Michelle Tillis Lederman: 7 Mindset Shifts That Turn Networking Into Your Greatest Advantage | Leadership | YAPClassic

Intentional networking, not luck, helped Michelle Tillis Lederman land back on her feet fast. After being laid off, she secured a new job in just three days. That experience led her to create the "Connector’s Advantage", a framework for building authentic connections that drive faster and better results. In this episode, Michelle shares how organizations can foster genuine human connection and strengthen team building, even across remote and hybrid workplaces. She also breaks down the seven mindsets of successful "connectors" and the networking strategies that actually pay off. In this episode, Hala and Michelle will discuss: (00:00) Introduction (01:00) Why Connection Is the New Superpower (06:31) How to Evolve From Networker to Super Connector (11:15) How Openness Builds Trust and Connection (20:44) Emotional Intelligence as a Core Leadership Skill (24:25) The Power of Vision and Intentional Connection (30:24) How to Ask for What You Want (44:26) Networking Tactics to Add Real Value (48:37) Staying Connected in a Hybrid Workplace Michelle Tillis Lederman is a nationally recognized expert in workplace communication, networking, and leadership. She is a keynote speaker, author, corporate trainer, and the CEO and founder of Executive Essentials, a company that provides customized communication and leadership programs. Her book, The Connector’s Advantage, teaches how building strong relationships leads to faster, easier, and better results in both business and life. Sponsored By: Indeed - Get a $75 sponsored job credit to boost your job's visibility at Indeed.com/PROFITING Shopify - Start your $1/month trial at Shopify.com/profiting. Quo - Get 20% off your first 6 months at Quo.com/PROFITING Revolve - Head to REVOLVE.com/PROFITING and take 15% off your first order with code PROFITING Merit Beauty - Go to meritbeauty.com to get your free signature makeup bag with your first order. DeleteMe - Remove your personal data online. Get 20% off DeleteMe consumer plans at to joindeleteme.com/profiting Spectrum Business - Visit Spectrum.com/FreeForLife to learn how you can get Business Internet Free Forever. Airbnb - Find yourself a cohost at airbnb.com/host Resources Mentioned: Michelle’s Book, The Connector’s Advantage: bit.ly/ConnectAdvantag Michelle’s Book, The 11 Laws of Likability: bit.ly/LawsofLikability Michelle’s Website: michelletillislederman.com Michelle’s LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/communicationexpertspeaker Michelle’s Instagram: instagram.com/mtlederman Michelle’s YouTube: youtube.com/user/michellelederman YAP E165 with Daniel Goleman: youngandprofiting.co/EI YAP E194 with Michelle Lederman: youngandprofiting.co/GrowUrNetwork Active Deals - youngandprofiting.com/deals Key YAP Links Reviews - ratethispodcast.com/yap YouTube - youtube.com/c/YoungandProfiting Newsletter - youngandprofiting.co/newsletter LinkedIn - linkedin.com/in/htaha/ Instagram - instagram.com/yapwithhala/ Social + Podcast Services: yapmedia.com Transcripts - youngandprofiting.com/episodes-new Entrepreneurship, Entrepreneurship Podcast, Business, Business Podcast, Self Improvement, Self-Improvement, Personal Development, Starting a Business, Strategy, Investing, Sales, Selling, Psychology, Productivity, Entrepreneurs, AI, Artificial Intelligence, Technology, Marketing, Negotiation, Money, Finance, Side Hustle, Startup, Mental Health, Career, Leadership, Mindset, Health, Growth Mindset, Goal Setting, Time Management, Problem Solving, Decision Making, Leadership Skills, Strategic Planning

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Hala Taha?

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• 0:45Hala Taha?

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• 1:20Hala Taha?

  Hello, young and profiterers. In a world where who you know often outweighs what you know, your ability to connect can make or break your success. In this Yap Classic episode, we're rewinding my conversation with Michelle Tillis Letterman, a top leadership expert, executive coach, and author of The Connector's Advantage. Michelle believes that genuine connection isn't about collecting contacts. It's about cultivating meaningful relationships built on trust, generosity, and authenticity. In this episode, she breaks down the seven mindsets of a connector and reveals how shifting your focus from networking to connecting can supercharge your career, influence, and happiness. So sit back and enjoy this conversation with the incredible Michelle Tillis Letterman.

• 2:06Hala Taha?

  So Michelle, you're obviously a super successful business owner, speaker and thought leader. And people often say that you're lucky. They call you lucky, but you say you're actually a connector. And that's what actually makes you lucky. So talk to us about how being a connector resembles being lucky.

• 2:23Speaker 01

  I love that you brought that up because I actually find it really frustrating. We're like, oh, you have all the luck. I'm like, no, no, no, no. This isn't luck that things serendipitously happen. And, and I tell the story at the opening of the Connectors Advantage around how I got laid off back in 2001 and was literally working my next job with, I had the offer, I think, within three days of my notice. And it wasn't luck. It was relationships. It was connections. And I really explained that when you have those relationships and you are willing to be clear about what you want and ask for it, that things happen and they happen faster, easier, and often with a much better result.

• 3:05Speaker 01

  And that's what I define the Connectors Advantage as, faster, easier, better results.

• 3:10Hala Taha?

  I love that. And I know that connection and building these connections is more important than ever because we are in the networking age. So it was the industrial age, the technology age. Now we're in this new networking age. So tell us about why connection is more important than ever.

• 3:26Speaker 01

  I always say that your relationships and the people in your life are your greatest asset. And that's for organizations as well. They say, oh, yes, our assets are our people. But they don't always treat the people that way. And so for me, I want to be out there helping organizations create connected cultures because, and I'm taking this now from an organizational standpoint. If you want retention and loyalty and engagement and productivity and happiness and high morale and all those things organizations want out of their team, you need to be a connected leader and create a connected culture. And that's pretty simple. I mean, I know it sounds really hard, but if you just think about two things, one, ensure that your people know that you care about them as people. I mean, that's kind of basic. And two is show your people you care about the things that they care about.

• 4:10Speaker 01

  And that takes a lot more, right? Listening and adapting and flexing and all of those things.

• 4:16Hala Taha?

  Yeah. And I have to imagine, and I know your book was written before this AI revolution that basically started six months ago. How do you think AI is going to transform the way that we need to think about relationships and connections, especially in the workplace?

• 4:32Speaker 01

  Oh, AI is kind of exciting and scary all at the same time. And I think there's great things. AI can be a collaboration spark, but I wouldn't want you to lose the connection to the collaboration partners that you have internally. You can almost think about AI as one more person on the team, but not to replace anyone on the team, right? They're a contributor, just as we are all contributors, and to use the skills that they bring to the table and make sure you're still leveraging all the skills that everyone else around you brings to the table.

• 5:02Hala Taha?

  And just to add to that, I think AI is really going to help people with technical skills, right? And these hard skills that we once used to need to go to school for and train for and memorize, we no longer are going to need to do that because AI is going to handle the hard skills for us. But what it can't do is the soft skills, and that's what makes connectors so special, right? And so I think being a connector is going to be actually more valuable, and it's a skill that more hiring managers and people are going to desire as time goes on and as AI starts to take more precedent in the workplace. I think being a connector is going to even be more valuable.

• 5:37Speaker 01

  I do worry about AI kind of removing the authenticity from our communications. Because one of the things AI does for us is it helps us draft communications really quickly, and then we might edit. But we might be sending things without really putting ourselves into them. And that's where that authenticity and that connection can get lost. So use it for what it does, which is speed us up, but make sure that you bookend it with the essence of you.

• 6:06Hala Taha?

  Hmm, I love that. I think that's great advice. So let's talk about the spectrum of connectors to sort of get a foundation for everyone. So you say there's a difference between the levels of connectors. It's based on two spectrums, the breadth and depth of the connections, and then their tendency to initiate or respond to others. So can you walk us through these spectrums and the type of people you find on either end?

• 6:29Speaker 01

  You got it. Okay, so I don't think we find too many people all the way on the non-connectors spectrum. These are people that don't even think relationships are valuable. And I actually had a coaching client once that said, "I don't value relationships." And I'm thinking, "Why did you hire me?" It was really, really fascinating, but there are people who just don't see the value in relationships. Those are few and far between. Most people are at least what we call emerging connectors. An emerging connector is somebody who at least sees the value in it, but doesn't yet have the confidence or knowledge in their skills of how to do it. And so as we start to move from an emerging to a responsive connector, we're starting to think about that first lever that you mentioned, which is, do we initiate or respond to those requests for connection, to those requests for assistance?

• 7:12Speaker 01

  And a responsive connector is responding. They're like, you need something? I got you. And they're taking action, but they're not initiating the action. They're not identifying and offering what they think that they could do within the relationship. So as we initiate more and not just respond, we're moving all the way to the acting connector. And you can simply do that based on frequency and balancing the initiation and the responsiveness. So non-connector, responsive connector, acting connector. And honestly, if all of your audience gets to an acting connector stage, I'm a really happy girl. Because we are prioritizing relationships, that's what a connector does, in everything that they do, and they're embodying the seven mindsets, which we'll get to in a minute. Now, if you want to

• 7:54Speaker 01

  take it up to level, if you really want to embrace and access the connector's advantage of faster, easier, better results, we're going to pull the other lever, and that's the depth and breadth. So my sister knows everybody in New Jersey real estate law, and no, she is not a New Jersey real estate lawyer, but she knows everybody in that niche. That is a niche connector. It could be a geographic niche, it could be a industry niche, it could be a functional niche, but they know, they are the know of. If you need to know somebody in that field, go check with my sister. If we go wide, now we are going across function, across industry, across geography, across demography, across countries'

• 8:37Speaker 01

  borders. We go from super connector all the way to global super connector. So you can be a global niche connector, and you can be a global super connector. And that's pulling those other levers. And those are the people that they have somebody everywhere. I once realized that I was a global super connector when I was talking to somebody, and they were in London or something, and I'm like, oh, do you know so and so? And I made a connection across the country for two people in the same location. So that is the ability to build those connections and create those, or I should say, connect those dots anywhere and with anyone.

• 9:13Hala Taha?

  Something that I think is interesting is that you say that not everyone's goal is the same. Not everybody should be a super connector or a global super connector. Why is that?

• 9:23Speaker 01

  You don't necessarily need to. I mean, it's great. The higher up the spectrum you get, the, you know, more value can add to somebody else. The more connections you can make, the faster, the easier, the better, right? You get more. But taking my sister's again, as an example, her industry, her function, her work is all US-based. She doesn't necessarily need to access that global area. It is so specific and so narrow and so niche that all the sheriff's officers in almost every courthouse in New Jersey knows her, all the lawyers. So she is well-known in her niche. And so I would call her a super connector, a super niche connector.

• 10:05Hala Taha?

  This is so interesting because it's also the same way that I think about social media. When I'm working with my clients, I'll always ask them, do you want a broad audience? Do you want a niche audience? And usually if they want a niche audience, they have some high-ticket offer. They only care about attracting this certain type of person in their network online that can afford their services and it makes them a thought leader in their industry and whatever it is. And then there's people who have a low-ticket offer who wants to attract a broad audience. So it's just interesting to think that the same type of logic crosses over in real life and online. So let's move on to the seven mindsets of a connector. I know one of the most important ones is to be open, right? Open and accepting. Why is openness such a foundation as a connector?

• 10:50Speaker 01

  That's actually the first one I talk about because it is foundational, as you said, to be open and accepting. And oftentimes we define open as open to somebody else and accepting of somebody else. But I actually, when I think about being a connector, it is bidirectional. Yes, absolutely. We want to be open to other people. We want to be open to other ideas. We want to be accepting of our differences. But at the same time, we need to be open and accepting of ourselves. And what I talk about are our unique charms, right? So to be open is to access the law of authenticity that we talked about on the last podcast, right? That's the foundation of likability is to be the real you. Except when people go, you know, but I'm a jerk. That's the real me.

• 11:30Speaker 01

  Being authentic does not give you permission to be a jerk. But being open and accepting has us understand when we have attributes that might not be working for us and when and how to flex them. So a unique charm is that quality about ourselves that is core to who we are. Right for me, I talk a lot. I fill in all the silence, all the gaps. I go, go, go, go, go. And can be a little intense at times, so I'm told. So I know it's who I am and I also know that it's not always working for me. And to understand how to flex it. Another example of a unique charm is my husband. I love his sense of humor. I married him for a sense of humor. He still makes me laugh after nearly 20 years. But sometimes he goes for the joke, not at the right time. Hmm.

• 12:14Speaker 01

  And that's one of his unique charms and understanding when it works for him and when it works against him. So to be accepting of ourselves is to embrace ourselves, not be judging and criticizing and beating ourselves up and saying, I'm not worthy, I'm not worthy. Wayne's World reference, if you got that one, tell us. I did not.

• 12:32Speaker 01

  But we need to be open and accepting of ourselves so that we can also give that same grace to everyone else and enable that connection to form. So when we think about being open, I also want you to think about being open to being wrong. There's so much meat in this one idea, right? Because it's inward, but it's also about our assumptions. One of the big terms out there is unconscious bias and we all have it. And one of the ways to understand unconscious bias is to make it conscious. And I'm not saying that we want to embrace our bias, but when we are aware of our bias, you can make a choice about how you act with that awareness of how that bias might be leading you in a wrong direction. Because we make decisions really quickly.

• 13:17Speaker 01

  We take in little bits of information and then we decide whatever we're going to decide. And then we look in more information to confirm that bias. So that's confirmation bias. What I want you to do is be open to being wrong. I want you to check your assumptions. I want you to climb back down that ladder. There's four questions I put in the chapter to help people really tactically do that, of slow their thinking down so that I can stay open to you, your ideas, and open to being wrong.

• 13:44Hala Taha?

  And I have the questions right here. So what don't I know? How else could I interpret it? What if I'm wrong? Do I want to be right?

• 13:50Speaker 01

  Am I trying to be right? And that's the one that I added because I was just like, ah, you know, sometimes I just, I'm just going for the win.

• 13:58Hala Taha?

  Yeah.

• 13:59Speaker 01

  And sometimes we're not separating the person from the problem. And I'm like, I just don't like you. And therefore I'm not going to let you in, even though I know you're right.

• 14:06Hala Taha?

  Hmm.

• 14:07Speaker 01

  Right? So just being aware of some of our tendencies there.

• 14:11Hala Taha?

  Let's hold that thought and take a quick break with our sponsors.

• 14:18Hala Taha?

  Okay. And so this openness part, I really want to make sure that people understand it because it is tricky. And like you said, there's like multiple parts. So you talk about this Johari window in your book. It's a visual grid, so I don't think we're going to do a great job explaining a visual grid on an audio podcast, but I would love for you to explain why this tool helps and what we need to understand about this tool.

• 14:39Speaker 01

  We actually, it's a really simple grid, so I will verbally describe it because it's simply a box with four quadrants, right? We can all imagine the four quadrants. And at the top of the box, we're going to have what is known to me. And on the other side is what is known to others. And so if we cross those boxes, what is known to me and to others, the box one, is my openness. That is where I'm showing who I am to the world. If we have what is known to me, but is hidden to others, that is what I'm hiding. That is, you know, that part of me that I'm not sharing with the world. If it is unknown to me, but it's known to others, that's my blind spot. I'm like, I just didn't realize that's how I'm coming off.

• 15:22Speaker 01

  Like, that's how I felt when I realized that I was intense and intimidating. I'm like, really? I don't see myself that way at all. But yet I was getting tons of feedback around that. And so the blind spots that we can start to decrease through feedback and self-awareness and taking in information. And then unknown to me and unknown to others, that is simply the unknown, right? It is yet to be discovered. And so our goal is really to expand box one, being more open. And we do that by self-disclosure, right? So we're going to reduce what I'm hiding away by sharing a little bit more of ourselves, being a little bit more vulnerable, because vulnerability leads to credibility. It's one of those pillars of trust that we talk about at a further chapter down the book.

• 16:06Speaker 01

  And we are going to seek information to reduce our blind spots.

• 16:09Hala Taha?

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• 17:37Hala Taha?

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• 18:22Hala Taha?

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• 18:29Hala Taha?

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• 19:11Hala Taha?

  If you're ready to launch your business before Black Friday, go to Shopify.com/profitting to start your free trial. That's Shopify.com/profitting. Go to Shopify.com/profitting today to hear your first. So this idea of unique charms, essentially just to sort of tie it together, is whatever you come across in yourself after you get to really be open to yourself, that may seem negative, but it's not necessarily something that you're going to let go of. Like, so for example, you're really talkative. For me, my confidence can sometimes come off as arrogance or that like I don't want to be friendly or something. But really, it's just, I'm just really confident and like, keep it moving. You know what I mean? So it's like, I don't want to change that about me because that's why I'm successful.

• 19:55Hala Taha?

  But maybe I need to make that a unique charm, call it out, joke around about it, make it known. So that I share my weakness and be open about it without necessarily stopping the behavior altogether if I don't want to stop the behavior. Is that right?

• 20:10Speaker 01

  Okay, I love everything you said, but one tweak.

• 20:12Hala Taha?

  Okay.

• 20:13Speaker 01

  It is not a weakness.

• 20:14Hala Taha?

  Hmm.

• 20:15Speaker 01

  A unique charm is not a weakness. Your confidence is your strength, right? This is a quality about yourself that you really do love about yourself. And at the same time, it is not always working in your interactions with other people. And so what I want people to think about is, how do I flex in that moment? So to your point of sometimes coming on too strong or people feeling, I'm not getting rid of that. That's why I've written four books. That's why I'm successful too. You don't need to get rid of it, but what you can do, and so here's an example of something, because I had that same one as well. We can have more than one unique charm. I was recently collaborating with somebody on my team. We were designing and co-creating a program and I said to her off the bat, I said, please disagree with me. Please push back on me.

• 20:58Speaker 01

  I said, sometimes when I speak, I come off as if my answer is the right answer and there's no room for anybody else. I said, do not take me that way. So I let them know off the bat not to interpret the way that I know my tendency is to be interpreted. And she's like, that was so great. Thank you. I will push back. And she does. And it's wonderful.

• 21:17Hala Taha?

  That's such great advice. I think this is something that's like, it's not obvious. It's definitely a tool that we can use to be more open with others. And it's genius, in my opinion, because it's just calling out the elephant in the room. Let me just call it out. So it's not awkward anymore and so that we can get along as well as possible.

• 21:35Speaker 01

  It's matching intent with impact. And so when we have some of these unique charms, when we have some of these blind spots, we have a certain intent, but it's not the impact that we're having. And so in order to have those things and bridge that gap, giving some information about how to interpret me or how to receive something I do or how to even keep me in line. Sometimes I'm like, sometimes I get excited and I interrupt. Don't let me. And so I talk to a lot of my coaching clients about teaching their employees and their assistants and things like that, how to manage them, how to manage up. And it is a amazing tool to create more collaborative, more cohesive and more productive working relationships. When you tell somebody, here's how to keep me in line.

• 22:18Hala Taha?

  This is really, really smart for any leaders or managers tuning in because especially as a leaders, people get afraid to sort of tell you anything otherwise or counteract your opinion or whatever it is. So I can imagine that that could really help foster relationships in a business. Okay, so let's talk about emotional intelligence. So I know that it's pretty obvious to think that connectors are going to have higher emotional intelligence than non connectors. Can you talk to us about the five levels of emotional intelligence and how we can improve our emotional intelligence?

• 22:53Speaker 01

  It's so funny. I was starting to listen to the 10th anniversary of emotional intelligence by Daniel Goldman this morning on my morning walk.

• 23:01Hala Taha?

  I interviewed him.

• 23:03Speaker 01

  Really fresh in my mind. And there's a lot of different models of emotional intelligence and I don't remember who I credit this model to, but I think of it in two parts, self mastery and social mastery. So the first three levels of emotional intelligence about self mastery. So that has to start with self awareness, which we've already been talking about, right? Understanding my triggers and understanding the good and the bad. And then it's self regulation. So how do I not be reactive and be more responsive in those moments of trigger? And self motivation. So how do I act in the face of obstacles? How do I keep, as you said, let's go, go, go. When some roadblock or something doesn't go our way, how do we

• 23:46Speaker 01

  rebound and recover and regroup? So that's the self mastery. Social mastery is about taking this outside of yourself. So it's picking up on those social cues, social awareness, right? The awareness of others and listening, I always say with your eyes as well as your ears. So what am I getting? And then taking responsibility and checking that assumption, like I'm feeling this, what's going on there? Or checking in because we don't want to just assume we're right. And then being able to act and make decisions collaboratively, that's at the pinnacle, right? When I can collaborate, co-create and make decisions with others, now I have really mastered the emotional intelligence where they feel empowered and appreciated and engaged.

• 24:32Hala Taha?

  Yeah, and it's so interesting to think, you know, I think of my business partner, Kate, and myself, we're so different. We're both masters at emotional intelligence, but in our own ways. And it's just so interesting to think how you could be really strong in one aspect of emotional intelligence and not so strong on other aspects. What's the best way to gauge where we are? And what are some resources we can use to learn more about EI?

• 24:56Speaker 01

  Well, there's tons of assessments out there. And, you know, I am a fan of them. But you can do free ones online. There are paid ones where you get a robust report. But if you do the paid ones, do it with a coach, because it has expertise in that one tool, because that will help you figure out what to do with it. So we might get a result and say, okay, great, you know what your triggers are, but you let them trigger you. And so you really need to work on self regulation and to get to a more responsive place versus a reactive place. Then they can help you put an action plan into place to do that. It could be you just don't have an awareness of others is, you know, you're not even looking up from your work. You're so focused down here that your eyes aren't up here to pick up on those cues that other people are giving you. So your social awareness

• 25:38Speaker 01

  might be lacking. So feedback, whether it is self collected through an assessment, that's the best way you're going to get information. That's how we start to reduce our blind spots.

• 25:49Hala Taha?

  And then Daniel Goldman, I think, has a bunch of books on emotional. He's like, really the godfather. We also have a whole episode on Yap about that. So I'll mention it in the outro, so you guys can check it out. Okay, so let's talk about agency over our lives and having a clear vision for our future. Why is that so important for connectors?

• 26:10Speaker 01

  I was kind of hoping you'd go to this one. For those who haven't read the book yet, The Seven Mindsets, we're going a little bit in order. I'm going to list them out just so you heard them once, because we're probably not going to get through all of them. But connectors are open to accepting. They have a clear vision. They trust. They come from a place of abundance. They're social and curious, conscientious, and have a generous spirit. And one of the reasons I put have a clear vision really upfront, and by the way, these are nonlinear. It's not like I have to do one, then do the next and do the next. They actually enable each other. It's really hard to be conscientious if you don't trust and have a generous spirit if you don't come from a place of abundance. So they really do enable and support each other. But to have a clear vision is the only way

• 26:55Speaker 01

  you are really going to access the connector's advantage. Because if you don't know what you want, you can't get it. So you can't get faster, easier, better results if you don't know what result you're looking for. But I've always hated the question, what do you want to do? You know, 10 years from now, where do you see yourself? Five years down the road, I'm like, I don't know. I don't want to know now. I want it to be a surprise. I want the exploration. I don't want predestined. If you have that, good on you. I've just never been that person. But it doesn't mean I don't have a clear vision for something. I actually have right here, always in my drawer, my sticky notes. And you'll see there's lots of sticky notes over the years. Each year I write a sticky note of what's my vision for the year. And it doesn't have to be the far out plan. It could be the three month, six month, nine month, one year plan.

• 27:41Speaker 01

  And I don't usually go beyond that. And what that does for us is it has us understand when somebody is embodying the mindset of a connector with that spirit of generosity. And they say, what are you working on and how can I help? Which is something I would say everybody listening should be doing all the time in all those conversations. Before you get off, you know, what are you working on? How could I help? Who do you want to know? What would be valuable for you? It's a fabulous question to ask. It's also a really important question to have an answer to. And that's what having a clear vision does for you. So when somebody says, I'm here offering you help, you can say, okay, here's the kind of help I'm looking for.

• 28:20Hala Taha?

  So is this clear vision just related to networking? Or are you saying have a clear vision for your goals? And then, once you know what your goals are, think about what networking you need to do to support that? Give us some rigor around what you want us to do exactly.

• 28:38Speaker 01

  Okay, so the first question is, this is not about networking. This is about you, your life, your goals. So having a clear vision about whatever it is that you are trying to accomplish in your life, whether it is a personal goal of changing careers, or getting healthier, or running a marathon, or if it's a professional goal of landing a client, becoming partner, getting a new job, whatever it is, right? You have something you're working on. One time, when my second book came out, The Heroes Get Hired book, my goal was to connect with Michelle Obama. And I put it out there. I put it out there so much so that I got a phone call with her chief of staff. I never spoke to her directly, but that's pretty close. And I got my book in front of her. And that was the goal. When my last book came out, my goal was very simple. I wanted to get to 100 reviews on Amazon.

• 29:24Speaker 01

  And so, they can be small goals, they can be big goals, right? And I just gave you two examples of ones that I've had over time. And they can be different goals based on the person you're talking to. So first thing is, that's what the goal is about. The second thing is, and I kind of squirmed to my seat a little bit when you're like, do we do this first, do we do that first? And you wanted rigor. And I was like, you know what? I've always been a little organic when it comes to connection. And the truth is that I've had to be a little more intentional about that post-COVID. I will say that it still makes me squirm a little bit to be too strategic and too like tactical when it comes to building relationships. But I actually just designed a course called Intentional Connection in a Hybrid World. And have been delivering, I just delivered it to Procter & Gamble Women last month.

• 30:08Speaker 01

  And they were so hungry for it because all of a sudden, we don't have a water cooler moment. We're only in the office one or two days a week, and the people that we want to connect with might not be there the same two days. And there's fewer live events, although they are coming back. And we don't feel as connected to our organizations, or to our coworkers, or our friends, because we're just not in their space anymore. And so, yes, I do think we need to be intentional about going out and building those relationships, and having virtual coffees. And we can talk a little bit more about how to be tactical around that. And, as I say that, I also just want you to build the relationships that you want to build. Because that's where the true relationship and connection forms deeply and strongly, and it lasts. And you don't know who they went to camp with, and you don't know who

• 30:53Speaker 01

  they went to school with, and you don't know who their neighbor is, and you don't know who they're married to. And those strong ties can lead to the weak ties and the introductions that you might need.

• 31:06Hala Taha?

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• 31:49Hala Taha?

  Friday, go to Shopify.com/profitting to start your free trial. That's Shopify.com/profitting. Go to Shopify.com/profitting today to hear your first...

• 32:05Hala Taha?

  What's up, Yap fam? You guys know we love reading on this show, so I'm always excited when I find a book I genuinely think is worth sharing. "Life at the Speed of Play: Launch Products People Love" by Mark Pincus is one of those books. Mark is a legendary Silicon Valley entrepreneur and investor, and this fast-paced 170-page book is his playbook for testing ideas quickly, navigating uncertainty, and figuring out what's actually worth pursuing. One of my favorite concepts is what he calls "the abyss," those moments when you feel stuck or unsure of what's next. Instead of fearing uncertainty, he shows you how to use it as a tool for discovery. Right now, Mark is doing a buy-one-get-one offer for

• 32:48Hala Taha?

  Yap listeners. Go to GetMark'sBook.com/Yap. Buy one copy for $30. $22 and get a second copy free. So you can keep one for yourself and give the second to a friend, future co-founder, or someone who needs a little push. What's up, yap fam? If you're building a personal brand, you already know how hard it is to stay consistent with content when you're also trying to actually run your business. I love creating content, but realistically, I'm not trying to sit in front of the camera every single day. I need time to work on my business. But the problem is consistency matters. The more people see your face and hear your voice, the more familiar you become. That's why HeyGen has been such a great tool for me. You can record just 15 seconds of footage, create an AI avatar of yourself,

• 33:33Hala Taha?

  and use it to make videos on demand. So instead of constantly filming from scratch, you can create more content, stay visible, and keep showing up without making your entire life be about generating content. And you guys know I'm always looking for tools that give entrepreneurs more leverage. HeyGen is definitely one of those tools. 30 million people already use it, from solo founders to 85% of the Fortune 100. Your first three videos are free at heygen.com/profitting. That's H E Y G E N dot com slash P R O F I T I N G. Heygen.com/profitting. Totally understand. Let's talk about the ways that we can achieve what we want,

• 34:17Hala Taha?

  and that means asking for what we want. So let's do quick fire. Right now, I'm going to rattle off a type of ask that you mentioned in your book, and you can tell us what we need to know about it, how we can use this approach, when we should use it, why it works. So the first one is an opt-out ask.

• 34:36Speaker 01

  Perfect. And I was hoping you were going to take us to the ask, because that's the other part of having a clear vision. You can't just have a clear vision. You have to be willing to ask for what you want. And I always say, if you don't ask, the answer is no. If you ask, you immediately increase your odds. And I'm like drilling this into my kids. Every time, I'm like, ask, ask. And I'm like, see? You wouldn't have gotten if you didn't ask.

• 34:56Speaker 01

  I'm very annoying. The opt out ask is actually one of my favorite asks. It is the easiest one to access. And the reason I love it is because you are giving the person the reason to say no. And you want to make it as easy for them to say no as it is for them to say yes, because yes is easy and no is hard. And if I have to say no to you, or I want to say no to you, now I'm uncomfortable. And that puts the relationship at risk. And my goal in teaching you how to ask is to make sure that you don't put a relationship at risk. It is not necessarily always to get the yes, but to increase your chances of getting a yes, either now or later. And that is by putting the relationship at first. So an opt out ask might be, if your company allows it, I would really appreciate a recommendation on LinkedIn.

• 35:40Speaker 01

  If your company allows it is the opt out. Or if you have time, I would really appreciate a review on Amazon. If you have time is the opt out. I'm really busy right now. Totally get it. Don't even think twice. They feel like it's totally okay and you're not annoyed with them. And now they don't feel like they need to avoid you.

• 35:59Hala Taha?

  Hmm. I love that because if you don't give them an opt out and they say no, then they just feel like, well, I can never talk to this person again now. It makes it less awkward. Okay, how about make it easy ask?

• 36:11Speaker 01

  So make it easy has actually a lot of ways to make it easy. And what we want to do is make it easy for them to say yes. And if it's not yet easy, we're going to find different ways to make it easy. So there is the alternate ask. And all of these are forms of making it easy. The alternate ask is, do you want to try this or do you want to try that? And they can choose because they're of equal value to you. And they can feel like, well, that one feels more comfortable. I'll do that one. So you're giving them options, the alternatives. If you want to make it smaller, you can do the shrinking ask. And so, hey, can I take you out for lunch? And they're thinking, hmm. Or maybe just a coffee, hmm. Or, you know, perhaps we can just jump on a Zoom or a phone call, hmm. Or, you know, if this is your busy season, I totally get it.

• 36:55Speaker 01

  Is there somebody else in the organization that you might connect me to that that might have some time, you know, in the next few months? So we're going to make the ask smaller and smaller and smaller until there's something that they can say yes to, because people do want to say yes. Right? So instead of them having to figure out the alternative to what you asked for, you can give them smaller and smaller options in ways that you can be supported. And there's also the convenient ask. Which is really making it easy. Typically, when somebody is of a higher rank or brings more to the relationship, and we kind of know when we're in those positions, we might say, do you want me to come to your office? Or do you have a favorite coffee shop? What time is best for you? And just really make it as easy, and you jump through all the hoops to get to that yes.

• 37:39Hala Taha?

  I love that. A note on that is if you're talking to somebody busier than you, definitely don't send them a Calendly link. Definitely don't say, my assistant will send you times. Like, you bring the times, you bring the options. Like, just make it as easy as possible. This is something I see a lot of people screw up. How about the whiff it ask?

• 37:59Speaker 01

  So, whiff it, for those who haven't heard this phrase, it's what's in it for them? And this is actually one of the most powerful asks because it is putting the benefit forward to create an impetus for action. But it's also one you need to be careful with because sometimes it is really not a benefit to them. And if it is not, don't pretend that it is. And I can't tell you how many times I've gotten email, LinkedIn things saying, I think it'd be mutually beneficial for us to connect, and duh, duh, duh, duh, duh. And I'm thinking, hmm.

• 38:31Hala Taha?

  Where's the benefit?

• 38:33Speaker 01

  You know, if you're a student and you're going to a CEO, don't say it'll be mutually beneficial. Say, you know, I know that you're really keen on mentorship, and I'm trying to learn this, and might you or somebody in your organization, you can combine asks, right? So, we're being deferential. We're not saying what's in it for them. And we're giving also shrinking, we're giving options. We're throwing it all in there. But what's in it for them was also there because I said, I know you're really big on mentorship. Right? So I'm saying, this is something you've said you value, and here's a way for you to execute on one of your values. So there's a whiff it there. When you are going to your organization, and you want to go to this conference, and it costs a lot of money, and you're trying to convince your organization to pay for it, that's a great time to use a whiff it.

• 39:18Speaker 01

  What's in it for the organization for me to go to this? What information can I bring back? How will I bring it back? How will I create value for the organization if I go?

• 39:26Hala Taha?

  These are really good. I feel like this is my favorite part of the interview so far because I feel like it's so actionable. Like, we can just use this immediately. Okay, how about the non-ask?

• 39:37Speaker 01

  So this is my newest favorite. I was all about the opt out and now I have really kind of incorporated in the non-ask. And the non-ask is when you're not asking for anything specific. Instead, you're sharing a little bit about your goal or your vision without the ask. But here's the trick. When you bring your energy and when you bring your passion and your enthusiasm, your excitement, and you're sharing, here's what I'm working on, like, you know, hey, I want to make my book a bestseller, or hey, I want to meet Michelle Obama, whatever that crazy thing is, that excitement, that exuberance, it's contagious and people are wanting to help. And if they don't come up with an idea themselves, then you simply follow it up with any advice or any ideas for me. And that's not asking

• 40:20Speaker 01

  them for anything specific, but that's tapping into their brain and their desire to be valuable, to add value, to tap into their generous spirit, their connector mindset, and think about who can I connect them to, what information can I give them, how could I be helpful, what ideas? And this happens to me all the time. I have a mentor. He is a CEO of multiple companies that have gone public and I've known him since I was pregnant with my first child, who is now 17. And we are still in touch and we get together once a year and COVID, maybe not so much, but we've stayed in touch. And I shared with him about my latest book. And while I was still writing, and he goes, well, here's an idea. And here's, and I didn't even ask him for ideas. And his ideas were phenomenal. And it's because

• 41:05Speaker 01

  of him that I have 30 experts in my book, giving me and everyone who's reading it even more advice and guidance. And it was because he said, well, let's get a millennial angle here. And it's those moments of brilliance that is just because I'm sharing, here's what I'm working on, here's what I'm excited about. That's the non-ask.

• 41:24Hala Taha?

  I think that works really, really well. So I know that we're not going to have time to cover all these mindsets, but I do want you to cover them at a high level. So let's talk about abundance, trust, being curious, just walk us through at a high level, some of these mindsets that we didn't talk about yet.

• 41:39Speaker 01

  I'll think about like, when I'm doing my keynote, I give you a like a two sentence thing on each one. Trust for me is the foundation of relationship. And I talk about four pillars of trust, authenticity, which we talked a little bit about, vulnerability, transparency and consistency. And I will say you have to give trust to get trust. But don't be afraid of vulnerability. It is not weakness, it is openness. The next one is abundance. This is the hardest one for people. And it's also the hardest one for me because I grew up with scarcity. And whatever scarcity looks like to you, there's not enough money, there's not enough time, there's not enough clients, there's not enough room at the top for women, there's not enough something. And a shift from scarcity to abundance, it's not, everything's fine and everything's going to be great.

• 42:24Speaker 01

  And there's no, no. It is the belief in the possibility and not, not even possibility, the probability that things can be exponentially better than they are, that it doesn't have to be a linear progression and that there's enough to go around and that I am enough. And it doesn't mean that we're not jealous at times, but it means that we can put that aside and then, so here's an example. Friend of mine landed this amazing client. I was super, super jealous. It was in the sports field. I'm like, oh, my God, can I work for you? You know, do you need help? I'm like, how did you land them? And I was really like, ah, for a little bit. And that's okay. Feel it, let it go, release it. And then I went back and I'm just like, okay, teach me, how did you land that one?

• 43:07Hala Taha?

  This is something I want to stick on for a moment because for me, I consider myself a super connector. And I think one of my big things is that I never look at anybody as competition. You could be in my field, you could be also like LinkedIn queen, podcaster, whatever. I'm just going to figure out how you can help me and how we can help each other and how we can work together and collaborate. So I always say collaboration over competition. And if you don't have this abundant mindset, you will never work with your competitors. And this is one of the most important things you can do to get ahead is to actually be friends with and work with people who are your competitors or in your same field. And a lot of people get tripped up on this. They, they don't want to help anyone. They don't want to give away any sort of secrets.

• 43:51Hala Taha?

  And like, that's definitely not how you grow within your niche.

• 43:54Speaker 01

  It's like we're of the same mind. I'm like, I knew when we met the first time that we connected because we think alike. Something I always say is I have no competition. I only have potential strategic alliances. People are like, well, who's your biggest competitor? I'm like, I don't have competitors. I don't need to be in competition. There is enough and I have collaboration partners and I have strategic partners and alliances and friends and colleagues. And that's how I view everyone and anyone.

• 44:22Hala Taha?

  Okay, so take us to the next one.

• 44:23Speaker 01

  So we are up to social and curious. And I'm always very careful with this one because a lot of the introverts out there are like, I don't like this one. But let me be clear, there's a section in this called the introvert's edge. Because being social and curious is not a social butterfly. It's not the life of the party. It is simply putting yourself in a position to be social and curious about one other individual. And introverts are actually really uniquely skilled and naturally good at this. So that's really why social and curious go together. Because they need to go together if you want to build connection and relationships.

• 44:58Hala Taha?

  Let me stick on this for a second. So I know that introverts are great listeners. So that's a great skill as a networker. Talk to us about the different formats that they can leverage to ensure that they'll be successful.

• 45:11Speaker 01

  So that's a really important thing. And I say find your format, right? Whether you want to be on this platform, that platform, face to face, big conferences, small round tables, whatever format or channel of communication for you to connect and be social and curious on is your choice. At the same time, I want everyone out there listening to think about their stretch. I don't want you to be stretching all the time, but if we're always stretching just a little or often stretching just a little, then the next time it's not as big a stretch. So find your format, be comfortable and work in the environments in which you thrive and always think about a stretch.

• 45:51Hala Taha?

  I really appreciate that advice because I know a lot of people that are introverts and they'll say like, well, I really only do one on one. But when you're friends with extroverts, we don't want to be one on one. And so you might just get left out of opportunities that are not one on one, right? And so you want to make sure you're open to different opportunities. I know it's harder for people who are introverts, but like you said, to stretch is important. Okay, so what else is down the line?

• 46:17Speaker 01

  Conscientious. And I wish we had more time because this is one that I think everyone needs. And it's the idea that connectors do what they say they're gonna do. They follow up and they follow through. And if they're able to do that, they need to learn how to say yes, and they need to learn how to say no. And so it's about setting up boundaries. It's about being generous with yourself, right? So we said these enable each other, right? I can't be conscientious. I also have to be generous spirit, not just to others, but generous spirit to myself. So creating boundaries and recognizing that yes and no are not one word answers. And we won't go into it, but in that chapter, I give you lots of ways to frame a yes and a no. Again, not to be off putting in the relationship.

• 46:56Hala Taha?

  And then generosity, is that the last one?

• 46:59Speaker 01

  That's the last one. You can't be a connector if you do not want to add value, if you do not want to support and show that interest in something else, because that's what a connector's mindset is, is thinking about not just me and not just you, but the interaction between us and how we can create value for all.

• 47:18Hala Taha?

  Okay, so I love this. And let's transition into like our tactical best advice, give us exercises, activity portion of the interview. So like I mentioned, I consider networking to be one of my top skills, right? I feel like the reason why I'm very successful and dominated my niche is because I've had these networking skills. And so one of the things that I like to do, speaking of generosity, is I always think of ways to add value. And my favorite way to do this is to actually introduce two people together in my network. So when I first meet somebody, one of the first things I think about is who in my network can solve their problem. So I try to understand what their problem is, even if I have nothing to do with it, if I have zero expertise. I interview so many people on my podcast.

• 48:02Hala Taha?

  I meet so many people. So I sort of know an expert in everything. And then I try to introduce them to somebody who I already know. And so what I'm doing is basically giving value to a cold connection, and then warming up an existing connection and putting them together. And I learned from Jordan Harbinger, to do this in the best way, I have to do a double opt-in intro. So I'll ask the first person, "Hey, I've got somebody who I think is going to solve your problem. Are you okay with me introducing you guys on email?" Then I ask the other person, "Hey, I think I have a potential client for you. Are you okay? Do you have bandwidth? Can I introduce you over email?" You get both yeses, and then you introduce them. What you don't want to do is introduce people without asking them first, especially if one of them is like a celebrity or influencer. You don't want to give away somebody's email.

• 48:45Hala Taha?

  If they're not really a celebrity or influencer, you have less risk there, but I would definitely do a double opt-in intro. Any other suggestions in terms of how we can bring value to other people when networking?

• 48:57Speaker 01

  So I have so much to add on the intros.

• 48:58Hala Taha?

  Yeah, go, tell me, tell me.

• 49:00Speaker 01

  I think you will build a reputation with people that when the intro is equal, you won't necessarily have to do the permissions all the time. When they're unequal, you want to make sure you're at least doing the permission at the higher level. I agree with that fully. So introductions, love. That's one of the greatest ways to add value. Information, invitations, appreciation, recognition, engagement, right? So on the social media, a great way to add value is a like, a comment, a share. There's lots of light touches that we can do to show that we are wanting to stay in somebody's orbit and be in their mind, have our name pop up, but not get in their face. And, you know, one of the things that you said was something really tactical. And when you asked me that, the first thing that came to my

• 49:45Speaker 01

  mind is, a lot of times, introverts and extroverts will have somebody pop into their mind, and then it'll float right back out. I want you to hold on to it. When somebody pops into your mind, write their name down, write into your calendar, your Outlook, your whatever. And then, when it pops back up, send them a note, send them a tweet, send them a text, send them a something, and just say, "Hey, I was just thinking about you. What's up?" I've been just doing something on social media lately of just, anybody who, all of a sudden, if I see them pop up, and I'm like, "Ah!" And I have that moment of curiosity. They're going to get a little note on LinkedIn of saying, "You just popped up in my feed. Check it in. What's going on? Here's what's going on with me." It's really quick. And so those light touches where you're not really requiring or requesting or asking for anything, but just keeping it fresh.

• 50:31Speaker 01

  And then if we think about tactics for if it's already kind of feels a little stale and it's gone a little stale. My favorite subject line of an email is it's been too long. Just acknowledge, as we said all along, we acknowledge the elephant in the room. I used to have this graveyard, I called it my graveyard of business cards, which I threw out over the pandemic. But like you collect them and then they just pile up. And sometimes you'd like go through and clean them up. And I'd be like, I forgot about this person. And I'd send a note saying, I just found your business card on my desk. And that would be another subject line. And usually I'd written something on it so I could reference. But those are two little quick things that anybody can do right now.

• 51:08Hala Taha?

  Yeah, and you can take this business card idea and you can use your text messages or your emails, scroll all the way to the bottom, see like whoever I talked to in a while and just sort of refresh those connections. Okay, last question before you go. Hybrid work environment, we teased it out before. What are some things that we should consider when connecting in a hybrid work environment?

• 51:27Speaker 01

  Oh, there's so much. Okay. So I really talk about being intentional about what you do at work when you're with people and being intentional about what you decide to do in a virtual environment. But one of the things you have to be intentional about is building into the agenda, those moments of water cooler, right? So we get on and everyone's on a little bit early. The meeting always has a five minute grace. That five minutes is the chit chat that happens as we're coming into the room. Be inclusive. Everyone's listening to your chit chat. So as people come into the room, invite them into that conversation. So you're broadening the conversation and we have it. You can have rotating icebreakers. And they're not necessarily icebreakers anymore. I'll call them connection activities. It could be, hey, let's give me a tour of your office. It could be hold up something on your desk that makes you smile every day.

• 52:12Speaker 01

  Or turn your camera around so we can see what you're looking at. I mean, I have a list of them, like I have so many that I could share around little things. But rotate who's running it. So it's not just the boss every time saying, okay, today's thing is this. It's all right, we're going in alphabetical order and next week it's going to be you. And you get to come up with what we're going to talk about for the first five or 15 minutes. And not every meeting, but build some of those things in.

• 52:38Hala Taha?

  Well, I know you have to run, so we're not going to do your actionable advice because you already did that. What is your secret to profiting in life, Michelle?

• 52:45Speaker 01

  Relationships, of course.

• 52:49Speaker 01

  It's network, not for need or for now, but build a relationship that you want to, that you get to, that will sustain you all the way through.

• 52:58Hala Taha?

  And where can our listeners learn more about you and everything you do?

• 53:01Speaker 01

  I love hearing from listeners and tell me that you heard me on this podcast. And best place to start is my website, which is Michelle with two L's, Tillis, T-I-L-L-I-S, Letterman, L-E-D-E-R-M-A-N, com. From there, you're going to find my blog, my YouTube channel, my LinkedIn newsletter. LinkedIn is my favorite place to be, so connect me there. I'm also on Insta. You'll find all the places from there.

• 53:23Hala Taha?

  Perfect. And we'll stick all those links in the show notes to make it super easy. Michelle, thank you. It's always a pleasure.

• 53:29Speaker 01

  Likewise.