How Cop Killer 'Dezi Freeman' Became Australia’s Most Wanted Fugitive

In August 2025, two Victoria Police officers were shot and killed while executing a search warrant at a regional Victorian property linked to Desmond Filby, also known as Dezi Freeman. A third officer was injured, and Filby vanished into the bush, triggering a seven-month manhunt that gripped the nation. The case began with a child abuse investigation and ended in March 2026, when police found Filby hiding in a shipping container and shot him dead after he threatened officers with a stolen police gun. In this episode, we unpack the tragedy, the investigation, and the dramatic final chapter of one of Australia’s most confronting police operations. LINKS Watch Dezi Freeman: The Hunt on 7Plus here. https://7plus.com.au/dezi-freeman-the-huntand listen here. https://play.listnr.com/podcast/secrets-we-keep If you’re experiencing family and domestic violence, Safe Steps provides immediate and confidential assistance. Find out more here https://safesteps.org.au/contact/. If any of the contents in this episode have caused distress, know that there is help available via Lifeline on 13 11 14 or Beyond Blue on 1300 22 4636. New Mamamia subscribers get $40 off — $20 off an annual membership and $20 off your TWOOBS order. Click here to subscribe https://www.mamamia.com.au/twoobs-discount-code/?utm_source=shownotes&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=discounts&utm_content=twoobs-ron. Already a subscriber? Click here for your $20 TWOOBS discount code https://www.mamamia.com.au/subscriber-hub/exclusive-offers/. T&C's apply. GET IN TOUCH Follow us on Instagram and TikTok @truecrimeconversations https://www.instagram.com/truecrimeconversations/?hl=en Want us to cover a case on the podcast? Email us at [email protected] mailto:[email protected] or send us a voice note. https://help.mamamia.com.au/en-US/send-a-podcast-voice-note-467960 Make sure to leave us a rating and review on Apple & Spotify to let us know how you're liking the episodes. CREDITS Guest: Cassie Zervos https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0533976/Host: Gemma Bath https://www.linkedin.com/in/gemmabath/?originalSubdomain=au Senior Producer: Tahli Blackman https://www.linkedin.com/in/tahli-blackman-205a891b7/?originalSubdomain=au Group Executive Producer: Ilaria Brophy Video Editor: Julian Rosario Audio Engineer: Tegan Sadler Mamamia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on which we have recorded this podcast. Become a Mamamia subscriber: https://www.mamamia.com.au/subscribe https://www.mamamia.com.au/subscribe See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

• 0:02Speaker 00

  It's Monday, March 30 in 2026 and Cassie Zervos is getting ready to take her four-month-old baby to a mums and bubs gym class. She's currently on maternity leave from her job as crime editor at Seven News Melbourne. But as she packs the wipes and nappies into her bag while juggling her daughter on her hip, her watch buzzes with a notification. It keeps buzzing. Curious, Cassie checks her phone. One of her police contacts has messaged. DF found, it reads. Moments later, another message comes through. DF dead. Immediately, Cassie knows what it means.

• 0:43Speaker 00

  Dezi Freeman, real name Desmond Filby, Australia's most wanted fugitive for the past seven months. The man accused of murdering two police officers at his rural Victorian property. The man accused of fleeing a home in which police found hundreds of files containing child abuse material. That man, that criminal, is dead. Finally, the manhunt that has terrorised a country and a police force in mourning is over.

• 1:18Speaker 00

  I'm Gemma Bath and you're listening to True Crime Conversations, a podcast exploring the world's most notorious crimes by speaking to the people who know the most about them. Two men, two Victorian police officers, simply doing their jobs, were killed on August 26, 2025 by Desmond Filby. Their names were 59-year-old detective-leading senior constable Neil Thompson and 34-year-old senior constable Vadim Devartotar. A third officer was left seriously wounded. The deaths of Neil and Vadim have been felt deeply by their families, friends and colleagues in blue.

• 2:00Speaker 00

  Neil was just a week from retirement, a dedicated detective attached to the Wangaratta Criminal Investigation Unit. His loved ones describe a man who loved footy and campfires and hammocks, a naturally talented bushman who left behind his partner of six years' visa and two stepchildren. Vadim was just 34. He lived and worked in Melbourne, a member of the Public Order Response Team. He was only supposed to be in regional Victoria for a week on deployment to help deal with snow crowds. Born in Belgium, Vad migrated to Australia as an adult and was known as kind, adventurous, upbeat and worldly. An adrenaline junkie and a romantic at heart.

• 2:44Speaker 00

  Vad leaves behind his devastated parents and brother. After murdering these two beloved men, Filby, a self-identified sovereign citizen and accused paedophile, fled the scene, leaving his wife and baby at the property. That was the start of seven long months of searching, of false leads, of horrific taunts from others in his community who shared his anti-police beliefs, of heartbreaking funerals and tearful goodbyes. Then, in March 2026, while cradling her baby, Cassie broke the news of Filby's death from her living room.

• 3:24Speaker 01

  Well, we have some major breaking news now in regards the search for Dezi Freeman.

• 3:30Speaker 02

  Let's go live to Cassie Zervos now in Melbourne. Cassie, this is all happening, what can you tell us?

• 3:35Speaker 03

  Good morning, guys. Well, this is obviously huge developing news this morning. What we can confirm is that Dezi Freeman, the man who shot down two police officers in August last year, was found in the Porpanca region this morning by heavily armed officers. But as you can understand, this is very much a developing story. So details on how it actually unfolded, what went down, how police were able to find him, still unknown, but of course, we will bring you those details as soon as we get them.

• 4:05Speaker 00

  Cassie has returned from maternity leave again briefly to release a six-part podcast called Dezi Freeman: The Hunt. Just a note, in this episode, we will be referring to the killer by his birth name, Desmond Filby, not the name he self-appointed to himself in conjunction with his sovereign citizen beliefs. Cassie joins us now to take us behind the scenes of covering this extraordinary and horrifying case.

• 4:32Speaker 00

  Cassie, thank you for joining us on True Crime Conversations. Can you take me back to August 2025? Where were you at in your life and career at that point in time?

• 4:43Speaker 03

  Yeah, Gem, thanks for having me. Wow, it seems like so long ago, even though it was only seven months ago, or eight months now. I was in my third trimester of pregnancy. It was a Tuesday morning. I was sent out to just another crime scene in Melbourne. I can't even remember what it was now. But I do remember sitting in the car, my cameraman's car, because my feet were sore, my back was sore. Everything was aching. I was at that stage where I was sort of like waddling around and just sort of counting down the days to maternity leave. And my phone was in my pocket and I sort of was checking it and scrolling. And I saw these messages that kind of pop up.

• 5:24Speaker 03

  And then there were a number of text messages from contacts saying there's been some sort of police incident in the Alpine region in Victoria and a number of members unaccounted for. And I was like, what does unaccounted for mean? And I actually said, I'm like, excuse my ignorance, but what does unaccounted for mean? And the message was, Cass, I'll call you. And the conversation was, we think there's been a police shooting. We think at least two members have been killed. And I remember sort of looking, it was this weird moment because I looked out and it was raining and it was cold in Melbourne. And I looked out at the cameraman and I was like, is this happening? Like, is this for real? And then thinking, what do we do now?

• 6:07Speaker 03

  So it was just the process of calling the newsroom and hitting the road pretty much as soon as we got word that there was a major police incident. And because it was four and a half hours away from where we were in town, all we could do was just get there as soon as we could safely, of course.

• 6:26Speaker 00

  So without going home, getting supplies or anything, you just hit the road straight to the scene?

• 6:31Speaker 03

  Hit the road, I remember wearing boots with heels because I'd actually made plans with my husband that night to go out for dinner and I was in like a maternity dress, a big like kind of coat and that was it, that's all I had on me. I didn't have anything else. And to be honest, I didn't think I would be there for as long as I did. I genuinely thought by the time we arrived in Porpanca, the accused would have been in custody. I genuinely thought that because it was a good four and a half, five hour drive, I thought, oh, by the time we get there, the narrative of the story would have changed and there would have been, you know, an angle of, okay, we've got court cases and there'll be charges and this kind of thing. But when I arrived in that, that wasn't the case. There

• 7:14Speaker 03

  was still an active manhunt. Oh no, it sort of hit me that I could be here for a while and it turned out I was there for 17 days straight. So.

• 7:23Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 7:24Speaker 03

  It was, it was one of those things where, yeah, and then like messages were coming through from like FIC Emergency saying, um, if you can stay inside, active shooter on the run, do not approach Desmond Filby on the run, do not approach active shooter. And that, those messages kept coming through and, and we're obviously there and the police were there and you're thinking, are we safe? Like where could this guy be? Could he be hiding in plain sight? What, what's the situation here? So there were all these different emotions and feelings going on, but you sort of go into, um, like the adrenaline kicks in and I almost forgot I was pregnant. It was just kind of like, okay, I'm in work mode now.

• 8:04Speaker 03

  I want to do the best that I can do and cover this as the best that I can. And, um, and we were just waiting for the next update, really.

• 8:13Speaker 00

  Let's set the scene a bit for listeners of the area we're talking about. Porpanca, regional Victoria. Can you tell us about it? What's it like there?

• 8:21Speaker 03

  It's beautiful. It's the Alpine region. So there's beautiful mountain buffalo in the background. And at the time in August, it was the end of August towards the start of September, it was freezing in Melbourne and the weather was awful. But there was actually snowfall. So it was like this beautiful part of the world. But.

• 8:40Speaker 03

  Freezing and tiny, quite rural, lots of farming properties. The area that the police were searching was really dense, the terrain was really dense. I'm not a camper, I'm not a hiker, I'm not like, I'm not really familiar with that kind of, those kind of activities. But a lot of people who, other journalists who were there had been camping there and had gone on weekend hikes and it's a beautiful tourist town. So it's actually a really stunning part of the world. Um, and why lots of people decide to holiday there and, you know, go on the camping trips and go on the snows, the snows trips as well. So it's, but it's, it's remote, it's very remote.

• 9:22Speaker 03

  And particularly Desmond's property, it was, um, it was huge. Uh, and from an outsider looking in, like you drive past his straight rain track and you wouldn't know that there's a huge rural property there. Um, but there's so many properties like it around that area where there's farmers and, and, um, people who are running businesses for caravanning and, and campervanning and that kind of thing as well. So you've got a bit of everything there.

• 9:51Speaker 00

  And Filby's residence on this enormous property, it wasn't actually a house, was it? It was a, a bus?

• 9:57Speaker 03

  Yeah, it was like an old rundown bus that was, um, he turned it into a, I guess, a house for him and his family. Um, the owners of the actual property allowed him to stay there. Um, but he didn't own the property, the actual land itself. He was just living on a bus on the property and he'd been living there for some time, I believe. Um, but, you know, this was a man who was, you know, anti-society. He decided to homeschool his children. He didn't want to get his kids vaccinated, um, which, you know, each to their own. But he, he made himself known in town for his beliefs and particularly during COVID.

• 10:39Speaker 03

  And that's something that we really sort of deep dive during this whole period of the manhunt and particularly post it as well in the last few months.

• 10:49Speaker 00

  Well, let's talk about what happened before we get to. Filby's beliefs. It was about 10.30 in the morning and police were attending the property to execute a search warrant. Can you tell us the details of that? Why were they executing a search warrant?

• 11:04Speaker 03

  Sure, so there were allegations against Filby that historic child abuse allegations dating back to the past two years, and that's what Victoria Police came out and said. So it was very much fact. So it was a search warrant to go in and search and seize any potential evidence that could be held against him. And that's why they were there. It was a routine search warrant. Police do these kind of warrants almost every day for all different reasons. You know, and a lot of people have come out and said, why, if it was just a routine search warrant, why were there so many police officers there? And I've spoken to officers who have worked closely on this case and they said, because

• 11:45Speaker 03

  the property is obviously so big, it's not unusual to have that many members attend a search warrant because it's a huge property and it's time, you know, being time efficient. And it's quite common, even in Melbourne or even in like, you know, suburban warrants, it's quite common for there to be more numbers than not, for safety reasons as well. But there was nothing unusual about this search warrant. They didn't believe he was capable of carrying out what he did that day. And I think that's something that will come out now in the coroner's inquest, which is expected to begin in the next couple of months too.

• 12:25Speaker 00

  Let's go into Filby's background because he was known to police. This wasn't the first time they'd had run ins with him. Can you tell us about him? To start with, his name, publicly, everyone will know him as Desmond, Desi Bird Freeman. That's not his name.

• 12:42Speaker 03

  No, it's not. It's not Jem. He actually changed his name, I believe, in the late 2000s to Dezi Freeman. And the surname Freeman, if you break it up, free man, and that's quite a popular name within the sovereign citizen movement. He was born as Desmond Christopher Filby and that's what his family knew him as. I've been speaking to some of his family members post everything that's happened. And when I speak to them, they refer to him as Des or Desmond. They don't make reference to that Freeman surname that he changed it to. He was actually. You know, in his early teens, late teens, early twenties, really into the hippie movement

• 13:27Speaker 03

  and would go to and attend a lot of festivals that often spread messages of love and peace. And he was sort of going down that path. And then an associate of his that I had been speaking to throughout the past seven or so months said that all of a sudden something switched in him, it switched in him where he became quite angry and resented the world and authority. Nothing, there was no sort of like trigger point, nothing really happened, but he always sort of questioned authority, you know, like, why do I have to go to work? Why do I have to do this? Why do I have to conform with society? Why do I have to get a driver's licence? Why can't I go to speed that I think is safe? And it's just like, well, it's the law, you've got to do it, we all do it. We're, you know, this is, this is, you know, I don't, you know, necessarily always want to go to work, but you got to, like, you've got bills to pay and this to do and, you know, there's responsibilities as an adult and as you get older.

• 14:11Speaker 03

  And he questioned that very early on. And so much so, I believe the first time he's running, running with the police was with the New South Wales Police when he was like 21 or 22, and it was for speeding. And he, you know, copped a fine like you do and he just refused to pay it. So he was sort of in and out of the court system from quite an early age. And it was often things like speeding fines, parking fines that he refused to pay. And then, of course, the COVID pandemic hit. And that's when his, his behaviour really escalated. We're aware, you know, Victoria had probably the strictest lockdowns in the country, some would argue, around the world.

• 14:52Speaker 03

  And, you know, he refused to wear the mask, he refused to get the COVID vaccination. There were, you know, the vision that has since emerged of him like baiting police officers when they pull him over, why are you not within, you know, your 5K radius of the rules? And, and he just, and his family said, he just, his, his mental health and his health really escalated from that moment onwards. But he never hurt or physically lashed out at a police officer. It was always verbal abuse.

• 15:26Speaker 00

  When you say sovereign citizen, is that, is that just like an organised movement that he would be a part of? Is that, is that a well-run group for those that aren't aware?

• 15:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, so a sovereign citizen is basically a person who. Thinks they're above the law, doesn't abide by society's laws, um, doesn't believe in the government, uh, doesn't believe in police authority or, yeah, essentially the laws. There's not necessarily like a group, there's a group, you know, there'd be people, a movement or his associates, his friends. Um, but in terms of an actual group, I don't believe he was necessarily part of, you know, like a sovereign citizen group. It was just, he was a self-described sovereign citizen. During the time of the pandemic, because the police were going to his house and checking on his kids because they weren't going to school and they weren't getting the vaccinations and there was a lot of sort of welfare checks.

• 16:21Speaker 03

  He, he would go on his social media pages and, and rant and say that the authorities were out to get in purely because he didn't believe in abiding by the law and the rules. And it got so bad that he would actually threaten authority online. I remember seeing a post that he wrote saying, any good cop is a dead cop and describes police as terrorist thugs. That's what he posted online. So there was so much hatred towards authority and, um, it really escalated during the pandemic and post it as well.

• 17:03Speaker 00

  But in terms of like charges against him, was it more of these like nuisance charges? Like he's, you know, verbally abusing or, or the, the speeding and stuff like that? There weren't actual serious charges on his criminal history before these allegations of child abuse?

• 17:21Speaker 03

  That's absolutely right. There was nothing, there was nothing, you know, obviously speeding, it's illegal parking, you know, not paying fines, but there was nothing like the allegations that we've since learnt about. But in terms of the seriousness of his offending, it wasn't violent, it wasn't, it was more of a nuisance to authorities. And he would fight it and he would go through all the pages of the law and say, well, you know, under this section and this section and this and this. And it was almost, he almost became a nuisance for the magistrates as well and, um, and the police. But it was never, he was charged with.

• 17:58Speaker 03

  Anything incredibly criminal, if that makes sense.

• 18:02Speaker 00

  Yeah. What about his kind of work life, family life? Did he have a job, children?

• 18:09Speaker 03

  No, so. And this is what I find quite interesting. He was actually on The Doll. So he was taking, he was on a, he claimed a disability pension or something like that. And I don't think he actually, from speaking to his associates, he didn't have anything wrong, but he managed to find a loophole where he could claim taxpayers' money. So he was so anti-government, so anti, you know, authority, but yet he was happy to take the money from, from us. And that's the thing that gets me as well. You sort of think, okay, well, this is a man who like really wants to fight a good fight in his own mind and in his world, but is so happy to take money from

• 18:47Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:48Speaker 03

  the government. But um he hadn't been working for years. When I spoke to a close relative of his, um he actually said he wasn't able to hold down a job, kind of for the same reasons. You know, you go to work and there are rules. There are rules everywhere you go. That's just the world that we, that's the world, that's life.

• 19:03Speaker 00

  That's life.

• 19:04Speaker 03

  He just couldn't handle it. He couldn't handle it. And these allegations that I've been told, you know, what police have since been able to find on his devices. Desmond actually told his family members, oh, the police are coming after me over these, you know, these lies.

• 19:20Speaker 00

  But I do believe police have since confirmed that they found child abuse material.

• 19:25Speaker 03

  Correct. So the devices that they seized from Desmond's property, laptops and iPads, they were able to use specialised technology to download files from, from the, from his devices. And there were hundreds and hundreds of child exploitation material found on his devices.

• 19:44Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 19:44Speaker 03

  Um. And many people don't believe that, you know, obviously that's come out recently. And if you look at comments online, people who have the same beliefs as Desmond Filby, uh and who are, you know, supporters of him, so to speak, they're saying, oh, it's fake news. The, the police are just out to get him, which is a whole other debate. Like since, since really deep diving into this movement and, and doing the podcast that we have done.

• 20:15Speaker 03

  Um, the comments online, like I get messages daily being like, he's still alive. It's a cover up. Um, all these different conspiracy theories that people genuinely believe, which is like a whole other thing.

• 20:27Speaker 00

  And we haven't got there yet, but it is just so offensive to the victims of and the families that are grieving to hear all of that nonsense.

• 20:35Speaker 03

  And these are two men who went to work and should have come home. Like they put on a uniform, they, they, they go to their workplace, they, they do their job and they should come home and they didn't. And the people who are defending this man, it really makes you angry. And it almost like, I've almost had to like mute notifications because you can't reason with these people. You're never going to change their minds. But because there's so many people who have the same thinking as him, it almost terrifies you because you're like, what's this? What kind of society are we living in where people are celebrating this person when they should be mourning the deaths of two good men? It just, it really baffles me and makes, it actually makes me very angry.

• 21:18Speaker 00

  After the break, we talk about how a search warrant at Desmond's property escalated into a shooting.

• 21:25Speaker 04

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• 22:00Speaker 00

  Let's talk about the, the circumstances, the incident that led to the deaths of Vadim and Neil. They arrive for this search warrant. There's a number of offices, I believe nine. How did it escalate into a shooting?

• 22:15Speaker 03

  So what I've, my understanding of what happened that day is Neil was and had a lot of dealings with Desmond in the past. With, you know, being in town, Neil was a 37-year police veteran of the force. He, he knew everyone, you know, and he was just days out from retirement and he thought, oh, I've dealt with this guy before. I'll, I'll lead the team in, it'll be like another, another search warrant. And I understand that there was a lot of back and forth. Desmond refused to come out of the bus. So what police would have done is they would have entered the property and they've got all the right paperwork saying, you know, we've got a search warrant. We're here to execute a search warrant.

• 22:59Speaker 03

  Desmond, anyone else inside, please come out. His wife, Molly, was also inside the bus at the time. I understand she was actually breastfeeding their youngest child, their baby. And they refused to come out and there was this standoff for some time. I don't, in terms of timeframe, how long it went on for, I'm not sure. But during, what I've been told during that period, Desmond's behaviour and language really escalated. He was becoming very angry, very volatile. You know, in his mind, he was there to protect his family. This is my property, you're not welcome on my property, leave, leave, leave. And then it got to the point where the police ended up going in. And Neil, being the true leader that he was, he led his team in.

• 23:42Speaker 03

  And he was the first to get shot, which was just absolutely tragic. And then the dim was behind him. And, um, and then my understanding is everything from that moment was very quick and a bit of a blur for the other members. Desmond tried to fire at the third female police sergeant, but it didn't go off. You can only imagine how she would, she would have felt in that moment, but also months later as well. And there was another other police officer who was shot in the leg. And my understanding is that he had to take shelter under the bus until more backup arrived. But.

• 24:24Speaker 03

  It's just, it's when you think about it, these men and women, you know, they're there to protect. Their job as a police officer is to protect the community and that's what they were doing. There were some serious allegations against Desmond and they were there to seize evidence. And for whatever reason, he thought in his sick mind, no, you're not coming onto my property. It's my right to do, to protect my property, my family. And that's what he decided to do. Uh, firing the gun in front of his wife, in front of his baby.

• 25:04Speaker 03

  And his middle child, his middle son was also there who witnessed the ordeal as well, the shooting as well. So, um, just a really dark day for obviously the force and a force that's still incredibly grieving with, with what's happened. And, um, I don't think, I don't think members who work in that, in that region and members who worked with Fadim, I understand. He was actually working in the public order response team and he was on a succumbant in Wangaratta. And I've spoken to a lot of members from the port unit and they're not the same. How can you be? Because you sort of think, oh, that could have been me on succumbant, you know, starting in my career. And, and what I've been told, Fadim just showed so much potential as a police officer as well.

• 25:47Speaker 03

  And, um, learning from, from his colleagues and from senior members.

• 25:52Speaker 00

  Well, I believe Fadim was actually only there for, he was only supposed to be there for a week. He was dealing with, um, the snow crowds. This is a man that wasn't even supposed to, he doesn't even live in that area. He's from Melbourne, that's where he lives and works. And he went to help out on a search warrant while there for, to help with tourism and snow and he lost his life.

• 26:12Speaker 03

  Um, and it's just when you break it down like that and you think wasn't supposed to be there. Had he not have taken the succumbant, had he have gone to a different region, like all the what ifs, you know, that's what plays in your head. What if, what if they had more, you know, heavily armed police that went in? What if? Well, all the what ifs. What if Desmond decided to come out and actually do what he was told? And, you know, my understanding is that they didn't know that he was armed. He actually lost his firearms licence years ago. Um, so my understanding was that he didn't, there was no awareness that he had weapons inside that bus. Had police have known that, there would have been the Critical Incident Response Team there.

• 26:53Speaker 03

  Potentially even the Special Operations Group, they're Victoria's most elite, um, police squad. And they, they have the right equipment to deal with offenders like Desmond Tilby.

• 27:04Speaker 00

  I shared with listeners a bit earlier, a little bit about Vadim and about Neil. But can you tell us about their funerals, about the outpouring of grief and love for these two men?

• 27:16Speaker 03

  The services were just beautiful. The love in the police chapel and the guard of honour that they did, it was, it, it stopped you in your tracks for Vadim's funeral. Um, for the, for listeners who don't know, um, Vadim was from Belgium. So his family flew to Melbourne. And I remember seeing his mother and she was dressed in so much colour. And there were songs that would play throughout the service. And often she would stop and sing along while crying. And there was just this so much raw emotion. Vadim's brother got up and spoke and told the chapel, um, of Vadim's love for Batman.

• 28:01Speaker 03

  And, and how he'd often, uh, wear Batman socks under his uniform, his police uniform, and go to work and wear his Batman socks under the Victoria Police uniform. And, and he stood up Vadim's brother and said, he was my real life superhero. He was my very own Batman. And he asked his, the, the mourners to remember Vadim for the way that he lived and not for the way that he died. And I think that was a really powerful message because obviously during the time of the funerals, there was still an active manhunt going on. Uh, Desmond was still somewhere out in the community. So you've got. The police chapel packed with hundreds and hun- I think it almost got to over a thousand

• 28:45Speaker 03

  people and there was people on the street, it sort of spilled out onto the road and they had to close roads down for the guard of honour and there were all these men and women in blue grieving and, and then you got the other side of it where you got, you know, five hours away, an active manhunt and that morning, police on the ground, they were, they said, "We never felt more determined to find justice for, for the families of Neil and Badim." Um, and obviously it came months later, but there was this real hunger and real determination that the police just said, "We are not going to give up." And obviously this story led our news bulletins night after night and the, the search itself

• 29:28Speaker 03

  started to slow, like from what we saw, picture wise, you know, started to slow down and we'd ask, you know, in press conferences, down the track, "Oh, how many members do you still have there?" And, and our, our chief commissioner, Mike, Mike Bush, he came out and said, "We will not give up until there's justice. It might take weeks, months, years, but we are determined to find justice." And so everyone else gets on with their lives and, you know, the headlines change and the top story of the news of the day changes and, but these are people who kept fighting, kept looking, following up all the tip-offs. There were thousands and thousands of tip-off, tip-offs to Crime Stoppers. And there were a lot of false leads, there were a lot of false sightings, people who thought they

• 30:12Speaker 03

  may have seen, you know, the local Woolworths, the local Coles, "Oh yeah, we, we think we've, we've seen Desmond." And so of course, police have to follow that up because what if, what if it was that critical tip-off? What if? That eventually, that eventually did come this year. So I just think it was a remarkable effort by- By a team, by a force that was grieving, hurting. They were angry, they were emotional. Um, and they just, they just kept going. And then you've got Neil's funeral. So Vidim started his career in 2018. He was very much at the start of, you know, he was just going up, up, up. Whereas Neil was at the other end. He was days out from retirement. I believe the day of Vidim's funeral, Neil was actually supposed to retire that day.

• 30:57Speaker 03

  That's my understanding. And he was described as a man who, you know, you know, those people where you walk into a room and you've got their attention and they make you feel like you're the only person that matters. He was that kind of guy that would make you feel like you were the only person that mattered. And I feel like those people have this special art of making people feel special. And, you know, our days are busy and our lives are busy. But, and he was, he was a busy man, you know, protecting his community. But he would make the community feel loved and special and his colleagues, particularly his colleagues. Um, and true to form, he, he said, yeah, I'll do one last, I'll help my team one last time. And before I retire and enjoy my retirement years. And, and that was the decision that essentially cost him his life, which I just think, you know,

• 31:42Speaker 03

  when you think about it, God, like, he worked so hard and he worked so hard and just had so much to look forward to and it was taken away from him. And it's just so much grief, I think, for both of those funerals.

• 31:58Speaker 00

  I think for, for the colleagues of these two men, you have to remember that they do a very, very dangerous job. So when they lose people, it's like, it's, it's, it does happen. We have lost quite a number of police officers in Australia. And then they have to go out and, and continue doing the dangerous job and try and find the person that killed one of their colleagues. It's just, it's really hard to imagine.

• 32:26Speaker 00

  Having to do that, like that, that's your job. You, you have to just kind of put the uniform back out, back on and go out there and find the guy.

• 32:33Speaker 03

  Hmm. And we, I spoke to the police, our police association, union boss, Wayne Gatt. And I asked him, I said, this is probably going to sound like a really dumb question, but I'm going to ask it anyway. And he goes, yeah, of course. And I said, when the manhunt was going on and, you know, the hours turned into days and the days turned into weeks, was the feeling for members, were they scared? Were they worried that, you know, this was a person they were looking for who would kill again? Who was armed, who was dangerous? He stole a police firearm. And he said, Cassie, these are members who chose to stand in the dark on busy roads at roadblocks

• 33:17Speaker 03

  because it was almost safer for them to stand in the dark on a road than be out, you know, on display in case Desmond came across them. And as everyone knows, it's never safe to stand in the dark on a road. But in their mind, it was. And I think that just shows the severity of the situation, just how they were feeling. They wanted to obviously find him, but they, I mean, everyone wants to go home at the end of the day of their workday. So.

• 33:51Speaker 00

  You mentioned that you were on location for 17 days. So at the start of that manhunt, did you feel scared? There was a man with a gun running around.

• 34:00Speaker 03

  Hmm. Yeah, I really did. I actually, it's in, when I arrived in Porpanca, I think I was in sort of game mode. Like there was a job to do, there was so much adrenaline. But I remember getting back to the motel that night. And in my heart, I genuinely thought this, they'd find him straight away. Like I'd be there for maybe a couple of days, we'd go to court and we'd come back. When I went back to the motel that night.

• 34:28Speaker 03

  And it was windy and I just couldn't sleep cause I was like, this guy could be anywhere. This man could be hiding in the bush. He could, you know, you know, at nighttime, everything just seems worse as well. And we were doing, we were, yeah, we were doing door knocks the next day. So as a journo, like what we do is we go to properties nearby where something has happened and we try and get as much information or get interviews with people. And I remember myself and a couple of the other TV journo's, we, we were like, let's do it together because the properties are so big. And I was tired, like I was waddling around. I was like, I just wanna work smarter, not harder, almost.

• 35:07Speaker 03

  And we knocked on a property next to Desmond's and it was a big rural property. So it took a while for the, for the owner to come out, the person who lived there to come out. All of a sudden, this dog starts running over to us. And I was like, that's okay, the dog's fine. And this man emerges and he's got a gun over his, over his shoulder. And I'm looking at my cameraman thinking, hmm, I don't feel good. I'm like, we're defenseless here. Not that I think he would do anything, but you don't know. There were no police around. And he just goes, who are you? And we just all said, oh, the boy from the media, we're following up, you know, what happened. And, and he just didn't say anything. And I just said, we're gonna go, we're gonna go.

• 35:48Speaker 03

  And he looked at us and he goes, yeah, and he goes, I just, he goes, I think that's a good idea. And I remember getting in that car and I said to my cameraman, let's go. Like, we're not going back there. And he wouldn't, I just, when someone comes out with a gun and you're, you know, I'm, I was like thirty two weeks pregnant, I think at the time. And you sort of think, God, like, what am I doing? Like, this is, what, what's, what's the reward versus the risk in this situation? And I remember speaking to some of the members from the special operations group, cause there were so many roadblocks. Like you'd go to get one checkpoint and they're like, oh yeah, you can go to there, but don't go anywhere further. But, you know, people were getting around and there's always different ways to get around, to get the best spot, to get the best location when police were going in and searching and everything.

• 36:32Speaker 03

  And this special operations group member, and he's in like full like bulletproof vest, helmet, everything. And he comes over to our car and he goes, I'm not gonna tell you guys how to do your job, but we've got the full gear on. So we're as protected as we can be. You don't have a helmet on, you don't have a vest on. This man hates authority. He hates mainstream media. He hates police. He's just killed two of our own. I, I, I wouldn't be here if I was you. And I remember going, mm hmm, no worries, we're out. And I remember just saying to all the other crews, this is just not worth it. Like this is, you know, we're here to do our job. We're here to cover a story. But at the end of the day, like, no, like, I'm not risking anything. Um, and hearing it from someone who was so, oh, no.

• 37:17Speaker 03

  And I was like, I've got my belly and, you know, I'm, I've got nothing. I've got my, at that point, I think my dress was five days old. And, you know, you're running on empty a bit because being pregnant, as tiring as it is, plus, you know, all the live cross commitments and you're not sleeping because there's an active shooter on the run and just all the emotions. And I just said to my cameraman, let's get a coffee, let's get a hot pie, let's just take a breather. And at the end of the day, we're a team, we've got to agree on everything. And I just said, if we miss something, I'll wear it. I don't, you know, at this point, we're all, we're all just doing our best right now. So there were just all these different layers of difficulty to covering this story.

• 37:57Speaker 03

  Um, and also making sure that you covered it in a way where, because you know, family members, police are watching everything. You want to do the best you can in a way where you're not disrespecting force or just, you know, adding, adding any trauma to the families that are already going through so much too. So, yeah, there was a lot to take into consideration, definitely.

• 38:20Speaker 00

  Up next, the moment Kathy's maternity leave was interrupted by the news that Desmond had been found dead. So if you were thirty two ish weeks pregnant, you went on maternity leave not long after all of this happened. Were you able to, obviously having a baby is very time consuming and it's, changes your whole world. Were you, were you able to park this story? Or were you, were you constantly kind of checking in?

• 38:46Speaker 03

  I remember when I went on leave, I said to my boss, I'll only come back if Desmond is found to cover it. But I genuinely didn't think it would happen while I was off. Uh, I'd spoken to a lot of officers who were working on this case and. You know, at the start of the year, they put out a, an alert saying that they brought in cadaver dogs, which are dogs that are trained to specifically smell, sniff out human remains. So when I went on leave, I was sort of like, oh, I don't know what's gonna happen, but I just really wanted to enjoy that baby bubble as well.

• 39:24Speaker 00

  Um. Yeah.

• 39:26Speaker 03

  So it was a bit of a, it's a weird feeling like as a, as someone who's like put their career first just forever, really. And then you sort of pause that to focus on something completely different. It was a bit of a mixed, yeah, I was sort of checking in every now and then, but I didn't know how I would feel if it was to happen. And then of course it did happen. And then it was like, just, I still can't like, it was just a massive blow when it did, because I just didn't think it was gonna happen while I was off.

• 39:52Speaker 00

  Well, it, it happened when you had a, if I'm correct, three month old baby? Like you were very much in the depths of postpartum.

• 40:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, it was like a Monday morning. Um, and I'm trying to get back, like exercise for me is sort of like my outlet. And I love doing it before I felt pregnant and I'm loving getting back into it. So I joined a mom and bub's gym class, you know, nearby my house. And Mondays are always chaotic, as is, let alone when you've got a baby. And I've got two stepkids that are with us full time as well. So I'm just trying to get everyone to school, trying to, you know, clean vomit off me. And, and my, my watch, I had an Apple watch on and just kept vibrating. And I was like, oh, someone's, you know, must be something on Instagram, someone's sending me funny reels or something. And then I must have looked down and it caught my eye because I was like, DF out. And then in my head, I'm like, DF.

• 40:46Speaker 03

  And it took me a good couple of seconds to process, oh my goodness, they're talking about Desmond Filby. And then the next message, DF dead.

• 40:57Speaker 03

  And so I'm standing in my living room. My husband's working at the table and I'm holding the baby and I'm like, what? And I walk over to him, he's like, what's wrong? You going to gym? And I'm like, I think they've just found Desmond. And I think he's been killed. And I remember my husband was like deep in whatever he was doing. He sort of paused, looked at me, he's like, actually? And I'm like, I think so, yeah. He's like, give me the baby, make calls, do what you've got to do. So I'm handing the baby over, called the newsroom and I'm like, I'm so sorry, like, sorry. Like I hadn't, I didn't have the TV on, so I wasn't sure what was on morning news and everything. And I'm like, I'm so sorry if this is like old information. And they're like, no, this is not old information. You're going to break it right now on live television.

• 41:40Speaker 03

  And I'm like, I haven't done a live cross in four months, four, five months. I don't know, I can't string a scent, I've had no sleeve, I've got no, I don't know where my makeup bag is.

• 41:48Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 41:49Speaker 03

  We ended up, we ended up doing it. I remember going, like after we came off air, my husband said, are you sure you're right? Like, are you sure it's him? But during the live cross, Victoria Police sent out a media alert confirming that it was. So I called my mom and I said, mom, I need you to come over and help with the baby. And um, she raced over and cameraman came to my house and it was just a long four and a half hour drive to where the scene was. And I, this time had more time to, more, a chance to pack things. And I remember all I took was my Spectra breast pump. Cause I'm like, that's all I really need right now.

• 42:27Speaker 00

  It's important.

• 42:28Speaker 03

  But I didn't realise it was like on one bar of charge. So um, it actually died on the way there. So I had to get the cameraman to stop a baby bunting in Albury. So I could get like one of those like let down things. And it was just a whole, it was just like, this is a crime scene done completely differently, but.

• 42:44Speaker 00

  No, but these are the logistics that people don't understand. Like you're three months postpartum, you've got a breastfed baby, you're trying to break a story. Like that's, Cassie, that's a lot to deal with.

• 42:53Speaker 03

  Yeah, it was, it was, you know, when you're in the moment and you're like, all right, I've just got to do what I've got to do. And then I'll worry about everything else afterwards. It was kind of like that, like I was so determined to get there. My husband was like, you know, you, you were so invested in this. You've got, I have a lot of, you know, police officers who were just friends that I, you know, get coffee with and whatever. And this is something that really affected them and, and the way that they went about working in the, you know, months that followed. And for me, it was almost like I needed personal closure in covering a story like this. And to do it right and to do it, I hope, where the families felt like, you know, as best as it could have been dealt with. Um, and it wasn't about thinking, oh, I'm going to, you know,

• 43:36Speaker 03

  come in on that leave and do it. I didn't even think of it. It was just like, I, I, I put my journalist, my journalist hat came back on and I've parked my mum one for a bit. And, and then you've got all the feelings, four and a half hours is a long time to get from A to B. And my phone was blowing, you know, there was interviews and crosses and everything. And, and I kept thinking, am I doing the right thing? Like, am I doing the right thing? And it was too late. I was already three hours down the road. And, um, and it was, again, it was adrenaline. And it wasn't until I sort of stopped in the evening that night. And I thought, I just really want to get home now and see my baby and, and, and feed her and get the milk out. And it was, and dealing with that too, like I was pumping

• 44:16Speaker 03

  in between news commitments on the side of a road when there's a crime scene. And you've got people kind of walking past going, oh, well, can't look at you. You're, you know, got your boob out on the side of the road. And I'm like trying to do it discreetly and trying to get my head in it. Hey, I've got to say this, I've got to say that. I can't do this, I can't do, you know, just, just balancing it all. And we got there in the end.

• 44:38Speaker 00

  I definitely couldn't have done that three months postpartum. So kudos to you. Um, can you tell us how police found Desi and how it ended in him being killed?

• 44:50Speaker 03

  He was killed on March 30th this year. My understanding, what I've been told from contacts is that they received this critical tip off just a week before.

• 45:02Speaker 03

  And from there, they didn't think, their, their initial reaction was, oh, okay, we'll check it out. And the biggest thing for them is, of course, identifying that the person that they're looking for is Desmond. But I want to stand to, um, it had been seven months at that point. His appearance was very different. His hair had grown, he had beard and everything. So, once they realised this, he's here, yep, he's alive, he's here, this is the man we've been looking for for seven months. It's then risk assessment. So, is there anyone else with him? Are there people coming and going? Are there, who's living at this property, who owns this property? Um, are there any kind of, you know, traps

• 45:45Speaker 03

  that he may have set up for an ambush? Uh, are there paths where he can get away? What, what this, you know, he was, he was living inside a shipping container. I'm not sure if this is how in-depth the police were thinking, but just ways that he could escape. So, there's a risk assessment and making sure that he's there, yep, it's him, and making sure there was no one else there. Once all of those things were ticked off, it was then game mode. So, um, obviously, these are, uh, you know, confidential ways that they carry out operations like this, but special operations group, uh, were called in and they surrounded the property. They went in at five thirty in the morning, Monday,

• 46:26Speaker 03

  that Monday, March thirty. And their goal was to get him into custody. They didn't want to kill him, they didn't want to shoot him. They had a police negotiator there and that person's job is to purely negotiate with the suspect, with the accused. And that is to get this man out safely, handcuffed, no one else injured, no one else hurt, and interca- and, you know, interviewed and into the cells. Once that, um, wasn't going the way that they had originally planned for, um, they, things escalated. During the police negotiations with Desmond, uh, there were things that he was saying to the officers

• 47:08Speaker 03

  there that only he would know. So, I don't know what was said between them and the team that was there, but after the fact, um, when the police confirmed that it was him, they said, you know, there was things that he was saying about. What happened on August twenty sixth last year that only he would know. Um, and his demeanor became so volatile that he started to defend what he did that day. Why he killed the police, why he decided to open fire. And so you've got a team of police who are grieving, but who have a job to do. And you never want to act out of anger or out of rage. So they've got to just sort of,

• 47:48Speaker 03

  almost like in one ear, out the other, kind of just, just focus on what you've got to do to get this man out safely. Or then what ended up happening. So because he refused to come out, they used this tool on the Bearcat that essentially pierces the shipping container. And they use like a capsicum spray or like a, uh, an O C spray to essentially like smoke bomb him out. And I'm not sure if you've ever had capsicum spray in your eyes or down your throat, but it is brutal. Like it really throws you off. It's sorry and takes you. So that's what they wanted to do. Um, and it worked. He eventually emerged. He was wrapped in a doona. Um, but he was holding the police firearm that he stole.

• 48:29Speaker 03

  And as soon as they saw the gun, and my understanding now is that he did, there was crossfire, there were shots fired. Um, that's when police opened fire on Desmond and killed him and shot him dead.

• 48:44Speaker 00

  Can you take us through the reaction from his community when that happened? Because they didn't even believe it, did they?

• 48:51Speaker 03

  No, so it's, it's this online community of, um, like-minded people to, to Desmond who believe they're above the law. And, and many commented saying, it's not true. It's, it's, you know, fake news. It's not real. He's still alive. Or then there was other people saying, oh, he was actually killed on August twenty sixth. And this is just a huge police cover up and.

• 49:21Speaker 03

  And the comments were just coming in, coming in, you're like, do you, do you bother responding or do you just leave it? And my, my take was, I'm just, I can't, I'm not gonna change these people's minds. If they can't see the evil in what Desmond has done and carried out, you're not gonna convince them otherwise. So I'm like, I'm not gonna waste my time, energy and emotions on these people. So you've got that side of it. Then you've got the community and Bright and in Porpanca, who are so angry at Desmond for what he's done and for what he's done to their community as well. Because they said, we're not all like this. We don't all have these sick beliefs. We, we love the police and we, you know, we, we follow the rules and we follow the law. And a lot of them actually donated food and coffee to, to the officers

• 50:06Speaker 03

  um who were working relentlessly for the seven months that were, you know, based there for so long. So you've got that side of it. You've got all these different little sides of um of a town that's, that's grieving in their own way. And then of course, you've got Desmond's family. So his son uh actually posted pretty soon after this long post on Facebook in their community page, basically just saying that those people who are celebrating my dad's death, you're, you know, you're this and that. And, and he said, what my dad did was wrong and he should never have done that. But he's my dad and people who are celebrating his death, you know, this is not nice, it's not fair.

• 50:45Speaker 03

  And, and so there's just all these elements to it um of grief. But the biggest one, of course, was for the families of Neil and Vadim. Like this is a man who had been on the run for so long and so many unknowns. Like, you know, was he alive? Was he dead? Everyone had a theory. Everyone thought, oh, nah, he's done this or he's gone here. Or and at the end of the day, you've got two families who, uh, you know, finding him is not gonna bring their loved ones back. But it's a little bit of, I can only imagine it would be a, a little bit of closure.

• 51:23Speaker 00

  I think it's also unfair for these conspiracy theorists, because that's what they are. And I remember dealing with them during COVID as a journalist as well. And their, their beliefs just get so warped and they get so kind of. Removed from reality and to say things like you're celebrating his death. No, they were probably relieved it was over and that, you know, it had finally come to an end. These people aren't cheering that the man's died. They're just glad it's over.

• 51:49Speaker 03

  Hmm. And it was, and I think you're right. It's, it's, it's that, it's that it was over, like the man, that manhunt, the search for Desmond, the appeals, the, you know, there'd always be that little, oh, potential sighting, was it, was, you know, is he there or is he here? Or, uh, the gossip as well, I think, kind of puts an end to that town gossip. Um, but, but with that said, there are stills, like, like you mentioned, the people who genuinely think that it's a police cover up and it's, or, you know, the police are out to, to get him. And like, it's, I, I, I personally can't see any sense in any of that.

• 52:32Speaker 03

  And to me, anyone who was murdered the way that Fidim and Neil were murdered and had their lives taken from them in such a violent way. There's no, there's no ifs, there's no buts. It's, it's, it's evil, it's brutal and they didn't deserve to die like that. No one deserves to die like that. Everyone deserves to go home to their families and loved ones at the end of their working day. And they didn't. And people defending Desmond, uh, yeah, like I said, you just can't. It makes you angry, it makes, uh, even talking about it, you're like, oh, it just, it infuriates you because how can you be so cold hearted to think there's any sense to it, I think.

• 53:11Speaker 00

  You're juggling a baby, you're juggling stepkids, everything.

• 53:15Speaker 00

  Is this a story that you have found quite defining in your career, covering this?

• 53:19Speaker 03

  I think it has been, but not by choice, if that makes sense. Like for me, I, my job has always been really important to, to me. And I think being a journalist is a privilege. And I think, um, covering news and giving people a voice when maybe they don't have a voice or can't get their message across is, is something that I don't take for granted ever. Um, but I think this story, I think because It just went on for so long and I think the added layer of like, I was, you know, I was pregnant with my daughter when the manhunt was on and then my daughter was here when they found him. It's just like all these different little bits to it. I, I think for me, my biggest

• 54:00Speaker 03

  thing is I never, I always want to treat people that I interview and speak to with respect and I have a lot of respect for the police. I think what they do is bloody hard work. And, you know, when I spoke to Wayne Gatt, the, the union, the police union boss, he said, post-COVID, there's so much anger towards police. And we see it like in protests, there's almost a protest every single weekend in Melbourne. And I see what they have to put up with. And it's only because they're in uniform. If they took the uniform off, they probably wouldn't be spoken to the way that they've been spoken to. But it's the uniform that upsets people. And I, I think my job is really important. And I, I remember saying to my, my boss at the time,

• 54:43Speaker 03

  after all this happened, I'm like, I don't want this to be about me. Like, this is about them, this is about Neil and the DM and the force. I just, I just want to do the best that I can do as a reporter to cover the facts accurately and fairly and represent that as best as I can do. And he was like, yeah, fair point. That makes sense. So, um, yeah, it's been, it's been a lot. And even now, I'm like, oh, did I do the right thing on the day? Like, should I have left my baby? And, but everyone I've spoken to said she won't have any clue. And it's a story to tell her when she's older. I'm like, true. But it's that guilt, right? You get guilt, like as a, as a new mom. I'm like, all these different feelings and thoughts and you want to protect your career. But then

• 55:25Speaker 03

  you also want to be present as a, as a parent and as partner. Um, so just juggling all of that.

• 55:34Speaker 00

  Cassie, this all only happened, what, seven, eight months ago? It's so fresh. The murders of Vadim and Neil, their families are still in deep grief, trying to come to terms with what happened.

• 55:48Speaker 00

  This is something the force, their families are going to be dealing with for many months and years to come, isn't it?

• 55:54Speaker 03

  Oh, Gem, absolutely. I think this is something that their families and the force, it'll always be with them. The brutality of it, of course, and also the other people and the other officers who were involved in that that search warrant that day. There was a third police officer who was shot and injured and he literally had to hide under the bus to protect himself until backup arrived. So you can only imagine what he's going through in his recovery. You've got the other members who witnessed it. You've got that fourth police officer, the female sergeant, who had a gun pointed at her and it didn't go off. You can only imagine,

• 56:40Speaker 03

  and I haven't spoken to them, I don't know, but the ripple effect mentally and physically that this will have on the Victoria Police Community will be ongoing. And they'll, and they'll band together and they'll mourn and grieve and work towards, you know, some sort of new normal. But then you've got the families, like Vidim, he was in his early 30s. There's so much, there was so much ahead of him. And then you've got Neil, who right now should have been enjoying his retirement years, going camping and and spending time with his partner and, and they don't get to do that.

• 57:21Speaker 03

  So the ripple effect that this shooting will have on the Victorian community and the policing community will be in, in what I believe, ongoing for some time, absolutely.

• 57:35Speaker 00

  Thank you to Cassie for joining us on this episode. You can find a link to the six-part podcast, Dezi Freeman, The Hunt, at the link in our show notes. Thanks so much for listening. I'll be back next week with another true crime conversation.