incident?

• 1:55:20Justin Roczniak?

  I will get to that. Um scraps of textile, you know, uh from textile mills that was probably that was actually that one can be hazardous, you know, auto, you know, stuff from automobile manufacturers, things like that. Toxic powders, mud, soil mixed with toxic substances, you know.

• 1:55:43November Kelly?

  The automobile parts one is the one that's throwing me, right? Because I have a real Trangolismo sort of tie in for this, which is if you drive like an Alfa Romeo, right? At a certain point, you will come out to the curb and you will find that like a single part of your car is now 100% rust and will just dissipate to the four winds the second you like turn the key, right? And you will go, okay, cool. I really need a replacement part for this like tie rod or whatever the fuck it is, right? And I want you to know in that moment that the last supply of those that Alfa Romeo made was thrown into a volcano by a mobster.

• 1:56:29Justin Roczniak?

  Metal toxic components, hospital waste, sewage waste, industrial mud and oils. Now, this is an interesting one.

• 1:56:39Liam McAnderson?

  Industrial mud, brother.

• 1:56:42Justin Roczniak?

  There's lots of industrial muds. What the hell are you talking? It's like drilling.

• 1:56:49Justin Roczniak?

  It's like, what's, what's the, what's the really nice mud that's like really expensive?

• 1:56:53Liam McAnderson?

  The baseball mud?

• 1:56:55Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, not the baseball mud. No, it's, uh, you know, it's a clay I'm thinking of actually.

• 1:57:01November Kelly?

  I had a Japanese face mask like that once. I don't, is that what you're thinking of?

• 1:57:07Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, they can't use it again. They gotta dispose of it.

• 1:57:11November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:12Justin Roczniak?

  That might be a commercial mud, not an industrial one. Uh, you know.

• 1:57:17November Kelly?

  Sorry, this mud's only zoned for light commercial use.

• 1:57:24Justin Roczniak?

  You know, and they're, they're, they're shredding like automobiles, you know, stuff like that. All this fucking crap, even like.

• 1:57:33November Kelly?

  The last Lancia Delta Integra went directly into a car crusher and from there into Vesuvius.

• 1:57:41Justin Roczniak?

  Into the volcano. Yeah. Soil from graveyards.

• 1:57:49November Kelly?

  What's in this one? Oh, bunch of mud, uh, like some bones, a Lancia Stratos, uh, like a bunch of X-ray sources.

• 1:58:01Justin Roczniak?

  And grandma.

• 1:58:04Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, when I'm dead, just throw me in the trash. I've seen It's Always Sunny. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:58:07Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:58:10November Kelly?

  Into the volcano.

• 1:58:13Justin Roczniak?

  In 2004 and 2005, regional dumps were discovered containing radioactive waste.

• 1:58:20Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, I too have eaten at an Arby's special.

• 1:58:25Justin Roczniak?

  I, oh, that's pretty bad. You go in there and you have a regional dump?

• 1:58:29Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah.

• 1:58:36Justin Roczniak?

  They smelled that shit over in Conshohocken.

• 1:58:39Liam McAnderson?

  I hope they do.

• 1:58:45Justin Roczniak?

  So there's two downstream effects of this. The first is, uh, you know, folks start saying, hey, could you please stop covering the Italian countryside and all this shite?

• 1:58:58Justin Roczniak?

  You know?

• 1:58:59November Kelly?

  Counterpoint, counterpoint, I have a gun.

• 1:59:03Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, that's true.

• 1:59:06Justin Roczniak?

  Second is, you know, uh, that waste that shouldn't be going to landfills often this untreated industrial waste, which is falsely registered as non-hazardous, starts filling up all the landfills, right? People are noticing, wow, these landfills are filling up a lot quicker than they ought to be, right?

• 1:59:29November Kelly?

  Hmm, there's a lot more Lancia Stratos is in here than there should be.

• 1:59:33Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 1:59:35Justin Roczniak?

  So in the 90s, prosecutors tried to stop the flourishing waste traffic by shutting down some landfills because of their precarious sanitary conditions, right?

• 1:59:50Justin Roczniak?

  And the main consequence of those law enforcement actions was the interruption of urban waste collection with almost no proven effects on the illegal practices themselves.

• 2:00:03November Kelly?

  Elliot Ness comes to town and like breaks up the mob. And so now your bins can't get taken out, but all of the rivers are still full of radioactive waste.

• 2:00:12Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:00:15November Kelly?

  Beautiful.

• 2:00:16Liam McAnderson?

  Taking poop to look like Cobalt 60, baby, let's do this.

• 2:00:21Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, the world's first dirty shit.

• 2:00:27Liam McAnderson?

  Not the way I'm doing it.

• 2:00:36Justin Roczniak?

  So in 1993, February 1993, the first regional waste management plan was approved in order to reduce the use of landfills in Campania by 50%. In 1994, Italy declares a waste emergency and establishes-

• 2:00:53November Kelly?

  I hate to rag on Sam, right? But here's the thing, right? And this is not a criticism. I love you. Thank you for doing this for us. However, that's not what it says. What it says is it's quite a compact list of just many bullet points of things that have happened. But in this one space, there is a typo. And what it says is in 1994, "The Italian declares a waste emergency." And I don't know why he did that. But the one Italian that there is.

• 2:01:26Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, Vittorio Emanuele.

• 2:01:29November Kelly?

  Yeah, fuck.

• 2:01:30Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:33Justin Roczniak?

  They declare, he declares a waste emergency and establishes-

• 2:01:38Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, from beyond the grave somehow.

• 2:01:40Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, it's, "The Italian" is an inherited title. I believe it's currently held by Berlusconi.

• 2:01:49November Kelly?

  It's a lot like being Pope in a lot of ways.

• 2:01:52Justin Roczniak?

  Pretty much, yeah.

• 2:01:55Justin Roczniak?

  They establish an emergency regime in Campania for waste, right? They, they create-

• 2:02:01November Kelly?

  The dictatorship of the bins.

• 2:02:03Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. Committee for the Waste Emergency in Campania delegates full powers of waste management to it. I, I invest in you, the full powers of waste management as, you know, as given down by, by God himself, Italian God, which I guess is regular God.

• 2:02:27Speaker 00

  Dying, going to heaven and being like, gee, I just didn't think you'd be Italian.

• 2:02:30Justin Roczniak?

  No, I was obviously gonna be Italian.

• 2:02:37Justin Roczniak?

  You know, they're tasked with creating a regional plan for waste management and then assigning a contract to build the facilities required for said regional plan and they don't do anything for two years. And

• 2:02:49Liam McAnderson?

  You're telling the truth, brother.

• 2:02:50Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. That plan led the Prime Minister to nominate a new Commissioner on March 18th, 1996, the President of the Regional Council, given power to

• 2:03:01November Kelly?

  You are now the new bins dictator.

• 2:03:03Justin Roczniak?

  You, you are, you, you have become Count Binface. Yes. And

• 2:03:11Justin Roczniak?

  and you have been given power to produce a management plan without consulting the Regional Council. You can say, fuck you. Right?

• 2:03:23November Kelly?

  This is, this is like putting Italy back under Napoleonic rule.

• 2:03:26Justin Roczniak?

  Pretty much. Yeah. This is the bins Napoleon. Right? In 1997, the Commissioner finally drafts a regional plan. We're going to construct two waste to energy plants, seven facilities for the production of waste derived fuel or refuse derived fuel that's RDF, an unspecified number of landfills for managing about two and a half million tons of regional garbage produced annually. Now landfill saturation is predicted to occur in 1999 at this point. It's 1997. That's two years. So

• 2:04:05November Kelly?

  Oh, having five years of climate left is bad enough. Having two years of bins left?

• 2:04:10Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a pretty bad situation.

• 2:04:15Justin Roczniak?

  To alleviate this potential crisis, the Commissioner draws maps to designate sites for landfills. Right?

• 2:04:23Liam McAnderson?

  Why can't we just, real question, just dump it in the Mediterranean Sea, man? It's real big. Just back up the truck.

• 2:04:29November Kelly?

  We don't, we don't know that they weren't doing that too.

• 2:04:32Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, it, well, you know, we used to do that and that's how you get lower Manhattan and like Back Bay and like, um, what, what other, actually those are pretty great places. Yeah, maybe they should have just done that.

• 2:04:46Liam McAnderson?

  I told you.

• 2:04:48Justin Roczniak?

  No, this is much more hazardous waste than they used to build those.

• 2:04:52Liam McAnderson?

  They're barely people to me.

• 2:04:54Justin Roczniak?

  Well, I mean, you know, back then, when we did those sorts of-

• 2:04:58Speaker 00

  New Yorkers or Mediterranean's.

• 2:04:59Liam McAnderson?

  I know, no, specifically, my mother-in-law is Neapolitan, so she- room, so I was trying to talk shit before she left, but she made it out before I could like re- her.

• 2:05:10Justin Roczniak?

  Ah, damn. The thing about a lot of those, you know, landfill projects, which upon which some of America's most beloved cities sit, is that back then, 99% of the waste people generated was oyster shells, because they all ate 20 of them every day.

• 2:05:28Liam McAnderson?

  Right, it's radioactive.

• 2:05:35Justin Roczniak?

  It's amazing how, how far the rate of oyster consumption has dropped since like 1880.

• 2:05:44Speaker 00

  This is my one return thing.

• 2:05:46November Kelly?

  With a V, yes.

• 2:05:48Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, actually, I do like a nice oyster, yeah.

• 2:05:51Liam McAnderson?

  Me too.

• 2:05:54Justin Roczniak?

  All right, yeah, well, there's your problem. Bring back oysters. Anyway. That's a different episode.

• 2:06:01Liam McAnderson?

  The Bloody Marys, yeah.

• 2:06:03Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, yeah, you got some nice, nice, nice spicy sauce, you know, you got, yeah, you got, yeah, no shit, I want to go eat some oysters at a fancy restaurant now, fuck.

• 2:06:19Justin Roczniak?

  So anyway, the commissioner, who was designated site, designating sites for landfills, follows the path of least resistance by, of course, targeting the most vulnerable and socio-economically deprived places in Campania.

• 2:06:39November Kelly?

  Yeah, I feel like this is a guy who comes into work and there's two maps in the office, and one of the maps is where to put the new landfills, and one of the maps is Roma population, and those maps kind of overlap a lot.

• 2:06:52Justin Roczniak?

  Management needs you to find the difference between these two maps.

• 2:06:55November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 2:06:59Justin Roczniak?

  So those areas are not very happy about being chosen for landfills, which in their experience, those landfills wind up full of toxic waste illegally dumped there by the mafia, right? So.

• 2:07:15November Kelly?

  Huh, those scamps.

• 2:07:17Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, those, those, oh, those mafia guys, you know, anyway. They start trying to.

• 2:07:27November Kelly?

  They just nationalized the landfills.

• 2:07:29Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, they start trying to bring the landfills under public ownership in an attempt to disassociate management from organized crime, right?

• 2:07:38November Kelly?

  Yeah, that could be because you couldn't have any like organized crime influence in local government, that'd be crazy.

• 2:07:45Justin Roczniak?

  Obviously not, you know, it's um.

• 2:07:48November Kelly?

  How many more slides are there? Oh, um, uh, thirty?

• 2:07:52Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. So. Castelase clan member Carmen Chivone.

• 2:08:05Liam McAnderson?

  German.

• 2:08:06Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, whatever. He's arrested in 1991, turns pentito in 1993, testifies at the.

• 2:08:16November Kelly?

  There's so many things going on here, the anti mafia, like tabards, the, the cop with the hairline they don't make anymore. The fact that this guy had just has, has this shit on, uh, incredible, beautiful image. I love Italy in the 90s.

• 2:08:32Justin Roczniak?

  The shirts rule, I love.

• 2:08:34Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah. Nova, if you'll notice, all the guys in this photo have hairlines they don't make anymore.

• 2:08:41November Kelly?

  Oh, my God. This is a headline that they don't make anymore because it's a headline they don't make anymore because you could only get it by getting a baseline level of cadmium in your water that has never been replicated anywhere else.

• 2:08:57Justin Roczniak?

  So he, he testifies at the Spartacus trial, which was a series of criminal trials against the Casalese members from 1998 to a whole decade later in 2008, which was a whole thing.

• 2:09:13November Kelly?

  Fastest Italian criminal trial.

• 2:09:16Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. In 2013, he claimed he turned informant because of the waste dumping and realizing the empire and my environmental impact.

• 2:09:26Liam McAnderson?

  I love it. Oh, yeah. Try not, my guy.

• 2:09:31Justin Roczniak?

  I'm, I'm the, I'm, I'm.

• 2:09:33November Kelly?

  It took him two years after he got caught. He did two years in nerd prison. And then at the end of that, he was like, oh yeah, save the fucking trees or whatever.

• 2:09:42Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:09:42Liam McAnderson?

  Trees will be hard with the Lorax's armed as this guy's prison tattoo.

• 2:09:47Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, he got put in a cell with like a Greenpeace guy, you know, and, and some of the.

• 2:09:53Liam McAnderson?

  Had it right.

• 2:09:58Justin Roczniak?

  During this time, he testifies to a commission of inquiry in 1997 about the widespread waste dumping and disposal of toxic and radioactive waste across Campania. In recently declassified testimony from 1997, Carmen Chianvon, a former treasurer for a faction of the Camara, described nighttime operations in which mobsters wearing police uniforms subsupervised the burial of toxic waste from as far away as Germany.

• 2:10:30November Kelly?

  Oh my God, you're telling me the cops were in on it? What? That's crazy.

• 2:10:35Liam McAnderson?

  In Italy, the cops were corrupt?

• 2:10:37Justin Roczniak?

  Yep. No, no, mobsters wearing police uniforms. No, the cops didn't.

• 2:10:42November Kelly?

  Oh, sorry. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. They were just doing some like police impersonation. They, they're just like, I'm, I'm like a mob guy, but I love collecting cop uniforms and like wearing them to do my mob stuff.

• 2:10:54Justin Roczniak?

  What if there's a cop who loves collecting mob uniforms?

• 2:10:59Liam McAnderson?

  So just a cop, dude.

• 2:11:01November Kelly?

  Cop who goes home and he's, cop who goes home, he's got like 50 different camel coats hanging up.

• 2:11:10Justin Roczniak?

  So the result of this is everyone can tell the government knows that the mafia is doing what it's doing. They know that this goes beyond just the bins are too full, right? Or the company, the Campanians are too stupid and southern to learn how to recycle, right?

• 2:11:29Liam McAnderson?

  My favorite thing about Roz of many is Roz's adoration, Italian nation, an absolute disdain for the Italian people.

• 2:11:39Justin Roczniak?

  Italy's great. I love Italy. It's

• 2:11:41Liam McAnderson?

  How do you feel about Italians, Roz?

• 2:11:44Justin Roczniak?

  No, Italians are very good. I had never met a bad Italian.

• 2:11:47Liam McAnderson?

  Fuck myself.

• 2:11:48Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. No, this is an opinion. Okay. So there's a northern and southern Italian divide, right? And the north thinks the south is stupid and full of dumb people who are poor. They're too poor to be smart and they're too dumb to be rich, right? You know, so this, this is part of it is, you know, a lot of the, the, a lot of the, the popular narrative is there's so much garbage in Campania because those people are too poor and stupid to recycle.

• 2:12:26Justin Roczniak?

  As opposed to, we are taking all of the toxic waste from northern Europe and dumping it in people's backyards.

• 2:12:37Liam McAnderson?

  Right. And then making them move next to it.

• 2:12:40Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:12:43Justin Roczniak?

  And the intervention, oh crap, I moved the notes around. The intervention here entirely focused on management of urban waste. They didn't deal with the fact that this waste was illegal dumping and garbage trafficking from the west, the rest of Europe, right?

• 2:13:03November Kelly?

  Yeah, because that's money and you don't fuck with the money. You just want the bins to work again in Naples.

• 2:13:09Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, exactly. It's like, okay, we still need to, you know, take leaking barrels of, you know, calorific, you know, radioactive waste and put them in a huge pile, but you better fucking compost, you know?

• 2:13:34Speaker 00

  Just for the record, waste trafficking does like bring to mind a convoy of garbage trucks playing Eastbound and Down.

• 2:13:47Speaker 00

  They have like a, they've got like a fucking Delta Integrale with the big screaming chicken painted on the hood.

• 2:13:53Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, fuck yeah.

• 2:13:55Speaker 00

  Italian Burt Reynolds.

• 2:13:57Liam McAnderson?

  Italian Burt Reynolds is, oh, yes.

• 2:14:01Justin Roczniak?

  Breaker, breaker, this is the garbage man.

• 2:14:08Justin Roczniak?

  So 2013 also happens to be when the Italian government finally released the 1997 Commissioner of Inquiry from being a state secret. They made the, they made the garbage inquiry a state secret. Yeah.

• 2:14:24November Kelly?

  Incredible.

• 2:14:25Justin Roczniak?

  Well, ideally, as we discussed previously, once you put the garbage in the landfill, it doesn't leak. You use a liner for that. But this is again, these are bad landfills, right?

• 2:14:41Justin Roczniak?

  So this is the incinerator we looked at before. And you can sort of see, you know, the incinerator here and outside, there's just big piles of trash, which they have lined with trash bags, as one does.

• 2:15:02Liam McAnderson?

  Well, it's got trash bags.

• 2:15:05Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, no, that, well, that's the bad part is the bags only on top, you know, well, no, I think the bag goes underneath. I don't know how this works.

• 2:15:15Justin Roczniak?

  So they sent out this tender for like managing the waste, right? And a company called F I B E.

• 2:15:25Justin Roczniak?

  Shit, what does that stand for?

• 2:15:28November Kelly?

  Fiza? Fiza?

• 2:15:30Speaker 00

  Fiza Italia, Italia, limpianta, uh, uh, Fiza Italia limpianti, SCA.

• 2:15:37November Kelly?

  Oh my god, how many fucking, how many fucking bullet points are in this slide? I've seen fewer bullet points attached to like, machine gun links. I, okay, right.

• 2:15:48Speaker 00

  Dot chip, backcock, and langen, GMBH.

• 2:15:51November Kelly?

  We got a [bleep] Sam.

• 2:15:52Speaker 00

  Evil, overhousen, AG.

• 2:15:55November Kelly?

  Can I, can I, can I ask something?

• 2:15:56Justin Roczniak?

  Sam's research is very thorough.

• 2:15:59November Kelly?

  Yeah, can I, can I seize the controls of the aircraft here? Can I, can I just, can I just summarize freely?

• 2:16:08Justin Roczniak?

  November, could you please do that? Yeah.

• 2:16:10November Kelly?

  Okay, cool, right, I'm piloting the episode now, thanks so much.

• 2:16:13Justin Roczniak?

  Okay, okay, okay.

• 2:16:14November Kelly?

  Okay, so, they're gonna, they're gonna try and fix this. They're gonna try and fix this, right? By building, by building the fucking waste valorizer machine, the, the thing, right? And, everybody hates it, right? They have some justified nimbyism about building this gigantic waste incinerator, to the point that they protest against it, and four people get arrested, uh, 56 people get, like, the shit kicked out of them by the riot police, including the communist mayor of Asara. So, um, hell yeah, question mark?

• 2:16:56Speaker 00

  Long tradition of communists getting their shit kicked in by cops.

• 2:17:00Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:17:01November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 2:17:02Justin Roczniak?

  But rarely is it the mayor.

• 2:17:06Justin Roczniak?

  You got like a sash with like an hammer and a sickle on it.

• 2:17:10November Kelly?

  What we, what we move from is mob stuff to like, corporate stuff, right? And perverse incentives, and so, because the Italian government are gonna subsidize them to make the marquee rolls, the like, eco bales, right? Uh, and then burn them, they just have to make them, and that's why we have this photo of the waste valorizer with all of the garbage outside, right? Um, and... Anytime one of these incinerators gets closed for any reason, which includes the mob interfering and trying to shut them down, the garbage piles up. They have to open up more landfills to temporarily store all of these like marquee rolls, all of the eco bales.

• 2:17:56Justin Roczniak?

  And, and this is an interesting point here. Because of the way the contract is structured,

• 2:18:04Justin Roczniak?

  municipalities are supposed to deliver a certain amount of waste to the incinerator every day, or they have to pay a fee, right?

• 2:18:17Justin Roczniak?

  So the incentivization here is to produce more waste and not less. Like, I better not see you fucking recycling. Chuck that shit in the bin.

• 2:18:33November Kelly?

  Also, the quality of the bales that they're putting out is ass. You know how we mentioned how if it's too wet, it actually like costs more energy than you get back to burn it? They're too wet, right? They're like twice as wet as they should be. These are wet bales of garbage. They're just throwing whatever shit in there. There's a bit in here about how they have entire wheels off of cars. So like, again, if you drive the Alfa Romeo and you're like, where are my wheels? They're in one of these eco bales.

• 2:19:05Justin Roczniak?

  They're, they've, they've, they're waiting to be incinerated several decades from now.

• 2:19:12November Kelly?

  Mm hmm. Yeah. And so this prompts a judicial inquiry called Operazione Rompivalle, which is, uh, Operation Pain in the Ass.

• 2:19:28Liam McAnderson?

  Ah, ah?

• 2:19:31Justin Roczniak?

  Isn't it like closer to-

• 2:19:32November Kelly?

  Operation Ballbreaker.

• 2:19:34Justin Roczniak?

  I'm just breaking your balls.

• 2:19:36Liam McAnderson?

  I am. There's so many power, there's so many bullet points in here.

• 2:19:41Liam McAnderson?

  I'm, I'm-

• 2:19:41November Kelly?

  This is, so like, they're investigating, like, one of the tricks that they use to get these marquee rolls to look like they've been processed, which is just driving a bulldozer for them.

• 2:19:55Justin Roczniak?

  Well, if it burns, it burns. You know, I'm not, I'm not too worried about the, I'm not too worried about the energy production. Just make the waste go away, please.

• 2:20:07Liam McAnderson?

  Dump it in the, just dump it in the ocean. I keep saying it.

• 2:20:11Justin Roczniak?

  They were already, yeah.

• 2:20:14November Kelly?

  So a bunch of guys get indicted, including this guy Guido Bartalassa, who is the head of the like civil defense, right? Incidentally, the consortium, the company FIBA that is doing all of this, their parent company is in charge of doing the high-speed train line between Milan and Florence. And a guy in charge of that gets convicted for dumping illegal waste beneath the rails as ballast.

• 2:20:45Justin Roczniak?

  They're just, you know, Phil is Phil.

• 2:20:51Liam McAnderson?

  We're all God's children in the dark, baby.

• 2:20:54Justin Roczniak?

  I've been on that garbage train. It's actually, no, it's pretty good. I would, I would not describe that train as garbage.

• 2:20:59November Kelly?

  You rode over some garbage. Yeah.

• 2:21:02Liam McAnderson?

  Which was some dude that fires and God knows what else.

• 2:21:06November Kelly?

  Okay, next slide, please.

• 2:21:08Justin Roczniak?

  Next, next. Okay, now we're at round one.

• 2:21:12November Kelly?

  December, the end of December 2007, there's a garbage strike, right? Not like, not like the good kind of garbage strike, but the kind where they, they say, oh, the dumps are full, right?

• 2:21:23Justin Roczniak?

  Dumps full, not getting in a truck today.

• 2:21:27November Kelly?

  Yep, yep. And so everybody comes back from the holidays to find out Naples full of garbage. January 7th, the prime minister sends in the army to like bulldoze the streets of garbage.

• 2:21:43Liam McAnderson?

  Oh my God.

• 2:21:45November Kelly?

  It's like people are, people are burning the garbage, which means the fire department are getting called out to garbage fires all the time.

• 2:21:53Speaker 00

  I feel like this is a city skyline problem. I've definitely done this in a bunch of saved files. I definitely left after this point.

• 2:22:01November Kelly?

  This is the Italian government. Yeah, the Italian government are going to everywhere around Naples, begging them to take some of Naples garbage. And they're like, no, we're not going to do that.

• 2:22:13Speaker 00

  Fucking up trash collection so bad in Naples, you just click the Vesuvius button. Like, I gotta start over.

• 2:22:20Justin Roczniak?

  This is a workers and resources Soviet Republic problem in that, you know, you find out that, uh, like, like, I don't know. You know, your entire garbage collection is fucked for four years because one truck broke down in the wrong place. Now the dump is full and, you know, there's no way out.

• 2:22:40November Kelly?

  And to be clear, like, the reason why these dumps are full is because they're full of industrial waste from, like, Germany and Northern Italy and shit. But now when you go to Northern Italy and you're like, hey, can we use your dumps to take care of some of Naples's shit? They're like, absolutely not.

• 2:22:59Justin Roczniak?

  No, God, no, absolutely not. Um, that's because you're stupid and poor southerners. Sorry.

• 2:23:06November Kelly?

  Yes. Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:23:11November Kelly?

  All right. So, uh, we got a, we got a map here and we have circled Pianora.

• 2:23:16Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, down here.

• 2:23:17November Kelly?

  And right next to it is, yeah, right next to it is a place called Chiayano, uh, although in Neapolitan it's called Kianora. Uh, it's, it's not even marks. It's just, this is where we are next to Naples, right?

• 2:23:29Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:23:29November Kelly?

  Next slide, please.

• 2:23:33November Kelly?

  We got to talk about the garbage riots.

• 2:23:36Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, they're, they're, they're, uh, trying to reopen a landfill here, I believe.

• 2:23:42November Kelly?

  Yes. Yeah. And immediately people are protesting against the landfill. Um, and again, Italian policing is like, if you make us put on the riot gear, we will kick the shit out of you because it's hot in Italy.

• 2:23:57Justin Roczniak?

  And we're all surrounded by trash.

• 2:24:01November Kelly?

  Yeah, it's also like.

• 2:24:02Justin Roczniak?

  That's a bad combination. Yeah, if I'm hot and surrounded by trash, I will also try and beat people up.

• 2:24:08Liam McAnderson?

  That's how I feel in New Orleans.

• 2:24:09November Kelly?

  Yeah. And like, to be clear, they're they're reopening this landfill. The landfill is full, right? And it's full of God knows what. They've got like Lancia Stratos is in there. They've got like your grandma's bones, all of this. And they're just like, well, it can't be in Naples, so it has to be here.

• 2:24:29Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:24:32November Kelly?

  And they're like, they're bringing in the army. People are throwing Molotovs at the army. They're like, people are firing guns at the town hall.

• 2:24:47November Kelly?

  But so eventually, what they do is they get into court, they tie it up in the Italian court system, and they close the landfill again, and it has never reopened since, which, again, fastest moving part of the Italian court system.

• 2:25:02Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:25:05November Kelly?

  Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:25:06Justin Roczniak?

  Next.

• 2:25:09November Kelly?

  This brings down the Italian Prime Minister. Um, this is, this is Romano Pradi. He, because again, to be clear, he gets back from Christmas and is like, yeah, Naples is full of garbage and people are burning the garbage. We got to do something. He promises to do something and he meets.

• 2:25:26Justin Roczniak?

  I will fix this.

• 2:25:27November Kelly?

  Yeah, yeah. And he meets his political end with the garbage riots.

• 2:25:32Justin Roczniak?

  I did not fix this.

• 2:25:34November Kelly?

  Yeah. Uh, and we have some images on the next slide of him not fixing this. This is what Naples looks like in the middle of February. We bear in mind, this is something that started in December.

• 2:25:46Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, at least it doesn't smell that bad, though. Think about that.

• 2:25:53November Kelly?

  Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:25:54Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, wait until summer.

• 2:25:55November Kelly?

  It is.

• 2:25:58November Kelly?

  Because this is this is the central business district of Naples in March.

• 2:26:04Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, dearie me.

• 2:26:06Justin Roczniak?

  It's gone poorly.

• 2:26:09November Kelly?

  It's gonna, it's gonna get worse, but.

• 2:26:12Justin Roczniak?

  It doesn't smell that bad yet.

• 2:26:17November Kelly?

  If if you're the Italian public, right, you're like, well, I gotta vote for someone who can fix this. And we're out of prime minister. We need a new prime minister. Someone has to show like a strong hand and leadership and next slide, please.

• 2:26:33Justin Roczniak?

  The the man who inherited the title, the Italian.

• 2:26:39November Kelly?

  Yes, the Italian is gonna fix the garbage. He campaigns on fixing the garbage and he gets sworn in on May the eighth.

• 2:26:49Justin Roczniak?

  I'm going to pick up the bins.

• 2:26:55November Kelly?

  Like, there's, there's a quote here from the BBC suggesting there are maybe like 200,000 tons of garbage just in Campania, which isn't, as, as Sam describes it accurately, an unfathomably large amount of trash.

• 2:27:10Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I, you know, it's, it's, it's really easy to go up there and win an election. You know, by saying I'm, I'm gonna make the bin men hard. I.

• 2:27:20November Kelly?

  Yeah, he literally does. This is his plan, right, is he's gonna open all of the landfill sites, including the ones that are full. He's gonna reopen all of the incinerators and make them work. And those are gonna be like strategic, like a military site. The army is gonna come in and guard them. And if you try and protest, you are gonna get like five years in prison.

• 2:27:46November Kelly?

  He's like, people forget that Berlusconi came to power as Bin Stalin.

• 2:27:52Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, yeah, yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna fix the problem. We're gonna, we're gonna do Bin's Stalingrad. We're gonna do, we're gonna do, I guess also in the sense that it took a long time and he lost.

• 2:28:08November Kelly?

  One step binwards. So the, but like, he has a, he has a guy for this, right? Who he brings on. And the guy he brings on is Guido Bertolasso, who was prosecuted for the FIBO thing of just having a fake incinerator, basically. So.

• 2:28:26Justin Roczniak?

  He's the garbage czar.

• 2:28:29November Kelly?

  Yeah, he's, he is the garbage czar.

• 2:28:32Justin Roczniak?

  He's the, the, the bin. Um, oh, no, there's gotta be a lot of these. The, the trash. Um, no, that, I'm looking for some alliteration here, folks. You know, uh,

• 2:28:47Justin Roczniak?

  the regent, the regent of refuse, the, uh,

• 2:28:52November Kelly?

  Yeah, there we go.

• 2:28:54Justin Roczniak?

  The, uh,

• 2:28:54November Kelly?

  The crap czar.

• 2:28:56Justin Roczniak?

  The crap, the, the, yeah, the crap czar, the count crap. Um,

• 2:29:01Speaker 00

  The premier of poop.

• 2:29:04Justin Roczniak?

  The grand poobah of garbage.

• 2:29:08November Kelly?

  Awful. Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:29:15November Kelly?

  So we, we have here, uh, a guy taking his shirt off at the protest, even though he has recently had an intestinal operation because dudes rock, I guess. But the thrust of this is the garbage riots will continue until morale improves, right?

• 2:29:36November Kelly?

  And admittedly, this is like, kind of to the mob's advantage, but the garbage riot is a generally portrayed somewhat unfairly as like mob stooges, right? Uh, not so much so when everyone hates living next to a landfill and the landfill is full of like radioactive waste and the radioactive waste is giving everybody cancer, right?

• 2:29:58Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, it's, it's, uh, it's like some kind of horrible refuse from like a, a Dutch, you know, semiconductor machine plan. Yeah.

• 2:30:07November Kelly?

  Jesus. Hmm. Yeah, this is, this is heating up to the point that, that like a bin man is shot dead by the mafia because he tries to like testify against them.

• 2:30:18Justin Roczniak?

  Wow.

• 2:30:21November Kelly?

  Yeah, this is this is heavy shit. Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:30:24Justin Roczniak?

  That that was a hard bin, man, right there. I mean, that was.

• 2:30:28November Kelly?

  Una bomba ecologica. Is that good?

• 2:30:32Justin Roczniak?

  Up.

• 2:30:36November Kelly?

  So this is, uh, it's like a, it's a tough quarry. Tough is like, I don't know what tough is, but, um, the point is.

• 2:30:44Justin Roczniak?

  Tufa, it's the, uh, the hard stone that, uh, what you call it, the Romans used for most of their buildings. It's, uh, you know, everyone said, everyone's like, oh, look at these marble buildings. No, it's a thin veneer of marble. There's tufa behind it. Um, you can see this in a lot of places in Rome. Um, fun fact.

• 2:31:06November Kelly?

  Interesting. Yeah. So th- this is, this is gonna be the emergency landfill for Naples. The fact that it's in a national park is not considered particularly important. Uh, the fact that it has, the fact that it has an aquifer underneath it is also not considered important. And so they approve it for.

• 2:31:27Justin Roczniak?

  Have an aquifer underneath.

• 2:31:29November Kelly?

  Uh, as far, they approve it for everything, right? You can dump anything here, right? Because it's, it's all gotta go somewhere.

• 2:31:37Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, it's garbage. Created, we've created the bottomless pit. Yeah. Yeah. Mono garbage, mono garbage, mono garbage, mono gar- Anything you want, feed the pit, put it in there. Put it in, put it in there. Yeah, you know. Feed the boy.

• 2:31:53November Kelly?

  Admittedly, this, we've, Sam, Sam has found some phrases, which, thank you, Sam. Um, it, it runs for three years and then they closed it again because of numerous irregularities, which I think may be related to the whole bomba ecologica thing.

• 2:32:10Justin Roczniak?

  No, put it in there. It's fine. Don't worry about it. Yeah.

• 2:32:15November Kelly?

  They, so the, the civil protection guy had like contracted to get a clay liner in the bottom, which leaks. And so everything is just seeping out of this landfill. And when describing one of these articles includes the phrase unbearable miasmas.

• 2:32:35Justin Roczniak?

  Oh my God, no, bentonite. That's what I was thinking of earlier. God damn it. Okay, never mind. That's totally, that was like 20 slides ago. No, you're, you're seeing a truck pull up with Ukrainian plates with a, you know, suspiciously elephant foot shaped, you know,

• 2:32:54Justin Roczniak?

  cargo under a tarp and nah, throw it in there. It's fine.

• 2:32:59November Kelly?

  Why do my fillings itch?

• 2:33:02Justin Roczniak?

  Oh damn, if I take a picture, it's all grainy.

• 2:33:07November Kelly?

  So at this point, the anti mafia gets involved and like 17 people running the landfill get arrested because guess what? They were also collaborating with the mob. This is kind of the thing, right? Like, close the landfill, open the landfill, either way, because the mob are a fact of Campania might, you're collaborating with the fucking mob, right? Because if you're not, you're getting shot. Next slide, please.

• 2:33:33November Kelly?

  So this is, this is an Italian soldier who is part of the like military aid to the civil power, like, you know, sweeping the streets, just checking to make sure how much radiation you've got in your garbage.

• 2:33:46Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. After that Ukrainian truck came through, it's like, okay, we gotta check everyone now. They had like loosely taped, they had like loosely taped an Italian flag over the Ukrainian flag on the, on the license plate.

• 2:34:02November Kelly?

  Trying to convince this guy he's colorblind and also sees the wrong number of stripes.

• 2:34:08Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah. Why, why, why did all the trees die on the way in? I don't worry about it's in the pit. It doesn't matter.

• 2:34:15Speaker 00

  Really, really smelly poop cube.

• 2:34:16Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:34:17November Kelly?

  I would submit humbly that this is not a problem that a normal society would have. Is the army having to be like, do you have any radiation in this garbage?

• 2:34:29Justin Roczniak?

  Nope.

• 2:34:31Justin Roczniak?

  No, sir.

• 2:34:33November Kelly?

  Next slide, please. So Berlusconi gets his Stalingrad law, decree 90, through in July, and he declares victory over the garbage.

• 2:34:47Justin Roczniak?

  I won.

• 2:34:47November Kelly?

  The war on garbage.

• 2:34:49Justin Roczniak?

  I won the war on garbage.

• 2:34:53November Kelly?

  It's in terms of Italy versus garbage, Italy wins, right? And he ends the state of emergency. This is a photo taken on the day that he did that. So I think he may have been engaged in a time honored political practice called lying.

• 2:35:10Justin Roczniak?

  I'm just imagining him like winning a boxing match against like a pair of empty cardboard boxes, you know?

• 2:35:21November Kelly?

  Tearing apart the Amazon boxes, yeah.

• 2:35:23Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, it's like, yep, I won. I won the war on garbage.

• 2:35:27November Kelly?

  Undefeated again. Next slide, please.

• 2:35:30Liam McAnderson?

  Back to back garbage war champs.

• 2:35:34November Kelly?

  So remember this place?

• 2:35:36Liam McAnderson?

  Oh, yes, I do. I remember the trash tower thing.

• 2:35:39November Kelly?

  The next year, they finally opened the incinerator for real, right? And even though the company that's running it is still being indicted, they just opened the thing.

• 2:35:53Justin Roczniak?

  They opened it. It took 10 fucking years. They said they were gonna do it in 300 days. It took 10 years. 10 years is...

• 2:36:01Liam McAnderson?

  Italy, bud.

• 2:36:03Justin Roczniak?

  3,000 days and also whatever the 65 times 10 is, 63,600. I could have just multiplied that by 10. It would, I don't, fuck, I, anyway.

• 2:36:16November Kelly?

  3,650 days, yeah.

• 2:36:19Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, that's a lot of, that's a lot more days than 300. I was, I was working towards like...

• 2:36:24Speaker 00

  There's gonna be at least two leap years in there, too.

• 2:36:26Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, shit, yeah.

• 2:36:27November Kelly?

  Oh, my God. So the good, the good news is, right?

• 2:36:31Justin Roczniak?

  2000, 2004, and 2000. Oh, wait, 2000 was not a leap year.

• 2:36:35Liam McAnderson?

  Not a leap year, right.

• 2:36:36Justin Roczniak?

  2004 and 2008. Yes.

• 2:36:39November Kelly?

  So, so the good news is they're actually burning stuff, right? Which means some of the garbage is getting like disposed of.

• 2:36:46Liam McAnderson?

  It's about time we let some shit on fire.

• 2:36:48November Kelly?

  The bad news is, there is still like no control over what they're burning because they want to get rid of all of these like low quality, like maki rolls, these low quality bales. So they just go, yeah, fuck it, just burn all of them.

• 2:37:02Justin Roczniak?

  They put the elephant's foot in a bale.

• 2:37:05November Kelly?

  Yeah. And then the, then Campania just kind of again declares victory, right? And they're, they're sort of, the state of emergency is over. Nobody has any control over what this thing incinerates. And within a year, it goes back to not incinerating anything and only one of the four furnaces is working.

• 2:37:29Justin Roczniak?

  Oh my God, you know, you would think, you would think they'd go hog wild with incinerating stuff. You know, when I hear the phrase-

• 2:37:36Liam McAnderson?

  You couldn't give me away from burning trash.

• 2:37:37Justin Roczniak?

  When you, yeah, if you, we've, you hear the phrase, no one has any control over what this incinerates. I would imagine they'd go crazy. They'd start like incinerating like, like anything. Like they would steal people's cars and incinerate them. They would like go into people's houses and take furniture and incinerate it. Like they would, you know, but no, no, no. They would like go into schools and take like kindergarteners, throw them in. No.

• 2:38:06Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, they just decided not to burn anything. That's boring.

• 2:38:10November Kelly?

  Have you, have you considered two things? One, it's work and two, it's, it's not just easier to throw stuff in the pit. That's like a tradition of the mafia now. They can just like, it's, it's almost like gay shit to burn it.

• 2:38:25Justin Roczniak?

  You get to burn stuff. It's fun.

• 2:38:29Speaker 00

  My father and my father's father and my father's father's father, we all dumped our trash in Vesuvius. And I'll be damned if we change now.

• 2:38:38Justin Roczniak?

  That's the kind of burning stuff.

• 2:38:41Liam McAnderson?

  It's certainly more cinematic, right? I like how brown this picture is, by the way. This is real. This is a real Doom 3 vibe.

• 2:38:49Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, no. Little known fact, southern Italy does have the Mexico filter.

• 2:38:56November Kelly?

  Okay, okay, so despite the fact that they have the incinerator working, they forced the dumps open. All of the dumps near Naples fill up, right? Again, including one that is just on Vesuvius. There's one, there's a dump on the volcano that is just full of 250,000 tons of garbage.

• 2:39:21Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, they should just, you know, put a conveyor belt up there so that you just dump it in the crater proper.

• 2:39:25November Kelly?

  Yeah, like satisfactory.

• 2:39:28Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:39:28Speaker 00

  Have you ever watched one of those Cities Skylines videos where somebody makes like the poop volcano? Where you just take all the raw sewage from your town and dump it into the, yeah. I feel like we're building to this situation.

• 2:39:42November Kelly?

  So we're in this situation, right? Where the Italian government goes, kind of just one more lane, bro. And they try to open another landfill. And when they do, when they do, the residents react like in the image. Um, and we get more garbage riots. 20 cops injured.

• 2:40:03Liam McAnderson?

  It's a little like a goddamn Christmas. It looks like Christmas, goddamn.

• 2:40:07November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 2:40:10November Kelly?

  So they stop using the new landfill.

• 2:40:14Justin Roczniak?

  Look, I mean, James Cameron went to the bottom of the Mariana's Trench and proved there was nothing there. We should just have a bunch of drop bottom barges and dump it there. You know, that's gonna work for a long time, anyway.

• 2:40:29November Kelly?

  Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:40:33November Kelly?

  So Naples fills up with garbage again, and this time it's November. So it's

• 2:40:40Justin Roczniak?

  It's you.

• 2:40:42November Kelly?

  I know her. Yeah.

• 2:40:45November Kelly?

  We've dodged summer, right? That's Berlusconi's main achievement is it's not going to be like super, super hot.

• 2:40:54November Kelly?

  This, this is a beautiful example of the art of. Yeah, there's a beautiful example of the art of compromise here where they go to the, the residents and go, we will postpone opening the dump that you're rioting about if you stop rioting about it. To which they say no.

• 2:41:15Justin Roczniak?

  Hmm.

• 2:41:17November Kelly?

  Yeah, reasonable because they a hundred percent would have started dumping shit in the landfill again. Um, Berlusconi promised that he would have cleaned up the streets of Naples within 10 days. And now there's like one landfill left that he can take stuff out of Naples too.

• 2:41:34Justin Roczniak?

  You're just having like the same like empty garbage trucks cycling through the town all the time. And it's some, for some reason, it never stops on our street. But you can tell pickup must be occurring because I see one empty garbage truck.

• 2:41:48November Kelly?

  Hell yeah. Uh, next slide, please. So we have one landfill left and then that landfill fills to capacity.

• 2:41:57Justin Roczniak?

  I thought we had a bottomless pit. You're telling me it's not bottomless?

• 2:42:03November Kelly?

  It's not, it's not worse.

• 2:42:05Justin Roczniak?

  I sent a guy down there to check if it was bottomless.

• 2:42:09November Kelly?

  And this is the bottom and it's, it's fucked up. Me, when I look in the mirror, but like they promised.

• 2:42:17Justin Roczniak?

  Oh my God.

• 2:42:19November Kelly?

  They promised to like do remediation on this as soon as it was full. And then they went, no, we have to dump another 50,000 tons on top of this, making this 243 meters deep.

• 2:42:35Liam McAnderson?

  Jesus, it's like the super cold.

• 2:42:37November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 2:42:39November Kelly?

  And the liner, the liner's fucking up. This is not a good liner. Um, and in fact, the levels of leachate, which in Italian, charmingly is percolato, like a coffee. The levels of that, um, no one has ever checked.

• 2:42:59Justin Roczniak?

  I think this guy.

• 2:43:00Liam McAnderson?

  I don't want to drink the wet.

• 2:43:02Justin Roczniak?

  I've heard, I, there's some stuff, there's some stuff happening in the nation's capital right now, similar. This guy might be Antifa.

• 2:43:10November Kelly?

  Um.

• 2:43:14November Kelly?

  I mean, with Berlusconi, it's very plausible.

• 2:43:16Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:43:18November Kelly?

  Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:43:22November Kelly?

  So we run into July of 2011, fully, it's, it's, it's summer and it's bad. It's, it smells bad. There's garbage everywhere.

• 2:43:35Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:43:36November Kelly?

  Next slide, please. Um, but change is coming and that's because in June of 2011, Naples gets a new mayor. This is a mayor show, Luigi di Magistris.

• 2:43:50Justin Roczniak?

  Luigi Mangione, no.

• 2:43:53November Kelly?

  Luigi Mangione. And the thing about Luigi Mangione is that he's woke, which is why there's a picture of him at Campania Pride.

• 2:44:00Justin Roczniak?

  Oh.

• 2:44:01Liam McAnderson?

  Oh.

• 2:44:02November Kelly?

  So they, he gets elected as a kind of like left opponent of Berlusconi, right? And, uh, he maybe tries some things like recycling, which is a crazy idea.

• 2:44:15Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, but then the incinerator doesn't make money.

• 2:44:18November Kelly?

  Yeah, this is a problem. He kind of just does it anyway.

• 2:44:22Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, my God.

• 2:44:22November Kelly?

  Door to door recycling waste. Um, the city council like cuts off all of the private waste disposal companies and they just remunicipalize waste management.

• 2:44:34Justin Roczniak?

  But then how do the waste companies make money?

• 2:44:37November Kelly?

  Yeah, that's a real problem. I mean.

• 2:44:39Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:44:40November Kelly?

  I, I don't know. Maybe they have to go back to like jock crimes.

• 2:44:44Justin Roczniak?

  I.

• 2:44:45Speaker 00

  Fuck, we gotta traffic drugs again.

• 2:44:49November Kelly?

  Guy who's been doing nerd crimes for too long and worries he isn't cool anymore. Also, is the image for Campania Pride, a gay cup of coffee? That rocks.

• 2:44:58Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, yeah, that's pretty cool. I like that.

• 2:45:01November Kelly?

  But so in addition, they find, because this is the key story of all of this is garbage disposal is about finding somewhere else to put it. And finally, at long last, Northern Europe pays for its crimes, right? Because they just start shipping stuff to the Netherlands.

• 2:45:18Justin Roczniak?

  Good. Bury them under it.

• 2:45:23November Kelly?

  Well, I mean, this is fine, because the Netherlands can always use more garbage, because they can use it for land reclamation or whatever.

• 2:45:28Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, yeah, they can use more garbage, like their people who are garbage.

• 2:45:32Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, but also you-

• 2:45:33November Kelly?

  Infuriatingly smug urbanism. It's like 150,000 tons of garbage. Yes, that fits perfectly in my backfeet.

• 2:45:41Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, it all comes up in a cargo bike. Yeah.

• 2:45:48Justin Roczniak?

  Of course, they didn't, they didn't pay for their crimes, because of course you have to pay to dispose the waste. They made money the whole damn time.

• 2:45:57November Kelly?

  They profited off of their crimes.

• 2:45:59Justin Roczniak?

  They profited on both ends.

• 2:46:03November Kelly?

  I am thinking now about a garbage scowl backfeet, though, so that's going to please me for a while. Next slide, please.

• 2:46:12November Kelly?

  And pretty soon after that, Berlusconi out, right? And this is just added to like, one of his long, long, long list of scandals was that he didn't win the war on garbage.

• 2:46:25Speaker 00

  I'm gonna sound really stupid here about Italian politics, but like, Berlusconi's been prime minister, like, what, five times or something?

• 2:46:34November Kelly?

  Yeah, yeah, he worked out a, like, a technique where you could still keep your immunity from prosecution if you were still prime minister or president. So he just kept running the stuff.

• 2:46:46Speaker 00

  Okay, yeah, because I was just gonna say, like, I feel like he was in office longer than 2008 to 2011.

• 2:46:53Speaker 00

  He seems like he was there for my entire teenage years.

• 2:46:56Justin Roczniak?

  Still, he is still the holder of the title, the Italian.

• 2:47:02November Kelly?

  God of the grave. Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:47:06Justin Roczniak?

  Or has, there has yet to be a word, the Italian, yes.

• 2:47:12November Kelly?

  So, uh, this, this is, uh, Calvi Risotta. It's north of Naples. Uh, this is 60 acres of bullshit. Um, they, I mean, it's got like, they don't know what's in there. They've got French industrial waste. They've got random solvents. Uh, it's got like 10 centimeters of like soil just covering so much bullshit that they had to dig through it for three days with bulldozers to estimate the size.

• 2:47:43Justin Roczniak?

  What we have here is a giant ball of garbage.

• 2:47:48November Kelly?

  Yeah, this is a giant illegal ball of garbage. This is 30 football fields full of illegally dumped garbage. Uh, and they found stuff just leaking up onto the surface. They found like, uh, stuff labeled polyethylene ribiline, uh, Goodyear Chemical Division, BASF and LTEx. Um, but the good news is that they didn't find anything radioactive.

• 2:48:16Justin Roczniak?

  Well, you know, you always have to look, you know, every landfill has a silver lining. Um, well, actually usually it's black. Um, but.

• 2:48:27November Kelly?

  And so this is just the biggest of like a ton of illegal dumping sites.

• 2:48:31Justin Roczniak?

  Also, some of them don't have it, which is I guess the subject of this podcast.

• 2:48:36November Kelly?

  Yeah, I don't think this had a liner. I don't think, this barely had a top on it. They were just throwing stuff on the ground.

• 2:48:44November Kelly?

  But besides just like dumping stuff, the other thing the mafia was doing was burning stuff. Next slide.

• 2:48:50Justin Roczniak?

  Ooh.

• 2:48:52November Kelly?

  And that's not

• 2:48:54Justin Roczniak?

  I thought that was woke. They don't let you do that. Yeah.

• 2:48:58November Kelly?

  Well, they don't let you do that in a way that doesn't give people cancer, right? But like, in this sense, if you don't give a shit about people getting cancer, you can just kind of do whatever, you know? Like, in the same way you're allowed to take a sting a missile. Yeah, please.

• 2:49:13Speaker 00

  The receptors of child population, population, child workers informal and workers informal is real dark.

• 2:49:24Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:49:25November Kelly?

  There's

• 2:49:27Speaker 00

  This is me learning about rage trucking of slides.

• 2:49:33November Kelly?

  One of the things about working in sort of like any kind of NGO sector or brushing up against it even is that you will find yourself either reading or making a lot of very corporate style infographics about things like child workers brackets informal or like conflict sexual assault or shit like that. It's just, it's part of the, this is, it's how we organize things here in the liberalism, I guess. But so the mafia, strictly speaking, the Camorra, I've been saying the mafia the whole time because I don't care. They've burned, they're burning so much shit in the open and leaving it burning that Campania gets nicknamed the land of fires.

• 2:50:14Justin Roczniak?

  Jesus Christ.

• 2:50:15November Kelly?

  That's a lot.

• 2:50:17Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, that's pretty bad.

• 2:50:18November Kelly?

  You think, you think that's a cool name? If you think that's a cool name, if you want to see land of fires, they're a down ticket of next slide, please.

• 2:50:26Justin Roczniak?

  The triangle of death.

• 2:50:30November Kelly?

  The triangle of death. Yeah, to be clear, this is from, from the Lancet Oncology in 2004. Not a good Lancet to be in, I would say. And this is the first English language use of triangle of death. It's not the first Italian usage because everyone in Campania knows what's happening, right? Not necessarily the exact contours, but they know everybody's getting sick, right?

• 2:50:58November Kelly?

  But so.

• 2:50:59Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 2:51:01Justin Roczniak?

  Good boy.

• 2:51:01Speaker 00

  So they. I see a lot of texts in here about tumors.

• 2:51:05Justin Roczniak?

  Oh.

• 2:51:06November Kelly?

  Yeah.

• 2:51:07Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 2:51:07November Kelly?

  Basically, the Italian state looks into this. They do another inquiry, which goes, ah, it's nothing to do with waste disposal. Although we do acknowledge that everybody has cancer. Yeah, yeah. And it's like, okay, but the cancer rates are crazy, right? Like, there's one district.

• 2:51:28Speaker 00

  What's Love Canal in Italian?

• 2:51:31Justin Roczniak?

  Uh, Amore Canal.

• 2:51:33November Kelly?

  Amore.

• 2:51:34Speaker 00

  Thank you. I know it couldn't be that hard.

• 2:51:38November Kelly?

  There's like one municipality.

• 2:51:45November Kelly?

  There's, there's one area, one triangle where it's like, everybody has, uh, liver cancer, colorectal cancer, leukemia, lymphoma, right? Then more than anywhere else in Italy. Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:52:01November Kelly?

  And we have some gory details here, uh, like sheep losing their wool and dying. Rare forms of cancer among children, farm animals being born with deformities.

• 2:52:14Justin Roczniak?

  That, that, that is a funny way to phrase it, though, is, um, like, the, the sheep cannot live without wool. Like, woolless sheep immediately dies.

• 2:52:27November Kelly?

  Yeah, too cold. No, it's, it's like, this is even, this is at a really serious point, right? Because it's fucking with the mozzarella. Like, they have to, they're doing like, mass coals of buffalo because their milk is full of dioxin.

• 2:52:42Justin Roczniak?

  Jesus. Jesus Christ.

• 2:52:46Justin Roczniak?

  No, no one knows what to put on a pizza then. They gotta like import Provol from St. Louis or some bullshit like that.

• 2:52:55November Kelly?

  You know, you know who else is in Campania is the United States military.

• 2:53:00Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 2:53:02November Kelly?

  Yeah, in an unusually frank sort of thing for internal dissemination, because, you know, Italy's problems are not their problems. They go, oh, yeah, all of the water is unsafe to drink.

• 2:53:14Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, my God.

• 2:53:17November Kelly?

  But we think that that's fine. So if you're on base, because you're only going to be deployed here for like two or three years. So you probably won't get.

• 2:53:28Liam McAnderson?

  Turbo cancer.

• 2:53:30Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I make calculations like that all the time.

• 2:53:33Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah.

• 2:53:33Justin Roczniak?

  That's why I use the containers like four or five times.

• 2:53:38November Kelly?

  God damn. Yeah. But they they did. They did identify three areas that they banned people from renting in because it's like too dangerous.

• 2:53:56November Kelly?

  Uh, next slide, please.

• 2:54:00November Kelly?

  All right. So you can sort of map this onto the previous slide and and draw the triangle if you want to. Um, but the gist of this is that they're dumping this stuff in the suburbs, like outside of Naples and Caserta.

• 2:54:18November Kelly?

  Which is already where the government is trying to put the incinerators in the dumps.

• 2:54:27November Kelly?

  And they're finding all of the like, because a ton of a ton of this is not like city water. This is rural enough to that you have wells.

• 2:54:35Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, no.

• 2:54:37November Kelly?

  You're all of a sudden your well is full of arsenic, cadmium, tin, beryllium, tetrachloride, toluene.

• 2:54:44Liam McAnderson?

  What the shit is toluene?

• 2:54:48November Kelly?

  It's one of the components.

• 2:54:49Justin Roczniak?

  These are the only ones which the news has come to Harvard. Many others, but they haven't been discovered.

• 2:54:57November Kelly?

  Four times the permissible level of lead.

• 2:55:02November Kelly?

  The the death rate in the area is 10% higher than the rest of the region. And almost all of that is tumors and respiratory diseases.

• 2:55:11Speaker 00

  Are you telling me that nerd crimes have higher death rates than the cool ones?

• 2:55:15Liam McAnderson?

  Crime doesn't pay except in human lives.

• 2:55:19November Kelly?

  Yeah, you can. You can sort of turn into the kind of Robert McNamara of giving water buffalo dioxin poisoning. There's.

• 2:55:30November Kelly?

  That's great. There's a, there's a quote here from a GP in Fratamajore. In Italy, a general practitioner with 1,500 patients sees an average of nine cases of cancer a year. I already have 15, right? And so Italy, Italy is now concerned enough about this to point out this triangle and ban the sale of mozzarella, olive oil and wine made within it.

• 2:55:58Justin Roczniak?

  Damn.

• 2:56:02November Kelly?

  It's like, this, this is too poisoned for you to even, uh, put on the pizza. This is not good.

• 2:56:13Justin Roczniak?

  I would be so pissed. Oh my God.

• 2:56:16November Kelly?

  Oh yeah. If you're a mozzarella farmer and the government's like, you gotta kill all your buffalo because you got like dioxin in them and also you can never sell mozzarella here again. That's not so good, you know?

• 2:56:29Justin Roczniak?

  That's when you back the tractor up to a building and spray poop on it.

• 2:56:34November Kelly?

  Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, uh, that's, that's sort of European farmers mobilizing for the most kind of depressed cause you've ever seen, uh, heard in your life.

• 2:56:41Justin Roczniak?

  Oh yeah.

• 2:56:42November Kelly?

  So this is, this is your, your risk of mortality and deformities on the left-hand side, your risk of exposure to toxic waste in the middle and your socioeconomic deprivation indicator on the right. You can see that this, it's not one-to-one, but it maps pretty fucking closely, right?

• 2:57:05Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:57:06November Kelly?

  Next slide, please. So this is, this is still ongoing to the point that, uh, Chicago Pope went there, um, and, and visited, uh, met some, met some like families of people who had like died of cancer, um, does a very like ecological homily.

• 2:57:26Justin Roczniak?

  Well.

• 2:57:27November Kelly?

  Which is, which is nice of him. But then the European Court of Human Rights finds that the Italian authorities knew that all of this was happening and knew that the Camara was doing it and had known that since 1988.

• 2:57:40Liam McAnderson?

  Jesus.

• 2:57:41November Kelly?

  And

• 2:57:44November Kelly?

  they're not required to do any like compensation or anything. They are legally required to do another inquiry.

• 2:57:55Liam McAnderson?

  Okay, well, maybe we'll get this one done before 2070.

• 2:57:59Justin Roczniak?

  One of these days, we'll get to the bottom of this.

• 2:58:02Liam McAnderson?

  Just take it, take it, give it up. Give us a minute, give us a minute.

• 2:58:06November Kelly?

  So, so Maloney has, has like appointed a general, so ring in the army again to, uh, which is funny because she might end up being deposed by a general. Um, but like she's appointed this guy to like lead this task force to, to do the, to look into doing a cleanup. But the, the anti mafia prosecutor in Naples, right? Anti mafia prosecutors in Italy, uh, fuck and are some of the only like independent sort of, uh, civil servants, basically. Um, uh, the, the Naples anti mafia guy is like, hey, so if you do a massive cleanup, you are gonna have to issue a ton of public contracts, a ton of which are gonna go to the mob.

• 2:58:53November Kelly?

  So.

• 2:58:55Justin Roczniak?

  You play both sides. That's why, that's how you always come out on top.

• 2:58:59Liam McAnderson?

  Yep.

• 2:59:00November Kelly?

  Yeah, yeah. And because all of the landfills are full of this bullshit, Campania is still a net exporter of waste to the rest of Italy. And that is how the bins got fucked in Campania.

• 2:59:17Justin Roczniak?

  Well, you know, we can all look forward to a new generation of

• 2:59:24Justin Roczniak?

  mob, mobbed up toxic waste remediation companies.

• 2:59:30November Kelly?

  Yeah, I'm a toxic waste remediation consultant. And then if we go to the next slide, Sam, bless you, Sam, has included a bonus slide because just in case we needed to fill time. You know, because this episode might have been kind of short.

• 2:59:46Justin Roczniak?

  Could have been short, yeah.

• 2:59:48Liam McAnderson?

  Could have been, wasn't.

• 2:59:51November Kelly?

  So if we, if we remember Calabria, which is the, the region sort of opposite, the Drangetta. That's their Camorra, that's their mafia. They have been irradiating the coastline of Somalia.

• 3:00:08Justin Roczniak?

  Jesus Christ.

• 3:00:10November Kelly?

  Yeah, yeah, they've, they've just been like dumping it at sea and a bunch of those ships have sunk and just vanished suspiciously. It's so who fucking knows, right? And some of them have been sent to Somalia. Some of them have been like just buried on land in Somalia. There is, there is one Pintito, Francesco Fonti, who claims that an Italian TV journalist and her cameraman were murdered in Somalia in 1944, in 1994, because they had seen some of this toxic waste arriving.

• 3:00:46Liam McAnderson?

  Jesus webbed.

• 3:00:49November Kelly?

  Yeah, very, very likely that the 2004 tsunami just washed up a bunch of toxic and radioactive waste as well.

• 3:00:59November Kelly?

  But that's, that's, that's the bins. That's the Italian bins.

• 3:01:03Justin Roczniak?

  That's the Italian bins, folks. I mean.

• 3:01:06November Kelly?

  I'm, I'm sorry for grabbing the controls away from you, Justin.

• 3:01:09Justin Roczniak?

  No, no, no, I said, I said your controls. It's fine.

• 3:01:15November Kelly?

  Okay, well, I, I, I, I think we have landed the plane now.

• 3:01:18Justin Roczniak?

  That's called crew resource management. You know, and it's, you know, all we, all we can do now is, you know, it's, it's interesting that the mafia from this point onwards is going to be, have to become environmental and woke, you know, in order to-

• 3:01:36November Kelly?

  Yeah, game's gone woke.

• 3:01:37Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, exactly. It's gone woke. That's where the money is, is woke now. You know, there's no stopping it. You know, it's, it's gonna be-

• 3:01:45November Kelly?

  Yeah, you have to get your pronouns through this one contractor.

• 3:01:48Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, you gotta get the pronouns through. Hey, you care about the rainforest? You care about the fucking rainforest?

• 3:01:59November Kelly?

  When you think about it, these guys are job creators for themselves.

• 3:02:03Justin Roczniak?

  Better care about the fucking coral reef or I'll send you down there.

• 3:02:13Justin Roczniak?

  But yeah, I, um, I, I, what did we, what did we learn?

• 3:02:20November Kelly?

  Um, I mean-

• 3:02:21Speaker 00

  I make it the meatball.

• 3:02:23Justin Roczniak?

  I make it the meatball.

• 3:02:28November Kelly?

  That if you're gonna try and win the war on bins, you should probably have a better dictator than, uh, Berlusconi.

• 3:02:38Justin Roczniak?

  Yes. Yes.

• 3:02:40Speaker 00

  Or Maloney.

• 3:02:41Justin Roczniak?

  Or Maloney.

• 3:02:42November Kelly?

  Yeah, for real.

• 3:02:44Justin Roczniak?

  We need, we need, we need a new the Italian.

• 3:02:53November Kelly?

  Yeah, we do, we do. And, and, and hopefully a woke one, but I'm not optimistic.

• 3:02:57Justin Roczniak?

  No, we, we, we can get a woke the Italian. You know, I, I, I don't know how. They better fuck-

• 3:03:05November Kelly?

  Oh, fuck, there's, there's like the mayor, the, the current mayor of, oh, I wanna say, I'm gonna get every single detail wrong in a way that's just tragic. The current mayor of fucking Turin, Nellie Sheen, or whatever the fuck her name is. I, she's woke, right? And so like, maybe she can be the Italian. I said the Canadian. Yeah.

• 3:03:24Justin Roczniak?

  They, they need a woke, uh, the Italian from Southern Europe. I don't, I don't want anyone from Turin. I, I want someone from like fucking, I don't know, Sicily.

• 3:03:36November Kelly?

  Do they make woke in, in Sicily?

• 3:03:40Justin Roczniak?

  No. Well, yes, now that the mob is woke.

• 3:03:43Liam McAnderson?

  That's right. That's right.

• 3:03:44November Kelly?

  Sylvia Solis, Mayor of Genoa. So I was wrong on every detail. Beautiful.

• 3:03:50Justin Roczniak?

  Still too far north.

• 3:03:53November Kelly?

  Hmm. For real.

• 3:03:55Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 3:03:56November Kelly?

  But that's, that, that is, that is a podcast, I believe.

• 3:03:59Justin Roczniak?

  That is the podcast. Well, we have a segment on this podcast called

• 3:04:06Justin Roczniak?

  Safety Third.

• 3:04:08November Kelly?

  Boom, boom, boom. I swear, I swear to God, I will set up the iPad and the new microphone soon.

• 3:04:17Justin Roczniak?

  Until then, I'm, I'm, I'm gonna find new things to put in there. It's gonna make everyone mad.

• 3:04:24Liam McAnderson?

  Talk to talk about that.

• 3:04:29Justin Roczniak?

  Hello, November. Yay, Liam, Roz, Devon, and assorted other hosts.

• 3:04:35Liam McAnderson?

  Other hosts.

• 3:04:36Justin Roczniak?

  Other hosts.

• 3:04:37November Kelly?

  Didn't name Victoria. Cancelled, translated.

• 3:04:39Justin Roczniak?

  Okay, next slide. No.

• 3:04:44Justin Roczniak?

  Likely buzzer noise for missing someone or assuming someone else was there. What do we got?

• 3:04:50November Kelly?

  Correct.

• 3:05:01Justin Roczniak?

  Greetings from-

• 3:05:02Speaker 00

  Do you want Taco Bell?

• 3:05:05Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, that would be really good. They just opened the Taco Bell here.

• 3:05:08Speaker 00

  Taco Bell garbage place.

• 3:05:10Justin Roczniak?

  Oh, yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah. Fuck. Holy shit. I would fuck that up. Yeah.

• 3:05:14November Kelly?

  Plaza de Basura?

• 3:05:16Justin Roczniak?

  No. Liam, they opened the Taco Bell where the Boston Market used to be.

• 3:05:20Liam McAnderson?

  Did they really?

• 3:05:22Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 3:05:24Liam McAnderson?

  We gotta go.

• 3:05:25Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah, I know, right? It's a, it's like an actual properly sized Taco Bell. Anyway.

• 3:05:30Liam McAnderson?

  Yeah, dude.

• 3:05:33Justin Roczniak?

  Greetings from the serial killer above the meth lab, AKA Canada.

• 3:05:41Justin Roczniak?

  I work at a small but very busy bronze foundry that specializes in lost wax castings of various sculptural works by a whole pile of artists.

• 3:06:00Justin Roczniak?

  Today, we had a perfect safety third incident, which somehow was unrelated to the fact that we work with bolted metal, power tools, large amounts of silica dust, and a room that is full of both flammable wax and fire.

• 3:06:17November Kelly?

  Incredible.

• 3:06:19Justin Roczniak?

  The delivery driver shows up at the shop, delivering bronze ingots.

• 3:06:26November Kelly?

  That's

• 3:06:29November Kelly?

  It's like fucking Minecraft. Really taken by the way you said bronze ingots.

• 3:06:33Justin Roczniak?

  I

• 3:06:33November Kelly?

  And of course, you see, I've become hopelessly dependent upon the ingots.

• 3:06:37Justin Roczniak?

  It is rare, in my experience, to interact with or even see an ingot of any metal, let alone bronze.

• 3:06:50November Kelly?

  This, this guy is just having someone say to you, yeah, I had a really annoying thing where a guy delivered me a bunch of bronze ingots is a potentially thousands years old safety third.

• 3:07:02Justin Roczniak?

  I had to describe this in a clay tablet.

• 3:07:07Speaker 00

  Hello, November Enos here, writing in.

• 3:07:15Justin Roczniak?

  Now, hold on. Finishing the sentence, delivering bronze ingots and all the shit we need to make the ceramic shell molds.

• 3:07:29Justin Roczniak?

  The first warning sign was that he goes to grab the pallet with the 1,500-ish pounds of bronze ingots.

• 3:07:42Justin Roczniak?

  It's on a stubby half pallet, and when he gets it on his little electric pallet jack, he doesn't get the weight all the way back to the powered wheel. No, he leaves the pallet on the front wheels, near the tips of the forks.

• 3:08:00Justin Roczniak?

  So the weight was in completely the wrong spot to get power down on the floor of this box drop, which would be less of an issue if not for the fact the driveway is on a slight slope. So he needs to drag that 1,500-ish pounds of bronze ingots that is precariously held with way less traction than he should have.

• 3:08:25Justin Roczniak?

  Luckily, our crew weren't dumbasses and we got in the truck and helped him move the pallet enough and got him to take up the weight in not a stupid spot.

• 3:08:38November Kelly?

  You legit could have sent in this safety third from the like the construction of the pyramids.

• 3:08:46Justin Roczniak?

  Then the real dumb shit starts.

• 3:08:49November Kelly?

  Now, okay.

• 3:08:51Justin Roczniak?

  This truck has one of them hydraulic tailgate lifts pictured here.

• 3:08:59Justin Roczniak?

  Oh my God, that's scrolled all the way back up. These are sketchy things at the best of times.

• 3:09:08Justin Roczniak?

  That's why I rent trucks from U-Haul. The platform is lower, not sponsored. Wait, no.

• 3:09:15Justin Roczniak?

  Meet our new sponsor, U-Haul. Anyway.

• 3:09:19November Kelly?

  Only two of us are lesbians.

• 3:09:24Speaker 00

  I did drive a U-Haul this past weekend, so I can't really say anything. We were in the Seattle.

• 3:09:30November Kelly?

  You have to celebrate Pride Month somehow.

• 3:09:31Speaker 00

  We were in the Seattle Pride Parade, carrying all the Dykes on bikes, helmets and gear and shit. And people thought that we were like actually representatives of U-Haul.

• 3:09:43Speaker 00

  They were like, are you U-Haul? And I just reached over and grabbed my wife to kiss her. And I was like, yeah, sure. Why not?

• 3:09:49November Kelly?

  I love the LGBTQ community.

• 3:09:56Justin Roczniak?

  These hydraulic tailgate lifts are sketchy things at the best of times. Normally when you're handling heavy loads with them, you really, really, really do that. A little tired. You do not want the weight out near the edge of the tailgate. So you get your pallet jack, pallet jack sitting on it perpendicular to the direction of the truck. Right? To keep the weight farther back and prevent the front wheels of your pallet jack from, for instance, going over the edge of the tailgate.

• 3:10:34Justin Roczniak?

  This man did not do that. He took the 1,600 pounds of bronze ingots.

• 3:10:44November Kelly?

  It's gained another 100 pounds.

• 3:10:46Justin Roczniak?

  No, yeah, no, I, this is a second load, I believe.

• 3:10:51November Kelly?

  Jesus.

• 3:10:51Justin Roczniak?

  On the 500 ish pounds of electric pallet jack and drives it within half an inch of having the front wheels go over.

• 3:11:02Justin Roczniak?

  We are at this point, fully in the realm of dumb cowboy shit. We somehow got the bronze off without incident. Okay. So no, maybe this is.

• 3:11:12Speaker 00

  What form was that bronze in?

• 3:11:14Justin Roczniak?

  Ingots.

• 3:11:17November Kelly?

  Sorry, what were the ingots made out of?

• 3:11:19Justin Roczniak?

  Bronze.

• 3:11:32November Kelly?

  I really want us to sell like a, not like a miniature bronze ingot. What's the smallest commercially viable ingot of bronze we can sell?

• 3:11:42Justin Roczniak?

  What's a full, it's presumably standard. It's a bronze ingot.

• 3:11:49November Kelly?

  Like in Skyrim?

• 3:11:52Justin Roczniak?

  Yes.

• 3:11:52November Kelly?

  Bronze ingots.

• 3:11:58November Kelly?

  Oh damn, you can buy, you can buy a kilogram ingot of bronze for 16.99?

• 3:12:03Justin Roczniak?

  That's not bad.

• 3:12:04November Kelly?

  That's crazy.

• 3:12:06November Kelly?

  I'm gonna, I'm gonna do that. I'm just straightforwardly gonna do that. I'm gonna buy myself a kilogram of bronze.

• 3:12:12Liam McAnderson?

  You earned it Nova.

• 3:12:14Justin Roczniak?

  It used to be, it used to be tungsten cubes. Now it's bronze ingots.

• 3:12:20Speaker 00

  I mean, it was like last episode that I was on, that I ordered the, the four and a half foot tall plush Chinese Dongfeng ICBM, which is now currently sitting on the couch behind me.

• 3:12:31Justin Roczniak?

  Nice.

• 3:12:32November Kelly?

  The podcast is, is largely an experiment to turn your listening time and money into dumb purchases.

• 3:12:38Justin Roczniak?

  Yes, yes. You know, I get sometimes the left, it's some, consumerism is, you know, I, I don't even know what I'm saying, other than yeah, go out right now and buy a bronze ingot.

• 3:12:52Liam McAnderson?

  Well, this constitutes investment advice. Don't worry.

• 3:13:00Justin Roczniak?

  It's only gonna go up in price. They ain't finding any more bronze.

• 3:13:09Justin Roczniak?

  Then we need to get to the second pallet, which has 1,200 pounds-ish of assorted grades of silica, plus a 700-ish pound, 55 gallon barrel of binder that allows us to turn all of that silica into ceramic shell molds around pieces of wax. The barrel is on one edge of the pallet. The many 55 pound bags of assorted silica take up the rest of the space. The driver takes his little electric pallet jack and scoots it under the side with the silica. Right? That's up here.

• 3:13:49November Kelly?

  Oh, basic physics problem failed.

• 3:13:56Justin Roczniak?

  Hold on. I've lost my place here. Every, every time I scribble on a, on a PowerPoint, it loses my space in the notes. This has been a problem for 200 episodes now.

• 3:14:11Justin Roczniak?

  Microsoft, fix this and don't do it with AI.

• 3:14:20Justin Roczniak?

  So that leaves the 55 gallon, 700-ish pound barrel of liquid on the tips of the forks.

• 3:14:29Justin Roczniak?

  The driver then repeats his previous action and just kinda drives the fucker straight out onto the lift with the front wheels of the pallet jack sitting under the barrel about half an inch away from just fucking rolling off the tailgate. As again where I scribbled over here.

• 3:14:50Justin Roczniak?

  This has the effect of loading the tailgate with 1,200 pounds of silica, 700 pounds of binder, 500-ish pounds of pallet jack, and maybe 140 pounds of dipshit delivery driver. The vast majority of which is oriented way the fuck out towards the edge.

• 3:15:11Justin Roczniak?

  Now, for those of you with even the most basic understanding of how to load things and of leverage, you can see this is shortly about to cause issues.

• 3:15:25Justin Roczniak?

  The driver pressed the button to lower the lift. Being a sketchy ass hydraulic lift, it's not exactly smooth. Has a bit of a bounce as it lowers. A bounce which mostly affects the leading edge of the lift. Which is where all the weight was.

• 3:15:45Justin Roczniak?

  This has the predictable effect of making the lip of the tailgate lift lower. Which causes the wheels of the pallet jack to slip off. Suddenly dropping several hundred pounds, another several inches.

• 3:16:01Justin Roczniak?

  This is what is called a shock load. That over 2,000 pounds of load is now acting like significantly more than over 200,000, 2,000 pounds, excuse me. Not quite 200,000 pounds, that's a lot.

• 3:16:18Speaker 00

  Think about how many ingots that would get you.

• 3:16:21November Kelly?

  Unloading my osmium ingots.

• 3:16:25Justin Roczniak?

  Jesus, these are having. Single bronze ingot, you know?

• 3:16:32Justin Roczniak?

  Now, this overloads the poorly welded blocks which keep the lift from just falling the fuck down. The welds on those blocks go off like a fucking gunshot. The front edge of the lift drops exactly the the way you would expect. A bunch of plate steel with hundreds of pounds hanging off the edge would. See figure three here, hold on. There's the mouse.

• 3:17:02Justin Roczniak?

  There we go.

• 3:17:03November Kelly?

  Tailgate fall down, Mr. Bond.

• 3:17:06Justin Roczniak?

  Tailgate fell down.

• 3:17:10Justin Roczniak?

  I lost my place again. Okay, there we go.

• 3:17:17Justin Roczniak?

  The driver by some fucking miracle avoided either falling in the now existing gap between the back edge of the tailgate in the truck and as such who getting his leg or back fucking snapped like a twig when the gap stops existing a few seconds later when things settle or getting launched by his pallet jack and flipping directly into the sharp sheet metal roof of the shop or being crushed by the load of shit he driven out onto the edge of the lift like a dumbass.

• 3:17:54November Kelly?

  I fully thought this guy was gonna trebuchet himself like if he's still holding on to the pallet jack when this happens the sort of motive force of bronze ingot is gonna make this guy into a kind of hypersonic missile.

• 3:18:08Justin Roczniak?

  That would be like a fully medieval situation. I was trebucheted by bronze ingots.

• 3:18:14Liam McAnderson?

  What the hell is a way to die?

• 3:18:16November Kelly?

  Yeah, just just getting getting to heaven and being like, yeah, fucking Age of Empires two shit happened to me. I don't know.

• 3:18:26Justin Roczniak?

  They get they have to put you they have to technically they have to put you in with a bunch of crusaders even though it's you know, 2000 and whatever it is 2026.

• 3:18:37November Kelly?

  26 workmen just like just like dapping up a crusader being like mangonel got you too, hammer.

• 3:18:49Justin Roczniak?

  What would you die of? Dysentery.

• 3:18:58Justin Roczniak?

  We at the shop then got to unload this tipped pallet, stand the barrel of binder back up and assist dipshit in strapping.

• 3:19:10Justin Roczniak?

  Strapping his totally fucked up tailgate lift so that he could drive away without dragging the damn thing. The electric pallet jack is currently-

• 3:19:20November Kelly?

  You get the truck back and you've had to like stick the whole tailgate back up is really good.

• 3:19:27Justin Roczniak?

  The electric pallet jack is still currently at the shop because there was no way to load it back into the truck.

• 3:19:34November Kelly?

  It's just embedded in the concrete at this time.

• 3:19:41Justin Roczniak?

  It's surrounded by perfectly stacked ingots, bronze ingots.

• 3:19:49November Kelly?

  Okay, good. I feel like, I feel like my entire brain has been like sanded down nice and smooth.

• 3:20:01Justin Roczniak?

  No, it's been turned into an ingot.

• 3:20:04Liam McAnderson?

  Which I can sell, what's all those? Nova's-

• 3:20:08Justin Roczniak?

  Alright, that was Safety Third.

• 3:20:14November Kelly?

  Really fun.

• 3:20:16Justin Roczniak?

  Jesus. Our, our next episode will be on Chernobyl. Does anyone have any commercials before we go?

• 3:20:30November Kelly?

  Listen to Trains Atlantic.

• 3:20:32Justin Roczniak?

  It's, it's fun.

• 3:20:33November Kelly?

  Listen to Trangolismo.

• 3:20:34Justin Roczniak?

  Yeah.

• 3:20:35November Kelly?

  Listen to, listen to Be Gay Solve Crimes.

• 3:20:38Justin Roczniak?

  I, I just, I just listened to the episode about Columbo and I thought it was wonderful.

• 3:20:43November Kelly?

  Oh, thank you so much.

• 3:20:46Justin Roczniak?

  Really, really, I, because I, I really, you know, I felt like it captured the spirit of, you know, Columbo. I'm making Columbo gestures right now. You can't see it.

• 3:20:57November Kelly?

  I, I fucking love Columbo. So yeah.

• 3:21:02Justin Roczniak?

  My, my wife, you know, my wife really, she loves Columbo. I don't really get it, but you know, I listen to your podcast.

• 3:21:10November Kelly?

  And just one more thing. Listen to Trains Atlantic.

• 3:21:18Justin Roczniak?

  There was one thing that was bothering me, right?

• 3:21:28November Kelly?

  I just said there was one thing that... You say you died of trebuchet. You got three hours into the podcast and you didn't plug the new podcast with Gareth Dennis. And that surprised me, you know?

• 3:21:39Justin Roczniak?

  No, I plugged that at the beginning. No, I didn't even plug that, yet you put that in there.

• 3:21:44November Kelly?

  Yeah, you put that in there.

• 3:21:45Justin Roczniak?

  Oh shit. There was one thing. Now, my wife, my wife, I don't really get it. My wife is really into bronze ingots.

• 3:21:56Justin Roczniak?

  Now you put the bronze ingots...

• 3:21:57November Kelly?

  Ancient Sumerian Columbo.

• 3:22:00Justin Roczniak?

  You put the bronze ingots on the front of the pallet jack.

• 3:22:09November Kelly?

  End this.

• 3:22:10Liam McAnderson?

  End this.

• 3:22:11Justin Roczniak?

  I think that was, that was a podcast.

• 3:22:15November Kelly?

  That was beautiful. That was beautiful.