Flip vs Fold: Why Not Both?

This week, Marques, Andrew, and David sit down to discuss everything from a new Huawei flip phone to the battle going on between the EU and Apple. They also talk about the new Fuji camera which David got to try out and a whole bunch of iPhone rumors. Plus, it's the last episode of the month so you know everyone had some strong opinions about what their Crown and Clown was! It was complete chaos (in a good way). Enjoy! Links: “I Built A Playstacean” by GingerOfOz David's GFX video Verge - Huawei Pura X Vivo Vision 9to5Mac - AirPods Max lossless audio MacRumors - iPhone 17 Pro 8K rumor EU vs Apple Android Authority - Android Screen unlock when off Music provided by Epidemic Sound Shop the merch: https://shop.mkbhd.com Socials: Waveform: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Marques: https://www.threads.net/@mkbhd Andrew: https://www.threads.net/@andrew_manganelli David: https://www.threads.net/@davidimel Adam: https://www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:44Speaker 01

  Support for the show comes from Jira by Atlassian. AI is only as useful as the context it has to work from. But when that context is scattered across tools, threads, and DMs, that means your team and your AI agents end up flying blind. That's the problem that Jira solves. What's the goal tied to your project? What got decided last week in Slack? Atlassian's teamwork graph pulls all these pieces together from Jira, Confluence, Slack, GitHub, and more, so nothing falls through the cracks. With Jira, you can actually share that context with the AI agents you already use, like Claude, Cursor, and GitHub Copilot, assign them work directly, or connect your agents through MCP. Spend less time digging through endless links and DMs, less time chasing down what got decided and by who, and more time actually shipping. Learn more at jira.com.

• 1:29Speaker 01

  That's J-I-R-A dot com. I have a hot take that's going to burn this whole podcast.

• 1:35Speaker 01

  It's gonna be great. That's coming up? Yep, it's coming up.

• 1:38Speaker 02

  Should we start this with that hot take?

• 1:40Speaker 01

  Sure. Only the USB type C AirPods Max get it while the cable is attached. Yeah. And so, obviously, okay, so the Lightning one doesn't support it. Most of the AirPods Max out there are the Lightning one, but okay, these $550 headphones finally got lossless audio.

• 1:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh boy.

• 1:57Speaker 01

  Updating my LinkedIn profile. My hot take is...

• 2:07Speaker 01

  What is up, people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marques.

• 2:12Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm Andrew.

• 2:13David Imel?

  And I'm David.

• 2:14Speaker 01

  We're all back in the same room to talk about a variety of things. A true grab bag of chaotic things in tech that have happened in the last week. Everything from a mixed reality headset to a weird backwards foldable, to a massive AirPods Max update out of nowhere, to dub dub dates, to maybe another folding phone coming soon. It's all here. And then, of course, we'll end with our crown. Crown or clown?

• 2:37Andrew Manganelli?

  And clown.

• 2:38Speaker 01

  Game, crown and clown.

• 2:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Cause we're doing both.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  Right, right. Which is, you know, perfect for the end of the month.

• 2:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 2:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:44Andrew Manganelli?

  But first, can I start with a video shout out?

• 2:46Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay. We do this every once in a while. We do some content, but there is this video this week called, "I Built a Playstation", which for audio listeners, and probably even video listeners right now, that probably sounds really confusing. It is spelled P-L-A-Y-S-T-A-C-E-A-N.

• 3:07Speaker 01

  Crustacean.

• 3:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Like crustacean. It is by someone named Ginger of Oz, and they built a PS1 that looks like a crab. That is the easiest way I can describe this, but it is incredible.

• 3:21David Imel?

  You know that, you know how everything eventually? So there's a thing. We talked about this on a podcast long ago, on a podcast very far away. There is a theory in science where everything eventually turns into a crab, and it's called carcanization. The Playstation has had its time.

• 3:38Speaker 01

  Speedruns directly to crab.

• 3:40David Imel?

  Finally evolved into the crab.

• 3:42Andrew Manganelli?

  So this is a PS1 ONE, not the first Playstation, but they made like a more, a smaller adaptation of it later on. So it's a little more like curved. And I guess there was an art project someone made online, and this Ginger of Oz guy decided to 3D render it and model it and print it. It's great. The video is really well done. It shows how he did all the things. This has a working disc tray, working controller ports. The claws in the front of it have two working PS1 controllers with the sticks and R and L buttons on top of it. It's incredible and it totally works. And I really think you should go watch the video. We'll link it in the show notes. It's a work of art.

• 4:25David Imel?

  Big meaty claws. Big meaty claws.

• 4:28Speaker 01

  Very cool.

• 4:28Andrew Manganelli?

  It's also like, the claws are attached. So if you use that as a controller, you have to play within. Six inches of the actual console.

• 4:35David Imel?

  And holding hands with the crab.

• 4:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Holding hands with the crabs while it's like staring you in the face.

• 4:39David Imel?

  Do they actually work?

• 4:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, everything works. It's all like bendable, like all of these arms rotate and everything. It's really well done.

• 4:47David Imel?

  That's epic.

• 4:48Speaker 02

  You know what's funny? When I opened this doc and I saw that picture, it did not register that it was a PlayStation. I was just like, someone has like a toy crab. That's cool.

• 4:56Andrew Manganelli?

  I was laughing because Marquez was like, we have a chaotic episode and just on my screen is a crab PlayStation. Sitting in the document. One other video that came out, in case you haven't seen, was from a little creator we know as David Amell.

• 5:10David Imel?

  Wow, little. Got him.

• 5:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Never mind, don't watch it. He's too small. Sorry, we don't punch down around here.

• 5:22David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 5:22Andrew Manganelli?

  No, you released a GFX 100 RF review.

• 5:25David Imel?

  I did. I did. Um, yeah.

• 5:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you want to give us a?

• 5:28David Imel?

  Wow.

• 5:29Andrew Manganelli?

  A little TL, a big TLDR.

• 5:31David Imel?

  Big TLDR.

• 5:33Andrew Manganelli?

  And then everyone else can go watch it if they're interested.

• 5:35David Imel?

  Cool. Thank you.

• 5:36Andrew Manganelli?

  You're welcome.

• 5:36David Imel?

  For sharing that. Um, yeah, so I made a camera video. It is the GFX 100 RF, which is a rangefinder style, fixed lens, medium format camera. That is the official meaning of RF. Rangefinder style, fixed lens. Um, very Japanese, very Japanese. But basically it is a fixed lens, medium format digital camera, which we haven't really seen before. There is one from Phase One that is horrible and costs $63,000.

• 6:06Speaker 01

  I remember Phase One. Wow.

• 6:08David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 6:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:09David Imel?

  People kind of universally say that you should never buy that.

• 6:12Speaker 01

  No, you shouldn't.

• 6:13David Imel?

  But the RF is interesting because if you knew about the X100 series, which was very popular for many years, and then the X106 came out, we have a video on the Studio Channel about it. This is like a medium format version of that camera. It looks very similar. It has a lot, it has a few extra features. But the overall consensus is that I think that this camera is sort of for two groups of people. It is for existing film photographers or people that used to shoot film. Because it has this really cool extra feature called an aspect ratio dial that is on the back of the camera that emulates a bunch of the old aspect ratios of film cameras.

• 6:51David Imel?

  So it has like 6:4, 5, 6 by 7, 65 by 24, 6 by 17. Does not have 6 by 24 because Fuji was not insane enough to make that. But yeah, it's super cool. I think the two groups of people that it's sort of for are street photographers, because the whole, basically what the camera is, it's a medium format 100 megapixel sensor that has a large wide lens mounted to it. Well, not large. It has a wide lens mounted to it. So it's kind of like, take the photo in general and then reframe.

• 7:22Speaker 01

  Crop later.

• 7:23David Imel?

  Yeah, crop later. So either you're a film photographer who you want to use the aspect ratio dial to like compose in camera, and then you take the photo in the same aspect ratio that you would take a film photo, or you're like a street photographer who wants to use it to run around taking photos of things on the street or, you know, street work, and then also crop later and still have a lot of resolution. So yeah, it is $4,900, or at least a little video about it.

• 7:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Whenever you do a camera video, I'm like, that thing costs too much. I'm not even remotely close to the person.

• 7:59David Imel?

  It's, yeah, it's interesting. It's the cheapest medium format camera that Fujifilm sells. It's pretty much the cheapest medium format digital camera on the market that you can buy new. Its biggest competition is the Leica Q3, and the reason for that is that it's basically the only other fixed lens digital camera that is full frame or larger. The two things that people are yelling at each other about on the internet about this, because of course people just need to argue about something.

• 8:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Fair. That's why we get views on this podcast.

• 8:30David Imel?

  Yeah. The RF does not have image stabilization and the lens is f4. And a lot of people, well, when I, I went to Utah to use it, and it was a little bit difficult when the light got low, because I like to shoot at blue hour, which is the hour after golden hour where it starts to get darker. And without a wider aperture, you definitely have to push the ISO up a little bit. You can just change it to black and white mode if you want to do that and it looks kind of fine.

• 8:59Speaker 01

  Film grain.

• 9:00David Imel?

  Yeah. And then I think that people have just gotten really used to optical image stabilization. But the body of this camera is only a little bit bigger than the X106, which is an APS-C camera. So the fact that they were able to fit a sensor way bigger than there. I talked to some people who designed the camera, because I flew to Prague, bought some plane tickets, bought some hotels, flew to Prague so I can talk to the Fujifilm team that worked on the camera. And they said that if they had even made it f3.5, the mount would have been bigger than the size of the body. So if that is true, I understand why it's f4. But I think this is for a very specific group of people. And anyway, I made a video about it.

• 9:43David Imel?

  The video talks about aspect ratios and why the film aspect ratios are the way they are. And it's on my YouTube channel.

• 9:50Speaker 02

  I have a question for you.

• 9:51David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 9:51Speaker 02

  How high do you think you could push the ISO and it still is usable?

• 9:55David Imel?

  That's kind of hard. I mean, a lot of people will say now that the AI noise removal has gotten so good, like there's a Lightroom AI noise removal tool that's really good. I think you could try a lot of those. I shot a fairly long exposure shot at 4000 ISO and it was a little bit muddy. So I would say the highest I would push it is like 2500 max, unless you're okay with it being grainy. But again, if you shoot in black and white, black and white stuff is already kind of grainy, so if you...

• 10:27Speaker 02

  Also, 2500 is really good.

• 10:29David Imel?

  2500 is pretty good, but you know, so...

• 10:31Speaker 01

  We also just talked about Sony cameras recently.

• 10:33David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. One thing, Fuji is releasing a, they're going to be releasing a like Red competitor, I think later this year or early next year, called the Fujifilm Eterna, that is a box camera.

• 10:45Speaker 01

  I'll be the judge of that.

• 10:46David Imel?

  Well, it is a-

• 10:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Eternos is a sweet name already.

• 10:49David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 10:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Props for the name.

• 10:50David Imel?

  Eternos is their old film stock, by the way.

• 10:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 10:53David Imel?

  Yeah, actual film stock. It has dual native ISO. And I really, I think it would have been awesome if they put dual native ISO in this camera. Because, because it's using the exact same sensor. So, it would have been really cool if they had put dual native ISO in this camera because it would have helped with those kind of things. But, uh, yeah, people on the internet got very angry at each other about this, this stuff because the Q3 has optical image stabilization and a F1.7 lens. This lens is quite a bit slower and no OIS, but it has a lot of other features. So, they're very different cameras, it's just that because they're the only two fixed lens digital cameras that are full frame or bigger, people lump them into the same category.

• 11:34Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, compared with each other, yeah.

• 11:36David Imel?

  Also, the Q3 is more expensive. Yeah, the Q3 is $1,400 more.

• 11:41Andrew Manganelli?

  I have a banger follow-up video for you.

• 11:43David Imel?

  Okay.

• 11:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Ready? GFX 100RF versus iPhone 16 Pro.

• 11:48David Imel?

  Ooh. Do you want to get people on the internet riled up? That's one way to do it, for sure.

• 11:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 11:54David Imel?

  Anyway.

• 11:54Andrew Manganelli?

  You gotta do a drop test.

• 11:57David Imel?

  So, that's on my YouTube channel. I had many existential crises about whether or not to put it on my channel or just start a camera channel.

• 12:03Andrew Manganelli?

  I think you made the right choice.

• 12:04David Imel?

  I think I made the wrong choice.

• 12:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Really? We can get into that another day?

• 12:08David Imel?

  Yeah, we can. We can.

• 12:11Speaker 01

  Well, speaking of products designed for particularly niche demographics, Huawei, Huawei, thank you.

• 12:18David Imel?

  You call me niche?

• 12:19Speaker 01

  Well, I think 100 megapixel, $5,000 median for my camera is-

• 12:24David Imel?

  Oh, I mean this, I mean this phone.

• 12:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, you're in the niche for sure. But it is a niche. Huawei Pura X gets unveiled slash shown off. It's, okay, so you know how we have like hamburger phones and hot dog phones, right? So, we have like folds that go out like that?

• 12:41David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 12:41Speaker 01

  And then flips like that. What if you took a phone that's shaped on the outside like a flip, but folds out like a fold?

• 12:52Andrew Manganelli?

  This is, this is really hard to describe, right?

• 12:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, hot burger or a ham dog kind of thing.

• 12:57David Imel?

  Exactly.

• 12:58Speaker 01

  It's like cat dog, right?

• 12:59David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 13:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, this is the cat dog phone.

• 13:03Andrew Manganelli?

  This phone is so simple and so hard to explain for audio listeners at the same time. Because what it is essentially is a Samsung Flip or a Moto Razr. But when you're looking at it closed, rotate it 90 degrees. So the hinge is now on your left like a book.

• 13:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:19Andrew Manganelli?

  But then when you open it, you have to then rotate it another 90 degrees to kind of use it as a standard portrait version.

• 13:25Speaker 01

  If you want to use it as a portrait, like a portrait tablet.

• 13:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, it felt like Huawei was at their meeting and said, you know, we've seen all these foldables, flips, fold, like hot dog versus hamburger. How do we innovate? And they just did the like porcino los dos meme and like cheering at everyone. And they're like, we did it. Here's both in one.

• 13:44Speaker 01

  This feels like something LG would do, like they're picking up where LG left off of like, hey, no one's done that swively thing yet, have they? Okay, yeah, now we are. So here's the, yeah, the Huawei flip fold.

• 13:54David Imel?

  Well, the interesting thing about Huawei is that they have never really made a fold that looks like other folds. Because they were the ones that put the screen on the outside first, when the Galaxy Fold was doing it folding internally.

• 14:05Speaker 01

  And then everybody else started doing that.

• 14:07David Imel?

  And then they made the, well, nobody, nobody did the outside screen, like the.

• 14:11Speaker 01

  Oh, sorry. I'm thinking, I'm thinking of their flipping phone. They had a flip phone that looks exactly like Samsung's flip phone.

• 14:18David Imel?

  Yeah, they had that.

• 14:19Andrew Manganelli?

  And they do have a regular folding phone, but they, the first.

• 14:22David Imel?

  No, but that, no, but that folding phone has the screen on the outside.

• 14:26Andrew Manganelli?

  No, but then they also have this one.

• 14:27David Imel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 14:28Andrew Manganelli?

  The Mate X2.

• 14:29David Imel?

  You're right.

• 14:29Andrew Manganelli?

  It's just a regular folding phone.

• 14:30David Imel?

  But then, so they made the weird one, and then they made the tri-fold.

• 14:34Speaker 01

  That's also Huawei.

• 14:35David Imel?

  Nobody has yet copied, but Samsung inferred at Galaxy Unpacked that they were working on one.

• 14:40Speaker 01

  Big LG vibes.

• 14:42David Imel?

  And now they're making, yeah, it's like, wow.

• 14:45Speaker 01

  Just trying stuff.

• 14:46David Imel?

  I wonder if Huawei and LG are anagrams.

• 14:50Speaker 01

  LG.

• 14:50Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't think so.

• 14:52Speaker 01

  But yeah, no, they're definitely picking up where they left off. I think it's an interesting idea. It's still a small-ish phone. It's a 6.3 inch phone when you open it. So you know how some of them are like kind of gigantic, 6.7, 6.8, 6.3 open. So it's not as gigantic. So I feel like there could be a smaller crowd that's into this idea.

• 15:09David Imel?

  And the weird thing about the size is that 6.3, but with a different aspect ratio because it's wider than most phones.

• 15:16Andrew Manganelli?

  It's 16 by 10 on the interior screen.

• 15:19Speaker 01

  Right.

• 15:19Andrew Manganelli?

  And I think it's interesting because it's smaller opened, but then it's really compact when it's closed. And it's almost asking you to like,

• 15:28Speaker 01

  Use it closed.

• 15:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Use it a lot closed if you're okay with a really small screen. I shouldn't even say really small screen. It's bigger screen than like a, I think it's a bigger screen than a flip when it's closed. But because where it's rotated, it feels more portrait style.

• 15:41Speaker 01

  Totally.

• 15:42Andrew Manganelli?

  And I think that's kind of cool. This, I think this wants you to kind of use it half and half of closed. This wants you to use it closed more than like a flipper or a razor is my guess.

• 15:51David Imel?

  Yeah, because it turns into like the iPad mini.

• 15:53Speaker 01

  I think it's too small to use it closed very much. I think it's similar to the Samsung situation and the Razer where you have a big screen on the outside, but you're not really meant to use it on the outside that much. It's more just like, I want to read an entire notification without it being cropped. I want to see, like I might play a game on the outside once in a while. But that's really kind of a niche thing.

• 16:15David Imel?

  Okay, so Counterpoint.

• 16:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:17David Imel?

  Clicks, Michael Fisher's brand. Disclosure, our friend. Slash my ex roommate. Not my ex's roommate, but my ex roommate. He just released, they just released Clicks for Razer. And it uses the Razer closed and then you use the keyboard and you use the whole phone closed.

• 16:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:44David Imel?

  So it's like this.

• 16:45Speaker 01

  That's even more niche.

• 16:48David Imel?

  Yes.

• 16:50David Imel?

  Because you attach a keyboard to it.

• 16:54David Imel?

  But I mean, you can do everything that you can do when the phone's open.

• 16:58Speaker 01

  You know what I mean?

• 16:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Uh, yeah.

• 16:59Speaker 01

  Except to watch a widescreen video. But that's why you open it. Exactly. Turn it sideways.

• 17:03Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, I'd say that, like, this is, I feel like that's enough to answer a text message. It's enough to, like, if you're doing walking directions in Google Maps, I'd probably just want the small one that I can throw in my pocket super easily.

• 17:13Speaker 01

  Totally.

• 17:14Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know.

• 17:15Speaker 01

  The other thing is when you open it, it's already in landscape orientation. So if you're, if you start a video while it's closed, you just open it. You don't even have to turn it. That is probably the best part. Book style. I like that.

• 17:27Andrew Manganelli?

  I think the best part of this is Huawei's getting a bunch of news coverage because they're just like, let's take a flip and rotate it 90 degrees. And now they've got an entire news cycle.

• 17:35Speaker 01

  Someone had to do it first. Someone had to think of it. Nobody else did it.

• 17:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Brilliant, honestly.

• 17:39Speaker 01

  Also, the main cameras are facing you. So it's like built for selfies. It's fire.

• 17:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Triple camera up top.

• 17:46Speaker 01

  So it's gonna start off as China only. It's gonna be the equivalent of about $1,000, similar to like Razer and Z Flip. And it's probably not gonna show up in the US anytime soon. But we get to read articles about it and admire it from here. Yeah. It also seems like if you want to take pictures of things that are not your face, you have to open it. Yes, exactly.

• 18:07Andrew Manganelli?

  I mean, similar.

• 18:08Speaker 01

  Minor downside.

• 18:10Speaker 01

  Minor downside. At least you get a giant viewfinder.

• 18:12Andrew Manganelli?

  It also will be the first phone to ship with Harmony Intelligence, which is Huawei's AI assistant.

• 18:17Speaker 01

  Powered by DeepSeek.

• 18:19Andrew Manganelli?

  Or they're, they're calling it their own in-house AI model powered by DeepSeek or something like that.

• 18:24Speaker 01

  That is an oxymoron.

• 18:26Andrew Manganelli?

  I forgot the exact, I'm sure the exact phrasing is in here.

• 18:30Speaker 01

  Do you guys think that in China, DeepSeek is like a hyped brand? Because it has so much global appeal. So hard for us to know.

• 18:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Enhanced by DeepSeek. In-house model enhanced. In-house Pangu model?

• 18:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, it's DeepSeek. It's like, if you are gonna say in-house model enhanced by DeepSeek, you are by nature of emphasizing one of those, basically discarding the other. If you're gonna tell us, it's our in-house model. Oh, I'm supposed to be very impressed by that? Enhanced by DeepSeek? Oh. Okay, so, so it's not. That's kinda like how Siri is enhanced by ChatGPT. It's like, okay, I, I'm either impressed by one or the other, not both. But you can pick your choice. Siri can do basic stuff, but when you need really hard tasks, we offer that to ChatGPT.

• 19:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, right now Siri can't do those basic things either. Maybe not till next year.

• 19:19Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 19:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Um, I have one other announcement, and I wanna preface this, not announcement.

• 19:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. What are you about to say? I'm prefacing this by saying, I'm 99% sure this is real. But I'm not completely sure this is real. And I'll explain why, and you guys can help me figure this out. All right. So there's a bunch of posts and very few news articles about something called Vivo Vision, which is the company Vivo, we all know. They're a phone manufacturing company. They have done a lot of crazy things in the past. Were they not the first people to do like the under fingerprint?

• 19:57Speaker 01

  Vivo, yeah, they were.

• 19:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Years ago, used to be the ones like innovating a lot of stuff that we tested before we saw them in like every other phone. But Vivo Vision is their mixed reality headset that was showcased at a conference in China last week.

• 20:12Speaker 01

  Allegedly.

• 20:13Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm, okay. So the first time I saw this was on a post on Threads and the video, which I thought I linked in here, let me find the video so you can see it, has this like very wonky, sketchy effect on it that looks like it's AI enhanced, really bad.

• 20:35Speaker 01

  Look at the bottom of the screen.

• 20:37Andrew Manganelli?

  The whole bottom is just glitching out and the Vivo Vision text is like freaking out and looks super AI. But everything else looks totally fine, right?

• 20:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. Why? Okay. It looks like someone shot the video in like 16 by 8 and someone said at the last second, you need this video to be 16 by 10. And so they had to AI extend the bottom 500 pixels of the video to be taller. So the bottom of the entire video looks like it's glitching out and AI enhanced, which includes a lot of the text. But it's kind of weird.

• 21:11Andrew Manganelli?

  So I, when I saw this, there are not very many news articles. The only website that I frequently visit that posted about this was GSM Arena, which I generally trust. Forbes has an article about it. Forbes has one?

• 21:22Speaker 01

  Forbes has one. They all show the same two images.

• 21:27Andrew Manganelli?

  But so I reached out to a different Android reporter that I know and I was like, have you heard about this? He said, no. And I showed him the video and he's like, I think there was a watermark on this and that's an AI watermark removal, probably from some Chinese publication.

• 21:40Speaker 01

  Definitely.

• 21:41Andrew Manganelli?

  And whatever this video from is just the only one we can see, not on one of those websites trying to remove that.

• 21:46Speaker 01

  It's so sad that someone was like, I want to not attribute this publication so badly that I'm going to mess up the video and make people think it's fake.

• 21:55Andrew Manganelli?

  But there's, it's, I think that, I think it's real ultimately. And we need to talk about how it looks because there's not a lot of information on it. But this is, this is like if a mola is party in the front, business in the back. This is Apple Vision Pro in the front, Project Muhan in the back, or sorry. Vision Pro in the back, Muhan in the front. It is the exact same knit band and battery connector and battery of a Vision Pro.

• 22:24David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 22:24Andrew Manganelli?

  And then the front.

• 22:25David Imel?

  Glass.

• 22:26Andrew Manganelli?

  The front, it looks like a higher quality material version of Muhan where it has like a much bigger face shield, like face padding.

• 22:34David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 22:34Andrew Manganelli?

  And kind of thin down actual like screen and sensors and stuff, but yeah.

• 22:41David Imel?

  This image has been saved so many times. It's just so compressed.

• 22:44Speaker 01

  Exactly. Yeah. It's like this one image, one or two images on every single website. And then this AI video floating around 25 second orbit of this thing. It looks, yeah, it looks kind of like Vivo saw the Vision Pro and went, all right, we're doing our own headset. Heavily inspired by the Vision Pro.

• 23:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 23:03Speaker 01

  Not shocking. I definitely, so this is probably going to run Android XR is my guess. Or they're going to do their own software. But when I did that Android XR video, it was kind of along the lines of what do all the non Vision Pro headsets run? And if you run, if you're Meta and you have your own Horizon OS, that's cool. If you're not, maybe you just use Google's new OS because it's going to work with everything. And so this is probably going to run that. And we'll see when it eventually comes out, maybe, but.

• 23:33David Imel?

  I find it very funny that Meta was getting so hyped about making Horizon OS like the OS for headsets.

• 23:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:40David Imel?

  And just nobody cared.

• 23:42Speaker 01

  Did anyone else use it?

• 23:44David Imel?

  I think there may have been a Lenovo. Or there were companies that announced they were going to use it. I don't know if any actually came out.

• 23:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:54David Imel?

  But they wanted to make the OS for, you know, the metaverse.

• 23:59Speaker 01

  The metaverse.

• 23:59David Imel?

  Or like, yeah, or, or these VR headsets. And I don't know if anyone actually took them up on that.

• 24:05Speaker 01

  So we'll see what this ends up.

• 24:06David Imel?

  I'm going to guess it's, it's the, uh, the Google one.

• 24:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:08David Imel?

  Android XR.

• 24:10Andrew Manganelli?

  It's Android XR. So all I, all we really know outside of this is that it was at this conference.

• 24:16Speaker 02

  The Bao Forum.

• 24:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Is that how you pronounce that?

• 24:19Speaker 02

  I don't know how to pronounce it.

• 24:20Andrew Manganelli?

  B O A O.

• 24:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Forum and.

• 24:23Speaker 02

  It looks like a business conference. So like my guess is like Vivo wanted to show off like, look what we can make.

• 24:29Andrew Manganelli?

  It looks like they have like, the video of it is in this little Vivo booth, which they apparently also showed off 6G advancements and that X200 Ultra smartphone.

• 24:39Speaker 01

  Oh, God, here we go.

• 24:40David Imel?

  Do we know whether or not this is like real or just them saying, look, we can make something just like this?

• 24:46Speaker 02

  That would be my guess.

• 24:47David Imel?

  This might not be. Cause it's also called Vivo Vision, which is sort of an immediate like, hey, we can do manufacturing exactly the same as Apple.

• 24:55Speaker 01

  Concept.

• 24:56David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 24:56Speaker 01

  This is everything short of concept without having a word concept in it.

• 24:59David Imel?

  Pump our stock.

• 25:00Andrew Manganelli?

  The closest information I found on this is that there's a prototype anticipated mid 2025.

• 25:06Speaker 01

  A prototype. Okay, can we break down that sentence?

• 25:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 25:11Speaker 01

  What is a prototype? A prototype is a pre-release, not ready for the public yet version of something that's, that's like to show it. A, and what was the sentence? A prototype?

• 25:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, a unit was present at the Vivo booth to showcase the design while the prototype is anticipated to launch in mid 2025.

• 25:28Speaker 01

  Prototype is anticipated mid 2025.

• 25:34David Imel?

  Maybe, allegedly.

• 25:35Speaker 01

  Allegedly. So by mid 2025.

• 25:37Speaker 02

  That nobody knows if it really took place.

• 25:38Speaker 01

  We will have maybe a prototype.

• 25:42Speaker 02

  Announcement.

• 25:43David Imel?

  Prototypes, prototypes don't always come out either, like.

• 25:46Speaker 01

  No, it's just like, they usually don't end up looking like the prototype.

• 25:50Speaker 02

  That's, that doesn't seem too far fetched though, because.

• 25:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Vivo loves to do stuff like this.

• 25:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, and if Google's really gonna be pushing Android XR and like Muhan and everything, like, you would want to have something ready to go for when they announce that. So it makes sense.

• 26:03Speaker 01

  It does make sense.

• 26:04Andrew Manganelli?

  I blame all this prototype stuff on the video game industry because they just started pushing alpha releases of games, realized they could make money and never have to update them. And now everyone else is like, why don't we just release stuff that's broken and blame it on the people paying for it?

• 26:21Speaker 01

  That's true. I found the press release, so it is definitely real, it's definitely from Vivo, and it is definitely a prototype.

• 26:27Andrew Manganelli?

  This is like, there are more articles up right now than when I wrote this this morning. So it seems like it's more.

• 26:34Speaker 02

  That's wild, dang.

• 26:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, it looks nice.

• 26:36Speaker 02

  It does look cool.

• 26:37Speaker 01

  Does look cool.

• 26:38Andrew Manganelli?

  I mean, I'm not excited that it has the same band that the Vision Pro didn't work very well. That was a really grammatically correct sentence.

• 26:47Speaker 01

  But maybe. But maybe this one's a lot lighter, you know? We'll see if they're able to innovate and do something Apple wasn't with this headset, with this band. Yeah. TBD. TBD.

• 26:56Speaker 02

  I don't think the hardware was the problem.

• 26:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:59Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know, I think it was kind of the problem.

• 27:01Speaker 02

  With the Apple Vision Pro?

• 27:02Speaker 01

  It was a combination.

• 27:03Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, but if there was an amazing experience, people would just use it.

• 27:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, the weight was huge, was huge, but also there was no content. And the price tag was also. And it was expensive, that's it. Yeah. Alright, well, we gotta talk about some more Apple stuff after the break, but before we take a break, we should take a trivia break. Did you guys do trivia? You did trivia last week, huh?

• 27:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, and neither of them got it right.

• 27:25Speaker 01

  Oh, good.

• 27:27Speaker 01

  You could have called me.

• 27:28Speaker 02

  So you didn't miss anything. We were debating it, but I was going to if they had gotten it.

• 27:32Speaker 01

  I was only five hours ahead.

• 27:34Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't even remember what it was.

• 27:35Speaker 02

  Honest?

• 27:36Andrew Manganelli?

  I was questioning about David. It was really hard. What does Leaf stand for?

• 27:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, the Nissan Leaf, what does Leaf stand for?

• 27:42Andrew Manganelli?

  It was a backronym.

• 27:42Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 27:43Speaker 01

  Oh, no.

• 27:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Which I argue makes it more embarrassing because it's so stupid, why would you make it a? Only make a backronym if it's super creative and good, don't just do it.

• 27:52Speaker 01

  Electric and vision. So yeah, zero points for David.

• 27:57Speaker 02

  Zero points for David.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  We all thought E was electric, it wasn't.

• 28:01Speaker 02

  It was environmentally friendly. Yes, that's one word.

• 28:04Speaker 01

  What about the A?

• 28:05Speaker 02

  The A is affordable.

• 28:08Speaker 01

  What is the L?

• 28:09Speaker 02

  The L is leading. Why are you asking this all out of order?

• 28:12Speaker 01

  Leading environmentally friendly.

• 28:13Speaker 02

  Leading environmentally friendly, affordable, family car.

• 28:16Andrew Manganelli?

  This is like. Do you know when they make like memes of acronyms where like one of the letters is multi- like, "I need CPR, crab rangoons right in my mouth" or whatever? And like, this is what that is, environmentally friendly.

• 28:30Speaker 02

  You guys could have gotten a point if you had gotten any of those correct.

• 28:33Andrew Manganelli?

  Really?

• 28:34Speaker 02

  It wasn't like you had to get the whole thing. You just needed one of the words.

• 28:36David Imel?

  Wait, so L is leading?

• 28:38Speaker 02

  Leading.

• 28:38David Imel?

  Didn't I say that?

• 28:39Speaker 02

  No.

• 28:39David Imel?

  No. I said "love."

• 28:41Speaker 02

  Either way, that was last week's.

• 28:43David Imel?

  It's kinda like how the RF and GFX100RF, like, it stands for "Range Finder Style Fixed Lens", which also almost sounds like a acronym. In my video, I literally said, "It is a Range Finder Style Fixed Lens", and everyone was like, "It's not a range finder!" And I was like...

• 29:02Speaker 02

  Range Finder Style.

• 29:03David Imel?

  I know.

• 29:04Speaker 02

  We need to get rid of hyphens.

• 29:05David Imel?

  But that is literally what it stands for. Damn.

• 29:08Speaker 02

  Alright, first question.

• 29:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 29:10Speaker 02

  We spoke about the PS1 earlier.

• 29:13David Imel?

  Oh boy. I don't know.

• 29:15Speaker 02

  Fun fact, it was released in the United States, September of 1995. So, question for you. Which of these games was not available on the PS1?

• 29:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I just-

• 29:26David Imel?

  Breath of the Wild.

• 29:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Before we get to there. GTA 6.

• 29:30Speaker 02

  Dota 2.

• 29:31Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, are you saying PS1 like he's talking about in there? Which is the modified version after the original PlayStation?

• 29:37Speaker 02

  No, no, the original PlayStation, the PS1, yeah. Um, okay. A, Gran Turismo. B, Crash Bandicoot. C, Final Fantasy. D, Call of Duty: World at War. Or E, all of these were available on the PS1.

• 29:54David Imel?

  No way.

• 29:55Speaker 02

  Ooh.

• 29:59David Imel?

  This is before my time, so I'm full stab in the dark for me. I'm not gonna know the answer, but we'll see.

• 30:04Andrew Manganelli?

  It was not before your time. You were alive.

• 30:06David Imel?

  Didn't you just say it was, when did you say? 95. 95, so I was 2 years old.

• 30:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 30:10David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 30:10Andrew Manganelli?

  You were 95.

• 30:11Speaker 02

  I thought you were a real gamer.

• 30:12David Imel?

  I wasn't sentient yet. I was 5 months old and I knew about these games. Okay. Alright, I take it back. Well, I'm gonna be guessing, but answers will be at the end, like usual.

• 30:22Speaker 02

  Crash Bandicoot.

• 30:24David Imel?

  We'll be right back.

• 30:39Speaker 00

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• 31:22Speaker 05

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• 32:01Speaker 06

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• 32:31Speaker 01

  I have a hot take that's going to burn this whole podcast. It's gonna be great.

• 32:35Andrew Manganelli?

  That's coming up.

• 32:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, yup, it's coming up.

• 32:37Speaker 02

  Should we start this with that hot take?

• 32:39Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 32:40David Imel?

  It's not even a track car, man.

• 32:41Speaker 02

  We're already back.

• 32:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, okay.

• 32:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Alright, get ready to format this card.

• 32:44Speaker 01

  We're back. And I just said I have a, I have a hot take that's gonna burn this whole podcast down. And you know where this comes from? So, so here's, so here's the announcement that this is around.

• 32:53David Imel?

  Every hot take with a backstory is crazy.

• 32:55Speaker 01

  No, I believe this, though. Every, I fully believe this. I fully stand by this with all of my heart.

• 33:02David Imel?

  There's a lot of buildup.

• 33:03Speaker 01

  The announcement is AirPods Max get lossless audio. And the subtext of the announcement is only the USB Type C AirPods Max get it while the cable is attached.

• 33:13David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:13Speaker 01

  And so obviously, okay, so the Lightning one doesn't support it. Most of the AirPods Max out there are the Lightning one, but okay, these $550 headphones finally got lossless audio.

• 33:24David Imel?

  Oh boy.

• 33:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Updating my LinkedIn profile.

• 33:28Speaker 01

  My hot take is none of you people can tell the difference between lossless audio and regular compressed audio. Zero of you. And I know you think you can, but you can't. You can only tell it because of confirmation bias, but if you listen back to back, you might maybe get it right. But if you don't label them and you do a blind test, you'll get it wrong every single time. There is no, I'll stop there. I'll stop there.

• 33:53Andrew Manganelli?

  We physically tested this with the Walkman video on the studio. Ellis did like a test and brought all of us in to see if we could tell the difference between.

• 34:02David Imel?

  I think I got seven out of eight right, just saying.

• 34:05Speaker 01

  Seven out of eight? There are more differences than just band, just the amount of information. There were other, you know, dynamic range differences, et cetera. But if you just take lossless versus compressed, no difference to people.

• 34:19David Imel?

  So you're saying that they are trying to take the people who believe that there's a difference and sell them the new headphone?

• 34:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 34:27Andrew Manganelli?

  I mean, that's great marketing strategy.

• 34:28Speaker 01

  And it's great. Look, lots, lots of expensive headphones support lossless audio and AirPods Max are fairly late to this. And it's like, okay, great, you can do it now. You require the cable. That's not a surprise. Okay, now you have lossless audio. You've caught up to the other $500 headphones out there. But I don't care.

• 34:44Andrew Manganelli?

  If somehow audio listeners haven't figured out Ellis isn't in the studio. From jumping in on that one, it should be there.

• 34:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, Ellis would probably have thoughts.

• 34:53David Imel?

  We can probably pay, play back the clip of the episode where they announced the AirPods Max with USB C. And we thought it was gonna be AirPods Max 2 and we were like.

• 35:01Andrew Manganelli?

  That's it? They just put a USB C cable and gave it some new colors?

• 35:06Speaker 01

  Slightly new colors.

• 35:07Andrew Manganelli?

  There are a couple other small features that is coming with this. Personalized spatial audio and they're in ultra-low latency.

• 35:17Speaker 01

  Right.

• 35:18Andrew Manganelli?

  With the cable attached. So gaming now, it's, they say gamers and live streamers can benefit from ultra-low latency audio, which lowers lag time and is on par with native built-in speakers on Mac, iPad, and iPhone.

• 35:30Speaker 01

  That one's nice. I do notice the ultra-low latency stuff because I've noticed differences in latency between different types of headphones. And I think Razer did this thing with their gaming headphones not that long ago, this ultra-low latency mode. And it was like, okay, this, you know how you watch a YouTube video with Bluetooth headphones on and the person's mouth is moving slightly different from the audio in your headphones?

• 35:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 35:49Speaker 01

  That's actually noticeable and annoying. So you can imagine while gaming, you want that audio to line up exactly with what you're doing. Yes, this is very useful. I support ultra-low latency.

• 35:59Andrew Manganelli?

  I agree with everything you said.

• 36:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Except. Except I'm pretty sure this article means it only works when it's plugged in.

• 36:06Speaker 01

  Yes, correct. Only the cable.

• 36:08Andrew Manganelli?

  So I'm not impressed.

• 36:09Speaker 01

  I'm not impressed. I'm just saying it's a useful feature.

• 36:12David Imel?

  All headphones are ultra-low latency when they're plugged in.

• 36:15Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm not crazy.

• 36:16David Imel?

  Bluetooth is the only thing that causes drag.

• 36:18Speaker 01

  That's true. Yes, that's true.

• 36:20Andrew Manganelli?

  So they're just spinning the fact that it's plugged in. I feel like I have to be missing something here.

• 36:25Speaker 01

  I guess my only take is that there is a noticeable difference between ultra-low latency and wireless. So I'm like, okay, it supports it. Great. I'm, I'm, my take that I can see the comments already are that the difference between 24-bit, 48 kilohertz lossless audio and whatever codec, whatever bitrate it was doing over Bluetooth before.

• 36:48Andrew Manganelli?

  1644.

• 36:49Speaker 01

  Imperceptible to 99.9% of people. And that last 0.1% is kind of guessing.

• 36:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Damn.

• 36:58David Imel?

  Wow.

• 36:58Speaker 01

  Mic drop.

• 37:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, don't you worry, there's another big announcement.

• 37:03David Imel?

  Okay.

• 37:03Speaker 01

  You can't afford this.

• 37:06Speaker 01

  If you're a gamer, you cannot afford this, I'm sorry.

• 37:10Andrew Manganelli?

  You also now can buy a USB-C to 3.5mm audio cable for the low, low price of... My ring makes that really bad drum solo. Thirty-nine dollars.

• 37:22David Imel?

  Geez.

• 37:22Speaker 01

  Yep. That gets you... The DAC is in the cable, I believe. You can...

• 37:27David Imel?

  What?

• 37:28Speaker 01

  And you can plug it straight into... Because what are you plugging into?

• 37:30David Imel?

  There's an additional DAC?

• 37:32Speaker 01

  I think you might need it, because if you're plugging into something with a headphone jack, this isn't a modern smartphone anymore. This is like some MP3 player or some other thing. And you're gonna plug it straight into the AirPods Max, so you're gonna probably need some support from the cable.

• 37:46David Imel?

  To drive them?

• 37:47Andrew Manganelli?

  I do also want to make the difference here is there already is a USB-C to 3.5mm adapter. This is the cable to plug directly into your headphones.

• 37:56Speaker 01

  The adapter's probably totally passive.

• 37:58David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 37:58Speaker 01

  Was there already a Lightning, male Lightning to male 3.5?

• 38:05Speaker 01

  I bought one on Amazon a while ago for cheap, and it was not very good. I don't think Apple sold one. If they did, it probably cost a lot more. Yeah, I have not used it.

• 38:14David Imel?

  I know they had a Lightning to female 3.5, because they originally sold that with the iPhone X.

• 38:22Andrew Manganelli?

  I immediately get lost in Apple donkles. It's so hard to keep track of all the different ones.

• 38:27David Imel?

  Yeah. Okay, well, big news for those people.

• 38:33Speaker 01

  USB-C, AirPods Max people.

• 38:35David Imel?

  To the people that care, congratulations. Moving on, there is also a rumor going around that the iPhone 17 Pro is going to have 8K video recording.

• 38:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Yay. I have a hot take. Most of you who think you can see 8K video footage can't actually tell the difference.

• 38:54Speaker 01

  I would take you up on that. I definitely can watch a 4K video and then switch to 8K and be like, wow, this looks way better.

• 39:00David Imel?

  Where are you watching it on?

• 39:02Andrew Manganelli?

  I was joking about that.

• 39:03Speaker 01

  6K Pro Display XDR, 6K display.

• 39:05David Imel?

  Okay.

• 39:06Speaker 01

  If I watch a 4K video and then an 8K video, even though it's not an 8K display, I can see a difference.

• 39:10David Imel?

  What about 1080p enhanced bitrate?

• 39:12Speaker 01

  That I...

• 39:13David Imel?

  I can't. I wish I could.

• 39:15Speaker 01

  I...

• 39:16David Imel?

  I wish I could.

• 39:17Speaker 01

  It depends on the video.

• 39:18David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 39:18Speaker 01

  Depends on the video, because the thing is YouTube had this bug recently where... And I don't know if you saw this. If you started watching a video... And you had a great Wi-Fi connection, it would still play at ultra-low quality. Right. And this went on for a couple of days, and I was very annoyed by this because every video I watch on my iPad, I immediately select the highest possible bitrate and resolution. Yeah. So it was going to default to these lower resolutions, and every single time I would switch it. And I started noticing more and more videos that have 1080p and 1080p high bitrate. Yeah. Some of them, just for [bleep] and giggles, I would check it out, and I would notice a tiny difference with the high bitrate, but it would depend on the video and how much movement and motion there is, and how much is happening in the video.

• 39:57Speaker 01

  So some of those I would be able to tell, some of those I wouldn't, but I can definitely tell the difference between like 1080 and 1440 and 4K. Yeah. And then if there's an 8K video, I'm probably getting a big display to notice the difference, but... And how close you are to the screen. Yeah. And the thing about 8K videos is they're typically shot on sensors and cameras that look better than 4K cameras. So it's not just pure resolution difference. Like if I were to take a 8K video from the Red and downsize it to 4K, it's still gonna look really, really good, and that's gonna be hard to tell the difference. But a 4K video from my RX100 versus an 8K video from my Red, it's like, okay, I can tell which one the 8K one is because it looks better in so many other ways. What about an 8K from a Galaxy S24 Ultra?

• 40:40Speaker 01

  That's what I'm curious. So right now, 8K videos from smartphones, the couple that support it, the way it kind of ends up going is it's only from the main sensor, because that's the only one with the high enough resolution and fast enough processing and fast enough scanning of the sensor. Yeah. And then it ends up looking like this super, super crisp, over-sharpened video from top to bottom. Yeah. And so it kind of fools you into thinking, wow, this is much better because I have all this detail, and like, someone's hair will like wisp off in the sun, and you can see like every little thing, and it looks sharper and better, but it's not actually more usable in terms of like resolution or just looking like better footage. I would get more from a larger sensor and a shallower depth of field than I would from going to 8K. Yeah.

• 41:25Speaker 01

  That being said, I've wanted 8K from lots of smartphone cameras. I think the iPhone is a prime camera to support 8K. I've shot lots of video on iPhones. You watch the autofocus channel. You've seen a lot of it. I would love to see what 8K from those sensors would look like. But we haven't seen it yet. So maybe this next generation we will.

• 41:45David Imel?

  Would you use it?

• 41:46Speaker 01

  Uh, I think so. So the thing about 8K also is it's four times 4K resolution. So it's gonna be a ton of storage. And you already know what it looks like to shoot 4K HDR ProRes.

• 41:56David Imel?

  Log.

• 41:57Speaker 01

  Log. Those are big files.

• 41:59Andrew Manganelli?

  They're so big.

• 41:59Speaker 01

  So, so big. I'm thinking 8K is going to require at least a terabyte iPhone or something crazy. Cause they're not gonna unlock that for 250, 600 iPhones. And it's gonna probably, I don't know if it'll require external storage, but it'll be strongly suggested.

• 42:14David Imel?

  My guess is they're not even going to allow you to shoot 8K ProRes. Like 8K will be an option, but ProRes is gonna be limited to 4K.

• 42:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's H265, because H264 is limited to 4K, right? So H265 is 8K.

• 42:29David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 42:29Speaker 01

  And that's, that'll be, that's the only way to support.

• 42:32David Imel?

  But I just don't think that Apple even let you because they're just gonna be like, this eats up way too much storage.

• 42:36Speaker 01

  So they're gonna compress 8K. So is the compressed 8K gonna look better than the ProRes 4K?

• 42:42David Imel?

  It's the same thing. It's like, it's like the 8K on the smartphone looks kinda worse than just the regular 4PK. Because it's so much sharpening, so much, uh, what was that? So much sharpening, so much noise reduction, that it just ends up looking like over sharpened and plasticky.

• 42:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:57David Imel?

  But it would just be better to shoot 4K.

• 42:59Andrew Manganelli?

  What if they want it taking up more storage so you can buy more iCloud?

• 43:02David Imel?

  Conspiracy. Yeah, I mean, they didn't allow ProRes Log unless you had the 256 gig model.

• 43:12Speaker 01

  I think you needed more. I think you might have needed the terabyte.

• 43:15David Imel?

  No, I think it was.

• 43:16Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it was just there wasn't.

• 43:17David Imel?

  I think the base model didn't allow it.

• 43:18Speaker 01

  Right, right, right.

• 43:19David Imel?

  I think it was just the base model didn't allow it. So I could see if they did that. I just, I don't think they're going to allow 8K in ProRes Log at all.

• 43:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, those would be crazy big files.

• 43:29David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 43:29Andrew Manganelli?

  I bet if this does come out on 17 Pro, they announce it. At the event and it comes out three months later.

• 43:37David Imel?

  Hmm, yeah, I could see that.

• 43:38Speaker 01

  I could definitely. That's actually a really good prediction. I think that's exactly what they would do.

• 43:43David Imel?

  Pretty solid.

• 43:43Speaker 01

  Wow. Especially because the day one videos of people being like, I shot 10 minutes of 8K video and now my phone is full. They were just, well, just delay those headlines by a couple of weeks while people buy the phones and then turn it on.

• 43:55David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 43:55Speaker 01

  Damn, that's a good, that's a good one, Andrew.

• 43:57Andrew Manganelli?

  I like how the, the smallest note in this outline turned into one joke and possibly the longest conversation.

• 44:05Speaker 01

  Just, I'm, I can see the comment section burning up already from my last two takes from AirPods Max and now 8K video on phones, but I stand by them.

• 44:14David Imel?

  Other small rumor is that Mark Gurman is saying that they possibly may be producing the foldable iPhone as early as 2026, selling it as early as 2026.

• 44:24Speaker 01

  Next year.

• 44:25David Imel?

  Uh, we also had an analyst saying that the device has entered a new production phase and mass production could be slated for the second half of next year. So.

• 44:34Speaker 01

  So it's gonna beat the, the roo taxi.

• 44:38David Imel?

  Everything will be the roo taxi.

• 44:40Speaker 01

  Interesting, okay.

• 44:41David Imel?

  Uh, I've been burned before, so. But Mark Gurman does think that it's a foldable style, uh, flip phone and not a flip style folding phone. I, that, that, there's too many names for this folding thing.

• 44:53Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it's confusing because when you fold and flip are next to each other, it makes perfect sense. But when you only say folds, then it's like pants and shorts. Shorts are over shorts, but I think, right. But that's a hotter take than. Go on, go on, I'm not getting into that argument.

• 45:06David Imel?

  He also says there will be less of a crease, uh, which matches with an earlier report from ET News.

• 45:11Speaker 01

  Less of a crease than existing.

• 45:13David Imel?

  Than existing folds and flips. And Apple has decided to eliminate crease at all costs.

• 45:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. So that's something ET News reported like a month ago, saying that like, Apple is willing to like, not have a crease on this. Like, that's a main factor.

• 45:27Speaker 01

  Interesting tidbit. I mean, I, I recently did the video on the Oppo Find N5, talking about this peak foldable where they've done so much. It's super thin. It has a large battery. The hinge is really nice and there's almost no crease. And I wonder, like, as Apple watches all of these foldables coming out, what they're thinking is like, all right, what we've got to do to make it like, okay for us to ship a foldable. And to land on the crease being the tough thing and not the aspect ratio or the bezels or the under display selfie camera or anything else. The crease, gotta have no crease. That's an interesting.

• 46:03David Imel?

  Yeah, I guess that's Apple kind of admitting, or at least saying that the industry has figured out the form factors by now, because that's usually what they do. They let the experimental stuff cook for like a few years and then they take, okay, what are the key problems with these things that people are testing out? Let's iron that out and then release something.

• 46:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, iron it out, get the crease out.

• 46:24David Imel?

  That's right.

• 46:25Speaker 01

  Iron the crease out.

• 46:26David Imel?

  And they're basically saying, nice, they're basically saying that a foldable, hot dog style foldable is the style that is correct. I don't know if I agree with that. I think that, you know, the new Huawei one is kinda hot, but...

• 46:44Andrew Manganelli?

  I always pictured Apple doing flip style. I just thought it made more sense. That's a literal iPhone that like flips.

• 46:52Speaker 02

  And that's the one that I see all over the place and iPhone people are like, hmm.

• 46:56David Imel?

  Yeah, my question becomes though, do we see them all over the place because they're still half the price of folds?

• 47:01Speaker 02

  100%.

• 47:02David Imel?

  I think so.

• 47:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, but that's also, like, there are also folds out there, but none of my iPhone people in my life care about them. It's like a joke. Like, why would you want that? But they see the flips and they're like, huh, that is cool.

• 47:14Speaker 01

  And is that independent of price, you think?

• 47:15Speaker 02

  Well, they don't know the pricing when they're just looking at it.

• 47:18Speaker 01

  Right, yeah. Because I think when I imagine which one to tackle first is the best idea, I think there are more flips in the world, but I think that's also because of the price. So I don't know if that's a good indicator for which one's a better idea. But also for Apple positioning, you know, they want to go premium. And I think with the flips, it's just, oh, the iPhone, but it folds in half. Well, what does that offer me? I guess it's cool that it folds in half and it's smaller. But they can do, they can tell a way more dramatic premium story with this tablet in your pocket thing. And I think if this is going to be a $2,000-plus phone, like, they would like to have some big...

• 47:55David Imel?

  You know, heavy hitting thing to start the category. The other interesting thing becomes iOS and iPadOS are different and work differently. And so, does Apple merge them and just make them? Cause like Android basically took Android and then they had a foldable version of Android. And they eventually just merged them into one version where all Android phones can now just dynamically expand and do the like plug into a computer and all these things. Apple's gonna have to go through that process and it took Google like three years to figure that out. So are they just gonna like knock it out of the park day one or are they gonna have some flubs?

• 48:33Speaker 02

  I think they, they killed the iPad mini.

• 48:36David Imel?

  No.

• 48:36Speaker 02

  Unfortunately.

• 48:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Please no.

• 48:38David Imel?

  And this is the new iPad mini?

• 48:39Speaker 02

  And then this is the new iPad.

• 48:40Andrew Manganelli?

  And then they make a, a commercial where they're like, hey, what's that iPad? And the person's like, what's an iPad?

• 48:46David Imel?

  That'd be awesome.

• 48:47Speaker 02

  Deep cut.

• 48:47David Imel?

  Uh, it should be around $2,000 or $2,000 to $2,500. So, that is a fairly, yes, it is. But it was, it's also the same price that the folds have been for like a very long time. Yeah. Or at least were when they launched.

• 49:01Speaker 02

  I'm not sure if that would like.

• 49:02David Imel?

  A little cheaper now.

• 49:03Speaker 02

  Get a new round of people buying iPhones. I think a flip would be way more compelling to people. Cause you also don't have to tell developers, okay, now there's a new screen size you have to figure out.

• 49:14David Imel?

  Well, there is the, the front facing screen if they had, if they had a screen on the front. Yeah.

• 49:19Speaker 02

  Oh, that's true.

• 49:19David Imel?

  It's that or the big landscape thing.

• 49:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:22David Imel?

  What, maybe, maybe it's iOS when it's closed, when you open it, it's iPadOS. And it's got an M chip? And it. And it's, wait, now I want it.

• 49:34David Imel?

  Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, more rumor mill stuff. I think we've been reporting on this for.

• 49:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, yeah.

• 49:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, we'll see.

• 49:40David Imel?

  A year.

• 49:41Andrew Manganelli?

  We just need to talk about it enough to maybe put it in the thumbnail.

• 49:45David Imel?

  It is a long way away, but it is interesting to imagine. We have some facts to throw at you that are different from rumors. WWBC, also called Dub Dub, someone in the comment section said, stop calling it that. And to you I say, no.

• 50:00Speaker 02

  That's what it's called though.

• 50:01David Imel?

  It's an acronym. I've listened to your concerns and I've chosen to ignore them.

• 50:07Speaker 01

  You sound a lot like Tim Cook, right?

• 50:09David Imel?

  Also WWDC, oh my goodness, that takes forever to say.

• 50:15Speaker 01

  I'm just gonna say Worldwide Developer Conference every single time.

• 50:17David Imel?

  It hurts me.

• 50:19Speaker 01

  So when is the Worldwide Developer Conference this year?

• 50:21David Imel?

  June 9th.

• 50:22Speaker 02

  Ah. Oh, Worldwide Developer Conference 2025?

• 50:25David Imel?

  Yeah, the Worldwide Developer Conference 2025 is taking place at Apple headquarters in Cupertino, California at One Infinite Loop.

• 50:31Speaker 01

  It's typically in June, the Worldwide Developer Conference.

• 50:33David Imel?

  Yeah, the Worldwide Developer Conference starts on June 9th, but the Worldwide Developer Conference is actually going to be accessible to every developer online, fully available online between June 9th and June 12th.

• 50:44Speaker 02

  What are we expecting to see at this Worldwide Developer Conference?

• 50:46David Imel?

  Well, glad you asked, Adam. At the Worldwide Developer Conference, I'm sorry, we're done.

• 50:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Done, done. That person regrets that comment.

• 50:54Speaker 01

  I wasn't done.

• 50:55David Imel?

  I'm honestly surprised none of us tripped.

• 50:57Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm very surprised. That's why I didn't participate, because I knew I would have.

• 51:02David Imel?

  Yeah, so it's taking place June 9th. It is going to be available to developers entirely online, which is exciting. It is a Monday this year, which is a little bit different. Usually they do it on Tuesdays, so.

• 51:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, the like, initial day, first keynote and stuff.

• 51:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 51:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 51:15David Imel?

  So for us, I mean, unless we're like, doing a podcast there, then we can just do our normal podcast, I guess.

• 51:20Speaker 01

  Amazing.

• 51:21David Imel?

  Which is cool.

• 51:21Speaker 02

  If that's even happening anymore.

• 51:23David Imel?

  Yeah, who knows? We will have to wait like, four days for people to hear our thoughts on, on the thing that's happening on Monday. But, in other news, the European Union has officially put into effect the consequences of its Digital Markets Act, and it's going to force Apple, allegedly, to change iOS in nine key, or seven key ways, nine key ways, nine key ways. I wrote this this morning, nine key ways. Now, obviously, Apple can still appeal this, and they almost definitely will, because the ways that the European Union has told Apple to change iOS are all ways in which they keep people in their ecosystem. So, surprisingly, all of these changes are things that you have to be like, very, you

• 52:08David Imel?

  know, tech savvy and understand why these features kind of keep people in the ecosystem to do. So I'm just gonna go on the list here. Number one is better access to iOS notifications, which would allow third-party smartwatches to show notifications and allow people to interact with them similar to how the Apple Watch can. You also must allow custom actions.

• 52:30David Imel?

  You also must allow custom actions from third-party developers and ensure that the actions are triggered on the iOS device.

• 52:36Speaker 01

  So like quick replies?

• 52:37David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, quick replies or like opening apps on your phone when you click on the watch, that kind of stuff.

• 52:43Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 52:43David Imel?

  Uh, this would fix a lot of the Garmin problem that we have. Big dub. Big dub? I mean, big win. Big win. Oh, sorry, yeah. Sorry, yeah. Uh, win-win developer conference. Can we just, when you say these, can we say if this is a... A dub? Yeah. A W? Mm-hmm. A world? Okay, number two.

• 53:03Speaker 01

  World's in the chat.

• 53:04David Imel?

  High bandwidth peer-to-peer Wi-Fi connections. Uh, I believe this means that MacBooks are gonna be able to see your phone's network and connect to it very easily regardless of it's an iPhone. Because right now, as long as your phone is around your Mac and is on this, is, uh, connected to the same Apple ID, you can just click the Wi-Fi button and click connect to your phone.

• 53:25Speaker 01

  Super useful.

• 53:26David Imel?

  Yes.

• 53:27Speaker 01

  Also, when Chromebooks did that, that was useful.

• 53:29David Imel?

  They still do it.

• 53:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, Chromebooks and Pixels.

• 53:31David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 53:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:32David Imel?

  Yeah, so that would be really nice. Uh, the question then becomes to me, if there are tons of phones everywhere, is your laptop just gonna show a zillion different networks?

• 53:43Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 53:43David Imel?

  I feel like that could be frustrating, because the reason, the way that they do it now is they check to see if you're on the same Apple ID and then it shows it. But part of this European Union thing is like, the discovery aspect of that network needs to be opened. So, that's pretty interesting. But they specifically say high bandwidth peer-to-peer, and that makes me wonder if there is some underlying protocol where the iPhone giving access to internet to the MacBook is faster with its bandwidth or something than like an Android phone that is casting internet to the MacBook? I'm not totally sure. Uh, number three, proximity-triggered pairing needs to be opened up. So, obviously, when you have in a pair of AirPods or something and you hold it near the iPhone, it'll show that little,

• 54:29David Imel?

  pop-up window on the iPhone that's like, "Pair your..." Yeah, Google has fast pair, but only for Android phones. And so basically, I think they're just trying to make it so that all earbuds have the same capabilities. So that would be nice.

• 54:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 54:44David Imel?

  Is that a dub?

• 54:44Andrew Manganelli?

  I think that's a dub. I'm also wondering if pairing AirPods to an Android phone.

• 54:50David Imel?

  Yeah, I mean.

• 54:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Would have to do it the other way around.

• 54:52David Imel?

  Yeah, specifically, they're going after Apple here. I imagine.

• 54:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, that's still Apple. Is that, oh, I guess it's who's allowing that connection on an Android phone.

• 55:01David Imel?

  Yeah. Google would still have to allow, because they're different protocols right now. Like, Google has the official fast pair protocol, you know?

• 55:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 55:11David Imel?

  They use like a Qualcomm thing.

• 55:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, yeah. And then I wonder, like, is the EU gonna make Google open it up?

• 55:17David Imel?

  That is a great question. That is a great question.

• 55:20David Imel?

  Number four, background execution. Apple needs to provide third parties with the ability to work in the background and fetch data. This is also something that completely nukes third-party smartwatches. Because a lot of the tasks and stuff cannot run in the background. Eric Mijkoewski, who just relaunched Pebble, specifically said why Apple won't let us make a good Pebble app. He wrote a whole blog post about it. And a lot of that has to do with the ability to fetch information from the phone actively while it's running in the background.

• 55:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Gotcha.

• 55:52David Imel?

  WW.

• 55:55David Imel?

  Close-range wireless file transfer. Other platforms must be able to send and receive data via an equally powerful method as AirDrop when connected to an Apple device and have access to the same protocols AirDrop uses to operate, such as discovery Wi-Fi transfer. More enormous dub.

• 56:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Love it. Love to see it. It would make working in this office so much easier.

• 56:16David Imel?

  AirDrop everything all the time.

• 56:18Andrew Manganelli?

  If I could AirDrop stuff from my phone.

• 56:18David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 56:19Andrew Manganelli?

  You know, and I don't feel bad for them having to open this up, because for so long, you could have just let me plug my fucking phone into my computer and access the files to it. But you don't. So here we go. I'm Slack messaging myself photos.

• 56:32David Imel?

  Yeah, I mean, AirDrop is definitely, they basically, what they did was they went onto Apple devices and they were like, what are all the things that only work among Apple devices? And make it so you have to buy another Apple device for this feature to work well. And they are basically just saying you have to open all this stuff up, which is amazing. I think the AirDrop is kind of the secondary reason that people stay on iPhones when they have a Mac next to iMessage. So that's a very big thing. Automatic Wi-Fi connection on third-party devices. So, for example, if you connect to a Wi-Fi network on your iPhone, and then you open your MacBook, it's automatically connected to the same Wi-Fi network. That's very helpful, and that'd be nice. I'm not really sure how they're going to do that. I'm guessing it means with like, because some smartwatches can connect to Wi-Fi,

• 57:16David Imel?

  which allows them to pull notifications and stuff to the internet. So it doesn't have to be connected via Bluetooth to your phone. It might be that. I would love to see that based on other computers as well, but I just don't really see how that would happen. But who knows? Casting solutions equal to AirPlay. So, Apple has to give third parties the ability to cast with the same tech AirPlay has access to, and it must be available in the Control Center picker and offer it via the standard media playback APIs without the developer needing to integrate an SDK. So, that's cool.

• 57:48Speaker 02

  Am I the only one that's like, not a fan of all of this?

• 57:52Speaker 01

  What do you mean, not a fan?

• 57:52Speaker 02

  Like, that they're forcing Apple to do this?

• 57:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, it's basically, the result is good.

• 57:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, but it's weird.

• 58:01Speaker 01

  But the way it's happening is a slippery slope. Like, if they can just come in and go, "All right, I know you built these technologies, but now here's what you have to do with them."

• 58:13Speaker 02

  Like, you know where all of these technologies exist? On Android phones. Like, if it's really that serious, you know, you could just leave.

• 58:21David Imel?

  But you can't. Then that's the whole problem.

• 58:26David Imel?

  I think that's the whole reason they're doing this, is because you can't leave. Like, you have to buy AirPods if you want to have, like, device switching and all that kind of stuff, you know?

• 58:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:36Speaker 01

  You have to, you have to leave universally.

• 58:38Speaker 02

  You have to leave iPhones, I mean, yeah.

• 58:40David Imel?

  Yeah, which is very hard for people to do. Ironically, in Europe, it's not as hard to do.

• 58:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's what I was gonna say. This is in the EU. It's harder here, but I don't think it's that difficult in the EU.

• 58:51David Imel?

  Yeah, so, I don't know. We got two more. Automatic audio switching. So, third-party headphones must have the ability to automatically switch between your phone and your laptop. Right now, there is, what is the term for it?

• 59:06Speaker 01

  Multi-device.

• 59:07David Imel?

  Multi-point. Where you can be connected to both at the same time. So I don't see this as that big of a deal, because it's from the headphones' perspective and not, you know, the device's perspective. But, apparently, they have to open that up to other headphones. And also, they must be allowed to use the same high-bandwidth connection that AirPods use, I guess for lower latency or something like that. And then number nine, Apple has to open the NFC chip to read, write, so that you cannot only have to use it with Apple Pay.

• 59:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh.

• 59:36David Imel?

  Yeah, because they-

• 59:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I love all these.

• 59:39David Imel?

  Yeah, I don't know. I'm not a fan.

• 59:41Andrew Manganelli?

  I think all of these are things where like, if you either have an, like, if you have an iPhone, you should be able to have other things that are in Apple Pay.

• 59:48David Imel?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 59:50Andrew Manganelli?

  I think that's super reasonable.

• 59:51David Imel?

  Right.

• 59:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 59:52Speaker 01

  The results are super reasonable.

• 59:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 59:55Speaker 01

  It's just, is this the way to accomplish those results?

• 59:59Andrew Manganelli?

  I mean, Apple's not gonna do it by themselves.

• 1:00:01David Imel?

  Yeah, right.

• 1:00:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:03Speaker 01

  Consumers should.

• 1:00:04David Imel?

  The question of, well, but the question always becomes like, have you created a space where it's hard for consumers to pick other options? And therefore they have to buy the Apple option, which further locks them into the Apple ecosystem. They can't get out. So other players like can't even compete.

• 1:00:21Speaker 01

  I'm trying to imagine a less competitive version of the same thing where this would never happen. Like, I designed, like, what did we, what was that random car that had luggage? The BMW IX? BMW made bespoke luggage that fits perfectly in the trunk of the BMW IX. So like maximizes the trunk space. So if you want to fill the trunk space with luggage, you have to buy that luggage. Otherwise, you're just gonna buy some random cheap other third-party luggage and it might not fit, or it might only take up half the space. Now the EU comes in and says, BMW, you are required to allow others to like, design luggage with your exact specifications.

• 1:00:59David Imel?

  Yeah, but that's not illegal right now.

• 1:01:01Speaker 01

  Well, it's not illegal.

• 1:01:02David Imel?

  Well, like, it's not illegal. You can still design luggage.

• 1:01:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, I feel like the difference would be, it's like, if someone designed the luggage that did fit in there and then BMW had a, a way of being like, no, that doesn't, or the trunk, the trunk won't close if you put different luggage.

• 1:01:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, if you, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's better. Yeah, like, if you, you are allowed to design with the exact dimensions, but if they detect it's not BMW's, then it doesn't work or something.

• 1:01:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Or like, yeah, they should, the EU should be like, you can't do that. I'm also gonna go and say, I am sure the way the EU is doing it isn't perfect because there's a lot of issues in every government everywhere, but like- I think, like, it seems crazy that, I know lots of people with iPhones that would rather have a Garmin watch just because there are a lot of benefits to it, even versus an Apple Watch Ultra. And not being able to do a bunch of the things and just straight up losing features in that.

• 1:01:51David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Seems like super ticky tacky and things that like, I don't think any of these are super unreasonable asks that would really make people like not want their iPhone anymore. It just lets people with an iPhone have some more opportunities.

• 1:02:07David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah. There does become a question of like, how do you differentiate? How does Apple differentiate its products to make people want to buy them? Like, do they just have to make the audio quality better? Do they just have to, which, to be fair, is what every other brand has to do. And there does become a problem when the platform developer becomes the person that is selling accessories for the platform because they can always prefer their accessories. Yep. You know, and so it's hard for competition to compete when there's a platform developer that also creates the.

• 1:02:39Speaker 01

  It's like an Amazon basics, like knocks off products and puts their listing above other stuff.

• 1:02:44David Imel?

  Yeah, right.

• 1:02:45Speaker 01

  We're Amazon, we built the search engine, so we put what we want there.

• 1:02:48David Imel?

  You search fanny pack or like small camera bag and it comes up with the Peak Design knockoff that Amazon themselves made, like, that is anti-competitive. Yeah. So.

• 1:02:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, but the solution is also you just leave the iPhone.

• 1:03:01David Imel?

  It's really hard to leave the iPhone.

• 1:03:03Speaker 02

  I do it like three times a year.

• 1:03:04David Imel?

  Yeah, okay. Well, you, yeah, I mean, you're built different.

• 1:03:10Speaker 01

  Built different.

• 1:03:12David Imel?

  We have no discipline out here. I would say like, AirDrop is probably the one thing that keeps me using the iPhone right now. Because now that RCS exists and I'm getting these RCS chats from people and I'm RCS chatting with people, I'm like, I really don't have qualms not using iMessage anymore, but I do use AirDrop constantly and it is really, really hard to move files from an Android phone to a MacBook.

• 1:03:37Speaker 02

  May I interest you in an app called Local Send, which does that?

• 1:03:42Speaker 01

  How fast, how fast does it do it?

• 1:03:44Speaker 02

  It's the same as AirDrop. It's just you have to download the app.

• 1:03:46Speaker 01

  Also send from the MacBook to the phone?

• 1:03:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:03:50Speaker 01

  Do you need an app on the MacBook?

• 1:03:51Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:03:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:52Speaker 02

  That's the thing. It's like this is built into the OS, but there are other options. You just have to download it.

• 1:03:59Speaker 01

  I would like to end this segment with a tech support question. Because I know that this has worked in the past where somebody has an issue and then they put it out into the world and then other people with the same issue will find them. I have a tech support issue. It's RCS related.

• 1:04:13Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:04:14Speaker 01

  So this phone has RCS on it.

• 1:04:16Speaker 02

  Which phone is this?

• 1:04:17Speaker 01

  This is the Galaxy S25 Ultra and I have AT&T. And I use Google Messages, so it should work perfectly with RCS. And RCS chats is turned on and connected on this phone.

• 1:04:27Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:04:27Speaker 01

  When I send a message to someone with RCS, it starts to try to send for a while and then it says it's pending. It'll send when the recipient is online and then a couple of minutes later it goes, "The recipient was never online, so I sent an SMS instead."

• 1:04:42Speaker 02

  Does the recipient have an iPhone or an Android?

• 1:04:44Speaker 01

  Both. This has happened with both. And what is their carrier? So Andrew, what's your carrier?

• 1:04:51Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm T-Mobile.

• 1:04:52Speaker 01

  You're T-Mobile. So it says RCS chat with Andrew.

• 1:04:54Andrew Manganelli?

  T-Mobile.

• 1:04:54Speaker 01

  Test, send. It says, "I'm gonna try to send an RCS and it will stay there and you haven't gotten a text yet, right?"

• 1:05:01Andrew Manganelli?

  No.

• 1:05:01Speaker 01

  I hit send.

• 1:05:02Andrew Manganelli?

  I am in airplane mode, so maybe that's...

• 1:05:05Speaker 01

  So when I hit this, it says, "Message delivers when Andrew is online," but it never gets there and it just stays and the person will not get my text until it auto backs up to SMS or I just hit switch to SMS and then it sends you an SMS. So this, you will not get this text.

• 1:05:20Speaker 02

  I have a dumb question.

• 1:05:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:22Speaker 02

  Have you tried turning it off and on again?

• 1:05:23Speaker 01

  Yes. I have tried turning it off and on again. I have tried disabling it on one phone and then enabling it on a different phone. I think my issue is I have switched phones so many times and then I, when I switch phones, I don't like turn RCS off on one phone and then turn it on on the other phone.

• 1:05:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:05:41Speaker 01

  And I think that might be messing with it because as of this particular phone... I have like two RCS chats that are working and the rest all don't work and they're backing all of them to SMS. And Andrew, you will not get that.

• 1:05:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, and I just got other text messages.

• 1:05:54Speaker 01

  Yep. Yeah. So you're not going to get it until, wait, see this? Switch to SMS. You're going to get it in like two seconds now. Cause it's just a regular SMS. There you go. Can you try it with me?

• 1:06:03Andrew Manganelli?

  Funny, because it still says RCS chat with Andrew.

• 1:06:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it still thinks it's an RCS chat.

• 1:06:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, it says you're typing right now?

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Which is probably the other one.

• 1:06:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, but it will never go through.

• 1:06:13Speaker 02

  Marcus, I think you're on to something though, because my, this is like a known thing when you leave iMessage. Where like your number's kind of tied up on the online service or whatever. And because you're switching between Android phones that also now have this RCS enabled, that would be my guess.

• 1:06:28Speaker 01

  I think the jibe servers are like being pulled from one phone that isn't this phone. And so some other phone somewhere is logged in as RCS for me.

• 1:06:37Speaker 02

  Probably right in the closet.

• 1:06:39Speaker 01

  Well, the thing is, if I go boot up those other phones, they all say they're signed out. So even though this is the only one that says it's signed in, I think other phones are still getting these messages. Yeah, that sounds about right.

• 1:06:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Can you go into your Google account and sign out other accounts?

• 1:06:53Speaker 02

  Not with RCS, I don't think.

• 1:06:55Speaker 01

  You can go, yeah.

• 1:06:57Speaker 02

  You can like sign out of your Google account.

• 1:06:59Speaker 01

  There was a bug when I was testing the Pixel 9, where I was trying to get RCS to work and it was not working. And it was because I had not like turned RCS off on an old phone or something. Right. And then it wouldn't re-register it on the new device. I think that's where I'm at right now. Yeah. So if anyone else is watching this video and has had the same issue and found a fix to it, please let me know. I will be trolling through the comments, digging between all of your hot takes about wired audio and iPhones.

• 1:07:27Speaker 02

  You want an answer, but you already set everyone off on something else.

• 1:07:30Speaker 01

  Protocols.

• 1:07:32Andrew Manganelli?

  That seems super niche because you switch phones so much, but if that does occur to someone making a change and their old phone is broken or whatever, and they can't go back, that's like a significant issue.

• 1:07:42Speaker 01

  It's been like a month of me not being able to chat with people in RCS on this phone.

• 1:07:46Andrew Manganelli?

  But so every time you send like someone a message, you then have to go in and like.

• 1:07:50Speaker 01

  Yep, and then hit the text and then go switch to SMS and now you're going to get my text.

• 1:07:54Speaker 02

  Marcus, have you heard of WhatsApp?

• 1:07:59Speaker 01

  I've heard of it, and I don't want to go down that road.

• 1:08:03David Imel?

  I just...

• 1:08:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, yeah, we'll see if anyone hits me up in the comments. We're gonna have to take one more quick break. We do have Crown and Clown after we get back, but before we get back, let's do trivia.

• 1:08:16Speaker 02

  Trivia!

• 1:08:19Speaker 02

  Alright, so what is wrong with Marques's phone? That's the question. No, I'm joking. Uh, when was airdrop announced? You will get one point for the year, two points for the month and the year.

• 1:08:31David Imel?

  Ooh.

• 1:08:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Three points for the day.

• 1:08:33Speaker 02

  Three points for the day, sure, why not? Let's do it.

• 1:08:35David Imel?

  Four points for the announcer.

• 1:08:37Speaker 02

  Five points for the hour. Actually, I will give you four points if you can guess the announcer.

• 1:08:42David Imel?

  Six points...

• 1:08:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Shack.

• 1:08:45David Imel?

  Six po- Six points if you can tell me what they ate for lunch before they announced it.

• 1:08:51Speaker 01

  Alright, we'll think about it. We'll be back after the break.

• 1:08:55Speaker 02

  This would be the wildest way for me to come back.

• 1:09:11Speaker 01

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• 1:10:59Speaker 02

  Welcome back, and now, because it is the last episode of the month, we are going to do Crown and Clown, which means that we are going to go around and say what we think is the best thing that happened this month, AKA, the Crown, and what is the worst thing that happened this month, AKA, the Clown. The trick is, we all need to agree on what the Crown and the Clown is. So we have to convince each other of what it is.

• 1:11:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes, and we're gonna attempt to be more organized this month. Attempt, being the keyword.

• 1:11:28Speaker 02

  An attempt was made, let's just say that.

• 1:11:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 1:11:30David Imel?

  So we're trying to be persuasive here.

• 1:11:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, let's do crowns first.

• 1:11:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, make your case. Who wants to go first?

• 1:11:35David Imel?

  I will.

• 1:11:36Speaker 02

  Okay. This is for Crown.

• 1:11:38David Imel?

  Okay, Crown.

• 1:11:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:11:39David Imel?

  I think that my crown is that we did our first live waveform show this month.

• 1:11:44Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:11:45David Imel?

  We did.

• 1:11:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Personally, it's really hard to go against that one.

• 1:11:49Speaker 01

  It was a good time.

• 1:11:50Speaker 02

  Damn it, David.

• 1:11:51Speaker 01

  That is funny, because my crown comes from that. But I do want to appreciate that it went really well.

• 1:12:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Sorry, that was an alarm.

• 1:12:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, David, wake up.

• 1:12:04David Imel?

  I just wake up.

• 1:12:09Speaker 02

  The whole thing was a dream.

• 1:12:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Again?

• 1:12:15Speaker 01

  Welcome to the podcast.

• 1:12:16Speaker 00

  What? What?

• 1:12:19Speaker 01

  No, that's, that is a good one. So I, I, my crown comes from that. It's not exactly that, but I do want to appreciate that we did do that. It went really well. It was a good time. It gave me ideas about other ways that we could do that in the future, which is exciting. If we decide to go that route at some point, could be fun. Shout out to everyone who was there. Shout out to the questions. We did publish that as well. If you guys listened to that. I think that's pretty cool.

• 1:12:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. So what is yours that comes? Yeah, I think you should do it because.

• 1:12:46Speaker 01

  Okay, sure. My, my crown, like you having to think and make sure I say the right word, is Gemini Live with access to your camera launching in the last month. I have been using this a lot more than I thought I would. So Gemini Live is a conversational Gemini where you pull up that like full screen thing, whatever it has access to your screen and then you can give it access to your camera.

• 1:13:10Speaker 01

  You open up the camera and you can just ask it about your surroundings and point it at stuff and ask it about what it's pointed at. It has not missed once.

• 1:13:17Andrew Manganelli?

  Do it to us right now. Yeah, ask it about us.

• 1:13:19Speaker 01

  All right, let's do it.

• 1:13:22Andrew Manganelli?

  We're supposed to be looking at the camera.

• 1:13:23Speaker 01

  What do you see here?

• 1:13:26Speaker 08

  It looks like you're in a podcast studio. Are you getting ready to record a new episode?

• 1:13:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm about to record this episode with these two people here. Is there anything you think I should ask them?

• 1:13:37Speaker 08

  That's awesome. Since you're podcasting with two people, you could explore the dynamic of their relationship. Ask them how they first met or what it's like working together. It often leads to interesting stories.

• 1:13:49Speaker 01

  Now, here's, here's what's fun. I want you to tell me about these headphones he's wearing. What are these?

• 1:13:55Speaker 08

  Those are AudioTecnic A T H M 50X headphones. They're pretty popular in the audio world, known for their clear sound and.

• 1:14:02Speaker 01

  It doesn't miss, dude. I've asked it about products. I've asked it about animals. Yeah, let's try it.

• 1:14:06Andrew Manganelli?

  That is crazy. What about my watch? Cause it's.

• 1:14:09Speaker 01

  What watch is this and is any good?

• 1:14:12Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm wondering, cause this is like the Phoenix basically stole from the Epix line and. Wait, you confused it.

• 1:14:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, we asked it like one person.

• 1:14:19Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, it's not very good if it can't listen to two people talk at the same time. I know our audience loves when we talk over each other. Gemini is just like, I will not partake.

• 1:14:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. All right, let's try it.

• 1:14:30Speaker 01

  All right. So what is this watch and is it any good?

• 1:14:36Speaker 08

  It's a really popular high-end GPS watch, known for its durability and tons of features. Do you have any specific activities in mind that you'd want to use it for?

• 1:14:45Speaker 01

  No, but cancel that. I actually want you to tell me about this watch. I think it looks way cooler. What is this?

• 1:14:53Speaker 08

  Ah, that's a Casio AE1200WHD1A. It's a digital watch with a retro vibe. And yeah, it does look pretty cool.

• 1:15:02David Imel?

  What?

• 1:15:02Speaker 08

  Are you thinking about getting one?

• 1:15:03David Imel?

  This is modified.

• 1:15:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Mine was a Phoenix 9, by the way.

• 1:15:06David Imel?

  That's crazy.

• 1:15:07Speaker 01

  With the screen off, I might look at it.

• 1:15:08David Imel?

  This is like heavily modified to the point where you can barely tell that it's an AE1200.

• 1:15:13Speaker 01

  That's crazy. It's, I've, I've pointed it at animals. It's told me about the animal. I've pointed it at products that like don't have labels on them and it just knows what they are. I've been just asking it like how to do things around the house. It's, it's genuinely shocking how useful it is. I don't actually have that many things I need to do with it, but I just keep finding reasons to use it because it's that good. This is my crown for the month. I think people should try it if they have it on their phone. You do need a subscription. It's really good. Try it out. Wow. Yeah.

• 1:15:40David Imel?

  That is interesting.

• 1:15:42Andrew Manganelli?

  I'll do mine. I don't think it's as good as either of these, so I'm not doing a good job of convincing, but I do think it will be appreciated in here. Android 16 is going to let all Pixel phones use fingerprint unlock when the screen is off. And this will be going back to old Pixels as well.

• 1:15:59David Imel?

  Wait, why?

• 1:15:59Speaker 01

  Fingerprint. Because before you had to tap on the screen to wake it up.

• 1:16:03Andrew Manganelli?

  Screen up before you could use the fingerprint unlock under the screen.

• 1:16:06Speaker 01

  Specific, uh, okay.

• 1:16:08Andrew Manganelli?

  I remember one time you saying, one of the things you really liked about the Samsung phones is that you can unlock them while the screen is off.

• 1:16:15Speaker 01

  And that's because they use ultrasonic fingerprint readers that don't need to light up the screen to see your finger. On the ones with optical fingerprint readers under the display, what they do is they, they light up a little area and then when you press that area, then it shines a bright white light just on your finger.

• 1:16:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:33Speaker 01

  And there are some phones that don't do that. So just making them all do that is great.

• 1:16:38Speaker 02

  Is this one you don't have like always on display or something?

• 1:16:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I think it's whether whether you have always on or not. I think a lot of these phones understand that people just want to unlock it right away. And so they'll have a little area indicator of where to press. But some of them don't have that area. So so you're saying Android 16 is going to make all of them that have an under display fingerprint reader. Tell you where to press and then when you press it, it'll unlock.

• 1:17:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Pixel phones currently require the screen to be on for the fingerprint scanner to function. Thankfully, this limitation will be addressed in the upcoming Android 16 update for Pixel. And that they tested in settings, security and privacy, device unlock, face and fingerprint unlock, fingerprint unlock. There's now a slider for screen off fingerprint unlock. And they said it also did work on their 6A and 7 Pro. They were using the beta.

• 1:17:25Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:17:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay. Which I've realized I didn't know was even a thing until I remember you mentioning it and I use it on my S24 all the time now.

• 1:17:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:33Speaker 02

  I was gonna say, I didn't know that was a thing because mine just does that. But I think it's because I have always on display on, so it is like always.

• 1:17:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Your Pixel does?

• 1:17:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, the screen never actually turns off. So there's always an area to like touch my finger and turn it on.

• 1:17:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 1:17:46Speaker 01

  Yeah. Nice. That's a good, it's a good feature. It's a good feature.

• 1:17:50Andrew Manganelli?

  And it's good that they're adding it back and not pretending it can only happen in the newest phones.

• 1:17:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:17:54Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:17:55Speaker 02

  Interesting.

• 1:17:55Speaker 01

  And do you have a crown?

• 1:17:57Speaker 02

  Uh, my crown was going to be. I had three, but I'm just gonna pick one because I thought it was gonna be pretty unanimous and none of you guys picked it. So I'm gonna pick the top one. I'm going with the Pixel 9A. That came out this month.

• 1:18:10Speaker 01

  Did it?

• 1:18:12Speaker 02

  Did it?

• 1:18:12Speaker 01

  Oh, it's in April.

• 1:18:14David Imel?

  It got moved to April.

• 1:18:15Speaker 01

  That's the thing about.

• 1:18:15Speaker 02

  Well, that's fair. Yeah. Okay. All right, then I'll go to my backup. The Sigma BF.

• 1:18:21Speaker 01

  Ooh.

• 1:18:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:18:22David Imel?

  The Sigma boyfriend.

• 1:18:23Speaker 02

  That thing is so, I still can't stop thinking about it. It is completely impractical, but so cool.

• 1:18:29Speaker 01

  The evolution of the coverage of this camera online has been so fun to watch because it started off as like, what, what is Sigma doing? They made this really weird camera with no card slot and it's also all metal and doesn't look ergonomic. And then it shifted to. Yeah, this is kind of what Apple would have done if they made a camera. It's really pretty. And it is a Sigma camera and it's not that expensive. And then people got their hands on the camera and started shooting with it and using it because of all the attention. And suddenly it's like, okay, it doesn't have a viewfinder, but it is kind of fun to shoot with. And it does have a couple decently useful features. And suddenly it's like, this is kind of a friendly, like fun camera.

• 1:19:04Speaker 02

  And the pictures are good.

• 1:19:05Speaker 01

  And the pictures are solid. So it's like, it went from being kind of novelty and quirky weird headline to suddenly an option for people to actually buy in the last couple of months.

• 1:19:15David Imel?

  Can't really use it outside when it's bright outside.

• 1:19:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, no viewfinder, no card slider. Still has weird quirks. Yeah.

• 1:19:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:19:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:25David Imel?

  But it's so freaking fast.

• 1:19:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. And also those, the eye series lenses, they're super affordable and feel insanely premium. And also affordable is still a few hundred dollars, but in the lens world, it's super affordable.

• 1:19:38David Imel?

  Come on.

• 1:19:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:19:40David Imel?

  What are we talking about here?

• 1:19:41Speaker 02

  So that's mine.

• 1:19:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Pretty cool.

• 1:19:42Speaker 02

  That's my.

• 1:19:42Andrew Manganelli?

  You said the silver version. I would agree with you, but you left it vague.

• 1:19:46David Imel?

  The silver is also really hard to film, especially outside.

• 1:19:49Andrew Manganelli?

  It looks everything. It looks so good.

• 1:19:51Speaker 02

  I'm not, I like, personally, I like looking at the silver one more. I think it's beautiful. But if I were to buy one, I'd probably would just get the black.

• 1:19:58Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:19:58Andrew Manganelli?

  Same.

• 1:19:59Speaker 02

  I'm not walking around with that giant silver block hanging around my neck.

• 1:20:02Andrew Manganelli?

  I would only buy that if I wanted everyone to see that I had it. So I would buy the silver one.

• 1:20:06Speaker 01

  You say that. I think that's where I started when I was looking at this camera. I was like, oh, there's a black one, but you have to get the silver one. That's the whole point of this camera. Now I'm like, if I was really going to shoot with this.

• 1:20:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, like if you were actually going to buy it.

• 1:20:18Speaker 01

  I'll get the black one.

• 1:20:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:20:19David Imel?

  I get the silver.

• 1:20:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Silver, team silver. You're both wrong. It's fine.

• 1:20:24Speaker 01

  Interesting. Okay.

• 1:20:25David Imel?

  I think the image quality is so good.

• 1:20:26Speaker 01

  So our crown options are our first South by Southwest success live show. Gemini live, looking through your camera.

• 1:20:36Speaker 02

  Android 16 fingerprint.

• 1:20:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Fingerprint unlock.

• 1:20:39Speaker 01

  Fingerprint unlock toggle and.

• 1:20:42Speaker 02

  Thank you, David.

• 1:20:44Speaker 01

  And Sigma BF. Mirrorless camera.

• 1:20:47Andrew Manganelli?

  How about we do this? We know the winner is all voting for ourselves at South by Southwest. So let's pick the second winner.

• 1:20:54Speaker 01

  I agree with you. That's a good thing to do.

• 1:20:56Speaker 02

  That's why I was like, damn it, David.

• 1:20:58Speaker 01

  I would pick actually useful AI on your phone. I think that's gotta be it. I would pick that, too.

• 1:21:04Speaker 02

  Damn, I was gonna stick with my Sigma BF, but I guess I'm outvoted.

• 1:21:08Andrew Manganelli?

  I think I'll go, I think the AI is the most useful and the most reasonable for most of our listeners, too.

• 1:21:14Speaker 01

  That is cool.

• 1:21:14Andrew Manganelli?

  My heart wants to pick the Sigma BF.

• 1:21:16Speaker 01

  The Sigma is pretty, and I do, I do.

• 1:21:19Speaker 02

  It's where your heart leads.

• 1:21:20Speaker 01

  This is, yeah, the Sigma BF and the GFX100RF had like very.

• 1:21:25Speaker 02

  That was my third option.

• 1:21:26Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. They had very intense conversations online. And we don't get that intense of a conversation, especially about a camera, that often. I think especially the BF had even more conversations, so.

• 1:21:39Speaker 02

  And who really convinced me about it was Veeran at The Verge.

• 1:21:41Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:21:42Speaker 02

  He posted his like videos and his pictures. I was like, oh, man.

• 1:21:44Speaker 01

  His photos are.

• 1:21:46Speaker 02

  In the hands of someone who's capable, this thing was doing work.

• 1:21:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, his photos are awesome. I might actually switch to the BF.

• 1:21:52Speaker 02

  Oh, let's go. Montmarquez.

• 1:21:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Considering Adam voted for the AI.

• 1:21:57Speaker 01

  We've been getting like, we've been getting the Gemini, like it's been slowly being upgraded like continuously for like so long. Yeah.

• 1:22:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I ask you a question? How often are you using it? And can you give me a few examples of how you're using it? That's always mine.

• 1:22:12Speaker 01

  Sure, I pointed it at a bird in my yard the other day and I said, what is that? And it told me what kind of bird it was, because it looked kinda weird and I was like, what kind of bird is this? Did you fact check that? Uh, I think I Googled that name of a bird later and it was right. Okay. Um. That bird is uranium 53. I pointed it at a, I, okay, so it doesn't have to be pointed at one thing. I scanned the entire room of all the gym equipment and then asked me, what can I do with this equipment? And it told me a bunch of different workouts with all the different things. What kind of smoothie can I make with this gym equipment? Yeah, so like, you know, the demo when you have the Apple, the glasses on and look at something and it tells you what to make from those ingredients? You can just point it at four or five things and then ask it the question and it will do it.

• 1:22:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Can it do multimodal on your screen? Like it can see what's on your screen?

• 1:22:56Speaker 01

  It can see what's on your screen.

• 1:22:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Can you open it right now and ask you why your RCS messages aren't going through?

• 1:23:02Speaker 01

  Ooh.

• 1:23:03Speaker 02

  Whoa.

• 1:23:03Andrew Manganelli?

  If it solves that, I think it's automatic winner right now.

• 1:23:06Speaker 02

  That's an automatic winner, I think.

• 1:23:07Speaker 01

  There we go.

• 1:23:08Andrew Manganelli?

  There's zero chance it does.

• 1:23:10Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 1:23:11Speaker 01

  Also, is this the Sigma boyfriend or the Sigma Becca Versace? Let's try this. So you can see this screen with a text message conversation. The message is not delivering, and I think it's an RCS issue. Can you tell me what the problem is?

• 1:23:27Speaker 08

  Okay, I see what's going on. The message says, "Message delivers when David is online." And there's a button to "Switch to Text (SMS/MMS)". That means you're trying to send a message using RCS, but David isn't online or doesn't have RCS enabled.

• 1:23:42Speaker 01

  Wrong.

• 1:23:42Speaker 08

  If you switch to SMS/MMS, it'll send as a regular text message.

• 1:23:47Speaker 01

  So here's the thing, David does have RCS, and so do I, so there must be some other issue.

• 1:23:52Speaker 08

  Okay, since you both have RCS, let's try a few things. First, make sure your mobile data or Wi-Fi is on, as RCS needs internet. If that doesn't work, try restarting your phone.

• 1:24:07Speaker 01

  I don't really want to restart my phone. I also have tried that before.

• 1:24:13Speaker 08

  Okay, I understand.

• 1:24:18Andrew Manganelli?

  All right, secret B.

• 1:24:20Speaker 01

  We're pretty far from AGI, my friends.

• 1:24:22Speaker 02

  I don't know, now I'm in on the AI.

• 1:24:25Speaker 01

  It tried.

• 1:24:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Valently tried.

• 1:24:26Speaker 02

  I can see that you have a problem.

• 1:24:30Speaker 01

  I can see that.

• 1:24:31Speaker 02

  In his defense, none of us could figure it out. I understand why that might upset you.

• 1:24:36Speaker 01

  I've also pointed it at a YouTube video, and it read the title of the video and told me what the video would be about, so I didn't have to watch it. Was it about that?

• 1:24:42Andrew Manganelli?

  That's terrible.

• 1:24:43Speaker 01

  It was, right. Yeah, but it's just...

• 1:24:44Andrew Manganelli?

  We're gonna go under.

• 1:24:45Speaker 01

  It's good at a lot of things, that's all I'm saying. How does it handle clickbait that's not about what the title is? Because it knew the video. It didn't just look at the title, it knew the video. Whoa, really? Yeah. So there's just a lot of things. Matter of fact, I'll just pull up this drone deliveries video we just did and see if it can tell me what this was.

• 1:25:01Speaker 02

  While you do that, there is someone on, I think, Twitter who's been replying to our auto posts about the video going live, and it at's a bot that does exactly this. And it'll take the video, summarize it in like a paragraph or two.

• 1:25:15Speaker 01

  So I've got it on my screen right now, right? People just don't want to undo anything anymore. Tell me what this YouTube video is about. That's why I watch it 2X speed.

• 1:25:23Speaker 08

  That looks like Marques Brownlee's video about the truth of drone deliveries. Did you have any questions about it?

• 1:25:30Speaker 02

  What was his conclusion?

• 1:25:33Speaker 08

  His conclusion was that while drone delivery is technically impressive, it's not as practical or widespread as some people think. He pointed out limitations like battery life, weather restrictions, and regulations that make it difficult to implement on a large scale.

• 1:25:46Speaker 02

  That's both right and...

• 1:25:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. Yeah, that's a good guess.

• 1:25:50David Imel?

  Also, many people in our Indian audience have told us that drone delivery is actually quite popular in India, which is...

• 1:25:55Speaker 02

  In all of India, because India's huge.

• 1:25:58David Imel?

  I would not know.

• 1:25:59Speaker 01

  There are some countries that were coming to the top of the comments. Ghana's another one that I was like, yeah, we do that a lot here. Hmm. Yeah. Anyway. If I can't sway you guys on that, I think I could switch to Sigma.

• 1:26:10Andrew Manganelli?

  I think we might have to go Sigma BF.

• 1:26:11Speaker 01

  Alright.

• 1:26:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Is the crown.

• 1:26:13Speaker 01

  Alright, Sigma BF's crown.

• 1:26:14David Imel?

  Sigma, of course it's gonna change.

• 1:26:17Speaker 01

  Now we'll do our clown of the month of March 2025. Anyone wanna take first dibs? First, first takers?

• 1:26:27Andrew Manganelli?

  Adam's going, okay.

• 1:26:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:26:29Speaker 02

  So, have you guys seen the Saratoga water guy?

• 1:26:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes.

• 1:26:33Speaker 01

  Dude, clown, crown for sure.

• 1:26:35Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:26:36Speaker 01

  Crown.

• 1:26:36Speaker 02

  No, how is that a crown?

• 1:26:38Speaker 01

  Because he, for, I've never seen a post...

• 1:26:42Andrew Manganelli?

  You have to explain this.

• 1:26:43Speaker 01

  I've never, yeah, what is it? First of all, what is the video?

• 1:26:46Speaker 02

  So, it's like a video of a guy who's getting up at like 3 or 4 in the morning. No, I think it's like 3 in the morning or something like that. And he's going through his like epic morning routine, but there's always Saratoga water in the shot, or he's using it for like dumping his face in it with ice or something like that. And he's drinking it. The, the stock rose like 17% just off of this guy going viral or something.

• 1:27:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Maybe the YouTubers do have an effect on the stocks.

• 1:27:13Speaker 01

  This was a, this was one of those cringey, uh, daily routine videos.

• 1:27:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:27:18Speaker 01

  That this guy, I wanna find out what his name was.

• 1:27:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Ashton Hall.

• 1:27:21Speaker 01

  Ashton Hall. He did, he does a bunch of these, and this is a whole genre online, but it's basically, picture the, the stereotypical like guy who wakes up at 3:30, dumps his face in ice water, does a workout, takes some work calls, has a whole day done by noon, eats healthy food, does everything perfectly, and you're like, wow, okay, whoop-de-doo this guy's...

• 1:27:41David Imel?

  Meditates.

• 1:27:42Speaker 01

  This guy's doing this most unrealistic thing ever. To me, it's a crown clearly for two reasons.

• 1:27:47Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:27:47Speaker 01

  Convince me.

• 1:27:48Speaker 02

  It's in this pool.

• 1:27:49Speaker 01

  One, this guy is self-aware and is playing into it and is successfully getting a lot of views. I have never seen a post on Twitter get 600 million views.

• 1:28:02Speaker 02

  What?

• 1:28:03Speaker 01

  Until this one.

• 1:28:04David Imel?

  Are you sure that's real and not just like impressions?

• 1:28:07Speaker 01

  Well, it's, I've never seen 600 million impressions on Twitter either.

• 1:28:10David Imel?

  This says it's up to 742 million.

• 1:28:12Speaker 01

  I've never seen anything get that many. And two, because now everyone's talking about it and the company, which let's be honest, is probably associated with him in some way.

• 1:28:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:28:22Speaker 01

  Is getting a lot of free and...

• 1:28:24Speaker 02

  I don't know that he is.

• 1:28:24Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't think they are. I think it's just like, I think he just picked a water that's like a more, like it's a water that makes no sense to brush your teeth with and wash your face with.

• 1:28:33Speaker 01

  It's expensive water.

• 1:28:34Andrew Manganelli?

  It's like, nice, for reference, this is super niche to know this and to be a Top Chef watcher. But for like 20 seasons, Top Chef was sponsored by San Pellegrino, which is I'm sure a bottled water company you've heard of. The last two or three seasons, now their big sponsorship is Saratoga Spring Water, which is this. What this guy has done for Saratoga Spring is 10x what Top Chef has ever done for this. And they're spending hundreds of thousands, if not millions of dollars.

• 1:29:00Speaker 01

  Agreed. And now everyone's parodying it too. And they're buying the same water to do the parody videos. That is a huge crown as well.

• 1:29:06Speaker 02

  My thing is, I, I know that now he's definitely aware of it and he's capitalizing on it.

• 1:29:11Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:29:12Speaker 02

  I'm thinking back to how this started. Did he do this intentionally? Or did he just have the water there while going through a real legit morning routine?

• 1:29:22Speaker 01

  I'll let you in on a little secret.

• 1:29:25Speaker 01

  There...

• 1:29:26Speaker 02

  Oh, God.

• 1:29:26David Imel?

  Oh, God.

• 1:29:27Speaker 01

  Remember when I told you guys, there's like tons of different genres on YouTube? Like there's the, there's the Apple unboxing YouTube channel. There's the, you know, every little, there's the I Only Modify, Classic Porsche's YouTube channel.

• 1:29:37David Imel?

  Uh-huh.

• 1:29:38Speaker 01

  There are also lots and lots of inspirational YouTubers who just do routine videos. This is my makeup routine. This is my morning routine. If you go on YouTube, you will find endless of these videos. And as that got more and more popular, you got more and more extreme versions of it. The Huberman versions of this where they're just like, I wake up at 3 o'clock in the morning and I write down my daily affirmations and I do an hour of yoga. And then I do a cold plunge and then I eat my second breakfast.

• 1:30:06Speaker 02

  Were you watching me this morning?

• 1:30:07Speaker 01

  Like that's, that's, that's a real... Genre of YouTube is unrealistic, unrealistic daily routine videos.

• 1:30:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:17Speaker 01

  This one happened to catch fire and go viral, but I will tell you now, it is not unlike many hundreds of others that I unfortunately have seen. This guy found just the right combination of parody and self-awareness to be like, does this guy really think that this is realistic? Like, I think he nailed this video and that's how he got 700 million views in a week and why we're all talking about it. And I think everyone else in this genre on YouTube is like, damn, this guy got it.

• 1:30:46Andrew Manganelli?

  I think there's a 50/50 of this of, I think he does do a lot of inspirational stuff, but is going in on the meme. Cause like, there's a part where he like wipes his face down with a banana peel.

• 1:30:57Speaker 01

  Nobody does that and doesn't think this is gonna go viral.

• 1:31:01Andrew Manganelli?

  I think he par- he turned parts into parody for sure. And then he posted a picture of like his shopping cart, it was just like, "Seratutter Spring Water and Bananas." It's like, you all know what this is for.

• 1:31:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. I think there was not one second that this guy wasn't like thinking, how can I make this get a lot of views? Cause he's made a lot of these in the past.

• 1:31:20Andrew Manganelli?

  So you think this was like premeditated?

• 1:31:22Speaker 01

  I think so. And I think he, I think that is why it's like, it's more of a crown than a clown, in my opinion.

• 1:31:28Andrew Manganelli?

  We'll never know, but if, if that's the case, I'll agree. But I don't know. It seems like this trend needs to go away already. That's where I'm at.

• 1:31:37Speaker 02

  It'll be gone by the time.

• 1:31:39Speaker 01

  It's gonna be a meme for like three weeks, probably.

• 1:31:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Anyway, what was your guys' clowns?

• 1:31:44Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:31:45Andrew Manganelli?

  There's two real big ones that I know will be said that are.

• 1:31:49Speaker 01

  You guys thinking that that video matters?

• 1:31:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Does someone wanna go next?

• 1:31:55Speaker 01

  I have a clown.

• 1:31:56Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay.

• 1:31:57Speaker 01

  My clown is the Dodge Charger EV.

• 1:32:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh.

• 1:32:01Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:32:03Speaker 01

  It's a

• 1:32:04David Imel?

  I was thinking about that.

• 1:32:05Speaker 01

  We have talked about this. It's the electric car that makes lots of loud noises like a gas car, but isn't as fun.

• 1:32:12David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:13Speaker 01

  That one.

• 1:32:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's, that's my clown.

• 1:32:15David Imel?

  It's a pretty good one.

• 1:32:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. Only 240 miles of range.

• 1:32:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you want to go or do you want me to go?

• 1:32:21Speaker 01

  Eighty-six grand for a charger.

• 1:32:23David Imel?

  Eighty-six.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  Come on.

• 1:32:25Andrew Manganelli?

  But it makes a fun noise.

• 1:32:26Speaker 01

  Need I go on?

• 1:32:27David Imel?

  I think you should go because I'm still thinking.

• 1:32:29Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, I think there's two pretty big stories and one of them is 23andMe going bankrupt and selling all of our DNA data to the highest bidder. Feels like a giant clown.

• 1:32:40David Imel?

  Wait, did they sell already?

• 1:32:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Not yet.

• 1:32:42David Imel?

  They did not sell yet.

• 1:32:43Andrew Manganelli?

  They haven't sold, but it's up for sale and that's

• 1:32:45Speaker 01

  That's a problem.

• 1:32:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Feels

• 1:32:47Speaker 01

  I should delete my account.

• 1:32:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, that feels super bad. I think there are some articles out there on how to like get as much as you can off of that as possible, but it, you know, sending your DNA into one of those from the start didn't ever seem like a good idea and now it kind of is really proving that.

• 1:33:03David Imel?

  But um, counterpoint. I was

• 1:33:07Speaker 01

  It was cool.

• 1:33:08David Imel?

  I was 18 and I thought that the tech industry was not going to become what it is.

• 1:33:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, what's the old Google saying?

• 1:33:15David Imel?

  Don't be evil.

• 1:33:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Don't be evil.

• 1:33:17David Imel?

  I think my clown is that I was not able to make it to the atmosphere conference this last weekend, which is the AT Protocols first conference for Blue Sky.

• 1:33:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Leave it up to you to somehow turn this into David's so on brand.

• 1:33:32David Imel?

  Stuck in pride. I couldn't make it to Seattle in time.

• 1:33:36Andrew Manganelli?

  You were willing to make yourself the clown.

• 1:33:40David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:41Speaker 01

  I vote for that.

• 1:33:41David Imel?

  Actually, I was the clown because I bought one of those insanely cheap tickets that you cannot change. And I only found out about the conference that I could go after I bought the tickets. And I would have had to pay a thousand dollars to get

• 1:33:55Speaker 01

  That is clown worthy.

• 1:33:55Andrew Manganelli?

  You hate to see it.

• 1:33:56David Imel?

  Yeah. Clowning myself.

• 1:33:57Andrew Manganelli?

  When you're flying United by any chance?

• 1:33:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, you've reminded me of another clown.

• 1:34:03David Imel?

  Well, I guess we'll always take the opportunity to clown on a airline.

• 1:34:07Speaker 01

  There is a story, I don't know if you saw this on Twitter, apparently, and this was corroborated. There was a flight that took off from LA on the way to China, and then two hours into the flight, it turned around and flew back, diverted to San Francisco because the pilot forgot his passport.

• 1:34:21David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:21Speaker 01

  And I just want to be a fly on the wall for the moment that he had to announce that to everyone, because he flew for two hours. Everyone thought, alright, time to post up, relax, chill. And then the plane starts doing that like turnaround thing, and starts going back and had to go, "Hey, uh, hey, everybody, we got to..." Yeah, that must have been the worst in-flight announcement of all time.

• 1:34:44David Imel?

  The thing too is that you can't say, there's some, you can't like, cover it up and say there's something wrong, because you're already over the Pacific Ocean.

• 1:34:51Speaker 01

  No, you just gotta own it.

• 1:34:52David Imel?

  You're gonna freak everyone out.

• 1:34:53Speaker 01

  And for the next two hours, and when they landed and everybody got off the plane, they all just went, "Mmm." And everyone got a $15 meal voucher, that was their result.

• 1:35:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Two meal vouchers.

• 1:35:04Speaker 01

  Sorry, two $15 meal vouchers, which is for sure better than one.

• 1:35:08David Imel?

  True.

• 1:35:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I'm gonna say United Airlines, or at least that pilot in that moment qualifies for the clown.

• 1:35:14David Imel?

  Bummer town.

• 1:35:15Speaker 01

  It's gotta be.

• 1:35:16David Imel?

  Who among us has not forgotten our passport, though, let's be real?

• 1:35:18Speaker 01

  I did once.

• 1:35:19David Imel?

  Really?

• 1:35:20Speaker 01

  Luckily, I had enough time, and this is extremely rare, to go back home, get it, and go back to the airport.

• 1:35:25David Imel?

  I had the same thing happen.

• 1:35:26Speaker 01

  It's crazy.

• 1:35:27David Imel?

  Yeah. Um, what was I going to say? I don't remember.

• 1:35:32Speaker 01

  So yours is flight-related clown?

• 1:35:34David Imel?

  Mine is a flight-related clown.

• 1:35:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:37David Imel?

  Yeah. But, the AT Protocol Conference did happen, it's called the Atmosphere Conference, I think it's super cool, and I will be at the next one.

• 1:35:44Speaker 01

  Is it annual?

• 1:35:45David Imel?

  As long as I don't buy a cheap ticket.

• 1:35:46Speaker 01

  Annual?

• 1:35:47David Imel?

  Hopefully.

• 1:35:48Speaker 01

  You gotta wait another year?

• 1:35:48David Imel?

  Yeah. How about, oh, how about the Pixel 9A?

• 1:35:54David Imel?

  That was supposed to come out.

• 1:35:55Andrew Manganelli?

  That was pretty.

• 1:35:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, but the thing is, we're never gonna find out why.

• 1:35:59David Imel?

  Yeah, they said a potential component issue.

• 1:36:01Speaker 01

  Which could be any of the components.

• 1:36:03David Imel?

  And to be, to be fair, it's better to delay a product if you've caught something early than to release it and have it go wrong.

• 1:36:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, we don't know how careful they're being. We don't know if it's like, hey, 10 of them exploded, or if it's like, oh, one of the vibration motors was a little bit weird and we had to replace them all. So I have no idea what severity of the issue is. But they've addressed it before shipping or taking pre-orders, and I think that's actually a good thing.

• 1:36:26David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:26Speaker 01

  But, yeah, we don't know what the thing is.

• 1:36:28David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it's selling our DNA to the highest bidder.

• 1:36:34Speaker 01

  But they haven't done it yet.

• 1:36:36David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:37Andrew Manganelli?

  They're trying.

• 1:36:38David Imel?

  Oh, they will.

• 1:36:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, they're, yeah.

• 1:36:40David Imel?

  I need to delete my data.

• 1:36:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Everyone on here should look that up.

• 1:36:43Speaker 01

  I did a, I did an ancestry.com one a long time ago, and ever since then, they have consistently emailed me anytime someone gets added to my family tree, meaning someone else takes a test, and it turns out they're related to me.

• 1:36:53David Imel?

  Yeah, in any way.

• 1:36:54Speaker 01

  And sometimes it's someone that I know. It's like my dad's cousin or something, and it'll be like, oh, your dad's cousin. I'm like, oh, super cool. I got one the other day that said, "Second cousin once removed." And I don't know what that means, so I just archived it and moved on.

• 1:37:10David Imel?

  My crown is that I thought I had to unplug and replug my car in, but when I unplugged it, it was already at 95%.

• 1:37:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Nice.

• 1:37:16Speaker 01

  Oh, you're good.

• 1:37:17Andrew Manganelli?

  Best thing that happened in all month.

• 1:37:19Speaker 01

  Imagine if your car had a Fratsonic exhaust.

• 1:37:23David Imel?

  Clown?

• 1:37:23Speaker 01

  A Fratsonic chambered exhaust. 126 decibels.

• 1:37:28David Imel?

  Ooh.

• 1:37:29Speaker 01

  Rumbles your car from the inside. Are the speakers good? No. But they're loud.

• 1:37:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I love how competitive Mark has is. He just lost the crown vote by a hair.

• 1:37:43David Imel?

  I need this one.

• 1:37:44Andrew Manganelli?

  I'll vote for Charger EV, although I'm pretty sure hundreds of millions of personal data getting sold is pretty bad.

• 1:37:51David Imel?

  I, that's worse. That's 100%. I'm voting for that, dude.

• 1:37:53Speaker 01

  I can't vote for it until it happens. As soon as it happens, I'll be on your side.

• 1:37:57David Imel?

  Yeah, but.

• 1:37:57Speaker 01

  But we have to give them the benefit of the doubt. All they did was file for bankruptcy, and then every tech company went, "Does that mean that X company could buy it? That would be horrible, and it would, but it hasn't happened yet."

• 1:38:07David Imel?

  I feel like there's like.

• 1:38:08Speaker 01

  If they're for sale, someone will.

• 1:38:10Andrew Manganelli?

  There's way too many tech companies building their, like. Random offshoot LLC or whatever, so they can buy without it just being like meta bought the 23

• 1:38:19David Imel?

  Oh my god. That would be the end times.

• 1:38:22Speaker 01

  Paint me a picture, what's the worst that could happen?

• 1:38:25Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know enough about it, but.

• 1:38:26David Imel?

  Find your DNA, they give it to people you don't want them to give it to. And then they know everything about you.

• 1:38:35Speaker 01

  But it's not associated with me.

• 1:38:37Andrew Manganelli?

  It's your DNA. It literally is your association.

• 1:38:40Speaker 01

  It wasn't the thing that it's not like individually associated with.

• 1:38:43David Imel?

  Yeah, but my question.

• 1:38:44Andrew Manganelli?

  What I thought that was confusing about.

• 1:38:45David Imel?

  That's confusing is like, then how do I log into my account and see my specific traits then? Cause it.

• 1:38:50Andrew Manganelli?

  They're saying that I think.

• 1:38:51Speaker 01

  You can see your traits, but you can't see the data that is your DNA like showing you the surface. They're surfacing information from the DNA that they analyzed.

• 1:39:02David Imel?

  So people could, but if they, the people they sold it to could see my traits.

• 1:39:05Speaker 01

  They could see your traits.

• 1:39:06David Imel?

  So then they know that I'm likely to grow back hair.

• 1:39:09Speaker 01

  Whatever it tells you, they maybe can see that. I don't even know if that's true, but I don't think they can see your

• 1:39:15Speaker 01

  literal DNA.

• 1:39:17David Imel?

  Why would that? I don't know.

• 1:39:19Speaker 01

  What do you have to hide in your DNA?

• 1:39:20David Imel?

  I don't know dude. Look, there are so many times in the tech industry where I thought that it couldn't be that bad. And every time it's even worse. That's just, I just, you know?

• 1:39:32Speaker 01

  Somebody bought my DNA. What's the worst that could happen?

• 1:39:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Marquez is really trying to win this charger EV.

• 1:39:42David Imel?

  Here's, here's an article. What's, here's the worst that could happen if your DNA data is exposed.

• 1:39:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Here it goes, eyes open.

• 1:39:50Speaker 01

  23andMe's bankruptcy has some consumer advocates warning customers of the DNA testing company to delete their accounts. Here's why.

• 1:40:00David Imel?

  I just took a DNA test. Turns out 23andMe went bankrupt and sold my DNA.

• 1:40:06Speaker 01

  Chapter 11 doesn't change how it's stored or guarded as data. Any buyer will have to comply by law. The problem is the applicable laws are incomplete and don't cover this emerging industry. For example, employers can't make hiring decisions based on genetic test results.

• 1:40:24David Imel?

  Yet.

• 1:40:26Andrew Manganelli?

  God.

• 1:40:27Speaker 01

  Well, that's a good law, but the law has nothing to say about applying genetic data to other forms of insurance like life insurance.

• 1:40:34David Imel?

  Boom.

• 1:40:35Andrew Manganelli?

  That's pretty bad. Hmm.

• 1:40:37David Imel?

  Dude. They're gonna charge me more for my car insurance because I grow back hair.

• 1:40:44Speaker 01

  Or like, like, health insurance.

• 1:40:47Andrew Manganelli?

  I feel like.

• 1:40:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:40:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. It's wild that there's a lot of people listening to this podcast. They'll be like, what do you mean by health insurance? What do you guys have to do over here?

• 1:40:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, that seems like a pretty straightforward law.

• 1:40:59David Imel?

  That's. Well, the health insurance thing?

• 1:41:02Speaker 01

  Can I deny coverage based on genetic profile?

• 1:41:07Andrew Manganelli?

  They'll find a way.

• 1:41:08David Imel?

  They'll find a way.

• 1:41:09Andrew Manganelli?

  This feels like the, the little like progressive thing you put in your car to see how you drive around. Except now it's just my DNA for my insurance instead. Before you drive away in this car, spit in this tube.

• 1:41:22Speaker 01

  Oh, your insurance went up. That's crazy.

• 1:41:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Alright, so I'll give you Marquez. The, you're, what are you voting for?

• 1:41:29Speaker 01

  The Frat Sonic chambered exhaust.

• 1:41:35Speaker 01

  I think that's the worst thing that happens.

• 1:41:36Andrew Manganelli?

  You really think it's worse?

• 1:41:38Speaker 01

  Have you heard this car drive by 126 decibels of, seriously dude? Every time.

• 1:41:45David Imel?

  Does the car sell your DNA to insurance companies?

• 1:41:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Doesn't say it doesn't.

• 1:41:49Speaker 01

  Worse.

• 1:41:50David Imel?

  It loops in MP3.

• 1:41:52Speaker 01

  It tells everyone that you drive by exactly who you are.

• 1:41:54David Imel?

  Oh.

• 1:41:56Speaker 01

  You know?

• 1:41:57David Imel?

  Alright.

• 1:41:57Speaker 01

  Damn.

• 1:41:57David Imel?

  Mic drop.

• 1:41:58Speaker 01

  I'm just saying.

• 1:42:01Andrew Manganelli?

  We will, we'll let the comment section vote. How about that?

• 1:42:05David Imel?

  I don't.

• 1:42:08Andrew Manganelli?

  We're gonna have to figure something out how to get a tiebreaker.

• 1:42:11Speaker 01

  The segment being we all have to agree, really, it made it hard.

• 1:42:15Andrew Manganelli?

  This version of the segment was already the most polished out of all the ones we've done so far.

• 1:42:19David Imel?

  Around here. Why aren't we just democratic?

• 1:42:21Speaker 01

  Alright, so I'm going Fratzog. Are you going Fratzog?

• 1:42:24Andrew Manganelli?

  No.

• 1:42:24Speaker 01

  Are you going Fratzog? Are you going Fratzog?

• 1:42:28Speaker 02

  Over 23 and me potentially. Okay, here's what I'll say.

• 1:42:33Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:42:33Speaker 02

  I'm gonna go the Daytona.

• 1:42:35Speaker 01

  Oh my god.

• 1:42:35Speaker 02

  Specifically because nothing bad has happened yet.

• 1:42:39Speaker 01

  That's also my logic.

• 1:42:40David Imel?

  I understand politics so much better now.

• 1:42:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:42:42David Imel?

  This is always what happens behind closed doors.

• 1:42:44Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. The April clown could be catastrophic, but

• 1:42:50Speaker 01

  here we are in March, nothing's happened yet.

• 1:42:52David Imel?

  You know, it's Marquez like, you know what? It hasn't happened yet.

• 1:42:56Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:42:56David Imel?

  April clown.

• 1:42:59David Imel?

  UnitedHealth now owns 23andme.

• 1:43:03Speaker 01

  So, yeah, I think that's my only logical argument.

• 1:43:06Speaker 02

  Here we go.

• 1:43:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:43:07Speaker 02

  I agree.

• 1:43:08Speaker 01

  Okay, hell yeah.

• 1:43:09David Imel?

  What the?

• 1:43:10Speaker 01

  Join us on the logical train, David.

• 1:43:12David Imel?

  I don't know about this. This is more like the jury duty that just wants it to be over.

• 1:43:15Speaker 01

  In fact, you should be happy that they went bankrupt because they were gonna do some crazy things with that information anyway. So they're bankrupt, that's great.

• 1:43:22David Imel?

  Let you know.

• 1:43:23Speaker 02

  They were actually doing some pretty cool things, but.

• 1:43:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:43:26David Imel?

  Disagree. Cool.

• 1:43:27Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:43:27Speaker 01

  Okay. We got them. Ladies and gentlemen, we got them. What better time to do the trivia?

• 1:43:34David Imel?

  Oh my god.

• 1:43:36Speaker 02

  All right.

• 1:43:37David Imel?

  And eraser.

• 1:43:39Speaker 02

  This is, uh, running a little long probably, but it's fine. It's fine. We'll fix it in post. So, question, oh, actually first, quick update on the score, because I forgot to do it last week. Marquez.

• 1:43:51David Imel?

  Don't tell me.

• 1:43:51Speaker 02

  With 13.

• 1:43:53David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:43:54Speaker 02

  Andrew with 6.

• 1:43:56David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:43:57Speaker 02

  David carrying the 2 with 15.

• 1:44:00David Imel?

  All right, good.

• 1:44:01Speaker 02

  Here we go.

• 1:44:01David Imel?

  I did think I was ahead by 2.

• 1:44:02Speaker 02

  Yeah. Question 1. Which of these games was not available on the PS1? A, Gran Turismo. B, Crash Bandicoot. C, Final Fantasy. D, Call of Duty: World at War. Or E, all of these were available on the PS1?

• 1:44:37Speaker 02

  Flip 'em and read, what do we got?

• 1:44:42Speaker 02

  Oh god.

• 1:44:42Speaker 01

  Okay, we are all on the same page here.

• 1:44:44Andrew Manganelli?

  No we're not.

• 1:44:45Speaker 01

  Oh, that's not the same?

• 1:44:46Speaker 02

  Yeah we are.

• 1:44:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, are we?

• 1:44:47Speaker 02

  It is the same.

• 1:44:48Speaker 01

  You said-

• 1:44:48Andrew Manganelli?

  There's an E, sorry. Okay, yeah, we all said Call of Duty.

• 1:44:50Speaker 01

  I said D, you said Call of Duty, you said David is right, we all said D for Call of Duty. I said, yeah.

• 1:44:57Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 1:44:57Speaker 01

  Ayo!

• 1:44:58Speaker 02

  Was it that easy? I thought that one was a difficult one.

• 1:45:00Speaker 01

  I was torn between C and D, I picked D.

• 1:45:03Speaker 02

  Cause Call of Duty came out on PS2, so I thought that might trip you.

• 1:45:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, but Call of Duty feels newer than all those other games.

• 1:45:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Call of Duty: World of War is the second one also.

• 1:45:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's kinda what I was hoping for.

• 1:45:13Speaker 01

  Did the first one come out on PS1?

• 1:45:15Andrew Manganelli?

  The first one was on PC only, I think. I played it on the computer.

• 1:45:18Speaker 01

  There were computers back then.

• 1:45:20Speaker 02

  What's a computer? Question two, when was airdrop announced?

• 1:45:25Speaker 01

  Airdrop, okay, I gotta think about this one.

• 1:45:27Speaker 02

  Airdrop. You will get one point for the year, two points for the month, three points for the month, day and year, four points if you could tell me all of that, plus who announced it.

• 1:45:37Speaker 01

  Here. Who announced it?

• 1:45:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:45:40Speaker 01

  Oh, the guy.

• 1:45:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:45:41Speaker 01

  Or the person.

• 1:45:42Speaker 02

  The person that announced it. Actually, I'll just make each of those things one point.

• 1:45:46Speaker 01

  Wait, hold on.

• 1:45:49Speaker 01

  Hold on, hold on, hold on, I'm still writing, can you do it again?

• 1:45:51Speaker 02

  No, flip 'em and read, David, David, David. Okay. Who wants to go first?

• 1:45:59Speaker 01

  Okay, so my logic is like- Wait, I'm such a- They had to have things to airdrop between, so I kinda tried to pick like right after the iPad came out and the other one. Shoot! So I said- Continue. I went July 2010, just to be summer 2010, and I said it was Jaws.

• 1:46:14Speaker 01

  I'm so stupid.

• 1:46:15Speaker 02

  Unfortunately, you only got one point.

• 1:46:18Speaker 01

  Okay. The year?

• 1:46:19Speaker 02

  The month. It was July.

• 1:46:21Speaker 01

  It was July?

• 1:46:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:46:22Andrew Manganelli?

  Alright, my logic was, my marker ran out of ink and I did not have a lot of time, so I wrote three things down very quickly. 2013?

• 1:46:29Speaker 02

  Nope.

• 1:46:30Andrew Manganelli?

  March, right, I know it's written, and I wrote the 17th.

• 1:46:34Speaker 02

  As who announced it?

• 1:46:35Speaker 01

  I thought we were guessing the day also.

• 1:46:37Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, if you wanted to.

• 1:46:42Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:46:43David Imel?

  Okay, look, I have to preempt this. I didn't mean what I wrote, but I guess I'm gonna have to lay it out there.

• 1:46:53Speaker 02

  Okay, what is it?

• 1:46:54David Imel?

  Clown on me. It's an iOS 5.

• 1:46:57Speaker 02

  Not a date?

• 1:46:59David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:00Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:47:02David Imel?

  Now, I'm like, oh, 2011.

• 1:47:09Speaker 02

  But what did I write?

• 1:47:10David Imel?

  Wrote 2007.

• 1:47:12Speaker 02

  It was 2011.

• 1:47:15David Imel?

  I think I just thought iPhone and I wrote 2007, but I meant to write 2011.

• 1:47:20Speaker 02

  That's unfortunate.

• 1:47:21David Imel?

  I hate myself. Was that iOS 5, right?

• 1:47:23Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 1:47:24David Imel?

  Yeah, I'm a god. Okay, so I wrote June, but...

• 1:47:28Speaker 02

  June.

• 1:47:29David Imel?

  But my...

• 1:47:30Speaker 02

  You never wrote who announced it.

• 1:47:32David Imel?

  I was also gonna write Jaws, but I didn't. But, well, he ate for breakfast that morning.

• 1:47:38Speaker 01

  Was definitely an apple.

• 1:47:40David Imel?

  Scrambled eggs. What the... Rotata.

• 1:47:42Speaker 01

  I want to petition for a point for being the closest in date, but I'll let it slide.

• 1:47:49David Imel?

  Can anyone give me a point for knowing it was 2011 but not writing it?

• 1:47:54Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:47:56Speaker 01

  Nope.

• 1:47:57Speaker 02

  The correct answer.

• 1:47:58David Imel?

  The thing is, I just thought of iPhone and I wrote 2007.

• 1:48:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, give us the correct answer, Adam.

• 1:48:02Speaker 02

  It was July 20th, 2011, announced by Phil Shiller.

• 1:48:07Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:48:08David Imel?

  Oh, yeah, Phil Shiller.

• 1:48:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:10David Imel?

  iOS 5, right?

• 1:48:11Speaker 01

  No, 7.

• 1:48:13Speaker 02

  According to Andrew.

• 1:48:13David Imel?

  Airdrop.

• 1:48:15Speaker 01

  Well, according to Google's AI overview. I assumed it was a dub dub reference, which is why I went with the summer.

• 1:48:21David Imel?

  I'm pretty sure that's wrong.

• 1:48:22Speaker 01

  Paid off. No matter what, I am one point closer to David, and that's all that matters here at the end of the day. Thank you for watching and listening. This is probably our rambliest, craziest episode in a while. But that's just how it goes.

• 1:48:35David Imel?

  We don't have Ellis to rein us in.

• 1:48:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, sometimes we don't have Ellis to rein us in, and we just go absolutely nuts. And now the comments are flaming me about lossless audio, and that's okay. Thanks for watching and listening. Catch you guys next week. Peace.

• 1:48:49David Imel?

  Goodbye.

• 1:48:50Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait For Us produced by Adam Molina and Ellis Rovin. We're part of the Vox Media Podcast Network and our track for music was created by Vane Sil.

• 1:48:55David Imel?

  Bingo. Let's go.

• 1:49:12David Imel?

  No, here, I'm asking Gemini, based on this document, which is a podcast script, what would we title the episode?

• 1:49:18David Imel?

  Flip versus fold, why not both? What about that?

• 1:49:21Speaker 02

  Flip versus fold.

• 1:49:22David Imel?

  That's just such a- And it rhymes. Based on this document, the episode should be titled "Episode 281."

• 1:49:29David Imel?

  Sick. Yo, that's not bad, dude. Damn, that's good. That is literally not the title. That might do numbers.

• 1:49:38Speaker 00

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