Episode 390 - Phone Calls from the Dead

We’re answering the phone, but this time, the call might be coming from the other side. We’re diving into the eerie history of phone calls from the dead, including early attempts to build devices that could communicate with spirits, Thomas Edison’s mysterious “spirit phone,” and the strange patterns researchers have found in reported phantom calls. Then we get into the truly creepy stuff: personal experiences of voicemails from loved ones who have already died, calls from disconnected numbers, and messages that seem to arrive with a warning or final goodbye. Watch the video version here. Have ghost stories of your own? E-mail them to us at [email protected] New Episodes are released every Thursday and Sunday at 12am PST/3am EST (the witching hour, of course). Corinne and Sabrina hand select a couple of paranormal encounters from our inbox to read in each episode, from demons, to cryptids, to aliens, to creepy kids... the list goes on and on. If you have a story of your own that you'd like us to share on an upcoming episode, we invite you to email them to us! If you enjoy our show, please consider joining our Patreon, rating and reviewing on iTunes & Spotify and following us on social media! Youtube, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, and Discord. Edited and produced by Jaimi Ryan. Original music by Arms Akimbo! Disclaimer: the use of white sage and smudging is a closed practice. If you’re looking to cleanse your space, here are some great alternatives! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Americans United for Separation of Church and State. Hey, everyone. This is Jonathan Van Ness from Getting Better. You know what you believe. Maybe your faith is at the center of your life. Maybe you're still figuring it out. Maybe religion just isn't your thing. Those choices are personal, and in America, they should stay personal. That's why Americans United for Separation of Church and State is fighting for something that affects all of us. The freedom to live as yourself and believe as you choose, so long as you don't harm others. Because religious freedom isn't just about protecting your right to practice or not. And it surely isn't about having one forced government sanctioned religion. It's about protecting your right to say, this is what I believe, while your neighbor says,

• 0:44Speaker 00

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• 1:03Speaker 01

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• 1:52Corinne Vien?

  Hi.

• 1:53Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Hello, I just got the shiveries.

• 1:56Corinne Vien?

  We can't turn on the heaters because then I get sweaty, so Sabrina just has to freeze her butt off.

• 2:02Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Hey, everyone.

• 2:03Corinne Vien?

  This is Two Girls and a Ghost.

• 2:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Two Girls, One Ghost. We are your guestesses. That's Corinne.

• 2:08Corinne Vien?

  Hello.

• 2:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I'm Sabrina. And Corinne, I just...

• 2:12Corinne Vien?

  I'm too deep into pregnancy, guys. I can barely walk.

• 2:16Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  But by the time this episode comes out, you will no longer be pregnant. You'll have a newborn, and you'll have your hands full in a different way.

• 2:22Corinne Vien?

  Once upon a time, we're like, oh, we should always... Because we usually record like two episodes in one day. And we're like, oh, we'll do outfit changes so it like feels different on video and stuff. And I was like, I can't do an outfit change, but it doesn't matter because I have three shirts that fit me and have for months. So it's like, what am I gonna do? Just change into the same Noah Khan or like the...

• 2:40Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  The main sweatshirt.

• 2:41Corinne Vien?

  The main sweatshirt or the like, where the weirdos are shirt. That's it. And this one.

• 2:47Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You've got your staple uniform. It's your capsule wardrobe.

• 2:50Corinne Vien?

  I realized how bad it was when I was looking back at some of our videos and I was like, oh, my God, this wasn't even recorded on the same day. And it's just like me in the same shirt over and over and over and over and over again because it's like I have three outfits.

• 3:02Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I know.

• 3:03Corinne Vien?

  And I can't balance this on my... And I'm man spreading and I just like, I smell.

• 3:08Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You don't smell.

• 3:09Corinne Vien?

  I smell myself. I've been smelling something and I think it's me. And I'm also bent not to like, you know how like people's houses all smell? How like have a certain smell? This house was a very strong smell when we moved in. We had the floors refinished and we painted all of the walls to try to...

• 3:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Change it up?

• 3:28Corinne Vien?

  Change it up. And I feel like it did enough for a long time, but for the past like six months, the smell has been creeping back in. And over the past couple of weeks, it is like potent to me, like even while I'm in the house. Because normally you get used to a house's smell and you like can't smell it.

• 3:44Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And when you walk back in, you get it?

• 3:46Corinne Vien?

  When you walk back in, you're like, whoa. I'm like, this house freaking reeks. So gross.

• 3:51Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Because I feel like your house has a good smell and I always like, I think it smells to me like your hand soap in the bathroom.

• 3:59Corinne Vien?

  The bathroom is one of the stinkiest spots right now.

• 4:01Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I love that soap smells so much.

• 4:04Corinne Vien?

  No, but it doesn't smell like...

• 4:05Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Maybe I just keep getting licks of it.

• 4:07Corinne Vien?

  Because like that area, I'm like, okay, I understand why that one would be a little stinkier because like the brick, like you can only...

• 4:12Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Do so much.

• 4:13Corinne Vien?

  Do so much to like get a smell out of a giant brick wall. You know, my house reeks.

• 4:18Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Maybe it's a ghost that has a smell and it's hanging out with you. Maybe that's why your leg hurts. They're hebacking on you right now.

• 4:25Corinne Vien?

  It's my hip. My hip went out of place like three days ago and I literally...

• 4:32Corinne Vien?

  It's a we... Like you came in, you set up the whole studio. I heard you say hello, but I was only halfway down the hall. I was like, I can't even... I'm not gonna respond to you because it's gonna be another 15 minutes before you even see my face. Anyhow, pregnancy is brutal. My house is stinky.

• 4:47Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  No.

• 4:48Corinne Vien?

  And I do actually, oh.

• 4:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  What? You have a ghost story?

• 4:51Corinne Vien?

  Well, I told... Didn't I tell you that the other day I thought Brian was coming into...

• 4:55Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 4:56Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. But I was saying that on Campfire Stories yesterday when you had food poisoning. Sorry. So Sabrina couldn't make it. So I did it solo and I was... What was on my brain? What was I gonna say?

• 5:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You were telling the story about Brian, hearing Brian go into the...

• 5:14Corinne Vien?

  Oh, okay. But it happened during Bronwyn's story, which Bronwyn has a bunch of like amazing hauntings. And she was telling a story about how her grandfather had come and interrupted. Like she accompanied one of her friends to a psychic reading. And her, she overhears like behind the like door or whatever, her friend being like, no, that doesn't relate to me. No, I don't think so. And Bronwyn's sitting there being like, oh, my God, this is my grandfather coming through. And her grandfather basically like interrupted and hijacked the whole reading.

• 5:41Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Crashing the whole session.

• 5:42Corinne Vien?

  And so she ended up getting like the whole reading from her grandfather.

• 5:44Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's so funny.

• 5:45Corinne Vien?

  It made me think of like when I gave birth to Noah, all of the stuff that happened after and me thinking that it was my Uncle Dicky and me thinking that it was my grandpa Bob and just like all of that sort of stuff. And she gave the name of the woman who she's gone to now three times. And she said every single time is like dead accurate, super spot on. And so I think I might book a reading because after that experience the other day where I heard Brian walk up the stairs, the baby gate open and close, and then our bedroom doors start to open and then no one came in for 30 minutes until Brian actually came up.

• 6:19Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You want to know who it is?

• 6:20Corinne Vien?

  I'm like, I think that this is starting. I think the family members are back.

• 6:24Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  They're moving in.

• 6:25Corinne Vien?

  And I need someone to tell me who it is.

• 6:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  They're starting to nest.

• 6:28Corinne Vien?

  They're nesting.

• 6:29Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And you're recording the podcast.

• 6:32Corinne Vien?

  They're taking my mobility away from me in the worst possible week because my nesting this time was renting a dumpster to throw out my whole house and it's here and I haven't been able to do anything because I can't move.

• 6:41Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Oh, man.

• 6:41Corinne Vien?

  Anyhow.

• 6:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Ghosts are moving into Corinne's house.

• 6:45Corinne Vien?

  I think I'm gonna book the reading and I'll let you know if...

• 6:47Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay, how it goes.

• 6:48Corinne Vien?

  How it goes.

• 6:49Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  What you find out?

• 6:50Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 6:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay. Please send us all your recommendations for psychics and mediums.

• 6:54Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 6:54Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Because we...

• 6:55Corinne Vien?

  There's so many and it's hard to know, like...

• 6:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  There's someone local that my hairdresser told me about.

• 6:59Corinne Vien?

  Oh, really?

• 6:59Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Like Steven, Psychic Steven or something like that. And I was like, ooh, we should maybe, we should reach out to Steven.

• 7:03Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, we should. The hard thing is just like sometimes we get recommendations and obviously these are people's careers. They have to make money.

• 7:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 7:09Corinne Vien?

  But like sometimes I'm like, oh, my God, that's incredible. I need to book a session. And then I'm like, oh, I don't think I can afford to book a session. But we'll see, we'll see.

• 7:18Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And then I just send Letha a text message and be like, hey, I feel weird. Can you do a reading for me? And then she sends me like 40 minute voice notes and I'm like, okay, wow, I have a whole podcast to listen to. Anywho.

• 7:28Corinne Vien?

  Anywho.

• 7:29Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Ghosts, they're here.

• 7:30Corinne Vien?

  Okay, so recent... And we have a ghost themed episode today.

• 7:34Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  No, we do? Surprise, Two Girls and a Ghost, ghost themed episode.

• 7:39Corinne Vien?

  Recently, I did the things caught on baby monitors. And it just reminded me of stories that we have heard from just like various research and then also just from encounters where people will get a phone call.

• 7:53Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  We did an encounter recently.

• 7:54Corinne Vien?

  Yes, phone calls from the dead. And then I told you right before this that I had to get up early this morning to redo my research because I'd written a bunch out and I kept being like, God, this is so familiar. God, I feel like I've heard this story before. As I'm like pulling stories from online and then I realized we covered this topic back in episode 281. So there's a lot more stories. If you like this theme, you can go back to episode 281.

• 8:19Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 8:20Corinne Vien?

  And hear ones I wrote and then deleted and chose different ones to tell today.

• 8:25Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Now we have new ones today.

• 8:26Corinne Vien?

  Now we have some new ones. The dead are calling and they have a message for you.

• 8:30Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Ring, ring, ring.

• 8:31Corinne Vien?

  Hello? Hello? This is your Uber driver? You're six minutes late when I'm driving away.

• 8:38Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  They wouldn't call and tell you that. They just leave.

• 8:41Corinne Vien?

  This is your DoorDash? Your Jersey Mike's is here. That's more realistic for us. Okay, so to begin, we're gonna do history, which I don't even think I did back in episode 281.

• 8:51Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay.

• 8:51Corinne Vien?

  How did we get the telephone?

• 8:54Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  First long distance phone call was made in Salem, Massachusetts to, or Boston to Salem, at Turner's Seafood.

• 9:00Corinne Vien?

  There we go. More facts. I didn't even write that one in. So there you have it. Okay, so phone was invented by Alexander Graham Bell, which we all learned way back in the day in school. He's cited as being the first inventor of the telephone, being the first to pass the patent for it, and making the very first telephone call in 1876. Though there were a few people, I think, working on like the same concept at the same time. But how exciting. People can

• 9:23Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  They were putting together soup cans with string.

• 9:25Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 9:25Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And then it evolved.

• 9:27Corinne Vien?

  God, I really hope kids still do that these days. That was so fun.

• 9:30Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's the first phone.

• 9:31Corinne Vien?

  That is the first phone. But for a while, like, so even when the phone first existed, this was, this was like a fancy thing. People just didn't have phones in their homes. Like, it was for businesses and then, like, rich people, basically. Definitely a luxury for a long time. But post-World War II, in the 1950s, telephone networks started to expand. There are more landlines being installed, and this became more of a standard household item. So the 1950s kind of marked the threshold of when it became

• 10:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  More accessible.

• 10:00Corinne Vien?

  Over 50% of the people having a phone in their home.

• 10:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay.

• 10:05Corinne Vien?

  In their private residence. That really was like one singular phone. It's like, it's in

• 10:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  A landline.

• 10:10Corinne Vien?

  It's a landline connected to the kitchen or living room or like some communal space. Everyone's sharing it.

• 10:15Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 10:15Corinne Vien?

  One singular phone, and it would be that way for a long time.

• 10:18Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:19Corinne Vien?

  Cell phones started being a thing in the 1990s and early 2000s, but it really wasn't like a popular thing for everyone to have until, I don't know, I got my first cell phone in like 2007, and I feel like I was pretty early on. And we were getting like the like first editions of some of the cell phone companies.

• 10:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I got mine early because my sister, so I think I was seven and my sister was nine because

• 10:38Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, you did get yours really early.

• 10:39Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It was a buy one, get one free situation, and my sister did a lot of figure skating, so she'd be at the ice rink by herself a lot.

• 10:46Corinne Vien?

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 10:47Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  My parents wanted to buy them, and then I got one and I just did brick. Or snake. It was snake, snake, yeah.

• 10:53Corinne Vien?

  Snake was so good. I'm trying to remember my very first cell phone, like what it even was.

• 10:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Mine was like a block, and then it had a case that you could change the color of like on top.

• 11:03Corinne Vien?

  Oh, oh my gosh, do you remember that? Oh, you used to walk through the malls and the like middle kiosks would just have like bejeweled and different designed cell phone cases to snap on.

• 11:13Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And then you could put things on the antennas.

• 11:15Corinne Vien?

  Whoa, you just fully unlocked a memory for me. I totally forgot about that. That was so fun.

• 11:21Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I know.

• 11:21Corinne Vien?

  Ah, and then you'd get your, you'd have to buy like ringtones, but like the ringback tones where like when people call you, they get to listen.

• 11:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  My one friend, L'Oreal, still has a ringback tone. I don't know, and she doesn't even know either. She's like, I never

• 11:33Corinne Vien?

  What's the song?

• 11:35Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  True Call or Find Out?

• 11:36Corinne Vien?

  Yes. Oh, my gosh, what a time capsule.

• 11:39Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 11:40Corinne Vien?

  Early cellphone days were great because it was very limited. It was basically call your friend and play snake.

• 11:45Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's it. Um, you know what I really wanted to do, or I had the decision and inspiration to do last night while I was in bed, is bejewel my Zolaft. Like the pill bottle.

• 11:56Corinne Vien?

  Your pill bottle?

• 11:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 11:57Corinne Vien?

  And then you just, every time you get a refill, you just put it in your

• 12:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah, put it in my bejeweled

• 12:01Corinne Vien?

  That is incredible. I love that. That's so funny.

• 12:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That will be my summer project. While you're with a newborn, I'll be bejeweling all my medication.

• 12:10Corinne Vien?

  You could sell it.

• 12:10Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Make it cute.

• 12:11Corinne Vien?

  Actually, that's probably illegal.

• 12:13Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Well, I could sell the bottles.

• 12:14Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, that's true.

• 12:15Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Who wants your medication bejeweled? There's probably an Etsy for that already.

• 12:19Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. Anyway, I'll also say that phone communication's been around for 150, if I do that math right, something like that, 150 years or so, but it certainly didn't take that long for spirits to figure out how to communicate on phones.

• 12:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Mm-hmm.

• 12:34Corinne Vien?

  So back in the day when spiritualism was, I almost said was a thing, it's still a thing, but like was more like mainstream, popular-ish. Spiritualists started to claim that spirits could manipulate certain technology and soon to be like a phone to communicate. So it started out with messages using Morse code, like there can be like tapping, and we actually covered in episode 281 a Morse code communication.

• 12:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay, very cool.

• 12:58Corinne Vien?

  I won't repeat it here. You can go back and listen if you're curious about that. So starting out with like tapping in Morse code, but like would evolve to some of the other technologies, like a cell phone being communication device with the dead. So from 1920 to 1921, a medium named Francis Grierson claimed to use a psychophone. He was a psychic medium, and he was basically saying that he was using this phone to have this special phone to have conversations with spirits on the other side, and they would be famous spirits. I didn't write them down. There's a big list of them, but like Abraham Lincoln, it was a bunch of, yeah, a bunch of famous ones, but also a bunch of just like regular people that he made contact with.

• 13:35Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  But if he's a psychic, what's the difference between just like normal psychic communication and this phone communication?

• 13:40Corinne Vien?

  Well, that's a great question. I'm, I'm not really sure. But anyway, he published the transcripts of these conversations, and it does deviate a bit from the characteristics that we're going to talk about, like fit the mold of what like a traditional contact from the dead via a phone looks like, because his conversations were extensive.

• 13:58Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Hmm.

• 13:58Corinne Vien?

  And so this inspired some people to try to create phones to talk to the dead. So there was another psychical researcher named F. R. Melton, and he designed and built a psychic telephone. It had a headset that connected to like the transmitter box and all that. Yeah, like a spirit box, but inside of the box

• 14:18Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I don't know, what is it?

• 14:19Corinne Vien?

  Was a balloon filled with the breath of a psychic medium.

• 14:28Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  No.

• 14:28Corinne Vien?

  How much does he pay someone to breathe into his balloon?

• 14:31Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Amazing.

• 14:32Corinne Vien?

  Isn't it? I was like, this has to be fake. That's so weird.

• 14:35Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I love that so much.

• 14:37Corinne Vien?

  It might have been like misconstrued over different articles and periods of time.

• 14:41Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  What? No, that's, I mean

• 14:43Corinne Vien?

  There's a balloon in the middle, and he has psychic mediums. Fill them up.

• 14:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Listen, invention starts somewhere.

• 14:52Corinne Vien?

  It does. Who, who's to say that that wasn't actually the missing component?

• 14:56Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I love that so much.

• 14:58Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, people are interested in this, right? Like, that's the whole point. People are trying to create these devices. Still today, people are creating devices to try to

• 15:05Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 15:06Corinne Vien?

  capture the voice of the dead. Another person who was interested in this was Thomas Edison.

• 15:11Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Of course.

• 15:12Corinne Vien?

  Gave us the light bulb. Thanks, Tom.

• 15:15Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Good old Tommy boy.

• 15:16Corinne Vien?

  Tommy boy.

• 15:17Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Love to be light.

• 15:18Corinne Vien?

  He announced that he was working on a spirit phone. Some articles said it was a spirit phone, others said it was a necrophone, so I don't know what he himself was calling it.

• 15:28Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 15:28Corinne Vien?

  But he was working to create a telephone to make contact with the dead. And he basically, like his pitch or his like thinking was that if he could create this telephone using a particular valve, this valve could amplify and detect subtle particles that he believed were surviving remnants of a human's personality. It's a little confusing, so I'm not really sure if he thought he was like talking, if it was going to be like you can talk to the dead, or if there's just like lingering energy

• 15:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Which, what's the difference?

• 15:58Corinne Vien?

  In the idea of a person.

• 15:59Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right. Isn't the dead a spirit lingering energy in a way?

• 16:03Corinne Vien?

  Right, but it's almost like, was it active communication, or was he just capturing like what's left over floating through space? I don't really know. But yeah, that's what he said he was gonna do. He was gonna create this device. That's what was gonna happen. And it was published in a very popular magazine, and people were so excited about it. And like, you'd think a lot of people would be like, oh, my God, like you've lost your mind. You must have been electrocuted too many times, Thomas Edison. But no, this was coming off of World War II, and so a lot of people

• 16:30Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Want to talk to their

• 16:32Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, there were a lot of losses. They're like looking for comfort. Here's this guy who's this like well-known inventor, and he's kind of giving this like glimmer of hope that one day someone could hear their loved one's voice again.

• 16:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right.

• 16:43Corinne Vien?

  Unfortunately, from what I could find, this, this phone did not work out for Thomas Edison. He didn't come up with a phone. It didn't come to fruition. But you don't need a phone specifically built to communicate with the dead to communicate with the dead.

• 16:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  No, you don't.

• 16:57Corinne Vien?

  So there's a silver lining. Public recognition of the phenomena of spirits making contact through phones begins, or public recognition begins more in the 1970s. So before it was like kind of conversations here and there, you'd lose interest, or like spiritualist movement would bring something up, and then, but it would, it would dwindle. It wasn't like this like steady thing. But then in September of 1976, there was a letter published in Fate magazine, and Fate magazine was like a paranormal-y focus magazine.

• 17:24Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay.

• 17:25Corinne Vien?

  This letter came from a man named Don B. Owens of Toledo, Ohio, and he wrote in with his story. He said he had a close friend named Lee Epps, and they grew up in the same neighborhood, but in adulthood, Lee had moved away from the neighborhood, and so they're still friends as adults, and they would catch up occasionally over phone. On October 26th, 1968, at 10:30 PM

• 17:47Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Close to Halloween.

• 17:48Corinne Vien?

  Very close to Halloween.

• 17:49Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Veil is thinning.

• 17:50Corinne Vien?

  Absolutely. So it's 10:30 PM, and the phone rings at Don's house. He's not home, so his wife Ethel picks up the phone, and it's Lee on the other side. And he seems really sad, and he seems really distressed, and he said, sis, tell Don I'm feeling real bad. Never felt this way before. Tell him to get in touch with me the minute he comes home. It's important, sis.

• 18:12Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It's really scary.

• 18:13Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. The phone call ends, and Ethel is like, oh, my gosh, like what is happening to Lee? I'm concerned. So she tries calling him back to be like, are you okay?

• 18:20Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  What's going on?

• 18:21Corinne Vien?

  What's going on? He doesn't pick up. She keeps trying, doesn't pick up. Don comes home finally, and she tells him about the phone call.

• 18:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 18:28Corinne Vien?

  And he's like, I'm super concerned, immediately picks up the phone, tries to call his friend Lee, nobody picks up.

• 18:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Oh, no.

• 18:34Corinne Vien?

  They're stressed, and I think it's like an entire day, basically, that passes, like all night and into the day, when finally they make contact with someone in Lee's family. And it turns out he, Lee, had been in a coma in a hospital. He wasn't even at home. He was in hospital. And he had died that night that he had called them. And his time of death was 10:30 PM.

• 18:56Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So literally like

• 18:57Corinne Vien?

  When the phone call happened. Yep. So this story, I know, I have chills thinking about it. This story is published in the magazine and two parapsychologists, D. Scott Rogo and Raymond Bayless, both take a bunch of interest in this like phenomenon. So Scott actually worked for Fate Magazine and he worked with the Psychological Research Foundation in Durham, North Carolina, and the Division of Parapsychology at Mammonides Medical Center in Brooklyn, New York.

• 19:24Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 19:25Corinne Vien?

  He was also a skeptic. So it was like, he was super into it, but like researching like what it could possibly be. It's not a paranormal explanation, like what is happening that's grounded in reality and science.

• 19:36Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  But those people I feel like want to believe in the paranormal the most.

• 19:39Corinne Vien?

  I feel like they all end up

• 19:40Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Being the biggest believers.

• 19:42Corinne Vien?

  Having something happen where they're like, okay, I guess.

• 19:44Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Can't ignore it anymore.

• 19:46Corinne Vien?

  Okay. So that was Scott's background and Raymond was a researcher and author with extensive experience researching and chronicling paranormal and psychic phenomenon or phenomena, sorry. So the two team up and they start looking into this topic, like communication with the dead through phones. Was this something that other people had experienced? Was Lee the first person to make a phone call to his friend from the other side? Only two years it took them and they had a book published of 50 cases called Phone Calls From the Dead.

• 20:17Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Wait, I want to read this book.

• 20:18Corinne Vien?

  You can get it still.

• 20:19Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That would be fun.

• 20:20Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. So yeah, this was something that people certainly had experienced. So with the publication of this book, other people started to take interest. And of course, when it comes to any bit of research, skeptics come along, they try to scrutinize and debunk it. That's normal with just like, I feel like any bit of scientific

• 20:37Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yes.

• 20:37Corinne Vien?

  advancement, not just paranormal, but the conversation was happening, though it wasn't like this electric topic that took over the whole world again, right? Like it was kind of a niche thing, but somewhat mainstream at the same time. So thousands of people are starting to come forward with stories and study this phenomena. But the whole topic isn't really, like people are doing things individually, but it's not really revisited again in like a big group setting until 2012, when a young psychologist at the University of Northampton in England named Dr. Callum Cooper found this book that these two other researchers had published after two years of research. He found it in his university's parapsychology collection, read it.

• 21:20Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  To just be perusing the parapsychology collection and be like, ooh, look at this fun aside.

• 21:25Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. Yeah. So 2012, he's like looking, he reads it and then he's like, oh my God, I am so obsessed with this topic. So he's like,

• 21:34Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You and Corinne Callum, the two of you together.

• 21:36Corinne Vien?

  Phone calls from, it's so fascinating. So he spent years conducting new interviews, researching the topic, applying modern psychological practices to his research, and then publishing his findings in a book called Telephone Calls From the Dead. So he continued with the research. So in his book, there's some 100 additional cases presented.

• 21:58Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  2012, it's much easier to get like in touch with people and hear people's stories.

• 22:02Corinne Vien?

  Totally.

• 22:03Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 22:03Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. I mean, like blogs on the internet, like people are sharing things.

• 22:07Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 22:07Corinne Vien?

  But in all of the cases that he has found, plus the cases that Scott and Raymond have found, there begins to be like a very clear pattern to exactly what's happening. And I think Scott and Raymond had presented this sort of like, here's the MO of the ghosts who are making these calls. And then Callum's research basically was confirming like all of that. Damn.

• 22:30Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Americans United for Separation of Church and State. Hey everyone, this is Jonathan Van Ness from Getting Better. You know what you believe. Maybe your faith is at the center of your life. Maybe you're still figuring it out. Maybe religion just isn't your thing. Those choices are personal and in America, they should stay personal. That's why Americans United for Separation of Church and State is fighting for something that affects all of us. The freedom to live as yourself and believe as you choose, so long as you don't harm others. Because religious freedom isn't just about protecting your right to practice or not. And it surely isn't about having one forced government sanctioned religion.

• 23:10Speaker 00

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• 24:02Speaker 04

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• 24:32Corinne Vien?

  So what are the similarities?

• 24:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah, what's the MO?

• 24:35Corinne Vien?

  Okay. So the MO, the first is voice quality.

• 24:38Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay.

• 24:39Corinne Vien?

  In almost every case, the phantom caller's voice sounds very distant. It sounds like they're very far away. Some people have described it sounding like they're underwater. And also another thing that isn't with every single case, but a lot of them is like as the conversation is starting to wrap up or the message being delivered is, is coming to an end, the voice becomes even more distant. Like it's like fading away.

• 25:01Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah. Wow.

• 25:02Corinne Vien?

  So it's like staticky. It's kind of hard to hear, but you can still make out

• 25:07Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  What's important and what's trying to be said.

• 25:09Corinne Vien?

  And you can recognize the voice. The second is the duration of the call. So it's always pretty quick, never more than a few minutes. And the moment someone remembers to bring attention to the fact that this caller has passed away, the call ends. So if you ask any questions or if you bring up like, how are you, how are you talking to me? Or are you okay? Or like, who were you with or whatever? Any recognition about them being on the other side, boom, call ends.

• 25:36Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay. So if you get a call from a loved one on the other side, do not ask questions. Just let them deliver their message.

• 25:41Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 25:41Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Tell them you love them.

• 25:43Corinne Vien?

  And third, the message is usually some sort of warning, like for the person to be careful or some sort of reassurance, like that they're okay and saying goodbye, but like usually because that person is having a really hard time moving on.

• 25:58Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right.

• 25:58Corinne Vien?

  And so it's less of like the person's spirit saying that for their own closure and more of like

• 26:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  For you.

• 26:05Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. They, they feel like they have to wrap it up for you.

• 26:08Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Which is very nice.

• 26:09Corinne Vien?

  Yes. The fourth pattern is that these calls frequently come from phones that have been disconnected. So it's like a call from someone's dad and the cell phone has been disconnected for 12 years and the cell phone has no battery and the cell phone's sitting in your drawer in your bedroom.

• 26:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Or you try to call the number back and it says like, this number doesn't exist or has been disconnected.

• 26:32Corinne Vien?

  It's been disconnected. That is exactly what happens. Also, the caller ID will often come up as a specific known number, even if they're not calling from that number. It's like the caller ID will either say like dad or like whoever it's, even if it's not authentically coming from that number.

• 26:48Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Interesting.

• 26:49Corinne Vien?

  It will identify the caller as the spectral person who's calling in.

• 26:53Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Wow. Didn't we have at one of our live shows, was it New Orleans, when in the middle of the show, someone's phone series said calling mom and like their mom had passed away like years prior and it was the anniversary or something like that.

• 27:07Corinne Vien?

  It was in New Orleans.

• 27:08Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah. I can't remember the specific details, but yeah.

• 27:10Corinne Vien?

  I like remember the venue and I remember where she was sitting.

• 27:12Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And she came up to us afterwards and said,

• 27:14Corinne Vien?

  And the light also started flickering like at the same time. The like spotlight like right on her and other people were drawing attention to it, being like, do you see this?

• 27:21Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 27:21Corinne Vien?

  Oh yeah.

• 27:22Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So special.

• 27:23Corinne Vien?

  So yeah, it is interesting because like the number itself or the phone line has been disconnected. So there's no way for it to be able to ring through in the first place.

• 27:32Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Mm hmm.

• 27:32Corinne Vien?

  Yet it does. So I have chosen, provided by the internet and various bloggers and other people out there, a few real life stories to share.

• 27:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And I have a couple from our listeners, too.

• 27:44Corinne Vien?

  Hell, yes. Okay. Again, back in episode 281, there are a few more examples in that episode of different calls from the dead, but-

• 27:53Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  We also did haunted phone numbers, like back early days.

• 27:56Corinne Vien?

  Oh, yeah.

• 27:56Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And that also-

• 27:57Corinne Vien?

  I feel like you were getting a bunch of, weren't you getting a bunch of calls from-

• 28:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I can't remember if I was, but I think a lot of listeners after that episode were getting weird ass calls.

• 28:06Corinne Vien?

  Mm hmm.

• 28:08Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So go back, I don't remember what episode that is. Jamie, maybe you know, and if you do, it will be in the bottom of the video. But if-

• 28:14Corinne Vien?

  It's hard, there's been so many episodes. That's why when I was first researching this, some of them, I was like, did I bring this up in the third Man Syndrome episode? And I was like, no.

• 28:21Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 28:22Corinne Vien?

  And I like couldn't figure it out. And then I realized, oh, I literally have an episode called like Calls From-

• 28:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  From the Dead.

• 28:27Corinne Vien?

  Dead, or From the Other Side.

• 28:29Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I remember that, that was a good one.

• 28:30Corinne Vien?

  Oh, well, thanks. So 281, if you want to hear the researched one, we have a recent encounters.

• 28:36Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 28:37Corinne Vien?

  All about calls from the dead and a bunch more sprinkled throughout the past eight some nine years.

• 28:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Nine years.

• 28:43Corinne Vien?

  Nine years, I guess, after this has already come out. All right. We are going back to 1969, Montclair, New Jersey.

• 28:49Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Oh, hey, Jersey, what's up?

• 28:51Corinne Vien?

  Is it Montclair right by you?

• 28:52Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It's close, yeah.

• 28:53Corinne Vien?

  Okay. So New Jersey rock musician named Carl Uphoff, I think he was a teenager at the time that this story happened. He receives a phone call from his grandmother.

• 29:02Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay.

• 29:03Corinne Vien?

  And now this is very strange because his grandmother was deaf. So she very rarely used the phone because she was deaf enough that like she couldn't hear or like make conversation over the phone. It's not to say she never used the phone. She did occasionally and it would be like, they were very close. I'm not sure if he was living with her at the time. It was kind of unclear based on like some of the retellings of this. But at least, at the very least, he would frequent her house and like visit with her. So she had the numbers of his friends. She like generally knew where he was. And so it wasn't completely out of the ordinary for every once in a blue moon for her to call one of his friends. And just if the receiver, like if the call picked up, she would just say, is Carl there? This is his grandmother. If so, can you tell him to come home?

• 29:46Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right.

• 29:47Corinne Vien?

  And then hang up because she wouldn't be able to like-

• 29:48Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Hear the response.

• 29:49Corinne Vien?

  Hear the response.

• 29:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 29:50Corinne Vien?

  So it was more of like her way of delivering a, like a voicemail via live-

• 29:54Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Sure.

• 29:54Corinne Vien?

  Interaction. But anyway, so that part is odd. Even more odd, his grandmother passed away two days before.

• 30:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I would say that's the most odd.

• 30:02Corinne Vien?

  That's probably the most odd. So why are you getting a phone call from your grandmother?

• 30:05Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yes.

• 30:06Corinne Vien?

  In this moment, he did not realize he was getting a phone call from his grandmother.

• 30:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay.

• 30:09Corinne Vien?

  He was at his friend's house. They were in the basement. I think they were like, like-

• 30:14Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You know, doing middle, uh, high school teenage things.

• 30:16Corinne Vien?

  I think they were like literally practicing in their bands. Like I think they were, it was like a music-

• 30:20Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  In the heat of the moment.

• 30:22Corinne Vien?

  Like a basement band situation.

• 30:23Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 30:24Corinne Vien?

  So his friend's mom comes down and says, Carl, you have a call. So he goes up the stairs and he picks up the phone. And immediately he recognizes that it's his grandmother's voice, which is bizarre because again, she has passed away.

• 30:38Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Two days ago.

• 30:39Corinne Vien?

  She almost never, she would never ask to talk to him because she wouldn't be able to hear his response anyway. But she starts talking to him and he recognizes her voice. And it's only a very short period of time and I'm not exactly sure what she said because it wasn't written anywhere. But Carl asked where she was and then the call ended.

• 30:58Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Hung up.

• 30:59Corinne Vien?

  Oh. And for the next several days, he would keep getting calls from his grandmother. But anytime he asked a question like, where are you? What's it like on the other side? Are you okay? The call would end immediately after.

• 31:12Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Every day this was happening.

• 31:13Corinne Vien?

  It made it sound like it happened for a few days.

• 31:16Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Wow.

• 31:16Corinne Vien?

  Like probably like three or four days.

• 31:18Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah, sure.

• 31:18Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, it was multiple calls.

• 31:20Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's wild.

• 31:21Corinne Vien?

  It's not like it's a time when he has a cell phone or anything like this is lamb, uh, she's tracking him down and getting-

• 31:27Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 31:27Corinne Vien?

  In contact with him. Okay. So then in 1995, we're now in Liverpool, England. There's a radio station that often features this medium named James Byrne. And he would take calls live over the radio. People would call in asking to make some sort of like connection to a loved one. And he would basically do like live mediumship on the radio. It was a very popular segment. Yeah. And it would happen like late at night, not super late. I think it was-

• 31:51Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 31:52Corinne Vien?

  Whatever, like a 10 o'clock show or something like that. But anyway, it was a popular segment. A ton of people would call in. And on this particular night, there was a woman who went by the name Mrs. Wilson in the retellings of this. And she called in and she had hoped that she would make contact with her grandfather who'd passed a year prior and see if her grandfather had any messages for her. Only she didn't actually get to talk to the psychic James. Because when she called in, it was kind of like calling in for like American Idol in the early days where like it's a busy tone and you say you call like 40 times to like cast your singular vote or whatever. So like she didn't actually get through. And so she's like, okay, ton of people are calling in. That was my hope tonight. But like, maybe I'll try a different night. So she just like sits back and relaxes and starts to listen to the show as it begins.

• 32:35Corinne Vien?

  And like callers are, are actually getting through to James, the psychic medium. And as she's listening, her home phone rings. When she picks up and in the distance, it's this like very faded voice that says, look, love, I'm all right. It's great over here. I'm with your grandmother and all the nice people who've passed on. Right?

• 32:55Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Literally.

• 32:55Corinne Vien?

  Me too. Chills. Oh. And she is like, oh my God, that sounds like my grandfather. She goes, granddad, is that you? And he responds, yes, it's him. He's looking over her. He wants her to focus on living life in the present and not looking back and reminiscing too much about him. And to tell all of the kids that he loves them. And then he says, bye. And that was that. She couldn't hear him anymore. It was like the phone call didn't end, but it was just kind of like static and downward voice. And his voice was starting to trail off like more and more distant as he was talking.

• 33:28Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So special.

• 33:29Corinne Vien?

  I know. And also just like proves that even if you don't get the opportunity to talk with someone or like use some sort of communication device to like actually get in contact with who you're trying to reach out to, that like they know that you are.

• 33:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 33:42Corinne Vien?

  Okay. So this sounds amazing, but like at the time, this woman, even though she's hearing her grandfather's voice and she thought this and no one else knew that she had called in, she's still like, this can't be happening.

• 33:52Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right.

• 33:53Corinne Vien?

  So she thinks it's a, a super cruel prank.

• 33:55Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Which it would be a super cruel prank if it's a prank.

• 33:58Corinne Vien?

  Oh, absolutely.

• 33:58Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 33:59Corinne Vien?

  So immediately she punches in whatever the number is in the UK to like basically do the callback.

• 34:05Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 34:05Corinne Vien?

  Call back the number that just had called you. And whatever the automated message is, she, she basically gets told by this like automated receiver that the phone number cannot be connected because it's her phone number. It was like she received the call from her own phone.

• 34:21Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's what happened with my grandma, when my grandpa died. It was her number with the number like seven in front of it or something like that.

• 34:27Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 34:29Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's wild.

• 34:30Corinne Vien?

  So yeah, how can you call yourself? You can't, but the spirits can. All right. The next example of a mysterious phone call. It's one that when I was writing it, I was like, this sounds so familiar. And I looked back and I don't believe that I had covered it in the previous one. So I don't know if we've covered it again in a different episode, or if maybe I just had read it when I was previously researching.

• 34:51Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Either way, I'm sure it's great.

• 34:52Corinne Vien?

  So either it's going to be your first time or not hearing this, but we're going to revisit it again. So we're back in England and it's the late 1980s. And there's this woman in Manchester, her name is Sadie, and she had just recently lost her husband. And it was very sad and it was very tragic. Um, she had a seven year old daughter, Abigail. And so it was just really tough on them. And so-

• 35:12Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Of course.

• 35:12Corinne Vien?

  They decided, Sadie decided that she was going to move her and Abigail out of their family home. Try to start somewhat fresh somewhere else where like it's, the pain isn't immediately there. And so they end up moving to a different town and renting this beautiful old cottage.

• 35:29Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Sounds lovely.

• 35:30Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. It's very cheap, like way too cheap. And so there was like a small amount of suspicion about how cheap it was, but it also wasn't the best, like most kept up with property. So there was definitely some things that like, they were doing some deep cleanings. Sadie was definitely trying to like get the property, like feel a little more homey and, and shining and new.

• 35:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 35:50Corinne Vien?

  This was like a wonderful little retreat. And so her and Abigail, Sadie and Abigail, her daughter are living there. And three months after moving, Abigail comes inside and says that she saw this kind old woman in a long black dress, standing under the willow tree. Cause there's also like a lake on the property or like a pond, standing under the willow tree, just smiling at her and waving.

• 36:13Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Kind old lady.

• 36:14Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. Or sorry, I don't think the woman waved. I think she was just standing there smiling.

• 36:17Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Abigail probably.

• 36:18Corinne Vien?

  Seven year old Abigail.

• 36:19Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Was like, hi.

• 36:19Corinne Vien?

  Waved and said that as she was waving, the woman just faded away. So she's telling her mom Sadie this and Sadie actually immediately believes Abigail because Abigail was not a kid who just like would tell these fanciful stories from her imagination. They had gone through a lot, like she just was not- This was, if she said something, it was factual and true and it happened.

• 36:40Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Also, let's make it normal to believe your children.

• 36:43Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 36:44Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Maybe?

• 36:44Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. And also, like, you moved into a house that was dirt cheap and

• 36:47Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 36:48Corinne Vien?

  an area that you're not super familiar with.

• 36:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Why not?

• 36:51Corinne Vien?

  It probably haunted. So I think that's what Sadie was thinking. She was like, oh, we might have just moved into, onto college. All right, like, whatever. But doesn't think much more of it. So fast forward some time and one evening, Abigail, seven-year-old Abigail, starts to feel really dizzy and sick. And Sadie's like, oh, gosh, you must be coming down with something. Why don't you go to bed early tonight and try to like, sleep it off, get a little extra sleep? So she tucks her daughter, Abigail, into bed, goes through her own, like, nightly routine, has a little extra time because she's child free for like, another hour or two. And then finally, around 10 o'clock, she goes into bed, sleeps into bed, turns on her bedside lamp, opens up her book, and she's reading. 11 o'clock PM. There's a knock on the door.

• 37:34Corinne Vien?

  And she's like, what the hell? If it were me, I would never would have gone downstairs, but thank God.

• 37:40Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Oh, like on the front door, not her bedroom door?

• 37:42Corinne Vien?

  No, no, no.

• 37:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Like the front door. Okay.

• 37:44Corinne Vien?

  Because they were not expecting any visitors. They didn't really know many people around here. Yeah, it's late. It's not a super popular populated area. They're just like renting here. So she is like, who is knocking on my door at 11 PM?

• 37:56Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 37:57Corinne Vien?

  Very cautiously, she goes downstairs and with the door still closed, she asks like, who is that? Like, who's there?

• 38:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 38:04Corinne Vien?

  And the person who responds, it's like the, an older male voice, and he says that he is a doctor and that he's here because he received a call for a home visit.

• 38:15Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Wait, a real doctor?

• 38:16Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, a real doctor. And she's like, wait, what? And he was like, I received a call to come look or do an examination tonight of a little girl named Abigail? And so Sadie's like, what? And she cracks open the door and she sees this older man who has a briefcase. He's totally dressed as a physician. And he's like, oh, are you the mom, Sadie? And like, says the last name. No Sadie's full name. And she's like, yes. And so she's, ah, I'm chills. She's spooked, but like, he is not acting in any particular way for her to feel

• 38:45Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right.

• 38:45Corinne Vien?

  alerted. So she

• 38:46Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  He seems like a safe person.

• 38:47Corinne Vien?

  Yes.

• 38:48Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 38:48Corinne Vien?

  She ends up fully opening the door and letting this guy in, bringing him up to Abigail's room, waking up Abigail, and he does an examination.

• 38:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 38:58Corinne Vien?

  And when he's looking at Abigail and like, taking in all of her symptoms, he notices that she has this rash and mixed with all the other symptoms. He's like, here's the thing, like, there's a chance that this could be meningitis, and I think you need to go to the hospital.

• 39:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So like, thank goodness. Oh, my God, wait, I love this.

• 39:13Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. So Abigail and her mom, Sadie, go to the hospital, and she did have meningitis. And if it had gone untreated for much longer, she very likely would have died. And it was all because

• 39:25Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Someone.

• 39:25Corinne Vien?

  this physician received a phone call from a house that no one called from, giving the identification and a patient's name and the mother's name.

• 39:35Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I love that.

• 39:36Corinne Vien?

  And calling urgently for a home visit to check on the health of the little girl.

• 39:41Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Did the physician say he spoke to like, a woman or something?

• 39:44Corinne Vien?

  It wasn't in the

• 39:45Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  This reminds me so much of, uh, Lorraine Warren told us this about when she was growing up in the Conjuring House. The like, duo paranormal investigators who came to the house had received a call from Caroline. Wait, I, wait, no, I said Lorraine Warren. Um, why am I blanking on her name?

• 40:03Corinne Vien?

  Oh, uh,

• 40:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Andrea Perrin.

• 40:05Corinne Vien?

  Well, I'm almost like, we should have brought her to the

• 40:06Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 40:07Corinne Vien?

  Guys, there's so many people.

• 40:09Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That Caroline Perrin, which was Andrea's mother, had called these paranormal investigators and asked them to come investigate the house, but no one ever called them.

• 40:18Corinne Vien?

  No. And didn't she say, like, it sounded like when they heard Caroline's voice, they were like, oh, no, it was you?

• 40:23Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It was you. Yeah.

• 40:24Corinne Vien?

  But it wasn't. It was something mimicking her voice to bring attention to the house.

• 40:28Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Wanted them to come.

• 40:29Corinne Vien?

  Oh, my gosh. Yeah. So I don't know the details of the actual, like, phone call and stuff.

• 40:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Was it the old lady or was it the dad who had passed, the husband who had passed away?

• 40:38Corinne Vien?

  See, I never even considered that. I just immediately thought it was

• 40:41Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  The nice old lady.

• 40:42Corinne Vien?

  The nice old lady who was waving at Abigail and like, checking in on her.

• 40:45Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Either way, very protective, good, haunting.

• 40:47Corinne Vien?

  Yes. A spirit made a phone call to save a little girl's life.

• 40:51Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Wow.

• 40:51Corinne Vien?

  And with that, I conclude this episode. A few extra stories that we have.

• 40:56Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Don't worry, it's not over.

• 40:57Corinne Vien?

  No, but you have multiple from listeners.

• 41:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I do. And I pulled three because one of them's super short.

• 41:03Corinne Vien?

  But it is kind of, like, I love this topic because it's a nice thought that even, it's so like, morbid of me, but I keep the most recent voicemail from everyone who's ever given me a voicemail.

• 41:14Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 41:15Corinne Vien?

  Just so I'd have like, the most recent recording of their voice should something ever happen. And I feel like a lot of people, like, that's what you want. Like, you, you want to hear your loved one's voice one more time. But it is so nice to think that, like, you might, but like, it's not just a, a voicemail. Like, it's

• 41:30Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right. You can actually get a call.

• 41:32Corinne Vien?

  Contact.

• 41:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Well, I have, um, that phone call from my grandma of her saying, happy birthday, Alexis, because she had called my number instead of my sister's number. But so every year on my sister's birthday, I send her that voicemail.

• 41:44Corinne Vien?

  So nice.

• 41:46Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Americans United for Separation of Church and State. Hey, everyone. This is Jonathan Van Ness from Getting Better. You know what you believe. Maybe your faith is at the center of your life. Maybe you're still figuring it out. Maybe religion just isn't your thing. Those choices are personal, and in America, they should stay personal. That's why Americans United for Separation of Church and State is fighting for something that affects all of us. The freedom to live as yourself and believe as you choose, so long as you don't harm others. Because religious freedom isn't just about protecting your right to practice or not. And it surely isn't about having one forced government sanctioned religion.

• 42:26Speaker 00

  It's about protecting your right to say, this is what I believe, while your neighbor says, I believe something completely different. And honestly, that's the whole point. If that sounds like the kind of America you want, learn more at au.org slash getting better. Because your beliefs are yours and theirs are theirs.

• 42:49Speaker 01

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• 43:18Speaker 04

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• 43:48Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So this first story is from our listener, Amanda, and I love it because it's called, "An Otherworldly Visit From My Mass Hole Dad."

• 43:59Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay. Hello, my favorite madams of the macabre. My name is Amanda. I'm a Boston native now, a Pittsburgh transplant, and I have become obsessed with your podcast. I've always been a creepy kid, and I'm writing to tell you an experience I had after my dad's sudden passing in 2022. Massachusetts will always be home, and the community for us weirdos is strong here, even allowing me to open an alternative bakery doing pop-ups at metal shows. I'm also in a band, a bit of an artist, flighty as fuck, forever a hustler, even with four kids. So a lot of the tenacity I have, as well as some of the not-so-great traits, they come from my dad. I was an only child and my parents divorced when I was young. I don't think my dad ever got over my mom.

• 44:40Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And sadly, he struggled with the substance abuse and lost almost everything he had as a successful cranberry grower. And a lot of my childhood was pretty traumatic, but being from my generation and where I was raised, you just suck it up and you keep living. My dad was also passionate. He had a brilliant voice. He loved playing guitar about as much as he loved sunflower seeds, which I found in his actual guitars a lot of the time.

• 45:03Corinne Vien?

  Oh, that's so cute.

• 45:05Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  My dad moved to New Hampshire when I was around 22 and would drive three hours just for South Shore Bar Pies and Carver. Now I'm like, what's the? Cav. Wait, did you see that video where it was like, names that I can't name my children because my mom has a really thick Boston accent?

• 45:22Corinne Vien?

  And then she was like, Carter. And the mom was like, Ca-.

• 45:24Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Ca-.

• 45:25Corinne Vien?

  She's like, Carter. And she's like, Ca-.

• 45:28Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And then for Charlotte, she was like, Charlotte.

• 45:30Corinne Vien?

  Charlotte.

• 45:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  My stomach. My stomach is like, Charlotte. My dad loved taking drives, which is also something I inherited. In August of 2021, I visited him with my kids, and my dad was not himself. He was angry, depressed, and his health was failing, and he treated me the way he did when I was younger, which this time he did in front of my children. When we left, I cried in the car because I had the strangest feeling that it would be the last time I saw him. And I hated the idea of those being the last memories my children and I would have, but I didn't express that to him. Over the next few months, we spoke periodically, but I didn't answer when he would call on his morning dunks runs nearly enough. In early 2022, I told him I was coming out in April to help him get a doctor and his health issues in order.

• 46:17Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  But on March 20th, I got a call from his longtime partner that he had passed in his sleep from congestive heart failure.

• 46:23Corinne Vien?

  So sorry.

• 46:24Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  No goodbye. And his last voicemail, because I hadn't answered his call, was him yelling at me to answer my phone. He sounded desperate, and I didn't listen to the voicemail until after he passed. I was devastated. I went home to Boston to make arrangements, but the rest of the family decided not to do a memorial until September, which I was unable to attend with the kids going back to school. So I got no closure and I was heartbroken. My husband and I were at home three days after my dad's passing. We were pulling into a parking garage to do some shopping, and it was that moment that I just completely lost my shit and broke down. I was sobbing in the car, unloading everything to my husband, when all of a sudden, I started getting a phone call through the car's Bluetooth. It was my fucking dad. I answered, completely shaken. Hello?

• 47:04Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It was silent for a moment, and then I heard what sounded like an old landline receiver being hung up. The call ended. I was completely shook. I immediately called my dad's girlfriend and asked if she had just called me from his phone, and she said, no, she would never. And the phone hadn't moved from his nightstand since he passed away.

• 47:20Corinne Vien?

  Wow.

• 47:20Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I spared her the details, but confirmed we were coming up. When we got there, my husband immediately turned on my dad's phone and checked the call log, and sure enough, at 3:14 PM, there was an outgoing call made to me.

• 47:32Corinne Vien?

  Wait, I feel like that's really unique because so many times, there's no record in the call log of like, the phone call ever having existed.

• 47:38Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  But dad was like, I need to talk to her. Later that evening, my husband said that what he heard didn't sound like the phone hanging up, but more of like a sigh, almost one of exasperation. And keep in mind, I had been crying when the call came in, and my dad hated when I got emotional. So it felt like it was him calling and sighing, giving me his typical, Jesus Christ, Amanda, you want some cheese with that wine?

• 48:02Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It was his mass hole way of telling me he was still with me and there was no reason to worry. Thank you for letting me share one of the most profound moments of my life. Proof that we don't just disappear. From one spooky mass hole to two others, Amanda.

• 48:14Corinne Vien?

  Dang. You know what's so great is like when people's personalities and the way that they communicate still come through.

• 48:20Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Oh, yeah.

• 48:20Corinne Vien?

  Even if it's like harsh or insensitive or like whatever.

• 48:24Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah.

• 48:24Corinne Vien?

  I feel like it does provide humor and also just like some relief in knowing like, yeah, that's authentically the person that you think that it is.

• 48:32Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Right. They didn't just become like a peaceful zen Buddhist on the other side.

• 48:36Corinne Vien?

  Oh, I miss you so much and everything is so beautiful over here. Like, I'm always watching over you. He's like.

• 48:42Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Stop fucking whining.

• 48:43Corinne Vien?

  Oh, my God. Pick up your damn phone.

• 48:45Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  But I would like some cheese with that wine, Dad. Thank you. That sounds delicious. Cheese when you're sad? Yes.

• 48:51Corinne Vien?

  I love that.

• 48:52Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Okay, the second one. This is from my listener Shannon. Hi, Corinne and Sabrina. I discovered your podcast this year and binged it while I did all of my Halloween DIYs this year. This was back in 2021. I love the encounters episode and our episodes, and I know you guys like some lighthearted ones and not so spooky ones. So I have two for you. The first one happened to my cousin, but she called me immediately after experiencing it. Our grandmother passed away in July 2020. This is difficult on my family, as you know, this during the pandemic, and we hadn't seen my grandmother since before March of that year.

• 49:22Corinne Vien?

  Oh, wow.

• 49:23Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Since nursing homes and hospitals were restricting visitors. I truly tear up thinking about it. Anyway, my cousin was especially close to my grandma and having a really hard time with it. So she had saved several voicemails for my grandma and had put them into these really cool photo frames that when you press the button, it would play the voicemail. These were not motion censored at all. Like, you physically had to press the button on the picture frame for it to talk. One night, we're having a big storm, and interestingly enough, one of the voicemails my cousin chose to save and put in one of the frames, saying, "Hi, just calling to see how you made it out in the storm," or something along the lines of that, and then, "I'll talk to you soon." So my cousin is at home, and there's a massive storm going on. She's standing nowhere near this photo frame, when all of a sudden, the

• 50:05Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  frame starts playing over and over again. "Hi, just calling to see how you made out in the storm." "Hi, just calling to see how you made out in the storm."

• 50:12Corinne Vien?

  Ooh.

• 50:13Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  "Hi, just calling to see how you made out in the storm." My cousin, obviously terrified, was like, "What is going on?" It suddenly stopped, but it repeated over and over. Once it did finally stop, she called her dad. The second he picked up, the frame went off again, as if my grandmother heard my uncle's and her dad's voice and wanted to get his attention, too. Then, my cousin called me after, and it hasn't happened since. It's just weird, because it happened specifically during the severe storm.

• 50:41Corinne Vien?

  Yeah. It's like the perfect sign.

• 50:44Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah, just checking in.

• 50:45Corinne Vien?

  I'm just checking in. How are you doing? I also feel like if you, if it just kept kind of happening at random, you might be able to excuse it away as being like a glitch.

• 50:53Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  A glitch or something. Yeah. It only happened that night, multiple times during the storm.

• 50:58Corinne Vien?

  And relating to what was actually going on.

• 51:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yes.

• 51:00Corinne Vien?

  Yeah, like around weather-wise.

• 51:02Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  And it sounds like there are multiple voicemails saved. I don't know if it's like one per frame, or maybe there's multiple per frame. I don't know, but like, for just that voicemail to repeat.

• 51:10Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 51:11Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah. Okay, the next story is not as freaky, just an odd coincidence, and it has to do with my cousin and my grandma on my other side. I grew up in New England. Didn't realize I picked two New England ones. And my grandparents had this big house and giant backyard in Smithfield, Rhode Island. All of my cousins on that side are girls, so there was nothing but shrieking and playing and giggling, and of course, tons of sleepovers at grandma's. Me and my cousin Molly were the oldest two out of all of us, Molly the oldest, and Molly and I spent most of our time there and slept over the most. Our whole childhoods were nothing but joyful and fond memories of that house. Except, I was always exceptionally creeped out by the upstairs hallway. It had three bedrooms at the end of the hallway, and one of them had an old trunk full of letters from my great grandparents

• 51:53Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  from Ireland, and another room had these old porcelain dolls, of course.

• 51:57Corinne Vien?

  Mm-hmm.

• 51:58Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Nothing ever really happened, but that eerie energy in the hall was probably from one of those things, either the dolls or the letters. Eventually, they sold that house, and I grew up always having dreams about it. The dreams were always about really odd things happening in that hallway. A few weeks ago, I was texting Molly and casually mentioned that I have dreams about the Smithfield house. She immediately responded, asking what kind of dreams, and I mentioned that they were about ghosts or creepy things. She goes, "Oh, my God, I've always been creeped out by that hallway, too, and also have dreams about ghostly things happening there."

• 52:28Corinne Vien?

  Interesting.

• 52:29Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  So, yeah, we both got this to ourselves our entire lives and never spoke of it until this text conversation. We just discovered this.

• 52:36Corinne Vien?

  It makes me wonder if like, they're being manipulated by the house to have the same dreams, like what their actual dreams are, or if they're just both picking up on the energy so much that like, in their subconscious there, every once in a while revisiting the fear of the place.

• 52:48Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Or did those things actually happen, but they blocked it out of their memories, but it's happening again in their dreams? I don't know. Okay, the last one, this is a short one, from a listener, Brent, and we may have caught this one. "Hi, longtime listener, third time caller. So let's just cut to the chase, because this is short. I'm going back to listen to old encounters episodes, because they're the creepiest to me. So here I am, in my kitchen, listening, when I get a phone call. I'm like, ugh, of course, another spam call. And I'm in an unfortunate phase of being called nonstop by spam numbers. So anyway, I sent this one to voicemail, like I do all the others. But then, I see the transcription of the voicemail pop up on my phone. The message is short and sweet. Die."

• 53:30Corinne Vien?

  Well, damn.

• 53:30Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  The fuck. And then I, curious, went to go listen to it, and sure enough, it sounds like a female voice saying, "Die."

• 53:38Corinne Vien?

  Well, oh, my God.

• 53:39Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I screenshotted it, and then I deleted that, because I don't need that shit on my phone. But yeah, so a little creepy coincidence while listening to y'all. Here's a screenshot of the voicemail beneath. It was encounters 175, and then it has the transcription. It says, "Die."

• 53:53Corinne Vien?

  Ooh, ooh. I do not like that at all.

• 53:56Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  I'm curious what story was playing.

• 53:58Corinne Vien?

  Yeah.

• 53:59Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's from Brent.

• 54:00Corinne Vien?

  It also reminds me of when I was in middle school, and my friend, or maybe it was early high school, my friend Margaret, in the morning when I woke up, she was like, "Wait, what? What did you say to me? Why did you say that?" And I was like, "What are you talking about?" It was all over text. She was like, "Why did you tell me to die?" And I was like, "Oh, literally, what are you talking about?" And she screenshotted our text message thread, and what didn't exist on my phone existed on hers, where it showed my phone texting her at like, 2:00 AM or 3:00 AM, like, middle of the night, to die, or something like that.

• 54:31Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Well, that's how, that's the one time that I had you come cleanse my college dorm, was because I got a text from my roommate that said, "Don't die." And I was like, "What?" And she was like, "What?" And then I sent her a screenshot, and she goes, "I didn't send that." And then, on her side, there was no outgoing text saying, "Don't die."

• 54:48Corinne Vien?

  Yes. That's like where I truly felt like a paranormal investigator, because you text me, and I like, put things in a little briefcase.

• 54:55Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You literally came over with a briefcase.

• 54:56Corinne Vien?

  I had a little metal briefcase.

• 54:57Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  You had a feather?

• 54:59Corinne Vien?

  I think it was a makeup case, like a hard shell makeup case, but I like, threw everything out, put all my like, spiritual stuff in. And I remember Lexi was very scared, because she was also pretty devoutly Catholic at the time, wasn't she?

• 55:13Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  She was, she was something.

• 55:14Corinne Vien?

  She was something.

• 55:15Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  She was born again, I think.

• 55:17Corinne Vien?

  I don't know. She was something, and things were going on, and then, yeah.

• 55:21Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  It was scary. When you get a text saying, "Die," or "Don't die," that's, yeah, very scary.

• 55:25Corinne Vien?

  I know. And you were in one of the newer dorms, too.

• 55:28Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah, but that doesn't mean anything.

• 55:29Corinne Vien?

  It doesn't mean anything.

• 55:30Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That means nothing.

• 55:33Corinne Vien?

  Dang.

• 55:33Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah. And those are just a couple that I found, because I was trying to find like a variety of things.

• 55:38Corinne Vien?

  I mean, there's so many stories online, too. And it's like, I just went with the ones that were published in like, actual articles and like, big blog posts. Like, if I went to Reddit or something, like, I'm sure there'd be a million more stories.

• 55:50Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  We might need to do a Reddit episode like that.

• 55:52Corinne Vien?

  Oh, we should. I love this topic. Clearly, I forgot I did it before, and I was like, "Ooh, this is the best topic." We've revisited it a few times, so.

• 56:00Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  Yeah. So.

• 56:01Corinne Vien?

  We'll do it again.

• 56:01Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  That's the call to action. If you have had any paranormal ghostly calls, please email them to us. And also, just email us any of your experiences in general, because we want to hear them. Our email is [email protected]. That is listed in the show notes on our website, on our Instagram page, kind of everywhere. So if you don't know where to email, you can find it. And you can join us on Patreon if you want episodes one week early, ad-free, plus bonus content, plus join us live for Campfire Stories, where you can tell your ghost stories to us. It's a weekly event. We also have witch class and book club and so many other fun benefits over there.

• 56:37Corinne Vien?

  And thank you to Jamie Ryan, who edits and produces our podcast.

• 56:40Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  We love you all very, very much.

• 56:42Corinne Vien?

  And we will.

• 56:43Sabrina Deana-Roga?

  See you on the other side.

• 56:52Speaker 05

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